บทถอดความฉบับเต็มของ REPLAY: Checking In w Tamron Hall

the area. My major was criminal justice. I'm just going to say criminal law, criminal justice. So tell us that journey. 00:03:40 Speaker 2: Okay, Well, for this all makes sense then because this listen. 00:03:43 Speaker 3: Jordan Manning is a character inspired by my years as a reporter in Chicago. Watch Where They Hide, which is my new novel as well as the first as The Wicked. Watch all set in Chicago, in and around the Chicago area and over the pandemic. I, like so many people, trying to figure out what you want next. Right, life came into a different perspective and I always wanted to write a novel. I grew up reading Nancy drew in crime novels and also being a crime reporter. I showed Deadline Crime. I went for six seasons. Someone they knew a stow that I recently did. So I've always been quite fascinated, of course, as a journalist, But the deeper part of crime that I wanted to reveal with Jordan Manning was what is it like to cover those stories. We know the stories, but from a reporter's standpoint. The first book was inspired by a case out of Chicago, Ryan Harris, this little girl who was killed on the South Side of Chicago. And I remember that night, Michelle going home after standing just a few yards from where she was found and just sobbing and being so just torn up inside. You know, here I am on TV. I'm supposed to present myself as this reporter with your microphone and the crime tape is behind you, and then I'm supposed to go home and forget that this little girl wasn't going to go home to her mother. You would never celebrate a prom, she would never be able to get married or go to college, any of the dreams that you and I have been able to pursue. And so with Jordan Manning, I wanted to show through my experience and also what I've witnessed what is it like to be a crime reporter? But also what is it like to be a woman climbing the ladder where people believe you're putting work before love. And she's got this great friend circle. So it's a little bit of sex in the city. It's a little bit of you know, life that I live. But also I wanted it to be a juicy thriller that you know, whether you're on vacation or you know, you just need some time to relax and you don't want to be on social media and you want to read something good. It's got escapism, but it's also got heart, like what is what is fueling Jordan Manning? And I have to tell you as I'm sitting here talking to you people, we've been able to option it and we're looking at turning it into a series. And now that I know you have criminal justice background, you need to be Jordan Manning because you are like your faith everything. If somebody I'm going to put it out here in the universe, we're casting Michelle as Jordan Manning in the series because you would be perfect. She gotaged, She's got a background in forensics and decided to pursue this journalism career, and now she's using what she learned in her studies with what she's learned in real time as a journalist to solve the stories that she's supposed to be covering. But now she's turned investigator to find out in the end why this crime happened and who did it. 00:06:32 Speaker 1: Wow, okay, y'all, I'm so excited a major new criminal justice forensics is what I wanted to go to to be a forensic psychologist because I like to get into the mind and pull the layer. Yeah, try to get to the root of behaviors and responses and all of that, which I've used that skill in relationships. So ladies, gentlemen, if you need me to find out anything, call me child, I'll get to the root of it all. 00:06:59 Speaker 3: One. 00:07:00 Speaker 2: It is Jordan Manning. You heard it here. 00:07:03 Speaker 1: I am so excited. But I'm so glad that you were talking about how it kind of almost well, it doesn't totally mirror or parallel your entire life. But that is so good because you can take the route as well of you can know, you can do the biography, the autobiography. But then but the word escapism is so huge of what I've learned to me and an author like people like your real life stories, but they also like the escapism part. I can be in the airport. I'm going to have this book because I'm going to go to the beach and I'm going to read this book. We are so excited, excited. 00:07:41 Speaker 2: That's what I wanted. 00:07:42 Speaker 3: I want to you know, like I said, I use some of the inspiration of For example, you know, in this book The Newest One Watcher They Hide, Jordan is approached by the sister of a woman who is missing, and the sister is begging for media attention and begging Jordan to help her find out what happened to her sister. I've been very open about the death of my own sister and an unsolved crime, so it does touch a little bit on my real life. But with Jordan, I am able to create a world and a character who can do things I never could. I mean, there's scenes where Jordan, the crime, the disappearance happens in Indiana, and there's Jordan getting in her car, driving to Indiana to get to the business to find out and then driving back to try to make it to a date with a guy that's been interested in her for a while, but believes that all she thinks about is work and that her whole focus is work. 00:08:37 Speaker 2: So you see this. 00:08:39 Speaker 3: Character inspired by me but experiencing I think something very relatable in many ways that all of us are going to solve crime, Like Michelle can whip out her little Sherlock Holme a magnifying glass. 00:08:52 Speaker 2: I will, I sure will. 00:08:54 Speaker 3: But we I think many of us understand that work life imbalance, because I don't call it balance. There's no such thing, you know, the work life imbalance, the struggle to find identity. She's in her thirties and it's like, what is this all for? What do I really want to do? So while she is solving these crimes, we see this richly layered character that really is a combination of many people that I've experienced and things that I've seen. So it's juicy and it's you

know, it's betrayal, it's infidelity, it's all those things that going to have you like look inside eye at your next date. 00:09:27 Speaker 2: But it's good. It's good stuff. 00:09:29 Speaker 1: Listen not only side I at your next date. But Tameron, have you ever had people maybe do the page turner? You know, with your book and they're wondering, Okay, now is this. 00:09:39 Speaker 2: Real life you? Oh? Yeah, of course, of course, you know. 00:09:42 Speaker 3: I have to tell you in fact, when I wrote the first one, I was in bed with my husband and night and I'm writing and I burst out. He was actually fall asleep and I'm writing and I started laughing, and. 00:09:53 Speaker 2: He's like, what are you laughing about it? 00:09:54 Speaker 3: I said, oh, I'm writing this scene with Jordan and she's on this day and. 00:09:59 Speaker 2: He is writing about your exes. I was like, I was like, well what, I'm like. 00:10:07 Speaker 1: No, honey, I'm writing about how you make me laugh. Jordan's she just needs someone in her life like you to make her laugh. Right. 00:10:17 Speaker 3: People have tried to figure out some of the names are similar, uh, And I've already started, you know, writing the third book, and there's a character named Nelson, and some people have you know, made some speculations about that. 00:10:28 Speaker 2: But we are like, you know, there's there's a lot. 00:10:30 Speaker 3: Of fun in creating as you know, characters and creating a world and touching on things with Jordan's. You know, I tell people covering crime for all those years, I didn't realize the level of and I don't use this loosely this level of PTSD that I experienced because you know, when I was pregnant. Even I remember sitting and writing and reading this crime that I was covering, and the woman had been murdered and she was pregnant, and I was like, oh my god, I can't do this for a living. 00:10:58 Speaker 2: This is not what I can do. 00:11:00 Speaker 3: And when I was creating Jordan, I was able to really face some of those things as a crime journalist or a you know, true crime reporter that people don't know exists in that world. And so it was it was cathartic. It was a relief, but it was also and I used this word very carefully. 00:11:22 Speaker 2: Because it is about crime, but it was it was exhilarating. 00:11:25 Speaker 3: I'm over fifty, I'm fifty three years old, and to be able to step out and do something new that you don't think you can do. That also became a bit of the story. Right It's like, i have this book, and now I have this series, and even though I've got the talk show and things that I've worked on in the past, as you said, people approached people and wanting a memoir. They wanted a beauty book, and that's not where my head was at that time. I really wanted to take on this new challenge and say, you know, can I do it? 00:11:55 Speaker 2: Let me do it. And I talk about. 00:11:57 Speaker 3: That because I want the tanfam, whomever it is, to always feel inspiration to step out there, do things that no one's expecting, things that might make you feel uncomfortable. 00:12:08 Speaker 1: Even wow, because I definitely was gonna ask if you had advice for aspiring writers, but you just you just gave it to us, like try. 00:12:16 Speaker 2: Something new to try, except we would. 00:12:19 Speaker 1: Still love a memoir, We would still love the beauty book and how like. And then this has nothing to do with the book, but as far as the beauty book is concerned, you have literally coined for especially for journalists and women of color. Now I get to say it, she don't, but everybody got the Tamil haircut. That is a black journalist, and that's great. 00:12:43 Speaker 2: So we definitely want to, you know. 00:12:45 Speaker 1: And then it's like, okay, wait a minute, has she ever thought can she go along? But there's like no, that's part of her brand, you know, and I do. 00:12:53 Speaker 2: I wanted to like because you know, it's so funny. 00:12:55 Speaker 3: Even now I'm working on a little bit of a memoir that you know was down the line, but I talk about when I first cut my hair, so crazy, Michelle. I was in Chicago and Johnny Wright, who you know, my hair solace since he was eighteen. Johnny and I met Chicago and I cut my hair. And when I was in Chicago, people everyone's like, oh, the hair is so fly. I want the haircut, I want the haircut. I came to National News and I remember being an MSNBC in the beginning of my career, and people started, this was right. 00:13:21 Speaker 2: They were like, why do you have short hair? And you know, is she this? Is she that looking? 00:13:28 Speaker 3: And I remember reading someone saying women with short hair are lazy because that's a lazy haircut. 00:13:33 Speaker 2: Oh no, I read it all and I. 00:13:35 Speaker 3: A pretty confident person, and so imagine the stark contrast. I leave Chicago where people are like, can I get the Tammer Hall haircut? And beating down Johnny Store, to the National press and some of the people in national articles questioning, you know, short hair aesthetic, and I started to grow my hair out. I'm not kidding, and I was so insecure and I started to cry. And then one day I looked on air and I had a full mushroom and I was like, oh no, no, no, no, We're not going out like that. And I called Johnny he was with Michelle Obama at the time, because the only time we've never had a break was when he was worth the first lady. 00:14:04 Speaker 2: I called Johnny. 00:14:04 Speaker 3: I was like, if you don't get on that to sell a train and get here and cut my hair right now, because I cannot go out like that. 00:14:10 Speaker 2: But you go through those moments. 00:14:11 Speaker 3: But yeah, it's crazy, and that's part of what I'll talk about in my memoir one day, is that that betting on yourself and not letting people rock your boat, you know, finding for who you are. 00:14:26 Speaker 1: The Tameron Hall Show has been renewed, you know, and then

you're an author, wife and mom. People ask all the time, where are you finding the time? And to seemingly do things so seamlessly and with excellence, nothing seems to miss. 00:14:44 Speaker 2: A oh's done so great? You know what it is? 00:14:48 Speaker 3: It's first of all, for me, I'm a virgo, so anybody knowver, I'm like, I overthink everything, all right. 00:14:59 Speaker 2: My poor phone is like littered with notes. I'm always taking notes. 00:15:02 Speaker 3: I try my best, like keep it with the wardrobe, whether it's my personal wardrobe or here on the set. I tell people that the whole week of wardrobe is picked out in advance, because that's one less thing I have to think about. And I learned that from my dad, who was in the military. He was like, pick it out, but Biggie, say, I'm Gucci down to the socks. I pick out everything down to the sphinx, and I'm all laid out for that week. I don't I could have a white suit picked out and it could rain mud, and I'm not changing that suit because that's one less thing I have to think about. Think about how many times you're getting ready to go somewhere and you're like, oh, that shirt's dirty, and wait a minut, where does that shoot? And before you know it, it's taking your time, taking your mind, and now you're late. You arrived frazzle and you're not present. So the decisions that I can make in advance, I do. I PI line out my son's lunch. The whole week of lunch is all in advance. Is breakfast all. We write it all down. And some might think that that's a very strident way to live, but it allows for me to be creative. It allows for me to be prepared for the unknown variable. I tell my husband all the time. We were on vacation recently and he was all going doing his mind about something, and I said, you better enjoy this moment because listen, as my friend Bevy Smith says, life be life, and it's gonna come. You don't have to look for it. The unknown variable that's going to screw up your whole time is coming. We were the Huntel. We were in Italy once and his great vacation. We're on the plane and oh my gosh, you're all in our fields and we land and I'll never forget the phones started buzzing as soon as I landed our house to flood it, and I'm like, what But had I not taken that respite, and had I not, you know, said I need to decompress, and I would have been on ten, landed and gone to one hundred and been crying. But I was just kind of in this relaxed state because I had taken a moment to appreciate that time with him, that time with my son, that the rewards of the hard work right being able to be in Italy. So when I landed don't get me wrong, is highly upset, but I'd taken that breathing moment because that unknown variable of that challenge in our home it was waiting for me. I didn't know it, but it was waiting for me. You so him to take care of yourself when you can, and that allows me to find room to create like I did you know the book or be present with my child who was looking to me as his guide. 00:17:24 Speaker 2: I am his life. I'm his guide, and I want to be the best guide I can be. 00:17:28 Speaker 1: Well you are, y'all. The son that she speaks so beautifully about is his name is Moses four years old? Now is he four years. 00:17:37 Speaker 3: Or he'll be five in April? And he is oh a whole vibe. He's a Taurus and he is I live with a baby bull. But he's very, very fun. 00:17:49 Speaker 2: You know. I never imagine being a parent. 00:17:51 Speaker 3: I remember when I'm on the cover of People magazine it's like Tammernhall forty eight year old miracle baby, and I was like, wait, first of all, I'm forty eight, how'd that happen? And then a mere I didn't because when you're in the throes of it, you don't fully understand or you're not conscious. I think of the enormity of it. And then I started hearing from other women who had gone through IVF struggles, and some were able to conceive and others were not. But they thank me for being open about this late in life journey that I'm now on. But no, he's a whole firecracker. He's a he's a comedy. 00:18:24 Speaker 2: I don't know what he is. Somebody said, what do you think. 00:18:26 Speaker 3: I think it's gonna be comedian because all he wants to do is be silly and make people laugh. 00:18:31 Speaker 2: He's so sweet. 00:18:32 Speaker 1: Oh well, he's gonna have to make his first stand up comedy appearance on your show. 00:18:38 Speaker 2: You Know. 00:18:40 Speaker 1: You have been so open about things personally, even talking about your iv OF journey. I'll be forty five this year. I have yet to have children, and it's been in the back of my mind because you can be so career oriented, or then when you are then being in a relationship, I'm like, wait a minute, do I want this? And then us, you know, producing this show that you are my guests on you Know, and you sharing you gave birth at the age of forty eight, but you're like, I even know I don't feel forty eight. I don't feel fifty three, you know. And it's like, what do people like to. 00:19:18 Speaker 2: Be fifty three? 00:19:20 Speaker 1: Yeah, you're more like twenty three energy wise, and just let me not say energy wise. Well, yes, energy wise because in order to move with the capacity, in order to move at the capacity in which you do, you've got to feel young. But for people to maybe feel like they're discouraged to get married or have children, I feel like when you get older, you feel better. 00:19:47 Speaker 2: I do, I do, you know. 00:19:49 Speaker 3: Listen, there are two versions of this, right, of course, there are versions of that. I will be very very honest with you in a way that I have not been honest with anybody. There are times where I say, damn, you know, was I supposed to be at twenty seven and twenty five? 00:20:04 Speaker 2: You know? 00:20:04 Speaker 3: And I wasn't trying at twenty five or twenty seven. It wasn't even in front of mine. I was dating, I had a couple of boyfriends probably you know, and a lot of

things going on, but I didn't. And then when I tried in my thirties, ran into complications. 00:20:18 Speaker 2: I was in a serious relationship and ran into some complications. And then that relationship ended in that the thought of it ended in my mind. 00:20:25 Speaker 3: I wasn't a person who would say like I was like, oh gosh, I have to have a kid. I knew I wanted. I probably, if I'm being honest as well, I probably assumed that it was just a part of my life. I assumed that I was going to get married one day and have a kid. It wasn't I've never I never looked in wedding books saying that's going to be my wedding. I wasn't that type, right, I wasn't. No, just same, Yeah, I wasn't that type. I knew I wanted to have someone special because I as no joke. 00:20:52 Speaker 2: Because I'm a talker and I talk a lot. 00:20:53 Speaker 3: I didn't want to be I didn't want to start the story over with a new man every day. I wanted the man in the house that was there and I was like, oh, yeah, what you said yesterday, So I wouldn't have to go like, you know, Suirley, the one. 00:21:04 Speaker 2: I told you about at work and then the way. No. 00:21:06 Speaker 3: I wanted somebody who was consistent in my life. And I knew that whether it was with a marriage or us just living together, that wasn't front of mine, but I knew I wanted that consistency, and through dating it didn't happen. And I remember around thirty five ish, I started to feel a little panic and I was like, oh God, I don't want to be in another failed relationship, right. I didn't want that to have to tell my friends, Oh God, broken up with this and then let's start over. 00:21:33 Speaker 2: Yeah, And I just I went to that thirty five year old angst of it. And then in my forties, I was like, you know, whatever it is, it is and I'm still dating. 00:21:41 Speaker 3: And I met my husband through just a weird circumstance and it was at the right time for me in the right time for him, but I didn't have a plan. And then when the idea of having a child, we talked about it on our first date. 00:21:54 Speaker 2: He didn't have kids either. I never had kids. I was like, oh, you know, let's see what happens. And it worked out for me. 00:22:00 Speaker 3: But there's a version of it now that I'm older that I thank god, I'm more settled. 00:22:05 Speaker 2: I'm less frazzled by things. I think. 00:22:08 Speaker 3: You know, there's a Bonnie Right song scared to run out of time, so that's a part of it a little bit, you know, because now you're you're older, and it cuts up. 00:22:15 Speaker 2: You know. 00:22:16 Speaker 3: I was scared to run in time and I'll be able to have him, and now I'm scared to run out of time that i won't have enough time with him. 00:22:21 Speaker 2: Right. 00:22:21 Speaker 3: So it's always going to be these things, you know, But you're going to always have the. 00:22:25 Speaker 1: You'll be day three, honey with that haircut, and you'll maybe you. 00:22:30 Speaker 3: Know, But I just tell people, you know, there's no as you know, there's no perfect plan. 00:22:35 Speaker 2: You you kind of get in there and you live life. 00:22:37 Speaker 3: And I want to, as a woman, as a black woman, live my life in a way that my grandmother, who died in her forties didn't have a chance to do, and just ride it to the wheels fall off and in the process, if you're lucky enough, you can be an inspiration to other people. 00:22:57 Speaker 2: And I'm lucky enough to do that. 00:22:59 Speaker 3: But I just, you know, I'm just living like you Like you know, I tell somebody the last day I breathe on this planet, I want people on my gravestone to know one thing I wanted to say, she rooted for me, because that's the journey. 00:23:11 Speaker 2: I want to people to know. 00:23:12 Speaker 3: She rooted for me, that I'm rooting for you and in return, such great things have come my way. 00:23:18 Speaker 1: Absolutely, my show Checking In is the foundation has been about mental health and in your impeccable career of being a journalist and then having to walk onto like you said, you know the story about Ryan Harris, how you walked on the scene where she was found and then an advocate for domestic violence and your own unfortunate I saw a clip of you and Kenya Moore and you were sharing how someone pretty much took you, you know what I mean. And so with the foundation of Checking In being about mental health, how have you been taking care of yourself? And I know you mentioned the word PTSD earlier on in the interview, not necessarily correlating with it's so interesting, you know, but how have you been able to continue to flourish in your career with so much Well? 00:24:21 Speaker 3: For me, you know, I practiced transcendental meditation. I meditate twice a day and it helps me refocus, you know. I try to go to church every Sunday. I just built the little Sunday School at my church because we didn't have a kid's room. And I grew up in a culture where the kids and so I honestly never noticed we didn't have a kids. There was a small church that I go to the city, and now that I have my son, I was leaving and I was like, but he's like, Mommy, where are you going? As I'm going to church, but you got to stay home because of course I'm not trying to chase him through the pews. 00:24:51 Speaker 2: And I said, no, I'm going to do this. 00:24:53 Speaker 3: So we, together with my church, built this little Sunday school room and the kids are in there and they're playing just like when I was, and I'm able to go in and worship. 00:25:03 Speaker 2: And for me, you know, when I open my eyes, I pray. 00:25:06 Speaker 3: I pray before I walk out the door of that show, I say, God, you know, guide my words and let my words be an inspiration to people. 00:25:13 Speaker 2: Let me be purposeful in my words. 00:25:16 Speaker 3: And when I don't have the words, give me the words and what And I say that even before a cooking show, because everything has an impact. So it's

between meditating. As I said, the minute I wake up, I lay in that bed. I'm probably supposed to get on my knees, but I'm too lazy sometimes and I lay in that bed at four forty. 00:25:33 Speaker 2: Five or whatever it is, and I ask God to really. 00:25:36 Speaker 3: Watch over me, because I know that my mom was a nineteen year old single mom who came home with a baby, uncertain of what, you know, the next day was going to be like. And she really provided a great foundation for me. And so I'm I tell my audience all the time before we end the show and the commercial pregass, I hope I make you proud. And when I say those words, I think of every person that I've ever encountered, from the woman in Chicago at the food court at the water Tower my first time I went on air and she said, you got new black girl on a WFLD, and I said, yes, girl were watching you, you know, and I never will know her name. I don't know where she is, but that energy of girl were watching you as I'm in the food. 00:26:18 Speaker 2: Court by big o'dpile of Chinese food. 00:26:20 Speaker 3: You know, It's like those moments that allow me to take care of myself mentally and put it all in perspective. That's the biggest lesson, Michelle I think I've had in my fifties. It's putting it in perspective. My husband likes to say, don't put a twenty on a ten. You know, I try to not let things that don't warrant it being you know, a crisis, right, I saved crisis for crisis. And I say, you know, I saved my mind and my mental health by putting things in perspective. 00:26:54 Speaker 2: Tameron, you know that's a one, and then are you going to react on a five? You know? 00:26:59 Speaker 3: Or how does that really matter? In my youth, my early early years, I wasn't letting anything. Somebody I was last word tammering. I'm like, no, yeah, because you especially as a black woman and as a woman, you don't want people to feel that they can run over you or that you speaking up somehow makes you bad and it makes them good to keep you quiet. And so early in my career and early in my life, I was always trying to fight for that voice. But now in my fifties, I put it in perspective and I say, you know, I can let that person leave the room thinking that I'm okay with that because I've lived enough of this journey where that all they have to look and see it's wrong. 00:27:38 Speaker 1: You know, Yes, Oh, y'all, she shared so much that it can be a part two. So are you making mountains out of molehills? Yes, situay, if there's a situation that's really one, are you putting tens on it? My heart warmed. Now you know, I'm a church girl, so my heart warmed when you mentioned you helped your church build a Sunday school room. You know, we would call that children's church, you know, where the kids can check in. And y'all, she always is posting out that I love when you post, you know, outside the church. 00:28:15 Speaker 2: What you know something that the. 00:28:18 Speaker 1: Church signing the message that it's that it's about. And so I just thank you so so much for being here and for you to just continue to ascend and soar. You also just mentioned how sometimes when black women are we're trying to be assertive, we are called aggressive, right, But I know you don't let that stop you. You are the executive producer of the Emmy winning award show The Tammeron Hall Show. We're excited about your book, Watch Where They Hide. We got to make this a New York Times bestseller. Now that last book, the last book that I'm like, wait a minute, in why t that was one hundred thousand units. Now, what's the qualifications. I said that she did it because I want it up. Okay, so listen, we are so excited. I can't wait to continue to keep in touch with you. 00:29:13 Speaker 2: We love you. Yeah, yeah, well we'll see you. 00:29:18 Speaker 3: So we got to see you in the studio on the show when you're in New York. 00:29:22 Speaker 2: I ignore you. 00:29:23 Speaker 3: Yeah yeah, And I tell my mom, I told the story of us all hanging out in the fabulous sex with Avenue Street department. I love you and you're just such a bright light and it's always an honor pleasure. 00:29:35 Speaker 2: To talk to you. Thank you for pleasure. 00:29:38 Speaker 1: Absolutely, I am rooting for you. Wow, what an inspiring show. Oh my gosh, I'm so excited about her new book. Watch where they had Okay, I'm really excited about her new book. I hope you guys enjoy today's episode. 00:30:00 Speaker 2: Just be resilient. 00:30:01 Speaker 1: Write those books that you want to write, write that script that you want to write. You know, whatever it is that you want to do, do it. Don't let anybody make you feel because you're this you can't also have your foot in that. Okay, you might be a teacher, but maybe you can sketch. Maybe you want to design some clothes or I don't care, just hair bonnets, whatever it is that you want to do. I hope this episode pushes you. You know, go girl, go bro do this. Checking In with Michelle Williams is a production of iHeartRadio and The Black Effect. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.