7: From Freeze to Flow: Reclaiming Safety Through the Nervous System with Amy Thomson Holaday, RN, LMT의 전체 녹취록

of it that way at the time. 00:06:34.000 --> 00:06:40.639 I didn't realize it with those types of words at the time, but when I think back, it felt that clear. 00:06:40.720 --> 00:06:53.199 It felt and I have my my parents to thank for that um experience because I I grew up without indoctrination. 00:06:53.360 --> 00:06:56.480 I grew up without being told what to believe. 00:06:57.439 --> 00:07:08.240 So, which was kind of tough in the South, in the middle of the Bible belt, and mostly because I wanted to join youth group and have fun times like all my friends were having. 00:07:08.959 --> 00:07:09.519 Right. 00:07:09.839 --> 00:07:22.560 Um, but I basically um was able to experience it that way because I had like a clean slate. 00:07:23.600 --> 00:07:24.240 Yeah. 00:07:27.839 --> 00:07:29.120 And that's a blessing. 00:07:29.199 --> 00:07:41.519 I mean, a lot of people have a very opposite reaction to spirit, to God, um, because there's so much blockage there. 00:07:41.839 --> 00:07:51.839 And it sounds like you were just letting that flow, your inner divine self flow, even from when you were in second grade in nature. 00:07:52.399 --> 00:07:59.680 How beautiful to say that was, and of course, when you were in second grade, you didn't know, right? 00:07:59.759 --> 00:08:02.399 You were just experiencing the beauty of nature. 00:08:02.560 --> 00:08:32.240 But with children, and I've mentioned before, I'm a teacher, but with children, I think we can learn so much from children because they have so much clarity that we as adults just don't have because you go through your life and people tell you things, and there's judgments, and there's all of this crap, for lack of a better word, that gets built up in us and blocks that inner true divine presence that we all have. 00:08:32.399 --> 00:08:46.159 And as children, when you look at children who are just enjoying life, you're reminded that that's truly what we're meant to be doing throughout our whole life, not just as kids. 00:08:46.320 --> 00:09:00.320 And so it's so beautiful to hear you mention like you've had that feeling since you were so young, and that not only have you kept up with it, but like you remember that and you keep that in your adult life. 00:09:00.480 --> 00:09:09.600 I think that's just really a beautiful testament to not only you as a person, but to our to our creator. 00:09:11.679 --> 00:09:12.399 Thank you. 00:09:12.720 --> 00:09:21.039 I basically found it's like I didn't realize the experiences until much later. 00:09:21.279 --> 00:09:21.679 Right. 00:09:21.840 --> 00:09:28.080 And there was plenty of challenge, plenty of suffering. 00:09:28.879 --> 00:09:40.559 So it wasn't all filled, and so it was like I didn't quite get the kind of foundational um part of that until much later. 00:09:41.200 --> 00:09:41.840 Yeah. 00:09:43.759 --> 00:09:44.000 Yeah. 00:09:44.240 --> 00:09:46.320 How did um that come about for you? 00:09:46.480 --> 00:09:53.840 So if you kind of had this feeling for yourself, like how how did that transpire when you were older, if I can ask? 00:09:54.240 --> 00:09:55.279 Yeah, thank you. 00:09:55.440 --> 00:10:13.519 I basically um found myself um struggling with what do I want to do in my career, and originally had studied mechanical and biomedical engineering, which um I was miserable the entire time. 00:10:13.600 --> 00:10:14.799 I did not enjoy that. 00:10:14.960 --> 00:10:26.960 So I was doing it for not out of a place of being in sync with who I was and being in sync with my soul or my true nature or what really drives me. 00:10:27.279 --> 00:10:33.759 Um, and so I was experimenting after. 00:10:33.919 --> 00:10:40.720 So this was like me starting to have faith, but I didn't realize that's what I was doing. 00:10:41.039 --> 00:10:49.600 Um, I just started saying, all I can do is make one decision, and then I can make one more decision, and I can see how that feels. 00:10:50.080 --> 00:11:03.759 And at the time I was living in Boston as an engineer, and I joined this women's career exploration and decision-making workshop run by a counselor in the area. 00:11:04.000 --> 00:11:15.600 And so I met with all these women, and one of them suggested, based on the things I said that I would like that I go teach at this boarding school for rebel teenagers. 00:11:16.080 --> 00:11:24.159 So I left Boston and began teaching at a boarding school for rebel teenagers in Maine. 00:11:24.480 --> 00:11:33.200 I was running the ropes, I was like a coach or whatever you call it, the person who's helping them do the ropes course in the woods. 00:11:33.759 --> 00:11:43.120 And um I was I was trying out counseling as a profession, and I didn't want to get another degree and not use it. 00:11:43.200 --> 00:11:46.960 So I went and I just dove in and became a counselor at this school. 00:11:47.039 --> 00:11:49.279 That was part of what the teachers did there. 00:11:50.399 --> 00:11:56.879 And um, so trial by fire and um learned a lot that way. 00:11:57.360 --> 00:12:06.320 And but I remember someone asking me at that school, it was like a mentor, he said, Do you believe in a higher power or not? 00:12:06.559 --> 00:12:08.480 And he like forced my hand. 00:12:08.639 --> 00:12:20.240 And I said, Oh god, oh god, because I did get some belief systems spoken around me a lot that people who believe in God are weak-minded or that they're just sheep. 00:12:20.480 --> 00:12:21.279 Oh yeah. 00:12:21.919 --> 00:12:24.639 And so I had the opposite influence. 00:12:24.879 --> 00:12:33.279 Um, possibly, as then say a lot of maybe Christians get sort of the opposite type of an influence. 00:12:33.440 --> 00:12:40.960 So it took a lot for me to let go of those negative thoughts and just say, yes, I believe in a higher power. 00:12:41.200 --> 00:12:43.759 But I'm so glad he forced my hand that day. 00:12:43.919 --> 00:12:46.559 He was like, Do you believe it or do you not believe it? 00:12:46.720 --> 00:12:52.559 And then I found

myself describing what I believed to another teacher there. 00:12:52.720 --> 00:12:58.480 And anytime I did that, people's eyes got kind of like, what is she talking about? 00:12:58.720 --> 00:13:07.600 But I would say, I feel like God is in each of our hearts, God just in each of our hearts, and it God is in all of us. 00:13:07.840 --> 00:13:20.639 And uh to me, actually, when at the more I've learned about Christianity and true Christian mysticism, that is actually the teaching of true Christian mysticism. 00:13:20.799 --> 00:13:25.519 So I didn't realize I was becoming more and more Christian over the years. 00:13:26.320 --> 00:13:34.480 Um, but I was basically describing like true Christian mysticism in my 20s and didn't even realize that's what I was doing. 00:13:34.720 --> 00:13:46.879 So for me, it's just amazing to sort of feel and hear the truth coming through me and through my body, and then starting to piece the pieces together. 00:13:47.360 --> 00:13:49.039 Oh wow, that's so beautiful. 00:13:49.200 --> 00:13:50.720 I didn't know that story. 00:13:51.039 --> 00:14:03.519 And and it's funny because we've met and we have experienced this almost like a like a divine spark within us. 00:14:04.720 --> 00:14:08.159 And that's kind of my truth as well. 00:14:08.799 --> 00:14:27.679 And I've said this before that you know, I know God is real, and I know God is in me, and I know God is good, like those are the foundations, and so I just love I love that story, how you've you've kind of come to learn that through personal experience. 00:14:29.759 --> 00:14:36.480 Yeah, and a lot of processing that took a quite a long time, mm-hmm. 00:14:37.039 --> 00:14:45.200 And so I'm curious, Amy, how where are you now in in your relationship with the divine? 00:14:45.279 --> 00:14:48.240 And and tell us a little bit more about what you do. 00:14:54.240 --> 00:15:41.600 So right now, my relationship with the divine is um ever since I met you, Kylie, and we were at that retreat, we learned a beautiful meditation there that helps us get into a feeling of safety and protection in our bodies, and then it brings us into our heart space, and then in that heart space, we can it's a very simple meditation, which is why I think it's working so well for me because I can have a lot of thoughts, and I can also go into nervous system freeze um easily where my mind just kind of blanks out. 00:15:42.159 --> 00:16:27.759 So between those two things, this meditation has worked very well for me, and so since early June of this year, my relationship with God has been to sit every morning on my screen porch, um, drink my worn lemon water and my organic coffee with a dash of organic cream, and um do this meditation where we feel protected, my body feels protected by God, and then dropping into the heart space with some intentional breathing, and then ask what do you want me to know? 00:16:27.919 --> 00:16:37.679 Ask, have a conversation, um, talk about whatever it is that is true for me right now. 00:16:38.480 --> 00:16:50.000 Um, if I'm struggling with something, admit that, ask for help with that, ask for any guidance that it that might be helpful with that. 00:16:50.399 --> 00:17:25.519 And for me, it's been amazing because it just gave me that structure I needed because I can be kind of drifty thinking that I'm trying not to be controlling, um, and it just really has helped me have a more intentional personal relationship with God, and my knowing, learning my knowing has been a wild ride. 00:17:26.240 --> 00:17:39.519 And I have so many clients in sessions that have knowings, but some people have visions, some people feel things, some people know things, some people see things. 00:17:39.920 --> 00:17:52.400 The way I am in touch with my deepest truth and with God is I'll get these one or two or three quiet words that just kind of go by and easy to miss. 00:17:52.640 --> 00:18:08.319 If and so that's why I'm so happy I finally found this practice, because the way my knowing works, I need that quietness and that type of intentional space, safe space to actually hear. 00:18:08.880 --> 00:18:18.480 And then I'll have a knowing of a vision, so it's not an actual vision, it's like I know that I see this. 00:18:19.599 --> 00:18:32.480 So um, I'm a very knowing-oriented person when it comes to my deepest truth um and my relationship with God. 00:18:33.440 --> 00:18:35.519 Everyone's a little different. 00:18:37.759 --> 00:18:40.000 That's that's what it's like for me. 00:18:41.920 --> 00:18:42.880 So what is that? 00:18:43.200 --> 00:18:47.759 Can you, and I know Kylie, you were at the retreat, I wasn't, um, but can you expand? 00:18:47.920 --> 00:19:04.400 So learning your knowings, that's just in what I'm getting, gathering from what you just described is is almost quieting the brain enough to the point where you are receiving information from a divine place. 00:19:05.039 --> 00:19:08.720 Is that kind of what learning your knowings means? 00:19:09.359 --> 00:19:14.400 So that's what it means for me, because my knowing is so quiet. 00:19:14.480 --> 00:19:18.559 And if if I'm not super quiet and still, I might miss it. 00:19:20.559 --> 00:19:29.839 Um, and if I'm not super intentional, um I might miss it, especially if you're a person who has a lot of thoughts. 00:19:30.079 --> 00:19:33.920 It's easy to miss that quiet few words that come through. 00:19:35.119 --> 00:19:42.960 So that's my personal experience of knowing, and not everyone has that same experience. 00:19:43.440 --> 00:20:08.960 Some people have been knowing easily and having visions and feeling things in their body and getting clear messages since they were as long as they can remember, and they don't have that much of a challenge with um the knowing or the receiving the deepest truth, receiving the messages from God, the guidance. 00:20:10.720 --> 00:20:11.519 I love that. 00:20:11.680 --> 00:20:16.799 I love how that's impacted you because I I took a a

lot from that experience too. 00:20:16.960 --> 00:20:24.000 And that's when I when I I used to write in my journal every morning, um, God, I trust you. 00:20:24.160 --> 00:20:37.359 That was my first journal entry for probably a full year when I was really um trying to reprogram my thoughts and dismantle this fear-based thinking. 00:20:38.079 --> 00:20:43.839 And and I would always have to start in the morning before I get into my day. 00:20:44.480 --> 00:21:10.079 And the takeaway that I received after that meditation experience and and intentionally doing it, which you said it's very simple, it's so it's almost so simple that people are like, no, that's not, but it is so profound because I left saying now in my journal, um, God, I trust you are in me. 00:21:11.680 --> 00:21:13.920 That was my biggest takeaway. 00:21:14.240 --> 00:21:38.960 And for me, when I'm intentionally doing this in the morning and having that space where I'm breathing in this um, this golden light, this divine light that is of God breathing it into me and and also dropping into my heart to focus in my heart space, that space of pure compassion, forgiveness, love. 00:21:39.680 --> 00:21:44.640 A lot of times when I'm asking in that space, I don't hear anything. 00:21:45.119 --> 00:21:48.960 Um, that's this is just what I'm experiencing right now. 00:21:49.519 --> 00:21:59.759 But later in the day, because then after I get out of it right before, I bring that awareness, that certainty, that perception that God is in me. 00:22:00.319 --> 00:22:03.519 That I won't miss anything into my day. 00:22:03.680 --> 00:22:07.359 So I breathe it out when I get out of the meditation. 00:22:07.920 --> 00:22:19.839 And so I'm noticing that those questions that I was asking, I'll have moments throughout the day and I will receive sentences, I will receive questions. 00:22:22.240 --> 00:22:27.839 And it is so profound because it's so subtle and it is quiet. 00:22:29.279 --> 00:22:45.440 But I'm noticing that as long as I'm intentional with that space and asking and allowing God to speak to me without me having any certain expectations of what that looks like and when it's gonna happen. 00:22:45.599 --> 00:22:46.960 I I'm open up to it. 00:22:47.119 --> 00:22:49.119 I receive it exactly when I need it. 00:22:49.440 --> 00:22:50.960 Exactly when I need it. 00:23:27.200 --> 00:23:28.880 Yeah, in the present moment. 00:23:30.720 --> 00:23:33.680 I mean, I have a question. 00:23:33.839 --> 00:23:37.359 And Kylie, I believe we did this meditation. 00:23:38.000 --> 00:23:38.240 Yeah. 00:23:38.400 --> 00:23:46.240 But I'm wondering, is there like a shortened version one of you can do really quick just so our listeners can understand what you're talking about? 00:23:46.480 --> 00:23:48.640 Because we don't want to be gatekeepers here. 00:23:48.720 --> 00:23:54.720 We want to share a tiny little condensed version of it. 00:23:55.759 --> 00:23:56.720 So helpful. 00:23:57.359 --> 00:24:05.519 Kylie, I

I did write to um Megan and she gave me permission to share her meditation with my clients and with people. 00:24:05.759 --> 00:24:06.400 Amazing. 00:24:06.799 --> 00:24:10.400 So I would be happy to do that unless you feel called to do it. 00:24:10.720 --> 00:24:13.759 No, I would love to hear from you. 00:24:13.920 --> 00:24:16.559 So that would be wow, this is so fun. 00:24:19.759 --> 00:24:32.240 And by the way, by the way, I was so happy when I was listening to your previous episodes um getting ready for this conversation today. 00:24:32.400 --> 00:24:36.480 And Kylie, you were giving credit all around to all your influences. 00:24:36.640 --> 00:24:38.640 And I think you are too, Julie. 00:24:38.880 --> 00:24:50.240 And I just was like, that just feels so good hearing you guys give um, you know, credit for your influences and all of that. 00:24:50.400 --> 00:24:52.240 It feels so authentic and real. 00:24:53.119 --> 00:24:59.119 Thanks for feeling so it feels so important, like recognizing who has helped us. 00:24:59.279 --> 00:25:06.720 Like we can have mentors that we don't personally have private conversations with, but they're like a mentor, they've helped us so much. 00:25:06.960 --> 00:25:07.680 Yes, yes. 00:25:08.079 --> 00:25:09.279 Yeah, that's such a good point. 00:25:09.359 --> 00:25:11.440 Yeah, for sure. 00:25:12.000 --> 00:25:19.519 Okay, so um I'll just lead you through this the way I've been leading clients through it. 00:25:19.680 --> 00:25:25.519 It may be a little different from how Megan taught it, but that it was definitely inspired by her. 00:25:27.839 --> 00:25:31.599 And it's a cool pretty simple process. 00:25:31.759 --> 00:25:35.759 So just get comfortable wherever you are, if you're sitting, if you're laying down. 00:25:36.799 --> 00:25:49.519 Just be in a position where you're not having to put out a lot of work or effort, and where your body feels like it can just sort of let go into the surfaces that are supporting you. 00:25:52.559 --> 00:26:16.400 And notice the support of those surfaces and how that support is literally coming all the way up from the stabilizing, steady earth below us, through the building or home we're in, through the chair we're on, the couch we're on, or the bed we're on, the floor we're on. 00:26:18.079 --> 00:26:22.799 So just letting your body feel the support that's always there. 00:26:31.359 --> 00:26:39.200 Yeah, now we're just going to know, feel, visualize whatever works for you. 00:26:40.000 --> 00:26:45.519 That there's a golden light surrounding your entire body. 00:26:50.480 --> 00:26:53.920 From head to toe, from front to back. 00:27:13.440 --> 00:27:19.200 And begin saturating all of your cells with this golden honey light. 00:27:33.119 --> 00:27:43.519 And it can come down through all of your cells, all of your organs, all of your tissues, bones, skin, down through your whole body, all the way to your feet. 00:27:54.400 --> 00:28:02.480 And I also like to work with white light and allowing the white light to also surround your entire body. 00:28:07.519 --> 00:28:11.279 Seeing it, feeling it, knowing it. 00:28:14.720 --> 00:28:16.400 However, that is for you. 00:28:20.640 --> 00:28:26.799 And allowing that white light to also come in through the crown of your head and saturate your entire body. 00:28:28.799 --> 00:28:30.319 All the way down to your feet. 00:28:38.400 --> 00:28:51.279 And with our first intentional breath, as we're breathing in a long, slow deep breath, it's as though our whole awareness is dropping down into our heart space. 00:28:58.000 --> 00:29:07.680 A lot of us spend a lot of time in our heads, so for a lot of people this will feel like going down from the head into the heart space. 00:29:16.559 --> 00:29:26.160 And with our second intentional breath, people are just really going to feel our entire heart space just inhabited. 00:29:57.200 --> 00:30:00.000 It can be throughout our whole core of our body. 00:30:02.880 --> 00:30:12.240 So if you don't feel like you've quite gotten it yet, feel free to take as many breaths as you need to just fully inhabit your whole heart space. 00:30:36.000 --> 00:30:43.359 We're going to tune into that part of us that is our soul. 00:30:44.640 --> 00:30:48.960 That part of us that is infinite. 00:30:50.640 --> 00:30:57.279 That part of us that is our connection with God. 00:30:59.119 --> 00:31:02.960 And Megan calls it the eye of the heart. 00:31:04.480 --> 00:31:06.559 I pretty much call it the soul. 00:31:06.960 --> 00:31:10.000 You can call it whatever feels good for you. 00:31:13.039 --> 00:31:22.160 So with our third deep intentional breath feeling into our soul, our essence. 00:31:23.440 --> 00:31:25.279 It's in the heart space. 00:31:41.920 --> 00:31:46.000 Is anything that's true for you right now? 00:31:46.960 --> 00:31:52.480 So if you already have a question, it's important to ask what's true for you. 00:31:54.559 --> 00:32:01.519 And if you don't have a question, you might just ask what do you want me to know today? 00:32:29.519 --> 00:32:32.960 We'll just sit here in this space for about a minute. 00:33:46.319 --> 00:34:06.640 Um if you haven't had any sort of a knowing or vision or an allowing, I invite you to move forward with your day with uh with the understanding that that knowing will come at some point in the next day or two for you. 00:34:11.280 --> 00:34:17.840 And we just ask that that be clear so that we can be aware of when it happens. 00:34:32.239 --> 00:34:44.719 Come back to you, Lou, come back and fully enter your space that you're in, notice some colors around you, notice some textures around you. 00:34:48.960 --> 00:34:50.480 Trees, animals. 00:35:03.199 --> 00:35:03.840 Wow. 00:35:05.440 --> 00:35:07.840 And how was that for everyone? 00:35:08.000 --> 00:35:12.000 If you feel like sharing, if you don't, then please don't. 00:35:17.199 --> 00:35:22.239 Oh wow, that was really, really, really good. 00:35:22.480 --> 00:35:23.679

Really nice. 00:35:24.159 --> 00:35:26.480 It was um calming. 00:35:28.000 --> 00:35:31.760 I don't know how I'm gonna podcast after this. 00:35:34.880 --> 00:35:35.920 What are you feeling? 00:35:36.239 --> 00:35:36.960 What are you feeling? 00:35:37.039 --> 00:35:40.800 Like your brain doesn't want to think right now, or what are you feeling? 00:35:41.679 --> 00:35:52.880 Yeah, I feel as though I'm more centered than I've been in a while. 00:35:55.119 --> 00:36:04.559 I'm more aligned than I've been in a couple days, maybe weeks. 00:36:05.599 --> 00:36:07.679 That was really beautiful. 00:36:08.719 --> 00:36:15.280 The only word that did pop in my head that I will share was truth. 00:36:20.159 --> 00:36:21.360 Just truth. 00:36:21.840 --> 00:36:23.920 So I love that. 00:36:24.800 --> 00:36:25.840 That's beautiful. 00:36:26.000 --> 00:36:27.360 That was beautiful, Amy. 00:36:27.440 --> 00:36:28.239 Thank you so much. 00:36:28.480 --> 00:36:29.119 It really was. 00:36:29.280 --> 00:36:31.039 Thank you for sharing that. 00:36:32.559 --> 00:36:34.159 Thanks for asking me to share it. 00:36:34.320 --> 00:36:39.199 It's been a joy to share it since I learned it and it's done so much for me. 00:36:39.519 --> 00:36:40.079 Wow. 00:36:40.880 --> 00:36:41.679 That was neat. 00:36:41.760 --> 00:36:47.519 I feel like when I opened my eyes because I'm sitting outside and everything was a little more vivid. 00:36:48.880 --> 00:36:52.639 And I just felt so much peace. 00:36:54.719 --> 00:36:59.440 And the word that was coming to me was presence. 00:37:00.000 --> 00:37:01.119 Be present. 00:37:02.960 --> 00:37:03.599 Yeah. 00:37:04.000 --> 00:37:05.920 So I feel really good. 00:37:06.480 --> 00:37:07.199 So thank you. 00:37:07.440 --> 00:37:08.079 I do too. 00:37:08.320 --> 00:37:10.719 Thank you for wonderful, wonderful. 00:37:10.880 --> 00:37:19.280 And I I've been receiving a similar um vision or knowing or symbol for a while now. 00:37:19.360 --> 00:37:22.400 I've been receiving an infinity symbol. 00:37:23.119 --> 00:37:23.440 Cool. 00:37:23.599 --> 00:37:28.079 And it's and I keep feeling like the middle of the infinity symbol is at the heart. 00:37:28.159 --> 00:37:30.480 So it's like infinite heart. 00:37:31.199 --> 00:37:35.599 So that's what that's what I was sitting with during that time. 00:37:36.000 --> 00:37:40.960 And when you're in a group doing these things, the group energy field is special. 00:37:41.280 --> 00:37:55.599 And so uh more different things can be possible depending on um, you know, the people you're with and the the group um experience. 00:37:56.559 --> 00:37:59.599 Yeah, yeah, because that energy is shared. 00:37:59.920 --> 00:38:16.159 Um I you know, on that note that we're talking about the knowing, a lot of times I hear from from people I talk to who sometimes they share, like, oh, I experienced a voice, or I experienced this. 00:38:16.320 --> 00:38:44.079 And then there's oftentimes uh a pullback, and they will share with me

things like, but I, you know, I know that's just me, you know, or I'm just those are just my thoughts, or it's almost like when the divine is reaching out to us through our heart space, through our mind, through our bodies, through our experiences, people don't want to. 00:38:44.400 --> 00:38:58.719 I think maybe it's a fear thing, but so often I hear people say, like, oh, well, that's not real, you know, or that was just my subconscious, or that's just why do we do that? 00:38:58.960 --> 00:39:00.719 Do you have any sense of that? 00:39:00.880 --> 00:39:04.000 Or do you experience that with your clients? 00:39:04.639 --> 00:39:19.599 Um it's almost it's almost like a put down where it's like, no, no, no, I'm not that powerful, I'm not that knowing, I don't have that in me, where it's like, yes, you do. 00:39:20.559 --> 00:39:20.880 Right. 00:39:21.039 --> 00:39:24.559 I don't do you experience that from anyone that you work with? 00:39:25.360 --> 00:39:44.239 Well, um, similar to your topic, you you both um discussed on the ego, um, I feel that um we all have doubt and we all can have you know unworthiness or not believing in ourselves. 00:39:44.559 --> 00:39:53.119 And um those are actually um us, you know, our mind trying to protect us. 00:39:54.079 --> 00:40:00.239 Um so it comes from a place of protection. 00:40:00.800 --> 00:40:23.280 Um and uh we all spend time and energy and effort if we are motivated to to sort of um you know not listen to those voices um as you both so eloquently described in in your previous um discussions on the ego. 00:40:24.800 --> 00:40:25.119 Yeah. 00:40:25.440 --> 00:40:37.679 So I feel like there's two parts, like the nervous system dysregulation can happen, and when nervous system dysregulation is happening, we're not really as present in our body. 00:40:39.440 --> 00:40:53.280 So when we're in the fight or the flight nervous system, there's so many people that are kind of chronically there, and they're in the go, go, go, do, do, do energy or you know, experience. 00:40:53.440 --> 00:40:57.519 Their bodies are just in that fight or flight nervous system. 00:40:58.719 --> 00:41:23.679 And then the other direction our nervous systems go to try to protect us is freeze, and freeze um is more of a lower energy uh state, and you'll hear people saying they're tired, they're in brain fog, they feel depressed, um those types of words, they space out. 00:41:24.079 --> 00:41:30.320 Um that is uh our ways can be ways to describe nervous system freeze. 00:41:30.639 --> 00:41:43.920 So when we're in any of the dysregulated nervous system states, um it's much easier to need thoughts to sort of also protect us. 00:41:44.159 --> 00:42:00.559 Oh, I'm just um, you know, the thoughts you were describing, Julie, there's a sort of protective thoughts to kind of uh help us make some understanding of those dysregulated states in a way. 00:42:01.440 --> 00:42:02.880 Yeah, yeah. 00:42:03.599 --> 00:42:06.800 Could you expand more on that free state? 00:42:06.880 --> 00:42:23.519 Because I know Kylie and I are very interested in what that looks like, feels like, and I think the way that I experience, because obviously you are you're experiencing people who come to you, right? 00:42:23.599 --> 00:42:26.079 And and are ready to get out of that state. 00:42:26.400 --> 00:42:38.480 Whereas oftentimes I think that I interact with people who don't know they're in that freeze state, they are unaware of that. 00:42:38.719 --> 00:42:48.079 And and I think even I'm coming to a point where I'm like, oh, like I've been there before, and and I can maybe see that in other people too. 00:42:48.400 --> 00:42:53.840 But you know, you can't just say, hey, do you know that you're in a freeze state right now? 00:42:55.519 --> 00:42:58.239 So yeah, what does that look like? 00:42:58.400 --> 00:42:59.599 What does that feel like? 00:42:59.760 --> 00:43:03.840 What is how can we understand it more? 00:43:05.280 --> 00:43:06.239 Absolutely. 00:43:06.480 --> 00:43:15.519 Um, so the words I already use to describe it depression, low energy, fatigue, everything feels slower. 00:43:16.159 --> 00:43:27.360 Um so if you imagine water that's frozen, the water you know has qualities of fluidity and things kind of moving. 00:43:27.599 --> 00:43:36.800 And then when your nervous system is in more of a freeze state, it's more like ice and things aren't moving, they feel more stuck, they feel more heavy. 00:43:37.119 --> 00:43:39.840 Some people literally feel cold. 00:43:40.719 --> 00:43:47.679 Um, and so it's like the circulation is not the same in the body. 00:43:48.639 --> 00:43:59.840 Um, and so it freeze can look like so many things, um, and it can be very individual. 00:44:03.599 --> 00:44:19.199 People pleasing is a form of freeze that a lot of people can relate to, either through their own self or their self in the past, or a loved one, or a friend, or a coworker, or a boss, or whatever. 00:44:19.760 --> 00:44:24.639 Almost everyone has experience with, and that's another name for that is fawning. 00:44:24.960 --> 00:44:42.719 So someone whose whole whole a lot of their personality is basically always putting on a smile and um but generally speaking, not as in tune with what are my needs and more in tune with what is your what are their needs. 00:44:42.800 --> 00:44:47.440 So everyone can just be accommodated and we can all just get along. 00:44:50.239 --> 00:44:52.800 Whoa so that could be a freeze day as well. 00:44:53.119 --> 00:44:56.480 Yes, freeze can look a lot of different ways. 00:44:58.159 --> 00:45:03.519 Would you say one of the symptoms of that too is not being able to make decisions? 00:45:05.440 --> 00:45:13.760 Yes, I can't say that every time you're not making a decision, it's nervous system freeze, but that can definitely be a part of nervous system freeze. 00:45:14.000 --> 00:45:14.320 Okay. 00:45:14.559 --> 00:45:14.880 Okay. 00:45:15.199 --> 00:45:16.239 Absolutely. 00:45:16.880

--> 00:45:17.760 Absolutely. 00:45:18.000 --> 00:45:23.199 Yeah, we definitely hear more about the fight or flight and the constant doing. 00:45:23.920 --> 00:45:40.480 But then we experience and I think I was more in the fight or flight um state or my f most of my um teenage adult or early adult state. 00:45:40.719 --> 00:45:54.400 And I think that there's this perception of people in freeze that are that perhaps they're lazy or they're there's something off. 00:45:54.800 --> 00:46:12.960 And so I I really appreciate us talking through this and understanding it from an outside perspective because I I I can't really relate to that from a personal experience, but I know Amy, we've talked that you've experienced this. 00:46:13.679 --> 00:46:22.880 So I'm curious because obviously you're helping people get out of this state or move move more to feeling whole again. 00:46:23.760 --> 00:46:24.880 Absolutely. 00:46:26.000 --> 00:46:38.239 And yeah, just curious about your personal experience, what that feels like in your body, and how would somebody take the first step of getting out of that? 00:46:40.960 --> 00:46:42.079 Absolutely. 00:46:42.320 --> 00:46:52.400 Um so my personal experience, oh, and by the way, Julie, you said something. 00:46:53.840 --> 00:47:01.360 Um or I don't remember um who said it, but we can be in all all the states. 00:47:01.440 --> 00:47:05.119 We can have parts of us, the different layers, different parts. 00:47:05.440 --> 00:47:13.119 So just to add, it's a complex thing, it's not a super easy to understand thing. 00:47:13.280 --> 00:47:24.400 It takes some um some awareness and some education and um experiencing it in your body and all of that. 00:47:24.559 --> 00:47:28.639 So it's not just this, oh, every it's not so cut and dry. 00:47:29.039 --> 00:47:32.159 There can be many layers of freeze. 00:47:32.960 --> 00:47:59.280 Um and literally in client sessions, sometimes the way I know freeze is coming up is um a part of someone's body will literally feel like another material, like plastic or metal or um dirt or something that's not human, flesh. 00:47:59.840 --> 00:48:12.800 And so that's one sign in a session of nervous system freeze showing up, wanting to be noticed, wanting to be felt, wanting to be have space held for it. 00:48:13.599 --> 00:48:27.280 So that is one way, like it does show up a lot in sessions, and another way it shows up in sessions with clients is someone we we create a safe space. 00:48:28.400 --> 00:48:31.360 Um, the their body guides the session. 00:48:31.599 --> 00:48:46.320 So it's a very autonomous feeling where nothing is ever, it's definitely comes from the person, it comes from what their body wants, what their body says yes to, what their body says no to. 00:48:46.480 --> 00:48:55.599 So it's a lot of um coming from their truth, coming from their experience, and very empowering. 00:48:56.400 --> 00:49:02.719 And because of all that safety, things start to happen. 00:49:02.880 --> 00:49:07.199 They start to feel things in their body that maybe they weren't aware of before. 00:49:07.360 --> 00:49:11.119 Well, that's another example of freeze that's starting to thaw. 00:49:11.599 --> 00:49:15.519 Oh, now I'm feeling this ache in my right hip. 00:49:15.760 --> 00:49:20.159 That's an example of, oh, I didn't even know I had an ache in my right hip. 00:49:20.320 --> 00:49:27.840 That's that's that's a very you know clear example of someone becoming aware of freeze through the body. 00:49:30.400 --> 00:49:32.400 Okay, okay, that makes sense. 00:49:32.559 --> 00:49:34.159 Thanks for for sharing that. 00:49:35.599 --> 00:49:49.679 So you mentioned it's for somebody that let's say you're around somebody and you're aware that they are in a kind of that freeze state. 00:49:51.199 --> 00:50:00.719 How would you recommend somebody operate around this person to create kind of a a bubble of love and safety? 00:50:02.480 --> 00:50:03.119 Yeah. 00:50:03.679 --> 00:50:11.039 Um, we everyone has choice and um where it's not our job to change anyone. 00:50:12.159 --> 00:50:18.719 So um exactly like you said, Kylie, just understanding, love, support. 00:50:19.360 --> 00:50:26.800 You can ask a question if a person's open to that, but if they're not, you know, that's their choice. 00:50:27.920 --> 00:50:39.519 Um sometimes people, you know, you you have to feel out each person and the situation, but I would just say come with curiosity about their experience. 00:50:42.320 --> 00:50:53.199 And you know, on that note, for somebody who is stuck and they recognize they're stuck, what is that first step, would you say? 00:50:53.519 --> 00:50:59.679 Granted, they can't come see you in Georgia, even though that would be amazing. 00:51:00.480 --> 00:51:01.119 Yes. 00:51:01.360 --> 00:51:06.960 Um, so luckily, so our nervous systems are wired for co-regulation. 00:51:07.199 --> 00:51:13.280 So our we need other people, we need nature, we need animals. 00:51:13.760 --> 00:51:35.119 So those are all ways and places where we can experience co-regulation, and that just means if your system's a little frozen or stuck or revved up, being with someone else who is um more in a regulated state can have a big impact on your nervous system. 00:51:36.079 --> 00:51:50.239 So um, if that's available to you, that's what I'd recommend to like work with how we're wired, which is co-regulation. 00:51:50.480 --> 00:51:53.039 That's how our nervous systems are wired. 00:51:54.239 --> 00:52:08.719 Um, and sometimes people don't feel for whatever reason that they have that around them at the time, and in that situation, I would just do whatever works for you to feel more present in your body. 00:52:09.039 --> 00:52:18.800 So taking some long deep breaths, um, you know, moving your body, shaking your body. 00:52:18.960 --> 00:52:31.280 Um, because sometimes if you're in a freeze, you just feel like sitting still and doing like the meditation we did earlier might feel spacey

or hard. 00:52:32.079 --> 00:52:37.280 And so in a freeze, you we don't try to force, oh, you have to meditate. 00:52:37.360 --> 00:52:40.719 It's more like, hey, how about a walk outside in the sun? 00:52:41.039 --> 00:52:48.719 Let's get some things flowing, moving, um, and and all that. 00:52:48.960 --> 00:52:54.079 And something you that reminds me of something I wanted to say earlier, too. 00:52:54.400 --> 00:52:58.719 I used to hear God in all kinds of funny ways. 00:52:58.800 --> 00:53:01.519 So I was on this like high maintenance to hear God. 00:53:01.599 --> 00:53:06.079 I was like, okay, I'm gonna run a hot absent salt bath and get in it, and then I'm gonna hear God. 00:53:06.159 --> 00:53:09.360 It's like, well, what if you can't do that today, you know? 00:53:09.599 --> 00:53:15.679 And then um, literally in sessions, I always hear hear God. 00:53:16.079 --> 00:53:22.320 Like, not always, if I'm having a hard day or a hard week, I hear it God bless during sessions. 00:53:23.280 --> 00:53:40.559 Um, but if I'm in a present regulated place, remembering all the structures that help me to support myself and connect with God, then I in sessions hear God more. 00:53:40.639 --> 00:53:46.800 But the thing that's always tripped me up is by the time I have time to write it down, I don't always remember it. 00:53:47.280 --> 00:53:48.400 Right, right. 00:53:50.960 --> 00:53:57.199 And it it makes me think of when you said go outside, go on a walk, move your body. 00:53:57.360 --> 00:54:03.760 If if you don't feel better the first time you do that, that's okay. 00:54:04.559 --> 00:54:05.920 Do it again later. 00:54:06.480 --> 00:54:17.440 Like there have been times where I'm I've meditated and I've I've I tried so hard to meditate, but just like you said, I you know, you ran a hot Epsom salt bath, and you're like, okay, I'm gonna do it. 00:54:17.679 --> 00:54:20.159 And that's been me with meditation sometimes. 00:54:20.239 --> 00:54:24.239 And sometimes I come out of it and I'm like, that was the worst. 00:54:24.400 --> 00:54:27.440 I didn't hear a thing, my thoughts wouldn't stop. 00:54:27.679 --> 00:54:35.519 But it doesn't mean to stop meditating, it doesn't mean to say, oh, you can't meditate, or you can't, you know, this doesn't help you. 00:54:35.679 --> 00:54:38.320 Try again, give it another shot. 00:54:38.639 --> 00:54:41.360 That, but also honor where your body is. 00:54:41.519 --> 00:54:46.400 So for years, I literally could not sit and meditate, like for years. 00:54:47.840 --> 00:54:53.760 And that's why I'm so delighted right now that this meditation is working right now. 00:54:54.559 --> 00:54:59.360 Because for years I had, I said, Well, I'm just a moving meditator. 00:54:59.519 --> 00:55:06.480 I meditate while I'm moving, I meditate while I'm walking, I meditate while I'm in a hot bath. 00:55:06.639 --> 00:55:07.760 I you know what I mean? 00:55:08.000 --> 00:55:11.599 And I just accepted that about the way my body works. 00:55:11.760 --> 00:55:14.400 So that's what I would recommend everyone do. 00:55:14.639 --> 00:55:19.599 What your body needs is what your body needs, and honor that. 00:55:19.760 --> 00:55:24.320 And if you don't know what your body needs, maybe get a somatic session. 00:55:24.400 --> 00:55:30.320 And I do online sessions as well, if anyone feels resonant with um with that. 00:55:30.800 --> 00:55:38.880 But there's um uh there's also other ways to find local practitioners as well. 00:55:39.039 --> 00:55:48.159 Uh, somatic um work has become more well known, at least in my land, but I I'm in that bubble. 00:55:48.239 --> 00:56:09.440 So maybe it's not as well known to everyone, but um, you know, there's also like my my depth and foundation training that I finally found in 2020 is called alchemical alignment, and they have a find a practitioner um place on their website. 00:56:09.920 --> 00:56:15.920 It's not super like there might not be one near you, but there might be. 00:56:16.159 --> 00:56:17.920 So that's another way. 00:56:18.079 --> 00:56:39.760 And the reason I'm mentioning this is that co-regulation part uh of a safe practitioner can can sort of help you um find relief, find what you're looking for, maybe faster if you're if you're feeling like you're just not able to get there on your own. 00:56:39.920 --> 00:56:40.880 That's okay. 00:56:41.039 --> 00:56:45.280 That's part of how our nervous system works. 00:56:45.599 --> 00:56:52.320 And we are wired for support and co-regulation, so there's nothing wrong with getting the help you need. 00:56:53.599 --> 00:56:54.559 Thank you for that. 00:56:55.039 --> 00:56:56.480 You're welcome. 00:56:57.760 --> 00:57:00.480 I do have one last question for you, Amy. 00:57:00.719 --> 00:57:06.960 Okay, because um we we talked about this offline about three circles. 00:57:08.239 --> 00:57:09.599 Does that ring a bell? 00:57:09.920 --> 00:57:11.599 Three circles, yeah. 00:57:11.840 --> 00:57:18.639 The I think like the three circles of of people um in that space. 00:57:19.360 --> 00:57:20.159 Okay, okay, cool. 00:57:20.559 --> 00:57:21.760 I know what you're talking about. 00:57:22.000 --> 00:57:33.119 Yeah, and and Julie and I have been talking about it offline, just like so curious of that concept and what you can um share with us if if you're open to it. 00:57:33.519 --> 00:57:34.719 Absolutely. 00:57:34.960 --> 00:57:41.199 Um, so this is something I wish I had been taught when I was in grade school. 00:57:42.320 --> 00:58:07.039 And a lot of us, um, at least I can't really speak for everyone, but I grew up in the 70s and 80s, and a lot of us in the 70s and 80s as kids um had a roof, had food, had you know, a lot of people went to church on Sunday, that type of thing, at least in where I grew up in Georgia. 00:58:07.360 --> 00:58:14.480 Um, but not a lot of us had emotional or inner world parenting. 00:58:18.480 --> 00:58:27.119 So um Kylie, remind me why I'm telling you this right now.

00:58:27.440 --> 00:58:29.920 Well, it was just something that you mentioned. 00:58:30.400 --> 00:58:31.360 Oh, the inner okay. 00:58:31.519 --> 00:58:32.079 Yep, yep. 00:58:32.960 --> 00:58:47.360 Um, so the like definitely um as I've learned how to take better care of myself, the somatic worker do, it's really like reparenting ourselves on some on some levels. 00:58:48.239 --> 00:59:14.960 Um, and get and re and filling in the gaps of what we needed that we didn't get, and um becoming present enough, regulated enough in a in a rest and digest nervous system enough to be able to start giving that to the younger frozen parts of ourselves that needed to freeze for protection. 00:59:16.480 --> 00:59:20.320 Um, and that was wise that we froze for protection. 00:59:20.480 --> 00:59:28.079 It was wisdom because we would have been overwhelmed otherwise, and we didn't have the skills or the tools to deal with it at the time. 00:59:28.239 --> 00:59:31.360 So our body was kind enough to store it for us. 00:59:32.159 --> 00:59:46.079 And so as I have been teaching myself, parenting myself, it's the concept I think you're talking about is the outer circle, middle circle, and inner circle. 00:59:46.639 --> 01:00:00.239 Um, I've um learned over time to this is sort of a part of having good healthy boundaries for yourself, specifically in your relationships. 01:00:00.800 --> 01:00:06.320 And that you can have a lot of different types of people in your life. 01:00:06.639 --> 01:00:10.719 But for me, I've been learning how to discern what circle they belong in. 01:00:10.800 --> 01:00:35.599 Do they belong in the outer circle where it's more they don't I don't really open my heart necessarily in those relationships or invite them into my heart space because I haven't learned from either I don't know them well enough or some, you know, somewhere along the way I learned that that's not a person that I trust with my heart space. 01:00:36.800 --> 01:00:39.039 I didn't used to have a process for that. 01:00:39.119 --> 01:00:41.440 I used to just be more wide open. 01:00:43.519 --> 01:01:07.679 I didn't realize there was really a process that can be put in place to help um sort of the protection that's stored inside of our bodies to help it be on the outside, to help it be give our bodies a break from all the work so that we can make choices, discern where people belong, how close, how far back. 01:01:07.920 --> 01:01:12.639 And it's not it's an internal process, it's not something you have to share with anyone. 01:01:12.800 --> 01:01:17.519 Um, but it's something I wish I had been taught from a very young age. 01:01:17.760 --> 01:01:20.960 I can imagine, wow, wouldn't that have been amazing? 01:01:21.440 --> 01:01:25.519 And it also gives, it also comes from a whole different viewpoint. 01:01:25.679 --> 01:01:33.280 I am worthy of deciding who belongs where, and I take care of me, right? 01:01:34.559 --> 01:01:43.440 So it's a very, it's like a boundary uh type of exercise in your relationships. 01:01:43.679 --> 01:01:45.039 Does that help? 01:01:46.239 --> 01:01:47.840 Oh, yes, yeah. 01:01:48.079 --> 01:01:50.159 And I think go ahead, Julie, sorry. 01:01:50.320 --> 01:02:08.880 Well, well, talking just about your nervous system, how and co-regulation, there's probably uh what would be the opposite of co-regulation, co-disregulation with with people who might dysregulate you and understanding that you can have boundaries. 01:02:09.119 --> 01:02:12.079 I am a recovering people pleaser. 01:02:12.400 --> 01:02:25.679 And when you so often attach your joy and your happiness to other people and their joy and their happiness, and how can I make you happy so in turn that I can be happy? 01:02:25.920 --> 01:02:35.039 There is never going to be a point where um, you know, you find that space of, oh, I finally did enough. 01:02:35.360 --> 01:02:39.599 I finally did what you wanted me to do, and so now I can be happy. 01:02:39.840 --> 01:02:41.920 That's a slippery slope. 01:02:42.159 --> 01:02:54.880 And to know that we are so worthy, and our heart is so precious to us, and our creator sees us as so divine and so perfect in so many ways. 01:02:54.960 --> 01:03:13.119 Like, and we have the ability to say, you know, I I see you, you're a part of my life, but you don't have to be a part of my my heart and my my inner inner peace that I have because you dysregulate me, you know, and you don't have to say that to people. 01:03:13.280 --> 01:03:26.800 What I'm kind of gathering for you from saying it to yourself, yes, it's more about discerning it for yourself and taking care of yourself, then maybe later you might feel differently. 01:03:27.039 --> 01:03:36.960 Um, you might have a stronger center and not be as impacted by that person, or maybe not, you know. 01:03:37.280 --> 01:03:48.239 But for me, there's certain non-negotiables, like, oh, if somebody isn't really on a path of like kindness, then I don't really want them in my heart space. 01:03:48.400 --> 01:04:00.880 If somebody isn't really on a path of generally seeking the truth, I don't really want them in my heart space, my inner circle. 01:04:01.440 --> 01:04:15.679 And I found my inner circle's gotten kind of small, but I'm still I'm interested in the process um of trusting that it's okay to have that space. 01:04:16.559 --> 01:04:42.320 And you know, I've actually noticed um I'm getting close to new friends, so there's a flow happening and then there's changes happening, and I've also noticed that some of the new friends that don't have as much space to have a new person in their inner circle because they're busy um playing all the roles. 01:04:42.639 --> 01:04:46.000 Um, and uh, you know, so it's interesting. 01:04:46.159 --> 01:05:08.079 I feel like um I'm in the unknown with some of this, but I also feel like I wouldn't have it any other way because it feels honest and true and authentic to where I'm at, and then my the space is kind of open, and and it it just reminds me I'm gonna pray for um a little help with that. 01:05:12.239 --> 01:05:13.679 That's perfect. 01:05:14.159 --> 01:05:21.519 Well, Amy, this was so amazing, and thank you so much for sharing and and adding that meditation. 01:05:21.679 --> 01:05:25.039 That was I needed that, so thank you. 01:05:25.599 --> 01:05:33.280 How can our listeners get connected with you if they do find resonance in in your work and what you're you're doing? 01:05:33.679 --> 01:05:35.599 Oh, they can go to my website. 01:05:35.760 --> 01:05:42.960 Um are you at uh soulpathwellness.com, S-O-U-L-P-A-T-H wellness.com. 01:05:43.280 --> 01:05:43.760 Perfect. 01:05:44.000 --> 01:06:07.599 And um sometime uh by the time this podcast is being listened to, there'll be a free offer on my website as a good place to start with a free resource for ways that you know you're disconnected from yourself and a few what um where to start, a few things to start with if that's resonating for you. 01:06:07.760 --> 01:06:12.960 So I um go you can head over and look for that right away. 01:06:13.360 --> 01:06:20.000 And um I appreciate being connected to anyone that wants to reach out. 01:06:21.360 --> 01:06:22.239 Amazing. 01:06:22.880 --> 01:06:24.239 Amazing, what a gift. 01:06:24.400 --> 01:06:25.760 Thank you so much, Amy. 01:06:26.159 --> 01:06:26.880 Thank you both. 01:06:27.039 --> 01:06:29.920 I'm so amazing in so many ways. 01:06:30.239 --> 01:06:31.840 Oh thank you. 01:06:32.079 --> 01:06:39.920 Thank you so much for this amazing, uh present, authentic space of connection. 01:06:40.880 --> 01:06:43.199 It's it's just beautiful. 01:06:44.719 --> 01:06:54.639 It's a journey, it's a journey, and we're learning as we go, and we're letting you know spirit guide us step by step, following those breadcrumbs one day at a time. 01:06:54.800 --> 01:06:58.000 And it's been it's been so fun and so energizing. 01:06:58.239 --> 01:06:59.519 So thank you again. 01:07:00.639 --> 01:07:01.840 I feel that. 01:07:03.280 --> 01:07:04.159 You're welcome. 01:07:04.320 --> 01:07:04.880 Thank you. 01:07:05.199 --> 01:07:05.679 Thank you. 01:07:05.840 --> 01:07:12.480 Well, we um thank you so much for listening, and we look forward to the next conversation.