บทถอดความฉบับเต็มของ Pixels & Prototypes: How Collaboration Turned a Website into a Story | The BIMTech Podcast #3

00:04:01.639 For you, what makes Pixel Kicks unique then in your experience of being there? 00:04:01.639 --> 00:04:02.039 Yeah. 00:04:02.039 --> 00:04:09.879 When we approached a project, like I said a couple of minutes ago, I tend to fully immerse myself in it. 00:04:09.879 --> 00:04:10.280 So... 00:04:10.280 --> 00:04:10.680 Yeah. 00:04:10.680 --> 00:04:20.639 Getting like a great understanding we're kind of given the ability to spend time with things and we're not swamped with five projects at the same time, that kind of thing. 00:04:20.639 --> 00:04:24.600 So when we actually come to do a project, we're thinking about a lot of things. 00:04:24.879 --> 00:04:33.759 We've done a lot of research into the industry and how best to position you and your new website to like cater to that. 00:04:33.759 --> 00:04:34.720 Yeah. 00:04:34.720 --> 00:04:44.839 So when we actually come to design it, we don't just design like the desktop or we don't just design a couple of pages and then we'll just take care of the rest kind of thing and you don't get to see it. 00:04:46.279 --> 00:04:47.759 That does work for some people. 00:04:47.759 --> 00:04:56.360 Not to say we can't do that, but in your case we kind of did every page and kind of approached every page differently. 00:04:56.360 --> 00:04:56.680 Yeah. 00:04:56.680 --> 00:05:02.759 So different sections needed to function differently across the site, but not only on desktop. 00:05:02.759 --> 00:05:07.720 We had to then think about how those things would work on tablet size and on mobile size as well. 00:05:07.800 --> 00:05:08.000 Yeah. 00:05:08.000 --> 00:05:10.639 We kind of always do that. 00:05:08.000 --> 00:05:13.639 So we always at least consider mobile designs for every desktop design that we do. 00:05:13.800 --> 00:05:23.240 Whether that's like the landing page, the services page, the about page, everything gets a responsive thought behind it and how it's going to scale. 00:05:23.720 --> 00:05:29.720 Yeah, I think that's what drew us to you in the first place, I think was when we came into the first meeting with Jamie. 00:05:29.720 --> 00:05:39.439 He took us through your processes and I think that was one of the big drawing points was how much detail goes into that process and the stages. 00:05:39.480 --> 00:05:44.199 So that was the thing about coming to you guys was we wanted something unique. 00:05:44.240 --> 00:05:48.800 We wanted something that had a process to it and gave us a really distinctive look. 00:05:48.920 --> 00:05:55.560 And I don't think you can get that without going to someone like a company like you and working with a designer like you. 00:05:55.759 --> 00:05:56.079 Yeah. 00:05:56.079 --> 00:06:01.040 And I think that's the drawing point really of a company like Pixel Kicks. 00:06:01.079 --> 00:06:13.560 I suppose that brings us onto the process really now, which is, I'll ask you first before we go into it, but on a typical process of a website design, I know we know like the stages, but... 00:06:13.560 --> 00:06:13.839 Yeah. 00:06:13.839 --> 00:06:17.639 When you're in contact with a client, what does it typically work like? 00:06:17.639 --> 00:06:18.720 Is there much pushback? 00:06:18.720 --> 00:06:23.720 Is there a typical way that sort of every project usually goes? 00:06:26.120 --> 00:06:32.560 Well, like you say, they all follow like the same milestones because that's how we kind of manage the project internally. 00:06:32.879 --> 00:06:33.600 Yeah. 00:06:33.600 --> 00:06:37.920 If we have our own internal processes and things like that, it helps us push it. 00:06:38.560 --> 00:06:41.759 I wouldn't say yours was that much different, really. 00:06:41.800 --> 00:06:51.879 There was, in the later stages and once we kind of got through the concept stage, there was a lot more collaboration, a lot more than what we would normally do. 00:06:51.959 --> 00:06:59.879 And especially we invited you and Ross into the file so that you could see in real time basically the work that was going on. 00:07:00.240 --> 00:07:02.399 That's not something we normally do, but... 00:07:02.399 --> 00:07:03.439 Right. 00:07:03.439 --> 00:07:08.519 And to be honest, I was quite apprehensive about doing it at first because I was like, they're going to be watching like every 5 minutes. 00:07:08.519 --> 00:07:10.480 They're going to be like, leaving comments. 00:07:10.480 --> 00:07:12.959 “Why isn't this done?” Yeah. 00:07:12.959 --> 00:07:18.839 But no, it was actually really good and really eye opening is the other thing I'd say because Right. 00:07:20.160 --> 00:07:24.240 on one of the last stages when we were doing, we were kind of focusing on that services page weren’t we? 00:07:24.240 --> 00:07:35.480 And I just spent like the afternoon just sprinting, put as many ideas as I could down of how that page could work and the different kind of processes we could use on it, different interactions. 00:07:35.920 --> 00:07:44.759 And then you and Ross just like jumped in and said,“Don't like this”, “This is amazing”, “Try this one”, “like this”,“working on this, so try that.” And it was great. 00:07:45.560 --> 00:07:45.920 Yeah. 00:07:45.920 --> 00:07:47.199 Really eye opening to how collaborative it could be. 00:07:47.199 --> 00:07:48.240 Yeah we talked about that. 00:07:48.240 --> 00:07:52.199 I think that there could have been a lot of back and forth couldn't there? 00:07:52.199 --> 00:07:52.439 Yeah. 00:07:52.439 --> 00:07:57.759 If we didn't know what was going on in the design file, you could of spent ages doing something and then we come back and we're like, actually... 00:07:57.759 --> 00:07:58.800 I don't like. 00:07:57.759 --> 00:07:58.800 I don't like. 00:07:58.800 --> 00:07:59.279 Yeah. 00:07:59.279 --> 00:08:11.439 So yeah, during those latter stages where you're trying to tweak and finalize things and really put some thought into them, to have us just like constantly there making sure that you're not doing too much in one direction

and diverting you. 00:08:11.920 --> 00:08:13.800 I think you're right. 00:08:11.920 --> 00:08:13.800 I think that process works. 00:08:13.800 --> 00:08:15.000 Yeah, it did, yeah. 00:08:15.000 --> 00:08:15.399 Yeah. 00:08:15.399 --> 00:08:17.199 Well the testament is, it did. 00:08:17.199 --> 00:08:18.079 Yeah. So. 00:08:17.199 --> 00:08:18.079 Yeah. 00:08:18.399 --> 00:08:25.560 Well I know at the start of it all we also had like a couple of, like you said, meetings that the ideas got a bit like, I suppose. 00:08:25.759 --> 00:08:26.360 What's the word? 00:08:26.360 --> 00:08:26.920 A bit muddled. 00:08:26.920 --> 00:08:27.839 Yeah muddled. 00:08:27.839 --> 00:08:30.519 I guess we should talk about a little bit of the process shouldn’t we? 00:08:30.519 --> 00:08:31.160 Yeah. 00:08:31.160 --> 00:08:36.240 So when we start a project, we tend to sit down the key stakeholders. 00:08:36.480 --> 00:08:39.480 Get you all around a table kind of thing. 00:08:39.679 --> 00:08:45.720 Sometimes it's virtual and we just kind of run through like a digital whiteboard and so we have like loads questions. 00:08:45.720 --> 00:08:51.639 Normally Jamie goes through it like a couple of days before and drops everything that he spoke to you about in the sales process. 00:08:51.759 --> 00:08:53.200 Jamie was great at doing that. 00:08:53.200 --> 00:08:53.519 Yeah. 00:08:53.519 --> 00:09:00.240 He’s really good at handing over all his notes into stuff that I can actually work with rather than just like sales jumble. 00:09:00.360 --> 00:09:01.600 Yeah. 00:09:01.600 --> 00:09:02.519 So that's really good. 00:09:02.519 --> 00:09:20.159 So when we go into that meeting we’re then informed or I'm informed as the lead designer of what kind of things you've said at the outset that you're looking for in a new website. So in some cases it's like key interactions or like API integrations that we’ve got to think about, CRM integrations, things like that. 00:09:20.159 --> 00:09:23.759 And in other cases it's like, oh we really like this competitor website. 00:09:24.000 --> 00:09:26.600 We don't want to look like that or we do want to look like that. 00:09:26.600 --> 00:09:26.960 Yeah. 00:09:26.960 --> 00:09:35.240 So yeah, we kind of come into that meeting with all that in mind and then we go through like the process, what content you're thinking of putting on the website. 00:09:35.240 --> 00:09:37.480 Do you have like Google Analytics? 00:09:37.480 --> 00:09:40.559 Are you writing content or are you pulling old content across? 00:09:41.200 --> 00:09:45.360 What kind of design language like visual language do you like? 00:09:45.679 --> 00:09:47.120 What do you not like? 00:09:47.120 --> 00:09:55.960 You probably remember all this now, I was going through it and showing you like some old websites, new websites, websites that weren't in the construction industry at all. 00:09:55.960 --> 00:09:56.240 Yeah. 00:09:56.240 --> 00:10:02.399 Just to try and gauge what kind of direction you want to go in. 00:10:02.559 --> 00:10:08.399 So then after that meeting, I think I went away and then put some concepts together based on what we'd said. 00:10:08.399 --> 00:10:12.840 So I think we did get a bit muddled in that first meeting. 00:10:12.840 --> 00:10:16.519 Some of the websites we were looking at were very architectural, if you remember. 00:10:16.600 --> 00:10:17.559 Yeah. 00:10:17.559 --> 00:10:19.320 And there was like elements of those that you liked. 00:10:19.320 --> 00:10:22.320 So I was like, okay, so they like this, this and this. 00:10:22.799 --> 00:10:29.399 I'll try and mangle into some sort of BIMTech way of saying those things that you like. 00:10:29.399 --> 00:10:29.919 Yeah. 00:10:29.919 --> 00:10:32.960 So those first two concepts that we sent you. 00:10:33.960 --> 00:10:35.000 I still remember that meeting. 00:10:36.039 --> 00:10:36.200 Yeah. 00:10:36.200 --> 00:10:41.279 I feel like that meeting needed to happen really, for us to sort of start going in the right direction. 00:10:41.279 --> 00:10:44.320 And I think the direction it went after that meeting. 00:10:44.399 --> 00:10:44.799 Yeah. 00:10:44.799 --> 00:10:49.679 Was something we didn't even think the direction was going to go in. 00:10:49.799 --> 00:10:50.320 Yeah. 00:10:50.320 --> 00:10:53.679 Yeah, well, you came because of your design background. 00:10:53.679 --> 00:10:56.720 You came with your own designs didn’t you? 00:10:56.720 --> 00:11:02.720 To that meeting, so you were trying to steer us in more the direction that you had in mind. 00:11:02.759 --> 00:11:05.919 And then, like you said, I kind of took that and went off. 00:11:06.639 --> 00:11:09.840 Did our version of your version of things. 00:11:09.960 --> 00:11:10.960 Yeah. 00:11:10.960 --> 00:11:16.399 And then like you say that was totally not what you expected or further than what you were expecting... 00:11:16.399 --> 00:11:16.919 Yeah. 00:11:16.919 --> 00:11:18.639 ...it to look like. 00:11:18.639 --> 00:11:19.559 But yeah it did need to happen. 00:11:19.559 --> 00:11:26.679 Yeah, I think that sprint system as well worked really well, especially with like the navigation system. 00:11:27.720 --> 00:11:32.480 Yeah, we did a few didn’t we, so we did like the navigation system itself. 00:11:32.480 --> 00:11:34.080 We did a whole sprint around that. 00:11:34.080 --> 00:11:34.559 Yeah. 00:11:34.559 --> 00:11:39.120 And how that could work, and I kept sneaking the bars back in, if you remember. 00:11:39.120 --> 00:11:39.799 Oh yeah. 00:11:39.799 --> 00:11:53.639 We were speaking about hamburgers and, like, the normal way of doing a menu system and how we kind of did the whole sprint system around the navigation system and how it's totally different to like what most websites use. 00:11:53.759 --> 00:11:54.240 Yeah. 00:11:54.240 --> 00:12:09.360 So I'd be interested to see if you use something like Hotjar, like heat map software to track how people and visitors are using your website, whether the

navigation system works for them, or whether you might come to see that they're struggling to actually use it. 00:12:09.360 --> 00:12:10.039 Yeah. 00:12:10.039 --> 00:12:12.600 With it being different to like the expected. 00:12:12.600 --> 00:12:18.559 There's a UX law, I can’t remember which one it is but it's like across the internet you see more and more of the same thing. 00:12:18.559 --> 00:12:20.480 So you expect the same thing when you come to a website. 00:12:20.480 --> 00:12:21.480 Right. 00:12:21.480 --> 00:12:23.399 So yeah, I’m interested to see. 00:12:23.519 --> 00:12:25.000 I think that’s it, I think we went a bit... 00:12:25.000 --> 00:12:32.000 We looked at different construction websites, similar ones towards when it comes to like BIM and CAD and stuff. 00:12:32.080 --> 00:12:48.799 And I think the one thing I think I struggle with is the idea of the projects pages being so large and scrollable where you’re just getting so much information and most of it is a bit useless as well to people who don't, you know, who are going there for a specific thing. 00:12:48.799 --> 00:12:49.240 Yeah. 00:12:49.240 --> 00:12:58.559 So I think when we first started designing it going in the right direction, we started looking at the project specific pages quite in detail didn’t we? 00:12:58.559 --> 00:13:03.480 And we came up with quite a cool looking projects page... 00:13:03.480 --> 00:13:05.039 Well... you did. 00:13:05.039 --> 00:13:06.879 No, we did it together. 00:13:07.320 --> 00:13:08.360 Collaborative working. 00:13:08.360 --> 00:13:10.639 Yeah well that’s it isn’t it, yeah. 00:13:10.679 --> 00:13:17.679 I think the projects page was one of the first pages we kind of looked at after that initial narrative home page. 00:13:18.159 --> 00:13:23.519 More so because you wanted to see how that page would work and like you say, reduce the amount of content on it. 00:13:23.519 --> 00:13:23.840 Yeah. 00:13:23.840 --> 00:13:42.399 So one of the ways of getting around that was letting you upload a PDF to that page so someone can, if they want like the full story or I don't know if your case studies are massive offline in PDF format, you could always upload one of them and if they want all that information, it's there, but on the website it doesn't need to be there, kind of thing. 00:13:42.399 --> 00:13:52.159 And then even at the end of the project, if you remember, I did a change to that project page which hid that text even more so then it kind of put that project imagery like front and center. 00:13:52.559 --> 00:13:56.399 And so it was constantly evolving, even bits that we thought we'd done. 00:13:57.399 --> 00:14:03.600 Yeah, I think that's one of the things we talked about as well is we were in the file weren't we? 00:14:03.759 --> 00:14:06.000 Yeah. And nearer the sort of well end of it. 00:14:06.000 --> 00:14:15.840 We were still quite active in the other file because you sort of like provide us with a figma file that we can look at progressively through the project. 00:14:15.840 --> 00:14:16.080 Yeah. 00:14:16.080 --> 00:14:18.799 But then nearer the end we were pretty much... 00:14:18.799 --> 00:14:19.600 In the file. 00:14:19.600 --> 00:14:20.600 Yeah. 00:14:20.600 --> 00:14:22.039 Deep in the file. Yeah. 00:14:22.039 --> 00:14:27.519 I guess we'll kind of touch on like the usual process with how we share work with clients. 00:14:27.519 --> 00:14:30.600 So normally we just share the prototype link. 00:14:30.600 --> 00:14:33.000 So it's not really like you're live in the file. 00:14:33.000 --> 00:14:37.639 You can't see the real time design behind the file, behind the wizard's curtain kind of thing. 00:14:38.399 --> 00:14:40.279 I was thinking of it in Oz. 00:14:40.440 --> 00:14:50.360 But with this project because I kind of knew that you had a design background, so I wasn't as apprehensive about sharing the access to the file. 00:14:50.360 --> 00:14:50.720 Yeah. 00:14:50.879 --> 00:14:58.559 I knew you wouldn't be kind of pushing for, like, feedback every couple of days or minutes or hours even. 00:14:58.559 --> 00:15:14.039 And I think having worked through it and seeing how powerful the collaboration side of it was, it's definitely something I'll consider in the future, whether we do that maybe a different way of not having people directly in my live file. 00:15:14.519 --> 00:15:15.360 Yeah. 00:15:15.360 --> 00:15:26.159 Just because it works both ways where quick feedback is good, but it can also be bad in terms of people just like instantly reacting to something. 00:15:26.159 --> 00:15:26.720 Yeah. 00:15:26.720 --> 00:15:28.120 And say well I like that. 00:15:28.120 --> 00:15:32.120 And then next week they might have changed their mind when they’ve thought about it a bit more or they see it again. 00:15:32.120 --> 00:15:34.080 When they've not looked at it for a week kind of thing. 00:15:34.080 --> 00:15:47.919 So I think there's like a 50/50 kind of approach where providing like stepped prototypes or sort of live files but not live files so that people can actually see different ideas in the file. 00:15:47.919 --> 00:15:51.960 And it's not just presented in like that nice MacBook screen or wherever. 00:15:52.000 --> 00:15:52.559 Yeah. 00:15:52.559 --> 00:15:56.440 But they're also not in the live where they can see all the scraps. 00:15:56.759 --> 00:16:01.000 That maybe I know that aren’t working, but I've left them at the site to kind of think about in the future. 00:16:01.000 --> 00:16:01.679 Yeah. 00:16:01.759 --> 00:16:12.639 Maybe that is something, maybe when you're dealing with someone who's not in design, it’s harder for them to visualize it without seeing it in that like computer screen type preview. 00:16:12.759 --> 00:16:13.039 Yeah. 00:16:13.039 --> 00:16:21.320 Whereas me and Ross kind of like seeing it in that sort of mess of stuff where you’re coming up with ideas and we can look at what's going on. 00:16:21.399 --> 00:16:30.559 But again, that's

probably a benefit towards working with people who know the process of design rather than someone who just likes to see the finished, oooo god... 00:16:30.639 --> 00:16:31.200 look at this. 00:16:31.200 --> 00:16:31.799 The glossy shine. 00:16:31.799 --> 00:16:32.919 Yeah, yeah. 00:16:32.919 --> 00:16:35.279 So yeah, I think that's one of the benefits. 00:16:35.279 --> 00:16:57.919 I mean the process from start to finish is sort of we're in I know we came in and talked to Jamie first and he sort of provided us with information about the company, the processes and then that's when a couple of days later you sign off and we start contact with you and came in for that meeting that was first before that very memorable meeting that we talked about before. 00:16:58.480 --> 00:17:07.920 But then once that initial thing with that meeting and the sort of like understanding was met, that was when everything started to sort of start to move, wasn't it? 00:17:08.759 --> 00:17:09.160 Yeah. 00:17:09.160 --> 00:17:11.400 I think you were worried as well when you came to that meeting weren’t you? 00:17:11.400 --> 00:17:13.319 Oh yeah! That we were going to take it the wrong way. 00:17:13.319 --> 00:17:14.240 And kind of kick off. 00:17:14.240 --> 00:17:17.599 Like, “no, this is how you’re having it.” That's another thing with design. 00:17:17.599 --> 00:17:24.000 I think a proper person who understands design can take constructive criticism. 00:17:24.079 --> 00:17:24.319 Yeah. 00:17:24.319 --> 00:17:33.720 And then sort of you evolve the design together, don't you, and create something pretty special, but you're not shy of people who aren’t like that. 00:17:33.720 --> 00:17:34.160 Yeah. 00:17:34.160 --> 00:17:46.079 They'll take it a bit personally and it's like, we're not trying to offend you, we're trying to get the best out of, you know, the proposal and the contract we've signed and all the process. 00:17:46.079 --> 00:17:49.400 But you took it with your stride. 00:17:49.759 --> 00:17:50.680 Yeah. 00:17:50.680 --> 00:17:56.240 To your credit and you were like, yeah, you know, I'm glad you've said it. 00:17:56.559 --> 00:18:03.240 Yeah, you can't be a designer if you can't take criticism and you've got to I mean there's a saying in the industry that’s ‘kill your babies’. 00:18:03.240 --> 00:18:03.720 So... 00:18:03.720 --> 00:18:04.240 Ah right. 00:18:04.240 --> 00:18:10.599 A bit harsh, but it's like don't become too attached to something because really you should be always adaptable. 00:18:10.599 --> 00:18:13.400 You should always be thinking about how you could change it. 00:18:13.400 --> 00:18:17.640 Because even if you did, like, the greatest design ever, it's not going to be perfect. 00:18:17.640 --> 00:18:22.240 It's not going to do the exact thing that you originally set out for it to do. 00:18:22.279 --> 00:18:27.559 Yeah, I guess it links to what you were saying about your sort of like progression through the industry. 00:18:27.839 --> 00:18:29.519

You know, you made your mistakes. 00:18:29.519 --> 00:18:30.559 Yeah, yeah. 00:18:30.759 --> 00:18:35.359 You need to do that to get something good and great don’t you? 00:18:35.359 --> 00:18:37.599 You need that... 00:18:37.599 --> 00:18:47.279 that feedback and the little butt of heads and all that sort of stuff, you know, you don't get anywhere with a design if you're not pushing it like that. 00:18:47.279 --> 00:18:47.799 No. 00:18:48.000 --> 00:18:52.680 So I think that's why the design for BIMTech came out like it did. 00:18:52.799 --> 00:18:57.680 It was just something that evolved naturally I think in the end and really grew... 00:18:58.759 --> 00:18:59.599 I’ll say grew wings. 00:18:59.599 --> 00:19:01.880 Like it just did start to like. 00:19:01.880 --> 00:19:02.400 Yeah. 00:19:02.400 --> 00:19:04.640 It became its own beast really, didn’t it? 00:19:04.640 --> 00:19:07.480 Yeah. 00:19:04.640 --> 00:19:07.480 I suppose it was about trying to... 00:19:07.480 --> 00:19:16.680 I mean, our process was trying to involve as much interactivity as possible on the website, especially on the home page, because that's the thing that people see first, isn't it. 00:19:16.680 --> 00:19:20.880 So that was the inclusion of a model that you could move about. 00:19:20.880 --> 00:19:22.599 Yeah. We used SketchFab didn’t we? 00:19:22.599 --> 00:19:27.240 A scan, a 360 image of the office that you can sort of traverse. 00:19:27.480 --> 00:19:28.920 The virtual tours kind of thing. 00:19:28.920 --> 00:19:29.079 Yeah. 00:19:29.079 --> 00:19:36.799 The virtual tours kind of thing, you know, and then the idea of having it fixed scroll when you scroll so you can involve a little bit of added animated... 00:19:36.839 --> 00:19:37.559 Yeah... 00:19:37.559 --> 00:19:41.240 You know, movement through it. 00:19:41.240 --> 00:19:42.039 I guess that was it. 00:19:42.039 --> 00:19:51.039 Like you said, maybe the decisions were quite typical but the additions to things were like can you do this, can you do that. 00:19:51.039 --> 00:19:53.119 And you were going, yeah, yeah, we can do that. 00:19:53.119 --> 00:19:54.119 Yeah, we can give it a go. 00:19:54.119 --> 00:19:54.960 I never say no. 00:19:54.960 --> 00:19:55.599 No. 00:19:55.960 --> 00:20:02.359 I always try and even if it's like a really complicated idea maybe, I’d always try and make it work. 00:20:02.440 --> 00:20:03.640 Sometimes it won't. 00:20:03.640 --> 00:20:09.759 Just because maybe you're asking too much of that particular device, whatever you may call it to do. 00:20:10.039 --> 00:20:11.119 Yeah. 00:20:11.119 --> 00:20:13.640 But there's always a way of doing something. 00:20:13.640 --> 00:20:14.839 Yeah. 00:20:14.839 --> 00:20:16.000 I'd say. Yeah. 00:20:16.000 --> 00:20:17.480 Well that was one of the benefits to working with you I think. 00:20:17.480 --> 00:20:19.839 Just nothing was out of bounds for you. 00:20:19.839 --> 00:20:20.359 No, no. 00:20:20.359 --> 00:20:22.440 You just kept pushing the design. 00:20:22.440 --> 00:20:27.039 Like we said, I don't think it would have got to the point without you. So, you know. 00:20:27.039 --> 00:20:31.680 I don't think any other BIM or construction company is going to take this approach either, do you? 00:20:32.319 --> 00:20:34.480 I think that is a great point. 00:20:34.480 --> 00:20:38.599 I think that was what we wanted in the first place was something unique that no other company... 00:20:38.599 --> 00:20:39.720 I think that's what anyone wants. 00:20:39.720 --> 00:20:42.039 That is in sort of a design mind. 00:20:42.039 --> 00:20:47.279 I think that was our goal in the first place because I think what was one of the keywords we threw around in the first meeting was just like unique. 00:20:47.279 --> 00:20:50.880 It has to be like unique and you have to associate it with BIMTech. 00:20:50.880 --> 00:21:06.119 And it was also the idea of I know it's been seven years since we developed a new website, but it was with the idea in mind of another ten years of a website, but with the added thing of having it more active as well. 00:21:06.119 --> 00:21:06.720 Yeah. 00:21:06.720 --> 00:21:08.440 You know, actually. 00:21:08.440 --> 00:21:14.279 That's going to be a big thing, yeah, keeping on top of your news and all your podcasts are going to go on there as well aren’t they? 00:21:14.279 --> 00:21:22.319 So this will be on there, things like that, videos, news articles, case studies, just keeping it active. 00:21:22.319 --> 00:21:22.960 Yeah. 00:21:22.960 --> 00:21:23.799 Is the key. 00:21:23.799 --> 00:21:24.720 Yeah. 00:21:24.720 --> 00:21:38.920 So, with that design stuff in mind and the changes that you made to the process of making our website like the sprint thing happening instead and the inclusion of us in the file as you were working in it. 00:21:39.119 --> 00:21:49.720 Are those things that you’d use going forward or was that just something that it was with this project and the involvement with me and Ross with you? 00:21:50.400 --> 00:21:54.839 Well as Turhan always says, we're always open to change. 00:21:55.240 --> 00:22:03.200 So I think in terms of like future, the sprint side of things kind of spoke for itself really, didn't it? 00:22:03.200 --> 00:22:03.599 Yes. 00:22:03.599 --> 00:22:07.160 You were able to feedback a lot quicker. 00:22:07.160 --> 00:22:13.200 I was able to do, like revisions and different ideas quicker because you were giving me feedback quicker. So... 00:22:13.200 --> 00:22:13.640 Yeah. 00:22:13.640 --> 00:22:20.160 The whole thing kind of just went faster and better, not just faster and still the same quality. 00:22:20.160 --> 00:22:20.759 Yeah. 00:22:20.759 --> 00:22:25.599 I think that is probably something we're going to consider moving forwards. 00:22:25.839 --> 00:22:27.559 More sprint based work. 00:22:27.559 --> 00:22:35.000 Yeah, I think, I don't know if I asked you this or not, but for you, what is the best part of the website that you designed?

00:22:35.079 --> 00:22:39.359 Like, what’s the bit of it that you think oh yeah, this came out... 00:22:40.599 --> 00:22:41.839 I really like the project page. 00:22:41.839 --> 00:22:47.039 And the way it kind of overlays and the kind of blurry background stuff like that. 00:22:47.039 --> 00:22:48.759 That’s a really nice page. 00:22:48.759 --> 00:22:50.160 And some of the cards as well. 00:22:50.160 --> 00:22:53.160 Some of the cards have like really nice interactions when you hover over them. 00:22:53.160 --> 00:22:54.240 Oh yeah. Yeah. 00:22:54.240 --> 00:22:55.000 What's yours? 00:22:55.000 --> 00:22:57.240 Mine? Oh god. 00:22:58.680 --> 00:23:05.759 I think, yeah, it's either the projects page because I think that came out looking great and the sort of flow through. 00:23:05.960 --> 00:23:08.880 I think the flow of the website is one of the best parts of it. 00:23:08.880 --> 00:23:10.559 It just, it all works nicely. 00:23:10.559 --> 00:23:18.599 I think the other thing we haven't mentioned, I'll mention quickly, is just the idea that obviously we're media in the company and there’s engineering in the company. 00:23:18.599 --> 00:23:24.359 And the idea was to also add another element of that by switching to media to see the services that we provide. 00:23:24.640 --> 00:23:29.920 And I think we did that quite nicely as well because we're not a big company within it. 00:23:29.920 --> 00:23:33.240 We are, again, we're more of like a media consultancy within the business. 00:23:33.440 --> 00:23:37.440 So it's just highlighting that there is a different aspect to the company and here it is. 00:23:37.440 --> 00:23:49.960 But in this cool way where you ended up coming up with an idea of putting, tags underneath the menu system so that you could switch between the two brands, which I thought was a unique little feature to the website. 00:23:49.960 --> 00:23:55.119 I know that was another thing that took a bit of time to sort of get our heads around about how we were going to do that. 00:23:55.119 --> 00:23:59.720 But to me that's one of the most unique parts of it as well, is that ability to do that. 00:24:00.000 --> 00:24:01.400 The site switcher as we ended up calling it. 00:24:01.400 --> 00:24:01.799 Yeah. 00:24:01.799 --> 00:24:04.160 Site switcher, yeah, you can take that forward. 00:24:04.160 --> 00:24:06.519 Unless we patent it? 00:24:07.680 --> 00:24:10.640 But yeah, that was one of the best parts of it as well. 00:24:10.640 --> 00:24:14.400 But the home page itself, I think the home page speaks for itself. 00:24:14.799 --> 00:24:19.440 You scroll through it and it's just so nicely laid out and the interactions within it. 00:24:19.480 --> 00:24:23.680 I think you could get a whole grasp of the business just by scrolling through that one page. 00:24:23.680 --> 00:24:24.000 Yeah. 00:24:24.000 --> 00:24:32.200 And you’d have a whole overall view of it without having to traverse the site, which I think is important when it comes to a home page.

00:24:32.200 --> 00:24:34.440 The SketchFab thing in particular, I'm looking forward to seeing. 00:24:34.440 --> 00:24:36.240 Yeah, the ability to move the model. 00:24:36.240 --> 00:24:38.240 Yeah. In real time. 00:24:38.240 --> 00:24:41.640 Would you think about putting those on your project pages maybe in the future? 00:24:41.920 --> 00:24:43.319 Yeah, we did discuss that, didn't we? 00:24:43.319 --> 00:24:51.720 I think the only problem we have in our industry is we work in quite a private, you know, there's like prison jobs and stuff, so you can't really share the models on them. 00:24:52.039 --> 00:24:53.039 That’d be bad wouldn’t it? 00:24:53.039 --> 00:24:55.160 Yeah, yeah. Great escape. 00:24:56.119 --> 00:25:01.440 No, I think there's tons of aspects of it that are great. 00:25:01.440 --> 00:25:02.240 Yeah. 00:25:02.240 --> 00:25:08.279 You know, I think we're all happy with the way it's gone and working with you specifically has been great. 00:25:08.279 --> 00:25:08.640 Yeah. 00:25:08.640 --> 00:25:11.519 And excited for the build to start happening. 00:25:11.519 --> 00:25:11.920 Yeah. 00:25:11.920 --> 00:25:22.079 I think, I can’t remember if we mentioned earlier about how exciting it's going to be to actually see it like live in a web kind of format rather than figma, because Figma can only show so much. 00:25:22.519 --> 00:25:22.880 Yeah. 00:25:22.880 --> 00:25:26.079 I can only do so much prototyping and not break the file. 00:25:26.079 --> 00:25:26.640 Yeah. 00:25:26.640 --> 00:25:28.799 Or break your computer in the process. 00:25:28.799 --> 00:25:29.880 You're right. 00:25:29.880 --> 00:25:34.799 So it'd be great to see, like, all those interactions kind of happening in real time. 00:25:34.799 --> 00:25:35.960 Yeah. 00:25:35.960 --> 00:25:45.680 With you moving the mouse and stuff or pulling things and sliding things, and like you said earlier, the homepage with the navigation, the fixed kind of nav. 00:25:45.680 --> 00:25:49.960 So it tells us like the story of BIMTech, they'll be nice to see actually happen. 00:25:49.960 --> 00:25:50.759 Yeah. 00:25:50.759 --> 00:26:03.400 So, sort of rounding it all off I think a couple of questions to ask are, in your opinion is the process that you did with us the sort of like beneficial process? 00:26:03.400 --> 00:26:11.640 Is that your preferred and has it allowed you to create something that you wouldn't normally be able to create in other conditions? 00:26:13.559 --> 00:26:32.000 Yeah, I'd say, yeah, what came out was, well, you said it yourself, it was far beyond what you expected to see and I think it pushed me in a design sense, like pushed me to my limits of squeezing the rag or ringing the rag of creative juices. 00:26:32.000 --> 00:26:32.640 Yeah. 00:26:32.640 --> 00:26:33.519 Of what I could come up with. 00:26:33.519 --> 00:26:38.759 There was a lot of head scratching, a lot of headaches in trying to think how I could make something work. 00:26:38.759 --> 00:26:42.359 But at the end of the day, it looks so much better for it. 00:26:42.920 --> 00:26:44.279 Yeah. Well, that’s good. 00:26:44.279 --> 00:26:44.880 So I’d say yeah to that. 00:26:44.880 --> 00:26:46.119 Yeah. No, nice one. 00:26:46.119 --> 00:26:50.200 If it had gone the other way I’d have just cut that out. 00:26:50.200 --> 00:26:52.039 Yeah. No, cheers for coming in today. 00:26:52.039 --> 00:26:52.559 No problem. 00:26:52.559 --> 00:26:54.480 It’s been really good to chat to you. 00:26:54.480 --> 00:26:55.119 Good to relive it. 00:26:55.119 --> 00:26:57.920 For listeners, we lost half the podcast. 00:26:57.920 --> 00:26:59.480 So we had to go through a couple of things. 00:26:59.480 --> 00:27:01.759 But, yeah, it's still been great to chat you. 00:27:01.759 --> 00:27:02.559 Yeah. 00:27:02.559 --> 00:27:04.200 And, we've enjoyed working with you. 00:27:04.200 --> 00:27:07.119 I'm assuming you'll still be on the process a little bit. 00:27:07.119 --> 00:27:07.519 Yeah. 00:27:07.519 --> 00:27:11.400 So what normally happens is I kind of do like a handover with a dev. 00:27:11.400 --> 00:27:14.599 Explain how everything needs to work. 00:27:14.599 --> 00:27:14.960 Yeah. 00:27:14.960 --> 00:27:16.519 And then they kind of go away. 00:27:16.519 --> 00:27:22.160 So the actual dev side of it is a little less involved just because there's no changes, if that makes sense. 00:27:22.160 --> 00:27:24.799 So they just build what is agreed. 00:27:24.799 --> 00:27:25.119 Yeah. 00:27:25.119 --> 00:27:30.200 And then towards the end of that process we go through what we call snagging. 00:27:30.200 --> 00:27:34.640 So then that's when I come back into it and I go through it with like a fine tooth comb you could say. 00:27:34.640 --> 00:27:36.920 And say, this is wrong, this is wrong, this is wrong. 00:27:36.920 --> 00:27:37.319 Yeah. 00:27:37.319 --> 00:27:38.279 This this needs to work like this. 00:27:38.279 --> 00:27:40.119 This needs to work like this. 00:27:40.119 --> 00:27:45.240 I'm sure the devs hate when I get on it because I'm really quite in depth. 00:27:45.359 --> 00:27:45.960 Yeah. 00:27:45.960 --> 00:27:47.759 With my snagging but it has to be right. 00:27:47.759 --> 00:27:52.880 There's no point spending like three months, four months, would you say it's been of design? 00:27:52.880 --> 00:27:53.400 Yeah. 00:27:53.400 --> 00:27:54.359 Not counting Christmas. 00:27:54.359 --> 00:27:59.480 So there's no point spending that much time to then just let things slide at the end. 00:27:59.480 --> 00:28:02.480 So needs to be spot on. 00:28:02.480 --> 00:28:05.319 No, nice one. 00:28:02.480 --> 00:28:05.319 Everyone's leaving for lunch now. 00:28:06.440 --> 00:28:06.839 Yeah. 00:28:06.839 --> 00:28:08.880 No, cheers for coming on. 00:28:08.880 --> 00:28:10.200 No problem. It's been a pleasure. 00:28:10.200 --> 00:28:12.359 I'm still looking forward to having you in the process and stuff. 00:28:12.359 --> 00:28:12.559 Yeah. 00:28:12.559 --> 00:28:19.559 But yeah, seeing where it all goes and where it ultimately comes out as I think will be great to see. 00:28:19.559 --> 00:28:22.680 Yeah, I'll keep popping in the meetings and check how it's going. 00:28:22.920 --> 00:28:23.519 Nice one. 00:28:23.519 --> 00:28:24.039 I'll keep in touch. 00:28:24.039 --> 00:28:31.200 No, cheers for listening and I don't know what the next podcast will be on, so just tune in for the next one. 00:28:32.720 --> 00:28:33.960 Maybe how the website's gone all wrong.