WEBVTT
00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:02.839
This episode is sponsored by 5 .11, a company
00:00:02.839 --> 00:00:05.059
that I've used for well over a decade and continue
00:00:05.059 --> 00:00:08.539
to use to this day. And 5 .11 is offering you
00:00:08.539 --> 00:00:10.640
guys, the audience of the Behind the Shield podcast,
00:00:10.960 --> 00:00:13.759
a discount on every purchase you make with them.
00:00:14.179 --> 00:00:16.280
Before we get to that code, I want to highlight
00:00:16.280 --> 00:00:18.199
a couple of products that again I personally
00:00:18.199 --> 00:00:22.120
use today. One of the most impressive products
00:00:22.120 --> 00:00:25.559
they just released is their Rush Backpack 2 .0.
00:00:25.980 --> 00:00:27.719
Now, for many of you, whether you're going to
00:00:27.719 --> 00:00:29.339
the fire station, the police station, whether
00:00:29.339 --> 00:00:31.320
you're traveling with your family, whether you're
00:00:31.320 --> 00:00:34.159
taking training courses, we have to fly, we have
00:00:34.159 --> 00:00:36.700
to drive, we have to take trains. And I have
00:00:36.700 --> 00:00:40.280
to say, I own multiple backpacks, many of 5 .11's
00:00:40.280 --> 00:00:42.520
different ones, but as far as a day pack, this
00:00:42.520 --> 00:00:45.259
one was the most impressive. There are so many
00:00:45.259 --> 00:00:47.520
different compartments. The way it sits on your
00:00:47.520 --> 00:00:49.920
back is incredibly comfortable. If you are a
00:00:49.920 --> 00:00:52.399
concealed carry person, there's also a spot for
00:00:52.399 --> 00:00:55.380
a weapon. So they've thought of multiple, multiple
00:00:55.380 --> 00:00:57.520
things that a man or woman would have to do on
00:00:57.520 --> 00:01:00.759
a daily basis. That is in addition to all of
00:01:00.759 --> 00:01:03.420
the products that I talk about a lot. Their uniforms
00:01:03.420 --> 00:01:07.319
fit for men or fit for women in the first responder
00:01:07.319 --> 00:01:09.989
professions. The footwear that they offer, whether
00:01:09.989 --> 00:01:12.390
it's the Norris sneaker or the Atlas system that
00:01:12.390 --> 00:01:15.049
is designed for foot health and therefore knees
00:01:15.049 --> 00:01:18.370
and back and hips and shoulders and neck. As
00:01:18.370 --> 00:01:20.209
a civilian, I live in a lot of their clothes
00:01:20.209 --> 00:01:22.209
as well. Their jeans stretch. You can actually
00:01:22.209 --> 00:01:24.689
squat down in them. We live in Florida here,
00:01:24.769 --> 00:01:26.750
so I wear a lot of their shorts, which again,
00:01:26.849 --> 00:01:28.730
very, very lightweight material. You can get
00:01:28.730 --> 00:01:31.510
it wet and it will dry almost immediately. And
00:01:31.510 --> 00:01:33.310
then moving to the fitness and tactical space,
00:01:33.609 --> 00:01:36.370
I used to have just a regular weight vest. Recently,
00:01:36.370 --> 00:01:38.849
I switched to a 5 .11 vest and actually bought
00:01:38.849 --> 00:01:41.569
ballistic plates as well. My thinking was simply,
00:01:41.629 --> 00:01:43.450
if I'm going to have a vest, why not have one
00:01:43.450 --> 00:01:45.730
that protects me as well? And that Tac vest is
00:01:45.730 --> 00:01:47.849
trusted by law enforcement all around the country.
00:01:48.370 --> 00:01:50.150
So I mentioned they were going to offer you a
00:01:50.150 --> 00:01:53.189
discount code. So if you go to 5 .11tactical
00:01:53.189 --> 00:01:56.769
.com and enter the code SHIELD15, S -H -I -E
00:01:56.769 --> 00:02:00.849
-L -D -1 -5, you'll get 15 % off, not just that
00:02:00.849 --> 00:02:02.969
one purchase, but every time you visit their
00:02:02.969 --> 00:02:05.519
store. And if you want to learn more about 5
00:02:05.519 --> 00:02:08.039
.11, their mission, their products, then listen
00:02:08.039 --> 00:02:11.159
to episode 338 of the Behind the Shield podcast
00:02:11.159 --> 00:02:15.219
with the CEO and founder, Francisco Morales.
00:02:16.419 --> 00:02:19.900
Welcome to episode 561 of Behind the Shield podcast.
00:02:20.099 --> 00:02:22.000
As always, my name is James Geering, and this
00:02:22.000 --> 00:02:24.680
week it is my absolute honor to welcome on the
00:02:24.680 --> 00:02:28.699
show, Frank Wright. Now, it's not often that
00:02:28.699 --> 00:02:30.719
you get to speak to a veteran from the World
00:02:30.719 --> 00:02:33.439
War II era, but it's even less likely you'll
00:02:33.439 --> 00:02:35.479
get to speak to one of the Marines that stood
00:02:35.479 --> 00:02:38.960
on Iwo Jima. So Frank's story is incredible,
00:02:39.120 --> 00:02:42.120
from his hilarious enlistment story where he
00:02:42.120 --> 00:02:45.800
wasn't heavy enough to make the grade, so he
00:02:45.800 --> 00:02:48.620
improvised, through to some of his incredible
00:02:48.620 --> 00:02:51.680
deployments, having to fight with bayonets and
00:02:51.680 --> 00:02:55.139
knives in Guam, being shot multiple times on
00:02:55.139 --> 00:02:58.830
Iwo Jima. his incredible mental health story,
00:02:58.969 --> 00:03:02.849
and so much more. So I urge you to listen from
00:03:02.849 --> 00:03:06.629
beginning to end to hear the perspective of a
00:03:06.629 --> 00:03:10.349
true warrior of World War II. Before we get to
00:03:10.349 --> 00:03:12.629
this incredible conversation, as I say every
00:03:12.629 --> 00:03:14.689
week, please just take a moment, go to whichever
00:03:14.689 --> 00:03:17.469
app you listen to this on, subscribe to the show.
00:03:17.900 --> 00:03:20.719
Leave feedback and leave a rating. Each five
00:03:20.719 --> 00:03:23.360
-star rating truly does elevate this podcast,
00:03:23.639 --> 00:03:26.439
making it easier for others to find. And this
00:03:26.439 --> 00:03:31.939
is a free library of 561 episodes now. So all
00:03:31.939 --> 00:03:34.479
I ask in return is that you help share these
00:03:34.479 --> 00:03:37.360
incredible men and women's stories so I can get
00:03:37.360 --> 00:03:39.919
them to every single person who needs to hear
00:03:39.919 --> 00:03:43.500
them. So with that being said, I introduce to
00:03:43.500 --> 00:04:06.550
you Frank Wright. Enjoy. So, Frank, I just want
00:04:06.550 --> 00:04:08.849
to start by saying thank you so much for coming
00:04:08.849 --> 00:04:13.750
on the Behind the Shield podcast today. Thank
00:04:13.750 --> 00:04:17.089
you. My pleasure to do this. Give me a little
00:04:17.089 --> 00:04:21.889
bit more exposure to get rid of my not get rid
00:04:21.889 --> 00:04:26.350
to sell my book. Absolutely. Well, there's so
00:04:26.350 --> 00:04:29.779
much I want to ask you about because. Being a
00:04:29.779 --> 00:04:32.259
soldier from the World War II generation and
00:04:32.259 --> 00:04:36.100
reading your book, I see so many parallels with
00:04:36.100 --> 00:04:39.500
the issues that modern -day soldiers, firefighters,
00:04:39.959 --> 00:04:46.120
police officers deal with in 2022. So for everyone
00:04:46.120 --> 00:04:49.220
listening, where are we finding you geographically
00:04:49.220 --> 00:04:59.100
today? I'm in Lunar, California. And do you want
00:04:59.100 --> 00:05:02.279
further information on that? Just whatever you'd
00:05:02.279 --> 00:05:03.959
like to say. I'll start with the beginning in
00:05:03.959 --> 00:05:08.800
the moment. About 35 miles south of Sacramento.
00:05:09.660 --> 00:05:16.279
And it's just parallel to about San Francisco.
00:05:17.560 --> 00:05:24.300
And it's a small town. I don't know exactly what
00:05:24.300 --> 00:05:30.540
the... population is but it's a very nice town
00:05:30.540 --> 00:05:36.240
and it's what brought me here in this particular
00:05:36.240 --> 00:05:42.180
area was nearly all of the houses in the area
00:05:42.180 --> 00:05:47.620
had such pretty lawns and real green and very
00:05:47.620 --> 00:05:53.110
manicured so we like that so We moved up from
00:05:53.110 --> 00:05:59.269
Sacramento, from Stockton, to get into the Lodi
00:05:59.269 --> 00:06:05.170
area, and then that gave us a start on a long
00:06:05.170 --> 00:06:10.470
term. I have lived in Lodi off and on for about
00:06:10.470 --> 00:06:20.779
all 50, 60 years. So it's been a long... for
00:06:20.779 --> 00:06:24.240
me to be in one spot like this because I was
00:06:24.240 --> 00:06:29.259
used to moving around for a while with my wife
00:06:29.259 --> 00:06:34.220
about every five years. And then finally we moved
00:06:34.220 --> 00:06:43.279
into the California area and we just stayed down
00:06:43.279 --> 00:06:46.040
here. It was just too wet for me up in Oregon.
00:06:46.319 --> 00:06:51.480
Go ahead. No, so I would love to start at the
00:06:51.480 --> 00:06:53.319
very beginning because you talked about traveling.
00:06:53.360 --> 00:06:55.160
Obviously, you've literally traveled around the
00:06:55.160 --> 00:06:58.459
world through the military and then after. So
00:06:58.459 --> 00:07:01.139
tell me where you were born and then tell me
00:07:01.139 --> 00:07:03.819
about your family, what your mom and dad did
00:07:03.819 --> 00:07:07.100
and how many siblings you had. Well, I was born
00:07:07.100 --> 00:07:18.009
in 1925. two other brothers two brothers with
00:07:18.009 --> 00:07:20.889
me there were three and three boys in our family
00:07:20.889 --> 00:07:28.209
my dad was uh on worked on wpa he did two jobs
00:07:28.209 --> 00:07:33.089
uh working uh with the post office and working
00:07:33.089 --> 00:07:38.870
on the state capitol as a tool checker so uh
00:07:38.870 --> 00:07:45.209
and my mother worked for gus blasses I think
00:07:45.209 --> 00:07:50.490
it was called Gus Blass Department Store. And
00:07:50.490 --> 00:08:00.649
I was a school kid. And we had no transportation.
00:08:01.050 --> 00:08:06.750
We didn't have any automobiles until Arkansas
00:08:06.750 --> 00:08:12.980
gave the first World War veterans a bonus. And
00:08:12.980 --> 00:08:18.519
then he purchased a car at that time with that
00:08:18.519 --> 00:08:26.060
bonus that the state of Arkansas gave all the
00:08:26.060 --> 00:08:31.060
veterans on it, which was many years ago. I don't
00:08:31.060 --> 00:08:36.320
know exactly when it was, but I know I was probably
00:08:36.320 --> 00:08:42.500
four years old at that time. And I went to school
00:08:42.500 --> 00:08:49.419
at Little Rock Eastside Junior High School. No,
00:08:49.440 --> 00:08:55.179
first I went to grade school at Peabody. And
00:08:55.179 --> 00:09:00.460
then I went from there after sixth grade, went
00:09:00.460 --> 00:09:05.000
to Eastside Junior High. And then from there
00:09:05.000 --> 00:09:13.009
I went to Little Rock Senior High. and uh that
00:09:13.009 --> 00:09:18.450
was the came became a little famous when uh the
00:09:18.450 --> 00:09:23.169
uh little rock senior high became uh integrated
00:09:23.169 --> 00:09:30.429
with the uh african americans there and uh uh
00:09:30.429 --> 00:09:35.809
but they were they were not uh school was not
00:09:35.809 --> 00:09:38.029
integrated at the time that i was going there
00:09:39.600 --> 00:09:45.419
But I stayed in high school until I was in the
00:09:45.419 --> 00:09:52.159
10th grade, I think it was. And I was 16. And
00:09:52.159 --> 00:09:58.519
World War III, World War II, we're not there
00:09:58.519 --> 00:10:07.480
yet. I hope not. World War II, that was in 1941.
00:10:08.830 --> 00:10:14.929
I was in the 11th grade at that time. I had not
00:10:14.929 --> 00:10:19.409
graduated high school from senior high on it.
00:10:19.730 --> 00:10:25.529
Actually, I was making airplanes, model airplanes
00:10:25.529 --> 00:10:31.029
for a five and dime store in Little Rock. And
00:10:31.029 --> 00:10:35.409
I'd make an airplane. They'd give me the airplane
00:10:35.409 --> 00:10:39.289
to... I would make the airplane, and then I would
00:10:39.289 --> 00:10:42.870
give it back to them, and they would give me
00:10:42.870 --> 00:10:46.730
one for making it. So that's how I got my stuff.
00:10:46.809 --> 00:10:51.490
I would work for it on it. And I was making airplanes
00:10:51.490 --> 00:10:59.149
at that time for the department store, and I
00:10:59.149 --> 00:11:07.169
heard the information on the radio. that Pearl
00:11:07.169 --> 00:11:11.490
Harbor had been bombed. And of course, I didn't
00:11:11.490 --> 00:11:13.970
know where Pearl Harbor was, but I knew that
00:11:13.970 --> 00:11:19.950
it was part of the United States. So I started
00:11:19.950 --> 00:11:25.289
getting the fever to join up with the service
00:11:25.289 --> 00:11:30.049
on it so I could get out of the area on it. And
00:11:30.049 --> 00:11:35.799
that's how... I started to get into the Marine
00:11:35.799 --> 00:11:41.840
Corps. So I went to the Navy and I was too light.
00:11:42.139 --> 00:11:47.000
I went to the Marines and I was too light and
00:11:47.000 --> 00:11:52.559
wasn't old enough. So I was supposed to be 17
00:11:52.559 --> 00:11:57.039
at that time, but I couldn't make the grade.
00:11:57.500 --> 00:12:03.610
But my mother's... sister was a notary public
00:12:03.610 --> 00:12:08.029
and she knew how to get around that and she made
00:12:08.029 --> 00:12:13.889
out a delayed birth certificate and gave me a
00:12:13.889 --> 00:12:20.009
different birth date. So I joined the Marine
00:12:20.009 --> 00:12:27.029
Corps using my younger brother's birth date and
00:12:27.029 --> 00:12:35.340
then that made me just Verity 17. So I took his
00:12:35.340 --> 00:12:40.820
birthday all through the Marine Corps until I
00:12:40.820 --> 00:12:46.179
got filed up for Social Security. And when I
00:12:46.179 --> 00:12:49.039
became 65 and signed up for Social Security,
00:12:49.259 --> 00:12:53.840
they asked me when I was born. And so I said,
00:12:54.179 --> 00:12:59.940
well, I gave him my real birth date. And he said,
00:13:00.019 --> 00:13:02.220
well, the records show that you were born in
00:13:02.220 --> 00:13:06.100
December, not July. I said, well, I lied about
00:13:06.100 --> 00:13:09.220
my age. So he said, well, that's all right. He
00:13:09.220 --> 00:13:11.559
says, I'll just change it here. He says, a lot
00:13:11.559 --> 00:13:16.379
of servicemen did that. And I had been carrying
00:13:16.379 --> 00:13:20.860
my brother's birth date for many years until,
00:13:20.919 --> 00:13:25.580
I have to say, until I got it filed up and had
00:13:25.580 --> 00:13:31.919
them correct it. Social Security. I went from
00:13:31.919 --> 00:13:38.139
there. I went for seven other people, kids that
00:13:38.139 --> 00:13:44.820
were just 17. And we took the oath with the Marine
00:13:44.820 --> 00:13:54.620
Corps in January the 21st, 1942, which was just
00:13:54.620 --> 00:13:59.240
several, about three or four weeks. after Pearl
00:13:59.240 --> 00:14:03.580
Harbor. Well, you talked about being too light,
00:14:03.659 --> 00:14:06.340
just to interject for a moment. When you were
00:14:06.340 --> 00:14:09.179
referring to that, your physical weight was below
00:14:09.179 --> 00:14:11.539
the standard that they want. So tell me the story
00:14:11.539 --> 00:14:13.519
about how you overcame the weight challenge.
00:14:16.519 --> 00:14:21.720
Well, the first thing he did, he wanted to know
00:14:21.720 --> 00:14:25.059
if I was, how old I was, and I told him this
00:14:25.059 --> 00:14:29.840
was the recruit. recruiting sergeant and so i
00:14:29.840 --> 00:14:33.960
told him that uh i was 17 and he said well you
00:14:33.960 --> 00:14:37.740
don't look it he says but just get on the scales
00:14:37.740 --> 00:14:46.899
and so i was uh i uh i remember what the date
00:14:46.899 --> 00:14:50.460
the weight was supposed to be but i was about
00:14:50.460 --> 00:14:54.360
five pounds underneath the standard weight of
00:14:54.360 --> 00:15:01.840
going in And so I went home and started eating
00:15:01.840 --> 00:15:06.659
bananas. And finally, I just took some bananas
00:15:06.659 --> 00:15:09.200
and stuffed them in my back pocket, my front
00:15:09.200 --> 00:15:13.860
pocket, all over. And then I made the grade by
00:15:13.860 --> 00:15:19.879
putting five pounds of bananas on mine. I had
00:15:19.879 --> 00:15:28.220
some in my socks. Yeah. So I really started my
00:15:28.220 --> 00:15:36.340
career by lying. I did too. And that was the
00:15:36.340 --> 00:15:40.340
first lie that I had ever made. It's interesting
00:15:40.340 --> 00:15:42.919
because when I went to become a firefighter,
00:15:42.919 --> 00:15:47.559
we had to declare the things that we'd done in
00:15:47.559 --> 00:15:52.559
the past that may be deemed unethical, whatever
00:15:52.559 --> 00:15:56.100
it is. thinking that honesty was what they were
00:15:56.100 --> 00:15:58.179
looking for i said well a long time ago i did
00:15:58.179 --> 00:16:01.100
this and you know and i was immediately disqualified
00:16:01.100 --> 00:16:04.279
so i learned in the fire service that to become
00:16:04.279 --> 00:16:06.379
a firefighter you didn't talk about any of the
00:16:06.379 --> 00:16:08.519
bad stuff you ever did you basically lied about
00:16:08.519 --> 00:16:11.100
it pretended you were a choir boy and i got the
00:16:11.100 --> 00:16:14.019
job first time i started lying so i can totally
00:16:14.019 --> 00:16:19.759
understand Well, I'll tell you a little bit about
00:16:19.759 --> 00:16:22.679
that. Anyway, a friend of mine did about the
00:16:22.679 --> 00:16:27.220
same thing, except he was over in Denmark and
00:16:27.220 --> 00:16:30.120
he had not integrated over to the United States
00:16:30.120 --> 00:16:38.120
yet. But there was two lines in Denmark that
00:16:38.120 --> 00:16:42.799
was going to be, one line was going to the gas
00:16:42.799 --> 00:16:48.740
chambers and the other line. was going into the
00:16:48.740 --> 00:16:55.759
concentration camp in another area. And the lines
00:16:55.759 --> 00:16:59.620
were only about seven feet apart. And he wanted
00:16:59.620 --> 00:17:03.000
to go into the other one because he says, I heard
00:17:03.000 --> 00:17:07.160
that this line that we're in is going to the
00:17:07.160 --> 00:17:15.269
gas chambers. So he talked to his friend. to
00:17:15.269 --> 00:17:17.470
change the lines and he says, no, I don't want
00:17:17.470 --> 00:17:21.930
to. They might shoot me if I try to. He said,
00:17:21.950 --> 00:17:23.990
well, I'm going to change them. He changed over
00:17:23.990 --> 00:17:27.029
to the one that was going to concentration camp
00:17:27.029 --> 00:17:31.589
and his friend went to the gas chambers. When
00:17:31.589 --> 00:17:35.690
he got over there into the line, they asked him,
00:17:35.690 --> 00:17:41.349
what kind of an occupation did you have and are
00:17:41.349 --> 00:17:46.279
you... have an occupation that's worthy of you
00:17:46.279 --> 00:17:49.319
to come to the United States? And he says, yes.
00:17:49.500 --> 00:17:53.539
He says, I was a qualified bridge builder. They
00:17:53.539 --> 00:17:56.740
wanted to have a lot of bridges made and stuff
00:17:56.740 --> 00:17:59.380
like that, you know, for the military. And he
00:17:59.380 --> 00:18:04.259
says, and I was the bridge builder for the, and
00:18:04.259 --> 00:18:08.960
a superintendent on that. So, what's your degree?
00:18:09.200 --> 00:18:15.069
And he told him some fictitious degree he got
00:18:15.069 --> 00:18:19.910
in by saying that and he that he was a bridge
00:18:19.910 --> 00:18:22.269
builder and he came to the united states and
00:18:22.269 --> 00:18:25.750
he said that's what he was and he got a job in
00:18:25.750 --> 00:18:31.190
california to building bridges and he didn't
00:18:31.190 --> 00:18:34.029
he had never built one at all but that was his
00:18:34.029 --> 00:18:39.740
qualification so we went to uh this and start
00:18:39.740 --> 00:18:42.660
building bridges on it. So I don't know what,
00:18:42.740 --> 00:18:47.440
but he lied about coming in from his too. It's
00:18:47.440 --> 00:18:53.259
not mine, but that's his story. And he still,
00:18:53.500 --> 00:18:59.299
he was until about four or five years ago on,
00:18:59.319 --> 00:19:04.960
and he was still doing bridges. I built a lot
00:19:04.960 --> 00:19:08.160
of bridges. Yeah, I'd be scared of driving that
00:19:08.160 --> 00:19:09.640
town if you didn't know how to build them, though.
00:19:11.119 --> 00:19:15.900
Yeah. A lot of people did that. A lot of guys
00:19:15.900 --> 00:19:20.339
came into the service and just did everything
00:19:20.339 --> 00:19:23.319
they could to get in to pass the examination.
00:19:23.339 --> 00:19:27.839
Of course, most of them were out of jobs, didn't
00:19:27.839 --> 00:19:35.170
have an education. And they needed people in
00:19:35.170 --> 00:19:40.829
the service. And so they took anybody in at that
00:19:40.829 --> 00:19:43.509
time. If you could breathe, they said, come in.
00:19:45.009 --> 00:19:46.990
Absolutely. Well, I want to get to your journey
00:19:46.990 --> 00:19:48.450
through the training because obviously you ended
00:19:48.450 --> 00:19:52.470
up in a very unique group of Marines in the end.
00:19:52.589 --> 00:19:54.990
Before we do, though, you mentioned something
00:19:54.990 --> 00:19:57.349
that was interesting to me, that your dad was
00:19:57.349 --> 00:20:01.039
a World War I veteran. You ended up seeing combat.
00:20:01.099 --> 00:20:03.519
You ended up struggling with the physical and
00:20:03.519 --> 00:20:06.460
mental health elements of that. Did you ever
00:20:06.460 --> 00:20:09.339
see any of that exhibited by your father when
00:20:09.339 --> 00:20:13.859
you were young? My dad was over in France. He
00:20:13.859 --> 00:20:18.160
was a bugler. He played the bugle. And at that
00:20:18.160 --> 00:20:24.000
time, that's where most of the military reacted.
00:20:24.759 --> 00:20:26.619
got up with the bugle, and they went to bed with
00:20:26.619 --> 00:20:29.500
the bugle. They got paid by the bugle. They went
00:20:29.500 --> 00:20:32.660
to eat by the bugle. They went to attack by the
00:20:32.660 --> 00:20:38.059
bugle. So everything was transferred. Now, of
00:20:38.059 --> 00:20:42.000
course, it's a lot different. But that was his
00:20:42.000 --> 00:20:46.400
thing, and I have plenty of pictures of him at
00:20:46.400 --> 00:20:53.660
that time. His brother was in World War I as
00:20:53.660 --> 00:20:59.359
well. and he was a well -educated uh man so uh
00:20:59.359 --> 00:21:03.660
he had uh uh some kind of i don't never did know
00:21:03.660 --> 00:21:07.720
what my uncle that would be my uncle i what he
00:21:07.720 --> 00:21:13.400
did on him so but uh they lived in uh in arkansas
00:21:13.400 --> 00:21:19.180
that's where i was born in arkansas too so he
00:21:19.180 --> 00:21:22.819
saw action but i don't know i don't know what
00:21:22.819 --> 00:21:27.079
uh what part of the country he was in on it and
00:21:27.079 --> 00:21:30.799
of course i'm i was in of course europe area
00:21:30.799 --> 00:21:35.000
and i i never did know too much about the war
00:21:35.000 --> 00:21:38.599
in europe because it was all everything was crammed
00:21:38.599 --> 00:21:43.519
in my uh vocabulary was uh the south pacific
00:21:43.519 --> 00:21:49.180
and running in that so but uh he understood what
00:21:49.180 --> 00:21:59.119
the ptsd But at the time, it was called combat
00:21:59.119 --> 00:22:06.240
fatigue. They didn't pick up the term PTSD until
00:22:06.240 --> 00:22:11.359
probably in the 50s, I would imagine. But still,
00:22:11.519 --> 00:22:17.480
you're still combat fatigue. And still use that
00:22:17.480 --> 00:22:23.099
word at that time. But it was... I think there
00:22:23.099 --> 00:22:32.519
was a story in Patton's army about a kid that
00:22:32.519 --> 00:22:35.359
couldn't take it any longer. Patton asked him
00:22:35.359 --> 00:22:40.700
what was wrong with him. He said that he had
00:22:40.700 --> 00:22:45.599
combat fatigue, and so he slapped him. In fact,
00:22:45.660 --> 00:22:50.180
that was one of his main things when they did
00:22:50.180 --> 00:22:55.579
a live. story on Patton about him hitting this
00:22:55.579 --> 00:23:00.920
kid that had combat fatigue because he said nobody
00:23:00.920 --> 00:23:06.440
has combat fatigue in my army so but they were
00:23:06.440 --> 00:23:09.359
still using it at that time overseas as well.
00:23:10.400 --> 00:23:12.500
Yeah, well, it's been amazing when you look back,
00:23:12.539 --> 00:23:14.740
you've got so many terms, you know, soldier's
00:23:14.740 --> 00:23:18.119
heart, shell shock, thousand yard stare. I mean,
00:23:18.160 --> 00:23:22.279
this same symptom has existed for hundreds of
00:23:22.279 --> 00:23:26.079
years, just the name changed. Yeah, that's true.
00:23:27.900 --> 00:23:32.640
And it could, I can see it. And it did, it happened
00:23:32.640 --> 00:23:40.920
to me. And they did not diagnose it. at first,
00:23:40.960 --> 00:23:47.920
after I got out. There's a big story in my book
00:23:47.920 --> 00:23:53.759
in regards to when I came back from Iwo Jima.
00:23:54.000 --> 00:23:58.900
They diagnosed me at that time. I was shot all
00:23:58.900 --> 00:24:04.000
through my chest and my arm and was in surgery.
00:24:07.579 --> 00:24:11.420
got in an altercation with the surgeon because
00:24:11.420 --> 00:24:17.720
they were going to cut my arm off. So I slugged
00:24:17.720 --> 00:24:23.160
him and knocked him off of his surgical tray
00:24:23.160 --> 00:24:26.839
off and everything. And he got mad at me. So
00:24:26.839 --> 00:24:32.519
he diagnosed me as combat fatigue. Then he let
00:24:32.519 --> 00:24:39.039
me go. And when I got... Got into San Diego,
00:24:39.099 --> 00:24:41.940
I think, to hospital. They still had me down
00:24:41.940 --> 00:24:45.140
as combat fatigue and put me in the nut ward.
00:24:46.000 --> 00:24:50.099
And they didn't take care of my wounds properly.
00:24:50.380 --> 00:24:54.299
And I had to find someone to change my bandages.
00:24:54.779 --> 00:24:59.240
And there's quite a story in my book on that.
00:25:00.079 --> 00:25:06.559
But I was really worried at the time. I figured
00:25:06.559 --> 00:25:13.319
that might help, I mean, hurt me in getting a
00:25:13.319 --> 00:25:19.519
Purple Heart on it. If they saw my record, it
00:25:19.519 --> 00:25:22.920
said Combat Fatigue. I had already been wounded
00:25:22.920 --> 00:25:27.519
once someplace else, so two different areas.
00:25:29.339 --> 00:25:33.700
Anyway, read my book. You'll get the big story.
00:25:34.200 --> 00:25:36.400
Yeah, no, there's this, you know, so much description
00:25:36.400 --> 00:25:39.519
of so many of the battles that you were in. So
00:25:39.519 --> 00:25:41.359
I want to get to that journey now, if that's
00:25:41.359 --> 00:25:45.599
okay. So talk to me. You are a very small framed,
00:25:45.880 --> 00:25:50.380
brave 16 and a half year old boy who finds himself
00:25:50.380 --> 00:25:53.539
in the Marines. So walk me through the initial
00:25:53.539 --> 00:25:56.859
boot camp and then the, you know, the Raiders
00:25:56.859 --> 00:25:58.559
selection and then what that looked like for
00:25:58.559 --> 00:26:08.339
you. In January. 21st, 1942, on it. There's seven
00:26:08.339 --> 00:26:16.819
Arkansas boys that had taken the oath, and we
00:26:16.819 --> 00:26:21.319
were put on a train to go to boot camp. Boot
00:26:21.319 --> 00:26:27.660
camp was in San Diego, Marine Corps Recruit Depot
00:26:27.660 --> 00:26:36.059
on it. And when we got there, we had three Marines
00:26:36.059 --> 00:26:43.720
waiting for us at the station. They had already
00:26:43.720 --> 00:26:50.700
picked up some from other trains before from
00:26:50.700 --> 00:26:55.339
other states. And they were waiting for us. And
00:26:55.339 --> 00:27:01.700
as I said, when I got there on it, I was... One
00:27:01.700 --> 00:27:10.279
of the kids was the carrier or the transfer papers.
00:27:11.259 --> 00:27:16.660
And he handed all the papers over to the sergeant.
00:27:16.660 --> 00:27:20.740
And I said that he was the devil. And he had
00:27:20.740 --> 00:27:27.140
two other helpers. We were now being called everything
00:27:27.140 --> 00:27:32.079
in the book besides. young men going into the
00:27:32.079 --> 00:27:38.859
service. But you cannot do that now in boot camp.
00:27:39.640 --> 00:27:45.839
But you're not supposed to do that now. Anyway,
00:27:46.000 --> 00:27:51.920
I was in a platoon. I had a sergeant or the head
00:27:51.920 --> 00:28:00.140
DI, drill instructor, and two corporals. that
00:28:00.140 --> 00:28:07.960
were assistant DIs. And I was in platoon 150,
00:28:08.460 --> 00:28:15.519
1501. I stayed in that for, I think it was eight
00:28:15.519 --> 00:28:19.539
weeks at that time, but I'm not positive it was
00:28:19.539 --> 00:28:29.099
eight or ten. But we got our... indoctrination,
00:28:29.480 --> 00:28:33.400
I guess, with what the Marine Corps was all about
00:28:33.400 --> 00:28:42.339
and how we reacted to those above us and with
00:28:42.339 --> 00:28:46.559
them. I think they call it God and country and
00:28:46.559 --> 00:28:53.079
family, Marine Corps. So, anyway, we went through
00:28:53.079 --> 00:28:59.009
that training and I remember one incident that
00:28:59.009 --> 00:29:02.390
I had. I was in what they called the feather
00:29:02.390 --> 00:29:07.490
merchant area, which was the smaller Marines
00:29:07.490 --> 00:29:11.269
and the company. Because there were some of them
00:29:11.269 --> 00:29:14.450
in there. There were six of them. Six foot seven.
00:29:14.910 --> 00:29:19.769
Another one was six three, I think it was. Something
00:29:19.769 --> 00:29:22.650
like that. They were in the head and we were
00:29:22.650 --> 00:29:26.380
in the back. We were the short guys. In fact,
00:29:26.380 --> 00:29:29.759
there was one kid who was a lot smaller than
00:29:29.759 --> 00:29:32.059
I was, and I don't know how he got in, but I
00:29:32.059 --> 00:29:36.640
think it was because he came in from Chicago.
00:29:37.180 --> 00:29:41.799
But they were counting the cadence, and we were
00:29:41.799 --> 00:29:47.519
marching along, and he and the sergeant said,
00:29:47.640 --> 00:29:55.240
platoons, ho! And so we stopped. And I was about...
00:29:56.000 --> 00:30:01.759
30 inches from my chest to the man in front of
00:30:01.759 --> 00:30:06.200
me. And the sergeant came over and he whacked
00:30:06.200 --> 00:30:09.140
me on top of the head with his swaggering stick.
00:30:09.740 --> 00:30:13.880
And he said, boy, what's your name? I told him,
00:30:13.900 --> 00:30:18.319
Private Wright, sir. He said, well, Wright, you're
00:30:18.319 --> 00:30:22.900
all wrong. He said, it's 40 inches back to breast.
00:30:25.420 --> 00:30:30.039
I got my first whack with the swagger stick for
00:30:30.039 --> 00:30:35.380
not being the proper number of inches between
00:30:35.380 --> 00:30:39.259
the two of us. But that was about it for me as
00:30:39.259 --> 00:30:47.819
I was a very good and studious marine and I learned
00:30:47.819 --> 00:30:57.799
a lot and I was I knew that what they were teaching
00:30:57.799 --> 00:31:01.619
us was something that was needed in their training.
00:31:02.319 --> 00:31:05.920
And I paid very good attention to it, and I carried
00:31:05.920 --> 00:31:11.200
that training clear through my Marine Corps tour
00:31:11.200 --> 00:31:16.680
for four years. And I thought, and I blessed
00:31:16.680 --> 00:31:23.109
those kids that were tolerated, tolerable. to
00:31:23.109 --> 00:31:26.329
me was that room and i went up through boot camp
00:31:26.329 --> 00:31:33.210
my first uh uh duty station was up in uh posted
00:31:33.210 --> 00:31:38.769
in uh in tongue point oregon which is uh right
00:31:38.769 --> 00:31:42.009
in astoria oregon which is the mouth of the columbia
00:31:42.009 --> 00:31:46.970
river i stayed there on guard duty we guarded
00:31:46.970 --> 00:31:51.230
the mountain that we were the large mountain
00:31:51.230 --> 00:31:57.119
i called it a mountain right there near the mouth
00:31:57.119 --> 00:32:03.059
of Columbia. Because they had ammunition stored
00:32:03.059 --> 00:32:12.660
in the area and we were guarding all day and
00:32:12.660 --> 00:32:18.680
all night. Then we got liberty every once in
00:32:18.680 --> 00:32:24.420
a while. I was transferred, a temporary transfer
00:32:24.420 --> 00:32:29.259
over to, well, that's another story. While we
00:32:29.259 --> 00:32:36.460
were stationed in Tongue Point, the Japanese
00:32:36.460 --> 00:32:42.500
had, they shelled the, I think it was the oil
00:32:42.500 --> 00:32:48.299
fields in Southern California. Then they finally
00:32:48.299 --> 00:32:54.140
went on up the, coastline on up to from California
00:32:54.140 --> 00:32:59.259
up to the Columbia River and there they were
00:32:59.259 --> 00:33:02.799
heavily heading for Portland and Seattle where
00:33:02.799 --> 00:33:07.160
they were building warships there's two submarines
00:33:07.160 --> 00:33:12.940
that came in the river by following the minefield
00:33:12.940 --> 00:33:17.619
the fishermen who were out fishing and then they
00:33:17.619 --> 00:33:20.490
come in whenever they come in and raise the They
00:33:20.490 --> 00:33:26.789
pulled the mines off the side to let the fishermen
00:33:26.789 --> 00:33:33.029
in and the Japanese came up right behind them
00:33:33.029 --> 00:33:37.589
and came in on the Columbia River. And they stayed
00:33:37.589 --> 00:33:41.970
there a couple of nights first and then they
00:33:41.970 --> 00:33:47.000
finally they shelled. The military base, which
00:33:47.000 --> 00:33:50.240
was the first time any foreign country had ever
00:33:50.240 --> 00:33:56.859
shelled a military base in World War I or II,
00:33:56.980 --> 00:33:59.720
or as that goes. Anyway, they came in and shelled
00:33:59.720 --> 00:34:04.980
Fort Stevens and didn't do any damage. They knocked
00:34:04.980 --> 00:34:08.840
down a couple of outdoor movies, I think it was,
00:34:08.880 --> 00:34:12.599
or something like that. But they didn't do very
00:34:12.599 --> 00:34:16.090
much harm. But they scared the hell out of everybody
00:34:16.090 --> 00:34:18.750
up there. They thought that was the first wave
00:34:18.750 --> 00:34:25.510
coming in and going in to Astoria. Anyway, we
00:34:25.510 --> 00:34:35.010
got the alert sign. We were on Liberty at the
00:34:35.010 --> 00:34:38.489
time that they shelled Fort Stevens, which is
00:34:38.489 --> 00:34:44.099
only about six or eight miles. from tongue point
00:34:44.099 --> 00:34:49.420
there and uh we were we tried to help them out
00:34:49.420 --> 00:34:54.019
but they i explained it pretty real uh more thorough
00:34:54.019 --> 00:35:00.400
than that in my book but uh then after they they
00:35:00.400 --> 00:35:04.500
were finally uh i think they were sunk it might
00:35:04.500 --> 00:35:07.480
have been off on oregon coast but i'm not positive
00:35:07.480 --> 00:35:13.099
anyway uh about two three weeks or so After that,
00:35:13.099 --> 00:35:18.840
they transferred me and I think it was six other
00:35:18.840 --> 00:35:25.420
Marines to Port Angeles, Washington, to teach
00:35:25.420 --> 00:35:32.119
them how to fire the 20 -millimeter ammunition,
00:35:32.420 --> 00:35:37.199
20 -millimeter, they called it machine gun at
00:35:37.199 --> 00:35:44.630
that time. We stayed up there for about two weeks,
00:35:44.889 --> 00:35:47.429
I guess, and then they shipped us back to Tung
00:35:47.429 --> 00:35:52.530
Point, and we were kind of like a special forces
00:35:52.530 --> 00:35:59.210
for planning to put the 20 millimeters all over
00:35:59.210 --> 00:36:03.650
the mountain up there, the ammunition hill. We
00:36:03.650 --> 00:36:10.110
stayed there, and I had a... accident falling
00:36:10.110 --> 00:36:13.809
off one of the cliffs up there and I was in the
00:36:13.809 --> 00:36:17.489
hospital for a little bit a couple of weeks or
00:36:17.489 --> 00:36:23.570
so and then about that time the Marine Corps
00:36:23.570 --> 00:36:31.969
was forming a new special forces called Raiders
00:36:31.969 --> 00:36:40.440
and they had some trouble getting enough people
00:36:40.440 --> 00:36:45.619
to volunteer for it. They sent individuals to
00:36:45.619 --> 00:36:49.960
different posts around the West Coast to join
00:36:49.960 --> 00:36:57.860
up. And they took the best that, in their mind,
00:36:58.039 --> 00:37:01.500
Marines that would qualify as a raider on it.
00:37:01.940 --> 00:37:09.699
And they had their eye on young kids, but they
00:37:09.699 --> 00:37:18.579
were fit and had a good record. And I had shot
00:37:18.579 --> 00:37:25.719
expert rifle and expert pistol. And I had machine
00:37:25.719 --> 00:37:34.280
gun and bayonet training. I had 20 millimeter
00:37:34.280 --> 00:37:41.429
training. And so I, and I shot, shot really a
00:37:41.429 --> 00:37:48.929
good, my score was 3 .55 out of four. So anyway,
00:37:49.110 --> 00:37:55.090
and so they say, well, you, you would qualify
00:37:55.090 --> 00:37:57.750
if you want to go. So I told him I wanted to
00:37:57.750 --> 00:38:01.670
go and I wanted to fight. So he said, well, you'll
00:38:01.670 --> 00:38:06.769
have to be down there within two weeks. two weeks
00:38:06.769 --> 00:38:11.210
to make my mind up and then go. One of the reasons
00:38:11.210 --> 00:38:15.429
was because I had had good training and had good
00:38:15.429 --> 00:38:21.110
reports from my boot camp and my training and
00:38:21.110 --> 00:38:27.949
my, not training, but on my good conduct with
00:38:27.949 --> 00:38:37.570
the Navy on Tungpun Island. Tongue Point Station
00:38:37.570 --> 00:38:44.070
there. But I was transferred from there to, I
00:38:44.070 --> 00:38:50.650
think it was Capitol June, which was in San Diego
00:38:50.650 --> 00:38:56.210
area on it. I think that's where we first started
00:38:56.210 --> 00:39:01.710
from. And then we went into Camp Pendleton area.
00:39:02.849 --> 00:39:09.739
And we were in Camp Pendleton on October 1943,
00:39:10.920 --> 00:39:20.239
and stayed in Camp Pendleton. And James Roosevelt,
00:39:20.539 --> 00:39:25.400
Jimmy Roosevelt, was Major at first, but he came
00:39:25.400 --> 00:39:33.119
in as Colonel, and he was President's son. I
00:39:33.119 --> 00:39:35.039
was president of the United States at the time.
00:39:35.719 --> 00:39:39.780
And he was my commanding officer. And he came
00:39:39.780 --> 00:39:47.559
in in November of 1943. And I actually was in
00:39:47.559 --> 00:39:52.880
Raiders about two weeks before he was signed
00:39:52.880 --> 00:39:57.320
up as our commanding officer. And with that,
00:39:57.460 --> 00:40:02.369
I was signed as a squad leader. from the Raiders.
00:40:02.730 --> 00:40:09.449
I stayed in there from October until February.
00:40:09.849 --> 00:40:14.130
I think it was in February. Anyway, we left for
00:40:14.130 --> 00:40:18.389
overseas on February the 11th. I think that was
00:40:18.389 --> 00:40:23.809
in 1943. The other was in 1942. Anyway, I can't
00:40:23.809 --> 00:40:28.429
remember right now. My memory is not very good.
00:40:29.579 --> 00:40:31.760
I think it's incredible considering. I really
00:40:31.760 --> 00:40:34.599
do. I want to get on one thing before we talk
00:40:34.599 --> 00:40:36.480
about your overseas deployments, which I thought
00:40:36.480 --> 00:40:41.000
was fascinating. Talk to me about the hand -to
00:40:41.000 --> 00:40:43.380
-hand combat training that you did, because seeing
00:40:43.380 --> 00:40:47.119
words like judo in the 1940s seems very progressive
00:40:47.119 --> 00:40:52.480
to me. Yes. We were taught in the Raiders, we
00:40:52.480 --> 00:40:58.619
were taught the art of self -defense. And the
00:40:58.619 --> 00:41:01.719
things that we were taught were to kill someone.
00:41:01.960 --> 00:41:07.840
It wasn't for anything. And if we were going
00:41:07.840 --> 00:41:11.659
to get in a fight with the enemy, we were not
00:41:11.659 --> 00:41:15.900
going to get in there just to wound him or to
00:41:15.900 --> 00:41:20.000
maim him. It was to kill him. And so everything
00:41:20.000 --> 00:41:23.920
we had terminated with the idea of killing someone.
00:41:24.539 --> 00:41:31.909
And we had... several trainees that had been
00:41:31.909 --> 00:41:39.570
over to England to, with the Special Forces over
00:41:39.570 --> 00:41:45.869
in England, be trained on the Art of Self -Defense
00:41:45.869 --> 00:41:49.510
over there, which was a little bit different
00:41:49.510 --> 00:41:52.630
than the Art of Defense in the United States.
00:41:53.409 --> 00:41:59.130
But anyway, those trainees happened to be in
00:41:59.130 --> 00:42:03.230
our 4th Raiders, which was nice. So we got a
00:42:03.230 --> 00:42:07.730
lot of personal stuff because they were so close
00:42:07.730 --> 00:42:14.849
to us in our own platoon. We fought the battle
00:42:14.849 --> 00:42:19.769
in San Clemente. I think we took and captured
00:42:19.769 --> 00:42:24.179
San Clemente many times on our training. at the
00:42:24.179 --> 00:42:27.019
Nautilus. We trained on the Nautilus and it was
00:42:27.019 --> 00:42:34.420
the submarine and the USS Waters and I think
00:42:34.420 --> 00:42:39.360
it was the USS Bent. Seemed like there was another
00:42:39.360 --> 00:42:43.099
submarine also down there, but I can't remember
00:42:43.099 --> 00:42:46.000
that name, but the Nautilus was what I'm on.
00:42:46.519 --> 00:42:50.559
But we'd come in to the coast with a submarine
00:42:50.559 --> 00:42:55.739
and we had to get up at nighttime and we'd surface
00:42:55.739 --> 00:43:00.119
and then pull out our rubber boats and get on
00:43:00.119 --> 00:43:04.500
the rubber boats and paddle into the beach and
00:43:04.500 --> 00:43:11.699
then we would deploy out from the beach in the
00:43:11.699 --> 00:43:13.980
different areas and finally we'd go into the
00:43:13.980 --> 00:43:17.460
ones that had beach houses down there and so
00:43:17.460 --> 00:43:24.219
we captured them. It was hard. It was really
00:43:24.219 --> 00:43:29.219
hard, hard training, very hard training. There's
00:43:29.219 --> 00:43:34.619
two or three steps above what the normal Marines
00:43:34.619 --> 00:43:38.699
were getting at the time. Yeah, I can only imagine
00:43:38.699 --> 00:43:40.400
as well. When we think of submarines, we think
00:43:40.400 --> 00:43:42.699
of them today, you know, with all the advanced
00:43:42.699 --> 00:43:46.139
equipment. But I've seen some of the World War
00:43:46.139 --> 00:43:49.889
II era submarines and they... Just to get in
00:43:49.889 --> 00:43:52.409
one of those and be under the water seems like
00:43:52.409 --> 00:43:57.989
it took an amazing amount of courage. Well, yeah.
00:43:58.969 --> 00:44:06.889
And it's very close quarters. I had one of my
00:44:06.889 --> 00:44:10.269
bunks had torpedoes right underneath where we
00:44:10.269 --> 00:44:17.050
were sleeping. And the sailors were very eager
00:44:17.050 --> 00:44:21.539
to teach. us marines different things about the
00:44:21.539 --> 00:44:25.519
torpedoes and one of them was the torpedo juice
00:44:25.519 --> 00:44:30.880
that they had on it that's 190 proof alcohol
00:44:30.880 --> 00:44:36.739
so they'd have a canteen full of that and then
00:44:36.739 --> 00:44:42.460
i wish he would rob from torpedoes around there
00:44:42.460 --> 00:44:48.599
and then they'd make us uh drink it if we wanted
00:44:48.599 --> 00:44:50.500
to go to chow or something like that. We had
00:44:50.500 --> 00:44:54.820
to take a taste of it or something. So, you don't
00:44:54.820 --> 00:44:57.860
need, you don't, you just don't take a swig of
00:44:57.860 --> 00:45:03.760
190 proof alcohol without it burning. So, but,
00:45:03.920 --> 00:45:08.679
it's a lot of, a lot of stuff goes on. People
00:45:08.679 --> 00:45:14.239
have, what is it, claustrophobia? Yes. Yes, sir.
00:45:14.360 --> 00:45:22.639
Yeah. And you can hear different sounds that
00:45:22.639 --> 00:45:25.519
you just don't hear all the time, but of course
00:45:25.519 --> 00:45:30.679
they do. The Navy does, but the Marines didn't.
00:45:33.159 --> 00:45:40.800
But the training is real hard. And of course
00:45:40.800 --> 00:45:46.460
they train now. The same thing, except they carry
00:45:46.460 --> 00:45:50.219
it a little bit further than that. It's a different
00:45:50.219 --> 00:45:54.719
type of train. The Special Forces now are well
00:45:54.719 --> 00:45:59.320
trained on it. They have all this electronic
00:45:59.320 --> 00:46:03.420
stuff that goes along with it, and they've got
00:46:03.420 --> 00:46:06.360
to carry that on their back. They've even got
00:46:06.360 --> 00:46:10.980
their own drones, I think they call them, military
00:46:10.980 --> 00:46:15.230
drones on it. They have those. They have to carry
00:46:15.230 --> 00:46:18.769
those. Everything has to be carried on it like
00:46:18.769 --> 00:46:26.750
that. But now, everything, now, you ride a helicopter
00:46:26.750 --> 00:46:31.309
someplace to your destination on it. And before,
00:46:31.710 --> 00:46:36.030
we were trained to walk. And we walked to our
00:46:36.030 --> 00:46:39.289
destination. We walked to the different places
00:46:39.289 --> 00:46:44.710
on it. We walked to go get the... The chow. A
00:46:44.710 --> 00:46:47.949
lot of times I had to walk 25 miles just to get
00:46:47.949 --> 00:46:51.010
breakfast. That was just not one time, but several
00:46:51.010 --> 00:46:53.889
times we had to do that. And, of course, Jimmy
00:46:53.889 --> 00:46:56.750
Roosevelt was right along with us on it. He wasn't
00:46:56.750 --> 00:46:59.449
riding in a Jeep or anything like that. He walked
00:46:59.449 --> 00:47:03.110
right with us on it. He got the same blisters
00:47:03.110 --> 00:47:06.909
that we got. I'm just trying to think a while
00:47:06.909 --> 00:47:11.690
ago about this one. I think it was Barocco that
00:47:11.690 --> 00:47:19.170
we attacked on it. And the rubber boats and even
00:47:19.170 --> 00:47:26.170
the six -man boat, eight -man boat on it. Winds
00:47:26.170 --> 00:47:34.230
blew us off course and they were out of 15 miles
00:47:34.230 --> 00:47:37.710
off the landing area. They were supposed to land.
00:47:38.670 --> 00:47:42.610
The wind blew them off course and they land about
00:47:42.610 --> 00:47:48.590
14 to 15 miles away from the real landing zone.
00:47:49.610 --> 00:47:56.070
Those that were in those two or three boats had
00:47:56.070 --> 00:48:01.730
to walk through the jungle to get it back up
00:48:01.730 --> 00:48:07.929
to the landing zone. before they even fired a
00:48:07.929 --> 00:48:15.289
shot. So all of this hiking and stuff, it was
00:48:15.289 --> 00:48:21.630
needed. Especially if you're in the jungle like
00:48:21.630 --> 00:48:27.650
we were. But it's a different thing now. And
00:48:27.650 --> 00:48:31.090
it's a lot different than just regular boot camp.
00:48:31.909 --> 00:48:37.130
But you do get training in boot camp. The first
00:48:37.130 --> 00:48:43.349
bayonet training I had on boot camp in San Diego
00:48:43.349 --> 00:48:50.630
came in handy when we landed on Guam. And I was
00:48:50.630 --> 00:48:55.170
in bayonet fights on Guam. There were several
00:48:55.170 --> 00:49:01.730
different bonsai attacks that we had. And I thanked
00:49:01.730 --> 00:49:05.559
my old sergeant. his training is at that time
00:49:05.559 --> 00:49:11.440
because i learned a few more my own but uh it
00:49:11.440 --> 00:49:13.659
was a training that you think you're you think
00:49:13.659 --> 00:49:16.599
it's hard on you at that time but boy i tell
00:49:16.599 --> 00:49:21.519
you you use your training well i think that's
00:49:21.519 --> 00:49:24.019
a really important you know perspective to hear
00:49:24.019 --> 00:49:26.460
from someone you know from your generation firstly
00:49:26.460 --> 00:49:29.099
it's interesting with the technology because
00:49:29.099 --> 00:49:32.559
what really amazes me about the world war ii
00:49:32.559 --> 00:49:35.199
and world war ii era is you didn't have gps you
00:49:35.199 --> 00:49:37.000
didn't have computers you didn't have drones
00:49:37.000 --> 00:49:40.460
and you know planes in the sky with radar so
00:49:40.460 --> 00:49:42.400
as you mentioned you know once you land that's
00:49:42.400 --> 00:49:44.760
where you are and you might have to hike to where
00:49:44.760 --> 00:49:46.840
you're supposed to be you've got no way of really
00:49:46.840 --> 00:49:49.760
knowing where the enemy are so that in itself
00:49:49.760 --> 00:49:52.519
is incredible but in the fire service something
00:49:52.519 --> 00:49:55.269
that i've talked about a lot is I was very fortunate
00:49:55.269 --> 00:49:58.269
to get some really, really good, incredibly hard
00:49:58.269 --> 00:50:01.030
training early in my career, just by chance,
00:50:01.070 --> 00:50:03.510
the departments I went to. And I feel that really
00:50:03.510 --> 00:50:07.789
set the bar for the standards of my firefighting
00:50:07.789 --> 00:50:09.670
career. Not saying I was a great firefighter,
00:50:09.690 --> 00:50:11.309
but I was definitely held to a high standard.
00:50:12.030 --> 00:50:16.250
So talk to me about when you first deployed,
00:50:16.349 --> 00:50:19.489
your first combat, and there you are as a young
00:50:19.489 --> 00:50:25.650
boy from the US. high level of training as a
00:50:25.650 --> 00:50:28.690
raider carried over to your first combat mission
00:50:28.690 --> 00:50:37.010
uh firstly is the uh training that we had in
00:50:37.010 --> 00:50:44.769
san diego uh the fourth raiders were the i'll
00:50:44.769 --> 00:50:50.409
call say the guinea pig of uh for uh determining
00:50:50.409 --> 00:50:56.699
what a raider should be trained at. When we left
00:50:56.699 --> 00:51:04.699
in, I think, 1943 on February the 11th, they
00:51:04.699 --> 00:51:11.420
named the course that we had to take on it, they
00:51:11.420 --> 00:51:16.579
named that as a combat course, and every Marine
00:51:16.579 --> 00:51:20.460
that went overseas had to go through combat course
00:51:20.460 --> 00:51:23.639
on it. that was caused, and I think it still
00:51:23.639 --> 00:51:29.960
is, that plus other things that they had to learn,
00:51:30.119 --> 00:51:33.840
of course, as the type of the enemy that they
00:51:33.840 --> 00:51:39.420
had to face. So when we left, we left, of course,
00:51:39.460 --> 00:51:45.599
as I say, in February, and we went to New Hebrides
00:51:45.599 --> 00:51:53.789
Island, same committee, New Caledonia. And we
00:51:53.789 --> 00:51:59.590
were training all the way over there on board
00:51:59.590 --> 00:52:06.570
ship. We arrived there, were trained on New Caledonia
00:52:06.570 --> 00:52:11.530
and New Hebrides. Then we got word that we were
00:52:11.530 --> 00:52:15.929
going to be transferred over to a little place
00:52:15.929 --> 00:52:22.610
called Guadalcanal and our company. our platoon
00:52:22.610 --> 00:52:26.809
were transferred over there and we were set up
00:52:26.809 --> 00:52:32.929
to patrol on Guadalcanal Henderson airfield that
00:52:32.929 --> 00:52:39.789
there was on and uh and around uh the uh some
00:52:39.789 --> 00:52:42.469
town I don't know which one that wasn't very
00:52:42.469 --> 00:52:45.590
uh too much active on that because we were in
00:52:45.590 --> 00:52:50.849
there as a backup and clean up, mop up, or whatever
00:52:50.849 --> 00:52:55.230
you want to say, on Guadalcanal. We were looking
00:52:55.230 --> 00:52:58.909
for stragglers, we were looking for holdouts,
00:52:59.110 --> 00:53:05.449
and we were shelled by hand grenades. I think
00:53:05.449 --> 00:53:10.510
we had two people who were wounded in our company
00:53:10.510 --> 00:53:15.929
from there. But we got into a little action on
00:53:15.929 --> 00:53:25.280
Guadalcanal. And during our period of going out
00:53:25.280 --> 00:53:28.599
in the jungle and searching for these holdouts,
00:53:28.980 --> 00:53:36.599
Seabees had landed and were building the tent
00:53:36.599 --> 00:53:45.159
camps for the Marines that were following behind
00:53:45.159 --> 00:53:50.860
our companies. because they were going to use
00:53:50.860 --> 00:53:55.079
Guadalcanal as a jumping -off place for all of
00:53:55.079 --> 00:53:59.800
the South Pacific and North Pacific area. And
00:53:59.800 --> 00:54:05.480
I got a chance to fire, but I was scared all
00:54:05.480 --> 00:54:09.039
the way through. When you're out in the jungle
00:54:09.039 --> 00:54:12.340
and you hear something firing going on, you don't
00:54:12.340 --> 00:54:20.550
know if it's at you or what. get scared. But
00:54:20.550 --> 00:54:27.590
the proper platoon sergeant, I think we just
00:54:27.590 --> 00:54:30.150
had a sergeant, we had a platoon sergeant there,
00:54:30.309 --> 00:54:36.269
and he would always holler out, you know, about
00:54:36.269 --> 00:54:42.030
that it was two miles out, two miles over, or
00:54:42.030 --> 00:54:44.630
whatever it was, to calm us down on it. But we
00:54:44.630 --> 00:54:48.840
were scared. But that was my first exposure to
00:54:48.840 --> 00:54:52.980
someone firing at us. After we got through with
00:54:52.980 --> 00:54:58.300
those area around Henderson Field, we went to
00:54:58.300 --> 00:55:04.780
area where we were to stay and be as our final
00:55:04.780 --> 00:55:11.119
camp month there on the canal. The Seabees are
00:55:11.119 --> 00:55:15.539
great. They are great people. They have the best
00:55:15.539 --> 00:55:22.980
food in the Pacific. And we used to go and stand
00:55:22.980 --> 00:55:26.699
in their chow line and hike for so many miles
00:55:26.699 --> 00:55:31.280
just to go on their chow line just to get something
00:55:31.280 --> 00:55:40.500
to eat besides canned dog food, as we said. That's
00:55:40.500 --> 00:55:48.960
where Spam. And after we got there, then... Finally,
00:55:48.960 --> 00:55:56.860
most of the Japanese had been captured or killed.
00:55:57.820 --> 00:56:03.059
But we still had perimeter guard duty all the
00:56:03.059 --> 00:56:05.739
time, and we were scared that they were coming
00:56:05.739 --> 00:56:12.079
in on us. So I was always worried about that,
00:56:12.139 --> 00:56:17.690
about them sneaking in back behind us. The Japanese
00:56:17.690 --> 00:56:24.050
had figured out the area that our planes are
00:56:24.050 --> 00:56:29.690
coming over and they set up a lot of radio stations
00:56:29.690 --> 00:56:34.289
along in those areas in the Solomons. The Solomons
00:56:34.289 --> 00:56:39.269
is a bunch of small islands and all connected
00:56:39.269 --> 00:56:45.030
to in the Solomons as they were New Georgia.
00:56:46.000 --> 00:56:52.079
was the largest one. There's Barocco, there's
00:56:52.079 --> 00:57:03.820
Price Anchorage, but we were stationed in Guadalcanal,
00:57:04.000 --> 00:57:08.880
which was one of the largest of the Solomons.
00:57:09.500 --> 00:57:21.059
We went to was our area was into barroco we went
00:57:21.059 --> 00:57:25.599
into barroco well we were still with we're still
00:57:25.599 --> 00:57:29.840
using uh the rubber boats at that time for our
00:57:29.840 --> 00:57:35.380
attack force on it and uh which they found out
00:57:35.380 --> 00:57:38.820
that the fact that rubber by going into rubber
00:57:38.820 --> 00:57:43.500
boats with rubber boats they make an island had
00:57:43.500 --> 00:57:48.340
been, had used them almost exclusively, and it
00:57:48.340 --> 00:57:54.039
didn't work out. And Colonel Carlson even wrote
00:57:54.039 --> 00:58:02.780
a battle report about the motors that were, the
00:58:02.780 --> 00:58:07.780
outboard motors that were on the little eight
00:58:07.780 --> 00:58:12.159
-man boats that we were using. So we were using
00:58:12.699 --> 00:58:16.619
uh at that time uh they were changing over from
00:58:16.619 --> 00:58:21.340
rubber boats park rubber boats and we weren't
00:58:21.340 --> 00:58:26.800
using the submarine we're using the uh uh happened
00:58:26.800 --> 00:58:33.159
to be one of the uh uss waters and uh we had
00:58:33.159 --> 00:58:36.039
been we had trained on that one time on san diego
00:58:36.039 --> 00:58:44.710
and we landed on barroco and uh the guys that
00:58:44.710 --> 00:58:49.030
were in the smaller boats got blown off course
00:58:49.030 --> 00:58:57.530
again and their outboard motor got Drowned it
00:58:57.530 --> 00:59:01.449
out. So they had to take the oars and pull themselves
00:59:01.449 --> 00:59:05.650
in on that with the oars They were off course
00:59:05.650 --> 00:59:16.860
it came in and The Japs had their radio stations
00:59:16.860 --> 00:59:20.820
and stuff further in than we had anticipated.
00:59:22.400 --> 00:59:31.019
And we were shot at and we lost a lot of men
00:59:31.019 --> 00:59:36.780
at that time. But not on my company. My company
00:59:36.780 --> 00:59:44.760
was up on the other side of it. of the supposedly
00:59:44.760 --> 00:59:53.039
radio stations. But we started walking in there
00:59:53.039 --> 00:59:58.699
and we walked into a trap on it. We had to go
00:59:58.699 --> 01:00:03.840
through the coconut farm over there and the Japs
01:00:03.840 --> 01:00:10.420
were all over the foliage and the trees and stuff
01:00:10.420 --> 01:00:19.840
on it. And they had machine guns that were in
01:00:19.840 --> 01:00:25.320
small pillboxes that they had built out of the
01:00:25.320 --> 01:00:36.219
downed trees. And we were trapped. I was using
01:00:36.219 --> 01:00:43.820
a .55 caliber. anti -tank boys and a tank rifle
01:00:43.820 --> 01:00:49.139
at the time. And we were stationed along the
01:00:49.139 --> 01:00:56.960
road heading into that area that the guys were
01:00:56.960 --> 01:01:01.579
trapped. They had called for help and we went
01:01:01.579 --> 01:01:06.300
in there with them. And we got stuck in this
01:01:06.300 --> 01:01:10.760
trap as well. They were perfectly well organized
01:01:10.760 --> 01:01:19.639
on it. And had a lot of corpsmen in there taking
01:01:19.639 --> 01:01:26.059
care of the kids as they were shot. Father Redman
01:01:26.059 --> 01:01:31.300
was our pastor of all denominations, I would
01:01:31.300 --> 01:01:35.400
say. And he was reading rites to everybody that
01:01:35.400 --> 01:01:42.300
he would see them. that they were dead. And the
01:01:42.300 --> 01:01:47.739
mortars that we took, knee mortars we took, were
01:01:47.739 --> 01:01:52.960
not very accurate to the point that we couldn't
01:01:52.960 --> 01:01:55.480
see them. So we didn't know exactly where they
01:01:55.480 --> 01:02:01.739
were. They were very well camouflaged. So we
01:02:01.739 --> 01:02:07.300
found out. I was carrying a sidearm. and a Thompson
01:02:07.300 --> 01:02:14.219
submachine gun at the time. So we couldn't pick
01:02:14.219 --> 01:02:21.719
out one person or one area that the Jets were
01:02:21.719 --> 01:02:29.199
hiding. We just took the submachine gun and just
01:02:29.199 --> 01:02:33.960
sprayed the whole top of the tree. hoping that
01:02:33.960 --> 01:02:37.420
one of the bullets would get on someone and And
01:02:37.420 --> 01:02:39.900
we did that's one where they we got out of some
01:02:39.900 --> 01:02:43.159
problems that we had up there, but they were
01:02:43.159 --> 01:02:46.639
We didn't know for sure if we got them or not
01:02:46.639 --> 01:02:50.340
because they were tied into the trees And they
01:02:50.340 --> 01:02:54.639
wouldn't fall so we had a lot of wasted ammo
01:02:54.639 --> 01:02:59.179
ammo on that one of that reason so but finally
01:02:59.179 --> 01:03:04.909
we we broke out of that particular situation
01:03:04.909 --> 01:03:08.969
and made it around them, came in from behind
01:03:08.969 --> 01:03:12.530
them, and at that time we found the radio station,
01:03:12.630 --> 01:03:15.190
destroyed all the radio stations that we could
01:03:15.190 --> 01:03:21.469
come to, and then come back to the main road,
01:03:21.730 --> 01:03:29.809
and some of the kids were transported out of
01:03:29.809 --> 01:03:36.789
the area by by three airplanes. I don't remember
01:03:36.789 --> 01:03:48.369
who it was. At that time, before we left Guadalcanal,
01:03:48.590 --> 01:03:54.789
I had malaria and I was in the field hospital.
01:03:55.730 --> 01:03:59.670
I heard that my company and guys were going to
01:03:59.670 --> 01:04:05.880
leave. and for an operation. So I snuck out of
01:04:05.880 --> 01:04:15.340
the field hospital and met my squad at the ship
01:04:15.340 --> 01:04:23.039
and came in. Well, it just so happened that Jimmy
01:04:23.039 --> 01:04:27.179
Roosevelt, our commanding officer, he got malaria
01:04:27.179 --> 01:04:33.539
as well. at that on Guadalcanal. Guadalcanal
01:04:33.539 --> 01:04:43.219
was all gone wet with swamps and little back
01:04:43.219 --> 01:04:46.000
streams and stuff like that, and mosquitoes.
01:04:48.000 --> 01:04:51.340
And I don't know how many, I wouldn't even guess
01:04:51.340 --> 01:04:54.079
if it was 40 % or 50 % or something like that.
01:04:54.139 --> 01:04:58.260
The Marines got malaria off of them, but anyway.
01:04:59.660 --> 01:05:02.599
Our commanding officer, Roosevelt, he got it
01:05:02.599 --> 01:05:06.380
as well. He was in the field hospital when we
01:05:06.380 --> 01:05:11.800
left. But when we got back from, when we finally
01:05:11.800 --> 01:05:18.440
got off of Barocco, part of the guys went around
01:05:18.440 --> 01:05:25.760
to Rice Anchorage, and I was in one of the companies
01:05:25.760 --> 01:05:33.639
that... and over there and to uh destroy some
01:05:33.639 --> 01:05:42.039
uh radio equipment and uh we went by uh uh by
01:05:42.039 --> 01:05:46.800
native boats on and they rode us across the way
01:05:46.800 --> 01:05:53.760
for that they came back through the barroco got
01:05:53.760 --> 01:06:01.460
aboard our ship came back to Guadalcanal, and
01:06:01.460 --> 01:06:08.380
Jimmy Roosevelt had been transferred out of his
01:06:08.380 --> 01:06:13.719
field hospital back to the United States. They
01:06:13.719 --> 01:06:17.679
blew him out on it. But when I got back, I was
01:06:17.679 --> 01:06:22.460
still shaking, and I think part of it was from
01:06:22.460 --> 01:06:25.480
the fright, and the other part was from... from
01:06:25.480 --> 01:06:32.880
the malaria, but they diagnosed it as AWL. But
01:06:32.880 --> 01:06:35.239
they wiped that off because they knew that I
01:06:35.239 --> 01:06:41.019
had snuck aboard a ship to get into combat, real
01:06:41.019 --> 01:06:46.699
tight combat, which was crazy. Anyway, but I
01:06:46.699 --> 01:06:52.659
went back into the field hospital. The field
01:06:52.659 --> 01:07:00.230
hospital... I stayed in for a while and I think
01:07:00.230 --> 01:07:05.230
it was at that time that the 1st and 2nd Raiders
01:07:05.230 --> 01:07:13.210
had wiped out most of the Japanese force around
01:07:13.210 --> 01:07:21.489
the island and the 3rd Raiders were coming in
01:07:22.280 --> 01:07:24.679
in some place up that i don't remember where
01:07:24.679 --> 01:07:27.820
they were from and the fourth raiders were coming
01:07:27.820 --> 01:07:30.659
back to their regular camp on it so they had
01:07:30.659 --> 01:07:35.500
all four raider companies that was overseas were
01:07:35.500 --> 01:07:40.219
all on guadalcanal well that was a design uh
01:07:40.219 --> 01:07:43.699
thing because that's when they wanted to break
01:07:43.699 --> 01:07:48.239
up the raiders the raiders were a smaller outfit
01:07:48.239 --> 01:07:53.269
and uh were trained for hit and run, a lot of
01:07:53.269 --> 01:07:56.809
night fighting and stuff, and they wanted to
01:07:56.809 --> 01:08:04.150
get rid of those tactics and have a more larger
01:08:04.150 --> 01:08:13.230
type of action. So most of the raiders of the
01:08:13.230 --> 01:08:20.810
Third Division, the Fourth Raiders, were reassigned
01:08:20.810 --> 01:08:26.630
to, I think it was the 4th Division and the 6th
01:08:26.630 --> 01:08:31.090
Division, as well as the 1st and 2nd Raiders.
01:08:32.090 --> 01:08:41.890
I was still in the hospital and I got discharged
01:08:41.890 --> 01:08:53.020
out of the hospital on December 25th. And I went
01:08:53.020 --> 01:09:01.020
to a reserve unit. And from there, I went into
01:09:01.020 --> 01:09:05.699
the third division, the 21st Marines. I was assigned
01:09:05.699 --> 01:09:10.739
as a squad leader. That's one of the reasons
01:09:10.739 --> 01:09:14.939
that most of the 4th Raiders had been assigned
01:09:14.939 --> 01:09:19.859
to the 4th Division. And I didn't go in with
01:09:19.859 --> 01:09:22.760
the 4th Division at that time because I had already
01:09:22.760 --> 01:09:26.859
been discharged out of the hospital and to a
01:09:26.859 --> 01:09:31.420
reserve unit to wait to go into the 3rd Division
01:09:31.420 --> 01:09:35.399
as the 3rd Division and the 21st Marines were
01:09:35.399 --> 01:09:44.479
being formed at that time too. So I went in from
01:09:44.479 --> 01:09:47.979
the 3rd Division. Now the Barocco was the first
01:09:47.979 --> 01:09:57.960
really fighting for the Fourth Raiders. We had
01:09:57.960 --> 01:10:00.199
been trained all this time. We really only trained
01:10:00.199 --> 01:10:05.539
and only fought one big battle over there. We
01:10:05.539 --> 01:10:10.180
were in the tail end of the type of action that
01:10:10.180 --> 01:10:18.300
they needed at that time. But in the third division,
01:10:18.600 --> 01:10:22.760
then we had a different course as far as I was
01:10:22.760 --> 01:10:25.640
concerned. I had a different commander and a
01:10:25.640 --> 01:10:30.100
different company. The 21st Marines, but I was
01:10:30.100 --> 01:10:31.920
still the squad leader and still responsible
01:10:31.920 --> 01:10:37.140
for the seven men. We were trained much differently
01:10:37.140 --> 01:10:44.659
than the Raider training. And the reason was,
01:10:45.039 --> 01:10:51.899
that were we were being uh trained for a uh larger
01:10:51.899 --> 01:10:55.340
a larger island that we're going going to come
01:10:55.340 --> 01:10:57.560
in and we're not going to be going in on a small
01:10:57.560 --> 01:11:03.760
small uh unit like the battalion we had two people
01:11:03.760 --> 01:11:06.060
we had two divisions that were going to be going
01:11:06.060 --> 01:11:14.119
in at the same time and uh so the uh 3rd and
01:11:14.119 --> 01:11:19.380
4th and part of the 5th, 2nd and 3rd division
01:11:19.380 --> 01:11:24.100
and part of the 4th division, I think it was,
01:11:24.239 --> 01:11:33.579
were being trained to go to Guam and Tinian and
01:11:33.579 --> 01:11:39.600
Saipan. Really, it was the Saipan first. And
01:11:39.600 --> 01:11:48.039
Saipan, then... then it would be Tinian, then
01:11:48.039 --> 01:11:54.779
it would be Guam on it. But the 3rd Division
01:11:54.779 --> 01:12:03.539
was kind of reserved on a reserve until the 3rd
01:12:03.539 --> 01:12:10.699
and 4th had attacked and partly secured Saipan.
01:12:11.949 --> 01:12:19.250
And then they went on over to Tinian, which was
01:12:19.250 --> 01:12:24.270
a smaller island, and that was situated between
01:12:24.270 --> 01:12:33.949
Saipan and Guam. And Guam, I don't know too much
01:12:33.949 --> 01:12:42.340
about Saipan, but Guam, that was our... main
01:12:42.340 --> 01:12:51.020
objective on it. So we came in on, at first,
01:12:51.100 --> 01:13:01.399
we came in on small boats on it and LSTs, which
01:13:01.399 --> 01:13:04.180
was the landing ship tank, I think they called
01:13:04.180 --> 01:13:10.380
it. Then they transferred us over to I would
01:13:10.380 --> 01:13:16.579
say maybe a half mile away from the landing zone
01:13:16.579 --> 01:13:23.760
and we went into Amtraks and the reason for the
01:13:23.760 --> 01:13:26.699
transfer from the boats to the Amtraks was because
01:13:26.699 --> 01:13:33.300
Guam had so much coral along this landing zone
01:13:33.300 --> 01:13:38.880
and they would just creep over the over the coral
01:13:38.880 --> 01:13:43.760
on it and a regular boat would be going through
01:13:43.760 --> 01:13:47.020
it would tear the bottom up so we transferred
01:13:47.020 --> 01:13:55.000
over and we came in on Amtrak we landed and the
01:13:55.000 --> 01:14:02.619
I think it was an open rice field that we our
01:14:02.619 --> 01:14:09.760
company was going through I remember the water
01:14:09.760 --> 01:14:14.800
buffalo out there in the middle of the rice paddies
01:14:14.800 --> 01:14:21.500
eating while we were shooting and hand grenades
01:14:21.500 --> 01:14:24.220
and mortars and stuff like that going over it.
01:14:24.359 --> 01:14:27.560
It didn't bother him a bit when it came through
01:14:27.560 --> 01:14:35.079
there. We had a comparative light landing, but
01:14:35.079 --> 01:14:43.050
it was... quite noisy with mortars that they
01:14:43.050 --> 01:14:46.250
were shooting at them. They still scared us.
01:14:48.069 --> 01:14:54.729
You're scared, but you don't show it. It's a
01:14:54.729 --> 01:14:58.750
different type of scare. Worried, I guess, maybe.
01:14:59.670 --> 01:15:02.850
More worried about, am I going to be one of the
01:15:02.850 --> 01:15:08.500
guys who's going to get hit? We came on in. Right
01:15:08.500 --> 01:15:16.079
at the end of the rice field, there was an incline.
01:15:17.239 --> 01:15:20.199
We went up that incline on it, and right at the
01:15:20.199 --> 01:15:26.319
top of the incline, we were met with tanks and
01:15:26.319 --> 01:15:33.239
ground troops there, and we fought ourselves.
01:15:34.250 --> 01:15:40.350
right to the top of that incline. And that took
01:15:40.350 --> 01:15:44.050
most of the day going across the rice paddy and
01:15:44.050 --> 01:15:49.649
over that incline. So we dug in right there.
01:15:50.069 --> 01:15:59.130
And we had two companies that was attacked there.
01:15:59.899 --> 01:16:03.579
But one of the main things that we had, the main
01:16:03.579 --> 01:16:08.479
objectives that we were supposed to go to was
01:16:08.479 --> 01:16:13.159
the concentration camp that the Japanese had
01:16:13.159 --> 01:16:18.720
on the island. When the Japanese attacked the
01:16:18.720 --> 01:16:25.979
Guam in 1941, they took all kinds of Marines
01:16:25.979 --> 01:16:32.920
and Navy and corpsmen. and they put them in the
01:16:32.920 --> 01:16:36.779
concentration camp just to get in them a little
01:16:36.779 --> 01:16:41.340
bit. And P Company was, I think, I think it was
01:16:41.340 --> 01:16:46.420
P Company, was charged with taking and go right
01:16:46.420 --> 01:16:53.880
on through that incline around to the concentration
01:16:53.880 --> 01:16:56.640
camp or internment camp, whatever you want to
01:16:56.640 --> 01:17:04.130
call it. and uh released all of the um rescued
01:17:04.130 --> 01:17:08.829
all of the prisoners that they had taken at that
01:17:08.829 --> 01:17:14.770
time on it and then uh which did uh i was not
01:17:14.770 --> 01:17:19.350
involved in that going my uh my company apart
01:17:19.350 --> 01:17:22.289
i think there was a platoon that went with uh
01:17:22.289 --> 01:17:25.229
the people on my my positive group i've heard
01:17:25.229 --> 01:17:30.970
that But anyway, we started digging in there.
01:17:31.109 --> 01:17:35.770
We dug in, and I took nearly all day coming through
01:17:35.770 --> 01:17:43.770
there. And then David Foxhole was there. And
01:17:43.770 --> 01:17:49.250
about that afternoon, that evening, rather, just
01:17:49.250 --> 01:17:54.609
before dark, we heard all kinds of information.
01:17:57.009 --> 01:18:02.369
tanks and mortars. Guys hollering, yelling, screaming.
01:18:02.909 --> 01:18:07.909
And then we had what they call a bonsai attack.
01:18:09.670 --> 01:18:14.989
And it was about two or three hundred Japs came
01:18:14.989 --> 01:18:22.890
out of the brush and attacked us. And we were
01:18:22.890 --> 01:18:26.039
told to stay in our boxholes. on it don't go
01:18:26.039 --> 01:18:30.359
don't get out because of you if we stay in the
01:18:30.359 --> 01:18:33.279
foxhole at least we've got some kind of protection
01:18:33.279 --> 01:18:37.079
but you can't stay in your foxhole when you've
01:18:37.079 --> 01:18:39.520
got mortars coming in there it's just no way
01:18:39.520 --> 01:18:46.239
it's anyway so they ran down they were coming
01:18:46.239 --> 01:18:49.960
down the hill on it to try to drive us off the
01:18:49.960 --> 01:18:55.859
island and uh that's where my bayonet practice
01:18:55.859 --> 01:19:03.300
came into hand there. I shot what I had and and
01:19:03.300 --> 01:19:13.220
it was harder on the first time. That was the
01:19:13.220 --> 01:19:17.180
first time that our company had ever been set
01:19:17.180 --> 01:19:23.460
aside for that, for a bonsai attack. But we killed
01:19:23.460 --> 01:19:30.890
a lot of lot of them and The tanks and drove
01:19:30.890 --> 01:19:34.310
the tanks most of the tanks back up in that back
01:19:34.310 --> 01:19:40.270
the hills there So they didn't they didn't Push
01:19:40.270 --> 01:19:42.909
her off the person push us off the island like
01:19:42.909 --> 01:19:46.670
their plans were the next day They're counted
01:19:46.670 --> 01:19:51.710
all the Moses that were still alive Started up
01:19:51.710 --> 01:19:57.460
toward the coastline toward uh argana and our
01:19:57.460 --> 01:20:03.819
agate or out of that on it and uh we bought the
01:20:03.819 --> 01:20:06.520
pill boxes and stuff all the way up the island
01:20:06.520 --> 01:20:10.479
up there until we got to a gat which was about
01:20:10.479 --> 01:20:15.340
the third or fourth day and then the uh headquarters
01:20:15.340 --> 01:20:18.939
company came in right behind us and stayed in
01:20:18.939 --> 01:20:25.409
on on the beach side and we were going up on
01:20:25.409 --> 01:20:31.649
that incline, just kind of looking over the beach.
01:20:32.789 --> 01:20:39.710
We got up there until all kinds of pillboxes
01:20:39.710 --> 01:20:45.449
we had to go through. And then that night, we
01:20:45.449 --> 01:20:52.029
dug in again. We were digging in. And that night,
01:20:53.210 --> 01:20:57.170
We heard just all these tanks coming down the
01:20:57.170 --> 01:21:03.489
road where we were. And they had about 400 Japs
01:21:03.489 --> 01:21:07.949
following in behind the tanks. And they were
01:21:07.949 --> 01:21:14.189
heading for the headquarters company that was
01:21:14.189 --> 01:21:17.789
down below us on the lower end of the incline.
01:21:22.470 --> 01:21:26.890
They started fighting and stuff and I had I've
01:21:26.890 --> 01:21:35.050
got up out of my foxhole and I Shot one clip
01:21:35.050 --> 01:21:40.289
of eight As it came down running down the hill
01:21:40.289 --> 01:21:45.590
on toward me I Changed got me another round got
01:21:45.590 --> 01:21:50.329
me another clip and stuck it in there And got
01:21:50.329 --> 01:21:55.350
it in there just in time I shot that out. I shot
01:21:55.350 --> 01:22:03.310
eight more. And I was unable to reload because
01:22:03.310 --> 01:22:05.970
I couldn't find another clip out of my bandolier.
01:22:07.569 --> 01:22:13.250
So I started using my bayonet. And some of them
01:22:13.250 --> 01:22:16.149
were jumping over others that were down already.
01:22:16.930 --> 01:22:24.119
So when Jeff came in, he was... good -sized man
01:22:24.119 --> 01:22:38.460
and uh i stabbed him and uh he uh started fighting
01:22:38.460 --> 01:22:47.199
with me and i started backing up and uh stumbled
01:22:47.199 --> 01:22:51.119
over the little berm that i had put around my
01:22:51.550 --> 01:22:57.590
my uh my foxhole that i was digging and uh put
01:22:57.590 --> 01:23:01.449
that and i started falling and just as i started
01:23:01.449 --> 01:23:05.890
falling down he jabbed me in the stomach and
01:23:05.890 --> 01:23:13.890
i fell down on my back in the foxhole he was
01:23:13.890 --> 01:23:16.130
standing right above the box so he was getting
01:23:16.130 --> 01:23:23.099
ready to jump down and the guy from the next
01:23:23.099 --> 01:23:31.720
foxhole over this area. He shot the guy in the
01:23:31.720 --> 01:23:35.579
back or he stabbed him, one of the two. I don't
01:23:35.579 --> 01:23:38.840
know how, but he fell. He fell down on top of
01:23:38.840 --> 01:23:44.020
me in the foxhole. As I fell down in the foxhole,
01:23:44.180 --> 01:23:53.119
my hand hit my gung -ho knife and He fell on
01:23:53.119 --> 01:23:55.579
top of me, and I grabbed that knife. My hand
01:23:55.579 --> 01:23:58.500
was on it, and I grabbed it, and I shoved it
01:23:58.500 --> 01:24:02.479
through his neck and his throat, and I killed
01:24:02.479 --> 01:24:09.260
him there, laying on top of me. And then the
01:24:09.260 --> 01:24:14.699
tanks, the American tanks came in then to join
01:24:14.699 --> 01:24:19.359
the fight from below, and they had been... stationed
01:24:19.359 --> 01:24:21.720
down below the headquarters company. They came
01:24:21.720 --> 01:24:28.020
in up the hill and they just chased the Japs
01:24:28.020 --> 01:24:32.220
back into their holding grounds up further on
01:24:32.220 --> 01:24:37.159
back and back. I stayed in the boxhole with this
01:24:37.159 --> 01:24:41.399
guy on me because I didn't know how deep that
01:24:41.399 --> 01:24:49.819
stomach wound was. So I held on to it, and he
01:24:49.819 --> 01:24:53.960
just bled all over me. But anyway, we got to
01:24:53.960 --> 01:25:00.720
the next morning. We had the corpsman. The corpsman
01:25:00.720 --> 01:25:02.899
came up from the headquarters, and they started
01:25:02.899 --> 01:25:06.859
counting noses on us to see who the people were
01:25:06.859 --> 01:25:10.520
and how bad they were. They pulled the guy off
01:25:10.520 --> 01:25:13.939
of me, and they thought I was done for, but it
01:25:13.939 --> 01:25:20.050
was just his blood, not mine. And they pulled
01:25:20.050 --> 01:25:32.430
me out on it. As I had fallen backwards, he stabbed
01:25:32.430 --> 01:25:36.850
at me. He stuck me in the stomach, and it went
01:25:36.850 --> 01:25:40.430
kind of sideways. It didn't go straight in, so
01:25:40.430 --> 01:25:48.520
it went along under the skin in there. Just stuck
01:25:48.520 --> 01:25:55.239
the capillaries and things. But anyway, they
01:25:55.239 --> 01:25:59.420
pulled me up and wiped me off and got it. And
01:25:59.420 --> 01:26:03.939
then they put bandages on me, put some sulfur
01:26:03.939 --> 01:26:10.779
on me. And they take me up. And he says, okay,
01:26:10.920 --> 01:26:14.260
everybody stay here. It's going to stay here.
01:26:14.909 --> 01:26:19.890
Going to the headquarters company. Well, I just,
01:26:19.930 --> 01:26:23.170
I wanted to stay with my men. So there's only
01:26:23.170 --> 01:26:28.850
three of us left. Me and my B .A. arm and my
01:26:28.850 --> 01:26:34.630
scout. So I just stayed with them and bundled
01:26:34.630 --> 01:26:38.609
up my stomach and held on to it and restarted
01:26:38.609 --> 01:26:43.550
on up further and up through Ghana and Pagod.
01:26:44.090 --> 01:26:48.550
I came across a lot of Jap officers had committed
01:26:48.550 --> 01:26:54.310
harry -carry in the tents. They didn't want to
01:26:54.310 --> 01:27:00.829
be captured, I guess. I was bleeding that night
01:27:00.829 --> 01:27:07.270
a little bit, so one of the corpsmen came up
01:27:07.270 --> 01:27:12.960
from the headquarters company. I met that same
01:27:12.960 --> 01:27:17.640
corpsman in San Diego at the Ring Raider Association
01:27:17.640 --> 01:27:20.859
meeting down there. He was one of the guys that
01:27:20.859 --> 01:27:25.420
came up and he taped me. He came up and they
01:27:25.420 --> 01:27:28.539
wiped all the blood off on it and re -stuck,
01:27:28.560 --> 01:27:34.760
re -applied sulfur. I think they called it sulfur.
01:27:35.760 --> 01:27:40.859
And then he taped it. He pulled the skin together.
01:27:41.710 --> 01:27:46.010
on it and taped it and by that time it didn't
01:27:46.010 --> 01:27:49.970
look too bad by the time he had gone through
01:27:49.970 --> 01:27:55.630
that got into uh and we started uh going on further
01:27:55.630 --> 01:28:02.069
on up and i found uh that one of my real good
01:28:02.069 --> 01:28:09.229
friends lieutenant leonard had been killed by
01:28:09.229 --> 01:28:12.640
leading a charge on on the box one of the pill
01:28:12.640 --> 01:28:20.279
boxes there um and uh he and uh pretend to home
01:28:20.279 --> 01:28:31.039
her buddies with me on guadalcanal they were
01:28:31.039 --> 01:28:37.560
in the raiders so anyway we went on up through
01:28:37.560 --> 01:28:46.350
there and uh We stayed on Guam for, on that end
01:28:46.350 --> 01:28:51.970
for three more days. Going up there and finally
01:28:51.970 --> 01:28:57.850
we got into, oh, my, one of my, my scout, I think
01:28:57.850 --> 01:29:05.909
it was, Navarro, found two cases of sake. And
01:29:05.909 --> 01:29:16.100
sake is rice wine. Yeah, it's good. I lived in
01:29:16.100 --> 01:29:17.800
Japan for a while, so I know exactly what you're
01:29:17.800 --> 01:29:27.659
talking about. Well, we got that, but we couldn't
01:29:27.659 --> 01:29:31.260
drink it all. We couldn't drink the thing. So
01:29:31.260 --> 01:29:37.260
it was all unopened. So we found a good spot
01:29:37.260 --> 01:29:41.750
and we dug a hole and buried it. And we knew
01:29:41.750 --> 01:29:46.449
where it was going to be. So we decided amongst
01:29:46.449 --> 01:29:50.350
ourselves to leave it there, not drink it, and
01:29:50.350 --> 01:29:53.210
didn't have time. We had other things to do.
01:29:54.670 --> 01:30:00.109
We went to, I remember the little town that was
01:30:00.109 --> 01:30:08.090
right down in the jet. Anyway, we stayed there
01:30:08.090 --> 01:30:14.510
for the, the fifth night, sixth night, and then
01:30:14.510 --> 01:30:19.989
we moved inward and by that time we had pretty
01:30:19.989 --> 01:30:25.590
well got Guam situated because all of the main
01:30:25.590 --> 01:30:35.449
Japanese area attack force had already been wiped
01:30:35.449 --> 01:30:40.970
out. chased back way on the other side. So I
01:30:40.970 --> 01:30:45.729
don't remember where it was that we were stationed
01:30:45.729 --> 01:30:54.829
or posted there. But I'm going to pull back a
01:30:54.829 --> 01:30:58.869
little bit. When we were on board ship coming
01:30:58.869 --> 01:31:04.649
to Guam, they took all our money away and gave
01:31:04.649 --> 01:31:10.329
us gave us what they call hawaiian dollars now
01:31:10.329 --> 01:31:17.750
hawaiian dollar is uh regular uh 5 10 and 20
01:31:17.750 --> 01:31:25.130
dollar bills with the word hawaii uh stamped
01:31:25.130 --> 01:31:29.329
on the face of it we were and that was the only
01:31:29.329 --> 01:31:36.279
legal legal tender on guam was uh those Hawaiian
01:31:36.279 --> 01:31:41.699
dollars on it. Now the reason was that when the
01:31:41.699 --> 01:31:51.060
Japs conquered in 1941, the paymaster for all
01:31:51.060 --> 01:31:56.100
of the islands in the Pacific were captured as
01:31:56.100 --> 01:32:01.640
well. Many millions of dollars in United States
01:32:01.640 --> 01:32:10.090
money were captured as well. And the U .S. government
01:32:10.090 --> 01:32:17.750
did not want us poor Marines to recapture that
01:32:17.750 --> 01:32:23.750
money and send it home. So we couldn't use it
01:32:23.750 --> 01:32:28.210
on the islands. So that was because the only
01:32:28.210 --> 01:32:32.409
tender that we could use was the Hawaiian dollars.
01:32:34.189 --> 01:32:38.880
That's little. side thing because and another
01:32:38.880 --> 01:32:42.659
thing that they told us on that that ship at
01:32:42.659 --> 01:32:47.800
that time on it to watch out for airplanes that
01:32:47.800 --> 01:32:51.760
are uh civilian type airplanes that are crashed
01:32:51.760 --> 01:32:56.819
out there and see to find out they were what
01:32:56.819 --> 01:32:59.500
they were still looking for was a media air heart
01:32:59.500 --> 01:33:09.899
yeah they were had and uh um Her plane was, at
01:33:09.899 --> 01:33:16.680
that time, supposed to have been downed in some
01:33:16.680 --> 01:33:21.279
of the islands around there. But it turned out
01:33:21.279 --> 01:33:26.520
that they weren't. Amelia Ellerhart actually
01:33:26.520 --> 01:33:33.760
was on a small island and was captured by...
01:33:34.109 --> 01:33:42.550
a Japanese stroller and was brought to Guam through
01:33:42.550 --> 01:33:51.369
Saipan and was seen on Saipan and so was Amelia
01:33:51.369 --> 01:33:56.170
Earhart on it but they were told at the time
01:33:56.170 --> 01:34:00.069
to keep looking for civilian airplanes that have
01:34:01.400 --> 01:34:09.840
I crashed in the islands there. But I have a
01:34:09.840 --> 01:34:13.260
letter. I won't go into that. That's secret.
01:34:14.159 --> 01:34:22.859
Anyway, we got there on Guam and we started our
01:34:22.859 --> 01:34:30.920
training again. I used to hitchhike all over
01:34:30.920 --> 01:34:41.220
Guam to the Seabees and get their food. Get the
01:34:41.220 --> 01:34:49.659
best food in the military. Real egg. Well, what's
01:34:49.659 --> 01:34:52.260
interesting, I actually got married to my first
01:34:52.260 --> 01:34:56.050
wife in Guam. So it's crazy to talk to you and
01:34:56.050 --> 01:34:58.409
there you were fighting for your life, you know,
01:34:58.430 --> 01:35:01.430
some 55 years prior. And I was standing in the
01:35:01.430 --> 01:35:04.609
chapel, you know, marrying this American girl,
01:35:04.710 --> 01:35:07.590
you know, on this beautiful tropical island where
01:35:07.590 --> 01:35:10.369
now the Japanese that were, you know, our friends
01:35:10.369 --> 01:35:13.829
again were coming on vacation. As long as you
01:35:13.829 --> 01:35:20.069
bring that in, I'll tell you. On last year, I
01:35:20.069 --> 01:35:27.560
got a call from. the Justice Department and San
01:35:27.560 --> 01:35:37.699
Jose from the Superior Court on it. The judge
01:35:37.699 --> 01:35:42.920
could come over and visit with me and talk about
01:35:42.920 --> 01:35:50.050
his parents were in and that concentration camp
01:35:50.050 --> 01:35:54.369
on Guam. Really? And he was, and his parents
01:35:54.369 --> 01:36:01.210
were released by part of my company that was
01:36:01.210 --> 01:36:09.390
owned there. And his name was Joe Gogo, Justice
01:36:09.390 --> 01:36:14.109
Gogo, I think they called it. And San Jose, he
01:36:14.109 --> 01:36:19.739
was going to be the... The president of the United
01:36:19.739 --> 01:36:25.340
States was going to assign him as the ambassador
01:36:25.340 --> 01:36:30.840
to Guam. Anyway, he came over and visited with
01:36:30.840 --> 01:36:33.920
me, and he thanked me, and he brought the flag,
01:36:34.140 --> 01:36:38.720
the Guamanian flag over with him, and a bunch
01:36:38.720 --> 01:36:44.640
of souvenirs, and he gave them to me. And I signed
01:36:44.640 --> 01:36:50.609
the... Romanian flag or like that. And they were
01:36:50.609 --> 01:36:55.390
going to have a parade on Guam and wanted me
01:36:55.390 --> 01:37:02.210
to be one of the grand marshals for the parade
01:37:02.210 --> 01:37:07.310
over there. Because every year, I don't remember
01:37:07.310 --> 01:37:12.670
what month, but every year that they have a parade
01:37:12.670 --> 01:37:20.149
to celebrate the Americans. on Guam. It was quite
01:37:20.149 --> 01:37:25.850
interesting to talk to him. I did Christmas cards
01:37:25.850 --> 01:37:28.510
and Valentine cards and stuff like that from
01:37:28.510 --> 01:37:32.750
the judge. Thanked me for, because if it wasn't
01:37:32.750 --> 01:37:37.829
for saving his parents, he wouldn't be here.
01:37:38.310 --> 01:37:43.270
Absolutely. So that was rather, that was, as
01:37:43.270 --> 01:37:46.909
long as you brought the American your wedding
01:37:46.909 --> 01:37:50.109
thing. I thought maybe I'd throw that in there.
01:37:51.289 --> 01:37:55.130
But they were, Guam is a great place. It's beautiful.
01:37:55.590 --> 01:38:01.430
It's a great place. I have a pic, I think it's
01:38:01.430 --> 01:38:04.090
someplace in there. I have a picture of the last
01:38:04.090 --> 01:38:11.090
PBY that left Guam before it was captured by
01:38:11.090 --> 01:38:16.270
the Japanese in 1941 on it. They had one, the
01:38:16.270 --> 01:38:20.609
last PBY that left was full. I have a picture.
01:38:20.770 --> 01:38:29.090
And one of the lady's parents that my wife had
01:38:29.090 --> 01:38:35.270
gone to school with in Westport, Oregon, her
01:38:35.270 --> 01:38:43.489
mother's parents were on that plane. as it left
01:38:43.489 --> 01:38:49.350
Argana. So, that was fun. That's amazing. So,
01:38:49.390 --> 01:38:51.430
I mean, you've obviously told us a lot about
01:38:51.430 --> 01:38:54.090
the time in Guam, the book details, a lot more
01:38:54.090 --> 01:38:57.079
of, you know, the different... moments that you
01:38:57.079 --> 01:38:59.479
have when it came to combat i would love to just
01:38:59.479 --> 01:39:02.880
bring you into iwajima so then we can then transition
01:39:02.880 --> 01:39:05.800
to you know your your transition out of the military
01:39:05.800 --> 01:39:08.460
but obviously that's a very famous conflict a
01:39:08.460 --> 01:39:10.699
very different landscape than the jungles that
01:39:10.699 --> 01:39:14.119
you're used to in guam so talk to me about the
01:39:14.119 --> 01:39:17.479
the iwajima attack and then you know we'll work
01:39:17.479 --> 01:39:22.199
on from there on guam we've trained we were training
01:39:22.199 --> 01:39:28.670
again for uh a different kind of action than
01:39:28.670 --> 01:39:32.689
we have been faced before. Before we were in
01:39:32.689 --> 01:39:37.829
Guadalcanal, we were in deep jungle. And then
01:39:37.829 --> 01:39:43.489
on over to Guam, we're in farmland and jungle.
01:39:44.149 --> 01:39:51.850
And then we were training for hills and... caves
01:39:51.850 --> 01:39:54.109
and stuff like that of which we had never been
01:39:54.109 --> 01:39:58.550
trained before and So we all felt that that was
01:39:58.550 --> 01:40:03.590
going to be different On it, but anyway on February
01:40:03.590 --> 01:40:13.630
the February 1945 We left we left Guam as a unit
01:40:13.630 --> 01:40:28.180
The 4th and 5th Division left Guadalcanal, Guam,
01:40:28.199 --> 01:40:33.859
and Saipan. The 21st Marines, which I was a member
01:40:33.859 --> 01:40:39.800
of the 21st Marines, of the 3rd Division were
01:40:39.800 --> 01:40:48.699
backup reserve for the landing on Iwo Jima. We
01:40:48.699 --> 01:40:59.239
were, they, the generals, that'll put me in the
01:40:59.239 --> 01:41:03.760
right connection, I think. The generals thought
01:41:03.760 --> 01:41:09.560
that, were thinking that we were going to have
01:41:09.560 --> 01:41:17.760
a heavy casualty going on in Iwo Jima. and they
01:41:17.760 --> 01:41:27.100
wanted a regiment on the water. They called them
01:41:27.100 --> 01:41:33.819
Floating Reserve because to put forth another
01:41:33.819 --> 01:41:37.819
regiment, they wanted them right then. They didn't
01:41:37.819 --> 01:41:40.800
want to wait to come from Saipan or something.
01:41:40.960 --> 01:41:43.819
It took a couple of days or something. They want
01:41:43.819 --> 01:41:47.550
a reserve. They want them now. So they had the
01:41:47.550 --> 01:41:54.750
21st Marines in the harbor waiting to go shore.
01:41:55.170 --> 01:41:59.989
On February the 19th, the 3rd and 4th Division
01:41:59.989 --> 01:42:07.350
landed on Iwo Jima. On that date, we were 50
01:42:07.350 --> 01:42:14.449
miles away from Iwo Jima heading. toward, when
01:42:14.449 --> 01:42:19.510
I say we, the 21st Marines were 50 miles away
01:42:19.510 --> 01:42:21.850
from the Iwo Jima harbor where we were supposed
01:42:21.850 --> 01:42:30.189
to be. And we got word aboard ship at that time
01:42:30.189 --> 01:42:37.310
that there was hardly any action at all on landing
01:42:37.310 --> 01:42:44.779
at Iwo Jima. And that the They were had expected
01:42:44.779 --> 01:42:52.739
heavy casualty load at that time and It didn't
01:42:52.739 --> 01:42:59.119
happen and then until after the third the third
01:42:59.119 --> 01:43:04.560
the fourth fourth and fifth division the fifth
01:43:04.560 --> 01:43:10.140
division went straight for Mount Suribachi and
01:43:10.140 --> 01:43:14.800
they went above the started up the mountain.
01:43:14.859 --> 01:43:20.520
Mount Suribachi is an extinct volcano. And it
01:43:20.520 --> 01:43:25.279
has lava holes, lava caves, and all the way up
01:43:25.279 --> 01:43:29.659
the mountain, to the top of the mountain. And
01:43:29.659 --> 01:43:38.520
the fourth divisions were assigned the first
01:43:38.520 --> 01:43:43.340
airport, first airfield, which was The closest
01:43:43.340 --> 01:43:48.279
one toward Mount Suribachi. They started and
01:43:48.279 --> 01:43:51.140
started toward, now I can't remember if that
01:43:51.140 --> 01:43:56.460
was north or south on the other end, toward the
01:43:56.460 --> 01:44:02.380
other airfields. But the 5th Division started,
01:44:02.699 --> 01:44:07.479
the 28th Marines of the 5th Division started
01:44:07.479 --> 01:44:15.960
up the mountain on it. And the 4th Division started,
01:44:16.420 --> 01:44:22.840
let's say, south. I don't know if that was the
01:44:22.840 --> 01:44:31.119
direction or not. And to drive the Japanese from
01:44:31.119 --> 01:44:34.439
there. And that cut off the Japanese between
01:44:34.439 --> 01:44:41.109
the airport airfield and... the Mount Suribachi.
01:44:42.449 --> 01:44:46.390
Part of the 4th came in on the other side of
01:44:46.390 --> 01:44:52.329
the island to meet the 4th Division. During that
01:44:52.329 --> 01:44:59.909
day of February the 19th, the 21st Marines came
01:44:59.909 --> 01:45:08.590
in on the USS Jackson. We came in into Iwo Jima
01:45:08.590 --> 01:45:16.149
Harbor. At that time, all hell broke out of the
01:45:16.149 --> 01:45:21.189
mountain. The Japanese figured that they were
01:45:21.189 --> 01:45:28.149
all on shore and in the places that they had
01:45:28.149 --> 01:45:31.329
marked. The Japanese had just about every square
01:45:31.329 --> 01:45:35.989
inch of that landing zone marked, and their mortars
01:45:35.989 --> 01:45:41.699
pep in. firing the mortars as the rest of the
01:45:41.699 --> 01:45:46.880
units were coming in. And I'll tell you right
01:45:46.880 --> 01:45:53.579
now, the Seabees, this is the first battle that
01:45:53.579 --> 01:45:58.819
the Seabees have ever been with the landing force
01:45:58.819 --> 01:46:06.039
that came in on the initial. Normally, the Seabees
01:46:06.039 --> 01:46:13.449
were came in maybe the next day or so after it
01:46:13.449 --> 01:46:18.149
had been more secured, landing zone would be
01:46:18.149 --> 01:46:21.529
more secured. But this time they came in right
01:46:21.529 --> 01:46:30.250
with the 4th Division on it, most of them on
01:46:30.250 --> 01:46:36.760
it. had mortars all over that place, all over
01:46:36.760 --> 01:46:44.479
the lower end of this Mount Suribachi. And they
01:46:44.479 --> 01:46:50.899
shelled all of those square inches, I will say,
01:46:51.039 --> 01:46:57.260
along that island. And it was, you just couldn't.
01:46:59.340 --> 01:47:01.840
You can't imagine the number of people that were
01:47:01.840 --> 01:47:07.319
killed right there. Thousands right there on
01:47:07.319 --> 01:47:09.819
the beach, on the landing beach of the 4th and
01:47:09.819 --> 01:47:15.260
5th. It seems like the limbs were one of the
01:47:15.260 --> 01:47:20.960
biggest things. On arm, leg, knees, legs were
01:47:20.960 --> 01:47:27.920
just scattered all over the place. Heads. It
01:47:27.920 --> 01:47:33.380
was just scattered all over the place. The 4th
01:47:33.380 --> 01:47:40.960
Division were chasing the main group north or
01:47:40.960 --> 01:47:46.880
south on the line. I just don't remember that.
01:47:49.979 --> 01:47:55.420
The 5th Division was doing the same over there.
01:47:56.329 --> 01:48:02.170
They were shoving over toward the 4th Division.
01:48:02.890 --> 01:48:06.130
They were splitting up the Japanese. And the
01:48:06.130 --> 01:48:11.850
28th Marines had a real tough time going up that
01:48:11.850 --> 01:48:23.149
hill. And I talked to one of the pilots from
01:48:23.149 --> 01:48:27.130
one of the aircraft carriers. that was on Iwo
01:48:27.130 --> 01:48:34.270
Jima and he said when they made their final when
01:48:34.270 --> 01:48:43.289
they made their pass over the landing zone that
01:48:43.289 --> 01:48:50.710
it looked like a bunch of ants just full of dead
01:48:50.710 --> 01:48:58.460
bodies and stuff and then We stayed there. That
01:48:58.460 --> 01:49:02.760
was on the 19th, the evening of the 19th on it.
01:49:03.460 --> 01:49:09.340
And we were called. The 21st was on floating
01:49:09.340 --> 01:49:13.479
reserve. And we were called on the next day,
01:49:13.560 --> 01:49:18.579
the 20th. I can't remember the commander's general
01:49:18.579 --> 01:49:22.420
now. I can't remember who it was. He gave us
01:49:22.420 --> 01:49:27.260
the word. to depart from the ship and get on
01:49:27.260 --> 01:49:33.979
your get on the uh on the lcis and ldc it gave
01:49:33.979 --> 01:49:38.140
the word to go overside so we went over the side
01:49:38.140 --> 01:49:42.680
and climbed down the ropes onto our uh on our
01:49:42.680 --> 01:49:50.699
perspective uh landing barge landing craft and
01:49:50.699 --> 01:49:56.239
uh started a rendezvous around the ship. Our
01:49:56.239 --> 01:50:03.399
ship was USS Jackson and we waited and we circled
01:50:03.399 --> 01:50:11.460
our ship for six hours trying to get organized
01:50:11.460 --> 01:50:18.260
to go ashore and surf was up. He said six foot
01:50:18.260 --> 01:50:25.180
surf but I don't know about how they judge that,
01:50:25.319 --> 01:50:30.340
but anyway, we're waiting for the beach master
01:50:30.340 --> 01:50:35.399
to give us the word that they had room for us.
01:50:35.399 --> 01:50:39.739
They didn't have room for us on the landing zone.
01:50:41.619 --> 01:50:48.460
All the tanks that were disabled, all the the
01:50:48.460 --> 01:51:00.210
LCIs, landing ship infantry were crashed, blown
01:51:00.210 --> 01:51:03.529
up, decided they had just all kinds of equipment.
01:51:04.350 --> 01:51:11.329
Men were lined around like in pieces all over.
01:51:11.569 --> 01:51:20.369
They had graveyard people with gunny sacks picking
01:51:20.369 --> 01:51:31.329
up the the arms and legs and whatever. And they
01:51:31.329 --> 01:51:36.289
said that we couldn't land. The beach captain
01:51:36.289 --> 01:51:40.409
told us that he wasn't going to allow us to land.
01:51:41.609 --> 01:51:46.989
So our general says, go back aboard ship. So
01:51:46.989 --> 01:51:50.430
after we've been floating around on the ship,
01:51:50.920 --> 01:51:55.479
round and round and round the ship for six hours
01:51:55.479 --> 01:51:58.800
and it's hard to serve and we got back had to
01:51:58.800 --> 01:52:02.319
go back and climbed up the ladder that uh rope
01:52:02.319 --> 01:52:06.539
ladder again hit back aboard ship i got aboard
01:52:06.539 --> 01:52:10.579
ship on it and that was with the 21st Marines
01:52:10.579 --> 01:52:18.680
on the 20th and the ship's uh cook had sandwiches
01:52:19.470 --> 01:52:23.829
and coffee all ready for us and we hid and they
01:52:23.829 --> 01:52:28.710
gave us that we had no wounded or anything coming
01:52:28.710 --> 01:52:33.210
back aboard ship we were full of force for the
01:52:33.210 --> 01:52:37.289
20th and the night of the 20th morning of the
01:52:37.289 --> 01:52:44.409
21st we had uh we got the word to debark from
01:52:44.409 --> 01:52:53.340
the ship again so uh We got off the ship and
01:52:53.340 --> 01:52:57.439
headed in toward the night on it. Me and my crew
01:52:57.439 --> 01:53:05.359
were on a Amtrak on it. And we came in and we
01:53:05.359 --> 01:53:13.399
landed on part of the Yellow Beach on it. And
01:53:13.399 --> 01:53:18.000
right by the... I can never remember that name.
01:53:21.460 --> 01:53:27.539
Well, it's where the Japanese shipped out their
01:53:27.539 --> 01:53:43.010
salt and stuff off of the island on it. Anyway,
01:53:43.189 --> 01:53:47.510
I never can remember that name of that harbor.
01:53:48.590 --> 01:53:55.470
Anyway, we came in, and as we came in, we were
01:53:55.470 --> 01:54:01.229
supposed to meet the 4th Division at 10 o 'clock
01:54:01.229 --> 01:54:09.989
that morning on the 21st. We were held up. Now,
01:54:10.050 --> 01:54:14.350
4th Division had... pushed the Japanese off of
01:54:14.350 --> 01:54:20.090
airfield number one and pushed them. I'm going
01:54:20.090 --> 01:54:22.270
to get south or north. I'm going to push them
01:54:22.270 --> 01:54:24.409
away from it toward the other end of the island.
01:54:24.449 --> 01:54:27.090
I'll put it because I can't remember the direction.
01:54:30.729 --> 01:54:39.090
We hit the beach and the Amtrak crawled up on
01:54:39.090 --> 01:54:43.449
the beach about 20, I would say about 20 yards
01:54:43.449 --> 01:54:52.189
and like that. And we got, they opened fire on
01:54:52.189 --> 01:55:00.430
us from the rock prairie, prairie there. And
01:55:00.430 --> 01:55:04.909
machine gun on us as well as the rest of them.
01:55:04.989 --> 01:55:13.779
And we jumped off of the the Amtrak, and we had
01:55:13.779 --> 01:55:19.180
seven men at that time, and I lost two of them.
01:55:20.300 --> 01:55:27.159
Me and my other guys went off on one side of
01:55:27.159 --> 01:55:31.260
the, on the port side, and two of my men got
01:55:31.260 --> 01:55:34.119
off on the starboard side with their boats on
01:55:34.119 --> 01:55:37.899
it, and the starboard side, that's where the
01:55:38.670 --> 01:55:44.229
I forgot that name again. Get that back. Anyway,
01:55:44.470 --> 01:55:48.130
our machine gun was stationed up there and killed
01:55:48.130 --> 01:55:53.449
two of my guys there on it, as well as more of
01:55:53.449 --> 01:55:57.289
them. We lost a lot of men coming in on that
01:55:57.289 --> 01:56:05.189
particular area. And we were pinned down as we
01:56:05.189 --> 01:56:14.300
came in. The 4th Division at that time had gone
01:56:14.300 --> 01:56:21.100
clear through Airfield 101 and were waiting at
01:56:21.100 --> 01:56:29.899
the beginning on the morning of the 21st. That's
01:56:29.899 --> 01:56:35.840
when we were supposed to meet the 4th Division.
01:56:37.569 --> 01:56:41.569
relieve them because they had been fighting for
01:56:41.569 --> 01:56:51.630
two days, the 19th and 20th. And so, but we couldn't
01:56:51.630 --> 01:56:57.850
make it because we were held down as well. And
01:56:57.850 --> 01:57:00.289
we were supposed to be there at 10 o 'clock.
01:57:00.430 --> 01:57:04.529
Well, we couldn't make it. We stayed there that
01:57:04.529 --> 01:57:08.810
night. in that area, and we finally mopped up
01:57:08.810 --> 01:57:12.369
those machine guns at the quarry, I remember
01:57:12.369 --> 01:57:18.970
that now, at the rock quarry, and we were supposed
01:57:18.970 --> 01:57:24.770
to meet then the following day, and we got pinned
01:57:24.770 --> 01:57:33.949
down. Well, it so happened that the 4th Division
01:57:34.960 --> 01:57:38.979
had been waiting for us at the beginning of airfield
01:57:38.979 --> 01:57:42.140
number two, and that's where we were supposed
01:57:42.140 --> 01:57:50.520
to relieve them on it. Someone told a runner
01:57:50.520 --> 01:57:57.020
or a radio, or what, told the commanding officer
01:57:57.020 --> 01:58:04.619
of the 4th Division that overall by... near one,
01:58:04.840 --> 01:58:13.380
that the Japanese were farming in airfield number
01:58:13.380 --> 01:58:18.640
two and was working their way around between
01:58:18.640 --> 01:58:25.279
us and the fourth division. The 21st Marines
01:58:25.279 --> 01:58:30.619
Regiment was by the rock prairie there by the
01:58:30.619 --> 01:58:35.699
beach. The Japanese were going to work around
01:58:35.699 --> 01:58:40.260
and come in behind the 4th Division. Well, it
01:58:40.260 --> 01:58:45.359
sure had happened that they didn't realize that
01:58:45.359 --> 01:58:49.439
we were coming in from the beach at that time.
01:58:50.560 --> 01:58:53.800
But the Japs were trying to sneak in behind the
01:58:53.800 --> 01:58:56.939
4th Division, and they couldn't make it. Because
01:58:56.939 --> 01:59:00.720
when they came up between us, then we pinned
01:59:00.720 --> 01:59:04.220
them down. So now we had a whole bunch of Japs
01:59:04.220 --> 01:59:09.399
between us. So the 4th Division just turned around
01:59:09.399 --> 01:59:11.359
and started shooting them, and we shot them from
01:59:11.359 --> 01:59:15.380
behind. So we wiped the whole bunch out right
01:59:15.380 --> 01:59:18.539
there at the beginning. We finally went up to,
01:59:18.600 --> 01:59:23.800
got them, and we went to, through, met the 4th
01:59:23.800 --> 01:59:26.560
Division at the beginning of the airfield number
01:59:26.560 --> 01:59:33.560
2. We fought. We went through them and left them
01:59:33.560 --> 01:59:37.619
at the beginning of the airfield and the 21st
01:59:37.619 --> 01:59:43.100
Marine Regiment started to take airfield number
01:59:43.100 --> 01:59:47.260
two. All those Japanese that they had chased
01:59:47.260 --> 01:59:51.960
from airfield number two, which was right down
01:59:51.960 --> 02:00:01.090
by the Mount Suribachi, they were all... uh all
02:00:01.090 --> 02:00:04.289
holed up there on airfield number two and we
02:00:04.289 --> 02:00:09.689
ran into them like that and we had one hell of
02:00:09.689 --> 02:00:16.850
a fight there and they turned the mortars that
02:00:16.850 --> 02:00:24.470
were on wheels toward us and fought and fired
02:00:24.470 --> 02:00:29.760
those right down you know four or five feet up
02:00:29.760 --> 02:00:36.100
off the ground on it, as if they were rifles.
02:00:37.600 --> 02:00:43.460
And as I say, lame as you flew. But we finally
02:00:43.460 --> 02:00:48.159
got through that bunch on it. On the second,
02:00:48.380 --> 02:00:53.399
we fought all day, we fought all night. And the
02:00:53.399 --> 02:00:57.460
second day, I think it was the second day, I
02:00:57.460 --> 02:01:00.300
got hit in the head with a piece of, either by
02:01:00.300 --> 02:01:04.579
a shell or by a bullet, I don't know which one.
02:01:04.819 --> 02:01:09.300
He hit my helmet and knocked me out, knocked
02:01:09.300 --> 02:01:12.520
my helmet off, cut a big hole in it. And I was
02:01:12.520 --> 02:01:19.619
out. And we got, the rest of the 21st kept going
02:01:19.619 --> 02:01:25.520
through. My guys, I lost all of them there, all
02:01:25.520 --> 02:01:33.930
but two. on that fight. And we got hours out
02:01:33.930 --> 02:01:37.930
and some guy from the 4th Division came up behind
02:01:37.930 --> 02:01:41.449
me and shook my back. I think he was trying to
02:01:41.449 --> 02:01:44.170
get my knife was what he was trying to do. But
02:01:44.170 --> 02:01:50.750
anyway, and that woke me up. And then from then
02:01:50.750 --> 02:01:55.989
on I was working with the 4th Division because
02:01:56.520 --> 02:01:59.739
My third division had already, the 21st police
02:01:59.739 --> 02:02:05.199
had already gone through the rest of them. And
02:02:05.199 --> 02:02:09.840
I finally, he asked me where I was from, and
02:02:09.840 --> 02:02:11.239
I told him I wasn't part of Washington. He said,
02:02:11.260 --> 02:02:15.060
well, they're way up ahead of us on it. They've
02:02:15.060 --> 02:02:20.680
already gone through. So we got on up there.
02:02:21.159 --> 02:02:25.850
It took us five days to go through. Airfield
02:02:25.850 --> 02:02:32.869
number two. At day and night. Day and night.
02:02:34.390 --> 02:02:39.630
We were airdropped food. Corsairs, I think they
02:02:39.630 --> 02:02:43.710
were. I think they were corsairs that did that.
02:02:44.210 --> 02:02:49.869
And we got over to on the other side of airfield
02:02:49.869 --> 02:02:56.600
number two. And By that time I had found another
02:02:56.600 --> 02:03:05.460
helmet and I was in pretty well the headache
02:03:05.460 --> 02:03:12.479
and got over there on the other side of airfield
02:03:12.479 --> 02:03:21.020
number two and they have a sulfur plant and a
02:03:21.020 --> 02:03:26.050
sulfur field over there. The Japs had used the
02:03:26.050 --> 02:03:29.890
sulfur for other reasons, other things, I guess.
02:03:30.069 --> 02:03:34.510
And then they went to, they used to go out through
02:03:34.510 --> 02:03:39.369
the quarry. And that's where they shipped it
02:03:39.369 --> 02:03:44.069
from. That's where we came in. We got over there
02:03:44.069 --> 02:03:48.310
on that side. I asked if anybody knew where the
02:03:48.310 --> 02:03:51.770
21st Marines were. And he says, well, we saw
02:03:51.770 --> 02:03:55.220
two guys. uh he thought that they were they were
02:03:55.220 --> 02:03:58.720
strangers and so i went over there and that was
02:03:58.720 --> 02:04:07.020
my barman and my uh scout and then that was me
02:04:07.020 --> 02:04:10.680
then so there's only three of us left out of
02:04:10.680 --> 02:04:17.340
the seven uh they were uh we had no more company
02:04:17.340 --> 02:04:22.699
it wiped them out and uh Yeah, just the three.
02:04:25.140 --> 02:04:30.760
So we're staying down there in Siegfried's 27th,
02:04:30.800 --> 02:04:35.899
28th, 27th or 28th in that area. 27th, I think
02:04:35.899 --> 02:04:43.239
it was. Some general came by and the three were
02:04:43.239 --> 02:04:48.800
huddled in one big shell. He asked us where we
02:04:48.800 --> 02:04:56.800
were from. And I said that we're the 21st Marine,
02:04:56.899 --> 02:05:01.319
3rd Division, and he says, well, they're not
02:05:01.319 --> 02:05:06.659
here. And I don't know where they are. He says,
02:05:06.659 --> 02:05:08.779
but you're going to be in the 4th Division now.
02:05:09.800 --> 02:05:12.100
And so we finished up. He says, we've got to
02:05:12.100 --> 02:05:15.979
take those two radio stations out and go through
02:05:15.979 --> 02:05:24.119
Moriyama Airfield. village, Yodamayam Village.
02:05:24.800 --> 02:05:31.100
So we went to, followed him up through the, he
02:05:31.100 --> 02:05:36.020
and his, I think he was a gunny soldier. Anyway,
02:05:36.180 --> 02:05:39.659
he was out there with them, and they were gathering
02:05:39.659 --> 02:05:43.140
up the men that had just gone through the second
02:05:43.140 --> 02:05:50.310
airfield. And we took off from there. We followed
02:05:50.310 --> 02:05:54.090
the 4th Division then, the three of us, over
02:05:54.090 --> 02:06:01.770
to Motoyama Village, to the Motoyama Village,
02:06:01.890 --> 02:06:05.229
which is on the side of airfield number 2, then
02:06:05.229 --> 02:06:09.050
went from there to the radio station, knocked
02:06:09.050 --> 02:06:12.670
it out, and then we started running over from
02:06:12.670 --> 02:06:20.520
airfield number, from Hill 362. I think that
02:06:20.520 --> 02:06:31.020
was on the 27th, 28th, 27th, I think it was.
02:06:31.880 --> 02:06:35.260
And it took us two days to get through those.
02:06:36.380 --> 02:06:42.479
And then we headed toward 362. We got pinned
02:06:42.479 --> 02:06:49.880
down on 362 for two days. uh 362 was one day
02:06:49.880 --> 02:06:56.979
and we left that morning on uh on the first of
02:06:56.979 --> 02:07:03.560
march i'm getting the dates uh pasta day someplace
02:07:03.560 --> 02:07:10.020
first of march and it took us two days uh and
02:07:10.020 --> 02:07:18.739
then we went over to uh uh to hill 380. 382.
02:07:18.739 --> 02:07:23.960
Now 382 is the second highest peak on Iwo Jima
02:07:23.960 --> 02:07:30.359
and Mount Suribachi was the highest peak and
02:07:30.359 --> 02:07:37.840
382 was designated and it was the second highest
02:07:37.840 --> 02:07:41.800
on it and they wanted us to have high ground
02:07:41.800 --> 02:07:48.180
so we tried to go high ground. They had only
02:07:48.180 --> 02:07:53.539
one place that we could go through on 382, was
02:07:53.539 --> 02:08:02.439
up between two big rocks and stone caves. And
02:08:02.439 --> 02:08:11.720
then we got into where there was a... We'd get
02:08:11.720 --> 02:08:15.699
up... uh over started to go over the hill and
02:08:15.699 --> 02:08:22.020
then the japanese would uh had two pill boxes
02:08:22.020 --> 02:08:27.760
up there and they were knocking us down every
02:08:27.760 --> 02:08:34.159
time and uh with hand grenades and and mortars
02:08:34.159 --> 02:08:38.340
go out and pull us knocked us down again and
02:08:38.340 --> 02:08:43.149
we go back down and reorganize and go up again.
02:08:43.890 --> 02:08:51.909
We kept that up for two days. And finally on
02:08:51.909 --> 02:08:57.029
March the 3rd, they sent us up and they used
02:08:57.029 --> 02:09:01.270
my scout as the first one. He was the first one
02:09:01.270 --> 02:09:03.630
to go up over the hill between these two big
02:09:03.630 --> 02:09:09.989
rocks. That's how we were going to take it. He
02:09:09.989 --> 02:09:14.289
went up over the hill and got up there and looked
02:09:14.289 --> 02:09:18.750
around and he went on down. Then I followed the
02:09:18.750 --> 02:09:24.109
scout and I got up there on top of the hill.
02:09:24.590 --> 02:09:27.970
I looked around like that and then the damn machine
02:09:27.970 --> 02:09:36.470
gun opened up from the shell, one of the pillboxes.
02:09:40.300 --> 02:09:45.960
He sprayed my chest. That was a Nambu 25. He
02:09:45.960 --> 02:09:51.699
sprayed my chest and arm. And I fell down and
02:09:51.699 --> 02:10:01.180
then I was bleeding like a stuck pig. And the
02:10:01.180 --> 02:10:09.239
corpsman and my VAR man came up, got a hold of
02:10:09.239 --> 02:10:14.920
my feet. And they pulled me back down into a
02:10:14.920 --> 02:10:20.479
big shell hole. And then Corbin started treating
02:10:20.479 --> 02:10:29.159
me. And then McCoy, the airman, came up. He went
02:10:29.159 --> 02:10:35.899
out, got all the same stuff. And he went right
02:10:35.899 --> 02:10:40.859
over to that pillbox. He cleaned the pillbox
02:10:40.859 --> 02:10:44.960
out. They killed him. He had four people in there,
02:10:45.020 --> 02:10:49.279
and he had two machine guns on him. And he got
02:10:49.279 --> 02:10:55.920
them, cleaned them all out. I was in the shell
02:10:55.920 --> 02:10:59.340
hole. They were still operating. Not operating,
02:10:59.420 --> 02:11:06.239
they were still fixing me up. And then pretty
02:11:06.239 --> 02:11:15.020
soon, McCoy came down, and he was bleeding all
02:11:15.020 --> 02:11:19.340
over his back on it. They threw a hand grenade
02:11:19.340 --> 02:11:21.840
right behind him, and it blew up and blew in
02:11:21.840 --> 02:11:26.199
the rocks and stuff, and the pieces of shell
02:11:26.199 --> 02:11:32.500
and rock, stones, went all through his back.
02:11:33.399 --> 02:11:40.199
He was just peckered. holes all through his back
02:11:40.199 --> 02:11:46.399
when you were bleeding. And he came down the
02:11:46.399 --> 02:11:53.319
shell hole with me. And I stayed there. The corpsman
02:11:53.319 --> 02:12:02.020
had put a tag on me with where I was shot and
02:12:02.020 --> 02:12:07.739
what I was doing there. what treatment he did,
02:12:07.859 --> 02:12:12.260
and he put that all on a tag and he pinned it
02:12:12.260 --> 02:12:18.819
to my blouse, upper blouse by my neck. And pretty
02:12:18.819 --> 02:12:23.260
soon the machine, the mortars started falling
02:12:23.260 --> 02:12:28.399
in the shell hole where we were on it. And he
02:12:28.399 --> 02:12:35.380
says, can you walk right? I said, sure the hell
02:12:35.380 --> 02:12:40.279
can. He said, well, let's go. We couldn't get
02:12:40.279 --> 02:12:44.119
anybody, any stretcher bearers up there because
02:12:44.119 --> 02:12:48.000
it was too dangerous right then at that time.
02:12:48.079 --> 02:12:51.800
They were shooting one of the stretcher bearers
02:12:51.800 --> 02:12:56.359
and then they wouldn't have anybody to carry
02:12:56.359 --> 02:13:00.680
it anyway. So we just started, we started back.
02:13:04.130 --> 02:13:10.989
And I have, I grabbed hold of his arm and he
02:13:10.989 --> 02:13:18.670
grabbed, and he gave one of the guys his, his
02:13:18.670 --> 02:13:23.750
BAR, because they didn't want to get that kind
02:13:23.750 --> 02:13:27.670
of firepower right in the front. And he had the
02:13:27.670 --> 02:13:38.619
BAR. And I gave my rifle to, I think it was,
02:13:38.659 --> 02:13:45.819
to him for protection. So we started walking
02:13:45.819 --> 02:13:51.079
back and we were about a mile and a half, maybe
02:13:51.079 --> 02:14:00.119
a mile from the beach where we were to be evacuated
02:14:00.119 --> 02:14:04.000
off of. off the island we were walking together
02:14:04.000 --> 02:14:09.779
along along the side of airfield number two and
02:14:09.779 --> 02:14:12.699
the guys were still walking mopping up there
02:14:12.699 --> 02:14:18.199
and a b -29 came down we're just trying to land
02:14:18.199 --> 02:14:20.479
right there on that and all those in the are
02:14:20.479 --> 02:14:25.340
big when they're you know 15 20 feet off the
02:14:25.340 --> 02:14:30.500
ground they are big and he was looking for a
02:14:30.500 --> 02:14:33.159
place to land but there was just no place to
02:14:33.159 --> 02:14:38.340
land there on number two. So he kept on going
02:14:38.340 --> 02:14:42.239
and he got into our field number one. Number
02:14:42.239 --> 02:14:47.579
one was by that time the Seabees had finished
02:14:47.579 --> 02:14:50.699
their tractor work and had been cleaning up a
02:14:50.699 --> 02:14:59.510
good landing site for the Corsairs and fighter
02:14:59.510 --> 02:15:05.270
planes had landed down there already and had
02:15:05.270 --> 02:15:09.369
a good laying field. I knew that they could have
02:15:09.369 --> 02:15:17.510
landed there pretty good. So the B -29, the Corsairs
02:15:17.510 --> 02:15:23.250
took off for another run someplace and then the
02:15:23.250 --> 02:15:26.970
B -29 came in and landed and I think I was the
02:15:26.970 --> 02:15:33.880
first. B -29 to land on AWOL and that was, that's
02:15:33.880 --> 02:15:36.180
what we were fighting for. We were fighting to
02:15:36.180 --> 02:15:41.000
get those fields clear enough so that they could,
02:15:41.079 --> 02:15:49.340
so that the fighters could escort the 29s when
02:15:49.340 --> 02:15:56.439
they were flying over to Japan and bomb them.
02:15:57.289 --> 02:16:02.069
So they were using the airfields already for
02:16:02.069 --> 02:16:08.670
that purpose and saving them. I stayed with McCoy
02:16:08.670 --> 02:16:13.609
there. When we got over to the airfield number
02:16:13.609 --> 02:16:26.640
one, the evacuation for the wounded were just
02:16:26.640 --> 02:16:32.579
off to the side of airfield number one, and they
02:16:32.579 --> 02:16:37.159
were waiting for pickup from different kinds
02:16:37.159 --> 02:16:39.479
of transportation going out to the hospital ships.
02:16:40.620 --> 02:16:43.079
They stayed on the hospital, they stayed there.
02:16:43.340 --> 02:16:48.620
I stayed there with McCoy, and I was laying on
02:16:48.620 --> 02:16:51.719
my stomach, and I was laying on my back, and
02:16:51.719 --> 02:16:55.059
he was laying on his stomach. We're having a
02:16:55.059 --> 02:17:04.000
cigarette and talking and visiting. I turned
02:17:04.000 --> 02:17:11.040
up and looked at McCoy. And he says, I'm going
02:17:11.040 --> 02:17:14.739
to take off. He says, this one has got ambulatories.
02:17:15.860 --> 02:17:21.799
So I said, OK. So we shook hands and thanked
02:17:21.799 --> 02:17:29.930
for it. being with each other and company. And
02:17:29.930 --> 02:17:32.569
he walked off and walked all over, went to his
02:17:32.569 --> 02:17:40.229
LST, got on that. That was the last I saw a car
02:17:40.229 --> 02:17:45.649
on it. And I think he got through the war okay.
02:17:47.790 --> 02:17:55.340
And I had asked him how. Navarro, our scout,
02:17:55.620 --> 02:17:59.079
he said he didn't know for sure. He says, last
02:17:59.079 --> 02:18:04.920
I saw, he was shooting and running toward a couple
02:18:04.920 --> 02:18:08.379
of pillboxes out there. He said he didn't know.
02:18:08.479 --> 02:18:12.059
By that time, he said I'd been hit. So I don't
02:18:12.059 --> 02:18:18.540
know what happened to Navarro and McCoy. And
02:18:18.540 --> 02:18:23.819
I were the only ones out of K Company that we
02:18:23.819 --> 02:18:31.280
ever found. Until we got, until I got to the
02:18:31.280 --> 02:18:41.020
Stockton Marine Corps Club and met Ted Salisbury.
02:18:42.520 --> 02:18:46.979
And he was on, he and I were in the same company.
02:18:48.079 --> 02:18:51.940
And he thought he was the last one. Because he
02:18:51.940 --> 02:18:55.739
hadn't met anybody at all. And maybe I hadn't
02:18:55.739 --> 02:18:58.540
seen him either. Met a lot of them out there.
02:18:58.639 --> 02:19:03.920
But wounded it. I couldn't tell. So they transferred
02:19:03.920 --> 02:19:08.120
me over to that. And I stayed on that. Went over
02:19:08.120 --> 02:19:13.379
on the hospital ship. And went from there to
02:19:13.379 --> 02:19:18.620
Saipan. Picked up another. bunch of going they're
02:19:18.620 --> 02:19:24.440
going toward the states and left Saipan went
02:19:24.440 --> 02:19:34.420
to uh the Johnson Island which is out by out
02:19:34.420 --> 02:19:43.940
near uh Pearl Harbor the Hawaiian Islands and
02:19:43.940 --> 02:19:54.420
uh landed there with a PBI and a corpsman came
02:19:54.420 --> 02:20:04.299
on board the plane and sprayed us with DDT. They
02:20:04.299 --> 02:20:14.680
didn't want us to spread any bugs on their beautiful
02:20:14.680 --> 02:20:23.370
island. Yeah. They cleaned us off there and took
02:20:23.370 --> 02:20:32.690
us over to the hospital. I can't remember the
02:20:32.690 --> 02:20:38.110
name. I think it was the Army Hospital. And I
02:20:38.110 --> 02:20:48.950
stayed there for a couple of days. And the doctor
02:20:48.950 --> 02:20:56.010
came by and looked at my tag. Well, first when
02:20:56.010 --> 02:21:06.190
we landed there at the main island, he looked
02:21:06.190 --> 02:21:09.770
at my tag and he talked me off to see what ward
02:21:09.770 --> 02:21:13.409
I should go to. And my tag said combat fatigue
02:21:13.409 --> 02:21:20.100
end. They put me in a combative ward on there.
02:21:20.239 --> 02:21:24.879
It had no nurses on there, no doctors on there,
02:21:24.959 --> 02:21:35.159
no nothing on there. And my bandage needed changed
02:21:35.159 --> 02:21:41.620
badly and cleaned it all and stuff. Doctor came
02:21:41.620 --> 02:21:45.639
through to to ask me what I was doing there.
02:21:45.799 --> 02:21:51.219
And I said, they put me here. And so he said
02:21:51.219 --> 02:21:53.979
to me, he says, oh, schedule this man for a tap.
02:21:55.280 --> 02:22:00.719
And so I said, well, at least I've got something
02:22:00.719 --> 02:22:05.299
going. So after he left, I asked the nurse, I
02:22:05.299 --> 02:22:08.600
said, well, what's a tap? He said, well, you're
02:22:08.600 --> 02:22:12.840
bleeding on the inside. And says, you've got
02:22:12.840 --> 02:22:16.600
blood on your chest cavity, and they have to
02:22:16.600 --> 02:22:19.680
get the chest, get the blood out. And says, they
02:22:19.680 --> 02:22:24.860
stick a needle in your back and drain it, drain
02:22:24.860 --> 02:22:36.420
it that way. I said, good Lord. So I went to
02:22:36.420 --> 02:22:42.270
bed that evening, and that night I... I woke
02:22:42.270 --> 02:22:45.409
up and I thought I'd wet the bed because I had
02:22:45.409 --> 02:22:53.770
peed all over the rubber mattress that they had
02:22:53.770 --> 02:23:00.770
there. And so I hollered for the nurse. The night
02:23:00.770 --> 02:23:05.170
nurse came over and she looked at me and asked
02:23:05.170 --> 02:23:08.610
what for. And I told her I had wet my bed, I
02:23:08.610 --> 02:23:10.579
think. because I sit down with this lady and
02:23:10.579 --> 02:23:16.159
a bunch of porn. She turned the nightlight on
02:23:16.159 --> 02:23:20.159
and she looked at me and turned it off right
02:23:20.159 --> 02:23:28.079
away and took off. And we came back with a couple
02:23:28.079 --> 02:23:34.139
other guys and turned the lights on like that
02:23:34.139 --> 02:23:36.860
and pulled the covers back and I'd been left
02:23:36.860 --> 02:23:40.979
in bed. Laying in the pool of blood because the
02:23:40.979 --> 02:23:48.159
bandage was off. I had rolled over on my left
02:23:48.159 --> 02:23:51.780
side, and all that blood that was in my chest
02:23:51.780 --> 02:23:56.719
came out and went all over, and that's what I
02:23:56.719 --> 02:24:00.239
was laying in. So you tapped yourself. And so,
02:24:00.260 --> 02:24:04.579
yeah. So they said, well, we'll have to cancel
02:24:04.579 --> 02:24:06.559
that. And I said, what? They said, cancel what?
02:24:06.950 --> 02:24:08.670
You're not going to have a tap tomorrow. Oh,
02:24:08.829 --> 02:24:18.069
thank God. Oh, I can remember that. I was happy.
02:24:19.290 --> 02:24:28.149
Anyway, the next day after they changed my bed
02:24:28.149 --> 02:24:30.950
and stuff like that, the next day they came over
02:24:30.950 --> 02:24:36.229
and they transferred me up to going to to the
02:24:36.229 --> 02:24:43.209
States. So I took, and I think, and I'm not for
02:24:43.209 --> 02:24:52.549
sure, I think I flew to the Naval Hospital landing,
02:24:52.809 --> 02:24:59.750
and I think it was a PBY, and I flew. I can't
02:24:59.750 --> 02:25:03.530
remember the ship at all, because I think that
02:25:03.530 --> 02:25:10.950
I flew in. I got in there and they looked at
02:25:10.950 --> 02:25:14.629
my tag and it said Combat Fatigue. And that's
02:25:14.629 --> 02:25:17.409
where I went. They took me in and put me in a
02:25:17.409 --> 02:25:24.290
Combat Fatigue ward. I told you that's what the
02:25:24.290 --> 02:25:31.290
story I had about Combat Fatigue and PTSD on
02:25:31.290 --> 02:25:35.750
it. The guy missed. diagnosed me on board ship
02:25:35.750 --> 02:25:40.250
because i had and because i had knocked his butt
02:25:40.250 --> 02:25:44.569
across the hall with uh when they were going
02:25:44.569 --> 02:25:49.729
to take my arm off i mean you were tired of being
02:25:49.729 --> 02:25:54.829
shot basically anyway that's where i got to put
02:25:54.829 --> 02:26:00.010
it first on it and uh and it's still got my it's
02:26:00.010 --> 02:26:04.200
it's in my records on it It's combat fatigue
02:26:04.200 --> 02:26:07.639
on the thing. It didn't say anything about my
02:26:07.639 --> 02:26:14.000
wounds at that time at all. Right. Anyway, I
02:26:14.000 --> 02:26:19.159
got into San Diego Hospital. And I stayed there
02:26:19.159 --> 02:26:24.100
for a month, I think. It was about a month. Then
02:26:24.100 --> 02:26:29.020
I got shipped home. I had a few instances in
02:26:29.020 --> 02:26:38.829
the hospital, but... And that got me home. I
02:26:38.829 --> 02:26:43.889
flew home. I got home from San Diego. I hitched
02:26:43.889 --> 02:26:54.450
a ride. Oh, a little aside. I had met my wife,
02:26:54.649 --> 02:27:00.290
my coming wife, honey, in Astoria, Oregon, when
02:27:00.290 --> 02:27:02.600
I was stationed at the second point. That's where
02:27:02.600 --> 02:27:10.739
I had met her. And her sister had married a Navy
02:27:10.739 --> 02:27:16.399
guy and they were stationed in San Diego. So
02:27:16.399 --> 02:27:27.760
I was able to sneak a way out of the hospital.
02:27:30.829 --> 02:27:36.489
got a cab and went over and met my future wife
02:27:36.489 --> 02:27:41.030
and her sister and her husband and stayed there
02:27:41.030 --> 02:27:43.709
that afternoon and the evening and then the first
02:27:43.709 --> 02:27:46.329
thing in the morning, well, I snuck back into
02:27:46.329 --> 02:27:58.190
the hospital. And I stayed there until I got
02:27:58.760 --> 02:28:02.940
And she came home, back home, to her Astoria
02:28:02.940 --> 02:28:11.180
home and graduated out of school. And I went
02:28:11.180 --> 02:28:22.319
to hospital and had a furlough transfer. That
02:28:22.319 --> 02:28:24.959
was the first furlough I had had in the Marine
02:28:24.959 --> 02:28:34.319
Corps. A day off, more than 72 hour pass in the
02:28:34.319 --> 02:28:46.159
four years. And then when I was overseas, they
02:28:46.159 --> 02:28:51.100
told me and the rest of the raiders, you're only
02:28:51.100 --> 02:28:54.979
required to be over there 12 months. That's all.
02:28:59.209 --> 02:29:02.409
Kid Buns came. We were all short -timers, we
02:29:02.409 --> 02:29:06.770
thought. But Marine Corps didn't think that.
02:29:07.610 --> 02:29:09.950
They said, no, it's going to be a year and a
02:29:09.950 --> 02:29:13.930
half before you can go home. Maybe a year and
02:29:13.930 --> 02:29:17.930
a half. No, it's duration. But we never did get
02:29:17.930 --> 02:29:21.010
a chance to get out off of there due to the turnover.
02:29:21.870 --> 02:29:28.079
Anyway, I got home on a leave transfer. And they
02:29:28.079 --> 02:29:30.940
had asked me where I wanted to go for my last
02:29:30.940 --> 02:29:34.559
six months in the service. And I said I wanted
02:29:34.559 --> 02:29:39.280
to go, I wanted to be a drill instructor at Parris
02:29:39.280 --> 02:29:42.000
Island. That's the closest to Arkansas that I
02:29:42.000 --> 02:29:51.399
can get. So I caught a train, I think it was,
02:29:51.520 --> 02:29:58.430
to Kansas City. I think that's where it was.
02:29:59.350 --> 02:30:03.350
And then, no, it was just the opposite. I got
02:30:03.350 --> 02:30:09.989
one from San Diego to Kansas City on a plane.
02:30:10.450 --> 02:30:14.549
I set it on boxes to get out. It was a military
02:30:14.549 --> 02:30:22.170
plane. And I got it in Kansas City. Then I took
02:30:22.170 --> 02:30:28.120
a train down. to arkansas met my folks and i
02:30:28.120 --> 02:30:34.360
stayed there until i was ready for my leave to
02:30:34.360 --> 02:30:37.860
be up i transferred then i transferred over to
02:30:37.860 --> 02:30:46.760
uh um to paris island as a drill instructor until
02:30:46.760 --> 02:30:51.899
my district so what i'm sorry frank i didn't
02:30:51.899 --> 02:30:53.620
mean to i was just going to say what what was
02:30:53.620 --> 02:30:55.920
it like because Up to that point, you'd seen
02:30:55.920 --> 02:30:59.500
fierce fighting. You'd seen what Lieutenant Colonel
02:30:59.500 --> 02:31:02.620
Dave Grossman talks about as the most traumatic
02:31:02.620 --> 02:31:05.620
version of combat, which is the extremely close
02:31:05.620 --> 02:31:08.780
bayonet knife fighting that you obviously encountered
02:31:08.780 --> 02:31:12.639
several times. So how did you handle physically
02:31:12.639 --> 02:31:15.079
your transition as far as your wounds, but also
02:31:15.079 --> 02:31:16.979
mentally? I mean, you end up writing a book about
02:31:16.979 --> 02:31:19.620
touching on PTSD. What was that journey like
02:31:19.620 --> 02:31:23.020
for you mentally after? being in the south pacific
02:31:23.020 --> 02:31:24.860
literally fighting for your life for multiple
02:31:24.860 --> 02:31:33.979
years well uh i got when i got uh see i was i
02:31:33.979 --> 02:31:38.659
was put into the uh ptsd or combat war on it
02:31:38.659 --> 02:31:43.659
i was put into that on it and uh i didn't have
02:31:43.659 --> 02:31:48.239
regular medical care because if i wanted something
02:31:48.780 --> 02:31:51.399
my bandage changed i had to go someplace else
02:31:51.399 --> 02:31:59.520
to get it and in that when my time came to discharge
02:31:59.520 --> 02:32:06.040
like that a different guy in the ptsd ward was
02:32:06.040 --> 02:32:13.100
in charge of it and he released me without conferring
02:32:13.100 --> 02:32:18.790
to the medical doctor a medical doctor had And
02:32:18.790 --> 02:32:25.409
I had what they called a proud flesh sticking
02:32:25.409 --> 02:32:33.149
out of my chest, about an inch long. And my wounds
02:32:33.149 --> 02:32:36.670
were trying to heal, and my muscle was sticking
02:32:36.670 --> 02:32:41.989
out. And they referred to it as proud flesh.
02:32:47.559 --> 02:32:50.600
One doctor didn't ask the other doctor or get
02:32:50.600 --> 02:32:54.239
her released from him. So they released me. And
02:32:54.239 --> 02:32:59.940
so I took off. And I took off. And I still had
02:32:59.940 --> 02:33:02.860
my bandage on. I still had this muscle sticking
02:33:02.860 --> 02:33:10.299
out of my chest. I got there in Arkansas. And
02:33:10.299 --> 02:33:16.690
my dad worked at... He was a supervisor of the
02:33:16.690 --> 02:33:25.790
crew that worked on poison gas facilities. And
02:33:25.790 --> 02:33:31.790
when I got there in Arkansas, then of course
02:33:31.790 --> 02:33:38.250
I went home and dad was all, he was all wanting
02:33:38.250 --> 02:33:40.229
to know what happened and where'd you go and
02:33:40.229 --> 02:33:42.790
what'd you do, were you killing anybody and all
02:33:42.790 --> 02:33:47.329
that stuff, and mother was... different kind
02:33:47.329 --> 02:33:53.290
of a meeting. Anyway, I showed him my chest,
02:33:53.610 --> 02:33:57.409
and so he peeled off the bandage off my chest.
02:33:57.709 --> 02:34:00.209
Here's this damn piece of muscle sticking out
02:34:00.209 --> 02:34:04.770
about an inch. Boy, he was about ready to blow.
02:34:05.329 --> 02:34:10.170
He was so mad at the Navy doctors for letting
02:34:10.170 --> 02:34:17.950
him go like that. And then, So he called up the
02:34:17.950 --> 02:34:23.709
medical doctor on the baby and told him the story.
02:34:24.270 --> 02:34:29.950
And they took me over to the medical ward at
02:34:29.950 --> 02:34:37.190
the Army Hospital there and put me into the ward
02:34:37.190 --> 02:34:40.750
there and asked what it was that I was wanted
02:34:40.750 --> 02:34:46.010
for. The dad explained. I had just been released
02:34:46.010 --> 02:34:50.170
from the medical doctor, from the PTSD doctor
02:34:50.170 --> 02:34:53.469
and all that kind of stuff. Anyway, he says,
02:34:53.549 --> 02:34:55.270
well, he looked at it and he says, well, this
02:34:55.270 --> 02:35:00.590
has to go. We have to take that off. So he just
02:35:00.590 --> 02:35:04.329
said, go in there and disrobe. And I told the
02:35:04.329 --> 02:35:08.049
nurse, prep him up. So they took me right in
02:35:08.049 --> 02:35:15.639
and froze the... part that they were going to
02:35:15.639 --> 02:35:22.799
cut off. And then they cut that out. And redid
02:35:22.799 --> 02:35:28.860
it. And he was pissed. He couldn't believe that
02:35:28.860 --> 02:35:35.020
they let someone out with a war wound that wasn't
02:35:35.020 --> 02:35:39.420
even healed yet. Well, again, the reason was
02:35:39.420 --> 02:35:45.260
I was in a PTSD ward. And he didn't confer with
02:35:45.260 --> 02:35:49.239
the medical board. They had permission for one,
02:35:49.239 --> 02:35:51.639
but not the other. And that's why. And I took
02:35:51.639 --> 02:35:55.319
it. Because I wanted to get out of there. As
02:35:55.319 --> 02:35:59.040
I said, my dad was a bugler. And he was a member
02:35:59.040 --> 02:36:02.799
of the Drum and Bugle Corps. And I knew drums.
02:36:03.520 --> 02:36:07.700
So I joined the Drum and Bugle Corps with him.
02:36:08.200 --> 02:36:12.159
And he and I used to march in the military parade
02:36:12.159 --> 02:36:17.370
together. I'd play drums and he'd play the beautiful.
02:36:17.750 --> 02:36:20.930
And he was the most happy man on earth, to have
02:36:20.930 --> 02:36:25.450
his son home, of course, and being able to be
02:36:25.450 --> 02:36:32.709
out there and play in a band with him. But he
02:36:32.709 --> 02:36:36.149
reacted that way. My mother was mad, of course,
02:36:36.270 --> 02:36:41.149
and she didn't want to look at the wounds for
02:36:41.149 --> 02:36:49.819
a while. And she did. I had two holes in my chest.
02:36:50.479 --> 02:36:58.559
My clavicle was cracked on and above my arm,
02:36:58.920 --> 02:37:07.340
above my lungs. And went out through my chest
02:37:07.340 --> 02:37:11.639
and went through my muscle in my left arm. and
02:37:11.639 --> 02:37:17.719
they were going to amputate my left arm. That's
02:37:17.719 --> 02:37:22.260
what made me mad about ship. But I had been massaged
02:37:22.260 --> 02:37:28.379
on my arm and shoulder for a long time from a
02:37:28.379 --> 02:37:38.489
little woman, a Marine nurse corpsman. And she
02:37:38.489 --> 02:37:41.209
went and massaged around my arms and shoulders.
02:37:42.489 --> 02:37:47.430
And she said, gee, what it was is that it was
02:37:47.430 --> 02:37:53.510
my arm muscles and nerves were trauma, still
02:37:53.510 --> 02:37:58.590
in trauma. And therefore you couldn't, so all
02:37:58.590 --> 02:38:01.010
I could do was just raise my wrist up and that's
02:38:01.010 --> 02:38:12.459
it. But I got home. And then PTDSD didn't set
02:38:12.459 --> 02:38:22.200
in until after we were married. For some reason,
02:38:22.260 --> 02:38:27.879
I don't know what shook it off. I think what
02:38:27.879 --> 02:38:32.719
shook it off, I was president of the American
02:38:32.719 --> 02:38:44.760
Legion in Florence. And seeing all of the guys
02:38:44.760 --> 02:38:47.399
out there and talking to them, it simply brought
02:38:47.399 --> 02:38:50.840
back a hell of a lot of memories. I think that's
02:38:50.840 --> 02:38:55.420
what set that farm open. I started drinking.
02:38:58.260 --> 02:39:08.430
Then I found out there wasn't a way to go. I
02:39:08.430 --> 02:39:16.090
saw that little help. I got help from some guys
02:39:16.090 --> 02:39:20.329
in the American Legion there who talked about
02:39:20.329 --> 02:39:26.110
it and stuff. So it was okay until I got back
02:39:26.110 --> 02:39:31.450
over to California and went in again. They told
02:39:31.450 --> 02:39:35.110
me that I'd never get rid of it, to talk it out.
02:39:36.209 --> 02:39:40.110
That's why I'm here. I want to talk about it.
02:39:41.129 --> 02:39:45.950
I bring back a lot of memories. I know the guys.
02:39:50.649 --> 02:39:59.290
And that's about it. You got any questions? No,
02:39:59.290 --> 02:40:01.629
sir. Well, I mean, firstly, I want to thank you
02:40:01.629 --> 02:40:04.739
for telling the story. The fact that you're moved,
02:40:04.879 --> 02:40:08.100
the fact that you're emotional about this is
02:40:08.100 --> 02:40:10.219
exactly what these conversations should be about.
02:40:10.360 --> 02:40:14.860
Because my generation, it's such a bizarre thing.
02:40:14.940 --> 02:40:17.280
Your generation is what we call the greatest
02:40:17.280 --> 02:40:21.159
generation. And you saw and did so much that
02:40:21.159 --> 02:40:23.239
no one should ever have to see or have to do.
02:40:23.739 --> 02:40:27.899
And then you have my generation that was raised
02:40:27.899 --> 02:40:31.450
with this insane notion that... Men don't cry.
02:40:31.610 --> 02:40:33.549
Men don't show emotion. Kind of like the pattern
02:40:33.549 --> 02:40:35.729
example that you gave me. Just give them a little
02:40:35.729 --> 02:40:38.430
slap around the face and their PTSD will be gone,
02:40:38.549 --> 02:40:41.450
which has driven so many men and women into the
02:40:41.450 --> 02:40:45.909
grave because of that ridiculous notion. So hearing
02:40:45.909 --> 02:40:48.389
from someone like yourself, and I always point
02:40:48.389 --> 02:40:51.729
to the 101st Easy Company from Band of Brothers,
02:40:51.889 --> 02:40:54.370
the TV show that they made, the real men that
02:40:54.370 --> 02:40:57.799
talk on that, you can see. the just sheer emotion
02:40:57.799 --> 02:41:01.979
in them too so by hearing your story and hearing
02:41:01.979 --> 02:41:05.680
you get choked up is exactly what younger generations
02:41:05.680 --> 02:41:08.040
need to hear that this of course as you said
02:41:08.040 --> 02:41:10.459
how how could it not affect you that you had
02:41:10.459 --> 02:41:12.719
to take lives that you watched your friends killed
02:41:12.719 --> 02:41:15.920
that you you know and then came back and even
02:41:15.920 --> 02:41:18.040
some of the the situations where you know you
02:41:18.040 --> 02:41:20.020
were left wounded and feeling abandoned in a
02:41:20.020 --> 02:41:22.139
psych ward when you should have been having your
02:41:22.139 --> 02:41:25.549
wounds addressed so I want to thank you. I want
02:41:25.549 --> 02:41:27.590
to thank you for taking the time to walk us through
02:41:27.590 --> 02:41:30.530
an event where very few voices are left to tell
02:41:30.530 --> 02:41:34.110
that story and for being courageous to tell the
02:41:34.110 --> 02:41:37.610
other side, which is the part that most people
02:41:37.610 --> 02:41:42.209
shove down, the impact mentally and physically
02:41:42.209 --> 02:41:44.969
on the men and women that we send to war and
02:41:44.969 --> 02:41:47.190
what they bring home in their body and what they
02:41:47.190 --> 02:41:52.719
bring home in their mind. It helped me a lot
02:41:52.719 --> 02:41:58.600
on it. I go to the Stockton Marine Corps Club
02:41:58.600 --> 02:42:04.700
on it, and I meet a lot of good people that have
02:42:04.700 --> 02:42:07.879
gone through the present -day war, I'll call
02:42:07.879 --> 02:42:13.260
it that, that they've been through, Vietnam on,
02:42:13.500 --> 02:42:18.120
and some of their stories and stuff, and that
02:42:18.120 --> 02:42:27.479
has helped me. I've given speeches. to the Sacramento
02:42:27.479 --> 02:42:38.459
Club and their home Marine Corps birthday balls.
02:42:38.920 --> 02:42:44.120
I've spoken there. I've given two or three speeches
02:42:44.120 --> 02:42:51.350
on Iwo Jima, and that's helped. all right and
02:42:51.350 --> 02:42:54.030
by getting it away from me i even put it in my
02:42:54.030 --> 02:42:58.469
book that i have uh written uh that that's what
02:42:58.469 --> 02:43:03.549
i think it would be good for those people those
02:43:03.549 --> 02:43:08.129
men and women that uh have all this traumatic
02:43:08.129 --> 02:43:12.649
experience on it if they get rid of it and uh
02:43:12.649 --> 02:43:15.469
and talk and let people know you know i'm sorry
02:43:15.469 --> 02:43:18.649
and don't say it's a When they ask, you know,
02:43:18.649 --> 02:43:21.030
what happened? Oh, nothing, we fought a little
02:43:21.030 --> 02:43:27.469
bit, and stuff like that. Well, tell them. Tell
02:43:27.469 --> 02:43:31.729
them what it is. Know about it, and let people
02:43:31.729 --> 02:43:36.790
know what it is. Maybe they won't think about
02:43:36.790 --> 02:43:43.440
it if they do come into where they have it. The
02:43:43.440 --> 02:43:46.680
authority or the vote, if you will, in Congress
02:43:46.680 --> 02:43:49.620
or so, about going into war again or causing
02:43:49.620 --> 02:43:56.139
things to go to war. Don't do that. Do something
02:43:56.139 --> 02:44:02.559
else if you have to do it. War is hell. But get
02:44:02.559 --> 02:44:06.139
rid of it. Tell somebody. Tell somebody. Show
02:44:06.139 --> 02:44:11.629
what you did in the service on it. Let them know
02:44:11.629 --> 02:44:23.110
that it's not just to play games. John William
02:44:23.110 --> 02:44:29.190
had a speech, and of course I've written for
02:44:29.190 --> 02:44:40.500
him, but he had a speech on Iwo Jima on it. After
02:44:40.500 --> 02:44:48.479
the first day, he talked. And he has the words
02:44:48.479 --> 02:44:55.180
that they sounded like he really meant it. But
02:44:55.180 --> 02:44:58.459
that was exactly what it was. He meant it. He
02:44:58.459 --> 02:45:08.000
really meant that. It's not all glory. I see
02:45:08.000 --> 02:45:12.479
some of the... movies that always throw, of course,
02:45:12.500 --> 02:45:19.420
they've got to sell it to, but the romance in
02:45:19.420 --> 02:45:26.260
it, and some of them show what their wife or
02:45:26.260 --> 02:45:30.139
girlfriend are going through, which is good.
02:45:30.440 --> 02:45:33.319
And they're suffering, too. The home folks suffer.
02:45:35.840 --> 02:45:44.950
But that's why I jumped at chance to say my story.
02:45:46.270 --> 02:45:49.909
And I've lost a lot of my memory. Otherwise,
02:45:50.049 --> 02:45:52.090
I used to be able to. When I started writing
02:45:52.090 --> 02:45:56.549
my book on it, my wife was against it. Because
02:45:56.549 --> 02:46:02.229
I had referrals. I had things that I had to look
02:46:02.229 --> 02:46:06.350
up. I had to look up the names of ships. I was
02:46:06.350 --> 02:46:10.170
on 11 different ships overseas. going to and
02:46:10.170 --> 02:46:20.450
from different islands, both for combat or for
02:46:20.450 --> 02:46:24.770
just being transferred. And that's a lot of ships.
02:46:25.129 --> 02:46:32.889
That is. Yeah. I've got one submarine and a whole
02:46:32.889 --> 02:46:40.079
bunch of ships. It's an adventure for a young
02:46:40.079 --> 02:46:48.399
kid. That's adventure. And I realize that I'm
02:46:48.399 --> 02:46:52.780
96 years old now. My memory is getting a little
02:46:52.780 --> 02:46:57.319
short. And I know that people, and there's not
02:46:57.319 --> 02:47:02.139
much of us left. Not much left of 96 -year -olds.
02:47:02.239 --> 02:47:09.659
Fight or no fight. And I know that they, my wife
02:47:09.659 --> 02:47:11.860
asked me about, well, why do you want to go there?
02:47:12.459 --> 02:47:15.239
What do you want to do there? I said, I want
02:47:15.239 --> 02:47:18.719
to be there. I said, just to give some of these
02:47:18.719 --> 02:47:22.620
little four and five year old kids an opportunity
02:47:22.620 --> 02:47:27.899
just to shake hands with someone that has been
02:47:27.899 --> 02:47:33.500
in the fight that I have been in too. It's good,
02:47:33.680 --> 02:47:36.680
and as old as I am, I'm a grandfather to a lot
02:47:36.680 --> 02:47:41.059
of them, but I'm not. There is a man that I bum
02:47:41.059 --> 02:47:47.819
around with on these different occasions in Stockton.
02:47:49.180 --> 02:47:52.540
He was on Iwo Jima. He was wounded the same day
02:47:52.540 --> 02:47:56.680
that I was. He says he is, at least, on March
02:47:56.680 --> 02:48:05.520
the 3rd, 1945. And he's 106. Wow. That's 10 years
02:48:05.520 --> 02:48:09.139
older than I am. Sort of the whippersnapper to
02:48:09.139 --> 02:48:14.579
him. Yeah, that's an old man. He calls me kid.
02:48:15.739 --> 02:48:18.739
My grandmother's 104. She's still going strong.
02:48:19.239 --> 02:48:25.879
Yeah, see? And it's nice to see. And I see some
02:48:25.879 --> 02:48:30.059
of the kids when they tell him he's 106. Their
02:48:30.059 --> 02:48:33.319
eyes are big as saucers. You can see that he's
02:48:33.319 --> 02:48:42.360
over 100 years old. And he was in China. He was
02:48:42.360 --> 02:48:46.100
one of the old China Marines. And he went in,
02:48:46.100 --> 02:48:50.319
I think he stayed in 1934 or something like that.
02:48:51.079 --> 02:48:59.190
But he's in a home in Stockton. Major William.
02:49:00.030 --> 02:49:08.090
Oh, crap. Got it. White. Major William White.
02:49:08.329 --> 02:49:15.430
White. Major William White on it. And it's 106
02:49:15.430 --> 02:49:21.170
on July the 21st. Incredible. That was 96 on
02:49:21.170 --> 02:49:27.030
July the 5th. Not December like the record. The
02:49:27.030 --> 02:49:33.129
old birth certificate. Well, Frank, I just want
02:49:33.129 --> 02:49:35.229
to say thank you. Like I said before, I mean,
02:49:35.250 --> 02:49:41.030
to hear the whole story, to give the background
02:49:41.030 --> 02:49:44.229
to you even joining up, and it definitely gives
02:49:44.229 --> 02:49:46.950
us a perspective versus maybe some of the mentalities
02:49:46.950 --> 02:49:50.250
these days. You know, the physical side, the
02:49:50.250 --> 02:49:53.129
mental side, the transition out. It's been an
02:49:53.129 --> 02:49:55.750
incredible conversation. You did write a book.
02:49:56.829 --> 02:50:04.909
I wrote a book last year, I think it was 2019,
02:50:05.270 --> 02:50:09.510
and it's called Battles in the Pacific, World
02:50:09.510 --> 02:50:18.530
War II. And you can get them at Amazon. And they
02:50:18.530 --> 02:50:23.149
print them up, and they have real good rapport
02:50:23.149 --> 02:50:33.489
on that. A story about what I did in those times.
02:50:33.909 --> 02:50:36.889
It has a little romance in it because that's
02:50:36.889 --> 02:50:41.649
when I met my wife. I was married for 74 years.
02:50:42.489 --> 02:50:45.370
And that was her first date and my first date.
02:50:45.930 --> 02:50:54.409
Amazing. It lasted a long time. And I'd like
02:50:54.409 --> 02:50:57.600
more people to buy it. ready to kind of get an
02:50:57.600 --> 02:51:03.940
idea and have it in their book reading if they
02:51:03.940 --> 02:51:08.340
possibly can. And it also details a lot of the
02:51:08.340 --> 02:51:15.260
stories that I just detailed. Absolutely. It's
02:51:15.260 --> 02:51:17.780
good. Yeah, well, so just for everyone listening,
02:51:17.860 --> 02:51:20.940
I read it. I got it on the Kindle, which is the
02:51:20.940 --> 02:51:22.700
one you get on the computer just because of time.
02:51:22.780 --> 02:51:24.040
I think it was going to take a couple of weeks
02:51:24.040 --> 02:51:26.790
to ship. But I mean, it is how often do you get
02:51:26.790 --> 02:51:29.389
to read, you know, a story like that? And there's
02:51:29.389 --> 02:51:31.370
a lot of detail in some of the conflicts and
02:51:31.370 --> 02:51:34.590
battles that you had and the wounds and that
02:51:34.590 --> 02:51:36.430
we didn't even really get to touch on, which
02:51:36.430 --> 02:51:38.030
is good. And I don't want to tell the whole book
02:51:38.030 --> 02:51:40.729
on this conversation either. So I highly recommend
02:51:40.729 --> 02:51:43.389
it. And again, if we want to support. someone
02:51:43.389 --> 02:51:45.290
from that generation we want to keep the story
02:51:45.290 --> 02:51:48.010
alive then i hope people listening will go online
02:51:48.010 --> 02:51:50.750
and get it so it was uh battles in the pacific
02:51:50.750 --> 02:51:54.469
world war ii my personal war causing ptsd so
02:51:54.469 --> 02:51:56.389
everyone looking for the what they call i think
02:51:56.389 --> 02:51:59.209
the subtitle whatever it is my name right beside
02:51:59.209 --> 02:52:02.469
because there's several books on the market that
02:52:02.469 --> 02:52:06.309
go by the name of world war ii yes and in the
02:52:06.309 --> 02:52:09.809
pacific and there's a battle in the pacific world
02:52:09.809 --> 02:52:14.549
war ii frank wright And that goes right to it.
02:52:15.809 --> 02:52:18.450
Absolutely. Well, I just want to say again, thank
02:52:18.450 --> 02:52:20.649
you. Thank you so much for coming on today. We've
02:52:20.649 --> 02:52:23.690
been talking for almost three and a half hours
02:52:23.690 --> 02:52:27.389
now. So I know you told Chris you weren't sure
02:52:27.389 --> 02:52:28.809
if you're going to be able to fill 90 minutes.
02:52:30.370 --> 02:52:33.290
He says, you know, it might be an hour. It might
02:52:33.290 --> 02:52:36.989
be. No, sometimes it'll go two hours. I said,
02:52:36.989 --> 02:52:41.399
I don't remember. Well, you smashed it. I don't
02:52:41.399 --> 02:52:46.520
think I can do that. Thank you, Chris. You're
02:52:46.520 --> 02:52:49.059
welcome. You're welcome. My honor. My honor to
02:52:49.059 --> 02:52:55.780
listen to your story. It was nice to get it out.
02:52:56.819 --> 02:53:03.620
That's why. I have to get it out. And this is
02:53:03.620 --> 02:53:07.959
my avenue to get it out. Thank you very much,
02:53:07.959 --> 02:53:10.639
Chris and Jamie. Thank you very much.
00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:02.839
This episode is sponsored by 5 .11, a company
00:00:02.839 --> 00:00:05.059
that I've used for well over a decade and continue
00:00:05.059 --> 00:00:08.539
to use to this day. And 5 .11 is offering you
00:00:08.539 --> 00:00:10.640
guys, the audience of the Behind the Shield podcast,
00:00:10.960 --> 00:00:13.759
a discount on every purchase you make with them.
00:00:14.179 --> 00:00:16.280
Before we get to that code, I want to highlight
00:00:16.280 --> 00:00:18.199
a couple of products that again I personally
00:00:18.199 --> 00:00:22.120
use today. One of the most impressive products
00:00:22.120 --> 00:00:25.559
they just released is their Rush Backpack 2 .0.
00:00:25.980 --> 00:00:27.719
Now, for many of you, whether you're going to
00:00:27.719 --> 00:00:29.339
the fire station, the police station, whether
00:00:29.339 --> 00:00:31.320
you're traveling with your family, whether you're
00:00:31.320 --> 00:00:34.159
taking training courses, we have to fly, we have
00:00:34.159 --> 00:00:36.700
to drive, we have to take trains. And I have
00:00:36.700 --> 00:00:40.280
to say, I own multiple backpacks, many of 5 .11's
00:00:40.280 --> 00:00:42.520
different ones, but as far as a day pack, this
00:00:42.520 --> 00:00:45.259
one was the most impressive. There are so many
00:00:45.259 --> 00:00:47.520
different compartments. The way it sits on your
00:00:47.520 --> 00:00:49.920
back is incredibly comfortable. If you are a
00:00:49.920 --> 00:00:52.399
concealed carry person, there's also a spot for
00:00:52.399 --> 00:00:55.380
a weapon. So they've thought of multiple, multiple
00:00:55.380 --> 00:00:57.520
things that a man or woman would have to do on
00:00:57.520 --> 00:01:00.759
a daily basis. That is in addition to all of
00:01:00.759 --> 00:01:03.420
the products that I talk about a lot. Their uniforms
00:01:03.420 --> 00:01:07.319
fit for men or fit for women in the first responder
00:01:07.319 --> 00:01:09.989
professions. The footwear that they offer, whether
00:01:09.989 --> 00:01:12.390
it's the Norris sneaker or the Atlas system that
00:01:12.390 --> 00:01:15.049
is designed for foot health and therefore knees
00:01:15.049 --> 00:01:18.370
and back and hips and shoulders and neck. As
00:01:18.370 --> 00:01:20.209
a civilian, I live in a lot of their clothes
00:01:20.209 --> 00:01:22.209
as well. Their jeans stretch. You can actually
00:01:22.209 --> 00:01:24.689
squat down in them. We live in Florida here,
00:01:24.769 --> 00:01:26.750
so I wear a lot of their shorts, which again,
00:01:26.849 --> 00:01:28.730
very, very lightweight material. You can get
00:01:28.730 --> 00:01:31.510
it wet and it will dry almost immediately. And
00:01:31.510 --> 00:01:33.310
then moving to the fitness and tactical space,
00:01:33.609 --> 00:01:36.370
I used to have just a regular weight vest. Recently,
00:01:36.370 --> 00:01:38.849
I switched to a 5 .11 vest and actually bought
00:01:38.849 --> 00:01:41.569
ballistic plates as well. My thinking was simply,
00:01:41.629 --> 00:01:43.450
if I'm going to have a vest, why not have one
00:01:43.450 --> 00:01:45.730
that protects me as well? And that Tac vest is
00:01:45.730 --> 00:01:47.849
trusted by law enforcement all around the country.
00:01:48.370 --> 00:01:50.150
So I mentioned they were going to offer you a
00:01:50.150 --> 00:01:53.189
discount code. So if you go to 5 .11tactical
00:01:53.189 --> 00:01:56.769
.com and enter the code SHIELD15, S -H -I -E
00:01:56.769 --> 00:02:00.849
-L -D -1 -5, you'll get 15 % off, not just that
00:02:00.849 --> 00:02:02.969
one purchase, but every time you visit their
00:02:02.969 --> 00:02:05.519
store. And if you want to learn more about 5
00:02:05.519 --> 00:02:08.039
.11, their mission, their products, then listen
00:02:08.039 --> 00:02:11.159
to episode 338 of the Behind the Shield podcast
00:02:11.159 --> 00:02:15.219
with the CEO and founder, Francisco Morales.
00:02:16.419 --> 00:02:19.900
Welcome to episode 561 of Behind the Shield podcast.
00:02:20.099 --> 00:02:22.000
As always, my name is James Geering, and this
00:02:22.000 --> 00:02:24.680
week it is my absolute honor to welcome on the
00:02:24.680 --> 00:02:28.699
show, Frank Wright. Now, it's not often that
00:02:28.699 --> 00:02:30.719
you get to speak to a veteran from the World
00:02:30.719 --> 00:02:33.439
War II era, but it's even less likely you'll
00:02:33.439 --> 00:02:35.479
get to speak to one of the Marines that stood
00:02:35.479 --> 00:02:38.960
on Iwo Jima. So Frank's story is incredible,
00:02:39.120 --> 00:02:42.120
from his hilarious enlistment story where he
00:02:42.120 --> 00:02:45.800
wasn't heavy enough to make the grade, so he
00:02:45.800 --> 00:02:48.620
improvised, through to some of his incredible
00:02:48.620 --> 00:02:51.680
deployments, having to fight with bayonets and
00:02:51.680 --> 00:02:55.139
knives in Guam, being shot multiple times on
00:02:55.139 --> 00:02:58.830
Iwo Jima. his incredible mental health story,
00:02:58.969 --> 00:03:02.849
and so much more. So I urge you to listen from
00:03:02.849 --> 00:03:06.629
beginning to end to hear the perspective of a
00:03:06.629 --> 00:03:10.349
true warrior of World War II. Before we get to
00:03:10.349 --> 00:03:12.629
this incredible conversation, as I say every
00:03:12.629 --> 00:03:14.689
week, please just take a moment, go to whichever
00:03:14.689 --> 00:03:17.469
app you listen to this on, subscribe to the show.
00:03:17.900 --> 00:03:20.719
Leave feedback and leave a rating. Each five
00:03:20.719 --> 00:03:23.360
-star rating truly does elevate this podcast,
00:03:23.639 --> 00:03:26.439
making it easier for others to find. And this
00:03:26.439 --> 00:03:31.939
is a free library of 561 episodes now. So all
00:03:31.939 --> 00:03:34.479
I ask in return is that you help share these
00:03:34.479 --> 00:03:37.360
incredible men and women's stories so I can get
00:03:37.360 --> 00:03:39.919
them to every single person who needs to hear
00:03:39.919 --> 00:03:43.500
them. So with that being said, I introduce to
00:03:43.500 --> 00:04:06.550
you Frank Wright. Enjoy. So, Frank, I just want
00:04:06.550 --> 00:04:08.849
to start by saying thank you so much for coming
00:04:08.849 --> 00:04:13.750
on the Behind the Shield podcast today. Thank
00:04:13.750 --> 00:04:17.089
you. My pleasure to do this. Give me a little
00:04:17.089 --> 00:04:21.889
bit more exposure to get rid of my not get rid
00:04:21.889 --> 00:04:26.350
to sell my book. Absolutely. Well, there's so
00:04:26.350 --> 00:04:29.779
much I want to ask you about because. Being a
00:04:29.779 --> 00:04:32.259
soldier from the World War II generation and
00:04:32.259 --> 00:04:36.100
reading your book, I see so many parallels with
00:04:36.100 --> 00:04:39.500
the issues that modern -day soldiers, firefighters,
00:04:39.959 --> 00:04:46.120
police officers deal with in 2022. So for everyone
00:04:46.120 --> 00:04:49.220
listening, where are we finding you geographically
00:04:49.220 --> 00:04:59.100
today? I'm in Lunar, California. And do you want
00:04:59.100 --> 00:05:02.279
further information on that? Just whatever you'd
00:05:02.279 --> 00:05:03.959
like to say. I'll start with the beginning in
00:05:03.959 --> 00:05:08.800
the moment. About 35 miles south of Sacramento.
00:05:09.660 --> 00:05:16.279
And it's just parallel to about San Francisco.
00:05:17.560 --> 00:05:24.300
And it's a small town. I don't know exactly what
00:05:24.300 --> 00:05:30.540
the... population is but it's a very nice town
00:05:30.540 --> 00:05:36.240
and it's what brought me here in this particular
00:05:36.240 --> 00:05:42.180
area was nearly all of the houses in the area
00:05:42.180 --> 00:05:47.620
had such pretty lawns and real green and very
00:05:47.620 --> 00:05:53.110
manicured so we like that so We moved up from
00:05:53.110 --> 00:05:59.269
Sacramento, from Stockton, to get into the Lodi
00:05:59.269 --> 00:06:05.170
area, and then that gave us a start on a long
00:06:05.170 --> 00:06:10.470
term. I have lived in Lodi off and on for about
00:06:10.470 --> 00:06:20.779
all 50, 60 years. So it's been a long... for
00:06:20.779 --> 00:06:24.240
me to be in one spot like this because I was
00:06:24.240 --> 00:06:29.259
used to moving around for a while with my wife
00:06:29.259 --> 00:06:34.220
about every five years. And then finally we moved
00:06:34.220 --> 00:06:43.279
into the California area and we just stayed down
00:06:43.279 --> 00:06:46.040
here. It was just too wet for me up in Oregon.
00:06:46.319 --> 00:06:51.480
Go ahead. No, so I would love to start at the
00:06:51.480 --> 00:06:53.319
very beginning because you talked about traveling.
00:06:53.360 --> 00:06:55.160
Obviously, you've literally traveled around the
00:06:55.160 --> 00:06:58.459
world through the military and then after. So
00:06:58.459 --> 00:07:01.139
tell me where you were born and then tell me
00:07:01.139 --> 00:07:03.819
about your family, what your mom and dad did
00:07:03.819 --> 00:07:07.100
and how many siblings you had. Well, I was born
00:07:07.100 --> 00:07:18.009
in 1925. two other brothers two brothers with
00:07:18.009 --> 00:07:20.889
me there were three and three boys in our family
00:07:20.889 --> 00:07:28.209
my dad was uh on worked on wpa he did two jobs
00:07:28.209 --> 00:07:33.089
uh working uh with the post office and working
00:07:33.089 --> 00:07:38.870
on the state capitol as a tool checker so uh
00:07:38.870 --> 00:07:45.209
and my mother worked for gus blasses I think
00:07:45.209 --> 00:07:50.490
it was called Gus Blass Department Store. And
00:07:50.490 --> 00:08:00.649
I was a school kid. And we had no transportation.
00:08:01.050 --> 00:08:06.750
We didn't have any automobiles until Arkansas
00:08:06.750 --> 00:08:12.980
gave the first World War veterans a bonus. And
00:08:12.980 --> 00:08:18.519
then he purchased a car at that time with that
00:08:18.519 --> 00:08:26.060
bonus that the state of Arkansas gave all the
00:08:26.060 --> 00:08:31.060
veterans on it, which was many years ago. I don't
00:08:31.060 --> 00:08:36.320
know exactly when it was, but I know I was probably
00:08:36.320 --> 00:08:42.500
four years old at that time. And I went to school
00:08:42.500 --> 00:08:49.419
at Little Rock Eastside Junior High School. No,
00:08:49.440 --> 00:08:55.179
first I went to grade school at Peabody. And
00:08:55.179 --> 00:09:00.460
then I went from there after sixth grade, went
00:09:00.460 --> 00:09:05.000
to Eastside Junior High. And then from there
00:09:05.000 --> 00:09:13.009
I went to Little Rock Senior High. and uh that
00:09:13.009 --> 00:09:18.450
was the came became a little famous when uh the
00:09:18.450 --> 00:09:23.169
uh little rock senior high became uh integrated
00:09:23.169 --> 00:09:30.429
with the uh african americans there and uh uh
00:09:30.429 --> 00:09:35.809
but they were they were not uh school was not
00:09:35.809 --> 00:09:38.029
integrated at the time that i was going there
00:09:39.600 --> 00:09:45.419
But I stayed in high school until I was in the
00:09:45.419 --> 00:09:52.159
10th grade, I think it was. And I was 16. And
00:09:52.159 --> 00:09:58.519
World War III, World War II, we're not there
00:09:58.519 --> 00:10:07.480
yet. I hope not. World War II, that was in 1941.
00:10:08.830 --> 00:10:14.929
I was in the 11th grade at that time. I had not
00:10:14.929 --> 00:10:19.409
graduated high school from senior high on it.
00:10:19.730 --> 00:10:25.529
Actually, I was making airplanes, model airplanes
00:10:25.529 --> 00:10:31.029
for a five and dime store in Little Rock. And
00:10:31.029 --> 00:10:35.409
I'd make an airplane. They'd give me the airplane
00:10:35.409 --> 00:10:39.289
to... I would make the airplane, and then I would
00:10:39.289 --> 00:10:42.870
give it back to them, and they would give me
00:10:42.870 --> 00:10:46.730
one for making it. So that's how I got my stuff.
00:10:46.809 --> 00:10:51.490
I would work for it on it. And I was making airplanes
00:10:51.490 --> 00:10:59.149
at that time for the department store, and I
00:10:59.149 --> 00:11:07.169
heard the information on the radio. that Pearl
00:11:07.169 --> 00:11:11.490
Harbor had been bombed. And of course, I didn't
00:11:11.490 --> 00:11:13.970
know where Pearl Harbor was, but I knew that
00:11:13.970 --> 00:11:19.950
it was part of the United States. So I started
00:11:19.950 --> 00:11:25.289
getting the fever to join up with the service
00:11:25.289 --> 00:11:30.049
on it so I could get out of the area on it. And
00:11:30.049 --> 00:11:35.799
that's how... I started to get into the Marine
00:11:35.799 --> 00:11:41.840
Corps. So I went to the Navy and I was too light.
00:11:42.139 --> 00:11:47.000
I went to the Marines and I was too light and
00:11:47.000 --> 00:11:52.559
wasn't old enough. So I was supposed to be 17
00:11:52.559 --> 00:11:57.039
at that time, but I couldn't make the grade.
00:11:57.500 --> 00:12:03.610
But my mother's... sister was a notary public
00:12:03.610 --> 00:12:08.029
and she knew how to get around that and she made
00:12:08.029 --> 00:12:13.889
out a delayed birth certificate and gave me a
00:12:13.889 --> 00:12:20.009
different birth date. So I joined the Marine
00:12:20.009 --> 00:12:27.029
Corps using my younger brother's birth date and
00:12:27.029 --> 00:12:35.340
then that made me just Verity 17. So I took his
00:12:35.340 --> 00:12:40.820
birthday all through the Marine Corps until I
00:12:40.820 --> 00:12:46.179
got filed up for Social Security. And when I
00:12:46.179 --> 00:12:49.039
became 65 and signed up for Social Security,
00:12:49.259 --> 00:12:53.840
they asked me when I was born. And so I said,
00:12:54.179 --> 00:12:59.940
well, I gave him my real birth date. And he said,
00:13:00.019 --> 00:13:02.220
well, the records show that you were born in
00:13:02.220 --> 00:13:06.100
December, not July. I said, well, I lied about
00:13:06.100 --> 00:13:09.220
my age. So he said, well, that's all right. He
00:13:09.220 --> 00:13:11.559
says, I'll just change it here. He says, a lot
00:13:11.559 --> 00:13:16.379
of servicemen did that. And I had been carrying
00:13:16.379 --> 00:13:20.860
my brother's birth date for many years until,
00:13:20.919 --> 00:13:25.580
I have to say, until I got it filed up and had
00:13:25.580 --> 00:13:31.919
them correct it. Social Security. I went from
00:13:31.919 --> 00:13:38.139
there. I went for seven other people, kids that
00:13:38.139 --> 00:13:44.820
were just 17. And we took the oath with the Marine
00:13:44.820 --> 00:13:54.620
Corps in January the 21st, 1942, which was just
00:13:54.620 --> 00:13:59.240
several, about three or four weeks. after Pearl
00:13:59.240 --> 00:14:03.580
Harbor. Well, you talked about being too light,
00:14:03.659 --> 00:14:06.340
just to interject for a moment. When you were
00:14:06.340 --> 00:14:09.179
referring to that, your physical weight was below
00:14:09.179 --> 00:14:11.539
the standard that they want. So tell me the story
00:14:11.539 --> 00:14:13.519
about how you overcame the weight challenge.
00:14:16.519 --> 00:14:21.720
Well, the first thing he did, he wanted to know
00:14:21.720 --> 00:14:25.059
if I was, how old I was, and I told him this
00:14:25.059 --> 00:14:29.840
was the recruit. recruiting sergeant and so i
00:14:29.840 --> 00:14:33.960
told him that uh i was 17 and he said well you
00:14:33.960 --> 00:14:37.740
don't look it he says but just get on the scales
00:14:37.740 --> 00:14:46.899
and so i was uh i uh i remember what the date
00:14:46.899 --> 00:14:50.460
the weight was supposed to be but i was about
00:14:50.460 --> 00:14:54.360
five pounds underneath the standard weight of
00:14:54.360 --> 00:15:01.840
going in And so I went home and started eating
00:15:01.840 --> 00:15:06.659
bananas. And finally, I just took some bananas
00:15:06.659 --> 00:15:09.200
and stuffed them in my back pocket, my front
00:15:09.200 --> 00:15:13.860
pocket, all over. And then I made the grade by
00:15:13.860 --> 00:15:19.879
putting five pounds of bananas on mine. I had
00:15:19.879 --> 00:15:28.220
some in my socks. Yeah. So I really started my
00:15:28.220 --> 00:15:36.340
career by lying. I did too. And that was the
00:15:36.340 --> 00:15:40.340
first lie that I had ever made. It's interesting
00:15:40.340 --> 00:15:42.919
because when I went to become a firefighter,
00:15:42.919 --> 00:15:47.559
we had to declare the things that we'd done in
00:15:47.559 --> 00:15:52.559
the past that may be deemed unethical, whatever
00:15:52.559 --> 00:15:56.100
it is. thinking that honesty was what they were
00:15:56.100 --> 00:15:58.179
looking for i said well a long time ago i did
00:15:58.179 --> 00:16:01.100
this and you know and i was immediately disqualified
00:16:01.100 --> 00:16:04.279
so i learned in the fire service that to become
00:16:04.279 --> 00:16:06.379
a firefighter you didn't talk about any of the
00:16:06.379 --> 00:16:08.519
bad stuff you ever did you basically lied about
00:16:08.519 --> 00:16:11.100
it pretended you were a choir boy and i got the
00:16:11.100 --> 00:16:14.019
job first time i started lying so i can totally
00:16:14.019 --> 00:16:19.759
understand Well, I'll tell you a little bit about
00:16:19.759 --> 00:16:22.679
that. Anyway, a friend of mine did about the
00:16:22.679 --> 00:16:27.220
same thing, except he was over in Denmark and
00:16:27.220 --> 00:16:30.120
he had not integrated over to the United States
00:16:30.120 --> 00:16:38.120
yet. But there was two lines in Denmark that
00:16:38.120 --> 00:16:42.799
was going to be, one line was going to the gas
00:16:42.799 --> 00:16:48.740
chambers and the other line. was going into the
00:16:48.740 --> 00:16:55.759
concentration camp in another area. And the lines
00:16:55.759 --> 00:16:59.620
were only about seven feet apart. And he wanted
00:16:59.620 --> 00:17:03.000
to go into the other one because he says, I heard
00:17:03.000 --> 00:17:07.160
that this line that we're in is going to the
00:17:07.160 --> 00:17:15.269
gas chambers. So he talked to his friend. to
00:17:15.269 --> 00:17:17.470
change the lines and he says, no, I don't want
00:17:17.470 --> 00:17:21.930
to. They might shoot me if I try to. He said,
00:17:21.950 --> 00:17:23.990
well, I'm going to change them. He changed over
00:17:23.990 --> 00:17:27.029
to the one that was going to concentration camp
00:17:27.029 --> 00:17:31.589
and his friend went to the gas chambers. When
00:17:31.589 --> 00:17:35.690
he got over there into the line, they asked him,
00:17:35.690 --> 00:17:41.349
what kind of an occupation did you have and are
00:17:41.349 --> 00:17:46.279
you... have an occupation that's worthy of you
00:17:46.279 --> 00:17:49.319
to come to the United States? And he says, yes.
00:17:49.500 --> 00:17:53.539
He says, I was a qualified bridge builder. They
00:17:53.539 --> 00:17:56.740
wanted to have a lot of bridges made and stuff
00:17:56.740 --> 00:17:59.380
like that, you know, for the military. And he
00:17:59.380 --> 00:18:04.259
says, and I was the bridge builder for the, and
00:18:04.259 --> 00:18:08.960
a superintendent on that. So, what's your degree?
00:18:09.200 --> 00:18:15.069
And he told him some fictitious degree he got
00:18:15.069 --> 00:18:19.910
in by saying that and he that he was a bridge
00:18:19.910 --> 00:18:22.269
builder and he came to the united states and
00:18:22.269 --> 00:18:25.750
he said that's what he was and he got a job in
00:18:25.750 --> 00:18:31.190
california to building bridges and he didn't
00:18:31.190 --> 00:18:34.029
he had never built one at all but that was his
00:18:34.029 --> 00:18:39.740
qualification so we went to uh this and start
00:18:39.740 --> 00:18:42.660
building bridges on it. So I don't know what,
00:18:42.740 --> 00:18:47.440
but he lied about coming in from his too. It's
00:18:47.440 --> 00:18:53.259
not mine, but that's his story. And he still,
00:18:53.500 --> 00:18:59.299
he was until about four or five years ago on,
00:18:59.319 --> 00:19:04.960
and he was still doing bridges. I built a lot
00:19:04.960 --> 00:19:08.160
of bridges. Yeah, I'd be scared of driving that
00:19:08.160 --> 00:19:09.640
town if you didn't know how to build them, though.
00:19:11.119 --> 00:19:15.900
Yeah. A lot of people did that. A lot of guys
00:19:15.900 --> 00:19:20.339
came into the service and just did everything
00:19:20.339 --> 00:19:23.319
they could to get in to pass the examination.
00:19:23.339 --> 00:19:27.839
Of course, most of them were out of jobs, didn't
00:19:27.839 --> 00:19:35.170
have an education. And they needed people in
00:19:35.170 --> 00:19:40.829
the service. And so they took anybody in at that
00:19:40.829 --> 00:19:43.509
time. If you could breathe, they said, come in.
00:19:45.009 --> 00:19:46.990
Absolutely. Well, I want to get to your journey
00:19:46.990 --> 00:19:48.450
through the training because obviously you ended
00:19:48.450 --> 00:19:52.470
up in a very unique group of Marines in the end.
00:19:52.589 --> 00:19:54.990
Before we do, though, you mentioned something
00:19:54.990 --> 00:19:57.349
that was interesting to me, that your dad was
00:19:57.349 --> 00:20:01.039
a World War I veteran. You ended up seeing combat.
00:20:01.099 --> 00:20:03.519
You ended up struggling with the physical and
00:20:03.519 --> 00:20:06.460
mental health elements of that. Did you ever
00:20:06.460 --> 00:20:09.339
see any of that exhibited by your father when
00:20:09.339 --> 00:20:13.859
you were young? My dad was over in France. He
00:20:13.859 --> 00:20:18.160
was a bugler. He played the bugle. And at that
00:20:18.160 --> 00:20:24.000
time, that's where most of the military reacted.
00:20:24.759 --> 00:20:26.619
got up with the bugle, and they went to bed with
00:20:26.619 --> 00:20:29.500
the bugle. They got paid by the bugle. They went
00:20:29.500 --> 00:20:32.660
to eat by the bugle. They went to attack by the
00:20:32.660 --> 00:20:38.059
bugle. So everything was transferred. Now, of
00:20:38.059 --> 00:20:42.000
course, it's a lot different. But that was his
00:20:42.000 --> 00:20:46.400
thing, and I have plenty of pictures of him at
00:20:46.400 --> 00:20:53.660
that time. His brother was in World War I as
00:20:53.660 --> 00:20:59.359
well. and he was a well -educated uh man so uh
00:20:59.359 --> 00:21:03.660
he had uh uh some kind of i don't never did know
00:21:03.660 --> 00:21:07.720
what my uncle that would be my uncle i what he
00:21:07.720 --> 00:21:13.400
did on him so but uh they lived in uh in arkansas
00:21:13.400 --> 00:21:19.180
that's where i was born in arkansas too so he
00:21:19.180 --> 00:21:22.819
saw action but i don't know i don't know what
00:21:22.819 --> 00:21:27.079
uh what part of the country he was in on it and
00:21:27.079 --> 00:21:30.799
of course i'm i was in of course europe area
00:21:30.799 --> 00:21:35.000
and i i never did know too much about the war
00:21:35.000 --> 00:21:38.599
in europe because it was all everything was crammed
00:21:38.599 --> 00:21:43.519
in my uh vocabulary was uh the south pacific
00:21:43.519 --> 00:21:49.180
and running in that so but uh he understood what
00:21:49.180 --> 00:21:59.119
the ptsd But at the time, it was called combat
00:21:59.119 --> 00:22:06.240
fatigue. They didn't pick up the term PTSD until
00:22:06.240 --> 00:22:11.359
probably in the 50s, I would imagine. But still,
00:22:11.519 --> 00:22:17.480
you're still combat fatigue. And still use that
00:22:17.480 --> 00:22:23.099
word at that time. But it was... I think there
00:22:23.099 --> 00:22:32.519
was a story in Patton's army about a kid that
00:22:32.519 --> 00:22:35.359
couldn't take it any longer. Patton asked him
00:22:35.359 --> 00:22:40.700
what was wrong with him. He said that he had
00:22:40.700 --> 00:22:45.599
combat fatigue, and so he slapped him. In fact,
00:22:45.660 --> 00:22:50.180
that was one of his main things when they did
00:22:50.180 --> 00:22:55.579
a live. story on Patton about him hitting this
00:22:55.579 --> 00:23:00.920
kid that had combat fatigue because he said nobody
00:23:00.920 --> 00:23:06.440
has combat fatigue in my army so but they were
00:23:06.440 --> 00:23:09.359
still using it at that time overseas as well.
00:23:10.400 --> 00:23:12.500
Yeah, well, it's been amazing when you look back,
00:23:12.539 --> 00:23:14.740
you've got so many terms, you know, soldier's
00:23:14.740 --> 00:23:18.119
heart, shell shock, thousand yard stare. I mean,
00:23:18.160 --> 00:23:22.279
this same symptom has existed for hundreds of
00:23:22.279 --> 00:23:26.079
years, just the name changed. Yeah, that's true.
00:23:27.900 --> 00:23:32.640
And it could, I can see it. And it did, it happened
00:23:32.640 --> 00:23:40.920
to me. And they did not diagnose it. at first,
00:23:40.960 --> 00:23:47.920
after I got out. There's a big story in my book
00:23:47.920 --> 00:23:53.759
in regards to when I came back from Iwo Jima.
00:23:54.000 --> 00:23:58.900
They diagnosed me at that time. I was shot all
00:23:58.900 --> 00:24:04.000
through my chest and my arm and was in surgery.
00:24:07.579 --> 00:24:11.420
got in an altercation with the surgeon because
00:24:11.420 --> 00:24:17.720
they were going to cut my arm off. So I slugged
00:24:17.720 --> 00:24:23.160
him and knocked him off of his surgical tray
00:24:23.160 --> 00:24:26.839
off and everything. And he got mad at me. So
00:24:26.839 --> 00:24:32.519
he diagnosed me as combat fatigue. Then he let
00:24:32.519 --> 00:24:39.039
me go. And when I got... Got into San Diego,
00:24:39.099 --> 00:24:41.940
I think, to hospital. They still had me down
00:24:41.940 --> 00:24:45.140
as combat fatigue and put me in the nut ward.
00:24:46.000 --> 00:24:50.099
And they didn't take care of my wounds properly.
00:24:50.380 --> 00:24:54.299
And I had to find someone to change my bandages.
00:24:54.779 --> 00:24:59.240
And there's quite a story in my book on that.
00:25:00.079 --> 00:25:06.559
But I was really worried at the time. I figured
00:25:06.559 --> 00:25:13.319
that might help, I mean, hurt me in getting a
00:25:13.319 --> 00:25:19.519
Purple Heart on it. If they saw my record, it
00:25:19.519 --> 00:25:22.920
said Combat Fatigue. I had already been wounded
00:25:22.920 --> 00:25:27.519
once someplace else, so two different areas.
00:25:29.339 --> 00:25:33.700
Anyway, read my book. You'll get the big story.
00:25:34.200 --> 00:25:36.400
Yeah, no, there's this, you know, so much description
00:25:36.400 --> 00:25:39.519
of so many of the battles that you were in. So
00:25:39.519 --> 00:25:41.359
I want to get to that journey now, if that's
00:25:41.359 --> 00:25:45.599
okay. So talk to me. You are a very small framed,
00:25:45.880 --> 00:25:50.380
brave 16 and a half year old boy who finds himself
00:25:50.380 --> 00:25:53.539
in the Marines. So walk me through the initial
00:25:53.539 --> 00:25:56.859
boot camp and then the, you know, the Raiders
00:25:56.859 --> 00:25:58.559
selection and then what that looked like for
00:25:58.559 --> 00:26:08.339
you. In January. 21st, 1942, on it. There's seven
00:26:08.339 --> 00:26:16.819
Arkansas boys that had taken the oath, and we
00:26:16.819 --> 00:26:21.319
were put on a train to go to boot camp. Boot
00:26:21.319 --> 00:26:27.660
camp was in San Diego, Marine Corps Recruit Depot
00:26:27.660 --> 00:26:36.059
on it. And when we got there, we had three Marines
00:26:36.059 --> 00:26:43.720
waiting for us at the station. They had already
00:26:43.720 --> 00:26:50.700
picked up some from other trains before from
00:26:50.700 --> 00:26:55.339
other states. And they were waiting for us. And
00:26:55.339 --> 00:27:01.700
as I said, when I got there on it, I was... One
00:27:01.700 --> 00:27:10.279
of the kids was the carrier or the transfer papers.
00:27:11.259 --> 00:27:16.660
And he handed all the papers over to the sergeant.
00:27:16.660 --> 00:27:20.740
And I said that he was the devil. And he had
00:27:20.740 --> 00:27:27.140
two other helpers. We were now being called everything
00:27:27.140 --> 00:27:32.079
in the book besides. young men going into the
00:27:32.079 --> 00:27:38.859
service. But you cannot do that now in boot camp.
00:27:39.640 --> 00:27:45.839
But you're not supposed to do that now. Anyway,
00:27:46.000 --> 00:27:51.920
I was in a platoon. I had a sergeant or the head
00:27:51.920 --> 00:28:00.140
DI, drill instructor, and two corporals. that
00:28:00.140 --> 00:28:07.960
were assistant DIs. And I was in platoon 150,
00:28:08.460 --> 00:28:15.519
1501. I stayed in that for, I think it was eight
00:28:15.519 --> 00:28:19.539
weeks at that time, but I'm not positive it was
00:28:19.539 --> 00:28:29.099
eight or ten. But we got our... indoctrination,
00:28:29.480 --> 00:28:33.400
I guess, with what the Marine Corps was all about
00:28:33.400 --> 00:28:42.339
and how we reacted to those above us and with
00:28:42.339 --> 00:28:46.559
them. I think they call it God and country and
00:28:46.559 --> 00:28:53.079
family, Marine Corps. So, anyway, we went through
00:28:53.079 --> 00:28:59.009
that training and I remember one incident that
00:28:59.009 --> 00:29:02.390
I had. I was in what they called the feather
00:29:02.390 --> 00:29:07.490
merchant area, which was the smaller Marines
00:29:07.490 --> 00:29:11.269
and the company. Because there were some of them
00:29:11.269 --> 00:29:14.450
in there. There were six of them. Six foot seven.
00:29:14.910 --> 00:29:19.769
Another one was six three, I think it was. Something
00:29:19.769 --> 00:29:22.650
like that. They were in the head and we were
00:29:22.650 --> 00:29:26.380
in the back. We were the short guys. In fact,
00:29:26.380 --> 00:29:29.759
there was one kid who was a lot smaller than
00:29:29.759 --> 00:29:32.059
I was, and I don't know how he got in, but I
00:29:32.059 --> 00:29:36.640
think it was because he came in from Chicago.
00:29:37.180 --> 00:29:41.799
But they were counting the cadence, and we were
00:29:41.799 --> 00:29:47.519
marching along, and he and the sergeant said,
00:29:47.640 --> 00:29:55.240
platoons, ho! And so we stopped. And I was about...
00:29:56.000 --> 00:30:01.759
30 inches from my chest to the man in front of
00:30:01.759 --> 00:30:06.200
me. And the sergeant came over and he whacked
00:30:06.200 --> 00:30:09.140
me on top of the head with his swaggering stick.
00:30:09.740 --> 00:30:13.880
And he said, boy, what's your name? I told him,
00:30:13.900 --> 00:30:18.319
Private Wright, sir. He said, well, Wright, you're
00:30:18.319 --> 00:30:22.900
all wrong. He said, it's 40 inches back to breast.
00:30:25.420 --> 00:30:30.039
I got my first whack with the swagger stick for
00:30:30.039 --> 00:30:35.380
not being the proper number of inches between
00:30:35.380 --> 00:30:39.259
the two of us. But that was about it for me as
00:30:39.259 --> 00:30:47.819
I was a very good and studious marine and I learned
00:30:47.819 --> 00:30:57.799
a lot and I was I knew that what they were teaching
00:30:57.799 --> 00:31:01.619
us was something that was needed in their training.
00:31:02.319 --> 00:31:05.920
And I paid very good attention to it, and I carried
00:31:05.920 --> 00:31:11.200
that training clear through my Marine Corps tour
00:31:11.200 --> 00:31:16.680
for four years. And I thought, and I blessed
00:31:16.680 --> 00:31:23.109
those kids that were tolerated, tolerable. to
00:31:23.109 --> 00:31:26.329
me was that room and i went up through boot camp
00:31:26.329 --> 00:31:33.210
my first uh uh duty station was up in uh posted
00:31:33.210 --> 00:31:38.769
in uh in tongue point oregon which is uh right
00:31:38.769 --> 00:31:42.009
in astoria oregon which is the mouth of the columbia
00:31:42.009 --> 00:31:46.970
river i stayed there on guard duty we guarded
00:31:46.970 --> 00:31:51.230
the mountain that we were the large mountain
00:31:51.230 --> 00:31:57.119
i called it a mountain right there near the mouth
00:31:57.119 --> 00:32:03.059
of Columbia. Because they had ammunition stored
00:32:03.059 --> 00:32:12.660
in the area and we were guarding all day and
00:32:12.660 --> 00:32:18.680
all night. Then we got liberty every once in
00:32:18.680 --> 00:32:24.420
a while. I was transferred, a temporary transfer
00:32:24.420 --> 00:32:29.259
over to, well, that's another story. While we
00:32:29.259 --> 00:32:36.460
were stationed in Tongue Point, the Japanese
00:32:36.460 --> 00:32:42.500
had, they shelled the, I think it was the oil
00:32:42.500 --> 00:32:48.299
fields in Southern California. Then they finally
00:32:48.299 --> 00:32:54.140
went on up the, coastline on up to from California
00:32:54.140 --> 00:32:59.259
up to the Columbia River and there they were
00:32:59.259 --> 00:33:02.799
heavily heading for Portland and Seattle where
00:33:02.799 --> 00:33:07.160
they were building warships there's two submarines
00:33:07.160 --> 00:33:12.940
that came in the river by following the minefield
00:33:12.940 --> 00:33:17.619
the fishermen who were out fishing and then they
00:33:17.619 --> 00:33:20.490
come in whenever they come in and raise the They
00:33:20.490 --> 00:33:26.789
pulled the mines off the side to let the fishermen
00:33:26.789 --> 00:33:33.029
in and the Japanese came up right behind them
00:33:33.029 --> 00:33:37.589
and came in on the Columbia River. And they stayed
00:33:37.589 --> 00:33:41.970
there a couple of nights first and then they
00:33:41.970 --> 00:33:47.000
finally they shelled. The military base, which
00:33:47.000 --> 00:33:50.240
was the first time any foreign country had ever
00:33:50.240 --> 00:33:56.859
shelled a military base in World War I or II,
00:33:56.980 --> 00:33:59.720
or as that goes. Anyway, they came in and shelled
00:33:59.720 --> 00:34:04.980
Fort Stevens and didn't do any damage. They knocked
00:34:04.980 --> 00:34:08.840
down a couple of outdoor movies, I think it was,
00:34:08.880 --> 00:34:12.599
or something like that. But they didn't do very
00:34:12.599 --> 00:34:16.090
much harm. But they scared the hell out of everybody
00:34:16.090 --> 00:34:18.750
up there. They thought that was the first wave
00:34:18.750 --> 00:34:25.510
coming in and going in to Astoria. Anyway, we
00:34:25.510 --> 00:34:35.010
got the alert sign. We were on Liberty at the
00:34:35.010 --> 00:34:38.489
time that they shelled Fort Stevens, which is
00:34:38.489 --> 00:34:44.099
only about six or eight miles. from tongue point
00:34:44.099 --> 00:34:49.420
there and uh we were we tried to help them out
00:34:49.420 --> 00:34:54.019
but they i explained it pretty real uh more thorough
00:34:54.019 --> 00:35:00.400
than that in my book but uh then after they they
00:35:00.400 --> 00:35:04.500
were finally uh i think they were sunk it might
00:35:04.500 --> 00:35:07.480
have been off on oregon coast but i'm not positive
00:35:07.480 --> 00:35:13.099
anyway uh about two three weeks or so After that,
00:35:13.099 --> 00:35:18.840
they transferred me and I think it was six other
00:35:18.840 --> 00:35:25.420
Marines to Port Angeles, Washington, to teach
00:35:25.420 --> 00:35:32.119
them how to fire the 20 -millimeter ammunition,
00:35:32.420 --> 00:35:37.199
20 -millimeter, they called it machine gun at
00:35:37.199 --> 00:35:44.630
that time. We stayed up there for about two weeks,
00:35:44.889 --> 00:35:47.429
I guess, and then they shipped us back to Tung
00:35:47.429 --> 00:35:52.530
Point, and we were kind of like a special forces
00:35:52.530 --> 00:35:59.210
for planning to put the 20 millimeters all over
00:35:59.210 --> 00:36:03.650
the mountain up there, the ammunition hill. We
00:36:03.650 --> 00:36:10.110
stayed there, and I had a... accident falling
00:36:10.110 --> 00:36:13.809
off one of the cliffs up there and I was in the
00:36:13.809 --> 00:36:17.489
hospital for a little bit a couple of weeks or
00:36:17.489 --> 00:36:23.570
so and then about that time the Marine Corps
00:36:23.570 --> 00:36:31.969
was forming a new special forces called Raiders
00:36:31.969 --> 00:36:40.440
and they had some trouble getting enough people
00:36:40.440 --> 00:36:45.619
to volunteer for it. They sent individuals to
00:36:45.619 --> 00:36:49.960
different posts around the West Coast to join
00:36:49.960 --> 00:36:57.860
up. And they took the best that, in their mind,
00:36:58.039 --> 00:37:01.500
Marines that would qualify as a raider on it.
00:37:01.940 --> 00:37:09.699
And they had their eye on young kids, but they
00:37:09.699 --> 00:37:18.579
were fit and had a good record. And I had shot
00:37:18.579 --> 00:37:25.719
expert rifle and expert pistol. And I had machine
00:37:25.719 --> 00:37:34.280
gun and bayonet training. I had 20 millimeter
00:37:34.280 --> 00:37:41.429
training. And so I, and I shot, shot really a
00:37:41.429 --> 00:37:48.929
good, my score was 3 .55 out of four. So anyway,
00:37:49.110 --> 00:37:55.090
and so they say, well, you, you would qualify
00:37:55.090 --> 00:37:57.750
if you want to go. So I told him I wanted to
00:37:57.750 --> 00:38:01.670
go and I wanted to fight. So he said, well, you'll
00:38:01.670 --> 00:38:06.769
have to be down there within two weeks. two weeks
00:38:06.769 --> 00:38:11.210
to make my mind up and then go. One of the reasons
00:38:11.210 --> 00:38:15.429
was because I had had good training and had good
00:38:15.429 --> 00:38:21.110
reports from my boot camp and my training and
00:38:21.110 --> 00:38:27.949
my, not training, but on my good conduct with
00:38:27.949 --> 00:38:37.570
the Navy on Tungpun Island. Tongue Point Station
00:38:37.570 --> 00:38:44.070
there. But I was transferred from there to, I
00:38:44.070 --> 00:38:50.650
think it was Capitol June, which was in San Diego
00:38:50.650 --> 00:38:56.210
area on it. I think that's where we first started
00:38:56.210 --> 00:39:01.710
from. And then we went into Camp Pendleton area.
00:39:02.849 --> 00:39:09.739
And we were in Camp Pendleton on October 1943,
00:39:10.920 --> 00:39:20.239
and stayed in Camp Pendleton. And James Roosevelt,
00:39:20.539 --> 00:39:25.400
Jimmy Roosevelt, was Major at first, but he came
00:39:25.400 --> 00:39:33.119
in as Colonel, and he was President's son. I
00:39:33.119 --> 00:39:35.039
was president of the United States at the time.
00:39:35.719 --> 00:39:39.780
And he was my commanding officer. And he came
00:39:39.780 --> 00:39:47.559
in in November of 1943. And I actually was in
00:39:47.559 --> 00:39:52.880
Raiders about two weeks before he was signed
00:39:52.880 --> 00:39:57.320
up as our commanding officer. And with that,
00:39:57.460 --> 00:40:02.369
I was signed as a squad leader. from the Raiders.
00:40:02.730 --> 00:40:09.449
I stayed in there from October until February.
00:40:09.849 --> 00:40:14.130
I think it was in February. Anyway, we left for
00:40:14.130 --> 00:40:18.389
overseas on February the 11th. I think that was
00:40:18.389 --> 00:40:23.809
in 1943. The other was in 1942. Anyway, I can't
00:40:23.809 --> 00:40:28.429
remember right now. My memory is not very good.
00:40:29.579 --> 00:40:31.760
I think it's incredible considering. I really
00:40:31.760 --> 00:40:34.599
do. I want to get on one thing before we talk
00:40:34.599 --> 00:40:36.480
about your overseas deployments, which I thought
00:40:36.480 --> 00:40:41.000
was fascinating. Talk to me about the hand -to
00:40:41.000 --> 00:40:43.380
-hand combat training that you did, because seeing
00:40:43.380 --> 00:40:47.119
words like judo in the 1940s seems very progressive
00:40:47.119 --> 00:40:52.480
to me. Yes. We were taught in the Raiders, we
00:40:52.480 --> 00:40:58.619
were taught the art of self -defense. And the
00:40:58.619 --> 00:41:01.719
things that we were taught were to kill someone.
00:41:01.960 --> 00:41:07.840
It wasn't for anything. And if we were going
00:41:07.840 --> 00:41:11.659
to get in a fight with the enemy, we were not
00:41:11.659 --> 00:41:15.900
going to get in there just to wound him or to
00:41:15.900 --> 00:41:20.000
maim him. It was to kill him. And so everything
00:41:20.000 --> 00:41:23.920
we had terminated with the idea of killing someone.
00:41:24.539 --> 00:41:31.909
And we had... several trainees that had been
00:41:31.909 --> 00:41:39.570
over to England to, with the Special Forces over
00:41:39.570 --> 00:41:45.869
in England, be trained on the Art of Self -Defense
00:41:45.869 --> 00:41:49.510
over there, which was a little bit different
00:41:49.510 --> 00:41:52.630
than the Art of Defense in the United States.
00:41:53.409 --> 00:41:59.130
But anyway, those trainees happened to be in
00:41:59.130 --> 00:42:03.230
our 4th Raiders, which was nice. So we got a
00:42:03.230 --> 00:42:07.730
lot of personal stuff because they were so close
00:42:07.730 --> 00:42:14.849
to us in our own platoon. We fought the battle
00:42:14.849 --> 00:42:19.769
in San Clemente. I think we took and captured
00:42:19.769 --> 00:42:24.179
San Clemente many times on our training. at the
00:42:24.179 --> 00:42:27.019
Nautilus. We trained on the Nautilus and it was
00:42:27.019 --> 00:42:34.420
the submarine and the USS Waters and I think
00:42:34.420 --> 00:42:39.360
it was the USS Bent. Seemed like there was another
00:42:39.360 --> 00:42:43.099
submarine also down there, but I can't remember
00:42:43.099 --> 00:42:46.000
that name, but the Nautilus was what I'm on.
00:42:46.519 --> 00:42:50.559
But we'd come in to the coast with a submarine
00:42:50.559 --> 00:42:55.739
and we had to get up at nighttime and we'd surface
00:42:55.739 --> 00:43:00.119
and then pull out our rubber boats and get on
00:43:00.119 --> 00:43:04.500
the rubber boats and paddle into the beach and
00:43:04.500 --> 00:43:11.699
then we would deploy out from the beach in the
00:43:11.699 --> 00:43:13.980
different areas and finally we'd go into the
00:43:13.980 --> 00:43:17.460
ones that had beach houses down there and so
00:43:17.460 --> 00:43:24.219
we captured them. It was hard. It was really
00:43:24.219 --> 00:43:29.219
hard, hard training, very hard training. There's
00:43:29.219 --> 00:43:34.619
two or three steps above what the normal Marines
00:43:34.619 --> 00:43:38.699
were getting at the time. Yeah, I can only imagine
00:43:38.699 --> 00:43:40.400
as well. When we think of submarines, we think
00:43:40.400 --> 00:43:42.699
of them today, you know, with all the advanced
00:43:42.699 --> 00:43:46.139
equipment. But I've seen some of the World War
00:43:46.139 --> 00:43:49.889
II era submarines and they... Just to get in
00:43:49.889 --> 00:43:52.409
one of those and be under the water seems like
00:43:52.409 --> 00:43:57.989
it took an amazing amount of courage. Well, yeah.
00:43:58.969 --> 00:44:06.889
And it's very close quarters. I had one of my
00:44:06.889 --> 00:44:10.269
bunks had torpedoes right underneath where we
00:44:10.269 --> 00:44:17.050
were sleeping. And the sailors were very eager
00:44:17.050 --> 00:44:21.539
to teach. us marines different things about the
00:44:21.539 --> 00:44:25.519
torpedoes and one of them was the torpedo juice
00:44:25.519 --> 00:44:30.880
that they had on it that's 190 proof alcohol
00:44:30.880 --> 00:44:36.739
so they'd have a canteen full of that and then
00:44:36.739 --> 00:44:42.460
i wish he would rob from torpedoes around there
00:44:42.460 --> 00:44:48.599
and then they'd make us uh drink it if we wanted
00:44:48.599 --> 00:44:50.500
to go to chow or something like that. We had
00:44:50.500 --> 00:44:54.820
to take a taste of it or something. So, you don't
00:44:54.820 --> 00:44:57.860
need, you don't, you just don't take a swig of
00:44:57.860 --> 00:45:03.760
190 proof alcohol without it burning. So, but,
00:45:03.920 --> 00:45:08.679
it's a lot of, a lot of stuff goes on. People
00:45:08.679 --> 00:45:14.239
have, what is it, claustrophobia? Yes. Yes, sir.
00:45:14.360 --> 00:45:22.639
Yeah. And you can hear different sounds that
00:45:22.639 --> 00:45:25.519
you just don't hear all the time, but of course
00:45:25.519 --> 00:45:30.679
they do. The Navy does, but the Marines didn't.
00:45:33.159 --> 00:45:40.800
But the training is real hard. And of course
00:45:40.800 --> 00:45:46.460
they train now. The same thing, except they carry
00:45:46.460 --> 00:45:50.219
it a little bit further than that. It's a different
00:45:50.219 --> 00:45:54.719
type of train. The Special Forces now are well
00:45:54.719 --> 00:45:59.320
trained on it. They have all this electronic
00:45:59.320 --> 00:46:03.420
stuff that goes along with it, and they've got
00:46:03.420 --> 00:46:06.360
to carry that on their back. They've even got
00:46:06.360 --> 00:46:10.980
their own drones, I think they call them, military
00:46:10.980 --> 00:46:15.230
drones on it. They have those. They have to carry
00:46:15.230 --> 00:46:18.769
those. Everything has to be carried on it like
00:46:18.769 --> 00:46:26.750
that. But now, everything, now, you ride a helicopter
00:46:26.750 --> 00:46:31.309
someplace to your destination on it. And before,
00:46:31.710 --> 00:46:36.030
we were trained to walk. And we walked to our
00:46:36.030 --> 00:46:39.289
destination. We walked to the different places
00:46:39.289 --> 00:46:44.710
on it. We walked to go get the... The chow. A
00:46:44.710 --> 00:46:47.949
lot of times I had to walk 25 miles just to get
00:46:47.949 --> 00:46:51.010
breakfast. That was just not one time, but several
00:46:51.010 --> 00:46:53.889
times we had to do that. And, of course, Jimmy
00:46:53.889 --> 00:46:56.750
Roosevelt was right along with us on it. He wasn't
00:46:56.750 --> 00:46:59.449
riding in a Jeep or anything like that. He walked
00:46:59.449 --> 00:47:03.110
right with us on it. He got the same blisters
00:47:03.110 --> 00:47:06.909
that we got. I'm just trying to think a while
00:47:06.909 --> 00:47:11.690
ago about this one. I think it was Barocco that
00:47:11.690 --> 00:47:19.170
we attacked on it. And the rubber boats and even
00:47:19.170 --> 00:47:26.170
the six -man boat, eight -man boat on it. Winds
00:47:26.170 --> 00:47:34.230
blew us off course and they were out of 15 miles
00:47:34.230 --> 00:47:37.710
off the landing area. They were supposed to land.
00:47:38.670 --> 00:47:42.610
The wind blew them off course and they land about
00:47:42.610 --> 00:47:48.590
14 to 15 miles away from the real landing zone.
00:47:49.610 --> 00:47:56.070
Those that were in those two or three boats had
00:47:56.070 --> 00:48:01.730
to walk through the jungle to get it back up
00:48:01.730 --> 00:48:07.929
to the landing zone. before they even fired a
00:48:07.929 --> 00:48:15.289
shot. So all of this hiking and stuff, it was
00:48:15.289 --> 00:48:21.630
needed. Especially if you're in the jungle like
00:48:21.630 --> 00:48:27.650
we were. But it's a different thing now. And
00:48:27.650 --> 00:48:31.090
it's a lot different than just regular boot camp.
00:48:31.909 --> 00:48:37.130
But you do get training in boot camp. The first
00:48:37.130 --> 00:48:43.349
bayonet training I had on boot camp in San Diego
00:48:43.349 --> 00:48:50.630
came in handy when we landed on Guam. And I was
00:48:50.630 --> 00:48:55.170
in bayonet fights on Guam. There were several
00:48:55.170 --> 00:49:01.730
different bonsai attacks that we had. And I thanked
00:49:01.730 --> 00:49:05.559
my old sergeant. his training is at that time
00:49:05.559 --> 00:49:11.440
because i learned a few more my own but uh it
00:49:11.440 --> 00:49:13.659
was a training that you think you're you think
00:49:13.659 --> 00:49:16.599
it's hard on you at that time but boy i tell
00:49:16.599 --> 00:49:21.519
you you use your training well i think that's
00:49:21.519 --> 00:49:24.019
a really important you know perspective to hear
00:49:24.019 --> 00:49:26.460
from someone you know from your generation firstly
00:49:26.460 --> 00:49:29.099
it's interesting with the technology because
00:49:29.099 --> 00:49:32.559
what really amazes me about the world war ii
00:49:32.559 --> 00:49:35.199
and world war ii era is you didn't have gps you
00:49:35.199 --> 00:49:37.000
didn't have computers you didn't have drones
00:49:37.000 --> 00:49:40.460
and you know planes in the sky with radar so
00:49:40.460 --> 00:49:42.400
as you mentioned you know once you land that's
00:49:42.400 --> 00:49:44.760
where you are and you might have to hike to where
00:49:44.760 --> 00:49:46.840
you're supposed to be you've got no way of really
00:49:46.840 --> 00:49:49.760
knowing where the enemy are so that in itself
00:49:49.760 --> 00:49:52.519
is incredible but in the fire service something
00:49:52.519 --> 00:49:55.269
that i've talked about a lot is I was very fortunate
00:49:55.269 --> 00:49:58.269
to get some really, really good, incredibly hard
00:49:58.269 --> 00:50:01.030
training early in my career, just by chance,
00:50:01.070 --> 00:50:03.510
the departments I went to. And I feel that really
00:50:03.510 --> 00:50:07.789
set the bar for the standards of my firefighting
00:50:07.789 --> 00:50:09.670
career. Not saying I was a great firefighter,
00:50:09.690 --> 00:50:11.309
but I was definitely held to a high standard.
00:50:12.030 --> 00:50:16.250
So talk to me about when you first deployed,
00:50:16.349 --> 00:50:19.489
your first combat, and there you are as a young
00:50:19.489 --> 00:50:25.650
boy from the US. high level of training as a
00:50:25.650 --> 00:50:28.690
raider carried over to your first combat mission
00:50:28.690 --> 00:50:37.010
uh firstly is the uh training that we had in
00:50:37.010 --> 00:50:44.769
san diego uh the fourth raiders were the i'll
00:50:44.769 --> 00:50:50.409
call say the guinea pig of uh for uh determining
00:50:50.409 --> 00:50:56.699
what a raider should be trained at. When we left
00:50:56.699 --> 00:51:04.699
in, I think, 1943 on February the 11th, they
00:51:04.699 --> 00:51:11.420
named the course that we had to take on it, they
00:51:11.420 --> 00:51:16.579
named that as a combat course, and every Marine
00:51:16.579 --> 00:51:20.460
that went overseas had to go through combat course
00:51:20.460 --> 00:51:23.639
on it. that was caused, and I think it still
00:51:23.639 --> 00:51:29.960
is, that plus other things that they had to learn,
00:51:30.119 --> 00:51:33.840
of course, as the type of the enemy that they
00:51:33.840 --> 00:51:39.420
had to face. So when we left, we left, of course,
00:51:39.460 --> 00:51:45.599
as I say, in February, and we went to New Hebrides
00:51:45.599 --> 00:51:53.789
Island, same committee, New Caledonia. And we
00:51:53.789 --> 00:51:59.590
were training all the way over there on board
00:51:59.590 --> 00:52:06.570
ship. We arrived there, were trained on New Caledonia
00:52:06.570 --> 00:52:11.530
and New Hebrides. Then we got word that we were
00:52:11.530 --> 00:52:15.929
going to be transferred over to a little place
00:52:15.929 --> 00:52:22.610
called Guadalcanal and our company. our platoon
00:52:22.610 --> 00:52:26.809
were transferred over there and we were set up
00:52:26.809 --> 00:52:32.929
to patrol on Guadalcanal Henderson airfield that
00:52:32.929 --> 00:52:39.789
there was on and uh and around uh the uh some
00:52:39.789 --> 00:52:42.469
town I don't know which one that wasn't very
00:52:42.469 --> 00:52:45.590
uh too much active on that because we were in
00:52:45.590 --> 00:52:50.849
there as a backup and clean up, mop up, or whatever
00:52:50.849 --> 00:52:55.230
you want to say, on Guadalcanal. We were looking
00:52:55.230 --> 00:52:58.909
for stragglers, we were looking for holdouts,
00:52:59.110 --> 00:53:05.449
and we were shelled by hand grenades. I think
00:53:05.449 --> 00:53:10.510
we had two people who were wounded in our company
00:53:10.510 --> 00:53:15.929
from there. But we got into a little action on
00:53:15.929 --> 00:53:25.280
Guadalcanal. And during our period of going out
00:53:25.280 --> 00:53:28.599
in the jungle and searching for these holdouts,
00:53:28.980 --> 00:53:36.599
Seabees had landed and were building the tent
00:53:36.599 --> 00:53:45.159
camps for the Marines that were following behind
00:53:45.159 --> 00:53:50.860
our companies. because they were going to use
00:53:50.860 --> 00:53:55.079
Guadalcanal as a jumping -off place for all of
00:53:55.079 --> 00:53:59.800
the South Pacific and North Pacific area. And
00:53:59.800 --> 00:54:05.480
I got a chance to fire, but I was scared all
00:54:05.480 --> 00:54:09.039
the way through. When you're out in the jungle
00:54:09.039 --> 00:54:12.340
and you hear something firing going on, you don't
00:54:12.340 --> 00:54:20.550
know if it's at you or what. get scared. But
00:54:20.550 --> 00:54:27.590
the proper platoon sergeant, I think we just
00:54:27.590 --> 00:54:30.150
had a sergeant, we had a platoon sergeant there,
00:54:30.309 --> 00:54:36.269
and he would always holler out, you know, about
00:54:36.269 --> 00:54:42.030
that it was two miles out, two miles over, or
00:54:42.030 --> 00:54:44.630
whatever it was, to calm us down on it. But we
00:54:44.630 --> 00:54:48.840
were scared. But that was my first exposure to
00:54:48.840 --> 00:54:52.980
someone firing at us. After we got through with
00:54:52.980 --> 00:54:58.300
those area around Henderson Field, we went to
00:54:58.300 --> 00:55:04.780
area where we were to stay and be as our final
00:55:04.780 --> 00:55:11.119
camp month there on the canal. The Seabees are
00:55:11.119 --> 00:55:15.539
great. They are great people. They have the best
00:55:15.539 --> 00:55:22.980
food in the Pacific. And we used to go and stand
00:55:22.980 --> 00:55:26.699
in their chow line and hike for so many miles
00:55:26.699 --> 00:55:31.280
just to go on their chow line just to get something
00:55:31.280 --> 00:55:40.500
to eat besides canned dog food, as we said. That's
00:55:40.500 --> 00:55:48.960
where Spam. And after we got there, then... Finally,
00:55:48.960 --> 00:55:56.860
most of the Japanese had been captured or killed.
00:55:57.820 --> 00:56:03.059
But we still had perimeter guard duty all the
00:56:03.059 --> 00:56:05.739
time, and we were scared that they were coming
00:56:05.739 --> 00:56:12.079
in on us. So I was always worried about that,
00:56:12.139 --> 00:56:17.690
about them sneaking in back behind us. The Japanese
00:56:17.690 --> 00:56:24.050
had figured out the area that our planes are
00:56:24.050 --> 00:56:29.690
coming over and they set up a lot of radio stations
00:56:29.690 --> 00:56:34.289
along in those areas in the Solomons. The Solomons
00:56:34.289 --> 00:56:39.269
is a bunch of small islands and all connected
00:56:39.269 --> 00:56:45.030
to in the Solomons as they were New Georgia.
00:56:46.000 --> 00:56:52.079
was the largest one. There's Barocco, there's
00:56:52.079 --> 00:57:03.820
Price Anchorage, but we were stationed in Guadalcanal,
00:57:04.000 --> 00:57:08.880
which was one of the largest of the Solomons.
00:57:09.500 --> 00:57:21.059
We went to was our area was into barroco we went
00:57:21.059 --> 00:57:25.599
into barroco well we were still with we're still
00:57:25.599 --> 00:57:29.840
using uh the rubber boats at that time for our
00:57:29.840 --> 00:57:35.380
attack force on it and uh which they found out
00:57:35.380 --> 00:57:38.820
that the fact that rubber by going into rubber
00:57:38.820 --> 00:57:43.500
boats with rubber boats they make an island had
00:57:43.500 --> 00:57:48.340
been, had used them almost exclusively, and it
00:57:48.340 --> 00:57:54.039
didn't work out. And Colonel Carlson even wrote
00:57:54.039 --> 00:58:02.780
a battle report about the motors that were, the
00:58:02.780 --> 00:58:07.780
outboard motors that were on the little eight
00:58:07.780 --> 00:58:12.159
-man boats that we were using. So we were using
00:58:12.699 --> 00:58:16.619
uh at that time uh they were changing over from
00:58:16.619 --> 00:58:21.340
rubber boats park rubber boats and we weren't
00:58:21.340 --> 00:58:26.800
using the submarine we're using the uh uh happened
00:58:26.800 --> 00:58:33.159
to be one of the uh uss waters and uh we had
00:58:33.159 --> 00:58:36.039
been we had trained on that one time on san diego
00:58:36.039 --> 00:58:44.710
and we landed on barroco and uh the guys that
00:58:44.710 --> 00:58:49.030
were in the smaller boats got blown off course
00:58:49.030 --> 00:58:57.530
again and their outboard motor got Drowned it
00:58:57.530 --> 00:59:01.449
out. So they had to take the oars and pull themselves
00:59:01.449 --> 00:59:05.650
in on that with the oars They were off course
00:59:05.650 --> 00:59:16.860
it came in and The Japs had their radio stations
00:59:16.860 --> 00:59:20.820
and stuff further in than we had anticipated.
00:59:22.400 --> 00:59:31.019
And we were shot at and we lost a lot of men
00:59:31.019 --> 00:59:36.780
at that time. But not on my company. My company
00:59:36.780 --> 00:59:44.760
was up on the other side of it. of the supposedly
00:59:44.760 --> 00:59:53.039
radio stations. But we started walking in there
00:59:53.039 --> 00:59:58.699
and we walked into a trap on it. We had to go
00:59:58.699 --> 01:00:03.840
through the coconut farm over there and the Japs
01:00:03.840 --> 01:00:10.420
were all over the foliage and the trees and stuff
01:00:10.420 --> 01:00:19.840
on it. And they had machine guns that were in
01:00:19.840 --> 01:00:25.320
small pillboxes that they had built out of the
01:00:25.320 --> 01:00:36.219
downed trees. And we were trapped. I was using
01:00:36.219 --> 01:00:43.820
a .55 caliber. anti -tank boys and a tank rifle
01:00:43.820 --> 01:00:49.139
at the time. And we were stationed along the
01:00:49.139 --> 01:00:56.960
road heading into that area that the guys were
01:00:56.960 --> 01:01:01.579
trapped. They had called for help and we went
01:01:01.579 --> 01:01:06.300
in there with them. And we got stuck in this
01:01:06.300 --> 01:01:10.760
trap as well. They were perfectly well organized
01:01:10.760 --> 01:01:19.639
on it. And had a lot of corpsmen in there taking
01:01:19.639 --> 01:01:26.059
care of the kids as they were shot. Father Redman
01:01:26.059 --> 01:01:31.300
was our pastor of all denominations, I would
01:01:31.300 --> 01:01:35.400
say. And he was reading rites to everybody that
01:01:35.400 --> 01:01:42.300
he would see them. that they were dead. And the
01:01:42.300 --> 01:01:47.739
mortars that we took, knee mortars we took, were
01:01:47.739 --> 01:01:52.960
not very accurate to the point that we couldn't
01:01:52.960 --> 01:01:55.480
see them. So we didn't know exactly where they
01:01:55.480 --> 01:02:01.739
were. They were very well camouflaged. So we
01:02:01.739 --> 01:02:07.300
found out. I was carrying a sidearm. and a Thompson
01:02:07.300 --> 01:02:14.219
submachine gun at the time. So we couldn't pick
01:02:14.219 --> 01:02:21.719
out one person or one area that the Jets were
01:02:21.719 --> 01:02:29.199
hiding. We just took the submachine gun and just
01:02:29.199 --> 01:02:33.960
sprayed the whole top of the tree. hoping that
01:02:33.960 --> 01:02:37.420
one of the bullets would get on someone and And
01:02:37.420 --> 01:02:39.900
we did that's one where they we got out of some
01:02:39.900 --> 01:02:43.159
problems that we had up there, but they were
01:02:43.159 --> 01:02:46.639
We didn't know for sure if we got them or not
01:02:46.639 --> 01:02:50.340
because they were tied into the trees And they
01:02:50.340 --> 01:02:54.639
wouldn't fall so we had a lot of wasted ammo
01:02:54.639 --> 01:02:59.179
ammo on that one of that reason so but finally
01:02:59.179 --> 01:03:04.909
we we broke out of that particular situation
01:03:04.909 --> 01:03:08.969
and made it around them, came in from behind
01:03:08.969 --> 01:03:12.530
them, and at that time we found the radio station,
01:03:12.630 --> 01:03:15.190
destroyed all the radio stations that we could
01:03:15.190 --> 01:03:21.469
come to, and then come back to the main road,
01:03:21.730 --> 01:03:29.809
and some of the kids were transported out of
01:03:29.809 --> 01:03:36.789
the area by by three airplanes. I don't remember
01:03:36.789 --> 01:03:48.369
who it was. At that time, before we left Guadalcanal,
01:03:48.590 --> 01:03:54.789
I had malaria and I was in the field hospital.
01:03:55.730 --> 01:03:59.670
I heard that my company and guys were going to
01:03:59.670 --> 01:04:05.880
leave. and for an operation. So I snuck out of
01:04:05.880 --> 01:04:15.340
the field hospital and met my squad at the ship
01:04:15.340 --> 01:04:23.039
and came in. Well, it just so happened that Jimmy
01:04:23.039 --> 01:04:27.179
Roosevelt, our commanding officer, he got malaria
01:04:27.179 --> 01:04:33.539
as well. at that on Guadalcanal. Guadalcanal
01:04:33.539 --> 01:04:43.219
was all gone wet with swamps and little back
01:04:43.219 --> 01:04:46.000
streams and stuff like that, and mosquitoes.
01:04:48.000 --> 01:04:51.340
And I don't know how many, I wouldn't even guess
01:04:51.340 --> 01:04:54.079
if it was 40 % or 50 % or something like that.
01:04:54.139 --> 01:04:58.260
The Marines got malaria off of them, but anyway.
01:04:59.660 --> 01:05:02.599
Our commanding officer, Roosevelt, he got it
01:05:02.599 --> 01:05:06.380
as well. He was in the field hospital when we
01:05:06.380 --> 01:05:11.800
left. But when we got back from, when we finally
01:05:11.800 --> 01:05:18.440
got off of Barocco, part of the guys went around
01:05:18.440 --> 01:05:25.760
to Rice Anchorage, and I was in one of the companies
01:05:25.760 --> 01:05:33.639
that... and over there and to uh destroy some
01:05:33.639 --> 01:05:42.039
uh radio equipment and uh we went by uh uh by
01:05:42.039 --> 01:05:46.800
native boats on and they rode us across the way
01:05:46.800 --> 01:05:53.760
for that they came back through the barroco got
01:05:53.760 --> 01:06:01.460
aboard our ship came back to Guadalcanal, and
01:06:01.460 --> 01:06:08.380
Jimmy Roosevelt had been transferred out of his
01:06:08.380 --> 01:06:13.719
field hospital back to the United States. They
01:06:13.719 --> 01:06:17.679
blew him out on it. But when I got back, I was
01:06:17.679 --> 01:06:22.460
still shaking, and I think part of it was from
01:06:22.460 --> 01:06:25.480
the fright, and the other part was from... from
01:06:25.480 --> 01:06:32.880
the malaria, but they diagnosed it as AWL. But
01:06:32.880 --> 01:06:35.239
they wiped that off because they knew that I
01:06:35.239 --> 01:06:41.019
had snuck aboard a ship to get into combat, real
01:06:41.019 --> 01:06:46.699
tight combat, which was crazy. Anyway, but I
01:06:46.699 --> 01:06:52.659
went back into the field hospital. The field
01:06:52.659 --> 01:07:00.230
hospital... I stayed in for a while and I think
01:07:00.230 --> 01:07:05.230
it was at that time that the 1st and 2nd Raiders
01:07:05.230 --> 01:07:13.210
had wiped out most of the Japanese force around
01:07:13.210 --> 01:07:21.489
the island and the 3rd Raiders were coming in
01:07:22.280 --> 01:07:24.679
in some place up that i don't remember where
01:07:24.679 --> 01:07:27.820
they were from and the fourth raiders were coming
01:07:27.820 --> 01:07:30.659
back to their regular camp on it so they had
01:07:30.659 --> 01:07:35.500
all four raider companies that was overseas were
01:07:35.500 --> 01:07:40.219
all on guadalcanal well that was a design uh
01:07:40.219 --> 01:07:43.699
thing because that's when they wanted to break
01:07:43.699 --> 01:07:48.239
up the raiders the raiders were a smaller outfit
01:07:48.239 --> 01:07:53.269
and uh were trained for hit and run, a lot of
01:07:53.269 --> 01:07:56.809
night fighting and stuff, and they wanted to
01:07:56.809 --> 01:08:04.150
get rid of those tactics and have a more larger
01:08:04.150 --> 01:08:13.230
type of action. So most of the raiders of the
01:08:13.230 --> 01:08:20.810
Third Division, the Fourth Raiders, were reassigned
01:08:20.810 --> 01:08:26.630
to, I think it was the 4th Division and the 6th
01:08:26.630 --> 01:08:31.090
Division, as well as the 1st and 2nd Raiders.
01:08:32.090 --> 01:08:41.890
I was still in the hospital and I got discharged
01:08:41.890 --> 01:08:53.020
out of the hospital on December 25th. And I went
01:08:53.020 --> 01:09:01.020
to a reserve unit. And from there, I went into
01:09:01.020 --> 01:09:05.699
the third division, the 21st Marines. I was assigned
01:09:05.699 --> 01:09:10.739
as a squad leader. That's one of the reasons
01:09:10.739 --> 01:09:14.939
that most of the 4th Raiders had been assigned
01:09:14.939 --> 01:09:19.859
to the 4th Division. And I didn't go in with
01:09:19.859 --> 01:09:22.760
the 4th Division at that time because I had already
01:09:22.760 --> 01:09:26.859
been discharged out of the hospital and to a
01:09:26.859 --> 01:09:31.420
reserve unit to wait to go into the 3rd Division
01:09:31.420 --> 01:09:35.399
as the 3rd Division and the 21st Marines were
01:09:35.399 --> 01:09:44.479
being formed at that time too. So I went in from
01:09:44.479 --> 01:09:47.979
the 3rd Division. Now the Barocco was the first
01:09:47.979 --> 01:09:57.960
really fighting for the Fourth Raiders. We had
01:09:57.960 --> 01:10:00.199
been trained all this time. We really only trained
01:10:00.199 --> 01:10:05.539
and only fought one big battle over there. We
01:10:05.539 --> 01:10:10.180
were in the tail end of the type of action that
01:10:10.180 --> 01:10:18.300
they needed at that time. But in the third division,
01:10:18.600 --> 01:10:22.760
then we had a different course as far as I was
01:10:22.760 --> 01:10:25.640
concerned. I had a different commander and a
01:10:25.640 --> 01:10:30.100
different company. The 21st Marines, but I was
01:10:30.100 --> 01:10:31.920
still the squad leader and still responsible
01:10:31.920 --> 01:10:37.140
for the seven men. We were trained much differently
01:10:37.140 --> 01:10:44.659
than the Raider training. And the reason was,
01:10:45.039 --> 01:10:51.899
that were we were being uh trained for a uh larger
01:10:51.899 --> 01:10:55.340
a larger island that we're going going to come
01:10:55.340 --> 01:10:57.560
in and we're not going to be going in on a small
01:10:57.560 --> 01:11:03.760
small uh unit like the battalion we had two people
01:11:03.760 --> 01:11:06.060
we had two divisions that were going to be going
01:11:06.060 --> 01:11:14.119
in at the same time and uh so the uh 3rd and
01:11:14.119 --> 01:11:19.380
4th and part of the 5th, 2nd and 3rd division
01:11:19.380 --> 01:11:24.100
and part of the 4th division, I think it was,
01:11:24.239 --> 01:11:33.579
were being trained to go to Guam and Tinian and
01:11:33.579 --> 01:11:39.600
Saipan. Really, it was the Saipan first. And
01:11:39.600 --> 01:11:48.039
Saipan, then... then it would be Tinian, then
01:11:48.039 --> 01:11:54.779
it would be Guam on it. But the 3rd Division
01:11:54.779 --> 01:12:03.539
was kind of reserved on a reserve until the 3rd
01:12:03.539 --> 01:12:10.699
and 4th had attacked and partly secured Saipan.
01:12:11.949 --> 01:12:19.250
And then they went on over to Tinian, which was
01:12:19.250 --> 01:12:24.270
a smaller island, and that was situated between
01:12:24.270 --> 01:12:33.949
Saipan and Guam. And Guam, I don't know too much
01:12:33.949 --> 01:12:42.340
about Saipan, but Guam, that was our... main
01:12:42.340 --> 01:12:51.020
objective on it. So we came in on, at first,
01:12:51.100 --> 01:13:01.399
we came in on small boats on it and LSTs, which
01:13:01.399 --> 01:13:04.180
was the landing ship tank, I think they called
01:13:04.180 --> 01:13:10.380
it. Then they transferred us over to I would
01:13:10.380 --> 01:13:16.579
say maybe a half mile away from the landing zone
01:13:16.579 --> 01:13:23.760
and we went into Amtraks and the reason for the
01:13:23.760 --> 01:13:26.699
transfer from the boats to the Amtraks was because
01:13:26.699 --> 01:13:33.300
Guam had so much coral along this landing zone
01:13:33.300 --> 01:13:38.880
and they would just creep over the over the coral
01:13:38.880 --> 01:13:43.760
on it and a regular boat would be going through
01:13:43.760 --> 01:13:47.020
it would tear the bottom up so we transferred
01:13:47.020 --> 01:13:55.000
over and we came in on Amtrak we landed and the
01:13:55.000 --> 01:14:02.619
I think it was an open rice field that we our
01:14:02.619 --> 01:14:09.760
company was going through I remember the water
01:14:09.760 --> 01:14:14.800
buffalo out there in the middle of the rice paddies
01:14:14.800 --> 01:14:21.500
eating while we were shooting and hand grenades
01:14:21.500 --> 01:14:24.220
and mortars and stuff like that going over it.
01:14:24.359 --> 01:14:27.560
It didn't bother him a bit when it came through
01:14:27.560 --> 01:14:35.079
there. We had a comparative light landing, but
01:14:35.079 --> 01:14:43.050
it was... quite noisy with mortars that they
01:14:43.050 --> 01:14:46.250
were shooting at them. They still scared us.
01:14:48.069 --> 01:14:54.729
You're scared, but you don't show it. It's a
01:14:54.729 --> 01:14:58.750
different type of scare. Worried, I guess, maybe.
01:14:59.670 --> 01:15:02.850
More worried about, am I going to be one of the
01:15:02.850 --> 01:15:08.500
guys who's going to get hit? We came on in. Right
01:15:08.500 --> 01:15:16.079
at the end of the rice field, there was an incline.
01:15:17.239 --> 01:15:20.199
We went up that incline on it, and right at the
01:15:20.199 --> 01:15:26.319
top of the incline, we were met with tanks and
01:15:26.319 --> 01:15:33.239
ground troops there, and we fought ourselves.
01:15:34.250 --> 01:15:40.350
right to the top of that incline. And that took
01:15:40.350 --> 01:15:44.050
most of the day going across the rice paddy and
01:15:44.050 --> 01:15:49.649
over that incline. So we dug in right there.
01:15:50.069 --> 01:15:59.130
And we had two companies that was attacked there.
01:15:59.899 --> 01:16:03.579
But one of the main things that we had, the main
01:16:03.579 --> 01:16:08.479
objectives that we were supposed to go to was
01:16:08.479 --> 01:16:13.159
the concentration camp that the Japanese had
01:16:13.159 --> 01:16:18.720
on the island. When the Japanese attacked the
01:16:18.720 --> 01:16:25.979
Guam in 1941, they took all kinds of Marines
01:16:25.979 --> 01:16:32.920
and Navy and corpsmen. and they put them in the
01:16:32.920 --> 01:16:36.779
concentration camp just to get in them a little
01:16:36.779 --> 01:16:41.340
bit. And P Company was, I think, I think it was
01:16:41.340 --> 01:16:46.420
P Company, was charged with taking and go right
01:16:46.420 --> 01:16:53.880
on through that incline around to the concentration
01:16:53.880 --> 01:16:56.640
camp or internment camp, whatever you want to
01:16:56.640 --> 01:17:04.130
call it. and uh released all of the um rescued
01:17:04.130 --> 01:17:08.829
all of the prisoners that they had taken at that
01:17:08.829 --> 01:17:14.770
time on it and then uh which did uh i was not
01:17:14.770 --> 01:17:19.350
involved in that going my uh my company apart
01:17:19.350 --> 01:17:22.289
i think there was a platoon that went with uh
01:17:22.289 --> 01:17:25.229
the people on my my positive group i've heard
01:17:25.229 --> 01:17:30.970
that But anyway, we started digging in there.
01:17:31.109 --> 01:17:35.770
We dug in, and I took nearly all day coming through
01:17:35.770 --> 01:17:43.770
there. And then David Foxhole was there. And
01:17:43.770 --> 01:17:49.250
about that afternoon, that evening, rather, just
01:17:49.250 --> 01:17:54.609
before dark, we heard all kinds of information.
01:17:57.009 --> 01:18:02.369
tanks and mortars. Guys hollering, yelling, screaming.
01:18:02.909 --> 01:18:07.909
And then we had what they call a bonsai attack.
01:18:09.670 --> 01:18:14.989
And it was about two or three hundred Japs came
01:18:14.989 --> 01:18:22.890
out of the brush and attacked us. And we were
01:18:22.890 --> 01:18:26.039
told to stay in our boxholes. on it don't go
01:18:26.039 --> 01:18:30.359
don't get out because of you if we stay in the
01:18:30.359 --> 01:18:33.279
foxhole at least we've got some kind of protection
01:18:33.279 --> 01:18:37.079
but you can't stay in your foxhole when you've
01:18:37.079 --> 01:18:39.520
got mortars coming in there it's just no way
01:18:39.520 --> 01:18:46.239
it's anyway so they ran down they were coming
01:18:46.239 --> 01:18:49.960
down the hill on it to try to drive us off the
01:18:49.960 --> 01:18:55.859
island and uh that's where my bayonet practice
01:18:55.859 --> 01:19:03.300
came into hand there. I shot what I had and and
01:19:03.300 --> 01:19:13.220
it was harder on the first time. That was the
01:19:13.220 --> 01:19:17.180
first time that our company had ever been set
01:19:17.180 --> 01:19:23.460
aside for that, for a bonsai attack. But we killed
01:19:23.460 --> 01:19:30.890
a lot of lot of them and The tanks and drove
01:19:30.890 --> 01:19:34.310
the tanks most of the tanks back up in that back
01:19:34.310 --> 01:19:40.270
the hills there So they didn't they didn't Push
01:19:40.270 --> 01:19:42.909
her off the person push us off the island like
01:19:42.909 --> 01:19:46.670
their plans were the next day They're counted
01:19:46.670 --> 01:19:51.710
all the Moses that were still alive Started up
01:19:51.710 --> 01:19:57.460
toward the coastline toward uh argana and our
01:19:57.460 --> 01:20:03.819
agate or out of that on it and uh we bought the
01:20:03.819 --> 01:20:06.520
pill boxes and stuff all the way up the island
01:20:06.520 --> 01:20:10.479
up there until we got to a gat which was about
01:20:10.479 --> 01:20:15.340
the third or fourth day and then the uh headquarters
01:20:15.340 --> 01:20:18.939
company came in right behind us and stayed in
01:20:18.939 --> 01:20:25.409
on on the beach side and we were going up on
01:20:25.409 --> 01:20:31.649
that incline, just kind of looking over the beach.
01:20:32.789 --> 01:20:39.710
We got up there until all kinds of pillboxes
01:20:39.710 --> 01:20:45.449
we had to go through. And then that night, we
01:20:45.449 --> 01:20:52.029
dug in again. We were digging in. And that night,
01:20:53.210 --> 01:20:57.170
We heard just all these tanks coming down the
01:20:57.170 --> 01:21:03.489
road where we were. And they had about 400 Japs
01:21:03.489 --> 01:21:07.949
following in behind the tanks. And they were
01:21:07.949 --> 01:21:14.189
heading for the headquarters company that was
01:21:14.189 --> 01:21:17.789
down below us on the lower end of the incline.
01:21:22.470 --> 01:21:26.890
They started fighting and stuff and I had I've
01:21:26.890 --> 01:21:35.050
got up out of my foxhole and I Shot one clip
01:21:35.050 --> 01:21:40.289
of eight As it came down running down the hill
01:21:40.289 --> 01:21:45.590
on toward me I Changed got me another round got
01:21:45.590 --> 01:21:50.329
me another clip and stuck it in there And got
01:21:50.329 --> 01:21:55.350
it in there just in time I shot that out. I shot
01:21:55.350 --> 01:22:03.310
eight more. And I was unable to reload because
01:22:03.310 --> 01:22:05.970
I couldn't find another clip out of my bandolier.
01:22:07.569 --> 01:22:13.250
So I started using my bayonet. And some of them
01:22:13.250 --> 01:22:16.149
were jumping over others that were down already.
01:22:16.930 --> 01:22:24.119
So when Jeff came in, he was... good -sized man
01:22:24.119 --> 01:22:38.460
and uh i stabbed him and uh he uh started fighting
01:22:38.460 --> 01:22:47.199
with me and i started backing up and uh stumbled
01:22:47.199 --> 01:22:51.119
over the little berm that i had put around my
01:22:51.550 --> 01:22:57.590
my uh my foxhole that i was digging and uh put
01:22:57.590 --> 01:23:01.449
that and i started falling and just as i started
01:23:01.449 --> 01:23:05.890
falling down he jabbed me in the stomach and
01:23:05.890 --> 01:23:13.890
i fell down on my back in the foxhole he was
01:23:13.890 --> 01:23:16.130
standing right above the box so he was getting
01:23:16.130 --> 01:23:23.099
ready to jump down and the guy from the next
01:23:23.099 --> 01:23:31.720
foxhole over this area. He shot the guy in the
01:23:31.720 --> 01:23:35.579
back or he stabbed him, one of the two. I don't
01:23:35.579 --> 01:23:38.840
know how, but he fell. He fell down on top of
01:23:38.840 --> 01:23:44.020
me in the foxhole. As I fell down in the foxhole,
01:23:44.180 --> 01:23:53.119
my hand hit my gung -ho knife and He fell on
01:23:53.119 --> 01:23:55.579
top of me, and I grabbed that knife. My hand
01:23:55.579 --> 01:23:58.500
was on it, and I grabbed it, and I shoved it
01:23:58.500 --> 01:24:02.479
through his neck and his throat, and I killed
01:24:02.479 --> 01:24:09.260
him there, laying on top of me. And then the
01:24:09.260 --> 01:24:14.699
tanks, the American tanks came in then to join
01:24:14.699 --> 01:24:19.359
the fight from below, and they had been... stationed
01:24:19.359 --> 01:24:21.720
down below the headquarters company. They came
01:24:21.720 --> 01:24:28.020
in up the hill and they just chased the Japs
01:24:28.020 --> 01:24:32.220
back into their holding grounds up further on
01:24:32.220 --> 01:24:37.159
back and back. I stayed in the boxhole with this
01:24:37.159 --> 01:24:41.399
guy on me because I didn't know how deep that
01:24:41.399 --> 01:24:49.819
stomach wound was. So I held on to it, and he
01:24:49.819 --> 01:24:53.960
just bled all over me. But anyway, we got to
01:24:53.960 --> 01:25:00.720
the next morning. We had the corpsman. The corpsman
01:25:00.720 --> 01:25:02.899
came up from the headquarters, and they started
01:25:02.899 --> 01:25:06.859
counting noses on us to see who the people were
01:25:06.859 --> 01:25:10.520
and how bad they were. They pulled the guy off
01:25:10.520 --> 01:25:13.939
of me, and they thought I was done for, but it
01:25:13.939 --> 01:25:20.050
was just his blood, not mine. And they pulled
01:25:20.050 --> 01:25:32.430
me out on it. As I had fallen backwards, he stabbed
01:25:32.430 --> 01:25:36.850
at me. He stuck me in the stomach, and it went
01:25:36.850 --> 01:25:40.430
kind of sideways. It didn't go straight in, so
01:25:40.430 --> 01:25:48.520
it went along under the skin in there. Just stuck
01:25:48.520 --> 01:25:55.239
the capillaries and things. But anyway, they
01:25:55.239 --> 01:25:59.420
pulled me up and wiped me off and got it. And
01:25:59.420 --> 01:26:03.939
then they put bandages on me, put some sulfur
01:26:03.939 --> 01:26:10.779
on me. And they take me up. And he says, okay,
01:26:10.920 --> 01:26:14.260
everybody stay here. It's going to stay here.
01:26:14.909 --> 01:26:19.890
Going to the headquarters company. Well, I just,
01:26:19.930 --> 01:26:23.170
I wanted to stay with my men. So there's only
01:26:23.170 --> 01:26:28.850
three of us left. Me and my B .A. arm and my
01:26:28.850 --> 01:26:34.630
scout. So I just stayed with them and bundled
01:26:34.630 --> 01:26:38.609
up my stomach and held on to it and restarted
01:26:38.609 --> 01:26:43.550
on up further and up through Ghana and Pagod.
01:26:44.090 --> 01:26:48.550
I came across a lot of Jap officers had committed
01:26:48.550 --> 01:26:54.310
harry -carry in the tents. They didn't want to
01:26:54.310 --> 01:27:00.829
be captured, I guess. I was bleeding that night
01:27:00.829 --> 01:27:07.270
a little bit, so one of the corpsmen came up
01:27:07.270 --> 01:27:12.960
from the headquarters company. I met that same
01:27:12.960 --> 01:27:17.640
corpsman in San Diego at the Ring Raider Association
01:27:17.640 --> 01:27:20.859
meeting down there. He was one of the guys that
01:27:20.859 --> 01:27:25.420
came up and he taped me. He came up and they
01:27:25.420 --> 01:27:28.539
wiped all the blood off on it and re -stuck,
01:27:28.560 --> 01:27:34.760
re -applied sulfur. I think they called it sulfur.
01:27:35.760 --> 01:27:40.859
And then he taped it. He pulled the skin together.
01:27:41.710 --> 01:27:46.010
on it and taped it and by that time it didn't
01:27:46.010 --> 01:27:49.970
look too bad by the time he had gone through
01:27:49.970 --> 01:27:55.630
that got into uh and we started uh going on further
01:27:55.630 --> 01:28:02.069
on up and i found uh that one of my real good
01:28:02.069 --> 01:28:09.229
friends lieutenant leonard had been killed by
01:28:09.229 --> 01:28:12.640
leading a charge on on the box one of the pill
01:28:12.640 --> 01:28:20.279
boxes there um and uh he and uh pretend to home
01:28:20.279 --> 01:28:31.039
her buddies with me on guadalcanal they were
01:28:31.039 --> 01:28:37.560
in the raiders so anyway we went on up through
01:28:37.560 --> 01:28:46.350
there and uh We stayed on Guam for, on that end
01:28:46.350 --> 01:28:51.970
for three more days. Going up there and finally
01:28:51.970 --> 01:28:57.850
we got into, oh, my, one of my, my scout, I think
01:28:57.850 --> 01:29:05.909
it was, Navarro, found two cases of sake. And
01:29:05.909 --> 01:29:16.100
sake is rice wine. Yeah, it's good. I lived in
01:29:16.100 --> 01:29:17.800
Japan for a while, so I know exactly what you're
01:29:17.800 --> 01:29:27.659
talking about. Well, we got that, but we couldn't
01:29:27.659 --> 01:29:31.260
drink it all. We couldn't drink the thing. So
01:29:31.260 --> 01:29:37.260
it was all unopened. So we found a good spot
01:29:37.260 --> 01:29:41.750
and we dug a hole and buried it. And we knew
01:29:41.750 --> 01:29:46.449
where it was going to be. So we decided amongst
01:29:46.449 --> 01:29:50.350
ourselves to leave it there, not drink it, and
01:29:50.350 --> 01:29:53.210
didn't have time. We had other things to do.
01:29:54.670 --> 01:30:00.109
We went to, I remember the little town that was
01:30:00.109 --> 01:30:08.090
right down in the jet. Anyway, we stayed there
01:30:08.090 --> 01:30:14.510
for the, the fifth night, sixth night, and then
01:30:14.510 --> 01:30:19.989
we moved inward and by that time we had pretty
01:30:19.989 --> 01:30:25.590
well got Guam situated because all of the main
01:30:25.590 --> 01:30:35.449
Japanese area attack force had already been wiped
01:30:35.449 --> 01:30:40.970
out. chased back way on the other side. So I
01:30:40.970 --> 01:30:45.729
don't remember where it was that we were stationed
01:30:45.729 --> 01:30:54.829
or posted there. But I'm going to pull back a
01:30:54.829 --> 01:30:58.869
little bit. When we were on board ship coming
01:30:58.869 --> 01:31:04.649
to Guam, they took all our money away and gave
01:31:04.649 --> 01:31:10.329
us gave us what they call hawaiian dollars now
01:31:10.329 --> 01:31:17.750
hawaiian dollar is uh regular uh 5 10 and 20
01:31:17.750 --> 01:31:25.130
dollar bills with the word hawaii uh stamped
01:31:25.130 --> 01:31:29.329
on the face of it we were and that was the only
01:31:29.329 --> 01:31:36.279
legal legal tender on guam was uh those Hawaiian
01:31:36.279 --> 01:31:41.699
dollars on it. Now the reason was that when the
01:31:41.699 --> 01:31:51.060
Japs conquered in 1941, the paymaster for all
01:31:51.060 --> 01:31:56.100
of the islands in the Pacific were captured as
01:31:56.100 --> 01:32:01.640
well. Many millions of dollars in United States
01:32:01.640 --> 01:32:10.090
money were captured as well. And the U .S. government
01:32:10.090 --> 01:32:17.750
did not want us poor Marines to recapture that
01:32:17.750 --> 01:32:23.750
money and send it home. So we couldn't use it
01:32:23.750 --> 01:32:28.210
on the islands. So that was because the only
01:32:28.210 --> 01:32:32.409
tender that we could use was the Hawaiian dollars.
01:32:34.189 --> 01:32:38.880
That's little. side thing because and another
01:32:38.880 --> 01:32:42.659
thing that they told us on that that ship at
01:32:42.659 --> 01:32:47.800
that time on it to watch out for airplanes that
01:32:47.800 --> 01:32:51.760
are uh civilian type airplanes that are crashed
01:32:51.760 --> 01:32:56.819
out there and see to find out they were what
01:32:56.819 --> 01:32:59.500
they were still looking for was a media air heart
01:32:59.500 --> 01:33:09.899
yeah they were had and uh um Her plane was, at
01:33:09.899 --> 01:33:16.680
that time, supposed to have been downed in some
01:33:16.680 --> 01:33:21.279
of the islands around there. But it turned out
01:33:21.279 --> 01:33:26.520
that they weren't. Amelia Ellerhart actually
01:33:26.520 --> 01:33:33.760
was on a small island and was captured by...
01:33:34.109 --> 01:33:42.550
a Japanese stroller and was brought to Guam through
01:33:42.550 --> 01:33:51.369
Saipan and was seen on Saipan and so was Amelia
01:33:51.369 --> 01:33:56.170
Earhart on it but they were told at the time
01:33:56.170 --> 01:34:00.069
to keep looking for civilian airplanes that have
01:34:01.400 --> 01:34:09.840
I crashed in the islands there. But I have a
01:34:09.840 --> 01:34:13.260
letter. I won't go into that. That's secret.
01:34:14.159 --> 01:34:22.859
Anyway, we got there on Guam and we started our
01:34:22.859 --> 01:34:30.920
training again. I used to hitchhike all over
01:34:30.920 --> 01:34:41.220
Guam to the Seabees and get their food. Get the
01:34:41.220 --> 01:34:49.659
best food in the military. Real egg. Well, what's
01:34:49.659 --> 01:34:52.260
interesting, I actually got married to my first
01:34:52.260 --> 01:34:56.050
wife in Guam. So it's crazy to talk to you and
01:34:56.050 --> 01:34:58.409
there you were fighting for your life, you know,
01:34:58.430 --> 01:35:01.430
some 55 years prior. And I was standing in the
01:35:01.430 --> 01:35:04.609
chapel, you know, marrying this American girl,
01:35:04.710 --> 01:35:07.590
you know, on this beautiful tropical island where
01:35:07.590 --> 01:35:10.369
now the Japanese that were, you know, our friends
01:35:10.369 --> 01:35:13.829
again were coming on vacation. As long as you
01:35:13.829 --> 01:35:20.069
bring that in, I'll tell you. On last year, I
01:35:20.069 --> 01:35:27.560
got a call from. the Justice Department and San
01:35:27.560 --> 01:35:37.699
Jose from the Superior Court on it. The judge
01:35:37.699 --> 01:35:42.920
could come over and visit with me and talk about
01:35:42.920 --> 01:35:50.050
his parents were in and that concentration camp
01:35:50.050 --> 01:35:54.369
on Guam. Really? And he was, and his parents
01:35:54.369 --> 01:36:01.210
were released by part of my company that was
01:36:01.210 --> 01:36:09.390
owned there. And his name was Joe Gogo, Justice
01:36:09.390 --> 01:36:14.109
Gogo, I think they called it. And San Jose, he
01:36:14.109 --> 01:36:19.739
was going to be the... The president of the United
01:36:19.739 --> 01:36:25.340
States was going to assign him as the ambassador
01:36:25.340 --> 01:36:30.840
to Guam. Anyway, he came over and visited with
01:36:30.840 --> 01:36:33.920
me, and he thanked me, and he brought the flag,
01:36:34.140 --> 01:36:38.720
the Guamanian flag over with him, and a bunch
01:36:38.720 --> 01:36:44.640
of souvenirs, and he gave them to me. And I signed
01:36:44.640 --> 01:36:50.609
the... Romanian flag or like that. And they were
01:36:50.609 --> 01:36:55.390
going to have a parade on Guam and wanted me
01:36:55.390 --> 01:37:02.210
to be one of the grand marshals for the parade
01:37:02.210 --> 01:37:07.310
over there. Because every year, I don't remember
01:37:07.310 --> 01:37:12.670
what month, but every year that they have a parade
01:37:12.670 --> 01:37:20.149
to celebrate the Americans. on Guam. It was quite
01:37:20.149 --> 01:37:25.850
interesting to talk to him. I did Christmas cards
01:37:25.850 --> 01:37:28.510
and Valentine cards and stuff like that from
01:37:28.510 --> 01:37:32.750
the judge. Thanked me for, because if it wasn't
01:37:32.750 --> 01:37:37.829
for saving his parents, he wouldn't be here.
01:37:38.310 --> 01:37:43.270
Absolutely. So that was rather, that was, as
01:37:43.270 --> 01:37:46.909
long as you brought the American your wedding
01:37:46.909 --> 01:37:50.109
thing. I thought maybe I'd throw that in there.
01:37:51.289 --> 01:37:55.130
But they were, Guam is a great place. It's beautiful.
01:37:55.590 --> 01:38:01.430
It's a great place. I have a pic, I think it's
01:38:01.430 --> 01:38:04.090
someplace in there. I have a picture of the last
01:38:04.090 --> 01:38:11.090
PBY that left Guam before it was captured by
01:38:11.090 --> 01:38:16.270
the Japanese in 1941 on it. They had one, the
01:38:16.270 --> 01:38:20.609
last PBY that left was full. I have a picture.
01:38:20.770 --> 01:38:29.090
And one of the lady's parents that my wife had
01:38:29.090 --> 01:38:35.270
gone to school with in Westport, Oregon, her
01:38:35.270 --> 01:38:43.489
mother's parents were on that plane. as it left
01:38:43.489 --> 01:38:49.350
Argana. So, that was fun. That's amazing. So,
01:38:49.390 --> 01:38:51.430
I mean, you've obviously told us a lot about
01:38:51.430 --> 01:38:54.090
the time in Guam, the book details, a lot more
01:38:54.090 --> 01:38:57.079
of, you know, the different... moments that you
01:38:57.079 --> 01:38:59.479
have when it came to combat i would love to just
01:38:59.479 --> 01:39:02.880
bring you into iwajima so then we can then transition
01:39:02.880 --> 01:39:05.800
to you know your your transition out of the military
01:39:05.800 --> 01:39:08.460
but obviously that's a very famous conflict a
01:39:08.460 --> 01:39:10.699
very different landscape than the jungles that
01:39:10.699 --> 01:39:14.119
you're used to in guam so talk to me about the
01:39:14.119 --> 01:39:17.479
the iwajima attack and then you know we'll work
01:39:17.479 --> 01:39:22.199
on from there on guam we've trained we were training
01:39:22.199 --> 01:39:28.670
again for uh a different kind of action than
01:39:28.670 --> 01:39:32.689
we have been faced before. Before we were in
01:39:32.689 --> 01:39:37.829
Guadalcanal, we were in deep jungle. And then
01:39:37.829 --> 01:39:43.489
on over to Guam, we're in farmland and jungle.
01:39:44.149 --> 01:39:51.850
And then we were training for hills and... caves
01:39:51.850 --> 01:39:54.109
and stuff like that of which we had never been
01:39:54.109 --> 01:39:58.550
trained before and So we all felt that that was
01:39:58.550 --> 01:40:03.590
going to be different On it, but anyway on February
01:40:03.590 --> 01:40:13.630
the February 1945 We left we left Guam as a unit
01:40:13.630 --> 01:40:28.180
The 4th and 5th Division left Guadalcanal, Guam,
01:40:28.199 --> 01:40:33.859
and Saipan. The 21st Marines, which I was a member
01:40:33.859 --> 01:40:39.800
of the 21st Marines, of the 3rd Division were
01:40:39.800 --> 01:40:48.699
backup reserve for the landing on Iwo Jima. We
01:40:48.699 --> 01:40:59.239
were, they, the generals, that'll put me in the
01:40:59.239 --> 01:41:03.760
right connection, I think. The generals thought
01:41:03.760 --> 01:41:09.560
that, were thinking that we were going to have
01:41:09.560 --> 01:41:17.760
a heavy casualty going on in Iwo Jima. and they
01:41:17.760 --> 01:41:27.100
wanted a regiment on the water. They called them
01:41:27.100 --> 01:41:33.819
Floating Reserve because to put forth another
01:41:33.819 --> 01:41:37.819
regiment, they wanted them right then. They didn't
01:41:37.819 --> 01:41:40.800
want to wait to come from Saipan or something.
01:41:40.960 --> 01:41:43.819
It took a couple of days or something. They want
01:41:43.819 --> 01:41:47.550
a reserve. They want them now. So they had the
01:41:47.550 --> 01:41:54.750
21st Marines in the harbor waiting to go shore.
01:41:55.170 --> 01:41:59.989
On February the 19th, the 3rd and 4th Division
01:41:59.989 --> 01:42:07.350
landed on Iwo Jima. On that date, we were 50
01:42:07.350 --> 01:42:14.449
miles away from Iwo Jima heading. toward, when
01:42:14.449 --> 01:42:19.510
I say we, the 21st Marines were 50 miles away
01:42:19.510 --> 01:42:21.850
from the Iwo Jima harbor where we were supposed
01:42:21.850 --> 01:42:30.189
to be. And we got word aboard ship at that time
01:42:30.189 --> 01:42:37.310
that there was hardly any action at all on landing
01:42:37.310 --> 01:42:44.779
at Iwo Jima. And that the They were had expected
01:42:44.779 --> 01:42:52.739
heavy casualty load at that time and It didn't
01:42:52.739 --> 01:42:59.119
happen and then until after the third the third
01:42:59.119 --> 01:43:04.560
the fourth fourth and fifth division the fifth
01:43:04.560 --> 01:43:10.140
division went straight for Mount Suribachi and
01:43:10.140 --> 01:43:14.800
they went above the started up the mountain.
01:43:14.859 --> 01:43:20.520
Mount Suribachi is an extinct volcano. And it
01:43:20.520 --> 01:43:25.279
has lava holes, lava caves, and all the way up
01:43:25.279 --> 01:43:29.659
the mountain, to the top of the mountain. And
01:43:29.659 --> 01:43:38.520
the fourth divisions were assigned the first
01:43:38.520 --> 01:43:43.340
airport, first airfield, which was The closest
01:43:43.340 --> 01:43:48.279
one toward Mount Suribachi. They started and
01:43:48.279 --> 01:43:51.140
started toward, now I can't remember if that
01:43:51.140 --> 01:43:56.460
was north or south on the other end, toward the
01:43:56.460 --> 01:44:02.380
other airfields. But the 5th Division started,
01:44:02.699 --> 01:44:07.479
the 28th Marines of the 5th Division started
01:44:07.479 --> 01:44:15.960
up the mountain on it. And the 4th Division started,
01:44:16.420 --> 01:44:22.840
let's say, south. I don't know if that was the
01:44:22.840 --> 01:44:31.119
direction or not. And to drive the Japanese from
01:44:31.119 --> 01:44:34.439
there. And that cut off the Japanese between
01:44:34.439 --> 01:44:41.109
the airport airfield and... the Mount Suribachi.
01:44:42.449 --> 01:44:46.390
Part of the 4th came in on the other side of
01:44:46.390 --> 01:44:52.329
the island to meet the 4th Division. During that
01:44:52.329 --> 01:44:59.909
day of February the 19th, the 21st Marines came
01:44:59.909 --> 01:45:08.590
in on the USS Jackson. We came in into Iwo Jima
01:45:08.590 --> 01:45:16.149
Harbor. At that time, all hell broke out of the
01:45:16.149 --> 01:45:21.189
mountain. The Japanese figured that they were
01:45:21.189 --> 01:45:28.149
all on shore and in the places that they had
01:45:28.149 --> 01:45:31.329
marked. The Japanese had just about every square
01:45:31.329 --> 01:45:35.989
inch of that landing zone marked, and their mortars
01:45:35.989 --> 01:45:41.699
pep in. firing the mortars as the rest of the
01:45:41.699 --> 01:45:46.880
units were coming in. And I'll tell you right
01:45:46.880 --> 01:45:53.579
now, the Seabees, this is the first battle that
01:45:53.579 --> 01:45:58.819
the Seabees have ever been with the landing force
01:45:58.819 --> 01:46:06.039
that came in on the initial. Normally, the Seabees
01:46:06.039 --> 01:46:13.449
were came in maybe the next day or so after it
01:46:13.449 --> 01:46:18.149
had been more secured, landing zone would be
01:46:18.149 --> 01:46:21.529
more secured. But this time they came in right
01:46:21.529 --> 01:46:30.250
with the 4th Division on it, most of them on
01:46:30.250 --> 01:46:36.760
it. had mortars all over that place, all over
01:46:36.760 --> 01:46:44.479
the lower end of this Mount Suribachi. And they
01:46:44.479 --> 01:46:50.899
shelled all of those square inches, I will say,
01:46:51.039 --> 01:46:57.260
along that island. And it was, you just couldn't.
01:46:59.340 --> 01:47:01.840
You can't imagine the number of people that were
01:47:01.840 --> 01:47:07.319
killed right there. Thousands right there on
01:47:07.319 --> 01:47:09.819
the beach, on the landing beach of the 4th and
01:47:09.819 --> 01:47:15.260
5th. It seems like the limbs were one of the
01:47:15.260 --> 01:47:20.960
biggest things. On arm, leg, knees, legs were
01:47:20.960 --> 01:47:27.920
just scattered all over the place. Heads. It
01:47:27.920 --> 01:47:33.380
was just scattered all over the place. The 4th
01:47:33.380 --> 01:47:40.960
Division were chasing the main group north or
01:47:40.960 --> 01:47:46.880
south on the line. I just don't remember that.
01:47:49.979 --> 01:47:55.420
The 5th Division was doing the same over there.
01:47:56.329 --> 01:48:02.170
They were shoving over toward the 4th Division.
01:48:02.890 --> 01:48:06.130
They were splitting up the Japanese. And the
01:48:06.130 --> 01:48:11.850
28th Marines had a real tough time going up that
01:48:11.850 --> 01:48:23.149
hill. And I talked to one of the pilots from
01:48:23.149 --> 01:48:27.130
one of the aircraft carriers. that was on Iwo
01:48:27.130 --> 01:48:34.270
Jima and he said when they made their final when
01:48:34.270 --> 01:48:43.289
they made their pass over the landing zone that
01:48:43.289 --> 01:48:50.710
it looked like a bunch of ants just full of dead
01:48:50.710 --> 01:48:58.460
bodies and stuff and then We stayed there. That
01:48:58.460 --> 01:49:02.760
was on the 19th, the evening of the 19th on it.
01:49:03.460 --> 01:49:09.340
And we were called. The 21st was on floating
01:49:09.340 --> 01:49:13.479
reserve. And we were called on the next day,
01:49:13.560 --> 01:49:18.579
the 20th. I can't remember the commander's general
01:49:18.579 --> 01:49:22.420
now. I can't remember who it was. He gave us
01:49:22.420 --> 01:49:27.260
the word. to depart from the ship and get on
01:49:27.260 --> 01:49:33.979
your get on the uh on the lcis and ldc it gave
01:49:33.979 --> 01:49:38.140
the word to go overside so we went over the side
01:49:38.140 --> 01:49:42.680
and climbed down the ropes onto our uh on our
01:49:42.680 --> 01:49:50.699
perspective uh landing barge landing craft and
01:49:50.699 --> 01:49:56.239
uh started a rendezvous around the ship. Our
01:49:56.239 --> 01:50:03.399
ship was USS Jackson and we waited and we circled
01:50:03.399 --> 01:50:11.460
our ship for six hours trying to get organized
01:50:11.460 --> 01:50:18.260
to go ashore and surf was up. He said six foot
01:50:18.260 --> 01:50:25.180
surf but I don't know about how they judge that,
01:50:25.319 --> 01:50:30.340
but anyway, we're waiting for the beach master
01:50:30.340 --> 01:50:35.399
to give us the word that they had room for us.
01:50:35.399 --> 01:50:39.739
They didn't have room for us on the landing zone.
01:50:41.619 --> 01:50:48.460
All the tanks that were disabled, all the the
01:50:48.460 --> 01:51:00.210
LCIs, landing ship infantry were crashed, blown
01:51:00.210 --> 01:51:03.529
up, decided they had just all kinds of equipment.
01:51:04.350 --> 01:51:11.329
Men were lined around like in pieces all over.
01:51:11.569 --> 01:51:20.369
They had graveyard people with gunny sacks picking
01:51:20.369 --> 01:51:31.329
up the the arms and legs and whatever. And they
01:51:31.329 --> 01:51:36.289
said that we couldn't land. The beach captain
01:51:36.289 --> 01:51:40.409
told us that he wasn't going to allow us to land.
01:51:41.609 --> 01:51:46.989
So our general says, go back aboard ship. So
01:51:46.989 --> 01:51:50.430
after we've been floating around on the ship,
01:51:50.920 --> 01:51:55.479
round and round and round the ship for six hours
01:51:55.479 --> 01:51:58.800
and it's hard to serve and we got back had to
01:51:58.800 --> 01:52:02.319
go back and climbed up the ladder that uh rope
01:52:02.319 --> 01:52:06.539
ladder again hit back aboard ship i got aboard
01:52:06.539 --> 01:52:10.579
ship on it and that was with the 21st Marines
01:52:10.579 --> 01:52:18.680
on the 20th and the ship's uh cook had sandwiches
01:52:19.470 --> 01:52:23.829
and coffee all ready for us and we hid and they
01:52:23.829 --> 01:52:28.710
gave us that we had no wounded or anything coming
01:52:28.710 --> 01:52:33.210
back aboard ship we were full of force for the
01:52:33.210 --> 01:52:37.289
20th and the night of the 20th morning of the
01:52:37.289 --> 01:52:44.409
21st we had uh we got the word to debark from
01:52:44.409 --> 01:52:53.340
the ship again so uh We got off the ship and
01:52:53.340 --> 01:52:57.439
headed in toward the night on it. Me and my crew
01:52:57.439 --> 01:53:05.359
were on a Amtrak on it. And we came in and we
01:53:05.359 --> 01:53:13.399
landed on part of the Yellow Beach on it. And
01:53:13.399 --> 01:53:18.000
right by the... I can never remember that name.
01:53:21.460 --> 01:53:27.539
Well, it's where the Japanese shipped out their
01:53:27.539 --> 01:53:43.010
salt and stuff off of the island on it. Anyway,
01:53:43.189 --> 01:53:47.510
I never can remember that name of that harbor.
01:53:48.590 --> 01:53:55.470
Anyway, we came in, and as we came in, we were
01:53:55.470 --> 01:54:01.229
supposed to meet the 4th Division at 10 o 'clock
01:54:01.229 --> 01:54:09.989
that morning on the 21st. We were held up. Now,
01:54:10.050 --> 01:54:14.350
4th Division had... pushed the Japanese off of
01:54:14.350 --> 01:54:20.090
airfield number one and pushed them. I'm going
01:54:20.090 --> 01:54:22.270
to get south or north. I'm going to push them
01:54:22.270 --> 01:54:24.409
away from it toward the other end of the island.
01:54:24.449 --> 01:54:27.090
I'll put it because I can't remember the direction.
01:54:30.729 --> 01:54:39.090
We hit the beach and the Amtrak crawled up on
01:54:39.090 --> 01:54:43.449
the beach about 20, I would say about 20 yards
01:54:43.449 --> 01:54:52.189
and like that. And we got, they opened fire on
01:54:52.189 --> 01:55:00.430
us from the rock prairie, prairie there. And
01:55:00.430 --> 01:55:04.909
machine gun on us as well as the rest of them.
01:55:04.989 --> 01:55:13.779
And we jumped off of the the Amtrak, and we had
01:55:13.779 --> 01:55:19.180
seven men at that time, and I lost two of them.
01:55:20.300 --> 01:55:27.159
Me and my other guys went off on one side of
01:55:27.159 --> 01:55:31.260
the, on the port side, and two of my men got
01:55:31.260 --> 01:55:34.119
off on the starboard side with their boats on
01:55:34.119 --> 01:55:37.899
it, and the starboard side, that's where the
01:55:38.670 --> 01:55:44.229
I forgot that name again. Get that back. Anyway,
01:55:44.470 --> 01:55:48.130
our machine gun was stationed up there and killed
01:55:48.130 --> 01:55:53.449
two of my guys there on it, as well as more of
01:55:53.449 --> 01:55:57.289
them. We lost a lot of men coming in on that
01:55:57.289 --> 01:56:05.189
particular area. And we were pinned down as we
01:56:05.189 --> 01:56:14.300
came in. The 4th Division at that time had gone
01:56:14.300 --> 01:56:21.100
clear through Airfield 101 and were waiting at
01:56:21.100 --> 01:56:29.899
the beginning on the morning of the 21st. That's
01:56:29.899 --> 01:56:35.840
when we were supposed to meet the 4th Division.
01:56:37.569 --> 01:56:41.569
relieve them because they had been fighting for
01:56:41.569 --> 01:56:51.630
two days, the 19th and 20th. And so, but we couldn't
01:56:51.630 --> 01:56:57.850
make it because we were held down as well. And
01:56:57.850 --> 01:57:00.289
we were supposed to be there at 10 o 'clock.
01:57:00.430 --> 01:57:04.529
Well, we couldn't make it. We stayed there that
01:57:04.529 --> 01:57:08.810
night. in that area, and we finally mopped up
01:57:08.810 --> 01:57:12.369
those machine guns at the quarry, I remember
01:57:12.369 --> 01:57:18.970
that now, at the rock quarry, and we were supposed
01:57:18.970 --> 01:57:24.770
to meet then the following day, and we got pinned
01:57:24.770 --> 01:57:33.949
down. Well, it so happened that the 4th Division
01:57:34.960 --> 01:57:38.979
had been waiting for us at the beginning of airfield
01:57:38.979 --> 01:57:42.140
number two, and that's where we were supposed
01:57:42.140 --> 01:57:50.520
to relieve them on it. Someone told a runner
01:57:50.520 --> 01:57:57.020
or a radio, or what, told the commanding officer
01:57:57.020 --> 01:58:04.619
of the 4th Division that overall by... near one,
01:58:04.840 --> 01:58:13.380
that the Japanese were farming in airfield number
01:58:13.380 --> 01:58:18.640
two and was working their way around between
01:58:18.640 --> 01:58:25.279
us and the fourth division. The 21st Marines
01:58:25.279 --> 01:58:30.619
Regiment was by the rock prairie there by the
01:58:30.619 --> 01:58:35.699
beach. The Japanese were going to work around
01:58:35.699 --> 01:58:40.260
and come in behind the 4th Division. Well, it
01:58:40.260 --> 01:58:45.359
sure had happened that they didn't realize that
01:58:45.359 --> 01:58:49.439
we were coming in from the beach at that time.
01:58:50.560 --> 01:58:53.800
But the Japs were trying to sneak in behind the
01:58:53.800 --> 01:58:56.939
4th Division, and they couldn't make it. Because
01:58:56.939 --> 01:59:00.720
when they came up between us, then we pinned
01:59:00.720 --> 01:59:04.220
them down. So now we had a whole bunch of Japs
01:59:04.220 --> 01:59:09.399
between us. So the 4th Division just turned around
01:59:09.399 --> 01:59:11.359
and started shooting them, and we shot them from
01:59:11.359 --> 01:59:15.380
behind. So we wiped the whole bunch out right
01:59:15.380 --> 01:59:18.539
there at the beginning. We finally went up to,
01:59:18.600 --> 01:59:23.800
got them, and we went to, through, met the 4th
01:59:23.800 --> 01:59:26.560
Division at the beginning of the airfield number
01:59:26.560 --> 01:59:33.560
2. We fought. We went through them and left them
01:59:33.560 --> 01:59:37.619
at the beginning of the airfield and the 21st
01:59:37.619 --> 01:59:43.100
Marine Regiment started to take airfield number
01:59:43.100 --> 01:59:47.260
two. All those Japanese that they had chased
01:59:47.260 --> 01:59:51.960
from airfield number two, which was right down
01:59:51.960 --> 02:00:01.090
by the Mount Suribachi, they were all... uh all
02:00:01.090 --> 02:00:04.289
holed up there on airfield number two and we
02:00:04.289 --> 02:00:09.689
ran into them like that and we had one hell of
02:00:09.689 --> 02:00:16.850
a fight there and they turned the mortars that
02:00:16.850 --> 02:00:24.470
were on wheels toward us and fought and fired
02:00:24.470 --> 02:00:29.760
those right down you know four or five feet up
02:00:29.760 --> 02:00:36.100
off the ground on it, as if they were rifles.
02:00:37.600 --> 02:00:43.460
And as I say, lame as you flew. But we finally
02:00:43.460 --> 02:00:48.159
got through that bunch on it. On the second,
02:00:48.380 --> 02:00:53.399
we fought all day, we fought all night. And the
02:00:53.399 --> 02:00:57.460
second day, I think it was the second day, I
02:00:57.460 --> 02:01:00.300
got hit in the head with a piece of, either by
02:01:00.300 --> 02:01:04.579
a shell or by a bullet, I don't know which one.
02:01:04.819 --> 02:01:09.300
He hit my helmet and knocked me out, knocked
02:01:09.300 --> 02:01:12.520
my helmet off, cut a big hole in it. And I was
02:01:12.520 --> 02:01:19.619
out. And we got, the rest of the 21st kept going
02:01:19.619 --> 02:01:25.520
through. My guys, I lost all of them there, all
02:01:25.520 --> 02:01:33.930
but two. on that fight. And we got hours out
02:01:33.930 --> 02:01:37.930
and some guy from the 4th Division came up behind
02:01:37.930 --> 02:01:41.449
me and shook my back. I think he was trying to
02:01:41.449 --> 02:01:44.170
get my knife was what he was trying to do. But
02:01:44.170 --> 02:01:50.750
anyway, and that woke me up. And then from then
02:01:50.750 --> 02:01:55.989
on I was working with the 4th Division because
02:01:56.520 --> 02:01:59.739
My third division had already, the 21st police
02:01:59.739 --> 02:02:05.199
had already gone through the rest of them. And
02:02:05.199 --> 02:02:09.840
I finally, he asked me where I was from, and
02:02:09.840 --> 02:02:11.239
I told him I wasn't part of Washington. He said,
02:02:11.260 --> 02:02:15.060
well, they're way up ahead of us on it. They've
02:02:15.060 --> 02:02:20.680
already gone through. So we got on up there.
02:02:21.159 --> 02:02:25.850
It took us five days to go through. Airfield
02:02:25.850 --> 02:02:32.869
number two. At day and night. Day and night.
02:02:34.390 --> 02:02:39.630
We were airdropped food. Corsairs, I think they
02:02:39.630 --> 02:02:43.710
were. I think they were corsairs that did that.
02:02:44.210 --> 02:02:49.869
And we got over to on the other side of airfield
02:02:49.869 --> 02:02:56.600
number two. And By that time I had found another
02:02:56.600 --> 02:03:05.460
helmet and I was in pretty well the headache
02:03:05.460 --> 02:03:12.479
and got over there on the other side of airfield
02:03:12.479 --> 02:03:21.020
number two and they have a sulfur plant and a
02:03:21.020 --> 02:03:26.050
sulfur field over there. The Japs had used the
02:03:26.050 --> 02:03:29.890
sulfur for other reasons, other things, I guess.
02:03:30.069 --> 02:03:34.510
And then they went to, they used to go out through
02:03:34.510 --> 02:03:39.369
the quarry. And that's where they shipped it
02:03:39.369 --> 02:03:44.069
from. That's where we came in. We got over there
02:03:44.069 --> 02:03:48.310
on that side. I asked if anybody knew where the
02:03:48.310 --> 02:03:51.770
21st Marines were. And he says, well, we saw
02:03:51.770 --> 02:03:55.220
two guys. uh he thought that they were they were
02:03:55.220 --> 02:03:58.720
strangers and so i went over there and that was
02:03:58.720 --> 02:04:07.020
my barman and my uh scout and then that was me
02:04:07.020 --> 02:04:10.680
then so there's only three of us left out of
02:04:10.680 --> 02:04:17.340
the seven uh they were uh we had no more company
02:04:17.340 --> 02:04:22.699
it wiped them out and uh Yeah, just the three.
02:04:25.140 --> 02:04:30.760
So we're staying down there in Siegfried's 27th,
02:04:30.800 --> 02:04:35.899
28th, 27th or 28th in that area. 27th, I think
02:04:35.899 --> 02:04:43.239
it was. Some general came by and the three were
02:04:43.239 --> 02:04:48.800
huddled in one big shell. He asked us where we
02:04:48.800 --> 02:04:56.800
were from. And I said that we're the 21st Marine,
02:04:56.899 --> 02:05:01.319
3rd Division, and he says, well, they're not
02:05:01.319 --> 02:05:06.659
here. And I don't know where they are. He says,
02:05:06.659 --> 02:05:08.779
but you're going to be in the 4th Division now.
02:05:09.800 --> 02:05:12.100
And so we finished up. He says, we've got to
02:05:12.100 --> 02:05:15.979
take those two radio stations out and go through
02:05:15.979 --> 02:05:24.119
Moriyama Airfield. village, Yodamayam Village.
02:05:24.800 --> 02:05:31.100
So we went to, followed him up through the, he
02:05:31.100 --> 02:05:36.020
and his, I think he was a gunny soldier. Anyway,
02:05:36.180 --> 02:05:39.659
he was out there with them, and they were gathering
02:05:39.659 --> 02:05:43.140
up the men that had just gone through the second
02:05:43.140 --> 02:05:50.310
airfield. And we took off from there. We followed
02:05:50.310 --> 02:05:54.090
the 4th Division then, the three of us, over
02:05:54.090 --> 02:06:01.770
to Motoyama Village, to the Motoyama Village,
02:06:01.890 --> 02:06:05.229
which is on the side of airfield number 2, then
02:06:05.229 --> 02:06:09.050
went from there to the radio station, knocked
02:06:09.050 --> 02:06:12.670
it out, and then we started running over from
02:06:12.670 --> 02:06:20.520
airfield number, from Hill 362. I think that
02:06:20.520 --> 02:06:31.020
was on the 27th, 28th, 27th, I think it was.
02:06:31.880 --> 02:06:35.260
And it took us two days to get through those.
02:06:36.380 --> 02:06:42.479
And then we headed toward 362. We got pinned
02:06:42.479 --> 02:06:49.880
down on 362 for two days. uh 362 was one day
02:06:49.880 --> 02:06:56.979
and we left that morning on uh on the first of
02:06:56.979 --> 02:07:03.560
march i'm getting the dates uh pasta day someplace
02:07:03.560 --> 02:07:10.020
first of march and it took us two days uh and
02:07:10.020 --> 02:07:18.739
then we went over to uh uh to hill 380. 382.
02:07:18.739 --> 02:07:23.960
Now 382 is the second highest peak on Iwo Jima
02:07:23.960 --> 02:07:30.359
and Mount Suribachi was the highest peak and
02:07:30.359 --> 02:07:37.840
382 was designated and it was the second highest
02:07:37.840 --> 02:07:41.800
on it and they wanted us to have high ground
02:07:41.800 --> 02:07:48.180
so we tried to go high ground. They had only
02:07:48.180 --> 02:07:53.539
one place that we could go through on 382, was
02:07:53.539 --> 02:08:02.439
up between two big rocks and stone caves. And
02:08:02.439 --> 02:08:11.720
then we got into where there was a... We'd get
02:08:11.720 --> 02:08:15.699
up... uh over started to go over the hill and
02:08:15.699 --> 02:08:22.020
then the japanese would uh had two pill boxes
02:08:22.020 --> 02:08:27.760
up there and they were knocking us down every
02:08:27.760 --> 02:08:34.159
time and uh with hand grenades and and mortars
02:08:34.159 --> 02:08:38.340
go out and pull us knocked us down again and
02:08:38.340 --> 02:08:43.149
we go back down and reorganize and go up again.
02:08:43.890 --> 02:08:51.909
We kept that up for two days. And finally on
02:08:51.909 --> 02:08:57.029
March the 3rd, they sent us up and they used
02:08:57.029 --> 02:09:01.270
my scout as the first one. He was the first one
02:09:01.270 --> 02:09:03.630
to go up over the hill between these two big
02:09:03.630 --> 02:09:09.989
rocks. That's how we were going to take it. He
02:09:09.989 --> 02:09:14.289
went up over the hill and got up there and looked
02:09:14.289 --> 02:09:18.750
around and he went on down. Then I followed the
02:09:18.750 --> 02:09:24.109
scout and I got up there on top of the hill.
02:09:24.590 --> 02:09:27.970
I looked around like that and then the damn machine
02:09:27.970 --> 02:09:36.470
gun opened up from the shell, one of the pillboxes.
02:09:40.300 --> 02:09:45.960
He sprayed my chest. That was a Nambu 25. He
02:09:45.960 --> 02:09:51.699
sprayed my chest and arm. And I fell down and
02:09:51.699 --> 02:10:01.180
then I was bleeding like a stuck pig. And the
02:10:01.180 --> 02:10:09.239
corpsman and my VAR man came up, got a hold of
02:10:09.239 --> 02:10:14.920
my feet. And they pulled me back down into a
02:10:14.920 --> 02:10:20.479
big shell hole. And then Corbin started treating
02:10:20.479 --> 02:10:29.159
me. And then McCoy, the airman, came up. He went
02:10:29.159 --> 02:10:35.899
out, got all the same stuff. And he went right
02:10:35.899 --> 02:10:40.859
over to that pillbox. He cleaned the pillbox
02:10:40.859 --> 02:10:44.960
out. They killed him. He had four people in there,
02:10:45.020 --> 02:10:49.279
and he had two machine guns on him. And he got
02:10:49.279 --> 02:10:55.920
them, cleaned them all out. I was in the shell
02:10:55.920 --> 02:10:59.340
hole. They were still operating. Not operating,
02:10:59.420 --> 02:11:06.239
they were still fixing me up. And then pretty
02:11:06.239 --> 02:11:15.020
soon, McCoy came down, and he was bleeding all
02:11:15.020 --> 02:11:19.340
over his back on it. They threw a hand grenade
02:11:19.340 --> 02:11:21.840
right behind him, and it blew up and blew in
02:11:21.840 --> 02:11:26.199
the rocks and stuff, and the pieces of shell
02:11:26.199 --> 02:11:32.500
and rock, stones, went all through his back.
02:11:33.399 --> 02:11:40.199
He was just peckered. holes all through his back
02:11:40.199 --> 02:11:46.399
when you were bleeding. And he came down the
02:11:46.399 --> 02:11:53.319
shell hole with me. And I stayed there. The corpsman
02:11:53.319 --> 02:12:02.020
had put a tag on me with where I was shot and
02:12:02.020 --> 02:12:07.739
what I was doing there. what treatment he did,
02:12:07.859 --> 02:12:12.260
and he put that all on a tag and he pinned it
02:12:12.260 --> 02:12:18.819
to my blouse, upper blouse by my neck. And pretty
02:12:18.819 --> 02:12:23.260
soon the machine, the mortars started falling
02:12:23.260 --> 02:12:28.399
in the shell hole where we were on it. And he
02:12:28.399 --> 02:12:35.380
says, can you walk right? I said, sure the hell
02:12:35.380 --> 02:12:40.279
can. He said, well, let's go. We couldn't get
02:12:40.279 --> 02:12:44.119
anybody, any stretcher bearers up there because
02:12:44.119 --> 02:12:48.000
it was too dangerous right then at that time.
02:12:48.079 --> 02:12:51.800
They were shooting one of the stretcher bearers
02:12:51.800 --> 02:12:56.359
and then they wouldn't have anybody to carry
02:12:56.359 --> 02:13:00.680
it anyway. So we just started, we started back.
02:13:04.130 --> 02:13:10.989
And I have, I grabbed hold of his arm and he
02:13:10.989 --> 02:13:18.670
grabbed, and he gave one of the guys his, his
02:13:18.670 --> 02:13:23.750
BAR, because they didn't want to get that kind
02:13:23.750 --> 02:13:27.670
of firepower right in the front. And he had the
02:13:27.670 --> 02:13:38.619
BAR. And I gave my rifle to, I think it was,
02:13:38.659 --> 02:13:45.819
to him for protection. So we started walking
02:13:45.819 --> 02:13:51.079
back and we were about a mile and a half, maybe
02:13:51.079 --> 02:14:00.119
a mile from the beach where we were to be evacuated
02:14:00.119 --> 02:14:04.000
off of. off the island we were walking together
02:14:04.000 --> 02:14:09.779
along along the side of airfield number two and
02:14:09.779 --> 02:14:12.699
the guys were still walking mopping up there
02:14:12.699 --> 02:14:18.199
and a b -29 came down we're just trying to land
02:14:18.199 --> 02:14:20.479
right there on that and all those in the are
02:14:20.479 --> 02:14:25.340
big when they're you know 15 20 feet off the
02:14:25.340 --> 02:14:30.500
ground they are big and he was looking for a
02:14:30.500 --> 02:14:33.159
place to land but there was just no place to
02:14:33.159 --> 02:14:38.340
land there on number two. So he kept on going
02:14:38.340 --> 02:14:42.239
and he got into our field number one. Number
02:14:42.239 --> 02:14:47.579
one was by that time the Seabees had finished
02:14:47.579 --> 02:14:50.699
their tractor work and had been cleaning up a
02:14:50.699 --> 02:14:59.510
good landing site for the Corsairs and fighter
02:14:59.510 --> 02:15:05.270
planes had landed down there already and had
02:15:05.270 --> 02:15:09.369
a good laying field. I knew that they could have
02:15:09.369 --> 02:15:17.510
landed there pretty good. So the B -29, the Corsairs
02:15:17.510 --> 02:15:23.250
took off for another run someplace and then the
02:15:23.250 --> 02:15:26.970
B -29 came in and landed and I think I was the
02:15:26.970 --> 02:15:33.880
first. B -29 to land on AWOL and that was, that's
02:15:33.880 --> 02:15:36.180
what we were fighting for. We were fighting to
02:15:36.180 --> 02:15:41.000
get those fields clear enough so that they could,
02:15:41.079 --> 02:15:49.340
so that the fighters could escort the 29s when
02:15:49.340 --> 02:15:56.439
they were flying over to Japan and bomb them.
02:15:57.289 --> 02:16:02.069
So they were using the airfields already for
02:16:02.069 --> 02:16:08.670
that purpose and saving them. I stayed with McCoy
02:16:08.670 --> 02:16:13.609
there. When we got over to the airfield number
02:16:13.609 --> 02:16:26.640
one, the evacuation for the wounded were just
02:16:26.640 --> 02:16:32.579
off to the side of airfield number one, and they
02:16:32.579 --> 02:16:37.159
were waiting for pickup from different kinds
02:16:37.159 --> 02:16:39.479
of transportation going out to the hospital ships.
02:16:40.620 --> 02:16:43.079
They stayed on the hospital, they stayed there.
02:16:43.340 --> 02:16:48.620
I stayed there with McCoy, and I was laying on
02:16:48.620 --> 02:16:51.719
my stomach, and I was laying on my back, and
02:16:51.719 --> 02:16:55.059
he was laying on his stomach. We're having a
02:16:55.059 --> 02:17:04.000
cigarette and talking and visiting. I turned
02:17:04.000 --> 02:17:11.040
up and looked at McCoy. And he says, I'm going
02:17:11.040 --> 02:17:14.739
to take off. He says, this one has got ambulatories.
02:17:15.860 --> 02:17:21.799
So I said, OK. So we shook hands and thanked
02:17:21.799 --> 02:17:29.930
for it. being with each other and company. And
02:17:29.930 --> 02:17:32.569
he walked off and walked all over, went to his
02:17:32.569 --> 02:17:40.229
LST, got on that. That was the last I saw a car
02:17:40.229 --> 02:17:45.649
on it. And I think he got through the war okay.
02:17:47.790 --> 02:17:55.340
And I had asked him how. Navarro, our scout,
02:17:55.620 --> 02:17:59.079
he said he didn't know for sure. He says, last
02:17:59.079 --> 02:18:04.920
I saw, he was shooting and running toward a couple
02:18:04.920 --> 02:18:08.379
of pillboxes out there. He said he didn't know.
02:18:08.479 --> 02:18:12.059
By that time, he said I'd been hit. So I don't
02:18:12.059 --> 02:18:18.540
know what happened to Navarro and McCoy. And
02:18:18.540 --> 02:18:23.819
I were the only ones out of K Company that we
02:18:23.819 --> 02:18:31.280
ever found. Until we got, until I got to the
02:18:31.280 --> 02:18:41.020
Stockton Marine Corps Club and met Ted Salisbury.
02:18:42.520 --> 02:18:46.979
And he was on, he and I were in the same company.
02:18:48.079 --> 02:18:51.940
And he thought he was the last one. Because he
02:18:51.940 --> 02:18:55.739
hadn't met anybody at all. And maybe I hadn't
02:18:55.739 --> 02:18:58.540
seen him either. Met a lot of them out there.
02:18:58.639 --> 02:19:03.920
But wounded it. I couldn't tell. So they transferred
02:19:03.920 --> 02:19:08.120
me over to that. And I stayed on that. Went over
02:19:08.120 --> 02:19:13.379
on the hospital ship. And went from there to
02:19:13.379 --> 02:19:18.620
Saipan. Picked up another. bunch of going they're
02:19:18.620 --> 02:19:24.440
going toward the states and left Saipan went
02:19:24.440 --> 02:19:34.420
to uh the Johnson Island which is out by out
02:19:34.420 --> 02:19:43.940
near uh Pearl Harbor the Hawaiian Islands and
02:19:43.940 --> 02:19:54.420
uh landed there with a PBI and a corpsman came
02:19:54.420 --> 02:20:04.299
on board the plane and sprayed us with DDT. They
02:20:04.299 --> 02:20:14.680
didn't want us to spread any bugs on their beautiful
02:20:14.680 --> 02:20:23.370
island. Yeah. They cleaned us off there and took
02:20:23.370 --> 02:20:32.690
us over to the hospital. I can't remember the
02:20:32.690 --> 02:20:38.110
name. I think it was the Army Hospital. And I
02:20:38.110 --> 02:20:48.950
stayed there for a couple of days. And the doctor
02:20:48.950 --> 02:20:56.010
came by and looked at my tag. Well, first when
02:20:56.010 --> 02:21:06.190
we landed there at the main island, he looked
02:21:06.190 --> 02:21:09.770
at my tag and he talked me off to see what ward
02:21:09.770 --> 02:21:13.409
I should go to. And my tag said combat fatigue
02:21:13.409 --> 02:21:20.100
end. They put me in a combative ward on there.
02:21:20.239 --> 02:21:24.879
It had no nurses on there, no doctors on there,
02:21:24.959 --> 02:21:35.159
no nothing on there. And my bandage needed changed
02:21:35.159 --> 02:21:41.620
badly and cleaned it all and stuff. Doctor came
02:21:41.620 --> 02:21:45.639
through to to ask me what I was doing there.
02:21:45.799 --> 02:21:51.219
And I said, they put me here. And so he said
02:21:51.219 --> 02:21:53.979
to me, he says, oh, schedule this man for a tap.
02:21:55.280 --> 02:22:00.719
And so I said, well, at least I've got something
02:22:00.719 --> 02:22:05.299
going. So after he left, I asked the nurse, I
02:22:05.299 --> 02:22:08.600
said, well, what's a tap? He said, well, you're
02:22:08.600 --> 02:22:12.840
bleeding on the inside. And says, you've got
02:22:12.840 --> 02:22:16.600
blood on your chest cavity, and they have to
02:22:16.600 --> 02:22:19.680
get the chest, get the blood out. And says, they
02:22:19.680 --> 02:22:24.860
stick a needle in your back and drain it, drain
02:22:24.860 --> 02:22:36.420
it that way. I said, good Lord. So I went to
02:22:36.420 --> 02:22:42.270
bed that evening, and that night I... I woke
02:22:42.270 --> 02:22:45.409
up and I thought I'd wet the bed because I had
02:22:45.409 --> 02:22:53.770
peed all over the rubber mattress that they had
02:22:53.770 --> 02:23:00.770
there. And so I hollered for the nurse. The night
02:23:00.770 --> 02:23:05.170
nurse came over and she looked at me and asked
02:23:05.170 --> 02:23:08.610
what for. And I told her I had wet my bed, I
02:23:08.610 --> 02:23:10.579
think. because I sit down with this lady and
02:23:10.579 --> 02:23:16.159
a bunch of porn. She turned the nightlight on
02:23:16.159 --> 02:23:20.159
and she looked at me and turned it off right
02:23:20.159 --> 02:23:28.079
away and took off. And we came back with a couple
02:23:28.079 --> 02:23:34.139
other guys and turned the lights on like that
02:23:34.139 --> 02:23:36.860
and pulled the covers back and I'd been left
02:23:36.860 --> 02:23:40.979
in bed. Laying in the pool of blood because the
02:23:40.979 --> 02:23:48.159
bandage was off. I had rolled over on my left
02:23:48.159 --> 02:23:51.780
side, and all that blood that was in my chest
02:23:51.780 --> 02:23:56.719
came out and went all over, and that's what I
02:23:56.719 --> 02:24:00.239
was laying in. So you tapped yourself. And so,
02:24:00.260 --> 02:24:04.579
yeah. So they said, well, we'll have to cancel
02:24:04.579 --> 02:24:06.559
that. And I said, what? They said, cancel what?
02:24:06.950 --> 02:24:08.670
You're not going to have a tap tomorrow. Oh,
02:24:08.829 --> 02:24:18.069
thank God. Oh, I can remember that. I was happy.
02:24:19.290 --> 02:24:28.149
Anyway, the next day after they changed my bed
02:24:28.149 --> 02:24:30.950
and stuff like that, the next day they came over
02:24:30.950 --> 02:24:36.229
and they transferred me up to going to to the
02:24:36.229 --> 02:24:43.209
States. So I took, and I think, and I'm not for
02:24:43.209 --> 02:24:52.549
sure, I think I flew to the Naval Hospital landing,
02:24:52.809 --> 02:24:59.750
and I think it was a PBY, and I flew. I can't
02:24:59.750 --> 02:25:03.530
remember the ship at all, because I think that
02:25:03.530 --> 02:25:10.950
I flew in. I got in there and they looked at
02:25:10.950 --> 02:25:14.629
my tag and it said Combat Fatigue. And that's
02:25:14.629 --> 02:25:17.409
where I went. They took me in and put me in a
02:25:17.409 --> 02:25:24.290
Combat Fatigue ward. I told you that's what the
02:25:24.290 --> 02:25:31.290
story I had about Combat Fatigue and PTSD on
02:25:31.290 --> 02:25:35.750
it. The guy missed. diagnosed me on board ship
02:25:35.750 --> 02:25:40.250
because i had and because i had knocked his butt
02:25:40.250 --> 02:25:44.569
across the hall with uh when they were going
02:25:44.569 --> 02:25:49.729
to take my arm off i mean you were tired of being
02:25:49.729 --> 02:25:54.829
shot basically anyway that's where i got to put
02:25:54.829 --> 02:26:00.010
it first on it and uh and it's still got my it's
02:26:00.010 --> 02:26:04.200
it's in my records on it It's combat fatigue
02:26:04.200 --> 02:26:07.639
on the thing. It didn't say anything about my
02:26:07.639 --> 02:26:14.000
wounds at that time at all. Right. Anyway, I
02:26:14.000 --> 02:26:19.159
got into San Diego Hospital. And I stayed there
02:26:19.159 --> 02:26:24.100
for a month, I think. It was about a month. Then
02:26:24.100 --> 02:26:29.020
I got shipped home. I had a few instances in
02:26:29.020 --> 02:26:38.829
the hospital, but... And that got me home. I
02:26:38.829 --> 02:26:43.889
flew home. I got home from San Diego. I hitched
02:26:43.889 --> 02:26:54.450
a ride. Oh, a little aside. I had met my wife,
02:26:54.649 --> 02:27:00.290
my coming wife, honey, in Astoria, Oregon, when
02:27:00.290 --> 02:27:02.600
I was stationed at the second point. That's where
02:27:02.600 --> 02:27:10.739
I had met her. And her sister had married a Navy
02:27:10.739 --> 02:27:16.399
guy and they were stationed in San Diego. So
02:27:16.399 --> 02:27:27.760
I was able to sneak a way out of the hospital.
02:27:30.829 --> 02:27:36.489
got a cab and went over and met my future wife
02:27:36.489 --> 02:27:41.030
and her sister and her husband and stayed there
02:27:41.030 --> 02:27:43.709
that afternoon and the evening and then the first
02:27:43.709 --> 02:27:46.329
thing in the morning, well, I snuck back into
02:27:46.329 --> 02:27:58.190
the hospital. And I stayed there until I got
02:27:58.760 --> 02:28:02.940
And she came home, back home, to her Astoria
02:28:02.940 --> 02:28:11.180
home and graduated out of school. And I went
02:28:11.180 --> 02:28:22.319
to hospital and had a furlough transfer. That
02:28:22.319 --> 02:28:24.959
was the first furlough I had had in the Marine
02:28:24.959 --> 02:28:34.319
Corps. A day off, more than 72 hour pass in the
02:28:34.319 --> 02:28:46.159
four years. And then when I was overseas, they
02:28:46.159 --> 02:28:51.100
told me and the rest of the raiders, you're only
02:28:51.100 --> 02:28:54.979
required to be over there 12 months. That's all.
02:28:59.209 --> 02:29:02.409
Kid Buns came. We were all short -timers, we
02:29:02.409 --> 02:29:06.770
thought. But Marine Corps didn't think that.
02:29:07.610 --> 02:29:09.950
They said, no, it's going to be a year and a
02:29:09.950 --> 02:29:13.930
half before you can go home. Maybe a year and
02:29:13.930 --> 02:29:17.930
a half. No, it's duration. But we never did get
02:29:17.930 --> 02:29:21.010
a chance to get out off of there due to the turnover.
02:29:21.870 --> 02:29:28.079
Anyway, I got home on a leave transfer. And they
02:29:28.079 --> 02:29:30.940
had asked me where I wanted to go for my last
02:29:30.940 --> 02:29:34.559
six months in the service. And I said I wanted
02:29:34.559 --> 02:29:39.280
to go, I wanted to be a drill instructor at Parris
02:29:39.280 --> 02:29:42.000
Island. That's the closest to Arkansas that I
02:29:42.000 --> 02:29:51.399
can get. So I caught a train, I think it was,
02:29:51.520 --> 02:29:58.430
to Kansas City. I think that's where it was.
02:29:59.350 --> 02:30:03.350
And then, no, it was just the opposite. I got
02:30:03.350 --> 02:30:09.989
one from San Diego to Kansas City on a plane.
02:30:10.450 --> 02:30:14.549
I set it on boxes to get out. It was a military
02:30:14.549 --> 02:30:22.170
plane. And I got it in Kansas City. Then I took
02:30:22.170 --> 02:30:28.120
a train down. to arkansas met my folks and i
02:30:28.120 --> 02:30:34.360
stayed there until i was ready for my leave to
02:30:34.360 --> 02:30:37.860
be up i transferred then i transferred over to
02:30:37.860 --> 02:30:46.760
uh um to paris island as a drill instructor until
02:30:46.760 --> 02:30:51.899
my district so what i'm sorry frank i didn't
02:30:51.899 --> 02:30:53.620
mean to i was just going to say what what was
02:30:53.620 --> 02:30:55.920
it like because Up to that point, you'd seen
02:30:55.920 --> 02:30:59.500
fierce fighting. You'd seen what Lieutenant Colonel
02:30:59.500 --> 02:31:02.620
Dave Grossman talks about as the most traumatic
02:31:02.620 --> 02:31:05.620
version of combat, which is the extremely close
02:31:05.620 --> 02:31:08.780
bayonet knife fighting that you obviously encountered
02:31:08.780 --> 02:31:12.639
several times. So how did you handle physically
02:31:12.639 --> 02:31:15.079
your transition as far as your wounds, but also
02:31:15.079 --> 02:31:16.979
mentally? I mean, you end up writing a book about
02:31:16.979 --> 02:31:19.620
touching on PTSD. What was that journey like
02:31:19.620 --> 02:31:23.020
for you mentally after? being in the south pacific
02:31:23.020 --> 02:31:24.860
literally fighting for your life for multiple
02:31:24.860 --> 02:31:33.979
years well uh i got when i got uh see i was i
02:31:33.979 --> 02:31:38.659
was put into the uh ptsd or combat war on it
02:31:38.659 --> 02:31:43.659
i was put into that on it and uh i didn't have
02:31:43.659 --> 02:31:48.239
regular medical care because if i wanted something
02:31:48.780 --> 02:31:51.399
my bandage changed i had to go someplace else
02:31:51.399 --> 02:31:59.520
to get it and in that when my time came to discharge
02:31:59.520 --> 02:32:06.040
like that a different guy in the ptsd ward was
02:32:06.040 --> 02:32:13.100
in charge of it and he released me without conferring
02:32:13.100 --> 02:32:18.790
to the medical doctor a medical doctor had And
02:32:18.790 --> 02:32:25.409
I had what they called a proud flesh sticking
02:32:25.409 --> 02:32:33.149
out of my chest, about an inch long. And my wounds
02:32:33.149 --> 02:32:36.670
were trying to heal, and my muscle was sticking
02:32:36.670 --> 02:32:41.989
out. And they referred to it as proud flesh.
02:32:47.559 --> 02:32:50.600
One doctor didn't ask the other doctor or get
02:32:50.600 --> 02:32:54.239
her released from him. So they released me. And
02:32:54.239 --> 02:32:59.940
so I took off. And I took off. And I still had
02:32:59.940 --> 02:33:02.860
my bandage on. I still had this muscle sticking
02:33:02.860 --> 02:33:10.299
out of my chest. I got there in Arkansas. And
02:33:10.299 --> 02:33:16.690
my dad worked at... He was a supervisor of the
02:33:16.690 --> 02:33:25.790
crew that worked on poison gas facilities. And
02:33:25.790 --> 02:33:31.790
when I got there in Arkansas, then of course
02:33:31.790 --> 02:33:38.250
I went home and dad was all, he was all wanting
02:33:38.250 --> 02:33:40.229
to know what happened and where'd you go and
02:33:40.229 --> 02:33:42.790
what'd you do, were you killing anybody and all
02:33:42.790 --> 02:33:47.329
that stuff, and mother was... different kind
02:33:47.329 --> 02:33:53.290
of a meeting. Anyway, I showed him my chest,
02:33:53.610 --> 02:33:57.409
and so he peeled off the bandage off my chest.
02:33:57.709 --> 02:34:00.209
Here's this damn piece of muscle sticking out
02:34:00.209 --> 02:34:04.770
about an inch. Boy, he was about ready to blow.
02:34:05.329 --> 02:34:10.170
He was so mad at the Navy doctors for letting
02:34:10.170 --> 02:34:17.950
him go like that. And then, So he called up the
02:34:17.950 --> 02:34:23.709
medical doctor on the baby and told him the story.
02:34:24.270 --> 02:34:29.950
And they took me over to the medical ward at
02:34:29.950 --> 02:34:37.190
the Army Hospital there and put me into the ward
02:34:37.190 --> 02:34:40.750
there and asked what it was that I was wanted
02:34:40.750 --> 02:34:46.010
for. The dad explained. I had just been released
02:34:46.010 --> 02:34:50.170
from the medical doctor, from the PTSD doctor
02:34:50.170 --> 02:34:53.469
and all that kind of stuff. Anyway, he says,
02:34:53.549 --> 02:34:55.270
well, he looked at it and he says, well, this
02:34:55.270 --> 02:35:00.590
has to go. We have to take that off. So he just
02:35:00.590 --> 02:35:04.329
said, go in there and disrobe. And I told the
02:35:04.329 --> 02:35:08.049
nurse, prep him up. So they took me right in
02:35:08.049 --> 02:35:15.639
and froze the... part that they were going to
02:35:15.639 --> 02:35:22.799
cut off. And then they cut that out. And redid
02:35:22.799 --> 02:35:28.860
it. And he was pissed. He couldn't believe that
02:35:28.860 --> 02:35:35.020
they let someone out with a war wound that wasn't
02:35:35.020 --> 02:35:39.420
even healed yet. Well, again, the reason was
02:35:39.420 --> 02:35:45.260
I was in a PTSD ward. And he didn't confer with
02:35:45.260 --> 02:35:49.239
the medical board. They had permission for one,
02:35:49.239 --> 02:35:51.639
but not the other. And that's why. And I took
02:35:51.639 --> 02:35:55.319
it. Because I wanted to get out of there. As
02:35:55.319 --> 02:35:59.040
I said, my dad was a bugler. And he was a member
02:35:59.040 --> 02:36:02.799
of the Drum and Bugle Corps. And I knew drums.
02:36:03.520 --> 02:36:07.700
So I joined the Drum and Bugle Corps with him.
02:36:08.200 --> 02:36:12.159
And he and I used to march in the military parade
02:36:12.159 --> 02:36:17.370
together. I'd play drums and he'd play the beautiful.
02:36:17.750 --> 02:36:20.930
And he was the most happy man on earth, to have
02:36:20.930 --> 02:36:25.450
his son home, of course, and being able to be
02:36:25.450 --> 02:36:32.709
out there and play in a band with him. But he
02:36:32.709 --> 02:36:36.149
reacted that way. My mother was mad, of course,
02:36:36.270 --> 02:36:41.149
and she didn't want to look at the wounds for
02:36:41.149 --> 02:36:49.819
a while. And she did. I had two holes in my chest.
02:36:50.479 --> 02:36:58.559
My clavicle was cracked on and above my arm,
02:36:58.920 --> 02:37:07.340
above my lungs. And went out through my chest
02:37:07.340 --> 02:37:11.639
and went through my muscle in my left arm. and
02:37:11.639 --> 02:37:17.719
they were going to amputate my left arm. That's
02:37:17.719 --> 02:37:22.260
what made me mad about ship. But I had been massaged
02:37:22.260 --> 02:37:28.379
on my arm and shoulder for a long time from a
02:37:28.379 --> 02:37:38.489
little woman, a Marine nurse corpsman. And she
02:37:38.489 --> 02:37:41.209
went and massaged around my arms and shoulders.
02:37:42.489 --> 02:37:47.430
And she said, gee, what it was is that it was
02:37:47.430 --> 02:37:53.510
my arm muscles and nerves were trauma, still
02:37:53.510 --> 02:37:58.590
in trauma. And therefore you couldn't, so all
02:37:58.590 --> 02:38:01.010
I could do was just raise my wrist up and that's
02:38:01.010 --> 02:38:12.459
it. But I got home. And then PTDSD didn't set
02:38:12.459 --> 02:38:22.200
in until after we were married. For some reason,
02:38:22.260 --> 02:38:27.879
I don't know what shook it off. I think what
02:38:27.879 --> 02:38:32.719
shook it off, I was president of the American
02:38:32.719 --> 02:38:44.760
Legion in Florence. And seeing all of the guys
02:38:44.760 --> 02:38:47.399
out there and talking to them, it simply brought
02:38:47.399 --> 02:38:50.840
back a hell of a lot of memories. I think that's
02:38:50.840 --> 02:38:55.420
what set that farm open. I started drinking.
02:38:58.260 --> 02:39:08.430
Then I found out there wasn't a way to go. I
02:39:08.430 --> 02:39:16.090
saw that little help. I got help from some guys
02:39:16.090 --> 02:39:20.329
in the American Legion there who talked about
02:39:20.329 --> 02:39:26.110
it and stuff. So it was okay until I got back
02:39:26.110 --> 02:39:31.450
over to California and went in again. They told
02:39:31.450 --> 02:39:35.110
me that I'd never get rid of it, to talk it out.
02:39:36.209 --> 02:39:40.110
That's why I'm here. I want to talk about it.
02:39:41.129 --> 02:39:45.950
I bring back a lot of memories. I know the guys.
02:39:50.649 --> 02:39:59.290
And that's about it. You got any questions? No,
02:39:59.290 --> 02:40:01.629
sir. Well, I mean, firstly, I want to thank you
02:40:01.629 --> 02:40:04.739
for telling the story. The fact that you're moved,
02:40:04.879 --> 02:40:08.100
the fact that you're emotional about this is
02:40:08.100 --> 02:40:10.219
exactly what these conversations should be about.
02:40:10.360 --> 02:40:14.860
Because my generation, it's such a bizarre thing.
02:40:14.940 --> 02:40:17.280
Your generation is what we call the greatest
02:40:17.280 --> 02:40:21.159
generation. And you saw and did so much that
02:40:21.159 --> 02:40:23.239
no one should ever have to see or have to do.
02:40:23.739 --> 02:40:27.899
And then you have my generation that was raised
02:40:27.899 --> 02:40:31.450
with this insane notion that... Men don't cry.
02:40:31.610 --> 02:40:33.549
Men don't show emotion. Kind of like the pattern
02:40:33.549 --> 02:40:35.729
example that you gave me. Just give them a little
02:40:35.729 --> 02:40:38.430
slap around the face and their PTSD will be gone,
02:40:38.549 --> 02:40:41.450
which has driven so many men and women into the
02:40:41.450 --> 02:40:45.909
grave because of that ridiculous notion. So hearing
02:40:45.909 --> 02:40:48.389
from someone like yourself, and I always point
02:40:48.389 --> 02:40:51.729
to the 101st Easy Company from Band of Brothers,
02:40:51.889 --> 02:40:54.370
the TV show that they made, the real men that
02:40:54.370 --> 02:40:57.799
talk on that, you can see. the just sheer emotion
02:40:57.799 --> 02:41:01.979
in them too so by hearing your story and hearing
02:41:01.979 --> 02:41:05.680
you get choked up is exactly what younger generations
02:41:05.680 --> 02:41:08.040
need to hear that this of course as you said
02:41:08.040 --> 02:41:10.459
how how could it not affect you that you had
02:41:10.459 --> 02:41:12.719
to take lives that you watched your friends killed
02:41:12.719 --> 02:41:15.920
that you you know and then came back and even
02:41:15.920 --> 02:41:18.040
some of the the situations where you know you
02:41:18.040 --> 02:41:20.020
were left wounded and feeling abandoned in a
02:41:20.020 --> 02:41:22.139
psych ward when you should have been having your
02:41:22.139 --> 02:41:25.549
wounds addressed so I want to thank you. I want
02:41:25.549 --> 02:41:27.590
to thank you for taking the time to walk us through
02:41:27.590 --> 02:41:30.530
an event where very few voices are left to tell
02:41:30.530 --> 02:41:34.110
that story and for being courageous to tell the
02:41:34.110 --> 02:41:37.610
other side, which is the part that most people
02:41:37.610 --> 02:41:42.209
shove down, the impact mentally and physically
02:41:42.209 --> 02:41:44.969
on the men and women that we send to war and
02:41:44.969 --> 02:41:47.190
what they bring home in their body and what they
02:41:47.190 --> 02:41:52.719
bring home in their mind. It helped me a lot
02:41:52.719 --> 02:41:58.600
on it. I go to the Stockton Marine Corps Club
02:41:58.600 --> 02:42:04.700
on it, and I meet a lot of good people that have
02:42:04.700 --> 02:42:07.879
gone through the present -day war, I'll call
02:42:07.879 --> 02:42:13.260
it that, that they've been through, Vietnam on,
02:42:13.500 --> 02:42:18.120
and some of their stories and stuff, and that
02:42:18.120 --> 02:42:27.479
has helped me. I've given speeches. to the Sacramento
02:42:27.479 --> 02:42:38.459
Club and their home Marine Corps birthday balls.
02:42:38.920 --> 02:42:44.120
I've spoken there. I've given two or three speeches
02:42:44.120 --> 02:42:51.350
on Iwo Jima, and that's helped. all right and
02:42:51.350 --> 02:42:54.030
by getting it away from me i even put it in my
02:42:54.030 --> 02:42:58.469
book that i have uh written uh that that's what
02:42:58.469 --> 02:43:03.549
i think it would be good for those people those
02:43:03.549 --> 02:43:08.129
men and women that uh have all this traumatic
02:43:08.129 --> 02:43:12.649
experience on it if they get rid of it and uh
02:43:12.649 --> 02:43:15.469
and talk and let people know you know i'm sorry
02:43:15.469 --> 02:43:18.649
and don't say it's a When they ask, you know,
02:43:18.649 --> 02:43:21.030
what happened? Oh, nothing, we fought a little
02:43:21.030 --> 02:43:27.469
bit, and stuff like that. Well, tell them. Tell
02:43:27.469 --> 02:43:31.729
them what it is. Know about it, and let people
02:43:31.729 --> 02:43:36.790
know what it is. Maybe they won't think about
02:43:36.790 --> 02:43:43.440
it if they do come into where they have it. The
02:43:43.440 --> 02:43:46.680
authority or the vote, if you will, in Congress
02:43:46.680 --> 02:43:49.620
or so, about going into war again or causing
02:43:49.620 --> 02:43:56.139
things to go to war. Don't do that. Do something
02:43:56.139 --> 02:44:02.559
else if you have to do it. War is hell. But get
02:44:02.559 --> 02:44:06.139
rid of it. Tell somebody. Tell somebody. Show
02:44:06.139 --> 02:44:11.629
what you did in the service on it. Let them know
02:44:11.629 --> 02:44:23.110
that it's not just to play games. John William
02:44:23.110 --> 02:44:29.190
had a speech, and of course I've written for
02:44:29.190 --> 02:44:40.500
him, but he had a speech on Iwo Jima on it. After
02:44:40.500 --> 02:44:48.479
the first day, he talked. And he has the words
02:44:48.479 --> 02:44:55.180
that they sounded like he really meant it. But
02:44:55.180 --> 02:44:58.459
that was exactly what it was. He meant it. He
02:44:58.459 --> 02:45:08.000
really meant that. It's not all glory. I see
02:45:08.000 --> 02:45:12.479
some of the... movies that always throw, of course,
02:45:12.500 --> 02:45:19.420
they've got to sell it to, but the romance in
02:45:19.420 --> 02:45:26.260
it, and some of them show what their wife or
02:45:26.260 --> 02:45:30.139
girlfriend are going through, which is good.
02:45:30.440 --> 02:45:33.319
And they're suffering, too. The home folks suffer.
02:45:35.840 --> 02:45:44.950
But that's why I jumped at chance to say my story.
02:45:46.270 --> 02:45:49.909
And I've lost a lot of my memory. Otherwise,
02:45:50.049 --> 02:45:52.090
I used to be able to. When I started writing
02:45:52.090 --> 02:45:56.549
my book on it, my wife was against it. Because
02:45:56.549 --> 02:46:02.229
I had referrals. I had things that I had to look
02:46:02.229 --> 02:46:06.350
up. I had to look up the names of ships. I was
02:46:06.350 --> 02:46:10.170
on 11 different ships overseas. going to and
02:46:10.170 --> 02:46:20.450
from different islands, both for combat or for
02:46:20.450 --> 02:46:24.770
just being transferred. And that's a lot of ships.
02:46:25.129 --> 02:46:32.889
That is. Yeah. I've got one submarine and a whole
02:46:32.889 --> 02:46:40.079
bunch of ships. It's an adventure for a young
02:46:40.079 --> 02:46:48.399
kid. That's adventure. And I realize that I'm
02:46:48.399 --> 02:46:52.780
96 years old now. My memory is getting a little
02:46:52.780 --> 02:46:57.319
short. And I know that people, and there's not
02:46:57.319 --> 02:47:02.139
much of us left. Not much left of 96 -year -olds.
02:47:02.239 --> 02:47:09.659
Fight or no fight. And I know that they, my wife
02:47:09.659 --> 02:47:11.860
asked me about, well, why do you want to go there?
02:47:12.459 --> 02:47:15.239
What do you want to do there? I said, I want
02:47:15.239 --> 02:47:18.719
to be there. I said, just to give some of these
02:47:18.719 --> 02:47:22.620
little four and five year old kids an opportunity
02:47:22.620 --> 02:47:27.899
just to shake hands with someone that has been
02:47:27.899 --> 02:47:33.500
in the fight that I have been in too. It's good,
02:47:33.680 --> 02:47:36.680
and as old as I am, I'm a grandfather to a lot
02:47:36.680 --> 02:47:41.059
of them, but I'm not. There is a man that I bum
02:47:41.059 --> 02:47:47.819
around with on these different occasions in Stockton.
02:47:49.180 --> 02:47:52.540
He was on Iwo Jima. He was wounded the same day
02:47:52.540 --> 02:47:56.680
that I was. He says he is, at least, on March
02:47:56.680 --> 02:48:05.520
the 3rd, 1945. And he's 106. Wow. That's 10 years
02:48:05.520 --> 02:48:09.139
older than I am. Sort of the whippersnapper to
02:48:09.139 --> 02:48:14.579
him. Yeah, that's an old man. He calls me kid.
02:48:15.739 --> 02:48:18.739
My grandmother's 104. She's still going strong.
02:48:19.239 --> 02:48:25.879
Yeah, see? And it's nice to see. And I see some
02:48:25.879 --> 02:48:30.059
of the kids when they tell him he's 106. Their
02:48:30.059 --> 02:48:33.319
eyes are big as saucers. You can see that he's
02:48:33.319 --> 02:48:42.360
over 100 years old. And he was in China. He was
02:48:42.360 --> 02:48:46.100
one of the old China Marines. And he went in,
02:48:46.100 --> 02:48:50.319
I think he stayed in 1934 or something like that.
02:48:51.079 --> 02:48:59.190
But he's in a home in Stockton. Major William.
02:49:00.030 --> 02:49:08.090
Oh, crap. Got it. White. Major William White.
02:49:08.329 --> 02:49:15.430
White. Major William White on it. And it's 106
02:49:15.430 --> 02:49:21.170
on July the 21st. Incredible. That was 96 on
02:49:21.170 --> 02:49:27.030
July the 5th. Not December like the record. The
02:49:27.030 --> 02:49:33.129
old birth certificate. Well, Frank, I just want
02:49:33.129 --> 02:49:35.229
to say thank you. Like I said before, I mean,
02:49:35.250 --> 02:49:41.030
to hear the whole story, to give the background
02:49:41.030 --> 02:49:44.229
to you even joining up, and it definitely gives
02:49:44.229 --> 02:49:46.950
us a perspective versus maybe some of the mentalities
02:49:46.950 --> 02:49:50.250
these days. You know, the physical side, the
02:49:50.250 --> 02:49:53.129
mental side, the transition out. It's been an
02:49:53.129 --> 02:49:55.750
incredible conversation. You did write a book.
02:49:56.829 --> 02:50:04.909
I wrote a book last year, I think it was 2019,
02:50:05.270 --> 02:50:09.510
and it's called Battles in the Pacific, World
02:50:09.510 --> 02:50:18.530
War II. And you can get them at Amazon. And they
02:50:18.530 --> 02:50:23.149
print them up, and they have real good rapport
02:50:23.149 --> 02:50:33.489
on that. A story about what I did in those times.
02:50:33.909 --> 02:50:36.889
It has a little romance in it because that's
02:50:36.889 --> 02:50:41.649
when I met my wife. I was married for 74 years.
02:50:42.489 --> 02:50:45.370
And that was her first date and my first date.
02:50:45.930 --> 02:50:54.409
Amazing. It lasted a long time. And I'd like
02:50:54.409 --> 02:50:57.600
more people to buy it. ready to kind of get an
02:50:57.600 --> 02:51:03.940
idea and have it in their book reading if they
02:51:03.940 --> 02:51:08.340
possibly can. And it also details a lot of the
02:51:08.340 --> 02:51:15.260
stories that I just detailed. Absolutely. It's
02:51:15.260 --> 02:51:17.780
good. Yeah, well, so just for everyone listening,
02:51:17.860 --> 02:51:20.940
I read it. I got it on the Kindle, which is the
02:51:20.940 --> 02:51:22.700
one you get on the computer just because of time.
02:51:22.780 --> 02:51:24.040
I think it was going to take a couple of weeks
02:51:24.040 --> 02:51:26.790
to ship. But I mean, it is how often do you get
02:51:26.790 --> 02:51:29.389
to read, you know, a story like that? And there's
02:51:29.389 --> 02:51:31.370
a lot of detail in some of the conflicts and
02:51:31.370 --> 02:51:34.590
battles that you had and the wounds and that
02:51:34.590 --> 02:51:36.430
we didn't even really get to touch on, which
02:51:36.430 --> 02:51:38.030
is good. And I don't want to tell the whole book
02:51:38.030 --> 02:51:40.729
on this conversation either. So I highly recommend
02:51:40.729 --> 02:51:43.389
it. And again, if we want to support. someone
02:51:43.389 --> 02:51:45.290
from that generation we want to keep the story
02:51:45.290 --> 02:51:48.010
alive then i hope people listening will go online
02:51:48.010 --> 02:51:50.750
and get it so it was uh battles in the pacific
02:51:50.750 --> 02:51:54.469
world war ii my personal war causing ptsd so
02:51:54.469 --> 02:51:56.389
everyone looking for the what they call i think
02:51:56.389 --> 02:51:59.209
the subtitle whatever it is my name right beside
02:51:59.209 --> 02:52:02.469
because there's several books on the market that
02:52:02.469 --> 02:52:06.309
go by the name of world war ii yes and in the
02:52:06.309 --> 02:52:09.809
pacific and there's a battle in the pacific world
02:52:09.809 --> 02:52:14.549
war ii frank wright And that goes right to it.
02:52:15.809 --> 02:52:18.450
Absolutely. Well, I just want to say again, thank
02:52:18.450 --> 02:52:20.649
you. Thank you so much for coming on today. We've
02:52:20.649 --> 02:52:23.690
been talking for almost three and a half hours
02:52:23.690 --> 02:52:27.389
now. So I know you told Chris you weren't sure
02:52:27.389 --> 02:52:28.809
if you're going to be able to fill 90 minutes.
02:52:30.370 --> 02:52:33.290
He says, you know, it might be an hour. It might
02:52:33.290 --> 02:52:36.989
be. No, sometimes it'll go two hours. I said,
02:52:36.989 --> 02:52:41.399
I don't remember. Well, you smashed it. I don't
02:52:41.399 --> 02:52:46.520
think I can do that. Thank you, Chris. You're
02:52:46.520 --> 02:52:49.059
welcome. You're welcome. My honor. My honor to
02:52:49.059 --> 02:52:55.780
listen to your story. It was nice to get it out.
02:52:56.819 --> 02:53:03.620
That's why. I have to get it out. And this is
02:53:03.620 --> 02:53:07.959
my avenue to get it out. Thank you very much,
02:53:07.959 --> 02:53:10.639
Chris and Jamie. Thank you very much.
