Pełna transkrypcja odcinka 77 - Serial Killer Confessions on Death Row

want more. Okay. 71 00:04:19.560 --> 00:04:23.480 Yeah, but that was coincidence. It was incredible because within 72 00:04:23.720 --> 00:04:26.720 forty eight hours of me giving the information to Ken, 73 00:04:27.399 --> 00:04:30.680 he came back and says, Bill, I know who the 74 00:04:30.680 --> 00:04:33.879 girl from Berkeley is. Information you gave me was spot on. 75 00:04:34.120 --> 00:04:38.800 Everything that you gave me matched perfectly, so we had that. 76 00:04:39.000 --> 00:04:41.800 As soon as he had that, he happened to have 77 00:04:41.920 --> 00:04:47.920 known a person named Jason Woolf from Fireside Pictures. They 78 00:04:47.920 --> 00:04:51.079 were the ones that immediately said, we have to record this. 79 00:04:51.120 --> 00:04:54.040 We want to see the victims families, we want to 80 00:04:54.199 --> 00:04:57.480 bring closure, but more so, we wanted to bring law 81 00:04:57.560 --> 00:05:01.759 enforcement into this. This wasn't because I wanted ratings. Remember 82 00:05:01.839 --> 00:05:04.360 at this time, I had no idea I was ever 83 00:05:04.399 --> 00:05:08.680 going to get out, no idea. So it was about 84 00:05:08.800 --> 00:05:13.000 victims families and about justice for the victims. And it 85 00:05:13.040 --> 00:05:17.240 all happened to evolve and I get out July the first. 86 00:05:17.759 --> 00:05:22.160 Suddenly the shows as slated for a September the sixth, 87 00:05:22.240 --> 00:05:27.160 thirteenth or fourteenth on True Crime, Oxygen and Peacock. So 88 00:05:27.279 --> 00:05:29.920 it was all a coincidence. But yes, it did have 89 00:05:30.040 --> 00:05:32.959 perfect timing because I got out and here I am 90 00:05:33.000 --> 00:05:34.959 in the last episodes of Clothes. I'm in them. 91 00:05:35.319 --> 00:05:40.319 Ah, it's just crazy. I can't believe it. It is 92 00:05:40.399 --> 00:05:44.959 a wild story and wow. So I'm trying to understand 93 00:05:45.000 --> 00:05:49.199 the timeline. So when did this idea decide to become 94 00:05:49.199 --> 00:05:52.800 a show? When you got connected with I would say 95 00:05:52.920 --> 00:05:53.720 Jason Wolf. 96 00:05:54.120 --> 00:05:56.800 Yes, well, Ken Mains had a relationship prior to this. 97 00:05:57.319 --> 00:06:01.600 They did a show some years ago and can't ask me? 98 00:06:01.639 --> 00:06:04.680 He said, listen, man, can I like to talk about 99 00:06:04.720 --> 00:06:06.639 this with some of it because for me it's always 100 00:06:06.639 --> 00:06:10.399 been about victims? And I said absolutely. I had nothing 101 00:06:10.439 --> 00:06:15.199 to gain from it aside from the satisfaction of actually 102 00:06:15.279 --> 00:06:18.759 practicing what I preach. I have been practicing what I 103 00:06:18.839 --> 00:06:22.240 preach for decades, and that is a living amends, meaning 104 00:06:22.480 --> 00:06:25.959 that each day I live it with the intention of 105 00:06:26.040 --> 00:06:31.519 doing good in honor of victims. I have a victim 106 00:06:31.560

--> 00:06:34.360 from nineteen eighty three. Let's get this out and the clear. 107 00:06:35.000 --> 00:06:38.160 I was convicted of killing someone in nineteen eighty three. 108 00:06:38.199 --> 00:06:41.279 I was sentenced to death for it. The powers that be, 109 00:06:41.399 --> 00:06:44.600 the judges that looked the case decades letters, said hey, 110 00:06:44.639 --> 00:06:47.680 you know what, this is wrong. He did not kill 111 00:06:47.720 --> 00:06:51.439 for insurance money or anything. He killed that anger. At 112 00:06:51.480 --> 00:06:53.839 that time, when I was eighteen years old, my sixteen 113 00:06:53.920 --> 00:06:57.040 year old girlfriend I were respecting our first child. She 114 00:06:57.160 --> 00:07:00.439 was nearly five months pregnant. They forced her under abortion. 115 00:07:01.000 --> 00:07:04.439 I lost my temper and I ended up taking someone's life. 116 00:07:05.120 --> 00:07:08.519 I will mention the victim because obviously I don't want 117 00:07:08.519 --> 00:07:11.439 to do that to disrespect them. But the bottom line 118 00:07:11.519 --> 00:07:14.040 is that was my reason, that was my intent, that 119 00:07:14.199 --> 00:07:18.000 was I own it. That's my responsibility. So now I 120 00:07:18.040 --> 00:07:20.360 can't change the past, but I can change the future, 121 00:07:21.000 --> 00:07:24.439 and I choose to change the future by helping victims, families, 122 00:07:24.680 --> 00:07:30.240 by helping victims, by giving the knowledge I have, because look, honestly, 123 00:07:30.959 --> 00:07:33.000 there is not a person on earth that has more 124 00:07:33.040 --> 00:07:36.160 experience of serial killers than I do. I spent forty 125 00:07:36.240 --> 00:07:39.720 years with them in the same place, studying them, speaking 126 00:07:39.800 --> 00:07:44.240 to them, interviewing them, getting information to make society a 127 00:07:44.279 --> 00:07:47.000 separate place. That's my living amends. That's why I do 128 00:07:47.079 --> 00:07:47.519 what I do. 129 00:07:48.759 --> 00:07:51.439 I we're just thinking today as I posted something on 130 00:07:51.519 --> 00:07:54.399 social do you know of anyone that's lived with the 131 00:07:54.439 --> 00:07:59.839 serial killer, live with multiple serial killers, that survived, that's living, 132 00:08:00.079 --> 00:08:03.079 that can tell, like, let's live with them for decades, 133 00:08:03.160 --> 00:08:07.399 that can share the stories. So this is this incredible 134 00:08:07.480 --> 00:08:13.600 position that you were in to have this experience, to 135 00:08:13.720 --> 00:08:19.920 have these conversations, to get the details, and it's pretty 136 00:08:19.920 --> 00:08:25.680 clever and so yeah, I haven't finished reading it yet, 137 00:08:25.759 --> 00:08:29.839 but I'm in the throes of it, and I feel 138 00:08:29.879 --> 00:08:32.000 like you do such a great job of sort of 139 00:08:32.080 --> 00:08:34.360 just taking me there in the yard with you. 140 00:08:35.240 --> 00:08:37.519 That's the whole point of the book. Yeah, you're absolutely right. 141 00:08:38.039 --> 00:08:41.519 I wanted to give the reader a real feel for 142 00:08:41.600 --> 00:08:43.639 what it feels like to be on the yard and 143 00:08:43.679 --> 00:08:46.200 death row. There are a lot of people out there 144 00:08:46.240 --> 00:08:50.320 that claim to be true crime specialists. They're psychologists, they 145 00:08:50.320 --> 00:08:53.919 are former law enforcement. None of them, none of them 146 00:08:54.240 --> 00:08:56.919 have been on an active yard with seven hundred and 147 00:08:57.000 --> 00:09:01.320 seventy some plus murderers on the And I did it 148 00:09:01.440 --> 00:09:04.639 every day. I've said is before, I didn't miss the 149 00:09:04.679 --> 00:09:07.960 day yard it was raining, it was hailing, unless I 150 00:09:08.000 --> 00:09:11.399 was at the doctors or at a visit, I was 151 00:09:11.480 --> 00:09:15.399 at the yard. I wasn't hard to find. A lot 152 00:09:15.399 --> 00:09:18.799 of people may have issues with how I am. I'm 153 00:09:18.799 --> 00:09:21.320 a straight shooter. If I don't like the way a 154 00:09:21.360 --> 00:09:23.840 person is, I tell them and I tell the hey, 155 00:09:24.240 --> 00:09:27.240 we can deal with this right now either way. And 156 00:09:27.320 --> 00:09:30.360 that is what impressed actually Joseph Naso, which is the 157 00:09:30.399 --> 00:09:34.679 serial killer that I write about in that book, he 158 00:09:34.919 --> 00:09:37.639 was impressed with me, and he asked for my protection 159 00:09:38.720 --> 00:09:41.759 and I gave it. Of course, he had no idea 160 00:09:42.440 --> 00:09:46.159 that I was luring him to tell me everything. And 161 00:09:46.240 --> 00:09:48.279 one of the things that we find out, of course, 162 00:09:48.440 --> 00:09:51.879 is that the list of ten that he wrote about, 163 00:09:51.879 --> 00:09:56.120 which law enforcement confirms six of those murders, obviously, Ken 164 00:09:56.159 --> 00:09:59.080 and I have solved five more of those murders, because 165 00:09:59.080 --> 00:10:02.039 there's not actually t ten. Ten was just his greate 166 00:10:02.039 --> 00:10:05.600 ast hits ten were his favorites. He actually killed twenty 167 00:10:05.679 --> 00:10:06.679 six people. 168 00:10:06.799 --> 00:10:09.039 And that was jaw dropping in the book where he 169 00:10:09.320 --> 00:10:11.840 laughed out loud that he thought it was funny that 170 00:10:11.960 --> 00:10:14.840 lawn Force only thought there were ten, and that somebody 171 00:10:14.919 --> 00:10:17.240 broke in and stole the actual list of all the 172 00:10:17.279 --> 00:10:20.840 other victims, and what a find. It would be if 173 00:10:20.879 --> 00:10:23.159 we had that actual list, but he thought it was 174 00:10:23.240 --> 00:10:25.600 funny that they even thought it. There was only ten. 175 00:10:26.159 --> 00:10:28.919 Yeah, and that's another thing. You know, you hear these

176 00:10:28.960 --> 00:10:32.320 so called serial killer experts and I get a kick 177 00:10:32.320 --> 00:10:35.039 out of it. It's comedy for me. So let me 178 00:10:35.120 --> 00:10:37.960 just be complete straight here. You know, you hear these people, Well, 179 00:10:38.120 --> 00:10:40.799 they say, I've read three hundred books on serial killers. 180 00:10:41.840 --> 00:10:45.159 So what you've read a bunch of speculation, a bunch 181 00:10:45.240 --> 00:10:48.759 of guesswork, and maybe even an interview with a serial killer. 182 00:10:49.120 --> 00:10:51.639 But he's performing at the highest level. He deserves an 183 00:10:51.639 --> 00:10:55.000 oscar because he has nothing to gain. He knows all 184 00:10:55.000 --> 00:10:57.840 the answers that you know, none that you're there as 185 00:10:57.879 --> 00:11:01.960 a spectator to his theater, and that's what they do. 186 00:11:02.000 --> 00:11:05.799 You hear guys like Ed Kemper, the Giant Sealer killer. 187 00:11:06.200 --> 00:11:09.759 This guy can't find a podcast, he can't find a 188 00:11:09.919 --> 00:11:12.559 radio station that he can't fall in love with because 189 00:11:12.559 --> 00:11:15.840 he wants to tell you everything. Okay, but he's only 190 00:11:15.840 --> 00:11:18.919 an expert in himself. He's not an expert other serial killer. 191 00:11:18.919 --> 00:11:21.399 Wha it's on. He's been around himself, and of course 192 00:11:21.879 --> 00:11:24.240 he has a very high IQ about one hundred and 193 00:11:24.240 --> 00:11:26.799 forty five, one hundred and fifty and he knows how 194 00:11:26.799 --> 00:11:30.720 to play you because he does these audio recordings, narrative 195 00:11:30.759 --> 00:11:34.879 recordings for books. He's recorded over five hundred books. I'll 196 00:11:34.919 --> 00:11:38.000 give him this. He has a good little scam going. 197 00:11:38.600 --> 00:11:40.759 But let's talk about some of these other so called 198 00:11:41.159 --> 00:11:44.480 people that run podcasts at other people that do the 199 00:11:44.639 --> 00:11:47.720 right books about it. Look, I respect an author for 200 00:11:47.840 --> 00:11:50.440 doing the research, for going in a courtroom and reading 201 00:11:50.440 --> 00:11:54.440 the transcript, but again you're just getting the version of 202 00:11:54.440 --> 00:11:56.679 the DA and he's putting whatever he feels to give 203 00:11:56.720 --> 00:11:59.159 you a conviction. Yes, we have the body. We know 204 00:11:59.240 --> 00:12:01.799 it was fun in this, But what I give you 205 00:12:01.879 --> 00:12:04.639 is what was the serial killer thinking when he was doing? 206 00:12:05.600 --> 00:12:08.720 What was he giggling about? In that book, it tells 207 00:12:08.759 --> 00:12:11.519 you what Joseph Nasa was thinking. How you would sit 208 00:12:11.559 --> 00:12:15.600 with mannequins for hours, drinking coffee, having conversations with her, 209 00:12:15.840 --> 00:12:19.080 and suddenly he would explode into violence. No DA is 210 00:12:19.120 --> 00:12:19.679 going to give you that. 211 00:12:20.440 --> 00:12:23.720 Yeah, that was I think it's page fifty seven. I 212 00:12:23.840 --> 00:12:28.440 dratted it down. Diabolical, This mannequin scene. You just have 213 00:12:28.600 --> 00:12:31.039 to read the book. But I mean it caused me 214 00:12:31.200 --> 00:12:35.320 pause to kind of think about the reality of what 215 00:12:35.480 --> 00:12:38.080 this man is creating. I think you called it some 216 00:12:38.120 --> 00:12:40.320 sort of studio of horrors. 217 00:12:41.279 --> 00:12:42.399 That's exactly what it was. 218 00:12:42.480 --> 00:12:45.960 Yeah, No, he staged a studio to lure you in 219 00:12:46.159 --> 00:12:48.639 as a model, take your pick. He staged it as 220 00:12:48.679 --> 00:12:50.679 Foxy Rock. She says, like, why are there drapes on 221 00:12:50.720 --> 00:12:54.679 the windows? And it's like, but so quickly it escalated. 222 00:12:55.360 --> 00:12:59.480 Now he just snaps into terror. Yeah, it's just so shocking. 223 00:13:00.039 --> 00:13:04.320 And then he just drags the body out and rolls 224 00:13:04.440 --> 00:13:07.120 down a hill and goes on for this life. It 225 00:13:07.159 --> 00:13:10.240 was a fake studio. It wasn't a real studio where 226 00:13:10.279 --> 00:13:13.759 you're going to become a model, be on Instagram. 227 00:13:14.120 --> 00:13:17.200 Well, see, that's the thing about Joseph Naso. He wouldn't 228 00:13:17.240 --> 00:13:19.919 remember girls' names either. People would say that's a tall 229 00:13:19.919 --> 00:13:22.639 tale sign for someone not telling the truth. No, the 230 00:13:22.679 --> 00:13:25.240 tall tale sign is that he would tell me the 231 00:13:25.320 --> 00:13:28.799 story in January, and I would wait three years and 232 00:13:28.840 --> 00:13:32.279 ask him the same question again and the answer was identical, 233 00:13:32.919 --> 00:13:36.039 the consistency in the patterns, And I would ask, well, 234 00:13:36.080 --> 00:13:38.440 why don't you remember the names? And you really telling me? 235 00:13:38.480 --> 00:13:41.759 He'd laugh. It was hilarious to me. Said, why should 236 00:13:41.759 --> 00:13:45.480 I remember their names. I am the artist, this is 237 00:13:45.639 --> 00:13:49.879 my show, it is my monumental moment. They're just spectators 238 00:13:49.879 --> 00:13:50.679 on my bullet train. 239 00:13:51.440 --> 00:13:54.200 But I thought it was interesting that he remembers the 240 00:13:54.360 --> 00:13:58.759 street and the city, you know, the street sign. So 241 00:13:58.960 --> 00:14:01.080 that's what he wrote down. I mean, I helped you 242 00:14:01.320 --> 00:14:02.120 find the clues. 243 00:14:02.600 --> 00:14:05.360 Yeah. Well, he's his own worst enemy. He loves to 244 00:14:05.399 --> 00:14:09.080 write things down. And I even when I actually interviewed 245 00:14:09.200 --> 00:14:12.879 with a number of police departments on my way out 246 00:14:12.879 --> 00:14:16.320 of

prison already. I met with Berkeley Police Department, I 247 00:14:16.399 --> 00:14:19.799 met with Daily City police departments. You know, the FBI 248 00:14:19.960 --> 00:14:23.519 was involved, Las Vegas Police department, Reno was involved, Yuba 249 00:14:23.600 --> 00:14:28.759 City was involved. And I told him, you guys, everybody 250 00:14:29.080 --> 00:14:32.039 in the world is terrified of a serial killer when 251 00:14:32.039 --> 00:14:34.759 he is out killing. So there's a public outcry to 252 00:14:34.759 --> 00:14:37.720 catch him. Law enforce him puts their energy together to 253 00:14:37.720 --> 00:14:40.240 catch this guy. Once they catch them, there is a 254 00:14:40.399 --> 00:14:44.080 huge public trial to make sure the justice has served. 255 00:14:44.360 --> 00:14:47.320 Then it's said the death row. And guess what everybody 256 00:14:47.360 --> 00:14:51.120 forgets about him, and that is where the true cold 257 00:14:51.159 --> 00:14:54.639 cases can be solved, because now he understands he's already 258 00:14:54.639 --> 00:14:57.399 on death row. He has nothing to lose, and he 259 00:14:57.440 --> 00:15:03.039 begins to write everything down. Serial killers have books in 260 00:15:03.080 --> 00:15:06.279 their cells that they've written on all the crimes they've done, 261 00:15:06.440 --> 00:15:11.960 and no one but no one, from FBI to law enforcement, 262 00:15:12.480 --> 00:15:15.120 local police. All they have to do is come to 263 00:15:15.159 --> 00:15:17.519 the warden of San Quentin and say, hey, I like 264 00:15:17.559 --> 00:15:19.879 to search this guy's cell. Let us know when he's 265 00:15:19.919 --> 00:15:21.759 out of his self, make an excuse to take him 266 00:15:21.799 --> 00:15:25.879 to wherever the hospital, lock him in a cage. We 267 00:15:25.919 --> 00:15:28.200 want to go on that cell. You bring in two 268 00:15:28.440 --> 00:15:33.080 forensic psychologists and let them read everything. And I guarantee 269 00:15:33.159 --> 00:15:36.799 you that cold cases will be solved because of everything. 270 00:15:36.879 --> 00:15:39.320 But they won't do it because the way they look 271 00:15:39.360 --> 00:15:42.080 at it, it costs money to retry them. I'm not 272 00:15:42.200 --> 00:15:45.960 talking about retrying them. That's the politician talking, well, we've 273 00:15:46.000 --> 00:15:48.759 already put him on death row and that case has 274 00:15:48.759 --> 00:15:53.720 been finalized. Bullshit. I spent forty years on death row. 275 00:15:54.159 --> 00:15:58.000 No one killed me. Okay, this is the game the 276 00:15:58.039 --> 00:16:00.320 politicians playing. You're only gonna hear it from me. I 277 00:16:00.480 --> 00:16:04.279 lived it. They say, we have the death penalty, We're 278 00:16:04.320 --> 00:16:10.519 gonna execute all these terrible people. Great, but then comes California. 279 00:16:10.559 --> 00:16:14.279 Jused prudence. You have to give the guy access to 280 00:16:14.320 --> 00:16:16.960

the court, you have to give him a lawyer, you 281 00:16:17.039 --> 00:16:19.919 have to give him a defense team. Meanwhile, there is 282 00:16:19.960 --> 00:16:23.240 a backlog of cases. This guy's never gonna get executed. 283 00:16:23.240 --> 00:16:27.120 There's only been thirteen executions in California. This is nineteen 284 00:16:27.240 --> 00:16:31.159 sixty seven. Aaron Mitchell was the last guy executed in 285 00:16:31.200 --> 00:16:34.559 ninety sixty seven. The first one over here in nineteen 286 00:16:34.639 --> 00:16:39.399 ninety two was the Smiling Killer, which is Robert Alton Harris. 287 00:16:39.679 --> 00:16:43.559 I knew him. He lived right above for me. So again, 288 00:16:44.080 --> 00:16:48.600 you spend billions, billions with a B and what do 289 00:16:48.639 --> 00:16:52.080 you get. You execute thirteen guys, and you put a 290 00:16:52.080 --> 00:16:55.519 lot of people in prison on death row who deserve 291 00:16:55.600 --> 00:16:58.840 to be in prison, but don't deserve a death penalty 292 00:16:58.879 --> 00:17:03.759 because it is a pony show. Politicians are only showcasing it. 293 00:17:03.919 --> 00:17:05.680 We're putting guys on death row. Do you know that 294 00:17:05.680 --> 00:17:07.680 a guy on death row gets ten times of stuff 295 00:17:07.680 --> 00:17:09.720 that anybody else does in any prisons. Hey, I had 296 00:17:09.720 --> 00:17:13.240 an art studio in myself. All those cubes you see 297 00:17:13.240 --> 00:17:15.799 in the background, or all the paintings you've seen online. 298 00:17:15.880 --> 00:17:18.440 I was making a very good living when I was 299 00:17:18.480 --> 00:17:21.319 on death row. I went to yard every day, I 300 00:17:21.400 --> 00:17:26.319 lifted ways. I got this body from the San Quentin Jim. Okay, 301 00:17:26.920 --> 00:17:30.000 you get a team of lawyers, a team of investigators. 302 00:17:30.799 --> 00:17:36.240 Serial killers get groupies, they get contact visits. It's all 303 00:17:36.440 --> 00:17:40.200 a dog and pony show. And Joe Naso's no difference. 304 00:17:40.720 --> 00:17:43.880 He says, Hey, the show's my show. I don't need 305 00:17:43.920 --> 00:17:47.359 to remember these women because they're just characters in my 306 00:17:47.519 --> 00:17:49.799 theater of horrors. That's it. 307 00:17:50.599 --> 00:17:53.680 So what does Joseph Naso know? 308 00:17:54.079 --> 00:17:54.400 Now? 309 00:17:57.680 --> 00:18:02.240 I'm just thinking like how he would just shit himself 310 00:18:02.319 --> 00:18:04.839 because it's all out now. I mean, are you going 311 00:18:04.920 --> 00:18:06.559 to sign a book and send it to him? 312 00:18:06.920 --> 00:18:07.440 I should? 313 00:18:08.039 --> 00:18:09.559 Can I deliver it to? 314 00:18:10.400 --> 00:18:12.279 No? Absolutely? 315 00:18:12.359 --> 00:18:16.400 Why does this go down? Because look, he's it Stockton 316 00:18:16.519 --> 00:18:21.279 Medical Facility. That's a place I probably almost ended up working. 317 00:18:21.480 --> 00:18:24.480 But you know, maybe I don't have to go to 318 00:18:24.799 --> 00:18:28.599 work in a prison right to get the details, because 319 00:18:28.599 --> 00:18:32.519 I always thought as a forensic psychologist, you know, we 320 00:18:32.599 --> 00:18:35.640 do our time in a different way, right. You know, 321 00:18:36.240 --> 00:18:38.480 everyone's got to go take a job at the county, 322 00:18:38.559 --> 00:18:42.599 the State the Prisons for Prison CDCR, number one employer 323 00:18:42.759 --> 00:18:45.480 a forensic psychologists in the state of California. So that's 324 00:18:45.519 --> 00:18:48.880 where all my friends work. I'd rather host a podcast 325 00:18:49.079 --> 00:18:53.440 interview you. You've been there, you tell me about your time. Okay, 326 00:18:54.200 --> 00:18:57.839 but let's talk about what do you know about Joseph 327 00:18:57.920 --> 00:19:01.559 Naso him discovering your book or well. 328 00:19:01.440 --> 00:19:05.960 Yeah, obviously law enforcement has been speaking to him. And 329 00:19:06.839 --> 00:19:08.119 you know, I really get a kick out of this 330 00:19:08.240 --> 00:19:14.079 because I won't mention the law enforcement agency's name. But 331 00:19:15.279 --> 00:19:18.880 when we approached him about this and we gave him 332 00:19:18.880 --> 00:19:22.160 the details, they immediately said, oh, yea, yeah, we've been 333 00:19:22.240 --> 00:19:26.440 we've been investigating this for a year. And my response is, 334 00:19:27.119 --> 00:19:30.599 that's not true. You've been investigating it for fifty years 335 00:19:31.480 --> 00:19:37.680 and your results are zero. So they went to Joseph 336 00:19:37.759 --> 00:19:40.799 Nasum and they said, hey, actually it was Dan Neis, 337 00:19:40.799 --> 00:19:42.640 and I know Dan wouldn't mind me talking about the 338 00:19:42.799 --> 00:19:46.519 Dan Noise of ABC News in the Bay Area actually 339 00:19:46.559 --> 00:19:50.160 covered Joseph Nasa during his trial, and Joseph Nasa gave 340 00:19:50.200 --> 00:19:52.160 him the song and dance. It wasn't him, it was 341 00:19:52.200 --> 00:19:54.240 somebody else, and it's in some of those You can 342 00:19:54.279 --> 00:19:57.279 actually look him up online, ABC News, Nasa and Nogera 343 00:19:57.440 --> 00:19:59.759 and it pops up. So one of the things that 344 00:20:00.279 --> 00:20:03.200 they told him was. They said, hey, you know, you know, 345 00:20:03.359 --> 00:20:08.279 Joe Bill Nogera is out. And he stopped. He said, 346 00:20:09.599 --> 00:20:11.960 is he out because of what I told him? Because 347 00:20:12.000 --> 00:20:13.359 I told him a lot of stuff he was not 348 00:20:13.400 --> 00:20:15.680 supposed to share with anybody. And I wrote a lot 349 00:20:15.680 --> 00:20:17.519 of things that he was supposed to share with anybody. 350 00:20:18.720 --> 00:20:23.400 And then dan Noy said, well, what was it? Oh, 351 00:20:23.440 --> 00:20:28.519 it was nothing. I didn't tell anybody. And

he got quiet. 352 00:20:28.599 --> 00:20:31.599 He realized what he had done. He had told him 353 00:20:31.680 --> 00:20:34.519 Number one, he knew me. Number two, he gave me information. 354 00:20:34.839 --> 00:20:37.480 Number three, he wrote it down. And here's the beauty 355 00:20:37.480 --> 00:20:42.160 of everything. I have his notes. He would send me 356 00:20:42.240 --> 00:20:45.599 little notes Bill, Let's meet in the corner so no 357 00:20:45.599 --> 00:20:48.880 one can hear what we're saying. What goes on between 358 00:20:48.920 --> 00:20:53.240 you and me is between you and me, yes, exactly. 359 00:20:53.799 --> 00:20:56.720 And then he even mentions other serial killers and he says, 360 00:20:57.079 --> 00:21:01.160 don't talk about around williams Souff, the Riverside killer, or 361 00:21:01.240 --> 00:21:05.079 Lake elsinor killer, because he has a big mouth. It 362 00:21:05.200 --> 00:21:08.160 was interesting, and I have these notes. I even have 363 00:21:08.319 --> 00:21:13.359 the notes leading up to his confession where he's talking about, look, 364 00:21:13.400 --> 00:21:15.880 we'll give this to the governor. The governor will give 365 00:21:15.920 --> 00:21:18.599 me a pardon. I'll give him more murders and then 366 00:21:18.599 --> 00:21:22.079 he'll let me out. Right, Bill, I'm like absolutely. I 367 00:21:22.160 --> 00:21:23.839 told him that I had a friend that played golf 368 00:21:23.880 --> 00:21:26.319 with him every month the first Saturday. That's how I 369 00:21:26.359 --> 00:21:29.119 got the confession from him. I basically paid him for 370 00:21:29.160 --> 00:21:30.799 an idiot. 371 00:21:32.599 --> 00:21:40.039 Okay, jokes on him, man, unbelievable. So he's ninety one. 372 00:21:40.160 --> 00:21:46.039 Now he's at the Suckton Medical Facility and does he 373 00:21:46.079 --> 00:21:47.359 have any visitors. 374 00:21:47.680 --> 00:21:50.160 No. One of the reasons he wanted me to approach 375 00:21:50.200 --> 00:21:54.799 the governor or, my friend Walt Pavlo from Forbes, was 376 00:21:54.839 --> 00:21:57.720 because he was hoping to be in a place closer 377 00:21:58.440 --> 00:22:03.359 where his sons could come see him. That is all fantasy. 378 00:22:03.480 --> 00:22:06.799 His sons do not want to talk to him. Joseph 379 00:22:06.880 --> 00:22:11.319 Naso does not receive visits unless it's a lawyer coming 380 00:22:11.359 --> 00:22:15.079 to see him who's representing him on his case. He 381 00:22:15.119 --> 00:22:19.119 has basically alienated everybody in his life because he's outlived 382 00:22:19.160 --> 00:22:22.680 everybody as well. His wife, Judith is dead now, his 383 00:22:22.799 --> 00:22:27.799 families are all dead. Joseph Naso is a cockroach the 384 00:22:27.880 --> 00:22:33.640 worst kind, arguably the most prolific rapist and serial killer 385 00:22:33.720 --> 00:22:37.039 in history. He raped over one hundred and fifty women 386 00:22:37.319 --> 00:22:40.599 before he started killing between nineteen fifty one nineteen sixty five. 387 00:22:41.720 --> 00:22:45.519 Then he started killing in nineteen sixty five and he killed. 388 00:22:46.160 --> 00:22:50.000 He didn't arrest him till twenty ten. I mean, this 389 00:22:50.079 --> 00:22:53.880 guy was prolific and the one thing that he does 390 00:22:53.920 --> 00:22:59.519 better than anyone is he's exactly that an average joe 391 00:23:00.319 --> 00:23:04.279 never remember him because he's not threatening. He's not the 392 00:23:04.359 --> 00:23:08.200 kind of figure you remember, so he's able to get 393 00:23:08.240 --> 00:23:12.240 close to people. Unfortunately, Pamela Lampson was one of them 394 00:23:12.720 --> 00:23:15.480 when he met her at the A's Game. One of 395 00:23:15.519 --> 00:23:18.559 the things she told her brother, and it's covered in 396 00:23:18.680 --> 00:23:21.559 the docu series as well as the book, is that 397 00:23:21.599 --> 00:23:26.960 she said, Hey, this guy could be my father. And 398 00:23:27.799 --> 00:23:33.000 that jive perfectly well because they actually accused Rodney Accala, 399 00:23:33.079 --> 00:23:36.559 the Dating Game killer, of killing Pamela lamps and leaving 400 00:23:36.599 --> 00:23:44.000 her on mountain. That's absolutely incorrect and shame on law 401 00:23:44.079 --> 00:23:50.440 enforcement for screwing that up. Joseph Naso bragged me that 402 00:23:51.640 --> 00:23:54.640 Rodney Aco is being accused for a murder he didn't commit. 403 00:23:55.519 --> 00:23:58.599 And Joseph Naso's other girl from mont Time, because there 404 00:23:58.680 --> 00:24:01.720 was two of them. He also picked her up in 405 00:24:01.759 --> 00:24:03.920 the A's game, and it's in that book. It gives 406 00:24:03.960 --> 00:24:07.319 you details where she's at, where he left her, how 407 00:24:07.319 --> 00:24:09.720 he killed her, how he picked up on her, and 408 00:24:09.839 --> 00:24:16.720 they match identically to Pamela Lampson. It's unfortunate that they 409 00:24:16.960 --> 00:24:22.160 realize this because Rodney Alcala looks nothing in the nineteen 410 00:24:22.240 --> 00:24:27.440 seventies like someone's father. He was a charismatic some would 411 00:24:27.519 --> 00:24:33.119 say handsome, charming individual creepy, but all those things were 412 00:24:33.119 --> 00:24:36.039 happening in the seventies. You know, he had long hair, 413 00:24:36.880 --> 00:24:40.599 Joseph Na's had none of those. He looked like someone's father. 414 00:24:41.759 --> 00:24:44.640 That should have been the first clue to law enforcement. 415 00:24:44.960 --> 00:24:48.000 This is the wrong guy. Rodney Alcola could not be 416 00:24:48.119 --> 00:24:50.519 this guy. But you know what, they like to put 417 00:24:50.519 --> 00:24:53.680 things in nice little packages and put them away until 418 00:24:53.720 --> 00:24:56.920 someone shines a light me and says. 419 00:24:56.720 --> 00:25:01.319 Wrong, Yeah, what does this law enforce an agency think 420

00:25:01.400 --> 00:25:02.119 of you? Now? 421 00:25:02.920 --> 00:25:07.680 I could give a damn. Honestly, I'm out. I'm not 422 00:25:07.720 --> 00:25:11.039 doing anything incorrect. I'm helping victim's families. I'm living a 423 00:25:11.079 --> 00:25:14.640 clean life. I don't even talk about rehabilitation or redemption. 424 00:25:15.119 --> 00:25:19.079 Redemption is a selfish act. This isn't about me. If 425 00:25:19.119 --> 00:25:21.759 it was, I never would have put myself in danger because, 426 00:25:21.759 --> 00:25:23.319 as you know what you will know at the end 427 00:25:23.319 --> 00:25:26.200 of the book, I've been put on a hit list 428 00:25:26.519 --> 00:25:30.880 to be murdered because me turning on the system and 429 00:25:31.119 --> 00:25:33.279 doing what I do. I could care less. You know 430 00:25:33.319 --> 00:25:36.440 what I said it back in forty years on death row. 431 00:25:36.720 --> 00:25:39.279 I'm not hard to find. I go to yard every day. 432 00:25:39.680 --> 00:25:41.880 If you want to come after me, be my guest. 433 00:25:42.359 --> 00:25:44.799 Same thing with killers. Right now, you really want to 434 00:25:44.839 --> 00:25:47.599 come after me, you know what it's like sending a 435 00:25:47.680 --> 00:25:50.839 rabbit to the wolf. Bring them. I have no problem 436 00:25:50.839 --> 00:25:53.720 with it. I believe that the agencies that care the 437 00:25:53.720 --> 00:25:57.559 CDC are my parole agent, and the people in parole 438 00:25:57.680 --> 00:26:00.200 are behind what I'm doing because they see the bigger picture. Sure, 439 00:26:01.200 --> 00:26:05.079 rehabilitation is only a word unless you back it up 440 00:26:05.119 --> 00:26:08.400 with action. If I say, well I've been rehabilitated, I'm 441 00:26:08.440 --> 00:26:12.319 the longer robbing banks. That's about you. I don't even 442 00:26:12.400 --> 00:26:15.640 say rehability it My value system is changed, my belief 443 00:26:15.720 --> 00:26:19.079 system is changed, and that is to help victims' families. 444 00:26:19.799 --> 00:26:22.839 I am practicing what I preach. I'm doing what I 445 00:26:22.880 --> 00:26:26.759 say I'm gonna do. That is what true rehabilitation is. 446 00:26:26.799 --> 00:26:30.640 About because you're actually putting action behind words all that 447 00:26:30.680 --> 00:26:33.200 other stuff. People are just trying to make a living. 448 00:26:33.200 --> 00:26:35.319 I don't give a damn about that. I don't need 449 00:26:35.359 --> 00:26:37.559 to make a living from this. I want only to 450 00:26:37.759 --> 00:26:40.640 educate the public, entertain the public a little bit, and 451 00:26:40.799 --> 00:26:45.440 hopefully somebody's family's going to say, thank you, my god, 452 00:26:45.519 --> 00:26:47.559 I didn't know what happened my child, and now I know, 453 00:26:47.799 --> 00:26:48.759 thank you. That's it. 454 00:26:49.640 --> 00:26:52.160 Yeah, they just stick that R on the you know, 455 00:26:52.279 --> 00:26:55.039 Department of Rehabilitation. What does that really mean? Right that? 456 00:26:55.160 --> 00:26:55.799 To add that? 457 00:26:56.359 --> 00:26:59.559 Right? Well, back in the day, there was no CDC R. 458 00:26:59.599 --> 00:27:02.480 It was just CDC. You went in there and if 459 00:27:02.480 --> 00:27:04.920 you have problem, you'll used to tell you, good luck 460 00:27:04.920 --> 00:27:07.200 with that. You shouldn't have committed crimes. Good luck with that. 461 00:27:07.880 --> 00:27:11.079 Well, yeahsbabs something we talk about as forensic psychologists. They 462 00:27:11.079 --> 00:27:13.119 add the R. And of course I have friends that 463 00:27:13.160 --> 00:27:15.599 work for cities, yards we go what does that really mean? 464 00:27:15.599 --> 00:27:18.799 What does what they roll out? What's changed? How do 465 00:27:18.839 --> 00:27:22.119 they track that? Where's the funds for the rehabilitation. 466 00:27:22.759 --> 00:27:26.119 It's interesting you say that because I believe, and this 467 00:27:26.160 --> 00:27:31.400 is my opinion, that the CDC are the R now today, 468 00:27:31.519 --> 00:27:35.519 in today's world is actually something because they are giving 469 00:27:35.640 --> 00:27:40.440 classes on domestic violence, They're giving classes on awareness, giving 470 00:27:40.480 --> 00:27:46.200 classes on victimization, alcohol anonymous, narcotic anonymous. There are a 471 00:27:46.240 --> 00:27:51.079 class on criminal thinking. There's a group called ARC and 472 00:27:51.480 --> 00:27:55.759 they are at the forefront of helping people who are 473 00:27:55.799 --> 00:28:00.440 criminals understand themselves, because if you understand yourself, you're better 474 00:28:01.680 --> 00:28:04.720 equipped to diagnose yourself before you do something. You understand 475 00:28:05.240 --> 00:28:08.599 character defects, you understand coositive factors. Why do I feel 476 00:28:08.599 --> 00:28:10.680 this way? I feel? I think that's one of the 477 00:28:10.759 --> 00:28:15.920 most important parts about the rehabilitation. It's actually education. And 478 00:28:15.960 --> 00:28:18.279 of course a bunch of freaking idiots out there say, oh, 479 00:28:18.400 --> 00:28:21.319 they're educate, giving these guys college degrees. It's got nothing 480 00:28:21.319 --> 00:28:25.480 to do with that. The education is education about why 481 00:28:25.559 --> 00:28:28.039 I am the person that I am. Why do I 482 00:28:28.119 --> 00:28:30.400 like to steal? Why do I feel that I have 483 00:28:30.480 --> 00:28:34.559 to seek powering gangs. If you have those answers, you're 484 00:28:34.640 --> 00:28:38.039 less likely to commit crimes. And I know about this 485 00:28:38.119 --> 00:28:41.519 because I need to facilitate the classes at Corker Straight Prison. 486 00:28:42.000 --> 00:28:45.000 I'm the facilitator. I'm the guy who was teaching the class. 487 00:28:45.640 --> 00:28:47.920 Can we co facilitate a class together? 488

00:28:48.359 --> 00:28:50.839 I think it would be great. I told you for Dinna, 489 00:28:51.160 --> 00:28:54.319 I think that us working together would be a great thing. 490 00:28:55.000 --> 00:28:57.640 Respective work that you do. You're the real deal. I'm 491 00:28:57.640 --> 00:28:59.599 a little scared of you. Though I'm sitting here. You're 492 00:28:59.599 --> 00:29:02.759 probably oh, yeah, this guy. You know, you have your 493 00:29:02.759 --> 00:29:05.160 little notes right there. You're taking anything down. But you 494 00:29:05.160 --> 00:29:07.759 know I'm an open book. Yeah they're there, aren't they. 495 00:29:08.200 --> 00:29:12.759 So I'll send you your psychological report later, Okay, and 496 00:29:12.799 --> 00:29:13.039 we do. 497 00:29:13.319 --> 00:29:14.920 Oh man, that's gonna be off the chain. Let me 498 00:29:15.000 --> 00:29:19.680 help you. Self centered, narcissistic? Am I getting the first 499 00:29:19.680 --> 00:29:20.079 two right? 500 00:29:21.720 --> 00:29:22.319 Keep going? 501 00:29:23.279 --> 00:29:28.559 Yeah, I know self analyzation great, right, But you know. 502 00:29:28.799 --> 00:29:31.920 We could still maybe work together, co facilitate a group, 503 00:29:32.039 --> 00:29:36.160 you know, and maybe can we go back and visit 504 00:29:36.279 --> 00:29:39.839 Joe and a little surprise visit. 505 00:29:40.880 --> 00:29:43.400 I would pay money to see the reaction on his face. 506 00:29:43.519 --> 00:29:46.599 Me walk through that door in my black sling shot 507 00:29:46.759 --> 00:29:49.319 and just this is I used to wear this in prison. 508 00:29:49.519 --> 00:29:52.440 I have pictures of me in the nineteen early nineties. 509 00:29:52.599 --> 00:29:55.319 We're in this same thing, and just walk in and 510 00:29:55.359 --> 00:29:59.400 smile them and just say, let's just talk. Man. He's 511 00:29:59.440 --> 00:30:03.200 not gonna do. He's an old man. He's gonna sit down. 512 00:30:03.440 --> 00:30:05.960 He's probably gonna be a cuetory and I'm gonna then 513 00:30:05.960 --> 00:30:07.799 I'm gonna try and do what I do best, say Joe, 514 00:30:07.799 --> 00:30:10.200 But look, we did some great things together, right. Some 515 00:30:10.279 --> 00:30:13.720 families are actually appreciative of what you've done, Joe. This 516 00:30:13.920 --> 00:30:16.640 is the way to really get your kids back. You've 517 00:30:16.680 --> 00:30:19.160 done so much. You don't understand how many people have 518 00:30:19.319 --> 00:30:23.319 told me Joseph Naso has all the answers and he 519 00:30:23.400 --> 00:30:26.039 could help us. And I bet you, I'm willing to 520 00:30:26.039 --> 00:30:27.519 bet you I can get him and tell me more. 521 00:30:28.200 --> 00:30:31.279 Oh, can you help me get a new wheelchair? Can 522 00:30:31.319 --> 00:30:34.640 you keep these guys from getting on me? I could 523 00:30:34.640 --> 00:30:37.480 really use your protection. Like, I'll give you some answers. 524 00:30:38.880 --> 00:30:41.559 Yeah, you know what I want to tell him. Absolutely, 525 00:30:42.000 --> 00:30:43.960 I'm here to help you, Joe. That's what I do. 526 00:30:45.240 --> 00:30:46.960 I'm the guy that get you things in prison. 527 00:30:47.480 --> 00:30:50.920 Well, yeah, I hear he's physically not doing too good. 528 00:30:51.880 --> 00:30:54.599 Yeah, somebody because he has that mouth like in that 529 00:30:54.680 --> 00:30:58.279 story about Rockhead. He can't stop talking down to people. 530 00:30:58.519 --> 00:31:01.920 It's a very condescending guy. And he did at someone 531 00:31:01.960 --> 00:31:04.640 this time and they flipped over his wheelchair and broke 532 00:31:04.640 --> 00:31:07.440 his hip. So yeah, he's not doing too good and 533 00:31:07.480 --> 00:31:11.720 it doesn't look like Joe's going to learning good lessons 534 00:31:11.720 --> 00:31:15.319 from this. Less Number one, don't talk shit to people 535 00:31:15.319 --> 00:31:15.960 that can hurt you. 536 00:31:16.599 --> 00:31:20.960 He's ninety one years old, like his days are numbered. 537 00:31:21.279 --> 00:31:29.839 So we got limited time, okay, And you know, dementia 538 00:31:29.920 --> 00:31:33.319 could be creeping in your memory fades like what can 539 00:31:33.400 --> 00:31:37.079 we squeeze out old Joe? And time? Like, I mean, 540 00:31:37.079 --> 00:31:40.279 what are your You've definitely squeezed out a lot of 541 00:31:40.319 --> 00:31:42.640 information from him, but he's still alive and this is 542 00:31:42.680 --> 00:31:46.759 a rare opportunity that where people are still alive to 543 00:31:46.799 --> 00:31:52.079 get details and it's time sensitive. I think about that, 544 00:31:52.319 --> 00:31:55.039 you know, and here is he going to give information to? 545 00:31:55.359 --> 00:31:58.839 Apparently you're the only one. But I also you did 546 00:31:58.880 --> 00:32:01.279 tell me he likes redheads. 547 00:32:02.200 --> 00:32:06.680 He loves redheads. His wife Judas was the redhead, and Roxanne, 548 00:32:06.680 --> 00:32:09.119 who he killed, was a redhead. He does have a 549 00:32:09.160 --> 00:32:13.160 thing about redheads. Doesn't mean it's his exclusive target, but 550 00:32:13.240 --> 00:32:19.039 if the opportunity presents itself, he does prefer redheads. I 551 00:32:19.079 --> 00:32:21.559 think there's things we can get from him. I think 552 00:32:22.000 --> 00:32:25.039 there's still meat on the bone. He gave me so much. 553 00:32:25.640 --> 00:32:30.799 Five murders have been identified and solved, and there are 554 00:32:30.839 --> 00:32:34.680 and that's only eleven of the twenty six. There are 555 00:32:35.119 --> 00:32:39.160 a lot of murders that still can be resolved, which 556 00:32:39.680 --> 00:32:42.799 we're working on right now. But it would be good 557 00:32:43.000 --> 00:32:45.519 if we can get to a point where Joe knows 558 00:32:45.759 --> 00:32:50.440 what I'm doing and he understands that this can only 559 00:32:50.480 -->

00:32:53.880 help him. He doesn't have any remorse, he doesn't care. 560 00:32:53.960 --> 00:32:56.119 He actually even cried to me one time when he said, 561 00:32:56.359 --> 00:32:58.680 I'm not a threat to anybody anymore. He was crying. 562 00:32:58.720 --> 00:33:01.640 He said, you know, I'm just old man. And then 563 00:33:01.880 --> 00:33:06.640 he stops and then starts giggling, you know, and he starts, 564 00:33:06.720 --> 00:33:10.519 you know, squeezing his hands together, and he says, you know, 565 00:33:10.599 --> 00:33:13.400 like here's an example. Joe's not the oldest guy on 566 00:33:13.440 --> 00:33:16.039 death Row, by the way. The oldest man on death 567 00:33:16.079 --> 00:33:19.720 Row is David Carpenter. He is the trail Side Killer, 568 00:33:20.160 --> 00:33:24.119 the trail side killer. And I spend decades talking, just talking, 569 00:33:25.079 --> 00:33:29.200 and the trail side Killer is ninety five years old. 570 00:33:31.359 --> 00:33:34.160 He might be ninety six. You know. I would tell him, 571 00:33:34.160 --> 00:33:36.240 I would joke around with him. I'd say, hey, David, 572 00:33:36.240 --> 00:33:39.839 what's going on? And he would say like this, Hi, Bill, 573 00:33:40.200 --> 00:33:42.319 And I say Hey, are you working out? You know 574 00:33:42.400 --> 00:33:44.880 what you would tell me? He says, I work out 575 00:33:45.000 --> 00:33:50.279 every day by squeezing a trigger, because that's how he 576 00:33:50.359 --> 00:33:53.359 killed his victims. He shot him. This is a kind 577 00:33:53.359 --> 00:33:56.400 of relationship I had with serial killers. I just come 578 00:33:56.480 --> 00:33:59.119 up to him, Hey, what's up, buddy? You working out? 579 00:33:59.200 --> 00:34:01.160 He always going to go he last, He goes like this. 580 00:34:01.759 --> 00:34:07.880 So you can imagine law enforcements, psychologists, judges, people, they're 581 00:34:07.880 --> 00:34:10.519 never going to have that type of relationship with a guy. 582 00:34:11.000 --> 00:34:13.039 Or I can joke with it, because remember he's talking 583 00:34:13.079 --> 00:34:16.360 to a peer for all intended purposes. I was the 584 00:34:16.440 --> 00:34:19.599 youngest guy at that time sentenced to death. Everybody knew 585 00:34:19.599 --> 00:34:22.719 who I was, and I was known as a killer, 586 00:34:23.880 --> 00:34:27.679 the guy you don't mess with in the yard. Syracures 587 00:34:27.679 --> 00:34:32.440 found that to be leveling field because they didn't feel 588 00:34:32.480 --> 00:34:35.559 threatened by me, meaning I wasn't gonna tell on them. 589 00:34:35.679 --> 00:34:38.000 I was never getting out of prison. No one gets 590 00:34:38.000 --> 00:34:40.000 out of death row. Wrong. 591 00:34:41.519 --> 00:34:44.960 Yeah, So having a life sentence, yeah, so this guy 592 00:34:45.000 --> 00:34:46.280 ain't going nowhere. 593 00:34:46.960 --> 00:34:52.119 Right, and it was fast. I had death January twenty eight, 594 00:34:52.199 --> 00:34:57.239 twenty twenty three, got life without positively a paroleue August 595 00:34:57.599 --> 00:35:02.519 Boom they drop it down the twenty five life January Boom, 596 00:35:02.960 --> 00:35:06.599 I get found suitable. I'm out in five months. That 597 00:35:06.760 --> 00:35:07.599 is unheard of. 598 00:35:08.559 --> 00:35:12.719 It's shocking. People always ask me about the criminal system 599 00:35:12.760 --> 00:35:17.760 and sentencing guidelines, and you know, I've just seen some 600 00:35:17.840 --> 00:35:20.800 shocking things and things you couldn't think could be overturned 601 00:35:20.880 --> 00:35:26.079 or changed for such variations and sentencing. In school, I 602 00:35:26.119 --> 00:35:28.960 remember the captain of the police department. I did my 603 00:35:29.000 --> 00:35:32.159 bachelor's in criminal justice, and he remember saying, the criminal 604 00:35:32.360 --> 00:35:35.239 justice system is a non system, it's not even a system, 605 00:35:35.280 --> 00:35:37.320 and he would just share all the stories of his 606 00:35:37.480 --> 00:35:41.880 experience and it really opened up my mind of like, wow, 607 00:35:41.960 --> 00:35:43.920 it's not really what you think it is. And so 608 00:35:45.360 --> 00:35:48.920 who knew your sentence could be undone and here you are. 609 00:35:49.880 --> 00:35:52.079 You know, it's always interesting because people now say, well, 610 00:35:52.119 --> 00:35:54.280 you got us so quickly. Well, no, it took forty 611 00:35:54.320 --> 00:35:57.199 two years. I was in the system where I saw 612 00:35:57.280 --> 00:36:00.320 people that they would do four or five years for 613 00:36:00.400 --> 00:36:03.199 murder and get out and I had one homicide. I 614 00:36:03.199 --> 00:36:06.719 didn't have seven. I didn't have eight. I had one. 615 00:36:07.079 --> 00:36:11.559 I'm not minimizing it, but that's what I had. It 616 00:36:11.599 --> 00:36:16.960 took forty two years and in forty two years. It 617 00:36:17.039 --> 00:36:22.880 was only eight years after my sentence that we got 618 00:36:23.280 --> 00:36:26.519 the witness that testified against me for the special circumstances, 619 00:36:26.559 --> 00:36:29.480 which was financial gain, to admit that he lied about 620 00:36:29.480 --> 00:36:34.320 everything that Sergeant Kelby Keltner fed on the story and 621 00:36:34.360 --> 00:36:36.599 then recorded it and then got him out of jail 622 00:36:36.679 --> 00:36:40.920 eighteen different times. From a testify against me. We had 623 00:36:40.960 --> 00:36:45.719 that eight years in it took another thirty four years 624 00:36:46.159 --> 00:36:49.039 for a judge to look at it and say I'm 625 00:36:49.119 --> 00:36:53.440 not allowing this to continue. Enough is enough. And that 626 00:36:53.599 --> 00:37:00.000 judge is Orange County Superior Court, Honorable Judge Lance Jensen. 627 00:37:00.880 --> 00:37:03.840 And I say honorable because someday I like to shake 628 00:37:03.880 -->

00:37:08.239 his hand. He is a man who practices what he preaches. 629 00:37:08.760 --> 00:37:12.800 He is a conservative that believes in common sense, not 630 00:37:12.920 --> 00:37:17.239 in political idolism or political gain. He had nothing to 631 00:37:17.320 --> 00:37:20.760 gain from helping me, but he helped me because he saw 632 00:37:20.800 --> 00:37:24.719 an injustice. And I thank him. I thanked him, and 633 00:37:25.599 --> 00:37:27.559 you know what the truth is, I'm here today because 634 00:37:27.559 --> 00:37:29.719 of him. I appreciate that. 635 00:37:30.239 --> 00:37:32.840 Wow, judges have a lot of power. 636 00:37:33.119 --> 00:37:35.519 Power to keep you in prison because they refuse to 637 00:37:35.559 --> 00:37:38.280 do anything, and in power to finally do something. You 638 00:37:38.280 --> 00:37:43.599 remember in twenty seventeen, federal Judge Christina and I Forget 639 00:37:43.599 --> 00:37:47.840 Her Lasting the Horrible Names ordered me released twenty seventeen, 640 00:37:49.000 --> 00:37:53.119 and that was ignored. The Attorney General appealed that for 641 00:37:53.280 --> 00:37:57.320 five years, appealed it until finally they say, just give 642 00:37:57.400 --> 00:38:00.000 him life. And then I postponed it for a year 643 00:38:00.519 --> 00:38:03.519 because I hadn't finished this book. I hadn't gotten all 644 00:38:03.559 --> 00:38:06.639 the information I needed from Joe Nasl, So I spent 645 00:38:06.719 --> 00:38:10.320 an extra year on death row to get that story. 646 00:38:10.880 --> 00:38:15.360 Like I said, sacrifice like I have done is unheard of. 647 00:38:16.159 --> 00:38:19.159 Oh wow, that's later. I didn't know. So you'd been 648 00:38:19.320 --> 00:38:21.800 ordered to be released, you weren't finished. 649 00:38:22.079 --> 00:38:25.480 I was already released in twenty seventeen. The Attorney General 650 00:38:25.960 --> 00:38:28.599 appealed it. Five years later, they said, okay, just give 651 00:38:28.639 --> 00:38:31.079 them life sentence them. I said no, no, no, no, no, hold on. 652 00:38:31.559 --> 00:38:35.639 I told my attorney postpone it, and he said why. 653 00:38:36.119 --> 00:38:37.480 I said, I got something to do. He says, wait, 654 00:38:37.480 --> 00:38:39.000 you gonna spend another year on death row? 655 00:38:39.119 --> 00:38:39.360 Why? 656 00:38:39.880 --> 00:38:42.400 I wouldn't tell him because I hadn't finished his story. 657 00:38:42.440 --> 00:38:44.000 I didn't have all the answers I needed. 658 00:38:44.840 --> 00:38:46.320 Wait, your attorney didn't even know. 659 00:38:47.760 --> 00:38:51.760 No, no one knew I couldn't afford it. Dana. You 660 00:38:51.800 --> 00:38:55.199 gotta understand my life was at risk had I gone 661 00:38:55.239 --> 00:38:58.880 outside and they knew what I was doing. Look, I'm 662 00:38:58.920 --> 00:39:01.039 not an easy guy to kill. That's one thing people know. 663 00:39:01.320 --> 00:39:03.960 Bill is not easy to kill. But if they sent 664 00:39:04.159 --> 00:39:07.519 four or five guys with knives, they're going to inflict damage. 665 00:39:07.559 --> 00:39:10.480 I might live through it, but I'm going to suffer 666 00:39:10.800 --> 00:39:15.000 a great deal of damage. My life was in danger 667 00:39:15.000 --> 00:39:17.760 when I was there, and I had to be very careful. 668 00:39:17.800 --> 00:39:20.920 I could not share this with anyone. 669 00:39:21.480 --> 00:39:24.079 Yeah, it's just how to keep this all to yourself. 670 00:39:24.079 --> 00:39:26.199 It's so much in your head, and of course you're 671 00:39:26.239 --> 00:39:30.480 writing it down. You had your own journal entries that 672 00:39:30.559 --> 00:39:32.840 at one point you said you had in your cell, 673 00:39:33.079 --> 00:39:37.079 and through some cell check the guards confiscated it. We 674 00:39:37.079 --> 00:39:38.280 were writing everything down. 675 00:39:38.920 --> 00:39:43.360 Yes, over three hundred pages of notes I took from 676 00:39:43.480 --> 00:39:47.960 Joseph Naso, plus photographs and everything. I had a file 677 00:39:48.000 --> 00:39:50.920 on him and several other Sero codes that at one 678 00:39:50.920 --> 00:39:53.599 point I sent him out to a lawyer to hold 679 00:39:53.599 --> 00:39:57.000 on for me. I retained a lawyer. I have the 680 00:39:57.039 --> 00:40:00.880 original confessions. I have them all. I have over one 681 00:40:00.960 --> 00:40:04.960 hundred and seventy eight pages of written confessions from different 682 00:40:05.000 --> 00:40:08.639 serial killers about the crimes they convict. I still have them. 683 00:40:09.079 --> 00:40:10.280 Those are next. 684 00:40:10.519 --> 00:40:12.800 Okay, well then we got a season. We gotta we 685 00:40:12.840 --> 00:40:16.760 have more seasons coming out. Absolutely, you're just getting started, 686 00:40:16.760 --> 00:40:19.320 because this is just well, this is just one serial killer. 687 00:40:19.840 --> 00:40:23.719 But I feel like we're not done here, Like how 688 00:40:23.719 --> 00:40:29.679 do we go back with Joe to get additional information? 689 00:40:30.039 --> 00:40:33.159 Ninety one is days are numbered? Race on death row 690 00:40:33.360 --> 00:40:37.840 like anytime someone can shake him. He's a pretty unlikable guy, right, Sorry, 691 00:40:37.960 --> 00:40:42.000 broke his hips, one overturned his wheelchair, and I think 692 00:40:42.039 --> 00:40:44.960 I watched one of the last media interviews he had 693 00:40:45.039 --> 00:40:49.880 with somebody, and of course he's not given up anything, right, 694 00:40:50.000 --> 00:40:52.519 So it's like, how can we create a circumstance to 695 00:40:52.719 --> 00:40:57.280 have him to stroke his ego, this narcissistic side of him, 696 00:40:57.360 --> 00:41:00.679 to to feel like there's something in it for him, right, 697 00:41:01.519 --> 00:41:04.079 Like he's the hero of his own story, this art 698 00:41:04.199 --> 00:41:08.320 that he believes he's created. Like it's

like, have you 699 00:41:08.400 --> 00:41:09.119 thought this out? 700 00:41:09.920 --> 00:41:12.679 I have. I've thought about a great number of times. 701 00:41:13.280 --> 00:41:16.119 The biggest hurdle would be for me to get back 702 00:41:16.119 --> 00:41:20.519 into the system, get back into a prison setting. It 703 00:41:20.559 --> 00:41:22.519 would be difficult because the parole board would have to 704 00:41:22.519 --> 00:41:25.880 approve it, and that could take months. But I believe 705 00:41:25.920 --> 00:41:29.119 that if law enforcement stepped in and said, hey, send 706 00:41:29.159 --> 00:41:32.199 him in there, he can do the job. Just let 707 00:41:32.280 --> 00:41:36.719 him do what he does best. If law enforcement supersedes 708 00:41:36.800 --> 00:41:42.719 anybody else, active investigations supersede anything else. So if law enforcement, 709 00:41:42.760 --> 00:41:47.320 who are probably listening to this, hey I'm available, send 710 00:41:47.320 --> 00:41:49.400 me in there. Let me talk to him. You give 711 00:41:49.440 --> 00:41:52.320 me a few hours of Joe Naso. I promise you 712 00:41:52.559 --> 00:41:55.519 I'll have more details. I already have a bunch of details. 713 00:41:55.880 --> 00:42:00.360 I have dozens and dozens and dozens of notebooks full 714 00:42:00.920 --> 00:42:05.639 of notes. Send me back in. I will get more 715 00:42:05.639 --> 00:42:08.800 from Joseph Naso. Hell, I can get a lot more 716 00:42:08.800 --> 00:42:11.960 from any of those guys, because the one thing that's 717 00:42:11.960 --> 00:42:15.840 going to appeal to them is that now I had 718 00:42:15.840 --> 00:42:18.920 a television series, I can make them famous. I can 719 00:42:18.960 --> 00:42:22.519 make them the center of women's attention. Serial killers have 720 00:42:22.559 --> 00:42:26.119 groupies on death row, for God's sakes, this would be 721 00:42:26.159 --> 00:42:26.760 great for them. 722 00:42:27.199 --> 00:42:30.159 Yeah, and we can show Joe, look, we got the 723 00:42:30.199 --> 00:42:34.519 perfect thumb now for your new YouTube channel. Right, we 724 00:42:34.840 --> 00:42:38.599 make him believe something that is never going to happen. 725 00:42:39.000 --> 00:42:41.320 I mean, wouldn't it be great. I mean, tell them 726 00:42:41.320 --> 00:42:44.360 that you have your own YouTube channel and actually have 727 00:42:44.519 --> 00:42:47.079 them be on the phone from death Row on a 728 00:42:47.159 --> 00:42:51.519 video camera telling us, Okay, go there, do this. He 729 00:42:51.639 --> 00:42:54.360 might appeal to him, but the way I think about 730 00:42:54.400 --> 00:42:56.360 it is just going in there and talking to him 731 00:42:56.360 --> 00:42:58.440 and tell him, Joe, I did this for Rick, to 732 00:42:58.480 --> 00:43:01.159 this family, but I got now the governor interested. You 733 00:43:01.280 --> 00:43:04.480 just gave the one written one. Give me this and 734 00:43:04.519 --> 00:43:08.039 that I'll get you out. I got myself out. I'm 735 00:43:08.079 --> 00:43:11.320 thinking I can convince them of that. I can convince them. 736 00:43:12.079 --> 00:43:16.320 I'm convinced you can convince him if anyone can. And 737 00:43:16.440 --> 00:43:21.960 I think this story, that this conversation that we're having 738 00:43:22.039 --> 00:43:25.280 right now, this book, this TV series, I people can 739 00:43:25.480 --> 00:43:28.440 actually watch it and understand the purpose of what we do. 740 00:43:29.920 --> 00:43:33.239 It's just this pivotal time and history that this is, 741 00:43:33.480 --> 00:43:37.719 this situation is presenting itself. It's like to solve more 742 00:43:37.800 --> 00:43:41.559 cold cases. And you just had such unique opportunity to 743 00:43:41.639 --> 00:43:44.199 have this front row seat and death Row to get 744 00:43:44.239 --> 00:43:49.119 all the details from Joe Naso. It's just incredible. And 745 00:43:49.159 --> 00:43:52.559 I want people to support what you're doing. And I 746 00:43:52.599 --> 00:43:56.719 know you have a nonprofit too, and I think your 747 00:43:56.719 --> 00:44:00.559 story is probably so it's just so mind blowing in credible. 748 00:44:00.639 --> 00:44:02.400 But I feel like there's so much of you that 749 00:44:02.440 --> 00:44:05.480 could be misunderstood too for people that don't know you 750 00:44:06.320 --> 00:44:09.960 and you know, haven't got a chance to sit down 751 00:44:10.000 --> 00:44:15.280 and talk with you. So I'm just so grateful that 752 00:44:15.280 --> 00:44:17.320 that you're chatting with me today and giving me all 753 00:44:17.320 --> 00:44:19.000 this information. It's unbelievable. 754 00:44:20.199 --> 00:44:23.239 Well look for me, Yeah, you say people misunderstand me, 755 00:44:23.960 --> 00:44:28.480 I'm not that tortured soul that's you know, misunderstood. I'm 756 00:44:28.519 --> 00:44:31.039 a pretty straight shooter. I think that's some of the 757 00:44:31.079 --> 00:44:33.199 things that people may not like about me is that 758 00:44:33.239 --> 00:44:35.119 I'm always a straight shooter. If I don't like someone 759 00:44:35.159 --> 00:44:37.760 to tell you right away, I try to be as 760 00:44:37.800 --> 00:44:41.519 politically correct as I can be. Sometimes not so much 761 00:44:41.960 --> 00:44:45.280 because I choose not to be with me. I am 762 00:44:45.320 --> 00:44:47.880 what you see, and I don't try and be anybody 763 00:44:47.920 --> 00:44:50.360 I'm not. I'm very comfortable my own skin. But I 764 00:44:50.400 --> 00:44:54.239 have a purpose, and that purpose is to solve as 765 00:44:54.239 --> 00:44:59.599 many cases I can to actually get involved on my 766 00:44:59.639 --> 00:45:04.079 own or with law enforcements help inactive serial killer cases. 767 00:45:04.159 --> 00:45:07.280 They're out there, they're happening. Serial killers have not disappearing. 768 00:45:07.920 --> 00:45:10.000 Don't get this thing all twisted where you have some 769 00:45:10.039

--> 00:45:12.440 experts saying that the golden age of serial killers is gone. 770 00:45:13.079 --> 00:45:15.199 That's the biggest crock of shit I ever heard in 771 00:45:15.239 --> 00:45:19.239 my life. Six hundred and forty three thousand people disappear 772 00:45:19.480 --> 00:45:23.360 in the United States every year. I'll repeat that, six 773 00:45:23.440 --> 00:45:27.039 hundred and forty three thousand people every year, and they're 774 00:45:27.079 --> 00:45:30.480 still missing because they haven't found a body. In the 775 00:45:30.519 --> 00:45:32.599 most case, a lot of those people are dead. A 776 00:45:32.639 --> 00:45:35.800 lot of those people have been sold into slavery. There 777 00:45:35.840 --> 00:45:38.519 are things that are going on right now that the normal, 778 00:45:38.880 --> 00:45:42.960 average law abidy incident has no idea happens. It's why 779 00:45:43.119 --> 00:45:46.800 in all my shows with be Safe, be aware of 780 00:45:46.840 --> 00:45:50.280 your surroundings. Your life could depend on it. It's really 781 00:45:50.400 --> 00:45:53.559 that simple. You have to be aware of your surroundings. 782 00:45:54.079 --> 00:45:56.360 I practice what I preach. When I was on death Row, 783 00:45:56.519 --> 00:46:00.119 I was always around aware of my surroundings because at 784 00:46:00.199 --> 00:46:03.679 any moment, violence can erupt. It's the same thing out here. 785 00:46:04.159 --> 00:46:08.519 It happens all the time. Mass shooting's, serial killer, serial rapists, 786 00:46:08.599 --> 00:46:11.119 whatever it may be. If you're aware of what's going on, 787 00:46:11.679 --> 00:46:15.360 the likelihood of someone sneaking up on you or putting 788 00:46:15.360 --> 00:46:18.000 you in a position where you're vulnerable does not exist. 789 00:46:18.519 --> 00:46:21.760 You have to be aware. That's what I want to tea, 790 00:46:21.840 --> 00:46:24.239 That's what I want to do. It's so important to me, 791 00:46:24.639 --> 00:46:26.400 and I'm passionate. As you can see, I get very 792 00:46:26.440 --> 00:46:30.119 passionate about this because it's important to me. I believe 793 00:46:30.480 --> 00:46:32.719 it's what I was built and created to do. And 794 00:46:33.119 --> 00:46:35.639 I wasn't born this way. I was created. It's different 795 00:46:35.679 --> 00:46:38.559 to me and serial killers. Serial killers are born that way. 796 00:46:39.000 --> 00:46:41.360 Anybody that argues to the opposite doesn't know what the 797 00:46:41.440 --> 00:46:45.880 fuck they're talking about. Okay, straight up. Jane Goodall is 798 00:46:45.920 --> 00:46:50.239 the leading expert was on chimpanzees because she lived with 799 00:46:50.280 --> 00:46:52.400 them so long, she saw things that no one else saw. 800 00:46:53.079 --> 00:46:56.199 I am, by all intended purposes, the Jane Goodall of 801 00:46:56.320 --> 00:46:59.639 serial killers, the serial killer whisperer, if you will, because 802 00:46:59.679 --> 00:47:03.280 they've told me everything. They told me, either logic or reasoning. 803 00:47:03.960 --> 00:47:09.119 Why they're cunning, their mo their signatures. I've learned it 804 00:47:09.280 --> 00:47:12.559 all from them because I was a boy put amongst them. 805 00:47:13.599 --> 00:47:16.599 They never paid attention to me until I was introduced 806 00:47:16.639 --> 00:47:20.880 to them by William Bonning, the Freeway Killer. Why you asked, 807 00:47:21.360 --> 00:47:23.440 because I was almost one of his victims when I 808 00:47:23.519 --> 00:47:24.760 was an eleven year old little. 809 00:47:24.519 --> 00:47:30.800 Boy, and he knew it, and why won't you his victim? 810 00:47:32.000 --> 00:47:34.559 I got lucky, Let's be honest. They had nothing to 811 00:47:34.599 --> 00:47:36.800 do with being aware of I was a little boy 812 00:47:37.280 --> 00:47:39.679 and I was dropped off at the bus stop every 813 00:47:39.760 --> 00:47:41.719 day in the summer by father so I can go 814 00:47:41.840 --> 00:47:46.360 surf Huntington Beach, and William Bonning pulled up behind me, 815 00:47:46.880 --> 00:47:49.920 opened the door, asked me to get in. The bus 816 00:47:50.000 --> 00:47:53.639 pulled up and I walked away. Now there's people would say, well, 817 00:47:53.639 --> 00:47:57.079 how the hell do you know that? Well, several decades 818 00:47:57.159 --> 00:48:00.719 later on death Row, he and I were talking about 819 00:48:01.440 --> 00:48:05.119 the one that got away his unicorn, and he mentioned 820 00:48:05.159 --> 00:48:09.880 a little boy who had this particular surfboard, surfboard with 821 00:48:10.039 --> 00:48:13.840 a spider man on it. I was the only kid 822 00:48:14.960 --> 00:48:17.880 that had a surfboard with a spider man because I 823 00:48:18.119 --> 00:48:20.920 airbrushed it. I'm an artist. I airbrushed it on there. 824 00:48:21.360 --> 00:48:23.760 And then he said that wouldn't have made him special. 825 00:48:23.880 --> 00:48:26.760 What made him special was five years later, when I 826 00:48:26.800 --> 00:48:30.199 got out of prison, meaning the freeway killer, I saw 827 00:48:30.280 --> 00:48:33.960 him again, but now he was no longer a little boy. 828 00:48:34.760 --> 00:48:37.880 He had long hair. He was sitting at the bus stop. 829 00:48:38.519 --> 00:48:42.159 The board was different. The board was black now with 830 00:48:42.320 --> 00:48:45.119 a red spider man. And I told him, hold on 831 00:48:45.199 --> 00:48:47.480 a minute. I went to my cell and I showed 832 00:48:47.559 --> 00:48:49.800 him a picture of me, and I'll send you the pictures. 833 00:48:49.840 --> 00:48:51.360 You can see the picture of me with long hair. 834 00:48:51.960 --> 00:48:55.280 And he got super quiet and he looked at me. 835 00:48:55.360 --> 00:48:59.880 He said, you're him, You're the unicorn. And he couldn't 836 00:49:00.159 --> 00:49:02.519 not get enough of me. He wanted to talk to 837 00:49:02.599 --> 00:49:04.679 me every day. He wanted to introduce

me to the 838 00:49:04.760 --> 00:49:09.599 other serial killers, Larry Bittaker, Rodney Alcala, all of them 839 00:49:09.639 --> 00:49:14.400 were there, and he told them this guy, we're gonna 840 00:49:14.400 --> 00:49:16.239 take him. We were gonna try to, but we pulled 841 00:49:16.280 --> 00:49:21.599 him next to him his crime partner, Vermin, but clicked 842 00:49:21.639 --> 00:49:23.559 the door open. When the door clicked open, my eyes 843 00:49:23.679 --> 00:49:28.079 came up and I stood up. And William Bonnie because 844 00:49:28.119 --> 00:49:31.000 he told me later, he told his crime partner, stop, 845 00:49:32.360 --> 00:49:35.880 that's more predator than pray. He said, I know that. 846 00:49:36.079 --> 00:49:41.719 Look I've seen it in prison. The damage he will inflict. 847 00:49:42.639 --> 00:49:47.599 Close the door, Vermin, let's go, and they left. That 848 00:49:47.880 --> 00:49:51.079 actually happened. I was supposed to be his victim. I 849 00:49:51.239 --> 00:49:54.559 turned out to be something a little bit different. He 850 00:49:54.760 --> 00:49:57.719 was right, more predator than prey. 851 00:49:58.599 --> 00:50:04.119 And that says something you can teach women how not 852 00:50:04.320 --> 00:50:07.639 to be a victim. Since the following is a lot 853 00:50:07.719 --> 00:50:11.000 of true crime is in my people that follow me 854 00:50:11.119 --> 00:50:16.280 is it's almost eighty percent women, but so many people 855 00:50:16.400 --> 00:50:20.840 who have been victimized or are trying to learn about 856 00:50:20.880 --> 00:50:22.079 how not to be a victim. 857 00:50:23.199 --> 00:50:23.519 And so. 858 00:50:25.159 --> 00:50:27.159 I think we could do a whole episode. 859 00:50:26.760 --> 00:50:32.400 On that absolutely for women, and I understand taking martial 860 00:50:32.480 --> 00:50:38.320 arts how that is a helpful dynamic for confidence. Let 861 00:50:38.400 --> 00:50:40.079 me tell you from a person who is the former 862 00:50:40.159 --> 00:50:44.360 Hopkito Midway champion and who has black belt in taekwondo Hopkito, 863 00:50:44.639 --> 00:50:47.360 I've trained in muy Thai jitkan do, an American grappling. 864 00:50:48.679 --> 00:50:50.760 I cannot teach one hundred and ten or a hundred 865 00:50:50.800 --> 00:50:53.320 and twenty pounds woman how to defend herself from a 866 00:50:54.199 --> 00:50:57.679 man who wants to do them wrong or harm in 867 00:50:57.800 --> 00:51:01.840 three or four weeks. It just can't be done. So 868 00:51:01.960 --> 00:51:05.079 what I teach is awareness. I teach how to pay 869 00:51:05.159 --> 00:51:09.239 attention to that sixth sense that tells you there's something there, 870 00:51:09.679 --> 00:51:12.840 there's danger. And we do that because as humans, we 871 00:51:12.960 --> 00:51:16.079 are animals. The only difference is we have the ability 872 00:51:16.079 --> 00:51:20.039 to reason. You've seen deer at a water hole. Suddenly 873 00:51:20.079 --> 00:51:23.199 their ears prick up and they've sent something. They haven't 874 00:51:23.239 --> 00:51:25.400 seen it, they haven't heard it, but they feel it. 875 00:51:26.440 --> 00:51:29.079 That is something that can be developed, That sense can 876 00:51:29.119 --> 00:51:33.199 be developed, so women will be more aware. It's called 877 00:51:33.239 --> 00:51:35.360 the hyper state of being, and I talk about it 878 00:51:35.400 --> 00:51:40.199 in my books, being hyper vigilance. It's not a bad thing, 879 00:51:40.960 --> 00:51:42.599 you know, it saves your life. 880 00:51:43.480 --> 00:51:45.639 Yeah, I think about the women who got into Joe's 881 00:51:45.719 --> 00:51:49.880 car and some who he took for long rides into 882 00:51:49.920 --> 00:51:53.760 the woods or even just short rides to his studio. 883 00:51:53.960 --> 00:51:57.559 But I would not get into a car with anyone 884 00:51:57.719 --> 00:52:00.639 I have. Working in the psych hospital, I I heard 885 00:52:00.639 --> 00:52:02.960 a lot of stories about things that happened to women 886 00:52:03.079 --> 00:52:06.960 who were hitch hiking or getting into a car with strangers, 887 00:52:07.039 --> 00:52:09.719 and then they end up being drugged or raped or 888 00:52:09.800 --> 00:52:12.519 left on the side of the road and me hearing 889 00:52:12.559 --> 00:52:16.400 their story later. So I've heard too many stories about 890 00:52:16.480 --> 00:52:21.039 how it starts and where it ends up. Getting into 891 00:52:21.079 --> 00:52:27.519 a car with a stranger is foolish. I could never 892 00:52:27.639 --> 00:52:31.159 do it, and yeah, I don't want to be a victim. 893 00:52:31.719 --> 00:52:32.559 And you would be one. 894 00:52:33.320 --> 00:52:35.920 I'm not getting into a car with no one. I 895 00:52:36.079 --> 00:52:38.519 caught an uber. I was out of state, a crime 896 00:52:38.639 --> 00:52:44.320 con in Colorado and waiting for my ride. The license 897 00:52:44.360 --> 00:52:47.320 plate didn't match right, so I wouldn't get in the 898 00:52:47.400 --> 00:52:50.079 car and it was supposed to be my ride. I 899 00:52:50.159 --> 00:52:52.320 made him open up his glove box. He held up 900 00:52:52.320 --> 00:52:55.039 the license plate to match the app on my phone, 901 00:52:55.079 --> 00:52:58.760 the license number, and it's like, I got trust issues. Man, 902 00:52:58.800 --> 00:53:02.400 I don't even try. That's a professional app. I don't 903 00:53:02.400 --> 00:53:05.000 know if this is bone collector gonna drive me to 904 00:53:05.159 --> 00:53:08.159 a warehouse and dissect me. But I ain't getting in 905 00:53:08.159 --> 00:53:09.400 a car with anyone. 906 00:53:10.159 --> 00:53:12.639 Yeah, and you shouldn't. You know, it's better to be 907 00:53:12.880 --> 00:53:16.400 annoying for a little while than to be a statistic. 908 00:53:16.920 --> 00:53:20.239 And your family is going to have to mourn you 909 00:53:20.480 --> 00:53:24.480 and go to a gravesite because you made that decision 910

00:53:24.559 --> 00:53:27.079 to get in the car and override all your senses. 911 00:53:27.159 --> 00:53:30.639 Because as women, I know that every one of you, 912 00:53:31.440 --> 00:53:34.159 before you go into situation like that, there is that moment, 913 00:53:34.280 --> 00:53:37.079 a pause, and you override it. Oh and I'm okay, 914 00:53:37.119 --> 00:53:39.920 I'm fine, I'm woman. Hear me, roar, And they get 915 00:53:39.960 --> 00:53:42.360 in a situation, and that is what he's counting on. 916 00:53:42.840 --> 00:53:46.599 He's kind of it. You override what hundreds of thousands 917 00:53:46.599 --> 00:53:49.599 of years of evolution have taught you, and they're hoping 918 00:53:49.679 --> 00:53:53.079 you override it because you want to be the tough person. 919 00:53:53.159 --> 00:53:56.000 You're not afraid. You can do this big mistake. 920 00:53:56.920 --> 00:54:00.400 Yeah, I've heard some terrifying stories, a lot of rapes stories, 921 00:54:00.480 --> 00:54:03.360 a lot of women being drugged and raped. So I 922 00:54:03.440 --> 00:54:05.840 think you and I together can educate people how not 923 00:54:06.000 --> 00:54:10.559 to be a victim. And again't even anyone handing me 924 00:54:10.639 --> 00:54:15.119 a drink. Never or never would I leave my drink 925 00:54:15.960 --> 00:54:18.960 just to be left for a moment for someone to 926 00:54:19.599 --> 00:54:22.920 put something in my drink. I'm actually just paranoid about that. 927 00:54:23.079 --> 00:54:26.559 But I just I don't ever want to. 928 00:54:26.559 --> 00:54:27.119 Be a victim. 929 00:54:27.280 --> 00:54:30.199 That's I want to stay alive for as long. 930 00:54:30.079 --> 00:54:32.760 As I can, absolutely, and I'm going to help you 931 00:54:32.840 --> 00:54:35.840 do that because if you know, I think that the 932 00:54:35.960 --> 00:54:38.920 two of us can, we can do a lot of damage. 933 00:54:39.800 --> 00:54:45.039 And I think that this is a good platform for 934 00:54:45.199 --> 00:54:50.559 us to educate both women and men, hopefully kids as well, 935 00:54:51.239 --> 00:54:56.400 to really understand what's out there. There are monsters that 936 00:54:56.480 --> 00:55:00.559 live among us. Joseph Naseel was a monster that or 937 00:55:00.760 --> 00:55:04.639 is a monster that lived among us. Was a little 938 00:55:04.679 --> 00:55:09.960 league coach, photographer, family man, father, and yet he is 939 00:55:10.159 --> 00:55:14.280 arguably history's most prolific killer and rapist that's ever lived. 940 00:55:15.039 --> 00:55:17.800 And the reason why I have this podcast or platforms. Again, 941 00:55:17.880 --> 00:55:19.760 we talked about I don't want people to be victims, 942 00:55:19.800 --> 00:55:23.480 but I also want like as parents, just in general, 943 00:55:23.559 --> 00:55:26.920 I don't want people to be naive, but parents teaching 944 00:55:26.960 --> 00:55:31.559 your kids how these conversations, Like predators are everywhere, whether 945 00:55:31.599 --> 00:55:33.440 you want to believe it or not, and you want 946 00:55:33.480 --> 00:55:36.880 to live in your naive world, they are absolutely everywhere, 947 00:55:37.719 --> 00:55:43.159 and teach your kid role play how these conversations. I've 948 00:55:43.239 --> 00:55:47.880 definitely role played with my boys. I role play through 949 00:55:48.039 --> 00:55:52.119 every scenario so and I'm not crazy. I will role 950 00:55:52.199 --> 00:55:56.039 play the most insane scenarios, Like you know, someone shows 951 00:55:56.079 --> 00:55:57.800 up at school to pick you up and they say 952 00:55:58.559 --> 00:56:01.000 all that stuff. I roll play all the scenarios and 953 00:56:01.079 --> 00:56:03.440 I jump out of nowhere with these scenarios, and I 954 00:56:03.559 --> 00:56:08.000 make my son. He's a teenager, my other sons an adult, 955 00:56:08.079 --> 00:56:10.360 so he survived all my role playing scenarios. But like, 956 00:56:10.719 --> 00:56:12.639 I'll come out with the scenario and I want to 957 00:56:12.639 --> 00:56:14.559 see how he thinks through it and what he might 958 00:56:14.639 --> 00:56:17.840 do and what he'll say, So I understand how he's 959 00:56:17.880 --> 00:56:19.920 thinking it through and what he would do, and then 960 00:56:19.960 --> 00:56:22.880 I can feed him information. But yeah, you do have 961 00:56:23.039 --> 00:56:25.559 to have these conversations with your kids, and you should, 962 00:56:25.679 --> 00:56:28.239 and you should do it earlier. And I'm a person 963 00:56:28.280 --> 00:56:31.440 who's encountered many terrible people, and I know the things 964 00:56:31.480 --> 00:56:34.039 they tell me, and how they groom people and groom children, 965 00:56:35.039 --> 00:56:37.840 and what they look for. So I want there to 966 00:56:37.880 --> 00:56:40.519 be less victims. I want to talk to people about 967 00:56:40.559 --> 00:56:43.719 these sick conversations I have with people. I sit down 968 00:56:43.840 --> 00:56:49.800 with the pedophiles, the sexaminers, the rapists for hours an hours, 969 00:56:49.840 --> 00:56:54.039 so not decades like you. But I do want to 970 00:56:54.079 --> 00:56:56.800 take the information I have and use it for good. 971 00:56:57.679 --> 00:57:00.679 Yeah, and I one thing I would suggest, and I 972 00:57:00.840 --> 00:57:03.159 offer this up only so you know that it's not 973 00:57:04.320 --> 00:57:08.719 me saying, hey, there's monsters everywhere. So I want you, 974 00:57:09.599 --> 00:57:12.079 those who are listening to his live or later on, 975 00:57:12.960 --> 00:57:17.719 get on your laptop, your phone, look up the sex 976 00:57:17.800 --> 00:57:24.360 offender website, put your house and then look at the 977 00:57:24.440 --> 00:57:31.519 surrounding area and note how many pedophiles live in your neighborhood. 978 00:57:31.559 --> 00:57:35.119 It's gonna shock you. It's gonna shock you, and you'll 979 00:57:35.199 --> 00:57:39.199 know that what I'm

telling you is absolutely accurate. There 980 00:57:39.239 --> 00:57:42.920 are monsters living among us. You have to know where 981 00:57:42.920 --> 00:57:46.559 they're at. Search them, find out where they are, get 982 00:57:46.599 --> 00:57:49.519 their picture, show at your children. Say this is the 983 00:57:49.639 --> 00:57:52.119 guy who's out there hunting you. But he could look 984 00:57:52.199 --> 00:57:54.880 like anybody. It can look like me. It could look 985 00:57:55.000 --> 00:57:57.599 like the lady down the street, because ladies are also 986 00:57:57.679 --> 00:58:02.840 sex offenders. Teach them that. Teach them good common sense 987 00:58:03.679 --> 00:58:07.280 alternatives to getting in a car. And if nothing else, 988 00:58:08.280 --> 00:58:12.079 call me. You know you're a parent, Make sure your 989 00:58:12.239 --> 00:58:18.039 child knows that. Does it matter? Call me. I'm never 990 00:58:18.119 --> 00:58:20.559 gonna be mad when you call me. That is so 991 00:58:20.719 --> 00:58:25.000 important because that's when that monster tells them, Hey, your 992 00:58:25.079 --> 00:58:28.199 dad said to come with them, and you're afraid to 993 00:58:28.280 --> 00:58:32.480 call your dad because he might get mad. Well, you're 994 00:58:32.480 --> 00:58:35.599 gonna be more upset when your kid disappears. You know 995 00:58:35.840 --> 00:58:39.320 I would tell my children call me at anything. I 996 00:58:39.400 --> 00:58:42.440 don't care if you feel uncomfortable getting your own car 997 00:58:43.000 --> 00:58:45.679 or your friend's car because he's drank a beer, whatever 998 00:58:45.760 --> 00:58:49.199 it is, call me. Never gonna be mad because of that. 999 00:58:49.760 --> 00:58:53.760 I will stop whatever I'm doing. For my child. Simple 1000 00:58:53.800 --> 00:58:57.000 as that if your children know that, the chances of 1001 00:58:57.079 --> 00:59:01.639 them getting in a car with some monster will lesson significantly. 1002 00:59:02.679 --> 00:59:05.639 Yeah, I'm watch out for those female sex ofvendors will 1003 00:59:05.679 --> 00:59:08.320 shank you, steal your kid and drive away in your car. 1004 00:59:09.000 --> 00:59:12.400 And just because someone is a female, they'd be there 1005 00:59:12.480 --> 00:59:15.239 to take your kid and bring your child to another location. 1006 00:59:16.079 --> 00:59:19.079 It's the mass that people wear. And I think as 1007 00:59:19.159 --> 00:59:21.679 we kind of conclude this podcast for today because we 1008 00:59:21.840 --> 00:59:24.400 talk forever, but it's like the mask that Joe Nasa 1009 00:59:24.519 --> 00:59:29.400 wears and what lies beneath. You know, he had press, 1010 00:59:30.199 --> 00:59:33.559 a fake press pass, you know, he calls, played as 1011 00:59:33.599 --> 00:59:37.679 a photographer and other things. And he had a wife, 1012 00:59:37.760 --> 00:59:39.679 he had children, which I'd love to talk about where 1013 00:59:39.719 --> 00:59:42.000 his kids are at now and I would love to 1014 00:59:42.079 --> 00:59:44.719 interview them. I just feel like there's so much information 1015 00:59:44.880 --> 00:59:48.840 I would love to further on Earth about him. But 1016 00:59:48.920 --> 00:59:52.000 I also want to say, guess what. And I know 1017 00:59:52.119 --> 00:59:54.320 we talked today, there's so many other books that you 1018 00:59:54.440 --> 00:59:57.079 have written, or ones that you have in the process. 1019 00:59:59.079 --> 01:00:01.880 You bought the other grat fantastic, you got the second one, 1020 01:00:02.039 --> 01:00:04.480 well the first one, actually, No, I got greedy. 1021 01:00:04.920 --> 01:00:07.679 Never wrong with that yeah, well I'm greedy and so 1022 01:00:08.199 --> 01:00:11.719 I ordered on Amazon. It just came like last night. 1023 01:00:11.880 --> 01:00:15.239 So anyways, but I got I got a lot of 1024 01:00:15.280 --> 01:00:20.199 homework to do, but Escape artist so many ideas that 1025 01:00:20.400 --> 01:00:23.800 together we could I just have so much, so much excitement, 1026 01:00:24.039 --> 01:00:27.360 how we could partner together for good. 1027 01:00:28.159 --> 01:00:30.000 No, I agree, So we have to come back. 1028 01:00:30.119 --> 01:00:33.880 You have to come back. And I wish we could 1029 01:00:33.920 --> 01:00:36.679 do this in person. I know we're in California. I'm 1030 01:00:36.719 --> 01:00:39.320 in northern California, you're in southern California. It would be 1031 01:00:39.440 --> 01:00:42.320 nicer to come to a podcast studio, and if you 1032 01:00:42.400 --> 01:00:45.119 ever want to, I got a podcast studio up the 1033 01:00:45.199 --> 01:00:48.039 road where you could get together and have it, you know, 1034 01:00:48.440 --> 01:00:51.119 in persons session. But for now, it's like we're doing 1035 01:00:51.159 --> 01:00:54.679 what we can. You know, we're remote, we're getting together, 1036 01:00:54.840 --> 01:00:57.920 we're recording episodes. We're just putting ourselves out there. We 1037 01:00:58.039 --> 01:01:01.280 want people to connect with us on social media and 1038 01:01:04.000 --> 01:01:09.960 and like ask questions about what we do and you know, 1039 01:01:10.199 --> 01:01:13.440 all answer questions. And when we do more live stuff, 1040 01:01:13.519 --> 01:01:17.280 we can you know, ask William questions anything you want. 1041 01:01:17.360 --> 01:01:20.000 I think, as he said, he is an open book. 1042 01:01:20.519 --> 01:01:23.639 I would ask that you guys can subscribe to my 1043 01:01:23.960 --> 01:01:28.599 it's nice subscript. Just follow me on Instagram. Dead Body 1044 01:01:28.679 --> 01:01:33.880 Society TikTok is also dead body Society YouTube dead Body Society. 1045 01:01:34.280 --> 01:01:35.880 And then I also have a newsletter. If you go 1046 01:01:35.920 --> 01:01:39.519 to my my Instagram account you can It's a free newsletter. 1047 01:01:39.559 --> 01:01:42.760 It gives you insights called the True Crime Insider. Sign 1048 01:01:42.840 --> 01:01:45.719 up for it's free, appreciate it, and I'll be here 1049 01:01:45.760 --> 01:01:51.400 with Dana doctor Anderson the Killer Psychologist. I'll be here 1050 01:01:51.480 --> 01:01:53.880 next Saturday as well to take any questions you guys have. 1051 01:01:54.760 --> 01:01:57.800 Ask questions. It's my father's always say it, and he 1052 01:01:57.880 --> 01:02:01.159 said it's better to be done for five minutes than 1053 01:02:01.400 --> 01:02:03.840 done for the rest of your life. Ask the questions. 1054 01:02:04.280 --> 01:02:07.239 No question is too dumb. If you're asking the question 1055 01:02:07.400 --> 01:02:09.599 because it's important to you. If it's important to you, 1056 01:02:10.239 --> 01:02:13.039 it's important to Dana and I, so ask the questions. 1057 01:02:13.599 --> 01:02:16.000 Thank you so much. It's been a real tree and 1058 01:02:16.199 --> 01:02:17.599 I can't wait to talk again. 1059 01:02:18.039 --> 01:02:19.360 Same here. Thank you so much. 1060 01:02:23.079 --> 01:02:26.519 Thank you for listening to Killer Psychologist. To watch full 1061 01:02:26.760 --> 01:02:29.599 video episodes or if you want to interact with me, 1062 01:02:29.880 --> 01:02:34.119 you can find Killer Psychologists on YouTube. You can also 1063 01:02:34.199 --> 01:02:37.280 get notified of new episodes by signing up in my 1064 01:02:37.480 --> 01:02:40.679 stand store now. If you want to work with me, 1065 01:02:41.079 --> 01:02:45.920 you can book a console. My website is psychologydoctor dot com. 1066 01:02:46.840 --> 01:03:07.880 That's psychologydr dot comsh