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Welcome to Beyond the Threshold™, the podcast where we explore the evolving landscape of security across schools, sports, healthcare, cities, and beyond. Every episode, we dive into the challenges and innovations that shape how we protect our communities.
Today's discussion is hosted by Evolv's co-founder, Anil Chitkara.
Today, we're here with John Baier. John is Evolv's head of sports and entertainment and spends a lot of time in the US and abroad with those clients in the sports industry, in the entertainment industry, and the related ecosystem around that. So, John, first of all, I've seen your you've been at the New York Islanders and the Brooklyn Nets. I'm not sure I've ever met somebody that had played both professional hockey and professional basketball. How did you do both?
It's a great question. I don't think the, those teams would have done as well on the court, on the ice if I was, if I was suited up. I was certainly behind the scenes, maintaining and having an impact on everything that did not happen on the court and then the ice, which is for the betterment of everybody.
Yeah. And you've been, at Evolv for a few years now?
Yes. Three years heading up the sports entertainment division, which has been, fantastic to to build this vertical and and to show that there there really is differentiation on how we approach different types of clients, different types of venues, and and nothing's cookie cutter, with how we prescribe that.
As the US came out of COVID, as fans were going back to stadiums, as, people were going back to entertainment venues, what did you see? What did you see in talking to our sports and entertainment companies out there?
Well, during the pandemic, I was actually on the team side and then the building side. So we went through the process of, fans coming in as as they had done for for years and years and years to really having no fans in the building and building out those plans on how do fans reenter the venue safely, most importantly, but also being able to enjoy. And I think there was there was obviously hesitation, but the amount of time and investment and energy and planning, the venues and the leagues, put into fans coming back to these venues, I think, gave fans, a a sense of comfort and a sense of, you know, they they were going to be safe. But technology needed to improve. People need to innovate.
These venues need to challenge companies like Evolv to to challenge the status quo and to change the status quo. And I think fans were looking for safety, but also for convenience, also ease, and leaning on technology to do that. And I I think just, again, the investment in time, and resources to make sure that fans could come back safe was the number one priority of the venues in the leagues.
John, I want to spend a little time talking about the role of technology, the role of technology at stadiums and arenas, the role of technology as it, impacts and improves the fan experience.
So we're here in Boston. If we look back a few years, it wasn't too long ago that Fenway Park used a manual scoreboard. They still use it when you go there.
You and I remember the times when you had paper tickets coming in. The tickets were torn, literally torn. Maybe there was a scoreboard up, and, eventually, there was a replay that you could, look up to. Sure. If you think about the last five, ten, fifteen years, what new technologies have come into the arenas and the stadiums, and what have those changes meant for the fans?
Well, I think technology is really pushing venue operators to to adapt, to what fans are dealing with on their everyday life and to bring that into to the sports venue. And sports entertainment often has the ability to be kind of a beta site for new technology, which is fantastic. I think what fans are looking for are convenience and ease. And that that goes from, you know, I call it the street to seat experience from when you leave your car in the parking lot or go to the subway to when you actually get to your seat.
What does that customer journey look like? It starts with with ingress and security. So looking for, solutions like Evolv Express®. You talked about tickets a couple years ago.
Everybody had a hard paper ticket, and there was a transition to to mobile ticketing on your phone, but it still required, you know, a motion of taking that ticket out, downloading an app. You know, to now there are venues that use biometrics and, and faces your ticket to enter the venue. Now fast forward to when you get into the venue, when you're consuming, and consuming can be food and beverage, consuming could be access to a club, consuming could be, you know, just the sights and sounds of the of the venue. You know, who would have thought you'd be able to go a concession stand and not deal with a single operator, you know, and and kinda have a just walk out type of experience?
There's now even the conveniences of knowing what bathroom and what restroom is gonna have the shortest wait time, and that's all based on technology.
Even the connectivity to the game, you know, to, ancillary information. You're not just there to watch the game that's on the field or the court. You know, can you log into an app that's giving you, stats or or or information that you wouldn't typically get unless you were at the venue? So all of these things, you know, really kind of culminate what this new experience is and what the expectation is for fans today. And what I'm excited about is now, five years from now, ten years from now, what's the technology gonna be like that we're not even thinking about today?
You talked about the role of technology transforming the fan experience in the stadium or in the arena. Can you talk about how teams think about the in person fan experience versus streaming options, TV options, this wide range of other technologies that can plug fans into a game without being there in person?
No. Sure. So the the competitiveness of technology and and the
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experience of sitting at home or sitting at the game, really has never been more competitive as it as it has been today. When I first got into the sports entertainment industry, there was no comparison.
You know, you sitting on your couch on a on a thirty six inch non HD television, was really never gonna be an option compared to going to the gaming live. Now with the technology that's out there, you know, there's certainly that challenge. And when I was on the team side, that's when that was really starting, to come about. So I think what venue operators are really focusing on is everything that's not on the court or on the field or on the ice or on the pitch.
You know, they they have no control over what happens with the team, but they have control over everything else. And the expectations have never been higher. So relying on technology, relying on ease of access, and relying on experiences, I think, are what venues are, are maintaining. If you go to a sports venue now and it could be a a major market, a small market, professional sports, minor league sports, There's a lot of venues and teams that are not even really marketing the team or the game.
It's marketing the experience. They have club spaces now that are really built to be gathering places and more of a social environment as opposed to just a fixed seat where you're just gonna watch the game and go home. And there there are, the flexibility the same way that, people aren't using cable television anymore and they're using these streaming apps. There are teams that have the flexibility where you're not just buying a season ticket or an individual game.
You're buying more of a subscription or a pass where you have the flexibility. And I think the forward thinking teams that are that are adapting that and not, not going against the curve, but are really embracing it are the teams that are having success. And those are the same teams that are investing and innovating in technologies like Evolv to make sure that they're they're ahead of that curve and and really meeting those expectations high expectations of the of the today's fan. I think about how I personally go to a sports event and how most of my friends and family think about going to sports event.
It's been the same for years and years and years. And I have young kids. We go to sports events all the time. The moment I tell them that we're going to the game a month or or six months from now, the excitement starts to build.
And then they know the day is coming up. It's marked on the calendar. They've got their jersey picked out. They're talking about it at school.
And then the day comes, we get to the game. We park the car. We're we get a quick bite to eat. You start to smell, you know, the popcorn and and and the hot dogs.
And you're walking to the stadium and you turn that corner, and you're met with this wall of people, and they're not moving. So that excitement, which was almost like a rollercoaster to roller coaster taking up, all of a sudden plummets to now it's anxiety. You know, that's a lot of people. Are we gonna miss the game?
Why is this line not moving? And as you get to the front of the line, you see the lines and lines of staff that are typically not friendly because all they're doing is telling people to take things out of their pocket. It's not a positive interaction with the staff members. You have to now put your belongings into a into a small dog bowl.
And when I'm with my kids, it's still one person at a time. So now I'm worried about putting my my wallet and my phone, in the divesting bowl, And I'm worried about my son wandering off because he has to go this through the system before I do. Now I'm wondering, has my daughter forgot her phone? And that all that excitement is now washed away in a moment as we're waiting to get in line and get to the stadium.
Once we get through, it does slowly build back up because we're at the game. But that anxiety is so unnecessary now with the with the technology that we have. And I think that's the expectations of fans, families, companies that are bringing customers out is they want that excitement to continue to build and build and build until the end of the game. There shouldn't be that lull.
It should just be a continuous positive experience from the moment that you decide to go to that game until the moment that game is over. I think professional sports, especially the the five major leagues in the United States, are are typically testing grounds for all sorts of technology. Not not every technology is going to be applicable to different areas of life or different types of venues. But if you look at things like, like mobile ticketing, like cashless concessions and things of that nature, they really do start in professional sports, but they can get so much, helpful and useful data from fans and just from from so many use cases and transactions that then that starts to be seen and and adopted in college universities in smaller theaters.
You know, we used to have a saying that let it either, pass or fail in the pros, and we'll take all the passes, and we'll adopt that into the smaller venues. But at the end of the day, now a lot of venues don't want to be first to act. You know, people want to be early adopters, but nobody wants to be last. So once it becomes commonplace when you're going to that baseball game, that football game, that hockey game, it now becomes the expectation. So if I go to that professional hockey game and then the following week, I'm going to a smaller venue, but it's not the same experience, the fans are gonna start to question why. So it becomes an expectation and kind of a gold standard. And if it happens at the pro sports venue, the other venues do see the best practices, and it it does start to get more widely adopted.
John, as we look into the future, how do you see sports and entertainment evolving over time?
So as far as the evolution of sports entertainment, I think a lot of people
focus on the technology in the building. Right? So, you know, Evolv Express, frictionless screening, biometric screening, cashless concessions are all things that people are are talking about. When I think about the future of sports entertainment, I also don't wanna dismiss the the physicality of the venues. For years, most venues are are just you're going into the venue, you're watching the game, and then you're getting back in your car and you're going home. The trend that I'm seeing that I'm very excited about is the campus mentality.
Sports and entertainment complexes coming on board. So if you look at these new venues that are that are coming online and and under construction or all of these renovations that we're we're very proud to be a part of, It's not just about the stadium or the arena or the bar or the or the ballpark.
It's about the entire complex, the retail, the the the housing. How do we get people on-site early So they're there all day with their friends and family. And there's things to do. There's engagement. And they're staying afterwards. So that's what we're seeing, which allows us to not just impact the fan experience when going to the game, but really from the moment they step on property and all the other activities that they're involved in. And and I'm very excited to see, the the development, not just of the technology, but the the physical development and the footprint of these complexes really being a destination and not just the venue.
John, as you talk to executives that are building out multi-use campuses around a stadium or around an arena, how are they thinking about the safety and security of not just their fans? Because now there's visitors that are going to these places as well, and it's a more complex environment as they think about the safety and security of the people visiting.
So when you think about the complex mentality and the campus mentality, which which most sports teams and venues are adopting as they build and as they renovate, it now expands that footprint of what needs to be secure for the fans, for the operators, for the employees, and for the visitors. You know, if you go to a sports venue now that really is just the stadium or the ballpark, the ancillary entertainment areas, the restaurants, the bars are are really not their jurisdiction per se. So that is not the same level of safety and security as it would be when you're going into the venue. Now that these operators are really controlling this entire space, they want to expand that safety. They want to expand that experience to have consistency across the entire complex. So now when you think about that expanded perimeter, it is not just going through security right before you get to that front door before you scan your ticket. It's going through some perimeter or some level of security before you step on to activate the food trucks or to go to the sports betting bar or whatever it might be.
That needs to be consistent. So as these venue operators are thinking about these expanded, and in some instances, massive complexes, how do they make sure that those guests, those visitors, those employees are all safe from the moment they step foot on campus until the moment they leave? And that is also their their priority. So it's it's soft targets.
It's really just making sure that everybody is safe from the moment they walk in.
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