Karen: Last year the world and your TikTok algorithm met Le Poisson Steve, an orange fish, a brainworm y song created with love by the Parisian duo Viggs and Tomo that quickly garnered millions and millions of views, remixes and fans. Excited to talk to them both today. so what?
tomo: It's okay, it's okay. And you, are you
Karen: good, good. I'm so thrilled to have you guys on on Open Studios. You are Victoria Rona and Thomas Ename. yeah,
tomo: Am I me? Yeah. That's me.
Karen: aka Viggs and Tomo. Viggs and Tomo. Okay, super.
tomo: Yeah.
Karen: one year ago, you brought joy to the world. a thing the world totally needs. you posted a ah TikTok song and video, took over the French internet, moved into the American internet, you've crossed cultures, crossed
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Mm-hmm.
Karen: other borders, and That is so freaking cool. And We're talking about Le Poisson, Steve. you made an orange fish, a cool, catchy tune, you're a friendship, you're a partnership,
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Ha ha.
tomo: Yep.
Karen: And the result is over twelve million views on its original post on TikTok on its debut. on Instagram quickly surpassed eight and a half, maybe you're closer to nine million views now. Steve spawned viral remixes, Spotify. You've got over ten million streams of the song. It's been called the French Anthem. Perhaps the French mascot. Le Poisson, Steve. Yay! Welcome. I'm so excited.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yay. Thank
tomo: Thank you so much for having us
Victoria Ronat (vigz): you so much.
tomo: Karen, thanks for the great introduction. It was great and we will talk more about Le Poisson Steve.
Karen: we met in Annecy. Anasi is this animation is the animation event of the year in Anasi France. And I came home and I was telling my daughter, who's twenty-one, more your age than mine. And I was like, my gosh, these people and lip was on Steve. And she's like, yeah. she was in a bad mood one day, and her friend said, How can you be in a bad mood when there's this? And she showed her lip was on Steve, and it completely turned her mood
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Ha ha.
tomo: That's so cute.
Karen: around. That's what
Victoria Ronat (vigz): No.
Karen: I mean by you bringing a joy, a bit of joy to the world. And I And I also feel like it's continued. It wasn't a moment that went away. I feel like the moment is still quite quite strong. But you'll tell me more about that. Okay. It has been said that a fish has no concept of water. And I wonder if that quote by the author Janet Fitch. resonates with you guys as as artists young artists in Paris do doing what you do on a day to day basis, breathing the air that you breathe, but really something magical was happening. how maybe you were swimming in something you weren't you weren't quite aware of, or maybe I'm wrong, maybe you are quite aware of the air that you that you breathe.
tomo: No, we weren't aware when we did Le Poisson Steve, like it's... It came out like a surprise for us Viggs and I are friends for like more than 10 years now and we met on Twitter and we had
Karen: wait, wait. You met ten years ago on Twitter?
tomo: Yeah.
Karen: Well, okay.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): We are both fans of French YouTuber and we found
Karen: Okay.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): quickly thanks to our common love about him and our common love of cartoons and and music. And we we we thought about making making a cartoon together when we grew up and maybe eight years plus eight years
tomo: Later.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): later we came to Twitch and became streamer.
Karen: Mm-hmm.
tomo: Victoria and I share like the same community and Victoria had all these characters and Steve was already a character the community knows and in France we have like this thing called Le poisson d'avril in English is April Fools if I have to translate yeah, yeah, if I have to translate
Karen: April, April Falls. April. Yeah. April Falls. Right. Mm-hmm.
tomo: le poisson d'avril in English, it's April's fish in France we stick fishes on the back of the people we love To
Victoria Ronat (vigz): I know fishes.
tomo: prank them Like
Karen: Mm-hmm.
tomo: when we were kids, like the first of April, you stick fishes in the back of your teacher and to make fun of her. And Victoria said it's too bad that now we are grown adults. We don't celebrate this thing. And she said like, I have this character called Steve and... Maybe you can like draw Steve in your style but I can't draw anything like I can't draw around I can't draw anything but I can make music so I had this idea like What would be the Opening of Steve if we were in the cartoon, what would be Steve opening? And so I made a song
Victoria Ronat (vigz): I love his music so much that I spent the night making a little animation and posted it on my old and empty social media which had been inactive for years.
Karen: responding.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): and I I was kinda scared about posting because
Karen: huh.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): I'm I'm a animator but I was a little rusty and I didn't post any drawing sciences but Tomo and everyone participating in my drawing challenge give me the the
tomo: A little push.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): yes, give me confidence.
Karen: Confidence. Confidence.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): yes, I post on Instagram saying maybe some people make will make joke about it, but I'm proud of it. it's cute, it's a good song and we have some fun doing it and we post it without thinking much about it.
Karen: did you Vic did you have it like everybody else on the planet, like in your head for like the next month Like
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yes, of course. And I have to animate on it. So imagine you making a drawing in rhythm with a song. So I have listened
Karen: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): to it maybe hundred hundred hundreds of time. during the animation phase.
Karen: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
tomo: It's funny because like Like the first day when it came out, we
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yeah.
tomo: didn't want to hear the song, it was too much. I did a complete version of the song. So I had it over and over and over in my head. and I couldn't hear it and when we posted we didn't know how people are going to use it and when it came on our for you page on TikTok it was like an instant skip like no like
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yeah.
tomo: I don't want to hear the song anymore like the first day like today
Karen: no. That's funny when Right.
tomo: it's okay like we we but like we had to do things quickly so we had over and over over and over over and over and and yeah, we couldn't hear the song.
Karen: When did you know that it was just like, wow, people are digging this.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): The next day I think
Karen: Really?
Victoria Ronat (vigz): I called Tomo and at this moment I think there is maybe three command three hundred K Yes and the notification went crazy and
Karen: My God.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): we we have a call and and we are very stunned because we didn't expect that at all and I post the video at maybe midnight. So it's not an algorithm friendly hour normally. So I didn't expect any of of this.
tomo: it wasn't planned at all. Like she said, her TikTok account was empty, like no followers and
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yeah.
tomo: no... Yeah, it was just a watching account. So yeah, it wasn't planned at all. The next day, we knew that something was happening with Steve because it was so much. people came into my TikTok to comment my old post like thanks for the Poisson Steve Thanks, and I didn't Do anything like I didn't post anything about the Poisson Steve at this time and people Send me messages like thanks for the Poisson Steve and I was like, okay something is happening right now.
Karen: I mean people became fans, like crazy
tomo: Hmm.
Karen: fans, right? So the UGC stuff and it's not yours anymore, Like you did this thing, it's not
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yeah.
Karen: yours. People are making I mean, I've seen crochet mugs, t shirts. event live events, performance art
tomo: Have you seen the tattoos?
Karen: both elements. Both elements. Tattoos.
tomo: Yeah
Karen: The tattoos.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Lot of them.
Karen: A lot of tattoos. Right. That's not a sticker. That's you will keep that's
tomo: Tattoos like tattoos like a thing you will keep Yeah
Karen: Do you guys know or have you heard of this concept of the third, the third artist? It really just means collaboration. So what really is powerful is that you guys did this thing together so naturally.
tomo: Yep. Yeah, it wouldn't be the same if it wasn't Victoria, if it wasn't my song. Like we love to say that it's a 50-50 job. this is the project is like half mine and half Viggs because that's what makes it like so beautiful and i think like the the people equally love the music and the character like when you say like it's like the third what what what was the expression the the third artist yeah it's it's really like that
Karen: Artist. Artist. more than a like you It only works because it's together. It it's magic.
tomo: And I and I feel like it's a part of our story as well like because we always
Karen: Mm.
tomo: wanted to do something like that and we know each other for like 10 years and this is like a new beginning of something because we have this dream of making our cartoon together and this is the Big opening to it. So it's yeah, it's it's
Karen: I'd say. Right.
tomo: it's it's it's magic
Karen: it is magic. and You make this thing, you put it out there, it's it's it's yours together, this collaboration, this partnership, this th third artist idea, but now it's not yours anymore.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): But it it was kind of overwhelming because at this moment I felt split it between happiness because I'm I'm proud of the success. But at the same time I feel anxious, stressed because we received a lot of message telling us quick quick make make some merch make another episode make a series take decision now because it's a trend you have to to react quickly because everyone will forget about him in one week so it was a pretty stress trustful but I think the the fact that we are two i it's very rasur rassurant command
Karen: Mm-hmm. Reassuring.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): reassuring because when I feel anxious tomorrow have kind words for me and same in the other way and I think I feel like we could we we
Karen: Balance.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Come on Yes, we balance. We we are good duo and I feel like I w I command shnore par
tomo: I wouldn't, I wouldn't.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): I wouldn't manage it so well if I was on my own.
Karen: on your
tomo: Yeah, we really balance our emotions. Luckily, when I'm down, she's up. And the same thing, we're
Victoria Ronat (vigz): I think.
tomo: never down together. So we can cheer each other up when...
Victoria Ronat (vigz): We o we say often the first one to complain is supported by the other.
tomo: Hmm.
Karen: real partnership.
tomo: Yeah, yeah.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yeah.
Karen: well when something surprises people, comes out of nowhere, right? And hits the sort of like dull monocultures like we're all kind of you feels
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Mm-hmm.
Karen: like people are all kind of same same same same same stores same movies
tomo: Mm-hmm.
Karen: and something hits it out of nowhere and then there's a rush to make it make sense to the monoculture like you said maybe take advantage make a merchandise, make more, make this. Are you gonna make another one? Are you gonna go to Cartoon Network? Are you gonna make a movie? Are you gonna blah blah blah blah blah? And you're like, wait
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Mm-hmm.
Karen: a minute, we're just having fun with twenty of our friends on on Twitch and writing some music it seems to me like you guys have been very very smart about that, but just not smart like calculating, smart like natural, like, no, this is just what's right for us. Is that
tomo: Hmm.
Karen: how do you know how to manage that?
tomo: Like as we said in the beginning our dream is to make something together so And by something I mean like a cartoon a show something we that came from us and I feel like this is what guides us to like stay in our line Stay with our ideas and not rush and when people show up to us and said you should do this you should do that you should do this okay but this is not our ideas this is not this is not our way so we won't do that and it's a long road it's a long long long road because we have only two people and we doesn't know anything about like this animation world and and all the things that came with making a show, making a cartoon but this is how we manage the things and yeah, maybe Victoria if you have something to add,
Victoria Ronat (vigz): we really wanted to take our time to
tomo: Hmm.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): make the r right decision because we didn't feel like rushing it it's a good idea. we we take our time, we take the time to reach out for amis animation professional. I joined an animation association called Les Femmes Anim. and that's an association that bring some tips and some con conseil
tomo: Nice.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): advice thank you to a young woman who wants to make a place in the animation industry so we have the opportunity to make a writing residence it's a month in in a house with other artists and we have the time to to create our project, to speak with others w and have feedbacks. last year we take a lot of time to think about it to reach out some professional and and really yeah take the right decision. don't know.
Karen: You're serious. Right, right. So perhaps since that guided you, it's guiding you as you move forward and you take the time and not do what everybody else is doing. And that can be your superpower, on top of you guys doing this, like the world, it's complicated. It's a tra compliqué. And
tomo: Mm-hmm. Yep.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yeah.
Karen: you're and and you're young artists and you wanna make a living with your art and with what you do. And and it's community for you guys and just things that feel natural. And fun is a big part of it. And I and I wondered like just like how's everybody doing out there? Your community and your friends? Are they feeling the same way? Like, how are the kids doing?
tomo: Like other our friends, other artists like like evolving is like
Karen: Yeah, you're just yeah, just the vibe, like how's everybody doing?
tomo: the world right now? That's your question?
Karen: Just yes, as an artist going out, you're okay, how old are you guys?
tomo: 27 and
Victoria Ronat (vigz): twenty eight.
tomo: 28.
Karen: Yeah, so you're like, you're not babies and you're y but you're young, right? You've done some things and you've got this great thing and you're meeting all these people and your most important thing in life as an artist, I think, is to develop your own point of view. Cause nobody can take that from you, right? So you guys are s doubling down on that. You're spending time doing that. Amazing. Does it fe and it feels like maybe that's a response, right? Response to the world. I don't know if it is.
tomo: Mm, mm, mm, mm, mm.
Karen: Like, I I guess I'm not asking you to speak for like a generation of people, but also I just wanna know like how are the kids doing? How how's the kids doing out there?
tomo: No, no, no, yeah, yeah, but I mean I mean we are surrounded by artists all of our friends are artists because we are evolving in artist like ways so I feel like everyone feel the same like everyone wants to Make a living with arts But... I feel like it's a response. I feel like we have all these creative minds and it's natural. we want to... bring joy to everyone who will meet our art.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): I feel like we choose a creative path in our life so we we see how old friends getting married married getting some kids and every everything like this. So it's not It's not we we're not confident every day about how choice choice. maybe artificial intelligence doesn't reassuring us no more, and quaque m'enfonce dans ce que je dis.
tomo: No, go ahead, it's interesting.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): in France we have a lot of political decision who makes artist life more difficult than before. we have a fantastic organization that's called CNC who is an organ an organization that give you some financement for your project but signs maybe one years six months they they they kick they they cut yeah they cut the project
tomo: as he cut it, Yeah.
Karen: Cut cut the budget. Right. Right. Yeah.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): for internet create creator so
Karen: Mm.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): we have some political decision to make status more difficult too because we have the intermittence du spectacle so maybe s show intermitt I don't know to t translate it but we have a statue that allow
Karen: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): us to work on a project and have some time off with remuneration and Taking the time to find another job and like this and live like this. But yeah, it's more difficult then when we grew up. And I think we have a a good a good group of friends that I don't know how to say it in English, but in France we say besser les bras, lower the arms. So
tomo: No, no, no.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): abandoning to give up, yeah. We Yeah.
tomo: To give up, we... Yeah. No one in our group wants to give up. We are really ambitious. We are really... We believe in our arts. And we believe on... I believe in Viggs and she believes in me. So she... And I believe in all my friends. And I feel like this is our strength. like this is what what's make me how how can i say like wake up in the morning and do stuff like yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah so i don't know about like yeah i don't
Karen: There you go. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Gives you the strength, the confidence. You're not alone, you know, and in a way with that support system, you want to prove to each other. Yeah.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yeah.
tomo: know about all the the kids out there but we have like in our group we are like yeah the power
Victoria Ronat (vigz): power of f friendship.
tomo: of friendship yeah yeah I don't know if it's
Karen: The the power of friendship. That's incredible. And I imagine that's
tomo: answer your question well like we talked a lot okay okay okay
Karen: No. No, it's good. There's no
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yeah.
Karen: there's no wrong answers, Tomo. I
tomo: Yeah, thank you.
Karen: i i it's it's a powerful thing, like community and friendship and
tomo: Yeah.
Karen: and I and I do think that that is really great advice for for anyone as well, no matter where you are in your creative life or just life life, who you surround yourself with and having reason to get up in the morning and and make stuff, right? is is powerful. That's that's everything, Has that initial Twitch community has that has that changed?
Victoria Ronat (vigz): J'ai pas compris, pardon.
tomo: Did change anything to have your community on Twitch?
Victoria Ronat (vigz): yeah, of course. I'm afraid to be present on internet, as a woman, as an artist. and I feel like Twitch give me the confidence because I have to animate a show, talk in front of a lot of people. a lot of I don't know, and I can't keep up I can't watch the list of viewers every time. So I need to be myself one hundred percent because if my mom came in the chat, if my friends, if my coworker came in the chat, I have to be myself and I feel like it's a really good exercise for giving confidence and giving and and Gaining some yeah, some some confidence.
Karen: because you could be a persona y you know, right, and
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yeah, yeah, of course.
Karen: not and not be yourself and
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Mm mm.
Karen: what you're saying is that then that wouldn't not only would it wouldn't work, it wouldn't be it wouldn't be worth it. It wouldn't be it wouldn't be w worth you you doing that. Is that do I understand that? Yeah.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Mm mm.
Karen: Yeah, yeah, absolutely. So yeah, I'm sure you're getting a lot of phone calls. You know, getting lot of meetings, your calendar's different than it was a year ago. But like what's what's the one phone call that that you really want to receive, me about?
Victoria Ronat (vigz): can say one you have, you already have.
tomo: We had.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): We had yes. That's
Karen: Yeah. breaking news.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): that's the New York Times. Do you remember?
tomo: wait, yeah. these articles like we had like this bit, this segment in a local TV channel like but they never reach out, they never like ask us like hey do you want to talk about it like and the first who did that it's like the New York Times and this was like crazy to us like what Like, okay, okay, I'm... I didn't remember the name of the journalist but hey, this is the New York time, do you want to talk about Le Poisson Steve? And we were like, yo... And fun fact, this was like our first English meeting. Like, we had a lot of English calls now but it was the first, like we didn't know how to speak English. Like, Le Poisson Steve...
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yes. And we didn't speak En English in front of each other. So it was pretty stressful.
tomo: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, really unlock our English like I didn't
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yeah.
tomo: I didn't speak English as good as I speak it right now it's not perfect but I can yeah yeah and
Victoria Ronat (vigz): We still have progress to make, but
tomo: the New York Times was like literally
Karen: It's inc that's incredible.
tomo: the first thing like in April 2025 like the journalist called us and our English was really really really bad and she said like you know what
Victoria Ronat (vigz): We started I know.
tomo: I'm gonna send you the question and you're gonna write the answer we were so proud of this yeah yeah yeah yeah
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yeah, and she was very patient.
tomo: yeah yeah and very kind yeah yeah
Karen: that's kind of what I mean also by like you hitting the monoculture. Like what's bigger than the New York Times? So like that's that's really incredible.
tomo: Yeah, right?
Victoria Ronat (vigz): I think we have an another call we we love to receive. it's what it it is Cartoon Network, Yes. We yes.
tomo: We would love, love to have like a phone call from Cartoon Network because maybe it's maybe like our common influence. Like we really, really love the shows that come, came out like Cartoon Network and we're really inspired by that. And we would love... We would love to talk about our show, about our stories and maybe do something with them. I don't know. This is like the dream font call. for... I'm a producer. We heard about Le Poisson Steve. Like, what do you want to do? Because we would love to work with you guys and... Like, this is the dream font call. Yeah, why not?
Karen: Should be able I mean the New York Times called, like you took down TikTok. It feels like anything's possible at this point. What is it
tomo: Yeah, right?
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yeah. Why not?
tomo: Right? Exactly.
Karen: what's what's your what's your collaboration look like today?
tomo: we have of course Le Poisson Steve that we are developing We want to make a series out of it like the plan is to like Like you said it don't belong to us because we give it to an internet and every people like are doing their own stuff, but we want to like retake this and tell our stories We we have a lot of things to share like we have a lot of joy a lot of questions a lot of many things and So this is our obviously our main collaboration right now But I'm a musician, I make music on my own and Victorial animates things. we wanted to show the world that we are not only the Poisson Steve, we can make other things. And we made a little animation on a song of mine. It's called Pas Du Tout. It's on our social media. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Karen: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah,
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Not not at the door.
Karen: yeah, okay, okay. Yeah, I saw I saw that. And again, like
tomo: Yeah.
Karen: you know, like just happiness, like Pharrell Williams happiness, you know, like it's like
tomo: Hmm.
Karen: just so perfectly matched, you know, like two people Doing something together. Again,
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Right.
Karen: the third artist thing, that's that's
tomo: Yeah, but we have like something we called le ping pong. Le ping pong is like the tennis table. Yeah. Okay, so le ping pong,
Karen: Ping pong. Yeah, yeah. Ping pong. Yeah. Yeah.
tomo: is how we are collaborating. So this
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Floor.
tomo: is our workflow. So this is a big secret I will reveal to you.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Okay.
Karen: I won't tell anybody.
tomo: Like when we have an idea like Maybe for pas du tout, it's an example. Like, we have like this big idea, okay, we have to do this. And Victoria
Victoria Ronat (vigz): We wanted to
tomo: she has more ideas and when she has more ideas I have more ideas and this is just a little game of ideas and the result is like a beautiful collaboration with our both point of view like this is and somehow the thing I imagine in my head it's not the result but it's better because like
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yes.
tomo: there is like her point of view and I think it's beautiful like I think the third artist came from this workflow like because
Karen: Ping pong fork flow.
tomo: yeah yeah exactly
Karen: guys, this is so cool. You've got your cat there, Tom. I was play not if not if the
tomo: Yeah, I have my cut.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): most beautiful cat in the world.
Karen: That cat could not
tomo: It's a big cut.
Karen: be bothered.
tomo: Never.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): sweet.
Karen: this is so this is so fun. And thanks so much. We spent
tomo: Yeah.
Karen: so much time. my God, we've been talking forever.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Thank you so much for having us.
tomo: No, it's okay, it's okay.
Karen: This is really, this is really great. And I hope we can keep the conversation going. I really want to hear how you guys are doing and
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yes, of course.
tomo: Yeah, of course, of course. Yeah.
Karen: so inspiring. And
tomo: Thank you.
Karen: just know that you've got a f you've got fans over here as well as
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yeah.
Karen: At the n at the New York Times, you know. All right, guys, have a g yeah, yeah.
tomo: Thanks, thank you so much for having us. it was a
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yeah, it
tomo: great conversation.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): doesn't And s sorry for
Karen: Friday evening as well.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): for my English and I I hope everyone will understand me.
tomo: It was great.
Karen: Your English is quite good. C'est parfait. It is.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Merci beaucoup.
Karen: my pleasure. Alright. Until Annecy next year. I'll see you in France. Okay. Okay. Au revoir.
tomo: Yeah! Yes! Okay! Bye! Au revoir! Bye!
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Au revoir. Bye.
Karen: What
tomo: salut!
Victoria Ronat (vigz): a little stressed at the beginning. Sorry. Yes, thank you.
Karen: too much pressure because you you open your window so you're not getting no, no, no, no, don't. Plus I can like I said, I I first of all, it's so
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yes.
Karen: human to expose yourself. I think this is perhaps you're like this is your theme of your life. You're like, I'm just doing the things that make me uncomfortable. And you're just doing it. Doing it, right? I love
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yeah.
Karen: that. Maybe Tomo, you're that way
tomo: Yeah.
Karen: too, but you gotta you're a little cooler customer, you I want you to open your window. That's it. That's it.
tomo: I'm faking it till I make it
tomo: It's okay, it's okay. And you, are you
Karen: good, good. I'm so thrilled to have you guys on on Open Studios. You are Victoria Rona and Thomas Ename. yeah,
tomo: Am I me? Yeah. That's me.
Karen: aka Viggs and Tomo. Viggs and Tomo. Okay, super.
tomo: Yeah.
Karen: one year ago, you brought joy to the world. a thing the world totally needs. you posted a ah TikTok song and video, took over the French internet, moved into the American internet, you've crossed cultures, crossed
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Mm-hmm.
Karen: other borders, and That is so freaking cool. And We're talking about Le Poisson, Steve. you made an orange fish, a cool, catchy tune, you're a friendship, you're a partnership,
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Ha ha.
tomo: Yep.
Karen: And the result is over twelve million views on its original post on TikTok on its debut. on Instagram quickly surpassed eight and a half, maybe you're closer to nine million views now. Steve spawned viral remixes, Spotify. You've got over ten million streams of the song. It's been called the French Anthem. Perhaps the French mascot. Le Poisson, Steve. Yay! Welcome. I'm so excited.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yay. Thank
tomo: Thank you so much for having us
Victoria Ronat (vigz): you so much.
tomo: Karen, thanks for the great introduction. It was great and we will talk more about Le Poisson Steve.
Karen: we met in Annecy. Anasi is this animation is the animation event of the year in Anasi France. And I came home and I was telling my daughter, who's twenty-one, more your age than mine. And I was like, my gosh, these people and lip was on Steve. And she's like, yeah. she was in a bad mood one day, and her friend said, How can you be in a bad mood when there's this? And she showed her lip was on Steve, and it completely turned her mood
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Ha ha.
tomo: That's so cute.
Karen: around. That's what
Victoria Ronat (vigz): No.
Karen: I mean by you bringing a joy, a bit of joy to the world. And I And I also feel like it's continued. It wasn't a moment that went away. I feel like the moment is still quite quite strong. But you'll tell me more about that. Okay. It has been said that a fish has no concept of water. And I wonder if that quote by the author Janet Fitch. resonates with you guys as as artists young artists in Paris do doing what you do on a day to day basis, breathing the air that you breathe, but really something magical was happening. how maybe you were swimming in something you weren't you weren't quite aware of, or maybe I'm wrong, maybe you are quite aware of the air that you that you breathe.
tomo: No, we weren't aware when we did Le Poisson Steve, like it's... It came out like a surprise for us Viggs and I are friends for like more than 10 years now and we met on Twitter and we had
Karen: wait, wait. You met ten years ago on Twitter?
tomo: Yeah.
Karen: Well, okay.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): We are both fans of French YouTuber and we found
Karen: Okay.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): quickly thanks to our common love about him and our common love of cartoons and and music. And we we we thought about making making a cartoon together when we grew up and maybe eight years plus eight years
tomo: Later.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): later we came to Twitch and became streamer.
Karen: Mm-hmm.
tomo: Victoria and I share like the same community and Victoria had all these characters and Steve was already a character the community knows and in France we have like this thing called Le poisson d'avril in English is April Fools if I have to translate yeah, yeah, if I have to translate
Karen: April, April Falls. April. Yeah. April Falls. Right. Mm-hmm.
tomo: le poisson d'avril in English, it's April's fish in France we stick fishes on the back of the people we love To
Victoria Ronat (vigz): I know fishes.
tomo: prank them Like
Karen: Mm-hmm.
tomo: when we were kids, like the first of April, you stick fishes in the back of your teacher and to make fun of her. And Victoria said it's too bad that now we are grown adults. We don't celebrate this thing. And she said like, I have this character called Steve and... Maybe you can like draw Steve in your style but I can't draw anything like I can't draw around I can't draw anything but I can make music so I had this idea like What would be the Opening of Steve if we were in the cartoon, what would be Steve opening? And so I made a song
Victoria Ronat (vigz): I love his music so much that I spent the night making a little animation and posted it on my old and empty social media which had been inactive for years.
Karen: responding.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): and I I was kinda scared about posting because
Karen: huh.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): I'm I'm a animator but I was a little rusty and I didn't post any drawing sciences but Tomo and everyone participating in my drawing challenge give me the the
tomo: A little push.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): yes, give me confidence.
Karen: Confidence. Confidence.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): yes, I post on Instagram saying maybe some people make will make joke about it, but I'm proud of it. it's cute, it's a good song and we have some fun doing it and we post it without thinking much about it.
Karen: did you Vic did you have it like everybody else on the planet, like in your head for like the next month Like
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yes, of course. And I have to animate on it. So imagine you making a drawing in rhythm with a song. So I have listened
Karen: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): to it maybe hundred hundred hundreds of time. during the animation phase.
Karen: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
tomo: It's funny because like Like the first day when it came out, we
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yeah.
tomo: didn't want to hear the song, it was too much. I did a complete version of the song. So I had it over and over and over in my head. and I couldn't hear it and when we posted we didn't know how people are going to use it and when it came on our for you page on TikTok it was like an instant skip like no like
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yeah.
tomo: I don't want to hear the song anymore like the first day like today
Karen: no. That's funny when Right.
tomo: it's okay like we we but like we had to do things quickly so we had over and over over and over over and over and and yeah, we couldn't hear the song.
Karen: When did you know that it was just like, wow, people are digging this.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): The next day I think
Karen: Really?
Victoria Ronat (vigz): I called Tomo and at this moment I think there is maybe three command three hundred K Yes and the notification went crazy and
Karen: My God.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): we we have a call and and we are very stunned because we didn't expect that at all and I post the video at maybe midnight. So it's not an algorithm friendly hour normally. So I didn't expect any of of this.
tomo: it wasn't planned at all. Like she said, her TikTok account was empty, like no followers and
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yeah.
tomo: no... Yeah, it was just a watching account. So yeah, it wasn't planned at all. The next day, we knew that something was happening with Steve because it was so much. people came into my TikTok to comment my old post like thanks for the Poisson Steve Thanks, and I didn't Do anything like I didn't post anything about the Poisson Steve at this time and people Send me messages like thanks for the Poisson Steve and I was like, okay something is happening right now.
Karen: I mean people became fans, like crazy
tomo: Hmm.
Karen: fans, right? So the UGC stuff and it's not yours anymore, Like you did this thing, it's not
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yeah.
Karen: yours. People are making I mean, I've seen crochet mugs, t shirts. event live events, performance art
tomo: Have you seen the tattoos?
Karen: both elements. Both elements. Tattoos.
tomo: Yeah
Karen: The tattoos.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Lot of them.
Karen: A lot of tattoos. Right. That's not a sticker. That's you will keep that's
tomo: Tattoos like tattoos like a thing you will keep Yeah
Karen: Do you guys know or have you heard of this concept of the third, the third artist? It really just means collaboration. So what really is powerful is that you guys did this thing together so naturally.
tomo: Yep. Yeah, it wouldn't be the same if it wasn't Victoria, if it wasn't my song. Like we love to say that it's a 50-50 job. this is the project is like half mine and half Viggs because that's what makes it like so beautiful and i think like the the people equally love the music and the character like when you say like it's like the third what what what was the expression the the third artist yeah it's it's really like that
Karen: Artist. Artist. more than a like you It only works because it's together. It it's magic.
tomo: And I and I feel like it's a part of our story as well like because we always
Karen: Mm.
tomo: wanted to do something like that and we know each other for like 10 years and this is like a new beginning of something because we have this dream of making our cartoon together and this is the Big opening to it. So it's yeah, it's it's
Karen: I'd say. Right.
tomo: it's it's it's magic
Karen: it is magic. and You make this thing, you put it out there, it's it's it's yours together, this collaboration, this partnership, this th third artist idea, but now it's not yours anymore.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): But it it was kind of overwhelming because at this moment I felt split it between happiness because I'm I'm proud of the success. But at the same time I feel anxious, stressed because we received a lot of message telling us quick quick make make some merch make another episode make a series take decision now because it's a trend you have to to react quickly because everyone will forget about him in one week so it was a pretty stress trustful but I think the the fact that we are two i it's very rasur rassurant command
Karen: Mm-hmm. Reassuring.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): reassuring because when I feel anxious tomorrow have kind words for me and same in the other way and I think I feel like we could we we
Karen: Balance.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Come on Yes, we balance. We we are good duo and I feel like I w I command shnore par
tomo: I wouldn't, I wouldn't.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): I wouldn't manage it so well if I was on my own.
Karen: on your
tomo: Yeah, we really balance our emotions. Luckily, when I'm down, she's up. And the same thing, we're
Victoria Ronat (vigz): I think.
tomo: never down together. So we can cheer each other up when...
Victoria Ronat (vigz): We o we say often the first one to complain is supported by the other.
tomo: Hmm.
Karen: real partnership.
tomo: Yeah, yeah.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yeah.
Karen: well when something surprises people, comes out of nowhere, right? And hits the sort of like dull monocultures like we're all kind of you feels
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Mm-hmm.
Karen: like people are all kind of same same same same same stores same movies
tomo: Mm-hmm.
Karen: and something hits it out of nowhere and then there's a rush to make it make sense to the monoculture like you said maybe take advantage make a merchandise, make more, make this. Are you gonna make another one? Are you gonna go to Cartoon Network? Are you gonna make a movie? Are you gonna blah blah blah blah blah? And you're like, wait
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Mm-hmm.
Karen: a minute, we're just having fun with twenty of our friends on on Twitch and writing some music it seems to me like you guys have been very very smart about that, but just not smart like calculating, smart like natural, like, no, this is just what's right for us. Is that
tomo: Hmm.
Karen: how do you know how to manage that?
tomo: Like as we said in the beginning our dream is to make something together so And by something I mean like a cartoon a show something we that came from us and I feel like this is what guides us to like stay in our line Stay with our ideas and not rush and when people show up to us and said you should do this you should do that you should do this okay but this is not our ideas this is not this is not our way so we won't do that and it's a long road it's a long long long road because we have only two people and we doesn't know anything about like this animation world and and all the things that came with making a show, making a cartoon but this is how we manage the things and yeah, maybe Victoria if you have something to add,
Victoria Ronat (vigz): we really wanted to take our time to
tomo: Hmm.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): make the r right decision because we didn't feel like rushing it it's a good idea. we we take our time, we take the time to reach out for amis animation professional. I joined an animation association called Les Femmes Anim. and that's an association that bring some tips and some con conseil
tomo: Nice.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): advice thank you to a young woman who wants to make a place in the animation industry so we have the opportunity to make a writing residence it's a month in in a house with other artists and we have the time to to create our project, to speak with others w and have feedbacks. last year we take a lot of time to think about it to reach out some professional and and really yeah take the right decision. don't know.
Karen: You're serious. Right, right. So perhaps since that guided you, it's guiding you as you move forward and you take the time and not do what everybody else is doing. And that can be your superpower, on top of you guys doing this, like the world, it's complicated. It's a tra compliqué. And
tomo: Mm-hmm. Yep.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yeah.
Karen: you're and and you're young artists and you wanna make a living with your art and with what you do. And and it's community for you guys and just things that feel natural. And fun is a big part of it. And I and I wondered like just like how's everybody doing out there? Your community and your friends? Are they feeling the same way? Like, how are the kids doing?
tomo: Like other our friends, other artists like like evolving is like
Karen: Yeah, you're just yeah, just the vibe, like how's everybody doing?
tomo: the world right now? That's your question?
Karen: Just yes, as an artist going out, you're okay, how old are you guys?
tomo: 27 and
Victoria Ronat (vigz): twenty eight.
tomo: 28.
Karen: Yeah, so you're like, you're not babies and you're y but you're young, right? You've done some things and you've got this great thing and you're meeting all these people and your most important thing in life as an artist, I think, is to develop your own point of view. Cause nobody can take that from you, right? So you guys are s doubling down on that. You're spending time doing that. Amazing. Does it fe and it feels like maybe that's a response, right? Response to the world. I don't know if it is.
tomo: Mm, mm, mm, mm, mm.
Karen: Like, I I guess I'm not asking you to speak for like a generation of people, but also I just wanna know like how are the kids doing? How how's the kids doing out there?
tomo: No, no, no, yeah, yeah, but I mean I mean we are surrounded by artists all of our friends are artists because we are evolving in artist like ways so I feel like everyone feel the same like everyone wants to Make a living with arts But... I feel like it's a response. I feel like we have all these creative minds and it's natural. we want to... bring joy to everyone who will meet our art.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): I feel like we choose a creative path in our life so we we see how old friends getting married married getting some kids and every everything like this. So it's not It's not we we're not confident every day about how choice choice. maybe artificial intelligence doesn't reassuring us no more, and quaque m'enfonce dans ce que je dis.
tomo: No, go ahead, it's interesting.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): in France we have a lot of political decision who makes artist life more difficult than before. we have a fantastic organization that's called CNC who is an organ an organization that give you some financement for your project but signs maybe one years six months they they they kick they they cut yeah they cut the project
tomo: as he cut it, Yeah.
Karen: Cut cut the budget. Right. Right. Yeah.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): for internet create creator so
Karen: Mm.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): we have some political decision to make status more difficult too because we have the intermittence du spectacle so maybe s show intermitt I don't know to t translate it but we have a statue that allow
Karen: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): us to work on a project and have some time off with remuneration and Taking the time to find another job and like this and live like this. But yeah, it's more difficult then when we grew up. And I think we have a a good a good group of friends that I don't know how to say it in English, but in France we say besser les bras, lower the arms. So
tomo: No, no, no.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): abandoning to give up, yeah. We Yeah.
tomo: To give up, we... Yeah. No one in our group wants to give up. We are really ambitious. We are really... We believe in our arts. And we believe on... I believe in Viggs and she believes in me. So she... And I believe in all my friends. And I feel like this is our strength. like this is what what's make me how how can i say like wake up in the morning and do stuff like yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah so i don't know about like yeah i don't
Karen: There you go. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Gives you the strength, the confidence. You're not alone, you know, and in a way with that support system, you want to prove to each other. Yeah.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yeah.
tomo: know about all the the kids out there but we have like in our group we are like yeah the power
Victoria Ronat (vigz): power of f friendship.
tomo: of friendship yeah yeah I don't know if it's
Karen: The the power of friendship. That's incredible. And I imagine that's
tomo: answer your question well like we talked a lot okay okay okay
Karen: No. No, it's good. There's no
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yeah.
Karen: there's no wrong answers, Tomo. I
tomo: Yeah, thank you.
Karen: i i it's it's a powerful thing, like community and friendship and
tomo: Yeah.
Karen: and I and I do think that that is really great advice for for anyone as well, no matter where you are in your creative life or just life life, who you surround yourself with and having reason to get up in the morning and and make stuff, right? is is powerful. That's that's everything, Has that initial Twitch community has that has that changed?
Victoria Ronat (vigz): J'ai pas compris, pardon.
tomo: Did change anything to have your community on Twitch?
Victoria Ronat (vigz): yeah, of course. I'm afraid to be present on internet, as a woman, as an artist. and I feel like Twitch give me the confidence because I have to animate a show, talk in front of a lot of people. a lot of I don't know, and I can't keep up I can't watch the list of viewers every time. So I need to be myself one hundred percent because if my mom came in the chat, if my friends, if my coworker came in the chat, I have to be myself and I feel like it's a really good exercise for giving confidence and giving and and Gaining some yeah, some some confidence.
Karen: because you could be a persona y you know, right, and
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yeah, yeah, of course.
Karen: not and not be yourself and
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Mm mm.
Karen: what you're saying is that then that wouldn't not only would it wouldn't work, it wouldn't be it wouldn't be worth it. It wouldn't be it wouldn't be w worth you you doing that. Is that do I understand that? Yeah.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Mm mm.
Karen: Yeah, yeah, absolutely. So yeah, I'm sure you're getting a lot of phone calls. You know, getting lot of meetings, your calendar's different than it was a year ago. But like what's what's the one phone call that that you really want to receive, me about?
Victoria Ronat (vigz): can say one you have, you already have.
tomo: We had.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): We had yes. That's
Karen: Yeah. breaking news.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): that's the New York Times. Do you remember?
tomo: wait, yeah. these articles like we had like this bit, this segment in a local TV channel like but they never reach out, they never like ask us like hey do you want to talk about it like and the first who did that it's like the New York Times and this was like crazy to us like what Like, okay, okay, I'm... I didn't remember the name of the journalist but hey, this is the New York time, do you want to talk about Le Poisson Steve? And we were like, yo... And fun fact, this was like our first English meeting. Like, we had a lot of English calls now but it was the first, like we didn't know how to speak English. Like, Le Poisson Steve...
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yes. And we didn't speak En English in front of each other. So it was pretty stressful.
tomo: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, really unlock our English like I didn't
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yeah.
tomo: I didn't speak English as good as I speak it right now it's not perfect but I can yeah yeah and
Victoria Ronat (vigz): We still have progress to make, but
tomo: the New York Times was like literally
Karen: It's inc that's incredible.
tomo: the first thing like in April 2025 like the journalist called us and our English was really really really bad and she said like you know what
Victoria Ronat (vigz): We started I know.
tomo: I'm gonna send you the question and you're gonna write the answer we were so proud of this yeah yeah yeah yeah
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yeah, and she was very patient.
tomo: yeah yeah and very kind yeah yeah
Karen: that's kind of what I mean also by like you hitting the monoculture. Like what's bigger than the New York Times? So like that's that's really incredible.
tomo: Yeah, right?
Victoria Ronat (vigz): I think we have an another call we we love to receive. it's what it it is Cartoon Network, Yes. We yes.
tomo: We would love, love to have like a phone call from Cartoon Network because maybe it's maybe like our common influence. Like we really, really love the shows that come, came out like Cartoon Network and we're really inspired by that. And we would love... We would love to talk about our show, about our stories and maybe do something with them. I don't know. This is like the dream font call. for... I'm a producer. We heard about Le Poisson Steve. Like, what do you want to do? Because we would love to work with you guys and... Like, this is the dream font call. Yeah, why not?
Karen: Should be able I mean the New York Times called, like you took down TikTok. It feels like anything's possible at this point. What is it
tomo: Yeah, right?
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yeah. Why not?
tomo: Right? Exactly.
Karen: what's what's your what's your collaboration look like today?
tomo: we have of course Le Poisson Steve that we are developing We want to make a series out of it like the plan is to like Like you said it don't belong to us because we give it to an internet and every people like are doing their own stuff, but we want to like retake this and tell our stories We we have a lot of things to share like we have a lot of joy a lot of questions a lot of many things and So this is our obviously our main collaboration right now But I'm a musician, I make music on my own and Victorial animates things. we wanted to show the world that we are not only the Poisson Steve, we can make other things. And we made a little animation on a song of mine. It's called Pas Du Tout. It's on our social media. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Karen: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah,
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Not not at the door.
Karen: yeah, okay, okay. Yeah, I saw I saw that. And again, like
tomo: Yeah.
Karen: you know, like just happiness, like Pharrell Williams happiness, you know, like it's like
tomo: Hmm.
Karen: just so perfectly matched, you know, like two people Doing something together. Again,
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Right.
Karen: the third artist thing, that's that's
tomo: Yeah, but we have like something we called le ping pong. Le ping pong is like the tennis table. Yeah. Okay, so le ping pong,
Karen: Ping pong. Yeah, yeah. Ping pong. Yeah. Yeah.
tomo: is how we are collaborating. So this
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Floor.
tomo: is our workflow. So this is a big secret I will reveal to you.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Okay.
Karen: I won't tell anybody.
tomo: Like when we have an idea like Maybe for pas du tout, it's an example. Like, we have like this big idea, okay, we have to do this. And Victoria
Victoria Ronat (vigz): We wanted to
tomo: she has more ideas and when she has more ideas I have more ideas and this is just a little game of ideas and the result is like a beautiful collaboration with our both point of view like this is and somehow the thing I imagine in my head it's not the result but it's better because like
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yes.
tomo: there is like her point of view and I think it's beautiful like I think the third artist came from this workflow like because
Karen: Ping pong fork flow.
tomo: yeah yeah exactly
Karen: guys, this is so cool. You've got your cat there, Tom. I was play not if not if the
tomo: Yeah, I have my cut.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): most beautiful cat in the world.
Karen: That cat could not
tomo: It's a big cut.
Karen: be bothered.
tomo: Never.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): sweet.
Karen: this is so this is so fun. And thanks so much. We spent
tomo: Yeah.
Karen: so much time. my God, we've been talking forever.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Thank you so much for having us.
tomo: No, it's okay, it's okay.
Karen: This is really, this is really great. And I hope we can keep the conversation going. I really want to hear how you guys are doing and
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yes, of course.
tomo: Yeah, of course, of course. Yeah.
Karen: so inspiring. And
tomo: Thank you.
Karen: just know that you've got a f you've got fans over here as well as
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yeah.
Karen: At the n at the New York Times, you know. All right, guys, have a g yeah, yeah.
tomo: Thanks, thank you so much for having us. it was a
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yeah, it
tomo: great conversation.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): doesn't And s sorry for
Karen: Friday evening as well.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): for my English and I I hope everyone will understand me.
tomo: It was great.
Karen: Your English is quite good. C'est parfait. It is.
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Merci beaucoup.
Karen: my pleasure. Alright. Until Annecy next year. I'll see you in France. Okay. Okay. Au revoir.
tomo: Yeah! Yes! Okay! Bye! Au revoir! Bye!
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Au revoir. Bye.
Karen: What
tomo: salut!
Victoria Ronat (vigz): a little stressed at the beginning. Sorry. Yes, thank you.
Karen: too much pressure because you you open your window so you're not getting no, no, no, no, don't. Plus I can like I said, I I first of all, it's so
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yes.
Karen: human to expose yourself. I think this is perhaps you're like this is your theme of your life. You're like, I'm just doing the things that make me uncomfortable. And you're just doing it. Doing it, right? I love
Victoria Ronat (vigz): Yeah.
Karen: that. Maybe Tomo, you're that way
tomo: Yeah.
Karen: too, but you gotta you're a little cooler customer, you I want you to open your window. That's it. That's it.
tomo: I'm faking it till I make it
