บทถอดความฉบับเต็มของ Eric Henerlau: The future belongs to clubs willing to change how they lead

everybody get together. 00:04:03.039 --> 00:04:12.879 What do you think are important things we need to do to start this conversation and get people on board to work together as an organization to get things going? 00:04:13.199 --> 00:04:14.400 There's a lot of things you covered there. 00:04:14.479 --> 00:04:16.480 I'm just trying to see if I can touch on all of them. 00:04:16.639 --> 00:04:20.720 One thing you've heard the phrase over the many years that all politics is local politics, right? 00:04:20.879 --> 00:04:22.959 All square dancing is local square dancing. 00:04:23.040 --> 00:04:27.120 You can talk about the state and federal level, but really it's all about the individual clubs, right? 00:04:27.439 --> 00:04:30.240 The clubs are looking at themselves and saying, what can we do? 00:04:30.399 --> 00:04:30.959 What can I do? 00:04:31.120 --> 00:04:38.079 And you look to large organizations maybe for ideas or support or help, but it's really going to come down to the individual clubs to make something happen. 00:04:38.240 --> 00:04:44.240 The conversation that has to really happen among all dancers and callers as well is what do we really want? 00:04:44.480 --> 00:04:46.319 Do we really want to grow this activity? 00:04:46.480 --> 00:04:48.879 And what are we willing to do to make that happen? 00:04:49.040 --> 00:04:51.040 And a lot of things are happening in different places. 00:04:51.199 --> 00:04:53.920 You've heard the call lab recently made a big change in the programs. 00:04:54.000 --> 00:04:58.240 And it's really important for people to understand the genesis of that and the importance of that. 00:04:58.399 --> 00:05:01.439 And it wasn't to disrupt everything to just annoy people. 00:05:01.600 --> 00:05:10.160 It was really to make it an opportunity for people to come into the activity at a much easier pace and a much easier commitment than was previously done in the past. 00:05:10.399 --> 00:05:22.959 The conversation really at the state and national level is are we willing to step forward and say, let's look at things differently and say, hey, let's make room for people who want to come into the activity, but don't have their entire lives to commit to it. 00:05:23.120 --> 00:05:27.120 Maybe they're a more casual dancer, but we want to have that as part of this because a part of our community. 00:05:27.199 --> 00:05:29.680 They're what we want to bring the joy of square dancing to. 00:05:29.839 --> 00:05:38.639 If they can think about it from those terms, then how can we refocus what we're doing into just a larger how do we bring more people into our umbrella? 00:05:38.800 --> 00:05:40.639 That's the conversation that we all need to have. 00:05:40.720 --> 00:05:42.959 How can we bring more people, whatever that means? 00:05:43.120 --> 00:05:45.199 And it could mean changing a lot of things to do that. 00:05:45.439 --> 00:05:47.920 Let's talk about those things that will need to change. 00:05:48.160 --> 00:05:59.920 The that idea that we have to start thinking in terms of it's okay for someone to be a casual dancer, is really hard with some of the older dancers to get across. 00:06:00.560 --> 00:06:07.360 They want people to take 24 lessons and then come to every dance afterwards and also go to all the festivals. 00:06:07.680 --> 00:06:11.120 And I'm running into that a lot for club growth. 00:06:11.600 --> 00:06:13.920 We don't have to have everybody go to festivals. 00:06:14.240 --> 00:06:18.959 If we have people come in when they're available, it's still fun. 00:06:19.360 --> 00:06:21.519 It still makes the club livelier. 00:06:21.759 --> 00:06:29.279 Can you speak to that and why it's important to loosen up and just realize that people who want to dance are who we want to connect with? 00:06:29.600 --> 00:06:31.680 Yeah, because it's a great point. 00:06:31.839 --> 00:06:37.360 If you think about it, a lot of people who go to clubs and dancing clubs don't dance outside of their club. 00:06:37.439 --> 00:06:40.879 They may dance in their club or their workshop or their classes or whatever, and that's it. 00:06:40.959 --> 00:06:42.000 That's all they do. 00:06:42.160 --> 00:06:47.120 And the festivals and the larger events that are square dancing related, they may not go to those. 00:06:47.279 --> 00:06:50.079 They may just want to stay at home with their club because that's what they enjoy. 00:06:50.240 --> 00:06:53.120 And it could be because, let's say they're a Wednesday night group, that's their Wednesday night. 00:06:53.199 --> 00:06:55.439 They're not going to go to the festivals, and that's okay. 00:06:55.680 --> 00:06:57.839 Everybody's got a place for square dancing. 00:06:57.920 --> 00:06:58.720 That's the bottom line. 00:06:58.800 --> 00:06:59.519 You've got to remember that. 00:06:59.600 --> 00:07:01.600 They've all come to pay money to have fun. 00:07:01.759 --> 00:07:04.720 And that's what we have to deliver for them is having fun and enjoyment. 00:07:04.879 --> 00:07:07.759 And it doesn't mean they have to sign up for some lifelong program. 00:07:07.839 --> 00:07:10.000 And some of them may get hooked and they may say, Yeah, this is great. 00:07:10.079 --> 00:07:11.439 I want to take it as far as I can. 00:07:11.680 --> 00:07:14.000 Other people may say, I can do this once in a while. 00:07:14.160 --> 00:07:14.959 I'll come for a while. 00:07:15.120 --> 00:07:17.519 Maybe I'll drop out for a while, but I want to come back later. 00:07:17.680 --> 00:07:18.879 And we see that a lot. 00:07:19.199 --> 00:07:22.480 In clubs that are locked into, we have to be here all the time. 00:07:22.560 --> 00:07:25.680 And if you fall behind, you can't come with us anymore because you've fallen off. 00:07:25.839 --> 00:07:27.120 We have to rethink that quite a bit. 00:07:27.199 --> 00:07:34.480 We have to think about how we can have the casual dancer still be part of our community because these are, they're all people and they're all great people. 00:07:34.560 -->

00:07:38.319 If they came into square dancing in the first place, they're probably great people to start out with. 00:07:38.480 --> 00:07:43.759 A lot of callers will do things they call one night stands or party nights for non-square dancers, and those are great. 00:07:44.000 --> 00:07:54.160 There's a great caller in the Washington area, Dave Harry, and you should talk to him because he has got this great program of monthly party nights that draws eight to 12 squares every month. 00:07:54.240 --> 00:07:56.560 And he puts it on and no experience required. 00:07:56.720 --> 00:07:58.319 That's one side of it, and that's one thing. 00:07:58.399 --> 00:08:00.399 Now, we're over here in the square dance community. 00:08:00.480 --> 00:08:02.879 We want you to go through a set of lessons and get up to this level. 00:08:02.959 --> 00:08:09.600 And maybe somewhere there's something in between that says, we'll teach some lessons and you can learn some calls and you can come and dance with us, and that's great. 00:08:09.680 --> 00:08:13.680 And we understand that sometimes you may not be able to come and you can have other things. 00:08:13.759 --> 00:08:21.040 Maybe you're on a vacation, maybe you've got other commitments, but we want to have a place for you to come back and join us again because we like you and we want you part of our community. 00:08:21.199 --> 00:08:23.519 And that's the place we got to figure out for everybody. 00:08:23.680 --> 00:08:24.879 And we have to define it well. 00:08:25.040 --> 00:08:32.720 When they come back, they don't feel frustrated because the caller is doing six new calls they never heard of, or the dancers are upset with them because they can't remember the call. 00:08:32.879 --> 00:08:33.759 Well, they were gone for a while. 00:08:33.840 --> 00:08:36.399 So you got to give them some leeway to get back up to speed. 00:08:36.480 --> 00:08:41.039 But they're part of the community that we want to have square dancing, and we have to create that space for them. 00:08:41.279 --> 00:08:41.759 I agree. 00:08:41.919 --> 00:08:52.720 And the other part is I also understand when you're in a group where the square breaks down every time because somebody doesn't dance very well, you can accommodate that in different ways, though. 00:08:52.879 --> 00:08:58.559 You can have an extra hour where for advanced dancing and that kind of thing at the end. 00:08:58.720 --> 00:09:04.559 So I think it is important to give people a chance to work their way in slowly. 00:09:04.879 --> 00:09:15.600 So, in my for example, in my club, my local home club here, I put an email out to the club saying, more targeted to newer dancers, I'm gonna be there half an hour early if you want to come review any call, anything you want to go over. 00:09:15.679 --> 00:09:17.200 And they're like, Yes, they reply they want to be there. 00:09:17.279 --> 00:09:19.519 And then before the lessons start, they want to review something. 00:09:19.600 --> 00:09:23.679 Maybe

they were gone, maybe they want a personal one-on-one walkthrough on something. 00:09:23.840 --> 00:09:25.919 So as a caller, we have to provide that for them. 00:09:26.080 --> 00:09:28.320 As long as the venue is available, we can get there. 00:09:28.480 --> 00:09:36.960 We need to make that place so they feel happy that we're taking care of them so they can learn it and they can have fun dancing it without feeling like they're breaking down everything. 00:09:37.120 --> 00:09:44.720 It's a great opportunity for callers to meet with dancers one-on-one, get to know them a little better, and talk through any issues that might come up. 00:09:44.879 --> 00:09:47.120 I'm gonna go a little bit on this on the teaching part there. 00:09:47.200 --> 00:09:55.519 And if you think about it, when a dancer is out there learning a call in a class or a workshop, he or she is trying to understand the call as best as he or she can. 00:09:55.679 --> 00:10:03.360 Now, the caller is giving words and instruction about what to do, and maybe that works, and maybe people understand that, and maybe it's a little fuzzy for some other people. 00:10:03.519 --> 00:10:12.240 And when dancers understand that the callers know that there are different ways that they can learn, it helps break the anxiety and bring it down. 00:10:12.399 --> 00:10:16.639 So, for example, you can stand on stage and teach all the words and how to do a call. 00:10:16.720 --> 00:10:17.600 Some people will get that. 00:10:17.759 --> 00:10:19.120 Other people might be confused. 00:10:19.279 --> 00:10:26.480 You can get off the stage and you can have two dancers or four dancers on a square demonstrate the call and walk through the whole thing. 00:10:26.720 --> 00:10:28.080 People see a lot by visual. 00:10:28.240 --> 00:10:32.639 Then you can have the new dancers walk through the call without music and get some kinetic understanding of the call. 00:10:32.720 --> 00:10:34.639 So different modalities of learning the call. 00:10:34.799 --> 00:10:36.240 Some people like to see it written out. 00:10:36.399 --> 00:10:39.919 Of course, most people have taminations, they can see it written out, they understand that. 00:10:40.080 --> 00:10:46.879 So it's understanding that there are different avenues for people to learn because they all do want to learn to understand so they can enjoy square dancing. 00:10:47.120 --> 00:11:03.360 Where I'm going with this is that callers and dance leaders need to understand that they need to create a place for people who are casual dancers or are learning in a class to go through the process of learning in the way that suits them best. 00:11:03.600 --> 00:11:04.960 Everybody learns differently. 00:11:05.039 --> 00:11:08.799 So we have to give that opportunity for different ways of teaching, ways of learning. 00:11:09.200 --> 00:11:10.080 Excellent point. 00:11:10.320 --> 00:11:11.840 You can talk to me all day long. 00:11:12.000 --> 00:11:13.840 I won't get it until I walk through

the motions. 00:11:14.240 --> 00:11:14.399 Exactly. 00:11:14.559 --> 00:11:14.720 Perfect. 00:11:15.120 --> 00:11:18.240 Luckily, I went to a college that's a motto was learn by doing. 00:11:19.440 --> 00:11:33.679 So the other thing I wanted to bring up is that I think that we don't focus on enough on what a great time we're in, what an opportunity we have to grow square dancing. 00:11:34.000 --> 00:11:40.240 I had a club write me and say that they were losing members, they didn't know what to do, what should they do? 00:11:40.559 --> 00:11:47.759 Because, and this is what they said, young people don't want to square dance, and they don't want to hang around older people. 00:11:48.080 --> 00:11:50.000 We have not found that to be true. 00:11:50.159 --> 00:11:58.480 But what's interesting is yesterday, I don't know if you listened to NPR, but they had a piece on the that dance halls are coming back. 00:11:59.360 --> 00:12:11.759 And young people and groups of people of all ages are opening their old dance halls and renovating them so they can all dance together as a community, and it's going on all over the country. 00:12:12.159 --> 00:12:21.600 So we're in a great time to tap into it by changing how we look at our clubs and the health of our clubs. 00:12:21.759 --> 00:12:24.159 I think we have a golden opportunity. 00:12:24.320 --> 00:12:26.720 So, what do you think are those golden opportunities? 00:12:27.120 --> 00:12:30.559 I'm gonna go back on this thing when you say people say young people don't want to square dance. 00:12:30.799 --> 00:12:31.759 So I'll go back 30 years. 00:12:31.840 --> 00:12:35.440 We talk about square dancing, and people say, My grandma did that, my grandpa did that. 00:12:35.679 --> 00:12:37.679 So we're dealing with that generational issue. 00:12:37.840 --> 00:12:42.080 30 years have gone by, and in a lot of places, square dancing has all but disappeared. 00:12:42.159 --> 00:12:44.960 So you can't even find it locally because some of the clubs have gone. 00:12:45.120 --> 00:12:48.720 So now when someone says square dancing, they say, number one, I didn't know it existed. 00:12:48.879 --> 00:12:50.320 Or number two, what is it? 00:12:50.480 --> 00:12:51.279 I don't know what it is. 00:12:51.440 --> 00:12:52.960 And that's a great place to come from. 00:12:53.039 --> 00:12:55.279 If they don't know what it is, what a wonderful opportunity. 00:12:55.360 --> 00:12:57.840 They don't have any idea what it might be, you know. 00:12:57.919 --> 00:13:01.120 So they said, Great, let's find out what it is and do something about it. 00:13:01.279 --> 00:13:14.799 I think we are on an uptick in people joining the activity because we've seen that there's been such a void of that in clubs everywhere and dancers everywhere, that people are coming into it something new and something fresh, gone through a whole cycle, it's coming back up again. 00:13:14.879 --> 00:13:15.919 And I think it's exciting. 00:13:16.000 --> 00:13:17.200 I'm very happy about that. 00:13:17.360 --> 00:13:28.720 The part about young people, you've heard the statistic before that people socialize generally with people their own age or people older or younger than themselves, usually plus or minus about 10 years. 00:13:28.879 --> 00:13:35.600 So if you have a 60-year-old person, they're gonna socialize with somebody probably between 50 and 70, is probably their social circle range. 00:13:35.759 --> 00:13:39.360 But a 60-year-old is not gonna be socializing with a 30-year-old and vice versa. 00:13:39.679 --> 00:13:48.240 You have to be realistic about who you're trying to attract into a club and who you think would really build into the club and bond with everybody else in the group. 00:13:48.399 --> 00:13:56.000 I'm not saying exclude anybody, but I'm saying don't target an audience that is not probably as receptive as other audiences. 00:13:56.159 --> 00:14:01.759 You can look at audiences that might be a better fit based on the demographics of your group you have right now. 00:14:01.919 --> 00:14:03.840 It's wonderful that dance halls are opening. 00:14:04.000 --> 00:14:09.360 I didn't hear that story, but I'll look for that story because dance halls are coming all the way around. 00:14:09.519 --> 00:14:23.600 And when dance hall is open, it opens up all kinds of dancing, which will include square dancing and may include square dancing in a form that we don't look at today, like the traditional dancing with live music and the contra dancing, which is not the form that we do it, but it's very popular with young people. 00:14:23.759 --> 00:14:28.720 So we have to understand that and recognize it and not fight it, but go with that and say, that's great. 00:14:28.879 --> 00:14:32.320 Maybe some of those people are interested in the square dancing we do, and maybe not. 00:14:32.480 --> 00:14:33.279 We'll find out. 00:14:33.440 --> 00:14:35.039 But that's another avenue for this thing. 00:14:35.200 --> 00:14:36.799 There's no such thing as bad dancing. 00:14:36.960 --> 00:14:41.519 Any kind of dancing getting out there will get somebody into the dance pool that we can look at. 00:14:41.840 --> 00:14:47.279 People might have seen that you're offering workshops and leadership, and we talked about those previously. 00:14:47.440 --> 00:14:52.240 Tell us a little bit about what you've been doing as far as doing workshops with leadership. 00:14:52.559 --> 00:15:07.440 So the idea that I came up with on this was when I do go out and do a weekend festival somewhere, oftentimes the sponsoring organization will have the caller that comes in do a collar clinic and for an hour with local calls, and we do some caller workshop caller training thing. 00:15:07.519 --> 00:15:08.240 And that's fine. 00:15:08.399 --> 00:15:14.399 But I thought rather than that, why not have all the club leaders get together for that since they all came out for the festival anyway, right? 00:15:14.639 --> 00:15:20.000 And then why don't we get

together for an hour and share ideas and issues and concerns? 00:15:20.159 --> 00:15:25.360 Now, this may be going on at some other level, at some other association meeting or whatever meeting might happen. 00:15:25.600 --> 00:15:31.120 Since we're all here at the festival, let's take that hour and get together and say, what is working? 00:15:31.279 --> 00:15:36.080 Somebody share a success story of what's working and somebody tell me what's not working. 00:15:36.240 --> 00:15:39.200 We're going to be captive in this room for an hour, 20 people. 00:15:39.279 --> 00:15:44.000 Let's try to figure out some ideas we can share back and forth to make things, maybe get some ideas that might work. 00:15:44.159 --> 00:15:53.440 And maybe something comes out of it, or maybe it's a more of an attitude shift of saying, instead of saying, I've got 27 reasons why people don't score dance, that's fine, but that's not relevant. 00:15:53.600 --> 00:15:57.120 Let's go find 10 reasons why people should score dance and go approach that. 00:15:57.279 --> 00:16:14.559 And that's the purpose of the leadership training is for people to get together and say, let's find out how we can take clubs that are working, that have something successful, and talk to those that are struggling and say, let's work together for one common purpose of bringing people into the activity and let's make this happen. 00:16:14.879 --> 00:16:19.120 I think we also have to change the way that we look at leadership. 00:16:19.279 --> 00:16:27.039 What I have seen in our state is that the people who take the higher offices tend to get there because they're well liked. 00:16:27.360 --> 00:16:29.759 They have been square dancing for decades. 00:16:30.320 --> 00:16:35.519 And they we're not talking a lot about helping the clubs, to be honest. 00:16:35.679 --> 00:16:38.000 But I think we have to shift to that. 00:16:38.159 --> 00:16:45.440 We know, for instance, I live in a valley right now that used to have four clubs and now we have zero clubs. 00:16:45.759 --> 00:16:49.759 Our district used to have 15 clubs and now we have five clubs. 00:16:50.159 --> 00:17:00.080 We travel almost one and a half hours on one Saturday to go to a club and we have a carpool, and then two hours to go to another club on the alternate Saturdays. 00:17:00.399 --> 00:17:02.000 That's how we swear dance. 00:17:02.240 --> 00:17:04.640 We're a dedicated rate. 00:17:04.960 --> 00:17:05.279 Right. 00:17:05.440 --> 00:17:07.440 But we would love to have a club here. 00:17:07.680 --> 00:17:08.880 Our problem is we can't. 00:17:08.960 --> 00:17:14.640 I think that we could actually start one, but we don't have a teacher within hours of us, so it's difficult. 00:17:15.359 --> 00:17:22.960 We start working together with our state and national organizations to get this thing a little bit more coordinated, I guess I would say. 00:17:23.119 --> 00:17:24.480 Do you think that's necessary? 00:17:24.799 --> 00:17:25.920 Well, I don't know.

00:17:26.160 --> 00:17:34.240 I'm not sure if it can be done at that level, but I would say you need three things to start a club a teacher/slash caller, a venue, and the willingness to make it happen. 00:17:34.480 --> 00:17:34.880 That's it. 00:17:35.039 --> 00:17:35.839 That's all you need. 00:17:36.000 --> 00:17:40.480 So if you can make those three things come together, you can find a way to make a club happen. 00:17:40.559 --> 00:17:46.160 Even in small rural areas or metropolitan areas, there is always somebody out there looking for it. 00:17:46.400 --> 00:17:53.920 So if you look around and say, well, we don't have a big area or we nobody wants to do it, or we had a club that folded, well, that's all fine, but that's the past. 00:17:54.160 --> 00:17:57.119 We have today and we have tomorrow, and we can look at it that way. 00:17:57.200 --> 00:18:02.079 So you have to have a teacher or a caller, you have to have a venue and the willingness to make it happen. 00:18:02.319 --> 00:18:05.920 So, can that happen at a state level or national level? 00:18:06.079 --> 00:18:09.839 You know, what you really need, and what I'm seeing is the biggest issue right now is callers. 00:18:09.920 --> 00:18:11.519 We need more callers out on the floor. 00:18:11.680 --> 00:18:15.599 A lot of callers are retiring out, so they're finishing their careers as callers. 00:18:15.759 --> 00:18:18.480 We need more callers who can come in and teach classes. 00:18:18.640 --> 00:18:25.440 If you don't show fun, if you just show a class that is something that is drudgery to go through, no one's gonna stick around for that. 00:18:25.599 --> 00:18:26.400 People want to have fun. 00:18:26.480 --> 00:18:30.079 They want to have a social time with their friends and they want to have fun dancing. 00:18:30.400 --> 00:18:34.559 So my challenge right now is finding callers who can come into an area. 00:18:34.640 --> 00:18:36.799 Like you said, there's nearest callers two hours away from you. 00:18:36.960 --> 00:18:38.799 Well, that's not gonna work very well, right? 00:18:38.960 --> 00:18:42.079 So you need to find out how you can grow your own callers in your own area. 00:18:42.480 --> 00:18:45.920 Maybe that comes from existing dancers or from another source. 00:18:46.079 --> 00:18:58.640 I've always thought that a great source for getting someone to become a score dance caller would be going to a karaoke bar and saying, going up to somebody who loves to sing and saying, Hey, would you like a job coming every week to sing for this group? 00:18:58.720 --> 00:19:02.880 And after every song that you sing for them, they're gonna clap for you and then they're gonna pay you money. 00:19:03.039 --> 00:19:03.759 How's that sound? 00:19:03.920 --> 00:19:06.240 So basically you're teaching them how to do a singing call, right? 00:19:06.400 --> 00:19:08.240 So they can say, Hey, that sounds like a great idea. 00:19:08.400 --> 00:19:12.000 So I have not gone to a karaoke bar to test this theory, but this is my theory anyway. 00:19:12.160 --> 00:19:14.960 So anybody out there who go to karaoke bars, let me know if that works, right? 00:19:15.200 --> 00:19:16.079 I love it. 00:19:16.400 --> 00:19:16.799 Try it. 00:19:17.039 --> 00:19:21.440 He's a karaoke bar singer, and they and they get to dance and it all works out, and everybody has fun. 00:19:21.599 --> 00:19:22.960 So I love that. 00:19:23.200 --> 00:19:28.559 The other thing I want to talk about is that I hear, well, we tried that and it didn't work. 00:19:29.119 --> 00:19:32.799 And I want to say, we're in a new era, things have changed. 00:19:33.039 --> 00:19:35.519 We have all these things going on online. 00:19:36.319 --> 00:19:45.920 People now have cell phones that they're married to, where before we had to be home and near the phone to communicate, other than person to person. 00:19:46.640 --> 00:19:54.559 And you know, young people, just as when we were young people, have different interests and ways of doing things. 00:19:55.039 --> 00:20:03.279 So because we tend to be an older group, although my one club, the one in Pueblo, is all ages and it's fantastic. 00:20:03.440 --> 00:20:08.400 We've just had an amazing person join that real got the whole thing going again. 00:20:08.640 --> 00:20:14.559 But somehow we got to get past the idea that there's a magic bullet and a recipe. 00:20:15.039 --> 00:20:17.359 There is no magic bullet, there is no recipe. 00:20:17.599 --> 00:20:23.279 There is there is an idea about having a long-term vision, and that's very important. 00:20:23.440 --> 00:20:26.079 You can't try something and have it fail and say it failed. 00:20:26.160 --> 00:20:27.119 Well, I'm never gonna do that again. 00:20:27.200 --> 00:20:27.680 We're doomed. 00:20:27.759 --> 00:20:29.200 That's ER talking, right? 00:20:29.440 --> 00:20:32.720 So you need to say our long-term vision is this, whatever that is. 00:20:32.880 --> 00:20:36.160 And maybe it's things that didn't work today will work tomorrow. 00:20:36.319 --> 00:20:36.880 We don't know. 00:20:37.039 --> 00:20:38.720 You just got to keep doing them down the line. 00:20:38.960 --> 00:20:45.599 I want to give you an example, and I know Justin Russell talked on this briefly about my own club and what we did about intro nights. 00:20:46.000 --> 00:20:50.079 So, like a lot of clubs, we ran classes once a year, right? 00:20:50.400 --> 00:20:52.720 And we had marginal success in that. 00:20:52.960 --> 00:20:56.960 Several years ago, a woman called and wanted to join square dancing. 00:20:57.039 --> 00:20:57.839 It was in May, right? 00:20:58.160 --> 00:20:58.960 I said, That's great. 00:20:59.039 --> 00:21:00.240 We'd love to have you in our class. 00:21:00.319 --> 00:21:01.680 We're gonna start a class in September. 00:21:01.839 --> 00:21:03.039 I got off the phone. 00:21:03.359 --> 00:21:09.279 I felt horrible because I just turned away somebody who really wanted to square dance today. 00:21:09.519 -->

00:21:10.640 And I didn't know what to do. 00:21:10.799 --> 00:21:14.079 Wow, we don't have a class coming until September, but she wants to square dance now. 00:21:14.400 --> 00:21:24.480 So I went to the club and I said, Listen, we dance every week on the weeknight, on Wednesday night, and we dance every Wednesday, and we have our class and club on the same night. 00:21:24.559 --> 00:21:25.680 That's how we're organized. 00:21:26.079 --> 00:21:39.599 And I said, Well, since we're having our class and club every Wednesday anyway, why don't we set aside one Wednesday a month for just a short time where we can have anybody who wants to try square dancing come in and dance, do an open house. 00:21:39.839 --> 00:21:42.400 And so the club said, that's a great idea. 00:21:42.559 --> 00:21:50.720 And so the first Wednesday of every month is our open house night, and for half an hour, maybe 40 minutes, anybody who wants to can come and try square dancing. 00:21:50.799 --> 00:21:53.119 And the club is already there and the class is already there, right? 00:21:53.359 --> 00:21:55.680 So we just fill out the squares and do it. 00:21:55.839 --> 00:21:56.799 And it's great. 00:21:56.960 --> 00:21:59.759 And if nobody shows up, not a problem because we're there. 00:22:00.160 --> 00:22:01.599 Anyway, for a class and club. 00:22:01.759 --> 00:22:04.480 And if somebody shows up, we do our program for them. 00:22:04.720 --> 00:22:09.920 And some months we've had zero people, some months we've had one or two, some months we've had eight people. 00:22:10.079 --> 00:22:12.480 And some months we have people so excited that this is great. 00:22:12.559 --> 00:22:14.319 Can I come back next month and bring my friends? 00:22:14.480 --> 00:22:15.920 And we say, Yeah. 00:22:16.559 --> 00:22:17.200 I do. 00:22:19.119 --> 00:22:24.480 And what happens is the success of the people coming in, you know, go up and down as far as the number of people each month. 00:22:24.559 --> 00:22:28.319 You know, it could be a few one month or not many, and then a lot, whatever. 00:22:28.480 --> 00:22:37.200 But we capture all their names and numbers, and then we run a class and we tell them all we tell them the class is coming up and they join the class. 00:22:37.359 --> 00:22:40.240 That's what happens because they get an opportunity to taste it for a few months. 00:22:40.480 --> 00:22:45.279 My point to this is we didn't just do it one time and say nobody showed up. 00:22:45.359 --> 00:22:46.559 We've been doing this for six years. 00:22:46.640 --> 00:22:48.160 So we've been doing this a long time. 00:22:48.319 --> 00:22:49.759 This is how we build our classes. 00:22:49.920 --> 00:22:52.720 And the moment you get somebody in a class, you know they're excited. 00:22:52.799 --> 00:22:53.279 And you know what? 00:22:53.359 --> 00:22:55.680 The first thing you want to do is, can I get my friends in this? 00:22:55.839 --> 00:22:56.319 Well, sure. 00:22:56.400 --> 00:22:57.440 No, I know you're

in the class. 00:22:57.599 --> 00:23:00.960 We're having an intro night first Wednesday of next month. 00:23:01.119 --> 00:23:01.599 Bring them in. 00:23:01.680 --> 00:23:03.759 So every month they got to bring their friends in. 00:23:03.920 --> 00:23:05.519 And it works out really, really well. 00:23:05.680 --> 00:23:07.759 So my point is you've got to look long term. 00:23:07.920 --> 00:23:09.680 You can't just try one thing one time. 00:23:09.759 --> 00:23:12.160 And there's different avenues for getting the word out there. 00:23:12.319 --> 00:23:24.640 We know that word of mouth is always the best, but in addition to word of mouth, there are other ways of getting the word out there and keep trying them, keep doing them, and you'll get different results each time, but look long term to see if your results are increasing. 00:23:24.960 --> 00:23:26.799 And everyone's emphasized that. 00:23:26.960 --> 00:23:34.319 I know the first time I helped our club uh do marketing to get more people in the lessons, and it worked. 00:23:34.400 --> 00:23:37.920 We got 18 people in the lessons in an oral era, which was huge. 00:23:38.240 --> 00:23:42.480 The assumption was those 18 people were going to be dancing from now on. 00:23:43.119 --> 00:23:49.359 I think actually we had a really good retention rate because about seven people are still dancing. 00:23:49.519 --> 00:23:50.559 Not all the time. 00:23:50.880 --> 00:23:53.359 A few people like me are dancing all the time. 00:23:53.680 --> 00:24:04.880 But we've got seven people that continue on dancing from that class of 18, which from what I understand from the national retention rate was very good. 00:24:05.200 --> 00:24:09.119 What a lot of people have emphasized is this is a slow game. 00:24:09.440 --> 00:24:30.720 So to think you're gonna like revive your club in a year or two, you just have to start rebuilding and trying new things and getting new people and getting excited and not focusing on the people that didn't stay, but focus on the people that did stay, and uh it will regrow. 00:24:31.200 --> 00:24:39.039 And at some point, I think we might see a real success and we'll be on NPR as the tradition that almost died. 00:24:39.440 --> 00:24:39.599 Great. 00:24:39.759 --> 00:24:42.000 Well, it's great to do is also do an exit interview. 00:24:42.160 --> 00:24:43.359 Do you know what exit interview is? 00:24:43.680 --> 00:24:48.960 So in corporate life, an exit interview is of course what you ask people when they're leaving the company that when they tell the truth about everything, right? 00:24:49.200 --> 00:24:53.519 An exit interview for square dancing is the person who dropped out from the beginner class. 00:24:53.599 --> 00:24:54.640 You want to find out why. 00:24:54.799 --> 00:25:02.880 If you can find out why, that's really golden information to find out because you can say, well, maybe I was gone a couple weeks and I couldn't keep up. 00:25:02.960 --> 00:25:03.839 Well, okay, that's good. 00:25:03.920 --> 00:25:06.079 So then how can you accommodate them in the future? 00:25:06.319 --> 00:25:08.799 Or I had a family emergency or I had to move away. 00:25:09.039 --> 00:25:09.920 Okay, you can't do that. 00:25:10.000 --> 00:25:11.119 But you know, it could be anything. 00:25:11.200 --> 00:25:14.000 Maybe it was I I just couldn't keep up with the pace of the class. 00:25:14.160 --> 00:25:15.599 Well, then you can address those things. 00:25:16.000 --> 00:25:26.880 And so the exit interview from other dancers gives great information about what you can do for future classes to you know accommodate as many people as possible. 00:25:27.039 --> 00:25:30.319 Remember, they all came there to have fun, and that's what they want to do. 00:25:31.920 --> 00:25:37.599 I've been reading on Calor Lab's website about what you're doing to attract new callers. 00:25:37.759 --> 00:25:48.720 And I'll have to say that our district president Ken Tucker at our state festival this year, he went up to every young caller from another state that he saw and got their phone number. 00:25:50.799 --> 00:25:52.319 So we could start calling them. 00:25:52.559 --> 00:25:59.599 Can you tell people what Color Lab is doing to attract younger callers and also give a little pitch with think about calling? 00:26:00.000 --> 00:26:01.279 So attracting younger callers. 00:26:01.359 --> 00:26:12.000 Well, Color Lab has a Collor Lab Foundation, which is a 501c3 nonprofit, which provides funds for a variety of activities to promote square dancing. 00:26:12.240 --> 00:26:16.880 One of the activities they do is to provide scholarships for callers that want to go to college school. 00:26:17.119 --> 00:26:29.359 So virtually any caller that wants to go to college school that would like to have financial assistance doing that is welcome to apply to the foundation and uh for a scholarship for the cost of the college school. 00:26:29.519 --> 00:26:31.359 So we really encourage that. 00:26:31.519 --> 00:26:37.200 We encourage callers or people who want to learn how to call to go to a college school, to understand the basics of that. 00:26:37.440 --> 00:26:39.680 Going to college school does not make you a caller. 00:26:39.920 --> 00:26:44.240 It's like going to college and getting a degree does not give you a job, right? 00:26:44.480 --> 00:26:46.000 It just means you got a degree. 00:26:46.160 --> 00:26:52.799 So you can go to a caller school and learn a lot about calling, but you become a caller when you actually get out there and start calling. 00:26:53.119 --> 00:26:57.200 So I'd like you to pitch people on thinking about becoming a caller. 00:26:57.519 --> 00:26:59.920 Well, I encourage everybody to think about that. 00:27:00.079 --> 00:27:07.359 Well, one of the things we do in my club is periodically, I will write some very easy material and then get some of the dancers to come up and call it. 00:27:07.519 --> 00:27:08.640 I'll write it out on a screen. 00:27:09.440 -->

00:27:16.160 So every at one point I had every person over a period of several weeks, every person called one tip, just a pattern part of a tip. 00:27:16.240 --> 00:27:20.960 And they all got to feel what it was like to be on this side of the microphone to watch the dancers. 00:27:21.039 --> 00:27:22.960 And a few of them caught the book and saying, This is kind of fun. 00:27:23.119 --> 00:27:23.920 I like this, you know. 00:27:24.079 --> 00:27:26.079 So we'll see if they take it on further on. 00:27:26.160 --> 00:27:38.799 But it's good for anybody to just get a shot about being on the other side of the microphone, have a caller write some very simple, easy material, stand by that person, and then help them deliver it so they know what it feels like to call. 00:27:38.960 --> 00:27:41.359 And somebody is gonna say, hey, this looks great. 00:27:41.440 --> 00:27:42.160 I'd like to do this. 00:27:42.400 --> 00:27:46.240 So, what would you say to a struggling club that doesn't know where to start? 00:27:46.400 --> 00:27:47.920 What do they need to do? 00:27:48.799 --> 00:27:49.599 There's a lot of things. 00:27:49.759 --> 00:27:50.960 It's funny you asked that. 00:27:51.119 --> 00:27:56.160 My brother lives in Washington State in Bellingham and is doing that very same thing with the club there. 00:27:56.240 --> 00:28:00.079 He talks to me a lot about what to do to revitalize their club. 00:28:00.799 --> 00:28:07.279 A lot of how it almost foldered the club, but they had to find a caller, they had to find a uh a venue, and they got that. 00:28:07.440 --> 00:28:19.279 And then we talked about structuring the classes and we talked about structuring the intro nights, so much so that I'm thinking about writing up actually a document about how to revitalize a club, thinking this is a plan, like a business plan. 00:28:19.839 --> 00:28:20.880 And I may put that together. 00:28:20.960 --> 00:28:27.599 But but the most important thing is that when your club wants to revitalize, you've got to be willing to think outside the box. 00:28:27.759 --> 00:28:30.960 You've got to think, okay, we're in this for fun. 00:28:31.119 --> 00:28:35.599 Okay, we've been doing it this way for a long time, and maybe this is not working so well right now. 00:28:35.680 --> 00:28:38.480 So, what can we change and still have a lot of fun doing it? 00:28:38.640 --> 00:28:40.240 And there's a lot of things you can do. 00:28:40.400 --> 00:28:44.720 And so is it important for everybody to learn a certain number of calls? 00:28:44.880 --> 00:28:46.400 Is that really critical to have fun? 00:28:46.640 --> 00:28:47.759 Re-evaluate that. 00:28:48.000 --> 00:28:52.880 For example, my club, after we came back from COVID, we reinvented ourselves as an SSD club. 00:28:53.039 --> 00:28:54.480 Prior to that, we were a plus club. 00:28:54.640 --> 00:28:57.440 So we said, no, we want to run frequent beginner classes all the time. 00:28:57.519 --> 00:28:58.720 So we're gonna stay SSD. 00:28:58.799 --> 00:29:02.319 And we did that, we still are, and we've grown, we've grown quite a bit from that. 00:29:02.640 --> 00:29:08.880 So you have to think, you have to have the right attitude to say, I want to grow and I'm willing to do what it takes. 00:29:09.119 --> 00:29:20.799 I want to, I'm willing to change something that's not working and change for something else and give it a shot for a while to see if we can try something different and be willing to go with that and have an open heart and an open attitude. 00:29:20.960 --> 00:29:26.880 And I'm gonna say open heart because when you have new dancers come in, you want to make sure you're friendly and loving. 00:29:27.039 --> 00:29:31.440 Don't, don't, don't, don't jump over them or anything, but just really welcome them with open arms, right? 00:29:31.599 --> 00:29:34.319 And then have a friendly atmosphere, a really friendly atmosphere. 00:29:34.400 --> 00:29:35.519 They want to be laughing. 00:29:35.680 --> 00:29:42.000 You want to be laughing all night long with everybody because all they're gonna remember when they go home isn't how to do an Alaman Left. 00:29:42.079 --> 00:29:43.440 It's gonna be, I had a great time. 00:29:43.519 --> 00:29:44.720 I was laughing, have so much fun. 00:29:44.799 --> 00:29:46.319 I haven't had this much fun in years. 00:29:46.480 --> 00:29:47.519 I got to come back to that. 00:29:47.680 --> 00:29:51.279 They'll come back next week and maybe they remember Alaman Left, maybe they don't. 00:29:51.359 --> 00:29:54.480 Um, but we'll go on from there and we've just got to keep laughing. 00:29:55.200 --> 00:30:02.400 I really appreciate you emphasizing that people are not going to pick up all the calls and do them perfectly. 00:30:02.559 --> 00:30:05.039 Because I see that expectation too. 00:30:05.279 --> 00:30:06.880 And I certainly didn't. 00:30:07.039 --> 00:30:15.119 I mean, I felt like it was three years before I felt like I got to the point where I was not breaking down the square regularly. 00:30:16.720 --> 00:30:20.880 And now I actually sometimes know how to fix a broken down square. 00:30:21.119 --> 00:30:23.119 But it it takes a while for some of us. 00:30:23.359 --> 00:30:24.559 We it has to click. 00:30:25.839 --> 00:30:29.039 You know, we can still incorporate. 00:30:29.680 --> 00:30:30.319 Are you having fun? 00:30:30.400 --> 00:30:30.799 That's important. 00:30:31.200 --> 00:30:31.839 Are you having fun? 00:30:31.920 --> 00:30:32.799 That's the most important thing. 00:30:33.039 --> 00:30:34.079 That's why I go back. 00:30:34.240 --> 00:30:39.039 I'm not a big smiler, but when I'm in dancing, I'm totally smiling all the time. 00:30:39.279 --> 00:30:45.039 And I'm an introvert, so I don't particularly fit in with some of the square dance culture, but I love it. 00:30:45.200 --> 00:30:45.599 I love it. 00:30:46.640 --> 00:30:48.079 So, some parting words. 00:30:48.240 --> 00:30:51.680 What would you want to tell clubs that they need to know?

00:30:51.759 --> 00:31:00.160 And the other thing I wanted to ask you is what I've tried to do throughout my career is tell people they need to get in leadership positions. 00:31:00.400 --> 00:31:03.680 I've been in local government and people get afraid of it. 00:31:03.759 --> 00:31:11.519 Like it's some sort of really difficult job that you have to have a lot of knowledge and you have to have a master's degree and all this other stuff to get into. 00:31:11.599 --> 00:31:18.400 And I say, no, you have to have a love of your community and want to address its problems and make it better for people to live. 00:31:18.720 --> 00:31:21.920 And I think that's also true of square dancing. 00:31:22.000 --> 00:31:26.960 You have to have a love of square dancing and you want to help it grow and make it more and more fun. 00:31:27.279 --> 00:31:28.240 Don't make it scary. 00:31:28.319 --> 00:31:29.519 Just make it make it fun. 00:31:29.680 --> 00:31:31.200 Don't make leadership scary. 00:31:31.359 --> 00:31:34.160 Don't put a lot of rules and regulations around leadership. 00:31:34.319 --> 00:31:37.119 We have a very, I would call it efficient trim board. 00:31:37.200 --> 00:31:38.319 We have five members on the board. 00:31:38.400 --> 00:31:38.799 That's it. 00:31:38.880 --> 00:31:42.319 You know, president, vice president, treasurer, and two members at large. 00:31:42.480 --> 00:31:43.039 And that's it. 00:31:43.119 --> 00:31:43.680 Nothing big. 00:31:43.759 --> 00:31:46.160 We don't have this long, complicated board. 00:31:46.559 --> 00:31:50.640 We meet infrequently, just as needed, almost as needed. 00:31:50.799 --> 00:31:59.680 People become afraid of saying, oh, I don't want to step into a leadership because I don't want to commit myself, or or I don't want to be tied down, or I don't know what I'm doing, or all those things. 00:32:00.000 --> 00:32:07.039 No, first of all, in square dance, if you step into leadership, people are just gonna clap their hands and say, Yay, great, because we need someone to do it. 00:32:07.119 --> 00:32:08.000 You know, that's the first thing. 00:32:08.079 --> 00:32:11.119 So you you really can't go wrong stepping into leadership. 00:32:11.279 --> 00:32:11.839 Do something. 00:32:12.079 --> 00:32:15.680 The second thing is like any good leader, you don't do it all yourself. 00:32:15.839 --> 00:32:16.559 You ask for help. 00:32:16.720 --> 00:32:17.599 Ask for help from everybody. 00:32:17.839 --> 00:32:20.960 Listen, I'll I'll be glad to do this function, but I can't do it along. 00:32:21.119 --> 00:32:22.640 Bob, Sue, Mary, can you help me? 00:32:22.720 --> 00:32:22.880 Right? 00:32:22.960 --> 00:32:23.359 That's it. 00:32:23.519 --> 00:32:28.720 Because you don't want to say I'm the one person in charge of membership, or I'm one person in charge of parties or whatever like that. 00:32:28.799 --> 00:32:30.480 You want to say just go out and get some help to do it. 00:32:30.559 --> 00:32:31.839 You're just coordinating it. 00:32:32.000 --> 00:32:37.759 So don't make leadership a big, uh, heavy, you know, something that's dreaded. 00:32:37.920 --> 00:32:45.039 Make it something that's gonna be easy and fun for everybody, just a coordination to everybody get involved because everybody really is a leader in their own way. 00:32:45.119 --> 00:32:46.000 We just draw it out of them. 00:32:46.079 --> 00:32:47.440 So we bring everybody together for that. 00:32:47.680 --> 00:32:52.640 So it's okay to be a leader, and it doesn't take much in the square dance world to do that. 00:32:52.880 --> 00:32:54.720 And the benefit is great. 00:32:55.200 --> 00:32:56.240 Yeah, for sure. 00:32:56.400 --> 00:32:58.160 Well, I really appreciate that. 00:32:58.319 --> 00:33:04.079 And thank you so much for bringing this topic up in square dancing, because I know people are struggling with it. 00:33:04.160 --> 00:33:16.960 And I was really surprised um in our uh and and this may be because people choose to answer our survey, but many people said they would be willing to get into a leadership position that aren't now. 00:33:17.599 --> 00:33:19.599 But they felt the need for training. 00:33:19.839 --> 00:33:27.839 So I'm hoping that you'll be one of my advisors as I work through this and give me some some feedback on doing this right. 00:33:28.319 --> 00:33:29.200 Keep doing what you're doing. 00:33:29.279 --> 00:33:29.680 This is great. 00:33:29.759 --> 00:33:31.440 I think we're on an uptick in score dancing. 00:33:31.519 --> 00:33:35.599 Keep looking forward, keep the optimism out there, and keep the smiling and keep laughing. 00:33:35.920 --> 00:33:36.240 Right. 00:33:36.480 --> 00:33:37.759 Well, thank you so much. 00:33:37.920 --> 00:33:39.119 I really appreciate it. 00:33:39.440 --> 00:33:39.920 Thank you.