What is The Difference Between Bitcoin and Trump Coin?의 전체 녹취록

There are also companies that help you do that. 25 00:02:15,820 --> 00:02:18,460 You know, Unchained Capital does it. 26 00:02:18,840 --> 00:02:22,300 I think OnRamp and there are a few others that are all very good at it. 27 00:02:22,300 --> 00:02:32,600 And so, you know, for people who aren't technically savvy or don't trust themselves to store their own seed words, there are services that will help you provide that and they'll take care of it. 28 00:02:32,640 --> 00:02:36,100 So I think this is a solvable problem, but it is a real problem. 29 00:02:36,220 --> 00:02:41,960 I mean, as anyone who's familiar with Bitcoin knows, if you lose the keys, if you lose your private keys, the money's gone. 30 00:02:42,420 --> 00:02:43,500 There's no do-over. 31 00:02:43,640 --> 00:02:44,700 There's no Federal Reserve. 32 00:02:44,880 --> 00:02:46,320 There's no FDIC. 33 00:02:46,720 --> 00:02:47,880 You know, the money's gone. 34 00:02:47,880 --> 00:02:53,540 And so Bitcoin has to be stored very securely and very safely, and that takes some thought. 35 00:02:54,260 --> 00:02:55,880 But it's not impossible. 36 00:02:56,160 --> 00:02:57,280 I mean, anybody can handle this. 37 00:02:57,340 --> 00:03:01,940 Even if you're not technical, you can get other people to help you handle it, people that you trust. 38 00:03:02,100 --> 00:03:04,280 So that would be my answer to the question. 39 00:03:04,500 --> 00:03:06,120 Self-custody is freedom. 40 00:03:06,780 --> 00:03:08,940 But freedom comes with responsibility. 41 00:03:09,480 --> 00:03:12,360 And that's exactly the gap Swan is trying to close. 42 00:03:12,360 --> 00:03:18,420 With Swan Vault, you get a guided two of three multi-sig setup designed to give you control 43 00:03:18,420 --> 00:03:21,860 of your Bitcoin without having to figure out every piece alone. 44 00:03:22,160 --> 00:03:25,680 You hold the keys, you get expert help setting it up. 45 00:03:25,720 --> 00:03:30,540 Because the goal isn't just to buy Bitcoin, it's to know how you're going to hold it for 46 00:03:30,540 --> 00:03:32,020 the people who come after you. 47 00:03:33,300 --> 00:03:35,060 Swan, Bitcoin, not crypto. 48 00:03:35,880 --> 00:03:37,660 Visit swanbitcoin.com today. 49 00:03:40,320 --> 00:03:41,520 Now, back to the show. 50 00:03:41,1000 --> 00:03:43,580 George, Bob, you want to add to that? 51 00:03:44,100 --> 00:03:47,480 Yeah, this has been a real issue for me, I will tell you right now, 52 00:03:47,520 --> 00:03:50,760 and especially coupled with some of the things we've been discussing. 53 00:03:50,920 --> 00:03:57,820 You know, I'm trying to move myself away from anything that has a counterparty between me and Bitcoin. 54 00:03:57,820 --> 00:04:02,460 And so, you know, my goal in the future is to have more and more Bitcoin in self-custody. 55 00:04:02,840 --> 00:04:07,400 That means in possession and able to move it in peer-to-peer electronic cash. 56 00:04:07,400 --> 00:04:14,100 and the issue, of course, is that there is

an asymmetric risk award for criminals regarding 57 00:04:14,100 --> 00:04:19,560 Bitcoin. It's unusual. You know, I used to be a cop and most criminals are stupid. They're dumb 58 00:04:19,560 --> 00:04:25,560 as rocks. I mean, they're just idiots and they're easy to catch. They're easy, whether it's armed 59 00:04:25,560 --> 00:04:31,700 robberies, whatever. They're just stupid. The problem is that even stupid criminals that have 60 00:04:31,700 --> 00:04:37,200 violence behind them are able to have an asymmetric reward in this case if they're able to get the 61 00:04:37,200 --> 00:04:41,980 12 words. And I'm talking about, of course, in this case, wrench attacks. But the other problem 62 00:04:41,980 --> 00:04:47,1000 is with AI on the scene now, we're seeing social engineering attacks that are becoming much more 63 00:04:47,1000 --> 00:04:52,380 sophisticated. I mean, much more. So you're going to have to, in the future, you're going to have to 64 00:04:52,380 --> 00:04:58,580 reevaluate your security situation. For me, what I've done is I've had to geo-disperse my custody. 65 00:04:58,920 --> 00:05:03,480 And if you're not familiar with that, I'm not going to go into how I've done it, but you can 66 00:05:03,480 --> 00:05:06,180 just go into one of the AI agents and say, hey, how can I 67 00:05:06,180 --> 00:05:22,076 geo disperse safely my Bitcoin wallets and still maintain self custody And then you know I used a trusted friend that I can help that I can call in an emergency and that my family can call in an emergency You know 68 00:05:22,576 --> 00:05:27,316 we all expect to be here forever, but, you know, from someone who's come from a very 69 00:05:27,316 --> 00:05:32,396 violent past at times, I can guarantee you that many friends that I had in the morning went out 70 00:05:32,396 --> 00:05:36,376 and they never came back and they were gone. And I just recently lost a friend that way. 71 00:05:36,376 --> 00:05:42,256 so you need to be prepared for this and you need to make sure that the people that are behind you 72 00:05:42,256 --> 00:05:47,976 your loved ones can answer the questions of how do i get to that bitcoin how can i recover that 73 00:05:47,976 --> 00:05:55,636 i'll just add i think you guys covered it well that um the like the unchained on-ramp type 74 00:05:55,636 --> 00:06:01,196 organization especially if you're building a bigger stack you've got a bigger stack you'd 75 00:06:01,196 --> 00:06:05,796 probably seriously consider them because they implement what are called multi-sig solutions, 76 00:06:06,476 --> 00:06:11,816 which means that they're actually in like, for instance, in the case of Unchained, three sets 77 00:06:11,816 --> 00:06:20,636 of keys and you need two of the three to move. And they hold one. So they can't take your Bitcoin 78 00:06:20,636 --> 00:06:26,216 because they only hold one of three and you hold one and you either or you could hold both, but you 79 00:06:26,216 --> 00:06:30,396 could put them

in two different locations or as George has, you know, have a trusted friend or 80 00:06:30,396 --> 00:06:36,856 family member that maybe holds it. Um, that's what I, I do a lot of this. Um, a lot of the 81 00:06:36,856 --> 00:06:43,576 Bitcoin hold for myself and for my companies is done in these multi-sigs and, um, the, all three 82 00:06:43,576 --> 00:06:49,056 keys are in three different States across the country. Like they're, they're geographically 83 00:06:49,056 --> 00:06:54,696 dispersed. So whether there's a natural disaster, like the Palisades fires or a tsunami or, you 84 00:06:54,696 --> 00:07:03,156 know whatever um or a wrench attack um or a death like like you can insulate yourself from those so 85 00:07:03,156 --> 00:07:10,256 i think as you're starting out um you know try try self-custody in the traditional manner get 86 00:07:10,256 --> 00:07:17,456 yourself a trezor you know something like that and use those products and then later on um if you 87 00:07:17,456 --> 00:07:21,796 get a bigger stack maybe a bitcoin plus or something like that now start thinking about 88 00:07:21,796 --> 00:07:23,516 having a multi-sig solution. 89 00:07:24,016 --> 00:07:25,096 Okay, thank you. 90 00:07:25,176 --> 00:07:26,156 That was both good answers. 91 00:07:26,516 --> 00:07:27,316 Next question. 92 00:07:28,036 --> 00:07:29,956 Can the government take or freeze my Bitcoin? 93 00:07:31,316 --> 00:07:33,076 And related question prior to this was, 94 00:07:33,196 --> 00:07:34,856 can the government stop Bitcoin? 95 00:07:35,516 --> 00:07:37,716 There was a time when the government actions, 96 00:07:37,936 --> 00:07:40,816 you know, were perhaps a threat to stopping Bitcoin 97 00:07:40,816 --> 00:07:42,836 if they shut down all the exchanges 98 00:07:42,836 --> 00:07:43,956 or taxed the hell out of it. 99 00:07:43,996 --> 00:07:45,776 I think that given what we've seen 100 00:07:45,776 --> 00:07:46,816 with the Trump administration, 101 00:07:47,376 --> 00:07:48,976 you know, the Clarity Act, et cetera, 102 00:07:49,496 --> 00:07:51,256 Genius Act, Clarity Act's not passed yet, 103 00:07:51,256 --> 00:07:52,916 but it's hopefully on the way to being passed. 104 00:07:53,836 --> 00:07:55,616 The government is not going to stop Bitcoin. 105 00:07:55,736 --> 00:07:56,556 They've embraced it. 106 00:07:56,716 --> 00:07:58,276 Big organizations have embraced it 107 00:07:58,276 --> 00:07:59,396 like Fidelity and BlackRock. 108 00:07:59,536 --> 00:08:01,076 I mean, they're not going to stop it. 109 00:08:01,156 --> 00:08:02,716 But can the government take it 110 00:08:02,716 --> 00:08:03,916 is a legitimate question. 111 00:08:04,236 --> 00:08:05,176 And the answer is yes. 112 00:08:05,716 --> 00:08:08,496 And I say that because we have a historical precedent. 113 00:08:08,956 --> 00:08:12,656 In 1933, when they were doing a monetary reset 114 00:08:12,656 --> 00:08:14,456 and we had the Great Depression, 115 00:08:14,956 --> 00:08:17,536 you know, deflation was killing the economy. 116 00:08:18,576 --> 00:08:20,656 President Roosevelt at that point in time said, 117 00:08:20,736 --> 00:08:21,176 you know what? 118 00:08:21,256 --> 00:08:26,236 we've got a problem with this gold standard. We need to grab all the gold. And so he issued 119 00:08:26,236 --> 00:08:32,176 Executive Order 6102, and he confiscated all the citizens' gold. So, you know, now that was a long 120 00:08:32,176 --> 00:08:38,076 time ago, and no one's, and amazingly, rather amazingly, the Supreme Court upheld that, which 121 00:08:38,076 --> 00:08:44,836 was just a travesty, but they did. And because, I guess, you know, he viewed, you know, deflation 122 00:08:44,836 --> 00:08:48,836 as an existential threat to the country, and therefore he was justified in taking this action. 123 00:08:48,836 --> 00:08:56,476 um you know um a blue administration in the future that thinks that sound money and gold 124 00:08:56,476 --> 00:09:01,656 and silver and bitcoin are destroying their beautiful keynesian system um and recognizes 125 00:09:01,656 --> 00:09:06,496 that the monetary system is falling apart and the dollar is failing uh could reach the same 126 00:09:06,496 --> 00:09:11,176 conclusion and say it's those damn bitcoiners and gold guys that have done it we got to confiscate 127 00:09:11,176 --> 00:09:18,096 all that stuff um and uh and they could you know i mean if you have your coins at fidelity or 128 00:09:18,096 --> 00:09:23,556 BlackRock or Strike or any other, you know, licensed U.S. financial institution and the 129 00:09:23,556 --> 00:09:27,856 government, the FBI calls up and says, please tell us who all your customers are and what all 130 00:09:27,856 --> 00:09:32,876 their Bitcoin is and send all that Bitcoin to us and give them cash dollars in exchange for it. 131 00:09:32,916 --> 00:09:35,616 We're not going to steal it. We're going to pay them in today's dollars. Of course, 132 00:09:35,656 --> 00:09:39,876 the dollars are about to depreciate rapidly. They would have your Bitcoin and you would have 133 00:09:39,876 --> 00:09:45,676 dollars at the last set price. So the answer is yes, they can take it. However, if you have 134 00:09:45,676 --> 00:09:51,196 self-custody. This is the reason for self-custody and self-sovereignty. If you have decided to take 135 00:09:51,196 --> 00:09:58,876 possession of your Bitcoin through a treasure, a hardware cold wallet, and you have your key 136 00:09:58,876 --> 00:10:05,996 phrase, your 12 words or 24 words, absent holding a gun to your head and telling you to give them 137 00:10:05,996 --> 00:10:10,476 the words or they're going to kill you, and of course you can always claim you lost the words, 138 00:10:10,536 --> 00:10:14,376 the government cannot get your Bitcoin. They cannot take it. There's no way they can crack it. 139 00:10:14,376 --> 00:10:17,156 you have those coins. 140 00:10:17,676 --> 00:10:19,396 And in that respect, 141 00:10:19,396 --> 00:10:36,093 it

even better than gold because you know your gold in your house and they show up with guns and they search your house they want to take the gold they can um but here they don get those words they don get those coins so the answer is um if you properly protected the answer is no um odds on a 142 00:10:36,093 --> 00:10:41,833 you know um uh 6102 like event occurring probably pretty low certainly with this administration 143 00:10:41,833 --> 00:10:49,273 but in a failing government with you know a liberal administration and a bunch of keynesians 144 00:10:49,273 --> 00:10:52,193 who are on the warpath, I mean, the odds aren't zero. 145 00:10:53,333 --> 00:10:57,473 So I, and I know amongst my friends and peers and investors, 146 00:10:57,473 --> 00:11:00,173 I've been, you know, pleasantly surprised 147 00:11:00,173 --> 00:11:03,793 to see everybody saying, hey, you know, I've got this ETF, 148 00:11:04,093 --> 00:11:07,713 but maybe I need to have some of this in cold storage in case. 149 00:11:09,713 --> 00:11:11,353 So the trend is in that direction. 150 00:11:11,433 --> 00:11:12,613 I think it's intelligently so. 151 00:11:12,713 --> 00:11:14,793 You just, you want to be prepared for all contingencies. 152 00:11:14,993 --> 00:11:16,673 So that's how I see it. 153 00:11:16,713 --> 00:11:17,673 What do you guys think? 154 00:11:17,713 --> 00:11:18,293 What do you think, George? 155 00:11:18,293 --> 00:11:38,713 Well, I don't know who sent in this question, but it's just a great question. I love it. And plus, it goes hand in hand with some of our discussion. You know, two people that are holding Bitcoin in cold storage with their own wallet connected to like, say, let's say a Sparrow wallet connected to a hardware device with connection to each other cannot be stopped. That's the beauty of Bitcoin. It's powerful. 156 00:11:39,373 --> 00:11:46,913 But quite frankly, anything, any counterparty that stands between you and that scenario that I just painted out, you could be stopped. 157 00:11:46,913 --> 00:11:52,453 And, you know, I love the fact that you brought up that discussion about gold and sailors' comments. 158 00:11:52,593 --> 00:11:54,533 I remember that was about a year and a half ago. 159 00:11:54,593 --> 00:12:02,713 And I thought it was really poorly thought out on his part because his whole argument was that the government would not do this because Bitcoin was not being used as money. 160 00:12:03,033 --> 00:12:04,533 I mean, very poorly thought out. 161 00:12:04,833 --> 00:12:06,333 First off, you can't predict the future. 162 00:12:06,333 --> 00:12:12,153 And as you mentioned already, what if some administration comes in that is very much anti-Bitcoin? 163 00:12:12,313 --> 00:12:17,453 And right now, Bitcoin is very closely aligned to one political party, perhaps one person, in fact. 164 00:12:17,973 --> 00:12:21,573 And now you have tremendous pushback going forward in this country. 165 00:12:22,093 --> 00:12:23,313 It would be very easy. 166 00:12:23,413 --> 00:12:25,813 It's incredibly easy to seize Bitcoin. 167 00:12:26,513 --> 00:12:30,393 If you have a counterparty between you and your custody, it's easy. 168 00:12:30,573 --> 00:12:34,673 Even in the fact that if you're using a multisig and it's with a third party, 169 00:12:34,673 --> 00:12:40,033 If that third party is contacted by the government and they say, hey, George is a bad actor, you will freeze his account. 170 00:12:40,113 --> 00:12:40,533 They will. 171 00:12:40,933 --> 00:12:45,413 They're not going to violate the U.S. government, the Fed, either the Treasury, well, the Treasury Department. 172 00:12:46,113 --> 00:12:47,593 They're not going to violate that. 173 00:12:48,193 --> 00:12:49,733 So it is a risk. 174 00:12:49,993 --> 00:12:58,373 And to protect yourself in this uncertain future, if we're in a fourth turning and, you know, the shit's going to hit the fan, then you need to be prepared for it. 175 00:12:58,433 --> 00:13:01,013 And one of the things you need to do is to be in self-custody. 176 00:13:01,013 --> 00:13:05,993 have a hardware wallet, have a, you know, something that you can interact on your own node 177 00:13:05,993 --> 00:13:11,053 and be able to transact. And here's the other thing. The last thing I'll say before I turn 178 00:13:11,053 --> 00:13:16,713 this over to Bob is, you know, what, what ultimate freedom is that? As Larry mentioned, 179 00:13:16,793 --> 00:13:21,033 people will come into your house. It's easy to seize gold. It's not difficult. Gold is physical. 180 00:13:21,033 --> 00:13:24,793 It doesn't move quickly. You know, try to get across the border with gold. You're going to be 181 00:13:24,793 --> 00:13:30,413 sticking them up your ass. You can't get across the border easily with gold. You can with Bitcoin. 182 00:13:30,413 --> 00:13:36,893 You can throw that hardware wallet in the garbage, smash it up, burn it, memorize 12 words, and you can cross that border. 183 00:13:37,133 --> 00:13:38,173 They can strip search you. 184 00:13:38,253 --> 00:13:39,193 They can do whatever they want. 185 00:13:39,533 --> 00:13:46,793 At the end of it, you know, you've got your money on the other side, and you can just flip them off on the way you go, and it'll be a great day for you. 186 00:13:47,613 --> 00:13:48,133 Bob, what do you think? 187 00:13:48,533 --> 00:13:58,633 Well, what I'll add to that is that the best way to protect your Bitcoin from the government is for them to never know that you even had it. 188 00:13:59,193 --> 00:14:00,093 Well said. 189 00:14:00,413 --> 00:14:08,513 And so there are ways in which you can acquire Bitcoin without anybody knowing it. 190 00:14:08,973 --> 00:14:19,193 The very best way is to mine the Bitcoin yourself and get paid directly from what's called the Coinbase transaction, meaning the Bitcoin network pays you. 191 00:14:19,453 --> 00:14:21,993 Bob keeps his best Bitcoin where nobody's ever seen it. 192 00:14:22,433 --> 00:14:23,653

Paid straight from the network. 193 00:14:23,913 --> 00:14:24,533 Bob's right. 194 00:14:25,673 --> 00:14:26,273 Yeah. 195 00:14:26,633 --> 00:14:27,413 No history. 196 00:14:27,933 --> 00:14:28,733 Nothing to explain. 197 00:14:28,733 --> 00:14:31,513 The ones who live like that, you can usually tell. 198 00:14:31,893 --> 00:14:32,833 They've got the stash. 199 00:14:33,253 --> 00:14:35,113 SAZ Mining makes it one tap. 200 00:14:35,573 --> 00:14:37,793 Your miner, hosted on renewable energy, 201 00:14:38,153 --> 00:14:40,453 paying sats to your own wallet every day. 202 00:14:40,833 --> 00:14:43,473 The Hash Stash, brought to you by SAZ. 203 00:14:43,693 --> 00:14:44,593 Come get yours. 204 00:14:44,953 --> 00:14:47,633 S-A-Z mining.com slash boomers. 205 00:14:49,573 --> 00:14:50,893 Now, back to the show. 206 00:14:51,073 --> 00:14:53,793 Full disclosure, I'm a board member and investor of Ocean, 207 00:14:53,973 --> 00:14:56,593 but that's what the Ocean Pool allows you to do. 208 00:14:56,593 --> 00:15:13,393 So if you follow that path, you can acquire non-KYC Bitcoin. And then if you use the things you guys have already talked about with self-custody, you combine those two things, you're in a great, great position. 209 00:15:13,393 --> 00:15:16,353 that they don't know that you had it. 210 00:15:16,613 --> 00:15:21,973 There's really no history of you that they can trace. 211 00:15:22,193 --> 00:15:25,213 And so I think that that's really the best, 212 00:15:25,673 --> 00:15:26,633 the ultimate way. 213 00:15:26,873 --> 00:15:28,333 Now, there are degrees from there. 214 00:15:28,493 --> 00:15:29,933 Like I'll give you guys an example, 215 00:15:30,053 --> 00:15:30,993 just a little tidbit. 216 00:15:31,493 --> 00:15:48,849 As a miner there is a secondary market for what called version Bitcoin And we can get paid a premium over market spot price from like 1 to 5 by selling Bitcoin that we mined 217 00:15:48,909 --> 00:15:52,509 that we got paid directly from the Coinbase transaction at a premium. 218 00:15:54,009 --> 00:15:55,689 So it's very interesting. 219 00:15:55,889 --> 00:16:01,989 And by the way, what's interesting is that the buyers of that 220 00:16:02,489 --> 00:16:06,869 are often very, very high net worth people 221 00:16:06,869 --> 00:16:08,929 and even family offices. 222 00:16:09,629 --> 00:16:10,949 I'm not doxing anybody, 223 00:16:11,449 --> 00:16:15,669 but it's very interesting 224 00:16:15,669 --> 00:16:19,289 who is buying Bitcoin in that method. 225 00:16:19,649 --> 00:16:21,709 And I'll also say that a lot of my investors, 226 00:16:22,389 --> 00:16:25,089 they like the fact that they get money 227 00:16:25,089 --> 00:16:27,049 that comes directly from the Coinbase 228 00:16:27,049 --> 00:16:31,049 that it obfuscates things much better. 229 00:16:31,549 --> 00:16:33,049 Okay, let's go to the next question. 230 00:16:33,349 --> 00:16:35,369 Will quantum computers break Bitcoin? 231 00:16:35,569 --> 00:16:38,749 This

is a third month running where this has been one of the top questions. 232 00:16:39,229 --> 00:16:43,269 Everything I've read suggests no, not in any realistic time frame. 233 00:16:43,269 --> 00:16:44,729 It's 10 years plus. 234 00:16:45,349 --> 00:16:47,809 They haven't created a stable quantum computer. 235 00:16:48,069 --> 00:16:56,769 The amount of computing power that it would be required to break the cryptography and the hash on Bitcoin is so large right now. 236 00:16:56,769 --> 00:17:04,049 We're not even, you know, 1% or 1 tenth of 1% of the way to having that kind of power in quantum computing. 237 00:17:04,309 --> 00:17:07,109 So it does not represent, in my view, a risk. 238 00:17:07,329 --> 00:17:25,509 And to the degree that in the future it does become a risk, there's been a lot of discussion by the top people in the Bitcoin space about how to, you know, address the existing coins, the existing addresses, and then create a newer version of them, which would be quantum resistant. 239 00:17:25,509 --> 00:17:28,489 and so everyone would migrate to that newer version. 240 00:17:28,749 --> 00:17:30,929 So, you know, one, I don't think it's a threat 241 00:17:30,929 --> 00:17:32,669 in any kind of a reasonable timeframe, 242 00:17:32,909 --> 00:17:34,109 less than 10 years. 243 00:17:34,769 --> 00:17:36,589 And two, it may never become a threat, 244 00:17:36,689 --> 00:17:38,309 but three, if it were to become a threat, 245 00:17:38,629 --> 00:17:39,889 the community will no doubt, 246 00:17:39,989 --> 00:17:41,549 everyone will have such a large incentive 247 00:17:41,549 --> 00:17:45,709 to move to a new quantum resistant cryptography, 248 00:17:45,709 --> 00:17:49,249 you know, scheme that, you know, Bitcoin will live on. 249 00:17:49,349 --> 00:17:51,309 So I just don't worry about it. 250 00:17:51,429 --> 00:17:54,509 To me, it's just, it's fear, uncertainty, and doubt. 251 00:17:54,509 --> 00:17:58,169 but it's out there and people do talk about it. 252 00:17:58,489 --> 00:18:00,349 So Bob, you want to add? 253 00:18:00,489 --> 00:18:01,589 Yeah, I'll just say, 254 00:18:01,929 --> 00:18:05,249 if we were presented with this threat tomorrow, 255 00:18:05,409 --> 00:18:07,249 the answer is no, there is not a threat. 256 00:18:07,689 --> 00:18:08,769 Do not worry about it. 257 00:18:09,229 --> 00:18:15,289 If we found out tomorrow that a quantum threat existed, 258 00:18:15,849 --> 00:18:19,409 the community could respond with a protocol change 259 00:18:19,409 --> 00:18:21,549 almost instantly. 260 00:18:22,289 --> 00:18:24,049 The hard part about it, 261 00:18:24,049 --> 00:18:26,209 and maybe a topic for a different discussion, 262 00:18:26,909 --> 00:18:29,889 is that some of the existing coins, 263 00:18:30,009 --> 00:18:31,929 basically the really old ones, 264 00:18:32,889 --> 00:18:34,289 would be exposed. 265 00:18:35,329 --> 00:18:37,809 And anybody today holding it 266 00:18:37,809 --> 00:18:40,509 outside of Satoshi and

a few really old Gs 267 00:18:40,509 --> 00:18:42,329 has absolutely nothing to worry about, really. 268 00:18:42,849 --> 00:18:44,729 But there's a few people 269 00:18:44,729 --> 00:18:46,589 from a long time ago 270 00:18:46,589 --> 00:18:47,869 that happen to have a lot of Bitcoin. 271 00:18:48,029 --> 00:18:48,889 We have to decide 272 00:18:48,889 --> 00:18:52,689 what is the appropriate method for Bitcoin 273 00:18:54,049 --> 00:18:59,589 handling their coins. And that could be we let the quantum computer take those, 274 00:19:00,349 --> 00:19:09,509 we freeze them, or we limit the rate at which they can be spent or uncovered. But anyway, 275 00:19:09,569 --> 00:19:14,049 it's a long discussion. Nobody here should be worried about this. This is a non-issue. 276 00:19:15,069 --> 00:19:15,149 George? 277 00:19:15,449 --> 00:19:19,809 This is kind of a tumultuous time right now in Bitcoin, and I think that people are 278 00:19:19,809 --> 00:19:26,849 kind of grasping at issues that perhaps spread fear. I'd have to say that some of the people 279 00:19:26,849 --> 00:19:32,729 that initially brought this issue to the forefront through various news organizations had agendas. 280 00:19:32,729 --> 00:19:39,429 I think that some of them were conflicted, and I think that they were attempting to profit off of 281 00:19:39,429 --> 00:19:45,669 the fear and doubt and just the FUD over these issues. So the only thing that I'd say is that 282 00:19:45,669 --> 00:19:50,809 Bob's hit it right on the nail there, you know, the pay to public keys. 283 00:19:50,949 --> 00:19:52,689 Yeah, they're probably at risk, you know. 284 00:19:52,789 --> 00:19:54,609 And for me, I just want to weigh in. 285 00:19:54,689 --> 00:20:00,729 I will say that I'm for confiscation, meaning I don't think we should be moving or doing anything with Satoshi's coins. 286 00:20:00,729 --> 00:20:04,229 You know, if they end up getting stolen, they get stolen. 287 00:20:04,569 --> 00:20:06,569 And that's just my personal viewpoint. 288 00:20:06,929 --> 00:20:10,069 And Satoshi's probably dead and his coins are probably a million coins. 289 00:20:10,169 --> 00:20:14,529 And so if they got stolen and spent, it wouldn't really affect the overall supply. 290 00:20:14,529 --> 00:20:18,669 I mean, to me, there's just not much risk here. 291 00:20:19,089 --> 00:20:19,729 Let's keep moving. 292 00:20:20,609 --> 00:20:22,789 Okay, this is a lengthy question, a little confusing. 293 00:20:22,969 --> 00:20:25,969 Why is Bitcoin crashing when the stock market is fine? 294 00:20:26,529 --> 00:20:28,509 Or verbatim, why is the price down 295 00:20:28,509 --> 00:20:31,049 in close to about half of what it was only four months ago? 296 00:20:31,209 --> 00:20:32,589 It's not four months ago, a little longer than that. 297 00:20:33,169 --> 00:20:35,569 Everyone is asking why Bitcoin is lagging the S&P. 298 00:20:36,509 --> 00:20:38,669 And so the confusion, I think, is surrounding 299 00:20:38,669 --> 00:20:42,149 why does Bitcoin go down when the stock market goes up? 300 00:20:42,149 --> 00:20:44,389 there's a little bit of a, you know, 301 00:20:44,389 --> 00:20:46,889 Bitcoin and gold are a little bit anti-correlated 302 00:20:46,889 --> 00:20:47,949 to the stock market. 303 00:20:47,949 --> 00:20:49,949 I mean, if you believe that the economy is held 304 00:20:49,985 --> 00:20:55,485 and expanding and money is sound, then, you know, in those time frames, gold hasn't done 305 00:20:55,485 --> 00:20:59,045 well, Bitcoin won't do well either because monetary debasement is not the issue. 306 00:20:59,465 --> 00:21:03,025 And stocks tend to grow and their earnings grow. 307 00:21:03,145 --> 00:21:08,545 And so the stock market is in healthy monetary environments with an expanding economy. 308 00:21:09,265 --> 00:21:11,485 Stocks are a better investment than sound money. 309 00:21:12,265 --> 00:21:12,545 Okay. 310 00:21:13,005 --> 00:21:18,505 What we think is going on right now is everyone thinks that that's the case, that, you know, 311 00:21:18,505 --> 00:21:23,585 inflation's under control the economy is going to grow again worse has got it all figured out 312 00:21:23,585 --> 00:21:30,165 and therefore who needs this gold and bitcoin stuff and so they're both down um we as we said 313 00:21:30,165 --> 00:21:35,805 earlier we think that's bullshit and so um and we're just you know we're just taking a break 314 00:21:35,805 --> 00:21:40,545 um particularly in gold i mean gold had an enormous up year last year you know even bitcoin i mean 315 00:21:40,545 --> 00:21:44,965 let's not forget that bitcoin in 2020 only six years ago bitcoin was at ten thousand dollars 316 00:21:44,965 --> 00:21:49,945 it's at 60,000 right now, still 6x in six years. 317 00:21:51,385 --> 00:21:53,865 You know, yeah, okay, it feels bad that it went to 124 318 00:21:53,865 --> 00:21:54,945 and came back to 60, 319 00:21:55,205 --> 00:21:57,545 but let's not lose the longer-term perspective. 320 00:21:58,685 --> 00:22:01,225 You know, and right now stocks are at record highs 321 00:22:01,225 --> 00:22:02,465 because everyone thinks, you know, 322 00:22:02,525 --> 00:22:03,625 good times are going to last. 323 00:22:04,345 --> 00:22:05,045 We'll see. 324 00:22:05,865 --> 00:22:07,145 I kind of see it differently. 325 00:22:07,505 --> 00:22:10,705 So, George, Bob, what would you like to add to that? 326 00:22:11,705 --> 00:22:13,685 I think people are approaching that wrong, 327 00:22:13,685 --> 00:22:14,605 this drawdown. 328 00:22:14,605 --> 00:22:18,605 Why is it happening? I just view this as such a tremendous opportunity. 329 00:22:19,525 --> 00:22:22,905 You know, Bitcoin's not correlated to equities. 330 00:22:23,125 --> 00:22:30,865 I mean, I've never been able to find any correlation to equities S&P 500 that goes past a short-term period. 331 00:22:31,685 --> 00:22:36,565 So what that means to me is that you need to start looking at maybe what you can make a

case for. 332 00:22:36,645 --> 00:22:40,905 You can make a case for Bitcoin being tied to global liquidity. 333 00:22:40,905 --> 00:22:43,965 Liquidity and risk do affect Bitcoin. 334 00:22:43,965 --> 00:23:06,645 And Bitcoin, you know, right now is, you know, that's a risky asset to a lot of people. It's not to me. It's not to those people that are hodling in this particular bear market. You know, right now you've got headwinds. I mean, you've got, they're not going to kill Bitcoin, but there are headwinds. Right now the Fed's policy, the lack of direction of the Fed is a headwind. 335 00:23:06,645 --> 00:23:23,420 The fact that I believe markets have got worse reading incorrectly that they don really understand where the Fed going and the Treasury They going to be working closely together in my mind over the next couple years And I think that we going to see more liquidity coming into the market I think part 336 00:23:23,420 --> 00:23:29,800 of it's tied to one of the other items, which is AI CapEx and build out. And I think that's 337 00:23:29,800 --> 00:23:37,520 sucking up liquidity right now. How I view this is deep value accumulation zone for Bitcoin. 338 00:23:38,040 --> 00:23:40,900 You are being given a gift at these price points. 339 00:23:41,520 --> 00:23:48,180 And I can tell you, I can assure you from on-chain data right now that I follow that there are, you know, the tourists are exiting. 340 00:23:48,740 --> 00:23:53,200 We've basically shaken out even long-term holders who have capitulated at the wrong time. 341 00:23:53,700 --> 00:23:55,580 This happens every single market. 342 00:23:56,080 --> 00:24:02,060 And people that are accumulating in this period are going to be very happy over the next couple of years. 343 00:24:02,300 --> 00:24:03,220 Well said. 344 00:24:03,220 --> 00:24:05,200 Mom, how did we get so poor? 345 00:24:06,000 --> 00:24:07,300 Your dad sold his Bitcoin. 346 00:24:07,520 --> 00:24:08,700 For dollars. 347 00:24:09,340 --> 00:24:10,960 I could have just borrowed against it. 348 00:24:12,580 --> 00:24:13,300 Sorry. 349 00:24:14,480 --> 00:24:15,660 You heard of Leaden? 350 00:24:16,540 --> 00:24:16,960 Yeah. 351 00:24:18,700 --> 00:24:20,160 I'll leave you a little extra. 352 00:24:27,280 --> 00:24:28,540 That dream again? 353 00:24:29,100 --> 00:24:29,580 Yeah. 354 00:24:30,420 --> 00:24:31,860 I almost did it. 355 00:24:35,860 --> 00:24:37,420 Good thing you woke up. 356 00:24:37,520 --> 00:24:41,520 As long as they keep printing, we keep the Bitcoin. 357 00:24:41,520 --> 00:24:43,520 Pretty easy decision. 358 00:24:43,520 --> 00:24:45,520 Dad, how did we get so rich? 359 00:24:45,520 --> 00:24:46,520 He didn't sell. 360 00:24:46,520 --> 00:24:48,520 Then how we buy the house? 361 00:24:48,520 --> 00:24:50,520 The Bitcoin bought it. 362 00:24:50,520 --> 00:24:52,520 We just never let it go. 363 00:24:52,520 --> 00:24:54,520 Keep your options open. 364 00:24:54,520 --> 00:25:00,520 Over $10 billion in loans

originated, operating since 2018. 365 00:25:00,520 --> 00:25:01,520 Lead in. 366 00:25:01,520 --> 00:25:02,520 Now, back to the show. 367 00:25:02,520 --> 00:25:04,520 Okay, final question. 368 00:25:04,520 --> 00:25:06,520 And it's good because we're getting to the bell here. 369 00:25:06,520 --> 00:25:10,320 $10,000 invested in Trump coin is worth $364 today. 370 00:25:10,520 --> 00:25:11,840 Why is Bitcoin any different? 371 00:25:12,080 --> 00:25:13,360 Why would anyone buy that? 372 00:25:14,260 --> 00:25:15,180 It's a great question. 373 00:25:15,300 --> 00:25:17,180 I mean, this goes to a central issue, 374 00:25:17,240 --> 00:25:18,580 and I address this in my book, 375 00:25:18,620 --> 00:25:20,960 and I think all three of us have talked about this 376 00:25:20,960 --> 00:25:22,580 for many, many years now. 377 00:25:23,260 --> 00:25:25,800 Bitcoin is not crypto, and crypto is not Bitcoin. 378 00:25:26,300 --> 00:25:28,520 And it's sad that the crypto industry 379 00:25:28,520 --> 00:25:30,500 has been just nothing but fraud. 380 00:25:31,440 --> 00:25:34,240 Sam Bankman-Fried being the most notable example of it, 381 00:25:34,300 --> 00:25:35,600 but there have been many others. 382 00:25:35,600 --> 00:25:49,955 Alex Mashinsky and the list goes on and on And what crypto in many cases was was somebody spinning up a coin pre themselves a bunch of it trying to convince other people it had value and then you know 383 00:25:50,196 --> 00:25:54,376 dumping their coins onto the marketplace and watching it fall apart. And that's exactly what 384 00:25:54,376 --> 00:25:59,896 our president did. And it was stupid and tragic. You know, whatever you want to say about him, 385 00:26:00,455 --> 00:26:04,756 you can't defend that kind of behavior. Trump coin and Melania coin and World Liberty Financial, 386 00:26:04,756 --> 00:26:11,316 which his sons did they're all scams scams designed to get people to buy in you know based 387 00:26:11,316 --> 00:26:16,676 on affinity and who he is and then they dumped into it and made money it's it's sick and it's wrong 388 00:26:17,795 --> 00:26:23,955 bitcoin is a different animal completely bitcoin was launched without a pre-mine it was and it's 389 00:26:23,955 --> 00:26:32,196 grown organically and it represents the invention of digital scarcity where there is no ceo nobody 390 00:26:32,196 --> 00:26:38,756 has an advantage. We all play on a level playing field, and it really just is a protocol that can't 391 00:26:38,756 --> 00:26:46,295 be tampered with or altered. And so it's just a completely different animal than crypto. 392 00:26:46,855 --> 00:26:50,696 But sadly, a lot of people who don't take the time to study the two things, 393 00:26:51,056 --> 00:26:56,696 put them in the same bucket, and they're not. So that would be kind of my answer. I think, 394 00:26:56,876 --> 00:27:00,676 you know, and some people, some crypto people are going to be angry at me for this, but I basically 395 00:27:00,676 -->

00:27:02,396 We think almost all crypto is worthless. 396 00:27:03,276 --> 00:27:08,256 And yet Bitcoin is probably one of the most important inventions of the last 500 years. 397 00:27:08,735 --> 00:27:13,436 Because the invention of digital scarcity is going to change the world, in my view. 398 00:27:13,436 --> 00:27:17,816 Bitcoin is more than just a coin. 399 00:27:18,216 --> 00:27:19,056 It's a protocol. 400 00:27:19,436 --> 00:27:21,015 It's a decentralized protocol. 401 00:27:22,036 --> 00:27:28,455 I would argue it is the greatest, purest form of decentralization ever created, 402 00:27:28,455 --> 00:27:38,556 supported by billions of dollars and millions of servers that make it permissionless, 403 00:27:40,036 --> 00:27:47,016 uncensorable, immutable. We have a set of rules that give us a finite supply 404 00:27:47,016 --> 00:27:52,455 that are enforced by those miners and tens of thousands of nodes around the world. 405 00:27:52,456 --> 00:27:59,956 And so we're really comparing apples and oranges if we're comparing Trump coin to Bitcoin. 406 00:27:59,956 --> 00:28:17,991 But to Larry point essentially every other form of crypto compared to Bitcoin is really a poor comparison It really unfortunate that they get lumped together because they are not the same And so my advice to everybody is 407 00:28:18,291 --> 00:28:19,731 like, if you have an interest in this area, 408 00:28:19,811 --> 00:28:20,531 just buy Bitcoin. 409 00:28:20,691 --> 00:28:22,051 Don't bother with anything else 410 00:28:22,051 --> 00:28:25,971 because I think the default assumption is 411 00:28:25,971 --> 00:28:28,351 they are all a scam or at least flawed. 412 00:28:28,971 --> 00:28:29,451 It's correct. 413 00:28:29,551 --> 00:28:30,731 It's finite scarcity. 414 00:28:30,911 --> 00:28:31,651 We've never had that. 415 00:28:31,651 --> 00:28:35,971 And it is, as Bob said, the most decentralized protocol you'll ever find. 416 00:28:36,471 --> 00:28:37,351 Decentralized money. 417 00:28:37,651 --> 00:28:42,291 This is the first time as human beings we've ever had a chance to hold money ourselves. 418 00:28:42,591 --> 00:28:44,911 Real money that cannot be debased. 419 00:28:45,431 --> 00:28:48,351 And nothing else is close to it. 420 00:28:48,831 --> 00:28:52,231 You know, you mentioned Trump coin and Melania coin. 421 00:28:52,371 --> 00:28:57,051 But that's just one of endless, endless shit coins that have come out. 422 00:28:57,051 --> 00:29:10,511 And every one of them has resulted that I'm aware of anyway, have resulted in heartache and a loss of funds or such a great devaluation that it's like you're just rug pulled. 423 00:29:11,011 --> 00:29:15,631 And you have this opportunity to escape that system. 424 00:29:16,291 --> 00:29:17,331 Bitcoin is unique. 425 00:29:17,331 --> 00:29:27,251 And once you understand Bitcoin, if you just do the research, you'll understand that and you'll realize that this is your opportunity to escape the system. 426 00:29:27,991 --> 00:29:29,231 And Bitcoin is unique. 427 00:29:29,571 --> 00:29:31,691 It is a zero to one event. 428 00:29:32,051 --> 00:29:33,211 It's the invention of the wheel. 429 00:29:33,851 --> 00:29:36,891 You know, since the beginning of mankind, money has been debased. 430 00:29:37,691 --> 00:29:46,251 And to have a fixed supply of money, future money, that cannot be debased is just an enormous life and world changing event. 431 00:29:46,251 --> 00:29:47,991 and I don't think most people 432 00:29:47,991 --> 00:29:49,411 have really gotten their heads around that yet 433 00:29:49,411 --> 00:29:50,291 but once you do 434 00:29:50,291 --> 00:29:51,831 you'll say to yourself 435 00:29:51,831 --> 00:29:53,171 God I gotta own some of that 436 00:29:53,171 --> 00:29:56,371 because that's gonna protect me 437 00:29:56,371 --> 00:29:57,871 but anyway guys 438 00:29:57,871 --> 00:29:59,371 it's been great speaking with you 439 00:29:59,371 --> 00:30:00,471 really enjoyed it 440 00:30:00,471 --> 00:30:01,231 I've gotta run 441 00:30:01,231 --> 00:30:02,211 because I've got another call 442 00:30:02,211 --> 00:30:03,051 I gotta hop on 443 00:30:03,051 --> 00:30:06,111 but we will do it again soon 444 00:30:06,111 --> 00:30:07,431 and George thank you so much 445 00:30:07,431 --> 00:30:08,651 for filling in this week 446 00:30:08,651 --> 00:30:10,351 or this month or whatever 447 00:30:10,351 --> 00:30:11,931 I'm not sure how often we do these 448 00:30:11,931 --> 00:30:13,571 but thanks for filling in 449 00:30:13,571 --> 00:30:14,711 maybe we'll 450 00:30:14,711 --> 00:30:15,751 maybe we can make 451 00:30:15,751 --> 00:30:16,411 George a regular 452 00:30:16,411 --> 00:30:17,311 and just add Gary 453 00:30:17,311 --> 00:30:18,331 so now it's four of us 454 00:30:18,331 --> 00:30:18,971 not three of us 455 00:30:18,971 --> 00:30:19,851 I don't know what to see 456 00:30:19,851 --> 00:30:22,251 but thanks guys 457 00:30:22,251 --> 00:30:22,871 good to see you 458 00:30:22,871 --> 00:30:23,151 great episode 459 00:30:23,151 --> 00:30:23,431 great episode 460 00:30:23,431 --> 00:30:26,751 Bitcoin Boomers 461 00:30:26,751 --> 00:30:33,951 Bitcoin Boomers