This is a nearly 2-hour round 2 episode with none other than Dr. Satchin Panda of the Salk Institute!

At nearly two hours of dialog, this episode touches on a lot of material but has a special focus on practical implementation of time-restricted eating. Put another way, I kept a list of a lot of questions that seem to keep coming up and present them directly to Satchin.

We talk about dealing with shift work, black coffee when fasting, and some of the distinctions between Satchin's approach to time-restricted eating which is influenced by his deep background in circadian biology and more conventional protocols like 16:8 that many people are familiar with.

In addition to these important and very practical how-to tidbits, we dive into lots of interesting new territory as well, including...

  • How human anecdote and animal evidence suggests time-restricted feeding may be especially useful for gut-related issues, including inflammatory bowel disease and acid reflux.
  • The fascinating way Dr. Panda is using human anecdote from his trial to ask new scientific questions he wouldn't think to ask and then going back to animal data to figure it out and how this unique approach forms a sort of closed loop pattern: animal → human feedback → back to animal for mechanism.
  • How labs doing caloric restriction research may have actually been reaping the benefits of time-restricted without realizing it as an incidental to their experimental design.
  • The revelation that 70% of FDA drugs are subject to circadian effects and are either less effective or more effective at certain times of the day.
  • The effect melatonin has on the pancreatic production of insulin and the insight this lends to why we should probably stop eating 3-4 hours before we go to bed.
  • The bizarre way circadian rhythms affects everything from susceptibility to UV damage to recovery from surgery to cancer risk.

Sign-up for Dr. Panda's mobile app study on time-restricted eating.

Grab the full show notes, timeline & glossary from the episode page now.

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00:00:00hello folks today's podcast episode is a generous helping of a round two with dr. Sachin Panda you may remember him from a few episodes back when we discussed and eating strategy called time restricted eating but don't worry this podcast is actually very much stand alone as well but if you don't go back to that beside you may miss out on incredible primer of circadian biology and so much more as we dive into some discussion about dr. Panda's mobile app clinical study it should become increasingly clear how dr. panda in his colleagues are not just coming up with the way to eat but more importantly a whole new paradigm of how to use smartphone technology to efficiently crowdsource data including the occasional one-off anecdote and then go on to formulate new ideas to explore sometimes circling all the way back to animal research where is easier to establish mechanisms to explain what people are telling them dr. Panda not get into more specifics of how is mobile apps that he works during our conversation but to skip ahead and learn more and how you might be able to participate and submit your time restricted eating data to real research you can visit my
00:01:00circadian clock. Org that's mycircadianclock. Org is podcast dives into a few really important areas at differentiated from our earlier conversation including strategies for shift workers at greater risk of heart disease type 2 diabetes and obesity as a consequence of their occupational schedule how human anecdote an animal evidence suggests time restricted eating maybe especially useful for gout related issues including inflammatory bowel disease and acid reflux some of the differences between so-called 16/8 fasting and dr. Panda's philosophy of time restricted eating which is informed by circadian biology we dig into a lot of how important these distinctions might be for some of you that may have a history of following the 16/8 pattern already the bazaar way circadian rhythms affect everything from susceptibility to UV damage to recovery from surgery to cancer risk at least if you think the Whole World Health Organization knows what they're talking about plus a whole lot more including some important I'm sure to getting practical implementation questions that I've been
00:02:00Made It by many of you like how black coffee affect time restricted eating one thing to know in this podcast is that on occasion dr. Panda makes reference to a mouse diet which he refers to as the high-fat diet let's talk about that for a second that's actually shorthand this diet is an investigational tool also loaded with sugar that has the quality of being able to reliably create a mouse version of our Western diseases like type 2 diabetes obesity and heart disease okay with all of that said away we go on to the podcast hello everyone super excited to be here again with doctor is Sachin Panda who is a professor at the Salk Institute for biological sciences and this is actually around to podcasts previously searched and I had a really long and interesting discussion on his research and how we talk a lot about how the body's internal clock which is known as a circadian rhythm how that is regulated by the external cues such
00:03:00flight and how the interaction between light and a certain part of the brain called the suprachiasmatic nucleus which is like the master oscillator as it's called in master regulator of circadian rhythm and and how circadian rhythm regulates you know when were active when we sleep when we're awake when we eat things like that but also we talked a lot about this other external Q which also regulates circadian rhythm in what's known as peripheral peripheral oscillators which are other tissues outside of the nervous system such as the liver and the guy. And how that's actually regulated by the timing of the food that we need taken and that's where dr. Panda's work comes in as shed a lot of light on on what this was called on the timing of the food intake and how restricting that timing of your food intake to a certain period of time for example 9 to 12 hours during the day
00:04:00can possibly affect a variety of different metabolic outcomes and health factors so his research head in animals as shown that animals that are restricted to eating within a 9 to 12 hour window have improved glucose metabolism improve lipid profiles with cholesterol in you know increased lean muscle mass decrease fat Mass decrease fatty liver you know favorable gene expression powder and ulcerative you know really favorable outcomes in addition he's also shown that when he's my surf at a what would be sort of analogous to I think the standard American diet which is high in sugar high in saturated fat just not a really good diet if they are restricted to this narrow timing you know feeding window which is 9 to 12 hours they still have improved markers of metabolism and metabolic function in which is really helpful in a way because I think it also indicates that there may be some possibility that for people that have a really high
00:05:00time eating healthy or just don't eat healthy maybe even just doing this one thing where they I mean obviously we want them to eat healthy but if they don't eat within a certain time window that's more restricted possibly that would have sucked I'm super excited.
00:05:19Sorry but since we're talking about this do we have any human evidence that that the people that have for example like metabolic syndrome if they eat within a Time restricted eating window there's any benefits to that without changing their food composition historically most of this research studies haven't looked at the timing for say there was a very nice comprehensive review of published by American Heart Association went back too many studies were timing or at least how many times people let during the day was recorded and after compiling all this today is it was close to 70 or 80 different studies related to Pasta nutrition quality how many times people at the found that yes limiting food to certain number of hours during the day or maintaining overnight fasting was beneficial for cardiovascular health
00:06:19so that's a very well done Metal review of existing literature what we need to do now is to look for new studies where this is specifically looked at where everything else is kept constant and timing has changed so that will save other two benefits is sin among individuals who already have metabolic syndrome so that's what is lacking in the field and let you know this is a very new area of research and NIH funding cycle is 5 years so any of the studies will take at least five to seven years before we see any results and peer reviewed journals
00:07:01take me forever I guess clinical trial if you actually it's probably obesity I mean if a person is obese and may take a little more than just time restricted eating to lose weight although they may they may lose some and maybe they may require more of a like prolonged sort of fasting but it certainly would affect their I would predict would affect their metabolism so what we see in our study the small story that was published and also some of the other studies that maybe in the pipeline when people are adopted time does 2 defeating Paradigm India regular life in real life laboratory conditioner in clinical trial then the naturally reduce their caloric intake without even counting calories so stop at Target to stop around six seven or eight o'clock in the evening then the late night snacks and then they let night
00:08:01glass of wine or beer that used to be there is I'll have it they stopped at 10. We are doing two things one is reducing calories and also improving nutrition quality because that extra energy dense diet is not getting into their system so I am hopeful that will see some weight loss and then some improvement in real Health blood biomarkers and in Road and studies what we have seen when we take all of the fat mice which who have any ingredient healthy diet for long beard in the life and then put them on time just repeating paradigm
00:08:44I don't become like Lynn my symptoms of body weight that kind of never come over wet not normal but surprisingly there by chemically oropeza more healthy because of blood biomarkers for glucose cholesterol triglycerides they're all they come back to almost normal drains so we have to make that distinction that some people may not lose a huge amount of weight but they might actually see benefits in their metabolism in physiology so that's one thing where to look out for me was your furniture. They were still fed got a better diet
00:09:44very familiar with with time restricted eating or temperature to feeding to call with any with animal research like just what is that and how does that actually affect your your metabolism of glucose and fatty acids and amino acids and how does it relate to Security on to them what the deleted items sorry for you think about daily health health personal sense of how we feel healthy changes from time to time to her today Sabrina Campbell in the morning when we wake up healthy being healthy means you feeling much rested and you're full of energy to start the new day you're feeling actually much lighter is not feel that. Michael Dragoness have a good bowel movement on that being held a man's not feeling too hungry so having some
00:10:44Ford and your sister man and being productive today
00:10:48and then towards the end of the day being held actually means having taking a walk or something so you're not feeling really haven't moved all day and you're not feeling that I'll send something constrain the best night time before going to bed being held a men's feeling really sleepy so that you as soon as we switch off the light and get in the bed we fall asleep so that send this way you can say that the being held a this this definition is better different a different time of the day and a lot of it actually has to do with physiology of metabolism so in the morning
00:11:27telling lighter and not groggy and not having a food hangover men's you have already gone through hopefully somebody has gone through 10 to 12 in 14 hours of fasting not having food in the system so that your body has metabolize all the food and has processed it and your God has also gone through breast
00:11:51and then towards the end of the day when they're going to hit the bed if we have food in our system what happens is a blood flow is directed towards your stomach to digest it forward and observe it so cold water temperature remains high so not having food for 2 to 3 hours before going to bed actually helps us to go have that deep sleep sounds like drunk tonight send this way now if I backup cotton think okay so when should we eat sometime it makes sense that well after waking up maybe get one or two hours before we start dating and then before going to bed at least three to four depending on what your metabolism to do for hours before going to bed we should stop eating so that brings up
00:12:36the hitting window of say up to 10 to 12 hours max when we should be eating so that we have that
00:12:45personal sense of being healthy throughout 24 hours so in animal studies what we have done is we asked a very simple question if we take animals and give them for just like most laps do they have food in the hopper they can eat whenever they want and we calculate how many calories they eat and then give them the same number of calories from the same source of food where is high carb high fat high fructose doesn't matter we have to give the same so support set number of calories to the second group and they have to eat all that food within eight nine 10 11 12 hours then we consistently find that the num demise that eat all that folder than this 8 to 12 hours window
00:13:43el dia Dan Levitan Fred Meyers so that late today Tom what we call time restricted feeding where the timing of food when you eat is restricted or you define it and stick with a net Nordic not calorie restriction but you have a count calories and restricted send this word becomes easier because he's a tattoo we all know how to manage your time on a daily basis we always dealing with time because if we start eating around 8 o'clock in the morning and best rural lifestyle we can do 10 hours eating then I'll have my dinner say around 6 so that's the concept of time restricted eating no time to defeating having the time where you just sort of say well I should stop raining by you know 6 or you know kind of having it so you don't have to constantly each day think about it like when did I eat my first meal when did I take my 4
00:14:43but if you kind of just have this General Schedule where it's at least during the workweek you know it's easier we say 8 hours for the animals for 8 hours and then every week we measure that food intake and some weeks they might eat less and then we made it to change that schedule to say eight and a half hours and 9 hours the next week to make sure that they actually the same number of calories some moving this needle by 1 hour actually is not that detrimental still give them the benefit
00:15:22we have also asked another question 17 animal experiments in we can we let them three they can eat whenever they want and they definitely go outside of in 12 hours during the day and night but still that to our two days I've been dating can be counteracted by stick to 8 or 9 or 10 hours during the weekdays so. Also gives us hope that perhaps in humans occasional eating maybe once or maybe maximum twice a week we can still be tolerant for your typical work week and then weekend schedule like what's your your your time meeting Window and Door
00:16:18what I found is if I stick to maximum 12 hours window than I actually feel much better and more energetic I sleep well and I feel lighter and I'm still productive throughout the day so I start says somewhere around 7:08 in the morning and then I stopped and I'm 5 or 6 in the evening and I also try with different types of diet and wants to know one thing with many people who won new Time Restaurant eating eating a fitting is when they started that feel hungry and what I found is well having a having a fiber-rich diet or a protein-rich diet and slightly higher Factory tonight actually helps to go to that a long time without food and slowly you also get used to it and all of this actually in Crazy up nutrition quality because you're staying away from simple sugar
00:17:18and a high glycemic for and you're leaning more towards food that takes longer time to digest a longer time to answer so that have send out where my diet at quality and also the Depression had sent and I usually stick to 12 hours and in many cases I kind of try to stick to 10 hours should I try to see if you're talking about the people feeling hungry when they first try this out have you ever looked at the time restricted eating affects the title hormones like love tannoor Grill in which would be the one that makes you hungry so we have what we see is all of this hormone levels to come back to more home yesterday Clans that means I don't go too high and also don't go too low so that was kind of surprising because we thought that the hunger level will go out
00:18:18SSundee hunger hormones might go through the roof but somehow after a few days the body adjust to it and then it keeps them in a homeostatic lands and also humans are do it we do I say that after 2 to 3 weeks the hunger at bedtime is pretty low they don't feel hungry they might feel actually lighter and dirty to sleep so then then they realize how it feels like to go to bed with the with a lighter stomach with the heaviest if you break that time restricted eating window you I've noticed that lease and myself you actually start to feel worse like brown you know my tree my time restricted eating out the window well I do 12 hours but usually I do
00:19:18morning or Scott that's endurance related I liked it to eat within a shorter time window but but there are times that I can't even do with like to have been times throughout my pregnancy that I can can't even do 12 hours and I ate a little bit after. And I do notice it affects how I feel like I said the next morning so there's a slight stayed there and just don't like sleeping the deuce classic Indian clogged up there many times when people usually what happens is the door waiting to get into that for them and then we get this okay send feedback and I'll wait 5 or 6 when occasionally they feel like they could go out later
00:20:18right at 8 and then next morning I felt horrible because I'm not going to do that again so it's kind of interesting that. Hits around with 5 6 7 when people think that they have a doctor to a lifestyle and they're going doing okay and maybe they can occasionally eat outside the window and the door that let you know tonight and body reacts clock app can be found on the website mycircadianclock and it's basically your crowdsourcing data you know people that want to try this time restricted eating out can try it out and also send their data to you and take pictures of their food so that you can gather data for your your your day yeah that's that's kind of
00:21:18they're trying this out why not contribute to science what is even if we get the best punter clinical trial Grant from the most of the clinical studies are done with people who live within 20 to 30 miles radius of a clinical Center and sewing that way even if we foresee 3506 clinical trials in this country the only five or six of the centers and people were living within 20 to 30 miles and have time and energy to travel to clinical Center spend almost half a day in every 2 to 3 months or two to three weeks will participate in the study and we'll see the benefit fast and then we realized clinical trials which I like this one
00:22:14are actually will benefit our will sample of very small fraction of people came up with this idea why are Ethics Committee and we make sure that we would mention the privacy of people we don't sell this that I wouldn't say this that I would anybody else and we give that as soon as a problem then we may be able to recruit are endless participants who are not living within 40 miles who don't have time to come to a clinical Center but I willing to sell that data for Science and they can live anywhere in the world they can see other data and in this way this has been extremely useful because
00:22:59again in any clinical trial if you look at the exclusion criteria that is such a long exclusion criteria that only 1 in 50 or 100 within Susan Preston participating I can participate if we take that result and then try to disseminate to rest of the people does 49.99 people who cannot qualify then how are you how are we expecting that this will be up to go to all of them so it's kind of a conundrum so that's why we talk let's try this way we're the only exclusion criteria is if you have below 21 because that saying is it's mandatory exclusion criteria
00:23:40and in this way not only we can see home it'll benefit we may also see how much do not benefit so we can actually hit Prairie figure out what are the limitations of Tre and people who don't qualify for example ship workers the most excluded from any clinical studies because of the nature of the world they cannot come to the clinic at the right time on this is more 11 to them so now we have thousands of people who are sick workers and they're trying this and from then we're also learning what they can adopt and how they can adopt this Tre into that lifestyle and whether it helps them with alertness being on the job and other tells them to sleep in The Weeknd on the list. But this has been extremely useful to have this kind of study and sometimes we even get responses from our users that we had never thought about
00:24:40so we take that response and say hey can we do this animal study and see what is going on what are the biochemical basis for this what are the physiological response in animals maybe that's how we can address for example the Americas are there many m u let Ur disease and people report said that this email to let the diseases improve on the time restricted eating another surprising for us, sun goes down with time it rating and that makes sense if the system you can find me some goes down then many email related or in play me some information to liver disease would also go down with time masturbating so this is it there's some examples like this where he went but his parents tell us their story and if there is one or two person we may not take seriously but then
00:25:40it's for 5 or 10 or 15 people telling us the same kind of story for example many IBS patients who have irritable bowel syndrome who have been going to toilet four five six seven eight times everyday they do Terry and then they immediately see that the number of times it's a huge Improvement for them and then we might hear the story once or twice and then I'll take it seriously but then if we hear it five six seven times and really start thinking about okay let's go back to animal with drum all these animals we have collected everything so that same as what might have changed his diet did the microbiome chance interaction between microbiome the questions and that helps us to come up with new are hypotheses and do more
00:26:40studies so it has been extremely useful for people to go sign up on the my security and clock website and download the app and say that I'm also said that experience I just love hearing there's so many things that you brought up that I have more to my head to talk about but first of all what to speak to your point this is really I think it is extremely important that your dad got them all the state of from people without all these limitations aside from the age limitation like you said you're getting the shift workers I mean this is hugely relevant for shift working and you know people that have IBS people that have been stressed obviously people that have certain conditions are probably Consulting with her position but you're getting this this data and then you seeing these trends when people start to say these things over and over like oh my IBS is improving and there at five six times then you start to go to the Mass state and stuff to do experiments and cheese at mechanism fantastic it's absolutely fantastic so that the first time with him
00:27:40Mission you mentioned do you think the part of the the reduced systemic inflammation has to do with the fact that you know you're if you're eating within the time restricted window in this is something you know your metabolism is is optimal during this certain time certain time window so the first time you take in food service starts he's playful clocks in the liver for example which regulates glucose metabolism and if you you know don't eat within a window where you're most insulin sensitivity start eating later then you're going to have more inflammation cause your blood glucose levels are going to rise and it's going to cause a problem same thing goes with you know fatty fatty acid metabolism intake of fat itself actually can inhibit the beta oxidation process you know if you're if you're eating within this certain window you're fixing your metabolism and that in turn would that affect inflammation possibly but
00:28:40is also this idea that there's some amount of got licking ass and so some of the bacterial protein so back to the membrane component example LPS and few other things can leak through a gut lining into circulation and that can elicit an immune response what do you know that with time yesterday eating since I've got repairs itself at night for us then during fasting time to God has enough time to repair so that David got clicking a ghost town. We are immune system is actually less exposed to this antigens that might leak today got another way that go down I remember a colleague of mine who is Mark chicken naga he was a former colleague of mine when I was doing a post office Bruce Ames brilliant guy got expert
00:29:40he was telling me all about I remember you telling me about how that that can handle high fat meal the best early in the morning because of all this repair mechanisms and things are happening like the first thing in the morning if it's that it's better to eat he was saying in your heart that meal was more I could handle it better than it could like later on in the evening just kind of interesting but the LPS Vacation all this very relevant for inflammation of the major sources of inflammation. How is also you know on the Circadian rhythm and I just the microbiome but like seeing the goblet cells in the guy in the ones that are making the the cat barrier and all these seeing all these cells are on a circadian rhythm so it really does make sense that you want to eat within a certain time window for your for the health of your gut right I mean
00:30:40Hudson when we say health is a product of our nature versus nurture environment one of the biggest interaction with the environment happens in the guard for Ford and how the food is digested how is microbiome handle Stepford are digested and sent it to her system so so that's actually the interface between nature and nurture so what happens that has he was in fact I actually finding that then Target lightning from Las Vegas all the way to see come a strong is Acadian the many supporters are many bumps even the channels that absorb drugs and getting 12 liver many of them are strongly security and over the last 2 years they're all too many people that are coming out so annoying. Microbiome completely Sun itself is Acadian so that means the bugging out
00:31:40Tom when we go to bed I bet it different from we wake up with the difference in a box in the morning and this diversity is much more important because different set of bugs have their own specialized saw the breakdown of process different kind of food all day also for different kind of benefits so in Mouse experiment what we have CNAs when my it started diet a healthy diet and regular soda and eat less during daytime than that got Compass the microbiome composition changes nicely and I did make pass on throughout the day
00:32:24what Sunday is this high-fat diet continuously than that diversity goes down but they are God is most popular to buy a few measure Michaels and then when they eat on a CRF to 10 hours then some of the minor species that are almost obliterated contact constant eating this slowly come back and they start to work so we see that diversity company and slowly coming back on the ship workers have a higher incidence of like IBS or got issues and I certainly in the heart into so Dobie city and messed up no problem is depositing they always report complaint about so it makes sense from aphmau study and also from what you know from Sleepwalkers that security and do the MARSOC
00:33:24can eating pattern will have a huge impact on how the gut microbiome also affects the way we're absorbing nutrients that would affect obesity is well right so that's been shown so maybe there's also a link to that so they got a daily basis like for example on a daily basis what would feel healthy another definition of held in the ass while going to bed at night is not to have this acid reflux or heartburn which is essentially got sodium is a proton pump are working differently and what we find in Mouse today is the Hess Express on the level of this proton pump goes down on the time yesterday evening so this is one example where many of my security unblock users reporter saying well you know it's going down we don't get that
00:34:24what's heartburn and then we got curious we went back to what are the targets of all the acid reflux drugs and we found this poor Town Pump and interesting latest proton pump Express and goes down in Moscow. This is another example of why we will never ask about we don't have the means to ask what is acid reflux and heartburn in Mouse but we have a man still I should have got this response from users and go back and ask him mechanism
00:34:56the first time I experienced acid reflux was during her pregnancy late pregnancy when my husband and I went out and had some some like fancy meal and I usually don't ever like
00:35:10sugar deserve but I have like a little thing of bike ice cream with some like chocolate or something we were in a hotel and then I like we went to bed not not long after
00:35:20and I couldn't believe how unbelievably painful and uncomfortable it was I've never had in my life apparently when you're pregnant it's a problem yes quiz but anyways I decided at that moment like I'm not eating out like that again cuz I don't experience but it's just I've heard about so many people talking about acid reflux before I never I never really knew I was like oh you know what is it like in your stomach know it's really you can't sleep it was awful I had to like I can sleep I had to set up for like a couple of hours so that you know the fact that Terry seems to be affecting you know who the best free flux and you know through this specific proton pump inhibitor and some people using hop is like super cool work is so backed like the shift work and stuff because
00:36:20a lot of people have reached out and asked that are imminent think of something like 20% of the US Germany membership for girls but they are not counted in Department of Labor Statistics for Lyft drivers because they don't classify themselves that's it for cuz they might be the might have a wonderful job that they list but then in the evening and weekends are all the morning they are kind of doing during the second gig and they don't list themselves then another thing that we came up with is what we call Secondhand Sleepwalkers family members accept workers who have a lifestyle that are very similar to support and this is something that we found in a study in the same my security and Clark study
00:37:21India where we found some people who suck describe them as Nazi Parker but then they eating pattern was like supporters of when we asked him again then we realize that their spouses was it workers to mention that strong family bond call them the second-hand sex worker was not working and say it but they're actually sleeping and eating likes it worker and they may be experiencing the same adverse metallic consequences upset Park send out where the actual number of people fraction of population who are experiencing support like Donovan up a few months or years in the lights may be offered up 30%. 40%
00:38:11that's a lot of people that's a lot of people because in the in India and China The Car Care accept workers in what force can be around 27 to 30% and then you are the effects of them have family members who are like sit for girls because that second hand City so it can be a porta-potty person I would say scientific consensus that's associated with shift work what would be like the top you that you would say like right on the top and then obesity diabetes and actually the very least 30 unzipped work and metabolic disease was linking Ziploc with diabetes and obesity
00:39:02and then slowly we started to say that in many of the longitudinal studies with nurses are with health professionals just random eating pattern and sit for contagious cardiovascular disease risk
00:39:16and then recently I came across this very interesting piece of data that I was not aware of that the number one cause of death and disability among firefighters in the u.s. is not actually related to fire its cardiovascular disease and stroke so that's the number one cause not even 5 fighting fire so that tells us that all this call me business as a link to subtract and then the also mounting evidence all over the world that zip work is directly linked or increases the risk of certain kind of disease certain kind of cancers entering breast cancer so that's why World Health Organization has categorized as a potential casinos in so that's a very serious classification because yet
00:40:08window that we have to stay away from carcinogens even in buildings and that is at casinos and there's potential customers and used as a parent dies areas and then we had to put a sticker and to think about zip lockers they are actually doing something that's a potential carcinogen let's do it almost on a daily basis for many many years so that's why I think nowadays increasing I would miss how to manage skip work so that they will stay healthy and will reduce the risk of disease and the drink something beneficial I mean firefighters nurses you know please when they're they're there helping Society so it's not like you can just eliminate shift work right I mean a modern society is actually based on those Hills so we actually called and the guardian supposed to say it because the other ones in the middle of the night they are making the
00:41:08economy running daddy wants were hauling trucks long-distance trucks and they're the ones who are actually transporting cargos or playing or say it's not the ones in the middle of the night there taking care of her health and 20 emergency so we have to kind of make sure that these heroes are healthy so we have to call for the holy Heroes program where we can clearly said these are the lifestyles that they can adopt and not listen to their being productive at work now so that they stay healthy
00:41:47and one complexity with zipped work is citric is just not one type of sipped it's a mixture of many different types of slipped and for example firefighters my Beyonce for 24 hours straight what is an Autism safe only 12 hours of the song The First Responders Merry and safe to only for 8 hours and then for them but some of them disip my chance two or three times within a month so that maybe on a day safe buses nights it even within the same week
00:42:19Cora's in some departments in in Santa Fe Sunday can be uncensored for 3 to 4 months which helps them to a doctor that's it then. I think it'll be interesting to bring up this heterogeneity in sip work and figure out which kind of soup work is more manageable than others and perhaps figure out how we can have firefighter kind of spark VS noxus kind of chips and pasta spoon rest
00:42:48do we know from any animal evidence for example if you take an animal that is you know for example not trying to like like a rodent Mouse which usually it's at night before sit to now not eat at night but to be awake during the day need a day and not eat at night so if you can ship them to a not eat all day all night night but eat just within a Time restricted eating window
00:43:19do we know if they eventually adjust how long it takes for them to adjust is there's your kid doesn't metabolism it just kidding where them addressed the many different ways to look at it one is if we just give the same on healthy high fat high school girls diet and start giving them at night time for 10 hours for example give them giving date when they're not supposed to eat when they're supposed to sleep
00:43:47so the bottom line is if my seat randomly than any kind of time restricted eating is better than they planned on meeting so even if they eat during daytime for 10 hours that still gives them some benefits so it still beneficial if we
00:44:12they don't send definitely lose some sleep and then just eat on Lexapro cause they're actually not working throughout that day time unless we force them to really work so that it becomes a two-factor intervention
00:44:30and then at night time when they have to go back to that normal activity that run around in the kids so in that way they get to sleep deprivation factor factor into it so bad day. Not as healthy as night fell twice for the same time they have a strong sleep deprivation Factor so that's why I think I'm going to see if workers coming back to see Pluckers if we can control for almost asleep during the halftime and I can sleep enough is it come up with some sleep hygiene and adopt some sleep which was that helps them and then they adopted eating pattern that best suits there that's it then it might up still eating within a narrow window then there is another piece of unrelated evidence that daytime a thing of a healthy Ford still beneficial and that's comes from
00:45:30city of Callaway construction studies and rodents and in most vivariums people the animal technicians come around in the morning and then this year I might get that food around 7 or 8 in the morning and sometimes even up to 9:10 in the morning and the characteristic of mice actually eat all their food within 2 to 3 hours so they eat in the CR-V EX actually give them put and so they don't sleep throughout the day and in the evening they eat they actually it's right away so we know if I'm see after days that all sea animals most of this yesterday's indoor dance so tremendous health benefits even though for the winter time
00:46:30Blair complication could be not only just temperature to eating but eating less as well repair. Live it down so that mean the waiting at night time so they were never controlled during the day time so I think those are the new type of study is that need to be done but at least we know that if the animals we reduced calorie and fed them doing their time when they're supposed to sleep it doesn't have any adverse impact it actually gives them a lot of benefit now the question is if we give them the same number of calories as a limit on pet mice during daytime what happens and they have done that experiment not with standard diet with high fat diet and with high fat diet that better than so so I think for shift workers
00:47:22if they can constrain to certain number of hours that's better we can improve nutrition that's still better than they are we again and if they sleep we have juice do things to help him sleep better during during the day and I'm doing the quiet cool all the things I hope he's hope possibly possibly for shift workers and maybe let you know what has more data comes out through your study with mycircadianclock and also as you get data for my circadian clock app and then go to animals and look more mechanistically things may come out even more another serve question as a relates to this is when people ask this all the time
00:48:08is what about people that are start eating later in the day for sample they wake up in the morning but they don't eat until noon so that they eat their first bite of food at noon and they stop eating at 8 p.m. so that's a tower Tre we eating window and they go to bed by 11 or so
00:48:35do they still have the same benefits or they losing
00:48:40because it's like that the Circadian whether it's your time restricted eating Windows come shift it's later and obviously there is a light Darkness component all this some degree to those questions we haven't even tease time in animal models but I'm still some people start using them apart so what happens is in the morning with no insulin sensitivity is it has its best so people who have a big meal earlier in the day they have less insulin Spike less glucose Spike Center
00:49:21having said that
00:49:23we don't know the people who are starting that for every day at noon for the best insulin sensitivity is at noon or it actually happened at 8 in the morning so that information we don't know who this is where some studies needed in human volunteers who are doing this and maybe some people who are doing what are you things starting to eat at noon one day then maybe they can drink a glass of juice at 8 and pick themselves themselves and then another day a week later I'd known they were laid the same glass of juice and pick themselves and see how is the glucose response so that might that says simple Celtics play When the sunlight somehow the people if they're out there than they can do that and the other posted that are really nice
00:50:23damn night so this is word becomes little bit complicated because I just heard that it's day and night transition and we know that in the evening as a body pass to sleep on melatonin level begins to rise and that melatonin usually Rises 2 to 3 hours before our habitual sleep. So if somebody is going to bed around 11 then that melatonin is beginning to rise on my knob on an address for some people it might rise around $4 and some people that Rice EduCare bedtime
00:51:02and when my phone in rice is that new data showing that melatonin can bind to its receptor in pancreas and disengagement the melatonin with the pancreas receptor essentially tells the pancreas okay it's time to sleep. You don't have to bother releasing insulin
00:51:23sew-in. What happens if somebody is having a big meal when there is high melatonin and then that may not be enough insulin released from pancreas and glucose my stay high in the blood circulation a long time and this Thursday this kind of studies came to publication because almost 10 years ago lives in Homeworld Association studies found that people with obesity of diabetes might have a mutation in melatonin scepter and that was confusing because what is melatonin to do with obesity and diabetes and you fast-forward 10 years we went back to the drawing board and look at where the receptor is expressed and what it does when melatonin isn't gas and then I found out that there's this effect of melatonin on insulin
00:52:16so that's why people who are eating late into the night the Monarch at the best benefit and thoughts of glucose control because that Lucas might have been slightly higher if they have the same dinner 2 hours ask randomly over 12 hours 15 hours for seating tubeless 8 hours even that start at noon listen to you know the Fit Food the time of your food intake so we know the first time you're eating so it starts a lot of these liver enzymes and Metabolism metabolism of addition to that that circadian rhythm being regulated by just the food intake there's also this will melatonin issue and it in the night daylight cycle and you know when you're
00:53:16you starting to make more melatonin and all that complicates things as well it seems yeah I remember a study that was done where I think men were given the same color are Camille in the morning and the evening glucose was measured at the blood glucose levels were much higher in the evening this morning but of course they could have been who knows how how long it was the morning like 8 a.m. and then they were doing either 9 p.m. or 8:17 who knows like what their timing window was right and that's very well very widely observed phenomenon in fact there was a term for that. They just called evening diabetes supposed to be held in the morning. Because the evening if you do the same postprandial glucose tolerance test and then look at the glucose level and may be diagnosed
00:54:16component to this would be the Assassin component ride so if some people think well I'm the only eating with an 8-hour window so I have much longer fasting. And I think that maybe a couple of some of these differences between time restricted eating and being on a circadian rhythm and fasting intermittent fasting prolonged fasting all these do you know the songs from comes out there I think sometimes a lot of a lot of this all gets moist together in one group and it's like all the same but it's not actually all the same answer prayer examples given not having food in your system for 12 to 16 hours for there's fasting on North that's debatable because some people say well it's not fasting it's not not having food for 12 hours
00:55:12I think that's where
00:55:16I would say not having food for 3rd to 16 hours is not posting but maybe giving rest to your system test and repair and Rejuvenation of his system so what do you think about fasting I want to think about fasting two things come to mind feeling hungry and feeling hungry has too many different connotations many different intensity so one sense of feeling hungry is well we might feel light and then second your stomach May begin to tremble little bit and then I would say that is your stomach is feeling well and preparing myself myself you're not actually really hungry you are not getting low and I see that you cannot get up on the chair or around or something like that and then
00:56:10after several maybe one or two days of fasting or maybe after 24 hours of fasting some people get a headache so that's a good sign that your brain is not getting enough energy in a habitual user forum and maybe trying to Signal the rest of the body that the party has to send some other form of energy for example Ketone bodies or something soon. Where
00:56:39fasting if your measuring fasting off your departing fasting and Tom's of Ketone body for Mason above certain level than that make it came after 24 hours or if you have that stress 11 much higher than
00:56:56fasting maybe 24 48 72 or even 96 hours before you see that level of Ketone body that's that can be your definition of fasting I think the way you Define fasting will determine whether or 24 hours 48 hours 96 hours or even 12 hours or 16 hours is fasting but the way we think we kind of Define how many hours do a systems do not have food is best on all day Lisa Cadian Rhythm because if you think about what are the key elements to being healthy balls down to three important things want to sleep in the second one is nutritional food and third one is physical activity and this tree are interlinked with each other
00:57:49super example if somebody is sleep deprived or vintage sleep and it's very hard for that person to do physical activity next day I'll go on the marathon so they store in Turley similarly if somebody's eating for 15 16 hours and has a very heavy meal at the end of the day that it affects sleep with. So these three are in bubble letters on a daily basis what we feel is having limiting photo 8 to 10 maximum 12 hours helps to coordinate this trip on the essence of Health work on a daily basis and give us healthy benefit so if I want to relate time yesterday eating and then maybe long-term fasting one day pass in two days apart Singapore days of fasting which definitely have much more benefits than it's almost like taking care of your teeth
00:58:45so brushing everyday is like time restricted eating that's the minimum one can do and that's something necessary to take care of your date but again once in awhile maybe twice a year are three times a year or once a year depending on how much you want to take care of your titty want to go see a dentist so that's almost like if a long fast one has to do I do four to five days of water fasting only once a year and that absorbs all the other sins that I might have converted to 10. But I think the difference between time restricted eating and other forms of fasting is one can adopt I'm retreating is it true life style starting even from Tina is Ivan Pavlov years all the way through 1890 is 1100 year old
00:59:42what does this long-term fasting to does a 4 days of fasting forget about even teenagers doing it some older people who are very frazzled I do need medical intervention or some kind of supervision to do it many people who are slightly Angeles some diabetic or hypoglycemic a 10-12 hours type 2 diabetic I mean not be able to do it without medical supervision so all of those long-term fasting definitely have much benefit and that has been sold in multiple studies the name is so that they can be practiced only by certain type of people that certainly is an need more mental resolve and it may not be a everyday lifestyle but it's time to treating can be able to lights.
01:00:39that's a great way of putting it sounds like all so you're saying depending on what you're looking at what mile marker you're looking at Downstream I also can sort of Define something differently for example if you're looking at a tapa G or a pop ptosis that's happening you may not see or be able to even measure it maybe it's happening but you can't really measure it well until you're getting them or prolonged fast like where you don't eat for 4 days where as you know obviously when you're not eating for 16 hours if you're doing a Time restricted eating schedule meeting with an 8 hours in your fasting every night for 16 hours you know your your glycogen your liver glycogen starts to deplete at like 10 hours of of not amazing and you know something like this in your you know adipose tissue is releasing fatty acids and
01:01:39King some Ketone bodies you wouldn't necessarily be in the high level of ketosis or anything but you know D protein deacetylation starts to go down and you know this and AD levels rise depending on what you're looking at you can use things do start to happen like in between meals email so to some degree you can be in a fasted State maybe and not be necessarily fasting difference in value said the tests or run weather people can the Lively measure that sell Ketone body organ opposite level when beyond that say so so what happened was vast majority of lots and lots so they and many of the post office in grad students and Kennedy really driving signs they might have different schedules
01:02:39what happens if you come to live a different time and then they might be doing the essay a different time without any control of when the animals were fed up when how long the affair what type of food there an access to
01:02:53and then even if the mice are 12 hours apart staying or 16 hours of fasting one might get a result which is slightly higher than what it was without fasting with food but it's not supported civil because I've been no insecurities and roll them the same components and parameter can change over time even if we measure just fasting insulin level in my spirit you are fasting glucose level that has a very slow very small chance so in many cases people my discount it as nice in their system because somebody to do expanded morning someone did in the evening the Bell is a difference Adult Services noise so that's why people have come up with the longer fasting to see the test or to set it so that they can reproduce every say this is signal irrespective of what time of the day the postal code lasted an experiment but what we do with systematically we have
01:03:53Chevrolet motor timing so we will sample every 1 Hour 2 hours 3 hours the same anymore over multiple days one day 2 days even sometimes 3 days then we ask you a very simple question does it rise reproducibly
01:04:08everyday at the same time supposedly Ketone bodies do rise and the Menard go from 0 200 but they go from 0 to 10 every day then the second question is
01:04:24what is the benefit of Ketone bodies going to tan from zero on brain function of muscle function or heart function it's possible that maybe your brain Market much benefit but muscle and heart are getting some benefit and in that way you can see that if we carefully Monitor and then I asked specifically what are the benefits we can come up with where is where we can say even this 12 hours of fasting or not having the food in your system will create some of the benefit for her on a daily basis are some of the benefits from Barcelona Delicacies what is out of my 12-hour fasting of 16 hours fasting buses for days of fasting because otherwise you may go from 0 to 10 my benefit only one or two organ system that are benefits
01:05:24like for example when we have actually published papers showing that are blocks and notify gene expression does cycle on a daily basis and it's directed by some of the clock components amazed genetically mutant mice that don't have this clock components are available is that high or the other ways level is sexual or depending on which component does it go up during the fast food and restaurants go off during fasting Fizz in liver liver that's really cool
01:06:00I kind of got sidetracked here with this I talk with you because I don't know if you're interested in it but the thing is this repair process being you know in the fasting State and happening during the fasting State and like you said maybe there's a threshold where you know it's like obviously if your if your fasting for 14 or 16 hours every single day because you're eating within a Time restricted eating window that's also going to have benefits and you know you may have less of those benefits of what you're not cleaning up you know you don't have widespread apoptosis happening you're killing off all the damaged cells but you may be clearing up some protein aggregates or something you know every day on the steady-state sort of level which also is extremely important. It's almost like you know if you have a carpet if you vacuum it everyday or every other day then that remains clean by the same time every once a year you need a dipshit
01:07:00what vacuum but if you don't do that belly vacuum or at least once this Deli cleaning even though it's a low level very low level of the system that has a huge impact that goes along with any damage or repairing any strip challenge like if you were radiate like animals that are that are eaten you know on a Time restricted being a feeding sort of schedule where they're eating their food feeding feather food in a within 10 hours or so and challenge them with the repair the damage better because they use impact on the inner damage repair radiation damage repair a few years ago we are done a simple experiment that got highlighted in National Cancer Institute website
01:08:00that's it very simple straightforward experiment was a simple question that is how come humans skin is always exposed to sunlight or UV radiation and weighs many people get skin cancer but they never get hair cancer because he has the most rapidly dividing cells and so one would expect that they must be most sensitive to radiation damage and some damage. Sweaty too much or start with Allison. So we went back and checked and then realized that the hair follicles and every evening that sack idiom claw to bass all the damage DNA and make sure that the hair can grow back next day next morning
01:08:57Mmm Yeah so what is the real significance in July so we took the this mice and that did a simple experiment that is an opal many bone marrow transplant experiment my side irradiated and then the bone marrow is depleted on one can put the newborn Marion to the eye doctor this up by pretty well and if we get mice in the morning
01:09:268 o'clock then those mice lose 85% of it have and if we had the same mice for the same doors at 8 in the evening daily 10 85% of hair since a big like the evening that I dated my is the kid that hair perfectly fine now if we take a security and clock mutant mice what is it getting foggy outside be respectful of what time we lost hair
01:10:03akise story was much more about what which DNA repair enzymes regulated by Claude and how this works but this is a very simple straightforward experiment and similarly many percents to go through partial hepatectomy on people who have liver cancer that part of the liver is resected and then live liver grows back and in Mouse experiment at least a partial hepatectomy is down in the evening then those mice recover much faster than those weather app Academy West on the day time so that has inspired some people to think about this surgery time what time surgery should be done here at isn't so bad and so did your son just new ideas that I just come up in animal models in last 5 to 10 years or to take some time to really get some facts on India
01:11:03Samsung to figure out whether it's you know the combination of is it because they're getting more rest during that time during the resting fasted and resting so you know the combination of the mall or we know that the tumors grow slower in my eyes that eat only within certain time so time just repaired mice if we just implanted two more in there than the tumor will not draw as much as it might it randomly the same number of calories and another piece of gum from Route Patterson's group that women who passed for 13 hours overnight a protected from breast cancer yeah yeah so
01:11:54so that's really cool I wonder if the the with the at least the animal experiments were your implanting the tumor and their feta time restricted feeding schedule then if they're
01:12:09having more apoptosis more talk with you more DNA repair all these things are all sort of simultaneously happening because they're in a fasted state for longer possible the other thing that sort of on this whole fasting vs. Terry topic that gets asked a lot that I have to ask you a stupid coffee actually it's supposed to be caffeine like black coffee without any cream or any calories or anything like that
01:12:42how so caffeine can start
01:12:47things like clocks in her liver they do a lot of fasting whether you know they're they're fasting for 16 24 hours 48 hours but they drink caffeine and they noticed that they lose weight and so they say well I'm still getting results this is so it's fine I can drink my black coffee in obviously someone that's fasting for 48 hours it's very different than doing it the Tre schedule where you're eating for 10 hours a day or 11 hours a day and then fasting for you know 13 or 14 hours every night right so hyper person for example that wakes up in the morning drink black coffee at 7 a.m. to wake up have some black coffee 7 a.m. but they don't need anything but they don't eat their first bite of food until then when do they have to stop
01:13:47when that coffee started or is it when they eat the food so this is a question we also get to the app a lot and we actually posted a Blog and a website so here is a different thing so since we look at security and brother Mother whole exercise or activity and we know that caffeine research the body clock so for example
01:14:18drinking a cup of coffee is similar to having exposure to Bright Light for an hour hour-and-a-half so that's just on this Acadian clock itself now the question is well
01:14:32will it reset the clock the same way if the coffee comes in the morning versus evening or night and we know that that is a tomcar face response card so that means the same light it's a little extra light assembly tool reset the clock different play a different time of the day during their time when your system is expecting light if in the dark room and we see light doesn't reset the clock for the night time to visit o clock so we don't know
01:15:04what is the phase response card for coffee
01:15:08weather three sets much more at certain time and less out of the time the direct impact on of coffee and clock is on the thing that relates to Coffee sleep because coffee definitely suppresses sleep in Lord of people some people may be distant and the reason why we drink off his we wake up we get up from the bed but we may be still feeling sleepy anyway want to get that extra nosey that's why we drink coffee and along that line was drinking coffee at night is a straight no no fun because it will have impact on sleep but in the morning we are at the other question are you drinking coffee because you did not rest well
01:15:56that's not fast enough so maybe that's why you need coffee to reset your mental clock a brand clock to start it
01:16:04and sometimes it can be just pure habit or addiction program pool I used to like off in the morning and then I realized let's get rid of coffee what happened maybe Papa started as I have got a headache, and now I'm used to drinking just hot water it just a just a feeling of drinking sipping something from a sippy cup like in Babysitting something from sippy cup and that's what I was addicted to coffee with hot water and nothing changed I still have to buy out what I realized metabolism when I drink coffee is it going to trigger
01:16:58metabolism of certain things now got so that they got to think well now I have to start working today I stayed over and we think that's where that's where the metabolism of the function of the Guard to observe digest is coffee send. Catherine to liver and then to brand does Kickstart right after I drink coffee with a weird feeling the effect of coffee in the body because the stomach started working without your coffee and send it to liver liver my item metabolize it slightly and Saturday after the brand and body and then it gets back to kidney gets metabolized and excreted
01:17:43so then the question is
01:17:47forget about circadian clock now if we think about this metabolism and mitochondria function or even say go back to the office and then ask is caffeine in Breaking the first thing I saw that it starts stops out of it or it stops something else is that across town between say caffeine receptors located on the septic so that it does no fasting is kind of
01:18:17slightly over humidity in hundred percent spend 40% to 50% so that's why we say well if you can
01:18:28drink your coffee within this 8 hour 10 hours better
01:18:34by the same time we know I'm going back to the study that we discussed with Patterson study that did not consider coffee has food so when they considered 13 hours overnight fasting. 13 hours actually included coffee and tea send that to you know for cancer reducing breast cancer risk the starting hours of fasting can include coffee black coffee and tea this is where things are and we tend to air on the safe side so we tell well if you can
01:19:11have that coffee with the nail will getting window that's much better if you can then just have black coffee place that will not trigger your insulin response assistance so that's what we do this just started as a side note because you mentioned it I recently spoke with dr. Guido Cromer who is experiment Papa G and he was telling me about a study he had published a few years ago where are the specific polyphenols in coffee decaf or Catherine easy respective caffeine they triggered protein isolation which is one of the triggers for a taco cheese who actually increased food production
01:19:59has so many different ingredients that we don't know the activity many of them can have very different genes what is the last on to detect up protein carbohydrate and fat we have no idea what to do either alone or in combination right and then actually it's another question I print out some but that is a question that's frequently asked by people in the audience is like things that are xenobiotic like herbal tea even I guess to some degree people asking about flavored water so so water would that would contain for example like Steve or something you know does that start the clock and I think it's kind of answered that
01:20:59start actually triggering the pancreas to secrete extra insulin insulin is an anabolic hormone so it's not actually putting our body into a strong and I believe Drive sand. Vain many where does it say it said okay to have this non calorie company for but then it gets Mark here once we go to say Diet Coke or something else but that is artificial sweetener and then we don't we know that the artificial sweetener have any impact on gut microbiome and that's what things to come right on these are very practical questions for the same time
01:21:41we don't foresee that even though there be any control clinical trial to to assess a pet on this
01:21:50there's nutraceuticals Raymond things that we take for granted so this is what I can
01:22:00the end of one experiment self-expression kiss and hug yourself trying different kind of Behavioral intervention where you switch from water to flavor what does it make you feel different when it's not only weight can one asked why I said sleep activity feeling alot feeling productive and fasting blood glucose levels because I will let you do if you have a fasting if you have a continuous glucose monitoring system experimentation by inform citizens for very careful than not really they don't have any adverse metabolic disease and I'm not promoting the concert start doing Celtics
01:23:00Bob Norton the feedback sex and then we'll compile all of those and then that will help us to take in from this isn't a wild animal experiments at Mission animals we have tested this this is how it works and infusion maybe that work together some money my diet coke I was in my fasting window and all the sudden my blood glucose levels heard it to get worse and all the single have multiple people tell me that but you know people are asking about things like even supplements and I think like you know again you've answered that we don't you know you know what are you taking fish oil is it a fatty acid I mean maybe you got it there's lots of things here because that is you know if you're taking a fish oil supplement then what do you think that's different than taking for example vitamin D or
01:24:00the question of why I like this kind of like to compare this to say physical activity somebody is completely sedentary for that person
01:24:13going for a walk with her in the morning or evening I midnight doesn't matter because this person is getting some benefits of physical activity similar leave somebody is very low on vitamin D needs that fish oil supplement then what time the person takes doesn't have doesn't matter because that depends is getting corrected yeah that's true so that's true but then if someone and now. Is it slightly higher and says well you know I want to have this protein drink that's 25 gram of protein after my exercise late at night is it okay then that's where I will say well that's going to affect your baby if you have done a very strenuous exercise
01:25:06it's a training for like Iron Man or something like that yes you have to have that you know eat late at night after weight training that would counter and I think that's kind of pushing it a little bit what do you want most out of it like for example of a used to training late at night and having that protein and carb drink right after that what if you do little self-experimentation and move that to survive at 6 and see whether it actually helps you do one extra pass out so do I go for another 5 minutes or is it actually come from compromising your performance so it's okay and it said very personal and then some of these kind of cells to the Limit
01:26:05they want to squeeze the last drop of performance out of it and put them I think self-experimentation is the best way because there is no way we are scientists we can do that kind of stuff in our lives with a number of subjects were as competent as stem and then controlling for everything that you did show in one in one ear animal studies that is shorter feeding window for these animals like for example 9 hours or later by now you do have some be able to squeeze the last drop by and the reason why you didn't text I meant was we talked about it myself feeling faster for long time will their athletic performance or muscle performance go down because
01:27:05play was the Depo pronounce athletic performance bike go down and that way it might be harmful for some people for home physical activity is needed for example I see Parker's that they need that physical how much weight a person can lift that did not change that stayed the same but they endurance being on the treadmill for a long time. Actually significantly increased in some cases in doubles so what is this to myself I've done I've done like a tower 8 or 9 hour eating you know schedule and the next day so if I'm fasting for a longer period the next day I go for a run in the morning and my insurance is and this is I mean we're talking like 5 or 6 times maybe 7 times I've noticed it
01:28:05how to clean prove it I mean it's incredible like I just can't keep running late where is usually I'm tired and I reach the mark where I'm like okay this is it finally I'm getting any snow we say that there are many people who have given us this feedback that that dress. Go off and then again they then endurance improves and then once in awhile so I can go back to 12 hours recent studies coming out in the last year or so where exhaustion is Ketone bodies have been given to endurance athletes improve their endurance which makes sense because I'm Durance is heavily relies on mitochondria right so I mean it completely I mean if that's actually part of the mechanism which term refers to eating in terms of
01:29:05faster. One would presume would have higher levels of Ketone bodies with the grip strength but you know it depends on whether or not if you're pushing them to a high enough intensity where do it becoming glycolytic or not I don't know maybe we can ask questions to my people who are actually doing something very different kind of exercise exercise buses intense exercise does a very different maybe they can give us feedback to see what happens or did say lean muscle mass Implement only on my eyes that are given standard diet
01:30:05they were given the normal diet how what was there eating schedule lean muscle mass know this is that something like do you know why that is it has been looked at the sun. That's another thing
01:30:28pc-1 Express on a muscle so that might be an increase in mitochondria function surprisingly same as we saw that is less glycogen and muscle
01:30:44and that's kind of counterintuitive you might think that filed the muscles maybe we can load it with black accents telling my husband up but at the same time what we think is maybe because I have less like us and we know that if the muscle has less like us and then after our normal activity than glycogen may be completely depleted and when they eat they have much better feeling less pain so that means I must better glycogen synthesis response that may be making and breaking like as in making and breaking triglyceride on a daily basis of protein on a daily basis send. Where I think that may be mentoring much better muscle health because they also going to some gluconeogenesis is a breaking down some protein so maybe some of the structural proteins are modified and maybe they get damaged that kind of getting cleanse negative clean out of the system but is eating and fasting for them
01:31:44so it's again it's all speculation so we have to go back to the muscle killer very interested I mean increasingly muscle mass is hard to do and there's a lot of it huge interest in it huge interest play in multiple now in multiple strands of mice and it happens with the balanced diet so this is where the nutrition quality does so you can expect people to go in the same car they pulled and expect the most masculine rice some of these other questions that are just frequently asked you know a lot of people just really they weren't they want to do time restricted eating and they want to do it right and so that you know some of these questions
01:32:44be a little silly but it just shows how people are thinking like for example does just toothpaste start the clock if it'll swallowing security and Clark live so that's why we always get connected but time is the rating has alternate feeding passed in that hole physiology tied to it the other way to ask the question is does brushing your teeth or mouth was break the traditional definition of fasting and definitely it's not that it's not putting food in your stomach so that the stomach will start processing it and Insulin starts
01:33:39going outside Lee and blood glucose going outside. Where to keep in mind that would bring their definition back once in awhile some other people are we talked about the night shift work and so that was that was good and you also mentioned another side another thing people asking about is when can you start itinerary schedule in a person's life like developmental we can you start as a toddler is it too early I mean
01:34:13I think yeah so we know that in New Bern the suprachiasmatic nucleus is not even fully developed and it may not even fully connected to the rest of the body and that makes sense because the babies are going to a very rapid growth phase and what the need adult time is lot of nutrition Landreth so desirable
01:34:49it can trigger adverse effects so I don't recommend I think is when babies are toddlers begin to sleep 8 to 9 hours continuously throw night anyways now that physiology of the sleep pattern is already getting used to being without 44728 on maybe 9 hours and that may be a time where at least one can begin the first time that reading that is just scheduled a well-defined morning breakfast time at the last meal
01:35:32Urban bedtime England showing that babies were having a very regular schedule and also last meal
01:35:47are protected from childhood obesity even 5 6 7 years down the road
01:35:52so all of that did not measure when they say babies waiting on all that stuff what I think is having a regular bedtime itself is a very strong timing q that says babies are going to bed at a certain time and most babies will sleep for eight nine even 10 hours so they're already into 10 hours of fasting just fell asleep
01:36:15and then it takes an hour for them to get up and then get ready and then start eating all for some babies they may just finished eating and then they're reading a book or something and somebody's getting them a story book so that your dad that one hour between the last food and going to bed soon. I think the rule of time would be when babies start to sleep for 8 to 9 hours continuously then that would be a good time to start putting them to bed at 6 time and then the next thing would be giving them back part of the same time every day I'm having the last meal of the dinner time fixed so then the body gets used to it and then by the time
01:36:58Elementary School he'll be easy to put them to a doctor 12 hours eating time and then if they want maybe they can go down to 10 or 12 so that itself is a very good limit on them so I think it's something that you can start very early on and it can be a lifelong habit excellent
01:37:26I was here or the other really common ones
01:37:31some people are kind of curious whether or not there's if anyone's looked at or even if you have any thoughts about within your eating window like does it matter if you're having lots of frequent meals or two meals do I I kind of go back and forth between what we know about metabolism and response waiting and we know every time we eat a good amount of food even a good size snack is enough sugar in most of this novel trigger insulin response a couple of hours and then
01:38:19so every time we eat we essentially trigger on insulin to go outside late so that is this anabolic
01:38:26hormone going up and staying up for maybe one or two hours send. Where about is getting into that fat storing more every time we eat
01:38:38so with that in mind I would say said the smaller number of males within that 8 and 9 hours is better than eating every 1 hour within that at 9 hours but again this is why we don't have hard data and it's just going by my prediction based on what we saw from physiology and for this is again this might hold true for normal healthy people who do not become hypoglycemic thing that we find with many people to adopt theory that what happens is after
01:39:2114 to 16 hours of fasting they're hungry to have a good breakfast and if they have a good breakfast with an offset protein fat and some complex, then naturally they will not feel hungry for 7 to 8 hours night and sent it. Even happen to me I ate mostly two meals my big breakfast and then I go to dinner and actually helps me stay productive throughout the day I don't have to wear that one I was looking for for having lunch and then the postprandial
01:40:04saw that series last number of meals made with expensive what I eat for breakfast and I've known as change like if I eat like breakfast it's gotten higher protein 5lb satiated for much longer and as opposed to or even have higher fiber as opposed to it for example if I eat yogurt and some berries not good I wasn't sure. Talk for mentioning me in at what we do know about metabolism and how even you know small amount of food can trigger an insulin response and just do you know what the ketogenic just that only just eating fat and the reverse is about would be also I guess you know if you think about metabolism we know that like that meal you know
01:41:04if you're going to use that fat as energy you have to let you know it has to be imported into the mitochondria and Roses process called beta oxidation there's Transporters those also are regulated by guess what second meal will probably not be used as energy but some people think that particular diet is rich in protein that doesn't mean that it's only pure protein is one simple example is many people think that lentils are high in proteins are lentils they can just eat lentils and they'll get put into a circle until 7 after 25% for 10
01:42:00and 70% almost almost 70% carb insulin that's great I'll see what other ones that are really frequently Asked we talked about the antibiotics obviously Pharmaceuticals as if your doctor tells you to take a pharmaceutical tonight then then you have to pick a night and your doctor overrides any other
01:42:37xenobiotics themselves are on a circadian metabolism is strongly Security in and nobody to take care of degrading enzyme some so I actually did that the transcription factors that control many of the cytochrome p450 is there breakdowns antibiotics and these are strongest man in fact lot of is Acadian Rhythm research we use one of The xenobiotic Regulators as a reporter because even the security and clock components and not as robust as the Novak metabolizing so that's why
01:43:24symptoms of gingivitis almost every step of the xenobiotic absorption and Metabolism excretion is strongest kid in the regulator and that's a new area of circadian rhythm results so that is what time of the day medication maybe better absorbed and better and most effective because any medication that you take to actually going and interacting with the protein in most cases it's going on in everything are stopping at protein the activity in that protein
01:44:01what is a protein is actually not there then we essentially taking a drug with no benefit and the protein turns up so for example we take the medication in the morning but the protein actually wants to play in the evening
01:44:15so then
01:44:17this medication has no impact and then the doctor will keep on increasing the doses so that it comes to a point that is some medication that sleeps remaining at the end of the day it will start to have it intended effect but then decided what time of the day it given Brock Target reaches its peak and can we match drop timing with its Target so that we can have the same effect with less of the drug so that we can do side-by-side it packed and we can increase efficacy so that's a whole new area officials that's going on and the small of the most impactful statement about that is essentially people have found that nearly 70% of FDA approved drugs
01:45:14other targets cycling in the body so that means what's 70% of a beer drugs just timing can make it a drug or make it a poison wow. That would be an amazing area play something from circles and but I don't personally take Pharmaceuticals but I do take things like turmeric curcumin, can I take my curcumin at a certain time of day and it's more effective I get more bang for my buck you know because it doesn't capitalize quickly so I would like to find you know that's kind of cool okay I think
01:46:06I think they're covered
01:46:08questions that are pretty frequently Asked yeah great
01:46:15so again this getting back to the the mycircadianclock I think it's sort of key because you're you're aggravating data from all over the world right now for so we have people from almost every continent except Antarctica so if somebody is going on over there research station because the espestice on the next one we will listen it on. In every 90 minutes of the City of Sunrise and Sunset and Dad the ultimate ship workers we know that
01:47:09best regulated the Lord and reassembly the Isis is fitted with security and lighting so they will go through a simulation of Light Dark cycle North light. Cycle blue light and raised and red light and waste that kind of cycle so we'll see how it improves their life. Some people putting comments which I probably extremely useful you're learning obviously things like the IBS and all these things are learning from people putting their comments is there any mode of tracking like
01:47:47cognitive function or mental function or is it just the comments that you're so we actually we're going to release a newer version of the app based on many come inside we received outside of a little bit more user-friendly hopefully and
01:48:05yes if we add more functionality to the then it becomes more complicated for a lot of people where we have to write balanced or maybe bring up some cognitive functions link them link to other apps that do cuz I'm in whether or not I'm sure to eating affects cognitive function and performance and also just bring Aging in general you know cuz we do know that shift workers for example shift workers that have worked like 10 years have like their brains Asia like an accelerated rate with brains look like six and a half years older than age match controls or something I didn't hear some animal studies showing
01:48:56if you make my seat when I supposed to eat when they usually sleeping so for them for the day I think they're like hippocampal function was like messed up or long-term potentiation was messed up and running memories what is doing pretty good for the high fat diet for Vice Lord of cognitive functions and social. That's Acadian clogged 8 randomly we know that there is a problem with brain function and now they will those kind of experimental guide us to see if we give the same high-fat diet within 8 hours and 9 hours to mice and we do the same as is what will happen mother will see Improvement in benefits so that's one of the other set of experiments that will be very useful when I answer somebody else must be doing it because if I can think of an experiment somebody else that's the tech
01:49:56animal models of Parkinson's disease Alzheimer's disease and then put them on time surprised if we see this kind of stuff is coming out in the next 6 months or a year Shirley I mean if if you're clearing away at the very least clearing away from these protein aggregates because you're having a constant fasting. Then you if indeed this protein aggregates are affecting cognitive function you would imagine that that would be an improvement LOL so it would last week of three four years one of the big things that came out from sleep studies in the last few years is we knew sleep improves learning and memory synaptic plasticity it's extra sleep actually improves
01:50:56gunk in the brain gets broken down and is clean during this sleep time and I would say that that is that might be because of course in all these studies the animals we're eating less when they sleep and so then the question is how much of fasting contributed to Cleansing the brand exit, and then Super interesting very interesting affecting maybe this antibiotic metabolism or something else so it's kind of interesting that we did a very simple experiment few years ago and now we have more questions than answers and this is exciting yes do you have any that would be
01:51:56heart disease to see what is the impact of time just repeating on this mouse models and of course we can all just take one miles model we have to use a multiple number of miles model does to make sure that this is at least in my eyes we can assist with a benefit of adverse effects on multiple strains and then we can come to human body systems like one of the major ways the brain clears and acts like he said among other Gunk and things that that's part of the gunk so that would be extremely interesting to see if the Fitbit your eating schedule also affected affected that as well definitely no shortage of interesting things to see what side can mycelium clock. What
01:52:47that website has lot of information as blogs and also in the first place in the informed consent what we do we asked people to go to the informed consent to see what they asked to do or what they may volunteer to do as part of the study that might give us some information about themselves and in that way we can relate as we increase the number of fans we have more participants will always have some participants to belong to certain areas grow gender or socio-economic conditions of demographic send that way we can always figure out what is the existing lifestyle and what they tend to change what they can sense
01:53:37and then I put the sign up they got they got the copy of the informed consent in the email so it's very important that you give a email address that actually works we are not going to use the email for anything else and we are actually overseen by a committee of Ethics Ethics Committee who reviews everything that we do
01:53:59any data that we even in future if we want to see I passed to go to that detects committed cannot be given to any entity for profit and send out why we went to privacy very strongly
01:54:14and then wants to download the app and start collecting one interesting thing is what we find people hear about our study through podcast other things and they start doing decent time today anything from Get Go send that way you don't get a picture of snap sort of what is the lifestyle before they adopt a time that you're dating so one request is for the first one or two weeks it's better if they just continue their current lifestyle thing in the middle of the night once in awhile it's better to have that so that we can set this was the people killing themselves compare this was my lifestyle before and then after 2 weeks when they said that new goal or in the same all I can do only 10 hours that's fine but 12 hours or even 8 hours
01:55:06then I can compare how was life before. How is life after Theory and we can compare those two
01:55:13and what happened to his yes we asked to log a lot of different things some people do it and some people may not like to do it but that's okay if you a people can log at least one thing whether it's late but it's poured then that's much better than not looking at all LOL get into the habit of time to today eating for 4 to 6 weeks and then they stopped recording and we know that they actually that's okay I don't need this guidance so I don't need all this that I can do it by myself and that's fine but for us it'll be really nice if they can please deposit the last fast and last meal for the best product at 12 weeks
01:56:04cuz all of this will help us to figure out whether you're actually falling off the wagon or you got it so that you don't have to do it for 12 weeks send the next one of the app for when we go to at 6, tea and ask permission will say well you know we are finding that people get used to it in 6 weeks we don't have to ask them to monitor everything for 12 bucks so all these things
01:56:29and then once in a while giving us some feedback if you see some improvement please share with us if you see any adverse impact that's much more important please share with us because then we'll know what are the adverse impact and we can report that to our committee and also we can go back to my house and then see why this happened and then at the end up 12 weeks if people can record set of body weight or any other measures that they can also help us that will help us to go back to my house or even report including the final Publications because what we're saying is we might begin to start publishing from the app from end of this year on words and the many different ways
01:57:17one can dissect a dick. So the many different ways we can Publix it so the more information we have what happened in the sponsor Theory
01:57:28the better it is and maybe we'll go back and then it takes comedy can you tell us are you sticking with this habit of what actually met him not to stick with they have it because those things are also important what are the other lifestyle factors that are preventing us to stick to a meeting schedule
01:57:57so do you want to learn from people and we are not kind of lawn it's the other way around and start doing control clinical trial and taking it to people we want to get from people's experience and then see what steaks are done steak and then go back to basics on bedside and then back to basic thinking about things you wouldn't have even known to think about because you know I left him from people's feedback is when he did the small time to start deleting study when they're only eight participants but all eight of them said they slept better and we have never asked if my sweater this is so he went back to the Flies and we saw that they were sleeping better than we went back and look at the brain
01:58:57skip time to save while at sleeping better. This is one example of why we went from a feedback to doing a basic science research and flies and actually publishing that data in science and then moving on to do more money plus Tony's Sutton panda panda if I let me know tonight because you are doing the right thing for science signs to the Mars this is what we signed it's going to do and we need people like you
01:59:50alright guys I want to mention three quick things the first is that if you're interested in time restricted eating and want to give it a shot make sure to consider contributing your data to Sachin study you have to be 18 years of age or older but it's now open up to International participation in the basics are pretty straightforward the first step is to submit a 2-week bassline by eating like you normally would but logging it by taking a picture of it with your phone this part is actually important because at this stage or just tracking what you would normally do and when you take that picture with the app it creates a timestamp for that thing you just ate or drank for many people not deliberately practicing timer started eating yet this initial Baseline is a great way to find out that you're probably eating with him something like a 15-hour window rather than a 12 11 10 9 or even 8-hour window and that you have room for improvement after you do that initial two-week Baseline then you have the option to pick a new eating window you'd like to try out and think you can stick to for at least 12 weeks that's three months which is about the time it takes to really lock it and you
02:00:50that's it you have the option to add an other helpful date as well as you go along in particular they really like to try to get your weight once a week but by at least getting the minimum amount of data especially a picture of your first and last meal and sting with it you're really helping out dr. Panda's group and probably getting a little bit healthier in the process to sign up for dr. Panda's trial head over to mycircadianclock. Org that's circadian circadian once again mycircadianclock. Org the second thing I want to mention before we go visit this podcast is brought to you by listeners just like you so if you like this podcast and think we're doing a great thing head over to foundmyfitness. Com proud sponsor the best part about supporting the podcast in this way that is accessible to everyone because it's a pay-what-you-can subscription for some people that's going to be a mount that covers a latte and for others it might be a little bit more even sometimes less basically whatever it's worth to you this helps us to make our content free or nearly as
02:01:50free as humanly possible which means more people are able to be in Rich buy it I am so thankful to all of you that help me to be able to do that for those of you participating I try to throw a little perks like exclusive Q&A session sometimes and other odds and ends as well to make it worth everyone's well once again if you like what we're doing here I found my fitness you can get in on sending over a little pay-what-you-can support but heading over to foundmyfitness. Com forward slash proud sponsor that's found my fitness.com for a crowd sponsor Crown sponsor finally won last mention if you've done a 23andMe genetic test to provide you with Rodger that you can run through other services I have one of my website where you can learn about an interesting genetic polymorphism that affect metabolism nutrition and more I'm continually improving this report and I've also just added a few circadian related polymorphisms recently as well if that's interesting to you you can check it out at foundmyfitness. Com genetics once again that's found my fitness.com for genetics
02:02:50that's all I've got thank you so much for listening until next time I'm out of here

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