Transkrip penuh untuk Episode 32 - From Small Town to Broadway & Amazing Race Winner | Craig Ramsay

00:02:01.760 --> 00:02:02.400 I like you. 00:02:02.560 --> 00:02:03.040 Thank you. 00:02:03.439 --> 00:02:04.879 Well, that's I think that's generous. 00:02:05.040 --> 00:02:05.840 Uh thank you. 00:02:06.000 --> 00:02:08.319 Uh, but uh yeah, I grew up in Harrow, Ontario. 00:02:08.560 --> 00:02:11.520 I'm a county boy, and I loved it. 00:02:11.680 --> 00:02:16.879 I had a great upbringing, uh, supportive family, thank God, and uh great community. 00:02:17.120 --> 00:02:21.919 And I always loved to perform, and I think everyone noticed that. 00:02:22.080 --> 00:02:33.039 So uh they tried to support me as much as they could, but obviously there's limits to um how I can expand and uh grow my entertainment uh abilities in Harrow. 00:02:33.360 --> 00:02:48.639 Uh but then I got uh lots of opportunity in Windsor to work with a lot of community theater, and I went to WCCA uh program for the arts in uh midway through high school, and then I went for a year and a half to University of Windsor for their BFA musical theater program. 00:02:48.960 --> 00:02:58.719 I found that uh the program wasn't a great fit for me because I was truly obsessed with performing and not wanting to write down about performing. 00:02:58.960 --> 00:03:00.479 Got it, you know, with a degree program. 00:03:00.719 --> 00:03:01.360 So that's my fault. 00:03:02.319 --> 00:03:06.639 Yes, yeah, that's my fault for not researching what would have been the best match for me. 00:03:06.719 --> 00:03:10.319 Uh, but uh valuable experience and then danced. 00:03:10.400 --> 00:03:18.240 Uh always had this love for ballet, even when I considered myself more of an actor singer, uh, but I was very flexible. 00:03:18.400 --> 00:03:25.439 Even as a hockey player, uh, I was doing those double axles and triple LUTs uh on the ice. 00:03:25.520 --> 00:03:40.000 And uh I loved ballet and I was able to attend the Royal Winnipeg Ballet from university as a student on full scholarship, thank goodness, because uh is a very expensive genre of the entertainment industry. 00:03:40.319 --> 00:03:51.199 And then um got back to combining all of them singing, dancing, and acting, which led to uh a really lucky and and wonderful Broadway uh onstage performing career. 00:03:51.360 --> 00:03:51.680 Yeah. 00:03:51.840 --> 00:03:56.000 Yeah, and then I got reality TV, kind of fell into my lap. 00:03:56.240 --> 00:03:58.639 Yeah, yeah, we'll talk about that in a sec. 00:03:58.800 --> 00:04:00.400 Um so that's that's the upbringing. 00:04:00.639 --> 00:04:01.439 Up that's the upbringing. 00:04:01.520 --> 00:04:01.599 Yeah. 00:04:01.759 --> 00:04:09.759 And and we talked on the phone um when we first met there uh a little bit about obviously being gay, being open. 00:04:09.919 --> 00:04:11.120 Uh who me? 00:04:11.280 --> 00:04:12.479 Yeah, who you right? 00:04:12.800 --> 00:04:13.199 What? 00:04:13.439 --> 00:04:19.600 Um, but as a as a as a young kid in you know, country harrow, yeah. 00:04:19.759 --> 00:04:21.040 Uh how was that like? 00:04:21.199 --> 00:04:28.160 Because it's not like it was now, where it's a lot easier to be open and a lot easier to just express yourself. 00:04:28.480 --> 00:04:30.800 But growing up, I'm sure it was difficult. 00:04:31.120 --> 00:04:32.240 Yeah, big sip here. 00:04:32.319 --> 00:04:32.879 Here we go. 00:04:33.120 --> 00:04:35.600 We're gonna get into the real the real weeds of this. 00:04:35.759 --> 00:04:39.360 Yeah, and I don't even know if I would make the statement that it's easier now. 00:04:39.439 --> 00:04:45.360 I think that it the social media aspect has a whole different level for especially youth coming out. 00:04:45.519 --> 00:04:48.639 Uh, but I can definitely speak for my own experience. 00:04:48.879 --> 00:04:56.800 And it growing up in Harrow, um if if anyone's not familiar with Harrow, it's one of the smallest uh communities in Essex County. 00:04:57.040 --> 00:05:04.639 And uh I think it lent itself to have huge benefits for me because it was so small and everyone knew each other. 00:05:04.800 --> 00:05:08.240 And uh with that, I think we all loved each other. 00:05:08.480 --> 00:05:12.959 Like everyone was somewhat of an outcast when you're there's only a certain number of people. 00:05:13.199 --> 00:05:13.439 Yeah. 00:05:14.000 --> 00:05:20.160 So we all can relate to each other with that, and there's a sensitivity to it, at least when I grew up. 00:05:20.399 --> 00:05:26.399 And I think that uh adults know who you are before you do as a youth. 00:05:26.639 --> 00:05:30.959 And I think that it was quite obvious to a lot of people, but not to me, because it was my journey. 00:05:31.120 --> 00:05:31.360 Right. 00:05:31.600 --> 00:05:48.800 And like I often talk about this uh when I when I go um with a keynote uh on uh equality and diversity, in the sense that um when I was y young, there it wasn't about the sex or the sexuality aspect of it. 00:05:48.959 --> 00:05:50.959 Something was different with me, right? 00:05:51.120 --> 00:05:56.800 And there was uh like this air of um of lightness, if you will. 00:05:57.199 --> 00:06:01.839 And I found that the adults really protected me, which was lovely. 00:06:02.079 --> 00:06:02.560 That's great. 00:06:02.800 --> 00:06:09.040 In community, in school, and in um my church, even the United Church in in Harrow. 00:06:09.600 --> 00:06:15.120 And I was protected through those development years that I'm I wish all children had, and they don't. 00:06:15.199 --> 00:06:18.480 So I would say Harrow is truly the greatest place to grow. 00:06:18.720 --> 00:06:18.959 Yeah. 00:06:19.120 --> 00:06:21.680 And this is one I'm one of the reasons why you're moving back. 00:06:21.759 --> 00:06:23.199 You're moving, you guys are moving your life back. 00:06:23.519 --> 00:06:28.560 Well, the truth is too, some people know this, a lot of people don't, is that I really never left. 00:06:28.720 --> 00:06:43.759 Like, as I said, Harrow isn't Broadway, Windsor isn't Broadway, and for years I

kind of judged on like inappropriately the area because it I didn't understand why it couldn't provide me the satisfaction of my career that I wanted. 00:06:44.000 --> 00:06:48.079 So as I mature, it obviously became obvious that I was reaching big. 00:06:48.160 --> 00:06:51.279 Like I wanted it all, I wanted the big Broadway stage. 00:06:51.439 --> 00:06:58.959 Um, but with that, I never considered New York my home, LA my home, on tour with Mama Mia for two and a half years throughout the US. 00:06:59.199 --> 00:07:00.879 I always considered Harrow my home. 00:07:00.959 --> 00:07:06.240 So whenever I had a retreat or a vacation or time off, I would come to Harrow, but I would regroup. 00:07:06.480 --> 00:07:13.519 It's um it's sort of like in you know, Forrest Gump, Jenny, when uh she would go back home and she is is just hibernating. 00:07:13.600 --> 00:07:14.319 That's what I would do. 00:07:14.480 --> 00:07:16.000 And it was at my parents' house. 00:07:16.160 --> 00:07:19.759 And now I live next door to where my parents' house was. 00:07:19.839 --> 00:07:20.079 Yeah. 00:07:20.240 --> 00:07:23.040 Uh so it was a good transition, but I never really left. 00:07:23.199 --> 00:07:24.160 I never felt like I left. 00:07:24.399 --> 00:07:24.639 Yeah. 00:07:24.720 --> 00:07:24.879 Yeah. 00:07:24.959 --> 00:07:38.800 And it's one thing to like have these like big dreams and these big aspirations of doing these things that so many people can get lost in what you become and who you have to maybe become to do these things. 00:07:38.959 --> 00:07:39.279 Right. 00:07:39.360 --> 00:08:00.399 Uh, because I I was just had I just had another episode uh of this podcast recently where uh like the whole conversation was about like knowing who you are and knowing what your purpose is and knowing the things that you want to do versus the things that maybe are you're driven by your ego or you're driven by you know trying to prove other people wrong or whatever versus doing what you wanted to do. 00:08:00.560 --> 00:08:00.879 Yeah. 00:08:01.040 --> 00:08:01.360 Right. 00:08:01.519 --> 00:08:03.680 Um I never have any of that? 00:08:04.000 --> 00:08:33.600 I really struggled with as as most um LGBTQ youth would would, I overcompensated for aspects of myself, um, which actually led to a lot of um survival skills, if you will, which led lent itself to uh a lot of benefits on the amazing race, which is why I I feel a lot of um LGBTQ people do really well on reality shows of that nature because we know how to handle stressful situations, get out of problematic uh dangers. 00:08:34.639 --> 00:08:34.799 Yeah. 00:08:35.039 --> 00:08:37.039 Yeah, uh obstacles. 00:08:37.200 --> 00:08:46.559 Um so there's definitely um aspects of myself that I hid for years or downplayed, um, which is just not that that's what happens. 00:08:46.639 --> 00:08:46.799 Yeah. 00:08:46.960 --> 00:08:59.200 I if I could tell my younger self, I would have said, be authentic when you surrender to being your authentic self is when your career, the universe will align all of the potential for you. 00:08:59.360 --> 00:08:59.519 Right. 00:08:59.679 --> 00:09:13.440 And it wasn't till I did that into my, I would say, really late 20s, even though I was out and accepted my myself to some degree, I still was holding back thinking this is what the world wants to hear from me. 00:09:13.600 --> 00:09:13.840 Right. 00:09:14.080 --> 00:09:15.519 And I shouldn't have cared. 00:09:15.679 --> 00:09:19.840 I should if I tapped into that earlier, I mean everything happens for a reason, but sure. 00:09:20.000 --> 00:09:26.320 If I tapped into that earlier, I think um I would have had greater success, but I'm certainly happy with what unfolded. 00:09:26.559 --> 00:09:27.440 Yeah, and where you're at now. 00:09:27.679 --> 00:09:28.399 Yeah, obviously. 00:09:29.519 --> 00:09:34.639 And so you have the ballet in Winnipeg. 00:09:34.879 --> 00:09:35.120 Yeah. 00:09:35.279 --> 00:09:35.600 Right. 00:09:35.759 --> 00:09:42.960 And then when did um sort of the reality TV and all that kind of stuff sort of come about in life? 00:09:43.039 --> 00:09:44.720 And how did that come about in life? 00:09:45.200 --> 00:09:47.919 9-11 really changed me as a performer. 00:09:48.000 --> 00:09:56.080 I was with Mamma Mia um in on tour in Boston, and uh I was staying at the Double Tree with uh a lot of the terrorists. 00:09:56.240 --> 00:10:00.159 And so the next day was really hit home like that. 00:10:00.399 --> 00:10:01.279 It was a shocker. 00:10:01.600 --> 00:10:06.159 And I really didn't want to perform in Mamma Mia that night, nor did a lot of my castmates. 00:10:06.639 --> 00:10:12.000 But uh we took a vote uh if we're going to, and collectively uh we decided to do it. 00:10:12.320 --> 00:10:23.600 And that night I have never seen a larger uh uh attended um uh group at the stage door, and they weren't there for autographs, they were there to thank us. 00:10:23.759 --> 00:10:27.279 And it really pivoted how I look at the entertainment industry. 00:10:27.600 --> 00:10:34.000 And I found myself wanting shows that really make a difference, like Fiddler on the Roof. 00:10:34.159 --> 00:10:43.039 Um, all shows are a great experience for me, but the ones that stand out are the ones that have a message that challenges society and makes people think. 00:10:43.519 --> 00:10:59.039 And I was so fortunate to do a lot of great shows like that, like um Steven Sonnheim How Princess Bounce, uh the um uh Fiddler on the Roof on Broadway was one of the most special um shows that I've ever I've had the privilege of doing. 00:10:59.200 --> 00:11:03.919 And even cats to some degree, don't spit out your coffee because I was gonna. 00:11:04.159 --> 00:11:09.440 Cats is I think it is a really fun shift of energy for an audience. 00:11:09.759 --> 00:11:26.720 But my career got to a point where I became frustrated um sharing someone else's story, and I r felt like I wanted to focus on my own journey and

who I am as a person um in relation to fitness. 00:11:26.879 --> 00:11:38.720 So I was overlapping training a lot of my castmates on Broadway, and uh there's as you can imagine, there's a lot of like eating problems, eating disorders, uh self-body image issues that exist there. 00:11:38.960 --> 00:11:50.559 And I found that I was um feeling like I was making a difference and in turn feeling um a different pride in myself that I wanted to expand that into reality TV. 00:11:50.720 --> 00:11:56.000 So I didn't jump into um reality TV like uh competition shows or anything like that. 00:11:56.159 --> 00:12:00.799 My first one was Bravo's The Intervention, which uh was a weight loss show. 00:12:00.960 --> 00:12:01.440 Oh, okay. 00:12:01.759 --> 00:12:10.000 Helping people transform their lifestyle, which in turn helped them achieve the physique goals that they wanted, but that wasn't the point. 00:12:10.240 --> 00:12:11.759 The point was to change your life. 00:12:12.080 --> 00:12:12.559 Right. 00:12:12.879 --> 00:12:22.559 And is this right around the time when like all of the like um big weight loss shows were like a big thing, the um biggest loser. 00:12:22.799 --> 00:12:24.080 Biggest loser and all that kind of stuff. 00:12:24.320 --> 00:12:31.679 Yeah, I was ghost training, uh, which is off-camera training for biggest loser and quick push-up, all of these huge infomercials. 00:12:31.919 --> 00:12:36.320 Um, I was part of the success of the beh but all the behind the scenes. 00:12:36.399 --> 00:12:48.080 Um, not that I needed the credit for it, but I think that reality caught up with me where um uh Bravo reached out and they were certainly interested in me bringing that expertise but in front of the camera. 00:12:48.480 --> 00:13:04.559 Uh I think that at the time, though, the only concern was they were afraid that um it was going to come off because I've had an established acting career that I was acting the part rather than actually knowledgeable and able to guide people through uh the process of life transformation. 00:13:04.720 --> 00:13:05.039 Right. 00:13:05.279 --> 00:13:13.919 And so is this process of life transformation, fitness, working out, etc., is this something that you picked up in high school? 00:13:14.080 --> 00:13:23.840 Is it something you just learned as you started to become more involved in the actual ballet and Broadway shows? 00:13:24.080 --> 00:13:29.840 Is it something you just learned because of your own physique, wanting to stay fit and then transition to others? 00:13:30.080 --> 00:13:34.399 Or have you always had this like desire and knack for fitness? 00:13:34.720 --> 00:13:36.799 Wow, that's a really good loaded question. 00:13:36.879 --> 00:13:38.480 Uh, I'll break it up into two points. 00:13:38.559 --> 00:13:42.720 Uh, the first is that I'm uh I've always been really sensitive and caring person. 00:13:42.879 --> 00:13:46.320 Like I am uh half Lenore, half Chuck, my parents. 00:13:46.720 --> 00:13:50.240 And when

my mom got sick with fibromyalgia, it destroyed me. 00:13:50.399 --> 00:13:51.519 Like destroyed me. 00:13:51.600 --> 00:13:55.360 Where I took it upon myself because it was really hard for her to get answers. 00:13:55.519 --> 00:13:56.960 I was like, I'm gonna find the answers. 00:13:57.360 --> 00:14:02.399 So like I went to the bodies exhibit and had a full month there trying to study the body. 00:14:02.559 --> 00:14:08.399 And and in that process, it opened me up to sensitivity of other people's struggles around me. 00:14:08.559 --> 00:14:13.679 That's why in on Broadway it it really lent itself for me to to help people. 00:14:13.919 --> 00:14:21.279 And I I found that um uh a passion that uh I didn't know existed was to assist people. 00:14:21.519 --> 00:14:28.320 Uh also in that I need to say that a lot of fitness people professionals are the most unhealthy people. 00:14:28.639 --> 00:14:37.279 And me included to some degree, we talked about overcompensating as a skinny, short um boy growing up in in Harrow. 00:14:37.360 --> 00:14:44.399 Like I I I have a 15-year-old, um, and I often reference, I said, uh, you have to understand what I grew up with. 00:14:44.480 --> 00:14:51.919 Um, I was at boob level with school dances for the majority of my my career, or my um education years. 00:14:52.159 --> 00:14:55.759 And I said, and I didn't want to be at boob level uh for me personally. 00:14:55.919 --> 00:15:02.559 So in overcompensating, I wanted to I wanted to change my physique so that I wouldn't be bullied as much. 00:15:02.960 --> 00:15:04.879 And so I packed on muscle. 00:15:04.960 --> 00:15:06.320 It was during uh Mamma Mia. 00:15:06.559 --> 00:15:10.879 And I was quite young when I did, I was the second youngest cast member in Mamma Mia in the original Mamma Mia. 00:15:11.279 --> 00:15:13.039 And I gained a lot of muscle mass. 00:15:13.120 --> 00:15:17.600 And as the cast mates told me, I went from a boy to a man in a short period of time. 00:15:18.000 --> 00:15:20.960 And that was armor for me to protect myself. 00:15:21.120 --> 00:15:39.919 Um, but me recognizing that I think helps relate to other people's uh struggles of of putting on an armor uh just in the opposite effect for the weight loss show, which would have been uh a boundary uh for them to not let people in by covering it up with unhealthy habits. 00:15:40.480 --> 00:15:40.639 Yeah. 00:15:40.960 --> 00:15:51.200 And and and so you you said that a lot of the people that are typically fit bodybuilders, et cetera, are sometimes the unhealthiest in terms of not sometimes, almost always. 00:15:51.440 --> 00:15:51.919 Almost always. 00:15:52.240 --> 00:15:53.039 Why do you say that? 00:15:53.519 --> 00:15:56.240 Uh I I again I think it's it's like the pendulum swings. 00:15:56.320 --> 00:15:57.120 It's excess. 00:15:57.679 --> 00:15:58.399 Yeah, excess. 00:15:58.480 --> 00:16:09.679 Uh the body is not built to take on um that much physical activity uh for that long, uh, that um uh muscle mass. 00:16:09.919 --> 00:16:15.440 Like the organs don't know the difference between unhealthy weight and health what we deem is healthy weight. 00:16:15.600 --> 00:16:16.080 Healthy weight. 00:16:16.240 --> 00:16:37.200 So, like even myself, as I get older um and I packed on a lot of dense muscle mass, it's it's time for me to strip that away because it's not as healthy on my heart, my organs to sustain that size when I need to be fit and I need to shift now what those goals are for uh stability, um, strength and stamina. 00:16:37.440 --> 00:16:40.080 And so if I want to run, I gotta take off some weight. 00:16:40.240 --> 00:16:48.000 And going to Italy for the last two weeks doesn't help because all I did was eat pasta and lemon cello after after the meal. 00:16:48.159 --> 00:16:48.399 Uh-huh. 00:16:48.639 --> 00:16:55.120 Um, yeah, so uh that that's the balance that I think uh it does not exist in uh in the uh fitness world. 00:16:55.679 --> 00:17:04.960 It's interesting you say that because I think a lot of people uh they look at the super fit person and they're like, man, I just wish I was fit. 00:17:05.039 --> 00:17:06.640 I wish I could look like that. 00:17:06.720 --> 00:17:15.200 But I've never actually, I mean, I've been around fitness as a competitive swimmer for you know 30 some odd years of my life. 00:17:15.279 --> 00:17:15.440 Yeah. 00:17:15.680 --> 00:17:21.039 I've never heard somebody talk about like taking weight like off, yeah, which is interesting. 00:17:22.400 --> 00:17:27.440 Yeah, I think that uh athleticism with a sport is a a little different because it is short-lived. 00:17:27.680 --> 00:17:35.599 Like we I think I you even with the Danielle uh interview where you talk about a window of opportunity that you have with that. 00:17:35.839 --> 00:17:38.240 Uh with bodybuilding, it's hard for people to give that up. 00:17:38.319 --> 00:17:46.799 So I think that it just progresses more and more where it's dense muscle mass upon dense muscle mass, and then that becomes highly unhealthy on your organs. 00:17:46.960 --> 00:17:47.200 Right. 00:17:47.359 --> 00:17:47.599 Yeah. 00:17:47.920 --> 00:17:48.240 Interesting. 00:17:48.400 --> 00:17:52.160 So then, okay, so you do all of this, you learn all of this stuff. 00:17:52.319 --> 00:17:55.599 You start learning all this stuff because your mom didn't diagnosed. 00:17:55.759 --> 00:17:56.079 Yeah. 00:17:56.319 --> 00:18:08.480 Um, and I would I would 100% agree with you when you say, you know, you you feel, I mean, you seem like an extremely empathetic person who can take on a lot of feelings from the people around him, I'm assuming. 00:18:08.720 --> 00:18:09.200 Yeah, yeah. 00:18:09.759 --> 00:18:29.519 Um how did that then progress into you were just helping your other castmates, your other ballet members, etc., because they wanted it, because they saw what you were doing, because and you are right, there is probably lots of anorexia, bulimia, et cetera, in in that world.

00:18:29.759 --> 00:18:30.000 Yeah. 00:18:30.160 --> 00:18:37.440 Um, I mean, we were just talking and just kind of joking about um one of the reality TV shows outside. 00:18:37.599 --> 00:18:39.680 Um Age of Attraction. 00:18:39.920 --> 00:18:40.559 No, the other one. 00:18:41.519 --> 00:18:42.319 No, the other one. 00:18:43.039 --> 00:18:43.519 Model one. 00:18:44.000 --> 00:18:45.279 Oh, America's next top model. 00:18:45.519 --> 00:18:46.720 America's next top model, right? 00:18:46.880 --> 00:18:57.119 And you see a lot of eating disorders, etc., with people who because they're supposed to fit this mold that the industry wants you to be. 00:18:57.279 --> 00:18:57.519 Right. 00:18:57.680 --> 00:19:09.680 And then when you look at it, I mean, my wife and I were were talking about it the other day because when that documentary came out about that show, yeah, a lot of the stuff that was on that show like wouldn't fly today. 00:19:09.920 --> 00:19:11.599 Oh, no, there's no way that stuff. 00:19:12.079 --> 00:19:14.240 Oh, even my shows, even my reality shows. 00:19:14.319 --> 00:19:14.480 Yeah. 00:19:14.799 --> 00:19:15.839 And why do you say that? 00:19:16.079 --> 00:19:18.319 Oh, d times have changed and good. 00:19:18.640 --> 00:19:19.839 It's great that they've changed. 00:19:20.079 --> 00:19:21.519 I I think it it's a blessing. 00:19:21.680 --> 00:19:34.480 I mean, I the my next reality show was uh Newlyweds, the first year, which was uh a reality show with Bravo TV that did air in Canada as well, where it followed my husband and I's uh first year of married life together. 00:19:34.640 --> 00:19:38.720 And it was a year and a half, truth be told, of of almost daily filming. 00:19:39.440 --> 00:19:43.759 Um, but there's so much that would not fly, even that we were a part of. 00:19:44.079 --> 00:19:44.400 Really? 00:19:44.640 --> 00:19:45.440 Oh my gosh. 00:19:45.759 --> 00:19:46.480 Like what? 00:19:47.519 --> 00:19:50.640 Uh if you can say anything. 00:19:51.039 --> 00:20:03.759 Uh I I just think that w when um our our our marriage was the first legal federal same-sex marriage featured on a reality TV program in the States. 00:20:04.000 --> 00:20:04.319 Oh, wow. 00:20:04.559 --> 00:20:05.119 Brandon and I. 00:20:05.279 --> 00:20:05.519 Wow. 00:20:05.680 --> 00:20:07.519 And that had a lot of responsibility. 00:20:07.680 --> 00:20:14.480 Uh and I think that the audience around us expects us to fall into um stereotypes. 00:20:14.880 --> 00:20:16.880 And we we kind of gave into that a bit. 00:20:17.200 --> 00:20:17.680 Oh, really? 00:20:17.759 --> 00:20:17.839 Okay. 00:20:18.079 --> 00:20:19.440 Oh, yeah, yeah, I think so. 00:20:19.519 --> 00:20:22.400 Um and and leaned into what they wanted you to be like. 00:20:22.720 --> 00:20:25.279 Or like and and identify like who takes the garbage out. 00:20:25.359 --> 00:20:27.039 Oh, you know, who's the most sensitive one. 00:20:27.279 --> 00:20:30.000 And but I think that inquiring minds wanted to know. 00:20:30.240 --> 00:20:30.480 Sure. 00:20:30.720 --> 00:20:35.039 And we we do um Brandon and I certainly do fit stereotypes. 00:20:35.119 --> 00:20:36.000 Like we we do. 00:20:36.160 --> 00:20:37.200 I mean, he's the fashion guy. 00:20:37.279 --> 00:20:37.680 We talked about it. 00:20:37.680 --> 00:20:38.240 He's the fashion guy. 00:20:38.480 --> 00:20:38.799 Stereotypes. 00:20:39.119 --> 00:20:39.519 I am not. 00:20:39.599 --> 00:20:42.880 Like hopefully this is acceptable today. 00:20:43.279 --> 00:20:48.000 Um luckily gray and white go together, so my wife didn't say anything to me today, so that's good. 00:20:48.480 --> 00:21:01.359 Yeah, and we we tried uh desperately to have a child at the time, uh, a second child, because Brandon's sister and her wife, uh, Brian Jen, um, we co-parent uh a 15-year-old now. 00:21:01.440 --> 00:21:02.400 He's almost 15. 00:21:02.799 --> 00:21:10.400 Um, but uh uh he was only two at the time when we had the reality show together, and we tried to uh I tried to get her pregnant. 00:21:10.640 --> 00:21:19.039 And uh with it, there was so many obstacles that we had no idea that we were facing, and being on TV, it was heartbreaking. 00:21:19.200 --> 00:21:31.839 Like to know that because of our non-traditional coupling and and family, uh there were legal efforts to stop us from uh accessing um IVF and and options. 00:21:32.000 --> 00:21:40.960 It would cost us hundreds of thousands of dollars, which would be free for traditionally married or together couples just because we were LGBTQ. 00:21:41.200 --> 00:21:49.440 And so it was hard for us on TV to realize these things as a same sex couple and our unique family. 00:21:49.599 --> 00:21:55.759 Um and yeah, I it was it we did a turkey based insemination in Vegas. 00:21:55.920 --> 00:21:58.400 Uh the first ever can you imagine on TV? 00:21:58.480 --> 00:21:59.200 It was pretty extreme. 00:21:59.359 --> 00:21:59.680 Yeah when. 00:22:00.160 --> 00:22:04.960 Brandon and Bree's mom delivering my semen in a champagne flute from one room to another. 00:22:05.279 --> 00:22:05.519 Right. 00:22:05.759 --> 00:22:06.079 Right? 00:22:06.160 --> 00:22:08.400 Like I mean, I'm being honest. 00:22:08.480 --> 00:22:08.559 Yeah. 00:22:08.880 --> 00:22:10.400 But it was jarring and shocking. 00:22:10.559 --> 00:22:14.880 Um, so I I don't know if we would do any of those things today. 00:22:15.119 --> 00:22:15.359 Right. 00:22:15.599 --> 00:22:16.400 I don't think we'd have to. 00:22:16.640 --> 00:22:17.599 I don't think you'd have to either. 00:22:17.680 --> 00:22:17.759 Right. 00:22:18.000 --> 00:22:20.480 Because things have progressed, which is good. 00:22:20.720 --> 00:22:20.960 Right? 00:22:21.119 --> 00:22:22.079 Because we need to. 00:22:22.720 --> 00:22:24.559 Especially in Canada, we're progressing. 00:22:24.640 --> 00:22:30.799 I think in the States, uh it's rolling back uh very aggressively, which is um very disheartening. 00:22:30.880 --> 00:22:31.039 Yeah.

00:22:31.200 --> 00:22:33.920 Uh so I'm just I'm just so thankful to be here in Canada. 00:22:34.240 --> 00:22:34.640 Here in Canada. 00:22:34.720 --> 00:22:34.960 Yeah. 00:22:35.119 --> 00:22:37.119 No, I appreciate I I I mean we love having you. 00:22:37.279 --> 00:22:40.400 Yeah being a Canadian Canadian boy, being famous all over the world. 00:22:40.640 --> 00:22:41.039 Well. 00:22:41.279 --> 00:22:44.960 Um so okay, so you do newlyweds. 00:22:45.359 --> 00:22:45.680 Yeah. 00:22:45.920 --> 00:22:55.039 Um and then how does that all transition into things like the amazing race and all the other shows that you've done? 00:22:55.440 --> 00:23:07.519 The Amazing Race came about because my best friend Catherine Reeford, um, we we got to know each other well by dancing in the Royal Winnipeg Ballet together decades ago. 00:23:07.599 --> 00:23:08.880 And we've been best friends since. 00:23:08.960 --> 00:23:12.480 We lived together in major cities, Toronto, New York, LA. 00:23:12.720 --> 00:23:14.720 We have quite a past in the history. 00:23:14.960 --> 00:23:30.319 And um at the time in 2019, we were invited back to the Royal Winnipeg Ballet um to kind of honor the acting careers that we've had coming from a trained dance background with their school. 00:23:30.640 --> 00:23:43.039 So it was kind of an initiative to show um that the quality of dance, even 20 years later, from their school, is there and is exceptional and led to incredible careers for Catherine and I on Broadway. 00:23:43.119 --> 00:23:56.640 But then the artistry of us being actors as well, coming back to the ballet in uh the roles Lord and Lady Capulet in their Romeo and Juliet, um, they wanted to really bring that artistry back into the ballet. 00:23:56.880 --> 00:24:05.039 And also they recognize that Catherine at that point, six years before, um, was diagnosed with terminal brain cancer. 00:24:05.200 --> 00:24:08.000 She had a grapefruit size tumor removed from her brain. 00:24:08.160 --> 00:24:13.039 They got what they could, but it was a terminal diagnosis where she lived two to five years. 00:24:13.279 --> 00:24:13.599 Okay. 00:24:14.160 --> 00:24:28.000 So um they she had cognitive uh damage done, and um, they wanted to assist her in revisiting what it was like to be on stage in that capacity, which is a generous gift. 00:24:28.160 --> 00:24:28.400 Yeah. 00:24:28.559 --> 00:24:35.200 And but recognizing that it would be very tough for her, they knew that we were partnered so well throughout the years. 00:24:35.359 --> 00:24:43.200 So I was uh included on my own merit too, but certainly they recognized that me being there to support her would be a help. 00:24:43.440 --> 00:24:47.039 And she improved dramatically. 00:24:47.200 --> 00:24:58.640 Like we're um the medical industry was wanting to study her and travel her around the world to figure out how she was able to access and develop um uh damaged part of her brain. 00:24:58.799 --> 00:24:59.039 Yeah. 00:24:59.200 --> 00:25:04.799 Um, and from there, Catherine was so eager to have more improvements and more challenges. 00:25:05.119 --> 00:25:07.039 So she said, What can we do? 00:25:07.200 --> 00:25:08.960 I don't want to see this fade away. 00:25:09.119 --> 00:25:10.640 I want to keep going and keep living. 00:25:10.720 --> 00:25:14.400 And she kind of looked at that like she needed that in order to continue living. 00:25:14.559 --> 00:25:22.480 So then I was like, Well, what about that really, really difficult, impossible, stressful show, The Amazing Race Canada? 00:25:22.720 --> 00:25:25.759 And she said right away, she goes, Yes, that's what I want. 00:25:26.079 --> 00:25:27.839 And I said, if you want it, I'll want it. 00:25:27.920 --> 00:25:31.119 Because I never would have searched out for it if if this wasn't the situation. 00:25:31.359 --> 00:25:31.440 Right. 00:25:32.079 --> 00:25:41.759 And so we when we decided to do it and sent in our uh interview tape, I think her story was so compelling and our dynamic as um they look for really strong teams. 00:25:42.000 --> 00:25:44.880 We felt like if we put it forward, we were gonna get it. 00:25:45.119 --> 00:25:47.599 Uh, I I think maybe that's manifestations. 00:25:47.759 --> 00:25:49.920 Um yeah, so it aligned. 00:25:50.160 --> 00:25:54.799 And when we got it, it was so exciting and it brought Catherine a lot of security. 00:25:55.039 --> 00:25:56.160 Then COVID hit. 00:25:56.480 --> 00:26:00.640 So then they had to deliver a message that said, we're gonna postpone it a couple weeks. 00:26:01.359 --> 00:26:12.000 Because we all know it was really touch and go at first, and then they said it's gonna delay a year, and breaking that news to Catherine with her getting an MRI every three months, telling her if she's gonna live another three months. 00:26:12.240 --> 00:26:12.400 Right. 00:26:12.720 --> 00:26:14.160 They were devastated. 00:26:14.400 --> 00:26:20.880 But lo and behold, medical miracle, and she had that to look forward to, right, which really I think saved her. 00:26:21.200 --> 00:26:24.880 We got the opportunity in 2000 2022. 00:26:25.200 --> 00:26:25.519 Nice. 00:26:25.839 --> 00:26:28.240 So that's how we we got to to doing it. 00:26:28.480 --> 00:26:33.359 Um but I wouldn't have actively seeked out that or any kind of competition reality show. 00:26:33.440 --> 00:26:33.599 No. 00:26:33.920 --> 00:26:34.240 Right. 00:26:34.559 --> 00:26:37.440 So uh I don't know if this is a controversial question. 00:26:37.599 --> 00:26:38.880 Do you think it to me? 00:26:39.039 --> 00:26:41.039 Because I believe I believe in the whole manifestation thing. 00:26:41.119 --> 00:26:46.079 If you want it to happen, you know, you still gotta go to work and you still gotta go put in some effort and you gotta do all that kind of stuff, right? 00:26:46.160 --> 00:26:51.839 Like as as Jim Carrey would say, you can't uh you can't just think about a goal and then go home and sit on the couch and eat a sandwich.

00:26:52.000 --> 00:26:55.440 Like you have to actually go to work and still go try to do things. 00:26:55.599 --> 00:27:09.680 Um, do you think that there was a uh a point in the maybe application process or whatever that because your LGBTQ and because of her diagnosis that you just you thought like, yeah, they'll probably accept us just because of the situation, just because of the circumstance? 00:27:10.160 --> 00:27:13.039 I thought that they weren't gonna accept us. 00:27:13.119 --> 00:27:14.319 Um You thought it would be the opposite. 00:27:14.559 --> 00:27:26.960 Yeah, I thought the opposite because uh usually you have to have such a clean bill of health that I was like, there's no way Catherine's going to Why would they put this person with the condition on a shoulder that could potentially be devastating? 00:27:27.440 --> 00:27:28.400 Setting up for failure. 00:27:28.480 --> 00:27:30.880 Um, and uh the doctors cleared her. 00:27:31.039 --> 00:27:32.799 The doctors basically said you should be dead. 00:27:32.880 --> 00:27:34.400 You can do whatever you want, right? 00:27:34.480 --> 00:27:35.119 And she's like, okay. 00:27:37.119 --> 00:27:37.279 Yeah. 00:27:37.440 --> 00:27:37.519 Right. 00:27:37.759 --> 00:27:37.920 Yeah. 00:27:38.000 --> 00:27:38.880 So that was her turn. 00:27:38.960 --> 00:27:46.880 And mine, I actually thought that me having so much reality experience um would have uh definitely hindered the the acceptance. 00:27:47.359 --> 00:27:48.000 Excluded you from it. 00:27:48.240 --> 00:27:48.559 Yeah. 00:27:48.720 --> 00:27:54.240 And uh I have a reality experience, but um also um I was in the States. 00:27:54.480 --> 00:27:59.200 Like I I was mostly working in the States, so I thought that it's Amazing Race Canada. 00:27:59.440 --> 00:28:08.480 And as we know, Canadians have a lot of pride, and it was hard to communicate in a three-minute video how much I am Canadian and how like much pride I do. 00:28:09.119 --> 00:28:11.599 I've been working in the states and living in the states and stuff. 00:28:11.920 --> 00:28:12.000 Right. 00:28:12.079 --> 00:28:14.480 So I didn't think we were gonna get it because of that. 00:28:14.960 --> 00:28:16.880 Um, but luckily uh we did. 00:28:16.960 --> 00:28:18.480 They didn't do their research at all. 00:28:18.640 --> 00:28:23.519 Like they had no idea that I had any reality experience when we showed up day one. 00:28:23.680 --> 00:28:25.359 And I know how to work those cameras too. 00:28:25.519 --> 00:28:25.839 Right. 00:28:26.079 --> 00:28:38.559 So really, I doubt they'll ever have anyone back in the capacity of being a triple threat singer, dancer, actor like Catherine and I, and the the fact that I have so much reality experience, I don't think Amazing Race Canada will ever revisit that. 00:28:38.799 --> 00:28:38.960 Yeah. 00:28:39.119 --> 00:28:58.319 So you've said a few times now that uh in applying for a role or applying for something that um the fact that you've had past experience being in front of a camera, maybe people thought, or maybe they you think the audience or the producers would think that you're acting or it's not legitimate or it's not real. 00:28:58.559 --> 00:29:00.160 You've said it a number of times now. 00:29:00.319 --> 00:29:11.359 Do you find that in in society or in Hollywood that that that they're really trying to look at that kind of thing and say, what is this person's past? 00:29:11.680 --> 00:29:20.640 And rather than are they the right fit for the show that we're looking for, they're actually saying, like, maybe people aren't gonna like it because they think they're acting. 00:29:21.039 --> 00:29:28.400 In reality TV, anyone that's been a part of reality TV, the repeated theme that gets obnoxious is authenticity. 00:29:28.559 --> 00:29:34.400 Like these producers, and it's the bottom of the barrel part of the entertainment industry, reality TV, to be honest. 00:29:34.559 --> 00:29:41.279 Like, and I say that not in to demean it because there's some brilliance that happens on camera and behind the scenes for sure. 00:29:41.440 --> 00:29:54.480 Um, but it it I think that the low-hanging fruit is reality TV in the entertainment industry, and that word authenticity, they're looking for someone that is trying to pull the wool over someone's eyes. 00:29:54.720 --> 00:30:01.119 And with, as I said, me and Catherine being triple threats and and having the luxury of having these great careers. 00:30:01.200 --> 00:30:06.400 We've learned a lot of um things along the way in um researching roles. 00:30:06.559 --> 00:30:09.839 Like we've had these great careers, and when you research a role, you dive into it. 00:30:09.920 --> 00:30:10.160 Right. 00:30:10.319 --> 00:30:12.960 So, like Catherine went to nursing school, right? 00:30:13.200 --> 00:30:27.519 She she has all this great knowledge, um, and uh some of the roles I've played too, where it does um lend itself to knowing uh like a plethora of different uh what we thought was use useless skills that helped on the amazing race. 00:30:27.599 --> 00:30:27.759 Yeah. 00:30:28.160 --> 00:30:36.079 Um but yeah, the the authenticity, it's hard for them to accept that someone can have multiple lives in this one. 00:30:36.319 --> 00:30:36.640 Right. 00:30:36.799 --> 00:30:47.200 Um the the one difference I'll say, and I say this often when I go into universities and talk to to students in the arts, is it's in my opinion, it's all about getting in the room. 00:30:47.440 --> 00:30:54.319 Like if you environmentally put yourself in these situations to succeed, eventually it's gonna happen. 00:30:54.480 --> 00:30:54.640 Right. 00:30:54.880 --> 00:31:05.279 But it's when you get upset that there's limitations or the no's, the rejection, and then you isolate and you limit what your outreach is, that's where you are limiting yourself. 00:31:05.599 --> 00:31:07.680 So there's so much talent in this area. 00:31:07.839 --> 00:31:21.039 And I truly believe if a lot

of the people that I even went to school with just physically up themselves and put themselves in New York, or you know, and there's circumstances, of course, that that are far greater than people's will and determination. 00:31:21.359 --> 00:31:30.400 But the the difference is, I feel, is if you can put yourself out there, if you do send in the audition tape for reality TV, you gotta do that in order to be considered. 00:31:30.559 --> 00:31:30.799 Right. 00:31:30.960 --> 00:31:32.880 And if it's one thing I did, it's it's that. 00:31:33.200 --> 00:31:37.920 Yeah, I was gonna say, because that I mean, that's a message that I hear a lot. 00:31:38.160 --> 00:31:38.480 Yeah. 00:31:38.799 --> 00:31:41.359 Of like, you just gotta face the rejection. 00:31:41.440 --> 00:31:42.400 You just gotta kind of do it. 00:31:42.480 --> 00:31:44.319 You gotta put yourself in the right place. 00:31:45.119 --> 00:31:50.720 Um what do you think made I I don't want to say this is easy. 00:31:51.039 --> 00:31:53.519 I don't think it was easy for anybody at a certain point in time. 00:31:53.680 --> 00:31:58.799 Sooner or later you're like, I'll just it's it's rejection, it's another rejection, it's another no, whatever, right? 00:31:59.039 --> 00:32:08.960 But to start that process, you don't really strike me as a guy that when you were younger really were bothered by the rejection. 00:32:09.119 --> 00:32:17.920 You know, do you think that's because your parents were so supportive and the community was so supportive and everybody just kind of looked out for you that you were like, I can go do these things and they and they cheered you on. 00:32:18.000 --> 00:32:28.400 And or did you ever have a point in time where you were actually like, I don't know if I should do this thing because they might not like me and you just didn't go do it because of somebody else's opinion? 00:32:28.720 --> 00:32:29.920 Oh my God, all the time. 00:32:30.079 --> 00:32:32.079 I I thank you for bringing this up. 00:32:32.240 --> 00:32:40.640 I think what my parents did well uh is they allowed me to process uh disappointment and rejection. 00:32:41.039 --> 00:32:46.799 So like I remember even in speech competitions, you remember those in school that we'd have and like science fairs. 00:32:47.920 --> 00:32:51.359 See, I loved them and I was so passionate about it, but I never won. 00:32:51.599 --> 00:32:52.319 I never won. 00:32:52.480 --> 00:32:56.079 And I was so upset because as a kid, you know, you strive. 00:32:56.240 --> 00:32:57.680 I want that first place, I want that. 00:32:57.839 --> 00:32:59.119 And I was devastated. 00:32:59.200 --> 00:33:04.720 Like I would be so upset and crying for days. 00:33:04.880 --> 00:33:10.880 And my parents let me do that, and I think that that's what has gotten me through because I get terribly upset. 00:33:11.039 --> 00:33:14.000 Like I was just rejected for Charlottetown Festival for this summer. 00:33:14.160 --> 00:33:19.759 I got rejected for um Royal Manitoba Theater Center just recently, like two Anna Green Gables in a row. 00:33:20.000 --> 00:33:27.599 And it it destroys me, it does, but I process it, I recognize it, and I'm able to then get over it. 00:33:28.160 --> 00:33:33.920 Uh I that's what I also go into these schools and and share that um you are human. 00:33:34.000 --> 00:33:37.039 And what makes you a great performer is the fact that you are affected. 00:33:37.119 --> 00:33:39.680 So, how do you tell someone don't be affected by the rejection? 00:33:40.160 --> 00:33:44.559 You do, you have to process it and you have to put it into perspective of what it is. 00:33:44.720 --> 00:33:47.039 Your life is far grander than one gig. 00:33:47.279 --> 00:33:52.240 And the universe is aligning what is going to be appropriate and spectacular for you. 00:33:52.400 --> 00:33:59.680 It's a hard trust to do, but it's the only way to go because then when it does success happens, it starts to make sense. 00:33:59.839 --> 00:34:02.079 And that happens with maturity and with age. 00:34:02.240 --> 00:34:03.279 And you know, I'm there. 00:34:03.359 --> 00:34:04.319 I'm almost 50. 00:34:04.400 --> 00:34:06.079 So I've had I've had a little way. 00:34:06.319 --> 00:34:07.599 Oh god, you're almost 50? 00:34:07.759 --> 00:34:07.920 Yes. 00:34:08.159 --> 00:34:09.039 I would not have put you that way. 00:34:09.119 --> 00:34:09.599 Oh, thank you. 00:34:09.679 --> 00:34:10.480 Yeah, I'm 38. 00:34:10.559 --> 00:34:13.039 I would have put you at like 43. 00:34:13.599 --> 00:34:13.920 43? 00:34:14.159 --> 00:34:14.480 44. 00:34:14.639 --> 00:34:15.360 Oh, I'll take that. 00:34:15.440 --> 00:34:16.800 That's I mean, I'll take 49. 00:34:17.440 --> 00:34:18.480 You know, well, thank you. 00:34:18.639 --> 00:34:19.760 Yeah, I'll take my age. 00:34:19.840 --> 00:34:20.480 I I've earned it. 00:34:20.559 --> 00:34:25.440 I've earned every year, I've earned every wrinkle, and uh, you know, I'm I'm losing the hair. 00:34:25.519 --> 00:34:27.760 I'm surprised I have what I have at this point. 00:34:28.159 --> 00:34:28.639 Fair enough. 00:34:28.800 --> 00:34:34.480 Um, so are these some are these some messages that you're also then like passing on to your son? 00:34:34.719 --> 00:34:35.199 Yeah. 00:34:35.519 --> 00:34:42.559 Because like I don't know if my parents ever like let me process things, I guess. 00:34:42.719 --> 00:34:43.760 I mean, they must have. 00:34:43.920 --> 00:34:48.880 I guess I never really like put it together, but I was never like I never felt sort of emotional. 00:34:48.960 --> 00:34:50.000 I was never very empathetic. 00:34:50.079 --> 00:34:52.000 I am a pretty empathetic person, I think. 00:34:52.320 --> 00:34:53.519 At least people tell me I am. 00:34:54.159 --> 00:34:57.199 Um, but I was just like, okay, well, I guess I lost. 00:34:57.280 --> 00:34:59.280 I guess I'm just gonna have to go work harder. 00:34:59.519 --> 00:35:05.840 I never really like I guess I would never say I never really

dealt with uh emotion. 00:35:06.000 --> 00:35:07.920 I'm just like, well, okay, next. 00:35:08.079 --> 00:35:09.039 On to the next thing. 00:35:09.599 --> 00:35:11.519 Um and I don't really know where it came from. 00:35:11.679 --> 00:35:26.880 But are these some things that you're like talking to your son about when it when he has some failures that in his life, whether it's like school or sports or arts or anything like that, that you're like trying to pass this same coaching or mentorship on to your own kid? 00:35:27.119 --> 00:35:33.440 I I think by being vulnerable myself, I mean I think he witnesses the world around him, including us as parents. 00:35:33.519 --> 00:35:34.719 Uh, and we're very different. 00:35:34.880 --> 00:35:45.440 All four of us are extremely different, which I always tell him, I'm really proud of you for navigating uh unique relationships with people and still being consistent with who you are and your personality. 00:35:45.679 --> 00:35:50.800 Uh I I give him the space to process and to think on his own before I fill in those gaps. 00:35:51.039 --> 00:35:53.519 I kind of want him to I and I can gauge that. 00:35:53.760 --> 00:35:54.079 Yeah. 00:35:54.239 --> 00:35:57.760 Um, and no, he's he's he's really, I feel well-rounded. 00:35:57.920 --> 00:36:01.679 Um, and and we have open communication. 00:36:02.159 --> 00:36:05.840 Um, and I I think just leading by example, I'm not perfect. 00:36:06.000 --> 00:36:06.559 He sees it. 00:36:06.639 --> 00:36:13.679 I apologize when I think that I've I've done some terrible parenting, which certainly I think all parents can relate to, like when you have those moments. 00:36:13.840 --> 00:36:17.280 And I sit back and I I rewind and I say, This is how I feel. 00:36:17.360 --> 00:36:18.400 I could have done it differently. 00:36:18.480 --> 00:36:19.199 I'm sorry. 00:36:19.440 --> 00:36:20.400 Um, yeah. 00:36:20.559 --> 00:36:23.519 So I think I have that as a husband right now. 00:36:24.079 --> 00:36:27.360 My my my son is too young for that. 00:36:27.519 --> 00:36:33.119 He's only 10 months, but uh man, there's some times where I'm again male, female, different. 00:36:33.199 --> 00:36:34.239 She's with him all the time. 00:36:34.400 --> 00:36:38.079 I'm not, and I'm like, I'll just come home and like play with him, like wrestle or do. 00:36:38.239 --> 00:36:39.679 And I'm like, well, he's 10 months old. 00:36:39.840 --> 00:36:41.440 Like my wife's like, be careful. 00:36:41.679 --> 00:36:44.239 Like, I just I just want to see him, I just want to have fun. 00:36:44.320 --> 00:36:46.159 And she's like, Well, yeah, but you're not here all the time. 00:36:46.239 --> 00:36:47.280 You're not here every day, right? 00:36:47.360 --> 00:36:50.960 And I have to like, okay, like, how could I have handled that situation better? 00:36:51.119 --> 00:36:52.880 How could I have done this thing differently? 00:36:53.039 --> 00:36:53.679 Yeah, right. 00:36:53.840 --> 00:37:00.480 I I like the fact that you're like give them space to do it themselves before intervening. 00:37:00.880 --> 00:37:06.079 Because I think in anything, whether it's business, ballet, anything, right? 00:37:06.239 --> 00:37:08.800 Like you can't do it for somebody, right? 00:37:09.199 --> 00:37:11.519 You can't you can't want it, you can't want it for them, right? 00:37:11.679 --> 00:37:15.360 Whether it's success or what you can't want the role for somebody more than they want it for themselves. 00:37:15.679 --> 00:37:21.760 But you also have to kind of let people fail as much as it kind of sucks. 00:37:22.079 --> 00:37:23.599 But that's the only way they're gonna learn. 00:37:24.000 --> 00:37:27.920 You can coach them, but you gotta give it some time, I find. 00:37:28.480 --> 00:37:31.440 I'm not gonna be able to learn where someone is. 00:37:31.599 --> 00:37:39.199 This applies for parenting and for even um the fitness aspect uh or wellness aspect of my my career in life. 00:37:39.440 --> 00:37:46.719 I need to get as much information and collect information and allow people to speak and reveal all of that in a comfortable setting, right? 00:37:47.440 --> 00:37:53.920 So, like giving people that space is really important for them to exhaust what they need to get off of their chest. 00:37:54.480 --> 00:37:59.280 Um, that that's where I kind of collect data and information again, which helped on the amazing race. 00:37:59.360 --> 00:38:10.239 Yeah, like to kind of pay attention to um the other racers and the producers and the challenges, like being an observer is really important for success. 00:38:10.800 --> 00:38:12.159 I find interesting. 00:38:12.400 --> 00:38:30.719 And so when you say that in the fitness world, that you are letting people talk um and express themselves in that way, you're hoping that while they're talking that they're uncovering the thing that they think they need to change? 00:38:31.360 --> 00:38:32.880 I guess it it it varies. 00:38:33.039 --> 00:38:40.000 Like it I think that when someone is working out and they this is how we always look at it, especially weight loss. 00:38:40.079 --> 00:38:41.760 Okay, let's let's talk about weight loss. 00:38:41.920 --> 00:38:47.280 Uh, if if someone is on that journey and they're putting the physical into motion, right? 00:38:47.440 --> 00:38:56.239 And they are sweating, um, I always look at every single pound loss is baggage that has collected on someone over time. 00:38:56.559 --> 00:39:06.480 And it's not important for them to, and I'm not a trained, you know, uh therapist by any means, but it's not important for us to identify, oh, this is when that abuse happened. 00:39:06.559 --> 00:39:12.559 This is, you know, those specific situations, but rather the emotions and feelings that can come up from the weight loss journey. 00:39:13.039 --> 00:39:19.840 So a lot of times if if they just have the space to communicate, it it is their journey, not mine, to manipulate. 00:39:20.079 --> 00:39:24.239 Uh,

the reveal is allowing for that excess weight to come off. 00:39:24.559 --> 00:39:27.519 I it's for me, it's been proven. 00:39:27.599 --> 00:39:38.480 Like I I have helped people lose weight off camera, even in more uh more off camera than on camera because I've had more off opportunity off camera, um, because of that. 00:39:38.639 --> 00:39:45.440 It's an emotional journey that they're on, and then the physical is the the benefit, the uh the health benefit. 00:39:45.760 --> 00:40:07.599 So you so if I'm understanding you correctly, you're saying when you're working out with somebody and they start losing weight, they start going through the exercises, etc., maybe they do start losing some weight, they you know, start to see some success that they start to have this emotional reaction to how difficult it they thought it was going to be, but it's actually not that hard. 00:40:07.679 --> 00:40:09.840 It's just consistency, and then that spirals into other things. 00:40:09.920 --> 00:40:10.480 Is that what you're doing? 00:40:10.719 --> 00:40:12.480 Not before the weight loss, it's the movement. 00:40:12.719 --> 00:40:20.960 Like if someone is putting athleticism into motion, is when uh I find that um that's when the emotions come out, right? 00:40:21.199 --> 00:40:30.639 And you can feel it in your own workouts, like even if someone's bodybuilding, um, if you tap into who you are as a human as you're working out, all of that energy comes from someplace. 00:40:30.719 --> 00:40:41.199 That those are the the things that I'm talking about from your past that again, you don't have to identify, but whatever emotions you feel, if that drives your movement and then the weight loss comes off. 00:40:41.440 --> 00:40:48.400 So it's harder to put that into motion for people because a lot of people are fearful and they get in their head, like, oh, why is this so hard for me? 00:40:48.559 --> 00:40:50.800 And I'm and I'm like, You're human, it's not. 00:40:50.880 --> 00:40:51.920 It's terrible for me too. 00:40:52.079 --> 00:40:54.719 Like, I I do not enjoy being on a stair climber. 00:40:54.800 --> 00:40:56.320 I don't like I enjoy the benefits. 00:40:56.800 --> 00:40:57.679 Nobody likes a stair climber. 00:40:58.000 --> 00:40:58.320 Exactly. 00:40:58.480 --> 00:41:00.000 No one likes to be truthful. 00:41:00.079 --> 00:41:02.400 I don't think anyone really likes the physical activity. 00:41:02.639 --> 00:41:09.199 People that have put it into motion and then see the benefits of it, they like the feel of the benefit the benefits after the workout's over. 00:41:09.440 --> 00:41:16.800 After the workout, or once it starts snowballing and it becomes a habit and something that they immediately tap into where it chemically changes their mood. 00:41:17.039 --> 00:41:19.280 But to get jump started, it's not easy. 00:41:19.440 --> 00:41:27.519 It's not if I take two weeks off, which I did going to Italy and coming back to it, I have to respect my journey back and not

beat myself up. 00:41:27.760 --> 00:41:28.000 Right. 00:41:28.159 --> 00:41:28.400 Yeah. 00:41:28.480 --> 00:41:29.760 Why is this so hard for me? 00:41:29.920 --> 00:41:30.639 I'm a loser. 00:41:31.039 --> 00:41:35.360 All that still pops into my head, but I know how to kind of counter it and give myself some grace. 00:41:35.519 --> 00:41:35.679 Yeah. 00:41:35.760 --> 00:41:39.599 I was gonna say, is that that's something you taught yourself how to do? 00:41:39.840 --> 00:41:40.079 Yeah. 00:41:40.239 --> 00:41:40.400 Yeah. 00:41:40.559 --> 00:41:40.719 Right. 00:41:40.800 --> 00:41:42.000 Like I find the same thing. 00:41:42.079 --> 00:41:45.119 If I'm if I'm uh, okay, you know what? 00:41:45.199 --> 00:41:49.360 Time to, you know, make some calls, time to book some appointments for the office, whatever. 00:41:49.519 --> 00:41:53.519 It's like the first couple are like, oh man, that's a little rusty because I haven't done it in a couple weeks. 00:41:53.679 --> 00:41:57.360 But then you start getting into it, you're like, oh, this is fine, this is just natural again, and it's easy. 00:41:57.440 --> 00:42:00.800 But yeah, when I was first starting out in the business, like it was hard. 00:42:00.960 --> 00:42:07.119 Like trying to pick up the phone day after day and get rejected, you're like you have to really learn to like find a way to deal with it. 00:42:07.280 --> 00:42:07.599 Yeah. 00:42:07.840 --> 00:42:11.039 And I would probably agree with that physical fitness is kind of the same. 00:42:11.199 --> 00:42:17.440 Like once you're in a habit, yeah, you can fall out of the habit, but the more you do it, the easier it is to come back to it. 00:42:17.920 --> 00:42:22.480 Um, you already have that mental fortitude, you've already built up that resiliency to kind of just keep going. 00:42:22.559 --> 00:42:28.159 It still takes effort, yeah, but it's just not like it's just not like a rubber band. 00:42:28.239 --> 00:42:29.599 It doesn't just come back instantaneously. 00:42:29.840 --> 00:42:30.400 Not for me. 00:42:30.559 --> 00:42:30.800 Right? 00:42:30.960 --> 00:42:31.360 Yeah. 00:42:31.760 --> 00:42:32.559 So interesting. 00:42:32.719 --> 00:42:33.039 Okay. 00:42:33.440 --> 00:42:44.800 Um and so if you uh we talked earlier, like so we talked a little bit earlier about if all these things hadn't have happened, we wouldn't be where we are today, and that kind of stuff. 00:42:44.960 --> 00:42:48.960 Are there some things though in your past where maybe you feel like you would have done something a little different? 00:42:49.599 --> 00:42:54.079 Maybe like a failure that you had that maybe you you kind of wish you could go back and redo or something. 00:42:54.320 --> 00:42:54.960 Oh, I'm sure. 00:42:55.039 --> 00:43:08.159 I I think um I I I would have loved for someone to shift my energy around money and abundance coming from a small town. 00:43:08.480 --> 00:43:09.760 We did talk about that a little bit, yeah. 00:43:10.000 --> 00:43:11.440 Yeah,

I think we did over the phone, right? 00:43:11.519 --> 00:43:24.719 Yeah, yeah, where um uh coming from a small town and especially Canadian, because we don't have um, especially when I was younger, we don't have that American dream mentality where it's like, oh, I can have this and that. 00:43:24.880 --> 00:43:28.880 Like it's not really um part of uh my makeup. 00:43:29.119 --> 00:43:41.039 So going into the US and having even the success on Broadway, it it was kind of a hard pill to swallow and to accept that the successes I was getting, and also where do I take it from there? 00:43:41.199 --> 00:43:47.119 Um, like I remember um when we my husband and I bought a Land Rover car. 00:43:47.840 --> 00:43:59.679 I had so much guilt, like and res like I was debating this was a terrible idea just because of the amount of money that that it was, but it was zero percent financing, it was going. 00:44:00.239 --> 00:44:08.719 Be a car that was going to be able to have us travel appropriately with all of the stuff that we have for filming and for his work and my work. 00:44:09.039 --> 00:44:21.920 So it made sense, but it was really hard, and that was only six years ago, for me to adjust my hero brain into uh accepting abundance and or uh that kind of um spending. 00:44:22.159 --> 00:44:22.480 Yeah. 00:44:22.639 --> 00:44:30.400 Um so I wish someone shifted that for me and and I would have heard that that it's okay, you're not a bad person if you want money and or if you have money come in. 00:44:30.719 --> 00:44:30.880 Yeah. 00:44:31.199 --> 00:44:31.360 Yeah. 00:44:31.440 --> 00:44:34.639 I mean, listen, I mean in my business, I talk a lot, we talk I talk about it a lot. 00:44:34.719 --> 00:44:35.840 I mean, that's what I do, right? 00:44:35.920 --> 00:44:37.440 As a financial advisor. 00:44:37.679 --> 00:44:51.920 But the the fact that so many people attach so much stuff to money has always been kind of intriguing to me because money is really just a tool, right? 00:44:52.000 --> 00:44:55.599 If if you're a good person and you make a lot of money, you're probably gonna do a lot of good with it. 00:44:56.079 --> 00:44:59.599 If you're a bad person and you have a lot of money, you're probably gonna do a lot of bad with it. 00:45:00.239 --> 00:45:04.320 And so, but we don't come most of us don't come from money, right? 00:45:04.719 --> 00:45:17.199 So when you grow up with a certain lifestyle and certain thoughts, certain feelings, whether it's family or friends or um that kind of thing around money, it can be really hard to kind of change that. 00:45:17.440 --> 00:45:17.599 Right. 00:45:18.079 --> 00:45:22.960 Uh especially when we start making significant money that, you know, not everybody makes every day. 00:45:23.119 --> 00:45:23.360 Right. 00:45:23.519 --> 00:45:23.760 Right. 00:45:23.840 --> 00:45:31.039 So it becomes a little what do you think was the what do you think was sort of the hardest part of that for you when it comes just to to this concept of money? 00:45:31.199 --> 00:45:42.719 And I think developing relationships that are respectful, like with even producers of Broadway shows, or anyone that had money, I kind of looked at them as evil, to be honest. 00:45:42.960 --> 00:45:43.119 Okay. 00:45:43.280 --> 00:45:48.559 Like and I'm talking like many years ago, I've shifted that where uh as you just said, there's good people with money. 00:45:48.639 --> 00:45:48.719 Right. 00:45:48.960 --> 00:45:55.280 But coming from this area, and you know, my my my parents had um they worked their butts off in middle class jobs. 00:45:55.440 --> 00:46:00.559 Um, but I I always looked at money, people with money as can I trust them? 00:46:00.719 --> 00:46:01.519 How do they get that? 00:46:01.840 --> 00:46:02.960 Because we did we don't see that. 00:46:03.119 --> 00:46:07.840 I don't see people uh inheriting wealth when I grew up in in Harrow. 00:46:08.800 --> 00:46:16.159 Um so I I shifted that and um certainly I have lots of friends um at many financial levels, right? 00:46:16.480 --> 00:46:17.519 Doesn't matter. 00:46:17.679 --> 00:46:21.440 Um but that was something that I had to shift because I'm in that world, right? 00:46:21.599 --> 00:46:22.960 I'm around all of it. 00:46:23.119 --> 00:46:25.199 All of it all the time, and more money than not. 00:46:25.360 --> 00:46:25.760 Yeah. 00:46:26.000 --> 00:46:30.800 And so how do you how do you accept that and be in a world that you're not bitter, right? 00:46:30.880 --> 00:46:32.079 Right, or like judging. 00:46:32.159 --> 00:46:32.320 Yeah. 00:46:32.400 --> 00:46:33.760 Um so no, I shifted that. 00:46:34.079 --> 00:46:46.800 Do you think it's because I mean when I got in the business, I I was always taught you know, people when we're growing up, you hear people use like that person is filthy rich. 00:46:47.039 --> 00:46:47.360 Yeah. 00:46:47.519 --> 00:46:47.760 Right. 00:46:47.840 --> 00:47:01.840 And it's kind of like the the the mentality around the words that we're using to describe people who have money, because like, yeah, they have a lot of money, but that doesn't mean that they're filthy people in that sense, right? 00:47:02.079 --> 00:47:02.480 Right, yeah. 00:47:02.719 --> 00:47:09.440 Um, do you think it has a lot to do with that kind of fact that you just maybe those were the things that were being said around you? 00:47:10.000 --> 00:47:11.519 I think I'm learning something today. 00:47:11.760 --> 00:47:12.079 Yeah. 00:47:12.239 --> 00:47:15.599 No, I I didn't really analyze that, but of course it comes from from that. 00:47:15.920 --> 00:47:16.159 Yeah. 00:47:16.639 --> 00:47:17.039 Interesting. 00:47:17.199 --> 00:47:18.320 And so what do you think? 00:47:18.400 --> 00:47:28.079 Um uh now that you've sort of overcome that, um how do you think you kind of feel and operate now? 00:47:28.239 --> 00:47:32.400 Do you like do you sense not dealing with it? 00:47:32.800 --> 00:47:42.000 Or I don't know how the best way to say this,

uh before you dealt with it, I guess, and before you kind of opened your mind up to that concept. 00:47:42.320 --> 00:47:53.440 Um do you find that you looked at your career or your job opportunities or any of the experiences differently than you do now? 00:47:55.360 --> 00:47:55.599 Right? 00:47:55.760 --> 00:48:11.119 Because offering, you know, let's just say you got offered a role, let's say 10 years ago for whatever a million dollars a year versus a role now, having two different trains of thought around money, there must be like some kind of a different feeling or a different thought process. 00:48:11.280 --> 00:48:15.599 Or do you think before you might have felt like a bad person? 00:48:15.760 --> 00:48:18.800 Whereas now you're just like, it just is? 00:48:19.440 --> 00:48:25.760 Well, you I've had great success in the entertainment industry, but the level that I've had has not seen incredible wealth. 00:48:25.840 --> 00:48:26.880 It I just haven't. 00:48:27.039 --> 00:48:28.400 Um I I'm open to it. 00:48:28.480 --> 00:48:30.559 I've I've always been like, come on, bring it on. 00:48:30.639 --> 00:48:30.800 Yeah. 00:48:30.960 --> 00:48:34.719 But uh, you know, ensemble contracts on Broadway don't pay a lot. 00:48:34.800 --> 00:48:41.840 And you get thrilled when you're an understudy and you get on to go on for a week or two weeks because you make, you know, quadruple the paycheck that you normally would. 00:48:41.920 --> 00:48:42.159 Yeah. 00:48:42.320 --> 00:49:01.679 Um, so I've seen, I have seen money come in, but I think in my circumstance, being um a foreign uh you know worker um and putting so much into my green card and my citizenship, I've had investments that have depleted a lot of my wealth um that I haven't seen in Americans um there. 00:49:02.079 --> 00:49:24.239 So, like I wouldn't say I have resentment at all against that um or judgment, but um I I give myself grace that I haven't been able to invest in things differently than other people that were in my same situation because even the dollar being different, I certainly filtered a lot of money back home to protect family and take care of them with vacations and things like that. 00:49:24.559 --> 00:49:26.960 So I've lived a life of of wealth. 00:49:27.199 --> 00:49:31.519 Like I feel like I'm I've always been a millionaire, even though my bank account has never seen that. 00:49:31.599 --> 00:49:31.920 Yeah. 00:49:32.159 --> 00:49:37.840 Uh and but that that shift I um I think helps too, where there money still comes in. 00:49:38.000 --> 00:49:40.480 Uh, that's why when people ask me, like, what do you do? 00:49:40.639 --> 00:49:43.119 Sometimes I'm like, I don't know anymore. 00:49:43.280 --> 00:49:52.480 Like, yes, I'm a performer and I've done reality TV and fitness and all this stuff and books and and that, but the money has come in from so many different um opportunities in my life. 00:49:52.639 --> 00:49:54.719 It's hard for me to say I do this for a living. 00:49:54.800 --> 00:49:57.920 Yeah, but the universe certainly does still take care of me. 00:49:58.159 --> 00:49:59.840 I'm open to that and I need it. 00:49:59.920 --> 00:50:05.280 I need to shift that energy around money so that I'm able to financially be stable. 00:50:05.519 --> 00:50:05.760 Right. 00:50:06.000 --> 00:50:14.559 Yeah, it's funny you say that because that was one of the things I do remember from our initial conversation, is I was like, all right, so like tell me what you do, Craig. 00:50:14.719 --> 00:50:17.760 And you were like, uh, what don't I do? 00:50:17.920 --> 00:50:24.639 Uh act, dance, speak, yeah, uh, go on TV shows, reality, like all these different things. 00:50:24.800 --> 00:50:31.440 Like you're not the you're not the I don't want to say average person, not the typical person with a nine to five job, right? 00:50:31.679 --> 00:50:33.519 Being paid for the same thing all the time. 00:50:34.159 --> 00:50:36.159 Um, you know, money comes and goes. 00:50:36.400 --> 00:50:37.840 Yeah, it does different jobs, right? 00:50:38.079 --> 00:50:38.239 Yeah. 00:50:38.559 --> 00:50:40.559 Gotta be, gotta be aware of that at the same time. 00:50:40.800 --> 00:50:46.400 Yeah, but I'm also open to people um being supportive of me in my life. 00:50:46.559 --> 00:50:58.960 Like I have to really give it to so many wonderful friends that understand that um, and this might come off totally wrong, but that my line of work in entertainment industry is being of service. 00:50:59.119 --> 00:51:05.360 Like so many people that are part of my life, my family too, they've had incredible fun opportunities because of what I do for a living. 00:51:05.519 --> 00:51:10.320 And they understand that the the it doesn't generate a whole lot of income opportunity. 00:51:10.480 --> 00:51:15.039 So when I've needed it, I've had people step in and help me, which is hard to accept too. 00:51:15.280 --> 00:51:20.079 You know, we're in like a 40 plus year old man, and I'm like, I need help with rent. 00:51:20.239 --> 00:51:27.199 And it has happened um because it it's ebb and flow, like it it's not always coming in in this industry. 00:51:27.360 --> 00:51:34.559 Um, but now uh I'm just so grateful that I I have an opportunity to kind of mature and grow up and I do have a home. 00:51:35.039 --> 00:51:37.039 Um and thank you, Amazing Race. 00:51:37.199 --> 00:51:40.400 But every you know, every single everyone thinks I'm loaded from the amazing race. 00:51:40.639 --> 00:51:44.000 And like they maybe they get um uh confused with the American show. 00:51:44.559 --> 00:51:47.119 But even the American one, the taxes are enormous. 00:51:47.360 --> 00:51:55.519 So uh, you know, a half a million doesn't let someone fully retire uh in in in their circumstance in the and again entertainment industry. 00:51:55.679 --> 00:51:57.280 But everyone thinks I'm loaded, I'm not. 00:51:57.440 --> 00:52:04.159 Like I still have a house to pay off, and every single dime from that

from my Amazing Race Win went into that investment. 00:52:04.400 --> 00:52:06.079 But I am grown up, like I have a home. 00:52:06.159 --> 00:52:06.320 Right. 00:52:06.480 --> 00:52:11.280 And so many people, even my age, uh don't have that uh opportunity and that luxury to have. 00:52:11.599 --> 00:52:19.679 Yeah, there's tons that are, you know, they they are stuck renting, you know, house prices over the last call it decade have skyrocketed. 00:52:19.760 --> 00:52:26.880 Yeah, you know, it's not easy for young people, let alone older people, from getting a place if they haven't already got one. 00:52:26.960 --> 00:52:27.440 Yeah, right. 00:52:27.519 --> 00:52:28.320 It's not easy. 00:52:28.400 --> 00:52:30.480 Uh, I mean, I see it every day, right? 00:52:30.559 --> 00:52:38.239 And I we we we talk mainly in the industry of when you hear it in the news or you see it online, it's you know, how is the next generation going to be able to afford? 00:52:38.559 --> 00:52:46.079 Yeah, sure, but there are other generations beside the next one that are still having a problem because things have just got astronomically expensive in this country. 00:52:46.239 --> 00:52:47.039 Yeah, right. 00:52:47.199 --> 00:52:53.440 So yeah, and Brandon, my husband, um had he he he that works um in a salon. 00:52:53.599 --> 00:53:02.719 He has a salon in Palo Alto in California, and there's a lot of um very high-end business people there, social lights and and such. 00:53:02.960 --> 00:53:08.079 And for decades now, he's been told you need a financial advisor. 00:53:08.320 --> 00:53:11.599 And he keeps saying, like through the journey, I have no money for it. 00:53:11.679 --> 00:53:13.920 And they said, that's exactly why. 00:53:14.159 --> 00:53:16.559 You know, it's like at the balance of well, how do you pay for one? 00:53:16.639 --> 00:53:17.519 How do you do all this? 00:53:17.679 --> 00:53:21.920 But really, that's the number one theme that we've heard for decades. 00:53:22.079 --> 00:53:24.639 And just recently we were we're doing that. 00:53:24.800 --> 00:53:26.800 Like I think we talked about it a little bit. 00:53:27.039 --> 00:53:38.320 Um, where I I think we're giving it a go to see what how we can um create wealth that um we are unaware of how to do that. 00:53:38.639 --> 00:53:42.159 Yeah, and I think it's just it's a it's a financial literacy thing, right? 00:53:42.239 --> 00:53:58.079 I mean, we are not taught, and I would probably assume it's the same in America, but we are not taught how to manage money or how to save or why we should save or how five bucks every week grows to a big number by the time we want to retire. 00:53:58.239 --> 00:53:59.599 Like we're just not taught, right? 00:53:59.760 --> 00:54:00.000 Right. 00:54:00.079 --> 00:54:12.719 Uh it's one thing I love about um my job is being able to educate people about something that gets me excited about, very similar to you in that sense, as I get to coach and teach and do other things, but in

an area that you love. 00:54:12.880 --> 00:54:13.039 Yeah. 00:54:13.199 --> 00:54:13.440 Right? 00:54:13.519 --> 00:54:16.159 Numbers has just always been something that I've loved to do. 00:54:16.400 --> 00:54:16.639 Wow. 00:54:16.800 --> 00:54:17.039 Right. 00:54:17.119 --> 00:54:19.360 So I'm kind of lucky in that sense, you know. 00:54:19.519 --> 00:54:20.079 I think it's great. 00:54:20.159 --> 00:54:24.559 Yeah, I would have loved a class in that in uh Harrow junior school or even senior school. 00:54:24.639 --> 00:54:26.559 That would have been marvelous to hear. 00:54:26.800 --> 00:54:27.679 Yeah, I hear that a lot. 00:54:27.840 --> 00:54:30.880 When I meet with like teachers and stuff like that, they're like, Oh, you should come and teach. 00:54:30.960 --> 00:54:39.119 But unfortunately, it's you don't want to put the conspiracy hat on, but you know, it's not banks and it's not government's job to teach us how to manage money. 00:54:39.280 --> 00:54:39.519 Right. 00:54:39.679 --> 00:54:40.000 Right? 00:54:40.159 --> 00:54:44.320 They just they want their taxes and banks love keeping our money from us, right? 00:54:44.400 --> 00:54:46.559 So um, but it's unfortunate. 00:54:46.880 --> 00:54:55.920 But it's something too when I do go into schools and talk to them in high school art schools and uh university programs where I say, you know, this industry is lucrative. 00:54:56.000 --> 00:54:58.400 Like I don't want to make it out that like I haven't made any money. 00:54:58.639 --> 00:55:06.960 I certainly, you know, two broke girls, I see r royalty checks coming in still from years down the road, and it's small stuff, but it still pays for my phone bill. 00:55:07.360 --> 00:55:31.440 Like there's opportunity um in in this entertainment industry that uh are not really taught in schools where I think because of my experience I'm able to bridge that gap and tell them like when I first moved to LA, I did this, um, I showed up and and did this print audition, which is for like a magazine, like an ad um for Intel Bentium processors or whatever it is, and all they wanted was a yoga post. 00:55:31.599 --> 00:55:39.840 I didn't have any yoga experience, I just was like, oh, I think this is it, and I was confident with it, and I got hired for it, and it was more money than I made during Mamma Mia. 00:55:40.079 --> 00:55:40.320 Really? 00:55:40.559 --> 00:55:41.280 Like on day one. 00:55:41.440 --> 00:55:41.599 Wow. 00:55:41.760 --> 00:55:43.920 And all I had to do was stand on an ex and slate my name. 00:55:44.079 --> 00:55:54.079 Like if you if you expand what you think of it in the entertainment industry, and I think that a lot of kids don't know that that exists, there is money to be made, and it can be really lucrative and fun. 00:55:54.239 --> 00:55:55.440 It's like live your life. 00:55:55.679 --> 00:55:57.360 Yeah, very different, right? 00:55:57.599 --> 00:56:01.519 Not nine to five, not stuck in an office, not right, you know, that interesting. 00:56:01.840 --> 00:56:10.559 But even if it is a nine to five and it turns into one, uh, you know, the the studies show that theater kids succeed in other aspects of the business world. 00:56:10.800 --> 00:56:11.039 Yeah. 00:56:11.280 --> 00:56:12.239 Why do you think that is? 00:56:12.880 --> 00:56:22.559 Because I think it's the creative, I think it's the everything is different, kind of go with the flow a little bit more, they're open to different opportunities. 00:56:22.719 --> 00:56:23.119 Yeah. 00:56:23.280 --> 00:56:26.079 Um, they can problem solve things like that. 00:56:26.559 --> 00:56:27.280 Take rejection. 00:56:27.440 --> 00:56:27.760 Yeah. 00:56:28.079 --> 00:56:28.800 Yeah, for sure. 00:56:28.960 --> 00:56:31.920 And think outside of the box as you say like creativity. 00:56:32.159 --> 00:56:34.639 Uh, and I think working with uh people. 00:56:34.880 --> 00:56:42.079 Like one thing that really worked for Catherine and I on The Amazing Race was we didn't look at it as uh anything other than an ensemble show. 00:56:42.239 --> 00:56:48.719 We've never, well, just recently we do have our own two-person show now, but we've never on Broadway had our own show. 00:56:48.880 --> 00:56:50.800 It's always we work well with a group. 00:56:50.880 --> 00:56:53.840 That's how you survive in on stage performing, right? 00:56:54.320 --> 00:56:55.360 You're an ensemble. 00:56:55.519 --> 00:57:02.159 So I we looked at that and we respected everyone differently than a lot of the other teams did, and we kind of brought everyone in together. 00:57:02.320 --> 00:57:10.000 And in that process, I think people liked having us around and had liking us around protected us and gave us more longevity too. 00:57:10.159 --> 00:57:10.320 Right. 00:57:10.480 --> 00:57:14.239 And I think that that transfers over to the business world with any theater, theater kids. 00:57:14.400 --> 00:57:16.880 That's why theater's so important, even in high school. 00:57:17.039 --> 00:57:18.559 Yeah, it really shouldn't be cut. 00:57:18.639 --> 00:57:27.840 We think we should be putting more and more money into the arts uh for creativity and and that community-driven uh part of this this world. 00:57:28.159 --> 00:57:45.760 Yeah, I mean, I never even thought about it that way, but yeah, just dealing with people, dealing with the rejection, which is all the things that we do all the time, whether it's you know, trying to find a spouse or friend groups or career paths, like we're always meeting new people all the time. 00:57:46.159 --> 00:57:51.840 Which is my number one advice to my my son is the biggest decision you're ever gonna make is a spouse. 00:57:52.400 --> 00:57:56.639 You know, you keep you can't uh choose your your family except your spouse. 00:57:56.719 --> 00:57:57.039 Yeah. 00:57:57.280 --> 00:58:03.599 And you you really have to be solid in what that is and what that looks like uh for both of you, mutually. 00:58:03.920 --> 00:58:04.079 Yeah.

00:58:04.320 --> 00:58:05.119 Yeah, I know I agree. 00:58:05.280 --> 00:58:06.480 So what's next for you guys then? 00:58:06.639 --> 00:58:07.280 What's next for you? 00:58:07.360 --> 00:58:08.880 What's next for you, Brandon? 00:58:08.960 --> 00:58:10.719 Obviously, I remember you guys are moving here. 00:58:10.800 --> 00:58:14.159 He's yeah, is he you guys threw your party already, didn't you? 00:58:14.400 --> 00:58:15.039 No, it's coming up. 00:58:15.360 --> 00:58:15.760 Yeah, yeah. 00:58:16.159 --> 00:58:17.519 The permanent residency party. 00:58:17.760 --> 00:58:24.000 So I did sponsor Brandon for permanent residency, uh, which uh we've been putting into motion for years, really. 00:58:24.079 --> 00:58:30.559 Um, but uh the opportunity presented itself recently, so we're thrilled uh that we're here more times than not now. 00:58:30.639 --> 00:58:30.800 Okay. 00:58:30.960 --> 00:58:32.960 Um of course work still has us abroad. 00:58:33.119 --> 00:58:38.400 Brandon uh works with the B-52s and the Go Go's, and he's on tour with the B-52s over the summer. 00:58:38.480 --> 00:58:43.920 And the the huge benefit I get to do is I'm the rock lobster whenever I'm in town with them. 00:58:44.159 --> 00:58:49.840 So I get to dress up in the rock lobster outfit at the end and do some fun dance stuff and um be on stage with them. 00:58:50.159 --> 00:59:00.880 But Catherine and I, my amazing race partner, uh, we do keynote presentations that is uh on the power of friendship and how important human connection is in an AI-driven world. 00:59:01.280 --> 00:59:05.840 And that really motivates uh corporations um and makes them smile. 00:59:06.079 --> 00:59:09.119 And it's the first ever story song and dance keynote. 00:59:09.199 --> 00:59:14.400 So it's highly entertaining, but it hits all of the keynote uh requirements, if you will. 00:59:14.880 --> 00:59:25.599 And uh that's been wonderful to travel across Canada and do what we love to do and bring our story of resilience and and passion to um to people. 00:59:25.760 --> 00:59:31.519 And then we have our our two-person show Behind the Curtain, which is uh coming back to this area. 00:59:31.679 --> 00:59:44.639 We had a uh sold-out amazing experience at the Capitol last year, and we want to bring it to Essex County, so we're doing it at the Bank Theater in Leamington on Friday, July 3rd, and tickets go on sale uh very soon for that. 00:59:45.760 --> 00:59:46.400 What is that about? 00:59:46.639 --> 00:59:52.800 Uh oh well because I don't know what you're talking about, so I'm kind of can I'm kind of interested. 00:59:53.119 --> 01:00:03.199 So behind the curtain is uh a full show of Catherine and I uh and our journey together, a friendship, a decades-long friendship in the entertainment industry. 01:00:03.360 --> 01:00:06.480 So we tell the stories that have never been shared before. 01:00:06.639 --> 01:00:15.440 And the way that all of this came to be was uh Catherine is writing a book, and I'm assisting her

and interviewing her for the book that she's uh gonna write. 01:00:15.679 --> 01:00:19.519 Because we we definitely have a lot of impactful stories. 01:00:19.760 --> 01:00:19.920 Stories. 01:00:20.159 --> 01:00:20.559 Yes. 01:00:20.800 --> 01:00:30.639 And with the book, um, there was a whole list of of these stories that we categorized and put away uh that should never ever be shared and um should be burned. 01:00:30.880 --> 01:00:34.000 And then Catherine at one point she's like, I have terminal brain cancer. 01:00:34.079 --> 01:00:34.639 What do I care? 01:00:34.719 --> 01:00:37.199 And she's like, let's do a whole cabaret on those stories. 01:00:37.519 --> 01:00:41.760 And because our journey for decades has been together, her stories are my stories. 01:00:41.840 --> 01:00:42.719 I'm there with her. 01:00:42.800 --> 01:00:43.039 Yeah. 01:00:43.199 --> 01:00:48.719 So we piece together this cabaret that is very vulnerable but relatable. 01:00:48.880 --> 01:00:52.079 Like people are howling, they're laughing, laughing. 01:00:52.239 --> 01:00:55.360 And then one minute later, they're in tears of joy. 01:00:55.440 --> 01:01:06.079 And because we we definitely take everyone through the journey, if not just the amazing race win, but behind the scenes of our Broadway careers and Catherine's cancer journey. 01:01:06.320 --> 01:01:13.360 I mean, uh, she's such a remarkable person living with a terminal illness and given three-month increments at a time. 01:01:13.519 --> 01:01:19.840 Um, but we sing highlights uh from our Broadway careers, so a lot of favorite tunes are shared. 01:01:19.920 --> 01:01:23.440 Um, but the stories are not they're the behind the scenes, if you will. 01:01:23.840 --> 01:01:24.400 Yeah, fair enough. 01:01:24.559 --> 01:01:24.719 Yeah. 01:01:24.960 --> 01:01:25.360 Interesting. 01:01:25.519 --> 01:01:25.760 Okay. 01:01:26.159 --> 01:01:27.440 I think my wife would love that. 01:01:27.679 --> 01:01:29.519 Yeah, so July 3rd in the area. 01:01:29.599 --> 01:01:29.760 Yeah. 01:01:30.000 --> 01:01:32.719 I might have to I might have to bring her and the little boy out. 01:01:32.960 --> 01:01:33.599 Please, yeah. 01:01:33.679 --> 01:01:35.440 It's it's definitely not family friendly. 01:01:35.519 --> 01:01:37.119 It's adult content only. 01:01:37.599 --> 01:01:38.639 It's 10 months, so it's fine. 01:01:38.880 --> 01:01:39.519 He'll go over his end. 01:01:39.840 --> 01:01:41.039 He won't remember, it's fine. 01:01:41.199 --> 01:01:41.599 Yeah, yeah. 01:01:41.679 --> 01:01:42.639 Let's just put it this way. 01:01:42.719 --> 01:01:47.280 Um, my son has not seen the show and won't see it for a few years. 01:01:47.360 --> 01:01:47.519 Yeah. 01:01:47.840 --> 01:01:48.400 Ten years. 01:01:48.639 --> 01:01:49.840 Yeah, 10 years. 01:01:50.400 --> 01:01:51.519 Um cool. 01:01:51.679 --> 01:01:57.039 Uh well, listen, I mean, we're uh much over time here, um, but we could probably talk for a long time. 01:01:57.119 --> 01:01:59.039 Um, every time we've and I trust we will again. 01:01:59.599 --> 01:02:00.639 100% we will. 01:02:00.800 --> 01:02:08.639 Um what uh is there anything else that you want to share for anybody listening audience-wise, about anything coming up for you or anything like that? 01:02:09.119 --> 01:02:12.400 I'm getting more involved in the community here in Windsor and Essex County. 01:02:12.639 --> 01:02:13.920 Uh I'm thrilled. 01:02:14.079 --> 01:02:18.079 I I just love uh directing, choreographing. 01:02:18.159 --> 01:02:19.760 Um, so stay tuned. 01:02:19.840 --> 01:02:22.719 You know, there's some fun uh things in the in the works. 01:02:22.960 --> 01:02:23.199 Okay. 01:02:23.360 --> 01:02:25.360 And yeah, I just uh and say hi. 01:02:25.440 --> 01:02:32.880 I just I love connecting with this area and I I think that there should be a lot of pride that exists in in Windsor and Essex County. 01:02:33.039 --> 01:02:33.440 I would agree. 01:02:33.679 --> 01:02:35.519 I think we have something so special here. 01:02:35.679 --> 01:02:41.039 Obviously, you know, I've had the luxury of traveling the world, but there's nothing like being home and being here. 01:02:41.360 --> 01:02:49.039 Yeah, I mean, listen, I didn't grow up here, uh, and I am uh wholeheartedly uh with you on that. 01:02:49.280 --> 01:02:54.079 Um, this is my home now, has been for eight years, but like yourself, I have traveled the world. 01:02:54.239 --> 01:03:00.400 I've done 25, 26 countries, done it for swimming, done it just for normal travel, done it to meet friends. 01:03:00.480 --> 01:03:02.400 But Windsor is just it's fantastic. 01:03:02.480 --> 01:03:07.199 Yeah, and there's so many people that just don't know that it is a great place to be. 01:03:07.519 --> 01:03:08.159 It's amazing. 01:03:08.320 --> 01:03:08.559 Yeah. 01:03:08.800 --> 01:03:12.320 I'm so grateful to to be here and to have stayed connected with the area. 01:03:12.400 --> 01:03:16.320 And thank thank you for everyone for being interested in what I've been doing too. 01:03:16.480 --> 01:03:19.440 Uh, I think my my closest friends are from here. 01:03:19.519 --> 01:03:21.119 Uh, they know me better than anyone. 01:03:21.280 --> 01:03:27.920 You know, I really have not changed a whole lot since that grade five boy, you know, at Harrow uh senior school. 01:03:28.079 --> 01:03:29.599 And those friends know it. 01:03:29.679 --> 01:03:39.519 Uh and they're it it's really it's comforting for me because they are intrigued and they care, but there's not um any competition or resentment against me. 01:03:39.599 --> 01:03:48.159 Like I find that there's some people in the entertainment industry that it's difficult for them to hear and be around stories of other successes that they didn't have, you know, and it triggers them. 01:03:48.400 --> 01:03:56.719 And that's what's really comforting is that um yeah, people are interested, but they they just love they love hearing it so they can see it all behind the curtain. 01:03:56.880 -->

01:03:57.760 July 3rd. 01:03:58.079 --> 01:04:00.239 Man, I love we could talk forever. 01:04:00.400 --> 01:04:02.880 Every time you every time you say something, there's always one more thing. 01:04:02.960 --> 01:04:14.880 Because I love what you just said there, but like there's so people need to be aware that if you if you want some good in your life, you have to actually want good in other people's lives. 01:04:15.199 --> 01:04:16.079 Oh man, very nice. 01:04:16.639 --> 01:04:29.760 I've heard so many times we're just like that, where you're like, yeah, they just they're jealous of someone's success or they're jealous of something that they're doing, but like if you're jealous of that person having the success, yeah, why like why would you get it in your own life? 01:04:30.000 --> 01:04:32.719 Yeah, abundance is not limited, abundance is not limited, right? 01:04:32.800 --> 01:04:35.760 And just because someone else is winning doesn't mean you're not. 01:04:36.159 --> 01:04:40.800 You maybe need to reframe some things or rethink some things or change path, but you can win too. 01:04:40.880 --> 01:04:41.519 Yeah, right. 01:04:41.679 --> 01:04:44.400 And it's not just uh, well, he's winning, so I'll never win. 01:04:44.559 --> 01:04:45.360 You can win too. 01:04:45.519 --> 01:04:46.079 Yeah, right? 01:04:46.159 --> 01:04:47.119 It's it's interesting to see. 01:04:47.519 --> 01:04:49.519 Catherine and I never thought we'd win the amazing race. 01:04:49.679 --> 01:04:50.320 We never did. 01:04:50.400 --> 01:04:53.039 It never popped in our mind that we would win it. 01:04:53.199 --> 01:04:58.880 We felt the win, like I we didn't want to discount that, and we sat in that place of, oh, that win feels good, right? 01:04:59.119 --> 01:05:02.159 But all we wanted was longevity and we wanted to be in the game. 01:05:02.239 --> 01:05:02.719 That's it. 01:05:02.880 --> 01:05:05.280 And that led us to the finale. 01:05:05.360 --> 01:05:11.679 And then it was only at the very end of the finale where it it even be popped in our head that we could win this. 01:05:11.840 --> 01:05:12.159 Right. 01:05:12.320 --> 01:05:13.280 That wasn't the goal. 01:05:13.360 --> 01:05:13.519 Right. 01:05:13.679 --> 01:05:14.960 And I think that transfers over to life. 01:05:15.840 --> 01:05:17.360 It wasn't just uh, we're coming to win this thing. 01:05:17.440 --> 01:05:18.480 It's we're coming to have an experience. 01:05:18.719 --> 01:05:19.519 But shouldn't that be life? 01:05:19.599 --> 01:05:20.800 Yeah, shouldn't that be a job? 01:05:20.880 --> 01:05:22.239 Shouldn't that be a uh a show? 01:05:22.559 --> 01:05:23.280 Like it doesn't matter. 01:05:23.360 --> 01:05:31.440 I what I learned over the years is now um it doesn't matter if it's on Broadway or Windsor Light Opera or any any theater, even locally. 01:05:31.679 --> 01:05:35.119 What's behind you, that million dollar set, is none of your business as an actor. 01:05:35.199 --> 01:05:40.159 You're facing forward and you're delivering the same energy to an audience, doesn't matter where your stage is. 01:05:40.400 --> 01:05:41.199 That's what I'm saying. 01:05:41.280 --> 01:05:48.159 Uh I'm thrilled to be back because now I'm able to to have fulfillment like I've never had before right at home. 01:05:48.400 --> 01:05:48.639 Yeah. 01:05:49.119 --> 01:05:49.679 That's awesome. 01:05:49.760 --> 01:05:49.920 Yeah. 01:05:50.079 --> 01:05:52.000 Uh and so I didn't prepare you for this. 01:05:52.079 --> 01:05:54.719 Uh we always end the podcast with one question. 01:05:55.039 --> 01:05:55.360 Okay. 01:05:56.000 --> 01:05:59.280 What does success mean to Craig? 01:05:59.519 --> 01:05:59.760 Wow. 01:06:00.159 --> 01:06:00.320 Oh. 01:06:04.480 --> 01:06:12.239 Success for me would be happiness. 01:06:12.480 --> 01:06:12.880 Smile. 01:06:13.519 --> 01:06:15.519 Something that makes me smile and feel good. 01:06:16.079 --> 01:06:17.280 I shouldn't even say smile. 01:06:17.360 --> 01:06:18.400 I should say in the heart. 01:06:18.800 --> 01:06:26.159 Like if you follow your your feelings from a heart place, as long as it feels good and easy, that's successful. 01:06:26.320 --> 01:06:28.719 And that doesn't mean that's riches or anything. 01:06:28.800 --> 01:06:29.840 It's just satisfaction. 01:06:30.880 --> 01:06:32.079 I can get behind that. 01:06:32.559 --> 01:06:32.800 100%. 01:06:33.119 --> 01:06:38.480 I mean, if you can't if you can't uh you can't enjoy and you can't feel good, right? 01:06:38.800 --> 01:06:40.480 Then you got to change something up. 01:06:40.639 --> 01:06:41.039 Yep. 01:06:41.199 --> 01:06:44.880 It's just not it's not fun to go through life not enjoying what you're doing. 01:06:45.039 --> 01:06:46.159 Yeah, lead from the heart. 01:06:46.320 --> 01:06:46.559 Yeah. 01:06:46.719 --> 01:06:47.679 I love that one. 01:06:47.840 --> 01:06:48.480 It's great. 01:06:48.639 --> 01:06:50.480 Uh well, thank you very much, Craig. 01:06:50.559 --> 01:06:51.360 I appreciate the time. 01:06:51.599 --> 01:06:52.639 This was a fun conversation. 01:06:52.719 --> 01:06:52.880 Yeah. 01:06:53.039 --> 01:06:56.239 I know this isn't going to be the last time we have one of these. 01:06:56.400 --> 01:06:58.800 Um, I'm sure you're going to be a guest on this again. 01:06:58.880 --> 01:07:02.639 Uh hear about all the things that you've done for the community uh in the future. 01:07:02.880 --> 01:07:03.119 Great. 01:07:03.280 --> 01:07:03.760 Thank you. 01:07:04.000 --> 01:07:08.639 Uh that's it for another episode, guys, of Cracking the Success Fault with Spectre Group. 01:07:08.719 --> 01:07:13.519 Uh, as always, you can find us on uh your your Apple Podcast, YouTube, Spotify. 01:07:13.599 --> 01:07:14.559 You know where to find us. 01:07:14.719 --> 01:07:15.840 Until next time.