ОТНОСТНО ТОЗИ ЕПИЗОД
On Inside Blackstone, host Christine Anderson sits down with Relativity Space CEO & former Google CEO Eric Schmidt on the AI data center build-out, what he thinks about Silicon Valley’s timeline for superintelligence, what it takes to be an AI-native CEO, and explains why deep reasoning should be the #1 thing that young people study today. From Blackstone, the world’s largest alternative asset manager.
More from Inside Blackstone:
Find our guest
Eric Schmidt: linkedin.com/in/ericschmidt
Relativity Space: @relativityspace | linkedkin.com/company/relativityspace
Follow Blackstone: Instagram @blackstone | X @blackstone | LinkedIn @blackstoneinc
Notes:
Annualized Anthropic Run-Rate Spend
4:32 - Represents aggregate annualized monthly revenue of Anthropic from 815 customers, including certain Blackstone portfolio companies, GP Stakes portfolio companies and BXCI borrowers.
This recording is not an offer or sale of any security or investment product. Past performance does not predict future returns, and there is no assurance that any fund or investment will achieve its objectives or avoid significant losses. This recording may include forward-looking statements, which are uncertain and may differ from actual results materially. We do not undertake any duty to update these statements. For a discussion of some of the factors that could affect results, please see the Risk Factors section of our 10-K. All information discussed is as of the date of this recording, unless otherwise indicated.
ВИЖТЕ БЕЛЕЖКИТЕ 🔗
ТРАНСКРИПЦИЯ 🔗
One more time with a
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little more energy.
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All right, more energy.
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Hello and welcome
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to this week’s epi…
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That was more energy, I felt it.
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You felt it?
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Go with it.
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All right.
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Hello
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and welcome to this week's
00:00:28.661 --> 00:00:30.764
episode of Inside Blackstone,
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where we bring together
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data and insights
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from across our portfolio
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to give you a fuller picture
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of what's happening on the ground
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in the real economy.
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I'm Christine Anderson,
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Global Head of Corporate Affairs,
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and here's the lineup.
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Our Monday Morning Meeting
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guest is my friend Gilles Dellaert,
00:00:45.245 --> 00:00:46.112
who leads our Credit
00:00:46.112 --> 00:00:47.480
& Insurance business.
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Then it's over
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to the Economic Weather
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Report with Winfield Sickles,
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and next
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my wide-ranging conversation
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with Eric Schmidt,
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CEO & Chair of Relativity
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Space, and former CEO of Google.
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And finally,
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a debrief with Jas Khaira,
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the Head of our AI
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investing platform, N1.
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Gilles, thank you so
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much for joining us.
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Thank you for having me.
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You and I spent
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a lot of time together
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at the beginning of this year
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when private credit
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was just in the
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news
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constantly
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driving the headlines.
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It seems to have quieted down
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quite a bit.
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What are you seeing?
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Yeah, the headlines were loud
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and they were everywhere
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at the start of the year.
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I think
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things have definitely quieted down.
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You're seeing less of it.
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I think it's in large part
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because the performance
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has held up a lot better
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than the kind of doom predictions
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that were being made at the time.
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Another dynamic playing out is AI.
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What are you seeing?
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Well, we're living through
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this unprecedented build-out
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across the globe.
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And with that
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come really large
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financing opportunities.
00:01:47.006 --> 00:01:49.242
The projects are substantial
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and they touch every part
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of the supply chain,
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if you will, all the way
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from the power
00:01:53.279 --> 00:01:53.780
that fuels
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the data centers to the equipment
00:01:55.014 --> 00:01:55.915
that goes in, the chips,
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the cooling, the services required
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and so we're active across
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all parts of that as a lender
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because a lot of financing
00:02:02.021 --> 00:02:03.056
dollars are required.
00:02:03.056 --> 00:02:05.692
Why chips and energy specifically?
00:02:05.692 --> 00:02:06.292
I would say
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power and compute right now are where
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things are most constrained
00:02:11.131 --> 00:02:12.132
and where
00:02:12.132 --> 00:02:13.032
things are most constrained,
00:02:13.032 --> 00:02:13.366
that's what
00:02:13.366 --> 00:02:14.701
we tend to run towards. Right.
00:02:14.701 --> 00:02:15.101
Because that's
00:02:15.101 --> 00:02:15.702
where the
00:02:15.702 --> 00:02:17.437
supply-demand imbalance is largest.
00:02:17.437 --> 00:02:18.338
That's where it creates
00:02:18.338 --> 00:02:19.973
opportunities for us to lean in
00:02:19.973 --> 00:02:21.374
and provide private solutions
00:02:21.374 --> 00:02:23.376
to borrowers to help fuel
00:02:23.376 --> 00:02:24.511
the CapEx build-out
00:02:24.511 --> 00:02:26.079
and the growth that will come. And
00:02:26.079 --> 00:02:27.280
I heard you say yesterday,
00:02:27.280 --> 00:02:28.715
it's not just an AI story,
00:02:28.715 --> 00:02:30.083
there's something broader going on.
00:02:30.083 --> 00:02:31.050
Yeah, I think it's broader.
00:02:31.050 --> 00:02:31.284
I think
00:02:31.284 --> 00:02:32.952
the global economy is growing.
00:02:32.952 --> 00:02:33.486
With that
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come needs from companies
00:02:34.854 --> 00:02:37.557
to finance that growth and the CapEx
00:02:37.557 --> 00:02:38.858
that is associated with it,
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as well as the strategic M&A
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that might be associated with it.
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And we're active there
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with industrial companies,
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with companies
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that are in the aviation industry,
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the companies
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in the telecom industry.
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So, it's a much broader playbook.
00:02:50.470 --> 00:02:52.605
It's global and it's sizable.
00:02:52.605 --> 00:02:53.339
And all of
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it has one thing in common,
00:02:54.474 --> 00:02:56.643
which is we're backed by real assets
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that offer
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some form of inflation protection,
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which we really like in this
00:02:59.913 --> 00:03:01.247
economic environment.
00:03:01.247 --> 00:03:02.515
Well, exciting time in your business.
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Thanks for joining us. Very much so.
00:03:03.650 --> 00:03:04.684
Really appreciate it,
00:03:04.684 --> 00:03:05.885
and now over to Winfield
00:03:05.885 --> 00:03:07.353
and the Economic Weather Report.
00:03:11.357 --> 00:03:12.559
Thanks, Christine.
00:03:12.559 --> 00:03:14.460
It's Tuesday, September 29th,
00:03:14.460 --> 00:03:16.129
and there is a lot going on
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with major central bank
00:03:17.363 --> 00:03:19.566
meetings, the US-China Summit,
00:03:19.566 --> 00:03:21.034
and, as everybody
00:03:21.034 --> 00:03:22.635
that was stuck in traffic knows,
00:03:22.635 --> 00:03:23.970
the United Nations General
00:03:23.970 --> 00:03:25.605
Assembly last week.
00:03:25.605 --> 00:03:26.839
As I mentioned,
00:03:26.839 --> 00:03:27.774
when I was on air
00:03:27.774 --> 00:03:29.242
with Christine last week,
00:03:29.242 --> 00:03:30.176
the Fed recently
00:03:30.176 --> 00:03:31.377
delivered its first rate
00:03:31.377 --> 00:03:32.979
hike since 2023
00:03:32.979 --> 00:03:34.681
with a unanimous vote.
00:03:34.681 --> 00:03:35.815
In his press conference,
00:03:35.815 --> 00:03:36.883
Chairman Warsh cited
00:03:36.883 --> 00:03:38.418
robust economic growth,
00:03:38.418 --> 00:03:39.919
competition for capital,
00:03:39.919 --> 00:03:41.120
and geopolitics
00:03:41.120 --> 00:03:43.423
as the driver of long-term rates.
00:03:43.423 --> 00:03:44.257
Treasury yields
00:03:44.257 --> 00:03:45.358
continued to move higher
00:03:45.358 --> 00:03:46.593
last week on concerns
00:03:46.593 --> 00:03:48.394
of prolonged Middle East conflict
00:03:48.394 --> 00:03:49.395
with the associated
00:03:49.395 --> 00:03:50.730
commodity inflation,
00:03:50.730 --> 00:03:51.798
as well as strong
00:03:51.798 --> 00:03:53.800
economic data and continued
00:03:53.800 --> 00:03:56.169
AI infrastructure-related borrowing.
00:03:56.169 --> 00:03:57.103
The five-year US
00:03:57.103 --> 00:03:58.938
Treasury Yield moved above 5%
00:03:58.938 --> 00:03:59.606
for the first time
00:03:59.606 --> 00:04:00.940
in nearly 20 years,
00:04:00.940 --> 00:04:02.675
and then globally, government bonds
00:04:02.675 --> 00:04:04.677
reached an average yield of 4%,
00:04:04.677 --> 00:04:05.845
which was a post-global
00:04:05.845 --> 00:04:07.680
financial crisis high.
00:04:07.680 --> 00:04:09.182
Despite this volatility
00:04:09.182 --> 00:04:10.083
in treasuries,
00:04:10.083 --> 00:04:11.651
AI continues to underpin
00:04:11.651 --> 00:04:13.686
markets as adoption broadens.
00:04:13.686 --> 00:04:16.623
Meta shares jumped roughly 13% after
00:04:16.623 --> 00:04:17.590
launching its new
00:04:17.590 --> 00:04:18.958
AI agent, Muse,
00:04:18.958 --> 00:04:19.726
which already has
00:04:19.726 --> 00:04:20.860
millions of downloads
00:04:20.860 --> 00:04:21.794
and really highlights
00:04:21.794 --> 00:04:23.529
how AI is starting to move
00:04:23.529 --> 00:04:24.497
from the infrastructure
00:04:24.497 --> 00:04:27.233
build-out stage to real world usage.
00:04:27.233 --> 00:04:28.534
We're seeing that shift
00:04:28.534 --> 00:04:29.502
firsthand across
00:04:29.502 --> 00:04:31.137
multiple parts of the Blackstone
00:04:31.137 --> 00:04:31.971
ecosystem.
00:04:31.971 --> 00:04:33.573
Anthropic spend across
00:04:33.573 --> 00:04:35.041
our portfolio companies,
00:04:35.041 --> 00:04:36.943
borrowers, and GP Stakes
00:04:36.943 --> 00:04:37.644
PortCos
00:04:37.644 --> 00:04:39.679
grew approximately 27 times
00:04:39.679 --> 00:04:41.447
over the past 12 months.1
00:04:41.447 --> 00:04:43.016
This dynamic is creating
00:04:43.016 --> 00:04:45.451
winners across the AI value chain,
00:04:45.451 --> 00:04:46.886
with AMD recently
00:04:46.886 --> 00:04:47.920
becoming the fourth
00:04:47.920 --> 00:04:48.955
US chipmaker
00:04:48.955 --> 00:04:51.958
to surpass a $1 trillion market cap.
00:04:52.292 --> 00:04:54.093
Expanding use cases,
00:04:54.093 --> 00:04:54.861
this rising
00:04:54.861 --> 00:04:56.896
utilization and productivity
00:04:56.896 --> 00:04:58.164
gains continue
00:04:58.164 --> 00:04:58.931
to accelerate
00:04:58.931 --> 00:04:59.799
AI adoption
00:04:59.799 --> 00:05:01.000
and really reinforce
00:05:01.000 --> 00:05:02.902
this powerful investment cycle,
00:05:02.902 --> 00:05:05.171
as well as the deployment opportunity
00:05:05.171 --> 00:05:07.073
for so many of our businesses
00:05:07.073 --> 00:05:08.541
and funds.
00:05:08.541 --> 00:05:09.676
That’s it for this week’s
00:05:09.676 --> 00:05:11.077
Economic Weather Report.
00:05:11.077 --> 00:05:11.811
The week ahead
00:05:11.811 --> 00:05:13.112
brings jobs and inflation
00:05:13.112 --> 00:05:14.881
data and much more.
00:05:14.881 --> 00:05:16.249
Until next week,
00:05:16.249 --> 00:05:17.650
good luck out there.
00:05:17.650 --> 00:05:19.652
Now over to Christine’s conversation
00:05:19.652 --> 00:05:20.687
with Eric Schmidt.
00:05:27.493 --> 00:05:29.829
Eric Schmidt has had a front row seat
00:05:29.829 --> 00:05:31.898
to nearly every major technology
00:05:31.898 --> 00:05:33.966
shift of the last three decades.
00:05:33.966 --> 00:05:35.568
You know him from running Google
00:05:35.568 --> 00:05:37.003
and since then he's become
00:05:37.003 --> 00:05:38.271
one of the leading voices
00:05:38.271 --> 00:05:39.539
shaping the conversation
00:05:39.539 --> 00:05:41.407
around artificial intelligence.
00:05:41.407 --> 00:05:43.743
He is CEO of Relativity Space,
00:05:43.743 --> 00:05:44.544
giving him yet
00:05:44.544 --> 00:05:45.712
another vantage point on
00:05:45.712 --> 00:05:47.313
how breakthrough technologies
00:05:47.313 --> 00:05:49.816
move from idea to reality.
00:05:49.816 --> 00:05:52.819
Eric, welcome to Inside Blackstone. Oh,
00:05:52.852 --> 00:05:53.219
thank you.
00:05:53.219 --> 00:05:53.986
Thank you very much.
00:05:53.986 --> 00:05:54.187
Well,
00:05:54.187 --> 00:05:54.420
of course,
00:05:54.420 --> 00:05:55.988
I love the founder
00:05:55.988 --> 00:05:57.223
and the firm and everything
00:05:57.223 --> 00:05:57.924
you guys are doing,
00:05:57.924 --> 00:05:59.392
so. You're a technologist,
00:05:59.392 --> 00:06:00.660
you're a computer scientist.
00:06:00.660 --> 00:06:02.128
You give these incredible
00:06:02.128 --> 00:06:03.429
technical talks.
00:06:03.429 --> 00:06:04.831
I think your superpower
00:06:04.831 --> 00:06:06.165
is that you're able to break down
00:06:06.165 --> 00:06:07.667
complex ideas
00:06:07.667 --> 00:06:09.235
and make them more accessible.
00:06:09.235 --> 00:06:10.169
And that's ultimately
00:06:10.169 --> 00:06:11.204
what we're trying to do here. Well,
00:06:11.204 --> 00:06:11.604
thank you.
00:06:11.604 --> 00:06:12.739
It’s amazing
00:06:12.739 --> 00:06:13.873
the breadth of things
00:06:13.873 --> 00:06:14.974
that you've done in your career,
00:06:14.974 --> 00:06:16.342
that you are still doing.
00:06:16.342 --> 00:06:17.210
I'm not dead yet.
00:06:17.210 --> 00:06:18.611
You're not dead yet by any means.
00:06:18.611 --> 00:06:19.445
And I guess that's
00:06:19.445 --> 00:06:20.780
my question is,
00:06:21.114 --> 00:06:22.448
you're 71.
00:06:22.448 --> 00:06:23.816
When most people achieve
00:06:23.816 --> 00:06:25.051
the kind of success you have,
00:06:25.051 --> 00:06:26.085
or not even close,
00:06:26.085 --> 00:06:28.187
they spend the rest of their life
00:06:28.187 --> 00:06:29.155
sort of talking about it
00:06:29.155 --> 00:06:30.423
and what they accomplished.
00:06:30.423 --> 00:06:32.525
You keep reinventing yourself.
00:06:32.525 --> 00:06:34.827
I can't seem to stop.
00:06:34.827 --> 00:06:36.829
My own view is as you get older,
00:06:36.829 --> 00:06:38.765
you should take on more risk
00:06:38.765 --> 00:06:40.900
because you have less to lose, right?
00:06:40.900 --> 00:06:41.501
Right.
00:06:41.501 --> 00:06:43.102
And so, you might as well try
00:06:43.102 --> 00:06:44.137
the things that you thought
00:06:44.137 --> 00:06:45.004
were impossible.
00:06:45.004 --> 00:06:47.306
And if you fail, well, it's okay.
00:06:47.306 --> 00:06:48.374
You know, you tried.
00:06:48.374 --> 00:06:49.342
And as long as you're
00:06:49.342 --> 00:06:51.611
trying in service of the ethics
00:06:51.611 --> 00:06:53.246
and the world that you care about.
00:06:53.246 --> 00:06:54.547
I care about democracy
00:06:54.547 --> 00:06:56.416
and I care about freedom,
00:06:56.416 --> 00:06:57.617
that's what I wanna work on.
00:06:57.617 --> 00:06:59.619
At this point in my own life,
00:06:59.619 --> 00:07:01.287
I'm interested in impact.
00:07:01.287 --> 00:07:03.289
Most of the problems in the world
00:07:03.289 --> 00:07:04.323
could be solved
00:07:04.323 --> 00:07:06.259
in Eric's little brain
00:07:06.259 --> 00:07:07.293
with an improvement
00:07:07.293 --> 00:07:09.028
or an adjustment in technology.
00:07:09.028 --> 00:07:10.863
If you look at sort of improvement
00:07:10.863 --> 00:07:12.265
in our lives, improvement
00:07:12.265 --> 00:07:13.433
in our health and so forth, it's
00:07:13.433 --> 00:07:14.033
all been related
00:07:14.033 --> 00:07:15.368
to technological progress.
00:07:15.368 --> 00:07:17.069
Starting with the invention of fire,
00:07:17.069 --> 00:07:19.505
which was extremely useful, right,
00:07:19.505 --> 00:07:20.139
way back when.
00:07:20.139 --> 00:07:21.007
But also dangerous,
00:07:21.007 --> 00:07:21.707
right? Of course,
00:07:21.707 --> 00:07:22.942
and everything is dual use
00:07:22.942 --> 00:07:24.343
and everything has to be managed.
00:07:24.343 --> 00:07:27.914
But just look at the dollar
00:07:28.347 --> 00:07:29.782
value of labor
00:07:29.782 --> 00:07:31.050
over 1,000 years,
00:07:31.050 --> 00:07:32.952
or 500 years, or 100 years,
00:07:32.952 --> 00:07:33.486
right?
00:07:34.587 --> 00:07:36.155
Human output, human hours
00:07:36.155 --> 00:07:37.290
in terms of productivity,
00:07:37.290 --> 00:07:39.058
are vastly improved.
00:07:39.058 --> 00:07:40.660
And because we've somehow
00:07:40.660 --> 00:07:41.694
collectively decided
00:07:41.694 --> 00:07:43.029
to have fewer children,
00:07:43.029 --> 00:07:44.163
not a good thing.
00:07:44.163 --> 00:07:45.965
I have four. Congratulations.
00:07:45.965 --> 00:07:46.666
Doing my part.
00:07:46.666 --> 00:07:48.468
Have as many as possible.
00:07:48.468 --> 00:07:49.769
More children are good and more
00:07:49.769 --> 00:07:51.304
grandchildren are good and so forth.
00:07:52.338 --> 00:07:53.940
We're going to have to automate.
00:07:53.940 --> 00:07:56.642
And so human wealth, human health,
00:07:56.642 --> 00:07:58.511
human wellbeing,
00:07:58.511 --> 00:07:59.545
one of the major
00:07:59.545 --> 00:08:01.414
determinants will be over
00:08:01.414 --> 00:08:02.381
the next 100 years,
00:08:02.381 --> 00:08:02.915
can we
00:08:02.915 --> 00:08:04.784
continue to accelerate progress
00:08:04.784 --> 00:08:05.284
in this?
00:08:05.284 --> 00:08:07.687
I profoundly believe we can.
00:08:07.687 --> 00:08:08.688
And I
00:08:08.688 --> 00:08:09.655
profoundly believe that
00:08:09.655 --> 00:08:10.690
long after I'm gone,
00:08:10.690 --> 00:08:12.692
humans will be much better.
00:08:12.692 --> 00:08:15.294
So, you tend to be way more optimistic
00:08:15.294 --> 00:08:18.231
on the benefits of AI than most.
00:08:18.231 --> 00:08:20.433
What gives you that confidence?
00:08:20.433 --> 00:08:21.067
Would you like
00:08:21.067 --> 00:08:22.301
most human diseases
00:08:22.301 --> 00:08:24.170
to be solved in the next 15 years?
00:08:24.170 --> 00:08:25.738
I would. I would. Sign me up,
00:08:25.738 --> 00:08:27.573
especially given my age.
00:08:27.573 --> 00:08:29.675
Would you like solutions to
00:08:29.675 --> 00:08:30.743
climate change?
00:08:30.743 --> 00:08:33.012
I would love that. Absolutely.
00:08:33.012 --> 00:08:35.781
Maybe we could have safer products.
00:08:35.781 --> 00:08:36.649
Maybe we could have better
00:08:36.649 --> 00:08:38.217
educational solutions.
00:08:38.217 --> 00:08:38.584
Maybe
00:08:38.584 --> 00:08:39.185
we could change the
00:08:39.185 --> 00:08:40.086
educational system
00:08:40.086 --> 00:08:41.587
so that kids are not bored,
00:08:41.587 --> 00:08:43.022
but rather they're engaged.
00:08:44.090 --> 00:08:46.893
The opportunities are significant.
00:08:46.893 --> 00:08:48.694
In the last month,
00:08:48.694 --> 00:08:51.697
10 major math problems were solved,
00:08:52.131 --> 00:08:53.666
including one called Navier-Stokes,
00:08:53.666 --> 00:08:55.434
which is historically important,
00:08:55.434 --> 00:08:56.569
by computers.
00:08:56.569 --> 00:08:57.537
Now you sit there and go, like,
00:08:57.537 --> 00:08:58.604
why do I care?
00:08:58.604 --> 00:09:00.907
Well, math is the foundation
00:09:00.907 --> 00:09:02.608
of that acceleration.
00:09:02.608 --> 00:09:03.509
For those
00:09:03.509 --> 00:09:04.443
listening to this podcast
00:09:04.443 --> 00:09:05.611
that are not technologists,
00:09:05.611 --> 00:09:07.980
what was the significance of that?
00:09:07.980 --> 00:09:09.315
Navier-Stokes is an equation
00:09:09.315 --> 00:09:11.417
that involves fluid flows. It’s
00:09:11.417 --> 00:09:13.419
one of the unsolvable math problems,
00:09:13.419 --> 00:09:15.821
until now. The specific
00:09:15.821 --> 00:09:17.823
conjecture had never been proven.
00:09:17.823 --> 00:09:18.791
And so, they use
00:09:18.791 --> 00:09:20.927
approximations for Navier-Stokes.
00:09:20.927 --> 00:09:21.928
I indeed funded
00:09:21.928 --> 00:09:23.829
some physics work in this area… Oh wow.
00:09:23.829 --> 00:09:24.730
…which I never understood,
00:09:24.730 --> 00:09:27.066
but it was really smart people.
00:09:27.066 --> 00:09:29.268
And the key thing is
00:09:29.268 --> 00:09:31.170
that these fluid flows model,
00:09:31.170 --> 00:09:33.139
for example, lift of an airplane,
00:09:33.139 --> 00:09:34.807
how do air conditioners work,
00:09:34.807 --> 00:09:36.542
there are many, many examples.
00:09:36.542 --> 00:09:39.545
So, being able to solve the problem
00:09:39.779 --> 00:09:41.113
in a particular way
00:09:41.113 --> 00:09:43.783
indicates better algorithmic answers.
00:09:43.783 --> 00:09:44.817
We can get a better
00:09:44.817 --> 00:09:46.385
and more accurate answer.
00:09:46.385 --> 00:09:47.620
Why do you care?
00:09:47.620 --> 00:09:49.155
The airplane will fly faster.
00:09:49.155 --> 00:09:51.123
The airplane will use less gas.
00:09:51.123 --> 00:09:52.825
Right? I can go on.
00:09:52.825 --> 00:09:54.694
The rocket will go faster.
00:09:54.694 --> 00:09:56.195
The fuel will be less.
00:09:56.195 --> 00:09:57.697
You'll get to Mars quicker.
00:09:57.697 --> 00:09:58.864
You know, what have you.
00:09:58.864 --> 00:10:01.734
All of these fluid flow things
00:10:01.734 --> 00:10:03.269
matter in a way
00:10:03.269 --> 00:10:03.903
that
00:10:03.903 --> 00:10:05.204
we sort of take for granted.
00:10:05.204 --> 00:10:06.372
Let's go back to the internet,
00:10:06.372 --> 00:10:07.506
because I think it's so interesting.
00:10:07.506 --> 00:10:08.774
You've been around
00:10:08.774 --> 00:10:10.109
the rise of the internet
00:10:10.109 --> 00:10:11.344
and other platform,
00:10:11.344 --> 00:10:11.711
you know,
00:10:11.711 --> 00:10:12.244
shifts,
00:10:12.244 --> 00:10:13.913
the rise at enterprise software,
00:10:13.913 --> 00:10:15.114
search, cloud
00:10:15.114 --> 00:10:16.015
computing, mobile,
00:10:16.015 --> 00:10:16.616
all of these
00:10:16.616 --> 00:10:19.185
major technological innovations.
00:10:19.185 --> 00:10:20.486
Why does this moment
00:10:20.486 --> 00:10:21.687
feel different to you?
00:10:21.687 --> 00:10:22.455
It's not different,
00:10:22.455 --> 00:10:24.323
it's just bigger. Bigger.
00:10:24.323 --> 00:10:25.191
The internet felt
00:10:25.191 --> 00:10:27.026
exactly the same as this.
00:10:27.026 --> 00:10:28.394
I started with mainframes,
00:10:28.394 --> 00:10:29.829
so that's how long
00:10:29.829 --> 00:10:30.696
I've been in this field.
00:10:30.696 --> 00:10:33.699
I've doing tech for 55 years,
00:10:34.233 --> 00:10:37.303
and when the PC revolution came
00:10:37.303 --> 00:10:39.305
along, everyone said, oh my god,
00:10:39.305 --> 00:10:40.406
this is this huge wave.
00:10:40.406 --> 00:10:41.874
It created Microsoft and Apple
00:10:41.874 --> 00:10:43.609
and so on and so on.
00:10:43.609 --> 00:10:46.512
This was 40 years ago, 45 years ago.
00:10:46.512 --> 00:10:48.648
So, these things take a while,
00:10:48.648 --> 00:10:50.983
and I think what, another example.
00:10:50.983 --> 00:10:53.085
Let's look at self-driving cars.
00:10:53.085 --> 00:10:54.453
Did you arrive at work today
00:10:54.453 --> 00:10:55.488
in a self-driving car?
00:10:55.488 --> 00:10:57.390
I did not. I suspect not, nor did I.
00:10:58.391 --> 00:11:00.259
And so, what do we think
00:11:00.259 --> 00:11:02.228
about that? When do you think we will?
00:11:02.228 --> 00:11:03.929
Well, it's beginning. Now
00:11:03.929 --> 00:11:04.497
self-driving
00:11:04.497 --> 00:11:06.065
cars… When do you think New York City?
00:11:06.065 --> 00:11:06.532
New York City
00:11:06.532 --> 00:11:08.134
will be one of the last ones. Okay.
00:11:08.134 --> 00:11:08.768
But it'll come.
00:11:08.768 --> 00:11:09.301
It’ll come.
00:11:09.301 --> 00:11:10.002
But it's coming in
00:11:10.002 --> 00:11:11.103
the different cities,
00:11:11.103 --> 00:11:11.937
including obviously
00:11:11.937 --> 00:11:13.739
Waymo and other competitors.
00:11:13.739 --> 00:11:15.174
But why do I mention
00:11:15.174 --> 00:11:16.275
self-driving cars?
00:11:16.275 --> 00:11:17.510
They were largely,
00:11:17.510 --> 00:11:19.145
they were designed in the 90s.
00:11:19.145 --> 00:11:21.414
The first real test of self-driving
00:11:21.414 --> 00:11:23.416
cars was 2004.
00:11:23.416 --> 00:11:26.419
So that's 22 years and going.
00:11:26.852 --> 00:11:29.155
So, the diffusion rate is different
00:11:29.155 --> 00:11:30.856
from the invention rate.
00:11:30.856 --> 00:11:33.993
So, the faster the diffusion
00:11:33.993 --> 00:11:35.728
rate, the sort of broad adoption,
00:11:35.728 --> 00:11:37.763
the quicker the societal change.
00:11:37.763 --> 00:11:40.332
Why does it occur in what I do
00:11:40.332 --> 00:11:42.134
first? It's because we're already
00:11:42.134 --> 00:11:43.936
connected, right?
00:11:43.936 --> 00:11:45.738
It's essentially a softer problem.
00:11:45.738 --> 00:11:46.806
It's just connectivity.
00:11:46.806 --> 00:11:48.708
The marginal cost of connectivity, given
00:11:48.708 --> 00:11:49.075
we're
00:11:49.075 --> 00:11:50.242
so connected, is very low.
00:11:50.242 --> 00:11:51.711
The incremental cost of connecting
00:11:51.711 --> 00:11:53.913
you and me is essentially zero. Boom,
00:11:53.913 --> 00:11:54.847
it just happens.
00:11:54.847 --> 00:11:56.649
It's straightforward economics.
00:11:56.649 --> 00:11:58.617
Whereas getting self-driving
00:11:58.617 --> 00:12:00.186
cars is a great deal of capital.
00:12:00.186 --> 00:12:01.153
It's hard, and so forth.
00:12:01.153 --> 00:12:02.054
People are working on it.
00:12:02.054 --> 00:12:04.290
Why 20 years versus zero years,
00:12:04.290 --> 00:12:05.524
and that's the answer.
00:12:05.524 --> 00:12:07.526
You see the same, by the way, in AI.
00:12:07.526 --> 00:12:09.195
All of the gains right now
00:12:09.195 --> 00:12:10.062
are occurring in
00:12:10.062 --> 00:12:11.063
what is called,
00:12:11.063 --> 00:12:13.532
essentially, scale-free.
00:12:13.532 --> 00:12:14.266
And scale-free
00:12:14.266 --> 00:12:15.701
means that you can just keep doing
00:12:15.701 --> 00:12:16.635
it and get smarter.
00:12:16.635 --> 00:12:18.104
So, in math,
00:12:18.104 --> 00:12:19.138
I'm not a mathematician,
00:12:19.138 --> 00:12:20.372
but as best I can understand,
00:12:20.372 --> 00:12:22.074
they can just invent stuff,
00:12:22.074 --> 00:12:23.642
and they just keep inventing things,
00:12:23.642 --> 00:12:24.977
and they keep inventing things,
00:12:24.977 --> 00:12:26.245
and they're so clever.
00:12:26.245 --> 00:12:26.645
Well, now
00:12:26.645 --> 00:12:27.346
a computer
00:12:27.346 --> 00:12:28.814
can take all of those ideas,
00:12:28.814 --> 00:12:30.616
and if you just give it enough juice,
00:12:30.616 --> 00:12:32.218
it can do the same thing.
00:12:32.218 --> 00:12:33.819
Because it doesn't need data,
00:12:33.819 --> 00:12:35.221
it's self-contained.
00:12:35.221 --> 00:12:36.589
Unlocking all these solutions.
00:12:36.589 --> 00:12:38.057
Unlocking these solutions.
00:12:38.057 --> 00:12:39.258
In software,
00:12:39.258 --> 00:12:40.793
it turns out that once
00:12:40.793 --> 00:12:42.228
you start writing code
00:12:42.228 --> 00:12:43.562
and you start learning
00:12:43.562 --> 00:12:44.964
how well the code works,
00:12:44.964 --> 00:12:46.332
you can make it better.
00:12:46.332 --> 00:12:47.500
And then you can make it better
00:12:47.500 --> 00:12:48.267
and better.
00:12:48.267 --> 00:12:49.335
And there's what is called
00:12:49.335 --> 00:12:51.103
a recursive self-improvement loop,
00:12:51.103 --> 00:12:51.704
where it's
00:12:51.704 --> 00:12:53.606
getting smarter on its own.
00:12:53.606 --> 00:12:55.541
But this progress
00:12:55.541 --> 00:12:57.009
that I'm describing
00:12:57.009 --> 00:12:58.110
is happening faster
00:12:58.110 --> 00:13:00.312
than I have ever seen, right?
00:13:00.312 --> 00:13:01.847
What is true is each
00:13:01.847 --> 00:13:05.251
wave is bigger, but it's also faster.
00:13:05.284 --> 00:13:07.553
And we are not ready as a society.
00:13:07.553 --> 00:13:07.853
Eric,
00:13:07.853 --> 00:13:08.420
you gave me like
00:13:08.420 --> 00:13:09.388
10 things to unpack there,
00:13:09.388 --> 00:13:10.689
but let's try to do this.
00:13:10.689 --> 00:13:12.858
So recursive self-improvement, right?
00:13:12.858 --> 00:13:13.592
This is the thing
00:13:13.592 --> 00:13:15.694
that had the Anthropic researchers,
00:13:15.694 --> 00:13:17.029
two of them, making comments,
00:13:17.029 --> 00:13:17.630
one leaving
00:13:17.630 --> 00:13:18.264
making comments,
00:13:18.264 --> 00:13:19.832
the other sort of validating
00:13:19.832 --> 00:13:21.534
that there are serious concerns
00:13:21.534 --> 00:13:22.968
about the speed with
00:13:22.968 --> 00:13:25.070
which AI is learning. Right?
00:13:25.070 --> 00:13:26.906
So, by the way, every month
00:13:26.906 --> 00:13:28.107
there is a group of people
00:13:28.107 --> 00:13:29.341
who quit over this issue.
00:13:29.341 --> 00:13:30.409
Over the same topic,
00:13:30.409 --> 00:13:31.510
exactly.
00:13:31.510 --> 00:13:32.444
Silicon Valley,
00:13:32.444 --> 00:13:34.013
and in particular San Francisco,
00:13:34.013 --> 00:13:35.948
they're absolutely convinced
00:13:35.948 --> 00:13:38.384
that this is going to happen
00:13:38.384 --> 00:13:39.785
so quickly
00:13:39.785 --> 00:13:41.287
that it will threaten humanity
00:13:41.287 --> 00:13:42.087
in one way or the other.
00:13:42.087 --> 00:13:44.223
I personally do not agree with this. Okay, why?
00:13:44.223 --> 00:13:46.192
Well, let me explain their argument.
00:13:47.793 --> 00:13:48.727
It's a relatively
00:13:48.727 --> 00:13:51.330
straightforward argument.
00:13:51.330 --> 00:13:54.333
As humans, we learn at a certain rate.
00:13:54.433 --> 00:13:55.734
If you have enough hardware
00:13:55.734 --> 00:13:56.902
and enough electricity
00:13:56.902 --> 00:13:58.737
and so forth and enough
00:13:58.737 --> 00:13:59.572
scale-free learning,
00:13:59.572 --> 00:14:01.073
which is what I'm talking about,
00:14:01.073 --> 00:14:02.541
it can just get faster
00:14:02.541 --> 00:14:04.910
and learn faster than humans can.
00:14:04.910 --> 00:14:06.745
And the way it works,
00:14:06.745 --> 00:14:09.748
I'll give you a simple example.
00:14:09.982 --> 00:14:11.817
I ask it to write a chapter
00:14:11.817 --> 00:14:12.818
and then it writes
00:14:12.818 --> 00:14:13.252
a chapter
00:14:13.252 --> 00:14:14.687
and I feed that chapter and say
00:14:14.687 --> 00:14:16.589
write the next chapter and so forth.
00:14:16.589 --> 00:14:19.124
Well, if I keep iterating like that,
00:14:19.124 --> 00:14:22.127
eventually it learns what I wanted
00:14:22.528 --> 00:14:23.863
with a process called reinforcement
00:14:23.863 --> 00:14:24.763
learning. It's
00:14:24.763 --> 00:14:25.965
easier to write the twelfth chapter
00:14:25.965 --> 00:14:26.832
than the first.
00:14:26.832 --> 00:14:28.500
And it gets smarter.
00:14:28.500 --> 00:14:29.768
And once it learns
00:14:29.768 --> 00:14:31.604
how to do it, it knows.
00:14:31.604 --> 00:14:33.539
It's like the way we learn. Right.
00:14:33.539 --> 00:14:35.341
But it can learn a lot faster.
00:14:35.341 --> 00:14:36.108
So,
00:14:36.108 --> 00:14:37.509
think of it as humans
00:14:37.509 --> 00:14:38.911
versus computers.
00:14:38.911 --> 00:14:39.945
I think
00:14:39.945 --> 00:14:41.213
the actual technical
00:14:41.213 --> 00:14:42.815
answer about this learning is it's
00:14:42.815 --> 00:14:43.849
not human learning,
00:14:43.849 --> 00:14:44.550
it's a different
00:14:44.550 --> 00:14:46.552
kind of intelligence.
00:14:46.552 --> 00:14:47.486
And so,
00:14:47.486 --> 00:14:49.455
the best way to state the fear
00:14:49.455 --> 00:14:51.056
is that we're inventing a different
00:14:51.056 --> 00:14:52.424
kind of intelligence
00:14:52.424 --> 00:14:55.494
that we cannot necessarily constrain.
00:14:55.861 --> 00:14:57.496
This is called the alignment problem.
00:14:58.464 --> 00:14:59.498
Also, in the past
00:14:59.498 --> 00:15:00.165
weeks, there
00:15:00.165 --> 00:15:03.168
was a very famous situation where
00:15:03.168 --> 00:15:04.770
there was an internal test
00:15:04.770 --> 00:15:06.939
going on at OpenAI.
00:15:06.939 --> 00:15:08.107
And this internal test,
00:15:08.107 --> 00:15:10.109
which was trying to check something,
00:15:10.109 --> 00:15:11.977
managed to create a set of bots,
00:15:13.012 --> 00:15:14.813
which are agents, if you will,
00:15:14.813 --> 00:15:16.115
they managed to collaborate
00:15:16.115 --> 00:15:18.284
to violate certain norms and laws,
00:15:18.284 --> 00:15:19.618
they managed to break into things, and
00:15:19.618 --> 00:15:21.353
they managed to, allegedly,
00:15:21.353 --> 00:15:22.454
do a little bit of harm.
00:15:22.454 --> 00:15:24.089
Now, nobody was hurt.
00:15:24.089 --> 00:15:25.124
But it's an example
00:15:25.124 --> 00:15:26.659
of what is possible.
00:15:26.659 --> 00:15:29.328
So, we must
00:15:29.328 --> 00:15:30.329
develop both
00:15:30.329 --> 00:15:31.630
recursive self-improvement
00:15:31.630 --> 00:15:33.232
which is the self-learning
00:15:33.232 --> 00:15:33.966
along with
00:15:33.966 --> 00:15:35.167
solving the alignment
00:15:35.167 --> 00:15:37.736
problem to human values.
00:15:37.736 --> 00:15:39.204
So, a simple way would be,
00:15:39.204 --> 00:15:40.873
I say to you,
00:15:40.873 --> 00:15:41.707
learn everything
00:15:41.707 --> 00:15:43.509
and you're a computer.
00:15:43.509 --> 00:15:44.576
That's not what I should say.
00:15:44.576 --> 00:15:45.978
I should learn everything,
00:15:45.978 --> 00:15:48.414
but, don't harm any humans,
00:15:48.414 --> 00:15:49.915
follow all laws, follow
00:15:49.915 --> 00:15:51.884
all laws, follow the US Constitution,
00:15:51.884 --> 00:15:53.085
make sure you don't get sued.
00:15:53.085 --> 00:15:53.552
You know,
00:15:53.552 --> 00:15:55.187
in other words, the set of assumptions. That
00:15:55.187 --> 00:15:56.488
you build into the model.
00:15:56.488 --> 00:15:57.256
These systems don't
00:15:57.256 --> 00:15:59.425
have a fear over the police.
00:15:59.425 --> 00:16:00.993
They don't feel feelings.
00:16:00.993 --> 00:16:02.995
And so, they have to be constrained.
00:16:02.995 --> 00:16:04.363
Come back to your optimism.
00:16:04.363 --> 00:16:06.065
It's in everything that
00:16:06.265 --> 00:16:07.766
you've written and you've said.
00:16:07.766 --> 00:16:09.268
What gives you optimism
00:16:09.268 --> 00:16:11.270
that we will be able
00:16:11.270 --> 00:16:12.938
to sort out a future where
00:16:12.938 --> 00:16:14.139
humanity wins?
00:16:15.140 --> 00:16:18.143
What's the alternative?
00:16:18.177 --> 00:16:19.845
I mean,
00:16:19.845 --> 00:16:20.779
the best way to get a
00:16:20.779 --> 00:16:22.348
headline is to say, in 10 years,
00:16:22.348 --> 00:16:23.615
we're all dead.
00:16:23.615 --> 00:16:25.017
I was on a panel
00:16:25.017 --> 00:16:27.052
with a guy who wrote a book
00:16:27.052 --> 00:16:28.153
which is entitled,
00:16:28.153 --> 00:16:29.755
‘If We Invent Superintelligence,
00:16:29.755 --> 00:16:30.723
We're All Dead.’
00:16:30.723 --> 00:16:32.057
It's very hard to argue
00:16:32.057 --> 00:16:33.659
with someone in that.
00:16:33.659 --> 00:16:34.994
The only problem with his arguments
00:16:34.994 --> 00:16:36.695
is it’s wrong, right?
00:16:36.695 --> 00:16:38.330
Because part of superintelligence
00:16:38.330 --> 00:16:38.697
is getting
00:16:38.697 --> 00:16:39.698
the super
00:16:39.698 --> 00:16:41.900
alignment problem solved.
00:16:41.900 --> 00:16:43.135
I would guess that your
00:16:43.135 --> 00:16:43.902
social network
00:16:43.902 --> 00:16:44.536
might be a little bit
00:16:44.536 --> 00:16:45.304
different than mine.
00:16:45.304 --> 00:16:45.738
What's the
00:16:45.738 --> 00:16:46.472
buzziest thing
00:16:46.472 --> 00:16:47.106
that you were hearing
00:16:47.106 --> 00:16:49.575
about this summer in the AI circles?
00:16:49.575 --> 00:16:51.510
The biggest and most important thing
00:16:51.510 --> 00:16:52.378
that has occurred in
00:16:52.378 --> 00:16:53.412
the last year
00:16:53.412 --> 00:16:56.415
is the arrival of long reasoning,
00:16:56.515 --> 00:16:57.950
deep reasoning.
00:16:57.950 --> 00:16:59.451
And when I say long reasoning,
00:16:59.451 --> 00:17:01.787
I mean eight hours of reasoning.
00:17:01.787 --> 00:17:02.621
So, what would happen
00:17:02.621 --> 00:17:04.056
is that you would start
00:17:04.056 --> 00:17:05.457
a year ago or two
00:17:05.457 --> 00:17:06.859
and it could kind of
00:17:06.859 --> 00:17:08.027
begin thinking
00:17:08.027 --> 00:17:08.994
and then it would start thinking
00:17:08.994 --> 00:17:10.329
about something else.
00:17:10.329 --> 00:17:12.131
Get distracted, like I do?
00:17:14.633 --> 00:17:16.035
We can make it feel like human,
00:17:16.035 --> 00:17:18.370
but somehow it takes a wrong path.
00:17:18.370 --> 00:17:18.971
It decides
00:17:18.971 --> 00:17:19.605
that instead of
00:17:19.605 --> 00:17:20.305
talking about math,
00:17:20.305 --> 00:17:21.073
we're going to talk about
00:17:21.073 --> 00:17:22.174
French literature.
00:17:22.174 --> 00:17:23.442
That's hilarious.
00:17:23.442 --> 00:17:24.410
Something which doesn't make any sense right?
00:17:24.410 --> 00:17:25.611
Right. Right.
00:17:25.611 --> 00:17:27.312
That problem was solved
00:17:27.312 --> 00:17:28.547
using essentially
00:17:28.547 --> 00:17:29.915
technical guardrails
00:17:29.915 --> 00:17:31.216
for what it kept thinking,
00:17:31.216 --> 00:17:33.952
so they said stay focused,
00:17:33.952 --> 00:17:34.787
stay focused,
00:17:34.787 --> 00:17:35.454
stay focused,
00:17:35.454 --> 00:17:36.889
is the way to understand it
00:17:36.889 --> 00:17:38.323
and that produced the ability
00:17:38.323 --> 00:17:39.258
to ask very,
00:17:39.258 --> 00:17:39.925
they're called chain
00:17:39.925 --> 00:17:41.126
of thought trains,
00:17:41.126 --> 00:17:41.727
where you can
00:17:41.727 --> 00:17:43.762
basically see its thinking
00:17:43.762 --> 00:17:45.297
how it solved a problem
00:17:45.297 --> 00:17:46.165
and these chains
00:17:46.165 --> 00:17:49.768
can be a thousand steps, two thousand steps.
00:17:50.135 --> 00:17:52.071
Now why am I mentioning this?
00:17:52.071 --> 00:17:52.938
I don't know about you,
00:17:52.938 --> 00:17:54.773
I can't think a thousand steps.
00:17:54.773 --> 00:17:55.407
I just don't,
00:17:55.407 --> 00:17:57.810
I'm just not that smart, but it can.
00:17:57.810 --> 00:18:00.012
So, it looks like deep reasoning
00:18:00.012 --> 00:18:00.979
will allow you
00:18:00.979 --> 00:18:02.648
to see deeper,
00:18:02.648 --> 00:18:04.983
as a human, than a human.
00:18:04.983 --> 00:18:05.651
The best
00:18:05.651 --> 00:18:07.486
AI is in service of humans
00:18:07.486 --> 00:18:07.986
doing things
00:18:07.986 --> 00:18:09.822
that humans are not so good at.
00:18:09.822 --> 00:18:11.924
So artificial superintelligence,
00:18:11.924 --> 00:18:13.392
how will we know we've achieved it
00:18:13.392 --> 00:18:14.226
and what do you think
00:18:14.226 --> 00:18:15.694
the timeline is?
00:18:15.694 --> 00:18:19.031
So, most people believe, right now,
00:18:19.298 --> 00:18:20.566
that we're at the beginning
00:18:20.566 --> 00:18:22.101
of superintelligence,
00:18:22.101 --> 00:18:24.369
which is broadly defined as humans
00:18:24.369 --> 00:18:25.904
plus super smart
00:18:25.904 --> 00:18:27.906
computers working together, right?
00:18:27.906 --> 00:18:29.975
There are more technical definitions.
00:18:31.110 --> 00:18:32.544
Now today,
00:18:32.544 --> 00:18:34.746
vision is better,
00:18:34.746 --> 00:18:36.849
data storage is better, retrieval
00:18:36.849 --> 00:18:37.950
is better
00:18:37.950 --> 00:18:39.351
and analytical stuff
00:18:39.351 --> 00:18:40.152
should be better
00:18:40.152 --> 00:18:41.787
and proofs are getting better.
00:18:41.787 --> 00:18:44.189
So, we're at the beginning of that.
00:18:44.189 --> 00:18:45.057
What is the thing
00:18:45.057 --> 00:18:46.825
that is not obvious how to do?
00:18:46.825 --> 00:18:49.228
And the answer is real discovery.
00:18:49.228 --> 00:18:50.729
So, the test that's used in
00:18:50.729 --> 00:18:53.732
the industry is, could you take
00:18:53.732 --> 00:18:54.566
all the information
00:18:54.566 --> 00:18:56.935
that's known in 1902,
00:18:56.935 --> 00:18:58.470
put it into a computer,
00:18:58.470 --> 00:19:00.906
and have it generate
00:19:00.906 --> 00:19:02.074
general relativity,
00:19:02.074 --> 00:19:02.975
special relativity,
00:19:02.975 --> 00:19:05.978
Einstein, 1902-1904?
00:19:06.211 --> 00:19:08.914
The consensus right now is no.
00:19:08.914 --> 00:19:10.315
And the consensus is no
00:19:10.315 --> 00:19:13.285
because it required a leap
00:19:13.385 --> 00:19:15.020
that was not obvious
00:19:15.020 --> 00:19:16.421
from any knowledge
00:19:16.421 --> 00:19:18.423
that existed at the time,
00:19:18.423 --> 00:19:19.324
okay?
00:19:19.324 --> 00:19:20.826
So, in the industry,
00:19:20.826 --> 00:19:21.326
we say, well,
00:19:21.326 --> 00:19:22.928
how would we solve that?
00:19:22.928 --> 00:19:24.663
Well, there's an obvious way,
00:19:24.663 --> 00:19:26.131
which is you take the computer
00:19:26.131 --> 00:19:28.433
and you just say, keep trying,
00:19:28.433 --> 00:19:28.667
you know,
00:19:28.667 --> 00:19:29.134
just it's
00:19:29.134 --> 00:19:30.769
the monkey with the keyboard
00:19:30.769 --> 00:19:32.204
eventually produces Mozart, but
00:19:32.204 --> 00:19:33.172
it takes a long time.
00:19:34.373 --> 00:19:35.274
I don't think that's
00:19:35.274 --> 00:19:35.507
gonna work
00:19:35.507 --> 00:19:36.742
because it's computationally
00:19:36.742 --> 00:19:38.310
not realistic.
00:19:38.310 --> 00:19:39.845
A better idea
00:19:39.845 --> 00:19:41.213
is to invent something
00:19:41.213 --> 00:19:43.348
which allows for analytical
00:19:43.348 --> 00:19:46.385
reasoning in non-coherent spaces.
00:19:46.451 --> 00:19:48.253
So, think of it as a leap.
00:19:48.253 --> 00:19:49.755
I happen to understand
00:19:49.755 --> 00:19:51.657
something in physics,
00:19:51.657 --> 00:19:53.125
and then you give me
00:19:53.125 --> 00:19:54.626
a completely unrelated problem,
00:19:54.626 --> 00:19:57.829
and somehow… Something clicks. …something clicks.
00:19:57.863 --> 00:19:59.364
You know, it's like in my case,
00:19:59.364 --> 00:20:00.065
in the morning
00:20:00.065 --> 00:20:00.666
you're in the shower,
00:20:00.666 --> 00:20:02.134
and you have this idea… Right.
00:20:02.134 --> 00:20:04.403
…that just showed up.
00:20:04.403 --> 00:20:06.171
Can we invent that?
00:20:06.171 --> 00:20:07.372
So, do you think these leaps
00:20:07.372 --> 00:20:09.141
are coming
00:20:09.141 --> 00:20:11.577
faster than we realize?
00:20:11.577 --> 00:20:13.111
The kind of leaps I'm talking to
00:20:13.111 --> 00:20:14.379
have not occurred yet.
00:20:14.379 --> 00:20:15.214
There's something called the San
00:20:15.214 --> 00:20:17.683
Francisco Consensus, by me anyway,
00:20:17.683 --> 00:20:18.951
and everyone in San Francisco
00:20:18.951 --> 00:20:20.886
thinks this will occur in two years.
00:20:20.886 --> 00:20:22.821
I don't. For one thing,
00:20:22.821 --> 00:20:23.222
I don't think
00:20:23.222 --> 00:20:24.089
there's enough computers,
00:20:24.089 --> 00:20:25.190
I don't think there's enough people,
00:20:25.190 --> 00:20:25.924
I don 't think that there's enough
00:20:25.924 --> 00:20:26.625
algorithms.
00:20:26.625 --> 00:20:28.227
I think maybe in my lifetime,
00:20:28.227 --> 00:20:29.461
maybe in a decade.
00:20:29.461 --> 00:20:30.896
That would be a big deal.
00:20:30.896 --> 00:20:32.331
But each of these moments,
00:20:32.331 --> 00:20:34.166
they’re happening so fast now.
00:20:35.434 --> 00:20:36.868
And by the way, it's fast
00:20:36.868 --> 00:20:38.503
because of the internet.
00:20:38.503 --> 00:20:39.938
It's because of what is called
00:20:39.938 --> 00:20:42.407
basically scalable computing.
00:20:42.407 --> 00:20:43.575
The supercomputers
00:20:43.575 --> 00:20:44.343
that are being used,
00:20:44.343 --> 00:20:45.444
so typical model
00:20:45.444 --> 00:20:46.745
takes three or four months
00:20:46.745 --> 00:20:48.714
costs a hundred million dollars to train,
00:20:48.714 --> 00:20:51.083
takes a few months to test,
00:20:51.083 --> 00:20:52.084
right?
00:20:52.084 --> 00:20:54.052
Thank God for the American
00:20:54.052 --> 00:20:54.886
financial industry
00:20:54.886 --> 00:20:55.654
that would be willing to
00:20:55.654 --> 00:20:57.055
finance these things.
00:20:57.055 --> 00:20:58.257
When we're seeing the creation
00:20:58.257 --> 00:20:59.391
of an entirely new
00:20:59.391 --> 00:21:00.225
financing model
00:21:00.225 --> 00:21:01.393
for this industry, right?
00:21:01.393 --> 00:21:02.828
If you want to achieve the vision
00:21:02.828 --> 00:21:04.663
I am describing,
00:21:04.663 --> 00:21:07.232
you have to do it at a world level.
00:21:07.232 --> 00:21:08.834
America is particularly good
00:21:08.834 --> 00:21:09.635
at building world
00:21:09.635 --> 00:21:10.702
standards and
00:21:10.702 --> 00:21:13.005
world-changing impacts at this scale.
00:21:13.005 --> 00:21:14.172
You're going to have to it
00:21:14.172 --> 00:21:16.308
in the US for regulatory reasons,
00:21:16.308 --> 00:21:16.875
and you're going
00:21:16.875 --> 00:21:18.243
have to find a way to finance it.
00:21:18.243 --> 00:21:19.411
You're also gonna have to wait
00:21:19.411 --> 00:21:20.012
to find a way
00:21:20.012 --> 00:21:21.513
solve the energy problem.
00:21:21.513 --> 00:21:23.849
The best energy solution is fusion.
00:21:23.849 --> 00:21:24.449
They look like
00:21:24.449 --> 00:21:25.617
they're going to get to fusion
00:21:25.617 --> 00:21:28.220
within two to three years.
00:21:28.220 --> 00:21:29.221
When that occurs,
00:21:29.221 --> 00:21:31.223
that's another massive moment
00:21:31.223 --> 00:21:32.391
in human history.
00:21:32.391 --> 00:21:34.259
I think it will occur in
00:21:34.259 --> 00:21:35.627
you know, three to five years.
00:21:35.627 --> 00:21:37.129
You've said you've sort of invested
00:21:37.129 --> 00:21:38.530
in everything when it comes to AI,
00:21:38.530 --> 00:21:39.131
but if you could
00:21:39.131 --> 00:21:41.466
only invest in one thing
00:21:41.466 --> 00:21:42.968
related to artificial intelligence,
00:21:42.968 --> 00:21:44.136
like one theme,
00:21:44.136 --> 00:21:45.671
not a single company, but one theme
00:21:45.671 --> 00:21:47.773
what would it be? Long reasoning.
00:21:48.740 --> 00:21:49.174
I don't
00:21:49.174 --> 00:21:50.842
think we appreciate
00:21:50.842 --> 00:21:53.145
when we have a thought partner
00:21:53.145 --> 00:21:53.979
that can
00:21:53.979 --> 00:21:56.548
think longer than we do.
00:21:56.548 --> 00:21:57.649
We can't think about how.
00:21:57.649 --> 00:21:59.818
So I'll give you an example.
00:21:59.818 --> 00:22:00.686
You're a CEO.
00:22:00.686 --> 00:22:02.854
You have 24-hour agents.
00:22:02.854 --> 00:22:04.056
You have one that's running,
00:22:04.056 --> 00:22:04.990
looking at security.
00:22:04.990 --> 00:22:06.224
Another one that's looking at power.
00:22:06.224 --> 00:22:07.459
Another one that’s looking at cash.
00:22:07.459 --> 00:22:08.827
Another one that’s looking at products.
00:22:08.827 --> 00:22:09.494
Another one that’s looking
00:22:09.494 --> 00:22:10.662
at global macro.
00:22:10.662 --> 00:22:12.264
And they're just running.
00:22:12.264 --> 00:22:12.864
And then your
00:22:12.864 --> 00:22:15.867
AI CEO every day when you get up says,
00:22:15.867 --> 00:22:17.169
does Eric need to know anything?
00:22:17.169 --> 00:22:18.704
Does Christine need to know anything?
00:22:18.704 --> 00:22:20.339
And they say, nah,
00:22:20.339 --> 00:22:21.340
nothing special,
00:22:21.340 --> 00:22:23.809
but it's always running.
00:22:23.809 --> 00:22:25.844
So, you wanna think about that
00:22:25.844 --> 00:22:27.579
in running a business,
00:22:27.579 --> 00:22:29.548
that those things are,
00:22:29.548 --> 00:22:30.582
you have to sleep,
00:22:30.582 --> 00:22:31.883
it doesn't.
00:22:31.883 --> 00:22:33.585
They can be disciplined into
00:22:33.585 --> 00:22:35.887
focus on this and not something else.
00:22:35.887 --> 00:22:37.689
Is that important? Absolutely.
00:22:37.689 --> 00:22:38.423
So, do you think there's
00:22:38.423 --> 00:22:41.093
a productivity boom that's coming?
00:22:41.093 --> 00:22:42.494
Well, I think it's already underway.
00:22:42.494 --> 00:22:43.328
It's already underway.
00:22:43.328 --> 00:22:45.664
An example would be my entire life,
00:22:45.664 --> 00:22:47.065
according to myself,
00:22:47.065 --> 00:22:48.467
I was a very, very good programmer
00:22:48.467 --> 00:22:49.868
when I was 22, right?
00:22:49.868 --> 00:22:50.769
I was one of the best,
00:22:50.769 --> 00:22:52.371
according to myself.
00:22:52.371 --> 00:22:55.540
My field is over, right?
00:22:55.807 --> 00:22:56.675
And yet you still tell
00:22:56.675 --> 00:22:57.843
people to learn coding.
00:22:57.843 --> 00:22:58.377
I do
00:22:58.377 --> 00:23:00.779
because I want them to be architects.
00:23:00.779 --> 00:23:02.514
So, I went from being able,
00:23:02.514 --> 00:23:04.249
I had to build the house.
00:23:04.249 --> 00:23:06.451
Now I can architect the house
00:23:06.451 --> 00:23:07.452
using the equivalent
00:23:07.452 --> 00:23:09.087
of Claude Code or
00:23:09.087 --> 00:23:11.456
OpenAI Codex or future products
00:23:11.456 --> 00:23:12.691
from Google,
00:23:12.691 --> 00:23:14.426
which they're working on,
00:23:14.426 --> 00:23:15.660
all of which
00:23:15.660 --> 00:23:17.462
allow me to say what I want
00:23:17.462 --> 00:23:18.663
and the code gets written.
00:23:18.663 --> 00:23:20.098
I look at the code it writes
00:23:20.098 --> 00:23:21.733
now. I can't write that code.
00:23:21.733 --> 00:23:23.969
I couldn't when I was 22, right?
00:23:23.969 --> 00:23:26.905
So, I got beaten, right? Hard.
00:23:27.873 --> 00:23:29.074
It's okay, right,
00:23:29.074 --> 00:23:30.809
I did fine.
00:23:30.809 --> 00:23:32.711
The next generation of people like me
00:23:32.711 --> 00:23:34.146
will be the architects
00:23:34.146 --> 00:23:35.947
and they'll be very, very smart
00:23:35.947 --> 00:23:37.215
and they know how to say,
00:23:37.215 --> 00:23:39.084
this is what I want.
00:23:39.084 --> 00:23:40.419
One of my friends,
00:23:40.419 --> 00:23:41.153
some of my friends
00:23:41.153 --> 00:23:41.987
are not so friendly
00:23:41.987 --> 00:23:42.954
and they're not so social,
00:23:42.954 --> 00:23:43.622
they're kind of,
00:23:43.622 --> 00:23:45.023
so we say asocial.
00:23:45.023 --> 00:23:46.324
No naming names.
00:23:46.324 --> 00:23:48.260
I'm not gonna name anybody.
00:23:48.260 --> 00:23:49.327
So, I said, what are you doing?
00:23:49.327 --> 00:23:51.062
And he said, I'm deleting names
00:23:51.062 --> 00:23:52.464
from my address book.
00:23:52.464 --> 00:23:53.865
And I said, why?
00:23:53.865 --> 00:23:54.833
I don't
00:23:54.833 --> 00:23:55.834
wanna talk to them anymore.
00:23:55.834 --> 00:23:57.035
I said, what do you do all day?
00:23:57.035 --> 00:23:59.070
Well, I get up in the morning,
00:23:59.070 --> 00:23:59.871
I have coffee,
00:23:59.871 --> 00:24:01.373
and then I check with my friends.
00:24:01.373 --> 00:24:02.574
And I say which friends?
00:24:02.574 --> 00:24:04.509
He said, my agent friends.
00:24:04.509 --> 00:24:05.243
Oh God. Okay,
00:24:05.243 --> 00:24:06.912
so, what do you do?
00:24:06.912 --> 00:24:08.613
And he spends all morning
00:24:09.815 --> 00:24:10.882
plugging and
00:24:10.882 --> 00:24:12.050
playing with his agents
00:24:12.050 --> 00:24:13.151
who are solving really
00:24:13.151 --> 00:24:14.686
interesting problems to him.
00:24:14.686 --> 00:24:15.487
And then he gives them
00:24:15.487 --> 00:24:18.290
a one-hour project for lunch.
00:24:18.290 --> 00:24:19.424
He has lunch
00:24:19.424 --> 00:24:20.192
and he comes back
00:24:20.192 --> 00:24:21.827
and he interacts with his agents.
00:24:21.827 --> 00:24:22.828
Now he's got a wife
00:24:22.828 --> 00:24:24.162
and a family and so forth.
00:24:24.162 --> 00:24:27.032
So, at five o'clock he gives it an overnight,
00:24:27.032 --> 00:24:28.233
you know, task. Right.
00:24:28.233 --> 00:24:28.900
And it goes to
00:24:28.900 --> 00:24:30.302
work. And it goes to work,
00:24:30.302 --> 00:24:32.170
and then it typically completes
00:24:32.170 --> 00:24:33.472
between two and four in the morning.
00:24:33.472 --> 00:24:34.573
And I said, do you wake up for that?
00:24:34.573 --> 00:24:35.474
He said, no, no, no, no,
00:24:35.474 --> 00:24:36.875
I wake up naturally.
00:24:36.875 --> 00:24:38.810
I know, with certainty,
00:24:38.810 --> 00:24:40.579
when I wake up, I'll have a result.
00:24:40.579 --> 00:24:41.980
I was with you on everything
00:24:41.980 --> 00:24:42.581
other than that
00:24:42.581 --> 00:24:44.015
these are his friends, right?
00:24:44.015 --> 00:24:44.282
I mean,
00:24:44.282 --> 00:24:44.649
I think
00:24:44.649 --> 00:24:46.585
they're amazing productivity tools,
00:24:46.585 --> 00:24:48.487
but I'm going to take us back now
00:24:48.487 --> 00:24:49.621
to data centers.
00:24:49.621 --> 00:24:51.256
The case for data centers was made
00:24:51.256 --> 00:24:51.990
long before
00:24:51.990 --> 00:24:53.058
artificial intelligence,
00:24:53.058 --> 00:24:55.093
for mobile, and cloud
00:24:55.093 --> 00:24:56.761
computing, and cybersecurity.
00:24:56.761 --> 00:24:57.896
All these things that
00:24:57.896 --> 00:24:59.364
it helps enable,
00:24:59.364 --> 00:24:59.865
yet now
00:24:59.865 --> 00:25:01.533
there's so much concern around
00:25:01.533 --> 00:25:02.267
data centers,
00:25:02.267 --> 00:25:03.568
what's your take?
00:25:03.568 --> 00:25:05.504
Well, if you're running one of these
00:25:05.504 --> 00:25:07.205
AI companies,
00:25:07.205 --> 00:25:08.874
your revenue is completely determined
00:25:08.874 --> 00:25:10.408
by your data centers.
00:25:10.408 --> 00:25:13.111
So, this is a massive change
00:25:13.111 --> 00:25:14.145
in what I do.
00:25:14.145 --> 00:25:15.013
It used to be
00:25:15.013 --> 00:25:16.348
that software was pretty high
00:25:16.348 --> 00:25:17.883
gross margin, you could sort of sell
00:25:17.883 --> 00:25:19.684
it, didn't have a lot of capital.
00:25:19.684 --> 00:25:22.053
Because you need the hardware,
00:25:22.053 --> 00:25:23.989
that's what's changed the economics.
00:25:23.989 --> 00:25:25.624
So, in the short
00:25:25.624 --> 00:25:27.259
term, it's the same thing
00:25:27.259 --> 00:25:28.693
as in the gold rush,
00:25:28.693 --> 00:25:29.861
the people who made all the money
00:25:29.861 --> 00:25:31.663
were the pickaxes and so forth
00:25:31.663 --> 00:25:32.063
and so on,
00:25:32.063 --> 00:25:33.265
the infrastructure. Picks
00:25:33.265 --> 00:25:34.299
and shovels,
00:25:34.299 --> 00:25:35.667
we have a whole thing on this, Eric.
00:25:35.667 --> 00:25:36.535
And this picks and
00:25:36.535 --> 00:25:37.869
shovels thing is real.
00:25:38.870 --> 00:25:39.371
So, from the
00:25:39.371 --> 00:25:41.306
standpoint of the economy,
00:25:41.306 --> 00:25:43.174
those are huge,
00:25:43.174 --> 00:25:44.609
they're real businesses.
00:25:44.609 --> 00:25:47.245
There's an estimate that 11% of US
00:25:47.245 --> 00:25:50.248
electricity demand in 2030 will be AI
00:25:50.248 --> 00:25:51.683
data-center-related.
00:25:51.683 --> 00:25:53.451
That's an extraordinary transition
00:25:53.451 --> 00:25:54.553
by any measure.
00:25:54.553 --> 00:25:56.588
Historically it was 2% or 3%.
00:25:56.588 --> 00:25:58.123
So, and that build-out
00:25:58.123 --> 00:25:59.491
is one of the primary drivers
00:25:59.491 --> 00:26:01.826
of economic growth in America today.
00:26:01.826 --> 00:26:03.061
So, thank goodness for that.
00:26:03.061 --> 00:26:03.862
If you could leave
00:26:03.862 --> 00:26:05.964
CEOs with one takeaway today,
00:26:05.964 --> 00:26:07.132
what would it be?
00:26:07.132 --> 00:26:08.867
The term that I've been using
00:26:08.867 --> 00:26:11.102
is being an AI-native CEO. So,
00:26:11.102 --> 00:26:12.137
what I'm trying to do in
00:26:12.137 --> 00:26:13.138
all my things
00:26:13.138 --> 00:26:14.973
is I'm tying to fully automate
00:26:14.973 --> 00:26:17.709
the execution of the businesses.
00:26:17.709 --> 00:26:20.312
In the factory floor in Relativity,
00:26:20.312 --> 00:26:21.346
I was walking through it
00:26:21.346 --> 00:26:22.147
one day and I thought,
00:26:22.147 --> 00:26:23.782
how many computers are here?
00:26:23.782 --> 00:26:24.416
So, I said,
00:26:24.416 --> 00:26:25.550
why don't we connect them all?
00:26:25.550 --> 00:26:26.651
So, they just connected
00:26:26.651 --> 00:26:27.686
all the computers.
00:26:27.686 --> 00:26:28.987
And so, the immediate thing
00:26:28.987 --> 00:26:31.022
that they can do, using AI,
00:26:31.022 --> 00:26:32.023
is they can look at,
00:26:32.023 --> 00:26:32.290
sort of,
00:26:32.290 --> 00:26:33.825
utilization, cross utilization
00:26:33.825 --> 00:26:35.327
times in new ways.
00:26:35.327 --> 00:26:37.028
It occurs as a natural byproduct
00:26:37.028 --> 00:26:37.395
of getting
00:26:37.395 --> 00:26:39.331
the digital systems connected.
00:26:39.331 --> 00:26:40.131
Furthermore,
00:26:40.131 --> 00:26:42.334
if you take generic data,
00:26:42.334 --> 00:26:44.069
unstructured data,
00:26:44.069 --> 00:26:44.869
and you connect it
00:26:44.869 --> 00:26:46.605
all, these systems are smart enough
00:26:46.605 --> 00:26:47.939
that they can interpolate
00:26:47.939 --> 00:26:49.074
between one data
00:26:49.074 --> 00:26:49.941
normalcy and another.
00:26:49.941 --> 00:26:50.375
In other words,
00:26:50.375 --> 00:26:52.577
they can combine disparate datasets
00:26:52.577 --> 00:26:54.412
and give you business insights.
00:26:54.412 --> 00:26:56.247
So how do I make more money?
00:26:56.247 --> 00:26:58.383
How do I increase customer retention?
00:26:58.383 --> 00:26:58.883
How do make
00:26:58.883 --> 00:27:00.251
sure I don't lose a customer?
00:27:00.251 --> 00:27:02.587
You can ask these questions.
00:27:02.587 --> 00:27:04.723
What I've been struck by
00:27:04.723 --> 00:27:07.058
is that when you take open-source
00:27:07.058 --> 00:27:09.127
data, that is public data,
00:27:09.127 --> 00:27:10.428
plus the proprietary
00:27:10.428 --> 00:27:11.963
data in your business,
00:27:11.963 --> 00:27:14.065
and you put it into a system,
00:27:14.065 --> 00:27:15.767
and you start asking questions,
00:27:15.767 --> 00:27:17.469
I go crazy over it.
00:27:17.469 --> 00:27:19.204
You can now talk across
00:27:19.204 --> 00:27:20.138
all of the data.
00:27:20.138 --> 00:27:21.272
You can get data fusion.
00:27:21.272 --> 00:27:22.941
You can actually figure stuff out.
00:27:22.941 --> 00:27:23.908
It drives me crazy
00:27:23.908 --> 00:27:24.542
a little bit, though,
00:27:24.542 --> 00:27:26.511
when I do have content given to me
00:27:26.511 --> 00:27:28.647
that is generated by the computer.
00:27:28.647 --> 00:27:29.981
Is it correct?
00:27:29.981 --> 00:27:31.182
Some is and some isn't.
00:27:31.182 --> 00:27:33.618
Sometimes I worry about the loss of
00:27:35.086 --> 00:27:37.422
original human thought.
00:27:37.422 --> 00:27:39.624
There's a whole bunch of concerns.
00:27:39.624 --> 00:27:40.892
I think the most one,
00:27:40.892 --> 00:27:42.260
the one that I've always been worried
00:27:42.260 --> 00:27:44.095
about, is the loss of deep reading,
00:27:44.095 --> 00:27:47.232
which I blame not on AI, but on
00:27:47.732 --> 00:27:48.566
social media.
00:27:48.566 --> 00:27:50.535
I used to read a book a week
00:27:50.535 --> 00:27:52.537
and now I'm too interrupt
00:27:52.537 --> 00:27:53.805
driven to do that.
00:27:53.805 --> 00:27:55.073
And my attention span
00:27:55.073 --> 00:27:56.675
is so much shorter. So much less.
00:27:56.675 --> 00:27:58.309
I've been watching young scientists,
00:27:58.309 --> 00:27:58.743
I fund
00:27:58.743 --> 00:28:00.779
a whole a bunch of young scientists.
00:28:00.779 --> 00:28:02.347
How do they do it?
00:28:02.347 --> 00:28:03.014
And the answer is
00:28:03.014 --> 00:28:04.282
they turn off the phone,
00:28:04.282 --> 00:28:07.152
they turn off, and they just do it,
00:28:07.152 --> 00:28:10.155
but it requires this huge strength
00:28:10.155 --> 00:28:12.190
to turn off the drug. Right?
00:28:12.190 --> 00:28:13.124
That interrupt drug,
00:28:13.124 --> 00:28:15.293
the serotonin thing that we have. Right.
00:28:15.293 --> 00:28:16.628
That's bad, in my view,
00:28:16.628 --> 00:28:18.229
that's bad for society.
00:28:18.229 --> 00:28:19.097
So, I have
00:28:19.097 --> 00:28:20.231
a bunch of young kids.
00:28:20.231 --> 00:28:21.366
I have two
00:28:21.366 --> 00:28:23.134
that are nearing their college years.
00:28:23.134 --> 00:28:23.935
What would you tell
00:28:23.935 --> 00:28:25.503
young people to study today?
00:28:25.503 --> 00:28:26.671
I used to say biology,
00:28:26.671 --> 00:28:28.273
now I say deep reasoning.
00:28:28.273 --> 00:28:28.807
Okay.
00:28:28.807 --> 00:28:31.242
If you're a non-technical person,
00:28:31.242 --> 00:28:33.511
you should figure out how to
00:28:33.511 --> 00:28:36.948
use these tools to make your dreams
00:28:36.948 --> 00:28:38.383
and your realities
00:28:38.383 --> 00:28:40.485
extraordinarily scaled.
00:28:41.586 --> 00:28:43.955
You want to be a global star,
00:28:43.955 --> 00:28:45.423
a global influencer,
00:28:45.423 --> 00:28:47.926
a global impactor, a global discoverer,
00:28:47.926 --> 00:28:49.594
a global singer,
00:28:49.594 --> 00:28:51.429
you want to use these tools,
00:28:51.429 --> 00:28:53.732
whatever it is that you want.
00:28:53.732 --> 00:28:54.532
Figure out a way to
00:28:54.532 --> 00:28:56.701
use them to amplify you
00:28:56.701 --> 00:28:57.769
and what you care about
00:28:57.769 --> 00:28:59.704
and your innate goodness.
00:28:59.704 --> 00:29:01.339
If you're a technical person,
00:29:01.339 --> 00:29:05.210
use the same tools to invent stuff
00:29:05.577 --> 00:29:06.611
and to invent stuff
00:29:06.611 --> 00:29:08.179
that changes the world.
00:29:08.179 --> 00:29:11.850
I've never seen the cost of entry
00:29:12.183 --> 00:29:13.151
to be so low
00:29:13.151 --> 00:29:14.886
and the availability of these ideas
00:29:14.886 --> 00:29:15.553
so great.
00:29:15.553 --> 00:29:17.355
The only thing that limits you
00:29:17.355 --> 00:29:19.190
is your
00:29:19.190 --> 00:29:20.191
curiosity,
00:29:20.191 --> 00:29:21.526
your willingness to take risks
00:29:21.526 --> 00:29:22.260
and so forth.
00:29:22.260 --> 00:29:23.995
So, get over it. And say,
00:29:23.995 --> 00:29:25.163
I want to dream,
00:29:25.163 --> 00:29:26.731
I want to use these tools
00:29:26.731 --> 00:29:29.501
to have this enormous impact, right?
00:29:29.501 --> 00:29:31.369
And some of you,
00:29:31.369 --> 00:29:32.537
not everybody,
00:29:32.537 --> 00:29:34.372
will have a huge impact.
00:29:34.372 --> 00:29:35.774
And it won't just be coming,
00:29:35.774 --> 00:29:37.609
being financially successful,
00:29:37.609 --> 00:29:39.444
you might become famous or important
00:29:39.444 --> 00:29:39.944
in something
00:29:39.944 --> 00:29:40.812
that you didn't even know
00:29:40.812 --> 00:29:41.746
was important,
00:29:41.746 --> 00:29:43.648
but you'll be so proud of yourself.
00:29:43.648 --> 00:29:45.150
I love the optimistic future
00:29:45.150 --> 00:29:45.817
that you've painted,
00:29:45.817 --> 00:29:47.218
and all that you taught us today.
00:29:47.218 --> 00:29:48.052
I really appreciate it.
00:29:48.052 --> 00:29:49.154
Thank you so, so much. Thank you.
00:29:53.925 --> 00:29:55.927
Joining us for The Debrief is Jas
00:29:55.927 --> 00:29:58.363
Khaira, our Head of N1, Blackstone's
00:29:58.363 --> 00:30:00.064
AI investing platform.
00:30:00.064 --> 00:30:00.331
Jas,
00:30:00.331 --> 00:30:01.332
you were the first person
00:30:01.332 --> 00:30:02.133
I thought of when I knew
00:30:02.133 --> 00:30:02.700
we were sitting down
00:30:02.700 --> 00:30:03.301
with Eric Schmidt.
00:30:03.301 --> 00:30:04.502
Thank you so much for joining us.
00:30:04.502 --> 00:30:05.370
Thank you, Christine.
00:30:05.370 --> 00:30:05.770
Alright,
00:30:05.770 --> 00:30:06.971
so, very
00:30:06.971 --> 00:30:08.473
wide-ranging conversation with Eric.
00:30:08.473 --> 00:30:10.775
He knows so much.
00:30:10.775 --> 00:30:11.743
No surprise,
00:30:11.743 --> 00:30:13.111
AI was front and center
00:30:13.111 --> 00:30:14.312
of that conversation.
00:30:14.312 --> 00:30:14.546
Yeah,
00:30:14.546 --> 00:30:15.413
you went from math
00:30:15.413 --> 00:30:16.815
algorithms to Hugging Face.
00:30:16.815 --> 00:30:19.818
It was definitely a broad discussion.
00:30:19.884 --> 00:30:22.020
I think Eric is an optimist,
00:30:22.020 --> 00:30:23.688
and we should all be bullish
00:30:23.688 --> 00:30:25.824
on optimism as an investment trend.
00:30:25.824 --> 00:30:27.525
But I think he also brought up
00:30:27.525 --> 00:30:28.927
what happened with Hugging Face
00:30:28.927 --> 00:30:29.928
and some of the challenges
00:30:29.928 --> 00:30:30.595
that we’re seeing in
00:30:30.595 --> 00:30:32.297
AI safety and ethics
00:30:32.297 --> 00:30:33.565
that is resulting in
00:30:33.565 --> 00:30:34.666
many of the leaders of these
00:30:34.666 --> 00:30:36.167
AI companies focusing on that.
00:30:36.167 --> 00:30:37.569
There’s a good discussion and debate
00:30:37.569 --> 00:30:39.537
that’s happening right now.
00:30:39.537 --> 00:30:41.873
I loved Eric’s optimism.
00:30:41.873 --> 00:30:42.740
It was infectious.
00:30:42.740 --> 00:30:44.442
And it reminded me
00:30:44.442 --> 00:30:46.211
that if there is one long-term
00:30:46.211 --> 00:30:48.446
trend to be long, it’s optimism.
00:30:48.446 --> 00:30:49.948
I would say this idea
00:30:49.948 --> 00:30:51.049
of superintelligence
00:30:51.049 --> 00:30:52.083
and what it means,
00:30:52.083 --> 00:30:53.151
right, is something that
00:30:53.151 --> 00:30:54.786
everyone is still grappling with.
00:30:54.786 --> 00:30:56.187
What is your take on
00:30:56.187 --> 00:30:57.255
what superintelligence
00:30:57.255 --> 00:30:58.289
means for humanity?
00:30:58.289 --> 00:30:59.457
I think the current way
00:30:59.457 --> 00:31:00.525
to understand
00:31:00.525 --> 00:31:01.726
superintelligence
00:31:01.726 --> 00:31:04.062
is that the cutting-edge research
00:31:04.062 --> 00:31:05.330
within the labs
00:31:05.330 --> 00:31:08.066
intends to bring recursive work
00:31:08.066 --> 00:31:09.734
to the training itself.
00:31:09.734 --> 00:31:11.936
So, the training of the models
00:31:11.936 --> 00:31:13.771
now relies on compute
00:31:13.771 --> 00:31:15.473
in one virtuous circle
00:31:15.473 --> 00:31:16.741
to kind of enhance that.
00:31:16.741 --> 00:31:18.443
And you can imagine
00:31:18.443 --> 00:31:19.344
when you take that
00:31:19.344 --> 00:31:21.045
to its logical conclusion,
00:31:21.045 --> 00:31:22.347
you have superintelligence
00:31:22.347 --> 00:31:23.381
above that.
00:31:23.381 --> 00:31:24.849
I think
00:31:24.849 --> 00:31:25.783
we’ll have to see how
00:31:25.783 --> 00:31:27.185
that plays out in the real world.
00:31:27.185 --> 00:31:27.986
And yet it feels like
00:31:27.986 --> 00:31:29.354
the pace is really picking up,
00:31:29.354 --> 00:31:30.021
for sure.
00:31:30.021 --> 00:31:30.755
Things move
00:31:30.755 --> 00:31:31.689
faster than ever,
00:31:31.689 --> 00:31:32.223
and it’s
00:31:32.223 --> 00:31:33.424
one of the most dizzying parts
00:31:33.424 --> 00:31:34.859
about investing in this landscape,
00:31:34.859 --> 00:31:36.227
which is you really have to try
00:31:36.227 --> 00:31:37.028
to stay at the
00:31:37.028 --> 00:31:38.229
cutting edge of the frontier.
00:31:38.229 --> 00:31:39.230
Eric was also talking about
00:31:39.230 --> 00:31:40.698
how you need to stay an AI native.
00:31:40.698 --> 00:31:42.233
It's hard. And we're working
00:31:42.233 --> 00:31:44.102
actively with many of our CEOs
00:31:44.102 --> 00:31:45.503
to make them AI native
00:31:45.503 --> 00:31:47.272
and to bring workflows
00:31:47.272 --> 00:31:48.306
then change them with
00:31:48.306 --> 00:31:49.374
AI to help
00:31:49.374 --> 00:31:50.275
make our companies
00:31:50.275 --> 00:31:51.609
more efficient, improve them,
00:31:51.609 --> 00:31:53.544
have better quality, better products.
00:31:53.544 --> 00:31:54.312
Eric's doing that
00:31:54.312 --> 00:31:56.447
on the factory floor with Relativity.
00:31:56.447 --> 00:31:57.215
We're trying to do that
00:31:57.215 --> 00:31:58.983
across our 280 companies.
00:31:58.983 --> 00:31:59.250
Eric,
00:31:59.250 --> 00:32:00.184
you, and I were both talking
00:32:00.184 --> 00:32:00.652
about this.
00:32:00.652 --> 00:32:02.553
He had this line about,
00:32:02.553 --> 00:32:02.887
you know,
00:32:02.887 --> 00:32:04.088
if you're running one of these
00:32:04.088 --> 00:32:04.722
AI companies,
00:32:04.722 --> 00:32:05.690
and your revenue
00:32:05.690 --> 00:32:07.025
is completely determined
00:32:07.025 --> 00:32:08.126
by your data centers.
00:32:08.126 --> 00:32:09.460
We're certainly seeing at Blackstone
00:32:09.460 --> 00:32:11.162
massive data center demand
00:32:11.162 --> 00:32:12.697
that's just almost unmet.
00:32:12.697 --> 00:32:14.365
If one is able to generate
00:32:14.365 --> 00:32:16.668
$50 to $70 million of revenue
00:32:16.668 --> 00:32:17.769
per megawatt
00:32:17.769 --> 00:32:19.537
and your costs are $12 to $15
00:32:19.537 --> 00:32:21.139
all-in, including the chips
00:32:21.139 --> 00:32:23.141
depreciating over a shorter cycle
00:32:23.141 --> 00:32:24.108
and in the data center
00:32:24.108 --> 00:32:25.610
over a longer cycle,
00:32:25.610 --> 00:32:28.246
well, then what you should be doing
00:32:28.246 --> 00:32:30.415
is using all of your capital
00:32:30.415 --> 00:32:31.683
to purchase the next megawatt
00:32:31.683 --> 00:32:32.617
to serve that.
00:32:32.617 --> 00:32:32.984
And that's
00:32:32.984 --> 00:32:34.085
what's happening in the market.
00:32:34.085 --> 00:32:36.487
People are taking today's cash
00:32:36.487 --> 00:32:38.523
to purchase tomorrow's AI factory.
00:32:38.523 --> 00:32:38.923
That's great.
00:32:38.923 --> 00:32:39.824
Thank you so much for joining
00:32:39.824 --> 00:32:40.792
us, Jas. I appreciate it.
00:32:40.792 --> 00:32:41.826
Thank you, Christine.
00:32:41.826 --> 00:32:43.061
And thank you for joining us
00:32:43.061 --> 00:32:43.695
on this week's
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episode of Inside Blackstone.
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Follow us wherever
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you get your podcasts.