TRANSCRIPT 🔗
Tim: Founded in sixteen sixty six, Newark, New Jersey owns a history older than the United States itself. A history equally as interesting, one with considerable contributions to American culture, from music to visual arts, to theater, to of course literature. The city also has witnessed the ups and downs that have beset most urban locales. The Industrial Revolution, Deindustrialization, Upheaval, and Renewal. Along the way, Norw has served as home to American literary giants, urgent voices, and one of modern storytelling's most vital innovations, Audible, All of which make Norwick a fascinating location for a lit trip.
Tim Castano: I am Tim Costano, and this is Lit Trip, where we take you on a tour through a location's literary past, present, and future. Writers, scholars, civic leaders, and fans guide us through the history, influences, traditions, and contributions that transform a place into a destination. If you enjoy stories, personalities, and escape, come lose yourself in a lit trip.
Tim: Our visit to Norwick begins at the very top with Mayor Raz Baracca. Perhaps more so than any city in the country, Norwick's literary heart beats within its leader, a poet himself, and the son of Amina Baraca and Amiri Baraca, You grew up in a family that valued artistic expression, especially through literature. what does the written word, as well as the spoken word, mean to Norc's identity?
Tim Castano: Well, I mean, first, I mean, just on its face. We have incredible authors and writers that have come out of this city from Philip Rolf to Amiri Baraka, you know, to Richard Wesley who's start made made spoken word into movies. You know, you they're they're clawed, you know, there's a a bunch of people, Booby Heard, Nathan Heard, who are writers. so Newark's identity, you know, storytelling and writing is a part of our of our history and our culture here in the city. And I think it comes out of, you know, a very diverse community, populations of people who've been through many things, you know, whether they're immigrants or moving in f moving here from the south. Trying to find democracy and opportunity and using the spoken word to express their their condition, their journey, to tell their stories. And you know, so I think that's still part of our identity, you know, the the the storytelling and use the use of words and literature and poetry as a means for us to express ourselves.
Tim: In your role as mayor, do you ever turn to words written by your parents for inspiration?
Tim Castano: Yeah. Absolutely. I think most people, you know, who you know, grew up in the households with their families and they and then and it was, you know, inspirational are gonna turn to that is what they know. It's it's you know, is it's it's what I know, it's what I heard as a child, you know, sayings, information, stuff you lean back on when you're in trouble spots or things that you need when you need to grab Some words of inspiration or words of encouragement, definitely lean on that. One my father used to tell me, Don't lose my poetry license. Right. And you know, that that to me meant a bunch of things. It meant like don't stop writing poetry that you were poet, you know, at heart, but also it means like don't forget where you came from, like you know, what's going on, why you did this in the first place. I mean, because you find that in your imagination and the spoken word helps you realize why you're on this journey
Tim: How do you think your own talent as a poet complements your role as the city's leader?
Tim Castano: Well, I think being being a poet makes you like introspective, you know, a lot you know makes you look and think and and you know, pay attention to details. you know, because you are just describing, you know, what you see and what's going on and And and more importantly out of out of that, you know, it gives me a an a sense of imagination, a kind of radical imagination to see the place that I'm in differently than what it is now, which helps me. It helped me as a principal, it's helped me as a as the mayor, elected official, to not just accept what is, to think about what could be. And you know, when you when you when I'm writing and when I'm in that place writing, you know, my mind is in that in that place. Like how do I become a thermostat. You know, not just a thermometer, you know, so that's important.
Tim: When you scan the catalogue of writers throughout the city's history, you cannot help but observe the current of activism from the nineteenth century all the way to today. you have Robert Kirvin, Brenda Ray Morick, E. P. Rogers, we could name many, many more. Do you think this type of active engagement by the city's authors represents Norwich's literary character more so than any other aspect?
Tim Castano: yeah, I absolutely do. And again, I think it's, you know, because of Newark, the port city, you know, right right out on the other side of New York, the you know, other you know, the other side of the Hudson, you know, the you know, the largest city in the state where most people came through first, where communities grew up and where we had a solid Irish community, a solid Italian community, a solid Jewish community. a growing and solid African American community and Latino community and then all kinds of other immigrants found themselves in Newark and that kind of mix and culture and experience in America which was struggling to be d democratic, you know, and and I think each generation added to trying to make America more democratic than it was previous generations. And those experiences and those stories came out of the writing that you you hear and see coming out of Newark. And you know, those people made an impact on on the country, right? And yeah, so I I believe the again the spoken word, the written word, you know, and and literature itself coming out of the city ha has been incredibly impactful.
Tim: What do you think about Norc's literary scene today?
Tim Castano: Yeah, we
Load full transcript
I mean it's we still we still because the Dodge Poetry Festival is still happening, it's still jumping. That's why Dodge moved to Newark. We still have spoken word events that happen a around the city. you know, there there we have a host of writers who are now you know, interested more in film and T V more than anything else 'cause I think that's the direction things are going with social media and tax credits in New Jersey, you know, g giving people towards film and you know, T V. trying to write for that medium. But we still have robust literary scene in this city. and and it is impressive.
Tim: From City Hall, we head to another landmark, the Newark Public Library. Established in eighteen eighty eight and in its present home since nineteen one, the Nork Public Library extends seven branches throughout the city, acting as a center for researchers, early readers, and the community at large. We spoke with Dr. William Penniston, the former librarian for the Norwell of Art, who also has published extensively on the Nork Public Library.
Tim Castano: consequential figures have served the Newark Public Library since its founding in eighteen eighty nine. Individuals like James Brown, John Cotton Dana Louise Connolly, Charles Cummings and others. Could one describe these individuals as unsung heroes in the city? And how important are their legacies? I would definitely say that they could be categorized as unsung heroes, especially the the you know, the librarians such as James Brown, Charles Cummings, Louise Connolly, Bill Dane, I would throw in, Julia Sabin. these people they worked hard, they built up Collections that are still important and that will continue to be important. And they made major contributions in a variety of ways. Just Miriam Studley and Charles Cummings, for example, both of them worked in the New Jersey room for years, and both of them wrote articles for local newspapers that. are important. Charles Cummings knowing Newark, those there's something like 500 newspaper articles and those are rich sources of information on the history of of Newark. Those that source is going to be important long into the future. So definitely those people are unsung heroes. Of John Cotton Dana, on the other hand, is well known I don't know if I would say he's an unsung hero. He is definitely a hero in Newark's cultural and historical sites. People know of him and they often talk about him. how do you think the library's programmatic efforts today both preserve its past and promote its future for the modern reader? I would say this that the library, you know, certainly from an outside observer point of view, the library continues to strive to try to build upon its unique collections. and it is still trying to present educational and entertaining programs. Those programs are based on its collections and also it's what another thing that it's really trying to do is to serve the communities within the city of of Newark. So it's trying to be very sensitive
to the ethnic communities, the economic diversity within the city. so I'm I'm I I'm a I'm a big supporter of the library and I think it's doing a good job. regarding that diversity, at the beginning of the last century, under the leadership of the aforementioned John Cotton Dana, the Norwegian Public Library became one of the first such institutions in the nation to feature foreign language collections to serve the city's diverse population. How important was that decision for the city? And how do you think the library continues to support diverse readers today? So I would first of all I'd like to say that Frank Hill, who was the first director of the Newark Public Library, deserves a lot of credit for these kinds of outreach programs. So he is the one that was it was responsible for opening up the stacks to the public. he was responsible for building up the collection. constructing the main building on Washington Park, and also developing an outreach program to the neighborhoods through horse-drawn carriages at the time, because this is 1890s, establishing delivery stations at firehouses and schools and churches. so he deserves an awful lot of credit, and he is the one that began Building up collections of foreign language materials for the immigrant population of Newark. John Cotton Dana, of course, promoted that in ways that Frank Hill did not. I think Dana's main sources, he was a real promoter. He wrote extensively, he was always giving interviews to the newspapers or whatever. He was a real promoter. He published leaflets and pamphlets and whatever, trying to get the information out that the the library could serve those communities. And that community, those that those immigrant communities was a large part of the population of Newark at the time. I think that over 50% of Newarkers were firstborn or secondborn immigrants. I mean, many of them were born abroad, and 50 percent were either born abroad or children of immigrants. And that community at the time was from South, Central, and Eastern Europe. They were Catholic, Protestants, and Orthodox Christians as well as Jews. so diversity within religious orientation. and they spoke Lithuanian, which is a language we don't talk about much anymore, but it was an important language at the time Polish, German, Italian, Spanish. so these people all had access to material in their own languages, and that made them feel included. and it made their children have access to continuing that the tradition that they were growing up with at home. the library has continued to do that by developing programs for the the communities that now exist in the city. So now that a hundred and twenty years later, Newark is a city of almost 50% African American and about 30% Hispanic and Latino. So it's a still a very diverse community. And the public library has served those two communities by establishing an African American room, the James Brown Room. And that is a very rich source on African American culture, history, art, literature, both contemporary and traditional 19th century, 20th century, 21st century literatures. and the sala Hispano-Americana is very strong in Central American, South American, and Caribbean literature and culture. so the library continues to reach out to those communities. The Van Buren branch of the public library is located in the Ironbound section of the city, and that is a heavily Portuguese community. Portuguese from both Portugal and from Brazil. And that branch has a large collection of Portuguese language material as well as a strong outreach program to those communities. Newark's diversity lies not only in the population, but also in the genres and media you have decades of incredibly active newspaper publishing and all of the journalists on the rosters. You have a major children's book publisher, modern mystery writers like Harlan Coben, along with classroom staples like Stephen Crane. how would you guide someone attempting to understand the totality of the city's literary landscape? the New Jersey Room of the Newark Public Library has a really wonderful collection. They have a special New Jersey author collection. so that certainly would be one place to go to to find this kind of information and this the kind of diversity that you're talking about. it is a very odd collection because New Jersey authors could include anybody who's writing on any subject, whether it relates to New Jersey or Newark. for example, there is Mary Mapes Dodge and Hans Brinker and the Silver Skates. This is a a Very popular children's story in the 19th century, and it has nothing to do with Newark, but she wrote it in her family farm just outside of Newark there's that kind of author, but then you've got people like Philip Roth, so many of his novels are are based in Newark or they certainly come out of his own experience growing up in the Wequayc neighborhood of Newark. the other thing about Philip Roth is he was a big supporter of the library from a big user of the library when he was a kid, and then a supporter as he became an adult, and good friends with Charles Cummings in the New Jersey room, who he often referred to as his personal librarian. And when Philip Roth died, he gave to the Newark Public Library a large endowment and also his personal library. And so the Philip Roth Personal Library is his own collection of novels and historical work and political studies, that he he was a big reader, so he read a lot of these things. He annotated them. And all of that is in this wonderful room at the Newark Public Library, which does rotating exhibits of his the literary legacy. And the other thing is he did he endowed the library with an endowment that allows for an annual lecture. And these annual lectures have featured major writers like Zadie Smith, who's the first lecturer, Salmon Rushdie, historians like Robert Carro and and Sean Willens. you serve as the librarian and archivist of another cultural landmark within the city, the
Newark Museum of Art. How do entities like the museum and the library collaborate with one another and with other organizations in the city to foster Newark's artistic community? I was the librarian and the archivist at the Newark Museum. for 25 years. And my title, I'm still associated with the museum. I I'm now the librarian emeritus. and I do some consulting for them in regards to the library and archives. by default, I became the de facto historian of the institution. and when I retired, that is when I decided I would do this book for the images of America series. So a photographic essay on the history of the Newark Museum. and that was my first book. for a year and a half, I worked with the library, the public library's archival collection, known as their librariana collection. And I became very familiar with that collection as well. And so I followed up that first book with the second book on the Newark Public Library. and part of that second book was really a salute to the many people that I had worked with over the years because I was a solo librarian. working with volunteers, interns. I had 38 interns in my 27 years. and I relied on support from my colleagues at other institutions in Newark, my the my other librarians. Bill Dane, Charles Cummings, Bruce Ford. were all good friends and and and mentors. So part of that book on the pub Newark Public Library is a salute to them. The public library and the museum are both great institutions. They have wonderful collections. They have active educational programs that are insightful and entertaining. And those programs are going to continue as long as those institutions continue. I would like to say, in direct response to your question, I think. It should be summed up mainly by a quotation by John Cotton Dana, which I I'm just gonna read. so Dana wrote, A city should adorn itself, it should keep its streets neat and clean, supply itself with good water and an ample supply of sewers, set up beautiful parks, build plenty of attractive schools. And wear that air hospitable to learning wisdom and art, which has distinguished great cities throughout the ages, it should also take us on certain material indications of culture and refinement, such as libraries and museums. So I think he sums it up best.
Tim: As noted, the Nork Public Library houses the collection of one of the city's most notable authors, Philip Roth. Few locations more readily identify with a writer than Nork and Roth, who set several of his works in the city, from his first, Goodbye Columbus, right up to his last twenty ten's nemesis. In fact, the protagonist of Goodbye Columbus, Neil Klugman, works in the Norwork Public Library. We spoke with doctor Miriam Jaffe, who serves as program director of the Philip Roth Society.
Tim Castano: is there one work you believe captures Roth Snork or his relationship to the city? Would it be one of his earlier books or one of his later pieces like American Pastoral or The Plot Against America?
Miri: there isn't one work because Norick exists for Roth as pastoral space in some earlier works where he would go out to the nature preserve that kind of backs up into West Orange and that would be his sort of bucolic Berkshires or Connecticut. when he was living in this area. He found it to be like a nature place in some novels and then in other novels it's a different kind of third space. In American Pastoral I think Mary shows, in the arc of Mary's character you see how North plays all of these different roles. So there's this urban space of Norwick that's been affected by the 1967 riots that changed the city's ethnics and demographics. And then there's old Rimrock, which is this rural paradise in which Swede Lavov chooses to build this familial retreat. And this novel has this contrast between the family Lvov trying to protect against the outside world of Newark, but Lvov's daughter, and this is a quote from American Pastoral, transports him out of this longed for American Pastoral and into everything that is its antithesis and its enemy, into the fury, the violence, and the desperation of the counterpastoral in the indigenous American berserk. That's page 86. in my edition. So there's just these opposite dimensions of the novel, the uncorrupt and bucolic nature of old rimrock. And it's supposed to be that, but then Mary, turns out to be terrorist and eventually lives up, ends up living in the suburbs of Newark, which happens to be the same urban space that, her family tried to escape.
Tim Castano: What would you say, either positive or negative, about Nork being so closely identified with Philip Roth? Does he cast too big of a shadow, so therefore it limits an appreciation for the city's other writers? Or do you think he offers a gateway through which a reader can explore more of the city's authors?
Miri: think that Roth put Nork on the map in a really cool way and just revisits it over time in the sense that it becomes a longitudinal study for him. And that's really a cool historical way to look at this space. It's where he, you he's born into this space. And then as he grows, the city is growing and changing and that's always in interplay with his life. I know that American Pastoral seems like the big, Norke novel, but even in, Exit Ghost, where he leaves the Berkshires to come back to the city, there's this idea that, both of those aren't home. I love Eggs a Ghost because it's a beautiful example of Roth's regionalism. In American literary studies around Roth, Ross Posnack is the big, he was on my dissertation committee, but he was a big name and a big thinker outside the box of Roth's regional, like, For Posnack, Roth's regionalism is about Hawthorne and Emerson and Thoreau and Roth seeking out this bucolic, but in the same way that those writers need New England, a kind of America that we think of as maybe conventional or kind of conventional America. Scarlet Letter, just early stuff. Roth kind of did that same thing for New Jersey
and for Newark and all of the surrounding areas. That's my extension of Posnack's argument there.
Tim Castano: How do you think his work speaks to an audience today, both within Newark or outside of Newark Is it still echoing
Miri: I mean, certainly there's a pattern, not just in New Jersey and Newark, but of the white flight and gentrification and what it means to be American. So if we think about the plot against America, which takes place as a pseudo history or parallel. history to his own life and his family is there living in Newark. There's an idea that Newark isn't American enough for America. Like you have to go out and be a farmer. You have to go out and become, whiter. Newarkism is too ethnic in this novel. And I think Roth is saying, no, it's not. It's beautiful. All of this is beautiful. And if we don't see it, it will wipe out all of this diversity that comes with immigration.
Tim Castano: his works always have a sense of place. if you were leading a Philip Roth tour around the city, what site would you visit? Where would you take someone?
Miri: I recently had a Fulbright visiting from Italy studying Roth, because in Italy and Europe in general, Roth is considered quintessential American literature. And they know about Newark, New Jersey. in a way that maybe some people who are American don't even know about it. So she came to stay with me for six months and I set her up with John Wesley Johnson Jr. who is a historian of Newark and really understands the ways that highway construction in the area turned Newark into a It used to be that you could walk, you know, it was was Shabbos, you can't drive your car, you could walk from Newark to your grandparents and, you know, Elizabeth. But now that the highways are put in, Newark just became very boxed in. John Wesley Johnson, Jr. really is able to tell the whole full story about that. so my footprint went to hobbies and she started eating her pastrami sandwich with a fork and a knife and You know after going in there and saying where did Philip Roth sit, you know, where did tell me where Tell me what to do and they said well Philip Roth will not be able to handle you eating your pastrami with a fork and knife
Tim Castano: Ha ha ha.
Miri: So I would say, yeah, to go there, to go to his house, which has a plaque and you can get a good sense of the scale. I feel like when I imagined the house that Roth was discussing, his childhood home, maybe because he was a child and when you're a child, you think things are going to feel bigger, but his house was so small. And it was just one floor of that house that this whole world of imagination and ideas came out of. So that's a really good place to visit. I would also say the Philip Roth Personal Library in the North Public Library is a must. The exhibit there is phenomenal. And for scholars, you can get a sense, you can go visit Roth's text. in Newark in the library and imagine him in the library kind of in goodbye Columbus and feeling his ghost in
that space and feeling his ghost come off the pages in his marginalia of the few books that he did put a lot of marginalia into like Kafka and Hawthorne. So you can visit his books and know what he read. And then, you you want to take a walk around the Ironbound district and the Weequah neighborhood, which is vastly different. think I told you my family is from there. Well, at first they lived on top of the Blue Ribbon Bakery on Broad Street. But then they managed to move over to the Weequah section and behind there, it was like an eight apartment house where my whole family from everywhere lived. They actually had a farm in the backyard where they would have to hire people to help them to harvest because it was so big. And I think when people think about Newark as an urban space, they're not necessarily understanding Roths Newark and the Newark of my family, which was not. like that at all. It had these amazing parks and places that you could go to look at water and to be American because you made it into a pastoral space.
Tim: While Philip Roth ultimately graduated from Bucknell University, he began his studies at Rutgers University, Newark, whose creative writing program educates the next generation of authors, Award-winning poet and author Rigoberto Gonzalez serves as a distinguished professor of English and creative writing at Rutgers.
Tim Castano: what draws the next generation of writers to refine their skills in Newark?
Rigoberto González: Let's see, you know, I've been a professor at Rutgers University in Newark now for think 17, 18 years. And from the very beginning, I've been part of the writing program, which is about 17, 18 years, the graduate program, the MFA, at Rutgers Newark. And the intention of that program was to not only... or invite writers from all over the country, all over the world, but also New Jersey and maybe even Newark, because we did know that there were so many schools around our campus and there are all these programs that are allowing or they're showing the students that this place exists so that that is an option for whenever they think about the future. But this was another way in which Newark, Rutgers Newark could actually place itself on the map as a part of the literary history. It already has a huge jazz history, but I think there's a sort of less known literary history that's here in Newark, New Jersey. So the MFA program is gonna be part of this and it has been part of this for past 18 years. And with that comes the, not only the opportunity to be in this particular location, which is not far from New York City as part of the draw, but also the faculty that we have. have incredible writers that are part of the program, John Keane, the MacArthur Fellow. We have Brenda Shanathy, my colleague in poetry, Alice Elia Dark, Akil Kumarasami, and also Naomi Jackson and Simian Marsalis. I mean, we have such a great group of people who are invested in looking at voices that are particularly marginalized or come from marginalized communities. and helping them shape their vision of their writing and also their vision of themselves as writers. And so this is what you promise at the Rutgers New Work MFA program.
Tim Castano: You once said, our writing, all art, does not happen in a vacuum. It has to reflect, it has to mirror, it has to push back. How does Newark play a part in this dynamic? How does the city engage with poets, authors, and artists in their creative process?
Rigoberto González: Well, even though the word diversity is sort of being muted or is being edged off the conversations about education and also interactions in our everyday lives, that is one of the important components of Newark identity is diversity. It has a very long history of negotiating with both racial tensions and racial collaborations. It also has an incredible social justice movement history. Activism is an important part of Newark identity. And I think many of our young writers who come here are also part of that. They're also invested or thinking about the ways in which writing can be activism or in ways that they can participate in a community like Newark. There are a number of programs that we have that allow our students to lead workshops or to conduct workshops in the community of Newark, not only the schools, but also the libraries and community spaces. We work in collaboration with the Dodge Poetry Festival and also with the New Jersey Performing Arts Center, both incredible presences here in the city of Newark. So those two plus Rutgers Newark, the campus, I mean, there's a lot of talent, there's a lot of desire to do something that just kind of sit here and let people come to us. How can we go to the community? And so the draw is really this very diverse group of communities that surround us and the way that our students would like to be part of that. They want to interact. They want to be present. They want to share their knowledge or understanding, even their skills as writers in the community.
Tim Castano: In your reflections on your personal development, you have noted there wasn't a place for us. Do you believe Rutgers Newark has become the place you would have envisioned for yourself when you were beginning your journey as a writer?
Rigoberto González: Well, let me tell you a funny thing about just the word Newark. You know, the first time I encountered that place was watching a film, I think it was in 1990s, and they were making fun of Newark as a place. And it sounded like this place, Newark, I was in California. was living in California at the time. And I've never been to New York City or even New Jersey in the 1990s. was, you know, still kind of moving from teenage years to my 20s. And then when I got to the job and I began to see, and I did come with all these things in mind thinking about this Newark place. But once I got, once you're in the center of it, you see that that perspective is just one dimension. It's just one opinion or one point of view
among many in this place. Because the second time or the other important time that I heard about Newark, even before I came to the East Coast, was through a book that I had read. I think it was the first book in English that I had read that made quite an impression of me, and that was Stephen Crane's The Red Badge of Courage, which was a Civil War novel, right? And then come to find out that he was actually born in Newark, right? And that novel, I think, was published in like 1895. He was like, what, 24, I think, when he published that book. And that book made such an impression on me, both because of this character, this young man who had to deal with his sense of being, also the feeling like a coward, feeling like he wasn't courageous enough to be a hero. But also the Civil War, the American Civil War, which I knew nothing about because as an immigrant, I knew nothing about it. And it taught me so much, taught me a dimensionality about Civil War, about American-ness and about being yourself that I was really surprised by. And I thought, well, OK, this is is Newark too. that's one of the reasons that I really feel at home here, despite the fact that I'm now I would be like what upper class, upper middle class. But the thing is that I come from very working class, low income household and living. And I am sort of the you know, as much as people say, the American dream is dead or, you know, social mobility is impossible. And I think it is difficult. It's become more difficult. But, you know, I'm proof that it's possible, you know, with my parents not being literate, being migrant farm workers, being undocumented. And here I am, a professor at Rutgers Newark. And so I see myself in a lot of my students, particularly my undergraduates. Most of them are first generation students. And I see myself in the streets with young people. They have to tackle all these challenges. They have to... not live in a world where there is so much anxiety and uncertainty and they have dreams and they have directions that they want to take and all the rest of us can do is either get out of the way or help them out, you know.
Tim Castano: you just mentioned Stephen Crane. Are there other particular writers from Newark to whom you refer your students as examples?
Rigoberto González: absolutely. You know, it's such an amazing list of writers that have actually been born here. Not that many of them left soon after that or they never came back. Some like Philip Roth, of course, he even includes Newark in his literature. and then there's actually another Pulitzer Prize winning writer from Newark and that's C.K. Williams, know, one that I think it was also around the same time as Philip Rothman, the Pulitzer for a book of poetry by the name of Repair. Alan Ginsberg was born in Newark. I mean, you can't forget not only that, he's also buried in Newark. Right. And I knew about Philip Rothman and Alan Ginsberg because when I when I officially moved in order to 2025, and I've been
working here since, you know, 18 years ago, I actually moved here the week before the shutdown. So that was interesting to have that experience of moving to a place and then staying put for a year and a half. But during that time when I was going out walking, I ran across the mural there on McCarter Highway. And that's, you know, I saw Ellen Ginsburg, go, what's Ellen Ginsburg doing here? Is that Philip Roth? What's Philip Roth doing here? And that's when I realized, okay, this is Newark. With these two writers, Paul Oster also born here. the other one that's important, outside from me, Baraka, and also his partner, Amino, also think born in Newark. And then Ross, course, the Baraka dynasty, not only of- in politics, but also in poetry. There was also, my gosh, Helen Zia. Helen Zia is an important figure only because of the way, think she was in, she had moved to Detroit, right? Moved to Detroit. And that's where the Vincent Chin murder, the sort of the ushered in this consciousness about Asian-American in this country. And so she wrote a couple of books about the history of immigration. from China to the United States, and particularly to, I think her family was Shanghai, and they moved to Newark, they were here in Newark when she was born. So as a social justice figure, as somebody who's very interested in not only bringing her entire self or her identity, but also the community into the writing, it's an incredible example for our students to learn from. And then I think that the youngest person that I know of, and I don't know what his age is, know he's a little bit younger than I am, but that's Kyle Dargan. Kyle Dargan, an incredible poet. I've known him for a very long time. His first book is called The Book of Hungers. I think he's written a number, like five after that. But he's a professor now at American University in DC. And I used to run into him at the... yearly at the Association of Writers and Writing Programs, the ADVP conference every year.
Tim Castano: You have said, to me, a cultured life means having access to the intelligence, curiosity, beauty, mystery, imagination, and insight that's possible through books, through interactions with thinkers, artists, and activists. How does Newark allow for one to experience this cultured life?
Rigoberto González: Well, this I learned, you know, in or I began to really appreciate during the shutdown is that when I couldn't move and yet I knew that Newark had this airport, had this, you know, the Penn Station. And so there are many ways out of out of here and to Newark and a place that is at the center of so much movement is bound to have so many cultural interactions from people all over the all over the world. We definitely see that on our campus. I see that on the streets. I definitely see that in even some of the issues that are brought on in this. I we have like the couple of performance, not only the NJPAC, but also the Prudential Center. So it seems like this place is a place already
sort of seen as an important location for bringing people together and also not only that, but just mediums, right? So there's so much access to different, so you know there's jazz happening, there's music happening, there's literature happening, there's art happening here in Newark. And so that kind of energy is a little bit different than the kind of energy that I remember in New York City. New York City, I remember moving in 1998, I was very overwhelmed and I felt like, okay, I'm part of this flood that's moving through and maybe... somebody will notice me, maybe they won't. But here in Newark, it's a different kind of movement, even though there's still a lot of cultural movement. But it doesn't feel as overwhelming, perhaps because it is on a smaller scale, definitely. But there's also the arts that are appreciated here. You have to slow down, you have to pause, you have to stop, you have to sit to appreciate them. And I think that that really helps me understand that, okay, now I can sit next to it, I can sit in front of it, I can walk by it, not feel like I'm being pushed by it. And so I think that makes a little bit difference in the of like the psyche and sort of how am I perceiving the way that art is being made, shared, created, expressed in a place like this. It really does make a big difference. I feel like everything's accessible because, And not only because it'll be easy to say, oh, because it's not as big, it's not that much, but it's not about quality, it's about quality. It's about what is being presented, what is being shown. And again, I keep going back to like this diversity where I appreciate that there are conversations happening in the art that I'm interested in. I'm interested in social justice, I'm interested in diversity, I'm interested in cultural collaborations and collisions. So that's happening.
Tim Castano: what are your thoughts on the next generation, the upcoming generation of writers from Dora?
Rigoberto González: I came across this understanding about particularly Latino literature when I was putting together the Library of America anthology. And when I was doing that, I wanted to open up a space in that anthology for spoken word artists, because they knew that spoken word was an important medium that young people were gravitating toward. And I was very delighted to learn that there's so many spoken word organizations. in the city of Newark alone. But young people are, you know, exploring this medium as a way of self-expression, as a way of, you know, just dealing with so much that's sort of being laid at their feet or on their heads because, you know, we've, the thinking is that we're supposed to come into this world and leave it better for the next generation. It seems like we're going the other way around. And we've been doing that for a while now. We can't just blame it on today's, this is going on for a while. We're leaving the world in a worse shaped than it was. And I really do feel that. And so the frustration then are these young people to have to talk back, push back, or they cry, or celebrate their own sense of what is joy and beauty. Everything needs a space to be and to exist and to be heard, right? And so spoken word has been that choice and one of the mediums for young people. And so it's been exciting. I know that there's spoken word component to a lot of activities happening at the NJPAC. And I've gone to some of those and they're exciting. Young people, there's a lot of grief, a lot of pain, but also there's a lot of strength. There's a lot of joy as well. So it's not just, you know, we're going to tell the sad stories. No, there's also joyful stories that need to be told and that are being told. And spoken word is definitely one. So I'm really excited to know that that's happening here in Newark among many other places. But that particular medium is important to young people. And it's incredible to see how much it thrives and how much of themselves young people are placing into the work.
Tim: Norwork, New Jersey. Proud home to a long, distinguished literary history. One that continues to write itself today and well into the future. One deserving of a lit trip.