Full Transcript for Trans-Dimensional Realities - Neil Ward: Modern Mysteries of the Unexplained

achieve a certain grade of achievement, kind 71 00:04:48.639 --> 00:04:51.839 of medals and certificates and things like that. And they 72 00:04:51.839 --> 00:04:54.879 were all experienced skiers, and they were going out in 73 00:04:55.000 --> 00:04:58.639 January out into the Ural mountains, which is going to 74 00:04:58.680 --> 00:05:00.759 be pretty damn cold out there at that time of year, 75 00:05:00.759 --> 00:05:04.319 to be honest, But they were all experienced skiers. They're 76 00:05:04.439 --> 00:05:08.000 led by a young guy who's twenty three. I might 77 00:05:08.040 --> 00:05:10.480 have got his Christian name wrong, but it could be Yury, 78 00:05:10.600 --> 00:05:12.480 but I may be wrong. I know that one of 79 00:05:12.480 --> 00:05:16.439 them is called Yury Diatloff, who was I think he 80 00:05:16.560 --> 00:05:20.439 was studying to be an engineer, but the ski thing 81 00:05:20.600 --> 00:05:24.040 was another kind of string to his bow, as it were. 82 00:05:24.560 --> 00:05:28.319 And they all kind of went out there on trains 83 00:05:28.399 --> 00:05:31.639 and trucks and things like that, you know, like hop 84 00:05:31.720 --> 00:05:34.959 in from one location to another, staying overnight at one location, 85 00:05:35.680 --> 00:05:38.680 meeting school kids, telling them about their adventures that were 86 00:05:38.720 --> 00:05:41.519 to come, and they retrieved a lot of the information 87 00:05:41.639 --> 00:05:43.759 from a daily diary that one of the young girls 88 00:05:43.759 --> 00:05:46.319 that was part of this party was keeping on a 89 00:05:46.399 --> 00:05:48.560 daily basis, and they also took lots of cameras, so 90 00:05:48.560 --> 00:05:50.199 there was a lot of evidence that they could look 91 00:05:50.240 --> 00:05:53.720 back on to try and work out what may have happened. 92 00:05:54.279 --> 00:05:58.560 And so when it came to the kind of third 93 00:05:58.680 --> 00:06:01.920 or fourth day in one other party had to turn 94 00:06:02.040 --> 00:06:06.000 back because he had got injuries from a previous expedition 95 00:06:06.079 --> 00:06:08.439 somewhere and they weren't kind of there was causing him 96 00:06:08.519 --> 00:06:12.920 grief basically, so he had to abandon the party and said, 97 00:06:13.079 --> 00:06:16.120 I've got to go back. So because of that decision, 98 00:06:16.240 --> 00:06:18.279 it was a faithful decision because he was the only 99 00:06:18.319 --> 00:06:20.839 one out of that group that survived by going back. 100 00:06:21.639 --> 00:06:24.519 And the group proceeded on for another ten days or so, 101 00:06:25.439 --> 00:06:29.079 and again the diary was being written on a daily basis, 102 00:06:29.959 --> 00:06:32.720 and then they heard no more from them after a 103 00:06:32.720 --> 00:06:37.000 certain period of time. They couldn't obviously communicate with radios 104 00:06:37.120 --> 00:06:40.439 or they were meant to kind of send a message 105 00:06:40.519 --> 00:06:42.879 by

I think it was telegram in those days. If 106 00:06:42.920 --> 00:06:44.839 they got to a certain town. They said, when we 107 00:06:44.839 --> 00:06:47.240 get to this town, we'll send you a telegram to 108 00:06:47.240 --> 00:06:50.600 their headquarters back at the college and we'll let you 109 00:06:50.639 --> 00:06:53.319 know how we are now. The college didn't receive a 110 00:06:53.360 --> 00:06:56.759 telegram on the day in question, and they just assumed 111 00:06:56.759 --> 00:06:59.439 way it must be bad whether they've been slightly delayed 112 00:06:59.639 --> 00:07:04.040 in in there. But no word was reached for many days, 113 00:07:04.079 --> 00:07:06.759 and eventually they decided to call out a search party, 114 00:07:07.439 --> 00:07:10.600 and because of the bad weather, they couldn't find them 115 00:07:11.199 --> 00:07:14.519 until at least February. They found some of the party 116 00:07:15.639 --> 00:07:18.759 out in this area which has now been named Diatlov Pass, 117 00:07:19.040 --> 00:07:22.319 named after the leader of this group. And there's actually 118 00:07:22.319 --> 00:07:24.480 a great, big kind of monument that marks their death 119 00:07:24.560 --> 00:07:27.160 and it's called their pips on it. And they found 120 00:07:27.240 --> 00:07:30.639 them on this kind of mountain side it's actually called 121 00:07:30.680 --> 00:07:33.439 Death Mountain. They believe they was trekking up this mountain 122 00:07:33.480 --> 00:07:36.120 which is known locally as Death Mountain. So you couldn't 123 00:07:36.120 --> 00:07:40.639 get a more onymous kind of setting, really, And they 124 00:07:40.680 --> 00:07:43.319 found some were faced down in the snow by a tree, 125 00:07:43.319 --> 00:07:45.720 a cedar tree that had just been frozen. Some of 126 00:07:45.759 --> 00:07:48.399 their clothes were missing. They found the tent that they 127 00:07:48.439 --> 00:07:51.759 were all staying in completely torn and cut from the inside. 128 00:07:51.800 --> 00:07:53.759 When they analyzed the tent, they flew off the tent 129 00:07:53.839 --> 00:07:57.399 to get forensic analysis on it, and it wasn't until 130 00:07:57.439 --> 00:08:00.879 about three months later, as the snow began to thaw, 131 00:08:01.000 --> 00:08:05.160 that the locals managed to find what they believed could 132 00:08:05.160 --> 00:08:08.800 be disturbances in the snow as it melted. And sure enough, 133 00:08:08.800 --> 00:08:12.240 when they began digging with the special police and the 134 00:08:12.240 --> 00:08:15.079 military that was looking for them, they did find two 135 00:08:15.120 --> 00:08:18.160 bodies or was it four, three or four that had 136 00:08:18.160 --> 00:08:22.240 fallen down in sis ravine in a river. One of 137 00:08:22.240 --> 00:08:26.480 them they detected radioactive materials on their clothing, which was interesting, 138 00:08:28.480 --> 00:08:33.399 and the others they had like a crushed rib cage. 139 00:08:33.919 --> 00:08:36.919

Their eyes had been pulled out, tongues have been removed. 140 00:08:38.679 --> 00:08:40.799 Yet the things they buried, they were buried under like 141 00:08:40.879 --> 00:08:44.600 ten feet of snow at this point. So their speculation 142 00:08:44.679 --> 00:08:47.600 of what caused all those injuries was it animals like 143 00:08:47.679 --> 00:08:50.960 scavenger animals that were eating the corpses. But how could 144 00:08:50.960 --> 00:08:53.200 they do that they're under ten feet of snow. Maybe 145 00:08:53.360 --> 00:08:56.360 they ate the eyes and the tongue before the thing 146 00:08:56.440 --> 00:08:59.039 clapsed into the ravine, but it looked like they were 147 00:08:59.039 --> 00:09:00.879 trying to build a camp or something. In this film, 148 00:09:01.039 --> 00:09:03.600 thing had just clapped, but it could be that snow 149 00:09:03.639 --> 00:09:08.080 had fallen on them as well, causing their chest to 150 00:09:08.120 --> 00:09:10.279 get crushed and things. But some of them had their 151 00:09:10.320 --> 00:09:12.679 whole skin removed off their skull. If I mean, if 152 00:09:12.720 --> 00:09:14.240 you've got on the internet, you can find these pictures. 153 00:09:14.279 --> 00:09:17.519 They are quite disturbing. So I'd recommend that those of 154 00:09:17.559 --> 00:09:20.960 a nervous disposition maybe not to venture too closely into that. 155 00:09:21.559 --> 00:09:24.440 But it was the fact that the deaths were covered 156 00:09:24.519 --> 00:09:26.679 up by the Soviet authorities at the time, and it's 157 00:09:26.679 --> 00:09:29.080 only when the Berlin Wall collapsed in nineteen eighty nine 158 00:09:29.080 --> 00:09:32.639 did this story of these nine missing skiers sort of 159 00:09:32.639 --> 00:09:37.120 come to light. And the prosecutor involved in the case, 160 00:09:37.120 --> 00:09:39.759 who was a guy that was essentially he was the 161 00:09:39.879 --> 00:09:43.440 lead policeman on the case. He was told to keep 162 00:09:43.519 --> 00:09:45.440 quiet about a lot of that sort of stuff, and 163 00:09:46.639 --> 00:09:50.000 he was pretty sure that it could have been involved 164 00:09:50.000 --> 00:09:51.960 with the UFO. He think that they a lot of 165 00:09:52.000 --> 00:09:54.279 them have been shot by what he termed a death 166 00:09:54.360 --> 00:09:58.720 ray from a UFO because their cameras revealed photographs. Certainly 167 00:09:58.759 --> 00:10:05.159 the last shots revealed range lights in the sky. Yeah, 168 00:10:05.399 --> 00:10:09.360 I mean they did admit some years later the Soviet 169 00:10:09.559 --> 00:10:14.159 military were testing out what they call parachute mines, which 170 00:10:14.159 --> 00:10:17.159 are these mines that get launched from aeroplanes or fired 171 00:10:17.159 --> 00:10:20.039 from rockets or something. They come down on a parachute 172 00:10:20.440 --> 00:10:23.559 and they explode near the enemy or something as they're 173 00:10:23.600 --> 00:10:27.600 coming down on

a parachute. So that could explain potentially 174 00:10:27.639 --> 00:10:30.679 the lights that they had photographed. They didn't want to 175 00:10:30.720 --> 00:10:33.080 admit that they were maybe dropping these bombs in their 176 00:10:33.120 --> 00:10:35.879 area because they shouldn't have been doing it. But obviously, 177 00:10:35.879 --> 00:10:38.480 if this group of hikers had gone off course anyway, 178 00:10:38.879 --> 00:10:41.679 they were probably in the wrong place at the wrong time. 179 00:10:42.679 --> 00:10:46.799 So that was one potential explanation. But then the other 180 00:10:46.879 --> 00:10:50.240 explanation is, well, what's causing this radiation on some of 181 00:10:50.240 --> 00:10:53.720 the clothes you see. Now, it did turn out one 182 00:10:53.720 --> 00:10:58.399 of the explanations given to kind of explain that was 183 00:10:58.480 --> 00:11:02.399 that one of the party did work or had some 184 00:11:02.679 --> 00:11:09.840 association with a Russian atomic kind of factory or place 185 00:11:10.240 --> 00:11:14.039 where they were dealing with atomic and nuclear stuff, so 186 00:11:14.159 --> 00:11:17.919 that might explain some of the radiation. The important thing 187 00:11:17.960 --> 00:11:21.240 to note is that a lot of the clothes were 188 00:11:21.279 --> 00:11:23.759 found on these bodies were not actually their clothes, but 189 00:11:23.960 --> 00:11:27.000 they've taken from the other dead bodies, so as some 190 00:11:27.120 --> 00:11:30.639 died of frostbite, they would take their clothes off to 191 00:11:30.759 --> 00:11:33.320 keep for themselves to keep them warm. So they were 192 00:11:33.360 --> 00:11:36.240 really a lot of them are freezing to death basically. 193 00:11:37.039 --> 00:11:40.080 But when they held the funerals of these people, lots 194 00:11:40.120 --> 00:11:42.480 of eyewitnesses said that the color of the skin of 195 00:11:42.480 --> 00:11:45.600 the corpses when they were allowed to view them, didn't 196 00:11:45.600 --> 00:11:48.799 look right. They just didn't look like proper corpses. And 197 00:11:48.879 --> 00:11:53.279 so again that raised an anonymy with people about what 198 00:11:53.360 --> 00:11:57.759 possibly could have caused that. So and again you mentioned 199 00:11:57.759 --> 00:12:00.679 a yeti or a big foot. They did site a 200 00:12:01.039 --> 00:12:04.639 kind of creature or some shadowy figure through the trees, 201 00:12:04.679 --> 00:12:06.960 which they did take a photograph of, but you can't 202 00:12:07.000 --> 00:12:09.519 rediscern who it is or what it is exactly. It 203 00:12:09.559 --> 00:12:12.399 does look humanoid from a distance of maybe one hundred 204 00:12:12.559 --> 00:12:15.600 meters a well or so. And one of the young 205 00:12:15.639 --> 00:12:18.440 girls in a diary had written a kind of a 206 00:12:18.519 --> 00:12:21.480 jokey thing to say that we might even encounter the 207 00:12:21.559 --> 00:12:23.600 yetti out here. Who knows kind

of thing, you know, 208 00:12:23.960 --> 00:12:26.080 So there's lots of things there to kind of chew 209 00:12:26.159 --> 00:12:28.720 over and sort of think, well, what did kill these people? 210 00:12:28.919 --> 00:12:33.559 You see, see, I am unfamiliar with the parts of 211 00:12:33.559 --> 00:12:37.960 the story about the bodies found in the razine, in 212 00:12:38.000 --> 00:12:42.080 the ravine missing eyes and tongue, or the switching of clothes. 213 00:12:42.159 --> 00:12:46.919 Radiation that's all news to me. Shows you how I 214 00:12:46.960 --> 00:12:51.279 should have researched it more. But it's a fascinating case 215 00:12:51.559 --> 00:12:58.200 either way, because there's so many different elements from different explanations. 216 00:13:00.120 --> 00:13:04.080 I had always just assumed it was a yetty bigfoot attack, 217 00:13:05.120 --> 00:13:10.200 but now I'm starting to change that opinion. Seems like 218 00:13:10.240 --> 00:13:11.480 there is a lot more going on. 219 00:13:12.159 --> 00:13:15.679 Yeah, definitely. I mean, they did find some bodies that 220 00:13:15.960 --> 00:13:19.000 died they think earlier than the others. And the best 221 00:13:19.320 --> 00:13:22.519 explanation is that some died and when they died, they 222 00:13:22.759 --> 00:13:25.279 stole their clothes or took them respectfully off them to 223 00:13:25.360 --> 00:13:29.279 help them survive. But the thing is what caused them 224 00:13:29.360 --> 00:13:31.440 to suddenly cut their way out of the tent. So 225 00:13:31.519 --> 00:13:34.799 one of the other explanations, one of the more mundane explanations, 226 00:13:34.840 --> 00:13:40.200 is what they call a slab ice avalanche, where they 227 00:13:40.200 --> 00:13:43.039 think that an avalanche of literally slab ice is slid 228 00:13:43.039 --> 00:13:46.480 down the mountain toward them. They could probably hear it 229 00:13:46.519 --> 00:13:48.639 coming down the mountain towards them before it it actually 230 00:13:48.679 --> 00:13:50.960 struck the tent because they found the tent half buried 231 00:13:51.000 --> 00:13:55.519 in snow anyway, and so to find their way out quickly, 232 00:13:56.360 --> 00:13:58.559 can we get the zip open or the buttons undone 233 00:13:58.559 --> 00:14:01.080 of our tent or whatever is that holds it together, 234 00:14:01.440 --> 00:14:03.519 And they just took a knife and cut their way 235 00:14:03.519 --> 00:14:06.200 out quickly and then ran out the tent to get 236 00:14:06.240 --> 00:14:10.240 out the way of this oncoming slab ice. Really that 237 00:14:10.399 --> 00:14:13.039 may have killed a few of them, or they may 238 00:14:13.080 --> 00:14:15.240 have buried a few up to their necks in snow, 239 00:14:15.240 --> 00:14:17.759 and they may have dug their way out. But then 240 00:14:17.960 --> 00:14:20.360 some of them seem to have like a burn marks 241 00:14:20.840 --> 00:14:23.200 on their hands and arms, which could have been caused 242 00:14:23.200 --> 00:14:26.360 by campfires. Others seem to have bruises on their face, 243 00:14:26.639 --> 00:14:29.279 looked like someone had punched them up or something like that. 244 00:14:29.679 --> 00:14:32.720 So there was other people that sort of said, well, 245 00:14:32.759 --> 00:14:35.799 maybe they've been beaten up by the Russian military or something, 246 00:14:35.919 --> 00:14:40.919 you know, keep quiet about whatever we're doing here, and 247 00:14:41.000 --> 00:14:43.039 threatened them, or they may have been killed by the 248 00:14:43.080 --> 00:14:45.759 local populace, which is the people that lived out in 249 00:14:45.759 --> 00:14:50.519 those areas that herd it reindeer. So lots of people 250 00:14:50.559 --> 00:14:54.879 came under suspicion. But the guy that was the prosecutor 251 00:14:54.960 --> 00:14:58.120 found that his hands were tied to a certain extent 252 00:14:58.159 --> 00:15:01.879 because he felt that he couldn't proceed too much digging 253 00:15:02.240 --> 00:15:04.399 further into it because it was rough aled a few 254 00:15:04.440 --> 00:15:07.360 feathers higher up the chain, and so a lot of 255 00:15:07.399 --> 00:15:10.679 it is a mystery simply because people are not willing 256 00:15:10.720 --> 00:15:15.279 to divulge the nature of what's happened within the Russian 257 00:15:15.279 --> 00:15:18.559 government at that time and what happened out in the mountains, 258 00:15:18.559 --> 00:15:21.159 and basically lots of people lost their jobs are allowing 259 00:15:21.200 --> 00:15:25.159 them to go out there, and they forbid people to 260 00:15:25.159 --> 00:15:26.960 go into their air i for another three or four 261 00:15:27.080 --> 00:15:29.320 years after the event happened. I guess they just wanted 262 00:15:29.360 --> 00:15:32.159 to make sure that things weren't going to go or 263 00:15:32.200 --> 00:15:34.159 it gave them time to clear away evidence that they 264 00:15:34.159 --> 00:15:36.279 didn't want people to find. Maybe I don't know, but 265 00:15:36.320 --> 00:15:39.879 it's a very hard to get to place anyway. People 266 00:15:40.000 --> 00:15:42.799 obviously still go there, but only they're very determined, you know, 267 00:15:42.919 --> 00:15:46.039 those that are perhaps experienced hikers with people that know 268 00:15:46.080 --> 00:15:50.519 the way around there. But it's a very strange case. 269 00:15:50.519 --> 00:15:53.399 I mean, some people speculated it could be UFOs that 270 00:15:53.440 --> 00:15:57.000 are doing what they call human mutilations and things. Can't 271 00:15:57.039 --> 00:16:01.759 prove it, but it's one sort of like possibility, considering 272 00:16:01.840 --> 00:16:05.840 that the head guy that was investigating it did think 273 00:16:06.080 --> 00:16:09.360 it was UFOs, and certainly there was reports from other 274 00:16:09.440 --> 00:16:12.080 people that believed they'd seen UFOs and lights in the 275 00:16:12.120 --> 00:16:16.320 sky as well, which may not be

those parachute bombs. 276 00:16:16.360 --> 00:16:20.120 They could have been genuine UFOs, but who knows. Who knows. 277 00:16:20.840 --> 00:16:24.000 Fascinating case. I mean, I don't think we're ever going 278 00:16:24.000 --> 00:16:26.200 to give the full answers for it because it happened 279 00:16:26.240 --> 00:16:31.320 so long ago under the Soviet Union. So but it's 280 00:16:31.360 --> 00:16:33.159 a fascinating mystery. 281 00:16:34.240 --> 00:16:37.039 Yeah, it's one of those ones that every few years 282 00:16:37.559 --> 00:16:41.360 people seem to like have another crack at it, basically, 283 00:16:41.559 --> 00:16:44.879 And I know that in about twenty eighteen or nineteen 284 00:16:45.360 --> 00:16:47.240 they sent a team out there to come up with 285 00:16:47.279 --> 00:16:50.759 some various theories, and then more recently about twenty twenty 286 00:16:50.840 --> 00:16:54.080 three twenty four, another team went out there to try 287 00:16:54.080 --> 00:16:57.320 and come up with some theories. And the only explanation 288 00:16:57.480 --> 00:17:03.519 the Offishy came up with they were by some powerful force, 289 00:17:03.600 --> 00:17:06.519 but they didn't really explain what that powerful force was 290 00:17:06.759 --> 00:17:11.240 whether it's of nature or of man or or something offworldly. 291 00:17:11.599 --> 00:17:13.319 They didn't really go into detail, so it was a 292 00:17:13.440 --> 00:17:16.440 very abstract kind of explanation of what killed them. 293 00:17:16.880 --> 00:17:22.200 There's something that I've been really interested in studying lately, 294 00:17:23.279 --> 00:17:25.680 which may or may not have anything to do with 295 00:17:25.759 --> 00:17:30.240 this case. But it's all the stories out of in 296 00:17:30.440 --> 00:17:36.319 the US, out of Appalachia, and there's stories where the 297 00:17:36.400 --> 00:17:42.200 locals have rules because there's so many incidents of high strangeness, 298 00:17:43.079 --> 00:17:48.960 different creatures, Bigfoot especially, but like a big Gallin like creature, 299 00:17:50.000 --> 00:17:56.119 which is it's crazy as hell. But some of the 300 00:17:56.160 --> 00:18:00.720 things that you're mentioning from this story to fit in 301 00:18:00.839 --> 00:18:06.359 with this unexplainable high strangeness that's happening in the Appalachian Mountains. 302 00:18:07.119 --> 00:18:11.960 People hearing their names being called in the woods. The 303 00:18:12.319 --> 00:18:16.720 rules of Appalachia are at night, you close all your 304 00:18:16.759 --> 00:18:19.839 windows lines, you know, so you nothing can look in. 305 00:18:20.039 --> 00:18:23.480 You can't look out. If you're outside and you hear 306 00:18:23.519 --> 00:18:27.640 your name called, no you didn't. If you hear whistling, 307 00:18:28.200 --> 00:18:32.839 no you didn't. If you see anything, you turntail and 308 00:18:33.000 --> 00:18:37.279 walk away. Don't run because that, you know, kicks in 309 00:18:37.319 --> 00:18:41.359 a predator response. If you run, yes, but there's so 310 00:18:41.599 --> 00:18:45.319 many strange stories and there are places in the world 311 00:18:46.440 --> 00:18:48.839 that are just like this. I mean, you have the 312 00:18:48.880 --> 00:18:54.720 Bridgewater Triangle up in Massachusetts. You have what's that forest 313 00:18:54.799 --> 00:18:59.400 in Romania with the big open circle area, and people 314 00:18:59.440 --> 00:19:01.400 have had a lot of experiences in that. It's been 315 00:19:01.519 --> 00:19:03.160 years since I've talked about that. That's why I can't 316 00:19:03.200 --> 00:19:06.759 remember the name of it. Just certain places of high 317 00:19:06.839 --> 00:19:12.400 strangeness around the world that it really, you know, twists 318 00:19:12.440 --> 00:19:14.680 reality or what we think of as reality. 319 00:19:15.880 --> 00:19:18.799 Yeah, we mentioned Bigfoot there, and obviously we talked about 320 00:19:18.799 --> 00:19:22.039 Bigfoot in the Atloft Pass incident. Could there be a 321 00:19:22.119 --> 00:19:24.880 yetti or something involved in that one. But one of 322 00:19:24.920 --> 00:19:27.279 the other mysteries I cover in the book is the 323 00:19:28.680 --> 00:19:33.119 Bigfoot mystery. Because the dictator of the book is that 324 00:19:33.160 --> 00:19:35.880 I had to cover mysteries from the twentieth century to 325 00:19:35.920 --> 00:19:38.960 present day. I couldn't go way back into the past 326 00:19:39.000 --> 00:19:42.240 and say, well, who built the pyramids? That's a mystery 327 00:19:42.480 --> 00:19:45.319 that wasn't part of the remit on the book. So, 328 00:19:45.440 --> 00:19:47.880 I mean, one of the very first mysteries I picked 329 00:19:47.960 --> 00:19:51.759 up on was about a lighthouse where three of the 330 00:19:51.880 --> 00:19:55.960 lighthouse keepers in nineteen oh one literally just at the 331 00:19:56.000 --> 00:20:01.440 turn of the twentieth century went missing, possibly caused by 332 00:20:01.440 --> 00:20:03.519 a freak way that pulled them all out to sea. 333 00:20:04.279 --> 00:20:07.039 But one of the later ministries I covered was the Bigfoot, 334 00:20:07.160 --> 00:20:12.759 and that began around in the nineteen fifties, but people 335 00:20:12.839 --> 00:20:16.079 had already heard of something similar because when people started 336 00:20:16.119 --> 00:20:19.640 to go up Mount Everest and in the Himalayas, there 337 00:20:19.680 --> 00:20:24.240 was talk of seeing strange, large, ape like hairy creatures 338 00:20:24.319 --> 00:20:26.799 up there. They certainly found footprints in the snow, and 339 00:20:27.240 --> 00:20:31.359 they even measured them with their pickaxes to kind of 340 00:20:31.359 --> 00:20:34.440 get a rough gauge of how big these footprints were. 341 00:20:34.960 --> 00:20:37.799 And usually when these mountaineers were up the mountains, they 342 00:20:37.799 --> 00:20:40.039 could look down into the valley and

they could see 343 00:20:40.039 --> 00:20:42.400 these figures. They'd stand out a mile, these great, big, 344 00:20:42.480 --> 00:20:46.400 dark figures against the snow. And it was believed that 345 00:20:46.480 --> 00:20:50.000 these creatures YETI or the Bigfoot, were walking from one 346 00:20:50.079 --> 00:20:54.720 mountain range to another to find food, you know, sourcing 347 00:20:54.720 --> 00:20:59.000 food in the valley or something. And the name of 348 00:20:59.039 --> 00:21:02.279 the Abominable Snowmen and became known about around that time. 349 00:21:03.039 --> 00:21:07.119 That was actually a mistranslation from the Nepalese people. So 350 00:21:08.000 --> 00:21:11.240 because they smelled rather like bigfoot in the US and Canada, 351 00:21:11.279 --> 00:21:15.200 they got this skuncake kind of description of smelling. I 352 00:21:15.240 --> 00:21:17.519 think it the same applies to all these bigfoot creatures 353 00:21:17.559 --> 00:21:21.119 around the world. And what they were trying to describe 354 00:21:21.200 --> 00:21:26.240 was the bad smelling creature man hairy man. But the 355 00:21:26.279 --> 00:21:29.039 translation came out wrong, and the guy who translated it 356 00:21:29.039 --> 00:21:33.200 can only come up with the word abominable snowman because 357 00:21:34.000 --> 00:21:36.160 he couldn't come up with smelly old hairy man or 358 00:21:36.160 --> 00:21:38.839 something whichever this translation might become to. So I guess 359 00:21:38.920 --> 00:21:41.200 he maybe made it more palatable for the Western Ears 360 00:21:41.279 --> 00:21:43.480 or something, but he called it the abominable snowman. And 361 00:21:43.519 --> 00:21:45.359 it's a strange thing. Why was it called a bonninable? 362 00:21:45.359 --> 00:21:47.720 But I think that kind of explains it really. But 363 00:21:48.400 --> 00:21:50.599 it was later on when loggers were kind of like 364 00:21:50.720 --> 00:21:55.119 making roads in various forests in the US and Canada 365 00:21:55.519 --> 00:21:58.799 that they discovered lots of their equipment went missing or 366 00:21:58.920 --> 00:22:01.839 was messed around with, and then they started to find footprints. 367 00:22:02.200 --> 00:22:05.319 And what was happening as people become more industrialised, they're 368 00:22:05.559 --> 00:22:07.720 digging their way into these forests and that's where these 369 00:22:07.759 --> 00:22:11.519 creatures are allegedly living, and so they're kind of defending 370 00:22:11.519 --> 00:22:14.039 their territory or trying to warn them off or something, 371 00:22:14.279 --> 00:22:17.880 or just curious, and that's when they're finding evidence of them. 372 00:22:18.279 --> 00:22:21.279 And so the mystery the Bigfoot really started from there. 373 00:22:21.279 --> 00:22:25.039 And that's when people that had actually gone into the 374 00:22:25.079 --> 00:22:31.000 forests years before as a single gold prospectors who have 375 00:22:31.119 --> 00:22:33.319 encountered as they would read about these articles in these 376 00:22:33.359 --> 00:22:36.680 magazines some thirty or forty years later and said, well, 377 00:22:36.720 --> 00:22:39.079 I've seen these things, but thirty or forty years ago, 378 00:22:39.200 --> 00:22:42.920 you know, in nineteen fifteen or nineteen twenty. Albert Osman 379 00:22:43.039 --> 00:22:46.079 being a case point of that's what brought him for 380 00:22:46.160 --> 00:22:49.440 because he saw a magazine article about the Bigfoot, and 381 00:22:49.519 --> 00:22:51.920 so he stepped forward and says, well, I've seen one too, 382 00:22:52.039 --> 00:22:54.319 but it was in nineteen twenty six, and that's where 383 00:22:54.359 --> 00:22:57.279 he encountered a family of bigfoot and he stayed with 384 00:22:57.359 --> 00:23:00.160 them for like six days, not voluntary, other dad he 385 00:23:00.200 --> 00:23:04.279 was kept prisoner and he managed to escape after he 386 00:23:04.359 --> 00:23:06.880 managed to persuade the old man Bigfoot to try some 387 00:23:06.920 --> 00:23:08.839 of his snuff, and once he was distracted by the 388 00:23:09.359 --> 00:23:11.839 powerful smell of snuff up his nostrils, that's when he 389 00:23:11.880 --> 00:23:13.880 grabbed his gun and ran the hell out there. 390 00:23:13.880 --> 00:23:17.720 He said, well, that's a very famous case. I remember 391 00:23:17.759 --> 00:23:21.480 reading about that many years ago. And the same year 392 00:23:22.359 --> 00:23:26.319 there was the other case up around Mount Saint Helens 393 00:23:27.319 --> 00:23:30.960 in an area what would later be called Ape Canyon, 394 00:23:31.039 --> 00:23:35.720 where these miners were working and they had a little 395 00:23:35.759 --> 00:23:40.680 cabin and one day one of them saw what was 396 00:23:40.720 --> 00:23:46.240 probably a bigfoot type creature and they shot it and 397 00:23:46.599 --> 00:23:51.039 the creature fell into the canyon dead, and that's how 398 00:23:51.039 --> 00:23:53.759 it got the name Ape Canyon. But then that night 399 00:23:54.680 --> 00:23:58.160 they were attacked all night long by several of these 400 00:23:58.200 --> 00:24:01.680 creatures trying to break again to get at them in 401 00:24:01.720 --> 00:24:05.440 this cabin. They were bounding at the door, which they barricaded, 402 00:24:05.519 --> 00:24:07.279 They were trying to come through the roof. They were 403 00:24:07.359 --> 00:24:11.640 kept shooting at them. It was a really hairy bar 404 00:24:11.680 --> 00:24:17.160 in the pun experience. And the next morning they finally 405 00:24:17.960 --> 00:24:21.599 were able to get out of there. The creatures retreated, 406 00:24:22.160 --> 00:24:24.839 but there's all these big boulders and rocks all around 407 00:24:24.920 --> 00:24:27.799 the cabin and they got out of there. So but yeah, 408 00:24:27.839 --> 00:24:31.400 that happened the same year as Albert Osmand's experience. 409 00:24:31.920 --> 00:24:34.960 It's interesting

that you mentioned Mountain Helens because they believe 410 00:24:35.039 --> 00:24:39.079 that when Mountain Helen's the volcano that was there went 411 00:24:39.119 --> 00:24:42.599 off in nineteen eighty. I think it was a massive, 412 00:24:42.640 --> 00:24:47.160 ferocious eruption. They believed that a lot of the possible 413 00:24:48.799 --> 00:24:53.039 sasquatches maybe had to move out the area because of that, 414 00:24:53.359 --> 00:24:55.359 and so they ended up taking up new territories and 415 00:24:55.440 --> 00:24:58.359 more sightings increased because of that, and possibly some were 416 00:24:58.400 --> 00:25:01.480 killed in the lava flow, perhaps if they didn't get 417 00:25:01.480 --> 00:25:08.000 away or died of ash inhalation maybe or something. So yeah, 418 00:25:08.039 --> 00:25:12.359 with the Bigfoot chapter, I also cover the story of 419 00:25:12.559 --> 00:25:16.440 a guy that actually claimed, similar to your log cabin story, 420 00:25:16.480 --> 00:25:18.759 would claimed to have shot one, but he didn't want 421 00:25:18.759 --> 00:25:22.000 to admit to shooting it because someone like a lawyer 422 00:25:22.039 --> 00:25:24.400 pointed out to him saying, look, if if we managed 423 00:25:24.400 --> 00:25:27.720 to identify this creature and may prove that it's at 424 00:25:27.799 --> 00:25:31.519 least half human, because you've shot it, you could be 425 00:25:31.559 --> 00:25:35.359 had up for murder and your name's on the block 426 00:25:35.400 --> 00:25:38.799 sort of thing. So he would kind of allude to 427 00:25:39.880 --> 00:25:42.640 it being shot, but he would not admit to actually 428 00:25:42.720 --> 00:25:45.720 shooting it. So he came up with the whole kind 429 00:25:45.799 --> 00:25:51.240 of varied stories. Oh, it was found in Japan, or 430 00:25:51.480 --> 00:25:54.480 it was brought across by the Russians on an old 431 00:25:54.519 --> 00:25:56.880 boat or something like that, and then eventually he did 432 00:25:56.880 --> 00:25:58.680 say that he shot it, and it was known as 433 00:25:58.680 --> 00:26:02.240 a Minnesota Iceman. And then there was this guy who 434 00:26:02.400 --> 00:26:05.480 was out hunting with his friends looking for deer to shoot, 435 00:26:05.680 --> 00:26:08.240 and he came across I think it was three big 436 00:26:08.279 --> 00:26:11.279 foot that possibly they might have actually been eating his 437 00:26:11.759 --> 00:26:14.519 kill that he had shot, and he went up to them, 438 00:26:14.559 --> 00:26:17.400 and then one of them leapt up in the air 439 00:26:17.440 --> 00:26:20.119 towards him or something, and so he just shot, I 440 00:26:20.200 --> 00:26:23.039 presume instinctively for defense, and the others they must have 441 00:26:23.119 --> 00:26:26.799 run off, because he doesn't really mention them, but he 442 00:26:27.119 --> 00:26:29.680 shot it, and he was shocked. He didn't know what 443 00:26:29.720 --> 00:26:31.119 to do with it, so he left it. It was 444 00:26:31.119 --> 00:26:33.880 about five or six days later he decided they preyed 445 00:26:33.960 --> 00:26:35.440 on his mind too much. He's got to go back 446 00:26:35.519 --> 00:26:37.200 there and find his creature. And he found it there, 447 00:26:37.240 --> 00:26:39.920 buried in the snow by this point, and he put 448 00:26:39.960 --> 00:26:42.200 it in his pickup truck and he brought it back 449 00:26:42.240 --> 00:26:44.759 to his wife and says, oh, by the way, we 450 00:26:44.799 --> 00:26:47.440 need the freezer now for this thing, So get your 451 00:26:47.480 --> 00:26:50.119 peas and beef out. We're going to put this thing 452 00:26:50.119 --> 00:26:53.680 in the freezer. And they got this great big chest 453 00:26:53.680 --> 00:26:55.759 freezer or something. They put it down in this freezer 454 00:26:56.319 --> 00:27:00.200 and basically they toured this around the United States. It's 455 00:27:00.240 --> 00:27:05.680 a carnivals fairs, shopping malls as the Minnesota Riceman, charging people, 456 00:27:05.799 --> 00:27:07.640 you know, fifty cents or whatever at that time to 457 00:27:07.640 --> 00:27:11.039 go in there between nineteen sixty seven to about nineteen 458 00:27:11.799 --> 00:27:16.200 seventy eight or something like that. And Frank Hanson I think, 459 00:27:16.279 --> 00:27:20.640 was the guy that did this. Now there was some 460 00:27:20.720 --> 00:27:23.200 people he called in, some experts to come and kind 461 00:27:23.200 --> 00:27:26.559 of give it some authority. What was the kind of 462 00:27:26.640 --> 00:27:29.000 science and the biology of this creature that he had found. 463 00:27:29.640 --> 00:27:33.240 And they these two guys that were top bilagist of 464 00:27:33.279 --> 00:27:35.400 the day. One was Belgium, I can't remember the names now, 465 00:27:35.440 --> 00:27:39.240 and one was English. I think they were invited to 466 00:27:39.279 --> 00:27:41.680 go in during the winter months when this thing wasn't 467 00:27:41.720 --> 00:27:45.200 on tour, and they spent three days examining this corpse 468 00:27:45.240 --> 00:27:47.880 of this big foot for want of a bet of 469 00:27:47.880 --> 00:27:50.400 a word, this hairy creature that had been shot and 470 00:27:50.440 --> 00:27:53.240 they said it was buried under this ice with a 471 00:27:53.279 --> 00:27:57.079 glass cover, and at first they thought it was fake. 472 00:27:57.559 --> 00:28:00.160 They was very suspicious, but they said, let me to you. 473 00:28:00.279 --> 00:28:02.440 After three days of examine this thing close up. We 474 00:28:02.640 --> 00:28:05.200 came to the conclusion and this was once a real, living, 475 00:28:05.279 --> 00:28:09.000 breathing creature. And they said one of its eyes was missing, 476 00:28:09.319 --> 00:28:11.240 and the other eye had popped out and was hanging 477 00:28:11.559 --> 00:28:13.680 sort of down on its cheek. They said, that's possibly 478 00:28:13.680 --> 00:28:16.680 because of the force of the

other eye popping out, 479 00:28:16.680 --> 00:28:19.000 may have popped the other one out. Its hand was 480 00:28:19.079 --> 00:28:20.599 up like that. And now you think, oh, that's because 481 00:28:20.640 --> 00:28:22.480 it's trying to stop itself getting shot. But if you 482 00:28:22.519 --> 00:28:25.799 actually think about it, this creature has never encountered a 483 00:28:25.799 --> 00:28:29.039 man before, likely never understood what a gun was, so 484 00:28:29.079 --> 00:28:31.160 it wouldn't even understand that a bullet is coming out 485 00:28:31.200 --> 00:28:34.119 towards it at twice a speed of sound. So there's 486 00:28:34.160 --> 00:28:35.680 no way that it would even want to put its 487 00:28:35.720 --> 00:28:38.559 hand up instinctively. It may have put its hand up 488 00:28:38.559 --> 00:28:41.440 instinctly as it fell forward, perhaps to stop the fall. 489 00:28:41.559 --> 00:28:44.680 That's my explanation anyway, But its hand is found frozen 490 00:28:44.720 --> 00:28:48.279 in that position just above its head, and they reckoned 491 00:28:48.440 --> 00:28:51.480 it was a young male, possibly about twelve thirteen years 492 00:28:51.519 --> 00:28:53.880 of age, but it was at least six foot something. 493 00:28:54.839 --> 00:28:59.000 But it was a hairy, hairy person, and you could 494 00:28:59.000 --> 00:29:01.920 see where the blood had oozed out of it, and 495 00:29:01.960 --> 00:29:03.960 it all kind of bubbled in the water that had 496 00:29:04.000 --> 00:29:08.920 now become ice, And they basically gave it the thumbs 497 00:29:09.000 --> 00:29:12.039 up and said, this is definitely a real creature, and 498 00:29:12.079 --> 00:29:15.759 they wrote a book about it. And sometime after that, 499 00:29:15.799 --> 00:29:22.920 the Minnesota Iceman disappeared off the tour circuit thing and 500 00:29:23.000 --> 00:29:26.200 it was supposedly replaced by some sort of dummy that 501 00:29:26.359 --> 00:29:29.039 was there instead. Now, I looked at photoglass on the 502 00:29:29.079 --> 00:29:31.240 Internet of this creature and it didn't have the ice 503 00:29:31.319 --> 00:29:33.799 on or the glass on. So I suspected the pictures 504 00:29:33.839 --> 00:29:36.880 I was looking at was the dummy, because this looked 505 00:29:37.079 --> 00:29:39.319 kind of there's no ice there or blood or anything 506 00:29:39.400 --> 00:29:39.759 like that. 507 00:29:40.119 --> 00:29:43.519 I haven't seen the pictures of it in ice. 508 00:29:43.880 --> 00:29:47.160 And I've seen some of the in case in ice pictures. Yes, 509 00:29:47.559 --> 00:29:51.640 so you can kind of sense that what they've got 510 00:29:51.640 --> 00:29:54.680 in ice was was real. Because he also the guy 511 00:29:54.720 --> 00:29:56.839 that was studying it, He said, as they leant across 512 00:29:56.920 --> 00:30:01.119 the glass to study it, their weight cracked the glass 513 00:30:01.160 --> 00:30:04.079 below them and there was a breakage, and then they 514 00:30:04.119 --> 00:30:07.119 could start to smell the smell of rotten flesh coming 515 00:30:07.200 --> 00:30:11.559 up through this cracked ice, which to them said that's 516 00:30:11.559 --> 00:30:16.640 definitely something real in this box, you know. So, yeah, 517 00:30:16.680 --> 00:30:20.039 it was definitely given the seal of approval, as it were, 518 00:30:20.079 --> 00:30:24.319 by these two biologists zoologists. But of course if you 519 00:30:24.319 --> 00:30:26.599 go to Wikipedia, it's a different kettle fish you're going 520 00:30:26.640 --> 00:30:27.960 to be presented with. 521 00:30:28.200 --> 00:30:28.920 Yeah, that's the problem. 522 00:30:28.960 --> 00:30:32.200 Don't go to Wikipedia. No, go to that at all. 523 00:30:33.359 --> 00:30:40.200 Well, there's another story similar to that. I don't know 524 00:30:40.200 --> 00:30:44.440 if over there, if you remember Art Bell, Yeah, yeah, okay, 525 00:30:45.079 --> 00:30:47.920 when he was still doing Coast to Coast many years ago, 526 00:30:48.720 --> 00:30:51.119 he had a he got a fax from a guy 527 00:30:52.000 --> 00:30:56.640 who claimed to have killed two bigfoots. Oh, and he 528 00:30:56.759 --> 00:30:59.359 was very paranoid about coming out. He didn't want to 529 00:30:59.359 --> 00:31:03.240 be found out out for the exact reason of he 530 00:31:03.319 --> 00:31:05.680 didn't know if these things were human or not, and 531 00:31:05.720 --> 00:31:08.640 he was afraid of getting charged with murder. But then 532 00:31:08.680 --> 00:31:11.960 he eventually came forward on the air and told his story. 533 00:31:12.279 --> 00:31:15.000 I think, I mean by the name of Buzz. But 534 00:31:15.279 --> 00:31:21.519 he and a buddy were out hunting and they came 535 00:31:21.559 --> 00:31:26.440 across one of the creatures, a big male, and they 536 00:31:26.440 --> 00:31:31.640 shot it and it struggled, fell back into the bushes 537 00:31:31.720 --> 00:31:35.119 or whatnot, And Buzz, I guess was brave enough to 538 00:31:35.119 --> 00:31:38.920 go back in and look for it, and it was dead. 539 00:31:39.119 --> 00:31:42.240 But then all of a sudden, a female attacked them 540 00:31:43.240 --> 00:31:45.200 and they wound up shooting it too. 541 00:31:45.839 --> 00:31:47.400 Wow, so it killed. 542 00:31:47.279 --> 00:31:49.920 Both of them. And then when they realized they took 543 00:31:49.960 --> 00:31:53.920 a good look at what these creatures were, they started panicking. 544 00:31:54.240 --> 00:31:59.039 It's like, I think we murdered someone. And so they 545 00:31:59.079 --> 00:32:05.000 wound up burying the two corpses and then vowing never 546 00:32:05.079 --> 00:32:07.640 to speak of it again. So it took him about 547 00:32:07.680 --> 00:32:11.000 thirty years later to come out on Art Bell's show. 548 00:32:11.839 --> 00:32:15.599 And when you listen to this gentleman speak, he sounds 549 00:32:15.920 --> 00:32:20.920 very sincere, sounds very scared, paranoid of being found out

550 00:32:20.960 --> 00:32:23.119 who he is because he doesn't. 551 00:32:22.839 --> 00:32:23.640 Want to go to jail. 552 00:32:25.960 --> 00:32:27.759 And he came on a couple of times. But it 553 00:32:27.839 --> 00:32:32.119 was a really interesting and very believable story. Now I 554 00:32:32.160 --> 00:32:35.079 feel bad that they had to kill two bigfoot just 555 00:32:35.119 --> 00:32:39.920 because they didn't know what they were, but yeah, it's 556 00:32:40.799 --> 00:32:44.599 just another story of human encounters with Bigfoot that didn't 557 00:32:44.640 --> 00:32:46.200 turn out so well. 558 00:32:46.400 --> 00:32:48.759 Yeah. I mean, the thing is, given the number of 559 00:32:48.799 --> 00:32:53.920 signs of Bigfoot over the years, it doesn't surprise me 560 00:32:54.119 --> 00:32:56.400 that there are people that have come across them and 561 00:32:56.519 --> 00:32:58.799 killed them, and you think, well, surely we should be 562 00:32:58.839 --> 00:33:02.440 hearing about this, but you're hearing bits of it. People 563 00:33:02.480 --> 00:33:04.960 are very reluctant to tell you about it. They've done it, 564 00:33:05.000 --> 00:33:08.000 you know, because of this thing of getting into trouble, 565 00:33:09.640 --> 00:33:13.720 and you know, it would be amazing if they could 566 00:33:13.720 --> 00:33:17.039 bring one forward, but I think in today's world it'd 567 00:33:17.079 --> 00:33:20.720 be a very hot potato to deal with. And this 568 00:33:20.799 --> 00:33:22.759 is possibly why they don't want to admit to it, 569 00:33:22.799 --> 00:33:26.039 because it throws up all these questions about our evolution. 570 00:33:26.200 --> 00:33:30.240 Where did we come from? You know, were we created 571 00:33:30.240 --> 00:33:32.920 by God as Adam and Eve or did we come 572 00:33:32.960 --> 00:33:36.559 from apes? Or is there some other genetic connection there 573 00:33:36.559 --> 00:33:38.559 that we don't want to explain, you know, And that 574 00:33:38.599 --> 00:33:41.079 could lead into the whole alien thing where our DNA's 575 00:33:41.319 --> 00:33:44.759 allegedly being tampered with, and you know, maybe we've been 576 00:33:44.799 --> 00:33:47.440 mixed with the Neanderthal man and that's what the big 577 00:33:47.480 --> 00:33:49.880 Foot is, et cetera, et cetera, And it opens up 578 00:33:49.880 --> 00:33:54.400 a whole kind of keg of problems for people. 579 00:33:54.440 --> 00:33:58.920 I think, well, there are also stories, two different types 580 00:33:58.920 --> 00:34:03.519 of stories. Some people who have seen Bigfoot or or 581 00:34:03.599 --> 00:34:10.280 these these creatures receive men in black visits to shut 582 00:34:10.360 --> 00:34:14.960 up and don't tell their stories. But there are also 583 00:34:15.159 --> 00:34:21.440 a lot of stories surrounding these creatures that go beyond 584 00:34:22.159 --> 00:34:26.119 our version of reality. They seem to be able to 585 00:34:26.159 --> 00:34:30.360 appear and disappear at will, footsteps that go or down 586 00:34:30.360 --> 00:34:33.360 a path and then just stop, they're no longer there. 587 00:34:33.960 --> 00:34:37.440 People see one and then all of a sudden it's gone, 588 00:34:37.519 --> 00:34:41.840 peeking out from behind a tree. Some researchers who've caught 589 00:34:41.880 --> 00:34:45.400 some on thermal you'll see a head and shoulders and 590 00:34:45.599 --> 00:34:47.920 arm peeking up from behind a tree. It goes back 591 00:34:47.960 --> 00:34:49.719 behind the tree and they walk up to it and 592 00:34:49.719 --> 00:34:53.880 there's nothing there. So there's a lot of you know, 593 00:34:53.920 --> 00:34:57.920 there's also stories of bigfoots being seen with UFOs and 594 00:34:58.239 --> 00:35:04.639 things like that. But yeah, there's a very interdimensional quality 595 00:35:05.280 --> 00:35:08.920 that seems to be surrounding these creatures, at least from 596 00:35:09.000 --> 00:35:11.559 a lot of the stories that people have told. 597 00:35:12.920 --> 00:35:15.400 Yes, that's right. It seems there's lots of people that 598 00:35:15.440 --> 00:35:19.360 are into the zoology sort of stuff, the cryptozoology. They 599 00:35:19.400 --> 00:35:23.000 won't entertain the idea of Bigfoot coming out of a 600 00:35:23.119 --> 00:35:27.119 UFO or anything like that, whereas I'm open to the 601 00:35:27.119 --> 00:35:29.599 whole idea if they come out of UFOs. I mean 602 00:35:30.039 --> 00:35:32.559 there could be two types. There's the natural ones that 603 00:35:32.599 --> 00:35:35.119 we have on our earth and then the one that 604 00:35:35.199 --> 00:35:39.320 could be domesticated that are then put to use by 605 00:35:39.800 --> 00:35:43.639 et or whoever. There was an encounter. I never mentioned 606 00:35:43.679 --> 00:35:45.679 this in the book, but I've done this in a presentation. 607 00:35:45.760 --> 00:35:48.599 There was an encounter by an Italian guy that was 608 00:35:48.639 --> 00:35:53.519 traveling late at night through the mountains of Italy. He 609 00:35:53.599 --> 00:35:55.559 was on his way to stay at his aunt's house, 610 00:35:55.760 --> 00:35:57.480 who owned a hotel, I think, and he was on 611 00:35:57.519 --> 00:35:59.360 his way to her, but because of the snowy weather 612 00:36:00.159 --> 00:36:02.679 to pull over and just weighe it out during the night. 613 00:36:03.079 --> 00:36:06.400 But he saw this glowing disc craft down in the valleys, 614 00:36:06.400 --> 00:36:08.440 so he walked down towards to take a closer look, 615 00:36:09.079 --> 00:36:12.119 and a robot type creature was outside the craft. And 616 00:36:12.159 --> 00:36:14.320 then down this shaft of light or a lift or 617 00:36:14.360 --> 00:36:17.559 something appeared a alien with catlike eyes, and he started 618 00:36:17.599 --> 00:36:20.119 to speak to him, and he spoke to him about 619 00:36:20.119 --> 00:36:22.960 many many things. But one of the things he mentioned 620 00:36:23.239 -->

00:36:26.639 was that on their planet, or where he came from, 621 00:36:26.960 --> 00:36:30.679 they have ape like creatures that do their menial tasks 622 00:36:30.719 --> 00:36:34.280 for them. And I thought that was interesting because that 623 00:36:34.360 --> 00:36:38.079 might explain a lot about these bigfoot that come out 624 00:36:38.199 --> 00:36:41.239 of these craft. It's almost like you get if you 625 00:36:41.280 --> 00:36:43.159 think back to the film The Day of the Earth 626 00:36:43.199 --> 00:36:46.400 Stood Still, you got the nine foot tall gore I 627 00:36:46.400 --> 00:36:50.079 think his name is Robot that aids Michael Rennie. He 628 00:36:50.159 --> 00:36:51.960 could be a sort of the Bigfoot, could be a 629 00:36:52.000 --> 00:36:56.880 more gorilla type version of that as an aid for 630 00:36:57.000 --> 00:37:01.159 the aliens in some way. But yeah, it's an interesting connection. 631 00:37:01.360 --> 00:37:03.920 But whether we get to the bottom of it, I 632 00:37:03.960 --> 00:37:04.360 don't know. 633 00:37:05.119 --> 00:37:12.840 Well, there's one incident that was recorded by the KNIDS 634 00:37:12.920 --> 00:37:18.599 team National Institute for Discovery Science, who spent twenty something 635 00:37:18.719 --> 00:37:24.920 years investigating the Skinwalker Ranch in Utah, And there was 636 00:37:24.960 --> 00:37:28.760 a book that one of the researchers wrote with George Knapp, 637 00:37:28.760 --> 00:37:35.280 who's an investigative journalists, And there was one night two 638 00:37:35.320 --> 00:37:40.079 investigators from the team were out using night vision out 639 00:37:40.119 --> 00:37:43.320 near one of the old homesteads that were there, Homestead two, 640 00:37:44.360 --> 00:37:47.679 and they started to see only through the night vision, 641 00:37:47.800 --> 00:37:53.360 not in with their eyes, a light form near the 642 00:37:53.400 --> 00:37:56.880 ground and then started getting bigger and bigger and formed 643 00:37:57.000 --> 00:38:01.199 like a ring, and then this big what type creature 644 00:38:01.440 --> 00:38:03.760 crawled through it like it was crawling out of a 645 00:38:03.800 --> 00:38:07.079 tunnel came out, stood up and ran into the woods. 646 00:38:07.719 --> 00:38:08.119 Wow. 647 00:38:08.199 --> 00:38:13.840 And then that that tunnel or portal whatever it was, 648 00:38:13.880 --> 00:38:18.239 strength back down and then disappeared. The only bad thing 649 00:38:18.280 --> 00:38:22.000 about that whole thing is they didn't have any video 650 00:38:22.000 --> 00:38:25.039 on it. They didn't that cameras technology back then did 651 00:38:25.119 --> 00:38:29.679 not have recording capabilities like the newer ones do now. 652 00:38:30.280 --> 00:38:35.239 So it's just a story. But it's interesting, and that's 653 00:38:35.280 --> 00:38:38.760 another reason why I love Skinwalker Ranch, like some of 654 00:38:38.800 --> 00:38:41.719 these other places that seemed to be a mecca of 655 00:38:41.840 --> 00:38:43.159 high strangeness. 656 00:38:43.519 --> 00:38:46.119 Yeah. I think the thing is, even if you got 657 00:38:46.159 --> 00:38:49.239 footage of that kind of thing happening today, the atization 658 00:38:49.280 --> 00:38:52.840 will be thrown out. Well, that's just you know, CGII 659 00:38:53.079 --> 00:38:56.119 or something like that, you know, And that's the problem 660 00:38:56.159 --> 00:38:58.400 with people face they're going to get. You can give 661 00:38:58.440 --> 00:39:00.639 the best evidence, and it's always to be shot down. 662 00:39:00.639 --> 00:39:02.960 That's being created something on a computer. There must be 663 00:39:02.960 --> 00:39:06.679 a way of identifying what's AI and what's real through 664 00:39:07.199 --> 00:39:08.239 versual is. 665 00:39:08.679 --> 00:39:14.519 Actually you could run any photos or video through AI 666 00:39:15.079 --> 00:39:18.559 like chat, GPT or others, Yeah, and ask it to 667 00:39:18.639 --> 00:39:22.239 look for markers that it was created by AI. I 668 00:39:22.360 --> 00:39:25.960 had a photo that somebody sent me once that looked 669 00:39:26.039 --> 00:39:31.559 suspiciously like like CGI or or an AI creation, and 670 00:39:31.599 --> 00:39:33.760 I ran it through chat GPT and it did all 671 00:39:33.800 --> 00:39:37.039 these checks and he came back and said everything that 672 00:39:37.079 --> 00:39:38.440 it could see it was genuine. 673 00:39:39.000 --> 00:39:40.559 Wow. That's interesting. 674 00:39:40.719 --> 00:39:43.719 So there are ways to get around it. But I 675 00:39:44.079 --> 00:39:48.760 also warned people who are on social media, whether it's TikTok, YouTube, 676 00:39:49.000 --> 00:39:52.280 any of these channels where these people share footage of 677 00:39:52.400 --> 00:39:57.480 supposed bigfoots, there's a lot of AI creations out there now, 678 00:39:57.519 --> 00:39:59.800 and you can't take anything at face value. 679 00:40:00.159 --> 00:40:03.440 Yeah, I mean that reminds me. I talk a lot 680 00:40:03.519 --> 00:40:07.880 about on the Bigfoot chapter about the Patty Film, the 681 00:40:07.920 --> 00:40:10.840 so called Patty Film that was filming Bluff Creek in 682 00:40:10.880 --> 00:40:19.400 northern California by Roger Patterson and Bob Gimblin, who two cowboys, 683 00:40:19.440 --> 00:40:22.199 although they were kind of not official cowboys, I guess, 684 00:40:22.239 --> 00:40:23.719 I don't know really what the term would be, but 685 00:40:23.760 --> 00:40:26.840 they were riding horses. They look like cowboys to me anyway. 686 00:40:27.119 --> 00:40:31.880 But they had spent about three or four days, I think, 687 00:40:32.000 --> 00:40:34.599 going through this part of the area because they had 688 00:40:34.599 --> 00:40:37.920 heard there was footprints of Bigfoot in the area, and 689 00:40:38.280 --> 00:40:40.920 it is known that Roger Patterson was trying to make 690 00:40:40.960 --> 00:40:43.920 a documentary about Bigfoot.

He had an interest in it, 691 00:40:43.960 --> 00:40:47.480 and he persuaded Bob Gimblin to accompany him. And they'd 692 00:40:47.519 --> 00:40:51.079 just come around the creek of this small river where 693 00:40:51.119 --> 00:40:53.880 they suddenly, I think, he said, the horses detected at first. 694 00:40:53.880 --> 00:40:56.199 They must have smelt it or something, you know, and 695 00:40:56.199 --> 00:40:59.320 they got a bit itchy and the horse started to 696 00:40:59.360 --> 00:41:02.760 rear up. I think Bob Gimman fell off his horse. 697 00:41:03.239 --> 00:41:04.880 And that's the point, he said. When he got off 698 00:41:04.880 --> 00:41:06.639 the horse, or fell off the horse and he recovered, 699 00:41:06.639 --> 00:41:10.199 he saw the bigfoot stand up and start to walk 700 00:41:10.239 --> 00:41:15.719 away from them. So he shouted over to did I say, 701 00:41:15.719 --> 00:41:20.679 Bob g Yeah, he shouted across to Bob Gimlin, cover 702 00:41:20.800 --> 00:41:23.239 me because he had a rifle, and so he was 703 00:41:23.280 --> 00:41:25.079 looking at it through his rifle, and he said he 704 00:41:25.119 --> 00:41:27.000 didn't want to shoot the thing, but he was covered 705 00:41:27.039 --> 00:41:29.840 in just in case. And he said that he managed 706 00:41:29.840 --> 00:41:32.639 to film. Roger Pattinson he managed to film on this 707 00:41:33.320 --> 00:41:35.800 I think of a sixteen milimeter camera that he had hired, 708 00:41:36.480 --> 00:41:39.320 about two or three minutes of this bigfoot walking across 709 00:41:39.639 --> 00:41:42.480 and that has become one of the big favorites of 710 00:41:42.719 --> 00:41:46.559 Bigfoot fans around the world, and in this modern day 711 00:41:46.599 --> 00:41:48.880 and age now they've had people analyze it and freeze 712 00:41:48.880 --> 00:41:51.519 the frame and enhance and everything like that. And they've 713 00:41:51.519 --> 00:41:58.760 had people that were experts in anthropology. Jeff Meldrum, I 714 00:41:58.760 --> 00:42:02.440 think his name Jeff More. Yeah, he just he passed 715 00:42:02.480 --> 00:42:04.880 away a few months ago, didn't he. Yeah, But he 716 00:42:04.960 --> 00:42:06.599 was a big fan of it. He had come out 717 00:42:06.599 --> 00:42:09.559 and said, if you just study the muscles on the 718 00:42:09.599 --> 00:42:11.920 back of this creature and its calf muscles and things 719 00:42:11.960 --> 00:42:14.360 like that, you can see these muscles ripple. And he said, 720 00:42:14.400 --> 00:42:17.079 now with the aid of this technology, you can see 721 00:42:17.079 --> 00:42:19.760 it a lot clearer, and you know, you can see 722 00:42:19.760 --> 00:42:22.280 the way the feet walk and everything. And you know, 723 00:42:22.360 --> 00:42:24.800 you get the skeptics saying, oh, you can see the zipper, 724 00:42:25.440 --> 00:42:27.719 but where is the zipper. There's no zipper on this thing. 725 00:42:27.800 --> 00:42:30.199 You point it out, you know, there's no

zipper. And 726 00:42:30.519 --> 00:42:32.519 they've even had a guy that claimed that he was 727 00:42:32.519 --> 00:42:35.400 a big foot from the nineteen sixty seven film and 728 00:42:35.440 --> 00:42:38.079 he's been filmed walking in a kind of big foot costume, 729 00:42:38.280 --> 00:42:42.039 but he looks nothing like this Patty at all. 730 00:42:44.079 --> 00:42:46.639 As the costumes they've tried to use the debunk it 731 00:42:47.400 --> 00:42:52.559 or look fake as hell. They're obviously who would come 732 00:42:52.679 --> 00:42:58.599 up with the idea of making this creature a female yes, 733 00:42:58.639 --> 00:43:02.719 with breasts? Yes, yeah, I mean anybody who is going 734 00:43:02.760 --> 00:43:05.400 to try to make a Bigfoot movie, especially back then, 735 00:43:05.960 --> 00:43:08.639 put a guy in a suit and just a regular 736 00:43:08.760 --> 00:43:11.760 gorilla suit or whatnot and walk across. I mean we 737 00:43:11.800 --> 00:43:16.440 are talking nineteen sixty seven here or sixty eight sixty seven. Yeah, yeah, 738 00:43:16.840 --> 00:43:22.039 so the technology didn't exist back then, but to put 739 00:43:22.119 --> 00:43:27.039 that extra detail into the video, you can't tell me 740 00:43:27.119 --> 00:43:29.480 that was fake. Plus, I agree, I've seen the video 741 00:43:30.159 --> 00:43:34.159 examined by multiple anthropologists. They talk about the muscles under 742 00:43:34.199 --> 00:43:38.199 the fur, how the arms are longer down by the knees, 743 00:43:38.360 --> 00:43:41.119 and the gate and the way it walked. I mean, 744 00:43:41.159 --> 00:43:42.440 I totally believe it's real. 745 00:43:43.360 --> 00:43:50.239 Yes, yeah, me too. I kind of agree with Dr 746 00:43:50.280 --> 00:43:53.239 Jeff Maldron based upon his expertise that leads me to 747 00:43:53.239 --> 00:43:57.159 think that it's definitely a real creature. And the other 748 00:43:57.199 --> 00:44:00.400 thing about it is that he makes a comparison with 749 00:44:00.519 --> 00:44:02.599 the Planet of the Apes films that were coming out 750 00:44:02.639 --> 00:44:05.719 around that time. The original Planet of the Apes films 751 00:44:05.719 --> 00:44:09.679 with the latex facial masks or appliance that they'd put 752 00:44:09.679 --> 00:44:12.360 on their faces. And he particularly points out in an 753 00:44:12.400 --> 00:44:14.039 interview that I've seen with him, he says, if you 754 00:44:14.079 --> 00:44:16.719 go to the sequel film, which like nineteen sixty nine, 755 00:44:16.800 --> 00:44:19.960 nineteen seventy Beneath the Planet the Apes, they actually have 756 00:44:20.039 --> 00:44:23.239 a shot of these gorillas in a kind of sauna 757 00:44:23.679 --> 00:44:26.719 taking a sauna thing. And he said, these things just 758 00:44:26.800 --> 00:44:31.199 like a great, big furry kind of fur coats sitting 759 00:44:31.239 --> 00:44:33.599 on him, and said they look like big furry Pillsbury 760 00:44:33.599 --> 00:44:37.159 dough boys. They're

terrible costumes, he said, they look really awful. 761 00:44:37.639 --> 00:44:39.400 And he said, but that was the best they had 762 00:44:39.440 --> 00:44:43.000 at the time. And there was also a guy that 763 00:44:44.920 --> 00:44:48.079 he was employed by Hollywood, and I think he might 764 00:44:48.119 --> 00:44:53.440 have been from Czechoslovakia. And I forget the guy's name, 765 00:44:53.800 --> 00:44:56.440 but he was always the guy that dressed up as 766 00:44:56.480 --> 00:44:59.559 the ape or the monster in lots of horror films 767 00:44:59.559 --> 00:45:03.280 of the fifth ffties and the sixties, and he had 768 00:45:03.360 --> 00:45:07.239 the best effects applied to him. And even he said, 769 00:45:07.360 --> 00:45:11.079 I think it's a genuine Bigfoot. And yet he would 770 00:45:11.119 --> 00:45:12.960 know the top effects of the day and what they're 771 00:45:13.000 --> 00:45:16.159 capable of. And the guy who did the effects for 772 00:45:16.320 --> 00:45:21.440 the Planet the Apes, the makeup effects was John Chambers 773 00:45:21.440 --> 00:45:23.840 who he actually received an oscar for his special effects 774 00:45:23.840 --> 00:45:26.719 on Planet the Apes. And when he was in retirement 775 00:45:26.840 --> 00:45:30.480 home after he had not worked for many years, someone 776 00:45:30.519 --> 00:45:34.639 had got into the retirement home like an investigative report 777 00:45:35.239 --> 00:45:37.599 or someone like that, but they dressed up as a 778 00:45:37.719 --> 00:45:40.480 nurse to make out they were part of the retirement 779 00:45:40.519 --> 00:45:43.119 home to get his trust, I think, and then they 780 00:45:43.159 --> 00:45:46.000 would talk to him and they said to him, so 781 00:45:46.400 --> 00:45:50.559 what do you think about that Bigfoot filmed in northern 782 00:45:50.559 --> 00:45:54.639 California And he said, well, he says, I'm good, but 783 00:45:54.760 --> 00:45:58.079 are not that good? Meaning he's not as good as 784 00:45:58.119 --> 00:46:01.079 whoever did the effects if there were effects of this 785 00:46:01.280 --> 00:46:06.000 makeup on this patty creature. And so that kind of 786 00:46:06.079 --> 00:46:08.519 is a strong statement to make. You've got the top 787 00:46:08.519 --> 00:46:11.880 guy who did all the artistry on the Planet of 788 00:46:11.880 --> 00:46:14.920 the Apes and he's claiming that he can't be as 789 00:46:14.920 --> 00:46:17.719 good as the one that's been seen on this sinny film, 790 00:46:17.719 --> 00:46:21.880 which was amazing. Really, So there's been people that, like 791 00:46:21.920 --> 00:46:24.159 you said, there's many people that trying to emulate it, 792 00:46:24.239 --> 00:46:27.480 and they try and copy it using their footage and 793 00:46:27.800 --> 00:46:30.440 there's very few that come even close to it. It 794 00:46:30.519 --> 00:46:32.559 was just one of those things that they managed to 795 00:46:32.599 --> 00:46:34.480 be there on the day and get some

really really 796 00:46:34.519 --> 00:46:36.559 strong footage of it. It's amazing. And they even made 797 00:46:36.559 --> 00:46:39.199 cast of the footprints because the footprints that it created, 798 00:46:39.199 --> 00:46:41.280 they managed to get castle those later on as well. 799 00:46:41.320 --> 00:46:44.679 You see, so there's that secondary evidence they brought forward 800 00:46:44.679 --> 00:46:45.159 as well. 801 00:46:48.679 --> 00:46:52.480 Well, what are we have enough time for one more story? 802 00:46:52.519 --> 00:46:57.079 What's something else from the book that you find personally 803 00:46:57.159 --> 00:46:57.920 very fascinating. 804 00:46:58.159 --> 00:47:01.559 I've always been fascinated with the Well, there's two I 805 00:47:01.599 --> 00:47:03.599 can talk about, but you can choose. I can talk 806 00:47:03.639 --> 00:47:08.679 about the ghost of the person writing through Time. I 807 00:47:08.800 --> 00:47:10.719 mentioned this to you before Writing through Time from the 808 00:47:10.719 --> 00:47:15.480 Middle Ages through an early computer, they were receiving messages. 809 00:47:15.679 --> 00:47:19.159 It's called the Dondalston messages. And this guy moved into 810 00:47:19.159 --> 00:47:22.599 a cottage he had borrowed an early BBC micro computer 811 00:47:22.679 --> 00:47:25.880 from nineteen eighty four I think, and he started to 812 00:47:25.880 --> 00:47:31.280 receive strange messages written in what he called early modern English, 813 00:47:31.320 --> 00:47:33.639 and they appeared to be a messages from a guy 814 00:47:33.679 --> 00:47:35.880 talking through time who used to live in the house 815 00:47:35.880 --> 00:47:39.239 some four hundred years earlier or something, which was an 816 00:47:39.280 --> 00:47:42.559 interesting one. So he was a teacher. This guy called 817 00:47:43.320 --> 00:47:46.719 Ken Webster and he lived in there with his girlfriend, 818 00:47:46.800 --> 00:47:48.800 who was Debbie, and she was nineteen at the time, 819 00:47:48.840 --> 00:47:51.880 and I think Ken was probably about thirty or something. 820 00:47:52.559 --> 00:47:54.920 And because he was a teacher, they were just at 821 00:47:54.920 --> 00:47:59.159 that time bringing out the early BBC micro computer, which 822 00:47:59.360 --> 00:48:02.000 had no Internet connection. The Internet was about twelve years 823 00:48:02.000 --> 00:48:05.280 away from being public as it were. It had no modem, 824 00:48:05.320 --> 00:48:10.039 of course, it was literally a word processor. And Kenn 825 00:48:10.079 --> 00:48:12.480 had borrowed this computer from the school to practice on 826 00:48:12.519 --> 00:48:14.440 it so that he could then teach those skills to 827 00:48:14.519 --> 00:48:17.199 his students. And there was also a third person that 828 00:48:17.280 --> 00:48:19.880 lived in this house for a short while who was 829 00:48:19.920 --> 00:48:22.119 writing comedy scripts, and he said, well, why don't you 830 00:48:22.199

--> 00:48:24.440 practice on this computer, and he showed her how to 831 00:48:24.440 --> 00:48:25.920 do it, and you have to save it to this 832 00:48:26.000 --> 00:48:29.760 floppy disk, you know, and so that's what she did. 833 00:48:29.800 --> 00:48:31.559 But sometimes they go off to the pub and they'd 834 00:48:31.559 --> 00:48:34.920 come back and they'd find messages on there, and it'd 835 00:48:34.920 --> 00:48:38.039 be written in old English, so it's hard to even 836 00:48:38.079 --> 00:48:41.280 to understand. We're in the book that I've read called 837 00:48:41.360 --> 00:48:44.639 The Vertical Plane. They print some of the messages as 838 00:48:44.679 --> 00:48:47.760 they were, and then they've got a sort of translation 839 00:48:47.840 --> 00:48:52.679 of how it's sounded. Today's English. So it says, for instance, 840 00:48:52.840 --> 00:48:57.159 does the have a horse and he has to write 841 00:48:57.199 --> 00:48:59.920 back says, no, we have horses, but we don't use 842 00:49:00.119 --> 00:49:03.000 them like you do. We have cars. And he has 843 00:49:03.039 --> 00:49:05.079 to try and describe what a car is to this guy. 844 00:49:05.639 --> 00:49:08.519 And at first he thought someone was playing a prank 845 00:49:08.599 --> 00:49:10.639 on him. He kept thinking, what is it my girlfriend? 846 00:49:10.639 --> 00:49:12.960 And they'd leave the computer on, they go to the pub, 847 00:49:12.960 --> 00:49:15.599 they come back, they find a message on there, and 848 00:49:15.639 --> 00:49:18.719 he would talk about his time in Oxford and things 849 00:49:18.760 --> 00:49:22.840 like that, and he called himself Lucas, this mysterious writer 850 00:49:22.920 --> 00:49:25.599 who's coming through their computer. But the weird thing was, 851 00:49:25.639 --> 00:49:27.760 he said he could also see them, and he said, 852 00:49:27.760 --> 00:49:31.079 what are you doing in my house? So it appeared 853 00:49:31.079 --> 00:49:34.239 to be a case of a poltergeist type of activity, 854 00:49:34.519 --> 00:49:36.840 because they'd find things like all the chairs stacked up 855 00:49:36.880 --> 00:49:39.320 in the corner of the kitchen, or they'd got a 856 00:49:39.440 --> 00:49:42.199 cat and all the tins of cat food were piled 857 00:49:42.239 --> 00:49:44.519 one on top of each other, very neatly on the 858 00:49:44.599 --> 00:49:48.800 kitchen table. But he would talk about things they didn't 859 00:49:48.840 --> 00:49:51.400 know about the house. For instance, he had mentioned red 860 00:49:51.679 --> 00:49:56.119 flagstone flooring because Ken was trying to renovate the cottage. 861 00:49:56.159 --> 00:49:59.400 It was only some time later that he found traces 862 00:49:59.440 --> 00:50:03.679 this red red flagstone flooring underneath the floorboards and things. 863 00:50:05.440 --> 00:50:07.719 But he was observing them from his time. He could 864 00:50:07.719 --> 00:50:10.159 see them like ghosts in his house, and he was 865 00:50:10.159 --> 00:50:12.920 frightening them, thinking they were demons or devils or something 866 00:50:13.000 --> 00:50:16.559 like that. But eventually he began to trust them. So 867 00:50:16.960 --> 00:50:19.599 they said, well, how can you write to us? What 868 00:50:19.639 --> 00:50:22.000 are you using to talk to us from your time? 869 00:50:22.599 --> 00:50:25.800 And he said that there was this person that came 870 00:50:25.880 --> 00:50:29.840 down his chimney in a blaze of green light, who 871 00:50:29.920 --> 00:50:32.800 he termed as a friend, and he gave. 872 00:50:32.599 --> 00:50:32.920 Me the. 873 00:50:34.400 --> 00:50:37.280 Leams boist, which is a modern English word that he 874 00:50:37.320 --> 00:50:40.280 gave early modern English word the leams boised. Now the 875 00:50:40.360 --> 00:50:43.559 leam's voice. Someone translated it and they said boised is 876 00:50:43.679 --> 00:50:47.400 box and leams is colorful lights. So basically he was 877 00:50:47.440 --> 00:50:50.320 talking about a box of colorful lights that he was 878 00:50:50.440 --> 00:50:55.239 using to speak through to send messages to the future 879 00:50:55.360 --> 00:50:59.239 of nineteen eighty four. Fascinating story. Fascinating story. 880 00:51:00.960 --> 00:51:04.480 I mean that that gets my brain twirling in all 881 00:51:04.519 --> 00:51:09.920 sorts of different directions. Being of light or light comes 882 00:51:09.920 --> 00:51:14.159 down the chimney and being gives them basically a computer. Yeah, 883 00:51:14.360 --> 00:51:18.719 the tripe things, and it bridges through time. Now, time 884 00:51:18.760 --> 00:51:22.960 itself is a very quote doctor who whibbly wobbly timey 885 00:51:23.079 --> 00:51:28.400 whymy type of thing? And there is the idea that 886 00:51:28.480 --> 00:51:32.599 all time is happening at once. So instead of linearly 887 00:51:32.800 --> 00:51:37.079 looking all the way back hundreds of years for this 888 00:51:37.119 --> 00:51:42.159 communication take place, it's possibly it's happening right now, right 889 00:51:42.239 --> 00:51:47.840 in real time. And that device was able to bridge 890 00:51:48.639 --> 00:51:52.719 the gap between those two timelines that we are only 891 00:51:52.800 --> 00:51:55.719 able to see and experience one at a time. 892 00:51:56.800 --> 00:52:00.559 Yes, yeah, so the the the interesting thing is that 893 00:52:00.960 --> 00:52:03.760 he didn't have a keyboard on it from how we 894 00:52:03.760 --> 00:52:06.199 would understand a keyboard to type things. They said, but 895 00:52:06.320 --> 00:52:08.519 how do you write the words? And he said, well, 896 00:52:08.559 --> 00:52:11.760 I discovered the words would appear in front of me, 897 00:52:11.960 --> 00:52:15.199 like in the air. And he had a housemaid that 898 00:52:15.280 --> 00:52:17.400 used to do his errands for him. She was like fourteen, 899 00:52:18.000 --> 00:52:20.000 and so she used to clean and cook and stuff 900 00:52:20.039

--> 00:52:21.679 like that, and she would sing, and she would sing 901 00:52:21.760 --> 00:52:25.199 little songs apparently, and he would see these words appear 902 00:52:25.440 --> 00:52:29.119 in the air above this leam's voiced. So he took 903 00:52:29.159 --> 00:52:31.519 that as his way that he could maybe send messages. 904 00:52:31.559 --> 00:52:33.679 So he would speak and he would see them. But 905 00:52:33.719 --> 00:52:36.800 he said it was interesting that other people couldn't see 906 00:52:36.800 --> 00:52:40.760 this box. It's only he could see it. So it's 907 00:52:40.800 --> 00:52:42.760 almost like he had to be the medium to make 908 00:52:42.800 --> 00:52:46.519 this thing work, or it gets a bit complicated because 909 00:52:46.519 --> 00:52:48.880 other people start to use it, so I'm not quite 910 00:52:48.920 --> 00:52:52.239 sure how they can see it too. But he had 911 00:52:52.280 --> 00:52:54.320 to be near it or something to make it work. 912 00:52:54.599 --> 00:53:00.679 But eventually he had to move away, and I think 913 00:53:00.800 --> 00:53:02.679 I'm not quite sure what happened to the Lean's books. 914 00:53:02.719 --> 00:53:05.440 I can't remember whether someone took it or whatever. But 915 00:53:05.559 --> 00:53:10.400 he wrote a book on his experiences in thirteen eighty 916 00:53:10.480 --> 00:53:12.199 or whatever the year was that he wrote this book, 917 00:53:12.280 --> 00:53:15.480 and he said it would be found somewhere at some point. 918 00:53:15.519 --> 00:53:18.199 Now they haven't found this book today. But there was 919 00:53:18.239 --> 00:53:22.480 an angle on this story as well as ken Webster 920 00:53:22.599 --> 00:53:27.000 communicating with this being called Lucas, whose real name was Thomas. 921 00:53:27.920 --> 00:53:30.639 He used Lucas an alias because he was worried about 922 00:53:30.679 --> 00:53:33.360 witchcraft accusations, getting into trouble that type of thing, a 923 00:53:33.360 --> 00:53:37.239 bit like our caller about the bigfoot type of thing. 924 00:53:38.639 --> 00:53:41.360 He would use an alias. But he said there was 925 00:53:41.400 --> 00:53:45.519 another person in on this conversation who was from the 926 00:53:45.639 --> 00:53:48.519 year twenty one oh nine, and so when he was 927 00:53:48.559 --> 00:53:52.039 originally talking to Ken Webster, who was in nineteen eighty four, 928 00:53:52.559 --> 00:53:55.639 he said, oh, I am sorry. I apologize. I thought 929 00:53:55.719 --> 00:53:59.480 you was the person from twenty one oh nine, and 930 00:53:59.519 --> 00:54:00.960 he said who is this And he said, well, that's 931 00:54:01.000 --> 00:54:03.800 another person that talks to me from the year twenty 932 00:54:03.840 --> 00:54:07.840 one oh nine. So Ken Webster scratched his head and thought, well, 933 00:54:07.960 --> 00:54:11.840 this is getting really peculiar. So eventually decided that he'll 934 00:54:11.840 --> 00:54:14.000 try and type a message this twenty one oh nine. 935 00:54:14.039 --> 00:54:17.400 So he wrote call in twenty one oh nine, and 936 00:54:17.719 --> 00:54:20.079 maybe an hour later, a message pops up on the 937 00:54:20.119 --> 00:54:22.599 computer and it's from this twenty one oh nine, and 938 00:54:22.599 --> 00:54:26.960 it said it's conducting experiments with time and there's many 939 00:54:27.039 --> 00:54:29.360 of us. We can't tell you too much because it 940 00:54:29.360 --> 00:54:32.159 would interfere with the experiment, but we're trying to answer 941 00:54:32.199 --> 00:54:37.760 your questions as best as we can. But it looked 942 00:54:37.840 --> 00:54:41.199 like some of the messages that were coming from Lucas 943 00:54:41.719 --> 00:54:45.000 were being hacked by this twenty nine because some of 944 00:54:45.000 --> 00:54:47.519 the people raise concerns. They said, well, look there's a 945 00:54:47.599 --> 00:54:50.440 question mark that Lucas has written here. You didn't have 946 00:54:50.519 --> 00:54:54.599 question marks back in that time, so he can't be 947 00:54:54.719 --> 00:54:57.719 using them. But what they believed is that twenty one 948 00:54:57.760 --> 00:55:00.719 oh nine, whoever was in twenty one was adding they 949 00:55:00.719 --> 00:55:04.360 were like correct in the typos as such, you see, 950 00:55:04.559 --> 00:55:07.000 to try and improve the English. It was a very 951 00:55:07.000 --> 00:55:10.719 bizarre case, very bizarre, and they even had people from 952 00:55:10.840 --> 00:55:15.800 the Psychic Investigations of the spr the Society's Cycle Research 953 00:55:15.840 --> 00:55:18.480 too researchers go there and try and work out what 954 00:55:18.639 --> 00:55:21.800 was happening, and they could not fathom it at all. 955 00:55:21.840 --> 00:55:23.760 They had no explanation of what was happening. 956 00:55:24.039 --> 00:55:27.559 Wow, that is probably one of the most bizarre and 957 00:55:27.639 --> 00:55:29.760 unique cases they've ever heard of. 958 00:55:30.960 --> 00:55:32.960 It's worth if anyone. I mean, I can read it 959 00:55:33.000 --> 00:55:35.000 in the book that I've got, got Modern Mysteries of 960 00:55:35.000 --> 00:55:37.880 the Unexplained by Neil Ward, But if you want to 961 00:55:38.000 --> 00:55:40.880 deep dive into it and look at the actual write 962 00:55:40.920 --> 00:55:43.280 in and the text and things, I would recommend buying 963 00:55:43.320 --> 00:55:47.400 The Vertical Blane by Ken Webster of Amazon. Now there 964 00:55:47.440 --> 00:55:49.920 are copies out there that are like two hundred pounds, 965 00:55:49.960 --> 00:55:53.119 I would steer away from those. There's a more revised, 966 00:55:53.159 --> 00:55:55.840 updated edition and I would go for that one, which 967 00:55:55.840 --> 00:55:58.440 in UK money is about seventeen pounds. That might be 968 00:55:58.440 --> 00:56:02.599 about twenty five dollars or something your money maybe, so 969 00:56:02.760 --> 00:56:05.719 I would go for the more

type in revised edition 970 00:56:05.920 --> 00:56:07.880 of The Vertical Plane if you want to try and 971 00:56:08.079 --> 00:56:09.079 crack down on that one. 972 00:56:09.400 --> 00:56:12.599 Fascinating, Okay, I'm going to look into that definitely. So 973 00:56:12.920 --> 00:56:15.000 we were coming to the end of the show here. 974 00:56:15.239 --> 00:56:17.039 Now where can people find your book? 975 00:56:18.039 --> 00:56:20.360 So, as I mentioned, Amazon is probably one of the 976 00:56:20.400 --> 00:56:23.199 most well known places. So it's true Tale, sorry, not 977 00:56:23.199 --> 00:56:25.119 True Tales of the Paranormal. That's our previous book. So 978 00:56:25.199 --> 00:56:28.360 this is Modern Mysteries of the Unexplained, and they can 979 00:56:28.400 --> 00:56:31.480 find it on Amazon. It's published by our Tourist Publishing, 980 00:56:31.880 --> 00:56:33.360 but I guess you can buy and all the other 981 00:56:33.400 --> 00:56:37.400 websites like Barnes and Noble or your local bookstore anywhere 982 00:56:37.480 --> 00:56:41.239 like that. But yeah, go check it out and please 983 00:56:41.320 --> 00:56:43.079 leave a review if anyone does buy it, I'd be 984 00:56:43.119 --> 00:56:44.199 glad to have a review of it. 985 00:56:44.960 --> 00:56:47.800 And also I want to tell everybody remind them that 986 00:56:47.920 --> 00:56:50.760 you are the co host of the Paranormal Peep Show, 987 00:56:51.519 --> 00:56:56.679 which the latest episode is coming out as we're recording 988 00:56:56.719 --> 00:57:01.400 this tomorrow, Thursday the eighteenth. Ironically, my show will be 989 00:57:01.400 --> 00:57:05.400 coming out at the same time too, so push everybody 990 00:57:05.440 --> 00:57:08.320 to your show. It's always a great one and everyone 991 00:57:08.400 --> 00:57:11.559 loves it. So but again, Neil, thank you so much 992 00:57:11.599 --> 00:57:13.599 for coming on and talking with me today. This has 993 00:57:13.639 --> 00:57:14.400 been a treat. 994 00:57:15.159 --> 00:57:17.639 Thank you very much, and I take this opportunity to 995 00:57:17.679 --> 00:57:20.199 wish you and all your family and friends a great 996 00:57:20.280 --> 00:57:23.760 Christmas holiday and to all the listeners on the Paranormal 997 00:57:23.840 --> 00:57:27.039 UK Radio Network also enjoy yourselves and stay safe. Thanks 998 00:57:27.039 --> 00:57:27.559 for listening. 999 00:57:28.079 --> 00:57:32.079 Well, that was certainly an interesting interview with Neil. Neil's 1000 00:57:32.079 --> 00:57:34.360 a good friend. I've known him a long time and 1001 00:57:34.960 --> 00:57:40.320 his show, Paranormal Peep Show is airing the third Thursday 1002 00:57:40.599 --> 00:57:44.280 of every month here in the Paranormal UK Radio Network. 1003 00:57:45.039 --> 00:57:50.440 So until next time, just fyi, we will not be 1004 00:57:50.599 --> 00:57:55.039 having a show next week because of Christmas, but I 1005 00:57:55.079 --> 00:57:57.440 am going to have a show ready for New Years, 1006 00:57:58.360 --> 00:58:01.039 and so once everybody wakes up and starts getting over 1007 00:58:01.079 --> 00:58:04.880 their hangovers, they have a new trans dimensional reality show 1008 00:58:05.920 --> 00:58:09.119 to watch which is going to be a show solely 1009 00:58:09.119 --> 00:58:14.440 dedicated to ghosts and ghosts investigations. So until then, thank 1010 00:58:14.480 --> 00:58:18.800 you for watching and listening here on the Paranormal UK 1011 00:58:19.280 --> 00:58:22.599 Radio Network. Be good humans and we'll talk to you 1012 00:58:22.639 --> 00:58:23.400 soon bye bye