Full Transcript for Free Word Lecture with Misan Harriman | Bradford Literature Festival 2026

photographers, but I'm gonna get you a camera. 00:06:07.519 --> 00:06:12.319 So we went to um to India, to Rajasthan, beautiful part of the world. 00:06:12.480 --> 00:06:22.160 And she had bought me a camera, and we were pregnant with our first child, and I took a whole bunch of crap photos of a very beautiful part of the world. 00:06:22.480 --> 00:06:40.720 But the thing about uh this kind of new world for someone like me who would have struggled in a traditional photo school is that I realized that there were men and women who had made YouTube videos of all the questions that I needed to ask. 00:06:41.199 --> 00:06:42.480 How does ISO work? 00:06:42.560 --> 00:06:44.319 How does shutter speed work? 00:06:44.720 --> 00:06:46.079 What is an F-stop? 00:06:46.319 --> 00:06:47.519 And I learned really quickly. 00:06:47.680 --> 00:06:55.759 I also I became the photographer that I am today by failing, failing, failing, and failing. 00:06:57.199 --> 00:07:21.759 Shortly after we became parents, a man that looks like me, called George Floyd, was lying in his own piss, begging for his mama, while still calling the men with their knees on his neck, sir, as he left this mortal coil. 00:07:23.120 --> 00:07:28.480 And I remember looking to my wife again saying, I don't have any more tears. 00:07:29.199 --> 00:07:30.959 And she was like, Look to your camera. 00:07:31.040 --> 00:07:32.000 I was like, and do what? 00:07:32.160 --> 00:07:33.600 She goes, look to your camera. 00:07:33.759 --> 00:07:48.079 And I remember taking the train to London, going to Hyde Park for my first sort of protest after George Floyd was lynched, not knowing if there'll be five or five thousand people there. 00:07:49.040 --> 00:07:50.879 And the people came. 00:07:51.439 --> 00:07:58.000 All walks of life, all races, all religions, and I started taking photographs. 00:07:58.639 --> 00:08:01.120 It's my clicker alive? 00:08:06.399 --> 00:08:08.000 It's not clicking. 00:08:08.720 --> 00:08:10.079 I think it's on. 00:08:13.439 --> 00:08:15.199 And I'll continue talking. 00:08:15.360 --> 00:08:16.959 Someone probably come and fix it. 00:08:17.279 --> 00:08:18.800 Ah, there we are. 00:08:19.040 --> 00:08:26.160 Um and the images I took, it was it was it was really strange because I was photographing my own trauma. 00:08:26.240 --> 00:08:30.800 So this image here has become one of the most shared, it's been seen by over a billion people. 00:08:31.040 --> 00:08:34.639 Um, one of the most shared civil rights images of the digital age. 00:08:34.799 --> 00:08:37.039 And I've become family with Darcy. 00:08:37.200 --> 00:08:39.840 She's a field hockey player for England. 00:08:40.399 --> 00:08:45.440 And she had a disagreement with friends and family about whether she should go. 00:08:45.600 --> 00:08:50.720 And she decided to go, and you can see the paint is still drying on the sign. 00:08:51.120 --> 00:08:57.440 And if she had taken a different train, if I had been looking in a different direction, this is a nine elms lane outside the US Embassy. 00:08:57.600 --> 00:09:01.200 We would never have met each other on the street. 00:09:01.679 --> 00:09:06.159 And of course, as I pressed the shutter, someone threw their fists in the air. 00:09:06.399 --> 00:09:10.000 And the rest, as they say, really is history. 00:09:10.320 --> 00:09:22.080 Martin Luther King's son, this the son of the woman I just showed you, saw this image, didn't know who I was, didn't even know it was taken in England, and was so moved that he shared it. 00:09:22.320 --> 00:09:32.720 And then all those celebritons started sharing it, and um my life, I would say, really did change forever because of this image. 00:09:33.279 --> 00:09:34.799 This is in Guildford. 00:09:35.759 --> 00:09:46.320 Small protests, really moving protests, because there's something about our youth, and God, I swear by this, they've never been on the wrong side of history, our young people. 00:09:46.639 --> 00:09:49.120 We should respect and learn from them. 00:09:49.840 --> 00:09:59.919 And this young woman, as a black man, I always hear black lives matter, black lives matter, but I had never seen a sign like this before saying matter is a minimum. 00:10:00.480 --> 00:10:04.240 That we are worthy, beloved, and needed. 00:10:04.799 --> 00:10:07.200 Once again, a young mind wrote that. 00:10:07.360 --> 00:10:11.440 That's not her professor or father or mother, that's what she feels. 00:10:12.080 --> 00:10:17.759 And I don't know about you, but we could listen to those words and take heed of them. 00:10:18.799 --> 00:10:24.159 And I went on this journey, photographing all around London. 00:10:25.759 --> 00:10:27.600 You fucked with the last generation. 00:10:27.679 --> 00:10:28.720 It's an interesting image. 00:10:28.879 --> 00:10:32.240 The way he's staring, that's on Parliament Square. 00:10:32.480 --> 00:10:36.399 And I remember just thinking, I've never experienced this before. 00:10:36.639 --> 00:10:44.320 So many people that are so sure that we can have an alternative to what the status quo is. 00:10:46.720 --> 00:10:48.559 This image broke me. 00:10:49.039 --> 00:10:49.840 It broke me. 00:10:50.000 --> 00:10:54.720 I was in my editing suite and just looking through the images, and it was a tough day. 00:10:54.799 --> 00:10:56.720 It's hard to take these pictures. 00:10:56.960 --> 00:10:58.879 This is all in 2020. 00:10:59.039 --> 00:11:13.440 And to see this young man in, you know, this is just after lockdown, and God knows he has his own challenges in the wheelchair with his mother, and there's spots of rain falling down, a sea of fists behind him. 00:11:13.519 --> 00:11:21.600 And I and I looked at this image and I was like, my God, if this isn't hope, I don't know what hope would be. 00:11:22.799 --> 00:11:28.960 He's coming out for the dignity of people that look like me with the challenges that he has. 00:11:29.519 --> 00:11:38.559 And I'm like, I want to be part of the community

that this mother and young man are proud to build. 00:11:40.000 --> 00:11:45.279 Sometimes you can take an image and not realize what you've taken. 00:11:45.679 --> 00:11:49.120 So I saw those eyes, and I saw my eyes. 00:11:49.279 --> 00:11:50.799 I saw shared trauma. 00:11:50.960 --> 00:11:55.360 I saw the invisible handshake of the decisive moment of taking a picture. 00:11:55.519 --> 00:12:04.879 It wasn't again till I looked at the image properly, and I was like, Because there's someone behind this man holding a sign. 00:12:05.039 --> 00:12:08.559 You can barely see most of it, but there are two lines you can see. 00:12:09.200 --> 00:12:12.960 I am not a moment, but can you see us now? 00:12:14.399 --> 00:12:18.879 I sometimes think certain images choose you. 00:12:26.159 --> 00:12:27.200 My mental health. 00:12:27.360 --> 00:12:46.159 I you know, I I I was having a particularly low day, it was a big protest, and I was I was gonna go home, and I remember just double taking, and I just saw these ocean blue eyes, but little, little head, and I was like, no. 00:12:47.200 --> 00:12:54.639 And I walk up to this man, and we've become friends now, his name's Roger, and I was like, what the f are you doing? 00:12:55.200 --> 00:13:07.120 And he's like, I believe in the osmosis effect of protest, and she may not remember, her name's Juno, and she may not remember, but something from this day will be part of her. 00:13:07.840 --> 00:13:09.600 And I was holding back tears. 00:13:09.759 --> 00:13:10.159 Woof. 00:13:11.120 --> 00:13:18.960 And in my um exhibition, which is still ongoing, he came with Juno, who's this high now. 00:13:19.759 --> 00:13:27.039 And and again, she's part of this legacy that many of us are really trying to build. 00:13:29.440 --> 00:13:39.120 I laugh because my first professional gig as a photographer was one of the most important uh uh I guess fashion shoots in this in this country. 00:13:39.360 --> 00:13:45.120 I'll never forget when I got the Zoom call and lots of different heads popped up, you know, from Vogue. 00:13:45.200 --> 00:13:46.000 I thought, oh. 00:13:46.320 --> 00:13:51.039 And then Edward Eningfall said, Oh, Miss Ann, we're giving you the cover, and I was like, the cover? 00:13:51.200 --> 00:13:53.360 I had no idea what was going on. 00:13:53.600 --> 00:13:56.000 And he goes, Yeah, you've got September. 00:13:56.799 --> 00:14:18.559 And I remember taking the train to Manchester to Marcus Rashford's house, and him being really nervous, and he was doing keepy opies with his mates to feel a little we were all nervous, but we also knew that if we nailed this, it could be something really, really important in that moment six years ago. 00:14:18.720 --> 00:14:22.320 And it's really rare to have a black and white cover of any fashion magazine. 00:14:22.399 --> 00:14:35.840 It's really rare to have a man, uh, and it's even more rare to have a black man, and then to have this extraordinary black woman, Adwa, who who is a model and activist, it was just you couldn't do this cover today. 00:14:36.159 --> 00:14:46.960 Um, and um, it changed my life, and suddenly people knew uh of me and my work, and other phone calls happened. 00:14:47.200 --> 00:14:57.279 And with Lewis, it was interesting because I was asked to photograph him, um, but we're both dyslexic, so there was you know a potential real connection. 00:14:57.360 --> 00:14:59.360 So they also asked me to interview him. 00:14:59.600 --> 00:15:12.399 So I interviewed him and shot him for GQ Man of the Year, and he was so gentle and and and listened intently to everything um that I was talking about and spoke about how he was bullied a lot. 00:15:13.120 --> 00:15:17.360 He was small, and his father will say, You do your fighting on the track. 00:15:17.919 --> 00:15:22.480 They would take spare parts of other go-karts to get theirs built. 00:15:22.879 --> 00:15:26.000 And look, look at what he's done with his life. 00:15:26.240 --> 00:15:30.159 And he's donated a lot of money to all the things that we all care about. 00:15:32.559 --> 00:15:36.559 Another woman with a big heart, you know, Angelina Jolie. 00:15:36.720 --> 00:15:42.799 I remember when um we were waiting for her, and um I was like, Oh, I'd love to have her go up on the roof. 00:15:42.879 --> 00:15:44.480 They're like, no, no, no roof. 00:15:44.879 --> 00:15:46.480 And she arrived, and I was like, hello. 00:15:46.639 --> 00:15:48.159 She goes, call me Angie. 00:15:48.240 --> 00:15:50.480 Uh I was like, I would love, you know, I love natural light. 00:15:50.639 --> 00:15:51.919 She goes, of course. 00:15:52.240 --> 00:15:56.480 And literally, as we we go up onto the roof, it was like a gray London day. 00:15:56.559 --> 00:16:04.559 As this woman stepped onto the roof, the clouds just parted, and this golden light shone upon her. 00:16:05.039 --> 00:16:08.720 And um, she's she's a woman of of deep moral clarity. 00:16:08.879 --> 00:16:15.759 She's been you know insulted and harassed by her own father because of her stance for Palestine. 00:16:15.919 --> 00:16:21.519 And she still speaks, and as you saw earlier in the year, she went to Jordan to continue the work. 00:16:23.039 --> 00:16:33.840 And then I get a phone call from a head hunter saying, we're considering you know the new chair for South Bank Center, and of course I laughed saying, you know, are you for real? 00:16:33.919 --> 00:16:44.080 And and um then I started thinking about how much time I spent there, how much I love the fact that it was one of the most inclusive spaces we have for art and culture. 00:16:44.399 --> 00:16:58.960 And a long interview process later, I became again the first black chair of this country's largest cultural institution, set up just after we were licking our wounds from war 75 years ago. 00:16:59.120 --> 00:17:02.879 The great village hall, 40% of our programming is still free. 00:17:03.039 --> 00:17:14.079 Everything from the skate park to the classical music

inside to hosting the BAFTAs, but more really a space where it doesn't matter who you are, you don't reduce yourself in South Bank. 00:17:14.160 --> 00:17:18.720 It isn't a golden, gilded palace where things cost so much. 00:17:18.880 --> 00:17:25.200 It's a place for you to discover who you are, who you could be, and belong. 00:17:25.599 --> 00:17:29.440 And I'm deeply proud of my association of such an institution. 00:17:32.079 --> 00:17:34.480 My wife's like, you really like movies? 00:17:34.960 --> 00:17:35.920 I was like, I do. 00:17:36.079 --> 00:17:43.039 And she's like, that is the thing that you haven't really been sure enough to try. 00:17:43.599 --> 00:17:49.359 So I came up with this story, found a good script writer, and we pitched Netflix. 00:17:49.759 --> 00:17:57.119 Netflix somehow said yes to a story about grief and masculinity called The After. 00:17:57.759 --> 00:18:05.039 I had no idea, and there's nowhere to hide, by the way, when you make a film, right, where it would go. 00:18:05.279 --> 00:18:07.920 And it did end up being nominated for an Oscar. 00:18:08.079 --> 00:18:10.559 It it is um something I'm deeply proud of. 00:18:10.720 --> 00:18:16.079 I remember DMing David O'Yellow, or big actor, thinking, well, he's not gonna respond. 00:18:16.240 --> 00:18:20.000 And he responded saying, Oh, I love your pictures, let's make a movie together. 00:18:20.319 --> 00:18:22.640 So DMs can work. 00:18:23.839 --> 00:18:25.279 Don't be shy. 00:18:27.279 --> 00:18:37.119 And as all of these things were happening, I guess I could have stayed on red carpets or fancy yachts and can film festival photographing very famous people. 00:18:37.440 --> 00:18:41.200 But as I as I said at the beginning of this, I'm a child of empire. 00:18:41.359 --> 00:18:51.599 And there's something in my bones that I I just can't let go of when I see injustice happening to people who haven't won the lottery of life. 00:18:51.839 --> 00:19:01.119 So when Save the Children asked me to become the ambassador, I've been working, you know, with them quietly, but they're like, we would love you to step up. 00:19:01.359 --> 00:19:04.319 And it was and still is a great honor. 00:19:04.799 --> 00:19:12.079 I uh went pretty quickly to Somalia to document what's happening in the Horn of Africa. 00:19:12.400 --> 00:19:25.680 The images I took, I was I remember being so excited because I had these images, I had a good understanding of what you could do to make sure famine doesn't come and and and and have children perish. 00:19:26.160 --> 00:19:37.039 And I get back to England and I have lots of contacts in the press, and I called a senior contact, and he goes, mate, you're a friend of mine, if you are coming back from Ukraine, I would run this story. 00:19:37.200 --> 00:19:38.720 He said it to my face. 00:19:40.160 --> 00:19:45.599 I got one, I think the FT ran a story off my trip, and no one else did. 00:19:46.720 --> 00:19:58.480 Trying to humanize these mothers that walk miles and have to learn how to keep their children alive under unimaginable circumstances. 00:19:58.720 --> 00:20:07.680 Because of the war in Ukraine, so much of the wheat, many people don't know this, Ukraine feeds a lot of East Africa. 00:20:08.000 --> 00:20:17.200 And when that stopped exponentially, the price of food goods in the market went up and it makes it even harder to survive. 00:20:17.519 --> 00:20:27.519 Which is why it's so important when our press decides whose humanity matters for all of you to be their voice. 00:20:27.680 --> 00:20:34.559 Whether it's on your WhatsApp group, whether it's arguing with your friends or colleagues, humanize these people. 00:20:35.680 --> 00:20:36.640 Humanize them. 00:20:36.799 --> 00:20:47.839 And speaking of humanizing, after October 7th, I did actually even before, before October 7th, I was shooting Palestine protests because I photograph all protests. 00:20:49.200 --> 00:20:59.920 This image on the embankment is of two men who, again, we have been told that they're supposed to hate each other. 00:21:00.160 --> 00:21:04.000 And I've seen them in almost every protest, and they're always there. 00:21:04.559 --> 00:21:17.279 And I just think it's such a powerful rebuke of algorithms and bad actors trying to keep us on islands of rage. 00:21:18.160 --> 00:21:23.839 If you lean into the community you're told to hate, you will only see humanity. 00:21:24.400 --> 00:21:25.680 Lean into that. 00:21:26.319 --> 00:21:28.319 It really, really matters. 00:21:29.279 --> 00:21:53.039 I photographed the Jewish bloc and anti-Zionist Jews and a full broad spectrum of Arab, Muslim, South Asian, black, progressive humans, and of course white English folk in the pro Palestine movement. 00:21:54.400 --> 00:21:56.720 And I noticed something really strange. 00:21:56.880 --> 00:21:59.759 Every time I posted an image of the Jewish bloc. 00:22:00.640 --> 00:22:03.920 I would within 30 seconds get bots. 00:22:04.000 --> 00:22:07.039 And I'm used to bots, but these bots said a very specific thing. 00:22:07.200 --> 00:22:08.480 They said, AI. 00:22:09.920 --> 00:22:11.119 This is not real. 00:22:11.440 --> 00:22:14.319 Both on my Facebook and Instagram within 30 seconds. 00:22:14.559 --> 00:22:16.160 And I found that really interesting. 00:22:16.240 --> 00:22:19.759 And I've tried again to speak to a lot of my friends in the press. 00:22:19.920 --> 00:22:25.440 I have thousands of images of this community, and none of them want to run it. 00:22:25.680 --> 00:22:31.440 The same people that were running my Black Lives That Matter images, my Ukraine images, because I photographed everything. 00:22:31.759 --> 00:22:43.200 Women's rights images, the queer and trans, they don't, these people do not want this group of people to be amplified, which I think is very, very interesting. 00:22:43.359 --> 00:22:46.000 So I share it on my social media. 00:22:46.240 --> 00:23:07.839 Because it's important when Suele Brahman coined the

term hate march, and I was seeing a coalition of kind people that worship different gods, that love differently, that look differently, saying, for God's sake, there must be a better solution than bombs. 00:23:08.319 --> 00:23:11.839 And I don't think that equates to hate. 00:23:22.640 --> 00:23:27.119 How when decisions of primal violence are made, it's usually men in the room. 00:23:27.279 --> 00:23:46.480 But I have to say, in these protests, I've seen beautiful men, beautiful fathers raising their kids as best they can, unsure of what the future is bringing, but having them want to understand what it means to be in community and to lift others into the same place as them. 00:23:46.640 --> 00:23:53.200 And I'm really proud that these images exist in the age of Andrew Tate and Tommy Robinson. 00:23:54.079 --> 00:24:00.640 A gentle, kind man is not a sign of weakness, and we must amplify that as best we can. 00:24:01.680 --> 00:24:07.119 I've also photographed a lot of specific protests on the murder of journalists. 00:24:07.599 --> 00:24:09.839 Something that means a lot to me. 00:24:10.319 --> 00:24:18.480 And I'm asked El Sharif, there are many, there are many, many, but their names are forgotten. 00:24:21.279 --> 00:24:27.839 Documenting usually the annihilation of their own people, sometime burying their own family. 00:24:28.640 --> 00:24:37.599 And it's just really important for you to understand that more journalists have been killed in Gaza than any recorded modern warfare. 00:24:39.519 --> 00:24:45.359 And we have not had walkouts from Sky News, Channel 4, the BBC. 00:24:45.440 --> 00:24:48.000 We haven't had them say these are our people. 00:24:48.559 --> 00:24:51.599 You can't call them all terrorists. 00:24:52.319 --> 00:24:55.119 And the crime cannot be truth itself. 00:24:55.680 --> 00:25:06.480 Because that must never be the crime, otherwise, we will arrive in the place that all well warned us to reject what we see and hear with our own eyes. 00:25:09.920 --> 00:25:12.640 The tear, the tear. 00:25:13.599 --> 00:25:24.799 These two images you're about to see are a reminder of how so many of us are deeply changed in the last three years. 00:25:25.039 --> 00:25:26.720 We will never be the same. 00:25:27.279 --> 00:25:32.720 And this woman, it was the pots and pans outside Downing Street and the tear going down her. 00:25:34.880 --> 00:25:40.720 I felt like I was standing within her own soul because I know what that means. 00:25:40.880 --> 00:25:47.759 I locked myself away a couple of times a week in my toilet so my girls don't see me weep. 00:25:47.839 --> 00:25:49.440 I know what that tear is. 00:25:49.680 --> 00:25:52.079 And it's a sign of humanity. 00:25:53.839 --> 00:26:00.960 What I can't get over are people that are still going to play golf on the weekends and planning Halloween costumes. 00:26:01.920 --> 00:26:08.160 When the equivalent of six Hiroshimas has been dropped in a place with a million children, what are we doing?

00:26:09.440 --> 00:26:16.240 Even if you don't have the answers, allow yourself to feel the injustice of this moment. 00:26:17.039 --> 00:26:18.799 This was in Barcelona. 00:26:20.160 --> 00:26:29.759 And there's something about ports and goodbyes that's been with us for as long as we have been near the sea. 00:26:31.039 --> 00:26:40.799 And I don't know their relationship, but I know that this is a real hug that means something to both of them. 00:26:42.799 --> 00:26:50.160 But once again, the tear is a sign that you are living and have humanity within you. 00:26:50.880 --> 00:26:56.400 I always I hope I'll meet her one day because I always say, how kind does she look? 00:26:56.960 --> 00:26:58.720 She looks like such a kind person. 00:26:58.880 --> 00:27:03.599 And these words, systemic change for collective liberation, a lot of people say, What does that mean? 00:27:03.839 --> 00:27:18.000 Well, systemic change for me is when we all stop aspiring to be part of the machinery that is destroying the only planet we have. 00:27:20.079 --> 00:27:31.920 Just five years ago, there would never have been the revulsion that I saw of Jeff Bezos' wedding. 00:27:33.119 --> 00:27:37.759 For the first time, I saw male friends of mine saying, nah, I don't need to be that rich. 00:27:38.240 --> 00:27:45.359 You know, I don't, I don't, I don't need to be able to rent a Venice for a wedding. 00:27:45.599 --> 00:27:52.240 I have friends that are now asking themselves how they can stop using things in the Amazon ecosystem. 00:27:52.319 --> 00:28:02.400 And when I tell them about farmers that are getting cancer due to the data centers Amazon owns, they actually start doing the research. 00:28:02.720 --> 00:28:04.240 Systemic change. 00:28:04.720 --> 00:28:24.400 It's just thinking about how First Nation people lived, how they understood the land, they understood the fluidity of seasons, and that time and memories and stories matter more than things to accumulate too. 00:28:26.480 --> 00:28:31.440 Christmas time a few years ago, I was looking at my girls ripping over present after present. 00:28:31.599 --> 00:28:33.920 I looked to my wife, I'm like, what are we doing here? 00:28:35.200 --> 00:28:37.039 They don't care about these things. 00:28:37.200 --> 00:28:42.160 We've been programmed to give them things when they want moments and memories. 00:28:43.359 --> 00:28:54.240 The stillness of my youngest one's cheek when she rubs it against mine is something that she wants more than any toy. 00:28:56.160 --> 00:29:10.319 And as I walk my dog in the mornings and listen to the trees and try and connect to a world that many genocided nations knew all too well, I realize that we have been programmed to harm this earth. 00:29:11.519 --> 00:29:22.720 And we as a community can start planting the new seeds to make sure that our children's children have a fighting chance of a livable planet. 00:29:24.880 --> 00:29:32.720 I've got to meet many extraordinary people with my lens,

but this one was a big one for me. 00:29:32.960 --> 00:30:02.400 Wael Aldado, Bureau Chief of Al Jazeera, reported whilst his family was being murdered, his wife, two of his sons, including Hamza, who was also a reporter, his daughter and grandson, all murdered by Israeli weapons missiles. 00:30:03.359 --> 00:30:06.960 And I was like, what am I even going to say when I meet him? 00:30:08.240 --> 00:30:25.759 And the thing about men like this, so many extraordinary people like this, is the grace, the grace of him recognizing my humanity when he has suffered so much. 00:30:26.400 --> 00:30:51.839 Traveling the world to make sure that stories don't die, because we know history is written by the victors, and many of the victors deny the existence of the human beings that were always there, just as we have seen in America, which just turned 250 years with absolutely next to zero mention of the First Nation people of America. 00:30:53.039 --> 00:30:59.119 He did this whilst healing, whilst still healing, injured himself. 00:31:00.480 --> 00:31:08.079 And these are the men that we are told that we should not see the humanity of. 00:31:13.839 --> 00:31:19.519 We don't know what the future holds, but I know that my images will outlive us all. 00:31:20.720 --> 00:31:26.880 And there will be custodians to make sure that people will know what we did during this time. 00:31:28.799 --> 00:31:38.720 I don't usually post these images because I struggle talking about them, but I had been trying to get you know into Gaza and it was just impossible. 00:31:39.200 --> 00:31:50.400 But one of the first ceasefires, I said, Miss Anders a window, we have uh children that are in Egypt, and I was like, I would love to do a photography course. 00:31:50.720 --> 00:31:52.559 This is one thing I can do, right? 00:31:52.720 --> 00:32:20.160 Um, and I went and I spent time with these amazing boys and girls, and the talent was amazing, the lust for life was amazing, and of course, I was I will I begged to take their portraits as well because so many times with Palestinian children, we see them either dead or dying, definitely not showing them as they should be seen. 00:32:20.559 --> 00:32:49.759 And these images just show these children to be kids, kids that have had too much already taken from them, but are as deserving as all of your children for a future of possibility, and no one will ever make me stop seeing these children's need for a future of possibility. 00:32:50.480 --> 00:32:55.119 How dare anyone deny the future of any child? 00:32:55.839 --> 00:32:59.920 If we have to debate that, then we are lost as human beings. 00:33:03.599 --> 00:33:07.839 He was so happy and proud, he wanted to show him his dabka. 00:33:08.960 --> 00:33:10.880 And I was like, sure. 00:33:11.440 --> 00:33:14.880 And he did this his thing, and I again I was like, Mr. 00:33:15.359 --> 00:33:17.200 Do not do not cry. 00:33:17.759 --> 00:33:21.440 He's happy, he's healthy, he's being a boy. 00:33:23.920 --> 00:33:28.880 Do your job, take the picture, show his joy. 00:33:29.839 --> 00:33:33.920 And that's exactly what I did on a rooftop in Cairo. 00:33:35.119 --> 00:33:39.680 And in that moment, he is completely happy. 00:33:42.160 --> 00:33:44.079 And then I met the mothers. 00:34:27.440 --> 00:34:34.239 Many of these women have to leave their older children to bring the young, leave their husbands. 00:34:36.400 --> 00:34:39.280 And I spoke to them, I listened to them. 00:34:41.440 --> 00:35:01.519 And what was so powerful with all of them is their sense of returning home to the land where they gave birth to their children, where they want to grow old. 00:35:03.840 --> 00:35:07.599 But I was particularly moved by their strength. 00:35:07.760 --> 00:35:09.599 I haven't seen strength like that. 00:35:10.079 --> 00:35:11.039 Not in person. 00:35:11.199 --> 00:35:13.280 I've never seen strength like that. 00:35:16.159 --> 00:35:35.440 They would sing songs, sometimes freezing intense, sometimes not knowing when the next meal is, worrying about friends, worrying about their babies, but hope never left them. 00:35:35.760 --> 00:35:37.840 And it's important that you all recognize that. 00:35:41.679 --> 00:35:52.639 You know, the World Cup is on, we're dealing with longer days, and the world can distract us from what matters. 00:35:53.599 --> 00:36:03.519 Just remember that there is no point to all of this if we gallop towards oblivion on the bones of dead children. 00:36:07.360 --> 00:36:11.599 They're thriving, they're happy in Egypt, but they do want to go home. 00:36:12.800 --> 00:36:23.920 And it was just a really important project, and I hope to go back and see them and continue to support the boys and girls, be boys and girls. 00:36:26.079 --> 00:36:28.320 This is one of the youngest ones. 00:36:28.559 --> 00:36:32.159 She had a snooze downstairs whilst listening to Miss Rachel. 00:36:35.039 --> 00:36:43.039 But I look at her hair and her eyes, and I curse creation. 00:36:43.760 --> 00:36:44.719 I really do. 00:36:45.599 --> 00:36:49.920 When I have to witness the other the things we've all witnessed in this room. 00:36:50.960 --> 00:36:58.800 If there is somebody watching all over us, I have one request, and it's a really simple one. 00:36:59.280 --> 00:37:01.440 Let these children grow old. 00:37:05.119 --> 00:37:05.920 Philippa. 00:37:06.079 --> 00:37:06.960 We've become friends. 00:37:07.119 --> 00:37:08.800 She comes to the gallery a lot. 00:37:09.119 --> 00:37:11.199 These days will define us. 00:37:13.519 --> 00:37:16.400 These days will define us. 00:37:18.079 --> 00:37:23.440 I remember walking towards her on the Mow, and I saw that sign, and I was like, you've done it again. 00:37:23.599 --> 00:37:29.599 And she just stood there quietly, holding it almost like it's more than a sign. 00:37:30.159 --> 00:37:36.559 But there's a surety to her that gives me strength to this day. 00:37:39.199 --> 00:37:47.039 Nina Simone, I

think if you follow me, you know I spoke about this, but it's such an interesting quote. 00:37:47.519 --> 00:37:54.800 The people that built their heaven on your land are telling you yours is in the sky. 00:37:55.280 --> 00:37:58.079 I find that just so, so powerful. 00:37:58.800 --> 00:38:06.079 And a reminder of what colonialism, occupation can be. 00:38:07.360 --> 00:38:17.280 Even if you look at Nigeria, my country, new religion was brought, new ways to value things were brought. 00:38:18.400 --> 00:38:22.880 Bronzes are in museums all over the world, many of them still not returned. 00:38:24.639 --> 00:38:26.000 I look at Congo. 00:38:27.280 --> 00:38:30.960 All our consumer devices today cannot function. 00:38:31.519 --> 00:38:36.880 Yet there are boys and girls in mines, and the way they die is not just getting crushed. 00:38:37.360 --> 00:38:39.199 Mines close in deep. 00:38:39.440 --> 00:38:52.480 So the boys are there slowly losing oxygen and suffocating to death so we can have bigger batteries in our Teslas and buy a new phone every September. 00:38:53.760 --> 00:39:00.239 One of these tech companies has one trillion dollars cash reserves. 00:39:00.800 --> 00:39:15.360 And you're telling me that they can't invest in Congolese diaspora and in country to make sure that there is not a single human being under the age of 18 working in any of those mines. 00:39:16.480 --> 00:39:20.079 It is up to us, the consumer, to force them to do it. 00:39:20.320 --> 00:39:22.559 Because that's the only language they understand. 00:39:24.000 --> 00:39:34.400 What made apartite break was consumerism or using it to fight. 00:39:35.119 --> 00:39:36.239 And it's important. 00:39:36.400 --> 00:39:43.360 There's direct action, there's walking in the streets, but one of the other powers you have is how you spend the dollar and pound. 00:39:45.280 --> 00:39:49.280 And think about Sudan, think about Venezuela. 00:39:51.039 --> 00:39:57.199 Think about all of the inhumanity in the world, and don't think it's overwhelming. 00:39:57.920 --> 00:40:00.320 For me, it softens my heart. 00:40:00.960 --> 00:40:07.280 I feel awakened by it because it allows me to understand what I can do to help. 00:40:07.440 --> 00:40:09.599 No one's asking you to change the world. 00:40:09.840 --> 00:40:26.559 They're just asking you to go on a journey of unlearning and understanding the ills of our collective past so you can know why we are in the mess of our present with the hope that we can build a future we all deserve to inherit. 00:40:26.800 --> 00:40:43.039 I want to finish by reading the words of my friend, we are now friends, I'm very proud to say that, Omar El Akkard, in his book One Day Everyone Would Have Always Been Against This, which genuinely changed my life. 00:40:43.679 --> 00:40:53.440 I'm quite dyslexic, so I I listen to audiobooks a lot, and I thank God I listened to the audiobook because he has this gentle cadence. 00:40:53.840 --> 00:40:59.599 And it felt like all

of the questions I couldn't find answers to were answered by his pen. 00:40:59.760 --> 00:41:03.360 His pen wrapped itself around me at a time that I really needed it. 00:41:03.599 --> 00:41:10.000 So I'm going to read you this excerpt, and I think uh we can do QA's afterwards if you want. 00:41:11.840 --> 00:41:16.960 Alongside the ledger of atrocity, I keep another. 00:41:17.280 --> 00:41:22.480 The Palestinian doctor who would not abandon his patients even as the bombs closed in. 00:41:22.800 --> 00:41:27.599 The Icelandic writer who raised money to get the displaced out of Gaza. 00:41:28.079 --> 00:41:34.480 The American doctors and nurses who risked their lives to go treat the wounded in the middle of a killing field. 00:41:34.719 --> 00:41:40.719 The puppet maker injured and driven from his home who kept making dolls to entertain the children. 00:41:40.960 --> 00:41:50.320 The congresswoman who stood her ground in the face of censure, of constant vitral, of her own colleagues' indifference. 00:41:50.800 --> 00:41:58.400 The protesters, the ones who gave up their privilege, their jobs, who risked everything to speak out. 00:41:59.199 --> 00:42:09.679 The people who filmed and photographed and documented all of this, even as it happened to them, even as they buried their dead. 00:42:10.880 --> 00:42:18.159 It's not so hard to believe, even during the worst of things, that the courage is a more potent contagion. 00:42:18.480 --> 00:42:22.480 That there are more invested in solidarity than annihilation. 00:42:22.960 --> 00:42:29.760 That just as it has always been possible to look away, it is always possible to stop looking away. 00:42:30.559 --> 00:42:33.840 None of this evil was ever necessary. 00:42:34.400 --> 00:42:41.119 Some carriages are gilded and others are lacquered in blood, but the same engine pulls us all. 00:42:41.679 --> 00:42:48.000 We dismantle it now, build another thing entirely, or we hurtle toward the cliff. 00:42:48.880 --> 00:42:49.840 Thank you very much. 00:43:22.159 --> 00:43:23.840 Is there a microphone for folks? 00:43:24.960 --> 00:43:25.199 Yeah. 00:43:26.239 --> 00:43:27.039 Should we do that? 00:43:27.599 --> 00:43:27.840 Okay. 00:43:29.360 --> 00:43:30.719 Do we have any questions? 00:43:39.199 --> 00:43:39.920 Hi Vitan. 00:43:40.639 --> 00:43:41.920 It's not really a question. 00:43:42.159 --> 00:43:43.920 It's just to say thank you so much. 00:43:52.320 --> 00:43:55.519 I genuinely don't think I would have survived the last three years. 00:44:00.320 --> 00:44:01.119 Each other together. 00:44:01.280 --> 00:44:02.400 I generally do. 00:44:02.639 --> 00:44:10.880 I've spoken about sometimes being on the tube and I see someone with a little badge and we look at each other and we're like Yeah. 00:44:11.119 --> 00:44:13.119 And then there's there's a stillness. 00:44:13.280 --> 00:44:14.239 It's just there. 00:44:14.400 --> 00:44:24.559 There are people who I meet, and and just because I know um what what they're going through, it's a completely different connection. 00:44:24.639 --> 00:44:29.199 It's unbelievable how you can have such deep connections with people you've never met before. 00:44:29.360 --> 00:44:32.079 So I I hear and feel you, and I reciprocate. 00:44:32.159 --> 00:44:33.440 You've all held me together. 00:44:33.679 --> 00:44:34.480 Believe. 00:44:34.800 --> 00:44:35.679 Thank you. 00:44:41.360 --> 00:44:42.639 I can't really see. 00:44:42.800 --> 00:44:43.840 Any more questions? 00:44:44.000 --> 00:44:47.760 We have like 10 minutes, so oh, there's someone up there. 00:44:57.519 --> 00:44:58.320 Thank you, Mizen. 00:44:58.400 --> 00:45:00.639 It's a pleasure to see you and hear you speak. 00:45:00.800 --> 00:45:09.519 Um you alluded to two things, but my question is um, what do you think we can do and should be doing um in these challenging times? 00:45:09.599 --> 00:45:18.079 You alluded to two things talk to your friends, to talk to your colleagues, don't let the conversation dry up, and you have power to s to spend your money the way you want to. 00:45:18.559 --> 00:45:20.000 But what advice would you give me? 00:45:20.239 --> 00:45:27.360 Yeah, I I would also say curate, curate what the other two things is curate what what the hell you are consuming online. 00:45:28.079 --> 00:45:31.519 Um I wouldn't be on X at all, you know. 00:45:31.679 --> 00:45:36.719 I have to be on X because it's how I know what what new attack is coming for me. 00:45:36.800 --> 00:45:48.400 Um but in general, I would suggest you stay off X and just even on Instagram, Facebook, whatever you choose to, if you are online, is to really, really curate it and also think before you post. 00:45:48.559 --> 00:45:49.920 I have this two-hour rule. 00:45:50.000 --> 00:45:52.639 When I see something that's really triggering me, I wait two hours. 00:45:52.719 --> 00:46:01.199 And there's that great roomy quote um raise your words, not your voice, for it is rain that grows flowers, not thunder. 00:46:01.360 --> 00:46:05.039 And that's really, really important in this age of rage. 00:46:05.280 --> 00:46:09.199 It's for us to let our waters simmer a bit. 00:46:09.440 --> 00:46:10.800 So two more. 00:46:11.840 --> 00:46:12.639 Thanks. 00:46:20.400 --> 00:46:21.280 Any more? 00:46:22.159 --> 00:46:22.719 Quezies? 00:46:23.199 --> 00:46:23.440 Hello? 00:46:24.000 --> 00:46:24.239 Hello? 00:46:24.400 --> 00:46:25.840 Oh, there's a few down here. 00:46:31.360 --> 00:46:33.920 Hello, Miss Ann, thank you so much. 00:46:34.079 --> 00:46:37.760 Um it really resonated with me when you talked about being neurospicy. 00:46:37.920 --> 00:46:40.000 I have a very neurospicy child. 00:46:40.559 --> 00:46:45.280 Um and what I felt from you is that you feel very deeply, and so does he. 00:46:45.840 --> 00:46:58.320 And I think for people like you and my son and others who identify in this way, the heartbreak is constant because you feel so deeply all the time and you soak up so much.

00:46:58.559 --> 00:47:01.360 How do you deal with that heartbreak again and again? 00:47:01.920 --> 00:47:03.519 I thank you for that question. 00:47:03.599 --> 00:47:13.199 And I so many people have said this in comments, saying that they believe that neurodivergent people do, you know, are natural uh activists and things like that. 00:47:13.280 --> 00:47:16.400 I I haven't seen any studies, so I wouldn't, I can't confirm. 00:47:16.639 --> 00:47:27.199 But um I would actually be more in a really bad place if I wasn't doing something about it. 00:47:27.599 --> 00:47:38.400 So what I've learned is, and it isn't necessarily sort of just the act of activism, it's going on the journey of having the inquisitive mind, right? 00:47:38.719 --> 00:47:48.239 So, you know, reading about our past, about things that have linked us to our past are really, really important. 00:47:48.400 --> 00:47:53.840 I was saying in a piece I just did, Caroline Elkins' book, Legacy of Violence, is also really, really important. 00:47:53.920 --> 00:47:55.280 So I've just done a lot of reading. 00:47:55.440 --> 00:48:22.960 And then beyond that, I've, and I don't want to sound like some new age person, but um nature, honestly, my dog, my my my beautiful nine-year-old dog who doesn't give a damn how many Oscar nominations or how fancy my friends are, uh sleeping under a willow tree, um, walking, and I know your your your son is probably thinks all of these things are boring, but for me, it's really helped me reset. 00:48:23.599 --> 00:48:30.320 Um, and also being around people that don't take that energy, which is really, really important. 00:48:30.559 --> 00:48:37.039 So, what I've had to learn, and many of you will probably agree, is that there are people that are supposed to be in your life for seasons. 00:48:37.679 --> 00:48:45.760 Cherish those memories, but don't hurt yourself by clinging on to someone that doesn't see the humanity or somebody else. 00:48:46.239 --> 00:48:47.840 And that's really important as well. 00:48:48.559 --> 00:48:48.880 Thank you. 00:48:55.119 --> 00:48:56.079 Hi there, thank you. 00:48:56.239 --> 00:48:58.239 Um I cannot stop what to think. 00:48:58.320 --> 00:49:01.920 Um there is a connection between images and imagination. 00:49:02.800 --> 00:49:03.760 Imagination. 00:49:03.840 --> 00:49:06.880 Um I would like to ask which one comes for you first. 00:49:07.039 --> 00:49:11.199 Is it the image that plays with your imagination or vice versa? 00:49:11.440 --> 00:49:15.280 Throughout your presentation, I couldn't stop what to think about Fred or Kahle. 00:49:15.679 --> 00:49:22.320 When you look at the images, it plays with your imagination and also reflects her true feelings. 00:49:22.400 --> 00:49:24.719 They're very they come across very strongly. 00:49:24.880 --> 00:49:29.440 So it would be interesting to know which one comes for you first, which one follows next. 00:49:29.519 --> 00:49:30.000 Thank you. 00:49:30.320 --> 00:49:30.800 Thank you. 00:49:30.960 --> 00:49:42.079 Uh yeah, I mean I I um the reason I guess the quality of my photography kind of exploded in the way that it did is because I've been obsessed with uh light my whole life. 00:49:42.239 --> 00:49:47.760 One of my favorite films is um Barry Linden by Sandy Kubrick, which is a living painting. 00:49:48.320 --> 00:50:02.559 And I all say photography is chasing this lady called light and trying to dare ask if you could waltz with this lady called Light. 00:50:02.960 --> 00:50:16.400 And um I don't use Photoshop, I don't have 10 assistants, any of you have to see me in a protest, just me in my backpack, and I'm in a transient state when I'm shooting, but I'm always looking to waltz with light. 00:50:16.559 --> 00:50:24.159 So I think that is part of the imagination of how I compose and I structure my images, even though it's in an instant, it's not the same thing. 00:50:24.400 --> 00:50:33.360 Because the the great point is, of course, many of my images that have become iconic, there were 50 other photographers, stood right where I was. 00:50:33.519 --> 00:50:42.079 But there's something about how you see, and everyone sees it in their own way, that allows you to compose the human story that either connects or doesn't. 00:50:42.719 --> 00:50:45.199 Can I respond to the comment you made about my thing? 00:50:45.519 --> 00:50:45.840 Okay. 00:50:46.719 --> 00:50:58.800 Um you um talk about Rumi, he has a saying, um wound is where the light enters, and I think that's that maybe explains your fascination with his poetry. 00:50:58.880 --> 00:50:59.039 Thank you. 00:50:59.360 --> 00:51:00.880 The wound, yeah, yeah, absolutely. 00:51:01.039 --> 00:51:02.880 Um yes. 00:51:03.119 --> 00:51:06.239 Yeah, I don't want to go on a therapy session, but yes. 00:51:07.119 --> 00:51:07.760 Absolutely. 00:51:07.920 --> 00:51:09.519 I think we we can do two more questions. 00:51:09.599 --> 00:51:10.320 Is that okay? 00:51:10.559 --> 00:51:13.920 If there are, is there any man who's gonna ask questions? 00:51:14.239 --> 00:51:15.519 Huh, dudes? 00:51:21.199 --> 00:51:27.360 Speaking of speaking of men, a friend of mine called me, said she's getting a divorce. 00:51:27.920 --> 00:51:30.559 And I know her and her husband pretty well. 00:51:31.920 --> 00:51:35.599 And she's been changed in the last three years. 00:51:36.719 --> 00:51:51.360 And uh she said, Miss Ann, he cries in church when he sings the hymn Jerusalem, and when I bring up what's happening in Jerusalem, he switches off. 00:51:52.880 --> 00:52:10.880 And it was just a profound way of of um trying to, for me, to understand obviously a big family dilemma, but also as a man to understand why for some men it's been really difficult to go on a journey when I've seen so many women from all walks of life do that. 00:52:11.199 --> 00:52:19.760 I had five percent of my followers be men at the beginning of this, and I'm really proud to say it's now 38%. 00:52:20.639 --> 00:52:22.880 So

don't give up on men. 00:52:23.039 --> 00:52:33.679 Um, they process the world differently, but they're you know, it's it's it's it sounds ridiculous, but everyone takes a different pathway to sometimes get to the same place. 00:52:33.760 --> 00:52:34.960 So it's really important. 00:52:35.280 --> 00:52:35.760 Sorry. 00:52:36.159 --> 00:52:37.519 Yeah, um Hello. 00:52:37.840 --> 00:52:38.320 How are you there? 00:52:38.400 --> 00:52:38.960 Yeah, man. 00:52:40.400 --> 00:52:43.840 Um you mentioned Sudan. 00:52:44.000 --> 00:52:55.199 I wonder will you have an opportunity to go there, one of the worst worst places just now, and uh just interested what what future projects you have lined up and how they come about. 00:52:55.679 --> 00:52:56.000 Sure. 00:52:56.239 --> 00:52:56.639 Sure. 00:52:56.800 --> 00:53:02.719 Um I do have a planned trip to Sudan actually, but for security reasons I can't tell you when I'm going in or out. 00:53:02.800 --> 00:53:04.239 But that's already planned. 00:53:04.400 --> 00:53:09.679 Um and I'm going to do a vaccination situation in Nigeria. 00:53:09.840 --> 00:53:17.039 Um again, I can't tell you the date, and we'll be going back, obviously, to see those kids as well in Cairo. 00:53:17.280 --> 00:53:25.679 Beyond that, I have gosh projects for black children with Down syndrome that I'm still trying to get out there. 00:53:26.000 --> 00:53:32.159 I'm um I have two films that are almost ready to begin the prep stage. 00:53:32.239 --> 00:53:34.719 So I'll be directing two feature films. 00:53:34.960 --> 00:53:48.079 And in general, just continuing with the work of documenting protests globally, trying to get my archive of images to travel around England and the world, as you know, because of Palestine. 00:53:48.320 --> 00:53:54.159 We don't have uh the luxury of having big sponsors, even though I'm probably the most visible photographer on earth. 00:53:54.320 --> 00:53:59.440 But as you also know, I will never remove Palestine from my body of work. 00:54:00.000 --> 00:54:00.800 Thanks. 00:54:13.440 --> 00:54:14.400 Sorry, sorry. 00:54:14.719 --> 00:54:17.039 This is this is not a question, this is an advert. 00:54:17.119 --> 00:54:20.000 Was joined the documentary shooting the shoot the people about you? 00:54:20.320 --> 00:54:20.800 Friday. 00:54:21.039 --> 00:54:21.599 On Friday. 00:54:21.920 --> 00:54:22.719 Please go. 00:54:23.360 --> 00:54:23.920 Exactly. 00:54:25.119 --> 00:54:27.440 It's it's this Friday at the next door, right? 00:54:27.760 --> 00:54:30.480 It's at the Pitcherville Cinema at the National Museum. 00:54:30.800 --> 00:54:35.280 So if you haven't seen it, please be what was the experience like of uh making the making the documentary? 00:54:35.679 --> 00:54:44.880 It's weird um uh having your life story for 90 minutes, but again, for people that look like me, i.e. 00:54:45.039 --> 00:54:48.800 black people, we usually have to be dead for documentaries to be made. 00:54:49.039 --> 00:54:50.800 Um it's

crazy. 00:54:50.880 --> 00:54:54.239 You know, I'm not your negro, James Baldwin's story, he was dead. 00:54:54.480 --> 00:54:57.119 Choice of weapons, Gordon Park's story, he was dead. 00:54:57.280 --> 00:55:00.000 Ernest Cole came out last year, he was also gone. 00:55:00.079 --> 00:55:05.679 And there are plenty of white artists who have many documentaries made of them whilst they're living. 00:55:05.760 --> 00:55:14.960 So when this opportunity came, and I was seeing the madness of the world, I thought, you know, let's do it, and maybe you can help people know that they're not alone and their voice matters. 00:55:15.119 --> 00:55:18.159 So if you have the opportunity, please watch it. 00:55:18.480 --> 00:55:19.119 Thanks. 00:55:19.440 --> 00:55:20.400 I saw your hand up. 00:55:20.559 --> 00:55:25.360 Do you want to just talk about the project? 00:55:32.800 --> 00:55:37.760 One that I'm not able to do, well, yeah. 00:55:38.000 --> 00:55:48.400 I mean that there there are certain parts of the world um that that are just tricky security-wise for me to get into. 00:55:48.480 --> 00:55:52.559 I'm figuring that out and trying to beg my wife to let me let me go. 00:55:53.039 --> 00:55:55.679 Um I'm very frustrated. 00:55:55.760 --> 00:56:09.920 I've been documenting Grenfell uh for eight years now, getting on to nine, and I'm just losing my mind over the lack of interest from this government on the biggest loss of life in a civilian building since the Second World War. 00:56:10.079 --> 00:56:15.039 So it's not that I can't do it, but I get very frustrated about I'm not doing enough. 00:56:15.360 --> 00:56:24.239 Um there are, although I go to Nigeria, there are parts of northern Nigeria where I can't get to for security reasons, but I'm figuring out what I can do there as well. 00:56:24.400 --> 00:56:35.599 But I'm not really good at saying I can't do things, so I'm gonna figure it out, and if there's any way I can help, um uh I will I will use my voice and lens. 00:56:36.320 --> 00:56:37.280 Thanks. 00:56:38.239 --> 00:56:39.760 Oh my lord. 00:56:40.800 --> 00:56:41.440 Uh hi. 00:56:42.079 --> 00:56:56.480 Uh I just wanted to ask, um, you know, during you're actually taking the photos, is it any like do you experience any like, I don't know, like backlash or racism during like the actual thing for many people like watching or something? 00:56:56.960 --> 00:56:58.159 Uh great question. 00:56:58.320 --> 00:56:59.360 Um yeah. 00:56:59.760 --> 00:57:10.960 Um depending who I'm photographing, because of course I photographed um Tommy Robinson marches, far-right marches, I f I photographed pro-Israel marches, I have been, yeah, spat on. 00:57:11.199 --> 00:57:36.000 I've been, I was recently just called the N-word and a monkey by um a pro uh I don't even know how to describe it, it was at a Iran march, and it was a sort of there are many different elements of the Iran uh situation, and this, these, these guys, it was the same day as the women's march, and some women got very upset at the group. 00:57:36.159 --> 00:57:48.320 They kind of met together, and the group was um dancing to uh the Donald Trump song and thanking Ben uh Benjamin Netanyahu that upset the women. 00:57:48.480 --> 00:57:52.960 I tried to get to calm things down, and one of them said, I'm the N-word monkey, go away. 00:57:53.119 --> 00:57:57.679 And I was like, So that happens, but you know what? 00:57:57.840 --> 00:58:17.679 I've learned that the mainly men that do and say those things are um traumatized, uh, just like the Tommy Robinson guys I've seen that have always called me the N-word, and I call them broken boys and men's bodies, and if anything, I try and look into their eyes and see the humanity. 00:58:17.840 --> 00:58:22.480 Um, because only hurt people want to hurt the world. 00:58:22.639 --> 00:58:25.599 Um, and that's just part of what I do. 00:58:25.760 --> 00:58:31.199 Um sometimes I'm in danger dangerous situations, but it it comes with a territory. 00:58:32.000 --> 00:58:32.880 Thank you. 00:58:33.519 --> 00:58:34.159 Cheers. 00:58:35.360 --> 00:58:37.039 Okay, thank you. 00:58:37.280 --> 00:58:38.159 Thank you.