Transcrição completa de 5 YRS AGO SMACKDOWN POST-SHOW: Keller & LeClair talk New Day-Bloodline, McIntyre’s positioning, Happy Corbin & Madcap Moss, Pat McAfee, more

00:04:06.379 --> 00:04:08.719 in the mix which I think that I think if 69 00:04:08.759 --> 00:04:11.689 you gave me a gave me a vote I'd probably 70 00:04:11.889 --> 00:04:14.069 pick six-man tag elimination. 71 00:04:14.370 --> 00:04:17.170 And and I am totally fine and we've seen them 72 00:04:17.209 --> 00:04:19.990 vary this over the years of Survivor Series having a 73 00:04:20.009 --> 00:04:23.310 brand versus brand elimination tag match maybe one with women 74 00:04:23.410 --> 00:04:27.750 one with men and then don't worry about tradition otherwise 75 00:04:27.889 --> 00:04:29.389 if it gets in the way and I'm not against 76 00:04:29.410 --> 00:04:31.810 the elimination match other well I mean, I can see 77 00:04:32.029 --> 00:04:34.110 WWE not wanting a bunch of people on one team 78 00:04:34.129 --> 00:04:35.970 to do jobs. You know, they might want to protect, 79 00:04:36.970 --> 00:04:39.750 you know, multiple wrestlers in that match from being, quote, eliminated. 80 00:04:39.790 --> 00:04:41.250 I mean, they have their tricks to do that. Oh, 81 00:04:41.269 --> 00:04:43.410 there's a count out. Oh, there's a DQ. Oh, it was, 82 00:04:43.810 --> 00:04:45.829 you know, there was a distraction. How could I forget that? 83 00:04:45.910 --> 00:04:49.509 But nevertheless, I would be totally, I mean, they can 84 00:04:49.550 --> 00:04:51.750 headline Survivor Series with those three against those three in 85 00:04:51.769 --> 00:04:54.529 a standard match the way that they're building it up. 86 00:04:54.670 --> 00:04:56.470 And I'm not, I mean, I think this is a 87 00:04:56.509 --> 00:05:01.589 cool kind of cross-brand route thing to get to the 88 00:05:01.610 --> 00:05:03.990 brand versus brand match at Survivor Series. I just look 89 00:05:04.009 --> 00:05:10.600 at Big E's momentum on Raw right now, or what I... 90 00:05:08.819 --> 00:05:11.870 It's such a WB word. Momentum, so I'm self-conscious saying it. 91 00:05:12.439 --> 00:05:15.000 I think Big E's off to a good start. And 92 00:05:15.019 --> 00:05:17.079 I think they've done a really good job featuring him 93 00:05:17.120 --> 00:05:19.540 and making him feel like a big deal. And that 94 00:05:20.040 --> 00:05:24.339 he isn't just a guy holding the world title on 95 00:05:24.480 --> 00:05:27.449 a show, but the real champion with the real belt 96 00:05:27.490 --> 00:05:30.029 that matters right now is on that other show. And 97 00:05:30.329 --> 00:05:34.069 that's baked in right now for anybody who holds a 98 00:05:34.110 --> 00:05:37.120 title that Roman isn't holding. And frankly, any title that's 99 00:05:37.180 --> 00:05:40.579 not on Fox Network instead of USA. And it would 100 00:05:40.600 --> 00:05:43.139 take work to overcome that. But I just don't think 101 00:05:43.160 --> 00:05:45.339 you want to emphasize it and make it even more 102 00:05:45.420 --> 00:05:47.889 obvious by having Reigns beat Big E. But frankly, I 103 00:05:47.910 --> 00:05:49.730 would vote for Reigns beating Big E clean before I'd 104 00:05:49.750 --> 00:05:51.389 vote for Big E beating Reigns clean because I think 105 00:05:51.939 --> 00:05:56.860 Reigns has 400-some days, 430-some days of this championship reign, 106 00:05:56.899 --> 00:05:59.120 and him losing should be a big deal, not something 107 00:05:59.139 --> 00:06:02.399 you're forced into because it's Survivor Series and you just 108 00:06:02.439 --> 00:06:03.730 sort of feel like you have to do the champ 109 00:06:03.750 --> 00:06:06.069 versus champ match. So even though they've said, you know, 110 00:06:06.250 --> 00:06:07.779 it is going to happen or kind of hinted at it, 111 00:06:07.810 --> 00:06:11.569 I'm fine with them breaking tradition and just putting on 112 00:06:11.730 --> 00:06:13.529 what makes the most sense otherwise. 113 00:06:14.730 --> 00:06:18.370 Yeah, I think that the one thing that I am 114 00:06:18.410 --> 00:06:21.180 really enjoying about this is that despite it being brand 115 00:06:21.189 --> 00:06:26.360 versus brand, it's not a feud built around Raw versus SmackDown. 116 00:06:26.560 --> 00:06:30.100 It just so happens that New Day is feuding with 117 00:06:30.139 --> 00:06:33.339 the Usos, and now Roman Reigns has gotten involved, and 118 00:06:33.379 --> 00:06:35.800 it only makes sense for Big E to hop in 119 00:06:35.819 --> 00:06:39.959 there and come to the aid of his friends. And 120 00:06:40.000 --> 00:06:44.740 it serves WWE's purpose of having WWE champion versus universal champion. 121 00:06:45.180 --> 00:06:47.329 So I like the way that they're setting this up. 122 00:06:47.620 --> 00:06:52.589 I am someone who strongly dislikes the brand versus brand 123 00:06:52.629 --> 00:06:56.509 format of survivor series, not only because it feels shoehorned 124 00:06:56.610 --> 00:07:01.089 and manufactured and fake, but also because it occurs every year. 125 00:07:01.250 --> 00:07:04.339 So close to when they now do the draft that 126 00:07:04.379 --> 00:07:08.230 it feels especially pointless because it's, Most of the guys 127 00:07:08.290 --> 00:07:11.910 that are fighting have just recently switched brands. So how 128 00:07:11.970 --> 00:07:14.910 could they possibly have developed that much allegiance to that 129 00:07:14.970 --> 00:07:18.769 brand and have that much hatred and vitriol toward the 130 00:07:18.790 --> 00:07:20.629 brand that they were just on three weeks ago? 131 00:07:21.449 --> 00:07:24.980 And the brand versus brand, you know, Survivor Series format 132 00:07:25.009 --> 00:07:27.060 is it feels like I mean, it's a carryover from 133 00:07:27.079 --> 00:07:31.000 when they were really doing is is I won't say ineptly, 134 00:07:31.019 --> 00:07:34.360 but sort of halfheartedly or, you know, fleeting in a 135 00:07:34.399 --> 00:07:37.759 fleeting way. oh, we're really against each other. There's rival GMs. 136 00:07:37.819 --> 00:07:40.420 It's Stephanie versus Shane, or it's this GM versus that GM. 137 00:07:40.720 -->

00:07:42.600 And the announcers are even bad-mouthing each other. And they're 138 00:07:42.620 --> 00:07:45.000 talking about ratings. And, you know, that lasted, you know, 139 00:07:45.379 --> 00:07:48.060 a few weeks, but yet we're still stuck with this 140 00:07:48.180 --> 00:07:51.279 format born out of that, especially now with a draft 141 00:07:51.399 --> 00:07:54.209 that comes so close to Survivor Series. So yeah, it's just, 142 00:07:54.290 --> 00:07:56.829 it's kind of, you know, let's just reevaluate it. I mean, 143 00:07:57.449 --> 00:08:00.029 it's not even the WWE Network era. It's the Peacock era. 144 00:08:00.149 --> 00:08:03.709 They're like, they just don't, I mean, I want to, 145 00:08:04.069 --> 00:08:06.930 whisper this so NBCUniversal executives don't hear, but they don't 146 00:08:06.949 --> 00:08:08.529 care as much as they used to about some of 147 00:08:08.550 --> 00:08:11.889 these shows. They want to sell. They're running stadium shows 148 00:08:11.930 --> 00:08:15.209 now for more stadium shows next year because they make 149 00:08:15.430 --> 00:08:19.730 more money if they sell more tickets. But they don't 150 00:08:19.769 --> 00:08:22.689 make more money from Peacock if Survivor Series is better 151 00:08:22.709 --> 00:08:25.560 or worse. Under a WWE network, they made more money 152 00:08:25.600 --> 00:08:27.860 if Survivor Series was better because more people would subscribe 153 00:08:27.899 --> 00:08:30.089 to the network, fewer would cancel. They'd have a better 154 00:08:30.149 --> 00:08:33.960 quarterly statement. Now the way to show improvement in revenue, 155 00:08:34.460 --> 00:08:38.039 because everything else is baked in, locked in, under contract. 156 00:08:38.240 --> 00:08:40.200 I mean, yes, you want to have good numbers to 157 00:08:40.360 --> 00:08:43.970 renegotiate the next deal. That's not exactly how WB operates. 158 00:08:44.009 --> 00:08:46.789 That's not even how human incentives work. We often don't 159 00:08:46.830 --> 00:08:50.730 think long-term. We think more short-term. So if they're running 160 00:08:50.769 --> 00:08:53.649 stadium shows so they can make more money, Survivor Series, 161 00:08:54.590 --> 00:08:57.870 there's not an incentive to give away what should be 162 00:08:58.750 --> 00:09:04.320 a more prestigious, valued, rare matchup, which is the champ 163 00:09:04.340 --> 00:09:06.559 from Raw against the champ from SmackDown. Don't put that 164 00:09:06.740 --> 00:09:09.039 on the calendar as something locked in where then you 165 00:09:09.080 --> 00:09:11.120 have to do a finish. I don't think Drew ever 166 00:09:11.159 --> 00:09:13.799 recovered from being defined down last year as a guy 167 00:09:13.840 --> 00:09:18.169 who lost to Roman. And, you know, I don't, I mean, 168 00:09:18.429 --> 00:09:21.450 it's a tough call. I mean, if Drew beat Roman, 169 00:09:21.509 --> 00:09:25.799 is Roman weaker? Just don't do the matches. It's not 170 00:09:25.940 --> 00:09:27.639 that big of a deal when nobody expects a finish 171 00:09:27.779 --> 00:09:28.980 or everyone's mad about the finish. 172 00:09:30.080 --> 00:09:32.779 Yeah, and they got away from it the year prior. 173 00:09:33.320 --> 00:09:35.639 The year prior, they had done two title matches rather 174 00:09:35.679 --> 00:09:39.210 than having the WWE versus the Universal Champion. So I 175 00:09:39.230 --> 00:09:41.870 was surprised to see them go back to it last year, 176 00:09:41.990 --> 00:09:44.990 especially when they had two strong champions. And that seemed 177 00:09:45.029 --> 00:09:47.509 like a WrestleMania match, and they just gave it away. 178 00:09:47.889 --> 00:09:51.799 And yeah, I think that It definitely hurt Drew McIntyre. 179 00:09:51.899 --> 00:09:54.450 I and I agree. I don't think that he's recovered. 180 00:09:55.909 --> 00:09:58.299 It's interesting, though, that you bring up Peacock and that 181 00:09:58.740 --> 00:10:01.299 WWE no longer has to worry about month to month 182 00:10:01.740 --> 00:10:04.759 how many people are watching the pay-per-views, and that's a 183 00:10:04.840 --> 00:10:08.940 good thing given those numbers and that money, the financials 184 00:10:08.960 --> 00:10:09.940 that came out about Peacock. 185 00:10:11.889 --> 00:10:15.049 Your time is valuable. Go VIP and listen to our 186 00:10:15.090 --> 00:10:20.980 shows commercial-free. A nice streamlined listening experience. PWTorch.com. slash GoVIP 187 00:10:21.279 --> 00:10:24.279 for full details on a commercial-free listening experience. And with 188 00:10:24.320 --> 00:10:27.090 a full VIP membership, you can create custom feeds for 189 00:10:27.190 --> 00:10:30.190 individual shows or groups of shows by theme and also 190 00:10:30.309 --> 00:10:34.009 unlock nearly four decades of archives and access our ad-free 191 00:10:34.049 --> 00:10:39.580 website with VIP-exclusive content, pwtorch.com slash GoVIP. Your time is valuable, 192 00:10:39.600 --> 00:10:43.120 and that's one of the reasons we offer VIP membership, pwtorch.com 193 00:10:43.159 --> 00:10:53.950 slash GoVIP. Okay, let's pause here and introduce ourselves and 194 00:10:54.669 --> 00:10:56.269 give out the phone numbers and move on with our 195 00:10:56.309 --> 00:11:00.600 conversation about a lot of happenings on SmackDown. Some more 196 00:11:00.639 --> 00:11:04.620 newsworthy than others. This is the Wade Keller Pro Wrestling 197 00:11:04.820 --> 00:11:09.120 Post Show for Friday, November 5th, 2021. I'm Wade Keller, 198 00:11:09.159 --> 00:11:12.210 the host of the program, the editor-publisher-founder of the Pro 199 00:11:12.250 --> 00:11:17.860 Wrestling Torch Weekly Newsletter and the website peakwtorch.com. and also 200 00:11:17.879 --> 00:11:19.960 the host of this, the Wade Keller Post Show and 201 00:11:20.000 --> 00:11:23.789 the Wade Keller Podcast. Yesterday we ran a good portion 202 00:11:23.970 --> 00:11:27.409 of my conversation from this week with John Arezzi, who 203

00:11:27.450 --> 00:11:31.110 was on the Dark Side of the Ring documentary season 204 00:11:31.129 --> 00:11:35.259 finale last week covering the WWE, or then WWF, 1994 205 00:11:35.259 --> 00:11:38.600 Vince McMahon steroid trial. And John and I were both 206 00:11:38.639 --> 00:11:41.200 on that documentary on Vice, and we both were in 207 00:11:41.220 --> 00:11:43.860 the courtroom for the trial, and we just had a conversation, 208 00:11:43.879 --> 00:11:48.289 sharing memories and adding memories additional context and details to 209 00:11:48.309 --> 00:11:50.610 what was in the documentary and reviewing some of the 210 00:11:50.649 --> 00:11:53.210 choices they made in that documentary. So I encourage you 211 00:11:53.250 --> 00:11:56.110 to seek out the documentary. If you didn't see it 212 00:11:56.129 --> 00:11:58.690 the first time, look for it online or it might 213 00:11:58.710 --> 00:12:01.159 be on your DVR or on demand, and then check 214 00:12:01.220 --> 00:12:04.580 out that conversation with John. I also did an hour-long 215 00:12:04.639 --> 00:12:08.340 watch-along solo for VIP members on the Wade Keller Hotline 216 00:12:08.399 --> 00:12:11.639 last weekend and just pushed play on it and talked 217 00:12:11.960 --> 00:12:14.110 about the documentary and the choices they made and who 218 00:12:14.120 --> 00:12:16.700 was featured and adding even more stories to it. So 219 00:12:17.019 --> 00:12:20.919 lots of trial coverage this week, this past week for 220 00:12:20.960 --> 00:12:22.519 VIP members, and you get a good sample of it 221 00:12:23.019 --> 00:12:26.220 on yesterday's Wade Keller Pro Wrestling Podcast. That now is 222 00:12:26.320 --> 00:12:30.940 free as of last night. The other voice you hear 223 00:12:31.580 --> 00:12:35.480 is Brandon LeClaire. He is a PWTorch.com contributor. He formerly 224 00:12:35.500 --> 00:12:38.360 covered SmackDown on a weekly basis, you know, writes all 225 00:12:38.399 --> 00:12:42.279 perspective reports on WWE pay-per-views and fills in sometimes when 226 00:12:42.500 --> 00:12:48.110 needed on TV reports. Brandon, thanks for accepting being bumped 227 00:12:48.190 --> 00:12:52.029 last week after we double booked. It worked better. You 228 00:12:52.200 --> 00:12:55.000 were able to be more flexible. So I really appreciate that. 229 00:12:55.179 --> 00:12:57.200 And that means I get to host with you instead 230 00:12:57.220 --> 00:12:58.399 of Zach. So good to hear your voice. Good to 231 00:12:58.419 --> 00:12:58.720 have you on. 232 00:12:59.980 --> 00:13:02.480 Yeah, definitely. Glad to be here. A little bit of 233 00:13:02.500 --> 00:13:06.940 confusion last week. Zach wasn't filled in. So by the 234 00:13:06.980 --> 00:13:11.440 time he saw my tweet mentioning that I would be 235 00:13:11.500 --> 00:13:15.470 joining this week instead of next week, He was like, wait, 236 00:13:15.690 --> 00:13:21.169 so you're you're out for tonight. And I was like, oh, no. So, yeah, 237 00:13:21.389 --> 00:13:23.389 we got it. We got it cleared up. Wade, I 238 00:13:23.509 --> 00:13:27.570 also want to mention a funny, funny tidbit here for 239 00:13:27.590 --> 00:13:30.029 your appearance on Dark Side of the Ring last week. 240 00:13:30.049 --> 00:13:34.049 I I put the show on and my girlfriend was 241 00:13:34.149 --> 00:13:35.990 was getting ready to go to sleep. And she kind 242 00:13:36.029 --> 00:13:38.710 of like she she heard the start of the episode 243 00:13:38.730 --> 00:13:41.649 and she rolled over and she was like, is that Wade? 244 00:13:42.779 --> 00:13:48.549 And she, not a wrestling fan, never watched wrestling willingly 245 00:13:48.590 --> 00:13:51.509 in her life, but knows your voice from hearing you 246 00:13:51.570 --> 00:13:54.809 through my headphones. And for me, it's like, when I've 247 00:13:54.830 --> 00:13:57.210 done these shows with you, and then also from when 248 00:13:57.250 --> 00:13:59.830 I've just listened to stuff from The Torch. So she 249 00:13:59.870 --> 00:14:02.490 just casually rolled over and was like, is that Wade? 250 00:14:02.669 --> 00:14:05.029 I was like, yeah, good catch. Actually, it is. 251 00:14:05.970 --> 00:14:07.610 I was at a karate class with my son. It 252 00:14:08.070 --> 00:14:12.590 was right before COVID, so two years ago. in the 253 00:14:12.629 --> 00:14:16.009 fall of 19. And I'm just talking with my family. 254 00:14:16.080 --> 00:14:17.820 And then this guy comes up to me after karate class. 255 00:14:17.840 --> 00:14:19.620 He goes, I don't want to bother you, but are 256 00:14:19.639 --> 00:14:22.700 you Wade Keller? And I'm like, yeah. And he goes, yeah, 257 00:14:22.720 --> 00:14:24.840 I just, I'm sitting over there and I hear your voice. 258 00:14:24.879 --> 00:14:26.159 And I was like, oh my God, I think that's 259 00:14:26.240 --> 00:14:29.919 the wrestling guy. Just another, another dad there. So the voice, 260 00:14:30.279 --> 00:14:31.679 I guess the voice is distinct. 261 00:14:32.330 --> 00:14:36.070 So weird, weirdly enough, she recognized it right away. And 262 00:14:36.289 --> 00:14:39.149 it was odd for me. I thought you sounded different. 263 00:14:39.389 --> 00:14:42.950 And then like, So after like 10 or 15 minutes 264 00:14:42.990 --> 00:14:44.870 or so, it kind of like settled and clicked, and 265 00:14:44.889 --> 00:14:47.490 I was like, oh, yeah, okay, that's the voice. But before, 266 00:14:47.590 --> 00:14:50.830 it was like, oh, this is different. It's like hearing 267 00:14:50.870 --> 00:14:55.080 your own voice. You never quite recognize it. Voices are weird. 268 00:14:55.559 --> 00:14:55.840 Yes. 269 00:14:56.980 --> 00:15:00.120 Fun stories. All right. Oh, by the way, I will 270 00:15:00.139 --> 00:15:01.679 mention here at the top of the show, I interviewed 271 00:15:01.700 --> 00:15:06.659 Tony Khan, AEW president, Ted Booker, for about an hour 272 00:15:07.490 --> 00:15:11.559 earlier this afternoon and talked about Cody

getting booed and asked, 273 00:15:11.580 --> 00:15:13.940 you know, kind of multiple follow-up questions on that and 274 00:15:14.279 --> 00:15:17.220 how his relationship with the executive vice presidents, Matt and 275 00:15:17.240 --> 00:15:19.379 Nick Jackson and Kenny Omega and Cody has evolved over 276 00:15:19.419 --> 00:15:22.340 the past couple of years. We talked about the Jon 277 00:15:22.379 --> 00:15:28.539 Moxley situation, the substitution of Miro, CM Punk's ratings, and 278 00:15:29.000 --> 00:15:32.409 what Tony's take is on that and more. Really good interview. 279 00:15:32.450 --> 00:15:34.809 We put up part one for VIP members on my 280 00:15:34.850 --> 00:15:38.730 new daily focus on AEW podcast that I started on Monday, 281 00:15:38.850 --> 00:15:41.110 November 1st. And, intend to do just about every day 282 00:15:41.149 --> 00:15:44.350 this month as a special series. And then we'll see 283 00:15:44.370 --> 00:15:46.590 where we go from there with it. And so part 284 00:15:46.649 --> 00:15:49.330 one is up already. The first half hour and the 285 00:15:49.350 --> 00:15:52.129 second half hour goes up tomorrow. If you're not a 286 00:15:52.149 --> 00:15:57.320 VIP member and that interests you, go VIP. pwtorch.com slash 287 00:15:57.529 --> 00:16:01.600 go VIP. It is Apple podcast compatible. In fact, when 288 00:16:01.620 --> 00:16:03.360 you sign up, you'll get a link. You just click 289 00:16:03.460 --> 00:16:06.059 on it and it'll just open up on your phone 290 00:16:06.220 --> 00:16:08.570 and you're subscribed. You don't have to cut and paste 291 00:16:08.639 --> 00:16:11.850 URLs or go to advanced settings or enter passwords, but 292 00:16:11.870 --> 00:16:13.370 it only works as long as you're a current member. 293 00:16:13.389 --> 00:16:15.669 It's a cool setup that we started this year. If 294 00:16:15.690 --> 00:16:17.309 you're not on iPhone or don't use a native app, 295 00:16:17.330 --> 00:16:20.769 we work on more podcast apps than ever, including Android, 296 00:16:20.789 --> 00:16:24.470 which is a phone I have, Samsung Galaxy. And when 297 00:16:24.490 --> 00:16:26.389 you sign up and get VIP, you get 30-plus years 298 00:16:26.429 --> 00:16:28.809 of archives, and you can read. Speaking of the trial, 299 00:16:29.710 --> 00:16:31.590 my original coverage of being at the trial for three weeks, 300 00:16:31.629 --> 00:16:34.990 we put out a 24-page double issue after two weeks 301 00:16:35.029 --> 00:16:37.820 of the trial and then another issue dedicated almost entirely 302 00:16:37.860 --> 00:16:40.539 to the trial after the verdict was read. That is 303 00:16:40.580 --> 00:16:44.659 available in the archives, and it's fascinating and worth reading 304 00:16:45.279 --> 00:16:48.220 as either a warm-up or a supplement to the documentary. 305 00:16:48.259 --> 00:16:51.679 It was a really amazing time and a big story 306 00:16:51.720 --> 00:16:54.580 to cover. So lots of reasons to go VIP. Plus, 307 00:16:54.700 --> 00:16:56.610 this show has the ads and plugs removed for the 308 00:16:56.620 --> 00:17:00.590 VIP members on our podcast feed. So check out details, pwtorch.com 309 00:17:00.610 --> 00:17:04.950 slash go VIP. Let's give out the phone numbers for 310 00:17:04.990 --> 00:17:07.789 today's show here and the email. Our phone number, if 311 00:17:07.809 --> 00:17:10.410 you want to call and talk about SmackDown, is 347-215-8558. 312 00:17:10.789 --> 00:17:19.029 That's 347-215-8558. And when you call, push 1 on your 313 00:17:19.069 --> 00:17:22.339 keypad to flag you on our switchboard. Also, you can 314 00:17:22.390 --> 00:17:31.740 email the show, WadeKellerPodcast at PWTorch.com. That is WadeKellerPodcast at PWTorch.com. 315 00:17:32.240 --> 00:17:36.359 We are hoping to hear from Jordan in Evansville. who 316 00:17:36.400 --> 00:17:39.690 attended tonight as our on-site correspondent. I didn't get confirmation 317 00:17:39.730 --> 00:17:42.289 today from him, but he did indicate he was going 318 00:17:42.309 --> 00:17:45.089 to be calling in. So we'll look for him as 319 00:17:45.150 --> 00:17:48.049 the show progresses. But in the meantime, Brandon, we got 320 00:17:48.069 --> 00:17:51.900 more to talk about on this show. Let's go ahead 321 00:17:52.000 --> 00:17:56.740 and go to our first call of the show here. 322 00:17:57.259 --> 00:17:59.680 And I believe this is Sean from Murfreesboro. Sean, welcome 323 00:17:59.700 --> 00:17:59.980 to the show. 324 00:18:01.299 --> 00:18:03.579 Wade, it's only been two weeks, but, man, it seems 325 00:18:03.599 --> 00:18:04.220 like forever. 326 00:18:04.279 --> 00:18:04.559 I don't know. 327 00:18:04.619 --> 00:18:06.960 I was thinking that today. Number one, you're throwing me off. 328 00:18:07.140 --> 00:18:09.119 When you put me on first, you always throw me off. 329 00:18:09.180 --> 00:18:11.460 Second of all, it feels like it's been forever, but 330 00:18:11.509 --> 00:18:12.109 it really hasn't. 331 00:18:12.130 --> 00:18:16.329 Yeah. It's only been two weeks, but, man, I missed you. 332 00:18:16.470 --> 00:18:17.349 Where have you been? 333 00:18:17.490 --> 00:18:19.170 Brandon, good to talk to you guys. How are you doing? 334 00:18:20.849 --> 00:18:21.519 Where have you been? 335 00:18:22.359 --> 00:18:22.759 I've been. 336 00:18:22.779 --> 00:18:26.779 Oh, God. I've been around, well... I mean, it's always 337 00:18:26.819 --> 00:18:29.420 good to talk to Zach, you know, and Nick Barbati. 338 00:18:29.460 --> 00:18:30.480 I mean, what a guy. 339 00:18:31.059 --> 00:18:31.660 But come on. 340 00:18:31.680 --> 00:18:34.680 You're the– Wade, you're still the man. You're still the 341 00:18:34.720 --> 00:18:37.299 guy I always want to talk to. I mean, you're 342 00:18:37.319 --> 00:18:39.380 just that good. I mean, no, but I was going 343 00:18:39.400 --> 00:18:42.470 to say real quick, I am looking forward to hearing– 344 00:18:42.599 --> 00:18:45.119 I haven't heard the first

interview with Tony Condit, so 345 00:18:45.259 --> 00:18:47.500 I'm looking forward to hearing that first part tonight before 346 00:18:47.539 --> 00:18:50.079 I go to bed and then obviously catching part two tomorrow. 347 00:18:50.099 --> 00:18:53.069 And go VIP, guys. You're stupid if you don't. You're 348 00:18:53.089 --> 00:18:56.420 missing out, man. Like, wrestling– up your ear. There's just 349 00:18:56.480 --> 00:18:58.960 so much stuff to listen to. It's just, you know, again, 350 00:18:59.059 --> 00:19:01.680 it's fantastic. Brandon, how are you, man? Good, good. 351 00:19:01.720 --> 00:19:02.099 How are you? 352 00:19:02.240 --> 00:19:05.670 I'm actually, I'm, uh, I'm, I'm recovering. I'm on, well, 353 00:19:05.930 --> 00:19:10.930 I'm on about hour five since getting my booster shot today. So, uh, no, uh, 354 00:19:11.089 --> 00:19:13.769 no negative effects to report thus far. A little, little 355 00:19:13.809 --> 00:19:16.410 bit of soreness in the arm, but feeling a little tired. 356 00:19:16.490 --> 00:19:17.190 Otherwise good. 357 00:19:18.089 --> 00:19:18.309 Cool. 358 00:19:18.589 --> 00:19:18.809 Cool. 359 00:19:18.829 --> 00:19:21.390 Very cool. Um, wait and i will figure out i'm 360 00:19:21.450 --> 00:19:23.750 sorry for your tough loss sunday i know it's been 361 00:19:23.769 --> 00:19:26.009 five days and i didn't bring it up but i 362 00:19:26.029 --> 00:19:28.250 apologize it's just you know. 363 00:19:29.670 --> 00:19:31.950 Oh wade you and i are at war this weekend 364 00:19:31.970 --> 00:19:32.789 that's right. 365 00:19:34.170 --> 00:19:36.480 I i i as of sunday stop looking ahead in 366 00:19:36.500 --> 00:19:40.079 the calendar what what's coming up what's happening this weekend. 367 00:19:39.740 --> 00:19:42.299 Your your vikings play my ravens. 368 00:19:42.319 --> 00:19:46.200 Yeah i can't can't wait for another heartbreaking well i 369 00:19:46.259 --> 00:19:49.089 and i don't know i i i I rejuvenate my, 370 00:19:49.809 --> 00:19:52.450 my optimism after a few days. So I'm, I'm ready 371 00:19:52.470 --> 00:19:56.769 to start thinking about him again. That was tough though. 372 00:19:56.910 --> 00:19:57.450 That was tough. 373 00:19:57.470 --> 00:20:00.950 Okay. We'll go back to SmackDown. I, SmackDown was very, 374 00:20:01.519 --> 00:20:04.059 very ho-hum tonight. I, I didn't really care for it 375 00:20:04.119 --> 00:20:05.680 in a lot of ways. It was just kind of, 376 00:20:06.450 --> 00:20:08.549 paint my numbers which I guess is not a bad 377 00:20:08.630 --> 00:20:11.029 thing but it just it didn't tickle my fancy I 378 00:20:11.049 --> 00:20:15.789 guess I'll say that the I guess I agree with 379 00:20:15.829 --> 00:20:17.650 what you said Wade I really don't want Roman and 380 00:20:17.690 --> 00:20:19.769 Biggie I really hope they don't do that either I 381 00:20:20.170 --> 00:20:23.670 just kind of oh Survivor Series just kind of doesn't 382 00:20:23.730 --> 00:20:25.369 excite me right now either

but I wanted to talk 383 00:20:25.710 --> 00:20:27.809 I really wanted to switch gears a little bit and 384 00:20:27.849 --> 00:20:31.450 go back to the Shotzi promo yeah she got tonight 385 00:20:31.569 --> 00:20:34.869 which I'm glad they did that I thought it was 386 00:20:35.690 --> 00:20:38.230 good from she showed a lot of fire a lot 387 00:20:38.269 --> 00:20:40.549 of you know mean fire and i like that part 388 00:20:40.569 --> 00:20:42.880 of it i didn't like the material her saying i 389 00:20:42.900 --> 00:20:45.500 lost support of wb universe like they don't really know 390 00:20:45.519 --> 00:20:48.500 you well enough to lose support for you i didn't 391 00:20:48.559 --> 00:20:50.859 like that what do you think about her promo just 392 00:20:50.900 --> 00:20:53.480 the material and the delivery because i like the delivery 393 00:20:53.519 --> 00:20:55.740 didn't really care for the material what'd you guys think about. 394 00:20:55.609 --> 00:20:58.329 That yeah i'm i my first thought was i like 395 00:20:58.369 --> 00:20:59.990 her better as a heel than a baby face as 396 00:21:00.049 --> 00:21:01.849 an act i thought as a baby face she was 397 00:21:02.289 --> 00:21:06.029 you know just obnoxious and not likable and kind of just, 398 00:21:06.269 --> 00:21:08.150 I don't know. Um, and the tank thing just never 399 00:21:08.170 --> 00:21:10.019 did anything for me. I mean like, woohoo, I'm in 400 00:21:10.160 --> 00:21:13.599 a child sized tank shooting nerf darts at people and 401 00:21:13.660 --> 00:21:16.920 I'm hooping and hollering and acting ridiculous. I didn't like that. 402 00:21:16.940 --> 00:21:20.359 So this is an improvement. It would be tough not 403 00:21:20.380 --> 00:21:23.269 to improve on that. I thought she carried herself as 404 00:21:23.329 --> 00:21:27.670 a snotty heel. Well, I think this, like you say, Sean, 405 00:21:27.710 --> 00:21:32.200 the delivery was good. Um, I can live with, her 406 00:21:32.240 --> 00:21:35.509 not having had support from the WWE Universe on SmackDown 407 00:21:35.529 --> 00:21:38.230 because she's so new. I can live with that because, 408 00:21:38.250 --> 00:21:40.529 you know, it's sort of something he'll say. Oh, I 409 00:21:40.549 --> 00:21:42.289 lost the, you know, it's the WWE speak, but I 410 00:21:42.309 --> 00:21:44.670 lost support of the fans. So, you know, screw them. 411 00:21:44.710 --> 00:21:47.069 And sometimes heels can be hasty in coming to that 412 00:21:47.109 --> 00:21:50.000 conclusion or use a small sample size to overreact. And 413 00:21:50.059 --> 00:21:53.700 you can give them a little more leeway in that respect. But, 414 00:21:53.880 --> 00:21:57.099 you know, it is absolutely a stretch. But mostly I 415 00:21:57.140 --> 00:22:01.339 came away from that liking it. You know, I'm going 416 00:22:01.359 --> 00:22:04.059 to run... over Sasha Banks and anyone else that gets 417 00:22:04.099 --> 00:22:05.440 in my way and I don't need a tank to 418 00:22:05.500 --> 00:22:08.660 do it. I would normally groan at sort of the 419 00:22:08.700 --> 00:22:10.740 pun or the play on words there, but I'm like, 420 00:22:10.779 --> 00:22:15.319 if that means the tank is gone, then I'm happy. Brandon, 421 00:22:15.339 --> 00:22:15.900 your thoughts on that? 422 00:22:16.920 --> 00:22:19.000 Yeah, that was the first thing I was going to 423 00:22:19.039 --> 00:22:24.420 mention was that I don't really care for the super 424 00:22:24.609 --> 00:22:27.349 overly scripted close to the promo. I was just one 425 00:22:27.369 --> 00:22:29.549 of those things that someone would never say naturally in 426 00:22:29.589 --> 00:22:32.279 conversation unless they wrote it down beforehand. And if you're 427 00:22:32.299 --> 00:22:35.000 doing that, then, you know, are you really a badass 428 00:22:35.039 --> 00:22:37.119 heel or just someone who writes down things they want 429 00:22:37.140 --> 00:22:40.019 to say to mock someone else? Like it, it's, it, 430 00:22:40.240 --> 00:22:45.289 it came off rather poorly, but I too was totally 431 00:22:45.329 --> 00:22:47.630 fine with it because it seems like it means the 432 00:22:47.710 --> 00:22:49.950 end of the tank. And I also think that the 433 00:22:49.970 --> 00:22:54.759 tank came off poorly. It was a little ridiculous. It 434 00:22:54.779 --> 00:22:58.009 was kind of, a uh it was kind of dragging 435 00:22:58.049 --> 00:23:01.660 the whole gimmick down i i don't think that we 436 00:23:01.980 --> 00:23:04.799 are to take shotzi all that seriously when she's riding 437 00:23:04.839 --> 00:23:07.420 to the ring on a tank so if if this 438 00:23:07.519 --> 00:23:10.130 means the end of that chapter of her character i 439 00:23:10.509 --> 00:23:14.269 am happy and and uh more than willing to excuse 440 00:23:14.329 --> 00:23:16.289 an overly scripted line at the end of the promo 441 00:23:16.630 --> 00:23:19.349 uh i thought that the the promo was fine her 442 00:23:19.369 --> 00:23:23.289 delivery was okay i think that She probably has some 443 00:23:23.349 --> 00:23:25.839 room to grow in that, in that role. She doesn't 444 00:23:25.859 --> 00:23:29.380 seem overly comfortable on, on the microphone quite yet. Um, 445 00:23:29.420 --> 00:23:32.200 but that's okay. I think she was serviceable enough to 446 00:23:32.680 --> 00:23:35.420 come off, uh, like, like a strong heel tonight. And 447 00:23:35.480 --> 00:23:38.140 I'm interested to see what kind of direction they go 448 00:23:38.180 --> 00:23:41.519 with her. They definitely need depth on the women's side on, 449 00:23:41.740 --> 00:23:44.829 on both SmackDown and raw. So if they can get 450 00:23:44.970 --> 00:23:48.789 her into sort of a cemented position where she's kind 451 00:23:48.809 --> 00:23:52.349 of a weekend week out character, uh, that is solidified 452 00:23:52.390 --> 00:23:55.170 within that division, that's a huge positive. 453 00:23:57.329 --> 00:23:59.259 What have you thought, Brandon, of

her work in the 454 00:23:59.319 --> 00:24:02.440 ring over time? I mean, and just the idea of 455 00:24:02.500 --> 00:24:06.880 giving her this promotion and this push and a match 456 00:24:06.900 --> 00:24:09.099 with Sasha. I mean, in a general sense, I am 457 00:24:09.880 --> 00:24:15.829 generically happy with elevating new women in WWE for sure. 458 00:24:16.470 --> 00:24:18.009 They just need more depth. When you look at the 459 00:24:18.049 --> 00:24:20.900 depth chart right now, uh, post draft, it's like, where 460 00:24:20.920 --> 00:24:22.200 are they going to get, you know, where's this going 461 00:24:22.220 --> 00:24:24.890 to come from? Um, where are you on, on Shotzi getting, uh, 462 00:24:25.809 --> 00:24:26.990 getting this push from what you've seen of her? 463 00:24:28.349 --> 00:24:31.430 I thought, I thought she was fine in NXT. I never, 464 00:24:32.069 --> 00:24:36.509 I never was overly impressed. I was also nothing she 465 00:24:36.569 --> 00:24:40.430 ever did stood out negatively. I mean, I thought, you know, her, 466 00:24:40.670 --> 00:24:44.289 her tag stuff, uh, her tag stuff there with, with 467 00:24:44.309 --> 00:24:48.119 Ember moon was fine. Um, And moving over to SmackDown, 468 00:24:48.240 --> 00:24:50.220 I don't think the sample size is large enough to 469 00:24:50.279 --> 00:24:52.960 really say one way or another. I mean, the team 470 00:24:53.000 --> 00:24:56.700 with Tegan Nox was so short-lived. They were mostly put 471 00:24:57.279 --> 00:25:01.410 in enhancement roles, more or less. I mean, they hardly 472 00:25:01.710 --> 00:25:03.390 even appeared. And when they did, it seemed like they 473 00:25:03.410 --> 00:25:07.569 were losing in relatively short order. So the first time 474 00:25:07.589 --> 00:25:09.750 that I was impressed by what she did in the 475 00:25:09.809 --> 00:25:13.440 ring was last week against Charlotte Flair. And I don't 476 00:25:13.480 --> 00:25:15.319 know how much of that was Shotzi and how much 477 00:25:15.359 --> 00:25:19.880 of it was Charlotte carrying the match. But I was 478 00:25:19.940 --> 00:25:22.650 impressed overall by what the two of them were able 479 00:25:22.690 --> 00:25:25.869 to do together. So I'm looking forward to seeing more 480 00:25:25.890 --> 00:25:26.079 of it. 481 00:25:28.509 --> 00:25:29.029 Hey, everyone. 482 00:25:29.069 --> 00:25:31.789 Greg Parks here. You've probably heard me hosting Wrestling Night 483 00:25:31.809 --> 00:25:34.890 in America after pay-per-views and also co-hosting the Tuesday flagship 484 00:25:34.910 --> 00:25:37.960 with Wade Keller. I also host a VIP exclusive podcast 485 00:25:38.079 --> 00:25:40.960 every week called Greg Parks Out Loud. In this podcast, 486 00:25:41.000 --> 00:25:43.079 I delve into a single topic for around 20 minutes, 487 00:25:43.319 --> 00:25:45.160 perfect length for one of your daily commutes or while 488 00:25:45.180 --> 00:25:48.180 walking the dog. A couple of my recent episodes included

489 00:25:48.220 --> 00:25:50.519 a look at TNA as they move to AMC and 490 00:25:50.720 --> 00:25:54.279 WWE and AEW injuries for the year 2025. You can 491 00:25:54.319 --> 00:25:57.400 listen to VIP podcasts with a VIP membership on many platforms, 492 00:25:57.519 --> 00:26:00.500 including on Patreon, Spotify, the Apple Podcasts native app on 493 00:26:00.599 --> 00:26:03.619 iPhone and CarPlay, just about every popular iOS and Android 494 00:26:03.640 --> 00:26:05.940 podcast app out there, and even stream right from the 495 00:26:06.019 --> 00:26:10.920 ad-free PWTorch VIP website. Full details on VIP membership at pwtorch.com 496 00:26:10.960 --> 00:26:14.589 slash govip. As an added bonus, VIP membership means you 497 00:26:14.630 --> 00:26:17.529 won't hear this commercial again or any commercials as commercial 498 00:26:17.569 --> 00:26:20.069 breaks are skipped right over on the VIP podcast feed 499 00:26:20.250 --> 00:26:22.910 in addition to all the commercial-free VIP podcasts. 500 00:26:23.299 --> 00:26:23.710 Check it out. 501 00:26:23.880 --> 00:26:25.779 We'd love for you to join our community and unlock 502 00:26:25.859 --> 00:26:28.119 access to all our VIP exclusive content. 503 00:26:35.220 --> 00:26:36.329 Sean, thank you for any follow-up. 504 00:26:37.549 --> 00:26:40.960 Going back to what you said, as far as what 505 00:26:41.039 --> 00:26:44.119 I thought, I haven't been a fan of Shotzi. She's 506 00:26:44.400 --> 00:26:47.119 gotten better in the ring, but I guess I didn't 507 00:26:47.180 --> 00:26:50.529 care for the match as much as maybe you did, Brandon. 508 00:26:50.849 --> 00:26:52.089 I thought it was fine, but it seemed to me 509 00:26:52.109 --> 00:26:53.950 like Charlotte was caring a little more of it and 510 00:26:53.970 --> 00:26:56.890 trying to make her look good, which was cool. I 511 00:26:57.170 --> 00:26:58.690 think Shotzi's got a lot more work to do, but 512 00:26:58.730 --> 00:27:00.980 I think this... Again, I think I said last week 513 00:27:01.019 --> 00:27:03.109 a little, as far as I think this match will help, 514 00:27:03.380 --> 00:27:05.630 this feud will help Shotzi in the ring. Because Sasha, 515 00:27:06.009 --> 00:27:07.890 you can't go wrong having her as an opponent to 516 00:27:07.930 --> 00:27:10.890 work with. I mean, she's going to make you usually 517 00:27:10.910 --> 00:27:12.970 look like a million bucks. And so I think that's 518 00:27:13.009 --> 00:27:15.190 going to help Shotzi. But I think this was a 519 00:27:15.210 --> 00:27:17.460 good start. You know, I think she'll get better on 520 00:27:17.500 --> 00:27:19.400 promos as she goes along. So I'm kind of curious 521 00:27:19.420 --> 00:27:21.339 to see where they go with her and what she 522 00:27:21.380 --> 00:27:23.849 can do. Because I'm just worried, you know, I don't 523 00:27:23.890 --> 00:27:27.369 see how Shotzi will beat Sasha unless they do. So 524 00:27:27.529 --> 00:27:29.809 I don't know how she, she'd

have to look really 525 00:27:29.869 --> 00:27:32.480 good for it to help her moving along. And so 526 00:27:32.500 --> 00:27:33.960 we'll see where that goes. But the next thing I 527 00:27:33.960 --> 00:27:35.400 was going to kind of going into the more of 528 00:27:35.420 --> 00:27:38.960 the women was guys, where are they going with Naomi 529 00:27:39.000 --> 00:27:42.880 and Shayna? I just named Naomi and Sonia. I just, 530 00:27:43.920 --> 00:27:46.180 it's kind of getting old now. Like I know they 531 00:27:46.220 --> 00:27:49.710 just keep putting heat on Naomi and it's like the 532 00:27:49.730 --> 00:27:53.559 match was not good. The, the, finish was, you know, 533 00:27:53.640 --> 00:27:56.720 just what it was. And then Sonia coming out and 534 00:27:56.769 --> 00:28:00.390 doing that. Where, where do you think they're ultimately going 535 00:28:00.410 --> 00:28:02.109 with it? Cause I just don't see the, I mean, 536 00:28:02.170 --> 00:28:04.130 they're just drawing it out for me too long. Where 537 00:28:04.150 --> 00:28:04.750 do you think they're going? 538 00:28:05.950 --> 00:28:08.650 I'm taking a wait and see on this. I'm a 539 00:28:08.690 --> 00:28:14.319 fan of Sonia Deville and her performance. I think she's 540 00:28:14.440 --> 00:28:17.980 been believable and nuanced and, and had, had shown that 541 00:28:18.000 --> 00:28:20.059 at different times, you know, even before taking on this 542 00:28:20.140 --> 00:28:22.930 role and, And this gives her something to do. And again, 543 00:28:22.950 --> 00:28:26.630 I go back to sort of my generic wish for 544 00:28:26.829 --> 00:28:29.369 more women to be elevated and put in the mix with, 545 00:28:31.690 --> 00:28:33.799 put in the mix where it seems like there are 546 00:28:33.880 --> 00:28:37.880 significance and there's not just this big gap between the 547 00:28:37.960 --> 00:28:41.700 established top four or fives or six women and the rest. 548 00:28:41.960 --> 00:28:45.240 And so, you know, This is giving her some TV time. 549 00:28:45.329 --> 00:28:47.150 I don't know what the result is, but I'm okay 550 00:28:47.190 --> 00:28:49.309 with it as long as the announcers are saying out 551 00:28:49.349 --> 00:28:52.309 loud what we're thinking and what you're thinking, which is why? 552 00:28:53.210 --> 00:28:55.650 What's Sonya's beef with Naomi? How does this end? Why 553 00:28:56.089 --> 00:28:59.609 is this going on like this? And, you know, Baszler's 554 00:28:59.630 --> 00:29:02.039 just kind of a good sort of heavy to be 555 00:29:02.119 --> 00:29:05.680 in this role, you know, doing the beatdowns. I'm okay 556 00:29:05.720 --> 00:29:07.819 with a slow build so far. I think I'm higher 557 00:29:07.880 --> 00:29:09.319 on it than you, Sean. Brandon, what do you think? 558 00:29:10.519 --> 00:29:14.089 I think I'm somewhere in the middle. I'm completely fine 559 00:29:14.109 --> 00:29:20.349 with the Naomi and Deville aspect of the angle. I 560 00:29:20.410 --> 00:29:23.910 think that the slow build has mostly been fine. It 561 00:29:24.009 --> 00:29:27.089 seems pretty clear to me that they are going for, eventually, 562 00:29:27.109 --> 00:29:29.369 a return to the ring for Sonya, where the two 563 00:29:29.410 --> 00:29:32.690 of them face off. I can't imagine it going in 564 00:29:32.769 --> 00:29:36.589 any other direction. Perhaps it does, but to me, it 565 00:29:36.910 --> 00:29:39.970 seems to be headed in that direction, where Sonya eventually 566 00:29:40.069 --> 00:29:42.849 does step in the ring with Naomi and Naomi, I assume, 567 00:29:42.910 --> 00:29:47.190 beats her. But in the meantime, what I have not 568 00:29:47.289 --> 00:29:50.119 liked at all about this angle is the inclusion of 569 00:29:50.150 --> 00:29:54.579 Shayna Baszler, because I think that they had something with 570 00:29:54.619 --> 00:29:57.369 Shayna for the first time in a long time. She 571 00:29:57.410 --> 00:30:01.589 took out Nia Jax and then she she took out 572 00:30:01.630 --> 00:30:04.369 Dana Brooke. She attempted to take out Doudrop and then 573 00:30:04.809 --> 00:30:08.630 just loses cleanly to Doudrop moves over to SmackDown. And 574 00:30:08.690 --> 00:30:11.089 I think a lot of people, myself included, were hoping 575 00:30:11.170 --> 00:30:14.410 that the move to SmackDown would give us an opportunity 576 00:30:14.450 --> 00:30:18.799 to sort of forget about the Doudrop loss and continue 577 00:30:18.859 --> 00:30:22.680 that track of this this killer that Shayna Baszler had 578 00:30:22.740 --> 00:30:25.950 been for the last month or so on Raw. And instead, 579 00:30:26.069 --> 00:30:30.170 she just gets gummed up in this angle where she's 580 00:30:30.549 --> 00:30:34.920 winning either, you know, in short order because of a 581 00:30:35.640 --> 00:30:39.720 quick count from Sonya Deville or in tonight's case, because 582 00:30:39.759 --> 00:30:43.859 of the match being restarted after she loses on both 583 00:30:43.940 --> 00:30:48.220 occasions in these matches with Naomi. Shayna has either actually 584 00:30:48.279 --> 00:30:51.740 lost the match. or at the very least visibly lost 585 00:30:51.779 --> 00:30:55.160 the match. Uh, even if it wasn't actually, you know, 586 00:30:55.619 --> 00:30:59.329 fully called. So I have a big problem with that. 587 00:30:59.609 --> 00:31:01.630 I just think that Shane is too talented and too 588 00:31:01.690 --> 00:31:05.930 important in a division that is this thin to be 589 00:31:06.109 --> 00:31:09.049 utilized in this way. I think that there's other women 590 00:31:09.549 --> 00:31:14.079 that they could have put in the role of Naomi's 591 00:31:14.119 --> 00:31:17.500 weekly opponent to be the quote unquote heavy for, for 592 00:31:17.559 --> 00:31:20.619 Sonia before Sonia actually gets in the ring. And I 593 00:31:20.640 --> 00:31:22.519 think it would have worked better because some of those 594 00:31:22.579 --> 00:31:25.140 other women that they

might've used in that role maybe 595 00:31:25.200 --> 00:31:28.319 could use a rub from getting a cheap win over Naomi. 596 00:31:28.359 --> 00:31:31.259 Whereas I don't think Shayna gains anything with cheap wins. 597 00:31:31.299 --> 00:31:32.160 I think she loses. 598 00:31:34.240 --> 00:31:36.259 Yeah. Yeah. Sean, back to you for your thoughts. I 599 00:31:36.259 --> 00:31:36.960 think some good points there. 600 00:31:38.460 --> 00:31:41.089 Yeah, no, I agree. And I'm with you on the Shayna, 601 00:31:41.240 --> 00:31:43.049 you know, being included in it. I didn't really like 602 00:31:43.109 --> 00:31:45.029 that from the start. And part of, I guess what 603 00:31:45.089 --> 00:31:49.349 I'm kind of not liking is Sonia, I like Sonia, 604 00:31:49.670 --> 00:31:52.130 you know, more than Naomi. And I think that's my 605 00:31:52.190 --> 00:31:54.990 problem is like, Sonia is going to wrestle her. Naomi's 606 00:31:55.009 --> 00:31:58.329 going to win. It's Naomi's, you know, not that great 607 00:31:58.349 --> 00:32:00.759 in the ring. She's okay, but she's not great. I mean, 608 00:32:00.799 --> 00:32:02.279 it's like, I don't, I'm not really going to get 609 00:32:02.359 --> 00:32:05.480 behind her. And I think that's ultimately where they're going 610 00:32:05.500 --> 00:32:08.299 to go whenever they finish it, but where's Naomi going 611 00:32:08.319 --> 00:32:09.559 to go. And then they're going to put her in 612 00:32:09.579 --> 00:32:11.480 maybe higher spots, but I just don't know if she's 613 00:32:11.960 --> 00:32:14.029 like good enough to be in those higher spots. I mean, 614 00:32:14.049 --> 00:32:16.660 I'm curious to see where they go and, I just 615 00:32:16.700 --> 00:32:19.309 haven't been an overall fan, but I'm willing to play 616 00:32:19.349 --> 00:32:21.710 it out and see what happens. And then the last 617 00:32:21.750 --> 00:32:26.289 thing I was going to bring up was going to 618 00:32:27.309 --> 00:32:30.609 Los Lotharios is what they're being called now, Garza and Carrillo, 619 00:32:30.950 --> 00:32:33.970 which was, you know, I guess kind of a cool name. 620 00:32:34.009 --> 00:32:39.190 But I just, I don't know, like, I'm glad they're 621 00:32:39.230 --> 00:32:41.109 getting a push and I want, I want to see, 622 00:32:41.130 --> 00:32:42.650 you know, what they do with them. Cause they, they 623 00:32:42.690 --> 00:32:44.490 need to be pushed. I mean, they need more depth, 624 00:32:44.710 --> 00:32:46.420 especially in the tag teams. I got to get more 625 00:32:46.460 --> 00:32:49.079 tag teams, but you know, I'm just worried because Vince 626 00:32:49.119 --> 00:32:51.119 doesn't usually care about them. They're just going to kind 627 00:32:51.160 --> 00:32:54.450 of plot around, win some, lose some, whatever. But I just, 628 00:32:55.029 --> 00:32:57.470 want them to do something with their characters. Like other 629 00:32:57.509 --> 00:33:00.029 than like, we're prettier than, you know, better looking than 630 00:33:00.089 --> 00:33:01.769 everybody and all this kind of stuff. I just want 631 00:33:01.789 --> 00:33:04.150 them to do more with, with them as an app, 632 00:33:04.589 --> 00:33:06.730 as a tag team, other than we're just better looking 633 00:33:06.769 --> 00:33:09.150 than everybody. I want them to be like bad-ass guys, 634 00:33:09.609 --> 00:33:12.750 bad-ass heels. So what do you think they've done with them? 635 00:33:12.809 --> 00:33:14.730 And where do you think they might go with them? 636 00:33:15.450 --> 00:33:18.210 And I'll let, hopefully Nick's there. Cause if I say 637 00:33:18.230 --> 00:33:20.009 his name, he's not there. It makes me look bad, 638 00:33:20.069 --> 00:33:22.329 but hopefully he's on there and all the other callers. 639 00:33:22.390 --> 00:33:25.599 I'm curious to see what you guys thought. And, Brandon, 640 00:33:25.619 --> 00:33:27.940 I appreciate you, man. Wade, you're the best. I always 641 00:33:27.960 --> 00:33:29.140 appreciate you guys taking my call. 642 00:33:29.740 --> 00:33:31.059 Thanks, Sean. Great to talk to you again. 643 00:33:31.079 --> 00:33:31.400 Yeah, thanks. 644 00:33:32.440 --> 00:33:35.019 Yeah, I'm kind of cool with what they're doing with 645 00:33:35.039 --> 00:33:40.130 Angel Garza and Humberto Carrillo, too. I mean, I don't 646 00:33:41.049 --> 00:33:44.029 see them as badass. I don't know. I mean, I 647 00:33:44.049 --> 00:33:45.430 guess it depends what you mean by badass. If you 648 00:33:45.450 --> 00:33:47.130 mean just make sure they kind of have a credible 649 00:33:47.250 --> 00:33:52.269 edge to them, yeah, definitely. But, I mean, they're leaning 650 00:33:52.309 --> 00:33:55.890 hard into– a shtick that seems to fit their look, 651 00:33:55.930 --> 00:33:59.250 their appearance, their style, their age. And it's bringing out 652 00:33:59.369 --> 00:34:01.450 a personality in Humberto that's kind of fun to see 653 00:34:01.509 --> 00:34:04.759 instead of just sort of, you know, the likable, dopey, 654 00:34:04.799 --> 00:34:07.059 smiling guy who gets beat up and takes great bumps. 655 00:34:07.180 --> 00:34:10.179 Now he's, you know, I think looking like he belongs 656 00:34:10.239 --> 00:34:13.239 next to Angel Garza in terms of an arrogant, full 657 00:34:13.260 --> 00:34:15.739 of himself heel. So I think this is getting more 658 00:34:15.840 --> 00:34:18.429 out of him. And I mean, one of the things 659 00:34:18.469 --> 00:34:22.510 with the draft that I think, baking a draft into 660 00:34:22.530 --> 00:34:25.369 the format like they do to their calendar, I think 661 00:34:25.409 --> 00:34:27.989 it does cause them to just sit down and brainstorm 662 00:34:28.030 --> 00:34:31.610 and reassess who aren't we taking advantage of? What more 663 00:34:32.340 --> 00:34:36.440 can we do with certain people? Who can we present 664 00:34:36.480 --> 00:34:39.639 in a new way and repackage and elevate as a 665 00:34:39.659 --> 00:34:41.039 result of it? And I think

we're seeing a lot 666 00:34:41.059 --> 00:34:42.840 of it. And that's why in the two, three weeks 667 00:34:42.860 --> 00:34:45.650 leading up to Crown Jewel, I was just like, I 668 00:34:45.670 --> 00:34:47.090 just want to get past this event and get to 669 00:34:47.130 --> 00:34:49.219 the draft because I know this stuff happens. And It 670 00:34:49.239 --> 00:34:51.340 doesn't all work and we don't like everything that they 671 00:34:51.360 --> 00:34:54.090 do with everybody, but it's more interesting because you are 672 00:34:54.170 --> 00:34:58.110 seeing what feels like the result of some brainstorming and 673 00:34:58.250 --> 00:35:01.489 open-mindedness towards talent that's been sitting in the back getting stale. 674 00:35:02.250 --> 00:35:04.889 So again, in a generic sense, I'm for it. And 675 00:35:04.929 --> 00:35:06.650 in a specific sense, I think they're doing a good 676 00:35:06.670 --> 00:35:09.269 job and they're good. You know, like I want to 677 00:35:09.329 --> 00:35:11.659 see them in tag team matches. I think if they're 678 00:35:11.679 --> 00:35:13.760 going to be in tag matches and they're protected somewhat, 679 00:35:14.480 --> 00:35:17.019 they're going to be good. And it's good for New 680 00:35:17.059 --> 00:35:20.550 Day and the Usos And the Viking writers have opponents 681 00:35:21.170 --> 00:35:23.849 that aren't just each other over and over. Brandon, your thoughts. 682 00:35:24.969 --> 00:35:28.110 Yeah, I'm I'm I'm cool with this in theory. I 683 00:35:28.150 --> 00:35:31.110 think that like like you brought up and like Sean 684 00:35:31.130 --> 00:35:34.650 brought up, it's it's really crucial that they get depth 685 00:35:34.710 --> 00:35:38.500 in the tag team division. They they very frequently during 686 00:35:38.539 --> 00:35:42.320 these drafts, they'll oftentimes break teams up sort of arbitrarily 687 00:35:42.400 --> 00:35:46.809 and especially in the women's division. and send guys to 688 00:35:46.849 --> 00:35:50.570 different rosters for seemingly no reason, and then create this 689 00:35:50.630 --> 00:35:53.829 conundrum for themselves that doesn't really need to happen. And 690 00:35:54.289 --> 00:35:56.849 so to have this influx of new teams on SmackDown, 691 00:35:56.869 --> 00:36:00.269 I think is helpful. The problem though, of course, is 692 00:36:00.309 --> 00:36:03.130 just that every year they kind of do this. And 693 00:36:03.230 --> 00:36:07.219 then inevitably these guys and gals just get lost in 694 00:36:07.239 --> 00:36:10.719 the shuffle and are quickly defined down. And then you're 695 00:36:10.760 --> 00:36:13.650 left with, the Usos versus the New Day for the 696 00:36:13.690 --> 00:36:17.449 10th time or the Usos versus the Street Profits. I 697 00:36:17.530 --> 00:36:21.960 think that is ultimately what WWE just keeps going back 698 00:36:22.019 --> 00:36:24.900 to over and over, no matter who they have waiting 699 00:36:24.920 --> 00:36:28.119 in the wings. So, you know, I

want to give 700 00:36:28.139 --> 00:36:30.019 them the benefit of the doubt and say that this 701 00:36:30.059 --> 00:36:33.420 time could be different, but history suggests that it won't be. 702 00:36:33.559 --> 00:36:35.840 So for me, it's kind of a wait and see. 703 00:36:36.019 --> 00:36:39.840 I think Garza and Carrillo have done an admirable job 704 00:36:40.219 --> 00:36:43.340 in this role so far. Carrillo seems sort of like 705 00:36:43.380 --> 00:36:47.280 a plug and play to, to replace Andrade in some respects. 706 00:36:47.639 --> 00:36:50.780 I mean, I think that the team has done enough 707 00:36:50.929 --> 00:36:55.989 to differentiate itself from that, from that team. It's Carrillo 708 00:36:56.030 --> 00:37:00.590 has taken on Garza's gimmick more than he has slipped 709 00:37:00.630 --> 00:37:03.789 into the Andrade role. So I think that that that's 710 00:37:03.809 --> 00:37:07.269 a good thing. Um, But I'm interested to see where 711 00:37:07.309 --> 00:37:09.809 they go. I think this week was a far better 712 00:37:09.869 --> 00:37:13.719 showing for them than last week where they got involved 713 00:37:13.889 --> 00:37:20.320 in that just ridiculous Halloween match with Nakamura and Rick Boobs. 714 00:37:20.539 --> 00:37:23.360 And I had said in my report for PW Torch 715 00:37:23.420 --> 00:37:28.880 just how disappointing it was to seemingly define a brand 716 00:37:28.920 --> 00:37:33.099 new team on SmackDown down immediately by putting them in 717 00:37:33.159 --> 00:37:37.219 this ridiculous comedy shtick and sort of being subservient in 718 00:37:37.260 --> 00:37:40.659 a way to happy Corbin and, and, and madcap Moss. 719 00:37:40.960 --> 00:37:44.170 And I think that maybe they recognize that, that putting 720 00:37:44.190 --> 00:37:46.829 them in that position last week, wasn't the smartest move. 721 00:37:47.230 --> 00:37:49.710 And they definitely course corrected this week by just having 722 00:37:49.750 --> 00:37:51.530 them in a straight up tag match where they could 723 00:37:51.570 --> 00:37:53.409 showcase what they can do and, and get a win. 724 00:37:56.329 --> 00:38:01.489 Sean did mention Nick from Brattleboro. So that means we 725 00:38:01.730 --> 00:38:04.239 have to go to him and we want to go 726 00:38:04.300 --> 00:38:06.110 to him. Nick, And Brattleboro, welcome. 727 00:38:08.690 --> 00:38:12.690 Huge shout-out to Sean. How are you doing, buddy? Also, 728 00:38:12.730 --> 00:38:14.880 good evening to you, too. How are you guys doing? 729 00:38:15.110 --> 00:38:16.300 Doing great. Good to talk to you. 730 00:38:18.139 --> 00:38:22.340 Yeah, I got my booster three days ago, and I've recovered. 731 00:38:22.559 --> 00:38:29.469 No more arm pain. So hang in there, Brandon. And 732 00:38:29.510 --> 00:38:31.250 I also had a COVID test, and it was negative. 733 00:38:31.269 --> 00:38:32.030 So everything's great. 734 00:38:32.349 --> 00:38:33.250 Anyway.... 735 00:38:34.630 --> 00:38:41.730 Hello, Aaron

Rodgers. Anyway, a little bit more global here. 736 00:38:41.869 --> 00:38:45.010 I agree with Sean that this week's show just didn't 737 00:38:45.239 --> 00:38:48.219 do it for me, and I think what I identified 738 00:38:48.420 --> 00:38:56.739 is this was more sports entertainment SmackDown from, say, maybe 739 00:38:56.800 --> 00:39:02.340 even two years ago than wrestling SmackDown, that it has been... 740 00:39:03.639 --> 00:39:09.030 really through the pandemic and the Thunderdome and the return 741 00:39:09.070 --> 00:39:15.190 to crowds era, it, it, there was so much, um, uh, 742 00:39:15.829 --> 00:39:21.010 Sammy Zane and, and hit row and just so much 743 00:39:21.710 --> 00:39:25.269 sports entertainment stuff, uh, happy talk. And I just, it, 744 00:39:26.360 --> 00:39:33.559 was very boring from a wrestling sports standpoint. 745 00:39:33.920 --> 00:39:35.619 I don't know how often they sit down and think 746 00:39:35.900 --> 00:39:37.199 are we going to have a lot of good wrestling 747 00:39:37.219 --> 00:39:38.130 on the show are we going to have a lot 748 00:39:38.150 --> 00:39:40.789 of good promos on the show are we overdoing it 749 00:39:40.889 --> 00:39:43.170 on some of the things that people are sensitive to 750 00:39:43.650 --> 00:39:50.650 like distraction finishes and corniness and you know I think 751 00:39:50.949 --> 00:39:53.389 Adam Cole is sweating spray tan right now on his chest. 752 00:39:54.719 --> 00:39:56.820 I don't usually get distracted with Rampage in the background, 753 00:39:56.840 --> 00:40:00.079 but I think he's sweating spray on tan right now 754 00:40:00.280 --> 00:40:02.820 on national television. Maybe it's my color balance. 755 00:40:02.920 --> 00:40:06.400 Oh, he's having a Rudy Giuliani moment. 756 00:40:07.199 --> 00:40:07.840 Anyway, sorry. 757 00:40:08.619 --> 00:40:11.360 I pride myself on not losing my train of thought 758 00:40:11.380 --> 00:40:15.679 despite all the distractions I often surround myself with. Yeah, 759 00:40:15.739 --> 00:40:20.230 so this wasn't a show that This was a show 760 00:40:20.250 --> 00:40:23.150 that checked fewer boxes of what I love, although we 761 00:40:23.170 --> 00:40:28.349 haven't gotten into how good Bloodline was tonight. But it 762 00:40:29.590 --> 00:40:32.570 didn't hold back on some of the indulgences. And, you know, 763 00:40:33.289 --> 00:40:39.349 happy Corbin and Madcap Moss and that hilarity. You know, although, 764 00:40:39.530 --> 00:40:41.889 I mean, it was almost worth watching SmackDown. 765 00:40:41.929 --> 00:40:42.969 Heavy quotation marks. Yeah. 766 00:40:43.650 --> 00:40:47.599 Well, it was almost worth watching SmackDown, Brandon, just for. 767 00:40:49.150 --> 00:40:54.159 The Viking Raiders to make fun of... I'm trying to 768 00:40:54.199 --> 00:40:59.099 find the quote here. When they came out, I'm scrolling 769 00:40:59.179 --> 00:41:03.559 to it as I talk. I'm stalling here. The Viking 770 00:41:03.579 --> 00:41:06.159 Raiders

come out and Eric said, they aren't there to 771 00:41:06.199 --> 00:41:08.639 be their guests. Ivar said, we're here to raid Happy 772 00:41:08.679 --> 00:41:13.199 Talk because it's corny and it sucks. I'm like, and 773 00:41:13.219 --> 00:41:16.000 then it was great. Corbin's like the chill guy, not flinching. 774 00:41:16.019 --> 00:41:16.219 He goes. 775 00:41:17.239 --> 00:41:19.579 you guys are still in your Halloween costumes, you know? Like, 776 00:41:19.599 --> 00:41:22.760 what are you doing talking about corniness? So not a 777 00:41:22.980 --> 00:41:24.780 great self-awareness from the Viking Raiders. I cut up the 778 00:41:24.820 --> 00:41:27.059 spit take for the Viking Raiders, having the gall to 779 00:41:27.099 --> 00:41:28.579 call someone else corny as they walk out in their 780 00:41:28.599 --> 00:41:33.300 Viking gear. But at least Corbin responded with it. And, 781 00:41:33.539 --> 00:41:36.380 you know, Madcap Moss's joke was just so stupid, it 782 00:41:36.420 --> 00:41:37.199 was almost kind of funny. 783 00:41:37.820 --> 00:41:39.840 No one was wrong there, by the way. 784 00:41:40.820 --> 00:41:41.079 I know. 785 00:41:41.099 --> 00:41:43.449 That's the thing. Yeah, they're all just staring each other down, 786 00:41:43.489 --> 00:41:47.469 and it's sort of like, You look backstage like, you know, hey, everybody, 787 00:41:47.550 --> 00:41:49.829 you know what they're saying about each other? It's all true, 788 00:41:49.889 --> 00:41:51.849 but it doesn't have to be. You know, you guys 789 00:41:51.889 --> 00:41:53.369 back there are in control of this. You don't have 790 00:41:53.429 --> 00:41:57.159 to be this way. So, yeah, I don't know. Brandon, yeah, 791 00:41:57.179 --> 00:42:01.179 I guess what's your overall take on tonight's episode? Sometimes 792 00:42:01.239 --> 00:42:03.139 I watch and I report and then I do the 793 00:42:03.199 --> 00:42:05.420 show and I'm thinking about specific segments to talk about 794 00:42:05.440 --> 00:42:07.440 and delve into. And I don't kind of have that, 795 00:42:07.659 --> 00:42:10.300 you know, that time to just think, oh, how was 796 00:42:10.340 --> 00:42:12.960 this show overall? And our callers do. So how about you? 797 00:42:12.980 --> 00:42:13.599 I'm putting you on the spot. 798 00:42:14.800 --> 00:42:18.980 So I'm kind of looking at it with a hypercritical 799 00:42:19.099 --> 00:42:21.659 eye here because I've covered both the last two weeks 800 00:42:21.699 --> 00:42:25.170 in different ways. Last week, covering the show in written 801 00:42:25.210 --> 00:42:29.250 format for PW Torch, and then tonight watching without the 802 00:42:29.269 --> 00:42:33.530 writing aspect, but preparing to do this show. So I 803 00:42:33.650 --> 00:42:38.039 definitely thought tonight was a stronger showing than last week, 804 00:42:38.340 --> 00:42:41.920 but the bar was admittedly low. I mean, last week's 805 00:42:41.980 --> 00:42:46.039 show was one of, my least favorite episodes of SmackDown in, 806 00:42:46.150 --> 00:42:49.550 in quite a long time. And I do not think 807 00:42:49.610 --> 00:42:53.929 that that is in, in small part, uh, because of, 808 00:42:54.070 --> 00:42:56.639 of Roman Reigns absence. I think that had, you know, 809 00:42:56.719 --> 00:43:00.519 almost everything to do with it. Uh, Reigns returned tonight and, 810 00:43:00.579 --> 00:43:02.880 and the work that the bloodline did tonight, I thought 811 00:43:02.940 --> 00:43:06.119 went a long way in making the show more enjoyable. 812 00:43:06.219 --> 00:43:10.599 But generally speaking, I have not found SmackDown to be 813 00:43:10.699 --> 00:43:13.710 quite as strong since, uh, the new rosters kicked in. 814 00:43:14.130 --> 00:43:16.550 I think that they, they took a lot of talent 815 00:43:16.690 --> 00:43:20.889 over to raw. And though they SmackDown was replenished in 816 00:43:20.929 --> 00:43:24.269 certain ways with some fresh acts, uh, Wade, I think 817 00:43:24.289 --> 00:43:27.090 they're very much still suffering from what you and I 818 00:43:27.159 --> 00:43:30.440 talked about on the post draft episode of, of this 819 00:43:30.519 --> 00:43:34.400 show that there's just no, there's just no upper mid card. 820 00:43:34.460 --> 00:43:38.099 There's no challengers for Roman reigns. I mean, they're, they're, 821 00:43:38.280 --> 00:43:42.610 they're slowly getting drew McIntyre there, obviously, but, he appears 822 00:43:42.670 --> 00:43:45.769 to be kind of in this open challenge mode for, 823 00:43:45.909 --> 00:43:48.949 for a little while before they want to start teasing 824 00:43:48.989 --> 00:43:53.260 his involvement with the bloodline. So there's just, there's nothing there. 825 00:43:53.320 --> 00:43:58.760 There's nothing for, for talent to do. Everything feels very stagnant. 826 00:43:58.940 --> 00:44:02.360 It feels like a show that is sort of spinning 827 00:44:02.400 --> 00:44:05.960 its wheels. And there, there was some good stuff tonight. 828 00:44:06.199 --> 00:44:08.969 I think again, the, what the bloodline did was great. And, 829 00:44:09.469 --> 00:44:11.610 As we started the show talking about where they can 830 00:44:11.650 --> 00:44:14.699 go with Survivor Series, I feel pretty positively about that. 831 00:44:15.219 --> 00:44:18.949 But still, even that angle doesn't feel huge. It feels 832 00:44:19.309 --> 00:44:20.489 like a show spinning its wheels. 833 00:44:22.679 --> 00:44:24.860 It's next-level coverage that you come to expect from the 834 00:44:24.920 --> 00:44:30.099 PW Torch brand. No AI, no rookie perspectives, no unfounded rumors, 835 00:44:30.460 --> 00:44:34.780 no clickbait, no deceptive headlines, just high-quality writing, breaking news, 836 00:44:34.989 --> 00:44:39.230 and fascinating flashbacks every day at pwtorch.com. Pull yourself away 837 00:44:39.329 --> 00:44:41.570 from the vacuous social media experience that I know many 838 00:44:41.590 --> 00:44:44.469 of you regret once

you get lost in it for minutes, 839 00:44:44.530 --> 00:44:46.809 if not hours at a time, and settle in for 840 00:44:47.030 --> 00:44:57.800 high-quality PW Torch-branded wrestling coverage. Yeah, I think SmackDown being 841 00:44:57.860 --> 00:45:02.760 a better show before than now in certain ways is 842 00:45:03.099 --> 00:45:05.469 not taking into... What I take into account is does 843 00:45:05.510 --> 00:45:08.230 it feel fresh and new and are there some new 844 00:45:08.250 --> 00:45:11.789 people being pushed? Do we have some new journeys? And 845 00:45:11.949 --> 00:45:15.469 I don't watch wrestling for the show only because I 846 00:45:15.510 --> 00:45:18.679 want it to be good. I also enjoy watching people 847 00:45:18.719 --> 00:45:23.039 get elevated and get cast in new ways that ideally takes... 848 00:45:23.440 --> 00:45:26.320 better advantage of their talent. And so I have sort 849 00:45:26.360 --> 00:45:30.780 of a, a, a, a more generous curve early when 850 00:45:30.880 --> 00:45:33.619 new things are happening. And cause I don't think a 851 00:45:33.659 --> 00:45:35.550 good pro wrestling show is just about having good matches. 852 00:45:35.800 --> 00:45:39.309 Like there's just no shortage of good matches in the world, 853 00:45:39.369 --> 00:45:42.250 both currently and archives and all that. It's like, I 854 00:45:42.309 --> 00:45:44.769 want to be taken on a journey. I want the 855 00:45:45.150 --> 00:45:48.349 characters to interest me. I want to see characters not 856 00:45:48.449 --> 00:45:51.190 on a treadmill, but changing. So that in a way 857 00:45:51.230 --> 00:45:53.809 can sort of cloud my judgment towards, yeah, but is 858 00:45:53.849 --> 00:45:56.230 any of it any good? Or is enough of it good? 859 00:45:56.449 --> 00:45:59.880 Or are they left with less wrestlers of consequence? As 860 00:45:59.989 --> 00:46:03.400 to not having sort of that mid-card, I mean, we see, 861 00:46:03.440 --> 00:46:06.579 and sometimes these cutbacks can be overblown. And, you know, 862 00:46:06.840 --> 00:46:08.400 I mean, when we look at the list of cutbacks, 863 00:46:08.440 --> 00:46:11.400 I mean, I look at who got cut and it's 864 00:46:11.460 --> 00:46:13.920 a product of hiring a bunch of people. And by definition, 865 00:46:14.400 --> 00:46:15.639 there's gonna be a lot of people who you think 866 00:46:15.840 --> 00:46:19.599 for a wide array of reasons aren't worth continuing to 867 00:46:19.639 --> 00:46:22.480 invest in. And that's going to happen. And I think WWE, 868 00:46:22.679 --> 00:46:24.460 it might be prudent to them to stop doing mass 869 00:46:24.519 --> 00:46:26.380 layoffs and just sort of quietly let people go a 870 00:46:26.400 --> 00:46:28.489 little bit at a time and not have it become 871 00:46:28.530 --> 00:46:31.949 a big whole day story. You know, and then, but 872 00:46:32.150 --> 00:46:34.730 do they care? You know, I mean, they just think 873 00:46:35.050 --> 00:46:36.530 it's going to, you know, blow away in a day 874 00:46:36.570 --> 00:46:38.489 or two. And in some ways it does, but in 875 00:46:38.530 --> 00:46:40.239 some ways it doesn't because people end up kind of 876 00:46:40.260 --> 00:46:44.539 like with the Saudi shows, which is less goodwill towards 877 00:46:44.559 --> 00:46:46.119 the brand. And I think this is just sort of 878 00:46:46.159 --> 00:46:49.780 a PR nightmare for them, you know, on social media 879 00:46:49.800 --> 00:46:51.599 for a day or two and it, but it, but 880 00:46:51.639 --> 00:46:54.610 it kind of sticks around the negative feelings stick around. Um, 881 00:46:55.730 --> 00:46:57.110 but when you look at the top wrestlers, I mean, 882 00:46:57.170 --> 00:46:59.510 I talked to enough people to kind of get the 883 00:46:59.590 --> 00:47:01.809 side of the story of WWE, why certain people would 884 00:47:01.849 --> 00:47:05.809 let go. And I talked to wrestlers who talk about, yeah, 885 00:47:05.849 --> 00:47:07.329 I mean, the fans aren't going to know this, but 886 00:47:07.550 --> 00:47:08.909 if you knew what I knew, you'd understand why they 887 00:47:08.929 --> 00:47:10.760 were cut that kind of thing. But I also get 888 00:47:10.820 --> 00:47:14.679 some people and especially a couple instances, um, among the 889 00:47:14.719 --> 00:47:17.019 list where people like, I, I, I don't know why 890 00:47:17.079 --> 00:47:20.190 they cut him or her, but, I disagree with it 891 00:47:20.230 --> 00:47:23.730 and it was a mistake. So basically, we don't know 892 00:47:23.789 --> 00:47:27.429 enough to know everything when it comes to these cutbacks. 893 00:47:27.730 --> 00:47:32.199 What we do know is that they aren't replenishing. So 894 00:47:32.510 --> 00:47:36.760 my issue is not pretending that because I was a 895 00:47:36.780 --> 00:47:38.719 fan of somebody in the indie circuit five years ago 896 00:47:38.780 --> 00:47:40.260 or two years ago or thought they had a good 897 00:47:40.300 --> 00:47:41.960 match or I just liked their gimmick that they deserve 898 00:47:41.980 --> 00:47:44.139 to continue to have a job perpetually. There are other 899 00:47:44.159 --> 00:47:47.690 things that go into it. Bad attitudes, laziness, Um, in, 900 00:47:47.750 --> 00:47:49.780 in this case, sometimes not getting vaccinated when they need 901 00:47:49.800 --> 00:47:52.780 to go to states where you need vaccinations to get in. And, 902 00:47:53.059 --> 00:47:55.579 and it's, it's a, you know, that's a legit concern 903 00:47:55.599 --> 00:47:56.590 for a wrestling company to have. 904 00:47:57.369 --> 00:47:59.750 Um, so, and, and, or, or. 905 00:48:00.179 --> 00:48:02.960 Things outside the ring. That happened a lot where management 906 00:48:02.980 --> 00:48:04.539 hears about it and they go, this person is not 907 00:48:04.579 --> 00:48:07.639 someone we want representing our company off hours. So that 908 00:48:07.659 --> 00:48:10.869 stuff happens. So my issue isn't that there's cutbacks. My 909

00:48:10.909 --> 00:48:13.269 issue is, do we see them replenishing enough? And I 910 00:48:13.309 --> 00:48:15.869 feel like they're not replenishing enough. I want there to 911 00:48:15.909 --> 00:48:18.050 be shows, and we got it here with like No Charlotte, 912 00:48:18.070 --> 00:48:21.269 for instance, but not every SmackDown has to have everybody 913 00:48:21.489 --> 00:48:23.099 on it. You know, that's one of the benefits of 914 00:48:23.119 --> 00:48:26.719 AEW having a deep roster is the top wrestlers stay fresher. 915 00:48:26.739 --> 00:48:31.510 They're not out there just burning themselves out. So It's 916 00:48:32.289 --> 00:48:33.949 kind of a long journey to get to my point, 917 00:48:33.989 --> 00:48:36.610 which is it would be nice to have a mid-card 918 00:48:36.670 --> 00:48:38.949 where you can watch wrestlers and go, I think that 919 00:48:38.969 --> 00:48:41.719 there's a chance they're going to rise through the ranks 920 00:48:42.360 --> 00:48:44.539 and they're going to be successful and I want to 921 00:48:44.579 --> 00:48:48.079 be along for that ride. And when you gut the 922 00:48:48.139 --> 00:48:51.159 roster and don't replenish it, you don't have that depth, 923 00:48:51.559 --> 00:48:55.039 then you end up with the wrestlers who you're supposed 924 00:48:55.079 --> 00:48:58.420 to invest hope in or think are in fresh situations 925 00:48:58.519 --> 00:49:01.539 are A ricochet who you have lose in five minutes, 926 00:49:01.559 --> 00:49:06.239 give or take, to Drew. And then the redeeming aspect 927 00:49:06.280 --> 00:49:08.150 of the storyline is he gets to stand up to Ali, 928 00:49:08.170 --> 00:49:10.469 who also got beat up by Drew last week. And 929 00:49:11.070 --> 00:49:13.710 why– they want us to get excited about people who 930 00:49:13.750 --> 00:49:17.340 are constantly defined down with no hope of moving up. 931 00:49:18.380 --> 00:49:22.280 And that's where that's where there's this big gap, but 932 00:49:22.320 --> 00:49:25.340 they just don't want, they don't want people, you know, 933 00:49:25.639 --> 00:49:28.059 they don't want people on payroll who aren't in money positions, 934 00:49:28.139 --> 00:49:30.199 not understanding that to get people in money positions, you 935 00:49:30.219 --> 00:49:32.079 need people who aren't in money positions who you treat 936 00:49:32.119 --> 00:49:34.949 well for a couple of years first. So anyway, yeah. 937 00:49:35.820 --> 00:49:40.610 Yeah, it quickly becomes chicken or egg scenario and catch-22s 938 00:49:40.650 --> 00:49:43.690 for a lot of these guys and girls. And I 939 00:49:43.750 --> 00:49:47.289 think that the strangest thing with these cutbacks to me 940 00:49:47.349 --> 00:49:50.530 is just how only a few years ago we were 941 00:49:50.570 --> 00:49:54.969 talking about how incredibly deep the WWE roster was. And 942 00:49:55.409 --> 00:49:57.940 some guys were getting used, some guys weren't, and people 943 00:49:57.980 --> 00:50:01.099 were itching for certain guys and girls to be promoted 944 00:50:01.199 --> 00:50:04.119 and maybe for others to be rotated or cycled out. 945 00:50:04.860 --> 00:50:08.340 And And now one of the biggest talking points on 946 00:50:08.360 --> 00:50:12.320 these shows week to week is just how glaringly obvious 947 00:50:12.420 --> 00:50:16.449 that they do not have depth. And so instead of 948 00:50:16.670 --> 00:50:19.650 cycling in new talent and bringing in new acts and 949 00:50:19.809 --> 00:50:24.570 elevating acts, what instead they've done is cut the majority 950 00:50:24.610 --> 00:50:27.809 of guys and gals that they brought in that never 951 00:50:27.929 --> 00:50:32.889 got a huge amount of exposure, lost the talent that 952 00:50:33.090 --> 00:50:37.010 were over and who we thought had bright futures within 953 00:50:37.050 --> 00:50:41.139 the company, guys like Adam Cole, for example, and continued 954 00:50:41.219 --> 00:50:45.380 to push the same acts that have been retread over 955 00:50:45.420 --> 00:50:48.559 and over again and have shown not to connect time 956 00:50:48.599 --> 00:50:53.179 and time again. So despite having this massive talent roster 957 00:50:53.219 --> 00:50:56.869 at one time, it's like, they spun the wheel and 958 00:50:56.969 --> 00:51:01.210 landed back at the original starting point and emptied the 959 00:51:01.289 --> 00:51:04.610 new talent out. It was, it's just a really, it's 960 00:51:04.650 --> 00:51:07.110 a strange, strange circumstance. 961 00:51:08.550 --> 00:51:09.510 All right, Todd, Nick, back to you. 962 00:51:11.980 --> 00:51:15.400 Yeah, just to build on that, like one thing I 963 00:51:15.420 --> 00:51:18.780 was thinking while you guys were talking is they brought 964 00:51:18.840 --> 00:51:22.880 up Ridge Holland. He's basically, over the last, I think 965 00:51:22.980 --> 00:51:28.110 it's three weeks or been standing backstage with a, what 966 00:51:28.130 --> 00:51:33.219 are those called, a sap, you know, a mallet, whatever those, 967 00:51:33.239 --> 00:51:39.440 the police baton, banging it into his hand. They could have, 968 00:51:39.539 --> 00:51:43.869 or they could, and they may still, have him challenge Drew, 969 00:51:44.409 --> 00:51:51.380 have a great 15-minute match where he loses but gets 970 00:51:51.719 --> 00:51:58.320 elevated because he did so well in the way A.W. 971 00:51:59.260 --> 00:52:03.309 did with Darby, with Jungle Boy, where they had these 972 00:52:03.389 --> 00:52:06.690 matches with the top stars. Of course they lost, but 973 00:52:06.949 --> 00:52:13.650 in their losing, they went through a labor of Hercules 974 00:52:13.670 --> 00:52:18.929 and came close and then you can then go back 975 00:52:18.989 --> 00:52:21.070 to them and then they win, you know, and then 976 00:52:21.110 --> 00:52:27.030 they triumph. And, and, um, and, and I agree totally 977 00:52:27.070 --> 00:52:30.289 with what Brandon is saying. I mean, could you imagine a, a, 978

00:52:30.409 --> 00:52:34.670 a baby face Alistair Black getting ready to take on Roman, uh, 979 00:52:35.170 --> 00:52:40.050 at the day one pay-per-view? It would be amazing. I mean, 980 00:52:40.090 --> 00:52:45.409 people would be going nuts. Um, and, uh, While I 981 00:52:45.469 --> 00:52:49.760 know what they were doing with the Kofi and the Usos, 982 00:52:51.199 --> 00:52:54.239 since Jimmy came back, the Usos have lost several times, 983 00:52:54.320 --> 00:52:57.559 including to Dominic and Ray and a few other people. 984 00:52:58.900 --> 00:53:02.059 And Romans never flipped out before, unless this was all 985 00:53:02.139 --> 00:53:05.079 planned for them to beat up the king. And I 986 00:53:05.099 --> 00:53:09.039 was just worried that bringing the New Day king gimmick, 987 00:53:09.099 --> 00:53:11.159 if they just brought the New Day in, that's one thing, 988 00:53:11.760 --> 00:53:15.599 but bringing in the whole king gimmick, in a way, 989 00:53:15.679 --> 00:53:19.500 almost brought Roman down a little bit instead of Roman 990 00:53:19.559 --> 00:53:25.579 bringing Xavier and Kofi up. And at the end of 991 00:53:25.599 --> 00:53:27.659 the show, I'm sitting there going, there's two minutes left. Okay, 992 00:53:27.679 --> 00:53:30.300 where's Biggie? You know, he's supposed to come out now 993 00:53:30.619 --> 00:53:35.199 and set up whatever's going to happen at Survivor Series. 994 00:53:35.239 --> 00:53:39.809 I like your guys' idea of a three-on-three, you know, non-title. 995 00:53:40.250 --> 00:53:41.250 You can have a couple of. 996 00:53:42.769 --> 00:53:45.070 Times when Roman and Big A are facing off and 997 00:53:45.090 --> 00:53:48.789 then have either Kofi or one of the Usos take 998 00:53:48.809 --> 00:53:49.900 the pin at the end of it. 999 00:53:52.809 --> 00:53:53.469 Yeah. 1000 00:53:53.530 --> 00:53:55.030 I just feel that, yeah. 1001 00:53:55.449 --> 00:53:56.619 Well, I think. 1002 00:53:56.639 --> 00:53:57.500 Oh, yeah, go ahead. 1003 00:53:57.659 --> 00:53:59.940 Yeah, a number of things there. One, I think the 1004 00:54:01.159 --> 00:54:05.099 Xavier bit with the King, I mean, it's just not 1005 00:54:05.139 --> 00:54:08.219 for me. I'm, you know, open-minded to the idea that 1006 00:54:08.280 --> 00:54:10.420 I'm in the minority and there's, you know, enough people 1007 00:54:10.460 --> 00:54:12.670 getting a kick out of it. I I see this 1008 00:54:12.730 --> 00:54:16.409 kind of smug self-satisfaction with a real, with cheesing it 1009 00:54:16.530 --> 00:54:19.659 up as if cheesing it up to 11 makes it 1010 00:54:19.760 --> 00:54:25.320 original and entertaining. It's not quite insufferable for me, but 1011 00:54:25.639 --> 00:54:26.119 it's not. 1012 00:54:26.139 --> 00:54:26.480 It's not. 1013 00:54:27.300 --> 00:54:27.980 I'm not alone, you mean? 1014 00:54:28.920 --> 00:54:30.059 No, you're not alone at all. 1015 00:54:30.480 --> 00:54:33.380 Yeah. So, I mean, he's standing up there. 1016 00:54:33.400 --> 00:54:35.360 I'm going to shout out the window. I'm mad as hell. 1017 00:54:35.440 --> 00:54:39.820 I appreciate it. The way that Kofi and Xavier come across, 1018 00:54:40.000 --> 00:54:43.840 it's hard for me to see them as sympathetic or 1019 00:54:45.500 --> 00:54:49.440 appealing babyface acts because they're just, again, so smugly self-satisfied 1020 00:54:49.480 --> 00:54:52.059 as if they're just doing something that is the most 1021 00:54:52.099 --> 00:54:55.539 entertaining thing that anyone could imagine. And with the escape 1022 00:54:55.579 --> 00:54:57.139 hatch being, well, we know we're being corny. We're just 1023 00:54:57.179 --> 00:54:59.559 being corny to an extreme degree that makes it original 1024 00:54:59.619 --> 00:55:03.139 and fun. And I just don't think it does. 1025 00:55:04.090 --> 00:55:04.559 It's so.... 1026 00:55:05.940 --> 00:55:09.239 I don't enjoy that. Now, when it's aimed at getting 1027 00:55:09.280 --> 00:55:11.960 under Roman's skin, and if it pulls some good reactions 1028 00:55:12.000 --> 00:55:16.550 out of Roman, there's some redeeming qualities to that. You know, 1029 00:55:16.590 --> 00:55:18.909 but it doesn't seem like Xavier is in on the 1030 00:55:19.070 --> 00:55:22.150 joke mocking Roman for being full of himself. Xavier just thinks, 1031 00:55:22.309 --> 00:55:23.849 I won King of the Ring. I have more of 1032 00:55:23.869 --> 00:55:25.190 a right to be full of myself than you do. 1033 00:55:25.769 --> 00:55:30.389 And that sort of ruins it for me. There doesn't 1034 00:55:30.409 --> 00:55:32.210 seem to be kind of that self-aware sense of humor. 1035 00:55:32.230 --> 00:55:34.230 We're not really taking ourselves seriously in a wink at 1036 00:55:34.250 --> 00:55:36.610 the audience. Like, I just I don't sense that's there. 1037 00:55:37.050 --> 00:55:39.829 And I find Kofi pretty close to insufferable endorsing Xavier. 1038 00:55:39.869 --> 00:55:44.949 So all of that said, I still, anything that Roman 1039 00:55:44.989 --> 00:55:49.409 and the Bloodline are involved in, it tends to be 1040 00:55:49.449 --> 00:55:51.219 good to excellent. And I thought this was one of 1041 00:55:51.260 --> 00:55:55.619 the better weeks for them playing off each other. Inconsistencies 1042 00:55:55.659 --> 00:55:59.780 in the past are not good, but Roman going, I'm 1043 00:55:59.820 --> 00:56:03.409 gone for a week and look what happens. And And 1044 00:56:03.889 --> 00:56:05.980 the great lines, I was running around naked on my 1045 00:56:06.699 --> 00:56:09.300 own private island, which my wife loved. And he kind 1046 00:56:09.320 --> 00:56:13.179 of just broke into a little smile. I don't know 1047 00:56:13.199 --> 00:56:15.519 if it broke character, but Roman showed a sense of 1048 00:56:16.019 --> 00:56:19.659 joy for the first time since turning heel in kind 1049 00:56:19.679 --> 00:56:23.780 of that moment of delighting in the type of vacation 1050 00:56:23.920 --> 00:56:26.039 fun

that he has as he frolics naked on the 1051 00:56:26.099 --> 00:56:28.880 island for his wife. So there were enough moments. And 1052 00:56:29.320 --> 00:56:31.400 I've been calling for Jimmy and Jay in the tension with, 1053 00:56:31.920 --> 00:56:35.000 them being subservient and letting Roman down. And, uh, and, 1054 00:56:35.099 --> 00:56:36.699 and when they pointed at each other and, you know, 1055 00:56:36.719 --> 00:56:38.639 cause they're twins who, who took, who lost and they 1056 00:56:38.679 --> 00:56:40.440 like pointed at each other. You know, I'm sure they 1057 00:56:40.460 --> 00:56:43.760 did that as kids, you know, who broke the window, him, him, 1058 00:56:43.969 --> 00:56:45.289 you know, well, the neighbor only saw it was one 1059 00:56:45.309 --> 00:56:46.050 of you. We don't know which one. 1060 00:56:46.070 --> 00:56:46.389 Oh, it was him. 1061 00:56:46.409 --> 00:56:48.170 It was him. I mean, I'm sure that's played out. So, 1062 00:56:49.190 --> 00:56:52.090 and Heyman, I mean, just is fantastic. And the nervousness 1063 00:56:52.730 --> 00:56:56.110 that he had, the frantic, like near nervous breakdown he 1064 00:56:56.170 --> 00:56:58.510 had when one of the Usos didn't hand the microphone 1065 00:56:58.530 --> 00:57:02.639 to Roman, Roman held his hand out. Um, It just– again, 1066 00:57:02.679 --> 00:57:04.539 I just– there was so much about this that was 1067 00:57:04.579 --> 00:57:06.960 good that even if other aspects of the show didn't 1068 00:57:06.980 --> 00:57:10.840 do much for you, it's hard to not give so 1069 00:57:10.860 --> 00:57:15.010 much credit to that that it weighs the show in 1070 00:57:15.050 --> 00:57:17.550 a positive way quite a bit. Brandon, go ahead and 1071 00:57:17.849 --> 00:57:18.590 jump in on any of that. 1072 00:57:19.389 --> 00:57:23.130 Yeah, I think that there's something to be said for 1073 00:57:23.269 --> 00:57:28.789 mixing this ridiculous King gimmick of New Day– in with 1074 00:57:29.090 --> 00:57:33.239 something as, as serious and, uh, and, and, you know, 1075 00:57:33.320 --> 00:57:37.119 well positioned as the bloodline. But I think that Roman and, 1076 00:57:37.219 --> 00:57:40.280 and by extension, the Usos and Paul Heyman have been 1077 00:57:40.500 --> 00:57:44.750 so good that the way that they're going about this, 1078 00:57:44.829 --> 00:57:49.090 the way that Roman looked down at woods tonight at 1079 00:57:49.110 --> 00:57:53.289 the end of the show and, and told him that, 1080 00:57:53.630 --> 00:57:56.630 you know, I forget the exact line. He said something 1081 00:57:56.670 --> 00:57:59.590 about seeing what a real king is next week. And 1082 00:58:00.389 --> 00:58:03.170 Pat McAfee said, you know, what does that mean? I 1083 00:58:03.250 --> 00:58:07.190 think that Reigns has an air about him and a 1084 00:58:07.289 --> 00:58:11.269 confidence about him that he can get away with mixing 1085 00:58:11.309 --> 00:58:16.230 it up with an act that displays as little seriousness 1086 00:58:16.349 --> 00:58:20.110 as New Day does and still come out for the 1087 00:58:20.150 --> 00:58:23.929 better because of how talented he's been. And how confident 1088 00:58:23.949 --> 00:58:28.070 he is in this role. I am definitely. While I 1089 00:58:28.289 --> 00:58:30.570 agree with both of you guys. On the subject of 1090 00:58:30.630 --> 00:58:34.210 New Day. And Xavier Woods. And this whole King gimmick. 1091 00:58:34.889 --> 00:58:38.449 The one sort of net positive. I can take out 1092 00:58:38.469 --> 00:58:41.510 of this. Is the fact that it could be much worse. 1093 00:58:41.659 --> 00:58:45.159 In that they could have saddled. An actual serious character 1094 00:58:45.179 --> 00:58:50.000 with this gimmick. We could have seen. Finn Balor transform into. 1095 00:58:51.219 --> 00:58:51.880 King Balor. 1096 00:58:52.360 --> 00:58:52.480 And. 1097 00:58:53.250 --> 00:58:56.710 I think that the alternative of Xavier Woods getting the 1098 00:58:56.730 --> 00:59:00.719 gimmick is far, far better. Now, if I had a 1099 00:59:00.760 --> 00:59:03.340 vote or a say, I would say no one should 1100 00:59:03.380 --> 00:59:05.510 get the King gimmick. You should just win King of 1101 00:59:05.550 --> 00:59:09.170 the Ring and then get a push. But alas, that's 1102 00:59:09.230 --> 00:59:11.170 not how we do King of the Ring anymore. So 1103 00:59:11.389 --> 00:59:14.469 if someone is going to get stuck with this King gimmick, 1104 00:59:14.650 --> 00:59:19.449 at least it's a character that is already ridiculous and 1105 00:59:19.530 --> 00:59:23.460 over the top and doesn't take himself too seriously. I'm 1106 00:59:23.519 --> 00:59:26.719 not really getting a kick out of changing their names 1107 00:59:26.840 --> 00:59:33.280 and speaking with a royal accent. And man, calling Kingston 1108 00:59:33.400 --> 00:59:39.369 Sir Kofi Kingston, it's bad. It's not good. But again, 1109 00:59:39.389 --> 00:59:42.730 I think that what they do in the ring makes 1110 00:59:42.789 --> 00:59:47.090 up for some of it. And them working with the 1111 00:59:47.110 --> 00:59:49.690 bloodline is going to be a lot of fun, even 1112 00:59:49.769 --> 00:59:52.329 if their promos might be a little insufferable. 1113 00:59:54.260 --> 00:59:55.000 I'm Chris Maitland. 1114 00:59:55.400 --> 00:59:56.380 I'm Justin McClelland. 1115 00:59:56.719 --> 00:59:59.800 We host Wrestling Coast to Coast, a podcast of independent wrestling. 1116 01:00:00.239 --> 01:00:02.449 Every week, Chris and I review a different show or 1117 01:00:02.489 --> 01:00:05.409 talk about important topics from around the indie wrestling world. 1118 01:00:05.769 --> 01:00:08.289 Learn about the hot underground stars and the future main 1119 01:00:08.329 --> 01:00:11.750 eventers before anyone else. You can reach us at TorchCoastToCoast 1120 01:00:11.829 --> 01:00:15.269 at gmail.com and me on Blue Sky at Mind of Maitland. 1121 01:00:15.550 --> 01:00:18.210 You can reach me at

Blue Sky at Justin McClelland. 1122 01:00:18.550 --> 01:00:21.469 Find the show on your PW Torch Daily Cast podcast 1123 01:00:21.510 --> 01:00:25.510 feed Search PWTorch on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you 1124 01:00:25.530 --> 01:00:29.550 listen to podcasts. Also, stream the latest shows on PWTorch.com. 1125 01:00:36.150 --> 01:00:37.309 Nick, any follow-up? 1126 01:00:37.329 --> 01:00:38.530 I know you talked about a lot, so if there's 1127 01:00:38.550 --> 01:00:40.829 something else you want us to respond to, please prompt 1128 01:00:40.869 --> 01:00:41.210 us for that. 1129 01:00:42.150 --> 01:00:45.710 Yeah, no, real quick. I just actually thought it was 1130 01:00:45.769 --> 01:00:50.409 funny as Cole kept calling him Night Tophie. He couldn't 1131 01:00:50.469 --> 01:00:55.610 think of Sir Kofi. I said, Night Kofi is doing this. Anyway, 1132 01:00:55.670 --> 01:00:58.670 last point, and then I'll get off and let Chris 1133 01:00:58.690 --> 01:01:05.480 get on, if he's on. But if you know anybody backstage, 1134 01:01:06.519 --> 01:01:10.500 tell them to tell McAfee that he's got to tone 1135 01:01:10.539 --> 01:01:14.599 it down a little bit. He's going way too far 1136 01:01:14.679 --> 01:01:18.170 back to his first few weeks. where he was just 1137 01:01:18.309 --> 01:01:23.829 so over-the-top effusive that he's starting to be grating again, 1138 01:01:23.949 --> 01:01:26.010 to me, at least. I mean, he still says some 1139 01:01:26.070 --> 01:01:35.239 great things, but his overall enthusiasm and euphoria over what 1140 01:01:35.500 --> 01:01:38.000 is going on is getting to be a little bit 1141 01:01:38.039 --> 01:01:40.619 of a pain. And with that, I will say good 1142 01:01:40.659 --> 01:01:42.969 night and wish you all a great weekend. 1143 01:01:44.030 --> 01:01:47.690 Thank you, Nick, very much. Good topic. Brandon, were you 1144 01:01:47.730 --> 01:01:51.230 the one who told me early on, I like Pat McAfee, 1145 01:01:51.250 --> 01:01:51.789 give him a chance? 1146 01:01:53.349 --> 01:01:53.690 Maybe. 1147 01:01:53.719 --> 01:01:57.260 You're a fan of his radio show? 1148 01:01:57.500 --> 01:01:59.760 I don't listen to his radio show often. 1149 01:01:59.900 --> 01:02:00.500 I have. 1150 01:02:02.159 --> 01:02:05.300 I still enjoy him. I like what he's doing. I 1151 01:02:05.480 --> 01:02:09.760 was going to actually bring up tonight that I feel 1152 01:02:09.880 --> 01:02:13.780 like It's a bit hard to explain, but to me, 1153 01:02:13.880 --> 01:02:18.690 for years and years, WWE commentary has felt so sterile 1154 01:02:18.789 --> 01:02:23.690 and so insular that it has felt like anyone who 1155 01:02:23.789 --> 01:02:30.139 speaks at that announce booth must eat, sleep, breathe WWE 1156 01:02:30.139 --> 01:02:32.940 24 hours a day, seven days a week. They've never 1157 01:02:33.320 --> 01:02:36.380 seen a movie. They've never watched a TV show. They 1158 01:02:36.400 --> 01:02:39.280 don't follow sports enough about

Byron Saxton. Why you got 1159 01:02:39.300 --> 01:02:44.239 to beat up their current events? Knowledge comes directly from 1160 01:02:44.300 --> 01:02:47.639 whatever they were told backstage to say right before they 1161 01:02:47.679 --> 01:02:50.250 went out. That's how they all feel. And I'm sure 1162 01:02:50.670 --> 01:02:53.210 that they're all very well read and they're, you know, 1163 01:02:53.449 --> 01:02:55.989 good guys with plenty of hobbies and interests, but that's 1164 01:02:56.050 --> 01:02:58.710 not the way that they come off on TV. Pat 1165 01:02:58.750 --> 01:03:02.769 McAfee is the exact opposite. He feels plugged in to 1166 01:03:02.929 --> 01:03:09.699 current events. So the real world, to sports, to movies, 1167 01:03:09.739 --> 01:03:12.500 to TV. He feels plugged into all of it. He 1168 01:03:12.579 --> 01:03:16.659 feels like a living, breathing human being instead of a 1169 01:03:17.429 --> 01:03:22.889 WWE robot. And because of that, I'm willing to overlook 1170 01:03:23.710 --> 01:03:28.530 some of the shortcomings he has elsewhere. There are unquestionably 1171 01:03:28.809 --> 01:03:32.159 some grading aspects to what he's doing. And I do 1172 01:03:32.219 --> 01:03:36.059 agree there are definitely times where it calls for him to, 1173 01:03:36.639 --> 01:03:40.619 you know, kind of live in the moment and, and 1174 01:03:40.699 --> 01:03:44.300 realize that not every segment is a WrestleMania home run. 1175 01:03:44.949 --> 01:03:45.179 Yes. 1176 01:03:45.550 --> 01:03:48.300 I'm, I'm really close to where you are on him. Um, 1177 01:03:48.309 --> 01:03:52.110 and I think that's really well put having, I think what, 1178 01:03:54.010 --> 01:03:56.570 everything that you complimented him on is what makes the 1179 01:03:56.690 --> 01:03:59.889 things that are grading right now about him all the 1180 01:03:59.909 --> 01:04:03.320 more disappointing in, in the sense that, um, He does 1181 01:04:03.360 --> 01:04:07.159 seem like he's not a WWE robot who's programmed to 1182 01:04:07.260 --> 01:04:11.940 just say things positive about WWE that fit exactly the 1183 01:04:12.000 --> 01:04:15.159 corporate styling, this corporate message styling that Vince McMahon has 1184 01:04:15.199 --> 01:04:17.260 honed over the years and trained everybody in on. To 1185 01:04:17.300 --> 01:04:19.659 the point where I sat down with the WWE announcer 1186 01:04:19.739 --> 01:04:22.969 once after a WWE TV event. It doesn't work there anymore. 1187 01:04:23.550 --> 01:04:26.699 And he opened up a folder saying, And showed me, oh, 1188 01:04:26.820 --> 01:04:29.500 here's the words that Vince McMahon says you might be 1189 01:04:29.539 --> 01:04:31.840 tempted to use. And here are the phrases you should 1190 01:04:31.940 --> 01:04:36.239 use instead. Now, I won't even say guilty of it. 1191 01:04:36.320 --> 01:04:38.579 I do that with people who write for me. I 1192 01:04:38.619 --> 01:04:41.019 think there's phrases that are used that

are trite, that 1193 01:04:41.039 --> 01:04:44.280 are cliche, that are just grammatically wrong, that are pet 1194 01:04:44.320 --> 01:04:47.429 peeves of mine. And so I'll do that too. And 1195 01:04:47.489 --> 01:04:49.829 I actually kind of have an appreciation to a degree 1196 01:04:49.869 --> 01:04:53.119 with Vince McMahon for thinking– you know, do we really 1197 01:04:53.139 --> 01:04:56.840 want to call our championships straps? You know, like the 1198 01:04:56.900 --> 01:05:01.840 problem is how strident and antiseptic it ends up feeling 1199 01:05:01.860 --> 01:05:04.579 when all the rules are applied all the time and 1200 01:05:05.000 --> 01:05:08.059 the joy in the humanity is taken out of conversation. 1201 01:05:08.539 --> 01:05:11.280 So I get the spirit of what he's doing. I 1202 01:05:11.320 --> 01:05:16.260 understand his history comes from an era where wrestling was 1203 01:05:16.340 --> 01:05:21.969 seen as lowbrow and his philosophy was formed on trying 1204 01:05:22.010 --> 01:05:25.710 to counteract that by not having sloppy language and lazy 1205 01:05:25.750 --> 01:05:29.809 wording and cliches. And that's why, you know, he, when 1206 01:05:29.849 --> 01:05:32.780 he was younger, overdid it on the, you know, multi-syllable words, 1207 01:05:32.840 --> 01:05:35.559 you know, or just, you know, he had, you know, notwithstanding, 1208 01:05:35.599 --> 01:05:37.980 you know, they have his favorite words that sounded more 1209 01:05:38.019 --> 01:05:40.659 complex than needed because he comes from that. And I 1210 01:05:40.679 --> 01:05:43.860 think people watching now who are younger, you know, don't 1211 01:05:44.019 --> 01:05:47.900 get that. That's sort of the, uh, the origin story 1212 01:05:48.019 --> 01:05:49.530 of what he does. It's to try to seem a 1213 01:05:49.550 --> 01:05:51.449 little bit higher brow, which is ironic when you look 1214 01:05:51.489 --> 01:05:53.349 at his sense of humor and the content he puts 1215 01:05:53.429 --> 01:05:55.429 out there. But, you know, I'm not saying it makes 1216 01:05:55.469 --> 01:05:57.170 sense in the end. I'm just saying, where is he 1217 01:05:57.210 --> 01:06:00.469 coming from? And where he's coming from is, I just 1218 01:06:00.510 --> 01:06:04.420 want the product to sound less lowbrow, and then I 1219 01:06:04.460 --> 01:06:06.659 can get away with my stupid sense of humor. I 1220 01:06:06.679 --> 01:06:15.420 don't know. So, all of that said, Pat McAfee... being 1221 01:06:16.219 --> 01:06:27.150 so effusively over-the-top, excited about everything, seemingly indiscriminately, works against 1222 01:06:27.369 --> 01:06:29.710 and makes it more disappointing because in other ways he 1223 01:06:29.750 --> 01:06:32.679 does seem like a fresh voice who's speaking freely. But 1224 01:06:32.699 --> 01:06:37.159 he loses points as a free-speaking, non-robot, worried about what 1225 01:06:37.199 --> 01:06:38.739 Vince McMahon is going to yell at him through a 1226 01:06:38.760 --> 01:06:41.440 headset or backstage afterwards, like just about everybody else, including 1227 01:06:41.500 --> 01:06:45.570 Legends fans. like Mick Foley, former ECW champion, and a 1228 01:06:45.639 --> 01:06:48.619 great promo was there, a Taz. I mean, these people, 1229 01:06:48.679 --> 01:06:50.500 and Rene Young, one of the nicest people in the 1230 01:06:50.519 --> 01:06:53.099 whole world, and he's just being jerks to them on 1231 01:06:53.119 --> 01:06:56.059 the headset. And I just doubt Pat McAfee would have 1232 01:06:56.079 --> 01:07:00.460 put up with that for a week. So that's where 1233 01:07:01.219 --> 01:07:04.090 I think it, for people who do appreciate what Nick 1234 01:07:04.489 --> 01:07:07.090 explained that he likes about him, that's why I think 1235 01:07:07.469 --> 01:07:10.469 it becomes all the more disappointing when he's somewhat angry 1236 01:07:10.760 --> 01:07:14.699 he's not very discriminating when it comes to putting everything 1237 01:07:14.800 --> 01:07:17.739 over in a way that it's the greatest thing ever 1238 01:07:17.940 --> 01:07:20.599 and laying it on a little too thick. So if 1239 01:07:20.639 --> 01:07:23.219 he was a little more discriminating and picking out the 1240 01:07:23.300 --> 01:07:27.769 right things worthy of praise and lowering the volume and 1241 01:07:27.789 --> 01:07:30.670 the temperature a little bit on the things that he 1242 01:07:30.710 --> 01:07:35.860 should have the, the ability to gauge aren't worthy of 1243 01:07:35.880 --> 01:07:39.199 such praise, he could be a great color commentator. And 1244 01:07:39.639 --> 01:07:44.179 that bombast and that kind of that Mark Madden-esque, you know, 1245 01:07:44.239 --> 01:07:48.690 approach that he brings to commentary, I think would work better. 1246 01:07:49.710 --> 01:07:53.389 I don't know. I know people are reacting different ways 1247 01:07:53.530 --> 01:07:55.949 to one comedy made, but I'll get to that in 1248 01:07:56.030 --> 01:07:57.489 a minute because we have an email on it. Any 1249 01:07:57.530 --> 01:08:01.269 thoughts on my summation, I guess, of my thoughts on McAfee? 1250 01:08:02.639 --> 01:08:05.559 No, I think I think that's that's pretty accurate. I 1251 01:08:05.639 --> 01:08:09.639 think that that he does need to discriminate from from 1252 01:08:09.719 --> 01:08:12.880 segment to segment. It's not something that he's shown a 1253 01:08:13.000 --> 01:08:16.149 proclivity to do for for better or for worse. I 1254 01:08:16.189 --> 01:08:18.750 don't or for one way or the other. I don't 1255 01:08:18.850 --> 01:08:23.369 know why that has become his go to there because 1256 01:08:23.390 --> 01:08:26.529 there seems to be some real genuine excitement in in 1257 01:08:26.569 --> 01:08:30.140 his commentary. And a love for what he's doing. 1258 01:08:30.500 --> 01:08:32.430 I think he walks through the door at the arena 1259 01:08:32.560 --> 01:08:36.229 at 5 p.m. or 3 p.m. or 7 or 1 p.m., 6.58, 1260

01:08:36.229 --> 01:08:39.310 whatever time he shows up. If it's right before showtime, 1261 01:08:39.670 --> 01:08:41.390 I think he walks through the door and goes, yes, 1262 01:08:42.189 --> 01:08:46.090 I'm here. What's planned? Let's get to it. I'm excited. 1263 01:08:46.130 --> 01:08:49.390 Let's talk. Whether that's true or not, I have never asked, 1264 01:08:49.470 --> 01:08:51.289 but that's when he comes across. 1265 01:08:51.310 --> 01:08:53.920 The funny thing, Oh, yeah, for sure. And the funny 1266 01:08:53.939 --> 01:08:58.029 thing is, is somehow the guy who who really might 1267 01:08:58.109 --> 01:09:00.520 be the biggest company guy of them all. all in 1268 01:09:00.539 --> 01:09:03.199 the sense that he just loves everything he's seeing and 1269 01:09:03.260 --> 01:09:06.020 everything that he's doing and he just loves it. It's great. 1270 01:09:06.100 --> 01:09:08.920 It's perfect. It's, it's everything that he wants and then some. 1271 01:09:09.739 --> 01:09:13.260 So somehow this guy that, that is the only one 1272 01:09:13.279 --> 01:09:16.300 in the company who doesn't sound like a company guy 1273 01:09:16.800 --> 01:09:19.340 is in fact the biggest company guy of them all. Yeah. 1274 01:09:19.810 --> 01:09:23.800 It's such a conundrum, and it's so strange that it 1275 01:09:23.859 --> 01:09:27.220 comes off that way. But he– and that's the thing. 1276 01:09:27.239 --> 01:09:31.090 I think what you mentioned, if Vince McMahon was yelling 1277 01:09:31.119 --> 01:09:33.130 at Pat McAfee in the headset, I just don't think 1278 01:09:33.149 --> 01:09:35.350 he'd put up with it. I mean this is a 1279 01:09:35.409 --> 01:09:38.829 guy– I said it months ago when McAfee first came around. 1280 01:09:39.649 --> 01:09:43.359 Pat McAfee does not need WWE. WWE needs Pat McAfee. 1281 01:09:43.500 --> 01:09:43.840 That's right. 1282 01:09:44.500 --> 01:09:48.199 If, if Vince McMahon cut Pat McAfee tomorrow, he's going 1283 01:09:48.229 --> 01:09:50.390 to go on his radio show on Monday morning and 1284 01:09:50.510 --> 01:09:52.250 he's going to be perfectly fine. He's going to make 1285 01:09:52.289 --> 01:09:54.510 plenty of money and he's going to be a household name, 1286 01:09:54.989 --> 01:09:59.489 especially in the NFL world. I mean, today alone, McAfee 1287 01:09:59.750 --> 01:10:03.340 McAfee is, is everywhere because of that Aaron Rogers interview. 1288 01:10:03.439 --> 01:10:07.819 So I mean, McAfee does not need this job. So 1289 01:10:07.840 --> 01:10:11.579 I don't think I was worried in the, in the 1290 01:10:11.619 --> 01:10:14.220 beginning that, McMahon was going to get to him, that 1291 01:10:14.279 --> 01:10:17.739 Vince was going to change the way that he came across. 1292 01:10:17.920 --> 01:10:23.850 And the things that have changed about McAfee's delivery, it 1293 01:10:24.069 --> 01:10:28.369 more feels like him slipping back into old ways than 1294 01:10:28.390 --> 01:10:31.210 it does him being molded by Vince McMahon. 1295 01:10:33.130 --> 01:10:36.449 Did you know that you can enjoy commercial-free versions of 1296 01:10:36.649 --> 01:10:39.529 all of your favorite Wade Keller podcasts and PWTorch Daily Casts? 1297 01:10:40.729 --> 01:10:45.369 Just go to patreon.com, search PWTorch, and subscribe to a 1298 01:10:45.390 --> 01:10:47.850 VIP membership tier. You get a seven-day free trial, by 1299 01:10:47.869 --> 01:10:49.560 the way, to kick the tires a bit and see 1300 01:10:49.569 --> 01:10:52.319 if you like the service. And then sync it with Spotify, 1301 01:10:52.439 --> 01:10:54.939 and you can listen to commercial-free versions of our free 1302 01:10:54.979 --> 01:10:56.859 shows like the Wade Keller Post Shows, the Wade Keller 1303 01:10:56.880 --> 01:11:01.130 Podcast Flagship, our flashbacks, and also the PWTorch Daily Cast lineup. Again, 1304 01:11:01.390 --> 01:11:05.130 all commercial-free, a nice streamlined listening experience. But with third-tier membership, 1305 01:11:05.149 --> 01:11:08.550 you can also unlock all the VIP podcasts, including Everything 1306 01:11:08.569 --> 01:11:10.270 with Rich and Wade, The Fix with Todd Martin that 1307 01:11:10.310 --> 01:11:12.590 I host with Todd every week, the Wade Keller News 1308 01:11:12.630 --> 01:11:17.829 Bulletin's post-pay-per-view roundtables, and an array of other VIP-exclusive podcasts 1309 01:11:17.869 --> 01:11:20.880 with different hosts and different themes. Check out the lineup. 1310 01:11:21.270 --> 01:11:25.699 Go to Patreon and search PWTorch and subscribe and sync 1311 01:11:25.720 --> 01:11:28.460 it up with Spotify or stay within the Patreon ecosystem. 1312 01:11:28.939 --> 01:11:32.239 Either way works, go to Patreon and start your seven-day 1313 01:11:32.319 --> 01:11:45.369 free trial. I'll read the email on McAfee here. Dnaz said, 1314 01:11:45.409 --> 01:11:47.510 just watched the backstage segment with Hit Row and Sami Zayn. 1315 01:11:47.529 --> 01:11:49.569 I thought they did an okay job handling the release 1316 01:11:49.630 --> 01:11:52.430 of BFAB by sweeping it under the rug on television. 1317 01:11:52.449 --> 01:11:54.520 But then I hear Pat McAfee exclaim that it's going 1318 01:11:54.529 --> 01:11:58.319 to be fabulous as they cut to a commercial. What 1319 01:11:58.359 --> 01:12:03.239 was he thinking? LOL. Thanks and go VIP, everyone. I 1320 01:12:03.279 --> 01:12:06.180 didn't catch that. I mean, I probably heard it. I 1321 01:12:06.199 --> 01:12:09.930 just didn't think about it. But I don't know. Yeah, 1322 01:12:11.689 --> 01:12:14.090 I don't know enough. I have to ask if that 1323 01:12:14.270 --> 01:12:17.970 seems like it was a tip of the hat to her. Like, hey, 1324 01:12:17.989 --> 01:12:21.149 we haven't forgotten you. Or, haha, you lost your job 1325 01:12:21.189 --> 01:12:23.119 and I'm glad you did because I know why you 1326 01:12:23.140 --> 01:12:25.060 lost your job and you deserve to not have a job. Like, 1327 01:12:25.319 -->

01:12:28.920 I couldn't read into it, so I can't. judge it 1328 01:12:29.039 --> 01:12:32.199 also could have just been him being cute um what 1329 01:12:32.239 --> 01:12:33.470 was your take or what is your take on. 1330 01:12:33.449 --> 01:12:37.409 It yeah i i was not sure either way i 1331 01:12:37.489 --> 01:12:41.149 did hear the comment and i i wondered very much 1332 01:12:41.729 --> 01:12:45.130 you know what what he was trying to get across 1333 01:12:45.189 --> 01:12:48.970 there mcafee has in the past had these sort of 1334 01:12:49.229 --> 01:12:52.850 like you said cute references in order to like i 1335 01:12:52.880 --> 01:12:55.300 don't know like pop the internet or or get people 1336 01:12:55.340 --> 01:12:59.140 talking and He's very much plugged in. I mean, he 1337 01:12:59.199 --> 01:13:02.090 knows what's going on. He knows what the beat is online. 1338 01:13:02.119 --> 01:13:05.909 I think it's very clear that he follows the product 1339 01:13:05.930 --> 01:13:07.010 very closely. 1340 01:13:07.029 --> 01:13:07.689 Hi, Pat. 1341 01:13:07.710 --> 01:13:08.369 Call in some time. 1342 01:13:10.970 --> 01:13:15.109 From a behind-the-scenes aspect, he seems to be very clued 1343 01:13:15.149 --> 01:13:18.289 in because he has dropped hints and said things before 1344 01:13:18.869 --> 01:13:21.970 that someone who's not paying attention just wouldn't know to do. 1345 01:13:22.470 --> 01:13:22.710 I mean. 1346 01:13:23.449 --> 01:13:25.670 it's, it's clear that he is plugged in and in 1347 01:13:25.710 --> 01:13:28.430 that way. So I don't know. I don't know if 1348 01:13:28.510 --> 01:13:31.430 he was, it was some sort of dog whistle in 1349 01:13:31.590 --> 01:13:35.579 one way or another, or if he just thought like, Hey, 1350 01:13:35.640 --> 01:13:38.640 here's a cool way to reference this person who WWE 1351 01:13:38.659 --> 01:13:40.779 is not going to talk about her being gone. So 1352 01:13:41.199 --> 01:13:43.819 maybe I can do this. I don't know. I, if 1353 01:13:43.880 --> 01:13:45.500 I had to guess, I guess maybe I would, I 1354 01:13:45.520 --> 01:13:48.199 would think it's that because, you know, it's kind of 1355 01:13:48.229 --> 01:13:51.350 a cute little nod to her, but yeah, man, while, 1356 01:13:51.430 --> 01:13:54.789 while we're on the subject of, of hit row, I don't, man, 1357 01:13:54.829 --> 01:13:58.029 I don't, I don't know how you felt Wade, but it, they, 1358 01:13:58.069 --> 01:13:59.270 they felt empty. 1359 01:13:59.210 --> 01:14:02.250 To me without her BFAB without her. 1360 01:14:02.409 --> 01:14:02.789 Yeah. 1361 01:14:02.829 --> 01:14:06.130 It just felt, it felt totally, totally different. I mean, 1362 01:14:06.149 --> 01:14:09.569 the second they appeared on screen with Sammy Zane, I 1363 01:14:09.609 --> 01:14:12.189 was like, this doesn't feel right. This doesn't look right. And, 1364 01:14:12.689 --> 01:14:17.050 and the thing is, is they're not even a well-established act. 1365 01:14:17.109 --> 01:14:19.869 I mean, they didn't spend a ton of time in NXT. So, 1366 01:14:20.979 --> 01:14:23.779 it shows the chemistry that the four of them developed 1367 01:14:23.800 --> 01:14:26.560 together as a unit. The fact that I'm feeling that 1368 01:14:26.619 --> 01:14:30.859 way in, in that short amount of time. And I 1369 01:14:30.920 --> 01:14:33.420 think this is going to be a huge blow to 1370 01:14:33.439 --> 01:14:36.149 the three of them, not just, you know, her, the 1371 01:14:36.199 --> 01:14:38.729 loss of her in general, but I thought, I felt 1372 01:14:38.750 --> 01:14:39.970 like they lost something already. 1373 01:14:40.770 --> 01:14:40.909 Yeah. 1374 01:14:40.989 --> 01:14:43.189 One wrestler asked about the reliefs as an ex WB guy. 1375 01:14:43.229 --> 01:14:45.810 And he just said the BFAB release was really short sighted. 1376 01:14:46.649 --> 01:14:48.810 And I've been asking around, you know, just trying to 1377 01:14:48.829 --> 01:14:53.409 get a sense of, of, why um and again of yeah. 1378 01:14:53.899 --> 01:14:57.159 Of everything of all the releases today when when you 1379 01:14:57.199 --> 01:15:01.680 look past you know keith lee and mia yim you 1380 01:15:01.699 --> 01:15:04.260 can make the case and i think a very strong 1381 01:15:04.300 --> 01:15:07.529 case that how can you release these two when you 1382 01:15:07.729 --> 01:15:10.649 you're struggling so much for depth right now and you 1383 01:15:10.710 --> 01:15:14.529 need people of their caliber in their respective divisions to 1384 01:15:14.590 --> 01:15:18.710 fill out the rosters but given the way that things 1385 01:15:18.750 --> 01:15:22.250 have gone with Keith Lee in the past. I think 1386 01:15:22.329 --> 01:15:25.029 you can connect the dots and, and kind of see 1387 01:15:25.510 --> 01:15:27.479 where that one was coming from. And of course the 1388 01:15:27.520 --> 01:15:29.739 connection to Mia Yim makes it easy to kind of, 1389 01:15:30.000 --> 01:15:33.359 to group the two together. So for me today, by 1390 01:15:33.659 --> 01:15:37.260 far the biggest surprise has to be B-Fab. It makes 1391 01:15:37.899 --> 01:15:38.500 no sense. 1392 01:15:40.039 --> 01:15:40.720 Um, yeah. 1393 01:15:40.920 --> 01:15:44.989 And it makes me think, is there more to it? 1394 01:15:45.300 --> 01:15:48.680 And I mean, you know, These are human beings with 1395 01:15:49.340 --> 01:15:54.350 a wide range of common sense and a wide range 1396 01:15:54.810 --> 01:16:00.229 of immaturity. And then there's other instances where somebody is 1397 01:16:00.250 --> 01:16:03.970 a strong person and WWE expects you to be subservient. 1398 01:16:04.609 --> 01:16:07.739 And you conduct yourself professionally, but you also expect to 1399 01:16:07.760 --> 01:16:10.800 be treated professionally. And as Nia Jax just explained her 1400 01:16:10.880 --> 01:16:14.479 side of the story, WWE doesn't always communicate really well 1401 01:16:14.600 --> 01:16:17.100 and

they don't put up well with people who break 1402 01:16:17.159 --> 01:16:20.989 unwritten rules. So I don't know which side, if it 1403 01:16:21.029 --> 01:16:24.949 had anything to do with BFAB, either her honoring behavior 1404 01:16:24.989 --> 01:16:27.630 being unprofessional or perhaps on the flip side, she just 1405 01:16:27.649 --> 01:16:29.449 stood up to management in a way that a grownup 1406 01:16:29.489 --> 01:16:32.130 should be able to without losing their career because she's 1407 01:16:32.170 --> 01:16:34.489 not gonna put up with their BS. It could be 1408 01:16:34.550 --> 01:16:37.020 one of those two things. One that you go, well, good, 1409 01:16:37.029 --> 01:16:39.180 she got released. She might've deserved it because of X, Y, 1410 01:16:39.180 --> 01:16:42.260 Z that she did. The other side could be management 1411 01:16:42.279 --> 01:16:44.199 sure has a thin skin and boy, by getting rid 1412 01:16:44.220 --> 01:16:46.159 of her, they sent a message, everybody should be compliant. 1413 01:16:46.779 --> 01:16:48.420 And just do what you're told. And I don't know 1414 01:16:48.439 --> 01:16:50.279 what it is. I'm asking around on that. It could 1415 01:16:50.300 --> 01:16:53.159 be some third option too. Um, but I agree. It 1416 01:16:53.180 --> 01:16:55.500 hurts it row. Um, for sure. 1417 01:16:56.439 --> 01:17:00.460 Yeah, it definitely, it changes. It changes that, that the whole, 1418 01:17:01.100 --> 01:17:04.119 it changes the, just the whole, the whole landscape of 1419 01:17:04.159 --> 01:17:07.079 that act. I think, I mean, when they, when they 1420 01:17:07.119 --> 01:17:09.739 came out tonight and, and you could still kind of 1421 01:17:09.800 --> 01:17:12.380 hear her in the background or their theme. And it's like, man, this, 1422 01:17:13.260 --> 01:17:15.590 it just feels off. It feels, it feels weird. I, 1423 01:17:16.840 --> 01:17:19.500 I think and what you're bringing up there, there's so 1424 01:17:19.560 --> 01:17:23.010 many avenues and so many reasons that that could potentially 1425 01:17:23.550 --> 01:17:26.689 be the catalyst for these releases. Like we just had 1426 01:17:26.710 --> 01:17:29.149 a brand new one thrown into the mix with Nia Jax. 1427 01:17:29.210 --> 01:17:31.770 I mean, here she is saying, you know, it's related 1428 01:17:31.829 --> 01:17:34.489 to requesting time off due to due to her mental health. 1429 01:17:34.949 --> 01:17:37.649 But then there was also the fact that that apparently 1430 01:17:37.750 --> 01:17:40.369 she was out with an injury, with a legitimate injury 1431 01:17:40.409 --> 01:17:43.899 and had surgery to to to take care of that. 1432 01:17:44.039 --> 01:17:46.659 And then, you know, I've seen a lot of people 1433 01:17:46.720 --> 01:17:50.399 bring up the vaccination status. She sort of addresses that in, 1434 01:17:50.560 --> 01:17:54.020 in her note, but then there's also the underlying piece 1435 01:17:54.180 --> 01:17:58.270 of she was the person that,

that started a lot 1436 01:17:58.310 --> 01:18:01.869 of this stuff with Charlotte flair. And, you know, is 1437 01:18:01.909 --> 01:18:04.489 there a breaking point there? Did people in the locker 1438 01:18:04.529 --> 01:18:08.250 room get behind her because she is sort of the, the, 1439 01:18:08.569 --> 01:18:14.260 the unspoken or the unofficial spokeswoman for this sort of 1440 01:18:15.439 --> 01:18:19.670 mounting frustration with Charlotte. I mean, there's a lot of 1441 01:18:20.050 --> 01:18:23.590 nuance to a lot of these releases, especially Nia. 1442 01:18:24.270 --> 01:18:30.739 My incomplete straw poll of the WWE locker room, and 1443 01:18:30.760 --> 01:18:34.079 it is not a scientific sample size, but would indicate 1444 01:18:34.159 --> 01:18:36.720 that it would be an overwhelming vote to keep Nia 1445 01:18:36.760 --> 01:18:41.159 Jax and get rid of Charlotte. But that doesn't mean 1446 01:18:41.199 --> 01:18:45.840 Charlotte's all wrong. I mean, Again, how much of, and 1447 01:18:45.859 --> 01:18:47.779 Jason Paul brought this up last week on the flagship, 1448 01:18:47.800 --> 01:18:49.510 you know, how much of what's going on with Charlotte is. 1449 01:18:50.260 --> 01:18:53.899 frustration with management, sort of isolating herself over things that 1450 01:18:54.140 --> 01:18:56.260 she thinks management did wrong, that maybe her and Nia 1451 01:18:56.279 --> 01:18:59.060 Jax will share some notes on someday and come to agreement. 1452 01:19:01.220 --> 01:19:03.020 And she's just sort of like, you know, in a 1453 01:19:03.039 --> 01:19:05.109 different place than some of the other women. And and 1454 01:19:05.220 --> 01:19:07.819 in her life and professionally, and people are just taking 1455 01:19:07.859 --> 01:19:09.399 it wrong and, you know, she handled it wrong, but 1456 01:19:09.420 --> 01:19:11.880 she's not this awful person, you know, and she feels 1457 01:19:11.899 --> 01:19:14.180 like she needs to stand up for herself in a 1458 01:19:14.220 --> 01:19:16.279 way that other top stars have. And she's been given 1459 01:19:16.319 --> 01:19:18.579 advice to do that because it worked before with management, 1460 01:19:18.619 --> 01:19:20.600 but management's in a different place because of their financial 1461 01:19:20.640 --> 01:19:23.130 standing and how corporate they are and it's not working. 1462 01:19:23.170 --> 01:19:25.670 And she just didn't really adjust to them, adjust to 1463 01:19:26.149 --> 01:19:30.529 the situation. So it's always complicated in these situations. And 1464 01:19:30.590 --> 01:19:32.970 so I, you know, I know Twitter just, you know, 1465 01:19:33.090 --> 01:19:35.369 you can just make your judgment instantly and, How dare 1466 01:19:35.390 --> 01:19:37.930 they release Keith Lee? I have people in WWE who 1467 01:19:38.069 --> 01:19:40.850 really like Keith Lee personally, who don't think he deserved 1468 01:19:40.869 --> 01:19:43.979 to keep his job because he had a, just a 1469 01:19:44.100 --> 01:19:48.760 bare minimum attitude towards his job. And they're, they're sad 1470 01:19:49.260 --> 01:19:51.680 for him, but they don't blame management, you know, and 1471 01:19:51.699 --> 01:19:54.600 they like him, but they get it. There just wasn't 1472 01:19:54.619 --> 01:19:58.329 a motivation to, to, to, you know, that there needed 1473 01:19:58.350 --> 01:20:01.640 to be more, more, more from him. so that they 1474 01:20:01.699 --> 01:20:06.420 felt he was safe and someone they could rely on 1475 01:20:06.680 --> 01:20:09.319 and someone who could deliver in a big pay-per-view main event. 1476 01:20:09.340 --> 01:20:11.079 They didn't want to push him as a mid-carder. They 1477 01:20:11.119 --> 01:20:13.100 wanted to push him as a top guy. But to 1478 01:20:13.119 --> 01:20:17.399 be a top guy, you've got to do top guy things, 1479 01:20:17.470 --> 01:20:20.729 and he wasn't. And you could tell it was push-pull, 1480 01:20:20.810 --> 01:20:23.609 try again, let's give him another chance. Okay, now we're 1481 01:20:23.649 --> 01:20:25.369 down on him again. Maybe this will teach him a lesson. 1482 01:20:25.390 --> 01:20:27.090 I remember Jim Ross with Big Show back in the day. 1483 01:20:27.489 --> 01:20:29.630 you know, and have these long phone calls with big show, 1484 01:20:29.649 --> 01:20:31.609 you know, got to stop smoking and eating Snickers and 1485 01:20:31.630 --> 01:20:32.789 you got to get yourself in shape. You're going to 1486 01:20:32.810 --> 01:20:34.949 have such a great career. And then they jobbed him 1487 01:20:34.970 --> 01:20:37.270 out on TV and thought maybe that'll hurt his pride 1488 01:20:37.310 --> 01:20:39.489 and pictures, whatever you're paying me. And I can, it's 1489 01:20:39.520 --> 01:20:43.199 just like every situation's different, but people who just think 1490 01:20:43.319 --> 01:20:45.199 WWE is being awful to Keith Lee. It's like, there 1491 01:20:45.319 --> 01:20:49.119 is so it's just, you're not getting the full view 1492 01:20:49.520 --> 01:20:52.239 with that instant reaction of it's a shame because I liked, 1493 01:20:52.340 --> 01:20:55.899 you know, a few things he did. Um, OK, so 1494 01:20:56.020 --> 01:20:57.770 all that said, I hope they I hope they add 1495 01:20:57.810 --> 01:21:01.199 to the to the hit row act and round it 1496 01:21:01.239 --> 01:21:02.970 out because it does feel like it's missing something. And 1497 01:21:02.989 --> 01:21:05.189 maybe there's someone else can, you know, play that part. 1498 01:21:05.250 --> 01:21:07.550 One of their one of their girlfriends or their sister 1499 01:21:07.569 --> 01:21:11.329 or friend. I don't know. Somebody on the scene. 1500 01:21:12.329 --> 01:21:15.489 Yeah, it's so it's so weird to sort of I mean, 1501 01:21:16.170 --> 01:21:18.050 in a way you figure, OK, it's a it's a 1502 01:21:18.109 --> 01:21:21.470 relatively new act. So so theoretically, you could put someone 1503 01:21:21.609 --> 01:21:25.079 else in

there. but their gimmick is so specific that 1504 01:21:25.819 --> 01:21:27.579 it really has to be a good fit. And if 1505 01:21:27.680 --> 01:21:31.310 it's somebody that the crowd senses that WWE has sort 1506 01:21:31.319 --> 01:21:34.989 of shoehorned into that role, someone who doesn't necessarily belong 1507 01:21:35.630 --> 01:21:38.750 that man, they're in for even more trouble. I mean, 1508 01:21:38.770 --> 01:21:42.329 it would be, you know, it's the, it's the equivalent, 1509 01:21:42.770 --> 01:21:46.449 it's the equivalent of, you know, CM Punk setting up 1510 01:21:46.470 --> 01:21:49.949 the shield and he, he gets Roman reigns in the shield. Like, because, 1511 01:21:50.590 --> 01:21:52.949 He doesn't he doesn't recommend Roman Reigns for the shield. 1512 01:21:52.970 --> 01:21:54.949 But WWE puts him in there because, you know, they 1513 01:21:55.010 --> 01:21:58.300 want him in that prominent position. And, you know, look 1514 01:21:58.319 --> 01:22:02.119 where that wound got Roman Reigns for several years after 1515 01:22:02.380 --> 01:22:05.479 the shield ran. So they're they're playing with fire if 1516 01:22:05.520 --> 01:22:08.390 they just sort of shoehorn someone in there, especially someone 1517 01:22:08.409 --> 01:22:11.250 that that is replacing someone who they fired. 1518 01:22:12.149 --> 01:22:18.720 Yes, absolutely. You don't you don't want a. God, I'm trying, like, 1519 01:22:18.979 --> 01:22:20.899 this is a very dated reference, but when the, when 1520 01:22:20.920 --> 01:22:23.079 the actors on Duke, the original Dukes of Hazzard had 1521 01:22:23.140 --> 01:22:25.739 a contract holdout and they replaced him with two replacements 1522 01:22:25.760 --> 01:22:28.239 for a season and everybody hated it. What, what's a 1523 01:22:28.239 --> 01:22:31.340 more contemporary example of the substitution? I mean, yeah, Diesel 1524 01:22:31.359 --> 01:22:33.300 and Kane, that's easy to go to with, you know, 1525 01:22:33.319 --> 01:22:38.649 Glenn Jacobs and Rick Bogner. But yeah, Eddie, oh, actually, oh, 1526 01:22:38.670 --> 01:22:41.750 this is even older. Actually, no, it's not, it's, it's 1527 01:22:41.789 --> 01:22:43.850 older than the Kane-Diesel one, but newer than the Dukes 1528 01:22:43.869 --> 01:22:47.010 of Hazzard one. In Memphis Wrestling, the fabulous ones left. 1529 01:22:47.619 --> 01:22:49.779 And they just created a new fabulous ones tag team 1530 01:22:49.819 --> 01:22:55.590 with Eddie Gilbert and now I'm drawing a blank on, 1531 01:22:55.689 --> 01:22:59.229 Oh my God, who is, I'm, I don't know. Uh, 1532 01:22:59.729 --> 01:23:02.430 maybe Nick knows some, someone messaged me, Eddie Gilbert in 1533 01:23:02.449 --> 01:23:07.069 the new fabulous ones. Let me see if I can, um, remember. 1534 01:23:07.270 --> 01:23:09.039 Oh, what? 1535 01:23:09.119 --> 01:23:09.560 Please don't what? 1536 01:23:10.720 --> 01:23:13.319 Please don't give them ideas. Cause somebody next week, somebody's 1537 01:23:13.340 --> 01:23:14.640 going to show up with, and they're going to be 1538 01:23:14.680 --> 01:23:18.380 like C fab or D fab. Like, It's completely different person. 1539 01:23:19.220 --> 01:23:21.909 The answer to this is awesome. So Stan Lane and 1540 01:23:22.250 --> 01:23:23.789 Steve Kern, one of the, you know, kind of the, 1541 01:23:23.909 --> 01:23:26.750 one of the original tag teams of that era, like 1542 01:23:26.770 --> 01:23:29.369 the rock and roll express and the rockers, the midnight rockers, 1543 01:23:30.970 --> 01:23:34.189 they left Memphis and they just replaced them with a 1544 01:23:34.210 --> 01:23:36.670 new fabulous ones. Eddie Gilbert, this young up and coming, 1545 01:23:37.189 --> 01:23:42.399 you know, baby face and wildfire. Tommy rich was not 1546 01:23:42.439 --> 01:23:44.579 a great, even at that point, wasn't anymore. He was 1547 01:23:44.619 --> 01:23:47.500 not a great fit for that anymore. So I chuckled 1548 01:23:47.539 --> 01:23:49.600 because I forgot because it was so preposterous to make 1549 01:23:49.619 --> 01:23:54.159 him a fabulous one. Anyway, Wildfire Tommy Rich had a run. 1550 01:23:55.260 --> 01:23:58.739 There should be a documentary on him, what an upstart, 1551 01:23:59.079 --> 01:24:01.380 hot prospect he was, and then what he turned into later. 1552 01:24:09.949 --> 01:24:12.949 Are you a fan of AEW looking to sit back, relax, 1553 01:24:13.069 --> 01:24:15.949 and listen to some like-minded podcasters who share your passion? 1554 01:24:16.619 --> 01:24:18.420 Do you want to be talked off the ledge after 1555 01:24:18.439 --> 01:24:20.659 a segment that has you wondering what the heck are 1556 01:24:20.680 --> 01:24:21.199 they thinking? 1557 01:24:21.819 --> 01:24:24.270 Do you want to join a discussion on what AEW 1558 01:24:24.350 --> 01:24:26.770 is doing right and what they could do to improve? 1559 01:24:27.170 --> 01:24:29.789 Then join me, Joel. And me, Greg, for the All 1560 01:24:29.850 --> 01:24:33.550 Elite Conversation Club every Friday on the PWTorch Livecast feed. 1561 01:24:34.460 --> 01:24:38.119 Search PWTorch in your podcast app and subscribe to PWTorch 1562 01:24:38.140 --> 01:24:42.600 Dailycast or stream our shows directly from PWTorch.com. Find full 1563 01:24:42.619 --> 01:24:47.579 details on the PWTorch Dailycast lineup at PWTorchDailycast.com. 1564 01:25:01.819 --> 01:25:04.359 Wait, before we move on from from the releases, this 1565 01:25:04.439 --> 01:25:08.739 isn't necessarily release related, although I had brought up Charlotte 1566 01:25:08.760 --> 01:25:10.600 Flair with the with the Nia Jax thing. 1567 01:25:10.720 --> 01:25:10.899 Yeah. 1568 01:25:11.359 --> 01:25:14.649 Would you get the sense? Because I've kind of looked 1569 01:25:14.710 --> 01:25:16.569 at it both ways. Do you get the sense that 1570 01:25:17.069 --> 01:25:22.449 that Charlotte's the issues with Charlotte lately are coming from 1571 01:25:22.489 --> 01:25:25.949 a position

more of Charlotte would like to get fired 1572 01:25:27.010 --> 01:25:32.170 or Charlotte doesn't care if she gets fired? because the 1573 01:25:32.250 --> 01:25:36.140 alternative of AEW is there and that's where her fiance is. 1574 01:25:36.279 --> 01:25:38.939 And that's, you know, and, and WWE, she could perceive 1575 01:25:38.960 --> 01:25:42.159 that they've have wronged her father in, in any number 1576 01:25:42.199 --> 01:25:44.479 of ways. Do you, do you feel like it's one 1577 01:25:44.500 --> 01:25:46.220 of those two options or something different? 1578 01:25:46.659 --> 01:25:49.000 I think closer to, I don't care that I'm trying. Um, 1579 01:25:49.079 --> 01:25:52.850 I think she feels she has a soft landing, um, 1580 01:25:53.319 --> 01:25:55.869 if things go awry, but I also, I, I do 1581 01:25:55.909 --> 01:25:58.289 not rule out and it doesn't mean I'm defending her actions, 1582 01:25:58.329 --> 01:26:01.090 her attitude, um, the disrespect her colleagues feel for her, 1583 01:26:01.149 --> 01:26:05.250 the disrespect towards the authority to, you know, it's one 1584 01:26:05.270 --> 01:26:07.399 thing to make your case. It's like, you know, Jon 1585 01:26:07.409 --> 01:26:09.199 Moxley told me when we interviewed him after he left 1586 01:26:09.279 --> 01:26:13.380 WWE and before he went to AEW, I fought hard 1587 01:26:14.119 --> 01:26:18.060 for changes. I told Vince McMahon, I thought this is dumb. 1588 01:26:18.119 --> 01:26:19.880 It makes me look dumb. The fans are going to 1589 01:26:19.899 --> 01:26:22.220 think it's dumb. It's dumb. And if Vince said in 1590 01:26:22.239 --> 01:26:24.380 the end, do it, he did the best he could 1591 01:26:24.399 --> 01:26:28.300 to make it work. And I think the idea with 1592 01:26:28.340 --> 01:26:32.909 Charlotte is, that she's got her gripes. She's got her insecurities. 1593 01:26:32.989 --> 01:26:34.810 She's got her, I'm going to act like a top 1594 01:26:34.850 --> 01:26:36.979 star because I am one. And just because I'm a 1595 01:26:37.020 --> 01:26:39.979 woman and just because I'm tired of apologizing for the 1596 01:26:40.140 --> 01:26:42.119 leg up that I got as a second generation wrestler, 1597 01:26:42.560 --> 01:26:44.619 I'm just going to stand up for myself. And there's some, 1598 01:26:44.899 --> 01:26:47.159 you know, clearly she thinks that and there's people telling 1599 01:26:47.180 --> 01:26:50.000 her stand up for yourself, but it's coming across to 1600 01:26:50.140 --> 01:26:54.159 at least some of her colleagues as selfish and in 1601 01:26:54.180 --> 01:26:57.560 a business where that's, that can ostracize you pretty quick. 1602 01:26:57.659 --> 01:26:59.590 If it seems like you're not, willing to give. And 1603 01:26:59.630 --> 01:27:01.029 then you have her putting out the story that she 1604 01:27:01.069 --> 01:27:04.090 wanted to put over Bianca Belair. You know, Todd Martin 1605 01:27:04.489 --> 01:27:07.520 on the fix said he didn't really buy that. I

1606 01:27:07.880 --> 01:27:10.720 do think that's possible. Her camp would say that and 1607 01:27:11.020 --> 01:27:13.539 as a way to, as a cover story. But there's just, 1608 01:27:13.600 --> 01:27:15.680 is no way to know. I don't know either way. 1609 01:27:15.800 --> 01:27:18.520 I don't rule it out. I know people feel strongly. 1610 01:27:18.680 --> 01:27:24.229 That's just inconsistent with her attitude. And it's to people 1611 01:27:24.270 --> 01:27:26.550 who know the whole thing that's going on with Charlotte. 1612 01:27:26.899 --> 01:27:28.500 They're like, there's just no way she would say that 1613 01:27:28.579 --> 01:27:30.390 given her mindset and her approach to things and how 1614 01:27:30.399 --> 01:27:33.329 she feels about Belair. I don't know enough to vouch 1615 01:27:33.350 --> 01:27:36.829 for that. I'm just repeating that's what I'm told. With 1616 01:27:36.850 --> 01:27:40.149 sources who have been reliable and have turned out to 1617 01:27:40.170 --> 01:27:43.689 be right on things and all that. So I think 1618 01:27:43.720 --> 01:27:47.460 with Charlotte, I mean, we want to make people good 1619 01:27:47.500 --> 01:27:50.000 guys and bad guys behind the scenes and there's nuance. 1620 01:27:50.039 --> 01:27:53.579 But sometimes people are just kind of making boneheaded decisions 1621 01:27:54.699 --> 01:27:58.970 and their reputation is earned. And it's, you know, immaturity 1622 01:27:59.149 --> 01:28:01.689 or a cavalier attitude, because like you say, she feels 1623 01:28:01.729 --> 01:28:03.989 like if I get fired, so what? I don't think 1624 01:28:04.029 --> 01:28:09.699 she's trying to. But that's my assessment, not knowing. 1625 01:28:10.979 --> 01:28:13.579 I think what you bring up with Jon Moxley is 1626 01:28:13.600 --> 01:28:17.279 an important distinction, because I think that there is a 1627 01:28:18.250 --> 01:28:24.189 certain level of martyrdom that fans are attuned to and 1628 01:28:24.229 --> 01:28:28.840 willing to accept with with wrestlers that are sort of trapped, 1629 01:28:28.960 --> 01:28:32.600 for better or for worse, in WWE. With Jon Moxley, 1630 01:28:32.779 --> 01:28:36.529 like you mentioned, he fought tooth and nail for what 1631 01:28:36.569 --> 01:28:39.329 he believed in and what he thought was a good story. 1632 01:28:39.770 --> 01:28:41.779 But at the end of the day he would go 1633 01:28:41.939 --> 01:28:44.840 out and do the crap that vince mcmahon wanted him 1634 01:28:44.899 --> 01:28:50.369 to do not necessarily because not not just because he 1635 01:28:50.409 --> 01:28:53.270 was under contract with with vince mcmahon but because i 1636 01:28:53.329 --> 01:28:58.399 think moxley had a keen understanding that if it involved 1637 01:28:58.479 --> 01:29:03.920 making someone else good or if his insubordination would negatively 1638 01:29:04.079 --> 01:29:08.039 impact someone else on the roster, he wasn't willing to 1639 01:29:08.140 --> 01:29:12.300 do that. Whereas with Charlotte Flair, I mean, we're now 1640 01:29:12.380 --> 01:29:16.109 at two segments in the last, what, three months that 1641 01:29:16.130 --> 01:29:20.250 have had to be removed or heavily edited from replays 1642 01:29:20.409 --> 01:29:24.069 because they were so embarrassing. I mean, that's not something 1643 01:29:24.109 --> 01:29:26.510 that nearly anyone on that roster I would think could 1644 01:29:26.550 --> 01:29:27.109 get away with. 1645 01:29:27.869 --> 01:29:28.590 Yeah. Yeah. 1646 01:29:30.869 --> 01:29:32.720 iPhone users, if you're listening to us on the native 1647 01:29:32.729 --> 01:29:36.770 podcast app on your iPhone. You can unlock our commercial-free 1648 01:29:36.810 --> 01:29:41.750 versions of our free shows by searching PWTorch in Apple Podcasts. 1649 01:29:41.770 --> 01:29:44.310 You'll see a charcoal gray logo that says PWTorch VIP 1650 01:29:44.390 --> 01:29:46.380 on it. Click on that. There's some free samples of 1651 01:29:46.439 --> 01:29:50.020 VIP shows, and you can unlock the entire VIP lineup, 1652 01:29:50.039 --> 01:29:53.260 which includes VIP exclusives plus commercial-free versions of the free 1653 01:29:53.279 --> 01:29:56.949 shows by searching PWTorch in Apple Podcasts and clicking on 1654 01:29:56.970 --> 01:30:00.289 the PWTorch VIP logo. and then activate your three-day free trial. 1655 01:30:00.329 --> 01:30:02.770 And after that, you can become a VIP member using 1656 01:30:02.810 --> 01:30:06.010 your Apple account. It's that easy. Enjoy a streamlined listening 1657 01:30:06.069 --> 01:30:09.670 experience to our free shows and unlock all the VIP exclusives, 1658 01:30:09.710 --> 01:30:13.409 including our post-pay-per-view roundtables, the Wade Keller news bulletins, everything 1659 01:30:13.430 --> 01:30:15.569 with Rich and Wade, the fix that I host with 1660 01:30:15.590 --> 01:30:19.029 Todd Martin, and a variety of other VIP exclusives. Just 1661 01:30:19.050 --> 01:30:28.649 search PWTorch in your Apple Podcast app. All right, I've 1662 01:30:28.689 --> 01:30:31.079 got Mike on hold here. I want to get to him, 1663 01:30:32.159 --> 01:30:35.579 but good conversation. Hey, Mike, thanks for calling. You've been 1664 01:30:35.600 --> 01:30:37.800 listening in. What's on your mind tonight regarding SmackDown? 1665 01:30:38.220 --> 01:30:39.640 Yeah, how you guys doing? 1666 01:30:39.720 --> 01:30:42.359 I thought SmackDown, it was okay tonight. 1667 01:30:42.420 --> 01:30:43.739 It had its on and off points. 1668 01:30:44.579 --> 01:30:47.039 It wasn't as good as Raw, I don't think. You know, 1669 01:30:47.100 --> 01:30:49.659 Raw has had some, you know, really good matches the 1670 01:30:49.680 --> 01:30:52.380 past couple of weeks, you know, and they feel, like, 1671 01:30:52.439 --> 01:30:55.340 really fresh. But I did like tonight. I liked the 1672 01:30:55.380 --> 01:30:59.359 Drew fight. Ricochet match. I thought that was fresh. And, 1673 01:30:59.399 --> 01:31:00.460 you know, that

was a fun match. 1674 01:31:00.560 --> 01:31:00.920 That was. 1675 01:31:01.659 --> 01:31:04.079 I don't know if you guys touched on that match earlier, 1676 01:31:04.180 --> 01:31:07.939 but would you guys think of how they handled that 1677 01:31:08.000 --> 01:31:10.920 match and where this is all headed for Drew? Are 1678 01:31:10.939 --> 01:31:13.890 they going to push Drew, you think, to a match 1679 01:31:13.930 --> 01:31:16.670 with Roman Reigns at the Rumble? Or do you think 1680 01:31:16.710 --> 01:31:18.430 they'll hold off until Mania? 1681 01:31:19.630 --> 01:31:22.510 I like what they're doing with Drew coming out of 1682 01:31:22.590 --> 01:31:25.670 losing to Big E at Crown Jewel. and getting a 1683 01:31:25.689 --> 01:31:30.289 little bit cold on raw. And I think fans have a, 1684 01:31:31.989 --> 01:31:36.779 I think fans appreciate when a wrestler shows a self-awareness 1685 01:31:36.819 --> 01:31:40.060 of something that wasn't working and steers in a different direction. 1686 01:31:40.260 --> 01:31:43.460 I think, and that'll come out in my, uh, part 1687 01:31:43.479 --> 01:31:45.380 two of my interview with Tony Khan, uh, that'll be 1688 01:31:45.399 --> 01:31:47.640 dropped tomorrow for VIP members. When we talk about Cody 1689 01:31:47.659 --> 01:31:50.510 for a while, sometimes fans just want to see an 1690 01:31:50.550 --> 01:31:54.539 acknowledgement that they've been heard. And, uh, instead of pushing 1691 01:31:54.600 --> 01:31:58.479 back and saying they're wrong or get over it, you change. 1692 01:31:58.520 --> 01:32:00.930 And I think with Drew, he's saying, I guess you 1693 01:32:00.949 --> 01:32:02.489 guys don't want to hear me talk. So let me 1694 01:32:02.529 --> 01:32:04.850 just kick someone's ass. Someone come out here. And then 1695 01:32:04.869 --> 01:32:06.670 he goes out and he's had two, two of the 1696 01:32:06.710 --> 01:32:09.050 best like opponents you can have for Drew on the 1697 01:32:09.090 --> 01:32:14.939 roster for a really good, compact, hot hat, hard hitting, entertaining, 1698 01:32:15.020 --> 01:32:19.180 athletic TV match that Drew can win, but he's expected 1699 01:32:19.199 --> 01:32:22.060 to win. It doesn't really bury the guys who lose. And, 1700 01:32:22.829 --> 01:32:25.899 he can look like a badass who's redeeming, redeeming is 1701 01:32:25.909 --> 01:32:28.659 the wrong word, who's rebuilding himself after coming up short 1702 01:32:28.680 --> 01:32:30.920 against Big E and then moving to SmackDown. So I 1703 01:32:30.979 --> 01:32:35.279 get the story. I think it's being done well. And 1704 01:32:35.319 --> 01:32:38.399 I think using the two people who lost to Drew 1705 01:32:38.600 --> 01:32:41.220 and having them now split off into a feud where 1706 01:32:41.279 --> 01:32:43.199 Ricochet did some of his best mic work he's done 1707 01:32:43.239 --> 01:32:48.050 before the match and backstage with Ali, it felt, you know, 1708 01:32:48.449 --> 01:32:53.710 more real and more

relaxed, more authentic. It, I like 1709 01:32:53.869 --> 01:32:55.890 the idea of Ricochet and Ali in a feud. That's 1710 01:32:55.949 --> 01:32:58.869 a bias, too. I'm going to lean in more towards 1711 01:32:58.909 --> 01:33:01.529 liking the storyline if it results in those two having 1712 01:33:01.569 --> 01:33:04.060 some singles matches, too. So I like this quite a bit. 1713 01:33:04.399 --> 01:33:08.260 Brandon, how about you? Yeah, I thought this was one 1714 01:33:08.279 --> 01:33:11.000 of the highlights of the show outside of the stuff 1715 01:33:11.020 --> 01:33:15.149 with the bloodline. I think that so far, while I 1716 01:33:15.159 --> 01:33:19.109 have been disappointed with the post-draft SmackDown by and large 1717 01:33:19.210 --> 01:33:23.090 and sort of the new rosters, Drew McIntyre moving over 1718 01:33:23.109 --> 01:33:24.529 to SmackDown was one of the things that I was 1719 01:33:24.569 --> 01:33:27.720 looking forward to the most. And that's because I'm a 1720 01:33:27.760 --> 01:33:31.579 huge fan of McIntyre and I think that he can 1721 01:33:31.619 --> 01:33:34.880 bring a lot to the main event scene in WWE. 1722 01:33:35.260 --> 01:33:37.949 And I thought that they got so far away from 1723 01:33:37.989 --> 01:33:41.050 that on Raw and he had fallen so far that 1724 01:33:41.609 --> 01:33:45.010 he really, really needed a change up and some fresh scenery. 1725 01:33:45.170 --> 01:33:49.710 So SmackDown certainly brings that for him. I think that 1726 01:33:49.829 --> 01:33:52.939 having him on the same show as Roman Reigns is 1727 01:33:52.979 --> 01:33:55.899 a good thing long term because they can clearly establish 1728 01:33:55.939 --> 01:33:58.899 him as as the number one baby face opposite to 1729 01:33:58.960 --> 01:34:02.239 Roman Reigns, number one heel. I think that this is 1730 01:34:02.279 --> 01:34:06.199 a good start. He absolutely needed a rebuild. He needed 1731 01:34:06.380 --> 01:34:09.880 some sort of winning streak, even if it is against 1732 01:34:10.970 --> 01:34:15.250 lesser opponents. I think that toning down the mic work 1733 01:34:15.310 --> 01:34:19.600 has been an overall positive because, Wade, like you said, 1734 01:34:19.840 --> 01:34:22.399 I think on Raw the promos were getting too wordy. 1735 01:34:22.500 --> 01:34:25.800 I think that they were getting a little too comical 1736 01:34:25.939 --> 01:34:28.920 for someone who's supposed to be taken seriously as a 1737 01:34:28.960 --> 01:34:32.039 main event babyface act. And he was really in danger 1738 01:34:32.119 --> 01:34:37.340 there of sort of falling into full-fledged rejection as a babyface. 1739 01:34:38.140 --> 01:34:40.500 And I think they've done an admirable job in these 1740 01:34:40.560 --> 01:34:43.239 first few weeks of, of sort of curbing that and, 1741 01:34:43.729 --> 01:34:45.869 and getting him back around a corner to be a 1742 01:34:45.989 --> 01:34:48.970 baby face that you want to root for. Uh, this 1743 01:34:49.069 --> 01:34:53.810 is not entirely unlike the rebuild of John Cena in, 1744 01:34:53.930 --> 01:34:58.140 in 2015, uh, during his us title run where Cena 1745 01:34:58.180 --> 01:35:00.640 just went out there and granted it's on a larger 1746 01:35:00.720 --> 01:35:02.840 scale than what they're doing with Drew right now. But, 1747 01:35:03.239 --> 01:35:06.840 Cena also had a much longer run of sort of 1748 01:35:06.939 --> 01:35:11.140 being maligned by the fans. So I, I liken it 1749 01:35:11.159 --> 01:35:14.390 to that just because John was going out there every week, 1750 01:35:14.439 --> 01:35:18.630 having great matches with opponents who were deemed lesser than, 1751 01:35:18.789 --> 01:35:21.649 and he was making them look really good, even in defeat. 1752 01:35:22.289 --> 01:35:24.750 And I thought that that's exactly what drew did tonight with, 1753 01:35:24.869 --> 01:35:27.909 with Ricochet. I thought this was Ricochet's best showing in 1754 01:35:27.949 --> 01:35:30.829 a while and, I think they set something up for 1755 01:35:30.869 --> 01:35:34.729 the coming weeks with Mustafa Ali, whether that means that 1756 01:35:34.829 --> 01:35:38.760 Ricochet does turn heel and side with Mustafa or if 1757 01:35:38.840 --> 01:35:42.119 it's just to get them to a match between Ricochet 1758 01:35:42.140 --> 01:35:45.279 and Mustafa. Either way, I think it's a net positive 1759 01:35:45.319 --> 01:35:49.560 for Ricochet and really good for Drew. So, yeah, I'm 1760 01:35:49.619 --> 01:35:52.460 looking forward to seeing this continue and to seeing Drew 1761 01:35:52.500 --> 01:35:55.590 eventually move back into the spot that he should be in. 1762 01:35:56.670 --> 01:35:58.170 Yeah, I was wondering if Drew's going to have to 1763 01:35:58.189 --> 01:35:59.970 turn heel, and I don't think he has to turn 1764 01:35:59.989 --> 01:36:03.989 heel with this reframing of what he's doing. I think 1765 01:36:04.010 --> 01:36:08.090 he can be a cheered babyface opponent to Reigns taking 1766 01:36:08.109 --> 01:36:08.810 this approach, Brandon. 1767 01:36:10.210 --> 01:36:14.300 Oh, yeah, definitely. I think that's the goal, and I 1768 01:36:14.359 --> 01:36:16.750 think that... that's what they should want to do. And 1769 01:36:16.770 --> 01:36:19.369 I think that this is exactly the way that you 1770 01:36:19.390 --> 01:36:23.850 can do it without doing a, a, you know, more harm. 1771 01:36:24.189 --> 01:36:27.220 I think they're doing a really admirable job and it 1772 01:36:27.600 --> 01:36:30.420 was a good match tonight. And man, that Claymore was 1773 01:36:31.100 --> 01:36:31.699 really cool. 1774 01:36:34.159 --> 01:36:37.659 Yes, it was absolutely. And ricocheted a great opponent for him. 1775 01:36:38.600 --> 01:36:40.659 Mike back to you. Any follow-up on that or another topic? 1776 01:36:41.979 --> 01:36:42.220 Yeah. 1777 01:36:42.239 --> 01:36:46.289 I want to talk something about a Shelty Blackheart. I'm 1778 01:36:46.350 -->

01:36:49.909 really a big fan of Chelsea. You know, we've been 1779 01:36:49.989 --> 01:36:53.489 since NXT. I thought she had some great matches with 1780 01:36:53.689 --> 01:36:58.109 EO and, you know, those tag matches, you know, with 1781 01:36:58.149 --> 01:37:01.899 Sasha and all that over on NXT. And I'm surprised 1782 01:37:01.920 --> 01:37:04.500 she's getting pushed like this. I didn't expect this. And 1783 01:37:05.760 --> 01:37:09.000 I thought, you know, as a baby face, I mean, 1784 01:37:09.039 --> 01:37:10.619 if they would have kept their baby face, I was 1785 01:37:10.659 --> 01:37:13.119 always worried she was just going to get lost in 1786 01:37:13.159 --> 01:37:16.859 the shuffle. Like the one guy said last week, she 1787 01:37:16.880 --> 01:37:19.479 would just get lost in the shuffle like Nikki Cross, basically. 1788 01:37:20.100 --> 01:37:24.189 You know, I really didn't see her going anywhere in 1789 01:37:24.210 --> 01:37:27.510 the future as a babyface. Even though she was over, 1790 01:37:27.529 --> 01:37:30.270 I mean, the crowd was really cheering for her last 1791 01:37:30.329 --> 01:37:33.470 week and chanting her name against Charlotte. She was definitely 1792 01:37:33.590 --> 01:37:38.829 over against Charlotte. But I don't think the character as 1793 01:37:38.890 --> 01:37:41.489 a babyface was going anywhere. And a lot of that's 1794 01:37:41.729 --> 01:37:43.850 WWE's fault. I don't think they really would have gave her... 1795 01:37:45.340 --> 01:37:47.960 as a baby face, a big push and a big chance. 1796 01:37:48.060 --> 01:37:52.260 So now that they're turning her heel, maybe, I mean, 1797 01:37:52.279 --> 01:37:54.520 they'll go all out with her depending on how she does. 1798 01:37:54.600 --> 01:37:59.409 And I think tonight's promo, although maybe it sounded a 1799 01:37:59.430 --> 01:38:02.970 little scripted, I'll admit that, but the intensity and the 1800 01:38:03.069 --> 01:38:06.260 fire was there. And I felt like she brought it, 1801 01:38:06.609 --> 01:38:10.720 like you guys said earlier, delivery-wise. And I want to 1802 01:38:10.760 --> 01:38:14.140 see your cut promos in front of our live audiences 1803 01:38:14.199 --> 01:38:16.229 as a heel. And then we'll really see if it 1804 01:38:16.250 --> 01:38:18.310 works or not. You know, if she gets real comfortable 1805 01:38:18.710 --> 01:38:22.140 like Bailey did, you know, because at first, remember Bailey, 1806 01:38:22.180 --> 01:38:25.520 she wasn't really that comfortable on the mic. You know, 1807 01:38:25.579 --> 01:38:28.319 she just didn't really sound that good. Then she got really, 1808 01:38:28.359 --> 01:38:31.899 really good as time went on. And that can happen 1809 01:38:31.939 --> 01:38:33.779 with Chelsea. And, you know, I hope it does. And 1810 01:38:33.800 --> 01:38:36.180 I hope she gets a big push. And I think 1811 01:38:36.279 --> 01:38:40.840 working with Sasha, that'll be great. Sasha can help elevate her. 1812 01:38:42.060 --> 01:38:44.640 But what do you think happens after she feuds with Sasha? 1813 01:38:45.260 --> 01:38:48.939 I mean, who is left for her to feud with? 1814 01:38:49.409 --> 01:38:51.159 And when do you think the match with Shelty and 1815 01:38:51.199 --> 01:38:51.800 Sasha happens? 1816 01:38:52.760 --> 01:38:55.619 I mean, the way WWE operates right now, and I'm 1817 01:38:55.680 --> 01:38:58.859 still kind of recalibrating, I mean, I don't know that they... 1818 01:38:58.880 --> 01:39:01.140 I mean, I was thinking, oh, they're setting up for 1819 01:39:01.279 --> 01:39:06.229 a future date a tag match with the Viking Raiders 1820 01:39:06.270 --> 01:39:08.449 and Happy Corbin and Mad Cat Moss, and then when 1821 01:39:08.470 --> 01:39:10.130 they have the match after the break, I'm like, I'm 1822 01:39:10.170 --> 01:39:12.010 just an idiot. Of course they're going to have it 1823 01:39:12.050 --> 01:39:13.609 right now. They're not going to wait and build up 1824 01:39:13.649 --> 01:39:17.350 to that. They've got to feed the beast. They've got 1825 01:39:17.369 --> 01:39:21.069 to feed the TV shows with with things that are issues. 1826 01:39:21.090 --> 01:39:24.250 So I wouldn't be at all surprised. This is my 1827 01:39:24.270 --> 01:39:25.470 way of saying I wouldn't be surprised if it's not 1828 01:39:25.510 --> 01:39:28.189 on TV in a week or two. But otherwise, it 1829 01:39:28.220 --> 01:39:30.539 could be Survivor Series. They can also do a series 1830 01:39:30.579 --> 01:39:33.939 of matches. Sometimes feuds in WWE last longer. Rivalries last 1831 01:39:33.960 --> 01:39:39.000 longer than we imagine they would. And sometimes it works, 1832 01:39:39.020 --> 01:39:46.060 sometimes it doesn't. As for other possible opponents, I mean, 1833 01:39:46.079 --> 01:39:51.569 Xia Li, Toni Storm, um, Aaliyah. I mean, those are 1834 01:39:51.590 --> 01:39:54.949 possible Shotzi opponents after this. None are top tier stars 1835 01:39:54.989 --> 01:39:57.479 cause they're just, you know, they're, they're don't have a 1836 01:39:57.500 --> 01:40:01.020 lot of them. Um, Shayna Baszler could eventually turn baby face, 1837 01:40:01.279 --> 01:40:05.140 you know, maybe she gets tired of being, you know, the, the, the, 1838 01:40:05.300 --> 01:40:08.840 the thug for, for Sonya Deville. And I think she, her, 1839 01:40:09.020 --> 01:40:11.430 I think her best future is as a baby face. Um, 1840 01:40:12.170 --> 01:40:15.510 so you could do that. Um, Natalya, who knows, she 1841 01:40:15.529 --> 01:40:16.989 might end up being a baby face soon. You know 1842 01:40:17.010 --> 01:40:18.369 what I mean? They, they bounce her around. So, I mean, there's, 1843 01:40:18.670 --> 01:40:23.609 there's options. I mean, they're positioning people and pushing people 1844 01:40:23.670 --> 01:40:26.449 in novel way in, in novel ways in the sense 1845 01:40:26.489 --> 01:40:29.600 that a month ago you wouldn't have predicted it. Um, 1846 01:40:30.760 -->

01:40:33.859 and so I'm not ruling anything out in terms of who, 1847 01:40:33.979 --> 01:40:35.800 who gets elevated and we're kind of surprised by it 1848 01:40:35.840 --> 01:40:37.600 or who gets cut and we're surprised by it. They're 1849 01:40:37.659 --> 01:40:38.680 unpredictable right now. 1850 01:40:39.439 --> 01:40:43.159 Yeah. I, I, I think that the opponents you listed are, 1851 01:40:43.380 --> 01:40:47.430 are the, the likely suspects. I mean, WWE sort of 1852 01:40:47.470 --> 01:40:50.310 has a pattern, especially in the women's division, and that 1853 01:40:50.489 --> 01:40:55.090 is to have a champion, have a main title challenger, 1854 01:40:55.229 --> 01:40:58.789 and then if you have another major act who is 1855 01:40:58.829 --> 01:41:02.300 not currently involved in the title picture, then they need 1856 01:41:02.310 --> 01:41:04.920 a secondary feud. So they elevate a heel or a 1857 01:41:04.939 --> 01:41:08.479 baby face temporarily, whoever they need to get into that 1858 01:41:08.579 --> 01:41:12.760 position for the eventual contender to beat And then that 1859 01:41:12.779 --> 01:41:14.800 contender moves on to challenge for the title. And the 1860 01:41:14.920 --> 01:41:17.779 other woman inevitably falls down the card. And I think 1861 01:41:17.890 --> 01:41:20.989 that's where Shotzi is right now. She is there to 1862 01:41:21.010 --> 01:41:23.310 play the foil for Sasha Banks while they heat up 1863 01:41:23.369 --> 01:41:27.609 Sasha to get ready to face Charlotte Flair. Now, again, 1864 01:41:27.689 --> 01:41:29.710 this is much like the tag division, like we talked 1865 01:41:29.750 --> 01:41:36.109 about earlier with, with Umberto Carrillo and Angel Garza. History 1866 01:41:36.189 --> 01:41:40.789 suggests that not much will come of this, that, that, Shotzi, 1867 01:41:40.890 --> 01:41:44.970 like Garza and Carrillo, will fall back down the card 1868 01:41:45.430 --> 01:41:48.630 after a few weeks when Vince gets bored. And, you know, 1869 01:41:48.649 --> 01:41:51.270 maybe they cycle through the title picture very briefly, but 1870 01:41:51.310 --> 01:41:55.380 very little happens with them overall. If I'm being, you know, 1871 01:41:55.659 --> 01:41:59.039 an optimist and trying to see the positive spin on this, 1872 01:41:59.140 --> 01:42:02.810 then what Wade mentioned could certainly be the case. You 1873 01:42:02.859 --> 01:42:06.300 have other secondary feuds there. And you have some women 1874 01:42:06.340 --> 01:42:08.939 waiting in the wings that can kind of fill that 1875 01:42:09.000 --> 01:42:12.270 void and, and fill the, the opponent slot for Shotzi 1876 01:42:12.279 --> 01:42:17.149 for a little while. But I, I just don't see that, that, 1877 01:42:17.609 --> 01:42:22.670 that is the most likely of scenarios. Unfortunately, I hope 1878 01:42:22.729 --> 01:42:24.970 that I'm wrong. I always want to be wrong in 1879 01:42:25.010 --> 01:42:28.329 these scenarios, but until they do it until I actually 1880 01:42:28.470 --> 01:42:31.850 see it, I'm just going to assume that she's going 1881 01:42:31.880 --> 01:42:35.149 to lose to Sasha. And then, you know, We'll see 1882 01:42:35.189 --> 01:42:38.810 her in random match on SmackDown every couple of weeks. 1883 01:42:41.800 --> 01:42:45.720 Hey, everyone. Longtime PWTorch columnist Sean Radican here to let 1884 01:42:45.739 --> 01:42:49.359 you know I've revamped and renewed the Radican Worldwide Podcast 1885 01:42:49.380 --> 01:42:54.050 for 2026. a weekly VIP exclusive. Every week, I break 1886 01:42:54.090 --> 01:42:56.750 down four or five of the biggest trending topics in 1887 01:42:56.829 --> 01:43:00.649 pro wrestling. I also present my analysis, providing insight that 1888 01:43:00.689 --> 01:43:03.310 helps you understand the story better or see it another 1889 01:43:03.350 --> 01:43:06.470 way than maybe is the controversial take out there. Then 1890 01:43:06.590 --> 01:43:08.550 I bring on a special guest for the second half 1891 01:43:08.569 --> 01:43:11.649 of the podcast. Sometimes it's a wrestler or someone else 1892 01:43:11.689 --> 01:43:13.989 who works in the business. Other times it's a guest 1893 01:43:14.130 --> 01:43:16.930 analyst who brings their specialized point of view on a 1894 01:43:16.979 --> 01:43:20.369 particular key topic in the news. Recent guests have included 1895 01:43:20.409 --> 01:43:23.569 Bronson Reed from WWE and PCO. One of my areas 1896 01:43:23.609 --> 01:43:26.310 of specialty is the Japan wrestling scene, so I often 1897 01:43:26.350 --> 01:43:29.369 cover a big topic from Japan with PW Torch's own 1898 01:43:29.510 --> 01:43:33.149 Alan Farrell, Kelly Wells, and Chris Lansdell. I don't just 1899 01:43:33.229 --> 01:43:35.479 cover the news. I don't just riff on the news 1900 01:43:35.560 --> 01:43:38.000 or give a standard hot take. I'll bring my decades 1901 01:43:38.060 --> 01:43:41.619 of studying this industry and talking one-on-one with dozens of 1902 01:43:41.680 --> 01:43:45.039 wrestling promoters to each week's show so you understand not 1903 01:43:45.079 --> 01:43:48.159 just what's happening, but the context of why. Get ahead 1904 01:43:48.189 --> 01:43:50.649 of the news. Get ahead of the pack with Ratican 1905 01:43:50.670 --> 01:44:00.829 Worldwide only at PWTorch VIP. 1906 01:44:00.869 --> 01:44:01.550 Mike, back to you. 1907 01:44:02.350 --> 01:44:07.250 Yeah, that worries me too. You know, she probably loses 1908 01:44:07.289 --> 01:44:09.949 to Sasha. Yeah, she'll just have a match, just a 1909 01:44:09.989 --> 01:44:12.939 random match like every other week, like you're saying. I 1910 01:44:12.979 --> 01:44:15.079 hope that's not the case. But yeah, I worry about 1911 01:44:15.119 --> 01:44:18.640 that too. I'm looking forward to the Chelsea, uh, Shasta 1912 01:44:18.659 --> 01:44:22.880 matches and, uh, you know, Chelsea working as a heel. 1913 01:44:23.199 --> 01:44:25.399 That'll be interesting. You know, like, you

know, doing like 1914 01:44:25.479 --> 01:44:28.640 choke holds and stuff like that and see how well 1915 01:44:28.699 --> 01:44:30.760 she is at being aggressive. You know, I'm looking forward 1916 01:44:30.779 --> 01:44:34.800 to that. And, uh, hopefully that'll, that'll turn out good 1917 01:44:35.039 --> 01:44:36.779 and she'll be, you know, a successful heel. 1918 01:44:37.939 --> 01:44:41.159 Sasha sold incredibly well for her last week. So I 1919 01:44:41.239 --> 01:44:43.939 think that I I'm looking forward to that match too, 1920 01:44:44.050 --> 01:44:47.670 if only because Sasha seems invested in this. I don't 1921 01:44:47.710 --> 01:44:50.729 know what her and Shotzi's relationship is backstage or anything 1922 01:44:50.750 --> 01:44:55.069 like that. But last week, man, Sasha was all in 1923 01:44:55.270 --> 01:44:56.689 on making her look like a killer. 1924 01:44:57.520 --> 01:44:59.779 And that's what you want. And that's what the veteran 1925 01:45:00.020 --> 01:45:03.840 women on this roster should want. You need opponents. You 1926 01:45:03.859 --> 01:45:06.039 need to make people seem like a million bucks. And, 1927 01:45:06.600 --> 01:45:09.479 you know, fair or unfair, you know, Charlotte's been criticized 1928 01:45:09.800 --> 01:45:13.220 for being more selfish than was deemed prudent and kind before. 1929 01:45:14.430 --> 01:45:18.109 um in some of her you know promos and matches 1930 01:45:18.189 --> 01:45:20.750 and that's you know what manifested to to you know 1931 01:45:20.909 --> 01:45:23.550 what what blew up a couple Fridays ago with Becky 1932 01:45:24.329 --> 01:45:27.369 and you know I mean you got you got to 1933 01:45:27.390 --> 01:45:30.149 have fresh opponents that's the the top stars know that 1934 01:45:30.189 --> 01:45:32.149 they you know not all of them I mean I 1935 01:45:32.170 --> 01:45:33.770 should say the top stars know the top stars know 1936 01:45:33.789 --> 01:45:36.649 that some are good about about being generous and building 1937 01:45:36.670 --> 01:45:38.510 up the next generation and others feel threatened or it 1938 01:45:38.550 --> 01:45:41.810 just doesn't um it's not in there they're not hardwired 1939 01:45:41.850 --> 01:45:45.329 to be to be giving um you know but most are, 1940 01:45:45.350 --> 01:45:46.909 and Sasha was. 1941 01:45:48.590 --> 01:45:51.189 I think there's a lot of legitimate criticisms to be 1942 01:45:51.250 --> 01:45:55.479 had for Sasha Banks. But one thing that I don't 1943 01:45:55.500 --> 01:45:58.840 think anyone can ever get on her for is how 1944 01:45:58.920 --> 01:46:01.699 good she is at selling. She's a great seller. She 1945 01:46:01.779 --> 01:46:05.060 always has been. I think it's one of, yeah, at 1946 01:46:05.119 --> 01:46:09.310 times it even is over the top. But when she's 1947 01:46:09.359 --> 01:46:12.739 really in it and she's at her best, She's one 1948 01:46:12.770 --> 01:46:15.430 of the best in the business, male or female. 1949 01:46:16.449 --> 01:46:17.189 Yep. 1950 01:46:17.210 --> 01:46:17.449 Very good. 1951 01:46:17.470 --> 01:46:23.069 Mike, anything else for us? 1952 01:46:23.130 --> 01:46:27.850 Real quick on Naomi. It was mentioned on last week's show. 1953 01:46:29.069 --> 01:46:29.430 I forget. 1954 01:46:29.630 --> 01:46:32.619 I think it was Zach or his host said about 1955 01:46:33.720 --> 01:46:38.060 how they don't view Naomi as like a future star. 1956 01:46:38.659 --> 01:46:40.479 because of the way she is like they don't think 1957 01:46:40.539 --> 01:46:45.869 she has it in the ring like let's say Sasha 1958 01:46:45.970 --> 01:46:48.510 Charlotte Bailey like she never will like she'll never be 1959 01:46:48.569 --> 01:46:51.689 on that level like she they say she's athletic but 1960 01:46:51.750 --> 01:46:54.369 she really can't go in the ring to that point 1961 01:46:55.270 --> 01:46:58.739 and that's what'll hold her back from being accessed in 1962 01:46:58.760 --> 01:47:02.600 the future so um what are your guys thoughts on 1963 01:47:02.640 --> 01:47:05.890 that you think Naomi will ever get a a time 1964 01:47:05.899 --> 01:47:09.189 to shine? Like, does she really have it to be 1965 01:47:09.210 --> 01:47:13.050 that big star like a Becky? What do you think? 1966 01:47:14.010 --> 01:47:17.810 I think you have to have, you know, you have 1967 01:47:17.829 --> 01:47:20.989 to be like great at something to make up for 1968 01:47:21.029 --> 01:47:24.529 being poor at something else. If there's, you know, three 1969 01:47:24.550 --> 01:47:28.109 or four key categories to becoming a Becky Charlotte, Sasha 1970 01:47:28.149 --> 01:47:31.189 level star, you've, you know, you gotta have at least 1971 01:47:31.210 --> 01:47:32.829 something you're great at, or a few things you're good 1972 01:47:32.869 --> 01:47:35.470 at to make up for what your shortcoming is. And 1973 01:47:35.489 --> 01:47:40.029 I guess with Naomi, I'm just not sure what that 1974 01:47:40.140 --> 01:47:42.800 management looks at and says, yeah, we can work with 1975 01:47:42.859 --> 01:47:47.960 that despite that. Um, and she's getting a chance, but 1976 01:47:48.239 --> 01:47:50.500 you know, she's been around a while and not caught 1977 01:47:50.579 --> 01:47:54.000 on for a reason. And I think they're, they're, you know, 1978 01:47:54.420 --> 01:47:56.619 I don't know how many people just think, yes, this 1979 01:47:56.640 --> 01:47:57.939 is going to be a great match when they hear 1980 01:47:57.979 --> 01:48:01.159 she's in the ring. It's not like burying her. It's just, 1981 01:48:01.199 --> 01:48:03.279 that's not what you think of. There's sort of a, 1982 01:48:03.829 --> 01:48:07.810 sometimes a clunkiness or an awkwardness or a lack of 1983 01:48:07.890 --> 01:48:10.579 crispness to some of what she does. But I also 1984 01:48:11.340 --> 01:48:14.319 don't think her ring style is disqualifying. And I think 1985 01:48:15.159 --> 01:48:18.350 there's enough there that I

get why they kind of 1986 01:48:18.390 --> 01:48:21.859 keep giving her you know, kind of start and stop pushes. So, 1987 01:48:22.600 --> 01:48:25.140 you know, she's still here for a reason, but she's 1988 01:48:25.180 --> 01:48:27.680 still where she is for a reason. Brandon, your take. 1989 01:48:28.859 --> 01:48:35.529 Yeah, definitely. I think with Naomi, there's definitely some incredible 1990 01:48:35.609 --> 01:48:39.569 athleticism and they build some really cool spots for her. 1991 01:48:40.359 --> 01:48:44.159 But to me, with her, it's always been about the spots. 1992 01:48:44.600 --> 01:48:48.239 And I think of someone like Bianca Belair, who's similar 1993 01:48:48.279 --> 01:48:53.600 in the sense that in Bianca Belair's matches recently, they've 1994 01:48:53.699 --> 01:48:56.500 tried to give her big spots to really stand out 1995 01:48:57.159 --> 01:49:00.020 and to kind of bring her along. And it's worked. 1996 01:49:00.100 --> 01:49:01.800 And the spots are really cool, the same way that 1997 01:49:01.859 --> 01:49:03.899 Naomi has had some really cool spots in the past. 1998 01:49:03.979 --> 01:49:07.560 The difference, though, I think, is that Belair has a 1999 01:49:07.600 --> 01:49:11.949 stronger character, a more serious character. And she's a little 2000 01:49:11.989 --> 01:49:15.189 bit better at the fundamentals in the ring. And she's 2001 01:49:15.229 --> 01:49:18.270 caught on a lot quicker than someone like Naomi, who's 2002 01:49:18.369 --> 01:49:22.710 been around for a long time and still comes off clunky. 2003 01:49:23.090 --> 01:49:25.829 And not to say Belair can't feel that way at 2004 01:49:25.869 --> 01:49:28.609 times too, but you almost forgive it because she's so 2005 01:49:28.670 --> 01:49:31.430 fresh and so new. And for Naomi to be this 2006 01:49:31.470 --> 01:49:33.949 far in her career and kind of to still have 2007 01:49:34.010 --> 01:49:38.130 that awkwardness, I think that that holds her back in 2008 01:49:38.149 --> 01:49:44.340 a way. In 2021, where WWE tries its best to 2009 01:49:44.439 --> 01:49:48.399 treat the women in the main event picture as equals 2010 01:49:48.460 --> 01:49:52.460 to the men. Sometimes they're successful at that. Sometimes they're 2011 01:49:52.720 --> 01:49:55.840 a little lackluster. But by and large, we're supposed to 2012 01:49:55.880 --> 01:50:00.810 buy that the women's championship can and should headline in 2013 01:50:00.850 --> 01:50:03.569 the same way that the men's title does. And that 2014 01:50:03.890 --> 01:50:08.789 often requires 15, 20 minute main events. And That's something 2015 01:50:08.810 --> 01:50:12.020 that you expect from Sasha Banks and Charlotte Flair and 2016 01:50:12.060 --> 01:50:15.920 Becky Lynch and Bianca Belair. Now, that's not something that 2017 01:50:15.979 --> 01:50:20.859 I can see Naomi putting together. And maybe she could 2018 01:50:21.060 --> 01:50:24.239 if she were ever given the opportunity. But I've never 2019 01:50:24.340 --> 01:50:27.270 watched one of Naomi's matches and thought, man, this would 2020 01:50:27.310 --> 01:50:28.930 just have been this would been a lot better if 2021 01:50:28.970 --> 01:50:31.909 it was just a little bit longer. So I think 2022 01:50:32.010 --> 01:50:36.399 that ultimately is what's going to hold Naomi back. For me, 2023 01:50:36.640 --> 01:50:40.239 I think the most interesting thing for Naomi at this 2024 01:50:40.310 --> 01:50:46.149 stage of her career would be a run with the bloodline. 2025 01:50:46.869 --> 01:50:51.810 And I'm hesitant to suggest it only because I think 2026 01:50:51.829 --> 01:50:55.750 they're so strong at what they've done thus far. But 2027 01:50:55.810 --> 01:50:57.890 I do think that it would be neat to see 2028 01:50:57.930 --> 01:51:01.529 a woman in the fold and to see how Roman 2029 01:51:01.649 --> 01:51:05.569 played off of her. And also to see her as 2030 01:51:05.590 --> 01:51:10.300 a cocky heel that matches the personality of her husband, 2031 01:51:10.380 --> 01:51:14.119 her brother in law and her cousin Roman. So I'd 2032 01:51:14.220 --> 01:51:17.810 like to see it. But I also I say that 2033 01:51:17.850 --> 01:51:20.010 with the caveat of understanding that it could go really 2034 01:51:20.050 --> 01:51:24.140 poorly and make and make me enjoy something I love less. 2035 01:51:26.090 --> 01:51:28.050 You know that last segment you're just listening to and 2036 01:51:28.069 --> 01:51:30.109 the next one that you're waiting to listen to? Those 2037 01:51:30.149 --> 01:51:32.649 can be one second apart with a VIP membership. You 2038 01:51:32.670 --> 01:51:36.829 can unlock our commercial-free versions of our shows. PWTorch.com slash 2039 01:51:36.869 --> 01:51:41.579 GoVIP tells you how to do it. That's PWTorch.com slash GoVIP. 2040 01:51:41.939 --> 01:51:45.640 Options exist within the Apple Podcast app using your Apple account, 2041 01:51:45.800 --> 01:51:47.720 through Patreon, which, by the way, you can sync up 2042 01:51:47.760 --> 01:51:50.920 with Spotify, or just about any iOS or Android app 2043 01:51:51.079 --> 01:51:53.920 with a full VIP membership. You can customize the feed 2044 01:51:53.960 --> 01:51:57.279 for individual shows and clusters of shows and themes. Go 2045 01:51:57.319 --> 01:52:00.979 to pwtorch.com slash govip for full details on all the 2046 01:52:01.119 --> 01:52:05.439 options to listen commercial-free. And with upper-tier options, unlock our 2047 01:52:05.550 --> 01:52:15.869 VIP-exclusive podcasts that run throughout the week every week. All right, Mike, 2048 01:52:15.989 --> 01:52:17.449 any closing words for us here? 2049 01:52:18.140 --> 01:52:20.939 Yeah, remember the one time Naomi was a heel, actually? 2050 01:52:21.300 --> 01:52:24.520 like you think she played it good. I, I was actually, 2051 01:52:24.539 --> 01:52:26.319 a lot of people didn't like that. I actually, uh, 2052 01:52:27.000 --> 01:52:29.100 it was felt fresh to me. I

actually enjoyed her 2053 01:52:29.220 --> 01:52:31.659 as a heel. Actually, as far as I remember, she 2054 01:52:31.699 --> 01:52:36.520 played the role pretty good. Did you guys, uh, remember that? 2055 01:52:37.409 --> 01:52:41.050 I remember, I remember when, when Sasha came in and 2056 01:52:41.170 --> 01:52:44.350 they were in that stable with Tamina and I, I 2057 01:52:44.390 --> 01:52:47.729 don't remember, I don't remember being too down on it, but, 2058 01:52:48.079 --> 01:52:52.699 the focus was so heavily on establishing Sasha that I 2059 01:52:52.739 --> 01:52:54.909 think I forgot a lot of what Naomi was doing there, 2060 01:52:54.949 --> 01:52:56.229 but I don't remember being down on it. 2061 01:52:57.170 --> 01:52:58.409 I mean, it'd be an interest. I mean, they just 2062 01:52:58.430 --> 01:53:00.890 turned Shotzi, although, you know, she was so new, but 2063 01:53:01.250 --> 01:53:03.130 I mean, you know, you can always turn someone if 2064 01:53:03.149 --> 01:53:05.689 you're looking to put them in a fresh, you know, 2065 01:53:05.750 --> 01:53:08.689 in a fresh situation where their character doesn't feel as stale. 2066 01:53:09.470 --> 01:53:12.720 I don't have a ton of recollection of feelings, feeling 2067 01:53:12.779 --> 01:53:15.420 strongly either way, but as I think about it now, 2068 01:53:15.539 --> 01:53:18.659 I mean, I can imagine... I can imagine that working 2069 01:53:20.140 --> 01:53:22.060 in bringing something out in her a little bit more 2070 01:53:22.100 --> 01:53:26.199 than we see now. But I mean, you know, she's 2071 01:53:26.239 --> 01:53:28.420 on the roster. Make the best of who you have 2072 01:53:28.460 --> 01:53:30.869 and who you're sticking with and figure that out. And 2073 01:53:30.890 --> 01:53:32.670 that's why I'm just, you know, going full circle back 2074 01:53:32.689 --> 01:53:35.670 to the original call on this. I'm along for the 2075 01:53:35.710 --> 01:53:37.789 ride and I want to see where we end up here. 2076 01:53:37.850 --> 01:53:41.800 And I think Sonya is so strong interacting in mic 2077 01:53:41.840 --> 01:53:47.109 work that it gives, it can carry and elevate Naomi's work. 2078 01:53:47.680 --> 01:53:49.960 And I think there will be a crowd pop for 2079 01:53:49.979 --> 01:53:53.460 when Naomi gets Sonya one-on-one in the ring if they 2080 01:53:53.479 --> 01:53:55.560 get to that point. And I assume they are. 2081 01:53:56.420 --> 01:53:58.989 That's the thing that Naomi has always had going for her. 2082 01:53:59.039 --> 01:54:02.210 She's always gotten a strong crowd reaction. She's always had 2083 01:54:02.229 --> 01:54:05.590 the crowd behind her. That's sort of been the biggest 2084 01:54:05.649 --> 01:54:06.789 part of that character. 2085 01:54:08.369 --> 01:54:09.289 Mike, thanks so much for calling. 2086 01:54:12.149 --> 01:54:13.529 Yeah, thanks a lot for taking my call, guys. You 2087 01:54:13.760 --> 01:54:14.300 have a great night. 2088 01:54:14.439 --> 01:54:18.800 Absolutely, you bet. Javier apologizes for not being a call-in. 2089 01:54:18.819 --> 01:54:21.500 He was planning to, and some stuff came up where 2090 01:54:21.520 --> 01:54:22.880 he's got to be up super early in the morning. 2091 01:54:22.960 --> 01:54:25.250 So if people are waiting around for Javier, I apologize 2092 01:54:25.270 --> 01:54:25.510 for that. 2093 01:54:26.090 --> 01:54:27.789 I was waiting around for Javier. 2094 01:54:27.829 --> 01:54:30.409 Yes, yes, we miss him. And I don't know what 2095 01:54:30.430 --> 01:54:33.550 happened to Kyle either. Kyle from Baltimore. I mean, our regulars, geez. 2096 01:54:35.399 --> 01:54:37.300 And I praise Sasha. I know. 2097 01:54:37.359 --> 01:54:38.960 That's what I was thinking when we were talking about her. 2098 01:54:39.039 --> 01:54:41.180 I'm like, I want to go to Kyle next, and 2099 01:54:41.859 --> 01:54:45.340 he's not here. Maybe he watched that he did. Eddie 2100 01:54:45.359 --> 01:54:47.500 Kingston's CM Punk promo that was on in the background 2101 01:54:47.539 --> 01:54:50.539 that I'm hearing good things about and want to see, 2102 01:54:50.699 --> 01:54:56.970 and Anthony Bowens and Brian Danielson having a nice 9-10 2103 01:54:56.989 --> 01:54:59.569 minute match. Bowens is going to be, he already is good, 2104 01:54:59.649 --> 01:55:02.729 but he was in the pink and black, kind of 2105 01:55:02.770 --> 01:55:04.970 Bret Hart-esque, and I just think of him as a 2106 01:55:05.029 --> 01:55:07.550 young excellence of execution. Everything he does is just so crisp. 2107 01:55:07.569 --> 01:55:09.890 He's just selling and being in the right place at 2108 01:55:09.909 --> 01:55:12.149 the right time and having that little extra snap to 2109 01:55:12.189 --> 01:55:14.710 what he does, kind of like Evan Bourne or Matt Seidel. 2110 01:55:15.239 --> 01:55:17.560 early in his career where they're just that little something extra. 2111 01:55:17.659 --> 01:55:19.819 And so I was waiting for what that third match 2112 01:55:19.880 --> 01:55:21.819 rampage is going to be. And when I saw late today, 2113 01:55:21.859 --> 01:55:24.800 they announced Brian Danielson against bones. I was like, this 2114 01:55:24.880 --> 01:55:26.439 is going to be, there's going to be a test 2115 01:55:26.460 --> 01:55:30.140 for bones, see what he can do. And so, yeah, 2116 01:55:30.180 --> 01:55:33.060 maybe everyone's watching rampage, man. 2117 01:55:33.140 --> 01:55:38.399 How, how good has Brian Danielson been? It's just, it's just, 2118 01:55:38.560 --> 01:55:41.220 it's such a joy. It's, it's so much fun to 2119 01:55:41.279 --> 01:55:43.479 watch him and how clear it is that he's just 2120 01:55:43.520 --> 01:55:47.289 having a the best time. I mean, it's, it's, it's 2121 01:55:47.329 --> 01:55:47.869 so much fun. 2122 01:55:49.270 --> 01:55:49.649 Yeah, it is. 2123 01:55:49.949 --> 01:55:54.560 And, you know, we talk about giving back. Um, I think, uh, 2124 01:55:55.220 -->

01:55:58.079 you know, Brian Anderson can give back to, you know, 2125 01:55:58.119 --> 01:56:00.060 wrestlers who earn it, you know, you don't, and not, 2126 01:56:00.100 --> 01:56:02.520 not just anybody gets a match with Brian Anderson, but 2127 01:56:02.539 --> 01:56:04.579 if you've got, um, you know, if you've got a 2128 01:56:04.600 --> 01:56:06.479 good reputation and a good body of work that you're 2129 01:56:06.500 --> 01:56:09.140 building up, he can help elevate you. So, um, I 2130 01:56:09.180 --> 01:56:11.600 think bones is somebody to keep an eye on Max Caster, 2131 01:56:11.619 --> 01:56:14.329 the blast. He's just a personality leaps off the screen. Um, 2132 01:56:14.949 --> 01:56:19.109 sometimes in ways where you're cringing a little. But, you know, 2133 01:56:19.289 --> 01:56:20.970 the two of them bring different things. But there's a 2134 01:56:21.010 --> 01:56:24.050 reason Bowens was in the ring with Bryan being given 2135 01:56:24.069 --> 01:56:26.159 a 10 minute showcase tonight to show what he can do. 2136 01:56:27.340 --> 01:56:31.699 One of the things that shows the contrast between the 2137 01:56:31.739 --> 01:56:34.239 two companies right now is just, you know, we're heading 2138 01:56:34.260 --> 01:56:38.890 into a pay-per-view for AEW where two WWE guys are 2139 01:56:38.909 --> 01:56:41.409 going to face each other in a number one contenders match. 2140 01:56:41.489 --> 01:56:43.909 And It's a match that I don't know if we 2141 01:56:43.970 --> 01:56:46.399 ever saw it in WWE, but if we did, you know, 2142 01:56:46.479 --> 01:56:50.359 I forgot about it because, you know, everybody faces everybody 2143 01:56:50.399 --> 01:56:53.439 and they don't really give much credence to one match 2144 01:56:53.500 --> 01:56:57.460 over the other. And it feels huge. I mean, Miro 2145 01:56:57.500 --> 01:57:01.159 versus Danielson feels feels huge. And to think that just 2146 01:57:01.199 --> 01:57:03.550 a couple of years ago, that match just could have 2147 01:57:03.569 --> 01:57:06.770 been thrown on Raw or SmackDown without even a second thought. 2148 01:57:06.810 --> 01:57:08.050 It's just it's crazy. 2149 01:57:08.779 --> 01:57:11.250 Yeah, they wrestled in a Money in the Bank qualifier 2150 01:57:11.329 --> 01:57:13.869 match at the very least. I don't know how often 2151 01:57:13.890 --> 01:57:17.869 they wrestled. But, yeah, they're in a different place now, 2152 01:57:17.930 --> 01:57:22.520 and Miro's so good. Danielson's so good. I mean, you 2153 01:57:22.560 --> 01:57:25.720 just think about who WWE had and now doesn't have 2154 01:57:26.479 --> 01:57:28.800 and how different things could be. You know, the Aleister 2155 01:57:28.819 --> 01:57:33.159 Black example and what Miro has done. I mean, I 2156 01:57:33.159 --> 01:57:35.189 don't even think of him as Rusev anymore, to credit him. 2157 01:57:35.210 --> 01:57:35.470 And I was. 2158 01:57:36.109 --> 01:57:38.869 down on him as anyone with that whole video game, self-indulgent, 2159 01:57:39.310 --> 01:57:41.689 lower card stuff. It's like, people are into video games. 2160 01:57:41.710 --> 01:57:43.550 They have to realize not everybody is, and we don't 2161 01:57:43.569 --> 01:57:46.659 want to hear about it. And, you know, don't build 2162 01:57:46.699 --> 01:57:48.539 your national wrestling career in front of a million people 2163 01:57:48.579 --> 01:57:51.520 around this sense that people who are into video games 2164 01:57:51.560 --> 01:57:53.619 want to... who aren't into video games want to hear 2165 01:57:53.640 --> 01:57:58.619 you talk about them because they don't. And now he's 2166 01:57:58.659 --> 01:58:00.310 just reinvented himself, and wow. 2167 01:58:00.510 --> 01:58:03.609 It's just... Yeah, it's just been interesting to see how 2168 01:58:03.729 --> 01:58:07.789 these guys... and and girls who who leave wwe fair 2169 01:58:08.289 --> 01:58:12.090 in other avenues because it it really is it it 2170 01:58:12.210 --> 01:58:15.189 hasn't been i'd like to say you know wwe got 2171 01:58:15.220 --> 01:58:18.439 it wrong every time and and everyone who leaves there 2172 01:58:18.500 --> 01:58:22.359 and goes off somewhere else proves wwe wrong like man 2173 01:58:22.380 --> 01:58:25.439 they they miss the boat on this guy completely but 2174 01:58:25.479 --> 01:58:28.500 that hasn't been the case it the it's, it's crazy 2175 01:58:28.539 --> 01:58:28.939 to see. 2176 01:58:29.140 --> 01:58:29.399 Yes. 2177 01:58:29.520 --> 01:58:31.880 They have missed the boat on a lot of people. 2178 01:58:32.039 --> 01:58:35.460 Miro being a perfect example, but there have been plenty 2179 01:58:35.479 --> 01:58:37.899 of others where you see them outside of WWE and 2180 01:58:37.920 --> 01:58:40.510 you're like, eh, it kind of makes sense. 2181 01:58:40.649 --> 01:58:42.789 But who, who of them has Tony Khan hired? Uh, 2182 01:58:46.789 --> 01:58:48.550 I mean, he didn't, he didn't, he hasn't hired a 2183 01:58:48.590 --> 01:58:51.989 white yet. So we don't know there. Um, you know, Ruby. 2184 01:58:52.029 --> 01:58:55.039 So it was doing fine. Um, you know, I don't 2185 01:58:55.060 --> 01:58:58.460 think she's like leaping off the screen as this amazing centerpiece. 2186 01:58:58.819 --> 01:59:01.399 I mean, you know, for WWE, they could use, they 2187 01:59:01.420 --> 01:59:05.000 certainly underutilized her, you know, going back to Miz Dow, 2188 01:59:05.060 --> 01:59:08.199 D'Lo Brown, you know, some of those, those people left 2189 01:59:08.229 --> 01:59:11.329 and it's just like, they went to impact and it's like, yeah, okay. 2190 01:59:11.729 --> 01:59:14.489 You know, and I, you know, Ryback didn't, you know, 2191 01:59:14.770 --> 01:59:17.350 Ryback hasn't been, hasn't been hired. Braun Strowman hasn't been 2192 01:59:17.369 --> 01:59:20.529 hired by Tony. So, I mean, yeah, I think just 2193 01:59:21.010 --> 01:59:22.729 Tony's making some good calls so far on who he 2194 01:59:22.770

--> 01:59:24.859 brings in and, you know, Impact sort of takes what 2195 01:59:24.880 --> 01:59:27.859 they can get. And I get that and tries to 2196 01:59:27.880 --> 01:59:29.760 make the best of it. And not that the names 2197 01:59:29.800 --> 01:59:32.119 I mentioned were failures. It just was like, oh, it 2198 01:59:32.159 --> 01:59:33.600 wasn't as big of a loss as I thought it 2199 01:59:33.640 --> 01:59:34.000 might have been. 2200 01:59:35.100 --> 01:59:37.939 Yeah, I think there's a lot of people who, you know, 2201 01:59:37.979 --> 01:59:40.930 you just know from the jump that WWE missed the 2202 01:59:40.970 --> 01:59:43.350 boat on this guy and they're going to go be 2203 01:59:43.369 --> 01:59:46.609 a huge star somewhere else. Jon Moxley, perfect example. I mean, 2204 01:59:46.770 --> 01:59:50.050 anyone can see that Moxley is a star. And, you know, 2205 01:59:50.149 --> 01:59:52.609 he was a star to some extent in WWE, but 2206 01:59:52.649 --> 01:59:55.869 they squandered it. For the most part. And then there's 2207 01:59:55.909 --> 01:59:59.289 the talent who and I think Ruby Soho maybe fits 2208 01:59:59.329 --> 02:00:04.689 this bill the best. Someone who maybe people can now 2209 02:00:04.789 --> 02:00:07.930 point to and see her in AEW and say, see, 2210 02:00:08.090 --> 02:00:11.210 she wasn't all that the Internet made her out to be. 2211 02:00:11.390 --> 02:00:14.350 Except that I think for a lot of these people 2212 02:00:14.590 --> 02:00:18.090 that the argument shouldn't have been this guy or this 2213 02:00:18.130 --> 02:00:21.550 girl can carry the company. It's just that this guy 2214 02:00:21.649 --> 02:00:26.109 or this girl can be a really strong, good hand 2215 02:00:26.750 --> 02:00:29.829 in the mid card, occasionally working their way up to 2216 02:00:29.850 --> 02:00:33.890 the top rather than a not being used at all 2217 02:00:34.390 --> 02:00:37.979 or be being used as glorified enhancement talent to put 2218 02:00:38.079 --> 02:00:43.079 over people who aren't working. And that's what someone like 2219 02:00:43.500 --> 02:00:46.380 Ruby Riot or Ruby Soho was used as in WWE. 2220 02:00:46.840 --> 02:00:49.649 I think there's a lot more examples of those people overall. 2221 02:00:49.729 --> 02:00:52.970 I mean, you can even point to somebody like something 2222 02:00:52.989 --> 02:00:56.470 like FTR where, you know, they're not they're not even 2223 02:00:56.489 --> 02:01:00.229 the top tag team in AEW. But man, are they 2224 02:01:00.270 --> 02:01:02.489 great hands and man, are they good at what they 2225 02:01:02.550 --> 02:01:05.800 do in their role? And in WWE, they're just the 2226 02:01:05.840 --> 02:01:07.779 guys that go out and lose to New Day every week. 2227 02:01:10.850 --> 02:01:12.930 Admit it, you love Nick Barbatti when he co-hosts with 2228 02:01:12.970 --> 02:01:14.729 me on the Wade Keller Post Shows. Well, now you 2229 02:01:14.750 --> 02:01:17.029 can listen to him every week on the Nicky's Club, 2230 02:01:17.069 --> 02:01:20.109 a VIP exclusive podcast. Here's Nick to tell you more. 2231 02:01:20.260 --> 02:01:22.699 Hey, wrestling fans. It's Nick Barbatti, and I'm back with 2232 02:01:22.720 --> 02:01:24.779 the Nicky's Club, the place where the family of Nicky's 2233 02:01:24.840 --> 02:01:27.760 comes together for big laughs and sharp takes on WWE. 2234 02:01:27.840 --> 02:01:30.760 From WrestleMania rumors to surprise returns, I got you covered. 2235 02:01:30.899 --> 02:01:33.100 The Nicky's Club, where the wrestling feels like the coolest 2236 02:01:33.140 --> 02:01:33.699 club in town. 2237 02:01:33.939 --> 02:01:35.720 Nick Barbatti wants to be part of your pro wrestling 2238 02:01:35.760 --> 02:01:40.090 life every week, so... Why not let him? GoVIP. PWTorch.com 2239 02:01:40.369 --> 02:01:43.289 slash GoVIP for full details on signing up. We're compatible 2240 02:01:43.310 --> 02:01:46.609 with Patreon, Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and just about any other 2241 02:01:46.750 --> 02:01:48.750 iOS or Android app out there. You can also stream 2242 02:01:48.770 --> 02:01:51.770 directly from our ad-free VIP website. The Nicky's Club, waiting 2243 02:01:51.810 --> 02:02:02.510 for you every week at PWTorch VIP. uh brandon it 2244 02:02:02.529 --> 02:02:04.600 was brought up in passing i don't think we commented 2245 02:02:04.609 --> 02:02:09.020 uh much at length the uh ridge holland segment yeah 2246 02:02:09.640 --> 02:02:11.340 um i mean it looks like they're setting something up 2247 02:02:11.380 --> 02:02:14.739 with him and seamus and uh we haven't seen much 2248 02:02:15.619 --> 02:02:19.500 on smackdown from seamus so far but he's another person 2249 02:02:19.520 --> 02:02:23.149 who i thought had a really good year and you 2250 02:02:23.270 --> 02:02:27.090 add him to the mix and you know that looks 2251 02:02:27.109 --> 02:02:29.439 good and i and i like and i like Rich 2252 02:02:29.449 --> 02:02:31.680 Holland kind of saying, hey, this is somebody I look 2253 02:02:31.739 --> 02:02:35.399 up to, and now what's next? I thought this was 2254 02:02:35.439 --> 02:02:35.960 a good segment. 2255 02:02:37.260 --> 02:02:40.199 Yeah, I thought it was a little curious the way 2256 02:02:40.229 --> 02:02:44.449 that they kind of brought Sheamus into the picture and 2257 02:02:44.510 --> 02:02:51.180 bringing up the John Cena thing and that storied title 2258 02:02:51.239 --> 02:02:53.420 match with the awkward table finish and all of that. 2259 02:02:54.760 --> 02:02:57.760 but I'm curious to see where it goes. Do you 2260 02:02:57.800 --> 02:03:02.000 get the sense that they're more going the direction of 2261 02:03:03.340 --> 02:03:07.300 Holland playing the baby face to Seamus' heel, who doesn't 2262 02:03:07.479 --> 02:03:12.250 want to involve himself with Holland, or maybe the other 2263 02:03:12.310 --> 02:03:15.569 way around? Holland is sort of tricking Seamus, or do 2264 02:03:16.189 --> 02:03:17.590 you get the

sense more that it could be a 2265 02:03:17.630 --> 02:03:18.130 tag team? 2266 02:03:19.050 --> 02:03:23.609 What I like about this is All three entered my mind. 2267 02:03:25.079 --> 02:03:28.039 Because your question is right along the lines of my thinking. 2268 02:03:28.079 --> 02:03:29.939 Is it this? Or is it this? Or is it 2269 02:03:30.020 --> 02:03:33.039 this and then this? Because it's almost for sure going 2270 02:03:33.060 --> 02:03:36.859 to be A, B, or C, followed by B, C, 2271 02:03:36.920 --> 02:03:39.260 or A. They're either going to be enemies and become 2272 02:03:39.300 --> 02:03:42.300 friends and then form a team. Or they're going to 2273 02:03:42.319 --> 02:03:46.430 be friends. Yes, it's rinse and repeat with him. Or 2274 02:03:46.619 --> 02:03:53.260 it's going to be Holland acts like he's... uh, that, 2275 02:03:53.300 --> 02:03:55.739 that he looks up to him and Seamus buys in 2276 02:03:56.460 --> 02:03:58.939 and they're both kind of a baby facing. And then there's, there's, 2277 02:03:59.119 --> 02:04:01.960 there's a turn. Um, and it happens right away or 2278 02:04:02.000 --> 02:04:04.279 later or yeah. Seamus just goes, who do you think 2279 02:04:04.300 --> 02:04:08.680 you are fella? And Ridge is, you know, more sympathetic. Yeah. 2280 02:04:08.760 --> 02:04:11.359 It's just, I can talk it through and, and it 2281 02:04:11.380 --> 02:04:15.939 was totally open for interpretation. And I think Holland showed 2282 02:04:16.060 --> 02:04:21.430 good presence, uh, and the story felt kind of believable. 2283 02:04:21.829 --> 02:04:24.060 He seems like a guy who would be looking up 2284 02:04:24.079 --> 02:04:27.119 to Sheamus with his buddies, and you're thinking, what's he 2285 02:04:27.220 --> 02:04:30.399 up to, or how's Sheamus going to react to this, 2286 02:04:30.479 --> 02:04:32.319 and is it going to let him down? And I'm 2287 02:04:32.420 --> 02:04:33.199 already into the story. 2288 02:04:34.640 --> 02:04:37.680 Yeah, I'm intrigued. It gives Sheamus something to do. I'm 2289 02:04:37.720 --> 02:04:41.159 with you. I think that Sheamus has been great this year. 2290 02:04:41.859 --> 02:04:46.189 Someone who... I've mentioned this on the post-show before. Sheamus 2291 02:04:46.229 --> 02:04:49.010 is a guy who I... very rarely, if ever want 2292 02:04:49.029 --> 02:04:50.710 to see in the main event. And as soon as 2293 02:04:50.729 --> 02:04:53.069 he's in the main event, I start to groan and 2294 02:04:53.569 --> 02:04:56.010 it seems like inevitably the program doesn't work very well, 2295 02:04:56.489 --> 02:04:58.649 but he's one of my favorite guys to watch in 2296 02:04:58.670 --> 02:05:01.489 the mid card. Uh, and it's been that way for years. 2297 02:05:01.810 --> 02:05:04.600 I just think he's a great hand who can have 2298 02:05:04.640 --> 02:05:07.960 some great matches with a variety of opponents. And he 2299 02:05:08.060 --> 02:05:11.420 he's not really built to be that company carrying heel, 2300 02:05:11.479 --> 02:05:15.000 but man, is he great to have. Uh, and I 2301 02:05:15.020 --> 02:05:17.750 think that Even in these later stages of his career, 2302 02:05:17.869 --> 02:05:21.909 he's proven to be a really, really worthwhile piece and 2303 02:05:21.930 --> 02:05:24.229 an important piece of the roster that they can sort 2304 02:05:24.270 --> 02:05:27.989 of plug and play when they need him in certain scenarios. So, yeah, 2305 02:05:28.140 --> 02:05:30.899 it's a great person for Ridge to mix up with 2306 02:05:31.300 --> 02:05:34.359 his first go around on the main roster because he's 2307 02:05:34.380 --> 02:05:38.840 a guy who I think needs someone like Seamus. Ridge 2308 02:05:38.859 --> 02:05:42.859 Holland is someone who doesn't necessarily stand out at first 2309 02:05:42.920 --> 02:05:45.510 glance when you hear him talk or when you see him. 2310 02:05:46.310 --> 02:05:48.920 or even when you see him wrestle particular opponents, but 2311 02:05:49.560 --> 02:05:52.939 if they get him in the ring against Seamus, I 2312 02:05:53.000 --> 02:05:55.220 think that they're going to beat the crap out of 2313 02:05:55.239 --> 02:05:59.569 each other. And that is going to get some attention 2314 02:05:59.670 --> 02:06:03.609 on Ridge. And conversely, if they team up, I think 2315 02:06:03.649 --> 02:06:06.210 they're just going to be bruisers to whoever they face 2316 02:06:06.649 --> 02:06:08.449 and that is going to accomplish the same thing. 2317 02:06:08.789 --> 02:06:13.640 So, yeah, absolutely. Um, you know, Seamus has the second, 2318 02:06:13.880 --> 02:06:16.079 you know, the nose broken twice in short order. I 2319 02:06:16.399 --> 02:06:19.460 give him plenty of time, but that does maybe create some, 2320 02:06:19.619 --> 02:06:22.430 you know, a potential sympathetic angle. Once his nose won't 2321 02:06:22.479 --> 02:06:25.710 rebreak doing the angle, um, you could have Holland, you know, 2322 02:06:25.949 --> 02:06:27.569 act like a friend and turn on him. I think 2323 02:06:27.609 --> 02:06:29.810 Seamus is a baby face makes more sense. My, if 2324 02:06:29.850 --> 02:06:31.689 I'm to answer your question, honestly, I think Holland came 2325 02:06:31.729 --> 02:06:35.069 across more like a heel or someone who I think 2326 02:06:35.149 --> 02:06:41.189 is being, I'm, I'm suspicious. He's being sneaky and sinister. Um, 2327 02:06:41.899 --> 02:06:43.979 and he's up to something. That's the vibe I got. 2328 02:06:44.000 --> 02:06:45.859 So if they're going for that, that's what I interpreted, 2329 02:06:45.880 --> 02:06:47.960 but it doesn't rule out it was sincere, and I'm 2330 02:06:48.000 --> 02:06:51.479 just cynical. But I think Sheamus as a babyface makes 2331 02:06:51.520 --> 02:06:52.350 more sense at this point. 2332 02:06:53.090 --> 02:06:55.770 Yeah, and it's been a long time since Sheamus has 2333 02:06:55.789 --> 02:06:59.329 been a babyface too, and I just finished talking about 2334 02:06:59.350 -->

02:07:01.569 how I don't typically enjoy Sheamus in the main event. 2335 02:07:02.270 --> 02:07:06.399 The one exception to that was his babyface world title run, 2336 02:07:06.500 --> 02:07:09.460 which it wasn't the best. It wasn't the greatest world 2337 02:07:09.479 --> 02:07:11.899 title run by any means, but I thought it worked. 2338 02:07:11.960 --> 02:07:13.939 I thought it worked as the secondary him being the 2339 02:07:13.979 --> 02:07:17.189 secondary sort of world champion. And he was certainly over 2340 02:07:17.229 --> 02:07:19.350 with the crowd at that time. I thought he was entertaining. 2341 02:07:19.359 --> 02:07:21.369 He had a lot of good matches. I think he 2342 02:07:21.409 --> 02:07:24.909 gave Alberto Del Rio some of his some of his 2343 02:07:24.949 --> 02:07:29.550 better matches in WWE, even though, you know, it wasn't 2344 02:07:29.590 --> 02:07:32.630 a it wasn't a feud that, you know, knocked my 2345 02:07:32.649 --> 02:07:35.050 socks off or anything, but it was enjoyable for what 2346 02:07:35.090 --> 02:07:39.109 it was. So, yeah, I would not mind seeing Sheamus 2347 02:07:39.210 --> 02:07:40.409 take on a baby face role. 2348 02:07:40.270 --> 02:07:40.609 For a while. 2349 02:07:41.250 --> 02:07:42.729 And I think with the year he had, people would 2350 02:07:42.750 --> 02:07:44.869 be more receptive to it, and there does come a 2351 02:07:44.890 --> 02:07:47.310 point where you're just around long enough, like Cena, where 2352 02:07:47.329 --> 02:07:50.289 people are like, all right, we didn't like you. We resisted, 2353 02:07:50.369 --> 02:07:55.430 but you persevered, and now we'll acknowledge that you paid 2354 02:07:55.449 --> 02:07:58.609 your dues. You let us boo you or whatever, and 2355 02:07:58.689 --> 02:07:59.390 now you've put in the work. 2356 02:08:00.119 --> 02:08:02.800 Um, so I think they could have, I think they 2357 02:08:02.840 --> 02:08:04.600 could have done it coming out of the Drew McIntyre 2358 02:08:04.619 --> 02:08:07.260 feud if they had wanted to just because they beat 2359 02:08:07.279 --> 02:08:09.720 the crap out of each other just so frequently that 2360 02:08:09.739 --> 02:08:10.579 I think they could have done it. 2361 02:08:11.060 --> 02:08:11.260 Yeah. 2362 02:08:11.319 --> 02:08:13.279 And I could see, you know, I mean, Seamus and Drew, 2363 02:08:13.319 --> 02:08:14.880 you know, they're in social media taking pictures of each 2364 02:08:14.920 --> 02:08:17.279 other at like national predator games and stuff. They're, they're 2365 02:08:17.300 --> 02:08:20.010 pals and they're on the same brand now. You could 2366 02:08:20.050 --> 02:08:23.529 see them associating with each other in a feud with 2367 02:08:23.909 --> 02:08:27.880 the Usos or something like that, which then leads to 2368 02:08:28.359 --> 02:08:30.760 Drew and Reigns. But then after that, or before that, 2369 02:08:30.920 --> 02:08:34.460 as a setup or afterwards, Sheamus and Reigns. Because I 2370 02:08:34.479 --> 02:08:37.699 kind of want to see Sheamus against Reigns. Sheamus as 2371 02:08:37.739 --> 02:08:42.560 a babyface against Roman can be good. And I think Sheamus, 2372 02:08:42.979 --> 02:08:44.720 the thing I like about Sheamus is he just seems 2373 02:08:44.819 --> 02:08:47.359 sure of who he is now. And he's kind of 2374 02:08:47.479 --> 02:08:52.479 aged into and earned through his tenure, the ability to 2375 02:08:52.520 --> 02:08:55.460 be confident and have it be believable as opposed to 2376 02:08:55.500 --> 02:08:59.439 who do you think you are? And I think fans 2377 02:08:59.560 --> 02:09:01.640 are willing to, are ready to embrace him. And he's just, 2378 02:09:01.819 --> 02:09:05.210 he's had some good bangers, you know, so go have 2379 02:09:05.250 --> 02:09:08.310 more and do it to Roman and have Roman sell 2380 02:09:08.369 --> 02:09:10.270 and have the Usos freak out and have Heyman look worried. And, 2381 02:09:10.590 --> 02:09:12.869 you know, you can get, you can get some, you 2382 02:09:12.890 --> 02:09:14.909 can get a couple of pay-per-views. 2383 02:09:14.590 --> 02:09:14.829 Out of that. 2384 02:09:15.760 --> 02:09:18.199 Yeah, I think that that's a really good that's a 2385 02:09:18.260 --> 02:09:21.560 really good, you know, be pay-per-view and not to not 2386 02:09:21.579 --> 02:09:23.560 to discredit Seamus or anything. I think it's a good 2387 02:09:23.729 --> 02:09:26.670 view to have, you know, sort of your off months 2388 02:09:26.689 --> 02:09:30.210 when you have the smaller pay-per-views. I also I always 2389 02:09:30.569 --> 02:09:32.430 it's a little hard now if we if we cast 2390 02:09:32.449 --> 02:09:35.489 Seamus in that baby face role, considering, you know, where 2391 02:09:35.609 --> 02:09:38.630 where he's at. But I I've always been really interested 2392 02:09:38.649 --> 02:09:41.430 to see Lesnar and Seamus, too. I. 2393 02:09:41.470 --> 02:09:43.579 Yes, I think that'd be a blast. And by the way, 2394 02:09:43.590 --> 02:09:46.590 if Seamus leaves WWE and goes to AEW and he 2395 02:09:46.609 --> 02:09:52.119 shows up as a heel, um, there's some fun matches there. So, and, 2396 02:09:52.180 --> 02:09:53.600 and actually you could show up as a baby face 2397 02:09:53.659 --> 02:09:54.880 and take on a heel Kenny, but I think it 2398 02:09:54.920 --> 02:09:57.600 makes more sense if Kenny's a baby face. Um, and, 2399 02:09:57.739 --> 02:09:59.260 and just, I, cause I'm just kind of, it just 2400 02:09:59.279 --> 02:10:01.739 feels like two worlds colliding who, you know, oil and water, 2401 02:10:01.770 --> 02:10:03.449 like how can these two even coexist in the ring? 2402 02:10:03.470 --> 02:10:05.149 Cause they're from such different worlds, but I think they 2403 02:10:05.189 --> 02:10:08.270 could have a good match. And there's a list of 2404 02:10:08.310 --> 02:10:10.649 other wrestlers who would be good. Some, you know, size-wise 2405 02:10:10.670 --> 02:10:13.789 because of AW

pushing, thankfully, people who don't have to be, 2406 02:10:13.970 --> 02:10:17.909 you know, six foot one or taller. Not all are 2407 02:10:17.930 --> 02:10:20.689 great matchups, but, you know, as Daniel Bryan showed, you can, 2408 02:10:21.050 --> 02:10:22.189 you know, Sheamus can make it work. 2409 02:10:23.569 --> 02:10:29.689 Is Miro the first, like, tried and true WWE discovered 2410 02:10:29.939 --> 02:10:34.399 talent to jump over? That hasn't, I mean, granted, someone 2411 02:10:34.439 --> 02:10:37.460 like Christian, yeah, he comes from WWE, but he's worked 2412 02:10:37.500 --> 02:10:41.329 other places in between stints, but Someone at the level 2413 02:10:41.369 --> 02:10:45.029 of Seamus, like who, you know, Seamus is a WWE 2414 02:10:45.050 --> 02:10:48.329 guy through and through like Miro Rusev was a WWE guy. 2415 02:10:48.609 --> 02:10:49.510 Have there been any others? 2416 02:10:50.430 --> 02:10:51.810 There haven't been many period. 2417 02:10:52.649 --> 02:10:53.090 You know what I mean? 2418 02:10:53.130 --> 02:10:55.109 Like, I mean, WWE, whether they want to admit it 2419 02:10:55.149 --> 02:10:57.369 or not are full of people who worked indie shows first. 2420 02:10:57.670 --> 02:10:57.909 Sure. 2421 02:10:58.770 --> 02:10:59.010 Yeah. 2422 02:10:59.029 --> 02:11:00.489 I think, I think he is. I'm just kind of 2423 02:11:00.510 --> 02:11:01.170 thinking about the names. 2424 02:11:03.010 --> 02:11:03.250 Yeah. 2425 02:11:03.270 --> 02:11:06.390 I mean, I just think like, you know, they're granted. 2426 02:11:06.409 --> 02:11:08.380 I don't think that it would ever happen. The biggest 2427 02:11:08.409 --> 02:11:13.340 of that bunch obviously would be, a John Cena given his, uh, his, his, 2428 02:11:13.920 --> 02:11:18.300 his newfound relationship with, with Warner. But, uh, yeah, just 2429 02:11:18.340 --> 02:11:20.619 thinking through it, I don't think there has there. I 2430 02:11:20.659 --> 02:11:21.600 think Rusev's the only one. 2431 02:11:21.859 --> 02:11:22.010 Yeah. 2432 02:11:22.020 --> 02:11:24.369 All right, Brandon, we will, uh, and there tell people 2433 02:11:24.390 --> 02:11:26.130 how they can follow you on social media and what 2434 02:11:26.149 --> 02:11:26.909 they will find there. 2435 02:11:27.789 --> 02:11:30.989 Yeah, sure. You can follow me at B LeClaire 12 2436 02:11:30.989 --> 02:11:34.890 on Twitter, um, and, uh, talking wrestling and some movies, 2437 02:11:34.909 --> 02:11:39.720 some music, uh, football, given that we're, we're, We're deep 2438 02:11:39.760 --> 02:11:44.210 in the season now. So, yeah, a bunch of a 2439 02:11:44.289 --> 02:11:46.510 bunch of different things. I've got a bunch of different hobbies. 2440 02:11:46.630 --> 02:11:49.550 Wrestling and football tend to take up most of my 2441 02:11:49.609 --> 02:11:52.250 time during the during the fall months. 2442 02:11:52.369 --> 02:11:55.529 But, yeah, you can follow me on Twitter at the 2443 02:11:55.569 --> 02:11:59.449 Wade Keller and follow our brand at P.W. 2444 02:11:59.710 --> 02:12:00.050 Torch. 2445 02:12:00.869 --> 02:12:03.250 Thanks, everybody. Go VIP. Listen to a Tony Khan interview 2446 02:12:03.550 --> 02:12:05.939 and so much more is waiting for you there. We 2447 02:12:05.979 --> 02:12:10.210 appreciate your support. PWTorch.com slash go VIP. 2448 02:12:11.029 --> 02:12:11.250 Check. 2449 02:12:11.329 --> 02:12:12.470 Oh, VIP members, by the way, will get to hear 2450 02:12:12.510 --> 02:12:18.069 Tyler Sage and Joel Donnell doing a post show this 2451 02:12:18.109 --> 02:12:22.220 week with Tyler Sage covering tonight's Rampage. And I am 2452 02:12:22.260 --> 02:12:25.079 looking forward to watching the show for a variety of reasons. 2453 02:12:25.100 --> 02:12:27.600 This sounds like a good episode. And like I said, 2454 02:12:27.619 --> 02:12:31.140 I had it on in the background. And so, yeah, 2455 02:12:31.180 --> 02:12:33.020 look for that. If you're a VIP member, I know 2456 02:12:33.039 --> 02:12:35.359 we cover SmackDown here on Friday nights and wish we 2457 02:12:35.380 --> 02:12:37.720 could do a rampage too, but with the overlap we don't. 2458 02:12:38.159 --> 02:12:40.239 And that's where Tyler and his Mexico hosts do. So 2459 02:12:40.539 --> 02:12:42.300 we make that a VIP exclusive too, as a thank 2460 02:12:42.319 --> 02:12:44.600 you for those of you who support us through a 2461 02:12:44.640 --> 02:12:49.130 subscription and VIP membership. Uh, Brandon, as always, it's blast. Thanks. 2462 02:12:49.250 --> 02:12:50.210 And we'll talk to you very soon. 2463 02:12:50.649 --> 02:12:50.810 Yeah. 2464 02:12:51.090 --> 02:12:52.829 Thanks so much for having me. Uh, glad to be here. 2465 02:12:52.890 --> 02:12:53.970 Always a fun time. 2466 02:12:54.250 --> 02:12:57.270 Excellent. Thanks to our callers and our emailers and all 2467 02:12:57.289 --> 02:12:59.970 of our listeners until next time on behalf of Brandon, 2468 02:12:59.989 --> 02:13:36.670 Wade Keller signing off. Your time is valuable. Go VIP 2469 02:13:36.789 --> 02:13:42.029 and listen to our shows commercial-free. A nice streamlined listening experience. pwtorch.com 2470 02:13:42.329 --> 02:13:46.050 slash govip for full details on a commercial-free listening experience. 2471 02:13:46.409 --> 02:13:48.949 And with a full VIP membership, you can create custom 2472 02:13:49.020 --> 02:13:51.840 feeds for individual shows or groups of shows by theme 2473 02:13:52.159 --> 02:13:55.340 and also unlock nearly four decades of archives and access 2474 02:13:55.439 --> 02:14:01.199 our ad-free website with VIP-exclusive content. pwtorch.com slash govip. Your 2475 02:14:01.239 --> 02:14:02.869 time is valuable, and that's one of the reasons we 2476 02:14:02.949 --> 02:14:08.590 offer VIP membership, pwtorch.com slash govip. You can participate in 2477 02:14:08.609 --> 02:14:12.010 the Wade Keller Pro Wrestling Podcast by emailing your question 2478 02:14:12.029 --> 02:14:16.819 or

topic to wadekellerpodcast at gmail.com. You can also participate 2479 02:14:16.880 --> 02:14:21.220 in the Wade Keller Post Shows by emailing wadekellerpostshow at gmail.com 2480 02:14:21.439 --> 02:14:25.159 during or right after Raw, Dynamite, or SmackDown. Let your voice, 2481 02:14:25.199 --> 02:14:27.800 let your opinions be heard on our shows via email, 2482 02:14:27.979 --> 02:14:32.859 wadekellerpodcast at gmail.com for the flagship and wadekellerpostshow at gmail.com 2483 02:14:33.050 --> 02:14:36.649 for our post shows. It's next-level coverage that you come 2484 02:14:36.689 --> 02:14:40.050 to expect from the PW Torch brand. No AI, no 2485 02:14:40.149 --> 02:14:45.319 rookie perspectives, no unfounded rumors, no clickbait, no deceptive headlines, 2486 02:14:45.560 --> 02:14:49.420 just high-quality writing, breaking news, and fascinating flashbacks every day 2487 02:14:49.560 --> 02:14:53.220 at pwtorch.com. Pull yourself away from the vacuous social media 2488 02:14:53.239 --> 02:14:55.319 experience that I know many of you regret once you 2489 02:14:55.500 --> 02:14:57.819 get lost in it for minutes, if not hours at 2490 02:14:57.850 --> 02:15:01.750 a time, and settle in for high-quality PW Torch-branded wrestling coverage. 2491 02:15:03.430 --> 02:15:05.510 Admit it, you love Nick Barbatti when he co-hosts with 2492 02:15:05.550 --> 02:15:07.310 me on the Wade Keller Post Shows. Well, now you 2493 02:15:07.329 --> 02:15:09.609 can listen to him every week on the Nicky's Club, 2494 02:15:09.649 --> 02:15:12.689 a VIP exclusive podcast. Here's Nick to tell you more. 2495 02:15:12.829 --> 02:15:15.270 Hey, wrestling fans. It's Nick Barbatti, and I'm back with 2496 02:15:15.300 --> 02:15:17.359 the Nicky's Club, the place where the family of Nicky's 2497 02:15:17.420 --> 02:15:20.340 comes together for big laughs and sharp takes on WWE. 2498 02:15:20.420 --> 02:15:23.319 From WrestleMania rumors to surprise returns, I got you covered. 2499 02:15:23.479 --> 02:15:25.680 The Nicky's Club, where the wrestling feels like the coolest 2500 02:15:25.720 --> 02:15:26.239 club in town. 2501 02:15:26.500 --> 02:15:28.279 Nick Barbatti wants to be part of your pro wrestling 2502 02:15:28.319 --> 02:15:32.659 life every week, so why not let him? GoVIP. PWTorch.com 2503 02:15:32.939 --> 02:15:35.869 slash GoVIP for full details on signing up. We're compatible 2504 02:15:35.890 --> 02:15:39.189 with Patreon, Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and just about any other 2505 02:15:39.329 --> 02:15:41.329 iOS or Android app out there. You can also stream 2506 02:15:41.350 --> 02:15:44.369 directly from our ad-free VIP website. The Nicky's Club, waiting 2507 02:15:44.390 --> 02:15:49.090 for you every week at PWTorch VIP. Did you know 2508 02:15:49.130 --> 02:15:52.500 that you can enjoy commercial-free versions of all of your 2509 02:15:52.520 --> 02:15:56.510 favorite Wade Keller podcasts and PWTorch Daily Casts? Just go 2510 02:15:56.569 --> 02:16:01.970 to

patreon.com, search PWTorch, and subscribe to a VIP membership tier. 2511 02:16:02.010 --> 02:16:04.000 You get a seven-day free trial, by the way, to 2512 02:16:04.039 --> 02:16:05.460 kick the tires a bit and see if you like 2513 02:16:05.479 --> 02:16:08.100 the service. And then sync it with Spotify, and you 2514 02:16:08.119 --> 02:16:10.899 can listen to commercial-free versions of our free shows like 2515 02:16:10.920 --> 02:16:13.250 the Wade Keller Post Shows, the Wade Keller Podcast Flagship, 2516 02:16:13.630 --> 02:16:17.689 our flashbacks, and also the PWTorch DataCast lineup. Again, all commercial-free, 2517 02:16:17.710 --> 02:16:20.750 a nice streamlined listening experience. But with third-tier membership, you 2518 02:16:20.770 --> 02:16:24.189 can also unlock all the VIP podcasts, including Everything with 2519 02:16:24.229 --> 02:16:25.850 Rich and Wade, The Fix with Todd Martin that I 2520 02:16:25.869 --> 02:16:28.569 host with Todd every week, the Wade Keller News Bulletin's 2521 02:16:28.689 --> 02:16:33.479 post-pay-per-view roundtables, and an array of other VIP-exclusive podcasts with 2522 02:16:33.500 --> 02:16:36.899 different hosts and different themes. Check out the lineup. Go 2523 02:16:36.940 --> 02:16:41.260 to Patreon and search PWTorch and subscribe and sync it 2524 02:16:41.299 --> 02:16:44.600 up with Spotify or stay within the Patreon ecosystem. Either 2525 02:16:44.620 --> 02:16:48.340 way works, go to Patreon and start your seven-day free trial. 2526 02:16:50.000 --> 02:16:51.799 If you're listening to us on the Apple Podcast app, 2527 02:16:51.860 --> 02:16:53.899 on Spotify, or any other app that allows you to 2528 02:16:53.979 --> 02:16:55.770 rate our podcast, please take a moment to give us 2529 02:16:55.829 --> 02:16:58.690 a five-star rating. It really helps us in the algorithm 2530 02:16:58.729 --> 02:17:01.930 and helps them know that you recommend us to others. 2531 02:17:02.090 --> 02:17:03.950 Just look for a place to rate the show on Spotify, 2532 02:17:03.969 --> 02:17:06.110 on Apple Podcasts, or wherever you're listening to our shows, 2533 02:17:06.309 --> 02:17:08.569 and please click that five-star rating. And of course, thank 2534 02:17:08.590 --> 02:17:12.959 you so much for listening. A PWTorch VIP membership doesn't 2535 02:17:13.000 --> 02:17:14.879 just give you ad-free access to these shows and a 2536 02:17:14.899 --> 02:17:17.600 ton of other VIP-exclusive podcasts throughout the week, but you 2537 02:17:17.620 --> 02:17:21.219 also gain access to our unmatched, vast library of wrestling history, 2538 02:17:21.559 --> 02:17:24.659 our contemporaneous week-to-week coverage through our Pro Wrestling Torch weekly 2539 02:17:24.700 --> 02:17:27.799 newsletters dating back to the late 1980s, along with streaming 2540 02:17:27.840 --> 02:17:31.079 and download access to hundreds of retro radio shows from 2541 02:17:31.100 --> 02:17:34.540 the 1990s, including some of my interviews with wrestling's top 2542 02:17:34.639 --> 02:17:38.389 newsmakers in the 90s. And also our podcast library dating 2543 02:17:38.409 --> 02:17:42.430 back to the year 2003. There's no larger, longer-spanning pro 2544 02:17:42.489 --> 02:17:45.969 wrestling podcast library than that that comes with a PWTorch 2545 02:17:46.010 --> 02:17:49.969 VIP membership. Now approaching 20 years of podcasting. Go VIP. 2546 02:17:50.520 --> 02:17:53.379 and dive into our post-pay-per-view roundtables, our coverage of some 2547 02:17:53.420 --> 02:17:57.659 of your favorite eras of wrestling, top-name long-form interviews, and 2548 02:17:57.739 --> 02:18:02.270 special format podcasts that we've done throughout the years. PWTorch.com 2549 02:18:02.370 --> 02:18:05.729 slash go VIP. We have a streamlined sign-up form, and 2550 02:18:05.750 --> 02:18:07.850 you can pay with PayPal or directly with your credit 2551 02:18:07.889 --> 02:18:10.469 card or debit card. In one or two minutes from 2552 02:18:10.530 --> 02:18:12.350 right now, you can be a VIP member and diving 2553 02:18:12.399 --> 02:18:15.600 into our library, pwtorch.com slash govip.