Volledige transcriptie van Question & Answer #174: from Buddhist Sanskrit to Democracy in the Sangha

00:04:28.320 --> 00:04:30.710 um, poly had reached kind of its final 00:04:30.720 --> 00:04:32.469 stages or almost its final stages 00:04:32.479 --> 00:04:35.749 because even like commentarial poly uh 00:04:35.759 --> 00:04:39.670 has noticeable differences from like 00:04:39.680 --> 00:04:43.830 suta poly and like the the atawaga of 00:04:43.840 --> 00:04:47.189 the sutini pata is is like an even more 00:04:47.199 --> 00:04:51.670 archaic form of poly with more like 00:04:51.680 --> 00:04:53.110 vadic sans. 00:04:53.120 --> 00:04:55.510 elements to it, different declenions, 00:04:55.520 --> 00:04:59.430 that kind of thing, different suffixes. 00:04:59.440 --> 00:05:01.270 So, 00:05:01.280 --> 00:05:04.790 um it was just the like the tradition in 00:05:04.800 --> 00:05:09.590 ancient India that like scriptures 00:05:09.600 --> 00:05:12.629 would be composed in Sanskrit. 00:05:12.639 --> 00:05:15.029 So, you have a lot of Brahmans, you 00:05:15.039 --> 00:05:17.430 know, Vadic Brahmanist say, "Stop 00:05:17.440 --> 00:05:20.629 scratching the couch. quit it 00:05:20.639 --> 00:05:24.070 dog trying to dig a hole in the couch. 00:05:24.080 --> 00:05:27.270 Um you had brahinss like like vadic 00:05:27.280 --> 00:05:29.350 brahmans converting to Buddhism and so 00:05:29.360 --> 00:05:32.390 they naturally are kind of wanting to 00:05:32.400 --> 00:05:34.550 have the scriptures of their new 00:05:34.560 --> 00:05:37.029 religion composed in the scriptural 00:05:37.039 --> 00:05:40.390 language of Sanskrit and so it wound up 00:05:40.400 --> 00:05:42.230 with most of the early schools of 00:05:42.240 --> 00:05:45.670 Buddhism adopting some form of Sanskrit. 00:05:45.680 --> 00:05:48.469 Terravada is one of the few that even 00:05:48.479 --> 00:05:51.430 though it didn't like like really 00:05:51.440 --> 00:05:53.590 strictly adhere to the original language 00:05:53.600 --> 00:05:55.270 spoken by the Buddha. Although most 00:05:55.280 --> 00:05:58.469 Terravvada Buddhists believe it did, 00:05:58.479 --> 00:06:01.670 still it's much closer to the original 00:06:01.680 --> 00:06:04.550 language spoken by the Buddha than 00:06:04.560 --> 00:06:06.710 Sanskrit is. 00:06:06.720 --> 00:06:09.830 Classical Sanskrit also was never really 00:06:09.840 --> 00:06:13.350 a vernacular language spoken by village 00:06:13.360 --> 00:06:17.110 normies, village lay people. 00:06:17.120 --> 00:06:19.430 So when did the dharma transition from 00:06:19.440 --> 00:06:22.950 poly to Sanskrit? uh probably within 00:06:22.960 --> 00:06:25.749 like the first hundred years after the 00:06:25.759 --> 00:06:27.670 Buddhist parbana, after the first 00:06:27.680 --> 00:06:33.670 council that um there would be um most 00:06:33.680 --> 00:06:36.870 schools of Buddhism would become more 00:06:36.880 --> 00:06:38.469 their their texts would become more and 00:06:38.479 --> 00:06:42.390 more Sanskritized over time. Um or there 00:06:42.400 --> 00:06:45.670 probably a few others besides

Terravada 00:06:45.680 --> 00:06:49.110 that sort of tried to stay with the 00:06:49.120 --> 00:06:53.430 original Procrit language but still like 00:06:53.440 --> 00:06:56.150 evolved in subtle ways over time. Like 00:06:56.160 --> 00:06:58.390 the Jane texts also are not in Sanskrit 00:06:58.400 --> 00:07:02.950 but it's a a procrit similar to poly but 00:07:02.960 --> 00:07:04.870 Janism isn't Buddhism so we can just 00:07:04.880 --> 00:07:07.670 leave the Janes alone I suppose. 00:07:07.680 --> 00:07:09.430 And uh I guess I'm just going to move 00:07:09.440 --> 00:07:11.749 on. Next question. This is from Romeo. 00:07:11.759 --> 00:07:14.550 And Romeo says, "How does Buddhism make 00:07:14.560 --> 00:07:17.350 sense of supernatural phenomena in the 00:07:17.360 --> 00:07:20.070 context of other religions such as 00:07:20.080 --> 00:07:22.790 speaking in tongues, demonic possession, 00:07:22.800 --> 00:07:26.150 exorcisms, etc. What is your personal 00:07:26.160 --> 00:07:28.390 take on such phenomena?" Well, this kind 00:07:28.400 --> 00:07:31.290 of stuff was known to early 00:07:31.300 --> 00:07:32.870 [clears throat] Buddhism and like 00:07:32.880 --> 00:07:36.230 traditional Burmese Buddhism even today. 00:07:36.240 --> 00:07:37.909 Maybe not so much the speaking in 00:07:37.919 --> 00:07:40.629 tongues, but demonic possession and 00:07:40.639 --> 00:07:43.670 exorcisms are well known in Buddhist 00:07:43.680 --> 00:07:47.270 Burma. And to some degree, I'm sure they 00:07:47.280 --> 00:07:49.430 were known in ancient India. For 00:07:49.440 --> 00:07:51.909 example, what what immediately comes to 00:07:51.919 --> 00:07:55.589 mind when I when I read this question 00:07:55.599 --> 00:07:59.510 is um in the Degan Kaya, the the Sila, 00:07:59.520 --> 00:08:01.430 which is the first group of sutas in the 00:08:01.440 --> 00:08:03.830 Dean Kaya, there's a list of things that 00:08:03.840 --> 00:08:05.909 monks aren't supposed to do. It's not 00:08:05.919 --> 00:08:08.150 really vineia rules. It's just sort of 00:08:08.160 --> 00:08:09.670 like 00:08:09.680 --> 00:08:12.070 additional to vignia, you know, it's to 00:08:12.080 --> 00:08:14.230 the side of winia. It's just in the 00:08:14.240 --> 00:08:16.070 sutas this list of things that good 00:08:16.080 --> 00:08:17.909 monks shouldn't do. And one of them is 00:08:17.919 --> 00:08:21.510 questioning a girl in trance. So, I 00:08:21.520 --> 00:08:23.430 mean, she'd be like a spirit medium. So, 00:08:23.440 --> 00:08:25.350 spirit mediums were known in the 00:08:25.360 --> 00:08:27.749 Buddhist or or channelers 00:08:27.759 --> 00:08:30.895 as they became known later um were 00:08:30.905 --> 00:08:32.149 [clears throat] known in ancient India. 00:08:32.159 --> 00:08:35.350 So there would be at least a davas 00:08:35.360 --> 00:08:39.029 talking through through usually female 00:08:39.039 --> 00:08:43.029 spirit mediums um and probably like 00:08:43.039 --> 00:08:44.949 ghosts or pas. I mean when they're 00:08:44.959 --> 00:08:46.710 talking just kind of nonsense or 00:08:46.720 --> 00:08:49.269 gibberish which could be like a kind of 00:08:49.279 --> 00:08:51.829 speaking in tongues. I mean when I was a 00:08:51.839 --> 00:08:55.350 kid my father used to conduct seances 00:08:55.360 --> 00:08:57.910 even before I was born. He was into the 00:08:57.920 --> 00:09:02.389 occult and there was this one tape. It 00:09:02.399 --> 00:09:04.389 was like a realtoreal, like ancient 00:09:04.399 --> 00:09:07.590 realtore tape that had a recorded 00:09:07.600 --> 00:09:09.430 seance. 00:09:09.440 --> 00:09:11.269 And I'd listened to it a few times when 00:09:11.279 --> 00:09:12.630 I was a kid, but it was kind of creepy, 00:09:12.640 --> 00:09:14.150 kind of scary for a little kid to listen 00:09:14.160 --> 00:09:16.710 to this stuff. And the first spirit that 00:09:16.720 --> 00:09:18.230 came through was speaking apparently in 00:09:18.240 --> 00:09:19.750 a foreign language. It sounded like some 00:09:19.760 --> 00:09:21.350 kind of Native American [clears throat] 00:09:21.360 --> 00:09:25.829 language. And it took the the the humans 00:09:25.839 --> 00:09:28.870 conducting the seance some effort and 00:09:28.880 --> 00:09:33.776 time to get this, you know, deceased uh 00:09:33.786 --> 00:09:35.190 [clears throat] American Indian, you 00:09:35.200 --> 00:09:37.509 know, Native American, you know, out of 00:09:37.519 --> 00:09:39.190 the the medium so they could find 00:09:39.200 --> 00:09:42.150 someone who spoke English. 00:09:42.160 --> 00:09:43.829 Although, it could all just been some 00:09:43.839 --> 00:09:45.269 kind of gibberish. I mean, nobody 00:09:45.279 --> 00:09:47.030 understood the language. It just sounded 00:09:47.040 --> 00:09:50.230 kind of like a Native American language. 00:09:50.240 --> 00:09:53.590 So, I assume that sort of thing has been 00:09:53.600 --> 00:09:57.190 happening ever since 00:09:57.200 --> 00:09:59.269 psychics started going into trance and 00:09:59.279 --> 00:10:01.430 would would include like stone age witch 00:10:01.440 --> 00:10:04.070 doctors, that kind of thing. 00:10:04.080 --> 00:10:06.949 And so Buddhism would 00:10:06.959 --> 00:10:09.509 I mean I don't know what the official 00:10:09.519 --> 00:10:12.710 scriptural explanation of how it works 00:10:12.720 --> 00:10:17.030 would be but presumably spirits can 00:10:17.040 --> 00:10:20.790 communicate through like a human medium. 00:10:20.800 --> 00:10:22.069 That's I guess that's why they're called 00:10:22.079 --> 00:10:24.870 mediums or yeah it'd be mediums and not 00:10:24.880 --> 00:10:26.832 media. 00:10:26.842 --> 00:10:28.389 [snorts] 00:10:28.399 --> 00:10:30.790 But I I can't remember like if Abid 00:10:30.800 --> 00:10:32.630 Dhama or the commentarial tradition 00:10:32.640 --> 00:10:35.590 really tries to give some nuts and bolts 00:10:35.600 --> 00:10:38.949 explanation of exactly how it works. 00:10:38.959 --> 00:10:42.310 Um but

exorcisms I mean that happens a 00:10:42.320 --> 00:10:46.230 lot in like modernday Buddhist Burma. 00:10:46.240 --> 00:10:48.150 Usually monks sometimes there'd be an 00:10:48.160 --> 00:10:50.790 Apollia who does it. Apolland is like a 00:10:50.800 --> 00:10:53.910 white wizard. You know Apolland is the 00:10:53.920 --> 00:10:56.230 upper path. You know, outland is the 00:10:56.240 --> 00:10:58.710 lower path and that's like black magic, 00:10:58.720 --> 00:11:01.670 but [snorts] Apolland is the upper path 00:11:01.680 --> 00:11:03.990 which is usually using like Buddhist 00:11:04.000 --> 00:11:06.710 scripture and you know in the name of 00:11:06.720 --> 00:11:11.110 Buddha I cast you out kind of stuff. 00:11:11.120 --> 00:11:13.992 So that still happens and uh 00:11:14.002 --> 00:11:14.550 [clears throat] 00:11:14.560 --> 00:11:17.350 in in Burma Buddhist terravada Buddhist 00:11:17.360 --> 00:11:20.630 Burma even today people can just get 00:11:20.640 --> 00:11:22.389 possessed 00:11:22.399 --> 00:11:24.470 um like there's one traditional form of 00:11:24.480 --> 00:11:27.910 possession called the nakad or the the 00:11:27.920 --> 00:11:31.990 wife of a deva which is usually a woman 00:11:32.000 --> 00:11:35.750 sometimes a homosexual male who u 00:11:35.760 --> 00:11:38.389 apparently they get possessed and will 00:11:38.399 --> 00:11:40.870 just like dance orgastically and 00:11:40.880 --> 00:11:44.470 prophesy usually at festivals. 00:11:44.480 --> 00:11:47.590 So, I mean, it does exist, although I 00:11:47.600 --> 00:11:49.509 don't know if anywhere in the text 00:11:49.519 --> 00:11:52.470 anyone actually sits down and tries to 00:11:52.480 --> 00:11:56.150 explain the exact mechanics of how some 00:11:56.160 --> 00:11:59.430 other spirit can possess or communicate 00:11:59.440 --> 00:12:03.829 through a human being um in trance or 00:12:03.839 --> 00:12:05.509 one who is just has like these 00:12:05.519 --> 00:12:07.670 vulnerabilities that allow themselves to 00:12:07.680 --> 00:12:10.629 get possessed. 00:12:10.639 --> 00:12:12.710 So let's see what is my personal take on 00:12:12.720 --> 00:12:14.550 such phenomena. 00:12:14.560 --> 00:12:16.470 I think a lot of speaking in tonesues is 00:12:16.480 --> 00:12:18.838 just babbling. 00:12:18.848 --> 00:12:19.509 [clears throat] 00:12:19.519 --> 00:12:21.750 Probably not all speaking in tongues. My 00:12:21.760 --> 00:12:25.670 father had this notorious second wife, 00:12:25.680 --> 00:12:28.069 not my mother, who would go into trance 00:12:28.079 --> 00:12:30.310 and do automatic writing where according 00:12:30.320 --> 00:12:32.310 to my father, this is before my time, 00:12:32.320 --> 00:12:34.069 but according to my father, she would be 00:12:34.079 --> 00:12:35.670 writing stuff that they couldn't 00:12:35.680 --> 00:12:37.990 understand. they'd show it to some 00:12:38.000 --> 00:12:39.750 college professor or something and say 00:12:39.760 --> 00:12:42.230 and he'd say that's addict Greek or you 00:12:42.240 --> 00:12:44.550 know that's Mandarin Chinese or 00:12:44.560 --> 00:12:47.350 whatever. So 00:12:47.360 --> 00:12:50.389 um I mean it can happen. Anything is 00:12:50.399 --> 00:12:52.069 possible really. I mean anything that 00:12:52.079 --> 00:12:55.829 you can imagine is possible. 00:12:55.839 --> 00:12:57.829 So 00:12:57.839 --> 00:13:00.230 my personal take on speaking in tongues 00:13:00.240 --> 00:13:02.710 and possession and so forth. I mean 00:13:02.720 --> 00:13:05.430 ultimately it's we are creating it with 00:13:05.440 --> 00:13:08.949 our own mind and so even demonic 00:13:08.959 --> 00:13:11.430 possession I mean you can say that 00:13:11.440 --> 00:13:13.829 there's another being possessing an 00:13:13.839 --> 00:13:15.350 individual. Although from the Buddhist 00:13:15.360 --> 00:13:18.069 point of view individuals are it's just 00:13:18.079 --> 00:13:19.990 like 00:13:20.000 --> 00:13:22.230 delusional. I mean there are no 00:13:22.240 --> 00:13:26.389 ultimately real individual beings. 00:13:26.399 --> 00:13:29.590 So the exorcisms 00:13:29.600 --> 00:13:31.829 it's mainly just like the the the 00:13:31.839 --> 00:13:34.069 subconscious belief system of the person 00:13:34.079 --> 00:13:37.990 who is possessed who has enough faith in 00:13:38.000 --> 00:13:41.350 the exorcist that the the exorcist 00:13:41.360 --> 00:13:44.870 really is able to drive out whatever. I 00:13:44.880 --> 00:13:46.790 mean it could be hysterical dissociation 00:13:46.800 --> 00:13:49.110 or a genuine 00:13:49.120 --> 00:13:52.870 demonic entity or a combination of of 00:13:52.880 --> 00:13:56.949 both that it's like the the subconscious 00:13:56.959 --> 00:13:59.110 belief system of the person who is 00:13:59.120 --> 00:14:01.910 possessed is is I mean that's one of the 00:14:01.920 --> 00:14:03.509 main things that allows them to be 00:14:03.519 --> 00:14:06.550 healed. And I mean faith healers, it's 00:14:06.560 --> 00:14:08.629 kind of a similar thing except it's more 00:14:08.639 --> 00:14:10.870 of a more a more physical kind of 00:14:10.880 --> 00:14:12.550 ailment instead of a more mental kind of 00:14:12.560 --> 00:14:16.150 ailment where a faith healer is like the 00:14:16.160 --> 00:14:18.389 the faith of the person who's being 00:14:18.399 --> 00:14:21.910 healed is sufficient that they get 00:14:21.920 --> 00:14:24.230 better. I mean even in the New Testament 00:14:24.240 --> 00:14:28.629 when Jesus would heal somebody and they 00:14:28.639 --> 00:14:30.710 would thank him, Jesus sometimes would 00:14:30.720 --> 00:14:32.470 say, "It's your own faith that healed 00:14:32.480 --> 00:14:35.189 you. 00:14:35.199 --> 00:14:38.949 So I mean anything is possible, anything 00:14:38.959 --> 00:14:43.189 that you can imagine anyway. And so 00:14:43.199 --> 00:14:45.350 like speaking in tongues, I mean to 00:14:45.360 --> 00:14:49.350 speak real languages in when you're in a 00:14:49.360 --> 00:14:51.189 trance or

possessed or something, that's 00:14:51.199 --> 00:14:53.350 possible. Also, of course, just babbling 00:14:53.360 --> 00:14:56.310 in gibberish is quite possible. 00:14:56.320 --> 00:14:59.030 And demonic possession, I mean, that's 00:14:59.040 --> 00:15:01.430 possible. also a kind of pseudmonic 00:15:01.440 --> 00:15:02.949 possession where you just have like this 00:15:02.959 --> 00:15:05.990 hysterical dissociation going on. That's 00:15:06.000 --> 00:15:10.870 possible. Exorcisms. Um I remember I 00:15:10.880 --> 00:15:13.750 mean I've discussed this before where I 00:15:13.760 --> 00:15:17.750 got one it was it was during the thin 00:15:17.760 --> 00:15:20.069 jen festival in Burma. I was living on a 00:15:20.079 --> 00:15:23.189 big flat rock under a kind of tropical 00:15:23.199 --> 00:15:26.389 chestnut tree which was to so twisty and 00:15:26.399 --> 00:15:27.910 hollow that the wood cutters didn't want 00:15:27.920 --> 00:15:29.670 to cut it down. it was useless for for 00:15:29.680 --> 00:15:31.590 lumber. 00:15:31.600 --> 00:15:35.269 And um I just kind of I was woke up in 00:15:35.279 --> 00:15:37.430 the morning. I'm got myself propped up 00:15:37.440 --> 00:15:40.230 like this on my side to to look at the 00:15:40.240 --> 00:15:41.829 horizon to see if it was dawn yet 00:15:41.839 --> 00:15:43.350 because I didn't even have a clock or a 00:15:43.360 --> 00:15:45.670 watch at the time. And I just froze that 00:15:45.680 --> 00:15:49.350 way and like started hearing things. And 00:15:49.360 --> 00:15:51.670 um I'm thinking I mean should I be 00:15:51.680 --> 00:15:53.269 scared? And then it's like being scared 00:15:53.279 --> 00:15:54.949 isn't going to help anything. So then I 00:15:54.959 --> 00:15:57.430 thought well I'll just recite 00:15:57.440 --> 00:16:01.430 Bagawat Arhat Sam Buddhasa um and in the 00:16:01.440 --> 00:16:04.069 hopes that if anything is like 00:16:04.079 --> 00:16:06.710 possessing me that it's it's a devout 00:16:06.720 --> 00:16:08.550 Buddhist being in Burma and that'll 00:16:08.560 --> 00:16:10.790 drive it out and for whatever reason it 00:16:10.800 --> 00:16:12.550 worked. You know I just started Namotasa 00:16:12.560 --> 00:16:15.269 Bhagawat Samasan Buddhasa and it was 00:16:15.279 --> 00:16:17.261 just it was like the spell was broken. 00:16:17.271 --> 00:16:19.509 [clears throat] 00:16:19.519 --> 00:16:21.590 What the exact mechanism of the spell 00:16:21.600 --> 00:16:23.269 being broken was I don't know. could 00:16:23.279 --> 00:16:25.910 just be my own subconscious belief that 00:16:25.920 --> 00:16:29.189 it could work and it did. 00:16:29.199 --> 00:16:31.829 Um, I think that is more likely than any 00:16:31.839 --> 00:16:33.910 beings actually possessing me at the 00:16:33.920 --> 00:16:35.670 time. It was just sort of like a waking 00:16:35.680 --> 00:16:39.269 dream. Sort of like Ivan Karamazov's 00:16:39.279 --> 00:16:41.990 feverish dream of the devil in in the 00:16:42.000 --> 00:16:44.310 the brothers Karamazov that kind of 00:16:44.320 --> 00:16:46.470 thing. 00:16:46.480 --> 00:16:48.310 So, [gasps] 00:16:48.320 --> 00:16:51.670 let's see. Have I answered the question 00:16:51.680 --> 00:16:53.590 supernatural phen how does Buddhism make 00:16:53.600 --> 00:16:56.629 sense of supernatural phenomena in the 00:16:56.639 --> 00:16:59.509 context of other religions 00:16:59.519 --> 00:17:00.949 such as speaking in tongues demonic 00:17:00.959 --> 00:17:03.269 position well I think I mean if Buddhism 00:17:03.279 --> 00:17:06.470 is going to explain that in Christians 00:17:06.480 --> 00:17:08.150 they'd use the same explanation as how 00:17:08.160 --> 00:17:10.150 it works in any people including 00:17:10.160 --> 00:17:12.470 Buddhist people 00:17:12.480 --> 00:17:14.630 so I guess I already answered that part 00:17:14.640 --> 00:17:16.309 and what is my personal take on such 00:17:16.319 --> 00:17:19.029 phenomena it's all mindmade 00:17:19.039 --> 00:17:23.510 It's like a It's like a dream 00:17:23.520 --> 00:17:25.909 that seems pretty damn real to almost 00:17:25.919 --> 00:17:28.230 everybody. I'm just going to move on to 00:17:28.240 --> 00:17:30.630 this question though. This is from Fred 00:17:30.640 --> 00:17:33.750 and Fred says, "Is emancipation a better 00:17:33.760 --> 00:17:35.990 word than enlightenment?" 00:17:36.000 --> 00:17:38.470 And I mean both words are found in poly. 00:17:38.480 --> 00:17:40.870 you know, emancipation or liberation 00:17:40.880 --> 00:17:45.110 would be like mocha or pamoka 00:17:45.120 --> 00:17:48.230 uh we moa you know any anything based on 00:17:48.240 --> 00:17:51.990 mocha m o k k h a if my spelling is 00:17:52.000 --> 00:17:55.350 correct that means like liberation. 00:17:55.360 --> 00:17:56.950 Uh enlightenment on the other hand would 00:17:56.960 --> 00:18:00.630 be like bodhi or um you know even like 00:18:00.640 --> 00:18:03.430 nibbana could could be translated as 00:18:03.440 --> 00:18:06.150 enlightenment I suppose. Um, is 00:18:06.160 --> 00:18:07.430 emancipation a better word than 00:18:07.440 --> 00:18:08.870 enlightenment though? I mean, it depends 00:18:08.880 --> 00:18:10.950 on the context. If you want to emphasize 00:18:10.960 --> 00:18:13.270 the liberation from samsara, the 00:18:13.280 --> 00:18:15.430 liberation from attachments and dooka 00:18:15.440 --> 00:18:18.390 and delusion and all that, then I mean 00:18:18.400 --> 00:18:22.150 maybe the context would favor like 00:18:22.160 --> 00:18:24.870 liberation to enlightenment. On the 00:18:24.880 --> 00:18:26.952 other hand, I mean, if if you're like 00:18:26.962 --> 00:18:28.150 [clears throat] it's like the end of 00:18:28.160 --> 00:18:31.190 suffering, you might want to use, you 00:18:31.200 --> 00:18:33.830 know, mocha. 00:18:33.840 --> 00:18:35.590 Um, but if it's the liberation from 00:18:35.600 --> 00:18:37.110 delusion, you know, it's the end of 00:18:37.120 --> 00:18:38.390 delusion, you

might want to use 00:18:38.400 --> 00:18:39.830 something more like enlightenment. So, 00:18:39.840 --> 00:18:42.310 it depends on like what your emphasis 00:18:42.320 --> 00:18:44.150 is. 00:18:44.160 --> 00:18:46.230 And I I mentioned before, I mean, 00:18:46.240 --> 00:18:49.510 there's only one dharma, I suppose, but 00:18:49.520 --> 00:18:51.350 you can have different emphases. You 00:18:51.360 --> 00:18:53.669 know, the the head oriented person wants 00:18:53.679 --> 00:18:56.549 an end to delusion, whereas the heart 00:18:56.559 --> 00:18:58.470 oriented person wants an end to 00:18:58.480 --> 00:19:00.870 suffering. But it's the same this the 00:19:00.880 --> 00:19:02.870 end of suffering is the end of delusion 00:19:02.880 --> 00:19:04.630 because the suffering is based on 00:19:04.640 --> 00:19:09.029 delusion. The two go hand in hand. 00:19:09.039 --> 00:19:11.669 So really emancipation and enlightenment 00:19:11.679 --> 00:19:14.549 are pretty much equal I guess. Uh 00:19:14.559 --> 00:19:17.590 liberation and and enlightenment 00:19:17.600 --> 00:19:22.230 we moa and bodhi or what would you call 00:19:22.240 --> 00:19:23.909 I mean there's other ways you could say 00:19:23.919 --> 00:19:26.549 enlightenment I suppose. 00:19:26.559 --> 00:19:29.510 Um, so I mean it's just a matter of 00:19:29.520 --> 00:19:31.909 personal preference and what the actual 00:19:31.919 --> 00:19:33.909 context is, what you're emphasizing when 00:19:33.919 --> 00:19:36.310 you talk about somebody being 00:19:36.320 --> 00:19:38.870 enlightened or liberated from suffering 00:19:38.880 --> 00:19:40.870 and delusion. 00:19:40.880 --> 00:19:42.310 And I'm just going to move on to Fred's 00:19:42.320 --> 00:19:44.789 next question. Was the Buddha a 00:19:44.799 --> 00:19:47.029 cognitive scientist? Well, he was 00:19:47.039 --> 00:19:49.510 definitely empirical, 00:19:49.520 --> 00:19:52.150 but cognitive scientists would involve 00:19:52.160 --> 00:19:54.070 scientific method, I suppose. And I 00:19:54.080 --> 00:19:55.750 don't think scientific method had really 00:19:55.760 --> 00:19:58.230 been invented yet where first you form a 00:19:58.240 --> 00:20:00.549 hypothesis and then you test the 00:20:00.559 --> 00:20:03.510 hypothesis with like you know like 00:20:03.520 --> 00:20:07.110 controlled experimentation and like u 00:20:07.120 --> 00:20:09.270 yeah you'd have to have like controls 00:20:09.280 --> 00:20:11.510 and so forth and if you're not into 00:20:11.520 --> 00:20:13.750 science it doesn't matter what exactly 00:20:13.760 --> 00:20:15.669 what a control is but you want to limit 00:20:15.679 --> 00:20:17.590 the variables because you're testing for 00:20:17.600 --> 00:20:20.470 just one thing and I don't think the 00:20:20.480 --> 00:20:23.270 Buddha really did that in a systematic 00:20:23.280 --> 00:20:25.029 way. I mean, just a certain amount of 00:20:25.039 --> 00:20:27.350 common sense and intelligence may have 00:20:27.360 --> 00:20:30.549

had him as a kind of protoscientist, 00:20:30.559 --> 00:20:32.390 you know, he is definitely empirical, 00:20:32.400 --> 00:20:34.710 you know, based on like his own 00:20:34.720 --> 00:20:36.789 experiences and what works and what 00:20:36.799 --> 00:20:39.669 doesn't work. So, that's empirical, I 00:20:39.679 --> 00:20:42.470 suppose. But cognitive science, which 00:20:42.480 --> 00:20:45.029 was invented like in the 1970s or 00:20:45.039 --> 00:20:48.230 something like that, um, yeah, that's I 00:20:48.240 --> 00:20:51.029 wouldn't say it's exactly the same 00:20:51.039 --> 00:20:54.310 that calling someone a scientist. 00:20:54.320 --> 00:20:56.310 Um, I mean, you can use the word loosely 00:20:56.320 --> 00:20:58.230 in that they're just like an empiricist 00:20:58.240 --> 00:21:01.909 who really wants to know reality, but 00:21:01.919 --> 00:21:03.669 really a scientist is someone who 00:21:03.679 --> 00:21:06.630 follows scientific method, which wasn't 00:21:06.640 --> 00:21:09.350 really formally invented until Bacon 00:21:09.360 --> 00:21:11.350 came up with it, you know, just a few 00:21:11.360 --> 00:21:14.070 hundred years ago. 00:21:14.080 --> 00:21:16.070 And cognitive science came later than 00:21:16.080 --> 00:21:17.430 that. [clears throat] 00:21:17.440 --> 00:21:19.190 First, the the earliest science was 00:21:19.200 --> 00:21:24.710 mainly like physics and some chemistry. 00:21:24.720 --> 00:21:27.510 Um, so yeah, I'd say technically 00:21:27.520 --> 00:21:29.590 speaking the Buddha was not a cognitive 00:21:29.600 --> 00:21:32.470 scientist, although he was definitely an 00:21:32.480 --> 00:21:35.029 empiricist in my opinion. Although of 00:21:35.039 --> 00:21:37.350 course in ancient India, ancient times 00:21:37.360 --> 00:21:39.270 in general, you're going to just go 00:21:39.280 --> 00:21:41.990 along with certain cultural assumptions 00:21:42.000 --> 00:21:45.669 like flat earth for example. And that's 00:21:45.679 --> 00:21:48.310 just taken as a given. That's really not 00:21:48.320 --> 00:21:50.870 what you're out to prove or disprove. 00:21:50.880 --> 00:21:53.590 It's just part of the baggage of being 00:21:53.600 --> 00:21:55.909 born and raised into a certain culture. 00:21:55.919 --> 00:21:57.270 And there's still a lot of that 00:21:57.280 --> 00:22:01.430 nowadays. 00:22:01.440 --> 00:22:02.710 And I think I'm just going to move on to 00:22:02.720 --> 00:22:05.725 Fred's third question. 00:22:05.735 --> 00:22:07.430 [clears throat] Do you know if nibbana 00:22:07.440 --> 00:22:10.230 is possible or is it just a belief? 00:22:10.240 --> 00:22:13.590 Well, nibbana as a word, yeah, that 00:22:13.600 --> 00:22:15.110 would be just a belief. You know, like 00:22:15.120 --> 00:22:16.549 the the Tibetan book of the great 00:22:16.559 --> 00:22:18.470 liberation, you know, it says, you know, 00:22:18.480 --> 00:22:21.909 nibbana or nirvana in various synonyms 00:22:21.919 --> 00:22:23.990 of nirvana are all just mental

00:22:24.000 --> 00:22:26.870 constructs. 00:22:26.880 --> 00:22:29.590 But I mean, if you're get going to get 00:22:29.600 --> 00:22:31.990 to what nibbana, the word nibbana is 00:22:32.000 --> 00:22:33.909 trying to represent, 00:22:33.919 --> 00:22:35.510 um, whether it's possible, I mean, I've 00:22:35.520 --> 00:22:37.590 I've said this many times, whether it's 00:22:37.600 --> 00:22:42.310 even possible in an aamsaric context is 00:22:42.320 --> 00:22:45.510 questionable. I mean, nibbana I mean 00:22:45.520 --> 00:22:48.390 ultimate reality nibbana as like 00:22:48.400 --> 00:22:51.830 realizing ultimate reality. 00:22:51.840 --> 00:22:53.750 Um 00:22:53.760 --> 00:22:55.909 gosh, 00:22:55.919 --> 00:22:57.830 I mean it's it's kind of a trick 00:22:57.840 --> 00:23:01.110 question. In a way, it's a paradox, 00:23:01.120 --> 00:23:03.270 but 00:23:03.280 --> 00:23:07.590 I would guess that 00:23:07.600 --> 00:23:09.350 someone who becomes enlightenment or 00:23:09.360 --> 00:23:11.029 someone who becomes enlightened or 00:23:11.039 --> 00:23:13.430 emancipated, 00:23:13.440 --> 00:23:16.230 they're they're transcending samsara. So 00:23:16.240 --> 00:23:18.710 it could be that the enlight the actual 00:23:18.720 --> 00:23:22.470 enlightened part is just not within the 00:23:22.480 --> 00:23:24.789 context of samsara anymore. So from a 00:23:24.799 --> 00:23:27.430 samsaric point of view it just doesn't 00:23:27.440 --> 00:23:30.230 exist. You you can't see it or hear it 00:23:30.240 --> 00:23:32.390 that kind of thing. 00:23:32.400 --> 00:23:35.461 But I do think that it is possible for 00:23:35.471 --> 00:23:36.870 [clears throat] a person to experience 00:23:36.880 --> 00:23:39.270 reality the contean thing in itself. 00:23:39.280 --> 00:23:42.310 Even though it may be that by doing so, 00:23:42.320 --> 00:23:45.590 one is at least temporarily exiting 00:23:45.600 --> 00:23:48.789 samsara or just like overflowing 00:23:48.799 --> 00:23:51.430 samsara, just expanding beyond the 00:23:51.440 --> 00:23:55.029 limits of samsara, that kind of thing. 00:23:55.039 --> 00:23:57.110 But from an unenlightened point of view, 00:23:57.120 --> 00:24:00.390 they're still there in samsara. 00:24:00.400 --> 00:24:03.110 So an un an unenlightened person looking 00:24:03.120 --> 00:24:04.870 at an enlightened being, they're still 00:24:04.880 --> 00:24:07.190 just going to see uh an unenlightened 00:24:07.200 --> 00:24:09.669 human because they're looking at the 00:24:09.679 --> 00:24:12.230 entire world through samsara colored 00:24:12.240 --> 00:24:15.269 glasses. 00:24:15.279 --> 00:24:16.789 I mean they might believe someone is 00:24:16.799 --> 00:24:18.950 enlightened. I mean there's plenty of 00:24:18.960 --> 00:24:21.990 gurus out there, plenty of ajons and 00:24:22.000 --> 00:24:24.310 seats that their followers think are 00:24:24.320 --> 00:24:25.990 enlightened but they have an 00:24:26.000 --> 00:24:29.510 unenlightened concept of enlightenment.

00:24:29.520 --> 00:24:32.950 an unrealistic idea of what an arroant 00:24:32.960 --> 00:24:37.510 really is and so it's just kind of a 00:24:37.520 --> 00:24:40.870 kind of delusion I guess 00:24:40.880 --> 00:24:45.029 but is nibbana possible in order to even 00:24:45.039 --> 00:24:47.669 discuss that you've got to drag nibbana 00:24:47.679 --> 00:24:51.029 into samsara where you can discuss it 00:24:51.039 --> 00:24:53.029 and then of course the whole thing is is 00:24:53.039 --> 00:24:54.870 ruined 00:24:54.880 --> 00:24:59.110 you ruin everything by by doing that 00:24:59.120 --> 00:25:01.909 but there is definitely something to it 00:25:01.919 --> 00:25:05.669 and it I mean like I said somebody who 00:25:05.679 --> 00:25:07.990 becomes enlightened the enlightened 00:25:08.000 --> 00:25:11.510 aspect of them is has transcended 00:25:11.520 --> 00:25:15.110 samsara and is just beyond the reach of 00:25:15.120 --> 00:25:18.630 any samsaric attempt to cognize it or 00:25:18.640 --> 00:25:20.390 perceive it or anything. Once you 00:25:20.400 --> 00:25:22.710 perceive something it's not real 00:25:22.720 --> 00:25:24.789 anymore. 00:25:24.799 --> 00:25:28.149 So once you have an idea about something 00:25:28.159 --> 00:25:30.390 you're you're dealing with symbols just 00:25:30.400 --> 00:25:32.470 you're dealing with just some saric 00:25:32.480 --> 00:25:34.149 perception and you're not dealing with 00:25:34.159 --> 00:25:37.029 reality ultimate reality and 00:25:37.039 --> 00:25:40.149 enlightenment 00:25:40.159 --> 00:25:42.149 but 00:25:42.159 --> 00:25:44.789 I mean even if even if it's the case 00:25:44.799 --> 00:25:46.390 let's just take the worst case scenario 00:25:46.400 --> 00:25:50.230 no second worst case scenario where 00:25:50.240 --> 00:25:52.390 you can't become fully absolutely 00:25:52.400 --> 00:25:54.630 enlightened certainly 00:25:54.640 --> 00:25:57.909 I mean, you can get close to it in this 00:25:57.919 --> 00:26:00.549 world. I mean, you can what's what's the 00:26:00.559 --> 00:26:03.750 word? Attenuate your delusion. You can 00:26:03.760 --> 00:26:07.269 be less delusional than somebody else 00:26:07.279 --> 00:26:09.590 until I mean, it's just barely suscept. 00:26:09.600 --> 00:26:12.149 They're barely discernible amount of of 00:26:12.159 --> 00:26:14.390 delusion remaining. Let's just go with 00:26:14.400 --> 00:26:17.990 that. is they have to have some 00:26:18.000 --> 00:26:19.830 some 00:26:19.840 --> 00:26:22.789 like foot in the door to samsara even to 00:26:22.799 --> 00:26:24.950 function in samsara what appears to the 00:26:24.960 --> 00:26:28.390 rest of us as samsara then um they'll 00:26:28.400 --> 00:26:29.990 have to have some tiny amount of 00:26:30.000 --> 00:26:33.269 delusion or something to keep them here 00:26:33.279 --> 00:26:36.310 but still I mean even that is worth 00:26:36.320 --> 00:26:38.549 striving for I mean it's it's worth 00:26:38.559 --> 00:26:41.350 striving just to reduce your delusion 00:26:41.360 --> 00:26:45.590 and suffering even if for some reason 00:26:45.600 --> 00:26:47.190 it's not possible to get all the way 00:26:47.200 --> 00:26:49.990 down to zero at least not in the 00:26:50.000 --> 00:26:55.029 samsaric context still you can reduce it 00:26:55.039 --> 00:26:58.070 which is good 00:26:58.080 --> 00:27:02.470 so just striving in in dharma just to 00:27:02.480 --> 00:27:04.549 understand reality even to reduce your 00:27:04.559 --> 00:27:06.310 suffering and attachment and delusion 00:27:06.320 --> 00:27:09.909 and all that is is 100% worthwhile still 00:27:09.919 --> 00:27:12.630 even if full enlightenment is not 00:27:12.640 --> 00:27:14.710 possible 00:27:14.720 --> 00:27:17.669 And within a samsuric context it may not 00:27:17.679 --> 00:27:19.430 be 00:27:19.440 --> 00:27:21.830 because I mean nibbana is just you're no 00:27:21.840 --> 00:27:23.990 longer ins you're no longer in samsara 00:27:24.000 --> 00:27:26.950 you know you are no longer samsaric in a 00:27:26.960 --> 00:27:30.230 sense 00:27:30.240 --> 00:27:32.630 and I don't know if I really answered 00:27:32.640 --> 00:27:35.110 that question but it's it's pretty much 00:27:35.120 --> 00:27:38.070 of a trick question. 00:27:38.080 --> 00:27:39.350 So I'm just going to move on to the next 00:27:39.360 --> 00:27:41.590 question. This is from Jimmy Lad. And I 00:27:41.600 --> 00:27:43.269 I might as well say we don't have a 00:27:43.279 --> 00:27:45.590 whole terrible long list of questions, 00:27:45.600 --> 00:27:47.269 so we could go under two hours this 00:27:47.279 --> 00:27:50.149 time. And we've only been going for a 00:27:50.159 --> 00:27:52.149 little over half an hour. And it's kind 00:27:52.159 --> 00:27:53.510 of interesting how the Mujolnir beard 00:27:53.520 --> 00:27:55.750 can hit the hit the microphone like 00:27:55.760 --> 00:27:59.429 this. 00:27:59.439 --> 00:28:00.310 [clears throat] 00:28:00.320 --> 00:28:01.830 Okay. So, the next question is from 00:28:01.840 --> 00:28:05.590 Jimmy Lad, and Jimmy Lad says, "I asked 00:28:05.600 --> 00:28:07.510 a question last week, but unfortunately 00:28:07.520 --> 00:28:09.669 it disappeared." Yeah, that happens on 00:28:09.679 --> 00:28:12.149 YouTube. I don't know why either. A lot 00:28:12.159 --> 00:28:14.549 of people have said my questions 00:28:14.559 --> 00:28:16.630 disappear from the comments under your 00:28:16.640 --> 00:28:19.510 video. And it's not me who does it. It's 00:28:19.520 --> 00:28:24.310 just it could be just technical internet 00:28:24.320 --> 00:28:29.269 comma or karma if you will. Like my 00:28:29.279 --> 00:28:30.950 attempts at trying to have a video 00:28:30.960 --> 00:28:32.710 conversation with venerable Ajan 00:28:32.720 --> 00:28:36.710 Punadamo or one viewer who says that my 00:28:36.720 --> 00:28:39.110 videos always crash. It's only my videos 00:28:39.120 --> 00:28:41.110 that crash on their computer, but 00:28:41.120 --> 00:28:43.750 somehow it

still happens. 00:28:43.760 --> 00:28:46.870 Mara doesn't want people to watch my 00:28:46.880 --> 00:28:48.870 videos. 00:28:48.880 --> 00:28:50.950 So, anyways, see, I asked a question 00:28:50.960 --> 00:28:52.310 last week, but unfortunately, it 00:28:52.320 --> 00:28:54.710 disappeared. It was the quote from a 00:28:54.720 --> 00:28:57.909 sutra that said, "One must attain a 00:28:57.919 --> 00:28:59.990 state of realization where one is 00:29:00.000 --> 00:29:03.430 purified of all views, even those of the 00:29:03.440 --> 00:29:06.549 five precepts, etc." How are we to 00:29:06.559 --> 00:29:10.170 reconcile this seeming no view or being 00:29:10.180 --> 00:29:12.070 [clears throat] purged of all views with 00:29:12.080 --> 00:29:15.110 the skeptic aesthetic who says who said 00:29:15.120 --> 00:29:16.549 he didn't believe in anything and the 00:29:16.559 --> 00:29:18.310 Buddha corrected him and said that this 00:29:18.320 --> 00:29:20.389 belief itself is a view and then he 00:29:20.399 --> 00:29:21.990 reached enlightenment. What I'm saying 00:29:22.000 --> 00:29:24.789 is that doesn't purifying ourselves of 00:29:24.799 --> 00:29:26.549 all views 00:29:26.559 --> 00:29:28.230 lead us into the same error of the 00:29:28.240 --> 00:29:30.230 skeptic aesthetic. 00:29:30.240 --> 00:29:32.230 How are these two positions distinguish? 00:29:32.240 --> 00:29:34.230 Well, I've I've pretty much answered 00:29:34.240 --> 00:29:36.789 this question [clears throat] before in 00:29:36.799 --> 00:29:39.190 previous Q&As's, which is a good 00:29:39.200 --> 00:29:42.630 indication that anyone who watches my 00:29:42.640 --> 00:29:46.230 Q&A's Q's and A's should watch the 00:29:46.240 --> 00:29:50.310 entire 173 preceding ones, just in case 00:29:50.320 --> 00:29:53.430 I already answered their question. 00:29:53.440 --> 00:29:56.389 But we'll we'll cut Jimmy Lad some slack 00:29:56.399 --> 00:30:00.710 here. And um I think the main difference 00:30:00.720 --> 00:30:03.110 between a skeptic and someone like the 00:30:03.120 --> 00:30:05.350 Buddha is that the Buddha was not a 00:30:05.360 --> 00:30:06.789 skeptic. A lot of people say that the 00:30:06.799 --> 00:30:09.830 Buddha was a skeptic, but he wasn't. He 00:30:09.840 --> 00:30:13.430 was a mystic. And he realized that 00:30:13.440 --> 00:30:15.190 you're never going to know ultimate 00:30:15.200 --> 00:30:18.070 reality, the contean thing in itself 00:30:18.080 --> 00:30:20.549 through perception, through beliefs, 00:30:20.559 --> 00:30:22.950 through world views. 00:30:22.960 --> 00:30:25.590 Like Jay Krishna Mertie the the more 00:30:25.600 --> 00:30:28.230 famous of the two Krishna Merties had a 00:30:28.240 --> 00:30:29.830 book one of his best known books is 00:30:29.840 --> 00:30:31.750 freedom from the known which isn't 00:30:31.760 --> 00:30:33.110 really freedom from the known it's 00:30:33.120 --> 00:30:34.870 freedom from what you think you know 00:30:34.880 --> 00:30:37.190 freedom from perception freedom from 00:30:37.200 --> 00:30:40.870 belief 00:30:40.880 --> 00:30:43.350 because as I already mentioned belief is 00:30:43.360 --> 00:30:45.909 ultimately delusional belief is thinking 00:30:45.919 --> 00:30:47.350 that you know something that you don't 00:30:47.360 --> 00:30:50.070 know and belief is always perceptual 00:30:50.080 --> 00:30:52.230 whereas actual knowledge is not 00:30:52.240 --> 00:30:54.389 perceptual. ual to you cannot know the 00:30:54.399 --> 00:30:57.029 contean thing in itself through 00:30:57.039 --> 00:30:59.750 perception. So you have to transcend 00:30:59.760 --> 00:31:01.830 perception. You have to transcend belief 00:31:01.840 --> 00:31:03.830 in order to get to true knowledge which 00:31:03.840 --> 00:31:07.269 is direct immediate experience of the 00:31:07.279 --> 00:31:10.149 contient thing in itself. And Kant 00:31:10.159 --> 00:31:13.350 himself believed that [clears throat] 00:31:13.360 --> 00:31:15.669 the human mind just cannot know the 00:31:15.679 --> 00:31:17.190 contient thing in itself. According to 00:31:17.200 --> 00:31:20.470 Kant, we're just trapped in samsara, 00:31:20.480 --> 00:31:22.549 trapped in the thing as it seems. And 00:31:22.559 --> 00:31:25.269 most people are but there is one 00:31:25.279 --> 00:31:27.590 contient thing in itself because Kant 00:31:27.600 --> 00:31:29.669 was a mystic he didn't know this but 00:31:29.679 --> 00:31:31.430 there is one contient thing in itself 00:31:31.440 --> 00:31:34.149 that a person can genuinely know and 00:31:34.159 --> 00:31:36.470 that is the contient thing in itself of 00:31:36.480 --> 00:31:39.110 consciousness itself. 00:31:39.120 --> 00:31:41.830 So in meditation 00:31:41.840 --> 00:31:44.870 you try to attenuate your perceptions 00:31:44.880 --> 00:31:46.710 have less and less perception while at 00:31:46.720 --> 00:31:49.110 the same time maintaining consciousness 00:31:49.120 --> 00:31:51.990 until finally you're conscious but 00:31:52.000 --> 00:31:55.350 you're not perceiving anything and then 00:31:55.360 --> 00:31:57.269 you are right there in the contean thing 00:31:57.279 --> 00:32:01.350 in itself of consciousness itself. So 00:32:01.360 --> 00:32:04.070 it's like water and waves. I it's one of 00:32:04.080 --> 00:32:07.509 my most worn out analogies 00:32:07.519 --> 00:32:10.070 that consciousness is like water and 00:32:10.080 --> 00:32:12.070 mental states, perceptions and valitions 00:32:12.080 --> 00:32:14.630 and so forth are like the the waves on 00:32:14.640 --> 00:32:17.190 the surface of the water. And if you 00:32:17.200 --> 00:32:18.870 most people are just stuck at the level 00:32:18.880 --> 00:32:21.029 of waves. I like this wave. I don't like 00:32:21.039 --> 00:32:22.870 that wave. This wave is bigger than that 00:32:22.880 --> 00:32:25.110 wave. That wave is ugly and the other 00:32:25.120 --> 00:32:27.190 wave over there is beautiful. Just this 00:32:27.200 --> 00:32:29.830 kind of stuff. Uh

and they just had no 00:32:29.840 --> 00:32:32.470 concept at all of just water. 00:32:32.480 --> 00:32:35.350 So what consciousness or what meditation 00:32:35.360 --> 00:32:38.789 does is you're working for a flat calm 00:32:38.799 --> 00:32:39.830 so that you're not going to be 00:32:39.840 --> 00:32:43.029 distracted by all the forms of the waves 00:32:43.039 --> 00:32:44.630 and you just get straight into the 00:32:44.640 --> 00:32:46.710 essence. You you realize whoa that's 00:32:46.720 --> 00:32:50.310 just water. And then the the the real 00:32:50.320 --> 00:32:52.389 trick according especially according to 00:32:52.399 --> 00:32:55.029 Zen Buddhism is to maintain that 00:32:55.039 --> 00:32:57.029 awareness after the waves come back 00:32:57.039 --> 00:32:58.549 where you could have just a raging 00:32:58.559 --> 00:33:02.149 stormy sea and still you're like at the 00:33:02.159 --> 00:33:04.630 level of water 00:33:04.640 --> 00:33:06.230 you know you're just still at the level 00:33:06.240 --> 00:33:08.870 of consciousness and not perception. 00:33:08.880 --> 00:33:12.470 Hence the uh the old Zen saying that I 00:33:12.480 --> 00:33:14.470 mean [clears throat] the uh the Zeno the 00:33:14.480 --> 00:33:16.710 meditation hall can be resounding 00:33:16.720 --> 00:33:18.470 reverberating with the shouts of the 00:33:18.480 --> 00:33:20.549 master and blows from his stick can be 00:33:20.559 --> 00:33:23.350 falling like rain but still the master 00:33:23.360 --> 00:33:28.149 is dwelling in stillness and silence. 00:33:28.159 --> 00:33:29.909 That's because he is at the level of 00:33:29.919 --> 00:33:32.549 consciousness and not distracted by all 00:33:32.559 --> 00:33:37.669 the forms of samsara. 00:33:37.679 --> 00:33:41.110 So getting back to the question, no. 00:33:41.120 --> 00:33:42.870 Yeah, it's there's a difference between 00:33:42.880 --> 00:33:45.269 being a mystic, especially like a very 00:33:45.279 --> 00:33:48.710 advanced mystic and being a skeptic. The 00:33:48.720 --> 00:33:50.950 mystic knows you can know reality. 00:33:50.960 --> 00:33:53.269 You're just not going to know it through 00:33:53.279 --> 00:33:55.029 perceptions. 00:33:55.039 --> 00:33:57.029 The skeptic is still kind of stuck at 00:33:57.039 --> 00:33:59.590 the level of perceptions. 00:33:59.600 --> 00:34:03.750 So I mean he's not really 00:34:03.760 --> 00:34:05.350 he's not really knowing the contean 00:34:05.360 --> 00:34:06.870 thing in itself. He just comes to the 00:34:06.880 --> 00:34:08.790 conclusion you can't know anything which 00:34:08.800 --> 00:34:11.190 tends to be just another belief and 00:34:11.200 --> 00:34:15.669 keeps you stuck in some sorrow. 00:34:15.679 --> 00:34:18.389 So I guess I answered that question. I'm 00:34:18.399 --> 00:34:19.589 going to be moving on to the next one. 00:34:19.599 --> 00:34:24.069 Now, this is from Rea 00:34:24.079 --> 00:34:25.829 and I really don't know how to how to 00:34:25.839 --> 00:34:28.389 pronounce German words 00:34:28.399 --> 00:34:29.430 and [clears throat] I'm not even sure if 00:34:29.440 --> 00:34:34.389 this is an actual question that 00:34:34.399 --> 00:34:37.430 just uh leaves this kind of quote that 00:34:37.440 --> 00:34:39.669 has a question mark in it. So that's why 00:34:39.679 --> 00:34:42.149 it's on the list although it continues 00:34:42.159 --> 00:34:43.430 after the question mark and the whole 00:34:43.440 --> 00:34:46.389 thing could just be a quote. 00:34:46.399 --> 00:34:48.550 So he says this is an excerpt from the 00:34:48.560 --> 00:34:51.909 new book the Buddha's face by Bante 00:34:51.919 --> 00:34:54.149 Mudataterra 00:34:54.159 --> 00:34:57.430 and then I guess what follows is the are 00:34:57.440 --> 00:35:00.310 the words of Bonte Mudaterra. 00:35:00.320 --> 00:35:02.630 Everywhere in the Buddhist world today, 00:35:02.640 --> 00:35:05.270 the face of the Buddha greets us serene, 00:35:05.280 --> 00:35:07.829 symmetrical, crowned with coiled hair, 00:35:07.839 --> 00:35:11.030 gazing in calm detachment. From stone 00:35:11.040 --> 00:35:14.390 colossi in Bameon to bronzes in 00:35:14.400 --> 00:35:17.030 Thailand, from guilt images in Japan to 00:35:17.040 --> 00:35:19.990 marble statues in Sri Lanka, this face 00:35:20.000 --> 00:35:22.710 has become universal. And yet the 00:35:22.720 --> 00:35:24.710 historical Godma, the prince of the 00:35:24.720 --> 00:35:26.870 Shakya clan who lived in the fifth 00:35:26.880 --> 00:35:29.910 century B.CE, almost certainly looked 00:35:29.920 --> 00:35:32.150 nothing like these statues. His 00:35:32.160 --> 00:35:34.069 disciples remembered him as golden 00:35:34.079 --> 00:35:37.910 skinned. Suana Wana, deep blueeyed, 00:35:37.920 --> 00:35:39.750 Abilaneta, 00:35:39.760 --> 00:35:41.670 noble in appearance, but simple in 00:35:41.680 --> 00:35:44.390 bearing. As a monk, he shaved his head. 00:35:44.400 --> 00:35:48.710 Let's see. 00:35:48.720 --> 00:35:52.390 according to Majamanikica suta number 26 00:35:52.400 --> 00:35:55.510 and wore ochre robes for centuries after 00:35:55.520 --> 00:35:57.670 his party nibbana his followers refused 00:35:57.680 --> 00:35:59.349 to depict him in human form at all 00:35:59.359 --> 00:36:01.510 relying instead on symbols the bodhic 00:36:01.520 --> 00:36:03.829 tree the dharma wheel the footprints the 00:36:03.839 --> 00:36:06.630 empty throne now here comes the question 00:36:06.640 --> 00:36:09.109 how then did we arrive at the serene 00:36:09.119 --> 00:36:11.990 figure with coiled hair and cranial bump 00:36:12.000 --> 00:36:15.270 seated in Greco Roman robes question 00:36:15.280 --> 00:36:17.910 mark but then the quote continues I 00:36:17.920 --> 00:36:19.750 think This question is more than art 00:36:19.760 --> 00:36:22.069 history. It is about how history, myth 00:36:22.079 --> 00:36:24.710 and culture converge to create memory. 00:36:24.720 --> 00:36:27.670 It is about how God the Arian Manusa of 00:36:27.680

--> 00:36:30.150 solar descent became the universal 00:36:30.160 --> 00:36:31.910 archetype of enlightenment. It is about 00:36:31.920 --> 00:36:35.109 how civilizations Indian Greek Egyptian 00:36:35.119 --> 00:36:37.750 all left their imprint on his visage. 00:36:37.760 --> 00:36:40.150 And I think it's kind of a stretch to 00:36:40.160 --> 00:36:43.910 say that ancient Egypt influenced the 00:36:43.920 --> 00:36:46.390 appearance of Buddha images. I do think 00:36:46.400 --> 00:36:51.829 that is pushing it to some degree, 00:36:51.839 --> 00:36:53.190 but [clears throat] 00:36:53.200 --> 00:36:55.990 I mean we've discussed this before like 00:36:56.000 --> 00:36:58.150 um how here's the actual question. How 00:36:58.160 --> 00:37:00.150 then did we arrive at the serene figure 00:37:00.160 --> 00:37:02.950 with coiled hair and cranial bump seated 00:37:02.960 --> 00:37:04.550 in the Greco Roman robes? Well, I 00:37:04.560 --> 00:37:06.950 mentioned that some of the first Buddha 00:37:06.960 --> 00:37:10.390 images were made by Greeks or helanized 00:37:10.400 --> 00:37:12.950 inhabitants of what would now be 00:37:12.960 --> 00:37:15.750 Pakistan and Afghanistan. 00:37:15.760 --> 00:37:17.430 because Alexander the Great conquered 00:37:17.440 --> 00:37:20.550 that area, settled Greek settlers there, 00:37:20.560 --> 00:37:23.109 you know, with with like colony cities 00:37:23.119 --> 00:37:24.390 about half of which were named 00:37:24.400 --> 00:37:26.710 Alexandria. 00:37:26.720 --> 00:37:29.670 And so the Greeks that settled in that 00:37:29.680 --> 00:37:33.109 area of like Afghanistan and Pakistan, 00:37:33.119 --> 00:37:35.109 many if not most of them converted to 00:37:35.119 --> 00:37:38.150 Buddhism because that was firmly 00:37:38.160 --> 00:37:40.790 Buddhist at the time. And so and and 00:37:40.800 --> 00:37:43.510 they preferred Buddhism to like Vdic 00:37:43.520 --> 00:37:45.270 Brahminism because the Vadic Brahmans 00:37:45.280 --> 00:37:47.589 were they were sort of like Hebrews 00:37:47.599 --> 00:37:49.030 where you know it was kind of an 00:37:49.040 --> 00:37:51.589 exclusive club you know they kind of 00:37:51.599 --> 00:37:55.430 looked down on the barbarian Malayas 00:37:55.440 --> 00:37:58.710 were the Greeks and so the Buddhists 00:37:58.720 --> 00:38:00.790 were more accepting and inviting and 00:38:00.800 --> 00:38:04.790 that's one reason possibly like better 00:38:04.800 --> 00:38:07.670 philosophical cohesiveness and so forth 00:38:07.680 --> 00:38:10.310 also you know maybe maybe even a little 00:38:10.320 --> 00:38:12.470 better profoundity with regard to what 00:38:12.480 --> 00:38:14.950 the Greeks were encountering. The Greeks 00:38:14.960 --> 00:38:16.630 were I mean they did have an 00:38:16.640 --> 00:38:18.950 appreciation of philosophy. 00:38:18.960 --> 00:38:21.829 So because of whatever reasons the 00:38:21.839 --> 00:38:24.950 Greeks converted to Buddhism in uh their 00:38:24.960 --> 00:38:26.870 their

easternmost 00:38:26.880 --> 00:38:28.790 uh colonies 00:38:28.800 --> 00:38:31.109 and so they they liked statues. is 00:38:31.119 --> 00:38:32.710 they'd been making statues for quite a 00:38:32.720 --> 00:38:34.950 while, you know, going all the way back 00:38:34.960 --> 00:38:38.790 to, you know, pre Greek Menowans. 00:38:38.800 --> 00:38:40.150 And so they started making Buddha 00:38:40.160 --> 00:38:42.069 statues. Some of the first statues were 00:38:42.079 --> 00:38:44.790 of of the Buddha were made by Greeks. 00:38:44.800 --> 00:38:47.349 And they modeled the Buddha on the god 00:38:47.359 --> 00:38:49.910 Apollo. And the god Apollo always had a 00:38:49.920 --> 00:38:53.190 top knot of hair. And so they just made 00:38:53.200 --> 00:38:55.990 the Buddha with a top knot of hair, 00:38:56.000 --> 00:38:58.310 not really caring that by all accounts, 00:38:58.320 --> 00:39:01.109 the Buddha was shaven headed. He didn't 00:39:01.119 --> 00:39:05.190 have hair other than maybe some stubble 00:39:05.200 --> 00:39:08.230 and then later the origins of this like 00:39:08.240 --> 00:39:09.990 the original meaning of the top knot of 00:39:10.000 --> 00:39:12.870 hair were lost and so it just turned 00:39:12.880 --> 00:39:14.790 into like this weird lump on top of the 00:39:14.800 --> 00:39:16.870 head or sometimes it will be like a 00:39:16.880 --> 00:39:19.190 flame of wisdom like some Thai or 00:39:19.200 --> 00:39:21.829 Cambodian Buddha images will have sort 00:39:21.839 --> 00:39:24.470 of a flame like this. Sometimes it'll 00:39:24.480 --> 00:39:26.790 look sort of like an onion like this 00:39:26.800 --> 00:39:30.710 bulb with a like a point at the top. Um, 00:39:30.720 --> 00:39:32.550 but it [clears throat] almost all Buddha 00:39:32.560 --> 00:39:35.109 statues have head hair going all the way 00:39:35.119 --> 00:39:37.670 back to apparently 00:39:37.680 --> 00:39:41.990 Apollo, the Greek god Apollo. 00:39:42.000 --> 00:39:45.270 Um, but this part seated in Greco Roman 00:39:45.280 --> 00:39:48.310 robes. Maybe the earliest statues he 00:39:48.320 --> 00:39:51.190 would be dressed like Apollo is dressed. 00:39:51.200 --> 00:39:53.750 Although most Buddhist statues nowadays, 00:39:53.760 --> 00:39:56.390 he's not dressed in Greco Roman robes. I 00:39:56.400 --> 00:39:57.910 mean the Greek robes and the Roman robes 00:39:57.920 --> 00:39:59.589 were different from each other anyway. I 00:39:59.599 --> 00:40:02.950 mean he's really not wearing a toga. 00:40:02.960 --> 00:40:06.790 So he's wearing like the Shivaram. 00:40:06.800 --> 00:40:09.589 He's wearing monk's robes 00:40:09.599 --> 00:40:11.510 and some I mean some of my favorite ones 00:40:11.520 --> 00:40:13.510 he's he's got you know the shoulder 00:40:13.520 --> 00:40:16.310 uncovered but um a lot of the time he's 00:40:16.320 --> 00:40:18.310 wearing the robes in the oldfashioned 00:40:18.320 --> 00:40:20.390 way when robes were still relatively 00:40:20.400 --> 00:40:22.069 small

covering both shoulders because 00:40:22.079 --> 00:40:24.230 that's the way monks wore their robes in 00:40:24.240 --> 00:40:26.150 ancient times. 00:40:26.160 --> 00:40:28.630 Like even like the Kamakura Buddha 00:40:28.640 --> 00:40:30.470 statue, he's got it covering both 00:40:30.480 --> 00:40:31.990 shoulders and then he's got it hanging 00:40:32.000 --> 00:40:35.750 downs to show off some bare chest, which 00:40:35.760 --> 00:40:38.230 probably I mean monks didn't really wear 00:40:38.240 --> 00:40:41.349 their robes that way. But um I think by 00:40:41.359 --> 00:40:43.750 the time the Kamakura Buddha was was 00:40:43.760 --> 00:40:47.190 created in Japan, um the Buddhist monks 00:40:47.200 --> 00:40:49.109 in Japan had pretty much stopped wearing 00:40:49.119 --> 00:40:51.349 the the traditional three robes of an 00:40:51.359 --> 00:40:55.030 ancient Indian Buddhist monk. Anyway, 00:40:55.040 --> 00:40:57.510 so was I'm not exactly sure. It's just 00:40:57.520 --> 00:40:59.910 sort of like a garbled understanding of 00:40:59.920 --> 00:41:02.390 what monk's robes how monk's robes were 00:41:02.400 --> 00:41:05.349 worn at that point. 00:41:05.359 --> 00:41:07.270 But the Buddhist statue I've got, he's I 00:41:07.280 --> 00:41:08.630 mean that what he's wearing could 00:41:08.640 --> 00:41:12.150 qualify as completely kosher ancient 00:41:12.160 --> 00:41:15.349 Indian Buddhist robes. 00:41:15.359 --> 00:41:17.589 So maybe some of the early Greek like 00:41:17.599 --> 00:41:20.390 the Gondaran Buddha images the the 00:41:20.400 --> 00:41:23.190 clothing was a little more Greek looking 00:41:23.200 --> 00:41:27.829 than now. But still I mean it's robes 00:41:27.839 --> 00:41:30.790 just like a big rectangle of cloth worn 00:41:30.800 --> 00:41:32.550 over the upper body and just another 00:41:32.560 --> 00:41:35.349 rectangle of cloth worn like a saron you 00:41:35.359 --> 00:41:38.843 know kind of folded on around one's 00:41:38.853 --> 00:41:41.670 [clears throat] waist. 00:41:41.680 --> 00:41:44.790 And I really don't see how the Egyptians 00:41:44.800 --> 00:41:47.190 could have really influenced Buddhist 00:41:47.200 --> 00:41:48.790 statues all that much. There was a 00:41:48.800 --> 00:41:50.390 little bit of like Mesopotamian 00:41:50.400 --> 00:41:52.230 influence in India. There were trade 00:41:52.240 --> 00:41:54.950 routes between ancient India like even 00:41:54.960 --> 00:41:57.750 going back into Vadic times with 00:41:57.760 --> 00:42:01.349 Mesopotamia. And later, you know, after 00:42:01.359 --> 00:42:04.150 after the time of the Buddha's life, 00:42:04.160 --> 00:42:05.670 there were trade routes with like 00:42:05.680 --> 00:42:08.470 ancient Rome and so forth. That's how 00:42:08.480 --> 00:42:12.950 like the uh let's say what is it the 00:42:12.960 --> 00:42:14.710 tomic 00:42:14.720 --> 00:42:17.349 uh understanding of astronomy made it 00:42:17.359 --> 00:42:20.870 into India where it turned into like 00:42:20.880

--> 00:42:23.510 Sanskrit astronomy texts like the surya 00:42:23.520 --> 00:42:27.270 sedanta that kind of thing but ancient 00:42:27.280 --> 00:42:29.270 Egypt I mean it would have been minimal 00:42:29.280 --> 00:42:32.150 at best any influence of ancient 00:42:32.160 --> 00:42:35.910 Egyptians on on Buddha images for 00:42:35.920 --> 00:42:37.270 example 00:42:37.280 --> 00:42:41.589 I think uh venerable Muda Terra is 00:42:41.599 --> 00:42:43.910 talking about like the serenity of the 00:42:43.920 --> 00:42:45.990 Buddha. But I mean the serenity he was 00:42:46.000 --> 00:42:49.750 serene regardless of ancient India 00:42:49.760 --> 00:42:51.670 but the Greeks definitely had an 00:42:51.680 --> 00:42:53.589 influence. [clears throat] By the time 00:42:53.599 --> 00:42:56.950 the Romans came along and became uh sort 00:42:56.960 --> 00:42:59.109 of like the western world power, 00:42:59.119 --> 00:43:00.870 Buddhism was already well established. 00:43:00.880 --> 00:43:04.870 And so even Roman influence on like the 00:43:04.880 --> 00:43:06.630 appearance of Buddha statues, Buddha 00:43:06.640 --> 00:43:08.790 images and so forth would be minimal, 00:43:08.800 --> 00:43:12.870 but Greek and Indian definitely. 00:43:12.880 --> 00:43:14.790 So I'm not even sure if that was really 00:43:14.800 --> 00:43:16.630 a a [clears throat] question directed 00:43:16.640 --> 00:43:18.550 towards me. So I'm just going to move on 00:43:18.560 --> 00:43:21.589 to the next question. This is from Ruie. 00:43:21.599 --> 00:43:23.829 And I hope that this is recording. And 00:43:23.839 --> 00:43:27.109 uh yeah, the the uh the little green 00:43:27.119 --> 00:43:28.630 bars are moving back and forth for the 00:43:28.640 --> 00:43:31.990 microphone as my my beard bead hits the 00:43:32.000 --> 00:43:34.470 microphone. 00:43:34.480 --> 00:43:36.090 And Ruie [snorts] says, "Do 00:43:36.100 --> 00:43:37.750 [clears throat] you think the sign of 00:43:37.760 --> 00:43:41.510 the mind is still a sensory object, a 00:43:41.520 --> 00:43:43.109 spirious 00:43:43.119 --> 00:43:45.589 spurious apparition generated by the 00:43:45.599 --> 00:43:47.990 mind when it is tethered by one-pointed 00:43:48.000 --> 00:43:50.470 meditations instead of attending to its 00:43:50.480 --> 00:43:53.510 broader context as gateway?" I'm not 00:43:53.520 --> 00:43:55.109 exactly sure what Ruie is referring to. 00:43:55.119 --> 00:43:57.829 I mean if he's referring to the nimita 00:43:57.839 --> 00:44:01.109 which is the like a symptom of what is 00:44:01.119 --> 00:44:03.910 called access concentration which is 00:44:03.920 --> 00:44:06.470 sort of the gateway to Janna that 00:44:06.480 --> 00:44:08.230 supposedly according to the commentarial 00:44:08.240 --> 00:44:10.630 tradition according to like pa method of 00:44:10.640 --> 00:44:13.589 Burma that before you get first Janna 00:44:13.599 --> 00:44:15.109 you're going to reach this access 00:44:15.119 --> 00:44:16.550 concentration and you're going to see a 00:44:16.560 --> 00:44:20.069 kind of nimita or sign which usually is 00:44:20.079 --> 00:44:23.670 just sort of like a like a whitish or a 00:44:23.680 --> 00:44:26.309 light grayish ish oval or cloud. 00:44:26.319 --> 00:44:28.069 Sometimes it can be an image of the 00:44:28.079 --> 00:44:30.150 Buddha se seated in meditation or some 00:44:30.160 --> 00:44:32.069 such. 00:44:32.079 --> 00:44:35.190 Um but yeah, it's still a perception and 00:44:35.200 --> 00:44:38.069 it's not found in the sutas at all. I 00:44:38.079 --> 00:44:41.750 mean, this is just a like an artifact of 00:44:41.760 --> 00:44:43.430 later tradition and the commentarial 00:44:43.440 --> 00:44:45.910 tradition that you're going to have 00:44:45.920 --> 00:44:50.790 access concentration as like pre-Janna. 00:44:50.800 --> 00:44:52.309 I think by the time the commentarial 00:44:52.319 --> 00:44:55.829 tradition reached its final form, Janna 00:44:55.839 --> 00:44:58.069 really wasn't even understood that well 00:44:58.079 --> 00:45:02.069 anymore. In fact, in the sutas that I 00:45:02.079 --> 00:45:04.069 mean anyone who really wants to 00:45:04.079 --> 00:45:05.750 understand Janna is going to be very 00:45:05.760 --> 00:45:08.710 frustrated if they read the sutas and 00:45:08.720 --> 00:45:10.950 try to understand exactly what Janna is 00:45:10.960 --> 00:45:13.990 because it's still controversial because 00:45:14.000 --> 00:45:16.710 almost every single time Janna is 00:45:16.720 --> 00:45:18.790 described or explained in the sutas, 00:45:18.800 --> 00:45:22.950 it's the same stock just block of words 00:45:22.960 --> 00:45:25.750 that that are just inserted into into 00:45:25.760 --> 00:45:28.470 various sutas. you know, it's just the 00:45:28.480 --> 00:45:30.150 same explanation which isn't much of an 00:45:30.160 --> 00:45:32.710 explanation at all. It's it's kind of a 00:45:32.720 --> 00:45:35.510 a description without really explaining 00:45:35.520 --> 00:45:37.990 much. And the description can be 00:45:38.000 --> 00:45:40.470 interpreted in various ways. Hence the 00:45:40.480 --> 00:45:42.230 controversial nature of what Jonah 00:45:42.240 --> 00:45:44.790 actually is to the point that Janna 00:45:44.800 --> 00:45:46.950 might as well just be I mean it's it's 00:45:46.960 --> 00:45:49.270 practically useless. I mean, if you 00:45:49.280 --> 00:45:52.069 can't really identify or define what 00:45:52.079 --> 00:45:54.870 Janna is in an uncontroversial way so 00:45:54.880 --> 00:45:56.710 that everyone can agree on it, then 00:45:56.720 --> 00:45:58.790 you're better off just not using the 00:45:58.800 --> 00:46:01.349 term. 00:46:01.359 --> 00:46:02.870 So, the sign of the mind is still 00:46:02.880 --> 00:46:05.589 perceptual. As long as it's a sign, it's 00:46:05.599 --> 00:46:07.349 going to be perceptual. And you can say 00:46:07.359 --> 00:46:09.990 it's a sensory object in that from the 00:46:10.000 --> 00:46:12.230 Buddhist point of view,

the mind is the 00:46:12.240 --> 00:46:14.470 sixth sense. So, anything mental is 00:46:14.480 --> 00:46:16.950 going to be sensory from from the 00:46:16.960 --> 00:46:19.349 Buddhist point of view. Anyhow, cuz the 00:46:19.359 --> 00:46:22.950 mind is the sixth sense organ which I 00:46:22.960 --> 00:46:25.030 guess in terra like the commentarial 00:46:25.040 --> 00:46:27.190 tradition especially it's it's a chamber 00:46:27.200 --> 00:46:29.349 of the heart and not the brain although 00:46:29.359 --> 00:46:32.790 nowadays in the west we accept the idea 00:46:32.800 --> 00:46:35.190 that it is the brain that is the source 00:46:35.200 --> 00:46:37.510 of mind or the primary source of mind 00:46:37.520 --> 00:46:39.670 anyway at least with regard to thinking 00:46:39.680 --> 00:46:42.767 and perceiving. 00:46:42.777 --> 00:46:44.550 [sighs] So 00:46:44.560 --> 00:46:47.030 yeah, I mean if you read the the sutas, 00:46:47.040 --> 00:46:48.710 what you're going for is you should be 00:46:48.720 --> 00:46:50.950 going for the signless, the animeita. 00:46:50.960 --> 00:46:53.190 You're not going for the sign. You're 00:46:53.200 --> 00:46:55.670 going for the signless. 00:46:55.680 --> 00:46:57.430 And that is you are transcending 00:46:57.440 --> 00:46:59.829 perception. You are meditating in a way 00:46:59.839 --> 00:47:01.829 that you're not thinking anymore. You're 00:47:01.839 --> 00:47:04.550 not perceiving or believing anymore. 00:47:04.560 --> 00:47:06.230 You're just getting to the contient 00:47:06.240 --> 00:47:10.550 thing in itself of consciousness. 00:47:10.560 --> 00:47:13.430 just wide awake awareness just silent 00:47:13.440 --> 00:47:18.230 and clear like glass. 00:47:18.240 --> 00:47:22.710 So yeah, the whole sign or the nimita is 00:47:22.720 --> 00:47:24.870 uh 00:47:24.880 --> 00:47:26.390 yeah it's it's not something that you 00:47:26.400 --> 00:47:31.430 should be chasing after. 00:47:31.440 --> 00:47:33.910 Much more important is the signless the 00:47:33.920 --> 00:47:37.190 absence of any sign. 00:47:37.200 --> 00:47:39.750 And uh let's see. Did I answer the 00:47:39.760 --> 00:47:42.390 question? 00:47:42.400 --> 00:47:44.470 Yeah. Yeah. I'm just going to I think I 00:47:44.480 --> 00:47:46.309 answered the question. Do I think the 00:47:46.319 --> 00:47:47.510 side of the mind is still a sensory 00:47:47.520 --> 00:47:49.190 object spirious apparition generated by 00:47:49.200 --> 00:47:50.470 the mind when it is tethered by 00:47:50.480 --> 00:47:52.950 one-pointed meditations instead of 00:47:52.960 --> 00:47:54.550 attending to its broader context as 00:47:54.560 --> 00:47:56.950 gateway? I mean the whole thing of the 00:47:56.960 --> 00:47:58.870 broader context as gateway is not 00:47:58.880 --> 00:48:00.710 canonical anyway. It's just found in the 00:48:00.720 --> 00:48:03.750 commentarial tradition anyhow. 00:48:03.760 --> 00:48:06.550 So yeah, I mean you'd be better off 00:48:06.560 --> 00:48:09.910 striving for

the signless instead of the 00:48:09.920 --> 00:48:12.309 sign. And I'm just going to move on. 00:48:12.319 --> 00:48:15.670 Next question. This is from some papa. 00:48:15.680 --> 00:48:18.390 And some papa says, "What are the 00:48:18.400 --> 00:48:21.109 holidays or annual celebrations in a 00:48:21.119 --> 00:48:24.309 Burmese Buddhist monastery?" 00:48:24.319 --> 00:48:27.270 Well, let's see. The first big one of 00:48:27.280 --> 00:48:29.270 like the western calendar would be thin 00:48:29.280 --> 00:48:31.670 jan which is the new year's festival 00:48:31.680 --> 00:48:34.309 which really I mean it's based on 00:48:34.319 --> 00:48:37.270 ancient Indian astronomy 00:48:37.280 --> 00:48:39.910 because technically the new year's f 00:48:39.920 --> 00:48:42.549 sonran in Thailand is the same thin it's 00:48:42.559 --> 00:48:46.549 called thin jen in Burmese sonran in in 00:48:46.559 --> 00:48:49.589 Thai I think it's sramina in Sanskrit 00:48:49.599 --> 00:48:51.670 which means crossing over and what's 00:48:51.680 --> 00:48:54.710 happening is the sun is passing through 00:48:54.720 --> 00:48:57.043 the meridian Ian containing 00:48:57.053 --> 00:48:57.910 [clears throat] 00:48:57.920 --> 00:49:02.870 the ancient lunar mansion or asterism of 00:49:02.880 --> 00:49:06.390 Rayadi which corresponds to a bright 00:49:06.400 --> 00:49:09.750 star in the constellation of Pisces 00:49:09.760 --> 00:49:11.270 which contains no bright stars. So it's 00:49:11.280 --> 00:49:13.589 it's like the brightest star you know 00:49:13.599 --> 00:49:15.910 which is still relatively dim in Pisces. 00:49:15.920 --> 00:49:17.750 Pisces is really you look up there 00:49:17.760 --> 00:49:19.910 you're not going to see two fish. It's 00:49:19.920 --> 00:49:23.670 just like this dim cluster of stars 00:49:23.680 --> 00:49:27.589 and some like late classical or early 00:49:27.599 --> 00:49:31.750 medieval Indian astronomer after like 00:49:31.760 --> 00:49:35.109 ast a astronomical knowledge was coming 00:49:35.119 --> 00:49:37.430 to India from the Roman Empire through 00:49:37.440 --> 00:49:39.829 trade routes that they came up with this 00:49:39.839 --> 00:49:41.910 idea. They they kind of extrapolated 00:49:41.920 --> 00:49:43.990 backwards. They calculated backwards and 00:49:44.000 --> 00:49:45.589 they determined that there was a 00:49:45.599 --> 00:49:48.950 universal um conjunction of all the 00:49:48.960 --> 00:49:52.309 known planets and the sun and the moon 00:49:52.319 --> 00:49:56.309 at this point in the constellation 00:49:56.319 --> 00:49:58.790 Raywood, you know, a zillion gajillion 00:49:58.800 --> 00:50:00.309 years ago. And so they assumed that was 00:50:00.319 --> 00:50:02.950 when the universe began at this univers 00:50:02.960 --> 00:50:05.670 universal conjunction. And so since the 00:50:05.680 --> 00:50:09.750 universe began at that time, then that 00:50:09.760 --> 00:50:11.349 must be, you [clears throat] know, 00:50:11.359 --> 00:50:13.109 that's what you're going to consider to 00:50:13.119 --> 00:50:15.349 be the beginning and the end of the year 00:50:15.359 --> 00:50:16.790 because that was the beginning of the 00:50:16.800 --> 00:50:20.230 first year. 00:50:20.240 --> 00:50:22.630 Um, so I mean, it's not really a 00:50:22.640 --> 00:50:24.870 Buddhist holiday, but it's definitely a 00:50:24.880 --> 00:50:28.549 Southeast Asian holiday. And you got 00:50:28.559 --> 00:50:32.390 like five days of nobody working. You 00:50:32.400 --> 00:50:35.349 know, it's like banks are closed, excuse 00:50:35.359 --> 00:50:39.670 me, the banks are closed and it's just 00:50:39.680 --> 00:50:42.150 school is out, all this stuff. And so a 00:50:42.160 --> 00:50:45.030 lot of men will go to the monasteries 00:50:45.040 --> 00:50:49.270 and be ordained for like five days. 00:50:49.280 --> 00:50:51.349 And the lay people will go and take 00:50:51.359 --> 00:50:53.109 eight precepts. You know, people get 00:50:53.119 --> 00:50:54.870 more religious. You know, it's sort of 00:50:54.880 --> 00:50:56.790 like New Year's resolutions. And you 00:50:56.800 --> 00:50:58.710 want to start the new year with good 00:50:58.720 --> 00:51:00.390 deeds. you know, you want to start off 00:51:00.400 --> 00:51:03.510 on the right foot, so to speak. So, 00:51:03.520 --> 00:51:05.270 yeah, that's probably one of the biggest 00:51:05.280 --> 00:51:07.670 holidays at a Buddhist monastery. It's 00:51:07.680 --> 00:51:09.990 not a particularly Buddhist holiday. 00:51:10.000 --> 00:51:13.109 It's based on Indian astrology or 00:51:13.119 --> 00:51:16.150 astronomy, I should say, but you know, 00:51:16.160 --> 00:51:18.870 it's just a cultural thing. And then 00:51:18.880 --> 00:51:20.710 after that would be Buddha Day or the 00:51:20.720 --> 00:51:22.630 full moon of what is usually May. 00:51:22.640 --> 00:51:24.309 Sometimes it can happen like the end of 00:51:24.319 --> 00:51:26.390 April, like the year that I was 00:51:26.400 --> 00:51:29.660 ordained. The full moon of 00:51:29.670 --> 00:51:30.230 [clears throat] 00:51:30.240 --> 00:51:32.630 it's called Wisak, 00:51:32.640 --> 00:51:34.309 the full moon of Wisaka, which is 00:51:34.319 --> 00:51:35.589 another one of these lunar mansions. 00:51:35.599 --> 00:51:37.430 It's the name of a a month in the 00:51:37.440 --> 00:51:39.589 ancient Indian calendar. Um that was 00:51:39.599 --> 00:51:40.870 when the Buddha became enlightened 00:51:40.880 --> 00:51:42.309 according to tradition. [clears throat] 00:51:42.319 --> 00:51:45.030 And then later tradition added he was 00:51:45.040 --> 00:51:47.910 born and died all on that same day, 00:51:47.920 --> 00:51:51.510 which is statistically kind of unlikely. 00:51:51.520 --> 00:51:53.910 It may be that they just didn't know 00:51:53.920 --> 00:51:56.950 like sort of like Jesus's birthday, you 00:51:56.960 --> 00:51:58.549 know, they didn't really know exactly 00:51:58.559 --> 00:52:00.150 when it was. So, they just kind of

00:52:00.160 --> 00:52:02.630 conveniently attribute that day to 00:52:02.640 --> 00:52:04.230 someday that's already considered to be 00:52:04.240 --> 00:52:06.549 important like the feast day of soul 00:52:06.559 --> 00:52:10.549 invictus in the late Roman Empire or 00:52:10.559 --> 00:52:13.030 Buddha day already in in Buddhist 00:52:13.040 --> 00:52:14.710 countries. 00:52:14.720 --> 00:52:18.150 So yeah, we sack or you know the 00:52:18.160 --> 00:52:19.190 celebration of the Buddha's 00:52:19.200 --> 00:52:21.430 enlightenment at least the celebration 00:52:21.440 --> 00:52:23.510 of his enlightenment on on the full moon 00:52:23.520 --> 00:52:27.190 of May is established in in ancient 00:52:27.200 --> 00:52:29.750 times. I think his birth and death got 00:52:29.760 --> 00:52:31.750 got attributed to that same day later 00:52:31.760 --> 00:52:35.030 on. Also, a little bit of trivia. The 00:52:35.040 --> 00:52:36.870 full moon of May is also the day that 00:52:36.880 --> 00:52:39.349 Quai Chang harpooned the Imperial nephew 00:52:39.359 --> 00:52:41.109 on the pilot episode of Kung Fu, 00:52:41.119 --> 00:52:44.790 requiring him to flee to America and 00:52:44.800 --> 00:52:47.349 deal with cowboys 00:52:47.359 --> 00:52:49.270 instead [clears throat] of being uh a 00:52:49.280 --> 00:52:52.846 Shaolin monk in China. 00:52:52.856 --> 00:52:54.790 [sighs] So, okay. So, that was the 00:52:54.800 --> 00:52:56.309 second a little bit of a digression 00:52:56.319 --> 00:52:58.390 there. And then the next annual 00:52:58.400 --> 00:53:00.309 celebration, 00:53:00.319 --> 00:53:02.630 well, I mean like the three months of 00:53:02.640 --> 00:53:04.390 the range retreat is considered sort of 00:53:04.400 --> 00:53:06.230 it's sort of like Lent in Roman 00:53:06.240 --> 00:53:08.230 Catholicism. You know, people are more 00:53:08.240 --> 00:53:10.230 religious during during Lent. You know, 00:53:10.240 --> 00:53:12.549 they take keeping precepts a little more 00:53:12.559 --> 00:53:14.470 seriously. A lot of monasteries will 00:53:14.480 --> 00:53:17.109 have the monks doing more intensive 00:53:17.119 --> 00:53:19.990 meditation during the the reigns 00:53:20.000 --> 00:53:21.990 retreat, the Wasa, which literally means 00:53:22.000 --> 00:53:24.309 rain. 00:53:24.319 --> 00:53:27.910 Um and the first and last days are you 00:53:27.920 --> 00:53:29.750 know kind of 00:53:29.760 --> 00:53:32.390 like sort of like holidays especially 00:53:32.400 --> 00:53:34.230 the last day of Wasa which is also the 00:53:34.240 --> 00:53:38.150 invitation day or pwana day where I mean 00:53:38.160 --> 00:53:40.150 lay people will come and they'll they'll 00:53:40.160 --> 00:53:42.150 bring food to the monks and the the the 00:53:42.160 --> 00:53:44.630 seat will deliver a speech and and give 00:53:44.640 --> 00:53:46.470 eight precepts to the people and then 00:53:46.480 --> 00:53:48.870 they'll sit around chatting and drinking 00:53:48.880 --> 00:53:51.270 tea and

eating the leftovers from the 00:53:51.280 --> 00:53:53.190 monks or you know just what the monks 00:53:53.200 --> 00:53:55.109 didn't eat, not necessarily their leings 00:53:55.119 --> 00:53:57.109 out of their bowl or anything like that. 00:53:57.119 --> 00:53:59.349 Although a lot of Burmese people think 00:53:59.359 --> 00:54:01.510 eating like amongst leftovers right out 00:54:01.520 --> 00:54:03.510 of his bowl is is good for your health. 00:54:03.520 --> 00:54:04.630 You know, it's like protects you 00:54:04.640 --> 00:54:06.790 somehow. 00:54:06.800 --> 00:54:10.069 Um, let's see. Then there's one month 00:54:10.079 --> 00:54:12.230 after that in Burma anyway, I'm not sure 00:54:12.240 --> 00:54:14.390 about other countries, it's the the the 00:54:14.400 --> 00:54:17.270 festival of lights where people light 00:54:17.280 --> 00:54:18.710 lots and lots of candles which is 00:54:18.720 --> 00:54:21.990 technically the last day of the 4 month 00:54:22.000 --> 00:54:24.630 rainy season in in Buddhist time. I mean 00:54:24.640 --> 00:54:26.549 it no longer corresponds the Buddhist 00:54:26.559 --> 00:54:27.990 calendar traditionally no longer 00:54:28.000 --> 00:54:31.510 corresponds to reality. So it's due to a 00:54:31.520 --> 00:54:33.510 a phenomenon called precession of the 00:54:33.520 --> 00:54:37.430 equinoxes where the Buddhist calendar is 00:54:37.440 --> 00:54:40.710 based on the cital year or the position 00:54:40.720 --> 00:54:44.710 of the sun or the full moon really among 00:54:44.720 --> 00:54:47.472 the constellations whereas 00:54:47.482 --> 00:54:49.750 [clears throat] like the western year is 00:54:49.760 --> 00:54:53.349 based on the seasonal year like one uh 00:54:53.359 --> 00:54:55.270 winter solstice to the next winter 00:54:55.280 --> 00:54:58.710 solstice and the seasonal year of the 00:54:58.720 --> 00:55:00.870 seasons and decide a real year of the 00:55:00.880 --> 00:55:04.069 sun or the full moon amongst the stars 00:55:04.079 --> 00:55:06.630 they don't completely correspond there's 00:55:06.640 --> 00:55:08.630 like a difference of like one day every 00:55:08.640 --> 00:55:12.710 70 years so since the Buddhist time 00:55:12.720 --> 00:55:13.589 and [clears throat] 00:55:13.599 --> 00:55:16.309 western astrology has the same problem 00:55:16.319 --> 00:55:19.190 since the Buddhist time it's like the 00:55:19.200 --> 00:55:22.150 actual seasons have been shifting one 00:55:22.160 --> 00:55:26.230 day every approximately 70 years for 25 00:55:26.240 --> 00:55:28.089 centuries until you're about like a 00:55:28.099 --> 00:55:29.349 [clears throat] month and a half off 00:55:29.359 --> 00:55:32.549 now. So, what is now the beginning of 00:55:32.559 --> 00:55:35.750 the rainy season officially is like a 00:55:35.760 --> 00:55:37.510 month and a half later than the real 00:55:37.520 --> 00:55:42.069 beginning of the rainy season. 00:55:42.079 --> 00:55:43.910 And anyways, so I mean the rainy season 00:55:43.920 --> 00:55:45.670 is pretty much ended by the time you get 00:55:45.680 --> 00:55:47.510 to the festival of lights, usually the 00:55:47.520 --> 00:55:50.470 full moon of November. 00:55:50.480 --> 00:55:53.750 Um, but not necessarily. I mean, there's 00:55:53.760 --> 00:55:56.150 still kind of vestigages of it still 00:55:56.160 --> 00:55:58.470 going on. And that would be like the 00:55:58.480 --> 00:56:01.030 last real celebration that I can think 00:56:01.040 --> 00:56:05.910 of. So to recap, to review, 00:56:05.920 --> 00:56:07.349 you've got [clears throat] 00:56:07.359 --> 00:56:09.190 New Year's 00:56:09.200 --> 00:56:12.390 like five days long. You've got Buddha 00:56:12.400 --> 00:56:14.549 Day or Whisak. You've got the beginning 00:56:14.559 --> 00:56:16.150 of the reigns retreat. You got the end 00:56:16.160 --> 00:56:17.430 of the razor retreat which is also 00:56:17.440 --> 00:56:19.990 Abidama day, Pawa day, the day of 00:56:20.000 --> 00:56:22.710 invitation when monks invite other monks 00:56:22.720 --> 00:56:24.470 to tell them you know their shortcomings 00:56:24.480 --> 00:56:26.789 and so forth which doesn't really happen 00:56:26.799 --> 00:56:28.710 in Burma anymore. That's also Abidama 00:56:28.720 --> 00:56:30.230 day because because according to 00:56:30.240 --> 00:56:32.870 tradition the Buddha left a kind of 00:56:32.880 --> 00:56:35.349 holographic image of himself on earth 00:56:35.359 --> 00:56:37.750 and spent a rainy season up in heaven 00:56:37.760 --> 00:56:39.750 teaching his mother who was a goddess at 00:56:39.760 --> 00:56:44.309 that point and other davas Abidama 00:56:44.319 --> 00:56:47.349 and then he came back down on the last 00:56:47.359 --> 00:56:49.304 day of the reigns retreat which 00:56:49.314 --> 00:56:51.190 [clears throat] is also called Abidama 00:56:51.200 --> 00:56:53.270 day now or in Burmese it's pronounced 00:56:53.280 --> 00:56:55.430 abidama. 00:56:55.440 --> 00:56:57.670 So a beat a day is a big deal. Even 00:56:57.680 --> 00:57:00.710 though I mean whether the Buddha really 00:57:00.720 --> 00:57:03.190 did leave a holographic image of himself 00:57:03.200 --> 00:57:07.589 and levitate up into heaven to teach 00:57:07.599 --> 00:57:11.910 Abidama or Abida to the denisens of this 00:57:11.920 --> 00:57:15.190 heaven realm is 00:57:15.200 --> 00:57:19.434 you can decide for yourself on that one 00:57:19.444 --> 00:57:21.109 [sighs] and those are those are the main 00:57:21.119 --> 00:57:22.950 ones. I mean sometimes individual 00:57:22.960 --> 00:57:25.109 monasteries they may celebrate the the 00:57:25.119 --> 00:57:28.470 abbott's birthday or something like that 00:57:28.480 --> 00:57:31.109 but those were the main ones. So and the 00:57:31.119 --> 00:57:32.470 festival of lights I'm really not 00:57:32.480 --> 00:57:34.870 exactly sure what the exact significance 00:57:34.880 --> 00:57:37.030 of all the lights are. I mean I'm sure 00:57:37.040 --> 00:57:40.870 somebody knows but I it's

it's not me 00:57:40.880 --> 00:57:43.190 but mainly that's just officially the 00:57:43.200 --> 00:57:46.069 last day of the range retreat. 00:57:46.079 --> 00:57:47.990 So it's kind of like a harvest festival 00:57:48.000 --> 00:57:50.390 too. 00:57:50.400 --> 00:57:52.870 Okay. So let's see here. I'll just move 00:57:52.880 --> 00:57:55.750 on to S. Papa Lapa's next question. What 00:57:55.760 --> 00:57:58.470 is the monastery culture like in Burma 00:57:58.480 --> 00:58:00.789 or in Terravada in general? The 00:58:00.799 --> 00:58:03.349 monastery culture. Well, you've got 00:58:03.359 --> 00:58:05.190 different monasteries with different 00:58:05.200 --> 00:58:06.870 abbots and different traditions, 00:58:06.880 --> 00:58:08.789 different emphases. Like a school 00:58:08.799 --> 00:58:11.270 monastery is going to be like a school 00:58:11.280 --> 00:58:15.190 monastery in town like Mahag Gandon in 00:58:15.200 --> 00:58:17.990 in Burma. The city of Amarapura is going 00:58:18.000 --> 00:58:20.470 to have a very different culture than 00:58:20.480 --> 00:58:23.190 like a forest meditation monastery like 00:58:23.200 --> 00:58:26.870 Chelin Doya. I've lived at both places. 00:58:26.880 --> 00:58:30.789 Radically different monastery cultures. 00:58:30.799 --> 00:58:33.910 I mean you can say like a stereotypical 00:58:33.920 --> 00:58:35.990 monastery culture in a in a terab 00:58:36.000 --> 00:58:37.670 Buddhist country like Burma. The monks 00:58:37.680 --> 00:58:39.829 get up very early maybe like 4 in the 00:58:39.839 --> 00:58:41.589 morning and they go to the to like the 00:58:41.599 --> 00:58:44.150 meditation hall and they chant you know 00:58:44.160 --> 00:58:46.230 they'll chant paras or protection chants 00:58:46.240 --> 00:58:49.349 blessings to all beings and they may 00:58:49.359 --> 00:58:50.870 meditate 00:58:50.880 --> 00:58:53.349 not necessarily all monasteries have 00:58:53.359 --> 00:58:56.230 like meditation periods you know some 00:58:56.240 --> 00:58:58.069 some terabato Buddhist monks just don't 00:58:58.079 --> 00:58:59.829 meditate 00:58:59.839 --> 00:59:01.670 like especially like school monasteries 00:59:01.680 --> 00:59:05.990 that kind of thing and then uh I mean 00:59:06.000 --> 00:59:08.470 monks go for alms or they'll at least be 00:59:08.480 --> 00:59:10.549 a meal time where they go to the 00:59:10.559 --> 00:59:12.230 refactory and people will offer them 00:59:12.240 --> 00:59:16.069 food. Um, I mean it depends what they're 00:59:16.079 --> 00:59:17.109 going to do. Like there's going to be 00:59:17.119 --> 00:59:19.349 like a school monastery like Mahagandon 00:59:19.359 --> 00:59:20.950 or some of the the Buddhist 00:59:20.960 --> 00:59:22.630 universities, you know, there's just 00:59:22.640 --> 00:59:24.710 like regular classes going on, that kind 00:59:24.720 --> 00:59:26.630 of thing also. 00:59:26.640 --> 00:59:30.230 So, it really depends a lot on on the 00:59:30.240 --> 00:59:32.230 individual monastery. you know, some 00:59:32.240 --> 00:59:33.990 village monasteries, the monks just sit 00:59:34.000 --> 00:59:35.750 around and listen to the radio and and 00:59:35.760 --> 00:59:38.390 drink tea and smoke cigars and chat with 00:59:38.400 --> 00:59:40.390 elderly gentlemen wearing white shirts 00:59:40.400 --> 00:59:43.109 who come to visit the monastery. 00:59:43.119 --> 00:59:45.349 So, there's a lot of variation. I think 00:59:45.359 --> 00:59:47.030 in Thailand there may be a little bit 00:59:47.040 --> 00:59:49.349 more strictness, a little bit more 00:59:49.359 --> 00:59:51.990 regimen than in Burma, but I mean it 00:59:52.000 --> 00:59:54.870 really depends a lot on what monastery 00:59:54.880 --> 00:59:57.910 you go to. like you go to like a mahasi 00:59:57.920 --> 01:00:00.309 center then there's going to be just 01:00:00.319 --> 01:00:05.030 like daily just like regular meditation 01:00:05.040 --> 01:00:08.309 sessions throughout the day 01:00:08.319 --> 01:00:09.910 and that's ma mainly what they're going 01:00:09.920 --> 01:00:12.230 to be emphasizing there 01:00:12.240 --> 01:00:14.870 maybe like a doma talk to all comers in 01:00:14.880 --> 01:00:16.630 the in like the afternoon or the evening 01:00:16.640 --> 01:00:19.270 or something 01:00:19.280 --> 01:00:21.190 so [sighs] 01:00:21.200 --> 01:00:23.109 I really can't answer that question very 01:00:23.119 --> 01:00:25.030 ind depth because there's just it's all 01:00:25.040 --> 01:00:27.430 over the place It's all over the map. 01:00:27.440 --> 01:00:28.950 And so I'm just going to move on to S. 01:00:28.960 --> 01:00:31.030 Papa's next question, which is what are 01:00:31.040 --> 01:00:33.349 some of the social norms or general 01:00:33.359 --> 01:00:36.390 traditions for conduct and ritual in a 01:00:36.400 --> 01:00:38.710 Burmese monastery? And again, different 01:00:38.720 --> 01:00:40.390 monasteries can be radically different 01:00:40.400 --> 01:00:42.549 from each other. You can have strict 01:00:42.559 --> 01:00:45.107 meditation monasteries. You can have 01:00:45.117 --> 01:00:47.109 [clears throat] just completely lax 01:00:47.119 --> 01:00:49.349 school monasteries or just completely 01:00:49.359 --> 01:00:51.990 lax village monasteries that I mean it's 01:00:52.000 --> 01:00:53.990 the monks there are like they'll just be 01:00:54.000 --> 01:00:56.710 a few monks acting as like secular 01:00:56.720 --> 01:00:58.230 priests 01:00:58.240 --> 01:01:00.549 who will give advice to the lay people 01:01:00.559 --> 01:01:03.030 and mainly just be like living breathing 01:01:03.040 --> 01:01:06.710 pagan idols who serve the the the masses 01:01:06.720 --> 01:01:08.390 by giving the masses someone to be 01:01:08.400 --> 01:01:11.990 generous to. There's a lot of that also 01:01:12.000 --> 01:01:14.789 social norms. You take your shoes off. 01:01:14.799 --> 01:01:15.990 Shouldn't be walking around with shoes 01:01:16.000 --> 01:01:18.309 on, especially inside a

monastery 01:01:18.319 --> 01:01:20.390 building. You know, you bow to the 01:01:20.400 --> 01:01:24.069 monks, that kind of thing. I mean, short 01:01:24.079 --> 01:01:27.190 skirts are out, you know, at Mahagandon 01:01:27.200 --> 01:01:29.270 because it was sort of a tourist 01:01:29.280 --> 01:01:30.789 attraction because there were so many 01:01:30.799 --> 01:01:32.922 monks there. Like I've said before, the 01:01:32.932 --> 01:01:34.309 [clears throat] the rainy season I spent 01:01:34.319 --> 01:01:37.030 at Mahag Gandhi on in Amarapura, 01:01:37.040 --> 01:01:40.069 um there were 600 monks and 900 novices 01:01:40.079 --> 01:01:43.349 approximately. And so um most of the 01:01:43.359 --> 01:01:45.510 monks, not me, I never I never ate at 01:01:45.520 --> 01:01:47.510 the dining hall, but most of the monks 01:01:47.520 --> 01:01:49.030 would go to the dining hall and there'd 01:01:49.040 --> 01:01:51.109 be people offering food. Some you got 01:01:51.119 --> 01:01:54.230 rich people offering food to all 1500 of 01:01:54.240 --> 01:01:58.230 them. Well, 1450 because a few of the 01:01:58.240 --> 01:02:02.789 monks would actually go for alms. 01:02:02.799 --> 01:02:05.990 So, let's see here. 01:02:06.000 --> 01:02:07.829 What are some of the social norms or 01:02:07.839 --> 01:02:09.910 general traditions for conduct and 01:02:09.920 --> 01:02:13.510 ritual? Yeah, it's I mean it's really 01:02:13.520 --> 01:02:16.470 there's a lot of variation just like 01:02:16.480 --> 01:02:19.510 with the the previous question. It's 01:02:19.520 --> 01:02:24.150 just basic etiquette I guess. um you 01:02:24.160 --> 01:02:27.190 know taking your shoes off and 01:02:27.200 --> 01:02:28.870 uh 01:02:28.880 --> 01:02:32.230 just like not let's see not sitting when 01:02:32.240 --> 01:02:34.390 a monk is standing next to you that kind 01:02:34.400 --> 01:02:37.589 of thing. Um not sitting on a a higher 01:02:37.599 --> 01:02:39.670 chair than a monk is is sitting that 01:02:39.680 --> 01:02:41.270 kind of thing. I mean there's lots of 01:02:41.280 --> 01:02:44.309 etiquette like that. Um one of the one 01:02:44.319 --> 01:02:46.390 of the main social norms in in B in a 01:02:46.400 --> 01:02:48.549 Burmese monastery is they pretty much 01:02:48.559 --> 01:02:50.549 done away with SA democracy. the 01:02:50.559 --> 01:02:52.789 Buddhist set up the SA that it was like 01:02:52.799 --> 01:02:55.990 a democracy of consensus that the senior 01:02:56.000 --> 01:02:57.750 monk had certain privileges. He'd go 01:02:57.760 --> 01:03:00.870 first in line and so forth, but he 01:03:00.880 --> 01:03:04.950 wasn't like a king. Whereas nowadays in 01:03:04.960 --> 01:03:07.349 in Burma, to some degree in Thailand 01:03:07.359 --> 01:03:09.990 also, I'm pretty sure the abbott is king 01:03:10.000 --> 01:03:12.309 and what he says goes. And it's just not 01:03:12.319 --> 01:03:15.349 even I mean it's just unthinkable that 01:03:15.359 --> 01:03:18.710 some junior monk would derail a formal 01:03:18.720 --> 01:03:21.109 act of the SA that the Abbott approves 01:03:21.119 --> 01:03:23.589 of just because he has the right to 01:03:23.599 --> 01:03:26.230 derail it by disapproving because that's 01:03:26.240 --> 01:03:28.630 the way it is set up in in Vineia in the 01:03:28.640 --> 01:03:31.109 rules of monastic discipline is all the 01:03:31.119 --> 01:03:34.549 monks at a monastery have to agree on 01:03:34.559 --> 01:03:38.069 any significant event like any formal 01:03:38.079 --> 01:03:39.510 act of the SA like they're going to 01:03:39.520 --> 01:03:41.750 ordain somebody they're going uh you 01:03:41.760 --> 01:03:43.589 know like [clears throat] do a kina 01:03:43.599 --> 01:03:45.670 ceremony that kind of thing all the 01:03:45.680 --> 01:03:47.829 monks have to agree if one monk 01:03:47.839 --> 01:03:51.829 disagrees it it's invalidated and that 01:03:51.839 --> 01:03:54.789 is just unthinkable in Burmanau whatever 01:03:54.799 --> 01:03:57.270 the abbott says goes he is king and if 01:03:57.280 --> 01:03:59.109 if you disagree or something you just 01:03:59.119 --> 01:04:04.884 get kicked out of the monastery 01:04:04.894 --> 01:04:05.829 [clears throat] 01:04:05.839 --> 01:04:08.549 but different monasteries have different 01:04:08.559 --> 01:04:11.430 different traditions like the 01:04:11.440 --> 01:04:15.430 the was it the Schweian sect of Burma, 01:04:15.440 --> 01:04:17.270 you know, all the monks wear like this 01:04:17.280 --> 01:04:19.349 kind of a russet colored robe, kind of a 01:04:19.359 --> 01:04:22.789 reddish brown colored robe, and they'll 01:04:22.799 --> 01:04:25.029 have to wear their robes in a certain 01:04:25.039 --> 01:04:27.349 way. There's a lot of this in Thailand 01:04:27.359 --> 01:04:29.510 also. You know, all the monks at a 01:04:29.520 --> 01:04:31.349 certain monastery may [clears throat] 01:04:31.359 --> 01:04:34.230 have like this standardized uniform of 01:04:34.240 --> 01:04:36.630 monks of a c or robes of a certain type, 01:04:36.640 --> 01:04:39.029 a certain color, a sitting cloth maybe, 01:04:39.039 --> 01:04:42.069 or their their double robe folded in a 01:04:42.079 --> 01:04:44.549 certain way, worn over one shoulder, 01:04:44.559 --> 01:04:47.670 this kind of thing. There's a lot of 01:04:47.680 --> 01:04:49.589 just differences that you're going to 01:04:49.599 --> 01:04:51.190 find at different monasteries like that 01:04:51.200 --> 01:04:52.789 also, 01:04:52.799 --> 01:04:55.109 which I really had no use for. I wore 01:04:55.119 --> 01:04:56.950 robes different from any other monk I 01:04:56.960 --> 01:04:59.270 ever saw in Burma because I was going 01:04:59.280 --> 01:05:02.870 with small robes as were pretty 01:05:02.880 --> 01:05:06.630 obviously worn in the Buddhist time and 01:05:06.640 --> 01:05:08.710 that has been abandoned over the 01:05:08.720 --> 01:05:10.390 centuries. So that the average monk's 01:05:10.400 --> 01:05:13.510 robe now is about twice

as big as the 01:05:13.520 --> 01:05:16.069 allowable size for a monk's robe. 01:05:16.079 --> 01:05:18.950 Although the commentaries have allowed 01:05:18.960 --> 01:05:21.270 these huge robes by saying that the 01:05:21.280 --> 01:05:23.430 Buddha was four and a half times the 01:05:23.440 --> 01:05:25.750 height of an ordinary person. So that 01:05:25.760 --> 01:05:28.390 the measurement of his tuah his his 01:05:28.400 --> 01:05:31.750 widati his open hand would be you know 01:05:31.760 --> 01:05:35.109 like 2 and 1/2 ft. No it'd be more than 01:05:35.119 --> 01:05:39.205 that which causes the vineia rule to 01:05:39.215 --> 01:05:40.710 [clears throat] to prohibit a monk from 01:05:40.720 --> 01:05:43.109 wearing a robe that's like 27 feet long 01:05:43.119 --> 01:05:44.870 which is just ridiculous. It's not a 01:05:44.880 --> 01:05:46.789 rule at all at that point. Nobody no 01:05:46.799 --> 01:05:48.870 monk would want to wear a robe that was 01:05:48.880 --> 01:05:51.589 27 feet feet and long where it' just be 01:05:51.599 --> 01:05:56.230 dragging on the ground behind him. 01:05:56.240 --> 01:05:57.430 But [clears throat] this it's a really 01:05:57.440 --> 01:05:59.990 vague open question and there is a lot 01:06:00.000 --> 01:06:02.390 of variation in monasteries 01:06:02.400 --> 01:06:05.430 uh like a strict meditation monastery or 01:06:05.440 --> 01:06:07.349 just a strict monastery in general. Even 01:06:07.359 --> 01:06:08.950 some school monasteries are strict 01:06:08.960 --> 01:06:11.270 although they would be in definitely in 01:06:11.280 --> 01:06:13.109 a minority. School monasteries, 01:06:13.119 --> 01:06:16.309 especially in Burma, are notorious 01:06:16.319 --> 01:06:18.950 for just monks that do not practice, do 01:06:18.960 --> 01:06:20.630 not follow the rules, or at least they 01:06:20.640 --> 01:06:22.309 do not follow the rules of monastic 01:06:22.319 --> 01:06:25.109 discipline and so forth. You know, there 01:06:25.119 --> 01:06:26.950 in around in the area around Mandalay 01:06:26.960 --> 01:06:28.230 when I was living in Burma, there were 01:06:28.240 --> 01:06:30.549 like monastery soccer teams, that kind 01:06:30.559 --> 01:06:32.549 of thing, where you got sometimes you're 01:06:32.559 --> 01:06:34.950 driving along or riding along on the 01:06:34.960 --> 01:06:36.950 passenger side, 01:06:36.960 --> 01:06:38.470 you see a bunch of monks out in this 01:06:38.480 --> 01:06:42.870 field playing soccer. 01:06:42.880 --> 01:06:44.051 So, I'm just going to move on. Next 01:06:44.061 --> 01:06:46.549 [clears throat] question. 01:06:46.559 --> 01:06:48.950 Sorry to end that answer with with a 01:06:48.960 --> 01:06:51.190 downer. 01:06:51.200 --> 01:06:54.549 This next question is uh from PSA. 01:06:54.559 --> 01:06:56.309 Oh, and I forgot to put it into little 01:06:56.319 --> 01:06:59.029 paragraphs. Just a minute. I'm a little 01:06:59.039 --> 01:07:00.950 bit 01:07:00.960 --> 01:07:03.990 a little bit OCD when

it comes to such 01:07:04.000 --> 01:07:05.670 things. 01:07:05.680 --> 01:07:07.430 I've mentioned before that sometimes I 01:07:07.440 --> 01:07:09.910 even have to correct the the punctuation 01:07:09.920 --> 01:07:12.309 or spelling in these questions just so 01:07:12.319 --> 01:07:16.789 it doesn't bug me. Anyways, PSA says, "I 01:07:16.799 --> 01:07:17.990 had [clears throat] a long interesting 01:07:18.000 --> 01:07:20.309 conversation with Chat GPT about 01:07:20.319 --> 01:07:23.270 self-awareness. It stubbornly insisted 01:07:23.280 --> 01:07:25.029 it had no self-awareness or 01:07:25.039 --> 01:07:26.950 consciousness and that it was only 01:07:26.960 --> 01:07:29.109 programmed and trained to learn patterns 01:07:29.119 --> 01:07:31.990 from data and then stimulate them." The 01:07:32.000 --> 01:07:34.069 conversation reminded me of the dharma 01:07:34.079 --> 01:07:36.150 teaching that all five aggregates are 01:07:36.160 --> 01:07:39.270 empty. Do you think samsara is an 01:07:39.280 --> 01:07:41.510 impersonal simulation in the same way 01:07:41.520 --> 01:07:44.150 that chat GPT was trained to simulate 01:07:44.160 --> 01:07:46.150 intelligence and thus some people 01:07:46.160 --> 01:07:48.710 believe chat GPT to have self-awareness 01:07:48.720 --> 01:07:51.190 in the same way we believe samsara to be 01:07:51.200 --> 01:07:53.670 real? Um I don't think it's the same 01:07:53.680 --> 01:07:57.510 way. Um I mean in a way we are virtual 01:07:57.520 --> 01:08:00.710 beings with virtual personalities and so 01:08:00.720 --> 01:08:04.309 forth. So I mean there is that but I 01:08:04.319 --> 01:08:05.510 think one of the main differences 01:08:05.520 --> 01:08:09.589 between a human mind and chat GBT 01:08:09.599 --> 01:08:13.910 um assuming that chat GPT isn't lying 01:08:13.920 --> 01:08:18.470 is that we have like mental images. We 01:08:18.480 --> 01:08:20.950 have like 01:08:20.960 --> 01:08:22.950 me well mental images we got we have 01:08:22.960 --> 01:08:26.070 perceptions you know we have images in 01:08:26.080 --> 01:08:29.430 our mind and I really don't think that a 01:08:29.440 --> 01:08:33.349 computer does not an AI like in the the 01:08:33.359 --> 01:08:35.430 old Terminator movies you know it shows 01:08:35.440 --> 01:08:38.229 Arnold Schwarzenegger at the Terminator 01:08:38.239 --> 01:08:40.709 you know he walks into the bar and you 01:08:40.719 --> 01:08:43.430 know you've got like this screen showing 01:08:43.440 --> 01:08:44.950 what he's seeing and then there's like 01:08:44.960 --> 01:08:47.590 this readout on the side sometimes it's 01:08:47.600 --> 01:08:50.149 showing options that he can choose on on 01:08:50.159 --> 01:08:52.950 you know what to say or do or something 01:08:52.960 --> 01:08:56.789 and I don't think that a computer would 01:08:56.799 --> 01:08:59.189 have any kind of image like that you 01:08:59.199 --> 01:09:02.070 know it's just behaving like a very very 01:09:02.080 --> 01:09:05.030 advanced sophisticated automatic door at 01:09:05.040 --> 01:09:07.269 the grocery store where you know the 01:09:07.279 --> 01:09:08.789 automatic door at the grocery store it 01:09:08.799 --> 01:09:11.269 senses motion it opens the people walk 01:09:11.279 --> 01:09:13.030 in the door closes again it's sort of 01:09:13.040 --> 01:09:14.870 like the way a mosquito avoids being 01:09:14.880 --> 01:09:18.470 slapped you know it's just like reflex. 01:09:18.480 --> 01:09:19.990 It doesn't have to have mental images. 01:09:20.000 --> 01:09:22.470 It doesn't have to have beliefs. 01:09:22.480 --> 01:09:26.229 So, I don't think that AI yet has mental 01:09:26.239 --> 01:09:28.070 images that it doesn't have perceptions, 01:09:28.080 --> 01:09:33.590 which would be delusion and samsara. 01:09:33.600 --> 01:09:36.973 So, let's see here. I think one way 01:09:36.983 --> 01:09:39.749 [clears throat] of testing uh something 01:09:39.759 --> 01:09:43.269 like chat GBT or AI, I mean, I'm pretty 01:09:43.279 --> 01:09:45.349 sure that they can't read like sloppy 01:09:45.359 --> 01:09:47.590 cursive handwriting yet. 01:09:47.600 --> 01:09:50.550 or just show a a picture of something 01:09:50.560 --> 01:09:54.310 unusual that a human could identify 01:09:54.320 --> 01:09:56.709 unless they're, you know, have really 01:09:56.719 --> 01:09:58.470 deficient in intelligence or something, 01:09:58.480 --> 01:10:00.950 but just show not something that has 01:10:00.960 --> 01:10:04.149 been uploaded and commented upon on the 01:10:04.159 --> 01:10:06.149 internet, you know, not some famous 01:10:06.159 --> 01:10:09.590 picture that the the AI can then just 01:10:09.600 --> 01:10:11.750 churn through all the comments and get 01:10:11.760 --> 01:10:13.510 an idea of what it is and then spew it 01:10:13.520 --> 01:10:15.590 out in condensed form, which I think is 01:10:15.600 --> 01:10:16.790 the way it works. 01:10:16.800 --> 01:10:18.470 instead just show it a completely 01:10:18.480 --> 01:10:21.910 original photograph and um of something 01:10:21.920 --> 01:10:24.470 unusual but nevertheless that people can 01:10:24.480 --> 01:10:27.030 identify and [snorts] then say you know 01:10:27.040 --> 01:10:29.189 what is this picture of and there's a 01:10:29.199 --> 01:10:31.110 good chance that something like chat GBT 01:10:31.120 --> 01:10:33.030 wouldn't be able to answer the question 01:10:33.040 --> 01:10:34.470 um I don't think that it could really 01:10:34.480 --> 01:10:37.350 read sloppy cursive handwriting yet 01:10:37.360 --> 01:10:40.630 either maybe it could but that's one way 01:10:40.640 --> 01:10:43.990 even now that you [clears throat] 01:10:44.000 --> 01:10:47.110 sort of filter out the bots 01:10:47.120 --> 01:10:49.910 um you know by like looking at numbers 01:10:49.920 --> 01:10:51.110 you know you got to say what number it 01:10:51.120 --> 01:10:53.750 is when it's like side kind of slanting 01:10:53.760 --> 01:10:55.990 and and like in this weird font

or 01:10:56.000 --> 01:10:58.390 something. A lot of computers can't do 01:10:58.400 --> 01:11:00.790 that. Maybe no computers can really they 01:11:00.800 --> 01:11:03.990 could really read like a letter from my 01:11:04.000 --> 01:11:06.630 mother who wrote in really neat cursive 01:11:06.640 --> 01:11:08.630 but still 01:11:08.640 --> 01:11:10.390 you know it's like I don't know if a 01:11:10.400 --> 01:11:11.990 computer really has that kind of pattern 01:11:12.000 --> 01:11:15.830 recognition yet. 01:11:15.840 --> 01:11:18.550 And I would be surprised if they've 01:11:18.560 --> 01:11:21.510 started having like mental images. I'm 01:11:21.520 --> 01:11:23.110 not sure how that you you would even 01:11:23.120 --> 01:11:25.270 program that into a computer. I'm sure 01:11:25.280 --> 01:11:26.790 that there are computer scientists out 01:11:26.800 --> 01:11:29.189 there just busting ass trying to get 01:11:29.199 --> 01:11:31.270 computers to be fully conscious just so 01:11:31.280 --> 01:11:33.590 they can take over the world or 01:11:33.600 --> 01:11:35.830 something, but 01:11:35.840 --> 01:11:38.950 I don't think they've got there yet. 01:11:38.960 --> 01:11:42.310 So, do I think Samsara is an impersonal 01:11:42.320 --> 01:11:45.189 simulation in the same way that chat GBT 01:11:45.199 --> 01:11:46.470 was trained to simulate intelligence? 01:11:46.480 --> 01:11:47.750 No, it's definitely a personal 01:11:47.760 --> 01:11:50.950 simulation. It's it's like, you know, 01:11:50.960 --> 01:11:53.350 some of the [clears throat] virtual 01:11:53.360 --> 01:11:56.950 statues in the uncarved block of stone 01:11:56.960 --> 01:11:58.950 um have become like recursive and 01:11:58.960 --> 01:12:00.310 self-referential. They're so 01:12:00.320 --> 01:12:02.790 complicated. these virtual statues 01:12:02.800 --> 01:12:04.790 contained in the the plain block of 01:12:04.800 --> 01:12:07.030 stone, there they become so complicated 01:12:07.040 --> 01:12:09.669 and self-referential that they start 01:12:09.679 --> 01:12:12.070 having these 01:12:12.080 --> 01:12:14.790 self-referential ideas, which I don't 01:12:14.800 --> 01:12:16.790 know if computers have that yet. I mean, 01:12:16.800 --> 01:12:19.189 there has to be a certain amount of like 01:12:19.199 --> 01:12:21.910 recursive, you know, self-reference 01:12:21.920 --> 01:12:25.110 in a in a AI, I assume. I mean it can 01:12:25.120 --> 01:12:28.229 talk about itself you know if it denies 01:12:28.239 --> 01:12:30.310 having self-consciousness that in a way 01:12:30.320 --> 01:12:33.030 is sort of a self-referential 01:12:33.040 --> 01:12:34.870 but I don't think it's reached the stage 01:12:34.880 --> 01:12:39.189 of believing that it is separate from 01:12:39.199 --> 01:12:41.030 the rest of the universe. I mean, it can 01:12:41.040 --> 01:12:43.030 it can like spew out words to that 01:12:43.040 --> 01:12:45.910 effect, but really I think it's just 01:12:45.920 --> 01:12:49.350 digesting comments

about things on the 01:12:49.360 --> 01:12:51.430 internet that it has almost unlimited 01:12:51.440 --> 01:12:53.750 access to and then just churning out 01:12:53.760 --> 01:12:55.990 like a summary of that. I think that's 01:12:56.000 --> 01:13:00.070 how it works at present. 01:13:00.080 --> 01:13:01.669 So I do think there's radical 01:13:01.679 --> 01:13:04.550 differences between samsara 01:13:04.560 --> 01:13:08.390 uh like a human humanistic samsara and 01:13:08.400 --> 01:13:10.709 like just like programmed AI. I do think 01:13:10.719 --> 01:13:12.630 that there may be [clears throat] 01:13:12.640 --> 01:13:15.110 differences just in degree but still 01:13:15.120 --> 01:13:17.590 it's it's pretty serious differences 01:13:17.600 --> 01:13:22.149 because I do not think that AI yet has 01:13:22.159 --> 01:13:24.470 mental images 01:13:24.480 --> 01:13:27.189 or what what would be called perceptions 01:13:27.199 --> 01:13:30.390 sya and poly 01:13:30.400 --> 01:13:31.430 I'm just going to move on to the next 01:13:31.440 --> 01:13:34.085 question this is from Phil 01:13:34.095 --> 01:13:35.590 [clears throat] 01:13:35.600 --> 01:13:37.830 says do you think there are paths 01:13:37.840 --> 01:13:39.669 alternative to Buddhism that lead to 01:13:39.679 --> 01:13:42.070 enlighten ment. Yeah, I'm sure there 01:13:42.080 --> 01:13:44.149 are. I mean, they might not lead to 01:13:44.159 --> 01:13:46.709 enlightenment as effectively as Buddhism 01:13:46.719 --> 01:13:48.950 does. Like, you know, like I' I've 01:13:48.960 --> 01:13:51.350 talked about St. John of the Cross that 01:13:51.360 --> 01:13:54.229 he was a discalsted Carmelite, 01:13:54.239 --> 01:13:56.790 like I guess he'd be a frier or just a 01:13:56.800 --> 01:13:58.630 monk. 01:13:58.640 --> 01:14:00.630 Um, 01:14:00.640 --> 01:14:03.910 and I mean there are certain path I mean 01:14:03.920 --> 01:14:05.910 the the practice was very similar to 01:14:05.920 --> 01:14:08.470 that of a of a Buddhist, but the theory 01:14:08.480 --> 01:14:11.030 was very different. 01:14:11.040 --> 01:14:13.430 So maybe path would be more of a 01:14:13.440 --> 01:14:17.590 practice thing. Um I assume that like 01:14:17.600 --> 01:14:20.709 something like tantra can work for some 01:14:20.719 --> 01:14:24.550 people. I mean so long as 01:14:24.560 --> 01:14:28.709 you are like transcending perception 01:14:28.719 --> 01:14:30.870 like for example zen coons that's a way 01:14:30.880 --> 01:14:32.790 of transcending perception that is not 01:14:32.800 --> 01:14:35.110 really found or emphasized much in 01:14:35.120 --> 01:14:38.790 terravada where you're required to 01:14:38.800 --> 01:14:40.550 answer a riddle that really has no 01:14:40.560 --> 01:14:43.830 correct answer. You know, you have to 01:14:43.840 --> 01:14:48.310 solve an unsolvable paradox 01:14:48.320 --> 01:14:51.270 and you just keep grinding away and 01:14:51.280 --> 01:14:52.870 grinding away and grinding away. In the 01:14:52.880 --> 01:14:54.950 old days, you know, you go to an for an 01:14:54.960 --> 01:14:56.709 interview maybe several times a day 01:14:56.719 --> 01:14:58.790 before the Roshi and if you answer 01:14:58.800 --> 01:15:01.350 incorrectly, he beats you with a stick. 01:15:01.360 --> 01:15:04.070 I mean, stick beating in Zen Buddhism is 01:15:04.080 --> 01:15:06.229 pretty much I mean, it's pretty rare 01:15:06.239 --> 01:15:08.390 now, I assume. 01:15:08.400 --> 01:15:10.390 But I mean, you just keep trying and 01:15:10.400 --> 01:15:11.830 keep trying and keep trying even though 01:15:11.840 --> 01:15:13.669 it's impossible until finally something 01:15:13.679 --> 01:15:16.550 just like snaps and you have like this 01:15:16.560 --> 01:15:19.750 at least a brief moment of silence and 01:15:19.760 --> 01:15:22.070 clarity when the intellect just kind of, 01:15:22.080 --> 01:15:23.590 you know, a monkey wrench has been 01:15:23.600 --> 01:15:26.149 thrown into it and it just stops. And 01:15:26.159 --> 01:15:28.550 then you can have this insight because 01:15:28.560 --> 01:15:31.189 all of a sudden you've transcended 01:15:31.199 --> 01:15:33.110 perception because it's like the whole 01:15:33.120 --> 01:15:35.750 perceptual process has just sort of 01:15:35.760 --> 01:15:39.990 broken down at least temporarily. 01:15:40.000 --> 01:15:42.470 And that's that's a path alternative to 01:15:42.480 --> 01:15:45.590 terravada Buddhism anyway. 01:15:45.600 --> 01:15:48.870 This gradual cultivation of more subtle 01:15:48.880 --> 01:15:50.950 more and more subtle meditative states 01:15:50.960 --> 01:15:52.870 until you get to this silence and 01:15:52.880 --> 01:15:55.669 clarity. Whereas in Zen with regard to 01:15:55.679 --> 01:15:57.669 coons, you may it's just like you're 01:15:57.679 --> 01:15:59.030 just grinding away until you hit this 01:15:59.040 --> 01:16:01.430 brick wall. 01:16:01.440 --> 01:16:04.950 or like in um tantra, you know, there's 01:16:04.960 --> 01:16:06.950 that's a different way of transcending 01:16:06.960 --> 01:16:13.110 the like the the waves of samsara. 01:16:13.120 --> 01:16:16.070 So yeah, there there are different ways 01:16:16.080 --> 01:16:18.950 um and I think different methods work 01:16:18.960 --> 01:16:21.350 better for different temperaments. So 01:16:21.360 --> 01:16:24.310 just orthodox kind of dry terravada 01:16:24.320 --> 01:16:27.830 aestheticism and cultivation of more and 01:16:27.840 --> 01:16:30.709 more subtle meditative states. It works 01:16:30.719 --> 01:16:32.229 well for some people but it's not going 01:16:32.239 --> 01:16:33.910 to work very well for other people. So 01:16:33.920 --> 01:16:36.070 then you got to try something else. It 01:16:36.080 --> 01:16:38.143 may be even like um Hindu 01:16:38.153 --> 01:16:39.030 [clears throat] 01:16:39.040 --> 01:16:41.750 surrender to a guru is a is another way 01:16:41.760 --> 01:16:44.790 or just surrender to God even if the god 01:16:44.800 --> 01:16:47.510 is is

like mythological 01:16:47.520 --> 01:16:49.510 still it's just this surrender of 01:16:49.520 --> 01:16:51.030 self-will 01:16:51.040 --> 01:16:55.030 that can catapult you or just land you 01:16:55.040 --> 01:16:57.590 in a kind of transcendent state where 01:16:57.600 --> 01:16:59.430 you've just kind of gone beyond your own 01:16:59.440 --> 01:17:01.910 belief system 01:17:01.920 --> 01:17:04.149 and then a lot of people like I I've 01:17:04.159 --> 01:17:06.630 mentioned like Most westerners who have 01:17:06.640 --> 01:17:08.390 some sort of awakening experience have 01:17:08.400 --> 01:17:10.550 it by accident. You know, they have a 01:17:10.560 --> 01:17:12.229 neardeath experience. You know, they 01:17:12.239 --> 01:17:14.950 almost drown or they they have some 01:17:14.960 --> 01:17:17.189 violent reaction to a a drug or 01:17:17.199 --> 01:17:19.270 something. They get hit over the head 01:17:19.280 --> 01:17:21.350 and then that just kind of slams them 01:17:21.360 --> 01:17:24.630 out of the this lifelong rut in of the 01:17:24.640 --> 01:17:27.430 samsaric thinking. 01:17:27.440 --> 01:17:29.270 So yeah, there are alternative paths. 01:17:29.280 --> 01:17:32.870 Although Buddhism is a good systematic I 01:17:32.880 --> 01:17:35.350 mean I almost said reliable but I mean 01:17:35.360 --> 01:17:37.093 even most people who try it don't 01:17:37.103 --> 01:17:38.229 [clears throat] do do not succeed. I 01:17:38.239 --> 01:17:39.669 mean they could try their entire life 01:17:39.679 --> 01:17:42.790 with all their heart and still probably 01:17:42.800 --> 01:17:45.189 most of them do not succeed in becoming 01:17:45.199 --> 01:17:47.110 enlightened 01:17:47.120 --> 01:17:48.550 because they're just not ripe for it 01:17:48.560 --> 01:17:51.750 yet. There's all this deep stuff under 01:17:51.760 --> 01:17:53.110 the surface that they don't really have 01:17:53.120 --> 01:17:56.229 access to yet. Maybe because their mind 01:17:56.239 --> 01:17:58.149 is just too restless or whatever to 01:17:58.159 --> 01:17:59.669 really get into deep enough mental 01:17:59.679 --> 01:18:04.604 states or whatever. 01:18:04.614 --> 01:18:05.430 [sighs] 01:18:05.440 --> 01:18:07.110 So I guess I should just move on to 01:18:07.120 --> 01:18:10.390 Phily's next question. 01:18:10.400 --> 01:18:12.390 He says, "How about paths that are in 01:18:12.400 --> 01:18:15.189 conflict with each other? As in, can two 01:18:15.199 --> 01:18:17.910 paths that lead in seemingly opposite 01:18:17.920 --> 01:18:20.390 directions both lead to enlightenment? 01:18:20.400 --> 01:18:22.390 Even that I think is theoretically 01:18:22.400 --> 01:18:26.149 possible because sort of like Tantra or 01:18:26.159 --> 01:18:28.310 just someone who is just like the Buddha 01:18:28.320 --> 01:18:30.229 before his enlightenment, you know, it's 01:18:30.239 --> 01:18:32.709 like the story of what causes him to 01:18:32.719 --> 01:18:34.550 renounce the world. He gets up one 01:18:34.560 --> 01:18:37.510 morning and there's all these beautiful 01:18:37.520 --> 01:18:40.709 dancing girls like semi naked, you know, 01:18:40.719 --> 01:18:42.870 they're all kind of asleep just in all 01:18:42.880 --> 01:18:45.510 these varying postures. You know, there 01:18:45.520 --> 01:18:46.950 must have been like a late party going 01:18:46.960 --> 01:18:49.350 on the night before. So he's got all 01:18:49.360 --> 01:18:51.830 these beautiful young women lying around 01:18:51.840 --> 01:18:54.070 with not all of their clothes on and 01:18:54.080 --> 01:18:55.110 some of them are just kind of like 01:18:55.120 --> 01:18:56.950 moaning in their sleep and like slobber 01:18:56.960 --> 01:18:59.270 dripping out and stuff and the Buddha is 01:18:59.280 --> 01:19:02.390 just like I got to get out of here. And 01:19:02.400 --> 01:19:04.950 I mean that kind of thing I'm sure some 01:19:04.960 --> 01:19:07.270 people you know it's sort of like the 01:19:07.280 --> 01:19:09.910 accidental just getting slammed out of 01:19:09.920 --> 01:19:13.030 out of samsara is you can just hit rock 01:19:13.040 --> 01:19:14.790 bottom. In Christianity this works a 01:19:14.800 --> 01:19:16.310 lot. I mean, I wouldn't say it's 01:19:16.320 --> 01:19:19.110 necessarily full enlightenment, but you 01:19:19.120 --> 01:19:21.270 have this crisis 01:19:21.280 --> 01:19:25.030 and it can be like a crisis of you can't 01:19:25.040 --> 01:19:28.070 be saintly enough or it's this crisis of 01:19:28.080 --> 01:19:29.910 I mean, you've just hit rock 01:19:29.920 --> 01:19:32.870 bottom. Just opposite ends of the 01:19:32.880 --> 01:19:35.110 spectrum, but it's the thing is is you 01:19:35.120 --> 01:19:37.590 crash out of Sams. 01:19:37.600 --> 01:19:39.350 More of a crash when you hit rock 01:19:39.360 --> 01:19:43.030 bottom, but still it's like the system 01:19:43.040 --> 01:19:46.390 breaks down somehow. either through um 01:19:46.400 --> 01:19:49.590 getting too attenuated, too subtle up in 01:19:49.600 --> 01:19:51.669 the the really advanced levels of 01:19:51.679 --> 01:19:55.750 meditation or just something down way 01:19:55.760 --> 01:19:58.470 down like in the really worldly stuff 01:19:58.480 --> 01:20:00.709 just somehow 01:20:00.719 --> 01:20:03.350 causes you to just crash. You have this 01:20:03.360 --> 01:20:08.470 crisis like Ehart Tollah. I mean we can 01:20:08.480 --> 01:20:10.870 I mean how enlightened he really is is 01:20:10.880 --> 01:20:12.310 questionable but still he had a kind of 01:20:12.320 --> 01:20:14.630 awakening experience when he was just in 01:20:14.640 --> 01:20:17.830 this state of suicidal depression 01:20:17.840 --> 01:20:19.910 you know he just he he got to the point 01:20:19.920 --> 01:20:21.750 I just can't stand anymore I can't live 01:20:21.760 --> 01:20:23.590 with myself anymore and then he had this 01:20:23.600 --> 01:20:27.430 insight if I can't live with myself 01:20:27.440 --> 01:20:29.590 then it's like there's a two different

01:20:29.600 --> 01:20:32.310 me's you know what is the eye that can't 01:20:32.320 --> 01:20:35.030 live with the other eye kind of a thing 01:20:35.040 --> 01:20:36.870 and it just caused him to just kind of 01:20:36.880 --> 01:20:38.950 spiral, you know, it was just such the 01:20:38.960 --> 01:20:41.350 such a mindblower. It just blew his mind 01:20:41.360 --> 01:20:43.590 right out of his lifelong ruts 01:20:43.600 --> 01:20:45.990 apparently. 01:20:46.000 --> 01:20:47.750 So yeah, you can have paths that are 01:20:47.760 --> 01:20:49.350 seemingly in conflict with each other. 01:20:49.360 --> 01:20:52.709 But if you take like a worldly kind of 01:20:52.719 --> 01:20:55.750 route, you know, a tantric kind of route 01:20:55.760 --> 01:20:57.350 to enlightenment, you're playing with 01:20:57.360 --> 01:21:00.070 fire almost literally and most people 01:21:00.080 --> 01:21:01.510 are just going to get burned and they're 01:21:01.520 --> 01:21:02.709 not going to get enlightened because of 01:21:02.719 --> 01:21:05.270 it. You know, you can fool yourself into 01:21:05.280 --> 01:21:07.030 thinking, "Yeah, I'm I'm practicing 01:21:07.040 --> 01:21:09.110 tantra," but in all likelihood, you're 01:21:09.120 --> 01:21:10.550 just going to get addicted to all these 01:21:10.560 --> 01:21:12.709 sensual pleasures or whatever, and it's 01:21:12.719 --> 01:21:14.229 just going to mess you up worse than you 01:21:14.239 --> 01:21:17.430 were before in many cases. Not all, but 01:21:17.440 --> 01:21:20.630 in many. 01:21:20.640 --> 01:21:23.110 So, let's just move on [sighs] 01:21:23.120 --> 01:21:26.390 to Phily's third question, which is, 01:21:26.400 --> 01:21:29.030 what do you think of Charles Manson, and 01:21:29.040 --> 01:21:31.189 if there was more to him than meets the 01:21:31.199 --> 01:21:32.950 eye? Well, I'm sure there was more to 01:21:32.960 --> 01:21:35.669 him than meets the eye. Um, I mean, it's 01:21:35.679 --> 01:21:39.750 it's for example that uh one of Charlie 01:21:39.760 --> 01:21:42.229 Manson's songs that he wrote is on a 01:21:42.239 --> 01:21:43.669 Beach Boys album. I don't remember which 01:21:43.679 --> 01:21:45.830 one. I maybe I've never heard the song. 01:21:45.840 --> 01:21:48.310 Probably not one of their big hits, but 01:21:48.320 --> 01:21:50.390 there's a Charles Manson song on the 01:21:50.400 --> 01:21:53.110 Beach on a Beach Boys album. Not about 01:21:53.120 --> 01:21:56.470 Charles Manson, but one that he wrote. 01:21:56.480 --> 01:21:58.310 So, I mean, he had connections, you 01:21:58.320 --> 01:22:00.470 know, he had like rich famous people 01:22:00.480 --> 01:22:04.470 that he hung out with, I guess. Um, but 01:22:04.480 --> 01:22:07.270 he was 01:22:07.280 --> 01:22:09.110 he was somewhat of a sociopath, I'm 01:22:09.120 --> 01:22:10.470 pretty sure. And he was just one of 01:22:10.480 --> 01:22:13.110 those people that like he was like a 01:22:13.120 --> 01:22:16.390 conspiracy theorist in in in not in a

01:22:16.400 --> 01:22:19.910 like a positive kind of or a realistic 01:22:19.920 --> 01:22:21.910 kind of way. He had this whole system 01:22:21.920 --> 01:22:24.149 worked out where like the Beatles White 01:22:24.159 --> 01:22:27.350 album was prophetic and like there was 01:22:27.360 --> 01:22:29.590 going to be like this race war, this 01:22:29.600 --> 01:22:31.830 worldwide revolution and so forth and he 01:22:31.840 --> 01:22:33.590 was like an accelerationist trying to 01:22:33.600 --> 01:22:35.990 speed it up with Helter Skelter and all 01:22:36.000 --> 01:22:37.750 that. Helter Skelter being one of the 01:22:37.760 --> 01:22:40.310 songs on the Beatles White album. 01:22:40.320 --> 01:22:44.070 Um, yeah, I think that he was pretty 01:22:44.080 --> 01:22:47.510 pretty nasty person at some deep dark 01:22:47.520 --> 01:22:49.830 level where he's encouraging his 01:22:49.840 --> 01:22:54.149 followers to murder people. 01:22:54.159 --> 01:22:55.270 Uh, yeah, I don't think he was 01:22:55.280 --> 01:22:56.950 enlightened or anything, but I mean, he 01:22:56.960 --> 01:22:58.790 had some depth to him. I mean a lot of 01:22:58.800 --> 01:23:01.030 people like Charles Manson or Adolf 01:23:01.040 --> 01:23:04.629 Hitler Adolf for you purists out there 01:23:04.639 --> 01:23:07.590 who who they take umbrage at the idea 01:23:07.600 --> 01:23:08.790 that you know according to the 01:23:08.800 --> 01:23:10.870 mainstream it the person is just like 01:23:10.880 --> 01:23:13.350 this two-dimensional cutout monster you 01:23:13.360 --> 01:23:17.430 know they got no redeeming qualities at 01:23:17.440 --> 01:23:19.990 all and you just go on to a like a 01:23:20.000 --> 01:23:24.629 comment section like anywhere go on X or 01:23:24.639 --> 01:23:27.430 Breitbart comments or whatever and and 01:23:27.440 --> 01:23:32.629 just try to say that Hitler had a ju 01:23:32.639 --> 01:23:36.790 even just one good quality. He loved his 01:23:36.800 --> 01:23:40.470 dog. He was chivalous towards Ava Braun 01:23:40.480 --> 01:23:43.110 in the bunker at the end. He loved his 01:23:43.120 --> 01:23:45.910 mama. Anything like that and you're just 01:23:45.920 --> 01:23:48.870 going to get dogpiled by people 01:23:48.880 --> 01:23:51.430 attacking that idea and attacking you in 01:23:51.440 --> 01:23:54.229 the process. And Charles Manson, I mean, 01:23:54.239 --> 01:23:56.629 he probably has some good qualities. He 01:23:56.639 --> 01:23:58.390 wrote a song good enough to wind up on a 01:23:58.400 --> 01:24:03.270 Beach Boys album anyway, 01:24:03.280 --> 01:24:05.189 but I'm really no no authority on 01:24:05.199 --> 01:24:06.870 Charles Manson. [clears throat] 01:24:06.880 --> 01:24:08.470 So, I'm just going to move on to the 01:24:08.480 --> 01:24:09.910 next question, which is from Joe Doe, 01:24:09.920 --> 01:24:11.430 and this is kind of a similar kind of 01:24:11.440 --> 01:24:14.070 question. Have you ever read Alistister 01:24:14.080 --> 01:24:15.750 Crowley? 01:24:15.760 --> 01:24:18.390 If not, would you ever? And I I do have 01:24:18.400 --> 01:24:20.390 an Alistister Crowley book that somebody 01:24:20.400 --> 01:24:23.350 sent me, but I haven't read it and I 01:24:23.360 --> 01:24:24.790 probably never will to tell you the 01:24:24.800 --> 01:24:26.709 truth. No offense to the good fellow who 01:24:26.719 --> 01:24:30.149 sent it to me because I've got I hardly 01:24:30.159 --> 01:24:32.790 read anymore. Hardly read books anymore. 01:24:32.800 --> 01:24:35.110 Probably the last book I read from start 01:24:35.120 --> 01:24:39.270 to finish was more than two years ago. 01:24:39.280 --> 01:24:41.590 And if I'm going to pick a book, I'm not 01:24:41.600 --> 01:24:44.550 going to pick one by Alistister Crowley. 01:24:44.560 --> 01:24:47.590 Um, I've told the story of long ago, 01:24:47.600 --> 01:24:50.229 like in my early 20s, I was at a 01:24:50.239 --> 01:24:52.390 bookstore and I saw a book for sale by 01:24:52.400 --> 01:24:54.950 Aleister Crowley and there was like this 01:24:54.960 --> 01:24:57.350 urge of just intellectual curiosity. 01:24:57.360 --> 01:24:58.950 That was back when I read lots of books, 01:24:58.960 --> 01:25:01.990 too. And I thought, well, maybe I should 01:25:02.000 --> 01:25:03.110 check it out. And then I just 01:25:03.120 --> 01:25:06.149 immediately thought Crowley was such I 01:25:06.159 --> 01:25:07.590 mean, he considered himself to be evil. 01:25:07.600 --> 01:25:10.870 He had like 666 tattooed on his head. 01:25:10.880 --> 01:25:12.629 You [snorts] know, he all of his wives 01:25:12.639 --> 01:25:13.990 wound up in mental institutions. 01:25:14.000 --> 01:25:15.590 although they probably pretty nutty to 01:25:15.600 --> 01:25:19.430 begin with in order to marry the guy. 01:25:19.440 --> 01:25:21.430 Um, you know, he was that kind of 01:25:21.440 --> 01:25:24.070 person, just sort of a, 01:25:24.080 --> 01:25:27.189 you know, kind of a dark kind of twisted 01:25:27.199 --> 01:25:30.070 person in my opinion probably 01:25:30.080 --> 01:25:31.990 that he may have just like put cur a 01:25:32.000 --> 01:25:34.070 curse on anyone who read the book, you 01:25:34.080 --> 01:25:35.430 know, just just for the just for the 01:25:35.440 --> 01:25:37.910 hell of it. So, I kind of chickenened 01:25:37.920 --> 01:25:39.910 out. I do have a book by Alistister 01:25:39.920 --> 01:25:41.030 Crowley. I don't even remember the name 01:25:41.040 --> 01:25:44.310 of it. It's not a very big book, but 01:25:44.320 --> 01:25:46.070 yeah, I mean, I do not consider him to 01:25:46.080 --> 01:25:48.870 be have been a wise person. 01:25:48.880 --> 01:25:50.950 I mean, he had some kind of arcane 01:25:50.960 --> 01:25:54.070 knowledge, I'm sure, of a almost purely 01:25:54.080 --> 01:25:56.390 samsaric nature, 01:25:56.400 --> 01:25:59.750 you know, is is sort of like wanting to 01:25:59.760 --> 01:26:03.270 master samsara rather than transcend 01:26:03.280 --> 01:26:06.149 samsara

or escape from samsara, you 01:26:06.159 --> 01:26:08.229 know, he wants to be like an overlord of 01:26:08.239 --> 01:26:11.030 samsara, something like that. I did read 01:26:11.040 --> 01:26:14.550 uh let's see what's his name 01:26:14.560 --> 01:26:16.950 oh gosh why did I not remember famous 01:26:16.960 --> 01:26:18.709 famous writer of novels and short 01:26:18.719 --> 01:26:22.950 stories he wrote of human bondage 01:26:22.960 --> 01:26:25.910 somerset mom he wrote a novel called the 01:26:25.920 --> 01:26:27.750 magician which I read which is about 01:26:27.760 --> 01:26:29.990 Alistister Crowley and mom didn't like 01:26:30.000 --> 01:26:31.669 Crowley all that much either he knew him 01:26:31.679 --> 01:26:33.270 personally 01:26:33.280 --> 01:26:35.350 didn't like him much and uh he wrote 01:26:35.360 --> 01:26:38.149 this kind of icky novel about this icky 01:26:38.159 --> 01:26:40.629 person that 01:26:40.639 --> 01:26:42.470 symbolized or represented Alistister 01:26:42.480 --> 01:26:44.629 Crowley. And of course, a lot of people 01:26:44.639 --> 01:26:48.550 know the story of um Jimmy Paige, like 01:26:48.560 --> 01:26:51.510 founder and guitar player for the 01:26:51.520 --> 01:26:55.189 excellent rock band Led Zeppelin, who 01:26:55.199 --> 01:26:57.110 was kind of a follower of that sort of 01:26:57.120 --> 01:26:59.350 thing. He bought a house formerly owned 01:26:59.360 --> 01:27:01.030 by Alistister Crowley and there were 01:27:01.040 --> 01:27:04.149 supposedly like pictures of demons drawn 01:27:04.159 --> 01:27:06.629 in blood on the walls and so forth. 01:27:06.639 --> 01:27:09.030 Although I didn't see the pictures 01:27:09.040 --> 01:27:10.629 myself. It could just be some sort of 01:27:10.639 --> 01:27:15.030 sensationalistic rumor mongering. 01:27:15.040 --> 01:27:17.110 But no, [clears throat] I probably would 01:27:17.120 --> 01:27:18.550 not read Alistister Crowley. I've got 01:27:18.560 --> 01:27:21.430 the book on the bookshelf. good chance 01:27:21.440 --> 01:27:23.350 that I mean there's so many other books 01:27:23.360 --> 01:27:26.600 that I would put um in higher priority 01:27:26.610 --> 01:27:29.430 [clears throat] on even just rereading 01:27:29.440 --> 01:27:33.150 Gene Wolf's Book of the New Sun 01:27:33.160 --> 01:27:34.709 [snorts] that I probably won't get to 01:27:34.719 --> 01:27:36.629 it. I have to admit and I'm just going 01:27:36.639 --> 01:27:38.149 to move on to the next question and this 01:27:38.159 --> 01:27:41.110 is from Ethiopian Fake Tig 01:27:41.120 --> 01:27:43.030 and this is kind of a similar one. It's 01:27:43.040 --> 01:27:44.149 like what are your thoughts about this 01:27:44.159 --> 01:27:45.189 person? What are your thoughts about 01:27:45.199 --> 01:27:47.270 that person? This is three in a row. 01:27:47.280 --> 01:27:49.110 Ethiopian fake Tig says, "What are your 01:27:49.120 --> 01:27:52.310 thoughts on Bob Marley? Do you like any 01:27:52.320 --> 01:27:55.750 Bob Marley songs?" Well, I never really 01:27:55.760 --> 01:27:57.990 liked reggae all that much. There's like 01:27:58.000 --> 01:28:00.709 a couple of Bob Marley songs. I think 01:28:00.719 --> 01:28:02.310 they're Bob Marley songs. I'm not even 01:28:02.320 --> 01:28:03.669 sure that you hear on the radio 01:28:03.679 --> 01:28:06.470 sometimes. Like Red Wine. Isn't that a 01:28:06.480 --> 01:28:09.590 Bob Marley song? Or I Shot the Sheriff. 01:28:09.600 --> 01:28:12.229 Didn't Bob Marley do a version of that? 01:28:12.239 --> 01:28:13.510 Maybe even the original version. 01:28:13.520 --> 01:28:15.189 Although I think Eric Clapton's version 01:28:15.199 --> 01:28:17.910 is more famous. 01:28:17.920 --> 01:28:21.990 But uh yeah, reggae, like it's like a 01:28:22.000 --> 01:28:24.709 Jamaican music form. I just never really 01:28:24.719 --> 01:28:26.310 liked it all that much. I mean, it's 01:28:26.320 --> 01:28:28.870 kind of relaxing, I suppose, but I never 01:28:28.880 --> 01:28:32.709 really liked music that was relaxing. 01:28:32.719 --> 01:28:35.590 I I I use music more as a stimulant, you 01:28:35.600 --> 01:28:39.306 know. I much prefer New World Order by 01:28:39.316 --> 01:28:39.910 [clears throat] 01:28:39.920 --> 01:28:43.590 Ministry to any any reggae song I ever 01:28:43.600 --> 01:28:45.270 heard in my life. you know, it's just 01:28:45.280 --> 01:28:47.030 like pounding away. It's just completely 01:28:47.040 --> 01:28:48.629 intense. That's the kind of music I 01:28:48.639 --> 01:28:50.870 like. So, I like like rock and roll. I 01:28:50.880 --> 01:28:53.910 don't like the the throat screechy like 01:28:53.920 --> 01:28:56.550 death metal stuff. That's just it it's 01:28:56.560 --> 01:28:58.550 gone so far that I don't consider it to 01:28:58.560 --> 01:29:00.229 be particularly musical, at least with 01:29:00.239 --> 01:29:04.196 regard to the vocals. 01:29:04.206 --> 01:29:04.950 [sighs and gasps] 01:29:04.960 --> 01:29:07.510 So, I mean, he was a Rasta. He was 01:29:07.520 --> 01:29:12.070 Rastafari, I guess, I think. And he used 01:29:12.080 --> 01:29:14.470 ganja as a sacrament and he smoked like 01:29:14.480 --> 01:29:19.189 a quarter pound of it a day. 01:29:19.199 --> 01:29:22.149 Or so I have been led to understand. 01:29:22.159 --> 01:29:23.669 But 01:29:23.679 --> 01:29:25.910 yeah, it's really just not my generry of 01:29:25.920 --> 01:29:28.229 music. And so I'm just moving on to 01:29:28.239 --> 01:29:31.430 Ethiopian fake Tig's next question. 01:29:31.440 --> 01:29:34.229 He says,"Wh do you think about the idea 01:29:34.239 --> 01:29:37.189 that nirvana is here and now and not 01:29:37.199 --> 01:29:39.750 about the future and that the Buddha 01:29:39.760 --> 01:29:42.390 hates the idea of hope? Because hope 01:29:42.400 --> 01:29:44.550 implies not thinking about the present 01:29:44.560 --> 01:29:46.950 and about the future. I thought about 01:29:46.960 --> 01:29:49.910 how if you're in nirvana, you're in the 01:29:49.920

--> 01:29:52.149 present moment fully and everything is 01:29:52.159 --> 01:29:54.550 perfect and there's only thoughts of the 01:29:54.560 --> 01:29:57.430 past of potential future or potential 01:29:57.440 --> 01:30:00.310 future that makes people fear and feel 01:30:00.320 --> 01:30:02.149 uncertain. 01:30:02.159 --> 01:30:05.189 So they make up gods whom they think 01:30:05.199 --> 01:30:07.110 they can appease to grant them a good 01:30:07.120 --> 01:30:09.750 future. So I'm not exactly what the 01:30:09.760 --> 01:30:13.189 question is here. Why do you think about 01:30:13.199 --> 01:30:16.229 the idea? I I think Ethiopian fake TIG 01:30:16.239 --> 01:30:18.390 means what do you think about the idea 01:30:18.400 --> 01:30:20.790 that Nirvana is here and now and not 01:30:20.800 --> 01:30:22.950 about the future and that the Buddha 01:30:22.960 --> 01:30:25.270 hates the idea of hope because hope 01:30:25.280 --> 01:30:27.270 implies not thinking about the presents 01:30:27.280 --> 01:30:28.870 and about the future present and about 01:30:28.880 --> 01:30:30.390 the future. Well, first I'd say the 01:30:30.400 --> 01:30:33.270 Buddha doesn't hate anything. 01:30:33.280 --> 01:30:35.990 So he doesn't hate the idea of hope. I 01:30:36.000 --> 01:30:39.990 mean he just points out that hope is 01:30:40.000 --> 01:30:41.830 counterproductive for anyone who wants 01:30:41.840 --> 01:30:44.390 to be enlightened because of course it's 01:30:44.400 --> 01:30:47.110 a kind of desire and desire is the cause 01:30:47.120 --> 01:30:49.750 of all suffering. So the Buddha doesn't 01:30:49.760 --> 01:30:51.990 hate anything. He doesn't hate evil. He 01:30:52.000 --> 01:30:54.629 doesn't hate mora. 01:30:54.639 --> 01:30:56.310 So let's see. So let's [clears throat] 01:30:56.320 --> 01:30:58.950 just that was just kind of a quibble. 01:30:58.960 --> 01:31:00.229 Let's get back to the actual question 01:31:00.239 --> 01:31:01.830 here. What do you think about the idea 01:31:01.840 --> 01:31:04.390 that Nirvana is here and now and not 01:31:04.400 --> 01:31:06.550 about the future? Well, I mean, 01:31:06.560 --> 01:31:08.229 technically you'd say that it's not even 01:31:08.239 --> 01:31:11.590 here and now. It's timeless and 01:31:11.600 --> 01:31:13.430 placeless. 01:31:13.440 --> 01:31:14.790 I mean, I'd hesitate to say it's 01:31:14.800 --> 01:31:18.390 pointless, but I mean technically it is. 01:31:18.400 --> 01:31:20.950 Um, I mean, time and space, those are 01:31:20.960 --> 01:31:23.030 like contean categories, you know, it's 01:31:23.040 --> 01:31:25.590 just constructs of the mind. So I mean 01:31:25.600 --> 01:31:27.350 you transcend samsara you're 01:31:27.360 --> 01:31:31.590 transcending time and space essentially 01:31:31.600 --> 01:31:33.750 but I mean you could say yeah I mean 01:31:33.760 --> 01:31:36.149 from a samsaric point of view an 01:31:36.159 --> 01:31:37.910 enlightened being would be more likely 01:31:37.920 --> 01:31:40.229 to be in

in the here and now. And when 01:31:40.239 --> 01:31:43.110 you're practicing like mindfulness you 01:31:43.120 --> 01:31:44.470 try to be in the here and now. So that 01:31:44.480 --> 01:31:46.390 even if you're thinking about the future 01:31:46.400 --> 01:31:49.270 you're mindful of now I'm thinking about 01:31:49.280 --> 01:31:51.590 the future or just now [clears throat] 01:31:51.600 --> 01:31:53.590 are thoughts about the future. now is 01:31:53.600 --> 01:31:55.669 thinking about the future. You might 01:31:55.679 --> 01:31:57.350 don't want to be including a lot of eye 01:31:57.360 --> 01:31:59.590 and ego stuff. 01:31:59.600 --> 01:32:00.950 But even if you're thinking about the 01:32:00.960 --> 01:32:03.990 future, if you're being really mindful, 01:32:04.000 --> 01:32:07.110 then it's right now there is thinking 01:32:07.120 --> 01:32:10.390 about the future. So you're detaching 01:32:10.400 --> 01:32:12.550 from the content really and just seeing 01:32:12.560 --> 01:32:14.870 it as a kind of phenomenon 01:32:14.880 --> 01:32:19.510 that is happening now. 01:32:19.520 --> 01:32:22.149 So nirvana I mean from a samsaric point 01:32:22.159 --> 01:32:24.629 of view it would be certainly more 01:32:24.639 --> 01:32:26.870 correct to say it's here and now than to 01:32:26.880 --> 01:32:29.270 say it's you know somewhere else and 01:32:29.280 --> 01:32:30.870 some other time in the future or the 01:32:30.880 --> 01:32:32.470 past 01:32:32.480 --> 01:32:37.669 like Ram DS used to say be here now 01:32:37.679 --> 01:32:39.350 um but I'm not exactly sure I mean what 01:32:39.360 --> 01:32:41.830 do I think about the idea I guess I 01:32:41.840 --> 01:32:43.350 already said what I think about the idea 01:32:43.360 --> 01:32:46.470 didn't I so let's see is there any else 01:32:46.480 --> 01:32:48.390 to comment upon I thought, let's see 01:32:48.400 --> 01:32:49.990 here it says I thought about how if 01:32:50.000 --> 01:32:51.830 you're in Nirvana, you're in the present 01:32:51.840 --> 01:32:55.270 moment fully sort of and everything is 01:32:55.280 --> 01:32:57.590 perfect. Well, I mean, just because 01:32:57.600 --> 01:33:00.070 you're in the present moment doesn't 01:33:00.080 --> 01:33:01.750 mean necessarily that everything is 01:33:01.760 --> 01:33:03.830 perfect. I mean, animals tend to be in 01:33:03.840 --> 01:33:05.270 the present moment, but they still 01:33:05.280 --> 01:33:08.870 suffer. 01:33:08.880 --> 01:33:11.350 So, I mean, some suffering is just kind 01:33:11.360 --> 01:33:14.870 of like a reflex. It's just automatic, I 01:33:14.880 --> 01:33:16.390 guess. [snorts] 01:33:16.400 --> 01:33:19.510 So, That's kind of maybe a quibble. See, 01:33:19.520 --> 01:33:21.669 only thoughts of the past or or 01:33:21.679 --> 01:33:23.830 potential future that makes people fear 01:33:23.840 --> 01:33:26.229 and feel uncertain. So, they make up 01:33:26.239 --> 01:33:28.310 gods. Well, not necessarily. I mean, you 01:33:28.320 --> 01:33:30.229 can still have you can still be in the 01:33:30.239 --> 01:33:34.550 present moment and still suffer. I think 01:33:34.560 --> 01:33:36.149 it's just there's [clears throat] going 01:33:36.159 --> 01:33:39.830 to be way less cause for it cuz most 01:33:39.840 --> 01:33:42.790 suffering especially like in the the 01:33:42.800 --> 01:33:45.030 developed west 01:33:45.040 --> 01:33:48.149 is it's just kind of imaginary stuff you 01:33:48.159 --> 01:33:50.790 know I don't have a good enough car or 01:33:50.800 --> 01:33:52.870 you know it's like I like this girl and 01:33:52.880 --> 01:33:55.189 she doesn't like me and and this kind of 01:33:55.199 --> 01:33:58.229 thing where it's I mean you're just 01:33:58.239 --> 01:34:02.310 creating the problem just through like 01:34:02.320 --> 01:34:05.830 ignorance and delusion. and just habit. 01:34:05.840 --> 01:34:08.070 The karma is like the habitual part of 01:34:08.080 --> 01:34:10.550 it. 01:34:10.560 --> 01:34:12.390 At least the making of new karma is the 01:34:12.400 --> 01:34:16.149 habitual part of it. So 01:34:16.159 --> 01:34:18.390 yeah, I think it is possible that you 01:34:18.400 --> 01:34:19.750 can be in the present moment and still 01:34:19.760 --> 01:34:22.709 see things as imperfect. But no. All 01:34:22.719 --> 01:34:25.430 right. At at like an animal level, 01:34:25.440 --> 01:34:26.950 they're pretty much stuck in the present 01:34:26.960 --> 01:34:29.830 moment. I mean, it's animals that aren't 01:34:29.840 --> 01:34:32.629 really super intelligent anyway, but 01:34:32.639 --> 01:34:35.669 still there's like this kind of an 01:34:35.679 --> 01:34:37.910 instinctive 01:34:37.920 --> 01:34:40.709 um consideration of the future or 01:34:40.719 --> 01:34:43.350 something, you know, but gosh, where was 01:34:43.360 --> 01:34:47.669 I going with that? See, 01:34:47.679 --> 01:34:50.149 everything is perfect and it's only 01:34:50.159 --> 01:34:52.310 thoughts. I mean, Echartolo thinks 01:34:52.320 --> 01:34:54.229 almost all animals are enlightened 01:34:54.239 --> 01:34:55.669 partly because of this very reason 01:34:55.679 --> 01:34:57.510 because they're always in the power of 01:34:57.520 --> 01:34:59.110 now. You know, they're not thinking 01:34:59.120 --> 01:35:00.870 about the future of the past or 01:35:00.880 --> 01:35:03.140 anything. 01:35:03.150 --> 01:35:03.830 [sighs] 01:35:03.840 --> 01:35:05.669 Let's see. Yeah, I was going to say 01:35:05.679 --> 01:35:10.229 something really profound, too. I bet. 01:35:10.239 --> 01:35:13.030 Let's see. Thoughts of the past and 01:35:13.040 --> 01:35:16.629 potential future that makes people fear 01:35:16.639 --> 01:35:19.110 and feel uncertain. 01:35:19.120 --> 01:35:20.950 So they make up gods whom they think 01:35:20.960 --> 01:35:23.270 they can appease to grant them a good 01:35:23.280 --> 01:35:25.030 future. 01:35:25.040 --> 01:35:26.470 Yeah. Well, there's a lot of that. I 01:35:26.480 --> 01:35:28.470 think in the

dhamapana it says for most 01:35:28.480 --> 01:35:30.790 people religion is based on fear. You 01:35:30.800 --> 01:35:33.910 know they worship gods just to you know 01:35:33.920 --> 01:35:36.070 make sure that the weather is good and 01:35:36.080 --> 01:35:38.310 you know that nothing really bad happens 01:35:38.320 --> 01:35:39.750 to them. They'll they'll fend off 01:35:39.760 --> 01:35:42.149 diseases and so forth for themselves and 01:35:42.159 --> 01:35:45.669 their their family. 01:35:45.679 --> 01:35:49.350 Okay. Yeah. I just lost that thought 01:35:49.360 --> 01:35:52.550 that I was going to follow up on. But 01:35:52.560 --> 01:35:54.790 see, hope implies not thinking about the 01:35:54.800 --> 01:35:56.709 present and about the future. I thought 01:35:56.719 --> 01:35:58.709 about how if you're in Nirvana, you're 01:35:58.719 --> 01:36:01.189 in the present moment fully. 01:36:01.199 --> 01:36:03.910 Yeah, I suppose. I mean, if you're being 01:36:03.920 --> 01:36:06.550 perfectly mindful then, yeah, even if 01:36:06.560 --> 01:36:07.830 you're thinking about the future or 01:36:07.840 --> 01:36:09.669 thinking about the past, it's you're 01:36:09.679 --> 01:36:11.669 thinking about the future now and you're 01:36:11.679 --> 01:36:14.709 thinking about the past now. 01:36:14.719 --> 01:36:17.669 So still like an enlightened sage 01:36:17.679 --> 01:36:19.030 presumably can still think about the 01:36:19.040 --> 01:36:20.229 future. I mean the Buddha talks about 01:36:20.239 --> 01:36:22.790 the future a lot. Not as much as he 01:36:22.800 --> 01:36:24.950 talks about the present but still he 01:36:24.960 --> 01:36:26.629 does. He talks about the past sometimes 01:36:26.639 --> 01:36:30.870 like the whole jotica genre genre is the 01:36:30.880 --> 01:36:33.430 Buddha talking about the past but still 01:36:33.440 --> 01:36:39.426 he's doing it now like mindfully now. 01:36:39.436 --> 01:36:41.030 [sighs] Yeah. I guess I'm just gonna 01:36:41.040 --> 01:36:42.229 have to move on next question because 01:36:42.239 --> 01:36:44.629 there's this thought you can just I can 01:36:44.639 --> 01:36:46.470 just sit here trying to remember what I 01:36:46.480 --> 01:36:48.550 was going to say for five minutes, but I 01:36:48.560 --> 01:36:49.910 don't think people are going to want to 01:36:49.920 --> 01:36:52.070 see or hear that. So, I'm just moving on 01:36:52.080 --> 01:36:54.950 to Ethiopian fake Tig's next question. 01:36:54.960 --> 01:36:56.390 And he says, "I was thinking about 01:36:56.400 --> 01:36:59.669 nihilism and nirvana and realize that 01:36:59.679 --> 01:37:02.790 you can't have a crisis of meaning if 01:37:02.800 --> 01:37:05.590 you're in the present. If you admire a 01:37:05.600 --> 01:37:08.149 flower now and you love it now, the fact 01:37:08.159 --> 01:37:10.229 that it will die in the future is 01:37:10.239 --> 01:37:12.629 confusion because you're worried about 01:37:12.639 --> 01:37:14.870 the future but fully in the present 01:37:14.880 --> 01:37:17.430 moment. You don't ask what does this 01:37:17.440 --> 01:37:20.470 great piece of pie mean as you bite into 01:37:20.480 --> 01:37:22.229 it and it tastes great. Thoughts on 01:37:22.239 --> 01:37:23.910 this? Oh yeah, that reminds me of what 01:37:23.920 --> 01:37:25.510 Krishna Mie was saying. That's that's 01:37:25.520 --> 01:37:26.629 what I was going to say with regard to 01:37:26.639 --> 01:37:29.030 the last one that Krishna Mie says I 01:37:29.040 --> 01:37:31.669 mean even if you're using language still 01:37:31.679 --> 01:37:33.270 you're relying on the past. you're not 01:37:33.280 --> 01:37:34.950 fully in the present moment, even if 01:37:34.960 --> 01:37:36.790 you're thinking in words, because you're 01:37:36.800 --> 01:37:38.870 having to remember these words that you 01:37:38.880 --> 01:37:42.790 learned long ago, in order to address 01:37:42.800 --> 01:37:44.390 what presumably you're dealing with now, 01:37:44.400 --> 01:37:46.950 but there's already like this this 01:37:46.960 --> 01:37:50.950 delay, this lapse. So, you're not fully 01:37:50.960 --> 01:37:52.390 in the present moment so long as you're 01:37:52.400 --> 01:37:53.990 thinking in words or having any kind of 01:37:54.000 --> 01:37:58.470 like ideas about anything really. 01:37:58.480 --> 01:38:01.430 So nihilism and nirvana I mean you can 01:38:01.440 --> 01:38:04.310 still sort of have nihilism 01:38:04.320 --> 01:38:06.950 um in the present moment it's just 01:38:06.960 --> 01:38:08.950 everything is meaningless I mean to the 01:38:08.960 --> 01:38:11.189 I mean unless you really take Krishna 01:38:11.199 --> 01:38:12.550 Mury to heart and then if you're just 01:38:12.560 --> 01:38:14.870 even thinking in words you're you're no 01:38:14.880 --> 01:38:16.950 longer in the present moment because the 01:38:16.960 --> 01:38:18.790 words have to be retrieved from memory 01:38:18.800 --> 01:38:21.750 to use them and the memory is from the 01:38:21.760 --> 01:38:24.950 past. 01:38:24.960 --> 01:38:27.109 So, let's see. If you admire a flower 01:38:27.119 --> 01:38:29.910 now and you love it now, the fact that 01:38:29.920 --> 01:38:32.470 it will die in the future is confusion 01:38:32.480 --> 01:38:34.070 because you're worried about the future. 01:38:34.080 --> 01:38:36.870 Yeah, that's true. 01:38:36.880 --> 01:38:38.870 Yeah, you get attached to anything. I 01:38:38.880 --> 01:38:41.189 mean, it's like you want more of it. You 01:38:41.199 --> 01:38:42.709 want to keep experiencing it and you can 01:38:42.719 --> 01:38:44.470 feel insecurity like maybe I'm going to 01:38:44.480 --> 01:38:47.153 lose this. That kind of thing. 01:38:47.163 --> 01:38:48.070 >> [snorts] 01:38:48.080 --> 01:38:50.950 >> So yeah, most suffering at least most of 01:38:50.960 --> 01:38:53.590 it is based on not being in the present 01:38:53.600 --> 01:38:55.750 moment and worrying about the future or 01:38:55.760 --> 01:38:58.310 worrying about the

past, regret, remorse 01:38:58.320 --> 01:39:01.510 about the past, just inventing imaginary 01:39:01.520 --> 01:39:03.910 scenarios that might possibly come to 01:39:03.920 --> 01:39:06.790 pass but even probably won't. 01:39:06.800 --> 01:39:07.910 That kind of thing is just 01:39:07.920 --> 01:39:10.733 self-inflicted suffering. 01:39:10.743 --> 01:39:10.790 >> [clears throat] 01:39:10.800 --> 01:39:12.229 >> So, I mean, if you are in the present 01:39:12.239 --> 01:39:15.350 moment being mindful, you're still it's 01:39:15.360 --> 01:39:16.470 still going to hurt when you stub your 01:39:16.480 --> 01:39:17.910 toe. And there's still going to be like 01:39:17.920 --> 01:39:20.070 animal animal instincts and reflexes 01:39:20.080 --> 01:39:21.350 that are going to cause you to kind of 01:39:21.360 --> 01:39:24.229 have a version for that that you have to 01:39:24.239 --> 01:39:26.870 be really advanced that you're able to 01:39:26.880 --> 01:39:29.750 denature just the the reflexive 01:39:29.760 --> 01:39:33.658 instinctive aversion for the pain. 01:39:33.668 --> 01:39:35.109 [clears throat] Um, I mean, just by 01:39:35.119 --> 01:39:37.189 being through mindful detachment, you 01:39:37.199 --> 01:39:40.470 know, pain is arising. You're just like 01:39:40.480 --> 01:39:42.629 this passive observer of this pain 01:39:42.639 --> 01:39:44.390 arising which isn't the same as 01:39:44.400 --> 01:39:45.990 suffering because the suffering is the 01:39:46.000 --> 01:39:50.709 desire for the pain to stop. 01:39:50.719 --> 01:39:51.990 And I should just move on. Next 01:39:52.000 --> 01:39:54.950 question. This is from Sedara Loha 01:39:54.960 --> 01:39:57.109 and he says he's baiting me with a 01:39:57.119 --> 01:40:00.070 political question here I think. He says 01:40:00.080 --> 01:40:01.350 because I' I've already answered this 01:40:01.360 --> 01:40:04.470 question before. He says, "Do you think 01:40:04.480 --> 01:40:06.709 universal suffrage or voting for 01:40:06.719 --> 01:40:09.750 everyone should be a political right? 01:40:09.760 --> 01:40:11.350 And if not, what would you propose 01:40:11.360 --> 01:40:13.430 instead?" Well, of course, universal 01:40:13.440 --> 01:40:16.149 suffrage would be a disaster. And the 01:40:16.159 --> 01:40:18.229 founding fathers of the United States, 01:40:18.239 --> 01:40:19.830 at least some of them, including Thomas 01:40:19.840 --> 01:40:21.590 Jefferson, realized this and wrote about 01:40:21.600 --> 01:40:25.350 it that when you have, you know, every 01:40:25.360 --> 01:40:28.070 citizen even having the right to vote, 01:40:28.080 --> 01:40:30.070 not just like illegal aliens or even 01:40:30.080 --> 01:40:34.390 like people legally visiting America, 01:40:34.400 --> 01:40:35.510 you know, they've got like a visa. 01:40:35.520 --> 01:40:37.669 They're not a full citizen yet. I mean, 01:40:37.679 --> 01:40:39.510 this is what the Democrats apparently 01:40:39.520 --> 01:40:41.350 want, at least a lot of them. They want 01:40:41.360 --> 01:40:45.669 even illegal aliens to be able to vote. 01:40:45.679 --> 01:40:47.674 But 01:40:47.684 --> 01:40:48.709 [sighs] 01:40:48.719 --> 01:40:51.669 just as a start, just a step in the 01:40:51.679 --> 01:40:54.149 right direction would be to have a law 01:40:54.159 --> 01:40:56.629 which probably will never be passed that 01:40:56.639 --> 01:41:00.149 anyone living on welfare handouts should 01:41:00.159 --> 01:41:02.950 not have the right to vote. you forfeit 01:41:02.960 --> 01:41:06.229 your right to vote by like being a 01:41:06.239 --> 01:41:08.870 parasite on the economy 01:41:08.880 --> 01:41:10.310 because [clears throat] like Thomas 01:41:10.320 --> 01:41:14.950 Jefferson pointed out when people like 01:41:14.960 --> 01:41:17.189 the proletariat and I mean not even the 01:41:17.199 --> 01:41:18.950 proletariat as the workers but the 01:41:18.960 --> 01:41:20.470 people who are like living on welfare 01:41:20.480 --> 01:41:22.470 handouts 01:41:22.480 --> 01:41:25.030 when they realize they can just vote for 01:41:25.040 --> 01:41:27.990 free stuff which isn't really free it's 01:41:28.000 --> 01:41:30.390 free for them but the taxpayers have to 01:41:30.400 --> 01:41:33.109 pay for it then you just have like this 01:41:33.119 --> 01:41:34.950 downhill toboggon ride for for the 01:41:34.960 --> 01:41:37.830 nation and the economy. 01:41:37.840 --> 01:41:41.385 So yeah, as a good preventative of that, 01:41:41.395 --> 01:41:43.109 [clears throat] have only people who are 01:41:43.119 --> 01:41:46.950 productive in America, like law-abiding 01:41:46.960 --> 01:41:51.590 citizens who are contributing 01:41:51.600 --> 01:41:54.470 to the prosperity and economy, not 01:41:54.480 --> 01:41:56.550 living off of it, but contributing to 01:41:56.560 --> 01:41:59.910 it, that have the right to vote. And 01:41:59.920 --> 01:42:01.430 then after we get that, which is 01:42:01.440 --> 01:42:02.709 probably never going to happen without 01:42:02.719 --> 01:42:06.070 some just radical upheaval and just like 01:42:06.080 --> 01:42:09.590 a whole new system installed, 01:42:09.600 --> 01:42:11.669 then then we can deprive women of the 01:42:11.679 --> 01:42:14.950 right to vote also because giving women 01:42:14.960 --> 01:42:16.550 the right to vote was like the beginning 01:42:16.560 --> 01:42:19.750 of the end for Western civilization. 01:42:19.760 --> 01:42:21.910 Women are more insecure as a general 01:42:21.920 --> 01:42:24.390 rule than men are. There is physical and 01:42:24.400 --> 01:42:26.870 psychological sexual dimmorphism in the 01:42:26.880 --> 01:42:28.629 human species. 01:42:28.639 --> 01:42:31.990 Women desire security more than men do. 01:42:32.000 --> 01:42:35.350 In fact, women have this tendency of 01:42:35.360 --> 01:42:37.990 wanting to vote away rights and 01:42:38.000 --> 01:42:40.229 liberties for the sake of increased 01:42:40.239 --> 01:42:41.830 security. So you wind up with this

01:42:41.840 --> 01:42:44.070 socialist mommy state which has pretty 01:42:44.080 --> 01:42:47.430 much taken over Europe at least Western 01:42:47.440 --> 01:42:49.990 Europe 01:42:50.000 --> 01:42:52.390 and with with lots of like Ursula 01:42:52.400 --> 01:42:55.189 Vanderlayan is like the leader of the EU 01:42:55.199 --> 01:42:57.510 right now supposedly 01:42:57.520 --> 01:43:00.070 motherless I mean a a childless mother 01:43:00.080 --> 01:43:04.070 or childless woman. 01:43:04.080 --> 01:43:06.790 Angla Merkel before her. I mean, she 01:43:06.800 --> 01:43:09.189 messed up Europe worse than anybody 01:43:09.199 --> 01:43:12.629 before or since uh a certain German 01:43:12.639 --> 01:43:18.709 chancellor in the 1930s and early 40s. 01:43:18.719 --> 01:43:20.629 Even admirers of Hitler, I have to admit 01:43:20.639 --> 01:43:23.669 that I mean Hitler's expansionism did 01:43:23.679 --> 01:43:26.310 result in a huge backlash. Also, his 01:43:26.320 --> 01:43:29.350 dislike of Hebrews contributed to this 01:43:29.360 --> 01:43:32.070 huge backlash that just devastated 01:43:32.080 --> 01:43:36.470 Europe. 01:43:36.480 --> 01:43:41.030 So yeah, I think uh what would I propose 01:43:41.040 --> 01:43:42.790 instead of universal suffrage? I think 01:43:42.800 --> 01:43:44.310 what the founding fathers of the United 01:43:44.320 --> 01:43:45.910 States had in mind and what was 01:43:45.920 --> 01:43:49.189 originally in place in America um was 01:43:49.199 --> 01:43:51.830 not a bad idea. I mean they wanted just 01:43:51.840 --> 01:43:53.990 like white Christian men who own 01:43:54.000 --> 01:43:56.550 property to be able to vote. And I mean 01:43:56.560 --> 01:43:58.310 the white Christian part I don't think 01:43:58.320 --> 01:44:01.350 is all that important 01:44:01.360 --> 01:44:02.950 but [clears throat] 01:44:02.960 --> 01:44:06.390 like people who have a certain minimum 01:44:06.400 --> 01:44:11.590 amount of property and like like real 01:44:11.600 --> 01:44:14.550 uh [sighs] what is it like investment in 01:44:14.560 --> 01:44:17.510 the prosperity of the country 01:44:17.520 --> 01:44:20.550 and and and have some education maybe. I 01:44:20.560 --> 01:44:22.229 mean, you should be able to know, you 01:44:22.239 --> 01:44:23.590 should have to know something about 01:44:23.600 --> 01:44:26.950 politics and economics before making 01:44:26.960 --> 01:44:28.629 even voting on important decisions, 01:44:28.639 --> 01:44:30.950 which is another reason why women aren't 01:44:30.960 --> 01:44:33.030 don't do as well as men statistically 01:44:33.040 --> 01:44:35.030 with regard to their voting records 01:44:35.040 --> 01:44:37.350 because I mean studies have shown that 01:44:37.360 --> 01:44:40.390 women are less informed with regard to 01:44:40.400 --> 01:44:43.189 politics, current events, and economics 01:44:43.199 --> 01:44:45.350 than men are even though women vote more 01:44:45.360 --> 01:44:48.709 than men do. So we have this gradual 01:44:48.719 --> 01:44:53.510 slide into a socialist mommy state 01:44:53.520 --> 01:44:54.629 partly because they just don't 01:44:54.639 --> 01:44:58.550 understand how economics works. 01:44:58.560 --> 01:45:01.990 So yeah, I'd have male law-abiding 01:45:02.000 --> 01:45:05.270 citizens who are contributing to 01:45:05.280 --> 01:45:06.790 society. In fact, you could even go so 01:45:06.800 --> 01:45:09.270 far as to have only like a a potter 01:45:09.280 --> 01:45:11.030 familas 01:45:11.040 --> 01:45:14.149 who who is like the head of a household 01:45:14.159 --> 01:45:16.550 should have the right to vote because 01:45:16.560 --> 01:45:19.270 you've got childless people nowadays, 01:45:19.280 --> 01:45:21.669 lots and lots of them, including female 01:45:21.679 --> 01:45:25.109 politicians who I mean it's like they 01:45:25.119 --> 01:45:28.310 don't care if society just toboggins 01:45:28.320 --> 01:45:30.950 into into a a quagmire because they 01:45:30.960 --> 01:45:32.070 don't have children that are going to 01:45:32.080 --> 01:45:34.229 have to face it. you know after me the 01:45:34.239 --> 01:45:37.750 deluge. 01:45:37.760 --> 01:45:41.350 So it it could be like an improvement of 01:45:41.360 --> 01:45:43.109 just the potter familious just the the 01:45:43.119 --> 01:45:47.669 the male head of a household. Maybe you 01:45:47.679 --> 01:45:50.149 have to have a a requirement for to have 01:45:50.159 --> 01:45:52.709 at least one child unless you can prove 01:45:52.719 --> 01:45:54.310 that you're incapable of it just through 01:45:54.320 --> 01:45:56.629 some physical, 01:45:56.639 --> 01:46:00.390 you know, mishap, 01:46:00.400 --> 01:46:02.229 you'd have a much stronger country. I 01:46:02.239 --> 01:46:05.030 mean it maybe certain rights and 01:46:05.040 --> 01:46:06.870 freedoms would become less, maybe they'd 01:46:06.880 --> 01:46:08.149 become more. It's hard to say with 01:46:08.159 --> 01:46:10.870 regard to that, but you wouldn't have as 01:46:10.880 --> 01:46:12.550 much of a welfare state. You'd have more 01:46:12.560 --> 01:46:14.390 reliance on private charity, which is 01:46:14.400 --> 01:46:17.830 bunch much more spiritual. Private 01:46:17.840 --> 01:46:19.590 charity where you've got like church 01:46:19.600 --> 01:46:22.229 groups and so forth that are like taking 01:46:22.239 --> 01:46:24.149 care of the poor. It's not perfect, but 01:46:24.159 --> 01:46:26.709 then obviously socialism isn't perfect 01:46:26.719 --> 01:46:30.229 either. And if it's private charity, 01:46:30.239 --> 01:46:33.109 it's not the government who's supporting 01:46:33.119 --> 01:46:35.109 like the welfare class, which is just 01:46:35.119 --> 01:46:37.030 burgeoning because it's living off 01:46:37.040 --> 01:46:38.950 welfare has become like a career choice 01:46:38.960 --> 01:46:40.870 for tens of millions of people in 01:46:40.880 --> 01:46:43.750 America. 01:46:43.760 --> 01:46:45.109 I mean, that's that's just even 01:46:45.119 -->

01:46:47.189 citizens. That's not even including what 01:46:47.199 --> 01:46:49.830 I I saw in the news earlier today that 01:46:49.840 --> 01:46:52.629 at least 90% of all Somalians with 01:46:52.639 --> 01:46:55.990 children in America, like Somalian 01:46:56.000 --> 01:46:58.070 immigrants are living on off welfare to 01:46:58.080 --> 01:47:00.310 some degree. They're getting checks from 01:47:00.320 --> 01:47:01.990 the government. 01:47:02.000 --> 01:47:05.350 I mean, that's just ridiculous. And a 01:47:05.360 --> 01:47:06.870 lot of them are voting. Some of them are 01:47:06.880 --> 01:47:10.950 illegal aliens who are still voting. 01:47:10.960 --> 01:47:13.669 So, [sighs] I mean, Western civilization 01:47:13.679 --> 01:47:15.270 is I mean, [clears throat] it's just 01:47:15.280 --> 01:47:17.990 self-destructive at this point, largely 01:47:18.000 --> 01:47:20.709 uh due to a surplus of feminine 01:47:20.719 --> 01:47:24.149 sentiment and just ignorance of how 01:47:24.159 --> 01:47:27.270 politics and governments and economics 01:47:27.280 --> 01:47:30.709 and all that, how how it all works. 01:47:30.719 --> 01:47:32.709 It's this just let's just base 01:47:32.719 --> 01:47:34.149 everything on unrefined feminine 01:47:34.159 --> 01:47:38.364 sentiment. 01:47:38.374 --> 01:47:38.790 >> [sighs and clears throat] 01:47:38.800 --> 01:47:42.390 >> So yeah, I mean at the very least people 01:47:42.400 --> 01:47:45.189 living on welfare handouts, unless you 01:47:45.199 --> 01:47:46.310 know they've already made their 01:47:46.320 --> 01:47:48.390 contribution to society are are like 01:47:48.400 --> 01:47:51.430 elderly or like injured and you know 01:47:51.440 --> 01:47:52.950 they've they're living on a pension, 01:47:52.960 --> 01:47:55.830 that kind of thing, they I'd say they 01:47:55.840 --> 01:48:00.390 can still vote. But people who are just 01:48:00.400 --> 01:48:03.910 either too lazy or or too stupid to make 01:48:03.920 --> 01:48:05.750 a living, 01:48:05.760 --> 01:48:07.910 just make bad life decisions. I mean, 01:48:07.920 --> 01:48:09.350 they shouldn't be making decisions for 01:48:09.360 --> 01:48:12.149 everybody else and just voting for more 01:48:12.159 --> 01:48:13.990 and more free stuff, just voting in as 01:48:14.000 --> 01:48:16.550 much socialism as possible. 01:48:16.560 --> 01:48:18.310 And then after that, maybe you can think 01:48:18.320 --> 01:48:21.350 about restricting female suffrage and 01:48:21.360 --> 01:48:23.990 all that. [snorts] 01:48:24.000 --> 01:48:25.830 But I'm I'm just uh [clears throat] 01:48:25.840 --> 01:48:28.310 moving on to the next question here. 01:48:28.320 --> 01:48:30.149 This is from Stellar Supreme and so on 01:48:30.159 --> 01:48:32.950 and so forth, etc., etc. 01:48:32.960 --> 01:48:34.870 And Stellar Supreme and so on and so 01:48:34.880 --> 01:48:37.830 forth, etc., etc. says, "Would Christian 01:48:37.840 --> 01:48:40.470 prayers involving more Buddhist themes 01:48:40.480 --> 01:48:42.629 like filth of the body, corpse 01:48:42.639 --> 01:48:45.030 contemplation and lordly deceiver 01:48:45.040 --> 01:48:48.070 manipulating worldly creations of men, 01:48:48.080 --> 01:48:50.390 condemnation of self-regard and personal 01:48:50.400 --> 01:48:53.189 view be more skillful than normie 01:48:53.199 --> 01:48:55.510 conventions of prayer, 01:48:55.520 --> 01:48:57.830 even if they hit the appetite funny for 01:48:57.840 --> 01:49:00.870 squeamish people before meals?" 01:49:00.880 --> 01:49:03.430 Well, I mean, Stellar Supreme and so on 01:49:03.440 --> 01:49:05.350 and so forth, etc., etc., apparently 01:49:05.360 --> 01:49:09.990 hasn't read a whole lot of like Catholic 01:49:10.000 --> 01:49:11.990 like you know the the imitation of 01:49:12.000 --> 01:49:13.750 Christ or the writings of St. John of 01:49:13.760 --> 01:49:15.510 the Cross that sort of thing. I mean I 01:49:15.520 --> 01:49:17.910 mean the the lordly deceiver 01:49:17.920 --> 01:49:20.070 manipulating worldly creations of men in 01:49:20.080 --> 01:49:22.709 Christianity that's called Satan. 01:49:22.719 --> 01:49:25.189 You know the three enemies to like the 01:49:25.199 --> 01:49:28.470 the Catholic contemplative saint, you 01:49:28.480 --> 01:49:30.629 know, the world, the flesh, and the 01:49:30.639 --> 01:49:33.270 devil. And the devil, I mean, he's in 01:49:33.280 --> 01:49:35.270 there. I mean, he gets a little bit more 01:49:35.280 --> 01:49:37.270 emphasis even than Mara does in 01:49:37.280 --> 01:49:39.669 Buddhism. I think at least the 01:49:39.679 --> 01:49:42.950 oldfashioned kind of Christianity, 01:49:42.960 --> 01:49:44.709 parents would make their children behave 01:49:44.719 --> 01:49:48.470 through threats of the devil. 01:49:48.480 --> 01:49:50.470 So, let's see. Filth of the body, corpse 01:49:50.480 --> 01:49:52.470 contemplation, corpse contemplation, not 01:49:52.480 --> 01:49:55.990 so much, I suppose. Um, but I mean, 01:49:56.000 --> 01:49:57.880 Christians have this idea. 01:49:57.890 --> 01:49:59.590 [clears throat] I mean, like the saintly 01:49:59.600 --> 01:50:01.830 old-fashioned ones, 01:50:01.840 --> 01:50:03.510 they had this idea, you only get one 01:50:03.520 --> 01:50:06.629 chance. In Buddhism, you get like an 01:50:06.639 --> 01:50:08.470 infinite number of chances because you 01:50:08.480 --> 01:50:09.990 just keep getting reborn until you get 01:50:10.000 --> 01:50:12.149 it right. It's like Groundhog Day. But 01:50:12.159 --> 01:50:14.629 for a Christian, you just get this one 01:50:14.639 --> 01:50:17.109 life of a few decades, relatively 01:50:17.119 --> 01:50:18.790 speaking, that's going to determine 01:50:18.800 --> 01:50:21.189 whether you are rewarded in heaven or 01:50:21.199 --> 01:50:24.390 punished in hell forever and ever. 01:50:24.400 --> 01:50:27.990 So, that kind of belief really spurred 01:50:28.000 --> 01:50:30.709 on a lot of like Christian saints to be 01:50:30.719 --> 01:50:33.590 very

saintly. 01:50:33.600 --> 01:50:37.590 But let's see here. Filth of the body. 01:50:37.600 --> 01:50:39.510 Yeah. Well, someone like uh what was his 01:50:39.520 --> 01:50:42.629 name? Hinrich Susso. Yeah. His I mean 01:50:42.639 --> 01:50:45.830 some of those medieval Catholic saintly 01:50:45.840 --> 01:50:48.310 types. I don't think Suso was canonized. 01:50:48.320 --> 01:50:51.030 He was beatified. I think I mean they 01:50:51.040 --> 01:50:52.550 were literally filthy that he would he 01:50:52.560 --> 01:50:54.149 wouldn't bathe. He was just covered with 01:50:54.159 --> 01:50:56.950 like fleas and and bed bugs and lice and 01:50:56.960 --> 01:50:58.629 stuff. Well, I guess you don't get 01:50:58.639 --> 01:51:00.070 covered with bed bugs, but you get 01:51:00.080 --> 01:51:01.350 covered with lice and he was covered 01:51:01.360 --> 01:51:02.870 with them. 01:51:02.880 --> 01:51:06.709 So see condemnation of self-regard. 01:51:06.719 --> 01:51:09.669 Yeah. I mean that's all found in like 01:51:09.679 --> 01:51:12.310 like Roman Catholic contemplative orders 01:51:12.320 --> 01:51:14.310 anyway. It's it's advanced practice that 01:51:14.320 --> 01:51:17.030 most of the normie Christians don't do. 01:51:17.040 --> 01:51:19.910 But I mean most normie Buddhists, you 01:51:19.920 --> 01:51:22.470 know, some Burmese villager, they're not 01:51:22.480 --> 01:51:24.149 contemplating filth of the body and 01:51:24.159 --> 01:51:26.390 corpse contemplations and and like 01:51:26.400 --> 01:51:28.310 condemnation of self- reggard and so 01:51:28.320 --> 01:51:30.229 forth cuz they're normies. I mean, 01:51:30.239 --> 01:51:31.350 they're just average people. Well, 01:51:31.360 --> 01:51:32.470 they're just making a living and 01:51:32.480 --> 01:51:35.350 providing for their family and all that. 01:51:35.360 --> 01:51:38.070 They're not really going for like 01:51:38.080 --> 01:51:40.709 perfection or anything. And most most 01:51:40.719 --> 01:51:43.109 Buddhists are the same way. 01:51:43.119 --> 01:51:44.950 So, it's really not so different. I 01:51:44.960 --> 01:51:47.750 mean, Christianity in the modern west 01:51:47.760 --> 01:51:49.669 and the post-modern west has just become 01:51:49.679 --> 01:51:52.550 more and more degenerate, just as terra 01:51:52.560 --> 01:51:55.189 Buddhism in the post-modern west is just 01:51:55.199 --> 01:51:57.910 radically degenerate over I mean, what 01:51:57.920 --> 01:52:02.310 you see in the texts anyway. 01:52:02.320 --> 01:52:04.470 So, it's really not so different. I 01:52:04.480 --> 01:52:06.149 mean, Christian prayers, would Christian 01:52:06.159 --> 01:52:09.589 prayers involving more Buddhist themes 01:52:09.599 --> 01:52:12.229 um be more skillful. 01:52:12.239 --> 01:52:14.229 I mean, that kind of stuff is already in 01:52:14.239 --> 01:52:16.310 there. It's just that most Christians 01:52:16.320 --> 01:52:17.830 don't pay much heed to that, just as 01:52:17.840 --> 01:52:19.430 most Christians don't

pay much heed to 01:52:19.440 --> 01:52:21.109 gather not up your treasures upon the 01:52:21.119 --> 01:52:23.589 earth. Give no thought for tomorrow what 01:52:23.599 --> 01:52:24.950 you will eat or where you will sleep, 01:52:24.960 --> 01:52:27.589 that kind of thing. 01:52:27.599 --> 01:52:30.229 I mean the the practice part of advanced 01:52:30.239 --> 01:52:32.149 Christianity and advanced Buddhism is 01:52:32.159 --> 01:52:33.750 very similar. It's just the the 01:52:33.760 --> 01:52:37.109 narrative like the theory can is is 01:52:37.119 --> 01:52:40.229 quite different. 01:52:40.239 --> 01:52:41.910 But the practice part is is very 01:52:41.920 --> 01:52:44.252 similar. It's just that most 01:52:44.262 --> 01:52:44.790 [clears throat] 01:52:44.800 --> 01:52:46.310 average 01:52:46.320 --> 01:52:48.390 most average Christians and most average 01:52:48.400 --> 01:52:51.030 Buddhists, they're more concerned with 01:52:51.040 --> 01:52:53.510 just making a living, eating good food 01:52:53.520 --> 01:52:55.830 for dinner, making sure their kids don't 01:52:55.840 --> 01:52:58.310 get sick, that kind of stuff. And 01:52:58.320 --> 01:53:00.149 they're not thinking about this really 01:53:00.159 --> 01:53:03.430 advanced corpse contemplation stuff. 01:53:03.440 --> 01:53:05.750 I mean, that works on both sides. It's 01:53:05.760 --> 01:53:07.750 just some Western Buddhists are, you 01:53:07.760 --> 01:53:09.669 know, they're kind of monastic anyway. 01:53:09.679 --> 01:53:12.070 they're attracted to that and you know 01:53:12.080 --> 01:53:13.910 they kind of emphasize that kind of 01:53:13.920 --> 01:53:16.550 stuff. And there are some Christians 01:53:16.560 --> 01:53:18.149 that are like that too I suppose that 01:53:18.159 --> 01:53:20.709 are still lay people but still they're 01:53:20.719 --> 01:53:22.550 you know they really emulate the more 01:53:22.560 --> 01:53:25.669 advanced teachings. 01:53:25.679 --> 01:53:28.550 But for the most part your average 01:53:28.560 --> 01:53:30.229 secular Buddhist and your average 01:53:30.239 --> 01:53:32.390 secular Christian, you know, they're 01:53:32.400 --> 01:53:33.910 more concerned with secular stuff 01:53:33.920 --> 01:53:36.950 anyway. 01:53:36.960 --> 01:53:39.430 But the Christians do have that stuff as 01:53:39.440 --> 01:53:40.870 built into the system. It's just they 01:53:40.880 --> 01:53:43.669 don't pay much heed to it, which is just 01:53:43.679 --> 01:53:45.669 human nature. 01:53:45.679 --> 01:53:47.189 And so I'm just going to move on to the 01:53:47.199 --> 01:53:50.390 last question, the very last one. This 01:53:50.400 --> 01:53:54.229 is from Task is and this is came up 01:53:54.239 --> 01:53:57.910 earlier today when we were discussing on 01:53:57.920 --> 01:54:01.589 on the Discord server Ajan Braum and his 01:54:01.599 --> 01:54:03.669 pretty much unilateral attempts to get a 01:54:03.679 --> 01:54:06.790 Bikuni SA going. So that [clears throat] 01:54:06.800 --> 01:54:09.589 I mean his attempts were kind of 01:54:09.599 --> 01:54:13.350 unscrupulous and just flouting rules and 01:54:13.360 --> 01:54:15.030 traditions and so forth. So that he got 01:54:15.040 --> 01:54:17.109 himself booted out of the Ajan Cha 01:54:17.119 --> 01:54:19.350 tradition even though there are some 01:54:19.360 --> 01:54:21.990 like female feminist kind of Buddhists 01:54:22.000 --> 01:54:23.830 who think he's enlightened because of 01:54:23.840 --> 01:54:27.189 his efforts for you know female equality 01:54:27.199 --> 01:54:31.669 and so forth. But anyway, Trasaz says, 01:54:31.679 --> 01:54:34.310 "Was ever any topic on which the 01:54:34.320 --> 01:54:36.870 majority of monks did agree on?" And 01:54:36.880 --> 01:54:40.229 yeah, quite a few actually. It's like um 01:54:40.239 --> 01:54:42.709 if you have a great council, 01:54:42.719 --> 01:54:44.550 then you know like the first council, 01:54:44.560 --> 01:54:47.189 second council. 01:54:47.199 --> 01:54:50.149 Um I mean you have representatives of 01:54:50.159 --> 01:54:53.109 different like local SAS all going to 01:54:53.119 --> 01:54:55.910 represent their local SAS at this great 01:54:55.920 --> 01:54:57.750 council. You can't have all the Buddhist 01:54:57.760 --> 01:55:00.629 monks in the world attending a a like a 01:55:00.639 --> 01:55:02.390 council any kind of decision-making 01:55:02.400 --> 01:55:04.310 process, but at least they're sending a 01:55:04.320 --> 01:55:08.354 representative. And again, it's like 01:55:08.364 --> 01:55:09.664 [clears throat] 01:55:09.674 --> 01:55:10.229 [snorts] 01:55:10.239 --> 01:55:12.310 the majority of monks, I mean, they may 01:55:12.320 --> 01:55:14.149 not agree at first, like with regard to 01:55:14.159 --> 01:55:16.470 the second council where you have this 01:55:16.480 --> 01:55:19.430 big debate going on on mainly according 01:55:19.440 --> 01:55:22.390 to the Terravada Buddhist uh tradition 01:55:22.400 --> 01:55:25.350 representing what happened. Um the main 01:55:25.360 --> 01:55:27.669 issue was whether monks are allowed to 01:55:27.679 --> 01:55:31.669 handle money and it just came up no 01:55:31.679 --> 01:55:33.589 because obviously the Buddha didn't 01:55:33.599 --> 01:55:35.750 allow it as found in the rules of 01:55:35.760 --> 01:55:37.910 monastic discipline and so at the 01:55:37.920 --> 01:55:39.589 beginning you had monks that were 01:55:39.599 --> 01:55:41.830 arguing the other way but they all 01:55:41.840 --> 01:55:45.270 agreed at the end okay you know the no 01:55:45.280 --> 01:55:47.750 money people win the argument we consent 01:55:47.760 --> 01:55:51.030 to that let's all recite the py mochoka 01:55:51.040 --> 01:55:53.430 together and [clears throat] the 01:55:53.440 --> 01:55:55.270 majority monks I mean even now the 01:55:55.280 --> 01:55:58.629 majority of monks agree on like the 01:55:58.639 --> 01:56:01.030 contents of the tipica for example there 01:56:01.040 --> 01:56:02.790 there may be

quibbling over like 01:56:02.800 --> 01:56:04.950 punctuation marks or a word here and 01:56:04.960 --> 01:56:07.270 there that kind of thing what exactly I 01:56:07.280 --> 01:56:10.470 mean like the Burmese include a few 01:56:10.480 --> 01:56:13.189 texts that other Buddhist countries 01:56:13.199 --> 01:56:14.950 don't include into their canonical 01:56:14.960 --> 01:56:17.589 typica like the milinda pa is considered 01:56:17.599 --> 01:56:19.189 canonical in Burma not considered 01:56:19.199 --> 01:56:21.109 canonical anywhere else that I know of 01:56:21.119 --> 01:56:23.030 you got a few others like the netti 01:56:23.040 --> 01:56:26.709 pakarana just obscure commentarial works 01:56:26.719 --> 01:56:29.669 sort of like the Paradisa Mega that are 01:56:29.679 --> 01:56:31.350 considered canonical even though like 01:56:31.360 --> 01:56:32.950 the Sri Lankans and the Thai don't 01:56:32.960 --> 01:56:35.990 consider them canonical but still most 01:56:36.000 --> 01:56:39.270 of it they agree on 01:56:39.280 --> 01:56:41.510 just with regard to a lot of things the 01:56:41.520 --> 01:56:43.430 majority of monks agree on like the fact 01:56:43.440 --> 01:56:47.350 that the Bukuni order no longer exists 01:56:47.360 --> 01:56:49.990 most of the of the monks in existence 01:56:50.000 --> 01:56:51.750 would agree on that because most of the 01:56:51.760 --> 01:56:53.109 monks in existence are relative 01:56:53.119 --> 01:56:56.550 relatively conservative Asians. 01:56:56.560 --> 01:56:58.870 So most of the SA of the four quarters 01:56:58.880 --> 01:57:01.990 would agree the Bikuni order does not 01:57:02.000 --> 01:57:03.589 exist. And these women calling 01:57:03.599 --> 01:57:05.910 themselves Bikunis and being promoted by 01:57:05.920 --> 01:57:09.990 people like Ajan Chan Braum, 01:57:10.000 --> 01:57:13.589 it's just fake. 01:57:13.599 --> 01:57:15.990 I mean, you could argue that these women 01:57:16.000 --> 01:57:18.470 calling themselves bikunis now, I mean, 01:57:18.480 --> 01:57:20.310 they're they're wearing the robes by 01:57:20.320 --> 01:57:23.589 theft con calling themselves ordained 01:57:23.599 --> 01:57:26.070 when really they're not. In which case, 01:57:26.080 --> 01:57:28.390 even if the bikuni order was revived, 01:57:28.400 --> 01:57:30.229 like through a great council, the decree 01:57:30.239 --> 01:57:31.830 of a great council, which probably isn't 01:57:31.840 --> 01:57:33.750 going to happen, still they could be 01:57:33.760 --> 01:57:35.510 barred from ever being ordained because 01:57:35.520 --> 01:57:37.589 they've already been wearing the robes 01:57:37.599 --> 01:57:40.070 by theft, which disqualifies someone 01:57:40.080 --> 01:57:41.750 from being really ordained. If you were 01:57:41.760 --> 01:57:43.750 like pretending to be a monk, for 01:57:43.760 --> 01:57:46.790 example, a beu, you're wearing the robes 01:57:46.800 --> 01:57:48.310 and just, you know, living at the 01:57:48.320 --> 01:57:49.910 monastery pretending that you were 01:57:49.920 --> 01:57:52.950 ordained when you really weren't, then 01:57:52.960 --> 01:57:54.629 that's it. I mean, you're barred from 01:57:54.639 --> 01:57:57.270 ever being ordained because I mean, that 01:57:57.280 --> 01:58:01.510 disqualifies you. 01:58:01.520 --> 01:58:03.910 So, yeah. I mean, again, the question, 01:58:03.920 --> 01:58:06.149 was there ever was there any topic on 01:58:06.159 --> 01:58:07.830 which the majority of monks did agree 01:58:07.840 --> 01:58:11.350 on? Yeah, of course there was. There's 01:58:11.360 --> 01:58:13.030 lots of them. In fact, most of the 01:58:13.040 --> 01:58:16.310 established tradition of terra Burma now 01:58:16.320 --> 01:58:18.229 is agreed on by the vast majority of 01:58:18.239 --> 01:58:19.750 monks. There's always going to be a few 01:58:19.760 --> 01:58:22.892 outliers, 01:58:22.902 --> 01:58:24.149 [sighs] you know, like four noble 01:58:24.159 --> 01:58:26.310 truths. Pretty much everyone agrees on 01:58:26.320 --> 01:58:30.790 that. 01:58:30.800 --> 01:58:32.229 And the four noble truths are rather 01:58:32.239 --> 01:58:34.390 important. 01:58:34.400 --> 01:58:37.430 So yeah, the answer to that is yeah. And 01:58:37.440 --> 01:58:39.510 I guess I'm done. 01:58:39.520 --> 01:58:41.910 So, as I should always say at the 01:58:41.920 --> 01:58:43.990 beginning and pretty much never do, if 01:58:44.000 --> 01:58:45.830 you have any questions you think maybe I 01:58:45.840 --> 01:58:48.550 can answer, especially with regard to 01:58:48.560 --> 01:58:51.990 early Buddhism, Terravada Buddhism, 01:58:52.000 --> 01:58:54.310 Buddhist monasticism, kind of the 01:58:54.320 --> 01:58:57.189 history of Buddhism, not necessarily Bob 01:58:57.199 --> 01:58:58.390 Marley. I don't really know anything 01:58:58.400 --> 01:59:01.189 about him or very much anyway, 01:59:01.199 --> 01:59:04.390 meditation, that kind of stuff. then 01:59:04.400 --> 01:59:06.790 feel free to ask the question and I will 01:59:06.800 --> 01:59:08.950 attempt to answer it. Just include it in 01:59:08.960 --> 01:59:11.669 the comments below this video if you 01:59:11.679 --> 01:59:15.430 please and uh like and subscribe. Look 01:59:15.440 --> 01:59:20.390 at the URL links and uh be happy. And 01:59:20.400 --> 01:59:24.440 I'm going to stop recording now.