Full Transcript for Night in the Woods

think people who play video games will take it a little 48 00:05:38,880 --> 00:05:47,280 bit more personally when you can't just be the good person, you know? I do. I think it's like, 49 00:05:49,600 --> 00:05:55,600 when you can't do what you want with a video game character, it feels different than when you're 50 00:05:55,600 --> 00:06:01,680 reading a somewhat unredeemable protagonist in other media. Yeah, we had similar issues and we 51 00:06:01,680 --> 00:06:09,040 played, we had similar issues with Pentamans, right? Oh yeah. Where like, it was by the character 52 00:06:09,040 --> 00:06:14,800 kind of like living, the protagonist kind of like living on their own a little bit. There's like 53 00:06:14,800 --> 00:06:20,480 that disconnect between player and player character. I would like to, I'd like to explain 54 00:06:20,480 --> 00:06:26,640 myself a little bit for my dislike of May, right? I think this actually ties in really well to a 55 00:06:26,640 --> 00:06:31,840 point I made with the last episode that released, which at time of recording was Chickery, A 56 00:06:31,840 --> 00:06:38,240 Colorful Tale. I think you can tell a lot about the experience of the writers by how they portray 57 00:06:38,240 --> 00:06:44,160 certain things in the things they write. I think obviously everyone knows this, right? So what I 58 00:06:44,160 --> 00:06:49,600 was trying to say in Chickery, A Colorful Tale is you can tell a lot about the experience that the 59 00:06:49,600 --> 00:06:56,000 writers have with people who ask them for help or the times that they've had to like, read 60 00:06:56,000 --> 00:07:03,040 books, like the, the, how they think about sort of responsibility by how they portray the people 61 00:07:03,040 --> 00:07:08,880 who asked pizza for help in Chickery, right? How they like kind of portrayed them as pushy in some 62 00:07:08,880 --> 00:07:17,120 instances. I think in this game where one of the major themes is like maturing, growing up and 63 00:07:17,120 --> 00:07:23,440 leaving behind sort of the immaturity and lack of responsibility of being a child, you can learn a 64 00:07:23,440 --> 00:07:30,480 lot about what the authors think by how they characterize May as the immature character. 65 00:07:31,680 --> 00:07:39,120 And the thing that I personally found grating was that there were certain aspects of her that I 66 00:07:39,120 --> 00:07:48,320 really related with in her character, characterization as immature, her hesitance to take on new 67 00:07:48,320 --> 00:07:55,840 responsibilities, her inability to view things through a lens of like, you know, the mundanity 68 00:07:55,840 --> 00:08:02,080 of everyday work and things like that. And then there are aspects to her character that I thought 69 00:08:02,080 --> 00:08:12,480 that's like, to me seemed like, seemed to be also communicating an immaturity, but like not in any 70 00:08:12,480 --> 00:08:20,080 way that I think any myself or any reasonable person would ever act like being completely 71 00:08:20,080 --> 00:08:28,560 oblivious to people's economic situation or like in some ways just like very unbelievably for the, 72 00:08:28,560 --> 00:08:34,400 the situation I'm referring to specifically is the scene where you have a conversation with your 73 00:08:34,400 --> 00:08:43,600 best friend B in her bedroom. And you know, B is relating to you like, you know, my mom died, my 74 00:08:43,600 --> 00:08:50,400 dad is medically doing not good. I have to take over the hardware store and support us. We lost 75 00:08:50,400 --> 00:08:57,840 the house and you know, B and May is just like, Oh, well you always have a choice, you know, like 76 00:08:57,840 --> 00:09:02,480 you can choose not to do this. You could choose to go to college. And it's like, well, you know, 77 00:09:02,480 --> 00:09:07,120 you're just like ignoring the things she said, you're being like a huge asshole about it. And 78 00:09:07,760 --> 00:09:16,880 these things don't match like a realistic experience for me. It's not realistic, 79 00:09:16,880 --> 00:09:24,800 right? But that's to me. So, sorry, Buck. You know, the idea, if, if the idea, right, is that 80 00:09:24,800 --> 00:09:32,560 May is immature, then it would make sense that she's going to have a more idealistic outlook 81 00:09:32,560 --> 00:09:39,840 on things as opposed to the rest of her friend group who have kind of matured past her. You know, 82 00:09:39,840 --> 00:09:44,800 there's, there's a good line and like somewhere in the game where it's like, you know, being an 83 00:09:44,800 --> 00:09:52,880 adult isn't about, you know, turning a certain age or hitting a certain milestone. Being adult is 84 00:09:52,880 --> 00:09:58,160 like more of like a state of mind. I don't remember exactly. I think it is B who says something along 85 00:09:58,160 --> 00:10:05,600 those lines. You know, people like, she's talking about like people growing up past May, when May 86 00:10:05,600 --> 00:10:12,320 tries to point out that she's like two months older, yeah, two years older or something. And 87 00:10:13,680 --> 00:10:20,480 I think that, I think that's just part of it, right? Is like, there is a kernel of truth in a lot of 88 00:10:20,480 --> 00:10:28,160 the things that May says, like, yeah, at the end of the day, B, Bay does have a choice, right? She 89 00:10:28,160 --> 00:10:36,480 could choose to do that, but in reality, obviously it's not that simple to make those decisions. 90 00:10:36,480 --> 00:10:45,120 I, I need to push back on the believability. I think someone thinking like that in that situation, 91 00:10:45,120 --> 00:10:52,240 especially someone characterized like May up to that point in the game, I could totally see 92 00:10:52,240 --> 00:10:59,600 someone keeping doing that. I mean, you just cringed at me. I mean, look, dude, I spent years 93 00:10:59,600 --> 00:11:07,600 talking to teenagers for eight hours a day. There are people that think like this. 94 00:11:07,600 -->

00:11:16,720 I don't think there aren't. I mean, like, it's just that there's a certain, there's a certain 95 00:11:16,720 --> 00:11:30,320 friction that happens when you, you know, how do I want to word this? Like you see a social situation 96 00:11:30,320 --> 00:11:35,200 like devolving and all of your dialogue options are just like the worst thing you could possibly 97 00:11:35,200 --> 00:11:43,040 say. And I know like, you know, the artist has a very specific like vision for how they want to 98 00:11:43,040 --> 00:11:51,280 portray how the scene goes down. And I, you know, I want to see that, but it's just very strange 99 00:11:52,240 --> 00:11:57,120 to be like, okay, well now you choose between these two identical text options that are both like, 100 00:11:57,120 --> 00:12:04,880 both like the worst possible things you can say. So now you feel like personally immersed 101 00:12:04,880 --> 00:12:10,400 in this scene with these things that I think like anyone with even a modicum of social awareness 102 00:12:10,960 --> 00:12:17,920 would never say. And then it's like turning up May's like worst qualities to like 10. 103 00:12:17,920 --> 00:12:25,280 I think you're overestimating the ability of a lot of 20 year olds with no direction. 104 00:12:27,600 --> 00:12:33,680 It could be just a disconnect between myself. It could be just a disconnect between myself and May 105 00:12:33,680 --> 00:12:40,400 as a main character, because like, I know that, you know, I'm not going to say that like I matured 106 00:12:40,400 --> 00:12:43,680 very fast or I was like a very mature young person in a lot of ways. I think I'm very 107 00:12:44,400 --> 00:12:50,160 still immature and irresponsible, but like, I think like one of the first things I learned 108 00:12:50,160 --> 00:12:58,080 and one of the simplest things to grasp is like, don't just like say like very straightforwardly 109 00:12:58,080 --> 00:13:01,680 antagonistic things to people who are in vulnerable positions. Cause that makes you like, 110 00:13:01,680 --> 00:13:10,640 want like a huge scumbag. And that seemed to, you know, it seemed like in a lot of ways, 111 00:13:11,600 --> 00:13:19,680 the writing was trying to get me to buy into the fact that May wasn't a scumbag. She wasn't a 112 00:13:19,680 --> 00:13:26,400 terrible person. She just had a lot of growing up to do. Well, I think a big part of May's character 113 00:13:26,400 --> 00:13:36,720 is at some point her parents stopped being active in her upbringing. And that I, I don't know why 114 00:13:36,720 --> 00:13:40,320 you disagree with me. No, no, I'm not disagreeing. I'm just thinking about it. I'm sorry. My facial 115 00:13:40,320 --> 00:13:43,920 expression is kind of betraying a different thought that I'm just trying to wrap my head around. 116 00:13:43,920 --> 00:13:49,840 I think you're right, Buck. Cause I, I think part of the reason why, 117 00:13:49,840 --> 00:13:54,400 to me at least the way it reads is part of the reason why May had such a close relationship 118 00:13:54,400 --> 00:14:01,600 with her grandfather is because her grandfather was more, I don't know if more, her grandfather 119 00:14:01,600 --> 00:14:07,360 played a bigger parental role while her parents got more distant as a result of 120 00:14:09,520 --> 00:14:16,800 the living conditions of the town. Yeah. And like there's multiple things that you can do 121 00:14:16,800 --> 00:14:24,240 to help you get out of the town. I mean, I assume we're going to be talking about this game in bits 122 00:14:24,240 --> 00:14:31,040 and pieces, but like I would like to kind of zoom in on this point here. You know that May 123 00:14:32,080 --> 00:14:38,720 and her mom were abused by her father at some point. You know that May almost killed someone. 124 00:14:38,720 --> 00:14:51,200 Right. And I think a lot of, and you also find out eventually that May has a very severe mental 125 00:14:51,200 --> 00:15:00,480 condition. Like it's very severe. So I think her parents started to distance themselves 126 00:15:01,600 --> 00:15:07,600 from her upbringing. So May doesn't really have an understanding of responsibility at this point. 127 00:15:07,600 --> 00:15:14,880 Right. I don't think May understands what accountability is because I think her parents 128 00:15:15,440 --> 00:15:21,840 stepped away from that accountability and with her grandfather dying, she just kind of got to do what 129 00:15:21,840 --> 00:15:29,520 she wanted to do because I think her parents were scared to engage past a certain point at one point. 130 00:15:29,520 --> 00:15:36,880 And they just thought that if she went off on her own, like if they just stuck with the plan, 131 00:15:37,440 --> 00:15:43,920 that she could have figured it out herself. But I don't think she had the tools to actually do that 132 00:15:44,800 --> 00:15:49,520 because of how she was brought up. And I mean, I'm drawing, I'm making some assumptions here 133 00:15:49,520 --> 00:15:55,520 because we're not given the full picture, but that's kind of how I see it is that, 134 00:15:55,520 --> 00:16:02,080 because May doesn't even know about her own family's financial position. So seeing someone else's, 135 00:16:03,040 --> 00:16:10,480 I think that's part of why she doesn't see it with May. I mean, even without the context of 136 00:16:11,360 --> 00:16:20,320 everything about the parents, there is a whole like concept that the parents have to redeem themselves 137 00:16:20,320 --> 00:16:28,320 to May just from literally forgetting her at the bus station on the first night that she gets back 138 00:16:28,320 --> 00:16:35,760 from college because they just got the dates wrong. From the very drop of the game, 139 00:16:35,760 --> 00:16:44,000 you get the concepts that May's parents aren't, I don't want to say negligent, but there is an 140 00:16:44,000 --> 00:16:54,720 aspect of like absenteeism. I think I interpreted a lot of very different, I mean, I don't think 141 00:16:54,720

--> 00:17:00,160 that what you guys are saying are wrong. I think it's a valid reading before I start going off on 142 00:17:00,160 --> 00:17:08,640 how I read this very differently. So this isn't like a big, I disagree thing. But what I kind of 143 00:17:08,640 --> 00:17:16,240 took away were all these very heartwarming moments and how good the relationship between May and her 144 00:17:16,240 --> 00:17:22,640 parents are that they could just pick up where they left off and have this very sweet and 145 00:17:22,640 --> 00:17:28,320 compassionate relationship even after May has done this really inconsiderate thing to them, 146 00:17:29,120 --> 00:17:34,880 which is dropping out of college after they really stuck their neck out to get her there. 147 00:17:34,880 --> 00:17:41,040 Well, I mean, I'm also not excusing May for not taking accountability for her stuff, right? That's 148 00:17:41,040 --> 00:17:53,040 the other thing is that May's not a great person. So I think part of their inability to get her to 149 00:17:53,040 --> 00:17:59,840 understand accountability or unwillingness to is they actively avoid conflict with her. 150 00:17:59,840 --> 00:18:08,080 You know, they actively avoid conflict with her, right? So because they don't want to feel that, 151 00:18:09,280 --> 00:18:15,680 and I mean, I don't know, I have seen situations like this. 152 00:18:16,960 --> 00:18:26,160 This is like a very common look to me at small town politeness and like small town appearances 153 00:18:26,160 --> 00:18:35,840 where when you live in a place with so few people, there is a certain air of 154 00:18:38,480 --> 00:18:44,480 keeping up the outward appearance of what your family is. Like what, because the family unit 155 00:18:44,480 --> 00:18:58,160 in places like this, like, you know, probably fairly conservative and obviously strong religious 156 00:18:58,160 --> 00:19:03,280 values. There is like a concept where the family unit becomes so important and you don't want to 157 00:19:03,280 --> 00:19:11,760 become the ire of the town. And we'll kind of get to this later where as a failing of a family, 158 00:19:11,760 --> 00:19:19,600 you're now like a public enemy of everyone in town. So I think there is an air of like having to keep 159 00:19:19,600 --> 00:19:30,480 up the appearances. And I do think there is a level of, you know, I still think that May's 160 00:19:30,480 --> 00:19:35,280 parents love her and care about her. I don't think it's like, and that's why I didn't want to say like, 161 00:19:35,280 --> 00:19:42,480 you know, they're negligent because I don't think they're negligent. They're just, I think they're 162 00:19:42,480 --> 00:19:49,120 like, there are aspects of May and May's life that they don't want to be as involved in. 163 00:19:49,840 --> 00:19:56,160 Or they don't know how to, they don't have the tools to deal with how to breach subjects with her. 164 00:19:58,640 --> 00:20:02,080 I think it speaks a lot to the quality of the game

that we were able to, 165 00:20:02,080 --> 00:20:07,520 we were able to, and well, I mean, like we were, we all, it seems to me, 166 00:20:08,560 --> 00:20:15,200 like read into this and related like very personal parts of our own lives and relationships. Like 167 00:20:15,760 --> 00:20:20,640 for instance, like with our own parents and where we were in our lives in a certain upbringing, 168 00:20:21,600 --> 00:20:28,880 kind of into the, into the game, right? It captures really well a lot of these feelings, 169 00:20:28,880 --> 00:20:34,320 you know, in a lot of ways, in a lot of very contradictory ways, even very, very well. 170 00:20:35,200 --> 00:20:40,320 That's why, and that's why I think May is such a great protagonist because for all of the 171 00:20:41,520 --> 00:20:49,280 inane bat shit, just crazy backwards things that she does, she says there is still a level 172 00:20:49,280 --> 00:20:59,760 of like truth in her as a character, even, even like the grinding things that she does. And she 173 00:20:59,760 --> 00:21:08,960 says, it's like, well, I would not say this ever in polite, you know, conversation. 174 00:21:08,960 --> 00:21:11,200 Even among friends, I think she says. 175 00:21:11,200 --> 00:21:20,560 But, you know, I think I know how to say this. May is just intrusive thoughts personified. 176 00:21:22,880 --> 00:21:27,120 Maybe. I mean, she literally has them. Yeah. Like, 177 00:21:28,560 --> 00:21:33,600 I don't, like, I don't know that that might not necessarily been what the writers were going for 178 00:21:33,600 --> 00:21:39,840 specifically, but like, when, you know, when you think about it, like, you know, 179 00:21:39,840 --> 00:21:43,920 you know, when you think about intrusive thoughts, you're like, I would never say that. May is just 180 00:21:43,920 --> 00:21:48,240 like, that's just the thing I'm going to say. I'm going to say that thing. I just thought. 181 00:21:48,240 --> 00:21:52,720 I think another thing that made me feel pretty bad about playing May is the fact that I related 182 00:21:52,720 --> 00:21:57,280 a lot more strongly with Greg and that he was right there the whole game. And I, you know, 183 00:21:57,280 --> 00:21:59,840 a lot of times I would think like, man, I wish I was playing like the Greg game, 184 00:22:00,400 --> 00:22:05,360 not the May game, you know, I mean, I think it really, and I think that just speaks to how 185 00:22:05,360 --> 00:22:11,920 strong the characters are in this game that I think if you were to play any of the core cast, 186 00:22:12,560 --> 00:22:19,360 if you were to play May, Greg, B, Jerm, Angus to a lesser extent, you would still get like a 187 00:22:20,160 --> 00:22:28,880 very interesting and phenomenal game. But like, so like a little bit more pushback on it being the 188 00:22:28,880 --> 00:22:36,480 May game, isn't it the B game or the Greg game? Kind of. I mean, you do play as May and a lot of 189 00:22:36,480 --> 00:22:39,440 your other interactions with the

world are as May, but like your primary choice is like- 190 00:22:39,440 --> 00:22:44,320 I'm just talking about like the lens that you're looking through to the game is like, 191 00:22:44,320 --> 00:22:48,720 I wish it could be Greg. I wish I could have all these like intimate immersive moments that you 192 00:22:48,720 --> 00:22:54,080 have with May that are really good. I wish I could have them as Greg because I personally relate to 193 00:22:54,080 --> 00:23:00,320 like Greg is a lot like me in a lot of ways. Just goofy guy. Yeah. He's like even like- 194 00:23:00,320 --> 00:23:10,000 Doing crimes. Even down to small details. Illegally owns weapons. That was a joke. That was legally a 195 00:23:10,000 --> 00:23:20,400 joke. Stole an animatronic. Stole lots of food line property. Breaks his company's property. 196 00:23:20,400 --> 00:23:28,640 Yeah. He's just like me for real. Let's talk. So let's, I guess this is a good time transition. 197 00:23:28,640 --> 00:23:33,920 Let's talk about, let's talk about Greg. Greg, I've- He's like one of the best characters in 198 00:23:33,920 --> 00:23:40,720 the game. He's like, I mean like not even in the sense that he's like a protagonist and a good guy 199 00:23:40,720 --> 00:23:47,040 and I love seeing him win, but just like, he's like really well written and he embodies a lot of the 200 00:23:47,040 --> 00:23:54,880 central struggle of the game really well in the, in the sort of, I've used the word friction a lot. 201 00:23:54,880 --> 00:24:00,640 I don't want to use it again. In the sort of like turbulence that happens in between wanting to hold 202 00:24:00,640 --> 00:24:06,640 on to the fun childlike wonder of being a young person and then like the responsibility and the 203 00:24:06,640 --> 00:24:13,520 mundanity of being like an older person and he, he like, he hits the balance so well of like what, 204 00:24:13,520 --> 00:24:20,240 what that time is like. I'm actually like, I'm a little disappointed that I was initially kind 205 00:24:20,240 --> 00:24:27,920 of averse to Greg because like I didn't think Greg was what May needed, right? And like, so I did the 206 00:24:27,920 --> 00:24:36,000 the B route, but I went and watched some of the Greg hangout things and I think ultimately where 207 00:24:36,000 --> 00:24:44,080 Greg ends up is Greg is May, but reacting to the circumstances kind of like a normal person. 208 00:24:44,080 --> 00:24:47,920 Yeah. You know, like, yeah, that's what I was thinking. Like eventually you learn that like 209 00:24:48,480 --> 00:24:53,600 Greg is just like someone who's handling the spot. He's in way better than May, but they're in a very 210 00:24:53,600 --> 00:25:01,120 similar spot, but yeah, I love him. He's just like this dude who wants to hold onto these, like all 211 00:25:01,120 --> 00:25:08,240 the good parts of like childhood. I feel, I feel that way a lot. He's someone who like very 212 00:25:08,240 --> 00:25:15,440 miraculously is romantically involved with this person who seems to be like so much a better person 213 00:25:16,080 --> 00:25:20,880 and everyone around him is vexed. I feel very, I relate to that a lot. 214 00:25:20,880 --> 00:25:31,680 Yeah. Greg has this really cool, I mean, it's like a, this is a stereotype that's done a lot 215 00:25:31,680 --> 00:25:36,640 in media where it's, but it's like big goofball who seriously has a lot of inner turmoil. 216 00:25:38,800 --> 00:25:44,960 You know, there was a time where my one moment from this game was the scene where you, I don't 217 00:25:44,960 --> 00:25:49,040 know if either of you did this, but you go into the woods with Greg, you go to the lake and you 218 00:25:49,040 --> 00:25:56,960 take out the crossbow and you like shoot at the decoy deer and Greg just talks about how 219 00:25:58,320 --> 00:26:03,840 he struggles with, in his relationship with like believing that he's good enough 220 00:26:04,800 --> 00:26:14,400 and that he is an adequate fit for Angus. And you know, even, even if you go with B, 221 00:26:14,400 --> 00:26:19,200 you know, there, there's a scene with B where she is like, oh yeah, I think they're definitely 222 00:26:19,200 --> 00:26:24,640 going to break up. Angus is going to like realize he has better options and just leave Greg for 223 00:26:24,640 --> 00:26:30,880 sure. That's a hundred percent going to happen. And so I think, and I don't know, it's just really, 224 00:26:32,320 --> 00:26:36,560 because it's one of those things where it's like, this is a stereotype, but they handled it very 225 00:26:36,560 --> 00:26:43,360 well because it very easily could have been like corny or cheesy, but like Greg is such a likeable 226 00:26:43,360 --> 00:26:51,440 they do such a good job of like painting Greg as a likeable character. And well written. Yeah. Like 227 00:26:51,440 --> 00:26:57,440 the way he communicates his feelings just feels very natural to how he's characterized. Yeah. 228 00:26:58,480 --> 00:27:05,520 It's not, it's not like he goes from this like, oh, you're back. Oh, I love that you're back. Let's 229 00:27:05,520 --> 00:27:13,920 go do band practice. And he's like, my life is such a struggle. Everything is so hard all the time. 230 00:27:13,920 --> 00:27:20,480 It's like, it feels very real. It's very funny that I very funny that he's like, everything's 231 00:27:20,480 --> 00:27:25,120 so hard all the time when he works at a gas station leaves early all the time and is constantly just 232 00:27:25,120 --> 00:27:30,560 like stealing from work and doing fun shit. Cause like today I have decided at work that you and I 233 00:27:30,560 --> 00:27:35,840 are going to get a bat and smash all the neon lights, the new unused neon lights. And then I'm 234 00:27:35,840 --> 00:27:41,200 going to cut out early. And he's like, this is so exhausting. Sometimes I'm going to throw a glass 235 00:27:41,200 --> 00:27:48,800 bottle at you. And then he's like, work is so exhausting. Like, motherfucker, no, it is

not. 236 00:27:48,800 --> 00:27:56,480 No, he's, he's can't let him cook. He's kind of cooking. Greg's great. Now they're the other 237 00:27:56,480 --> 00:28:04,400 masterfully written character as good as Greg B. He's also great for similar reasons and, and some 238 00:28:04,400 --> 00:28:11,360 different reasons, but like a lot, a lot the same, she really captures that moment in life for, you 239 00:28:11,360 --> 00:28:16,240 know, some, some of us, it's been us, some of us, it's been someone we know, someone like 240 00:28:16,240 --> 00:28:24,400 economically trapped, right? Someone stuck in hometown, someone who is ambitious and has a lot 241 00:28:24,400 --> 00:28:29,680 of potential, but like has been completely starved of opportunities for reasons outside of their 242 00:28:29,680 --> 00:28:36,320 control. Someone who definitely takes the things in their life seriously, like fashion and art and 243 00:28:37,040 --> 00:28:44,880 learning who just like, like you're so certain we'll just never get the chance to like fully 244 00:28:44,880 --> 00:28:55,760 explore those things. It's like crazy. Yeah. And just such a forgiving person too, right? Like, 245 00:28:55,760 --> 00:28:56,800 Oh yeah. 246 00:28:58,800 --> 00:29:04,560 Cause like every way more than she should be. Oh yeah, totally. But like, I mean, I think that's 247 00:29:04,560 --> 00:29:13,680 like her thing is like, I think maybe she's gone through what she has with her dad, but like, 248 00:29:13,680 --> 00:29:18,720 See, I don't necessarily agree that she's more forgiving than she should be. I think she's as 249 00:29:18,720 --> 00:29:24,400 forgiving as she has to be to be able to maintain some semblance of a regular life because the, all 250 00:29:24,400 --> 00:29:29,600 the friends that she's surrounded with are kind of shit heads. And it's like either she forgives 251 00:29:29,600 --> 00:29:34,800 them or she has no social life except for the once a month that she's able to sneak out to a 252 00:29:34,800 --> 00:29:41,120 college party and like live her facade of a normal life. So I think it's like, it's kind of, it's 253 00:29:41,120 --> 00:29:46,400 kind of her, that aspect of her personality is born out of necessity. I think it was like, I just 254 00:29:46,400 --> 00:29:51,200 have to forgive May and Greg when they're shit heads or else I have no friends. 255 00:29:52,160 --> 00:29:59,840 Well, you know, I think that whole scene with Jackie and Bay and May really just, 256 00:30:03,040 --> 00:30:06,640 I think it's just interesting to see Jackie who is just like, 257 00:30:06,640 --> 00:30:14,000 I don't want to say normal because she's definitely not normal on like a relative scale, but 258 00:30:14,960 --> 00:30:24,800 like a more level headed and adult like person, just like having to interact with this, with someone 259 00:30:24,800 --> 00:30:32,160 who very much has not moved past the more childlike aspects of their life and like how 260 00:30:32,160 --> 00:30:39,520 easy it is for them to identify the problems with May and just like call her out on the things that 261 00:30:39,520 --> 00:30:43,600 she does and the things that, and how she's behaved, you know. 262 00:30:45,680 --> 00:30:54,080 I mean, like also ask exactly how like you expect her to with like what May ends up doing. 263 00:30:54,080 --> 00:30:57,520 Yeah. Yeah. That's how a rational person would behave. 264 00:30:57,520 --> 00:31:07,120 In that situation. Well, cool. Just quick, a little cool, fun fact for y'all. Jackie was transgender. 265 00:31:07,120 --> 00:31:14,240 And this was not, this was not, they originally wrote her that way and they just forgot to put, 266 00:31:14,240 --> 00:31:19,760 put any like indication of it. Yeah. And then they added in like a later update 267 00:31:19,760 --> 00:31:25,360 that Jackie is in a band called something. Oh yeah. Yeah. No, I saw that earlier in the game. 268 00:31:25,360 --> 00:31:31,200 Actually, I saw that she's in a band. It's called, oh, it's like, like trans women, which wars or 269 00:31:31,200 --> 00:31:35,440 something. I forget. Yeah. But it's really cool. I saw it didn't click. It was the same character 270 00:31:35,440 --> 00:31:40,240 because, you know, she's like twice. Yeah. That seems really far apart, but yeah, 271 00:31:41,200 --> 00:31:45,040 that's really cool. No, but B is like, I think it's like, I think it's like, 272 00:31:45,040 --> 00:31:51,280 she's like difficult when she's, when she's running ya, and then she's also like trying 273 00:31:51,520 --> 00:31:55,760 not to deal with the other guys who have one, but some of it's, yeah, 274 00:31:56,640 --> 00:32:02,960 indeed. I can't really get into much detail about her. I know she's working for Dude, 275 00:32:02,960 --> 00:32:08,960 So I want to save that for later because she, he's a stripes and red corner. 276 00:32:09,120 --> 00:32:12,000 Yeah, I agree. She seems like they're jammin his fact. So yeah, 277 00:32:12,000 --> 00:32:16,920 With Greg you have them do a scene with B and then you're like alright pick one of these two people to hang out with 278 00:32:17,920 --> 00:32:20,460 Are gonna pick Greg because he's cool 279 00:32:21,640 --> 00:32:24,800 So I think that I think that is the hard part even I did that at first 280 00:32:24,800 --> 00:32:30,000 You know I eventually did some one of one of the scenes of people I went straight for B. Yeah 281 00:32:30,000 --> 00:32:35,400 I went straight for B. I was like I got to know like what's going on here. That was also my pull 282 00:32:35,400 --> 00:32:42,240 Yeah, I wanted to know what was going on because because of how weirdly nice she was to me like 283 00:32:42,600 --> 00:32:47,680 For me it was because the first interaction with her where she's like yeah 284 00:32:47,680 --> 00:32:48,520 I'll give you a ride home 285 00:32:48,520 --> 00:32:52,380 And then you're like how your parents doing and she's like get the fuck out of the car 286

00:32:52,380 --> 00:32:57,300 I was like well. I do want to mend this fence because I think May is a pretty 287 00:32:58,040 --> 00:33:02,560 Fucking terrible person, so I'm gonna make this game about mending these fences and it worked 288 00:33:02,560 --> 00:33:04,560 mm-hmm, and it's 289 00:33:06,200 --> 00:33:10,360 That a whole the whole arc of the 290 00:33:10,880 --> 00:33:16,020 B storyline is kind of interesting right because like 291 00:33:17,600 --> 00:33:23,640 When you get to the post Jackie scene, and they're just kind of like well, I guess we just ended up together 292 00:33:24,520 --> 00:33:26,520 it's 293 00:33:26,520 --> 00:33:33,680 It almost doesn't feel like they've actually gotten to where they need to be but then everything else that happens 294 00:33:34,280 --> 00:33:41,040 After that it feels more like that. I don't know that scene that scene to me is about just them 295 00:33:42,000 --> 00:33:43,160 understanding 296 00:33:43,160 --> 00:33:50,520 The nature of their relationship, and I think once you understand like the core of what your relationship with the person is 297 00:33:50,840 --> 00:33:52,840 it becomes easier to 298 00:33:52,840 --> 00:33:54,840 Live and 299 00:33:55,400 --> 00:33:57,400 Grow with that person 300 00:33:57,400 --> 00:34:03,240 You know if you don't understand how you're connected to somebody it gets a lot harder 301 00:34:03,240 --> 00:34:06,840 It gets harder and harder to figure out 302 00:34:07,800 --> 00:34:14,440 How to relate you know for lack of a better term just to be clear you're talking about the doc scene right yeah, yeah 303 00:34:15,000 --> 00:34:17,840 For me that scene was about 304 00:34:19,800 --> 00:34:21,800 Be kind of 305 00:34:21,800 --> 00:34:23,800 Be coming to grips with the fact that 306 00:34:25,440 --> 00:34:27,440 People can 307 00:34:27,920 --> 00:34:30,640 Have it not as bad as her and still have it pretty bad 308 00:34:31,240 --> 00:34:33,240 you know like the the 309 00:34:33,560 --> 00:34:36,680 All the worst people you know on the internet are like 310 00:34:37,160 --> 00:34:42,640 God has that shit go that annoying ass just because you have it worse doesn't mean I can't have it better 311 00:34:42,640 --> 00:34:48,040 You know like that shit yeah, but like she has to like come to grips with that like oh, yeah, they can have 312 00:34:48,040 --> 00:34:51,880 legitimate reasons for dropping out of college because she's like 313 00:34:52,400 --> 00:34:54,800 Dealing with a pretty brutal depressive 314 00:34:55,400 --> 00:34:57,400 Right because isn't that where? 315 00:34:58,800 --> 00:35:04,960 Isn't that scene where she tells be that she literally had a psychotic break when she almost killed that guy yes 316 00:35:05,520 --> 00:35:13,000 Yeah, that's they share. They both share that that kind of thing with each other be the the college fantasies and made the like oh 317 00:35:13,360 --> 00:35:16,800 Yeah, I've been like basically floating through life unable to

318 00:35:16,800 --> 00:35:22,120 Well she actually processed feelings for years. She talks about that that scene. She just talks about her 319 00:35:22,640 --> 00:35:28,520 mental struggles from college the the scene where may talks about the shapes is after 320 00:35:29,520 --> 00:35:31,520 They go into after 321 00:35:31,840 --> 00:35:35,000 May almost get shot and they're on the couch 322 00:35:35,880 --> 00:35:38,960 Laying on the couch. I'm is like yeah, just 323 00:35:39,880 --> 00:35:43,360 Things are just shapes. I don't really see people as people 324 00:35:43,360 --> 00:35:45,360 But she does go into like 325 00:35:46,440 --> 00:35:50,640 She does go into her sort of depressive her like mental issues on the doc scene 326 00:35:50,640 --> 00:35:56,080 Yeah, she she opens up a little bit like one-tenth as much as she needs to yeah, and it's like 327 00:35:56,880 --> 00:36:04,320 May like being it and it's sorry be being able to understand like oh, yeah like I've been holding this thing against May 328 00:36:04,640 --> 00:36:07,400 And not even considering that she might have legitimate reasons 329 00:36:08,280 --> 00:36:10,280 to have done what she did just because 330 00:36:10,280 --> 00:36:14,240 she threw away an opportunity that I would kill for and wouldn't throw away for the world and 331 00:36:14,440 --> 00:36:19,920 You know there's nothing necessarily wrong with being like if I have that opportunity. I wouldn't throw it away for anything 332 00:36:20,640 --> 00:36:22,280 but you know 333 00:36:22,280 --> 00:36:24,280 B was getting like her 334 00:36:24,720 --> 00:36:29,320 Big you know character defining moment was being like holding it against May 335 00:36:30,560 --> 00:36:34,000 That she had just so happen to have an opportunity 336 00:36:34,520 --> 00:36:37,120 That may didn't or that B didn't for 337 00:36:37,120 --> 00:36:39,120 You know really 338 00:36:39,800 --> 00:36:42,440 Unfortunate circumstances like her mom dying 339 00:36:43,840 --> 00:36:48,120 So let's get into our one moments, and then we can open up to 340 00:36:49,280 --> 00:36:55,640 The sort of mid and late game and then some of the B plots that happen around town, okay 341 00:36:56,160 --> 00:36:58,640 So does anyone want to want to start? 342 00:37:00,120 --> 00:37:01,120 Yeah, I'll start 343 00:37:01,760 --> 00:37:04,560 Yeah, my one moment was when I was like, okay 344 00:37:04,560 --> 00:37:07,240 Yeah, I'll start yeah my one moment 345 00:37:08,640 --> 00:37:10,640 Was 346 00:37:11,720 --> 00:37:16,920 The so there's a side plot in this game and my one moment comes from the side plot 347 00:37:16,920 --> 00:37:19,200 Sorry to be blending our our time slots here 348 00:37:19,840 --> 00:37:22,880 the pastor of the local church pastor Kay is 349 00:37:23,920 --> 00:37:26,760 Trying her hardest to get some 350 00:37:27,560 --> 00:37:33,320 Abandoned buildings rezoned and having a local homeless man put up in one of them for free 351 00:37:33,320 --> 00:37:35,520 and she's fighting against the 352 00:37:36,680 --> 00:37:38,680 chamber of commerce slash 353 00:37:39,640 --> 00:37:46,680 town council slash historical society the same like what seems like the same for people who do all these jobs who 354 00:37:47,000 --> 00:37:49,640 were basically being like complete tyrants and 355 00:37:50,600 --> 00:37:53,680 think that giving this homeless guy house is gonna 356 00:37:54,280 --> 00:37:57,400 You know not attract the market and all this 357 00:37:58,280 --> 00:38:00,280 nonsense NIMBY 358 00:38:00,480 --> 00:38:02,480 terrible stuff 359 00:38:02,480 --> 00:38:08,720 Bruce at one point realizes that the battle is lost before pastor Kay has given up hope and 360 00:38:09,960 --> 00:38:11,480 tells 361 00:38:11,480 --> 00:38:14,040 May in kind of 362 00:38:15,120 --> 00:38:17,120 metaphorical and 363 00:38:17,720 --> 00:38:24,280 Shrouded terms that he plans to commit suicide and that she shouldn't tell pastor Kay until the next day and 364 00:38:24,280 --> 00:38:32,280 May doesn't get it right away because may obviously sort of very childlike in a lot of ways pastor 365 00:38:32,920 --> 00:38:34,360 Kay 366 00:38:34,360 --> 00:38:39,600 learns the next day when Bruce has gone missing and May goes and talks to her and she just 367 00:38:40,320 --> 00:38:42,320 Has to sort of sit 368 00:38:42,320 --> 00:38:44,560 Silently you leave pastor Kay alone 369 00:38:45,360 --> 00:38:50,400 With the tent that Bruce used to stay in outside of the church with her 370 00:38:50,400 --> 00:38:54,320 Coming to the realization that he has thrown himself off the cliff nearby 371 00:38:54,960 --> 00:39:01,440 to go in quotes, you know be with his family and that you know, she's she is 372 00:39:02,400 --> 00:39:07,040 Lost the battle to get him a home and have a dignified life for him 373 00:39:08,000 --> 00:39:10,000 Pastor Kay speaks to me a lot 374 00:39:10,800 --> 00:39:15,240 I love pastor Kay as a holy shit as a faithful person 375 00:39:15,600 --> 00:39:19,040 You know she she speaks a lot to how she herself 376 00:39:19,040 --> 00:39:21,040 struggles and doubts 377 00:39:21,520 --> 00:39:26,080 With her faith in God and how faith is only really there to fill in the cracks 378 00:39:26,800 --> 00:39:28,320 where 379 00:39:28,320 --> 00:39:31,600 You know her understanding of the world can't 380 00:39:32,640 --> 00:39:38,080 Can't fill in things and it's just it's like such a heartbreaking and also 381 00:39:39,040 --> 00:39:46,720 Such a vastly beautiful scene just you know all those little conversations with her adding up where she says like 382 00:39:46,720 --> 00:39:48,720 you know 383 00:39:48,800 --> 00:39:54,720 Everything with Bruce is kind of in God's hands now and I only have faith to fill in where my 384 00:39:55,040 --> 00:39:57,040 ignorance of the future is 385 00:39:57,600 --> 00:39:59,600 And then having it all kind of fall apart 386 00:39:59,920 --> 00:40:03,440 Because this town is like

terrible and falling apart 387 00:40:04,640 --> 00:40:08,640 It's like I mean, it's it's heartbreaking, but it's like it's so beautiful 388 00:40:09,360 --> 00:40:11,360 Yeah, I love pastor Kay is 389 00:40:11,360 --> 00:40:18,320 A fantastic I we're gonna say this about a lot of characters in this game really well just really well constructed 390 00:40:18,960 --> 00:40:20,480 you know 391 00:40:20,480 --> 00:40:22,480 I it's 392 00:40:22,560 --> 00:40:27,840 I think the it's really smart of this game that you can't even talk to pastor Kate until 393 00:40:28,480 --> 00:40:30,480 many many days into the game 394 00:40:31,200 --> 00:40:32,480 because 395 00:40:32,480 --> 00:40:35,440 For me, I think a lot of this game is 396 00:40:36,000 --> 00:40:38,480 The important aspects of this game to me are 397 00:40:38,480 --> 00:40:41,040 told through these side stories and through these 398 00:40:41,440 --> 00:40:43,440 plot threads that relate to 399 00:40:44,640 --> 00:40:50,160 life in a small town in an impoverished area right where like 400 00:40:51,600 --> 00:40:57,760 You have a pastor of a church who probably comes from a more progressive 401 00:40:58,640 --> 00:41:00,080 city life 402 00:41:00,080 --> 00:41:04,560 and as comes a small town to try to like change things and make a difference and 403 00:41:04,560 --> 00:41:06,560 Is it used to? 404 00:41:07,200 --> 00:41:11,280 This kind of pushback against the concept of just helping 405 00:41:11,600 --> 00:41:17,520 Yeah, why why would the members of my congregation and community not want to help people? 406 00:41:18,160 --> 00:41:20,160 You know 407 00:41:20,880 --> 00:41:22,880 I love that 408 00:41:24,240 --> 00:41:29,040 Hey, what's up, it's Mason and I'm back for the mid-roll ad normally at this point 409 00:41:29,040 --> 00:41:30,580 I do some jokes about the 410 00:41:30,580 --> 00:41:37,560 After that last section of the podcast it feels just a bit inappropriate so i'm going to be a bit more clinical today if you'll forgive me of that 411 00:41:37,560 --> 00:41:44,280 I'm just here to remind you that if you're enjoying the podcast it helps us out so immensely if you rate us five stars 412 00:41:44,600 --> 00:41:52,840 On whatever app you happen to be listening on and then also please share like and comment and do all those other cool social media engagement metrics 413 00:41:53,800 --> 00:41:57,720 Anywhere that we post or any other content that you want to see us post 414 00:41:57,720 --> 00:42:04,220 Uh anywhere that we post or anywhere that you happen to post about us. I'll throw you back to the episode 415 00:42:07,560 --> 00:42:09,560 I guess I can talk about my one moment 416 00:42:10,360 --> 00:42:16,280 So my favorite character is summers. Yeah, I love summers. Summers is great. She's great 417 00:42:17,960 --> 00:42:19,960 Summers whole thing is that 418 00:42:21,480 --> 00:42:23,480 She writes poetry 419 00:42:23,480 --> 00:42:27,720 And so that's not her only thing. That's not

her only she's also divorced 420 00:42:27,800 --> 00:42:33,480 She's also divorced and she spent some time in jail and dealt drugs. You said divorced three times. Yeah 421 00:42:34,760 --> 00:42:36,520 so 422 00:42:36,520 --> 00:42:40,600 That was the best joke i've ever told on this podcast. I've got nothing from you. Fuck you guys 423 00:42:42,440 --> 00:42:44,440 So if you talk to her 424 00:42:45,160 --> 00:42:46,840 most days 425 00:42:46,840 --> 00:42:50,040 One of the things she'll do is she'll give you one of her poems 426 00:42:50,040 --> 00:42:52,840 And the first poem she gives you is 427 00:42:53,240 --> 00:43:00,840 My heart is a dankness, but when I see you I feel a thankness when I feel a blueness all I need is a you-ness 428 00:43:02,520 --> 00:43:07,400 Yeah, okay, it's just like a cute and point goofy and kind of corny, you know multiple 429 00:43:07,800 --> 00:43:11,560 You know days later. She reads a poem. It's bats and moon 430 00:43:12,200 --> 00:43:17,640 Against the gloom the night is black. I made a snack. I microwaved 431 00:43:17,640 --> 00:43:22,360 Pizza I'd saved the pizza is cold is breakfast gold 432 00:43:23,800 --> 00:43:25,800 That's two of her poems 433 00:43:26,440 --> 00:43:29,880 You're like this is fun. I like this is a good ass poems and 434 00:43:30,600 --> 00:43:36,680 Then you have a scene where you go with b to the library to read some microfiche microfiche 435 00:43:37,720 --> 00:43:39,720 microfiche 436 00:43:40,600 --> 00:43:43,160 Because you're trying to track down the mystery of 437 00:43:43,720 --> 00:43:45,000 ghosts 438 00:43:45,000 --> 00:43:51,000 ghosts and as you're leaving if you've been just talking to summers enough you see 439 00:43:52,200 --> 00:43:59,080 The possum springs poetry society is having a meeting and you have the ability to sit in and listen 440 00:43:59,640 --> 00:44:01,400 to 441 00:44:01,400 --> 00:44:07,960 Some poetry can we point out the characters that are here? Yeah, so one of the characters is a guy who fishes 442 00:44:09,480 --> 00:44:11,480 in a flooded tunnel 443 00:44:11,480 --> 00:44:19,080 Oh, it's so good and all of his poems are about how he thinks the fish judge him. He's just singing to the fish 444 00:44:24,440 --> 00:44:28,840 It's really good it's really just you walk up to him you're always sneaking up on him and he's like 445 00:44:29,320 --> 00:44:34,520 Hmm tunnel trout. I love you. I want to put you in my mouth and you're like, oh, that's good 446 00:44:34,600 --> 00:44:36,600 You're gonna eat these and he's like go away 447 00:44:37,480 --> 00:44:39,480 Because he's so funny 448 00:44:39,480 --> 00:44:41,480 and then 449 00:44:42,280 --> 00:44:48,920 Summers starts this poem called there's no reception in possum springs and i'm not going to read the whole thing because it's kind of long 450 00:44:49,720 --> 00:44:50,920 but 451 00:44:50,920 --> 00:44:52,920 It's basically this 452 00:44:53,320 --> 00:45:01,400 Whereas all of others summers other poems have been kind of silly and kind of lighthearted. This is like a slam poetry 453 00:45:02,280 --> 00:45:04,280 session 454 00:45:04,520 --> 00:45:06,520 Where she talks about how? 455 00:45:06,520 --> 00:45:08,520 How 456 00:45:09,400 --> 00:45:11,960 Trickle-down economics have failed and 457 00:45:13,560 --> 00:45:15,560 The ability for 458 00:45:15,640 --> 00:45:20,520 Younger and younger generations to obtain anything has become basically untenable 459 00:45:22,040 --> 00:45:24,040 And I was like 460 00:45:24,120 --> 00:45:26,840 I remember like sitting through that scene the first time I was like 461 00:45:27,960 --> 00:45:31,400 What the fuck? Yeah, what just happened? It's not the same summers 462 00:45:31,400 --> 00:45:36,200 That was awesome, yeah, I want more of that that was a great scene 463 00:45:36,440 --> 00:45:43,000 But the reason that scene works so well is because you don't expect that's what is about to happen 464 00:45:43,800 --> 00:45:45,800 and 465 00:45:46,120 --> 00:45:50,200 I i've never it's so rare for me that there is one 466 00:45:51,960 --> 00:45:54,920 Strip of dialogue in a game that I feel so 467 00:45:54,920 --> 00:46:00,300 So wholeheartedly encapsulates one of the main things that the game is about 468 00:46:02,140 --> 00:46:06,220 And I felt that this the scene with summers was like a perfect 469 00:46:07,460 --> 00:46:09,460 summation of 470 00:46:11,420 --> 00:46:13,420 Like small 471 00:46:13,420 --> 00:46:15,420 America dying right? 472 00:46:15,900 --> 00:46:19,580 You know it it's the idea that there's all the all the wealth 473 00:46:20,460 --> 00:46:22,460 in is being 474 00:46:22,460 --> 00:46:29,900 Not hoarded. I'm like like it's being concentrated all the wealth is being concentrated in these like big cities, right? 475 00:46:30,620 --> 00:46:35,420 Well, it's not even just all the wealth being concentrated in the big cities, right? It's also 476 00:46:36,540 --> 00:46:40,700 The labor they can do is taken from them, right? Yeah, you know the 477 00:46:41,340 --> 00:46:46,300 There's there's other scenes where like people were like, ah, well, you know all the jobs are sent overseas and stuff 478 00:46:46,380 --> 00:46:48,380 It's like yeah, that's a problem 479 00:46:48,540 --> 00:46:50,540 but it goes back to 480 00:46:50,540 --> 00:46:53,180 the summers poem where you know 481 00:46:54,220 --> 00:46:56,460 The reason why this is all happening is because 482 00:46:57,420 --> 00:46:59,900 big guy somewhere making more money 483 00:47:00,860 --> 00:47:04,060 So I just I don't know. There's just something about that scene to me that just 484 00:47:05,020 --> 00:47:06,300 in a game 485 00:47:06,300 --> 00:47:11,500 That has its moments, but I would say across the board is like fairly silly 486 00:47:13,100 --> 00:47:14,620 The the moments 487 00:47:14,620 --> 00:47:21,100 That are going to hit the most are always going to be the ones where the characters take a step back from that and

just 488 00:47:21,580 --> 00:47:23,900 Are allowed to be real 489 00:47:24,460 --> 00:47:26,860 And to me this this was the one 490 00:47:27,340 --> 00:47:29,340 that hit the hardest 491 00:47:29,580 --> 00:47:31,580 just because 492 00:47:33,100 --> 00:47:37,900 Not only was it a very did I like relate very personally to it 493 00:47:38,140 --> 00:47:41,420 But also it came from a character 494 00:47:41,420 --> 00:47:45,340 Who I would not have thought had this 495 00:47:45,900 --> 00:47:47,900 big of a bearing on 496 00:47:49,020 --> 00:47:54,220 The overall narrative not narrative but the overall theming of the game 497 00:47:57,740 --> 00:47:59,740 Okay, you're gonna have to pick just one 498 00:47:59,740 --> 00:48:06,380 Yeah, it's hard to pick a moment because I mean one you two pick like two of the big ones like 499 00:48:07,180 --> 00:48:09,180 I really liked the 500 00:48:09,180 --> 00:48:14,620 Bruce and pastor k storyline like that was very good. Oh man. I will pick 501 00:48:15,580 --> 00:48:16,620 the 502 00:48:16,620 --> 00:48:18,940 moment that is called 503 00:48:19,900 --> 00:48:23,660 For the achievement for it's called like something field where 504 00:48:24,780 --> 00:48:26,780 May and her mom 505 00:48:27,420 --> 00:48:31,100 Go out into the go out to the field into that field and 506 00:48:31,660 --> 00:48:36,620 You know at this point may and her mom have had the confrontations 507 00:48:36,620 --> 00:48:38,620 that they've had, you know 508 00:48:38,940 --> 00:48:40,940 may like 509 00:48:40,940 --> 00:48:43,980 May's mom feels wronged by her just 510 00:48:44,460 --> 00:48:47,820 coming back and not being willing to like 511 00:48:48,540 --> 00:48:50,860 Be forward with why she's back, right? 512 00:48:51,340 --> 00:48:53,660 Which I mean is totally reasonable, right? 513 00:48:53,660 --> 00:48:58,780 And I think if you give 18 years of your life and refinance your house to send someone to college 514 00:48:58,780 --> 00:49:01,820 They at least owe you an explanation why they dropped out 515 00:49:02,460 --> 00:49:04,460 May's mom is so good in this game 516 00:49:04,460 --> 00:49:08,140 Yeah, and you know mom all the time mom all day 517 00:49:08,860 --> 00:49:13,820 All day and all night every day mom all time. We're seven mom 24 seven mom eels 518 00:49:15,980 --> 00:49:21,980 Like that moment where like it finally feels like they can connect with each other 519 00:49:22,700 --> 00:49:27,580 And also she sends her daughter to fall off of a giant tower 520 00:49:27,580 --> 00:49:29,580 Fall off of a giant tower 521 00:49:36,380 --> 00:49:38,380 Yeah jump on up there go ahead 522 00:49:40,780 --> 00:49:44,860 I just I was really glad that that moment 523 00:49:45,740 --> 00:49:50,460 happened because you know, it's a really easy for games to 524 00:49:50,460 --> 00:49:55,820 Kind of not give you a good resolution to that kind of conflict 525 00:49:56,220 --> 00:49:58,700 And you know that was 526 00:49:59,260 --> 00:50:05,500 At that point I was like, okay, you know and at that point like some 527 00:50:06,460 --> 00:50:07,580 like 528 00:50:07,580 --> 00:50:11,740 Sad weird stuff had started happening too, right? So it was like 529 00:50:13,420 --> 00:50:17,980 Okay, at least we've got this going for us, you know 530 00:50:17,980 --> 00:50:21,180 And also i'm really sad 531 00:50:22,140 --> 00:50:25,740 I don't know if this would be my moment, but I found out there's a thing you can do 532 00:50:25,740 --> 00:50:29,180 I didn't know you could give your dad the tooth 533 00:50:31,260 --> 00:50:33,260 I didn't know that either 534 00:50:33,260 --> 00:50:38,940 So to give everybody context because I thought this was just a super interesting world building thing that we'll never talk about again 535 00:50:39,580 --> 00:50:41,580 This is a rude like this is 536 00:50:41,660 --> 00:50:45,020 When buck says really cool world building context 537 00:50:45,020 --> 00:50:49,740 He is like way under selling it. This is like this is the coolest shit in the fucking game 538 00:50:51,180 --> 00:50:53,020 I 539 00:50:53,020 --> 00:50:57,580 I've read this scene. This is another scene where I was like what the fuck? Yeah 540 00:50:58,140 --> 00:51:01,980 So when you're doing the microfiche thing you can read 541 00:51:02,780 --> 00:51:04,780 about what happened to your town 542 00:51:05,660 --> 00:51:06,940 and 543 00:51:06,940 --> 00:51:08,940 part of what you find out 544 00:51:09,340 --> 00:51:10,780 is 545 00:51:10,780 --> 00:51:13,580 There was a massacre of 546 00:51:13,580 --> 00:51:16,300 massacre of a union 547 00:51:17,180 --> 00:51:19,180 by the national guard 548 00:51:19,660 --> 00:51:21,660 and 549 00:51:22,760 --> 00:51:24,760 Apparently what happened is 550 00:51:25,900 --> 00:51:30,700 So like y'all will have to help me out because I don't think I remember every detail correctly 551 00:51:31,660 --> 00:51:35,820 The guys who were responsible for the massacre happening 552 00:51:37,420 --> 00:51:40,940 They took their teeth like the union members 553 00:51:40,940 --> 00:51:44,860 So they so what happened was their boss? Yeah, there was a bot though 554 00:51:45,100 --> 00:51:47,100 They the union was bargaining with the boss 555 00:51:47,740 --> 00:51:51,420 The boss hit one of the union members or attacked one of them 556 00:51:51,820 --> 00:51:57,260 So in response the union held him down and pulled all of his teeth out and then in response to that 557 00:51:57,900 --> 00:51:59,740 They massacred the union 558 00:51:59,740 --> 00:52:07,020 but the teeth stayed a few of his teeth stayed in circulation and the union members would pass them down from member to member as a 559 00:52:07,260 --> 00:52:08,380 as like a 560 00:52:08,380 --> 00:52:16,220 Sign like that, you know, this is our power and and another thing that you read during this is that your grandfather was an important union 561 00:52:16,220 --> 00:52:17,100 member 562 00:52:17,100 -->

00:52:22,300 I love how often unions come up in video games and then just like in real life. They just 563 00:52:22,940 --> 00:52:27,260 It's not around. Hey, look, there's a reason there's a reason why most of the 564 00:52:28,060 --> 00:52:30,540 Video games we play that are heavily union 565 00:52:31,340 --> 00:52:33,340 oriented have been indie games 566 00:52:33,340 --> 00:52:35,340 And 567 00:52:36,700 --> 00:52:38,220 And not triple a titles 568 00:52:38,220 --> 00:52:43,820 But like I don't know what do either of you know what happens in this scene because I didn't get the chance to give dad 569 00:52:43,900 --> 00:52:48,380 the two you it's it's kind of just your dad retelling you more of 570 00:52:48,780 --> 00:52:53,040 Your family's history like he talks he opens up more about your grandfather 571 00:52:53,740 --> 00:52:57,580 He opens up more about like your family's history in the union and your dad 572 00:52:57,580 --> 00:53:03,260 talks more like there's there's that scene in that blog where you talk to your dad and your dad's just like 573 00:53:04,220 --> 00:53:09,100 I'm just all I ever wanted for my life was to be able to provide for my family and be a good father 574 00:53:09,100 --> 00:53:10,540 And have a good job 575 00:53:10,540 --> 00:53:14,780 and so that's it's it's a little bit of him about reminiscing about the idea of 576 00:53:15,500 --> 00:53:21,340 Being able to have a good stable job. Even if the job is just like doing hard manual labor, you know 577 00:53:21,340 --> 00:53:28,220 And I also just to mention the dad here. They did a great job of 578 00:53:29,980 --> 00:53:35,820 Maybe this is gonna sound too personal. I think they did a great job of portraying like a formerly abusive 579 00:53:36,380 --> 00:53:41,180 A hard working and well-meaning, but maybe not like the best dad. Yeah 580 00:53:42,540 --> 00:53:48,940 Where like the time you spend with him is just watching tv and watching tv and not talking to each other. I mean 581 00:53:48,940 --> 00:53:52,700 The dad is is just like a lot of the other characters 582 00:53:53,420 --> 00:53:58,860 In that they want to do their best, but they don't have a full understanding of how to do that 583 00:53:59,420 --> 00:54:03,980 It's just that you know, the dad is fulfilling the dad's role 584 00:54:05,180 --> 00:54:10,060 What is expected in a Midwest town in a in like the 80s and 90s, you know 585 00:54:11,100 --> 00:54:14,780 And just like a lot of the other characters. He's he's done some terrible things 586 00:54:15,660 --> 00:54:17,660 I like how 587 00:54:17,660 --> 00:54:21,420 All of the characters in the game the major and minor characters 588 00:54:22,780 --> 00:54:24,060 have 589 00:54:24,060 --> 00:54:26,060 like this 590 00:54:28,380 --> 00:54:33,980 This really good characterization like some part of them that you can like latch on to and be like 591 00:54:34,300 --> 00:54:39,980 There's like a nugget of like humanity in there with the exception of town council. Fuck those guys 592 00:54:40,540 --> 00:54:45,980 But like you can you can see like the the ray of humanity shining through for all of these characters 593 00:54:45,980 --> 00:54:49,020 for all of these characters, even though most of them 594 00:54:49,820 --> 00:54:54,700 Like do some like pretty insensitive and terrible things or even in the minor characters 595 00:54:55,420 --> 00:54:59,340 Even though you can see the nugget of humanity even though that they're not in the spotlight 596 00:54:59,820 --> 00:55:01,820 for like most of the game 597 00:55:01,980 --> 00:55:09,820 Shout out to call center lady who gets who ends up just having to work two jobs because she can't get the hours at the 598 00:55:10,460 --> 00:55:14,640 Ham panther, yeah, but she couldn't stand continuing to work at the telazoft 599 00:55:14,640 --> 00:55:18,160 Because the set the sounds of the call center were driving her crazy 600 00:55:20,720 --> 00:55:22,720 That's the next character I want to talk about 601 00:55:23,840 --> 00:55:28,480 Is mr. Chazkov. I knew it. I want to talk about mr. Chazkov. He's great 602 00:55:29,760 --> 00:55:31,760 I didn't get the definition. And the dusk stars 603 00:55:33,520 --> 00:55:37,440 Because I missed the first day because I didn't understand how to get up there 604 00:55:37,840 --> 00:55:42,400 You have to go across the way sam sam had to tell me sam had to tell me I was literally like mason 605 00:55:42,400 --> 00:55:46,800 There's one i'm not gonna i'm not gonna drive you in any particular direction in this game 606 00:55:46,800 --> 00:55:49,600 But I do want you to talk to mr. Chazkov every day 607 00:55:50,000 --> 00:55:54,160 I was like I can't triple jump on these wires and he was like you can jump on the windowsills 608 00:55:55,360 --> 00:55:58,740 Can't see nothing visually indicating. Yeah jump on the fucking windowsills 609 00:56:00,320 --> 00:56:02,320 I 610 00:56:04,000 --> 00:56:10,080 The dusk stars are like so completely unnecessary to the rest of this game from a 611 00:56:10,080 --> 00:56:12,080 Like 612 00:56:15,360 --> 00:56:17,200 So I follow 613 00:56:17,200 --> 00:56:20,400 the art director of this game on twitter and 614 00:56:21,040 --> 00:56:24,800 It's very clear that one of his hobbies is 615 00:56:25,660 --> 00:56:26,800 stargazing 616 00:56:26,800 --> 00:56:28,640 and so my belief 617 00:56:28,640 --> 00:56:33,440 And I don't know if it's for sure is that part of the reason this ended up in the game is because he was like 618 00:56:33,440 --> 00:56:38,000 Hey guys, I have this concept. I want to you know, there's things called dusk stars and 619 00:56:38,000 --> 00:56:41,440 you know, we can make up constellations in the universe of the game that 620 00:56:42,080 --> 00:56:43,280 become 621 00:56:43,280 --> 00:56:45,280 relevant to 622 00:56:45,280 --> 00:56:48,240 That connects to characters in the storyline of the game 623 00:56:49,440 --> 00:56:51,520 And also big snake and also a

big snake 624 00:56:52,560 --> 00:56:54,560 He was a big snake 625 00:56:54,560 --> 00:56:56,560 And so I just really like how 626 00:56:58,960 --> 00:57:03,760 There is this ethereal thing because 627 00:57:03,760 --> 00:57:11,940 Because you know you think about all these dream sequences that may has you think about all this like crazy 628 00:57:13,520 --> 00:57:16,880 Cult stuff that happens in the end of the game that we'll get to 629 00:57:17,600 --> 00:57:21,360 And it's like well, there's no one there to like explain anything that's happening 630 00:57:22,080 --> 00:57:24,160 and it's just nice to have this thing where 631 00:57:25,040 --> 00:57:27,040 There is a 632 00:57:27,040 --> 00:57:31,120 Just a very kind old man who's just there to explain 633 00:57:31,120 --> 00:57:33,120 This very far off 634 00:57:34,720 --> 00:57:38,640 In con otherwise incomprehensible concepts to you 635 00:57:39,680 --> 00:57:44,880 And I just really like that and I really love like all of the the constellations that they put together 636 00:57:45,360 --> 00:57:50,160 And all the like little stories that they tell and how they start off with these like big 637 00:57:50,800 --> 00:57:52,800 grandiose 638 00:57:52,720 --> 00:57:55,840 Epic tales and then it's like this guy 639 00:57:56,400 --> 00:57:58,400 discovered fire 640 00:57:58,400 --> 00:58:00,400 That's cool 641 00:58:00,400 --> 00:58:02,400 So 642 00:58:03,440 --> 00:58:09,600 Again I took something very different away from mr. Chazikov again. I don't think your reading is it's like 643 00:58:10,160 --> 00:58:13,600 Buck with the parents. I don't think that's an invalid reading or anything, but like 644 00:58:14,240 --> 00:58:15,440 I thought 645 00:58:15,440 --> 00:58:18,480 The stargazing and mr. Chazikov was about him 646 00:58:19,520 --> 00:58:21,520 showing you 647 00:58:21,600 --> 00:58:22,640 like 648 00:58:22,640 --> 00:58:26,960 this connection to the past and like showing you this thing that like 649 00:58:28,220 --> 00:58:29,520 everyone 650 00:58:29,520 --> 00:58:34,800 you know despite this myriad of experiences and these like changing times and this like 651 00:58:35,360 --> 00:58:38,240 Chaos and confusion as to where your life has been and going 652 00:58:39,040 --> 00:58:42,880 Everyone throughout all of time has slept under the same stars 653 00:58:43,920 --> 00:58:50,080 For so long that we have like legends that we've lost and we don't even know the moral of the story 654 00:58:50,560 --> 00:58:52,640 Or the ending of some of them 655 00:58:53,680 --> 00:58:56,480 Because the you know, the stars have been like 656 00:58:56,480 --> 00:58:58,960 Humanity has been persistent for so long 657 00:58:59,520 --> 00:59:05,920 That we have these constellations that are so ancient that we don't even know the ending of the story, right? It's like to me 658 00:59:07,040 --> 00:59:09,040 Considering the theme of the game 659 00:59:09,360 --> 00:59:11,360 It was about like this assuredness 660

00:59:11,920 --> 00:59:16,000 That life will go on and like things will work themselves out 661 00:59:16,800 --> 00:59:18,800 especially given 662 00:59:18,800 --> 00:59:20,800 some lines in the later 663 00:59:20,800 --> 00:59:26,080 Series of those death star searches where mr. Chazikov is like well, you know right now 664 00:59:26,080 --> 00:59:31,520 You're kind of unable to see the beauty of a little town like possum springs, but you got to trust me that's there, you know 665 00:59:36,000 --> 00:59:38,000 So, I guess we should probably talk about 666 00:59:38,880 --> 00:59:41,040 Metal gear solid 2s ending 667 00:59:41,600 --> 00:59:47,040 Yeah, let's let's let's before we get to that. Let's there's definitely there's two more things you talk about. So first thing let's talk about 668 00:59:48,000 --> 00:59:50,000 Because they kind of tie together 669 00:59:50,000 --> 00:59:52,000 Let's talk about may's dreams 670 00:59:52,000 --> 00:59:54,000 Oh, yeah, yeah, yes 671 00:59:54,000 --> 00:59:56,000 so 672 00:59:56,000 --> 00:59:58,000 On some nights not every night 673 00:59:58,000 --> 01:00:02,980 But on some nights you do this dream sequence where may finds herself in a dreamscape 674 01:00:04,000 --> 01:00:08,020 And you have to go around finding these four musicians 675 01:00:10,480 --> 01:00:16,000 Activate them and then return to where you started and then normally there's going to be some 676 01:00:16,000 --> 01:00:20,720 Astral animal that shows up and does something 677 01:00:22,000 --> 01:00:24,000 Usually kills may in the dream 678 01:00:24,800 --> 01:00:26,000 presumably 679 01:00:26,000 --> 01:00:28,000 usually the 680 01:00:28,480 --> 01:00:34,960 Well part of the imagery of the dreams. I think is like the history of the town, right? 681 01:00:36,000 --> 01:00:37,280 interesting 682 01:00:37,280 --> 01:00:39,280 Okay 683 01:00:39,520 --> 01:00:44,960 At least I think it is that's a reading that's a way you can interpret it like what's the 684 01:00:44,960 --> 01:00:47,600 Interpret it like what it seems like to me 685 01:00:49,600 --> 01:00:50,640 Is 686 01:00:50,640 --> 01:00:55,600 What it felt like to me is each dream, you know got bigger, right? 687 01:00:56,480 --> 01:00:58,880 And with each dream getting bigger 688 01:00:59,520 --> 01:01:03,680 You saw different kinds of imagery in the things 689 01:01:04,720 --> 01:01:06,800 Like I felt like, you know 690 01:01:07,520 --> 01:01:10,320 the trains coming was like a 691 01:01:10,860 --> 01:01:13,040 actual allegory for like the trains 692 01:01:13,040 --> 01:01:15,040 and 693 01:01:15,040 --> 01:01:17,040 like 694 01:01:17,920 --> 01:01:19,280 I think 695 01:01:19,280 --> 01:01:21,440 I'm trying to remember exact details of the dreams 696 01:01:21,920 --> 01:01:28,080 It's hard to remember exact things in this game, especially for the dream sequences because I found them a little annoying 697 01:01:28,640 --> 01:01:30,640 Thank you 698 01:01:30,640 --> 01:01:35,280 Thank you.

See but you and I are like the same person we share a brain 699 01:01:36,000 --> 01:01:37,360 they 700 01:01:37,360 --> 01:01:40,240 I just I did I not say the same shit 701 01:01:40,240 --> 01:01:44,400 Did I not say that same thing to you when I was doing the train one? 702 01:01:44,960 --> 01:01:52,960 It it felt kind of like you were running around the town in part of like may's personality and also like seeing 703 01:01:54,080 --> 01:01:55,360 like 704 01:01:55,360 --> 01:02:01,600 If i'm remembering right, I feel like there was kind of like a flooded feel to one of the dreams 705 01:02:01,600 --> 01:02:09,200 And then you had the trains and then you had like the woods you had like the floating sky one, too. Yeah 706 01:02:10,880 --> 01:02:14,640 Although I don't really know what the floating sky one would be in that I like the 707 01:02:15,040 --> 01:02:18,080 Dream sequences just because the music slaps. Oh, yeah 708 01:02:18,240 --> 01:02:22,240 Music's are really good. The music's what makes it bearable that I have to walk 709 01:02:22,800 --> 01:02:27,600 Back and forth 15 times to figure out where the last all the way to the bottom of the shit 710 01:02:27,600 --> 01:02:31,840 It's like all the way to the top the game the game does direct you a little bit 711 01:02:31,840 --> 01:02:36,880 Yeah, you get the little glowing the little glow at the edge of the red dot. Yeah, those are helpful 712 01:02:37,040 --> 01:02:41,280 I couldn't tell if that was trying to guide me or not. It is. Yeah, they are 713 01:02:41,840 --> 01:02:47,920 Those were helpful. It's just that the levels are big and may is very slow. So what I thought those were trying to symbolize 714 01:02:48,800 --> 01:02:51,600 Was I thought may was dreaming about her fears? 715 01:02:52,480 --> 01:02:55,360 That number one the town was changing rapidly 716 01:02:55,360 --> 01:02:57,360 without her and that to 717 01:02:57,680 --> 01:03:03,600 She was like grappling with mortality because like the things that I was seeing and what I was thinking about is like 718 01:03:04,160 --> 01:03:08,640 What does a train do it like it just moves on relentlessly and then like what does a flood do? 719 01:03:08,640 --> 01:03:11,120 It's this like unstoppable force of nature 720 01:03:11,440 --> 01:03:16,320 And then like the town floating into the sky is like it moving up and away without may 721 01:03:16,800 --> 01:03:19,440 And then at the end of all the dreams she dies 722 01:03:20,000 --> 01:03:22,000 to this big monster attack 723 01:03:22,000 --> 01:03:27,920 So that's that's what I was thinking right? I thought it was like symbolizing because that's what I thought the game was about is like 724 01:03:28,400 --> 01:03:32,080 This like this like melancholy of the town changing 725 01:03:32,880 --> 01:03:38,400 Right because you know like the pizza place shuts down and like now greg has a job and like so that's what I thought it was 726 01:03:38,720 --> 01:03:41,280 I like I like the thought that it could be 727 01:03:42,800 --> 01:03:45,440 The history though, I like the thought that it could be the history 728 01:03:45,440 --> 01:03:48,240 I think it's the train station and the fucking flooding 729 01:03:48,240 --> 01:03:53,280 I think it's the potential of whatever catholic being that lives under the town 730 01:03:53,920 --> 01:03:55,920 Trying to communicate with you 731 01:03:55,920 --> 01:04:00,800 I think there's one of I think both of you are fair, but I think there's one point that we're missing in this and that is 732 01:04:01,360 --> 01:04:03,360 That in every dream 733 01:04:03,360 --> 01:04:05,600 It's always the musicians that are there 734 01:04:06,160 --> 01:04:12,400 Yeah, because the music is one of the only stable things that may has in her life 735 01:04:12,720 --> 01:04:17,040 Yeah, the band practices band practices and the be the ability to play the band 736 01:04:17,040 --> 01:04:22,320 and the be the ability to play bass even though it seems like she pushes back on her ability to do it a little bit like 737 01:04:22,720 --> 01:04:25,920 clearly is a talent of hers and it is a 738 01:04:26,720 --> 01:04:31,760 That is something that will always be there. Well, she's only ever as talented as you are at playing rhythm games, right? 739 01:04:31,760 --> 01:04:33,760 She could suck shit at playing bass 740 01:04:34,640 --> 01:04:40,640 Why is there a trophy for do like not hitting a single note in all the songs throughout the game? 741 01:04:41,440 --> 01:04:45,120 I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. That was a trophy. It is a trophy and I don't understand 742 01:04:45,120 --> 01:04:47,120 Why it's probably called like apathy 743 01:04:47,680 --> 01:04:49,680 complete apathy or something 744 01:04:50,800 --> 01:04:52,800 I really like the songs. I really like the 745 01:04:53,920 --> 01:04:59,520 Song vignettes. I like how they're animated. I like the songs. I don't think they designed the note charts very well 746 01:04:59,600 --> 01:05:01,200 Oh, no, of course not 747 01:05:01,200 --> 01:05:05,920 It's not a good rhythm game, but it's not a rhythm game. Yeah. All right. Let's talk about the ending 748 01:05:06,000 --> 01:05:08,000 let's talk about solid to the 749 01:05:08,320 --> 01:05:10,320 ending sequence where 750 01:05:10,320 --> 01:05:16,320 You go into the woods and then you get shot and you find a cult and you find a big hole and inside the hole 751 01:05:16,320 --> 01:05:18,320 There is a god 752 01:05:18,320 --> 01:05:21,440 What's your mark? So why don't we start with? 753 01:05:22,800 --> 01:05:23,840 on 754 01:05:23,840 --> 01:05:26,400 Uh, do you want to talk about furry halloween? 755 01:05:30,000 --> 01:05:34,160 I thought you were gonna I thought you wanted to talk about the night where may dreams about god 756 01:05:34,160 --> 01:05:36,160 And 757 01:05:40,240 --> 01:05:44,880 On horror fest may sees a random child get abducted 758 01:05:45,600 --> 01:05:49,520 Which causes her

obsession with figuring out what the ghost is 759 01:05:50,240 --> 01:05:54,560 You go and see and figure out what the ghost is you go out into 760 01:05:55,360 --> 01:05:59,600 You you pick you can do two out of three hanging out sessions 761 01:05:59,600 --> 01:06:05,760 Which I highly recommend hanging out with angus because that's the time that you get to that's the only time you get to hang out with angus 762 01:06:05,760 --> 01:06:09,840 Yeah, and you see the hash slinging slasher walking around 763 01:06:10,800 --> 01:06:16,800 the the the same person you thought you saw on horror fest and then eventually 764 01:06:18,480 --> 01:06:26,160 Y'all just go out into the woods to look for them because you think you know where they I can't remember what triggers the you're chasing them and 765 01:06:26,160 --> 01:06:33,200 You end up stumbling upon them and you hear that the arm that you found at the beginning of the game 766 01:06:34,240 --> 01:06:37,360 Was from apparently a body they chopped up 767 01:06:41,360 --> 01:06:45,280 And they threw it into a hole in the ground yeah 768 01:06:46,800 --> 01:06:48,800 May fucks up. Yeah 769 01:06:49,520 --> 01:06:51,520 And she does 770 01:06:51,520 --> 01:06:54,560 And you run away may almost get shot 771 01:06:54,560 --> 01:07:02,320 This whole sequence is really confusing right? Yeah, there's a lot that's like well did this happen or may's in the hospital 772 01:07:02,320 --> 01:07:07,680 May's in the church may is back home. Is she dead or did she go into a coma or like? 773 01:07:08,160 --> 01:07:10,160 I think a lot of it is meant to 774 01:07:12,320 --> 01:07:17,920 There's like a little bit of this thing going on where it's like oh I want may to have an epiphany 775 01:07:18,640 --> 01:07:22,000 That the town is going to go away anyway 776 01:07:22,000 --> 01:07:27,680 So I need something to happen. You know I feel I got like that kind of vibe out of some of this my take 777 01:07:27,680 --> 01:07:29,680 I don't think it was like egregious 778 01:07:29,680 --> 01:07:35,760 My take was that it's like may's brain trying to make sense of the things that would happen to her if 779 01:07:36,560 --> 01:07:40,160 This were something that happened to her if that makes sense 780 01:07:40,160 --> 01:07:42,480 Yeah, like if she were to be grievously injured 781 01:07:42,480 --> 01:07:45,120 This is the things that her brain would expect to happen 782 01:07:45,680 --> 01:07:50,000 Her parents in the town would gather around her at a church and mourn over her death 783 01:07:50,000 --> 01:07:52,000 Except her dick neighbor 784 01:07:52,480 --> 01:07:55,920 You know her parents would take her to a hospital to 785 01:07:57,200 --> 01:08:03,760 Heal her you know eventually she would end up back home to rest like that. That's kind of how I 786 01:08:05,360 --> 01:08:07,360 Interpreted like it was her brain 787 01:08:08,880 --> 01:08:10,880 Coming to terms with 788 01:08:10,960 --> 01:08:15,280 The concept of potentially dying and what would happen 789 01:08:15,280 --> 01:08:21,600 I thought it was showing a bunch of contiguous like canon actually did happen events just a little clumsily 790 01:08:22,240 --> 01:08:25,520 Like maggots found the people of the town 791 01:08:26,320 --> 01:08:30,800 Realized she's injured and her parents go her mom working at the church 792 01:08:31,600 --> 01:08:38,400 Takes her and they pray they have like a prayer and then they take her to the hospital because she's not like bleeding out or anything 793 01:08:38,400 --> 01:08:40,400 I think the linchpin for me as to 794 01:08:40,400 --> 01:08:46,480 I'm not saying that's not our boundary. I think the linchpin for me that makes me feel like it's it's not reality 795 01:08:46,720 --> 01:08:49,840 Is the janitor showing up at the hospital? Yeah 796 01:08:50,480 --> 01:08:52,480 And he's like old and gray 797 01:08:52,480 --> 01:08:57,600 It was just like it just like doesn't make any sense for that person that for the janitor to be there 798 01:08:57,600 --> 01:09:00,080 The janitor character is very interesting and obviously 799 01:09:00,800 --> 01:09:03,760 Personifies a concept of faith and religion himself 800 01:09:04,480 --> 01:09:06,720 And blah to blah he could definitely be a 801 01:09:06,720 --> 01:09:12,480 Jesus I don't want to get too deep into that because that's like a very I think that's a very service level reading of him, but 802 01:09:13,520 --> 01:09:15,520 you know 803 01:09:16,800 --> 01:09:20,000 I think it's really just I don't I love how trippy 804 01:09:20,640 --> 01:09:24,480 the last like section of the game is because they're not afraid to just 805 01:09:28,000 --> 01:09:30,000 Not be this grounded 806 01:09:31,040 --> 01:09:33,040 Reality that most of the game has been 807 01:09:33,040 --> 01:09:36,160 This very like character driven grounded 808 01:09:36,880 --> 01:09:38,480 society like 809 01:09:38,480 --> 01:09:40,480 society based drama 810 01:09:40,960 --> 01:09:42,960 I also love how 811 01:09:43,760 --> 01:09:45,280 the 812 01:09:45,280 --> 01:09:48,560 Just the friends are characterized during this 813 01:09:49,360 --> 01:09:51,360 like the whole 814 01:09:51,680 --> 01:09:56,080 Just them trying to figure things out in Greg and Angus's apartment 815 01:09:56,800 --> 01:09:58,960 You know, I I really liked 816 01:09:58,960 --> 01:10:02,960 the whole I the whole scene where 817 01:10:03,520 --> 01:10:07,840 They're trying to figure things out and then oh, there's someone at the door and then it cuts to may 818 01:10:08,640 --> 01:10:11,520 Who like deliriously just walks from? 819 01:10:12,400 --> 01:10:15,920 Home to the home to the apartment, which is a very long walk 820 01:10:16,320 --> 01:10:22,000 And you know, it turns out to be her instead of the weird scary secret society people that they saw 821 01:10:22,480 --> 01:10:24,160 you know, I 822 01:10:24,160 --> 01:10:26,160 I like the 823 01:10:26,160 --> 01:10:30,000 You know,

I I like how? 824 01:10:31,980 --> 01:10:34,480 Competent they all end up being you know 825 01:10:35,760 --> 01:10:37,760 Man, it's a really well written 826 01:10:38,720 --> 01:10:42,800 Scene, I don't know. I don't feel like it's very valuable to keep saying well written 827 01:10:43,760 --> 01:10:46,480 We're gonna talk about this cult y'all we do it's 828 01:10:47,520 --> 01:10:52,160 Very good. Okay. I want I'll so here's here's the main thing. I want to talk about is there 829 01:10:53,040 --> 01:10:55,040 A reading you have for this 830 01:10:55,040 --> 01:10:57,840 other than the surface level like 831 01:10:59,360 --> 01:11:02,960 Because when I played this originally I was like, okay, I get it the cult is like 832 01:11:03,920 --> 01:11:05,840 you know 833 01:11:05,840 --> 01:11:07,840 divisive politics 834 01:11:08,800 --> 01:11:15,920 Where there's going to always be a group that essentially ends up being a death cult who's willing to throw away the lives of people? 835 01:11:16,880 --> 01:11:18,080 to 836 01:11:18,080 --> 01:11:21,200 Bolster the economic situation that they find themselves in 837 01:11:21,200 --> 01:11:25,360 That that was like my read on it and I have not like 838 01:11:27,040 --> 01:11:32,240 Obviously in the context of the game there there is a more 839 01:11:34,320 --> 01:11:39,360 I think it is played a little more literally that this is literally a cult and there is literally 840 01:11:39,840 --> 01:11:42,480 some entity deep in this hole 841 01:11:43,120 --> 01:11:44,640 but 842 01:11:44,640 --> 01:11:46,160 You know 843 01:11:46,160 --> 01:11:49,920 I from outside looking at I just want to know if you guys had a different read on it 844 01:11:49,920 --> 01:11:54,560 So I because that was what I took away from it. I do have a different read on it 845 01:11:55,120 --> 01:11:57,680 Did you notice anything about the prologue? 846 01:11:58,240 --> 01:12:00,800 If the poem about your grandfather, they were 847 01:12:01,360 --> 01:12:07,840 The where your grandfather says they were afraid of they were afraid of something. So they ate the young well, there's so 848 01:12:08,400 --> 01:12:13,280 The big thing about the prologue that I noticed not prologue. Sorry epilogue 849 01:12:13,840 --> 01:12:17,280 Oh epilogue, did you notice anything in interesting in the epilogue? 850 01:12:17,280 --> 01:12:21,280 There's one guy missing from the town. Yeah. Yeah only one 851 01:12:22,080 --> 01:12:23,680 And it's 852 01:12:23,680 --> 01:12:28,560 Not anyone you care about. Yeah, it's just the smelters fan. I 853 01:12:29,200 --> 01:12:31,440 think part of it is like 854 01:12:32,160 --> 01:12:36,720 You have these people who say they care so much about the community 855 01:12:37,920 --> 01:12:41,200 And then when they're all supposedly dead and gone 856 01:12:41,920 --> 01:12:44,480 You don't even notice that they're dead and gone 857 01:12:44,480 --> 01:12:46,720 Okay, that's interesting it's 858 01:12:48,080 --> 01:12:51,040 Yeah, I mean I don't think these things are necessarily 859 01:12:51,600 --> 01:12:57,440 Dissociated either right people that are going to be more in touch and in line with their community aren't 860 01:12:58,000 --> 01:13:00,480 going to like give into the fervor of 861 01:13:02,160 --> 01:13:04,160 Fanaticism 862 01:13:04,160 --> 01:13:05,920 But it's like 863 01:13:05,920 --> 01:13:12,080 The thing that I took away from it was like the takeaway that I had there was 864 01:13:12,080 --> 01:13:17,520 like yeah, these people are threatening and 865 01:13:18,800 --> 01:13:25,040 Potentially, you know, it's so funny that you just end up accidentally killing like a dozen people, right? Yeah 866 01:13:28,080 --> 01:13:30,560 A lot of weird phone calls this morning not 867 01:13:31,280 --> 01:13:35,440 Well, you know they hold partial responsibility because they're 868 01:13:36,240 --> 01:13:38,880 They're a death cult. They're a death cult. They're hanging out in mine 869 01:13:38,880 --> 01:13:42,800 It's not just that they're a death cult, right? It's also like 870 01:13:43,840 --> 01:13:49,840 What is even triggering this to be a part of what they think will help the town? 871 01:13:50,480 --> 01:13:57,760 Right, like what is the point of killing someone like Casey who was just trying to leave which I mean we didn't mention that 872 01:13:57,840 --> 01:14:03,360 Well, it's not that he's trying to leave and say he's no good piece of garbage person who will never amounts to anything 873 01:14:03,360 --> 01:14:06,560 So we will feed people to our god people just think he was 874 01:14:06,560 --> 01:14:12,000 Trying to leave but he wasn't he wasn't trying to leave. He got kidnapped. Well, right. He got kidnapped god 875 01:14:12,720 --> 01:14:14,720 But ah, man, it's just so 876 01:14:15,520 --> 01:14:19,280 Such a weird way to look at other people, right? Yeah 877 01:14:20,080 --> 01:14:21,280 it's 878 01:14:21,280 --> 01:14:24,800 But they were they're so afraid of ghosts that they ate their young right? 879 01:14:24,800 --> 01:14:28,560 It's like the poem your grandfather told you so I've got a foot 880 01:14:28,800 --> 01:14:34,240 This is gonna I need y'all to promise me they are gonna stop me if this sounds too game theory 881 01:14:34,240 --> 01:14:36,240 We'll go we'll go with you 882 01:14:36,240 --> 01:14:42,240 Stop you're going full matpat. Yeah, I just maybe I just like when I was thinking about this earlier 883 01:14:42,240 --> 01:14:48,160 I was like, I think this fits with the theming of the game, but it sounds a little game theory ish 884 01:14:48,720 --> 01:14:53,760 So stop me if it if it gets too unbearable. All right, so my big theory 885 01:14:55,360 --> 01:14:56,000 I 886 01:14:56,000 --> 01:15:01,920 Think the god in the pit that the miners worship is not real. I think there's nothing down there 887 01:15:01,920 --> 01:15:07,680 I think it's like some kind of shared delusion or esoteric religion that they all

share 888 01:15:08,160 --> 01:15:10,160 And I think it's meant to 889 01:15:10,880 --> 01:15:12,880 illustrate 890 01:15:12,880 --> 01:15:16,960 the sort of logical conclusion of 891 01:15:17,920 --> 01:15:25,360 These character traits that may is trying to move past. I think I think this for two main reasons 892 01:15:25,920 --> 01:15:27,920 number one 893 01:15:28,160 --> 01:15:30,160 the 894 01:15:30,160 --> 01:15:34,160 God that they describe right is the the black goat 895 01:15:35,200 --> 01:15:39,120 That is a specific that is a HP. That's a Lovecraft Ian 896 01:15:40,080 --> 01:15:42,080 Thing it's shoved a giraff 897 01:15:43,600 --> 01:15:45,600 It's a real it's like 898 01:15:45,600 --> 01:15:50,160 It's literally like one for one the thing that HP Lovecraft wrote 899 01:15:51,040 --> 01:15:56,160 So I think they chose that for a reason. I think they didn't make up their own little 900 01:15:56,160 --> 01:16:02,000 Crazy eldritch horror. I think they chose one specifically because to illustrate that it's it's fiction 901 01:16:02,480 --> 01:16:06,640 It's fictive. I also think it's fiction because at the beginning of the game 902 01:16:07,360 --> 01:16:11,360 Your grandpa like literally tells you like it's a ghost story. It's like one of his little spooky stories 903 01:16:12,320 --> 01:16:15,840 I think it's there. I think those scenes were like 904 01:16:17,280 --> 01:16:19,280 To me about like 905 01:16:20,320 --> 01:16:23,600 You know in a lot of ways this game is about people who are 906 01:16:23,600 --> 01:16:30,800 in a lot of ways this game is about people who hold on to the past and it ends up damaging them and 907 01:16:31,280 --> 01:16:33,680 the cult we see is this like 908 01:16:34,800 --> 01:16:38,160 weird underground group of fringe right-wing weirdos and 909 01:16:38,880 --> 01:16:43,040 Around the time that this game came out was sort of 17 910 01:16:43,600 --> 01:16:47,760 Yeah, so you had a lot of these groups of fringe right-wing internet weirdos 911 01:16:47,760 --> 01:16:54,960 Grasping on to these like weird esoteric religions, right and like in an attempt to 912 01:16:55,920 --> 01:16:57,120 recapture 913 01:16:57,120 --> 01:17:03,280 The these good parts of the past and that's exactly what the cult's doing too. And it's like the logical 914 01:17:04,080 --> 01:17:06,080 conclusion of 915 01:17:06,480 --> 01:17:07,680 May 916 01:17:07,680 --> 01:17:14,560 Right of these bad parts of may these parts of may that she has to grow past and learn to let go of 917 01:17:14,560 --> 01:17:20,160 Right, you know because she's like anti-social and she's on the internet a lot and she 918 01:17:21,520 --> 01:17:26,960 But you know has these metaphysical beliefs right she's she's like in some ways like she 919 01:17:27,440 --> 01:17:31,600 is open to the idea of God and she comes from this like 920 01:17:32,640 --> 01:17:36,560 Midwest small town and it's like the danger of 921 01:17:37,360 --> 01:17:41,760 Not maturing and

not letting go of these thoughts of 922 01:17:41,760 --> 01:17:44,240 the past and I don't think it's like 923 01:17:44,960 --> 01:17:48,160 a fully cohesive reading because obviously there's like the 924 01:17:48,800 --> 01:17:50,800 teleporting serial killer and the 925 01:17:51,360 --> 01:17:55,680 You know like all the goats sings to you and she's literally like dreaming about music 926 01:17:56,320 --> 01:17:58,320 But like I think I think 927 01:17:58,560 --> 01:18:03,280 The elements of that are there. I think it's to me. It was supposed to be read as like 928 01:18:04,080 --> 01:18:08,960 Yeah, these are just maniacs that are killing people for no reason down in a mine 929 01:18:08,960 --> 01:18:10,960 To recapture 930 01:18:10,960 --> 01:18:17,840 Something that they'll never get back. That's what it was to me. Yeah, and that's mainly how I read them too is like 931 01:18:18,640 --> 01:18:20,000 you know 932 01:18:20,000 --> 01:18:21,120 They 933 01:18:21,120 --> 01:18:23,760 Have nothing else that they think they can do 934 01:18:24,640 --> 01:18:30,400 Right, like they're not corporate big wigs. They don't trust politicians. Yeah 935 01:18:31,680 --> 01:18:33,360 They 936 01:18:33,360 --> 01:18:36,240 They simply the thing they can do is 937 01:18:36,240 --> 01:18:40,720 Worship an eldritch god and kill people they view as undesirable. Yeah 938 01:18:41,440 --> 01:18:43,440 Just like the real life people people who? 939 01:18:44,480 --> 01:18:46,480 People who don't share 940 01:18:46,480 --> 01:18:48,480 People who don't share their values 941 01:18:49,520 --> 01:18:54,720 It's not even just don't share their values. It's act exactly how they want them to act, right? It's 942 01:18:55,680 --> 01:19:00,400 Well, I think I I mean those things are mutually exclusive I grew up around some of these people 943 01:19:00,400 --> 01:19:02,400 They would describe that as not sharing their values 944 01:19:02,400 --> 01:19:05,360 I think you probably have met some of these people before too, right? 945 01:19:06,080 --> 01:19:10,080 Like so I like I said that it has some holes 946 01:19:10,080 --> 01:19:14,080 I don't think it's meant to be like a game theory like it this cracks the code type thing 947 01:19:14,560 --> 01:19:16,800 But that is it's certainly how I interpreted it 948 01:19:17,440 --> 01:19:23,040 Anything else you guys want to talk about for this game? I really like the choice to let you control maze hands 949 01:19:23,520 --> 01:19:26,560 Instead of yeah, just like hitting spacebar and picking up a thing 950 01:19:27,360 --> 01:19:29,360 Grabby hands. Yes 951 01:19:29,360 --> 01:19:32,640 Just like you have to like open a window you have to like 952 01:19:33,200 --> 01:19:34,720 it really 953 01:19:34,720 --> 01:19:38,080 Like the the two times that I thought like, okay 954 01:19:38,080 --> 01:19:42,640 This is like really good is the time where she's like burglary. She's burglary 955 01:19:42,640 --> 01:19:47,840 She's doing burglary and her like hands are shaking. It's like yeah, she loves doing crime 956 01:19:48,400 --> 01:19:52,480 That much is clear. She talks about how much she loves it and she's very excited to do it all the time 957 01:19:53,040 --> 01:19:55,040 But it also makes her very anxious 958 01:19:55,040 --> 01:19:59,040 It's like that's like a great characterizing. Yeah for for me 959 01:20:00,880 --> 01:20:04,480 I like the teens the teens are the teens the teens are really funny 960 01:20:06,480 --> 01:20:11,680 May this strange woman just walks up is like you guys need to roll around in numbers 961 01:20:12,400 --> 01:20:17,040 Do we know you lady? I love the teens in the graveyard. I'm just like great 962 01:20:17,760 --> 01:20:21,920 Tell us tell us your most embarrassing moments. Have you ever done? 963 01:20:21,920 --> 01:20:24,720 It what did it feel like? 964 01:20:26,080 --> 01:20:28,080 It's so good 965 01:20:29,360 --> 01:20:33,120 The graveyard teens are good man for I mean if we're talking about how this game is about 966 01:20:34,000 --> 01:20:35,280 You know 967 01:20:35,280 --> 01:20:36,160 maturity 968 01:20:36,160 --> 01:20:40,080 Teens do a really good job of just being stupid pieces of shit 969 01:20:41,120 --> 01:20:44,640 The whole time except for lori except for lori lori's great 970 01:20:46,080 --> 01:20:46,480 All right 971 01:20:46,480 --> 01:20:49,360 Well, I think that brings us to an end of the game 972 01:20:49,360 --> 01:20:52,880 All right. Well, I think that brings us to an end of night in the woods 973 01:20:53,680 --> 01:20:55,680 Thank you guys for playing this game with me 974 01:20:56,560 --> 01:20:58,560 You can find this game 975 01:20:59,440 --> 01:21:05,920 Pretty much on steam and I do want to give a big shout out to the glory society who? 976 01:21:06,880 --> 01:21:08,880 kind of was the group that 977 01:21:11,200 --> 01:21:13,440 Developed out of night in the woods 978 01:21:13,440 --> 01:21:20,800 You know just found out recently that they're having to cancel development on the next game which was going to be revenant hill 979 01:21:21,520 --> 01:21:22,480 so 980 01:21:22,480 --> 01:21:24,080 hope that uh 981 01:21:24,080 --> 01:21:28,000 all the members of their team who are having health issues have 982 01:21:29,200 --> 01:21:31,200 good recoveries swift recoveries 983 01:21:32,000 --> 01:21:39,360 And you know, maybe they are able to work on a different project someday. Hey special. Thank you to all of them. I know this 984 01:21:39,360 --> 01:21:43,040 game meant a lot to a lot of people and it was 985 01:21:43,520 --> 01:21:47,520 Really special and i'm glad that they got to work together to make it. Yeah. Thank you for making this game 986 01:21:47,600 --> 01:21:55,440 It's really good next episode. We are going to be talking about katana zero very just a way different just a 180 987 01:21:55,840 --> 01:21:57,200 Yeah 988 01:21:57,200 --> 01:21:58,480 so 989 01:21:58,480 --> 01:22:01,840 If you want to play that you can pick it up on probably I think most major 990 01:22:02,460 --> 01:22:04,460 platforms, but 991 01:22:04,460 --> 01:22:09,520 Uh, we will see you all next time