บทถอดความฉบับเต็มของ Property as Protagonists with Louise Candlish

00:03:13,500 Thank you so much, guys. 91 00:03:13,640 --> 00:03:17,860 We're accumulating a huge bank of cool extra stuff in there. 92 00:03:17,960 --> 00:03:19,300 Every year, I guess we have on the show, 93 00:03:19,300 --> 00:03:21,880 So it does an extra question that we drop in the Patreon there. 94 00:03:21,930 --> 00:03:26,640 So if you want to get on the building and be part of that, it's a very small subscription. 95 00:03:27,060 --> 00:03:27,900 It's $3 a month. 96 00:03:28,060 --> 00:03:28,240 That's it. 97 00:03:28,340 --> 00:03:29,200 $3 a month. 98 00:03:29,270 --> 00:03:30,160 Not a show a month. 99 00:03:30,600 --> 00:03:33,640 That's it, people, and you get plenty of extra stuff. 100 00:03:33,800 --> 00:03:34,580 So it's good fun. 101 00:03:34,680 --> 00:03:35,100 Go over there. 102 00:03:35,520 --> 00:03:37,120 Check it out at Patreon.com. 103 00:03:37,660 --> 00:03:43,800 Our guest today is the marvelous Louise Gantlisch, who's a huge bass seller over in the UK. 104 00:03:44,360 --> 00:03:47,640 She's a major force here in the US as well. 105 00:03:47,860 --> 00:03:51,380 She has several books up and made into TV shows back in the UK. 106 00:03:52,340 --> 00:03:54,140 And we're looking forward to chatting with her. 107 00:03:54,140 --> 00:03:57,460 But first, we have a listening question from our recent guest, JT Ellison. 108 00:03:59,720 --> 00:04:01,500 Welcome again, JT Ellison. 109 00:04:01,700 --> 00:04:05,440 Thanks for coming back and just asking us our listener question this week. 110 00:04:05,560 --> 00:04:06,020 It's been great. 111 00:04:06,370 --> 00:04:08,140 Well, I'm not going to ask you where you get your ideas. 112 00:04:08,820 --> 00:04:08,980 Okay. 113 00:04:10,760 --> 00:04:11,720 I'm going to ask you. 114 00:04:11,720 --> 00:04:13,380 Most of the time, they come off of bathroom walls. 115 00:04:13,610 --> 00:04:14,440 So, sister. 116 00:04:15,299 --> 00:04:16,840 1-900, call Doug. 117 00:04:18,599 --> 00:04:19,079 (laughing) 118 00:04:23,660 --> 00:04:25,940 - I get mine from a sub-stack called the creative edge. 119 00:04:26,340 --> 00:04:27,900 - No, excellent, well done. 120 00:04:29,420 --> 00:04:34,240 So my question is, if you could only read one book 121 00:04:34,400 --> 00:04:35,860 for the rest of your life, what would it be? 122 00:04:36,060 --> 00:04:36,680 - Oh, shit. 123 00:04:37,919 --> 00:04:39,940 Oh, that's a really good question. 124 00:04:39,940 --> 00:04:40,400 - Oh, wow. 125 00:04:41,020 --> 00:04:42,380 - That's a good question right there. 126 00:04:42,820 --> 00:04:43,960 Jonathan Livingston Seagull. 127 00:04:45,000 --> 00:04:46,940 - Oh, now that's an excellent book. 128 00:04:47,500 --> 00:04:48,200 That made me cry. 129 00:04:48,740 --> 00:04:50,520 That's like the first book I think that ever made me cry. 130 00:04:51,020 --> 00:04:53,340 - Ah, I'm gonna go with the Mark Twain 131 00:04:53,340 --> 00:04:54,860 and probably pick Huckleberry Finn, 132 00:04:55,140 --> 00:04:57,540

but 'cause it's got a little bit of good moments 133 00:04:57,700 --> 00:05:01,560 and not all down, not all up, 134 00:05:01,780 --> 00:05:03,720 but that's a good question 'cause I'm not sure. 135 00:05:03,820 --> 00:05:04,260 There's a lot. 136 00:05:04,460 --> 00:05:05,700 I was like, I ran through a whole list. 137 00:05:05,780 --> 00:05:07,140 I'm like, yeah, I don't know if I'm gonna read 138 00:05:07,200 --> 00:05:08,460 that more than four times, so. 139 00:05:08,840 --> 00:05:09,620 - Yeah, yeah. 140 00:05:09,780 --> 00:05:10,980 Okay, JT, what do you got? 141 00:05:11,080 --> 00:05:11,420 What's yours? 142 00:05:12,320 --> 00:05:12,840 - Fourth wing. 143 00:05:13,320 --> 00:05:14,720 I'm gonna just wanna escape. 144 00:05:15,220 --> 00:05:20,720 I want to, if I'm stuck reading something over and over again, I want, I want a big set piece, 145 00:05:20,900 --> 00:05:26,160 which that has, it has a good romance, it has a good lesson, it's got a bunch of reversals 146 00:05:26,240 --> 00:05:28,940 in it and love and death and all kinds of stuff. 147 00:05:29,320 --> 00:05:31,160 I'm a huge Romantic fan right now. 148 00:05:31,360 --> 00:05:31,900 It's really fun. 149 00:05:32,240 --> 00:05:33,860 Oh, cool, cool, cool, cool. 150 00:05:34,460 --> 00:05:36,420 All right, Doug, what's the first book that made you cry? 151 00:05:36,860 --> 00:05:37,520 Oh, shoot. 152 00:05:38,920 --> 00:05:39,600 I do not know. 153 00:05:40,260 --> 00:05:41,260 Mine was the dictionary. 154 00:05:42,280 --> 00:05:43,100 My dad hit me with it. 155 00:05:46,660 --> 00:05:47,100 (laughing) 156 00:05:47,900 --> 00:05:49,440 - Oh my gosh. 157 00:05:51,540 --> 00:05:52,940 - Wow, we teed that one up. 158 00:05:53,340 --> 00:05:54,480 - You did, you did. 159 00:05:55,000 --> 00:05:55,920 That was nice. 160 00:05:56,880 --> 00:05:58,720 - I ain't scared to swing if you're gonna tear that. 161 00:05:59,840 --> 00:06:01,860 All right, JT, thank you very much. 162 00:06:02,120 --> 00:06:03,460 I'm sure you're regretting it at this point, 163 00:06:03,560 --> 00:06:05,320 but thank you very much for coming back 164 00:06:05,400 --> 00:06:06,840 with a list of the question, we appreciate it. 165 00:06:07,280 --> 00:06:08,760 - Oh, no, this has been great. 166 00:06:12,920 --> 00:06:15,900 Louise, welcome to the show. Thank you so much for joining us. How are you? 167 00:06:16,480 --> 00:06:20,440 I'm really well. Thank you. It's a bit sticky in South London where I am right 168 00:06:20,520 --> 00:06:22,280 now, but otherwise good. 169 00:06:22,720 --> 00:06:23,520 Define sticky. 170 00:06:25,300 --> 00:06:25,480 Yeah. 171 00:06:25,940 --> 00:06:27,360 We should get you over here in 10c. 172 00:06:27,540 --> 00:06:30,980 I live in the tropics, so give us your sticky ocean. 173 00:06:31,240 --> 00:06:33,540 Okay. Sticky is when you don't have aircon. 174 00:06:34,140 --> 00:06:34,300 Yeah. 175 00:06:34,900 --> 00:06:39,679 That's all I need to say. There's no aircon in London or very little and 176 00:06:39,680 --> 00:06:45,140 Definitely not in houses. So, you know, you're just walking around all sweaty. So it's really horrible 177 00:06:45,340 --> 00:06:50,720 But actually the temperature, you know, the outside temperatures probably, you know, you guys would would snare it 178 00:06:51,020 --> 00:06:54,900 It's near it such a low a low number, but for us, it's terrible 179 00:06:55,260 --> 00:07:01,320 That's what people don't kind of get about the UK and we were over at a conference in London a couple of months ago 180 00:07:01,860 --> 00:07:04,240 And then we were there between the two big heat waves 181 00:07:05,480 --> 00:07:07,359 I was there in the heat 182 00:07:07,640 --> 00:07:13,420 Yeah, I stayed and everybody was like miserable for that little bit or like I mean they were like oh, it's so hot 183 00:07:13,560 --> 00:07:14,260 Yeah 184 00:07:16,020 --> 00:07:18,740 Definitely about the air con. I think that you know 185 00:07:18,860 --> 00:07:21,820 It's absolutely fine if you know you can escape it 186 00:07:22,360 --> 00:07:27,660 But it's when there's no escape at night and you can't sleep but you know, it's it's you know, it's not too bad 187 00:07:27,880 --> 00:07:32,359 It's that we're coming out of it now. I think do they not have window units in the UK 188 00:07:33,360 --> 00:07:36,760 I'll say, "Man, we need to, oh, we should be starting shipping those over there, Nick. 189 00:07:36,770 --> 00:07:37,660 We can make a fortune." 190 00:07:37,660 --> 00:07:38,980 Yeah, yeah, definitely. 191 00:07:39,360 --> 00:07:40,300 No, there's none of that. 192 00:07:40,960 --> 00:07:47,180 Bizarrely, some of the train lines and buses, you will get some nice cool air, but not so 193 00:07:47,240 --> 00:07:47,920 much in buildings. 194 00:07:48,620 --> 00:07:52,880 Yeah, those portable AC units are brilliant, where you just run the duct to the window. 195 00:07:53,200 --> 00:07:53,940 They work really well. 196 00:07:54,120 --> 00:07:57,780 So if you find any of those over there, that would be the thing to start importing that 197 00:07:57,900 --> 00:07:58,040 dog. 198 00:07:58,220 --> 00:07:59,220 Oh, that's a good tip. 199 00:07:59,500 --> 00:08:02,080 Yeah, thank you, because I think this is going to happen again. 200 00:08:02,280 --> 00:08:04,360 I don't think this is going to be the last hot summer. 201 00:08:04,780 --> 00:08:04,920 Yeah. 202 00:08:05,320 --> 00:08:07,740 It's going to keep getting hotter, unfortunately, the way we're going. 203 00:08:08,080 --> 00:08:09,420 So yeah, it's just great. 204 00:08:09,560 --> 00:08:13,180 Candlesh Industries will go like holistic, make millions, 205 00:08:13,599 --> 00:08:15,240 importing portable aircon into. 206 00:08:15,460 --> 00:08:17,200 Hey, that is not that hard. 207 00:08:17,400 --> 00:08:18,600 I mean, don't joke. 208 00:08:18,760 --> 00:08:20,860 This time next year, there'll be no book to discuss. 209 00:08:21,100 --> 00:08:24,420 There'll be

a billion dollar business. 210 00:08:25,380 --> 00:08:27,900 And in fact, at this point, we'll just thank you for coming on the show 211 00:08:27,950 --> 00:08:30,000 and talking about English weather, which is what we'll do. 212 00:08:30,160 --> 00:08:31,580 And that was it, folks. 213 00:08:31,880 --> 00:08:33,599 All right, everybody tune out right there. 214 00:08:33,659 --> 00:08:34,099 It's perfect. 215 00:08:34,919 --> 00:08:36,620 We wouldn't be English if we didn't talk about the weather. 216 00:08:36,760 --> 00:08:38,620 All right, let's talk about some books, Louise. 217 00:08:39,020 --> 00:08:40,219 So give us a little bit of background 218 00:08:40,380 --> 00:08:41,479 on how you got started in writing 219 00:08:41,510 --> 00:08:42,500 and when you were first published. 220 00:08:43,440 --> 00:08:44,780 - Well, I was first published. 221 00:08:44,900 --> 00:08:47,860 I was in my early 30s and I had just gone traveling. 222 00:08:48,400 --> 00:08:49,260 I'd taken a sabbatical. 223 00:08:49,360 --> 00:08:51,520 I was a copywriter and advertising copywriter 224 00:08:52,560 --> 00:08:53,800 and needed a break. 225 00:08:54,300 --> 00:08:56,760 So I took a couple of months off and went to Sicily. 226 00:08:57,460 --> 00:09:00,580 And no sooner had I been on my own for, you know, 227 00:09:00,800 --> 00:09:06,640 day or two than, you know, I was bored because I was just so used to working. So I started 228 00:09:06,740 --> 00:09:12,800 writing a novel and I wrote a kind of, you know, very slim first draft in the couple 229 00:09:12,900 --> 00:09:17,760 of months that I was away, set in Sicily. So it was very inspired by the traveling 230 00:09:18,540 --> 00:09:24,000 odyssey that I was on. And when I came back, I typed it up, I made it a bit longer and 231 00:09:24,040 --> 00:09:29,900 then I sent it to Agents and that was published, that book, that was my first book. So it was, 232 00:09:30,200 --> 00:09:31,680 It couldn't have been easier. 233 00:09:32,140 --> 00:09:33,680 I was going to say, that's like it. 234 00:09:34,020 --> 00:09:35,020 It's not the usual. 235 00:09:35,960 --> 00:09:37,080 That's what you'll find. 236 00:09:37,520 --> 00:09:37,960 I know. 237 00:09:40,840 --> 00:09:42,860 Just look around, feel inspired. 238 00:09:43,350 --> 00:09:46,300 But I will say though that when it came out, it was, you know, 239 00:09:46,720 --> 00:09:50,460 a baptism of fire because the editor who had acquired the book 240 00:09:50,570 --> 00:09:52,040 and, you know, had this fairy tale start, 241 00:09:52,440 --> 00:09:56,020 she was fired a couple of weeks after she made the acquisition. 242 00:09:56,400 --> 00:10:01,140 And, you know, I wouldn't say that the team were quite so enthused about it and it bombed 243 00:10:01,300 --> 00:10:02,460 and it was quite upsetting. 244 00:10:03,080 --> 00:10:06,580 And then when that book deal ended, they didn't want to renew it. 245 00:10:07,080 --> 00:10:10,820 So it kind of, it's, it's felt like

it started like a dream. 246 00:10:11,280 --> 00:10:14,660 But quite quickly, you know, I was back down to earth with a bump. 247 00:10:14,720 --> 00:10:18,120 And, you know, since then I've had such a roller coaster of a career that, you know, 248 00:10:18,220 --> 00:10:22,720 I'm actually quite grateful for that start because it made me realize that you just cannot 249 00:10:22,920 --> 00:10:23,740 believe the dream. 250 00:10:24,200 --> 00:10:28,560 You are only as good as your last book and your last sales figures and your last reviews 251 00:10:29,240 --> 00:10:31,940 and you just cannot be believing your own publicity. 252 00:10:32,320 --> 00:10:34,720 There is no sitting back on your laurels after you. 253 00:10:34,760 --> 00:10:35,000 No. 254 00:10:35,400 --> 00:10:36,400 You've got to keep working. 255 00:10:36,800 --> 00:10:40,420 Yeah, I mean it's disappointing because I would have loved to be resting on my laurels 256 00:10:40,580 --> 00:10:40,860 by now. 257 00:10:40,880 --> 00:10:41,920 That would be nice. 258 00:10:42,460 --> 00:10:43,540 It would be fabulous. 259 00:10:43,910 --> 00:10:46,940 I think I'd be really good at resting on my laurels as well. 260 00:10:47,120 --> 00:10:49,960 I think resting on my laurels is what I was called to do. 261 00:10:50,030 --> 00:10:52,060 I think that was like, you know, God put me in this sort of feeling. 262 00:10:52,080 --> 00:10:53,960 I think I'm just gonna let him rest on his laurels. 263 00:10:54,280 --> 00:10:56,360 - Absolutely. - He just didn't give me enough 264 00:10:56,460 --> 00:10:58,840 laurels to really rest on, so that was part of my problem. 265 00:10:58,960 --> 00:11:00,840 - I can't find my laurels. - We need it on our gravestones. 266 00:11:01,050 --> 00:11:02,220 - You can't find your laurels? 267 00:11:02,260 --> 00:11:04,180 - Yeah, who stole my laurels? 268 00:11:04,520 --> 00:11:05,140 I have no laurels. 269 00:11:05,860 --> 00:11:07,220 - That's the problem for all of us. 270 00:11:07,340 --> 00:11:08,320 Where are the laurels? 271 00:11:09,040 --> 00:11:10,060 - Where are the laurels? 272 00:11:10,740 --> 00:11:11,360 - That's a t-shirt. 273 00:11:11,560 --> 00:11:13,280 Every show we come up with a new t-shirt. 274 00:11:13,560 --> 00:11:15,560 - No, we gotta... - All right, all right. 275 00:11:15,680 --> 00:11:19,280 So, a neighbor's guide to murder is your new release, 276 00:11:19,460 --> 00:11:21,000 which is not a new release in the UK. 277 00:11:21,160 --> 00:11:27,460 about a year ago to great success. But it is a new release in the US, just came out in July, 278 00:11:27,550 --> 00:11:33,900 I believe. So first of all, why the long gap? They have to translate it. They have to translate it. 279 00:11:33,900 --> 00:11:38,600 Oh, they have to translate it. Yeah, that long Americanization process. 280 00:11:39,700 --> 00:11:45,220 Take all the views out. It's not uncommon for me, actually, and I think a lot of writers, 281 00:11:45,380 --> 00:11:51,140 if you

don't have an established relationship with an American publisher, then you're likely 282 00:11:51,140 --> 00:11:57,520 to have a staggered publication. So I think we were still submitting the book to US publishers 283 00:11:58,279 --> 00:12:02,400 when, I'm trying to remember the timeline actually because you know there've been so many books and 284 00:12:02,440 --> 00:12:07,040 so many publishers but I think we were still submitting it when the book was already edited 285 00:12:07,360 --> 00:12:12,820 and finished and about to come out in the UK. So inevitably there was going to be at least a year's 286 00:12:12,880 --> 00:12:18,900 lag and you know I was really pleased to get a new publisher in Grand Central and we did a new 287 00:12:18,900 --> 00:12:23,580 edit actually. And what I'm learning with my books is because they have quite a lot of social 288 00:12:23,760 --> 00:12:29,200 commentary, a little bit of politics in there. There's different sensibilities in the US. So, 289 00:12:29,480 --> 00:12:35,340 you know, a few, a few bits had to be cut. Actually, it was a really fantastic edit. My US 290 00:12:35,520 --> 00:12:39,800 edited a fantastic editor. I was really pleased with it. So yeah, by the time it comes out, 291 00:12:39,900 --> 00:12:45,300 it's a year later, it's quite weird to be talking about a book for so long. I think that's the main 292 00:12:45,300 --> 00:12:49,180 thing because in that time I have done all sorts of other different projects. 293 00:12:49,760 --> 00:12:55,660 And so it's about kind of sustaining the enthusiasm really and just kind of keeping up to date 294 00:12:55,820 --> 00:12:57,120 with that original book. 295 00:12:57,510 --> 00:13:00,920 Because it's so, I mean I will forget characters names and I'll forget things. 296 00:13:00,940 --> 00:13:04,760 I would say does that mean forgetting things because I forget everything from my previous 297 00:13:04,880 --> 00:13:05,060 books. 298 00:13:05,520 --> 00:13:06,680 Yeah, no absolutely. 299 00:13:06,990 --> 00:13:11,600 I mean before doing something like this I will remind myself I'll do a little refresher 300 00:13:11,800 --> 00:13:14,060 update on what are the themes of this book. 301 00:13:14,700 --> 00:13:19,740 have people responded to? Because otherwise, my head is just filled with more recent projects. 302 00:13:19,920 --> 00:13:24,660 So that's the tricky thing. I think keeping it current in your own creative space. 303 00:13:25,300 --> 00:13:32,040 Right. Interesting. So is there anything you do different for or you think about differently 304 00:13:32,340 --> 00:13:37,280 when it's launched to the UK audience versus the US audience? Do you feel like you have 305 00:13:37,280 --> 00:13:39,900 to present things in a slightly different way to the two audiences? 306 00:13:40,300 --> 00:13:45,820 Well, I think as I'm so much better known in the UK, there's a lot of shorthand. 307 00:13:46,100 --> 00:13:49,720 Readers already know me, I'll do events and people will already have read my books and 308 00:13:49,760 --> 00:13:51,160 be familiar with my work. 309 00:13:51,640 --> 00:13:56,220 But in the US, I'm not well known, so I need to go back to basics and say, "This is the 310 00:13:56,240 --> 00:13:57,380 type of book I'm writing. 311 00:13:57,760 --> 00:14:00,220 These are the ingredients you'll find in my books." 312 00:14:00,240 --> 00:14:03,900 There's lots of them to dip into, should you like this one. 313 00:14:05,340 --> 00:14:10,420 I didn't have a book published in the US until our house, which was, I think, my 12th book, 314 00:14:10,690 --> 00:14:11,380 if I'm right. 315 00:14:11,550 --> 00:14:17,680 And so, you know, it was celebrated as a debut, a very accomplished debut, funnily enough, 316 00:14:17,820 --> 00:14:21,120 having, you know, 11 books worth of experience behind me. 317 00:14:21,120 --> 00:14:23,440 I kind of knew what I was doing, finally. 318 00:14:24,180 --> 00:14:29,660 It's much more about not presuming any knowledge of my work, whereas I can make that sort of 319 00:14:29,740 --> 00:14:30,900 assumption here in the UK. 320 00:14:31,240 --> 00:14:35,540 So then for our listeners who are meeting your neighbor's guide to murder fresh, why don't 321 00:14:35,540 --> 00:14:39,580 you give us a little setup like what pulls wind into her neighbor's lies and where does 322 00:14:39,580 --> 00:14:40,540 it start to go wrong? 323 00:14:40,980 --> 00:14:41,420 Absolutely. 324 00:14:41,610 --> 00:14:47,020 So it's domestic suspense and I'm known as a sort of queen of suburban noir here in the 325 00:14:47,060 --> 00:14:53,360 UK and generally there will be a beautiful property involved or you know an extremely 326 00:14:53,860 --> 00:14:55,900 powerful sort of domestic setting. 327 00:14:56,380 --> 00:15:01,100 So in this book there is a lovely building called Columbia Mansions, a mansion block 328 00:15:01,280 --> 00:15:01,940 of apartments. 329 00:15:02,720 --> 00:15:07,080 And our narrator Gwen lives in one of them and she lives alone or she has been living 330 00:15:07,200 --> 00:15:07,400 alone. 331 00:15:07,540 --> 00:15:11,740 She's 70 years old so she's an unusually older narrator for me. 332 00:15:11,800 --> 00:15:14,660 I'm normally dealing with middle-aged, middle-class people. 333 00:15:15,220 --> 00:15:21,820 And she develops this very unlikely age gap friendship with the lodger to her neighbour. 334 00:15:22,060 --> 00:15:24,380 And so this young lady's called Pixie. 335 00:15:24,580 --> 00:15:31,000 in her 20s and they just hit it off as friends do and all should be well. 336 00:15:31,300 --> 00:15:36,760 That should be the end of the story but of course this is a thriller and we discovered 337 00:15:36,880 --> 00:15:45,140 that Gwen has all kinds of things in her past, regrets, secrets, traumas that lead her to behave 338 00:15:45,400 --> 00:15:52,339 with Pixie in an unusual way and pretty soon she gets involved in Pixie's relationship with her 339

00:15:52,340 --> 00:16:00,580 Landlord Alec. Let's just say she sort of overreaches and before you know it a scandal has erupted in the building and then as the 340 00:16:00,860 --> 00:16:03,160 title suggests a murder takes place. 341 00:16:03,500 --> 00:16:06,840 It's well titled and themed on a 342 00:16:07,750 --> 00:16:13,500 You know the only what it's the only murders in the building. Yes. Yes. I've never actually seen that show 343 00:16:13,660 --> 00:16:15,300 But I was brilliant. Yeah, is it? 344 00:16:16,660 --> 00:16:21,100 Yeah, it seems like there are parallels. I mean, my books are quite dark, I would say. 345 00:16:21,320 --> 00:16:28,100 You know, there is humor, but they're fairly bleak sometimes in theme. So, you know, the theme, 346 00:16:28,280 --> 00:16:33,840 one of the main themes in this book is the practice of sex for rent, which is, you know, 347 00:16:33,890 --> 00:16:39,500 a kind of not as well known as it should be. But, you know, in these days of rental crisis in 348 00:16:39,540 --> 00:16:44,659 capital cities and big cities and the shortage of properties, you know, that sometimes there's more 349 00:16:44,660 --> 00:16:49,120 more than money, changing hands for young people to get a roof over their head. 350 00:16:49,280 --> 00:16:51,040 So that was kind of my starting point. 351 00:16:51,840 --> 00:16:54,320 But, you know, there's all kinds of other stuff in the mix as well. 352 00:16:55,360 --> 00:16:57,520 And now a quick word from this episode's sponsor. 353 00:16:57,790 --> 00:17:02,520 At what turns a good manuscript into a career defining bestseller, Elisa James sits down 354 00:17:02,600 --> 00:17:07,579 with her editor, Carrie Farron, a VP of gallery books, Simon and Schuster, at Author Nation 355 00:17:07,800 --> 00:17:11,780 to pull back the curtain on the editorial partnership between decades of bestselling 356 00:17:12,020 --> 00:17:14,220 fiction only at Author Nation.Live. 357 00:17:14,540 --> 00:17:15,560 Now we'll get back to the show. 358 00:17:16,620 --> 00:17:21,380 Okay, we'll come back to some of the crafty stuff that you touched on there in a bit. 359 00:17:21,410 --> 00:17:26,980 But let's talk about, you had, as you mentioned, Our House was what your 12th book, you had 360 00:17:26,980 --> 00:17:30,860 a whole run of books before that, but you were writing in a slightly different genre, 361 00:17:31,060 --> 00:17:31,120 right? 362 00:17:31,200 --> 00:17:32,480 There was a definite switch. 363 00:17:33,040 --> 00:17:34,140 So talk about that a little bit. 364 00:17:34,460 --> 00:17:37,080 They were relationship dramas, is that right to say? 365 00:17:37,200 --> 00:17:41,460 And I think it's the sudden departure of the phrases was maybe the first one that moved 366 00:17:41,560 --> 00:17:42,740 to the suspense? 367 00:17:43,200 --> 00:17:48,160 Yeah, or maybe, yeah, I mean, it's really, it's quite hard to talk about it because it 368 00:17:48,240 --> 00:17:49,000 wasn't deliberate. 369 00:17:49,110 --> 00:17:50,840 It wasn't a sort of conscious switching. 370 00:17:50,930 --> 00:17:57,460 If anything, it was a very gradual creep as darker elements started to find their way 371 00:17:57,640 --> 00:17:58,440 into my books. 372 00:17:59,040 --> 00:18:03,600 So I had a book, my fourth, was it my fourth book, possibly, or fifth book was called The 373 00:18:03,660 --> 00:18:04,460 Second Husband. 374 00:18:05,120 --> 00:18:06,920 And I would say that was pretty dark. 375 00:18:07,050 --> 00:18:11,980 And you know, I'm even talking about it now with TV people because it's very much in the 376 00:18:11,980 --> 00:18:18,580 sort of the mode of my more recent books that are being adapted. It's about a woman whose 377 00:18:19,160 --> 00:18:23,440 teenage daughter has a relationship with her new husband, so it's kind of got a 378 00:18:24,280 --> 00:18:30,200 lillita vibe, I suppose. And so I think those quite unsavory, dark elements have been there for 379 00:18:30,740 --> 00:18:35,180 much longer than people realise. But I think it was with a change of publisher, and I think, 380 00:18:35,350 --> 00:18:39,580 you know, listeners who are authors will recognise this, that sometimes it's when you change publisher 381 00:18:39,580 --> 00:18:44,300 that you are repositioned more formally in the market. And I think that's what happened 382 00:18:44,520 --> 00:18:49,660 with the sudden departure of the phrases. I had had books before that that were a bit 383 00:18:49,740 --> 00:18:54,840 darker. The Disappearance of Emily Ma, I would say, was one of them. But it wasn't 384 00:18:55,020 --> 00:19:00,740 till phrases that I think I was being positioned with reviewers and readers as someone who 385 00:19:00,780 --> 00:19:08,899 moved into the domestic noir sort of space. But from my point of view, I've never written 386 00:19:08,900 --> 00:19:11,360 consciously including any ingredients. 387 00:19:11,860 --> 00:19:14,260 I will always just write the story I want to write. 388 00:19:14,290 --> 00:19:16,500 And I've been really lucky that publishers have been 389 00:19:16,920 --> 00:19:18,280 quite flexible about that. 390 00:19:18,840 --> 00:19:22,500 It causes issues with branding and sort of getting 391 00:19:22,600 --> 00:19:26,940 a consistent brand look when one might be very hitch cocky 392 00:19:26,940 --> 00:19:29,340 and then the next one might be more like white lotus. 393 00:19:29,840 --> 00:19:32,480 But I do switch around a little bit and do what feels right 394 00:19:32,660 --> 00:19:34,100 for the story I want to tell. 395 00:19:34,420 --> 00:19:38,880 And interestingly, the US Publication of Neighbors Guide 396 00:19:38,880 --> 00:19:42,600 it's positioned it very much as something that could be a funny book. You know, it's 397 00:19:42,640 --> 00:19:48,280 got that kind of cartoony brand cover very much. I love. Yeah. And when you look at the 398 00:19:48,580 --> 00:19:54,440 British cover and I've just received in the post

today, the Dutch edition, it's very dark. 399 00:19:54,850 --> 00:19:59,820 You know, the Dutch one's super dark, you know, it could be vertigo or psycho or something. 400 00:19:59,940 --> 00:20:05,760 And then the British ones more generic property led. And then the American cover is, you know, 401 00:20:06,520 --> 00:20:11,240 going to have some giggles with this. Yeah, yeah. So, you know, so it's interesting. 402 00:20:11,320 --> 00:20:17,560 The Dutch are kind of dark anyway. So, we're just over here just la la la. 403 00:20:20,200 --> 00:20:24,800 Well, this is it. I mean, you know, the editors and the marketers, they know their market. So, 404 00:20:24,850 --> 00:20:29,460 well, I would never, ever interfere with an overseas market, the British market, 405 00:20:29,600 --> 00:20:34,820 I obviously know quite well. But yeah, so it wasn't a conscious switch. But, you know, 406 00:20:34,840 --> 00:20:41,500 I found myself suddenly invited to crime events and festivals and I'm really pleased because 407 00:20:41,600 --> 00:20:43,520 before that I hadn't done any events. 408 00:20:43,570 --> 00:20:46,000 There wasn't really a community that I was a part of. 409 00:20:46,330 --> 00:20:50,120 And so for all kinds of reasons, it's not least sales. 410 00:20:50,520 --> 00:20:54,140 It's been really good for me to go over to the dark side. 411 00:20:54,640 --> 00:20:58,820 I mean, obviously this repositioning, often people will talk about this genre change. 412 00:20:58,890 --> 00:21:04,159 You might leave your existing readers behind, but did you lose any of your previous audience 413 00:21:04,160 --> 00:21:09,180 any of this repositioning that you went through in genres or do you think that now that you've added 414 00:21:09,240 --> 00:21:13,900 the crime events that might have actually brought in more? I think that I think I've brought quite a 415 00:21:13,900 --> 00:21:19,660 few with me and interestingly you know on my social media I'll do a lot of you know on this day in 416 00:21:20,220 --> 00:21:26,380 you know 2008 or 2013 and you know this was the book that came out to to introduce new readers 417 00:21:26,940 --> 00:21:32,720 to my backlist because you know one of the things I've found with having had quite a long career 418 00:21:32,720 --> 00:21:37,460 is that you're always being propelled forwards. You're always talking about your current book 419 00:21:37,620 --> 00:21:42,700 or your next book. It's always about the next deal, how we're going to improve and 420 00:21:43,620 --> 00:21:49,240 smash new targets next time. And you never, ever look back. And so this year, I've actually taken 421 00:21:49,260 --> 00:21:55,220 a year off writing a book. And I'm focusing on TV projects, but I'm also focusing on my backlist 422 00:21:55,220 --> 00:22:01,600 and just always trying to reflect on everything I've achieved and bring some of those older books 423 00:22:01,600 --> 00:22:06,000 to audiences. And you know, my big thing is that I just would never want anyone to be misled. 424 00:22:06,400 --> 00:22:11,660 So if I say to someone, there's a reissue or there's a ebook deal on my first book, I'll always 425 00:22:11,920 --> 00:22:17,120 give a little bit of background, but of context, don't expect a twist. Don't expect a murder. This 426 00:22:17,220 --> 00:22:22,940 is just a fun romp. You know, you could read it on your son, Lange by the pool. And so it's really 427 00:22:23,100 --> 00:22:28,240 just about repositioning some of those older books. I've enjoyed that process of kind of almost 428 00:22:28,240 --> 00:22:33,240 taking control of my own backlist. I think a lot of times people forget about those backlists. 429 00:22:33,490 --> 00:22:37,860 We have those books out there and you probably want to keep selling them to keep making money off 430 00:22:37,960 --> 00:22:43,360 of what you've already done. So I think that's an important thing to consider is how to handle 431 00:22:43,500 --> 00:22:48,720 and manage your backlist. I think so and you need time because we're also time poor. We're all 432 00:22:48,780 --> 00:22:58,220 expected to do so much to help promote the current release. And there isn't that much time, but 433 00:22:58,220 --> 00:23:02,460 done that and it's, you know, I would really recommend it to other authors. It's really 434 00:23:02,540 --> 00:23:06,440 satisfying to take, stop and think, hang on a minute, those books were really good. You 435 00:23:06,440 --> 00:23:11,200 know, no one is talking about them now. So why don't I? Because they're good reads. 436 00:23:12,060 --> 00:23:17,480 As indie authors and we're series writers, it's the model. I mean, we're always promoting 437 00:23:17,840 --> 00:23:22,780 Book One and the new release. And then the idea is you're pulling people into Book One 438 00:23:22,880 --> 00:23:26,539 and then they read through the series. That's how you, the only way we get to return on 439 00:23:26,540 --> 00:23:29,340 investment is marketing book one and getting the read through. 440 00:23:29,720 --> 00:23:30,720 So it's the same for you. 441 00:23:30,920 --> 00:23:33,660 You're just, instead of selling a series, you're selling a brand, you're selling you, 442 00:23:33,820 --> 00:23:35,860 you're selling the type of stories that you write. 443 00:23:36,160 --> 00:23:37,580 Yeah, that's so interesting. 444 00:23:37,760 --> 00:23:41,680 I mean, I've always wondered about a series because it is such a risk and it's a risk 445 00:23:41,840 --> 00:23:48,320 for a traditional publisher to take one on because if you don't get that fantastic start 446 00:23:48,500 --> 00:23:54,080 and that engine going, then it's hard to then persuade people to buy book two, book three, 447 00:23:54,200 --> 00:23:54,740 book four. 448 00:23:55,380 --> 00:23:58,600 But yeah, but once you do get people hooked, then that's wonderful. 449 00:23:59,440 --> 00:24:04,540 So a lot of our listeners, fellow authors, were always weighing this idea of a genre

450 00:24:04,660 --> 00:24:04,840 switch. 451 00:24:05,040 --> 00:24:06,280 Maybe I should try this over here. 452 00:24:06,340 --> 00:24:07,480 Maybe I should move over there. 453 00:24:08,000 --> 00:24:13,420 And Doug and I have both done it to a smaller extent to widen our audience. 454 00:24:13,980 --> 00:24:19,520 Looking back now, it wasn't a conscious decision necessarily to switch to that darker vibe. 455 00:24:19,540 --> 00:24:24,340 But looking back now, what advice would you have for other authors in doing a genre switch? 456 00:24:24,620 --> 00:24:26,700 What do you think of things they should keep in mind? 457 00:24:27,220 --> 00:24:31,000 Well, I think you need to get advice from your agent and your publisher. 458 00:24:31,720 --> 00:24:36,940 Because to be pragmatic, you need to figure out whether your publisher is going to support 459 00:24:37,060 --> 00:24:39,240 that switch and whether you might need to change publisher. 460 00:24:39,840 --> 00:24:44,660 I would imagine that an agent would support a switch because generally agents want you 461 00:24:44,700 --> 00:24:46,900 to write the story that you're passionate about. 462 00:24:47,300 --> 00:24:53,360 They know that that's the best story to go for, the one that you are so compelled to 463 00:24:53,400 --> 00:24:53,580 do. 464 00:24:54,420 --> 00:25:00,760 I think you just need to be prepared to make some changes and maybe step back a little 465 00:25:00,900 --> 00:25:03,000 bit on sales and start again. 466 00:25:03,340 --> 00:25:06,840 But ultimately, I just don't believe in sort of cynical writing. 467 00:25:06,920 --> 00:25:11,340 I believe in just writing the story that you want to tell at that time. 468 00:25:11,340 --> 00:25:13,600 And if it happens to be in a different genre, so be it. 469 00:25:13,700 --> 00:25:15,380 And you can always have another name. 470 00:25:15,480 --> 00:25:16,700 You can always use a pen name. 471 00:25:17,280 --> 00:25:21,960 There are authors out there with seven or eight different names, different genres. 472 00:25:23,260 --> 00:25:25,660 I think it's anything goes really. 473 00:25:26,180 --> 00:25:27,980 It all depends on what it is you're protecting 474 00:25:28,120 --> 00:25:28,660 in the first place. 475 00:25:28,740 --> 00:25:31,580 If you are a huge seller in one genre, 476 00:25:32,100 --> 00:25:34,700 you do need to weigh up what you might lose 477 00:25:35,000 --> 00:25:37,000 if you step away from that and start again 478 00:25:37,120 --> 00:25:39,260 because you're essentially only going to take 479 00:25:39,440 --> 00:25:41,720 a portion of those early readers with you. 480 00:25:42,300 --> 00:25:44,940 So I think you just have to hold your nerve, 481 00:25:45,140 --> 00:25:47,580 but I think that about almost everything in this game. 482 00:25:47,630 --> 00:25:51,640 I just think be, have the value your own work, 483 00:25:52,120 --> 00:25:55,480 even if others don't appear to, and then hold your nerve. 484 00:25:56,040 --> 00:25:57,820 But if you've weighed up what you've got to lose 485 00:25:57,940 --> 00:26:00,040 and you're perpetitating that risk, then go for it. 486 00:26:00,660 --> 00:26:02,220 - That's smart, smart decision making. 487 00:26:02,600 --> 00:26:04,780 It's good thinking about what your career is, 488 00:26:04,780 --> 00:26:05,360 that kind of thing. 489 00:26:05,560 --> 00:26:08,100 So let's talk a little bit about TV then, 490 00:26:08,260 --> 00:26:10,460 'cause you've got, our house has aired 491 00:26:10,580 --> 00:26:12,680 and you've got two more projects filming right now, 492 00:26:12,700 --> 00:26:14,320 I believe, and one in a development. 493 00:26:15,100 --> 00:26:18,360 - Yes, they both just wrapped actually by coincidence. 494 00:26:18,660 --> 00:26:21,160 I mean, we know how hard it is to get an adaptation, 495 00:26:21,440 --> 00:26:26,880 So it does feel very greedy to have two that happen to, you know, come get green lit at 496 00:26:26,920 --> 00:26:27,820 exactly the same time. 497 00:26:27,820 --> 00:26:28,780 I'm being greedy. 498 00:26:28,920 --> 00:26:29,940 Just be grateful. 499 00:26:30,240 --> 00:26:30,940 I am grateful. 500 00:26:31,140 --> 00:26:31,640 I am grateful. 501 00:26:31,840 --> 00:26:37,080 But yeah, so they were filmed at the same time and they wrapped about a week or two apart 502 00:26:37,240 --> 00:26:41,620 and now they're both in post-production and I'm hoping they'll both be on air by the end 503 00:26:41,620 --> 00:26:44,640 of the year but the transmission dates aren't confirmed yet. 504 00:26:45,040 --> 00:26:49,780 So one is the heights and that was actually one of my favorite of my books. 505 00:26:50,280 --> 00:26:54,800 came out in lockdown and did it come out? Yes, it came out in lockdown. Well, I wrote 506 00:26:54,880 --> 00:26:58,820 it in lockdown, I think, and it maybe came out just towards the end of that COVID period. 507 00:26:59,480 --> 00:27:04,300 So, you know, it was such a personal private time where we were all incarcerated and I, 508 00:27:04,620 --> 00:27:09,340 you know, the characters in this book were my friends. That's the one about a very unusual 509 00:27:09,540 --> 00:27:17,680 feud where a mum called Ellen takes an intense dislike to her teenage son's new best friend 510 00:27:17,680 --> 00:27:21,980 and this feud develops and tragedy strikes and Ellen is out for revenge. 511 00:27:22,330 --> 00:27:26,020 So Ellen is being played by Anna Freel, who I've seen, 512 00:27:26,300 --> 00:27:30,600 I've seen some early cuts of the Heights and Anna is extraordinary. 513 00:27:30,840 --> 00:27:33,420 There's an amazing cast actually in both shows. 514 00:27:33,880 --> 00:27:40,180 Both shows have a lot of new talent and I've surprised myself by being most excited about that. 515 00:27:40,260 --> 00:27:45,680 Just seeing these young actors, you know, sort of getting maybe their first big mainstream show 516 00:27:45,960 --> 00:27:49,320 or consolidating, you know, a couple of

smaller roles. 517 00:27:50,540 --> 00:27:54,800 The actor who plays Lucas, who's Ellen's son, in the Heights, 518 00:27:55,040 --> 00:27:57,420 it's his first job, and he's phenomenal. 519 00:27:57,900 --> 00:28:00,040 So, yeah, it's been lovely, and it's been really busy. 520 00:28:00,180 --> 00:28:03,240 It kept me very busy because I've been very involved with the scripts. 521 00:28:04,120 --> 00:28:07,580 I've been sent all of the footage to watch and the early cuts. 522 00:28:07,910 --> 00:28:11,180 So it's taken up quite a lot of time, and yeah, it's been great. 523 00:28:11,680 --> 00:28:15,940 So for those of us who've not had a chance to have been optioned before or anything, 524 00:28:16,050 --> 00:28:20,680 so can you kind of walk us through what actually happens between the, hey, someone optioned 525 00:28:20,680 --> 00:28:22,160 it to, oh, it's on screen? 526 00:28:22,840 --> 00:28:26,240 Right, okay, well, that's a whole hour in its own right. 527 00:28:26,740 --> 00:28:35,100 But basically, it usually will be at least a year where a writer is being found and a 528 00:28:35,140 --> 00:28:41,660 writer is writing the treatment or the pitch and they're starting to talk with the person 529 00:28:41,660 --> 00:28:46,360 commissioners about the project, that whole process could take years and years and years. 530 00:28:46,880 --> 00:28:51,140 So the heights is actually when I think that the company who made it were actually the second 531 00:28:51,260 --> 00:28:55,380 company to option it. So there were a good two or three years where another company tried to get 532 00:28:55,380 --> 00:29:04,480 it made first. So there's constant discussions where Zendaya's reading the script is that's 533 00:29:04,520 --> 00:29:09,160 where it starts and then it ends with we're not going to renew the option, we've run out of ideas. 534 00:29:09,180 --> 00:29:15,020 So that's the norm. So when it works, it's really a question of the patience and the hustling power 535 00:29:15,600 --> 00:29:22,280 of the producers to just not give up and to just get this project over the line. It's not really 536 00:29:22,480 --> 00:29:29,000 anything to do with me or the story. It's to do with how good they are at selling this show to the 537 00:29:29,040 --> 00:29:35,740 right person at the right time. So as with everything, timing is a huge factor. And sometimes it can 538 00:29:35,740 --> 00:29:39,620 happened quite quickly. The heights happened extremely quickly, I would say, happened within a year. 539 00:29:39,920 --> 00:29:45,420 The only suspect, the other one, which is one that stars Kevin McKidd, that took about four years 540 00:29:45,700 --> 00:29:52,320 to get over the line. Once you've got a commissioner interested, they will usually fund or support 541 00:29:52,680 --> 00:29:57,340 a pilot. And so the writer will then write the pilot and then that will be read and then you'll 542 00:29:57,340 --> 00:30:02,220 get the green light, hopefully, for the full

series to be written and then everything cranks into gear. 543 00:30:02,580 --> 00:30:10,960 The thing that's most interesting about TV i think is that everything feels so painfully slow and then when it actually happens you just cannot believe. 544 00:30:11,640 --> 00:30:25,700 The hard work and efficiency and speed of these people who all work together in this sort of high and everyone knows you know everyone knows their role and doesn't overstep and there's such harmony there's no difficult characters or. 545 00:30:26,000 --> 00:30:30,920 There's just no time for that. It's such an expensive process. Millions is on the line. 546 00:30:31,380 --> 00:30:35,820 And they just do it so quickly and so efficiently. And they work these incredibly long hours. 547 00:30:36,190 --> 00:30:41,560 And the actors who, you know, I initially expected, you know, kind of actors, you know, 548 00:30:41,640 --> 00:30:47,080 having hangovers and being really deep, deeper-ish, then they're not like that at all. 549 00:30:47,580 --> 00:30:49,940 That's more like authors, right? Just more of the authors. 550 00:30:50,880 --> 00:30:56,580 I know, I know, I'm thinking about, you know, the kind of olivary types that's all in the past. 551 00:30:57,000 --> 00:31:02,160 That's all in the past. They are so wholesome. They work so hard. They are well rested. They're 552 00:31:02,280 --> 00:31:08,000 all gym-honed and you just couldn't ask them. That's what they say about me. They call me gym-honed too. 553 00:31:09,760 --> 00:31:15,220 Oh no, I'm sorry. Gin, gin-honed. Oh, there we go. That's good. So you're missing some element there. 554 00:31:15,520 --> 00:31:16,760 I misspelled it, sorry. 555 00:31:17,160 --> 00:31:18,660 That's my category as well. 556 00:31:18,740 --> 00:31:20,220 I'm more Jim Hone, absolutely. 557 00:31:20,480 --> 00:31:21,560 This is why we're writers. 558 00:31:22,000 --> 00:31:23,900 Yes, so it becomes very, very exciting. 559 00:31:24,320 --> 00:31:28,040 And I find visiting the set quite surreal initially. 560 00:31:28,360 --> 00:31:31,380 It feels quite frightening to think 561 00:31:31,500 --> 00:31:34,340 that all of this money is being spent on a story 562 00:31:34,540 --> 00:31:38,120 that I wrote on the sofa with a coffee by my side. 563 00:31:38,500 --> 00:31:40,700 It suddenly feels like, oh my God, am I 564 00:31:40,740 --> 00:31:42,080 accountable for all of this? 565 00:31:42,380 --> 00:31:44,920 And then after a while, you relax into it. 566 00:31:44,920 --> 00:31:47,120 and you almost stop making that connection 567 00:31:47,560 --> 00:31:49,380 and you just enjoy it for what it is 568 00:31:49,460 --> 00:31:52,380 because it's such a different format from the book. 569 00:31:52,920 --> 00:31:54,460 You know, I always think with a book 570 00:31:54,600 --> 00:31:57,480 it's such a collaboration between the writer and the reader 571 00:31:57,620 --> 00:32:00,660 and the reader is doing such a lot of the imaginative work 572 00:32:01,260 --> 00:32:02,760 taking our words on the page 573 00:32:02,920 --> 00:32:05,720 and the pictures arriving in their minds 574 00:32:05,800 --> 00:32:07,220 are their own creation. 575 00:32:07,940 --> 00:32:11,040 But with TV, all of that is done for you. 576 00:32:11,380 --> 00:32:13,220 It's the director's format. 577 00:32:13,480 --> 00:32:15,500 It's the actors' work. 578 00:32:15,900 --> 00:32:18,680 And the words are very much a sort of vehicle. 579 00:32:19,460 --> 00:32:20,460 It feels so different. 580 00:32:20,920 --> 00:32:23,500 And it actually makes me really value books 581 00:32:23,740 --> 00:32:26,080 because I think that imaginative collaboration 582 00:32:26,300 --> 00:32:28,380 between reader and writer is really special. 583 00:32:28,480 --> 00:32:29,760 And you don't get that with TV. 584 00:32:29,940 --> 00:32:32,400 You're pretty much spoon fed everything. 585 00:32:32,600 --> 00:32:35,780 All of the gorgeous visuals are created for you. 586 00:32:35,860 --> 00:32:37,260 You don't have to do that yourself. 587 00:32:37,680 --> 00:32:39,600 So very, very different formats 588 00:32:39,780 --> 00:32:42,160 and both so satisfying in different ways. 589 00:32:43,120 --> 00:32:44,860 A quick word from this episode's sponsor. 590 00:32:45,340 --> 00:32:46,980 - Hi gang, it's me, Jamie Davis, 591 00:32:47,240 --> 00:32:49,060 the show manager from Author Nation. 592 00:32:49,380 --> 00:32:51,380 We're locking down the final details 593 00:32:51,560 --> 00:32:52,760 for this year's big event. 594 00:32:53,200 --> 00:32:55,700 So I hope we'll get to see you soon in Las Vegas. 595 00:32:56,220 --> 00:32:58,000 In the meantime, my wife asked me 596 00:32:58,060 --> 00:33:00,060 what was for dinner last Tuesday night. 597 00:33:00,800 --> 00:33:03,600 Well, I just told her we should talk about it. 598 00:33:04,180 --> 00:33:05,080 - Now back to the show. 599 00:33:06,280 --> 00:33:09,160 So it's interesting, you've got to be on the sets 600 00:33:09,340 --> 00:33:11,240 of now multiple productions, 601 00:33:11,280 --> 00:33:12,340 'cause a lot of writers don't, 602 00:33:12,400 --> 00:33:13,680 by the time it gets to that point, 603 00:33:13,840 --> 00:33:16,260 they're sort of pretty heavily disconnected from it. 604 00:33:16,740 --> 00:33:18,040 We hear about that in Hollywood a lot, 605 00:33:18,360 --> 00:33:19,560 but it's great that you get to be there. 606 00:33:19,640 --> 00:33:20,920 How do you find the people, 607 00:33:21,000 --> 00:33:22,260 apart from being polite and nice, 608 00:33:22,860 --> 00:33:25,740 how do you find like the director and the actors treating you? 609 00:33:25,900 --> 00:33:27,300 Do you find them come over and go, 610 00:33:27,960 --> 00:33:28,960 "Louise, what were you thinking here? 611 00:33:29,220 --> 00:33:31,040 "What was kind of in your mind?" 612 00:33:31,040 --> 00:33:33,260 Or it's the director like, "No, no, I got this." 613 00:33:33,480 --> 00:33:35,840 - The directors are

normally extremely busy. 614 00:33:36,500 --> 00:33:38,560 They haven't got time to breathe, 615 00:33:39,160 --> 00:33:42,800 let alone indulge in planning my ego. 616 00:33:43,220 --> 00:33:45,260 But I do think that I think they're all quite different. 617 00:33:45,480 --> 00:33:48,400 And so some directors are actually really eager 618 00:33:48,480 --> 00:33:51,240 to talk about the book and to talk about the characters, 619 00:33:51,680 --> 00:33:55,500 even well into filming, either to get new ideas 620 00:33:55,540 --> 00:33:58,320 or just to feel they've captured the DNA. 621 00:33:58,480 --> 00:34:00,920 Because it's important to them to feel like 622 00:34:01,020 --> 00:34:02,500 they've captured the DNA of the book, 623 00:34:02,640 --> 00:34:04,360 because that's the whole point of adapting a book, 624 00:34:04,520 --> 00:34:08,540 is someone did all that heavy lifting for you. 625 00:34:08,919 --> 00:34:13,720 So some will want to go quite in depth and others are much more polite. 626 00:34:14,280 --> 00:34:16,399 You might get directors who haven't even read the book. 627 00:34:16,500 --> 00:34:18,240 You will get actors who haven't read the book. 628 00:34:18,399 --> 00:34:21,639 You know, the script is their book, the script is their Bible. 629 00:34:22,240 --> 00:34:25,040 And so then it is much more a polite exchange. 630 00:34:25,220 --> 00:34:29,220 You know, thank you for entrusting us with, you know, your wonderful book, you know, 631 00:34:29,260 --> 00:34:30,100 those sorts of lines. 632 00:34:30,240 --> 00:34:33,139 So it can vary a lot and either way is fine. 633 00:34:33,240 --> 00:34:34,899 I don't mind at all. 634 00:34:35,000 --> 00:34:39,980 I'm, you know, by that stage, you're so happy that yours has made it over the line and, you 635 00:34:39,980 --> 00:34:41,500 know, it's going to have this second life. 636 00:34:42,100 --> 00:34:45,300 And I'm always, always thinking from the point of view of the author. 637 00:34:45,679 --> 00:34:49,800 I'm always thinking, you know, I do want to protect the DNA of the book. 638 00:34:49,899 --> 00:34:55,120 I do want the readers to be happy with what they see while, you know, totally understanding 639 00:34:55,300 --> 00:34:56,280 that it's a different form. 640 00:34:56,679 --> 00:35:01,400 And then I also want, you know, to gain new readers when the, when the, when the show 641 00:35:01,400 --> 00:35:06,460 I want people to say, "Who created this story and has she written any other books?" 642 00:35:06,620 --> 00:35:10,520 I'm thinking from a book point of view all the time. 643 00:35:10,960 --> 00:35:14,940 You see an influx of new readers when our town was aired on ITV. 644 00:35:15,230 --> 00:35:19,760 You saw that in book sales as well, or it was almost like a whole new release to it? 645 00:35:20,160 --> 00:35:20,940 Yeah, definitely. 646 00:35:21,340 --> 00:35:21,520 Definitely. 647 00:35:21,700 --> 00:35:25,400 Or you might meet people at events who don't know your work and then if you say, "Well, 648 00:35:25,430 --> 00:35:29,920 did you see our house starring Martin Compton and Tappant's Middleton on ITV?" 649 00:35:29,920 --> 00:35:33,520 TV and they'll say, "Oh yeah, I saw that." And then I can say, "Well, that was mine." 650 00:35:33,520 --> 00:35:38,320 And so you can just get that connection in a new way. But absolutely, I mean, I personally 651 00:35:38,600 --> 00:35:43,000 don't watch a TV adaptation and then go and read the books. I feel like, "Well, I already 652 00:35:43,060 --> 00:35:48,960 know what happens." So it's much more just getting your name a bit more high profile 653 00:35:49,400 --> 00:35:53,480 and you might get more media. You might get more interest generally. And then when the 654 00:35:53,560 --> 00:35:59,280 next book comes out, you've got these great TV shows to talk about. 655 00:35:59,600 --> 00:36:04,120 I would assume maybe you get like a new lease with the cover, the TV, whatever the media 656 00:36:04,300 --> 00:36:05,680 cover that they put out to. 657 00:36:05,890 --> 00:36:09,500 So it's almost like a little more bookshelf space or a re-release. 658 00:36:10,220 --> 00:36:12,860 Yeah, re-release with the new cover and everything. 659 00:36:13,100 --> 00:36:13,160 Yeah. 660 00:36:13,380 --> 00:36:16,740 Yeah, sometimes they'll do a reissue with the TV branded cover. 661 00:36:16,880 --> 00:36:18,000 We did that for our house. 662 00:36:18,520 --> 00:36:23,580 We're not doing it with the next two, partly because I'm no longer with the publisher who 663 00:36:23,700 --> 00:36:27,880 published those books, but we have a great relationship and we'll be doing lots of, you 664 00:36:27,880 --> 00:36:37,100 We'll be doing the stamps, the roundels with the TV artwork and marketing the books during 665 00:36:37,240 --> 00:36:37,780 that period. 666 00:36:38,120 --> 00:36:39,460 So, yeah, everyone's on board. 667 00:36:39,740 --> 00:36:42,140 Everyone's really excited about these things. 668 00:36:42,410 --> 00:36:45,740 But a lot of TV dramas are from books. 669 00:36:46,030 --> 00:36:50,980 So most of the big publishers certainly will have, they'll be very practiced about the 670 00:36:51,000 --> 00:36:57,200 whole routine and they'll understand how late in the day they're going to have the transmission 671 00:36:57,200 --> 00:37:01,460 date confirmed and how late in the day that they're going to get the artwork that they 672 00:37:01,540 --> 00:37:08,300 need to do any of the branding bits and pieces. So yeah, everyone's very geared up. And again, 673 00:37:08,540 --> 00:37:12,560 you know, it's my job to make sure everyone in the mix gets what they need. 674 00:37:13,240 --> 00:37:16,780 All right, let's look back and talk about a little bit of craft stuff for a minute. 675 00:37:17,540 --> 00:37:24,600 So houses and properties have become a major focus in your books. Did that just happen? 676 00:37:25,280 --> 00:37:28,920 Or did you think there's something really exciting

about a building and then bring 677 00:37:29,020 --> 00:37:31,660 you all the people into the building and killing of you? 678 00:37:32,000 --> 00:37:33,200 It wasn't really conscious. 679 00:37:34,020 --> 00:37:39,900 And in fact, it was only when I got involved in TV that it was pointed out to me that this 680 00:37:40,020 --> 00:37:42,940 was a key ingredient in all of my books for so long. 681 00:37:44,540 --> 00:37:47,380 It was all just very natural and instinctive. 682 00:37:47,600 --> 00:37:50,940 Isn't that nice when somebody tells you what you were thinking and you're like, "Oh, I 683 00:37:51,000 --> 00:37:52,600 didn't realize what your past is." 684 00:37:52,700 --> 00:37:53,320 Yeah, yeah. 685 00:37:53,800 --> 00:37:57,140 Thank you because actually it was very useful to hear what they thought. 686 00:37:57,170 --> 00:37:57,960 Yeah, that's a good point. 687 00:37:58,460 --> 00:38:04,280 Yeah, but I think it's just for me, it's the age I am in my 50s. 688 00:38:04,280 --> 00:38:10,720 I'm Gen X. It has been the defining issue, social issue of my entire adult life. 689 00:38:10,960 --> 00:38:17,520 People talking about property, people making money out of property, people on right move 690 00:38:17,940 --> 00:38:19,640 looking at property porn. 691 00:38:20,040 --> 00:38:22,600 It's just been such a huge, huge thing. 692 00:38:23,079 --> 00:38:23,440 (laughing) 693 00:38:25,740 --> 00:38:28,600 Really, I mean, I've been called the queen 694 00:38:28,760 --> 00:38:30,120 of property porn noir. 695 00:38:30,420 --> 00:38:31,400 I mean, can you imagine? 696 00:38:31,940 --> 00:38:33,580 50 years, some fat. 697 00:38:34,519 --> 00:38:36,220 - That is a title right there. 698 00:38:36,620 --> 00:38:38,380 That's also a t-shirt you need to have in the back. 699 00:38:38,540 --> 00:38:38,600 - Yeah, yeah. 700 00:38:38,600 --> 00:38:39,660 - Another one, no, I'll be sure. 701 00:38:39,900 --> 00:38:40,880 - Along with the laurels. 702 00:38:41,360 --> 00:38:41,600 - Yeah. 703 00:38:42,240 --> 00:38:43,200 - And a judge on the laurel. 704 00:38:43,200 --> 00:38:44,660 - Property porn queen resting on her laurels. 705 00:38:44,860 --> 00:38:45,840 - Resting on her laurels. 706 00:38:47,240 --> 00:38:48,780 - Yeah, so I think it happened naturally. 707 00:38:48,920 --> 00:38:54,900 And of course, not just me, but a whole genre, a domestic noir is based on this whole fear 708 00:38:55,320 --> 00:39:01,420 of not being safe in the domestic realm, losing the very thing that you should feel confident 709 00:39:01,600 --> 00:39:03,820 about being safe in your home. 710 00:39:04,100 --> 00:39:08,580 And domestic stories, we've had them for centuries, and just look at things like Madame 711 00:39:08,700 --> 00:39:13,180 Bovary and all of the stories that can be rooted in the home. 712 00:39:13,570 --> 00:39:17,740 But yeah, so even before our house, property had been a theme. 713 00:39:17,800 --> 00:39:20,280 in my books, I just hadn't really recognized it. 714 00:39:20,350 --> 00:39:23,700 You know, people had either been struggling to have a roof over their head, or they had 715 00:39:23,860 --> 00:39:30,280 been downsizing after a divorce, or they had been, you know, in one book, someone broke 716 00:39:30,460 --> 00:39:33,840 into someone's house in a village in France and squatted there. 717 00:39:34,200 --> 00:39:40,040 It's always been at the center of my stories, I think, but it's only in the last sort of 718 00:39:40,140 --> 00:39:44,300 five to ten years that I've been directly associated with property. 719 00:39:44,760 --> 00:39:50,600 But I never run out of ideas and I never run out of property-based stories because if anything, 720 00:39:51,080 --> 00:39:55,700 it's all just even more intensely relevant to the way we live now. 721 00:39:56,050 --> 00:40:02,240 The property crisis, I've just, a couple of books ago, I wrote about the second home owners 722 00:40:02,600 --> 00:40:09,540 in a beauty spot in the UK and the war between holiday home owners and locals who can't get 723 00:40:09,640 --> 00:40:10,440 on the property ladder. 724 00:40:11,120 --> 00:40:18,420 year there's more and more stories on these themes and it's not getting any easier for people. 725 00:40:19,240 --> 00:40:25,340 Another thing I would say is that, you know, the older I get and the more I, you know, I definitely 726 00:40:25,580 --> 00:40:30,920 identify as a workaholic, someone whose identity is really based on their work, but I do have friends 727 00:40:31,140 --> 00:40:35,840 whose identity is based on how beautiful their home is. And I think I've always been really 728 00:40:35,840 --> 00:40:42,140 fascinated by that tribe, which I'm not in, where just having the perfect sofa and the 729 00:40:42,220 --> 00:40:47,840 right paint color is kind of all they need to feel really, really satisfied with life. 730 00:40:48,420 --> 00:40:52,480 And so there's often a character in my books who is a bit like that, where they've almost 731 00:40:52,640 --> 00:40:58,640 placed more value in their home decoration than they maybe have some of their relationships. 732 00:40:59,440 --> 00:41:02,260 So yeah, there's just endless amounts of property related stuff. 733 00:41:02,520 --> 00:41:07,540 You've also got a kind of a map for adding like catching a live social issue besides 734 00:41:07,740 --> 00:41:10,800 just I mean obviously the property values is nothing but right mean kind of before it 735 00:41:10,820 --> 00:41:14,640 almost becomes a headline like you're kind of like prescient in how that is but do you 736 00:41:15,200 --> 00:41:20,680 go looking like to add that social comment to your books every time on on top of obviously 737 00:41:20,840 --> 00:41:24,540 we talk about the property values but you have some other social issues that you kind 738 00:41:24,560 --> 00:41:28,140 of like grab hold of such as the rent for sex. 739 00:41:28,360 --> 00:41:29,680 Yeah, yeah, sex for rent. 740

00:41:29,880 --> 00:41:32,960 I do. I mean, I'm really interested in politics. I read. 741 00:41:33,140 --> 00:41:33,280 Yeah. 742 00:41:33,820 --> 00:41:35,680 The other way around. That's quite different. 743 00:41:35,840 --> 00:41:37,140 Yeah, rent for sex. Yeah, that is different. 744 00:41:38,020 --> 00:41:41,500 Yeah. You can stay here if you'll just give me some. 745 00:41:43,320 --> 00:41:44,860 Isn't that the same thing as sex for rent? 746 00:41:45,060 --> 00:41:46,360 Yeah. Either way, it's floppy. 747 00:41:46,480 --> 00:41:47,120 Rent for sex. 748 00:41:48,300 --> 00:41:49,300 It's all about the order. 749 00:41:49,480 --> 00:41:51,420 Like, I've already got the rent there. 750 00:41:51,540 --> 00:41:53,520 If you sleep with me, I'll let you pay rent. 751 00:41:53,780 --> 00:41:54,540 It would be with me. 752 00:41:54,900 --> 00:41:57,780 Yeah. I think the answer you get is very different. 753 00:41:58,240 --> 00:42:00,800 - The pinning on the city, I might be willing to do that. 754 00:42:00,900 --> 00:42:01,540 I'm just saying. 755 00:42:01,800 --> 00:42:04,320 - One version gets a lot of no's and one version 756 00:42:04,500 --> 00:42:05,560 gets a fair number of uses. 757 00:42:05,620 --> 00:42:06,460 - Yeah, absolutely. 758 00:42:06,800 --> 00:42:08,880 - I've been fucked by landlords before, 759 00:42:09,260 --> 00:42:10,740 so it's not that big of a deal. 760 00:42:11,100 --> 00:42:11,300 - No. 761 00:42:11,460 --> 00:42:11,940 - All the way around. 762 00:42:13,440 --> 00:42:13,840 (laughing) 763 00:42:17,780 --> 00:42:18,580 - Metaphorically, obviously. 764 00:42:19,300 --> 00:42:20,300 - Metaphorically, well, yes. 765 00:42:21,060 --> 00:42:23,400 - Okay, so Louise, do you consciously try 766 00:42:23,400 --> 00:42:25,420 and put a social element into every book? 767 00:42:27,040 --> 00:42:33,120 Yes, I guess so. I'm writing about what I'm interested in. I'm very interested in the way 768 00:42:33,180 --> 00:42:37,980 we live now. I'm really interested in social and consumer issues. My dream is to listen to 769 00:42:38,120 --> 00:42:45,260 radio for consumer shows, things like Moneybox and You and Yours. That's my idea of a fantastic 770 00:42:45,580 --> 00:42:52,240 hour to hear about the latest scams and frauds. Fraud, of course, is the biggest growth area 771 00:42:52,240 --> 00:42:57,420 in crime, there's a lot of fraud in my stories and scams. I can't get enough of it. I mean, 772 00:42:57,500 --> 00:43:04,380 I don't enjoy other people's misery at all. It's not that kind of vibe, but I just want to know 773 00:43:04,460 --> 00:43:08,840 about it and I'm very attracted to those sorts of stories. And then they find their way into my 774 00:43:08,960 --> 00:43:15,020 novels because the way I construct my books is, you know, I'll have several themes or issues 775 00:43:15,180 --> 00:43:19,640 that I'm really interested in that, you know, aren't enough in their own right to be a whole book. 776 00:43:20,080 --> 00:43:29,460 And so I'll wait for enough of them to come along and then I'll tangle them up and then I'll think of a great way to structure it and that's kind of how I do it. 777 00:43:29,860 --> 00:43:35,620 So you know sex parental rent for sex whichever we're gonna call it that's not really enough. 778 00:43:36,140 --> 00:43:46,560 For a whole book I needed lots of other things that I wanted to explore and so you know neighbors guide that is the boomerang child so Gwen 30 something some has come back. 779 00:43:47,040 --> 00:43:52,520 to live with her and you know is a real pain in the ass and you know this is this is a big problem 780 00:43:52,740 --> 00:44:00,460 now with adults not leaving home you know you got done anything there Doug i wouldn't know anything 781 00:44:00,580 --> 00:44:05,820 about that are you a boomerang no no but i've got a boomerang they never left 782 00:44:10,480 --> 00:44:16,920 there's so many there's so many in fact mainly guys but also Gwen's daughter has gone 783 00:44:16,920 --> 00:44:20,720 into this full-on "Trad Wife" influencer sort of thing. 784 00:44:21,020 --> 00:44:22,060 There's a Nepo baby. 785 00:44:22,460 --> 00:44:25,180 In many ways, this, even though the narrator is 70 years old, 786 00:44:25,180 --> 00:44:28,200 in many ways, this book is my Zuma book. 787 00:44:28,300 --> 00:44:31,120 This is my Gen Z book, because all of the young characters 788 00:44:31,260 --> 00:44:35,600 are kind of typifying some kind of odd new way, 789 00:44:35,820 --> 00:44:38,480 odd to me, about living your life. 790 00:44:39,020 --> 00:44:42,160 And so in a way, that was why I had to create an older narrator 791 00:44:42,320 --> 00:44:45,220 to navigate it, because I didn't really understand. 792 00:44:45,560 --> 00:44:49,980 you know, it's quite hard to imagine being a Nepo baby, and it's quite hard to imagine 793 00:44:50,300 --> 00:44:55,180 bouncing back after divorce and living in your childhood room if you haven't done it. 794 00:44:55,680 --> 00:45:02,860 So I kind of needed someone to take a rye kind of observational position on all of those 795 00:45:02,980 --> 00:45:06,760 different young people, while also being quite compassionate because it's, you know, 796 00:45:06,780 --> 00:45:08,200 it's not easy to be young right now. 797 00:45:08,600 --> 00:45:14,120 So yeah, I think it's all, it all melds together, you know, my, the reading idea for pleasure, 798 00:45:14,440 --> 00:45:20,760 the fact that I'm very engaged with the newspapers and politics and everything that's going on 799 00:45:20,820 --> 00:45:24,460 in the world, it all finds its way somehow into a book. 800 00:45:24,920 --> 00:45:28,540 Okay, so a couple of things to wrap up. A couple of questions we ask everybody. And the first 801 00:45:28,720 --> 00:45:31,800 one is, what do you think is your author's superpower? 802 00:45:32,500 --> 00:45:38,960 Well, I think my strongest asset is that I can hold my nerve and I'm very confident 803

00:45:38,960 --> 00:45:45,140 about the books and I will, even if no one else feels the same enthusiasm, I will continue 804 00:45:45,360 --> 00:45:50,540 to feel that passion burning for them. So I just feel like I am willing to hold my nerve 805 00:45:50,900 --> 00:45:56,540 in difficult situations and stand by my work. In terms of the actual writing, I think probably 806 00:45:56,680 --> 00:46:02,640 my best thing would be my dialogue. I think my dialogue's quite natural and quite good. 807 00:46:02,780 --> 00:46:07,119 And maybe that's why, you know, one of the reasons the TV producers have fallen for quite 808 00:46:07,120 --> 00:46:11,420 lot of my stories. I think that the conversational elements are quite natural. 809 00:46:11,980 --> 00:46:15,940 Great, good answer. Okay, and final question will be a random question. 810 00:46:16,400 --> 00:46:18,900 Final questions, we have a wheel of questions here. 811 00:46:18,960 --> 00:46:20,180 Oh wow, look at that! 812 00:46:20,280 --> 00:46:23,500 Yeah, you didn't know you were on a full-on show game show. 813 00:46:23,680 --> 00:46:24,620 A game show! 814 00:46:24,760 --> 00:46:28,280 Yeah, I love this. I can't see any of the questions, so you could say anything. 815 00:46:29,280 --> 00:46:33,140 That's true. It's my handwriting. Even if you couldn't see it, you wouldn't be able to read it. 816 00:46:33,160 --> 00:46:34,420 Yeah, you wouldn't be able to decipher it. 817 00:46:34,720 --> 00:46:37,640 Most of them were kind of like, I have them as short hands. 818 00:46:37,960 --> 00:46:39,860 So, okay, oh, it's a good one. 819 00:46:40,360 --> 00:46:44,020 Who would be your favorite protagonist as you've written? 820 00:46:44,560 --> 00:46:46,020 - Oh my goodness, okay. 821 00:46:46,480 --> 00:46:50,900 I really like Alex in "The Only Suspect." 822 00:46:51,000 --> 00:46:53,700 I tend to prefer my male protagonists, actually. 823 00:46:53,900 --> 00:46:54,660 I've come to realize. 824 00:46:55,140 --> 00:46:59,500 And so he's this very jaded, cynical, Gen X guy. 825 00:46:59,600 --> 00:47:02,960 He's the one played by Kevin McKidd in the TV adaptation. 826 00:47:03,440 --> 00:47:05,800 But he is a very complex character 827 00:47:05,900 --> 00:47:07,640 because he's hiding a huge secret 828 00:47:08,060 --> 00:47:12,520 and it's prevented him from living life as he would like to. 829 00:47:12,940 --> 00:47:13,500 I love Alex. 830 00:47:13,920 --> 00:47:14,460 - That's cool. 831 00:47:14,740 --> 00:47:16,420 So is there gonna be another Alex book? 832 00:47:16,800 --> 00:47:19,400 - No, well, I've never done, I've never done a sequel. 833 00:47:20,320 --> 00:47:22,440 Let's see, let's see if the TV show is a hit. 834 00:47:22,540 --> 00:47:23,840 Maybe they'll, they'll ask. 835 00:47:23,980 --> 00:47:26,880 - If the TV show is a hit, they'll be wanting one. 836 00:47:27,080 --> 00:47:28,400 - Well, they'll be wanting season two. 837 00:47:28,760 --> 00:47:29,580 - Absolutely. - Season two, whatever. 838 00:47:29,840 --> 00:47:30,660 Yes, yes. - Yeah. 839 00:47:30,660 --> 00:47:32,000 - But we need to know whether he lives. 840 00:47:32,140 --> 00:47:33,420 I think, you know, if he lives-- 841 00:47:33,420 --> 00:47:36,320 So yeah, he was saying that and I was just thinking, oh, he dies at the end. 842 00:47:36,560 --> 00:47:36,820 Yeah, no. 843 00:47:37,020 --> 00:47:37,860 That's just a rather... 844 00:47:38,660 --> 00:47:38,980 [Laughter] 845 00:47:39,960 --> 00:47:41,180 The younger life of Alex. 846 00:47:41,280 --> 00:47:42,880 I don't think she'd have picked one to eat. 847 00:47:42,900 --> 00:47:43,200 No. 848 00:47:43,240 --> 00:47:45,200 To kill all, all throughout the band, you know, yeah. 849 00:47:45,300 --> 00:47:45,400 No. 850 00:47:45,400 --> 00:47:49,380 I'm not going to say explicitly, but you know, we can feel optimistic for Alex. 851 00:47:49,840 --> 00:47:50,300 There we go. 852 00:47:50,560 --> 00:47:51,040 Perfect, perfect. 853 00:47:51,160 --> 00:47:53,420 Louise, thank you so much for spending the time with us. 854 00:47:53,500 --> 00:47:54,140 This has been brilliant. 855 00:47:55,239 --> 00:47:58,740 And Neighbour's Guide to Murder will be a huge hit in the US, same way it has been in the 856 00:47:58,780 --> 00:47:59,100 UK. 857 00:47:59,860 --> 00:48:02,200 And so best of luck with all the TV projects. 858 00:48:02,420 --> 00:48:05,360 Thank you so much and this was so much fun. Thank you. 859 00:48:12,700 --> 00:48:15,300 Thank you so much to Louise. That was brilliant. She was lovely. 860 00:48:15,520 --> 00:48:17,580 She was fun. That was a lot of fun. We were laughing hard. 861 00:48:17,820 --> 00:48:19,860 I always like the shows where we laugh a lot on them. 862 00:48:20,380 --> 00:48:21,880 I know. Yeah. I'm always happy. 863 00:48:22,780 --> 00:48:23,560 That's what we do it for, right? 864 00:48:23,880 --> 00:48:25,780 That's what I do it for. I just want to... 865 00:48:26,180 --> 00:48:28,460 I only want to entertain myself. That's the only reason I write. 866 00:48:28,600 --> 00:48:29,560 That's the only reason I do anything. 867 00:48:31,080 --> 00:48:34,080 And there's only so many times you can do it the other way you do it. 868 00:48:34,220 --> 00:48:36,720 So it's just not on air. 869 00:48:37,320 --> 00:48:37,580 All right. 870 00:48:38,000 --> 00:48:40,480 So hello, you might get the rent paid. 871 00:48:40,760 --> 00:48:41,820 Hey, you know, do it again. 872 00:48:43,280 --> 00:48:44,420 So it's interesting. 873 00:48:44,540 --> 00:48:47,960 I like the fact that, I mean, all her books have human protagonist in them, but that, 874 00:48:48,320 --> 00:48:52,540 you know, that a property or that property theme thing is a character in all of her books. 875 00:48:52,740 --> 00:48:59,740 And it's interesting that it just, it fell that way, you know, organically rather than 876 00:48:59,740 --> 00:49:01,120 being deliberate, which is really cool. 877 00:49:01,400 --> 00:49:03,280 I think

it's, well, and sometimes I think that's what is. 878 00:49:03,500 --> 00:49:09,780 Something that you know about, that we're passionate about, that we think about on a 879 00:49:09,780 --> 00:49:11,960 regular basis, those are going to come out in our writing. 880 00:49:12,260 --> 00:49:15,880 And she's, you know, I think it's funny that somebody told her, "Hey, you know, you've 881 00:49:15,900 --> 00:49:19,000 been writing about property," and she's like, "Oh, I guess I have." 882 00:49:19,000 --> 00:49:19,160 Yeah. 883 00:49:20,140 --> 00:49:21,060 Oh, yes I do. 884 00:49:21,140 --> 00:49:25,260 You know, sometimes I think that's probably the case for a lot of us, is until you start 885 00:49:25,260 --> 00:49:31,060 realize and what you're doing and not what you're doing so much, but realize that you 886 00:49:31,120 --> 00:49:33,580 have a theme that seems to kind of flow. 887 00:49:33,980 --> 00:49:35,600 That's kind of an interesting way that... 888 00:49:35,620 --> 00:49:39,720 The other thing that's interesting, I think, is she's doing well in the States, but she's 889 00:49:39,920 --> 00:49:43,860 huge in the UK and won all kinds of awards and her books are best sellers over there. 890 00:49:44,200 --> 00:49:47,440 And now she's got these TV shows that are going, "You know, one of them is going to 891 00:49:47,440 --> 00:49:50,540 get picked up by Netflix or someone over here and get shown." 892 00:49:50,540 --> 00:49:55,760 So it'll be interesting to see how that goes and probably blows her up in the US, you know, 893 00:49:56,290 --> 00:49:58,380 to a lot bigger status on the author side. 894 00:49:58,670 --> 00:49:59,160 And it's interesting. 895 00:49:59,320 --> 00:50:00,320 And that's what it is. 896 00:50:00,380 --> 00:50:04,760 All these shows on Netflix and they are all like off of these books and stuff. 897 00:50:04,900 --> 00:50:09,120 So I am curious how it really affects book sales in the long run. 898 00:50:09,400 --> 00:50:10,540 So it'd be kind of interesting. 899 00:50:10,740 --> 00:50:15,040 That was a neat comment too because she said, "Do people go and buy the book because they 900 00:50:15,120 --> 00:50:16,460 just watched the TV show?" 901 00:50:16,460 --> 00:50:18,340 No, they kind of know the ending. 902 00:50:18,840 --> 00:50:22,380 But I bet the books around it and her backlist do really well. 903 00:50:22,430 --> 00:50:23,060 Oh, it's going to help. 904 00:50:23,170 --> 00:50:24,000 When that stuff comes out. 905 00:50:24,240 --> 00:50:24,320 Yeah. 906 00:50:24,520 --> 00:50:24,680 Cool. 907 00:50:24,880 --> 00:50:25,160 Very good. 908 00:50:25,530 --> 00:50:25,780 All right. 909 00:50:26,210 --> 00:50:29,060 Big thanks to our friends at Valom for supporting the show. 910 00:50:29,190 --> 00:50:29,840 We love you guys. 911 00:50:30,020 --> 00:50:30,640 We love the product. 912 00:50:30,960 --> 00:50:35,980 If you haven't tried Valom before, head on over to tryvalom.com/tourthers and give it 913 00:50:35,980 --> 00:50:36,320 a whirl. 914 00:50:36,540 --> 00:50:38,120 Thank you to all our Patreon subscribers. 915 00:50:38,560 --> 00:50:39,840 We really appreciate support. 916 00:50:40,120 --> 00:50:44,760 Another great nugget of a really cool bonus with Louise. 917 00:50:45,100 --> 00:50:46,040 Almost a full show. 918 00:50:46,760 --> 00:50:48,880 It was a pretty long one. 919 00:50:49,820 --> 00:50:50,980 Yeah, it was good. 920 00:50:51,400 --> 00:50:55,780 So yeah, thank you to our Patreon supporters and until next time, be cool to each other. 921 00:50:56,080 --> 00:50:57,400 Fair winds and fallen seas. 922 00:50:58,900 --> 00:51:04,280 You've been listening to the Two Authors podcast with Nicholas Harvey and Douglas Pratt. 923 00:51:04,880 --> 00:51:09,060 Subscribe on your favourite platform for new shows coming every week. 924 00:51:09,060 --> 00:51:10,220 (upbeat music)