บทถอดความฉบับเต็มของ #2245 Self-Flying Planes - Patrick Bonello

and face planted, cracked her skull, 34 or 30 stitches or something, brain bleed, three days in hospital, multiple MRIs, concussion. And it's fair to say that at the minute, the old brain's not operating at 100%. So... interesting phone calls, bless her. And it is really a different, it is a different time of life for her, for me, and also, and there's no self-pity, there's nothing, I don't want any sympathy, attention, nothing. But it is just, all of a sudden you go, oh, well, if I don't look after mum and protect mum and ask all the questions and find all the solutions and have all the hard conversations and manage the money and protect her there's no it's not like i have brothers and sisters or i have a wife or there's grandkids that can get involved or you know there's none of that which is just the situation but it's been a uh a steep learning curve the last few months it's been a big adjustment uh but i would uh I'm very, very honoured to be doing it. 00:04:06 Speaker 1: Like there's nothing I'd rather do. There's no resentment. 00:04:09 Speaker 2: There's just a steep learning curve. So thanks for asking, mate. But it's been a wild ride. And as long as she's okay, as long as she's mentally and physically not in any kind of anguish, then I'm all right. 00:04:25 Speaker 3: Actually, by coincidence, it's Carers Week this week. 00:04:29 Speaker 2: There you go. Yeah. 00:04:31 Speaker 3: I did a function last night for a whole lot of mums of children who are disabled and they had a little bite-tight cheese session with me. And I guess with ageing parents, that's been a massive journey for you the last couple of years particularly. And then I think of other people who have a disabled child for their whole life and it's an ongoing thing. And I think One of the things in Australia, I don't know what it's like in other parts of the world, but people knuckle down and they don't complain. They just get on with it and they do it and they do it and they do it. You know, every day, you drove up to visit three times last week. I don't know how many Ks. What's that, 500 Ks you drove or something? 00:05:16 Speaker 2: Depending on traffic, it's like five hours of driving a day. So I did that three days in a row. But anyway, it just... But it's doable. Like what's interesting is I got a phone call on Wednesday from one of the nurses at Yolambi where she's at. By the way, they are fantastic there. And she said, Craig, and I could tell she was nervous. Like I'm sorry to tell you, like your mum fell, right? And there was so much blood. I should, anyway, fuck it. There was so much blood that the paramedics to whom I spoke said they were worried that she'd bleed out because she's so small and there was so much blood, right? So clearly with somebody who's under 40 kilograms, there's not a lot of blood volume. But, you know, I was in a normal workday, podcasts, coaching sessions, meetings, emails, shit to do. I get this phone call. And literally four minutes later,

I am in the car and nothing else matters. You don't go, oh, tell her I'll be there in five hours. 00:06:28 Speaker 1: It's like, no. 00:06:29 Speaker 2: And it's not like, oh, look at me, the fucking great son. It's none of that. You just go, oh, well, I don't have an option and I don't want an option. This is all I want to do. But it's amazing how when you have to make shit happen or work, like you just make it work. So I get in the car, I ring Melissa. I'm like, can you ring this person, this person, this person? Can you cancel that? Can you reschedule that? And I don't know what I'm going to be doing tomorrow. So let's just, you know, and you just figure it out. Like I wrote something the other day, and I know this is not really on topic for our typical conversation, but I feel like it can be relevant to where the world. 00:07:10 Speaker 1: Is at right now. 00:07:11 Speaker 2: But I feel like life is always asking us one question and that is can you adapt? 00:07:18 Speaker 1: Can you adapt? Because everything's dynamic. 00:07:22 Speaker 2: And if in the middle of all of that change and evolution and all that shit that we can't control or predict, if we are a metaphoric statue, it makes it very hard to survive. So when someone rings and goes, hey, Patrick, this happened to someone you love, we need you to leave home in three minutes, you're leaving home in three minutes. 00:07:46 Speaker 1: Yeah. 00:07:47 Speaker 3: I don't know if you remember this, Craig, when my younger brother who's disabled got run over. He had stepped out from the side of a bus, wasn't the fault of the driver. He stepped out and got run down. Now, I got called in the newsroom at what was close to the end of my shift. And I remember the first thing I did was started crying. You know, that was, I was gutted. And your life just gets thrown for a tailspin You know, and then you've got to start to triage, you know, what do I do now? I've got to get there. I've got to help the family. I've got to support mum and dad, all that sort of stuff. But it's, yeah, I think, I know we all get thrown those curly ones at different stages, but, you know, it doesn't make it easy. And it's great that you had a Melissa to call on, but, you know, it's, but you're the one doing, running the show because you're just the only kid. 00:08:36 Speaker 2: Yeah. 00:08:37 Speaker 1: Yep. 00:08:37 Speaker 2: And all of a sudden it's like, oh, I'm the decision maker on this. Like there's nobody to go, hey, what do you think? Because it's no, it's Craig, it's actually just what you think. So here's what we're going to do. Do you want us to do this or that with your mum? 00:08:54 Speaker 1: Because your medical. 00:08:54 Speaker 2: Power of attorney and if this happens, I'm like, fuck, I don't want to be in Latrobe Regional Hospital at 11 o'clock on a Wednesday night figuring out life and death shit for my mum. 00:09:08 Speaker 1: It's like that's you, dude. 00:09:10 Speaker 3: It's a pivotal time in your life when you become the grown-up. Yeah. 00:09:15 Speaker 1: I've been waiting. It's here. 00:09:17 Speaker 2: It's a fuck. 00:09:18 Speaker 1: Yeah. 00:09:19 Speaker 3: Yeah. It is an interesting one. When mum's dementia got really bad, I spoke to someone at Dementia Australia. I was doing a course with them, and I said, I really want to take mum to visit my big brother who lives in Canada to see him for the last time. And I said to the carer, I said, well, how soon should I leave? And he said, now. He said, do it now. You haven't got time to wait. So I bundled mom and dad and my disabled younger brother. And all of a sudden, I'm standing at the airport. Dad is humming to himself because he's just in a box with the pixies. Mom's totally in the throes of dementia. And I've got my disabled younger brother. And I'm standing there thinking, oh, hell. I'm the one wearing the pants now. 00:10:03 Speaker 2: Why on earth did you not just fly your brother out? My God, that would have seemed like. 00:10:08 Speaker 3: A simple solution. No, no, no, wait, wait. There was a reason because his wife was undergoing cancer treatment for breast cancer. So this was the, and I couldn't, it wasn't a holiday. It was to go there. I think I've told you the story because it was also not long after 9-11 and mum gets detained at the airport because she's got the wrong passport and should have had. like a visa to enter the U.S. Oh, man, it is a whole podcast episode by itself. 00:10:38 Speaker 2: I think we've just depressed all of you and me together. 00:10:42 Speaker 4: Sorry. 00:10:43 Speaker 2: Can you tell us some good news? 00:10:45 Speaker 4: Looking forward to Queensland, looking forward to sunny Queensland. Thanks for asking. 00:10:50 Speaker 3: Sorry, everyone. What's happening in Queensland, Tiff? 00:10:52 Speaker 5: I'm going up for a conference, actually. Oh, what is it? 00:10:56 Speaker 4: So, yeah, flying up a day early. Conference I was at last year, a speaker's conference, yeah. 00:11:02 Speaker 2: Awesome. 00:11:03 Speaker 3: So what are you looking forward to the most? 00:11:04 Speaker 5: Oh, just the people in the room. 00:11:06 Speaker 4: You know, I met the most amazing connections up there and those events fill my cup. 00:11:12 Speaker 5: And so I was going to sit it out because. 00:11:14 Speaker 4: I'm in the throes of building a new part of my business now that has got nothing to do with speaking, but I kind of at the last minute went, nah. 00:11:23 Speaker 5: People, people. Go be with your people. It gives you lots of energy. 00:11:26 Speaker 3: So, yeah. That's great. 00:11:30 Speaker 1: Go and connect with your tribe. 00:11:32 Speaker 3: There's something to be said about that, isn't there, Crago? I know we form communities. I think it's almost a human imperative to find our tribe, to find our group, our club, our organisation. And it's great when you do find that and it's like, oh, wait a minute, all these people talk the way that I do. All

these people resonate with what I'm talking about, you know, And I think in some ways we have this little club called TYP and it is a bit of a one-way conversation. But when I talk to our listeners, because I know a few of our listeners and they, you know, there's a good friend of mine, Kim, and I'll say, oh, did you know that? Oh, yeah, yeah, I know. I said, wait a minute, I didn't tell you. She said, no, you talked about it on the podcast. Like, oh, shit. 00:12:17 Speaker 1: What? 00:12:19 Speaker 3: Which is kind of cute you know that that sometimes i've told my friends who listen and they know it and then i go to tell them the story it's like no no i already know this like what do you mean how do you know this do you listen to me yeah which is. 00:12:35 Speaker 2: Like when i met i met a stranger who to me is a stranger and to them i'm a friend and they're like and I'm looking at them, I'm like, I do not know who you are. I do not know who you are. And they're like, so sorry to hear about your dad. How's your mum? And I'm like, oh, that's right. So, yeah. 00:12:53 Speaker 3: But it's a nice feeling aside from the creepiness, yeah. 00:12:58 Speaker 2: But, I mean, you know what? I mean, we now know, and this is not new information, but 10 years ago it was new information. It's like connection and– love and belonging and acceptance and community, in other words, the opposite of loneliness and disconnection, these are some of the biggest determinants of health, physical health, not just mental and emotional health, which makes sense, but physical health, longevity, healthspan, lifespan, all that stuff. We know that right up there with diet and exercise is human connection. as maybe more important. In fact, I would like, I look at my mum and I think the most important thing for her health, her recovery, her healing, her longevity right now, the most important thing is just the fact that she's in a community and she's loved and liked and needed and wanted and accepted and acknowledged and connected with. For me, that makes me happy. I don't really give a fuck if the breakfast is healthy or not. 00:14:05 Speaker 3: Yeah. The interesting thing when you recounted that story, because I knew that mum had had a fall, we've spoken before about the injuries she sustained, but I didn't realise she was doing the cafe thing and cleaning tables and all that sort of stuff because my fondest memories of your mum is bossing you around at Harper's Gym and cleaning around the place, getting the broom out, you know, making sure everything looked tidy when she was doing the reception stuff. 00:14:30 Speaker 1: Can I say that Mary was the worst employee I ever had? 00:14:37 Speaker 2: We had like a big Tupperware container of jelly beans in the off chance, on the off chance that somebody would have a low blood sugar event, a hypo, right? 00:14:50 Speaker 1: And, you know, they were. 00:14:51 Speaker 2: Just there in case somebody needed a bit of, well, Mary would just walk out on the gym floor amongst all the populace just handing out lollies. Just handing out lollies to all the people who don't need lollies and telling me and everyone else one won't hurt them. Oh, and then she would basically call me a pain in the ass for telling her not to fucking go and give sugar to all the people who were in the gym trying to get in shape. 00:15:22 Speaker 1: Those were the days, though. Yeah. 00:15:24 Speaker 3: Those were the days. 00:15:25 Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah. 00:15:27 Speaker 2: Let's talk about technology and AI and all the things. 00:15:32 Speaker 3: Yeah, this is a technology thing that scares, not scares the crap out of me, but really disturbed me when I saw the article in The Guardian today. And we spoke about it briefly before we jumped on. And this is where I'm actually in favor of censorship. I'm the last person ever that would want censorship. I've got to say, I really believe people should make their own decisions and self-censor as opposed to a government telling you you can or can't, having been to China where you can't log into Google or Facebook or anything. But at the moment, there's a real big call to stop the streaming of an execution in the United States. I mean, the fact that they're going to live stream someone being killed is goes so against the grain with me on every single level. It disturbs me so greatly that someone thinks this is a good idea. And the fact that people in Australia are saying, what? You people are lunatics. We should not let Australians see this shit. I agree for the first time. Censor the shit out of this. This is going to happen in early December, allegedly. The defense secretary over there, a guy by the name of Pete Hesgeth, said that they're going to plan the execution of the guy who was a– like a guy who was a shooter at Fort Hood. Now, regardless of what the person's done, now, they may be guilty of sin, but, man, I don't want anybody to see that. Do you? I mean, what's your take on it, Harps? 00:17:02 Speaker 2: Look, I mean, the sad reality is that there are already lots and lots of online places where you can see that, you know, where you can see– I'm not even going to describe them, but array of different horrible, violent acts, including death. Do I think it's a good idea to stream? Absolutely not. Do I think, I don't know, from a, you know, like there's just so much stuff that goes on in the world. I think something like that happens all the time. or different versions of that. I would not watch it. I would not think most of our listeners would watch it. I would rather it not available than available. But, you know, people have their own right to, you know. No, I think it's... I think of all the things that we could be doing with our time and energy, streaming executions, probably not in the top 5,000 things that we need to be doing. 00:18:02 Speaker 4: Tiff? 00:18:02 Speaker 2: What about you, Cook? 00:18:04 Speaker 5: Yeah, no, it's... This week it was

interesting. 00:18:07 Speaker 4: I opened social media and someone had shared, I don't know if you heard about the guy that got into the zoo enclosure in Yorkshire. 00:18:14 Speaker 3: I heard about it. 00:18:15 Speaker 4: He was killed by a tiger and that was straight, literally the footage was streamed and he had to go in and I was like, this must be AI and it wasn't. 00:18:25 Speaker 5: And I'm like, well, that's kind of crazy that we just, that's now entertainment. 00:18:30 Speaker 2: Yeah. Oh, that's, yeah. 00:18:33 Speaker 1: Yeah, what do you think about that? 00:18:34 Speaker 2: I know this is not tech, but what do you think about, like, firstly, I'm sad he lost his life, but what they were going to do, what they were considering, but they decided against it, but was killing the tiger. I'm like, he's just a tiger doing tiger shit. Like, he's not making a moral judgment. Like, some dude, which is basically just meat... You know, to him, it's like, oh, a snack, you know. So I'm glad they didn't. 00:19:07 Speaker 1: Kill the tiger. 00:19:08 Speaker 2: Yeah. 00:19:08 Speaker 3: Can I also say, Tiff, that your algorithm somewhere, someone at Meta had an algorithm that said Tiff Cook would like to see a man killed by a tiger. That's fucked up. 00:19:21 Speaker 5: It was shared. 00:19:22 Speaker 3: I don't explain much. Yeah, no. 00:19:24 Speaker 4: But also it was shared by a guy whose content I have previously watched. He sometimes puts like amazing stuff with animals around the world. 00:19:33 Speaker 5: And that's what made me think, why is he sharing this? This must be AI slop. 00:19:39 Speaker 4: Yeah. 00:19:40 Speaker 3: See, there was a really interesting article in the ABC today where they interviewed an 18-year-old guy who said it was talking about the manosphere. Now, I don't know. how much you know about the manosphere, but it's quite misogynistic. It's saying that women should be more traditional roles, keep them at home, cooking. It's all the stuff that was from the 1940s, 50s, and 60s or whatever. And particularly the manosphere is anti-feminism, like absolutely, absolutely anti-feminism. But there was a really interesting insight from this 18-year-old who said he'd signed up for social media and he said his feed keeps getting Manosphere stuff. And he said, I didn't ask for it. I don't look at it. I love my music. So basically the things that he sees on Insta he wants to see is music related. But because he's 18 and because he's a male, because he's a boy or a young guy, he keeps getting stuff that he doesn't want to see. So this was quite a frank thing. He wasn't being prompted by the journalist. He's just saying, why do I keep getting this Manosphere stuff? And this is where that algorithm thing comes in, where the Albanese government is trying to give people the option to opt out of the algorithm. And then the Trump government came in and said, wait a minute, you can't do that. You're, you know, they're having a go at Australia

for trying to filter out the crap. And that was really interesting in itself. But, you know, regardless of what you're doing online, you should have the power to filter out stuff you don't want to see. Let's face it. I mean, I know we have a choice to watch it. But Tiff, you were saying you thought it was AI. You clicked on it and you started watching it. Now, you may not have realized till halfway through that it was actually real. And that's the thing, you know, if we have an option prior to. But the way social media works is there's no editor. There's nobody filtering that. There's no one making an editorial decision as to whether it's appropriate for it to be screened or viewed or clicked on. 00:21:35 Speaker 2: I think I agree with you, Patrick. I also think pretty much the race is run in terms of Like I think if I agree that I'm going to have a presence on Instagram and I'm going to look at Instagram and then that's going to happen. Like the only way for that not to happen is if I'm not on Instagram. Like I think it's like if we're just being real world practical, good luck turning off this or turning off that or not getting exposed to anything. It's like, Craig, if you don't ever want to see any of that, Don't go on Facebook. Don't go on Instagram. Yes, Tips, you've got your little index finger in the air. 00:22:12 Speaker 3: Yes. 00:22:12 Speaker 1: Like witchy poo. 00:22:14 Speaker 5: Witchy poo. 00:22:14 Speaker 3: Oh, I thought she was going to pick her nose. Yeah. 00:22:20 Speaker 4: I talk about this to people all the time, how important it is to deliberately curate and hide or block or, like, deliberately search on things to feel, because the algorithm chases you. You might search something in the news and next minute every single article someone or opinion piece someone puts up is that. And I have cleared, unfollowed, I've pressed not interested to deliberately clear when sometimes the algorithm. 00:22:48 Speaker 5: Puts shit in front of me that I don't want to have to be in my head. 00:22:53 Speaker 2: Yes, yes. That's a really good point to be active, yeah. You don't really jump on Instagram, Patrick, do you? 00:23:01 Speaker 3: At all, no. I don't use socials at all. 00:23:04 Speaker 2: At all? 00:23:04 Speaker 3: No. 00:23:05 Speaker 2: Well, good for you. I mean, good for you. All right. Nearly $ 300 billion worth of AI data center builds delayed or blocked. Like this is the thing, building data centers now, isn't it? And everyone's a bit. It must be profitable for somebody, but it's creating a lot of controversy. It's causing a lot of concern for people. 00:23:30 Speaker 3: Now, I don't know how much of this is propaganda, but certainly, you know, we keep getting told that data center equals lots of water being used, lots of resources being used. You know, chips are now going up. So if you buy a smartphone, I can probably guarantee that your average smartphone has probably gone up by at least $ 100. And that's because there are less chips out there, less computer chips, because they're going towards data centers. So they've been bought up. And it means that consumer electronics have all increased in price. And there's this ongoing effect. But basically, there's been a lot of community pushback. This is just the United States, by the way. $ 295. 5 billion worth of AI data centers have been delayed or frozen entirely. We're talking about Amazon, Alphabet, Microsoft, all those companies. So the delays are really strongly about municipal water supplies. That seems to be the biggest thing that people are concerned about. And also the pressure on the electricity grid. So there's polls that say 70% of Americans oppose hosting AI data centers in their local areas. That's a massively large number of people who are opposed to that. I don't know what the feeling is in Australia. I got asked by my local real estate agent to fly a drone over our water supply in Belan. And it's this beautiful reservoir called Colebrook. And I thought we were just doing a drone for a property that was adjacent to the reservoir. And then when we got back from the shoot, I said, so what was the property? Which one are you actually selling? And he said, oh, no, no, I want to make a pitch to data centers to get a data center there. It's like, are you freaking kidding? It's in the middle of the bush. It's a beautiful area. It's our water supply. And you want to get them to build a data center there? Well, that footage disappeared, didn't it? 00:25:24 Speaker 1: And you were complicit. 00:25:25 Speaker 3: Now, Patrick, they actively didn't give it to him. 00:25:30 Speaker 2: Not that I don't know, but just for our friends who don't know that might look like me, what is a data centre? Is this just a big building that stores information? 00:25:47 Speaker 3: That processes information. So it's a big, big, big factory-sized building that has racks and racks and racks and racks and racks of computers. And those computers either store data, well, they will store data, process data. So in a lot of cases, for people to be able to use AI, then you need lots and lots of data centers. So, you know, when you jump on and use a search and you use Claude or you use ChatGPT or whatever, AI that you're using, it takes a lot of processing power. So at the moment, a lot of AI processing is done at these massive data centers. And that's every query now. When you do a search query in Google, most of the time you're getting an AI response. Even if you don't want to use AI, you're going to be using it anyway. When you call up a bank and you're hit by an AI that wants to talk to you first before you get passed on to a human operator... You don't have a choice in that matter. So the reality of it is companies are embracing AI. They're streamlining their businesses. They're trying to put an AI fence between you and a human operator because guess what? It's cheaper for them to use an AI than to have a human person answer a phone.

So, you know, much as we don't like it, It's something we've got to live with, but that processing power has to go somewhere. So having a data center where they store that information, process that information, takes resources. 00:27:16 Speaker 2: I love that you pointed out that it was a human person. Thanks for that. 00:27:21 Speaker 3: As opposed to a non-human person. 00:27:24 Speaker 2: So we've already got autonomous cars and we've got, in some countries in the world, autonomous cars. buses we've definitely got autonomous trucks which are being trialed in maybe the northern territory i'm not sure but air traffic control is worn against ai smart navigation system yeah i wonder if that's heading eventually towards autonomous planes but there's no pilot that would scare the shit out of me i definitely won't be trying i won't be debuting on that Yeah. 00:27:55 Speaker 3: Look, this is a particular guy. This was an article on Futurism. It's a website that I kind of like to check through. And what they're doing is they're now trialing a model at air traffic control around the United States. So what they're going to do is the AI will be monitoring aircraft and locating flight paths for landings and takeoffs real time. So air traffic operations... have a safety risk, you know, human fatigue, there's always a possibility of human error, but now they're saying that this is going to have AI oversight and AI will be running it. But the concern from air traffic controllers is the term that's been bandied around a lot, AI hallucination. You know, when you do a search and suddenly your AI is determined that this is the right thing, but in fact, it's wrong. So AI systems can generate fabricated and erroneous data. They make mistakes. And the concern from flight traffic controllers in the US is that this could potentially be a massive concern for flight traffic because there's a lot of aircraft flying all over the place. I think Melbourne to Sydney, our air traffic is probably the highest population. traffic corridor in the world, I think. I remember reading somewhere that we have a lot of air traffic, but if you've ever been to LAX and seen all those aircraft coming in and out all the time, that is phenomenal. And air traffic controllers work a really stressful job. So I can see where it would be good to have the tools there, smart AI tools, but I wouldn't be really comfortable if that's all you had. You know, I still feel that human oversight is really important. And that's the concern they've got here that, you know, at the moment, you know, there's a real concern that if you've got AI running it, then, you know, pilots rely on air traffic control to be able to land and take off. 00:29:53 Speaker 2: Tiff and I were talking with Gillespie the other day and about the fact that they We did confirm, Tiff confirmed on the podcast, that they are using recruiting gamers, so video gamers in the United States to become air traffic controllers. 00:30:12 Speaker 3:

Oh, right. Okay. 00:30:13 Speaker 2: Yeah. 00:30:13 Speaker 1: And paying them, was it like $ 150, 000 US a year, Tiff? 00:30:16 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah. Within the first three years. 00:30:17 Speaker 5: They make up to $ 155, 000 US. 00:30:19 Speaker 4: Crazy. 00:30:19 Speaker 3: Yeah. 00:30:19 Speaker 1: So they're- Look at Patrick. 00:30:28 Speaker 4: He's submitting his resume as we speak. He's just popping it through the Air Traffic Association of America. 00:30:32 Speaker 2: You can't just stop talking and jump on your computer. 00:30:35 Speaker 3: You two are talking. I can type while you guys are talking. God. 00:30:38 Speaker 1: How high does his voice get? 00:30:40 Speaker 3: Too high. 00:30:42 Speaker 2: Oh, God. 00:30:43 Speaker 1: When he gets defensive, he sounds like a mouse. 00:30:46 Speaker 4: Once he gets through a bit more of his ADHD management course, he might stop doing that rude task switching in the middle of podcasts. 00:30:53 Speaker 3: I was still listening, and the reason, can I tell you what I was sharing for you bastards, the pair of you? 00:30:59 Speaker 1: Hey, take the feedback, bro. There's no use to insult people. 00:31:04 Speaker 3: No, I was doing a Google search on a movie called Gran Turismo. I don't know if you've seen the film. It's actually quite a good film. I've seen it. It's basically a true story. 00:31:11 Speaker 2: I've seen it, where they train all these gamers to drive cars in real life. 00:31:16 Speaker 3: And so guess what? It was relevant to our conversation. Just thought I'd get my facts straight before I brought it up because, you know, I wanted to make sure it actually was called Gran Turismo, which it was. And that's what it was relating to, Tiff. 00:31:30 Speaker 2: I'll tell you. 00:31:30 Speaker 1: What, he'd be good in a corporate space, wouldn't he, Tiff? 00:31:33 Speaker 5: Oh, wouldn't he be exceptional? 00:31:35 Speaker 3: I'm unemployable. Oh, fucking hell. 00:31:38 Speaker 1: You wouldn't want to talk to him about his performance. 00:31:42 Speaker 2: Fucking hell, the guy. that Glow Mesh would be in the shag pile every five minutes. Yeah. 00:31:48 Speaker 3: Was that as good for you as it was for me? Sorry. 00:31:53 Speaker 2: Can I ask you a question? Yeah. Can I ask you both actually finish your Gran Turismo bit because I've got a question for both you. 00:32:00 Speaker 3: No, no, just saying that it's a very interesting one that they're using gamers because gamers have really good reflexes and it makes absolute sense if you're going to employ someone, then Missile Command would be great, wouldn't it? Remember the game Missile Command with the trackball? Yeah. 00:32:14 Speaker 1: Let's keep the missiles at bay, shall we? Let's keep the missile talking. 00:32:20 Speaker 3: But if someone was really good and got like a top score on missile command, I would be so happy for them to be an aircraft controller. Oh, yeah. 00:32:27 Speaker 1: Hi, it's the North Korean Army here. 00:32:29 Speaker 4: I know a lot of boxers that have done a lot of work on their reflexes. Maybe we should just employ boxers to air traffic control. 00:32:36 Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it's a very specific kind of reflex. Hey, I was watching– I was watching a report. They were talking about buying secondhand cars and they were saying how the best buy right now is to buy like a two-year-old EV because a one to two-year-old EV in the first year, Tiff, in the first year of ownership, if you spend 50 grand on an EV, it loses 25 to 30% in the first year. Right. So now your $ 50, 000 car's worth $ 35, 000, even though it's still relatively brand new. And then two to three years, depending on mileage, et cetera, it's only worth 50% of what you paid for it. So you can buy yourself a $ 50, 000 car that's two years old for $ 25, 000, give or take, that's still got probably five years warranty on it. So that's not the worst idea. It was actually a lady, a motoring journalist. And I'm like, this is not the worst strategy here. 00:33:42 Speaker 3: And I just say, this is so strange that you bring this up because I was looking up secondhand electric cars this morning in bed. And you know what the result came back with? The Hyundai Kona electric vehicle, the Highlander, And the reason that it said was a really good deal is because when they released them, they had an issue with their batteries a year or so into it. So they replaced the batteries for free, which means a car that's 2019 or 2020 has a much newer battery in it. So you're not just getting an electric EV car. You're also getting a brand new battery or a much newer battery than relates to that model. So when I did the search, I said, what's going to be the best value? Because I thought, oh, what if I sold my car? What would I get for it? And if I did a switchover... And it said that this was the absolute best deal at the moment, the Hyundai Kona Electric. Are you familiar with that one, Craig? I had a look at it online. It's not the prettiest. 00:34:43 Speaker 1: I'm a car head. I'm a car head. 00:34:47 Speaker 2: I read all the bloody, I read everything on cars. But sadly, I don't. We all know I bought a new car a year and a half ago and sold it. I drive it four times and then went, it's too fancy. So I sold it. 00:35:02 Speaker 1: So now I drive my shitter around. 00:35:05 Speaker 2: And everybody makes fun of me and I love it, but I reckon it is your next car, Patrick going to be an EV. 00:35:11 Speaker 1: Do you think? 00:35:12 Speaker 3: Yeah, I'd absolutely like it to, but remember my track record, I had my last, my previous car, my Nissan I had for 32 years. So I like to run a car into the ground, not to replace cars. So I reckon my current Mazda, uh, the hybrid I'll probably have, you know, maybe till I'm 80. 00:35:31 Speaker 2: Um, Speaking of, I'm going to ask you in a sec, but before we go to Tiff, so I'm selling Mary's car at the moment, right? So it's a little Suzuki Swift, but it's a 2023, so it's

three years old. It's literally like new. I mean, literally, it looks like a showroom car. It's got 7,000 Ks on it. Awesome. So- It'll probably be sold by the time this gets out, but, you know, and I'm not doing a sales pitch, but I'm like, oh, my God. So, Tiffy, are you going to buy an EV one day? 00:36:05 Speaker 4: I don't know. I'm a bit like Patrick. I'm not fussed about upgrading my car anytime soon. And apparently Elwood is terrible for charging stations because the lad has been looking at the EV market. 00:36:20 Speaker 3: Right. Can I just say that in the Balan Shire, in the shire that I live in, the Marooble Shire, We don't have a single charging station except at the council for the council offices, but the public can't use it. So there's one charger at the shire offices and we're not allowed to use it. We don't need it, you know, because our shire extends from Melton all the way to... It's a very, very big shire, but we don't have a charging station. 00:36:53 Speaker 2: Wow. 00:36:53 Speaker 1: Your voice just went very weird, didn't it, Tiff? 00:36:56 Speaker 4: It just went Darth Vader for like one to two seconds in the middle of the sentence. 00:37:00 Speaker 1: Yes, a little bit of Darth Vader going on. 00:37:01 Speaker 3: Okay. Do you want me to repeat that? 00:37:03 Speaker 1: No, it's all right. 00:37:05 Speaker 2: Just leave it in. And let's leave that in as well. 00:37:09 Speaker 1: This is how. 00:37:10 Speaker 2: Can we leave this bit in too? Yeah, no. 00:37:12 Speaker 1: What about this bit? 00:37:13 Speaker 3: Yeah. Okay, Tiff. That's all right with you. No editing. No editing needed. Let's just leave this bit in. I reckon we should leave all of this in. 00:37:22 Speaker 2: Speaking of electric vehicles, high mileage electric vehicles are more reliable than petrol cars. 00:37:29 Speaker 1: What's that based on? How did they come up with that? 00:37:32 Speaker 3: This was an article in The Guardian and the British Ministry of Transport did roadworthy inspections and looked at high mileage electric vehicles and and they found that over a long term, they were more mechanically reliable than internal combustion engines. 00:37:52 Speaker 1: Because they have way less parts. 00:37:54 Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly. Yeah, absolutely. 00:37:55 Speaker 2: Like way less. 00:37:57 Speaker 3: Yeah, which is great. So when they looked at it, what they found was that, and they based this on British Rental and Leasing Association figures. So these are real cars that have been used in the real world and were driven for between 145,000 kilometres and 193,000. They've clocked up a lot of Ks, but it was the electric vehicles recorded an inspection failure rate of 16.5%, whereas the petrol engines, 22.1%. So that was the difference in terms of that long-term, you know, sustainability of the vehicle, whereas the electrics came out on top. 00:38:35 Speaker 2: Tiff, I've got a question for you. Do electric vehicles have engines? 00:38:42 Speaker 4: Pass. 00:38:44 Speaker 2: You're an arsehole. 00:38:45 Speaker 3: That's not the 30% that I'm dude-like with. 00:38:48 Speaker 1: No, that's... Well, the battery is the engine. 00:38:57 Speaker 2: That's why they last so long because there's nothing to break really. It does seem funny though not having a motor per se, doesn't it? 00:39:07 Speaker 1: It seems strange. 00:39:08 Speaker 3: Well, it has an electric motor and some have multiple electric motors. They do have electric motors. The battery isn't the engine. The battery is the power. 00:39:16 Speaker 2: The battery drives it. 00:39:17 Speaker 3: No, the battery powers it. It's the actual electric engine. that drives the wheels, but there's no gearing mechanism per se, because with an electric engine, you can control the speed just purely through the amount of electricity that goes into it so yeah it does have an engine i don't know. 00:39:34 Speaker 2: That us three should be especially technical yeah Yeah. 00:39:39 Speaker 1: Fuck that. 00:39:39 Speaker 2: There's probably some– well, there's definitely 100 blokes and maybe 100 ladies. I don't know. 00:39:44 Speaker 1: That was very discriminatory. 00:39:46 Speaker 2: 100 people listening of all genders who know exactly the answer to what we are or. 00:39:52 Speaker 3: What– All right, fuck. 00:39:54 Speaker 1: Let's cut this out. 00:39:55 Speaker 3: Do you want to look it up, Tiff? 00:39:56 Speaker 1: Leave it in. Look it up. 00:39:59 Speaker 2: Look it up. 00:40:00 Speaker 3: Go on, Tiff. Look it up. 00:40:01 Speaker 1: Do you know why the fuck I opened that door? 00:40:02 Speaker 3: I don't know why you opened that door. Yeah, that was just dumb. 00:40:06 Speaker 4: Sorry. 00:40:06 Speaker 2: Patrick, banned Dahua surveillance cameras identified in Australian Leap Motors, speaking of EVs. Yeah, yeah. So that's a brand in Australia, Leap Motor, another Chinese brand, but they've got surveillance cameras operational in Australia that are actually banned. 00:40:23 Speaker 4: Yeah. 00:40:24 Speaker 3: So this is interesting because government organizations right around Australia banned the cameras from this particular Chinese manufacturer. But now the same Chinese manufacturer is installing their cameras into vehicles because vehicles need to see the road. And there's a whole lots of things that most new cars have cameras in them to be able to control the reversing cameras, adaptive cruise control. There's lots of reasons. And I don't know if you've seen in some of the newer cars, it blows my mind where they have an aerial view and you can see around you when you're parking. So there's lots of reasons that these cameras are needed in new cars. But this company that basically was kicked out of Australia because they thought, well, They can't prove that they're not part of the Chinese government. There's surveillance issues. They didn't want them anywhere near the Defence Force. And now some bloke or woman who buys an electric car and parks

out the front of or drives past one of our Defence Force or anywhere that is kind of sensitive, potentially all these cameras are pointing at it because they're now consumer devices. 00:41:34 Speaker 2: You keep going, Darth Vader. 00:41:37 Speaker 3: Yeah, that was kind of weird. Why am I Darth Vader-ing? Is that just sitting on the cable? Oh, now that's better. Is that still sounding weird? 00:41:45 Speaker 2: That's better. 00:41:46 Speaker 3: Oh, okay. 00:41:47 Speaker 1: Leave it all in, Tiff. 00:41:48 Speaker 2: Leave all this in. 00:41:49 Speaker 5: Just so people know what I have to deal with. 00:41:52 Speaker 2: Yeah, let everybody listen to the messiness that is. Patrick, I feel sorry for the grandmother who was jailed for six months because of faulty facial recognition. 00:42:05 Speaker 1: You'd be pissed off. 00:42:06 Speaker 2: With that, wouldn't you? 00:42:07 Speaker 3: Well, the thing is, what I don't understand is if you have been charged with a crime, so she gets distant grandmother in the United States. She gets dragged out of her home. I think she was kind of sitting the grandkids at the same time, dragged out, charged because there was facial recognition, misidentified her, goes to jail. And what a shit legal team she had. A legal team, wouldn't you? Yeah. 00:42:34 Speaker 4: Yeah. 00:42:36 Speaker 2: You would think that would be pretty easy to figure out. 00:42:39 Speaker 3: She was 1,000 kilometres, she was 19, actually 1,930 kilometres away from where the crime happened. That's the worst legal team in history. Hey, here's some evidence. She was here. We can prove it. And then she goes to jail. So she was, I think the crime was committed in North Dakota and she was in Tennessee. 00:43:01 Speaker 2: So, I mean, do we know? Like, in all seriousness, why did she go to jail if they had that evidence? 00:43:08 Speaker 3: Well, because the legal team was a piece of crap. They just added doing work experience, maybe give the job to the work experience kid to run the court case. Who knows? But she got convicted. It was a facial recognition error. Her name is Angela Lips, and she's 50 years old. You know, isn't it funny when you hear 50-year-old grandmother and you think, oh, man, I'm way older than that? It makes me feel old when I see that. She sounds like she's a really old lady. 50's not old. I think our listeners would kind of... agree to that i'm hoping. 00:43:40 Speaker 2: I've got a friend who's 45 yeah and she's got or maybe 46 she's got two grandkids yeah yeah like and she's tiff sage. 00:43:53 Speaker 5: Anyway and i'm still waiting for my cans to grow. 00:43:57 Speaker 2: Well i don't know that i don't know that you're Using your words, not my words. I don't know that your cans are going to grow. I think the best you can hope for is bigger pecs. 00:44:08 Speaker 5: I've got that covered. 00:44:10 Speaker 2: I'm working on it. 00:44:13 Speaker 1: Yeah. 00:44:13 Speaker 2: No, I think your body's very functional, Tiff. I'm going to say that. I think that's about as much as I can comment. But it is very strong and very functional and I wouldn't complain. 00:44:26 Speaker 3: Yeah. 00:44:27 Speaker 2: Patrick, where do you want to lead us next on your little technical adventure? 00:44:31 Speaker 3: Down the rabbit hole, probably. Look, here's a warning. I buy a lot of stuff online. I find it easy to shop online. I find it convenient to shop online. If I want to get stuff tomorrow, even living in a rural area, it's really handy. But ASIC has launched a warning to basically anybody who's buying online that There are some websites out there that are actually fake websites. And I did this the other day. I was looking for something online, a fountain pen that I've misplaced. Why does she laugh at me when I just say one word? Man, she's having a, yeah, anyway. 00:45:09 Speaker 1: It's not 1958. That's why. A fountain pen. 00:45:14 Speaker 2: There's a beautiful rotary. I just misplaced it. They're near my hush puppies in my pipe somewhere. 00:45:22 Speaker 3: So I was on a train once and I had this fountain pen called a Rotaring Freeway Fountain Pen. It was made in the early 2000s. Anyway, it's a really nice fountain. It's 20 years old. 00:45:34 Speaker 2: Tiff, can you hear that sound? It's the sound of listeners turning off. 00:45:39 Speaker 5: Fleeing. 00:45:40 Speaker 2: It's people running the other way. You know when you start a sentence with I had a fountain pen once? 00:45:48 Speaker 4: It's the complete opposite of what Patrick's supposed to bring to the table here. 00:45:53 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 00:45:55 Speaker 2: You know how podcasts work, right, and engaging listeners. 00:45:58 Speaker 3: Yeah, wait a minute. There is a story here that has relevance, right? 00:46:01 Speaker 2: Can you get there quicker? 00:46:03 Speaker 3: So I lost a fountain pen on a train when it rolled off my lap into a gap between the seat and the actual bolts that bolt the seat to the V-line train. 00:46:14 Speaker 1: Oh, I didn't realise it was going to get this good. 00:46:17 Speaker 3: Yeah. Someone out there is going to empathise with me, you bastards. 00:46:24 Speaker 2: Anyway. I would have stuck around if I knew it was going to be this. Is that Hollywood calling? 00:46:32 Speaker 3: Yep. 00:46:34 Speaker 2: Yeah, we can make it into a movie, sure. Just email Patrick. 00:46:38 Speaker 3: What would you call it, you reckon? What would you call it? 00:46:41 Speaker 1: Oh, fucking. 00:46:41 Speaker 3: History of the missing fountain pen. 00:46:43 Speaker 2: I tell you what, for all those people who have got, what's that thing where you can't sleep? Insomnia. I can just record this, record this and just press play. 00:46:56 Speaker 3: You want me to finish the story or do you want to go on to something else? 00:46:58 Speaker 2: Of course, of course. 00:47:01 Speaker 3: I don't want to bore our, you know, anyway. So I've been looking to try to replace the fountain pen,

but it's a 20-year-old fountain pen. And I've been online looking and looking and looking for it. And I went to a website. It's like, oh, fountain pen, old stock, basically brand new. So I jumped into AI and I said, is this a legitimate website? They came back, no, the website hasn't been up long. The specials are too dodgy. And it effectively did what I would have done as due diligence. But the reality of it is there are a lot of scam websites out there. And I know the adage, if it's too good to be true, it's too good to be true. But ASIC's coming out and saying that there are very, very good looking websites that are very easy to fool people where they get you to make a purchase where you think I'm getting a real bargain. And the reality of it is you're not getting a bargain because you're never going to get your items. You're going to pay for it and it's never going to land. So this is now quite regularly happening to the point where ASIC's come out. The ASIC commissioner, Alan Kirkland, has come out and said we need to be really careful if we're shopping online. So stick with the legitimate processes. But also when you make payments for anything online... If you're using, say, PayPal, that has quite a robust cash back if something goes wrong. If you're with your credit card company, that sort of thing. So be aware of how you make those payments as well. And if you're saving that credit card information, does the website store that as well? So even though it may seem semi-legitimate, but once it's stored, it's in a database somewhere. And if their database gets hacked, then all your credit card information can't goes with it as well so they're the things you need to be looking out. 00:48:47 Speaker 2: For i think for the average punter it is it is a minefield because i mean i i wouldn't know how to pick it like if it looked legit and it functioned seemingly legitimately and all the products look real and the whatever the payment gateway seems legit and i wouldn't i wouldn't know One of. 00:49:12 Speaker 3: The things you can do is you can do a search to find out when the domain name was registered. So through AI, you can do that as well. If you just jump in and say, do the search. Is this a legitimate website? and that can be one way of doing it. But I think that adage gets thrown around a lot. If it's too good to be true, it's too good to be true. If you've got a ticket item that's worth $ 1, 000 and they're selling it for $ 150, you've got to ask yourself, this seems like it's way too good to be true. But there's lots of scams on Facebook Marketplace, on secondhand sales sites, and the reality of that is you just don't hand over the money until you've got the item or you're able to connect with the person who's selling it, and that way you're assured of getting the item. But being diligent online is something you've just got to really make plans for. All right. 00:50:01 Speaker 1: Give us one more. Give us your best. 00:50:04 Speaker 2: You've got in your little bloody bag of tricks. 00:50:07 Speaker 3: We were talking about, I mean, it's not a good story, but it's an interesting story in terms of SUVs. Some data that's come out, this is a story in the ABC a couple of weeks ago, and it seems that women and children are face a disproportionately higher risk from larger and larger vehicles being on our roads. So the size of vehicles has gotten bigger and bigger. You know, drive to a primary school one day at the end of the day, and people are driving bigger and bigger SUVs. Now, the issue seems to be that even though, you know, most of the time car accidents are being reduced with all this great technology, but as vehicles have got bigger... Pedestrians are now in a situation where there's more pedestrian fatalities. And there's a couple of reasons for this because the impact zone on a really big vehicle means that if you hit somebody, you're more likely to have head trauma when you get hit by a large vehicle. than you are getting hit by a smaller vehicle, which is not a good thing, but it's a reality. And the most at risk are children and women because by stature, women tend to be smaller than men. And the interesting thing I was reading in this article is when people are in these massive big SUVs and they are quite large, they can see really well off into the distance, but the vehicle could actually obstruct pedestrians that are close by. And that's a real concern. So this is, you know, and these are statistics that have been looked at, the road safety researchers and urban transport planning and all that sort of stuff. I think some of this research was done in Belgium and it involved 300,000 casualties. So these are people, real instances, and the correlation was it seems like larger vehicles are causing more harm to pedestrians than smaller vehicles. Yeah. 00:52:01 Speaker 2: Well, you think about it, Patrick, if somebody your size, your height, like back in the old days, or even like with your Nissan NX, let's say you walked up to the front of that and you stood sideways and you put your leg against it. 00:52:17 Speaker 1: It wouldn't even come up to your hip. It would come up to kind of mid-thigh, right? 00:52:21 Speaker 3: Yeah, absolutely. 00:52:23 Speaker 4: Right? 00:52:23 Speaker 2: Now compare that to some of the utes where it's as high as your shoulder, like the front bonnet area. So if you stand in front of that, whereas in the old days on a normal car with a normal bonnet, you would just probably go over it and a lot of you wouldn't be impacted the same way, whereas in some of those great big SUVs where the top of the bonnet is shoulder height Yeah, so that's not surprising and it's probably not going to reverse that trend anytime soon because I think it is an interesting thing, just the fascination or obsession that urban dwellers have with gigantic cars that can drive over fucking river crossings and they never leave the urban kind of landscape. 00:53:16 Speaker

1: Like they spend their life on bitumen. 00:53:18 Speaker 2: Yeah. 00:53:18 Speaker 3: Living in a rural area, I know lots of people who tow– trailers for horses they collect firewood they need a tow barn they need a big vehicle they go a little bit of off-road and let's face it the state of the roads in Victoria is so bad I think almost everybody has an argument for needing that's valid so maybe they do need it even going and picking up the school the kids after school you need a four-wheel drive to get there and back at the moment but but it is a valid point that you know are they for purpose are they fit for purpose I don't know how people can afford to pay all that money for diesel and fuel. When you think of the gas guzzling, the bigger the vehicle, it stands to reason the more it's going to cost in terms of fuel. I know you laughed at me a few episodes before where I was saying how I was really watching my driving and I think I was saving myself $ 5 and you just laughed at me because... Yeah, anyway. 00:54:15 Speaker 2: What were you doing, like coasting down the hills or something? 00:54:20 Speaker 3: If I go from Blan's at 300 metres. 00:54:22 Speaker 1: Notice how his voice gets higher straight away. 00:54:24 Speaker 3: I would be the worst person in a court case, wouldn't I? There's no way that I could. If I was being charged, facial recognition aside, there's no way you're going to convict me. 00:54:38 Speaker 2: You go straight from tenor to soprano. 00:54:41 Speaker 3: Yeah. I have a very good vocal range. I can sing. Yeah, anyway, I don't think that was a good thing, was it? I wasn't really defending myself in any way. But that said. 00:54:50 Speaker 2: Tiff, can you give him the TYP shovel and he can maybe dig himself out? Yeah. 00:54:58 Speaker 3: Oh, I thought it was to pick up the crap. 00:55:00 Speaker 2: The shovel. 00:55:01 Speaker 3: I need a shovel, not a doggy bag. I need a shovel. 00:55:04 Speaker 1: I thought you said the crab then. 00:55:06 Speaker 3: No, the crab. 00:55:07 Speaker 1: Not the crab, the crap. 00:55:09 Speaker 3: Yeah, the crab. Oh. 00:55:10 Speaker 1: Oh, we're all over the shop, aren't we? 00:55:12 Speaker 3: We are, aren't we? 00:55:13 Speaker 2: Who's the crab? 00:55:14 Speaker 3: Who's the crab? 00:55:14 Speaker 2: Patrick, where can people connect with you and follow you? I don't know that they're going to want to this week, but that's okay. 00:55:20 Speaker 3: We could talk fountain pens. Hey, I'll tell you what. If you have a fountain pen and you love fountain pens like I do, let me know what fountain pen you're using and just message me at websitesnow.com.au, websitesnow.com.au, and let me know what your favorite fountain pen is. Is it a Waterman? Maybe you've got a Montblanc. A Montblanc could be a nice pair. 00:55:43 Speaker 2: Just open the floodgates on that. 00:55:45 Speaker 1: Yeah. 00:55:45 Speaker 2: Wow. 00:55:46 Speaker 3: Do you reckon anybody will message me? 00:55:48 Speaker 2: No. 00:55:48 Speaker 3: No. Do we have a bet? Can we have a bet? What do we have a bet, Tiff? I reckon we should have a bet. What are we going to bet? Come put your money where your mouth is, Craig. I think that we have listeners who use fountain pens. 00:56:01 Speaker 2: I was going to say something inappropriate and hilarious, and you two would have laughed your asses off, but no, no. 00:56:09 Speaker 1: I'll tell you what the bet is off air, but I can't tell you on air. 00:56:12 Speaker 2: Oh. 00:56:13 Speaker 1: Tiff, enjoy your trip to Queensland. 00:56:16 Speaker 5: Thank you so much. 00:56:18 Speaker 2: Are you getting on stage and speaking or are. 00:56:20 Speaker 1: You just up there schmoozing? 00:56:21 Speaker 5: No, no, I'm just schmoozing. 00:56:23 Speaker 4: I'm just schmoozing and sitting up the back being disruptive. 00:56:29 Speaker 2: That's you. That's you. 00:56:31 Speaker 3: Yes. 00:56:33 Speaker 1: Patrick, websites now, tell us. 00:56:37 Speaker 3: If you use a fountain pen, just contact me, websitesnow.com.au. And just send a message. Just let me know what fountain pen you use and how much you love it. 00:56:47 Speaker 2: That's it? That's all you want to shout out today? Yeah. 00:56:50 Speaker 3: Oh, it's Pink Up the Land at the moment. That's been fun. I've been raising money for the McGrath Foundation, a whole month of pink activities. What do you reckon they invited me? I was in a fashion show last week, Craig. 00:57:02 Speaker 1: Were you? 00:57:03 Speaker 3: Yeah. Upshot fashion show. It was great. I got $ 20 for my first outfit and $ 50 for the second outfit. 00:57:09 Speaker 1: Please stop. 00:57:12 Speaker 3: Just look up Pink Up Berlin and you can see the photos. 00:57:15 Speaker 2: Or don't. Or don't. 00:57:16 Speaker 1: Everyone, I formally apologise. 00:57:20 Speaker 2: Patrick, Tiff, I don't even want to say thanks. 00:57:24 Speaker 1: Just see you next time. 00:57:26 Speaker 5: See you. 00:57:27 Speaker 3: Will there be a next time?