Reflection: When Moving Too Slow Costs More Than Mistakes의 전체 녹취록

00:04:48.983 Like not a problem to solve, but a tension to manage, which, and that's what I wanna talk to you about today in a couple of different ways, because I think oftentimes we're like, it's as simple as this. 00:04:48.983 --> 00:04:54.774 Like we like, but there is more of a, there's more of like a sliding scale of dealing with. 00:04:55.129 --> 00:05:00.079 Change how fast we move, how we make decisions, how we bring people along for those decisions. 00:05:00.079 --> 00:05:02.419 So that's what we're gonna talk about today. 00:05:02.929 --> 00:05:03.259 Let's go. 00:05:03.799 --> 00:05:04.919 It's definitely a tension. 00:05:04.968 --> 00:05:05.809 We feel it too. 00:05:06.229 --> 00:05:06.559 Yeah. 00:05:06.559 --> 00:05:07.489 And we can talk through that. 00:05:07.489 --> 00:05:09.799 Maybe we can get some work done while we're on this call. 00:05:13.408 --> 00:05:23.429 The first, so the first kind of tension category of tension that we deal with this is this idea of like progress and perfection. 00:05:23.989 --> 00:05:33.319 Which I think there's a, another way to say it might be like iteration versus the highest quality outcome. 00:05:33.348 --> 00:05:38.419 Like really this battle between we're learning as we go. 00:05:38.419 --> 00:05:46.338 We're giving our space, we're giving ourselves space to unlearn, we're giving ourselves space to create feedback loops. 00:05:46.639 --> 00:05:46.699 Yeah. 00:05:46.999 --> 00:05:50.269 And then moving towards the quickest, most. 00:05:50.614 --> 00:05:57.554 High quality most, directed action and getting it right the first time, second time, third time. 00:05:57.713 --> 00:06:06.114 Let me just tell you my reaction to that 'cause I have a deep bias when it comes to this and that it's that learning happens in action. 00:06:06.713 --> 00:06:15.473 And so like when people get paralyzed by perfection, it feels like something's sitting on the shelf because we're afraid of failure. 00:06:15.954 --> 00:06:16.614 And. 00:06:17.049 --> 00:06:24.489 There's actually a mentality that you can have over the speed of failure, and so it's not about not failing because you will fail. 00:06:24.489 --> 00:06:26.288 Things will be less than perfect. 00:06:26.559 --> 00:06:31.538 So how fast can we get through the reps, the awkward reps? 00:06:31.884 --> 00:06:33.234 And a lot of this comes down. 00:06:33.294 --> 00:06:34.283 Some of us are wired. 00:06:34.283 --> 00:06:35.424 I'm a perfectionist. 00:06:35.424 --> 00:06:37.584 I'm, I, excellence is all that matters. 00:06:37.884 --> 00:06:40.644 I don't want to be seen as somebody that makes a mistake or an error. 00:06:40.644 --> 00:06:46.764 So I reread my email five times and I, my bent's like way on the other side you're gonna get an email from me. 00:06:47.033 --> 00:06:50.994 It might not have capitalization, it might not have punctuation. 00:06:51.319 --> 00:06:56.329 I'm gonna do dot seven times in one very long sentence because that's how my mind thinks. 00:06:56.538 --> 00:07:05.209 So you might get that from me, but I'm gonna get that off and it's gonna be done, and it's gonna be outta my mind and outta my space, and so my ability to get more done. 00:07:05.809 --> 00:07:07.819 Maybe not perfect, but more done. 00:07:08.088 --> 00:07:10.999 I just don't know how much value perfection actually has. 00:07:10.999 --> 00:07:18.059 Now on this other side of that, like I don't want us launching features in our software that have bugs and let users have a bad experience, right? 00:07:18.538 --> 00:07:20.859 So it's knowing like where's that is the tension, right? 00:07:20.859 --> 00:07:21.848 Where is the line? 00:07:22.329 --> 00:07:25.119 But I think learning happens in action. 00:07:25.119 --> 00:07:27.189 And if we're waiting for something to be perfect. 00:07:27.864 --> 00:07:31.014 Then we're like to launch, like then we're not getting customer feedback. 00:07:31.014 --> 00:07:36.084 We're not seeing where things break fast enough and just learning happens in action. 00:07:36.084 --> 00:07:36.984 But I know that's a tension. 00:07:37.033 --> 00:07:42.114 'Cause you do things really well and you want them to be really well. 00:07:42.413 --> 00:07:43.794 So how do you manage that? 00:07:44.064 --> 00:07:48.704 Yeah I was gonna say, I don't, and in response to what you just said, I don't think that. 00:07:49.408 --> 00:07:51.329 I totally agree with. 00:07:51.684 --> 00:07:59.884 I think I was gonna say like in more of a growth stage business, but I think in any business I've been in the progress over perfection. 00:07:59.884 --> 00:08:00.394 It's true. 00:08:00.394 --> 00:08:03.304 No matter what stage you're at, I think it is. 00:08:03.634 --> 00:08:06.134 I think it's focusing the two things. 00:08:06.134 --> 00:08:12.223 I think it's focusing on what things require perfection, which is one of the things that you just mentioned. 00:08:12.223 --> 00:08:14.059 So I think that's one bucket. 00:08:14.848 --> 00:08:25.408 What requires perfection and are we creating the correct feedback loops so that if we're living in the journey of progress, are we making sure that we're learning from it? 00:08:25.439 --> 00:08:34.229 I think that's where, I think that's where that falls off the rails and people wanna use that as we're just, we've gotta learn, which I think is absolutely true. 00:08:34.318 --> 00:08:35.188 A hundred percent. 00:08:35.828 --> 00:08:38.948 We've got a beta test, we've gotta get MVPs out there. 00:08:38.948 --> 00:08:44.438 We have to do that, but we also have to make sure that we're looking at what we learned and iterating on that. 00:08:45.218 --> 00:08:57.808 When I say we need to focus, perfection, what you just said about so we have a software and it would not be acceptable for us to be releasing features that are half baked. 00:08:57.889 --> 00:09:02.298 It doesn't create the customer experience that we know we need in order to. 00:09:02.739 --> 00:09:05.198 Serve our

customers in the way that we want to. 00:09:05.408 --> 00:09:10.443 So I think that perfection piece, there's gonna be a progress to get to that perfection. 00:09:10.443 --> 00:09:14.884 But there's a certain number of things in any business where you say, these are non-negotiable. 00:09:14.974 --> 00:09:20.913 These are the things we're gonna do extraordinarily well, and we're probably actually gonna be spending more and more time. 00:09:21.318 --> 00:09:24.168 Making progress on making that thing better over time. 00:09:24.168 --> 00:09:31.209 So that could be customer service, that could be speed to delivery, that could be communication. 00:09:31.209 --> 00:09:42.798 There's probably a handful of things that are, that require that perfection and maybe we give it the space to or we just acknowledge that we give it we acknowledge the thing that requires a perfection. 00:09:42.798 --> 00:09:44.959 We let everything else live in progress. 00:09:45.094 --> 00:09:47.824 I like feel myself tightening up on the inside even. 00:09:47.989 --> 00:09:50.538 When you say there's some things that require perfection. 00:09:50.639 --> 00:09:52.168 So go back to the software example. 00:09:52.219 --> 00:09:53.418 We don't get perfection. 00:09:53.418 --> 00:09:58.938 There's gonna be some weird edge case use case that we didn't expect and a customer's gonna find it. 00:09:59.219 --> 00:10:04.729 So in that case, it's get it to the place where we're comfortable with for the majority of the users. 00:10:04.908 --> 00:10:10.938 Put it out there and then our job is to be like, how fast can we respond and fix that? 00:10:10.994 --> 00:10:12.163 It's not perfection. 00:10:12.214 --> 00:10:13.053 It's not perfection. 00:10:13.053 --> 00:10:14.104 It's excellence. 00:10:14.163 --> 00:10:14.374 Yeah. 00:10:14.374 --> 00:10:23.274 It's a standard, and different things have different bars for what that can be, and different people have different bars, and I think that's where it can create organizational frustration. 00:10:23.514 --> 00:10:27.354 I was in a session yesterday and people were like, why hasn't this launched? 00:10:27.384 --> 00:10:31.884 And it took us forever to get to like kind of the root problem. 00:10:31.884 --> 00:10:33.894 And there were a couple things that. 00:10:33.894 --> 00:10:37.014 It people like didn't believe were ready. 00:10:37.063 --> 00:10:43.933 And it's that, it's what you're saying, like they didn't feel like it was to the excellence standard that the organization has. 00:10:44.443 --> 00:10:50.144 And so internally it was hard to get buy-in to then take externally and that was a huge roadblock. 00:10:50.144 --> 00:11:01.504 And so we had to go, okay, what things don't feel excellent and are these really deal breakers that are gonna stop us from launching or, so we made like an absolute list and a coming soon list. 00:11:01.798 --> 00:11:03.028 So where is the line? 00:11:03.079 --> 00:11:08.989 That we feel good enough we can take this to market to start to get some feedback, to get more data. 00:11:09.019 --> 00:11:10.938 Like action creates learning, right? 00:11:11.119 --> 00:11:15.438 So there's gonna be something else that comes up that's ooh, this is not to our level of excellence. 00:11:15.769 --> 00:11:18.168 But we wouldn't have known that if it was sitting on the shelf. 00:11:18.629 --> 00:11:24.269 But it took a lot for them to get to that root in the room, especially 'cause it involves the whole organization. 00:11:24.269 --> 00:11:28.048 So everybody had their different perspective on their part of. 00:11:29.204 --> 00:11:32.293 The pieces and what should be perfect and what was good and what wasn't. 00:11:32.293 --> 00:11:35.504 So it took us a long time to get there and realize that's what was happening. 00:11:36.403 --> 00:11:38.744 I, I think that's such an important step. 00:11:38.744 --> 00:11:45.824 I had a real, it's funny, I had a similar conversation internally yesterday in, inside of our team around the same thing. 00:11:46.303 --> 00:11:53.874 There's, we're working on a project and as we we decided this project, I guess at this point, six weeks ago. 00:11:53.964 --> 00:11:57.384 So we're halfway through the time allotted for it. 00:11:57.714 --> 00:12:02.124 And as we, over this six weeks, we've learned a ton and it's changed. 00:12:02.183 --> 00:12:13.274 Everything that we planned for has changed and we're looking at it and I'm talking to this team member and it's oh, like this kind of feels like a failure because everything we thought is not true and we're not gonna hit the goal. 00:12:13.829 --> 00:12:15.509 So we're like what could we do differently? 00:12:15.509 --> 00:12:22.028 And the two things we landed on were when we talk about this on the front end, maybe there's some like reality check. 00:12:22.028 --> 00:12:26.709 We need to pause and do what you did with that team, which is what's negotiable? 00:12:26.729 --> 00:12:28.048 What's non-negotiable? 00:12:28.349 --> 00:12:28.769 Yeah, 00:12:29.009 --> 00:12:29.849 there's that. 00:12:30.239 --> 00:12:35.009 And then there's also just giving ourselves the space for iteration and learning. 00:12:35.704 --> 00:12:41.764 And maybe that's truly like we need to allot more days of time or weeks of time. 00:12:41.793 --> 00:12:43.984 'cause there's a lot of unknowns that we need to account for. 00:12:44.854 --> 00:12:55.484 One of the things as you were talking that I was thinking of is, I think a lot of times, and maybe this is a me problem, but like I'll get frustrated at times when I see slowness. 00:12:55.903 --> 00:12:56.264 Yeah. 00:12:56.474 --> 00:12:57.644 When we've made a decision. 00:12:57.644 --> 00:13:01.033 We're gonna, it's like we, we decided that we're moving in that direction. 00:13:01.063 --> 00:13:02.264 Why isn't everybody. 00:13:02.918 --> 00:13:03.818 Why aren't we there? 00:13:04.089 --> 00:13:09.259 And I think there's so much in wrapped up in that, in, in leading

people through change. 00:13:09.769 --> 00:13:15.408 But I think one of the things that you just said related to that team is that they were unclear there. 00:13:15.469 --> 00:13:24.019 It wasn't that people are being slow, it's that there was something that wasn't clear about what the deliverable was, what our standard of excellence is. 00:13:24.199 --> 00:13:25.519 And that's, I think. 00:13:26.384 --> 00:13:33.984 The slowness is probably an indicator less of like disengagement or disinterest or procrastination. 00:13:33.984 --> 00:13:37.433 It's more of a signal of care because people are like, I wanna do my job. 00:13:37.484 --> 00:13:40.303 So I think that conversation's really important to have 00:13:40.479 --> 00:13:40.699 it. 00:13:41.293 --> 00:13:41.504 It is. 00:13:41.504 --> 00:13:48.313 I will say it also felt like a leadership fail because these are senior leaders and nobody like just raised their hand and said. 00:13:49.454 --> 00:14:15.104 I have trouble backing this, or my team has trouble backing this because X, Y, Z. So the fact that we had to have the conversation and go those layers deep without somebody just raising their hand or multiple people raising their hand, that felt like, ooh, we've got some, we've got some, leadership inner work to do because we can't just my coach has a, let's see if I can get this quote be careful of disagreement, masquerading as confusion. 00:14:16.394 --> 00:14:20.033 And I see that a lot too as oh, I wasn't sure about this and this. 00:14:20.033 --> 00:14:21.114 No, you just disagreed. 00:14:21.114 --> 00:14:27.024 Or you didn't like the answer or you weren't you didn't do your job, so you just act confused about what was supposed to happen. 00:14:27.454 --> 00:14:29.344 I don't know why my team did this and this. 00:14:29.344 --> 00:14:34.063 Okay, maybe it's 'cause you didn't lead them well and give them the directive to get it done or the urgency. 00:14:34.063 --> 00:14:38.193 And I think I know what project pro project you're referring to internally for us. 00:14:38.644 --> 00:14:49.074 And I smile going "man. I don't know that we could have done any better on the front side." And that's the point, is we all love the quote, the saying everybody's got a plan until you get punched in the face. 00:14:49.124 --> 00:14:49.693 You can add that. 00:14:50.474 --> 00:14:51.344 Mike Tyson. 00:14:51.793 --> 00:14:52.063 Yep. 00:14:52.063 --> 00:14:52.423 There you go. 00:14:52.423 --> 00:14:52.813 Thank you. 00:14:52.813 --> 00:14:53.354 Fact check. 00:14:53.563 --> 00:14:57.193 But like this is that we created a plan and then we got punched in the face. 00:14:57.204 --> 00:14:59.183 Oh my gosh, this is so much bigger. 00:14:59.244 --> 00:15:01.884 There's a better way to actually go about the whole thing. 00:15:01.884 --> 00:15:06.443 Different people need to be involved in different parts of the process in a different way, and so we learned a lot. 00:15:06.443 --> 00:15:11.874 We iterated, we switched, and it's gonna be so much better because of all the switches that we've made. 00:15:12.274 --> 00:15:14.974 So I don't know, but you're, what you're talking about goes to this. 00:15:15.004 --> 00:15:21.524 The other thing that we we talk about internally, I don't know if we've ever used this language outside, but it's like your gut versus gravity. 00:15:21.943 --> 00:15:25.124 My guts always says we should be moving faster. 00:15:25.484 --> 00:15:26.293 Always. 00:15:26.504 --> 00:15:32.053 But there's a gravity in every organization to both how you've always done it. 00:15:33.048 --> 00:15:37.278 And a pace that you're comfortable with, like people seek comfort. 00:15:37.818 --> 00:15:42.729 And so very rarely, most founders are very okay with being uncomfortable. 00:15:42.729 --> 00:15:46.928 That's like the number one trait because there's nothing comfortable about being a founder. 00:15:47.139 --> 00:15:58.699 But then you're surrounded by a bunch of people in an organization that seek comfort and they, the leaders have gut saying this should be this way and this should go faster, and why aren't we doing this? 00:15:59.464 --> 00:16:03.043 There's a gravity to the people in the organization pulling you down. 00:16:03.043 --> 00:16:12.308 And I laughed, what was it this week or last week when we were around a table and you said, but I just don't know if we're going fast enough. 00:16:12.308 --> 00:16:14.918 And I'm like, oh my gosh, this is the moment. 00:16:14.918 --> 00:16:15.879 Write it down. 00:16:16.178 --> 00:16:20.839 Like it's usually me saying that to you and you being the gravity, and I'm like. 00:16:21.783 --> 00:16:22.954 This is awesome. 00:16:24.303 --> 00:16:25.894 And then I was the gravity in that moment. 00:16:25.894 --> 00:16:30.514 I'm like, yeah, but I honestly am not sure what we even do to be able to go faster. 00:16:30.854 --> 00:16:31.604 But I feel you. 00:16:31.604 --> 00:16:32.144 I feel you. 00:16:32.144 --> 00:16:35.173 So there's like the gut, the feeling and then the reality. 00:16:35.504 --> 00:16:41.364 So how are you handling your frustration of your gut that we should be going faster? 00:16:41.903 --> 00:16:49.320 And our pace, our and the gravity of resources and time and people and all of the realities. 00:16:50.548 --> 00:16:50.938 Okay. 00:16:50.938 --> 00:16:57.749 I have two thoughts and I wanna push your question the side and go back to what you were saying about the speed versus comfort thing. 00:16:58.169 --> 00:17:01.789 There's part of me that agrees with it, and then there's part of me that's oh wait, let me do this. 00:17:01.789 --> 00:17:04.909 Yes and yes, and meaning I agree. 00:17:04.938 --> 00:17:08.899 And also I don't know that it's always a comfort thing. 00:17:09.440 --> 00:17:15.169 As much as it is, we have people on our team with different, we call 'em geniuses. 00:17:15.559 --> 00:17:27.980 Their genius requires a pace that let, lets them sit in something, comb through

something, marinate and pull out oh yeah, did we think of this? 00:17:27.980 --> 00:17:34.659 Did we, oh, I if they have a few hours instead of a few minutes, they're able to look at something differently objectively, or. 00:17:35.364 --> 00:17:37.044 They can make that connection. 00:17:37.359 --> 00:17:41.654 I'm a little more like that, so I tend to be and I'm a more cautious person. 00:17:41.654 --> 00:17:44.324 So the caution is probably the comfort piece. 00:17:44.324 --> 00:17:47.384 It's makes me feel comfortable when we're moving cautiously. 00:17:47.834 --> 00:17:58.394 But I do think, and we've encountered this internally, it's like your pace is I can give feedback in five minutes and there's other people on our team, they need five hours. 00:17:58.754 --> 00:18:04.224 And their return in that five hours is gonna be exponentially better for the way that they operate. 00:18:04.704 --> 00:18:06.714 And I think we have to keep that in mind as well. 00:18:07.074 --> 00:18:08.964 Just as a dignifying piece. 00:18:09.054 --> 00:18:09.625 A dignifying 00:18:09.865 --> 00:18:10.344 Yeah, absolutely. 00:18:10.394 --> 00:18:11.625 It gets us what we want. 00:18:12.324 --> 00:18:12.519 I'll give you, 00:18:12.589 --> 00:18:14.754 I'll give you a very real example of that. 00:18:15.004 --> 00:18:20.854 There were a couple actual objectives that were on our list for the quarter. 00:18:21.734 --> 00:18:36.644 One specifically that you had, and it's big and you are gonna have to have a couple meetings, and I'm sure if you stuck with that, whatever you came back would be like masterful. 00:18:36.644 --> 00:18:44.623 And there'd be a document and there'd be a flow chart, and there'd be like the level of detail would've been way deeper than I was capable of. 00:18:44.744 --> 00:18:48.514 I am capable of, because of what you're talking about your ability to go deep into. 00:18:48.933 --> 00:18:49.534 The thinking. 00:18:50.204 --> 00:19:01.284 We decided, a week or two ago, I'm gonna, I'm gonna take that for now, and I just stewed on it in my subconscious and it actually drove me crazy for a little while. 00:19:01.674 --> 00:19:04.434 But then I came back and what I brought back to you was like. 00:19:05.034 --> 00:19:08.814 The work output of maybe 20 minutes at a computer, right? 00:19:08.894 --> 00:19:09.854 Maybe it was more than that. 00:19:10.154 --> 00:19:12.334 But there was all the thinking that went into it. 00:19:12.334 --> 00:19:17.115 And then the 20 minutes at the computer, your work would've been days. 00:19:17.444 --> 00:19:20.294 But it would've been way deeper and way better. 00:19:20.844 --> 00:19:24.824 But you also would've gotten to a point where because you would've wanted it to be so good. 00:19:25.409 --> 00:19:33.119 Had you been wrong in any of your decision points along the way, you would've done a lot of work that couldn't, that we would have to go backwards on. 00:19:33.169 --> 00:19:38.419 And so I took it and two days later I'm like, when can I present this to you and Chris, right? 00:19:38.419 --> 00:19:41.240 Like to make sure I'm on the right path. 00:19:41.929 --> 00:19:46.240 And I don't know if I am or not, but that's an example of what you're talking about. 00:19:46.240 --> 00:20:01.119 Like I'm gonna go really fast, but it might not have a depth and an accuracy to it that you or some of our other people on the team would have, which makes, I think it makes a good partnership, but it is also still a tension because. 00:20:01.990 --> 00:20:05.319 I know when you give me something you're like, I don't know what I'm gonna get back. 00:20:05.319 --> 00:20:06.789 It's gonna end up back on my plate. 00:20:06.789 --> 00:20:08.439 I'm gonna have to do the deep work. 00:20:09.259 --> 00:20:10.549 So that, am I right? 00:20:10.549 --> 00:20:11.689 Is that real? 00:20:12.019 --> 00:20:13.099 Sometimes, yeah. 00:20:14.059 --> 00:20:17.809 Sorry, my mind's going a bunch of directions I wanna talk about. 00:20:18.109 --> 00:20:19.309 I think sometimes yes. 00:20:19.889 --> 00:20:21.719 It's again, we're in attention. 00:20:21.719 --> 00:20:23.809 That's why this is there's not a one answer. 00:20:23.809 --> 00:20:26.089 'cause there's sometimes I fully agree with you. 00:20:26.089 --> 00:20:40.000 It's we don't need, we don't need, and I need to make sure that I'm not communicating to our team in a way that when I give them something to do, they go and they spend 17 hours instead of seven minutes when all we need is the seven minutes. 00:20:40.000 --> 00:20:42.039 We don't need 17 hours yet. 00:20:42.309 --> 00:20:42.549 Yeah. 00:20:43.209 --> 00:20:55.559 I think we have to, it's, and sometimes you do a really good job of this, where you communicate that on the front end where you're like, let's go work on this, but don't spend here's how much time you should spend on it. 00:20:55.559 --> 00:20:59.359 I know we could go and become like PhDs on this, but like we need to. 00:20:59.865 --> 00:21:06.644 Like right size the appetite is the word we use for it, but communicate what the appetite is, I think is really important. 00:21:07.004 --> 00:21:08.984 Yeah, I was gonna say, you really good at it too. 00:21:08.984 --> 00:21:10.214 And I think that's something you've 00:21:10.694 --> 00:21:11.504 grown in, you've 00:21:11.714 --> 00:21:21.653 Learned over the last couple years, that even if we think, this is a 10 minute task, somebody could pick it up thinking that we think it's a, 10 hour task. 00:21:21.653 --> 00:21:25.284 And so to communicate that you do that exceptionally well. 00:21:25.613 --> 00:21:25.943 Yeah. 00:21:26.769 --> 00:21:27.309 Thank you. 00:21:27.369 --> 00:21:28.119 There's, so when do 00:21:28.119 --> 00:21:40.129 we decide whether to push a team to go faster versus slow down and do it well, or just not even, staying neutral to the speed that's happening? 00:21:40.969 --> 00:21:44.209 When do we know when to push a team to go faster? 00:21:44.359

--> 00:21:46.699 When to slow down or stay neutral? 00:21:47.149 --> 00:21:49.129 So I'll answer it and I wanna hear your answer. 00:21:49.729 --> 00:21:56.479 I think when we're trying something new, when we don't have a proof of concept yet, I think we have to move really fast. 00:21:56.689 --> 00:22:00.048 So we know we have a new product that we wanna release. 00:22:00.078 --> 00:22:02.639 There's a new business line. 00:22:03.119 --> 00:22:05.548 There's a new marketing campaign. 00:22:06.344 --> 00:22:07.664 Marketing activity. 00:22:07.964 --> 00:22:12.764 I think that requires speed Plus feedback loops. 00:22:12.884 --> 00:22:13.034 Yeah. 00:22:13.094 --> 00:22:14.024 Plus iteration. 00:22:14.024 --> 00:22:16.424 There's gotta be this like process. 00:22:16.524 --> 00:22:18.054 When do we need to slow down? 00:22:18.054 --> 00:22:24.024 I think once we found a proof of concept with something, I think then we dial it in. 00:22:24.054 --> 00:22:26.454 It's like, how do we sharpen what we've learned? 00:22:26.514 --> 00:22:27.684 We've learned that works. 00:22:28.149 --> 00:22:33.039 For example, this is inside of our business, so we've got software. 00:22:33.039 --> 00:22:33.939 We've talked about that. 00:22:33.939 --> 00:22:37.029 The software is like constantly iterative. 00:22:37.240 --> 00:22:39.429 There's so much that we have to move really fast. 00:22:39.429 --> 00:22:43.764 Some of that's the industry pace and some of it is just we have to test things and learn. 00:22:44.534 --> 00:22:45.794 On the other side of the business. 00:22:45.794 --> 00:22:58.534 We move a lot slower when it comes to the, we have a coach community, a bunch of business coaches that are part of our community, and we are very intentional and careful about how we add new things to that yeah. 00:22:58.534 --> 00:22:58.984 Environment. 00:22:58.984 --> 00:23:01.234 And I think maybe that's an example of. 00:23:01.419 --> 00:23:02.889 Of how that works. 00:23:02.919 --> 00:23:07.519 'cause we wanna be very, the word is intentional and how we handle that part of our business. 00:23:07.519 --> 00:23:10.309 It feels like we've, it's like we've really established a proof of concept. 00:23:10.309 --> 00:23:11.209 We've got something awesome. 00:23:11.209 --> 00:23:12.259 We're like, we don't wanna mess it up. 00:23:12.879 --> 00:23:13.389 Neutral. 00:23:13.389 --> 00:23:13.899 I don't know. 00:23:13.949 --> 00:23:15.929 I don't know if I have an answer for neutral. 00:23:16.139 --> 00:23:18.568 Here's what comes up for me. 00:23:18.808 --> 00:23:19.139 Yeah. 00:23:19.409 --> 00:23:27.209 Is I think most organizations are moving too slow and I think most organizations, the reason why. 00:23:27.729 --> 00:23:31.028 Is because we do the work without thinking about the work. 00:23:31.269 --> 00:23:42.498 And maybe it's just a skillset I have, but I end up in a lot of conversations where I question how we're doing the work and people are like oh yeah, we could do it that

way. 00:23:42.498 --> 00:23:48.798 And now we're doing it in half the time, or we're doing it, and that those kind of conversations have been a lot. 00:23:48.888 --> 00:23:51.528 And I think it's because most people, when they start doing the work. 00:23:52.173 --> 00:23:53.883 They don't think about how to do the work. 00:23:54.183 --> 00:24:03.353 I am I don't know if this is the right word, but I wanna say lazy, that I will spend the time figuring out the easiest way to do the work before I just start doing the work. 00:24:03.863 --> 00:24:06.413 And I think most organizations don't do that. 00:24:06.413 --> 00:24:12.593 So if you feel like you're going too slow, you're probably not taking enough time to think about how you're doing the work. 00:24:13.584 --> 00:24:14.544 That's my big takeaway. 00:24:14.544 --> 00:24:14.964 What's yours? 00:24:15.534 --> 00:24:16.344 No, I love that. 00:24:16.344 --> 00:24:21.173 I was gonna say, maybe neutral isn't an option because it should always be a conversation. 00:24:21.534 --> 00:24:22.434 That's interesting. 00:24:22.494 --> 00:24:22.854 At least. 00:24:22.854 --> 00:24:23.094 Yeah. 00:24:23.094 --> 00:24:25.574 Then you're forcing that, are we doing this the right way? 00:24:25.964 --> 00:24:27.164 Yeah, that's good. 00:24:27.164 --> 00:24:36.964 And I would say the takeaway, it's advice and a takeaway I guess, but this is attention to be managed, which means this is a conversation at all times. 00:24:37.014 --> 00:24:39.324 I think there's an emotional aspect to this. 00:24:39.564 --> 00:24:49.854 One thing we didn't really talk about is I think sometimes we get into this comparison trap with this pace of change for our organization or our stuff versus other people's stuff. 00:24:50.183 --> 00:24:58.854 And I think we have to have the conversations internally and either, acknowledge that we're trying to compare ourselves to our competitor. 00:24:59.244 --> 00:25:01.434 We're unclear, we disagree. 00:25:01.494 --> 00:25:06.984 Like I think the convers it has to be a conversation and it's a huge fail. 00:25:06.984 --> 00:25:19.884 As you mentioned with the example you gave earlier, it's a huge fail for a leadership team if we're not, someone's not raising their hand to say, I either don't understand this, or we haven't evaluated this, or whatever it is. 00:25:19.884 --> 00:25:21.414 So I think maybe that's my takeaway. 00:25:22.149 --> 00:25:22.659 That's good. 00:25:22.988 --> 00:25:24.519 Hey, thanks for bringing up this conversation. 00:25:24.519 --> 00:25:25.148 This is good. 00:25:25.148 --> 00:25:26.918 It feels deep 'cause it feels personal. 00:25:26.918 --> 00:25:39.933 So hopefully everybody listening can relate to this in one way or another and have something actionable that they can go do, a team that they can go ask about how they're doing the work or challenge them to speed up or maybe slow down. 00:25:39.933 --> 00:25:44.763 Maybe there's a quality issue there that they're, they are going too fast, which makes me. 00:25:44.823 --> 00:25:49.173 I'm almost sick to say because I want everything to go faster. 00:25:49.863 --> 00:25:56.133 But we'll see how fast this next week goes, and we'll see you next week for another episode of Sessions. 00:25:56.223 --> 00:25:57.628 Thanks again to fist bumps.