Full Transcript for Supporting a Struggling Spouse, Honoring Different Values, and Parenting Without a Blueprint (Q+R)

that your spouse needs to do, or the stuff that your spouse is facing, because there is in a marriage, there and in any close relationships. 04:57.629 --> 05:02.333 [SPEAKER_00]: If somebody close to you is experiencing something like debilitating anxiety, 05:03.093 --> 05:07.677 [SPEAKER_00]: or constantly getting triggered because of stuff that happened in their past. 05:08.918 --> 05:16.924 [SPEAKER_00]: There is a really real component of needing to just be present and support and to help that person through. 05:17.805 --> 05:26.712 [SPEAKER_00]: But in the long haul of it, that importance of doing your own work so that you can be okay even when they're not okay. 05:49.988 --> 06:14.755 [SPEAKER_01]: You know, you were saying, if the healthier spouse can hide behind the unhealthy other one, what, like, say more about that because I think that is actually the sneakier side of all of this that I know we've talked about a lot where if mine was more obvious, if my unhealthy or my process or where I'm at in my journey of healing is just more out there in the sense like, well, he's got a lot to work through. 06:16.716 --> 06:17.596 [SPEAKER_01]: same more about that. 06:17.656 --> 06:24.739 [SPEAKER_01]: What does it look like for you at times to hide behind that unhealthy health of someone else and not to your own work? 06:25.180 --> 06:28.221 [SPEAKER_01]: Because again, I think it answers and responds to this question very well. 06:29.642 --> 06:43.088 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean, I'll get real specific about what can be my tendency is to handle things patiently and calmly at first and then 06:45.000 --> 06:56.808 [SPEAKER_00]: if you proceed in getting more triggered, more of the responses I know you don't want to have, but come out, and then I respond really poorly in anger. 06:58.189 --> 07:06.515 [SPEAKER_00]: And I can unconsciously, and sometimes consciously give myself the narrative, well, I would have been just fine. 07:06.575 --> 07:12.500 [SPEAKER_00]: I would have continued to respond well if he had not been so disregulated. 07:12.720 --> 07:20.586 [SPEAKER_00]: If he had backed off when I responded well, or received what I said, because I said it gently, the first five times I said it. 07:21.647 --> 07:33.694 [SPEAKER_00]: I can hide behind, well, if you had responded better or well, then I would have remained responding well. 07:34.175 --> 07:35.356 [SPEAKER_00]: That makes sense? 07:36.616 --> 07:42.080 [SPEAKER_00]: Instead of, and this is the tricky thing, is that's true. 07:43.563 --> 07:50.347 [SPEAKER_00]: But I am also responsible for what comes out of me when I get triggered because you got triggered. 07:51.747 --> 08:00.552 [SPEAKER_00]: And that's been the work that I've been doing with my therapist is is I told her I want to get to a place where I'm okay when he's not okay. 08:01.272 --> 08:05.875 [SPEAKER_00]: Meaning I can stay calm and regulate it and be present to you. 08:07.242 --> 08:16.311 [SPEAKER_00]: without taking everything personal, without getting defensive, without with with truly stepping into compassion and understanding what's happening for you. 08:16.331 --> 08:17.693 [SPEAKER_00]: And I will say this so. 08:19.098 --> 08:36.202 [SPEAKER_00]: That is in the context of when you've come down when your nervous system is back calm, when you've spent time with Jesus, when you've gone on a walk, you are always coming back and acknowledging what happened, not passing blame, not reframing. 08:38.123 --> 08:43.324 [SPEAKER_00]: And that makes that even more accessible, I guess, I could say. 08:44.324 --> 09:00.263 [SPEAKER_00]: And so I also know there are situations in marriage where one spouse, their anxiety is running the show and it's looking like control and anger and or their trauma is running the show and there's no acknowledgement of it. 09:01.044 --> 09:03.607 [SPEAKER_00]: That is a harder road to walk. 09:04.488 --> 09:25.322 [SPEAKER_00]: and I know that there are so many listening that that is the case where maybe your spouse is actually trying to make you responsible for their struggles and separating yourself from that while still holding compassion, like Scripture's talk about, put on compassion at something we choose, it's not something we feel all the time. 09:25.902 --> 09:27.083 [SPEAKER_00]: sometimes we feel compassionate. 09:27.204 --> 09:37.055 [SPEAKER_00]: Oftentimes we choose to be compassionate towards somebody who is hurt and is therefore hurting others or has been hurt and is therefore incredibly anxious. 09:38.737 --> 09:40.398 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I think there's a lot. 09:40.539 --> 09:44.263 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm not going to risk, I think you said so many wonderful things there and I think 09:44.603 --> 09:46.505 [SPEAKER_01]: that start doing your own work. 09:46.545 --> 09:49.927 [SPEAKER_01]: That's the biggest, I mean, the biggest takeaways you've got to start doing your work. 09:49.967 --> 09:53.810 [SPEAKER_01]: There's obviously more big takeaways in that, but owning it yourself, that dynamic. 09:53.830 --> 09:55.231 [SPEAKER_01]: And again, that's our dynamic. 09:55.251 --> 09:59.194 [SPEAKER_01]: You can't take from what you can learn from that. 09:59.315 --> 10:03.258 [SPEAKER_01]: So don't just, you know, immediately say it has to look exactly like that. 10:03.298 --> 10:08.041 [SPEAKER_01]: But here's an interesting other one on marriage for sure. 10:08.061 --> 10:11.724 [SPEAKER_01]: How do I stay myself while honoring a spouse who value 10:14.557 --> 10:20.362 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know anything to say about that, but you probably have a lot to say about that. 10:20.782 --> 10:23.805 [SPEAKER_01]: How do you stay yourself while honoring a spouse who values struct one of you? 10:24.426 --> 10:28.749 [SPEAKER_01]: I think it's a good choice of words whether you meant to use it or not, a value. 10:28.949 --> 10:36.156 [SPEAKER_01]: Like structure is good, order is good, cleanliness is good. 10:37.137 -->

10:38.378 [SPEAKER_01]: being on time is good. 10:38.458 --> 10:54.032 [SPEAKER_01]: All of these things are good and certain people not only value those things more, but are like naturally capable and have all of the tools to be able to be consistent with that all the time I follow through. 10:54.833 --> 11:05.266 [SPEAKER_01]: Now, do not hear me to say that there's some people that have that skill in some people that don't, and I'm not saying you can't learn that skill, I'm not saying you can't learn how to be more of all of those things. 11:06.088 --> 11:07.109 [SPEAKER_01]: Let me just be fair though. 11:07.189 --> 11:12.035 [SPEAKER_01]: There are whole groups of different types of people who have different brains. 11:12.816 --> 11:18.760 [SPEAKER_01]: that are not always efficient, productive, on-time, and they're creative, and they have different strengths. 11:19.380 --> 11:37.251 [SPEAKER_01]: What usually happens is those two types marry each other, and then they try to destroy each other for being different, and are constantly either mad at the person for being different, or having some false ideal idea that it's just as simple as trying, and you're not trying, and therefore you don't care, you don't love and all whatever. 11:37.851 --> 11:40.054 [SPEAKER_01]: Now, some of that is, again, this is tension. 11:40.074 --> 11:42.857 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm not going to give you like, there's no pass on either side on this one. 11:42.877 --> 11:45.299 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm just trying to say, that's the stage. 11:46.120 --> 11:52.747 [SPEAKER_01]: I think it's learning where are you weak, where can you actually make changes and then how do you change? 11:53.608 --> 11:55.669 [SPEAKER_01]: All that said, how do you stay yourself? 11:56.189 --> 11:57.950 [SPEAKER_01]: I think it's similar to what you said. 11:57.970 --> 11:59.051 [SPEAKER_01]: You've got to learn yourself. 11:59.171 --> 12:02.072 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, are you timeline because you have ADHD? 12:02.092 --> 12:05.934 [SPEAKER_01]: You've never taken time to like address that, talk about it, have space for it. 12:05.974 --> 12:10.376 [SPEAKER_01]: So you literally hope that you're gonna have time for all this stuff and you just never do. 12:11.937 --> 12:17.019 [SPEAKER_01]: Have you ever tried to create order and stick to it? 12:17.460 --> 12:19.100 [SPEAKER_01]: Instead of just saying, I'm not an orderly person. 12:19.120 --> 12:22.322 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, again, I think it's you starting to be honest about your own stuff. 12:23.022 --> 12:25.064 [SPEAKER_01]: But how do you stay yourself? 12:25.124 --> 12:27.366 [SPEAKER_01]: I think that you have to talk about it a lot. 12:27.386 --> 12:29.107 [SPEAKER_01]: I think it's understanding empathy. 12:29.147 --> 12:42.358 [SPEAKER_01]: Like my kids, the joke around our house, and this wasn't even, I didn't even start learning about more of this until, you know, we did a whole episode of learning about me learning about having ADHD and where that shows up in my life. 12:42.418 --> 12:46.020 [SPEAKER_01]: One of them is like, I, time blindness is not an excuse. 12:46.101 --> 12:47.321 [SPEAKER_01]: I still have to be places on time. 12:48.062 --> 12:55.609 [SPEAKER_01]: that said, I am very prone to time blindness in the sense of saying, I think that I can accomplish way more in a certain amount of time than I actually can. 12:56.169 --> 13:01.694 [SPEAKER_01]: And for whatever reason, that is a pretty consistent thing that happens with me where I will always tell myself, I can do that. 13:01.774 --> 13:06.879 [SPEAKER_01]: Like I have time for that and that and that and so my kids have learned to graciously be like, 13:11.383 --> 13:12.544 [SPEAKER_01]: get in the shower by this time. 13:12.684 --> 13:25.810 [SPEAKER_00]: Like they start they start suggesting like are you going to be ready on time because you know what time you know it's just precious but it's also very someone explaining time blindness with ADHD and they they described it like if you have to be somewhere 13:28.445 --> 13:31.987 [SPEAKER_00]: you're not, you don't get ready until it's eight. 13:32.667 --> 13:35.008 [SPEAKER_00]: It's not a problem until it's eight. 13:35.028 --> 13:36.189 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not, no, I'm not saying that's you. 13:36.569 --> 13:44.012 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm saying that's like an example of like, it's not, somebody else might be like, why are you sitting on the couch at 745? 13:44.433 --> 13:48.414 [SPEAKER_00]: It's like urgent to somebody else, but to you, it's not urgent until it's actually eight. 13:48.615 --> 13:51.256 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, oh my gosh, and now how do you get ready and now how do you do these things? 13:56.557 --> 13:57.918 [SPEAKER_01]: I know how to be on time. 13:58.478 --> 14:02.280 [SPEAKER_01]: And I know that there's certain times where I'll have to be, I really have to make sure I'm on time for this. 14:02.300 --> 14:11.824 [SPEAKER_01]: What's interesting though, is I really have to do a lot, a lot of work of reminding myself constantly that this thing is something I cannot be late for. 14:11.884 --> 14:16.947 [SPEAKER_01]: Now, arguably certain types are hearing this going, you can never be late for anything. 14:17.267 --> 14:24.210 [SPEAKER_01]: It shows that you don't care for people and they use it as a shame narrative and I just want to say chill out, like slow your role, slow your judgment. 14:25.410 --> 14:30.074 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, I agree that when you agree to a meeting in your late, it does disrespect someone's time. 14:30.134 --> 14:38.401 [SPEAKER_01]: I also think there are certain things that are okay, that aren't like so tight, and I see your face, I hear everyone's mistakes. 14:39.061 --> 14:44.166 [SPEAKER_01]: The point being, like we just have to remember that I have to do my work. 14:44.806 --> 14:51.151 [SPEAKER_01]: and the structure that you have, you are more structured and desire more structure and I'll say this, need more structure than I

do. 14:51.691 --> 14:55.954 [SPEAKER_01]: Too much structure is constructive to me and feels suffocating. 14:56.534 --> 14:58.636 [SPEAKER_01]: Structure to you feels safe and expanding. 14:59.416 --> 15:06.121 [SPEAKER_01]: And so it's not too demonize you for having that need, just like it's not your just demonize me for not having that need. 15:06.702 --> 15:10.844 [SPEAKER_01]: It's trying to figure out, okay, like the house being in this type of order helps you. 15:11.665 --> 15:12.245 [SPEAKER_01]: where can I help? 15:12.365 --> 15:15.186 [SPEAKER_01]: Where can I get help for the things I can't make up for whatever the thing is? 15:15.766 --> 15:22.927 [SPEAKER_01]: I think it's just understanding like you can have structure in order, but it can't, but you're not going to get all your preferences. 15:23.487 --> 15:25.188 [SPEAKER_01]: And I'm not going to get all my preferences. 15:25.468 --> 15:27.368 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's actually good for me. 15:27.568 --> 15:28.328 [SPEAKER_01]: It's good for you. 15:29.108 --> 15:37.150 [SPEAKER_01]: If your orderliness was fully encouraged to go to its extent, oh yeah. 15:37.590 --> 15:48.818 [SPEAKER_01]: It could honestly, it would do damage to you, to our family structure, to our kids, just like me and my desire to have freedom would literally undo hurt and damage. 15:49.378 --> 15:52.580 [SPEAKER_01]: So that's where we come together and go like, I need more of your order. 15:53.421 --> 15:55.562 [SPEAKER_01]: And I think this is where we balance each other out a lot. 15:55.582 --> 15:58.084 [SPEAKER_01]: It's like, you need more, you need less structure. 15:58.104 --> 16:01.426 [SPEAKER_01]: And I come in and often, I'm like, okay, this one, are we going to die? 16:01.466 --> 16:03.087 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know if that's the hill to die on this one. 16:04.068 --> 16:06.749 [SPEAKER_01]: And so anyway, I'm just painting that to say, how do you do it? 16:06.789 --> 16:07.569 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, it's a dance. 16:07.629 --> 16:08.730 [SPEAKER_01]: It's a communication. 16:08.910 --> 16:12.091 [SPEAKER_01]: It's honoring who God's made you and then communicating about that. 16:12.351 --> 16:17.293 [SPEAKER_01]: And then having your spouse like hopefully understand that your differences are not bad. 16:18.473 --> 16:21.374 [SPEAKER_01]: There's something that are important that's why they married you. 16:21.494 --> 16:21.614 [SPEAKER_01]: But 16:23.143 --> 16:35.055 [SPEAKER_01]: Sameness in that sense is not always even good and it's not even the goal like it's not your job to change your spouse to make them do your worst things that you want and it's Those are my thoughts. 16:35.875 --> 16:36.816 [SPEAKER_01]: Talk a lot beyond us. 16:37.717 --> 16:41.561 [SPEAKER_00]: No, I just think I mean, you already said it all, but 16:44.373 --> 16:56.171 [SPEAKER_00]: It's, I think it's so important, especially with things that are like non, non-gospital issues, non, like, not talking about a sin issue.

16:56.351 --> 16:58.495 [SPEAKER_00]: Now obviously there's like a fine line between 17:00.857 --> 17:14.389 [SPEAKER_00]: being responsible, making sure that you are getting work done, that you're showing up to work on time, like that the lack of structure is not causing a detriment to provision 17:26.178 --> 17:40.861 [SPEAKER_00]: And this could apply in a lot of different areas, not just one is structured one is not be able to recognize it is not bad to not need like the fact that you don't need the regimented structure that I need to flourish. 17:41.662 --> 17:51.824 [SPEAKER_00]: is not because you are less than, and it's a bad thing, and because I need structure and order or thrive in it, doesn't mean that I'm bad. 17:51.904 --> 17:53.125 [SPEAKER_00]: We're just different. 17:54.125 --> 18:03.087 [SPEAKER_00]: And when we can just honor each other's differences, be honest and communicate about where those differences create tension and are hard for each other. 18:03.847 --> 18:23.994 [SPEAKER_00]: And where do we need to, where do I need to move towards you in loosening up and where do you need to move towards me to to recognize what I need to flourish and vice versa, like that that is what one this looks like that is what mutually submitting to each other serving each other laying our lives down for each other. 18:24.554 --> 18:25.675 [SPEAKER_00]: That's what that looks like. 18:26.415 --> 18:35.477 [SPEAKER_00]: And so I think it's just so important that we're aware of if we've developed some sort of framework of demonizing our spouse because of their differences because it doesn't look like us. 18:36.197 --> 18:39.518 [SPEAKER_00]: And really ask ourselves, is that a moral issue? 18:40.278 --> 18:47.400 [SPEAKER_00]: Is that actually a character issue or is it just a difference that maybe annoys me because I need something different? 18:48.860 --> 18:54.622 [SPEAKER_00]: I think it's important that we make those distinction that are not just put it in the character issue or the a moral issue 18:57.763 --> 18:59.285 [SPEAKER_01]: Let's move to parenting questions. 18:59.986 --> 19:00.186 [SPEAKER_01]: Okay. 19:00.206 --> 19:06.352 [SPEAKER_01]: How do you balance parenting a young child and having to parent a church at the same time? 19:08.256 --> 19:13.479 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm sure the people you pass or would love to be know that you feel like they are your children. 19:13.980 --> 19:14.680 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, they are. 19:15.240 --> 19:16.281 [SPEAKER_01]: No, no, no. 19:16.321 --> 19:17.702 [SPEAKER_00]: Pasturing is a lot of parenting. 19:18.182 --> 19:22.424 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, yes, but obviously certain people handle that well, that I do some people don't. 19:22.964 --> 19:26.106 [SPEAKER_01]: How do you balance that? 19:26.906 --> 19:28.447 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, I think you're asking them on question. 19:28.627 --> 19:29.788 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think you do balance it. 19:29.828 --> 19:36.532 [SPEAKER_01]: I think one of the things

you have to remember about life is it starts with values and priorities. 19:37.432 --> 19:51.673 [SPEAKER_01]: There's going to be times when work is going to require something that's going to take from you and your family and there's times when family needs to actually be far more important than what you're doing at work. 19:52.454 --> 19:55.135 [SPEAKER_01]: And that idea that they are going to line up perfectly. 19:55.215 --> 19:57.135 [SPEAKER_01]: You're just going to have time for this and have time for that. 19:57.235 --> 20:01.237 [SPEAKER_01]: It's the false goal that does not exist in our life. 20:02.097 --> 20:07.759 [SPEAKER_01]: It is a dance a weekly one daily one at times of what does our family need? 20:08.319 --> 20:09.799 [SPEAKER_01]: What does work need? 20:09.839 --> 20:11.280 [SPEAKER_01]: What is calling vocation all that? 20:11.380 --> 20:12.440 [SPEAKER_01]: We're talking about ministry. 20:12.540 --> 20:14.781 [SPEAKER_01]: Ministry is a can be. 20:14.801 --> 20:18.582 [SPEAKER_01]: If you don't have good guardrails and all consuming, overwhelming nonstop. 20:19.382 --> 20:19.942 [SPEAKER_01]: life suck. 20:20.002 --> 20:21.623 [SPEAKER_01]: It could literally take you over. 20:21.683 --> 20:34.650 [SPEAKER_01]: So I think don't ask the question and as soon balance, I would say the better thing to do, something that I know we do is looking over the course of a month or the course of a week, who's getting more of your time? 20:35.331 --> 20:44.655 [SPEAKER_01]: If you have five nights out a week at church and all day Sundays and you are saying yes to every meeting and you get home and you are like completely done. 20:45.776 --> 20:46.556 [SPEAKER_01]: That's a problem. 20:46.856 --> 20:49.737 [SPEAKER_01]: That's exclusively work and not your family. 20:49.757 --> 20:53.077 [SPEAKER_01]: You are basically robbing from one and giving to another another. 20:54.558 --> 21:00.779 [SPEAKER_01]: But at the same time, there's that other end of it where it's like, well, some weeks are going to be like that. 21:00.819 --> 21:02.199 [SPEAKER_01]: But not all the weeks should be like that. 21:02.239 --> 21:03.219 [SPEAKER_01]: There's seasons to that. 21:03.619 --> 21:04.960 [SPEAKER_01]: There's moments, there's weeks. 21:05.060 --> 21:05.300 [SPEAKER_01]: You know? 21:05.320 --> 21:11.041 [SPEAKER_01]: And so I think he's looking at your life and asking the deeper question, at the end of the day, your family needs more of you 21:12.661 --> 21:19.286 [SPEAKER_01]: and what rhythms can you build to make sure that, hey, I'm only out this spending nights a week as a way to just preserve time with the kids. 21:19.706 --> 21:24.070 [SPEAKER_01]: Now, does that mean you can never do something if on one of those nights if the church needs it? 21:24.150 --> 21:25.070 [SPEAKER_01]: No, you totally can't. 21:25.110 --> 21:35.218 [SPEAKER_01]: But have the the natural order of things when things aren't busy or chaotic to have a balance in that sense of what your family needs and what the church needs. 21:35.698 --> 21:45.565 [SPEAKER_01]: But again, looking for true balance all the time, it does, it just doesn't exist because families like right now, I'm about like, we're at the stage where you're about to have back surgery. 21:46.105 --> 21:49.128 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to be out for like a month on medical leave. 21:49.168 --> 21:55.112 [SPEAKER_01]: So like, I don't know, like the family is completely taking the front seat and anything with work related is going to be with our team. 21:55.152 --> 21:57.714 [SPEAKER_01]: And so, I mean, that's not balanced. 21:58.354 --> 21:59.135 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's not even the goal. 21:59.215 --> 22:00.155 [SPEAKER_01]: It's like right now 22:02.577 --> 22:15.771 [SPEAKER_01]: Therefore, family is getting all of me, works getting none of me, and that's our situation, that's our setup, that's our, because of the work we do, because of work I do, and my role, like I have that ability with our team, but we've been preparing like... 22:15.891 --> 22:16.051 [SPEAKER_01]: I agree. 22:16.612 --> 22:18.414 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, but not impossible at all. 22:18.474 --> 22:23.920 [SPEAKER_01]: Like if you, but let me say, I've been building the team for the last year, the last six months exclusively, 22:25.280 --> 22:41.925 [SPEAKER_01]: Not necessarily because I knew back surgery was coming but because that was what we were doing anyway So everything wasn't hyper-dependent upon me if that's a bad model anyway and there's seasons for that and we've had that, but Yeah, I would just say Don't try to strike true down the middle balance. 22:42.125 --> 22:44.866 [SPEAKER_01]: It looks like some days and weeks are gonna be more family. 22:44.886 --> 22:53.448 [SPEAKER_01]: Some is more Ministry but at the end at the end of the day, make sure that you are prioritizing Your responsibility with your family and 22:54.613 --> 22:55.034 [SPEAKER_01]: Any thoughts? 22:55.674 --> 22:56.694 [SPEAKER_00]: No, I think that's good. 22:57.735 --> 22:57.975 [UNKNOWN]: Wow. 22:58.875 --> 22:59.136 [SPEAKER_01]: Really? 22:59.816 --> 23:00.336 [SPEAKER_01]: It's amazing. 23:01.036 --> 23:01.757 [SPEAKER_01]: Another parenting one. 23:02.297 --> 23:05.379 [SPEAKER_01]: I just like when you compliment me, thank you. 23:07.720 --> 23:12.422 [SPEAKER_01]: How do you parent well when you didn't have healthy examples growing up? 23:16.624 --> 23:18.945 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, you had more healthy examples growing up. 23:20.665 --> 23:29.415 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I want to broaden this question out because I think there's so many listening who that is their story. 23:29.875 --> 23:38.504 [SPEAKER_00]: They are parenting in a way that they were not parented and they know what they want to do different but they have no models for what that looks like. 23:39.105 --> 23:48.032 [SPEAKER_00]: and they have a nervous system and procedural memory that would cause them to naturally parent

the way they were parented. 23:48.292 --> 23:49.273 [SPEAKER_00]: And that's very real. 23:49.373 --> 23:49.833 [SPEAKER_00]: That's what I mean. 23:49.853 --> 23:50.814 [SPEAKER_00]: You're doing something wrong. 23:52.035 --> 23:53.276 [SPEAKER_00]: And that is hard. 23:54.057 --> 23:57.699 [SPEAKER_00]: So Brooke will have a lot to to speak to about that. 23:58.000 --> 24:00.101 [SPEAKER_00]: What I want to broaden out is that 24:01.442 --> 24:11.545 [SPEAKER_00]: all of us are parenting our kids in a very different time than that which we were raised in and at least I'll speak for our generation. 24:12.385 --> 24:16.186 [SPEAKER_00]: We were not raised with technology in the way that it is now. 24:16.706 --> 24:21.047 [SPEAKER_00]: At all, we did a whole episode on this of how much culture has shifted and how quickly 24:21.987 --> 24:27.831 [SPEAKER_00]: Um, so you are going to have even if you did have a great family and there's things you want to repeat. 24:28.071 --> 24:30.633 [SPEAKER_00]: There is going to be procedural memory stuff in you. 24:31.233 --> 24:47.124 [SPEAKER_00]: As you now parent the anxious generation, you now have to navigate all the digital worlds, all of social media, all of all of how that has shaped the friends your kids are going to have, the schools that they're going to all of it. 24:47.804 --> 24:48.024 [SPEAKER_00]: So, 24:49.325 --> 25:13.372 [SPEAKER_00]: That in a similar way is like parent wanting to parent very differently than how you were raised, there's wanting to parent differently than how you're raised and then there's so many of us that are having to but still have a similar procedural memory of a way it was now a way it needs to be that may look different or like in our case parenting kids with 25:16.453 --> 25:18.055 [SPEAKER_00]: it has to look different. 25:18.676 --> 25:35.373 [SPEAKER_00]: But my natural inclination is to do it how I was raised where it wasn't tailored to disabilities or so in that sense you're saying that even you who had healthy examples growing up are still trying to parent well. 25:36.873 --> 25:38.834 [SPEAKER_01]: in a new landscape that. 25:38.994 --> 25:39.714 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, different. 25:39.834 --> 25:44.816 [SPEAKER_01]: That doesn't have all of the things that it had when you know, culture didn't have a lot of the stuff. 25:45.096 --> 25:45.296 [SPEAKER_01]: Right. 25:45.316 --> 25:45.576 [SPEAKER_01]: So yeah. 25:45.857 --> 25:46.937 [SPEAKER_01]: So you're saying the same thing. 25:47.457 --> 25:55.260 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, just don't just don't just apply it to like parenting directly or we're raising kids in a family. 25:55.280 --> 25:56.841 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah, raising our kids in a different culture. 25:57.241 --> 25:58.742 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, I mean, how do you do it? 25:58.762 --> 25:59.663 [SPEAKER_01]: I think you already said it. 25:59.703 --> 26:06.607 [SPEAKER_01]: You said the word, but I'll just to briefly clarify what you said is you have to

have models. 26:06.647 --> 26:08.709 [SPEAKER_01]: You have to know, well, what does it even look like? 26:09.449 --> 26:16.634 [SPEAKER_01]: So many people that I know, you including, that asked this question are listening, you have a desire to be a good parent. 26:16.834 --> 26:19.215 [SPEAKER_01]: It's not that you don't have the desire or the heart. 26:19.295 --> 26:20.596 [SPEAKER_01]: You just don't have the models. 26:20.816 --> 26:24.059 [SPEAKER_01]: And so you're asking questions like, well, when they bite their sibling, 26:24.899 --> 26:25.680 [SPEAKER_01]: What do I do? 26:25.820 --> 26:27.601 [SPEAKER_01]: When I grew up, we got a bit back. 26:27.841 --> 26:29.482 [SPEAKER_01]: Now, I don't do that. 26:29.582 --> 26:30.302 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think that's good. 26:30.322 --> 26:32.844 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't recommend that at all. 26:32.864 --> 26:45.372 [SPEAKER_01]: But if that was your upbringing, you immediately just go back what you're saying procedural memory, procedural memories that part of our brain that is automated to do things that are look conscious, but aren't always things like writing a bike. 26:45.392 --> 26:46.272 [SPEAKER_01]: That's procedural memory. 26:46.552 --> 26:49.474 [SPEAKER_01]: When you drive a car and you can be driving for 20 minutes and like 26:52.396 --> 26:59.661 [SPEAKER_01]: procedural memory, there's a part of you that's operating and you're not necessarily hyper-focused on what's happening. 27:00.201 --> 27:08.106 [SPEAKER_01]: Procedural memories, those need your reaction response, is that's the word for when your kid does something and you respond just like your parent. 27:08.146 --> 27:12.009 [SPEAKER_01]: That's that nervous system wiring that happens and that's what it's called. 27:12.429 --> 27:13.410 [SPEAKER_01]: But how do you undo it? 27:13.430 --> 27:16.192 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, first you have to identify that you're doing it and that you're doing it. 27:16.612 --> 27:22.036 [SPEAKER_01]: potentially the wrong way and a lot of the times it is the wrong way so that the more unhealthy way. 27:22.896 --> 27:26.579 [SPEAKER_01]: And then the next thing is you have to pick a different way. 27:27.119 --> 27:30.641 [SPEAKER_01]: Now, that sounds really broad, but let me be really specific and very honest. 27:31.282 --> 27:33.403 [SPEAKER_01]: That sounds like, well, it's pretty simple. 27:34.464 --> 27:35.624 [SPEAKER_01]: That's the big end goal. 27:36.185 --> 27:37.206 [SPEAKER_01]: It is very tricky. 27:38.186 --> 27:38.787 [SPEAKER_01]: to get there. 27:38.847 --> 27:48.555 [SPEAKER_01]: And what I mean by that is it is so tricky to be able to actually identify that it's a problem and then move towards change. 27:48.675 --> 28:00.806 [SPEAKER_01]: It takes years, years, trust me, years and years to begin to identify what is wrong and then what needs to happen and then how to fix it and how to actually live in that. 28:01.687 --> 28:04.349 [SPEAKER_01]: And just to make it a little more tangible for us, it was 28:05.670 --> 28:08.331 [SPEAKER_01]: You had a strong framework because the home you grew up in. 28:08.571 --> 28:10.832 [SPEAKER_01]: I had a strong desire but not strong models. 28:11.532 --> 28:15.193 [SPEAKER_01]: There was times when I knew I wasn't being a great parent but didn't know how to be a good one. 28:15.913 --> 28:21.975 [SPEAKER_01]: There was times when I didn't know I wasn't being a good parent but you're like, this is not good parenting. 28:22.795 --> 28:24.996 [SPEAKER_01]: But again, these were my only models. 28:25.016 --> 28:33.618 [SPEAKER_01]: These were the only things I had to go back to and I almost, it was really humbling because I didn't choose to be parented the way I was parented but also 28:35.384 --> 28:40.587 [SPEAKER_01]: it was embarrassing and humbling because I never took the time to go, well, are those even good or bad? 28:40.868 --> 28:43.409 [SPEAKER_01]: And like, I've just adopted them as fine. 28:44.370 --> 28:46.471 [SPEAKER_01]: And all of that's a process. 28:46.791 --> 28:51.414 [SPEAKER_01]: And so in our story, you were really helpful with helping me see that. 28:52.175 --> 28:54.956 [SPEAKER_01]: I wanted that, although that was very messy and very hard. 28:55.817 --> 28:59.740 [SPEAKER_01]: But for some of your stories, that might be the case as your spouse is giving you that feedback. 29:00.660 --> 29:12.648 [SPEAKER_01]: And maybe some of you need to hear like, you're wrong, your spouse is actually right, and you need to listen to them because you're just being prideful and think that the way that you were raised was basically right, but honestly it's doing a lot of damage. 29:13.228 --> 29:18.670 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's pretty easy to track by the way and you just need to humble yourself and begin the process of listening to your spouse. 29:19.170 --> 29:26.073 [SPEAKER_01]: For others, it's going to be like, honestly, you, it's not that bad, but you need to change and you need to actually find some models. 29:26.093 --> 29:28.494 [SPEAKER_01]: And so, we hope to do that through this podcast. 29:28.614 --> 29:29.955 [SPEAKER_01]: Some of it will be listening to this podcast. 29:29.975 --> 29:34.817 [SPEAKER_01]: Some of it will be finding people that you see that are good parents in your community. 29:34.897 --> 29:38.158 [SPEAKER_01]: And just say, when you come over for dinner, can we ask you questions like, how did you handle this? 29:38.878 --> 29:53.425 [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, this one of the reasons intentional exists is to give people practical, tangible models of what it looks like every day, when you rise, when you walk along the way, when you go to bed, of what it looks like to be a person of Jesus and faith, with all the mixtures of marriage and kids and all that. 29:53.445 --> 29:55.666 [SPEAKER_01]: So those are some big thoughts you have the Bible. 29:56.467 --> 29:57.207 [SPEAKER_00]: I do have a Bible. 29:57.707 --> 30:00.989 [SPEAKER_00]: I was just

thinking of like, I know somebody will be like, okay, great. 30:01.049 --> 30:01.669 [SPEAKER_00]: I want models. 30:01.889 --> 30:02.490 [SPEAKER_00]: Where are they? 30:03.610 --> 30:10.114 [SPEAKER_00]: uh, scripture has an answer to when when they're not there and I think not just beyond that. 30:10.255 --> 30:29.387 [SPEAKER_00]: This is our first go to um James chapter one first five you've all heard it a million times but the context of it is interesting um James one five says if any of you lacks wisdom you should ask God who gives generously to all without finding fault and it will be given to you. 30:31.225 --> 30:46.988 [SPEAKER_00]: I think that is so easy to forget in our information age, in our, just go do the work, go talk to a therapist, go find a model, all those are great things, but we cannot skip asking the Holy Spirit for wisdom. 30:47.828 --> 30:51.709 [SPEAKER_00]: To simply say, I don't know how to parent this well. 30:52.309 --> 30:53.969 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know how to parent that kid well. 30:54.129 --> 30:55.950 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know how to parent that stage well. 30:56.850 --> 30:58.791 [SPEAKER_00]: God, we just give me wisdom. 30:59.111 --> 31:00.231 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't have the wisdom. 31:00.391 --> 31:01.712 [SPEAKER_00]: I don't have the lived experience. 31:01.752 --> 31:02.632 [SPEAKER_00]: We give me wisdom. 31:03.493 --> 31:05.954 [SPEAKER_00]: But I find it really interesting in the context of this question. 31:07.214 --> 31:12.557 [SPEAKER_00]: What comes before that verse that we quote all the time is another verse we quote all the time oftentimes misquoting it. 31:13.157 --> 31:20.280 [SPEAKER_00]: That verse that says, consider pure joy of my brothers and sisters whenever you face trials of many kinds because you know that the testing of your faith produces perseverance. 31:20.840 --> 31:24.942 [SPEAKER_00]: The perseverance finishes its work so that you may be mature and complete not lacking anything. 31:25.922 --> 31:42.904 [SPEAKER_00]: Then it says, if any of you lack wisdom and that idea of like, if you are healing from how you were parented and that's a long journey that's a hard and painful journey and now you are parenting as you are healing and you are trying to parent differently. 31:43.384 --> 31:50.447 [SPEAKER_00]: Again, that is hard and that is painful, that is a trial that requires persevering through. 31:50.608 --> 31:51.868 [SPEAKER_00]: No, I'm going to keep showing up. 31:51.928 --> 31:53.469 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to keep asking God to heal. 31:53.529 --> 32:01.353 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to keep talking to the people I know I need to talk to to help that healing continue to happen. 32:02.133 --> 32:04.256 [SPEAKER_00]: It's from that place that is that scripture. 32:04.276 --> 32:19.492 [SPEAKER_00]: Now, if anybody lacks wisdom, and I think that is that This passage of scripture could just be a go-to passage if that is your story to keep coming back to Holy Spirit help me

persevere and Holy Spirit give me wisdom 32:21.402 --> 32:22.002 [SPEAKER_01]: it's a great word. 32:22.863 --> 32:39.990 [SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, and the spirit wants to help so much and pray in the person you want to be even if you didn't have the models because how many people do you know that didn't have great models but they become great, they become great parents or great spouses or and it's because they 32:41.577 --> 32:58.507 [SPEAKER_01]: All God needs is the desire which he places there anyway to be a better, fuller, richer husband or wife or father or mother, and it's your job to just let that desire nudge you to pray, to ask God, to be a great father, a great mom, a great spouse. 32:59.288 --> 33:02.429 [SPEAKER_01]: And it's amazing how he can do that even without the models. 33:02.990 --> 33:05.251 [SPEAKER_01]: But it takes both, so we'll keep that up. 33:05.671 --> 33:07.412 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, answer one more, personal formation question. 33:07.452 --> 33:08.013 [SPEAKER_01]: This is a great one. 33:08.593 --> 33:21.642 [SPEAKER_01]: And I think this is like, in one sense, a low bar question, and it's also so deep, and I think we can go in so many different directions, which we won't go in all of them, but a very real felt practical need. 33:21.662 --> 33:24.904 [SPEAKER_01]: I think of many parents right now, especially in this moment. 33:25.324 --> 33:30.928 [SPEAKER_01]: How do I prioritize time with the Lord when it can feel like another thing to try to get done? 33:31.768 --> 33:37.309 [SPEAKER_01]: or just feeling so exhausted and brain dead, we can understand that, to carve out that time. 33:38.089 --> 33:40.510 [SPEAKER_01]: But I'm also feeling guilty that I didn't carve out that time. 33:43.051 --> 33:46.951 [SPEAKER_01]: So how do you prioritize time when it just feels like another thing? 33:46.972 --> 33:50.752 [SPEAKER_01]: Can I just respond just briefly? 33:50.772 --> 33:54.213 [SPEAKER_01]: I just love all of the different stories in the scriptures. 33:54.273 --> 33:57.414 [SPEAKER_01]: You said this in a recent episode, but about 33:58.815 --> 34:12.944 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, you said about another person, but I just love that a lot of the different stories when people are distressed and overwhelmed and feel all of this that Jesus doesn't say, spend more time with me, he's eating food and taking out, drink water, taking out. 34:13.645 --> 34:18.588 [SPEAKER_01]: I think that so many of these feelings of guilt are not from the Spirit of God. 34:18.668 --> 34:21.210 [SPEAKER_01]: God is not gilting and shaming you into time with him. 34:22.231 --> 34:27.814 [SPEAKER_01]: He knows that your brain does, and he knows that you're overwhelmed, and he doesn't expect you to try to be somewhere you're not. 34:28.575 --> 34:37.741 [SPEAKER_01]: I think it looks like you having to recognize that your love, connection and growth in Jesus has nothing to do with all the effort that you could put towards him. 34:37.761 --> 34:45.206

[SPEAKER_01]: You're not earning it, and what you get to do is simply receive the fact that God loves you has forgiven you, is giving you his spirit. 34:46.227 --> 34:50.569 [SPEAKER_01]: And at the same time, wants to connect with you, but understands that you're very, very full and very busy. 34:50.589 --> 35:01.975 [SPEAKER_01]: And so, one of our favorite books, Domestic Monastery, that is a great, quick read of like giving an example of what it can look like to walk with Jesus in the Domestic Everyday Life. 35:02.095 --> 35:07.738 [SPEAKER_01]: For men and women, but also just to say, like, this is such an interesting thing. 35:07.758 --> 35:10.040 [SPEAKER_01]: I absolutely felt this before in many times. 35:10.900 --> 35:22.145 [SPEAKER_01]: There's so many days and mornings when I wake up and I don't feel like spending time with God, but this is where I think ritual is really important. 35:23.045 --> 35:30.629 [SPEAKER_01]: Having a couple of things that you do with it throughout your day that are just you do them because you have decided to do them regardless of how you feel. 35:31.609 --> 35:33.510 [SPEAKER_01]: It's amazing why that's so important. 35:34.090 --> 35:38.653 [SPEAKER_01]: what's amazing what happens during that, but why that is so important is because it's your job to just show up. 35:38.813 --> 35:41.535 [SPEAKER_01]: You don't have to have a brain that's fully active. 35:41.575 --> 35:45.017 [SPEAKER_01]: You don't have to read a chapter and then two more that becomes legalism. 35:45.057 --> 35:45.977 [SPEAKER_01]: It'll have to time anyway. 35:46.758 --> 35:52.121 [SPEAKER_01]: Your job is to identify the ritual to wake up to be present, to spend time with God. 35:52.281 --> 35:57.368 [SPEAKER_01]: and you let him control the outcomes and some of those mornings are going to be the most amazing mornings and moments you've ever had. 35:57.808 --> 36:08.562 [SPEAKER_01]: Others are going to be you're distracted, you're overwhelmed, you are completely frustrated and honestly you're like I'm just scrolling my phone the whole time but God I'm here. 36:08.802 --> 36:08.962 [SPEAKER_01]: Like 36:10.664 --> 36:22.870 [SPEAKER_01]: I think, and I want to say this, God is not angry with you because you have those moments, he understands your frailty and your humanity, and he loves you in the same space. 36:23.410 --> 36:27.612 [SPEAKER_01]: But day after day, week after week, you're after year, you set up the ritual just being present. 36:27.652 --> 36:29.833 [SPEAKER_01]: And I would just take the pressure off. 36:29.853 --> 36:31.294 [SPEAKER_01]: God is not putting this pressure on you. 36:31.314 --> 36:32.294 [SPEAKER_01]: It's like any relationship. 36:32.334 --> 36:32.714 [SPEAKER_01]: It's not fun. 36:32.734 --> 36:32.975 [SPEAKER_01]: It's like, 36:33.955 --> 36:42.342 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm sorry, I didn't make enough space for you, but I'm feeling brain dead and overwhelmed, like, you'd go, like, yeah, well, do what you need

to do, so you can feel refreshed. 36:42.762 --> 36:43.503 [SPEAKER_00]: And it might be in. 36:44.023 --> 36:44.204 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. 36:44.324 --> 36:53.491 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, there's a scripture that I have just been sitting in for weeks, because it just, it just felt like it just hit me. 36:53.511 --> 36:56.434 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm reading through John in John five. 36:59.157 --> 37:06.140 [SPEAKER_00]: Jesus is like at the height of starting to do work in the community and tons of people are skeptical. 37:06.800 --> 37:07.941 [SPEAKER_00]: It feels kind of unsafe. 37:08.001 --> 37:08.881 [SPEAKER_00]: Who is this guy? 37:08.981 --> 37:11.742 [SPEAKER_00]: He's like not officially a rabbi. 37:11.842 --> 37:13.783 [SPEAKER_00]: He's but he's like teaching with this great authority. 37:15.003 --> 37:30.674 [SPEAKER_00]: And he's speaking to people who were followers, who had were following the law, who understood the Torah, who understood the scriptures up into that point that had been written. 37:31.375 --> 37:38.300 [SPEAKER_00]: And he says to them, you study the scriptures diligently because you think that in them you have eternal life. 37:39.180 --> 37:45.506 [SPEAKER_00]: These are the very scriptures that testify about me, yet you refuse to come to me to have life. 37:45.847 --> 37:46.287 [SPEAKER_01]: Hmm. 37:46.828 --> 37:48.169 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, that's so perfect for this. 37:48.730 --> 37:49.130 [SPEAKER_01]: I know. 37:49.150 --> 37:49.370 [SPEAKER_01]: I know. 37:49.510 --> 37:49.791 [SPEAKER_01]: I know. 37:52.017 --> 38:10.084 [SPEAKER_00]: it's was just this like gut punch reminder of here and I would imagine that Jesus said it with great intensity but with great compassion of like what stuck out to me is like thinking these are people who are studying the scriptures they are in the scriptures having the quiet time so to speak. 38:11.184 --> 38:26.388 [SPEAKER_00]: But it feels much safer to them to just say that they read the scriptures and know the scriptures and studied the scriptures than to come to Jesus who was right in front of them to have life because it was because it was risky. 38:26.408 --> 38:27.348 [SPEAKER_00]: It was vulnerable. 38:27.568 --> 38:31.789 [SPEAKER_00]: It was and and in full graciousness and understanding to them. 38:32.329 --> 38:33.749 [SPEAKER_00]: Jesus is like new on the scene. 38:33.789 --> 38:36.230 [SPEAKER_00]: They're like, is this who we've been reading about? 38:41.891 --> 38:44.812 [SPEAKER_00]: But I think take that to our own lives today. 38:45.072 --> 39:08.798 [SPEAKER_00]: How often are we doing what-on-quote spiritual things, even opening the scriptures and having a quiet time, but not with the purpose for our heart to come to the one who actually gives us life, who in your place of exhaustion as a parent of, I can hardly open my eyes, and this just feels like it to do, and I don't want it to feel like that, 39:11.478 --> 39:21.683 [SPEAKER_00]: Like I think this verse is your clue, you're like right there of actually what God wants more than anything is for you to bring yourself to Him. 39:22.684 --> 39:27.606 [SPEAKER_00]: And we are absolutely huge fans of the quiet time. 39:27.666 --> 39:37.831 [SPEAKER_00]: We start our mornings that way, a huge fans of reading the scripture regularly, letting the truth of the scriptures wash over you and inform everything you do. 39:38.331 --> 39:39.172 [SPEAKER_00]: Super important. 39:40.232 --> 39:46.774 [SPEAKER_00]: But the point of that is to bring you closer to Jesus who is right there, waiting for you, already in front of you. 39:47.774 --> 39:51.875 [SPEAKER_00]: And I just have been reading the scripture like every day of like, God, where is my heart? 39:52.175 --> 39:52.815 [SPEAKER_00]: What am I doing? 39:52.855 --> 40:02.577 [SPEAKER_00]: Because it's just wrote just routine that has always been or I was told to or I feel shame if I don't. 40:03.597 --> 40:05.158 [SPEAKER_00]: What is that versus what is 40:05.958 --> 40:12.099 [SPEAKER_00]: Where's my heart actually connecting with you, allowing you to be the one that fills me and sustains me? 40:12.260 --> 40:13.200 [SPEAKER_01]: What's the reference on that? 40:13.880 --> 40:16.861 [SPEAKER_00]: That is John 5 39 and 40. 40:18.481 --> 40:19.141 [SPEAKER_01]: Mark that down. 40:19.621 --> 40:21.222 [SPEAKER_01]: Leo, process that. 40:23.642 --> 40:29.584 [SPEAKER_01]: Well, we could respond all day, but man, what a great way to just end the conversation today. 40:29.604 --> 40:34.865 [SPEAKER_01]: And just to say thank you guys for continuing to send in questions faithfully. 40:35.525 --> 40:38.786 [SPEAKER_01]: And keep them coming because every situation in the life is different. 40:40.487 --> 40:47.049 [SPEAKER_01]: And I know for us, we are constantly in the process of trying to discern and figure out and we're asking a lot of questions of others too. 40:47.089 --> 40:51.011 [SPEAKER_01]: And so, I know we're in that same boat as all to say, we are, we're with you. 40:51.031 --> 40:54.272 [SPEAKER_01]: And so, thank you for taking time to listen, send your questions. 40:54.312 --> 40:57.413 [SPEAKER_01]: You can email, hello at intentionalparents.org. 40:57.573 --> 40:59.934 [SPEAKER_01]: You can send a one minute voice memo with your name where you're from. 41:00.394 --> 41:01.975 [SPEAKER_01]: And your question, or you can email it in. 41:04.556 --> 41:06.840 [SPEAKER_01]: you know, we can play him on air, it's fun, we can hear your voice. 41:07.021 --> 41:08.143 [SPEAKER_01]: It's just like a fun thing. 41:08.163 --> 41:13.272 [SPEAKER_01]: So if you've listened this far, please do that and check out all that's happening and intentional parents' support. 41:13.874 --> 41:15.457 [SPEAKER_01]: But thank you for sticking around this long. 41:15.657 --> 41:16.178 [SPEAKER_01]: We'll see you next week.