Full Transcript for Season 2: Welcome Back!!!

mean they took on their four grandkids in a full-time capacity and the two of us. 00:05:27.733 --> 00:05:35.793 So I mean, for two retirees it was a big life change and they were very selfless in that process. 00:05:35.793 --> 00:05:42.050 So we thought we would just have showings for a week, a weekend. 00:05:42.050 --> 00:05:49.725 That's what the market and our realtors told us and we thought to believe and that's not the reality of what happened. 00:05:49.725 --> 00:06:06.278 And by the time our house finally got into contract which I'm sure you'll talk about it was time for school to start and we didn't want our kids to start school and then have to change schools a month and a half in to the school year. 00:06:06.278 --> 00:06:13.961 So we decided it was best for us to continue to stay with my mom and dad while our house transition fully took place. 00:06:13.961 --> 00:06:16.144 It was a lot. 00:06:16.144 --> 00:06:17.728 I don't know where you want to go from there. 00:06:18.468 --> 00:06:21.843 I mean there's so many ways to go from there Right. 00:06:22.826 --> 00:06:26.036 I guess, to start, we'll start with the selling process. 00:06:26.036 --> 00:06:32.716 As I mentioned before, we had reached out to the people who helped us buy the house. 00:06:32.716 --> 00:06:34.100 We had a good experience. 00:06:34.100 --> 00:06:35.925 So we were like, hey, let's reach out to them. 00:06:35.925 --> 00:06:37.589 We kept in contact. 00:06:37.589 --> 00:06:38.291 This should be easy. 00:06:38.291 --> 00:06:48.134 Then we also had a buying agent up here where we currently live to help us find a new house. 00:06:48.134 --> 00:06:57.064 So two realtors and then we had them communicating with each other so that everybody was on the same page and everybody on board. 00:06:57.064 --> 00:06:58.687 Plus, we shopped some other realtors. 00:06:58.687 --> 00:07:02.646 Everybody was like, man, this house is awesome, it's going to sell within like four to seven days. 00:07:02.646 --> 00:07:04.596 So we were like, oh, it's going to sell within like four to seven days. 00:07:04.596 --> 00:07:08.548 So we were like, oh, it's going to be a cakewalk, we're going to be, you know. 00:07:09.971 --> 00:07:13.067 And then up here the real estate market moves a little slower. 00:07:13.067 --> 00:07:16.362 So we were anticipating that we would just have our way with a choice of house. 00:07:16.362 --> 00:07:20.966 And then came the hiccups. 00:07:20.966 --> 00:07:38.569 So the first hiccup was, within like a day or two of us listing our house for sale, going live on the market, the feds made an announcement that they were potentially going to lower interest rates In the fall. 00:07:38.569 --> 00:07:39.500 Right? 00:07:39.500 --> 00:07:44.906 So in the fall, you would think that that would not affect us at all. 00:07:44.906 --> 00:07:55.055 But what happened was our anticipation of selling within a week turned into a selling after 52 days. 00:07:55.055 --> 00:08:02.221 Right,

we had a like what the hell? 00:08:02.221 --> 00:08:02.783 Moment with our realtors. 00:08:02.783 --> 00:08:09.242 So if they are listening, please forgive my tone, but I was like dude, what the heck? 00:08:09.242 --> 00:08:11.165 What's our game plan? 00:08:11.165 --> 00:08:12.309 Why isn't this house selling? 00:08:12.309 --> 00:08:20.060 Everybody that came to see the house said the same thing oh, this is the best house we've seen, out of all the ones we've seen. 00:08:20.079 --> 00:08:21.442 So far Everybody loved it. 00:08:21.822 --> 00:08:23.125 But we're not going to make an offer. 00:08:23.125 --> 00:08:23.605 What? 00:08:23.605 --> 00:08:25.187 Why the fuck did you even come? 00:08:25.187 --> 00:08:26.348 Excuse my language, sorry. 00:08:26.348 --> 00:08:31.980 Um, people were like, hey, we don't, we don't know if we want a split level. 00:08:31.980 --> 00:08:40.423 You know, that was a big excuse and my thing was it says it's a split level in the in the ad, um. 00:08:40.423 --> 00:08:52.412 But you know, for whatever reason, um, in the first 30 days we had like nine viewings showings, um, which was pretty low. 00:08:52.412 --> 00:09:07.883 That's pretty low, um, and hence why, you know, we can't just move back in because it's not selling, so we have to keep the show ready back in because it's not selling, so we have to keep the show ready. 00:09:07.883 --> 00:09:14.575 So now we're living with my in-laws for a month, for two months, and that turned out to be a four and a half month ordeal. 00:09:15.519 --> 00:09:17.307 Well, finally the house went into contract. 00:09:17.600 --> 00:09:17.919 It did. 00:09:17.919 --> 00:09:21.104 We had to discount it, which broke my heart. 00:09:21.104 --> 00:09:27.971 I'm always the money conscious person and I was like I want to drive a hard bargain. 00:09:27.971 --> 00:09:34.682 But you know, we just had to relent and in the end we're happy with it. 00:09:35.182 --> 00:09:51.711 Yeah, I think what, without having to get into all of the details of all of the things um, we had made an offer on a house that we really liked and the contingency was we had to be within contract within a specific number of days, and we just couldn't meet that. 00:09:52.659 --> 00:09:54.583 Oh no, that's one detail we got to say. 00:09:54.583 --> 00:10:00.825 They said we had to be in contract, our house had to be sold within 10 days. 00:10:02.691 --> 00:10:05.225 We thought, eh, 10 days, no problem, it didn't work out. 00:10:05.225 --> 00:10:06.672 Like Remy said, we were on the market for 52 days. 00:10:06.672 --> 00:10:07.246 Yeah, we thought 10 days, no problem, it didn't work out. 00:10:07.246 --> 00:10:11.917 Like Remy said, we were on the market for 52 days, so it just it didn't work. 00:10:11.917 --> 00:10:21.932 And but I think the silver lining of that is, in retrospect, we want out bigger in the house we currently are in. 00:10:21.932 --> 00:10:25.548 Do you want me to talk about that a little bit in that process?

00:10:26.400 --> 00:10:32.640 Well, sure, I mean, there is the other house, though, which I thought was amazing, she's downplaying it. 00:10:32.640 --> 00:10:37.740 I thought at the time that there was no way we were going to find a better house for that. 00:10:38.241 --> 00:10:41.831 Yeah, I was not as in love with it as my husband was, but-. 00:10:42.139 --> 00:10:45.090 But she put it on a good front and made me feel like she was all in. 00:10:46.140 --> 00:10:46.922 I wasn't for you. 00:10:46.922 --> 00:10:49.488 It seemed to check all of the boxes for you. 00:10:49.488 --> 00:10:55.894 Um well, I mean, it was, it was good it just it didn't check all of the boxes for me. 00:10:55.894 --> 00:10:59.482 I imagined, if we were moving up here, that our yard was going to be bigger. 00:10:59.482 --> 00:11:08.809 Uh, it was going to be more, like my childhood experience, and so that house was still in a neighborhood and so we still had pretty close neighbors, things like that. 00:11:08.809 --> 00:11:12.530 So it was, the house was great. 00:11:12.530 --> 00:11:13.201 I didn't. 00:11:13.341 --> 00:11:21.419 I wasn't in love with the land, which you knew, so yeah, so the land was an acre and a quarter, I don't remember. 00:11:21.419 --> 00:11:33.908 So I mean, that's, that's a come up from our quarter acre lot at our last house, which was great for me, I don't remember, but mainly for me, it was the fact that the house had been completely redone. 00:11:33.908 --> 00:11:54.586 It was beautiful, central fireplace, you know, stone, all this stuff, and it set up on a big hill. 00:11:54.586 --> 00:12:03.815 And what I had found out was that this house used to belong to the head prosecutor of the county, I think I was told. 00:12:03.815 --> 00:12:12.679 And so, you know, I didn't even go in front, man, I was ego tripping, I'm like, oh, look at me with all these felonies about to move in a prosecutor's house. 00:12:12.679 --> 00:12:19.754 So I probably was willing to overreach for that alone. 00:12:19.754 --> 00:12:25.210 But you know, you never hear me talk about God. 00:12:25.230 --> 00:12:27.033 But something was looking out for us. 00:12:27.033 --> 00:12:33.187 The universe had other things lined up for us, you know, and so it fell through. 00:12:33.187 --> 00:12:40.192 Our 10 days expired and we were like, hey, sorry, guys, we need an extension. 00:12:40.192 --> 00:12:50.350 And they said, well, we asked for like 10 days or 11 days, I think so, yeah, and they were like, no, you can have, you know, we want it business days. 00:12:50.350 --> 00:13:00.125 They were like, no, you got straight seven days and we were like I don't know if that's going to work and we don't want to waste your time, so you know we'll walk. 00:13:00.125 --> 00:13:11.471 And like the next day, our realtor was like like yo, they reached out to us overnight and they were like no, no, we want to make this work yeah we'll give you five thousand dollars if you come through. 00:13:11.652

--> 00:13:16.370 And we were like I got excited because I like to negotiate. 00:13:16.370 --> 00:13:23.187 I was like I knew we should have leaned on him and gave him the squeeze, but we we turned him down. 00:13:24.671 --> 00:13:26.494 Yeah, cause at that point it was too much stress. 00:13:26.494 --> 00:13:31.010 Right, like I was, I as a person with an anxiety disorder I was over it. 00:13:31.010 --> 00:13:32.888 It wasn't a house I loved. 00:13:32.888 --> 00:13:48.214 I wasn't willing to continue to draw out something that I felt was inevitable, which was that it wasn't going to come together, and so the stress of that was really difficult for me, particularly because you're not allowed to answer your phone during the day. 00:13:48.433 --> 00:13:52.350 Yeah, so I did leave the bulk of this whole experience on you. 00:13:52.740 --> 00:13:59.386 I had to field the calls with the banks and the realtors and the back and forth. 00:13:59.386 --> 00:14:09.996 My phone ringing caused me anxiety because I didn't know who it was going to be and what I was going to have to figure out, because I couldn't get a hold of you to do it. 00:14:09.996 --> 00:14:11.426 I just had to make all these games. 00:14:11.426 --> 00:14:13.854 It was a really difficult time for me, yeah. 00:14:14.721 --> 00:14:18.696 And the bank side of it was a whole other ordeal that we probably won't get into. 00:14:18.696 --> 00:14:25.870 We're not going to get into it, but just know that it was petty and nonsensical. 00:14:25.870 --> 00:14:26.792 It was a lot. 00:14:26.792 --> 00:14:27.613 It was a lot. 00:14:27.714 --> 00:14:28.375 Getting approved. 00:14:28.375 --> 00:14:38.475 If you've gotten approved for a house loan in recent years, it's kind of like going to the B&B now where you've got to bring your soul in a jar to get your driver's license renewed. 00:14:38.475 --> 00:14:42.671 That's how getting a loan feels, regardless of your incomes. 00:14:42.671 --> 00:14:47.330 It's very invasive. 00:14:47.330 --> 00:14:48.923 I think is a good word for it. 00:14:49.004 --> 00:14:50.288 I mean, it's demeaning too. 00:14:50.288 --> 00:15:01.605 That's how it felt for me, because the one thing I will say on the subject is that we have multiple streams of income and it's all documented W-2s. 00:15:01.605 --> 00:15:03.649 Whatever was needed, we had it. 00:15:03.649 --> 00:15:07.095 And they were like no, we can't use these. 00:15:07.095 --> 00:15:09.388 We have no good reason why we can't. 00:15:09.388 --> 00:15:11.134 We're just going to use your main job. 00:15:11.134 --> 00:15:20.280 And then they were like, after excluding all of this income, we're going to say you're 1% over on the debt to income ratio. 00:15:20.280 --> 00:15:22.065 And we're like no, we're not. 00:15:22.065 --> 00:15:32.813 And then they then they were even like well, if you could pay this and this off, so we sold our motorcycles, which was sad, and, um, you know, we paid some other stuff off. 00:15:32.813 --> 00:15:36.471 And then they were like well, where's this money coming from that you're paying this stuff off with? 00:15:36.490 --> 00:15:46.355 and we're like that income you wouldn't include so it was literally with money you told me doesn't count. 00:15:46.355 --> 00:15:59.361 So I don't know what you like, because then we had to prove how we paid it off and I was like here's my paycheck and here's where I paid it off from this other job that you said doesn't count so, even selling the motorcycles, we sold the motorcycles. 00:15:59.682 --> 00:16:02.447 Like when I sold mine, the guy met me at the bank. 00:16:02.447 --> 00:16:13.066 We walked in, paid the people and got the lien release and all that, and they were like, well, this money didn't come from one of your accounts, you have to prove where it came from. 00:16:13.066 --> 00:16:18.485 And I'm like I just told you, but anyway, that was that. 00:16:18.485 --> 00:16:27.490 But the house fell through and I thought it was the end of the world because I was like, man, we're not going to find another house like that. 00:16:27.490 --> 00:16:28.572 I really wanted it. 00:16:28.572 --> 00:16:31.447 It did not check off all the things. 00:16:31.447 --> 00:16:45.606 Like you said, I was real big on having like a man space, but it was a ranch, it was immaculately done, it had more land, it had a three-car garage. 00:16:45.606 --> 00:16:46.705 We were like, ah, this is great. 00:16:46.705 --> 00:16:54.230 But you know, hey, I was willing to concede certain stuff in order to have that. 00:16:54.230 --> 00:17:03.214 It fell through and while I was moping, the most immaculate thing, the most amazing thing, happened to you. 00:17:03.660 --> 00:17:06.821 I went to the farmer's market is what happened? 00:17:06.842 --> 00:17:10.652 Yeah, farmer's market saved our lives. 00:17:10.932 --> 00:17:17.989 I was actually at the library in our tiny town here and I was working on my dissertation, which is another topic. 00:17:17.989 --> 00:17:24.747 But I was tired, I was ready to take a break and I was like, oh, it's Saturday, farmer's market's happening. 00:17:24.747 --> 00:17:28.634 I should stop by see if there's anybody I know still working at the farmer's market. 00:17:28.634 --> 00:17:34.590 We really love like fresh produce, we love local, supporting local, those types of things. 00:17:34.590 --> 00:17:51.605 I was like I'm going to check in at the farmer's market and a family friend was there who I had recently seen at the 4th of July parade here in our town and I had told him that we were looking at moving back. 00:17:51.625 --> 00:17:53.673 So I saw him again at the farmer's market and he said, hey, you still thinking of moving back here? 00:17:53.673 --> 00:18:02.049 And I said, yeah, we just had this house fall through or trying, but we can't get our house to sell, we can't get our uh, you know, the house, a house up here we're we're kind of in a pickle. 00:18:02.049 --> 00:18:06.642 And he said to me

well, I've actually been looking at downsizing. 00:18:06.642 --> 00:18:08.326 Would you like to come and check out my house? 00:18:08.326 --> 00:18:11.762 And I jokingly said back to him like well, I got a lot of kids. 00:18:11.762 --> 00:18:12.826 Is it going to fit my kids? 00:18:12.826 --> 00:18:15.211 And he was like yes, it absolutely will. 00:18:15.211 --> 00:18:24.307 So very next day, you and I came over to see it and as of now, we are sitting in the master bedroom of that house recording this podcast. 00:18:24.688 --> 00:18:42.140 Yeah, and just as a quick summary of what this house is, we talked about how I wanted a man space and of course, we need a space for our kids and we want it land. 00:18:42.140 --> 00:18:43.101 So what is this? 00:18:43.101 --> 00:18:45.467 A log cabin with a bunch of land. 00:18:45.707 --> 00:18:46.348 In a log cabin. 00:18:46.368 --> 00:18:47.191 And a workshop. 00:18:47.652 --> 00:18:50.826 Yeah, a big workshop, that is all yours. 00:18:50.986 --> 00:18:51.567 All mine. 00:18:51.567 --> 00:18:53.311 You hear that it's on record now. 00:18:53.682 --> 00:18:57.497 I said it on a recorded line, it was just a handshake deal before, but now it's on record. 00:18:57.497 --> 00:19:00.386 Yeah, I don't just do podcast count as official. 00:19:00.406 --> 00:19:00.748 It counts. 00:19:01.329 --> 00:19:01.750 Records. 00:19:06.240 --> 00:19:09.484 I got a million fans, at least in my mind and they're all going to show up to court to testify. 00:19:09.484 --> 00:19:13.852 Yeah, this house for me is a legacy, right. 00:19:13.852 --> 00:19:17.542 Like this is a house that we can pass on to our kids. 00:19:17.542 --> 00:19:21.549 It has extra spaces that were previously used. 00:19:21.549 --> 00:19:24.423 Like there's a space above the two-car garage. 00:19:24.423 --> 00:19:37.232 Like that whole two car detached garage used to be an apartment while they were building the house itself, and so it was important to you and I to have somewhere for our parents in case they needed a space. 00:19:37.232 --> 00:19:49.807 So we wanted like an in-law suite, just in case we needed to have our parents on site to help take care of them, and it kind of checks off that box, which was really big to us both. 00:19:51.048 --> 00:20:34.143 We have a lot of land for our kids to grow and explore, and you've got a space and it really worked out in a way that was unforeseen, couldn't have even dreamed of it, and because it was a family friend working with us, they didn't care when our house sold, so it immediately took the pressure off of like well, you have to be in contract by this date, because they were just like eh, let us know, we'll start looking around and making some plans and we'll take this casually and we continue to have a really great relationship now. 00:20:34.143 --> 00:20:37.089 We hang out, we check in with each other. 00:20:37.089 --> 00:20:41.280 Pretty frequently you call to just say the things that look cool. 00:20:41.580 --> 00:20:44.863 Yeah, I go out in that workshop and I'm like man, this is amazing. 00:20:44.863 --> 00:20:54.948 And the thing is that I often minimalize how far I've come after prison. 00:20:54.988 --> 00:20:55.327 Yes. 00:20:56.367 --> 00:21:00.470 And so, as you see, debbie, we'll, we'll attest to it. 00:21:00.470 --> 00:21:30.594 So I've had a pretty good run compared to, I guess, what the statistics say about, you know, recidivism and stuff and job placement and stuff like that, and I've done my best to help others and somehow I still because I had this grand book of goals and you know, a lot of them kind of just got distracted with new goals and stuff. 00:21:30.594 --> 00:21:31.819 So I kind of felt like man, I really ain't done much, you know. 00:21:31.819 --> 00:21:33.386 I mean I went to college. 00:21:33.386 --> 00:21:34.553 That was a big accomplishment. 00:21:34.574 --> 00:21:39.104 Then I dropped out of college and you know, I kind of was hard on myself about that. 00:21:39.104 --> 00:21:48.155 But it wasn't until we moved into this house that I really felt like man, like okay, we're doing something here. 00:21:48.155 --> 00:22:01.703 And, of course, debbie's, like I'm proud of you because you did this and I'm like, nah, because you know I believe I would have accomplished a lot, but I believe I would not have accomplished this without you. 00:22:01.703 --> 00:22:07.761 So this is an us achievement and it, you know, is both of our goals to do this. 00:22:07.761 --> 00:22:12.550 But you mentioned that this in itself is a legacy thing. 00:22:12.932 --> 00:22:13.251 It is. 00:22:13.712 --> 00:22:25.289 And that is what I really started to see, like making plans to turn the garage, the two car detached, into an apartment for parents, for retirement and stuff. 00:22:25.289 --> 00:22:40.449 You know, like, okay, like this isn't just a me goal, like this is really impacting other people's lives in major ways, um, to see what it's done for our kids already and we've only been in this house a few months it's like, you know, it's amazing. 00:22:40.449 --> 00:23:06.451 And so now I'm starting to see, like, um, so these goals didn't happen, but this is something that's not a drop in the bucket, it's not something to be sneezed at and disregarded, you know, um, so I really feel, like, you know, as I approach my seventh year out, that's right, um, you know, coming up in March, like this is huge. 00:23:06.451 --> 00:23:16.394 What, oh yeah, it is May, look at that Been out so long I don't even remember. 00:23:16.394 --> 00:23:19.241 I can still tell you my prison number, though. 00:23:19.241 --> 00:23:29.694 But give it another few years, it'll be good, all right, but anyway, this house, it's a journey. 00:23:36.020 --> 00:23:38.787 We moved in and it wasn't like the move-in show house. 00:23:38.787 --> 00:23:41.553 I mean, we had some projects on the books, yeah. 00:23:41.553 --> 00:23:49.951 But at first I thought, man, it needs some work, it

needs some work, it needs some work. 00:23:49.951 --> 00:23:55.686 And now, as you know, like I said, we've been here a few months and I've gotten a few projects under my belt. 00:23:55.686 --> 00:24:07.257 We just plowed our driveway, which is ridiculously long now, for the first time, and it was an experience, yeah, but it's like creating instant memories. 00:24:07.257 --> 00:24:13.010 You know like everything, every project we do, every you know thing we do outside. 00:24:13.553 --> 00:24:22.701 It's like an experience and it's really like putting our stamp on this place yeah you know, it's not just like, oh, we moved in the house and now we lived here. 00:24:22.701 --> 00:24:30.413 It's like, oh, we moved in this house and we're making it ours, beyond just simple decorations and stuff that we put in it. 00:24:30.453 --> 00:25:10.248 Yeah, and this forever home that we now have is when so many folks our age are still trying to buy their first house, is we very much acknowledge where that is for us but hopefully stands as a testament as to what is possible, even you know, in spite of things like felonies and a 10-year prison record, even in spite of significant student loan debt. 00:25:10.248 --> 00:25:17.240 I'm looking at myself, not at you, and now I think people are like, oh no, I've got too much in student loans, I can't afford to buy a house, which is, yeah, I get it. 00:25:17.240 --> 00:25:28.029 I do have significant student loan debt because of a system that is broken, um, regarding how we counsel students in terms of taking on college experiences. 00:25:30.943 --> 00:25:36.328 And credit card debt let's not forget that and credit card debt, All kinds of things right Because they're quick to give you a student credit card. 00:25:37.381 --> 00:25:39.429 Listen, that's another podcast. 00:25:40.320 --> 00:25:42.909 That's somebody else's, but we'd love to be guests, right. 00:25:44.861 --> 00:25:50.713 If you have that space, write to stories at lockdowntolegacycom and we will get in touch. 00:25:50.713 --> 00:25:53.107 But all of that to say we're really happy. 00:25:53.107 --> 00:26:00.354 We got our keys in the middle of November, had a really great move-in experience, hired the same folks who helped move us out. 00:26:00.354 --> 00:26:05.769 We have we tirelessly cleaned and getting the space ready. 00:26:05.769 --> 00:26:12.260 We've been working on some projects, some small things, getting ourselves ready for the spring and the bigger things we need to tackle. 00:26:12.340 --> 00:26:31.580 But the thought that this is it for us in terms of a house, right, and knowing that, whatever happens, this gets Ivan's already claimed it right no matter what happens to us, our children get to make the decisions as to what happens with this space next is a I don't know. 00:26:31.580 --> 00:26:36.231 It's a feeling of pride that I didn't think that I was going to feel. 00:26:36.231 --> 00:26:41.372 Um, so it's a very different experience than moving to the Maryland metropolis. 00:26:41.372 --> 00:26:49.660 It's a very different, uh experience than the things we thought it was going to be, which was buying a bigger house in the Columbus area, going to Maryland. 00:26:49.660 --> 00:27:04.236 None of our original dreams necessarily revolved around being out in a slower pace of life, but I don't have any regrets. 00:27:04.236 --> 00:27:04.757 How about you? 00:27:08.819 --> 00:27:09.101 No, not at all. 00:27:09.101 --> 00:27:16.334 Um, I you know, as we talk about legacies, I think it's great Um, how our kids love this house. 00:27:16.334 --> 00:27:20.942 Um, like our, our youngest, raylan. 00:27:20.942 --> 00:27:22.203 She named the house. 00:27:22.203 --> 00:27:37.311 Um, you just heard our six-year-old son has claimed the house, you know so, when actually he said he's never moving out. 00:27:37.311 --> 00:27:43.059 So not only has he claimed it, he's like you know, just to solidify that I'm not leaving. 00:27:43.299 --> 00:27:48.853 Well, and his statement to us was when he told us that he was going to keep the house. 00:27:48.853 --> 00:27:50.606 He was like I was like, oh, you want to live here. 00:27:50.606 --> 00:27:53.849 And he was like, well, somebody has to take care of grandma and grandpa. 00:27:53.849 --> 00:27:58.092 And when he means grandma and grandpa, he means my grandma and grandpa, so his great-grandparents. 00:27:58.092 --> 00:28:02.371 So he's acknowledging that we will have passed on. 00:28:02.371 --> 00:28:13.101 He's acknowledging that his grandparents will pass on, but don't worry, great-grandma and grandpa will still be around the corner and need somebody to take care of them. 00:28:13.101 --> 00:28:15.105 It made me laugh so much. 00:28:15.645 --> 00:28:36.471 Yeah, and in addition, I got bonus kids and to have them, we did Christmas all together this year and that was a great experience to have everyone here and like the look on their faces when they seen it for the first time, not including the little barn out front that needs torn down. 00:28:36.471 --> 00:28:42.835 But once we got past that and they saw it open up and they're like wow, like this is the house. 00:28:42.835 --> 00:28:45.017 Well, they didn't even realize. 00:28:45.017 --> 00:28:52.461 Like all the land was ours, so we had to explain to that. 00:28:52.461 --> 00:29:00.595 You know, we went on an ATV tour around the property and they're like oh my gosh, and that's really cool to change the perspectives of the kids and what is possible. 00:29:02.001 --> 00:29:05.451 Like for the majority of their lives they lived in small houses or apartments. 00:29:05.451 --> 00:29:21.080 So I always talk to my kids about my goals and try to explain along the way so that they don't think it happened overnight and it was easy, Like this is a labor of love, you know, and it's all yours one day. 00:29:21.080 --> 00:29:29.785 You know, you and your siblings, so that was really cool and to see how they grow in the

space. 00:29:29.785 --> 00:29:34.193 You know, at first they just saw oh, I get my own room, you know. 00:29:34.193 --> 00:29:42.721 Or uh, oh, look how big my room is, or you know, oh look, I have space for my cars and tracks and you know stuff. 00:29:43.605 --> 00:29:52.992 But it seems like every day something else comes up where they're like oh okay, you know, it's small stuff and it really matters to me too. 00:29:52.992 --> 00:30:00.942 But like building a fire in our wood-burning stove like the first time I did that I was like shit, fucking cowboy out here. 00:30:00.942 --> 00:30:05.809 You know I'm uh yeah, I'm right around, I'm walking around in my work, cowboy boots and stuff. 00:30:05.809 --> 00:30:15.785 I'm just feeling myself, but it's like that's not something we would have done in West Columbus. 00:30:15.785 --> 00:30:25.425 So for me that's kind of a big deal, Collecting firewood and just everything is pretty cool. 00:30:26.119 --> 00:30:27.021 Tell me about how the? 00:30:27.021 --> 00:30:34.263 Uh, cause you've mostly lived in big cities, too, your whole life, so this is a different. 00:30:34.263 --> 00:30:36.932 I mean, this is a normal to me. 00:30:36.932 --> 00:30:43.314 This is how I grew up, but, um, this is new ish to you in terms of the lifestyle. 00:30:43.314 --> 00:30:44.560 Uh, tell me about it. 00:30:44.560 --> 00:30:45.082 Yeah, I mean. 00:30:45.082 --> 00:30:47.244 So I've experienced this type of living new-ish to you in terms of the lifestyle. 00:30:47.244 --> 00:30:47.705 Tell me about it. 00:30:47.726 --> 00:31:00.788 Yeah, I mean so I've experienced this type of living, but mostly just visiting, like my grandfather living in a tiny town down in Florida, and you know everybody's got land and stuff like that. 00:31:00.949 --> 00:31:03.574 So it was kind of cool experiencing that as a kid. 00:31:03.574 --> 00:31:16.270 But you're right, for the most part I've lived in the neighborhood or in the hood, you know, um, pretty pretty close knit in different ways. 00:31:16.270 --> 00:31:21.523 Like living out here is very close knit, everybody knows everybody and everybody's supportive of everybody for the most part. 00:31:21.523 --> 00:31:29.262 But there's a proximity factor that's not really like our neighbor. 00:31:29.262 --> 00:31:42.890 Yeah, they're not like a mile down the road, but I can't look in their window, I can't see their front door, so it's kind of like out of sight, out of mind, like I feel like I don't have neighbors, Right? 00:31:42.890 --> 00:32:08.303 Um, but the fact that we we thought we weren't gonna like it or that we would have to take more time adjusting because we can't just run around the corner real quick to the store or to some trendy restaurant or high end dining, or you know, we went to OSU games, we went to Columbus Crew games. 00:32:08.303 --> 00:32:09.645 That's not down the street anymore. 00:32:10.106 --> 00:32:11.510 Yeah, takes some planning now. 00:32:11.811 --> 00:32:14.708 Right, I mean even the grocery store, stuff like that. 00:32:14.708 --> 00:32:18.801 You know, now it's like we got to go in town, we got to make a trip into town. 00:32:18.801 --> 00:32:19.683 Do you need anything? 00:32:19.683 --> 00:32:30.468 You know, and you particularly were worried about me and how I would take adjusting to that and I'm like shut up, I'm like I don't got no issues. 00:32:30.468 --> 00:32:32.567 You know, the commute has been OK. 00:32:32.567 --> 00:32:33.421 I got a. 00:32:33.421 --> 00:32:36.730 I got a 55 minute commute. 00:32:36.730 --> 00:32:39.708 Now I used to have a seven minute commute. 00:32:39.808 --> 00:32:39.989 Right. 00:32:41.201 --> 00:32:46.484 That is a little different and my energy levels had to adjust. 00:32:46.484 --> 00:32:52.480 You know getting up an hour earlier, you know to go, then do a 12-hour shift and drive back an hour. 00:32:52.480 --> 00:32:57.000 But for the most part, man, I like it. 00:32:57.000 --> 00:33:00.578 I like the smaller town vibe, less traffic, less. 00:33:00.578 --> 00:33:09.660 You know, nobody's really in a hurry here, so you don't have the people like cutting you off, almost causing an accident and then flicking you off like it was your fault. 00:33:09.660 --> 00:33:12.678 You know I like it. 00:33:12.678 --> 00:33:14.001 And we still have Walmart. 00:33:14.001 --> 00:33:16.136 We still got Kroger. 00:33:16.369 --> 00:33:17.734 Everybody's got a Walmart, don't they? 00:33:17.734 --> 00:33:18.176 No, they don't. 00:33:19.411 --> 00:33:23.582 But if you do have a Walmart, you know that you're in the club, you're big deal. 00:33:23.582 --> 00:33:27.708 But yeah, I like it out here. 00:33:27.708 --> 00:33:44.566 Man, I think that the commute, which I originally thought was going to be a bad thing, has actually been a good thing Because as I am leaving, the busyness of Columbus, where we lived before, has expanded exponentially. 00:33:44.566 --> 00:33:53.082 They built what five, six housing and apartment developments along two streets. 00:33:53.082 --> 00:33:57.433 On either side of our house there's six apartment and housing developments coming up. 00:33:57.433 --> 00:34:27.954 So the amount of traffic and just busyness you know to then like leave that and just the further out I get, the closer to home I get it's like it all disappears, right, and I'm on those two lane country roads by the time I'm back home and it's like mentally it's awesome, it's a great decompression and you know I can put myself in like home mode, you know which is pretty cool. 00:34:29.876 --> 00:34:30.318 What about you? 00:34:31.739 --> 00:34:32.139 uh, it's. 00:34:32.139 --> 00:34:35.644 It's an interesting thing because it's not new to me. 00:34:35.644 --> 00:34:41.148 It's like being back yeah, it's like how is it like to be back, everybody's like, is it you're? 00:34:41.148 --> 00:34:52.643 The and so it's uh, it's an interesting piece because, quite honestly, I couldn't wait to get away from

here. 00:34:53.244 --> 00:34:54.465 I worried about that coming by. 00:34:54.706 --> 00:35:41.282 Yeah, I think what is helpful, though, is what I have learned about myself in the time away and in living somewhere differently, is that I now know how to put up appropriate boundaries and I know how to filter opinions, and what I mean by that is, I think, that, though the ideologies that may exist here are different than my own, I have a good barometer, a little bit, of being able to just kind of filter that, because people's thoughts and opinions are just that their thoughts and opinions. 00:35:41.282 --> 00:35:52.661 They're not their whole selves, and I think, in being away and in being at school and being in jobs and living in Columbus, I have I mean, there are people in Columbus I don't agree with either, right, so it's-. 00:35:54.871 --> 00:35:57.119 It's kind of like that agree to disagree. 00:35:57.119 --> 00:35:58.775 Yeah, a little bit. 00:35:58.775 --> 00:36:06.840 Because I think I would imagine that living out here without experiencing anything outside of here gives you a pressure to kind of go along with it. 00:36:07.030 --> 00:36:13.423 Well, and you don't know how to like, you don't know how to counter those things in a way that feels appropriate. 00:36:13.423 --> 00:36:23.943 I think I, as a person, have grown a lot in my time away and so it's given me better skills to facilitate difficult conversations. 00:36:23.943 --> 00:36:29.969 Or and it's not that I I mean I feel like I'm making it sound like every conversation I have here is bad or that every person that lives here I disagree with. 00:36:29.969 --> 00:36:39.811 That's not necessarily the case, but, like when you've not lived anywhere else or experienced anything differently, um, I think your perspective is a little bit limited. 00:36:39.811 --> 00:36:54.952 But by me moving away and having a lot of personal growth and professional growth and all of these other things, coming back doesn't necessarily feel like I'm coming back the same way. 00:36:56.173 --> 00:36:59.561 I'm coming back with a lot of different perspectives. 00:36:59.561 --> 00:37:05.599 My truths are different, my opinions have changed right, because I've been confronted with some new information, right. 00:37:05.599 --> 00:37:10.978 So I feel good about being here. 00:37:10.978 --> 00:37:18.034 I still get to do things that I enjoy and spaces that I enjoy, and I'm finding ways to do so intentionally. 00:37:18.034 --> 00:37:23.251 So I really have liked being back to be closer to family. 00:37:23.251 --> 00:37:29.655 That was really important to me, particularly after our loss the beginning of last year, which just happened. 00:37:29.655 --> 00:37:37.898 The anniversary of that death just happened, which just happened, the anniversary of that death just happened. 00:37:37.898 --> 00:37:45.114 And that was like I think I said in that episode, that was the first death my family has experienced in like 30 years, so that was really hard for us. 00:37:45.114 --> 00:37:58.130 So now that we are here, I feel like we are able to help out differently, help out more, and my family is really close, like they're together all the time. 00:37:58.130 --> 00:37:59.938 They're together right now while we're recording. 00:38:00.380 --> 00:38:02.815 Yeah, we kind of skipped out on Sunday lunch. 00:38:03.036 --> 00:38:04.840 Yeah, apologies, grandma. 00:38:05.121 --> 00:38:08.760 Apologies, cause they just might be listening to this though, sorry. 00:38:10.309 --> 00:38:38.273 So those are the things that I feel like I missed and those are truthfully the things that I feel like I missed and those are truthfully the things that I felt like the kids were missing out on um because we weren't close to your family or my family and being in columbus I mean we weren't far, but we were far enough that it made that community really hard to foster so especially um trying to bring both sides together and a place where nobody's like, nobody's close to here. 00:38:38.893 --> 00:38:40.317 So they were all traveling. 00:38:40.317 --> 00:38:44.632 You know, an hour, two hours away, to come meet us in Columbus. 00:38:45.293 --> 00:38:48.842 Yeah, so that got tricky to try to do those things. 00:38:48.842 --> 00:38:51.568 So, um, I'm glad I'm. 00:38:51.568 --> 00:39:00.643 I'm grateful for the change of pace, I'm grateful to continue to keep the community in the spaces that I need it and, um, being back's been fine for me, I'm glad to be here. 00:39:00.643 --> 00:39:01.972 I love our house. 00:39:01.972 --> 00:39:06.269 So I tell you that all the time I love it every time something new happens in the house. 00:39:06.289 --> 00:39:16.320 I'm like man, I love our house, so I, by chance, at a farmer's market we found the house we were gonna buy and it wasn't on the market and we were able to kind of facilitate that. 00:39:18.010 --> 00:39:21.960 To be honest, even if this house was on the market, we wouldn't have looked at it. 00:39:21.960 --> 00:39:31.820 It didn't fall into even though it's what we were looking for in terms of potential. 00:39:31.820 --> 00:39:37.925 It didn't fall into what we were looking for as far as finished product at the moment. 00:39:37.925 --> 00:39:49.903 At that time and it also we felt it was probably out of our budget and I don't know just there were a ton of reasons why we figured like no, we can't buy this. 00:39:49.903 --> 00:39:53.557 But for the fact that it was somebody we knew. 00:39:53.557 --> 00:39:56.614 I mean, like you said, it wasn't on the market. 00:39:56.755 --> 00:39:58.362 We didn't have to rush the process. 00:39:58.362 --> 00:40:01.954 They needed their own time to find their own place to go and move. 00:40:01.954 --> 00:40:05.059 Nothing was packed on their end. 00:40:05.059 --> 00:40:14.623 It was really impromptu for them too, and so it was kind of like, hey, while you're doing us this solid, we're doing you this solid. 00:40:14.623 -->

00:40:27.295 It worked out for everybody, and the fact that we knew them made it so much easier, like I don't have to call their realtor and their realtor give them a message and then they get back to them and get back to us you know we would meet in person. 00:40:27.750 --> 00:40:29.552 It's like, hey, I'll call them up real quick. 00:40:29.992 --> 00:40:34.235 You want to stop over and we can talk about this, or you don't want to touch base on it. 00:40:34.235 --> 00:40:42.684 It was just a really easy process and I think that they reciprocally feel that love, so it was good all the way around. 00:40:42.844 --> 00:40:45.505 It's like an additional part of the family now. 00:40:45.947 --> 00:40:46.126 Right. 00:40:46.126 --> 00:40:55.047 It worked out for both of us and provided them exactly what they needed to, so we were glad that it wrapped out that way for the end of 2024. 00:40:55.067 --> 00:40:59.016 Yeah, so, now that it's 2025, what are? 00:40:59.036 --> 00:40:59.818 you looking forward to? 00:40:59.818 --> 00:41:02.956 Oh my gosh, I graduate this year. 00:41:02.956 --> 00:41:04.019 Yeah, I'm done. 00:41:04.019 --> 00:41:06.617 So that's what I'm looking forward to. 00:41:07.333 --> 00:41:08.349 I'm feeling very done. 00:41:08.349 --> 00:41:12.476 You've been with this one for how long I don't know, you mentioned going back to school again, maybe. 00:41:21.449 --> 00:41:21.891 Listen, I don't know. 00:41:21.891 --> 00:41:22.152 I never know. 00:41:22.152 --> 00:41:23.115 So that's what I'm most looking forward to. 00:41:23.115 --> 00:41:33.563 I'm sure 2025 is going to bring us a lot of really cool things, but I will be done with this doctorate degree in May I graduate, so I'm really looking forward to closing that chapter. 00:41:33.563 --> 00:41:36.931 I'm excited for you. 00:41:36.931 --> 00:41:37.474 I'm proud of you, thanks. 00:41:37.474 --> 00:41:42.670 I'm proud of the research I've been able to do in this dissertation that I've been able to write. 00:41:42.670 --> 00:41:53.601 It's near and dear to me, so I'm glad to finally close the book, I guess, on that and get to experience the reward that I've been chasing for years. 00:41:53.601 --> 00:42:03.494 This is the end of my fourth year, so it's kind of hard to believe that that's all gone so quickly because it didn't feel quick. 00:42:03.916 --> 00:42:04.878 It's like doing time. 00:42:04.878 --> 00:42:08.159 It looks like it's a lot when you look back. 00:42:08.159 --> 00:42:11.838 I mean, it looks like a lot when you're looking forward. 00:42:12.239 --> 00:42:12.500 Yeah. 00:42:13.351 --> 00:42:14.815 But at some point you're like man. 00:42:14.835 --> 00:42:16.400 That kind of went fast. 00:42:16.400 --> 00:42:22.922 Yeah, a couple big hurdles left to seal the deal and be done, but I'm really looking forward to the end. 00:42:22.922 --> 00:42:31.344 But I'm proud of the process and what it's taken to get here and the sacrifice on all of our parts. 00:42:32.590 --> 00:42:33.693

So after this, then what? 00:42:34.376 --> 00:42:37.918 Oh, who knows, I can't even see too far ahead of me right now. 00:42:37.918 --> 00:42:42.759 Like I'm so in it right now to check these boxes that I can't even see. 00:42:42.759 --> 00:42:51.722 Like I can't see anything even in the second half of the year, let alone the what comes next for me. 00:42:51.722 --> 00:42:52.302 How about you? 00:42:52.989 --> 00:43:03.061 Well, you know, I finally got settled in to, you know, fuel hauling, right, and I feel like that's something I'm going to be at for the foreseeable future. 00:43:03.061 --> 00:43:09.239 I really I mean, it's a job that made me kind of give up on thinking about other jobs. 00:43:09.239 --> 00:43:10.041 That's big. 00:43:10.302 --> 00:43:11.043 That is big. 00:43:11.204 --> 00:43:15.072 That's big, a lot of people can say that I don't think Right, I mean, I like it. 00:43:15.072 --> 00:43:27.052 They're very supportive and the job is, it's not very challenging, but there's always something new coming along new accounts, new this, new that, and it's rewarding. 00:43:27.052 --> 00:43:27.992 So I like that. 00:43:27.992 --> 00:43:47.998 So I've decided for 2025, since you're graduating, no more school, I'm going to take all that time that you've been taking and I'm going to invest more in the podcast, because this is my baby, right, my baby been with the babysitter. 00:43:47.998 --> 00:43:49.835 I ain't been giving her no love. 00:43:49.835 --> 00:43:52.101 No, it's cool. 00:43:52.210 --> 00:43:58.418 But you know, I have been um, kind of thinking up some new ideas for the podcast and the business as a whole. 00:43:58.418 --> 00:44:03.612 Um, and I'm going to try to develop that for 2025 and beyond. 00:44:03.612 --> 00:44:06.739 Um, I bought some new equipment, which is cool. 00:44:06.739 --> 00:44:08.463 So I got a soundboard. 00:44:08.463 --> 00:44:27.387 Uh, that will make things a whole lot better when it comes to recording over the phone interviews, because a little behind the scenes peak, I was recording phone calls on my phone and I would just put a microphone up next to my phone on speakerphone. 00:44:29.251 --> 00:44:30.516 Turned out all right, you know. 00:44:30.516 --> 00:44:35.416 But now with the soundboard, I can, you know, hook it to Bluetooth and everything should go smoother. 00:44:35.416 --> 00:44:41.614 Also, we can include other people in on that, since I don't have to take up an additional microphone. 00:44:41.614 --> 00:44:45.663 So you know that I'm excited about that. 00:44:45.663 --> 00:45:08.398 Um, I'm excited that once the workshop is, uh, all done, I'll have like my own recording space and get into other aspects of it, like you know, maybe I don't know maybe go do video podcasting or get into the social media stuff that I'm not really big into, like TikTok and short videos. 00:45:08.398 --> 00:45:11.153 I don't know how to, don't look at me, nah, I don't really. 00:45:11.153 --> 00:45:14.603 Basically,

I'll be learning as I do it, but you know, just some ideas. 00:45:15.429 --> 00:45:20.862 If you are an influencer, reach out to us on stories at lockdowntolegacycom for some pro tips. 00:45:20.862 --> 00:45:22.637 We'd love to hear from you. 00:45:22.730 --> 00:45:22.989 And merch. 00:45:22.989 --> 00:45:24.913 That is something that's coming in 2025. 00:45:24.913 --> 00:45:37.983 I'm going to have some merchandise because I know we got some loyal listeners, some dedicated fans, and I would love to have some merch for them, whether it be hats, hoodies, you know, t-shirts, water bottles, whatever it is. 00:45:37.983 --> 00:45:46.864 I'm going to try to get that going, because that is something that I thought about last year and did not come to fruition. 00:45:47.230 --> 00:45:52.016 So if you are new here, this is probably a good spot for us to talk about who we are and what we do. 00:45:52.016 --> 00:45:57.686 So let's transition a little bit from an update on our lives to us. 00:45:57.686 --> 00:46:07.291 Do you want to talk a little bit about who you are and why this is important and how this podcast began and kind of the history of it? 00:46:07.931 --> 00:46:09.134 Sure, all right. 00:46:09.134 --> 00:46:14.563 So of course my name is Remy Jones, aka Jeremy Jones. 00:46:14.563 --> 00:46:22.603 I am a formerly incarcerated individual, having served 10 years in state prison in Ohio. 00:46:22.603 --> 00:46:44.626 After getting out, I just kind of had this self-determination and a plan best of all, to not come back and to not allow all of the doubt that the system likes to sow in us to win. 00:46:44.626 --> 00:46:50.659 So everyone said how hard it was going to be and all the things that weren't possible. 00:46:50.659 --> 00:47:05.237 And when they said what was possible, I recognized that it was all trying to condition me to aim low and just survive and not go back, and I didn't like that. 00:47:05.699 --> 00:47:05.900 Right. 00:47:06.791 --> 00:47:19.315 So you know, I made this little notebook full of goals that were just ostentatious and extreme and I didn't let anybody tell me, no, that's not possible. 00:47:19.315 --> 00:47:28.242 And so I started getting to it and there were many hiccups along the way and there are many people who continue to say, no, that's not possible. 00:47:28.242 --> 00:47:32.978 But I found me a good partner in DJ and together we are blazing a trail. 00:47:32.978 --> 00:47:44.822 So I'm a truck driver, I've sold cars that's pretty much the only two professions that I've had since release almost seven years ago. 00:47:44.822 --> 00:48:06.632 But I'm also a mentor and consultant and podcast personality consultant and podcast personality and my hope is that everything I do not just on this podcast, not just in mentoring or consulting, but my life in general is an example and a testament to what can happen. 00:48:06.632 --> 00:48:08.856 And it's not just a fluke. 00:48:08.856 --> 00:48:16.271 It's not just a one-off experience that I made it out, luke. 00:48:16.271 --> 00:48:24.731 It's not just a one-off experience that I made it out, but it is actually possible more often than not that you can not only survive without going back to prison, but you can actually thrive. 00:48:25.492 --> 00:48:26.974 Right, absolutely. 00:48:26.974 --> 00:48:33.264 I am Debbie Jones and, as you might have guessed, we are a husband and wife team. 00:48:33.264 --> 00:48:44.324 Hopefully you would have guessed that at this point in the podcast, but I don't know what I am. 00:48:44.324 --> 00:48:48.400 I'm a lot of things and nothing all at once. 00:48:48.400 --> 00:48:51.012 I don't know Right now. 00:48:51.012 --> 00:48:54.860 I'm finishing up a PhD in educational policy. 00:48:55.201 --> 00:49:04.496 My research focuses on the lived experiences of black educators in states with legislation that bans, bars or prohibits the discussion of race in the classroom. 00:49:04.496 --> 00:49:06.422 That sounds very practiced. 00:49:06.422 --> 00:49:08.592 It is. 00:49:08.592 --> 00:49:11.677 It is my statement, it's the thing I have to say about it. 00:49:11.677 --> 00:49:14.563 So my little abstract, I suppose. 00:49:14.943 --> 00:49:28.134 But in addition to that, I think that my professional career has been dedicated similarly to fighting injustice, and so what drew you and I together? 00:49:28.134 --> 00:50:01.000 A lot of things drew us together, but what drew us together in this line of work is that we see that the criminal legal system is far from just in most ways, and fighting injustice is a lot of what I do in my professional line of work in terms of finding equity, and you and I talked a lot about preventative measures to keep people from going to prison, but we also talked about how there isn't a lot of post-ventative measures. 00:50:01.000 --> 00:50:02.081 When people come home. 00:50:02.081 --> 00:50:31.045 There isn't a way to transition, and so we were hoping to create something that spoke to both ends of that spectrum and everything that happens in between you from a standpoint of lived experience and having gone through it from start to finish, but me from the angle of being able to bring the policy lens into that and the behind the curtain a little bit of the why things are written the way they are to continue to keep people oppressed in specific ways. 00:50:31.106 --> 00:50:34.818 So the podcast started in October of 2022. 00:50:34.818 --> 00:50:37.271 All the way back to our first episode. 00:50:37.271 --> 00:50:41.891 It's Lonely at the Bottom, but prior to that it took a little bit of convincing right. 00:50:42.672 --> 00:50:44.217 Yeah, yeah. 00:50:44.217 --> 00:50:54.257 So, of course, like everything else in my life, dj right here is my biggest supporter and motivator and she was like hey, that thing you talked about, like you should do it. 00:50:54.257 --> 00:51:04.853 But I have a friend named Shakima who not too long after I got out, you know, we were having

all these deep conversations and she was like, bro, like you should start a podcast. 00:51:04.853 --> 00:51:07.202 And at the time I didn't even know what a podcast was. 00:51:07.202 --> 00:51:11.094 But she was like man, you could start one up, like, and it costs next to nothing. 00:51:11.094 --> 00:51:17.737 And so it kind of went in one ear and out the other, but she did not give up on that idea. 00:51:17.737 --> 00:51:26.621 And then it was just happenstantial that Debbie also was like hey, you mentioned this thing before and I think we should do that. 00:51:26.621 --> 00:51:32.757 And I was like, eh, okay, well, now the pressure's on right. 00:51:32.757 --> 00:51:39.733 So here we are and I'm glad that people saw that and wouldn't let it go. 00:51:40.434 --> 00:51:42.920 Yeah, and the podcast has kind of evolved over time. 00:51:42.920 --> 00:51:44.422 It evolved before we started. 00:51:44.422 --> 00:51:44.690 Right. 00:51:44.690 --> 00:51:50.242 We had several concepts come up before we recorded that first one in October of 2022. 00:51:50.242 --> 00:52:01.903 October 13th was our first release date and our anniversary of this podcast, but it went strong for a year and a half, bringing us into what March, april-ish of 2024. 00:52:01.903 --> 00:52:11.994 At that point, we were just doing a lot of life and it was right before our house going on the market in June and we had to. 00:52:11.994 --> 00:52:23.034 Just something had to give right, and it's not a good excuse for stepping away from our fans for so long or from people who really enjoy listening to this podcast on a weekly basis. 00:52:23.034 --> 00:52:25.219 So you know, we're settled again. 00:52:25.219 --> 00:52:31.059 We're back in our own space and we have our recording equipment up. 00:52:31.059 --> 00:52:34.315 You've upgraded some equipment, so we're ready to roll. 00:52:34.655 --> 00:52:35.358 We're ready to roll. 00:52:35.358 --> 00:52:40.318 We're bringing it to you the real son, if y'all remember that from the intro from last season. 00:52:40.318 --> 00:52:49.259 So, yeah, I'm here, I'm ready and I look forward to sharing many stories and experiences with you guys. 00:52:49.259 --> 00:52:54.701 As always, you guys know the email stories at Lockdown to Legacy. 00:52:54.701 --> 00:53:03.452 There's also the Lockdown to Legacy podcast on Facebook, so please give your feedback, give your ideas, if there's something you want to hear about. 00:53:03.452 --> 00:53:09.155 You know if we got the knowledge, you know I'm all for it, and not only us. 00:53:09.155 --> 00:53:21.583 But we do bring incarcerated individuals on the show and other formerly incarcerated individuals and even supporters of them, people who were in their corner during that experience. 00:53:21.583 --> 00:53:28.563 So if you have those questions and we can get them answered, by any means, please share those. 00:53:29.771 --> 00:53:35.112 We have Remy's done a really good job getting a great lineup for you in terms

of interviews for season two. 00:53:35.112 --> 00:53:38.186 So we've got some really good voices some are old to the podcast. 00:53:38.186 --> 00:53:52.275 If you want to scroll back through our catalog, re-listen to some things as you are getting ready to hear lockdown to legacy weekly again, um, we've done episodes just you and I talking about different aspects of prison, but we've also done a lot of interviews. 00:53:52.275 --> 00:53:57.057 Um, podcast concept kind of evolved and we started bringing Warren in. 00:53:57.057 --> 00:54:03.315 Um started off just happenstance, but then everybody loved Warren so we had to bring him in more. 00:54:03.315 --> 00:54:05.722 You want to talk about him and your conversations? 00:54:06.150 --> 00:54:06.250 Uh. 00:54:06.250 --> 00:54:11.378 So first, um, warren, we still will have uh regularly for Warren's Wisdom. 00:54:11.378 --> 00:54:15.565 We will also still have Wise for Wise's World. 00:54:15.565 --> 00:54:20.356 If you guys haven't checked out those episodes, feel free to look back through the catalog. 00:54:20.356 --> 00:54:34.679 We are thinking we're going to change the structure of those episodes to make them a little bit more formal, because really they were just conversations with guys I love and we have good, good, deep conversations. 00:54:34.679 --> 00:54:43.123 But also I wanted to bring back that element of the Summer Legacy Series. 00:54:43.123 --> 00:54:56.210 So we're going to still do some of those type interviews to show you guys the successes and you know some of the not so successful people who came home and want to share their experiences. 00:54:56.210 --> 00:55:16.344 So, um, yeah, you know we're going to try to figure out that good balance to not be a big hodgepodge kind of, as we were as we were developing last season, but to not just forego some of those elements that we brought in that I feel like were good and that you guys expressed, that you liked. 00:55:16.931 --> 00:55:18.677 Yeah, I think it was important to us. 00:55:18.677 --> 00:55:25.983 We heard some feedback like not about I guess it wasn't toxic positivity, but about just showcasing the successes of folks. 00:55:25.983 --> 00:55:31.719 I do think folks need to hear and see that because we don't see enough of that post-incarceration, see enough of that post-incarceration. 00:55:31.719 --> 00:55:51.478 But also we need to ground it in reality and say sometimes it isn't successful the first time home, or sometimes it isn't successful in the endeavors you're taking on and you have to change course, and so we're going to try to bring in some more of those types of stories so that you can continue to see the persistence of everybody involved in this. 00:55:51.478 --> 00:56:06.617 So it was a great time away for us to regroup, to think through the elements that we wanted to keep and how the structure needed to move forward, and we're really excited to bring you season two of the Lockdown to Legacy podcast. 00:56:06.617

--> 00:56:09.309 Any other pieces on the podcast itself. 00:56:09.630 --> 00:56:22.835 We're going to bring you guys that same old down-to-earth, real, sometimes funny, sometimes serious, maybe occasionally even sad, but we're going to try to be that. 00:56:22.835 --> 00:56:25.541 What's the word I'm looking for? 00:56:25.541 --> 00:56:37.744 Source, that source of just unfiltered experience of the 360, experience of being involved with the criminal legal system. 00:56:38.510 --> 00:56:47.237 Well, now that we have given an update on our lives, given an update on the podcast, are you all right if I ask you a couple of closing questions? 00:56:47.237 --> 00:56:50.235 Oh, sure, you like being put on the spot. 00:56:50.235 --> 00:56:52.000 I didn't check these ahead of time. 00:56:52.079 --> 00:56:52.603 I'm ready, baby. 00:56:52.603 --> 00:56:53.413 I stay ready. 00:56:53.413 --> 00:56:54.416 So I got to get ready. 00:56:56.431 --> 00:56:58.018 You talked about this just a little bit ago. 00:56:58.018 --> 00:56:59.344 In terms of it's your. 00:56:59.344 --> 00:57:08.041 We're coming up on your seventh anniversary of being home and, as you shared just a minute ago, you were in for 10 years. 00:57:08.041 --> 00:57:14.844 So we're getting closer to the time home post-incarceration, equaling the time in. 00:57:14.844 --> 00:57:21.282 I'm curious from your perspective now how often are you still thinking about prison? 00:57:25.351 --> 00:57:26.777 I still think about prison all the time. 00:57:26.777 --> 00:57:41.076 I mean, that was a huge experience for me, especially being that when I went to prison I was 19 years old and so by the time I got out, I had spent a third of my life in prison. 00:57:41.076 --> 00:57:52.800 You know so, unfortunately, prison is a huge part of my life experience, you know so, until I get to that point where it's just a drop in the pond. 00:57:52.800 --> 00:57:58.173 It's really a big part, and it's always something that I'm comparing to. 00:57:58.173 --> 00:58:11.864 Something I did in prison, somebody I met in prison, a conversation I had in prison, you know whatever, but mostly when I think about prison, I think about the people I met in prison. 00:58:12.967 --> 00:58:20.300 You know, I left a lot of people behind when I came home, and my goal is to not leave them behind. 00:58:20.300 --> 00:58:28.733 You know, uh, I admit that when I was in there, I was that type of person that people would go home and they would try to give me their contact information. 00:58:28.733 --> 00:58:29.657 I would turn them down. 00:58:29.657 --> 00:58:31.240 I'm like, nah, I'm cool bro. 00:58:31.240 --> 00:58:35.632 Like yeah, we were cool, but like I'm not going to call. 00:58:35.632 --> 00:58:36.454 You're not going to call, we're not. 00:58:36.454 --> 00:58:36.775 You know. 00:58:37.356 --> 00:58:44.161 But I did hold on to some of those relationships, like Warren, like Wise, and you know some of my other friends. 00:58:44.161 --> 00:58:48.677 I have a few other friends that are in there, and so they are missed. 00:58:48.677 --> 00:58:51.963 You know they are missed especially as I. 00:58:51.963 --> 00:58:59.313 You know they are missed especially as I um have all these new experiences that I try to communicate to them. 00:58:59.313 --> 00:59:18.465 I try to you know, the whole model of this thing is to let people know like, hey, I did it, you can do it, and so I try to keep giving them new information so that they don't have to try to plan based off of old information or one-sided information, right? 00:59:18.465 --> 00:59:24.961 So I think about prison all the time, unfortunately and fortunately. 00:59:27.952 --> 00:59:35.653 You visited a lot of prison, I think, in the last few years, visiting people like Warren and other friends that are currently inside. 00:59:35.653 --> 00:59:42.719 Does it ever conjure up anything from you being the person that's coming into the prison now, not the person receiving visitors? 00:59:44.371 --> 00:59:49.242 No, I do know the importance of what I'm doing when I go into a prison to visit somebody. 00:59:49.242 --> 01:00:01.543 So I try not to make it too heavy but I try not to take it too lightheartedly to where it's felt like it's not significant Gotcha. 01:00:01.543 --> 01:00:05.456 It does feel weird sometimes. 01:00:05.456 --> 01:00:08.682 Some of the prisons that I've gone to were prisons that I've been in. 01:00:08.682 --> 01:00:12.336 So I've run into COs that I knew. 01:00:12.737 --> 01:00:18.701 I've run into administrators I knew and they kind of give you that second look like I know you from somewhere. 01:00:18.701 --> 01:00:25.217 You know you go through the spiel like, oh yeah, I used to be in here and they're like, oh, when did you get out? 01:00:25.217 --> 01:00:25.878 And et cetera. 01:00:25.878 --> 01:00:35.637 But it's surprising how you get to see a whole different side of that person, like CEOs and administrators. 01:00:35.637 --> 01:00:45.967 I've met the um, one of the unit managers that was always kind of a hard ass, one of the CEOs that was kind of always hard ass, and they're like, oh, what you been up to since you've been out? 01:00:45.967 --> 01:00:50.592 Obviously if you're coming back in here you must be doing something good. 01:00:50.592 --> 01:00:52.655 You know you're not getting in trouble and then so I'll give them a quick. 01:00:52.655 --> 01:01:11.958 You know you're not getting in trouble and then so I'll give them a quick, you know elevator pitch of my story and they're like, well, damn, um, they're really really happy to hear that and that is cool yeah. 01:01:11.978 --> 01:01:12.682 Um and oh, I had another one for you. 01:01:12.702 --> 01:01:20.840 I'm going to come up with it, mm-hmm, okay, okay, so now that it's going on year seven, what is like? 01:01:20.840 --> 01:01:23.844 I know you have a lot of things left that you want to do. 01:01:23.844 --> 01:01:25.574 You haven't accomplished all of

it. 01:01:25.574 --> 01:01:26.177 In seven years. 01:01:26.177 --> 01:01:38.710 You've accomplished a lot, but what's like the next thing for you that you want to accomplish, the next thing for you that you want to accomplish, like a thing that you dreamed of while in prison, that you want to actualize now, seven years home? 01:01:39.050 --> 01:01:39.873 Foreign travel. 01:01:39.873 --> 01:01:41.099 You know other countries. 01:01:41.099 --> 01:01:43.648 Yeah, we've done that and that's been awesome. 01:01:43.648 --> 01:01:48.782 That was a big thing because there is a lot of misinformation about that being a felon. 01:01:48.782 --> 01:02:05.320 People are like, oh, you can't get your passport, you can't leave the country and this and that, which is not true, like even when you're on supervision you're allowed to, which I don't know who said you can't or why, but it is very common misinformation that's out there being spread. 01:02:05.320 --> 01:02:06.862 So that was a big thing. 01:02:06.862 --> 01:02:09.876 I want to get a pardon. 01:02:09.876 --> 01:02:10.481 That's my thing, man. 01:02:10.481 --> 01:02:12.186 I want to get a pardon. 01:02:12.186 --> 01:02:13.972 That's my thing, man. 01:02:14.313 --> 01:02:24.405 I've managed to overcome having to tell people about my past, not saying I haven't had to tell them, but to where I don't really care. 01:02:24.405 --> 01:02:44.710 I freely, as you see on this show, I tell people and share my experience, so it hasn't really stopped me from gaining employment or housing or some of these other things that are common barriers when you have a criminal past. 01:02:44.710 --> 01:03:01.367 But I'm at that point now where it's like at for a very long time to where, if I didn't tell you about my past, you wouldn't be able to ascertain that that is something that I have with me. 01:03:01.367 --> 01:03:07.422 I don't live to where it looks like I have a past. 01:03:07.422 --> 01:03:21.123 I don't have any type of thoughts that recidivism is ever going to be a possibility for me, so really, the only reason why I hold on to it is to help other people, to teach other people. 01:03:21.123 --> 01:03:32.204 So I found out that there are some resources and programs out there that will help you get either an expungement or a pardon full pardon. 01:03:32.204 --> 01:03:36.739 So when my time is up, that's what I want to do. 01:03:36.739 --> 01:03:44.670 There is a time limit for how long you've been out or how long you've been off supervision, so that's my next move. 01:03:44.931 --> 01:03:46.637 Okay, full pardon. 01:03:46.637 --> 01:03:49.304 Baby, I'm inviting all the listeners. 01:03:49.304 --> 01:03:56.978 So, whatever we're at, however many listeners we have at that time, best believe we all come into the courthouse deep. 01:03:56.978 --> 01:04:12.617 I want all the like Southern Baptist preachers out front on the megaphones and we gonna take it to the White House and we gonna take it to Constitution Hall. 01:04:12.617 --> 01:04:14.844 Ha ha, ha. 01:04:14.844 --> 01:04:16.291 Like. 01:04:16.291 --> 01:04:19.501 I want y'all to show up and show out man, because that's going to be huge for me. 01:04:19.769 --> 01:04:21.393 You haven't even had any caffeine today. 01:04:21.393 --> 01:04:22.396 I haven't. 01:04:22.476 --> 01:04:23.097 This is just. 01:04:23.097 --> 01:04:24.822 I'm ready to take a nap, just you. 01:04:28.530 --> 01:04:29.715 My last piece. 01:04:29.715 --> 01:04:41.840 I'm looking forward to it, by the way, but we did this exercise last year, so I'll give you a second to think about it and I'll do mine first, but I want you to think about your word for 2025. 01:04:41.840 --> 01:04:45.697 I don't know if you remember what your 2024 word was. 01:04:46.117 --> 01:04:47.842 I don't actually, yeah, we did. 01:04:47.842 --> 01:04:55.724 I'm sure you could go back on the podcast I think we did it as part of this podcast too so you can go back to the episode and figure out what your word was and how you accomplished it or didn't. 01:04:55.724 --> 01:05:08.692 It's been a practice of mine to identify a word for the year that I want it to be for me, whether that's who I want to be or whether I want the year to look like for me and I've got a really good one this year. 01:05:09.612 --> 01:05:10.994 All right, so you're going to start us off. 01:05:11.054 --> 01:05:30.873 I am my word for 2025, and I hope it's not intended to sound superficial, so I need you to look at the depth of the word rather than it at its surface my 2025 year word is iconic Mm, mm, mm-hmm. 01:05:30.994 --> 01:05:34.277 So are you going to share your depth or are you just going to let people do their own? 01:05:34.416 --> 01:05:36.458 Well, I already talked about my graduation. 01:05:36.458 --> 01:05:37.739 That's really big for me. 01:05:37.739 --> 01:05:41.222 I don't intend to get another doctorate, right. 01:05:41.222 --> 01:05:45.967 So it's iconic for me. 01:05:45.967 --> 01:05:59.996 I will join the 2% of black women with a doctorate degree and that's very cool to me, um. 01:05:59.996 --> 01:06:01.318 But it's iconic in a lot of other ways too. 01:06:01.318 --> 01:06:03.242 We are spending our very first full year in our forever home. 01:06:03.242 --> 01:06:09.460 Um, I started a new job towards the end of 2024 and so I will be coming up on a first full year and they're like so it's. 01:06:09.460 --> 01:06:21.842 It's iconic because it's the, it's the first of a lot of things and it's the finality of others that have been really integral to who I am the last four years. 01:06:21.842 --> 01:06:46.619 So I think post-pandemic, right, we can go back to 2020 and realize what happened to the world in that year and the following year, and now we're coming out of that a bit globally, across countries, and the impacts are still there, but the way we interact has completely changed. 01:06:47.061 --> 01:07:04.190 Yeah, for sure, and so iconic oh tonic, oh, all right.

01:07:04.210 --> 01:07:11.056 So, um, I do know that in 2018, when I first came home, I had a one word that summed up my life, and that one word was sacrifice, um. 01:07:11.056 --> 01:07:21.746 And then 2019, 2020, 2021, um, it was growth, you know um, 2022, 2023. 01:07:21.746 --> 01:07:27.976 I don't really remember what they were, but I do know that, uh, I kind of switched it up a little bit, you know. 01:07:28.250 --> 01:07:30.798 I think it was hustle because that's when the podcast started. 01:07:30.798 --> 01:07:37.697 It's when you were doing a lot of the business work and getting your speaking organization off the ground, so it might have been hustle. 01:07:38.041 --> 01:07:46.682 Maybe it was a hustle, but I guess if I had to come up with one for 2025, what would I say? 01:07:46.682 --> 01:07:53.677 That is, I can't say contentment. 01:07:53.677 --> 01:07:57.719 I mean because in some ways I am. 01:07:57.719 --> 01:08:16.634 I will say that in 2025, I would say self-care, because, as much as I like to talk about how I sacrificed and I was so growth-focused and all this other things, it was all about the hustle. 01:08:16.954 --> 01:08:17.658 Yeah, you bad at it. 01:08:17.951 --> 01:08:21.461 I never wanted to take care of myself. 01:08:21.569 --> 01:08:23.056 Yeah, you bad at self-care. 01:08:24.110 --> 01:08:26.998 So that's what I want to say for 2025 is self-care. 01:08:27.780 --> 01:08:29.975 All right, Now that is also on a recorded thing. 01:08:29.975 --> 01:08:33.623 It's binding Binding legally, I'm sure. 01:08:33.623 --> 01:08:45.930 Sure, I don't know about all that all right, y'all heard it well, I think that's a great way to bring us back in, uh, bring our listeners up to date so they can be ready for some content when we break into the season next week. 01:08:46.131 --> 01:08:56.706 Any parting words, mr jones um, my parting words are thank you to everybody who um stuck by us. 01:08:56.706 --> 01:09:05.979 You know, I still watch the statistics for the podcast and there are people still listening, even though we haven't recorded in six months. 01:09:05.979 --> 01:09:10.001 So thank you very much to all of you guys. 01:09:10.001 --> 01:09:13.761 And now that we're back, you know, please continue to support us. 01:09:13.761 --> 01:09:17.958 You know, continue to share the podcast when the merchandise drops. 01:09:17.958 --> 01:09:19.122 You know, please hit me up. 01:09:19.122 --> 01:09:20.432 I'll have it. 01:09:20.432 --> 01:09:22.560 You know, I'll let you guys know where you can get it. 01:09:22.560 --> 01:09:27.742 But yeah, that's all I really got to say is thank you for your support. 01:09:29.070 --> 01:09:29.773 Sounds good to me. 01:09:29.773 --> 01:09:31.972 We'll see you next week, next week. 01:09:31.972 --> 01:10:08.506 Peace Bye, thank you. 01:10:08.506 --> 01:10:17.860 You can reach out to us with any feedback, questions, comments or share the love by emailing stories at lockdown2legacycom. 01:10:17.860 --> 01:10:20.557 Stories at lockdown2legacycom. 01:10:20.557 --> 01:10:33.399 You can reach out there too for a free sticker, and you can find us on Instagram and Twitter with the handle at lockdown2legacy and on Facebook at the Lockdown to Legacy podcast. 01:10:33.399 --> 01:10:37.020 Please don't forget to rate, review and subscribe. 01:10:37.020 --> 01:13:14.909 No-transcript.