The Kitchen Sponge의 전체 녹취록

get it. 33 00:02:21,000 --> 00:02:23,320 Promoting from within feels right. 34 00:02:23,320 --> 00:02:24,920 You want to reward loyalty. 35 00:02:24,920 --> 00:02:27,040 You want to believe in people's potential. 36 00:02:27,040 --> 00:02:31,320 And honestly, it's often easier than going through the whole hiring process to find external 37 00:02:31,320 --> 00:02:32,800 leadership. 38 00:02:32,800 --> 00:02:36,520 But here's what I've learned in 14 years of working with business owners. 39 00:02:36,520 --> 00:02:41,360 There's a massive difference between wanting someone to be a leader and them actually having 40 00:02:41,360 --> 00:02:44,880 the DNA to lead effectively. 41 00:02:44,880 --> 00:02:49,600 Let me pull back the curtain and tell you what happened with my clients, $350,000 promotion 42 00:02:49,600 --> 00:02:51,400 mistake. 43 00:02:51,400 --> 00:02:56,520 Earlier this week, I was on an exit interview call with an employee leaving their team. 44 00:02:56,520 --> 00:03:00,160 By the end of our conversation, four things were crystal clear. 45 00:03:00,160 --> 00:03:04,680 He was an A-player stuck in a worker B-roll. 46 00:03:04,680 --> 00:03:06,440 He wasn't set up for success. 47 00:03:06,440 --> 00:03:10,120 He tried for 18 months to make it work. 48 00:03:10,120 --> 00:03:14,600 And his manager was 95% of the reason he was leaving. 49 00:03:14,600 --> 00:03:18,080 His exit wasn't about money, benefits, or workload. 50 00:03:18,080 --> 00:03:23,200 This guy was leaving because he was a player stuck under a worker B-manager that was killing 51 00:03:23,200 --> 00:03:27,920 his soul one micro-managed project at a time. 52 00:03:27,920 --> 00:03:31,720 Let me pause your first second in case you're new to the podcast and do not know about my 53 00:03:31,720 --> 00:03:35,200 philosophy on players versus worker bees. 54 00:03:35,200 --> 00:03:40,360 Let me explain the critical difference because once you know this, it will change everything 55 00:03:40,360 --> 00:03:45,000 about how you manage your team and how you look at who's on your team. 56 00:03:45,000 --> 00:03:47,640 So players create profits. 57 00:03:47,640 --> 00:03:49,160 Players are expenses. 58 00:03:49,160 --> 00:03:51,160 A player comes with a plan. 59 00:03:51,160 --> 00:03:54,360 They're the people who get the big picture, the greater vision. 60 00:03:54,360 --> 00:03:58,080 And you say, "I have a goal," and they say, "Great, I have a plan." 61 00:03:58,080 --> 00:04:03,720 They're proactive, they run with you, and it's so much fun because they're even starting 62 00:04:03,720 --> 00:04:06,880 to anticipate things before you even think of it. 63 00:04:06,880 --> 00:04:09,960 I love it because they're the expert coming to you. 64 00:04:09,960 --> 00:04:17,560 Instead of on the other side, when you have a worker B, you're often thinking, "Switch 65 00:04:17,560 --> 00:04:23,640 Jesus, if I have to tell you what to do one more time, I might just walk out the door." 66 00:04:23,640 --> 00:04:28,160 Most worker bees struggle with critical thinking or thinking outside of task lists. 67 00:04:28,160 --> 00:04:34,120 They get stuck in the details, and they do work best with tasks instead of projects. 68 00:04:34,120 --> 00:04:39,320 They also tend to not be self-motivated, so you end up doing two people's jobs, yours, 69 00:04:39,320 --> 00:04:42,160 and then thinking of things for them to do. 70 00:04:42,160 --> 00:04:46,000 And when I see self-motivated, yes, a lot of them are hard workers. 71 00:04:46,000 --> 00:04:47,000 That's not what I'm saying. 72 00:04:47,000 --> 00:04:52,520 When I see self-motivated, it's about looking for other things to do outside of what you've 73 00:04:52,520 --> 00:04:53,520 been given to do. 74 00:04:53,520 --> 00:04:55,720 I'll give you a great example. 75 00:04:55,720 --> 00:05:00,960 Many years ago, I came in and I did a diagnostic in a financial services firm. 76 00:05:00,960 --> 00:05:10,080 And as I was interviewing the team, I asked one of the employees, "Hey, when so and so has 77 00:05:10,080 --> 00:05:15,280 not given you stuff to do, and you've completed your to-do list, tell me what you do with your 78 00:05:15,280 --> 00:05:16,280 time." 79 00:05:16,280 --> 00:05:18,160 And she said, "Bless her heart." 80 00:05:18,160 --> 00:05:24,080 Oh, you know, I go on Facebook and Instagram, and I'm working on my real estate license, so 81 00:05:24,080 --> 00:05:26,560 I go and I do some modules for that. 82 00:05:26,560 --> 00:05:27,560 Bless. 83 00:05:27,560 --> 00:05:31,760 I mean, on one hand, I love that I'm the kind of person that people tell their deepest, 84 00:05:31,760 --> 00:05:36,640 darkest secrets, too, but on the other hand, you're kidding me. 85 00:05:36,640 --> 00:05:41,280 Instead of thinking of things that you could get ahead of, or other projects or tasks to 86 00:05:41,280 --> 00:05:47,180 do, this person was screwing around on social media and doing something completely unrelated 87 00:05:47,180 --> 00:05:48,680 to her job. 88 00:05:48,680 --> 00:05:52,080 This perfectly illustrates a worker bee. 89 00:05:52,080 --> 00:05:55,320 Now it might seem like I'm hating on worker bees, but I'm really not. 90 00:05:55,320 --> 00:06:00,600 I love worker bees, but here's the thing that I want you to take away from this. 91 00:06:00,600 --> 00:06:08,480 Workers are necessary on teams, but only if here's the key, you have players managing them. 92 00:06:08,480 --> 00:06:14,240 You, as the business owner, should never be managing a worker bee. 93 00:06:14,240 --> 00:06:15,640 So back to my client. 94 00:06:15,640 --> 00:06:17,320 One exactly happened here. 95 00:06:17,320 --> 00:06:21,240 Well, long story short, they put a worker bee in charge of a player. 96 00:06:21,240 --> 00:06:26,080 To put it bluntly, they committed organizational suicide. 97 00:06:26,080 --> 00:06:31,360 The cost over 18 months with just this one departing player was $350,000. 98 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00:06:36,920 But if you multiply that across team morale, productivity loss, frustration, other people 99 00:06:36,920 --> 00:06:41,280 who are now questioning whether they want to stay, you're looking at the kind of damage 100 00:06:41,280 --> 00:06:44,160 that could take years to recover from. 101 00:06:44,160 --> 00:06:49,320 And the worst part, my client had promoted this person's manager, hoping that they'd step 102 00:06:49,320 --> 00:06:50,760 up and grow into the role. 103 00:06:50,760 --> 00:06:52,880 Have you ever done that? 104 00:06:52,880 --> 00:06:54,360 I know I have. 105 00:06:54,360 --> 00:06:58,720 That was until I figured out how to promote the right way and then everything changed, 106 00:06:58,720 --> 00:07:02,280 which is what I'm talking about with you today. 107 00:07:02,280 --> 00:07:05,720 Let me go back to that exit interview I mentioned before. 108 00:07:05,720 --> 00:07:09,280 This wasn't about pay, workload, or even the leadership culture at the top. 109 00:07:09,280 --> 00:07:13,840 The reason this player was leaving came down to a few catastrophic leadership failures of 110 00:07:13,840 --> 00:07:15,400 his manager. 111 00:07:15,400 --> 00:07:20,560 Lack of trust from his manager, feedback that ever came, concerns that went unaddressed, 112 00:07:20,560 --> 00:07:25,600 promises that quickly disappeared, and a manager who stifled growth instead of developing 113 00:07:25,600 --> 00:07:26,600 a leader. 114 00:07:26,600 --> 00:07:32,520 But here's the one thing that truly broke the dam, the Cardinal Sin. 115 00:07:32,520 --> 00:07:38,840 The manager delegated a project to him, told him he could lead it, and then took it back. 116 00:07:38,840 --> 00:07:41,160 Never actually letting him lead it. 117 00:07:41,160 --> 00:07:46,960 And it didn't just happen once, it happened over and over and over again. 118 00:07:46,960 --> 00:07:50,700 So when I asked this person, he was leaving on a scale of one to ten, how well were your 119 00:07:50,700 --> 00:07:52,000 strengths utilized? 120 00:07:52,000 --> 00:07:53,720 His answer was a two. 121 00:07:53,720 --> 00:07:55,640 A two. 122 00:07:55,640 --> 00:08:00,240 That's not just a miss, that's a red flag waving in neon lights. 123 00:08:00,240 --> 00:08:04,840 This kind of Indian giving behavior kills motivation faster than anything. 124 00:08:04,840 --> 00:08:10,320 This manager's micromanagement conflicting messages about ownership and completely opposite 125 00:08:10,320 --> 00:08:15,440 personality style created the perfect storm for disengagement. 126 00:08:15,440 --> 00:08:17,120 Here's the expensive reality. 127 00:08:17,120 --> 00:08:21,400 My client had a manager that they wanted to succeed, but the truth was this person was 128 00:08:21,400 --> 00:08:26,080 not cutting it, and leadership was abdicating their responsibility as a leader. 129 00:08:26,080 --> 00:08:28,680 They kept hoping this manager would step up. 130 00:08:28,680 --> 00:08:32,520 They heard the employee's concerns, but didn't actually step in to address the issue with 131 00:08:32,520 --> 00:08:33,520 the manager. 132 00:08:33,520 --> 00:08:41,480 They ostriched for 18 months, hoping things would improve, and then the dam broke. 133 00:08:41,480 --> 00:08:44,240 This is what I call leadership abdication. 134 00:08:44,240 --> 00:08:49,080 When we as business owners avoid making the hard decision about who can actually lead, 135 00:08:49,080 --> 00:08:53,200 so we either promote the wrong person or keep waiting for someone to become something 136 00:08:53,200 --> 00:08:54,360 they're not. 137 00:08:54,360 --> 00:08:55,360 And the cost? 138 00:08:55,360 --> 00:08:58,040 It's not just theoretical as you saw. 139 00:08:58,040 --> 00:09:01,200 This one was a doozy. 140 00:09:01,200 --> 00:09:05,600 At $350,000, with just one employee. 141 00:09:05,600 --> 00:09:09,640 Multiply that across your team, and you start to see why getting leadership right is an 142 00:09:09,640 --> 00:09:10,960 optional. 143 00:09:10,960 --> 00:09:14,840 With that in mind, let's talk about who you need to stop promoting. 144 00:09:14,840 --> 00:09:18,760 It's possible I'm going to step on some toes here, but someone needs to say this. 145 00:09:18,760 --> 00:09:24,400 First, the golden child, your top performer, your star salesperson who crushes quotas, 146 00:09:24,400 --> 00:09:28,480 your tech genius who knows the system inside and out, here's the painful truth. 147 00:09:28,480 --> 00:09:32,720 The skills that make someone excellent at doing the work as an individual contributor 148 00:09:32,720 --> 00:09:36,960 are completely different from the skills needed to lead people who do the work. 149 00:09:36,960 --> 00:09:42,240 I've watched super stars become mediocre managers and lose both their individual contribution 150 00:09:42,240 --> 00:09:44,520 and their leadership effectiveness. 151 00:09:44,520 --> 00:09:48,840 And oftentimes your stars burn out and leave because they never should have been promoted 152 00:09:48,840 --> 00:09:51,360 in the first place. 153 00:09:51,360 --> 00:09:56,080 It's the lifer, the person who's been there for, well, forever. 154 00:09:56,080 --> 00:10:00,840 Ten-year equals institutional knowledge, not necessarily leadership DNA. 155 00:10:00,840 --> 00:10:04,840 Just because someone knows where all the bodies are buried doesn't mean they can lead the 156 00:10:04,840 --> 00:10:05,840 living. 157 00:10:05,840 --> 00:10:10,920 I've seen companies promote tenure veterans who still manage like it's 2015, driving away 158 00:10:10,920 --> 00:10:15,360 a younger talent who feels stifled or in the case of one of my other clients, promoting 159 00:10:15,360 --> 00:10:19,200 a lifer who actually really didn't like people. 160 00:10:19,200 --> 00:10:20,920 That was a doozy. 161 00:10:20,920 --> 00:10:21,920 The Peacekeeper. 162 00:10:21,920 --> 00:10:26,640 Everyone's favorite person who never creates waves. 163 00:10:26,640 -->

00:10:32,520 Here's the thing, leadership requires making unpopular decisions and having difficult conversations. 164 00:10:32,520 --> 00:10:35,160 And frankly, it's uncomfortable. 165 00:10:35,160 --> 00:10:39,840 Peacekeeper's avoid conflict, which means problems fester and standard slip while your players 166 00:10:39,840 --> 00:10:43,880 get frustrated watching media accuracy get rewarded. 167 00:10:43,880 --> 00:10:47,080 The expert, your technical genius. 168 00:10:47,080 --> 00:10:49,720 Management isn't about being the smartest person in the room. 169 00:10:49,720 --> 00:10:52,760 It's about developing other people to be smart. 170 00:10:52,760 --> 00:10:57,280 These folks often get frustrated when their teams can't perform at their level and end up 171 00:10:57,280 --> 00:11:01,520 micromanaging or doing the work themselves because their ego can't take it. 172 00:11:01,520 --> 00:11:08,200 Hello, this is definitely the persona of my client that I am talking about in this episode. 173 00:11:08,200 --> 00:11:09,840 The climber. 174 00:11:09,840 --> 00:11:16,200 The person who wants it most because they want the title and the quote unquote respect. 175 00:11:16,200 --> 00:11:18,240 Ambition doesn't equal leadership DNA. 176 00:11:18,240 --> 00:11:22,320 Some people want management for the wrong reasons, the title, the money, the status. 177 00:11:22,320 --> 00:11:26,960 But if they don't have the natural ability to understand, coach, influence others and 178 00:11:26,960 --> 00:11:32,480 develop people, all that ambition turns into frustration for everyone. 179 00:11:32,480 --> 00:11:35,960 Now before we dive into the next section, here's an important caveat. 180 00:11:35,960 --> 00:11:40,360 I'm in no way saying that you should promote your mediocre performers or not promote 181 00:11:40,360 --> 00:11:41,880 someone who is a high performer. 182 00:11:41,880 --> 00:11:43,680 That is not what I'm saying. 183 00:11:43,680 --> 00:11:49,480 I'm saying that you get to promote performance and DNA. 184 00:11:49,480 --> 00:11:54,200 Now that you know the five risky profiles, let's talk about what real leadership DNA actually 185 00:11:54,200 --> 00:11:57,520 looks like because it's not what most people think. 186 00:11:57,520 --> 00:12:02,080 Real leadership DNA comes down to two core elements that you can't teach or fake. 187 00:12:02,080 --> 00:12:07,680 First, they understand that the number one job of a leader is to create other leaders, not 188 00:12:07,680 --> 00:12:12,160 manage people, not delegate tasks, create other leaders. 189 00:12:12,160 --> 00:12:16,520 That means they're actively developing critical fingers and problem solvers, not just telling 190 00:12:16,520 --> 00:12:18,240 people what to do. 191 00:12:18,240 --> 00:12:22,800 They get energized by watching someone on their team figure something out for themselves 192 00:12:22,800 --> 00:12:26,480 rather than needing to be the person with all the answers. 193 00:12:26,480 --> 00:12:31,320 Second, they have to be a world class people decoder. 194 00:12:31,320 --> 00:12:35,760 They're genuinely skilled at understanding what makes each person tick, what drives them, 195 00:12:35,760 --> 00:12:40,160 what their unique motivations are, and how to pull the best out of them. 196 00:12:40,160 --> 00:12:43,040 They don't just care about people in some generic way. 197 00:12:43,040 --> 00:12:48,320 They're curious about each individual and driven by empowering their team. 198 00:12:48,320 --> 00:12:52,280 In addition to the above, here is a simple test to gauge if someone should be promoted or 199 00:12:52,280 --> 00:12:53,280 not. 200 00:12:53,280 --> 00:12:59,800 Before I promote anyone, I ask them three specific questions and they have to answer yes to all three, 201 00:12:59,800 --> 00:13:01,400 otherwise I'm a no. 202 00:13:01,400 --> 00:13:05,920 First, do you know what you need to do to be successful in your role? 203 00:13:05,920 --> 00:13:10,120 Second, do you know what someone else needs to do to be successful in their role? 204 00:13:10,120 --> 00:13:16,160 Third, do you feel comfortable telling someone else what to do to be successful in their 205 00:13:16,160 --> 00:13:17,680 role? 206 00:13:17,680 --> 00:13:21,920 The reason why I love these questions is it tells you a lot about someone and the clarity 207 00:13:21,920 --> 00:13:26,840 necessary to not only succeed in their role but as a leader. 208 00:13:26,840 --> 00:13:29,200 The harsh truth bears repeating. 209 00:13:29,200 --> 00:13:31,960 Being a leader and a manager is uncomfortable. 210 00:13:31,960 --> 00:13:34,880 It takes finesse, mentorship, coaching, and empowering. 211 00:13:34,880 --> 00:13:41,960 It's about creating leaders and critical thinkers and problem solvers, not just managing people. 212 00:13:41,960 --> 00:13:46,320 And they have to want to do this uncomfortable work. 213 00:13:46,320 --> 00:13:51,280 So ask them directly, do you want to be responsible for somebody else's career development? 214 00:13:51,280 --> 00:13:54,680 Do you want to have difficult conversations about performance? 215 00:13:54,680 --> 00:13:59,000 Do you get excited about helping someone else succeed even when it means they might outgrow 216 00:13:59,000 --> 00:14:00,960 their current role? 217 00:14:00,960 --> 00:14:01,960 Dig deep with them. 218 00:14:01,960 --> 00:14:06,560 They need desire, performance, and DNA because without it all the leadership training in the 219 00:14:06,560 --> 00:14:10,560 world won't make them someone they aren't. 220 00:14:10,560 --> 00:14:12,560 One more quick caveat. 221 00:14:12,560 --> 00:14:17,160 Confidence and becoming a better, more effective leader can be taught and improved. 222 00:14:17,160 --> 00:14:22,320 But you just cannot change someone's DNA, which is why my contrarian hiring practice 223 00:14:22,320 --> 00:14:26,560 hires through DNA, not just resume experience. 224 00:14:26,560 --> 00:14:30,320 With my client, if we

go all the way back to the beginning of this episode, no matter 225 00:14:30,320 --> 00:14:34,840 how much training coaching, etc. came from the top, it just didn't land. 226 00:14:34,840 --> 00:14:37,480 Some people just aren't meant to lead, and that's okay. 227 00:14:37,480 --> 00:14:41,840 But you and the business owner and leader have to recognize who is or isn't meant to be 228 00:14:41,840 --> 00:14:42,840 a leader. 229 00:14:42,840 --> 00:14:47,360 And if you accidentally promoted someone that shouldn't be promoted, saying, "Okay, let's 230 00:14:47,360 --> 00:14:48,360 shift. 231 00:14:48,360 --> 00:14:51,480 Here's the thing, everything is figure outable. 232 00:14:51,480 --> 00:14:55,760 And at any moment, if you need to shift, you can, and in this case, you must." 233 00:14:55,760 --> 00:14:58,440 I'll give you another great example. 234 00:14:58,440 --> 00:15:02,040 One of my clients, we were having a challenge with the team, and of course you know me. 235 00:15:02,040 --> 00:15:06,240 I always go back to the root cause, and what was the common denominator? 236 00:15:06,240 --> 00:15:09,200 And in this case, it also came back to a manager. 237 00:15:09,200 --> 00:15:11,400 Are you seeing a trend here? 238 00:15:11,400 --> 00:15:15,480 Now in this situation, there was some pretty tumultuous conflicts happening in the team. 239 00:15:15,480 --> 00:15:21,000 And it all came to a head in a pretty spectacular way that almost cost us this very valuable 240 00:15:21,000 --> 00:15:22,600 employee. 241 00:15:22,600 --> 00:15:26,400 When the business owner and I sat down and did a post-mortem of how the heck did we get 242 00:15:26,400 --> 00:15:31,600 here, what was really interesting is it came down to one of the employees who is an absolute 243 00:15:31,600 --> 00:15:34,840 stellar, amazing employee. 244 00:15:34,840 --> 00:15:40,000 And she had come to her manager, this manager in question, countless times about her concerns 245 00:15:40,000 --> 00:15:43,560 with another employee who happened to be her direct report. 246 00:15:43,560 --> 00:15:48,360 She was looking for advice, support, and it just wasn't getting dealt with. 247 00:15:48,360 --> 00:15:50,360 It wasn't getting escalated. 248 00:15:50,360 --> 00:15:53,720 It was for all intents and purposes getting swept under the rug and falling on deaf 249 00:15:53,720 --> 00:15:54,720 ears. 250 00:15:54,720 --> 00:15:59,120 So when we are doing their reorg for the next chapter of growth for this business, I asked 251 00:15:59,120 --> 00:16:03,960 my client the really tough question of, what is the cost of having this person continue 252 00:16:03,960 --> 00:16:05,880 to manage people? 253 00:16:05,880 --> 00:16:09,920 He wanted to have the title that showed his tenure and contribution, and we wanted to 254 00:16:09,920 --> 00:16:14,920 honor that, but we just couldn't have him continue to lead people. 255 00:16:14,920 --> 00:16:19,200 This particular person is invaluable to the business, far more effective as an individual 256 00:16:19,200 --> 00:16:24,000 contributor, and he would be a heck of a lot happier if he was not managing people. 257 00:16:24,000 --> 00:16:28,720 It would be a win-win, and yet my client was really concerned about how he would take it, 258 00:16:28,720 --> 00:16:33,320 which is why I think a lot of business owners don't have these tough conversations. 259 00:16:33,320 --> 00:16:35,400 It makes everyone uncomfortable. 260 00:16:35,400 --> 00:16:37,840 But that's the thing about being a leader. 261 00:16:37,840 --> 00:16:42,640 Sometimes it really sucks to have those hard conversations, but if you address it as a 262 00:16:42,640 --> 00:16:44,600 win-win, trust me. 263 00:16:44,600 --> 00:16:47,400 Everybody is going to breathe a sigh of relief. 264 00:16:47,400 --> 00:16:50,240 Okay, back to the meat and potatoes. 265 00:16:50,240 --> 00:16:51,320 Thanks for sticking with me. 266 00:16:51,320 --> 00:16:55,480 This next part is for you if you've already made one of these promotion mistakes, and now 267 00:16:55,480 --> 00:16:59,040 need to figure out how to get out of the sticky situation. 268 00:16:59,040 --> 00:17:03,200 First and foremost, if you've promoted the wrong person, if you're not, you're not the only 269 00:17:03,200 --> 00:17:04,200 one. 270 00:17:04,200 --> 00:17:05,200 I've done it in the past. 271 00:17:05,200 --> 00:17:06,280 My clients have done it. 272 00:17:06,280 --> 00:17:08,280 I feel like it's actually a right of passage. 273 00:17:08,280 --> 00:17:12,400 So if you're feeling guilty about a recent promotion that isn't working out or you're lying 274 00:17:12,400 --> 00:17:16,440 awake, wondering if you just ruined someone's career by putting them in a role they can't 275 00:17:16,440 --> 00:17:18,440 handle, I get it. 276 00:17:18,440 --> 00:17:19,760 Here's how to fix it. 277 00:17:19,760 --> 00:17:21,520 The first step is to acknowledge it. 278 00:17:21,520 --> 00:17:26,280 I think sometimes as human beings we think that if we just ignore something it will go away. 279 00:17:26,280 --> 00:17:30,320 I can tell you after 14 years of doing this, that is never true. 280 00:17:30,320 --> 00:17:34,200 It will come back and bite you in the ass faster than you realize. 281 00:17:34,200 --> 00:17:38,360 I always say that sunlight is the best disinfectant, so acknowledge it. 282 00:17:38,360 --> 00:17:43,320 Go through your team and ask yourself the question of, is this person an effective leader? 283 00:17:43,320 --> 00:17:47,040 Do I want this person to continue being a manager and a leader? 284 00:17:47,040 --> 00:17:51,720 Make really clear on if you have set them up for successor failure. 285 00:17:51,720 --> 00:17:54,240 And if they're really meant to lead and manage. 286 00:17:54,240 --> 00:17:59,920 Ask the questions I talked about a bit earlier and get clear on who might be a victim of misguided 287 00:17:59,920 --> 00:18:00,920 promotion. 288 00:18:00,920 --> 00:18:05,480

Hopefully it's only one or two people that have popped in mind that we need to address. 289 00:18:05,480 --> 00:18:09,480 Then once you know who you need to talk to, you get to steal yourself and have that hard 290 00:18:09,480 --> 00:18:10,800 conversation. 291 00:18:10,800 --> 00:18:12,600 I'm not going to sugarcoat this. 292 00:18:12,600 --> 00:18:15,120 This is the part that sucks the most. 293 00:18:15,120 --> 00:18:19,280 I saw it happen four times with one of my fractional COO clients a few weeks after they brought me 294 00:18:19,280 --> 00:18:20,280 on board. 295 00:18:20,280 --> 00:18:24,460 When I came in and did my signature diagnostic to uncover the root causes of what had 296 00:18:24,460 --> 00:18:28,960 stalled growth and was plaguing retention, I started asking questions about different 297 00:18:28,960 --> 00:18:34,760 team members and managers, really digging in and asking the question of, why did this person 298 00:18:34,760 --> 00:18:35,760 get promoted? 299 00:18:35,760 --> 00:18:41,480 The answers I got were a lot of, well, we just needed somebody or they wanted it or something 300 00:18:41,480 --> 00:18:43,000 like that. 301 00:18:43,000 --> 00:18:46,240 Just my advice, this client did what I do not recommend. 302 00:18:46,240 --> 00:18:49,920 They demoted the people without a conversation, which sucks. 303 00:18:49,920 --> 00:18:53,600 So much because demoted people rarely stay. 304 00:18:53,600 --> 00:18:57,440 So instead of having a knee-jerk, oh shit moment, I encourage you to really look at your 305 00:18:57,440 --> 00:19:01,280 people and ask how valuable is this person that you promoted? 306 00:19:01,280 --> 00:19:02,960 That probably shouldn't have been promoted. 307 00:19:02,960 --> 00:19:08,560 If the answer is very valuable, which I hope it is, then say with them and say, hey, I 308 00:19:08,560 --> 00:19:11,240 think we promoted you into leadership and management. 309 00:19:11,240 --> 00:19:15,400 And this might not actually be setting you up for success or what you want. 310 00:19:15,400 --> 00:19:18,080 So I want to have an honest conversation. 311 00:19:18,080 --> 00:19:22,600 What would a win-win look like to you and would you be okay going back to being an individual 312 00:19:22,600 --> 00:19:24,080 contributor? 313 00:19:24,080 --> 00:19:28,360 You can phrase it a little bit differently because it's not necessarily if they want to stay 314 00:19:28,360 --> 00:19:29,720 but giving them an out. 315 00:19:29,720 --> 00:19:32,800 The truth is you can't keep somebody who's an ineffective manager. 316 00:19:32,800 --> 00:19:33,800 You just can't. 317 00:19:33,800 --> 00:19:39,760 But in my experience, people who are truly valuable, who you value and want to stay will find 318 00:19:39,760 --> 00:19:42,960 a way to make it work and the shift seamless. 319 00:19:42,960 --> 00:19:47,040 There might be ripple effects or whispers, but we all have short memories and as long as 320 00:19:47,040 --> 00:19:52,320 you as the leader manage the change with transparency and respect, it's a win-win. 321 00:19:52,320 --> 00:19:56,640 I'm going to start to wrap this up by illustrating how having these tough conversations also 322 00:19:56,640 --> 00:20:00,920 staves off the silent killer of teams, resentment. 323 00:20:00,920 --> 00:20:05,800 You know my favorite saying is unshared expectations are nothing more than pre-meditated 324 00:20:05,800 --> 00:20:06,800 resentments. 325 00:20:06,800 --> 00:20:11,240 So let's take a little walk down memory lane as I tell you one last story of a client who 326 00:20:11,240 --> 00:20:18,560 was bleeding $150,000 a month as a result of promoting someone who should not have been 327 00:20:18,560 --> 00:20:19,560 promoted. 328 00:20:19,560 --> 00:20:21,200 This was a couple of years ago. 329 00:20:21,200 --> 00:20:25,920 I came into a $70 million business and did my diagnostic, sat down with the team and was 330 00:20:25,920 --> 00:20:30,560 asking one of the department heads about his day to day and how he got there. 331 00:20:30,560 --> 00:20:33,400 He shared that when he got promoted, it was unexpected. 332 00:20:33,400 --> 00:20:35,080 He kind of just ended up there. 333 00:20:35,080 --> 00:20:38,440 And he felt like he was failing every day. 334 00:20:38,440 --> 00:20:42,060 And he also felt like he wasn't getting any support, like they just dropped him in the 335 00:20:42,060 --> 00:20:45,200 deep end and hoped he could swim. 336 00:20:45,200 --> 00:20:47,880 His team was also really not doing well. 337 00:20:47,880 --> 00:20:54,800 He was not doing well and the department was bleeding $150,000 a month. 338 00:20:54,800 --> 00:20:59,360 So finally, through the course of this conversation, I got to the crux of it. 339 00:20:59,360 --> 00:21:03,800 He was resentful of everyone in leadership for putting him in this position even though 340 00:21:03,800 --> 00:21:07,840 he confessed he did want the position. 341 00:21:07,840 --> 00:21:10,720 He did want the promotion. 342 00:21:10,720 --> 00:21:12,240 He was pissed. 343 00:21:12,240 --> 00:21:15,160 And rightfully so, he got promoted without support. 344 00:21:15,160 --> 00:21:19,360 And so he got what he wanted, but it was nothing like what he imagined and he was feeling 345 00:21:19,360 --> 00:21:23,440 like he wasn't supported and he was mad. 346 00:21:23,440 --> 00:21:27,440 Now I don't often have a true hard line of someone needing to be let go unless they are 347 00:21:27,440 --> 00:21:29,320 infected by resentment. 348 00:21:29,320 --> 00:21:35,640 This is the one symptom that I will immediately fire someone for because it's very, very hard 349 00:21:35,640 --> 00:21:41,280 to come back from and it infects the team faster than Pink Eye at preschool. 350 00:21:41,280 --> 00:21:46,720 So when my client and I did a postmortem and I did their R&R, their results in recommendation, 351 00:21:46,720 --> 00:21:52,520 we realized that this person's bad management, an ill-fated

promotion costs the business 352 00:21:52,520 --> 00:21:58,880 of whopping $2 million total in 10 team members. 353 00:21:58,880 --> 00:22:05,400 The crazy thing is that this business was overperforming so much in another department that the internal 354 00:22:05,400 --> 00:22:10,200 bleeding of this department wasn't actually caught until I came in with fresh eyes. 355 00:22:10,200 --> 00:22:14,120 More to that, his manager never spoke up about his resentment. 356 00:22:14,120 --> 00:22:20,480 In fact, he told me when I asked why he didn't bring any of this up to anyone beside me, 357 00:22:20,480 --> 00:22:24,560 he said he "just wanted to figure it out on his own." 358 00:22:24,560 --> 00:22:26,720 So there's a lot to unpack there. 359 00:22:26,720 --> 00:22:28,480 I won't go into it. 360 00:22:28,480 --> 00:22:32,560 But he was essentially resentful, he didn't have support yet didn't speak up. 361 00:22:32,560 --> 00:22:37,720 Oh yeah, why do we want to be business owners? 362 00:22:37,720 --> 00:22:41,920 So I tell you this story because I want you to know that it can have into anyone. 363 00:22:41,920 --> 00:22:44,280 Big, small, doesn't matter. 364 00:22:44,280 --> 00:22:47,440 We've all been there, but now you know better. 365 00:22:47,440 --> 00:22:51,320 You as the business owner need to proactively plan your team growth and promotion. 366 00:22:51,320 --> 00:22:55,880 It is so important to get clear on who is or isn't in the right seat, who is or isn't 367 00:22:55,880 --> 00:22:59,800 the best leader or manager, and to have the conversation. 368 00:22:59,800 --> 00:23:05,840 It's uncomfortable, but the pain of having the tough conversation is way better than the 369 00:23:05,840 --> 00:23:13,920 pain of regret and resentment, not to mention the literal and figurative costs. 370 00:23:13,920 --> 00:23:17,360 The other thing I want you to do that I've talked about in previous episodes is you need 371 00:23:17,360 --> 00:23:19,200 to have dual promotion tracks. 372 00:23:19,200 --> 00:23:23,320 One for individual contributors who can continue to grow, have more accountability, more 373 00:23:23,320 --> 00:23:28,560 responsibilities, and more success without leadership or management responsibilities. 374 00:23:28,560 --> 00:23:31,560 And then you create another path for leadership in management. 375 00:23:31,560 --> 00:23:36,640 Trust me, this will solve so many problems because most people want growth and recognition. 376 00:23:36,640 --> 00:23:40,680 They don't want to be stagnant, but you have to understand what kind of growth they want 377 00:23:40,680 --> 00:23:43,440 and set them up for success. 378 00:23:43,440 --> 00:23:47,520 Last but not least, going forward, I really want to encourage you to take a beat, take 379 00:23:47,520 --> 00:23:52,880 a breath, and start proactively promoting and hiring because it will change everything. 380 00:23:52,880 --> 00:23:57,080 Most business owners and in fact most of my clients come to me and

aren't doing promotion 381 00:23:57,080 --> 00:23:59,400 or headcount planning proactively. 382 00:23:59,400 --> 00:24:06,920 It's all "I need somebody yesterday" and that is a recipe for mishires, misaligned expectations, 383 00:24:06,920 --> 00:24:12,520 which you know leads to resentment, and simply put not having the best people you need. 384 00:24:12,520 --> 00:24:17,160 Now in case you, like me, still worry about how this will impact your team or owl, here's 385 00:24:17,160 --> 00:24:19,400 something else nobody really talks about. 386 00:24:19,400 --> 00:24:22,880 It isn't cruel to not make someone a manager or a leader. 387 00:24:22,880 --> 00:24:27,240 The person you don't promote to leadership, they get to stay in their zone of genius instead 388 00:24:27,240 --> 00:24:30,240 of struggling in a role that makes them miserable. 389 00:24:30,240 --> 00:24:34,680 Your team gets actual leadership instead of someone flailing around and you stop bleeding 390 00:24:34,680 --> 00:24:35,680 money and talent. 391 00:24:35,680 --> 00:24:40,000 Now I don't know about you, but I say that's a win, win, win. 392 00:24:40,000 --> 00:24:42,080 Good people sometimes aren't good leaders. 393 00:24:42,080 --> 00:24:45,480 It's not a character flaw, that's clarity. 394 00:24:45,480 --> 00:24:49,880 Your job is to recognize the difference and make decisions accordingly. 395 00:24:49,880 --> 00:24:52,720 Your leadership starts now, not next week. 396 00:24:52,720 --> 00:24:56,640 Give yourself permission to step in and make changes when leadership isn't working. 397 00:24:56,640 --> 00:24:58,960 Look at your recent promotions, are they working? 398 00:24:58,960 --> 00:25:00,520 Like really working? 399 00:25:00,520 --> 00:25:04,800 If you've even a hint of doubt, schedule that conversation this week. 400 00:25:04,800 --> 00:25:07,680 Create those parallel advancement paths I mentioned. 401 00:25:07,680 --> 00:25:12,560 Stop making leadership or managing people the only way to advance or get recognition. 402 00:25:12,560 --> 00:25:16,080 And if you're considering promoting someone right now, ask yourself, do they have the 403 00:25:16,080 --> 00:25:22,040 performance, willingness, DNA, and do they have the genuine want to develop and manage 404 00:25:22,040 --> 00:25:23,040 people? 405 00:25:23,040 --> 00:25:27,480 If the answer is no, find another way to promote and recognize them that doesn't put your 406 00:25:27,480 --> 00:25:30,200 team's success at risk. 407 00:25:30,200 --> 00:25:34,320 Your people are watching to see if you'll make decisions based on what feels good or what 408 00:25:34,320 --> 00:25:35,960 actually matters. 409 00:25:35,960 --> 00:25:40,560 Or to put it more bluntly, promoting the right people instead of the loudest voices. 410 00:25:40,560 --> 00:25:44,600 You're watching to see if you'll prioritize their success over your discomfort with difficult 411 00:25:44,600 --> 00:25:46,280 conversations. 412 00:25:46,280 --> 00:25:50,000 Choose wisely, your business, and your sanity depend on it. 413 00:25:50,000 --> 00:25:53,560 If this conversation hits home for you, please share it with other business owners who 414 00:25:53,560 --> 00:25:55,600 might be struggling with the same thing. 415 00:25:55,600 --> 00:25:59,520 We've all been there, and sometimes just knowing you're not alone and wrestling with these 416 00:25:59,520 --> 00:26:03,120 messy bits of business makes all the difference. 417 00:26:03,120 --> 00:26:08,200 Find me on Instagram @itsLaurenGoldstein, or on LinkedIn if you want to continue the conversation. 418 00:26:08,200 --> 00:26:11,640 I love hearing how these changes play out in your business. 419 00:26:11,640 --> 00:26:16,520 Remember, not everyone is meant to be a leader and recognizing that isn't mean. 420 00:26:16,520 --> 00:26:20,120 It's the kindest thing you can do for everyone involved. 421 00:26:20,120 --> 00:26:22,360 I'll be waiting for you in the next episode. 422 00:26:22,360 --> 00:26:22,760 See you there! 423 00:26:22,760 --> 00:26:39,480 [music] 424 00:26:39,480 --> 00:26:42,400 Thank you for listening to The Biz Doctor Podcast. 425 00:26:42,400 --> 00:26:46,880 Now I like to say that friends don't let friends WebMD your business, so if you're wondering 426 00:26:46,880 --> 00:26:51,320 what your next steps could be, here are some options for you. 427 00:26:51,320 --> 00:26:56,200 No matter what, head to the show notes or to my website, goldenkeypartnership.com, for some 428 00:26:56,200 --> 00:27:00,080 impactful resources to support you getting out from under your business. 429 00:27:00,080 --> 00:27:04,400 That's also where you'll find the links to learn more about our services and how we support 430 00:27:04,400 --> 00:27:09,960 business owners, just like you, who are ready to make the successful jump from business operator 431 00:27:09,960 --> 00:27:15,760 in the trenches to visionary business owner with more freedom and flexibility. 432 00:27:15,760 --> 00:27:20,520 All of that info is on our website, so pop on over to learn more or get in touch: 433 00:27:20,520 --> 00:27:22,520 www.goldenkeypartnership.com. 434 00:27:22,520 --> 00:27:27,560 Finally, if you love The Biz Doctor Podcast, I'd be so grateful if you would share it with 435 00:27:27,560 --> 00:27:31,960 your friends and network and give us a five star rating or review wherever you listen 436 00:27:31,960 --> 00:27:32,960 to your podcast. 437 00:27:32,960 --> 00:27:49,440 [music] 438 00:27:49,440 --> 00:27:51,440 From Story Studio Network. 439 00:27:51,440 --> 00:27:52,900