In one of the highlights of the year The Cinematologists screen Wong Kar-Wai's stylish masterpiece as part of the BFI 'love' season in association with The Poly, Falmouth. A veritable modern masterpiece In the Mood for Love stars Tony Leung and Maggie Cheung in iconic roles as lovers seeking refuge from disappointment, loneliness and the harsh realities of their surroundings. Dario and Neil also discuss their cinematic highlights of the year.

The Guardian article by Peter Walker referred to in the podcast can be found here: http://www.theguardian.com/film/filmblog/2011/dec/19/in-the-mood-for-love


United States


00:00:25Wait welcome to the final episode off the year off the cinema atala gist podcast great to have you on board and down the line as usual is dr neal fox neil how are you this week I'm good thank you how are you I'm pretty good i'm just getting
00:00:49in gear now for the final week you've already finished but i've got one more week to go so i'm doing a lecture on the state of contemporary british cinema on tuesday so i've gotta try and figure out what that is so great so your students are gonna leave
00:01:00very depressed christmas that well i don't know it's it's not all that but i mean they were depressed enough last week when we were talking about the influence of crowdfunding and crowd sourcing and the unsustainability of current economic models in cinemas So yeah that wasn't exactly a barrel
00:01:17of laughs cheery stuff now to be to be fair i was being facetious then because i think that there's a lot of really great british film makers currently playing their trade however difficult it might be i think that's um really really interesting work being released over the last
00:01:31couple of years and to be fair i watched andrew cuttings latest by ourselves with toby jones this week on just another reminder of some of the really fascinating an individual voices that we've got in british cinema that just don't get celebrated and an absolutely i mean i think
00:01:44it is probably a structural thing rather than a telling thing Well i think that that's definitely the case so on our last episode this was one of the events i think that we've been looking forward to for quite a while which wass our screening off in the mood
00:01:59for love yes so this was a screening that we did at the poly and farmer a cz part of the beer find love season on dh Yeah it was something that it was a film that when we talked about doing a podcast around this season this was the
00:02:15one film that we will both instantly drawn to on as time has gone on and the posters have gone up and people have been some kind of gearing up for it it really built a nice really nice all buzz of anticipation and seem to be an event that
00:02:28people really really looking forward to Yeah and when we turned up on the evening it was really what three three quarters full Maybe it was definitely our biggest crowd Yeah it was having this crowd and i think there was a great kind of cross section of people there
00:02:41there were regular listeners people who knew the podcast where people who just turned up to watch the film they didn't you really know anything about cinema tolerance that's all there were students there were non students it was just a really great mix and actual here later on in
00:02:56the queue and egg section some some really good kind of discussions and in depth discussion points that people pulled out i mean we were really we were really working hard i thought that yeah it was weird because obviously when when when when we've done it before there was
00:03:10there was that nice sense of you know who's in the room you see them all the time and it feels much more informal and it really felt like yeah this is this is a proper event even when even when we took dead of night on the road and
00:03:23point blank there was still a sense of it being quite intimate and amongst friends and although this was amongst friends it definitely felt like we were stepping onto a different platform with it on dh i think we did all right i think we are then we did well
00:03:36obviously the listeners will decide for themselves in a bit yeah it was great so that's that's to come but also today i think what we're going to do is we're going to talk a little bit about our highlights for the year now we discussed on the podcast before
00:03:50and i'm pretty philosophically against top tens and top fives and rankings films as if it's the premier league but i think we're going toe We're going to talk aren't we About maybe five highlights off the year in terms of films that we've really enjoyed maybe films that you
00:04:06haven't maybe seen and some that you have i think but yeah i just think having a discussion about what what's really floated our boat this year i don't know how you feel about this but looking back it hasn't been the strongest of years but there has been some
00:04:21nice highlights there to to talk about Yeah i know that personally Last year i was felt like a real high watermark in recent times you know there was a lot of films which i absolutely loved and still absolutely love many americans said um i think had a really
00:04:37really strong year last year it was a bit harder this year to formulate but i think that's it what i like about an interview list is not because it's yeah i agree with what you're saying about lists and we both feel that same way but it's it's nice
00:04:50at the end of the year to look back and and kind of remember what kind of year it's bean and kind of put it in perspective in terms of where film is and where different types of film are sitting so i think it's always a kind of useful
00:05:03exercise of nothing else and i don't know if there's a cz many films this year that will you know would feature say in the best of the decade list but but they're definitely some really interesting work and and some films that just you're kind of surprised as well
00:05:17which was which was good so yeah looking forward to kinda check about that yeah and also there were films this year that definitely soft sparked conversation about where cinema is on which is always something with that we're talking about So just before we move on to the hour
00:05:32in show two in the mood for love i thought maybe we could mention a couple of correspondence or social media conversations that we've had and supporters that we've had on the first thing is to just mention that we have been asked recently to cure a hour favorite podcasts
00:05:48or podcast that we like to listen to the influencers on neil you were you were sort of instrumental in making this connection Yes so we were approached by the site cure editor to curate a week of week of our favorite podcasts and it's an interesting sight on dh
00:06:05somehow some of the writing that done before had been featured been sub curated on their people it's all put forward a couple of bits that i'd done when they were asked to create which which was really nice on dh we were talking the other week about gateways and
00:06:19all the other episode about you know how we find this stuff on dh lists and can only think of that and it seems a very deliberate attempt to find interesting people to talk about the things that they're into and kind of open up discussions and access so on
00:06:32and also it's i think it's just a tool in a way off trying to curate your way through the absolute miasma of information and possibilities there are out there on the internet so if ever you you use the sight and i know there were people listening who have
00:06:45their particular websites that they use and they trust to give them the kind of content that they're that they're into So this is maybe another one to check out and that's a cure editor it's called yeah that zach your editor on twitter andi and that there's just us
00:06:59talking about our there's one of us will pick one of our own episodes that we think represents the podcast that we do and then we pick two to one favorite episodes each that look at film in in a variety of ways so yeah thanks very much to them
00:07:13for for getting in touch cool and we also wanted to say a big thank you to libya and fai who are two of your tv students who have been you know more or less to every screening and there are interestingly they are tv students but our most ardent
00:07:27supporters perhaps down it film with maybe yeah i mean we've got a lot of really great students who've come out you know teo to a number of things that they arrived in september and they've been to every every episode on yeah they are tv students but they are
00:07:40really interested on what's great is that they always say some thing and what they what they say is it was really astute and it's really encouraging for for you know to see first is coming in engaging with the stuff that we're doing on engaging with their own form
00:07:54you know in in such and such a good way so they've been yeah they've been really great support was in the last few months on also we wanted to say thank you teo lisa grabowski who is lilith du bois onto its a great handle and also thanks to
00:08:09charlotte cross to people who are very sore vocal on sweeter about supporting the podcast on we also just want to mention marie sullivan who is at reese a pie on twitter on dh she made a couple of comments about our previous episode how she felt that we were
00:08:26a little bit kind of down in the dumps about the screening itself and that that wasn't the case it's also sorry for if that came across we're just kind of self critical maybe we are we were soft overly self critical in the last episode yeah we might have
00:08:39been a bit too kind of navel gazing there but we're not now we're back out on dh very positive very excited for the for this episode yeah and we were very happy with the way this this episode when there was a couple of others as well big thank
00:08:55you to rachel jones who did an amazing job with our with our badges so we now have cinema tali gist badge is a very limited run that we've been coming handing out two of our most ardent supporters but they look great actually gave one to our the designer
00:09:11of the the branding philly philly blue mel yesterday on she loved the badges so thank you very much rachel for those way think it's the start of a merch empire so at some point in the future there will be all sorts of cinema challenges much yes it's another
00:09:27thing to add to the list that we have to kind of get our heads around but anyway yeah well i'm a big fan of much so excited to get more of those but yeah that was that was really nice surprised just kind of have those presented to us
00:09:39on then we've had some really great sort contributors throughout this Well yeah it kind of since the summer really that come on board which has been really good obviously because we're no longer in the same town keeping the screenings going on kind of getting up on stage and
00:09:54engaging We want to thank all of our contributors but particularly to our guest presenters So kingsley marshal mark jenkin james dean on rebecca marshall are all people who've come on stage and done the onstage a q a q and a withers so thanks very much to them Okay
00:10:10well that's ah that's The end of our little love in their on dh without further ado let's go to the b if i love screening introduction off in the booth tuesday it's a little better than three tuesdays but those over there on tuesday thank you for coming to
00:10:48that You wanted to bask in it a bit more That was kind of nice Welcome to the cinema ologists We are at the poly in falmouth for this screening in association with the beer fires love season off one car wise in the mood for love hello daria we
00:11:02are so love what's all that about who knows way didn't rehearse that they thought that was not hoping the film will tell us what love's about it's nice to have you back in falmouth thank you it's nice to be back in my old stomping ground and thank you
00:11:17for having me and not doing blowing me off s oh yeah way we're going to discuss a little bit about why we chose this so when the list came out didn't it It was kind of way both scanned it scanned down the list and number one straight away
00:11:30both of us in the mood for love so yes that i don't know it's it's weird isn't it It's it was actually really was our first choice wasn't as that of all the films that were on that list that this was the one that was that's the one
00:11:43we wanted to scream at us when we want to talk about what Why for you is it Why is it such a great from well we talked about on the podcast about the cinematic versus the televisual on dh the idea that tv perhaps is about information it's about
00:11:57narrative it's about characters saying things giving you exposition and moving on to the next thing and cinema is perhaps about the look about aesthetics about an aura about mood on dh i think as it says in the title of this film the film uses aesthetics to provoke a
00:12:14mood as profoundly as any film i can think off it's a kind of perfect assemblage off framing editing production design music characterization all creates this off or of longing and desire essentially for something that the society and culture of the film is present preventing you from from having
00:12:35so it's kind of a film about people who are surrounded by others surrounded by this world but are profoundly lonely on dh the hope off meeting someone to you know get rid of off sold up that loneliness and the to the two characters the two main protagonists absolutely
00:12:51mesmerizing in being able to solve the vote but i think absolutely agree for me is this is this is cinema at its best this is when this is close toe kind of the ideal that that that cinema gets i think you know carol morley this week was talking
00:13:08about the inadequacy of cinema to betray what's in the mind or what's in the heart you know and obviously the words could never get there But what i love about cinema is when it really strives to kind of admits that it can't ever articulate but then it's driving
00:13:24still striving to get there it's startinto portray with you know with color and time and space that that feeling you know that dream state that longing state on this film is so it's so rich in feeling it just kind of you know just just blows it just blew
00:13:42me away when i first saw it and it's haunting you know this is one of those films that you just you just can't shake it after you've seen it and there's so many things to it that just really like engaging and fascinating that it just it just seemed
00:13:56like the perfect film toe sure to screen on its ninety minutes as well no perfect let's isn't working for us here but also it's the perfect length for reminds you that you don't have to be two three hours long that you can you can use the cinematic language
00:14:12toe you know to tell a really kind of massive story Essentially we've talked with both mentioned the world longing and in a sense it's the film that is nostalgic onda about nostalgia so it's about an era that is so beautifully rendered and its assault idealization of romanticization off
00:14:30a particular era but that's within the content itself but also in the form So it's got this kind of xin where it looks as if it's been shot in the nineteen sixties when it was when it was set but yet it was you know it's a film from
00:14:42two thousand it how's that real sort of in the text on the hook context it's playing around with ideas of often nostalgia of memory and of time on dh perhaps the idea that what we all well lock onto the idea ofthe time a memory in terms of defining
00:14:57our own identity so who who are we where we're way come from What are our experiences Where have we bean but those things are kind of cepa's upstart abstract concepts in the film itself yeah and i think what's interesting is what was why i think is one of
00:15:11the great love films because it's it's nostalgic for the pain you know and i think that we are quite massacre stick species you know we like to live in the pain off off the past and you know those kind of failed relationships and on our own kind of
00:15:25failures and it's beautifully evokes you know they're kind of going back to that you know those things that didn't quite work out and kind of living in it you know it's just it's so complex because it's a beautiful love story but this there is a kind of real
00:15:39pain to it and that sense of regret as well where you know you you you see somebody and you you know you fancy them or whatever and you just don't go and talk to them you don't go and say hello it never happens and then forever you're always
00:15:49wondering you know is it soft some type of the beginning of the film that's off captures that idea on day two characters are just longing aren't they and they've got this off society and culture around them and the propriety of marriage and all these obstacles that's stopping them
00:16:04from you know acting on what they're feeling free but it's like you say in the form kind of makes it feel like it was it was more than that you know that this this remembrances was whole and you know on dh has a beauty to it despite despite
00:16:18all that that comes through no in dialogue but justin purely the way the film looks and the pace of the film and the compositions and the way the audio on this sound kind of works in relation to the protagonist when their on screen and stuff it's uh yeah
00:16:31it's it's a marble piece ofwork on dh it's a film that perhaps most epitomizes that notion of the modern classic we're talking about a little bit about this really wrong with you why is this film go on to the lists that full of films that you know from
00:16:46the twentieth century from back in the day and i mean it's on sight sound paula twenty for you the place the highest film in terms of you know that was made kind of the only film after the turn of century that's in the top twenty five in the
00:16:57most recent film you know before that was like the godfather godfather part two in that top so it's a really recent film firm for that kind of listen that's i think that's really interesting because what is it doing that's that's different and i still don't know is your
00:17:13film a lot and i still you know and i love it but i don't know there's something really ethereal about it and i think that that might be a very emotional decision by people because i think it's one of the most emotional films off of recent times for
00:17:28for film people and also what's interesting it evokes a kind of cinema that doesn't really get made anymore this's for you know that might get made it seem like carol by todd haynes you know which which is at the moment it's it's rare when these films come along
00:17:39which are which for your kind of contemporary terms of you know the context but so deeply rooted in a kind of cinema that is is so cinematically is quite ready and the filmmaker has got a very soft idiosyncratic style you know we talk a lot about you the
00:17:55whole notion of the altar of off filmmaker that creates films that a personal vision and rachel was saying to me the other day like wong kar wai in slow motion should get a room because he likes slow motion and off an awful lot so on dh there's this
00:18:09sort of there's this sense of off the director kind of encapsulating his own journey a little bit in terms of being an immigrant from china and then he's based in hong kong and the languages shift around from mate mandir into cantonese So i think there's a lot of
00:18:22cultural references that was as a western audience don't get and i think actually talking about being on with us off in the top fifty of great films of all time again that they're very eurocentric lists So i think this evokes a sense of exotics is um you know
00:18:36in western audiences but i agree but also the love story transcends yeah itjust transcends its so it's so real and human that the language is a secondary I was thinking about it because the whole idea of the auteur theory one of central ideas is that a good director
00:18:50can't make a bad film but one call away made my every nights so he's made a bad film on people talk about the terms of language and they say oh but it's not working in his you know in his native tongue but you know cinema again you know
00:19:03it's not about dialogue is not about necessary the words in this film is not about words it's about about feeling and space and you know so i'm not sure i'm not sure whether that you know the way we're not big fans of the auteur theory anyway but it
00:19:18is it feels like his most complete film to make and he has a z made anything is good something way were arguing about twenty forty six is it as good as this film I don't think so right Ok that's fine twenty forty six is kind of like the
00:19:30sequel t this movie so you know in a kind of roundabout way isn't it But he's very good but not maybe not quite and also it's you know it it feels i don't i don't like it in because i like the kind of the completeness of this film
00:19:44in the fact that it's incomplete you know and i like i like the amount of space that's left after in the mood for love for me you know in the eye and i like twenty forty six but i don't i don't feel it's kind of that necessary i
00:19:57don't think it adds anything too in the mood for love despite being a very good film and the grand master is a bit of a mess it is a bit of a mess but no is for apparently well it's a you know weinstein obviously kind of got involved
00:20:08in that and it feels like it it feels like a film has been taken away from a director it is a mess and there's bits in there where it's beautiful but it's not so just a just a sort of wrap up than the last thing we want to
00:20:21talk about was that idea off off how culture and society so off this dictates relationship because it is a lot about you know these two people who are in a situation they're in a situation kind of poverty and then of being immigrant immigrants let's say onda also you
00:20:36know they're both married on their lonely so therefore there in this kind of situation kind of reminds me in a very different way of the from the lobster which is which is about how culture and society dictates what relationships are totally different film on this is a lot
00:20:50more subtle the miller the lobster is but yeah it is soft talking about the idea of how we are how we define relationships and what what they are are almost stopped put onto us by what society's expectations yeah and you know thinking about this a lot of the
00:21:05great you know the great films about love seem to use those social kind of constraints that the characters find themselves as as a way off you know dealing with the emotional constraints that people just people in general are under put themselves under find themselves in so some brief
00:21:24encounter which has been talked about a lot this year you know we don't really live in that age anymore but we understand that emotional the emotional problem off being lonely and tracked and regardless of how societies moved on in terms of marriage and divorce and things like that
00:21:37they're still within the person you know on emotional understanding of the morality and and how complicated it is So those films last because within those situations that might change in terms of the society's kind of function people are still people and they still struggle with those emotional you
00:21:55know those those real kind of deep deep issues on dh film just gets so that so beautifully and i know what we want to talk so afterwards about about about the you know the way the film looks and sounds but we will hopefully have have what your appetite
00:22:12even further for so i think it's time to put it on so let's watch in the mood for love Theo wait we'll discuss the the film a little bit more perhaps put into the context of wong kar wai on his his other films and why specifically leading out
00:22:48of that discussion Any more thoughts we might have had about the filming that in section three of the podcast but maybe we can talk a little bit about the beef i love season because they have this really extensive list of films which we had to look at but
00:23:00we went for him in the mood for love But what some of the other highlights while the other some of the other kind of films that encapsulate the idea of love on screen for you Oh yes i think that's a big question and i think that's a question
00:23:11that was was really interesting about the season compared to the first season they did at this last season last year which was scifi you know which felt very much that was easy for us It was easy for us but also it felt it felt easier in terms of
00:23:25being able to delineate different types of of scifi on gamma tau really instantly see kind of key films I think the thing with love is it's such a big it's such a big sprawling season and then across large genre really is in that sense No i don't think
00:23:41so because obviously this great scifi love films you know that's it it just appears in all different types of cinema and the list was that list was i could understand it but it felt very it felt like a starting point more than more than anything else but they're
00:23:59saying that you know the films that that kind of the top of my favorite films that i think a kind of great love stories we're all in there but it's it's interesting you just say that just quickly because you know ninety nine percent of films have some kind
00:24:13of love element in them but then there's the films that you would actually say a sort of interrogating the concept of love and relationships and sex or wherever it wherever it might be So there's a kind of difference that could be pointed out there but yeah the list
00:24:28was i think very much as you say it was a sort of way into the idea of how to cinema explore these ideas of relationships and the different ways it does that yeah and i think what's interesting is like you know two films that i think really interesting
00:24:42kind of you know i say recent films which which kind of interrogate the idea of love and relationships all right michelle countries eternal sunshine of the spotless mind which i absolutely adore because of a big charlie catherine found but i think it's a really fascinating film about about
00:24:59the feeling that love leaves when it when it when it when it goes on and how that's how we deal with that and then other want to be like lynch's mulholland drive which i think is such a you know interesting love story on again it feels kind of
00:25:11like eternal sunshine like this really really deep emotional investigation off the feelings of lust and love on loyalty and things that not so they'll be to think there were two films that would be interested to kind of look at through this lens of love rather than anything else
00:25:30I think a lot of the films on the lift there were harking back to the idea of the classical epic sweeping love story you know so so brief encounter and dr shiv argo a tour that have been screamed all over the place and i think that there is
00:25:44sort of an affinity for that cinema thematic idea off the purity of love all the unrequited love situation you know which is the classical romeo and juliet storing this so many films that have taken that on directly whether whether it be adaptations of romeo and juliet but then
00:26:00also films like titanic for example is which is essentially just romeo and juliet on a sinking boat nicely put yeah exactly but and then i remember being back at film school in watching douglas sirk melodramas which have this riel idealized over oh hyper romanticized notion of love and
00:26:22i remember watching magnificent magnificent obsession with rock hudson soft learning how to be a doctor so he could save jayne mansfield site which is you know an interesting take on the idea of what you would do for love i suppose yeah beautifully sent up in a man with
00:26:39two brains yeah which i don't think those two feel get enough discussion in the same breath both great in their own ways yeah i mean you know one of a film that has been one of my favorite since i saw it on dh might actually be my is
00:26:52definitely in my top three films of all time is is that billy wilder's the apartment which i just think is one of the great one of the great love stories because it's there's just it was so funny and it's beautifully performed but also it it feels massive even
00:27:07though the story is a very very small simple story Andi has one of the great ending You know one of the great one of the great kind of romantic realizations on what i love about it is that the very final scene under undercuts the sweeping kind of drama
00:27:21that goes just before it which feels very real You know i love the way shirley maclaine's character comes to this massive realization and has gives this huge jester and then when she when she's in the room with with jack lemmon there's there's no she kind of returns to
00:27:36being the person that he knows that she is you know which i just love and it's he doesn't get to see the running in the rain and he doesn't get the sweeping music he gets this he gets the card game which just felt so so powerfully beautiful on
00:27:49dh as i've got older that that film has just grown and grown in terms of my appreciation for uh for love on screen yeah i suppose my my standard anchoring point is annie hall i suppose i know it's it's just being off for me and to me it's
00:28:03the soft prototypical or the prototype off the modern romantic comedy and it's that kind of exploration or analysis ofthe how our relationship is working and how it's how it's progressing in in different ways and how that affects the different partners in the relationship i love the way that
00:28:22it uses that jumping forward and backward in time to kind of contextualized what's going on in the present i think it's just a fascinating way in which we see our identity within a relationship through our conception of how it's built up over time and then on following on
00:28:40from that in the future when it all goes wrong how we how we define our conception of whose fault it wass through oh you did this you did that and of course the two the two partners in the relationship will remember that completely differently so that's really interesting
00:28:55and also thiss where's contemporary films even even a film like five hundred days of summer which i really enjoyed because i thought it was that it really encapsulated the idea that wet that two people can be invested in each other in a different way almost in a hierarchical
00:29:09way so you know there's always that that nagging doubt about if you're in a relationship with someone how much you love them how much they love you back on whether are you when you talk when you're totally floored by someone you're always in that that state of anxiety
00:29:25about you know is this coming back to the same degree and i'm just going to get left out you know on the limit some point yeah and and and putting that person on a pedestal you know and then and then the difficulties of navigating that which again yeah
00:29:39i think it's something eternal sunshine of spotless mind does does really well and kind of dealing with the aftermath so well that's good we know we're not complete cynical misers we do love a good the good romantic movie that's good absolutely absolutely so shall we move on to
00:29:54talking about our highlights of the year as we said before it's not been a vintage year i wouldn't i wouldn't say but i think the films that were going to talk about show that there are diamonds still in the rough if it is if it is that rough
00:30:07and there have been some really really excellent pieces of work both in a kind of mainstream sense but also in amore alternative or our house perspective So neil do you want to give us your first film on your list again We're not going to number them our way
00:30:21We're just going to say these there are five twilight Yes Oh yes oh five highlights The first highlight is alex ross perry's listen up philip Now i'm quite biased when it comes to teo alex's work full disclosure i you know i've known you for a for a number
00:30:37of years I screened his first film in the uk way back in two thousand nine on de so i kind of watched his career from from his first feature through and it's been great to see see him become really really kind of successful and on keep churning out
00:30:51great work and it was one of the highlights of the year was seeing his new film queen of earth of berlin but i only like to pick films that i've seen you know that they've come out ofthe theatrically in that year in terms of the round up on
00:31:02a listen up philip finally arrived and i was absolutely blown away buy it just by the confidence off the film in terms of what it was what i was trying to do how it was trying to do it you know that it's it's kind of dedication to an
00:31:17aesthetic is dedication to atone i thought it was really really funny you know i thought it was beautifully cast Yes Oh it's jason schwartzman on dh elizabeth moss yeah and elizabeth moss on day he's an angst ridden writer s o set around the release of his second novel
00:31:33on kind of in the in the build up to that release and he takes ah job kind of teaching writing you know at the university of his kind of mental who's jonathan pryce or jonathan pryce here as his mentor in he stays with him for a while and
00:31:45it's just an absolutely kind of scape bris film he's he's so beautifully unlikable just so fascinating and interesting and on sad yeah i mean it does sort of play is a cynical film satirical but a very cynical film as well but that's it's it's kind of strength I
00:32:04really enjoyed it too and it nearly got onto my list as well stop debating but i thought that you would you would talk about it but yeah really i mean and jason schwartzman i was just kind of like hey when people claim that an actor's performance is brave
00:32:19but taking on a role where you are going for dislike ability that's the actual aim of the role you know it takes a certain kind of acted to be able to do that well i think yeah and i know he's saying about the word brave but we live
00:32:31in an age where likability relatability empathy are all that people talk about so to knowingly go against that and on what that might mean in terms of how people see you on the performances that you can do i think is is a really interesting choice but the payoff
00:32:48is that you get you get a performance like that in a film which is just so strikingly off its own that you know hopefully hopefully he thinks it's worth it was definitely worth it for us because it's it's a great great movie great so i will see your
00:33:02listen up philip and i will raise you enemy which is the dennis veal nerve come on lynch in tail psychological thriller starring jake gyllenhaal like i saw this i don't see this at the cinema i saw online on dh it was something that i didn't really know what
00:33:19to expect and it really kind of affected me really got under my skin and it was that that's a lynch connection the notion of a sort of a mainstream film that was going for a surrealist edge and it's based on the jose saramago novel the double on dh
00:33:33this is to be a lot of a spate of films that are about this notion of doubling which of course you know you could talk about throughout the history of cinema So it's the story of a professor of history who is kind of seems to be leading this
00:33:47salt mundane life but he rents a video and sees an actor on this film that looks exactly like him and then it's a sort of exploration of off this guy following around this actor and finding out who he is But it goes into really soft dark interior territories
00:34:03of exploration of how we understand and internal reality but then also about how exterior structures of power influence our relationship to reality So it's a really a very soft post lynch though my think yes i've seen as well and i did enjoy it And you know like i
00:34:19like the catholic or esque kind of nature of it on just essentially what you're saying there in terms of you know this spate of films about about doubles they do seem to be chime ng with you know the current anxieties and also kind of proliferation off the idea
00:34:35of a second life you know and that we live this life we have we are ourselves and then online we are someone else and dealing with dealing with the fact that almost two selves out in the world andi thought it did that really interesting you know a lot
00:34:46people have said well nothing really happens you know but what i loved about it was again become actors how committed gillan hall was to those two rolls and i think i said that time i saw it you know jake gyllenhaal's given three of the best performances in his
00:35:00last two films you know so with two performances in that and then a night crawler that college is just a really interesting performer on dh that he pulls that fillmore because he's because he's really really good as both as both sides i think it's he's suffering from that
00:35:15kind of too pretty to be good tag you know i mean which i think you know actors and actresses of suffered from down the ages where people he's doing really interesting work and always has been interesting work but it is kind of getting labeled as somebody who is
00:35:32just you know the persona the hollywood persona of jake gyllenhaal comes above what he's actually doing is an actor yeah and i think he wasn't helped by that kind of you know the sullen noughties icon that he played in donnie darko there's something kind of spoil about his
00:35:47about his way in that so he's kind of seen in this area have you seen south poor haven't seen southport yet No no no it's kind of what it's going to go see it and then it got absolutely tramps that was like i watched that sometime online Yeah
00:35:59no no mr mentioned to see it for his performance but but that's about it Okay so from enemy i'm going to take us to inherent vice okay well that's on my list too so we can talk about that together We won't talk about it too much because we've
00:36:11still got that inherent vice episode in the bank waiting to this could be a bonus episode to come Indeed in my thinking i kind of included this engine in talk together because because of having two films released in a year is always there would probably both being my
00:36:27top five because i'm that much of a paul thomas anderson fan and i thought june was fantastic music documentary So this is the one that was in hour long documentary was released on movie exclusively on move yes so it was documenting jonny greenwood on shoaib answers recording of
00:36:42an album in india and there's much to talk about there and i'll talk about that again in the future when we talk about music documentaries been hair advice i've seen about three times now i think my three and a half on i've set aside time to watch it
00:36:57again this week on its absolute i just think it's fantastic on one of those films which absolutely demands more than one viewing I was speaking teo ryan gill be about it on dh he was he he summed it up and he said it's a great kind of hang
00:37:12out film it's a film that you just you just hang out with and every time i do i just get more and more from it It's absolutely exquisitely realized and like listen up philip very confident in what it's trying to do and not caring what what people expected
00:37:27to do very much kind of its own beast and another another film that has just got you know performances that you you are absolutely riveted by me working things again He doesn't suffer from the pretty boy tak that jake general hall does but in that he really is
00:37:42sort of doing that stone a loser down and out performance teo absolute perfection but also i think that the the position within the racial shit to the other characters particularly the female characters is really kind of interesting in seoul because possibility that that role could have just been
00:37:59a really soft big over the top shouty and there's moments off it which are like that but they tend to be kind of funny on purpose and the performances around working phoenix particularly katherine waters and i thought we were absolutely brilliant in terms ofthe advocating this particular time
00:38:17and place but also sort of riel psychological problems that the characters themselves were going through so i played it did play in and out of the idea of is this is film that is saying something serious or is this just a a really over the top cinematic exploration
00:38:34off off a particular era I mean i can understand why people didn't take to it because it hasn't got a straightforward narrative and it's about the thing we discussed all the time what is for cinema about is it about just information on dh story or is it about
00:38:49mood and atmosphere on aura And this is kind of dripping with that that's smoky seventies putrid down and out kind of aura thing Yeah it is it is kind of both silly and serious and it is it is it is deliberately shifting its tone based on whereabouts in
00:39:10the narrative you know we are what the characters that kind of feeling it is both this kind of interesting almost kind of nihilistic take on power structures again but also it's a stone a movie and i think phoenix is such a generous actor you know he's the lead
00:39:27in that but he never really feels like he's demanding the screen lets everyone else do their thing he's so willing and i don't i can't think of another performer who's turned in a string of performances this the immigrant her and the master are his last four films you
00:39:44tell me another actor with that range with that kind of presence and ability to transform into into wrote in great great movies were very lucky to have him working i think on i'm just glad that paul thomas anderson is kind of dedicated to mumbly is he You know
00:40:02he was always mumbly but you know he's just so watchable could constantly yeah if you've seen it once and you're a bit in there then you know go back in and and let it let it wash over you yeah i definitely have tio might after nicky or your
00:40:15blue ray when i come there for when it comes to farmer for christmas So yes that's inherent vice andi thinks off maybe keep in keeping with the big big movies of the year i'm going to talk a little bit about mad max fury road of course you are
00:40:31so yeah this is this was my highlight or one of my highlights off the year for various reasons and as you know on as regular listens to the podcasters will know wei are not particularly blockbuster fans mit maybe me even less so so this is a film that's
00:40:48a reboot essentially it's a franchise film it's a big spectacular action blockbuster and i think it's it's funny because it's almost looked looking back now about the conversations we had on also you know the arguments that will have around around this film it's maybe as important a film
00:41:07this year as there has been released in terms of what it means what it means for cinema i just thought that this film i did what a blockbuster is supposed to do everything was put together so fantastically well yes it had c g i but it was absolutely
00:41:23grounded in its physical stunt work on dh it created you know a believable world in a completely unbelievable kind of situation and story i think it did have interesting undercurrents thematic undercurrents that were that meant it was beyond simply spectacle you know particular around the conversations about whether
00:41:46it had you know a feminist ideology and it whether it was pushing that deliberately andi you know and that could have been read it was read completely opposition lee by different people you know whether this was saying something that was definitely a feminist tract or whether it was
00:42:01kind of like doing doing the opposite i mean like all of the the mad max films previously is saying something about the contemporary state of the world and where where that could lead but it was just absolutely rip roaring i mean i just came out way watched i
00:42:18watched it for the second time when you watch that first time and i just couldn't believe that way went to the pub after us like my brain was just on like on overdrive afterwards it was it was it was an incredible film but yeah i think it is
00:42:30an incredible film in yeah as a blockbuster there's there's not there's not been one like it for you know since pacific rim know don't start i just do that to wind you up on onda little bit of a call back to a previous episode but yeah i think
00:42:47it wass it was exhilarating as a cinematic experience on dh in a similar way to kind of in her advice i think it is both it's doing things that are feminist in the way that we want the films to be currently which is bringing female characters into into
00:43:04inter leading roles without drawing attention to it But then it's kind of also doing things which are really drawing attention to it's supposed feminist i did and i think it's a bit of a mess in that sense but a glorious mess i don't think it's coherent in terms
00:43:19of its ideological project no but then i don't know you know but i don't think that's what it's there for but i think it's really interesting that it that it is doing all of these things narratively i think it's it's amazing because you know you know teaching screenwriting
00:43:33and you talk about you look at blockbusters and how they're structured And this film is a chase to the middle of nowhere And then a chase back you know and that's that that that's the structure there is no acts there's no arcs there's no first second third act
00:43:48it's literally it goes forward and then it goes it comes back on dh it's like you know this kind of boomerang and it's just it's just beautifully beautifully Everything is in service of this of the central idea of kind of uh off of entertaining with with all this
00:44:05other stuff spilling out but also that it's no stop to the convention though as well I mean there's a couple of i mean i don't wanna give away the ending away but it doesn't fall into the patterns off oh we must by the end of the film of
00:44:16fulfilled this that this that and that and then there's a couple of moments in the film where actually looks as if it's going to conform to what conventional What was they would do in that situation It does it And then it completely switches it almost immediately And one
00:44:31particular moment in the meal when it when one of the central characters gets killed on dh it's just so incredibly kind of affecting in that's off over spectacle kind of way that's exactly what blockbusters should do on dh more often not they don't do for me Yeah i
00:44:49agree Completely agreed Yeah So Okay So the other one i wanted to mention was xavier dolan's mommy which was a second film of his i've seen he's i think he's about twenty six now and he's he's directed like ten films he's this french canadian brat you know movie
00:45:08brass who just makes the most yeah again interesting and exhilarate films And mummy was a film that really really struck me as really confident really bold it's loud and it's noisy and it's aggressive in its betrayal of particular young people on dh kind of family relationships But it
00:45:28feels incredibly contemporary if it was like that The the way it's telling its story very abrasively is intentional in a way that a lot not a lot filmmakers i think young filmmakers could could really kind of harness but it's it's it's this beautiful story about you know a
00:45:47young man on the fringe of society and his mother who's really struggling toe to bring him up there's a beautiful use of music it looks amazing i mean everyone talked about the kind of the four by through the use of four by three framing or forthree framing but
00:46:01absolutely intentional and beautifully used he's brash and loud but i think he's a filmmaker that kind of gives me hope in terms of new pushing the boundaries of kind of you know film language in the area so he'll be someone that i would definitely say check out and
00:46:20and kind of try and get past the fact that it you might feel a bit old you know because i think that particularly mummy almost like presents itself as a film not for you if you're a particular age because it's so it feels kind of vulgar but i
00:46:35think it's vulgarity is it's so it's so intrinsic to what it's trying to say that it's not really a film you know that it is it is just a great piece of work i think so yeah i haven't seen that so calm comment as yet but i will
00:46:50definitely definitely check that one out eso perhaps just before we move on to a film that i think we can both talk about i just want to quickly mention ex makina which is right the beginning of the year which i thought was a a brilliant piece of work
00:47:02by alex girl and really interesting scifi And and it continues a particularly strong cycle I think of the last two or three years when you when you think of under the skin and her off off side fi that have kind of like british connections there either britt british
00:47:18made or that directed So yeah check it Definitely Check her axe makina But i think the thing that we both wanted to talk about on this part their podcast was the duke of burgundy which if there was a phone number one this probably would have been it for
00:47:32me So this is the pierre strickland film on dh It follows on the heels off the very sound studio which is a film like that that i really loved not expecting to like it on all his kind of aesthetic skill on dh precision is there i think in
00:47:52the duke of burgundy which is a story about a leopard doctorate ist and her maid who enter into a b d sm relationship Now if you put that on the kind of advertising of a film it might solve turn a lot of people away But this was just
00:48:06an incredible kind of erotic drama with real substance but kind of undercuts The questions of sexuality that it's presenting all the way through and again two great central performances from subscribe concern who was obviously from borgen people in the u k well you know throughout europe will recognise
00:48:25from that chiara d'anna to great performances again and an amazing amazing film reel yeah and talk about as we did at the start you know kind of british cinemas kind of leading lights on guy would definitely put put strickland up there you know katalin varga i think it
00:48:41was in which was his debut was a farm i really really like a great kind of pulp revenge movie set in eastern europe in a rule released in europe on dh yeah and both barbarian sound studio and the duke of burgundy arms are both meticulous and kind of
00:48:57but also mundane and messy and i think that he's got this really beautiful way off like you say undercutting its very austere very kind of meticulous aesthetic with with kind of yeah almost absurdity and what one that was one thing i loved about the jacob burgundy was the
00:49:15way it it kind of it it felt very much in our marge too classic erotic cinnabar but also really interested in the kind of the practical realities of a relationship like that on the day to day basis and just really funny in the way it's hilarious isn't it
00:49:34when you know you've got there the sort of whips and chains and handcuffs and saying people up and then at some point that we were a movie one of the characters Look i just want to put my dressing gather on the rebar book leave me alone kind of
00:49:45thing Yeah that brilliant scene where she gets it she burned him too much away She looks she looks the maid in the who's a subject in the in the trunk and then kind of lays on the bed in our pajamas sort off reading a book and kind of
00:50:00issuing instructions that distance is absolutely fantastic But again it's kind of it is a cz well this really beautiful film and to look at but also in the way it kind of deals with this relationship between these two people and how that you know the kind of the
00:50:21the action serves as a way of us understanding just relationships in general and how we are with the people and the balance of power And i'm certain it's a it's been influenced by in the mood for love Interesting Yeah you know it's just watching watching that the other
00:50:35just thought you know this is pete stricken must have seen that film at some point i don't think it's any way connected apart from the fact it is about the soft presentation of a relationship in a very cinematic way but also there is a sort of the undercurrents
00:50:49of off the dynamics between two people are central to the film yeah definitely so on interesting as well you know we will mention in the in the discussion in a moment about the themes on this theme of performative ity eyes something that we go to him particularly drawn
00:51:05to in terms of thie types of films that way we both enjoy on this is this is a big part of that year that's kind of the way we perform roles in society on how they i relate to you know to what might be termed the real person
00:51:19for one of a better phrase fantastic so have you got any other honorable mentions just before we finish off yeah i mean seimei timing ling's stray dogs was a film that i finally saw that i loved and obviously he was a we felt we feature one of his
00:51:33earlier films on the podcast on day we both liked a wire with bigger monsoon a cz well which was which i again i saw the beginning of the year but has been a really yeah it has stuck with me all through the years in a real sort of
00:51:47venture into poetic realism i think that you don't often see today yes oh that's that was our highlights of the year if there's any particular films that you think i mean the caveat to that is that we we haven't seen as much as we perhaps would have liked
00:52:01too but if there's any films that you think we should have included or you want to agree or disagree with us then get in touch with us by the usual means will give the wear on we're onto it at cinema atala gist will give their all of our
00:52:14details of how to contact the podcast at the end of the show Oh and just a just a very just a very quick caveat I haven't seen carol yeah i'm seeing it tonight so i'm sure that would feature highly I'm very very excited Um so people like wise
00:52:26you know mention that because i haven't seen it yet but i am seeing it tonight Yeah i'm going to go see carol thiss weekend I think so Let's move into the q and a with the audience after our screening off in the booth No people are still quite
00:53:04a bit exhausted Yeah amazing leads I just forgot how great they are Just amazing Toe look out Just you know salty of this off gestures and the movements of times it's just i just feel you know i just feel ill equipped to talk about it you know I
00:53:22mean i just feel like you know i started watching i've seen it a lot and fertile scene on the big screen since it since it came out and i feel exactly the same as it did the first time i was trying to think about what it's doing and
00:53:33and i just get sucked in and i'm just just numb you know it's so son this how this moment something when you just kind of like just go just do it just you know i mean you and it's just never gonna never gonna lay on there and it's
00:53:49just just just withholds constantly and it's so confident in the way with holds i remember it i never remember it nostalgically in the sense that it's much more restless visually in terms of when it cuts between things it's you know it is clearly infamous bio zoo in terms
00:54:06of composition and use of doors and windows and frames and but i just remember those faces and when i when i remember it i remember it Still i remember the stillness of its not its but they are still in stoic but it moves it doesn't move around more
00:54:20than i remember but take away that just that sadness and that kind of quiet and if we didn't gamble every time they have the repetition of the musical sequence and then the slo mo on every time it means something different And then it's just clever little tricks as
00:54:36well where for example you know they never show the the faces of the husband the wife and then this sequence we're totally on these guys back to the guys but back to the camera and it makes you think it's the husband and then they're doing this whole rehearsal
00:54:50thing which again is kind of kind of strange on dh there's a couple things on that one it's interesting that we you know kingsley who's here who's one of our cinema tolerance ts mentioned about the themes the other day and you know on the theme of performative ity
00:55:04is something that we we kind of drawn a lot in the kind of films were speaking in in that film as well There's the performance of being each other's spouse you know and just knowing the rehearsal but kind of being on the phone and yeah it's just it's
00:55:16so interesting that you know that they give themselves over to that performance you know rather than rather doing the other thing and everything else is a clear after i don't even know it's like you know everything else is ugly around all the other people going toe characters almost
00:55:30heightened in there so baroque nissen away just so it makes you know maggie chilling tony look absolutely incredible yeah i mean we were talking earlier about coolness and i said this is a cool film it is those faces there's a call for you know they are part of
00:55:45the environment but they're also completely separate from it and they're clearly photographed to be both in that onda completely apart from it and and some of those images just just like you know they're just perfect resting just absolutely perfect he he shoots clock's a lot but there's no
00:56:04sense of time what's the weather is like for example the husband of the wife for away for god knows how long they've written to martial arts novels and that time off articles and that you cannot administer it makes no sense in terms of time and then you know
00:56:16what happens at the end you know but it's it's internet dream state thing is that it's totally watching again you know you you i felt like this film is kind of almost always going on you know in a simulator dead of night which we you know that this
00:56:33is them constantly trying or human he's constantly trying to do it again and get a different result and when i watch it i want a different result and i know it's never going to come on that that's so powerful to me is that you you could watch this
00:56:45for one hundred times and he's going to play that back and that repetition of music on dh when it slows down he wants a different outcome and it's never going to be just like today they be an audience in dvd ending you know where they all want the
00:56:59big code Oh yeah and then obviously the thing about time at the end as well in terms of the child which is very fitting you know you're supposed to you're supposed to be uncertain of time because that's supposed to just hang in the air and it's you know
00:57:11and then it kind of just so let's turn over because i think people hopefully have nothing to say Would you like to make a comment or ask something he's gonna kick is one of the only comes hi um i basically want you mentioned something about this film giving
00:57:36an exotic vibe before i would personally like to know how what what are you saw in this film that gave you that i would be go far enough to say oriental arrived i think that i think there's always a danger when i mean we would talk discussing that
00:57:55in the context of it being rated as the twenty fourth best film ever made by by the sights and poor which is you know essentially assault group of western white critics who are who are naming these are the films that we that we think of the great source
00:58:08now why What is it about this film that makes it a great film on dh I think there's a case to be made that is there is something about the presentation ofthe nostalgia the romanticization of the era the two leads everything about that that heightens that sense off
00:58:28what it is a za film and perhaps i don't know whether it has that same residents in the culture but it's actually about does that does that kind of makes sense So maybe there's always a sense when you talk about that in terms of any foreign language film
00:58:43in in a sense what it's got subtitles there you don't pick up the kind of like cultural references you can't because you're not from that culture but does it Does it then heighten it in terms ofthe giving it some kind of aura that that that means something to
00:58:55a western I mean i don't know whether that's true or not but this it's something that you don't you don't always wanna kind of put projects up onto the film from your own position but there is the sense particularly for the music and the way that a way
00:59:08that he shoots tony leone particularly that it's looking out towards a western audience because that stuff is classic hollywood you know composition framing slow motion you know so which which feels very different to the kind off sendoff party world that that that kind of gets talked about you
00:59:26know you know even like chorus our wouldn't shoot people like that doesn't she have funny like that you know so that they're feels like there's something else going on that is yeah that is kind of exits exotic sizing and i think that it because it's about nostalgia and
00:59:43memory as well it's kind of it's is playing around with all that stuff but again it's that that's all reading of it because because of where we kind of sit and i don't think it's essentially kind of doing anything like almost problematic in the in the presentation but
01:00:03again you know it's just weather is kind of constructing the ideal of these characters in this world in a way that is aimed at a western a western ira western audience perhaps but i don't i don't know whether that's really casey so just following on from your comments
01:00:22them so do you think that if you were to reverse this film and set in a western culture it would have less appeal Well a tried that didn't with my three nights in a way so that the film was english language and it was very trying to use
01:00:36a lot of the troops and you know a similar kind of idea of unrequited love it's jude law's in that with norah jones and that report but yeah i think it's difficult because we live in a world where hollywood is dominant so we live in that in that
01:00:50kind of context where that the history of cinema is dominated essentially by the ways in which hollywood framed in position and created a narrative and idealize things in certain in certain kinds of ways So if you you can't kind of reverse that concept even if you reversed you
01:01:08know completely the way that the way a film is made because you don't see i mean there are influences of course if it particularly in japanese cinema that was very heavily influenced by american westerns for for example basic difficult question to answer but yeah i mean it's it's
01:01:22you know it's it's just it just feels that one of the great i love love stories yeah no you know both both within its own culture but also it definitely definitely seems to transcend it definitely seems theo rooted in something really primal and and i'm trying to think
01:01:44but it is what i'm trying to think of another film from that but i can't because this film is just overwhelming you know I can't i can't think of any problem apart from his face in the rain you know I just i can't i mean you know the
01:01:56rain is just like that was the martial arts with flying around on wires what was that truck to try again Dragon so that's a film that is accused of kind of being westernized or producing producing this ideal of off oriental history if you want to use that weird
01:02:13for a place with that kind of exotic nature of that and i wouldn't think that that film i wouldn't use that film was being mohr that way than this film too clearly but they absolutely loved the double meanings of everything in this film especially for the main fleet
01:02:31actress had dresses all the flowers on there to kind of show how in ascension is and how pure she is So andi then at the same time he kind of tries to go through this act to try to act through yeah being a mistress and it's it's something
01:02:49that kind of fights a lot against each other or the way how they speak because especially the way how especially when she gets told off and the lady literally tip just tells it like i've seen you going out a lot lately and the stubborn meaning behind it that
01:03:05we can't really catch because it's so bake in the chinese culture i enjoyed seeing that and makes you thinking twice about how much power the words have because they are not a lot of them most of it's just literally just their gods is at tiny movements which means
01:03:24so so much on that really impressed by how much you khun literally just pain with pictures instead of using words yeah i mean it's it's exquisite cinema isn't it really it's you know it is the words have meaning other than themselves you understand the meaning of the words
01:03:43based on the images that you've already seen and the way those images to put together the construction you know there's so many small moments of editing and you know on dh just kind of holding on a shot that just just just sits with you and then later on
01:03:56something has said that draws that moment back i mean it's just it's that cinema isn't it that's what that's what you kind of go for i think andi rain makes things happen you know is that it's like the rain came down and that means that that they met
01:04:09just the right time and there was something else happen later on it just changed things just incredible and then it was just talking about what you said those i don't if you notice that the beginning it was a moment where she asked he asked her what what her
01:04:23name was and she said my husband's name is jiao which is really something get it off my name's go so obviously playing around with the idea of the propriety of the marriage and everything that's closer she always plays with him so he always thinks he can make the
01:04:38next step and then she brought it brush them off again so this is like it should the whole film you're always like come on just give him a chance just once just go for it and and the costume was welling is saying about the flowers in that sense
01:04:52you know that she's tryingto trying to to be you know her heart's telling her to do something else and the way she looks in the present self it is almost kind of stopping her trying to help ourself stop stop doing that and i love the way there's no
01:05:06law there's no massive amount of reading it is that great scene in the motel where the screen just literally with red and like the phone can't take dampening it down and it just explodes just extraordinary i mean just you know on on the big screen just no being
01:05:25very academical just going wow it's a technical till it is yeah anyone else um so he said that you wonder if they're camera is designed to build a western audience on dh I wonder if it's kind of in a country that's hodge lots of different occupation in the
01:05:50last hundred years whether it's kind of a beautiful example of a pie brevity of coaches in a country that has maybe a national identity which is meaningless because that's a great point And i think what he's saying in nine sixty two is kind of telling us well you
01:06:06know and then it all ends with the kind of you know with the cambodian the cambodian bit and i think that that's yeah that kind of heredity is i think is is a great point you know particularly because it's what we talked about looking back into the past
01:06:20and kind of picking from different things in order to create this create this narrative on i think also the movie i mean you talk about sort of visual imagery of the clothes and the way that the characters are dressed and this kind of thing and actually reading about
01:06:35a lot that to do is is the director's kind of memory of leaving china and moving teo hong kong On dh you know because there were people who had to leave because of the cultural revolution and that these were the salt middle class people who did have money
01:06:47so they were but then they were moving into these apartments which were really run down and because you know there was no one else there was nowhere else to go so i think there's a very subtle on the lying sense off you know politics but also you know
01:06:59that that influence of the way of the cultures of kind of clashing with each other yeah and also i think you know it's interesting the way the film becomes quite stark on daylight at the very end when that that moment i asked you know so there is the
01:07:12nostalgia of his ended and she she moves in to be in that space and he comes back to that space but it's not the same space it's much more of a matter of fact space because that moment has gone i'm really really sorry done here so that's a
01:07:26great point yeah yeah yeah well i didn't think he keeps leaving halfway through his projects apparently he's really really difficult to work with so you keep half way through the director of photography goes solve this somehow in arm off from in somebody else could be stayed on that
01:07:43one today here thankfully okay things just wondered what you thought about so it's a film that keeps remind you you're in the cinema and there's a lovely moment the restaurant where there's the whip pants you for these lovely framing of shots on then this quite it's quite clunky
01:08:01and then later on you have the kind of planning cameron and out and it shows you the where the sets are on all those kind of things and we ordinarily that would break the magic of the romanticism of the movie and i like you neil i've got butterflies
01:08:13love fly is how i feel and it's quite difficult to talk about that i just thought what what what what did you think about that and how it just tells us is the audience you are watching a movie every now and again i think we mentioned this earlier
01:08:29didn't mean we were talking about what we're kind of like talking about what we're going to say stuff that there's the sense that it's but that's what cinema is this boy looks so many of us love cinema is that it's that that recreation of things or that that
01:08:42gateway into feelings that we can't really express or things you know so way have a relationship with it which is wait go into it but we're all were always aware that you know we know we're watching a movie and we take from that what we need a lot
01:08:55of the time and i think that it is a celebration off off off you know off our nostalgia for movies and i are on our love for going into a world that is has been created for that experience and he's clearly creating a world for a take her
01:09:10experience and i think he does that with those with those techniques you know throughout you know and just yeah just the whole way it's not you know you're watching something which is it's really quite playful visually you nowhere where the camera goes where it said how it moves
01:09:28yeah just the ideas of not showing the other characters and the bustle of the noise you know it's it's saying yeah you're watching a movie but way love movies don't mean you know we love movies for this reason because they make us feel epic love and you know
01:09:41incredibly vulnerable in the safety off the screen he has the safety of memory you know although it's painful for him and i thought you told me earlier that kind of massacre is um you know why don't why don't get watching this film It makes me feel actually juice
01:09:56you know i'm reduced on i keep going why do i keep going back for the experience You know why do we go back to watch these things when we know it's never going to change you know what there's a comfort in that you know it's more than just
01:10:09it's well shot and it's you know that there's there's just more to and that's where a bit quick because there's something in there i can't explain and that's what i love about i think it's also they're alluding to the the uncertainty in the kind of construction of life
01:10:21you know i think so the idea that yeah it's a film and we can see the construction and we can see that he's playing around with that panning and say yeah this is the director going you know but in a way all of the the performance of the
01:10:33characters in the way that that rehearsal takes place and the way that it's a dream like state didn't really care what has really gone on in various ways you know we think about our own memories you know the things that from our childhood that they're constructed by a
01:10:46fragments and we don't have a you know a documentary pick understanding of our past so you know i think it all just feeds into that idea of everything we experience is constructed in some in some way and then and again it's just undermining the idea that what we
01:11:00see on the screen then khun replicate representation can replicate reality because both of them are kind of uncertain but yeah yeah i think that's andi just thinking on that as well like the amount of times that he leaves shots just you know most people would come on he
01:11:18doesn't cut i mean i'll jump cooks as well but we want to you know interrupt something that seems to need to play out a little bit longer what you talking about then there was the reason you could get backto watches it isn't that to do with that pain
01:11:37is the thing that makes you feel most alive and is easy to deal with if it's slightly removed perhaps and that's why people watch these kind of films and like that experience um and the fbi and state yet the whip pan you talking about kings in the final
01:11:55one is is almost up from over the shoulders and the camera's headed for the door and then it's kicked off again so the cameras kind of comeback going alright there's unfinished business here which which is great because that is and i think my point i made last time
01:12:10i said something in a tenement ologists event is that idea the camera isn't isn't a passive observer on dh filmmakers like this who kind of try and get away from this nonsense of realism that a lot ofthe film is about is so phony and disingenuous but is the
01:12:30norm and you mentioned transcendence a few times neal the reason i think this film does transcend is because it's it feels of the dream state is communicate in the dream state and that's universal that the ideas of of romantic realism that kind of stuff that isn't universal And
01:12:49so although in some ways it is jarring and its unconventional to maybe two words of commercial audience actually it's the natural is much more the natural way off telling a story or or creating a mood Yeah i mean not much about things you know i think i think
01:13:06i think you're right you know it's a bit on the on the on the first point you made it's like why do people go watch horror movies to be scared Because it almost sort of externalize is the fear doesn't it in a way I suppose so maybe it
01:13:18is that kind of tragedy might be might be the same thing perhaps and it's a painful film but also let you say yeah it's kind of it's it's it doesn't couch that pain in kind of a comfortable visual style you know it is it is you know much
01:13:33it's urgent and abrasive on dh wants you to confront that you know i think that's yeah that's very true down here what you said about the dreamlike state i think that i really really liked it and i thought the performances were sublime i also feel that the lead
01:13:58females i i feel like her purity her devotion to her husband she's defined as her husband puts property and obviously that's very very circumstantial the sexism of the era that he's talking about i get that but i worry that so much of the romanticism of the film hinges
01:14:20on a fetishist fetishization that word off her her purity her devotion to her husband you know we're talking about you know the flowers on her dress but my god she is glamorous and she is sexy and i promise you she spent two hours in make up every morning
01:14:37getting getting that look ready for that male gaze for that camera that follows her bomb very closely You know she is gorgeous to look at on part of the part of the lust that we have for her as thie audience i believe rests on the fact that she
01:14:54is so glamorous and gorgeous and sexy to look out and beautiful and her face is exquisite but then she's also very pure she's devoted to her husband She doesn't i slightly worry about that What would the film be if she was the one who touched him the first
01:15:08time Well the film plays with that doesn't he kind of asked that question I think i think you're absolutely right what i think the film does very cleverly is that it it makes it so obvious that she would leave to cheat on her husband in one sense because
01:15:22it presents the husband and the wife has just completely moral philanderers So why doesn't she on why Why does it never go anywhere and that's what we're talking about here in terms of it's the social construction of the marriage and i don't have purity is the right word
01:15:37because i think that i think is much more going on with her you know And i think the film gives her the chance to to transgress in the context of off marriage at that time No you know what he said but what she chooses not to and i
01:15:52think that's where the sadness comes from it's because you're kind of saying it would be okay for you to do this So why no And then because if they feel never answers now but i think actually it's alluding to the fact also that they were not going to
01:16:04become what their partners have become So it's there if you know i think the purity is around the actor the actual notion of their love is being something that if they actually do got did get together they would just become what they're husband and wife had become Every
01:16:20time they're in the taxi together he touches her hand first that's the sort of first physical contact i think that we get in a close up so it's much more implied that he's sort of lee i could be wrong about that but that he's sort of leading i
01:16:33just think it's you know i think it rest very heavily on this side idea liv of her sexuality and stuff is a woman whereas when we get the his wife you know she says there is not here and then she just slams the door in her face took
01:16:51about the adulterous you know slamming the door in our lead woman's face is like it's a bit blunt for me as a woman i think may be watching it now in twenty fifteen which is not to take away the beauty of it you know the cinema's didn't you
01:17:05don't think that tony luna's shot i mean what is in the best of that when i was in the vest in the rain and it's smoking down do not think that is are equally as objectifying him i wish i had hair and smoke like that is going to
01:17:19you know is pure sin among i looked it is pure cinema and i love that she's beautiful i love that she's sexy and i'm just saying i think it's so much to do with i don't know i think it is i think it is but i think it's
01:17:34actually it's actually a dressing that notion in the film itself where is i think there are you know ninety percent of other films that are objectifying that their female protagonists are not actually addressing the process of doing it and also there he gets into her head and they
01:17:51are both apart from everyone else in that film visually you know and if we see it as something that he maybe he's remembering if we look at the ending is him recalling you know there's no way she looked like that every day in every situation that's how he
01:18:04remembers her on dh it's also how he remembers himself as immaculately teo on always kill it and always you know always smoking you know he's he's remembering himself was the hero of his own narrative at the same time as her is the heroine so it is unrealistic that
01:18:23she would look at it it's a very idealistic film because it was a massive missed opportunity and he's i think he makes her his memory maybe makes that do that do those things because he wants it to be you want to turn it and it is that nostalgic
01:18:38thing you know the relationship that got away is always perfect you know nothing we're not saying it's not from a masculine thank you yeah thank you anyone else wait okay well um yeah thank you very much coming out thank you for engaging with cinema ologists just like the
01:19:01links maybe you were just a quick thank you to marcus claire james for doing our sound thank you Thanks to everyone who download download the podcast and follows on social media were at www dot scimitar agis dot com on you can find us on itunes terms and on
01:19:21twitter and facebook please if you enjoyed it share through your networks on dh download the show yeah the show will be out in when i get my finger out and get it in a little while this time about two weeks time so there is an episode before to
01:19:37go out first and then this one yeah so yeah thanks for coming hope you enjoy the film and the evening and we'll see you again so yeah that was all really great discussion after the screening a cz you could tell i was a little bit lost for words
01:20:12particularly at the start it was a really emotional evening you know andi think a lot of the audience felt kind of blown away they hadn't seen it or you know for a lot people they're seeing it on the on the big screen for the first time what did
01:20:27what did you make of the you know that the reaction on down what was your kind of reaction to the evening i think that they the audience were kind of like a loss for words as well I mean you know don't get me wrong we have some fantastic
01:20:41comments and then i think actually when we got to the public iran there was sophomoric spla aeration of what the filmmakers i think it's really funny it's like one of those films i think people were taking time to process and there was so many people who contacted me
01:20:54afterwards andi the twitter feed to say i had so much to say like an hour later because people would just sort of trying to process what what what they've just seen and it's interesting because i read the article by peter walker in the guardian who compares it to
01:21:09a film like a single man which i think is a good comparison because it's a film that there is a criticism of the film but it's just style over substance but i just don't understand that at all and and perhaps it's a sort of it's one of the
01:21:24lazy criticisms you here quite a lot about cinema or aimed films that just look amazing but but films should look amazing you know I mean on the way that it looks amazing is that actually presents quite a baroque landscaped with this sort of apartment Block and it's it's
01:21:41shot you know the dirt in the filth of the place is shot on the day today grumblings of the older characters are all up there on screen and what that does perfectly frames the beauty of the two central characters on the show the salt connection that they have
01:21:58within this ugly day today realist world and every time he stops to make these very cinematic aesthetic very very beautiful presentations let's say off the two characters i think that that is you know you have to read that as evocations of their inner feelings you know And it
01:22:19is following the way that they're looking each other but i think it's also really trying to focus in on how they are internally processing their their feelings at any given moment Yeah i think if you can't see that there is a visual discrepancy between the urban location and
01:22:38there's a ll the other characters and these two people then you are kind of missing a very very key element off it and i think that it's absolutely fair when i was talking to people in pub afterward too absolutely feel about the film that it just annoys them
01:22:53you know because they can't they just think just just get on with it and just do it and i think that so much of the film is what you what you bring to it and your your sensibility and your perspective and also your experience of off similar situations
01:23:07and i think that reading it in that way is that is absolutely valid but i think saying that it's it's not it hasn't got anything to say or it isn't doing anything beyond being a beautiful film is is missing is missing so much of what it is doing
01:23:23on i think there are a billion films which which look wonderful but have nothing to say and there's clearly in the cinematic language of this film on the way it presents those characters against the backdrop the way edits the use of music just the composition use of color
01:23:42there's clearly there's clearly something deep in its heart is trying to say absolutely right and i think it's the the possibilities of defining what love is through this film almost kind of endless really andi i think that the problem with that reading that you've just alluded to that
01:23:58people have made well people you know why don't they just get on with it They're together i mean there's a reading to be made that says she's she is in love with her husband and that's why she doesn't sleep with the guy who she's sexually attracted to you
01:24:11know i mean and that that's the definition of love that people that people have all people are defined by all over the world everywhere that you know they were in love with someone on their committed to them on dh that really hasn't got anything to do with the
01:24:26kind of desire and lust and sort of momentary aesthetic pleasure and beauty you can get in another person and i think also you know talking to one of our colleagues marry afterwards is really interesting because you know she gave this almost oppositional reading but actually that could have
01:24:41been the intentional reading off the fact that they did get together but it just wasn't seen and the and the whole soft timeline at the end of the film is actually if you watch it back again is an exploration of how that relationship ended up and i don't
01:24:54want it again i know we were discussing the ending of the film with the child and who who's we assume or i think there is an inn an implication that the child is hers and her husband but it very possibly that might not be the case i think
01:25:08it's a it's a deliberate blurring of the lines to allow several readings off the film based on based on the audience you know and terrence davis this week on the film program was talking about the role of the audience in watching a film which you know something we
01:25:23talked about a lot and i think in this film and what was great about the discussion was that the audience understand they have a role to play and i think what's great is even the readings which see as they should just do this that's still the audience engaging
01:25:37with it andi understanding what is trying to do and just disagreeing with it which is absolutely fine and not just dismissing it as being a bit of kind of nice looking fluff i think that so much of the film you know so much of one car wai's films
01:25:50are beautiful on dh that that's a way of understanding the characters and the emotions of the characters and situations of the characters that the films are the films are about it seems that's that's just one of his devices for communicating character which is why i think that you
01:26:09know we should have mentioned it in the in the discussion where something that the grandmaster doesn't feel as as coherent you know a cz over some say good good the wrong word but a strong as asses previous work because there seems to be a real disconnect between the
01:26:25look of the film and the characters in a way that things like you know chungking express don't andi office in the middle of don't don't have yeah it's interesting you say that because i just watched twenty forty six again last night on dh you know we were having
01:26:39a discussion before where they're excited i remember really rating twenty forty six put it but having watched it again isn't the satisfying is in the mood for love on it pushes the abstractions of narrative memory past their breaking point whereas i think that in the mood for love
01:26:53just keeps it inside that the idea ofthe yet we're still connected to this story in these characters it doesn't solve break that with over abstraction i think even though allows you particularly with the ending which you know we could do a whole podcast on that that the last
01:27:09fifteen minutes about what that actually means because you know it's it's is so sort off taking complete tagine towards the end of the film i think again that's something that the viewers who are looking for a classical ending perhaps struggle with yeah yeah totally yeah and something back
01:27:27in the mood for love feels like his last really really great movie for me you know the last and it i think it's his best film and it feels like the film where all all of his technique and all of his ambition in terms of the kind of
01:27:42story is trying to tell them we're going to tell them kind of just cohere into what you know you rightly described as a there's a kind of modern classic in ways that bits of his other read about his films since then have have got close to but never
01:27:55never is as completely as they do here cool so that will just about do it for our last episode ofthe senate pathologist podcast off this year's into season two are we doing seasons in just coming signing with the semester's is that how we're going to do it It
01:28:12seems to be falling that way that's cool but we do have already we have the plans for next year we are going to be doing screenings now hastings on a regular basis we have a partnership with the electric palace cinema in hastings on you're coming up for the
01:28:29first screening in january which is going to be the trial orson welles is calf adaptation yet a film that we both wanted to screen for a long long time a long long time we have been doing this a year but since the start it was on our initial
01:28:45list it's a film we both love and yes so we're going to kind of hopefully build on orson welles special with an interview that were lining up which were which were quite excited about on dh yeah i'm looking forward to come into the electric palace tio to screen
01:29:02that with you we haven't made any plans down here in falmouth in terms of what we're going to screen but yeah kind of it's been it's been a really good it's been really kind of really tough semester in terms of screenings on dh i'm really pleased that we'll
01:29:18be able to have them into different places on a regular basis because i think that as the second episode shows you know that the more the podcast grows with other contributors and other voices the better it'll be so yeah absolutely and yeah we'll definitely have to sit down
01:29:34have a discussion about what what we're goingto screen at your end if i can use that phrase but you also look out for hopefully we are hoping to have a bonus episode over the christmas new year period so you look out for that cross promise anything but we'll
01:29:50definitely try and get that together but until next year have a good christmas to all our listeners on dh we'll see you very soon yes merry christmas everyone thanks dario for a great year of scimitar agis ts activity yeah thank you kneel and we're looking forward to continuing
01:30:08next year so until next time this has been a cinema tolerates production thanks to our families and hasting student production crews for more information about music licenses future screenings and archived episodes please go to cinema atala gist dot com you can download the podcast on itunes and stitcher
01:30:25and if you do visit those sites a five star review and rating will be very much appreciated providing you enjoy the show off way really enjoy getting your questions and comments either on twitter at cinema atala gist or on our facebook page at facebook dot com slash said
01:30:39dermatologists then of course you're old school and what to email us It is cinema tahl Agis ts at gmail dot com We really appreciate it when list to share the podcast on social media so we'd like to encourage everyone to get the word out on our networks on
01:30:52your network So until next time this has been the same astrologist podcast Thanks for listening Way is the widest and tallest way

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