บทถอดความฉบับเต็มของ EP 37: 4 Simple Ways to Pack Healthier Lunches Without the Guilt

00:04:23.759 --> 00:04:27.920 I would go call from the school phone to my mom and say, Hey, can you can you bring it down? 00:04:28.160 --> 00:04:31.519 That was the one way I learned my parents' phone number by heart. 00:04:32.079 --> 00:04:37.360 But I was so grateful she did that for me because the last thing I wanted to do was buy school lunch. 00:04:37.600 --> 00:04:42.800 And honestly, I can't tell you what it was that I did eat in my packed lunch. 00:04:42.959 --> 00:04:47.920 There's a couple of things I remember my mom packing, but most of all, it was the people I was with. 00:04:48.240 --> 00:04:52.480 Most of all, it was the fun that I got to have at lunch. 00:04:52.720 --> 00:04:58.000 And, you know, the point here is that I wasn't focused on the food. 00:04:58.480 --> 00:05:05.360 And the cool thing is that honestly, I mean, the highlight of the meal was really spending time with my friends and building those relationships. 00:05:05.519 --> 00:05:09.839 And actually, you guys, like, I think that's the thing we forget with our own kids. 00:05:10.079 --> 00:05:16.879 When you pack them this like really healthy lunch, that's probably the last thing on their mind. 00:05:17.439 --> 00:05:19.279 And that's okay. 00:05:19.600 --> 00:05:23.120 In fact, I'd kind of rather it almost be that way. 00:05:23.279 --> 00:05:28.399 I want for them, for school to be so much more important than the lunch. 00:05:29.360 --> 00:05:33.120 But for us as parents, it feels totally the opposite. 00:05:33.199 --> 00:05:35.839 Like this can feel so stressful. 00:05:36.319 --> 00:05:42.319 And I know that as a parent, when I was my turn, I really don't like to admit how much it bothered me. 00:05:42.399 --> 00:05:45.360 And that's where I kind of want to kind of take you next. 00:05:45.519 --> 00:05:58.639 You know, when my oldest son first started eating lunch at school, I remember he'd he'd come home and um I could tell that he'd had like a bite out of a granola bar or sandwich, but everything else was basically crumbs at the bottom of the lunchbox. 00:05:58.720 --> 00:06:04.000 And I remember asking about the food and and he wouldn't remember what he ate or didn't eat. 00:06:04.319 --> 00:06:06.879 He just didn't really have much to say about it. 00:06:07.120 --> 00:06:10.879 And I kind of like wanted to be like, that's fine, no big deal. 00:06:11.040 --> 00:06:20.319 But I also, if I was really honest, felt quite a bit of frustration over time because I'd spent a lot of energy, mental energy, right? 00:06:20.560 --> 00:06:29.439 Planning what he'd have versus what he wouldn't have, thinking through the options, comparing different foods and and really thinking about this in a creative way. 00:06:29.680 --> 00:06:34.399 And honestly, it started to get too like a place where it was also really expensive. 00:06:34.720 --> 00:06:50.160 And when our kids were like young and I was still in training, I really remember pricing out specifically like how much I would budget for school lunch, like snacks and food versus how much it would cost for him to buy food. 00:06:50.240 --> 00:06:55.199 There was just real financial strain for me in thinking about how to do this and how to do it healthy. 00:06:55.360 --> 00:06:58.399 And at the end of the day, I remember feeling pretty guilty. 00:06:58.639 --> 00:07:05.040 Guilty that I'd packed something he probably wouldn't end up eating, or guilty that he might end up being hungry. 00:07:05.279 --> 00:07:07.839 I'd feel frustrated at times that he didn't eat the food. 00:07:07.920 --> 00:07:13.600 And he told me that earlier in the day he really liked and was planning on eating it, and then it came home and it got wasted. 00:07:13.839 --> 00:07:19.600 I'd sometimes feel irritated about that because I wanted to get him something that was actually nutritious. 00:07:19.839 --> 00:07:24.959 And I even remember thinking, like, gosh, if it doesn't matter what I send him, then what am I even supposed to put in there? 00:07:25.040 --> 00:07:27.120 And should I be putting this much energy into it? 00:07:27.199 --> 00:07:29.040 I mean, what gives? 00:07:29.920 --> 00:07:39.680 And on top of that, like the added layer that I know some parents feel the stress for is that for my son specifically, he was on ADHD medicine even pretty young. 00:07:39.839 --> 00:07:45.600 Um, and in that particular scenario, it really did suppress his appetite throughout the day. 00:07:45.759 --> 00:07:59.120 And so I get worried that if he wasn't eating while he was on his medication, he would either feel the side effects from the medication more, or I get worried that, you know, being hungry would um not be noticed and he'd start acting out in other ways. 00:07:59.279 --> 00:08:06.079 I get worried that if he didn't eat enough, it would impact his attention and focus, or even worse, like his ability to learn. 00:08:06.399 --> 00:08:25.600 So I hear this concern because I also hear parents who get worried, like if they're not eating and they're on this medicine or they're not eating throughout the day, how do I know that the problems we're having in school, or how do I know that the challenges we're having with attention and focus aren't just hunger? 00:08:26.079 --> 00:08:29.600 And what do I give them to sustain energy throughout the day? 00:08:29.839 --> 00:08:54.799 And I understand because honestly, like I felt terrible that if somehow I was getting in the way of my kids' success because I wasn't packing them the right lunch, I had this like like ownership that it was all on me, or somehow I was gonna be a failure by not meeting those needs of my kid, especially because I was this pediatrician who was also a dietitian who should know better than X, Y, and Z, or than to send her kid to school with something he's not gonna eat. 00:08:55.039 --> 00:09:00.480 I just kind of like assumed that there were all these eyes on me, watching and judging. 00:09:00.799 --> 00:09:04.879 And honestly, it really

wasn't the case at all. 00:09:05.200 --> 00:09:11.360 And I just say that in true honesty because I know other parents feel that way. 00:09:11.919 --> 00:09:14.320 So let me speak to you straight from the heart. 00:09:14.559 --> 00:09:27.600 I see you and I totally get it, which is why the next part of what I want to say is so hard for me to kind of come to an awareness of. 00:09:27.679 --> 00:09:34.159 And honestly, it's hard for me to put this out here because it's my own admission, my own, um, my own worries, my own fears that I had. 00:09:34.240 --> 00:09:36.879 And if I had them, I know I'm not alone. 00:09:37.039 --> 00:09:38.559 And neither are you. 00:09:38.960 --> 00:09:45.120 One of the things that helped me through that little kind of caveat was actually just talking and being honest with his teacher. 00:09:45.360 --> 00:09:48.639 And frankly, like that communication was huge. 00:09:48.799 --> 00:09:52.240 It's not easy for me to speak up about the things that bother me. 00:09:52.320 --> 00:10:00.799 It's not easy for me to kind of like own my worries because I also felt this sort of added pressure that as a professional, I should know better. 00:10:00.960 --> 00:10:05.440 Or, you know, like, but really when it comes to our kids, we are mom and dad. 00:10:05.600 --> 00:10:05.919 Okay. 00:10:06.240 --> 00:10:11.679 Even if you have all of the degrees or all of the accolades, this is still how you feel about your kid. 00:10:11.759 --> 00:10:12.559 And you know what? 00:10:12.720 --> 00:10:18.159 Your teacher's kid probably cares a whole lot more than you might be giving them credit for. 00:10:18.320 --> 00:10:20.159 Like they really care. 00:10:20.480 --> 00:10:28.080 And so far, my 10 years of having kids in school and many years of having teachers and being a learner myself, and then also being a teacher. 00:10:28.240 --> 00:10:34.000 I say all that to say that honestly, I've only had a couple of teachers in my life that I didn't genuinely partner well with. 00:10:34.240 --> 00:10:38.320 But 99% of them have been amazing champions for my kids. 00:10:38.480 --> 00:10:50.799 And, you know, if you share that vulnerability with them, I bet you're gonna get in return a pretty cool person who really wants your kid to succeed and who's gonna help you with insight that you wouldn't have otherwise. 00:10:50.960 --> 00:10:52.639 So don't be afraid to open up. 00:10:52.879 --> 00:10:53.200 Okay. 00:10:54.080 --> 00:10:58.080 Now, back to the point here. 00:10:58.559 --> 00:11:04.720 I noticed that, you know, a lot of the time the school lunches would come back and there really wasn't a lot eaten. 00:11:04.960 --> 00:11:07.360 And I was peeved about this. 00:11:07.600 --> 00:11:17.600 So the thing is, is, is it it took me a long time to kind of reflect on this because I was taking it personally and I didn't want to admit that, right? 00:11:17.759 --> 00:11:28.720 Like, so I kind of swing the other pendulum of instead of being overly overthinking about his lunch, I then kind of went in the opposite direction and said, well, I just want him to have something. 00:11:28.799 --> 00:11:31.919 So I'm gonna get him whatever it is he'll actually eat. 00:11:32.320 --> 00:11:36.000 And then I went through a period of time where I was like, I can't even think about that. 00:11:36.159 --> 00:11:37.759 So just buy lunch. 00:11:38.080 --> 00:11:45.039 And then I, you know, kind of would even have him be involved in the process and think, well, if he picks it out, then he's gonna eat it. 00:11:45.279 --> 00:11:46.720 And you know what, guys? 00:11:47.039 --> 00:11:50.080 No, none of those things were like my savior. 00:11:50.399 --> 00:11:54.559 I had to realize that actually the issue was in here. 00:11:54.720 --> 00:12:02.320 I had to let go of this layer of supervision that I wasn't able to provide my son anymore. 00:12:03.360 --> 00:12:08.720 And a lot of us like start out really wanting to give our kids genuinely healthy food. 00:12:08.879 --> 00:12:11.440 And we work really hard at that. 00:12:11.840 --> 00:12:15.679 Maybe because you want to give them something that you didn't have growing up. 00:12:15.919 --> 00:12:19.679 And when it's not appreciated, it feels kind of discouraging. 00:12:20.000 --> 00:12:23.039 And you try not to take it personally, but sometimes it still happens. 00:12:23.200 --> 00:12:24.320 I mean, hello. 00:12:24.879 --> 00:12:34.240 And when your kid goes through that picky stage, you kind of learn that as a toddler, like you kind of have to let go of some of that control and they have to develop, you know, lots of practice over time. 00:12:34.559 --> 00:12:40.159 And then you enter school and it's a whole new level of having to let go. 00:12:40.399 --> 00:12:43.759 You've curated their meals for years, five years at that point. 00:12:43.840 --> 00:12:51.120 And suddenly, you know, they're being influenced by friends that they've met for two days, and all of a sudden, like your influence is totally out the window. 00:12:51.360 --> 00:12:55.039 And it feels like just so frustrating. 00:12:55.279 --> 00:13:06.159 But I just, you know, and I say that to say that like I didn't really mind that other people were sharing, you know, little Debbie snacks with my son that he hadn't had before, or Cheetos and other things that I really didn't want in his lunchbox. 00:13:06.320 --> 00:13:13.679 But I think the thing that bothered me was that I didn't feel like I had the influence that I thought I had. 00:13:14.799 --> 00:13:19.279 Up until that point, you know, you'd offer him option A or B, both of which were healthy options. 00:13:19.360 --> 00:13:21.279 And so I'd feel fine with whatever he picked. 00:13:21.360 --> 00:13:28.960 But once they're presented with options that are beyond what you would offer them, it can feel like everything you've modeled for years is just kind of vanished. 00:13:29.200 --> 00:13:35.279 And, you know, if you are there, let me just tell you, it does

matter. 00:13:35.440 --> 00:13:37.679 Your influence is not gone. 00:13:37.919 --> 00:13:40.080 It's not that it didn't have an effect. 00:13:40.320 --> 00:13:43.279 All those meals that you curated, they still count. 00:13:43.440 --> 00:13:43.759 Okay. 00:13:44.399 --> 00:13:46.399 You just don't see the effects quite yet. 00:13:46.480 --> 00:13:48.080 So hold on, okay? 00:13:48.320 --> 00:13:49.679 It's not lost. 00:13:50.000 --> 00:14:00.559 But the thing here is that our kids actually need experience and they need the chance to figure out what actually matters to them, what they like, what they don't like. 00:14:00.879 --> 00:14:12.399 They need the option to explore how feeding in a different environment that's loud and noisy and probably at a different time than what they were used to eating lunch at all plays into their day. 00:14:12.559 --> 00:14:14.879 They have to experience these things for themselves. 00:14:15.039 --> 00:14:15.360 Okay. 00:14:15.600 --> 00:14:23.919 And the other thing is to remember that flavor is really the primary driver for a lot longer. 00:14:24.080 --> 00:14:27.279 I mean, really, it's the primary thing that drives us to eat what we eat in the first place. 00:14:27.519 --> 00:14:35.759 But for kids, especially, the flavor component is such an important part of their food choices and their food preferences. 00:14:36.159 --> 00:14:48.720 And it's not until we get through a different layer of maturity, usually about middle school, where we learn to connect the value of certain foods for how it feels in our body. 00:14:48.879 --> 00:14:51.360 That connection takes a long time. 00:14:51.519 --> 00:15:08.159 Some kids are good right out the gate, but frankly, especially, you know, Cheetos and hot corn dogs and chocolate milk and tater tots, the hyper palatable foods, you know, that you maybe wouldn't always offer for lunch, those things are gonna taste really good and they're gonna wanna eat a lot of those things. 00:15:08.240 --> 00:15:09.679 They're gonna be driven to do that. 00:15:09.919 --> 00:15:13.440 And that doesn't mean that they just want to eat junk food for the rest of their life. 00:15:13.600 --> 00:15:13.919 Okay. 00:15:14.639 --> 00:15:19.039 So don't think about the future when those things happen. 00:15:19.279 --> 00:15:20.159 It's okay. 00:15:20.399 --> 00:15:20.799 All right. 00:15:20.960 --> 00:15:25.120 Like you know that eating your Brussels sprouts and your veggies is really good for you. 00:15:25.279 --> 00:15:29.679 And you know that like you want to have regular bowel movements, so you're gonna focus on fiber at times. 00:15:29.840 --> 00:15:33.200 You know that you want energy, so you'll think about caffeine in the morning. 00:15:33.360 --> 00:15:35.200 You've learned those things over time. 00:15:35.440 --> 00:15:37.679 Experience has taught you that, right? 00:15:38.159 --> 00:15:42.720 And what's what we learn, experience is like such a good teacher. 00:15:42.879 --> 00:15:52.399 But for

a kid to make the connection of I'm lactose intolerant, and therefore when I eat ice cream, I have diarrhea and I now I won't eat ice cream. 00:15:52.480 --> 00:16:00.720 Like those series of connections actually take a lot of practice and reinforcement for them to learn because ice cream tastes really good. 00:16:01.200 --> 00:16:11.440 And so my point here is that like being cued into what your body feels as a response to food and then making choices based on that is a long game. 00:16:11.679 --> 00:16:12.000 Okay. 00:16:12.159 --> 00:16:20.320 And when our kids are starting kindergarten or they're in those first years of school, that's really not what we should be expecting of them. 00:16:20.799 --> 00:16:30.080 Nor should we be alarmed when they really like things that are sweet and salty and crunchy and and have, you know, MSG or cheesy flavor. 00:16:30.159 --> 00:16:31.919 Like those are very normal things. 00:16:32.000 --> 00:16:33.120 You're a normal human. 00:16:33.360 --> 00:16:52.879 But the key here, and my number one point for today is that when you think about what your kid is eating, I want you to take a moment and just ask yourself, what are you worried that repercussion will be if blank doesn't happen or if they don't eat what you prepare them, what are you most worried about? 00:16:53.759 --> 00:17:04.240 If you're looking at your five-year-old and worrying about them as a 40-year-old, like I maybe did, you have permission to let that thought go. 00:17:04.880 --> 00:17:05.279 Right? 00:17:05.440 --> 00:17:06.880 Just let it go right out your head. 00:17:07.440 --> 00:17:13.839 My hope for you is that you can separate your kid's choices at lunch from your performance as a parent. 00:17:14.720 --> 00:17:17.279 Because those are not the same thing. 00:17:17.519 --> 00:17:18.160 All right. 00:17:18.640 --> 00:17:28.720 Part of the reason your kid might also want to eat those Cheetos at lunch is because sharing that exchange is actually part of the relationship building, not just wanting the Cheetos, right? 00:17:28.799 --> 00:17:36.559 Like I remember my son figuring out that if he brought something to trade with his friends for lunch, it helped him make friends. 00:17:36.799 --> 00:17:46.240 And so for a while, we bought Oreos and Chips Ahoy and things that previously we never would have purchased simply because he wanted to make new friends. 00:17:46.880 --> 00:17:49.680 And by the way, it worked. 00:17:50.640 --> 00:17:52.400 But that's not the point. 00:17:52.480 --> 00:17:56.160 It wasn't about the food, it was about the relationship that came with it. 00:17:56.319 --> 00:17:56.640 Right. 00:17:56.799 --> 00:18:03.759 Like at that point in time, they didn't have each other's cell phone numbers, they couldn't text, they didn't get to play video games together, be on each other's sports teams. 00:18:04.079 --> 00:18:05.359 They had that moment. 00:18:06.000 --> 00:18:10.640 And so I leaned in and it was really fun. 00:18:10.720 --> 00:18:13.519 And I have zero regrets about doing that. 00:18:14.160 --> 00:18:17.680 But it took me a while to recognize that that was the point. 00:18:18.319 --> 00:18:22.240 Now, this brings me to the ways that we can have dialogue with our kids. 00:18:22.319 --> 00:18:22.640 Okay. 00:18:22.880 --> 00:18:29.759 Like when it comes to school lunch and being with our friends at the table, I'm I'm no saint, okay, so hear me out. 00:18:29.920 --> 00:18:35.680 Um, but I've practiced a lot of different ways to talk with my kids about food and their day. 00:18:35.759 --> 00:18:39.359 And I'll tell you kind of my catchphrase in case you're new to this content. 00:18:39.519 --> 00:18:44.960 Um, let go of your expectation and focus on the invitation. 00:18:45.759 --> 00:18:46.079 Okay. 00:18:46.480 --> 00:18:48.240 And then your words will come. 00:18:48.480 --> 00:18:48.960 All right. 00:18:49.279 --> 00:19:05.599 So I think it's actually more important to think about the how of those conversations and that dialogue rather than exactly the right phrasing or the right words, because what comes out of you naturally is going to be authentic and they're going to feel that. 00:19:05.839 --> 00:19:08.640 It's why I spend so much time talking about all the feelings. 00:19:08.720 --> 00:19:20.160 And, you know, this whole podcast so far is all about our feelings because this is what is so essential when I see families that have major breakthroughs and how they sit down and how they how they rewrite their nutrition stories with their kids. 00:19:20.240 --> 00:19:31.200 It's because they slowed down enough to address how they feel about feeding their kids and they let go of those old stories as the first step. 00:19:32.000 --> 00:19:37.839 Because once you let that go, it's much easier to respond instead of react. 00:19:38.079 --> 00:19:44.079 It's the difference between tell me about your lunch and ooh, tell me about your lunch. 00:19:44.960 --> 00:19:51.759 The other key is just asking questions instead of telling them your impression. 00:19:53.200 --> 00:20:00.640 You can also use the phrase I noticed if you really need to get something across, but like I noticed there's a lot left over. 00:20:00.960 --> 00:20:02.079 Did you not feel very hungry? 00:20:02.240 --> 00:20:04.319 Like you can use the I noticed statements too. 00:20:04.400 --> 00:20:06.319 That's key for lots of parenting things. 00:20:06.480 --> 00:20:10.400 But the more that they have to do the thinking, the the better. 00:20:11.119 --> 00:20:12.480 Plus, the more you learn. 00:20:12.640 --> 00:20:20.640 For concrete options, if you really need that, I do like to start with closed-ended questions and then broaden it to open-ended questions, like who did you sit with at lunch today? 00:20:21.119 --> 00:20:23.519 Or what special did you have today? 00:20:24.079 --> 00:20:26.559 Or did you get enough time to eat at lunch? 00:20:27.599 --> 00:20:30.720 And then I move into the tell me about the

bus ride. 00:20:30.880 --> 00:20:33.440 And is there something that you want in your lunchbox tomorrow? 00:20:33.599 --> 00:20:39.279 But again, think about the how and your tone before you focus so much on the words. 00:20:39.440 --> 00:20:42.000 Because even if you get it wrong, it's okay. 00:20:42.160 --> 00:20:42.880 There's grace. 00:20:43.359 --> 00:20:44.960 You can apologize and move on. 00:20:45.119 --> 00:20:46.079 But it's from the heart. 00:20:46.160 --> 00:20:54.799 And when you ask and you have that dialogue based on what you want to know about them and your curiosity about their day, you actually get a lot more insight. 00:20:56.720 --> 00:21:03.039 Okay, now the best way I actually found to get incredible perspective came by accident. 00:21:03.200 --> 00:21:05.519 And it's actually my second point today. 00:21:05.759 --> 00:21:08.559 That is to visit them at lunch. 00:21:08.799 --> 00:21:10.480 You can be a guest, okay? 00:21:10.720 --> 00:21:13.839 So, like I didn't do this as an effort to be a spy. 00:21:14.000 --> 00:21:20.319 Like it totally happened by accident, but in reflection, I learned powerful lessons that I want to share with you. 00:21:20.559 --> 00:21:27.359 It wasn't until my oldest was in about first grade and he had full day, um, uh full day school, and I had a day off. 00:21:27.440 --> 00:21:29.519 So I went and I sat down with him. 00:21:29.599 --> 00:21:30.880 I had, we'd planned it, right? 00:21:30.960 --> 00:21:34.720 So you have to like sign in and go through the paperwork to go into school, all that kind of stuff. 00:21:34.960 --> 00:21:40.799 And he knew not to bring lunch because I was gonna be bringing McDonald's, which was like a super rare occasion. 00:21:41.359 --> 00:21:43.920 And I thought he was going to be so excited about that. 00:21:44.400 --> 00:21:49.680 But what he wanted more than the McDonald's was to tell me about his friends. 00:21:49.839 --> 00:21:51.200 He wanted to introduce me to them. 00:21:51.359 --> 00:21:59.039 He wanted to show me the little Lego guy in his pocket, and he wanted me to know what he had read that morning because he was learning to read and he was really proud of that. 00:21:59.359 --> 00:22:01.039 That was the highlight. 00:22:02.000 --> 00:22:13.279 And if I'd realized in that moment that 10 years down the road, what he'd remember was my presence and not the McDonald's, I would have been so blown away. 00:22:13.759 --> 00:22:17.440 Because at the time that's not what I thought I was going to be getting out of it. 00:22:17.599 --> 00:22:17.839 Right. 00:22:18.000 --> 00:22:20.480 Like it was really helpful to see that. 00:22:20.960 --> 00:22:27.119 The relationship your kids build at that table are probably more important than just the nutrition that's there. 00:22:27.359 --> 00:22:28.640 And that's a win. 00:22:28.799 --> 00:22:29.119 Okay. 00:22:29.440 --> 00:22:34.319 Now, when I went to go visit him at lunch, I learned a couple of really important things. 00:22:34.480 --> 00:22:45.440 Number one, I learned that it was definitely really early in the day and he probably wasn't very hungry because he had a really he's good at eating breakfast. 00:22:45.680 --> 00:22:46.880 That was helpful to know. 00:22:47.039 --> 00:22:56.319 I also learned that most of the kids that he was eating around were eating school lunch and throwing away probably 75% of what they were being served. 00:22:56.640 --> 00:23:02.400 I also noticed that he had made friends with some kids that I never would have pictured him with. 00:23:02.640 --> 00:23:04.880 And I was so delighted to see that. 00:23:05.039 --> 00:23:10.720 It gave me the opportunity to talk about what they liked about each other and what they were interested in doing. 00:23:10.880 --> 00:23:21.279 And it gave me opportunity to talk about something other than lunch because at that point I didn't realize this, but he and I shared no other commonality throughout the school day except for lunch. 00:23:21.440 --> 00:23:24.160 And to him that was the least important part of the day. 00:23:24.319 --> 00:23:32.240 So it gave me insight into so much more you know the names of his like lunch aids and the bus driver and the systems that he was going through. 00:23:32.319 --> 00:23:38.960 And by the way also for somebody who had you know ADHD and was really distracted, it was really noisy. 00:23:39.119 --> 00:23:43.920 Sometimes that's a very hard environment for little ones to stay focused enough to eat. 00:23:44.160 --> 00:23:50.559 So there's so many factors that I took away from that experience that I wouldn't have been able to realize had I not been there. 00:23:50.960 --> 00:23:52.319 So that's my second takeaway. 00:23:52.480 --> 00:24:01.599 And in the subsequent points I am going to come back to other things that I learned from visiting my son at school but this is a good time for a break. 00:24:01.839 --> 00:24:12.000 All right hey guys quick break here if you have been enjoying this content please do me a favor and leave a rating review because it helps the show reach more parents just like you. 00:24:12.240 --> 00:24:14.640 And if you have a question or comment, reach out to me. 00:24:14.720 --> 00:24:16.880 I'd genuinely love to hear if something has helped you. 00:24:16.960 --> 00:24:28.160 The whole purpose here is to help parents navigate some of the challenges with kids' nutrition from a big picture lens because we get so stuck in the weeds and we hold ourselves back in some pretty silly ways. 00:24:28.319 --> 00:24:32.480 It sometimes just takes a little bit of that perspective to get us back on solid ground. 00:24:32.720 --> 00:24:34.079 All right welcome back. 00:24:34.319 --> 00:24:41.599 So after we get our own baggage out of the way and we go visit them at lunch, what do we actually offer our kids? 00:24:41.839 --> 00:24:42.160 Okay. 00:24:42.640 --> 00:24:44.720 And I have two major takeaways here. 00:24:44.799 --> 00:24:47.599 They're kind of

intertwined but they're really valuable. 00:24:47.839 --> 00:24:56.880 So number one, the concept is simple, but it does take a little observation on your end in order to kind of personalize this for you. 00:24:57.119 --> 00:25:03.039 My third point is to simplify the process so that it's not all on you. 00:25:03.200 --> 00:25:06.559 And I'll tell you about the system that worked for us. 00:25:06.960 --> 00:25:08.400 I like systems. 00:25:08.880 --> 00:25:13.519 I'm not however Marie Kondo or someone who's super organized. 00:25:13.920 --> 00:25:21.920 For me the system that helped was to kind of start with this master list of options within all the main food groups. 00:25:22.079 --> 00:25:28.480 So I had, you know, a grain list, a protein list, a fruit, a veggie, a dairy and this was before AI. 00:25:28.559 --> 00:25:38.240 I'm sure it's much easier now to just make your own little list of all these options but I kind of wrote down a long list of different options within each of those food groups. 00:25:38.720 --> 00:25:44.640 And I would go through that list with my kids in advance of my shopping. 00:25:44.720 --> 00:25:50.640 I typically go shopping once a week if I have to go twice okay but like I really try to get it down to once a week. 00:25:50.720 --> 00:25:58.720 And so I'd have this sort of master grocery list and they would have had to kind of pick a couple of things that they were thinking they would want the week ahead. 00:25:58.880 --> 00:26:04.079 I know kind of hard to do but I did it stick with me. 00:26:04.400 --> 00:26:08.880 And I let them choose a couple of items in each category. 00:26:09.359 --> 00:26:18.960 And then when I came back from the grocery store I would sort of separate out those things into some bins. 00:26:19.119 --> 00:26:35.519 I'd gone to the dollar store and I got different colored bins for each food group and had my kids color pictures of grain, protein, dairy, fruit and veggie because at that point in time not all of my kids were able to read. 00:26:35.599 --> 00:26:39.279 And so we needed color coded things and we needed pictures. 00:26:39.839 --> 00:26:55.279 You can go a step further and actually print out pictures of combined things if you really like we, we, you know, like a sandwich or you know a certain if you had a thermos and you wanted to put like ravioli or other things in there that's sort of like a two in one like your grain and your protein together, right? 00:26:55.440 --> 00:26:56.640 Like you can kind of do that. 00:26:56.880 --> 00:27:02.400 But for me, it was really helpful to have these separated into separate bins. 00:27:02.640 --> 00:27:07.920 So I done all the thinking on the front end and then they picked what they wanted. 00:27:08.000 --> 00:27:11.920 I got home from the store they had to help me every time I go to the store still to this day they do this. 00:27:12.000 --> 00:27:15.200 They help me unload my groceries and so they learned where everything goes in the pantry. 00:27:15.359 --> 00:27:36.160 But we would separate those things out into the bins because before this I learned pretty quickly that if I did a big haul on a Sunday by the time Thursday rolls around there's like nothing left in the fridge or the pantry because the kids would somehow eat all of their school lunch stuff for snacks after school or for you know on the weekends or things like that. 00:27:36.240 --> 00:27:37.599 And so it would just disappear. 00:27:37.839 --> 00:27:42.799 And being on a tight budget that I was, I really needed to pre-portion stuff out. 00:27:43.039 --> 00:27:54.000 So I would actually take the things that were really and I did the do this for everything, but like for my cucumbers and my carrots or fruits or things like that, I would sort of cut them up on a Sunday and individually bag them in the fridge. 00:27:54.079 --> 00:27:57.680 So they were in the fridge had its own little drawer for veggies and our dairy. 00:27:57.839 --> 00:28:08.799 And then we had um you know some of the respective like your pretzels or popcorn or things like that would be sort of in their own bags in the lunch boxes depending on that food category. 00:28:09.119 --> 00:28:20.319 And so what was really nice is that when they'd wake up in the morning after we got into this rhythm, they would take their lunchbox and they knew that they had to get something from or I asked them to get something from each bin. 00:28:20.559 --> 00:28:28.640 And so their lunchbox had a fruit, a grain, a dairy, you know, had all the components and I know that sounds like a ton of work but hear me out. 00:28:28.720 --> 00:28:34.880 It actually was really easy because they they were involved in that whole process. 00:28:35.200 --> 00:28:42.400 And the cool part here is that it actually helped us learn like those buckets were for lunch only. 00:28:42.640 --> 00:28:47.279 So when they weren't out and available like they didn't get accessed. 00:28:47.359 --> 00:28:57.119 And so they made it through the whole week and it really helped me understand too that like they really were capable of making their lunch from an even very early age. 00:28:57.359 --> 00:29:02.079 And it took a lot of pressure off of me right like they got to pick what was there. 00:29:02.240 --> 00:29:06.480 They got to be involved in the process and if they didn't love it then that's okay. 00:29:06.640 --> 00:29:10.720 Like it still was at least provided right and it did a couple of awesome things. 00:29:10.960 --> 00:29:21.519 It helped them of course get autonomy in choosing some options and it also taught them that a lunch or a balanced meal actually had multiple components that go together. 00:29:21.839 --> 00:29:33.599 And that was really kind of not an intentional part of the process but it actually was a big takeaway and now like it's just so part of building their plate that they recognize oh yeah, this is what we do. 00:29:33.680 --> 00:29:46.559 This is what a meal looks like right and the

best part for me was that it meant I had done my job, which was to be responsible for providing the food and offering some structure. 00:29:46.799 --> 00:29:50.400 But that if they didn't eat it, it wasn't on me, right? 00:29:50.559 --> 00:29:52.160 Like it wasn't my fault. 00:29:52.400 --> 00:29:56.319 And taking that mental load off of me was such a relief. 00:29:56.480 --> 00:30:00.880 I knew okay, I did my part and then they get to do theirs. 00:30:01.039 --> 00:30:10.960 And it helped me feel like I could kind of focus on what my task was because there's sort of a saying that you know whatever jobs you do for your kids, you'll continue to do for them. 00:30:11.200 --> 00:30:15.680 And so you have to let them get that experience and that practice. 00:30:15.920 --> 00:30:28.240 And this sort of leads me to the other thing I learned while visiting my boys for lunch and that's really my fourth point today which is how much kids eat at lunch is wildly different. 00:30:28.480 --> 00:30:28.799 Okay. 00:30:29.440 --> 00:30:35.759 And what we serve our kids for school lunch may not actually be the serving size that's really right for them. 00:30:36.240 --> 00:30:46.640 And at that point in time like I I think I knew that sort of in my mind, but I I didn't really like see it in effect until I went to go visit him. 00:30:47.440 --> 00:30:48.400 Here's what I mean. 00:30:48.559 --> 00:31:02.960 When I noticed what other kids were eating what sort of serving sizes were in their lunchboxes versus mine, it was like this kind of impressive opportunity to recognize that like we are all so very different. 00:31:03.279 --> 00:31:22.880 And in the same way, like I don't say that to judge I just say that because like you know you you know that in your own head but like you only know your own experience right and as a pediatrician I spend a lot of time talking with my patients about the growth curve and I get to care for kids across that spectrum and even across like our our size spectrum. 00:31:22.960 --> 00:31:28.000 So like I have kids who are the second percentile and have always been that way. 00:31:28.240 --> 00:31:32.400 And I have kids who are the 95th percentile and have always been that way. 00:31:32.640 --> 00:31:36.240 And both of those kids can be perfectly healthy. 00:31:37.039 --> 00:31:50.559 It's it's really about understanding that that difference isn't necessarily problematic, but that difference means that our portions are going to start to vary a little bit more as we mature. 00:31:50.720 --> 00:31:57.759 And I like to highlight this not because there's one that's right and one that's wrong, but because we have different belly sizes and we need different amounts of food. 00:31:58.000 --> 00:32:23.599 And so when we're preparing our kids meal for lunch, it's really kind of our first time to learn what they eat in that span of time as their day is different and understand too like I recall another time I went to go visit a different kid at his

at his different school I think it's like second, third grade and um and it was I was keenly aware that like as I was sitting at the table there were some lunch boxes filled to the brim, some that didn't have a whole lot in there. 00:32:23.839 --> 00:32:30.799 And you know like it was just a good reminder that we all have different needs. 00:32:31.119 --> 00:32:38.480 And we also at that age start to eat for pleasure too right like I mentioned some of those hyperpalatable foods. 00:32:38.640 --> 00:32:49.599 Well sometimes our kids are going to eat all of those things because they taste really good not necessarily because we're listening to those hunger cues and listening to just what our bodies tell us. 00:32:49.839 --> 00:32:55.680 And the older a kid gets the harder it can become to listen to those signals if we're not really attuned to them. 00:32:56.160 --> 00:33:02.079 So when a kid comes home with like an empty lunchbox, it doesn't necessarily mean that you need to pack more. 00:33:02.240 --> 00:33:08.000 It might actually mean that either they dumped half of it in the trash or they ate everything because it just tasted really, really good. 00:33:08.640 --> 00:33:19.200 So for our little ones who are like four and under, I do like to think of kind of a serving size as being about the size of their palm per like food group. 00:33:19.359 --> 00:33:22.799 So you know like how much pretzels what could fit in their hand, right? 00:33:22.880 --> 00:33:24.880 Like in berries and like an ounce of meat. 00:33:25.039 --> 00:33:35.920 I'm going to get into a couple of the specifics here in just a second on some of those serving sizes but understand as kids get older, the spread of what one kid needs versus another kid needs are going to widen more and more. 00:33:36.319 --> 00:33:48.640 And the the hard part here too is that like and we'll talk about this next week as the as we talk about the um school lunches but the USDA portions are very calculated and very specific. 00:33:48.720 --> 00:34:00.079 So they have a very specific serving size that have to be given because they're meeting 98% of kids' needs you know at a certain time like they're they're matching certain metrics. 00:34:00.319 --> 00:34:02.319 But that might not be what's right for you. 00:34:02.720 --> 00:34:19.360 In fact, like here's an example if you think about a bag of chips or a bag of pirate's booty or things like that, servings of pudding or little Debbie snacks, processed lunch, that kind of stuff, those pre-packaged servings are honestly more than a lot of little kids needs. 00:34:19.679 --> 00:34:26.559 And because they taste so good, I would argue that it can actually displace some of the calories they need from the other food. 00:34:26.880 --> 00:34:33.119 So the trick here isn't that you don't offer foods that they like it's that you don't have to give them the whole bag. 00:34:33.760 --> 00:34:40.159 In fact like this awareness came to us after my husband and I got into a

really big fight a few years ago. 00:34:40.320 --> 00:34:43.920 And in this case he won, I'm sorry to say. 00:34:44.400 --> 00:34:46.639 But it wasn't because we were fighting about food. 00:34:46.719 --> 00:34:56.159 It was actually because he was so frustrated with the amount of plastic wrappers and garbage produced by having three kids in school all packing their lunch. 00:34:56.719 --> 00:35:01.280 So we decided to switch to family size packages for some things. 00:35:01.519 --> 00:35:20.639 And lo and behold when we prepped our food for the week we learned that our kids actually adjusted the amount that they needed and we helped them with that too but it meant not only less waste for us all, but I didn't feel so bad when we bought a big bag of chips because it actually lasted longer which ended up meaning less waste for us all. 00:35:20.960 --> 00:35:38.400 I do let my kids eat chips however okay but I found that if I give them the whole bag of chips some dried fruit a sandwich baby carrots that's like just too much for my little one right so like my seven year old would come home and everything would be left in lunchbox except for that bag of chips. 00:35:38.559 --> 00:35:47.440 And he may have eaten enough calories to get him through the day, but it wasn't necessarily in the proportion of other macronutrients that really gave him the best energy. 00:35:47.679 --> 00:35:57.440 So when we switched over to you know portioning out our own serving sizes it actually enabled him to not only get some of the chips he really enjoyed, but he ate other things. 00:35:57.679 --> 00:36:00.559 And that was a much better option for us all. 00:36:00.719 --> 00:36:09.760 I know wild but like this is just an example of how we provided some structure without having to be controlling. 00:36:10.320 --> 00:36:18.639 And that enabled us to practice what moderation can look like because you know kids really don't instinctively know how to do that at this age. 00:36:18.719 --> 00:36:21.119 They do need scaffolding with these skills. 00:36:21.360 --> 00:36:24.159 And this was just really important, right? 00:36:24.719 --> 00:36:59.599 And when we have these conversations with them, it's it's important to understand that teaching body awareness and interoception skills of understanding how we feel, what makes us feel satiated versus really full are conversations that take time and they take practice with so if our goal is to understand how what we eat makes us feel, I want you to know that for a lot of kids that really takes about till nearly 10 for a lot of kids to understand those kinds of cause and effect. 00:36:59.760 --> 00:37:06.880 And so being careful about the portions that we offer little kids is a pretty delicate area. 00:37:07.119 --> 00:37:15.440 And you do have to give a little bit more awareness to that because sometimes it's not always really dialed in. 00:37:15.679 --> 00:37:20.559 And this is kind of tricky because I think the word hunger can mean a

lot of different things to little kids. 00:37:20.800 --> 00:37:31.119 And so I think there's so much nuance in in where I'm heading with this but hear me when I say that the portion size is something that you can experiment with. 00:37:31.599 --> 00:37:35.039 I am not advocating that we let our kids be hungry at lunchtime. 00:37:35.199 --> 00:37:49.519 I'm simply offering that what we get in the store with our portion sizes and our serving sizes may not be really attuned to your child and you can with freedom adjust that. 00:37:49.840 --> 00:37:50.159 Right. 00:37:50.480 --> 00:37:58.960 And so understand that like it may also be helpful to think about using words other than hunger. 00:37:59.360 --> 00:38:11.519 Sometimes kids say I'm hungry from very early on and realize that they can get attention when they ask for food or they can say I'm hungry and that gets them a cookie that they wouldn't ordinarily get or something different. 00:38:11.679 --> 00:38:13.599 And I and they're really smart. 00:38:13.679 --> 00:38:14.639 They're really creative. 00:38:14.800 --> 00:38:15.840 And that's not a bad thing. 00:38:15.920 --> 00:38:20.400 It's just it's okay to sort of adjust what you're noticing. 00:38:20.559 --> 00:38:27.599 In fact, you know, I don't know if you're aware of this or not but like restaurants and cafeterias actually do something very objective to understand this really well. 00:38:27.760 --> 00:38:30.320 And it's called plate waste analysis. 00:38:30.480 --> 00:38:43.199 They actually measure how much gets thrown away and how much um and they do this by adjusting serving sizes, portions and they and they use that to help forecast their menus because they don't want to pay for food that they're going to throw away right like they need to be able to make a profit somehow. 00:38:43.360 --> 00:38:46.559 And so if they're throwing it all away, then that doesn't get them where they need to go. 00:38:46.719 --> 00:38:59.679 And so you have the same opportunity every single time your kid's lunchbox comes home instead of like just asking them about why they didn't eat something you can simply look at it and like think about what they needed, right? 00:38:59.840 --> 00:39:11.599 So like if your lunchbox keeps coming back barely touched, try on the next meal packing the same variety but with half of the serving sizes on each of those things and just see what happens. 00:39:11.840 --> 00:39:14.400 And if that hurts your heart to do that, then that's okay. 00:39:14.480 --> 00:39:21.760 You can consider putting the other half of the lunch in their backpack for the bus ride home or for you know, you know, if they get really hungry they can get to it. 00:39:21.920 --> 00:39:26.159 So they have access to it, but it's not necessarily in the actual lunch box itself. 00:39:26.320 --> 00:39:30.960 Sometimes it can put a lot of pressure on a kid to just be served a portion that's way more than what they need. 00:39:31.519 --> 00:39:44.000 All right so for

a couple of concrete things just for those of you who have stuck around you might be surprised to hear this but actually a half of a sandwich or even a quarter of a sandwich maybe all your little one really needs for that part of it. 00:39:44.159 --> 00:39:49.519 And then you know a handful of popcorn their handful size of popcorn might be enough. 00:39:50.239 --> 00:39:57.599 You might want to do some pretzels but you might think about just maybe what's on the serving size like half of that or even a third of that. 00:39:57.840 --> 00:40:08.079 When it comes to um muffins I typically recommend doing mini muffins in lunch boxes for little ones as opposed to a big regular muffin if you happen to do breakfast for lunch. 00:40:08.400 --> 00:40:21.199 You might think about just like an ounce of meat turkey or if you have um some salami or some types of lunches lunch meat that you like to serve a single egg is plenty if you do hard boiled eggs. 00:40:21.360 --> 00:40:27.840 A tablespoon or two of peanut butter so the protein balls that I have alluded to a couple times on my Instagram page are also pretty small. 00:40:27.920 --> 00:40:32.079 And so they're about a tablespoon and a half in terms of like their actual serving size. 00:40:32.320 --> 00:40:38.639 Half of an apple right a small clementine about seven to ten grapes is probably enough. 00:40:38.800 --> 00:40:47.440 It doesn't take a lot for our little ones and you might just give that a shot and see how it goes before you send a whole lot extra there. 00:40:47.760 --> 00:40:52.159 Now as we wrap up I just want to say thank you again for listening all the way to the end. 00:40:52.320 --> 00:41:02.719 And you know if your kid's a packer and you really want to support them in eating healthy and helping build that kind of lifelong healthy eater then please don't take their behavior personally. 00:41:02.880 --> 00:41:07.840 It's not a reflection on your parenting and it doesn't mean they'll eat junk food for the rest of their life, right? 00:41:08.000 --> 00:41:17.599 They are getting the chance to experience new things, eat with friends and there's so many factors influencing what they eat that has nothing to do with you. 00:41:18.000 --> 00:41:19.519 So look at the big picture. 00:41:19.760 --> 00:41:27.039 Make a system that offers structure so that you don't have to do all of the thinking and offers them age appropriate autonomy. 00:41:27.199 --> 00:41:33.840 And if you get a chance go be a fly in the wall at one of their school lunches or be a guest and go and meet them for lunch. 00:41:34.000 --> 00:41:36.320 It is genuinely so informative. 00:41:36.960 --> 00:41:42.880 And don't be afraid to play around with the portion sizes because you might be offering way more than they actually need. 00:41:42.960 --> 00:41:45.280 And that feedback is actually a gift. 00:41:45.440 --> 00:41:47.360 Okay now thank you again. 00:41:47.519 --> 00:41:50.639 I'd love to hear what's working for you in the lunchbox department. 00:41:50.800 --> 00:41:54.639 So send me a note just like a little lunchbox note from you to me. 00:41:54.800 --> 00:41:56.320 I'd love to know what's going well. 00:41:56.480 --> 00:41:58.639 And if something's been challenging reach out. 00:41:58.800 --> 00:42:00.239 I'm excited to hear from you. 00:42:00.400 --> 00:42:06.480 So I hope you join me next week as we talk about school based lunches and all the fun that comes with that territory. 00:42:06.639 --> 00:42:08.960 Thanks so much guys I'll see you next week