บทถอดความฉบับเต็มของ 10 YRS AGO FLAGSHIP: Keller & McNeill talk Goldberg's real legacy from '90s, Lesnar-Goldberg prospects, Shane McMahon emasculating wrestlers

done 68 00:04:18.930 --> 00:04:21.389 a nice job in the podcast market. Jim Ross, Steve Austin, 69 00:04:21.430 --> 00:04:25.980 Chris Jericho, and on and on. And we appreciate your 70 00:04:26.060 --> 00:04:29.959 continued support as we continue to cover current events. We 71 00:04:30.000 --> 00:04:33.399 are a current events-driven show. So current, in fact, sometimes 72 00:04:33.420 --> 00:04:37.319 we're analyzing SmackDown and Raw on this very show before 73 00:04:37.360 --> 00:04:41.290 the show even ends. As the final scene is fading, 74 00:04:41.350 --> 00:04:44.410 we go on the air every Monday night and Tuesday 75 00:04:44.449 --> 00:04:45.589 night taking your calls online. 76 00:04:46.009 --> 00:04:46.889 And discussing the show. 77 00:04:46.949 --> 00:04:49.990 I hosted the post-RAW show solo on Monday, and I 78 00:04:50.029 --> 00:04:54.170 was joined by Greg Parks, PW Torch SmackDown correspondent and 79 00:04:54.389 --> 00:04:55.670 Pro Wrestling Torch newsletter columnist. 80 00:04:55.689 --> 00:04:57.329 Greg Parks yesterday after SmackDown. 81 00:04:58.319 --> 00:05:02.480 Today, I am pleased to be joined by Pat McNeil, 82 00:05:02.540 --> 00:05:05.220 who only because of Bruce Mitchell is not the senior 83 00:05:05.240 --> 00:05:07.500 Pro Wrestling Torch columnist, but he is a 15-plus year 84 00:05:07.519 --> 00:05:10.259 veteran with the Torch. Pat, welcome back to the livecast. 85 00:05:12.110 --> 00:05:15.889 Well, thank you. I'm looking forward to one day being 86 00:05:16.170 --> 00:05:19.149 more than just another middle-aged torch columnist. It's good to 87 00:05:19.170 --> 00:05:19.449 be here. 88 00:05:19.550 --> 00:05:20.189 Hello, you people. 89 00:05:20.600 --> 00:05:21.209 Good to have you. 90 00:05:22.680 --> 00:05:29.139 Pat, I just retweeted the East Coast Cast's poll question, Twitter. 91 00:05:28.920 --> 00:05:30.600 Poll question of the day. 92 00:05:31.019 --> 00:05:34.120 They will be on, by the way, at 6.30 Eastern 93 00:05:34.279 --> 00:05:40.529 tonight at EastCoastCast.com. Travis Bryant, the host of that program. 94 00:05:41.399 --> 00:05:43.060 they want to know what is the biggest story this week. 95 00:05:43.740 --> 00:05:45.579 And here are their four choices, Pat. I will ask 96 00:05:45.620 --> 00:05:49.420 you this question, and then we'll go from there. Brock Lesnar-Goldberg, 97 00:05:50.439 --> 00:05:54.550 No Mercy's main event, the result of it, the proposed 98 00:05:54.750 --> 00:05:58.769 network tiers, or a women's Hell in a Cell match. 99 00:05:59.189 --> 00:06:00.649 Do you have a fifth option for the biggest story 100 00:06:00.670 --> 00:06:02.670 of the week? And if not, which of those four 101 00:06:02.689 --> 00:06:04.689 do you think trumps the others? 102 00:06:06.699 --> 00:06:10.300 Well, obviously the fifth option has to be James Ellsworth 103 00:06:10.399 --> 00:06:13.160 finally gets the opportunity he's been waiting for. He's been 104 00:06:13.180 --> 00:06:15.250 paying his dues in this business for umpteen years, and 105 00:06:15.290 --> 00:06:17.069 he's going to get his title shot against A.J. 106 00:06:17.170 --> 00:06:17.509 Stiles. 107 00:06:18.230 --> 00:06:19.170 That is true. 108 00:06:19.230 --> 00:06:20.170 Yes, that's another option. 109 00:06:21.930 --> 00:06:28.269 So what's your pick? I would probably say Lesnar versus Goldberg. Yeah, 110 00:06:28.529 --> 00:06:33.389 I agree. And it's because the network tiers could be 111 00:06:33.410 --> 00:06:35.689 a big deal, but right now it's something that's only 112 00:06:35.769 --> 00:06:36.610 a discussion point. 113 00:06:37.129 --> 00:06:38.129 Yeah, I agree. 114 00:06:39.819 --> 00:06:42.120 Well, Lesnar-Goldberg, because I did want to talk to you 115 00:06:42.139 --> 00:06:46.220 about this, and I wanted to talk about Goldberg himself 116 00:06:47.100 --> 00:06:51.790 and his value to WWE today and his legacy. That's 117 00:06:51.829 --> 00:06:53.689 one of the topics I want to go in-depth on today. 118 00:06:53.750 --> 00:06:55.230 I do want to give out the phone number and 119 00:06:55.250 --> 00:06:58.449 let people know we are Driven. by current events, but 120 00:06:58.470 --> 00:07:00.689 we're also driven by callers. And we'd like some high-quality 121 00:07:00.730 --> 00:07:01.310 calls today. 122 00:07:01.629 --> 00:07:04.589 Give us a call. 123 00:07:04.610 --> 00:07:05.610 515-605-9345. 124 00:07:05.949 --> 00:07:14.009 That's 515-605-9345. Push 1 on your touchtone phone if you're 125 00:07:14.029 --> 00:07:16.540 interested in joining the program. Otherwise, you stay in the 126 00:07:16.560 --> 00:07:23.139 background in the standby queue. That's 515-605-9345. Pat, before I 127 00:07:23.160 --> 00:07:25.100 get your thoughts on Goldberg, let's just take a call 128 00:07:25.240 --> 00:07:28.180 right away. And so in case someone's on lunch break 129 00:07:28.259 --> 00:07:31.180 or on a commute and happen to be stopped somewhere, 130 00:07:31.220 --> 00:07:33.170 we don't lose their opportunity to talk to us. 131 00:07:33.199 --> 00:07:33.779 Let's start with 520. 132 00:07:33.779 --> 00:07:37.459 Area code 520, you're kicking off the caller portion of 133 00:07:37.480 --> 00:07:39.899 the show. State your name and the city you're calling from. 134 00:07:41.899 --> 00:07:42.480 Hey, Wade. 135 00:07:42.519 --> 00:07:45.189 This is Andy from Tucson, Arizona. First time caller. 136 00:07:45.689 --> 00:07:47.930 Oh, first time caller. We love it. Thanks for calling. 137 00:07:47.949 --> 00:07:48.550 How'd you hear about our show? 138 00:07:51.079 --> 00:07:54.399 Many moons ago, I was listening to a review of 139 00:07:54.420 --> 00:07:57.050 the Stone Cold podcast, and of course, you put your stuff, 140 00:07:57.209 --> 00:08:02.110 and I've been listening ever since. I tried it all 141 00:08:02.529 --> 00:08:05.290 for the Rob Post and the SmackDown, but I'm on 142 00:08:05.329 --> 00:08:08.120 the West Coast, so it's barely starting when

you guys 143 00:08:08.139 --> 00:08:08.660 are going on. 144 00:08:09.939 --> 00:08:12.500 Yeah, makes sense. All right, yeah, what have you got 145 00:08:12.519 --> 00:08:12.920 for us today? 146 00:08:15.139 --> 00:08:19.209 Two things and that's it first I might incur the 147 00:08:19.250 --> 00:08:23.750 wrath of the IWC with this question but in regards 148 00:08:23.769 --> 00:08:28.449 to Sasha Banks does anybody else cringe when she cuts 149 00:08:28.490 --> 00:08:32.809 her promos I don't feel she was very strong on 150 00:08:32.830 --> 00:08:36.490 the mic and I kind of just cringe and the 151 00:08:36.529 --> 00:08:40.830 second question is about New Day and the demolition record 152 00:08:41.730 --> 00:08:46.639 do you believe that New Day would have dropped the 153 00:08:46.720 --> 00:08:50.799 titles by now had it not been for Bill Eady 154 00:08:51.159 --> 00:08:53.279 being on the lawsuit. So they kind of want to 155 00:08:53.340 --> 00:08:55.879 scratch demolition out of the record books because of that. 156 00:08:56.539 --> 00:08:57.200 And that's all I got. 157 00:08:57.419 --> 00:08:57.639 Cool. 158 00:08:57.659 --> 00:08:58.399 Good topics, Andy. 159 00:08:58.700 --> 00:09:00.980 Well, first of all, on this show, I think if 160 00:09:01.000 --> 00:09:03.460 you listen regularly, you know that we are not the 161 00:09:03.480 --> 00:09:08.299 voice of the IWC. In fact, I think the IWC 162 00:09:08.370 --> 00:09:10.190 thinks this is awesome chants are a sign of a 163 00:09:10.230 --> 00:09:14.269 great match. Um, they think that, uh, that chanting you 164 00:09:14.289 --> 00:09:16.509 deserve it is the coolest thing in the world to 165 00:09:16.549 --> 00:09:20.070 do at a wrestling show. Um, and that certain companies 166 00:09:20.090 --> 00:09:22.029 and wrestlers can do no wrong. I mean, that's just 167 00:09:22.070 --> 00:09:27.090 not what we're about. Um, so have, have no fear callers, um, 168 00:09:27.129 --> 00:09:29.269 going against what you think is a conventional wisdom out 169 00:09:29.289 --> 00:09:31.399 there on the internet. Um, in fact, a big part of, 170 00:09:31.549 --> 00:09:32.929 I think what we do here at the torch pad 171 00:09:33.320 --> 00:09:40.990 is battle conventional wisdom. It doesn't mean we're contrarians by design, uh, arbitrarily. So, but, uh, Yeah, no, 172 00:09:41.389 --> 00:09:43.620 we are not in lockstep with whatever the trendy thing 173 00:09:43.779 --> 00:09:45.500 is in terms of who's cool and what to do. 174 00:09:46.039 --> 00:09:47.279 I'm with you, Andy. 175 00:09:48.220 --> 00:09:55.629 I criticized Sasha Banks in my TV report this week 176 00:09:56.389 --> 00:09:59.710 talking about how on Raw I just thought this whole 177 00:09:59.730 --> 00:09:59.970 thing about. 178 00:10:00.960 --> 00:10:02.100 I can't believe I'm here. 179 00:10:02.120 --> 00:10:04.799 I was a little girl and now I'm here and 180 00:10:04.840 --> 00:10:07.080 I watched Eddie Guerrero and I can't believe I'm here 181 00:10:07.159 --> 00:10:09.409 and then going on Twitter and gushing with her rival 182 00:10:09.889 --> 00:10:12.889 on social media about how much she's so appreciative of 183 00:10:12.909 --> 00:10:14.669 the great match that they got out of each other 184 00:10:14.789 --> 00:10:17.250 and all of that and then her doing all the 185 00:10:17.289 --> 00:10:20.250 crazy high spots that's almost getting her killed shortening her 186 00:10:20.289 --> 00:10:23.659 career i was glad to see bailey this week speak 187 00:10:23.779 --> 00:10:25.860 out and say that when she watches the matches she 188 00:10:25.960 --> 00:10:28.460 cringes she fears for their safety and she chews them 189 00:10:28.539 --> 00:10:31.340 out after matches there's a lot about sasha banks that 190 00:10:31.379 --> 00:10:33.940 i think is it represents a lot of things about 191 00:10:34.539 --> 00:10:36.100 and i and i don't like to generalize you don't 192 00:10:36.139 --> 00:10:37.960 hear me using the term iwc much but since andy 193 00:10:37.980 --> 00:10:39.730 brought it up there's a lot of things about the 194 00:10:39.779 --> 00:10:42.710 quote iwc approach that sasha entails that i think are 195 00:10:42.870 --> 00:10:48.039 really really if not maybe just kind of annoying, but 196 00:10:48.379 --> 00:10:52.039 counterproductive also. I think that if there was ever a 197 00:10:52.059 --> 00:10:54.639 time for her, Pat, to talk about her history and, 198 00:10:55.200 --> 00:10:56.480 oh my God, I can't believe I'm here, it'd be 199 00:10:56.500 --> 00:10:58.679 the week after she headlined Raw and the week after 200 00:10:58.700 --> 00:10:59.340 she won the title. 201 00:10:59.779 --> 00:11:01.759 I get that. I want to see her move away 202 00:11:01.820 --> 00:11:02.059 from it. 203 00:11:02.259 --> 00:11:04.470 I want to see her get into a mode of, 204 00:11:04.620 --> 00:11:07.250 I've earned it and I belong, not this, oh, I'm 205 00:11:07.289 --> 00:11:08.990 just a fan who loved Eddie and I can't believe 206 00:11:09.009 --> 00:11:11.889 I'm here. It's just too much of that. And I 207 00:11:11.909 --> 00:11:13.509 don't want to see her, by the way, go into 208 00:11:13.549 --> 00:11:15.299 Hell in a Cell and and try to get this 209 00:11:15.360 --> 00:11:17.139 is awesome chants. If she gets a this is awesome 210 00:11:17.159 --> 00:11:20.139 chant in that match, she's failing at her job, and 211 00:11:20.200 --> 00:11:22.840 so is Charlotte. The fans should be cheering for her 212 00:11:22.879 --> 00:11:26.960 to win and booing Charlotte, not thinking about how cool 213 00:11:27.000 --> 00:11:29.799 the moves are. That's not what draws in wrestling. It 214 00:11:29.850 --> 00:11:32.289 doesn't at a large level. So that's my take on 215 00:11:32.409 --> 00:11:34.990 the first topic. We'll get to demolition after that. Pat, 216 00:11:35.029 --> 00:11:38.549 your thoughts on Sasha Banks and her promo approach. 217 00:11:40.340 --> 00:11:44.620 Okay, well,

the promo Monday night was clearly over-scripted by somebody, 218 00:11:45.059 --> 00:11:48.750 and the time to give the I-can't-believe-I'm-here promo is the 219 00:11:48.789 --> 00:11:51.850 week you debut on the main roster, pretty much. At 220 00:11:51.909 --> 00:11:54.429 this point, when she's been there over a year and 221 00:11:54.450 --> 00:11:56.730 she's already won the title, it doesn't do a whole 222 00:11:56.750 --> 00:12:01.330 lot for anybody. The goal of acting like a star, 223 00:12:01.370 --> 00:12:05.120 try to act like you've done this before. As for 224 00:12:05.169 --> 00:12:08.679 the IWC, the IWC is an indie promotion out of Pittsburgh, 225 00:12:08.720 --> 00:12:13.029 last time I checked. And conventional wisdom, I know you 226 00:12:13.110 --> 00:12:16.110 battle conventional wisdom at times, Wade, and I appreciate that. 227 00:12:16.190 --> 00:12:19.529 But in my opinion, conventional wisdom is the stuff that 228 00:12:19.549 --> 00:12:21.259 comes out of my mouth when I speak on a 229 00:12:21.279 --> 00:12:23.639 show like this, and it gets picked up and repeated 230 00:12:23.679 --> 00:12:24.179 by other people. 231 00:12:25.539 --> 00:12:25.879 Thank you. 232 00:12:26.500 --> 00:12:27.480 Excellent, excellent, Pat. 233 00:12:28.139 --> 00:12:31.740 As far as Demolition goes, they found a way actually 234 00:12:31.759 --> 00:12:35.490 a few months ago to beat Demolition's record. already, which 235 00:12:35.549 --> 00:12:38.669 was to not acknowledge it, to pretend that those tag 236 00:12:38.690 --> 00:12:41.690 team titles are different, and they're not part of the 237 00:12:41.769 --> 00:12:45.899 lineage of the company, despite WrestleMania history being part of 238 00:12:45.929 --> 00:12:48.519 their lineage. I mean, despite all these, you know, it 239 00:12:48.559 --> 00:12:50.940 was just inconsistently applied. A lot of people were kind 240 00:12:50.980 --> 00:12:54.360 of upset about it. Like, you know, you understand it's 241 00:12:54.399 --> 00:12:59.519 a technicality, and you're ignoring their history. Are they, I 242 00:12:59.539 --> 00:13:01.799 won't say that petty, because I'm not sure that petty 243 00:13:01.820 --> 00:13:04.080 is the right word, but are they that driven to 244 00:13:04.690 --> 00:13:07.580 by things like that, that they would keep the titles 245 00:13:07.629 --> 00:13:09.899 on New Day, even if they thought booking-wise it would 246 00:13:09.919 --> 00:13:13.500 be better to switch them, just to spite Demolition, who 247 00:13:13.600 --> 00:13:15.879 are a Hall of Fame tag team, except for the 248 00:13:15.919 --> 00:13:18.480 fact that Bill Eady's not in good standing with the company. 249 00:13:20.340 --> 00:13:21.940 Except for the fact that they're not actually in the 250 00:13:21.960 --> 00:13:26.169 Hall of Fame. Yes, that's correct. Yeah, I mean, the 251 00:13:26.370 --> 00:13:28.570 first question is all divided into two parts. The first 252 00:13:28.590 --> 00:13:30.629

part of the question is, are they that petty? I 253 00:13:30.649 --> 00:13:34.080 think we've established over the years that Yes, Ben McMahon 254 00:13:34.259 --> 00:13:37.820 and family are occasionally that petty. But like you pointed out, 255 00:13:37.840 --> 00:13:43.129 the correct approach is to just pretend Demolition's Reign never happened, 256 00:13:43.149 --> 00:13:45.289 since we have a new set of tag belts and 257 00:13:45.330 --> 00:13:49.149 a new name for the tag belts. And I think 258 00:13:49.830 --> 00:13:52.610 that they actually want to recognize that New Day has 259 00:13:52.649 --> 00:13:57.429 been champions for over 400 days, and approaching the record, 260 00:13:57.480 --> 00:13:59.480 and that might be part of the storyline. Now, you 261 00:13:59.519 --> 00:14:02.629 look at last night, I mean, Miz mentions... that he 262 00:14:02.669 --> 00:14:06.539 held the Intercontinental title for 187 days. Well, that was 263 00:14:06.600 --> 00:14:10.559 never part of the storyline. You never had JBL and 264 00:14:10.580 --> 00:14:14.019 Mauro Ranallo going, Boy, this is approaching the all-time record 265 00:14:14.039 --> 00:14:16.980 for longest Intercontinental title reign held by the Hockey Talk Man. 266 00:14:17.559 --> 00:14:21.139 They didn't do that. So it's sort of irregular. And 267 00:14:21.899 --> 00:14:24.590 I can see it going either way. I would have 268 00:14:24.659 --> 00:14:26.970 thought that New Day would have lost the tag title 269 00:14:27.029 --> 00:14:31.009 by now if they are not putting together strong competition 270 00:14:31.090 --> 00:14:33.500 for New Day. And I think that's part of the 271 00:14:33.539 --> 00:14:35.210 reason that they've helped the titles for so long. 272 00:14:36.669 --> 00:14:37.450 All right, very good. 273 00:14:38.070 --> 00:14:40.809 Let's go to our first commercial break of the program. 274 00:14:41.409 --> 00:14:43.309 And when we come back, more phone calls. It looks 275 00:14:43.350 --> 00:14:45.830 like 732 is on deck. You can be on deck, too. 276 00:14:45.850 --> 00:14:46.269 515-605-9345. 277 00:14:46.330 --> 00:14:47.690 Give us a call. 278 00:14:47.710 --> 00:14:47.990 515-605-9345. 279 00:14:48.029 --> 00:14:50.610 We're going to try to get to calls quickly after 280 00:14:50.629 --> 00:14:52.710 you call. We're going to try to go for no 281 00:14:52.730 --> 00:15:01.049 long hold times here. because I know some of you 282 00:15:01.169 --> 00:15:04.419 on our midday episode, our midweek episode here, are on 283 00:15:04.700 --> 00:15:07.419 lunch break or have limited time. So give us a 284 00:15:07.440 --> 00:15:08.759 call while we're in the commercial break, and we'll try 285 00:15:08.779 --> 00:15:11.259 to get to your call quickly. I'm Wade Keller, joined 286 00:15:11.460 --> 00:15:14.519 by Pat McNeil, Torch columnist, and we're going to talk 287 00:15:14.639 --> 00:15:18.419 Goldberg's legacy and his value to WWE as one of 288 00:15:18.440 --> 00:15:21.740 the big topics on today's program, too. But first, some notes, 289 00:15:21.860 --> 00:15:25.980 some details on our main website that you are assigned 290 00:15:26.000 --> 00:15:29.000 the duty of visiting multiple times a day to keep 291 00:15:29.070 --> 00:15:33.070 up on Wrestling News. exclusive features, get live TV coverage, 292 00:15:33.629 --> 00:15:38.500 and so much more. Here's details on our flagship website, pwtorch.com. 293 00:15:40.500 --> 00:15:42.419 If you're like me, you've got a list of your favorites. 294 00:15:44.019 --> 00:15:47.340 Did you know that you can enjoy commercial-free versions of 295 00:15:47.539 --> 00:15:50.070 all of your favorite Wade Keller podcasts and PWTorch daily 296 00:15:50.090 --> 00:15:54.970 casts on Spotify? Just go to patreon.com, search PWTorch, and 297 00:15:55.009 --> 00:15:58.029 subscribe to a VIP membership tier. You get a seven-day 298 00:15:58.070 --> 00:16:00.009 free trial, by the way. to kick the tires a 299 00:16:00.049 --> 00:16:02.269 bit and see if you like the service and then 300 00:16:02.389 --> 00:16:04.450 sync it with Spotify. And you can listen to commercial 301 00:16:04.470 --> 00:16:06.769 free versions of our free shows, like the Wade Keller 302 00:16:06.789 --> 00:16:09.850 post shows, the Wade Keller podcast flagship, our flashbacks, and 303 00:16:09.889 --> 00:16:12.429 also the PW torch day, the cast lineup, again, all 304 00:16:12.500 --> 00:16:15.399 commercial free and nice streamlined listening experience. But with third 305 00:16:15.419 --> 00:16:18.419 tier membership, you can also unlock all the VIP podcasts, 306 00:16:18.460 --> 00:16:20.860 including everything with rich and Wade, the fix with Todd 307 00:16:20.879 --> 00:16:22.899 Martin that I host with Todd every week, the Wade 308 00:16:22.919 --> 00:16:26.570 Keller news bulletins, post pay-per-view roundtables and and an array 309 00:16:26.649 --> 00:16:30.429 of other VIP-exclusive podcasts with different hosts and different themes. 310 00:16:30.929 --> 00:16:34.889 Check out the lineup, go to Patreon, and search PWTorch, 311 00:16:35.370 --> 00:16:37.870 and subscribe and sync it up with Spotify, or stay 312 00:16:37.990 --> 00:16:41.659 within the Patreon ecosystem. Either way works, go to Patreon 313 00:16:41.840 --> 00:16:43.740 and start your seven-day free trial. 314 00:16:51.879 --> 00:16:52.440 And we are back. 315 00:16:52.779 --> 00:16:55.240 This is Wade Keller, joined by Pat McNeil. This is 316 00:16:55.320 --> 00:16:59.500 the PWTorch Livecast. Thanks so much for joining us today, 317 00:16:59.600 --> 00:17:06.279 either live at 1.14 p.m. Eastern Time on Wednesday, October 12, 2016, 318 00:17:06.279 --> 00:17:09.519 or on demand in iTunes or on popular podcast apps. 319 00:17:09.960 --> 00:17:13.210 You name them, we are on them and available. You 320 00:17:13.230 --> 00:17:19.009 can also find our show at PWTorchLivecast.com. That's our homepage 321 00:17:19.049 --> 00:17:23.900 for this

show. Not PWTorch.com, but PWTorchLivecast.com. Find out when 322 00:17:23.920 --> 00:17:27.859 the next show is airing and have access to prior shows, 323 00:17:27.940 --> 00:17:33.700 including our archives of past interviews. Tomorrow at 1 Eastern 324 00:17:33.869 --> 00:17:37.250 is Interview Thursday. Friday is Primetime Friday at 7 Eastern 325 00:17:37.269 --> 00:17:40.930 with Bruce Mitchell and Travis Bryant. Saturday morning, Pat McNeil, 326 00:17:41.049 --> 00:17:43.710 I believe you are guest hosting once again for Jim Valley, who, 327 00:17:43.730 --> 00:17:45.089 believe it or not, is traveling. 328 00:17:45.210 --> 00:17:45.950 Am I correct on that? 329 00:17:47.630 --> 00:17:51.180 You are correct, sir. I will be doing that. Joining 330 00:17:51.200 --> 00:17:55.240 me will be Rob Kellum, a.k.a. the Maestro, who was 331 00:17:55.400 --> 00:17:59.670 in WCW, Memphis Wrestling, and Smoky Mountain Wrestling, and has worked, 332 00:17:59.829 --> 00:18:03.430 I believe, for every single independent promotion in the Southeast. 333 00:18:03.589 --> 00:18:04.609 So that will be interesting. 334 00:18:05.430 --> 00:18:08.930 Very cool. And that is at 1130 Eastern, Saturday morning. 335 00:18:11.279 --> 00:18:11.519 Yes. 336 00:18:11.559 --> 00:18:12.099 So be there. 337 00:18:12.460 --> 00:18:12.859 Be there. 338 00:18:12.960 --> 00:18:17.900 And, you know, hey, Monday Night War certainly counts as nostalgia. 339 00:18:18.720 --> 00:18:21.069 Saturday morning wrestling, a nostalgia-based program. We're actually going to 340 00:18:21.089 --> 00:18:24.930 take a day off from the PWTorch livecast on Sunday. 341 00:18:25.430 --> 00:18:27.750 It's amazing. There will be no show on Sunday. However, 342 00:18:27.789 --> 00:18:31.109 we will be doing VIP audio shows nonstop because that's 343 00:18:31.150 --> 00:18:33.410 what we do. We make sure that there is always 344 00:18:33.450 --> 00:18:39.440 something for you waiting in your podcast queue from PWTorch 345 00:18:39.480 --> 00:18:41.240 when you're a VIP member. We'll talk about that later. 346 00:18:41.279 --> 00:18:43.220 Let's go to our second phone call of the day. 347 00:18:43.539 --> 00:18:45.829 If you want to be in line on the phone banks, 348 00:18:45.849 --> 00:18:50.930 call us 515-605- 9-3-4-5-7-3-2. Thanks for holding. Please state your 349 00:18:50.950 --> 00:18:51.769 name and where you're calling from. 350 00:18:51.789 --> 00:18:57.519 Hey, Scott. VIP member, Jamesburg, New Jersey. How are you tonight? 351 00:18:57.960 --> 00:19:00.460 Doing great. Good to hear from you, Scott. What have 352 00:19:00.480 --> 00:19:01.099 you got for us? 353 00:19:03.240 --> 00:19:05.579 I've got a couple things. We really enjoyed your rant 354 00:19:05.660 --> 00:19:08.369 on VIP audio on Monday night on the hotline. 355 00:19:08.730 --> 00:19:11.829 Your rant against Raw. You seemed very agitated. It was 356 00:19:11.890 --> 00:19:13.430 interesting to hear your point of view. 357 00:19:14.269 --> 00:19:14.569 Thank you. 358 00:19:17.920 --> 00:19:20.599 Guys real quick my first thing I got is my 359 00:19:20.640 --> 00:19:23.480 first question I want to ask you guys is with 360 00:19:23.500 --> 00:19:26.069 the way Survivor Series is shaping up I know Wade 361 00:19:26.109 --> 00:19:28.369 last night on the hotline you were not very happy 362 00:19:28.410 --> 00:19:31.950 with the way that it's set up Smackdown vs Raw 363 00:19:32.029 --> 00:19:35.470 with the three Survivor Series matches I. 364 00:19:35.450 --> 00:19:39.119 Can't wait Scott I can't wait to see a bunch 365 00:19:39.150 --> 00:19:41.339 of people who aren't feuding and have no personal issues 366 00:19:41.420 --> 00:19:43.000 fight in a match where I have no stake in 367 00:19:43.039 --> 00:19:45.319 who wins that's going to be great. 368 00:19:44.900 --> 00:19:45.559 All right, go ahead. 369 00:19:47.640 --> 00:19:50.130 I agree with you. I can't agree anymore. I thought 370 00:19:50.150 --> 00:19:52.009 that you made a great point. Why not have five 371 00:19:52.069 --> 00:19:55.170 on five survivor series matches with the raw brand doing 372 00:19:55.210 --> 00:19:57.549 a five on five and the SmackDown brand doing a 373 00:19:57.589 --> 00:20:01.180 five on five, you know, like doing their own special thing. 374 00:20:01.200 --> 00:20:03.619 And then someone comes out with some heat instead of 375 00:20:03.640 --> 00:20:07.980 not nonsensical, not just like you said, no one's rooting 376 00:20:08.039 --> 00:20:10.910 for the red brand or the blue brand. It's, You know, 377 00:20:11.009 --> 00:20:12.809 I don't see how it's going to happen. I don't 378 00:20:12.970 --> 00:20:15.789 see how it's going to work. But, Pat, I am intrigued. 379 00:20:15.829 --> 00:20:18.309 I guess they were listening to the Wayback Playback when 380 00:20:18.329 --> 00:20:22.210 you guys were viewing Survivor Series 87 with the tag team, 381 00:20:22.230 --> 00:20:24.779 10-man tag team match. What do you guys think about that? 382 00:20:25.660 --> 00:20:26.700 Please, for the love. 383 00:20:26.619 --> 00:20:34.240 Of God, don't pin this on me. I mean, it's 384 00:20:34.279 --> 00:20:37.349 a spectacle when you have a 10-on-10 tag match, which 385 00:20:37.430 --> 00:20:39.869 is basically what this is going to be. but the 386 00:20:39.920 --> 00:20:44.250 spectacle doesn't always translate into a great match. Plus when 387 00:20:44.269 --> 00:20:47.269 you do a tag team situation like that and the 388 00:20:47.309 --> 00:20:49.549 falls come at the same pace as a single situation, 389 00:20:49.589 --> 00:20:52.650 it starts to look goofy pretty quick. 390 00:20:53.390 --> 00:20:58.170 And I know that on ticket reseller websites that ringside 391 00:20:58.190 --> 00:21:01.349 tickets plummeted when Shane McMahon made that announcement because if 392 00:21:01.369 --> 00:21:02.609 you're in the first 20 rows, you're not going to 393 00:21:02.630 --> 00:21:04.650 be able to

see anything the whole show. All you're 394 00:21:04.670 --> 00:21:07.130 going to get to see is the backs of people. 395 00:21:07.890 --> 00:21:09.829 of a bunch of wrestlers standing waiting to get tagged in. 396 00:21:12.289 --> 00:21:14.940 Well, but that'll be exciting to some people. But, yeah, 397 00:21:16.460 --> 00:21:19.220 I can't verify Wade's statement, but, yeah, I can't imagine 398 00:21:19.279 --> 00:21:21.720 that the way it's set up, that those three matches 399 00:21:21.740 --> 00:21:23.359 are going to be a draw. But they don't have 400 00:21:23.400 --> 00:21:25.980 to be because Goldberg's fighting Lesnar, maybe. 401 00:21:27.880 --> 00:21:28.799 Maybe, yes, we will see. 402 00:21:29.039 --> 00:21:30.220 Scott, go ahead. 403 00:21:31.269 --> 00:21:34.849 Guys, one or two things. The first thing is, speaking 404 00:21:34.869 --> 00:21:37.980 of that, Can you make a prediction on what kind 405 00:21:38.019 --> 00:21:40.319 of pop Goldberg can have to the ratings on Monday? 406 00:21:40.339 --> 00:21:42.539 Do you think it could be substantial? 407 00:21:43.700 --> 00:21:50.000 That's the $ 10, 000 question, the $ 25, 000. 408 00:21:48.079 --> 00:21:48.640 Question, Pat. 409 00:21:49.099 --> 00:21:53.069 The influence of Goldberg on the ratings, that's one of 410 00:21:53.109 --> 00:21:54.970 the topics I want to get into as we get 411 00:21:55.009 --> 00:21:56.650 a little deeper into the show. Pat, give me your 412 00:21:56.670 --> 00:21:59.329 short answer on that. We'll delve more into the nuances 413 00:21:59.730 --> 00:22:01.309 once we get past a few of the phone calls 414 00:22:01.369 --> 00:22:03.869 and kind of hit that topic because somebody was on 415 00:22:03.910 --> 00:22:05.779 hold and just dropped off. because I think we didn't 416 00:22:05.799 --> 00:22:07.440 get to him right away. So I want to move 417 00:22:07.460 --> 00:22:10.279 swiftly through calls before we get to the in-depth Goldberg talk. Pat, 418 00:22:10.539 --> 00:22:12.759 do you have a prediction on how many tenths of 419 00:22:12.779 --> 00:22:16.299 a rating point difference, positive, negative, or otherwise, if there's 420 00:22:16.319 --> 00:22:18.359 such an otherwise on an either-or like that, that Goldberg 421 00:22:18.380 --> 00:22:18.940 will make? 422 00:22:19.019 --> 00:22:23.240 The short answer is it can't hurt. The long answer 423 00:22:23.500 --> 00:22:26.279 is I think I can get a 2.0 out of 424 00:22:26.319 --> 00:22:29.440 this Monday show. It depends on how well they capitalize 425 00:22:29.509 --> 00:22:31.769 on the portion of the show where Goldberg is coming out. 426 00:22:32.309 --> 00:22:35.230 If they save it for the last segment and they 427 00:22:35.289 --> 00:22:37.410 tease it and they milk it, they might be able 428 00:22:37.430 --> 00:22:40.259 to get a 2.0 as well within the realm of possibility. 429 00:22:41.319 --> 00:22:44.519 Yeah, and I mean, considering that the ratings that they're 430 00:22:44.539 --> 00:22:50.420 drawing typically are 1.93 or 1.92 the last two weeks, 431 00:22:50.859 --> 00:22:53.319 predicting a 2.0 isn't even a tenth of a rating 432 00:22:53.359 --> 00:22:56.779 point difference. However, percentage-wise these days. 433 00:22:58.569 --> 00:23:01.420 It's as significant as a two or three-tenths of a 434 00:23:01.430 --> 00:23:04.380 rating point jump was during the Monday Night War period 435 00:23:04.400 --> 00:23:05.420 last time Goldberg was around. 436 00:23:05.880 --> 00:23:06.960 The world is a different place. 437 00:23:07.140 --> 00:23:08.980 The wrestling world is a different place from a ratings 438 00:23:09.019 --> 00:23:12.759 and viewership standpoint compared to the last times that Goldberg 439 00:23:12.779 --> 00:23:19.460 was around. Scott, my prediction is they will jump above 2.0. 440 00:23:19.460 --> 00:23:21.880 They're going up against a Jets game. The Jets aren't good, 441 00:23:21.900 --> 00:23:24.670 but it is a New York market. So that can 442 00:23:24.710 --> 00:23:27.140 influence things a little bit. but it didn't seem to 443 00:23:27.160 --> 00:23:29.359 make a big difference this week. Monday Night Football ratings 444 00:23:29.839 --> 00:23:32.819 were 13 million two Mondays ago, 9 million this past Monday, 445 00:23:33.240 --> 00:23:36.119 and Raw's ratings were flat. So I'm not sure how 446 00:23:36.160 --> 00:23:39.650 much the Monday Night game changes things that much. I 447 00:23:39.670 --> 00:23:42.690 think with the announcement at Goldberg with one week notice, 448 00:23:42.710 --> 00:23:45.029 depending on the type of publicity that they do through 449 00:23:45.069 --> 00:23:47.190 social media and their website and that kind of thing, 450 00:23:48.529 --> 00:23:50.589 I would go as high as we can round up 451 00:23:50.630 --> 00:23:50.890 to a 2.1. 452 00:23:50.880 --> 00:23:52.579 The problem is it's a one. 453 00:23:56.099 --> 00:23:57.640 Segment, feature. 454 00:23:58.599 --> 00:24:01.940 And to me, a hot product makes a bigger difference 455 00:24:01.980 --> 00:24:04.000 in the ratings when people want to watch start to 456 00:24:04.039 --> 00:24:08.519 finish than one segment. I think the Goldberg segment will 457 00:24:08.559 --> 00:24:11.440 do great numbers on YouTube in the 48 hours after 458 00:24:11.480 --> 00:24:14.039 Raw goes off the air. That's my more solid prediction 459 00:24:14.339 --> 00:24:16.180 because I think there's people who just don't want to 460 00:24:16.200 --> 00:24:21.490 wait around. I think WWE might have done themselves a favor, Pat, 461 00:24:21.529 --> 00:24:25.859 by promising that Goldberg would be on in the first 462 00:24:25.940 --> 00:24:29.119 hour of Raw. And then kind of plot it out 463 00:24:29.200 --> 00:24:31.819 for like 40 minutes into the first hour. But have people, 464 00:24:32.359 --> 00:24:34.240 give people an incentive to tune in and let them know. 465 00:24:34.269 --> 00:24:35.529 You're not going to have to watch for three

hours, 466 00:24:35.569 --> 00:24:37.670 God forbid, to see Goldberg. He's going to be on 467 00:24:37.690 --> 00:24:40.170 in the first hour. But you could also run some 468 00:24:40.210 --> 00:24:43.210 sort of an angle or something that would be sort 469 00:24:43.230 --> 00:24:45.210 of a cliffhanger and then have Goldberg actually come out 470 00:24:45.230 --> 00:24:47.890 a second time later in the show. But let people 471 00:24:47.930 --> 00:24:49.769 know right away, tune in at the beginning. You don't 472 00:24:49.789 --> 00:24:50.430 want to miss Goldberg. 473 00:24:52.740 --> 00:24:54.859 Well, yeah, but that's not what they do. I mean, 474 00:24:54.940 --> 00:24:57.079 they would have had to have planned out next week's 475 00:24:57.119 --> 00:24:59.980 show before this week's show to make that announcement, and 476 00:25:00.000 --> 00:25:00.640 they never do that. 477 00:25:00.880 --> 00:25:01.099 Yes. 478 00:25:01.599 --> 00:25:03.339 All right, Scott, appreciate the call. Always good to hear 479 00:25:03.359 --> 00:25:04.480 from you. Thanks for being a VIP member. 480 00:25:06.480 --> 00:25:08.700 Thank you, Wade, for everything. Thanks to you, too, Pat. 481 00:25:08.720 --> 00:25:09.480 Appreciate it, Pat. 482 00:25:09.549 --> 00:25:10.109 Have a great one. 483 00:25:10.349 --> 00:25:10.609 Thanks. 484 00:25:10.950 --> 00:25:11.130 Okay. 485 00:25:11.609 --> 00:25:11.950 All right. 486 00:25:12.329 --> 00:25:18.569 Let's now go to 6143. This could be international. If 487 00:25:18.609 --> 00:25:20.190 you heard a tone, that's you. State your name and 488 00:25:20.210 --> 00:25:27.569 the city or country you're calling from. Yes, say your name, 489 00:25:27.589 --> 00:25:28.730 we'll repeat it, that means it's you. 490 00:25:31.210 --> 00:25:34.369 Hi there, how are you going? It's Dan, and I'm 491 00:25:34.450 --> 00:25:35.609 from Melbourne, Australia. 492 00:25:36.089 --> 00:25:39.089 All right, cool. Stan from Australia, what have you got 493 00:25:39.109 --> 00:25:39.299 for us? 494 00:25:41.390 --> 00:25:43.630 Dan. Oh, Dan? 495 00:25:43.829 --> 00:25:44.029 Okay. 496 00:25:44.109 --> 00:25:44.750 Oh, Dan, okay. 497 00:25:44.829 --> 00:25:45.470 Yeah, Stan. 498 00:25:46.109 --> 00:25:46.410 Excellent. 499 00:25:46.809 --> 00:25:50.609 Yeah, sorry, first-time caller, and I'm a VIP member of 500 00:25:50.630 --> 00:25:55.329 the service, guys, thank you. Um, okay. So I have, uh, 501 00:25:55.769 --> 00:25:59.799 just a couple of questions and a point. Well, can 502 00:25:59.819 --> 00:26:03.359 we go to the NXT show in Melbourne? So let 503 00:26:03.380 --> 00:26:05.400 you guys know how that is. That'd be awesome. 504 00:26:05.740 --> 00:26:06.579 Excellent. 505 00:26:06.599 --> 00:26:10.579 And, um, what do you think my question, first question is, 506 00:26:10.720 --> 00:26:16.250 what do you think, um, with WWE's booking with AJ Styles, uh, 507 00:26:16.289 --> 00:26:20.990 going from last, uh, from SmackDown recently, um,

It looks really, 508 00:26:21.390 --> 00:26:25.630 the comical stuff just doesn't seem to give much credibility 509 00:26:25.650 --> 00:26:28.529 to his title run so far, even though he has 510 00:26:29.009 --> 00:26:31.890 wins over Sinan Ambos. Just wondered what you thought of that. 511 00:26:32.630 --> 00:26:34.299 I think that's a great topic, Dan. 512 00:26:34.579 --> 00:26:40.660 I thought, Pat, that AJ walked, probably did not come 513 00:26:40.720 --> 00:26:45.000 across as a main event heel, the way that he 514 00:26:45.079 --> 00:26:49.410 was acting even before James Ellsworth came out. I was 515 00:26:49.430 --> 00:26:53.009 trying to find the adjective to describe his demeanor, and 516 00:26:53.029 --> 00:26:55.170 I couldn't quite come up with the exact one. I 517 00:26:55.210 --> 00:26:57.519 wasn't able to spend time with my thesaurus during the 518 00:26:57.559 --> 00:26:59.839 show last night. But I was watching it like Dan 519 00:26:59.859 --> 00:27:01.880 Pat thinking, I don't know that I think it's a 520 00:27:01.900 --> 00:27:05.109 little unbecoming of a guy who's a top credible heel 521 00:27:05.200 --> 00:27:07.609 champion to be acting that way. It sort of felt 522 00:27:07.650 --> 00:27:09.950 third or fourth from the top type, third or fourth 523 00:27:09.990 --> 00:27:10.809 at the top type of role. 524 00:27:12.970 --> 00:27:16.079 I don't know what adjective you're looking for, but goofy, 525 00:27:16.099 --> 00:27:18.039 would that be it, or not quite? 526 00:27:18.660 --> 00:27:21.480 Yeah, I mean, that's a good, well, that's the best 527 00:27:21.519 --> 00:27:24.660 word of the options I was thinking of, that is better. Yeah, 528 00:27:24.700 --> 00:27:27.279 he was just acting too goofy. But in a way 529 00:27:27.299 --> 00:27:29.089 that was, I thought, sort of unbecoming. I thought it 530 00:27:29.109 --> 00:27:33.230 was a little kind of childish, and like the butt 531 00:27:33.250 --> 00:27:35.170 of the joke. To me, it's like the role that 532 00:27:35.210 --> 00:27:37.890 he was playing is what the role that like Byron 533 00:27:37.930 --> 00:27:40.710 Saxton plays as the foil, or something like that. It's 534 00:27:40.759 --> 00:27:43.400 just I don't know, it just felt wrong. It felt 535 00:27:43.480 --> 00:27:46.910 out of step with when AJ is on fire on 536 00:27:46.970 --> 00:27:47.829 SmackDown otherwise. 537 00:27:50.289 --> 00:27:53.119 Yeah, well, I guess they're tired of people cheering for him, 538 00:27:53.660 --> 00:27:57.559 so I guess that's the way to solve that, maybe. Yeah, well, 539 00:27:57.779 --> 00:28:00.660 I was just thinking back to the 1980s and then when... 540 00:28:01.400 --> 00:28:03.960 And when the NWA did that great angle with Ric 541 00:28:04.000 --> 00:28:06.839 Flair fighting George South in a squash match, and they 542 00:28:06.880 --> 00:28:08.960 made Dusty the special guest referee, and Dusty beat up 543 00:28:09.000 --> 00:28:11.269 Ric Flair and put George South

on top. Oh, wait, 544 00:28:11.309 --> 00:28:13.710 they never did that. There's probably a good reason why 545 00:28:13.730 --> 00:28:19.890 they never did that. Yeah, this is gone. It's gone 546 00:28:19.910 --> 00:28:22.740 beyond silly. And there's a reason why the crowd reaction, 547 00:28:22.799 --> 00:28:24.339 if you go back and do some of these shows 548 00:28:24.380 --> 00:28:25.839 that Jim Bell and I have done on the way back, 549 00:28:25.880 --> 00:28:29.319 way back, the crowd reaction from 20, 25, 30 years 550 00:28:29.359 --> 00:28:31.900 ago were a little bit different from the crowds now. 551 00:28:31.940 --> 00:28:33.819 For one thing, nobody was chanting, this is awesome. 552 00:28:35.000 --> 00:28:37.079 And that's not just because the internet taught people wrestling 553 00:28:37.099 --> 00:28:40.049 wasn't real, because people knew back then wrestling wasn't real. 554 00:28:40.089 --> 00:28:42.509 The difference was when you walked into a building, you 555 00:28:42.549 --> 00:28:45.349 walked into a magic, and when you walked into an arena, 556 00:28:45.750 --> 00:28:48.769 you walked through some sort of force field where everything 557 00:28:48.869 --> 00:28:52.329 became real when you were in that building, because the 558 00:28:52.490 --> 00:28:55.210 wrestlers and the promoters and the presentation of the product changed. 559 00:28:55.720 --> 00:28:58.799 on television and during that live event, played into that, 560 00:28:58.900 --> 00:29:00.859 the way the wrestlers wrestled played into that. 561 00:29:01.500 --> 00:29:02.539 And it can happen. 562 00:29:02.579 --> 00:29:04.099 It's the same, one of the reasons people like to 563 00:29:04.140 --> 00:29:06.569 go to movie theaters. It's this isolation chamber where you 564 00:29:06.660 --> 00:29:09.990 enter this other universe and you get immersed in it 565 00:29:10.309 --> 00:29:12.750 and you're not evaluating how good the acting is. If 566 00:29:12.769 --> 00:29:14.730 the acting's good, you're not thinking about the acting. If 567 00:29:14.750 --> 00:29:16.670 the special effects are good, you're not thinking about the 568 00:29:16.710 --> 00:29:20.109 special effects. In almost all cases, you're immersed in the 569 00:29:20.150 --> 00:29:24.049 characters and the story that they're telling. And that's what, 570 00:29:24.420 --> 00:29:26.819 Pro Wrestling should aim for, not that this is Awesome Chance. 571 00:29:27.480 --> 00:29:30.000 You can do what they did with AJ last night, 572 00:29:30.759 --> 00:29:33.430 and people might not cheer him. But they're also not 573 00:29:33.450 --> 00:29:36.069 going to take him seriously. And that's one of the 574 00:29:36.109 --> 00:29:39.390 problems I have with Shane McMahon. Talking to AJ Styles 575 00:29:39.410 --> 00:29:41.970 like he's... his Little League coach going, do you understand? 576 00:29:42.309 --> 00:29:47.190 Do you understand me? I mean, Shane McMahon is awful. Awful. 577 00:29:47.519 --> 00:29:50.599

He and Stephanie both play that role, but at least 578 00:29:50.619 --> 00:29:55.480 Stephanie's a heel. He talks down to wrestlers, including his 579 00:29:55.559 --> 00:29:59.480 world champion heel, as if they're a 10-year-old who got 580 00:29:59.539 --> 00:30:02.680 distracted by a balloon and let a goal in. You 581 00:30:02.809 --> 00:30:05.089 don't talk to your wrestlers on the air that way. 582 00:30:05.769 --> 00:30:07.849 I just, it's so frustrating watching it. And, yeah, I 583 00:30:07.890 --> 00:30:09.809 didn't think last night was a good night for AJ Styles. 584 00:30:11.710 --> 00:30:15.259 Yeah, compared to Shane McMahon, Stephanie is Helen Mirren. You know, 585 00:30:15.279 --> 00:30:18.640 this is, I mean, it's just not even close. And 586 00:30:18.720 --> 00:30:21.519 I was, I missed the weeks that they had Shane 587 00:30:21.539 --> 00:30:22.279 McMahon not be there. 588 00:30:23.079 --> 00:30:23.660 Yes. 589 00:30:23.680 --> 00:30:24.059 Go ahead, Dan. 590 00:30:26.559 --> 00:30:28.849 Yeah, thank you. Now, just going on from what you 591 00:30:28.869 --> 00:30:31.789 were saying there, Wade, about the Shane McMahon thing, at 592 00:30:31.829 --> 00:30:37.250 the end of that segment, he said, I had to 593 00:30:37.589 --> 00:30:39.470 take business into my own hands. What do you think 594 00:30:39.519 --> 00:30:42.119 he meant by that? I think that could be something, 595 00:30:42.700 --> 00:30:44.440 I was thinking it might have been something to do 596 00:30:44.480 --> 00:30:46.019 with the club, but then how could they get them 597 00:30:46.099 --> 00:30:49.220 over to SmackDown and make it seem believable? 598 00:30:49.420 --> 00:30:49.900 What do you think? 599 00:30:50.289 --> 00:30:51.730 Ah, interesting. Pat, what do you think? 600 00:30:54.400 --> 00:30:56.400 I'm not sure I understood the question. 601 00:30:57.559 --> 00:30:58.460 Let me help. 602 00:30:59.480 --> 00:31:01.369 He's saying at the end, AJ said, I've got to 603 00:31:01.380 --> 00:31:03.710 take things into my own hands. Does that maybe mean 604 00:31:03.730 --> 00:31:05.170 he's going to try to get the club moved over 605 00:31:05.190 --> 00:31:06.509 to SmackDown to give him some help? 606 00:31:08.150 --> 00:31:12.210 That might be a good idea, yeah. It does give 607 00:31:12.259 --> 00:31:14.940 him somebody to play off of. It makes him more 608 00:31:15.000 --> 00:31:17.740 of a threat if he has guys there who can 609 00:31:17.880 --> 00:31:22.559 beat up his opponents. Plus, they're not really doing anything 610 00:31:22.579 --> 00:31:26.359 with Gallows and Anderson on Raw. I mean, there's a 611 00:31:26.380 --> 00:31:28.339 set of a few for them with Enzo and Cass, 612 00:31:28.400 --> 00:31:31.769 but that's something that's kind of low on the list 613 00:31:31.789 --> 00:31:32.720 of priorities right now. 614 00:31:34.450 --> 00:31:35.529 Dan, I appreciate your call. 615 00:31:38.130 --> 00:31:39.730 Thank you very much for taking it. Have

a good night. 616 00:31:40.009 --> 00:31:40.329 Absolutely. 617 00:31:40.349 --> 00:31:40.630 You too. 618 00:31:40.730 --> 00:31:43.099 Appreciate your call. Thanks for being a VIP member. Always 619 00:31:43.130 --> 00:31:48.230 cool to hear from This is a PWTorch Livecast. I'm 620 00:31:48.250 --> 00:31:50.670 Wade Keller, joined by Pat McNeil. We're rolling through phone calls. 621 00:31:50.670 --> 00:31:53.490 443 is next. Please state your name and where you're 622 00:31:53.509 --> 00:31:54.009 calling from. 623 00:31:54.069 --> 00:31:55.509 What city, 443? James from. 624 00:31:58.369 --> 00:31:59.910 Baltimore, Maryland. 625 00:31:59.930 --> 00:32:00.970 James from Baltimore. 626 00:32:01.130 --> 00:32:02.190 Is this James Ellsworth? 627 00:32:03.430 --> 00:32:04.890 No, no, no, not that one. 628 00:32:04.970 --> 00:32:05.470 Oh, okay. 629 00:32:05.490 --> 00:32:05.930 Just checking. 630 00:32:06.250 --> 00:32:07.210 That would have been a cool cameo. 631 00:32:07.230 --> 00:32:08.410 Go ahead, James. Questions. 632 00:32:15.740 --> 00:32:16.289 NXT. 633 00:32:17.349 --> 00:32:20.589 Do you guys, is Cedric Alexander on NXT, or is 634 00:32:20.650 --> 00:32:22.609 he part of the Cruiserweight? 635 00:32:22.950 --> 00:32:23.230 Yes. 636 00:32:24.930 --> 00:32:26.470 He's both, as near as I can tell. 637 00:32:28.109 --> 00:32:28.859 Yeah. 638 00:32:28.950 --> 00:32:32.119 I was at the NXT Bel-Air Baltimore, whichever one you 639 00:32:32.140 --> 00:32:35.200 want to call it, and they put him over great. 640 00:32:36.079 --> 00:32:38.779 He had a match with Glorious Bobby Roode, of course, 641 00:32:39.599 --> 00:32:43.569 and it was awesome, and They gave him about a 642 00:32:43.930 --> 00:32:45.150 five-minute standing ovation. 643 00:32:45.170 --> 00:32:47.599 That's good. 644 00:32:47.650 --> 00:32:48.700 Do you see a future for him? 645 00:32:50.460 --> 00:32:53.759 Yes, I do. I don't know why he hasn't been 646 00:32:53.799 --> 00:32:56.759 on Raw the past couple weeks, except that it probably 647 00:32:56.799 --> 00:33:00.039 doesn't play into a storyline and they're protecting him. I 648 00:33:00.099 --> 00:33:02.160 think we will know more tomorrow night, which is the 649 00:33:02.220 --> 00:33:05.529 next NXT taping. And if we see Cedric on there, 650 00:33:06.150 --> 00:33:08.609 then we know he's going to stay with NXT. And 651 00:33:08.630 --> 00:33:10.619 if he stays in NXT, it's because they're setting up 652 00:33:10.650 --> 00:33:14.480 a match with him, probably at TakeOver against, uh, Cien Almas. 653 00:33:16.200 --> 00:33:16.500 Oh, okay. 654 00:33:16.680 --> 00:33:16.880 Thanks. 655 00:33:17.819 --> 00:33:18.779 Yeah. 656 00:33:18.799 --> 00:33:19.099 Anything else? 657 00:33:19.160 --> 00:33:19.400 All right. 658 00:33:19.680 --> 00:33:20.480 Thank you, Cien Almas. 659 00:33:20.500 --> 00:33:20.779 Enjoy. 660 00:33:21.220 --> 00:33:21.700 Enjoy your day. 661 00:33:21.920 --> 00:33:22.140 Cool. 662 00:33:22.460 --> 00:33:24.589 Hey, uh, Pat, what is the upside of, of, uh, 663 00:33:24.619 --> 00:33:27.819 Cedric Alexander? Uh, cause to me, he's, he hovers in 664 00:33:27.839 --> 00:33:30.660 the category of someone who could be in the heavyweight division. 665 00:33:30.700 --> 00:33:33.140 They even said on Raw in his first cruiserweight match 666 00:33:33.180 --> 00:33:34.819 that he had to cut a lot of weight to 667 00:33:34.880 --> 00:33:38.670 make cruiserweight. Um, Is Cedric somebody that they shouldn't be 668 00:33:38.710 --> 00:33:41.910 looking at as necessarily just a cruiserweight guy? Because he's 669 00:33:41.950 --> 00:33:44.950 kind of in between, I think, AJ Styles and Dean 670 00:33:45.049 --> 00:33:45.950 Ambrose in size. 671 00:33:45.990 --> 00:33:46.369 I don't think. 672 00:33:47.210 --> 00:33:49.630 I think he probably... Or at least right around AJ 673 00:33:49.650 --> 00:33:52.930 Styles in size. I think he could probably, you know, 674 00:33:53.119 --> 00:33:55.180 work in the heavyweight division. And I'm not saying that 675 00:33:56.140 --> 00:33:58.240 it's a demotion to be in the cruiserweight division. I 676 00:33:58.259 --> 00:34:00.079 don't think it should be seen that way any more 677 00:34:00.099 --> 00:34:02.680 than Conor McGregor in UFC is seen as some sort 678 00:34:02.700 --> 00:34:05.559 of inferior fighter compared to Stipe Miocic. 679 00:34:05.880 --> 00:34:06.440 But what. 680 00:34:07.839 --> 00:34:09.800 What is Cedric's upside, and where would you place him, 681 00:34:09.820 --> 00:34:10.750 in which division, and why? 682 00:34:13.809 --> 00:34:17.070 The reason he's in the cruiserweight division is because he 683 00:34:17.349 --> 00:34:19.329 cut weight to make the 205 pounds. I think that's 684 00:34:19.409 --> 00:34:23.769 really the only reason at this point. And I can't 685 00:34:23.849 --> 00:34:27.030 understand the criteria that they use for making people cruiserweights 686 00:34:27.110 --> 00:34:33.019 and not cruiserweights. You have Neville, who is pretty much 687 00:34:33.280 --> 00:34:36.909 part of the superstars roster. And you would think that 688 00:34:36.969 --> 00:34:42.250 he would be a cruiserweight, but he's not. Cedric Alexander, 689 00:34:42.269 --> 00:34:48.590 he has energy. He is athletic. Those are the main 690 00:34:48.929 --> 00:34:52.239 things about him. His work has gotten a lot better 691 00:34:52.280 --> 00:34:57.260 over the past few years. But I won't know what 692 00:34:57.300 --> 00:34:59.880 his upside is until I see them try to make 693 00:34:59.900 --> 00:35:02.260 a character out of him and give him– I give 694 00:35:02.280 --> 00:35:04.639 them a little more personality than, hey, I'm teaming with 695 00:35:04.659 --> 00:35:07.000 Rich Swann or something like that. 696 00:35:07.019 --> 00:35:08.739 All right, very good. 697 00:35:08.760 --> 00:35:10.320 We're going to go to our bottom of the hour break. 698 00:35:10.679 --> 00:35:12.949 This is PWTorch Midweek

Edition. Get in line on the 699 00:35:12.969 --> 00:35:13.360 phone banks. 700 00:35:14.050 --> 00:35:15.730 The number is 515-605-9345. That's 515-605-9345. We'll be back right 701 00:35:15.769 --> 00:35:16.329 after this. 702 00:35:30.860 --> 00:35:32.940 Admit it, you love Nick Barbatti when he co-hosts with 703 00:35:33.000 --> 00:35:34.739 me on the Wade Keller Post Shows. Well, now you 704 00:35:34.760 --> 00:35:37.050 can listen to him every week on the Nicky's Club, 705 00:35:37.090 --> 00:35:40.150 a VIP exclusive podcast. Here's Nick to tell you more. 706 00:35:40.269 --> 00:35:42.710 Hey, wrestling fans. It's Nick Barbatti, and I'm back with 707 00:35:42.730 --> 00:35:44.809 the Nicky's Club, the place where the family of Nicky's 708 00:35:44.869 --> 00:35:47.769 comes together for big laughs and sharp takes on WWE. 709 00:35:47.849 --> 00:35:50.769 From WrestleMania rumors to surprise returns, I got you covered. 710 00:35:50.929 --> 00:35:53.139 The Nicky's Club, where the wrestling feels like the coolest 711 00:35:53.159 --> 00:35:53.679 club in town. 712 00:35:53.940 --> 00:35:55.739 Nick Barbatti wants to be part of your pro wrestling 713 00:35:55.780 --> 00:35:57.860 life every week, so why not let him? 714 00:35:57.980 --> 00:35:58.780 GoVIP. 715 00:35:58.900 --> 00:36:02.940 PWTorch.com slash GoVIP for full details on signing up. We're 716 00:36:02.980 --> 00:36:06.449 compatible with Patreon, Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and just about any 717 00:36:06.489 --> 00:36:08.530 other iOS or Android app out there. You can also 718 00:36:08.550 --> 00:36:11.590 stream directly from our ad-free VIP website. The Nicky's Club, 719 00:36:11.610 --> 00:36:14.230 waiting for you every week at PWTorch VIP. 720 00:36:23.559 --> 00:36:24.360 All right, we are back. 721 00:36:24.599 --> 00:36:28.829 This is PWTorch Livecast. You can find us at PWTorchLivecast.com. 722 00:36:29.250 --> 00:36:30.550 Follow us on Twitter right now. 723 00:36:30.889 --> 00:36:31.449 Take your phone out. 724 00:36:32.710 --> 00:36:37.269 Launch Twitter and enter PWTorch and click follow. 725 00:36:38.250 --> 00:36:38.989 All right, thank you. 726 00:36:39.750 --> 00:36:42.739 At PWTorch, you can follow our sister brand at MMA Torch. 727 00:36:43.159 --> 00:36:47.760 You can follow me at TheWadeKeller. And Pat McNeil is 728 00:36:47.800 --> 00:36:51.500 my guest, 15-plus-year Torch columnist. 729 00:36:51.539 --> 00:36:55.230 How can people follow you? On Twitter, Mr. Pat McNeil. 730 00:36:57.650 --> 00:37:02.599 Well, they can follow me at RealPatMcNeil, M-C-N-E-I-L-L. That's the 731 00:37:02.679 --> 00:37:06.820 correct spelling of my last name. Or they can go 732 00:37:06.840 --> 00:37:10.039 to the PWTorch site and PWTorch Twitter feed and find 733 00:37:10.119 --> 00:37:11.539 one of the times where they link to me and 734 00:37:11.579 --> 00:37:13.400 then just click on that and follow that way. 735 00:37:14.280 --> 00:37:15.000 That works, too. 736 00:37:15.579 --> 00:37:17.869 All right, let's go to the phone lines. Once again, 737 00:37:17.909 --> 00:37:21.909 let's go to 773. State your name and where you're 738 00:37:21.929 --> 00:37:22.230 calling from. 739 00:37:24.210 --> 00:37:25.110 Boris from Chicago. 740 00:37:25.309 --> 00:37:26.050 Hey, Boris. 741 00:37:26.090 --> 00:37:26.849 Hey, Boris, made it. 742 00:37:26.849 --> 00:37:27.289 All right. 743 00:37:27.789 --> 00:37:28.389 What's up, Boris? 744 00:37:28.429 --> 00:37:32.929 Thanks for getting to us early because, yes, I'm at work. 745 00:37:33.090 --> 00:37:38.849 My first question is to Brock and Goldberg. Do you 746 00:37:38.889 --> 00:37:42.210 think it should be two or three matches because if 747 00:37:42.349 --> 00:37:50.469 Brock beats Goldberg, that's one to one, and that third 748 00:37:50.530 --> 00:37:51.570 match is the actual. 749 00:37:53.230 --> 00:37:55.409 Match that would determine who's the better of the. 750 00:37:55.309 --> 00:37:55.769 Two, right? 751 00:37:56.530 --> 00:37:58.869 And are you guys looking forward to a Miz. 752 00:38:00.909 --> 00:38:02.929 What's the Spirit Squad? Survivor Series. 753 00:38:02.949 --> 00:38:03.469 Oh, God. 754 00:38:03.750 --> 00:38:05.289 I was looking forward. 755 00:38:05.150 --> 00:38:06.869 To a Miz-Spirit Squad what? 756 00:38:09.030 --> 00:38:09.820 Survivor Series. 757 00:38:11.260 --> 00:38:13.159 I guess Miz teaming with the Spirit Squad in a 758 00:38:13.179 --> 00:38:17.360 Survivor Series match is his idea. I don't know what 759 00:38:17.400 --> 00:38:19.579 Nick Mitchell is doing that keeps him so busy that 760 00:38:19.619 --> 00:38:22.760 he couldn't make the Spirit Squad reunion. still trying to 761 00:38:22.780 --> 00:38:24.510 figure that out. 762 00:38:24.530 --> 00:38:26.340 Pat, is the destination of Dolph Ziggler to end up 763 00:38:26.360 --> 00:38:28.110 back in the Spirit Squad with Miz? Is that where 764 00:38:28.119 --> 00:38:29.050 this storyline is headed? 765 00:38:31.610 --> 00:38:32.150 Don't think so. 766 00:38:32.510 --> 00:38:35.030 Now, I think there should be a rematch, and Miz 767 00:38:35.250 --> 00:38:39.150 should win, and then Dolph Ziggler will say, yes, once 768 00:38:39.190 --> 00:38:42.469 I put my career on the line, but now I'm 769 00:38:42.510 --> 00:38:44.829 willing to rejoin the Spirit Squad if I lose. 770 00:38:45.449 --> 00:38:46.510 I want another title shot. 771 00:38:47.650 --> 00:38:49.489 Although he would be entitled to a title shot anyway, 772 00:38:49.530 --> 00:38:54.150 but Nevertheless, for the sake of my storyline here, he 773 00:38:54.190 --> 00:38:56.070 loses to Miz and ends up in the Spear Squad 774 00:38:56.090 --> 00:38:57.269 outfit again being humiliated. 775 00:38:59.739 --> 00:39:00.500 You know the thing. 776 00:39:01.380 --> 00:39:03.219 You know it's cross her mind a rune does that way. 777 00:39:04.500 --> 00:39:05.260 And then he can go on. 778 00:39:05.219 --> 00:39:08.579 Talking Smack, Pat, and he

can talk about how his character. 779 00:39:08.110 --> 00:39:09.030 Is portrayed terribly. 780 00:39:09.309 --> 00:39:11.170 He can go on Talking Smack and complain about how 781 00:39:11.449 --> 00:39:13.329 his character is portrayed terribly once again. 782 00:39:15.369 --> 00:39:18.190 Well, I mean, really there should be a line of 783 00:39:18.230 --> 00:39:20.179 people going on to Talking Smack to complain about how 784 00:39:20.199 --> 00:39:22.420 their character is being portrayed. But, yeah, I guess they 785 00:39:22.440 --> 00:39:23.000 could do that with him. 786 00:39:23.320 --> 00:39:25.510 Actually, no wrestler should ever talk about how their character 787 00:39:25.530 --> 00:39:27.650 is portrayed because that's counterproductive. 788 00:39:27.670 --> 00:39:28.230 No, they shouldn't. 789 00:39:28.269 --> 00:39:32.099 No, it's true. being ordered by their bosses to do 790 00:39:32.139 --> 00:39:34.019 so which I guess is what's happening. 791 00:39:33.719 --> 00:39:35.619 Here but that's my point no wrestler should be talking 792 00:39:35.639 --> 00:39:38.119 about their character on Smackdown and it's implied whether they 793 00:39:38.139 --> 00:39:39.619 do it on their own or at orders of their 794 00:39:39.659 --> 00:39:42.199 boss so I mean I think it's pretty apparent that 795 00:39:42.539 --> 00:39:44.380 when you say someone when I say an announcer shouldn't 796 00:39:44.400 --> 00:39:47.289 say something I'm not blaming the announcer I'm blaming whoever 797 00:39:47.849 --> 00:39:49.369 was in charge of what the announcer said. 798 00:39:49.590 --> 00:39:50.070 But anyway. 799 00:39:51.719 --> 00:39:51.940 Okay. 800 00:39:51.980 --> 00:39:53.619 Well, now that we've made that clear, and I think 801 00:39:53.659 --> 00:39:58.530 it's good, the original question is, did they have Goldberg 802 00:39:58.590 --> 00:40:02.130 win and then set up a rubber match between the two? 803 00:40:02.289 --> 00:40:04.670 And I don't think they think of it that way. 804 00:40:04.849 --> 00:40:07.010 I think that they would much rather pretend that the 805 00:40:07.030 --> 00:40:11.929 match at WrestleMania 20 never happened. I mean, they'll mention 806 00:40:11.969 --> 00:40:14.469 that it happened. Paul Heyman mentioned that it happened, but 807 00:40:14.989 --> 00:40:17.489 they really aren't going to show a lot of clips 808 00:40:17.570 --> 00:40:19.489 of it. If they do, they might show up with 809 00:40:19.510 --> 00:40:22.619 the sound muted or something. They're not going to be 810 00:40:22.659 --> 00:40:26.079 going out of their way to bring back the great 811 00:40:26.139 --> 00:40:28.619 story of WrestleMania 20 when the crowd threw both of 812 00:40:28.639 --> 00:40:29.239 them out of the building. 813 00:40:30.400 --> 00:40:30.780 No, you're right. 814 00:40:30.820 --> 00:40:33.719 It's like they didn't talk a lot about Lesnar and Undertaker. 815 00:40:35.519 --> 00:40:37.219 It was just a dream match that was happening now, 816 00:40:37.239 --> 00:40:38.559 not something that had happened before. 817 00:40:38.579 --> 00:40:40.500 It is. 818 00:40:42.000 --> 00:40:42.300 What's that? 819 00:40:44.340 --> 00:40:45.800 It had happened multiple times, yes. 820 00:40:45.929 --> 00:40:46.340 Yeah, yeah. 821 00:40:47.789 --> 00:40:49.570 This is a good time to transition. I do want 822 00:40:49.590 --> 00:40:51.449 to let people know, short wait times, if you want 823 00:40:51.469 --> 00:40:54.650 to give us a call, 515-605-9345. We're trying to get 824 00:40:54.670 --> 00:40:56.610 the calls right away today when we see the phone 825 00:40:56.630 --> 00:40:59.230 lines light up to encourage you, if you have limited time, 826 00:40:59.469 --> 00:41:05.579 to get on the phone bank. So 515-605-9345. Pat, Goldberg's 827 00:41:05.719 --> 00:41:09.079 value today, this week's Progressing Torch newsletter that will be 828 00:41:09.099 --> 00:41:12.000 put online later today, I wrote a cover story about 829 00:41:12.360 --> 00:41:16.579 this and looked at Goldberg as sort of the last– 830 00:41:17.030 --> 00:41:20.920 card that WWE can play in terms of a wrestler 831 00:41:20.980 --> 00:41:24.159 from the Monday Night War era who can still wrestle 832 00:41:24.739 --> 00:41:27.460 who they have not used up already in some form 833 00:41:27.480 --> 00:41:31.940 or fashion I know that Goldberg came back and had 834 00:41:31.960 --> 00:41:34.760 the match with Lesnar it's not like they've never utilized 835 00:41:34.820 --> 00:41:37.739 him but we're talking a dozen years ago so there's 836 00:41:37.780 --> 00:41:41.639 a chance now for Lesnar to come back at age 837 00:41:41.639 --> 00:41:45.219 49 and next year 50 years old by next year 838 00:41:45.260 --> 00:41:48.369 he'll be 50 if he has a second match Is 839 00:41:48.389 --> 00:41:50.730 there anybody else? I mean, or are we finally done? 840 00:41:51.190 --> 00:41:54.889 I mean, they've done Rob Van Dam, they've done the NWO, 841 00:41:54.909 --> 00:41:59.070 the Outsiders, they've done Sting, of course. There's nobody left, right? 842 00:41:59.110 --> 00:42:02.329 We're finally through with this once the Goldberg card is played. 843 00:42:02.349 --> 00:42:07.400 From the Monday Night Wars era, sure, we're done. But 844 00:42:07.420 --> 00:42:09.440 they're still going to be bringing people back at some 845 00:42:09.480 --> 00:42:13.019 point because they have a problem making their own guys 846 00:42:13.360 --> 00:42:21.340 seem like stars. Except with a few exceptions. I wonder 847 00:42:21.360 --> 00:42:21.860 why that is. 848 00:42:21.880 --> 00:42:22.619 Shane McMahon. 849 00:42:23.440 --> 00:42:24.920 Stephanie McMahon. I wonder why that is. 850 00:42:24.960 --> 00:42:27.699 I wonder why today's stars aren't seen as men. Maybe 851 00:42:27.739 --> 00:42:33.590 because there's McMahon authority figures asking them, am I making 852 00:42:33.619 --> 00:42:34.179 myself clear? 853 00:42:34.860 --> 00:42:37.130 And the

wrestler just stands there and goes, yes, yes, sir. 854 00:42:37.409 --> 00:42:37.789 Yes, sir. 855 00:42:37.829 --> 00:42:38.949 You made yourself clear, Mr. McMahon. 856 00:42:39.090 --> 00:42:39.230 Right. 857 00:42:41.630 --> 00:42:43.789 Because that's what Boston did back in the 90s. He 858 00:42:43.949 --> 00:42:45.070 just stood there and said, yes, sir. 859 00:42:45.090 --> 00:42:45.769 This is McMahon. 860 00:42:46.369 --> 00:42:46.590 Yes. 861 00:42:47.570 --> 00:42:48.150 That's how that worked. 862 00:42:48.349 --> 00:42:48.630 Yeah. 863 00:42:49.489 --> 00:42:52.829 So did The Rock, I remember. I remember The Rock saying, yes, ma'am, 864 00:42:52.869 --> 00:42:53.809 to Stephanie McMahon a lot. 865 00:42:54.110 --> 00:42:56.679 Yeah, Ben Bruiser Brody. And, yeah, I mean, just on 866 00:42:56.719 --> 00:43:03.119 and on. I mean, it's ridiculous. It's born out of insecurity, 867 00:43:03.300 --> 00:43:06.559 but somebody needs to step in and say no. Nobody 868 00:43:06.579 --> 00:43:08.699 talks to our top wrestlers like that. 869 00:43:08.719 --> 00:43:09.360 If a top heel. 870 00:43:09.929 --> 00:43:12.269 no matter what role he's playing on that show, gets 871 00:43:12.429 --> 00:43:15.530 asked by an authority figure, am I understood? Not just 872 00:43:15.690 --> 00:43:20.170 am I understood, but am I understood? You slap him. 873 00:43:20.449 --> 00:43:22.909 Or you attack him. I mean, it's just like, no, 874 00:43:23.570 --> 00:43:26.610 if you're a wrestler, you don't let a middle-aged executive, 875 00:43:26.630 --> 00:43:28.349 no matter what his last name, talk to you like 876 00:43:28.389 --> 00:43:32.170 that and get to keep your balls. And he's got 877 00:43:32.190 --> 00:43:34.130 to turn them in. Every wrestler has. I mean, really, 878 00:43:34.150 --> 00:43:36.010 two-thirds of the roster have turned in their balls because 879 00:43:36.030 --> 00:43:38.210 of the way that Stephanie or Shane are or somebody 880 00:43:38.230 --> 00:43:40.050 else has talked to them. And it's a problem, and 881 00:43:40.070 --> 00:43:42.190 it's why they have to go to Goldberg, because although 882 00:43:42.210 --> 00:43:45.369 they tried to emasculate Goldberg with the wig and. 883 00:43:45.309 --> 00:43:46.250 All that stuff, too. 884 00:43:47.750 --> 00:43:50.659 They did a decent job, yeah. Back in the day. 885 00:43:50.699 --> 00:43:53.579 But see, people have forgotten about that. So they need 886 00:43:53.619 --> 00:43:56.000 somebody who's still seen as a star, and Bill Goldberg 887 00:43:56.800 --> 00:43:59.539 is still seen as a star. 888 00:44:00.139 --> 00:44:00.320 Yep. 889 00:44:01.679 --> 00:44:02.340 No, I agree. 890 00:44:03.219 --> 00:44:06.349 Pat, how much value does Goldberg have? I mean, I 891 00:44:06.369 --> 00:44:10.570 know he's got the 2K17 buzz going. There are two 892 00:44:10.610 --> 00:44:12.989 types of fans, the ones who lived through the Monday 893 00:44:13.010 --> 00:44:15.949 Night War era, they were college age or high school age, 894 00:44:16.610 --> 00:44:19.349 and it brings back some cool feelings of hanging out 895 00:44:19.389 --> 00:44:21.730 with your buddies and watching the adrenaline rush that was 896 00:44:21.769 --> 00:44:25.000 the Monday Night War, flipping back and forth, picking sides, 897 00:44:25.519 --> 00:44:28.500 watching the NWO and DX and The Rock and Steve 898 00:44:28.619 --> 00:44:31.219 Austin tear it up and the Cruiserweights and the Rise 899 00:44:31.260 --> 00:44:34.360 of Jericho and Eddie Guerrero and I mean, yeah, Goldberg 900 00:44:34.400 --> 00:44:36.420 was part of that. He contributed to it, but he 901 00:44:36.460 --> 00:44:40.119 was also a great beneficiary of those who kind of 902 00:44:40.300 --> 00:44:43.860 paved the parking lot that he squashed people in. But 903 00:44:44.059 --> 00:44:45.969 there is something about being gone for a while and 904 00:44:45.989 --> 00:44:48.650 being the last guy who still looks like he could 905 00:44:48.690 --> 00:44:51.829 wrestle and still looks badass and is of an age 906 00:44:51.849 --> 00:44:54.170 where he can still wrestle, kind of like Sting. There's 907 00:44:54.190 --> 00:44:56.050 some equity there. But how much equity is there? Do 908 00:44:56.070 --> 00:44:59.239 you think WWE is overestimating it by banking on this, 909 00:44:59.280 --> 00:45:01.579 being a difference maker and spending a Brock Lesnar match 910 00:45:01.679 --> 00:45:01.880 on him? 911 00:45:02.360 --> 00:45:02.599 Or does. 912 00:45:03.409 --> 00:45:05.269 Or are they right to think that this can make 913 00:45:05.309 --> 00:45:07.780 a difference? 914 00:45:07.900 --> 00:45:10.099 I think they're desperate, and I think it can make 915 00:45:10.139 --> 00:45:13.960 a difference, depending on how they set up and book 916 00:45:14.300 --> 00:45:20.250 Goldberg and Lesnar. It's very frustrating to see that, but 917 00:45:20.309 --> 00:45:25.050 they're not good at protecting their own wrestlers. Lesnar has 918 00:45:25.110 --> 00:45:26.570 been protected to a certain degree. 919 00:45:27.659 --> 00:45:27.760 Uh. 920 00:45:27.889 --> 00:45:30.659 they hopefully will protect goldberg but they they can't have 921 00:45:30.679 --> 00:45:33.059 them just come out we had once or twice and 922 00:45:33.780 --> 00:45:37.179 and not then stand around and not do anything physical 923 00:45:37.659 --> 00:45:40.900 before they get before they go to lesnar and goldberg uh... 924 00:45:40.880 --> 00:45:42.780 because he he is going to be a going but 925 00:45:42.800 --> 00:45:45.199 you've seen him there's a certain part of the audience 926 00:45:45.219 --> 00:45:47.320 which is what the female what it looks like and 927 00:45:47.400 --> 00:45:49.280 it'll turn back into the paper you and i want 928 00:45:49.420 --> 00:45:52.179 to go out there for repeated uh... that the public 929 00:45:52.300 --> 00:45:54.699 is doing something cool he's going to lose whatever equity 930 00:45:54.719 -->

00:45:57.059 they have an amp And by the way, I'm all 931 00:45:57.079 --> 00:46:00.170 in favor of WWE just letting whoever runs the video 932 00:46:00.190 --> 00:46:03.909 game department book these shows in the future. Because they 933 00:46:03.929 --> 00:46:06.309 seem to be able to come up with storylines. 934 00:46:08.630 --> 00:46:12.599 It is kind of sad when some of the better 935 00:46:12.639 --> 00:46:17.539 booking is happening on the video game side of things. Pat, 936 00:46:18.519 --> 00:46:20.760 watching Paul Heyman's promo, we didn't talk a lot about 937 00:46:20.800 --> 00:46:23.469 this on either of the live casts that I hosted 938 00:46:23.510 --> 00:46:26.849 this week. Paul Heyman got a promo, invited Goldberg, or 939 00:46:26.909 --> 00:46:29.300 challenged Goldberg, said, on behalf of my client, I challenge 940 00:46:29.320 --> 00:46:32.460 you to a match anytime, anyplace. What was your take 941 00:46:32.719 --> 00:46:37.599 on what Heyman, how Paul Heyman wanted us to view 942 00:46:38.059 --> 00:46:42.280 his client and Goldberg? Are we supposed to cheer Lesnar? 943 00:46:42.579 --> 00:46:46.420 Are we supposed to boo Lesnar? What strategy do you 944 00:46:46.440 --> 00:46:48.909 think WWE is taking in this regard? Or is it 945 00:46:48.929 --> 00:46:50.829 just a battle of icons? You've got to be there. 946 00:46:50.889 --> 00:46:52.329 Take your pick. We don't care if you cheer or boo. 947 00:46:52.349 --> 00:46:52.929 Just pay your money. 948 00:46:54.929 --> 00:46:58.750 Well, it's that second one. That's what WWE is going for. 949 00:46:58.769 --> 00:47:01.690 I don't think it was a great idea to have 950 00:47:02.469 --> 00:47:05.349 Paul Heyman on behalf of Lesnar call out Goldberg. I 951 00:47:05.389 --> 00:47:07.449 think Paul Heyman should have come and did his promo 952 00:47:07.510 --> 00:47:09.429 and said, well, I heard what Bill Goldberg said about 953 00:47:09.489 --> 00:47:13.780 Brock Lesnar. Bill Goldberg hasn't wrestled for X number of years. 954 00:47:15.460 --> 00:47:18.480 It takes no guts to stand there in the ESPN 955 00:47:18.500 --> 00:47:21.059 studios and talk about Brock Lesnar. There's no way Goldberg 956 00:47:21.079 --> 00:47:23.769 is going to show up here and fight Brock Lesnar, 957 00:47:23.789 --> 00:47:28.750 so forget about it. And that's when you have Goldberg supporting. 958 00:47:30.190 --> 00:47:31.090 Everybody. 959 00:47:31.110 --> 00:47:33.969 You need to have Paul Heyman acting at least a 960 00:47:34.030 --> 00:47:36.280 little bit like he's threatened by the idea of Goldberg 961 00:47:36.300 --> 00:47:36.679 showing up. 962 00:47:38.619 --> 00:47:41.860 Yeah. 963 00:47:42.179 --> 00:47:45.780 Is it believable within the narrative structure of WWE that 964 00:47:46.019 --> 00:47:48.699 Bill Goldberg is a threat to Brock Lesnar? 965 00:47:49.300 --> 00:47:49.519 I mean. 966 00:47:49.920 --> 00:47:51.880 I know people are willing to suspend their disbelief, and 967 00:47:51.900 --> 00:47:54.480 I know people bought into Sting maybe being a threat 968 00:47:54.860 --> 00:47:57.280 in his mid-50s because he could wear the face paint 969 00:47:57.360 --> 00:48:00.199 and an outfit that covered most of his body, and 970 00:48:00.440 --> 00:48:01.449 he still looked like Sting. 971 00:48:01.800 --> 00:48:03.389 Goldberg still looks like Goldberg. 972 00:48:03.409 --> 00:48:07.269 Do people care that since they last wrestled, Goldberg went 973 00:48:07.309 --> 00:48:11.210 on to become a UFC heavyweight freaking champion? He destroyed 974 00:48:11.250 --> 00:48:13.510 John Cena in their first SummerSlam match. He just knocked 975 00:48:13.570 --> 00:48:16.489 out and decimated Randy Orton. 976 00:48:17.030 --> 00:48:17.230 I mean. 977 00:48:17.760 --> 00:48:21.750 He ended Undertaker's streak. Does it matter that within the 978 00:48:21.769 --> 00:48:25.250 narrative structure, Goldberg should not by any measure have a 979 00:48:25.289 --> 00:48:29.250 chance against Lesnar? I'm not even advocating that it matters. 980 00:48:29.289 --> 00:48:31.309 I'm curious if it does, given how different they are 981 00:48:31.349 --> 00:48:32.469 today compared to 12 years ago. 982 00:48:34.039 --> 00:48:36.880 Well, you've got to remember, this is the WWE narrative structure, 983 00:48:36.900 --> 00:48:40.960 not a narrative structure based in reality. In the WWE 984 00:48:40.980 --> 00:48:45.800 narrative structure, Shane McMahon was a threat to The Undertaker. So, yeah, 985 00:48:45.880 --> 00:48:48.639 I mean, they can make Goldberg seem like a threat 986 00:48:48.679 --> 00:48:53.300 to Brock Lesnar. It would probably be a little more 987 00:48:53.360 --> 00:48:55.559 realistic and get people a little more interested if they 988 00:48:55.599 --> 00:48:58.380 pointed out, hey, you know, Brock Lesnar, yeah, what you said, 989 00:48:58.449 --> 00:49:00.730 Brock Lesnar went on to be a UFC champion. He 990 00:49:00.789 --> 00:49:03.630 destroyed this guy. He destroyed that guy. He just destroyed 991 00:49:03.650 --> 00:49:07.190 Randy Orton, The Undertaker. Dean Ambrose, go down the list. 992 00:49:07.630 --> 00:49:11.550 And Goldberg's been raising money to help animals. 993 00:49:11.570 --> 00:49:11.989 Yeah. 994 00:49:13.280 --> 00:49:14.460 Yes. 995 00:49:14.500 --> 00:49:18.289 Yeah, they should do that, but they, unless Paul Heyman 996 00:49:18.329 --> 00:49:19.789 says something on one of his promos, they're not going 997 00:49:19.809 --> 00:49:19.989 to do it. 998 00:49:20.150 --> 00:49:20.269 To. 999 00:49:20.929 --> 00:49:22.849 Yeah, yeah. 1000 00:49:22.989 --> 00:49:28.699 Our number, 515-605-9345. Give us a call. Quick turnaround on 1001 00:49:28.719 --> 00:49:31.960 taking your phone call on the midday, midweek edition of 1002 00:49:32.019 --> 00:49:36.340 the PW Torch livecast. Don't forget, you can show support 1003 00:49:36.380 --> 00:49:40.960 for us when you're about to shop at Amazon. If 1004 00:49:40.980

--> 00:49:43.460 you're listening to us on the Apple Podcast app, on Spotify, 1005 00:49:43.500 --> 00:49:45.679 or any other app that allows you to rate our podcast, 1006 00:49:45.719 --> 00:49:47.860 please take a moment to give us a five-star rating. 1007 00:49:47.900 --> 00:49:50.400 It really helps us in the algorithm and helps them 1008 00:49:50.440 --> 00:49:53.340 know that you recommend us to others. Just look for 1009 00:49:53.360 --> 00:49:55.579 a place to rate the show on Spotify, on Apple Podcasts, 1010 00:49:55.619 --> 00:49:57.780 or wherever you're listening to our shows, and please click 1011 00:49:57.820 --> 00:49:59.940 that five-star rating. And of course, thank you so much 1012 00:49:59.980 --> 00:50:04.639 for listening. Amazon, the next time that you need to 1013 00:50:04.679 --> 00:50:07.940 buy something through Amazon. Pat McNeil is my co-host on 1014 00:50:07.960 --> 00:50:11.880 today's midweek edition of the PW Torch, live cast. We're 1015 00:50:11.940 --> 00:50:16.230 talking a lot about Goldberg. Pat, what is Goldberg's legacy 1016 00:50:16.369 --> 00:50:20.010 in the Monday Night Wars? From a pure timeline standpoint, 1017 00:50:20.510 --> 00:50:23.369 he did not show up when WCW was behind and 1018 00:50:23.429 --> 00:50:26.179 help them become number one. He showed up when WCW 1019 00:50:26.199 --> 00:50:28.599 was number one, but on the decline and was around 1020 00:50:28.639 --> 00:50:32.139 for the entire decline. I would say that he slowed 1021 00:50:32.179 --> 00:50:32.760 the decline. 1022 00:50:32.800 --> 00:50:34.179 He did not cause the decline. 1023 00:50:34.699 --> 00:50:37.070 But the fact that a guy as green as him 1024 00:50:37.880 --> 00:50:41.980 with no wrestling history prior, so quickly rose to the 1025 00:50:42.039 --> 00:50:45.960 top is a testament to his star power, his innate 1026 00:50:46.039 --> 00:50:49.559 charisma that I compare to Road Warrior Hawk. Road Warrior 1027 00:50:49.579 --> 00:50:52.219 Hawk kind of combined with Stone Cold Steve Austin. But 1028 00:50:52.380 --> 00:50:54.679 it also was because there was a vacuum. There was 1029 00:50:54.719 --> 00:50:58.000 a lack of top babyfaces. You had Sting, you had 1030 00:50:58.039 --> 00:51:03.710 Diamond Dallas Page. WCW Nitro was booked largely by Kevin Sullivan, 1031 00:51:04.070 --> 00:51:06.530 who believed in heel heat, heel heat, heel heat. He 1032 00:51:06.570 --> 00:51:10.329 also had heels undercutting babyfaces. The NWO, especially Hall and Nash, 1033 00:51:10.969 --> 00:51:15.139 thought that getting themselves over was important, and they were 1034 00:51:15.320 --> 00:51:18.400 the cool heels who didn't necessarily get booed. They were 1035 00:51:18.440 --> 00:51:21.800 positioned as heels, but they were very effective at embarrassing 1036 00:51:21.840 --> 00:51:24.000 or cutting the legs out from under or emasculating their 1037 00:51:24.019 --> 00:51:27.860 babyface opponents. Goldberg was a guy who came along and

1038 00:51:27.900 --> 00:51:31.099 looked like he was actually worth cheering against everybody because 1039 00:51:31.139 --> 00:51:33.199 he was a badass who had yet to be emasculated. 1040 00:51:33.719 --> 00:51:35.159 It also helped he got to beat a bunch of 1041 00:51:35.199 --> 00:51:38.699 guys with a couple of cool moves and didn't have 1042 00:51:38.719 --> 00:51:41.360 to do even Steven matches or 50, it wasn't victim 1043 00:51:41.380 --> 00:51:42.380 of 50, 50 booking. 1044 00:51:42.900 --> 00:51:43.559 All of that helped. 1045 00:51:43.880 --> 00:51:47.340 And he was a phenomenon for a while. Uh, but 1046 00:51:47.380 --> 00:51:49.519 he wasn't stone cold in that sense that Steve Austin 1047 00:51:49.539 --> 00:51:53.039 took WWF from number two to number one on his back. 1048 00:51:53.719 --> 00:51:58.110 Goldberg took WSW from number one to out of business. 1049 00:51:58.550 --> 00:52:01.980 And he was along for the ride. It wasn't his fault. Uh, 1050 00:52:02.010 --> 00:52:04.190 but sometimes I don't know that people match that timeline 1051 00:52:04.250 --> 00:52:07.469 up really well. Uh, Where do you put Goldberg in 1052 00:52:07.510 --> 00:52:10.989 terms of, yeah, he helped slow down the decline of WCW, 1053 00:52:11.469 --> 00:52:13.750 or he was a symptom of some of the problems 1054 00:52:13.789 --> 00:52:16.460 they had, or otherwise? Your take on his Monday Night 1055 00:52:16.480 --> 00:52:17.019 War legacy. 1056 00:52:18.719 --> 00:52:20.460 Yeah, he was a symptom of a lot of the 1057 00:52:20.480 --> 00:52:25.000 problems they had, and maybe he could have slowed down 1058 00:52:25.039 --> 00:52:27.980 the decline of WCW more if they'd known what to. 1059 00:52:27.940 --> 00:52:28.300 Do with him. 1060 00:52:29.110 --> 00:52:30.849 Instead, what should have happened at the start of 1998 1061 00:52:30.849 --> 00:52:36.480 is Bret Hart has just arrived for WCW, Bret Hart, 1062 00:52:36.760 --> 00:52:40.519 they should have taken a year to set up Bret Hart, 1063 00:52:40.579 --> 00:52:44.260 you know, fighting and eventually getting the title from Hogan 1064 00:52:44.300 --> 00:52:46.940 or Nash or whichever NWO member they wanted to hold it. 1065 00:52:47.619 --> 00:52:51.190 What happened was they went about six months, then they 1066 00:52:51.210 --> 00:52:54.130 turned Bret Hart heel, and they turned him back babyface, 1067 00:52:54.170 --> 00:52:57.110 and it was just a complete mess. And I think 1068 00:52:57.150 --> 00:52:59.530 it was because, you know, the people like Hogan and 1069 00:52:59.570 --> 00:53:02.949 Hall and Nash figured, well, if Goldberg's a top babyface, 1070 00:53:02.969 --> 00:53:06.139 he's a... If we make him the top babyface, he'll 1071 00:53:06.199 --> 00:53:09.559 owe us, and we can probably maneuver him a lot 1072 00:53:09.599 --> 00:53:12.360 better because he's not as smart as Bret Hart. And 1073 00:53:13.489 --> 00:53:16.280 that was the thinking behind that. And, you know, Goldberg's 1074 00:53:16.389 --> 00:53:19.969 run really lasted for 14 months when he sort of 1075 00:53:20.010 --> 00:53:22.769 came in as a heel, then he started, then he 1076 00:53:22.809 --> 00:53:27.789 kept moving the streak, then he turned babyface because of 1077 00:53:27.809 --> 00:53:30.170 the streak, and he kept going until he lost to 1078 00:53:30.210 --> 00:53:32.190 Nash at Starrcade 98, and they finished it. 1079 00:53:32.210 --> 00:53:33.349 It made no sense. 1080 00:53:35.130 --> 00:53:39.630 And after that, he was never quite the same after 1081 00:53:39.670 --> 00:53:44.190 he lost that one match. They tried to recreate the streak, 1082 00:53:44.489 --> 00:53:45.889 and it didn't work. 1083 00:53:46.530 --> 00:53:51.519 No, you can't recreate that. And that's part of my 1084 00:53:52.079 --> 00:53:58.139 evaluation of Goldberg, is he was so paper-thin in terms 1085 00:53:58.179 --> 00:54:00.039 of his skill set. He wasn't good on the mic. 1086 00:54:00.519 --> 00:54:03.010 He wasn't good in the ring, except at doing one thing. 1087 00:54:03.489 --> 00:54:07.670 And that one thing has an expiration date. You can argue, 1088 00:54:07.869 --> 00:54:09.590 as Bruce Mitchell has, that they should have just had 1089 00:54:09.630 --> 00:54:11.530 him squash everybody. He's going to be mad at me 1090 00:54:11.550 --> 00:54:13.789 for portraying it this way, but just continue to squash 1091 00:54:13.849 --> 00:54:16.469 everybody on the roster in three minutes or less for 1092 00:54:16.530 --> 00:54:19.769 eternity because, well, it's working, so you just do that 1093 00:54:19.809 --> 00:54:22.699 until it doesn't work anymore. I think that argument works 1094 00:54:22.880 --> 00:54:25.460 if WCW was on the incline with him doing that. 1095 00:54:25.780 --> 00:54:29.820 But at some point, Pat, I think Goldberg's limitations as 1096 00:54:29.860 --> 00:54:32.190 a worker are and on the microphone and really his 1097 00:54:32.230 --> 00:54:34.869 understanding of wrestling psychology and how to transition to that 1098 00:54:34.889 --> 00:54:38.269 next stage was going to be a problem and did 1099 00:54:38.309 --> 00:54:41.369 turn into a problem in that even being poorly booked 1100 00:54:41.670 --> 00:54:44.329 or losing a match was pretty much all it took 1101 00:54:44.349 --> 00:54:46.590 for the house of cards that was Goldberg to crumble. 1102 00:54:47.309 --> 00:54:51.550 And I worry that they're going to, I shouldn't say 1103 00:54:51.590 --> 00:54:53.610 I'm worried, but I don't know what they're going to 1104 00:54:53.659 --> 00:54:56.610 do with Goldberg and Lesnar because Not only in terms 1105 00:54:56.690 --> 00:54:59.190 of fan reaction, which I touched on, how are they 1106 00:54:59.210 --> 00:55:00.269 going to steer the fans or. 1107 00:55:00.250 --> 00:55:00.889 Do they care? 1108 00:55:01.829 --> 00:55:05.469 But how do they book a Goldberg-Lesnar match? I mean, 1109 00:55:05.510 --> 00:55:07.929 it's going to have to be

meticulously booked move for 1110 00:55:07.969 --> 00:55:10.840 move because we're not talking, you know, Lesnar's dumbed his 1111 00:55:10.880 --> 00:55:13.440 style down to suplex city. It's not like he's having 1112 00:55:13.460 --> 00:55:16.760 these competitive ring general matches that he's capable of, but 1113 00:55:16.780 --> 00:55:18.619 chooses not to do anymore because he doesn't have to. 1114 00:55:19.280 --> 00:55:21.760 And Goldberg, my God, I mean, he's always been limited 1115 00:55:21.800 --> 00:55:25.840 and now he's going on 50 and their options for 1116 00:55:25.860 --> 00:55:27.789 booking this match are limited, and it's going to take 1117 00:55:27.809 --> 00:55:29.070 some meticulous planning, right? 1118 00:55:31.170 --> 00:55:34.349 Well, yeah, but they have Goldberg in WWE for a year, 1119 00:55:34.750 --> 00:55:37.630 and they didn't have him lose a one-on-one match in 1120 00:55:37.650 --> 00:55:39.900 that year, which, by the way, is something that I 1121 00:55:39.940 --> 00:55:42.960 would mention if I were trying to promote Goldberg as 1122 00:55:43.079 --> 00:55:47.000 a plausible contender to Brock Lesnar. And really, I mean, 1123 00:55:47.079 --> 00:55:49.159 they can do something that goes five minutes, and as 1124 00:55:49.219 --> 00:55:52.989 long as there's If there's enough violence in action, mostly violence, 1125 00:55:53.090 --> 00:55:53.980 I think people will buy it. 1126 00:55:55.769 --> 00:56:00.659 What about the idea that Boris brought up of do 1127 00:56:00.699 --> 00:56:03.400 they do more than one match? We had someone email 1128 00:56:03.860 --> 00:56:08.260 before the show, James S., says, obviously the general consensus 1129 00:56:08.300 --> 00:56:11.099 of opinion is that Goldberg will be returning on a 1130 00:56:11.280 --> 00:56:13.440 one-match basis only, but if we were to assume that 1131 00:56:13.480 --> 00:56:16.300 his run would extend beyond that point, where would you 1132 00:56:16.320 --> 00:56:20.340 see him going after his presumed loss to Brock? And 1133 00:56:20.360 --> 00:56:21.659 then he also has a question about Brock, which I'll 1134 00:56:21.679 --> 00:56:24.539 get to in a minute. But, Pat, is it safe 1135 00:56:24.619 --> 00:56:28.860 to bet on a one-off match and Brock one way 1136 00:56:28.880 --> 00:56:31.590 or the other wins and Goldberg gets his moment with 1137 00:56:31.619 --> 00:56:34.269 his wife and kids watching, he gets a payday, and 1138 00:56:34.769 --> 00:56:36.590 WWE moves on and we never see Goldberg in the 1139 00:56:36.630 --> 00:56:40.110 ring again? Or does Goldberg wrestle again, and if so, 1140 00:56:40.170 --> 00:56:41.289 is it against Brock or someone else? 1141 00:56:43.449 --> 00:56:46.429 I would think that WWE would be selling Goldberg on, okay, 1142 00:56:46.449 --> 00:56:48.360 we're going to do this thing You're going to lose 1143 00:56:48.389 --> 00:56:50.530 to Brock, then you'll come back for the next month's 1144 00:56:50.570 --> 00:56:54.909 pay-per-view or something, and we'll give you a guy. I'm 1145 00:56:54.949 --> 00:56:56.389 trying to think of who a good guy will be 1146 00:56:56.429 --> 00:56:59.730 for an opponent for him. We'll give you somebody, and 1147 00:57:01.730 --> 00:57:03.610 you'll get the victory on that pay-per-view, and you'll get 1148 00:57:03.650 --> 00:57:05.190 to go out as a winner. I think that would 1149 00:57:05.230 --> 00:57:08.070 be something to sell Goldberg on. The truth is, they 1150 00:57:08.110 --> 00:57:10.150 care about Goldberg's legacy as much as they care about 1151 00:57:10.170 --> 00:57:13.699 Sting's legacy, which is not one bit. So I don't 1152 00:57:13.719 --> 00:57:17.050 think they're going to be... interested in protecting Goldberg. They're 1153 00:57:17.150 --> 00:57:19.329 not going to set up a Goldberg versus Lesnar match 1154 00:57:19.409 --> 00:57:23.099 at WrestleMania because apparently the Lesnar spot at WrestleMania is 1155 00:57:23.199 --> 00:57:25.719 slotted for Shane McMahon, even though that makes less than 1156 00:57:25.739 --> 00:57:29.139 no sense. And really, if I were Vince McMahon, I 1157 00:57:29.179 --> 00:57:31.039 wouldn't want to put Brock Lesnar in the ring with 1158 00:57:31.079 --> 00:57:35.070 my son, even if he were wearing a suit of armor. 1159 00:57:35.119 --> 00:57:37.829 Yeah, I'm with you on that. Well, speaking of Brock, 1160 00:57:37.929 --> 00:57:41.489 what you just said plays into James' next question. I 1161 00:57:41.530 --> 00:57:44.150 would also be interested in hearing your thoughts on Brock's 1162 00:57:44.190 --> 00:57:46.510 next direction, given the fact that, as you have discussed before, 1163 00:57:46.909 --> 00:57:48.900 new fresh opponents for him are few and far between. 1164 00:57:49.400 --> 00:57:53.699 Maybe a Goliath versus Goliath match against Braun Strowman. Personally, 1165 00:57:53.760 --> 00:57:55.880 I shudder at the thought, but there's no arguing it 1166 00:57:55.920 --> 00:58:00.030 would be a spectacle. Is that one of the reasons 1167 00:58:00.050 --> 00:58:05.309 they're building up Braun Strowman? Or, gasp, could they end 1168 00:58:05.369 --> 00:58:09.530 up spending Braun Strowman's equity on on a second Goldberg match. 1169 00:58:09.630 --> 00:58:13.150 If Goldberg loses to Brock, I don't know that that's 1170 00:58:13.170 --> 00:58:15.530 how Goldberg wants to go out. It depends on how 1171 00:58:15.590 --> 00:58:18.809 it's booked. Maybe part of the negotiating is telling Goldberg, 1172 00:58:19.150 --> 00:58:21.210 we're going to give you, you're going to lose to Brock, 1173 00:58:21.230 --> 00:58:23.769 but we're going to have you win. And we've got 1174 00:58:23.789 --> 00:58:26.489 this guy, Braun Strowman, we're building up and we'll let 1175 00:58:26.530 --> 00:58:28.530 you get a win against him. Or perhaps, you know, 1176 00:58:29.329 --> 00:58:31.880 sprouting off from that, Goldberg gets to beat Miz or 1177 00:58:31.909 -->

00:58:35.809 gets to beat Bo Dallas, at least, in a match 1178 00:58:35.829 --> 00:58:37.409 where he just gets to kind of do his thing. 1179 00:58:37.449 --> 00:58:40.090 Hit a spear, hit a jackknife, his music plays, he snorts, 1180 00:58:40.150 --> 00:58:45.489 fans cheer, everybody's happy. So a couple questions in play there, Pat. 1181 00:58:47.409 --> 00:58:50.010 Okay, well, if they do that scenario, then they might 1182 00:58:50.030 --> 00:58:51.679 as well do it on a raw instead of a 1183 00:58:51.719 --> 00:58:54.579 pay-per-view so they can get some ratings out of it. 1184 00:58:54.699 --> 00:58:59.039 I think a lot of this is based on Goldberg's mystique, 1185 00:58:59.099 --> 00:59:02.139 based on him winning a whatever the fake number was, 1186 00:59:02.159 --> 00:59:05.599 100-some matches in a row, and once he comes back, 1187 00:59:05.760 --> 00:59:09.869 once he loses to Lesnar, the mystique's gone. He's just 1188 00:59:09.909 --> 00:59:13.739 a guy who lost to Brock Lesnar, and they're just 1189 00:59:13.760 --> 00:59:16.429 kind of like Sting has become the guy who lost 1190 00:59:16.449 --> 00:59:20.570 to Triple H in a comeback match. I'm trying to 1191 00:59:20.590 --> 00:59:24.050 think of another example, but you get the idea. It's 1192 00:59:24.250 --> 00:59:25.710 just not going to work. He's not going to have 1193 00:59:25.769 --> 00:59:29.179 that drawing power. So you might as well burn it 1194 00:59:29.260 --> 00:59:31.219 off on an episode of Raw or on a B-show 1195 00:59:31.260 --> 00:59:34.800 pay-per-view rather than try to build up something for the 1196 00:59:34.840 --> 00:59:36.840 Royal Rumble or WrestleMania because it's not going to work. 1197 00:59:39.610 --> 00:59:43.070 Need an extra dose of positivity in your wrestling podcasts? Well, 1198 00:59:43.130 --> 00:59:46.030 come join me, Alan Forel, over in the Pro Wrestling 1199 00:59:46.050 --> 00:59:50.010 Paradise at PWTorch VIP as we bask on the bright 1200 00:59:50.070 --> 00:59:52.690 side of wrestling and focus on some of the great 1201 00:59:52.730 --> 00:59:57.530 matches and shows from around the world. be it the US, Japan, Europe, 1202 00:59:57.699 --> 01:00:00.880 or Mexico. There's always a place for wrestling's past in 1203 01:00:00.900 --> 01:00:04.039 the Paradise too, and we've done fun historical shows such 1204 01:00:04.079 --> 01:00:07.460 as the We Love Liger series, celebrating the glorious career 1205 01:00:07.760 --> 01:00:11.039 of Jushin Thunder Liger, and our I Was There When shows, 1206 01:00:11.099 --> 01:00:13.019 where our guests will join me to talk about a 1207 01:00:13.099 --> 01:00:16.800 classic bout that they were in attendance for. We love variety, 1208 01:00:17.099 --> 01:00:19.070 and you can expect lots of it at the Pro 1209 01:00:19.090 --> 01:00:24.090 Wrestling Paradise. Detailed PWTorch VIP subscription information and a list 1210 01:00:24.130 --> 01:00:29.889 of all the VIP benefits is available at pwtorchvipinfo.com. And yes, 1211 01:00:30.269 --> 01:00:34.110 all VIP podcasts are compatible with popular podcast apps on 1212 01:00:34.269 --> 01:00:37.739 iPhone and Android devices. Or you can stream them directly 1213 01:00:37.780 --> 01:00:41.659 from our ad-free VIP mobile site. See you in the paradise! 1214 01:00:45.510 --> 01:00:49.050 All right, let's move on to another question. This came 1215 01:00:49.090 --> 01:00:54.119 from Reg A. Question for Wednesday's live cast. Do you 1216 01:00:54.199 --> 01:00:59.840 think WWE should bring some form of male-on-female violence, bring 1217 01:00:59.880 --> 01:01:02.800 it back, or at least tease it? I think this 1218 01:01:02.820 --> 01:01:08.309 would be a good way to get heat on both 1219 01:01:08.409 --> 01:01:10.590 male and female heels. For instance, you could have a heel, 1220 01:01:10.929 --> 01:01:13.940 female wrestler, enlisting a heel tag team to help physically 1221 01:01:14.000 --> 01:01:16.940 intimidate her babyface rival. I remember an angle on Raw 1222 01:01:16.960 --> 01:01:22.090 back in 2005 when Melina had Mercury and Nitro kidnap Trish. 1223 01:01:22.570 --> 01:01:23.909 I also remember when Trish was about to. 1224 01:01:23.949 --> 01:01:27.110 Set TNA on Lita until the Hardy Boys made the save. 1225 01:01:27.269 --> 01:01:29.989 Angles of this kind is what I'm referring to. What 1226 01:01:30.010 --> 01:01:31.650 do you think of this idea, Pat? 1227 01:01:33.110 --> 01:01:36.429 Okay, you're talking about two different things. Let's take an 1228 01:01:36.530 --> 01:01:39.980 angle like the one that maybe people remember the most 1229 01:01:40.039 --> 01:01:42.900 where The undertaker kidnaps Stephanie McMahon and was going to 1230 01:01:42.940 --> 01:01:47.320 do some sort of black satanic wedding ceremony with her. Okay, 1231 01:01:47.360 --> 01:01:51.820 that's one thing. It's ridiculous, of course, but the threat 1232 01:01:51.860 --> 01:01:55.599 of that as opposed to any actual physical violence, that's fine. 1233 01:01:56.780 --> 01:01:59.920 Actual male and female violence, I mean, you've got the network. 1234 01:01:59.960 --> 01:02:01.400 Go back and watch 2003, 2004, and 2005. They did 1235 01:02:01.420 --> 01:02:08.920 as much man-on-woman violence as I can remember. and it 1236 01:02:08.940 --> 01:02:11.860 stopped being effective, and the reason it stopped being effective 1237 01:02:11.889 --> 01:02:14.110 is they tried to do it for shock value, but 1238 01:02:14.130 --> 01:02:16.289 when you do something for shock value 30 times a year, 1239 01:02:16.329 --> 01:02:20.909 it's no longer shocking. And by the way, in case 1240 01:02:20.949 --> 01:02:24.289 you haven't been watching the news, the threats against women 1241 01:02:24.329 --> 01:02:26.670 and threats of violence against women are frowned upon in 1242 01:02:26.690 --> 01:02:30.670 this environment. You don't threaten to grab a woman by 1243 01:02:30.789 --> 01:02:33.710 anything if you're a guy,

okay? Bad idea. 1244 01:02:34.050 --> 01:02:38.989 Yeah, and we say that There's a narrative structure. Wrestling 1245 01:02:39.010 --> 01:02:41.440 can tell its own story. There's certain things that the 1246 01:02:41.480 --> 01:02:45.340 promotion will get blamed for if it happens. And to 1247 01:02:45.380 --> 01:02:47.219 be honest, even if– I mean, you're not going to 1248 01:02:47.239 --> 01:02:49.059 have it in UFC. If it's not going to happen 1249 01:02:49.099 --> 01:02:52.000 in UFC, you're not going to have a male fighter 1250 01:02:52.079 --> 01:02:56.829 threatening Ronda Rousey physically. It's just not going to happen, 1251 01:02:56.869 --> 01:02:59.690 much less somebody who's not Ronda Rousey, one of the 1252 01:03:00.050 --> 01:03:04.670 most badass women on the planet. It's not entertaining. I mean, 1253 01:03:04.690 --> 01:03:06.510 I don't even know why somebody would want to see that. 1254 01:03:07.059 --> 01:03:09.239 even in the context, if you framed it as well, 1255 01:03:09.559 --> 01:03:11.099 but it puts a woman in jeopardy and it gets 1256 01:03:11.139 --> 01:03:13.179 heat on the heels, it just, it's not something you 1257 01:03:13.199 --> 01:03:15.619 can pay off. And it's something that if you have 1258 01:03:15.659 --> 01:03:20.019 fans imagining it paying off, it's a turnoff and it's, 1259 01:03:20.159 --> 01:03:22.280 it's just, yeah, there's so many ways to draw money 1260 01:03:22.320 --> 01:03:24.659 in wrestling and that's one of them you just shouldn't 1261 01:03:24.699 --> 01:03:26.239 have to go to if you know what you're doing. 1262 01:03:26.300 --> 01:03:29.849 It's hack booking and you should be good enough not to. 1263 01:03:29.829 --> 01:03:31.090 Have to resort to that. 1264 01:03:31.210 --> 01:03:32.530 I'm sorry. 1265 01:03:32.690 --> 01:03:35.159 Um, In 2016, it's not going to put heat on 1266 01:03:35.179 --> 01:03:39.260 the heels because, as we talked about, people know it's 1267 01:03:39.300 --> 01:03:41.400 a show. It's going to put heat on the company 1268 01:03:41.420 --> 01:03:44.900 that's booking it. And they have been trying very hard 1269 01:03:44.940 --> 01:03:48.739 to keep this thing PG and to keep their advertisers happy. 1270 01:03:49.090 --> 01:03:52.710 I think one wrong move could set up some sort 1271 01:03:52.750 --> 01:03:56.190 of a boycott and could put WWE back in trouble. 1272 01:03:57.789 --> 01:03:58.130 I agree. 1273 01:03:58.550 --> 01:03:58.780 I agree. 1274 01:03:58.820 --> 01:04:01.030 All right, another email question came in. By the way, 1275 01:04:01.070 --> 01:04:02.550 our email address, I haven't plugged it on the show, 1276 01:04:02.570 --> 01:04:08.929 but apparently you guys know it. PWTorchLivecast at gmail.com. PWTorchLivecast 1277 01:04:09.269 --> 01:04:12.590 at gmail.com. Lee B. 1278 01:04:13.369 --> 01:04:15.449 Says, good afternoon. I have a question. 1279 01:04:15.469 --> 01:04:17.230 I watched No Mercy this past Sunday. I was surprised 1280 01:04:17.250 --> 01:04:19.150 that the main event was the first match. No matter, 1281 01:04:19.170 --> 01:04:21.510 the match was pretty good. However, I'm confused about the ending. 1282 01:04:21.630 --> 01:04:23.329 Dean Ambrose and John Cena get AJ Styles in a 1283 01:04:23.349 --> 01:04:25.690 submission hold, forcing him to tap out. Unless I'm seeing 1284 01:04:25.730 --> 01:04:27.670 this wrong, he should have been out of the match 1285 01:04:27.710 --> 01:04:29.789 and should have lost his title. But he stays around 1286 01:04:29.829 --> 01:04:32.719 on the outside, then sneaks in later with a chair. Ultimately, 1287 01:04:34.179 --> 01:04:37.539 he KOs John Cena with a chair and scores the pinfall. 1288 01:04:37.900 --> 01:04:39.019 I'm confused, to say the least. 1289 01:04:39.059 --> 01:04:40.760 If he has tapped out, shouldn't he have been escorted 1290 01:04:40.800 --> 01:04:42.420 or at least told to leave and go to the 1291 01:04:42.460 --> 01:04:43.989 back since he tapped out? How was he allowed to 1292 01:04:44.050 --> 01:04:46.369 stay in the match that he clearly lost? Can anyone 1293 01:04:46.389 --> 01:04:48.230 tell me what the rules are regarding this? The announcers 1294 01:04:48.610 --> 01:04:51.409 basically ignored this issue as AJ boasted about his victory. 1295 01:04:51.829 --> 01:04:53.409 I am not that smart, but I do want to 1296 01:04:53.489 --> 01:04:55.670 understand what is an unrealistic outcome. 1297 01:04:55.730 --> 01:04:58.010 This one stunk to me. I'm enjoying your shows, by 1298 01:04:58.050 --> 01:05:00.800 the way. Have a great afternoon. Pat, take that. 1299 01:05:02.539 --> 01:05:06.119 Yeah, there is precedence for it. They've done this before. 1300 01:05:07.099 --> 01:05:10.059 Two baby faces lock a submission on a heel wrestler 1301 01:05:10.099 --> 01:05:13.329 at the same time. 1302 01:05:13.429 --> 01:05:16.559 1303 01:05:16.599 --> 01:05:19.360 1304 01:05:19.380 --> 01:05:21.519 1305 01:05:21.539 --> 01:05:24.380 1306 01:05:24.420 --> 01:05:26.920 1307 01:05:27.099 --> 01:05:29.710 1308 01:05:29.769 --> 01:05:31.489 . 1309 01:05:31.469 --> 01:05:31.610 . 1310 01:05:40.769 --> 01:05:42.789 And it just– I mean, it serves to get heat, 1311 01:05:42.829 --> 01:05:44.710 but it serves to get heat on the company for 1312 01:05:44.730 --> 01:05:45.750 booking something stupid. 1313 01:05:45.769 --> 01:05:50.010 10-4, Pat. I am with you. 1314 01:05:50.030 --> 01:05:53.110 I like there to be a set of rules, and 1315 01:05:53.159 --> 01:05:55.480 I like it to be logical rules, and I like 1316 01:05:55.539 --> 01:05:59.139 everybody to know what those rules are. And it just 1317 01:05:59.280 --> 01:06:03.420 undercuts your investment in a match when it turns out 1318 01:06:03.480 --> 01:06:07.039 that the wrestling moves don't matter because– There's going to 1319 01:06:07.059 --> 01:06:09.380 be some arcane rule that doesn't

make any sense that 1320 01:06:09.420 --> 01:06:10.579 completely changes the outcome. 1321 01:06:11.219 --> 01:06:12.179 And I think you. 1322 01:06:12.099 --> 01:06:14.460 Could, you know, the idea that, and I was glad 1323 01:06:14.480 --> 01:06:17.840 that David Otunga last night on SmackDown actually criticized AJ 1324 01:06:17.880 --> 01:06:20.300 Styles for winning the way that he did, or at 1325 01:06:20.320 --> 01:06:21.880 least said, you know, hey, it's not a win he 1326 01:06:21.920 --> 01:06:25.030 can be proud of. Nobody else resorted to using a chair. 1327 01:06:25.090 --> 01:06:27.090 He only did because he felt it was his only 1328 01:06:27.130 --> 01:06:29.789 way that he could win. I think babyface announcers need 1329 01:06:29.829 --> 01:06:31.269 to say that. What we also need to do is 1330 01:06:31.329 --> 01:06:34.969 have fewer matches where there are no rules because it's stupid. 1331 01:06:35.420 --> 01:06:38.909 Because if a championship matters and you're a babyface fighting 1332 01:06:38.949 --> 01:06:42.570 a heel and the heel uses a chair legally against 1333 01:06:42.610 --> 01:06:45.309 you to win, you look like the buffoon for not 1334 01:06:45.429 --> 01:06:48.989 using the chair first because it's a no rules match. 1335 01:06:49.449 --> 01:06:54.769 So stop having no rules matches just because you want 1336 01:06:54.809 --> 01:06:56.840 to tell a certain story at the end of the 1337 01:06:56.900 --> 01:07:01.000 match because you're not a good booker. And so you say, well, 1338 01:07:01.019 --> 01:07:02.559 if we make it no rules, then we can have 1339 01:07:02.579 --> 01:07:04.239 somebody interfere at the end, and that'll get us out 1340 01:07:04.260 --> 01:07:06.679 of having to do a clean job. Well, yes, it does, 1341 01:07:06.760 --> 01:07:09.650 but it undercuts the very foundation of. 1342 01:07:09.449 --> 01:07:10.469 What you're otherwise trying to do. 1343 01:07:12.590 --> 01:07:15.510 It's my problem with having multiple Hell in a Cell matches. 1344 01:07:16.269 --> 01:07:21.900 They just think that the application of stipulations, no rules matches, 1345 01:07:21.980 --> 01:07:25.639 gimmick matches, it's overdone, and it's hack booking. And there's 1346 01:07:25.679 --> 01:07:29.320 a way to actually tell stories without that, Pat, do 1347 01:07:29.340 --> 01:07:31.119 you give a thumbs up or thumbs down to the 1348 01:07:31.199 --> 01:07:32.360 three Hell in a Cell matches? 1349 01:07:32.480 --> 01:07:33.739 Maybe there'll be six by next week. 1350 01:07:35.760 --> 01:07:38.349 Well, I mean, you know, you can never get too 1351 01:07:38.369 --> 01:07:40.289 much of a good thing. That's why every year we 1352 01:07:40.349 --> 01:07:44.690 have three World Series, three Super Bowls, three Christmases, three 1353 01:07:44.730 --> 01:07:48.280 Fourth of July celebrations. I mean, come on, it should be, 1354 01:07:48.300 --> 01:07:50.940 there should be one Hell in a Cell match, and maybe... 1355 01:07:51.219 --> 01:07:53.389 on a special occasion, two Hell in a Cell matches. 1356 01:07:54.110 --> 01:07:56.929 And what are you going to do? You're going to 1357 01:07:56.949 --> 01:07:59.269 have to have the Hell in a Cell matches all 1358 01:07:59.389 --> 01:08:01.630 one after the other during the third hour, or you're 1359 01:08:01.650 --> 01:08:04.429 going to be bringing up the cell, down the cell, 1360 01:08:04.650 --> 01:08:07.449 up the cell. You know, fans get excited the first 1361 01:08:07.489 --> 01:08:09.579 time you lower the cell. They're going to be less 1362 01:08:09.639 --> 01:08:10.579 excited the third time. 1363 01:08:11.599 --> 01:08:14.639 Yeah, but Dusty Rhodes was criticized for it with lockdown 1364 01:08:14.679 --> 01:08:16.079 and TNA, and for good reason. 1365 01:08:17.489 --> 01:08:18.029 So, yes. 1366 01:08:18.100 --> 01:08:20.699 And as I ranted about Monday, stop talking about Hell 1367 01:08:20.739 --> 01:08:23.140 in a Cell like it's a Lifetime Achievement Award trophy 1368 01:08:23.159 --> 01:08:23.720 for the women. 1369 01:08:24.420 --> 01:08:25.710 Oh, they've earned it. They've earned it. 1370 01:08:26.279 --> 01:08:28.319 No, that's not how you promote a Hell in a 1371 01:08:28.340 --> 01:08:32.039 Cell match, by acting like it's some great achievement in 1372 01:08:32.239 --> 01:08:37.560 women's rights or women's lib or women's progress or women's 1373 01:08:37.600 --> 01:08:40.699 revolution that they get. Yes, it is in a way 1374 01:08:41.359 --> 01:08:43.520 because it says Charlotte and Sasha have done a good 1375 01:08:43.560 --> 01:08:46.020 enough job that fans and the promoters perceive them as 1376 01:08:46.060 --> 01:08:47.100 worthy of being in that match. 1377 01:08:47.380 --> 01:08:50.260 But you don't say it. You don't say it on TV. 1378 01:08:50.279 --> 01:08:52.909 That's like in the middle of an action movie, having 1379 01:08:52.930 --> 01:08:56.630 a bunch of the hero praise the heel, praise the 1380 01:08:56.670 --> 01:08:59.770 villain for getting the role as the villain in such 1381 01:08:59.789 --> 01:09:02.449 a high profile high budget movie hey you've really paid 1382 01:09:02.489 --> 01:09:04.369 your dues aren't you glad that you got to play 1383 01:09:04.390 --> 01:09:06.069 the Joker in this Batman it's like no you don't 1384 01:09:06.229 --> 01:09:08.340 say that in the middle of a movie it's just 1385 01:09:08.529 --> 01:09:11.699 the stupidity of what is going on on the airwaves 1386 01:09:11.720 --> 01:09:15.100 these days Pat with the way that they portray wrestling 1387 01:09:15.140 --> 01:09:19.609 in the narrative structure in this social media internet It's 1388 01:09:20.550 --> 01:09:24.829 just counterproductive. I don't know how it makes it onto 1389 01:09:24.869 --> 01:09:27.930 the air without somebody with some power going, hey, wait 1390 01:09:27.949 --> 01:09:30.869 a second. This doesn't make sense to talk about this 1391 01:09:30.930 --> 01:09:31.250

this way. 1392 01:09:32.649 --> 01:09:36.479 Well, the wrestlers aren't the only ones who have their 1393 01:09:36.529 --> 01:09:37.920 balls confiscated. 1394 01:09:37.479 --> 01:09:37.840 At the door. 1395 01:09:38.939 --> 01:09:41.960 Well said. Pat, thank you so much. Always great to 1396 01:09:42.000 --> 01:09:44.359 have you on the Midweek Show. I always enjoy doing 1397 01:09:44.399 --> 01:09:44.789 audio with you. 1398 01:09:47.199 --> 01:09:49.140 Well, it was great to be here. Thank you, Wade. 1399 01:09:49.520 --> 01:09:51.720 And hopefully we'll get to do it again at some point. 1400 01:09:51.899 --> 01:09:52.500 I hope so, too. 1401 01:09:52.579 --> 01:09:57.390 Saturday morning, 1130 Eastern. You've got the Stroh, the Maestro, 1402 01:09:57.520 --> 01:09:59.789 on with you. And I'm sure you guys will probably 1403 01:09:59.810 --> 01:10:01.909 talk some more about Goldberg and take calls. If you 1404 01:10:01.970 --> 01:10:03.789 are listening to us on delay, you weren't able to 1405 01:10:03.829 --> 01:10:08.510 join us live. Saturday mornings, 1130 Eastern. You might be available, 1406 01:10:08.689 --> 01:10:10.109 even though you're not during the week. So that is 1407 01:10:10.130 --> 01:10:14.010 a great opportunity to call Pat McNeil and converse with 1408 01:10:14.050 --> 01:10:16.710 him this Saturday morning on Saturday Morning Wrestling. We've got 1409 01:10:16.729 --> 01:10:19.470 two shows between now and then, Interview Thursday tomorrow and 1410 01:10:19.550 --> 01:10:21.210 Primetime Friday with Bruce and Travis. 1411 01:10:21.689 --> 01:10:23.890 Thank you, everybody. Thank you, Pat McNeil. 1412 01:10:24.130 --> 01:10:28.489 And go to pwtorch.com right now and catch up on 1413 01:10:28.529 --> 01:10:29.409 the latest news. 1414 01:10:29.770 --> 01:10:31.829 And exclusive columns and points of views. 1415 01:10:31.850 --> 01:10:34.250 You can also read my report on Raw with a 1416 01:10:34.350 --> 01:10:37.970 ton of analysis of Monday's show and also my full 1417 01:10:38.010 --> 01:10:41.350 report on No Mercy from Sunday, among many other things. 1418 01:10:41.470 --> 01:10:45.130 It's a great-looking website. It is also mobile-friendly. Go check 1419 01:10:45.170 --> 01:10:45.369 it out. 1420 01:10:45.670 --> 01:10:47.189 If you're not a VIP member, we invite you to 1421 01:10:47.229 --> 01:10:51.029 become one, and here are details on VIP membership, which, 1422 01:10:51.069 --> 01:10:54.659 by the way, includes retro radio shows. If you want 1423 01:10:54.720 --> 01:10:59.340 to go back in time and hear my commentary on 1424 01:10:59.720 --> 01:11:04.539 past wrestling events or read it, you can go to pwtorch.com 1425 01:11:04.560 --> 01:11:08.520 slash govip for details. Here's some more information on going VIP, 1426 01:11:08.539 --> 01:11:16.739 which we invite all of you to do. If you're 1427 01:11:16.760 --> 01:11:20.960 a fan of the PWTorch livecast, go check it out today, pwtorch.com 1428 01:11:21.319 -->

01:11:34.819 slash govip. Thank you, everybody, once again for joining me 1429 01:11:35.000 --> 01:11:38.359 and Pat McNeil on the PWTorch livecast. If you want more, 1430 01:11:38.890 --> 01:11:42.310 check out yesterday's show immediately following SmackDown. I hosted with 1431 01:11:42.369 --> 01:11:45.140 Greg Parks, Pro Wrestling Torch columnist. And I hosted a 1432 01:11:45.300 --> 01:11:48.899 solo post-RAW edition with a lot of rants about Monday's 1433 01:11:48.939 --> 01:11:50.569 edition of RAW. I thought there were a lot of 1434 01:11:50.590 --> 01:11:55.229 things worth ranting about that were counterproductive to what WWE 1435 01:11:55.510 --> 01:11:58.510 is trying to do and symptomatic of a problem at 1436 01:11:58.550 --> 01:12:01.189 the core of their booking philosophy that was evident on Monday. 1437 01:12:01.699 --> 01:12:03.939 Check that out also. And then Greg Parks and Pat 1438 01:12:03.960 --> 01:12:09.560 McNeil hosted the post-No Mercy program on Sunday night. All 1439 01:12:09.600 --> 01:12:12.239 kinds of shows you can check out. You can browse 1440 01:12:12.460 --> 01:12:15.729 past episodes at PWTorchLivecast.com. 1441 01:12:16.170 --> 01:12:18.710 Thanks, everybody. Follow me on Twitter at TheWadeKeller. 1442 01:12:18.829 --> 01:12:21.590 Follow our brand at PWTorch and follow our sister brand 1443 01:12:21.789 --> 01:12:22.810 at MMA Torch. 1444 01:12:23.270 --> 01:12:25.770 Until next time, Wade Keller thanking you and signing off. 1445 01:12:36.859 --> 01:12:38.829 You know that last segment you're just listening to and 1446 01:12:38.850 --> 01:12:40.890 the next one that you're waiting to listen to? Those 1447 01:12:40.930 --> 01:12:43.430 can be one second apart with a VIP membership. You 1448 01:12:43.449 --> 01:12:47.609 can unlock our commercial-free versions of our shows. PWTorch.com slash 1449 01:12:47.649 --> 01:12:52.359 GoVIP tells you how to do it. That's PWTorch.com slash GoVIP. 1450 01:12:52.720 --> 01:12:56.439 Options exist within the Apple Podcast app using your Apple account, 1451 01:12:56.579 --> 01:12:58.500 through Patreon, which, by the way, you can sync up 1452 01:12:58.539 --> 01:13:01.699 with Spotify, or just about any iOS or Android app 1453 01:13:01.859 --> 01:13:04.699 with a full VIP membership. You can customize the feed 1454 01:13:04.739 --> 01:13:08.060 for individual shows and clusters of shows and themes. Go 1455 01:13:08.100 --> 01:13:11.760 to pwtorch.com slash govip for full details on all the 1456 01:13:11.880 --> 01:13:16.220 options to listen commercial-free. And with upper-tier options, unlock our 1457 01:13:16.319 --> 01:13:19.180 VIP-exclusive podcasts that run throughout the week every week. 1458 01:13:24.329 --> 01:13:28.449 You are listening to the PWTorch Livecast for Friday, October 1459 01:13:28.649 --> 01:13:29.890 the 14th, 2016. 1460 01:13:29.890 --> 01:13:32.350 I'm Bruce Mitchell, Senior Torch Columnist. 1461 01:13:33.140 --> 01:13:37.380 And I'll be joined

momentarily by, for the first time 1462 01:13:37.399 --> 01:13:41.159 in several weeks actually, by my good friend Travis Bryant. 1463 01:13:41.399 --> 01:13:44.729 I'm calling in from Austin, Texas. Well, anyway, I like 1464 01:13:44.739 --> 01:13:45.689 to make fun of him about that. 1465 01:13:45.750 --> 01:13:49.210 But he'll be joining us in just a moment. 1466 01:13:50.250 --> 01:13:53.210 PWTorch Livecast is sponsored by Loot Crate, a monthly subscription 1467 01:13:53.250 --> 01:13:58.949 box service to www.lootcrate.com and enter code PWTorch to save 1468 01:13:58.949 --> 01:14:00.649 $ 3 on any new subscription. 1469 01:14:01.210 --> 01:14:03.050 Uh, busy week in professional wrestling. 1470 01:14:03.069 --> 01:14:05.260 It looks like the, um, it looks like it's come 1471 01:14:05.300 --> 01:14:09.180 down to nut cutting time in TNA as far as financing, 1472 01:14:09.319 --> 01:14:12.399 as far as legal problems with the news that, um, 1473 01:14:12.939 --> 01:14:18.369 Bill Corgan has, has sued, um, the principals in, in TNA. Um, 1474 01:14:18.449 --> 01:14:22.420 not sure if everything's sealed right now, but, um, Lots 1475 01:14:22.439 --> 01:14:27.140 of little details coming out about that. We see what 1476 01:14:27.180 --> 01:14:32.649 happened after Mercy pay-per-view for WWE, including ratings and including 1477 01:14:33.550 --> 01:14:36.310 what I thought was a lot of really nice mid-card, 1478 01:14:36.729 --> 01:14:42.689 detail-oriented comedy, only it was all for main eventers on 1479 01:14:42.750 --> 01:14:43.909 Raw and on SmackDown. 1480 01:14:43.930 --> 01:14:47.850 So, cute, but I don't know. 1481 01:14:48.310 --> 01:14:52.560 Is Funny Now Money and Professional Wrestling... Not all that 1482 01:14:52.600 --> 01:14:56.220 sure about it. Lots to talk about. I should say, 1483 01:14:56.239 --> 01:15:00.439 I keep forgetting to say this because, again, I'm just 1484 01:15:00.460 --> 01:15:03.439 not used to it. But if you're not following me 1485 01:15:03.939 --> 01:15:10.909 on Twitter, follow me at MitchellPWTorch. So, at MitchellPWTorch. And, 1486 01:15:10.930 --> 01:15:16.029 of course, you can follow at PWTorch, too. So, let's 1487 01:15:16.829 --> 01:15:19.510 hold on. We will get to our friends. 1488 01:15:19.810 --> 01:15:25.449 Ah, uh-huh, uh-huh. So let's, let's see. Hold on. There 1489 01:15:25.470 --> 01:15:29.140 we go. Uh, let's bring in our good friend, Travis Bryant. Travis, 1490 01:15:29.149 --> 01:15:30.119 good to hear from you again. 1491 01:15:30.140 --> 01:15:36.800 Uh, is it, uh, what's happening, Bruce? Yeah, no, we, you. 1492 01:15:36.760 --> 01:15:39.159 Know, I dodged one, you dodged one. 1493 01:15:39.319 --> 01:15:41.680 I had a wrestling thing to do one night and, 1494 01:15:41.960 --> 01:15:43.619 and I did a teacher thing the other night and 1495 01:15:43.640 --> 01:15:44.739 you dodged one last week. 1496 01:15:44.800 --> 01:15:47.159 So, um, you know, the band is back together. 1497 01:15:47.380 --> 01:15:51.029 You mean, you mean when you, uh, Went and hung 1498 01:15:51.090 --> 01:15:53.350 out with your friends and got drunk and bowled? 1499 01:15:54.069 --> 01:15:55.590 Well, I bowled. I didn't get that drunk. 1500 01:15:55.609 --> 01:15:57.409 I mean, when you're sitting there next to the person 1501 01:15:57.449 --> 01:16:00.270 who employs you, I don't know, it doesn't behoove you. 1502 01:16:00.329 --> 01:16:02.590 You know, I had an A beer, but it doesn't 1503 01:16:02.630 --> 01:16:03.229 behoove you to. 1504 01:16:03.170 --> 01:16:05.130 Get too drunk. Did you see me worried about that? 1505 01:16:05.489 --> 01:16:05.670 Huh? 1506 01:16:06.489 --> 01:16:08.850 Yeah, I know. Did you see me worried about that? No, 1507 01:16:08.909 --> 01:16:11.069 I know. I mean, that's a good– exactly. That's a 1508 01:16:11.100 --> 01:16:11.560 good point. 1509 01:16:11.600 --> 01:16:13.600 So when it came my turn to do that on 1510 01:16:13.609 --> 01:16:17.500 the staff function, I– but, yeah, we were bowling. And 1511 01:16:17.520 --> 01:16:19.300 it was– you know, we had a good time this 1512 01:16:19.319 --> 01:16:22.949 summer bowling with– with Jason Powell and the torch staff 1513 01:16:22.970 --> 01:16:25.890 and all that stuff. But, um, but this, this was, 1514 01:16:26.130 --> 01:16:28.550 this was fun too, but I don't get a huge 1515 01:16:28.649 --> 01:16:29.890 chance to do that. 1516 01:16:29.909 --> 01:16:32.729 I'm going to get a hammer and smash something. Um, 1517 01:16:33.649 --> 01:16:39.420 but anyway, um, so really, all right. 1518 01:16:39.460 --> 01:16:42.149 Anyway, um, you call it at 5 1 5 6 1519 01:16:42.149 --> 01:16:44.460 0 5 9 3 4 5. And no, I can't 1520 01:16:44.500 --> 01:16:47.079 get over to the phone with this thing on my head. So, um, 1521 01:16:47.319 --> 01:16:52.779 didn't expect that on my landline. Um, So anyway, any 1522 01:16:53.159 --> 01:16:55.600 take on the TNA news, or is this just, it 1523 01:16:55.640 --> 01:16:58.939 seems like financially or business-wise it's worse, it's even worse 1524 01:16:58.979 --> 01:17:02.779 than I thought. And I'm not, I'm pretty clear-eyed when 1525 01:17:02.800 --> 01:17:06.069 it comes to TNA as far as like sentimentality. 1526 01:17:06.250 --> 01:17:07.670 But any reaction to this news? 1527 01:17:09.829 --> 01:17:11.689 No, because I'm not even sure what the news is. 1528 01:17:12.510 --> 01:17:15.510 Besides the lawsuit, I know about that, but if there's 1529 01:17:15.529 --> 01:17:19.300 something beyond that or some kind of revelation past that. 1530 01:17:19.500 --> 01:17:19.920 I don't know. 1531 01:17:20.399 --> 01:17:22.989 He's breaking it to me right now. Well, the state 1532 01:17:23.010 --> 01:17:24.770 of Tennessee has a tax lien on. 1533 01:17:26.550 --> 01:17:29.350 T & A for unpaid taxes. 1534 01:17:29.869 --> 01:17:32.869 There's yet another company that they owe serious money to, 1535 01:17:33.289 --> 01:17:37.250 and it may be

that Bill Corgan is owed money 1536 01:17:38.729 --> 01:17:43.399 by Dixie Carter herself. This is one of those deals 1537 01:17:43.439 --> 01:17:46.399 where tidbits... come out, puzzle pieces come out, but we 1538 01:17:46.439 --> 01:17:50.800 don't see the whole picture except for boy, this does 1539 01:17:50.939 --> 01:17:53.380 not look good as far as they've got a few 1540 01:17:53.420 --> 01:17:56.829 weeks to do something. What do you buy with them 1541 01:17:56.890 --> 01:18:02.069 except for a video library? There's only one suitor for 1542 01:18:02.090 --> 01:18:08.569 that video library and I would think that's WWE. I 1543 01:18:08.609 --> 01:18:10.609 always thought it would just be that Panda Energy would 1544 01:18:10.640 --> 01:18:12.439 decide they couldn't afford it anymore and then it would 1545 01:18:12.460 --> 01:18:12.859 be gone. 1546 01:18:13.140 --> 01:18:14.199 Apparently, Panda Energy. 1547 01:18:14.819 --> 01:18:18.399 did decide it at some point and um somehow they've 1548 01:18:18.439 --> 01:18:21.250 been able to keep going but this but this idea 1549 01:18:21.289 --> 01:18:23.550 that like it's it's lasted for all these years and 1550 01:18:23.590 --> 01:18:26.529 that's an accomplishment they've just wasted an enormous amount of 1551 01:18:26.590 --> 01:18:29.930 money and um never gotten you know and never became 1552 01:18:29.949 --> 01:18:32.369 profitable because they never learned how to become profitable they 1553 01:18:32.390 --> 01:18:35.109 never learned you know what wrestling is what they're saying 1554 01:18:35.189 --> 01:18:37.510 as far as you know as far as what would 1555 01:18:37.529 --> 01:18:39.520 be i mean i always understood when people there was 1556 01:18:39.560 --> 01:18:41.920 years when wcw did did really well and had a 1557 01:18:42.279 --> 01:18:45.420 had a good product and and and um made a 1558 01:18:45.460 --> 01:18:48.449 lot of money, and so I understood the sentimentality. 1559 01:18:48.550 --> 01:18:52.399 And also, it was a linked 30-year tradition. 1560 01:18:52.119 --> 01:18:56.319 From Georgia Championship Wrestling to Jim Crocker promotions to WCW. 1561 01:18:57.140 --> 01:18:59.260 So there was some sentimentality when that went out of business. 1562 01:18:59.279 --> 01:19:03.260 But this is just not good, and not good on 1563 01:19:03.279 --> 01:19:04.220 a lot of different levels. 1564 01:19:04.399 --> 01:19:09.569 Yeah, no, even people that have been... Either kind of 1565 01:19:09.890 --> 01:19:15.930 neutral or relatively pro-TNA or, you know, kind of just 1566 01:19:15.949 --> 01:19:18.689 like let it die already kind of has been the 1567 01:19:18.729 --> 01:19:20.970 attitude the last three, maybe five years. 1568 01:19:21.899 --> 01:19:25.000 No, I don't– yeah, I think there's been some other attitudes. But, yeah, 1569 01:19:25.140 --> 01:19:28.739 I think so. There's been the, you know, people won't 1570 01:19:28.779 --> 01:19:31.859 have a place to work and learn their craft. 1571 01:19:31.880 --> 01:19:32.220 Oh, sure. 1572 01:19:32.819 --> 01:19:33.340 Attitude. 1573 01:19:33.699 --> 01:19:34.260 Definitely. 1574 01:19:34.880 --> 01:19:37.689 And there's been– Additive attitude. Yeah. 1575 01:19:37.729 --> 01:19:37.949 Right. 1576 01:19:38.050 --> 01:19:40.350 To like have a business just so that people can 1577 01:19:40.409 --> 01:19:41.149 do that. Yeah. 1578 01:19:41.470 --> 01:19:44.609 And, um, and then there's the, well, they're getting better. Um, 1579 01:19:45.189 --> 01:19:47.220 and it's not their fault attitude. And then there's also 1580 01:19:47.260 --> 01:19:49.220 just the, they're in business. If they can find one 1581 01:19:49.260 --> 01:19:52.079 person to finance them, then, then they're successful, which I 1582 01:19:52.140 --> 01:19:54.750 completely don't agree with. And so just a lot of, 1583 01:19:55.399 --> 01:19:57.619 just a lot of things with that. Um, you know, it's, 1584 01:19:58.500 --> 01:20:01.869 it's painful. It's really painful to watch it go, go 1585 01:20:01.909 --> 01:20:05.649 down this, and this kind of dissolution though. I mean, 1586 01:20:05.670 --> 01:20:09.550 this is just not, um, not well done at all. So, um, 1587 01:20:09.560 --> 01:20:12.600 we haven't talked since, um, we, we had talked in 1588 01:20:12.619 --> 01:20:14.960 a while. We certainly haven't talked since no mercy. So, um, 1589 01:20:15.539 --> 01:20:19.180 what was your reaction? Um, what was your reaction to, uh, 1590 01:20:20.060 --> 01:20:22.710 John Cena getting beaten and it turns out he is 1591 01:20:22.729 --> 01:20:26.670 going to be gone until December with various reality television 1592 01:20:26.689 --> 01:20:30.069 shows and, and, and work outside of WWE. But, um, 1593 01:20:30.810 --> 01:20:35.039 AJ Styles winning and, um, and also Dolph Ziggler winning. 1594 01:20:35.119 --> 01:20:36.979 What was your reaction to all that? What did you 1595 01:20:37.000 --> 01:20:37.600 think of that. 1596 01:20:39.390 --> 01:20:39.989 Pay-per-view? 1597 01:20:40.710 --> 01:20:46.930 My first reaction was the formatting and what matches went where. 1598 01:20:47.689 --> 01:20:53.380 And it's really nothing to do with the title match 1599 01:20:53.420 --> 01:20:58.060 going on first. I understand. I get why they did that. 1600 01:20:58.640 --> 01:21:01.199 I didn't get why they main-evented with. 1601 01:21:02.920 --> 01:21:06.039 Didn't they finish with Bray beating Gordon? 1602 01:21:06.479 --> 01:21:08.859 Yeah, they did. They did. You know, one of the 1603 01:21:08.880 --> 01:21:11.500 things I'm interested in on SmackDown. 1604 01:21:11.600 --> 01:21:13.560 Let me just ask you this question. We'll throw this 1605 01:21:13.659 --> 01:21:16.039 out to callers, too. We'll start taking calls in just 1606 01:21:16.100 --> 01:21:16.460 a moment. 1607 01:21:16.479 --> 01:21:17.000 515-605-9345. 1608 01:21:17.020 --> 01:21:23.069 Who would you consider the number one act on SmackDown? 1609

01:21:28.210 --> 01:21:29.390 The number one act? 1610 01:21:29.850 --> 01:21:30.090 Yes. 1611 01:21:30.270 --> 01:21:31.229 AJ Styles. 1612 01:21:32.579 --> 01:21:34.060 So the champion, AJ Styles. 1613 01:21:34.079 --> 01:21:37.220 I mean, maybe I'm answering a different question. 1614 01:21:37.260 --> 01:21:38.319 No, you're not. You're not. 1615 01:21:38.779 --> 01:21:43.250 Because when I look at things in the last few months, 1616 01:21:43.649 --> 01:21:45.289 and I look at the end of that pay-per-view Sunday 1617 01:21:45.329 --> 01:21:49.350 night particularly, and I look at the end of SmackDown 1618 01:21:49.909 --> 01:21:53.140 and how all that worked this week, the number one act, 1619 01:21:53.199 --> 01:21:57.119 according to WWE, on SmackDown is Randy Orton. And I'm 1620 01:21:57.159 --> 01:21:59.729 curious as to why that is. Does it have anything 1621 01:21:59.770 --> 01:22:01.920 to do with being booked to get a concussion? Does 1622 01:22:01.960 --> 01:22:04.899 it have anything to do with much of anything else? 1623 01:22:04.939 --> 01:22:07.699 But as far as positioning goes, he had the last 1624 01:22:07.779 --> 01:22:12.140 match on the pay-per-view. He had the last match on SmackDown. 1625 01:22:12.199 --> 01:22:16.939 And his storyline gets more airtime than anything else, I think. So, 1626 01:22:17.000 --> 01:22:21.199 I mean, like I said, that's interesting to me. But 1627 01:22:21.220 --> 01:22:22.579 I don't think anybody else looks. 1628 01:22:22.479 --> 01:22:24.699 At Randy McMahon in the same way. Yeah, my initial 1629 01:22:24.729 --> 01:22:27.170 reaction was going to be Miz because I wanted to 1630 01:22:27.569 --> 01:22:32.399 act Miz. the number one act, and he is more 1631 01:22:32.579 --> 01:22:33.960 of an act than. 1632 01:22:33.979 --> 01:22:34.060 I. 1633 01:22:35.819 --> 01:22:39.140 Mean, they're all acts. I mean, I don't want to... 1634 01:22:39.100 --> 01:22:41.920 I'm trying to be a little bit nuanced. But my 1635 01:22:42.220 --> 01:22:44.899 initial reaction was almost Miz. Like, he almost is the 1636 01:22:44.939 --> 01:22:47.180 number one act on SmackDown. 1637 01:22:47.199 --> 01:22:47.619 But I think. 1638 01:22:48.159 --> 01:22:49.439 But I'd stick with AJ. 1639 01:22:49.859 --> 01:22:51.300 Yeah. 1640 01:22:51.399 --> 01:22:55.670 I don't know why... I don't understand. The finishes, the booking, 1641 01:22:55.710 --> 01:22:58.289 if Orton went over in that match, I guess I'd 1642 01:22:58.310 --> 01:23:03.430 understand a little more. But you had the career versus 1643 01:23:03.890 --> 01:23:11.770 title match, and you had the triumphant finish, or babyface 1644 01:23:11.829 --> 01:23:15.270 win at the end. Why isn't that ending the pay-per-view? 1645 01:23:15.289 --> 01:23:17.939 I just didn't. 1646 01:23:18.520 --> 01:23:21.399 Yeah, no, I mean, I think because they wanted Randy 1647 01:23:21.460 --> 01:23:23.779 Orton at the end. I mean, even though he lost. 1648 01:23:23.800 --> 01:23:27.380 To lose? To lose, yes. Clearly they did. 1649 01:23:27.399 --> 01:23:30.619 That nonsense angle they did with Luke Harper? I mean, 1650 01:23:30.640 --> 01:23:33.989 not nonsense, but like, no, big deal. Luke Harper's back. 1651 01:23:34.350 --> 01:23:37.329 I mean, great, I like Luke Harper, but he wasn't 1652 01:23:37.369 --> 01:23:40.149 back as some, you know, just random henchman number three. 1653 01:23:41.470 --> 01:23:45.029 Yeah, but as we talked about, as Wade Keller and 1654 01:23:45.149 --> 01:23:47.560 I and Todd Martin talked about on the roundtable, he did, 1655 01:23:47.579 --> 01:23:51.300 you know, Luke did stick his tongue out at Randy Orton. 1656 01:23:52.199 --> 01:23:54.439 And so, you know, that was pretty powerful. That was 1657 01:23:54.460 --> 01:23:55.199 a pretty powerful moment. 1658 01:23:55.220 --> 01:23:57.479 So anyway, all right. 1659 01:23:57.520 --> 01:23:59.939 Yeah, no, I know you're dealing with that all day. 1660 01:24:00.659 --> 01:24:04.159 Yeah, no kidding. No kidding. I'm probably dealing with it 1661 01:24:04.199 --> 01:24:05.310 right now as people are listening. 1662 01:24:05.329 --> 01:24:09.689 Hey, Steph, do you ever watch WWE and think it used. 1663 01:24:09.550 --> 01:24:09.989 To be better? 1664 01:24:10.289 --> 01:24:12.109 I don't know, Josh. Sometimes I think it used to 1665 01:24:12.149 --> 01:24:13.069 be a whole lot worse. 1666 01:24:13.409 --> 01:24:15.390 I mean, whether it's WrestleMania main events. 1667 01:24:15.770 --> 01:24:16.949 Old dudes at the top. 1668 01:24:17.460 --> 01:24:21.100 Too many titles, or women's wrestling, we're here to answer. 1669 01:24:20.899 --> 01:24:23.789 The big question, is it worse or better now? 1670 01:24:24.270 --> 01:24:28.510 Join me, Joshua White, and me, Stephanie Chase, for Worse. 1671 01:24:28.350 --> 01:24:31.510 Or Better, part of the PWTorch Daily Cast lineup dropping 1672 01:24:31.590 --> 01:24:32.449 on Monday nights. 1673 01:24:32.810 --> 01:24:36.310 Search PWTorch in your podcast app, such as Apple Podcasts 1674 01:24:36.350 --> 01:24:40.050 or Spotify, to subscribe for free or get a commercial-free 1675 01:24:40.069 --> 01:24:45.220 version with the PWTorch VIP membership. Check out PWTorch.com slash 1676 01:24:45.270 --> 01:24:47.720 GoVIP for details on going VIP. 1677 01:24:47.979 --> 01:24:51.180 Worse or better, finally, something for wrestling fans to do 1678 01:24:51.260 --> 01:24:52.039 on Monday nights. 1679 01:24:55.060 --> 01:24:55.659 As we said, 515-605-9345. 1680 01:24:55.739 --> 01:25:00.380 And we're going to go to, let's go to callers. 1681 01:25:00.699 --> 01:25:03.239 Let's go to Darrell from Georgia. Darrell, welcome to the 1682 01:25:03.319 --> 01:25:04.159 PWTorch Livecast. 1683 01:25:06.920 --> 01:25:08.659 How you doing, Bruce? How you doing, Trav? 1684 01:25:08.680 --> 01:25:10.239 The boys are back in town, I see. 1685 01:25:12.130 --> 01:25:12.510 What's up, man? 1686 01:25:15.229 -->

01:25:18.560 How y'all doing today? We've got three questions for you. 1687 01:25:18.630 --> 01:25:19.930 I'm going to go ahead and round it off. I 1688 01:25:20.229 --> 01:25:24.659 want to hear more thoughts on is this the final 1689 01:25:24.859 --> 01:25:27.699 nail in the coffin for TNA with all of this? 1690 01:25:28.659 --> 01:25:31.520 And how does the people who work for TNA look 1691 01:25:31.659 --> 01:25:35.159 by sticking with the company for so long? I'm the 1692 01:25:35.300 --> 01:25:39.779 one who did. My second question would be, With the 1693 01:25:39.800 --> 01:25:43.199 Survivor Series coming up and they're already hyping the Rumble, 1694 01:25:43.739 --> 01:25:49.600 does Survivor Series seem more like just a bigger bragging 1695 01:25:49.659 --> 01:25:52.699 rights pay-per-view? And why would guys want to team with 1696 01:25:52.739 --> 01:25:54.619 each other if you're in the middle of a heated 1697 01:25:55.739 --> 01:26:00.090 feud with somebody? And how do y'all like the turnout 1698 01:26:00.310 --> 01:26:03.050 of what's coming out to be maybe a good takeover 1699 01:26:03.090 --> 01:26:07.229 card again the night before that Survivor Series? And would 1700 01:26:07.399 --> 01:26:10.060 that make them start changing Survivor Series? 1701 01:26:10.659 --> 01:26:11.439 And that's it for me. 1702 01:26:12.840 --> 01:26:13.739 Let's go through this. 1703 01:26:14.140 --> 01:26:16.960 As far as TNA goes, one of the things about 1704 01:26:17.000 --> 01:26:19.329 TNA all these years was it could be a very 1705 01:26:19.390 --> 01:26:20.069 lucrative job. 1706 01:26:20.109 --> 01:26:21.310 It could be a good job. 1707 01:26:21.810 --> 01:26:26.470 And because it didn't... The job performance wasn't measured by 1708 01:26:26.489 --> 01:26:29.189 the performance of the company financially. It was measured by 1709 01:26:29.250 --> 01:26:34.550 where you were politically with certain people in the company, 1710 01:26:34.590 --> 01:26:38.069 whether it was Jeff Jarrett or Dixie Carter or whoever 1711 01:26:38.130 --> 01:26:41.689 had the pull at any time. It meant for a 1712 01:26:41.729 --> 01:26:44.470 lot of damaging politics, but it was a good place 1713 01:26:44.510 --> 01:26:47.810 to work. So I imagine the people that are there 1714 01:26:47.890 --> 01:26:51.250 that lasted all that time. I have some sympathy for 1715 01:26:51.270 --> 01:26:53.289 Jeremy Borash. I've seen how hard he worked. 1716 01:26:53.810 --> 01:26:56.689 There. And I have some sympathy for Don West and 1717 01:26:56.710 --> 01:26:57.689 the years he put in there. 1718 01:26:58.210 --> 01:27:00.619 And Mike Tanay, I have a lot of sympathy for 1719 01:27:00.659 --> 01:27:03.699 for a lot of reasons and just that Um, someone 1720 01:27:03.739 --> 01:27:06.640 that smart and that knowledgeable had to call a product 1721 01:27:06.680 --> 01:27:09.130 that lousy all the time and, and no better, you know, 1722 01:27:09.189 --> 01:27:11.949 and no better all

along what was going on. Um, 1723 01:27:12.590 --> 01:27:15.810 but yeah, I, you know, I, I think they're probably upset. 1724 01:27:15.869 --> 01:27:18.109 I think they're not, you know, I think they're not happy. 1725 01:27:18.149 --> 01:27:21.159 I think a lot of people look for landing spots and, and, and, 1726 01:27:21.199 --> 01:27:23.840 you know, AJ Styles found the best one of all. 1727 01:27:23.920 --> 01:27:25.760 He was able to, I mean, AJ Styles to me 1728 01:27:25.800 --> 01:27:28.779 is just, you know, the TNA story. He is the 1729 01:27:28.819 --> 01:27:33.250 TNA story, the guy that talented, um, featured on this 1730 01:27:33.310 --> 01:27:37.539 terrible platform and would have been an also-ran in his generation, 1731 01:27:37.579 --> 01:27:40.399 except for he finally, and he didn't want to, he 1732 01:27:40.420 --> 01:27:42.859 just couldn't make a money deal with him anymore, and 1733 01:27:43.420 --> 01:27:45.199 went out to New Japan Pro Wrestling and Ring of 1734 01:27:45.260 --> 01:27:48.840 Honor and ultimately WWE and made his reputation. 1735 01:27:49.260 --> 01:27:50.659 And what does that say about TNA? 1736 01:27:51.439 --> 01:27:54.939 So there's a lot of that, but there's also just 1737 01:27:55.000 --> 01:27:57.079 a lot of people who made a lot of money 1738 01:27:57.119 --> 01:28:00.149 by holding onto a job that maybe they weren't doing 1739 01:28:00.210 --> 01:28:00.590 so well. 1740 01:28:00.930 --> 01:28:03.010 So that's part of it. Travis, you want to add 1741 01:28:03.050 --> 01:28:03.310 to that? 1742 01:28:05.390 --> 01:28:08.449 Not really. I think you said. 1743 01:28:09.810 --> 01:28:10.250 It all. 1744 01:28:10.430 --> 01:28:13.670 You know, as far as Survivor Series, you know, I 1745 01:28:13.710 --> 01:28:18.329 make a joke on PW Torch VIP audio about I'm 1746 01:28:18.350 --> 01:28:20.569 a SmackDown guy. I don't watch Raw, and sometimes I'll 1747 01:28:20.600 --> 01:28:23.260 just make that joke because of how ridiculous it sounds 1748 01:28:23.800 --> 01:28:28.479 that wrestling fans are picking people Raw or SmackDown and 1749 01:28:28.539 --> 01:28:32.479 not watching the other. And that they have any rooting 1750 01:28:32.550 --> 01:28:36.329 interest in Raw versus SmackDown. And for them to do 1751 01:28:36.390 --> 01:28:39.270 a tag match that early, I just think it's something to... 1752 01:28:40.239 --> 01:28:44.199 something to talk about on the air as far as 1753 01:28:44.239 --> 01:28:48.319 getting the families, getting Steph and Shane over. And then just, 1754 01:28:48.350 --> 01:28:53.670 you know, what is it, 10 tag teams? So it'll 1755 01:28:54.449 --> 01:28:57.149 be one of those fast-paced spot fest. And some want 1756 01:28:57.170 --> 01:29:00.810 to win. And it might be good. It might be forgettable. 1757 01:29:00.939 --> 01:29:04.729 I would say probably good and forgettable at the same time. And, um, that's, 1758 01:29:05.090 --> 01:29:07.949 you know, that's where, I mean, I would, I would 1759 01:29:07.989 --> 01:29:09.710 think that's where that goes. 1760 01:29:09.869 --> 01:29:10.590 Um, Travis. 1761 01:29:12.329 --> 01:29:12.630 Yeah. 1762 01:29:12.909 --> 01:29:17.130 Two things. Um, they're not hyping the Royal rumble. They're 1763 01:29:17.149 --> 01:29:21.609 hyping the Royal rumble ticket sales. So you got, you 1764 01:29:21.649 --> 01:29:25.949 got to, you want to sell 60,000 seat building, you know, 1765 01:29:26.010 --> 01:29:27.609 you better get a three month headstart. 1766 01:29:28.189 --> 01:29:28.689 Absolutely. 1767 01:29:28.989 --> 01:29:35.050 Um, So, I mean, that's just what you do. Survivor 1768 01:29:35.069 --> 01:29:42.869 Series is over six weeks away, almost two months away. 1769 01:29:43.170 --> 01:29:45.369 I'm not going to start booking that thing out now. 1770 01:29:45.850 --> 01:29:48.729 We've got like two pay-per-views still before that, I think. 1771 01:29:48.750 --> 01:29:55.319 Something like that. We've got some hints of what the 1772 01:29:55.340 --> 01:29:59.689 cards could be and what they're going to do. But 1773 01:29:59.789 --> 01:30:02.770 as we talked about on Wednesday, that's a one-match show. 1774 01:30:02.989 --> 01:30:06.159 They can have a show like that with Lesnar and 1775 01:30:06.199 --> 01:30:13.619 Goldberg on top, and maybe even your title matches, if 1776 01:30:13.800 --> 01:30:16.949 you're going to do of all the titles that you have, 1777 01:30:17.930 --> 01:30:22.069 to do a bunch of Survivor Series-style matches, that's the 1778 01:30:22.109 --> 01:30:24.930 show to do that with a big, giant, hyped show. 1779 01:30:25.439 --> 01:30:28.319 match at the top that is going to draw interest 1780 01:30:28.420 --> 01:30:30.680 and you can get away with not having a bunch 1781 01:30:30.720 --> 01:30:33.779 of one-on-one and two-on-two matches you can do Survivor Series 1782 01:30:33.819 --> 01:30:38.220 stuff and you can save that for for WrestleMania season 1783 01:30:38.239 --> 01:30:39.920 that's right around the corner. 1784 01:30:41.189 --> 01:30:44.270 Gosh WrestleMania season's right around the corner it really is 1785 01:30:44.329 --> 01:30:47.279 it's not too far away um I should say that 1786 01:30:47.319 --> 01:30:48.060 the chat room is. 1787 01:30:48.140 --> 01:30:52.100 Especially once we're at Survivor Series, we're definitely going to be, 1788 01:30:52.340 --> 01:30:54.500 it's definitely going to be right around the corner. That's 1789 01:30:54.600 --> 01:30:57.920 when they'll start hyping, not even, because they'll still have 1790 01:30:57.939 --> 01:31:00.699 like three pay-per-views before the Rumble, even at that point, 1791 01:31:01.000 --> 01:31:05.039 as far as the total pay-per-views. So, maybe I'm exaggerating 1792 01:31:05.100 --> 01:31:05.399 a bit. 1793 01:31:06.180 --> 01:31:06.420 Yeah. 1794 01:31:06.960 --> 01:31:08.000 At least two in December. 1795 01:31:08.659 --> 01:31:13.810 So, I think also that NXT TakeOver

usually is a 1796 01:31:14.750 --> 01:31:15.689 great show is. 1797 01:31:15.609 --> 01:31:16.399 A very good show. 1798 01:31:16.489 --> 01:31:19.899 And, and, um, those are, you know, the audience getting 1799 01:31:19.939 --> 01:31:22.319 the ticket for the night before and it being still 1800 01:31:22.340 --> 01:31:24.119 the niche, the cult thing, even though, you. 1801 01:31:25.039 --> 01:31:27.800 Know, the viewership is not as good. 1802 01:31:27.859 --> 01:31:30.159 And even though it might be, you know, sometimes you 1803 01:31:30.180 --> 01:31:32.220 get that, if you're the niche, if you're the, if 1804 01:31:32.239 --> 01:31:34.420 you're the niche promotion, if you're the boutique promotion or 1805 01:31:34.439 --> 01:31:37.779 the cult promotion, you can get, you can much like 1806 01:31:37.840 --> 01:31:39.699 many of us have in our own lives, you can get, 1807 01:31:39.739 --> 01:31:42.970 get past it. you can not be quite as cool 1808 01:31:43.029 --> 01:31:46.449 after a while. And, you know, there are some people 1809 01:31:46.489 --> 01:31:47.649 that are doing that. I'm going to jump off the 1810 01:31:47.670 --> 01:31:51.689 bandwagon before it gets too crowded. 1811 01:31:52.090 --> 01:31:54.029 And that might be going on a little bit, too, 1812 01:31:54.050 --> 01:31:54.479 with NXT. 1813 01:31:54.520 --> 01:31:56.239 But I think the NXT takeover show, I mean, you 1814 01:31:56.260 --> 01:32:00.619 can't complain about Samoa Joe and Nakamura in a steel cage. 1815 01:32:00.659 --> 01:32:03.020 Good grief, that ought to be something. 1816 01:32:03.239 --> 01:32:09.090 What's your take, Travis, on Charlotte and Sasha Banks in 1817 01:32:09.130 --> 01:32:12.050 a Hell in a Cell match? I think, you know, 1818 01:32:12.909 --> 01:32:14.789 they're good. Both of them are good. They have good 1819 01:32:14.829 --> 01:32:17.850 matches for the most part. I worry somewhat. I worry 1820 01:32:17.890 --> 01:32:21.989 particularly about Sasha Banks taking, you know, are they going to, like, 1821 01:32:22.170 --> 01:32:23.840 try to prove a point? Are those two going to 1822 01:32:23.850 --> 01:32:25.529 try to prove a point, being the first women in 1823 01:32:25.560 --> 01:32:27.810 a Hell in a Cell match, of doing a lot 1824 01:32:27.840 --> 01:32:29.359 of dangerous stuff? 1825 01:32:29.560 --> 01:32:33.100 And then are they going to pay for it physically? 1826 01:32:35.899 --> 01:32:37.340 Yes, they are going to go in there and try 1827 01:32:37.380 --> 01:32:41.619 to prove a point. I don't like the idea. when 1828 01:32:41.640 --> 01:32:44.180 it was rumored, you know, three or four weeks ago 1829 01:32:44.199 --> 01:32:46.500 that that was kind of where they were going, I 1830 01:32:47.460 --> 01:32:50.520 thought it was a silly idea. Like, there's no need 1831 01:32:51.500 --> 01:32:55.010 for them to be in the Hell in a Cell. 1832 01:32:55.060 --> 01:32:58.670 I mean, I guess the psychology is kind of there. 1833 01:32:58.689

--> 01:33:01.430 I mean, I guess as far as feuds go, it's 1834 01:33:01.470 --> 01:33:05.390 a bit of a blood feud, you know, whatever. They've 1835 01:33:05.409 --> 01:33:07.409 had plenty of matches and going back and forth and 1836 01:33:07.430 --> 01:33:11.380 trading the title. So, you know, it's a escalated feud 1837 01:33:11.460 --> 01:33:15.659 that you can definitely sell it, I guess, uh, deserving 1838 01:33:15.699 --> 01:33:18.380 to be in the cell, but they're going to go 1839 01:33:18.399 --> 01:33:23.789 in there and, you know, I said before, the cell 1840 01:33:23.890 --> 01:33:28.869 itself is not the dangerous part because it's just the cell. 1841 01:33:28.930 --> 01:33:32.390 It's just the K it's just fencing. You know, I mean, 1842 01:33:32.430 --> 01:33:34.899 you can scrape a guy's face across the thing, but 1843 01:33:34.979 --> 01:33:37.489 you know, that's, it's what they're going to do and 1844 01:33:37.550 --> 01:33:39.970 turn it up in, in the ring. And then that matches, 1845 01:33:40.109 --> 01:33:41.970 you know, it worries me. 1846 01:33:42.729 --> 01:33:42.949 Yeah. 1847 01:33:43.510 --> 01:33:43.710 Yeah. 1848 01:33:43.770 --> 01:33:46.149 And you know, as far as whether it's built up 1849 01:33:46.189 --> 01:33:49.659 to hell in the cell, you know, you put the 1850 01:33:49.739 --> 01:33:53.060 cell over something because there's too much interference coming from, 1851 01:33:53.100 --> 01:33:56.800 but coming from one side and you have to close 1852 01:33:56.840 --> 01:33:58.239 it off and you have to just, you're going to 1853 01:33:58.279 --> 01:34:00.800 have this one final bat, you know, it should be 1854 01:34:01.020 --> 01:34:02.699 because that's why, why would you put them inside a 1855 01:34:02.739 --> 01:34:03.760 cell and lock the door? 1856 01:34:04.210 --> 01:34:06.840 Unless you're having a problem like this. And so, as 1857 01:34:06.850 --> 01:34:07.989 far as that goes, there's a little. 1858 01:34:08.060 --> 01:34:11.520 Well, I mean, if a guy's running, that's a reason. No, 1859 01:34:11.579 --> 01:34:15.100 that's true. If their matches have been spilled over into 1860 01:34:15.159 --> 01:34:18.739 the audience, a bunch, you know, three straight matches, they 1861 01:34:18.779 --> 01:34:21.880 can't contain it. I mean, there's more than one reason 1862 01:34:21.899 --> 01:34:24.350 that you'll put a book of people in the cell. 1863 01:34:24.359 --> 01:34:26.789 Well, that's true. That is true, and none of those reasons. 1864 01:34:27.069 --> 01:34:29.289 And it has to do with keeping the action in 1865 01:34:29.310 --> 01:34:30.250 the ring, keeping the action. 1866 01:34:30.270 --> 01:34:36.840 None of those are... It are... are relevant or prevalent 1867 01:34:37.060 --> 01:34:37.560 in this team. 1868 01:34:37.939 --> 01:34:38.140 Yeah. 1869 01:34:38.699 --> 01:34:42.850 So, anyway, let's roll on to our friend Brian from Phoenix, 1870 01:34:42.949 --> 01:34:45.229 a longtime VIP member. 1871

01:34:45.989 --> 01:34:47.470 Welcome to the PWTorch Livecast. 1872 01:34:50.229 --> 01:34:50.569 Hey, Bruce. 1873 01:34:50.630 --> 01:34:51.149 Hey, Travis. 1874 01:34:51.949 --> 01:34:53.149 Well, first of all, I hope you both have a 1875 01:34:53.149 --> 01:34:56.600 real good weekend. So, sticking with a couple points that 1876 01:34:56.640 --> 01:34:58.579 you brought up and Darrell talked about, first of all, 1877 01:34:58.800 --> 01:35:00.779 I don't have a problem with Survivor Series and them 1878 01:35:01.100 --> 01:35:04.739 doing Raw versus SmackDown. Yeah, it's too soon since the 1879 01:35:04.760 --> 01:35:07.020 brand split. You know, if they would have done the 1880 01:35:07.079 --> 01:35:11.789 brand separation or brand split in January, you know, it 1881 01:35:11.810 --> 01:35:14.029 probably would have still been too soon to do a 1882 01:35:14.050 --> 01:35:17.409 Survivor Series match. But I've always been, you know, since 1883 01:35:17.409 --> 01:35:19.770 87 when they first did the Survivor Series, I've always 1884 01:35:19.789 --> 01:35:22.569 been a mark for those type of matches. So, again, 1885 01:35:22.600 --> 01:35:25.380 I'm fine with it. And, you know, maybe it's too soon, yeah. 1886 01:35:25.720 --> 01:35:28.340 But I'm really interested to see, yeah, they can mix 1887 01:35:28.359 --> 01:35:31.100 heel and faces up on Raw and SmackDown team. To me, again, 1888 01:35:31.140 --> 01:35:36.890 it's no real big deal. So speaking about, I'm calling 1889 01:35:36.930 --> 01:35:39.029 it right now that Charlotte's going to do a moonsault 1890 01:35:39.470 --> 01:35:41.789 off of the top of the Hell in a Cell 1891 01:35:42.029 --> 01:35:46.170 onto Sasha. I'm calling it right now. That's my shot. 1892 01:35:47.529 --> 01:35:51.130 Well, are you going to go to the funeral, Brian? 1893 01:35:51.270 --> 01:35:51.529 Yeah. 1894 01:35:54.579 --> 01:35:58.640 I'll go to the Facebook funeral, yes. Send my condolences there. 1895 01:35:58.680 --> 01:36:01.680 Send your condolences, and then we'll all act really sad, 1896 01:36:01.699 --> 01:36:03.960 but we'll also talk about how she sacrificed herself for 1897 01:36:03.979 --> 01:36:06.520 the good of the universe. 1898 01:36:06.659 --> 01:36:08.319 This is wrestling. 1899 01:36:08.579 --> 01:36:12.119 Yeah. This is awesome. 1900 01:36:12.159 --> 01:36:16.119 She deserved to be dead, kind of, right? I mean, 1901 01:36:16.920 --> 01:36:19.239 that's the perfect chance to chant you deserve it, because 1902 01:36:19.260 --> 01:36:21.890 you're kind of a dumbass for doing that, but I'm sure. 1903 01:36:24.670 --> 01:36:27.640 Actually, Travis, they're going to say that for the casket 1904 01:36:27.649 --> 01:36:28.659 match they have next time. 1905 01:36:29.199 --> 01:36:30.680 Oh, good look, Brian. 1906 01:36:30.880 --> 01:36:33.760 Oh, man. Brian, I'm so disappointed in you. 1907 01:36:33.800 --> 01:36:37.220 I expected that, Travis, but I'm so disappointed in you. 1908 01:36:39.180 --> 01:36:39.899 It's horrible. 1909 01:36:40.899 --> 01:36:43.170 So I'm going to get to my main point here 1910 01:36:43.189 --> 01:36:45.829 in one minute. But, hey, Travis, thanks for reading my 1911 01:36:45.890 --> 01:36:49.369 email on an East Coast Cavs VIP, exclusive VIP thing. 1912 01:36:50.069 --> 01:36:51.729 I was falling asleep when I typed it, so I 1913 01:36:51.729 --> 01:36:53.770 made a couple typos here. I appreciate you covering that 1914 01:36:53.829 --> 01:36:54.090 for me. 1915 01:36:54.310 --> 01:36:55.029 Yeah, yeah, yeah. 1916 01:36:55.229 --> 01:36:58.210 Wait a minute. What is he talking about? Stop for 1917 01:36:58.229 --> 01:36:59.399 a second. What is this East Coast Caps? 1918 01:36:59.409 --> 01:37:00.960 No, he literally made some typos. 1919 01:37:01.439 --> 01:37:04.579 No, what is this show he's talking about? Plug your show, Travis. 1920 01:37:04.600 --> 01:37:07.939 I'm trying to be, like, subtle, and you're not very subtle, 1921 01:37:07.979 --> 01:37:10.340 and you're not even picking up on the not very subtle. 1922 01:37:10.859 --> 01:37:11.800 Plug the show, man. 1923 01:37:12.260 --> 01:37:16.869 East Coast Caps, every Wednesday, 6.30 Eastern until the guy 1924 01:37:16.890 --> 01:37:22.909 knows when. Chad at EastCoastCats.com, six years worth of archives. Yeah, 1925 01:37:23.029 --> 01:37:25.260 go PP. Thanks, Bruce. Thanks, Brian. 1926 01:37:28.579 --> 01:37:30.600 So I do have a question, but I'm going to 1927 01:37:30.619 --> 01:37:35.619 go back to somebody sent a letter to editor-publisher Wade 1928 01:37:35.640 --> 01:37:39.239 Keller asking, sticking with the Charlotte thing, asking is WWE 1929 01:37:39.960 --> 01:37:43.359 trying to get Charlotte to equal Ric Flair's 16 world titles? 1930 01:37:43.439 --> 01:37:48.109 I'm like, Charlotte has been in wrestling for like four years. And, yeah, 1931 01:37:48.210 --> 01:37:54.569 she won the women's championship twice. That's not in anybody's 1932 01:37:54.670 --> 01:37:58.989 thinking about her trying to equal Ric Flair's 16th. Again, 1933 01:37:59.029 --> 01:38:01.369 that was just a funny question. Somebody said the way 1934 01:38:01.409 --> 01:38:02.149 he played at you. 1935 01:38:02.670 --> 01:38:06.630 I mean, did he win, like, 13 titles, 11 titles 1936 01:38:06.750 --> 01:38:12.010 in six, seven years? Is that not even six, seven years? 1937 01:38:12.029 --> 01:38:15.600 When did he win his first one? Six, the beginning 1938 01:38:15.640 --> 01:38:19.310 of 06? And then he retired in 2011, and sometime 1939 01:38:19.550 --> 01:38:22.890 in that time span, he won 11 World Heavyweight Championships. 1940 01:38:24.430 --> 01:38:26.670 That says it all, doesn't it? I mean, that really does. 1941 01:38:26.689 --> 01:38:27.329 That says it all. 1942 01:38:30.090 --> 01:38:33.310 Well, I blame Vince Russo's crash booking, of course, for 1943 01:38:33.329 --> 01:38:35.829 the PW Torch wrap. That's why I blame. 1944 01:38:35.630 -->

01:38:38.189 Him for that. 1945 01:38:38.310 --> 01:38:40.710 Is that still up on YouTube? That still kills me. Oh, 1946 01:38:40.729 --> 01:38:43.180 my God. Yes, it is, Bruce. 1947 01:38:43.239 --> 01:38:44.840 I played it a couple of weeks ago. 1948 01:38:44.859 --> 01:38:51.260 Oh, wow. Thanks, Travis. No, it is awesome. 1949 01:38:51.300 --> 01:38:52.220 Was that you rapping? 1950 01:38:52.920 --> 01:38:55.880 No, it was not me rapping. Seriously, the thing is awesome. 1951 01:38:55.939 --> 01:38:57.359 I'm not even being ironic. 1952 01:38:57.420 --> 01:38:58.659 It's just amazing. 1953 01:38:59.859 --> 01:39:04.470 Go to PWTorchRap. Is that what it's called? I haven't 1954 01:39:04.489 --> 01:39:05.149 looked in a while. 1955 01:39:05.170 --> 01:39:07.430 Yeah, PWTorchRap on YouTube. 1956 01:39:07.590 --> 01:39:09.609 Yeah, so TorchRap on YouTube. 1957 01:39:09.670 --> 01:39:12.590 Or go to our East Coast Cast Facebook fan page. 1958 01:39:13.130 --> 01:39:16.710 It was up on there. However you want to do it. 1959 01:39:18.649 --> 01:39:20.789 So I do have a question, but I'm going to 1960 01:39:20.909 --> 01:39:26.630 now plug the East Coast Cats Facebook page because the 1961 01:39:26.710 --> 01:39:31.130 Nature Boy Ric Flair actually answered back Haley Berry's publicist 1962 01:39:31.189 --> 01:39:34.170 about Haley Berry and Ric Flair. So go ahead and 1963 01:39:34.210 --> 01:39:35.430 talk about that trap briefly. 1964 01:39:36.449 --> 01:39:43.409 Yeah, no, I suggested that Ric publicly respond to it. 1965 01:39:44.149 --> 01:39:48.569 to Holly's publicist saying, calling him a liar, which I believe. 1966 01:39:50.829 --> 01:39:54.800 And so, yeah, I got that to happen. And if 1967 01:39:54.819 --> 01:39:59.359 you want to hear Ric Flair responding directly to the 1968 01:39:59.399 --> 01:40:03.060 entire Halle Berry situation, plus more, you have to go 1969 01:40:03.079 --> 01:40:06.609 to search out the East Coast Cast fan page, P.W. Torch, 1970 01:40:06.649 --> 01:40:11.090 East Coast Cast, something like that, and you'll see the logo. And, yeah, 1971 01:40:11.109 --> 01:40:13.279 it's there. Exclusively on. 1972 01:40:13.869 --> 01:40:16.909 Which I'm glad to hear that. And I also want 1973 01:40:16.930 --> 01:40:20.810 to plug my own work this week. Easily the most salacious, 1974 01:40:20.930 --> 01:40:24.229 sleazy column I have ever written for PW Torch. And 1975 01:40:24.609 --> 01:40:27.239 that covers a lot of ground because I've definitely dug 1976 01:40:27.279 --> 01:40:29.779 my share of dirt over the years. And I wrote 1977 01:40:29.819 --> 01:40:35.039 about Ric Flair and Halle Berry. And editor-publisher Wade Keller 1978 01:40:35.060 --> 01:40:38.100 kind of hid it. He didn't put a headline up 1979 01:40:38.159 --> 01:40:39.340 on the VIP site. 1980 01:40:39.739 --> 01:40:42.930 He let it stay up in the– you have to 1981 01:40:42.970 --> 01:40:43.319 go up. 1982 01:40:43.710 --> 01:40:46.270 To the logo and then, and then click on the 1983 01:40:46.310 --> 01:40:48.470 newsletter icon, the top one on the left and do 1984 01:40:48.510 --> 01:40:50.409 its newsletter. And then you have to scroll down for 1985 01:40:50.949 --> 01:40:53.960 a while. Um, but I wrote about this too, and 1986 01:40:54.060 --> 01:40:56.479 I took a little more measured approach. Did this really happen? 1987 01:40:56.500 --> 01:40:57.760 Did it not? What does this mean? 1988 01:40:58.439 --> 01:41:02.380 And I threw in as much sexually related, um, wrestling 1989 01:41:02.439 --> 01:41:04.550 stuff as I could think of at that time, which 1990 01:41:04.600 --> 01:41:05.890 is a lot, which is a whole lot. 1991 01:41:06.069 --> 01:41:07.630 And I actually hinted. 1992 01:41:07.369 --> 01:41:12.130 That, um, there's another, um, there's another, there's another big 1993 01:41:12.149 --> 01:41:18.279 time celebrity, um, that might get, well, anyway, that, that might've, 1994 01:41:18.880 --> 01:41:22.039 might have, um, suffered the same fate. So, um, a 1995 01:41:22.079 --> 01:41:24.239 lot of, I mean, you know, as someone who's followed 1996 01:41:24.270 --> 01:41:28.109 Rick for his career for, for many, many decades, um, I, 1997 01:41:28.189 --> 01:41:30.449 hopefully I put this and I was trying to put, 1998 01:41:30.670 --> 01:41:32.630 do something serious too, which is things are not always 1999 01:41:32.649 --> 01:41:36.829 what they seem. So, um, you know, could this be possible? What, 2000 01:41:37.270 --> 01:41:39.289 you know, what, what is all the, you know, how 2001 01:41:39.329 --> 01:41:41.789 does all this work out and all that? And, um, 2002 01:41:42.500 --> 01:41:45.829 I came to a conclusion too. Hopefully people will go 2003 01:41:45.890 --> 01:41:47.970 over and look at it. I put some teasers up 2004 01:41:48.029 --> 01:41:49.989 on Twitter and I didn't get any bites. I'm just like, 2005 01:41:50.029 --> 01:41:51.689 I don't know what people want in this world anymore. 2006 01:41:51.710 --> 01:41:55.949 If you don't want wrestling star and Oscar winner doing 2007 01:41:55.970 --> 01:41:59.890 the thing, the letter's DTF. I don't know what to 2008 01:41:59.930 --> 01:42:03.020 tell you, but it's an interesting subject to me. 2009 01:42:03.479 --> 01:42:04.479 And I guess to Travis too. 2010 01:42:07.279 --> 01:42:10.140 So, Bruce, this article about Ric Flair and Haley Berry 2011 01:42:10.159 --> 01:42:12.239 is more salacious than when you broke the news about 2012 01:42:12.279 --> 01:42:14.710 how Raven's flock and what the actual meaning was. Is 2013 01:42:14.750 --> 01:42:15.789 it more salacious than that? 2014 01:42:16.090 --> 01:42:18.130 Yeah, I would say so. Yeah, I had a lot 2015 01:42:18.149 --> 01:42:20.350 of fun with that, too. But, yeah, I would say 2016 01:42:20.369 --> 01:42:24.029 it's more salacious than that. 2017 01:42:24.630 --> 01:42:25.210 Yeah. 2018 01:42:25.369 --> 01:42:26.569 Classic Bruce article. 2019 01:42:27.149 --> 01:42:28.079

Yeah, classic. 2020 01:42:28.119 --> 01:42:30.279 I'll save my question for next time because I've been 2021 01:42:30.300 --> 01:42:32.319 on for a while. So have a real good night 2022 01:42:32.460 --> 01:42:34.000 and have a real good weekend, Bruce and Trav. I 2023 01:42:34.000 --> 01:42:35.140 always appreciate talking to you both. 2024 01:42:35.720 --> 01:42:38.640 Brian, appreciate the support through all the years. Good deal. 2025 01:42:39.100 --> 01:42:44.300 And now that I've talked about salacious stuff, let's go 2026 01:42:44.340 --> 01:42:50.380 to our sponsors. 2027 01:42:53.710 --> 01:42:56.489 Before pushing play on the Wade Keller Pro Wrestling Post Shows, 2028 01:42:56.529 --> 01:43:00.310 check out pwtorch.com and our TV review section and skim 2029 01:43:00.369 --> 01:43:02.409 through a full rundown of the TV show. If you 2030 01:43:02.449 --> 01:43:04.310 didn't see it, that's your way to get an overview 2031 01:43:04.329 --> 01:43:07.489 of of what happened before you dive into our in-depth 2032 01:43:07.729 --> 01:43:11.710 analysis of the key happenings on the show. That's pwtorch.com, 2033 01:43:11.729 --> 01:43:15.090 your home for live TV coverage every Monday, Wednesday, and 2034 01:43:15.130 --> 01:43:17.229 Friday with my TV reports. And also check out our 2035 01:43:17.350 --> 01:43:20.109 NXT and Impact coverage on Tuesdays and Thursdays, our Collision 2036 01:43:20.130 --> 01:43:22.369 reports on Saturday nights, and of course our live pay-per-view 2037 01:43:22.390 --> 01:43:26.829 and PLE coverage on weekends. All waiting for you at pwtorch.com. 2038 01:43:28.850 --> 01:43:30.470 That's pwtorchlivecast.com. 2039 01:43:35.789 --> 01:43:39.750 So let's go to our friend Kylan from New Jersey. Kylan, 2040 01:43:40.170 --> 01:43:41.869 welcome back to the PWTorch Livecast. 2041 01:43:43.850 --> 01:43:46.430 Thank you, Bruce. It's an honor to be back. 2042 01:43:47.510 --> 01:43:49.590 How are you and Travis this week? 2043 01:43:51.909 --> 01:43:55.720 Doing all right. What's on your mind? 2044 01:43:55.770 --> 01:43:56.229 Good. 2045 01:43:59.800 --> 01:44:07.479 My question for this week is on future WWE returns. 2046 01:44:10.340 --> 01:44:10.840 Okay. 2047 01:44:11.260 --> 01:44:22.050 With the announcement of Mickie James returning to WWE at 2048 01:44:23.149 --> 01:44:31.140 NXT TakeOver Toronto in a few weeks, could it be 2049 01:44:31.220 --> 01:44:34.210 possible to to see. 2050 01:44:35.220 --> 01:44:47.180 Say Victoria or Melina possibly return rather soon to WWE. 2051 01:44:48.789 --> 01:44:54.909 You know I was Melina Melina and Victoria Melina and 2052 01:44:54.930 --> 01:44:58.409 Victoria I was surprised by Mickie James I'll be honest 2053 01:44:58.449 --> 01:45:01.710 that surprised me and she didn't leave under the best 2054 01:45:01.750 --> 01:45:04.670 of circumstances, and it's been a long time in several years. 2055 01:45:04.689 --> 01:45:09.810 She's married now with a child and all that. And also, 2056 01:45:09.850 --> 01:45:12.989 I'm just like, holy smokes. I mean, her and Asuka, 2057 01:45:13.010 --> 01:45:17.270 that ought to be interesting. As far as those two, 2058 01:45:18.310 --> 01:45:22.159 I think Victoria has just gone on in her life. 2059 01:45:22.239 --> 01:45:23.579 I'd be surprised at that one. 2060 01:45:23.600 --> 01:45:27.539 Melina, I guess, is a possibility, but I guess it's 2061 01:45:27.560 --> 01:45:29.810 a possibility, but then I didn't I didn't much think 2062 01:45:29.930 --> 01:45:36.569 of the other one coming back in. So, Travis, what's 2063 01:45:36.590 --> 01:45:40.630 your reaction to that? 2064 01:45:40.829 --> 01:45:48.640 I'm really happy to see Nicky James come back to 2065 01:45:48.659 --> 01:45:54.680 face Asuka. That women's division in NXT is struggling because... 2066 01:45:56.510 --> 01:45:59.409 put Asuka in there with four of them, and she's 2067 01:45:59.430 --> 01:46:03.649 just going to demolish them. Like, it's not even fair. Like, 2068 01:46:03.670 --> 01:46:06.810 the Liv Morgan build-up, I was like, what a funky 2069 01:46:07.430 --> 01:46:12.439 little thing you are, Liv. You know, like, oh, poor thing. 2070 01:46:12.460 --> 01:46:14.800 She's going to go in there and, you know, she 2071 01:46:14.819 --> 01:46:16.800 did a real good job of talking herself into it. 2072 01:46:16.979 --> 01:46:19.659 And that's fine. That's a thing that happens in sports. 2073 01:46:19.680 --> 01:46:24.890 That happens with people when there aren't competitors, the competition 2074 01:46:24.909 --> 01:46:27.409 it is. you know, what it is when you're just 2075 01:46:27.630 --> 01:46:32.250 that good. Mickie James can have... Oh, and it's the 2076 01:46:32.289 --> 01:46:37.189 perception as well, because they could book Liv Morgan to, 2077 01:46:38.960 --> 01:46:42.279 you know, kind of have a little more than what 2078 01:46:42.300 --> 01:46:44.600 she got. She kind of got rolled over a few 2079 01:46:44.640 --> 01:46:49.520 weeks ago. But it would insult us all, and you'd 2080 01:46:49.539 --> 01:46:51.699 be like, what? She's not that good. Why is it 2081 01:46:51.720 --> 01:46:58.300 Oscar just tearing through her? Mickie James is... Perception-wise, like 2082 01:46:58.340 --> 01:47:01.140 when she, you know, punches Asuka in the face or 2083 01:47:01.199 --> 01:47:05.060 kicks her or something, and Asuka sells it, you're like, well, yeah, 2084 01:47:05.119 --> 01:47:07.449 it's because Mickie James is the shit, and, you know, 2085 01:47:07.489 --> 01:47:09.350 we haven't seen her in a while, but I'm sure 2086 01:47:09.390 --> 01:47:14.130 those kicks and punches, whatever, still hurt. So I'm happy 2087 01:47:14.170 --> 01:47:18.859 just to give the other women some time to, and 2088 01:47:18.899 --> 01:47:23.119 they need more time than one feud, hopefully. I doubt 2089 01:47:23.159 --> 01:47:25.770 it's going to be a one-off. even if it turns 2090 01:47:25.810 --> 01:47:32.890 into a real

full-blown two-month feud, that's not time for somebody, Jay, 2091 01:47:32.949 --> 01:47:35.770 what are they going to do with that? Isn't there 2092 01:47:35.789 --> 01:47:39.350 Mickey J in the, Mickey K or something? 2093 01:47:39.649 --> 01:47:39.869 Yeah. 2094 01:47:40.310 --> 01:47:45.500 In the division. But all those women, the two Aussies, Daddy-O, 2095 01:47:45.560 --> 01:47:47.500 I forget her name, she hasn't even been on TV 2096 01:47:47.539 --> 01:47:52.279 in a while, Leah, or as we call her, Alia. Yeah. 2097 01:47:54.390 --> 01:47:56.350 Yes. Sorry. 2098 01:47:56.609 --> 01:47:59.789 Yeah, I mean, those women just don't have any credibility, 2099 01:47:59.890 --> 01:48:01.489 and it's going to take a while before they get 2100 01:48:01.550 --> 01:48:02.979 any credibility. 2101 01:48:03.399 --> 01:48:04.439 That's a really good point. 2102 01:48:04.500 --> 01:48:07.039 Basically, yeah, there's no one set up for Asuka, and 2103 01:48:07.659 --> 01:48:10.920 Mickie James can come in and do a better job 2104 01:48:10.939 --> 01:48:16.510 with that, has name value, and give NXT something while 2105 01:48:16.850 --> 01:48:19.210 hopefully the women are developing the other side of the 2106 01:48:19.329 --> 01:48:19.970 NXT format. 2107 01:48:20.029 --> 01:48:24.850 Because, Bruce, if not, you do three, four, five of 2108 01:48:24.909 --> 01:48:27.479 those same feuds you did with Liv Morgan over the 2109 01:48:27.520 --> 01:48:32.520 next four months, that division is trash. If she just 2110 01:48:32.619 --> 01:48:36.640 runs through everybody like she did Liv Morgan, they build 2111 01:48:36.720 --> 01:48:38.600 up for two or three weeks, and they get their 2112 01:48:38.640 --> 01:48:42.920 big match, and she's and the Challengers is defeated in 2113 01:48:43.079 --> 01:48:48.560 two minutes, decisively, emphatically, painfully, you got nothing. 2114 01:48:49.260 --> 01:48:50.760 No, you're right. I mean, that's just. 2115 01:48:50.859 --> 01:48:54.010 And what about you have Ember Moon, who's, you know, 2116 01:48:54.090 --> 01:48:57.729 who needs time to go through those women and build 2117 01:48:57.810 --> 01:49:00.310 up to become a credible thing. It's not like they 2118 01:49:00.350 --> 01:49:03.380 have no one. There are, you know, she is somebody 2119 01:49:03.409 --> 01:49:12.289 that can size-wise, style-wise... perception-wise, intimidation-factor-wise, can kind of stand 2120 01:49:12.310 --> 01:49:14.350 there and look at Asuka and you go, okay, well, 2121 01:49:14.369 --> 01:49:18.729 let's see where this goes. Not immediately. Well, sucks for you, 2122 01:49:19.449 --> 01:49:21.720 you know, whatever, whoever, random. 2123 01:49:23.000 --> 01:49:25.880 And also, as Mickie James is working with Asuka, she 2124 01:49:25.899 --> 01:49:29.859 can also work with, you know, the women that are learning, too, 2125 01:49:29.880 --> 01:49:32.500 and you've got an experienced hand in the ring that 2126 01:49:32.520 --> 01:49:34.859 they can learn from and that they can, you know, 2127 01:49:35.449 --> 01:49:37.579 they can get a better experience in the ring from. 2128 01:49:37.619 --> 01:49:41.819 So that's, yeah, it's a good question and good points, Travis. 2129 01:49:41.859 --> 01:49:46.979 I definitely agree with that. It just gives them time 2130 01:49:47.060 --> 01:49:51.390 to go with that. Let's go to Mike from Brooklyn. Mike, 2131 01:49:51.409 --> 01:49:53.770 you're up next on the PWTorch Livecast. 2132 01:49:55.750 --> 01:49:55.970 Yeah. 2133 01:49:56.689 --> 01:50:00.630 What's going on, Travis and Bruce? How y'all guys doing? 2134 01:50:00.670 --> 01:50:05.720 What's up, man? What's going on? Just basically just Yeah, 2135 01:50:05.739 --> 01:50:07.960 and counting on what y'all was saying, I was thinking 2136 01:50:07.979 --> 01:50:11.460 that too. I think it's too close, too soon for them, 2137 01:50:11.500 --> 01:50:16.060 you know, to go Ember Moon and Oscar. I would 2138 01:50:16.119 --> 01:50:18.819 say that would probably be, you know, if I'm a 2139 01:50:18.859 --> 01:50:23.199 better man to take over, you know, WrestleMania weekend because, 2140 01:50:23.689 --> 01:50:25.930 you know, you need time to build that one right there. 2141 01:50:27.029 --> 01:50:29.489 I think it's a smart thing, you know, to get Mickey, 2142 01:50:29.569 --> 01:50:32.789 you know, in there and also I'm thinking the fact 2143 01:50:32.869 --> 01:50:35.640 of the matter that the Spirit Squad You know, back 2144 01:50:35.720 --> 01:50:39.199 on SmackDown, you know, that does, I mean, it'll be low-card, 2145 01:50:39.239 --> 01:50:41.729 but it does add a little depth, you know, to 2146 01:50:41.750 --> 01:50:46.430 their tag team division. And, you know, Trav, we just 2147 01:50:46.449 --> 01:50:49.210 waiting on Joe to get up to the main roster. 2148 01:50:49.229 --> 01:50:52.930 Like I said, I'm a gambling guy, so my thing, 2149 01:50:53.010 --> 01:50:55.050 I would hope he would be like the fifth partner 2150 01:50:55.670 --> 01:50:58.520 on Team SmackDown or Raw or whatever and just come 2151 01:50:58.560 --> 01:51:03.520 through and just destroy it until WrestleMania. And then also 2152 01:51:03.560 --> 01:51:05.880 I got a question for Bruce, which I got to 2153 01:51:05.920 --> 01:51:06.699 think about. 2154 01:51:10.079 --> 01:51:10.300 That. 2155 01:51:10.479 --> 01:51:13.659 Spirit Squad, I mean, I'm not convinced. I said it 2156 01:51:13.979 --> 01:51:19.609 the other day. I'm not convinced. Mikey, I guess, the 2157 01:51:19.670 --> 01:51:23.149 one he used to scooch his ass, the bald-headed one, 2158 01:51:23.750 --> 01:51:28.869 I'm not even sure he was. I'm not sure he's 2159 01:51:28.909 --> 01:51:34.140 taken a bump in the last decade. Did you see 2160 01:51:34.159 --> 01:51:38.380 the welts under his arms or on his back from 2161 01:51:38.420 --> 01:51:43.239 hitting the ropes? That's like week one of wrestling training 2162 01:51:43.300 -->

01:51:46.420 that happens. And after that, or not after that, but, 2163 01:51:46.460 --> 01:51:52.369 you know, that's not happening three months into steady training. 2164 01:51:53.010 --> 01:51:55.750 You don't see that every day with guys, even pale 2165 01:51:55.770 --> 01:52:00.229 guys like Cena or Sheamus. you don't really even see 2166 01:52:00.250 --> 01:52:02.789 that because they're used to bodies, used to hitting those ropes, 2167 01:52:02.829 --> 01:52:05.630 and they're calloused up in that way. I think they 2168 01:52:05.670 --> 01:52:07.659 called him six weeks ago and was like, look, you 2169 01:52:07.699 --> 01:52:09.460 want some money, you want some TV time, we're going 2170 01:52:09.479 --> 01:52:11.220 to do the Spears quad stuff. Can you get to 2171 01:52:11.260 --> 01:52:14.779 our performance center and get some bumps in in the 2172 01:52:14.819 --> 01:52:17.779 next three weeks? He's like, okay. I think that's what 2173 01:52:17.819 --> 01:52:19.899 happened because he doesn't look like a guy that was, 2174 01:52:20.300 --> 01:52:22.229 and I don't even mean it physically, his body and 2175 01:52:22.239 --> 01:52:27.250 being in shape. I just mean taking simple... Back bumps. 2176 01:52:27.350 --> 01:52:30.529 Yeah. Ring shake. Ring shake. 2177 01:52:31.670 --> 01:52:35.039 Yeah. I'm not exactly thrilled that they're doing this Spirits 2178 01:52:35.060 --> 01:52:39.399 Squad stuff. I get it that they're stretching the Miz 2179 01:52:40.239 --> 01:52:42.939 doll stuff out and Miz is doing it to get 2180 01:52:43.000 --> 01:52:46.020 under doll skin and make fun of him. Yeah, that's fine. 2181 01:52:46.100 --> 01:52:47.380 But, yeah. 2182 01:52:48.640 --> 01:52:51.300 It's already just two of them and one of them 2183 01:52:51.340 --> 01:52:52.539 just looks pathetic and. 2184 01:52:55.119 --> 01:53:00.560 And then Kenny, who I didn't really ever really, just, whatever. Anyway. 2185 01:53:02.350 --> 01:53:04.449 It wasn't like they were some great act from, you know, 2186 01:53:04.470 --> 01:53:07.869 they were like, they were the ultimate stooges for Degeneration X, 2187 01:53:07.909 --> 01:53:10.390 and that was about it. And they were such stooges 2188 01:53:10.409 --> 01:53:12.109 that they got cut as soon. 2189 01:53:12.010 --> 01:53:12.439 As they finished. 2190 01:53:12.449 --> 01:53:13.449 But they were good athletes. 2191 01:53:14.000 --> 01:53:15.579 They were good athletes, and one of them, you know, 2192 01:53:15.600 --> 01:53:17.600 one of them turned into, yeah, they could bump, but, um, 2193 01:53:18.100 --> 01:53:19.180 You've got very good points. 2194 01:53:19.260 --> 01:53:23.640 I wasn't surprised to see them to build up that match. 2195 01:53:23.880 --> 01:53:26.850 I was surprised to see them three times. I just 2196 01:53:26.859 --> 01:53:30.670 thought it's a one-note joke from the past, and you 2197 01:53:30.689 --> 01:53:32.489 make your point with it, and then you move on 2198 01:53:32.510 --> 01:53:33.890 with Dolph Ziggler. 2199 01:53:34.310 --> 01:53:36.270 If he's going to win the. 2200 01:53:36.250 --> 01:53:39.050 Match, I think they're facing the problem we talked about, 2201 01:53:39.130 --> 01:53:41.810 which was, okay, Dolph Ziggler beat Miz. What do you 2202 01:53:41.829 --> 01:53:45.109 do now with Dolph Ziggler? Now he's got the Intercontinental title. 2203 01:53:45.529 --> 01:53:50.619 He's What's the next part of the story? And, you know, 2204 01:53:50.659 --> 01:53:51.180 we'll see where. 2205 01:53:51.199 --> 01:53:53.180 And he's being determined not to turn a deal. 2206 01:53:53.500 --> 01:53:56.260 Yeah. So where does this, you know, where does this go? 2207 01:53:56.640 --> 01:54:00.260 And, again, I thought they did the, you know, you 2208 01:54:00.300 --> 01:54:03.000 love me, you really, really love me, the Academy Award 2209 01:54:03.199 --> 01:54:04.220 acting promo. 2210 01:54:04.279 --> 01:54:06.039 And there were. 2211 01:54:05.880 --> 01:54:08.119 Parts of it that were good. The emotion was good. 2212 01:54:08.159 --> 01:54:11.140 But I just, I don't know. And, you know, that was, 2213 01:54:13.180 --> 01:54:15.600 there were some interesting parts to that. And then some 2214 01:54:15.619 --> 01:54:16.680 not so interesting parts to that. 2215 01:54:20.579 --> 01:54:24.329 Hey everyone, long time PWTorch columnist Sean Radican here to 2216 01:54:24.350 --> 01:54:27.489 let you know I've revamped and renewed the Radican Worldwide 2217 01:54:27.569 --> 01:54:32.579 Podcast for 2026. a weekly VIP exclusive. Every week, I 2218 01:54:32.619 --> 01:54:35.199 break down four or five of the biggest trending topics 2219 01:54:35.439 --> 01:54:39.279 in pro wrestling. I also present my analysis, providing insight 2220 01:54:39.310 --> 01:54:41.789 that helps you understand the story better or see it 2221 01:54:41.829 --> 01:54:44.729 another way than maybe is the controversial take out there. 2222 01:54:44.970 --> 01:54:47.170 Then I bring on a special guest for the second 2223 01:54:47.189 --> 01:54:50.250 half of the podcast. Sometimes it's a wrestler or someone 2224 01:54:50.289 --> 01:54:52.510 else who works in the business. Other times it's a 2225 01:54:52.550 --> 01:54:55.649 guest analyst who brings their specialized point of view on 2226 01:54:55.670 --> 01:54:58.739 a particular key topic in the news. Recent guests have 2227 01:54:58.779 --> 01:55:02.039 included Bronson Reed from WWE and PCO. One of my 2228 01:55:02.100 --> 01:55:04.810 areas of specialty is the Japan wrestling scene, so I 2229 01:55:04.850 --> 01:55:07.869 often cover a big topic from Japan with PW Torch's 2230 01:55:07.989 --> 01:55:11.750 own Alan Farrell, Kelly Wells, and Chris Lansdell. I don't 2231 01:55:11.770 --> 01:55:13.930 just cover the news. I don't just riff on the 2232 01:55:14.010 --> 01:55:16.260 news or give a standard hot take. I'll bring my 2233 01:55:16.340 --> 01:55:19.920 decades of studying this industry and

talking one-on-one with dozens 2234 01:55:20.300 --> 01:55:23.560 of wrestling promoters to each week's show so you understand 2235 01:55:23.640 --> 01:55:26.680 not just what's happening, but the context of why. Get 2236 01:55:26.720 --> 01:55:29.010 ahead of the news. Get ahead of the pack with 2237 01:55:29.060 --> 01:55:33.170 Ratican Worldwide only at PWTorch VIP. 2238 01:55:35.789 --> 01:55:36.829 So, Mike, what else you got? 2239 01:55:36.850 --> 01:55:42.649 So, the other night, Bruce, I bumped, you know, just 2240 01:55:42.670 --> 01:55:45.609 looking through YouTube and it had the records, you know. 2241 01:55:46.630 --> 01:55:47.130 Sure. 2242 01:55:47.170 --> 01:55:49.329 You know, to recommend them, watch them. So, I bumped 2243 01:55:49.409 --> 01:55:54.670 into Jim Cornette and Bruce Pritchard's podcast. 2244 01:55:55.270 --> 01:55:55.529 Yes. 2245 01:55:56.430 --> 01:55:56.569 And. 2246 01:55:58.460 --> 01:56:00.420 I mean, it was just, I don't, they were just 2247 01:56:00.479 --> 01:56:04.810 going in on you, Wade, and Dave Melfa. Like, it 2248 01:56:04.850 --> 01:56:05.829 was nobody's business. 2249 01:56:06.710 --> 01:56:09.250 You know, I'm starting to, like, lose track of these things. 2250 01:56:09.710 --> 01:56:12.729 I didn't realize that those two had done one together 2251 01:56:13.189 --> 01:56:15.329 and talked about us. In fact, I think someone tried 2252 01:56:15.350 --> 01:56:17.029 to say something about it, and I thought, is this 2253 01:56:17.090 --> 01:56:18.630 now or is this some other time? 2254 01:56:19.350 --> 01:56:21.210 Because, yeah, okay. 2255 01:56:22.069 --> 01:56:24.939 Because of what happened with Bruce Prichard on his own show, 2256 01:56:25.039 --> 01:56:29.460 on his own podcast with, you know, on the MLW 2257 01:56:29.500 --> 01:56:30.680 network with Conrad Thompson. 2258 01:56:30.899 --> 01:56:33.670 And, um, yeah. Okay. That's fine. 2259 01:56:33.689 --> 01:56:36.529 I mean, I don't, you know, go through all that, but, um, 2260 01:56:37.050 --> 01:56:38.810 I'll just say this. I stand by everything I said, 2261 01:56:38.829 --> 01:56:39.569 everything I've written. 2262 01:56:39.609 --> 01:56:43.270 So, um, and, and, I mean, it was more, it 2263 01:56:43.510 --> 01:56:47.039 was more so Cornette, you know, going, you know, going 2264 01:56:47.079 --> 01:56:47.680 in on you. 2265 01:56:48.140 --> 01:56:48.380 Yeah. 2266 01:56:48.460 --> 01:56:51.460 And Wade, you know, being prudent. And, you know, I 2267 01:56:51.479 --> 01:56:54.319 just want to, you know, like there's any backstory or 2268 01:56:54.340 --> 01:56:57.430 you care to speak on it. Like, Like, what did 2269 01:56:57.439 --> 01:56:58.569 that stem from? 2270 01:56:58.850 --> 01:56:59.609 Yeah, okay. 2271 01:56:59.649 --> 01:57:01.250 Well, it's been a long time. It's been a while. 2272 01:57:01.510 --> 01:57:05.630 I wrote a column during Smoky Mountain Wrestling time, taking 2273 01:57:05.649 --> 01:57:08.829 Jim Cornette to

task them, partly for just doing a 2274 01:57:08.869 --> 01:57:11.930 lot of bait-and-switch booking. It was very similar to the 2275 01:57:11.970 --> 01:57:16.329 Memphis style, and Smoky Mountain was having some trouble. But 2276 01:57:16.350 --> 01:57:21.220 I also wrote about bringing in the gangsters and basically 2277 01:57:22.079 --> 01:57:25.020 going into Tennessee, mountains of. 2278 01:57:25.000 --> 01:57:26.420 North Carolina, Georgia. 2279 01:57:26.789 --> 01:57:31.550 Where Smoky Mountain was, and trying to heal black guys 2280 01:57:31.689 --> 01:57:34.800 against the white guys. And I just basically wrote a 2281 01:57:34.840 --> 01:57:36.800 column and said, if you're going to do this, do 2282 01:57:36.840 --> 01:57:40.640 it right and put all the heat on. Anyway, and 2283 01:57:40.859 --> 01:57:44.260 Cornette took it personally, took it very personally. And when 2284 01:57:44.279 --> 01:57:46.430 I look back and read it, I can see why 2285 01:57:46.470 --> 01:57:50.970 he would. But there are some parts of it maybe 2286 01:57:50.989 --> 01:57:54.699 he didn't know or He just glossed over– he thought 2287 01:57:54.720 --> 01:57:56.779 I was taking personal shots at people in the company 2288 01:57:56.840 --> 01:57:58.729 when people in the company were laughing along with what 2289 01:57:58.770 --> 01:58:03.609 I wrote. I definitely knew that ahead of time or 2290 01:58:03.649 --> 01:58:06.229 when the column came out. But anyway, I thought it 2291 01:58:06.250 --> 01:58:08.819 was really offensive and a bad business move, and you know, 2292 01:58:08.859 --> 01:58:11.930 now if you listen to Jim Cornette, he has a progressive, um, 2293 01:58:12.409 --> 01:58:15.350 political view and he will say that the gangster gimmick 2294 01:58:15.409 --> 01:58:16.750 itself was a big mistake. 2295 01:58:17.350 --> 01:58:19.149 Um, but he takes that personally. 2296 01:58:19.189 --> 01:58:21.229 So the thing that's interesting to me about this, and 2297 01:58:21.250 --> 01:58:23.289 I really don't like to talk about it because it's just, 2298 01:58:23.810 --> 01:58:26.100 I mean, I'm fine with people reading. 2299 01:58:25.939 --> 01:58:28.220 The column and I'm proud of the column. I have 2300 01:58:28.239 --> 01:58:28.939 no problem with that. 2301 01:58:29.199 --> 01:58:35.020 Um, but it's just, you know, there's kind of a, anyway, um, Cornette, 2302 01:58:35.079 --> 01:58:37.159 when I hear these things, he, he comes up with 2303 01:58:37.180 --> 01:58:42.390 the same, the same, um, you know, insult every single time. 2304 01:58:42.590 --> 01:58:44.510 I mean, it's like the same, it's like pushing, putting 2305 01:58:44.520 --> 01:58:48.109 a quarter in a jukebox. So, um, you know, I'm, 2306 01:58:48.210 --> 01:58:50.489 I'm sorry about that part. We were friends before that 2307 01:58:50.869 --> 01:58:53.109 you haven't lived into, and it's not a positive thing. 2308 01:58:53.130 --> 01:58:53.829 You haven't lived. 2309 01:58:53.670 -->

01:58:58.649 Until you've, um, until you've been cursed out by Jim Cornette, but, um, it's, 2310 01:58:59.590 --> 01:59:01.590 And there were some things that he did in response 2311 01:59:01.630 --> 01:59:03.590 to some reporting in The Torch, too, that I thought 2312 01:59:03.630 --> 01:59:07.050 was just despicable. So I don't know if Bruce Prichard's 2313 01:59:07.109 --> 01:59:10.350 read a word of anything that I've ever written. And 2314 01:59:10.770 --> 01:59:12.869 I know he wasn't happy. Clearly, he wasn't happy with 2315 01:59:12.909 --> 01:59:17.649 what happened on Twitter. I mean, maybe he has, but 2316 01:59:17.760 --> 01:59:22.310 that's there. Prichard has a problem with Dave Meltzer. I'd 2317 01:59:22.350 --> 01:59:24.029 be interested to hear the two of them talking about 2318 01:59:24.069 --> 01:59:26.489 Dave just because Jim Cornette does not have a problem 2319 01:59:26.520 --> 01:59:28.399 with Dave Meltzer. So it'd be interesting to see the 2320 01:59:28.420 --> 01:59:30.960 tiptoeing that would go around on that. But, yeah, thanks 2321 01:59:30.979 --> 01:59:35.439 for the heads up. I didn't realize that cross-pollination had happened. 2322 01:59:35.500 --> 01:59:39.840 So, you know, it's just part of the deal. 2323 01:59:39.880 --> 01:59:42.520 Yeah, it's like a two-part interview, Bruce. I don't remember 2324 01:59:42.539 --> 01:59:46.159 which part, but it's a two-part interview. And it could 2325 01:59:46.180 --> 01:59:48.539 have been no more than like maybe a month ago 2326 01:59:48.560 --> 01:59:52.090 they did it. But, yeah, I just heard that little part, 2327 01:59:52.189 --> 01:59:54.359 and I just turned it off. 2328 01:59:54.460 --> 01:59:55.100 I'm like, wow. 2329 01:59:55.140 --> 01:59:57.119 That made me not want to even listen to it. 2330 01:59:57.800 --> 01:59:59.600 Well, I'd say this, Mike. 2331 02:00:00.060 --> 02:00:02.640 You can go in the archives in PWTorch VIP, and 2332 02:00:02.659 --> 02:00:05.079 I know you're a VIP member, and find the column 2333 02:00:05.100 --> 02:00:08.670 called Onward Cornet Soldiers, and that's what caused the problems 2334 02:00:08.689 --> 02:00:09.350 with him and I. 2335 02:00:10.090 --> 02:00:14.409 And then there's a little bit more with it. There 2336 02:00:14.430 --> 02:00:17.319 was a some bad instances. 2337 02:00:17.359 --> 02:00:19.930 And why is Virginia in a Smoky Mountain wrestling show 2338 02:00:20.020 --> 02:00:22.970 kind of related to some of this? And, um, he 2339 02:00:23.010 --> 02:00:25.270 was really angry with Wade, but I think he felt 2340 02:00:25.289 --> 02:00:29.409 more betrayed by me because we were, we were closer friends, but, um. 2341 02:00:30.689 --> 02:00:34.859 He did mention that he did. 2342 02:00:35.619 --> 02:00:35.859 Yeah. 2343 02:00:35.920 --> 02:00:37.939 But it, um, but it was something that I was 2344 02:00:37.960 --> 02:00:39.840 going to write about because it was such a bad 2345 02:00:39.939 --> 02:00:43.399 idea and offensive on so many levels to me. And 2346 02:00:43.439 --> 02:00:46.039 so that's what I do. I, I, I write things as, 2347 02:00:46.510 --> 02:00:49.489 close to the truth as i can and um i 2348 02:00:49.510 --> 02:00:51.510 get a lot of nice compliments that's all cool and 2349 02:00:51.529 --> 02:00:55.229 i also get a also over 25 years of made 2350 02:00:55.250 --> 02:00:57.810 some people angry and i'm okay with making them angry 2351 02:00:57.890 --> 02:01:00.189 as long as it's um you know as long as 2352 02:01:00.229 --> 02:01:02.590 it's valid if it's not valid i hate it but 2353 02:01:03.409 --> 02:01:06.449 and i'll i'll do whatever i can to make it 2354 02:01:06.520 --> 02:01:09.500 right but this one um i was mean but it 2355 02:01:09.560 --> 02:01:13.229 was i still think it was warranted and I've got 2356 02:01:13.270 --> 02:01:15.510 a lot, I learned a lot from Jim Cornette, watching 2357 02:01:15.550 --> 02:01:19.279 him over the years, and I have a lot of 2358 02:01:19.380 --> 02:01:21.800 admiration for things that he's done. I hate that he's 2359 02:01:21.819 --> 02:01:25.720 so anger-driven, but it's, you know, and I think that, 2360 02:01:25.859 --> 02:01:28.760 I think there are times when he's been, you know, 2361 02:01:28.779 --> 02:01:31.189 during his Ring of Honor tenure and some other times 2362 02:01:31.199 --> 02:01:34.630 where he's been unfairly castigated for some stuff, but I, 2363 02:01:34.789 --> 02:01:38.350 you know, he's unemployable because of acting like that, and 2364 02:01:38.510 --> 02:01:41.130 it's too bad, and I think that the idea that 2365 02:01:41.170 --> 02:01:43.710 now he's appeared in a lot of wrestling fans' mind 2366 02:01:43.770 --> 02:01:47.810 and in his own mind, and with Vince Russo is, like, terrible. 2367 02:01:48.060 --> 02:01:53.119 I just, like, the worst thing you can wish on him. So, um, that's, 2368 02:01:53.640 --> 02:01:55.579 you know, didn't mean to digress with all that, but 2369 02:01:55.880 --> 02:02:02.739 there it is. Anything else, Mike? 2370 02:02:04.590 --> 02:02:06.090 No, that's it, Bruce. That's all. 2371 02:02:06.210 --> 02:02:06.430 Thanks. 2372 02:02:06.869 --> 02:02:08.430 Good night. Talk to you guys next week. 2373 02:02:08.869 --> 02:02:09.699 All right. Appreciate it. 2374 02:02:11.310 --> 02:02:11.489 Cool. 2375 02:02:11.510 --> 02:02:11.850 Thanks, Mike. 2376 02:02:12.739 --> 02:02:15.020 So, Travis, you knew about all that, right? 2377 02:02:16.930 --> 02:02:17.130 Yeah. 2378 02:02:17.550 --> 02:02:18.109 Oh, okay, yeah. 2379 02:02:18.829 --> 02:02:21.090 I even knew about the thing Mike was talking about. 2380 02:02:21.390 --> 02:02:22.890 Yeah, okay. 2381 02:02:22.949 --> 02:02:26.909 You know, part of it is it's been 20-something years now, but, 2382 02:02:27.029 --> 02:02:28.710 you know, anyway. 2383 02:02:29.029 --> 02:02:32.220 But the thing with the quarter and the jukebox, it's like, oh, 2384 02:02:32.340 --> 02:02:37.560 I mean, it's like

that same thing. You know, it's the, oh, 2385 02:02:37.600 --> 02:02:39.699 I hope you get this in front of your family 2386 02:02:39.739 --> 02:02:40.659 and blah, you know, like. 2387 02:02:42.100 --> 02:02:42.720 It's like the same. 2388 02:02:42.729 --> 02:02:42.819 Yeah. 2389 02:02:42.859 --> 02:02:45.479 It doesn't even, it doesn't even, it doesn't even hit 2390 02:02:45.500 --> 02:02:48.960 anymore because like, it's not even shocking. Like, Oh my God, 2391 02:02:48.979 --> 02:02:50.659 why would you say something like that? Because it's like, 2392 02:02:51.619 --> 02:02:53.939 I heard that same vile insult. 2393 02:02:54.479 --> 02:02:54.720 Yeah. 2394 02:02:55.439 --> 02:02:57.729 And there's, you know, forever since I, there's been people 2395 02:02:57.739 --> 02:03:00.130 who have approached him at shows and, and, and I've, 2396 02:03:00.149 --> 02:03:01.670 you know, and then come back and told me and 2397 02:03:01.689 --> 02:03:02.789 I'm like, it's the same joke. 2398 02:03:03.029 --> 02:03:04.449 It's not even a joke, but it's the same thing 2399 02:03:04.489 --> 02:03:06.350 every time. It's like good grief. 2400 02:03:06.430 --> 02:03:08.750 So anyway, um, I, there's a part of me that 2401 02:03:08.789 --> 02:03:11.880 hates it and, and, and all that, but, um, I 2402 02:03:11.960 --> 02:03:13.920 don't know, the part of the insult, I mean, you know, 2403 02:03:13.939 --> 02:03:16.119 it's a vile insult, but on the other hand, wouldn't 2404 02:03:16.140 --> 02:03:17.720 you want to be surrounded by your family as you 2405 02:03:17.760 --> 02:03:18.340 passed away? 2406 02:03:19.119 --> 02:03:20.979 Your loving family as you passed away? 2407 02:03:21.699 --> 02:03:24.380 I mean, I don't know. 2408 02:03:24.600 --> 02:03:27.699 With me and just personally in my fandom, I guess, 2409 02:03:28.180 --> 02:03:30.939 of Jim Cornette, the Jim Cornette experience, or was it 2410 02:03:30.960 --> 02:03:34.979 that one? The one from, like, 2010 that he did. 2411 02:03:35.039 --> 02:03:39.020 It just, I, like, was like, oh, Cornette's pretty awesome again. 2412 02:03:39.060 --> 02:03:45.229 He would just... stand up to, like, nutty right-wing bullcrap, 2413 02:03:45.329 --> 02:03:48.649 and you're just not expecting that. Or at least I 2414 02:03:48.689 --> 02:03:54.260 wasn't at that time. Oh, okay. But then, you know, 2415 02:03:55.300 --> 02:03:59.340 what he can be like to people who I like 2416 02:03:59.359 --> 02:04:00.720 and respect and appreciate. 2417 02:04:02.779 --> 02:04:04.460 I think there was a lot of Al Sharpton in 2418 02:04:04.500 --> 02:04:06.699 the culture at that time, and it was also the O.J. 2419 02:04:06.720 --> 02:04:09.800 Simpson trial, and I thought that He turned himself baby-faced 2420 02:04:09.840 --> 02:04:11.800 so that he could answer Al Sharpton. That's kind of 2421 02:04:11.840 --> 02:04:13.800 how I saw it as far as symbolically, and I 2422 02:04:13.819 --> 02:04:18.680 just thought, and it was not, you

know, just not 2423 02:04:18.720 --> 02:04:21.430 the right kind of, it was going to be bad 2424 02:04:21.439 --> 02:04:23.649 for business, and it was bad for business. There is 2425 02:04:23.689 --> 02:04:26.529 such a thing as too much heat, and it was just, 2426 02:04:26.710 --> 02:04:32.109 you know, when you're directly exploiting racial tension, much less indirectly, 2427 02:04:32.189 --> 02:04:34.220 it's not, just to make a buck, it's not. 2428 02:04:34.100 --> 02:04:34.939 A good thing. 2429 02:04:36.180 --> 02:04:39.350 Bruce, who was the guy who, who didn't want to 2430 02:04:39.390 --> 02:04:43.229 lose to a guy in the Dominican Republic, so he 2431 02:04:44.189 --> 02:04:47.069 pulled him on top of himself or something? 2432 02:04:48.510 --> 02:04:52.489 That was Ric Flair. That was Jack Valeno. 2433 02:04:53.069 --> 02:04:53.439 Where was it? 2434 02:04:53.630 --> 02:04:56.369 Ric Flair and Roddy Piper were in a show. 2435 02:04:56.449 --> 02:05:00.970 Ric Flair was the NWA champion against Jack Valeno, and 2436 02:05:01.069 --> 02:05:05.109 Jack Valeno was the big star in the Dominican Republic. 2437 02:05:05.579 --> 02:05:08.340 And these people did not play. These fans did not play. 2438 02:05:08.840 --> 02:05:13.619 And so it was a very heated situation. And Flair 2439 02:05:13.649 --> 02:05:16.890 was supposed to win or survive with his title, some 2440 02:05:16.909 --> 02:05:20.529 sort of like screw job, disqualification, finish. It doesn't even 2441 02:05:20.569 --> 02:05:21.829 matter what it was, but he was going to come 2442 02:05:21.930 --> 02:05:25.390 out of there screwing this guy in the ring. And 2443 02:05:25.430 --> 02:05:29.659 the people were going and he brought Piper with him 2444 02:05:30.020 --> 02:05:31.039 just for protection. 2445 02:05:31.100 --> 02:05:32.279 I mean, just to like get to the ring and 2446 02:05:32.319 --> 02:05:32.800 get out of the ring. 2447 02:05:33.199 --> 02:05:35.119 And the place was going so crazy, and it was 2448 02:05:35.159 --> 02:05:39.140 so dangerous that Flair just grabbed the guy and said, 2449 02:05:39.359 --> 02:05:42.779 count referee, and lost the NWA title cleanly to the 2450 02:05:42.819 --> 02:05:45.579 guy and left the belt in the ring with him 2451 02:05:46.140 --> 02:05:47.619 just so that he could get back. 2452 02:05:48.140 --> 02:05:50.199 And God knows he did the right thing. 2453 02:05:50.220 --> 02:05:52.800 It's like he did the right thing so much because 2454 02:05:52.840 --> 02:05:54.960 he and Piper lived through it because they might have 2455 02:05:55.000 --> 02:05:58.220 been killed if not. It was like that type of heat. So, yeah, 2456 02:05:58.260 --> 02:06:00.579 that is– I don't know. Yeah, you can get too 2457 02:06:00.619 --> 02:06:02.789 much heat. I mean, that's just– or– you know, they 2458 02:06:02.810 --> 02:06:04.949 did the right thing to cool the heat down. Part 2459 02:06:04.970 --> 02:06:07.359 of the art of professional wrestling, particularly back in the 2460 02:06:07.399 --> 02:06:10.130 day when the fans were rabid and really wanted to, 2461 02:06:10.579 --> 02:06:13.819 and I say this literally, wanted to hang heels and 2462 02:06:13.899 --> 02:06:16.520 shoot them and kill them for their, you know, for 2463 02:06:16.539 --> 02:06:20.159 their misdeeds, that kind of heat, you know, there was, 2464 02:06:20.180 --> 02:06:22.180 you know, heels had to be good at bringing the 2465 02:06:22.220 --> 02:06:24.699 heat up and then sensing in the crowd that things 2466 02:06:24.729 --> 02:06:27.289 were getting too heated and too dangerous and then bringing 2467 02:06:27.329 --> 02:06:30.170 things down again. And that's like the classic thing, like 2468 02:06:30.189 --> 02:06:32.500 they got, you know, The good guy wins and everybody's celebrating. 2469 02:06:32.520 --> 02:06:34.079 Maybe get the hell out of Dodge. And that's what 2470 02:06:34.119 --> 02:06:35.479 they did. So, yeah, it's pretty. 2471 02:06:35.720 --> 02:06:39.000 That's one of those 22. What is it? 22, 23 2472 02:06:39.000 --> 02:06:43.119 title wins for Ric Flair. But if you're counting everything exactly. 2473 02:06:43.189 --> 02:06:43.970 So that's. 2474 02:06:44.609 --> 02:06:48.069 Yeah, that's. But what a great story. Holy crap. So that's. 2475 02:06:48.829 --> 02:06:53.140 So anyway, let's go to our friend Jason in Australia. Jason, 2476 02:06:53.180 --> 02:06:54.420 welcome to PW Torch Livecast. 2477 02:06:57.270 --> 02:07:00.039 Yeah, thanks, Bruce and Travis. Look, I'll get right into it. 2478 02:07:00.109 --> 02:07:04.600 Bruce, I wanted to talk about the pricing of the network, 2479 02:07:04.840 --> 02:07:09.300 the tiering, you know, the thing about offering so much 2480 02:07:09.380 --> 02:07:12.359 for a little amount, you know, $ 5, $ 9, and then 2481 02:07:12.399 --> 02:07:15.029 going to $ 14. Just wanted your guys' opinion on this. 2482 02:07:15.609 --> 02:07:18.289 I'm not a big fan of them decreasing the value 2483 02:07:18.550 --> 02:07:22.449 at all, decreasing the price, because I think the WWE Network, 2484 02:07:22.510 --> 02:07:25.350 and I think everyone would agree, offers tremendous value as 2485 02:07:25.409 --> 02:07:25.670 it is. 2486 02:07:26.170 --> 02:07:27.680 I'd be more keen for them, from a. 2487 02:07:27.680 --> 02:07:31.279 Business point of view, to make $ 9. 99 the absolute lowest 2488 02:07:31.680 --> 02:07:33.640 and then go up to your $ 14. 2489 02:07:33.079 --> 02:07:33.359 99. 2490 02:07:33.359 --> 02:07:40.640 You know, 1.5 million subscribers who would think of those arguments, 2491 02:07:40.659 --> 02:07:43.720 let's say 20% of them, would be willing to pay 2492 02:07:43.739 --> 02:07:48.420 the $ 5 more per month, which I think they would. $ 300, 000, 2493 02:07:46.859 --> 02:07:50.520 you know, it's an extra $ 1. 5 million for them per month. 2494 02:07:51.180 --> 02:07:54.760 What's your overall thoughts on this pricing strategy? Because, like 2495

02:07:54.800 --> 02:07:56.840 I said, I think $ 9. 2496 02:07:55.399 --> 02:07:58.520 99 should be the bare minimum, considering what we get 2497 02:07:58.560 --> 02:07:59.420 as wrestling fans. 2498 02:08:00.699 --> 02:08:04.239 Right, but the way you set it up, though, Jason, 2499 02:08:04.960 --> 02:08:10.010 it's almost as if they're giving, they're dropping, they're giving 2500 02:08:10.069 --> 02:08:11.989 away what they currently give away now for $ 9. 99 for 2501 02:08:12.010 --> 02:08:14.390 that $ 4 or $ 5. 99 price point. That's not the case. 2502 02:08:14.449 --> 02:08:14.810 You get. 2503 02:08:19.489 --> 02:08:24.489 Five hours per month to watch you can stream whatever's 2504 02:08:24.569 --> 02:08:27.449 on there but you got five hours of a month 2505 02:08:27.510 --> 02:08:30.659 of uh you know going into the on-demand stuff you 2506 02:08:30.680 --> 02:08:35.060 can't watch any pay-per-views or maybe only the big four 2507 02:08:36.140 --> 02:08:37.819 or something so it's like they took a ton of 2508 02:08:37.840 --> 02:08:41.010 stuff away like it's like i wouldn't want that but 2509 02:08:41.069 --> 02:08:43.130 if somebody wants to spend five bucks and then get 2510 02:08:43.149 --> 02:08:46.029 that bare bones kind of thing i think that's fine, 2511 02:08:46.069 --> 02:08:49.689 and you have your $ 9. 99 thing, which we're all getting now. 2512 02:08:50.430 --> 02:08:54.829 And then the $ 14. 99, which I don't think would be 2513 02:08:55.550 --> 02:08:59.810 as much of a steal. I mean, I guess if 2514 02:08:59.829 --> 02:09:03.369 you're into it. And I said on Wednesday, they would 2515 02:09:03.390 --> 02:09:07.850 have to target, they would have to have PWG, Chikara, and, 2516 02:09:08.069 --> 02:09:13.460 you know, another, like, maybe Midwestern, like, really respectable, kind 2517 02:09:13.500 --> 02:09:14.500 of really good indie indie. 2518 02:09:15.409 --> 02:09:18.770 CWF Mid-Atlantic. CWF Mid-Atlantic. 2519 02:09:18.930 --> 02:09:20.810 I bought that up Wednesday. I said, maybe the one, yeah, 2520 02:09:20.850 --> 02:09:27.520 Bruce is raved about there. They have a good track record. So, 2521 02:09:28.060 --> 02:09:33.640 and Evolve, I'm sure, of course. That's not worth another 2522 02:09:33.680 --> 02:09:36.720 five bucks for me. I don't watch that stuff now. 2523 02:09:36.739 --> 02:09:38.000 I don't go out of my way to watch that 2524 02:09:38.020 --> 02:09:42.760 stuff now. Five more. Yeah, no, it's already too much. 2525 02:09:43.579 --> 02:09:47.199 Too much. As far as in my life, it's enough entertainment. 2526 02:09:47.220 --> 02:09:50.899 I have enough things to watch or play or listen to, 2527 02:09:51.279 --> 02:09:53.760 and I don't need, for five extra dollars a month, 2528 02:09:54.600 --> 02:09:59.619 access to Chikara or Pro Wrestling Guerrilla or CWF Mid-Atlantic. 2529 02:10:01.770 --> 02:10:02.590 Yeah, I think. 2530 02:10:02.609 --> 02:10:04.029 Yeah, I guess from my point of view. 2531 02:10:04.149 --> 02:10:05.210 So I think it's a great. 2532 02:10:05.289 --> 02:10:08.050 I think what they've sent out as a feeler is 2533 02:10:08.470 --> 02:10:12.470 probably what's going to happen, and I think that's a really... 2534 02:10:13.500 --> 02:10:17.119 really a good way of introducing a higher price point 2535 02:10:18.640 --> 02:10:21.090 and a lower one because, you know, some people might 2536 02:10:21.119 --> 02:10:23.090 want to just spend five bucks. 2537 02:10:23.510 --> 02:10:26.949 I think if that lower price point is, you know, 2538 02:10:27.310 --> 02:10:30.010 is like the two crack rocks you get for free 2539 02:10:30.050 --> 02:10:33.380 the first time and you get, you want to watch it, 2540 02:10:33.609 --> 02:10:36.449 but you need more rocks. Um, you want some more 2541 02:10:36.529 --> 02:10:39.020 once you get in. I, I think I'm okay with that. 2542 02:10:39.060 --> 02:10:40.380 I mean, I think that kind of makes sense. 2543 02:10:40.399 --> 02:10:46.130 I am Ryan out for being, uh, Geez. 2544 02:10:46.189 --> 02:10:48.189 Oh, wait till you read my column if you think 2545 02:10:48.229 --> 02:10:53.430 that's bad. So anyway, maybe you shouldn't be reading my column. 2546 02:10:53.449 --> 02:10:56.590 No one should read my column. You think that's bad. 2547 02:10:56.649 --> 02:11:00.600 So that's, yeah, so I would think, you know, I 2548 02:11:00.640 --> 02:11:02.880 think there's something to that. But I'm sympathetic to what 2549 02:11:02.899 --> 02:11:06.220 Jason's saying about you keep lowering the price point. And 2550 02:11:06.239 --> 02:11:09.920 you're also giving people who don't want to watch three 2551 02:11:09.939 --> 02:11:12.180 hours of Raw all the time or two hours of SmackDown, 2552 02:11:13.550 --> 02:11:17.260 who are WWE fans, they can check in four times 2553 02:11:17.310 --> 02:11:21.939 a year at $ 4. 99 and watch the four biggest pay-per-views. 2554 02:11:23.119 --> 02:11:25.159 That's quite the little hole. I think they must be 2555 02:11:25.199 --> 02:11:28.060 really confident that once they get you hooked in on 2556 02:11:28.100 --> 02:11:32.520 your credit card that most people won't stop subscribing. 2557 02:11:32.640 --> 02:11:34.020 Right, but they got you for $. 2558 02:11:33.819 --> 02:11:34.039 60 a year. 2559 02:11:34.079 --> 02:11:36.159 Unless you're saying they come in for $ 4. 2560 02:11:35.479 --> 02:11:36.300 99 every. 2561 02:11:40.420 --> 02:11:43.600 Four times a year. I'm assuming that person with the 2562 02:11:43.600 --> 02:11:46.619 $ 5 thing is just leave it alone, and then they 2563 02:11:46.659 --> 02:11:50.239 come in and check in because the network allows them to. 2564 02:11:50.319 --> 02:11:53.710 And some of the other pay-per-views are staggered, like 30 2565 02:11:53.710 --> 02:11:56.590 days or something, but it's counted against your five months 2566 02:11:56.670 --> 02:12:02.050 of on-demand, you know, watching and stuff. So, yeah, for 2567 02:12:02.090

--> 02:12:05.260 people that would watch very little or would, yeah, like 2568 02:12:05.270 --> 02:12:08.220 you said, with the two rocks, try it. You know, here, 2569 02:12:08.279 --> 02:12:11.239 no person's on me, pal. Or first one half off 2570 02:12:11.310 --> 02:12:11.810 in this case. 2571 02:12:12.189 --> 02:12:12.409 Yeah. 2572 02:12:12.609 --> 02:12:13.470 Just for you. 2573 02:12:13.489 --> 02:12:14.550 I'll give it to you for half. 2574 02:12:15.010 --> 02:12:15.909 Just for you. 2575 02:12:15.970 --> 02:12:17.329 I wouldn't give anybody else this deal. 2576 02:12:17.590 --> 02:12:17.810 Right. 2577 02:12:17.869 --> 02:12:19.670 And the torch would never do anything like this. 2578 02:12:19.750 --> 02:12:25.470 But, no, it's a very successful way of marketing a product. 2579 02:12:25.489 --> 02:12:27.210 But there is that part of me. I agree with 2580 02:12:27.229 --> 02:12:28.430 Jason sometimes. 2581 02:12:28.770 --> 02:12:30.909 When you keep lowering the price of what your content 2582 02:12:30.989 --> 02:12:33.350 is and people get used to that, then you've got 2583 02:12:33.369 --> 02:12:35.829 your competitor has a high price that people pick and choose, 2584 02:12:36.270 --> 02:12:38.250 and you've got a low price that you keep everybody 2585 02:12:38.289 --> 02:12:38.750 for the month. 2586 02:12:38.789 --> 02:12:41.479 Which one's better? I think you need a hot product. 2587 02:12:42.060 --> 02:12:44.159 At the end of the day, you need content that 2588 02:12:44.180 --> 02:12:46.489 people are hungry for to get them to pay for it. 2589 02:12:53.449 --> 02:12:57.069 You can unlock our commercial-free versions of our free shows 2590 02:12:57.250 --> 02:13:01.010 by searching PWTorch in Apple Podcasts. You'll see a charcoal 2591 02:13:01.029 --> 02:13:03.159 gray logo that says PWTorch VIP on it. 2592 02:13:03.279 --> 02:13:03.859 Click on that. 2593 02:13:03.899 --> 02:13:06.279 There's some free samples of VIP shows, and you can 2594 02:13:06.539 --> 02:13:10.399 unlock the entire VIP lineup, which includes VIP exclusives plus 2595 02:13:10.439 --> 02:13:14.090 commercial-free versions of the free shows by searching PWTorch in 2596 02:13:14.289 --> 02:13:17.170 Apple Podcasts and clicking on the PWTorch VIP logo. and 2597 02:13:17.189 --> 02:13:19.470 then activate your three-day free trial. And after that, you 2598 02:13:19.489 --> 02:13:22.329 can become a VIP member using your Apple account. 2599 02:13:22.409 --> 02:13:22.930 It's that easy. 2600 02:13:23.050 --> 02:13:26.270 Enjoy a streamlined listening experience to our free shows and 2601 02:13:26.489 --> 02:13:30.109 unlock all the VIP exclusives, including our post-pay-per-view roundtables, the 2602 02:13:30.130 --> 02:13:33.090 Wade Keller news bulletins, everything with Rich and Wade, the 2603 02:13:33.149 --> 02:13:35.750 fix that I host with Todd Martin, and a variety 2604 02:13:35.789 --> 02:13:39.270 of other VIP exclusives. Just search PWTorch in your Apple 2605 02:13:39.289 --> 02:13:39.869 Podcast app. 2606 02:13:42.289 --> 02:13:42.550 Jason? 2607 02:13:45.380 --> 02:13:45.600 Yeah. 2608 02:13:47.029 --> 02:13:50.060 I just think the $ 5 option, when I read what 2609 02:13:50.100 --> 02:13:53.460 they're offering, to me it sounds very messy for people 2610 02:13:53.479 --> 02:13:54.220 to understand. 2611 02:13:54.239 --> 02:13:57.739 I just think you stay with the $ 9. 2612 02:13:57.539 --> 02:13:57.640 99. 2613 02:13:57.640 --> 02:14:01.939 Look, I don't know what they could offer for $ 5 more. 2614 02:14:02.039 --> 02:14:05.420 I think in hindsight, they would have probably gone in 2615 02:14:05.640 --> 02:14:11.520 and said $ 9. 99, you get the live stream, but for $ 14. 99, 2616 02:14:10.439 --> 02:14:12.800 you get the live stream and the library. 2617 02:14:13.100 --> 02:14:13.619 You know what I mean? 2618 02:14:13.659 --> 02:14:14.890 They could have done it that way, but. 2619 02:14:15.270 --> 02:14:16.100 They weren't to know that. 2620 02:14:16.149 --> 02:14:17.479 I guess they had to go all in. 2621 02:14:17.550 --> 02:14:20.529 But I'm just not a fan of lowering that price 2622 02:14:20.590 --> 02:14:24.189 point because I think, objectively speaking, what they're giving you, 2623 02:14:24.310 --> 02:14:27.149 pretty much the keys to the castle as far as 2624 02:14:27.189 --> 02:14:30.310 their whole library is concerned, I think it is tremendous value. 2625 02:14:30.350 --> 02:14:32.670 I'd be more keen for them to try and get 2626 02:14:32.689 --> 02:14:36.770 more money out of their existing subscribers because I think 2627 02:14:36.869 --> 02:14:40.010 it's showing that the hardcore fans are willing to pay 2628 02:14:40.050 --> 02:14:43.510 top dollar. The other thing I wanted to touch on 2629 02:14:43.529 --> 02:14:46.909 was the... Sasha Banks, Charlotte, Hell in a Cell match. 2630 02:14:47.770 --> 02:14:49.949 I don't know. I'm not a big fan of that match, 2631 02:14:50.050 --> 02:14:52.210 having those two in Hell in a Cell, because I'm 2632 02:14:52.229 --> 02:14:55.890 just worried about what they might do. I don't want 2633 02:14:55.909 --> 02:14:58.869 to see Charlotte going to the top to attempt a moonsault. 2634 02:14:59.329 --> 02:15:01.489 I don't want to see Sasha Banks. I'm just a 2635 02:15:01.569 --> 02:15:03.920 little bit concerned that that might take this a bit far. 2636 02:15:03.960 --> 02:15:04.659 What do you guys think? 2637 02:15:06.500 --> 02:15:08.020 I worry about Sasha Banks. 2638 02:15:08.340 --> 02:15:11.199 She just came off of an injury where she was 2639 02:15:11.260 --> 02:15:14.220 lucky not to be out for a longer period of time. Um, 2640 02:15:14.500 --> 02:15:17.310 and the truth is if you're, and I'm a fan, 2641 02:15:17.319 --> 02:15:19.770 I mean, I'm a fan of the whole package with 2642 02:15:19.789 --> 02:15:22.109 Sasha Banks. I mean, I think she's really got something and, 2643 02:15:22.569 --> 02:15:25.069 and her and Charlotte are

doing something in. 2644 02:15:25.029 --> 02:15:26.369 That division, no doubt. 2645 02:15:26.449 --> 02:15:30.149 But, um, you've got to work in ways that, um, 2646 02:15:30.489 --> 02:15:33.680 you've got to accentuate your positives and, and, and stay 2647 02:15:33.720 --> 02:15:37.220 away from negatives. And she's a small frame person and that's, 2648 02:15:37.539 --> 02:15:40.779 that's just the truth. And so you don't want to, um, 2649 02:15:41.260 --> 02:15:44.060 you don't want to, you want to, take all the 2650 02:15:44.100 --> 02:15:47.649 wrestlers to a point, but not, not past that point. 2651 02:15:47.670 --> 02:15:49.510 And I wonder what that's going to happen. I know that, um, 2652 02:15:50.029 --> 02:15:53.329 Ric Flair told Conrad Thompson on Ric Flair show that, um, 2653 02:15:53.710 --> 02:15:56.050 Charlotte had said she was going to do something that 2654 02:15:56.069 --> 02:15:59.380 had never been seen before and, and hell in the cell. 2655 02:15:59.449 --> 02:16:02.819 And that concerns me. You know, I think maybe, I mean, 2656 02:16:02.880 --> 02:16:03.199 I don't know. 2657 02:16:03.239 --> 02:16:05.880 We'll see what it is. So, um, hopefully it's something 2658 02:16:05.979 --> 02:16:08.399 smarter than it is risky, but I don't know. We'll 2659 02:16:08.420 --> 02:16:09.800 have to wait to see that night. 2660 02:16:13.939 --> 02:16:14.239 Travis? 2661 02:16:14.310 --> 02:16:15.399 Yeah, I'm not a big fan of that. 2662 02:16:15.439 --> 02:16:16.789 Hopefully it's, yeah. 2663 02:16:17.630 --> 02:16:17.869 Yeah. 2664 02:16:17.930 --> 02:16:20.029 Yeah, no, we, you, you got it and we covered 2665 02:16:20.069 --> 02:16:20.909 it a little bit earlier. 2666 02:16:21.270 --> 02:16:21.510 Yeah. 2667 02:16:21.689 --> 02:16:24.069 So, but yeah, I'm not, I'm not, I, I do 2668 02:16:24.109 --> 02:16:26.250 worry about that. And, um, Hell in a Cell is, 2669 02:16:26.729 --> 02:16:29.090 can be pretty nasty. They take a lot of like 2670 02:16:29.189 --> 02:16:32.409 strong bumps because it's a cage match without blood. So 2671 02:16:32.450 --> 02:16:36.129 you've got to get the, the wow factor somewhere. And, um, 2672 02:16:36.430 --> 02:16:38.209 I didn't like, I didn't like how Shane got it 2673 02:16:38.329 --> 02:16:40.430 and I don't like how Shane did it at WrestleMania. 2674 02:16:40.450 --> 02:16:42.629 I didn't like how Mick Foley did it. It's just, um, 2675 02:16:43.129 --> 02:16:45.129 you know, you look back and it's not a good thing. 2676 02:16:47.250 --> 02:16:49.829 That came up with, with Charlotte do a, do a 2677 02:16:49.829 --> 02:16:54.440 blade job and, uh, or, or something like that. 2678 02:16:55.020 --> 02:16:58.020 No, I can't imagine WWE is going to let anybody, 2679 02:16:58.040 --> 02:17:00.180 but Brock, you know, you know, there is, there is 2680 02:17:00.219 --> 02:17:02.799 a double standard, but the double standard with, with bleeding 2681 02:17:03.000 --> 02:17:05.969 is Brock Lesnar. And I don't

know that they're, they're, 2682 02:17:06.010 --> 02:17:08.190 you know, they're looking for that. I've, I've always wondered 2683 02:17:08.209 --> 02:17:10.510 what would happen in, in UFC the first time. And 2684 02:17:10.549 --> 02:17:12.649 it'll happen sooner or later. First time a woman, um, 2685 02:17:13.139 --> 02:17:18.100 gets really beaten up badly in a match and bleeds 2686 02:17:18.180 --> 02:17:18.700 a lot. 2687 02:17:18.899 --> 02:17:22.079 Well, her body didn't exactly go out pristine. 2688 02:17:22.469 --> 02:17:23.020 No, that's true. 2689 02:17:23.049 --> 02:17:24.309 Her face was. 2690 02:17:24.670 --> 02:17:28.989 Hamburger meat, but her face got pounded and kicked in. 2691 02:17:29.549 --> 02:17:32.930 And she stood there with a lumped-up face afterwards. So 2692 02:17:33.389 --> 02:17:37.049 that was a big high-profile, high-profile fight. That's true. 2693 02:17:37.409 --> 02:17:39.690 That's true. And they kind of got through. 2694 02:17:39.750 --> 02:17:39.930 It was. 2695 02:17:41.840 --> 02:17:44.750 But there was no gusher. There was no crimson mask 2696 02:17:44.850 --> 02:17:49.399 like you can get. So I do get your point. 2697 02:17:50.020 --> 02:17:52.639 And it is going to happen sooner or eventually, I 2698 02:17:52.659 --> 02:17:53.180 should say. 2699 02:17:54.440 --> 02:18:00.319 And I just don't see– I can't imagine– Go ahead. 2700 02:18:00.719 --> 02:18:01.299 Jason, go ahead. 2701 02:18:01.479 --> 02:18:04.159 Bruce, I was listening to you on the Bruce Mitchell 2702 02:18:04.180 --> 02:18:07.420 audio show. Were you saying that you think Goldberg. 2703 02:18:07.000 --> 02:18:07.780 Should beat Lesnar? 2704 02:18:09.139 --> 02:18:14.079 I think Goldberg is going to beat Lesnar. Yeah. He 2705 02:18:14.120 --> 02:18:18.250 really is. For what they want to do. 2706 02:18:18.270 --> 02:18:20.829 Goldberg ain't beating no goddamn... Come on, Bruce. 2707 02:18:20.850 --> 02:18:23.430 Oh, okay. 2708 02:18:23.450 --> 02:18:23.930 Come on. 2709 02:18:24.049 --> 02:18:25.090 I'm sorry. 2710 02:18:25.170 --> 02:18:28.049 I'm not going to beat Lesnar. First off, I'll be 2711 02:18:28.069 --> 02:18:30.680 with that fan that took the show. Be ready to. 2712 02:18:31.520 --> 02:18:32.600 Take it, brother. 2713 02:18:33.020 --> 02:18:36.000 Strangle the... attempt to, I'd be the guy that you 2714 02:18:36.020 --> 02:18:42.409 convinced to, no, I'm right behind you. Well, Travis, I. 2715 02:18:42.350 --> 02:18:43.090 Think you're right. 2716 02:18:43.129 --> 02:18:45.170 I think it is a miscarriage of justice if Bill 2717 02:18:45.370 --> 02:18:47.989 Goldberg beats Brock Lesnar. And I want you to know, 2718 02:18:48.389 --> 02:18:51.190 book your ticket, go on down there, and I'm right 2719 02:18:51.209 --> 02:18:52.690 behind you. 2720 02:18:53.149 --> 02:18:55.299 I'm right there. I got your back. I'm on your 2721 02:18:55.340 --> 02:18:57.879 back as you go in the ring. That would be absurd. 2722 02:18:59.450 --> 02:19:02.190 For Goldberg to go 2-0 against Lesnar, I mean, especially 2723 02:19:02.229 --> 02:19:05.219 after building up the fact that it's the one blemish, 2724 02:19:05.239 --> 02:19:07.420 but it's not really. But, you know, he doesn't like 2725 02:19:07.459 --> 02:19:10.360 that blemish on his record. Or at least the other 2726 02:19:10.399 --> 02:19:12.530 blemishes he's sort of got. You know, he beat Triple H, 2727 02:19:12.559 --> 02:19:15.379 Triple H beat him. I guess that maybe was Heyman's point. 2728 02:19:15.840 --> 02:19:18.809 But he's never, you know, he needs to tie that 2729 02:19:18.889 --> 02:19:21.209 up at least with Goldberg. And they're not going to 2730 02:19:21.250 --> 02:19:26.110 have Goldberg come in one-off and then win. No, friggin' 2731 02:19:26.409 --> 02:19:30.299 absolutely not. How do you even think that they would 2732 02:19:30.340 --> 02:19:31.340 allow that to happen? 2733 02:19:31.500 --> 02:19:34.319 So Jason, Travis clearly agrees with everything I say. 2734 02:19:34.440 --> 02:19:39.420 So what's your reaction to this? Bill Goldberg beats Brock Lesnar. 2735 02:19:42.500 --> 02:19:44.059 I think I understand what you're saying. I don't think 2736 02:19:44.079 --> 02:19:46.000 you want that to happen, but I think that's the 2737 02:19:46.020 --> 02:19:48.860 way you see the story going with Shane McMahon coming in. 2738 02:19:49.280 --> 02:19:52.120 Because remember, Shane McMahon's still got to get revenge on Lesnar, 2739 02:19:52.139 --> 02:19:54.329 so he brings in Goldberg if something happens. 2740 02:19:55.409 --> 02:19:56.950 I really don't want to see that. 2741 02:19:57.069 --> 02:20:00.180 If Goldberg beats Lesnar, I mean, I'll throw my hands 2742 02:20:00.260 --> 02:20:02.579 up in the air as far as their storytelling is concerned. 2743 02:20:02.819 --> 02:20:04.420 I mean, it's already shot to crap as it is. 2744 02:20:04.500 --> 02:20:06.879 I mean, but if they do that, I'm like, forget 2745 02:20:06.899 --> 02:20:07.200 about it. 2746 02:20:07.239 --> 02:20:07.940 It's all over. 2747 02:20:08.319 --> 02:20:10.379 I mean, I would like Shane to come. 2748 02:20:10.079 --> 02:20:12.579 In and bring in someone like Nakamura. 2749 02:20:13.750 --> 02:20:16.350 Hey, you got to put heat on. You got to 2750 02:20:16.489 --> 02:20:19.370 sell the video game. So you have the match now. 2751 02:20:20.129 --> 02:20:22.989 Goldberg's going to have one match. You sell the video game. 2752 02:20:23.010 --> 02:20:26.049 You don't beat him in the match. because you want 2753 02:20:26.069 --> 02:20:29.979 that video game. And then the heat goes to, the credit, 2754 02:20:30.020 --> 02:20:33.540 the rub goes to Shane McMahon, who is a very 2755 02:20:33.659 --> 02:20:36.600 big star in WWE. And not only that, but he's 2756 02:20:36.620 --> 02:20:38.579 a member of the McMahon family. And he is a 2757 02:20:38.659 --> 02:20:42.239 game changer. He saved WrestleMania last year. So then that 2758 02:20:42.299

--> 02:20:47.260 builds up Brock Lesnar versus Shane O'Mac. 2759 02:20:47.600 --> 02:20:48.909 Brock Lesnar then. 2760 02:20:48.729 --> 02:20:51.829 Gets his stuff back by beating the bigger star than 2761 02:20:51.850 --> 02:20:55.690 Bill Goldberg. Shane O'Mac, you know, Shane does like a, 2762 02:20:57.959 --> 02:21:00.399 you know, a flip off the cage instead of just 2763 02:21:00.459 --> 02:21:02.100 falling off the cage. Or maybe he does a double 2764 02:21:02.399 --> 02:21:03.700 moonsault off the cage. 2765 02:21:03.920 --> 02:21:04.309 I don't know. 2766 02:21:04.670 --> 02:21:09.069 And so 450 splash and misses Lesnar this time. 2767 02:21:10.670 --> 02:21:12.450 But still, he's so gutty and all that stuff. 2768 02:21:12.510 --> 02:21:19.180 And he, you know, in his loss. So, yeah, clearly 2769 02:21:19.219 --> 02:21:19.899 that's where it goes. 2770 02:21:22.520 --> 02:21:23.659 I was going to win some money off of Travis. 2771 02:21:23.680 --> 02:21:25.120 All right, well, it's been great speaking to you. 2772 02:21:25.139 --> 02:21:29.959 All right, good deal. Travis, appreciate all the calls. What 2773 02:21:30.120 --> 02:21:30.500 did you say? 2774 02:21:30.520 --> 02:21:31.049 Hey, Bruce. 2775 02:21:31.250 --> 02:21:33.149 Yes. Now, Bruce. Yes. 2776 02:21:33.510 --> 02:21:34.850 I'll say that as a joke. 2777 02:21:34.930 --> 02:21:37.010 Like, you went through everything to build up the show, 2778 02:21:37.049 --> 02:21:38.649 and I was like, I'm disgusted with it, so I'm 2779 02:21:38.690 --> 02:21:39.229 signing off. 2780 02:21:39.569 --> 02:21:40.930 You completely ruined my punchline. 2781 02:21:40.950 --> 02:21:41.309 I did. 2782 02:21:41.389 --> 02:21:42.350 I didn't hear you say that. 2783 02:21:42.389 --> 02:21:45.010 I didn't hear disgusted. I was just like, okay, he's 2784 02:21:45.030 --> 02:21:47.569 signing off. Let me get to the end of the show. 2785 02:21:48.120 --> 02:21:50.969 Say that again. I'm disgust... Yeah, okay. I killed your joke. 2786 02:21:51.010 --> 02:21:51.569 I apologize. 2787 02:21:51.629 --> 02:21:55.090 I usually. 2788 02:21:55.110 --> 02:21:55.989 Can't get the moment back. 2789 02:21:56.030 --> 02:21:56.430 It's gone. 2790 02:21:56.469 --> 02:21:57.250 Forget it. 2791 02:21:57.319 --> 02:22:02.049 Can't get it back. That's like when they botch a finish, 2792 02:22:02.450 --> 02:22:04.889 like a complicated kind of, you know, hit the ropes, 2793 02:22:04.930 --> 02:22:06.950 do this, do that, then here's the finish, and they 2794 02:22:06.969 --> 02:22:08.850 botch it, and they do the same thing, hit the ropes, 2795 02:22:08.870 --> 02:22:11.149 drop down, do this, and then they just go right 2796 02:22:11.250 --> 02:22:12.469 back to the same sequence. 2797 02:22:12.709 --> 02:22:13.629 Boy, you're so right. 2798 02:22:13.969 --> 02:22:17.629 Luckily, Wade Keller's going to– luckily, Wade Keller, editor-publisher Wade Keller, 2799 02:22:17.649 --> 02:22:18.530 is going to edit all this. 2800 02:22:19.170 --> 02:22:21.350 So that I look good at the end. So, you know, 2801 02:22:21.489 --> 02:22:22.489 I have a lot of things. 2802 02:22:22.510 --> 02:22:25.290 You're going to edit it to go at half speed 2803 02:22:25.690 --> 02:22:27.350 so people have to hear it longer. 2804 02:22:27.409 --> 02:22:28.950 Oh, man, I did. 2805 02:22:29.090 --> 02:22:32.430 I killed that joke. Oh, hell. I hate when that 2806 02:22:32.469 --> 02:22:35.329 happens to me. Oh, God. I hate when Ray Kellett 2807 02:22:35.350 --> 02:22:37.389 does that to me, actually. So, oh, man. 2808 02:22:37.809 --> 02:22:40.799 All right, Jason, I hope you will call back again 2809 02:22:40.819 --> 02:22:41.829 next week. 2810 02:22:42.030 --> 02:22:44.319 No, of course I will. 2811 02:22:44.510 --> 02:22:45.579 All right. Good on you guys. 2812 02:22:45.760 --> 02:22:46.420 Take it easy. 2813 02:22:46.780 --> 02:22:50.290 I appreciate it. I want to thank all the callers today. 2814 02:22:50.350 --> 02:22:50.870 Good show. 2815 02:22:52.049 --> 02:22:53.989 I'll be back with the Bruce Mitchell Audio Show for 2816 02:22:54.010 --> 02:22:57.850 VIP members with editor and publisher Wade Keller co-hosting this weekend. 2817 02:22:58.629 --> 02:23:03.319 And we'll be keeping an eye on a bunch of stuff. Travis, Travis, 2818 02:23:03.620 --> 02:23:06.120 plug East Coast Cast. Do you want to plug anything else? 2819 02:23:08.000 --> 02:23:13.799 Yeah, again, eastcoastcast.com, six years' worth of archives, every Wednesday live, 2820 02:23:13.799 --> 02:23:17.590 630 Eastern until Friday. You know, until the middle of 2821 02:23:17.610 --> 02:23:25.479 the night. Also, Cam and I's fan podcast, Flash, is back. 2822 02:23:25.940 --> 02:23:29.840 Season 3 is two episodes deep. And we have a 2823 02:23:29.879 --> 02:23:37.149 recap up for the premiere and episode 2. And it's 2824 02:23:37.350 --> 02:23:40.649 the Fan by Fan, Fan X Fan, the South Congress 2825 02:23:41.450 --> 02:23:43.569 Fan by Fan show. And that's Congress with a K. 2826 02:23:43.590 --> 02:23:46.270 So if you just search South Congress Podcasts, It'll pop 2827 02:23:46.309 --> 02:23:51.790 right up. Subscribe. But wherever podcasts live, you can find 2828 02:23:51.829 --> 02:23:53.750 the South Congress Fan by Fan show. 2829 02:23:54.790 --> 02:23:55.110 So, yeah. 2830 02:23:56.069 --> 02:23:56.670 All right, Travis. 2831 02:23:56.690 --> 02:23:58.909 It's good to have the team back together again. So 2832 02:23:58.969 --> 02:24:01.030 we'll do this again next Friday. 2833 02:24:03.319 --> 02:24:03.790 Yeah, hope so. 2834 02:24:03.799 --> 02:24:05.639 All right, good deal. Talk to you. 2835 02:24:25.709 --> 02:24:28.889 Your time is valuable. Go VIP and listen to our 2836 02:24:28.909 --> 02:24:34.190 shows commercial free. A nice streamlined listening experience. 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But with third-tier membership, you 2889 02:27:12.299 --> 02:27:15.719 can also unlock all the VIP podcasts, including Everything with 2890 02:27:15.780 --> 02:27:17.379 Rich and Wade, The Fix with Todd Martin that I 2891 02:27:17.420 --> 02:27:20.100 host with Todd every week, the Wade Keller News Bulletin's 2892 02:27:20.219 --> 02:27:25.000 post-pay-per-view roundtables, and an array of other VIP-exclusive podcasts with 2893 02:27:25.020 --> 02:27:28.420 different hosts and different themes. Check out the lineup. Go 2894 02:27:28.459 --> 02:27:32.790 to Patreon and search PWTorch and subscribe and sync it 2895 02:27:32.829 --> 02:27:36.120 up with Spotify or stay within the Patreon ecosystem. Either 2896 02:27:36.159 --> 02:27:39.829 way works, go to Patreon and start your seven-day free trial. 2897 02:27:41.549 --> 02:27:43.329 If you're listening to us on the Apple Podcast app, 2898 02:27:43.389 --> 02:27:45.450 on Spotify, or any other app that allows you to 2899 02:27:45.510 --> 02:27:47.250 rate our podcast, please take a moment to give. 2900 02:27:47.209 --> 02:27:48.510 Us a five-star rating. 2901 02:27:48.549 --> 02:27:51.030 It really helps us in the algorithm and helps them 2902 02:27:51.069 --> 02:27:53.969 know that you recommend us to others. Just look for 2903 02:27:53.989 --> 02:27:56.229 a place to rate the show on Spotify, on Apple Podcasts, 2904 02:27:56.250 --> 02:27:58.430 or wherever you're listening to our shows, and please click 2905 02:27:58.450 --> 02:28:00.569 that five-star rating. And of course, thank you so much 2906 02:28:00.629 --> 02:28:04.889 for listening. A PWTorch VIP membership doesn't just give you 2907 02:28:04.930 --> 02:28:06.829 ad-free access to these shows and a ton of other 2908 02:28:06.850 --> 02:28:09.860 VIP-exclusive podcasts throughout the week. But you also gain access 2909 02:28:09.920 --> 02:28:14.079 to our unmatched, vast library of wrestling history, our contemporaneous 2910 02:28:14.120 --> 02:28:16.909 week-to-week coverage through our Pro Wrestling Torch weekly newsletters dating 2911 02:28:16.950 --> 02:28:19.770 back to the late 1980s, along with streaming and download 2912 02:28:19.829 --> 02:28:23.459 access to hundreds of retro radio shows from the 1990s, 2913 02:28:23.469 --> 02:28:26.770 including some of my interviews with wrestling's top newsmakers in 2914 02:28:26.790 --> 02:28:30.190 the 90s. And also our podcast library dating back to 2915 02:28:30.209 --> 02:28:34.979 the year 2003. There's no larger, longer-spanning pro wrestling podcast 2916 02:28:35.020 --> 02:28:38.319 library than that that comes with a PWTorch VIP membership. 2917 02:28:38.690 --> 02:28:42.590 Now approaching 20 years of podcasting. GoVIP and dive into 2918 02:28:42.629 --> 02:28:45.569 our post-pay-per-view roundtables, our coverage of some of your favorite 2919 02:28:45.629 --> 02:28:50.829 eras of wrestling, top-name long-form interviews, and special format podcasts 2920 02:28:51.139 --> 02:28:55.940 that we've done throughout the years. PWTorch.com slash GoVIP. We 2921 02:28:55.979 --> 02:28:57.799 have a streamlined sign-up form, and you can pay with 2922 02:28:57.840 --> 02:29:00.559 PayPal or directly with your credit card or debit card 2923 02:29:00.920 --> 02:29:02.639 in one or two minutes. From right now, you can 2924 02:29:02.659 --> 02:29:06.059 be a VIP member and diving into our library. PWTorch.com 2925 02:29:06.120 --> 02:29:07.149 slash GoVIP.