TRANSCRIPT 🔗
speaker-0: What impact can I make to the teams that report to me? How can I help somebody else grow and pay back all the wonderful mentors that I've had in my life? My why when I wake up is how can I help the team? How can I help even the company I'm working with? Somebody is using their voice to alert you that there is a problem and they're passionate enough to raise it to your attention. You want to hear them and hear them out.
speaker-1: Sometimes people get out of like for being the complainer, but someone who's using their voice and really alerting people to a challenge and hopefully wanting to be part then of the continued solution. I'm Dr. Amy Aethe. As a licensed psychologist and performance expert, working with elite athletes, C-suite executives, and high performers operating in some of the most demanding environments, I've seen what it truly takes to perform when it matters most. From supporting members of the Naval Special Warfare community to advising leaders in high stakes, high-pressure situations, one truth remains consistent. The tools that drive performance are the same. You prepare in a way that allows you to show up. Ready when the moment arrives. Each week I'll share practical tools and insights to help you strengthen how you think, lead, and perform. Welcome to Still Evolving. Most leaders spend a fair amount of energy trying to avoid the messiest situations in their businesses. The failing division, the compliance disaster, the team that has been running hot for so long that no one wants to touch it. And then there's a smaller group of leaders who move in the opposite direction. They walk into that chaos. They walk toward the mess on purpose. That is where I want to start today. The leaders who thrive in turnaround work are not adrenaline junkies. They are not looking for suffering. They have simply figured out something the rest of the executive world has not fully caught up to, which is that chaos is where the leverage lives. When a situation is calm, running well, incremental improvement is available. But when a situation is broken, The ceiling on what can change is far higher, and the work of leadership becomes concentrated in a way that steady state environments rarely allow. The leaders who develop a taste for this kind of work are not chasing chaos. They are chasing impact, and they have learned that the two often live in the same place. What separates the leaders who walk toward that chaos and land well from the ones who walk toward it and get swallowed by it is very specific. It is a set of training capacities that most executives never had the opportunity to build in lower stakes environment. The ability to stay regulated when everyone around you is not. The clarity to see the actual problem underneath all of that noise. The trust in the playbook without becoming rigid about the plan. And the willingness to make decisions on partial information because waiting is a decision too, and usually a more expensive one. Those capacities do not appear the first time a leader steps into a broken situation. They get built over the arc of a career spent walking toward hard things. In my book, Moment Ready, I write about four capacities that let high performers show up in these moments that matter most. These are composure, clarity, connection, and courageous action. All four show up in turnaround work, and courageous action shows up first. Before any of the other capacities can do their work, leader has to be willing to step into the situation in the first place. That first step is what separates the leaders who eventually get the reputation for being able to handle anything from the ones who quietly steer their careers around the roles that could have taught them the most. Today's guest is Marie Johnston. Marie is a finance and operations executive who has spent her career leading turnaround and transformation work in the world. Inside PE-backed companies. She has been handed businesses in the middle of financial crisis, compliance failures, and organizational restructures, and she has built a career on identifying the problem, building the playbook, and moving teams through the hard work of executing it. She is refreshingly clear about the philosophy she brings into these situations, including how she reads a team when she first walks in the door, why she wants to meet the person everyone says is a complainer. And how she coaches people through the ebbs and flows of a turnaround pace. Her perspective on what actually sustains a leader across a career spent inside these environments is worth your time. Please welcome Marie to Still Evolving. Let's get to it. Marie, welcome to Still Evolving. Grateful for you and this opportunity to have the conversation today. Thank you.
speaker-0: Great to be here. Thank you for inviting me.
speaker-1: I was struck when we met and you shared on your journey. ⁓ your career, your leadership journey has been full of twists and turns of really like turns into very fast scaling, often some could argue broken, ⁓ situations, problem sets. And you have been charged with riding the ship in your domain expertise, of course, but nonetheless, Could you share with us a little bit about in your journey, like when you realized that actually walking into that chaos was some of where your strength comes alive?
speaker-0: Absolutely. I say very early career. ⁓ very early career, I was handed a messy corporation that had their funds frozen due to sales tax compliance issue. And ⁓ I discovered that you know these messy situations, you have to identify the issue, put together the playbook, execute the playbook. And to successfully execute the playbook, you really have to bring in the leaders or bring in those who are impacting to the situation or impacted by the situation. and it's really about building relationships. So ⁓ you have to build the relationships within the company. And it's about building the playbook. ⁓ And I'd say once I was able to
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execute on a project ⁓ that had a positive impact, the first one, the first two, it's really exhilarating. And for me, it makes me say, Give me another challenge to solve, another improvement to execute on. there's no greater feeling than leading a team through something that you feel good about. especially in today's world where getting given that opportunity is it's valuable and valuable for growth for me and valuable for my team.
speaker-1: So when you talk about building that team, ⁓ which you said that's kind of like the heart of this, right? Like you need, you need the people to the right and left of you who are gonna kind of take on this challenge, perhaps make some pretty significant shifts ⁓ in in how business is run, right? To solve for that problem. what are you looking for in the team members that you're looking perhaps? Maybe in the short run, like s you know, there are roles for EMTs out there to fix and and and do the ⁓ emergency first aid, if you will. And then also there's other team members that perhaps you're looking for to further grow, develop for a longer, a longer run. But I'm curious about building your team. If that's the heart of this in the midst of chaos, you need people to the right and left, what are you looking for in them?
speaker-0: Yep, so I go into companies and assess the team we have, but the team members who I either tend to ⁓ identify that they're high growth potential. or when I'm interviewing them, my one of my favorite interview questions is what project have you executed on? What opportunity have you had to make an impact? And how did that project go? ⁓ who was involved, who executed? I asked those type of questions because I want to get to know where their curiosity level is and sort of where their awareness level is of what's around them, what could be better? ⁓ the the team that I like to build is actually the one who has voice. ⁓ ⁓ people can say, this person always complains. and then I can't wait to meet that person. ⁓ because somebody is using their voice to alert you that there is a problem and they're passionate enough to raise it to your attention. And so you want to hear them and hear them out. I'd say those who can stick with me, they they have grit, right? The people who stick around a company. So often if I come into a company, they're already in some sort of need situation where they need processes. They need the right team built. They need somebody to execute a playbook. and so when I walk into a company ⁓ that's like that and they already have team members there, often those team members are there because they care, because they're passionate. and it also tells you a little bit about them that they have grit to go through sort of the the fast pace that this company moves that to h to get to where it was.
speaker-1: You know, you mentioned grit and and you talk about ⁓ really you you mentioned sometimes people get out of like for being the complainer, but someone who's using their voice and really maybe some people could argue could possibly use the voice differently or couch it differently, but nonetheless the message is there, alerting people to a challenge. And hopefully wanting to be part then of the continued solution. But you said this this moves fast. ⁓ this is you mentioned grit because I'm sure it's not only like persevering through all the change, but this isn't a stressed condition, a pressured condition, because odds are something wasn't working. You mentioned the financial crisis, if you will, that's at hand. So things have to move pretty quickly. How do you ⁓ Respond to team members that obviously are impacted by that stress or strain, are still passionate and trying to persevere to towards that solution, but ⁓ take you know, make missteps, right? That ⁓ perhaps they try something and it it didn't have the result that it was intended to have. How as a leader are you responding in a way to Keep that team steady because this is a pressure cooker. We gotta move fast. It's already been a long haul before you even got there. ⁓ what do you do when things go wrong?
speaker-0: Yeah, so coming in, it's a lot of coaching. So it's a lot of coaching to bring out the best in the individuals and to set up the team for success. And so one of the things that I find that is most challenging is if you don't know the why. And so part of my leadership strategy is to always be very open and communicative about here's The issue we're trying to solve, here's the issue at hand, here's why it's an issue. And then here's the temporary solution. ⁓ and please acknowledge it's a temporary solution. And then here's where we want to go in the future, because we don't have time necessarily all the time to just implement a system really quickly. you have to have good data or you know, that never works. Bad data in a system turns out to be a bad implement ⁓ poorly implemented system. so I think with with those team members, I'm coaching them on the why. And then it's a lot of coaching on like it is frustrating. And I'm often on a lot of calls where people are frustrated at the pace, people are frustrated at the constant change. and it's really giving them tools and tricks and and also allowing them, I think you had mentioned something about, hey, what if things don't go well? ⁓ you really have to create an environment that encourages trying, that encourages execution. And if something doesn't go well, you stop and say, What direction do we need to take this project? And being okay with the first attempts to not be successful. ⁓ being okay with multiple attempts not being successful. and I I think through all projects and change management you have the ebbs and flows of the project goes well, but you might hit a roadblock that you weren't anticipating or it takes longer to to execute on a piece of the project than you expected. it's it's being able to also teach your team that they need to have grace with themselves and along with the grit. So my
favorite saying with my team members is nobody died. And I say that because in our industry it's generally true. and you know, you just have to keep getting up and never lose sight of that end goal. the end goal is having the company at a better state than it was when you got here. ⁓ the other thing I really encourage my team members to do is if the decisions were not yours. If the decisions that got us here were not yours, don't apologize for them. We are here to fix, we are here to take ownership, we are here to make things better. And I think if you enable your team to see their role and their place in the company as a fixer, as a process improver, they're not gonna let you down. They're going to step into that for you.
speaker-1: They have an opportunity to contribute and bring that value to realization. You know, I heard you say when you when you're meeting with a team, certainly if there was a misstep or something didn't work, a couple of key takeaways. One, I like a helpful reset and challenge of responsibility, right? Like if part of being accountable is being accountable for your choices, your decisions, your actions. That's great, but there's a boundary there, and taking on too much can be incredibly weighting. Quite frankly, just noise in this chaotic environment, right? Like there's a lot of noise going on. There's there's the change, there's the impact of the current situation. Certainly, then, or that solution that needs to happen. There's a lot of noise going on, so let's not add to it. Let's not add to the weight. The second thing I heard you say is. Also, when you meet with them, is sometimes when you're on these calls, people are frustrated and they need a moment to be frustrated. they're, you know, being able to express that appropriately so. But if you're freaking mad or freaking over it, being able to give voice and getting some of that energy out can be really helpful. And then serving as a f ref a facilitator to reset or recenter the refocus the team on. Okay, now what? Right? Like what has to happen with this project? Great question. But also, like more specifically, what's the next step? How do we want to show up with leadership? How do we want to show up with other stakeholders? ⁓ being able to work through the reaction because it's a human, it's how we're wired, right? We react and then we can refocus. But if you just charge ahead. without lending space and and being able to facilitate some of that. Certainly you don't want it to become just some gripe session. I get that. But if you dismiss it, it's gonna be really hard to get people on board to feel like they want to contribute and bring the value and solving solving the the problem or implementing the next shift that's on the plate.
speaker-0: Yep, completely agree.
speaker-1: ⁓ so you have worked also ⁓ you know, s something unique in your experiences, often in PE backed turnarounds. So it's not just the pressure that comes or chaos that comes and perhaps a financial crisis, but also there's there's tremendous tremendous pressures coming from investor groups that ⁓ have a seat at the table and are expecting that return, right? Or at least the turnaround. Absolutely.
speaker-0: Absolutely.
speaker-1: The time pressure comes in, right? Like they time is money, I get it. The whole, the whole saying. ⁓ can you talk a little bit from that experience of something unique that you've taken away as a leader in working in that very specific performance domain, working with PE back companies that, you know, s something's been eliminated, there's a crisis financial, ⁓ and you coming in to help. stabilize the current condition. And I heard you say earlier, sometimes the solutions are you know they're temporary, but you gotta stop the bleeding, right? So can you talk a little bit about specifically or unique to that experience?
speaker-0: Yeah, I I think the pressures that come with making right sizing the ship and right sizing it quickly. ⁓ PE firms, the ones I've worked with, they value open communication, realistic timelines, and also to show progress. So as long as you continue to show improvement, as long as you continue to show the playbook and the execution of that. Even if a project gets delayed, as long as the again there's that open communication, the PE firms generally are supportive. and so I've worked with some amazing PE firms where they are heavily involved. I've worked with PE firms that are hands-off. but at the end of the day, I they understand. that the company needs to move forward. And so generally if I'm coming into a corporation for an engagement, it's to help the company move forward because the other option is to do nothing and to stay where it is. so that I I can't overstate it enough. It's the open communication and it's n constant showing of improvement.
speaker-1: I I appreciate the emphasis when you when you share communicate, ⁓ it seems as if the the specific ⁓ recommendation is like understanding that yes, they have an an intent and yes, they have a goal in mind, right? Like they want the company to stabilize, they want the company to grow, they want to have a return. and not an or and they understand perhaps the problems at hand that have to be solved. to do so. So if you are communicating specifically being transparent, XYZ is a challenge. This is our game plan to address each one of them. And this is where we are in the execution. That is what provides a level of certainty. Even though if perhaps, you know, on down the line other shifts are gonna have to be made, at least they can like you said, your your aim is to come in and And stabilize and and grow and and make it better than it was. So they can see that progress ⁓ versus the absence of communication. And people fill in the blanks with all sorts of things, right? ⁓ which may or may may not be accurate. the pressures of of working the financial side in these in these roles. talk to us a little bit about like how how that impacts you and perhaps how you integrate that in your life, because you are more than just a a financial leader. ⁓ you have many roles in your life. Like what has helped you sustain this journey? ⁓ and perhaps something that you have found that you can do on a daily or weekly basis to help either renew, recenter, kind of keep you in this because the turnaround world is ⁓ not for the weary. ⁓ It's it's nope. It takes sprint to a whole new level, right? ⁓ when you come in and having to step into what could be viewed as like a crisis situation. ⁓ what helps keep you going?
speaker-0: Yeah, so always being centered by knowing my why. ⁓ and I love how the why has changed throughout my life and then throughout my career. I was ⁓ early mother in my life and therefore my two boys were my why. and now they're adults, they have their own families. Your life goes through shifts of what that why is. And for me it's been my why has been my career, to see how far I can push myself. and I would say the last few years it's been what impact can I make to the teams that report to me? How can I help somebody else grow in their career and pay back for all the wonderful mentors that I've had in my life. And so my why when I wake up is how can I help the team? How can I help even the company I'm working with with, right? The PE firm, how can I how can I be an asset today to them? so I definitely would say it's it's just never losing sight of the why helps get through the tough days.
speaker-1: Yeah, very grounding for sure. Marie, it's been wonderful having the conversation with you today. Thank you for sharing back on your journey. And certainly I I I appreciate how at times those chaotic sprints it can take an impact. And ⁓ just very, very grateful for the lessons learned. Thank you.
speaker-0: Thank you, appreciate you.