Welcome to Empathy Deployed

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Jon: Welcome to empathy deployed the
podcast where you can experience an

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example customer interview every week.

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You'll discover new perspectives on
different software products and improve

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your customer interview technique.

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As I attempt to do the same

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I'm Jonathan Markwell.

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This episode provides some background
on why I started this podcast.

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If you'd like to get straight into
some customer interview examples,

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you can skip to episode one.

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I've lost jobs, falling out with
co-founders and had my software

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products fail, because I didn't
understand other people's perspective.

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I really enjoy writing software
and tinkering with my own ideas.

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My comfort zone is not talking to anyone.

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Unsurprisingly, multiple
colleagues have given me feedback,

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telling me I lack empathy.

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I spent over a decade struggling
with this along with the anxiety,

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depression, and debt that often
followed, I think fortunate to see

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more than my fair share of success.

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I've helped four B2B subscription
businesses go from zero to

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over 1 million in revenue.

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After spending hundreds of thousands
of pounds building the wrong thing,

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they discovered the problem they
should have been solving all along.

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I can trace the success of each of them
to a few conversations where the founders

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empathized with customers, luck played
far more of a part than it should

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have in making those conversations.

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I've had many teachers who have
taught me the importance of

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empathy over the last 15 years.

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I've attended conferences, listen to
podcasts, read books and taking courses.

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They've drilled it into me.

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I know having more empathy for
customers, colleagues, friends,

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and family would be a good thing.

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It will help me grow personally
and professionally, and I will

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be better equipped to help them.

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Yeah, I still fail to
practice it regularly.

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I've wondered if I'm
just not cut out for it.

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I learned I was dyslexic at
16, which explained some of my

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struggles with work at school.

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I also really struggled with making
friends and keeping them last year.

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My son was diagnosed as autistic
and I learned much more about

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neurodiversity as a result.

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I know I'm an introvert, but I
suspect I may have ADHD and, or

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be autistic as well, either way.

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I feel I need to put far more
work into having and displaying

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empathy than other people might.

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There's one podcast I've kept up
with every episode of over the

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last year, and it's really helped.

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I started listening to the software social
podcast, because I wanted to change from

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hearing the experiences of men without
children starting software businesses.

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I kept listening because I
found it more insightful and

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inspiring than anything else.

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I relate to the hosts.

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Colleen schnetzler as a Ruby developer and
Michelle Hanson as a customer research.

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Yeah.

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I found one episode,
particularly fascinating.

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And interview of one of Colleen's
customers conducted by Michelle.

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In the example, interview Michelle
expertly demonstrated what questions to

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ask, how to ask them and how to respond.

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The example is an excellent companion
to Michelle's book, deploy empathy.

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I was lucky enough to get early access
when she started publishing chapters

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to her newsletter earlier, this.

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It was the practical guide to
interviewing customers that I, and many

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of my clients always needed the book
and interviewing combined inspired me

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to conduct 12 customer interviews for
both my clients and my own businesses.

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Michelle's work helped me have some
of the most insightful customer

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interviews I've ever experienced.

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We learned pricing for one product
was far too low for some custom.

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We learned the job and other product did
for customers was completely different

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from how we described it on the website.

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I found myself talking to people outside
of work in far more positive ways.

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I was getting a better understanding of
how and why other people were thinking

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certain things, even when I didn't
agree with their ideas, then before

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I knew it, I realized I had failed
to keep up with this new practice.

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Weeks had gone by since my last customer
interview, I spent another with my

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heading code, not talking to anyone
outside of my household, I'd likely fall

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into the trap of building more stuff.

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Nobody wants I was stressed and it
was showing outside of work too.

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Now there's a hack I've used repeatedly
over the years to force me to do

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something that doesn't come naturally.

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I'm really bad at starting
conversations with people and

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building long-term relationships.

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I learned early on that if you
organize something, people will

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inevitably come to you with
questions and break the ice for you.

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So I started meetups conferences and
even a coworking community to get to know

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people and keep seeing them regularly.

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I can now trace most of my
best clients and many of my

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closest friends back to doing.

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I felt I needed a new hack to keep me in
the habit of doing customer interviews,

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listening to an example, customer
interview every week might do the trick.

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I'd have a steady source of
inspiration to do it myself.

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I found other people were
looking for this, but no one

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else seemed to be doing it.

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So after checking Michelle wasn't planning
something similar, I started this pub.

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I'm recording this intro after
doing the first two interviews, I've

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learned about highly valued products.

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I was previously unaware of I've learned
why they were chosen by people working

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in different businesses to my own.

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I'm hopefully getting
better at empathizing with

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people with each interview.

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You can be the judge of that.

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They're not perfect.

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I'm still learning, but I think you're
going to find them as fascinating as that.

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Each episode explores a different
software product from the perspective

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of a different user I'm being guided
by the interview script, Michelle

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includes and deploy empathy.

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I'm primarily focusing on business
software products as that's

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always been my area of interest.

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You might hear from people
using your competitor's

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products in parts of the world.

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You don't yet have customers in.

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Hopefully this will help you
to discover new perspectives.

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Make better products and do more customer
interviews for your own products.

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Guests will get some attention
from my audience of business

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owners and developers.

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Those who haven't been
on a podcast before.

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Shouldn't find my questions at all.

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Difficult to answer the focus will be
on tools and services they've been using

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rather than them and their own businesses
seasoned podcasters will hopefully find is

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a nice change of pace from other podcast.

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But of course also gets influenced a
few hundred people into building better

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products while raising awareness of
their own businesses and or causes.

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If you'd like to join me as a guest on
a future episode, please send me a note.

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I'm jumped on Twitter.

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That's J O T.

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My DMS are open.

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You can also use the form at
empathy, deployed.com or email.

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Hello at empathy deployed.

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Please include the names and
addresses of free software products

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you use regularly and or pay for.

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Now.

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Let's get into the customer interviews.