Full Transcript for Photography Mindset Shifts for Sustainable Growth with Alora Rachelle

Sheets, Google Docs, all the things gets lost personally. But, yeah, so I was tired of that specific issue and I decided to go into Notion and be like, okay, how can I build like a centralized CEO hub of all of my, data, basically my marketing data, my sales goals. I have a database of all the courses that I'm enrolled in that I have purchased. the payment plan, how much it costs, how long I have access, is it lifetime, is it 12 months? And the login information and the notes that I take. And so having all of that and just linking to multiple things, I can be like, okay, what am I not caught up on? What did I purchase recently that could be lost in my emails? So that is another thing. And [00:04:00] then also for marketing. I have a database for just like my podcast interviews and the podcast that I'm guesting on my own podcast, and then I am working on my Instagram and being more present. So we kind of have to have a marketing system where it's not like all your eggs in one basket. For example, all of us decide Instagram. Because it's quick, it's easy. You get that dopamine hit, you get the likes, the comments, or maybe get neither because the algorithm is trash, let's be real. But a lot of people put their, you know, efforts there. But having just the focus on an Instagram is not gonna help you if something happens and you're out of commission for a week or two, or there's a family emergency and or you just burn out and you wanna ghost, you know, get off the grid. Personally, have done many times, So having a long-term strategy of being like, okay, how's my blogging? How's my SEO? And then also am I gonna dabble in ads? And so having a database with all of those things staring at you and [00:05:00] you can schedule them all on a calendar, has been such a game changer for me. Now, I am a little bit of a slacker still on Instagram because I just, I don't know. I'll do stories. I show up, I'll do that. I don't know if I can do three to five posts every week. That's just not, yeah, I mean, I don't know if you can relate, but I don't just, I just, [00:05:18] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Oh yeah. [00:05:19] Alora Rachelle: Not something I think about every day. Like, man, what am I gonna post on Instagram today? It's like, okay, what is my long-term strategy? Like, how is this sustainable? Do I have the capacity? So, um, yeah, that's how I built my marketing database in Notion. [00:05:33] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: It's nice 'cause, um, talking about like the Instagram thing in particular, having as a database and then you can have a different view as a calendar and you can drag and drop to see, visualize, you know, how consistent am I on Instagram? So what is my potential? Um, it's, it's a, it's a good thing that, it's a good, it's a good solution for sure. Um. Personally,when I, when I do databases, I'm using, I'm using [00:06:00] Airtable. they don't, they can connect to each other. They don't connect to each other, I guess, as well as Notion might, depending on the Airtable plan in, I guess. But, yeah, I don't know. I, I also feel like I know not everybody wants to utilize the Google ecosystem as much. As we probably are already. but I definitely see Google moving into a Notion they have been already, right. Moving into a Notion,type of solution for, for people, right? Google Docs have had a lot of Notion features, Google Sheets already, a lot of Notion features. and there is actually an Airtable alternative that Google has built. so I definitely see all this coming into Google, the Google workspace ecosystem, included in, in due time. That's, that's my prediction. I see it happening probably by 2026, but we'll see. We'll see, we'll see. but it is nice that, uh, [00:07:00] you have been able to build something that is intertwined and cohesive and visualized enough for. Everything you have going on, you know, in your business. So, [00:07:10] Alora Rachelle: I kind of wanna learn more about the Google universe. So you're saying they're building dashboards then, or, 'cause I know Airtable has interfaces and I use Airtable to run, like my programs, everybody's a student, they have records, all that stuff is there, like that's separate. but I'm interested in the Google dashboard bit or whatever [00:07:30] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Yeah. So. So Google's Airtable, alter competitor, whatever you wanna call it, is called tables. it like, go Google tables or whatever it is. and yeah, it has different views and all the same stuff that Airtable does. It's, uh, it's not as, I'm gonna say not as robust as, as Airtable. but it was part of their like labs. Feature, you know, whether they have a, they have like a group of employees that just build stuff to see what happens. It was part, [00:08:00] it's part of that. So it hasn't evolved publicly [00:08:03] Alora Rachelle: Mm-hmm. [00:08:04] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: in quite some time. But, Google, Google knows that people are using Notion, so you know that they're working on it. Right. It's just a matter of time, so, [00:08:11] Alora Rachelle: Hmm. I think that's interesting. but you think that Google, is it tables, Google tables is gonna replace, you think Airtable by like next year? I. [00:08:23] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: I think there will be a sort of more official Google tables that is available to everybody, that they will push for people to utilize. And I, my, my, uh, my theory is that, my guess is that, maybe it's my hope who knows, is that, uh, it will be incorporated like within a Google doc. You will be able to deeply integrate a Google sheet and a table and whatever, you know, [00:08:56] Alora Rachelle: Yeah. [00:08:59] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: making it [00:09:00] make it a more fluid, cohesive solution. That's my guess. [00:09:03] Alora Rachelle: I mean, because the multiple, I don't even know, what do you call them? They, they don't intertwine with each other, and so. You can put 'em in a Google Drive folder and that's great. Sometimes

it doesn't work, you know? But I just feel like, yeah, right now it's like, okay, you have a Google Doc and then you lose it. Because everybody uses Google Docs. I sometimes I'll just make a Google Sheet just to do a simple calculation, 'cause I'm not a math girl. And then that's also lost. So that is interesting to see how that would go. I don't [00:09:28] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Yeah. I mean, now if you launch a Google Doc, you can actually right away choose a template that looks exactly like an Notion. so I. And, and you could, even if you're started typing something and you wanna reference a Google sheet or a Google slide, or you wanna reference a Google form or another Google doc, you hit the at sign and start typing like you're mentioning something and then it, now you've got that document linked, direct it, so it, they're moving in that direction. [00:09:54] Alora Rachelle: Huh. That's very, are you a Google guy? Like is, [00:09:57] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: I, so I am definitely, I [00:10:00] definitely fall in the line of, I'd rather not use Google as much as I'm using Google. But I'm so deeply in it at this point after years and years and years that it's like leaving, leaving is more of a hassle than it is to stay right at that point. [00:10:16] Alora Rachelle: No, it totally makes sense. [00:10:17] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: yeah. so the, the second thing that you mentioned to me that, that is going well in your workflow is your use of chat GPT. as an AI fan, myself, working for a an AI company. I, I and someone who's been using chat GPT for years as well, I am, uh, I love seeing when people, intelligently use chat, GPT. So share with me. How are you using chat? Pt chat, GPT in, in your business? [00:10:45] Alora Rachelle: Oh my gosh. Uh, for so many things. I actually recently left chat GPT for Claude, because, and I call 'em chatty B, but like Chatty B was giving me like some crazy answers and I'm like, okay, I need you to make this sound smarter. Okay, this is my tone of voice, like, so [00:11:00] I have uploaded documents. 'cause you have to feed your AI like a baby, but like you go from like. Instead of having mushy food, you instantly go into solid food. Like this is a Google Doc and it's uploaded as a PDF. This is my brand voice. These are all the things that I say, this is what I believe. This is my backstory. These are all like the products that I have, the things I wanna do, my goals, my missions. And so after feeding it that much for so long, you add it to a project. And now Chatty Bee should be so smart in everything concerning those documents. So. I have done that to update my website copy and make it sound like me. And it was really hard to get the witty and sarcasm just right without being too offensive. 'cause sometimes it doesn't sound like a person. It sounds like a person that like wants to fit in at the lunch table and you're like, where did you come from? but after tweaking for like months and months of that, I feel like I finally mastered the ability to have chat GPT, create my content for me. And I think it's, it's, I don't know, like I can [00:12:00] have sometimes, like I will tweak it a little bit just to make it sound a little bit more like a real person, but for the most part it's pretty flawless. And then, at least for me, 'cause I am a photography strategist, so like with my students, there are chat, GPT, like bots all over my program. In my curriculum, if there's something that everyone's getting stuck on, I'll just like make a bot. I'll make a bot and I will train it and I will give it lots of information. Like, I think I've, I usually spend about five to six hours on a really, really good informational bot. I've created a mindset one where if people just need like therapy, they just need like a quick mindset shift based on what we teach and like all the different methods of like from scarcity to growth. This can't happen for me, imposter syndrome. And so you can literally say, I'm struggling with this, and the bot would be like, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom. Now how are you gonna move forward? So that has been helpful.and then creating ones that help you come up with content ideas based on like what your goals are or just like showcasing your work [00:13:00] and being like, what words does this, you know, bring up? Or how does this resonate? What feelings do these images evoke? Because as photographers, we're so close to our work, we're so close to the whole business, sometimes we can't see like the forest between the trees. And so being able to sometimes just like. Upload something and be like, okay, what's going on? No, that's not connecting. Yes, that is connecting. so yeah, I feel like AI in terms of like, not necessarily creating things from scratch, but auditing, cleaning up and just like making sure that you're not so in your head that you can kind of like offboard it to a virtual bestie in a way. Yeah. [00:13:39] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: y ou mentioned that you switched to Claude recently. [00:13:41] Alora Rachelle: Yeah. [00:13:42] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: What was the differentiation? The different, what's, that's not what it, what's the, what was the, the driver, what was like the, last. [00:13:54] Alora Rachelle: Straw. [00:13:55] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Last straw that you had with chat gt Good, that's a good word. to, to, to make you [00:14:00] switch to claw. Like what, what did it for you? [00:14:01] Alora Rachelle: Oh man. I dunno. I feel like. I, like I said, I fed, I feed them both. They have like seven to eight documents of of content, of information back history. Everything and Chatty B was just giving me such like stuff, stuff that I already see online. Like, you know, when somebody puts something through chat GBT, you're like, okay, that was, that was ai. That was ai. Like, they didn't even put any effort. They, they just literally just posted that I wasn't trying to have that. I don't want people to look at

something and be like, oh, she didn't even like create that or audit it. She just posted it. And so I kept getting the same response over and over and it kept sounding less and less human. And I was like, I have spent a month training you. And then someone was like, oh, well Claude sounds, it's like more, personality or just a little bit more resonant.current, I don't know. The language is, the language barrier is completely different to me. So I love Claude. Now they say Claude doesn't have a good, uh, memory as chat GPT, so some [00:15:00] people have both. I'm not doing all that, but yeah, I like Claude's answers and then if it's not perfect, I'll be like, rewrite this, but add a little bit more wit, take away some of the sarcasm. You're a little mean, you know, and they get it usually within the first two to three tries. But yeah, I like Claude better for that reason. [00:15:17] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: one, so two things to share. One is, uh, I noticed that lately chat, GPT has been adding, you know, the, uh, I don't know what the, what the symbol is, but where it's uh, it's like two hyphens, but like, sort of like butt together where it looks like one long hyphen, [00:15:35] Alora Rachelle: Oh M Dash, [00:15:37] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: is that what it is? [00:15:38] Alora Rachelle: is it the really long [00:15:39] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: It's a really long line. Yeah. I've noticed that lately it's been using it way more than it ever has and I don't know if it's because like at this point I've trained Chat Petit to stop using Delve and all those other words that are very obvious. [00:15:55] Alora Rachelle: Yes. [00:15:56] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: And, and I wonder if it's trying to like, make [00:16:00] up for, by adding these, these characters again, that could be a part of the memory thing of it trying to evolve. anyway, I thought that was hilarious. The, the other thing, sort of going back to the Google thing, um, something I've been trying to build lately with chat, GPT is in the magic community, we get asked quite often like, Hey, here's a editing style that I love. What AI profile do you recommend? So I built with a lot of prompting and some other stuff, uh, I built a, uh, my GBT that anybody could, in theory, if this worked properly, upload an image. It would describe the editing style of that image, and then recommend any AI profile that is available for Imagine, based on that image, [00:16:46] Alora Rachelle: Wow. [00:16:47] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: chat. JPD likes to make up stuff that doesn't exist, even though it has all the instructions and all the data points. I made a, uh, Google their Gemini, which I, I don't really use often, but I like to [00:17:00] play around. I like to compare, right? and I haven't tried it with Claude yet, but I gave the same exact instructions to Google Gemini in a, in what they call a gem works perfect, absolutely perfect. But first try, gems are not shareable like my gpt are. where, where it's working better as far as the results go. I, I can't do anything with it for, for, for the community. So it's just very interesting that to compare and contrast. Right. yeah. But, but, but chat, GPT like likes to make up a whole bunch of stuff that I'm like, not, not only is it making up like profile names and taking real photographers and giving it a profile name, but it's giving them me fake links that just don't work. And it's just like, what are you doing? Yeah. [00:17:46] Alora Rachelle: it's a certified yapper with no information. [00:17:49] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Yeah. Yeah. But, it nails it with like the description of the editing style, right. That it does really well. Um, which I think is something that chat GPT has going on for it. It can do things like [00:18:00] that very well. but, uh, yeah, typically when I do a GA, my GPT, it's, it's great, right? But sometimes it's, it's not, and [00:18:11] Alora Rachelle: tweaking. [00:18:14] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: yeah. So there'll be even times where I'd be like, I'd be like, only use the data that I provided with you. And, and then it says, it replies and says, okay, I have strengthened my, my restrictions to only do that. And yet it still [00:18:28] Alora Rachelle: No, it doesn't. Listen, that's, that was probably, I should have summed that up. Chad. GPT doesn't listen. It does its own freaking thing. I'm like, what are you doing? And this is not what I asked for and the emoji bomb. I'm like, what are these emojis right now? [00:18:41] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Yep. [00:18:42] Alora Rachelle: It's overwhelming. It's too happy. [00:18:45] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: I, I would be curious. I should, I should, um, try this in, in Claude and see, see what it does compared to the others. so anyway. [00:18:53] Alora Rachelle: it once and I was sold, so yeah, I was like, get me outta here. [00:18:58] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Yeah.[00:19:00] so you moving into like what's not working well that you're struggling with, that you're working on improving?you mentioned to me that. U m, you are working on more consistency with a, um, four part marketing system. Can you explain what that means? and maybe others can learn and do the same. Mm-hmm. [00:19:24] Alora Rachelle: so the first part is short term, which is social media, anything that disappears or lives shortly. And then long term is anything between like, blogs, SEO, you know, your website I guess can count to. But long-term marketing is more, it's like a slow burn and short-term marketing is a little bit more fast-paced. And then there's also like networking, collabing, word of mouth, you know, all those things. and then there's ads, which kind of like is a standalone. It's like the pay to play. So. Personally, I, I think in the past, for years, have put all my eggs in short term, [00:20:00] but if something happens or I disappear or I just get tired, like I'm also off of the face of the earth and I don't think that's sustainable. And so, you

know, even the wedding photography industry, you always talk about blogging, right? You need to blog your weddings, you need to talk about their stories. And use very specific keywords. Use search engine optimization in terms of like the titles, all those things, which is actually what Noel is talking about with my students right now. but like blog and SEOI think is where everyone's lacking because everyone loves the dopamine rush of Instagram,whatever it's giving us. And then me personally, I am focusing more on like in-person events. I'm trying to get back out there now that the pandemic is. Supposedly really gone knock on wood. and literally it's like we don't, I know it's been five years, but like, don't come back like, [00:20:49] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Yeah, yeah. We're good. We're good. We don't need you anymore. [00:20:51] Alora Rachelle: so good. Um. But yeah, I, I'm actually coming up with like a strategy plan of being like, what is, like my goal behind my posts? [00:21:00] What can I do sustainably if I am gonna, you know, dip my toe in short term, maybe like one, two posts a week. But then, like, I'm putting all of my efforts into like blog and SEO this year, being like, okay, I need to build my house. And I feel like, you know, Instagram is. I don't know, the window, the front door, I don't know. It didn't work out. And so like ads, I wanna play around with that too. I'm hearing about Google ads versus meta ads and how there's like, there's differentiation there in terms of pricing. There's differentiation there in terms of like the cost per lead and the keywords. So pretty much that, and having a, a database where I can color code, like, okay. All of these categories are under short term. All of these categories are under long term. So I can look at the color and know, okay, there's a lot of short term, there's not enough long term. Or, you know, maybe we're not doing ads this summer. We'll do ads later. and then also, am I collaborating? Am I doing something, you know, with someone else? am I putting my name out there? Am I going to impro? Am I being visible? And I [00:22:00] feel like that's really what marketing is, is working on your visibility constantly. Because I think that, you know, we think marketing is optional, but it, it's really not because if you don't get bookings, you don't, I mean, if you don't get inquiries, don't get bookings, and then you don't make money. Like it starts with marketing and it ends with sales. And so yeah, that's what I've been working on just for myself. And then with my students too, all of them said like, actually we're doing really good with Instagram and Facebook groups are making a resurgence. But, I hate blogging. I don't wanna do it. Or SEO, what is that? What's a key word? And so Noella was walking them through like all of their backend and the back links and explain the terminology, and everyone was just like, mind blown. Because the word of mouth, the client experience, that's

easy. Like everyone just, just to be a good person and they'll refer you. But what about all the other things? So it's like looking for the gaps and seeing where you need to make adjustments so that you can have better results. [00:22:55] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: yeah. Um, so prior to working at Imagine I worked at a company [00:23:00] who was in the photography website space for 10 years. I worked for that company and talking about SEO and talking about blogging. That was my life for 10 years. And, so like, it's funny, like. Uh, I feel like I still hear about it. I have for a very long time. and yet there's, there's communities that don't talk about it and then, then they start, right? And it's like brand new to them, or they put it off for so long and now they have to focus on it or now they want to focus on, or whatever it might be. So it is interesting that, your, your students are sort of fairly new to them to now think about. Okay. I gotta go back to the website part because Instagram, you know, is Instagram. Yeah. I am curious, since you started doing this, if, since your students started doing this as well, are they seeing a shift in their, in where their leads come from beyond Instagram? Is it, is Instagram now going down a bit [00:24:00] as other things go up? how's that? How has it, how has it been working so far? [00:24:03] Alora Rachelle: Yeah. Um, one of my students, she decided to go full throttle on SEO for about six to 12 months, and she was dabbling with Instagram as we all do, trying to figure out what. What, and so eventually after that, after that year of her just like adjusting and posting and making sure everything is resonant with like her dream couples and stuff, she booked like 90% of her weddings from SEO. She was like, so I can take Instagram vacations. Bye. See ya. So it does work. It's not instant though, like you have to trust the process, but I feel like, and this is just me in general, like whatever you make work will work. You know what I mean? If you wanna focus on this and you're putting all of your effort in that, it's probably going to work. I can't say that for Instagram, but. If you find a strategy and it works for you and sustainable, then maybe it will, you know, or maybe you do it in the way that you [00:25:00] want to show up, and maybe your energy is different because you want to show up in Instagram stories versus dancing on reels. Or maybe you do talking reels instead of dancing. You know, whatever it is that that seems to kind of work with, like your energy, I feel like is gonna work because you're gonna put all of your efforts there and then people just know when you're passionate about something. I don't know, it's just my opinion. [00:25:18] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: I think with, with AI becoming. A huge component of of SEO at this point. Um, it's going beyond just the, the, the algorithm of, of search engines. It's now AI is now thinking, for lack of better word, um, to what, what, what to

give you as an answer, right? so in a way it, it becomes even more a. Show what you wanna sell, show what you wanna book type of situation. in the same way as as Instagram is, show, show, show yourself and what you [00:26:00] want to book and people will contact you to book.now, now, these days beyond just the core SEO values that have really not changed much over the years, I think. It's, and I'm, I'm experiencing this myself in my own photography, is, the more I blog and create content on my website about what I want to book and where I want to book, I am getting those leads nonstop. [00:26:30] Alora Rachelle: Wow. [00:26:32] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: So it's, it really is, um, a, a good example of this is, and it's funny, the last podcast episode I just recorded, we sort of talked about this a little bit as well. I live near Princeton University. I'm about 35 minutes away from the campus, and it's a beautiful campus. I typically get clients who want their photography there because they went there, they, the couple they met at the university. But sometimes I [00:27:00] get clients or leads because I don't always book everybody. I get leads that did not go there, but still want their photos there. So I'll question it if they don't tell me in the, in the lead form why they chose that location. I'll ask One was, and I photograph this session one was, that they love Harry Potter and the architecture of the campus is very much Harry Potter vibes. Then I had one recently that they said, oh, well we just saw your portfolio and we, we really like the photos that were at Princeton. I'm like, great, but it has no meaning for you besides just what you saw. So you booked based on what I showed you. [00:27:43] Alora Rachelle: That [00:27:44] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: And it happens a lot. So, um, food for thought, for, for those listening is just think about, not just. Blogging for SEO purposes, but show if there's a wedding venue that you love [00:28:00] photographing at, or you want to get on their, on their preferred list as a photographer, show that a lot, you know, not only will you catch search engines with their new AI features too, but you'll also catch the attention of the, of the venue. You'll catch the attention of. The couples that are gonna have their weddings there. So it's a good, it's a good thing to do. [00:28:22] Alora Rachelle: Yeah, I know. Um, in addition to doing like wedding posts specifically. Is also like having a post per venue or the vendor relationships that you have too, which is good for their SEO, your SEO and all that other great stuff. But I feel like too, it just shows your expertise and people will look to you from that perspective of like, oh, they know what they're talking about. They're professional. These are the photos they've taken here. This is the advice they have for us. Like, we're gonna obviously like inquire with them. So I do feel like, I mean that seems like the, the very tale is old as time, but like show

what you wanna shoot, but. It seems to kind of hold its ground for decades. [00:28:59] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: [00:29:00] Oh, yeah, totally does. Totally does. And again, like it, it shifts, right? I mean, at one point it was, it was all, everybody was all in on Instagram. Right. And, and the same thing was talking about what to do on Instagram. And uh, I feel like things come full circle and it always comes back to own your own domain, right? Own, own your own content. And, and, um, in a way, SEO is kind of another form of word of mouth, right? It's just the search engines are showing that they trust you more than people. So. That's the way I look at it at least, [00:29:39] Alora Rachelle: Yeah. I feel like we are kind of generation two, that if we want something, we're just gonna look it up, you know what I mean? And we get instant. Gratification knowing, oh, okay, this is what I want, like I wanna do, or this is what I want, this is what I wanna hire for. Oh, this person came up, page one, page two, page three. Like, I'm gonna inquire with all of these people. So, I mean, it does [00:30:00] pay off in the long run. Like once you're on that, everyone wants to be in the first page of Google. It's a big deal. You know? And I don't know, I search a lot of things. I don't even ask people verbally. And I was like, oh, okay. Good to know. First article, eh, you know, take it as a take it for base value. [00:30:15] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Yeah.one, one question before we, uh, before we wrap this up. I f you were to give advice to a photographer just getting started, they've had experience in photography, but they're just getting started in the business side of things, what, what would it be? [00:30:34] Alora Rachelle: Oh my goodness. It's mindset. It'll always be mindset. because when you get started, you're either really excited and also really scared at the same time. And sometimes the the scariness kind of over. Wells, the ambition. And so like people are so excited to say, oh, I can't wait till I do this, or I want to do this, and they don't end up doing it. It's being like, work on your mindset as much [00:31:00] as possible so you can just kind of hit the ground running. Um, whether it's about money and understanding like you're deserving of money and maybe you didn't come from money and just like having. Just the understanding of like, I can make money, literally I can make money, I can talk about money. Money can happen for me. And then of course about the skills. Oh, I can't raise my prices 'cause I don't know this skill yet. Or I was like, how can you learn that skill being in the way of like reframing constantly instead of living on this negative hamster wheel. Being like, okay, how? But how can I come to a solution? Because that can't be the end. Somebody else has done this before. Why can't it happen for me? So I always will say, work on your mindset. I'm still working on my mindset, constantly been in business for like 15 years now at this point. And I'm still working through mindset because every single level is gonna be a different set of issues, you know? So yeah, that would be my advice. [00:31:54] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Amazing. Amazing. Alora, where can everybody learn more about you? [00:32:00] Check out the, you know, the, the business mentorships and whatnot that you offer, the events you'll be speaking at. Where can they find all the stuff about Alora? [00:32:08] Alora Rachelle: Yeah. AloraRachelle.com and Instagram is,  Alora.Rachelle. And then my podcast is Wedding Atelier. So yeah, all the things. [00:32:16] Scott Wyden Kivowitz: Sweet. be sure to check out the podcast, subscribe as well. I will be on that podcast at some point soon as well, so very exciting. so we'll be linking to all that in the show notes. thank you everybody for listening. Alora, thank you for, for hopping in and chatting with me. I love I. Hearing different perspectives on everything, and I know everybody's gonna walk away with some good nuggets, [00:32:39] Alora Rachelle: Thank you for having me. ​ [00:33:00]