Полная расшифровка выпуска 401: Climate Communication

of came on later in life? 00:02:13.759 --> 00:02:16.240 For for me, it definitely came on later in life. 00:02:16.400 --> 00:02:28.479 I think a lot of people in the environmental space, although there's a million routes that people take to get into the environmental space, I think for a lot of people it stems from early childhood connection with nature. 00:02:28.560 --> 00:02:30.879 Uh, and I did not have much of that. 00:02:31.039 --> 00:02:32.800 I grew up in Louisville, Kentucky. 00:02:32.960 --> 00:02:36.240 Um, the most we got outdoors was tailgates for football games. 00:02:36.319 --> 00:02:38.719 Uh, we were very much like a sports family. 00:02:38.879 --> 00:02:40.479 Um, we didn't do camping. 00:02:40.719 --> 00:02:50.719 I remember romping around in the woods by our house, which was really outdoorsy, but I never really kind of immersed myself in nature until much later in life. 00:02:50.879 --> 00:02:55.199 And so I would say it was a pretty slow burn to getting into the environmental space. 00:02:55.360 --> 00:02:57.520 Uh, I studied biology in undergrad. 00:02:57.919 --> 00:03:00.639 And for me, it was all about going the medical route. 00:03:00.719 --> 00:03:05.439 It's what my parents told me I was gonna do, and so I was really adamant about doing it. 00:03:05.599 --> 00:03:08.800 Uh, but I realized I like talking about science a lot more than doing it. 00:03:08.960 --> 00:03:13.680 And it's also around that time that I started finding my love of the natural world and being outdoors more. 00:03:13.840 --> 00:03:20.240 And so after I graduated and started that pivot, it really just kind of fell one thing into the other. 00:03:20.479 --> 00:03:22.879 I really loved hiking and being outdoors. 00:03:23.039 --> 00:03:25.759 I really wanted to find a way to better protect the environment. 00:03:25.919 --> 00:03:29.680 Uh, and I also love talking about science, and so I found a way to marry those two. 00:03:30.000 --> 00:03:34.639 Was there a catalyst for that convergence for you? 00:03:34.719 --> 00:03:41.759 Like was, you know, because I'm sure there are many scientists and uh nature lovers that maybe don't put two and two together. 00:03:41.919 --> 00:03:50.800 Um, so was there anything specific that you saw or heard or, you know, learned that kind of put you on the path towards environmental? 00:03:51.599 --> 00:03:53.199 I would say a couple things. 00:03:53.360 --> 00:04:05.360 One was I went to school in San Francisco in the Bay Area, and I would go hiking up in mere woods, and standing around redwood trees is a remarkable experience. 00:04:05.520 --> 00:04:15.680 Like if I could get an experience for people around the world to immerse themselves in, it would be just to stand in a grove of redwoods for a little bit because it's an enlightening experience. 00:04:15.840 --> 00:04:21.040 Uh, and as someone who did not grow up with nature, it was very authentic to feel that kind of place. 00:04:21.199 --> 00:04:22.879 So I would say that was a big part of it. 00:04:22.959 --> 00:04:28.160 But then also my partner, my partner, uh, she studied conservation, conservation and development. 00:04:28.319 --> 00:04:44.399 She grew up very outdoors here in San Diego, loved the ocean, and she introduced me to a lot of sort of the concepts and foundations in the environmental space uh that really kind of piqued my interest and got me involved in it. 00:04:44.560 --> 00:04:57.360 And the last thing I'll add is I did um some environmental education with kids, and that is also a great experience if you want to uh really develop, I think, an appreciation for how closely linked we are to nature. 00:04:57.600 --> 00:05:07.360 Just watch kids out in the woods picking up rocks and investigating bugs and not no maliciousness, just curiosity and craving that connection. 00:05:07.519 --> 00:05:09.360 Um, that was also very formative. 00:05:09.600 --> 00:05:10.959 Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. 00:05:11.040 --> 00:05:16.319 And I'm I think it's probably something, myself included, that I haven't really had the opportunity to do. 00:05:16.480 --> 00:05:21.279 Um, I've done some education with kids, but I can imagine that getting outdoors. 00:05:21.439 --> 00:05:31.279 We also had another um individual named Kyle on the podcast that was Sustain SD, who does like gardening and composting work with schools and school-aged children. 00:05:31.439 --> 00:05:48.800 And he just talks about it very similarly in the way that they interact with the plants and the soil and that level of curiosity and connection that we either never had if you weren't outdoorsy, or lose as we get incorporated into this fast-paced, you know, technological concrete world. 00:05:49.120 --> 00:05:55.680 So the word sustainability means many different things, and it also means different things to different people. 00:05:55.839 --> 00:05:59.439 So I'm curious what the word sustainability means to you. 00:05:59.759 --> 00:06:00.000 Yeah. 00:06:00.160 --> 00:06:02.560 Yeah, sustainability to me is really a vision. 00:06:02.720 --> 00:06:06.800 It's a vision for the future that I think most of us want to live in. 00:06:06.879 --> 00:06:17.279 Uh, it's one that's more equitable, where humans and non-human nature are thriving, um, where we don't look around and kind of think, how did we get ourselves into this mess? 00:06:17.439 --> 00:06:20.959 But we look around and say, wow, what an incredible world we've created. 00:06:21.120 --> 00:06:26.240 And we know that it's going to be safe and be there for the next generation and many generations to come. 00:06:26.399 --> 00:06:29.519 So when I think of sustainability, it's very much a vision. 00:06:29.680 --> 00:06:35.600 Uh, and there's a great scientist, Catherine Hayhoe, who I'm sure has been mentioned on this many times. 00:06:35.759 --> 00:06:40.160 Um, she's an incredible scientist and also a great science communicator. 00:06:40.319 --> 00:06:51.759 And I was reading an older article

uh of which she was in, um, where she's talking a bit about how to communicate climate change to audiences that might be less receptive to it. 00:06:51.839 --> 00:07:03.360 Uh, and in there, when she was talking about sustainability, she really pointed out something that I think is important, which is when we talk about sustainability, I think we're often and intentionally talking about humans. 00:07:03.519 --> 00:07:08.800 I think nature will rebound, nature is resilient, life on the planet will continue. 00:07:08.959 --> 00:07:22.639 We're talking about making sure that humans can continue to thrive, that we're not in some post-apocalyptic world in a matter of decades, much less centuries, but that we're actually creating something that future generations can thrive in. 00:07:22.800 --> 00:07:26.079 So we're talking about sustainability of the human race oftentimes. 00:07:26.240 --> 00:07:27.040 And I think that's right. 00:07:27.120 --> 00:07:29.519 I think nature's resilient and will find a way regardless. 00:07:29.759 --> 00:07:30.079 Yes. 00:07:30.240 --> 00:07:33.199 And that has come up a couple of times on the podcast. 00:07:33.360 --> 00:07:46.959 Um, just really talking about, you know, it's the messaging for so many years, rightfully so, has been save the planet, you know, and and that message gets straight across what we're trying to accomplish. 00:07:47.120 --> 00:07:54.480 But at the end of the day, we're we really are trying to save humanity because the planet will survive, the planet will be here. 00:07:54.639 --> 00:08:03.279 Um, so it's really us that we're doing this for um in conjunction with you know all of the other beings uh and nature that exist currently. 00:08:04.560 --> 00:08:11.439 There's a lot of ways to look at environmental activism and a lot of approaches that we can take. 00:08:11.680 --> 00:08:29.040 Uh, we focus a lot on this podcast on individual action, and we'll talk about that um, you know, briefly right now, because I think most listeners are very interested in what they can do as individuals or maybe in their kind of more close-knit family, community, friends, um, which is always, always important. 00:08:29.199 --> 00:08:41.200 Another piece, of course, is the larger impactful uh corporate responsibility type approach that we don't talk about too much on this podcast, but I would like to get into with you as well. 00:08:41.279 --> 00:08:43.120 Um, so we'll start out with the individual steps. 00:08:43.200 --> 00:08:51.200 So, what do you think are the most important steps that an individual can take when they're looking for ways to be more environmentally friendly? 00:08:51.519 --> 00:08:58.960 Yeah, when I think about environmental action on an individual level, I really think usually in two boxes, direct and indirect. 00:08:59.120 --> 00:09:03.679 So directly, what can are the things that we can do to reduce our own emissions and our own life? 00:09:03.840 --> 00:09:17.440 And then indirect, what are the things that we can do as consumers or what powers do we have just as individuals that can influence the systems of which we are a part in order to get them to reduce their emissions? 00:09:17.519 --> 00:09:27.519 Um, and I'll talk about that category in a minute because that's actually for me, I think indirect action is is exciting and there's a lot uh of progress to be made there. 00:09:27.679 --> 00:09:33.519 But the direct things I think are things that a lot of people already intuitively know and is totally correct. 00:09:33.679 --> 00:09:42.080 So things like transportation, things like food, things like what you're doing in your home as far as energy consumption, those are really the three biggest. 00:09:42.320 --> 00:09:51.759 For most Americans, those are the three biggest, with transport typically being number one for most Americans as far as uh the emissions that they're individually generating. 00:09:52.000 --> 00:09:56.399 Uh, as far as solutions to those, I mean, transportation can be a tricky one. 00:09:56.639 --> 00:10:07.840 You know, with any individual action, you have to think about the person as a whole, what are they already doing, what circumstances do they have, um, what resources are available to them because it's not equitable. 00:10:07.919 --> 00:10:12.480 Uh, and a lot of solutions aren't going to be available to a lot of people. 00:10:12.639 --> 00:10:28.639 Um, but with transportation, trying to reduce how much you're driving or going electric, um, food, I know is one that you're passionate about, and we could do as much as you want on food because there's a lot nested within there uh in order to reduce our associated emissions. 00:10:28.799 --> 00:10:37.919 Uh, and then as far as our homes, um, you know, there's the obvious ones as far as solar panels and switching out appliances in your house. 00:10:38.080 --> 00:10:45.039 Um, but honestly, I think a lot of people overestimate how much you have to do around your house in order to reduce emissions. 00:10:45.200 --> 00:10:47.120 So those are sort of the three big ones. 00:10:47.759 --> 00:11:08.159 What impacts as individuals or the choices that we um make, whether it's consumerism, political action, um, the corporations that we choose to support, like how can we make a difference on this huge, huge problem that can be incredibly overwhelming? 00:11:08.240 --> 00:11:11.919 Um, and that obviously not one individual is going to change. 00:11:12.080 --> 00:11:14.000 So, what are some of the bigger things? 00:11:14.399 --> 00:11:15.679 Yeah, I I love that. 00:11:15.759 --> 00:11:20.080 And when I think of the bigger things, I think a lot in that bucket of indirect actions. 00:11:20.240 --> 00:11:24.000 And I think consumerism, to your point, that's totally kind of on that cusp. 00:11:24.080 --> 00:11:37.440 It's it's very direct, but then it also has indirect effects because in addition to reducing your own emissions by buying secondhand, by being more conscientious

as a consumer, you're also sending a market signal that those are the products that people want. 00:11:37.600 --> 00:11:44.879 And that's going to incentivize those companies to continue doing it and incentivize companies that are lagging to kind of pick up the slack. 00:11:45.039 --> 00:11:49.200 Um, so I I love indirect actions and they touch on those bigger things. 00:11:49.279 --> 00:11:56.240 And I think, you know, one that's close to home right now, just because we just had a report come out about it, is our banking habits. 00:11:56.399 --> 00:12:07.200 Uh, and so for a lot of people, when you have money in your bank account, which everyone listening, I hope you have copious amounts of it and you have a healthy financial uh situation. 00:12:07.679 --> 00:12:10.639 But for all the money in your bank account, it doesn't sit there. 00:12:10.799 --> 00:12:11.919 The bank uses that. 00:12:12.080 --> 00:12:24.159 And the reason that they can offer free checking accounts and all these benefits and interest benefits is because when your money's in there, they use it to invest in other things uh that they can make a return on. 00:12:24.320 --> 00:12:33.440 So they often invest in big companies, just like you might invest your own 401k or your own portfolio in order to help make that money grow. 00:12:33.759 --> 00:12:41.519 And I don't think most people think about it, but the bank that you bank with has a diversified portfolio. 00:12:41.600 --> 00:12:45.519 And that portfolio is going to be more or less carbon intensive depending on the bank. 00:12:45.679 --> 00:13:09.200 And so we just had a report come out called Saving for the Planet, um, which is looking at the top 10 most carbon-intensive banks in the United States and looking at how much of the money in those individual banks is being invested in carbon-intensive sectors like oil and gas expansion or uh misuse of food, land use, and agriculture space. 00:13:09.440 --> 00:13:23.039 And so what they found was that for the worst polluting banks, the banks that have the dirtiest portfolios, you could say, it's up to 30% of all of their investments are going to those industries. 00:13:23.200 --> 00:13:40.559 And so you have to imagine if you have, say,$10,000 in that particular bank, up to 30% of your hard-earned money, whether you are intending it to be used that way or not,$3,000 of it or so is being invested into carbon-intensive sectors that might not agree with your values. 00:13:40.720 --> 00:13:52.639 And so just switching your bank, which I think for a lot of people, especially nowadays with how easy it is online, is a relatively light lift, but can have a huge impact on your indirect carbon emissions. 00:13:53.200 --> 00:14:06.799 One of the findings that really struck me from the study is depending on where you bank, so the average across the 10 most carbon intensive was about like 19 to 20% of their portfolio is being invested in carbon intensive sectors. 00:14:06.960 --> 00:14:36.799 But what really made it sink home for me was I believe for the average American, so for every$1,000 that you have in a carbon-intensive bank, if you were to move that to a climate responsible bank that doesn't intentionally invest in the most carbon-intensive sectors, every$1,000 is about equivalent to the reduced emissions from a cross-country flight, like New York to Seattle cross-country flight every year. 00:14:36.960 --> 00:14:38.320 And that's per$1,000. 00:14:38.639 --> 00:14:53.360 So the more money you have, whether you're getting close to retirement and you have a lot more funds, whatever it is, or you're just getting started saving for retirement, the more funds that you can put into a bank, the more money you have, the bigger that impact is going to be in reducing the indirect emissions. 00:14:53.519 --> 00:14:58.000 And that's on top of sending a market signal to the bank as well, that you don't want to be a part of a bank. 00:14:58.159 --> 00:15:02.720 So you have power as someone who banks at that particular location. 00:15:02.960 --> 00:15:08.000 You can make demands of your bank to reduce the carbon intensity of their investments. 00:15:08.240 --> 00:15:11.519 And if they're not willing to do that, you can take your money elsewhere. 00:15:11.600 --> 00:15:13.279 And that sends a huge market signal. 00:15:13.440 --> 00:15:13.600 Yeah. 00:15:13.840 --> 00:15:24.480 But I think one of the things that I love about this solution as well is one of the rules of thumb that they found from the study was smaller local banks tend to be better. 00:15:24.639 --> 00:15:29.440 And that's just great because those are the banks that are also reinvesting that money back into the community. 00:15:29.600 --> 00:15:36.720 Yes, they're investing in other companies and trying to make a return as a bank, but they're also putting money into the community in a lot of ways. 00:15:36.879 --> 00:15:47.120 And there's great community credit unions and uh all sorts of small local banks that are doing great work, and you'd be supporting them on top of reducing your carbon intensity of your money. 00:15:47.200 --> 00:15:48.320 So it's a win-win. 00:15:48.559 --> 00:15:49.679 Yeah, you uh you beat me. 00:15:49.759 --> 00:15:50.240 You beat me. 00:15:50.320 --> 00:15:50.960 That was my next question. 00:15:51.200 --> 00:16:01.919 Was do you have any thoughts on credit unions local local banking institutions and and and why it's super important to consider that when you are um either looking to change banks or you know, looking for a new bank? 00:16:02.000 --> 00:16:11.519 Because for example, my personal banking currently is separate from my business banking, and I'm trying to kind of get that all in one spot, but it's a process, you know. 00:16:11.679 --> 00:16:16.879 Um, just like with everything that we talk about on here, every action that you can take, it does not happen overnight. 00:16:17.120 --> 00:16:20.559 And just thinking about it is the very first

step. 00:16:20.639 --> 00:16:23.440 Um, and that's more than many people will ever do. 00:16:23.600 --> 00:16:34.799 Um, so just encouraging people not to get overwhelmed by these things, but just to start your own research, start your own thought process so that when you are ready, you can make those decisions that will have a big impact. 00:16:34.960 --> 00:16:39.679 So, any other banking, what other indirect action items can you recommend? 00:16:40.000 --> 00:16:43.840 Yeah, one of my favorite, and and you touched on this um just now. 00:16:44.000 --> 00:16:54.159 So that idea of first um learning and thinking and doing your research, we we kind of have a flow of action that we talk about at Project Drawdown. 00:16:54.240 --> 00:16:57.519 So that's the first and and probably most important step of it. 00:16:57.679 --> 00:17:00.799 The next is to do, to take action to make those changes. 00:17:01.039 --> 00:17:08.559 And the last one, which I think is an important indirect action that I want to bring up, is share, share your own journey and your experience doing it. 00:17:08.720 --> 00:17:25.440 And I think that's an indirect action that does not get highlighted enough is talking about it, talking about climate change, both the threats that it has, but also the opportunities embedded within climate change to make a better world and also the actions that you're taking as an individual. 00:17:25.680 --> 00:17:29.920 Talk about it with your friends, talk about it with your family, talk about it on social media. 00:17:30.160 --> 00:17:38.720 There's a great climate change opinion survey put out by the Yale program on climate change communications. 00:17:38.960 --> 00:17:41.920 They're a great subset of Yale University. 00:17:42.079 --> 00:17:49.039 They do opinion surveys of the US regularly to understand what people think about climate change and climate action. 00:17:49.359 --> 00:17:55.359 And it's really a dose of optimism because consistently people want to take action on climate change. 00:17:55.519 --> 00:17:59.680 They care about the issues, they think it should be prioritized by Congress and by the president. 00:17:59.920 --> 00:18:07.599 It's over 50%, often in the 60 and 70 percent in favor of climate across the board. 00:18:07.839 --> 00:18:25.680 But two of the areas that tend to lag a little bit behind are down in like the 30% to 40% favorability, is talking about climate change with at least some frequency and seeing it in the media more than once per week. 00:18:25.839 --> 00:18:28.640 Those are the two areas consistently as a communicator. 00:18:28.720 --> 00:18:33.039 I see that, and I'm like, that is a huge opportunity for indirect action. 00:18:33.200 --> 00:18:36.960 We need to be talking about climate change a lot more and move the needle on that. 00:18:37.119 --> 00:18:43.519 And that will also have the additional benefit of driving more um media coverage to some degree. 00:18:43.680 --> 00:18:49.039 Media coverage is in part

driven by what they think people are going to click on, what people want to read. 00:18:49.200 --> 00:18:52.400 And if we're talking about climate change more, it's going to feed into all of that. 00:18:52.559 --> 00:18:56.720 So I think indirect action, talking about climate change, just start doing it. 00:18:56.799 --> 00:18:59.519 It you don't have to be a scientist. 00:18:59.599 --> 00:19:01.440 You know, you all have lived experiences. 00:19:01.599 --> 00:19:03.279 You all are seeing what's going on in the world. 00:19:03.440 --> 00:19:06.640 Just talk about climate like you talk about other issues. 00:19:06.880 --> 00:19:08.480 Yeah, absolutely. 00:19:08.640 --> 00:19:10.640 I have talked about it on here before. 00:19:10.880 --> 00:19:19.759 How, you know, at the end of the day, for me, the most successful on a personal level, I mean, obviously in my work life, I'm talking about it all the time. 00:19:19.839 --> 00:19:38.000 Um, but on a personal level, I find so much success um by just living my life and people asking questions and about something very simple that then leads to a conversation where maybe I can tell them a little bit more about what I'm doing, um, questions they have about what they could be doing. 00:19:38.720 --> 00:19:43.200 And I've had people that make significant changes because of those simple things. 00:19:43.359 --> 00:19:53.920 One of the most common ones is when we visit a restaurant or even more frequently, like a pop-up situation, like a farmer's market or something like that. 00:19:54.079 --> 00:19:58.400 And we always have our own containers and our own utensils to give to the vendors. 00:19:58.640 --> 00:20:03.359 And we'll be walking around with a, you know, a metal container and people are like, where did you get that one? 00:20:03.440 --> 00:20:07.680 And we're like, we brought it from home, and then we get to give it to them, and then our leftovers are in here. 00:20:07.759 --> 00:20:13.599 And the amount of people that I'm assuming just have never, of course, even considered that as an option sound so excited. 00:20:13.680 --> 00:20:22.640 Um, maybe not even from an environmental standpoint at first, of more of like a um, you know, then my leftovers are going to be in my own container and I can just put them in my fridge type situation. 00:20:23.279 --> 00:20:37.759 Um, but there are so many actions that I'm so used to taking that are slightly outside of the current norm that I'd like to see become more normalized that often lead to conversation pieces. 00:20:37.839 --> 00:20:53.519 Um, so just living your life by example, as you begin to integrate more sustainable practices into your life, you'll find that friends and family and community members are more curious, which opens the door for being more of a champion, you know, and it's and speaking about it more often. 00:20:53.839 --> 00:20:54.960 Absolutely, absolutely. 00:20:55.119 --> 00:21:08.720 And study after study shows that some of the most trusted people when it comes to talking about climate change is friends and family, which to me is incredible, like oftentimes above scientists or right in the same ballpark as scientists. 00:21:08.880 --> 00:21:23.599 So that means for the everyday person, where they get their climate news that actually influences the decisions they make is from friends and family, whether or not they have a science degree or a background in in climate science is irrelevant. 00:21:23.759 --> 00:21:25.039 They trust those people. 00:21:25.200 --> 00:21:26.799 And so that's exactly right. 00:21:26.880 --> 00:21:34.480 Like when you're talking to friends and family about the actions you're taking, it has a huge effect, huge ripple effect that I don't think people appreciate. 00:21:34.799 --> 00:21:35.039 Yeah. 00:21:35.119 --> 00:21:44.079 And I would want to put a caveat on that as of in the same thing as not getting discouraged by some obstacles you might find in your own life to making decisions. 00:21:44.319 --> 00:21:57.519 I'm sure with many decisions, be it uh climate action or not, we are often met by the people closest to us with rolling eyes and, you know, maybe not the immediate openness that we'd like. 00:21:57.599 --> 00:21:59.759 And I think that that can be very similar for many people when. 00:22:00.160 --> 00:22:01.440 It comes to climate. 00:22:01.759 --> 00:22:04.079 You know, I've definitely experienced that myself. 00:22:04.720 --> 00:22:10.960 And so it's one of those situations that you just navigate personally, you know, like continue to speak about it. 00:22:11.119 --> 00:22:14.559 Don't cause any issues, but you know, just always be excited. 00:22:14.640 --> 00:22:32.160 And that's the biggest thing for me is whether in a professional, like at an event speaking on this, or if I'm talking to friends or family, is like when I'm staying positive and excited and not being judgmental or argumentative, that is when I find, of course, by far the most success with people. 00:22:32.319 --> 00:22:42.160 Um, and so that is a big recommendation that I can give is if you can, if you can, always stay positive and excited because you're doing it because you're excited about it. 00:22:42.240 --> 00:22:45.920 Um and that's gonna inspire other people if you can kind of stick to that narrative. 00:22:46.160 --> 00:22:46.480 Yes. 00:22:46.640 --> 00:22:48.079 Yeah, that is a great one. 00:22:48.160 --> 00:22:53.920 And and in science communication and particularly climate communication, that is huge. 00:22:54.079 --> 00:22:58.559 You know, there's a big conversation around, you know, pessimism or optimism. 00:22:58.640 --> 00:23:03.599 Um, I think most people are realizing it's kind of in the middle, you know, there's room for both. 00:23:03.759 --> 00:23:04.799 It's an emotional thing. 00:23:04.960 --> 00:23:10.000 Climate change is an emotional thing, it is heartbreaking, um, but is also joyful. 00:23:10.079 --> 00:23:14.240 Uh, the thriving future that

we're working towards is is a positive thing. 00:23:14.400 --> 00:23:17.599 And so approaching it and not shying away from those emotions are huge. 00:23:17.759 --> 00:23:23.920 And joy is is an incredibly powerful emotion and positivity that is going to bring more people on board. 00:23:24.079 --> 00:23:36.400 So I think that's uh a huge one for climate communicators in general and just for people who are trying to get people on board with taking uh changes or making changes in their own life uh that are a bit more sustainable. 00:23:36.640 --> 00:23:48.640 Yeah, I think realistic optimism is kind of what I've landed on in my own personal life when it comes to climate, because I will continue to experience high highs and low lows when it comes to the climate crisis. 00:23:48.799 --> 00:24:04.400 Um, but when I find that middle ground of education and understanding of what realistically is happening and excitedly what innovations and steps are being made that continue to inspire me to stay joyful and optimistic. 00:24:04.559 --> 00:24:07.359 So there's kind of that, yeah, middle, middle ground. 00:24:07.680 --> 00:24:08.240 Absolutely. 00:24:08.400 --> 00:24:08.640 Yeah. 00:24:08.799 --> 00:24:09.039 Yeah. 00:24:09.119 --> 00:24:38.319 And I think, you know, I think as far as I'm always thinking as sort of public relations and media, and I think the negative sides of climate change are very effectively communicated, uh, particularly with increasing uh exposure to disasters and journalists and media becoming much better at calling it climate change when we have attribution science that is able to show us how much it's been exacerbated by climate change. 00:24:38.480 --> 00:24:44.720 But those joyful moments, I think sometimes fall under the radar, those people taking action. 00:24:44.880 --> 00:25:00.720 And that's why a big project that Project Drawdown does is we have a short documentary series called Drawdown's Neighborhood, where we go city by city and we find usually uh, you know, a half dozen to a dozen climate heroes in those locations. 00:25:00.880 --> 00:25:08.640 And we have them just share their story, how they were impacted by climate change and what they're doing in their own community, both big and small, in order to make a difference. 00:25:08.799 --> 00:25:15.200 And those stories of hope are among the most effective communication tools that we deploy at Project Rawdown for sure. 00:25:15.440 --> 00:25:16.400 Yeah, that's amazing. 00:25:16.559 --> 00:25:32.319 I know that I, especially being on social media and the algorithm being on climate for me most often, uh, you know, I am inundated by so much of the realistic information that can be discouraging. 00:25:32.480 --> 00:25:47.759 And I get very excited when I find the accounts that do the weekly positive climate news or and really pull those stories from around the globe of big and small, very exciting um information about the climate crisis. 00:25:47.839 --> 00:25:51.839 And and I've started more and more, I think my algorithm is is getting that a little bit. 00:25:51.920 --> 00:26:09.279 I've started to, you know, find those, like them a little bit more so that I can myself have a little bit more of that in my daily life, where I'm seeing those small and large um kind of climate positivity uh and inspirational stories alongside the statistics and the scary stuff. 00:26:09.359 --> 00:26:11.920 So yeah, yeah, we definitely need both. 00:26:18.160 --> 00:26:24.960 In this series, we are talking to local sustainable business owners and organizations to highlight tangible resources within our community. 00:26:25.119 --> 00:26:28.799 Are you a local sustainable business or do you know someone we should be talking to? 00:26:29.039 --> 00:26:33.519 Email us at sustainability is sexy the podcast at gmail.com. 00:26:38.799 --> 00:26:49.039 So speaking of project drawdown, um, I'd love to give the listeners, you know, a rundown of of who you guys are, what you're doing, um, and then a little bit about what you are doing with the organization. 00:26:49.440 --> 00:26:53.039 Yeah, so project drawdown is a climate solutions nonprofit. 00:26:53.359 --> 00:27:07.359 And really the idea behind Project Drawdown is the same science that we use to better understand climate change, uh atmospheric science, how bad things might be, or how good they could be if we take appropriate action. 00:27:07.599 --> 00:27:11.440 We want to apply that same scientific lens to the climate solutions. 00:27:11.680 --> 00:27:22.480 Which ones are ready to go, which ones need more work, which ones are going to be most effective at helping us reach a point where climate change is in the rear view mirror. 00:27:22.640 --> 00:27:38.319 And so a lot of the work we do is science behind the scenes, looking at solutions and trying to figure out which ones are most appropriate, where we're at with them, how quickly they should be deployed, and what the reductions in emissions will look like if that takes place. 00:27:38.559 --> 00:27:45.759 And then also communicating that both to policymakers, to the general public through a variety of channels that we have. 00:27:46.160 --> 00:27:50.720 In addition to that, we do a lot of storytelling work, like I said, with the Drawdowns Neighborhood program. 00:27:51.119 --> 00:27:59.119 That's underneath the umbrella of drawdown stories, which is specifically about climate storytelling, because stories are what get people to act. 00:27:59.200 --> 00:28:05.759 The same reason that we trust our friends and family more than almost anybody else is the same reason that stories are so effective. 00:28:05.839 --> 00:28:12.079 It's because they resonate with something human that is always going to be a degree detached from the numbers or the science. 00:28:12.240 --> 00:28:16.240 It's about wedding those two, is when you get really effective communication. 00:28:16.480 --> 00:28:18.960 And then we also do work more on the economic

side. 00:28:19.039 --> 00:28:35.359 We have a program called Drawdown Labs, which works with uh philanthropists, with impact investors, uh, with businesses in order to help them invest in the solutions that are most appropriate and also the ones that are actually going to move the needle on climate change. 00:28:35.599 --> 00:28:36.799 And what do you do? 00:28:37.039 --> 00:28:40.240 So, my job is I do a little bit of everything. 00:28:40.319 --> 00:28:43.599 So, what I love about my job is I'm a communications manager. 00:28:43.680 --> 00:28:50.640 Uh, and so I get to communicate the science, I get to communicate the stories, I get to communicate the economics work that we do. 00:28:50.799 --> 00:29:10.559 So, what I really love about what I get to do is I get to wear many different hats, many different times every single day in order to better understand both the research that our scientists are doing and that our business leaders are doing, but then also communicate that to the public or to policymakers or whatever audience we're trying to reach. 00:29:10.720 --> 00:29:13.759 So I I'd say I'm a bit of a synthesizer. 00:29:13.920 --> 00:29:18.720 I try to take in the information, synthesize it, and find a good home for it out in the world. 00:29:19.119 --> 00:29:36.640 And it sounds like obviously there's so many different aspects of the work that the organization is doing, um, that there's opportunity for involvement from many different levels of whether it's individual companies, philanthropists you mentioned. 00:29:36.880 --> 00:29:43.119 So if somebody wants to learn more or get more involved on any of those levels, what would your recommendation be? 00:29:43.440 --> 00:29:48.000 Yeah, so there's a lot of ways to get involved as an individual with the work that we do. 00:29:48.160 --> 00:30:03.680 Um, one that I'll call out that I really love is underneath our drawdown labs, which is sort of our economic private sector uh program at Project Drawdown, we have these guides called job function action guides. 00:30:03.839 --> 00:30:12.480 And they're broken down to if you're a marketing professional, if you're in sales, if you're in procurement, if you're a computer engineer or a product manager. 00:30:12.640 --> 00:30:15.759 There's about 10 in total and more being developed all the time. 00:30:15.920 --> 00:30:20.559 And they tell you very specifically for your job how to turn it into a climate job. 00:30:20.720 --> 00:30:25.039 So how to increase the sustainability of the work that you're doing. 00:30:25.279 --> 00:30:26.720 And it's really specific. 00:30:26.880 --> 00:30:30.960 It's it's you know done in collaboration with experts in those fields. 00:30:31.119 --> 00:30:32.799 So it's not a surface-level guide. 00:30:32.880 --> 00:30:36.079 It's very specific for your particular area of expertise. 00:30:36.240 --> 00:30:38.400 And so those guides are readily available. 00:30:38.480 --> 00:30:40.799 Um, we encourage you to check those out.

00:30:40.880 --> 00:30:43.759 So I think that's a huge one that individuals can do. 00:30:44.000 --> 00:30:48.160 But the other way that you can really support us is sharing our content. 00:30:48.400 --> 00:30:53.759 We have a great social media manager who manages all of our content on LinkedIn. 00:30:54.000 --> 00:30:56.400 We're on basically everything except TikTok. 00:30:56.480 --> 00:31:02.640 Uh, and uh they do a great job of um sharing our work broadly through those channels. 00:31:02.799 --> 00:31:05.119 We also have a newsletter written by yours truly. 00:31:05.200 --> 00:31:09.119 So I would be in your inbox every other week for the foreseeable future. 00:31:09.279 --> 00:31:25.519 Uh and sharing that content really helps get the word out, both about the climate solutions that we want to deploy, but it also um helps share stories of empowerment from drawdowns neighborhood, um, ways that your coworkers can get involved through job function action guides. 00:31:25.680 --> 00:31:29.920 So uh sharing our content is actually a huge way that you can support us. 00:31:30.079 --> 00:31:38.400 And then of course, all the other ways you can support any 501c3 nonprofit uh donations, um, working in kind, however, you can support us. 00:31:38.720 --> 00:31:39.039 Awesome. 00:31:39.200 --> 00:31:40.960 Well, I'm excited about many of those. 00:31:41.759 --> 00:31:52.480 Um I think the the first part that you mentioned with, you know, um, where people can find the guides on, you know, their particular uh industry or position, that's huge. 00:31:52.640 --> 00:31:53.440 That is huge. 00:31:53.599 --> 00:31:55.039 Like what an amazing resource. 00:31:55.200 --> 00:31:57.200 Um, I'm super excited to share that one. 00:31:57.279 --> 00:31:59.599 Um and I'm definitely gonna sign up for the newsletter. 00:32:00.000 --> 00:32:00.880 That's fantastic. 00:32:01.200 --> 00:32:02.319 I'm excited about that. 00:32:02.480 --> 00:32:06.319 Um, we'll be linking all of this in the show notes for people that are looking for it. 00:32:06.400 --> 00:32:08.799 Um, and I'll mention some stuff at the end as well. 00:32:08.960 --> 00:32:15.039 Um, so this next question is something I ask every guest that's on the podcast. 00:32:15.200 --> 00:32:19.440 Um, and I have a feeling that you probably have quite a few answers to the question. 00:32:19.519 --> 00:32:26.160 So feel free to do multiple, or if you, you know, it doesn't have to be about what you do for a living. 00:32:26.240 --> 00:32:31.599 It's it's truly just your personal um uh your your favorite stuff. 00:32:31.759 --> 00:32:39.519 So do you, Skylar, have a favorite sustainable product or practice that you want to share with our listeners that you use in your own life? 00:32:39.839 --> 00:32:49.279 Yeah, my favorite practice is definitely something that I've developed recently uh because I I did not grow up as much of a cook. 00:32:49.440 --> 00:32:54.000 I I wouldn't say, uh, and you can verify this with my wife.

00:32:54.160 --> 00:33:02.319 Uh gosh, I balk at some of the meals that I cooked her in air quotes uh when we first started dating before I knew how to cook. 00:33:02.559 --> 00:33:23.839 But honestly, when I became vegetarian, beyond all of the reasons that I did it for environmental reasons or um animal rights reasons or whatever it is, the sheer diversity of skills that I learned, the new flavors, the new recipes, I had to get so much more creative in the kitchen. 00:33:24.000 --> 00:33:26.160 And now cooking is one of my favorite things. 00:33:26.319 --> 00:33:41.759 So I would say if if you're a chef or you consider yourself the cook in your family, uh, and whether or not you're vegetarian, even if meat is sort of a primary thing that you cook, I encourage you to look at vegetarian or vegan recipes because it's incredible. 00:33:41.839 --> 00:33:46.799 It's opened up a whole new world of um flavors and ways to cook things. 00:33:46.960 --> 00:33:49.599 And I have my favorite cookbooks that I can also plug. 00:33:49.680 --> 00:33:50.799 I don't know if that's fine. 00:33:51.039 --> 00:33:51.440 Of course. 00:33:51.680 --> 00:33:52.559 I don't know if you have a cookbook. 00:33:52.960 --> 00:33:53.200 I do. 00:33:53.359 --> 00:33:56.079 Okay, well, I'll plug yours first and foremost, which I have not read. 00:33:56.240 --> 00:33:59.279 Yeah, I did want to just like interject here and say that this was not planned. 00:33:59.440 --> 00:33:59.680 Yes. 00:33:59.839 --> 00:34:04.079 Uh, and not, yeah, this is not a personal plug for what I do for a living. 00:34:04.160 --> 00:34:07.200 And I'm very, very excited that this is your recommendation. 00:34:07.279 --> 00:34:08.559 So yeah, yeah. 00:34:08.639 --> 00:34:18.960 So your your cookbook, of course, which I look forward to cooking all the recipes from, um, but ones that have really opened my eyes to how incredible um vegetarian and vegan cooking can be. 00:34:19.039 --> 00:34:22.159 Um, anything by Yodomo Dolange, he's great. 00:34:22.239 --> 00:34:37.039 He has a mix of things from I don't know, I don't know how to cook, and there's some very basic ones that are great for that, all the way through to I really have some time to invest and want to get creative and bust out the mortar and pestle. 00:34:37.199 --> 00:34:38.880 He has everything in between. 00:34:39.039 --> 00:35:00.880 Um, there's an incredible cookbook called East by Mira Soda, and it's I and I'm not sure if I'm pronouncing that right, but uh she does recipes all across um sort of Southeast Asia, um, Japanese, uh uh Thai, Indian, everything, um, sort of uh Eastern-based cooking. 00:35:01.039 --> 00:35:04.639 And I have not made a single recipe from that that has not been delicious. 00:35:04.880 --> 00:35:13.519 And then as someone who grew up in Kentucky, um, soul food, you know, I grew up ribs, burgers, uh, those are sort of the staples. 00:35:13.679 --> 00:35:18.880 And there's a book called Vegetable Kingdom by Bryant Terry, which is incredible. 00:35:19.119 --> 00:35:24.480 Soul food, as well as soul food from all cultures, Caribbean Soul Food, West African Soul Food. 00:35:24.559 --> 00:35:27.440 Uh, and his his cookbook is just a masterpiece. 00:35:27.519 --> 00:35:31.119 So I I would plug those in addition to was his cookbook, of course. 00:35:31.840 --> 00:35:34.960 Um, which for those that don't know, it's called Kitchen Contentment. 00:35:35.039 --> 00:35:37.760 Um, and it's through my company, Santosha Nutrition. 00:35:37.920 --> 00:35:59.199 But I am so appreciative of you of you bringing that up because I think many people who either don't cook or or kind of are daunted by cooking, um, especially if they are not vegan or vegetarian or have not been around that type of cuisine very often, just don't even really consider it as an option. 00:35:59.280 --> 00:36:01.039 It's not something that you really think about. 00:36:01.280 --> 00:36:18.559 But these days, you know, cookbooks aside, I mean, the internet is just, you know, full, of course, of recipes, techniques, inspiration, veganizing your favorite foods, you know, all those ones that you mentioned, you know, you can veganize all of those. 00:36:18.639 --> 00:36:21.119 Um, and it's something that is so fun to try. 00:36:21.280 --> 00:36:30.000 I always tell people, um, you know, because even if I'm speaking to other chefs maybe, and they scoff at the idea of being a plant-based chef. 00:36:30.079 --> 00:36:37.360 And and all I can say is there are so many more plants in this world to play with um than there are animal products. 00:36:37.519 --> 00:36:50.639 And uh I find that to be a huge inspiration with the flavors, colors, textures, cultures associated with the immense amount of edible plant life that we have on this planet. 00:36:50.800 --> 00:36:55.920 Um, and so I love that you brought that up and I second it wholeheartedly. 00:36:56.559 --> 00:37:04.400 Yeah, and I I, you know, I I've really love seeing vegetarian and vegan food get more into the high dining space as well. 00:37:04.559 --> 00:37:09.440 Um, there's a cookbook, uh, I forget the first name's Towel, I forget the last name. 00:37:09.519 --> 00:37:13.039 It's called Crossroads, and it's based on a restaurant that opened in LA. 00:37:13.519 --> 00:37:19.039 And I haven't been to the restaurant, I really want to check it out, but I got the cookbook and it's remarkable. 00:37:19.199 --> 00:37:22.960 I mean, you go through and these dishes are just uh insane. 00:37:23.119 --> 00:37:28.960 And and to your point about like the diversity of plants and the things that you can do with them. 00:37:29.119 --> 00:37:30.880 It's just it's absolutely incredible. 00:37:31.039 --> 00:37:48.880 So if you're a foodie or or someone who considers yourself a chef and you predominantly eat or cook meat-based food, you don't have to go full vegetarian or vegan, but I encourage you to start dipping your toe into that space because it's an incredible world of

flavor and creativity. 00:37:48.960 --> 00:37:49.920 It's really fun. 00:37:50.639 --> 00:37:51.599 I agree. 00:37:53.119 --> 00:37:55.599 Is there anything else you'd like to share? 00:37:56.639 --> 00:38:01.039 I think the other thing I would say to your point about um buying secondhand. 00:38:01.119 --> 00:38:02.480 So I agree. 00:38:02.639 --> 00:38:17.760 First, first thing you should do, especially with clothes, there's incredible resources now for buying nice secondhand clothes um uh uh online or go to your local thrift store or whatever it might be. 00:38:18.000 --> 00:38:28.400 For those times when you really need something new, you can't find something, or maybe it's workout clothes, which is always a bit on the fence with secondhand, um, and you do need something new. 00:38:28.559 --> 00:38:32.480 There's a great website that my brother-in-law showed me called Good On You. 00:38:32.960 --> 00:38:38.320 And they evaluate any, I haven't come across a clothes brand that's not on there really. 00:38:38.480 --> 00:38:49.519 And they evaluate uh how good they are to workers, how good they are to the planet, and how good they are to, I believe it's animals, whether they do sort of any animal product testing or anything like that. 00:38:50.159 --> 00:38:56.559 And they give them a grade and then they talk about are they transparent and what do they do well and what do they need to improve on. 00:38:56.719 --> 00:39:10.239 So I encourage you for those, for those times when you can't find something secondhand or you need to purchase something new, that website has honestly been a great resource for me to help assuage some of that guilt when you do need something new. 00:39:10.480 --> 00:39:31.519 Yeah, I use that website myself and um I've been lucky, you know, in the past few years to have really, especially as a part of Sustainability Sexy, met so many people in the local San Diego community that provide resources on whether it's upcycled or secondhand or thrift or all of these um amazing opportunities. 00:39:31.599 --> 00:39:36.480 But yeah, there are certain items that are a little more difficult or maybe just you don't want secondhand. 00:39:36.639 --> 00:39:45.920 So it's really great to have resources like Good On You where you can uh know that you're making the best and most informed decision that you can as a consumer. 00:39:46.719 --> 00:39:49.039 So thank you so much for joining me today, Skylar. 00:39:49.119 --> 00:39:53.840 You can find more information about Project Drawdown online at drawdown.org. 00:39:53.920 --> 00:40:01.199 Um, and I just want to give a huge shout out um to you for being here because you, like I mentioned, you inspired me so much in our first meeting. 00:40:01.280 --> 00:40:04.000 Um, and it just means a lot to be able to have this conversation with you. 00:40:04.079 --> 00:40:04.880 So thank you. 00:40:05.199 --> 00:40:08.000 Yeah, thank you so much for having me and for all the good work you do. 00:40:08.239 --> 00:40:13.199 As always, all of the resources and brands mentioned in today's podcast will be linked for your reference. 00:40:13.280 --> 00:40:18.239 And until next time, I'm Liz Murphy sending you sustainability love from San Diego. 00:40:25.119 --> 00:40:34.239 Sustainability of Sexy is a nonprofit organization located in San Diego, California, focused on inspiring and driving innovation within our community to create real change. 00:40:34.400 --> 00:40:39.280 Learn more at sustainabilitysexy.org and find out how you can be involved.