UTSKRIFT 🔗
WEBVTT
00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:01.780
Have you ever looked at a piece of history and
00:00:01.780 --> 00:00:04.139
realized the most important person in the room
00:00:04.139 --> 00:00:08.160
was the one nobody bothered to write down? Today,
00:00:08.300 --> 00:00:12.439
we're talking about the film that sounds like
00:00:12.439 --> 00:00:15.779
somebody with a head code or a spelling mistake,
00:00:16.079 --> 00:00:20.739
Hamnet, and not Hamlet. It's Hamnet. Stratford
00:00:20.739 --> 00:00:24.820
-upon -Avon, late 1500s. Not the postcard version,
00:00:24.980 --> 00:00:27.719
the muddy, loud, frankly, it smells like wet
00:00:27.719 --> 00:00:30.620
leather and livestock version. But before you
00:00:30.620 --> 00:00:35.039
think, I'm going highbrow literature here. That's
00:00:35.039 --> 00:00:36.840
not what we're doing. Because it's not about
00:00:36.840 --> 00:00:38.880
the dusty old books. It's about the stuff that
00:00:38.880 --> 00:00:44.640
keeps us up at 3 a .m. Movie Monday, Hamnet Coco,
00:00:44.960 --> 00:00:47.920
Mother's Day, yesterday. Yeah, let's kick it
00:00:47.920 --> 00:00:51.420
off, right? Whole two weeks of mothers. But now
00:00:51.420 --> 00:00:54.600
we're going to do two full weeks of mother -themed
00:00:54.600 --> 00:00:59.280
movies, TV shows. We're going all out for the
00:00:59.280 --> 00:01:03.340
moms. Now, how was Mother's Day for you over
00:01:03.340 --> 00:01:06.840
there, Coco? Mother's Day is always great if
00:01:06.840 --> 00:01:11.540
you... Don't demand what you need out of Mother's
00:01:11.540 --> 00:01:14.239
Day. I have a lot of moms that are online are
00:01:14.239 --> 00:01:16.879
like, I hate Mother's Day. Nobody does anything
00:01:16.879 --> 00:01:21.540
for me. It sucks. And I'm like, how do you not
00:01:21.540 --> 00:01:23.780
just plop yourself down on the couch and say,
00:01:23.879 --> 00:01:27.420
day off. Y 'all are taking care of me today.
00:01:27.640 --> 00:01:30.659
Because that's kind of what I do. Yeah. All right.
00:01:30.700 --> 00:01:33.480
But I do. I'm like, I work hard. Today is my
00:01:33.480 --> 00:01:37.569
day. We went to the zoo. Nancy wanted to go to
00:01:37.569 --> 00:01:39.530
the zoo. I'm like, all right. And there was lots
00:01:39.530 --> 00:01:44.189
of moms at the zoo. The zoo was packed. I started
00:01:44.189 --> 00:01:46.530
thinking about it. I was like, why do so many
00:01:46.530 --> 00:01:49.629
moms want to go to the zoo for Mother's Day?
00:01:49.769 --> 00:01:54.409
And I came up with two answers. One, it's because
00:01:54.409 --> 00:01:56.930
they want to leave their kids there because they're
00:01:56.930 --> 00:01:58.870
feral anyway, and they want to keep them at the
00:01:58.870 --> 00:02:02.170
zoo. That's probably not it. I think the second
00:02:02.170 --> 00:02:07.280
part is maybe it's that primal. Part of being
00:02:07.280 --> 00:02:11.099
a mother. You want to be around. Yeah. Yeah.
00:02:11.159 --> 00:02:14.539
Remember when we did Night Bitch? Yeah. There
00:02:14.539 --> 00:02:19.099
you go. You know, like going back to giving birth
00:02:19.099 --> 00:02:24.199
in a pile of hay or something. Yeah. Digging
00:02:24.199 --> 00:02:26.800
in the dirt, whatever it is. But I think that
00:02:26.800 --> 00:02:29.280
might be, there might be a trigger there. There
00:02:29.280 --> 00:02:32.919
might be something that. women connect to. Cause
00:02:32.919 --> 00:02:35.020
for father's day, I don't think I want to go
00:02:35.020 --> 00:02:37.159
to the zoo, but then again, father's day is a
00:02:37.159 --> 00:02:39.159
month later in June and it's probably going to
00:02:39.159 --> 00:02:42.719
be 120 degrees. So there's a, there's a, yeah,
00:02:42.840 --> 00:02:45.580
I don't know. Yeah. I mean, I think part of it
00:02:45.580 --> 00:02:49.560
is moms want not all moms. Let's be honest. No
00:02:49.560 --> 00:02:51.620
judgment. You want to spend a day. My mom was
00:02:51.620 --> 00:02:54.439
one of those that was like, she said to us yesterday,
00:02:54.520 --> 00:02:57.080
she goes, do you, do you guys even remember what
00:02:57.080 --> 00:02:59.520
we did on mother's day? I didn't see you all
00:02:59.520 --> 00:03:03.780
day. She was like, I wanted you gone. I was in
00:03:03.780 --> 00:03:06.419
my room all day. I didn't want to be bothered.
00:03:06.560 --> 00:03:09.219
I didn't want to be touched. But I think for
00:03:09.219 --> 00:03:11.340
a lot of moms, they're like, I do want a day
00:03:11.340 --> 00:03:13.860
with my family. I want to spend it with my kids.
00:03:13.979 --> 00:03:16.379
I just don't want to take care of anybody. I
00:03:16.379 --> 00:03:19.000
just want a break. So it's nice if we can go
00:03:19.000 --> 00:03:22.780
to the zoo, but I can relax and enjoy the zoo
00:03:22.780 --> 00:03:25.639
for once. That's how I see it. I would be like,
00:03:25.699 --> 00:03:29.610
okay, dads. whoever, you know, it's like you
00:03:29.610 --> 00:03:32.629
plan it, you pack the bags, you pack the car,
00:03:32.789 --> 00:03:34.810
you make sure everybody has their water bottles.
00:03:35.270 --> 00:03:37.830
I'm going to get in the car and wait to be taken
00:03:37.830 --> 00:03:44.969
to the zoo. Yeah. No, I see that too. Yeah. I
00:03:44.969 --> 00:03:48.629
see that. Yeah. Makes sense to me. I love the
00:03:48.629 --> 00:03:52.009
zoo though. Love the zoo. Let's get into, let's
00:03:52.009 --> 00:03:56.259
get into movie Monday though. Hamnet. Wait. One
00:03:56.259 --> 00:03:59.300
that you put on the docket probably wouldn't
00:03:59.300 --> 00:04:00.919
have come across my radar. But then again, it
00:04:00.919 --> 00:04:03.400
would have because it did get nominated for a
00:04:03.400 --> 00:04:06.159
bunch of awards. And, you know, you start watching
00:04:06.159 --> 00:04:10.479
this movie. And for me, it took me a couple of
00:04:10.479 --> 00:04:13.460
times to get through this movie. Got to get to
00:04:13.460 --> 00:04:15.539
the beginning.
Load full transcript
If you're not in the mood for
00:04:15.539 --> 00:04:16.740
something like this, you're not going to want
00:04:16.740 --> 00:04:18.740
to sit there and watch it. So you've got to kind
00:04:18.740 --> 00:04:22.420
of prep yourself that you're going back to the
00:04:22.420 --> 00:04:27.220
1500s. You're going to go. living this dirty
00:04:27.220 --> 00:04:31.360
just i mean it's wet it's raining all the time
00:04:31.360 --> 00:04:35.699
like i just i felt like i needed a bath watching
00:04:35.699 --> 00:04:38.879
it at home yeah pretty realistic and i mean honestly
00:04:38.879 --> 00:04:41.819
that period of time in that place it probably
00:04:41.819 --> 00:04:45.660
was very stinky nobody hours nobody took baths
00:04:45.660 --> 00:04:48.939
there's a reason there was um the bubonic plague
00:04:48.939 --> 00:04:54.810
yeah it's dirty it was a little dirty Yeah, so
00:04:54.810 --> 00:04:59.730
we're in 1580s Stratford -upon -Avon. You know,
00:04:59.730 --> 00:05:03.569
like I said, it's not your pretty postcard version.
00:05:03.649 --> 00:05:08.470
It's not your beautiful scenery movie. Don't
00:05:08.470 --> 00:05:10.329
get me wrong, it is a beautiful movie, but it's
00:05:10.329 --> 00:05:12.970
not going to make you feel clean. And we've got
00:05:12.970 --> 00:05:16.470
a guy named Will, Glovemaker's son, basically
00:05:16.470 --> 00:05:20.540
the Elizabethan version. of his dad has a small
00:05:20.540 --> 00:05:23.240
business and he's trying to not take it over
00:05:23.240 --> 00:05:26.680
like that's what he's got going on he meets artist
00:05:26.680 --> 00:05:30.980
yeah he meets agnes who history calls anne hathaway
00:05:30.980 --> 00:05:34.120
and labels her a shrew who trapped him into marriage
00:05:34.120 --> 00:05:37.879
that's what history kind of lays her out but
00:05:37.879 --> 00:05:41.160
maggie maggie o 'farrell the writer here says
00:05:41.160 --> 00:05:43.759
uh and i'm with her on this says wait a minute
00:05:44.600 --> 00:05:48.600
Not so fast. What if she was, you know, magic?
00:05:48.699 --> 00:05:51.019
What if there was some other stuff that goes
00:05:51.019 --> 00:05:56.680
on with Anne Hathaway and Agnes here? So you
00:05:56.680 --> 00:06:00.720
got, all in all, one marriage, three kids, two
00:06:00.720 --> 00:06:04.079
twins named Hamnet and Judith, and one very hungry,
00:06:04.160 --> 00:06:07.060
very patient fleet carrying the Black Plague.
00:06:07.160 --> 00:06:09.100
That's kind of what this movie comes down to.
00:06:09.279 --> 00:06:11.680
Coco, what'd you think about this flick here,
00:06:11.779 --> 00:06:17.500
overall? Well, you know, the gritty, dirty England
00:06:17.500 --> 00:06:22.819
countryside, all that aside, the aesthetic of
00:06:22.819 --> 00:06:25.180
the movie is absolutely right up my alley. In
00:06:25.180 --> 00:06:27.579
fact, I've been doing a lot of marketing and
00:06:27.579 --> 00:06:29.920
branding work for Prism Healing, my business,
00:06:30.120 --> 00:06:31.980
and trying to figure out what does the branding
00:06:31.980 --> 00:06:34.339
look like? What are kind of the aesthetics? And
00:06:34.339 --> 00:06:37.759
this movie came up as a suggestion. You know,
00:06:37.819 --> 00:06:41.040
those who've been listening to you. me and practically
00:06:41.040 --> 00:06:43.420
magic podcast, or, you know, if you follow me
00:06:43.420 --> 00:06:46.160
at all, you know, I love practical magic. Yeah.
00:06:46.459 --> 00:06:48.579
Covered that in the witch movie project, because
00:06:48.579 --> 00:06:52.120
again, that aesthetic, the general vibe of that
00:06:52.120 --> 00:06:56.300
movie is a hundred percent, you know, what I
00:06:56.300 --> 00:07:00.879
try to help people understand what magic really
00:07:00.879 --> 00:07:04.589
looks like. I mean, You can go really magical
00:07:04.589 --> 00:07:06.329
with it. You can go Harry Potter with it. You
00:07:06.329 --> 00:07:08.709
can be like, oh, you know, magic wand sparkles
00:07:08.709 --> 00:07:11.170
come out. There's something transforms into something
00:07:11.170 --> 00:07:15.649
else and blah, blah, blah. Real actual magic,
00:07:15.970 --> 00:07:19.050
quantum physics, spicy psychology, whatever you
00:07:19.050 --> 00:07:22.470
want to call it. More like this movie Hamnet
00:07:22.470 --> 00:07:25.569
than most other ways that Hollywood could portray,
00:07:25.949 --> 00:07:28.730
you know, what it means to be powerful, what
00:07:28.730 --> 00:07:31.699
it means to be a healer. And I think. That is
00:07:31.699 --> 00:07:33.660
my favorite part about this movie is why this
00:07:33.660 --> 00:07:37.560
show that strength. And, you know, there was
00:07:37.560 --> 00:07:40.939
some criticism. I mean, with witch talk being
00:07:40.939 --> 00:07:43.660
a thing, you know, they're like, it probably
00:07:43.660 --> 00:07:45.540
most likely wouldn't have looked like this if
00:07:45.540 --> 00:07:48.680
she had been what they called a cunning woman.
00:07:49.040 --> 00:07:53.360
But there were many men and women in the societies
00:07:53.360 --> 00:07:56.560
of that time and age and before that, that were
00:07:56.560 --> 00:07:59.939
portrayed as. And the etymology of the word witch
00:07:59.939 --> 00:08:03.600
comes from the person who everyone came to for
00:08:03.600 --> 00:08:07.040
healing and help in some way. And I've talked
00:08:07.040 --> 00:08:08.819
about this before. One of the things I culturally
00:08:08.819 --> 00:08:12.779
love about whales in particular is that they
00:08:12.779 --> 00:08:16.519
had less witch trials during this time period.
00:08:16.560 --> 00:08:18.660
You know, King James and the witch trials that
00:08:18.660 --> 00:08:21.600
started at some point after this. We know about
00:08:21.600 --> 00:08:24.879
that history. But whales in particular, they
00:08:24.879 --> 00:08:27.860
did not see their witches. or whatever their
00:08:27.860 --> 00:08:30.319
word for witch is, the Swinrike, the cunning
00:08:30.319 --> 00:08:33.080
women, they did not see them as evil in any way.
00:08:33.179 --> 00:08:35.519
In fact, they saw them as the person you would
00:08:35.519 --> 00:08:39.740
go to if you were having a problem. Like, instead
00:08:39.740 --> 00:08:42.899
of blaming the witches for cursing the land and
00:08:42.899 --> 00:08:45.980
the crops are dying or the cows are dying or
00:08:45.980 --> 00:08:48.460
whatever, you know, might be going on, rather
00:08:48.460 --> 00:08:50.440
than blaming the witches, they would have blamed
00:08:50.440 --> 00:08:53.360
the Fae. And they would have gone to a witch
00:08:53.360 --> 00:08:57.809
to ask for help. And I think Agnes' character
00:08:57.809 --> 00:09:00.909
in this movie perfectly portrays that type of
00:09:00.909 --> 00:09:04.009
person where she had wisdom passed down to her.
00:09:04.429 --> 00:09:07.490
Her and her brother commiserate over like the
00:09:07.490 --> 00:09:09.929
wise words that their mother had spoken to them
00:09:09.929 --> 00:09:13.070
and how they were taught how to use herbs and
00:09:13.070 --> 00:09:16.169
medicines and help women give birth and things
00:09:16.169 --> 00:09:20.149
like that. You see that come out in them and
00:09:20.149 --> 00:09:23.029
then she's teaching it and that's how she nurtures
00:09:23.029 --> 00:09:27.240
her own children. Yeah. She's intuitive. She
00:09:27.240 --> 00:09:30.700
has visions. She trusts her visions. She's not
00:09:30.700 --> 00:09:32.940
somebody who's like, I think I saw something
00:09:32.940 --> 00:09:35.000
in a dream, but I don't know. That's a little
00:09:35.000 --> 00:09:39.299
weird. She's like, no, I saw this. This is what's
00:09:39.299 --> 00:09:41.200
going to happen. I don't know how it's going
00:09:41.200 --> 00:09:43.879
to come about, but I do know that I saw two people
00:09:43.879 --> 00:09:48.600
at my deathbed. Or, you know, she has these premonitions
00:09:48.600 --> 00:09:51.299
and then she just goes with it. And she's confident
00:09:51.299 --> 00:09:54.940
in what she believes. I just love this movie
00:09:54.940 --> 00:09:59.019
for all of that element. I'm a big fan of Shakespeare,
00:09:59.200 --> 00:10:02.679
you know, being a theater person. Yeah. Shakespeare
00:10:02.679 --> 00:10:08.600
did some cool stuff. Oh, yeah. But, I mean, we've
00:10:08.600 --> 00:10:11.019
praised him enough. Do we think maybe, like,
00:10:11.019 --> 00:10:14.200
over the centuries? Exactly. And we can get into
00:10:14.200 --> 00:10:16.539
all the conspiracies about Shakespeare, who he
00:10:16.539 --> 00:10:19.159
was, was it one man, was it a woman, was it multiple
00:10:19.159 --> 00:10:21.039
people? Like, there's all these questions and
00:10:21.039 --> 00:10:24.299
all this stuff. You know, Do you think, do you
00:10:24.299 --> 00:10:26.779
have premonitions? Is premonitions, are those
00:10:26.779 --> 00:10:29.580
common? Or can we just call dreams a premonition?
00:10:30.100 --> 00:10:32.100
I mean, sometimes they are a dream. Some people,
00:10:32.159 --> 00:10:36.799
that's how they receive their downloads, if you
00:10:36.799 --> 00:10:39.279
will. I text you over the weekend. I had a dream
00:10:39.279 --> 00:10:41.279
about me and you. Oh, yeah, we haven't talked
00:10:41.279 --> 00:10:44.259
about that. No. I was going to ask you, what
00:10:44.259 --> 00:10:48.120
was that about? I have no clue. So you had a
00:10:48.120 --> 00:10:50.539
dream. Tell us about this. Let me text. Let me
00:10:50.539 --> 00:10:53.779
read the text that I sent you here because. I
00:10:53.779 --> 00:10:55.740
was a little busy hanging out at prom with your
00:10:55.740 --> 00:10:57.919
wife. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And I was texting
00:10:57.919 --> 00:11:00.379
you while you were out at prom with my wife.
00:11:00.799 --> 00:11:04.340
Yeah. Yeah. But I had a dream. And here it is.
00:11:04.399 --> 00:11:07.279
I said I had a dream that me and you talked about
00:11:07.279 --> 00:11:11.600
back rooms. Like super vivid to the point I actually
00:11:11.600 --> 00:11:15.279
had to look up our recordings and see. I went.
00:11:15.299 --> 00:11:17.460
I did. I got up. It was like middle of the night.
00:11:17.519 --> 00:11:19.559
I went up. I was like, did we talk about this
00:11:19.559 --> 00:11:23.139
or not? We actually were filming this in the
00:11:23.139 --> 00:11:24.679
back rooms. Now, I don't know if you're familiar
00:11:24.679 --> 00:11:27.179
with the back rooms yet, but you will be soon.
00:11:27.659 --> 00:11:29.980
Yeah. Let's just leave it at that. All right.
00:11:30.000 --> 00:11:32.480
Let's leave it at that. The back rooms are coming.
00:11:33.259 --> 00:11:35.759
There's an A24 movie coming called Back Rooms
00:11:35.759 --> 00:11:40.919
also. Oh. May 29th. And back rooms are a different
00:11:40.919 --> 00:11:43.940
genre. It's a new genre. I don't want to take
00:11:43.940 --> 00:11:46.289
away from Hamnet, though. Back to that movie.
00:11:46.389 --> 00:11:49.929
A dream? Yeah. Okay, so I do think information
00:11:49.929 --> 00:11:51.889
comes through dreams. And I think that if you're
00:11:51.889 --> 00:11:56.009
really good at deciphering, this dream felt like
00:11:56.009 --> 00:11:58.549
it meant something. There was a message behind
00:11:58.549 --> 00:12:00.850
it. Sometimes you can even feel that the dream
00:12:00.850 --> 00:12:03.809
didn't come from you. And I don't know how to
00:12:03.809 --> 00:12:06.309
explain that any other way. Just that I know
00:12:06.309 --> 00:12:11.159
that dream wasn't me. Wasn't my subconscious.
00:12:11.460 --> 00:12:14.440
It was like a download from the collective consciousness
00:12:14.440 --> 00:12:17.820
or something. Is that channeling? Is that what
00:12:17.820 --> 00:12:20.220
channeling is? Is that different? What is this?
00:12:20.759 --> 00:12:23.559
I mean, there might be some people wiser than
00:12:23.559 --> 00:12:27.379
me and in a different way that would say it's
00:12:27.379 --> 00:12:29.340
different or that there's different. I don't
00:12:29.340 --> 00:12:31.559
think so. I think that the channels in which
00:12:31.559 --> 00:12:34.720
something comes from the ether, the collective
00:12:34.720 --> 00:12:36.139
consciousness, whatever you want to call it,
00:12:36.159 --> 00:12:40.110
the universe, it's coming. In just different
00:12:40.110 --> 00:12:43.250
ways. I think people can feel it in their body.
00:12:43.389 --> 00:12:47.250
They can hear it through their clear audience.
00:12:47.669 --> 00:12:49.789
You know, there's different gifts that we receive
00:12:49.789 --> 00:12:52.490
information. But I think it's about developing
00:12:52.490 --> 00:12:54.690
those gifts and being more into it, allowing
00:12:54.690 --> 00:12:57.009
yourself to be trusting your intuition. Like,
00:12:57.070 --> 00:13:00.769
I feel this in my gut. I feel that this is, you
00:13:00.769 --> 00:13:02.590
know, I'm being led to this or I'm being told
00:13:02.590 --> 00:13:05.840
this or however it comes to you. And I think
00:13:05.840 --> 00:13:07.440
it can come to people a lot of different ways.
00:13:07.600 --> 00:13:10.980
I don't think there's anybody more gifted than
00:13:10.980 --> 00:13:14.700
anyone else. I think there's people who develop
00:13:14.700 --> 00:13:17.639
the gifts, who develop the skills, and who lean
00:13:17.639 --> 00:13:19.539
into it. I think there are others who are like,
00:13:19.639 --> 00:13:21.879
I don't know anything about that. Woo -woo is
00:13:21.879 --> 00:13:24.840
weird to me. And they're not interested in developing
00:13:24.840 --> 00:13:27.679
those gifts. You mentioned the universe playing
00:13:27.679 --> 00:13:30.500
a part in this. And I think it did because you
00:13:30.500 --> 00:13:32.899
got all this stuff going on. And the real gut
00:13:32.899 --> 00:13:37.139
punch is... Tell me this doesn't feel like a
00:13:37.139 --> 00:13:41.179
modern thriller slash drama. You know, you get
00:13:41.179 --> 00:13:44.399
the plague creeping through England and it's
00:13:44.399 --> 00:13:48.519
not an if, it's a when. You got Hamnet, the boy,
00:13:48.639 --> 00:13:52.759
and his twin, Judith, sister, getting sick. They
00:13:52.759 --> 00:13:55.679
try to trick death. You ever try to bargain with
00:13:55.679 --> 00:13:59.299
the universe? take me not them that's what this
00:13:59.299 --> 00:14:02.519
11 year old kid does it's what him does and here
00:14:02.519 --> 00:14:06.220
we go the universe being the cold -hearted bitch
00:14:06.220 --> 00:14:10.500
that it can be says deal yeah and that's what
00:14:10.500 --> 00:14:13.019
happens so think about what happens after this
00:14:13.019 --> 00:14:15.879
is there survivor's guilt that kicks in living
00:14:15.879 --> 00:14:18.639
in that house you know does judith feel like
00:14:18.639 --> 00:14:21.639
she's only half of a set that's left because
00:14:21.639 --> 00:14:24.669
she lost this What happened in that scene?
That
00:14:24.669 --> 00:14:26.769
scene's incredible, by the way. It's about halfway
00:14:26.769 --> 00:14:31.389
in the movie when they try to trick Death and,
00:14:31.529 --> 00:14:35.049
yeah, Death takes Hamnet. There's an X -Files
00:14:35.049 --> 00:14:39.649
episode about that. There is, right? It's occurring
00:14:39.649 --> 00:14:43.370
to me just now. I'm like, you see Death coming
00:14:43.370 --> 00:14:47.470
for you and you turn your head. Scully is going
00:14:47.470 --> 00:14:50.850
to live forever because she turned her eyes away
00:14:50.850 --> 00:14:55.919
from Death. This is a powerful story because
00:14:55.919 --> 00:14:59.879
it doesn't just give us the snapshot of the Shakespeare
00:14:59.879 --> 00:15:02.519
family and what happened to them. It's about
00:15:02.519 --> 00:15:06.519
this trauma and grief that shatters and ripples
00:15:06.519 --> 00:15:10.600
through, you know, generations. I truly believe,
00:15:10.799 --> 00:15:14.179
and, you know, some people talk about this in
00:15:14.179 --> 00:15:16.200
the witch community of, like, the witch wound.
00:15:16.320 --> 00:15:18.600
Things that happened in that period of time.
00:15:19.279 --> 00:15:24.019
This was pre... witch hunt, witch trial time.
00:15:24.259 --> 00:15:27.440
But it was still like, you know, Christianity
00:15:27.440 --> 00:15:29.779
being what it was at that time, it was creeping
00:15:29.779 --> 00:15:34.059
in, right? Like, no, King Henry VIII was also
00:15:34.059 --> 00:15:38.000
suspicious of witchcraft and would accuse and
00:15:38.000 --> 00:15:42.159
behead those that he felt were using malicious
00:15:42.159 --> 00:15:45.139
witchcraft against him. So it was creeping in
00:15:45.139 --> 00:15:46.740
as something that people were starting to fear.
00:15:47.440 --> 00:15:52.539
You know, this... plague i mean so many people
00:15:52.539 --> 00:15:55.639
losing family members how can that not ripple
00:15:55.639 --> 00:15:57.519
through the generations afterwards of people
00:15:57.519 --> 00:16:02.139
losing children and you know holding their own
00:16:02.139 --> 00:16:04.120
child in their arms while they died i mean it's
00:16:04.120 --> 00:16:09.779
just oh the heaviness and tragedy of it so powerful
00:16:09.779 --> 00:16:14.139
yeah that agnes shares and william as well i
00:16:14.139 --> 00:16:17.440
mean that they share in this he's kind of a little
00:16:17.440 --> 00:16:19.200
bit removed because he's living in london you
00:16:19.200 --> 00:16:22.250
know writing plays and doing that removed from
00:16:22.250 --> 00:16:24.429
his family. And we know that, but there's this
00:16:24.429 --> 00:16:26.250
connection with them. There's this connection.
00:16:26.250 --> 00:16:29.409
And that that scene at the end where they share
00:16:29.409 --> 00:16:31.429
in that grief, where she realizes he wrote this
00:16:31.429 --> 00:16:35.169
play Hamlet in honor of their son. And she's
00:16:35.169 --> 00:16:38.070
on the edge of the stage reaching out for him.
00:16:38.110 --> 00:16:41.909
Oh my gosh. I get chills all over my body. How
00:16:41.909 --> 00:16:44.669
can you not? It's hard, but let's, let's talk
00:16:44.669 --> 00:16:47.049
about will. And you said it like he's living
00:16:47.049 --> 00:16:50.159
in London. He's becoming the bard. Yeah, he's
00:16:50.159 --> 00:16:53.740
the original himself. He's the original. I'm
00:16:53.740 --> 00:16:56.600
doing this for the family dad who was never actually
00:16:56.600 --> 00:17:00.980
with the family. You know, how many of us have
00:17:00.980 --> 00:17:03.919
used the hustle or the career as a shield from
00:17:03.919 --> 00:17:07.500
keeping from dealing with heavy stuff at home?
00:17:07.819 --> 00:17:10.380
He's writing. Think about this. Think about this.
00:17:10.519 --> 00:17:15.539
He is writing fucking comedies while his son
00:17:15.539 --> 00:17:20.240
is being buried. Is he a genius? yeah is he a
00:17:20.240 --> 00:17:23.180
deadbeat maybe a little bit you know i think
00:17:23.180 --> 00:17:25.980
so but it's the tension we all feel for sure
00:17:25.980 --> 00:17:28.880
i mean yeah i mean this is where you go back
00:17:28.880 --> 00:17:31.460
to the conversation we've had before about uh
00:17:31.460 --> 00:17:35.359
about mothers and fathers who are artists or
00:17:35.359 --> 00:17:39.960
passionate dreamers ambitious people life in
00:17:39.960 --> 00:17:42.259
in what's portrayed in this movie and book is
00:17:42.259 --> 00:17:45.819
that he didn't want to be a simple you know glove
00:17:45.819 --> 00:17:47.880
maker or tradesman or anything like that. He
00:17:47.880 --> 00:17:49.940
had these ambitions and dreams, right? He had
00:17:49.940 --> 00:17:52.640
these stories to tell. He wanted to be on the
00:17:52.640 --> 00:17:55.259
stage or behind the scenes of the stage, writing
00:17:55.259 --> 00:17:58.140
the words that he wrote. And you see all this
00:17:58.140 --> 00:18:00.819
like passion and I have to be in London. I have
00:18:00.819 --> 00:18:04.160
to be there. And she's like, I can't be there,
00:18:04.240 --> 00:18:06.819
but I know you have to be there and I will support
00:18:06.819 --> 00:18:08.839
you. Right. So she's going to stay home, raise
00:18:08.839 --> 00:18:11.720
the kids out in the countryside. She's going
00:18:11.720 --> 00:18:14.680
to sacrifice having her husband there and available.
00:18:15.669 --> 00:18:17.910
but knowing that this is what he's got to do.
00:18:18.670 --> 00:18:21.029
How many times have we seen a story like that?
00:18:21.130 --> 00:18:23.369
And I'm glad it focuses on her in this movie
00:18:23.369 --> 00:18:26.130
because, again, we're going back to Mother's
00:18:26.130 --> 00:18:29.849
Day themed, but she made the sacrifices to make
00:18:29.849 --> 00:18:34.029
the family work. And so he, you know, even in
00:18:34.029 --> 00:18:36.009
losing his son, but not just in losing his son,
00:18:36.029 --> 00:18:41.250
in day -to -day
parenting life, he gets to kind
00:18:41.250 --> 00:18:43.670
of avoid it, right? He gets to see London writing.
00:18:45.590 --> 00:18:49.650
He talked about channeling. He can channel and
00:18:49.650 --> 00:18:53.630
transmute that grief energy and probably a lot
00:18:53.630 --> 00:18:57.869
of guilt. Yep. Of not being there, not being
00:18:57.869 --> 00:19:01.269
with his kids and not being there for his son's
00:19:01.269 --> 00:19:04.369
last moments. All these things channels it into
00:19:04.369 --> 00:19:08.690
the art. Yeah. Hamlet. Right. And I think that's
00:19:08.690 --> 00:19:11.410
it. I think that's a tension that we all feel,
00:19:11.589 --> 00:19:14.789
you know, trying to build a legacy. while the
00:19:14.789 --> 00:19:18.650
foundation is cracking under our own feet. He's
00:19:18.650 --> 00:19:22.430
trying to leave a mark. People trying to leave
00:19:22.430 --> 00:19:25.450
a mark, you don't need to try so hard sometimes.
00:19:26.329 --> 00:19:29.730
Yeah. There's no real winning at it, or there's
00:19:29.730 --> 00:19:32.650
no real right or wrong way to do it. No. I mean,
00:19:32.670 --> 00:19:34.930
you can give a lot of criticism to somebody like
00:19:34.930 --> 00:19:36.289
William Shakespeare and be like, you abandoned
00:19:36.289 --> 00:19:40.089
your family to go be a big star in London. But
00:19:40.089 --> 00:19:44.000
then also, he's Shakespeare. Exactly. And that's
00:19:44.000 --> 00:19:48.220
where I'm going to go, because he's got art,
00:19:48.279 --> 00:19:50.940
and it's basically an exorcism, if you think
00:19:50.940 --> 00:19:53.099
about it. I mean, four years later, he writes
00:19:53.099 --> 00:19:57.559
Hamlet, not Hamnet, after his son Hamlet. People
00:19:57.559 --> 00:20:00.619
think it's about the Prince of Denmark. I think
00:20:00.619 --> 00:20:03.019
it's a seance. You know, imagine being Agnes.
00:20:03.160 --> 00:20:06.019
You lost your son. Your husband has been gone
00:20:06.019 --> 00:20:09.359
for years. And then you hear he's written a play
00:20:09.359 --> 00:20:13.710
called... Exactly the name of your dead kids.
00:20:14.329 --> 00:20:18.650
Yeah. You're not going to just cast that as to
00:20:18.650 --> 00:20:20.289
the side. You're going to go to the theater.
00:20:20.690 --> 00:20:23.450
You go see your husband on a stage playing the
00:20:23.450 --> 00:20:27.289
ghost. The father is the ghost. And the son Hamlet
00:20:27.289 --> 00:20:29.690
is the one left behind. He literally swapped
00:20:29.690 --> 00:20:33.089
their fates on stage so he could talk to his
00:20:33.089 --> 00:20:37.630
son one more time. That's beautiful, right? I
00:20:37.630 --> 00:20:40.230
don't think I've ever seen Shakespeare performed.
00:20:41.099 --> 00:20:43.460
so well than that scene right there i mean yeah
00:20:43.460 --> 00:20:46.380
because there was all this new information behind
00:20:46.380 --> 00:20:49.559
it that just made you your stomach and your heart
00:20:49.559 --> 00:20:52.160
drop and this is the thing about shakespeare
00:20:52.160 --> 00:20:55.640
because a lot of people can have their thoughts
00:20:55.640 --> 00:20:58.960
about it yeah it'd be really boring it can be
00:20:58.960 --> 00:21:02.079
really awful to sit through trust me i know i
00:21:02.079 --> 00:21:04.599
was in theater for many years sometimes it can
00:21:04.599 --> 00:21:09.400
just be like oh yeah but when it's performed
00:21:10.289 --> 00:21:15.450
really well. It is fantastic. We have the Cedar
00:21:15.450 --> 00:21:18.170
City, the Shakespeare Festival here in Utah every
00:21:18.170 --> 00:21:21.450
year, and sometimes those performances are just
00:21:21.450 --> 00:21:24.450
above and beyond. Just absolutely amazing. I
00:21:24.450 --> 00:21:27.190
gotta point out, I love the one scene there when
00:21:27.190 --> 00:21:29.630
they're on the stage in the middle -ish of the
00:21:29.630 --> 00:21:33.670
movie, and he's got two of the actors, two of
00:21:33.670 --> 00:21:36.609
the players, and they're doing the lines back
00:21:36.609 --> 00:21:38.890
and forth, and he keeps saying, again, again.
00:21:39.750 --> 00:21:43.109
Again. And finally, he says, you're just basically
00:21:43.109 --> 00:21:45.549
I'm paraphrasing. He says, you're just saying
00:21:45.549 --> 00:21:49.250
these words. Yeah. Like and I felt that I'm like,
00:21:49.329 --> 00:21:51.130
yeah, you're right. You've got to feel this.
00:21:51.230 --> 00:21:54.309
You can't just be reciting because that's where
00:21:54.309 --> 00:21:56.369
you fall into what you're talking about. And
00:21:56.369 --> 00:21:59.329
it's boring as hell. I'd rather watch paint dry
00:21:59.329 --> 00:22:03.150
or grass grow. You know, like language. I mean,
00:22:03.150 --> 00:22:06.210
gosh, just just to think about how he came up
00:22:06.210 --> 00:22:09.279
with. basically making poetry out of everyday
00:22:09.279 --> 00:22:12.259
conversation. And it's just incredible, really.
00:22:12.559 --> 00:22:16.059
After watching this movie, we watched the Leonardo
00:22:16.059 --> 00:22:19.539
DiCaprio, Romeo and Juliet. And I made my 11
00:22:19.539 --> 00:22:20.819
-year -old watch it with me. And I was like,
00:22:20.920 --> 00:22:27.440
you need to know how incredible these words actually
00:22:27.440 --> 00:22:30.559
are. And that movie is one really great way to
00:22:30.559 --> 00:22:33.319
see how that comes to play. What an incredible
00:22:33.319 --> 00:22:35.619
movie. What an incredible soundtrack for that
00:22:35.619 --> 00:22:40.849
movie as well. Oh, I know. Yeah. 90s. Yeah. We
00:22:40.849 --> 00:22:42.309
can get into more about William Shakespeare,
00:22:42.349 --> 00:22:46.170
but back to Agnes, the mother, and this incredible
00:22:46.170 --> 00:22:51.049
portrayal of somebody who just, if this is how
00:22:51.049 --> 00:22:54.970
she really was, she deserves all this spotlight
00:22:54.970 --> 00:22:59.730
on her in this movie to show. The wisdom that
00:22:59.730 --> 00:23:03.349
she had, the connection to nature, the nurturing
00:23:03.349 --> 00:23:05.950
mothering that she was giving her children, everything
00:23:05.950 --> 00:23:12.329
about her just, it felt like home to me. Or what
00:23:12.329 --> 00:23:15.670
I wanted. Yeah. You know, what I wanted to feel.
00:23:15.849 --> 00:23:18.950
And I wanted to be more like her as a mother
00:23:18.950 --> 00:23:21.809
in this movie. I want my kids to gather around
00:23:21.809 --> 00:23:26.289
so I can show them how to smell. the time and
00:23:26.289 --> 00:23:28.849
Rosemary in the garden and what it's for. And,
00:23:28.869 --> 00:23:31.150
you know, these medicines that grow from nature
00:23:31.150 --> 00:23:34.829
and the way she, when she was getting ready to
00:23:34.829 --> 00:23:37.890
give birth to her first child and she had to
00:23:37.890 --> 00:23:42.349
be in the woods, she had to be, that was so incredible.
00:23:42.470 --> 00:23:44.730
Back to that, like primal, you know, urge to
00:23:44.730 --> 00:23:47.490
be in nature and be around animals. We were talking
00:23:47.490 --> 00:23:49.670
about going to the zoo for Mother's Day. I'm
00:23:49.670 --> 00:23:53.960
like that. Makes sense to me. When they tried
00:23:53.960 --> 00:23:56.279
to keep her from it in her second birth and they
00:23:56.279 --> 00:23:57.880
were like, no, you can't go out there. It's literally
00:23:57.880 --> 00:23:59.619
flooding out there. You can't go to the woods.
00:23:59.740 --> 00:24:03.960
And she's like, I have to be in the woods. I
00:24:03.960 --> 00:24:08.500
just felt that everywhere. Yeah. You do like
00:24:08.500 --> 00:24:14.640
the woods. I do. I loved the imagery. And you
00:24:14.640 --> 00:24:16.279
kind of got a feel for that. Like you talked
00:24:16.279 --> 00:24:19.339
about like the dirty feeling. I wonder if it
00:24:19.339 --> 00:24:21.079
was a conscious choice. It probably was. Obviously,
00:24:21.079 --> 00:24:23.019
everything with movie making was a conscious
00:24:23.019 --> 00:24:26.119
choice. But, you know, more in the house or in
00:24:26.119 --> 00:24:28.940
civilization, it felt dirty. But you notice how
00:24:28.940 --> 00:24:30.400
different it felt when they went out into the
00:24:30.400 --> 00:24:33.680
woods? It was green. It was clean. It was, even
00:24:33.680 --> 00:24:36.079
if it was raining and wet, it was somewhere I
00:24:36.079 --> 00:24:39.460
still wanted to be. Yes, I did notice. Had to
00:24:39.460 --> 00:24:42.200
be conscious. There's no way in hell I would
00:24:42.200 --> 00:24:44.160
ever want to be in the streets anywhere near
00:24:44.160 --> 00:24:48.779
Stratford -upon -Avon. No way. Yeah. What do
00:24:48.779 --> 00:24:50.720
they call them? The chamber pots? Yeah. Yeah.
00:24:51.079 --> 00:24:53.720
No way. It was just like chamber pots being dumped
00:24:53.720 --> 00:24:56.519
out the window into the streets. Yeah. No, no,
00:24:56.559 --> 00:24:58.680
no. Thank you. You know who I just thought about
00:24:58.680 --> 00:25:02.920
was great at performing Shakespeare? Will Friedle
00:25:02.920 --> 00:25:05.599
in Boy Meets World. Remember the episode that
00:25:05.599 --> 00:25:08.539
he. Yeah. Everybody out of the water. And that's
00:25:08.539 --> 00:25:11.059
real. I mean, sure, he's doing it great on the
00:25:11.059 --> 00:25:15.099
show, but he actually performed it. really really
00:25:15.099 --> 00:25:17.519
well i there's there's probably tons of people
00:25:17.519 --> 00:25:20.500
that can perform shakespeare shakespeare really
00:25:20.500 --> 00:25:24.720
well uh but there are a lot more who can perform
00:25:24.720 --> 00:25:29.279
it way way too bad and yeah there can be some
00:25:29.279 --> 00:25:32.440
stiff performances for sure and i have um you
00:25:32.440 --> 00:25:34.660
know we talked about this before on the on the
00:25:34.660 --> 00:25:38.500
podcast but uh i have judged high school drama
00:25:38.500 --> 00:25:40.880
for many years and sometimes you get assigned
00:25:40.880 --> 00:25:44.390
classic scenes And I'm not going to lie. I'm
00:25:44.390 --> 00:25:49.210
a little bit like, okay. Yeah. All right. We're
00:25:49.210 --> 00:25:50.309
going to be listening to a lot of Shakespeare
00:25:50.309 --> 00:25:54.950
today or whatever, you know, sit down. But honestly,
00:25:55.130 --> 00:25:57.769
sometimes it is a little bit like, all right,
00:25:57.869 --> 00:26:00.130
there's some work to be done here. But sometimes
00:26:00.130 --> 00:26:02.450
it's incredible. Sometimes those kids, even high
00:26:02.450 --> 00:26:06.109
school kids, can just pull it together and perform
00:26:06.109 --> 00:26:09.980
like nothing else. And I'm like. Fantastic job.
00:26:10.099 --> 00:26:13.299
Way to go for kind of getting it, like getting
00:26:13.299 --> 00:26:17.160
Shakespeare and portraying it in a way that we
00:26:17.160 --> 00:26:21.660
can understand. And I did see my favorite Shakespeare
00:26:21.660 --> 00:26:24.180
play, Midsummer Night's Dream, at the Globe Theatre
00:26:24.180 --> 00:26:28.539
in London when I was there in 1923. Check that
00:26:28.539 --> 00:26:31.339
off my bucket list. Nice. Did it smell awful?
00:26:31.519 --> 00:26:33.779
Did they still throw the chamber pots in the
00:26:33.779 --> 00:26:35.789
street? What was it going on there? No, it's
00:26:35.789 --> 00:26:37.829
great. It's clean. It's wonderful. They serve
00:26:37.829 --> 00:26:41.450
food. I actually had a seat under the awning,
00:26:41.589 --> 00:26:43.930
but you know, it's, it's built like the old globe
00:26:43.930 --> 00:26:46.289
theater. So the middle is totally exposed to
00:26:46.289 --> 00:26:48.490
the elements and it was raining that day. Oh,
00:26:48.630 --> 00:26:50.769
it felt bad for the people who are standing by
00:26:50.769 --> 00:26:53.049
the stage. Just like you see in the movie Hamnet
00:26:53.049 --> 00:26:55.650
at the end, she, she's right there in the front
00:26:55.650 -->
00:26:58.349
of the stage. People really do stand in the center.
00:26:58.410 --> 00:27:00.690
Like there's no, there's no seats there. Yeah.
00:27:00.750 --> 00:27:06.900
So for two hours, the play that that's how important
00:27:06.900 --> 00:27:11.140
it is to get the entertainment of the day. So
00:27:11.140 --> 00:27:13.660
what's, what's your final thoughts here on him?
00:27:13.720 --> 00:27:20.460
I know, I know. Just remember that witches portrayed
00:27:20.460 --> 00:27:24.180
in this movie is the absolute epitome of what
00:27:24.180 --> 00:27:27.819
I consider to be the witch. Okay. Just have had
00:27:27.819 --> 00:27:31.119
such a negative bias, witchcraft, anything like
00:27:31.119 --> 00:27:35.599
that. for so many centuries now that it is really
00:27:35.599 --> 00:27:38.700
time to look at this movie. Even if it's not
00:27:38.700 --> 00:27:41.500
as accurate as people, it wouldn't have been
00:27:41.500 --> 00:27:43.180
like that in that time. She would have been more
00:27:43.180 --> 00:27:45.799
of a Christian woman. Okay, fine. Because there
00:27:45.799 --> 00:27:48.319
are plenty of Christian witches. Doesn't matter.
00:27:48.740 --> 00:27:52.440
The point is, these are the people in your community
00:27:52.440 --> 00:27:56.160
that you would go to for help, for advice, for
00:27:56.160 --> 00:27:59.220
healing. So when I call myself a witch in the
00:27:59.220 --> 00:28:02.589
community, I... wear that as a badge of honor
00:28:02.589 --> 00:28:05.890
and if i call someone a witch or if i say hey
00:28:05.890 --> 00:28:09.509
that's witchcraft that you just did it's an honorable
00:28:09.509 --> 00:28:13.130
thing i'm talking about and i want that to be
00:28:13.130 --> 00:28:16.089
changed eventually i want movies like this to
00:28:16.089 --> 00:28:19.609
show that that is a real thing there is nothing
00:28:19.609 --> 00:28:22.690
magical or fictional about that in movies like
00:28:22.690 --> 00:28:26.650
this this is what we are engaging with and i've
00:28:26.650 --> 00:28:30.519
had some recent I don't know, pushback on using
00:28:30.519 --> 00:28:32.200
words like witch and witchcraft where people
00:28:32.200 --> 00:28:35.440
are like, well, you know, some people really
00:28:35.440 --> 00:28:37.299
don't like that word. And I'm like, too bad.
00:28:37.740 --> 00:28:40.220
Because guess what? You're doing witchcraft and
00:28:40.220 --> 00:28:42.819
you're doing witchcraft and you're doing, everybody's
00:28:42.819 --> 00:28:45.819
doing witchcraft, guys. How many of you are lighting
00:28:45.819 --> 00:28:49.519
candles and making wishes? Please, come on. It's
00:28:49.519 --> 00:28:51.740
witchcraft. So that's my soapbox for the day.
00:28:51.779 --> 00:28:54.759
I loved this movie. Oh, you're going to get some
00:28:54.759 --> 00:28:57.220
people coming at you for that. We're all practicing
00:28:57.220 --> 00:28:59.519
witchcraft. I guarantee they're going to be coming
00:28:59.519 --> 00:29:04.119
out of the woodwork. All these witchcrafts, all
00:29:04.119 --> 00:29:06.960
of the rituals and rites, all of the, you know,
00:29:06.960 --> 00:29:09.940
you can pull something else if you want, but
00:29:09.940 --> 00:29:11.920
it's still witchcraft. You heard it right here.
00:29:11.980 --> 00:29:13.980
When you put that birthday candle on your cake
00:29:13.980 --> 00:29:15.920
and you blow it out, that's witchcraft, folks.
00:29:16.079 --> 00:29:20.039
Yes. We're going to get a lot of people heated.
00:29:20.480 --> 00:29:23.700
I loved Hamnet. Go check it out. It's on Peacock.
00:29:24.359 --> 00:29:27.660
Peacock put that out. I'll watch it again. It's
00:29:27.660 --> 00:29:29.240
one of those. They'll probably start showing
00:29:29.240 --> 00:29:31.740
this one in schools. Maybe. I don't know. You
00:29:31.740 --> 00:29:35.799
have to be, you know, it'll be controversial
00:29:35.799 --> 00:29:39.579
if they do. But once again, what books in schools
00:29:39.579 --> 00:29:42.299
aren't already controversial these days that
00:29:42.299 --> 00:29:45.359
they're already teaching. So I loved it. I thought
00:29:45.359 --> 00:29:48.519
it was great. Go watch Hamnet. And for the freaks
00:29:48.519 --> 00:29:52.599
out there, you know. When have you had to bury
00:29:52.599 --> 00:29:57.519
something to make something bigger, to make something
00:29:57.519 --> 00:29:59.420
great? When did you have to let something go?
00:29:59.960 --> 00:30:02.599
Yeah. When did you take a loss and turn it into
00:30:02.599 --> 00:30:05.799
art? Maybe not to a level of Shakespeare making
00:30:05.799 --> 00:30:11.700
Hamlet, but where's your Hamlet? Freaks out there.
00:30:11.720 --> 00:30:13.460
This is Parallel Frequencies. I am just playing.
00:30:13.640 --> 00:30:16.319
She is Coco. You are the freaks. We will see
00:30:16.319 --> 00:30:16.960
you on the other side.