Full Transcript for Body Count

you that I don't already know. Like, I don't mind the fact that you had a life before me, but I don't want to walk into finding out about that life because, oh girl, sitting over here reminiscing because she just happened to find out you're mine. Like, I don't, like, at all. And I think as men, you know, there's the, I'm pretty sure they expect the same thing as well. I think that's the only reason why, for me, your body count and your past experiences should even be that serious of a topic. It's like, yo, okay, I know you work with such and such, or, you know, I see you have a distant friend circle, because there's always, like, this sixth degree of separation, especially in, like, you know, the industries we work in. That's the only way I'm doing it. I'm too grown to be on some, like, Oh, my God, that number. Like, most men anyway can't even tell you how many people they done slept with. 00:05:55 Speaker 1: And what is the right number? What number would he be comfortable with her saying? 00:06:00 Speaker 3: I feel like it's two. There isn't one. 00:06:02 Speaker 1: I feel like it's her and one other person maybe when she was 25 or something. 00:06:07 Speaker 2: No, I think it's like half of a person. Like, y'all almost did it, but y'all didn't. Like, y'all was young, and it was just like, oh, there. 00:06:13 Speaker 3: It feels like a trick. Exactly. 00:06:15 Speaker 1: It feels like a facade or a mirage. Like, you're not going to be comfortable with anything she tells you. And more importantly, if it's anybody who he knows, like he said, are we talking about I mean, you are probably he has millions and millions of followers. Are you counting the people who follow you? Are you just talking about the people you actually know? Because everyone's core circle is relatively small. And so outside of that, are you just talking about somebody peripherally who doesn't know you and you don't know them, but you may just know who they are? 00:06:46 Speaker 3: That's too much. She's been X'd out, right? She has the scarlet letter because of that person. I don't think it just makes no sense. It just feels like a setup. So I don't know. I'm not encouraging her to lie, but I'm just saying I understand. 00:06:59 Speaker 1: Lauren, what was your assessment of what Cam Newton said in that clip? 00:07:03 Speaker 2: So, okay. Unfiltered. I know that's probably your friend. I've interviewed Cam before, but I don't know him personally. Like, we're not friends. But even if so, honest opinion always. My first thought was, I understand where he's coming from, even though I know it's not going to be received well, because you are NFL Hall of Famer, who we know have ran through many packs of women all over the world. But I understand... Being a person that has worked very hard to build up this life and reputation for yourself and not wanting to be thrown into a surprise situation where you find out the person you loving on than been with half your whole team and you had

no idea. I can understand that point. Now, on the other side of it, whether at this big grown age that matters or should matter to everybody, I don't know if I fully agree with, but if that's the stance he takes and that's the hill he's on... I wasn't mad at him for wanting to know for that reason. Now, if it had been, I want to know because if she'd been around, if she's been with multiple people at this point and we almost 40 years old, it's almost impossible to not think that she's had sexual experience and sexual partners. And if you were judging her and making her less than or devaluing her body and who she is because of that, I don't ever agree with that. But if it's a thing of wanting to know what you're getting yourself into, I'm not mad at nobody for wanting to know that at all. Period. Okay. So. 00:08:25 Speaker 1: The only thing I would say that bothers me when men do this, and again, maybe everybody does it, but there becomes this element of ego and jealousy that you have to acknowledge. And when you think about women and relationships, one of the barriers to their safety at times becomes when you can incite a man's jealousy. We can be in a position where men can be jealous and they can use these tools as tools of combat against you. And so that's the only thing I would say is that sometimes this does become something that people don't want to know to do anything but to weaponize it. Right. And so where are you and how many people should you really disclose this to? So that's what I would say. I don't think it should be something everybody should know. 00:09:13 Speaker 2: I have a question, though, for you. Because even when women say, I hate how men judge us off a body count or how there's a double standard, how much of this should women be accountable for, right? Because in a situation... And let's take it away from Cam Newton and Jazzy. Yeah, absolutely. But if I'm a woman and I get with a man, and even if the man doesn't say it, but everything that he's doing is showing me that my vulnerability may be taken for granted because of whatever. Maybe he doesn't want marriage or he's just not as faithful as I need him to be or he's not as vulnerable as I'm being, right? Yes. But you choose to still be there. You choose to have them babies. You choose to. 00:09:48 Speaker 3: That's it. 00:09:49 Speaker 2: And even in the body count conversation, it's like, It's annoying to be judged based off of a body count at this big age. But at the same time, as a woman... I've never heard a woman say, I want a man that's a virgin. 00:10:02 Speaker 3: Absolutely. 00:10:03 Speaker 2: So we put them on this pedestal, but then we're upset when they're honest about not wanting to put us on the pedestal. 00:10:09 Speaker 3: Well, that's the point. That's what I'm saying. So What am I sharing this information with you for? Right. What is the value of this? 00:10:16 Speaker 1: And again, I think if there is a question of crossing paths with a person who we

have in common, that's one thing. 00:10:22 Speaker 3: But what is the right number? That's what I'm saying. 00:10:24 Speaker 1: It's almost like to me a trick question. If his number is four and your number is eight. You have now just been degraded. And so you're helping to degrade yourself in this relationship. It's hard because the other question is, what is sex, right? So does it count if he just, if it was just kind of like a dude who you just let put in a little bit and then he just came and it was like, oh, that wasn't even nothing. 00:10:46 Speaker 3: Do you count him? Did you count that? 00:10:48 Speaker 2: No, because that's the real thing. Because in a group chat, there is that conversation. Certain people and certain things don't count. I've been in conversations with women that are like, that don't count. 00:10:56 Speaker 3: That don't count. 00:10:57 Speaker 2: Like, it doesn't. 00:10:58 Speaker 1: So it's not even real anyway. And I feel like with men, everything counts for them. I'm listening to what Cam Newton was saying, right? He said the dude had a one up on me. I bet you what he feels like that if there was a girl who went on a date with a dude who he knows, right? 00:11:12 Speaker 2: Exchange phone numbers, anything. 00:11:13 Speaker 1: If they exchanged phone numbers, if they kissed, if she came over to the house and she cooked for him. 00:11:17 Speaker 3: So that's what I'm trying to say. It almost feels like in the roster, right? 00:11:21 Speaker 1: If somebody's been on their roster, meaning that maybe she was liking a dude who he knows and that dude can say, oh yeah, she was sweating me. I just feel like in general, women and men are held to a double standard. And so you really have to start figuring out internally, like we're judged for and expected to have really experience and learn from it. But then on the same token, we're also degraded if we're inexperienced and you are in a relationship with someone. Because honestly, one of the reasons that even if people get together, they get divorced, sexual compatibility is a big thing. 00:11:55 Speaker 3: And so people act like it's not a big thing. 00:11:57 Speaker 2: People think it's crazy when I say that. It's true. 00:12:00 Speaker 3: Oh, my God. 00:12:00 Speaker 2: I was in a conversation on The Breakfast Club with Pastor Joelle Tubman and I mean, the conversation of sex came up, which was pretty awkward because it's like I'm talking to a pastor. 00:12:10 Speaker 3: To a pastor? 00:12:11 Speaker 2: People had a lot to say about it because he asked me about our sexual relationship. And I told him, yeah, we're having sex. And then he asked me about something else. And he was like, the way you lit up about sex tells me everything. And basically trying to say how invested am I really in my relationships? because I lit up about sex, but not other things. And I'm like, well, it was just- It matters. To me, it was just awkward on a public platform to be having a conversation

with a pastor about sex. So that's why that was a little bit more awkward. And I'm like smiling because I'm like, oh my God, God, I'm sorry. But if I'm being honest, though. 00:12:43 Speaker 3: Let's be real. Less than 3% of people get married a virgin. So let's be real. 00:12:47 Speaker 2: I could never be married to somebody nor in relationship with somebody that I'm not sexually pleased by. And I know myself enough to say that. And I would not do that to myself. I don't know how people sit and say that that's not a thing for them. I understand the faith walk, but I just don't I don't understand. That's just not my ministry. I don't get it. 00:13:08 Speaker 1: But the body count situation, it really is about respectability politics, right? We really are dividing women into two categories of women, like good girls and like those other girls, right? The ones you can bring home to mom and get married and claim in groups of your friends or the ones that you can just put on your roster of somebody who's a baddie, who a hit. 00:13:29 Speaker 3: And so. 00:13:29 Speaker 1: If the communication, again, if your motivation, when you're asking me questions about who I've been with and my body count because I want to know so I can, like, for instance, know whether or not I should be getting tested on a regular basis or if you're actively having sex with other partners and doing condomless sex. and me and you are having sex, and you're actively still doing that, then that's one question. One other thing I think that's implied in all of what Cam was talking about, and again, I'm talking about ego, vulnerability, the one up on me, the roster, it's really men want to think and believe that they are the best that you've ever had. 00:14:04 Speaker 3: And what we do know. 00:14:06 Speaker 2: They have to. Your man is the best you've ever had. Period. That is law. 00:14:10 Speaker 1: And that you put it down so good on me that I want to be with you because you are the best. 00:14:16 Speaker 3: And that's what I'm saying. 00:14:17 Speaker 1: Then the question becomes when you start talking about body count, then you start also saying, oh, wait. So Lauren's ex-boyfriend is a former megastar actor who is on the red carpets and stuff. 00:14:29 Speaker 3: And I'm just a guy who works at AT & T. 00:14:33 Speaker 2: It's hypothetical, y'all. I ain't never dated no actor on a red carpet. But you know what I'm saying, right? And that's the point. No, I know what you mean. 00:14:39 Speaker 3: You want to know. You want to believe that you are the best that she's ever had. 00:14:43 Speaker 2: If you're lucky as a woman, the person that you're with, because I feel like what I'm dealing with in my adult age, in my adult relationship right now, versus what I've dealt with before, I can honestly say this is the best person. place I've been relationship wise, best sexual experience, and even being open to trying different things or whatever. I've never been here before, but it's

because it's like everything that comes along with the relationship has allowed me to like, feel like the vulnerability is possible because we're grown as hell. And I think the issue with what Kim is saying, here's my only real issue with it. It's like, regardless of like, I'm a loyal, right? So I'm never going to let you walk into somewhere if you're my man and somebody's there that has ever had any experience with me. And I don't at least, maybe we have a conversation after if right in the moment doesn't make sense, just because I would want to know that. I don't want you rubbing elbows, shaking hands. If you're not comfortable with doing that, we're so beyond that. So if you are, cool, it's nothing. But I do want you to know what's going on. I always want you to be able to see the room fully, not blindsided. But knowing that you have a woman that is like that, I don't think that you should even worry about anything else. If you know she's going to put you in a position where you don't have to feel like your reputation is going to be damaged, you're walking into somewhere and basically feeling embarrassed, like your vulnerability has been transactional and not valued. I think it's insulting to even come to me and say, well, I need to know everything and everybody. You need to know that I got you. And if it makes sense to get to that point, to talk through everything. who what when and why for that or safety purposes cool but i'm not giving you yeah because at 22 it was two people here because a man can honestly i've never met a man who can tell me every single person that they've slept with and they just don't it's too crazy don't even remember people sometimes. 00:16:30 Speaker 1: The other to me the other challenge just like you i think ray j said what do you say he's slept with how many women. 00:16:36 Speaker 2: Girl i don't know if ray j is a real is a real person at this point But you know what I'm saying. No, but you said it was. 00:16:43 Speaker 3: Like tens of thousands, right? 00:16:44 Speaker 1: Okay, so say in 10,000, you say 10,000, but there's 365 days in one year, right? So that would imply that several times a day, every day for years, you haven't said, because just for the math to make sense, the math ain't math. What that says is that nobody really, truly, honestly remembers every single interaction. And so that's why I'm saying it really does feel like a really a trick question. 00:17:08 Speaker 2: Like a setup. You feel like it's a setup. 00:17:10 Speaker 3: It does. 00:17:10 Speaker 1: It feels like a setup because it's really, am I asking this again because I'm trying to assess my sexual reproductive health and I need it for a purpose to talk to my doctor about whether or not I need to use pre-exposure prophylaxis or post-exposure prophylaxis? Are you just trying to say, I want to figure out what your value is to me and do I want to move forward with you? And I don't know because like you said, some really super religious

person. 00:17:36 Speaker 3: May want you to say you're a virgin. 00:17:38 Speaker 2: Yeah, child. 00:17:39 Speaker 3: And where they at? 00:17:40 Speaker 2: Find them. 00:17:41 Speaker 3: They're unicorns. 00:17:54 Speaker 2: Has your stance on needing to know the body count or valuing or devaluing a person because of the body count, man or woman, changed the older you've gotten? 00:18:05 Speaker 3: It has. 00:18:06 Speaker 1: I think when you're 16, you're assuming that a girl or a guy who has had several experiences, man, that's a lot. But when I'm 40, I'm expecting that you've had some experience because you've been in the world and you've been curious. 00:18:21 Speaker 2: I think too that a lot of men that I know, friends or whatever, they always talk about how they didn't learn about sex. They were told like, use condoms and that was it, right? So for me, my stance on that has changed as I've gotten older because I feel like When you're younger and you really don't know and you're having these feelings in your body and you're trying to get through it and the testosterone and all the things are coming and you don't know what you're dealing with, you're just trying to get it out. And hopefully you are healthy once you get through that phase of the fog and now you have a more clear vision of your life, your responsibilities, what you want for yourself. A lot of times too, I'm 34 years old and a lot of my single homegirls, we talk about the fact that it's hard to meet a straight man at 34 plus who is successful black and has no children. Because a lot of them have made decisions young to have children and it's just different for them than it has been for us and having to be so like particular about who we do that with. It changes for me there though, when it comes to the sexual component, because now I'm looking at it, man, if you still out here and you on everything moving and the lust and the horniness, I just, it's almost like it's disgusting a little bit because I'm looking at it like you got, first of all, where's your time? You should be busy to the point where you want to kind of angle it in on maybe one, a couple people that you're focused on. But also I want to meet and be in conversation with like, you know, when I was single and day my thing was the man that I'm going to be with I want a person that has been very intentional about anything that he's put on the earth like If you have children, I wanted you to have been very intentional about that, not just out here, oops, oh my God, I'm sorry, wow, didn't even know how that happened. Because I thought, for me, I think now as an adult, that says a lot about how you value yourself and your body and what you do to yourself is what you're going to do to somebody that you're in a relationship with. So now the body count conversation and you out here running crazy, it is such a big turnoff to me because I'm like, yo, you don't even value yourself. You're going to throw me out which ways around and I'm going to be emotionally confused and physically confused and all the things. So where I'm at now, the only reason why I think I was even able to settle down in my relationship now is because I felt like I met somebody who was like, all right, I'm very intentional about what my sexual life is looking like right now. And that was important for me, period. Because it's hard. A lot of women that are out there and dating right now, that's the thing. It's like men, they're so upfront about sex that it makes you feel like they're just out here humping on everything and everybody. And the body count conversation gets old and you get a little exhausted by meeting men who are still behaving at 34, 38 like they were at 17. Yeah. 00:21:04 Speaker 1: I just feel like almost you should be able to say, well, you know what? I feel like my number, it doesn't really tell me about my status. It doesn't tell me about your status. It doesn't tell me about what protection you use. And I feel like relevant sexual history matters, but my lifetime total really can't answer any of the questions about my sexual status, my sexual health status. And so I like to say I'm keeping that number private, but I'm Happy to talk to you honestly about protection, our agreement moving forward. And so I think you should be able to be empowered enough to have that conversation. 00:21:35 Speaker 2: I can't even believe we're still having this. 00:21:38 Speaker 3: Yeah, isn't it crazy? 00:21:39 Speaker 2: I can't even believe people are still having this conversation. Yes, it is. And then another thing for me too is men being able to have one set of morals or standards or just behavior sexually and then they grow and things change, hopefully. But I think with women, it's crazy because the double standard comes back in where it's like, as a woman, we're not allowed to or supposed to have had experience and know and can define what we want. I think a real mature partner, emotionally mature partner, sexually mature partner isn't afraid of that. They enjoy having conversations with you about experiences that you loved, you didn't love and making sure that y'all are curating your bedroom to the point where everyone is pleased and everyone is happy. But that gets rough too. Women are not allowed to grow through experiences in sex or dating. 00:22:28 Speaker 1: Yes. 00:22:30 Speaker 2: We're supposed to be these one-off. We just be with one person, go to sleep, wake up, boom, perfect wife, perfect life. 00:22:36 Speaker 3: Curating your bedroom. I love that. And that's the point. 00:22:39 Speaker 1: You guys should together be able to curate what's safe for you, what you want to do, what feels good. And outside of that, then nothing else really matters. Right? So with that being said, this is why I say you got to find a health care provider that you feel totally comfortable with or a facility that you feel like, OK, you know what? I can walk in here, put my big girl panties on and

be completely vulnerable and be like, look, I do love my husband. But this dude came back into my life. This is when you maybe think about going on prep. 00:23:11 Speaker 3: Right. Because you don't know what's going to happen. 00:23:13 Speaker 1: And so I'm telling you as a person who is who's a woman of a certain age, I have a lot of friends. 00:23:18 Speaker 3: I've had a lot of patients. 00:23:20 Speaker 1: And you would think that being in a, I'm air quoting, a monogamous relationship somehow makes you safe from being exposed to. 00:23:29 Speaker 3: Ain't nobody safe. Ain't nobody safe. 00:23:32 Speaker 1: And so this is, again, why the body count conversation don't actually always matter because the body count can change. Right. You could be in a relationship with somebody. 00:23:41 Speaker 2: And that person not going to update you when you're in a relationship and it changes. 00:23:45 Speaker 3: They're not going to update you. 00:23:46 Speaker 2: Dear Lord, please cover my relationship and my marriage to come because I don't want to be in jail for nobody's son, but I will go. You won't even have to arrest me. I will come and volunteer my services at the jail after I'm done. 00:23:57 Speaker 3: In the name of Jesus, we pray. 00:24:00 Speaker 2: Amen. Won't you do it? That makes me think about, though, our episode one when we were talking to Ciara about the HIV numbers when it comes to Black women. And how me and her were so shocked to find out that Black women are disproportionately affected by HIV than other people. And you talk about things happening and stepping outside of your relationships and stuff like that. And I just, I didn't know. And it still is crazy to me because the narrative has never been different. that Black women have these high numbers when it comes to HIV. 00:24:31 Speaker 1: And so the crazy thing is, too, when it comes to monogamy, right? Believe it or not, when you look at the data, a lot of Black women, and I'm air quoting the body count, they have lower body counts, right? 00:24:45 Speaker 3: They are actually more likely to have less sexual partners. 00:24:48 Speaker 1: But, unfortunately, based on 2024 data, making up 13% of the population, Black women account for more. 00:24:55 Speaker 3: Than 50% of the new HIV cases. Yes, more than 50%. 00:25:01 Speaker 2: But that's so crazy because I think with those numbers, maybe everybody doesn't know those numbers, right? But I also feel like a lot of prevention things, if I'm being honest, my girlfriends, like my Black women friends... We don't have a lot of prevention conversations. It's like it doesn't seem as personal to us because we feel like if we're with one person and we're consistent or we know who we're with as much as we need to know, whatever that means, we good. 00:25:29 Speaker 3: Yes. We know who we with. 00:25:31 Speaker 2: Why doesn't it feel personal? 00:25:33 Speaker 3: We know who we're with, but we don't know who they're with. 00:25:37 Speaker 1:

And somebody uses the term HIV possible. I don't know if you've ever heard that term, but it's like if you are pregnant possible— If it's possible that you can get chlamydia or syphilis or anything else, you can get HIV, right? Because if you're ever having sex without a condom, then you're opening yourself up to the risk of being exposed to HIV. 00:25:56 Speaker 2: We're talking about all these numbers, but I have a question about PrEP. Is PrEP just one medicine? Is it just like a pill? Is that the only option? 00:26:02 Speaker 1: You can do a pill or you can even do an injection. You have to first get tested and then you have to have a negative test. And then after that, you can then start a pill or you can do an injection. You talk to your doctor about what formulation makes the most sense for you. 00:26:15 Speaker 3: And it's safe. It's safe whether you're using PrEP and birth control. 00:26:18 Speaker 1: If you're on hormone therapy, it's safe to do it together. It's safe with most medications. Like it really is. And even if you're thinking about getting pregnant, you can even still... actually be on PrEP. And so there's different formulations and it's really the right answer for anybody who is actively having sex and they don't want to acquire HIV. 00:26:37 Speaker 2: Well, with all that being said, I think we now are clear and got it all out. How you feel about the numbers conversation now? 00:26:46 Speaker 3: I feel great. 00:26:47 Speaker 1: I feel like we have to de-stigmatize sex. Period. 00:26:53 Speaker 3: Right. 00:26:53 Speaker 1: But on the same token, we can't weaponize sex and we can't use it against each other. And we got to find a way to have a conversation that makes everybody at the end of it feel like we're just getting closer. We're using this conversation for intimacy and not to degrade the value of anybody. 00:27:09 Speaker 2: I love it. Let's do one quick round of Clock It or Stop It just to make sure that everybody is very clear and understands everything we've discussed today. So this is the body count edition of Clock It or Stop It where I throw some things out there and we either clock it or we say stop it. So you can keep your number private and still discuss sexual health honestly. Absolutely. 00:27:35 Speaker 3: Clock that. I'm doing my finger thing. 00:27:38 Speaker 2: Yes. 00:27:38 Speaker 3: Clock it. 00:27:39 Speaker 2: Yes. 00:27:40 Speaker 1: You can't say. I'm happy keeping that number private, right? The privacy and responsibility in our communication can coexist. But I'm happy to talk honestly about testing and protection. 00:27:54 Speaker 3: And again, what we're going to do in our relationship. But I don't feel comfortable disclosing that. 00:28:01 Speaker 2: If my friend asks about PrEP, something must be wrong in her relationship. 00:28:06 Speaker 3: Oh, my God. Stop that. 00:28:08 Speaker 1: Stop it. 00:28:08 Speaker 3: Stop it. 00:28:09 Speaker 1: That person is probably just empowered enough to say, you know what? I want to protect myself against pregnancy, against sexually transmitted infections. And honestly, I don't always know my partner's status. So I just want to be empowered to not have to worry about it. 00:28:21 Speaker 3: So absolutely not. 00:28:23 Speaker 2: Knowing prevention exists means everybody can access it equally. 00:28:29 Speaker 1: Yes, knowing prevention exists is really only the beginning, right? You really need to find a provider who offers PrEP, who offers an affordable way to get it, because when we think about access, again, I think I talked about this before, we as healthcare providers have not done a good job at just explaining the fact that PrEP should be and is available to anyone who who is actively having sex and wants to protect themselves against HIV. And so it is not just for men who have sex with men. It's not just for somebody who thinks they're with a man who's having sex with a man or who's ever had. It's really for anybody who wants to be protected against HIV. It is a prevention strategy. 00:29:10 Speaker 2: So what do you think now as a health care provider, what is the question we should be asking each other instead of how many people have you slept with? 00:29:19 Speaker 1: I think the question you should be asking yourself is, do I want to feel empowered and do I not want to worry about acquiring HIV or another sexually transmitted infection? 00:29:28 Speaker 3: It's just information. It's just sexual health. 00:29:31 Speaker 2: I love that. Well, guys, this is Love Lately with Lorna Rosa. And as we end today's episode, as we do every single episode, I want to give you guys my love letter to you all because that's all this conversation is. It's just my love letter to everybody listening who wants to learn, grow and experience things the right way. I don't even know if the right way is a thing, because is there a wrong way? As you're figuring it out on either side, right or wrong, we want you to be safe. So this is my love letter to you. Your sexual history is not a verdict on your worth. How many people you've slept with does not determine whether you deserve to be loved or respected. And anybody who makes you choose between your love, your respect, because of how many people you've slept with, is not somebody that you should move forward with. In any sense of the matter, somebody's body count doesn't tell you whether they are healthier either. That's ridiculous. Anything that you imagine can go wrong with your sexual health can happen with just one interaction with one person. So stop letting a number carry more weight than it deserves. Your past is a part of your story, but it is not your whole story. It is not your future story and it is not your value. Protect your heart. Understand and know that. Put that at the pinnacle of your daily. If you got to write it on your mirror every single day, do that. You've been listening to Love Lately with Lauren LaRosa. My girl, Dr. Contessa, is here with us. Next episode, we're actually going to talk about fetishes and kinks. So make sure you tap in. I love y'all for real.