Volledige transcriptie van Reclaiming Creativity and Creating Impact Through Storytelling & Connection with Christina Blacken

sponsors. 00:02:14.719 --> 00:02:18.240 You've built a name for yourself through hard work and dedication. 00:02:18.479 --> 00:02:22.479 But does managing the business side feel like a distraction from your true passion? 00:02:22.800 --> 00:02:25.039 Are you dealing with unmanaged finances? 00:02:25.360 --> 00:02:28.159 CME Accounting LLC is here to help. 00:02:28.319 --> 00:02:33.520 We specialize in organizing your financial records, allowing you to focus on what you do best. 00:02:33.680 --> 00:02:42.960 With organized books, you'll have more time for what inspires you, whether that's expanding your influence, building relationships, or simply enjoying life. 00:02:43.199 --> 00:02:46.000 Don't let unmanaged finances hold you back. 00:02:46.159 --> 00:02:50.639 Reach out to CME Accounting LLC today and let us help you thrive. 00:02:50.879 --> 00:03:01.599 Visit our website www.cmeaccountinglc.com or email us at admin at cmeaccountinglc.com. 00:03:01.840 --> 00:03:04.319 Alright, let's jump back into our conversation. 00:03:04.560 --> 00:03:05.120 Good day. 00:03:05.280 --> 00:03:07.039 It's a wonderful day in New York. 00:03:07.199 --> 00:03:11.599 My guest and I, Christina, we're just talking about how great the weather is today. 00:03:11.840 --> 00:03:12.400 What is it? 00:03:12.560 --> 00:03:14.719 We're in May, this first day of May. 00:03:14.879 --> 00:03:17.680 You'll be hearing this episode later on in the month. 00:03:17.840 --> 00:03:19.280 We just really love the weather. 00:03:19.439 --> 00:03:34.560 So today we're joined by Christina Blacken, a public speaker, writer, performer, and the founder of The GNU Core, a leadership development company focused on behavior change and authentic leadership. 00:03:34.800 --> 00:03:49.199 Through her work, Christina has trained over 31,000 people across multiple industries, helping them build trust, strengthen connection, and lead with intention, no matter the title. 00:03:49.439 --> 00:04:00.000 She's also the creator of Tell It Proud Framework, which uses personal storytelling as a powerful tool for everyday leadership and courage. 00:04:00.319 --> 00:04:13.280 Her work has been featured in outlets like the New York Times, Forbes, and Business Insider, and she's built a community of over 70,000 people across social media. 00:04:13.520 --> 00:04:21.920 A Utah native who's called New York City home for over 16 years, she also brings a unique perspective. 00:04:22.079 --> 00:04:26.720 And apparently, more uses for Jell-O than most of us would expect. 00:04:27.040 --> 00:04:28.399 Christina, welcome. 00:04:28.560 --> 00:04:32.720 Now, that Jell-O, what are those uses we're talking about here? 00:04:33.199 --> 00:04:41.199 I love keeping that in because people do not know that Jell-O at one point was Utah state food because of the amount of Jell-O that they consumed. 00:04:41.279 --> 00:04:44.399 It was like the highest per capita Jell-O consumption in the country. 00:04:44.560 --> 00:04:46.879 And

you know, New York gets up to some strange things. 00:04:46.959 --> 00:04:48.879 There's a niche for everything. 00:04:49.040 --> 00:04:50.480 So Jell-O could be used here. 00:04:50.560 --> 00:04:53.759 So I feel like it's been a thematic thing in my life, Jell-O. 00:04:54.319 --> 00:04:54.720 Wow. 00:04:54.800 --> 00:04:58.560 You know, that just brought me back to so many memories from my childhood. 00:04:58.639 --> 00:04:59.519 Um, I lived in St. 00:04:59.680 --> 00:05:03.839 Lucia, and we, whenever we would get jello in one, you know, we would get barrels sent to us. 00:05:04.240 --> 00:05:06.800 So we'd get those little boxes of jello in there. 00:05:06.879 --> 00:05:09.439 And oh my goodness, that was Christmas. 00:05:09.920 --> 00:05:10.800 Now, what flavor was it? 00:05:10.879 --> 00:05:12.160 It's important to know the flavor though. 00:05:12.319 --> 00:05:13.439 Many different flavors. 00:05:13.519 --> 00:05:17.199 We had a variety, but what comes to mind now is is it strawberry? 00:05:17.279 --> 00:05:18.319 Oh, I know it's was red. 00:05:18.639 --> 00:05:18.879 Okay. 00:05:18.959 --> 00:05:20.000 Yeah, red was a classic. 00:05:20.319 --> 00:05:22.319 Yes, the the the one I rem I'm remembering. 00:05:22.480 --> 00:05:26.800 I'm remembering different colors as I speak to you, but red definitely was one of those. 00:05:27.439 --> 00:05:29.199 It was probably just red flavor, not even cherry. 00:05:29.360 --> 00:05:30.240 It's just like, what's the flavor? 00:05:30.399 --> 00:05:30.720 Red. 00:05:30.879 --> 00:05:32.560 Yeah, I I don't even know. 00:05:34.639 --> 00:05:38.800 So Christina, I'm so glad that we're having this conversation today. 00:05:38.879 --> 00:05:45.199 I met you through a mutual friend, Christina Brian, who hosts those amazing events in New York City. 00:05:45.360 --> 00:05:47.680 She has been a guest on this podcast. 00:05:47.839 --> 00:05:51.199 So if you're listening, she's definitely somebody to get to know. 00:05:51.519 --> 00:05:57.759 Um, so Christina, I know in the intro we talked about you having 70,000 people across social media. 00:05:57.920 --> 00:05:59.279 That is no easy feat. 00:05:59.519 --> 00:06:00.800 How does this happen? 00:06:01.040 --> 00:06:02.160 It was kind of a fluke. 00:06:02.240 --> 00:06:03.680 I hate to admit it, but it's true. 00:06:03.920 --> 00:06:07.600 I was walking in Prospect Park, which is right across the street from me. 00:06:07.759 --> 00:06:20.959 I live in Brooklyn near Prospect Park, and I had on my mind at the time a pretty significant news story around Charlie Kirk and um the shooting that had happened at a university in Utah where he was located. 00:06:21.120 --> 00:06:24.160 And I just felt compelled as somebody who grew up in Utah to say something. 00:06:24.240 --> 00:06:41.360 And so I wrote a video really quickly in my notepad on my phone called The Values That Drive Conservative Thinking, and recorded this really short three-minute video that just kind of described

specific behavioral values you might see from people who have a specific sort of ideology that might support somebody like a Charlie Kirk. 00:06:41.519 --> 00:06:42.959 And the video just took off. 00:06:43.120 --> 00:06:45.360 It at one point had 1.7 million views. 00:06:45.439 --> 00:06:46.959 I think it might be up to 2 million. 00:06:47.120 --> 00:06:57.360 And from that singular video, I gained around like 45,000 followers or something overnight on Instagram, and then another like 12,000 on TikTok. 00:06:57.600 --> 00:07:06.399 And so it was sort of like right place, right time, right clear message that led to a huge bump in following. 00:07:06.560 --> 00:07:12.560 And from there, I've been able to continue to share my perspective around storytelling, leadership, daily acts of courage people should take. 00:07:12.639 --> 00:07:22.079 But it was not this methodical, I'm growing social media thing over many years, which goes to show you that the algorithm is just it'd be algorithming and you can't always control it, to be fair. 00:07:22.560 --> 00:07:23.680 Thanks for sharing that. 00:07:23.839 --> 00:07:27.920 That that really um brings across the storytelling because that is what happened there. 00:07:28.000 --> 00:07:32.399 You it was something in the news, you had an opinion on it, and you shared it. 00:07:32.560 --> 00:07:37.360 And you used your storytelling framework, I'm guessing, to deliver that. 00:07:37.680 --> 00:07:38.560 I did, yeah. 00:07:38.720 --> 00:07:44.079 And I used some parts of my own personal story of growing up in Utah as a black woman, which I think is very rare. 00:07:44.240 --> 00:07:45.199 People are like, who, what? 00:07:45.360 --> 00:07:45.839 What do you mean? 00:07:46.000 --> 00:07:46.959 A black person in Utah. 00:07:47.040 --> 00:07:50.639 And what's your perspective on this very specific national news story? 00:07:50.720 --> 00:08:04.959 And so I think knowing how your identity can be a lesson or wisdom for others, especially for really important, widespread topics, is a really key thing on using your story in a way that can garner you know influence and and leadership. 00:08:05.279 --> 00:08:05.759 Awesome. 00:08:05.839 --> 00:08:06.240 Thank you. 00:08:06.399 --> 00:08:09.360 Yes, and we will um talk about that a little bit more. 00:08:09.600 --> 00:08:11.439 You spoke about growing up in Utah. 00:08:11.519 --> 00:08:13.439 So let's talk about you a little bit. 00:08:13.600 --> 00:08:19.439 Um, can you tell us one word that describes you now and one word you'd have used to describe yourself as a child? 00:08:19.759 --> 00:08:21.920 I would say they were the same, creative. 00:08:22.079 --> 00:08:25.680 I was a super creative kid who was a storyteller and also a performer. 00:08:25.759 --> 00:08:32.879 I remember one of my earliest memories was stomping around our apartment in my diaper with one of those little microphone toys. 00:08:33.039 --> 00:08:41.759 It had the mic attached to a speaker, and I'd be

stomped around the house making my own little concerts and singing RB and hip-hop songs from the 90s at the time. 00:08:41.919 --> 00:08:52.480 And then I'd one point got this um toy guitar that had the buttons, not actual strings, but you push the buttons and you pretend you're playing, and I would put concerts on for my parents and my two siblings. 00:08:52.639 --> 00:08:53.759 I have two younger sisters. 00:08:53.919 --> 00:09:02.960 So I've always been really creative, constantly using imagination and singing and writing poetry and making up stories for my toys and dolls. 00:09:03.039 --> 00:09:06.320 And so I feel like that still plays a huge role in my life now. 00:09:06.399 --> 00:09:11.600 And I've reclaimed so much of it, probably in the last five years specifically, with how I lived my life and also the business that I built. 00:09:11.840 --> 00:09:15.039 And when you say you reclaim, tell us a little bit more about that. 00:09:15.200 --> 00:09:16.159 What do you mean there? 00:09:16.480 --> 00:09:25.759 You know, I think for a long time, and I'm sure so many people relate to this, I felt like my creativity was a nice hobby and extra and not a central part of my life. 00:09:25.919 --> 00:09:32.320 So I was always in choirs and bands and a cappella groups, and it was always just something to do outside of everything else. 00:09:32.480 --> 00:09:39.759 And so there was a big part of my personality and perspective that I wasn't honoring and sort of just compartmentalizing. 00:09:39.919 --> 00:09:46.399 And when I became an entrepreneur seven years ago, I started to incorporate a lot more of my creative voice as a public speaker and a writer. 00:09:46.559 --> 00:09:53.200 And in the last two years, I stepped fully into more creative expression beyond just the corporate trainings and things I do. 00:09:53.279 --> 00:10:00.399 I write poetry and I'm doing things that are about creative self-expression in addition to behavioral organizational change. 00:10:00.559 --> 00:10:06.879 I try to infuse my creativity in that, but then I realized it doesn't have to only live in the container of organizational change management. 00:10:06.960 --> 00:10:18.720 There's something more here that I haven't fully invested time in because I felt like it's a distraction, maybe a waste of time, or could be detrimental to my stability and well-being long term, which is not necessarily true. 00:10:19.039 --> 00:10:23.919 I'm glad you share that because there might be somebody processing that right now and you probably just help them. 00:10:24.080 --> 00:10:24.960 So thank you. 00:10:25.279 --> 00:10:25.519 Yeah. 00:10:25.679 --> 00:10:28.960 You know, there's a lot of hesitation we all have around creative creativity. 00:10:29.120 --> 00:10:38.639 We think we have to be a Beyoncé or a Jay-Z to be creative, or we have to constantly monetize and prove that creative outlets are worth our time. 00:10:38.799 --> 00:10:41.120 When in fact, it's such a central part of being human. 00:10:41.360 --> 00:10:46.240 Expressing our stories and our creative points of view is an incredible part of being human. 00:10:46.320 --> 00:10:49.360 And so many people feel like they don't have the space and time to do that. 00:10:49.600 --> 00:11:02.720 Yes, and and listening to you, I'm thinking of my daughter and even the memory you shared about, you know, when you were younger and you're just free and you know, embracing that creativity, and somehow along the way, that that kind of goes away sometimes. 00:11:02.879 --> 00:11:11.360 So I'm glad that you mentioned you reclaimed that and that now is an integral part of every your everything, your business, who you are, and all of that. 00:11:11.679 --> 00:11:16.960 Okay, so if there is somewhere in the world you could travel to today, where would that be? 00:11:17.279 --> 00:11:18.559 South Africa. 00:11:18.879 --> 00:11:23.200 I love Amont Piano music, the energy, the vibe. 00:11:23.360 --> 00:11:25.440 I just think I would have such an incredible time. 00:11:25.600 --> 00:11:31.519 I also have a friend who moved there a couple years ago, and we've been talking for a while to have me come out and visit. 00:11:31.759 --> 00:11:36.159 And it just seems like it would be such a nourishing, creative, and fun experience. 00:11:36.320 --> 00:11:39.919 I also haven't done enough traveling around the continent of Africa. 00:11:40.000 --> 00:11:44.159 I've been to Zanzibar, I've been to Ghana, but there's so much more time I'd like to spend there. 00:11:44.240 --> 00:11:47.519 Because I've definitely traveled in Europe, I've traveled in Latin America. 00:11:47.679 --> 00:11:53.519 I feel like it's time I expand my horizons and my experiences and go more to the continent. 00:11:53.840 --> 00:11:55.200 Yes, yes, I love that. 00:11:55.360 --> 00:11:55.840 I love that. 00:11:56.000 --> 00:12:00.080 And if there is one book or movie you'd recommend, um what would that be? 00:12:00.480 --> 00:12:08.639 Movie, it would be Origin by Aber Duvernay, and it's based on a book from Isabel Wilkerson, who's this incredible author. 00:12:08.799 --> 00:12:17.519 It's kind of like this creative genius movie about a woman who discovers how caste systems around the world have shaped how we love and treat each other. 00:12:17.679 --> 00:12:24.720 But it's this beautiful love story that encapsulates so much social complexity around how the world works and how oppression works. 00:12:24.960 --> 00:12:34.639 And I think it's uh the defining movie of our time because it's done so eloquently, infused with deep love and a deep kind of biopic story. 00:12:34.799 --> 00:12:38.799 And a lot of people have not seen it because I don't think it was funded in the ways that it should have been. 00:12:38.879 --> 00:12:44.480 Probably because the subjects it talks about right now are things that are being villainized by our government. 00:12:44.720 --> 00:12:50.480 So I would love if more people saw Origin, even if they

don't know about the book or the author. 00:12:50.639 --> 00:12:59.600 It's an incredible love story about humanity and just how we can treat one another better and reconcile our past and the issues and the injustices that have come from our past. 00:12:59.840 --> 00:13:00.960 And that is so needed. 00:13:01.120 --> 00:13:02.159 That is so needed. 00:13:02.399 --> 00:13:03.759 Thank you for sharing that. 00:13:03.919 --> 00:13:09.679 So going on to the business, is there a highest high you've experienced in business? 00:13:09.759 --> 00:13:11.519 Is that something that comes to mind? 00:13:11.840 --> 00:13:12.559 There's a few. 00:13:12.720 --> 00:13:21.200 I'll say one of them was I took on a pretty significant project with the technology company that was needing help around content moderation. 00:13:21.360 --> 00:13:25.039 And they were really struggling with racism and bias on the platform. 00:13:25.120 --> 00:13:26.960 And they were like, how do we get ahead of this? 00:13:27.120 --> 00:13:34.559 We have social media pages mocking our product and making fun of the fact that people are fighting and constantly not connecting. 00:13:34.639 --> 00:13:45.039 And so I created this moderation course that helped people to learn how to de-escalate conflict on the platform and in their neighborhoods because this tech company was around getting neighbors to communicate with one another. 00:13:45.279 --> 00:13:46.879 And the highs were just the impact. 00:13:46.960 --> 00:13:52.480 We had at the time, I think, 45,000 people signed up to do the training, around a third completed it. 00:13:52.639 --> 00:14:00.720 And we measured that people changed their behavior six months past the course, and they were taking those behaviors and applying them in their families, in their communities. 00:14:00.799 --> 00:14:09.519 So seeing something that came from my brain and from my lived experiences and research actually changed how people think and how they treat each other was incredible. 00:14:09.679 --> 00:14:30.320 And to do that for a year's long, uh, we did the project for three years total, and it was measured by Stanford University in terms of the behavioral impact, and it felt really meaningful, especially at a time because this was from 2020 until 2023, in the middle of the pandemic, when people were really isolated and divided, it felt very important to do that work. 00:14:30.559 --> 00:14:32.320 Oh, wow, talk about impact. 00:14:32.480 --> 00:14:32.960 Goodness. 00:14:33.120 --> 00:14:35.360 Thank you for sharing that and congrats. 00:14:35.840 --> 00:14:36.240 Thank you. 00:14:36.399 --> 00:14:49.679 Yeah, it was a challenging project, but also it felt really meaningful to incorporate all the different methodologies and tools that I use for behavior change, including storytelling, historical context, entertainment. 00:14:49.840 --> 00:14:52.159 You know, the trainings have singing and it's fun. 00:14:52.240 --> 00:14:55.919 Like there are ways that people

are like, I'm learning some really serious stuff, but I'm laughing too. 00:14:56.000 --> 00:14:56.960 And also, this is fun. 00:14:57.039 --> 00:15:00.480 And like we end up having really great reviews of the experience. 00:15:00.559 --> 00:15:02.320 And so I think that's hard to find. 00:15:02.399 --> 00:15:12.960 Like, how do you get people to deal with the tough, hard topics, but make it entertaining and engaging and something that feels like it's going to benefit them and help them to become better leaders, better communicators. 00:15:13.200 --> 00:15:15.519 That's not an easy thing to balance. 00:15:15.600 --> 00:15:17.279 And I'm really glad that we were able to do it. 00:15:17.519 --> 00:15:18.399 Yes, yes. 00:15:18.639 --> 00:15:23.679 And on the opposite side of that, can you think of maybe a not so good moment that you've had? 00:15:23.919 --> 00:15:25.840 Yeah, the last few years have been pretty tough. 00:15:25.919 --> 00:15:32.799 I mean, a lot of my work, so I've primarily done facilitation and workshops and trainings for organizations. 00:15:32.879 --> 00:15:37.840 So helping them to improve trust and communication on teams and within communities. 00:15:38.000 --> 00:15:43.360 And that organizational work got labeled under diversity, equity, and inclusion because I incorporate those tools into the work. 00:15:43.440 --> 00:15:47.120 You can't be a good leader or communicator without knowing how to speak to people who are not like you. 00:15:47.200 --> 00:15:48.720 That's just a fundamental. 00:15:48.879 --> 00:16:00.320 But because I was in DEI, and that is now a slur in our country, the funding, the support, the public conversation completely pivoted from five years ago. 00:16:00.480 --> 00:16:02.720 And so that had a significant impact on my business. 00:16:02.879 --> 00:16:07.279 I lost 90% of my revenue in the last like year and a half that I was normally making. 00:16:07.440 --> 00:16:17.679 And I had to kind of rebuild and start over because so much of the work was being categorized in ways that were really unfortunate, inaccurate, and wrong. 00:16:18.000 --> 00:16:21.600 And a lot of people self-complied because of executive orders. 00:16:21.840 --> 00:16:22.960 So that was really tough. 00:16:23.039 --> 00:16:24.080 It was a really dark moment. 00:16:24.240 --> 00:16:28.799 I think the statistic is like 600,000 black women were pushed out of the workforce. 00:16:28.960 --> 00:16:31.039 They were deregulated, defunded. 00:16:31.120 --> 00:16:33.120 I would consider myself one of those black women. 00:16:33.279 --> 00:16:42.399 And it felt like a methodical attack from our government on our population solely out of fear and not because it was valid or justified. 00:16:42.480 --> 00:16:56.320 And that was really, really hard to move through, especially because the conversation and attitude was a 180 just a year before that, where people are like, Yes, we want to be better, we want to improve our skills, we want to reduce bias,

help us do that. 00:16:56.480 --> 00:16:59.279 And then the next year is like, how dare you talk about bias? 00:16:59.440 --> 00:17:01.759 How dare you want us to do this kind of work? 00:17:01.919 --> 00:17:03.360 It just was it was whiplash. 00:17:03.600 --> 00:17:09.759 And it was very, very disappointing, especially from people who had made commitments and promises that they retracted on. 00:17:09.920 --> 00:17:13.599 Yeah, I'm listening to you, and you know, this environment we live in. 00:17:13.839 --> 00:17:15.759 I don't even know what to make of it. 00:17:15.920 --> 00:17:19.680 But I do know as a black woman myself, I know the experience. 00:17:19.920 --> 00:17:22.559 We are definitely not living through good times. 00:17:22.799 --> 00:17:27.680 And um, I just had a question that pop up for me like, what happens after that? 00:17:27.839 --> 00:17:30.960 You said you lost 90% of your revenue. 00:17:31.200 --> 00:17:32.640 How do you rebuild? 00:17:32.960 --> 00:17:39.759 Well, one of the things I did a couple years before that was build a safety net in case this kind of thing would happen. 00:17:39.920 --> 00:17:44.559 So I had significant savings and investments that helped me to weather that downturn. 00:17:44.720 --> 00:17:53.920 And I did that because I saw a few years prior, um, when Trump was elected right before Joe Biden, he did a test around some of this DEI defunding. 00:17:54.000 --> 00:17:56.240 So he had a couple of key executive orders. 00:17:56.319 --> 00:18:03.039 And I had some friends at the time who primarily had government contracts and they lost all of their business revenue with one order overnight. 00:18:03.200 --> 00:18:05.920 And watching them go through that, I was like, oh, this could happen again. 00:18:06.079 --> 00:18:19.119 So I started to make sure that anytime I was closing projects or deals, I set aside significant amounts of funding to make sure if things happen and I can't close deals or projects are fooled arbitrarily, I'd be okay. 00:18:19.359 --> 00:18:20.079 So that was one. 00:18:20.240 --> 00:18:27.359 The other was, you know, my work has always been around helping people to understand storytelling as this tool of deep relationship change. 00:18:27.519 --> 00:18:28.880 And that's always been the goal. 00:18:28.960 --> 00:18:32.960 It's leadership and storytelling, and that isn't something that's technically being villainized. 00:18:33.039 --> 00:18:34.880 So there were still people interested in the work. 00:18:35.119 --> 00:18:39.680 I just think the way that I messaged around it and the way that I implemented projects shifted too. 00:18:39.759 --> 00:18:47.119 So I started doing more public and individual work outside of institutions because institutions have been so all over the place. 00:18:47.279 --> 00:18:49.279 They're they're a hot mess right now. 00:18:49.440 --> 00:18:50.400 So that helped as well. 00:18:50.559 --> 00:18:56.079 Pivoting who I was serving, the way I was messaging it, in

addition to having my own kind of safety net. 00:18:56.240 --> 00:19:03.519 If I didn't have those things, I think I would have had to have completely closed the business and started over again and just went back to the drawing board. 00:19:03.680 --> 00:19:05.839 So I was fortunate that I planned ahead. 00:19:06.000 --> 00:19:08.319 And I tell people that a lot in entrepreneurship. 00:19:08.480 --> 00:19:09.599 We don't know what's gonna happen. 00:19:09.759 --> 00:19:19.759 The pandemic that happened 2019, when people were excited about 2020 and they were doing their New Year's resolutions, you think they were like on the docket is gonna be a worldwide global pandemic? 00:19:19.920 --> 00:19:20.160 No. 00:19:20.240 --> 00:19:22.000 And most people were not prepared for that. 00:19:22.240 --> 00:19:31.440 So I think now that's just taught me how to be present and not being too fearful of the future, but making some A, B, C, D, E, F G plans in case things don't go well. 00:19:32.160 --> 00:19:33.279 Yes, yes, yes. 00:19:33.359 --> 00:19:35.039 So I heard safety net there. 00:19:35.119 --> 00:19:40.720 I heard um keeping your ears to the ground, I guess, and really understanding what's happening. 00:19:40.880 --> 00:19:49.359 And you mentioned that you saw what happened when Trump was elected the first time, and you could see that if you know it could happen again. 00:19:49.599 --> 00:19:51.279 So preparing for that. 00:19:51.759 --> 00:19:55.680 Yeah, and you also mentioned pivoting, which is a big thing for business owners. 00:19:55.920 --> 00:19:58.960 It's um so I'm really glad you covered all of that. 00:19:59.200 --> 00:20:09.359 And something that comes that's coming to me now is um what if you don't have the safety net or you've already spent it all and now you're still in a situation? 00:20:09.519 --> 00:20:10.880 It's just something that came to me. 00:20:10.960 --> 00:20:14.640 So it's something definitely to for all of us to think through as well. 00:20:14.960 --> 00:20:18.319 But in terms of the business, you touched on it a little bit. 00:20:18.559 --> 00:20:24.480 I talked about it in the introduction, but just tell us a little bit more about what you do in business. 00:20:25.279 --> 00:20:29.839 Yeah, so I started out in I would say 2015. 00:20:30.240 --> 00:20:34.000 I was working in a couple of different corporate industries at that time. 00:20:34.160 --> 00:20:44.640 So I was a professional that was using storytelling, um, mostly as a tool for marketing, campaign building, doing it for nonprofits and media companies. 00:20:44.799 --> 00:20:52.000 And I kept thinking, wow, storytelling is this really powerful tool, but we're only using it for sales or to push things that people don't really need. 00:20:52.160 --> 00:20:59.200 How would it change things if people use storytelling as a tool for their own personal development, their leadership growth, their voice? 00:20:59.440 --> 00:21:10.799 And so I started doing research on how

storytelling affects your brain, how it affects relationships, and built frameworks and tools and started teaching them on the side, mostly at conferences, sometimes to colleagues. 00:21:11.039 --> 00:21:12.400 And I was getting some momentum. 00:21:12.480 --> 00:21:14.400 People were like, wow, I see a huge difference. 00:21:14.480 --> 00:21:16.480 I have clarity on my perspective. 00:21:16.799 --> 00:21:22.960 I have a set of stories I can use to motivate and inspire people to adopt new ideas or take on new goals. 00:21:23.119 --> 00:21:28.000 And so I was like, oh, I can make this a full-time thing and decided to save up what I called my FU fund at the time. 00:21:28.160 --> 00:21:36.079 And I was like, when I get to the number that I could essentially cover all my expenses for six months, I will quit my full-time job and go into this full-time. 00:21:36.240 --> 00:21:42.079 So I was able to hit that number in 2019, which at the time was$20,000, and quit my job. 00:21:42.160 --> 00:21:44.079 And I was like, great, I'm gonna do the new quo. 00:21:44.160 --> 00:21:52.319 I'm going to teach as a public speaker, facilitator, writer, how to use storytelling for leadership and communication and relationship building. 00:21:52.480 --> 00:21:55.200 And I was getting really good momentum and then COVID hit. 00:21:55.279 --> 00:21:56.640 So I was like, yeah, this is great. 00:21:56.720 --> 00:21:58.160 I got referrals from my community. 00:21:58.240 --> 00:21:59.759 I'm building with Fortune 500. 00:22:00.240 --> 00:22:05.920 Companies and then COVID completely shut down any in-person kind of facilitation or teaching. 00:22:06.160 --> 00:22:08.160 So I had to be again pivot. 00:22:08.240 --> 00:22:10.079 And at that time, I had a digital tool. 00:22:10.240 --> 00:22:19.839 So I decided to turn my frameworks, my workshops into online courses and was able to scale to that, you know, 31,000 number that you mentioned in my bio. 00:22:20.240 --> 00:22:22.720 So it was just being flexible, being on your feet. 00:22:22.880 --> 00:22:24.720 And really, my work is twofold. 00:22:24.799 --> 00:22:32.720 It's really helping people to become more conscious of how they use storytelling because 65% of all of our daily conversations are through stories. 00:22:32.880 --> 00:22:34.640 It is unconscious typically. 00:22:34.799 --> 00:22:36.960 And it's usually learned from your upbringing. 00:22:37.039 --> 00:22:44.480 So however you learned how to emulate stories, the beliefs and values that kind of got encoded from your experiences become the way that you tell stories. 00:22:44.640 --> 00:22:47.359 And a majority of people focus on negative storytelling. 00:22:47.440 --> 00:22:52.559 So complaint, criticism, and judgment is the primary way they're communicating and moving through the world. 00:22:52.720 --> 00:22:59.440 And so helping people to shift from that and communicate using their values is really important and primarily what I teach. 00:22:59.519 --> 00:23:13.519 So, how do you use your values to collect the right anecdotes, to use those anecdotes strategically in conversations, in emails, and presentations, and help people to understand the goals you're moving towards and the ideas that you can create together. 00:23:13.680 --> 00:23:20.319 And that's really resonated with people because I think very few people feel like their story is worth telling or that they're a good storyteller at all. 00:23:20.480 --> 00:23:27.519 And most leadership is just you telling stories and hoping and getting people to be motivated about the goals and ideas that you're sharing. 00:23:27.680 --> 00:23:31.599 And good storytellers have a lot of power, whether they're telling the truth or not. 00:23:31.759 --> 00:23:42.400 Right now we live in huge amounts of misinformation from people sharing stereotype stories, scapegoat stories of immigrants, stories of myths about the world and history, like all that is storytelling. 00:23:42.559 --> 00:23:47.279 And so getting other people to understand that and use that is really the crux of my work. 00:23:47.440 --> 00:23:49.279 And it also looks like um events. 00:23:49.359 --> 00:23:52.799 So I facilitate storytelling events and I have a learning community. 00:23:52.880 --> 00:23:59.759 So all of it is how do you get people to use storytelling more intentionally, more thoughtfully, and more with a social justice outcome? 00:24:00.559 --> 00:24:03.279 And how do you go about building those? 00:24:03.359 --> 00:24:10.480 You mentioned online courses, you mention actually being able to facilitate at conferences. 00:24:10.640 --> 00:24:14.000 How do you go about getting these or how do you do that? 00:24:14.880 --> 00:24:16.640 It started off with networking. 00:24:16.720 --> 00:24:27.839 You know, I was really good with first when I had started my company, I was talking to a lot of my colleagues and my peers about my work and the problems that I was solving and why I was focusing on it. 00:24:27.920 --> 00:24:39.519 And a lot of the problems I was solving at the time is reducing bias in how people communicate and how they share their stories and show up in teams and in their organizations. 00:24:39.599 --> 00:24:44.640 And so I was like, hey, if you need help with bias reduction, I have all these tools to help with that. 00:24:44.799 --> 00:24:48.960 So that was the preliminary conversations, and then people would bring me in by referral. 00:24:49.200 --> 00:24:51.359 The other thing I did was content marketing. 00:24:51.440 --> 00:25:04.720 So I do a lot of thought leadership on social media, LinkedIn, TikTok, Instagram, really giving perspectives around social issues and cultural analysis, and then giving specific practical tools, communication tools that people can use to address it. 00:25:04.880 --> 00:25:05.920 And that's helped too. 00:25:06.000 --> 00:25:09.599 It's helped people to see the credibility and the validity of what I do. 00:25:09.839 --> 00:25:19.839 And

then the third thing was really just putting myself out there when I would see asks, when people would open up, you know, open calls for speakers or applications for things. 00:25:19.920 --> 00:25:21.440 I'd be like, let me throw my hat in the ring. 00:25:21.599 --> 00:25:22.319 You know, it might not work. 00:25:22.400 --> 00:25:23.599 I've gotten a lot of notes. 00:25:23.680 --> 00:25:24.480 I'm like, you know what? 00:25:24.559 --> 00:25:25.119 Let me just try. 00:25:25.200 --> 00:25:26.160 Like, I would do that a lot. 00:25:26.240 --> 00:25:28.400 Let me just, and then we'll see what happens. 00:25:28.640 --> 00:25:33.839 Like one thing I've I started doing specifically in New York City is a storytelling event called Change My Mind. 00:25:34.000 --> 00:25:44.559 And that kind of came from this idea that people are isolated and lonely and don't have a lot of spaces to listen to true stories from people who are they're not related to or friends with. 00:25:44.640 --> 00:25:50.559 And that's a primary way of building trust in a community, is knowing people's real stories beyond the surface, beyond stereotype. 00:25:50.720 --> 00:25:55.680 And so I pitched the idea to a government agency here who had an open call for a community grant. 00:25:55.759 --> 00:25:59.039 And I was like, hey, I got this really great series called Change My Mind. 00:25:59.200 --> 00:26:03.119 People tell true nonfiction stories about an act of courage that changed them for the better. 00:26:03.279 --> 00:26:04.880 I facilitate audience interaction. 00:26:05.039 --> 00:26:06.079 And they were like, sounds great. 00:26:06.160 --> 00:26:07.759 I was like, oh, it worked. 00:26:07.839 --> 00:26:09.279 Like, people are they're interested. 00:26:09.440 --> 00:26:14.079 And so they funded it and it became and there, I'm bringing the series back again for the summer. 00:26:14.240 --> 00:26:26.880 And so I guess to say if you have an idea and you want to test it, you have to take the risk to put yourself out there to talk about your point of view, to talk about the problem you solve, and to attract the right people who want to support it and who have that pain point. 00:26:26.960 --> 00:26:29.920 And that process is constant when you're running your own business. 00:26:30.079 --> 00:26:38.799 So that's primarily the activities that I was always focusing on is how do you be a value and service to people and how do they know what you stand for and what problems that you solve? 00:26:40.319 --> 00:26:43.440 Let's pause for a moment to hear from our sponsors. 00:26:43.680 --> 00:26:47.200 You've built a name for yourself through hard work and dedication. 00:26:47.440 --> 00:26:51.519 But does managing the business side feel like a distraction from your true passion? 00:26:51.680 --> 00:26:54.000 Are you dealing with unmanaged finances? 00:26:54.240 --> 00:26:57.119 CME Accounting LLC is here to help. 00:26:57.279 --> 00:27:02.480 We specialize in organizing your financial records, allowing you to focus on what you do best. 00:27:02.640 --> 00:27:06.400 With organized books, you'll have more time for what inspires you. 00:27:06.640 --> 00:27:11.920 Whether that's expanding your influence, building relationships, or simply enjoying life. 00:27:12.160 --> 00:27:14.880 Don't let unmanaged finances hold you back. 00:27:15.119 --> 00:27:19.599 Reach out to CME Accounting LLC today and let us help you thrive. 00:27:19.839 --> 00:27:30.559 Visit our website www.cmeaccountinglc.com or email us at admin at cmeaccountinglc.com. 00:27:30.799 --> 00:27:33.440 Alright, let's jump back into our conversation. 00:27:34.160 --> 00:27:47.039 Yeah, and a lot of that it sounds like um people getting to know that it's through visibility and basically putting yourself out there, answering those questions, being the thought leader, and not necessarily waiting for people to come look for you. 00:27:47.200 --> 00:27:52.079 You put yourself out there, and you also mention referrals, um, which I hear a lot. 00:27:52.319 --> 00:27:52.960 So that's good. 00:27:53.039 --> 00:27:56.480 And the fact that you do a good job, you get more referrals, so that's great. 00:27:56.640 --> 00:28:01.359 And you also mentioned networking, and that's how we met through a networking event. 00:28:01.519 --> 00:28:03.920 So we know how important that is. 00:28:04.160 --> 00:28:11.359 Would you like to just share a little bit more about how you network or any advice on how to do it effectively? 00:28:11.599 --> 00:28:13.519 Yeah, I I love that question. 00:28:13.680 --> 00:28:17.519 I think people assume networking is what I call the pray and spray method. 00:28:17.680 --> 00:28:19.519 Here's my business card, here's what I need. 00:28:19.599 --> 00:28:24.319 You know, it's all this very pushing, like kind of salesy approach. 00:28:24.400 --> 00:28:26.400 And I think that's one of the worst ways to network. 00:28:26.640 --> 00:28:34.480 The primary thing I do is build one-on-one connections with people who I have something in common with, who I might want to learn from. 00:28:34.559 --> 00:28:44.799 And the conversations are usually informational chats, so I can understand what they stand for, what problems are they trying to solve, what are their values, and how can I be of support, and vice versa. 00:28:44.960 --> 00:28:54.319 So it's a lot of actual relationship building, showing curiosity, asking meaningful questions, reaching out and sending supports and information to people when it's useful. 00:28:54.400 --> 00:28:55.680 And I have that with them. 00:28:55.839 --> 00:29:08.000 So typically, if I go to an event, I'll make a connection with a couple of people, and then I'll really follow up and be like, let's have a real conversation and one-on-one with those individuals and start to see efforts and connection and commitment to those. 00:29:08.160 --> 00:29:19.759 Even if you meet three people at an event of 300, that could be so invaluable because those

relationships can become years-long relationships that can contribute in so many ways to what you do and what you are excited about. 00:29:19.920 --> 00:29:22.480 So, really, it's actual genuine relationship building. 00:29:22.559 --> 00:29:32.720 It's better to build thoughtfully with a smaller group of people over time than to like be thoughtless and self-involved and transactional with dozens and dozens of people. 00:29:32.880 --> 00:29:38.640 It's not just about what you can take from people, but genuinely, how can you have a reciprocal, mutually beneficial relationship with people? 00:29:38.799 --> 00:29:39.680 And that takes time. 00:29:39.839 --> 00:29:45.039 There is no shortcut, there is no buzzy, hot take social media way of doing that. 00:29:45.200 --> 00:29:48.240 It takes time to show genuine curiosity and effort to people. 00:29:48.400 --> 00:29:49.759 And so that's the primary thing. 00:29:49.920 --> 00:29:56.960 I would say most of my community, my network, value that I'm a dependable person, that I'm a person that doesn't just pop up when I need something. 00:29:57.200 --> 00:30:00.640 And I'm kind of constantly seeding those relationships over time. 00:30:01.440 --> 00:30:08.640 And for someone who has grown their social media so extensively, how do you like bridge the gap there? 00:30:08.720 --> 00:30:15.680 Like now, you know, because we talked about intentional and you know, one-on-one and all of that when you meet people at events. 00:30:15.839 --> 00:30:18.480 So, how does that work in the social media space? 00:30:18.640 --> 00:30:20.880 And how does that change all that? 00:30:21.039 --> 00:30:25.440 I was just having a conversation with a friend about this because I'm still figuring that out. 00:30:25.680 --> 00:30:31.359 I find social media very frustrating, and I think it's frustrating in the sense that you have little control. 00:30:31.599 --> 00:30:45.039 Even if you have a huge following, you cannot control how much of that following actually sees your content and engages with it because the algorithm is set up to intermittently reinforce the success of your content to keep you on the platform making content for free. 00:30:45.119 --> 00:30:46.240 That's just a fact. 00:30:46.400 --> 00:30:49.440 And um, the ethics of the algorithm sometimes can be questionable. 00:30:49.599 --> 00:31:04.400 So, in terms of relationship building, I think comments, DMs, like actual one-on-one conversations with people who continuously engage with the content can be useful because those people show an interest beyond being entertained, escaping for a second, and then moving on. 00:31:04.640 --> 00:31:16.480 And so I'm still figuring that out in terms of building one-on-one connections with people who have indicated through the like of a content post or through a follow that they they're interested, they want to know more. 00:31:16.640 --> 00:31:24.559 But I think about social media almost kind of like a street in a city where you don't know who's gonna pass your street. 00:31:24.720 --> 00:31:28.720 You might have a cool storefront and you got a sign that's like stop by and get a coffee. 00:31:28.799 --> 00:31:30.799 And some people may come in and some may not. 00:31:30.960 --> 00:31:37.200 And so you have a neighborhood of 50,000 people, but there's no guarantee that all 50,000 of those people come into the coffee shop. 00:31:37.279 --> 00:31:39.680 And that's kind of how the social media game is. 00:31:39.839 --> 00:31:42.559 So you're like, hey, come, don't you remember me? 00:31:42.640 --> 00:31:43.759 We live in the same neighborhood. 00:31:43.839 --> 00:31:45.119 You could come inside. 00:31:45.279 --> 00:31:54.400 And so I'm kind of trying to find a balance of not allowing these platforms to siphon my energy and my joy and get something in return out of it. 00:31:54.480 --> 00:31:55.440 And that is a hard balance. 00:31:55.519 --> 00:32:00.799 And I think a lot of entrepreneurs constantly have that battle of social media can be important. 00:32:00.960 --> 00:32:02.720 But I'll keep it really honest. 00:32:02.880 --> 00:32:07.279 A lot of my business I told you I built, social media had nothing to do with it at all. 00:32:07.440 --> 00:32:13.839 Like all those relationships, those projects primarily were built offline through networking and communities, not from social media. 00:32:14.000 --> 00:32:19.039 Social media was useful in terms of some visibility, credibility in terms of influence. 00:32:19.119 --> 00:32:24.799 But besides that, it was genuine real relationship building offline that helped me to build a business without a huge social following. 00:32:24.960 --> 00:32:29.119 I just got that following six months ago in terms of how big it is now. 00:32:29.279 --> 00:32:39.119 Before that, I had maybe three or four thousand followers on each platform, three thousand on Insta, 4,000 on LinkedIn, which is still an okay number, but it wasn't 70,000. 00:32:39.279 --> 00:32:44.559 So that is a very recent development that had nothing to do really with any of the business stuff I had done before. 00:32:44.720 --> 00:32:46.160 So I think that's the other thing, too. 00:32:46.319 --> 00:32:47.599 People think they have to have. 00:32:47.759 --> 00:32:51.599 I know people with humongous social media followings who make zero dollars from it. 00:32:51.759 --> 00:32:52.960 There is no guarantee. 00:32:53.039 --> 00:32:57.680 You have to work very hard to convert people in social media to actual genuine customers. 00:32:57.759 --> 00:32:58.720 That's a whole other conversation. 00:32:58.799 --> 00:33:03.039 But yeah, you do not need social media to have a successful, sustainable business. 00:33:03.440 --> 00:33:03.839 Thank you. 00:33:03.920 --> 00:33:05.519 Thanks for that perspective. 00:33:05.759 --> 00:33:14.000 And earlier you mentioned about funding for one of the programs that you're having, and you're actually running it this summer. 00:33:14.160 --> 00:33:17.440

So I was wondering if you could tell us a little bit more about how that works. 00:33:17.599 --> 00:33:22.079 Like the just anything about funding and grant applications that you could tell us about. 00:33:22.240 --> 00:33:28.640 And tell us a little bit more about your programming coming this summer, in case somebody's interested in being part of it. 00:33:29.119 --> 00:33:29.680 Absolutely. 00:33:29.759 --> 00:33:30.000 Yeah. 00:33:30.079 --> 00:33:31.599 So it was a grant in New York City. 00:33:31.680 --> 00:33:39.200 We have two offices called the New York City Office for the Prevention of Hate Crimes and the New York City Commission on Human Rights. 00:33:39.359 --> 00:33:47.920 And both of their goals are to fund through, you know, pack taxpaying dollars, interventions, and projects that help to reduce bias in neighborhoods. 00:33:48.000 --> 00:33:57.599 So they fund all types of different projects from trainings and interventions, direct service to things like I did, a storytelling event that helps people to connect and build community. 00:33:57.839 --> 00:33:59.119 And I just Googled it. 00:33:59.200 --> 00:34:01.359 I was like New York City grants, because I was like, you know what? 00:34:01.440 --> 00:34:02.640 I'm interested in doing an event. 00:34:02.799 --> 00:34:03.759 Could I get funding for it? 00:34:03.920 --> 00:34:04.799 Could I get support? 00:34:04.960 --> 00:34:10.079 So I was just Googling away and came across their open call for the grant application. 00:34:10.320 --> 00:34:17.440 And because I had already done the event before, uh for a community membership I was already a part of, I had a test pilot. 00:34:17.599 --> 00:34:21.519 So I wasn't coming off of um, had never done the event before. 00:34:21.599 --> 00:34:24.320 I had some legs to it and some momentum and some track record. 00:34:24.480 --> 00:34:26.480 So I do think that helps with these applications. 00:34:26.639 --> 00:34:29.280 You can prove you've had some level of impact. 00:34:29.440 --> 00:34:40.320 You have a structure and a point of view and a goal, and they feel more um secure, I would say, in investing in something that has some level of validity and some track record. 00:34:40.480 --> 00:34:42.559 And then from there, I just delivered really well. 00:34:42.639 --> 00:34:45.039 I was really responsive to all of their emails. 00:34:45.199 --> 00:34:47.840 I was really thorough with how I planned and structured things. 00:34:48.000 --> 00:34:50.960 I made a really comprehensive report on the impact. 00:34:51.039 --> 00:34:52.480 And that's why they wanted to work with me again. 00:34:52.559 --> 00:34:54.960 Because they were like, hey, you are so easy to work with. 00:34:55.360 --> 00:34:59.920 Your event did really well in terms of the ways people feel and the feedback they gave. 00:35:00.079 --> 00:35:01.039 Let's do it again. 00:35:01.199 --> 00:35:09.199 And the event structure itself, you know, the funding for it primarily covers my fees as somebody who's producing and facilitating the event. 00:35:09.360 --> 00:35:13.760 It also covers honorariums for the storytellers who I have performing the show. 00:35:13.920 --> 00:35:16.800 And it covers some basic, you know, videography and stuff. 00:35:16.880 --> 00:35:23.519 And the venues I've worked with luckily have been very low cost or no fee, which has helped with structuring the grant. 00:35:23.760 --> 00:35:27.920 And now I'm partnering with a new organization this year called A New. 00:35:28.239 --> 00:35:30.719 They're a social impact space in the West Village. 00:35:30.880 --> 00:35:36.000 And I'm really excited about that because they can help with bringing other community members and people into this event. 00:35:36.159 --> 00:35:49.840 But the event is really, you know, a credible way for people to hear a real story, to be inspired, to feel hopeful about the future, to make a connection with a new person and to do it in a way that doesn't feel like it's a huge cost or not affordable. 00:35:50.000 --> 00:35:52.800 Right now we have a wait list for the next event, which is May 14th. 00:35:52.960 --> 00:35:55.840 I don't know when this podcast is coming out, but that's their next event. 00:35:55.920 --> 00:35:58.400 It's happening May 14th, 6 to 8 p.m. 00:35:58.719 --> 00:36:10.239 But I'm hoping outside of the series, um, my thinking has been how do people get access to tools that help them to make meaningful connection with people, particularly at a time where people are really lonely. 00:36:10.400 --> 00:36:21.360 I think the loneliness epidemic has grown significantly because of COVID, but also because of the horrific oppressive injustices that are being enacted by our leadership across business and government. 00:36:21.519 --> 00:36:28.639 And so creating spaces for people to feel safe, to feel seen, to feel heard is incredibly important right now. 00:36:28.800 --> 00:36:36.000 And I think anyone who's doing that kind of work is going to have a huge uptick in interest, even if they have to find creative ways to fund it. 00:36:36.239 --> 00:36:36.880 Yes, yes. 00:36:37.039 --> 00:36:38.159 So loneliness. 00:36:39.119 --> 00:36:42.480 Well, I'm glad that you're playing a part in the solution, right? 00:36:42.639 --> 00:36:47.440 Because uh a lot of people in this environment they're creating the problem. 00:36:47.920 --> 00:36:49.679 So that's 100% true. 00:36:49.920 --> 00:36:50.239 Yes. 00:36:50.639 --> 00:36:53.360 We were hearing about all this wonderful work that you're doing. 00:36:53.519 --> 00:36:55.119 What does team look like for you? 00:36:55.360 --> 00:36:56.079 Yeah, absolutely. 00:36:56.159 --> 00:37:04.239 So I'm a solopreneur, so I do a majority of the work myself, but I do have contractors who I'll hire for very specific things. 00:37:04.400 --> 00:37:09.199 So I've had a virtual assistant for many years who've helped with research and preparation. 00:37:09.519 --> 00:37:14.079 I've had editors when it comes

to I do a podcast and other kinds of forms of content. 00:37:14.239 --> 00:37:17.119 I've paid CPAs to help with finance and tax. 00:37:17.440 --> 00:37:22.400 So I really hire experts for specific areas of the business that I don't want to run fully by myself. 00:37:22.559 --> 00:37:25.119 But a lot of the execution is still on me. 00:37:25.360 --> 00:37:32.639 And one reason why I chose that is the level of freedom and autonomy and also not having to have the pressure to pay a team full-time. 00:37:32.800 --> 00:37:39.840 And thank goodness I had that structure because with that loss of revenue, I would have been really dire and unfortunate if I had a team I needed to pay. 00:37:40.079 --> 00:37:49.840 The other reason is I have never necessarily wanted to build a large corporate structure where my majority of my time is spent managing people. 00:37:50.000 --> 00:37:58.559 I have been told in previous corporate jobs that I'm a really great manager and I think I have a knack for managing and mentoring people, but that's not where I want to spend 90% of my time. 00:37:58.639 --> 00:38:00.480 I actually like the execution of the work. 00:38:00.639 --> 00:38:05.280 I love public speaking facilitating, being in the work and less in managing people to do the work. 00:38:05.440 --> 00:38:09.760 And so that is one reason why I've built a more lean solopreneur model. 00:38:09.920 --> 00:38:17.920 And the reason why it's been sustainable is because my model has repeating services that are replicable and scalable outside of a big team. 00:38:18.000 --> 00:38:21.840 So me running a course can reach thousands of people without having to hire a lot of people. 00:38:22.000 --> 00:38:32.000 Me doing public speaking, I can tweak my intellectual property and deliver that same kind of intellectual property in slightly new ways for different clients and tailoring it to their situation. 00:38:32.159 --> 00:38:43.039 So I've been able to really be smart about how I scale things so I don't burn out and that I can be lean and still have an impact and still have flexibility to not be working all the time. 00:38:43.280 --> 00:38:47.840 But I think that's a unique model because of me being a public speaker and that being the primary thing I offer. 00:38:48.079 --> 00:38:53.360 For other people who have maybe more tech-heavy stuff or different services, they need more of a team for that. 00:38:53.440 --> 00:38:56.159 But because of my structure, I don't necessarily always need that. 00:38:56.400 --> 00:38:59.039 Yeah, but it sounds like you you were very intentional about it. 00:38:59.119 --> 00:39:01.920 You knew what you wanted and you you know what works for you. 00:39:02.159 --> 00:39:04.320 And we know we talked about pubertine before. 00:39:04.400 --> 00:39:07.599 So if that ever changes, even in that case, you could always change. 00:39:07.679 --> 00:39:09.840 But for now, this is what works for you. 00:39:09.920 --> 00:39:10.800 So I I love that. 00:39:11.119 -->

00:39:14.239 I think also, too, you know, one big thing, you're right. 00:39:14.400 --> 00:39:26.400 The intention in terms of I wanted to be able to take on a specific level of clients a year and still be able to cover all the expenses and have some more for savings, safety net future. 00:39:26.559 --> 00:39:36.400 And that's one reason why I did a lot of organizational work because I can take on, say, 20 clients in a year and be okay versus needing to take on hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of clients and transactions. 00:39:36.480 --> 00:39:38.320 So that's something people can keep in mind as well. 00:39:38.400 --> 00:39:44.159 You don't necessarily have to burn yourself out or have hundreds of clients of years to have like a sustainable business. 00:39:44.400 --> 00:39:44.719 Yeah. 00:39:44.800 --> 00:39:49.039 And I had a difference there between just necessary, like working with organizations. 00:39:49.199 --> 00:39:51.360 So I guess that's what we call B2B, right? 00:39:51.440 --> 00:39:52.960 Like being able to do that. 00:39:53.199 --> 00:39:55.199 Um thanks for sharing that. 00:39:55.360 --> 00:39:57.440 And you mentioned intellectual property. 00:39:57.599 --> 00:39:59.920 What do you put in place to protect that? 00:40:00.800 --> 00:40:03.760 Well, I have some copyrights, they're not always honored. 00:40:03.840 --> 00:40:08.079 I will say that, but I have copyrights on my name, of my business. 00:40:08.239 --> 00:40:12.320 There are copyrights on certain phrases that I've developed for frameworks. 00:40:12.480 --> 00:40:14.000 And that's the primary thing. 00:40:14.159 --> 00:40:26.719 I think also I try not to be too cagey around how I talk about stuff because you know, at the end of the day, I want people to be able to take these tools and to improve their experiences. 00:40:26.800 --> 00:40:29.199 I don't necessarily want to hold it just for myself. 00:40:29.280 --> 00:40:39.280 Um, but I primarily make sure that people need to be in person typically to experience it so that they can really digest it and not necessarily just replicate it from somewhere else. 00:40:39.440 --> 00:40:42.639 But yeah, copyrights are very important, trademarks are very important. 00:40:42.960 --> 00:40:49.280 I started those processes many years ago because it takes a little while to trademark or copyright things. 00:40:49.440 --> 00:40:59.119 So that's the first step is you know, use legal protections to be able to keep people from trying to siphon away your labor in ways that are exploitative or not okay. 00:40:59.440 --> 00:41:01.840 And it sometimes it doesn't stop people. 00:41:01.920 --> 00:41:12.559 I've had copycats, I've had people try to copy my business name, I've had people try to copy frameworks and things, and I guess that's a form of flattery, you know, mimicry is a form of flattery at times. 00:41:12.800 --> 00:41:18.480 It can be frustrating too, especially from people who claim that they care about equity and social justice. 00:41:18.639 --> 00:41:26.079 But I've also realized that if you've developed something that's from your specific lived experience, it's hard to copy and steal as well. 00:41:26.239 --> 00:41:29.920 So there's parts of the things I teach other people just could not replicate. 00:41:30.000 --> 00:41:32.880 Like I'm I have very specific experiences as a black woman from Utah. 00:41:33.039 --> 00:41:35.519 I talk about as context for a lot of the tools. 00:41:35.760 --> 00:41:38.559 If you aren't that, I mean it's hard to be like, well, I'm gonna steal that. 00:41:38.639 --> 00:41:44.079 You still have to have your own flavor, your own sauce, your own style in terms of doing and delivering. 00:41:44.159 --> 00:41:46.719 You know, I'm a performer, so I sing in a lot of my trainings. 00:41:46.960 --> 00:41:50.159 I facilitate really interesting dialogue between people. 00:41:50.239 --> 00:41:51.920 I use humor and comedy. 00:41:52.079 --> 00:41:53.920 And a lot of people can't always do that. 00:41:54.000 --> 00:41:57.679 So that's also part of it, too, is what is your unique sauce of how you deliver what you deliver? 00:41:57.760 --> 00:42:02.000 You can try to take the tools, you can steal the name, but can you deliver it in the same way? 00:42:02.079 --> 00:42:02.719 Probably not. 00:42:02.960 --> 00:42:03.920 So that's the key too. 00:42:04.000 --> 00:42:20.079 People need to focus more on their unique perspective and less on shortcuts and desperation and feeling like copying is the only way to find a sense of stability and security because you might be wasting your time and there might be something unique and cool about your perspective of something that might be worth pursuing. 00:42:21.119 --> 00:42:21.760 All right. 00:42:22.159 --> 00:42:26.480 So, Christina, what does success mean to you? 00:42:27.920 --> 00:42:33.119 I love that question because I feel like a lot of us are questioning what we think success is. 00:42:33.599 --> 00:42:36.320 For me, it's being creatively realized. 00:42:36.400 --> 00:42:38.719 Like, am I living to my fullest creative potential? 00:42:38.800 --> 00:42:41.039 And am I living in integrity with my values? 00:42:41.280 --> 00:42:51.119 One of the main reasons I decided to become an entrepreneur is I felt like the opportunities for my ancestors to have choice in freedom and autonomy was so limited. 00:42:51.280 --> 00:43:02.159 I have enslaved ancestors and come from a background of a lot of different adversities and setbacks that my family experienced intergenerationally and currently in this generation of my time. 00:43:02.400 --> 00:43:07.679 And so, choice, creative autonomy and choice and freedom of how I use my labor and time is really important. 00:43:07.920 --> 00:43:17.599 I would also say, too, this idea of living in my values, like not feeling like I have to portray myself to get a paycheck, you know, doing stuff that doesn't feel good, that doesn't feel just. 00:43:17.760 --> 00:43:24.000 A lot of

people are in those moral conundrums where they're doing jobs that are really harmful to the world, to the planet, to people. 00:43:24.159 --> 00:43:26.239 And then they go home and they're like, is this worth it? 00:43:26.320 --> 00:43:29.519 I'm stressing out at a job that's doing bad stuff. 00:43:29.760 --> 00:43:35.360 And you're like, is this worth crushing my soul and my body? 00:43:35.519 --> 00:43:50.320 And I'm I've been so lucky to close that gap a lot over the years where I feel like I get to show up every day and make things that have the impact I would like them to have on people and sleep well at night and not feel like I'm betraying myself or betraying others in that process. 00:43:50.480 --> 00:43:52.159 And so that to me is success. 00:43:52.239 --> 00:43:56.400 It's hard to have that in the world that we live in and the ways that the world is designed that we live in. 00:43:56.559 --> 00:43:59.440 There's very few people who maybe feel like they have choice. 00:44:00.079 --> 00:44:02.239 And success to me is choice and integrity. 00:44:03.760 --> 00:44:04.719 I love that. 00:44:05.039 --> 00:44:06.400 Thank you so much. 00:44:06.800 --> 00:44:13.199 And um, if there is just one final thing you'd like to share with our audience, what would that be? 00:44:13.360 --> 00:44:14.000 Anything? 00:44:14.320 --> 00:44:20.800 I would say tell your own story before someone does it for you, because most people feel like their stories don't matter. 00:44:20.880 --> 00:44:32.079 And they typically are operating on stories that have been indoctrinated on them from childhood, maybe from religious institutions if they attend those, educational institutions, media, TV. 00:44:32.559 --> 00:44:36.079 You get to define your own value, your own worth, your own story. 00:44:36.159 --> 00:44:39.119 And it's one of the most powerful things that you can do as an individual. 00:44:39.199 --> 00:44:45.280 And so every person who listens to this, I hope you can understand and know that your story is important and necessary. 00:44:45.440 --> 00:44:52.400 And the sooner that you tell it, and the sooner you use it and own it, the sooner that we can have a better future and a better outcome. 00:44:52.480 --> 00:44:56.880 And I would wish, I would hope, that more people understand that their story matters. 00:44:58.000 --> 00:44:59.840 You're speaking to me here. 00:45:00.000 --> 00:45:02.239 And I'm sure many others were listening. 00:45:02.400 --> 00:45:04.159 So thank you so much for sharing that. 00:45:04.320 --> 00:45:07.679 And can you tell us how our listeners can reach you? 00:45:08.480 --> 00:45:15.599 Yes, one of the best ways is on my website, which is the newquo.com, T-H-E-N-E-W-Q-U-O.com. 00:45:15.760 --> 00:45:29.840 I also have a podcast as well called Tell It Proud, which is about stories of courage, too good, to erase or ignore, about all types of ideas in terms of history and culture and social justice that can inspire people to change for the better. 00:45:30.079 --> 00:45:30.960 And my social media. 00:45:31.039 --> 00:45:33.199 I'm Christina Blacken on all platforms. 00:45:33.280 --> 00:45:39.280 So you can see me kikiing and acting a full on Insta, TikTok, LinkedIn, wherever you use your social media. 00:45:39.440 --> 00:45:41.119 So definitely check out my work there. 00:45:41.360 --> 00:45:41.679 Okay. 00:45:42.079 --> 00:45:46.320 Thanks so much for spending time with us and for sharing so much with all of us. 00:45:46.559 --> 00:45:51.840 I think I speak on behalf of myself and all those listening that we really enjoyed the conversation today. 00:45:52.000 --> 00:45:53.440 So thanks again. 00:45:53.840 --> 00:45:54.800 Thank you. 00:45:55.679 --> 00:46:02.239 A quick note before we wrap up: the insights and experiences shared by our guests are their own. 00:46:02.800 --> 00:46:07.840 We love creating space for real conversations about business and growth. 00:46:08.400 --> 00:46:10.480 And everyone's journey is unique. 00:46:11.360 --> 00:46:17.840 Therefore, this podcast is for informational and inspirational purposes only. 00:46:18.400 --> 00:46:24.559 It is not meant to replace legal, financial, or other professional advice. 00:46:25.280 --> 00:46:34.000 So we encourage you to take what's useful, do your own due diligence and build what works best for you. 00:46:34.639 --> 00:46:38.480 Thanks for listening to Begin Build Blossom Your Business Journey. 00:46:38.639 --> 00:46:45.679 We hope today's conversation gave you the insights and inspiration you need to move forward on your own path. 00:46:45.920 --> 00:46:51.519 Don't forget to subscribe or follow wherever you get your podcast so you never miss an episode. 00:46:51.760 --> 00:46:53.039 Do you have feedback? 00:46:53.280 --> 00:46:59.199 We'd love to hear from you at podcast at cmeaccountinglc.com. 00:46:59.440 --> 00:47:02.559 Join us again next week for a new episode.