บทถอดความฉบับเต็มของ How STARK Carpet Built a Luxury Empire — And Why AI Is Changing Everything with Chad Stark

um friends and family all commented, like, what are these rugs? 00:02:32.800 --> 00:02:34.080 I've never seen anything like it. 00:02:34.319 --> 00:02:37.199 And so the following year, they went back to Europe. 00:02:37.280 --> 00:02:38.319 Uh bought some more. 00:02:38.479 --> 00:02:44.800 They went back to the flea markets, they bought some more, and uh my grandfather ended up selling those. 00:02:44.879 --> 00:02:46.800 And he said, you know what, maybe there's something here. 00:02:46.879 --> 00:02:49.599 And he quit his job on Wall Street and he started Star Carpet. 00:02:50.080 --> 00:02:56.960 And so back then, uh we were uh exclusively just importing French handmade rugs into the US. 00:02:57.840 --> 00:03:00.719 And uh it started that way for maybe a decade or so. 00:03:00.879 --> 00:03:12.560 And uh I think my grandfather built a legacy of product innovation and product sourcing all around how do we find unique and beautiful things that have never been in America to bring them to America. 00:03:12.800 --> 00:03:22.639 And um, he unfortunately passed away early uh in 1970, when my grip my father and uncle were uh 19 and 20, respectively. 00:03:22.879 --> 00:03:25.280 And so they joined the business early on. 00:03:25.439 --> 00:03:32.159 Uh my grandmother, who was involved uh a little, got much more involved to help transition for them to be leaders. 00:03:32.479 --> 00:03:32.719 Wow. 00:03:32.879 --> 00:03:39.840 Uh and uh they took over the business uh when it was just a single showroom in New York, really just doing handmade rugs. 00:03:40.080 --> 00:03:47.520 And um, from a product category standpoint, they expanded to every category imaginable and in soft surfaces. 00:03:47.680 --> 00:03:51.120 They uh sourced from now sourced from all over the world. 00:03:51.280 --> 00:03:54.400 They took one showroom to now 25 corporate showrooms. 00:03:54.560 --> 00:03:57.520 They built a wholesale business selling to about a thousand resellers. 00:03:57.759 --> 00:03:58.080 Definitely. 00:03:58.400 --> 00:04:04.159 Um they entered the fabric business, which now is our uh sister company, Scal Mondre, which is uh which we're owners of. 00:04:04.560 --> 00:04:04.960 Wonderful. 00:04:05.039 --> 00:04:14.879 Um and so they've really done an incredible job expanding product, expanding distribution, and I mean revenue grew about 150x since they took over. 00:04:15.120 --> 00:04:19.680 So if I'm gonna grow 150x, it's still gonna be a little harder because it's starting from a bigger number. 00:04:19.839 --> 00:04:29.680 So my goal is maybe not 150x growth, but uh certainly we have uh aggressive uh growth goals in terms of how we can continue to keep the legacy going. 00:04:29.920 --> 00:04:39.839 And um, you know, it's exciting because for them, uh, they grew a company, you know, let's just say five to seven percent a year, but you do that over 50 years, it really compounds to something great. 00:04:40.160 --> 00:04:42.879 So um and so they played the

long game. 00:04:43.199 --> 00:04:43.600 Exactly. 00:04:43.680 --> 00:04:46.000 And I would say I would frame it slightly differently. 00:04:46.079 --> 00:04:47.759 It's not even the long game, it's the infinite game. 00:04:47.920 --> 00:04:48.079 Okay. 00:04:48.240 --> 00:04:50.160 It's like biz there's two types of games in this world. 00:04:50.319 --> 00:04:52.000 Yeah, there's finite games and infinite games. 00:04:52.079 --> 00:04:52.399 I like that. 00:04:52.560 --> 00:04:53.600 And so, like, what's the difference? 00:04:53.759 --> 00:04:57.360 So a finite game has a start, an end, and a score, right? 00:04:57.439 --> 00:04:58.160 You know who wins. 00:04:58.240 --> 00:04:58.319 Right. 00:04:58.720 --> 00:04:59.120 Sports, right? 00:04:59.199 --> 00:05:00.160 We were talking about sports before. 00:05:00.319 --> 00:05:00.480 Yeah. 00:05:00.639 --> 00:05:04.480 So you always can look at the scoreboard, you see who's winning, and you know when the game's gonna end. 00:05:04.720 --> 00:05:06.160 Business is an infinite game. 00:05:06.240 --> 00:05:07.600 Yeah, there really is no scoreboard. 00:05:07.839 --> 00:05:09.439 I mean, you can make scoreboards, sure. 00:05:09.600 --> 00:05:20.319 And there really is no start and end because um, you know, when that happens, like in the public markets as an example, it can actually force some decisions that are not good for the long term of the business. 00:05:20.399 --> 00:05:20.639 Right. 00:05:20.720 --> 00:05:23.920 Um, like mass layoffs were created by the stock market, right? 00:05:24.160 --> 00:05:28.720 By General, you know, motors or general electric or whatever those big companies to optimize for shareholder returns. 00:05:28.879 --> 00:05:40.160 And so I'd say my father and uncle took an infinite game approach and they said, How do we just keep sourcing the best product, expanding our assortment, opening in new markets, uh, serving more designers around the world. 00:05:40.319 --> 00:05:46.560 Um, and that approach, they never were concerned with like where there's a certain destination they're getting to. 00:05:46.639 --> 00:05:49.199 They just wanted the goal is to keep playing the game, right? 00:05:49.279 --> 00:05:49.839 It's not to win. 00:05:50.079 --> 00:05:50.399 I love that. 00:05:51.120 --> 00:05:53.680 I've never heard anyone explain it the way you just explained it. 00:05:54.160 --> 00:05:57.600 I think it's a great explanation to finite infinite. 00:05:57.680 --> 00:06:04.480 And I've I've had the pleasure of having like Leia Koker and Wayne Heising and all these different people mentor me in different things in business. 00:06:04.639 --> 00:06:06.959 But what you just said is very cool. 00:06:07.279 --> 00:06:07.680 Awesome. 00:06:07.759 --> 00:06:09.680 Well, I I wish I could take credit for the idea. 00:06:09.920 --> 00:06:14.959 There's an amazing uh business leader, Simon Sinek, uh, who wrote a book called The Infinite Game. 00:06:15.120 --> 00:06:19.920 And so um I'm I'm plagiarizing, so to speak, but I'll give him credit so it's not plagiarizing, but he's an amazing. 00:06:20.639 --> 00:06:24.879 What a great mindset that literally there is no cap. 00:06:25.199 --> 00:06:26.240 Yeah, you just gotta keep playing. 00:06:26.319 --> 00:06:30.959 And then it becomes, you know, how well what are the things to do to build an organization that can play in the infinite game? 00:06:31.120 --> 00:06:39.759 And I think that's been a big inspiration for me in terms of um being very conscious and choiceful in terms of what we're trying to create. 00:06:39.920 --> 00:06:44.560 Because, you know, I sometimes poke it like my father and uncle, it in all fun, right? 00:06:44.720 --> 00:06:47.680 Is like they built the best brand, one of the best brands in the industry. 00:06:48.000 --> 00:06:51.519 Well, it's the pinnacle of all coffee and rug in the world. 00:06:52.879 --> 00:06:56.240 And but with the way they did it was maybe a little bit more by accident. 00:06:56.319 --> 00:06:58.959 They were like, oh, well, let's just do every issue of architectural digest. 00:06:59.120 --> 00:06:59.279 All right. 00:06:59.600 --> 00:07:03.040 And they did that for 40 years, and then boom, yeah, there wasn't much diversity of channels. 00:07:04.079 --> 00:07:07.199 But before they got involved, because they got involved in 1970. 00:07:07.600 --> 00:07:08.720 And because they had to. 00:07:09.040 --> 00:07:10.480 I know, I'm just gonna tell you a story. 00:07:10.800 --> 00:07:20.560 So when we got when we got engaged and Tiffany was decorating a house that I had just had just had built, one of the first things he was like, well, I want to put this carpet in the living room. 00:07:20.639 --> 00:07:23.199 And I'm like, okay, it's the$28,000. 00:07:25.759 --> 00:07:26.720 Now we have a big living room. 00:07:26.800 --> 00:07:29.439 I said, okay, but she's just a stark carpet. 00:07:29.759 --> 00:07:30.480 Stark carpet. 00:07:30.720 --> 00:07:32.000 And I mean that's how I felt it. 00:07:32.720 --> 00:07:33.759 I was like, what's the difference? 00:07:33.920 --> 00:07:38.399 And she said to me, Well, stark carpet, Jackie Kennedy put him into the Oval Office. 00:07:38.560 --> 00:07:38.800 Yeah. 00:07:39.040 --> 00:07:40.560 And I was like, oh, really? 00:07:40.879 --> 00:07:43.040 I'd say that's probably my favorite heirloom in the company. 00:07:43.120 --> 00:07:47.839 Is there's actually a letter that Jackie Kennedy handwrote my grandmother thanking her for the work that they did together. 00:07:47.920 --> 00:07:50.079 And so that's like in the Stark vault somewhere, which is really cool. 00:07:50.399 --> 00:07:50.480 Yeah. 00:07:50.720 --> 00:07:52.879 Well, that's what she said to me and sold me on. 00:07:52.959 --> 00:07:53.439 It was okay. 00:07:54.079 --> 00:07:58.399 Well, and that's what's such like an amazing thing about the Stark legacy, right? 00:07:58.560 --> 00:08:09.040 Is I mean, that time that your dad and uncle were building

this brand, there was just so much growth that I don't think we even understood then that was happening. 00:08:09.439 --> 00:08:09.759 Absolutely. 00:08:09.839 --> 00:08:18.399 I mean, the whole interior design industry was like a product of the world wars when people were, you know, now after the World War II, they came home and everyone was home. 00:08:18.480 --> 00:08:27.120 And then the baby boomers, you know, generation came up and people for the first time like focused on the way that they lived, or at least not for the first time ever, but for the first time in a long time. 00:08:27.360 --> 00:08:27.519 Right. 00:08:27.680 --> 00:08:35.679 And that was like, you know, perfect timing for a company like ours to get started because, you know, with no internet, um, distribution was much more simple. 00:08:35.840 --> 00:08:41.120 Give people access to product, uh, give them great service, and grow by opening new markets. 00:08:41.440 --> 00:08:45.120 So your your your your father and your uncle took over in 1970. 00:08:45.279 --> 00:08:46.240 When did you take over? 00:08:46.399 --> 00:08:47.200 In the 2000s? 00:08:47.759 --> 00:08:52.399 So I joined the business in a full-time capacity in uh 2011. 00:08:52.720 --> 00:08:53.120 2011. 00:08:53.360 --> 00:08:54.240 Or maybe early 2020. 00:08:54.480 --> 00:08:55.519 Did you do anything before? 00:08:55.919 --> 00:08:56.159 Yes. 00:08:56.240 --> 00:08:58.320 So I never thought I was gonna join the business. 00:08:58.399 --> 00:08:58.960 Oh, yeah. 00:09:00.480 --> 00:09:01.919 Did you know this was what you would do? 00:09:02.320 --> 00:09:04.720 I interned there, you know, in high school and whatnot. 00:09:04.799 --> 00:09:13.360 And I always like to joke that, you know, the way I bonded with my dad when I was really young, he taught me how to uh take away commission from a salesperson when they didn't charge enough, right? 00:09:13.440 --> 00:09:16.639 Like he would review margin reports with me when I was like eight years old. 00:09:16.720 --> 00:09:17.919 And so like that was our bonding. 00:09:18.000 --> 00:09:22.080 And you know, we still bond in ways like that, slightly evolved, more evolved now. 00:09:22.240 --> 00:09:25.120 But um I never thought I was gonna join in a full-time capacity. 00:09:25.279 --> 00:09:32.960 I was very much at still am very much into technology, but but but was very much into technology uh in high school and in college. 00:09:33.039 --> 00:09:39.440 Uh I did a few startup y things uh in college that I realized I didn't want to do long term. 00:09:39.519 --> 00:09:42.799 And so some had moderate success, but there were nothing was like my passion that I wanted to do. 00:09:44.480 --> 00:09:45.840 What kind of like application? 00:09:46.159 --> 00:09:49.600 Well, so my first business was not actually uh a technology company. 00:09:49.679 --> 00:09:50.960 It was an event production company. 00:09:51.039 --> 00:09:59.679 Uh so I organized, uh started with like small parties, then it became like fraternity and sorority of big events, then became uh multi-city concerts. 00:09:59.919 --> 00:10:01.759 Okay, very cool specifically. 00:10:02.080 --> 00:10:04.720 And uh I learned how to DJ from that, and that was really fun. 00:10:04.799 --> 00:10:06.240 Uh but I didn't want to be a promoter. 00:10:06.320 --> 00:10:08.639 Uh and then I did a digital thing. 00:10:08.879 --> 00:10:10.320 So I was uh 18 when that started. 00:10:10.480 --> 00:10:12.879 So you definitely followed the same path. 00:10:13.279 --> 00:10:13.519 Yeah? 00:10:13.679 --> 00:10:13.840 Yeah. 00:10:13.919 --> 00:10:22.159 Well, I come from uh my father owned a chain of grocery stores called Food Town in New York, had a lot of them, and he wanted me to go into the grocery store business. 00:10:22.320 --> 00:10:26.240 I had no interest, but wanted to go into the entertainment and in college and went to St. 00:10:26.399 --> 00:10:27.200 John's University. 00:10:28.080 --> 00:10:29.279 They didn't put on concerts. 00:10:29.440 --> 00:10:34.639 I started putting on concerts there and started promoting concerts and doing events and so forth. 00:10:34.720 --> 00:10:37.519 And it's a great way for a young person to hustle. 00:10:37.840 --> 00:10:38.080 For sure. 00:10:38.320 --> 00:10:43.679 You know, it's like it's a social thing, but you're building something to when you're young and yeah. 00:10:43.919 --> 00:10:47.200 Yeah, and I mean I learned to DJ because of it, and now I still do DJ sometimes just for fun. 00:10:47.519 --> 00:10:47.840 You really? 00:10:48.000 --> 00:10:48.799 Yeah, just for fun. 00:10:49.120 --> 00:10:50.399 Um and it's really fun. 00:10:50.559 --> 00:10:51.519 But um, yeah, I did that. 00:10:51.600 --> 00:10:55.919 Then I did a digital marketing company, which was kind of hybrid technology uh and marketing. 00:10:56.000 --> 00:11:00.000 Uh, and then my you know got out of that because I realized it wasn't my passion. 00:11:00.159 --> 00:11:04.320 And then I started a tech company, uh, and which I did for two years. 00:11:04.399 --> 00:11:07.519 And it was uh, you know, people always say, What was the the idea of the company? 00:11:07.679 --> 00:11:09.759 Think Venmo, uh huh, but not Venmo. 00:11:10.000 --> 00:11:11.919 And before Venmo, the world was ready for Venmo. 00:11:12.000 --> 00:11:14.320 It was kind of trying to be mobile-based transactions. 00:11:14.399 --> 00:11:14.799 Yeah, right. 00:11:14.879 --> 00:11:20.960 Um, but it was a little before its time and struggled with technical co-founders uh because I'm technical-ish, I guess you could say. 00:11:21.039 --> 00:11:21.200 Yeah. 00:11:21.360 --> 00:11:23.759 I'm technically inclined, but I'm not a software developer. 00:11:24.320 --> 00:11:29.919 And you know, it's just funny with AI today, I could have started that company by myself, um, but I couldn't at the time. 00:11:30.240 --> 00:11:31.039 Timing's everything. 00:11:31.279 --> 00:11:32.799 So I graduated from

college early. 00:11:32.879 --> 00:11:47.759 I went to business school in Michigan, University of Michigan, and um graduated a year early, pursued the startup life for a year full in college and a year full-time, and then uh made the tough decision to shut down the company because I was, you know, I remember specifically I was with my co-founder in New York. 00:11:47.919 --> 00:11:57.600 We just met with an investor, and we had to decide do we want to move to San Francisco and raise all this money and basically own none of the company, or do we just want to call it quits? 00:11:57.919 --> 00:11:59.919 Wow, what a crazy decision, Patrick. 00:12:00.159 --> 00:12:00.320 Yeah. 00:12:00.399 --> 00:12:01.519 So we called it quits. 00:12:02.080 --> 00:12:05.679 And I basically had a rent expense and no income. 00:12:05.919 --> 00:12:07.440 So I said, Well, what am I gonna do? 00:12:07.600 --> 00:12:10.000 And my dad said, Well, maybe you could try working for me. 00:12:10.159 --> 00:12:11.039 I said, you know what? 00:12:11.200 --> 00:12:13.039 Until I figure it out, I'll give it a shot. 00:12:13.360 --> 00:12:19.440 And so I started uh in the IT department, uh, I I think just in charge of our website and at Stark. 00:12:19.679 --> 00:12:22.240 Uh and I said to my dad, there's one condition. 00:12:22.320 --> 00:12:27.120 Uh, I'll only work for the company if if you give me the budget to put us on a new computer system. 00:12:27.360 --> 00:12:27.759 Oh, yeah. 00:12:27.840 --> 00:12:29.440 And um, so that was my condition. 00:12:29.679 --> 00:12:32.639 And uh he agreed, and it was long overdue at the time. 00:12:32.879 --> 00:12:36.000 You know, we uh our process back then was very manual. 00:12:36.159 --> 00:12:43.919 You know, our sales team uh would hand handwritten notes to a typist to type up their quotes, and this is 2012. 00:12:44.000 --> 00:12:44.159 Yeah. 00:12:44.240 --> 00:12:49.440 Okay, so this is like, you know, we I used to look at my dad and I was like, I don't know how this company is so successful. 00:12:49.600 --> 00:12:50.879 Um you've done an amazing job. 00:12:51.039 --> 00:12:52.080 Imagine if we were efficient. 00:12:52.159 --> 00:12:55.360 Imagine if we embraced technology in the same way that you embraced products. 00:12:55.519 --> 00:12:55.919 Right, right. 00:12:56.080 --> 00:12:58.799 And so um that was kind of how I started. 00:12:58.960 --> 00:13:05.360 And back then, I, you know, I learned a lot over these last 15 years to have been with the company of like how my role should evolve. 00:13:05.440 --> 00:13:09.039 But there were so many people in the industry who said, Oh, like you shouldn't do technology. 00:13:09.120 --> 00:13:10.639 You can always hire people for that. 00:13:10.799 --> 00:13:11.840 You need to do product. 00:13:12.000 --> 00:13:13.360 Product is the engine of the company. 00:13:13.440 --> 00:13:13.679 Right. 00:13:13.919 --> 00:13:20.720 And, you know, I've struggled with that because there's so many product experts in my company, but there weren't that many technology experts. 00:13:21.120 --> 00:13:26.799 And so at a point in my career, I felt like I shouldn't be leading technology in the granular way. 00:13:27.279 --> 00:13:34.080 But fast forward to today, um, we don't have a CTO, chief technology officer, and me partnering with another member of our C suite. 00:13:34.240 --> 00:13:42.799 Like I'm involved running our, you know, IT priority list on a bi-weekly basis of our sprints and what we're developing and how we're using technology. 00:13:42.879 --> 00:13:47.360 And so it's like I've learned that it's okay, that a CEO doesn't have to do what the book says. 00:13:47.519 --> 00:13:47.600 Right. 00:13:48.080 --> 00:13:51.840 I like every CEO needs to leverage their strengths, is is what I've learned. 00:13:52.080 --> 00:13:53.679 And my strength is technology. 00:13:53.919 --> 00:13:58.320 And um who's to say what I should do other than me and where I think I can add the most value. 00:13:58.399 --> 00:14:00.159 And so technology is one of those things. 00:14:00.240 --> 00:14:05.039 And that's kind of how I started new computer system, you know, obviously had pros and cons. 00:14:05.120 --> 00:14:10.159 You know, fast forward, we're on this, we've done it again since then because I learned a lot through that process. 00:14:10.320 --> 00:14:20.480 And yeah, it's been uh an evolution from IT to sales to sales management to you know support to eventually becoming CEO in 2020. 00:14:20.799 --> 00:14:25.519 So, what does that look like for you when you become CEO at 2020? 00:14:25.679 --> 00:14:31.200 I mean, what was that like waking up the next day almost like was like I'm here? 00:14:31.919 --> 00:14:32.240 Oh my god. 00:14:33.440 --> 00:14:35.039 Almost an 80-year-old company. 00:14:35.120 --> 00:14:35.919 Yeah, for sure. 00:14:36.240 --> 00:14:38.320 Your grandfather and your father and your uncle. 00:14:38.639 --> 00:14:40.480 Yeah, I mean, it's a lot of pressure, isn't there? 00:14:40.720 --> 00:14:41.279 I for sure. 00:14:41.360 --> 00:14:45.919 And I would say it probably wasn't typical in terms of how it happened for two reasons. 00:14:46.159 --> 00:14:47.919 One, I'd say maybe is more typical. 00:14:48.080 --> 00:14:52.080 Uh, like many family businesses, you know, titles are kind of an afterthought. 00:14:52.480 --> 00:14:56.879 And so uh in 2017 is when I really took more of a leadership role. 00:14:57.039 --> 00:15:04.240 Um, you know, I learned about um these different methodologies that exist for how to run a business, which I didn't know existed. 00:15:04.320 --> 00:15:06.879 So there's one called traction or the entrepreneurial operating system. 00:15:07.120 --> 00:15:08.320 There's one called scaling up. 00:15:08.399 --> 00:15:13.519 And so there's all these frameworks that exist in the world that are like blueprints for how to run a business. 00:15:13.679 --> 00:15:15.360 And I had no idea these existed. 00:15:15.519 -->

00:15:20.159 So once I learned about that, it was like it was like the um, they clicked with you, obviously, though. 00:15:20.480 --> 00:15:20.639 For sure. 00:15:20.799 --> 00:15:22.320 I mean, it actually ignited a whole learning. 00:15:22.879 --> 00:15:24.559 You had to receive that information. 00:15:24.799 --> 00:15:27.840 Like sometimes people can put that in front of you and you don't. 00:15:27.919 --> 00:15:30.720 So the fact that you had to pull that in. 00:15:30.960 --> 00:15:35.679 We had like our first executive team offsite after we read those books in 2017. 00:15:35.840 --> 00:15:39.360 And while I wasn't the CEO, we started forming a leadership team more formally. 00:15:39.440 --> 00:15:45.360 We started doing more formal business planning, longer term, mid-term, shorter term, coming, having quarterly objectives and measuring them. 00:15:45.519 --> 00:15:48.799 So that all started like when I think my title was senior vice president. 00:15:48.879 --> 00:15:50.080 I can't remember at the time. 00:15:50.240 --> 00:16:03.519 Um, and then when 2020 came around, I had been for probably a couple of years already acting in some ways like a CEO, in terms of doing like a quarterly town hall where I give a presentation to the whole company about the state of the company and things like that. 00:16:03.679 --> 00:16:05.759 Um did you you enjoy that? 00:16:06.000 --> 00:16:10.639 Yeah, I love, I love, I love talking about uh things I'm excited about. 00:16:10.720 --> 00:16:10.879 Right. 00:16:11.200 --> 00:16:14.240 I get excited about I'm an optimist. 00:16:14.320 --> 00:16:14.480 Yeah. 00:16:14.639 --> 00:16:17.600 And I'm so you know, I get very excited, things I'm optimistic about. 00:16:17.679 --> 00:16:19.200 Uh and so I enjoy doing that. 00:16:19.440 --> 00:16:25.679 And um, yeah, and so I never thought it would it be so impactful to me to get the title. 00:16:25.919 --> 00:16:30.960 And how it happened is you know, March 7th, 2020 came around and the world shut down. 00:16:31.039 --> 00:16:33.200 I don't know if this is the seventh, tenth, something like that. 00:16:33.360 --> 00:16:33.600 Yeah. 00:16:34.080 --> 00:16:40.720 And, you know, we had to give a uh we had to communicate to our company what's what we're gonna do, what's the game plan was. 00:16:41.679 --> 00:16:46.159 So we sent a first message, hey, we'll get uh by the last day of March, we're gonna let everyone know our plans. 00:16:46.240 --> 00:16:49.840 We got to see what happens for a couple weeks, but like we had to shut down an office because someone got COVID. 00:16:50.000 --> 00:16:57.759 And then, you know, we get I gave a big presentation or speech on March 30th or whatever, the last day of March, about our plans. 00:16:57.919 --> 00:17:00.879 And I would say that was probably the most defining moment of my career. 00:17:01.039 --> 00:17:02.879 Um, it was a very emotional experience. 00:17:03.360 --> 00:17:07.920 Um, and uh the company did amazing through this. 00:17:08.559 --> 00:17:08.960 You thrived. 00:17:09.200 --> 00:17:09.839 Yeah, we thrived. 00:17:09.920 --> 00:17:21.039 I mean, obviously we couldn't have expected the home industry to come back, but we were down like 70% sales from the previous month in April, then down 40%, then down 25%, and then pretty much up 20% for the next 27 months. 00:17:21.279 --> 00:17:24.720 So it was like a six-month rebound, and then it was just like off to the races. 00:17:24.880 --> 00:17:33.200 Um, and through that whole journey, um, anyone, anyone who had doubts in the company about my role or what my role should be, I think. 00:17:33.599 --> 00:17:35.039 It was so in it. 00:17:35.200 --> 00:17:39.599 And so it wasn't like, you know, I got called in by my father and uncle, hey, you've been doing such a great job. 00:17:39.759 --> 00:17:42.880 Like you would you like to be we're we're gonna honor you by making you CEO. 00:17:43.039 --> 00:17:50.480 It was more like me and my uh now uh COO went in and were like, hey dad, I think it would be good for the company if I was CEO. 00:17:50.559 --> 00:17:52.079 And he's like, You want to be CEO? 00:17:52.160 --> 00:17:53.039 I'm like, I think it'd be good. 00:17:53.119 --> 00:17:53.759 He's like, okay. 00:17:54.640 --> 00:17:54.960 I love that. 00:17:55.200 --> 00:17:55.839 Do I get a raise? 00:17:55.920 --> 00:17:56.559 He's like, no. 00:17:56.799 --> 00:17:58.000 I'm like, okay. 00:17:58.319 --> 00:18:04.240 And so do they still call you daily, weekly, or yeah, I mean they're still involved for sure. 00:18:04.960 --> 00:18:06.160 I mean, much more in a board capacity. 00:18:06.240 --> 00:18:08.480 And they're not like, you know, they don't want to deal with the headaches anymore. 00:18:08.559 --> 00:18:16.079 They want to develop product, manage inventory, and talk about strategy, which we deal kind of more regularly for inventory, but strategically once a month. 00:18:16.240 --> 00:18:24.720 Um, and yeah, it was uh, you know, I I for for them and for me and for family businesses maybe more broadly, uh, it's all about building trust. 00:18:25.119 --> 00:18:29.039 And you know, by the time COVID happened, I'd been at the company for almost 10 years. 00:18:29.200 --> 00:18:39.200 And then through the way that we led uh through COVID and the the approach we took, you know, this kind of leaders eat last approach where the sacrifices we made were made the biggest at the top, right? 00:18:39.359 --> 00:18:47.599 I took no pay for six months, then it kind of just trickled down and and whatever, uh it really just earned trust inside the company and with my father and uncle. 00:18:47.759 --> 00:18:54.880 And, you know, I would say there's still moments for sure where it's just a question of like, even today, is like, am I really the CEO? 00:18:54.960 --> 00:18:59.039 Or like, you know, because my father and uncle don't care about a lot of things, but when they care, they really care. 00:18:59.119 --> 00:19:00.240 And of

course, I listen to that. 00:19:00.319 --> 00:19:03.039 They're our board, and there's still people who built this amazing company. 00:19:03.200 --> 00:19:10.960 Um, and so that I think is the dynamics of a family business that are a little atypical is just because I'm CEO, like it doesn't mean I can make every decision in a vacuum. 00:19:11.200 --> 00:19:15.039 Like, I have a board who I'm accountable to, and it's family, so it's slightly different. 00:19:15.119 --> 00:19:31.920 Um, but it's been uh super fun, and I'm really grateful of the trust that they put in me uh and the empowerment that I have, even to this now, to this day, especially, but even starting in 2020 and before, uh, because we've definitely had to evolve the company in ways that are maybe a little more uncomfortable for them. 00:19:32.079 --> 00:19:34.880 Uh, and uh it seems to be working out, so we're super excited about it. 00:19:35.279 --> 00:19:39.359 The dynamic of a family being involved in a business isn't easy. 00:19:39.759 --> 00:19:40.000 No. 00:19:40.240 --> 00:19:42.400 I mean, uh fortunately, we have a small family. 00:19:42.799 --> 00:19:49.119 Well, I was gonna ask if I know your cousin Ashley's a huge part of the design part of the business. 00:19:49.279 --> 00:19:51.200 Is there other family members involved? 00:19:51.440 --> 00:19:54.640 So it's just Ashley and I are the two family members uh in the third generation. 00:19:54.799 --> 00:20:00.160 So she started a few years before me, and uh we work really well together because we have very different interests. 00:20:00.400 --> 00:20:02.720 You know, I like to say she's shapes and colors, and I'm numbers. 00:20:02.880 --> 00:20:03.200 I love it. 00:20:03.440 --> 00:20:07.680 And so uh if she doesn't want any direct reports, and I guess I have all the direct reports. 00:20:07.759 --> 00:20:07.920 Right. 00:20:08.160 --> 00:20:09.920 And so uh we were very complimentary in our. 00:20:11.359 --> 00:20:11.599 Yeah. 00:20:11.759 --> 00:20:15.119 So it works out when you know your lanes and there's not like a competing interest. 00:20:15.200 --> 00:20:23.119 And you know, you know, I know I've heard horror stories when there's you know people who um don't respect the authority that's being given to the next generation or whatever. 00:20:23.200 --> 00:20:25.359 And you know, my father and uncle are amazing. 00:20:25.519 --> 00:20:27.359 My my relationship with Ashley is amazing. 00:20:27.440 --> 00:20:33.279 We have very different lanes, very different interests, very different ideas, uh, but all kind of in a similar vein. 00:20:33.440 --> 00:20:37.519 And so it's worked out really well and been a lot less complicated than some of the horror stories I've heard. 00:20:37.839 --> 00:20:41.279 What a blessing to watch that all come through. 00:20:41.519 --> 00:20:48.559 So, as you've taken on this, you know, new role, uh where is your vision for Stark? 00:20:49.279 --> 00:20:54.000 So the way I like to think about that,

I I like to use the word legacy. 00:20:54.319 --> 00:20:54.720 I do too. 00:20:55.039 --> 00:20:56.960 I'd say especially with the word Stark. 00:20:57.200 --> 00:20:57.839 For sure. 00:20:58.079 --> 00:21:04.160 And um, you know, I I remember, I don't remember what year it was, but we did a big national sales leadership event. 00:21:04.400 --> 00:21:09.920 And this it took me a couple years at the company to really like realize I was gonna stay at the company. 00:21:10.000 --> 00:21:12.880 I for the first two, three years, I was like kind of floundering a little bit. 00:21:13.039 --> 00:21:19.440 I mean, I was maybe being productive, but I wasn't like quite the passion inside of me for the business wasn't quite there yet. 00:21:19.599 --> 00:21:19.920 Yeah. 00:21:20.079 --> 00:21:33.440 Um, and I'd say what held me back was I always in what drove my desires to be an entrepreneur before and trying to start companies was I always wanted to build my own legacy and not live under the the my father and uncle's shadow. 00:21:34.079 --> 00:21:42.880 And um when I realized that they built a legacy, but I can use the company to build a different legacy. 00:21:43.279 --> 00:21:45.599 That to me was like the moment that it started changing. 00:21:45.680 --> 00:21:52.240 And we had a big national sales event and we kind of like polled our leaders what is the legacy that my father and uncle have left? 00:21:52.720 --> 00:21:56.480 And the short version is it was all product and brand, as you said, right? 00:21:56.640 --> 00:21:58.960 Amazing brand, amazing amazing product. 00:21:59.279 --> 00:22:05.359 So it's Okay, well, the best way for me to build a differentiated legacy is first define what I want that to be, right? 00:22:05.519 --> 00:22:06.400 Start with the end in mind. 00:22:06.640 --> 00:22:08.319 What do we want this next chapter to be? 00:22:08.640 --> 00:22:09.039 To look like. 00:22:09.279 --> 00:22:10.480 Yeah, so we can build that. 00:22:10.960 --> 00:22:14.640 And for us, it's all about service, people in service. 00:22:14.960 --> 00:22:18.799 And so now, like our mission as an organization is to create world-class experiences. 00:22:19.359 --> 00:22:28.720 You know, obviously we are a client-centric organization, but delivering world-class experiences for clients starts with our team members internally, uh, especially the ones who serve our clients. 00:22:28.880 --> 00:22:33.039 Because if the team members don't have a world-class experience, how can they deliver a world-class experience? 00:22:33.200 --> 00:22:35.920 And so there's this circle, and it's a tough question. 00:22:36.000 --> 00:22:37.519 Sometimes people say, well, what's more important? 00:22:37.680 --> 00:22:39.599 The employee experience or the customer experience? 00:22:39.759 --> 00:22:42.559 And I can't really answer that because they're so essential to each other. 00:22:42.640 --> 00:22:42.960 Yeah, yeah, yeah. 00:22:43.759 --> 00:22:47.200 Um that, but that's why we say

to create world-class experiences is our mission. 00:22:47.359 --> 00:22:59.119 And so we do that by investing in our people, and we do that by giving investing in the tools that our people can use to take uh things away from them that they don't need to do so they can focus on relationships. 00:22:59.279 --> 00:23:03.839 And so that's how we hope that what my I hope my legacy becomes is all around service and people. 00:23:03.920 --> 00:23:15.119 Uh and you know, culture has been a huge piece of um my job for the last 15 years, uh, learning about the power of culture, you know, through these frameworks that I talked about in 2017. 00:23:15.200 --> 00:23:18.799 Uh, but you know, we we have like core values that we talk about all the time. 00:23:18.960 --> 00:23:21.519 I did a culture, uh we do quarterly culture calls. 00:23:21.599 --> 00:23:23.440 So I did a quarterly culture call yesterday. 00:23:23.680 --> 00:23:31.599 And that was a fun exercise kind of discovering our core values because organizations who've been around for decades have core values, whether they know them or not. 00:23:31.759 --> 00:23:32.000 Right. 00:23:32.160 --> 00:23:32.319 Right. 00:23:32.640 --> 00:23:35.519 And so it was like, it wasn't like, well, what should our core values be? 00:23:35.680 --> 00:23:44.000 It was like, well, let's interview all the people who've been here decades about why they're here and what kept them to be so successful. 00:23:44.240 --> 00:23:46.160 And we have to discover our core values. 00:23:46.480 --> 00:23:47.519 That's huge, actually. 00:23:47.759 --> 00:23:47.839 Yeah. 00:23:47.920 --> 00:23:51.039 And so it's like the man on the mission, the man on the moon exercise, it's called. 00:23:51.119 --> 00:23:59.200 So it's like if if we were to take 10 people from our company to the moon to start Stark uh in like global or whatever, Stark space, yeah, who would they be and why? 00:23:59.359 --> 00:24:01.920 And those are the people who represent our core values the most. 00:24:02.000 --> 00:24:16.400 And how do we articulate that so we can use it not just in um like for recruiting to make sure we bring on the right people, but to use it in ways that help remind those who've been here a long time what are the behaviors that we know to be successful. 00:24:16.480 --> 00:24:22.319 So when no rule exists, when a situation happens that we couldn't have expected, that they know how to act, right? 00:24:22.400 --> 00:24:24.880 We want to be principles-based, not rules-based. 00:24:24.960 --> 00:24:30.559 So that way when a situation we couldn't have predicted comes up, people act in similar ways. 00:24:30.640 --> 00:24:32.880 And our values is kind of the guidebook for that. 00:24:33.039 --> 00:24:34.799 And so that's been a big focus as well. 00:24:34.880 --> 00:24:42.640 And building focusing on culture, being proactive in terms of defining and and reinforcing our culture to create world-class experiences. 00:24:43.119 --> 00:24:48.160 So, I mean, I've worked with the the same rep in Fort Lauderdale for many, many years. 00:24:48.400 --> 00:24:54.319 What is like when you're talking about the culture, is it giving them like because they do stay? 00:24:54.400 --> 00:24:57.759 It's been the same person 20 something years. 00:24:58.000 --> 00:25:00.240 But what makes them stay? 00:25:00.480 --> 00:25:02.480 Is it the pay structure? 00:25:02.640 --> 00:25:03.599 Is it the goals? 00:25:03.680 --> 00:25:05.359 Is it the culture? 00:25:05.519 --> 00:25:05.680 Yeah. 00:25:06.000 --> 00:25:06.160 Yeah. 00:25:06.240 --> 00:25:10.960 I mean, I would say something is that why would someone want to leave stock? 00:25:11.119 --> 00:25:11.599 Where else is there? 00:25:12.559 --> 00:25:13.839 But there's growth, there's opportunity. 00:25:14.240 --> 00:25:18.079 Maybe going to a different industry completely, but you're at the pinnacle. 00:25:18.400 --> 00:25:28.240 Well, there's a uh a a I could write a my father and uncle could write a whole book on people who thought they could out Stark Stark and take what they learned as Stark to start another company that competes with Stark and beat Stark. 00:25:28.319 --> 00:25:33.440 And some have been successful, and I've noticed don't mean any disrespect by it, but no one's been able to out Stark Stark. 00:25:33.839 --> 00:25:36.319 Um they've certainly have tried, that's for sure. 00:25:36.559 --> 00:25:39.920 Um so sorry, remind me of the question? 00:25:40.160 --> 00:25:45.279 No, it's just like I was just curious, like how you know the growth within the company is amazing. 00:25:45.680 --> 00:25:46.319 Why do they stay? 00:25:46.480 --> 00:25:47.440 So they don't follow. 00:25:47.839 --> 00:25:55.359 We like to say, you know, uh people care about what company they join, but they don't care about what company they work for. 00:25:55.519 --> 00:25:56.480 So what do I mean by that? 00:25:56.559 --> 00:26:03.039 Yeah right all of like best places to work and all this stuff, like that's just a recruiting tactic, right? 00:26:03.119 --> 00:26:06.880 People will apply to work at Stark because we're quote unquote best places to work. 00:26:06.960 --> 00:26:09.599 And we are awarded best places to work based on the survey. 00:26:10.000 --> 00:26:16.400 I forgot the name of the organization that credits it, but it's in a survey that goes out to our employees, and if we reach a certain threshold, we're considered best places to work. 00:26:16.559 --> 00:26:17.519 So we did that. 00:26:17.680 --> 00:26:20.559 And but the why we do it is for recruiting, not for retention. 00:26:20.880 --> 00:26:27.039 Because three weeks after someone starts, they could not care less that you're considered a great place to work. 00:26:27.200 --> 00:26:28.640 All they care about is their experience. 00:26:28.720 --> 00:26:30.559 And so what influences their experience? 00:26:30.720 --> 00:26:32.960 Their local environment, the people that they work with. 00:26:33.119 -->

00:26:39.839 There is a larger discrepancy of employee experiences across our locations than with our company and other companies. 00:26:40.079 --> 00:26:47.039 Because it all boils down to the people in that location, the manager in that location, and how that location represents our culture. 00:26:47.200 --> 00:26:48.960 And so, why do people stay? 00:26:49.119 --> 00:26:52.480 Because they're around people that they think are like-minded, that have similar interests. 00:26:52.640 --> 00:26:55.119 Of course, they feel supported by the organization. 00:26:55.200 --> 00:27:10.240 Uh, and we hope with our uh, like, I guess if we say what's our retention strategy, so to speak, our goal is how can we help uncover people's personal goals so that we can position the company as the vehicle through which they can achieve those goals. 00:27:10.400 --> 00:27:13.920 Because true motivation comes to achieving goals that may be outside of work. 00:27:14.000 --> 00:27:14.160 Yeah. 00:27:14.319 --> 00:27:14.559 Right. 00:27:14.720 --> 00:27:24.880 And if the company can allow them to achieve those goals, which might be on a day-to-day basis, you know, most people who've been with our company in sales specifically for a long time really enjoy people, right? 00:27:25.359 --> 00:27:29.680 They like sales, but they also like the aspect of sales that is relationship-based, right? 00:27:29.759 --> 00:27:31.440 We're not transactional, we're relational. 00:27:31.599 --> 00:27:33.279 We don't serve customers, we serve clients. 00:27:33.440 --> 00:27:33.759 Right. 00:27:34.000 --> 00:27:47.039 And um the cloud, the people who stay at our company a long time share that mindset and those interests, but they also uh see the life that Stark can provide to them as something that allows them to do what they want on a personal level. 00:27:47.119 --> 00:27:52.240 And so I'd say that's probably what's kept most people because it's hard to make it at our company. 00:27:52.400 --> 00:27:56.559 We have a lot of turnover the first three years of salespeople because it's relationship-based, right? 00:27:56.640 --> 00:27:57.920 So they have to build those relationships. 00:27:58.000 --> 00:27:58.240 Right. 00:27:58.400 --> 00:27:58.559 Right. 00:27:58.640 --> 00:28:00.480 And we have a lot of salespeople already. 00:28:00.559 --> 00:28:02.160 So a lot of relationships are taken. 00:28:02.319 --> 00:28:04.319 And so becoming successful is really hard. 00:28:04.480 --> 00:28:06.480 We have really high turnover over the first three years. 00:28:06.640 --> 00:28:12.960 But once they get past three years, and especially once they get past five years, like the likelihoods they stay for decades is really high. 00:28:13.440 --> 00:28:14.480 That's so amazing. 00:28:14.720 --> 00:28:28.400 So when it's so now we kind of talked a little bit about the culture when it comes to the designing and the growth, like the acquiring of Scala Mondre, like where did that kind of fall into the Stark umbrella? 00:28:28.880 --> 00:28:29.119 Sure. 00:28:29.359 --> 00:28:33.039 So I'd say that there's two different ways that we've thought about acquisitions. 00:28:33.200 --> 00:28:44.240 The Scala Mondre one is a little unique in that my father and uncle got into the fabric business as a just product expansion strategy, right? 00:28:44.319 --> 00:28:48.559 They're like, okay, well, we serve clients, we serve interior designers already, we serve clients who are doing homes. 00:28:48.720 --> 00:28:50.559 Is there more products we can sell to them? 00:28:50.880 --> 00:28:54.799 And they bought a company called Old World Weavers from a woman named Iris Acker. 00:28:55.119 --> 00:29:08.480 Iris, I know, which is like another legacy brand that's just so that was that was you know great foresight from them in terms of looking uh to other brands that uh share similar values and have you know can build this legacy. 00:29:08.720 --> 00:29:14.480 Then they bought a company called Grey Watkins and Fontille, which was a kind of a Carolinas-based brand. 00:29:14.720 --> 00:29:26.720 And then because they had multiple brands, they became Stark Fabric as the umbrella with some of our owned brands, and then we started distributing brands like Liliev from France or other brands that are European as like a multi-line showroom. 00:29:26.960 --> 00:29:34.240 And I joined the business, and our our fabric business was let's just call it 20% of total. 00:29:34.480 --> 00:29:34.799 Okay. 00:29:35.039 --> 00:29:40.799 Um and but it wasn't nearly 20% of like net income, for example. 00:29:40.880 --> 00:29:44.400 It was a lot of work and it wasn't as that much uh return. 00:29:44.880 --> 00:29:56.160 And what the challenge was is when with$100 of investment opportunity, it was hard to ever make the case for any of those dollars to go towards the fabric division. 00:29:56.559 --> 00:30:04.559 So the fabric, so it was like a it was like a I don't want to say downward spiral because it was doing fine, but it certainly was not the same opportunity that we saw on the stock side. 00:30:04.720 --> 00:30:09.759 And my general approach is if we're gonna do something, we better be best in the world at it, otherwise we shouldn't do it. 00:30:09.920 --> 00:30:10.160 Yeah. 00:30:10.240 --> 00:30:10.400 Right. 00:30:10.559 --> 00:30:14.240 And if you're gonna be best in the world, you can't be the best in the world at everything, right? 00:30:14.319 --> 00:30:20.240 You know, the master of what is it, the master of all is the master of none, or something like that, master of none, you know, okay at all. 00:30:20.799 --> 00:30:22.880 A man who tries to catch too many rabbits catches none. 00:30:23.119 --> 00:30:23.440 Yeah, exactly. 00:30:23.839 --> 00:30:24.319 That's another one. 00:30:24.559 --> 00:30:31.599 And so Scalamondre was actually uh a strategy to say, well, how do we essentially get fabric out of our day-to-day thinking? 00:30:31.839 --> 00:30:45.680 And so um we we

Scalamondre was owned by a gentleman named Louis Renzo, and basically we partnered with him, more so, where he's now still the CEO, uh, and he runs the day-to-day of Scalamondre. 00:30:45.759 --> 00:30:46.880 And so we call it sister companies. 00:30:46.960 --> 00:30:47.039 Okay. 00:30:47.359 --> 00:30:54.160 So there's the Scala Mondre business, which uh Lewis Renzo and the Renzo family are equity holders of, and Lewis runs on a day-to-day basis. 00:30:54.319 --> 00:30:57.839 We support their shared resources like accounting, HR, and IT. 00:30:57.920 --> 00:31:02.799 Um, and then there's the Stark organization, which has totally separate sales force, totally separate leadership team, et cetera. 00:31:02.960 --> 00:31:04.400 And so I straddle both a little bit. 00:31:04.480 --> 00:31:09.839 Some of you know, some of our leadership team members do, like finance, our CFO, and so did the other fabrics kind of move over? 00:31:10.079 --> 00:31:10.160 Yeah. 00:31:10.319 --> 00:31:13.279 And so we, you know, we say we got married to Scalamondre and took their name. 00:31:13.440 --> 00:31:17.119 So Old World Weavers and Gray Watkins now were distributed by Scalamondre. 00:31:17.200 --> 00:31:18.960 And so Scalamondre became the umbrella. 00:31:19.279 --> 00:31:19.599 Fabric. 00:31:19.759 --> 00:31:19.920 Right. 00:31:20.079 --> 00:31:22.799 The brands that we distributed became distributed by Scalamondre. 00:31:22.880 --> 00:31:27.359 The Scalamondre line, because their company was just Scalamondre, became the biggest line. 00:31:27.440 --> 00:31:27.599 Right. 00:31:27.759 --> 00:31:29.279 Uh, and it still is the biggest line. 00:31:29.359 --> 00:31:35.519 Uh, but now it's kind of four or five owned brands and a bunch of distributed brands all under the Scalamondre umbrella. 00:31:35.920 --> 00:31:37.279 And will they stay that way? 00:31:37.440 --> 00:31:40.079 Like will you keep those names for the Yeah? 00:31:40.160 --> 00:31:47.920 I mean, we, you know, I'd say we're definitely more focused on growing inventory and our own designs than we are on bringing on more distributed brands. 00:31:48.160 --> 00:31:51.519 But the fabric industry, what I've learned is so different than the carpet industry. 00:31:51.599 --> 00:31:55.119 You know, I'd say the biggest difference is in a room, how many fabrics do you have? 00:31:55.279 --> 00:31:56.079 How many carpets do you have? 00:31:56.400 --> 00:31:56.559 True. 00:31:56.799 --> 00:31:56.880 Right? 00:31:57.119 --> 00:31:58.319 There's only usually one rug. 00:31:58.400 --> 00:31:58.480 Yeah. 00:31:58.720 --> 00:32:00.640 There could be a dozen fabrics, right? 00:32:00.799 --> 00:32:04.799 How much fabric, what's the average order value of a fabric order versus a carpet order? 00:32:04.960 --> 00:32:08.000 You know,$600 versus$6,000. 00:32:08.240 --> 00:32:08.480 Correct. 00:32:08.640 --> 00:32:10.000 So it's a very different business. 00:32:10.079 --> 00:32:10.240 Yeah. 00:32:10.400 --> 00:32:12.160 Uh, it's

also a much more competitive business. 00:32:12.319 --> 00:32:14.720 And Scalamandre is not the biggest. 00:32:14.880 --> 00:32:20.160 And so there's some really big, really well-oiled machine fabric companies out there at the high end. 00:32:20.240 --> 00:32:25.599 And so it's it's a totally different competitive landscape versus carpet, is the the competitive landscape is totally different. 00:32:25.759 --> 00:32:28.480 People ask me all the time, who is Stark's biggest competitor? 00:32:28.720 --> 00:32:31.119 And my response is the local retailer, right? 00:32:31.279 --> 00:32:33.200 Which is interesting because we serve the local retailer also. 00:32:34.160 --> 00:32:38.400 Um, but there's not one company on a national scale that does what Stark does. 00:32:38.559 --> 00:32:40.160 We have some online competitors, sure. 00:32:40.240 --> 00:32:41.920 We have some local retail competitors. 00:32:42.160 --> 00:32:51.279 But um, you know, when we think about competition, it's more like this idea of who are the worthy rivals and like why are local retail stores beating us in certain markets? 00:32:51.519 --> 00:32:52.960 And we have to learn from them. 00:32:53.119 --> 00:33:00.960 Uh and so we have to serve them, but also learn from them and come up with a this symbiotic relationship, which is kind of challenging because we serve all these different uh client groups. 00:33:01.119 --> 00:33:02.319 Uh and so back. 00:33:02.880 --> 00:33:05.920 But aren't those aren't those local retailers selling stock? 00:33:06.400 --> 00:33:08.160 So uh yes and no. 00:33:08.400 --> 00:33:17.200 Um we have a piece of our we own a company called Prestige Mills, uh, which is a distributor of luxury carpets uh to stores. 00:33:18.319 --> 00:33:18.559 Yeah. 00:33:18.640 --> 00:33:22.160 And so um we have about a thousand uh prestige dealers. 00:33:22.640 --> 00:33:32.400 Uh Stark as a is an exclusive line that's only available through Stark corporate showrooms, the Stark Carpet website, and what we call our Stark premiere partners, of which there's 25. 00:33:32.559 --> 00:33:40.000 So there's 50 points round numbers around the country where you can physically go in and see Stark product and buy Stark samples or and buy Stark rugs. 00:33:40.160 --> 00:33:43.279 Um, and so most local retailers do not sell Stark. 00:33:43.519 --> 00:33:48.160 However, many of the best ones do because we've partnered with them, right? 00:33:48.240 --> 00:33:52.480 And so we we believe that, you know, rising tide rises all boats. 00:33:52.640 --> 00:34:10.239 And how do we bring the best entrepreneurs in the carpet industry all together with our brand, with our resources, all working together so that way our collective group continues to take more and more market share from, you know, individuals who are not part of our network who don't work with us or other online companies that are trying to do things? 00:34:10.320 --> 00:34:14.639 Um, because pooling the resources together is we've seen to be a good strategy. 00:34:15.039 --> 00:34:22.320 So, as your role has, you know, as CEO, do you have to go overseas and go constantly deal with these mills? 00:34:22.400 --> 00:34:25.519 And are you guys acquiring those mills, or maybe you already do? 00:34:25.679 --> 00:34:28.159 Just kind of understand a little bit how that goes. 00:34:28.320 --> 00:34:37.920 Because I've actually gotten beautiful pictures of a stark rug that we had made for a client, like literally all the people working on the machines and the looms and all the threads. 00:34:38.000 --> 00:34:38.800 I mean, they're awesome. 00:34:38.880 --> 00:34:43.920 And it helped my clients like 30-week lead time, you know, to get those pictures. 00:34:44.159 --> 00:34:51.920 Yeah, I mean, I would say that to answer your question directly and then kind of you know speak to that, I don't go as overseas as much anymore. 00:34:52.079 --> 00:34:52.320 Uh-huh. 00:34:52.480 --> 00:34:56.480 Um, I'd say that for the first, I don't know if it was seven or eight years, but I went to India once a year. 00:34:56.719 --> 00:34:56.960 Okay. 00:34:57.119 --> 00:35:00.320 Uh, and so um, I don't know if you've been to India, but it's a unique place. 00:35:00.719 --> 00:35:05.920 And uh places I go, I've been in and go in India are places that you are never gonna go, I can assure you. 00:35:06.480 --> 00:35:10.159 It's three hours outside of Badoe, right, or Varanasi. 00:35:10.639 --> 00:35:13.199 Um, but India's a magical country, right? 00:35:13.280 --> 00:35:14.320 Jaipur is incredible. 00:35:14.480 --> 00:35:19.679 We have a huge partner in the south uh in Kochi, who is incredible, makes amazing product. 00:35:19.840 --> 00:35:23.119 Um, and I used to go all the time. 00:35:23.280 --> 00:35:29.039 I don't go as much anymore because, as I said, I'm not directly accountable for product development. 00:35:29.199 --> 00:35:29.360 Right. 00:35:29.519 --> 00:35:29.679 Right. 00:35:29.760 --> 00:35:34.800 Ashley's involved, but we have a whole product development team that is there overseas three to four times a year. 00:35:34.960 --> 00:35:37.199 And so India is our biggest country of sourcing. 00:35:37.360 --> 00:35:37.440 Okay. 00:35:37.679 --> 00:35:44.000 Nepal is pretty important to us as well from a custom standpoint because you know, there's a lot of container business that comes out of India. 00:35:44.320 --> 00:35:46.480 Um, but we do, you know, one-off rugs. 00:35:46.559 --> 00:35:52.400 And so we find a manufacturer to create a one-off rug that they're never going to create again is a whole challenge in and of itself. 00:35:52.480 --> 00:35:55.360 And the whole custom rug supply chain is complicated. 00:35:55.440 --> 00:35:58.159 Um, and in uh Nepal rather is incredible at that. 00:35:58.239 --> 00:35:59.280 They're like specialized at that. 00:35:59.360 --> 00:36:01.519 And so we're really big out of Nepal for custom. 00:36:01.599 --> 00:36:03.280 We do a lot of custom out of India as

well. 00:36:03.440 --> 00:36:05.440 Um our textiles come from Europe. 00:36:05.599 --> 00:36:07.360 I used to go to trade shows every year. 00:36:07.440 --> 00:36:08.800 I don't do that as much anymore. 00:36:08.960 --> 00:36:12.719 Um, I try to focus my travel on seeing our team, honestly. 00:36:12.880 --> 00:36:16.000 Because I, you know, that's your legacy that you just spoke about. 00:36:16.320 --> 00:36:25.519 Yeah, to me, it's uh I can, you know, my my dad told me a story long ago of um my grandfather used to uh share an office, I think, with Edward Fields. 00:36:25.599 --> 00:36:32.960 Oh, and so they like shared an office and he's yeah, if you know like Marshall Fields or Yeah, well, Edward Fields is the like the uh hand-tufted rug company. 00:36:33.199 --> 00:36:33.360 Okay. 00:36:33.840 --> 00:36:39.280 And um and one of the things I think this was him, so maybe I'm butchering a story, but who knows? 00:36:39.440 --> 00:36:42.800 Um, that he was very involved in client relationships. 00:36:42.960 --> 00:36:45.519 And after he passed away, it was a real big challenge for the business. 00:36:45.679 --> 00:36:54.079 So my dad from very early on said, you know, in order to build the company that can outlast you, client relationships can't be dependent on you. 00:36:54.400 --> 00:36:56.400 And so I'm certainly involved in client relationships. 00:36:56.480 --> 00:36:58.719 And I whenever I go to markets, I do meet with clients. 00:36:58.800 --> 00:37:01.599 And even at home here, I you know, I still meet with clients. 00:37:01.760 --> 00:37:10.960 Um, I just believe that a more sustainable approach is working with the team and helping them build their own relationships and then supporting them, but not driving. 00:37:11.119 --> 00:37:18.000 So um I still go overseas when I have to, but I have a two-year-old and another on the way, so I try not to travel as much these days. 00:37:18.320 --> 00:37:23.920 And how did you end up in Miami when I always think of, like I said earlier, stock being based in New York? 00:37:24.159 --> 00:37:27.440 Yeah, I mean, I never thought I was gonna leave New York until COVID. 00:37:27.599 --> 00:37:31.840 And then COVID happened, and my and my father and uncle said, Hey, you're CEO, we're going to Florida. 00:37:32.079 --> 00:37:36.559 Okay, so I said, All right, they're like, come, come, come move to Palm Beach or Boca. 00:37:36.719 --> 00:37:38.480 And I'm like, I'm not moving to Palm Beach or Boca. 00:37:38.800 --> 00:37:43.119 And um, at the time I was single, you know, I just met my wife, so we were just dating. 00:37:43.280 --> 00:37:52.400 Um, and you know, on our first date with my wife, we like joked about how amazing it'd be to live in LA and how we're never gonna be able to do it because of both of our jobs. 00:37:52.559 --> 00:37:54.719 And then like two months later, the world shut down. 00:37:54.880 --> 00:37:56.239 And so we said, you know what? 00:37:56.400 --> 00:37:57.920 I was a big believer

in remote work. 00:37:58.000 --> 00:37:59.599 I was like, remote work is here to stay. 00:37:59.760 --> 00:38:02.320 I'm moving to California, and it's gonna be great. 00:38:02.480 --> 00:38:06.960 And then I get to California, and we realized remote work is not here to stay. 00:38:07.119 --> 00:38:08.559 And remote work is actually terrible. 00:38:08.719 --> 00:38:10.480 Yeah, culture means being in the world. 00:38:10.719 --> 00:38:11.840 Especially from a cultural standpoint. 00:38:12.079 --> 00:38:16.079 And so obviously work flexibility is important, yes. 00:38:16.320 --> 00:38:19.679 Uh, and hybrid schedules are here to stay, but complete work from home is not here to stay. 00:38:19.840 --> 00:38:31.280 And you know, we there were so many things, issues that happened through our company, whether it was onboarding senior people or you know, marketing and product collaborating, where things just got missed because people aren't together. 00:38:31.360 --> 00:38:37.679 It's like you know, things take longer because you have to schedule the call and talk about a specific thing versus the organic nature of talking about stuff. 00:38:37.840 --> 00:38:44.079 And so I really felt that the company suffered from me being in California. 00:38:44.559 --> 00:38:48.880 And um I don't want to be the person who chooses myself over the company. 00:38:49.280 --> 00:38:51.119 And so uh we had to make a change. 00:38:51.280 --> 00:38:52.239 I mean, that was one factor. 00:38:52.400 --> 00:38:53.599 My family was in the East Coast. 00:38:53.679 --> 00:38:56.320 I started going back and forth to New York more, and that's a much tougher flight. 00:38:56.480 --> 00:38:58.239 It's a quick we didn't want to go back to New York. 00:38:58.400 --> 00:39:02.639 And we kind of said, all right, well, um, we don't want to go to New York, we don't want to be in LA anymore. 00:39:02.719 --> 00:39:04.079 So where else is there to go? 00:39:04.800 --> 00:39:06.719 So we kind of landed in Miami. 00:39:07.280 --> 00:39:11.679 So, what does Stark's operation look like in Miami for you? 00:39:12.079 --> 00:39:15.360 Well, there's me, and then there's my office in the backyard of my house. 00:39:15.679 --> 00:39:16.559 That's our Miami. 00:39:16.880 --> 00:39:17.360 I love it. 00:39:17.519 --> 00:39:19.840 Uh, but Florida's a very important state to us as an organization. 00:39:20.159 --> 00:39:20.320 Yes. 00:39:20.559 --> 00:39:23.360 We have um a showroom in Hollywood, which is like North Miami. 00:39:23.920 --> 00:39:24.880 Yeah, and that's where we visit. 00:39:25.280 --> 00:39:27.519 We have a showroom in Naples on the West Coast. 00:39:27.760 --> 00:39:30.800 We we have a showroom in North Palm Beach. 00:39:30.880 --> 00:39:31.119 Yeah. 00:39:31.280 --> 00:39:35.039 Uh we are opening right now, it just opened a showroom in West Palm Beach. 00:39:35.440 --> 00:39:38.559 Which is becoming a huge little design hub itself. 00:39:38.719 --> 00:39:39.039 I mean. 00:39:39.519 --> 00:39:40.719 So uh that's great. 00:39:40.880 --> 00:39:43.119 Uh and we eventually are gonna do something in Miami. 00:39:43.199 --> 00:39:45.679 We have a Stark premiere partner in Miami who we really love. 00:39:46.000 --> 00:39:47.280 Like in the design district. 00:39:47.760 --> 00:39:55.280 They're actually they have uh multiple locations, two locations, one in Coral Gables and one just north of the design district, I think on 62nd in Biscayne. 00:39:55.360 --> 00:39:59.280 Um, and um we're gonna do more in Miami over time. 00:39:59.440 --> 00:40:02.400 This past year, we did a lot of real estate stuff for the company. 00:40:02.559 --> 00:40:08.559 We opened our corporate office, we're opening West Palm Beach, we opened a second showroom in New York City, we opened a Charleston showroom in South Carolina. 00:40:09.199 --> 00:40:11.039 It's another great market for you guys. 00:40:11.280 --> 00:40:11.519 Yeah. 00:40:11.679 --> 00:40:21.360 I mean, it's it's interesting because now we because we have Atlanta and Charlotte and Charlotte specifically and related to Charleston, like we were serving Charleston clients, but they just couldn't see us without traveling far. 00:40:21.840 --> 00:40:25.519 And so our showroom expansion strategy is kind of slowing down. 00:40:25.599 --> 00:40:27.519 Like we don't really need more showrooms. 00:40:27.679 --> 00:40:31.119 We're certainly open to smaller showrooms in different markets. 00:40:31.199 --> 00:40:34.480 Um, but we believe much more in from an expansion standpoint. 00:40:34.559 --> 00:40:37.519 Well, physical spaces is a huge part of our belief, right? 00:40:37.679 --> 00:40:41.519 We do not believe in downsizing physical access to product. 00:40:41.679 --> 00:40:54.800 Um, we just believe that our expansion physically can be leveraging partners more and supporting our showrooms because we have between our partners and our showrooms, like, you know, 50 already, and that could probably grow to 75, leveraging our partners. 00:40:54.960 --> 00:41:01.119 Um and uh how do we focus on making those environments as great as possible? 00:41:01.199 --> 00:41:15.599 And oh, and we have, you know, huge rent roll and staffing a showroom, you know, is challenging because one thing I learned early on in my career is we could spend all the money building the most incredible showroom in the most amazing market, and it'd be a massive failure because we don't have great people. 00:41:15.840 --> 00:41:22.239 And on the other side, we could have a really dingy showroom in a decent market and it could be incredible because we have great people. 00:41:22.960 --> 00:41:26.800 And so, like, I'd say the people we have in the sh the showroom is 80% of the success. 00:41:26.960 --> 00:41:34.159 The showroom itself is only 20%, which is like ironic because we're in this like beautiful industry, and like there's certain expectations of how a showroom should look. 00:41:34.239 --> 00:41:41.199 And what I've seen is those are

just all I don't know if it's ego or maybe it's brand, it's brand credibility maintenance, so to speak. 00:41:41.280 --> 00:41:43.440 Um, but it does not influence success. 00:41:43.920 --> 00:41:49.679 No, I had a beautiful office on a my my office address was one South Ocean Boulevard. 00:41:49.840 --> 00:41:59.199 I mean, it was beautiful in Boca, looked at the ocean, and I never got one project because of where I was or what my office looked like. 00:41:59.360 --> 00:42:07.360 And it was because having kids, I was like, I need to just get closer to home, closer to like my little circle, and I stopped caring as much for that. 00:42:07.440 --> 00:42:08.880 And it is about the people. 00:42:09.119 --> 00:42:12.079 So that makes sense that that's where your focus is. 00:42:12.400 --> 00:42:18.880 We say to ourselves, if we open a showroom, we have risk, we have rent, and we have people we have to figure out. 00:42:18.960 --> 00:42:19.519 And it's hard. 00:42:19.760 --> 00:42:20.400 That's the hardest part. 00:42:20.639 --> 00:42:30.559 If we find the best entrepreneurs in the industry who have amazing people already, and we can support them for them to grow their business and to support our business growth, that is a safer strategy. 00:42:30.639 --> 00:42:33.920 And what we found is actually a more, in some ways, a more successful strategy. 00:42:34.079 --> 00:42:40.719 It's not one or the other, but at a certain point, certain strategies get to the tail end, and then we have to look at new strategies. 00:42:40.880 --> 00:42:46.719 And from a corporate showroom expansion standpoint, in the way that we've done showrooms at least, that's kind of slowing down. 00:42:46.880 --> 00:42:52.079 Certainly there are opportunities for more showrooms outside of major markets where we have a showroom to have like a satellite. 00:42:52.400 --> 00:42:56.880 But again, having a satellite without the right person or the right people will serve no serve no purpose. 00:42:56.960 --> 00:42:58.559 And so it all goes back to the people. 00:42:59.039 --> 00:43:00.880 And what about stocking things? 00:43:00.960 --> 00:43:03.840 And I know you mentioned your warehouses in Georgia. 00:43:04.000 --> 00:43:07.760 Like, is there anything made and manufactured here? 00:43:08.559 --> 00:43:08.880 Yes. 00:43:09.039 --> 00:43:14.480 So we have a ownership stake in a mill in Pennsylvania that does high-end machine woven carpet. 00:43:14.559 --> 00:43:18.239 Uh, it also does some um, it does mainly Wilton's and Axminsters. 00:43:18.559 --> 00:43:23.519 Uh, and we certainly source a lot from there, but it can't keep up with our demand, right? 00:43:23.599 --> 00:43:27.039 So there's only so much supply we can get domestically for high-end carpet. 00:43:27.199 --> 00:43:33.599 You know, there's the big companies like the Shaw and the Mohawks that do like the synthetic fiber tufted, machine tufted. 00:43:33.679 --> 00:43:33.840 Yeah. 00:43:34.000 --> 00:43:34.880 That's just not our

business. 00:43:35.280 --> 00:43:37.440 And so um, it's they're huge businesses, right? 00:43:37.599 --> 00:43:43.039 Both multi-billion dollar businesses, but we're luxury residential at our core or boutique hospitality. 00:43:43.280 --> 00:43:46.239 And uh, that's not the product that resonates with our clients. 00:43:46.320 --> 00:43:48.000 And we're not really trying to go after that business. 00:43:48.239 --> 00:43:53.519 We actually, uh, if anything, are going the other way because it's so easy to race to the bottom. 00:43:53.599 --> 00:43:56.639 And what we want to do is elevate the top, uh, the top, right? 00:43:56.800 --> 00:43:59.760 And so if we keep doing unique and special things at the top end. 00:44:00.159 --> 00:44:14.639 And we can find partners who want to elevate their business alongside us, then we can keep rising the tide, so to speak, continuing to provide unique and special things for interior designers, um, as well as homeowners who are, you know, looking for the best of the best. 00:44:14.800 --> 00:44:21.119 Um, and we've seen that to work well, and whether it's pushing the boundaries of like broadloom as a term, right? 00:44:21.199 --> 00:44:23.840 The people outside of our industry don't know what broadloom means. 00:44:24.320 --> 00:44:26.960 And many people in our industry don't even know why it's called broadloom. 00:44:27.360 --> 00:44:28.159 A little history lesson. 00:44:28.400 --> 00:44:29.280 Yeah, you could tell us about that. 00:44:29.519 --> 00:44:37.440 Back in the uh Louis IV, the like the king days, right, in France, if you go to these palaces, you'll see that uh there's a seam every 27 inches. 00:44:37.519 --> 00:44:37.760 Uh-huh. 00:44:38.000 --> 00:44:41.440 Because historically, all carpet was 27 inches wide. 00:44:41.599 --> 00:44:44.320 And like a wallpaper or all almost, right? 00:44:44.480 --> 00:44:45.039 Yeah, exactly. 00:44:45.119 --> 00:44:48.559 And so what's what kind of piece of equipment is that made on? 00:44:48.639 --> 00:44:49.840 It's called a narrow loom. 00:44:49.920 --> 00:44:50.159 Uh-huh. 00:44:50.320 --> 00:44:52.000 And so what is a wide loom? 00:44:52.320 --> 00:44:52.639 Broad. 00:44:52.880 --> 00:44:53.280 Broad. 00:44:53.679 --> 00:44:56.239 So broadloom is basically the opposite of a narrow loom. 00:44:56.639 --> 00:45:09.920 And part of why broadloom is so important to our company is my grandfather actually worked with loom manufacturers to retrofit the first some of the first uh broad loom machines that could make patterned broadloom. 00:45:10.000 --> 00:45:14.639 So he was one of the first importers of uh patterned broadloom carpet into America. 00:45:14.719 --> 00:45:17.440 And that's kind of like that was like a huge catalyst for growth. 00:45:18.480 --> 00:45:20.719 Like that I always envision too. 00:45:21.039 --> 00:45:30.480 Yeah, but but what's so interesting about that is while so many people think of us for Broadloom, we do more custom hand-knotted rugs, one-off

rugs, than any company in the world, probably. 00:45:30.800 --> 00:45:31.760 At least for hand-knotted. 00:45:32.079 --> 00:45:35.679 Um, and so it's interesting, is like there's such different categories. 00:45:35.840 --> 00:45:43.760 One's in stock, one could be made custom size, delivered quickly, versus custom, it's like, you know, it could be six, nine, 12, 18 month lead times, depending on what you're making. 00:45:43.840 --> 00:45:44.000 Yeah. 00:45:44.320 --> 00:45:47.760 Um, and what we've tried to do is say, how do we bridge the two categories together? 00:45:47.920 --> 00:45:59.199 And so we said, all right, well, what if we took a hand knotted custom quality, made it by hand knotting into a roll that was 12 feet wide by 80 feet long or 15 feet wide by 80 feet long? 00:45:59.360 --> 00:46:01.440 And now we have hand-knotted silk broadloom. 00:46:01.519 --> 00:46:01.679 Right. 00:46:01.840 --> 00:46:10.400 And so, like, hey, you know, maybe that's not for everybody because it's broadloom and the way we price it is, you know, it could be expensive, more expensive than ordering a custom, but you can get it quickly. 00:46:10.559 --> 00:46:15.119 And so, what company is crazy enough to stock hand-knotted silk broadloom? 00:46:15.519 --> 00:46:16.000 None. 00:46:16.239 --> 00:46:16.880 That's for sure. 00:46:17.039 --> 00:46:19.199 Because it takes nine months to make a piece of inventory. 00:46:19.280 --> 00:46:21.519 You know, it's it's extremely expensive, it's extremely heavy. 00:46:21.599 --> 00:46:22.880 We can't even bring it into the US. 00:46:23.039 --> 00:46:24.400 We have to store it at our mills. 00:46:24.559 --> 00:46:29.039 When someone orders a rug, we have to make it from overseas and then ship it because the role is too heavy. 00:46:29.199 --> 00:46:32.480 And so it's a whole supply chain nightmare, so to speak. 00:46:33.119 --> 00:46:43.119 But that's where we specialize is we, you know, we talk about our core values, which we I talked about before, but then we have what we call our brand promises, which is like what we promise our customers or our clients, rather. 00:46:43.280 --> 00:46:43.440 Yeah. 00:46:43.599 --> 00:46:47.840 And so that's all about people, product, uh, service, and heritage. 00:46:48.000 --> 00:46:52.320 And so then why those are important, we go into in a lot of detail for on a training standpoint. 00:46:52.400 --> 00:47:08.800 And we use those pillars on our website communication because we have to say, in a world of Instagram and TikTok and digital, we have to make sure people understand what makes Stark different versus a startup that's well funded, that doesn't have a rent expense, that spends all their money on marketing and samples, right? 00:47:08.880 --> 00:47:10.000 It's easy to look amazing. 00:47:10.079 --> 00:47:13.039 And there are some great companies that are newer that are taking that approach. 00:47:13.280 --> 00:47:23.679 We're just a very different company, and we need to make sure

that we communicate what's so special about Stark to people who are looking for the best product and service experience they can get in luxury soft services. 00:47:24.320 --> 00:47:29.039 And what does Instagram and social media and all of that look like for Stark? 00:47:30.400 --> 00:47:35.760 It's certainly something we are um supporting, I guess you could say. 00:47:36.079 --> 00:47:41.280 Um we have not necessarily seen any like direct ROI, so to speak, from social. 00:47:41.760 --> 00:47:44.400 Um, we think it's an important brand awareness thing. 00:47:44.480 --> 00:47:45.760 You know, social proof is important. 00:47:45.840 --> 00:47:51.280 When someone hears about Stark for the first time and sees we have 250,000 followers on Instagram, they're like, oh, this is a legit company. 00:47:51.440 --> 00:47:51.679 Right. 00:47:51.840 --> 00:47:54.880 Um, but if we had 150,000 followers, would they feel any different? 00:47:55.039 --> 00:47:55.360 I don't know. 00:47:56.559 --> 00:48:03.920 You know, it's not like the conversion of people who we discover on social media is high because many people who follow us can't afford our product. 00:48:04.159 --> 00:48:04.400 Right? 00:48:04.559 --> 00:48:07.199 Uh, you know, our average order value is like$6,000 for a rug. 00:48:07.360 --> 00:48:07.519 Right. 00:48:07.679 --> 00:48:10.960 And that's not the average person on, especially on TikTok, let alone uh Instagram. 00:48:11.360 --> 00:48:11.920 Correct, yeah. 00:48:12.159 --> 00:48:14.960 And so uh we think it's really important for the brand. 00:48:15.039 --> 00:48:18.800 It's a great way to engage with like a community of followers. 00:48:18.960 --> 00:48:29.760 Um, and we've found that what's actually more impactful to the business is every showroom has its own local Instagram, which has, you know, thousands of followers, single-digit thousands of followers. 00:48:30.159 --> 00:48:37.519 And that is actually a much better way to engage with our clients because it's the team is managing it locally, they're engaging with the local clients. 00:48:37.840 --> 00:48:39.199 Which goes back to your culture. 00:48:39.360 --> 00:48:41.039 Like, and who's our competitive set? 00:48:41.119 --> 00:48:42.639 Our competitive set is the local retailer. 00:48:42.719 --> 00:48:53.760 And so the local retailer has localized content that fits the local market versus our beautiful, highly curated brand content that exists on our national Instagram, that might not resonate everywhere. 00:48:53.920 --> 00:48:54.079 Right. 00:48:54.239 --> 00:48:58.639 And so it's important to have both because uh we're serving different groups of people in different ways. 00:48:58.800 --> 00:49:00.239 So we certainly believe in it. 00:49:00.320 --> 00:49:03.679 And we're just trying to find the right balance to say how much should we invest in it? 00:49:03.920 --> 00:49:12.239 Obviously, from a digital advertising standpoint and to reach new people, we we spend a lot on uh like Meta and Instagram as well as Google. 00:49:12.320 --> 00:49:16.719 Uh, because as you kind of said earlier, we're like the ultimate if you know, you know brand. 00:49:16.880 --> 00:49:17.039 Correct. 00:49:17.199 --> 00:49:19.519 It's like you don't know Stark, but if you do, you do. 00:49:19.760 --> 00:49:20.159 You know Stark. 00:49:20.320 --> 00:49:24.400 So like to your story, I remember when I was uh 16, I went to a Suite 16 in Westchester. 00:49:24.480 --> 00:49:28.800 I lived in New York at the time, and I was there, it was like my friend's girlfriend or something. 00:49:28.960 --> 00:49:30.880 And we were like the last ones there. 00:49:31.039 --> 00:49:34.880 And the girl introduced me to her dad, and her dad was like, Hold on, honey, come down here. 00:49:35.039 --> 00:49:36.559 Like the star carpet guy's here. 00:49:36.639 --> 00:49:40.400 And he was like, I waited my whole life for my first star carpet, and I was like, What is this guy smoking? 00:49:41.119 --> 00:49:42.079 I've heard the same thing. 00:49:42.320 --> 00:49:43.840 Yeah, I'll never forget that. 00:49:44.400 --> 00:49:50.400 I mean, it's like having a you know, it's like carteer jewelry, or like, you know, it's it's but there's one big difference, right? 00:49:50.480 --> 00:49:53.360 So Cartier jewelry, you know, Hermes bags. 00:49:53.519 --> 00:49:55.679 Yeah, you see that and you recognize it. 00:49:55.760 --> 00:49:56.000 Yeah. 00:49:56.159 --> 00:50:00.719 But carpet, this nice you don't walk into someone's home and recognize the carpet. 00:50:00.800 --> 00:50:02.400 Certainly there might be recognizable patterns. 00:50:03.039 --> 00:50:03.760 Tiffany does. 00:50:04.800 --> 00:50:06.079 Well, like your antelope pattern. 00:50:06.400 --> 00:50:07.599 There's certainly recognizable patterns. 00:50:08.880 --> 00:50:13.360 But it's very different because all these fashion brands or jewelry brands play on ego, right? 00:50:13.519 --> 00:50:18.239 People want to be seen having an airman's bag and having all this stuff, right? 00:50:18.400 --> 00:50:24.960 And so we hope to build a relationship with our clients where when someone walks in, they want to tell them this is a star carpet. 00:50:25.199 --> 00:50:25.280 Right. 00:50:25.440 --> 00:50:25.519 Right. 00:50:25.679 --> 00:50:32.639 Well, I I've actually heard clients say to Tiffany when the husband comes in and the husband says, I want to make sure we have a star carpet in this house. 00:50:32.880 --> 00:50:33.039 Yeah. 00:50:33.119 --> 00:50:34.079 So I've heard that. 00:50:34.239 --> 00:50:34.400 Yeah. 00:50:34.480 --> 00:50:37.679 So it's it's certainly it's it's it's it's certainly what we aspire for. 00:50:37.760 --> 00:50:37.920 Yeah. 00:50:38.159 --> 00:50:41.840 It's challenging sometimes, though, especially when our main relationship is with designers. 00:50:42.000 --> 00:50:45.599 A homeowner isn't as invested necessarily in the brand. 00:50:45.760 --> 00:50:47.519 And that's why we focus on the designers.

00:50:47.599 --> 00:50:49.119 They're a much better client to have. 00:50:49.199 --> 00:50:52.239 Um, and we want to just serve both groups in different ways and ways that make sense. 00:50:52.639 --> 00:50:58.079 Well, and I've always appreciated that Stark was a brand that did cater to the design industry. 00:50:58.320 --> 00:51:16.000 Was that like truly a conscious decision, or was it one of these, again, just evolved that that's where people used to buy carpets or yeah, I mean, the whole going back to the World War II analogy that we talked about earlier, the entire United States high-end home industry was trade-only, right? 00:51:16.159 --> 00:51:18.159 Up until the 80s, 90s. 00:51:18.239 --> 00:51:28.239 It was the only way to buy nice home furnishings was through an interior designer, going to a building that didn't let you in if you were an interior designer, let alone into the store, into the showroom that you couldn't get in the building. 00:51:28.400 --> 00:51:28.480 Right. 00:51:28.800 --> 00:51:33.119 And so kudos to however that happened in the United States because it didn't happen anywhere else, right? 00:51:33.199 --> 00:51:34.480 The Europe has no trade only. 00:51:34.719 --> 00:51:36.960 Like there is no trade only anywhere outside of North America. 00:51:37.119 --> 00:51:37.440 I know. 00:51:37.599 --> 00:51:37.760 Right? 00:51:37.840 --> 00:51:40.719 There's just retail stores that give designers trade pricing. 00:51:40.880 --> 00:51:41.760 That's like the world. 00:51:42.079 --> 00:51:43.920 The United States is different for whatever reason. 00:51:44.079 --> 00:51:49.519 And so we developed into the business model that existed at the time, which was trade only. 00:51:49.679 --> 00:52:02.320 I'd say the conscious decision was saying, how can we navigate expanding our model to create more access in a way that still serves the designer better than they can be served by companies who stay trade only. 00:52:02.559 --> 00:52:04.320 And so we call our model trade preferred. 00:52:04.719 --> 00:52:10.559 Um so we don't call it retail, we call trade preferred because we truly design our model for the interior designer. 00:52:10.639 --> 00:52:10.800 Right. 00:52:11.039 --> 00:52:23.679 And we know with you know 75,000 rolls of carpet, not all of them are gonna sell, we need to make sure that we they're still really nice, but we need to expand our distribution if we're gonna invest in more inventory and in more product development. 00:52:23.760 --> 00:52:31.920 And that's part of the reason why we got into the wholesale business as well, because the more distribution we have, the more risky we can be on product, uh product innovation. 00:52:32.159 --> 00:52:32.559 I understand. 00:52:32.719 --> 00:52:42.960 And so product innovation is so important that without our wholesale business and without having availability direct to consumer in different ways in the way that we do it, um, we wouldn't be able to innovate on product in the way

that we do. 00:52:43.119 --> 00:52:49.199 And what we've learned is our best clients, certainly not every interior designer is happy that we're trade preferred versus trade only. 00:52:49.280 --> 00:52:51.199 Like I've I deal with this all the time. 00:52:51.360 --> 00:53:01.360 Um, and what I will say is our best clients, they care about how what's the quality of your product, what's the level of service I'm getting. 00:53:01.440 --> 00:53:07.760 I don't care who you sell to, just make sure that when you sell to me, I uh you do it in a way that serves me better than I could be served by others. 00:53:08.159 --> 00:53:15.039 And so we say, okay, for the designer who doesn't, who only wants to buy from trade-only companies, to them I say, go buy from trade-only companies. 00:53:15.119 --> 00:53:22.719 Like we're not maybe not the right company for you, but I assure you, if you work with us, you will see reasons that does make sense to work with us, even though we're trade preferred. 00:53:22.800 --> 00:53:29.840 And so you love technology, AI, anything like that you're bringing into the future for the Yeah. 00:53:29.920 --> 00:53:32.239 I mean, I would say they call me Chad GPT. 00:53:32.960 --> 00:53:35.840 Sometimes somebody got me a shirt that said Chad GPT. 00:53:36.000 --> 00:53:36.400 That's cute. 00:53:36.639 --> 00:53:38.559 So we are we're all in on AI. 00:53:38.719 --> 00:53:41.760 Uh I mean, we, you know, we have like a three-person AI task force. 00:53:41.840 --> 00:53:48.719 If we hired these three people uh who are their job is full-time implement AI in our company, we're redoing our in what manner? 00:53:48.800 --> 00:53:50.559 How how would you be using it? 00:53:50.960 --> 00:53:53.280 I mean, I'd say so to back up, right? 00:53:53.440 --> 00:53:58.480 Because maybe this could be a lesson for others listening of like, how do you what does it mean to be how do I become all in in AI? 00:53:58.800 --> 00:54:02.800 So I'd say for us, it started with saying, how do we build a culture that embraces AI, right? 00:54:02.960 --> 00:54:06.639 Goes back to culture because we can't teach everyone how to use AI. 00:54:06.960 --> 00:54:09.519 No, and it's like speaking a foreign language to some people. 00:54:10.239 --> 00:54:12.159 Well, they might think that, right? 00:54:12.320 --> 00:54:17.679 Because when you use AI, you learn the language of computer software engineering today is English. 00:54:17.760 --> 00:54:17.840 Yeah. 00:54:18.000 --> 00:54:18.159 Right? 00:54:18.239 --> 00:54:19.440 Like to do that's the language. 00:54:19.519 --> 00:54:21.599 So it is not actually foreign, it's totally English. 00:54:22.079 --> 00:54:24.719 And you can do all these things in ways that you never could before. 00:54:24.880 --> 00:54:29.119 And so for us, our approach has been first, how do we build a culture that is embracing AI? 00:54:29.280 --> 00:54:31.440 So we started by doing what we call the AI awards. 00:54:31.519 --> 00:54:37.920 And we said every quarter we're gonna give people cash prizes to submit innovating ideas of things they actually did using AI. 00:54:38.239 --> 00:54:39.920 And so we gave people cash prizes. 00:54:40.079 --> 00:54:42.159 Then we said, all right, now that within the company. 00:54:42.400 --> 00:54:43.920 Within the company for their job. 00:54:44.320 --> 00:54:44.480 Right. 00:54:44.559 --> 00:54:47.360 And so some of the ideas were like, hey, I made my emails better. 00:54:47.440 --> 00:54:47.840 Here's what I did. 00:54:47.920 --> 00:54:48.800 I'm like, okay, great. 00:54:48.880 --> 00:54:50.079 It's not about the the idea. 00:54:50.159 --> 00:54:51.519 That's like use case number one, right? 00:54:51.679 --> 00:54:52.800 How do I make my emails better? 00:54:52.880 --> 00:54:53.119 Yep. 00:54:53.280 --> 00:55:01.360 But it got people less afraid to say they're using AI because there are some cultures where they're like, well, if if I'm using AI, my boss is gonna fire me thinking I'm not working. 00:55:01.519 --> 00:55:01.679 Right. 00:55:01.920 --> 00:55:04.880 And we're like, if you don't use AI, like you may maybe you're gonna get involved. 00:55:05.039 --> 00:55:05.119 Right. 00:55:05.199 --> 00:55:05.599 We got involved. 00:55:05.840 --> 00:55:06.800 It's such a valuable tool. 00:55:06.880 --> 00:55:08.400 Like, that's like saying you don't use email. 00:55:09.039 --> 00:55:09.920 Who doesn't use email? 00:55:10.079 --> 00:55:10.400 Right. 00:55:10.639 --> 00:55:15.760 And our and the way I look at it is we're pretty, I would say, behind where we want to be from an e-commerce standpoint. 00:55:15.920 --> 00:55:19.679 It's a pretty small part of our business, the designers and consumers. 00:55:19.920 --> 00:55:23.920 And I look back and say, well, what if we were all in on e-commerce in 2000? 00:55:24.239 --> 00:55:26.000 Where would we be as an organization today? 00:55:26.559 --> 00:55:28.079 We have that opportunity with AI. 00:55:28.480 --> 00:55:28.639 Right? 00:55:28.719 --> 00:55:29.679 We're on the ground floor. 00:55:29.760 --> 00:55:32.800 And so it started by how do we build a culture that embraces AI? 00:55:33.039 --> 00:55:36.719 And what that means is instead of people saying, Can I AI do this? 00:55:36.800 --> 00:55:38.800 It's the first question is how can AI do this? 00:55:39.039 --> 00:55:43.119 And so we want we try to build the mindset within every single team member in our company. 00:55:43.360 --> 00:55:45.039 How can you use AI to do your job? 00:55:45.119 --> 00:55:49.199 When you're faced with a task, the first question should be what can AI do to support this to make it easier. 00:55:49.519 --> 00:55:51.599 And so, so in your question, how do you use it? 00:55:51.760 --> 00:55:53.039 Every way imaginable, right? 00:55:53.199 --> 00:55:58.800 I'd say the most most uh used uh use case, so to speak, is reporting and data analytics. 00:55:59.039 --> 00:56:05.360 That's like the the easiest one because spreadsheets are so easy

to visualize, data is so easy to manipulate now. 00:56:05.440 --> 00:56:08.239 It's like you don't have to know how to use Excel and do a VLOOKUP. 00:56:08.400 --> 00:56:13.360 You can just use it at Excel and Claude or ChatGPT and get the information you want. 00:56:13.599 --> 00:56:15.039 I mean, I'll give a perfect example. 00:56:15.280 --> 00:56:22.880 We tried a new pricing uh, and this is how I use it, and our organization uses it to inform strategic decisions that are that make our business better. 00:56:23.039 --> 00:56:27.039 And so uh another, you know, I'm big on frameworks, as I'm sure you're hearing. 00:56:27.119 --> 00:56:30.559 And so we all talk about like the mindset for innovation and what is innovation? 00:56:30.719 --> 00:56:31.280 Let's start with that. 00:56:31.440 --> 00:56:33.199 Innovation is doing something new by definition. 00:56:33.280 --> 00:56:35.360 Like that's all innovation means is newness. 00:56:35.599 --> 00:56:38.960 And when you do new things, it's impossible to predict the outcome. 00:56:39.280 --> 00:56:43.840 And so a company that is fearful of doing the wrong thing will not innovate. 00:56:44.320 --> 00:56:46.559 So we talk about the difference between a failure and a mistake. 00:56:46.880 --> 00:56:50.480 And when you innovate and do something new, if it doesn't work out, it's a failure. 00:56:50.800 --> 00:56:54.800 And if you learn from that failure, then if you then that's a good thing. 00:56:54.960 --> 00:56:55.119 Right. 00:56:55.440 --> 00:57:00.880 If you do something where you could have predicted the outcome, if you knew the outcome, but you did it anyway, that's a mistake. 00:57:01.039 --> 00:57:03.599 And so we try to maximize failures and minimize mistakes. 00:57:03.920 --> 00:57:12.559 And so with online, as we're trying to figure out how do we have a place online that serves our designers and serves consumers, we're trying new things, and not all of them are working, right? 00:57:12.800 --> 00:57:31.360 And so we try to uh our designers can get uh certain products priced two different ways from our showrooms and only one way online, and um without going into too much detail because I'll be conscious of time, but basically it was creating conflict around specifically runners, narrow, long rugs, right? 00:57:31.519 --> 00:57:32.239 Three by twenties. 00:57:32.480 --> 00:57:32.639 Yeah. 00:57:32.960 --> 00:57:37.599 And so we used AI to say, all right, well, if we were to limit this, like where's the breaking point? 00:57:37.840 --> 00:57:52.800 And like in one simple inquiry, the chat uh Claude, we use Claude mainly, said, Hey, well, we by looking at the data, once a rug, uh rugs under four feet wide have an average length of 18, rugs over four feet wide have an average length of like 12. 00:57:53.039 --> 00:58:00.800 And so you're using it to help guide you a hundred percent and keep you on a better track so you have more information to make decisions. 00:58:01.119 --> 00:58:09.920 Yeah, I'd say so that's like the main use case right now is how do we use it to help glean insights that are harder or get them faster or get better insights to make better decisions. 00:58:10.320 --> 00:58:16.400 The next evolution is how do we use AI to actually streamline workflows and automate things? 00:58:16.559 --> 00:58:16.719 Yep. 00:58:16.880 --> 00:58:19.760 And there's a big difference between automation and AI. 00:58:19.920 --> 00:58:23.119 And so like everyone says AI for everything, but that's not really true. 00:58:23.199 --> 00:58:28.639 Like things that are deterministic, where you like, you know, like picking what piece of inventory to allocate from. 00:58:28.800 --> 00:58:30.000 Like you don't need AI for that. 00:58:30.079 --> 00:58:30.719 You just need rules. 00:58:31.199 --> 00:58:32.880 But that's deterministic technology. 00:58:33.039 --> 00:58:40.400 But what AI can do is analyze the rules and help say, hey, now that you've done 100 cuts, there's maybe a better rule. 00:58:40.559 --> 00:58:42.639 Let's update the rules based on what's really happening. 00:58:43.039 --> 00:58:43.280 Right. 00:58:43.440 --> 00:58:55.440 And so like that's how we continue to build a loop that improves decision making, where you know, we can leverage AI and automation in different ways and different workflows to make people's jobs easier, which is our annual priority in 2026, was make jobs easier. 00:58:56.320 --> 00:59:00.000 That's so interesting in the industry alone. 00:59:00.480 --> 00:59:11.360 You see, you see, and you have been seeing for since you're a kid, some of the most magnificent carpets and rugs going out to incredible clients and businesses and so forth. 00:59:11.599 --> 00:59:17.519 Are there any are there any orders that come through every so often that you go, someone did what? 00:59:17.679 --> 00:59:18.480 They ordered what? 00:59:18.960 --> 00:59:21.119 Are there are there things that still surprise you? 00:59:21.199 --> 00:59:22.079 Or certainly. 00:59:22.480 --> 00:59:31.599 I would say, I mean, last year, uh and I won't I'll I'll leave the market out of it, but there was a order that came through for hand-knotted silk for an entire office. 00:59:31.920 --> 00:59:36.000 And it's like it was like a you know over a million dollar order for carpets and rugs. 00:59:36.079 --> 00:59:38.480 And I'm like, this office must be very successful, right? 00:59:38.639 --> 00:59:41.119 And so like there's gotta be things that that stop you. 00:59:41.599 --> 00:59:48.800 Yeah, it's just like it's sometimes just unbelievable uh, you know, how how much people invest in their carpets and rugs. 00:59:49.119 --> 01:00:00.000 Um and I would say, you know, even things in like New York, like when they order these big pieces, they have to take a crane up to the 80th floor of a building to like install a huge, heavy silk piece, right? 01:00:00.079 --> 01:00:03.360 The one that we couldn't ship that we had to make overseas and then ship, right?

01:00:03.519 --> 01:00:09.679 And so I'd say some of the unique installations and the size of things is what surprises me the most. 01:00:09.840 --> 01:00:15.360 Like, you know, we used to think that the more expensive the product was, the less someone would spend on the on, like the smaller the rug might be. 01:00:15.599 --> 01:00:19.760 But what we learned is the more expensive the product is per square foot, the larger the average size. 01:00:19.840 --> 01:00:23.920 Because if someone's buying a$150 a foot rug, like their house is huge. 01:00:24.000 --> 01:00:24.159 Yeah. 01:00:24.320 --> 01:00:27.039 They're not putting it like their closet needs a 12 by 15. 01:00:27.280 --> 01:00:29.599 And so it's like things like that we continue to learn. 01:00:29.840 --> 01:00:30.400 I love it. 01:00:30.559 --> 01:00:39.679 Um, and you know, I would say aesthetically and from a design standpoint, that's why we love the custom business so much because designers cust do custom when there is no stock available. 01:00:39.760 --> 01:00:39.920 Yeah. 01:00:40.079 --> 01:00:42.559 And so if if we had the item they needed, they wouldn't customize it. 01:00:42.800 --> 01:00:48.320 So there's gotta be some crazy stories of custom rugs that have been made that you'd question. 01:00:49.920 --> 01:00:52.480 Yeah, I mean, I'd say everyone, you know, taste is subjective. 01:00:52.719 --> 01:00:54.159 Right, of course, I guess you could say. 01:00:54.320 --> 01:01:01.920 Um, and so I try to being the numbers guy versus the shapes and colors person at the company, my taste is uniqueness, right? 01:01:02.079 --> 01:01:12.639 And so if I see a rug that has unique textures, unique multiple uh weaving techniques, uh, and a design that is not really seen elsewhere, to me, that's that's what I like, right? 01:01:12.719 --> 01:01:13.599 It's just different. 01:01:13.840 --> 01:01:16.800 Um, and so yeah, I mean, things surprise me all the time. 01:01:17.119 --> 01:01:22.320 Uh I've every day surprises me, whether it's our clients, I like to say we are in the most colorful industry alive. 01:01:22.480 --> 01:01:25.360 Uh it's very fun, a lot of fun people in it. 01:01:25.440 --> 01:01:32.239 Uh and so yeah, I mean, the the creativity of our clients certainly surprises me, and the the willingness to invest in this product sometimes does as well. 01:01:32.559 --> 01:01:38.159 So do you ever think if you weren't doing what you're doing today, what you might be doing at this point in your life? 01:01:38.559 --> 01:01:40.559 I mean, right now I would definitely do something with AI. 01:01:40.639 --> 01:01:42.559 Like that, I'm certain of what it would be. 01:01:42.719 --> 01:01:46.880 I mean, again, I think the company can be the vehicle through which I do something with AI. 01:01:47.199 --> 01:01:47.840 I right agree. 01:01:48.159 --> 01:01:57.440 I I'd say just to make everyone at my company laugh, I'll tell you what I say in a lot of our recruiting, and I say all the time, is we want to be a technology company that sells carpet, not a carpet company that sells technology. 01:01:57.599 --> 01:01:57.679 Right. 01:01:57.840 --> 01:02:00.639 And when I first started saying that, people thought I was gonna replace them with robots. 01:02:01.039 --> 01:02:09.599 And certainly if we're a people-oriented business and we care about world-class experiences, technology is the vehicle to do that, not a replacement of the And I agree with that too. 01:02:09.920 --> 01:02:10.639 I'm right there. 01:02:10.880 --> 01:02:13.920 I don't think that technology that AI is gonna replay. 01:02:14.159 --> 01:02:16.800 I think it's just gonna enhance what we can do. 01:02:17.199 --> 01:02:18.880 Yeah, so I'm super bullish, obviously. 01:02:19.039 --> 01:02:22.480 You know, I know people are pessimists about AI, but I'm a glass half-full kind of guy. 01:02:22.880 --> 01:02:30.880 And I think, you know, for all the challenges that it will create, there will be exponentially more opportunities created from it, just like the internet, just like email. 01:02:32.400 --> 01:02:35.519 And TV and it's amazing what you can do with AI. 01:02:35.679 --> 01:02:37.599 I mean, I've been using it for so many things. 01:02:37.760 --> 01:02:42.239 We have three kids that formed a band, they're writing music and recording. 01:02:42.639 --> 01:02:46.719 And you know, I said to them, okay, we're recording these songs. 01:02:46.960 --> 01:02:52.159 We look back in March, we were in the Abbey Road Studios in London recording their first three songs. 01:02:52.400 --> 01:02:56.559 I went up to to Claude and said, I need to build a spreadsheet. 01:02:56.639 --> 01:02:58.079 And I'm pretty good at spreadsheets. 01:02:58.480 --> 01:03:06.559 I need a spreadsheet of all the royalty aspects and and uh you know covering the the music. 01:03:06.800 --> 01:03:11.199 It built me a spreadsheet I could not believe in it in like once in in less than a minute. 01:03:11.440 --> 01:03:12.239 That's unbelievable. 01:03:12.320 --> 01:03:19.360 I mean, I'd say the last thing I'd I'll leave with with AI is you know, we do a lot of AI training, not just like the mindset, but like how to actually use the tools. 01:03:19.519 --> 01:03:24.320 And how to use the tools is just like get people comfortable with experimenting, and that's how they learn how to use AI. 01:03:24.400 --> 01:03:25.760 Like you can't tell someone how to use it. 01:03:26.000 --> 01:03:27.519 And context is everything. 01:03:27.679 --> 01:03:31.039 And the biggest unlock for me has been connecting everything to it. 01:03:31.119 --> 01:03:34.159 So like I use an app called Granola to transcribe all my meetings. 01:03:34.320 --> 01:03:37.440 And now I can ask Claude to like tell me how I spent my time last week. 01:03:37.599 --> 01:03:48.559 Or when I say, like, hey, write an email to this designer who is upset around our online price, it knows the conversations I've had about that, the investigation I did, that just pulls

it all automatically. 01:03:48.719 --> 01:03:55.360 So it's like it's like having an always listening assistant who is smarter than you, who doesn't forget anything, helping you do your job. 01:03:55.679 --> 01:03:56.000 Correct. 01:03:56.400 --> 01:03:57.280 That's brilliant. 01:03:57.519 --> 01:03:58.400 That's brilliant. 01:03:58.639 --> 01:04:03.280 What do you think the luxury market will look like in 10 years? 01:04:04.400 --> 01:04:09.440 I don't think it will be that different in the sense of, you know, if anything, people are just gonna create more experiences. 01:04:09.599 --> 01:04:11.920 People are gonna create more, crave more special product. 01:04:12.000 --> 01:04:20.239 And I always just you always go back to the Arames example is like it's easy to make a nice leather bag, but Arames just kept going up in price. 01:04:20.400 --> 01:04:20.719 Yeah. 01:04:20.960 --> 01:04:26.320 Because people, the the the most discriminating clients in the world will always want something their neighbor doesn't have. 01:04:26.639 --> 01:04:27.039 Agreed. 01:04:27.280 --> 01:04:30.000 And so custom is the saving grace of the interior design industry, I think. 01:04:30.239 --> 01:04:30.480 I agree. 01:04:30.719 --> 01:04:32.559 And you know, custom can mean many things. 01:04:32.639 --> 01:04:39.519 Right now, custom is more and more, meaning taking in-stock product and doing custom things to it so you can get it quickly, because the Amazon economy is real. 01:04:39.599 --> 01:04:41.119 Everyone wants everything yesterday. 01:04:41.199 --> 01:04:47.039 Uh, but uh luxury is just gonna keep going up because luxury consumers are gonna always want things that are different. 01:04:47.360 --> 01:04:47.599 I agree. 01:04:47.920 --> 01:04:50.159 Uh how we provide that is is is the unique part. 01:04:50.559 --> 01:04:53.280 Well, thank you so much for this conversation today. 01:04:53.440 --> 01:05:02.639 And just as a person who appreciates and loves the Stark legacy, I'm so glad that it's in your hands because I think it's really special that it stays in the family. 01:05:03.039 --> 01:05:03.440 Of course. 01:05:03.519 --> 01:05:12.480 I'm super grateful to be charged with this amazing task of ushering in the next phase of our company and with supporters like you as a client and on this podcast. 01:05:12.639 --> 01:05:15.360 You know, I know we'll get there, so I just appreciate you guys inviting me on. 01:05:15.440 --> 01:05:16.320 I'm super grateful for it. 01:05:16.639 --> 01:05:19.360 Well, thank you for joining us and welcome to South Florida Living. 01:05:19.679 --> 01:05:19.920 Thank you. 01:05:20.000 --> 01:05:20.400 Florida. 01:05:20.639 --> 01:05:21.920 I don't live in Florida, I live in Miami. 01:05:22.079 --> 01:05:22.320 In Miami. 01:05:25.280 --> 01:05:29.039 Thank you for listening to the iDesign Lab Podcast. 01:05:29.920 --> 01:05:36.639 iDesign Labs Podcast is an SW group production in association with the five star and TW interiors. 01:05:36.880 --> 01:05:43.039 To learn more about iDesign Lab or TW Interiors, please visit TW interiors.com.