Full Transcript for WKPWP Interview Classic (10 Yrs Ago): Mick Karch talks Hennig family legacy, how close he came to joining the WWF, his stint with the AWA

29 00:01:42.840 --> 00:01:48.319 meal, I don't even think about snacking four hours afterwards, that's how satisfying 30 00:01:48.319 --> 00:01:51.040 they are. But They've got calorie conscious options too for this summer, in 31 00:01:51.079 --> 00:01:53.120 case you're trying to lose some weight and if you're trying to put on some 32 00:01:53.200 --> 00:01:56.239 muscle mass or gain weight. They have protein plus meals with thirty grams of 33 00:01:56.239 --> 00:01:59.879 protein or more per serving. If you've thought of going vegan but think it 34 00:02:00.120 --> 00:02:04.640 comes without taste or satisfaction, this is the place to start. My next 35 00:02:04.640 --> 00:02:08.479 delivery includes three bean vegan chili, vegan mushroom marsala harrisa I think that's all 36 00:02:08.520 --> 00:02:12.680 you say it, braised garbanzos stew. The next week, my vegan options 37 00:02:12.680 --> 00:02:15.479 are peanut boot aball, tomato, roasted vegetable, risotto, smoked tofu, 38 00:02:15.520 --> 00:02:20.199 almond stir fry, and blacken tofu. Those are the meals I'm looking forward 39 00:02:20.240 --> 00:02:22.960 to the next few weeks. You can also round out your meal and replenish 40 00:02:23.000 --> 00:02:27.479 your snack supply with cold press juices, shakes, smoothies, and more. 41 00:02:27.879 --> 00:02:32.439 So head to Factor Meals dot com slash Wade fifty that's Factor Meals dot com 42 00:02:32.599 --> 00:02:38.560 slash fifty and use code Wade fifty to get fifty percent off your first box. 43 00:02:38.960 --> 00:02:43.400 That's code Wade fifty at Factor Meals dot com slash Wade fifty to get 44 00:02:43.439 --> 00:02:59.639 fifty percent off your first box. Now pw Dorgan Spreaker bring you the Wade 45 00:02:59.719 --> 00:03:04.680 Killer Pro Wrestling Podcast. It's done. Bro Wade's interview with one of pro 46 00:03:04.759 --> 00:03:15.039 wrestling's newsmakers. One of my favorite people to talk pro wrestling with over the 47 00:03:15.120 --> 00:03:19.479 decades has been Mick Harsh. He is a Minnesota based announcer. He was 48 00:03:19.520 --> 00:03:23.639 the ring announcer for the AWA during their time on ESPN. He hosted a 49 00:03:23.759 --> 00:03:30.879 local wrestling block in the Minneapolis Saint Paul Market called Saturday Night at Ringside, 50 00:03:30.879 --> 00:03:35.080 which by the way, used Saturday Nights all Right for Fighting as its theme. 51 00:03:35.240 --> 00:03:38.520 I think back in the day the rights fees were a lot less than 52 00:03:38.560 --> 00:03:42.080 what Tony Kan just spent for Collision, maybe zero, because they flew under 53 00:03:42.080 --> 00:03:46.520 the radar a little bit. But Mick is also, before he got into 54 00:03:46.560 --> 00:03:51.120 wrestling, known for being the president of the Nick Backwinkle Fan Club. Back 55 00:03:51.159 --> 00:03:55.520 when before wrestling newsletters in the mid eighties started to become a thing, really 56 00:03:55.520 --> 00:03:59.960 early eighties started to

become a thing. It was the fan club bulletins first 57 00:04:00.039 --> 00:04:02.840 Pacific wrestlers that would not only include the latest on that wrestler, that the 58 00:04:02.919 --> 00:04:06.120 fan club was built around, but also the territory that they were based in, 59 00:04:06.159 --> 00:04:11.759 and that's how wrestling fans communicated each other in the pre Internet era and 60 00:04:12.400 --> 00:04:15.120 wrestling journalism are in any kind of formal sense, and mccars was one of 61 00:04:15.160 --> 00:04:20.199 those people documenting mcbachunl squer but also things going on in the AWA, and 62 00:04:20.480 --> 00:04:26.959 he has since been one of the top indie play by play announcers in the 63 00:04:27.040 --> 00:04:33.480 country, applying old school rules that have lost their way over time in terms 64 00:04:33.480 --> 00:04:38.399 of enhancing and not undercutting what the wrestlers are going for when there is a 65 00:04:38.439 --> 00:04:43.480 deliberate babyface heel dynamic and making sure that what the wrestlers are trying to accomplish, 66 00:04:43.480 --> 00:04:47.439 the announcer is underling and accentuating, not undercutting or diffusing. And so 67 00:04:47.600 --> 00:04:53.160 he joined me ten years ago this month for a hour and a half plus 68 00:04:53.279 --> 00:04:58.519 interview and we started talking about the Hending family legacy and when in depth on 69 00:04:58.560 --> 00:05:01.759 that with the and death of Kurt Henning, and also how close he came 70 00:05:01.759 --> 00:05:06.040 to getting an announcing job with the WWF, and he talks about his time 71 00:05:06.079 --> 00:05:12.959 in the AWA, also Rock and Roll, Buck Zoomof's Meltdown and more. 72 00:05:13.040 --> 00:05:16.519 This is just great old school stories, great big picture philosophy. This is 73 00:05:16.560 --> 00:05:21.319 one of those interviews where you just learn about a pocket of wrestling history of 74 00:05:21.360 --> 00:05:27.000 significance. That's good to kind of having your portfolio of how we got to 75 00:05:27.079 --> 00:05:30.839 where we are. And mccarsh was around a lot of the major players, 76 00:05:30.000 --> 00:05:33.839 So let's get to it. This live streamed originally on June fourteenth, twenty 77 00:05:33.879 --> 00:05:40.439 thirteen, and it is today's Wade Keller Pro Wrestling Podcast Interview Classic for Thursday, 78 00:05:40.519 --> 00:05:43.959 June twenty nine, twenty twenty three. And remember, with a VIP 79 00:05:44.120 --> 00:05:46.240 membership, you do not need to wait for me to select a best of 80 00:05:46.319 --> 00:05:51.160 interview. You can gain access to our VIP website and dive into our archives 81 00:05:51.160 --> 00:05:57.720 and listen on demand to thousands of hours of interviews with summer Prosting's biggest names 82 00:05:57.720 --> 00:06:01.319 and most fascinating people. PW Torch dot com slash go vi IP gives you 83 00:06:01.399 --> 00:06:06.680 details on signing up and becoming a proud PW Torch v I P member. 84 00:06:15.839 --> 00:06:19.839 Welcome to dp Wteorge livecast. I am Way Keller, editor and publisher of 85 00:06:19.920 --> 00:06:27.079 the Pro Wrestling Torch newsletter since nineteen eighty seven and also pwtorchcot dot com website 86 00:06:27.120 --> 00:06:31.199 since nineteen ninety nine, and now the Pwtorch app for iPhones, Android, 87 00:06:31.519 --> 00:06:36.480 Amazon, Kindle, Fire, Windows phones, and Samsu Samsung Smart TVs. 88 00:06:38.040 --> 00:06:42.600 And also host of this the PW Torch Livecast every Tuesday and Friday. I 89 00:06:42.680 --> 00:06:46.279 say that every time, and yet somehow I managed to screw up a couple 90 00:06:46.279 --> 00:06:49.360 of things in there. It is Friday. It is interview Friday here at 91 00:06:49.360 --> 00:06:54.160 the livecast, and I am excited to introduce a return guest on the program. 92 00:06:54.519 --> 00:06:58.480 Wrestling announcer for many many years, one of my longest friends in pro 93 00:06:58.560 --> 00:07:02.560 wrestling, and a former Progressing Towards columnist, Mick Carsh. Mick, welcome 94 00:07:02.560 --> 00:07:05.319 back to the show. Thank you, Waite. Good to be back. 95 00:07:05.360 --> 00:07:08.680 It's been a while. And you know when you said that you started as 96 00:07:08.680 --> 00:07:12.360 a torch in nineteen eighty seven. Let's think of that's when I started doing 97 00:07:12.399 --> 00:07:17.839 announcing for Burne. But I was done in eighty eight. Here it is, 98 00:07:18.360 --> 00:07:20.879 you know, twenty six years later, and you're going strong, and 99 00:07:21.120 --> 00:07:25.560 I'm glad to be back on the show. Welvern was done in about eighty 100 00:07:25.560 --> 00:07:29.120 eight anyway too, And yeah he was he really was. Yeah, and 101 00:07:29.240 --> 00:07:31.800 you have been active in wrestling off and on, but mostly on ever since 102 00:07:31.839 --> 00:07:38.279 I don't have you have you in some capacity not been involved in a wrestling 103 00:07:38.279 --> 00:07:41.240 show. What's the longest stretch of time in the last twenty years you have 104 00:07:41.279 --> 00:07:44.160 not been involved in some sort of wrestling event. Oh, man, I 105 00:07:44.240 --> 00:07:47.839 you know, if you're counting, you know, announcing it in these shows 106 00:07:47.920 --> 00:07:53.319 or whatever. There's no time off. I mean, there hasn't been really 107 00:07:53.360 --> 00:07:57.199 anything. There were some lapses where I wasn't on television for a while, 108 00:07:57.800 --> 00:08:01.839 but as far as you know, being involved with a promotion here or there, 109 00:08:01.959 --> 00:08:05.800 or doing a house announcing or whatever, it's just been consistent since nineteen 110 00:08:05.040 --> 00:08:11.519 eighty five really and just kind of briefly talk mentioned where people might have seen 111 00:08:11.600 --> 00:08:16.040 you or heard of you who aren't from Minnesota and know about the indie then 112 00:08:16.079 --> 00:08:18.399

because you've done some I don't even know what kind of how to categorize them 113 00:08:18.399 --> 00:08:22.079 at different wrestling pay per views over the years. Besides the a w A 114 00:08:22.079 --> 00:08:26.480 announcing, Yeah, I really have. I've actually done some sort of announcing 115 00:08:26.480 --> 00:08:31.759 with Windy City with WCW. I did ring announcing for them. The ill 116 00:08:31.840 --> 00:08:37.080 fated American Wrestling Federation, Warriors of Wrestling Round System promotion. I had two 117 00:08:37.159 --> 00:08:43.600 runs with them. I was with Rob Russon in the International Wrestling Association for 118 00:08:43.639 --> 00:08:48.279 a while, you know, and then the various Independence I think, yeah, 119 00:08:48.679 --> 00:08:54.559 I think really the only the only major promotion. I guess Global too, 120 00:08:54.600 --> 00:08:58.720 But outside of WWE, I've kind of had at least a hand or 121 00:08:58.720 --> 00:09:01.960 a brief stint with a lot of different promotions. And of course I don't 122 00:09:01.960 --> 00:09:07.200 know how many Independence I lost count a long time ago. If it's a 123 00:09:07.279 --> 00:09:09.519 letter of the alphabet, I probably you know, announced for him at some 124 00:09:09.639 --> 00:09:15.200 point. And when did you first start watching wrestling? What year was it, 125 00:09:15.720 --> 00:09:18.320 and what do you remember about the first time pro wrestling caught your eye? 126 00:09:18.799 --> 00:09:22.600 Man, you're killing me. Nineteen sixty was the first year that I 127 00:09:22.600 --> 00:09:26.320 started watching wrestling, and you know that, you know it. I realized 128 00:09:26.360 --> 00:09:31.120 I'm dating myself, but hell, it's out there anyway. I turned on 129 00:09:31.200 --> 00:09:33.480 wrestling, you know, just kind of happened to flip the channels. I 130 00:09:33.600 --> 00:09:37.440 was, you know, just a young kid, and I've told this story 131 00:09:37.639 --> 00:09:41.320 many many times. I happened to flip on the old AWA And this was 132 00:09:41.559 --> 00:09:46.879 really when they were getting rolling and Fern was about to become champion. Back 133 00:09:46.919 --> 00:09:50.440 in nineteen sixty and one of the main stays back then was a guy by 134 00:09:50.440 --> 00:09:54.279 the name of Tiny Mills. And Tiny was known as the King of the 135 00:09:54.360 --> 00:09:58.639 Lumberjacks, you know, big two hundred and seventy pound, five pound guy, 136 00:09:58.759 --> 00:10:01.279 no zeke whatsoever. You know, back in the day, it didn't 137 00:10:01.320 --> 00:10:05.720 matter long hair. He was teaming up with Stan Crusher Kowalski at the time, 138 00:10:05.759 --> 00:10:09.000 and he were the a WATA team champions. And I happen to turn 139 00:10:09.039 --> 00:10:13.759 on the TeV. He just flipping channel's probably going from cartoons to whatever, 140 00:10:13.200 --> 00:10:18.600 and here Tiny Mills. He's got Marty O'Neill, who's the AWATV announcer. 141

00:10:18.639 --> 00:10:22.879 Marty's all of about five six, and Tiny Mills is grabbing Marty O'Neill by 142 00:10:22.919 --> 00:10:24.759 the lapels and he's shaken him and he's, you know, get get me 143 00:10:24.799 --> 00:10:28.720 Carbon, get me that match with Burned Gania. You know, somebody's going 144 00:10:28.799 --> 00:10:31.000 to pay for this. And you know, even at that tender age, 145 00:10:31.039 --> 00:10:33.320 I saw this and I figured, you know what, I think, I 146 00:10:33.320 --> 00:10:37.000 want to tune into this a couple more times. And you know, that 147 00:10:37.159 --> 00:10:43.559 was fifty some years later, and that's how I first got hooked on wrestling. 148 00:10:43.320 --> 00:10:48.960 I actually started when I was thirteen years old. I would go down 149 00:10:48.000 --> 00:10:52.759 to the Dykeman Hotel, which of course housed the Minneapolis Wrestling Club back in 150 00:10:52.799 --> 00:10:56.799 the day. Every Saturday afternoon, the wrestlers would come in and pick up 151 00:10:56.840 --> 00:11:00.159 their paychecks and their itineraries and what have you. When I would go out 152 00:11:00.200 --> 00:11:03.000 and sitting in the lobby wait for the wrestlers to come in, and Wally 153 00:11:03.120 --> 00:11:07.919 Carbo handed me a handful of change, and he had some publicity and he 154 00:11:07.960 --> 00:11:11.000 said, can you run this over to the Minneapolis Star Tribune building, which 155 00:11:11.000 --> 00:11:16.159 was about six blocks from the Dykeman Hotel. And that was my first actual 156 00:11:16.399 --> 00:11:22.639 job in professional wrestling, was you know, hand carrying the publicity for Wally. 157 00:11:22.639 --> 00:11:26.639 And from there, you know, was one thing after another, fan 158 00:11:26.720 --> 00:11:31.639 club newsletters, and I did some writing for a Minneapolis tabloid called The Daily 159 00:11:31.679 --> 00:11:39.960 American. In nineteen seventy three seventy four. I approached him and I said, 160 00:11:39.960 --> 00:11:43.200 how about a column on professional wrestling. They had been an alternative newspaper 161 00:11:43.240 --> 00:11:48.039 to the Star Tribune when the Star Tribune went on strike in nineteen sixty two, 162 00:11:48.480 --> 00:11:52.320 and they kind of hung around off and on became a tabloid, and 163 00:11:52.320 --> 00:11:54.720 they said, sure, we could use a wrestling column. So I did 164 00:11:54.759 --> 00:11:58.720 that for a couple of years, and then one thing led to another and 165 00:11:58.240 --> 00:12:05.320 the announcing stuff to started taking shape in about nineteen eighty five. It's great 166 00:12:05.360 --> 00:12:09.519 because I get asked frequently, even though I've never held a job in professional 167 00:12:09.519 --> 00:12:11.919 wrestling, how to get a job in professional wrestling? And I'm fascinated. 168 00:12:11.960 --> 00:12:16.840 Everybody has a different story of who have you worked in wrestling and collected paychecks 169 00:12:16.879 --> 00:12:20.519 in wrestling? What path they took? And I think every story is so 170 00:12:20.639 --> 00:12:24.080 fun to hear. And the thing about it is there is no conventional story. 171 00:12:24.120 --> 00:12:28.799 There's no one route to become a referee and announcer, doing publicity, 172 00:12:28.960 --> 00:12:33.039 setting up chairs, setting up the ring, becoming a wrestler. It's yourself 173 00:12:33.120 --> 00:12:35.919 or an announcer. Every story just there's not really this real common theme. 174 00:12:35.919 --> 00:12:41.559 It's it's it's a business without a handbook that helps people get a job exactly. 175 00:12:41.720 --> 00:12:45.679 And when people say it, and there are people that asked me on 176 00:12:45.720 --> 00:12:48.600 the internet, you know, what would you suggest how do I become a 177 00:12:48.600 --> 00:12:50.559 wrestling announcer? I don't have a clue. I you know, you're absolutely 178 00:12:50.639 --> 00:12:54.639 right. I don't know what to tell you, especially in this day and 179 00:12:54.720 --> 00:13:00.679 age and as far as you know, how you get involved wrestling. I 180 00:13:00.679 --> 00:13:03.480 mean I was lucky. I was really lucky that, you know, Wally 181 00:13:03.519 --> 00:13:05.720 took a shine to me for whatever back in the day, because I was 182 00:13:05.759 --> 00:13:09.360 just I mean I was literally not that I'm not now, but I was 183 00:13:09.399 --> 00:13:13.960 a hangaround. I mean I I bugged the wrestlers so badly at the the 184 00:13:15.039 --> 00:13:18.919 Dykemon Hotel. I remember Reggie Parks was one of the first guys that I 185 00:13:18.320 --> 00:13:22.080 saw at the Dykemon and he he got to the point where he complained to 186 00:13:22.080 --> 00:13:26.080 the office secretary back in the day, you know, these kids are hanging 187 00:13:26.120 --> 00:13:28.960 around, they're bugging me every week, get them out of here. And 188 00:13:28.120 --> 00:13:31.440 uh, you know so that was the beginning of my being a pain in 189 00:13:31.440 --> 00:13:35.600 the ass and here it is, you know. So, so fifty years 190 00:13:35.679 --> 00:13:39.240 later and I'm still doing it. I know that, feeling well of. 191 00:13:41.159 --> 00:13:45.679 I mean, Kathy Ghani used to answer the phones at the a WA headquarters, 192 00:13:45.759 --> 00:13:48.159 right, yes, yeah, I don't know how many weeks in a 193 00:13:48.240 --> 00:13:52.200 row I called her asking if Scott Hall really as called as I say at 194 00:13:54.000 --> 00:14:00.639 Wow. Well I didn't do that, but I mean, I would uh 195 00:14:01.240 --> 00:14:03.200 it was. It was so much fun there because you know, the Diapmond 196 00:14:03.240 --> 00:14:07.720 Hotel, the wrestling office was up on the sixth floor and you got off 197 00:14:07.720 --> 00:14:11.240 the elevator and before you went down the hall, if they had the office 198 00:14:11.360 --> 00:14:16.080 door open, you could hear pretty much everybody arguing with somebody.

And it 199 00:14:16.200 --> 00:14:20.720 was either Wally Carbo arguing with Bill Pisisto, who was the Minneapolis matchmaker at 200 00:14:20.720 --> 00:14:24.559 the time, or or Bill yelling at veran Gania or something. So it 201 00:14:24.639 --> 00:14:28.080 was. It was a never ending circus there. But it was so great 202 00:14:28.120 --> 00:14:33.480 because anybody who was anybody came through there, I mean consistently up through the 203 00:14:35.039 --> 00:14:37.840 nineteen seventies when they finally moved the wrestling office out to Saint Louis Park. 204 00:14:39.240 --> 00:14:43.600 When when did the Damond Hotel get torned down? And what's there now? 205 00:14:43.639 --> 00:14:48.399 Is that where the Marriott is or uh no, the uh it's actually z 206 00:14:48.759 --> 00:14:52.879 it's a city center. Um. The Diacmond Hotel was across the street from 207 00:14:52.960 --> 00:14:58.080 Murray's, which is on Sixth Street, right off of Nicolette between Nicolet and 208 00:14:58.159 --> 00:15:01.399 Hennepin. And so the part of the city center is there. And allthough 209 00:15:01.399 --> 00:15:05.200 I you know, I haven't been down there forever when the diakement got torn 210 00:15:05.279 --> 00:15:09.320 down. You know, I couldn't tell you. I guess approximately at the 211 00:15:09.320 --> 00:15:13.559 time of the the birth of the city Center. But that was it was. 212 00:15:13.639 --> 00:15:16.360 It was great, you know the uh they had a bar on the 213 00:15:16.399 --> 00:15:20.080 Diamond and after the matchress it's a Minneapolis auditorium, the wrestlers would come down 214 00:15:20.159 --> 00:15:22.919 and had a party afterward, and uh, it was it was good. 215 00:15:22.960 --> 00:15:26.960 It wasn't good time cool. Well. One one family that you have been 216 00:15:26.960 --> 00:15:28.480 able to see up close since one of the many subjects I want to talk 217 00:15:28.480 --> 00:15:31.919 to you about today, UH is the Henning family. Uh, Larry the 218 00:15:31.960 --> 00:15:37.200 acces Henning. You saw his career straight through. Uh, Kurt Hennings absolutely 219 00:15:37.200 --> 00:15:39.320 start to finish, and you were around for his uh you know, fast 220 00:15:39.440 --> 00:15:45.759 rise in the AWA and and now uh finally Uh Kurt heading son, Curtis 221 00:15:45.799 --> 00:15:48.279 Axel, at age thirty three getting a pretty big push on TV this month. 222 00:15:48.679 --> 00:15:54.279 I talked a little bit about Larry the Axe and Kurt Henning and what 223 00:15:54.279 --> 00:15:58.039 what kind of career Larry had, how Kurt either lived up to or was 224 00:15:58.120 --> 00:16:03.159 different than what Larry then, how how Larry's career went, you know, 225 00:16:03.200 --> 00:16:04.799 how how did Kurt, Because so many sons get compared to the dad, 226 00:16:04.799 --> 00:16:08.039 either favorably or unfavorably, and talk about that dynamic. And then after that, 227 00:16:08.120 --> 00:16:11.559 I kind of want to compare Curtis to both. Sure, I say, 228 00:16:11.600 --> 00:16:15.200 well, as far as Larry's concerned, I mean, Larry was involved 229 00:16:15.200 --> 00:16:18.960 in wrestling. He got started again, you're going back to about nineteen sixty 230 00:16:19.000 --> 00:16:23.919 one, nineteen sixty two. He was also a graduate of Robinsdale High School. 231 00:16:25.000 --> 00:16:30.159 And Larry was never real flashy in the ring. You know, a 232 00:16:30.200 --> 00:16:33.639 couple of years into the business, you know he had been baby faced for 233 00:16:33.720 --> 00:16:37.759 while. He had a feud. I think his biggest feud back in the 234 00:16:37.840 --> 00:16:42.159 day when he first got started was what's an AWA heavyweight champion, mister m 235 00:16:42.200 --> 00:16:47.480 who was doctor Bill Miller under a mask, And that was Larry's first real 236 00:16:47.600 --> 00:16:53.759 springboard into real prominence in the AWA. Although I should backtrack a little bit. 237 00:16:53.840 --> 00:17:00.639 Larry actually was part of an AWA tag team championship combination. This is 238 00:17:00.679 --> 00:17:03.119 going back to nineteen sixty two. He teams up with a guy by the 239 00:17:03.200 --> 00:17:08.240 name of Duke Duke Kaufman and they had a very short run as a WATA 240 00:17:08.440 --> 00:17:15.599 team champions but then in sixty three, they did the old teacher mentor or 241 00:17:15.000 --> 00:17:19.640 mentor student kind of thing, and Larry turned on veran Gania and turned heel. 242 00:17:21.400 --> 00:17:25.559 And from that point on until the middle nineteen seventies, Larry was a 243 00:17:25.680 --> 00:17:30.000 mainstay heel here in the AWA. And people who aren't familiar with Larry's career 244 00:17:30.240 --> 00:17:34.359 at Thleek that he centered specifically on the state of Minnesota. He had some 245 00:17:34.400 --> 00:17:40.400 pretty good runs in Texas, and he had a great run in New York 246 00:17:40.480 --> 00:17:45.799 State. A great old veteran, I mean, old school, big tough 247 00:17:45.839 --> 00:17:52.079 guy. That was Larry's reputation was that he was absolutely one of the toughest 248 00:17:52.079 --> 00:17:56.799 guys you did not want to screw around with. Larry Hennick. I remember 249 00:17:56.880 --> 00:18:00.960 one time in particular, and I don't know if the namest Hoffman will be 250 00:18:00.000 --> 00:18:04.279 familiar to you, but Horse Hoffman was a terrific wrestler out of Germany. 251 00:18:04.319 --> 00:18:07.480 He teamed up with Baron von Rashki here in the in the seventies, and 252 00:18:07.599 --> 00:18:11.279 Horse was a tough guy as well. And you know, legend has it 253 00:18:11.359 --> 00:18:14.839 that he and Larry kind of got into it at one point away from the 254 00:18:14.960 --> 00:18:19.759 ring, and Larry dismantled him pretty quickly. Um. In terms of Larry 255 00:18:21.000 --> 00:18:26.680 as opposed to Kurt, I think they're really different. Um because Kurt was 256 00:18:26.680 --> 00:18:30.319 was a

finesse wrestler, he was fast in the ring. Larry was always 257 00:18:30.400 --> 00:18:36.480 kind of the big, plotting, tough guy. Um. Kurt. I 258 00:18:36.480 --> 00:18:38.880 mean you saw his beginnings, you know, and you can certainly see him 259 00:18:38.880 --> 00:18:42.839 on the old tapes wrestling for Vince out East, and how he developed that, 260 00:18:44.000 --> 00:18:48.240 how he blossomed when he went out to Portland. I don't think outside 261 00:18:48.279 --> 00:18:55.759 of the outside of the dedication to the business itself and that old school mentality 262 00:18:55.799 --> 00:19:00.480 and protecting the business. I think Larry and Kurt were pretty diametrically up in 263 00:19:00.599 --> 00:19:03.279 terms of styles. Joe Hannah got, on the other hand, Curtis Axel 264 00:19:04.000 --> 00:19:07.519 reminds me an awful lot of Curry. I mean, if you if you 265 00:19:07.559 --> 00:19:10.839 look at his expressions, if you look at it, clearly he's been watching 266 00:19:10.920 --> 00:19:15.799 his dad's videotapes and you know, whether he's looking out into the crowd, 267 00:19:15.839 --> 00:19:18.559 the expression he has or some of the moves to snap soup plexus or the 268 00:19:18.640 --> 00:19:23.839 perfect plexus or what have you, this is he's going to be a real 269 00:19:25.200 --> 00:19:29.839 talent. And I last year in Waterloo, Iowa. This is kind of 270 00:19:29.839 --> 00:19:32.359 interesting that you mentioned. You know, he's thirty three years old, which 271 00:19:32.400 --> 00:19:34.920 is really you know, it's it's kind of a late start, you know, 272 00:19:36.000 --> 00:19:40.279 to blossom into the business the way he hasn't finally get the push. 273 00:19:40.400 --> 00:19:42.799 I remember I was talking to Larry Hennig at the Waterloo Hall of Fame and 274 00:19:42.880 --> 00:19:48.920 he didn't tell me exactly what was coming up with Joe, but what he 275 00:19:48.039 --> 00:19:52.319 said was, wait, it's finally happening. You know, Joe's got the 276 00:19:52.359 --> 00:19:56.599 seasoning that he needs right now. Vince is real high on him and they've 277 00:19:56.599 --> 00:20:00.400 got some big plans for him coming up. And you know, this was 278 00:20:00.480 --> 00:20:06.079 several months later, but I just I get a big kick out of watching 279 00:20:06.160 --> 00:20:08.519 him. I'm very impressed with him. I love the fact that he's with 280 00:20:08.559 --> 00:20:14.400 my friend Paul Hayman, and you know, the more they do with Johanna 281 00:20:14.440 --> 00:20:17.200 Curtis Axtell, the happier I'm going to be. I think he's I think 282 00:20:17.200 --> 00:20:18.960 he's in it for long haul. IV He's going to be a major player. 283 00:20:21.720 --> 00:20:25.240 Thank you for subscribing to the Wade Keller Pro Wrestling podcast and Wade Keller 284 00:20:25.279 --> 00:20:27.400 Pro Wrestling post shows. Don't forget We got a whole lineup of other shows 285 00:20:27.400 --> 00:20:32.799 called the PW Torch Daily Casts. It's free. Just search pw torch in 286 00:20:32.839 --> 00:20:36.240 your podcast stapp a different show on a different topic throughout the week, including 287 00:20:36.279 --> 00:20:41.359 shows dedicated to a ew n X t MMA, Ring of Honor and more. 288 00:20:41.559 --> 00:20:45.240 Just search pw torch in your podcast stapp or check out links to the 289 00:20:45.319 --> 00:20:53.440 latest shows at our main website, pwtorch dot com. What you liked, 290 00:20:55.039 --> 00:20:59.599 What they seem to have been doing with him gimmick wise at the beginning by 291 00:20:59.599 --> 00:21:03.319 having him win and kind of a flukish fashion by count out and uh and 292 00:21:03.599 --> 00:21:07.680 disqualification. You know, John Cena sees an ambulance and an ambulance light tases 293 00:21:07.720 --> 00:21:12.440 it, loses, Triola stumbles and brings I love too that make that John 294 00:21:12.440 --> 00:21:15.000 Cena made fun of right back for doing that exact same thing at the beginning 295 00:21:15.039 --> 00:21:18.640 of the show, you know, Siren, and then he does the exact 296 00:21:18.640 --> 00:21:22.599 same thing later. But that's been a subject of conversation, I know you. 297 00:21:22.920 --> 00:21:25.640 The thing people listeners should know is, even though Mick can talk about 298 00:21:25.920 --> 00:21:29.319 the sixties and seventies with the best of them, um, you're you're on 299 00:21:29.359 --> 00:21:33.680 Facebook all all the time, commenting as soon as these current shows there raw 300 00:21:33.720 --> 00:21:37.440 and impact. You've got your comments on the current a scene and you follow 301 00:21:37.440 --> 00:21:41.160 it as closely as just about anybody does still today, which is one of 302 00:21:41.160 --> 00:21:42.559 the great things about having me on the show because you can add that historical 303 00:21:42.599 --> 00:21:47.920 perspective while not being still bitter that you're not or just so disinterested that you're 304 00:21:47.960 --> 00:21:51.119 not watching what goes on today. So you're also on the booking of him. 305 00:21:51.200 --> 00:21:52.319 Yeah, you're thoughts on him, Well, I agree with you. 306 00:21:52.400 --> 00:21:56.920 I guess to me, if the guy was scoring clean Jim Falls, I'd 307 00:21:56.960 --> 00:22:00.119 be a lot happier. I guess you know, it's it's kind of a 308 00:22:00.160 --> 00:22:03.839 sit a wait and see whether they're going with this. At least, the 309 00:22:03.920 --> 00:22:07.519 way I look at it weight is at least they're giving him a push. 310 00:22:07.640 --> 00:22:11.799 At least he's not relegated to the craft that he was with the Michael mcgilla, 311 00:22:11.799 --> 00:22:15.440 Cutty and everything else and just being bogged down going nowhere. At least 312 00:22:15.480 --> 00:22:21.200 they're giving him a spotlight and hopefully they don't blow it. You know, 313 00:22:21.279 --> 00:22:23.839 so many times you think WW is on the verge of doing something great and

314 00:22:23.880 --> 00:22:27.440 then you know, something happens and the writers you know, have a brain 315 00:22:27.480 --> 00:22:32.880 fart and something happens and there it goes. Um. As far as uh, 316 00:22:33.200 --> 00:22:37.759 you know, the overall push of Joe Hennick Um, I think japping 317 00:22:37.799 --> 00:22:44.119 Paul in his corner is going to be a great asset. Um Again, 318 00:22:44.119 --> 00:22:47.480 You've got a brilliant mind, you know, along with Joe, and Joe 319 00:22:47.640 --> 00:22:52.240 seems to struggle a little bit with with promos um. You know, it 320 00:22:52.640 --> 00:22:55.599 kind of along the lines of Rock Lesner. You know, he can say 321 00:22:55.599 --> 00:22:57.799 a couple of things, but then you better have Paul jump in. Um. 322 00:22:59.119 --> 00:23:03.079 But I I'm excited about it. It gives me a reason to watch 323 00:23:03.119 --> 00:23:07.359 wrestling. And as far as what you said about me continuing to stay hooked 324 00:23:07.400 --> 00:23:10.400 on the business, I am. I mean, I don't deny you know. 325 00:23:10.720 --> 00:23:11.839 You know, you can throw the word mark out all you want. 326 00:23:11.880 --> 00:23:14.960 I'm the biggest mark in the world, and I will be, you know, 327 00:23:15.000 --> 00:23:17.640 the first to admit it. But I'm not one of these guys who's 328 00:23:17.640 --> 00:23:19.400 going to say I don't watch the current product. Well, you know, 329 00:23:19.440 --> 00:23:22.359 there's so many people who say I don't watch wrestling today. It sucks. 330 00:23:23.200 --> 00:23:27.119 But if you ask them a question about something that happened last week, miraculously. 331 00:23:27.200 --> 00:23:30.039 They know, you know, they knew what happened. They saw the 332 00:23:30.079 --> 00:23:34.000 angle or whatever it is, and I admit it. I mean, I 333 00:23:34.000 --> 00:23:37.519 am I bitter about it about what I see today. No, No, 334 00:23:37.680 --> 00:23:41.759 I'm not bitter about it. But I've got something to say about it. 335 00:23:41.799 --> 00:23:45.319 If I see something that is awful, like the end of Raw last week, 336 00:23:45.440 --> 00:23:51.000 then I'm going to comment on it. Let's go back to the st 337 00:23:51.240 --> 00:23:55.440 announcing with the A W A current hanging was around. Then you can talk 338 00:23:55.440 --> 00:23:57.279 about that a little bit. Just talk about also working for Verne. What 339 00:23:57.359 --> 00:24:00.960 it was like, you know, knowing kind your background now as you presented 340 00:24:02.000 --> 00:24:04.079 it to listeners, getting chance to fly out to Vegas, be at the 341 00:24:04.079 --> 00:24:07.559 show, about be a ring announcer, be part of the show that you 342 00:24:07.640 --> 00:24:12.039 grew up watching for twenty five years leading up to that moment with some involvement 343 00:24:12.079 --> 00:24:15.920 but not as an un air announcer. Talk about that experience and what it 344 00:24:17.000 --> 00:24:22.000 was like working for Vernon. Well, you know what happened. It's funny. 345 00:24:22.039 --> 00:24:26.240 I hung around for so many years and I always wanted to do what 346 00:24:26.400 --> 00:24:30.440 I wanted to be involved in the AWA with the AWA on TV from the 347 00:24:30.440 --> 00:24:33.440 time I was a kid, and years are going by and it's not happening, 348 00:24:33.440 --> 00:24:37.000 and it's not happening, and I, you know, it's now you're 349 00:24:37.000 --> 00:24:37.880 in the mid eighties, and I'm thinking, well, you know, it's 350 00:24:37.880 --> 00:24:42.039 over and done with. It's never going to happen. And then I happened 351 00:24:42.079 --> 00:24:47.920 to get a call. In the summer of nineteen eighty seven, I'm at 352 00:24:47.920 --> 00:24:51.680 my full time job and I got a call from Greg Ganya and Greg said, 353 00:24:51.680 --> 00:24:53.880 you know, I've seen some of your work. Would you be interested 354 00:24:55.000 --> 00:24:59.400 in coming down in auditioning with the AWA. We're looking for a ring announcer 355 00:25:00.079 --> 00:25:03.200 to come out to the show Bolt in Vegas with us once a month. 356 00:25:03.240 --> 00:25:06.599 Well, you know, how soon do I pack? It was that kind 357 00:25:06.640 --> 00:25:11.160 of thing. I was really really surprised because it kind of came out of 358 00:25:11.160 --> 00:25:17.000 the blue. What might have preceded it or precipitated it was George Shire and 359 00:25:17.200 --> 00:25:19.839 your friend. George and I had done some stuff up in Winnipeg in nineteen 360 00:25:19.880 --> 00:25:27.480 eighty six for Tony Condello and Nick Backwinkle actually watched our tapes and kind of 361 00:25:27.519 --> 00:25:33.519 critiqued him for us, and he was pretty high on stuff that George and 362 00:25:33.559 --> 00:25:34.920 I had done. And you know, I don't know for sure, but 363 00:25:36.000 --> 00:25:40.079 I have a feeling that Nick put in a good word. So I got 364 00:25:40.119 --> 00:25:41.759 the call, and you know, out to Vegas I went. And what's 365 00:25:41.799 --> 00:25:47.920 interesting before I before I mentioned talking about Verne, so many people will say, 366 00:25:47.960 --> 00:25:49.480 hey, you know, Mick Carsch is the whole a WA announcer. 367 00:25:49.519 --> 00:25:52.599 Well, in reality, in all the years I've been dow and wrestling, 368 00:25:52.799 --> 00:25:56.960 I was an AWA announcer for about six seven months. Yet you know, 369 00:25:57.279 --> 00:26:02.839 it was real quick. But it's funny how the ESPN, you know, 370 00:26:03.200 --> 00:26:06.640 all of a sudden you get that, you get that recognition. But for 371 00:26:06.680 --> 00:26:08.759 me, it was August of eighty seventh through about March of eighty eight, 372 00:26:08.759 --> 00:26:12.880 and I was done what the AWA as far as doing TV is concerned. 373 00:26:15.799 --> 00:26:21.960 As far as working for Verne, I saw the same two sides of verne 374 00:26:22.000 --> 00:26:26.920 Gania that pretty

much everybody did. I saw the verne Gania who, when 375 00:26:26.960 --> 00:26:30.319 he was in a good mood, was gregarious, He was outgoing, he 376 00:26:30.359 --> 00:26:36.519 was smiling. This was kind of the public persona of Verne. And I 377 00:26:36.559 --> 00:26:41.720 got along pretty well with Verne for the most part when greg greg was the 378 00:26:41.720 --> 00:26:44.799 one that hired me. But but I did, I got along okay, 379 00:26:44.799 --> 00:26:48.440 with Verne didn't make waves, kept my mouth shut, but I was coming 380 00:26:48.440 --> 00:26:52.960 in at really what was kind of the beginning of the end, and it 381 00:26:52.000 --> 00:26:56.319 was a long, a long beginning to a long end. I guess if 382 00:26:56.359 --> 00:27:00.079 you think about it, if you think that the aw a really full that 383 00:27:00.240 --> 00:27:03.240 up. You know, in ninety two, so they still had about four 384 00:27:03.319 --> 00:27:08.559 years left from the time I got started. But I could see if something 385 00:27:08.680 --> 00:27:14.200 wasn't going right, if there was an incident, the little things were getting 386 00:27:14.240 --> 00:27:18.279 to burn, and in his reactions you could see the tension, you could 387 00:27:18.319 --> 00:27:25.960 see the frustration. Now you're talking nineteen eighty seven, and the AWA had 388 00:27:26.000 --> 00:27:30.480 pretty well hung in with Vince from an attendance standpoint till about nineteen eighty six. 389 00:27:30.799 --> 00:27:33.759 Here in town. You know, if you say Wressell Rock was the 390 00:27:33.839 --> 00:27:38.359 last real hurrah for the AWA where they drew a sizeable crowd, And you're 391 00:27:38.359 --> 00:27:41.799 going into eighty seven and you've still got a decent rosterly, you know, 392 00:27:42.000 --> 00:27:48.799 like you mentioned, when I was there, Nick had just left, and 393 00:27:48.279 --> 00:27:53.319 so did Buddy Rose and Doug Summers, but the Midnight Rockers were still there, 394 00:27:53.359 --> 00:27:57.799 and Jerry Blackwell and Larry's Abisco, Tommy Rich, Adrian Adonis and you 395 00:27:57.839 --> 00:28:02.240 know Kurt Hannig, as you said, Greg guy, Yeah, they still 396 00:28:02.359 --> 00:28:07.519 had a decent roster, but you could sense things aren't starting to tank a 397 00:28:07.559 --> 00:28:14.559 little bit. And Verne was very, very tense. And I know we're 398 00:28:14.599 --> 00:28:18.839 gonna at some point we're here, we'll talk about the Uh what kinda was 399 00:28:18.920 --> 00:28:22.920 the beginning of the ends for me with the a WA and working for Verne? 400 00:28:22.200 --> 00:28:26.599 Yeah, well, I want to tell that story, but with the 401 00:28:26.440 --> 00:28:30.319 AWA, and it's it's disappointing for me in to a degree because as even 402 00:28:30.359 --> 00:28:33.920 though the a WA was around for several years after I started the Torch, 403 00:28:33.000 --> 00:28:37.440 I started in October nineteen eighty seven, and it's it is those it's the 404 00:28:37.559 --> 00:28:41.319 last stretch of time that the a w A had a real, you know, 405 00:28:41.480 --> 00:28:45.559 kind of respectful presence in the wrestling world. But there wasn't much left 406 00:28:45.559 --> 00:28:48.000 to cover. I mean, it was why I became a wrestling fan and 407 00:28:48.039 --> 00:28:52.799 all that, but how how much I think it was Steve Austin on his 408 00:28:52.880 --> 00:28:56.519 new podcast talking to Jim Ross, and they talked about different promoters over the 409 00:28:56.559 --> 00:29:00.440 years who had the best chance to expand nationally because it was going to happen 410 00:29:00.559 --> 00:29:03.720 just as national news. You know what cable was expanding, pay per view 411 00:29:03.759 --> 00:29:07.240 was coming around. Somebody was going to end up with a national promotion, 412 00:29:08.200 --> 00:29:12.759 and Robson Austin talked about Verne as maybe being the guy who had the best 413 00:29:12.880 --> 00:29:18.079 chance to do that, even more so than say Bill Watts or Earlee Anderson 414 00:29:18.200 --> 00:29:22.559 or Fritz Van Eric. Do you agree with that and what do you think 415 00:29:22.599 --> 00:29:27.000 stopped Verne? And I guess perhaps throw Greg in there from taking advantage of 416 00:29:27.039 --> 00:29:32.839 that possibility, that expanding national market. You know, what I've heard is 417 00:29:32.920 --> 00:29:36.799 that and I don't know, I don't know this for sure. I've heard 418 00:29:36.799 --> 00:29:41.079 that Greg was kind of the voice of reason a little bit back then, 419 00:29:41.680 --> 00:29:48.240 more soul, more so than Verne. I think if anything stopped Verne, 420 00:29:48.119 --> 00:29:56.559 it was And people have talked about this Vern's mentality in terms of, you 421 00:29:56.599 --> 00:30:00.400 know, the business changing and not wanting to keep up with the times and 422 00:30:02.200 --> 00:30:04.839 really ignoring what was going on around him, if if that makes sense, 423 00:30:04.920 --> 00:30:14.119 all looks like mixed phone just went out. So because I heard the ping, 424 00:30:15.559 --> 00:30:22.160 so he should call right back, so hopefully he will. Searching for 425 00:30:22.240 --> 00:30:26.960 more great pro wrestling talk, then join me. Jason Powell host him to 426 00:30:26.039 --> 00:30:30.240 free Weekly Pro Wrestling Boom Podcast. Each week, he'll hear the latest news 427 00:30:30.240 --> 00:30:33.519 and analysis for me and my team at pro wrestling dot net along with other 428 00:30:33.519 --> 00:30:37.880 pro wrestling media members. Plus, the Pro Wrestling Boom Podcast features long form 429 00:30:37.960 --> 00:30:41.920 interviews with notable names in the pro wrestling industry. Subscribe and I team at 430 00:30:41.920 --> 00:30:47.240 Stitcher, Downcast, and all your favorite secondary apps, or visit us directly 431 00:30:47.240 --> 00:30:57.440 at pwboom dot com. Once again, that's pwboom dot com. And in 432 00:30:57.480 -->

00:31:00.599 the meantime, I have not done this yet, so let me give the 433 00:31:00.599 --> 00:31:02.960 phone numbers out because we are taking live calls today. We're live on the 434 00:31:03.000 --> 00:31:07.160 air Friday afternoon. We're here every Friday at five thirty eastern two thirty Pacific 435 00:31:07.200 --> 00:31:11.839 time, and you can join us at five thirty eastern at pwtorch livecast dot 436 00:31:11.839 --> 00:31:17.359 com. That is pwtrchlivecast dot com. You can send an email questions if 437 00:31:17.359 --> 00:31:19.759 you are listening to us live and have a question or topic for Mick carsh 438 00:31:19.839 --> 00:31:22.880 but are not able to call in live or are shy. Otherwise, you 439 00:31:22.920 --> 00:31:26.920 can call our phone number which is six four six seven two one nine eight 440 00:31:26.920 --> 00:31:32.440 two eight six four six seven two one nine eight two eight. I mentioned 441 00:31:32.440 --> 00:31:40.319 Steve Auston's podcast. I definitely want to thank Steve for retweeting a PW Torch 442 00:31:40.319 --> 00:31:45.680 tweet earlier today. We have started pulling some interesting anecdotes, fac stories and 443 00:31:47.000 --> 00:31:52.400 such from Steve Auston's new podcast, and we have a bunch of snippets up 444 00:31:52.440 --> 00:31:55.799 already on pwtorch dot com and we'll continue to do that as he continues to 445 00:31:55.799 --> 00:31:59.759 produce great podcast. You know, the biggest star in the history of wrestling, 446 00:32:00.279 --> 00:32:02.799 UH doing well. You can argue with that. He's certainly right there 447 00:32:02.839 --> 00:32:07.240 in the conversation and nobody's much bigger than him if if you want to argue 448 00:32:07.240 --> 00:32:10.119 for somebody, and I would put Austin at the very top. UM and 449 00:32:10.599 --> 00:32:14.559 it's uh, it's it's it's a really fascinating show. And we're pulling out 450 00:32:14.559 --> 00:32:20.119 a lot of little excerpts and snippets of fascinating uh notes, including the conversation 451 00:32:20.119 --> 00:32:23.079 he had with Kevin nash Um since he started a podcast. So anyway, 452 00:32:23.119 --> 00:32:25.839 we we mentioned that on our Twitter page and Steve Auston retweeted it to his 453 00:32:25.920 --> 00:32:30.200 one point four million followers. So little thanks and shout out to fellow podcaster 454 00:32:30.359 --> 00:32:36.519 Steve Auston. M I knew, you know, there's that there's that direction 455 00:32:37.759 --> 00:32:45.000 that you go in with uh, with your career, um, and the 456 00:32:45.680 --> 00:32:50.880 correction in the direction that Steve Auston's career goes, goes from becoming the top 457 00:32:50.920 --> 00:32:57.279 superstar in professional wrestling and then eventually he graduates to podcasting. And so it's 458 00:32:57.279 --> 00:33:01.240 great that, um, it's great that he is moving to that to that 459 00:33:01.359 --> 00:33:07.559 level. All right, we're still trying to work through our technical issue here 460 00:33:08.559 --> 00:33:13.559 and now we hear it. Hey, Mick, Mick is here. All 461 00:33:13.640 --> 00:33:15.839 right. I don't know what happened. Do you think your phone went out? 462 00:33:15.599 --> 00:33:22.119 No? I think that Verne is somewhere with a wirecutter. That's what 463 00:33:22.279 --> 00:33:25.440 I'm guessing. I hope my phone doesn't go off. But sorry about that. 464 00:33:25.599 --> 00:33:30.119 And I don't even know where I left off you. The last well, 465 00:33:30.240 --> 00:33:32.160 the last thing you said is that Greg was probably the voice of rope. 466 00:33:35.519 --> 00:33:39.039 Greg, Greg was the voice of reason. Yeah. Verne, on 467 00:33:39.079 --> 00:33:44.960 the other hand, his attitude was such a lot of the guys would tell 468 00:33:45.039 --> 00:33:50.039 me that Verne would say you need me, I don't need you. And 469 00:33:50.359 --> 00:33:53.119 because of that, you know, systematically things are starting to fall apart, 470 00:33:54.079 --> 00:34:00.279 and whatever chance I think Verne had of a national expansion. You know, 471 00:34:00.359 --> 00:34:02.359 you got to be able to hold it together. You gotta have loyal employees 472 00:34:02.359 --> 00:34:07.079 that aren't mad at you. You gotta have guys that you know are going 473 00:34:07.160 --> 00:34:09.559 to stay with you and not be tempted to go somewhere else because they're not 474 00:34:09.599 --> 00:34:15.480 being treated well. So if if Vernon fact was going to be the guy, 475 00:34:15.960 --> 00:34:19.679 I don't know. I think things really had the change. It took 476 00:34:19.679 --> 00:34:23.840 them a long time to come around to the to the changes in the business. 477 00:34:25.440 --> 00:34:30.800 You know that very well. I mean in terms of how the presentation 478 00:34:30.119 --> 00:34:35.119 was and in old school versus the entertainment side of the business. So you 479 00:34:35.159 --> 00:34:38.119 know, right or wrong. I think I think Verne, because he was 480 00:34:38.159 --> 00:34:43.840 hanging on so tenaciously to the old way of doing things, I think national 481 00:34:43.840 --> 00:34:46.519 expansion was was kind of out of the question. Do you know if Vernon 482 00:34:46.519 --> 00:34:53.559 Gregor on Twitter? I don't know if Greg's on Twitter, but I would 483 00:34:53.559 --> 00:34:59.000 pretty much bet Verne isn't. Yeah, I just I just think about how 484 00:34:59.000 --> 00:35:01.000 fun it's been for you know why seeing vincec Man try to embrace Twitter. 485 00:35:01.440 --> 00:35:04.559 Jim Ross is kind of you know, I don't know if I want to 486 00:35:04.599 --> 00:35:07.039 do it now he loves it, you know. And Paul Bart before he 487 00:35:07.079 --> 00:35:09.199 died, really got into Twitter and love that. And you know, seeing 488 00:35:09.239 --> 00:35:14.039 you on Facebook, it's it's been interesting seeing you like how to throw you 489 00:35:14.039 --> 00:35:17.079 in there, but it's been

interesting seeing how much social media has brought the 490 00:35:17.119 --> 00:35:22.639 wrestling world together different. It's incredible. I mean, you know, I'm 491 00:35:22.639 --> 00:35:27.920 thinking back to when you started the Torch and that was kind of presenting wrestling 492 00:35:27.960 --> 00:35:30.159 in a different way, you know, I mean that was that was the 493 00:35:30.199 --> 00:35:34.679 first to me, that was the first real change in the media part of 494 00:35:34.719 --> 00:35:39.000 wrestling was obviously the newsletters and the sheaths and what have you. And now 495 00:35:39.039 --> 00:35:42.559 in this day and age, a lot of people have said to me, 496 00:35:42.599 --> 00:35:45.079 you know, man, you know, if if only you were doing SNR 497 00:35:45.239 --> 00:35:49.320 today, you know, the same kind of formats that I was doing, 498 00:35:50.000 --> 00:35:52.239 And I said, I couldn't do it because you know, I couldn't say 499 00:35:52.239 --> 00:35:57.000 anything faster than you could find it on the internet. Nobody would say to 500 00:35:57.079 --> 00:36:00.920 me, whatever happened to so and so, where's he wrestling? Because all 501 00:36:00.920 --> 00:36:04.039 you got to do is go to the internet and there it is. So 502 00:36:04.039 --> 00:36:08.280 so much has changed and I can't imagine Verne Gun you're using Twitter. Verne 503 00:36:08.280 --> 00:36:14.519 didn't even watch the Awa show on ESPN half the time, so I don't 504 00:36:14.559 --> 00:36:17.559 think he would he would get into social media very much. And you know 505 00:36:17.639 --> 00:36:22.239 there's the old mindset too, that so much is out there. I think 506 00:36:22.360 --> 00:36:24.920 Verne would just hate it. You know, if he knew the information that 507 00:36:25.039 --> 00:36:29.320 was out there today, why did he not watch the show on ESPN? 508 00:36:30.280 --> 00:36:32.800 You know, I don't know. I honestly don't know. But I remember 509 00:36:32.800 --> 00:36:36.840 a couple of people saying to me, you know, Verne, did you 510 00:36:36.880 --> 00:36:39.119 see that or what have you? And Verne would say sometimes, no, 511 00:36:39.199 --> 00:36:43.760 I haven't watched the show yet. And you know, this is three weeks 512 00:36:43.800 --> 00:36:47.280 after it aired, so you know why why you know, unless he got 513 00:36:47.280 --> 00:36:51.760 tired of looking at the Mills brothers in the front row at the show boat. 514 00:36:51.800 --> 00:36:53.599 I have no idea why he didn't watch the show. Well, we 515 00:36:53.639 --> 00:36:58.679 know he didn't DVR it, so no, he certainly did not know he 516 00:36:58.760 --> 00:37:00.960 didn't. But you know, and you know, we were gonna just make 517 00:37:01.039 --> 00:37:06.039 mention real quick of that, of that situation that I had with Durne, 518 00:37:06.079 --> 00:37:09.840 if I can talk about that right now. I had gone out there, 519 00:37:10.159 --> 00:37:14.639 Oh man, this is this is a couple three months so I'd probably made 520 00:37:14.719 --> 00:37:17.800 three four trips out to the show Boat, and Larry Nelson was actually the 521 00:37:19.239 --> 00:37:21.960 host at the time, and Larry was doing the ring announcing, and he 522 00:37:22.000 --> 00:37:25.960 was welcoming everybody to the show, and Larry had kind of had his fill 523 00:37:27.960 --> 00:37:30.760 of Verne yelling at him. I mean, this is basically what he told 524 00:37:30.800 --> 00:37:35.840 me. And so I was I was going to go out there, and 525 00:37:36.400 --> 00:37:39.199 the first time that I was out there by myself, Larry had actually stayed 526 00:37:39.239 --> 00:37:42.639 home. He didn't want to make the trip. So I was out there 527 00:37:42.679 --> 00:37:49.320 and Polish show Chupick and l De Russia we're directing. And this is in 528 00:37:49.719 --> 00:37:53.440 uh, I want to say, probably November October, November of eighty seven, 529 00:37:54.719 --> 00:37:59.239 and Verne comes to me before the before the show starts, and he 530 00:37:59.280 --> 00:38:02.800 said, now here the intermission, I want you to announce our big Christmas 531 00:38:02.840 --> 00:38:07.760 card coming up here back at the Showboat. He said, I want you 532 00:38:07.840 --> 00:38:10.599 to be real heavy on the fact that Sean Michaels and Marty Janetti are coming 533 00:38:10.599 --> 00:38:15.960 back to the Showboat and it's going to be a big holiday spectacular and get 534 00:38:15.960 --> 00:38:17.719 your tickets in boom boom boom ah. You know, I'm eager to do 535 00:38:17.760 --> 00:38:22.400 it I can do some pretty good pa and and so it comes intermission, 536 00:38:22.400 --> 00:38:25.480 and you know those tapings in Vegas were grueling anyway. Wait, you know, 537 00:38:25.559 --> 00:38:29.400 I don't know how many weeks of TV they tape, I think I 538 00:38:29.559 --> 00:38:35.039 believe for so you know, halfway through you're you're pretty well exhausted already. 539 00:38:35.119 --> 00:38:37.280 But it comes time for the intermission and they're going to do a tape change. 540 00:38:37.320 --> 00:38:40.639 And I'm sitting at the announced table and Rod tron Guard is right next 541 00:38:40.679 --> 00:38:44.840 to me, and then Verne is to the other side of him, and 542 00:38:44.880 --> 00:38:46.440 I said, ladies and gentlemen, you know we're going to take an intermission 543 00:38:46.440 --> 00:38:52.360 at this time, but I want to remind you the big Awa Holiday Spectacular 544 00:38:52.480 --> 00:38:55.440 coming back at the Showboat, you know, December twenty fourth or whatever it 545 00:38:55.559 --> 00:39:00.360 was. And in the process of making the announcement, I said, and 546 00:39:00.679 --> 00:39:07.960 also get ready for this, Sean Michaels and the crowd starts to pop Marty 547 00:39:07.039 --> 00:39:12.599 Jeannetti and now they're even louder the mid nine rockers Bull Bull in the place. 548 00:39:12.639 --> 00:39:15.440 He erupts. Well. I look over at Verne

and Verne is just 549 00:39:15.559 --> 00:39:20.639 ease as red as a stop sign. After that, I'm thinking, what 550 00:39:20.719 --> 00:39:23.920 did I do. It sounded pretty good to me. And Verne takes off 551 00:39:23.920 --> 00:39:30.239 his glasses, throws him on the announced table. His glasses roll off the 552 00:39:30.239 --> 00:39:32.199 announced table, fall out of the floor, The lens pops out of his 553 00:39:32.280 --> 00:39:38.760 glasses and I'm just a nervous wreck at this point. And Verne grabs me 554 00:39:38.920 --> 00:39:44.840 by the lapels. Seriously, we're sitting at ringside. Verne grabs me by 555 00:39:44.920 --> 00:39:49.320 the lapels and he says, you know what's guys like you that have cost 556 00:39:49.400 --> 00:39:53.159 me millions of dollars over the years. Guys like me single handedly. Wait, 557 00:39:53.320 --> 00:39:58.119 I cost bern gone you millions of dollars and I know rock fron Guard 558 00:39:58.159 --> 00:40:00.000 gets up and he walks away. Said Verne, what did I do? 559 00:40:00.039 --> 00:40:02.800 He says, well, first of all, you get into the the damn 560 00:40:02.880 --> 00:40:06.639 ring. When you're making an announcement. You don't do it from the table. 561 00:40:06.719 --> 00:40:08.880 You're the authority figure here. You make the announcement in the ring. 562 00:40:09.440 --> 00:40:15.199 He said. Secondly, why did you have to call them Sean Michaels and 563 00:40:15.239 --> 00:40:20.000 Marty Janelle? Why couldn't you just have said the midnight Rockers? And I'm 564 00:40:20.119 --> 00:40:22.559 flappergasted at this point, I think of what difference does it make you know 565 00:40:22.599 --> 00:40:29.519 the crowd, the crowd popped huge for the announcement, and vern sau you 566 00:40:29.599 --> 00:40:30.880 know, you do you keep up that kind of stuff, You're never going 567 00:40:30.960 --> 00:40:36.679 to work for me again. And the sad part is I had to go 568 00:40:36.760 --> 00:40:38.639 back into the ring and do about another hour and a quarter hour and a 569 00:40:38.719 --> 00:40:43.280 half after intermission, and I didn't want to do it. I mean, 570 00:40:43.280 --> 00:40:45.599 I went in and I put on the game face. But it was that 571 00:40:45.719 --> 00:40:53.679 kind of little insignificant clap that Verne was concerned about. Instead of seeing the 572 00:40:53.719 --> 00:40:59.400 big picture, instead of you know, looking looking down the road, a 573 00:40:59.440 --> 00:41:02.559 little book that the future of where his promotion was going, he was more 574 00:41:02.599 --> 00:41:07.519 concerned that I had called him Sean Michaels and Marty Janetti and why. And 575 00:41:07.679 --> 00:41:10.320 I got it back to Minneapolis and I called back Winkel. Of course I 576 00:41:10.440 --> 00:41:14.320 ran running to Nick and I said, and Nick was already gone. He 577 00:41:14.360 --> 00:41:17.239 had gone to work for WWF as an agent at the time. And Nick 578 00:41:17.280 --> 00:41:21.000 said, you know, tell Verne to shove the awa of his ass. 579 00:41:21.039 --> 00:41:22.159 You don't need it. Well I didn't need it, you know, it 580 00:41:22.239 --> 00:41:25.960 was a gig for me. And so I wrote vernal letter and I just 581 00:41:27.000 --> 00:41:29.159 said, hey, if you got something to say to me, Verne, 582 00:41:29.239 --> 00:41:31.599 please don't do it in public like that. That was embarrassing. You're the 583 00:41:31.639 --> 00:41:35.519 boss. I'll do whatever you say, but could we handle it a little 584 00:41:35.559 --> 00:41:40.119 more professionally. And Verne callback about two weeks later and he said that I 585 00:41:40.239 --> 00:41:45.599 do that. I don't even remember doing that or yelling at you. I 586 00:41:45.639 --> 00:41:49.960 apologize for that, but it was just it was a hillacious incident. And 587 00:41:50.519 --> 00:41:54.039 that was the other side of Verne Gunya, that that the people who were 588 00:41:54.079 --> 00:42:00.480 watching television didn't see. Give yourself a reason to look forward to go into 589 00:42:00.480 --> 00:42:06.840 the mailbox each week with a Pwtorch newsletter paper copy. Subscription details at pwtorch 590 00:42:06.880 --> 00:42:09.559 dot com slash paper Copy. It's twelve pages every week, packed with my 591 00:42:09.679 --> 00:42:14.400 TV reports, along with exclusive features such as my cover story on the top 592 00:42:14.440 --> 00:42:17.239 story of the week, our pay per view roundtable reviews from the Torch staff, 593 00:42:17.480 --> 00:42:22.719 exclusive feature length columns from Greg Parks, Rich Fan, Shan Radikin, 594 00:42:22.159 --> 00:42:27.639 Alan Coonahan and Zach Haydorn, Torch Talk transcripts, the latest news, and 595 00:42:27.880 --> 00:42:32.079 more. Pwtorch dot com slash paper Copy. Take a break from screen time 596 00:42:32.440 --> 00:42:37.400 and settle in every week with a megados of wrestling news and analysis with a 597 00:42:37.559 --> 00:42:42.400 Pro Wrestling Torch newsletter paper copy edition in the year twenty twenty two. You 598 00:42:42.400 --> 00:42:45.719 can get a full year of home delivery for just ninety nine dollars, or 599 00:42:46.079 --> 00:42:58.679 try us for an eight week trial subscription pwtorch dot com slash paper copy. 600 00:42:57.800 --> 00:43:00.320 What what what the problem with Michael and Marty Genetti? It's not like you 601 00:43:00.320 --> 00:43:05.719 called them Sean Ganettie and Marty Michaels. I have no idea. That's the 602 00:43:05.800 --> 00:43:08.800 strange thing about it, you know, I mean, I don't know. 603 00:43:08.880 --> 00:43:12.880 I mean, what did it take me an extra four seconds to say Michael's 604 00:43:12.880 --> 00:43:15.760 and Janetti instead of just saying the midnight rockers that That's the point I'm trying 605 00:43:15.760 --> 00:43:19.039 to make. It was this, like, what in the world are you 606 00:43:19.079 --> 00:43:22.840 bitching about? This is nothing, you know, we got over

what we 607 00:43:22.960 --> 00:43:27.159 wanted to get over. The crowd erupted. They're going to buy their tickets. 608 00:43:27.840 --> 00:43:30.599 I don't get I have no idea. I think it was just what 609 00:43:30.800 --> 00:43:34.280 Nick told me. He said, Verne isn't yelling at you, He's yelling 610 00:43:34.320 --> 00:43:37.519 at everybody. He said. He said, Actually Jack Lands and I meaning 611 00:43:37.599 --> 00:43:40.280 Nick and Lands, he says, are probably the two guys that Verne hasn't 612 00:43:40.320 --> 00:43:44.960 yelled at in the last year, so it was just kind of crumbling down 613 00:43:45.000 --> 00:43:47.559 on him, even back in nineteen eighty seven. And I just happened to 614 00:43:47.559 --> 00:43:51.360 be in the wrong place at the wrong time. Yeah, And I gotta 615 00:43:51.400 --> 00:43:53.840 taste of that shoot. I was shooting photos at ringside for the nw A 616 00:43:53.760 --> 00:43:58.280 a couple years later, and out of nowhere, Verne just came out of 617 00:43:58.280 --> 00:44:01.599 the locker room and after having passed me twenty seconds earlier, and just grabbed 618 00:44:01.599 --> 00:44:04.880 me by the arm. And I mean, my god, he was a 619 00:44:04.920 --> 00:44:08.599 strong guy. I'm you know, this been you know at that point, 620 00:44:08.639 --> 00:44:12.360 probably like nineteen, you know, nineteen year old kid. And he just 621 00:44:12.519 --> 00:44:15.039 yanks me by the arm and squeezes, I mean just squeeze his arm, 622 00:44:15.119 --> 00:44:19.360 yanks me, pulls me a sign and just threw this out of nowhere tantrum 623 00:44:19.440 --> 00:44:22.360 at what was I doing here? Who gave me press credentials? Blah blah 624 00:44:22.360 --> 00:44:24.480 blah, And I was like, I got credentials, I worked through your 625 00:44:24.480 --> 00:44:28.800 office, I've been here before, blah blah blah. And then he just 626 00:44:28.880 --> 00:44:30.559 kind of let go, and I can't remember. I don't know if I 627 00:44:30.639 --> 00:44:34.920 even remember what he said. If that, But like you, he probably 628 00:44:35.000 --> 00:44:37.519 didn't remember what, you know, the next day, what he had done. 629 00:44:37.519 --> 00:44:39.440 And that's that was kind of the weird part of it. So it 630 00:44:39.480 --> 00:44:43.000 had to be a little sad. I mean, I Eddie Sharky would always 631 00:44:43.000 --> 00:44:44.719 tell me about you know, Verne. He was a nice guy in the 632 00:44:44.760 --> 00:44:49.000 nineteen nineteen seventies and then and then I don't know what happened in late seventies 633 00:44:49.199 --> 00:44:52.360 he started changing. And have you ever been able to figure out the trigger 634 00:44:52.400 --> 00:44:58.480 point or that led to Verne changing or do you think he was always always 635 00:44:58.480 --> 00:45:00.440 had that in him. It just kind of got a little bit worth over 636 00:45:00.480 --> 00:45:04.400 time. Here's what I think happened, and what I hear from people is 637 00:45:04.400 --> 00:45:07.400 that when he produced the original and again this is all here say, I 638 00:45:07.440 --> 00:45:13.159 don't know when he produced the first movie, The Wrestler back in nineteen seventy 639 00:45:13.159 --> 00:45:15.880 three, seventy four, and it kind of flopped at the box office, 640 00:45:15.880 --> 00:45:20.280 and he had really put his heart and soul into it, and it was 641 00:45:20.360 --> 00:45:22.239 panned by the critics and so on and so forth. I mean, Verne 642 00:45:22.280 --> 00:45:25.960 was really stung by that. He didn't he didn't do very well with that 643 00:45:27.079 --> 00:45:32.840 at all. And then in the middle nineteen seventies. At the time WTCMTB 644 00:45:32.960 --> 00:45:38.960 that was carrying the AWA show here was owned by Chris Craft Television or Chrisscraft 645 00:45:39.039 --> 00:45:45.480 Corporation. They in turn sold to Metromedia. Metromedia, from what I understood, 646 00:45:45.559 --> 00:45:51.519 was they were not real high on wrestling, and when the sale was 647 00:45:51.639 --> 00:45:55.440 made, Verne was to have a meeting with the higher ups the exists with 648 00:45:55.639 --> 00:46:00.000 Metromedia Television, and for whatever reason, he blew him off. And the 649 00:46:00.119 --> 00:46:02.760 story goes, he had a tennis match, or he had a luncheon or 650 00:46:02.760 --> 00:46:07.400 something, but he did not meet with them, and in turn he got 651 00:46:07.400 --> 00:46:09.679 stuck with just a horrible time slot. And I forget what it was, 652 00:46:09.960 --> 00:46:14.880 but the AWA had been a staple on Saturday nights from six to seven thirty, 653 00:46:15.000 --> 00:46:19.039 which was just tremendous because you know, the show would end at seven 654 00:46:19.199 --> 00:46:22.199 thirty, and then I believe a lot of times they had eight thirty start 655 00:46:22.280 --> 00:46:24.920 times at the auditorium and boom boo boom they a hot shot an angle and 656 00:46:24.920 --> 00:46:29.360 people would get in their car and go right down to the matches. While 657 00:46:29.440 --> 00:46:34.960 when he got stuck in that lousy time slot, a tenants really started to 658 00:46:35.039 --> 00:46:37.320 drop. And then again This is probably I want to say, seventy four 659 00:46:37.559 --> 00:46:43.119 seventy five ish somewhere in there, and that's the prime period that I remember 660 00:46:43.159 --> 00:46:46.360 talking to Wally Cargo and Wally telling me what a tyrant Verne had become. 661 00:46:46.480 --> 00:46:50.639 So again it's all here say, but I just think a couple of things 662 00:46:50.679 --> 00:46:55.920 didn't go well and it was just additude change from there. But he had 663 00:46:55.960 --> 00:47:00.239 a reputation before that for being as nice as he came across in the be 664 00:47:00.280 --> 00:47:06.400 the wrestler. You know, even before that, I had heard that there 665 00:47:06.400 --> 00:47:12.280 were two sides, two sides to Verne from an out you know, from

666 00:47:12.440 --> 00:47:15.239 a public PERSONA couldn't find a nicer guy in the world. I mean that 667 00:47:15.280 --> 00:47:20.079 guy Verne smile, couldn't olp An Iceberg when he would come out on television. 668 00:47:20.119 --> 00:47:22.519 I mean, he really was. He was such a such an icon 669 00:47:22.840 --> 00:47:28.079 and such a treasure to the state of Minnesota. But I had heard, 670 00:47:28.440 --> 00:47:31.400 and again because I wasn't directly involved with the promotion at the time, so 671 00:47:31.440 --> 00:47:35.519 I didn't see it firsthand, but I had heard from people. Boy, 672 00:47:35.559 --> 00:47:37.480 when Verne gets a hair up his ass, you really don't want to be 673 00:47:37.519 --> 00:47:40.239 around, and he was getting more and more. You know, just a 674 00:47:40.360 --> 00:47:44.559 little ass things would set them off, so there were definitely two different Verne 675 00:47:44.559 --> 00:47:46.440 gun is a lot of that I heard from Wally Carbo. Did you know 676 00:47:46.519 --> 00:47:52.039 he and Verne were button heads for a long long time and it was really 677 00:47:52.079 --> 00:47:55.320 taken a toll on Wally, which is a whole story in itself. Yeah, 678 00:47:55.360 --> 00:47:58.800 well make god. Let's take a couple of phone calls. I got 679 00:47:58.800 --> 00:48:00.480 a couple of people on a hold. Not sure what they want to talk 680 00:48:00.480 --> 00:48:01.880 about, but we'll find out. If you're just joining us, I am 681 00:48:01.880 --> 00:48:07.599 Wade Keller and this is Interview Friday at PW torchlivecast dot com. And my 682 00:48:07.679 --> 00:48:10.840 guest is Mick Carsh returning to the show first time in well over a year. 683 00:48:10.880 --> 00:48:13.599 I think, Mick, since you were on with Bruce and me for 684 00:48:13.960 --> 00:48:15.519 a marathon show. So it's great to heavy on. I love these stories. 685 00:48:15.960 --> 00:48:19.599 Um, we got a lot more subjects to cover, but if you 686 00:48:19.639 --> 00:48:22.039 do want to call us here at the show live, the number is six 687 00:48:22.159 --> 00:48:25.880 four six seven two one nine two eight six four six seven two one nine 688 00:48:27.079 --> 00:48:30.760 two eight. Let's go to our first call and go to Erico two four 689 00:48:30.920 --> 00:48:32.280 zero two four. Oh thanks for holding. Please state your name and where 690 00:48:32.320 --> 00:48:37.519 you're from. This is Ryan camber One. Hey, Ryan, what have 691 00:48:37.519 --> 00:48:40.880 you got from question? I got a question about the A w A Yeah, 692 00:48:40.920 --> 00:48:43.880 And I was a little kid. I just always wondered, like how 693 00:48:43.960 --> 00:48:47.159 much they made per year, like say like a Sean Michael's Martin Genetti compared 694 00:48:47.199 --> 00:48:55.199 to like someone like Dennis stamp So in that in the mid eighties, in 695 00:48:55.199 --> 00:49:00.000 mid to late eighties, Ryan, you're wondering about what wrestlers made an income. 696

00:49:00.119 --> 00:49:05.360 Yeah, when he worked there, coming Oh sure, okay, yeah, 697 00:49:05.480 --> 00:49:07.440 make I'm sure all the rest was walking up to you telling them what 698 00:49:07.440 --> 00:49:14.880 what they made. Well, you know, it's it's interesting, first of 699 00:49:14.880 --> 00:49:16.639 all, I mean in terms of what the guys made. I used to 700 00:49:16.679 --> 00:49:21.440 hear more in the seventies what the guys were making them than in the eighties 701 00:49:21.440 --> 00:49:24.039 when it really started to boom. So I'm sure they did considerably better in 702 00:49:24.079 --> 00:49:27.559 the early eighties. But I remember, you know, we could start off 703 00:49:27.559 --> 00:49:30.519 with the enhancement talent. There were guys that would come in from Chicago and 704 00:49:30.599 --> 00:49:34.639 they would you know, work you know, two TV matches or three or 705 00:49:34.639 --> 00:49:37.760 whatever, and then you know, driving from Chicago, drive back to Chicago, 706 00:49:37.760 --> 00:49:40.679 whether you're talking about your angel Raveras or Nacho Berreras or you know, 707 00:49:40.760 --> 00:49:45.440 guys like that, and they I believe they were making about one hundred bucks 708 00:49:45.440 --> 00:49:47.840 for the night. So it's one hundred bucks and then you come in and 709 00:49:47.880 --> 00:49:50.960 you turn it right around and go home. But you're you know, you're 710 00:49:50.960 --> 00:49:54.719 a national TV star. The stars, the AWA stars were only getting like 711 00:49:54.760 --> 00:49:59.039 twenty twenty five bucks for TV because of course they're going to make their money 712 00:49:59.199 --> 00:50:06.599 at the house show. In terms of what the top tier guys made, 713 00:50:06.119 --> 00:50:10.719 I believe Jim Bronzel had stated that his best year in the ai WA was 714 00:50:10.800 --> 00:50:15.840 somewhere between eighty and one hundred grand, you know, and if this is 715 00:50:15.880 --> 00:50:20.400 back in the day when he and Greg are working the program with a Donnison 716 00:50:20.519 --> 00:50:24.960 Ventura, I believe Backwinkle was probably in and around one hundred and fifty two 717 00:50:25.039 --> 00:50:30.320 hundred grand range, which at the time was was really really decent. As 718 00:50:30.320 --> 00:50:32.000 far as the mid car guys, you know, like the Dennis Stamps of 719 00:50:32.079 --> 00:50:36.920 the world, I really couldn't tell you, but I know part of the 720 00:50:36.920 --> 00:50:39.760 appeal for the ai WA or to the AWA, and Nick has said this 721 00:50:39.880 --> 00:50:44.639 before, is you didn't you know, you might have made more money working 722 00:50:44.679 --> 00:50:49.320 for an NWA or a WWF, but you didn't have the extensive travel, 723 00:50:49.840 --> 00:50:52.480 so in the scheme of things, you were getting pretty decent money. You 724 00:50:52.559 --> 00:50:55.719 only had to work two days a week instead of five six days a week, 725 00:50:57.000 --> 00:51:04.519 so it was a very very nice situation. Are you a nostalgic wrestling 726 00:51:04.599 --> 00:51:07.440 fan? Do you want to hear about shows you haven't seen in ten, 727 00:51:07.559 --> 00:51:09.639 twenty, maybe even thirty years? While I have the show for you, 728 00:51:10.079 --> 00:51:15.519 impwtorch dot com contributor Frank Pettianni and since December of twenty twenty, I've hosted 729 00:51:15.559 --> 00:51:20.800 Pro Wrestling Then and Now together with a rotating chair of co hosts. We 730 00:51:20.920 --> 00:51:23.440 go back and review old shows from top to bottom, talk about where the 731 00:51:23.480 --> 00:51:28.519 wrestlers were at the time, and compare what's taking place now to what took 732 00:51:28.519 --> 00:51:31.239 place. Then you can hear this along with other shows as part of your 733 00:51:31.280 --> 00:51:38.079 Pwtorch VIP membership with exclusive podcasts just for members compatible with the Apple Podcasts app. 734 00:51:38.199 --> 00:51:52.239 Visit pwtorch dot com slash go vip for details and sign up form. 735 00:51:52.280 --> 00:51:54.159 Absolutely, I mean, that's that's a nice dolor level because it really was. 736 00:51:55.000 --> 00:52:01.360 When Scott only Kevin Nash left WWF w W and kind of were ignited 737 00:52:01.719 --> 00:52:07.280 the Monday Night War to a new level. They left because they were making 738 00:52:07.480 --> 00:52:10.519 well under seven hundred fifty thousand dollars a year, because that's they jumped for. 739 00:52:12.039 --> 00:52:16.199 That was guaranteed money seven fifty apiece, and that was so much more 740 00:52:16.280 --> 00:52:19.679 than they were making. I mean, I think it's safe to say they 741 00:52:19.719 --> 00:52:22.719 were in the two fifty to four hundred range in the WWF, and they 742 00:52:22.719 --> 00:52:25.760 didn't know And Kevin Nash talked about this with Steve Austin. He didn't know 743 00:52:25.800 --> 00:52:28.960 if he would even be on the rustument A card, or what spot he 744 00:52:28.960 --> 00:52:31.639 would be in, or what his paycheck would be until a couple months before 745 00:52:31.719 --> 00:52:36.119 when Vince got around to telling people what he had decided on. And so 746 00:52:36.239 --> 00:52:37.400 you know, Kevin, you know, went to Vince and just said, 747 00:52:37.880 --> 00:52:42.800 I have this offer. If you can match it, great, And Vince 748 00:52:42.800 --> 00:52:44.719 said, if I matched it for you, I'd have a bunch of other 749 00:52:44.760 --> 00:52:46.280 guys I had to match it for and I'd be out of business. And 750 00:52:46.440 --> 00:52:51.079 so, you know it, when you talk about Nick making you know maybe 751 00:52:51.079 --> 00:52:55.159 two hundred thousand. That's in the early eighties and fourteen years later in the 752 00:52:55.239 --> 00:53:00.760 WWF, an X world. You know, Kevin Nash, a champion at 753 00:53:00.760 --> 00:53:02.159 the top of the card, was making under five hundred. You know, 754

00:53:02.280 --> 00:53:06.599 so sure that that is that I mean today and today's money. I mean 755 00:53:06.599 --> 00:53:09.199 remember I remember in Kirby Puckett got the first million dollar contract of him Minnesota 756 00:53:09.239 --> 00:53:12.440 twin and that was a huge deal and he was as good as it got 757 00:53:12.519 --> 00:53:15.920 in baseball. And now it's like, you know, if you're at the 758 00:53:15.960 --> 00:53:19.320 bottom of the bullpen, you know you're you're you're possibly making a million. 759 00:53:19.400 --> 00:53:22.800 So things have gotten just crazy bigger to where I don't think there's even perspective 760 00:53:22.800 --> 00:53:25.960 on what a good living that was back in the early eighties. Well, 761 00:53:27.000 --> 00:53:29.360 and then two with you when you think about it, you know, the 762 00:53:29.599 --> 00:53:34.920 with the guaranteed contracts and you know when WCW and WWF are going head they 763 00:53:34.920 --> 00:53:36.920 head. I mean they had a lot of guys, you know Tom Zinc 764 00:53:36.960 --> 00:53:39.239 for example. You know they'd hire him just to hire him, and he 765 00:53:39.280 --> 00:53:43.440 would sit there and you know he'd still collect one hundred and fifty hundred and 766 00:53:43.440 --> 00:53:46.280 seventy five thousand dollars a year. I can't imagine ever, you know, 767 00:53:46.440 --> 00:53:51.400 Verne letting you guys sit home, you know, and collect that kind of 768 00:53:51.440 --> 00:53:53.719 money. So yeah, I mean totally different era as, totally different worlds. 769 00:53:54.480 --> 00:53:59.159 Ryan, Do you have any follow up on your question? That's one 770 00:53:59.199 --> 00:54:02.159 more question. Was your favorite wrestler to call matches for when you have been 771 00:54:02.239 --> 00:54:07.599 the announcing eg for the AWA? Oh man? Um? When I was 772 00:54:07.639 --> 00:54:10.800 at the AWE. Well, here's the thing. I mean I was, 773 00:54:10.880 --> 00:54:15.880 and this is interesting too. I was primarily a ring announcer for the AWA, 774 00:54:15.480 --> 00:54:19.599 and I actually asked Verne on a couple of occasions. I said, 775 00:54:19.599 --> 00:54:22.880 you know, Verne, I like doing the ring announcing, but really I'd 776 00:54:22.000 --> 00:54:27.280 love to have an opportunity to sit alongside Rod run Guard and call matches because 777 00:54:27.320 --> 00:54:30.400 that's really what I wanted to do. That's that's my love of the business. 778 00:54:30.679 --> 00:54:32.320 And Verne would always say, well, what makes you more qualified than 779 00:54:32.320 --> 00:54:37.360 Wahu, Mcdaleniel or Ray Stevens to call to call a match at ringside? 780 00:54:37.400 --> 00:54:40.840 Well, you know, I guess because I think I can call one better 781 00:54:42.119 --> 00:54:45.639 than they can. But um, I back then, I would have to 782 00:54:45.679 --> 00:54:50.639 say it. It was Kurt Hennick. Just there was something about you know, 783 00:54:50.760 --> 00:54:52.760 Kurt being the you know, the the heel a w A champion at 784 00:54:52.760 --> 00:54:57.440 the time, and you know, Paulie was back there. I forgot to 785 00:54:57.679 --> 00:55:00.920 you know, the Midnight Express. You know, Dennis comp and Randy Rolls 786 00:55:00.920 --> 00:55:06.760 were there. So, um, the matches that involved paul E and uh 787 00:55:06.920 --> 00:55:09.119 and Kurt Hanning, I think we're probably my favorites at the time. I 788 00:55:09.159 --> 00:55:15.519 didn't call a lot of matches, probably a handful where Verne would would say 789 00:55:15.800 --> 00:55:17.360 or you know, the producer would say to me, Verne wants you to 790 00:55:17.360 --> 00:55:22.599 sit in on this one. So uh yeah. But but Kurt, Kurt 791 00:55:22.679 --> 00:55:27.960 and uh Adonnas Tommy Rich was fun to call matches and Noah who It was 792 00:55:28.000 --> 00:55:30.559 a good time the few times that I did it. I will know too 793 00:55:30.599 --> 00:55:36.239 that pw torg VAFP members get to hear mccarsh on my radio show on KFE 794 00:55:36.320 --> 00:55:39.199 and twenty years ago, make you on my show a number of times, 795 00:55:39.199 --> 00:55:45.920 including a really special show where we were in studio with eld Russia and Roger 796 00:55:46.039 --> 00:55:51.760 Kent and Nick Backwinkle. Oh yeah, you and I've still got pictures. 797 00:55:51.880 --> 00:55:54.719 A friend of mine from college who's gone on to be a professional photographer, 798 00:55:54.960 --> 00:55:59.199 um was there and shot just really cool black and white pictures of us in 799 00:55:59.239 --> 00:56:02.119 studio and anyway that that was a really fun show, and so Mick, 800 00:56:02.400 --> 00:56:07.840 if people enjoy your perspective on things and awa discussion is kind of fun to 801 00:56:07.840 --> 00:56:09.639 go in the time machine as a VIP member because every week I put up 802 00:56:09.679 --> 00:56:14.519 a show from twenty years ago that week on the anniversary weekend of the show 803 00:56:14.559 --> 00:56:19.039 airing, so you can hear more Mick Carsh also encourage anybody listening to check 804 00:56:19.079 --> 00:56:21.760 out Mick the last time he was on the show. All of our interviews 805 00:56:21.800 --> 00:56:27.199 are available for free at PW Torch livecast dot com. Most of the interviews 806 00:56:27.239 --> 00:56:30.519 have a VIP after show that is just for VP members and that's part of 807 00:56:30.519 --> 00:56:32.840 the VIP website, which I'll talk about later. But you can listen to 808 00:56:34.000 --> 00:56:37.199 all of our shows going back since we started this interview Friday format on the 809 00:56:37.199 --> 00:56:42.400 PW Torch Livecast over year and a half ago, and we've had a lot 810 00:56:42.400 --> 00:56:45.719 of fun guests on a Hardcore Holly a couple of weeks ago, Diamond Dallas 811 00:56:45.719 --> 00:56:50.280 Page last week, Mickey James, TNA Knockout Champion a couple of weeks ago. 812 00:56:50.320 -->

00:56:53.519 Also it's Scott Hall, Paul Bear, Jake Roberts. It's been a 813 00:56:54.039 --> 00:56:58.960 fun stretch of months and really a fun couple of years of big name interviews 814 00:56:59.039 --> 00:57:04.199 and really I just think, uh, the listeners, Uh all, it's 815 00:57:04.199 --> 00:57:07.440 so often, Mick. It's it's so fun hearing different listeners react to different 816 00:57:07.440 --> 00:57:10.199 interviews. It's it's a real gratifying um, having such a wide variety of 817 00:57:10.199 --> 00:57:13.320 perspectives on and to be able to do this. I think back to the 818 00:57:13.639 --> 00:57:15.239 to the radio show days and how what a great privilege it was to do 819 00:57:15.280 --> 00:57:21.239 a show on radio. But now, um, podcasting has become so popular. 820 00:57:21.239 --> 00:57:23.480 I was joking, Mick when we lost you on the phone connection earlier 821 00:57:23.679 --> 00:57:27.599 that you know, Steve Austin arguably the biggest star in the history of the 822 00:57:27.599 --> 00:57:30.400 industry. Um, certainly in the discussion, and you know, he's he 823 00:57:30.480 --> 00:57:34.719 finally he thought he had reached the pinnacle when he was, you know, 824 00:57:34.760 --> 00:57:37.599 selling out buildings and earning eight million dollars here in the wweight. But finally 825 00:57:37.639 --> 00:57:42.360 in twenty thirteen, he has reached what he has always aspired to be, 826 00:57:42.760 --> 00:57:45.480 which is what I do and what you do, which is podcasting. He 827 00:57:45.599 --> 00:57:50.719 is finally finally become a podcaster, right, Mick, Well, you know 828 00:57:50.719 --> 00:57:53.159 also think, yeah, finally he's reached our level. H It took him 829 00:57:53.199 --> 00:57:57.320 long enough, but you know he's you know, he's in good company. 830 00:57:57.559 --> 00:58:00.199 It think where the real money is. I mean, we know that's right. 831 00:58:00.440 --> 00:58:02.559 Oh you're done right, you've give I mean this is every bit as 832 00:58:02.559 --> 00:58:08.280 good as those payoffs from Sharky at Ropers. Every good is good. On 833 00:58:08.480 --> 00:58:13.719 the podcasting note, people should or you should tell the listeners how they can 834 00:58:13.800 --> 00:58:19.239 hear your podcast because you host podcast, talk about what you talk about and 835 00:58:19.320 --> 00:58:22.519 why people might want to listen and how they can find it. What we 836 00:58:22.559 --> 00:58:25.519 are. I'm heavily involved with Steel Domain Wrestling, and I know that you're 837 00:58:25.639 --> 00:58:30.159 very familiar with Ed Wade and a lot of these Field Domain alumni have gone 838 00:58:30.199 --> 00:58:32.880 on to great things in wrestling, Adam Pierce, Cold Cabanas, CM Punk 839 00:58:34.400 --> 00:58:38.119 and every week at steel Domain Wrestling dot com, if folks go to that 840 00:58:38.239 --> 00:58:44.039 site and click on steel Radio, myself and the promoter Ed Heilier and our 841 00:58:44.320

--> 00:58:49.320 host Pete Wagner talk about not only upcoming events with Steel Domain Wrestling here in 842 00:58:49.320 --> 00:58:52.440 the Twin Cities, but we also will talk about some of the stuff on 843 00:58:52.440 --> 00:58:58.960 the national scene. We will get guests in periodically not only involved being involved 844 00:58:58.960 --> 00:59:02.159 in the local wrestling, but also national I mentioned to you before we went 845 00:59:02.199 --> 00:59:07.119 on the air today that just earlier today we had the Golden idol On, 846 00:59:07.280 --> 00:59:12.480 who was a tremendous manager back in the PWA days here in the two ent 847 00:59:12.519 --> 00:59:15.480 Cities in the late eighties and into the early nineties. A couple of weeks 848 00:59:15.480 --> 00:59:22.400 back, we had Princess Victoria, a great lady wrestler from w w das 849 00:59:22.360 --> 00:59:28.320 John Horton who was Craig Johnson and the old Global Wrestling Federation was a guest. 850 00:59:28.360 --> 00:59:30.760 So we have fun with it. It's very laid back and I encourage 851 00:59:30.760 --> 00:59:36.599 people again Steel Domain Wrestling dot Com and click on Steel Radio and you can 852 00:59:36.679 --> 00:59:40.159 do what we have to say. Very very cool. Other news on your 853 00:59:40.199 --> 00:59:44.679 front, Uh, we haven't talked a lot about Saturday at at Ringside so 854 00:59:44.719 --> 00:59:47.440 far in today's show, but you were host of Saturday Night at a Ringside. 855 00:59:47.480 --> 00:59:51.079 What was this? What was the period of time years the years that 856 00:59:51.119 --> 00:59:54.559 you were on it was it was almost four years exactly. We started in 857 00:59:54.639 --> 01:00:00.159 March of nineteen eighty eight and we were we were on ceremony obviously canceled in 858 01:00:00.280 --> 01:00:06.559 March of nineteen ninety two, and I believe we did two hundred shows even 859 01:00:07.360 --> 01:00:12.320 didn't miss too many Saturday nights in that time frame and just a great, 860 01:00:12.320 --> 01:00:15.119 great time. And just recently, through the magic of Facebook, I managed 861 01:00:15.119 --> 01:00:20.480 to hook up with gayal named Mary O'Neill who was the one of the producers 862 01:00:20.480 --> 01:00:23.599 and directors of Saturday Night at Ringside and actually hired me back in the day, 863 01:00:24.320 --> 01:00:28.800 so, you know, reliving some of the memories with her from from 864 01:00:28.800 --> 01:00:31.079 back in the day. But it was it was a great run SNR. 865 01:00:31.199 --> 01:00:34.760 And I've said this many many times. Of all the things that I have 866 01:00:34.840 --> 01:00:39.079 done in wrestling or been involved with, SNR is far and away my favorite, 867 01:00:39.199 --> 01:00:44.159 and it's gratifying, you know, to this day. So many people, 868 01:00:44.360 --> 01:00:49.320 especially in the Twin Cities here, remember the SNR days, and we'll 869 01:00:49.320 --> 01:00:52.320 talk about how they would sit around on Saturday nights and watch that wrestling block 870 01:00:52.360 --> 01:00:57.280 and they remember the t JO cons and she got on our cases and the 871 01:00:57.320 --> 01:01:01.679 people that we had on So it's with them what's at the Ringsiders of the 872 01:01:01.719 --> 01:01:07.400 week, Ringsiders of the Week including uh, you know, guys like Wade 873 01:01:07.519 --> 01:01:12.039 Keller and uh, you know, and people like that, and naturally Jeremy 874 01:01:12.119 --> 01:01:17.519 Borash was a Ringsider of the Week back in the day. Odb actually was 875 01:01:17.559 --> 01:01:22.559 a Ringsider of the Week when she was nine or ten years old, so 876 01:01:22.360 --> 01:01:27.039 yes, yes, yes, she was on there, and uh so, 877 01:01:27.519 --> 01:01:30.320 yeah, we launched the careers of a lot of people who have got on 878 01:01:30.440 --> 01:01:34.679 to fame and fortune in the world. And we did everything. I mean, 879 01:01:34.719 --> 01:01:37.840 you know, it was groundbreaking. We had trivia every week and we 880 01:01:37.840 --> 01:01:43.400 would run old video clips and kind of irreverent look at wrestling, and we 881 01:01:43.400 --> 01:01:45.480 would kind of do our own thing to our own angles in the studio and 882 01:01:45.760 --> 01:01:51.400 it was it was so much fun. I really miss it. You can 883 01:01:51.440 --> 01:01:54.440 support us on Patreon and get these shows with ads and plugs removed, the 884 01:01:54.440 --> 01:01:59.480 Waight Keller Prosing Podcast, Wait Killer Prosing post shows and the PW Torch Daily 885 01:01:59.519 --> 01:02:02.559 Caster out the week with ads and plugs removed, plus a few bonus vi 886 01:02:02.719 --> 01:02:07.760 IP shows throughout the month for just four dollars and ninety nine cents a month. 887 01:02:07.880 --> 01:02:13.639 Check it out patreon dot com slash PW Torch vi ip that's patreon dot 888 01:02:13.679 --> 01:02:16.880 com slash PW Torch vip and you can also upgrade two other tiers and receive 889 01:02:17.039 --> 01:02:25.199 even more benefits through Patreon. Let me briefly frame it because it was a 890 01:02:25.199 --> 01:02:30.519 block of wrestling shows on Saturday Night, thus called Saturday Night at Ringside, 891 01:02:30.840 --> 01:02:34.760 and it was a block of syndicated wrestling shows. They were in multiple hours, 892 01:02:35.119 --> 01:02:37.000 and you would introduce at the beginning of the night and then in the 893 01:02:37.000 --> 01:02:40.400 middle of each show in place of a commercial, essentially you would do a 894 01:02:40.440 --> 01:02:45.320 segment that was localized or your like you said, run a nostalgia clip, 895 01:02:45.320 --> 01:02:46.960 put it in perspective, have a ringstart of the week, promote a local 896 01:02:47.000 --> 01:02:50.760 indie show. You would run contests, that kind of thing, and you 897 01:02:50.760 --> 01:02:57.079 would weave it throughout the show to localize these nationally syndicated shows, which was 898

01:02:57.159 --> 01:03:00.639 you know, Jerry Lawler's USWA I think was on there, the icated shows 899 01:03:00.679 --> 01:03:05.320 for the NWA or WCW We're on there, the USWA, which was former 900 01:03:05.320 --> 01:03:07.880 World Class Champiship Wrestling on and on. I mean, it was it was 901 01:03:07.920 --> 01:03:12.800 a really really cool time to be a wrestling fan and have access to so 902 01:03:12.880 --> 01:03:15.840 much first run television, and this is before YouTube, before the Internet, 903 01:03:16.000 --> 01:03:21.519 and you know, it was your only chance to see some of this wrestling 904 01:03:21.519 --> 01:03:23.000 and it was just such a treat. After a lot of the fans who 905 01:03:23.039 --> 01:03:28.760 watched that show read about these territories in the national magazines for ten, fifteen, 906 01:03:28.800 --> 01:03:30.480 twenty years, but finally had a chance to see a real, real 907 01:03:30.519 --> 01:03:35.760 wide variety of top stars. And so we were very fortunate, very very 908 01:03:35.800 --> 01:03:38.079 fortunate. And as you said, at one point, wait, I believe 909 01:03:38.159 --> 01:03:42.119 we had a five hour block or a four and a half or five hours 910 01:03:42.519 --> 01:03:45.159 when we actually went off the air. Towards the end, I think we 911 01:03:45.159 --> 01:03:51.280 were down to two and a half. A half hour was actually comprised of 912 01:03:51.360 --> 01:03:53.159 the segments that I did. When I was first hired, it was strictly 913 01:03:53.199 --> 01:03:57.719 to do wraparounds, you know, to go in and introduce one show and 914 01:03:57.760 --> 01:04:00.480 then wrap it up and then introduced the next show, you know, over 915 01:04:00.559 --> 01:04:03.639 that that four or five hours, and then I went to the producer. 916 01:04:03.679 --> 01:04:06.400 I went to Mary O'Neil, and I saw an opportunity that you know, 917 01:04:06.519 --> 01:04:10.199 nobody else was doing anywhere in the country. And I said, let's involve 918 01:04:10.280 --> 01:04:13.400 people, you know, we can kind of do what we want here. 919 01:04:13.559 --> 01:04:15.760 And I went in and I said, how about if we have a fan 920 01:04:15.800 --> 01:04:16.840 of the week come in ringside of the Week. She said, yeah, 921 01:04:17.039 --> 01:04:19.800 sure, go ahead, and then we would you know. From there, 922 01:04:19.840 --> 01:04:23.559 I said, well, how about a trivia contest? How about if we 923 01:04:23.840 --> 01:04:29.199 run an old video vault, so something you know from another territory. Let's 924 01:04:29.199 --> 01:04:33.000 do a five minute news segments. So what initially started out as just doing 925 01:04:33.039 --> 01:04:38.559 the wraparounds actually became thirty minutes of airtime for me and as used to the 926 01:04:38.599 --> 01:04:44.599 localized segments, heavily putting over the local schools, particularly Eddie Sharkey's p WA, 927 01:04:44.679 --> 01:04:47.519 which kind of got to be the staple after Verne was was panking a 928 01:04:47.559 --> 01:04:54.239 little bit there. But to have the creativity and have the flexibility to kind 929 01:04:54.239 --> 01:04:58.920 of do what I wanted back then was just terrific and opened up a lot 930 01:04:58.920 --> 01:05:02.599 of doors and we had a lot of fun in the studio and again groundbreaking. 931 01:05:02.639 --> 01:05:05.599 I don't know if anybody that was doing it anywhere else. And I 932 01:05:05.679 --> 01:05:09.800 got to thank Joe Petesino. Actually, Paul E Dangerously is the one who 933 01:05:09.880 --> 01:05:13.519 told me, Hey, they're they're doing this in mini in the Atlanta right 934 01:05:13.559 --> 01:05:15.760 now, they're doing a wrestling block. Why don't you call Joe Petesino. 935 01:05:16.079 --> 01:05:19.559 Maybe he can get you set up with a tryout and the rest is history. 936 01:05:20.119 --> 01:05:23.400 Wow, that's right. Progressing this week. A big part of the 937 01:05:23.760 --> 01:05:27.320 Yes, A big part of that experience. Again, that's another thing look 938 01:05:27.360 --> 01:05:30.519 up on YouTube or research it for fans who weren't around at that time. 939 01:05:30.559 --> 01:05:32.760 But Proson this week, what a what a just I look back at that 940 01:05:32.840 --> 01:05:35.519 concept and the fact that it was able to last as long as it did 941 01:05:35.519 --> 01:05:41.679 and make it Gordon solely, Joe Petesino an hour of airing clips from around 942 01:05:41.719 --> 01:05:45.159 the country of different wrestling shows that they had rights to tare clips on Paul 943 01:05:45.239 --> 01:05:47.559 Hayman. You know, we talked about where did Paul Hayman first really shine? 944 01:05:47.599 --> 01:05:50.800 And people talk about Memphis, people talk about the eight wa He did 945 01:05:50.800 --> 01:05:55.559 it. He did some really interesting work in studio for progressing this week. 946 01:05:55.599 --> 01:06:00.519 Also, he certainly did. He and Petesino had kind of that Joe was 947 01:06:00.559 --> 01:06:04.480 kind of the good guy and you know, Paul was the adversary and certainly, 948 01:06:04.519 --> 01:06:09.360 and it's interesting that you said back in the day, back in nineteen 949 01:06:09.440 --> 01:06:14.719 eighty eight, to have kind of free reign and carry all these different shows 950 01:06:14.719 --> 01:06:18.440 and clips from all the different promotions was pretty amazing. I'm considering, you 951 01:06:18.440 --> 01:06:23.000 know, all the other promotions were so territorial, and here you had an 952 01:06:23.000 --> 01:06:26.079 hour program that really brought you, at least for a couple of minutes at 953 01:06:26.079 --> 01:06:30.960 to so many different territories around the country. Absolutely, Now what's around the 954 01:06:30.960 --> 01:06:38.280 corner because it's essentially returning in a certain format now, well, yes, 955 01:06:39.360 --> 01:06:44.400 and what's on the horizon we really don't know. But interestingly enough, I

956 01:06:44.440 --> 01:06:47.599 got a call, oh maybe a couple of months back. I actually longer 957 01:06:47.639 --> 01:06:50.519 ago than that. You know, I'm notorious for not returning phone calls, 958 01:06:50.559 --> 01:06:56.119 and you know, sad to say, sometimes it's really cost me or delayed 959 01:06:56.159 --> 01:06:59.079 something that might have happened. But a fellow by the name of Tom Burke, 960 01:06:59.119 --> 01:07:02.239 who works at the Seat of Twin Cities CW twenty three, called up. 961 01:07:02.239 --> 01:07:05.800 And Tom was coming into the station. He was actually getting hired in 962 01:07:05.840 --> 01:07:10.360 a sales capacity just as S and R was going off the air. And 963 01:07:10.440 --> 01:07:14.800 you called up in the Tom Burke of Global Wrestling News newsletter. No different 964 01:07:14.800 --> 01:07:18.000 guy, Wrestling Fan International, I think is what it was. Yeah, 965 01:07:18.119 --> 01:07:21.920 yeah, that that Tom Burke is a gem. But that's where they both 966 01:07:21.920 --> 01:07:26.519 are. They both are. But Tom called me up in the end he 967 01:07:26.599 --> 01:07:31.800 said, would you be interested in doing something around Ring of Honor, which 968 01:07:31.840 --> 01:07:36.360 is carried by the CW Twin Cities on Saturday nights at nine o'clock and basically 969 01:07:36.440 --> 01:07:41.440 what they're looking at right now. And again, the plan is to make 970 01:07:41.559 --> 01:07:45.440 enough of an impact enough of the market the station will say, hey, 971 01:07:45.440 --> 01:07:48.159 you know what people are watching, let's expand this a little bit. What 972 01:07:48.199 --> 01:07:54.280 they want to do is have me do literally wrapperunds again a minute before and 973 01:07:54.400 --> 01:07:58.239 a minute after the Ring of Honor show. I'm gonna come on and I'm 974 01:07:58.239 --> 01:08:01.079 gonna do as much as I can with that limited tipe frame. Some of 975 01:08:01.079 --> 01:08:04.800 the old s and our segments. If there's a Steel Romain show coming up, 976 01:08:04.800 --> 01:08:08.400 a local STW show, you know, we'll do a hard sell. 977 01:08:08.480 --> 01:08:12.360 If we've got a wrestler we can get into studio, or who wants to 978 01:08:12.360 --> 01:08:15.400 send in a promo. If we can do a quick fan of the week 979 01:08:15.440 --> 01:08:18.520 segment, maybe it's a trivia whatever it is. We're going to start slowly. 980 01:08:18.560 --> 01:08:21.359 We're going to take baby steps in getting this back on the air. 981 01:08:23.119 --> 01:08:27.720 And so many times people have said to me, again, would you do 982 01:08:27.760 --> 01:08:30.359 this? Would you want to come back and do an SNR type thing? 983 01:08:30.119 --> 01:08:33.840 Well, you know what, again, I'm real skeptical, or have been 984 01:08:33.920 --> 01:08:38.960 real skeptical because things have changed, the Internet has changed. But I think 985 01:08:39.000 --> 01:08:43.760 we can have a lot of fun with this back on Saturday Night Boomed the 986 01:08:43.800 --> 01:08:45.119 old station. I went down there a couple of weeks ago, and I 987 01:08:45.159 --> 01:08:49.600 went right back downstairs into the studio where we did so many of those angles, 988 01:08:49.600 --> 01:08:55.119 and I literally got chills. Weight on. I'm not being nonsensical here. 989 01:08:55.319 --> 01:08:58.039 I went down there and I looked around, and I thought about everything 990 01:08:58.039 --> 01:09:00.399 that we had done in that two hundred episode. So it's back to the 991 01:09:00.439 --> 01:09:05.319 old channel twenty three, same location, Saturday nights once again. We've got 992 01:09:05.319 --> 01:09:11.159 a target date to start sometime in July. Although we got it. You 993 01:09:11.159 --> 01:09:14.840 know, we've got a few little strings we got to tie up first before 994 01:09:14.840 --> 01:09:17.000 we get back on the air. But we're gonna try it. And if 995 01:09:17.039 --> 01:09:20.439 the viewership is good and response is good and people say, hey, we 996 01:09:20.479 --> 01:09:25.199 want more of this, uh, we're gonna go from there. Very cool, 997 01:09:25.840 --> 01:09:28.680 Mick. Let's go to one more phone call, and then I want 998 01:09:28.720 --> 01:09:31.199 to talk about your near myth. I don't know, I don't know how 999 01:09:31.239 --> 01:09:35.600 to exactly categorize it. With the WWFUL, people might be wondering, why 1000 01:09:35.600 --> 01:09:39.479 did you know did make ever try to get a job at the WWF after 1001 01:09:39.560 --> 01:09:42.760 or before the AWA. So you've got a story there and it's a fascinating 1002 01:09:42.800 --> 01:09:45.960 story. So let's go to that after this caller Eric code six one six, 1003 01:09:45.039 --> 01:09:49.000 you're up next. Please state your name and where you're from. This 1004 01:09:49.119 --> 01:09:53.680 is Eric and Grand Rapids. Hey Eric, thanks for calling Grand Rapids Michigan. 1005 01:09:53.760 --> 01:09:58.960 Right, yeah, yeah, I have I have a couple of questions 1006 01:09:59.000 --> 01:10:02.039 from from Mica out the American Wrestling feder Federation. Um, how come I 1007 01:10:02.119 --> 01:10:08.119 didn't work? And when you him and Terry Taylor just had good chemistry there, 1008 01:10:08.159 --> 01:10:11.119 And then I wanted to know who did when they did when they're on 1009 01:10:11.239 --> 01:10:14.800 commentary, who who did the impersonations of like the bigger wrestlers, like a 1010 01:10:15.199 --> 01:10:16.479 macho man in Hall cold? Was that him? Or was that Terry? 1011 01:10:16.479 --> 01:10:20.760 And that's all I got. Thanks a lot, thanks Arry. Okay, 1012 01:10:21.000 --> 01:10:24.760 a couple of things as far as far as the guy that was doing the 1013 01:10:24.840 --> 01:10:29.399 impressions, it was Terry. Terry did just a colossal macho man impression and 1014 01:10:29.800 --> 01:10:32.520 I think he did a Rick Flair impression as I as I recall, um, 1015 01:10:33.479

--> 01:10:36.560 Terry Taylor was just just a who to work with. I mean, 1016 01:10:36.760 --> 01:10:42.920 Terry Terry, very very smart, very creative mind for wrestling, A real 1017 01:10:43.000 --> 01:10:47.479 sarcastic soob at times he made like kind of miserable at times on the broadcast 1018 01:10:47.560 --> 01:10:53.239 booth, but fun stuff. And then after Terry, of course I had 1019 01:10:53.279 --> 01:10:57.720 the opportunity to work with Lord Alfred Hayes and that that was tremendous. You 1020 01:10:57.800 --> 01:11:02.359 talk about two completely different personalities, but it was great in both counts. 1021 01:11:02.560 --> 01:11:09.560 Why it didn't work several reasons, I think. And it's funny when I 1022 01:11:10.000 --> 01:11:13.439 meet up with Sergeant Slaughter or Tito Santana were the bookers at the time. 1023 01:11:13.439 --> 01:11:17.199 I'll see them at some of the wrestling reunions and they still feel and I 1024 01:11:17.279 --> 01:11:21.079 don't know how much bias it is that the AWF could have taken off and 1025 01:11:21.159 --> 01:11:25.840 could have done better if only this and if only that. I don't know 1026 01:11:26.039 --> 01:11:32.079 if fans remember the AWF was kind of unique or they tried to be in 1027 01:11:32.319 --> 01:11:39.680 using the European round system, and it was it was typically it was I 1028 01:11:39.840 --> 01:11:44.079 believe four three minute rounds or three four minute rounds, what have you, 1029 01:11:44.479 --> 01:11:48.000 and then there would be a referee decision if there was no pinfaller submission in 1030 01:11:48.119 --> 01:11:53.680 that time frame. The problem is, as you're you know, they tried 1031 01:11:53.720 --> 01:11:58.279 to carbonage, they tried to do something different in the face of the WW 1032 01:11:58.720 --> 01:12:01.800 and WCW or what have you. But in this day and age of crash 1033 01:12:01.880 --> 01:12:08.399 television, where you know, people want constant action, nobody was going to 1034 01:12:08.479 --> 01:12:11.319 sit still for all of a sudden you've got a near fall, or you've 1035 01:12:11.359 --> 01:12:14.560 got somebody mounting a comeback or whatever, and then the bill rings and you're 1036 01:12:14.560 --> 01:12:19.279 going to take a one minute rest it. It didn't work. I don't 1037 01:12:19.399 --> 01:12:23.319 know if it could work in this country, especially in this day and age, 1038 01:12:23.399 --> 01:12:30.199 I don't know. The other thing was that the AWF. The president 1039 01:12:30.239 --> 01:12:33.439 of the AWF, Paul Alperstein, a huge wrestling fan at the time. 1040 01:12:33.479 --> 01:12:36.119 Paul had a lot of money and he sunk his heart and soul and his 1041 01:12:36.239 --> 01:12:42.079 money his pocketbook into the AWF. But they were paying to be on television. 1042 01:12:42.079 --> 01:12:45.119 They were they were paying for their time slots, and they were paying 1043 01:12:45.119 --> 01:12:48.000 a lot of money, and in a lot of cases they were getting just 1044 01:12:48.319 --> 01:12:51.760 awful time slots middle of the night, three o'clock in the morning, four 1045 01:12:51.800 --> 01:12:56.720 o'clock in the morning, what have you. And Paul went through his money 1046 01:12:56.960 --> 01:13:00.439 very very quickly, and you know, they had a pretty good roster talent. 1047 01:13:00.560 --> 01:13:03.119 Some of the guys were kind of on the waning ends of their career, 1048 01:13:03.199 --> 01:13:08.600 like Tommy Richard, Greg Valentine or you know cocob Ware and you know 1049 01:13:08.800 --> 01:13:12.079 Hercules, guys like that. But they also had the Road Warriors, they 1050 01:13:12.159 --> 01:13:15.760 had the Hockey Talk Man. A lot of money invested in this product, 1051 01:13:15.800 --> 01:13:20.880 but I think between the round system just not catching on and then the horrible 1052 01:13:20.920 --> 01:13:25.720 time slots, you know, and kind of throwing money at money. There 1053 01:13:25.760 --> 01:13:30.119 were two different runs with the AWF that I had, and both times they 1054 01:13:30.239 --> 01:13:32.479 just didn't catch on. You know, they had syndication in a lot of 1055 01:13:32.560 --> 01:13:39.319 cities, but time frame wise and and you you name it, it just 1056 01:13:39.399 --> 01:13:42.399 didn't work, which is too bad. I think there was some potential there, 1057 01:13:42.479 --> 01:13:46.960 but you know, sad to say. Need an extra dose of positivity 1058 01:13:47.000 --> 01:13:51.640 in your wrestling podcasts, will come join me Alan fell Over in the Progress 1059 01:13:51.720 --> 01:13:58.359 Paradise at Pehorte vip As we bosk on the bright side of wrestling and focus 1060 01:13:58.439 --> 01:14:01.079 on some of the great matches and shows from around the world, be at 1061 01:14:01.199 --> 01:14:06.079 the US, Japan, Europe or Mexico. There's always a place for wrestlings 1062 01:14:06.119 --> 01:14:10.920 past in the Paradise too, and we've done fun historical shows such as the 1063 01:14:11.079 --> 01:14:15.479 We love Lyger series celebrating the glorious career of juician thunder Lyger and our I 1064 01:14:15.680 --> 01:14:19.199 was there when shows where our guests will join me to talk about a classic 1065 01:14:19.319 --> 01:14:24.520 bout that they were in attendance for. We love variety and you can expect 1066 01:14:24.600 --> 01:14:29.960 lots of it at the pro Rest Paradise. Detailed PWF Torch VIP subscription information 1067 01:14:30.239 --> 01:14:34.439 and a list of all the VIP benefits is available at pw Torch vipinfo dot 1068 01:14:34.479 --> 01:14:40.680 com. And yes, all VIP podcasts are compatible with popular podcast apps on 1069 01:14:40.840 --> 01:14:45.319 iPhone and Android devices, or you can stream them directly from our ad free 1070 01:14:45.640 --> 01:14:54.880 VIP mobile site. See you in the Paradise. Yeah, a lot a 1071 01:14:54.960 --> 01:14:58.720 lot of companies decried to be that you know number two, number

three group 1072 01:14:59.399 --> 01:15:02.359 ecle you to a degree, became that. Certainly after w W went away, 1073 01:15:02.399 --> 01:15:05.920 t NA filled the void to a certain extent. They're still trying to, 1074 01:15:08.079 --> 01:15:10.159 you know, to get to that next level. You know, they're 1075 01:15:10.199 --> 01:15:12.760 at the big arenas. They've got Holk Hogan, they've got Kurt Angel, 1076 01:15:12.800 --> 01:15:15.880 now they've got Rampage Jackson. I mean they keep scratching and klown trying to 1077 01:15:15.920 --> 01:15:18.920 get to that level where you know, there's that belief. Those w w 1078 01:15:19.119 --> 01:15:24.119 fans, those latent fans are still out there looking for an alternative to WWE 1079 01:15:24.479 --> 01:15:28.199 make I know you watched TNA semi regularly. Just I'll make a quick note. 1080 01:15:28.239 --> 01:15:30.359 We got the rating end just a couple of minutes ago. Last night 1081 01:15:30.439 --> 01:15:34.279 show did a nice one point zero three rating. That is up from the 1082 01:15:34.319 --> 01:15:39.960 point nine one and the point eight three the previous two weeks. It's only 1083 01:15:40.039 --> 01:15:43.960 the second time in the last six weeks that it did above a one point 1084 01:15:44.039 --> 01:15:47.760 zero and that was up against the Heat Spurs game. So, you know, 1085 01:15:48.000 --> 01:15:51.119 I mean, maybe Rampage Jackson's making a little difference. Who knows, 1086 01:15:51.640 --> 01:15:56.439 maybe the new time slot going back to the old time splot helped mix. 1087 01:15:56.960 --> 01:16:02.279 What's your take observing TNA having been part of the AWF and seeing promotions try 1088 01:16:02.359 --> 01:16:08.680 to find that niche in a WWF dominated or WWF slash w W dominated environment. 1089 01:16:09.000 --> 01:16:14.039 What do you think TNA's doing well and not well? I think what's 1090 01:16:14.079 --> 01:16:16.239 it? Well? They're doing something well because they're here all these years later 1091 01:16:16.279 --> 01:16:20.199 and nobody gave him a chance, you know, So in that sense, 1092 01:16:20.239 --> 01:16:24.560 I think they're you know, they've got something right. I mean in terms 1093 01:16:24.600 --> 01:16:28.279 of what they're doing wrong. You know, a lot of times I just 1094 01:16:28.439 --> 01:16:30.359 kind of shake my head at some of the storylines that they come up with. 1095 01:16:30.880 --> 01:16:35.439 And TNA, I think they've got tremendous talent down there. I don't 1096 01:16:35.520 --> 01:16:38.720 know. I don't know what the answer is. I think the only thing 1097 01:16:38.800 --> 01:16:41.880 that I could say to you, Wade, is that this is a WWE 1098 01:16:42.119 --> 01:16:46.960 dominated wrestling world. And it may be that when a group gets a one 1099 01:16:47.039 --> 01:16:50.039 point zero or a point eight or a point nine or a one point or 1100 01:16:50.119 --> 01:16:54.119 or whatever, that may be the niche. You know, that may be 1101 01:16:54.319 --> 01:16:59.239 about as good as it's going to get right now. I don't he Here's 1102 01:16:59.239 --> 01:17:02.720 what I think, I t and a success sometimes may depend more on how 1103 01:17:03.439 --> 01:17:08.319 WWE is not doing things right than it is what TNA is doing right. 1104 01:17:08.960 --> 01:17:12.199 Um, TNA's got some terrific talent. As I said, down there, 1105 01:17:12.439 --> 01:17:15.880 the X Division guys are are great. Certainly, if you've got Kurt Angle 1106 01:17:15.960 --> 01:17:19.079 on a show, you know, he's you know, he's magnificent. I 1107 01:17:19.199 --> 01:17:24.479 think if a WWE continues to do things like they're doing, you know, 1108 01:17:24.640 --> 01:17:29.439 trying to push right back into a buy our pay per view status, I 1109 01:17:29.560 --> 01:17:31.239 think that's going to hurt them and I think that, you know, people 1110 01:17:31.279 --> 01:17:35.319 are going to really start to look for an alternative. Although again, you 1111 01:17:35.399 --> 01:17:38.800 know, maybe the one point three is about as good as it's going to 1112 01:17:38.880 --> 01:17:42.239 get. But but I again, I think it's it's more t and a 1113 01:17:42.359 --> 01:17:47.319 success will depend more on how how poorly WWE does with some of their storylines. 1114 01:17:47.359 --> 01:17:51.199 I think tnaa plateau at this one point three or whatever. They've got 1115 01:17:51.239 --> 01:17:54.800 their niche, they've got their fan base, people that swear by it, 1116 01:17:54.840 --> 01:17:59.600 and we'll never watch the WWE by the same token. You know, Vince's 1117 01:17:59.680 --> 01:18:03.600 Vince, But personally, I think that ww kind of shoots them in the 1118 01:18:03.640 --> 01:18:08.680 foot more often, more often than not. And how close did you come 1119 01:18:08.840 --> 01:18:14.720 to working for w W eMac, Well, the chance was there at least 1120 01:18:14.760 --> 01:18:18.920 to audition. And again we're going back to nineteen eighty eight, and I 1121 01:18:19.079 --> 01:18:24.600 had just started Saturday United Ringside, as I said in March of eighty eight, 1122 01:18:24.720 --> 01:18:27.720 and this couldn't have been more than four or five weeks into the start 1123 01:18:27.760 --> 01:18:30.800 of the show, and I got a call from Jack Lanza, who at 1124 01:18:30.840 --> 01:18:35.479 the time was an agent for ww WWF at the time, Black Jack Lanza, 1125 01:18:36.399 --> 01:18:41.439 and he told me, since Vince is going to be attending a TV 1126 01:18:41.600 --> 01:18:46.039 taping up in Duluth's coming up next week the following week, and I'd like 1127 01:18:46.199 --> 01:18:49.479 you to come up there and have a tryout. I watched your stuff. 1128 01:18:49.640 --> 01:18:54.039 I watched your stuff with Burne, and by that time I had known Jack 1129 01:18:54.119 --> 01:18:57.199 for thirty years. He said, I watched your stuff with Burne, and 1130 01:18:57.239 --> 01:19:00.840 I'm really impressed with what

you're doing on this Saturday night a ringside show. 1131 01:19:00.840 --> 01:19:03.720 Would you be interested in trying out? And I said, Jack, here's 1132 01:19:03.920 --> 01:19:09.159 here's the situation. I said, my daughter was just born, literally a 1133 01:19:09.239 --> 01:19:13.000 week or two ago. It's really really difficult for me to get away right 1134 01:19:13.079 --> 01:19:15.000 now. You know, I got to stay home. I've got a young 1135 01:19:15.119 --> 01:19:17.600 son, and now my daughter is here. Plus I have a full time 1136 01:19:17.720 --> 01:19:21.479 job. It's very difficult for me to get away. If I don't go 1137 01:19:23.199 --> 01:19:26.600 to this TV taping, If I don't go for this try it or this 1138 01:19:26.720 --> 01:19:30.000 audition, Am I shooting myself in the foot? You know, for future 1139 01:19:30.119 --> 01:19:33.239 for down the road with Vince? And he said, no, absolutely not. 1140 01:19:33.439 --> 01:19:38.720 He said, I understand, he says, he said, I'll just 1141 01:19:38.920 --> 01:19:43.159 explain to Vince what your situation is and down the road, you know, 1142 01:19:43.239 --> 01:19:45.800 we'll try it again. And he said, Now, listen, you've got 1143 01:19:45.880 --> 01:19:48.520 a k fabe. This phone call from everybody, So I don't want anybody 1144 01:19:48.600 --> 01:19:50.439 to know. He says, I don't want your wife to know. I 1145 01:19:50.479 --> 01:19:54.680 don't want your you know, anybody in the wrestling business to know. He 1146 01:19:54.760 --> 01:19:58.079 said, this is strictly kfabe. I'll get back to you in a few 1147 01:19:58.159 --> 01:20:00.560 days. I'll get you an address, and I want you would at least 1148 01:20:00.560 --> 01:20:02.960 send me a tape so I can show it to Vince. Okay, that's 1149 01:20:03.319 --> 01:20:09.199 fine. So a couple of weeks goes by and I haven't heard anything from 1150 01:20:09.279 --> 01:20:14.680 Jack, I have no address, what have you? And WWF was running 1151 01:20:14.720 --> 01:20:16.680 a house show, I want to say, at the met Center, although 1152 01:20:16.720 --> 01:20:20.920 I wouldn't swear to it, and I had gotten access to from Channel twenty 1153 01:20:20.960 --> 01:20:26.399 three to go in and do some stuff. And I saw Jack and he's 1154 01:20:26.439 --> 01:20:30.279 just got smoke coming out of his ears. He's just livid. And you 1155 01:20:30.359 --> 01:20:31.560 know, the first thing he says, he eases to me, you're an 1156 01:20:31.600 --> 01:20:35.479 a hole, you know. And I'm obviously I'm paraphrasing there, and I 1157 01:20:35.560 --> 01:20:39.000 said, what's wrong? He says, I told you to get me a 1158 01:20:39.079 --> 01:20:43.680 tape and you didn't. And here I put you over to Vince and you 1159 01:20:43.800 --> 01:20:45.640 made me look like a fool, and you know, you blew it and 1160 01:20:45.800 --> 01:20:49.039 boom boom boom, and that's that. Well. I didn't dare say. 1161 01:20:49.199 --> 01:20:51.840 Jack had told me not to tell anybody. I had no way of getting 1162 01:20:51.840 --> 01:20:55.000 a hold of you. You were going to send me an address. I 1163 01:20:55.079 --> 01:20:59.159 could send you the tape. And the reality of it is, you know, 1164 01:20:59.439 --> 01:21:01.840 the story of if you don't do it this time, there'll always be 1165 01:21:01.920 --> 01:21:05.960 another time down the road. They never called again. So would I have 1166 01:21:06.079 --> 01:21:11.840 made it? I don't know. You know, I think I would have 1167 01:21:11.880 --> 01:21:14.960 been somebody worth looking at. But you know, back in the day where 1168 01:21:15.039 --> 01:21:18.960 they had a lot of a lot of revolving door going on there, Craig 1169 01:21:19.039 --> 01:21:25.239 to George and Sean Mooney and Jack Reynolds and Kennerisnik and Roger Cans and all 1170 01:21:25.279 --> 01:21:28.680 these guys. And for me, you know, it was pretty risky. 1171 01:21:28.720 --> 01:21:31.079 I got a newborn at home, I get a full time job. Am 1172 01:21:31.159 --> 01:21:35.640 I going to move to Stamford, Connecticut and relocate if I'm hired? Am 1173 01:21:35.680 --> 01:21:40.680 I going to relocate and possibly be part of that revolving door and get eighty 1174 01:21:40.800 --> 01:21:43.560 six? You know, before I know it? So the whole thing kind 1175 01:21:43.600 --> 01:21:45.199 of blew up a little bit. And you know, I look back on 1176 01:21:45.319 --> 01:21:47.760 it, Do I regret it? No, I don't. I got a 1177 01:21:47.840 --> 01:21:51.000 chance to see my kids grow up. Yeah, I mean, the best 1178 01:21:51.079 --> 01:21:55.920 best case scenario is you would have loved what you were doing, and you 1179 01:21:55.960 --> 01:22:00.560 would have had a long, lucrative career as the heir apparent of Man as 1180 01:22:00.560 --> 01:22:05.119 a main announcer, and have been the most well known WRESTLEMANI announcer with all 1181 01:22:05.119 --> 01:22:09.000 of them. But the odds of that happening, and it's nothing to do 1182 01:22:09.079 --> 01:22:11.760 with you. It's just you're right. Look at the history of WWE and 1183 01:22:12.199 --> 01:22:14.920 and vincit mahn in the way that announcers came and went. I mean, 1184 01:22:15.000 --> 01:22:17.920 and it's just the idea of it being a completely, you know, surefire 1185 01:22:18.039 --> 01:22:21.720 Rosie scenario where you're rich and famous and got to be you know, call 1186 01:22:21.760 --> 01:22:25.640 all these shows without a ton of headaches and missing out on so much of 1187 01:22:25.720 --> 01:22:29.000 your family life. I see where you're coming from when you say it. 1188 01:22:29.399 --> 01:22:32.199 You can't regret it when you look at the odds of it working out and 1189 01:22:32.359 --> 01:22:36.159 what you would have guaranteed to have given up, well, you know, 1190 01:22:36.319 --> 01:22:42.079 and it's interesting, and this is what people really are like taken aback by 1191 01:22:43.399 --> 01:22:45.520 people will say, well, it's

Vince called you today, would you go, 1192 01:22:46.479 --> 01:22:51.239 um, and this is surprising, Yes, I think so, And 1193 01:22:51.840 --> 01:22:56.039 I guess I can't explain it much beyond that, but it would still I 1194 01:22:56.119 --> 01:22:59.520 need it. At my age and you know, still kind of firmly rooted 1195 01:22:59.600 --> 01:23:03.880 in Minnesota and what have you. I would hope, I would hope that, 1196 01:23:04.039 --> 01:23:06.279 you know, i'd be in a position where I could say absolutely, 1197 01:23:06.399 --> 01:23:10.520 I mean, for the money if nothing else, I've been pretty fortunate. 1198 01:23:10.600 --> 01:23:15.279 And I've said this before. If there's a second or maybe even a third 1199 01:23:15.359 --> 01:23:19.479 tier in wrestling announcing, I got to do it. You know. At 1200 01:23:19.560 --> 01:23:24.800 one point, I guess if Joey Styles hadn't been hired to do the ECW 1201 01:23:25.119 --> 01:23:29.520 job, Paul was looking at me. You know, I had the AWF 1202 01:23:29.640 --> 01:23:33.239 front, I had the IWA run. I've been really lucky, and especially 1203 01:23:33.880 --> 01:23:38.960 in the state of Minnesota just doing you know, my stuff here, kind 1204 01:23:39.239 --> 01:23:44.079 kind of being the big fish in a small pond in local wrestling. So 1205 01:23:44.399 --> 01:23:45.199 yeah, I mean, yeah, I would have been great. The money 1206 01:23:45.199 --> 01:23:47.439 would have been terrific, But again, the odds are, you know, 1207 01:23:47.560 --> 01:23:51.359 probably about as good as getting struck by lightning, you know, might have 1208 01:23:51.439 --> 01:23:55.279 happened, might not have happened. But could I roll the dice at that 1209 01:23:55.399 --> 01:23:59.439 point when my daughter was you know, two weeks old, and no, 1210 01:23:59.760 --> 01:24:03.560 no, I couldn't and I can't second guess it. Invite you to email 1211 01:24:03.600 --> 01:24:08.560 the show with feedback or questions or comments. That email address is Wade Keller 1212 01:24:08.680 --> 01:24:14.159 Podcast at pwtorch dot com. That's Wade Keller Podcast at pwtorch dot com. 1213 01:24:14.359 --> 01:24:17.000 Also welcome your feedback on Twitter. You can follow us on Twitter at PW 1214 01:24:17.239 --> 01:24:23.279 torch and follow me at the Wade Keller. That's at PW Torch and at 1215 01:24:23.479 --> 01:24:30.840 the Wade Keller. Uh. There's a few of the stuffings I want to 1216 01:24:30.840 --> 01:24:33.279 cover with you, but I'd like to do it if it's okay with you 1217 01:24:33.319 --> 01:24:36.720 in the v IP after show, so the paying members of Progressing Torch have 1218 01:24:36.760 --> 01:24:40.239 a chance to get some exclusive content. Are you cool to stick running for 1219 01:24:40.319 --> 01:24:45.000 more minutes for that? Absolutely? All right, very good. If anybody 1220 01:24:45.079 --> 01:24:46.319 wants to sneak in, if you were on hold and dropped off, we 1221 01:24:46.399 --> 01:24:49.680 had a couple of people who did that. Just drop us a quick email 1222 01:24:49.800 --> 01:24:56.000 and we'll cover your question in the v IP after show. PW Torch Livecast 1223 01:24:56.119 --> 01:24:59.800 at gmail dot com is the number two call or the number two call is 1224 01:24:59.840 --> 01:25:03.520 the email to send to Sunday Night, James Caldwell with I Believe Greg Parks 1225 01:25:03.560 --> 01:25:10.920 will be hosting the post WWE Payback pay per View livecast starting thirty minutes after 1226 01:25:11.000 --> 01:25:13.920 the top of the hour. When the show ends thirty minutes later, log 1227 01:25:14.000 --> 01:25:17.520 into PWT PW torch livecast dot com and you can listen live, or if 1228 01:25:17.520 --> 01:25:20.279 you don't have a chance to listen live, if it's too late for you 1229 01:25:20.439 --> 01:25:23.479 or any other reason, you can listen on to lay the next day. 1230 01:25:23.720 --> 01:25:28.920 You can find all information about subscribing to this livecast's RSS feed through iTunes or 1231 01:25:29.119 --> 01:25:32.479 on your iPhone, or just stream them on our homepage. In the homepage 1232 01:25:32.479 --> 01:25:40.319 for this website is pwtorch livecast dot com. Our main website is pwtorch dot 1233 01:25:40.399 --> 01:25:44.560 com. We've been doing this since nineteen ninety nine online and since nineteen eighty 1234 01:25:44.560 --> 01:25:47.560 seven in print. Every day since the beginning of May, we have run 1235 01:25:47.680 --> 01:25:50.039 a new feature. We're kind of an old feature that we brought back from 1236 01:25:50.239 --> 01:25:56.159 heck the late eighties in the newsletter, which is ask PW Torch and either 1237 01:25:56.279 --> 01:26:00.039 I or a member of the PW Torch staff answers three four five questions every 1238 01:26:00.119 --> 01:26:03.680 day on that feature. We've been putting it up every midday, late morning, 1239 01:26:03.720 --> 01:26:08.199 early afternoon. Give you a reason to make visiting pwtorch dot com a 1240 01:26:08.359 --> 01:26:11.159 daily habit. We've been having a blast with it. We are getting more 1241 01:26:11.239 --> 01:26:15.399 questions than we can keep up with, and I'm even trying to carve out 1242 01:26:15.439 --> 01:26:16.760 time to maybe put up two of them a day because we're getting so many 1243 01:26:16.800 --> 01:26:20.800 questions. So that's one of many, many reasons to visit pwtorch dot com 1244 01:26:20.880 --> 01:26:25.119 our website every single day, and we're also a free iPhone app. Most 1245 01:26:25.159 --> 01:26:28.399 of the content on the website is also available on our free app. Just 1246 01:26:28.520 --> 01:26:31.960 do a search for Pwtorch on your smartphone and download our free app and you 1247 01:26:32.000 --> 01:26:38.439 can keep up with our wrestling news and our exclusive features through our app along 1248 01:26:38.479 --> 01:26:42.159 with our website. Finally, vip if you want to go. Vip got 1249 01:26:42.199 --> 01:26:45.720 tons of content

twenty five years with of archives, tons of new exclusive audio 1250 01:26:45.760 --> 01:26:48.319 shows, the new Progressing Torch newsletter, and a digital or PDF or i'll 1251 01:26:48.359 --> 01:26:55.199 text format. I think we're over a thousand back issues in our history are 1252 01:26:55.279 --> 01:27:00.880 now available online instantly, along with our VIP forum and of TV reports and 1253 01:27:00.960 --> 01:27:02.359 much more to go. Vi IP just tried for a month. If you 1254 01:27:02.479 --> 01:27:05.680 like it, we hope you'll stick around. The place to go is pwtorch 1255 01:27:05.800 --> 01:27:12.439 dot com slash go v i P. That's pwtorch dot com slash go VIP. 1256 01:27:12.800 --> 01:27:16.560 Whether you're into today's wrestling or wrestling from years ago or both, we've 1257 01:27:16.600 --> 01:27:20.000 got you covered, including those twenty years ago. Kfan Radio shows a lot 1258 01:27:20.079 --> 01:27:23.920 of fun, a lot of fun shows to relive every week. Um and 1259 01:27:24.000 --> 01:27:27.199 we've already got close to I don't know, roughly seventy five or eighty of 1260 01:27:27.239 --> 01:27:30.000 I'm up already. My guest today, Mick Harsh, thank you very much. 1261 01:27:30.199 --> 01:27:34.920 Time just flies by when I talk to you on this, on this 1262 01:27:35.119 --> 01:27:38.960 rate, on this podcast. So hopefully we can have you back again a 1263 01:27:39.039 --> 01:27:43.720 little bit sooner than it took for your since your last visit. Mick and 1264 01:27:45.239 --> 01:27:48.119 some more things talk about you you have there's not many people who have been 1265 01:27:48.159 --> 01:27:53.439 around as long as you have h and have been immersed in wrestling as long 1266 01:27:53.520 --> 01:27:55.640 as you have, and still follow it as closely as you do today. 1267 01:27:55.680 --> 01:27:58.920 And that's one of many reasons. You've been a great guest to have on 1268 01:27:59.000 --> 01:28:01.760 the show. I appreciate a way you do a terrific job as always, 1269 01:28:01.760 --> 01:28:05.560 and thank you very much and thanks everybody for listening. Absolutely well. Let 1270 01:28:05.800 --> 01:28:09.399 kids on bridges play us out on the other side of them. Oh, 1271 01:28:09.439 --> 01:28:11.920 you know, Mike, let me ask anything else you need to plug Facebook, 1272 01:28:11.960 --> 01:28:14.520 Twitter, website. I know you mentioned your podcast. I want to 1273 01:28:14.520 --> 01:28:16.000 make sure we get everything out there. Yeah, you know what, I 1274 01:28:16.399 --> 01:28:19.760 guess they would say. You know, I'm out on Facebook and I'm always 1275 01:28:19.800 --> 01:28:25.399 hawking some merchandise. I'm always hawking wrestling merchandise on facebooks. Will send me 1276 01:28:25.399 --> 01:28:29.319 a friend request. Typically Facebook has blocked me from sending out friend requests. 1277 01:28:29.600 --> 01:28:31.239 You know, apparently I'm too friendly a guy, So I get these sturdy 1278 01:28:31.319 --> 01:28:36.079 day suspensions, finds and suspensions, as Wally Carver would say. But always 1279 01:28:36.079 --> 01:28:40.079 selling the old wrestling memor Biley, I've got so much of it. And 1280 01:28:40.479 --> 01:28:44.239 just check me out on Facebook at bention that you heard me on Wade Show 1281 01:28:44.520 --> 01:28:46.560 and we'll go from there. Two things and to be at you have to 1282 01:28:46.600 --> 01:28:50.680 show. Among other subjects I want to talk about is the just creepy, 1283 01:28:50.840 --> 01:28:59.199 sad story of Buck dum Off and with his I guess long term sexual relationship 1284 01:28:59.359 --> 01:29:02.720 with his teenage biological daughter. I don't even know how to put that in 1285 01:29:02.800 --> 01:29:06.520 a way that doesn't sound as bad as that sounded, But we'll talk about 1286 01:29:06.560 --> 01:29:11.520 that and also make your eyewitness to a bit of a meltdown with Buck dum 1287 01:29:11.520 --> 01:29:15.960 Off at a recent charity wrestling event that preceded the news breaking of Buck's arrest. 1288 01:29:16.119 --> 01:29:19.880 So crazy story for a guy who was in a WA mainstay in the 1289 01:29:19.960 --> 01:29:23.279 nineteen eighties. And also, I just want to talking about the state of 1290 01:29:23.319 --> 01:29:28.239 announcing today and how it has changed and evolved over time, and your thoughts 1291 01:29:28.399 --> 01:29:30.399 on that and what you agree and disagree with in terms of how it's change. 1292 01:29:30.439 --> 01:29:33.359 Those are two of the subjects that I want to cover in the VIP 1293 01:29:33.439 --> 01:29:38.039 after show. Thanks as always to our listeners. Thanks again to Steve Austin 1294 01:29:38.119 --> 01:29:43.079 for the retweet today publicizing that we are pulling cool, cool snippets and facts 1295 01:29:43.199 --> 01:29:46.920 from his podcast, The Steve Austin Show. We appreciate him retweeting to his 1296 01:29:47.000 --> 01:29:53.760 one point four million Twitter followers that we are doing that on Pwtorch dot com. 1297 01:29:54.039 --> 01:29:57.159 But biggest thanks fall to mccarson. All our listeners on the other side 1298 01:29:57.159 --> 01:30:01.680 of the music VIP members got some good stuff waiting for it. We belie 1299 01:30:13.960 --> 01:30:31.039 these are the days, as we say we can. All right, Mick, 1300 01:30:31.239 --> 01:30:34.720 we are now in the P I P aftershow portion of the program. 1301 01:30:35.359 --> 01:30:40.000 Um, oh, I don't eat. We'd even begin with a Buck Zuma 1302 01:30:40.119 --> 01:30:44.319 story, Mick. Uh, what was There's been you know, rumors or 1303 01:30:45.319 --> 01:30:49.159 kind of I don't even know, uncomfortable jokes about Buck for years that had 1304 01:30:49.199 --> 01:30:54.800 gone around about what was going on in his personal life. What was your 1305 01:30:54.840 --> 01:30:58.439 reaction when this one's so public in the details came out of exactly what's going 1306 01:30:58.479 -->

01:31:00.520 on with him and his daughter? Well, you know, as you said, 1307 01:31:00.560 --> 01:31:05.920 Wade, there's and it's nothing to really joke about. But now here's 1308 01:31:06.079 --> 01:31:10.600 here's here's the thing. I mean, Buck is in he's incarcerated right now, 1309 01:31:10.840 --> 01:31:15.520 and anything that I say right now obviously is pure speculation. Um, 1310 01:31:15.960 --> 01:31:17.880 you know, whether or not he's going to be convicted of anything, we 1311 01:31:17.920 --> 01:31:20.800 don't know. We know he's been charged with a lot of stuff. Um, 1312 01:31:21.359 --> 01:31:25.800 there had been innuendo and there had been talked for many, many years 1313 01:31:25.880 --> 01:31:30.520 about buck situation, and of course back in uh once a nineteen eighty nine, 1314 01:31:30.680 --> 01:31:35.399 nineteen ninety Bucks incarcerated on a on a charge. I believe it was 1315 01:31:36.119 --> 01:31:41.079 having sex with a minor, if I remember correctly, I believe yeah, 1316 01:31:41.520 --> 01:31:44.800 yeah, yeah, And uh so it's not the first time around, and 1317 01:31:44.920 --> 01:31:50.199 people had heard stories for a long long time. And yeah, I guess 1318 01:31:50.239 --> 01:31:56.279 I've got no reason to doubt the victim. Um, she's a friend of 1319 01:31:56.319 --> 01:32:00.199 mine. I haven't talked to her at great length about, you know, 1320 01:32:00.359 --> 01:32:06.119 any of the allegations or the accusations. It's pretty ugly when I read the 1321 01:32:08.239 --> 01:32:12.319 when I read what she said and what I read what the prosecutor is talking 1322 01:32:12.399 --> 01:32:15.319 about, and the counts against Buck Zumhoff, it is, it's real ugly. 1323 01:32:16.159 --> 01:32:19.760 And I don't know what goes on in this guy. In a guy's 1324 01:32:19.800 --> 01:32:26.920 head, I can't say my dealings of Buck over the years until recently have 1325 01:32:27.079 --> 01:32:30.479 been fairly cordial, although I haven't had a lot of dealings with him. 1326 01:32:30.520 --> 01:32:32.800 So whatever's going to happen is going to play out in the courts. And 1327 01:32:34.359 --> 01:32:36.960 the one thing that I would say is there's a lot of a lot of 1328 01:32:38.039 --> 01:32:41.439 people who will come on Facebook or what have you, social media and make 1329 01:32:41.560 --> 01:32:46.319 jokes about this situation. It's not funny. You know, whatever we think 1330 01:32:46.359 --> 01:32:53.079 should happen with Buckszumhoff or whatever. If you're appalled by the situation or what 1331 01:32:53.239 --> 01:32:55.399 have you, we have to remember there is a victim here, and she's 1332 01:32:55.439 --> 01:33:00.239 a real person, and you know, allegedly all this really happened, and 1333 01:33:00.760 --> 01:33:04.520 it's nothing to sneeze. AD's very very ugly and very distressing, and it's 1334 01:33:04.560 --> 01:33:10.479 just it's awful. Thanks for downloading today's show. Take it to the next 1335 01:33:10.560 --> 01:33:14.359 level with a VIP membership. Get shows like this the Wait Killer Prosing podcast, 1336 01:33:14.439 --> 01:33:16.920 Wait Killer Prosing post show, and the pw Torch daily casts on our 1337 01:33:17.000 --> 01:33:23.039 pw Torch VIP podcast feed with ads and plugs removed from the shows for a 1338 01:33:23.119 --> 01:33:27.439 streamlined listening experience. And also here the VIP exclusive shows that I host with 1339 01:33:27.600 --> 01:33:30.800 Rich Fan and Todd Martin, Everything with Rich Fan and The Fix with Todd 1340 01:33:30.840 --> 01:33:33.560 Martin signature v IP series that you're missing out without a VIP membership. So 1341 01:33:33.720 --> 01:33:38.680 go vi ip here in twenty twenty two and enjoy all the benefits, all 1342 01:33:38.760 --> 01:33:44.000 the bonus content and the ad free listening experience. Pwtorch dot com slash go 1343 01:33:44.199 --> 01:33:54.880 vi ip where I witnessed to a bit of a meltone from Buck zoom off 1344 01:33:54.920 --> 01:33:58.720 at the Kenny J charity event. Talk about talk about that in the context 1345 01:33:58.760 --> 01:34:03.600 of what happened. This is really really surprising. I haven't seen Buck for 1346 01:34:03.760 --> 01:34:09.439 quite some time, and what I had heard recently, the Heavy Unwrestling promotion 1347 01:34:09.760 --> 01:34:14.880 ran the Jerry Lynn retirement show of course at the Convention Center and then extremely 1348 01:34:14.920 --> 01:34:17.960 well, and from what I understand, Buck was upset with the promoter, 1349 01:34:18.119 --> 01:34:23.640 Dave Sayvic, for running the show on his birthday weekend, Buck's birthday, 1350 01:34:24.239 --> 01:34:27.319 and apparently Buck had I don't know if he had wanted to run a show, 1351 01:34:27.600 --> 01:34:30.439 or if he had just wanted to invite some people to a party or 1352 01:34:30.520 --> 01:34:33.239 what have you, but it kind of took away the funder from Buck's birthday 1353 01:34:33.640 --> 01:34:39.760 and Buck was none too happy about that. So whatever it was that precipitated 1354 01:34:39.800 --> 01:34:42.920 what happened at the Kenny J. Deal, Kenny and I have had a 1355 01:34:43.039 --> 01:34:46.279 great relationship for many years. We will put Kenny over when he does his 1356 01:34:46.479 --> 01:34:51.439 yearly event for histiocytosis research, and Kenny in turn said, come on down. 1357 01:34:51.840 --> 01:34:57.279 Because Steele Domain was plugging a fundraiser for a seven year old boy named 1358 01:34:57.359 --> 01:35:01.359 Kevin Pearson, who I've been suffering from a brain tumor for the last year 1359 01:35:01.439 --> 01:35:05.560 and Steele Domaine was going to be running a fundraiser in Blaine, Minnesota. 1360 01:35:05.640 --> 01:35:10.800 A couple of weeks after Kenny's show. So Ed Hellier and I were at 1361 01:35:10.840 --> 01:35:14.640 Kenny Jason Van and about I don't know, halfway through the show whatever, 1362 01:35:14.800 --> 01:35:17.119 Kenny said, why

don't you guys go up and start talking about the benefit? 1363 01:35:17.199 --> 01:35:19.439 You know, you can, you know, put it over and tell 1364 01:35:19.520 --> 01:35:23.199 people where it is and what have you. And so Ed and I are 1365 01:35:23.319 --> 01:35:26.000 up there and we're going to address the crowd, and I no sooner got 1366 01:35:26.079 --> 01:35:28.760 the words out, you know, when we want to talk about a big 1367 01:35:28.840 --> 01:35:31.640 fundraiser coming up. Then out of the blue, Buck comes from behind me 1368 01:35:31.760 --> 01:35:36.960 and grabs the microphone out of my hand, and immediately I thought, oh 1369 01:35:38.199 --> 01:35:42.800 this is this is not going to be good. When I had gotten there, 1370 01:35:42.880 --> 01:35:45.760 I looked in Buck's direction earlier on the evening and I had kind of 1371 01:35:45.800 --> 01:35:48.600 waved to him, and he shot me a real dirty look and didn't acknowledge, 1372 01:35:48.640 --> 01:35:51.680 and I, you know, something's going on here. Well, Buck 1373 01:35:51.720 --> 01:35:56.199 took it, took the microphone out of my hand, and basically what he 1374 01:35:56.359 --> 01:36:01.239 was doing was be rating not only me, because according to Buck on the 1375 01:36:01.319 --> 01:36:05.079 voice of All Minnesota Wrestling, and I shouldn't be spending time putting over one 1376 01:36:05.199 --> 01:36:10.720 promotion when there's all these other promotions like Rock and Roll Wrestling out there, 1377 01:36:11.359 --> 01:36:15.359 you know, that are struggling promotions and what have you. And then he 1378 01:36:15.479 --> 01:36:18.159 turned his attention in his venom to Ed Hellier and I don't know what Buck 1379 01:36:18.239 --> 01:36:23.920 has against Ed, but but somehow Ed was the enemy. But again, 1380 01:36:24.039 --> 01:36:30.359 Buck totally unsolicited grabs the mic and just goes off on this tirade. And 1381 01:36:30.600 --> 01:36:33.520 a lot of people thought it was an angle way. That's what's interesting about 1382 01:36:33.560 --> 01:36:36.239 it. You know. Some of the people were laughing because they figured, 1383 01:36:36.239 --> 01:36:40.439 okay, well this is staged. You know, nobody comes up and grabs 1384 01:36:40.479 --> 01:36:45.399 a microphone when somebody's putting over a fundraiser and goes off on a tirade. 1385 01:36:45.479 --> 01:36:48.560 But he did, and sad to say, I mean, I just kind 1386 01:36:48.560 --> 01:36:51.039 of stood there with you know, on my hands at my side, thinking, 1387 01:36:51.159 --> 01:36:53.960 you know, okay, when is this guy going to be done? 1388 01:36:55.279 --> 01:37:00.039 And so finally he leaves and Ed Hellier made a mistake of sit What Buck 1389 01:37:00.079 --> 01:37:03.960 apparently isn't aware of is that this is a fundraiser. Well at that point 1390 01:37:04.039 --> 01:37:09.319 Buck comes back and grabs the microphone a second time. And at that point 1391 01:37:09.520 --> 01:37:12.560 Ed and I just walked off. I mean, we're not going to confront 1392 01:37:12.640 --> 01:37:15.720 this guy. We're not going to make a public spectacle. We're not going 1393 01:37:15.760 --> 01:37:19.119 to embarrass Kenny Jay, who I don't think was aware of what was going 1394 01:37:19.239 --> 01:37:25.079 on at all. And Buck again, you know there's other promotions here, 1395 01:37:25.199 --> 01:37:29.479 and you know we do fundraisers too, And as a matter of fact, 1396 01:37:29.520 --> 01:37:32.840 there's a sick kid in Chicago, and YadA, YadA, YadA, and 1397 01:37:33.880 --> 01:37:39.199 this is all going on in front of a camera which happened to be there, 1398 01:37:39.560 --> 01:37:43.520 and so it was captured on YouTube. The worst part about it was 1399 01:37:43.640 --> 01:37:45.560 not when we were up in front of the people. Ed and I kind 1400 01:37:45.600 --> 01:37:49.359 of gravitated to the back of the room and Buck came in and got right 1401 01:37:49.399 --> 01:37:51.880 in my face, I mean nose to those and he said, you know, 1402 01:37:53.039 --> 01:37:55.159 you used to be a friend of mine, and what did I ever 1403 01:37:55.279 --> 01:37:58.359 do to you? And and I said, Buck, what in the world 1404 01:37:58.439 --> 01:38:01.600 are you talking about? Well, what you're putting this guy over. You 1405 01:38:01.760 --> 01:38:04.640 never put us over. You never talk about my shows. I said, 1406 01:38:04.680 --> 01:38:10.159 Buck, you never called me with any information about your shows. Edie ran 1407 01:38:10.279 --> 01:38:13.279 and raved well. At that point, Ed Hellier came up and said, 1408 01:38:13.439 --> 01:38:16.920 hey, Buck, you know he knocked it awful, and Buck literally threatened 1409 01:38:17.000 --> 01:38:21.000 him. He physically threatened ed Hellier at that point, and he said, 1410 01:38:21.039 --> 01:38:26.600 I'm going to rip you apart right here, at which point Ed said if 1411 01:38:26.600 --> 01:38:30.920 you threatened me again, Buck, I'm gonna call the police. So I 1412 01:38:30.119 --> 01:38:33.279 don't know what happened. I don't know what caused the miltown. I mean, 1413 01:38:33.359 --> 01:38:39.399 he was so delirious about what was going on. He actually had thought 1414 01:38:39.479 --> 01:38:44.439 that Jerry Lynn had promoted was the promoter for his own retirement show, and 1415 01:38:44.600 --> 01:38:47.159 he made mention of the fact that Jerry Lynn runs a successful promotion in the 1416 01:38:47.279 --> 01:38:50.640 Twin Cities. Well, you know, if Jerry Lynn ever run a show 1417 01:38:50.680 --> 01:38:55.119 in the Twin Cities, I don't know about it, but it was just 1418 01:38:55.720 --> 01:38:58.920 disastrous, and I told Ed at that point, I went up to Kenny 1419 01:38:59.000 --> 01:39:00.199 j and I said, you know it, I'm gonna leave. I don't 1420 01:39:00.239 --> 01:39:03.000 know what this guy's going to do the rest of the evening. I think 1421 01:39:03.039 --> 01:39:05.479 it's best if we get out of here. I was

supposed to do an 1422 01:39:05.479 --> 01:39:11.560 auction for Kenny later in the evening Bennet, you know, to benefit Van 1423 01:39:11.680 --> 01:39:14.319 he was doing and I just said, I can't do it. I cannot 1424 01:39:14.439 --> 01:39:18.279 risk what Buck is going to do next. So just bizarre. And as 1425 01:39:18.359 --> 01:39:23.000 you said, this preceded by a couple of weeks, you know, his 1426 01:39:23.199 --> 01:39:30.439 arrest for the sexual inappropriate behavior. Wow. And I mean Buck was the 1427 01:39:30.840 --> 01:39:33.760 a w A light heavyweight champion and you know, a lower card main stay, 1428 01:39:33.800 --> 01:39:38.920 did some work for World Class Champion pressling also, um did a little 1429 01:39:38.920 --> 01:39:42.840 bit for the WWF uh, you know, and now he's just he's promoted 1430 01:39:42.920 --> 01:39:46.000 kind of under the radar these rock and wrestling shows around um, you know, 1431 01:39:46.039 --> 01:39:51.239 I think either completely or almost completely in the Minnesota outstate area, and 1432 01:39:51.399 --> 01:39:54.520 so we kind of was flying under the radar. But now, I mean 1433 01:39:55.000 --> 01:40:00.359 that incident and then obviously especially the arrest has brought introduced his name to a 1434 01:40:00.439 --> 01:40:03.399 whole new group of people who, um, I think probably don't have the 1435 01:40:03.399 --> 01:40:06.720 greatest impression from at this point. So it's it's gonna be interesting to follow 1436 01:40:06.760 --> 01:40:10.840 the story. I'm actually kind of surprised to make that that that arrest in 1437 01:40:10.920 --> 01:40:14.560 the story did not actually get picked up nationally. I think that's the type 1438 01:40:14.560 --> 01:40:16.680 of story that I would think like Nancy Grace would be interested in it seems 1439 01:40:16.720 --> 01:40:20.560 so uh, I don't. I don't even know what adjective to call it. 1440 01:40:20.680 --> 01:40:24.880 It's just unusual, and you know, given the pro wrestling connection, 1441 01:40:24.920 --> 01:40:29.359 it adds a little a little intrigue and spice on top for a national media 1442 01:40:29.359 --> 01:40:31.359 outlet to look into. And I don't think that they have, no, 1443 01:40:31.520 --> 01:40:35.199 they haven't. End I know a couple of the local media outlets picked up 1444 01:40:35.239 --> 01:40:39.680 on it real briefly. Um, you know, and I don't know if 1445 01:40:39.840 --> 01:40:42.960 if they're waiting to see, you know, what the what the eventual outcome 1446 01:40:43.119 --> 01:40:45.560 is here. But as you alluded to at the very beginning, you just 1447 01:40:45.760 --> 01:40:50.640 reading the list of charges and reading the details of the complaint against Buck. 1448 01:40:51.399 --> 01:40:56.560 Uh. I have a pretty good relationship with Buck over the years. You 1449 01:40:56.640 --> 01:40:59.359 know, I've worked a couple of his shows, not very many, but 1450 01:40:59.399 --> 01:41:02.960 it's always and kind

of a cordial relationship. Buck has always had kind of 1451 01:41:02.960 --> 01:41:05.880 the reputation of an odd duck. He's kind of done his own thing and 1452 01:41:06.119 --> 01:41:11.119 is his wrestling shows as they were with the Rock and Wrestling were a little 1453 01:41:11.119 --> 01:41:15.840 bit different in terms of the product that he was presenting, So he always 1454 01:41:15.920 --> 01:41:19.199 seemed like he was kind of on the edge. But this, this is 1455 01:41:19.279 --> 01:41:27.680 just this is pretty awful. And I know that the victim was agonizing for 1456 01:41:27.800 --> 01:41:31.840 a long long time about whether or not she should come forward at these allegations, 1457 01:41:32.640 --> 01:41:38.319 and she finally did. And it's not over for her by any stretch 1458 01:41:38.359 --> 01:41:41.720 of the imagination. You know. Obviously, it hasn't gone to court yet 1459 01:41:41.840 --> 01:41:45.039 and hasn't been anybody testifying or anything. So this is going to be just 1460 01:41:45.199 --> 01:41:48.479 a long haul for her, and I wish her nothing but the best. 1461 01:41:48.640 --> 01:41:53.159 And you know, if Buck did these things, then he's he's going to 1462 01:41:53.199 --> 01:41:57.479 pay a price. Let's let's talk about the wrestling announcing. The state of 1463 01:41:57.520 --> 01:42:00.319 wrestling announcing. I think it was last year when I tuned into the show 1464 01:42:00.359 --> 01:42:03.359 that you announced on on Saturday Night's local wrestling show, and it was in 1465 01:42:03.479 --> 01:42:06.600 the midst of Michael Cole, you know, being kind of the heel lead 1466 01:42:06.640 --> 01:42:11.159 announcer, bouncing back and forth from you know, ripping on the baby Faces 1467 01:42:11.199 --> 01:42:14.880 and being you know, a joker to then trying to hard sell angles with 1468 01:42:15.039 --> 01:42:17.680 the baby Faces being the sympathetic figure, and it was all messed up, 1469 01:42:17.840 --> 01:42:21.800 and then you had Meek Josh Matthews on SmackDown, just trying not to ruffle 1470 01:42:21.840 --> 01:42:26.680 any feathers and not be noticed and just you know, call the matches and 1471 01:42:26.760 --> 01:42:29.600 all that. And then you had Mike Tenay, you know, poor Mike 1472 01:42:30.079 --> 01:42:32.000 just doing his thing on on TENA. And I was just I was looking 1473 01:42:32.039 --> 01:42:36.520 at all this and and I was like, Mick is far in a way, 1474 01:42:36.640 --> 01:42:42.800 And I'm on record with this and set it on my outline and on 1475 01:42:42.880 --> 01:42:47.479 the website. You were, in our the best wrestling announcer in the business. 1476 01:42:47.880 --> 01:42:53.680 And I say that, and I say that sincerely in that in part 1477 01:42:53.720 --> 01:42:56.760 of it has to do with the freedom that you have to do what I 1478 01:42:56.920 --> 01:43:02.520 think worked about wrestling in the way that that a wrestling announcer is supposed to 1479 01:43:02.600 --> 01:43:05.439 win out. So you bring your talent, you bring your experience, your 1480 01:43:05.479 --> 01:43:09.800 professionalism, your dedication, all of that. But you can have that and 1481 01:43:09.960 --> 01:43:14.920 still mess up. But you have the wisdom to know. And what really 1482 01:43:14.960 --> 01:43:17.399 struck me is when Verne told you, and it was a great quote, 1483 01:43:17.439 --> 01:43:21.800 and as weird as that story was and inappropriate as Verne acted, he was 1484 01:43:21.920 --> 01:43:27.720 right about something in that in the quote where he said you are what was 1485 01:43:27.760 --> 01:43:30.199 the wording, Mick, the the authority figure of the show. You're the 1486 01:43:30.359 --> 01:43:34.760 person in charge. Was yeah, and it's like that's something that has been 1487 01:43:34.880 --> 01:43:39.800 lost. And when you think about Lance Russell, when you think about mean 1488 01:43:39.880 --> 01:43:42.600 gene Oakerland and what he meant to the NBA, Marty O'Neill before him, 1489 01:43:43.479 --> 01:43:46.600 Lance Russell in Memphis, or Bill Mercer and Mark Lranson world class, or 1490 01:43:47.159 --> 01:43:51.039 Gordon solely especially in any work that he did, and on and on. 1491 01:43:51.159 --> 01:43:55.680 Heck Eric bischoffwin Nitro began. I was just watching the first Nitro ever yesterday. 1492 01:43:57.520 --> 01:44:00.520 When the announcers have control in are that central moral authority figure, and 1493 01:44:00.600 --> 01:44:04.600 they're consistent in enforcing it, and they don't cower, enact scared, and 1494 01:44:04.720 --> 01:44:10.239 meet around wrestlers because they have the back of the power of the promoter and 1495 01:44:10.319 --> 01:44:15.000 the promotion everything that the wrestlers do works better. And I think that, 1496 01:44:15.079 --> 01:44:16.880 And I don't want to go on. I'm trying not to bogart here, 1497 01:44:17.279 --> 01:44:19.119 go on too long, Mick, But I want to set the table for 1498 01:44:19.199 --> 01:44:24.000 this, you understand, And I think so few people it even crosses their 1499 01:44:24.079 --> 01:44:27.000 mind, even people who have been in wrestling for years and years. When 1500 01:44:27.079 --> 01:44:30.920 the announcer is strong, the heels get them have a chance to get more 1501 01:44:30.960 --> 01:44:34.600 heal heat, the baby faces have a chance to be larger than life heroes. 1502 01:44:34.800 --> 01:44:40.039 But when you demean the announcers and treat them as either they're inconsistent or 1503 01:44:40.199 --> 01:44:45.279 they don't have a strong moral center centerpiece guiding them, the whole structure of 1504 01:44:45.319 --> 01:44:48.720 pro wrestling as a narrative falls apart. And that is something that's just so 1505 01:44:48.960 --> 01:44:53.840 clear to me. Whether it's through inertia and instinct or deliberate, you get 1506 01:44:53.960 --> 01:44:57.800 that. And up now, Michael Coles doing a better job now than he 1507 01:44:57.960

--> 01:45:00.319 was back when he was going back and forth, and he can do a 1508 01:45:00.359 --> 01:45:02.720 good job, but at that time, nobody was even close to doing that, 1509 01:45:02.840 --> 01:45:05.640 and you were. And it just struck me because I almost felt like 1510 01:45:05.720 --> 01:45:10.600 I had lost touch with that basic fundamental role that in an altar should have 1511 01:45:10.760 --> 01:45:14.960 and you had that, and you have it. One way that you can 1512 01:45:15.000 --> 01:45:17.920 help us sustain our schedule of putting out podcasts throughout the week is by giving 1513 01:45:18.000 --> 01:45:21.680 us a five star rating on Apple Podcasts. Just go to Apple podcast and 1514 01:45:21.800 --> 01:45:26.439 look for our Weight Killer Processing podcast and Weight Killer Processing Post show and give 1515 01:45:26.520 --> 01:45:29.680 us a five star rating. We hope you think we've earned that score. 1516 01:45:29.840 --> 01:45:33.680 With our fast turnaround times and our quantity and quality of wrestling analysis throughout the 1517 01:45:33.760 --> 01:45:38.000 week. So take a moment out for us and do us favor and give 1518 01:45:38.119 --> 01:45:41.760 us a five star rating and Apple podcast that helps us on search returns and 1519 01:45:41.960 --> 01:45:44.720 helps us grow. And if you want, you can add a few comments 1520 01:45:44.760 --> 01:45:46.680 about what you like about the programs in the comments section. Thank you so 1521 01:45:46.800 --> 01:45:56.720 much. I really appreciate it. I really appreciate the kind words, right, 1522 01:45:56.920 --> 01:46:00.880 and you know it's interesting and may be this, I mean, this 1523 01:46:00.000 --> 01:46:05.000 has been it's been my wheelhouse. But by the same token, I've I've 1524 01:46:05.039 --> 01:46:09.840 gotten the knock too about well at this day and age, you know, 1525 01:46:09.960 --> 01:46:12.439 you you put everything over cars, you know, like the you know, 1526 01:46:12.560 --> 01:46:15.359 the heels of the baby faces. You you and you know we know better 1527 01:46:15.399 --> 01:46:18.000 than that. And but you know what, that's my job. My job 1528 01:46:18.439 --> 01:46:21.760 is, you know, for two hours or whatever it is. I'm as 1529 01:46:21.920 --> 01:46:25.439 much, I don't want to say I'm as much a part of the show 1530 01:46:25.520 --> 01:46:29.000 as the wrestlers. But I have a story to tell and it's the story 1531 01:46:29.079 --> 01:46:32.760 that they're telling in the ring. And I walk a fine line because you 1532 01:46:32.840 --> 01:46:36.439 know, the wrestling audience has changed, so I know I have to be 1533 01:46:36.560 --> 01:46:41.680 careful not to alienate, you know, the people who are you know, 1534 01:46:42.000 --> 01:46:45.159 smart if you want to use that smart to the business. But by the 1535 01:46:45.239 --> 01:46:50.560 same token, I am not going to I'm not going to undersell. I'm 1536 01:46:50.640 --> 01:46:56.239 not going to I'm

not going to put myself over at the expense of what's 1537 01:46:56.279 --> 01:47:00.960 going on in the ring. You know, they're the ring and they're trying 1538 01:47:00.000 --> 01:47:02.279 to tell a story, and I've got to tell the same story. I 1539 01:47:02.319 --> 01:47:06.439 don't work for WW or TNA where we're talking about a backstage then, yet 1540 01:47:06.520 --> 01:47:11.560 we're not talking about, you know, having to put over a Twitter where 1541 01:47:11.680 --> 01:47:15.279 you know what's trending or um, you know, selling the next pay per 1542 01:47:15.399 --> 01:47:17.680 view or what have you. Because our shows are typically stand alone, so 1543 01:47:17.760 --> 01:47:23.319 I've got nothing to promote beyond what's going on in the ring right at that 1544 01:47:23.479 --> 01:47:29.319 time. But I really take pride in this is this is what I'm supposed 1545 01:47:29.359 --> 01:47:32.000 to do. I am supposed to the heel is supposed to be a heel. 1546 01:47:32.119 --> 01:47:38.479 If you're doing something dastardly that I'm gonna I'm gonna say it if they 1547 01:47:38.640 --> 01:47:42.199 miss a move. By the same token, I'm not going to sugarcoat it, 1548 01:47:43.239 --> 01:47:45.079 uh, you know, and and say you know whoa he didn't. 1549 01:47:45.479 --> 01:47:50.359 You know, you have to be you have to be as professional as you 1550 01:47:50.439 --> 01:47:56.119 can, and you have to respect the intelligence of the fans while still telling 1551 01:47:56.239 --> 01:47:59.640 that story. All of our shows are stand alone, you know when I 1552 01:47:59.720 --> 01:48:02.600 do in these shows, so right at that moment, and like I say, 1553 01:48:02.640 --> 01:48:05.319 I'm not promoting an upcoming pay per view, I don't. I don't 1554 01:48:05.359 --> 01:48:09.760 have to be distracted by that. I want to get over what's going on 1555 01:48:09.920 --> 01:48:12.840 in the ring. And you know, some of these some of these kids, 1556 01:48:13.039 --> 01:48:15.640 and I call them that because yeah, I mean some of them are 1557 01:48:15.680 --> 01:48:18.119 you know, they're eighteen nineteen years old that are wrestling. You know, 1558 01:48:18.479 --> 01:48:21.239 they will say to me, well, did you get that move over? 1559 01:48:21.439 --> 01:48:24.640 You know, when I do this, be sure that you say that you 1560 01:48:24.680 --> 01:48:27.720 know it. Let me do that. And if you don't think that I'm 1561 01:48:27.800 --> 01:48:30.960 doing that, well enough. And if you think that your work stands alone 1562 01:48:30.000 --> 01:48:34.640 without an announcer, and I've said this before, watch one of the DVRs 1563 01:48:34.680 --> 01:48:39.399 of your matches and turn the sound out. You know, don't don't listen 1564 01:48:39.479 --> 01:48:42.840 to me calling the match. When you do something, and especially if you 1565 01:48:43.039 --> 01:48:47.760 botch a move, you watch it and you tell me how invaluable the wrestling 1566 01:48:47.800 --> 01:48:53.359 announcer is to get in your story across and that's what I take pride in 1567 01:48:54.039 --> 01:48:56.680 and make you touched on it when you said you know that, Oh, 1568 01:48:56.800 --> 01:48:59.600 the fans are smart to the business, so I've got to, you know, 1569 01:49:00.399 --> 01:49:03.119 consider that. And to me, the smartest fans are the ones who 1570 01:49:03.239 --> 01:49:10.520 know from the opening to the closing credits everything is real and if everybody on 1571 01:49:10.720 --> 01:49:15.399 television is consistent in telling that story, it's no different than a great episode 1572 01:49:15.439 --> 01:49:18.680 of Game of Thrones. Nobody on Game of Thrones is winking and nodding at 1573 01:49:18.680 --> 01:49:23.560 the camera, going these are actors, there's a script. These people aren't 1574 01:49:23.560 --> 01:49:26.920 really brother and sister. This is that we're you know, nobody. Nobody's 1575 01:49:26.920 --> 01:49:30.680 having to wink at the HBO has smart viewers, but those smart viewers are 1576 01:49:30.680 --> 01:49:33.880 smart enough to know that from the opening to the closing credits, everybody is 1577 01:49:34.039 --> 01:49:39.640 in that moment in character. And pro wrestling evolved differently and comes from a 1578 01:49:39.640 --> 01:49:43.319 different era, and obviously, unlike Game of Thrones and TV series, pro 1579 01:49:43.439 --> 01:49:45.159 wrestling and you were part of that and experienced it, there was a whole 1580 01:49:45.199 --> 01:49:49.720 kay fabe aspect of it, and that it was important that Fanstada was real 1581 01:49:49.760 --> 01:49:56.319 in order to draw money. That's gone over with the vast, vast majority 1582 01:49:56.319 --> 01:50:00.199 of people who are your target audience. So all you owe them, and 1583 01:50:00.399 --> 01:50:03.119 I don't think even some of the fans who consider themselves smart understand this. 1584 01:50:03.520 --> 01:50:08.640 All you owe them is during the show to make sure that there's no winking 1585 01:50:08.720 --> 01:50:12.680 and nodding at the camera, so that you can immerse yourself as if you 1586 01:50:12.720 --> 01:50:15.920 were in the product. You don't want to be taken out of that moment. 1587 01:50:15.960 --> 01:50:18.399 That's something Jim Ross was talking about with Steve Auston on their podcast together 1588 01:50:18.479 --> 01:50:23.880 two several weeks back. You want people to be in the moment and announcing 1589 01:50:23.920 --> 01:50:27.079 that gets too cute and winks and nods and there's a moment for a joke 1590 01:50:27.119 --> 01:50:30.279 where there's a double meaning to something. But when you outright are having to 1591 01:50:30.319 --> 01:50:32.840 apologize to fans because you're not protecting, because you're not acknowledging it's fake in 1592 01:50:32.920 --> 01:50:35.920 the middle of calling it, or that you're not outraged at something the heal 1593 01:50:36.000 --> 01:50:40.439 did because quote, well, we

all know it's a work that's crazy. 1594 01:50:40.560 --> 01:50:44.760 The wrestlers work so hard to make to make mus look real, even though 1595 01:50:44.800 --> 01:50:49.000 people know that it's part of an act as part of a performance. Everybody 1596 01:50:49.079 --> 01:50:51.479 knows that, and the wrestlers work really hard to make it look as real 1597 01:50:51.520 --> 01:50:55.760 as possible. Yet there's this weird thing that announcers aren't allowed to treat it 1598 01:50:55.800 --> 01:50:58.840 as real. And you have announcers on w W E and T and A 1599 01:50:59.079 --> 01:51:01.479 who seem kind of a shame to quote pretend it's real and get outraged at 1600 01:51:01.520 --> 01:51:04.840 the heels. Yeah, you know what, I totally agree with that, 1601 01:51:05.079 --> 01:51:11.279 and uh for me, And it's fun for me too. It's fun for 1602 01:51:11.439 --> 01:51:15.399 me whether it's an Adrian Lynch as a heel, or an Aria Davari or 1603 01:51:15.479 --> 01:51:20.520 a Sean Davari or whoever it might be, Adam Pierce, it's fun for 1604 01:51:20.640 --> 01:51:26.720 me to feign that that disdained. It is fun for me to be a 1605 01:51:26.840 --> 01:51:30.439 part of that and get caught up in the same thing. And you know, 1606 01:51:30.760 --> 01:51:32.960 I'll do my takes to the camera or you know, if a heel 1607 01:51:33.039 --> 01:51:35.239 puts down, you know, I'll say why what are you putting down? 1608 01:51:35.279 --> 01:51:40.399 To people in Minnesota for you know that just for that two hours, I'm 1609 01:51:40.439 --> 01:51:44.199 as much of that show as the people at home. I've got to put 1610 01:51:44.279 --> 01:51:47.079 myself in the shoes, in the seats of the people at home and I'm 1611 01:51:47.159 --> 01:51:50.039 telling this story, and I, you know, every once in a while, 1612 01:51:50.119 --> 01:51:53.359 I'll slip in a you know, I'll slip in a comment that, 1613 01:51:53.560 --> 01:51:56.800 you know, kind of an insider line or whatever you might but I try 1614 01:51:56.960 --> 01:52:00.399 to be real cautious with that. I try to be real careful and not 1615 01:52:00.640 --> 01:52:03.279 make a joke out of it and not have a two hour laugh fest because 1616 01:52:03.319 --> 01:52:08.119 I've got a story to bell. And I've always said I'm not a wrestling 1617 01:52:08.239 --> 01:52:12.800 fan. As much as I am a wrestler fan, these guys are phenomenal. 1618 01:52:12.920 --> 01:52:15.960 I couldn't go in there and take one body slam, not one without 1619 01:52:16.039 --> 01:52:19.680 winding up in traction. And these guys are out there and they're busting their 1620 01:52:19.720 --> 01:52:24.079 asses night after night. And I'm talking about the ones who care, because 1621 01:52:24.119 --> 01:52:27.840 there's a whole you know, there's a whole different group of guys that play 1622 01:52:27.880 --> 01:52:30.399 Saturday night dress up, you know, for their friends and family and really 1623 01:52:30.479 --> 01:52:35.159 don't care.

But the professionals who take it seriously. It's my job to 1624 01:52:35.279 --> 01:52:41.439 help them get their points across. There's other subjects I know you and I 1625 01:52:41.520 --> 01:52:44.640 wanted to cover, but I just I don't want to gloss over them. 1626 01:52:44.680 --> 01:52:48.000 Briefly, so if we can have you back on later this summer. Really, 1627 01:52:48.279 --> 01:52:51.359 I want to get more into indie wrestling with you, and there's no 1628 01:52:51.439 --> 01:52:54.279 way with the time that we have that we can do it. And I 1629 01:52:54.319 --> 01:52:56.720 don't want to waste it and do the cliffsnoth version of it. But I 1630 01:52:57.000 --> 01:52:59.840 want to talk about the indie scene and how wrestlers have changed over the years 1631 01:52:59.880 --> 01:53:02.359 and stuff you just kind of touched on there and more so, let's let's 1632 01:53:02.399 --> 01:53:05.039 table a few of the other subjects you and I talked about before the show 1633 01:53:05.399 --> 01:53:10.359 for another appearance a little bit down the line and wrap up on that note. 1634 01:53:10.479 --> 01:53:12.439 Threat an hour forty five minutes now, and I don't want to eat 1635 01:53:12.479 --> 01:53:15.960 up too much of your time either, but good, I know it just 1636 01:53:15.039 --> 01:53:21.479 blows by, but great conversation and great insight, and I love I mean 1637 01:53:21.520 --> 01:53:25.680 if I'm love hearing old stories about the a w A. But I try 1638 01:53:25.720 --> 01:53:28.960 to make sure we cover a lot of other stuff too. Hey, I'm 1639 01:53:28.960 --> 01:53:30.119 one thing I made a note of that one that ask you is have you 1640 01:53:30.239 --> 01:53:34.800 read wrestling books that covered the AWA from people who were in I know George 1641 01:53:34.840 --> 01:53:40.520 Schier put out the Wrestling Encyclopedia of Minnesota wrestling with all the results and that 1642 01:53:40.600 --> 01:53:42.680 kind of thing. And that's great, and that's useful, and what a 1643 01:53:42.720 --> 01:53:45.560 fun way it is to kind of retrace all the results. It's it's a 1644 01:53:45.680 --> 01:53:48.760 nice package that he put together of the history. But from people who were 1645 01:53:48.800 --> 01:53:53.319 in the eight w A, are there any books that you've read that you 1646 01:53:53.479 --> 01:53:58.239 mote that you enjoyed getting some AWA anecdotes from? Yeah, I guess the 1647 01:53:58.319 --> 01:54:00.560 first one that comes to mind would be the Bobby Heenan books, especially his 1648 01:54:00.680 --> 01:54:03.319 first one, uh, you know, talking about you know, of course 1649 01:54:03.359 --> 01:54:08.680 Bobby transcended the AWA and the WWUP, but Bobby stories the AWA were just 1650 01:54:09.199 --> 01:54:12.640 terrific, you know, in another sense, in a whole other genre. 1651 01:54:12.880 --> 01:54:15.279 Larry Nelson, who kind of you know, went off and embellished some stuff. 1652 01:54:16.319 --> 01:54:19.800 But I enjoyed, you know, reading Larry's book, although I don't 1653 01:54:19.840 --> 01:54:24.520 know how accurate some of it was, but I guess for pure enjoyment for 1654 01:54:24.640 --> 01:54:28.439 the AWA fan, I would have to say that it was. It was 1655 01:54:28.479 --> 01:54:30.039 Bobby Enan's book. You know. Some of the other guys Rick Larry has 1656 01:54:30.079 --> 01:54:34.920 alluded to the AWA, as did Olee Anderson speaking very respectfully about Verne, 1657 01:54:35.000 --> 01:54:40.199 you know, and Bill wattson so forth. But it's funny that there hasn't 1658 01:54:40.239 --> 01:54:43.800 been that much Awa stuff that people have said to me, Could you write 1659 01:54:43.800 --> 01:54:46.439 a book? No, I couldn't because honestly, I could not put a 1660 01:54:46.560 --> 01:54:50.880 sentence together with everything. It's all a mishmash. I couldn't tell you dates 1661 01:54:50.920 --> 01:54:55.920 and names and what It all comes flowing out at the same time. But 1662 01:54:56.119 --> 01:54:59.520 yeah, good point. But I you know, again the synopsis. I 1663 01:54:59.600 --> 01:55:01.560 love being of stuff, you know. I asked that because those were the 1664 01:55:01.600 --> 01:55:04.760 two books that I had in mind, and I was really hoping there were 1665 01:55:04.960 --> 01:55:08.039 one or two that I didn't know about. Yeah, I don't. I 1666 01:55:08.079 --> 01:55:11.319 don't think so, I just don't think so. I know that bach Winkle 1667 01:55:11.439 --> 01:55:14.880 was talking about writing a book for a long time. Although it's interesting, 1668 01:55:14.960 --> 01:55:18.600 I you know, Nick's book I think might be might be a little bit 1669 01:55:19.039 --> 01:55:25.439 not flat, but it may be just a little bit too um nondescript for 1670 01:55:25.520 --> 01:55:29.319 the average wrestling fan, because I think Nick would approach the business more from 1671 01:55:29.319 --> 01:55:32.319 an intellectual standpoint instead of telling the road stories. So I don't know how 1672 01:55:32.399 --> 01:55:35.600 we would come out in print. But other dad, I sure haven't heard 1673 01:55:35.600 --> 01:55:39.760 of too many people, you know that one or or we're going to write 1674 01:55:39.800 --> 01:55:43.680 an AWA book. Yeah, it's for a territory that meant as much to 1675 01:55:43.760 --> 01:55:46.760 the industry as it did. And and granted, you know, getting a 1676 01:55:46.840 --> 01:55:50.520 really good book on territory it's as tougher than getting a book from the nineteen 1677 01:55:50.600 --> 01:55:53.680 nineties or two thousands. I mean, it's just sure, you know, 1678 01:55:53.840 --> 01:55:56.680 there's just there aren't as many people out there writing books. And but you 1679 01:55:56.760 --> 01:56:01.600 know, heck, I mean there are quote old timers who who are writing, 1680 01:56:02.000 --> 01:56:05.279 who are writing books. Butcher Vashan wrote it. Yes, but I've 1681 01:56:05.319 --> 01:56:09.760 got sitting on my have you

read that. I have not read Butcher's book, 1682 01:56:09.800 --> 01:56:12.479 but I've seen it and I will get around to it. And of 1683 01:56:12.560 --> 01:56:15.680 course, you know, Dallas Page wrote his book. You know, Dallas 1684 01:56:15.800 --> 01:56:17.640 is you know, kind of brief stint from the AWA. But you know, 1685 01:56:17.720 --> 01:56:20.039 for the most part, it's just uh, you know, and and 1686 01:56:20.279 --> 01:56:24.079 the guys are I hate to say it, the guys are dying off. 1687 01:56:24.199 --> 01:56:27.000 You know, the guys who would have had a history and talked about the 1688 01:56:27.079 --> 01:56:30.279 AWA, whether it's O. Wahoo, McDaniel, Ray Stevens or whoever, 1689 01:56:30.479 --> 01:56:33.359 probably gone off. So yeah, it's get sad. Yeah, yeah, 1690 01:56:33.880 --> 01:56:36.680 well make thanks very much. We will have you on again because I've got 1691 01:56:36.720 --> 01:56:41.720 a lot more that I think we can cover and we can take some more 1692 01:56:41.760 --> 01:56:44.840 calls, some more emails and that kind of thing. Um, Waterloo, 1693 01:56:44.920 --> 01:56:46.960 Iowa, it's coming up. I know we got an email question on that. 1694 01:56:47.439 --> 01:56:51.399 I feel bad if I didn't sneak that in real quick. Uh. 1695 01:56:51.520 --> 01:56:55.199 This comes from Matt who says, Mike, you'd be in Waterloo next month. 1696 01:56:55.319 --> 01:56:57.640 Eric Nelson, Den Couster and I met you at the banquet, but 1697 01:56:57.680 --> 01:57:01.039 we were disappointed we didn't get running to you at the afterwards. Who do 1698 01:57:01.079 --> 01:57:04.680 you think are the must have inductions for Waterloo, specifically for journalism. We'll 1699 01:57:04.720 --> 01:57:08.000 be back this year along with two more Torch members were recruited. Hope to 1700 01:57:08.039 --> 01:57:10.920 see you there. It's truly a first class event, Matt for Wisconsin, 1701 01:57:11.680 --> 01:57:14.439 it really is. And I'm going to be fortunate enough. I'm going to 1702 01:57:14.479 --> 01:57:16.560 be working. They're having kind of an Awa round table, and I know 1703 01:57:16.640 --> 01:57:19.960 the Baron is going to be there in Jim brunsl and Bill Watts, and 1704 01:57:20.119 --> 01:57:25.279 Rick Flair is supposed to be there. Larry Hannig is always there. I'll 1705 01:57:25.319 --> 01:57:30.560 be hosting the roundable round table with feel after but the what if people haven't 1706 01:57:30.600 --> 01:57:33.560 been to the Hall of Fame, the Luthez, George Stragel's Hall of Fame 1707 01:57:33.600 --> 01:57:38.479 and Waterloo, Iowa. It's the real deal. I mean it covers amateur 1708 01:57:38.520 --> 01:57:42.520 wrestling and professional wrestling. They do it in a very class, classy way. 1709 01:57:42.840 --> 01:57:45.760 These Hall of Fame inductions are the real deal. And I don't have 1710 01:57:45.880 --> 01:57:48.279 the dates at the top of my head. I believe it's like the thirteenth, 1711 01:57:48.359 --> 01:57:53.039 fourteenth of July. But it's always a great kick if you can make 1712 01:57:53.119 --> 01:57:57.279 the four hour trip from the Twin Cities to go on down the water Absolutely, 1713 01:57:57.319 --> 01:58:00.239 I highly recommended. You can get up and personal with the guys. 1714 01:58:00.800 --> 01:58:04.479 There's a bank with the awards ceremony, and just looking at the museum itself 1715 01:58:04.640 --> 01:58:08.680 is terrific, very good. I'm glad I remember to sneak that in at 1716 01:58:08.720 --> 01:58:11.000 the end give it because we had an email question on that. I didn't 1717 01:58:11.000 --> 01:58:13.199 want to leave that out because next time you're on it might have already happened. 1718 01:58:13.239 --> 01:58:15.119 So gotcha, gotcha. Well, thank you, Wade. I really 1719 01:58:15.199 --> 01:58:20.199 appreciate the time. Absolutely great stories, great insight and until next time on 1720 01:58:20.359 --> 01:58:25.399 behalf of my guest macarsas is Wade Keller Thinking the VAP member for your support 1721 01:58:25.479 --> 01:58:45.920 and signing up. Invite you to email the show with feedback or questions or 1722 01:58:46.000 --> 01:58:51.279 comments. That email address is Wade Keller Podcast at pewtorch dot com. That's 1723 01:58:51.359 --> 01:58:56.520 Wade Keller Podcast at pwtorch dot com. Also welcome your feedback on Twitter. 1724 01:58:56.720 --> 01:59:00.119 You can follow us on Twitter at pw torch and follow me at the Wade 1725 01:59:00.199 --> 01:59:05.159 Keller. That's at pw torch and at the Wade Keller. One way that 1726 01:59:05.199 --> 01:59:09.960 you can help us sustain our schedule of putting out podcasts throughout the week is 1727 01:59:10.000 --> 01:59:13.560 by giving us a five star rating on Apple Podcasts. Just go to Apple 1728 01:59:13.600 --> 01:59:16.319 podcast and look for our Weight Killer Prosing podcast and Weight Killer Prosing post show 1729 01:59:16.560 --> 01:59:19.560 and give us a five star rating. We hope you think we've earned that 1730 01:59:19.840 --> 01:59:26.000 score with our fast turnaround times and our quantity and quality of wrestling analysis throughout 1731 01:59:26.079 --> 01:59:29.079 the week. So take a moment out for us and do us favor and 1732 01:59:29.279 --> 01:59:31.359 give us a five star rating and Apple Podcasts. That helps us on search 1733 01:59:31.399 --> 01:59:34.720 returns and helps us grow. And if you want, you can add a 1734 01:59:34.760 --> 01:59:38.920 few comments about what you like about the programs in the comments section. Thank 1735 01:59:38.960 --> 01:59:45.800 you so much, do you remember when Hokogan shot the world and form the 1736 01:59:45.880 --> 01:59:49.000 New World Order? Or when Stonecoat Steve Boston passed down on the Sharp Shooter 1737 01:59:49.399 --> 01:59:55.119 to breath the hit Man Hart. I'm Torch contributor Frank Pettyanny and I review 1738 01:59:55.199 --> 02:00:00.039 these shows and many more for my exclusive VIP

podcast, Pro Wrestling Than and 1739 02:00:00.199 --> 02:00:03.000 Now. Together with a rotating chair of co hosts, we go back ten, 1740 02:00:03.199 --> 02:00:08.119 twenty, even thirty years, review pay per views from top to bottom, 1741 02:00:08.439 --> 02:00:11.760 talk about where the wrestlers were at the time, and compare what took 1742 02:00:11.840 --> 02:00:15.880 place then to what is taking place now. You get exclusive access to these 1743 02:00:15.279 --> 02:00:19.680 and other podcasts as part of the MPW Torch of VIP membership, which is 1744 02:00:19.720 --> 02:00:25.880 compatible with the Apple Podcasts app. Visit Pwtorch dot com slash go vip for 1745 02:00:26.039 --> 02:00:39.560 details and sign up for In twenty twelve, NXT transitioned into the developmental system 1746 02:00:39.640 --> 02:00:45.000 and ultimately the brand you see today. On the Torch VIP podcast NXT Eight 1747 02:00:45.119 --> 02:00:48.520 Years Back, we'll be taking a weekly look at this page in NXT's early 1748 02:00:48.680 --> 02:00:55.680 history. Join Kellywells and me Tom Stout from PWT Talks NXT every Saturday as 1749 02:00:55.760 --> 02:00:59.560 we go eight years back to the day to track NXT's rising talents and why 1750 02:00:59.600 --> 02:01:05.439 they did or didn't work out Exclusively for pwtorch vip members. Searching for more 1751 02:01:05.520 --> 02:01:10.600 great pro wrestling talk, then join me. Jason Powell hosted the pre weekly 1752 02:01:10.720 --> 02:01:14.960 Pro Wrestling Boom podcast. Each week you'll hear the latest news and analysis for 1753 02:01:15.119 --> 02:01:17.439 me and my team to pro wrestling dot Net along with other pro wrestling media 1754 02:01:17.520 --> 02:01:23.119 members. Plus, the Pro Wrestling Boom podcast features long form interviews with notable 1755 02:01:23.239 --> 02:01:27.079 names in the pro wrestling industry. Subscribe an i tam, Stitcher, downcast, 1756 02:01:27.159 --> 02:01:30.560 and all your favorite secondary apps, or visit us directly at pwboom dot 1757 02:01:30.640 --> 02:01:38.520 com. Once again, that's pwboom dot com. Need an extra dose of 1758 02:01:38.560 --> 02:01:43.239 positivity in your wrestling podcasts, will come join me. Alan fell Over in 1759 02:01:43.279 --> 02:01:47.800 the Progress Paradise at potorch vip as we basked on the bright side of wrestling 1760 02:01:48.000 --> 02:01:51.600 and focus on some of the great matches and shows from around the world, 1761 02:01:51.960 --> 02:01:57.720 be at the US, Japan, Europe or Mexico. There's always a place 1762 02:01:57.760 --> 02:02:01.079 for wrestling's past and the paradise too. We've done fun historical shows such as 1763 02:02:01.079 --> 02:02:06.319 the We Love Lger series celebrating the glorious career of Juician, thunder Lighter and 1764 02:02:06.439 --> 02:02:10.880 our I was there when shows where our guests will join me to talk about 1765 02:02:10.880 --> 02:02:15.119 a classic bout that they were in attendance for. We love variety and you 1766 02:02:15.199 --> 02:02:18.920 can expect lots of it at the Progress Paradise. Detailed PWEF Torch, VIP 1767 02:02:19.039 --> 02:02:25.239 subscription information and a list of all the VIP benefits is available at pbrew Torch 1768 02:02:25.319 --> 02:02:30.920 and vipinfo dot com. And yes, all VIP podcasts are compatible with popular 1769 02:02:30.000 --> 02:02:34.800 podcast apps on iPhone and Android devices, or you can stream them directly from 1770 02:02:34.840 --> 02:02:46.039 our ad free VIP mobile site. See you in the Paradise. Wrestling fans, 1771 02:02:46.520 --> 02:02:50.880 are you that person that works in a pro wrestling reference to every aspect 1772 02:02:50.960 --> 02:02:54.960 of your life. Well, we're those kind of people too, but we 1773 02:02:55.079 --> 02:02:59.279 do so with mixed martial arts. I'm Robert Villa, host host of MMA 1774 02:02:59.359 --> 02:03:04.880 Talk for wrestling fans every Monday on Pwtorch's dailycast lineup. Not only do we 1775 02:03:05.000 --> 02:03:11.680 cover every UFC in Bellator event, we provide context that only a wrestling sand 1776 02:03:11.720 --> 02:03:15.399 would really understand. I mean, we're the type of people that if you 1777 02:03:15.479 --> 02:03:18.039 ask us about how much of a mess the middleweight title. Situation is we're 1778 02:03:18.199 --> 02:03:23.800 likely to reference WCW in the early nighties. Think of us as a podcast 1779 02:03:23.880 --> 02:03:28.800 for casual MMA fans done by hardcore wrestling Notes and you could find us by 1780 02:03:28.840 --> 02:03:33.000 searching pwtorch and Apple Podcasts or any popular podcast app. And we're always available 1781 02:03:33.039 --> 02:03:38.880 on demand at pwtorch davidcast dot com, where you could check out the entire 1782 02:03:39.039 --> 02:03:56.119 lineup of the pwtwards dailycasts. Now that at summer you might be looking for 1783 02:03:56.199 --> 02:04:00.760 wholesome, convenient meals for sunny, active days, Factor America is number one 1784 02:04:00.880 --> 02:04:03.159 ready to eat meal kit can help you fuel up fast. It was flavorful 1785 02:04:03.199 --> 02:04:06.920 and nutritious ready to eat meals delivered straight to your door. 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That's code Wade fifty at factormaials 1825 02:06:34.359 --> 02:06:44.800 dot com slash Wade fifty to get fifty percent off your first box. Longing 1826 02:06:44.880 --> 02:06:48.760 for some nostalgia or maybe you want to learn some wrestling history, don't miss 1827 02:06:48.800 --> 02:06:53.760 the nineties Pass cast. Every Friday on the PWE Torch Daly Cast Feed. 1828 02:06:54.319 --> 02:06:58.840 Alex and Patrick will transport you thirty years into the past by taking you through 1829 02:06:58.840 --> 02:07:02.800 the Torch issue from that very week. Follow news from the WWF and WCW 1830 02:07:03.159 --> 02:07:06.920 and all the happenings from across the wrestling industry in the real time as The 1831 02:07:08.039 --> 02:07:12.880 Torch reported it thirty years ago. That's the nineties passcasts every Friday for the 1832 02:07:12.960 --> 02:07:31.159 PW Torch Dailycast Feed. Aloha Torche Faithful. This is Kelly Wells, host 1833 02:07:31.199 --> 02:07:35.520 of PWT Talks and XT. Every Thursday, you can hear me in my 1834 02:07:35.680 --> 02:07:40.159 Game of the Idiots, Tom Stout, who shares thoughts from the live tapings 1835 02:07:40.239 --> 02:07:44.359 and torch recap or Nate Limbergh, as well as a rotating cast of guests 1836 02:07:44.479 --> 02:07:48.680 cover the matches and events in NXT Live on USA Network. Search PW Torch 1837 02:07:48.760 --> 02:07:54.680 and Apple Podcasts or your podcast app to subscribe or listen on demand, and 1838 02:07:54.760 --> 02:08:01.000 see the entire PW torch Dailycast schedule at PW torch dailycast dot com. Cheers 1839 02:08:05.239 --> 02:08:09.279 thanks for downloading today's show. Take it to the next level with a VIP 1840 02:08:09.399 --> 02:08:13.079 membership. Get shows like this the wait Keller Prosing podcast, Wait Killer Prosing 1841 02:08:13.119 --> 02:08:16.800 post show, and the PW Torch Daily casts on our pw Torch VIP podcast 1842 02:08:16.880 --> 02:08:22.720 feed with ads and plugs removed from the shows for a streamlined listening experience. 1843 02:08:22.960 --> 02:08:26.479 And also here the VP exclusive shows that I host with Rich Fan and Todd 1844 02:08:26.560 --> 02:08:30.239 Martin, Everything with Rich Fan and The Fix with Todd Martin signature VP series 1845 02:08:30.279 --> 02:08:33.600 that you're missing out without a VIP membership, So go vi ip here in 1846 02:08:33.680 --> 02:08:37.840 twenty twenty two and enjoy all the benefits, all the bonus content and the 1847 02:08:37.000 -->

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