Full Transcript for Thoughts on America's first 250 with Dr. Cornel West and Tavis Smiley

love of black 36 00:02:11.199 --> 00:02:15.120 people that has a solidarity with all oppressed people in 37 00:02:15.319 --> 00:02:19.520 every corner of the country and the world. And we 38 00:02:19.560 --> 00:02:22.240 want to thank James Brown. We want to thank Susie 39 00:02:22.319 --> 00:02:25.360 his mama sixteen years old. We want to thank Joseph 40 00:02:25.520 --> 00:02:29.840 his daddy way out in a Shack in Barnville, South Carolina. 41 00:02:30.039 --> 00:02:33.719 When he was born Tavis, he was pronounced a stale born. 42 00:02:33.800 --> 00:02:34.159 That's right. 43 00:02:34.599 --> 00:02:37.479 They pronounced him dead. Thank god, he had an aunt 44 00:02:37.560 --> 00:02:40.680 that shook him after a little while and he started 45 00:02:42.039 --> 00:02:46.599 making some noises the next thing you know it, and 46 00:02:46.719 --> 00:02:50.800 he been funky ever since. He's been funky ever since. Well, 47 00:02:50.840 --> 00:02:54.639 that's an allegory of black people. When America was born, 48 00:02:55.000 --> 00:02:58.039 we were still born when it came to freedom. That's 49 00:02:58.039 --> 00:03:01.639 why Frederick Douglas said in April fifth, eighteen fifty two, 50 00:03:01.919 --> 00:03:05.400 when you're celebrated, it's a sham for us. When you 51 00:03:05.520 --> 00:03:09.520 talk about liberty and justice, it's hollow mockery when it 52 00:03:09.599 --> 00:03:15.360 comes to shameless hypocrisy and revolting bulbarity. America range with 53 00:03:15.520 --> 00:03:20.039 no rivals. That's Frederick Douglas April fifth, eighteen fifty two, 54 00:03:20.360 --> 00:03:24.520 at the Woman's Anti Slavery gathering in Rochester. Here we 55 00:03:24.680 --> 00:03:29.439 are now in twenty twenty six with a certain version 56 00:03:29.520 --> 00:03:33.159 of that. There's been breakthroughs, there's been progress because people 57 00:03:33.680 --> 00:03:38.719 sacrifice courageously, had visions and organizations. But when we look 58 00:03:39.120 --> 00:03:42.479 at the mass incarceration, look at the black child poverty 59 00:03:42.520 --> 00:03:46.240 and child poverty, look at black miseducation, look at the 60 00:03:46.479 --> 00:03:52.000 unbelievable unavailable access the healthcare and childcare. When it comes 61 00:03:52.039 --> 00:03:57.719 to difficulty to gaining ancestors to resources, let alone our 62 00:03:57.719 --> 00:04:00.360 own sources of self respect, that's something we got to 63 00:04:00.400 --> 00:04:03.120 come determined with, the sources of self love, that's what 64 00:04:03.199 --> 00:04:05.599 we got to come to terms with. But when it 65 00:04:05.680 --> 00:04:10.360 comes to the underside of America right now, the version 66 00:04:10.520 --> 00:04:16.879 of Frederick Douglas Steel holds two hundred and fifty years later, 67 00:04:16.920 --> 00:04:19.480 and we got to be honest about that. We got 68 00:04:19.480 --> 00:04:22.319 to be candid about that. But we also have to 69 00:04:22.399 --> 00:04:27.439 have a joy. Thank god, we were born black and 70 00:04:27.600 --> 00:04:31.319 have been able to revel in a great tradition of 71 00:04:31.360 --> 00:04:34.560 a hated and despise people who talk to moral so 72 00:04:34.680 --> 00:04:38.800 much about love and dignity. But that's not a function 73 00:04:38.879 --> 00:04:44.199 of skin pigmentation. That's a function of Black people choosing virtues, 74 00:04:44.519 --> 00:04:51.920 choosing character, choosing courage, choosing integrity, choosing honesty. And if 75 00:04:51.959 --> 00:04:56.000 we lose that, we become part of the spiritual decadence 76 00:04:56.079 --> 00:05:00.439 and decay of America that has been worshiping money, money, 77 00:05:00.720 --> 00:05:03.600 money for two hundred and fifty years too much. But 78 00:05:03.680 --> 00:05:07.079 thank god, we always got some vanilla brothers and sisters. 79 00:05:07.160 --> 00:05:10.480 Be they Quakers way back in abolitionists, or be they 80 00:05:10.600 --> 00:05:15.560 vanilla folk in president who are in solidarity, Whiz, Liberty 81 00:05:15.639 --> 00:05:19.839 for all, Justice for all here and in Gaza and 82 00:05:20.000 --> 00:05:24.040 in Haiti, and in Ethiopia and in Iran and in 83 00:05:24.199 --> 00:05:27.800 China across the board. Oh, what a great Black people 84 00:05:27.879 --> 00:05:32.800 will to be celebrating our resistance and struggle but also confronting, 85 00:05:32.879 --> 00:05:36.240 as my dear sister Connie says, the forces of evil 86 00:05:36.279 --> 00:05:37.439 that's coming at us. 87 00:05:37.879 --> 00:05:40.560 It's gonna be funky this whole hour. I want you 88 00:05:40.600 --> 00:05:43.399 to know. I ain't ask Cornell West nothing yet. All 89 00:05:43.439 --> 00:05:45.720 I said was, brother, it's good to hear your voice. 90 00:05:45.959 --> 00:05:49.279 And that's the opening salvo. It's gonna be funky this 91 00:05:49.600 --> 00:05:52.360 entire hour. You see why he chose it as his 92 00:05:52.480 --> 00:05:55.040 walk on saw. Corneer Orest is ready to go, and 93 00:05:55.079 --> 00:05:56.639 I'm ready to go with him for the rest of 94 00:05:56.680 --> 00:06:00.000 the hour. You're listening to Tavis smiling. I told you 95 00:06:00.279 --> 00:06:02.920 funk for the entire hour, for that matter, all three 96 00:06:02.959 --> 00:06:05.839 hours a day because doctor Wes DJ doc is curating 97 00:06:05.839 --> 00:06:08.959 the music today as we played the best of James Brown. 98 00:06:09.000 --> 00:06:13.319 And you think about it, I mean you imbibe what 99 00:06:13.439 --> 00:06:15.959 doctor West was saying. It makes all the sense in 100 00:06:16.000 --> 00:06:18.519 the world that we moved from Agretha Franklin yesterday to 101 00:06:18.639 --> 00:06:24.360 James Brown as we moved toward this celebration, this commemoration, 102 00:06:24.959 --> 00:06:28.920 this confrontation is Kanye and doctor vgreed when it comes 103 00:06:29.319 --> 00:06:32.800 to the two hundred fifty anniversary

of this republic over 104 00:06:32.839 --> 00:06:37.000 the weekend. And so we're just trying to trying to 105 00:06:37.000 --> 00:06:40.519 get to our paragraph. Right. When you look at America 106 00:06:40.759 --> 00:06:43.680 two hundred and fifty years in through a black lens, 107 00:06:43.920 --> 00:06:46.839 what do you see? And that's the purpose of all 108 00:06:46.879 --> 00:06:50.399 three hours today. Connie Rice was absolutely brilliant in the 109 00:06:50.480 --> 00:06:52.920 first hour, and doctor West came out the blocks, we 110 00:06:52.959 --> 00:06:55.759 passed the baton. Actually, Conye came out the blocks and 111 00:06:55.800 --> 00:06:58.000 then passed the baton to doctor West. And I told 112 00:06:58.040 --> 00:07:00.639 you he's gonna go faster and higher, and that's exactly 113 00:07:00.680 --> 00:07:02.720 what he did. I didn't ask this Negro nothing. He 114 00:07:02.879 --> 00:07:05.759 just went in and for fifteen minutes. But he laid 115 00:07:05.839 --> 00:07:08.360 the frame for this hour so beautifully, Miles, we got 116 00:07:08.399 --> 00:07:11.879 we gotta when docs starts going in like that, so brilliantly, 117 00:07:11.959 --> 00:07:13.720 what we got we got. We got some sound effects 118 00:07:13.800 --> 00:07:21.800 man like what we what can we give him? Do 119 00:07:21.839 --> 00:07:23.120 that again? I like that, I do that and do 120 00:07:23.160 --> 00:07:28.480 that again. How about how about how about when he 121 00:07:28.519 --> 00:07:30.399 starts preaching like that, how about like some some HAMM 122 00:07:30.439 --> 00:07:32.680 and B three like in the black pen acost the church. 123 00:07:33.680 --> 00:07:35.399 That's it. That's it, that's it. 124 00:07:35.480 --> 00:07:35.959 That's it. 125 00:07:38.639 --> 00:07:41.759 We got we gotta give doctor sound effects man when 126 00:07:41.759 --> 00:07:45.480 he's doing it like that. Uh, Doctor West, it's always 127 00:07:45.480 --> 00:07:47.160 a blessing to have you an. 128 00:07:50.000 --> 00:07:53.319 Younger generation. You love the younger generation. 129 00:07:53.439 --> 00:07:53.639 Brother. 130 00:07:54.720 --> 00:07:54.759 No. 131 00:07:55.240 --> 00:07:58.279 Uh. Doc has laid the frame for this hour, and 132 00:07:58.319 --> 00:08:01.360 I got the rest of this to sort of interrogate 133 00:08:01.399 --> 00:08:04.399 that frame. And here's where I want to start. You 134 00:08:04.480 --> 00:08:06.560 said so much that we could just talk about, you know, 135 00:08:06.680 --> 00:08:09.399 for our words, not even just this hour. But I 136 00:08:09.439 --> 00:08:11.040 want to come back to something that jumped out at 137 00:08:11.079 --> 00:08:16.079 me when you suggested that it's a blessing to be 138 00:08:16.120 --> 00:08:20.040 black in America. It's a blessing, Doctor West said, to 139 00:08:20.120 --> 00:08:24.000 be black in America. Let me ask a question that 140 00:08:24.079 --> 00:08:27.399 might sound bizarre. I hope it doesn't sound,

you know, 141 00:08:28.560 --> 00:08:32.080 sacriligious in anyway. But Doc said, it's a blessing to 142 00:08:32.120 --> 00:08:35.919 be born black in America. When you said that, for 143 00:08:35.919 --> 00:08:40.240 some reason, my mind went back to your dear departed friend, 144 00:08:41.200 --> 00:08:45.279 Tony Morrison. Yes, and you know where I'm going that 145 00:08:45.399 --> 00:08:49.360 issue of infanticide that is at the epicenter of that story, Beloved. 146 00:08:51.559 --> 00:08:55.399 I want to move from James Brown as a stillborn 147 00:08:55.519 --> 00:09:00.919 baby to the infanticide issue raised again in beloved text 148 00:09:02.600 --> 00:09:05.440 and ask you whether or not, two hundred and fifty 149 00:09:05.519 --> 00:09:11.200 years in with all that we have to endure, whether 150 00:09:11.279 --> 00:09:15.559 or not you still believe it's a blessing now to 151 00:09:15.600 --> 00:09:17.879 be born black in America. 152 00:09:20.159 --> 00:09:23.519 Yeah, my brother, I would say it's a blessing now 153 00:09:23.679 --> 00:09:30.759 more than ever, because when you've been through so much hell, 154 00:09:32.279 --> 00:09:36.320 when you've been terrorized for so long, the police hunt 155 00:09:36.360 --> 00:09:39.799 you down for so long, We've been wrestling with poverty 156 00:09:39.879 --> 00:09:42.879 for so long, and you come through it on the 157 00:09:43.039 --> 00:09:48.120 other side, closed in your right mind, with your soul impact, 158 00:09:48.600 --> 00:09:52.240 and the rest of the world still wants access to 159 00:09:52.440 --> 00:09:56.480 your language, your music, and your culture and your rhythms 160 00:09:56.519 --> 00:10:00.399 and your polyarhisms and ways of being in the wor world. 161 00:10:00.480 --> 00:10:04.440 You say to yourself, the best of Black people. I'm 162 00:10:04.480 --> 00:10:06.360 not talking about the worst, because we human beings like 163 00:10:06.399 --> 00:10:10.399 everybody else, but the best of black people is probably 164 00:10:10.440 --> 00:10:12.840 the greatest response. 165 00:10:12.879 --> 00:10:18.759 To all of the hopelessness and meaninglessness and nihilism and 166 00:10:18.919 --> 00:10:23.080 cynicism that is so pervasive in the. 167 00:10:22.960 --> 00:10:27.480 World, not just in America, in the modern world. So 168 00:10:27.519 --> 00:10:32.399 that black Moses being that have to do with wrestling 169 00:10:32.399 --> 00:10:36.159 with tragic comic reality, that have to do with wrestling 170 00:10:36.200 --> 00:10:40.200 with impetus and helplessness and hopelessness. But as you said earlier, 171 00:10:40.600 --> 00:10:43.080 not allowing him to have the last words, and how 172 00:10:43.080 --> 00:10:45.720 do you do that? You need to have the words 173 00:10:45.759 --> 00:10:49.279 and witnesses of those who came before. It's no accident 174 00:10:49.679 --> 00:10:54.039 that Cold Sweat, which was actually recorded right then Cincinnati, 175 00:10:54.080 --> 00:10:59.159 Ohio in May nineteen sixty seven, was co written by 176 00:10:59.200 --> 00:11:02.360 p Wee l Us, who was using Miles Davis as 177 00:11:02.360 --> 00:11:08.720 so what Dona Dona? The Miles had already taken it 178 00:11:08.759 --> 00:11:12.000 to the hill with Coltrane and others. Here comes pee 179 00:11:12.000 --> 00:11:17.440 Wee in the James Brown Band, gonna add now some 180 00:11:17.559 --> 00:11:21.840 deep funk with Miles's genius. So you get James Brown's 181 00:11:21.840 --> 00:11:25.720 genius and Miles Davis genius. My god, that's like a 182 00:11:25.840 --> 00:11:30.559 reef of Franklin's genius with Marion Williams genius. My god, 183 00:11:30.879 --> 00:11:34.600 that's Sarah Bond's genius with Billy Holladay's genius, we ain't 184 00:11:34.639 --> 00:11:38.639 got the W. B. D. Boyce and Ida B. Wells Barnett. 185 00:11:39.000 --> 00:11:43.320 What a tradition of a people when it has the bravery, 186 00:11:43.440 --> 00:11:47.919 the brilliance, the consistency, and the courage with love that 187 00:11:48.120 --> 00:11:50.799 is central. So I'm just thank God that I'm the 188 00:11:50.879 --> 00:11:54.200 child of Irene and Clifton. I thank god the Simpson 189 00:11:54.279 --> 00:11:58.159 who just died, but who's in the process of being 190 00:11:58.200 --> 00:12:04.000 reborn is my sister cliff A, Sheryl Travis, my brother 191 00:12:04.759 --> 00:12:07.080 Mark really Talvers, my bride, and go on and on. 192 00:12:08.440 --> 00:12:10.879 I got a smile on my face giving all the 193 00:12:10.919 --> 00:12:13.399 tears and heartache and heartbreak that I have to come 194 00:12:13.440 --> 00:12:15.600 to terms with every day. 195 00:12:16.600 --> 00:12:19.320 I was thinking a moment ago when you were talking, 196 00:12:19.399 --> 00:12:21.720 and I wanted to just revert right quick back to 197 00:12:21.720 --> 00:12:23.720 what some of what Connie was saying in the first 198 00:12:23.759 --> 00:12:27.399 hour about the resilience of black people. You've laid on 199 00:12:27.440 --> 00:12:29.519 that in your own way at the start of this hour. 200 00:12:29.799 --> 00:12:33.039 Connie went in on that point as well in our one. 201 00:12:33.519 --> 00:12:37.360 And I sometimes wonder, sometimes wonder for all that we 202 00:12:37.480 --> 00:12:40.840 have accomplished. And you said, I've heard you saying speeches 203 00:12:40.879 --> 00:12:43.480 here or there that when when the good white folks 204 00:12:43.480 --> 00:12:45.200 see us walk in the room, the audience give us 205 00:12:45.200 --> 00:12:47.960 a standing ovation. We just deserve it a standing ovation 206 00:12:48.559 --> 00:12:50.600 when we walk in the room. I've heard doctor West 207 00:12:50.639 --> 00:12:54.120 say that it is a miracle that black people did 208 00:12:54.159 --> 00:12:57.200 not form our own version of al Qaeda, given all 209 00:12:57.320 --> 00:12:59.960 that we've been put through over these two hundred and 210 00:13:00.039 -->

00:13:03.960 fifty years, we did not resort to that, nor did 211 00:13:03.960 --> 00:13:05.919 they resort to that in South Africa. At the end 212 00:13:05.960 --> 00:13:09.240 of a part time. It underscores and highlights the best 213 00:13:09.320 --> 00:13:11.840 of who we are. But for all the resilience that 214 00:13:11.919 --> 00:13:13.960 we have exhibited, I sometimes wondered, I don't even know 215 00:13:14.039 --> 00:13:16.200 there's an answer to this, Doctor, I'm just talking out loud, 216 00:13:16.679 --> 00:13:18.360 which I can do it, Doctor West, even if it's 217 00:13:18.399 --> 00:13:20.879 live on radio with people listening. I do this. I 218 00:13:20.919 --> 00:13:22.240 tend to do. It was just the two of us, 219 00:13:22.519 --> 00:13:25.000 So my questions, if they sound crazy, it's just between 220 00:13:25.080 --> 00:13:28.039 doctor westn me. But here's one of those questions, for 221 00:13:28.519 --> 00:13:32.200 all of our resilience, notc I wonder how much more 222 00:13:32.759 --> 00:13:37.159 we might have accomplished, how much better off we might be, 223 00:13:38.080 --> 00:13:41.720 how much farther down the road we would be if 224 00:13:41.759 --> 00:13:44.440 we didn't have for two hundred and fifty years, this 225 00:13:44.600 --> 00:13:48.360 knee on our neck. I mean, I celebrate the resilience, 226 00:13:48.559 --> 00:13:51.000 but I sometimes wonder how much further down the road 227 00:13:51.039 --> 00:13:56.039 we'd be if we hadn't had these speed bumps, these roadblocks. 228 00:13:56.200 --> 00:13:57.200 I think you take my point. 229 00:13:58.919 --> 00:14:01.840 Oh yeah, I don't think we have a language that 230 00:14:01.879 --> 00:14:04.159 could capture a vision as to what we could be 231 00:14:04.840 --> 00:14:07.600 if we didn't have this vicious white supremacy coming at 232 00:14:07.679 --> 00:14:11.480 us every day, every week, every year for four hundred years. Now, 233 00:14:11.519 --> 00:14:15.720 I know that's hypothetical and counterfactual, because supremacy has been 234 00:14:15.799 --> 00:14:19.600 real as an auto attack every minute of our lives. 235 00:14:19.720 --> 00:14:22.440 And we'll haunt us to the grave and our children's 236 00:14:22.440 --> 00:14:25.879 graves because it's not going away. It can be pushed back, 237 00:14:26.480 --> 00:14:29.799 but it's not going to ever be eliminated and erased, 238 00:14:30.240 --> 00:14:32.799 you see. But it can be pushed back as far 239 00:14:32.840 --> 00:14:35.720 as it can be. But can you imagine who we 240 00:14:35.759 --> 00:14:38.080 would have been and what we could have done? But 241 00:14:38.159 --> 00:14:40.440 we have to keep in mind doing relation to the 242 00:14:40.519 --> 00:14:44.879 United States and the experiment in constitutional republic trying to 243 00:14:44.919 --> 00:14:47.559 become a democracy. Since the county again is right in 244 00:14:47.600 --> 00:14:51.399 terms of you don't have a multi racial liberal democracy 245 00:14:51.480 --> 00:14:54.200 until the nineteen sixties, and then that gets you raised 246 00:14:54.919 --> 00:14:58.600 rather quickly under the neo fascism of Trumpet Company. And 247 00:14:58.639 --> 00:15:01.080 it's in the process of being that's why our fight 248 00:15:01.120 --> 00:15:03.759 is so intense. But the important thing to keep in 249 00:15:03.840 --> 00:15:09.399 mind those tabs is that on a spiritual and moral level, 250 00:15:09.559 --> 00:15:12.960 if we could reach the level of Imbatill's mother who says, 251 00:15:13.000 --> 00:15:15.919 I don't have a minute to hate, I'll pursue justice 252 00:15:15.960 --> 00:15:18.360 and for the rest of my life, and her only 253 00:15:18.480 --> 00:15:21.799 baby is right there in the call fan at Robert 254 00:15:21.879 --> 00:15:24.080 Tipple Church of God in Christ on the West Side 255 00:15:24.120 --> 00:15:29.000 of Chicago. That is a level of unbelievable moral and 256 00:15:29.080 --> 00:15:33.879 spiritual greatness. And there's been black mothers and black fathers 257 00:15:34.120 --> 00:15:38.080 who have tried to enact that kind of greatness, to 258 00:15:38.200 --> 00:15:41.000 pass it on to their children so that become not 259 00:15:41.080 --> 00:15:44.440 just freedom fighters, but also they become wounded healers, they 260 00:15:44.480 --> 00:15:48.720 become joy shares, they become love warriors, so that they 261 00:15:48.720 --> 00:15:52.080 bring the moral and the spiritual with the political, with 262 00:15:52.279 --> 00:15:55.639 the economic. That's why is them can never capture the 263 00:15:55.759 --> 00:15:57.080 richness of our movement. 264 00:16:00.200 --> 00:16:04.919 I wonder, I wondered, thank you, Miles, I wonder, Uh, 265 00:16:04.720 --> 00:16:08.559 that was funny, that was funny. I knew he was 266 00:16:08.559 --> 00:16:10.960 gonna do that. I knew that that B three was 267 00:16:11.000 --> 00:16:13.360 coming man. Fortunately Dr West and I both love him 268 00:16:13.360 --> 00:16:18.480 and B three as a matter of fact, But the Frisch. Yeah, 269 00:16:18.759 --> 00:16:20.559 you recall who played the MM and B three at 270 00:16:20.559 --> 00:16:25.120 your church when you was growing up. That's right, and 271 00:16:25.120 --> 00:16:27.799 and and sometimes and every now that you'd have a 272 00:16:27.879 --> 00:16:29.559 visitor who would get on the organ. And his name 273 00:16:29.679 --> 00:16:31.120 was Sevester Stewart's son. 274 00:16:31.279 --> 00:16:35.000 His name was Slash sevest Sevester. But the world knows 275 00:16:35.039 --> 00:16:36.600 him for the genius that he is Slash. 276 00:16:37.039 --> 00:16:40.480 That's right. For those who't know that story. Every fifth Sunday, Uh, 277 00:16:40.559 --> 00:16:43.320 Sylvester Stewart as he was known then with would step 278 00:16:43.399 --> 00:16:46.440 to the organ as Shallow Baptist Church in Sacramento. Uh. 279 00:16:46.440 --> 00:16:48.720 He came to be known in Slash Stone.

But Doc 280 00:16:48.720 --> 00:16:50.679 would see him played the organ at his church all 281 00:16:50.799 --> 00:16:55.039 those years ago. On the fifth Sunday, Doctor West said 282 00:16:55.039 --> 00:16:56.639 in this hour of conye countye right said in the 283 00:16:56.639 --> 00:17:00.559 first hour that this again is for us a look 284 00:17:00.559 --> 00:17:03.679 at this anniversary two and fifty years in you through 285 00:17:03.679 --> 00:17:07.720 a black lens. It is more a confrontation than a celebration. 286 00:17:08.319 --> 00:17:10.799 From Doc's perspective. I want to ask him what we 287 00:17:10.880 --> 00:17:15.079 are confronting at this moment, two fifty years in. What 288 00:17:15.559 --> 00:17:19.640 is the confrontation? That's the question. We'll start with Dr West. Well, 289 00:17:19.680 --> 00:17:26.519 come forward on Tavis, Smile, Baby, Baby Baby. It's the 290 00:17:26.559 --> 00:17:29.480 best of James Brown all three hours of show today 291 00:17:30.240 --> 00:17:34.039 courtesy of that's Cornell West. He's choosing the playlist, has 292 00:17:34.119 --> 00:17:37.240 chosen the playlist for all three hours a day. I 293 00:17:37.279 --> 00:17:40.000 miss him being here in studio and watching him run 294 00:17:40.039 --> 00:17:41.680 out of here into the control room. We talk to 295 00:17:41.680 --> 00:17:43.759 Miles to play he's what we're doing next, but he's 296 00:17:43.799 --> 00:17:48.079 curating it from Sacramento, believe it or not, down to 297 00:17:48.240 --> 00:17:52.480 La and it's sounding good. Miles is following his instructions 298 00:17:52.519 --> 00:17:55.599 from Sacto as we play the best of James Brown 299 00:17:55.640 --> 00:17:58.720 all three hours a day, again curated by Dr Cornell West. 300 00:17:59.160 --> 00:18:01.279 If in case you've just and you've missed a great 301 00:18:01.359 --> 00:18:03.839 hour and a half of this program today, and we 302 00:18:03.880 --> 00:18:06.039 still got ninety minutes to go. But Connie Rice is 303 00:18:06.039 --> 00:18:10.160 on the first hour, absolutely brilliant today, and Cornell West 304 00:18:10.279 --> 00:18:13.400 comes out of the blocks in this second hour with 305 00:18:13.839 --> 00:18:17.519 his unique brand of brilliance, and so we are all 306 00:18:17.559 --> 00:18:20.319 the better for hearing these voices on this particular day, 307 00:18:20.400 --> 00:18:23.000 as we are on the eve of the two hundred 308 00:18:23.000 --> 00:18:27.559 and fiftieth Celebration commemoration confrontation which we'll get to in 309 00:18:27.559 --> 00:18:30.599 a moment of this place we call America. We were 310 00:18:30.599 --> 00:18:33.039 talking a moment ago, doc about the notion of a resilience. 311 00:18:33.240 --> 00:18:34.599 I want to read a comment from a listener and 312 00:18:34.680 --> 00:18:36.200 let you respond to that before I go to my 313 00:18:36.319 --> 00:18:39.480 question that I posed moments ago. What is the confrontation 314 00:18:39.720 --> 00:18:43.799 at this point? From our perspective, what is it that 315 00:18:43.839 --> 00:18:48.400 we are confronting in this particular moment. Here's the comment 316 00:18:48.480 --> 00:18:51.960 from one of our listeners, Tavis, Resilience is one of 317 00:18:52.039 --> 00:18:57.039 humanity's greatest strengths. It has helped our species survive throughout history. 318 00:18:57.559 --> 00:19:00.359 But when resilience becomes a way of life because laws 319 00:19:00.359 --> 00:19:03.839 of racism and racial trauma, it is no longer just 320 00:19:03.960 --> 00:19:09.359 a strength. It becomes exhausting. The constant need to endure, recover, 321 00:19:09.480 --> 00:19:12.480 and keep going can take a devastating toll on both 322 00:19:12.519 --> 00:19:16.759 mental and physical health. The question isn't why black people 323 00:19:16.759 --> 00:19:20.160 are resilient. The question is why should black people have 324 00:19:20.240 --> 00:19:24.359 to learn resilience against white supremacy from the day they 325 00:19:24.400 --> 00:19:28.400 are born. There is nothing admirable about a society that 326 00:19:28.519 --> 00:19:32.799 forces people to be resilient simply to survive. The real 327 00:19:32.839 --> 00:19:36.960 shame is the persistence of the racism that makes such 328 00:19:37.079 --> 00:19:40.920 resilience necessary in the first place. And to that doc, 329 00:19:41.079 --> 00:19:43.240 you say what, I. 330 00:19:43.279 --> 00:19:47.319 Say that, that's a wise brother of sister who said that. 331 00:19:47.720 --> 00:19:51.640 I can tell you that that is so very, very true. 332 00:19:53.279 --> 00:19:55.960 But the reality is, you got to work with what 333 00:19:56.039 --> 00:19:58.599 you've got, and you got to fall back on what 334 00:19:58.680 --> 00:20:01.880 you have and what has been transmitted and bequeathed to you. 335 00:20:03.680 --> 00:20:07.680 The sickness of American society for two hundred and fifty 336 00:20:07.759 --> 00:20:11.920 years has precisely been with all the hatred and car 337 00:20:12.079 --> 00:20:15.440 and trauma coming at us. Be it enslavement, be it 338 00:20:15.599 --> 00:20:19.480 lynch and Jim Crow, or be it locked into hoods 339 00:20:19.480 --> 00:20:23.160 and ghettoes, and then told with less beautiful or less 340 00:20:23.200 --> 00:20:26.440 moral or less intelligential white supremacist lives that have been 341 00:20:26.519 --> 00:20:30.799 institutionalized and routinized in the history of the country. We're 342 00:20:30.880 --> 00:20:33.839 just forced to, at our best be resilient. Now, I'm 343 00:20:33.880 --> 00:20:36.680 every black person is not resilient. We've got to be 344 00:20:36.720 --> 00:20:38.880 honest about this, you see, we've got to be very 345 00:20:38.880 --> 00:20:41.799 honest about that. We got a history of black freedom 346 00:20:41.839 --> 00:20:44.440 fighters and loved warriors, we got a history of black 347 00:20:44.519 --> 00:20:49.039 cowards

and black informities, and so well, we're talking about 348 00:20:49.039 --> 00:20:52.400 the best of black people. And it's true that it's 349 00:20:52.440 --> 00:20:55.400 sad that we have to make resilience a way of 350 00:20:55.440 --> 00:20:58.559 life in order to under to survive alone thrive, but 351 00:20:58.680 --> 00:21:01.880 it is what it is. We have to come to 352 00:21:02.039 --> 00:21:04.960 terms with these realities. But we also have to keep 353 00:21:04.960 --> 00:21:07.920 in mind this though to Evison, and that is when 354 00:21:08.000 --> 00:21:14.319 James Brown put his band together, Clyde Stubblefield on the 355 00:21:14.400 --> 00:21:18.440 drums and Jibbo starts on the drums, Fred Wesley and 356 00:21:18.559 --> 00:21:20.160 Pee Wee Ellis. 357 00:21:20.440 --> 00:21:21.319 Hit me, Fred. 358 00:21:23.240 --> 00:21:26.920 Sinclair and all of those folks. He knew that it 359 00:21:27.000 --> 00:21:30.359 was going to be not just confrontation. It was going 360 00:21:30.440 --> 00:21:35.160 to be first a matter of cultivation. You got to 361 00:21:35.200 --> 00:21:39.960 get your discipline together. Stay on the one, boots He 362 00:21:40.039 --> 00:21:42.200 used to tell me all the time, James Brown would 363 00:21:42.240 --> 00:21:44.599 hit him because he wasn't on the one. He was 364 00:21:44.640 --> 00:21:47.559 on the one. James Brown kept telling Bootsy that to 365 00:21:47.640 --> 00:21:50.400 put the pressure on him to be eln better than 366 00:21:50.440 --> 00:21:54.119 he was, and he's on Jenas got even deeper because 367 00:21:54.200 --> 00:22:00.480 James was so hard on him. That's a matter of maturation, cultivation, discipline, 368 00:22:00.559 --> 00:22:02.759 And as James Brown used to say, when I was 369 00:22:02.799 --> 00:22:05.240 traveling with Booty and George Clinton and the others, what 370 00:22:05.400 --> 00:22:08.440 was James Brown said? Before every concert he would say, 371 00:22:08.759 --> 00:22:12.920 leave everything inside of you on the stage for the people, 372 00:22:13.000 --> 00:22:15.640 because we're an extension of them and they are an 373 00:22:15.680 --> 00:22:17.880 extension of us. So don't get out there and be 374 00:22:18.200 --> 00:22:23.319 superficial and artificial and acting like your very appearance is 375 00:22:23.359 --> 00:22:27.359 the event. No, your event is the service you provide 376 00:22:27.400 --> 00:22:31.079 to the people. As brother Ren Troy Brown used to say, Mark, really, 377 00:22:31.160 --> 00:22:35.480 Thomas understands. So if we don't have to write cultivation 378 00:22:35.640 --> 00:22:39.799 of our souls, that's a spiritual issue, that's the moral issue. 379 00:22:39.839 --> 00:22:43.519 That's also part of our confrontation. It's just not politics. 380 00:22:44.240 --> 00:22:48.039 You end up with these superficial politicians ain't got no backbone, 381 00:22:48.240 --> 00:22:51.559 ain't got no sense of wanting to serve and sacrifice 382 00:22:51.559 --> 00:22:54.680 in a serious way. They just got strategy and brands 383 00:22:54.880 --> 00:22:57.680 for the next election, rather than a cause that they 384 00:22:57.759 --> 00:23:00.000 ought to be willing to live and die for. James 385 00:23:00.160 --> 00:23:04.119 Brow that put everything in the performance for the people. 386 00:23:04.400 --> 00:23:06.960 That's why we love James now. 387 00:23:06.960 --> 00:23:09.000 He told that band. I heard this from Fred, I 388 00:23:09.039 --> 00:23:11.480 heard it from Maco, even heard it from boots. He 389 00:23:11.599 --> 00:23:14.480 to Doc's point, James James had a one liner. He 390 00:23:14.519 --> 00:23:17.039 would tell the band heal to toe if he ain't 391 00:23:17.079 --> 00:23:20.000 on the one you got to go. That was the line, 392 00:23:21.960 --> 00:23:24.799 heal to toe if he ain't on the one you 393 00:23:24.920 --> 00:23:28.440 got to go. U. And I've heard the stories from again, 394 00:23:28.519 --> 00:23:32.200 from Fred and Maco and Bootsy and others, and Martha 395 00:23:32.319 --> 00:23:35.799 Hines h Doc has heard these stories as well. James 396 00:23:35.839 --> 00:23:38.400 would find him, he would find the band he could. 397 00:23:38.559 --> 00:23:40.920 He would look at you in the performance and give 398 00:23:40.920 --> 00:23:43.039 you a look, and you knew you had just missed it. 399 00:23:43.079 --> 00:23:43.799 You had missed it. 400 00:23:44.240 --> 00:23:44.400 Uh. 401 00:23:44.599 --> 00:23:46.559 And so you get a fine. But he made that 402 00:23:46.680 --> 00:23:48.960 band better. But that was his line, heal to toe 403 00:23:49.319 --> 00:23:52.079 if he ain't on the one, you got to go. Uh. 404 00:23:52.160 --> 00:23:53.960 Let me let me tee this up. Now, it wouldn't 405 00:23:53.960 --> 00:23:56.039 be fair to give Doc sixty seconds to respond. Let 406 00:23:56.039 --> 00:23:58.359 me tee this up, and I'll cut him loose when 407 00:23:58.359 --> 00:24:01.319 we come forward. So we all agree that two hundred 408 00:24:01.319 --> 00:24:03.319 and fifty years in, we never let misery have the 409 00:24:03.359 --> 00:24:07.480 last word. The fight back continues. I'm just not so 410 00:24:07.519 --> 00:24:09.440 sure I know what the fight back looks like. And 411 00:24:09.440 --> 00:24:11.519 there are a lot of folk who are you know, 412 00:24:11.720 --> 00:24:14.480 in this fight, And I'm just not sure that the 413 00:24:14.519 --> 00:24:18.160 warfare they're engaged in is A is A is A 414 00:24:18.400 --> 00:24:20.319 is a campaign that I want to you know that 415 00:24:20.359 --> 00:24:22.160 I want to be a part of. So on the 416 00:24:22.200 --> 00:24:24.960 one end, for example, you got Kamala Harris, who's making 417 00:24:25.000 --> 00:24:28.440 the rounds now on the phone callings are on Mandami, 418 00:24:28.480 --> 00:24:31.279 it has been reported today, and other pro Palestinian voices 419 00:24:31.759 --> 00:24:34.799 trying to reboot what she

screwed up the last time around. 420 00:24:35.119 --> 00:24:38.160 So apparently, you know, Coamma's laying the groundwork to get 421 00:24:38.200 --> 00:24:40.799 back out there again. How does she do that successfully? 422 00:24:41.119 --> 00:24:44.720 Is she doesn't flat out apologize for how she missed 423 00:24:44.720 --> 00:24:46.079 it so bad at the first time around. And I 424 00:24:46.079 --> 00:24:49.400 don't even know that an apology at this point is sufficient. 425 00:24:49.960 --> 00:24:52.799 That's one kind of fight back. Kamala may get back 426 00:24:52.799 --> 00:24:57.039 in again. You see these DSA candidates that are that 427 00:24:57.079 --> 00:24:59.240 are that are rising up across the country. There's a 428 00:24:59.279 --> 00:25:03.519 peace the Washington Post yesterday, I read the headline no 429 00:25:03.720 --> 00:25:08.759 more appeasement. Democrats need to fight the DSSA. The far 430 00:25:08.880 --> 00:25:12.079 left is poised to take over the Democratic Party if 431 00:25:12.079 --> 00:25:14.799 it isn't stopped. I read one line from that article 432 00:25:14.839 --> 00:25:19.519 in the Washington Post yesterday, the dssay's radicalism is not 433 00:25:19.640 --> 00:25:22.960 a faction to be appeased. It is a movement to 434 00:25:23.079 --> 00:25:27.799 be opposed. So you got DSA, you got Kamala Harris, 435 00:25:28.519 --> 00:25:33.519 got Democratic Party establishment fighting against the DSSA. And on 436 00:25:33.640 --> 00:25:36.480 and on and on and on go the various types 437 00:25:37.039 --> 00:25:40.599 of fights that we could engage two hundred and fifty 438 00:25:40.640 --> 00:25:43.839 years in my question simply for doctors says, what from 439 00:25:43.839 --> 00:25:47.079 his perspective does the fight look like? What is the 440 00:25:47.200 --> 00:25:50.559 right fight? Because the struggle continues and the fight back 441 00:25:50.640 --> 00:25:53.960 is real, But what fight ought we be signing up for? 442 00:25:54.119 --> 00:25:57.079 What fight ought we be willing to be a part of? 443 00:25:57.519 --> 00:26:00.160 In this particular moment, We're gonna keep it funky. We 444 00:26:00.240 --> 00:26:03.240 come forward with James Brown and Cornell West on Tavis 445 00:26:03.240 --> 00:26:08.000 Smith to Cornell West as we continue trying to understand 446 00:26:08.039 --> 00:26:14.640 better what this to in celebration, commemoration, confrontation looks like 447 00:26:15.480 --> 00:26:18.200 from a black perspective, through a black lens, And we 448 00:26:18.240 --> 00:26:20.160 had Connie Rices in the first Our doctor West is here, 449 00:26:20.559 --> 00:26:22.880 uh and he has been on fire this entire hour. 450 00:26:22.960 --> 00:26:26.240 So Doc here's a simple question. The fight back is real, 451 00:26:27.119 --> 00:26:29.319 as you and I both know, the struggle is real. 452 00:26:29.640 --> 00:26:32.079 But so it's the fight back. The question I'm trusting 453 00:26:32.079 --> 00:26:35.599 toward from your perspective is what's the right fight? Take 454 00:26:35.599 --> 00:26:37.400 it anywhere you want it, but what's what's the right 455 00:26:37.440 --> 00:26:38.400 fight in this moment. 456 00:26:40.759 --> 00:26:42.559 Well, on the one hand, we've got to get our 457 00:26:42.599 --> 00:26:48.079 priorities right. Martin Kinge laid it out. Our priorities are 458 00:26:48.359 --> 00:26:51.880 fighting white supremacist in all of its forms. It is 459 00:26:51.960 --> 00:26:55.599 fighting poverty in all of its forms, material as well 460 00:26:55.640 --> 00:26:59.359 as spiritual poverty. It is fighting materialism and the worship 461 00:26:59.440 --> 00:27:04.039 of not just money, but worship of power, worship of status. 462 00:27:04.079 --> 00:27:08.720 And then it's also coming to terms with militarism around 463 00:27:08.759 --> 00:27:14.000 the world. So for like our dear sister Tamula, you 464 00:27:14.119 --> 00:27:17.920 got twenty five thousand Palestinian babies and you can't say 465 00:27:17.960 --> 00:27:20.599 a mumbling word and allow one voice to say a 466 00:27:20.640 --> 00:27:24.519 word about that at your national convention. But it's only 467 00:27:24.559 --> 00:27:28.799 when dfa folk win electures that you reach out to them. 468 00:27:29.319 --> 00:27:33.319 That's not a sign of character and integrity. I tell 469 00:27:33.359 --> 00:27:36.839 the sister, you are brilliant, but not brave. You don't 470 00:27:36.880 --> 00:27:40.240 have the kind of character required for the leadership of 471 00:27:40.279 --> 00:27:42.799 a great people. You can go on and play your 472 00:27:42.799 --> 00:27:46.240 political games. Achieved is the symbol of the democratic establishment. 473 00:27:46.240 --> 00:27:49.039 It's just not an her. That's true across the board, 474 00:27:50.279 --> 00:27:53.440 all the different colors of folks. And same would be 475 00:27:53.440 --> 00:27:56.160 true with maths, incarceration, same would be true with the 476 00:27:56.200 --> 00:27:59.559 police murdering, police brutality, same would be true with this. 477 00:28:00.599 --> 00:28:03.519 Look at the mayor of Detroit, my sister Mary Sheffield, 478 00:28:03.680 --> 00:28:08.880 what is she saying. I'm gonna make eliminating poverty a priority. 479 00:28:09.240 --> 00:28:12.559 That's part of team's legacy. You never hear that out 480 00:28:12.559 --> 00:28:16.400 of Democratic Party. We never heard that out of Obama. 481 00:28:16.559 --> 00:28:19.440 That's why we went on the poverty tour. It's just 482 00:28:19.440 --> 00:28:22.599 a matter of trying to keep our priorities right. But 483 00:28:22.680 --> 00:28:26.319 we got too many black folk who get so incorporated 484 00:28:26.440 --> 00:28:30.960 into the establishment that they lose their priorities and they 485 00:28:31.039 --> 00:28:33.720 lose their backbone, and all they want to do is 486 00:28:33.759 --> 00:28:37.680 just sustain their position and power in an

establishment that 487 00:28:37.920 --> 00:28:40.960 is unraveling. And the same as true about the Empire 488 00:28:41.559 --> 00:28:44.279 at two hundred and fifty years. If all black people 489 00:28:44.359 --> 00:28:48.039 want to do is just gang accets to some stattus 490 00:28:48.039 --> 00:28:52.680 and prosperity and lose their morality and spirituality. They just 491 00:28:52.799 --> 00:28:56.400 as decadent as the white brothers and sisters who too 492 00:28:56.440 --> 00:29:01.319 often a decadent. But thank God, there's always there's always 493 00:29:01.359 --> 00:29:05.240 a cloud of witnesses in every community, no matter what color, 494 00:29:05.519 --> 00:29:08.400 no matter what region, no matter what religions. Look at 495 00:29:08.400 --> 00:29:14.240 our churches spiritual awakening. Where's the moral resurrection that allows 496 00:29:14.279 --> 00:29:17.039 our people to wake up and straighten their backs up 497 00:29:17.240 --> 00:29:20.400 and organize and bring some power and pressure to bear 498 00:29:20.680 --> 00:29:25.680 on every level, not just the political, very important, not 499 00:29:25.799 --> 00:29:29.640 just the economic crucial predatory capitalism have been out of 500 00:29:29.640 --> 00:29:33.400 control for a long time, but also spiritual and moral. 501 00:29:33.440 --> 00:29:36.640 We got too many folks who don't have enough maturity, 502 00:29:36.880 --> 00:29:44.039 don't have enough character, no backbone, spineless, gullible, fickle, will 503 00:29:44.119 --> 00:29:47.759 never be able to move with just a fickle leadership. 504 00:29:49.079 --> 00:29:54.680 Thank God for TB fifteen eighty brother tablets and the 505 00:29:54.720 --> 00:29:57.960 others saying, no matter how cracked our vessels are, we 506 00:29:58.039 --> 00:30:00.839 all cracked vessels. We gonna hold hold up a blood 507 00:30:00.960 --> 00:30:04.799 thing battle other great people. What a wonderful thing we 508 00:30:04.839 --> 00:30:07.319 ought to have a joy even in the midst of 509 00:30:07.319 --> 00:30:10.319 my grief that I'm ristling with with my beloved and 510 00:30:10.440 --> 00:30:13.920 magnificent sister Cynthia. 511 00:30:13.720 --> 00:30:16.799 We are praying, We are praying, pulling in praying for 512 00:30:16.880 --> 00:30:20.400 the for the West family. Given the passing of doctor West, 513 00:30:20.440 --> 00:30:23.200 sister Cynthy we talked about the other day. Uh let 514 00:30:23.279 --> 00:30:24.799 me just let me just say this right quick. Somebody 515 00:30:24.799 --> 00:30:26.400 ought to take what doctor West just said an't meme 516 00:30:26.440 --> 00:30:28.000 it It ought to be a meme like in the 517 00:30:28.000 --> 00:30:31.240 next five minutes of Kamala Harris. He says the sister 518 00:30:31.400 --> 00:30:35.000 is brilliant but not brave. That about sums it up. 519 00:30:36.000 --> 00:30:38.599 That sums it up. It's hard to argue that Kamala's 520 00:30:38.640 --> 00:30:42.599 brave sister. She's brilliant, she's just not brave. And all 521 00:30:42.599 --> 00:30:45.720 these phone calls now trying to fix what you could 522 00:30:45.720 --> 00:30:49.880 have addressed, you know, a couple of years ago. It's problematic. 523 00:30:49.960 --> 00:30:52.000 It's problematic, and I'm not sure it works. I'm just 524 00:30:52.079 --> 00:30:55.359 not sure it works. But she is brilliant but not brave, 525 00:30:55.480 --> 00:30:58.720 says doctor Cornell West, speaking of brilliant but not brave. 526 00:30:58.920 --> 00:31:01.000 I want to ask Doc when we came for Eddie Claude. 527 00:31:01.039 --> 00:31:03.359 I discussed this on the program this week. I'm sure 528 00:31:03.359 --> 00:31:04.880 he did. I want to see if Doc read the 529 00:31:05.279 --> 00:31:08.559 Vanity Fair pieces. I recalled it. Tanna Hasse just wrote 530 00:31:08.559 --> 00:31:11.920 about empire, and now's the time twenty fifty years in 531 00:31:12.039 --> 00:31:14.319 to take on and talk more about the empire. Thanks 532 00:31:14.359 --> 00:31:19.920 Tona Hassee. We appreciate that that revelation. All these years later, 533 00:31:20.559 --> 00:31:22.920 I said to Eddie Claude, ton Hosse is like being 534 00:31:22.960 --> 00:31:25.839 on the Tona Hassee's on the float at the back 535 00:31:25.920 --> 00:31:28.319 of the float. He jump off and running around front 536 00:31:28.880 --> 00:31:34.039 like he conducted the parade again, brilliant but not brave 537 00:31:34.160 --> 00:31:36.440 and just always late to the party. But I wonder 538 00:31:36.440 --> 00:31:37.880 if Doc saw that piece of what his thought. Sorry 539 00:31:37.880 --> 00:31:39.440 about that, And then I want to close with this. 540 00:31:39.480 --> 00:31:42.559 I asked a question twenty and fifty years in, are 541 00:31:42.640 --> 00:31:45.480 we up to the task? It's just called it what 542 00:31:45.519 --> 00:31:47.920 it is. We are not our parents, we are not 543 00:31:47.920 --> 00:31:50.480 our grandparents, We should have not our great grandparents. Are 544 00:31:50.559 --> 00:31:54.559 we up to the task. Two hund and fifty years later, 545 00:31:54.720 --> 00:31:57.440 you're listening to that Western Tampson. There is There is 546 00:31:57.480 --> 00:32:00.400 by James Brown, not Corner West's Curity, the music of 547 00:32:00.440 --> 00:32:02.839 James Brown. All three hours of our show today, Doc, 548 00:32:02.880 --> 00:32:04.839 I got four minutes left and I want to give 549 00:32:04.880 --> 00:32:07.279 it to you brother. I don't know if you saw 550 00:32:07.319 --> 00:32:09.160 the piece that Tana Hasseie wrote. Eddie Claude and I 551 00:32:09.200 --> 00:32:11.839 talked about a little bit earlier on the show this 552 00:32:11.880 --> 00:32:14.759 particular week. But Tony Hassie says, now is the time. 553 00:32:15.359 --> 00:32:19.119 Now it's time to talk about empire. As I said, 554 00:32:19.119 --> 00:32:22.440 thank you Tom Hassee for that breaking news. And my 555 00:32:22.519

--> 00:32:25.559 extra question is two and fifty years in for all 556 00:32:25.599 --> 00:32:28.240 of our resilience which we discussed in this hour, are 557 00:32:28.319 --> 00:32:32.240 we up to the task? Are we up to the fight? 558 00:32:32.519 --> 00:32:33.839 Take it as you will. The last three and a 559 00:32:33.839 --> 00:32:35.440 half minutes belong to you, Doctor. 560 00:32:36.759 --> 00:32:38.759 Well. I mean, you know we need each other for 561 00:32:38.920 --> 00:32:42.119 empowerment and affirmation, but it's also got to have a 562 00:32:42.160 --> 00:32:45.519 critical dimension to it. That brother Coats in some ways 563 00:32:45.599 --> 00:32:49.519 is very much like Kamala, Harris and Obama. They all brilliant, 564 00:32:49.559 --> 00:32:54.279 but not Grave Colts was the embedded reporter with Obama 565 00:32:54.400 --> 00:32:58.200 for many years. Wrote a wonderful essay on reparation, but 566 00:32:58.519 --> 00:33:02.319 never had a major public sustained critique of Obama relation 567 00:33:02.519 --> 00:33:05.839 reparations because he wanted assets. You look at the third 568 00:33:05.880 --> 00:33:08.319 book and his introduction and the third book what he said. 569 00:33:08.720 --> 00:33:11.039 He says, I can't stand these black intellectuals who are 570 00:33:11.039 --> 00:33:13.279 critical of Israel, because it's clear they don't know what 571 00:33:13.319 --> 00:33:17.160 they're talking about. He's talking about myself and others. We 572 00:33:17.240 --> 00:33:19.920 know that because I'd written many pieces on raising the 573 00:33:20.039 --> 00:33:25.240 issues of Israeli occupation, Israeli apartheid, raising the issues of empire, 574 00:33:25.440 --> 00:33:29.720 raising issues of imperialism. Now things begin to shift. This 575 00:33:29.839 --> 00:33:32.559 is a truth for coma or two. Now all of 576 00:33:32.559 --> 00:33:34.880 a sudden on the cut and ad just talking about 577 00:33:35.000 --> 00:33:37.640 Paliston and Paul I had to go there and see it. No, 578 00:33:37.759 --> 00:33:39.880 you could have been reading the books, Brob. You didn't 579 00:33:39.920 --> 00:33:43.200 want to take a stand because your mentor, Dresseic Goldberg, 580 00:33:43.240 --> 00:33:48.160 who's the editor of Atlantic Magazine, was the facilitator of 581 00:33:48.200 --> 00:33:53.759 your career, and that magazine was a pro Israeli apartheip magazine. 582 00:33:54.480 --> 00:33:56.880 Now he knows that. Now he's open to that, and 583 00:33:57.039 --> 00:33:59.440 we welcome him to the club. But he's not on 584 00:33:59.519 --> 00:34:02.680 the cutting and you just one important voice among many 585 00:34:02.839 --> 00:34:06.160 of the voice because he didn't have the courage at 586 00:34:06.200 --> 00:34:08.679 that time, because it was a moment in which you 587 00:34:08.719 --> 00:34:12.880 had to sacrifice something. You don't wait and see what 588 00:34:13.079 --> 00:34:15.239 the wind, which way the wind is blowing in venue 589 00:34:15.280 --> 00:34:18.719 shift please, please. 590 00:34:22.480 --> 00:34:25.320 Are we up to the task? Here we are this weekend? 591 00:34:25.440 --> 00:34:29.360 Two hundred and fifty years in we discussed our resilience 592 00:34:29.400 --> 00:34:31.519 in this hour, in these last sixty seconds. Are we 593 00:34:31.679 --> 00:34:34.360 up to the task right about now? Black folk? That is? 594 00:34:36.519 --> 00:34:39.639 But I think it's always an open question. It depends 595 00:34:39.639 --> 00:34:43.039 on what we do. Rulph Ellison wrote the second novel 596 00:34:43.199 --> 00:34:46.119 that he never finished, and it was it was dedicated 597 00:34:46.119 --> 00:34:50.599 to the lost tribe of Negroes who are fading away. 598 00:34:51.719 --> 00:34:56.119 He saw the collapse of black defall, just like August 599 00:34:56.159 --> 00:35:02.000 Wilson did in his three It's in Place cycle. And 600 00:35:02.119 --> 00:35:04.920 aunt Esther, who was born in sixteen nineteen died in 601 00:35:04.960 --> 00:35:08.079 the nineteen eighties because of an attachment to greed, an 602 00:35:08.119 --> 00:35:11.599 attachment to money, and attachment to status, and no longer 603 00:35:11.719 --> 00:35:16.440 an attachment to service and courage to the least of these, 604 00:35:16.719 --> 00:35:19.199 those are two of our great artists. But we just 605 00:35:19.280 --> 00:35:21.519 don't know. It's an open question. But it doesn't make 606 00:35:21.559 --> 00:35:25.159 any difference whether in the end we're up to it. 607 00:35:25.559 --> 00:35:30.599 We have to declare our own declaration of independence and 608 00:35:30.679 --> 00:35:33.599 our own hearts and minds and souls and communities and 609 00:35:33.679 --> 00:35:36.639 say we gonna do the best that we can do, 610 00:35:37.199 --> 00:35:40.840 just like Grandmama did, just like Granddaddy did, just like 611 00:35:40.920 --> 00:35:44.280 Mary Lou Williams did, just like Sarah Von did, just 612 00:35:44.360 --> 00:35:47.960 like Tony Morrison did, just like James Baldwin did. We 613 00:35:48.000 --> 00:35:50.519 do the best that we can do, and we pass 614 00:35:50.559 --> 00:35:52.000 it on to the young. 615 00:35:51.880 --> 00:35:54.360 Folks, and just like James Brown did. And that's why 616 00:35:54.360 --> 00:35:57.719 were closing with this track this hour that is as 617 00:35:57.840 --> 00:36:01.079 chosen by Dr Cornell West, always on it to have 618 00:36:01.199 --> 00:36:03.920 on this program. We learned so much. We are empowered, 619 00:36:03.920 --> 00:36:07.760 we are inspired, we are elevated, and our voices are amplified. 620 00:36:07.840 --> 00:36:10.599 When Cornell West takes the mic, Doc, we love you, 621 00:36:10.599 --> 00:36:11.920 There's nothing you can do about it. I'll talk to 622 00:36:11.920 --> 00:36:12.280 you soon. 623 00:36:13.079 --> 00:36:15.639 I love your father the choice and I read