บทถอดความฉบับเต็มของ S01 E11 - Going Underground

that was a double bill in my teenage years that I very rarely missed. 00:03:04.879 --> 00:03:06.639 So, you know, I I caught up with then. 00:03:06.879 --> 00:03:08.879 I have a bit of mixed feelings on it now. 00:03:08.960 --> 00:03:24.319 I think I love the idea of it more than I like a lot of the episodes in execution, but like it still holds a dear place in my heart, and I'm not quite as nostalgic about it as I am something like Doctor Who. 00:03:24.400 --> 00:03:30.960 And it's something that I will dip into and watch an episode, but I can't I can't do a marathon of the whole thing or something like that. 00:03:31.199 --> 00:03:42.240 But there's there's lots to love about it, and particularly some of the amazing cast members, I think, you know, are characters I want to revisit over and over again. 00:03:42.479 --> 00:03:49.520 You you just reminded me, I was going to agree with you and say a Doctor Who has the you know it's the jewel in the crowd. 00:03:49.919 --> 00:04:00.000 I uh growing up in that sort of late 70s, early 80s period, though, there was Blake Sebov, there was Doctor Who, there was, of course, the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy. 00:04:00.080 --> 00:04:01.759 That's my impressionable mama did the work. 00:04:02.159 --> 00:04:12.960 Um they were all filled on the same low budget, and you just felt that the whole of the universe all had grey painted floors and with fill and studios and bad lighting, really. 00:04:13.120 --> 00:04:16.639 So um, yeah, I I'm I'm very keen on it. 00:04:16.800 --> 00:04:18.079 I'll tell you how keen I am on it. 00:04:18.160 --> 00:04:19.199 It was a really lovely book. 00:04:19.279 --> 00:04:26.639 I can't find it there, but it was a Blake Seven sort of making of book that some fans produced 25-30 years ago. 00:04:26.720 --> 00:04:29.360 Um, and I took that on my honeymoon to read. 00:04:30.959 --> 00:04:33.199 Wow, classic still married. 00:04:34.000 --> 00:04:35.680 Shocking, absolutely shocking. 00:04:36.800 --> 00:04:44.879 When Blake Seven came to big finish as an audio drama, I sort of fell in love with it all over again. 00:04:44.959 --> 00:04:51.199 And in many ways, I think I prefer Blake Seven the audio range to Blake Seven the TV series. 00:04:51.600 --> 00:04:58.399 I suddenly found myself engaged with a lot of the stories in a way that I hadn't been with a lot of the ones in the series. 00:04:58.560 --> 00:05:08.079 And I had a great old time when they first started doing those full cast audios to the point where I was looking forward to them much more than a lot of the Doctor Who's at the time, and there were good Doctor Who's. 00:05:08.319 --> 00:05:09.600 100% agree. 00:05:10.000 --> 00:05:14.959 It was like it well, it was flat it was the ideal version of Blake 7, wasn't it? 00:05:15.120 --> 00:05:27.600 Because the careless bits from the TV series and the shit filler script were all removed, and you got a much purer version of the Blake 7 universe, and you had all the original cars. 00:05:27.759 --> 00:05:30.480 That run spoilers everybody. 00:05:30.720 --> 00:05:38.160 Warships, in my mind, is okay, but what followed it was fucking superb. 00:05:38.399 --> 00:05:39.279 Yeah, absolutely. 00:05:39.360 --> 00:05:42.000 And I mean And I go back and re-listen to them actually. 00:05:42.079 --> 00:05:45.519 Yeah, and you kind I kind of wonder sometimes. 00:05:45.680 --> 00:05:59.279 I mean, there's many reasons probably why it didn't happen before they were trying to get a TV show off the ground, but it's kind of like by the time Big Finish were doing it, Big Finish had been going for sort of well over a decade, and it's kind of like, why didn't they get there sooner? 00:05:59.360 --> 00:06:06.879 But I imagine rights issues, but I'm so glad they managed to catch them just before everybody started to pass away. 00:06:06.959 --> 00:06:21.600 I know obviously a couple of them had, and a couple of people didn't want to do it, but ultimately we got all the big hitters back for a few more stories, which I think and and what a pleasure to be in their company for for for a good few years, and we got series two, didn't we? 00:06:21.759 --> 00:06:24.240 We got uh series one, then we got a bit of series three. 00:06:24.319 --> 00:06:24.639 Yeah. 00:06:24.800 --> 00:06:28.319 So yeah, absolutely yeah, wonderful. 00:06:32.480 --> 00:06:33.680 Uh what are we? 00:06:33.839 --> 00:06:35.279 Fans of cult TV. 00:06:35.360 --> 00:06:36.399 Yeah, let's call it. 00:06:37.839 --> 00:06:38.879 C who L T. 00:06:41.199 --> 00:06:46.240 I had somebody on discussing Dark Shadows the other day, which is not something I particularly know a lot about. 00:06:46.399 --> 00:06:47.920 But again, it was the same thing. 00:06:48.079 --> 00:07:00.959 It was this show from the 60s and 70s that finished, and very much an American show uh with an American fan base, and they just managed to capture all those stars for sort of five or six years of that show. 00:07:01.600 --> 00:07:06.319 Give the fan base that extra thing, before now they're either passed away or far too old. 00:07:06.399 --> 00:07:13.120 And so it's just nice that all the shows we love and that other people love get like a little bit of an afterlife. 00:07:13.439 --> 00:07:14.480 Yes, afterlife. 00:07:14.560 --> 00:07:16.879 That sounds like an episode of Blake Seven, doesn't it? 00:07:18.079 --> 00:07:21.040 Which of course I'm referring to aftermath, of course. 00:07:23.600 --> 00:07:25.040 Blake Seven watches out. 00:07:26.000 --> 00:07:32.160 So the first thing we're going to do today is The Logic of Empire from Magic Bullet Productions. 00:07:32.480 --> 00:07:37.360 This was an audio drama written by Alan Stevens and David Tully. 00:07:37.519 --> 00:07:41.439 It was released on the 27th of March 1998. 00:07:41.759 --> 00:07:47.600 Now, what I like to do is look at the general landscape of science fiction at the time. 00:07:47.839 --> 00:07:51.040 So we're a year off big finish launching at

this point. 00:07:51.439 --> 00:07:51.680 Really? 00:07:52.160 --> 00:07:54.480 You know, this pipped it to the forefront. 00:07:54.639 --> 00:07:58.879 Then on television in the UK, there was actually a bit of sci-fi going on. 00:07:59.040 --> 00:08:00.720 None of it I've ever really seen. 00:08:00.879 --> 00:08:06.240 Uh, invasion Earth was a six-part mini-series that was running on BBC One. 00:08:06.399 --> 00:08:08.480 Ultraviolet was on Channel 4. 00:08:08.720 --> 00:08:12.000 Bugs were still running, Shock Horror, it was in its last year. 00:08:12.319 --> 00:08:22.240 Space Island 1, the British German co-production about a multinational crew operating a commercial research space station, was broadcasting on Sky One. 00:08:22.319 --> 00:08:34.399 And something I've never heard of called Aquilia was on the BBC, which was a children's sci-fi series based on the Andrew Norris novel of the same name about two boys who find a Roman flying machine. 00:08:34.639 --> 00:08:38.480 So, I mean, these are these are the dark days of British science fiction. 00:08:39.039 --> 00:08:40.240 They really are, aren't they? 00:08:40.559 --> 00:08:45.279 Like all these things, apart from Bugs, really only ran for like a season or two. 00:08:45.519 --> 00:08:48.240 And I don't remember any of them being massive hits. 00:08:48.399 --> 00:08:53.759 Bugs was reasonably successful because it got a few series, but it's not remembered fondly. 00:08:55.120 --> 00:09:00.240 But it feels to me at this point, science fiction's very much like it's not in mainstream culture. 00:09:00.559 --> 00:09:01.919 It's gone underground, how's it? 00:09:02.320 --> 00:09:08.159 It's gone underground and it exists in the pages of Doctor Who magazine and DreamWatch and things like that. 00:09:08.399 --> 00:09:16.399 And so we get this Blake 7 audio, which is actually, it's not even an official Blake Seven audio, it's essentially a fan production. 00:09:16.559 --> 00:09:24.639 But what they've done is cast all the members of the cast of Blake 7 that they need and just gone to well, to hell with you, copyright. 00:09:24.720 --> 00:09:28.639 I mean, I'm assuming they didn't non-for-profit, it was like a charity thing or something. 00:09:31.120 --> 00:09:43.600 Seven years after the massacre on Garda Prime, Kurt Avon, now living in seclusion, is approached through his companion Elise by a resistance leader named Leiden, who seeks his help in stealing a shipment of Federation gold. 00:09:43.840 --> 00:09:51.519 Although sceptical of the plan's value to the Anti-Federation cause, Avon becomes involved and uses Aurac to devise a broader strategy. 00:09:51.759 --> 00:09:58.320 As the operation develops, tensions grow within the group when evidence suggests that someone has betrayed them to the Federation. 00:09:58.559 --> 00:10:02.320 The mission collapses when Federation forces strike with suspicious precision. 00:10:02.480 --> 00:10:10.399 Convinced that Elise has betrayed him, Avon kills her,

only to discover that the events have been manipulated by Federation psycho-strategists. 00:10:10.639 --> 00:10:18.399 Captured and bought before Servalan, Avon learns that the Federation's survival depends on maintaining the appearance of an organized resistance. 00:10:18.720 --> 00:10:25.200 Servalan therefore intends to use him as a controlled enemy whose actions will sustain the regime's grip on power. 00:10:25.360 --> 00:10:39.039 The story culminates in a psychological and political twist that links Avon to the legacy of Roger Blake, raising questions about identity, rebellion, and whether opposition to the Federation can ever truly escape the Federation's own designs. 00:10:41.200 --> 00:10:42.000 Have you heard this before? 00:10:42.639 --> 00:10:43.840 Well, when did you first hear it? 00:10:43.919 --> 00:10:45.440 Because you you picked this. 00:10:45.759 --> 00:10:46.399 I don't know. 00:10:46.879 --> 00:10:52.559 Back in the 90s, around the time, I don't know where I came across it. 00:10:52.799 --> 00:10:59.840 It had been released for three, six months, I think, when I discovered I discovered it alongside they did something with Travis as well. 00:11:00.000 --> 00:11:00.240 Yeah. 00:11:00.399 --> 00:11:04.399 And there was there was a tape that had an interview with Chris Boucher on. 00:11:04.480 --> 00:11:09.200 And I I might I might even have been at a convention, but I bought all probably with you. 00:11:09.679 --> 00:11:13.360 I bought all three all at the same time and consumed them very hungrily. 00:11:13.519 --> 00:11:15.120 And I was deter Dylan. 00:11:15.360 --> 00:11:16.559 I've got a confession to make. 00:11:16.799 --> 00:11:17.120 Go on. 00:11:18.159 --> 00:11:24.799 I was determined to be a professional person on your podcast, guesting for you. 00:11:24.879 --> 00:11:31.200 And I was determined to give a balanced, intelligent, and nay interesting uh review of this. 00:11:31.759 --> 00:11:34.720 Actually, I can't do that because I just love it so much. 00:11:34.879 --> 00:11:46.720 All I'm gonna do is tell you it's fing brilliant in every how they pulled it off spans, uh I don't know, but it is top quality all the way through, in my humble opinion. 00:11:47.039 --> 00:11:48.159 No, I absolutely agree. 00:11:48.320 --> 00:11:55.039 You've been banging on about this thing for bloody years, and it was only about 18 months ago I think I first heard it, where you were like, have you listened to it yet? 00:11:55.200 --> 00:11:56.240 Have you listened to it yet? 00:11:56.320 --> 00:11:59.519 Uh and I finally listened to it, and you were not wrong. 00:11:59.759 --> 00:12:14.159 I think because science fiction's not in the mainstream, I think anybody owning the rights to Blake 7 isn't getting a successful reboot off the ground, uh, and you know, neither did they continue to do so in the preceding 30 years. 00:12:14.320 --> 00:12:26.960 But uh I think fans got away with a lot more, like in Doctor Who terms, Big Finish obviously went out and did things professionally, but Bill Baggs was going every which way to uh make Doctor Who an all-but name. 00:12:27.039 --> 00:12:33.919 But you know, I'm I'm very much thinking of his audio series The Professor and Ace, starring Sylvester McCoy and Sophie Aldred. 00:12:34.159 --> 00:12:42.799 So it feels like copyright holders weren't really paying attention to fans because they were just a bunch of mad people, you know? 00:12:42.879 --> 00:12:43.039 Yeah. 00:12:43.200 --> 00:12:51.440 It was a bunch of nutters with a tape recorder somewhere, but actually they were sort of shaping the future of the genre, certainly in the audio format. 00:12:51.600 --> 00:13:04.240 So these sort of things get like I can't imagine now anybody being able to do a Blake 7 thing like this, even with the show sort of I mean, I know there's talk of oh, there's gonna be a revival, but isn't there always? 00:13:04.399 --> 00:13:14.639 Like, I just can't imagine the copyright holders just letting a bunch of people like if you and me decided to make a play and not charge anybody for it, I'm sure they'd be fine. 00:13:14.879 --> 00:13:19.759 But to get a bunch of the old actors back, they would stamp all over and go, what the hell are you doing? 00:13:20.000 --> 00:13:20.480 Yeah. 00:13:20.879 --> 00:13:49.039 It must have just been a quirk of the 90s that science fiction retreated underground and all of these creative people started to play with it and they were left alone and it enabled it to to it created a new momentum that then started to move into mainstream culture, yeah, probably culminating in the return of Doctor Who in 2005, which proved to filmmakers that sci-fi was cool again. 00:13:49.279 --> 00:13:50.480 Yeah, absolutely. 00:13:50.799 --> 00:13:54.399 So how does this continue the story of Blake 7? 00:13:54.559 --> 00:13:55.759 Because they all died. 00:13:56.159 --> 00:14:12.080 Well well, well, well, well, well um, so it's it it picks up events from the end of the very last episode, Blake, from the last episode of series D, because they like to call them ABC D, didn't they, for some bizarre reason. 00:14:12.480 --> 00:14:17.120 We saw people shot mining shooting and they fell over. 00:14:17.279 --> 00:14:19.600 We don't know whether they were shot or stunned. 00:14:20.000 --> 00:14:26.240 But the only one we knew was dead for sure was Blake because it was all the blood, and that was obviously famously all written into contracts and what have you. 00:14:26.320 --> 00:14:28.879 I'm still scarred from it to be honest, just before Christmas. 00:14:29.039 --> 00:14:30.240 Thank you, BBC. 00:14:30.720 --> 00:14:34.159 And then this is set, I think, about seven years later. 00:14:34.879 --> 00:14:40.960 And somehow A Bon is still alive, but they say that everybody's died. 00:14:41.279 --> 00:14:44.320 And it's it's not explicit, is it? 00:14:44.639 --> 00:15:05.919 But it's left to the imagination that in the first episode of Series D, Dorian, the

character, had not a picture in the loft, but a monster in the basement so easily confused that took all the evil and the nastiness from him and kept him young and Avon killed that character. 00:15:06.159 --> 00:15:15.360 So it's it's implied that the monster bonded then with Avon and then gave Avon whatever the mystical power was. 00:15:15.600 --> 00:15:19.279 Which is strange because Blake 7 didn't have any of this nonsense really normally. 00:15:19.519 --> 00:15:28.159 But it's sort of implied by the sound effects and and what uh in this play that he survived because they couldn't kill him effectively. 00:15:28.399 --> 00:15:38.320 They killed everyone, he didn't die because of this monster-y Dorian Grey uh type thing, and then he obviously killed all the iron guard because that's the make sure that they were all killed. 00:15:38.399 --> 00:15:44.480 Yeah so you've got a little bit of supernatural, but it's just the McGuffin to get you through that Avon's still about. 00:15:44.879 --> 00:15:45.039 Yeah. 00:15:45.360 --> 00:15:51.759 Paul Darren manages to do younger Avon voice and then sort of post-series D voice, doesn't he? 00:15:52.159 --> 00:15:52.480 Elise. 00:15:53.200 --> 00:15:54.080 Yeah, absolutely. 00:15:54.240 --> 00:15:55.679 Like he he he plays it well. 00:15:56.000 --> 00:15:59.120 Do you think Avon is the most interesting character of Blake Seven? 00:15:59.679 --> 00:16:02.080 Well, many people might argue that it's Gan. 00:16:04.320 --> 00:16:05.440 No, they wouldn't, would they? 00:16:05.600 --> 00:16:06.159 Yeah, I do. 00:16:06.240 --> 00:16:19.120 I think he complicated and well, now actually, he's complicated, he's spiky, he's selfish, and he's got brilliant one-liners and he's very witty. 00:16:19.200 --> 00:16:20.639 And we all found that very interesting. 00:16:20.879 --> 00:16:31.519 Peter Capaldi's doctor came along and he was drumpy and angry and spiky and had really good bitingly satirical copy, and a lot of people didn't like him at first, so maybe television viewing tastes have changed. 00:16:31.600 --> 00:16:35.840 Would Avon be popular now in a in a leading prime time TV program? 00:16:36.399 --> 00:16:37.200 Possibly not. 00:16:37.279 --> 00:16:46.159 But then I I what I like about Avon is that I think he works his best when he is up against Blake, who has got much more of the moral compass. 00:16:46.320 --> 00:16:54.879 And they're these two sort of co-leads, and one of them's the they're both anti-heroes in a way, but Avon is the most anti-hero of them all. 00:16:55.039 --> 00:16:58.879 And I think the appeal of Avon is that he is just a bit of a bastard. 00:16:59.039 --> 00:17:05.599 He's a bastard in space whose moral compass bothers him more than he'll admit. 00:17:05.680 --> 00:17:11.440 So he does quite often do the right thing, even though his brain's going, don't do it, take the money and run. 00:17:11.599 --> 00:17:32.880 And I think that's really interesting that he's not he's not Han Solo, who very

much has his moment at the end of the first film where he's like, I'm throwing away my old life and to become as you he's like constantly battling of like, I just want to be rich and uh run away somewhere, and oh, I've got this amazing spaceship and everything's fucked, so really I should do something about it. 00:17:33.119 --> 00:17:33.759 Yeah, yeah. 00:17:34.000 --> 00:17:35.200 And that's what I like about him. 00:17:35.359 --> 00:17:40.960 And then obviously the ambiguity of the ending of the final episode makes you go, oh, actually he was an asshole all along. 00:17:41.039 --> 00:17:46.319 And then but it's given us for 40 odd years, everybody sat around talking about what that meant. 00:17:46.640 --> 00:17:47.039 Yeah. 00:17:47.200 --> 00:17:57.039 He he was because of the there were enough moments, as you rightly say, through the TV series, where after all the talk, he actually then did the the right thing, the decent thing, and saved everybody. 00:17:57.119 --> 00:18:00.880 And then rolled his eyes and hated himself for doing it, and then went back to being grumpy again the next week. 00:18:00.960 --> 00:18:01.599 It's marvelous. 00:18:01.759 --> 00:18:09.359 A sort of there was an edge of dirty Harry, wasn't there, I think, about the way he was uh he was blunt and brutal and what have you. 00:18:09.599 --> 00:18:09.839 Yeah. 00:18:10.079 --> 00:18:11.599 Most interesting character, I think. 00:18:11.839 --> 00:18:18.319 Blake was interesting, more interesting in series B when he started to go sort of more mad and off the rails. 00:18:18.480 --> 00:18:18.720 Yeah. 00:18:18.960 --> 00:18:20.000 And yes, you're right. 00:18:20.079 --> 00:18:24.000 I think less interesting when you have nobody to rail against. 00:18:24.720 --> 00:18:27.920 But we love him and we love his behaviour, and we don't know what he's going to do. 00:18:28.000 --> 00:18:38.240 That unpredictability makes him interesting, which is why to suddenly have him fully grown, three-dimensional in this audio tape, replete with witty dialogue. 00:18:38.559 --> 00:18:38.960 Yeah. 00:18:39.200 --> 00:18:40.319 Oh, it was brilliant. 00:18:40.640 --> 00:18:44.240 So so how do they handle the character of Averman in this? 00:18:44.319 --> 00:18:46.480 Because it's basically his story right here. 00:18:46.559 --> 00:18:48.720 Like we do get other characters show up. 00:18:48.880 --> 00:18:52.480 Is it a fitting sequel for him post-Series D? 00:18:52.960 --> 00:18:54.640 I think for me it was. 00:18:54.720 --> 00:18:56.480 I find it very satisfying. 00:18:56.640 --> 00:18:58.880 I mean, do we spoil the ending after the stuff? 00:18:59.039 --> 00:19:00.000 Oh, spoiler wave. 00:19:00.240 --> 00:19:01.440 It's a thousand years old. 00:19:01.920 --> 00:19:02.799 Much like myself. 00:19:02.960 --> 00:19:23.359 Yeah, it it's a replay of some of the events of the beginning of series D, and then there are some flashback sequences, and then Avon is brilliant and he's very Avon-y, and we get a

bit of Blake, we get a bit of a throwback, we get the monster talking to him, we get lots of shooting, he's absolutely brilliant, there's great dialogue. 00:19:23.440 --> 00:19:35.440 He mistakenly shoots Elise, and um Lydon you know torments him, keep making the same mistake, which is a callback to him shooting his old girlfriend and just shooting Blake. 00:19:35.519 --> 00:19:37.759 It's just really consistent and lovely. 00:19:37.920 --> 00:19:49.200 And then suddenly from nowhere you get this really big twist that Serverland is actually gonna brainwash him and turn him into a new Blake because every Empire needs somebody to fight again. 00:19:49.279 --> 00:19:55.519 It's and then they're when they replay the events of the very first episode of Blake, my name's Rog Blake. 00:19:55.680 --> 00:20:11.440 It's just it's just spine-tingling me, brilliant! What a great idea! And it's a it feels a very dark, fittingly dark Blake Seven idea that there's the Federation away ahead of you all the time, and they they want some anti-heroes, they want rebels. 00:20:11.759 --> 00:20:16.640 And it suddenly gives you this thing of like, oh, was the more Blakes before this Blake? 00:20:16.720 --> 00:20:24.799 Yeah, and you're just like, oh god, what a horrible idea that the the freedom fighter was uh manipulated and brainwashed and controlled. 00:20:24.960 --> 00:20:25.680 Brilliant. 00:20:26.000 --> 00:20:32.000 Yeah, it's a bit like finding out your Labour government is funded exactly by the same people that fund all the other parties, you know? 00:20:32.079 --> 00:20:33.200 But uh Yeah, yeah. 00:20:33.279 --> 00:20:35.359 I mean, thank goodness, that's not the case. 00:20:39.839 --> 00:20:48.720 So Avon is the main character, Paul Darrow delivers the most Paul Darrow of Paul Darrow performances, but he's never that they've restrained him. 00:20:48.880 --> 00:21:06.400 We just get sort of the darker side of him here, and he gets a few on-liners, but I don't feel like perhaps occasionally in the TV series he was allowed to get away with a lot more, but it feels like the fans here who are making it know exactly what they want from their Avon. 00:21:06.640 --> 00:21:09.680 So they're restraining him slightly in the best possible ways. 00:21:10.000 --> 00:21:12.400 Yes, I think I think that's why it's so enjoyable. 00:21:12.720 --> 00:21:23.599 Feels like a Avon and not not an Avon that's gone and become the Paul Darrow show, which I think possibly in some episodes in the last series, it became Paul Darrow in space, didn't it? 00:21:24.079 --> 00:21:33.920 In space so they rain him back and he's quite sparing, and then eventually you start to see him as he uh has the shootout and what have you. 00:21:34.079 --> 00:21:35.839 But I like the interplay with Lydman. 00:21:36.079 --> 00:21:41.359 Um there's some lovely jokes in there, and I desperately just want to say on a podcast uh the Molyneux message. 00:21:41.839 --> 00:21:46.799 Oh, and my other favourite one, which I have tried to use in conversation, but it's never really taken off. 00:21:47.119 --> 00:21:48.400 My heart pump's pissed. 00:21:50.960 --> 00:21:56.400 So I recommend all of our listeners is to get out there tomorrow and find a way to say that to somebody. 00:21:57.119 --> 00:21:58.240 I certainly will. 00:21:58.960 --> 00:21:59.519 It would work. 00:22:00.000 --> 00:22:08.400 So Lydon is played by Ian Reddington, who fans may know as playing the chief clown in Doctor Who, the greatest show in the galaxy. 00:22:09.599 --> 00:22:11.920 And there's a few little nice names in here. 00:22:12.000 --> 00:22:15.519 So Trevor Cooper plays Kelso, who is in Starcops. 00:22:15.759 --> 00:22:15.920 Yeah. 00:22:16.160 --> 00:22:16.799 Great voice. 00:22:17.039 --> 00:22:33.839 We've got Peter Tudnam back as Aurax, Slave Zen, and then we've obviously got Jacqueline Pierce and Gareth Thomas in supporting roles in this, but they work really well, I think, as just sort of you're not going to get everybody back, I think, for a fan production. 00:22:33.920 --> 00:22:39.920 I imagine the pockets don't run that deep of the person who is funding this, which is Alan Stevens. 00:22:40.160 --> 00:22:43.759 But when I picked it up, I genuinely wasn't expecting Blake to be in it. 00:22:43.920 --> 00:22:47.920 And when we did hear a bit of him at the start, I was like, oh, they've pulled that from the episode, right? 00:22:48.160 --> 00:22:49.920 Like they're just being cheeky. 00:22:50.079 --> 00:22:54.640 But sure enough, you know, Gareth Thomas shows up at the end, as does Jacqueline Pierce. 00:22:54.720 --> 00:22:57.839 And I was like, to be honest, the second listen, I was still like, I've forgotten they're in it. 00:22:58.000 --> 00:22:59.200 This is fucking brilliant. 00:23:00.160 --> 00:23:01.279 It's lovely, isn't it? 00:23:01.440 --> 00:23:13.599 I think it's really very touching in the middle of the story when you get that flashback connect and and and that feels like a genuinely warm connection between Avon and Blake. 00:23:14.240 --> 00:23:16.160 And then suddenly you realise it isn't. 00:23:16.240 --> 00:23:24.400 And and I think it's very haunting the way that the monster character, which is using the form of Blake, just starts keeps saying the lightning raid. 00:23:24.799 --> 00:23:26.960 And it's really haunting. 00:23:27.200 --> 00:23:30.400 That goes off in my head quite often, actually, just for no apparent reasons. 00:23:30.720 --> 00:23:32.079 The lightning raid. 00:23:32.880 --> 00:23:33.599 Marvellous. 00:23:33.920 --> 00:23:39.440 Yeah, it's I just think it's such a it feels like a coder almost to Blake's Evan. 00:23:39.519 --> 00:23:43.839 It's not setting up some massive like Series E or something like that. 00:23:44.000 --> 00:23:48.960 And it's just like a nice little or there is a little bit room to give a bit bit of closure. 00:23:49.279 --> 00:23:58.799 And because fans have been sat around for years going, this could have happened

and that could have happened, and whether you consider this canon or not, it just goes, Oh yeah, there we go. 00:23:58.960 --> 00:24:02.319 That is that sort of puts a definitive end on it almost. 00:24:02.640 --> 00:24:06.160 It's the perfect full stop for me to the series. 00:24:06.400 --> 00:24:09.759 Were you uh satisfied with the end of Blake 7 at the time? 00:24:10.000 --> 00:24:12.000 No, hated it, broke my heart. 00:24:12.160 --> 00:24:12.559 Yeah. 00:24:12.880 --> 00:24:18.000 I uh we just had pressing Tom Baker disappear, and then we get this. 00:24:18.160 --> 00:24:20.079 And it was like everything I love is gone. 00:24:20.240 --> 00:24:24.319 At the same time, I went to big school and it was full of big scary boys, and I didn't like that either. 00:24:24.400 --> 00:24:29.200 So I I probably spent the whole of 1981 or two or whatever it was, being rather depressed. 00:24:29.440 --> 00:24:32.720 That sounds a very traumatic year in your life, to be honest. 00:24:32.960 --> 00:24:34.799 Yeah, it was it was actually, yeah. 00:24:35.039 --> 00:24:43.680 Because I only even when before I knew what Blake Seven, I knew it was the show where they all die at the end apart from one of them. 00:24:43.920 --> 00:24:55.759 It's just something that's you kind of go into the series knowing it, I think most people do now, which is kind of sad in a way, because you know it would it would have been nice to have experienced the shock for real. 00:24:55.839 --> 00:24:58.079 Because God, it was such a shock. 00:24:58.240 --> 00:25:29.519 Because you're watching most of the episode knowing that Gareth Thomas is back in it, and then he's there, and it and it's great with the scar and he looks older, but you're waiting for this kind of magic moment of a reunion, thinking, great, next series, Blake's back, it's God, it's gonna be brilliant, and then suddenly it all turns to shit and the craft crashes, and and then Tarant, I think, gets uh shot first, not the end of the world, and and it and it just unravels from there, and it's just and that haunting alarm noise at the end. 00:25:29.599 --> 00:25:36.400 Yeah, when all you nothing, and you just hear that wailing noise and the camera goes black, and then you hear all the gunshots. 00:25:36.559 --> 00:25:36.799 Yeah. 00:25:36.960 --> 00:25:37.440 Yeah. 00:25:37.680 --> 00:25:42.000 Oh brilliant, but I I've never quite felt the impact of it. 00:25:42.160 --> 00:25:48.400 Whereas weirdly here, because I know the ending that's happened, I'm a little bit more like, oh, what's gonna happen? 00:25:48.480 --> 00:25:52.400 Like, I I'm I've suddenly I'm suddenly in unknown territory for the first time. 00:25:52.559 --> 00:25:56.960 The Blake Sevens always existed as this complete thing where they all die at the end. 00:25:57.119 --> 00:26:01.279 So it's nice to suddenly go and or did they, and just have have this little moment. 00:26:01.599 --> 00:26:19.039 And it feels it would have been all too easy for fanfiction to go, oh, Villa was stunned and it was a glancy shot on Sue Lin and they can come back and then Avon survives, and you know, you could it this doesn't feel contrite, it feels like it's a possible outcome. 00:26:19.359 --> 00:26:20.559 Yeah, absolutely. 00:26:20.960 --> 00:26:22.480 Which I bloody love. 00:26:22.640 --> 00:26:23.680 Have I mentioned that? 00:26:23.839 --> 00:26:24.880 Uh no, he's not. 00:26:25.359 --> 00:26:25.599 No. 00:26:25.759 --> 00:26:30.880 Oh, well, I think I should be honest about it's really a can we talk about the music, please, then. 00:26:31.279 --> 00:26:34.799 Yes, well, I wanted to talk about the music, production values, that sort of thing. 00:26:34.880 --> 00:26:38.799 Because obviously it is to all intents and purposes an amateur production. 00:26:39.119 --> 00:26:41.440 But tell me your thoughts on the music first of all. 00:26:41.759 --> 00:26:46.799 Well, I've got this I've um now so I have zero musical ability or talent. 00:26:47.039 --> 00:26:51.039 I can't remember the words to my favourite songs that I've been listening to for 30 odd years. 00:26:51.200 --> 00:26:51.359 Right. 00:26:51.519 --> 00:27:05.039 So so please forgive me, people who are musical out there, but I really like the sort of melancholy, haunting theme that they have that that repeats throughout the production. 00:27:05.519 --> 00:27:10.160 And I'm absolutely convinced they picked that up and continued that into the big finish place. 00:27:11.039 --> 00:27:14.240 It comes around with Avon, it's almost become Avon's theme. 00:27:14.799 --> 00:27:22.559 But there's a really haunting serial darkness to it that I I think really fits the the whole production. 00:27:22.640 --> 00:27:30.000 So I I think I it just feels like every dimension that you could look at for this, they smashed it out apart, music being one of them. 00:27:30.240 --> 00:27:36.400 Indeed, like it's not your typical Dudley Simpson score that you know obviously underpinned the whole of Blake Seven. 00:27:36.559 --> 00:27:48.960 But I think actually, because this is seven years later, and as you say, there's a slightly more supernatural element to it, you need something different to sort of go, oh isn't perhaps not as it seems, and move it on. 00:27:49.119 --> 00:27:52.960 Because I don't think, you know, bless Dudley, it was good for some things and not for others. 00:27:53.039 --> 00:27:58.480 But I don't know whether his music would have been suited for something like not not a marindering sound, was it? 00:27:58.720 --> 00:27:59.680 Thank goodness. 00:28:01.680 --> 00:28:03.839 But generally, yeah, the music's great. 00:28:03.920 --> 00:28:05.680 I think the production values are good too. 00:28:05.839 --> 00:28:11.279 It sounds a bit dated now, but that's because mainly it's on the internet as ripped from a tape, you know. 00:28:11.519 --> 00:28:16.640 But if if you listen to ghosts of end space ripped from the tape, it sounds about the same. 00:28:16.720 --> 00:28:19.759

So it's not like it's a bunch of fans in a cupboard somewhere. 00:28:19.839 --> 00:28:22.000 It's like it's a professionally produced production. 00:28:22.319 --> 00:28:32.559 Well, just to give it the nostalgic vintage uh appeal, what I did is So I'm a bit of a car nutter and I've got a number of crap old cars. 00:28:32.880 --> 00:28:38.880 One of which I've got a cassette player, so and it and the car in question is from the year 2000. 00:28:39.680 --> 00:28:42.880 So I Marvel is a magnificent booth. 00:28:43.200 --> 00:28:53.920 So I've driven around in that in the year 2000 listening to the cassette of Logic of Empire, and it feels like and it was just such a nostalgic lovely thing to do. 00:28:54.160 --> 00:28:59.759 Um you know, in the Harman Carden top quality stereo going on in the sort of around the car. 00:29:00.240 --> 00:29:02.480 It yeah, it the production sounded good. 00:29:02.559 --> 00:29:04.960 There was death, the sound effects were really good. 00:29:05.119 --> 00:29:14.319 They were they didn't again they felt slightly better than the TV show, they didn't feel amateur, and then to have Peter what Tugnam's uh is it Peter Tugnam? 00:29:14.480 --> 00:29:15.359 Peter Peter Tugnam. 00:29:16.160 --> 00:29:16.960 Peter Tugnam. 00:29:17.599 --> 00:29:20.160 I've never said it out loud before, and it sounds slightly strange, doesn't it? 00:29:20.400 --> 00:29:34.000 Peter Tugnam's voice across all of his three characters would you but I think that was the real treat as well, which you know we don't get like going forward because he sadly passed away, but to hear Zen again, oh brilliant marvelous. 00:29:34.160 --> 00:29:34.720 Yeah. 00:29:35.039 --> 00:29:38.880 When is Siri gonna be when are we gonna be able to get Siri to talk? 00:29:38.960 --> 00:29:40.400 Like in Zen's voice. 00:29:40.720 --> 00:29:41.839 It's only a matter of time. 00:29:41.920 --> 00:29:46.160 If AI is good for one thing, it's changing Siri's voice to that. 00:29:46.640 --> 00:29:47.440 Exactly. 00:29:47.759 --> 00:29:50.559 There are other adventures in this. 00:29:50.799 --> 00:29:58.480 While this does feel like a coder and an end, there are a couple of other stories in this fan-made run, and they've been doing them every few years. 00:29:58.640 --> 00:30:04.240 So you mentioned there was another play called The Mark of Kane, which to my shame I have never listened to. 00:30:04.400 --> 00:30:12.880 And that features Brian Croucher as Travis, Gareth Thomas is back as Blake, Peter Miles plays a part in it, as does Terry Malloy. 00:30:13.039 --> 00:30:15.039 So have you ever listened to that one or not? 00:30:15.440 --> 00:30:17.200 I have, yeah, I've got it somewhere. 00:30:17.279 --> 00:30:17.519 Yeah. 00:30:17.839 --> 00:30:20.319 But it didn't blow your brains out like this one. 00:30:20.640 --> 00:30:21.519 No, no. 00:30:21.680 --> 00:30:24.799 I'm I probably should listen to it to it again. 00:30:24.880 --> 00:30:28.400 I think compared to this, it was just

okay, but less good. 00:30:28.720 --> 00:30:34.880 And I I'll I can I can't quite remember what happened, but it's Blake meeting Travis at some point later. 00:30:35.200 --> 00:30:38.160 But um I'll get it out and re-listen and I'll report back. 00:30:38.240 --> 00:30:38.799 Shall I do that? 00:30:39.119 --> 00:30:42.240 I'll drive around in my old car again and listen to it. 00:30:42.480 --> 00:30:43.119 Please do. 00:30:43.279 --> 00:30:46.720 And they've done a couple more sort of short trips, sort of 15-minute. 00:30:46.960 --> 00:30:50.880 There's one called iTravis, uh, which only came out a few years ago. 00:30:50.960 --> 00:30:53.359 And they're free to download on the Magic Bullet website. 00:30:53.440 --> 00:30:55.920 It's not like they're charging any money for them. 00:30:56.079 --> 00:31:02.880 There's another one called The Next Life, one called Prodigal Son, one called Travis, the final line. 00:31:03.119 --> 00:31:04.559 When Travis met Blake. 00:31:04.799 --> 00:31:06.160 Yeah, well, maybe that's the one I'm thinking. 00:31:06.480 --> 00:31:09.920 And there's one where there's uh an interview with Chris Boucher. 00:31:10.480 --> 00:31:10.880 Right. 00:31:11.039 --> 00:31:14.480 And and the interview is really good, really good. 00:31:14.960 --> 00:31:16.400 Haven't listened to that for a long time. 00:31:16.559 --> 00:31:19.359 That's brilliant, that's worth listening to, folks. 00:31:19.599 --> 00:31:42.480 So Alan Stevens, who's behind this, is behind a company called Magic Bullet, and they still started with these, but I think perhaps what they're best known for is they did a range of six audio CDs called Caldor City, which linked up Chris Boucher's Doctor Who World and his Blake Seven world, and it starred Paul Darrow as someone who may or may not be Avon. 00:31:42.640 --> 00:31:43.119 Later in life. 00:31:43.440 --> 00:31:44.240 Castoniago. 00:31:44.799 --> 00:31:46.960 It was that that was the theory, wasn't it? 00:31:47.519 --> 00:31:52.160 It was Avon landing on the planet and assuming the name Castoniago. 00:31:52.640 --> 00:31:52.960 Yeah. 00:31:53.119 --> 00:31:57.119 Either way, he gives the sort of performance that only Paul Darrow can give in it. 00:31:57.680 --> 00:31:58.480 Yes, he does. 00:32:00.000 --> 00:32:00.880 Absolutely. 00:32:01.119 --> 00:32:15.119 I mean, we'll talk a little bit about perhaps the future of Blake Seven at the end, but uh that the thing that I think you can recast pretty much every part in Blake Seven, but the Avon one what worries me, I'd almost go, just leave him out. 00:32:15.759 --> 00:32:24.559 It's it it's well, I just don't like I can I can absolutely cast all the other roles with many different actors, but it's a it's a tough one. 00:32:24.880 --> 00:32:36.240 It's it's it's casting somebody with the right demeanour and you know physicality as well as a performance with a gravitas that probably belies their age, actually. 00:32:36.319 --> 00:32:36.559 Yeah. 00:32:36.799 --> 00:32:38.559 What was Paul Darrow when he first started? 00:32:38.720 --> 00:32:42.720 He looked quite young, but he's probably late 30s when he was cast. 00:32:42.880 --> 00:32:43.519 Yeah, I don't know. 00:32:44.000 --> 00:32:46.319 He had real gravitas right from the get-go. 00:32:46.400 --> 00:32:52.319 That first scene when they first meet him in in the sort of holding cell, he he grabbed my attention and held it. 00:32:52.400 --> 00:32:56.480 He so he was, you know, some actors just have that, they yeah, absolutely. 00:32:56.640 --> 00:33:11.519 I love the evolution from this through to Caldor City, and then they do a faction paradox range as well afterwards, which is full of people like Philip Maddock and Julian Glover giving like fantastic performances in big, high concept sort of sci-fi fantasy stuff. 00:33:11.759 --> 00:33:18.640 But I mean, I think the thing that Magic Bullet do so well is they just get what we call the Chris Boucher universe now. 00:33:18.799 --> 00:33:19.119 Yes. 00:33:19.359 --> 00:33:32.240 But like and his take on both Blake Seven and Doctor Who was unique, and the characters were all very murky grey in both his Doctor Who's and his Blake Sevens, and so to have them all thrown together in one audio. 00:33:32.400 --> 00:33:36.960 He doesn't see the sunny side of life, Chris Boucher, when you look at the things he produces. 00:33:37.200 --> 00:33:38.319 No, he doesn't, does he? 00:33:38.480 --> 00:33:42.400 But he he does do really clever witty biting dialogue, which I like. 00:33:42.720 --> 00:33:47.200 And he's I think most often he's good at the motivations behind. 00:33:47.359 --> 00:33:47.759 Yeah. 00:33:47.920 --> 00:33:56.960 But unfortunately, I I feel Brian was not not Brian who played Travis 2, yeah, not necessarily the best actor. 00:33:57.759 --> 00:33:58.480 Possibly not. 00:33:58.880 --> 00:34:14.239 But the motivation for the character development of Travis I really enjoyed, and I think I think uh the writers got that right, that that it that descent into madness, and it was the fact that he started to realise he was being betrayed and betrayed by his family, which was the Meluxary. 00:34:15.119 --> 00:34:17.599 And that ri that that was really interesting. 00:34:17.679 --> 00:34:19.840 I think that was yeah, great writing. 00:34:20.079 --> 00:34:27.519 I mean, I think about Robots of Death, and it's in many ways it's quite a generic Doctor Who story. 00:34:28.239 --> 00:34:33.440 But there's something about his script that you get who all the guest characters are. 00:34:33.599 --> 00:34:40.480 He writes the regulars brilliantly, and then everybody goes, This is a great script, so they want to do a good job with it, I guess. 00:34:40.559 --> 00:34:48.800 And so the design work, and you're just like, all of a sudden, the whole show's elevated, and it's just a whodunit in a on a sand minor. 00:34:49.039 --> 00:35:11.760 It could be a a ship in the ocean or a spaceship in the sky or whatever, but it's

just every element of that world has sort of been thought about, and I think that's what he he he does so well, and that's what he does really well with his characters, which is why you can then spin a whole audio series about Kaldor City, which is just a mention, isn't it, in Robots of Death and maybe in Blake Seven too. 00:35:12.000 --> 00:35:13.840 You're absolutely that's such a good observation. 00:35:13.920 --> 00:35:15.280 I wish I'd make it. 00:35:16.639 --> 00:35:17.679 You're absolutely right. 00:35:17.760 --> 00:35:23.440 There are he builds a a bit like Holmes does, a throwaway line builds a whole world. 00:35:23.599 --> 00:35:24.000 Yeah. 00:35:24.239 --> 00:35:28.719 You don't need to know any more than the throwaway line about the sewer pits on Caldor City. 00:35:28.800 --> 00:35:30.320 That's all it is, isn't it? 00:35:30.480 --> 00:35:31.599 And the founding families. 00:35:31.679 --> 00:35:36.320 We don't know what that means, but it sets up a world, a world of privilege and poverty. 00:35:36.480 --> 00:35:36.800 Yeah. 00:35:37.039 --> 00:35:38.400 That you can play around in. 00:35:38.639 --> 00:35:42.639 And those sewer pits make an appearance in Chris Batcher's novel corpse marker. 00:35:42.960 --> 00:35:43.360 They do. 00:35:43.519 --> 00:35:50.639 You know, so we get to we get to see the sewer pits, we get to see the the founding families, and uh he throws some fendals in there too. 00:35:51.360 --> 00:35:53.679 It's just an intoxicating mixture, isn't it? 00:35:54.000 --> 00:35:54.639 Indeed. 00:35:54.880 --> 00:35:58.000 I can't remember the uh I doubt when did that book come out? 00:35:58.239 --> 00:36:01.119 Oh, that was that was the it was BBC Books. 00:36:01.199 --> 00:36:03.119 It was probably about the same time as this, to be honest. 00:36:03.199 --> 00:36:04.719 It was maybe a couple of years actually. 00:36:04.880 --> 00:36:11.119 Because 98's when BBC Books start doing the past Doctor and Eighth Doctor Rangers. 00:36:11.280 --> 00:36:13.119 So yeah, within a couple of years of this. 00:36:14.079 --> 00:36:20.480 It's not the best book, but it does again paint much more of an image of uh The Boucherverse. 00:36:20.639 --> 00:36:22.079 Yes, the Boucherverse. 00:36:22.239 --> 00:36:25.599 Do we have much more we want to say on this one before we move on to Warship? 00:36:25.760 --> 00:36:27.280 I've I mentioned that I really love it. 00:36:27.360 --> 00:36:28.239 I think it's fantastic. 00:36:28.559 --> 00:36:29.360 You have indeed. 00:36:29.599 --> 00:36:30.719 Oh, okay, well. 00:36:30.960 --> 00:36:35.280 So we're going to rate it a as a clanger, a banger, or an average meander. 00:36:35.440 --> 00:36:37.039 I can't imagine what you're going to say. 00:36:37.360 --> 00:36:39.360 Well, dun dun dun dun dun d. 00:36:40.000 --> 00:36:42.960 It's a cl no, no, it's a manga. 00:36:43.199 --> 00:36:43.599 Excellent. 00:36:43.760 --> 00:36:44.480 What a surprise. 00:36:44.639 --> 00:36:45.920 It's a banger from me too. 00:36:46.000 --> 00:36:50.000 This is the second time I've heard it, and I've taken away more on this listen. 00:36:50.159 --> 00:36:54.719 And I imagine I'll take away a bit more when I jump into it again in a few years' time. 00:36:55.039 --> 00:37:01.280 I think Lydon is a play on the member of the Sex Pistols, because he's got the same sort of accent. 00:37:01.599 --> 00:37:02.800 Maybe just one for me. 00:37:03.119 --> 00:37:03.519 Excellent. 00:37:03.760 --> 00:37:12.239 I love I love the idea of the Molly New Messica, which is obviously for people in the UK, it's a famous football ground for a continually bad performing team. 00:37:12.400 --> 00:37:14.320 So there's lovely little nudges in there as well. 00:37:14.400 --> 00:37:16.880 So I yeah, it's delightful. 00:37:17.119 --> 00:37:17.360 Absolutely. 00:37:17.760 --> 00:37:18.559 Don't get it now. 00:37:18.800 --> 00:37:30.000 Yeah, and if you're doing your Blake Seven watch through or something like that, and you get to the end and you're a bit disappointed, just stick this on and it just wraps things up slightly nicer than the TV series. 00:37:30.320 --> 00:37:32.800 Yeah, and thank you to everybody that was involved in it. 00:37:32.880 --> 00:37:36.159 It's one of those few things I think it's just it's a triumph. 00:37:36.480 --> 00:37:37.440 Absolutely. 00:37:40.000 --> 00:37:53.840 So, the next thing we're going to cover is Warship from Big Finish Productions, written by Peter Angelides, directed by Ken Bentley, released on the 24th of January 2013. 00:37:54.239 --> 00:37:59.760 Now, a little look at the state of science fiction in England and beyond at that point. 00:38:00.000 --> 00:38:04.960 Doctor Who was celebrating its 50th anniversary, so that was bigger than ever. 00:38:05.760 --> 00:38:09.440 And we were very much in a second age of um cult television. 00:38:09.679 --> 00:38:20.960 Black Mirror had launched, the Tomorrow people had got a short-lived revival, Arrow was in its first season, The Walking Dead in its fourth, and The Fringe in its final season. 00:38:21.199 --> 00:38:25.199 Doctor Who had been back for a while, there was science fiction everywhere. 00:38:25.360 --> 00:38:30.079 And I I guess Blake Seven had a slow road to audio at this point. 00:38:30.320 --> 00:38:33.119 We'd got those fan-made ones we discussed. 00:38:33.199 --> 00:38:35.760 There was the Barry Lett's radio plays. 00:38:35.920 --> 00:38:43.039 Then there was the reboot that they did that was like a full cast thing where Benedict Cumberbatch is in it. 00:38:43.119 --> 00:38:46.239 It's written by I think Mark Platt, and it's just this bizarre. 00:38:46.639 --> 00:38:47.360 Oh yeah. 00:38:47.599 --> 00:38:53.760 They released it on the internet in like five-minute chunks when you know everybody was trying new ways to do things. 00:38:54.000 --> 00:38:54.400 Yeah. 00:38:54.639 --> 00:38:56.079 And that never really went anywhere. 00:38:56.159 --> 00:38:59.360 So Big Finish got a license and did

the Liberator Chronicles. 00:38:59.519 --> 00:39:05.920 Which I remember not being that fussed on and just thinking, well, I want full cast Big Finish. 00:39:06.239 --> 00:39:08.079 I was exactly the same as you. 00:39:08.320 --> 00:39:12.159 I listened to that reboot thing and thought, hmm. 00:39:13.280 --> 00:39:16.800 I'd like it to be an average Meander, but I think it was probably a clanger. 00:39:17.199 --> 00:39:18.559 There's a free review for you. 00:39:19.440 --> 00:39:25.920 And then, yeah, Liberator Chronicles, it was like, oh no, I read I want Proper Blake Seven, that's what I want. 00:39:26.559 --> 00:39:35.360 I wonder whether they were just testing the waters to see if there was enough demand out there and they sold well enough that they went, we could probably get to more than one actor in one of these things. 00:39:35.679 --> 00:39:36.639 Yeah, you're probably right. 00:39:36.800 --> 00:39:37.599 You're probably right. 00:39:37.840 --> 00:39:49.199 Because I suppose you've got to at that at this point, it's been 30 odd years since Blake 7's been on, and while there is a big fan base for it, it's nowhere like the Blake 7 conventions have sort of stopped by that point. 00:39:49.280 --> 00:39:56.000 So I guess you'd have to be slightly cautious and go, does it have the appeal of a Doctor Who audio play or something like that? 00:39:56.320 --> 00:39:56.480 Yeah. 00:39:56.719 --> 00:39:59.119 But fortunately, it turned out that it did. 00:40:00.960 --> 00:40:06.960 And that's when I was just like, okay, they're full cast, I need to jump in here and see what they're like. 00:40:09.920 --> 00:40:14.719 With Blake, Jenner, Avon, Cali, Villa, and Dana aboard the Liberator. 00:40:14.880 --> 00:40:17.199 A full-scale intergalactic war erupts. 00:40:17.519 --> 00:40:25.360 An invading alien force launches a devastating assault, overwhelming military defenses, and threatening to conquer vast regions of space. 00:40:25.599 --> 00:40:32.559 The Liberator becomes one of the few vessels capable of striking back effectively, drawing the crew into the center of the conflict. 00:40:32.719 --> 00:40:44.960 As the invasion spreads, they undertake a series of increasingly dangerous missions, gathering intelligence, disrupting enemy operations, and working alongside forces they would normally avoid in order to halt the advance. 00:40:45.199 --> 00:40:52.719 The scale of the war grows rapidly, with entire fleets committed to the fighting and the fate of countless worlds hanging in the balance. 00:40:52.880 --> 00:41:01.199 As the campaign reaches its climax, the Liberator takes part in a desperate operation intended to stop the invaders from securing a final victory. 00:41:01.440 --> 00:41:08.480 The mission succeeds, but only after fierce fighting that leaves the Liberator badly damaged and the battlefront in chaos. 00:41:08.719 --> 00:41:13.920 During the confusion, Blake becomes separated from the rest of the crew while pursuing his own objective. 00:41:14.079 --> 00:41:20.079 And Jenna also disappears amidst the disorder, with communication shattered and the war still raging around them. 00:41:20.239 --> 00:41:24.320 Avon, Callie, Villa, and Dana are unable to locate either of them. 00:41:24.480 --> 00:41:31.840 In the aftermath of the victory, the surviving crew are forced to abandon the search and concentrate on escaping aboard the crippled Liberator. 00:41:32.079 --> 00:41:42.719 Blake and Jenna remain missing, their fates unknown, while Avon reluctantly assumes command of the remaining crew as they depart the devastated war zone and face an uncertain future. 00:41:45.280 --> 00:41:50.719 So can you remember what did you think when you heard that the full cast audios were coming to be? 00:41:51.199 --> 00:42:02.480 I was super excited because it was the full cast and it what you know, Blake was back, Paul Darrow, Gareth Thomas, and everybody pretty much. 00:42:02.719 --> 00:42:05.039 So it just felt really exciting. 00:42:05.199 --> 00:42:18.000 And I was full of confidence for it because it finished they did such a good job with different eras of classic Doctor Who that you just felt they could recreate this era successfully. 00:42:18.159 --> 00:42:22.000 And Ken Bentley had got a track record of being a really good producer. 00:42:22.079 --> 00:42:24.400 So yeah, I was full of confidence for this. 00:42:24.719 --> 00:42:30.239 Um so where does this this story pick up from in the Blake Seven mythos? 00:42:31.440 --> 00:42:38.159 Oh well, at the end of the second season, the whole of the second season actually almost has what would they call it today, Dylan? 00:42:38.480 --> 00:42:39.679 An arc or a wood? 00:42:40.079 --> 00:42:40.320 Yeah. 00:42:40.880 --> 00:42:50.079 Um it almost has that, which is the search for in the attempts to really destroy, do real damage to the Federation, they decide to look for Star One. 00:42:50.159 --> 00:42:52.800 And along the way, that causes Gan to get killed. 00:42:54.079 --> 00:43:00.639 You know, that was a bit of a big first, which made the show even cooler because they kill their own car uh leading characters off. 00:43:00.880 --> 00:43:06.800 And at the end of that season, they find Star One, Travis is there ahead of them. 00:43:07.119 --> 00:43:32.239 Travis has betrayed the Federation and Humanity to the to an alien race, and suddenly Blake's team and the gang go from have trying to destroy uh Star One and the Federation to trying to save it from the alien awards pouring in through some kind of complicated landmine system, a satellite array in outer space. 00:43:32.480 --> 00:43:34.239 How that would work, who knows. 00:43:34.480 --> 00:43:42.239 But the idea that that star one is at the shortest point between this galaxy and the nearest galaxy and Andromeda, that was rather f lovely. 00:43:42.559 --> 00:43:53.199 And then at the beginning of the following season, Series C in the episode called Aftermath, which we've already mentioned, boys

and girls, that one is set after the battle. 00:43:53.280 --> 00:44:00.559 So there's this gap between the alien or about to come through the satellite um grid, and it's All over. 00:44:00.719 --> 00:44:05.760 There's been a war, half the Federation's gone, but the aliens have been defeated, and we've lost the Liberator, and what's happening? 00:44:05.920 --> 00:44:12.480 And there's this gap, and it and it was designed rather neatly to fill up some of the events of that battle and that gap. 00:44:12.719 --> 00:44:14.960 Yeah, it's Blake Seven's time war, isn't it? 00:44:15.039 --> 00:44:18.000 It happened all off-screen, and everybody was like, no. 00:44:19.119 --> 00:44:38.239 Yeah, because again, great script for uh Star One, great story, brilliant performances, but we did end up with four hairdryers and uh some other piece of uh airfix kit stuck together asn't the alien horde, and it was less than completely and utterly convincing Terrapart. 00:44:39.039 --> 00:44:41.679 However, on audio, it's much better. 00:44:42.159 --> 00:44:47.679 Wasn't it a case that at one point Terry Nation was like that alien horde is going to be the Daleks. 00:44:48.000 --> 00:44:49.280 That's what he wanted. 00:44:49.519 --> 00:44:52.639 I so I've read somewhere, I don't know how true it is. 00:44:52.880 --> 00:44:53.039 Yeah. 00:44:53.199 --> 00:44:55.199 Even if it's apocryphal, it's a good story. 00:44:55.440 --> 00:45:01.199 It would have been a hell of a cliffhanger, wouldn't it, if you'd have just heard exterminate over the speakers on the Liberator? 00:45:01.599 --> 00:45:07.119 But I think it probably would have destroyed Blake Seven and all it had built up. 00:45:07.280 --> 00:45:08.480 I think it would have ruined it. 00:45:08.559 --> 00:45:10.000 So that that didn't happen. 00:45:10.239 --> 00:45:14.480 The problem is the moment you throw the dialeks in there, you go, well, the doctor needs to come and sort this out. 00:45:14.639 --> 00:45:21.360 Why is the doctor let this tyrannical federation spread out from earth and beyond? 00:45:21.440 --> 00:45:23.199 Surely he would have done something about it. 00:45:23.280 --> 00:45:33.280 So i it's a nice idea that I'm sure Terry Nation and Chris Boucher discussed after a few drinks in the BBC bar, but uh it probably doesn't make any sense. 00:45:33.519 --> 00:45:39.519 And I read Tom Baker and Gareth Thomas said they'd like to sort of cross paths in an episode somewhere. 00:45:39.599 --> 00:45:41.360 So yeah, I'm glad that didn't happen. 00:45:41.679 --> 00:45:49.920 Because otherwise we might have got some kind of re- a revisited version of the frontier in space, and we know that that was a little bit dull. 00:45:50.320 --> 00:46:00.000 What 70s Doctor Who really misses, and indeed Blake Seven, is children in need where they could have a little five-minute Blake Seven Tom Baker crossover scene. 00:46:00.239 --> 00:46:03.199 What uh on the East Enders set. 00:46:05.280 --> 00:46:07.440 Exactly, that's all you need, you know. 00:46:07.599 --> 00:46:09.360 Well, they could just be in the Queen Vic. 00:46:09.519 --> 00:46:13.920 Yeah, even running amok in the Queen Vic and killing everybody, that would have been marvelous. 00:46:14.079 --> 00:46:16.880 Get out of my pub! He's a veneration agent. 00:46:19.119 --> 00:46:22.960 So, how do they fill this gap then here with worship? 00:46:23.199 --> 00:46:29.840 On the good side, Dylan, they fill it with good performances, they sound like mostly like themselves. 00:46:30.000 --> 00:46:33.119 I think uh Gareth Thomas's voice is a little bit more rich and fruity. 00:46:33.760 --> 00:46:46.000 There's an okay story, and they get out at the end and it and it nicely excites us about Lake Seven and it tees up the the new series, which as we've already established was fantastic. 00:46:46.159 --> 00:46:59.360 Yeah, however, it it feels a bit the the aliens that were incredibly organic in Star One are suddenly metallic Olympic minds, and that yeah, that sort of jars with me. 00:46:59.679 --> 00:47:06.239 And Jacqueline Peirce doesn't really sound I don't know, she doesn't feel like Servalan to me. 00:47:06.320 --> 00:47:10.880 She's got her voice is different, but she's also a bit too warm and caddy, really. 00:47:11.199 --> 00:47:11.679 Yeah. 00:47:12.079 --> 00:47:22.880 It's a bizarre in, and I'm glad I remember hearing it at the time and being very excited, but I think my fond memories come from the things that happen after this. 00:47:23.119 --> 00:47:24.079 Yeah, absolutely. 00:47:24.159 --> 00:47:32.239 And well, you you the yin, as you say, it feels like a one of those NAF Star Trek captain's log updates, doesn't it? 00:47:32.400 --> 00:47:35.280 You know, Gareth Thomas giving us a recap. 00:47:35.360 --> 00:47:51.360 And I'm I was just thinking I just caught myself thinking, you know, because this is quite niche from a niche supplier who's going to buy this who hasn't got a fucking clue what Blake 7 is and needs to have a captain's log update or what happened in the events of Star Wars. 00:47:51.599 --> 00:47:54.480 I just that was a misstep for for me. 00:47:54.719 --> 00:47:58.480 Yeah, it was never going to be a jumping on point for anybody. 00:47:58.719 --> 00:48:02.159 You know, it's different with something like Doctor Who, where you go, there's different eras. 00:48:02.320 --> 00:48:04.159 Blake Seven is an ongoing series. 00:48:04.320 --> 00:48:07.280 The only jumping on point is episode one, really. 00:48:07.519 --> 00:48:07.760 Yeah. 00:48:08.000 --> 00:48:18.800 You can watch episodes out of context and sort of get the gist of it, but ultimately you need to start at the beginning, and whether you choose to do big finish audios or not, nobody nobody should be starting with a warship. 00:48:19.039 --> 00:48:23.679 No, no, it is it is the answer to a question that nobody really asked, doesn't it? 00:48:24.079 --> 00:48:24.880 Unfortunately. 00:48:25.039 --> 00:48:27.119 But but within that, great

performances. 00:48:27.360 --> 00:48:39.119 Villa and Avon, I really like then they got some great dialogue that felt part of the bouncer with us with the idea when when and Avon saying, Would you feel safer on the flight date with me? 00:48:39.280 --> 00:48:42.320 And oh no, actually, on reflection, I'll go outside. 00:48:42.480 --> 00:48:43.360 So that was good. 00:48:43.519 --> 00:48:52.639 There was a nice idea in using the shield to get rid of everything off the outside, and Villa, you know, as he always does, can only open the door when he's frightened enough. 00:48:52.800 --> 00:48:57.199 So there were some lovely touches that were very reminiscent of of TV Blake Seven. 00:48:57.360 --> 00:48:57.599 Yeah. 00:48:57.760 --> 00:49:02.239 And the sound effects again were excellent, I thought, and put placed you back. 00:49:02.400 --> 00:49:09.119 And I think the voice for A for Zen is in Aurack is good enough that it didn't take you out of the drama. 00:49:09.360 --> 00:49:10.800 So lots of good stuff. 00:49:10.960 --> 00:49:13.280 And I really I did like the ending. 00:49:13.440 --> 00:49:22.559 I think what the ending did was just enough of a nod to the tension between Blake and Avon with the whole who shit that'll do for now. 00:49:22.719 --> 00:49:23.920 I like that as well. 00:49:24.159 --> 00:49:25.679 So there are lots of good stuff. 00:49:25.920 --> 00:49:26.239 Yeah. 00:49:26.400 --> 00:49:29.360 And also at the end of it, the Liberator is destroyed, right? 00:49:29.679 --> 00:49:33.039 Well, it's damaged at the end of the war and they all have to evacuate it. 00:49:33.199 --> 00:49:37.840 So that sets up the events of aftermath at the beginning of Series C. 00:49:37.920 --> 00:49:38.159 Yeah. 00:49:38.400 --> 00:49:39.039 Nicely. 00:49:39.360 --> 00:49:40.079 Absolutely. 00:49:40.239 --> 00:49:45.840 I felt it gave Callie and Jenna a lot more to do than some of the episodes on TV. 00:49:46.159 --> 00:49:46.239 Yeah. 00:49:46.480 --> 00:49:58.480 Considering it's an hour long, inevitably, with a show like Blake's Heaven, with five or six or seven uh regular main cast members, there's always a couple that sort of tend to miss out. 00:49:58.559 --> 00:50:02.320 And I think it always felt like a lot of the time it was the women back in the day. 00:50:02.480 --> 00:50:09.440 And here I think they they managed to find interesting enough little plot lines within this hour for e everybody to have their moment. 00:50:09.519 --> 00:50:17.280 And I liked it when Jenna went off on her own and and stole a ship and um she was going to go off and attack the aliens. 00:50:17.440 --> 00:50:18.320 And do you know? 00:50:18.400 --> 00:50:21.280 I kind of thought, why don't you they should have just let her go? 00:50:21.440 --> 00:50:21.840 Yeah. 00:50:22.079 --> 00:50:27.920 Because we from this moment on she doesn't reappear in the series, and no one ever knows truly what's happened to Jenna. 00:50:28.559 --> 00:50:38.719 So that would have been an interesting way of her leaving the ship rather than her going off in an escape pod, and then she's got lost with Blake somewhere on the other side of the moon. 00:50:38.800 --> 00:50:46.239 So yeah, that was that was a lovely idea, which I wish I'd had the balls to follow it through with and so we talked a bit about the cast. 00:50:46.400 --> 00:50:47.519 It's nice to hear them back. 00:50:47.679 --> 00:50:50.559 I think I do think you're right, Servalan is a little bit off. 00:50:50.800 --> 00:50:54.719 It's always nice to hear Michael Keating back in the role as Villa. 00:50:55.039 --> 00:50:57.599 Like there's something I just enjoy his performance. 00:50:57.840 --> 00:51:12.400 He's not somebody that's ever going to carry his own series, you know, like the character of Villa, but he I I think he is a nice when you've got Blake's bravery and Avon's considered bravery, it's nice to just have an out and out coward within within the team. 00:51:12.719 --> 00:51:26.000 Yeah, and I think he was inconsistently written during a TV series, and and he got better dialogue through the through the big finish world, but he's got to win the award for the most consistent delivery of a character. 00:51:27.039 --> 00:51:29.599 He's Villa all the time, he does it so brilliantly. 00:51:29.679 --> 00:51:34.159 Yeah, and his voice is ageless, and his performance sparkles. 00:51:34.800 --> 00:51:37.199 Yeah, what a great performer he is. 00:51:37.519 --> 00:51:40.480 And like Gareth Talbot sounds a bit older. 00:51:40.559 --> 00:51:41.760 I I can deal with it. 00:51:41.840 --> 00:51:47.599 Like I think also I've I've heard him being interviewed for years, so he just sort of sounds like Gareth Thomas sounds. 00:51:47.840 --> 00:51:48.159 Yeah. 00:51:48.400 --> 00:51:51.199 And yeah, I think they all slip back into their roles really well. 00:51:51.280 --> 00:51:56.159 And yeah, it's just fun to hear them kick this thing off and go, oh, wonder where it's gonna go from there. 00:51:56.239 --> 00:52:02.159 And it, you know, it's sort of it's they spin it out, don't they, into a sort of a season B2, you'd call it, or something. 00:52:02.400 --> 00:52:03.599 Yes, yeah, they do, yeah. 00:52:03.760 --> 00:52:10.079 And it's it and there's some really good episodes in that with the Liberator getting damaged and crashing under the water. 00:52:10.480 --> 00:52:10.639 Yeah. 00:52:10.800 --> 00:52:14.719 I I've gone back and listened to that a few times, but I must do it all over again, actually. 00:52:15.039 --> 00:52:15.760 It's so good. 00:52:15.920 --> 00:52:16.800 It really is. 00:52:17.440 --> 00:52:18.079 Absolutely. 00:52:18.239 --> 00:52:20.320 I do think the script works. 00:52:20.800 --> 00:52:31.119 It's just a little bit it's feels like it's got a lot to cram in before they can go off and tell the stories they actually want to tell over the next sort of X amount of releases. 00:52:31.840 --> 00:52:35.280 It it feels like a proof of concept in a way, doesn't it?

00:52:35.519 --> 00:52:45.199 You know, we've got the music, we've got the sound effects, we've got all the actors, gel together, we can make it work, and it sort of sounds a bit like Blake Seven at the time, so we know it works. 00:52:45.280 --> 00:52:46.800 Let's go on and do a do a series. 00:52:47.119 --> 00:52:48.159 What do you think of the music? 00:52:48.239 --> 00:52:51.039 Does it capture old Dudley well here? 00:52:51.440 --> 00:53:02.639 Well, no, I think it evolves it on, but um yeah, it w it was sympathetic to the music of Dudley and the atmosphere of it it the whole thing did have the atmosphere of Blake Seven about it. 00:53:03.119 --> 00:53:20.239 The plasma expansion wave sound effect, I thought, on audio was a great, it was a really lovely conceit to give you an audio experience, and I think that was that was nice, and it and um and of course if they then surf that plasma wave uh you know out and it damaged the ship. 00:53:20.320 --> 00:53:28.639 So it that would that was a a a really lovely part of the story and an idea, and it and it demonstrated what the audio world could be like for us all. 00:53:29.199 --> 00:53:30.559 And it felt really immersive. 00:53:30.639 --> 00:53:34.800 There are moments in this where it feels like you could be watching a a big screen movie, doesn't it? 00:53:35.119 --> 00:53:36.239 Yeah, absolutely. 00:53:36.400 --> 00:53:51.440 I I think Alice Delotte does a thing with the m the music where for a few seconds you're like, oh, it's the old school Blake Seven music, but as you say, enhances it and goes, We need to get a bit more drama out of this than the the four instruments that Dudley was working with. 00:53:51.679 --> 00:53:52.800 And yeah, I think you're right. 00:53:52.960 --> 00:53:57.119 If they'd gone, we're gonna do Blake Seven the movie now, it would have felt a lot like this. 00:53:57.440 --> 00:53:57.679 Yes. 00:53:57.920 --> 00:54:03.039 It's the old cliche about audio, but the special effects are better, but the sound effects are better. 00:54:03.199 --> 00:54:14.719 Like the explosions sound like massive explosions, and the threat of outer space feels like the threat of outer space, not somebody floating on some Kirby wires in that. 00:54:14.880 --> 00:54:15.039 Yeah. 00:54:15.360 --> 00:54:20.079 So as much as it's a cliche, you're hearing that cliche for the first time in Blake 7. 00:54:20.800 --> 00:54:22.960 Oh, and and it's lovely, isn't it? 00:54:23.199 --> 00:54:26.400 I mean, and the last 10 minutes actually, probably the very best. 00:54:26.559 --> 00:54:38.400 It feels really like the characters are in the swing, they're in the middle of a drama, and they're pulling together and and the stakes are high, and the cost is the damage liberator and them all having to eject. 00:54:38.480 --> 00:54:47.280 So and it's quite a nice conceit that Blake and Jenna go out, or whatever it is, port side, and the others go the other way, and that's maybe why we lost them. 00:54:47.360 --> 00:54:48.000 So yeah. 00:54:48.239 --> 00:54:48.639 Yeah. 00:54:48.800 --> 00:54:51.840 And I think as you say, the liberator gets damaged. 00:54:52.000 --> 00:54:53.920 You could have almost you destroy it. 00:54:54.000 --> 00:55:00.320 That like you you could almost get to the point there and go, well, that's sort of it, and you know, we'll come back for the actual next season. 00:55:00.480 --> 00:55:05.599 But the fact that they managed to spin it out into this great mini-season that is brilliant. 00:55:05.840 --> 00:55:12.960 Do you think it was it was the right decision to fill the gaps rather than try and carry on the story some way, somehow? 00:55:13.280 --> 00:55:15.280 I don't know why they needed to do it, really. 00:55:15.360 --> 00:55:24.320 I think if they'd just started with a new series 2.5, we'd have all been on board because it was a full cast audio drama of Blake Seven, and we've been waiting 30 years for it. 00:55:24.480 --> 00:55:26.400 So they didn't really need to do this. 00:55:26.800 --> 00:55:41.599 That said, it was a good proof of concept, it's it's very good, and it also stands alone as a nice little little bit of a twinkly jewel, something to come back to, and just have that little brief moment of I wonder what happened at the end of Star One. 00:55:41.679 --> 00:55:42.000 Yeah. 00:55:42.159 --> 00:55:45.679 To the organic monsters that have become metallic limpet lines. 00:55:46.159 --> 00:55:48.639 That is the oddest, the oddest choice within it. 00:55:48.880 --> 00:55:57.440 But I love all that stuff of like this this, you know, the flotilla of spaceships coming to save to sort of save the galaxy and then it not quite working. 00:55:57.519 --> 00:56:05.599 And there's a real sense of panic throughout this that I think is quite present within Blake Seven. 00:56:05.760 --> 00:56:10.320 It is quite unusual for a sci-fi show in that nothing ever seems to really go right. 00:56:10.400 --> 00:56:18.079 They may get out of things, but largely they're always on the run, and there's always another danger just around the corner. 00:56:18.480 --> 00:56:22.320 Yeah, things generally end up turning to shit, don't they? 00:56:22.639 --> 00:56:28.400 And the and the federation are often one step ahead of you. 00:56:28.480 --> 00:56:32.800 And even in this, the flotillera ships are heroically coming to save a day. 00:56:32.960 --> 00:56:39.519 Meanwhile, the Federation are kicking the heels on the boundary, going, no, not yet, no, we'll see if McGiddo does its job first. 00:56:39.840 --> 00:56:40.000 Yeah. 00:56:40.320 --> 00:56:51.519 Which is a great use of the Federation as well, just sort of going of course they would see what happened with everybody else first, might as well get them destroyed, and then we'll come and pick up the pieces and hopefully win in the end. 00:56:51.760 --> 00:56:55.280 Like it just captures their malevolence very well. 00:56:55.599 --> 00:56:56.719 It really does, yeah. 00:56:56.800 --> 00:57:05.440

And and the malevolence of the world that they live in, whereas we follow the drama of Blake 7, but generally they get people killed and they don't make a jot of difference. 00:57:05.599 --> 00:57:05.840 Yeah. 00:57:06.000 --> 00:57:06.239 Absolutely. 00:57:06.480 --> 00:57:09.280 And it's yeah, depressing, dystopian world. 00:57:09.519 --> 00:57:11.039 Fortunately, not like the one we live in. 00:57:12.079 --> 00:57:12.480 Exactly. 00:57:12.639 --> 00:57:16.960 It's all smiles, happiness, and everybody's rich. 00:57:17.199 --> 00:57:17.679 Absolutely. 00:57:17.920 --> 00:57:20.400 And our leaders listen to what's good for everybody. 00:57:20.559 --> 00:57:21.280 Yeah, exactly. 00:57:21.599 --> 00:57:23.920 Do we have much more we want to say on Warship? 00:57:24.159 --> 00:57:25.199 I don't think so. 00:57:25.360 --> 00:57:25.679 No. 00:57:26.000 --> 00:57:26.320 Good. 00:57:26.719 --> 00:57:28.880 I love it, but not quite as much. 00:57:29.199 --> 00:57:32.239 So is it a clanger, a banger, or an average meander? 00:57:33.679 --> 00:57:45.519 I think still an absolute banger because of the effects, because of the cast, because of that last 10 minutes, and because, of course, it sets up a really brilliant series. 00:57:45.760 --> 00:57:48.480 Absolutely, I would call this an imperfect banger. 00:57:48.800 --> 00:57:49.440 Yes. 00:57:50.400 --> 00:57:53.199 I've heard that before, dude, but I can't remember where. 00:57:55.760 --> 00:57:56.800 Oh yeah. 00:57:57.920 --> 00:58:10.559 Yeah, I had a great time revisiting it, and it is making me want to jump into the rest of the series because it just reminded me of that brief time 10 years ago or so where we got some new Blake 7 and it was completely out of the blue almost. 00:58:10.880 --> 00:58:26.960 And I remember driving to work, listening to uh the first few stories in this in that new season, and slowing down so I could listen to a bit more before, do you know, and couldn't wait to drive home and to listen to the rest of it. 00:58:27.519 --> 00:58:32.559 And if somebody phoned me, it was a real irritation because they were brilliant, they were really immersive. 00:58:33.119 --> 00:58:36.320 This is a an imperfect banger, as you excellently described. 00:58:36.480 --> 00:58:37.360 It's like you've done this before. 00:58:37.519 --> 00:58:39.280 Hell marvelously described. 00:58:39.920 --> 00:58:45.519 What happened then was perfect banger after perfect banger, and it just got better and better, didn't it? 00:58:45.679 --> 00:58:46.480 Yeah, absolutely. 00:58:46.639 --> 00:58:50.400 For a couple of years, it was a golden age of Blake 7. 00:58:50.559 --> 00:58:54.639 It really was, and that was what, 2013 to 2015, something like that. 00:58:54.960 --> 00:58:55.840 Exactly. 00:58:56.159 --> 00:59:03.760 And then we've had a decade of stuff, and I mean, you know, people dying, and it and it changes the nature of what Big Finish can do. 00:59:03.920 --> 00:59:08.559 And now there's rumors that it could come back. 00:59:08.800 --> 00:59:09.760 How do we feel about that? 00:59:10.079 --> 00:59:11.679 Well, I was about to ask you the same question. 00:59:11.840 --> 00:59:12.559 Great minds, eh? 00:59:13.920 --> 00:59:26.559 I think there's been many rumours over the years that it could come back, and I think the most positive thing that's happened recently is that it's always been with the same company developing it, B7 Media. 00:59:26.719 --> 00:59:28.880 And whether they're still involved or not, I don't know. 00:59:29.039 --> 00:59:34.880 But it seems to be with a new company of people who actively work in the industry. 00:59:35.039 --> 00:59:38.639 So I think now's as good a chance as any as it's had to come back. 00:59:38.960 --> 00:59:46.960 But whether it will, whether the industry and the television landscape is ready for it, whether they've got the right take, I don't know. 00:59:47.119 --> 00:59:53.519 But I do think it's a fantastic idea that can be rebooted and done again. 00:59:53.679 --> 00:59:58.800 Maybe I mean this was 20 odd years ago now, but like the reboot of Battlestar Galactica, everybody loved that. 00:59:58.960 --> 01:00:02.320 And I think that's probably the sort of tone you might want to aim for. 01:00:02.639 --> 01:00:18.719 And I think you can do some nice sort of political allegory stuff with it, as long as it's not too much on the nose about dystopian worlds and crazy dictators and manipulation of the media, all your stuff which is very, very present in that that that first series at least. 01:00:18.960 --> 01:00:21.679 Yeah, and I think I I agree entirely with with that. 01:00:21.760 --> 01:00:33.599 I I I I look at it and I think if you look at the first two series and you cut now, bearing in mind we're never gonna get a 13-episode run anymore because modern TV, as you often say, has changed a lot. 01:00:33.760 --> 01:00:54.480 But the first two series, if you cut out the filler episodes and you focused on the freedom fighters against the federation, so you get you get the way back, a shorter version of that, you get the Project Avalons uh and and trials, and you move towards a Star One. 01:00:54.960 --> 01:01:04.320 There should be six or eight episodes that are very tonally consistent of them against a a dystopian, controlling, evil federation. 01:01:04.880 --> 01:01:10.480 And you could ask the audience the question about are they freedom fighters, are they terrorists? 01:01:10.639 --> 01:01:23.920 Yeah, how do you you know all the questions that Blake Seven wrote uh created back in the day, that's still relevant today, and the way the what geopolitics is changing the world perfect timing, you would think, wouldn't it? 01:01:24.159 --> 01:01:24.800 Yeah, absolutely. 01:01:24.960 --> 01:01:30.800 It just takes a smart writer with a smart take on it, and I I think it could do something really, really interesting. 01:01:30.960 --> 01:01:45.119 And like I think for many years, the people who wanted to bring it

back, it was all very much like it's going to be a sequel, and for a long time in the late 90s and early noughties, somehow, somehow Paul Darrow was going to be involved. 01:01:45.280 --> 01:01:48.159 I think now you can go the way of a complete reboot. 01:01:48.320 --> 01:01:56.480 Or if you wanted to sort of go the original series happen, you can call it Blake 7, and it's a bunch of people inspired by the idea of Blake in that in that universe. 01:01:56.639 --> 01:02:00.559 But I don't think there's really any room to bring bring back any of the characters. 01:02:00.800 --> 01:02:01.599 I mean, a lot of them. 01:02:02.000 --> 01:02:15.199 No, there was a rumour, wasn't it, that they were going to do a reboot where Avon inspired a young group to and he was an old man living like a hermit with Aurac and Yeah, I think that was the pitch. 01:02:16.639 --> 01:02:16.960 Yeah. 01:02:17.119 --> 01:02:17.360 Yeah. 01:02:17.440 --> 01:02:22.159 Isn't that what happened in Star Wars or something with a very old link sky walk? 01:02:22.400 --> 01:02:23.039 Yeah, pretty much. 01:02:23.199 --> 01:02:24.960 I think that was the 90s pitch. 01:02:25.119 --> 01:02:26.800 I mean, I'm sort of glad it didn't happen. 01:02:26.880 --> 01:02:32.480 I think we get a better version of that with just what happened in Logic of Empire as a as a little coda. 01:02:32.880 --> 01:02:33.440 Yes, we do. 01:02:33.599 --> 01:02:36.320 Um let's just have a reboot and go again. 01:02:36.480 --> 01:02:40.000 Yeah, I'd much rather them just cast a new bunch of people, see what we get. 01:02:40.159 --> 01:02:51.920 As I mentioned earlier, I think Avon is possibly the only one that I would struggle with, but then a whole new audience isn't going to know who Paul Darrow is, so it's like they cast the right bastard as Avon. 01:02:52.159 --> 01:03:14.159 They've got good actors is what make what what really helped Blake Seven, because it was the 1970s studio bound, not great special effects, not enough time taken over it, you know, Dudley Simpson's three instrument music, all of that was was really good scripts and really good actors, you know, Gareth Thomas, a Shakespearean actor. 01:03:14.320 --> 01:03:16.480 Paul Darrow played Avon so well. 01:03:16.639 --> 01:03:16.800 Yeah. 01:03:17.039 --> 01:03:19.920 Michael Keating, you had some really good performances. 01:03:20.079 --> 01:03:25.599 I mean, gosh, didn't Jacqueline Pierce create an icon in Serverland from nowhere. 01:03:25.760 --> 01:03:26.239 From nowhere. 01:03:26.480 --> 01:03:31.199 Serverland could have been quite plain on the page as she's written in the first couple of episodes at least. 01:03:31.280 --> 01:03:37.840 And once they get a feel for Jackie Pierce, you know, all of a sudden it becomes it becomes this much bigger character. 01:03:38.000 --> 01:03:44.159 But you what you read those first few episodes and it's her delivery that's selling that, not the sparkling dialogue. 01:03:44.480 --> 01:03:45.599 Yes, absolutely. 01:03:45.760 --> 01:03:46.239 Absolutely. 01:03:46.400 --> 01:03:47.440 So, yeah, great actors. 01:03:47.519 --> 01:03:53.840 That's what we need for a reboot, is really proper, brilliant, quality actors, and they'll bring it to line. 01:03:54.079 --> 01:03:58.239 Yeah, and some great quarries, because you can't do sci-fi without quarries. 01:03:58.719 --> 01:03:59.360 Of course. 01:03:59.760 --> 01:04:00.400 You can't. 01:04:00.559 --> 01:04:03.360 And and the ability to say down and safe. 01:04:03.679 --> 01:04:08.880 I genuinely hope that somebody somewhere has got a great take and somebody takes a chance on it. 01:04:08.960 --> 01:04:17.119 And in two years' time, we're sat down watching a brand new series of Blake Seven and going, oh, but Daniel Craig is playing Avon. 01:04:18.400 --> 01:04:20.079 Stranger things have happened, my friend. 01:04:20.239 --> 01:04:21.679 Stranger things have happened. 01:04:23.119 --> 01:04:26.079 Let me know if you get involved in it in any way, shape, form or form. 01:04:26.320 --> 01:04:27.280 I mean, that's the one, isn't it? 01:04:27.440 --> 01:04:28.960 That'd be the one for me to get involved in. 01:04:29.119 --> 01:04:30.159 Yeah, that would be brilliant. 01:04:31.039 --> 01:04:34.320 This was years ago, but Hammer were trying to make a new Quater mass. 01:04:34.400 --> 01:04:39.599 I said to my agent, if there's any way you can get me involved in that, uh because they don't really know I'm a nerd. 01:04:39.840 --> 01:04:44.320 But I've mentioned I'd like to do Doctor Who from time to time, and they're all like, oh, they only use Welsh people. 01:04:44.559 --> 01:04:47.119 Yeah, if there was a Blake Seven reboot happening somewhere. 01:04:47.360 --> 01:04:48.960 Hang on, your name's Dylan. 01:04:49.599 --> 01:04:50.159 Oh, well? 01:04:52.320 --> 01:04:53.199 Yeah, fairly fairly. 01:04:56.639 --> 01:04:57.039 Right. 01:04:57.199 --> 01:05:02.480 Well, look, thank you for joining me today and jumping into the expanded universe of Blake Seven. 01:05:02.719 --> 01:05:08.239 If you enjoyed this episode, please leave us a review on Apple Podcasts as it helps people to find the pod. 01:05:08.400 --> 01:05:14.480 Look for TooHot for TV on Instagram, TikTok, and YouTube at TooHotTheNumber4 Pod. 01:05:14.960 --> 01:05:19.840 That's Too Hot the number four pod for the latest updates and additional content. 01:05:20.159 --> 01:05:21.840 Next time I'll be joined by J.R. 01:05:21.920 --> 01:05:26.159 Southall and we'll be jumping into the expanded universe of the tripods. 01:05:26.400 --> 01:05:28.960 But until next time, I've been Dylan. 01:05:29.119 --> 01:05:30.159 I've been Nigel. 01:05:30.320 --> 01:05:32.400 And this has been Too Hot for TV. 01:06:18.800 --> 01:06:26.159 At this point, we've heard enough Doctor Who audios that if um Gareth Roberts is not Gareth Roberts, he's he's not there.