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ParFour with Ethan Andrews

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WEBVTT 00:00:29.030 --> 00:00:31.269 Driver off the deck for Cory Connor. 00:00:31.429 --> 00:00:33.590 Here's driver off the deck. 00:00:34.070 --> 00:00:34.789 They're hoblin. 00:00:34.950 --> 00:00:36.310 So the driver off the deck. 00:00:36.390 --> 00:00:37.750 I think you would try this, right? 00:00:39.109 --> 00:00:39.990 Oh my gosh. 00:00:45.030 --> 00:00:46.710 You have to put your foot on the gas. 00:00:46.790 --> 00:00:50.630 You pull out the driver off the deck and you put it on the green all the way up the hill. 00:00:50.950 --> 00:00:51.750 Don't stop! Don't stop! 00:00:53.109 --> 00:00:55.189 Welcome back to another episode of Off the Deck. 00:00:55.350 --> 00:00:55.909 We have Mr. 00:00:55.990 --> 00:00:58.310 Ethan Andrews joining the show today. 00:00:58.469 --> 00:01:00.070 Ethan, it is a pleasure to meet you. 00:01:00.230 --> 00:01:02.150 Thank you for taking time to come on the show. 00:01:02.469 --> 00:01:03.829 Josh, thanks for having me, man. 00:01:03.909 --> 00:01:05.030 I appreciate it. 00:01:05.430 --> 00:01:11.670 And I want you to introduce yourself because this is the first time we've ever met other than communicating via some DMs. 00:01:11.829 --> 00:01:16.310 Um tell the listeners who you are, what you do, and then we can dive into that. 00:01:16.629 --> 00:01:17.590 Yeah, absolutely. 00:01:17.750 --> 00:01:19.909 Um, so I'm Ethan Andrews. 00:01:19.989 --> 00:01:26.150 Uh founded Par 4 about, gosh, now coming up, I think on a year and a half. 00:01:26.310 --> 00:01:28.950 Um, and we have changed a lot. 00:01:29.109 --> 00:01:40.790 This is probably my first podcast since we've raised a million dollars, and we've pivoted our entire product, which has been the best decision we could have made, which is awesome. 00:01:41.030 --> 00:01:45.270 Um, but uh yeah, a little bit of back uh you know background about me. 00:01:45.350 --> 00:01:50.630 Um I I've played golf since I was gosh uh seven years old, I believe. 00:01:50.790 --> 00:01:53.910 Um, and uh been in tech since I was 17. 00:01:54.070 --> 00:02:03.990 So I've worked at uh Apple, I I helped build Home Depot's app, I was a part of BitPay, worked for a ton of Y Combinator companies for those who know what YC is. 00:02:04.230 --> 00:02:25.270 Um and so yeah, it's you know, taking what I absolutely love, uh and now what my children love, um and in and truly turning it into something that is is changing what we think is the way that tech is actually done in in inside uh inside the game and on the course and in the club, right? 00:02:25.349 --> 00:02:28.150 So it's like our old my old saying was we're changing the game. 00:02:28.229 --> 00:02:33.909 It's like no, this is this is software that's actually changing the momentum of the game, which is super, super cool. 00:02:34.150 --> 00:02:36.629 So um yeah, super excited to be on here. 00:02:36.710 --> 00:02:40.950 And yeah, I like I said, you're the first person uh that we've talked to since post-raise. 00:02:41.110 --> 00:02:46.390 So it'll be cool to kind of vocally give an update on on what we're doing and where we're at. 00:02:46.629 --> 00:02:47.990 Yeah, yeah, which I want to hear that. 00:02:48.069 --> 00:02:50.150 Uh, but I'd like to start with your background though. 00:02:50.230 --> 00:02:52.469 Um you said you've been in tech since you were 17. 00:02:52.550 --> 00:02:56.469 Where did you grow up when you when you said you were seven years old with a golf club in your hand? 00:02:56.629 --> 00:02:57.270 Where was that? 00:02:57.430 --> 00:03:00.310 Where where did your life begin on the course? 00:03:00.629 --> 00:03:09.189 Yeah, so uh North Georgia, Woodstock, Alpharetta, Georgia, is where I grew up most of my life, uh, actually, pretty much all my life. 00:03:09.430 --> 00:03:13.750 Uh and so yeah, I played USGA uh in Georgia. 00:03:13.990 --> 00:03:18.390 Actually played against my stepbrother a lot, who is now on the PGA tour. 00:03:18.550 --> 00:03:21.349 Uh so his uh his name is Anders Albertson. 00:03:21.590 --> 00:03:26.390 Actually, just got to caddy for him at the Arnold Palmer Invitational, which was super cool. 00:03:26.469 --> 00:03:30.789 Um, and that was my first time like inside the ropes with him and watching his swing. 00:03:30.870 --> 00:03:32.629 It was a whole different world, right? 00:03:32.710 --> 00:03:36.310 Like he's my stepbrother, but he is also a really freaking good golfer. 00:03:36.789 --> 00:03:39.750 And uh yeah, I I I played against him. 00:03:39.909 --> 00:03:43.349 He kicked my butt a lot, which is awesome. 00:03:43.509 --> 00:03:55.670 Uh and uh yeah, I I uh worked and lived in Georgia until I was uh my wife and I moved down here about seven, coming up on eight years now, uh to Orlando, Florida. 00:03:55.750 --> 00:03:57.270 So now I'm in Orlando. 00:03:57.430 --> 00:04:04.069 Uh I I I'm up in uh Claremont, so we're about on five acres here in Claremont, which is awesome. 00:04:04.150 --> 00:04:12.150 Uh a little bit about 35 minutes north of Disney, and I have golf uh every five miles away from me, which is incredible now. 00:04:12.310 --> 00:04:16.149 So uh member over at the uh Four Seasons Country Club. 00:04:16.230 --> 00:04:30.069 So if you're ever down and want to play some golf, uh and uh yeah, it's it's it's a really cool, very blessed uh to be where we are today and and and be able to like now engulf my life literally in golf, which is super cool. 00:04:30.310 --> 00:04:36.870 So is some is tech something you always wanted to work in, or did this just kind of accidentally become a thing? 00:04:37.589 --> 00:04:40.709 So uh I'm not sure if I've ever talked about this. 00:04:40.870 --> 00:04:41.990 Well, maybe. 00:04:42.149 --> 00:04:47.430 Uh I'm a high school dropout, so I dropped out at 17 years old to go work for Apple. 00:04:47.590 --> 00:04:50.629 Uh, and I struggle with severe dyslexia. 00:04:50.709 --> 00:04:57.509 So, like, I mean, if you gave me a book to read, it would be probably just very,
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very, very difficult for me to read. 00:04:57.670 --> 00:05:03.910 Um, I started learning how to do UI UX uh and just kind of like design and some front-end development. 00:05:04.069 --> 00:05:08.709 And I felt like it was just easier for me to do that than actually like read. 00:05:08.870 --> 00:05:15.590 Uh, and so I just knew that technology was gonna play a big part of like my life and what I wanted to do and and and where I'm at. 00:05:15.750 --> 00:05:26.149 Uh, and then my older brother, who is now my head of design at MailChimp, or he at uh at Parfur, he was the uh one of the lead designers at MailChimp for eight years. 00:05:26.550 --> 00:05:28.389 Uh so took him from MailChimp. 00:05:28.629 --> 00:05:31.670 I said, come work with me and build something cool. 00:05:31.829 --> 00:05:38.709 And uh he's really like the person who has taught me my entire tech, my background, kind of helped me fall in love with it. 00:05:38.870 --> 00:05:46.069 Um, there was an application, he I remember the day we were sitting on my mom's couch and he was showing me an application called Sketch. 00:05:46.149 --> 00:05:51.509 Uh, and he was showing me how I can basically build mobile screens and mobile designs. 00:05:51.590 --> 00:05:57.269 And this was like literally, gosh, right, right as I was about to drop out of high school. 00:05:57.350 --> 00:05:58.709 And I was like, I love this. 00:05:58.870 --> 00:06:02.550 I love building things, I love tinkering things, I love problem solving. 00:06:02.709 --> 00:06:10.310 Um, and so that's kind of where it led me to be like, I love technology and get to get to build it every day. 00:06:10.470 --> 00:06:15.990 So, and and I know my parents are gonna listen to this episode because they they're I think they're my biggest fans other than my wife. 00:06:16.230 --> 00:06:21.030 What do what do uh UI and UX stand for? 00:06:21.430 --> 00:06:24.470 Yeah, user experience and user interface. 00:06:24.629 --> 00:06:29.750 So user experience is something that me as a user, I'm going to go through, right? 00:06:29.910 --> 00:06:35.990 So I'm going to click button, button is going to take me to X, and then X is going to do Y. 00:06:36.310 --> 00:06:44.629 So every app you use, every piece of technology that you use, whether it's on web or mobile, somebody is thinking about that experience. 00:06:44.790 --> 00:06:52.790 Now there's some websites that don't care about experience and they don't care about user interface, and they just literally it's just a program, right? 00:06:52.949 --> 00:06:58.149 Um, and and a lot of today's technology is focused around user experience, user interface, right? 00:06:58.230 --> 00:07:11.750 They hire uh what is called user interaction designers who literally their sole purpose of their job is to talk to users and figure out what is going to make their lives easier for you to give them money, right? 00:07:11.910 --> 00:07:12.949 Uh as a product. 00:07:13.110 --> 00:07:19.590 And then you have user interface designers, which are literally solely focused on building something beautiful, right? 00:07:19.750 --> 00:07:29.189 And so, um, and then now you have UX engineers who are now a combination of UX user experience and then also know how to develop, right? 00:07:29.269 --> 00:07:31.189 So now you're kind of getting two birds, one stone. 00:07:31.269 --> 00:07:32.709 Those are very expensive people. 00:07:32.870 --> 00:07:37.990 Uh very talented of being able to use the left brain and the right brain simultaneously. 00:07:38.149 --> 00:07:44.709 Uh, and so yeah, I I mean it it's it's a it's a and with AI, it's a whole different world now, right? 00:07:44.790 --> 00:07:50.389 Like, I mean, it is it is insane what you can build at that level and even what you can think about, right? 00:07:50.550 --> 00:07:59.030 I can literally ask Claude or ChatGBT to say, act as a senior UX designer and help me flow do this flow. 00:07:59.110 --> 00:08:02.870 And it'll literally tell me the things that I need to do or how to do it. 00:08:02.949 --> 00:08:06.310 So it's like we're entering a whole new world of tech. 00:08:06.550 --> 00:08:09.910 We're utilizing it, not not dependent on it, right? 00:08:09.990 --> 00:08:12.470 And there's a there's a big, big difference between that. 00:08:12.629 --> 00:08:12.870 Sure. 00:08:12.949 --> 00:08:22.550 Um, but I think that you know, as UX designers and UI designers, there it's going to truly change the way that we design and think because of AI. 00:08:22.709 --> 00:08:29.910 So um I'm very excited to see like where tech is gonna go in the next like two to three years because it's yeah, it's scary and it's cool. 00:08:30.149 --> 00:08:30.790 Yeah, yeah. 00:08:30.949 --> 00:08:33.110 It's it is it's very scary, it's very cool. 00:08:33.269 --> 00:08:40.309 I mean, we we just recently moved and we pretty much designed our entire house with AI, with Claude. 00:08:40.389 --> 00:08:41.590 That's with Chat GPT. 00:08:41.669 --> 00:08:46.309 I mean it, yeah, it's not um saved thousands of dollars doing that too. 00:08:46.629 --> 00:08:51.909 Um so uh and I want to get to your pivot and congratulations on the funding. 00:08:52.069 --> 00:08:52.709 But thank you. 00:08:52.870 --> 00:08:59.909 I'm curious with every every product or with every, and I guess an app is a product, but everybody has an aha moment. 00:09:00.389 --> 00:09:08.149 What was what was the aha moment for you when this became something in your mind that you wanted to create, the parfour app? 00:09:08.549 --> 00:09:11.190 Yeah, so I'll kind of start from the beginning, right? 00:09:11.429 --> 00:09:19.750 So in the beginning, uh we, you know, the idea of parfois came from uh being able to go and live stream on a course, right? 00:09:19.909 --> 00:09:25.909 So we have Instagram Live, we have YouTube Live, we have Twitch, uh, you know, and all of those things are for specific things. 00:09:26.070 --> 00:09:31.350 Twitch is for video games, Instagram
Live is more of just like communicating, comedy, talking. 00:09:31.429 --> 00:09:39.909 And now you have TikTok live, which is, you know, now honestly in like the selling uh side of things where you can buy stuff off the TikTok shop and all that. 00:09:40.149 --> 00:09:44.870 So we were like, well, where's where's like where's live streaming for golf? 00:09:44.950 --> 00:09:46.149 Where's live streaming for sports? 00:09:46.230 --> 00:09:51.909 You have it for game changers, which is the baseball version of live stream where it has a camera behind home plate. 00:09:51.990 --> 00:09:53.909 Parents can watch when they're out of town. 00:09:54.230 --> 00:09:55.909 But where is this for golf? 00:09:55.990 --> 00:10:02.070 Now it's super hard, and there's a reason why this hasn't been done, uh, because it's very expensive to do that, right? 00:10:02.230 --> 00:10:17.029 You're using servers that require a lot of movement when it comes to video compression, uh phones, being able to create an app that actually takes that video, brings it to a live stream, chatting, user experience, user interface, engineers. 00:10:17.110 --> 00:10:18.710 It just it's massive, right? 00:10:18.950 --> 00:10:22.070 So we were doing it for some really cool tours. 00:10:22.149 --> 00:10:32.389 Um, and we figured out a way to do it to where we could basically uh do about one-tenth of the cost of what a normal actual production costs and still look the exact same. 00:10:32.629 --> 00:10:32.950 Wow. 00:10:33.110 --> 00:10:36.549 Um, we we did some stuff with uh the PGA tour. 00:10:36.629 --> 00:10:41.669 I can't say like what in the PGA tour, but we did some stuff with the PGA tour, which is super cool. 00:10:41.830 --> 00:10:49.669 Uh, and then we ended up doing stuff for the Annika Tour, so the women's uh you know, pathway to the uh LPGA tour. 00:10:49.909 --> 00:11:02.950 And there there's a gentleman named Gary, if he ever listens to this, and Gary one day literally we were out there streaming uh the championship for him, and during that stream, and I'm not on the camera, I have two camera guys. 00:11:03.190 --> 00:11:10.710 He looks over to me and he goes, You know, with your talents, you guys could probably recreate what Golf Genius has done better. 00:11:10.950 --> 00:11:13.990 And it was just that was like the aha moment. 00:11:14.070 --> 00:11:19.029 And I've you've I've used Golf Genius, I've never thought about like that's a beast, right? 00:11:19.110 --> 00:11:23.110 Like you, you, you, you're tackling David and Goliath at this point. 00:11:23.350 --> 00:11:31.509 Um, and so I thought I was like, okay, like, you know, we're making a little bit of money, we're not making what we thought we would make with the live streaming aspect. 00:11:31.590 --> 00:11:33.190 It's it's very travel heavy. 00:11:33.350 --> 00:11:37.350 I was becoming more of a media production company rather than a tech company, right? 00:11:37.590 --> 00:11:44.950 And so when Gary said that to me, I, you know, we had very, very little in the bank left. 00:11:45.190 --> 00:11:47.190 We were like, we got to do something. 00:11:47.269 --> 00:11:49.990 Like, this is this is the time to do it. 00:11:50.230 --> 00:11:55.509 Um, and uh fast forward today, we've raised a million dollars. 00:11:55.750 --> 00:12:04.070 Uh, we uh have uh onboarded 74 clubs, we've generated$50,000 in revenue in our first month. 00:12:04.310 --> 00:12:06.470 Uh and it's awesome. 00:12:06.629 --> 00:12:07.350 It's super cool. 00:12:07.509 --> 00:12:09.990 We're able to build extremely fast. 00:12:10.389 --> 00:12:19.509 Uh you know, for instance, uh two days ago, one of our users said, Hey, it'd be awesome to have a wait list where once the event is at full capacity, I can have a wait list. 00:12:19.750 --> 00:12:23.669 And if someone drops, it automatically fills them in and sends them an invoice. 00:12:23.830 --> 00:12:27.029 We built it in three days, testing from beginning to end. 00:12:27.429 --> 00:12:35.590 So if a member does this club and they've got a wait list, as soon as someone drops out, it automatically pops someone else in, invoices them. 00:12:35.830 --> 00:12:36.149 Yep. 00:12:36.389 --> 00:12:36.710 Wow. 00:12:36.870 --> 00:12:37.190 Okay. 00:12:38.149 --> 00:12:47.669 So there's there's pieces of the technology that we're hearing from outdated products and platforms that are literally saying, we've asked this stuff for years, right? 00:12:47.830 --> 00:12:51.990 The problem with those outdated applications, right? 00:12:52.149 --> 00:12:56.870 Um, is they've they're built on literally 20 to 25 years of architecture. 00:12:57.029 --> 00:13:02.310 So when you go and you say, hey, I want this, that one little thing takes months, right? 00:13:02.470 --> 00:13:06.950 Because what happens is they try to integrate it and there's a thing called regression. 00:13:07.029 --> 00:13:11.429 So if you change one thing, it can affect 85 different files, right? 00:13:11.669 --> 00:13:15.110 So there is there is not a lot of updating happening. 00:13:15.269 --> 00:13:18.870 They're they're moving at very slow speed, but it's working. 00:13:19.029 --> 00:13:21.990 What they have works, it's there, it's functional. 00:13:22.230 --> 00:13:28.230 And then now when you're looking at new today companies that are coming out, you either have two problems. 00:13:28.389 --> 00:13:30.230 Number one, it's AI slop, right? 00:13:30.310 --> 00:13:37.190 Like they're literally just having AI build it, which is fine, but it's not from a long term, it's not scalable, right? 00:13:37.269 --> 00:13:39.990 The infrastructure is not there to actually build on it. 00:13:40.149 --> 00:13:44.789 Um, number two, people are building, but it still looks like it was built in the 90s, right? 00:13:44.870 --> 00:13:49.110 Like there's just no attention to, again, user experience and user interface. 00:13:49.269 --> 00:14:00.230 Um, I always say, like, if I walk into a store and you see something
beautifully designed and then something really ugly, you're gonna buy the beautifully designed product first before you even look at the ugly product, right? 00:14:00.389 --> 00:14:06.629 So, like your landing page, your your branding, your aesthetic, it all needs to have a purpose and a reason. 00:14:06.870 --> 00:14:16.310 Um, and so, you know, that's what that's what we tried to focus on was how could we become the next adaptive idea and design for golf, right? 00:14:16.470 --> 00:14:17.830 Golf technology. 00:14:18.070 --> 00:14:25.110 Um, and we're really putting our focus heavy on clubs and events and tours, right? 00:14:25.269 --> 00:14:28.549 So at a club level, you have everything. 00:14:28.789 --> 00:14:37.190 You have the members, you have the actual club itself, the location, the things that it offers, the events, the whole nine yards. 00:14:37.350 --> 00:14:39.990 Then with inside of that, you have the members. 00:14:40.230 --> 00:14:47.750 So you're having to use about four, three to five different products right now to do everything that par four does. 00:14:47.909 --> 00:14:53.909 Um, and that's what we're trying to do is chip slowly away to be like, hey, you don't need PayPal anymore. 00:14:53.990 --> 00:15:07.350 If you go on a par four event page, you can actually buy a sponsorship for an event right there, upload your logo, and it automatically applies it to the event page, the scorecards, the cart cards, and you as the event manager have to not do a single thing. 00:15:07.429 --> 00:15:08.789 It does everything for you. 00:15:09.029 --> 00:15:09.429 Right? 00:15:09.669 --> 00:15:45.889 So we want to create better software, we want to create clubs more revenue, events more revenue, and to be able to bring in things that they never had in one platform where it doesn't feel like they're having to go and spend thousands of dollars over multiple platforms or forget which platform does what. 00:15:46.209 --> 00:15:54.209 Our pricing is super simple: four thousand dollars a year, no contract, no setup fee, and that's it. 00:15:54.689 --> 00:15:55.329 Wow. 00:15:55.809 --> 00:15:58.289 And then cost per event or or what? 00:15:58.370 --> 00:16:03.809 Is it just four grand for the year and you have I mean, obviously you don't get open-ended access, right? 00:16:03.889 --> 00:16:05.969 It it's how how does that function? 00:16:06.370 --> 00:16:08.049 Yeah, so we have three options. 00:16:08.129 --> 00:16:09.169 Well, technically four. 00:16:09.329 --> 00:16:10.850 You can create a club for free, right? 00:16:10.929 --> 00:16:14.449 So anyone can go in there, create a club, that's free. 00:16:14.689 --> 00:16:16.850 Um, to use an event, right? 00:16:16.929 --> 00:16:20.850 If you were, let's say you were a charity event and you're like, hey, I have one event a year. 00:16:21.009 --> 00:16:25.169 I don't need$4,000 worth of events, like I'm just doing one. 00:16:25.329 --> 00:16:28.289 For one event, it's$299, right? 00:16:28.449 --> 00:16:30.049 But we handle everything. 00:16:30.209 --> 00:16:38.529 We handle your event page, your registration, your live scoring, your sponsorships, uh, every fee we connect to Stripe. 00:16:38.689 --> 00:16:43.889 Uh, so essentially it is built all in right there through Stripe, which is awesome. 00:16:44.049 --> 00:16:56.529 Uh, and yeah, so we handle literally everything from before the event to final putt, live leaderboards, stats, to statistics, uh, what happens after the event, the whole nine yards. 00:16:56.769 --> 00:17:06.610 So that is free,$2.99, or you could do four$499 a month or annually$4,000 a year, right? 00:17:06.690 --> 00:17:09.009 Which saves about like 20-ish percent. 00:17:09.250 --> 00:17:18.690 So that's kind of like we have a lot of users who do the monthly event because for them, hey, I'm gonna run three or four events, cancel for a month, I'm gonna come back and do it for now. 00:17:18.850 --> 00:17:20.210 It's like for me, that's awesome. 00:17:20.289 --> 00:17:25.889 I love that because by the time you come back, we'll have four or five more features that you didn't have when you first started. 00:17:26.049 --> 00:17:26.209 Yeah. 00:17:26.689 --> 00:17:29.730 So I think that's the the new name of the game. 00:17:29.889 --> 00:17:32.769 And then the cool part is we actually launched our app. 00:17:32.849 --> 00:17:36.609 We have not made like any big hoot and howl about it. 00:17:36.689 --> 00:17:40.289 Um, but we're doing a big press release on April 17th. 00:17:40.369 --> 00:17:56.689 So we're gonna give the masters a little bit time to breathe uh with all the masters news, and we're gonna be a big press announcement where we've basically recreated 18 Birdies and the Grint and 19 Whole, and we've rebuilt the app completely from ground up, and it's completely free. 00:17:56.849 --> 00:17:59.409 So there is no subscription, there is no anything. 00:17:59.569 --> 00:18:02.289 We want users to literally use the Par 4 app. 00:18:02.369 --> 00:18:08.209 There's multiple game modes, so you can play Stroke Play, Scramble, Match Play, Stableford. 00:18:08.529 --> 00:18:20.049 We're coming out with Skins and Ryder Cup, and the app is going to be 100% completely free because we want people to come in and be like, oh my gosh, head pro, we need to use this our next member guest. 00:18:20.129 --> 00:18:21.969 We need to use this as our next member member. 00:18:22.129 --> 00:18:31.649 So we're using that opportunity to basically give anybody and everybody access to it and then go into the clubs and make their club experience better than it is today. 00:18:31.969 --> 00:18:33.569 That is fascinating. 00:18:33.729 --> 00:18:38.609 So uh, and you started the app for a different reason and it pivoted, like you mentioned. 00:18:38.769 --> 00:18:40.929 What was that a tough pill to swallow? 00:18:41.089 --> 00:18:43.089 Like you talked about the conversation you had. 00:18:43.569 --> 00:18:51.169 So tell me about the conversations
internally about completely changing course with what you all were doing as an organization. 00:18:51.329 --> 00:18:55.969 And I one of my questions was the size of your team, how many people you have at par four. 00:18:56.369 --> 00:19:00.769 Uh I mean, that turning a ship a completely different direction is a big move. 00:19:00.849 --> 00:19:02.369 How, how was that received? 00:19:02.449 --> 00:19:03.809 What was that process like? 00:19:04.209 --> 00:19:15.329 Man, so I mean, with with any startup, the big the hardest part, like when some when I I remember I always heard like the hardest part of being a C CEO is just navigating, right? 00:19:15.489 --> 00:19:23.009 Like knowing you have to make the call as to what is going to be best for you, best for the team, best for the product, best for the company. 00:19:23.329 --> 00:19:27.169 And I I I felt that full hand, right? 00:19:27.249 --> 00:19:29.649 Like I'm responsible for people's salaries. 00:19:29.809 --> 00:19:37.649 Uh the good part is is half the people, uh about 75% of the people on my team are some of my really close friends, if not family, right? 00:19:37.809 --> 00:19:47.569 So that pill was a little bit easier uh to swallow to be like, if we run out of money, I'm sorry, you know, like it's well, let's maybe go find something else. 00:19:47.809 --> 00:19:50.449 But um, you know, it was it was very hard. 00:19:50.529 --> 00:19:56.209 There was a lot of sleepless nights, there's a lot of hard conversations with my wife, which is like, do I continue this? 00:19:56.289 --> 00:20:01.889 Like, I I put so much time and effort into the brand, the voice, uh, the product, the tech. 00:20:02.049 --> 00:20:04.529 You know, our team members have done the same. 00:20:04.689 --> 00:20:07.649 Um, and and so yeah, it was a it was a gamble. 00:20:07.729 --> 00:20:09.569 It was a literally a flip the coin. 00:20:09.649 --> 00:20:12.449 Like, is this going to work or is this not going to work? 00:20:12.609 --> 00:20:18.449 Uh, and I remember I my first call with social leverage, it it was it was crazy. 00:20:18.609 --> 00:20:25.089 The first call I had, it was all about us raising money based off of the live streaming aspect. 00:20:25.249 --> 00:20:29.089 Two months later, I go back to them and I said, Hey, we pivoted in this, what we're building. 00:20:29.169 --> 00:20:34.209 And they were like, Oh my gosh, this is the Strava and Shopify for golf. 00:20:34.449 --> 00:20:35.889 And that's what they invested in. 00:20:35.969 --> 00:20:37.649 They didn't invest in the streaming aspect. 00:20:37.729 --> 00:20:40.289 They literally were like, You're gonna drop the streaming stuff, right? 00:20:40.449 --> 00:20:54.769 Uh, and I was like, Yeah, I mean, we'll still do it for some, you know, some Annika tour and some other tours, and and people we're talking to um that want to do cool events that are willing to pay the price tag, but that's not gonna be our core product anymore. 00:20:54.929 --> 00:20:56.769
And they they they loved it. 00:20:56.849 --> 00:20:58.529 They were they I mean, it's been so cool. 00:20:58.609 --> 00:21:06.529 And I think we found a really good uh VC that it the money, the money is the 50% of it. 00:21:06.689 --> 00:21:18.049 The connections and the the opportunities that they've given us just from this venture capitalist alone is worth if not more than what they gave us, right? 00:21:18.209 --> 00:21:25.569 And so uh if anyone's out there listening about uh raising capital, make sure it's the right VC because it it matters a lot, right? 00:21:25.729 --> 00:21:35.729 Like money can only get you so far, but your connections and like the the the conversations that they've given me, I I don't think I could have gotten from any other VC. 00:21:35.809 --> 00:21:44.849 And we got a couple other VCs with term sheets, but not as good as this term sheet, and also just as good as what they wanted to do, which was help us grow the business, right? 00:21:45.009 --> 00:21:52.129 So um, yeah, very, very hard pill to swallow to answer your question, and it and it was a massive risk, literally flipping a coin. 00:21:52.289 --> 00:22:01.329 And how much of your framework and everything within the app, and was that just scrapping everything and starting over, but you had the brand loyalty and the brand equity, so that's that was the plan. 00:22:01.889 --> 00:22:03.249 Yep, exactly. 00:22:03.569 --> 00:22:05.569 So that that sucked, right? 00:22:05.649 --> 00:22:11.569 Like we literally, we literally, I remember the day that we sat there and we said, All right, let's delete the app. 00:22:11.649 --> 00:22:16.209 And we started literally from scratch, and it it it sucked. 00:22:16.289 --> 00:22:16.929 It sucked. 00:22:17.009 --> 00:22:19.009 It was like, all right, there's no going back. 00:22:19.089 --> 00:22:19.809 Like we just like. 00:22:20.129 --> 00:22:22.449 How many users did you have on the app that you deleted? 00:22:22.689 --> 00:22:24.929 Uh so we still have all that user database. 00:22:25.009 --> 00:22:25.969 So they that's the good part. 00:22:26.049 --> 00:22:35.009 They can still access the app, but we had roughly around 10,000 users uh using like you know, that had an account in par four, which was super cool. 00:22:35.249 --> 00:22:44.369 Um but you know, today, if anyone was to go into the the the app, um we actually switched it to where there is no passwords in par four. 00:22:44.449 --> 00:22:47.009 It's an email, you get a six digit code, you enter that in, right? 00:22:47.089 --> 00:22:50.449 So That's really for our older generation that will be using the app. 00:22:50.609 --> 00:22:53.729 Another password is not needed right now in today's world, you know? 00:22:53.889 --> 00:22:56.769 So uh made it super easy from that standpoint. 00:22:57.009 --> 00:23:16.209 But we have uh we have seven team members total, and uh three of which are engineers, two of which are product and design, and then me, and then uh uh some sales guys and and marketing guys who kind of are you know part-time who help out. 00:23:16.609 --> 00:23:27.729 So yeah, it it's it's a very like I do all the graphics, I do all the branding, I do all the demos, uh, I do about 10 to 15 demos a day right now. 00:23:27.889 --> 00:23:38.689 Uh we're just cold reaching out to to clubs and being like, hey, you got Golf Genius, you got Blue Golf, like we can help you uh not want to pull your hair out at night. 00:23:38.769 --> 00:23:47.649 So yeah, that's kind of the the easy in, and then from there it it they once they see the product, they're just like, oh my gosh, this feels like an app that was built in 2026. 00:23:48.049 --> 00:24:07.169 So which it's funny you said because in in my nine to five, I'm currently dealing with a CRM that's about 20 years old and it's been just band band-aided along the way, which to your earlier point has created a mountain of problems that we're dealing with because once you pull this lever, it ch the domino effect is terrible. 00:24:07.409 --> 00:24:13.489 And yeah, it's it's yeah, in turn the the challenges it's created for us have been horrendous. 00:24:13.649 --> 00:24:23.649 Um so what is it that is uh the capabilities and the functionality that you all provide that's more advantageous than what, and I know Golf Genius is more prehistoric. 00:24:23.889 --> 00:24:27.809 What is it that par four is doing differently to set yourself apart? 00:24:28.129 --> 00:24:32.209 Yeah, so number one, I'll kind of walk you through like the entire UX, right? 00:24:32.289 --> 00:24:35.489 So this is a great example of um I'm a club, right? 00:24:35.569 --> 00:24:36.769 Uh, and that's the cool thing. 00:24:37.009 --> 00:24:40.609 This is not built for just country clubs or just munis, right? 00:24:40.689 --> 00:24:43.089 Like this is for the random golf club. 00:24:43.249 --> 00:24:49.009 This is for the Tuesday morning boys who go out, this is for the Thursday night golf sim league, right? 00:24:49.089 --> 00:24:56.449 Like this is literally built for every single type of golf club um that doesn't even have to have a building. 00:24:56.609 --> 00:25:00.209 And so that's the hard part that golf genius or any other product does, right? 00:25:00.369 --> 00:25:06.129 They don't they're focused on going after the country clubs, they're going after the public courses. 00:25:06.289 --> 00:25:10.129 And there's really nobody out there that's doing this for the everyday course. 00:25:10.209 --> 00:25:21.569 So for instance, today we signed on uh a core uh a club literally called the Social Tour out of Ontario Ontario, and they do just like high stakes, high-level golf. 00:25:21.809 --> 00:25:34.849 But they don't they can't use golf genius because it's so expensive, but also because it doesn't have the all the functionality and and their brand is super sweet, super cool looking, and they're like golf genius just bogs that down, right? 00:25:35.009 --> 00:25:43.329 Um, and so you know,
and they look at other products on the market, but most of these products is what we call is a fractional feature of what we offer. 00:25:43.569 --> 00:25:48.289 So they do like there's you know, one company that just does just events, right? 00:25:48.529 --> 00:25:52.289 Or one company that does tour level leagues and seasons. 00:25:52.369 --> 00:25:59.009 Um, but there's no one who does clubs, events, members, tours, and tournaments. 00:25:59.249 --> 00:26:08.929 So that's where we kind of come in play, which is focusing on bringing a club in, getting all of their members uploaded to to parfour. 00:26:09.089 --> 00:26:12.129 Then you can create events and not just golf events. 00:26:12.289 --> 00:26:25.409 Let's say that you have a social gala, or like for me, for instance, I'm actually throwing a master, I'm going to the masters Friday and sun uh Friday and Saturday, and then I'm flying home and we're throwing a master's party on Sunday. 00:26:25.649 --> 00:26:35.569 I literally did all of my registration through an event I made in par four where all my friends could register, add plus ones, and now I can see how much food I need to order, what I need to do. 00:26:35.649 --> 00:26:37.329 It gives them what to bring. 00:26:37.489 --> 00:26:47.089 We have bounce houses, a pool, but I like I basically created an invite or in bright for everything golf related. 00:26:47.169 --> 00:26:47.329 Yeah. 00:26:47.489 --> 00:26:47.649 Right. 00:26:47.729 --> 00:26:50.689 So it's not just on the course, which is super cool. 00:26:50.929 --> 00:27:02.129 Um, then I'm able to go in and I'm able to do differentiating factors like let's say I don't know the course or know where I'm playing or how much it costs, but I know this is the vision of my tournament. 00:27:02.289 --> 00:27:09.089 We have options where you can say, this is TBD, you know, location is TBD, price is TBD, but I can join a wait list. 00:27:09.329 --> 00:27:13.569 Once that wait list lets me know, it sends out an email automatically to all the members. 00:27:13.729 --> 00:27:16.689 A date has been chosen, a price has been chosen. 00:27:16.929 --> 00:27:21.169 Um we have uh built-in 43,000 golf courses. 00:27:21.409 --> 00:27:29.169 So as I'm actually building my event, I type in my golf course, you select it, and then boom, a drop-down comes down and tells you what tease you're playing. 00:27:29.409 --> 00:27:36.529 Um we just got uh kind of the okay to start using uh USGA. 00:27:36.609 --> 00:27:39.169 I don't know if I wasn't allowed to say that or not, but we'll find out. 00:27:40.609 --> 00:27:47.569 So we uh we have integration within USGA now, so you can go into the PAR4 app, link your USGA account. 00:27:47.729 --> 00:27:50.529 Uh our next step is to get all the scoring, right? 00:27:50.609 --> 00:27:57.169 So all the 10, your your past 10 scores will be brought into par four, and then all of your stats will be based off of that as well. 00:27:57.329 --> 00:28:01.889 So now we have full
handy care handicap operations for any game type. 00:28:01.969 --> 00:28:03.729 Um, again, free. 00:28:03.889 --> 00:28:09.729 Uh and uh going all the way down to during an event, you have a full leaderboard. 00:28:09.809 --> 00:28:13.329 And within the app, this is the cool part that no other app does. 00:28:13.489 --> 00:28:30.369 Um, as you're playing, a live GPS will actually show your icon moving across the golf course with the yardage to the pen, and it'll show your viewer what club you're taking, the weather, and everything about the location of where you're at, how many hazards there are on that hole. 00:28:30.449 --> 00:28:36.369 So we basically created shot link, what the PGA tour has, but for the everyday tournament and the everyday player. 00:28:36.449 --> 00:28:37.809 And also really cool. 00:28:37.889 --> 00:28:44.369 So you've got my wheels really turning because I'm going with 16 guys, or if there's 15 guys going with me, I'm the 16th. 00:28:44.529 --> 00:28:47.009 We're going to Landman in Nebraska in July. 00:28:47.169 --> 00:28:47.729 Oh, nice. 00:28:47.969 --> 00:28:54.369 And and I'm thinking through because there's always there's lots back and forth about what kind of games we're gonna do and how we're gonna keep up with it. 00:28:54.769 --> 00:28:57.169 And I might have found a solution. 00:28:57.409 --> 00:29:00.449 And and because it sounds like par four can solve all of that. 00:29:00.529 --> 00:29:10.449 Because if anybody wants to have side games, side bets, whatever, they can do that while we still have a large game between two teams that gets managed within the app. 00:29:10.529 --> 00:29:11.329 Am I hearing you correctly? 00:29:11.489 --> 00:29:13.169 Because that's like that functionality exists. 00:29:13.409 --> 00:29:13.729 Yep. 00:29:13.889 --> 00:29:18.609 And you can do scrambles, you can do stableford, we have point systems all the way down. 00:29:18.689 --> 00:29:22.369 Your handicaps will show everybody who gets a pop on which hole. 00:29:22.449 --> 00:29:30.849 Um, like everything is broken down to where all you have to do is literally push your your score, and that's it, and it does the rest, right? 00:29:31.089 --> 00:29:38.769 So um and and and the cool part is is we're working on where you can actually create side games in your big tournament, right? 00:29:38.929 --> 00:29:46.449 So if you're playing a stroke play, we're gonna have the op uh the option to be basically create a skins game in that stroke play. 00:29:46.529 --> 00:29:46.929 That's right. 00:29:47.169 --> 00:29:47.409 Right. 00:29:47.649 --> 00:29:55.009 So um again, just kind of doing things that are, you know, it's it in a way we're focusing on two different types of users. 00:29:55.169 --> 00:30:07.569 We're focusing on the the B2B, which is essentially the the clubhouse, the event manager, the people who are putting on events and tours, and then the B2C, which is leading us to the B2B, right? 00:30:07.729 --> 00:30:13.409 Um, and I think that like you said, this is built for physically any type of size. 00:30:13.729 --> 00:30:18.529 Two man, four, six, ten, sixteen, thirty, one hundred, five hundred. 00:30:18.689 --> 00:30:34.449 Um, you know, we just partner with Goldlinks, uh, the really, really awesome black community in golf that have that has like JR Smith and Justin Jefferson and like all these guys, uh Billy J, um, Swag Avance were actually hosting his tournament on par four. 00:30:34.849 --> 00:30:42.769 And uh yeah, it's it's it's just insane the level of detail that we can get into with still making it look freaking gorgeous. 00:30:42.929 --> 00:30:43.089 Yeah. 00:30:43.249 --> 00:30:43.409 Right. 00:30:43.489 --> 00:30:51.169 And and that's really what we're focusing on is uh, and I this kind of cliche, but we are truly trying to become the apple of golf, right? 00:30:51.249 --> 00:31:10.289 When someone looks at par four, when they look at our brand, look at our logo, they're like, they know they're going to get the best product, they know it's going to function well, and yeah, it may be a little bit on the expensive side, not compared to the other competitors, but just as a normal golf outing, but you're gonna get what you pay for, which is an incredible experience. 00:31:10.449 --> 00:31:21.409 Um, you know, our goal is to go after the invited club, the trunes, the the cabots that every time a big group goes out, they're using par four, a part of that party. 00:31:21.569 --> 00:31:28.369 Um, because now it feels like they're actually playing in their own little PGA tour right there at that event on that location. 00:31:28.609 --> 00:31:33.249 So when does when does a user like myself, like for my trip to Landman, when do I start paying? 00:31:33.489 --> 00:31:34.289 Is it doing it? 00:31:34.449 --> 00:31:37.889 So you would you would pay for just the just the one event. 00:31:37.969 --> 00:31:38.449 That's it. 00:31:38.529 --> 00:31:38.609 Okay. 00:31:38.929 --> 00:31:39.169 Right? 00:31:39.409 --> 00:31:40.849 That would be$299. 00:31:41.169 --> 00:31:47.089 And then what you do is you ask all all 16 guys to chip in 15 bucks and it's covered, right? 00:31:47.169 --> 00:31:53.649 But now you have a historical data of your entire round, and you can do multiple rounds in that event. 00:31:53.809 --> 00:31:58.609 So let's say that you do in that event, you do day one, you're going to play 18 holes at this location. 00:31:58.769 --> 00:32:03.889 You create a second round under that same event, it creates your scorecard for you for every single event. 00:32:03.969 --> 00:32:08.209 So you're not having to create five events, you're creating one event with multiple rounds inside. 00:32:08.449 --> 00:32:11.489 Okay, because that's I was about to ask that question because we're playing four rounds. 00:32:11.809 --> 00:32:22.209 So my event, I would have one event with four rounds under it, and then I can go in those each each of those rounds and make them either
scrambles or stroke play, whatever. 00:32:23.569 --> 00:32:24.449 Yep, yep. 00:32:24.609 --> 00:32:29.009 So you're able to now create all of that, and it's all separate different leaderboards. 00:32:29.169 --> 00:32:31.569 And then you can say, Hey, are we playing gross and net? 00:32:31.729 --> 00:32:33.969 Are we just playing stroke play straight up? 00:32:34.129 --> 00:32:36.929 So you get to choose as you're going through this. 00:32:37.089 --> 00:32:44.049 Um, and and and and you know, like let's say, for instance, you just happen to be like, hey, I'm gonna try to get a sponsor for this, right? 00:32:44.129 --> 00:32:45.569 And and publicly get it. 00:32:45.729 --> 00:32:48.849 You can literally create a sponsorship right there in that event. 00:32:49.009 --> 00:32:52.049 That sponsorship can buy it, and now it's on all of your scorecards. 00:32:52.129 --> 00:32:53.809 Now it's on all of your cart cards. 00:32:53.889 --> 00:32:59.409 And we do all the printouts right in par four where it automatically generates everything with cut lines. 00:32:59.569 --> 00:33:04.609 Uh, your sponsor logo shows up on it, a QR code shows up on it for you to download the app. 00:33:04.769 --> 00:33:08.769 You click it, there's no GG ID, there's no searching for your event. 00:33:08.929 --> 00:33:19.889 The email that you registered for, literally type that into par four, even if it's your first time using the app or a hundredth time, you log in, and that scorecard is literally waiting for you right at the top. 00:33:20.049 --> 00:33:28.209 So our ecosystem allows for you now your profile to go to another event, and that that that profile follows you along. 00:33:28.449 --> 00:33:34.449 So now your stats will follow you to any par four event that you do inside the platform. 00:33:34.609 --> 00:33:42.289 So it's not like other products where you use a a GG ID once and you're like, well, I don't know what happened to my score. 00:33:42.369 --> 00:33:43.489 It's in the ether now, right? 00:33:43.649 --> 00:34:13.170 Like it literally, like the only way you'll be able to see it is if you go back to if it's tied to a USGA account, right? 00:34:13.489 --> 00:34:20.929 Um with this, literally everything follows you uh inside of your member profile. 00:34:21.329 --> 00:34:24.210 Your club can actually go in and leave private comments. 00:34:24.289 --> 00:34:27.969 So, like, this guy's slow, we need to put him with the sandbaggers or what. 00:34:28.289 --> 00:34:33.170 So there's a full ecosystem for the club to literally manage their members in real time. 00:34:33.410 --> 00:34:35.570 Then there's a thing called my bag. 00:34:35.730 --> 00:34:43.329 So in the app, you can set up every single detail about your bag, your glove, the ball that you use, the bag that you use, all your clubs. 00:34:43.490 --> 00:34:54.930 So when you're playing, it literally is telling the user in real time that's watching you what club you're using based off the distance that you put in, and it's using that data every single time you play on every single course. 00:34:55.410 --> 00:34:57.970 And so which that's fascinating also. 00:34:58.210 --> 00:35:05.410 The on the group game, like the 16 guys, is there a link then that everybody gets sent where they're able to join that event? 00:35:05.570 --> 00:35:07.730 What how how does that that event? 00:35:07.890 --> 00:35:11.170 So what would happen is you would create an event, right? 00:35:11.410 --> 00:35:14.050 You now have a public page, they would all register. 00:35:14.130 --> 00:35:15.970 You would make this an unlisted event, right? 00:35:16.130 --> 00:35:22.369 Because you don't want it out in the ether, like you want people to literally you're your 16 guys to register. 00:35:22.530 --> 00:35:36.050 Once they're registered, you actually can go into that event and create tea times for specific one like rounds, but like, hey, we're gonna group these four guys together and these four guys, and then the next round, these four guys are gonna be grouped together, these four guys are gonna be grouped together. 00:35:36.210 --> 00:35:43.570 So you literally can customize it like you're the head pro at the clubhouse, but for just your 16 guys. 00:35:43.809 --> 00:35:53.730 Then as they're entering in all their emails to register for that, once they sign into the app and you start that event, literally that that scorecard shows up automatically in their app. 00:35:53.809 --> 00:35:56.210 So there's no searching for it, there's no entering a code. 00:35:56.449 --> 00:36:07.409 Literally, once you guys are starting your tea times, boom, everyone gets in the app a push notification saying your round is started, you hit it, and then it comes up and start scoring, and that's it. 00:36:07.650 --> 00:36:10.610 And then once you finish a hole, you just go in and put your score in. 00:36:10.849 --> 00:36:11.170 Yep. 00:36:11.329 --> 00:36:12.289 And then you hit next. 00:36:12.369 --> 00:36:14.690 And then on the web page, this is the cool part. 00:36:14.849 --> 00:36:16.369 The web page is dynamic. 00:36:16.449 --> 00:36:25.090 So the webpage they signed up on literally the sign-up goes away and it becomes a full leaderboard for people to literally follow along in real time. 00:36:26.369 --> 00:36:30.369 Then inside the app we have an optional thing that are called stats. 00:36:30.530 --> 00:36:35.010 So you can enter in your FIR, G I R, how many putts, how many sand traps. 00:36:35.250 --> 00:36:39.650 Below that leaderboard is all the data that's coming in real time from the app. 00:36:39.809 --> 00:36:43.809 So you could say, oh, Josh made a three putt here, but he made a par. 00:36:44.369 --> 00:36:47.809 Oh, Kevin made a two putt and he made an eagle, right? 00:36:47.889 --> 00:37:00.449 Like, so it literally lists out all the stats like you're literally watching uh a tour in real time, and it tells you, and and and the updates are literally four to eight seconds. 00:37:00.530 -->
00:37:05.170 As soon as you enter the score, it updates automatically right in the web browser, too. 00:37:05.490 --> 00:37:06.130 That's awesome. 00:37:06.210 --> 00:37:09.010 Well, yeah, so I'm I'm definitely gonna have to get with you on on for our channel. 00:37:09.570 --> 00:37:10.289 I'll give you a code. 00:37:10.369 --> 00:37:12.929 You can use it for free and test it out and give me some feedback. 00:37:13.090 --> 00:37:14.050 Yeah, that would be great. 00:37:14.210 --> 00:37:21.809 So, what what challenges have you guys run into with calling on clubs and just in the trip like me on a golf trip? 00:37:21.970 --> 00:37:27.010 What has been the biggest hurdle that you all have encountered that that kind of surprised you? 00:37:27.329 --> 00:37:28.610 New software, right? 00:37:28.690 --> 00:37:31.250 Like no one wants to sit there and relearn new software. 00:37:31.329 --> 00:37:31.570 Yeah. 00:37:31.730 --> 00:37:37.970 Um, and and we kind of win them, we've won them over recently by changing the way that we talk about it. 00:37:38.130 --> 00:37:43.730 And it's really saying, hey, I can I can actually onboard you in 30 minutes. 00:37:43.889 --> 00:37:51.809 A normal competitor uh onboarding takes anywhere between four to six hours multiple days, right? 00:37:51.889 --> 00:37:56.050 Because it's just so much, it's so convoluted, like it's it's massive. 00:37:56.210 --> 00:38:01.170 But we literally can onboard you in 30 minutes and have your first event up in nine minutes. 00:38:01.329 --> 00:38:05.409 So from beginning to end, I you can set up a full event in nine minutes. 00:38:05.650 --> 00:38:16.929 And so we we made it to where, like, uh it's funny enough, uh my my slogan or my saying is like if my mom, we literally asked my mom to do it and she was able to do it all the way through. 00:38:17.010 --> 00:38:20.929 And my mom is the person that calls me weekly asking for my pet for a password, right? 00:38:21.170 --> 00:38:27.329 And so we made it to where any type of level of person would be able to create an event and do it. 00:38:27.490 --> 00:38:40.530 Um, and so that's what we've really been focusing on is making it very quick, very easy, very beautiful, and truly focusing on that experience to make it be like, yeah, I'm gonna use this for everything that we do, right? 00:38:40.610 --> 00:38:44.530 And again, not just golf events, but everything that that club may offer. 00:38:44.690 --> 00:38:46.929 Um, and and we're we're building even more. 00:38:47.010 --> 00:38:54.449 Like next on our roadmap, the the the biggest thing that I'm absolutely so excited about, we're offering memberships with inside of a club. 00:38:54.690 --> 00:39:04.210 So a a club can now sell memberships at annual or yearly with dues in the whole nine yards within side of par four. 00:39:04.369 --> 00:39:07.809 So you can have membership packages in that membership package. 00:39:07.970 --> 00:39:14.769 Let's say you create an event and say, hey, I only want these members to get access for 24 hours, then it opens up to the public. 00:39:15.010 --> 00:39:23.010 So these members will get first access to my club and you pay X amount a month or X amount a year, and then here's the initiation. 00:39:23.170 --> 00:39:30.769 So all these clubs that exist without an actual building will now be able to create and build memberships right in par four. 00:39:30.929 --> 00:39:41.490 So now you have club management, member management, event management, uh sponsor management, league management, and everything all under one roof. 00:39:41.889 --> 00:39:42.530 That's very good. 00:39:42.769 --> 00:39:44.769 And that that's becoming a more popular thing, right? 00:39:44.929 --> 00:39:57.490 Like you're seeing that pop up all over the place where there's it's a golf club, I'm gonna make an air quotes, but they don't have brick and mortar, they don't have a home course, but they've had five of them sign up in the last 48 hours. 00:39:58.369 --> 00:39:59.010 Yeah. 00:39:59.490 --> 00:39:59.970 Yep. 00:40:00.210 --> 00:40:07.970 And and you have to think about it random golf club, golf gaming club, um, uh the cactus club, which they signed up. 00:40:08.130 --> 00:40:10.769 Terrence signed up on on par four for that. 00:40:11.010 --> 00:40:14.210 Um, we again today we just announced the social club. 00:40:14.289 --> 00:40:18.449 We have here a uh in Orlando, the Panther Pines Club. 00:40:18.530 --> 00:40:26.769 And it's literally all these clubs have no brick or building, they go and meet at different golf courses, they play, and that is their membership, right? 00:40:26.929 --> 00:40:30.929 Which is a freaking cool experience because now you get to go to multiple courses. 00:40:31.010 --> 00:40:38.210 Yeah, and usually it's the people inside the the club that's offering up their clubs for those players to come in. 00:40:38.449 --> 00:40:46.929 So yeah, I think I think in my in my opinion, where golf is going, you're going to see more clubs without buildings than buildings. 00:40:47.570 --> 00:40:49.250 Yeah, that's that's crazy. 00:40:49.409 --> 00:40:50.610 But it's a really cool concept. 00:40:50.690 --> 00:40:53.970 I mean, I'm not a part of one, but I'm I'm familiar with Gimme Golf in St. 00:40:54.050 --> 00:40:56.690 Louis and they're they're just exploding. 00:40:56.849 --> 00:40:59.090 And they've got access to clubs there in St. 00:40:59.250 --> 00:40:59.570 Louis. 00:40:59.650 --> 00:41:03.570 They have simulators, obviously, so they can play indoors, but their membership's huge. 00:41:03.650 --> 00:41:05.970 They're they've got international, they've got national members. 00:41:06.210 --> 00:41:08.690 Um that yeah, that's that's fascinating. 00:41:08.769 --> 00:41:14.130 I didn't I never even thought about that as an opportunity for revenue, but it it certainly makes complete sense. 00:41:14.769 --> 00:41:16.929 What is what is next for par four? 00:41:17.010 --> 00:41:26.690 So it sounds like you've found the
niche and where you guys are trying to kick open that door in terms of clubs both that have their own golf courses and clubs that don't. 00:41:27.010 --> 00:41:31.970 But what if you could wave a magic wand in the next five years, what does par four look like? 00:41:32.449 --> 00:41:36.289 Yeah, so big thing number one is is building trust, right? 00:41:36.449 --> 00:41:43.809 Like we're this new product, well, older new product that has pivoted to what we are. 00:41:43.970 --> 00:41:51.570 Um, and and I truly think that gaining trust of people to be like, hey, I'm I will spend money on your product, right? 00:41:51.650 --> 00:41:58.130 That's the hardest thing to get anybody to do is saying, man, I'm gonna drop$300 for one event. 00:41:58.289 --> 00:42:03.889 But what people don't realize is one sponsor can cover that, 10 guys can cover that, right? 00:42:03.970 --> 00:42:35.810 Like the when you break it down, it is so inexpensive to actually do an event or host an event or tournament or club inside a par four. 00:42:36.050 --> 00:42:43.970 And you know, we we've we've pitched it this way, which is we want to create more revenue streams for clubs that they did not know that existed, right? 00:42:44.050 --> 00:42:54.530 So it is starting to become a business for some of these people to create clubs, host events, create tournaments, and they're literally now be able to create a business off of it, right? 00:42:54.850 --> 00:42:57.490 Um, I mean, you you do the math simply. 00:42:57.650 --> 00:43:01.570 If I got, you know, we know a club, oh, Soba, Soba Club. 00:43:01.650 --> 00:43:08.530 They are uh, I'm actually going uh with uh Corey to Ireland, which is super cool in September. 00:43:08.690 --> 00:43:18.930 And we signed up Soba, you know, if you think about it, if they launched a membership for their 10,000 members at$75 a year, that the math's simple on that, right? 00:43:19.010 --> 00:43:34.770 Like you're creating a revenue stream that never existed, but now you get to offer your members something that they never got to get got to have, which is an experience almost feeling like they are part of a country club, but actually a tighter community, right? 00:43:35.010 --> 00:43:45.010 So that's I think where we want to focus is creating and generating revenue, but making sure that we're building clubs and events really freaking well for our users. 00:43:45.330 --> 00:43:52.050 So is there are there capabilities within the app to like a like a Discord channel where you can communicate with other members or no? 00:43:52.290 --> 00:43:53.010 Not right now. 00:43:53.090 --> 00:43:59.410 So we're working on a communication piece where you'll be able, right now you can email members inside of par four and it's its own system. 00:43:59.570 --> 00:44:02.770 Um we're working on text messages, in-app notifications. 00:44:02.850 --> 00:44:10.370 So you can basically be like, hey, I want to send out a push notification to your 16 guys and say, hey guys, make sure you're up and ready. 00:44:10.450 --> 00:44:12.370 Tomorrow's tea time, 6 a.m., right? 00:44:12.450 --> 00:44:12.530 Right. 00:44:12.690 --> 00:44:16.690 And it sends out a push notification to all their phones or text or whatever. 00:44:16.850 --> 00:44:27.490 Um, so we're working on that right now, and then we want to build uh, you know, some integration into something like MailChimp where you can export it, create a newsletter, and then send it off inside of MailChimp. 00:44:27.650 --> 00:44:42.450 So communication, uh communication memberships, uh multi-leaderboards is something that we're working on too, where you can have like a flight A leaderboard, a flight B, a women's leaderboard, a senior leaderboard. 00:44:42.610 --> 00:44:47.650 So that that takes a lot of effort because it's a lot of data flowing into one place. 00:44:47.810 --> 00:44:58.050 Uh and then we're actually working on a TV app right now for Fire Stick, Apple TV, where it's basically a customized leaderboard for your event with all your sponsors and logos. 00:44:58.930 --> 00:45:17.330 Um so you know, and I think we're we're we're hearing things uh a ton of like schools have been reaching out to us, which is the coaches want to create a roster or a way to manage his his vegan team inside of par four where he can create practice rounds or championship rounds. 00:45:17.490 --> 00:45:29.650 So we'll probably start going and branching out to do functionality and build functionality that are meant for other types of golf clubs, schools, colleges, uh simulators, right? 00:45:29.730 --> 00:45:32.610 Like building this software where we actually have one here. 00:45:33.090 --> 00:45:33.970 It's called one degree. 00:45:34.050 --> 00:45:36.770 I'm meeting with them tomorrow tomorrow morning. 00:45:37.410 --> 00:45:40.450 And he's like, I hate the software I use. 00:45:40.610 --> 00:45:41.650 What you have is awesome. 00:45:41.810 --> 00:45:52.770 Can you create a version where instead of one in the course, it literally is just a, you know, he'll he'll build stands for every single sim that he has, and you put your phone there and it's a scorecard, right? 00:45:52.850 --> 00:45:57.490 And then your phone becomes a scorecard without the map of the course that you're playing, right? 00:45:57.650 --> 00:46:04.370 So now it it and he has this huge, giant TGL type screen that he's like, I want to put the leaderboard on there. 00:46:04.450 --> 00:46:08.930 So when they update their score, all the sims can turn around and look at the leaderboard in real time. 00:46:09.250 --> 00:46:09.810 That's cool. 00:46:09.970 --> 00:46:13.650 Um, so I think there's a lot of different pieces that we're gonna go after. 00:46:13.810 --> 00:46:20.370 The the one thing that we don't want to do is try to put all of our every egg that we have in one basket, right? 00:46:20.610 --> 00:46:32.610 Um, I think really, really focusing on the idea to create a software really well is to build what you're
building really well, then move on to the next roadmap piece. 00:46:32.690 --> 00:46:32.930 Yeah. 00:46:33.090 --> 00:46:33.250 Right. 00:46:33.570 --> 00:46:34.770 Listening to our users. 00:46:34.930 --> 00:46:41.810 I mean, ever uh about 40, 40 or 50 of our my users, I text daily. 00:46:41.890 --> 00:46:48.450 And I'm like, and it's a white glove experience that probably will hopefully go away, you know, in in the long term as we grow. 00:46:48.530 --> 00:46:53.330 And but it's like right now I'm so excited to be like, hey, like today I sent out 30 messages. 00:46:53.490 --> 00:46:58.850 Hey, we just launched a new feature inside the club where you can now upload pictures into your club. 00:46:59.010 --> 00:47:04.370 So now your club has aesthetic viewing of what your club is like from a visual standpoint. 00:47:04.610 --> 00:47:11.490 And the other day we just added social media uh tags where you can go in and create your social media in your club. 00:47:11.650 --> 00:47:17.410 So our goal, hopefully in the next three months, is some of these clubs don't even have websites. 00:47:17.490 --> 00:47:21.810 Their website is their club page on part four because it has everything there, right? 00:47:21.970 --> 00:47:31.170 So again, creating that Shopify experience where then we'll move into hey, you can sell your products on part four, you can create your tea times on part four, right? 00:47:31.410 --> 00:47:38.370 So that's long term, but we gotta start and build something beautiful before we get to those cool and fun pieces. 00:47:38.610 --> 00:47:39.890 And like you said, gain the trust. 00:47:40.050 --> 00:47:47.090 As soon as you have yeah, gaining the trust with anything is a huge, huge factor um for anything that's gonna be successful. 00:47:47.170 --> 00:48:00.450 And once you have that trust, then you can start adding those other layers, and people have already know how your app works, they enjoy using the app, so they don't have any issue with a new feature because it we're we're all creatures of habit, right? 00:48:00.610 --> 00:48:03.890 And anything, as soon as something changes, we freak out. 00:48:03.970 --> 00:48:05.490 Like it doesn't matter. 00:48:05.730 --> 00:48:09.010 And yeah, but you're you're right, the trust part's huge. 00:48:09.170 --> 00:48:11.090 Um, I love what you're doing, it's fascinating. 00:48:11.330 --> 00:48:19.330 I love how you you just 17 dropped out of high school and had this aha moment and then had a complete change in direction for the company. 00:48:19.490 --> 00:48:23.650 Um that's it is a wild, wild journey you've been on, Ethan. 00:48:24.130 --> 00:48:31.810 It's uh yeah, there's sometimes I like literally like not even being cliche or cheesy, I lay in bed and I'm like, what the hell? 00:48:32.370 --> 00:48:33.970 Yeah, what are we doing? 00:48:34.210 --> 00:48:36.610 I'm like, what have I done? 00:48:36.770 --> 00:48:42.050 Like this is this is like there is no going back, you know, like it is it is
full steam ahead. 00:48:42.130 --> 00:48:45.730 And if you can't tell, like my passion for this is fiery. 00:48:45.890 --> 00:48:47.970 Like, I just I love what I get to do. 00:48:48.130 --> 00:48:48.770 I'm up. 00:48:48.930 --> 00:48:55.570 I mean, my not just me, my team, my CTO Josh literally is up most nights till one or two a.m. 00:48:55.730 --> 00:49:01.810 He lives in Atlanta, my older brother lives in Atlanta, we're all pretty much East Coast, okay, and we're just like it was funny. 00:49:01.890 --> 00:49:03.170 My I was talking to my brother today. 00:49:03.250 --> 00:49:06.770 I was like, okay, we need to look for, you know, start maybe hiring for this and this. 00:49:06.930 --> 00:49:11.810 And he's like, you do realize like we're gonna be the only people that stay up till one or two a.m. 00:49:11.970 --> 00:49:16.050 Like your expectation for other people to do that is is needs to come down. 00:49:16.130 --> 00:49:19.570 And I'm like, well, if they don't have the grit, I don't want them on my team. 00:49:19.810 --> 00:49:30.850 You know, like this is you know, I think if we if we work really hard to build something really cool, the reward is is gonna be way more worth every single night that I stay up till one or two a.m. 00:49:31.090 --> 00:49:34.850 You know, um, and I don't have to, but I'm excited about what I'm building. 00:49:35.010 --> 00:49:43.890 I'm excited about bringing tech and in a way that is not fractional and not old, um, and truly changing the way that like I get to play golf. 00:49:43.970 --> 00:49:47.810 Like my wife has recently become obsessed with golf, which I freaking love. 00:49:47.970 --> 00:49:52.850 Um, and we'll go out and use my app to score while we play golf. 00:49:52.930 --> 00:49:57.170 And I'm like, this is just this is wild, you know, like there's so many combinations here. 00:49:57.410 --> 00:50:08.610 Um, but it's a it's a massive blessing, and it it is it is super, super cool um to see how far we've come, the struggles, like yeah, the struggles have been insane. 00:50:08.690 --> 00:50:17.810 But like at the end of the day, like when we hit fifty thousand dollars this month in in in revenue, I I looked at that number and I was like, there's no way I would have seen this a year ago. 00:50:18.050 --> 00:50:22.850 And um people trusting us with what they want and need and building. 00:50:23.010 --> 00:50:30.210 Um, every every customer we talk to, our goal is saying, hey, if you have feedback and if there's something that we can build, let us know. 00:50:30.370 --> 00:50:31.730 We will add it to the roadmap. 00:50:31.890 --> 00:50:36.930 We're not gonna give you a defined time of when that will be done, but it won't take months and it won't take weeks. 00:50:37.170 --> 00:50:45.490 Like our goal is to truly put what customers want because what Mitchell wants is probably what a hundred other Mitchells want. 00:50:45.650 --> 00:50:45.730 Right. 00:50:45.970 --> 00:50:46.130 Right. 00:50:46.210 --> 00:50:53.090 And so if we can kind of articulate that, we're gonna become and build a successful product just listening to our users, right? 00:50:53.250 --> 00:51:04.850 Like Rolap said the other day, the best way to build an incredible profitable tour is listen live by listening to nine out of ten of the people who watch the game of golf. 00:51:05.090 --> 00:51:05.170 Right. 00:51:05.330 --> 00:51:05.410 Right. 00:51:06.210 --> 00:51:12.610 So if we do that, we can build something very successful that actually people want to use and will pay for. 00:51:12.930 --> 00:51:14.290 Yeah, that's fantastic. 00:51:14.450 --> 00:51:15.330 That's that is awesome. 00:51:15.410 --> 00:51:20.770 Well, yeah, I definitely want to I need to I need to use your app for my trip because I'll send you a code. 00:51:20.930 --> 00:51:22.850 There's a lot going on for that. 00:51:23.090 --> 00:51:27.730 Um, and and thank you for the time, but I got a couple little quick questions and then we'll get you out of here. 00:51:27.810 --> 00:51:28.210 Yeah, yeah. 00:51:28.610 --> 00:51:31.410 Uh, what is your favorite club in the bag right now? 00:51:31.730 --> 00:51:32.050 Okay. 00:51:32.690 --> 00:51:37.090 My Mizuno 60 degree is probably my favorite club. 00:51:37.810 --> 00:51:42.690 I just ordered a mini driver, so I'll let you know if that's my favorite club in about two weeks. 00:51:43.010 --> 00:51:43.330 Okay. 00:51:44.290 --> 00:51:48.210 But yeah, I my 60 degree, like, I just love chipping. 00:51:48.290 --> 00:51:55.570 Chipping's one of the most like peaceful things to me, which is very weird for someone to uh say that, but it's just yeah, I love it. 00:51:55.650 --> 00:51:56.690 I love my 60 degree. 00:51:57.010 --> 00:52:01.330 Yeah, well, so you've clearly listened to some episodes for you to make the mini driver reference. 00:52:01.490 --> 00:52:03.810 I mean, yeah, that's I need to get one in the bag. 00:52:04.050 --> 00:52:06.850 Uh what is your favorite course in Florida? 00:52:07.090 --> 00:52:07.810 Uh gosh. 00:52:07.970 --> 00:52:08.290 Okay. 00:52:08.610 --> 00:52:13.970 Favorite course in Florida would have to, I mean, I'm biased. 00:52:14.050 --> 00:52:16.530 Like, four seasons is just gorgeous. 00:52:16.770 --> 00:52:19.090 Um, it's it's in Disney World. 00:52:19.170 --> 00:52:24.130 It's on a uh a property that's four seasons, but it's also in a neighborhood called Golden Oak. 00:52:24.450 --> 00:52:30.930 So it's the only place in Disney World that you can actually live uh inside of the gates of Disney World. 00:52:31.090 --> 00:52:35.970 Houses start anywhere between 4.5 to 30 million dollars, right? 00:52:36.210 --> 00:52:40.610 So it is like it's nuts, but we don't have tea times. 00:52:40.850 --> 00:52:49.730 We have 200 members, and I literally like I like me and my wife could go out at three o'clock and not one single soul is on the course. 00:52:50.050 --> 00:52:51.090 Oh, that sounds amazing. 00:52:51.890 --> 00:52:56.690 Peaceful thing in
the world where her and I can literally just like practice chipping, practice doing this. 00:52:56.850 --> 00:53:05.330 Um, so I would say for the for the the factor and the benefits of the course, but also the beauty of the four seasons, they take so good care of it. 00:53:05.410 --> 00:53:07.890 Um, I would have to say four seasons all day long. 00:53:08.050 --> 00:53:09.490 Tranquilo is what it's called. 00:53:09.650 --> 00:53:09.810 Okay. 00:53:10.130 --> 00:53:13.490 Where they used to host the uh LPGA tournaments uh down here in Florida. 00:53:14.130 --> 00:53:14.690 Yeah, yeah, that's right. 00:53:14.770 --> 00:53:15.970 Yeah, I remember that now. 00:53:16.210 --> 00:53:22.130 Um if you could come up with a dream foresome, dead or alive, who who would be in that dream foresome with you? 00:53:22.450 --> 00:53:23.970 I I I have it. 00:53:24.050 --> 00:53:30.290 Uh Tommy Fleetwood, Bryson D.Chambeau, Anders Albertson, and me. 00:53:30.770 --> 00:53:31.730 That would be fun. 00:53:32.290 --> 00:53:34.690 That is is Anders a talker? 00:53:34.770 --> 00:53:36.850 Is is he is he talking about? 00:53:37.090 --> 00:53:39.250 He is he is quiet as a mouse. 00:53:39.410 --> 00:53:47.010 Um yeah, he is very quiet in it, and and I would love someone like Bryson to play with someone like Anderson. 00:53:47.410 --> 00:53:48.210 Right, yeah, yeah. 00:53:51.650 --> 00:53:59.250 And I feel like Tom Tommy would be the level head uh in the pros there, just like chilling, watching, just kind of taking it all in. 00:53:59.410 --> 00:54:02.930 But uh I I share uh in the love for Tommy Fleetwood. 00:54:03.010 --> 00:54:04.610 I I want him to get his first major. 00:54:04.690 --> 00:54:09.170 Um I'm hoping so bad it happens this year. 00:54:09.250 --> 00:54:11.090 I not not so much the masters. 00:54:11.170 --> 00:54:14.370 I I think I would love to see Bryson pull it off this year. 00:54:14.530 --> 00:54:16.530 He's uh I'm a big Bryson fan. 00:54:16.610 --> 00:54:17.170 I just love him. 00:54:17.250 --> 00:54:20.770 I love you know uh just how he thinks about the game. 00:54:20.850 --> 00:54:25.970 He he he invests in a ton of companies in tech to literally enhance the game. 00:54:26.130 --> 00:54:31.410 Um so he is just like a he's like the scientist, the mad scientist of golf, of what I what I feel like. 00:54:31.490 --> 00:54:37.570 And he just is like always dabbling in like what can make him better, what can what tech can make him better? 00:54:37.650 --> 00:54:38.610 And I'm just I love that. 00:54:38.770 --> 00:54:42.850 I love people who are like trying to progress what they do for a living, you know? 00:54:43.330 --> 00:54:44.450 Yeah, yeah, absolutely. 00:54:44.610 --> 00:54:47.570 Well, and lastly, do you hit driver off the deck? 00:54:48.210 --> 00:54:49.330 Uh no. 00:54:49.730 --> 00:54:58.290 Uh terrible, but that that mini driver, when I was hitting it off the deck at Golf Galaxy, I was strifing. 00:54:59.250 --> 00:55:00.370 I love that. 00:55:00.770 --> 00:55:01.330 Love that. 00:55:01.570 --> 00:55:03.570 Ethan, thank you so much for the time. 00:55:03.730 --> 00:55:05.410 Uh really enjoyed our conversation. 00:55:05.490 --> 00:55:12.210 I look forward to to using your app and look forward to keeping up with all of the success that that Par 4 has. 00:55:12.530 --> 00:55:13.250 Thank you, Josh. 00:55:13.330 --> 00:55:13.810 I appreciate it. 00:55:13.970 --> 00:55:14.690 Thanks for having me on. 00:55:14.770 --> 00:55:15.410 Thanks for talking. 00:55:15.490 --> 00:55:25.010 I I just I love being able to talk golf um and with cool people who who just truly, truly also want to grow the game in so many different aspects. 00:55:25.090 --> 00:55:27.490 So thank you for what you do and and your awesome podcast. 00:55:27.650 --> 00:55:28.610 Yeah, thank you for the kind words. 00:55:28.690 --> 00:55:32.610 Well, for Ethan Andrews, I'm Josh Stecker, and this has been another episode of Off the Deck.
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