บทถอดความฉบับเต็มของ How Technology & Intentional Planning are Reshaping the Aging Journey

for that matter, because it's based on a you know internet platform. 00:02:38.080 --> 00:02:42.560 And we do that and we run about a hundred classes a month with this program. 00:02:42.800 --> 00:02:47.759 So every Tuesday morning, the same group of fifteen people would get together. 00:02:47.919 --> 00:02:58.879 That then creates a virtual community because people are looking forward to their Tuesday morning, Wednesday afternoon, uh Thursday, to see the same faces. 00:02:59.120 --> 00:03:06.560 And so it really creates a community and really helps to combat loneliness as well as the greater social isolation. 00:03:06.879 --> 00:03:08.479 And and that's really amazing. 00:03:08.639 --> 00:03:11.759 I think that that is something that's fairly unique. 00:03:11.919 --> 00:03:17.759 And the idea that people have something to look forward to, they have the same people to talk to. 00:03:17.919 --> 00:03:26.240 I'm imagining that some of the folks that need the home care maybe aren't the most technologically savvy at certain times. 00:03:26.479 --> 00:03:32.879 And that's where the helpers can, you know, assist with that process to make sure they can get online and do all of that, right? 00:03:33.199 --> 00:03:41.199 They can, but one would be amazed at how technologically savvy people become once they begin to use the same tool and equipment. 00:03:41.360 --> 00:03:46.479 Sometimes we do assistance up front and we have a team of people who can help with that. 00:03:46.800 --> 00:03:53.120 But we have found that once people are working with our our virtual center, they want to know more. 00:03:53.280 --> 00:04:00.080 So one of the c a couple of the classes that we run actually are how do you go beyond the virtual center? 00:04:00.159 --> 00:04:01.599 How do you use the internet? 00:04:02.080 --> 00:04:03.439 How do you use email? 00:04:03.599 --> 00:04:07.520 How could you uh you know speak with your grandchildren or children? 00:04:07.759 --> 00:04:11.840 And so we expand once somebody gets comfortable with the technology. 00:04:12.080 --> 00:04:21.839 We have more than three over three thousand people on the program, and we've had some wonderful, heartwarming stories of you know people who are feeling more connected. 00:04:22.240 --> 00:04:38.160 We have one older gentleman who actually based on using the internet after he used the virtual center, met up with a an old girlfriend and she and he, her boyfriend, but they lived about 200 miles away. 00:04:38.319 --> 00:04:47.120 But they began talking and we facilitated the in-person meeting, as you you would hope we would, and we did, and it was just marvelous. 00:04:47.279 --> 00:04:47.839 Just marvelous. 00:04:48.240 --> 00:04:49.759 How did you come up with this idea? 00:04:49.920 --> 00:05:06.000 Because I think this is fantastic, and I'm I'm curious about how this all came about, and it's it seems kind of like the perfect size that if you have uh too many people on the virtual meetup, that it would

get where people just get lost in it. 00:05:06.160 --> 00:05:11.600 And it seems like the perfect size that people can uh really form relationships and things like that. 00:05:11.759 --> 00:05:23.839 So talk to me a little bit about how you came up with this idea, how it came about, and you know, whether other are there other organizations that you've seen that have successfully you know set this type of thing up. 00:05:24.160 --> 00:05:33.519 Yeah, so we have about five or six in-person centers, senior centers, if you will, where people can come in. 00:05:33.759 --> 00:05:45.519 And we were recognizing this goes back to uh about a dozen years ago at this point, recognizing that on occasion, from time to time, the people who we expected to come in didn't come in. 00:05:45.680 --> 00:05:54.399 And when we inquired as to why they didn't, it might have been a hospitalization or some sort of temporary health condition, or they had moved, but they weren't showing up. 00:05:54.480 --> 00:06:01.759 And so we were wondering, you know, how could we still get them to be connected because they had friends at the center. 00:06:02.000 --> 00:06:02.319 Right. 00:06:03.519 --> 00:06:19.120 Well, along came Microsoft and the uh Department for Aging in in New York City, and they said we'd we would like to try to figure out a technology solution that might work for older adults and you know what are the pain points. 00:06:19.279 --> 00:06:21.120 And this was one of them that we brought to them. 00:06:21.360 --> 00:06:33.120 And as a result, the three of us, uh self-help community services, Microsoft and Department for Aging, came together and developed what was then called the virtual senior center. 00:06:33.279 --> 00:06:35.279 And we began to enlist people. 00:06:35.360 --> 00:06:47.759 And initially we had six or seven people in it as a as the pilot program, and found that it was very rewarding for them and for us, and for the voluntary facilitator who picks a topic. 00:06:47.920 --> 00:06:55.120 It could be any topic, it could be current events, it could be tai chi, it could be, you know, how do you bake any of those. 00:06:55.360 --> 00:06:59.199 And so we began to expand the classes and it went from there. 00:06:59.360 --> 00:07:02.399 But that was the origins of it back in 2012. 00:07:02.800 --> 00:07:16.959 And there are other because we have now created a very safe and secure environment technologically speaking for people to join in so people can't just jump in if they are not previously vetted. 00:07:17.120 --> 00:07:25.120 We now have several other organizations and the New York State Department of Aging, who are part of this program. 00:07:25.360 --> 00:07:32.720 And through the State Department of Aging, they have connected many other organizations that are now part of our platform. 00:07:33.120 --> 00:07:37.120 And so this has gone this is goes all the way back to 2012. 00:07:37.360 --> 00:07:45.360 I would have guessed that some of our listeners would have thought that this would have been something that occurred after 2020 because everybody was going online at that point. 00:07:45.600 --> 00:07:48.319 There was you know a necessity there. 00:07:48.560 --> 00:07:54.639 How did things change from before uh the sort of COVID shutdown to after? 00:07:54.800 --> 00:07:58.319 Was there was it pretty much consistent, or were there any changes in how this worked? 00:07:58.720 --> 00:08:02.959 We saw a huge spike in in attendance and interest. 00:08:03.199 --> 00:08:07.839 Everybody, yes, was at home and trying to figure out how they stayed connected. 00:08:08.079 --> 00:08:14.240 And we were then eight years into the program, so many people knew about us, and we were getting calls. 00:08:14.399 --> 00:08:20.800 We were flooded with calls on how could we get on that program that you talked about four years ago or eight years, five years ago. 00:08:20.959 --> 00:08:27.519 And so we we accommodated, and that's when our numbers went from hundreds of people to thousands of people. 00:08:28.000 --> 00:08:29.040 That's really fantastic. 00:08:29.279 --> 00:08:34.159 Do you know the sort of rate of people consistently attending? 00:08:34.399 --> 00:08:37.759 Is this something that some people just attend occasionally? 00:08:37.840 --> 00:08:39.519 Or is it pretty consistent? 00:08:39.759 --> 00:08:51.840 I imagine with small groups like that, that's going to be pretty important because if you have a good number of people that are kind of spotty about whether they they participate or not, that could get you know a little bit more difficult. 00:08:52.000 --> 00:08:57.600 So uh do you know what the rate of participation is on an ongoing basis? 00:08:58.000 --> 00:08:59.679 Yeah, it's actually quite high. 00:09:00.000 --> 00:09:13.440 We have about 80% of the population using the virtual center is uses it at least once a week, 60%, two times a week, and then you know it begins to fall off. 00:09:13.600 --> 00:09:20.080 But you know, twice a week means two classes and high participation rate at the 60 and 80 percent level. 00:09:20.480 --> 00:09:27.279 So you have a facilitator and they often will come to the meeting with a topic in mind, right? 00:09:27.519 --> 00:09:32.799 And then it's a relatively small group, you said 12 to 14, somewhere in that range? 00:09:33.120 --> 00:09:33.440 Yes. 00:09:33.840 --> 00:09:36.559 And the topic is uh predetermined. 00:09:36.799 --> 00:09:48.080 So if you went on our site today, you would see you know five different classes being held today, and tomorrow, you know, six different classes. 00:09:48.320 --> 00:09:53.679 So people can join based on the title and a small description of what the class is about. 00:09:54.000 --> 00:09:56.240 So it is, though, a small group. 00:09:56.399 --> 00:10:01.440 In other words, you don't uh it's not open to just anybody that is interested in that topic. 00:10:01.600 --> 00:10:02.720 Am I correct about that? 00:10:02.799 -->

00:10:11.679 That it is the same group of people that are going to be interacting, and that there's not just random people coming in at any given time if they're interested in a topic. 00:10:11.840 --> 00:10:12.879 Am I accurate on that? 00:10:13.279 --> 00:10:14.639 Yes, you are, Robert. 00:10:14.879 --> 00:10:15.279 It is. 00:10:15.519 --> 00:10:17.360 People know what they're coming for. 00:10:17.519 --> 00:10:19.919 It's the same group of people for the class. 00:10:20.080 --> 00:10:26.000 It's uh as if going to a class in in school or college, and the same people come on. 00:10:26.159 --> 00:10:34.720 If there is somebody new would like to join, there is a vetting process and that that individual's introduced at the time they come into the class. 00:10:34.799 --> 00:10:37.440 So somebody doesn't just all of a sudden show up on the screen. 00:10:37.840 --> 00:10:43.279 And how I'm really curious now about how you determine who goes in what group. 00:10:43.440 --> 00:10:44.960 Is it relatively random? 00:10:45.120 --> 00:10:50.799 Is it something that is done very intentionally, about who we group together? 00:10:50.879 --> 00:10:51.519 How does that work? 00:10:51.600 --> 00:10:53.679 Aaron Powell It's based on individual choice. 00:10:53.919 --> 00:10:59.039 It's the choice of the older adult who who wants to be joining that class. 00:10:59.279 --> 00:11:04.159 We don't vet people from the standpoint of are you appropriate for this class? 00:11:04.399 --> 00:11:08.639 There's regular rules in terms of the way you conduct yourself during the class. 00:11:08.960 --> 00:11:09.200 Of course. 00:11:09.600 --> 00:11:12.080 But other than that, it's uh by self-selection. 00:11:12.240 --> 00:11:27.360 We want people to enjoy what they are doing and make their own independent choices, which is kind of the basis of our book as well, in terms of how you live life through stages and you know what choices you make for yourself. 00:11:27.440 --> 00:11:30.720 Aaron Powell What is the age range of people that usually participate in this? 00:11:31.120 --> 00:11:34.240 Any place from 60 years old to 100 plus. 00:11:34.639 --> 00:11:34.879 Right. 00:11:35.200 --> 00:11:41.519 And so then what about folks that might be experiencing some memory loss or dementia? 00:11:41.679 --> 00:11:45.840 Is there a way for them to participate or is that more difficult? 00:11:45.919 --> 00:11:54.399 Aaron Ross Powell Well, depending on the level of dementia, we sometimes there is somebody else in the room with them. 00:11:54.639 --> 00:12:02.480 It could be a a home care, caretaker, professional, or family member that would help with the prompts. 00:12:02.720 --> 00:12:11.519 But otherwise, there we do have a program that and a couple of sessions that are targeted just for that population. 00:12:11.759 --> 00:12:15.840 So there we know that there will be somebody in the room to assist them. 00:12:16.159 --> 00:12:16.639 That's great. 00:12:16.720 --> 00:12:25.039 And so then

uh what about, and I'm sure you get this question because this sounds like a really great program that's been very successful. 00:12:25.200 --> 00:12:31.039 What about other states and organizations that would like to learn how learn from your success? 00:12:31.279 --> 00:12:37.759 Is there do you have suggestions for other states and organizations to try to implement something like this? 00:12:38.159 --> 00:12:38.320 Sure. 00:12:38.399 --> 00:12:44.879 Uh we speak with other states and in fact have people on from other states and have worked with associations from other states. 00:12:45.039 --> 00:12:46.639 So we'd be happy to talk. 00:12:46.720 --> 00:13:08.399 I mean, you know, on our website, selfhelp.net is the website, and you will see it listed under Virtual Senior Center, and we'll have contact information to speak with people who can help with either advice on what we have done, or you can bring your uh community onto our platform. 00:13:08.799 --> 00:13:13.440 Well, that's great, and I'm glad that you gave us how to reach out to you. 00:13:13.600 --> 00:13:21.519 Tell us a little bit more about your book and you know how it came about that you guys decided to write the book and uh, you know, the purpose of that. 00:13:21.919 --> 00:13:22.080 Sure. 00:13:22.159 --> 00:13:24.240 So I'll start and then Marcus should join in. 00:13:24.480 --> 00:13:44.799 Marcus and I know each other from uh uh a variety of professional works, but in particular, uh we served on the board of the Global Aging Network, which is an uh a group of professionals who range from 60 different countries representing all of those countries on aging services. 00:13:44.960 --> 00:13:55.759 And Marx and I realize, Marcus being in Australia and I in the US, that regardless of country, the needs of older adults are very similar. 00:13:56.080 --> 00:13:58.240 That shouldn't be a surprise to anybody. 00:13:58.399 --> 00:14:03.759 Yes, different countries have different resources, so we can go down that road if if we'd like. 00:14:04.159 --> 00:14:07.120 But in general, the needs of the individuals are the same. 00:14:07.279 --> 00:14:14.480 And we recognize too that aging is similar regardless of country. 00:14:14.559 --> 00:14:21.759 And so we began talking about that and wondered, you know, yeah, how are we addressing aging and we should really be rethinking aging? 00:14:22.000 --> 00:14:30.399 And so we turned to that concept and wrote a book which creates seven new stages of aging and talks about the life journey. 00:14:30.720 --> 00:14:31.039 Marcus? 00:14:31.360 --> 00:14:47.279 Yeah, and I think as Stuart touched on there, Bob, really to change the way we think or or view aging, both at a personal level as well as at a collective or or societal level, and fundamentally moving away from the fixation we so often have on chronological age. 00:14:47.360 --> 00:14:56.240 And that limited thinking really leads to things like stereotypes to ageism, and very much narrows the way we look at ourselves and our own aging journeys. 00:14:56.399 --> 00:15:20.320 So, what we wanted to do was really provide new thinking and a new frame for people to look at themselves and others in terms of our increased longevity that most of us are going to enjoy, and introduce some really uh new concepts in terms of the seven new stages that Stuart touched on, but also concepts like the fluidity of aging and the feels like age, and again, moving away from this fixation on the chronological age. 00:15:20.559 --> 00:15:36.960 And importantly, introducing a concept that we call flicker, which essentially is your ability to uh overcome setbacks, to plan and to, with the right sort of positive interventions, move to your preferred stage of aging and and or remain in that stage for a longer period. 00:15:37.120 --> 00:15:45.519 So we've been really excited to share those uh new concepts and the feedback has been really affirming in terms of it resonating with with people. 00:15:45.600 --> 00:15:52.480 And one of the key drivers for us was to to make the book uh as accessible and as practical as possible. 00:15:52.639 --> 00:15:59.039 Uh it's based on a lot of research and a lot of experience, but it's not an academic book or a medical book. 00:15:59.120 --> 00:16:03.519 It's something for everyone to be able to pick up and use, come back to. 00:16:03.759 --> 00:16:10.879 There's a lot of really practical tools in it in terms of assessing where you're at in your aging journey, tools for planning and decision making. 00:16:11.039 --> 00:16:14.799 So we're really pleased with the feedback from uh people in the community so far. 00:16:15.279 --> 00:16:19.039 I appreciate that about the book that it is accessible like that. 00:16:19.279 --> 00:16:22.080 And I'd like to get into the seven steps and all of that. 00:16:22.240 --> 00:16:30.159 But before we do that, I'm curious, and I appreciate what you said, which is uh aging happens everywhere, right? 00:16:30.320 --> 00:16:36.559 And just because we're you guys are in different parts of the world, that it's there's a lot of similarities. 00:16:36.720 --> 00:17:00.799 But I also wonder whether or not the fact that your collaboration and that you are in different parts of the world, that that actually was you were able to sort of open up each other's eyes to things that are you know newer ideas, that that that actually helped with the process of coming up with some of the discussion and really making this accessible for people all over the world. 00:17:01.039 --> 00:17:11.119 And so was that collaboration, the fact that you are so far apart and there is different communities and things like that, did that help with that thought process in the book? 00:17:11.519 --> 00:17:11.920 Absolutely. 00:17:12.079 --> 00:17:23.839 I think both the respective knowledge bases that Stuart and I brought to our collaboration from the US and Australia, but also the knowledge we've acquired through that international

engagement. 00:17:24.000 --> 00:17:37.759 So looking at the both developed countries, but also uh the what we might call less developed countries as well, who have things that we can learn from in terms of their cultural approach or different initiatives that might be happening in in different parts of the world. 00:17:37.839 --> 00:17:45.920 So I think the bottom line there, Bob, is that we've all got something to share in terms of our knowledge and experiences and also things to learn from from other people. 00:17:46.160 --> 00:17:53.359 And uh as you alluded to, certainly the uh opportunity for us was to to share our experiences. 00:17:53.519 --> 00:17:57.279 Uh both Stuart and I having worked in the field of aging for quite a long time. 00:17:57.440 --> 00:18:10.000 We obviously had have had the benefit of learning from older people themselves, learning from colleagues and other research which we've been able to pull together and certainly a lot of commonality in both in terms of the challenges but also the opportunities. 00:18:10.319 --> 00:18:20.559 But those nuances are really interesting as well, and and certainly I think help ensure the book is relatable for for all people, as you said, irrespective of where they may be based. 00:18:20.880 --> 00:18:29.519 And I like the theme of really the idea that uh you can be intentional about your stage of aging. 00:18:29.680 --> 00:18:45.119 And I think that uh we don't just get to a certain age and then follow a standard pattern, or like you said, and even me saying, you know, that by questioning people's use of technology, and you're like, no, it's that's not the our experience. 00:18:45.359 --> 00:18:48.079 People of all ages can embrace technology. 00:18:48.240 --> 00:19:04.880 And that's kind of the idea a little bit behind all of this, that you can you don't have to go down a set path of aging in a way that somehow maybe we imagined when we were younger, or maybe our parents imagined, and that you're able to kind of uh be very intentional about this. 00:19:05.039 --> 00:19:09.200 So can we talk about the seven stages that you guys have outlined? 00:19:09.519 --> 00:19:09.759 Sure. 00:19:10.000 --> 00:19:14.079 So to pick up on what you were saying about uh you know we hit a certain point. 00:19:14.400 --> 00:19:27.839 In the U.S., you know, we created the Social Security Act about 90 years ago, and we set, based on actuarial analysis and financial realities, the age of 65 as the target. 00:19:28.079 --> 00:19:41.599 Well, back then in the 1930s, life expectancy was about sixty-seven or sixty-eight, so sixty-five was very convenient for the actuaries, because they said, Oh, we'll only have to pay for two years on average into social security. 00:19:42.319 --> 00:19:48.559 That has changed dramatically as we we know over this last hundred years. 00:19:48.880 --> 00:19:58.000 And uh now now when you're sixty-five, you can be looking forward to another twenty, thirty, or forty years even of life. 00:19:58.240 --> 00:20:03.039 And so we recognized that the there are stages to that aging. 00:20:03.119 --> 00:20:10.079 It's not just a dead by the decade, it's not chronologically driven, it's based on how you feel. 00:20:10.400 --> 00:20:23.039 And so we created seven stages, but didn't start at sixty-five because aging, as you referenced, Rob, was something that we can have influence over how we feel. 00:20:23.279 --> 00:20:28.400 So we started at twenty-five and we ran up to a hundred plus with our stages. 00:20:28.640 --> 00:20:37.519 And we believe that in each of those stages, you should be envisioning where you will be five years from now. 00:20:37.920 --> 00:20:40.799 Not ten, because that's a little bit too much, maybe, friend. 00:20:41.119 --> 00:20:44.559 A lot happens in ten, but five is something that's manageable. 00:20:44.799 --> 00:20:53.839 And you should consider you know what your passions are, what choices you want to make, and where you want to be in that term ahead. 00:20:54.079 --> 00:21:01.440 So we started with a stage called young adult, which starts at twenty-five, but has an age range that goes up to about forty. 00:21:01.839 --> 00:21:08.799 And the reason for that is because some people are young adult at twenty-five, and some people at thirty-five, and some people at forty. 00:21:09.119 --> 00:21:16.160 We did that with each of our stages so that there is overlap with the chronological age. 00:21:16.319 --> 00:21:20.319 So that people uh we like the tangible of holding on to numbers. 00:21:20.480 --> 00:21:32.000 And so we put these large age ranges that overlap because somebody could be 35 and be young adult, but somebody could be 35 and be mid-adult, the next. 00:21:32.880 --> 00:21:44.960 And then we went into transitional stages, a pre-transition, and then an in-transition stage, followed by something called settled in, and that now I'm moving up in the scale. 00:21:45.119 --> 00:21:47.519 So that could be between 65 and 84. 00:21:47.759 --> 00:21:51.680 You could be settled in when you're 75, you could be settled in when you're 65. 00:21:52.079 --> 00:21:55.279 Settled in meaning you know where you are in life. 00:21:55.440 --> 00:21:59.839 You've had a professional life, you perhaps have had a family, you know where your family are. 00:22:00.400 --> 00:22:00.880 Is in life. 00:22:01.039 --> 00:22:04.000 You know what your financial status is at that time. 00:22:04.160 --> 00:22:09.440 But again, when you're between sixty-five and eighty-four, that's a large range for you to be in. 00:22:09.759 --> 00:22:14.240 But you can be in this sweet spot of sixty-five to eighty-four. 00:22:14.480 --> 00:22:18.079 From settled in, we moved into a stage called supported living. 00:22:18.319 --> 00:22:24.319 And we recognize that you know there is a point where you may need assistance as you get older. 00:22:24.559 --> 00:22:30.400 And I say may because there are those who go through the life journey without any

assistance. 00:22:30.720 --> 00:22:32.880 And then finally we have an elder stage. 00:22:33.039 --> 00:22:39.359 And those are the seven stages, and that runs over to a hundred plus, but starts at about age eighty-five. 00:22:39.759 --> 00:22:44.160 So we have the full continuum and you can move back and forth. 00:22:44.240 --> 00:22:47.920 Uh Marcus earlier talked about the flicker phase. 00:22:48.799 --> 00:23:01.279 And based on life events, you may all of a sudden move from in transition to supported living because you have some sort of a medical setback that may put you into supported living. 00:23:01.359 --> 00:23:03.359 But when you're there, you need not stay there. 00:23:03.759 --> 00:23:12.799 So the flicker stage phase allows you to move back and forth between stages based on your passions, your choices, and your desires. 00:23:13.200 --> 00:23:13.920 It's interesting. 00:23:14.000 --> 00:23:17.200 Uh, this is the conversation that I frequently have. 00:23:17.440 --> 00:23:38.960 I do a lot of classes and presentations, and that's often how you describe the stages, is something that we talk about because, and maybe there's cultural differences in different parts of the world, but at least in my part of the world, it does seem like that there is a certain level of understanding across society about different stages. 00:23:39.119 --> 00:23:57.440 You know, we plan and from a planning perspective, from my perspective, and what I'm encouraging people to do is that we, of course, we, you know, plan for some when someone's leaving high school, and we plan for, you know, whether they're going to go into a job or to university. 00:23:57.759 --> 00:24:08.079 We plan for, you know, many people will plan for years for a marriage, for children, for one of the big ones, and I think you've addressed this, is planning for retirement. 00:24:08.240 --> 00:24:12.319 I I had I'm often asked to speak about you know, people planning for retirement. 00:24:12.400 --> 00:24:18.799 And often it's a it's a 10-year journey of, well, I'm still I'm thinking about maybe in 10 years I'll retire. 00:24:19.039 --> 00:24:38.480 And the thing that I noticed, and the thing, the reason I bring this up so often, is that uh that is the end of a lot of people's planning, that they plan for the retirement, and then they know that they got to do something to plan for death, but there's this whole stage now in the middle that needs to be planned for. 00:24:38.720 --> 00:24:55.680 And a lot of people aren't, you know, and and and we're starting to get around, and I think we're really starting to make some progress on getting folks to understand that it's more in my view, and in what we teach, is it's more important to plan for those living years than your death. 00:24:55.839 --> 00:25:02.319 Of course, we have to do something to plan for what happens after you die, but it's just as important to plan for those years. 00:25:02.559 --> 00:25:14.799 And somehow in American society,

it seems like we get to this point of retirement, and then we think, okay, well, that's just gonna, you know, kind of say stay stable and consistent until we die. 00:25:14.960 --> 00:25:21.279 There are different stages, and we need to plan for all those stages and the possibilities that we might not go through them, or we might. 00:25:21.440 --> 00:25:29.839 And, you know, and at some level, we kind of have to look at the statistics of how many of us might need assistance, might need the other people to help us out with those things. 00:25:30.160 --> 00:25:33.599 I think, Bob, it ties into your early point about being intentional. 00:25:33.920 --> 00:25:39.440 And you know, previously stages, if any, were mentioned was midlife, retire, death. 00:25:39.680 --> 00:25:44.000 And and as you rightly highlighted, there's multiple stages across that that journey. 00:25:44.079 --> 00:25:51.519 And it's not just a single aging, it's not just a single trajectory and and one of decline and and you reach a point where you should be participating less. 00:25:51.599 --> 00:25:57.759 And that's uh the stereotypical view that we've seen permeate through society for for so many generations. 00:25:57.839 --> 00:26:03.359 And we do now and and should be and have the opportunity to be much more intentional around that. 00:26:03.519 --> 00:26:08.640 And uh it it ties in with another concept from the book, which we call aging on pace. 00:26:08.799 --> 00:26:19.039 And uh that's really about living uh your life the way you want to, the sort of lifestyle you want to be, uh pursuing the things that are important to you in terms of your priorities and and passions. 00:26:19.200 --> 00:26:27.920 And for a number of decades, uh there's been a term called aging in place, which has been used a lot, particularly across the senior living and and care sectors. 00:26:28.000 --> 00:26:33.599 And that's talked about obviously where you live, whereas aging in pace is talking about how you live. 00:26:33.759 --> 00:26:42.960 So we feel that's the next evolution of that sort of thinking, and uh, as I said, really ties into your earlier point about being intentional in terms of how we want to live our longer lives. 00:26:43.279 --> 00:26:45.119 Well, uh that's that's great. 00:26:45.200 --> 00:26:48.559 I really appreciate everything that you guys have been working on here. 00:26:48.880 --> 00:26:50.079 Can you give us some tips? 00:26:50.240 --> 00:27:06.640 So our listeners are typically going to be folks that work in in senior services, folks that work in that provide long-term care, work in healthcare, and then just gen a lot of folks that are just getting into that age where they want to be intentional about how they live. 00:27:06.799 --> 00:27:09.599 And so those are the those are our typical listeners. 00:27:09.759 --> 00:27:12.400 What tips do you have for them for us? 00:27:12.559 --> 00:27:14.400 Because I'm getting into that age too. 00:27:14.480 --> 00:27:17.200 So what tips that you would recommend? 00:27:17.279 --> 00:27:20.640 And you know, obviously, one of them would probably be buy the book. 00:27:20.720 --> 00:27:23.599 Uh what other thoughts do you have for our listeners? 00:27:24.079 --> 00:27:26.799 I'll share a quick one and and hand over to Stuart. 00:27:27.119 --> 00:27:39.279 I come back to how we think about aging, Bob, and and to see our increased longevity, to see our aging journey is one where we can be creating possibilities that it's not a period of decline. 00:27:39.359 --> 00:27:56.640 It's an opportunity for us to really embrace and and take hold of uh and to plan for and and to identify what's important to us, whether that's with particular relationships, particular pursuits, things that are going to fuel our sense of purpose and really lean into those in terms of prioritizing time and and resources. 00:27:57.119 --> 00:28:05.279 And once we do the planning, I think you know this because this is what you are advising people on, is make decisions. 00:28:05.920 --> 00:28:28.160 The planning and the thinking about what I am going to do over the next year to be intentionable, intentional about working toward not working or trying to find volunteer opportunities, or thinking about I'd like to make that trip that I've never made, or bringing my family together, or me going closer to where my family is. 00:28:28.400 --> 00:28:31.759 We think about those things, but they go around in our mind. 00:28:32.240 --> 00:28:35.920 We don't make decisions and act on them as often as we should. 00:28:36.160 --> 00:28:43.440 So my tip would be when you have something intentional, make a decision, make a commitment, and do it. 00:28:43.680 --> 00:28:52.000 That's what moves you to a next step or a different stage is actualizing what your planning and thinking has been. 00:28:52.319 --> 00:28:54.720 Yeah, I think that's very powerful what you said right there. 00:28:54.799 --> 00:29:05.359 And I think that is so important that especially with so many distractions, you know, and I think all ages, it's easy to fall for all the distractions of social media and everything else. 00:29:05.440 --> 00:29:17.279 Uh, but to decide to actually follow through on things, I think that's very powerful if you want to be, you know, move beer be very intentional about where you want to be and how you want to live. 00:29:17.519 --> 00:29:18.640 So excellent. 00:29:18.720 --> 00:29:21.279 I appreciate so much of this conversation. 00:29:21.440 --> 00:29:25.759 I think it's been really helpful for folks, and I found it fascinating. 00:29:26.000 --> 00:29:28.400 Where is the best place to get your book? 00:29:28.640 --> 00:29:28.880 Sure. 00:29:28.960 --> 00:29:34.000 Online, Bonds and Noble, your agingadvantage.com will get you there. 00:29:34.160 --> 00:29:38.960 It's also in bookstores, and so your local bookstore likely has it as well. 00:29:39.279 --> 00:29:45.279 So local bookstore, but one of the easiest places you can go, youragingadvantage.com. 00:29:45.519 --> 00:29:46.079 Is that right? 00:29:46.319 --> 00:29:46.720 That's correct. 00:29:47.039 --> 00:29:48.799 Youragingadvantage.com. 00:29:48.960 --> 00:29:54.640 Thank you so much for this conversation, and I appreciate all of the work that you guys do for our listeners. 00:29:54.720 --> 00:30:05.119 If you enjoyed this conversation and you want to make sure that you're up to date on all of the folks that we talk to, don't forget to subscribe to advice from your advocates on any place that you find podcasts. 00:30:05.279 --> 00:30:12.640 And you can also check us out on the law firm website, which is manorlawgroup.com, or on the Manner Law YouTube. 00:30:13.039 --> 00:30:14.880 Thanks, and we'll see you next time. 00:30:15.920 --> 00:30:17.039 Thanks for listening. 00:30:17.200 --> 00:30:20.240 To learn more, visit Manor Law Group.com.