Data Centers의 전체 녹취록

environmental 98 00:03:04,800 --> 00:03:10,566 impacts and water use. 99 00:03:06,333 --> 00:03:12,366 >> We don't trust these people, 100 00:03:07,666 --> 00:03:14,166 and what they did was just 101 00:03:10,566 --> 00:03:15,600 wrong. They need to. Our 102 00:03:12,366 --> 00:03:16,866 community should be able to to 103 00:03:14,166 --> 00:03:18,300 know about this and make 104 00:03:15,600 --> 00:03:19,300 decisions. They made decisions 105 00:03:16,866 --> 00:03:20,400 without us. That's not what we 106 00:03:18,300 --> 00:03:21,500 elected them to do. 107 00:03:19,300 --> 00:03:23,533 >> Company officials say the 108 00:03:20,400 --> 00:03:25,000 facility would use a closed 109 00:03:21,500 --> 00:03:26,400 loop cooling system, consume 110 00:03:23,533 --> 00:03:28,233 relatively small amounts of 111 00:03:25,000 --> 00:03:30,200 water, and operate without 112 00:03:26,400 --> 00:03:31,800 increasing utility costs for 113 00:03:28,233 --> 00:03:32,866 existing customers. Supporters 114 00:03:30,200 --> 00:03:34,633 point to the possibility of 115 00:03:31,800 --> 00:03:36,433 billions of dollars in 116 00:03:32,866 --> 00:03:38,266 investment, significant tax 117 00:03:34,633 --> 00:03:39,466 revenue and hundreds of 118 00:03:36,433 --> 00:03:41,333 construction jobs. 119 00:03:38,266 --> 00:03:42,966 >> This is the start of a 120 00:03:39,466 --> 00:03:44,400 relationship we want to be in 121 00:03:41,333 --> 00:03:45,600 this community for for 15, 20 122 00:03:42,966 --> 00:03:46,600 years, and we're not going to 123 00:03:44,400 --> 00:03:48,000 be good neighbors unless we get 124 00:03:45,600 --> 00:03:49,466 to know one another. 125 00:03:46,600 --> 00:03:51,600 >> Meanwhile, local governments 126 00:03:48,000 --> 00:03:52,733 across Kentucky are hitting 127 00:03:49,466 --> 00:03:55,533 pause. In Boyle County, fiscal 128 00:03:51,600 --> 00:03:56,700 court leaders approved a one 129 00:03:52,733 --> 00:03:58,066 year moratorium on data center 130 00:03:55,533 --> 00:03:59,833 applications, while officials 131 00:03:56,700 --> 00:04:01,333 study how the facility should 132 00:03:58,066 --> 00:04:03,166 be regulated and where they 133 00:03:59,833 --> 00:04:04,566 should be located. Edmonson 134 00:04:01,333 --> 00:04:06,733 County, Scott County and Cave 135 00:04:03,166 --> 00:04:08,533 City have also enacted 136 00:04:04,566 --> 00:04:10,333 temporary moratoriums as local 137 00:04:06,733 --> 00:04:11,766 leaders examine potential 138 00:04:08,533 --> 00:04:13,566 impacts on water supplies, 139 00:04:10,333 --> 00:04:14,633 electrical infrastructure and 140 00:04:11,766 --> 00:04:16,800 land use. Cave city's 141 00:04:13,566 --> 00:04:17,833 moratorium is now facing a 142 00:04:14,633 --> 00:04:19,300 legal challenge from the 143 00:04:16,800 --> 00:04:20,900 Kentucky Industrial Alliance, 144 00:04:17,833 --> 00:04:22,900 which argues its proposal 145 00:04:19,300 --> 00:04:24,333 should be reviewed under zoning 146 00:04:20,900 --> 00:04:26,133 rules that existed before the 147 00:04:22,900 --> 00:04:27,600 pause was enacted. Another 148 00:04:24,333 --> 00:04:29,766 legal dispute is unfolding in 149 00:04:26,133 --> 00:04:31,200 Simpson County, where county 150 00:04:27,600 --> 00:04:33,000 and city officials are battling 151 00:04:29,766 --> 00:04:34,800 over who has authority to 152 00:04:31,200 --> 00:04:35,866 regulate a proposed data center 153 00:04:33,000 --> 00:04:37,700 development in Franklin. 154 00:04:34,800 --> 00:04:39,133 >> They don't believe that the 155 00:04:35,866 --> 00:04:40,566 county has the ability to 156 00:04:37,700 --> 00:04:41,666 implement that ordinance, and 157 00:04:39,133 --> 00:04:42,733 we believe we absolutely do 158 00:04:40,566 --> 00:04:44,166 have that ability. 159 00:04:41,666 --> 00:04:46,333 >> And in Lexington, city 160 00:04:42,733 --> 00:04:47,766 leaders recently approved a 161 00:04:44,166 --> 00:04:49,566 short term moratorium through 162 00:04:46,333 --> 00:04:51,700 October after learning a Texas 163 00:04:47,766 --> 00:04:53,500 based company had purchased 164 00:04:49,566 --> 00:04:54,966 buildings on the former Lexmark 165 00:04:51,700 --> 00:04:56,766 campus. Mayor Linda Gorton has 166 00:04:53,500 --> 00:04:58,566 expressed concerns about 167 00:04:54,966 --> 00:05:00,766 limited job creation and the 168 00:04:56,766 --> 00:05:02,166 potential for higher utility 169 00:04:58,566 --> 00:05:04,366 costs, calling for strict 170 00:05:00,766 --> 00:05:05,766 controls. The debate is also 171 00:05:02,166 --> 00:05:07,400 reaching Frankfort. Some state 172 00:05:04,366 --> 00:05:08,466 lawmakers and the governor have 173 00:05:05,766 --> 00:05:10,433 emphasized that Kentucky 174 00:05:07,400 --> 00:05:12,300 ratepayers should not shoulder 175 00:05:08,466 --> 00:05:13,666 the cost of new power 176 00:05:10,433 --> 00:05:15,133 generation needed to serve data 177 00:05:12,300 --> 00:05:17,100 centers. A bill to regulate 178 00:05:13,666 --> 00:05:18,366 data centers was introduced 179 00:05:15,133 --> 00:05:20,133 during the 2026 Kentucky 180 00:05:17,100 --> 00:05:21,600 General Assembly, but failed to 181 00:05:18,366 --> 00:05:24,100 make it out of committee. 182 00:05:20,133 --> 00:05:25,900 Energy planners say the 183 00:05:21,600 --> 00:05:27,366 challenge is balancing economic 184 00:05:24,100 --> 00:05:30,266 opportunity with consumer 185 00:05:25,900 --> 00:05:31,466 protections for Kentucky. 186 00:05:27,366 --> 00:05:33,266 Tonight. I'm Toby Gibbs. 187 00:05:30,266 --> 00:05:35,266 >> Thank you so much, Toby 188 00:05:31,466 --> 00:05:36,366 Gibbs, for setting that up for 189 00:05:33,266 --> 00:05:37,466 us, and it's going to be a good 190 00:05:35,266 --> 00:05:39,400 way to segue into our 191 00:05:36,366 --> 00:05:40,500 discussion and. Mr. Ted Smith, 192 00:05:37,466 --> 00:05:41,600 I want to start with you first. 193 00:05:39,400 --> 00:05:43,266 Even though you are at the 194 00:05:40,500 --> 00:05:44,266

University of Louisville, you 195 00:05:41,600 --> 00:05:45,266 are not speaking for the 196 00:05:43,266 --> 00:05:45,800 University of Louisville. And 197 00:05:44,266 --> 00:05:47,266 you will probably reiterate 198 00:05:45,266 --> 00:05:49,266 that throughout tonight's 199 00:05:45,800 --> 00:05:50,433 conversation. I want you to 200 00:05:47,266 --> 00:05:52,266 kind of pick up a little bit on 201 00:05:49,266 --> 00:05:53,333 what you heard Toby Gibbs say 202 00:05:50,433 --> 00:05:54,466 in that report. And in our 203 00:05:52,266 --> 00:05:55,533 conversation last week when we 204 00:05:53,333 --> 00:05:57,333 talked about this issue, you 205 00:05:54,466 --> 00:05:58,500 made the point that data 206 00:05:55,533 --> 00:06:00,366 centers are going to exist and 207 00:05:57,333 --> 00:06:01,466 they are already here, and it 208 00:05:58,500 --> 00:06:03,333 just depends on where you want 209 00:06:00,366 --> 00:06:04,366 them. We're not going to be 210 00:06:01,466 --> 00:06:06,266 able to escape this. Give us 211 00:06:03,333 --> 00:06:06,433 your overall perspective about 212 00:06:04,366 --> 00:06:08,266 where we are in this debate so 213 00:06:06,266 --> 00:06:09,500 far. 214 00:06:06,433 --> 00:06:11,266 >> Yeah, sure. And thank you so 215 00:06:08,266 --> 00:06:12,433 much for having me tonight. My 216 00:06:09,500 --> 00:06:14,266 pleasure. So, I mean, we've had 217 00:06:11,266 --> 00:06:15,366 data centers for 50 years in 218 00:06:12,433 --> 00:06:16,533 this country. And so it's a 219 00:06:14,266 --> 00:06:18,266 little bit surprising to a lot 220 00:06:15,366 --> 00:06:19,500 of people that we're now 221 00:06:16,533 --> 00:06:21,266 talking about data centers so 222 00:06:18,266 --> 00:06:22,366 much. And I think it is because 223 00:06:19,500 --> 00:06:23,400 we've hit this sort of 224 00:06:21,266 --> 00:06:25,333 threshold issue about the scale 225 00:06:22,366 --> 00:06:27,266 of these operations. And now 226 00:06:23,400 --> 00:06:29,300 there are real concerns at 227 00:06:25,333 --> 00:06:30,133 multiple levels. And, you know, 228 00:06:27,266 --> 00:06:31,800 I've gotten involved as local 229 00:06:29,300 --> 00:06:34,300 communities have been concerned 230 00:06:30,133 --> 00:06:35,766 about their health and health 231 00:06:31,800 --> 00:06:36,833 impacts. And so some of these 232 00:06:34,300 --> 00:06:38,266 facilities are just really, 233 00:06:35,766 --> 00:06:40,066 depending on how they're 234 00:06:36,833 --> 00:06:42,266 designed, you know, could be 235 00:06:38,266 --> 00:06:44,066 hazardous for community health. 236 00:06:40,066 --> 00:06:45,833 And really thinking carefully 237 00:06:42,266 --> 00:06:46,966 about that local control 238 00:06:44,066 --> 00:06:49,433 element. And so with these 239 00:06:45,833 --> 00:06:51,600 moratorium, with these 240 00:06:46,966 --> 00:06:53,400 ordinances, you see the 241 00:06:49,433 --> 00:06:55,266 struggle to try to figure out 242 00:06:51,600 --> 00:06:58,500 what is what is safe and 243 00:06:53,400 --> 00:06:59,533 healthy and, and really, how 244 00:06:55,266 --> 00:07:01,766 should we proceed knowing that 245 00:06:58,500 --> 00:07:02,900 prosperity and health don't 246 00:06:59,533 --> 00:07:03,966 have to be at odds. But if 247 00:07:01,766 --> 00:07:04,966 we're not careful, you know, 248 00:07:02,900 --> 00:07:06,700 you really can't have one 249 00:07:03,966 --> 00:07:07,766 without the other. 250 00:07:04,966 --> 00:07:09,233 >> And as you articulate this, 251 00:07:06,700 --> 00:07:10,666 this is not necessarily an 252 00:07:07,766 --> 00:07:12,166 argument against data centers. 253 00:07:09,233 --> 00:07:13,566 >> I mean, I think 254 00:07:10,666 --> 00:07:15,900 technological progress will 255 00:07:12,166 --> 00:07:17,633 continue. I think, you know, as 256 00:07:13,566 --> 00:07:19,533 a society, we've really become, 257 00:07:15,900 --> 00:07:20,533 you know, fully embedded with 258 00:07:17,633 --> 00:07:22,966 all of this stuff. And I think 259 00:07:19,533 --> 00:07:24,700 it's produced some real 260 00:07:20,533 --> 00:07:27,300 economic value. And so now the 261 00:07:22,966 --> 00:07:28,933 real question is how do we live 262 00:07:24,700 --> 00:07:30,166 with it? And I think, you know, 263 00:07:27,300 --> 00:07:31,333 there are choices that we make. 264 00:07:28,933 --> 00:07:33,300 I mean, there's a ridiculous 265 00:07:30,166 --> 00:07:35,900 amount of money in this sector 266 00:07:31,333 --> 00:07:37,533 right now, right? $700 billion 267 00:07:33,300 --> 00:07:38,633 in data centers this year. It's 268 00:07:35,900 --> 00:07:40,533 not clear to me, and it's not 269 00:07:37,533 --> 00:07:42,733 clear to many communities that 270 00:07:38,633 --> 00:07:44,166 are affected why we can't value 271 00:07:40,533 --> 00:07:45,800 health protections, harm 272 00:07:42,733 --> 00:07:46,800 reduction as part of that. And, 273 00:07:44,166 --> 00:07:48,800 you know, the other issues are 274 00:07:45,800 --> 00:07:51,033 very important issues, too, 275 00:07:46,800 --> 00:07:53,566 around price protection, around 276 00:07:48,800 --> 00:07:54,700 the energy, you know, concerns 277 00:07:51,033 --> 00:07:55,800 about water. All of that is 278 00:07:53,566 --> 00:07:57,633 important. It seems to me that 279 00:07:54,700 --> 00:07:58,800 there's enough money in the 280 00:07:55,800 --> 00:08:00,566 system right now that we could 281 00:07:57,633 --> 00:08:01,666 be working on solutions for 282 00:07:58,800 --> 00:08:02,766 that, and I hope we do. 283 00:08:00,566 --> 00:08:03,966 >> You've also mentioned in our 284 00:08:01,666 --> 00:08:05,633 conversation that Kentucky's 285 00:08:02,766 --> 00:08:07,100 topography and geology kind of 286 00:08:03,966 --> 00:08:07,333 make Kentucky very attractive 287 00:08:05,633 --> 00:08:09,033 for these. Explain that to our 288 00:08:07,100 --> 00:08:10,266 viewers. 289 00:08:07,333 --> 00:08:11,200 >> Well, I mean, there have 290 00:08:09,033 -->

00:08:13,300 been many sort of high profile 291 00:08:10,266 --> 00:08:15,133 experiments around the world 292 00:08:11,200 --> 00:08:16,200 putting data centers underwater, 293 00:08:13,300 --> 00:08:18,466 you know, finding innovative 294 00:08:15,133 --> 00:08:20,866 strategies for energy around 295 00:08:16,200 --> 00:08:23,066 hydrogen cells. You know, we've 296 00:08:18,466 --> 00:08:24,866 seen the Small nuclear reactor 297 00:08:20,866 --> 00:08:26,266 conversation develop. So I 298 00:08:23,066 --> 00:08:28,166 think it's a it's an evolving 299 00:08:24,866 --> 00:08:30,966 landscape. And I think there 300 00:08:26,266 --> 00:08:32,366 are there are places that they 301 00:08:28,166 --> 00:08:34,266 will be more welcome than 302 00:08:30,966 --> 00:08:35,900 others. Let's sort of put it 303 00:08:32,366 --> 00:08:38,133 that way. And I think I'm 304 00:08:34,266 --> 00:08:39,966 always surprised that many of 305 00:08:35,900 --> 00:08:42,233 these site selection firms just 306 00:08:38,133 --> 00:08:43,833 hadn't considered the 307 00:08:39,966 --> 00:08:44,966 population nearby at all. And I 308 00:08:42,233 --> 00:08:46,833 mean, I could, you know, I 309 00:08:43,833 --> 00:08:47,900 could give you a map of 310 00:08:44,966 --> 00:08:49,133 Kentucky and I could list lots 311 00:08:46,833 --> 00:08:51,133 of places that they're not 312 00:08:47,900 --> 00:08:51,933 likely to be successful at the 313 00:08:49,133 --> 00:08:53,333 local level. And I'm a little 314 00:08:51,133 --> 00:08:54,833 disappointed that we're not, 315 00:08:51,933 --> 00:08:56,566 you know, being proactive about 316 00:08:53,333 --> 00:08:57,600 this and really thinking about 317 00:08:54,833 --> 00:08:58,733 are there places in the 318 00:08:56,566 --> 00:09:00,600 Commonwealth we have an 319 00:08:57,600 --> 00:09:01,933 abundance of water. That 320 00:08:58,733 --> 00:09:02,933 doesn't mean we should abuse it, 321 00:09:00,600 --> 00:09:04,066 but are there innovative 322 00:09:01,933 --> 00:09:05,500 strategies? We have abandoned 323 00:09:02,933 --> 00:09:08,500 coal mines. Are there things 324 00:09:04,066 --> 00:09:09,833 that we could be learning right 325 00:09:05,500 --> 00:09:11,400 now uniquely in Kentucky? So, I 326 00:09:08,500 --> 00:09:12,533 mean, maybe that's a little 327 00:09:09,833 --> 00:09:14,400 Pollyanna ish, but, you know, 328 00:09:11,400 --> 00:09:15,500 I'd like to think that we 329 00:09:12,533 --> 00:09:16,400 should be trying to avoid sort 330 00:09:14,400 --> 00:09:17,500 of obvious pitfalls while we're 331 00:09:15,500 --> 00:09:18,766 doing this work. 332 00:09:16,400 --> 00:09:20,466 >> Representative Bray, I mean, 333 00:09:17,500 --> 00:09:22,433 this is a conversation that you 334 00:09:18,766 --> 00:09:23,566 were involved in last year, and 335 00:09:20,466 --> 00:09:24,600 we know that in 2025, if I get 336 00:09:22,433 --> 00:09:27,500 my year straight, that the 337 00:09:23,566 --> 00:09:29,966 Kentucky General Assembly did 338 00:09:24,600 --> 00:09:31,500 pass some incentive package for 339 00:09:27,500 --> 00:09:33,233 for data centers. So is that a 340 00:09:29,966 --> 00:09:35,433 wise move then? And where do 341 00:09:31,500 --> 00:09:38,266 you see things now? 342 00:09:33,233 --> 00:09:39,333 >> So last session filed House 343 00:09:35,433 --> 00:09:43,333 Bill 593 effectively. I 344 00:09:38,266 --> 00:09:45,500 referred to it as the Ratepayer 345 00:09:39,333 --> 00:09:46,933 Protection Act. Candidly, 346 00:09:43,333 --> 00:09:49,466 artificial intelligence is 347 00:09:45,500 --> 00:09:51,200 probably the national security 348 00:09:46,933 --> 00:09:52,666 issue of our time, of my 349 00:09:49,466 --> 00:09:55,533 lifetime, at least. It's 350 00:09:51,200 --> 00:09:56,666 provides a tremendous 351 00:09:52,666 --> 00:09:58,433 opportunity. Ted I say you all 352 00:09:55,533 --> 00:10:00,366 use artificial intelligence 353 00:09:56,666 --> 00:10:04,200 quite a bit. I mean, it's going 354 00:09:58,433 --> 00:10:05,633 to be what cures cancer one of 355 00:10:00,366 --> 00:10:10,300 these days with that, you know, 356 00:10:04,200 --> 00:10:11,733 data centers are an essential 357 00:10:05,633 --> 00:10:13,166 piece of it. And House Bill 593 358 00:10:10,300 --> 00:10:14,833 tried to address the issue of 359 00:10:11,733 --> 00:10:15,966 if data centers are going to 360 00:10:13,166 --> 00:10:17,900 come to Kentucky, we want to 361 00:10:14,833 --> 00:10:20,033 make sure that we've got the 362 00:10:15,966 --> 00:10:22,533 right guardrails in place to 363 00:10:17,900 --> 00:10:24,100 make sure that our energy 364 00:10:20,033 --> 00:10:25,600 prices don't go up. It provided 365 00:10:22,533 --> 00:10:27,600 three ways a data center could 366 00:10:24,100 --> 00:10:29,733 come in. They could bring their 367 00:10:25,600 --> 00:10:30,533 own generation, they could pay 368 00:10:27,600 --> 00:10:32,700 for it up front so that they're 369 00:10:29,733 --> 00:10:34,400 writing the check. They're the 370 00:10:30,533 --> 00:10:37,100 one taking the risk. Or they 371 00:10:32,700 --> 00:10:38,766 could purchase the power on the 372 00:10:34,400 --> 00:10:40,733 open market to where Kentucky 373 00:10:37,100 --> 00:10:42,000 ratepayers aren't taking the 374 00:10:38,766 --> 00:10:43,833 risk of investment. Because, 375 00:10:40,733 --> 00:10:45,166 you know, that's one of the 376 00:10:42,000 --> 00:10:46,333 biggest concerns we hear about 377 00:10:43,833 --> 00:10:50,666 data centers. People are scared 378 00:10:45,166 --> 00:10:51,766 to death that their electric 379 00:10:46,333 --> 00:10:53,166 bills are going to go up. So on 380 00:10:50,666 --> 00:10:55,033 February the 6th, we filed 381 00:10:51,766 --> 00:10:57,500 House Bill 593, worked on it 382 00:10:53,166 --> 00:10:59,966 for over a year. It passed out 383 00:10:55,033 --> 00:11:01,733 of committee unanimously on the 384 00:10:57,500 --> 00:11:04,666 26th, sent it to the Senate on 385

00:10:59,966 --> 00:11:06,066 the fourth. Actually, on the 386 00:11:01,733 --> 00:11:07,533 same day President Trump signed, 387 00:11:04,666 --> 00:11:08,733 had Big Tech signed the 388 00:11:06,066 --> 00:11:10,833 Ratepayer Protection Pledge, 389 00:11:07,533 --> 00:11:11,900 which pretty much worked hand 390 00:11:08,733 --> 00:11:14,066 in hand with what we were 391 00:11:10,833 --> 00:11:16,133 trying to accomplish in the 392 00:11:11,900 --> 00:11:18,333 House. Bill 593. It's just 393 00:11:14,066 --> 00:11:20,066 common sense, as far as I see 394 00:11:16,133 --> 00:11:21,600 it, that, you know, when big 395 00:11:18,333 --> 00:11:23,066 tech puts data center somewhere, 396 00:11:20,066 --> 00:11:24,466 we want to make sure that 397 00:11:21,600 --> 00:11:26,666 Kentuckians energy bills are 398 00:11:23,066 --> 00:11:27,733 going to be protected. 399 00:11:24,466 --> 00:11:29,500 >> So electric cooperatives in 400 00:11:26,666 --> 00:11:30,600 Kentucky were on board with 401 00:11:27,733 --> 00:11:32,733 your House Bill 593 that got 402 00:11:29,500 --> 00:11:34,166 absorbed into a Senate bill. I 403 00:11:30,600 --> 00:11:36,000 think it was 197. But, Mr. 404 00:11:32,733 --> 00:11:37,133 Bevington, I understand the 405 00:11:34,166 --> 00:11:38,533 LG&E and KU were somewhat 406 00:11:36,000 --> 00:11:41,066 critical of that measure. Can 407 00:11:37,133 --> 00:11:42,700 you tell us why you were 408 00:11:38,533 --> 00:11:45,033 opposed to Josh Bray measure? 409 00:11:41,066 --> 00:11:46,800 >> Well, I wouldn't say that we 410 00:11:42,700 --> 00:11:47,800 were critical. I actually think 411 00:11:45,033 --> 00:11:48,933 we, you know, applaud 412 00:11:46,800 --> 00:11:50,733 Representative Bray and the 413 00:11:47,800 --> 00:11:52,933 House's initiative to to look 414 00:11:48,933 --> 00:11:54,833 at ratepayer protection in the 415 00:11:50,733 --> 00:11:57,566 course of this. And that's we 416 00:11:52,933 --> 00:11:59,766 agree with that. It's frankly 417 00:11:54,833 --> 00:12:00,866 why we offered up in a rate 418 00:11:57,566 --> 00:12:03,000 review session that we had the 419 00:11:59,766 --> 00:12:05,233 extremely high load factor 420 00:12:00,866 --> 00:12:06,666 tariff offering where, you know, 421 00:12:03,000 --> 00:12:08,433 it is it is precisely for this 422 00:12:05,233 --> 00:12:10,166 this reason to protect all the 423 00:12:06,666 --> 00:12:10,866 rest of our customers, to 424 00:12:08,433 --> 00:12:13,766 prevent cost shifting from 425 00:12:10,166 --> 00:12:14,866 investments that we need to 426 00:12:10,866 --> 00:12:17,033 make in our system, cost 427 00:12:13,766 --> 00:12:18,833 shifting to residential 428 00:12:14,866 --> 00:12:21,033 customers. In that case, a few 429 00:12:17,033 --> 00:12:23,500 facts about that. And again, 430 00:12:18,833 --> 00:12:24,633 first of all, again, we agree 431 00:12:21,033 --> 00:12:26,366 and applaud that initiative. We 432 00:12:23,500 --> 00:12:27,866 just don't think there's a one 433 00:12:24,633 --> 00:12:29,666 size fits all approach. We have 434 00:12:26,366 --> 00:12:30,833 a very different operating 435 00:12:27,866 --> 00:12:32,633 model than East Kentucky Power, 436 00:12:29,666 --> 00:12:34,266 and a lot of the other 437 00:12:30,833 --> 00:12:36,866 utilities in the state. We're 438 00:12:32,633 --> 00:12:38,633 not part of a regional market 439 00:12:34,266 --> 00:12:39,666 of energy. We plan for and 440 00:12:36,866 --> 00:12:40,866 build for the needs of our 441 00:12:38,633 --> 00:12:42,600 customers now and into the 442 00:12:39,666 --> 00:12:43,166 future. So every three years, 443 00:12:40,866 --> 00:12:45,100 we go through what's called an 444 00:12:42,600 --> 00:12:46,200 integrated resource planning 445 00:12:43,166 --> 00:12:47,000 process, where we're looking at 446 00:12:45,100 --> 00:12:49,466 what is the adoption of 447 00:12:46,200 --> 00:12:50,700 electric vehicles look like? 448 00:12:47,000 --> 00:12:52,333 What is the adoption of data 449 00:12:49,466 --> 00:12:53,833 centers look like in Kentucky? 450 00:12:50,700 --> 00:12:55,600 You know, so, so we're planning 451 00:12:52,333 --> 00:12:56,766 for the system needs, and we've 452 00:12:53,833 --> 00:12:58,600 been doing that for 100 years. 453 00:12:55,600 --> 00:13:00,233 And we've been doing, you know, 454 00:12:56,766 --> 00:13:03,500 doing that very well for 100 455 00:12:58,600 --> 00:13:05,433 years. Frankly, if you look 456 00:13:00,233 --> 00:13:06,800 back at the 1920s when we built 457 00:13:03,500 --> 00:13:08,000 Ohio Falls, the thought process 458 00:13:05,433 --> 00:13:09,700 at that time was that that was 459 00:13:06,800 --> 00:13:11,900 going to generate enough power 460 00:13:08,000 --> 00:13:13,533 to supply the entire city of 461 00:13:09,700 --> 00:13:15,733 Louisville's energy needs today. 462 00:13:11,900 --> 00:13:17,500 The amount of capacity that 463 00:13:13,533 --> 00:13:18,933 that thing can put out is the 464 00:13:15,733 --> 00:13:20,033 equivalent to about 22,000 465 00:13:17,500 --> 00:13:21,866 homes. And so, you know, we've 466 00:13:18,933 --> 00:13:23,266 evolved as the world has 467 00:13:20,033 --> 00:13:25,433 evolved and as new large 468 00:13:21,866 --> 00:13:26,533 customers have come online with 469 00:13:23,266 --> 00:13:28,333 us, whether that be large auto 470 00:13:25,433 --> 00:13:30,133 automotive assembly plants or 471 00:13:26,533 --> 00:13:31,633 steel mills or what have you, 472 00:13:28,333 --> 00:13:33,333 we, we have an obligation to 473 00:13:30,133 --> 00:13:34,266 serve them and we've built to 474 00:13:31,633 --> 00:13:35,600 serve them. But we've also 475 00:13:33,333 --> 00:13:38,066 looked out for our customers 476 00:13:34,266 --> 00:13:39,166 and the way that we've offered 477 00:13:35,600 --> 00:13:40,200 tariff services and, and to 478 00:13:38,066 --> 00:13:42,000 prevent cost shifting to our 479 00:13:39,166 --> 00:13:43,533 residential customers. That's 480

00:13:40,200 --> 00:13:45,033 why we have one of the lowest 481 00:13:42,000 --> 00:13:46,100 electric rates in the nation, 482 00:13:43,533 --> 00:13:47,200 certainly in Kentucky, and why 483 00:13:45,033 --> 00:13:48,866 I think we've been an 484 00:13:46,100 --> 00:13:50,300 attractive place for economic 485 00:13:47,200 --> 00:13:52,433 development over that time span. 486 00:13:48,866 --> 00:13:53,533 So again, I wouldn't say that 487 00:13:50,300 --> 00:13:55,333 we were critical. We're right 488 00:13:52,433 --> 00:13:56,400 alongside. We just don't think 489 00:13:53,533 --> 00:13:58,033 there's a one size fits all 490 00:13:55,333 --> 00:13:59,200 approach, particularly when 491 00:13:56,400 --> 00:14:00,000 each of our operating companies 492 00:13:58,033 --> 00:14:03,233 does things a little bit 493 00:13:59,200 --> 00:14:04,333 differently. 494 00:14:00,000 --> 00:14:05,500 >> Mr. Gary was what 495 00:14:03,233 --> 00:14:06,833 Representative Bray had 496 00:14:04,333 --> 00:14:08,400 proposed good enough for you, 497 00:14:05,500 --> 00:14:09,733 and do you believe that even 498 00:14:06,833 --> 00:14:10,800 existing rules, if there are 499 00:14:08,400 --> 00:14:12,900 any existing rules, are tight 500 00:14:09,733 --> 00:14:14,766 enough? 501 00:14:10,800 --> 00:14:15,466 >> Sure. So I think that 502 00:14:12,900 --> 00:14:16,866 Representatives Bray 503 00:14:14,766 --> 00:14:18,033 Representative Bray proposed 504 00:14:15,466 --> 00:14:19,800 bill would have been a great 505 00:14:16,866 --> 00:14:21,566 first step. I think that that 506 00:14:18,033 --> 00:14:23,266 pledge to protect ratepayers is 507 00:14:19,800 --> 00:14:24,433 definitely important. I think 508 00:14:21,566 --> 00:14:26,633 the devil is really in the 509 00:14:23,266 --> 00:14:28,066 details and how that works out 510 00:14:24,433 --> 00:14:29,133 down the line to, for example, 511 00:14:26,633 --> 00:14:30,966 the the extremely high load 512 00:14:28,066 --> 00:14:32,400 factor tariff that Mr. 513 00:14:29,133 --> 00:14:33,866 Bevington mentioned. That's 514 00:14:30,966 --> 00:14:36,033 just one piece of making sure 515 00:14:32,400 --> 00:14:37,400 that existing ratepayers don't 516 00:14:33,866 --> 00:14:39,633 end up footing the bill for new 517 00:14:36,033 --> 00:14:41,866 infrastructure that's built. 518 00:14:37,400 --> 00:14:43,366 Right now, LG&E is constructing 519 00:14:39,633 --> 00:14:45,666 two new gas plants, buying into 520 00:14:41,866 --> 00:14:48,200 a new gas pipeline, building 521 00:14:43,366 --> 00:14:49,700 new transmission infrastructure. 522 00:14:45,666 --> 00:14:51,100 And unless they have those load 523 00:14:48,200 --> 00:14:52,533 forecasts right, unless they 524 00:14:49,700 --> 00:14:55,033 know exactly how many folks are 525 00:14:51,100 --> 00:14:56,866 going to end up taking service 526 00:14:52,533 --> 00:14:57,233 under that tariff, the rest of 527 00:14:55,033 --> 00:14:58,533 us could end up eating some of 528 00:14:56,866 --> 00:14:59,600 that. 529 00:14:57,233 --> 00:15:01,400 >> And if you will, because you 530 00:14:58,533 --> 00:15:03,266 mentioned some alphabets there 531 00:14:59,600 --> 00:15:03,466 or some letters, I want you to 532 00:15:01,400 --> 00:15:05,266 kind of give us the acronym 533 00:15:03,266 --> 00:15:06,333 there. 534 00:15:03,466 --> 00:15:07,500 >> E, h, l, f that extremely 535 00:15:05,266 --> 00:15:08,533 high load factor tariff, the 536 00:15:06,333 --> 00:15:10,266 one that Mr. Bevington was 537 00:15:07,500 --> 00:15:11,300 referring to that covers data 538 00:15:08,533 --> 00:15:12,666 centers. So having that tariff 539 00:15:10,266 --> 00:15:14,900 structured right is just one 540 00:15:11,300 --> 00:15:16,400 piece. I think there are some 541 00:15:12,666 --> 00:15:17,933 important protections in that 542 00:15:14,900 --> 00:15:21,333 tariff, but making sure that 543 00:15:16,400 --> 00:15:25,333 that load forecast is accurate 544 00:15:17,933 --> 00:15:27,100 is another piece. Making sure 545 00:15:21,333 --> 00:15:29,566 that we have the right way to 546 00:15:25,333 --> 00:15:31,766 serve them is another important 547 00:15:27,100 --> 00:15:33,633 piece of protecting ratepayers. 548 00:15:29,566 --> 00:15:35,766 You know, the elf has certain 549 00:15:31,766 --> 00:15:37,300 rates in place already and 550 00:15:33,633 --> 00:15:38,500 making sure that those 551 00:15:35,766 --> 00:15:39,833 incremental revenues to LG&E 552 00:15:37,300 --> 00:15:40,833 are sufficient to cover all 553 00:15:38,500 --> 00:15:42,033 those incremental costs for all 554 00:15:39,833 --> 00:15:43,866 that infrastructure I was 555 00:15:40,833 --> 00:15:45,700 mentioning is another another 556 00:15:42,033 --> 00:15:47,266 piece there. And making sure 557 00:15:43,866 --> 00:15:49,433 that we have that balance on 558 00:15:45,700 --> 00:15:51,600 both sides of the equation is a 559 00:15:47,266 --> 00:15:53,400 really tricky thing to do, I 560 00:15:49,433 --> 00:15:54,833 think. I applaud LG&E for 561 00:15:51,600 --> 00:15:56,033 taking that step step with rate 562 00:15:53,400 --> 00:15:58,433 e elf, but I still think there 563 00:15:54,833 --> 00:15:58,800 are important protections that 564 00:15:56,033 --> 00:15:59,900 we could see going down the 565 00:15:58,433 --> 00:16:01,066 line. 566 00:15:58,800 --> 00:16:02,933 >> And Representative Moore, 567 00:15:59,900 --> 00:16:04,233 you may agree with that. What 568 00:16:01,066 --> 00:16:05,933 would you like to see when it 569 00:16:02,933 --> 00:16:07,000 comes to data center regulation? 570 00:16:04,233 --> 00:16:07,966 >> Well, I was very much on 571 00:16:05,933 --> 00:16:09,633 board with Representative 572 00:16:07,000 --> 00:16:11,066 Bray's bill last year. And 573 00:16:07,966 --> 00:16:12,500 again, it was a great first 574 00:16:09,633 --> 00:16:14,166 step forward, as you were just 575 00:16:11,066 --> 00:16:15,233 saying, Byron. And I think we 576 00:16:12,500 -->

00:16:16,466 were coming at this from a 577 00:16:14,166 --> 00:16:17,633 logical perspective. We were 578 00:16:15,233 --> 00:16:19,333 seeing that utility rates were 579 00:16:16,466 --> 00:16:20,366 increasing and we already know 580 00:16:17,633 --> 00:16:21,600 how tight it is out there 581 00:16:19,333 --> 00:16:23,366 financially, economically, we 582 00:16:20,366 --> 00:16:24,533 want to save our constituents 583 00:16:21,600 --> 00:16:26,400 money if we can. We want to 584 00:16:23,366 --> 00:16:28,366 protect them if we can. And 585 00:16:24,533 --> 00:16:28,800 that's what Rep Bray and and I 586 00:16:26,400 --> 00:16:30,100 and others had tried to do with 587 00:16:28,366 --> 00:16:31,566 ratepayer protection 588 00:16:28,800 --> 00:16:32,833 legislation. And I think it 589 00:16:30,100 --> 00:16:34,666 makes sense from a logical 590 00:16:31,566 --> 00:16:35,766 perspective. Now, as time has 591 00:16:32,833 --> 00:16:36,866 gone on, as I look through 592 00:16:34,666 --> 00:16:38,766 things again through the rear 593 00:16:35,766 --> 00:16:40,666 view mirror, it seems to me 594 00:16:36,866 --> 00:16:41,833 that people want more than that 595 00:16:38,766 --> 00:16:44,166 because we heard it, I think in 596 00:16:40,666 --> 00:16:45,333 Toby Gibbs Toby Gibbs portion 597 00:16:41,833 --> 00:16:46,666 about the lack of transparency. 598 00:16:44,166 --> 00:16:48,466 There's this idea that when 599 00:16:45,333 --> 00:16:50,300 deals are being made behind 600 00:16:46,666 --> 00:16:52,100 closed doors, even if nothing 601 00:16:48,466 --> 00:16:54,166 nefarious is going on, it gives 602 00:16:50,300 --> 00:16:55,333 a presumption that maybe 603 00:16:52,100 --> 00:16:56,333 something is. And so as we got 604 00:16:54,166 --> 00:16:58,166 into this looking at ratepayer 605 00:16:55,333 --> 00:16:59,200 protection, it turns out that 606 00:16:56,333 --> 00:17:00,733 our constituents want more 607 00:16:58,166 --> 00:17:02,800 transparency. They want more 608 00:16:59,200 --> 00:17:04,000 local control. And as we look 609 00:17:00,733 --> 00:17:06,133 forward to 2027, I think that 610 00:17:02,800 --> 00:17:07,566 we as a legislature should take 611 00:17:04,000 --> 00:17:09,700 a more holistic view of rep 612 00:17:06,133 --> 00:17:11,166 Bray ratepayer protection, but 613 00:17:07,566 --> 00:17:12,200 also that transparency, that 614 00:17:09,700 --> 00:17:12,400 local control, that 615 00:17:12,466 --> 00:17:16,866 >> The nondisclosure agreements 616 00:17:13,666 --> 00:17:17,866 that we've read about that 617 00:17:15,500 --> 00:17:18,933 doesn't sit well with you. 618 00:17:16,866 --> 00:17:20,133 Perhaps at some county 619 00:17:17,866 --> 00:17:21,866 officials may have entered in. 620 00:17:18,933 --> 00:17:23,033 >> There are certain things 621 00:17:20,133 --> 00:17:24,100 that, of course, are going to 622 00:17:21,866 --> 00:17:25,066 be whether it's patent pending, 623 00:17:23,033 --> 00:17:26,866 if it's a unique rack 624 00:17:24,100 --> 00:17:28,033 configuration, but the amount 625 00:17:25,066 --> 00:17:29,966 of land that you need, the 626 00:17:26,866 --> 00:17:31,866 amount of water that you need, 627 00:17:28,033 --> 00:17:33,000 if there's going to be a heat 628 00:17:29,966 --> 00:17:34,866 plume, if there's going to be a 629 00:17:31,866 --> 00:17:35,866 noise that comes out of the 630 00:17:33,000 --> 00:17:36,966 center, I don't think you need 631 00:17:34,866 --> 00:17:38,000 to hide that information 632 00:17:35,866 --> 00:17:39,033 because that's not going to be 633 00:17:36,966 --> 00:17:40,900 industry secrets. That's 634 00:17:38,000 --> 00:17:42,066 something that the community 635 00:17:39,033 --> 00:17:43,866 that you want to be a part of, 636 00:17:40,900 --> 00:17:44,966 that you should be trying to 637 00:17:42,066 --> 00:17:46,833 cooperate with, they should be 638 00:17:43,866 --> 00:17:47,933 able to have access to that 639 00:17:44,966 --> 00:17:49,133 information. And I think if we 640 00:17:46,833 --> 00:17:50,866 start talking about those and 641 00:17:47,933 --> 00:17:52,000 get those out into the open, 642 00:17:49,133 --> 00:17:53,300 shine a little sunlight in 643 00:17:50,866 --> 00:17:54,866 there, then we're going to have 644 00:17:52,000 --> 00:17:55,866 a more cooperative relationship. 645 00:17:53,300 --> 00:17:57,100 When data centers do want to 646 00:17:54,866 --> 00:17:58,866 locate in our communities. 647 00:17:55,866 --> 00:17:59,333 >> So last week, I spoke with 648 00:17:57,100 --> 00:18:00,866 Eric King of the Energy 649 00:17:58,866 --> 00:18:02,000 Planning and Inventory 650 00:17:59,333 --> 00:18:03,000 Commission, or Epic as it's 651 00:18:00,866 --> 00:18:04,166 called for short. We talked 652 00:18:02,000 --> 00:18:06,033 about Epic's role in this 653 00:18:03,000 --> 00:18:07,066 debate. How many data centers 654 00:18:04,166 --> 00:18:09,233 are online and in the pipeline, 655 00:18:06,033 --> 00:18:10,900 and what policy discussions 656 00:18:07,066 --> 00:18:12,766 could lie ahead. Eric King, 657 00:18:09,233 --> 00:18:12,933 thank you so much for your time. 658 00:18:13,000 --> 00:18:17,366 >> So let's give our audience a 659 00:18:14,766 --> 00:18:18,800 primer on what is epic. Define 660 00:18:16,433 --> 00:18:20,266 that for us. 661 00:18:17,366 --> 00:18:24,233 >> Sure. Epic is the Energy 662 00:18:18,800 --> 00:18:25,333 Planning Inventory Commission. 663 00:18:20,266 --> 00:18:26,833 It was created in 2024 by our 664 00:18:24,233 --> 00:18:28,200 Kentucky legislature. Back then, 665 00:18:25,333 --> 00:18:29,666 you saw downward pressure on 666 00:18:26,833 --> 00:18:31,500 our coal fleet. There were 667 00:18:28,200 --> 00:18:33,566 questions about reliable and 668 00:18:29,666 --> 00:18:34,600 affordable electricity, the 669 00:18:31,500 --> 00:18:36,233 adequacy of our grid. You 670 00:18:33,566 --> 00:18:37,333 transition that we are seeing a 671 00:18:34,600 --> 00:18:39,266 demand, a surge

in demand, 672 00:18:36,233 --> 00:18:41,133 unlike we've ever seen before. 673 00:18:37,333 --> 00:18:42,166 I believe the Kentucky General 674 00:18:39,266 --> 00:18:43,600 Assembly knew then what we know 675 00:18:41,133 --> 00:18:45,033 today. In other words, they 676 00:18:42,166 --> 00:18:46,833 were seeing things around the 677 00:18:43,600 --> 00:18:48,000 corner about how our energy 678 00:18:45,033 --> 00:18:49,766 economy was changing and 679 00:18:46,833 --> 00:18:51,200 changing quickly. The coal 680 00:18:48,000 --> 00:18:52,866 fleet that I just mentioned has 681 00:18:49,766 --> 00:18:54,800 been needed now more than ever 682 00:18:51,200 --> 00:18:55,933 on the coldest days of the year 683 00:18:52,866 --> 00:18:57,733 and where we see now here in 684 00:18:54,800 --> 00:18:58,733 July, the hottest days of the 685 00:18:55,933 --> 00:18:59,800 year, that fleet is being 686 00:18:57,733 --> 00:19:01,000 called upon. So they've 687 00:18:58,733 --> 00:19:02,733 indicated in many ways in 688 00:18:59,800 --> 00:19:03,766 keeping a lot of those plants 689 00:19:01,000 --> 00:19:05,000 going and thriving for reliable 690 00:19:02,733 --> 00:19:06,800 and affordable power. But 691 00:19:03,766 --> 00:19:08,466 looking towards the future, I 692 00:19:05,000 --> 00:19:10,233 think that they made a very 693 00:19:06,800 --> 00:19:12,366 strategic move in creating good 694 00:19:08,466 --> 00:19:14,033 policy to create an energy 695 00:19:10,233 --> 00:19:16,700 planning function for our state. 696 00:19:12,366 --> 00:19:18,133 As you know, the complexities 697 00:19:14,033 --> 00:19:18,400 of our energy grid can't be 698 00:19:16,700 --> 00:19:19,500 overstated, particularly in 699 00:19:18,133 --> 00:19:21,233 Kentucky. 700 00:19:18,400 --> 00:19:22,133 >> And where it's really coming 701 00:19:19,500 --> 00:19:23,366 to bear is with all this 702 00:19:21,233 --> 00:19:25,133 conversation that's happening 703 00:19:22,133 --> 00:19:27,500 all across the state and indeed 704 00:19:23,366 --> 00:19:28,933 across the nation when it comes 705 00:19:25,133 --> 00:19:30,400 to hyperscale data centers, 706 00:19:27,500 --> 00:19:32,900 data centers have always been 707 00:19:28,933 --> 00:19:34,700 or been around for a long time. 708 00:19:30,400 --> 00:19:36,866 Right. But what makes 709 00:19:32,900 --> 00:19:37,966 hyperscale so much of a kind of 710 00:19:34,700 --> 00:19:38,733 a lightning rod term, and 711 00:19:36,866 --> 00:19:39,866 certainly caused a lot of 712 00:19:37,966 --> 00:19:41,500 conversation in cities and 713 00:19:38,733 --> 00:19:43,000 counties across the state. 714 00:19:39,866 --> 00:19:45,133 >> It certainly has, not only 715 00:19:41,500 --> 00:19:46,933 in Kentucky, but around the 716 00:19:43,000 --> 00:19:48,366 country, because energy has 717 00:19:45,133 --> 00:19:50,166 become synonymous with our 718 00:19:46,933 --> 00:19:51,266 national security. So our 719 00:19:48,366 --> 00:19:53,466 energy policy is in every 720 00:19:50,166 --> 00:19:54,533 discussion. It's the core of 721 00:19:51,266 --> 00:19:55,933 most discussions, not just in 722 00:19:53,466 --> 00:19:58,466 manufacturing, but also 723 00:19:54,533 --> 00:19:59,866 economic development and 724 00:19:55,933 --> 00:20:02,433 prosperity. So as you look at 725 00:19:58,466 --> 00:20:04,933 Hyperscaler, we can define that 726 00:19:59,866 --> 00:20:06,500 in many ways. But the standard 727 00:20:02,433 --> 00:20:08,533 is that it's anything over 728 00:20:04,933 --> 00:20:09,966 100MW as far as what we call 729 00:20:06,500 --> 00:20:14,233 power pool, or it's energy 730 00:20:08,533 --> 00:20:15,733 consumption. And typically 731 00:20:09,966 --> 00:20:18,266 around 12 or 10,000ft█!S. So 732 00:20:14,233 --> 00:20:20,433 you're talking about a space 733 00:20:15,733 --> 00:20:22,233 that's filled with chips that 734 00:20:18,266 --> 00:20:24,000 are communicating to their 735 00:20:20,433 --> 00:20:25,466 particular customer and 736 00:20:22,233 --> 00:20:26,900 supplying that data where it 737 00:20:24,000 --> 00:20:28,366 sends out and communicates for, 738 00:20:25,466 --> 00:20:30,466 for the purposes of that 739 00:20:26,900 --> 00:20:31,700 company. So our economy has 740 00:20:28,366 --> 00:20:33,033 really embraced this new 741 00:20:30,466 --> 00:20:34,766 innovation, but not just with 742 00:20:31,700 --> 00:20:36,633 AI. We can talk about other 743 00:20:33,033 --> 00:20:38,066 energy consumers, but it is 744 00:20:34,766 --> 00:20:40,000 certainly energy intensive, not 745 00:20:36,633 --> 00:20:41,700 just for the chips themselves, 746 00:20:38,066 --> 00:20:44,533 sometimes for the water that's 747 00:20:40,000 --> 00:20:46,000 being used to cool the chips 748 00:20:41,700 --> 00:20:47,066 off as they're functioning. But 749 00:20:44,533 --> 00:20:48,833 just to level set there, I 750 00:20:46,000 --> 00:20:49,233 guess that's how you would 751 00:20:47,066 --> 00:20:50,833 define more or less a 752 00:20:48,833 --> 00:20:52,433 hyperscaler. 753 00:20:49,233 --> 00:20:54,600 >> So what is it? The Kentucky 754 00:20:50,833 --> 00:20:56,800 General Assembly is looking to 755 00:20:52,433 --> 00:20:58,200 epic to do and to help them 756 00:20:54,600 --> 00:21:00,933 inform perhaps future policy. 757 00:20:56,800 --> 00:21:02,566 >> Absolutely. So I think, you 758 00:20:58,200 --> 00:21:03,966 know, it's one is to recognize 759 00:21:00,933 --> 00:21:05,766 that our energy system is 760 00:21:02,566 --> 00:21:07,233 complex. And I say complex, 761 00:21:03,966 --> 00:21:09,433 meaning that we're regulated 762 00:21:05,766 --> 00:21:11,033 State all of our utilities are 763 00:21:07,233 --> 00:21:12,733 vertically integrated. They are 764 00:21:09,433 --> 00:21:14,400 directed to serve territories 765 00:21:11,033 --> 00:21:16,600 that's assigned to them by law. 766 00:21:12,733 --> 00:21:19,366 So if you live in a particular 767 00:21:14,400 --> 00:21:20,933 territory, that

utility must 768 00:21:16,600 --> 00:21:22,400 serve you. So we're the 769 00:21:19,366 --> 00:21:23,866 territories are from east to 770 00:21:20,933 --> 00:21:25,933 west. So we're complicated in 771 00:21:22,400 --> 00:21:27,866 that the utilities serve for 772 00:21:23,866 --> 00:21:29,000 their systems at a fair, 773 00:21:25,933 --> 00:21:31,366 reasonable and just price as 774 00:21:27,866 --> 00:21:33,333 they adjudicate that through 775 00:21:29,000 --> 00:21:34,533 the Public Service Commission. 776 00:21:31,366 --> 00:21:36,766 But the PSC is the regulator. 777 00:21:33,333 --> 00:21:38,200 But there has not been a 778 00:21:34,533 --> 00:21:40,333 statewide view of energy 779 00:21:36,766 --> 00:21:42,166 adequacy across the entire 780 00:21:38,200 --> 00:21:43,200 state. So our directive is to 781 00:21:40,333 --> 00:21:44,766 come with this independent 782 00:21:42,166 --> 00:21:46,233 analysis. So we're not a 783 00:21:43,200 --> 00:21:47,666 utility. We're not the PSC, 784 00:21:44,766 --> 00:21:48,433 we're not the governor's office. 785 00:21:46,233 --> 00:21:50,033 >> And you're not for or 786 00:21:47,666 --> 00:21:51,833 against data centers. 787 00:21:48,433 --> 00:21:53,666 >> And we're not for or against 788 00:21:50,033 --> 00:21:55,133 any type of consumer. Those are 789 00:21:51,833 --> 00:21:56,966 local governmental decisions 790 00:21:53,666 --> 00:21:57,966 that will be made. But what 791 00:21:55,133 --> 00:21:59,066 we're doing is putting all the 792 00:21:56,966 --> 00:22:00,200 territories where the utilities 793 00:21:57,966 --> 00:22:02,200 have planned for their systems. 794 00:21:59,066 --> 00:22:04,100 They know their systems better 795 00:22:00,200 --> 00:22:05,500 than anyone. It's to put those 796 00:22:02,200 --> 00:22:07,700 pieces together and say, as a 797 00:22:04,100 --> 00:22:09,866 state, do we have enough 798 00:22:05,500 --> 00:22:11,766 adequate supply to meet the 799 00:22:07,700 --> 00:22:13,933 demands for the future? 800 00:22:09,866 --> 00:22:16,000 >> There are pluses and minuses 801 00:22:11,766 --> 00:22:17,433 of data centers. Can you spell 802 00:22:13,933 --> 00:22:18,933 out for us what are the 803 00:22:16,000 --> 00:22:20,666 benefits of these large 804 00:22:17,433 --> 00:22:21,000 hyperscale data centers, and 805 00:22:18,933 --> 00:22:22,666 what are the drawbacks or 806 00:22:20,666 --> 00:22:24,600 concerns? 807 00:22:21,000 --> 00:22:25,700 >> Sure. And I'll just hit it 808 00:22:22,666 --> 00:22:27,233 on again. Our our grid in 809 00:22:24,600 --> 00:22:28,933 Kentucky behaves like a system. 810 00:22:25,700 --> 00:22:29,833 Whatever happens in the East 811 00:22:27,233 --> 00:22:31,933 will invariably impact what's 812 00:22:28,933 --> 00:22:34,733 happening in central Kentucky 813 00:22:29,833 --> 00:22:36,833 and Western Kentucky. So there 814 00:22:31,933 --> 00:22:37,866 are many benefits to upgrading 815 00:22:34,733 --> 00:22:39,100 particular lines, updating 816 00:22:36,833 --> 00:22:40,833 infrastructure. You're going to 817 00:22:37,866 --> 00:22:41,900 hear a lot about the revenue. 818 00:22:39,100 --> 00:22:43,033 You're going to hear a lot 819 00:22:40,833 --> 00:22:44,833 about improvements to roads and 820 00:22:41,900 --> 00:22:45,933 bridges and schools and all the 821 00:22:43,033 --> 00:22:47,500 benefits on that side. But 822 00:22:44,833 --> 00:22:48,566 there are honest questions that 823 00:22:45,933 --> 00:22:50,300 people have. We've recently 824 00:22:47,500 --> 00:22:51,466 done a paper that observed 825 00:22:48,566 --> 00:22:53,400 these things in our state, and 826 00:22:50,300 --> 00:22:54,866 they deserve the confidence 827 00:22:51,466 --> 00:22:57,066 that if one of these users does, 828 00:22:53,400 --> 00:22:58,733 in fact, move forward. So the 829 00:22:54,866 --> 00:22:59,533 local officials, the county and 830 00:22:57,066 --> 00:23:01,000 the city have decided to move 831 00:22:58,733 --> 00:23:02,800 forward with something. 832 00:22:59,533 --> 00:23:03,533 Citizens deserve the confidence 833 00:23:01,000 --> 00:23:05,300 to know that we can have this 834 00:23:02,800 --> 00:23:06,733 economic development that 835 00:23:03,533 --> 00:23:08,533 brings those upgrades and new 836 00:23:05,300 --> 00:23:10,700 investments, but we can also 837 00:23:06,733 --> 00:23:12,133 maintain reliability and 838 00:23:08,533 --> 00:23:13,966 affordability and keep from all 839 00:23:10,700 --> 00:23:15,366 these spikes in prices. 840 00:23:12,133 --> 00:23:16,466 >> How many hyperscale data 841 00:23:13,966 --> 00:23:17,533 centers already exist in 842 00:23:15,366 --> 00:23:18,466 Kentucky, and how many do we 843 00:23:16,466 --> 00:23:20,066 know would like to. 844 00:23:17,533 --> 00:23:21,866 >> Be sure? 845 00:23:18,466 --> 00:23:23,066 >> We've done a recent analysis. 846 00:23:20,066 --> 00:23:25,100 There are a handful that that 847 00:23:21,866 --> 00:23:27,666 exist or I guess would meet 848 00:23:23,066 --> 00:23:29,033 that threshold, but there are 849 00:23:25,100 --> 00:23:30,500 around 35 technically in the 850 00:23:27,666 --> 00:23:31,566 pipeline, the public domain 851 00:23:29,033 --> 00:23:32,633 pipeline that we've seen. Again, 852 00:23:30,500 --> 00:23:33,566 you can find all this 853 00:23:31,566 --> 00:23:34,800 information out through the 854 00:23:32,633 --> 00:23:36,066 Public Service Commission where 855 00:23:33,566 --> 00:23:37,600 they've disclosed this 856 00:23:34,800 --> 00:23:39,866 information. But, you know, 857 00:23:36,066 --> 00:23:41,300 we're looking on the horizon in 858 00:23:37,600 --> 00:23:42,733 terms of trends. We've had 859 00:23:39,866 --> 00:23:44,466 affordable, reliable 860 00:23:41,300 --> 00:23:45,966 electricity as a whole, as a 861 00:23:42,733 --> 00:23:47,400 state that's allowed for our 862 00:23:44,466 --> 00:23:49,200 industrial base to prosper in 863 00:23:45,966 --> 00:23:51,400 Kentucky. We want to keep that 864

00:23:47,400 --> 00:23:52,433 advantage. So if a community 865 00:23:49,200 --> 00:23:53,933 wanted to cultivate a 866 00:23:51,400 --> 00:23:55,366 relationship with the data 867 00:23:52,433 --> 00:23:56,500 center and that community is 868 00:23:53,933 --> 00:23:57,566 accepting of it, we want to 869 00:23:55,366 --> 00:23:59,300 make sure that those rates 870 00:23:56,500 --> 00:23:59,633 remain the same. They are 871 00:23:57,566 --> 00:24:01,833 protected and that Kentucky can 872 00:23:59,300 --> 00:24:03,600 still compete. 873 00:23:59,633 --> 00:24:04,700 >> In that report really 874 00:24:01,833 --> 00:24:05,800 compares Kentucky's electric 875 00:24:03,600 --> 00:24:08,066 electricity regulatory 876 00:24:04,700 --> 00:24:09,766 environment with actions by two 877 00:24:05,800 --> 00:24:11,000 other states, particularly Ohio 878 00:24:08,066 --> 00:24:11,900 and Virginia, that have 879 00:24:09,766 --> 00:24:13,700 previously seen a surge of 880 00:24:11,000 --> 00:24:15,666 hyperscale data center 881 00:24:11,900 --> 00:24:17,300 development. Tell us about what 882 00:24:13,700 --> 00:24:19,133 both of those states are doing, 883 00:24:15,666 --> 00:24:19,500 right or wrong, and what 884 00:24:17,300 --> 00:24:21,300 Kentucky can glean from their 885 00:24:19,133 --> 00:24:23,166 experiences. 886 00:24:19,500 --> 00:24:25,233 >> Sure, we can learn a lot. I 887 00:24:21,300 --> 00:24:26,666 think Kentucky is in a position 888 00:24:23,166 --> 00:24:28,466 to where we can learn the 889 00:24:25,233 --> 00:24:31,333 mistakes done by other states. 890 00:24:26,666 --> 00:24:32,966 That's the purpose of planning. 891 00:24:28,466 --> 00:24:34,833 Planning is your ability not to 892 00:24:31,333 --> 00:24:36,366 foresee the future or predict 893 00:24:32,966 --> 00:24:38,533 it, but it is to eliminate, if 894 00:24:34,833 --> 00:24:39,966 not de-risk or lower the 895 00:24:36,366 --> 00:24:41,800 chances of mistakes. So we 896 00:24:38,533 --> 00:24:43,066 created what's called a meta 897 00:24:39,966 --> 00:24:44,633 analysis. Observations in other 898 00:24:41,800 --> 00:24:46,300 states of Virginia, which was 899 00:24:43,066 --> 00:24:47,900 the epicenter for data center 900 00:24:44,633 --> 00:24:50,766 right outside of DC. In that 901 00:24:46,300 --> 00:24:54,033 area they call data center 902 00:24:47,900 --> 00:24:55,100 alley. And so, you know, we we 903 00:24:50,766 --> 00:24:56,300 saw the potential spike in that 904 00:24:54,033 --> 00:24:57,700 state because of the 905 00:24:55,100 --> 00:24:58,700 concentration of data centers 906 00:24:56,300 --> 00:25:00,233 and how that materialized over 907 00:24:57,700 --> 00:25:01,933 time, what that meant for 908 00:24:58,700 --> 00:25:03,133 residents, what that meant for 909 00:25:00,233 --> 00:25:04,500 industry. And we saw lessons 910 00:25:01,933 --> 00:25:06,266 learned. So they had to react. 911 00:25:03,133 --> 00:25:07,700 Their legislature, they filed 912 00:25:04,500 --> 00:25:09,200 several bills that would combat 913 00:25:06,266 --> 00:25:10,000 and put some kind of 914 00:25:07,700 --> 00:25:12,033 placeholder to standardize the 915 00:25:09,200 --> 00:25:13,833 metrics for utilities to meet 916 00:25:10,000 --> 00:25:15,266 in order to protect ratepayers. 917 00:25:12,033 --> 00:25:17,100 We looked at Ohio that already 918 00:25:13,833 --> 00:25:18,300 had sort of a mechanism of 919 00:25:15,266 --> 00:25:19,966 protecting customers, how that 920 00:25:17,100 --> 00:25:21,100 worked, the durability of that 921 00:25:18,300 --> 00:25:22,266 over time. I think it's 922 00:25:19,966 --> 00:25:24,600 important to note many of those 923 00:25:21,100 --> 00:25:26,000 states and those states today 924 00:25:22,266 --> 00:25:29,033 are going back and revisiting 925 00:25:24,600 --> 00:25:30,566 the frameworks and policies 926 00:25:26,000 --> 00:25:32,466 that govern cost allocation and, 927 00:25:29,033 --> 00:25:34,300 and setting the rates in that 928 00:25:30,566 --> 00:25:35,100 state, because this is changing, 929 00:25:32,466 --> 00:25:36,500 accelerating so quickly. So 930 00:25:34,300 --> 00:25:37,600 Kentucky does have the 931 00:25:35,100 --> 00:25:38,433 advantage. And the report 932 00:25:36,500 --> 00:25:40,966 points out that's that's the 933 00:25:37,600 --> 00:25:42,233 advantage Kentucky has. We're 934 00:25:38,433 --> 00:25:43,933 not reacting to a crisis. We're 935 00:25:40,966 --> 00:25:44,933 seeing interest. We're at the 936 00:25:42,233 --> 00:25:46,200 beginning of the interest in 937 00:25:43,933 --> 00:25:47,300 data centers. So these 938 00:25:44,933 --> 00:25:48,466 conversations in Frankfort are 939 00:25:46,200 --> 00:25:49,366 happening at the highest level 940 00:25:47,300 --> 00:25:51,200 of our state government from 941 00:25:48,466 --> 00:25:52,266 our General Assembly. 942 00:25:49,366 --> 00:25:53,400 >> And that kind of leads to 943 00:25:51,200 --> 00:25:54,533 this next question about how 944 00:25:52,266 --> 00:25:55,933 some would say Kentucky is 945 00:25:53,400 --> 00:25:57,366 actually being reactive and not 946 00:25:54,533 --> 00:25:59,866 proactive, because these 947 00:25:55,933 --> 00:26:00,966 conversations are swelling 948 00:25:57,366 --> 00:26:02,100 across communities, and there's 949 00:25:59,866 --> 00:26:03,833 non-disclosure agreements that 950 00:26:00,966 --> 00:26:05,233 some county officials have 951 00:26:02,100 --> 00:26:07,133 taken some heat for, for being 952 00:26:03,833 --> 00:26:08,900 engaged in without getting 953 00:26:05,233 --> 00:26:10,366 community input. How do you see 954 00:26:07,133 --> 00:26:11,100 what's already happening in 955 00:26:08,900 --> 00:26:12,900 comparison to where you hope we 956 00:26:10,366 --> 00:26:13,766 can be? 957 00:26:11,100 --> 00:26:15,266 >> Well, I hope, I hope that 958 00:26:12,900 --> 00:26:16,500 folks will get the information 959 00:26:13,766 --> 00:26:18,533 that they're looking for. But 960

00:26:15,266 --> 00:26:20,433 more importantly, I think folks 961 00:26:16,500 --> 00:26:21,500 in Frankfort and our Senate and 962 00:26:18,533 --> 00:26:24,033 in our house, they are asking 963 00:26:20,433 --> 00:26:24,766 the right questions, which I 964 00:26:21,500 --> 00:26:26,400 think begins the process of 965 00:26:24,033 --> 00:26:27,600 understanding whether or not a 966 00:26:24,766 --> 00:26:28,700 community does or does not want 967 00:26:26,400 --> 00:26:30,466 these. Now you're going to have 968 00:26:27,600 --> 00:26:31,500 communities that say, we don't 969 00:26:28,700 --> 00:26:33,000 want these in our backyard, and 970 00:26:30,466 --> 00:26:34,433 that's perfectly fine. That's 971 00:26:31,500 --> 00:26:35,866 their prerogative. But there 972 00:26:33,000 --> 00:26:37,700 are county level officials and 973 00:26:34,433 --> 00:26:38,400 city level officials that are 974 00:26:35,866 --> 00:26:39,900 trying to understand this, but 975 00:26:37,700 --> 00:26:41,533 they're not alone because 976 00:26:38,400 --> 00:26:42,733 people around this country are 977 00:26:39,900 --> 00:26:43,866 are watching this acceleration 978 00:26:41,533 --> 00:26:45,600 of development and what that 979 00:26:42,733 --> 00:26:46,733 means for their economy, what 980 00:26:43,866 --> 00:26:47,533 that means for energy 981 00:26:45,600 --> 00:26:48,500 consumption and the energy 982 00:26:46,733 --> 00:26:50,300 system itself. 983 00:26:47,533 --> 00:26:51,333 >> And the environment. 984 00:26:48,500 --> 00:26:53,166 >> And the environment and the 985 00:26:50,300 --> 00:26:54,566 environment. But there's so 986 00:26:51,333 --> 00:26:56,400 many complexities to this 987 00:26:53,166 --> 00:26:58,200 problem that local officials 988 00:26:54,566 --> 00:27:00,000 are looking for questions to 989 00:26:56,400 --> 00:27:02,900 ask the developer, to ask the 990 00:26:58,200 --> 00:27:05,100 utility. How can they ensure 991 00:27:00,000 --> 00:27:06,333 that a 500 megawatt data center 992 00:27:02,900 --> 00:27:07,433 does not? That cost is not 993 00:27:05,100 --> 00:27:07,933 being borne on residents there. 994 00:27:06,333 --> 00:27:09,333 They deserve to have that 995 00:27:07,433 --> 00:27:10,500 confidence. 996 00:27:07,933 --> 00:27:11,566 >> Right. Well, thank you for 997 00:27:09,333 --> 00:27:12,333 your time. Is there anything 998 00:27:10,500 --> 00:27:13,600 else you'd like to share with 999 00:27:11,566 --> 00:27:15,433 us? 1000 00:27:12,333 --> 00:27:17,366 >> No, just that again, I think, 1001 00:27:13,600 --> 00:27:18,500 you know, data centers is the 1002 00:27:15,433 --> 00:27:20,366 topic of today. Epic is sort of 1003 00:27:17,366 --> 00:27:21,566 promoting this idea of energy 1004 00:27:18,500 --> 00:27:23,366 planning. We want to look at 15 1005 00:27:20,366 --> 00:27:23,900 to 20 years. I'll throw I'll 1006 00:27:21,566 --> 00:27:25,666 throw a technical term at you 1007 00:27:23,366 --> 00:27:27,566 called resource adequacy. 1008 00:27:23,900 --> 00:27:29,166 That's kind of the umbrella of 1009 00:27:25,666 --> 00:27:30,166 what we're trying to do at epic, 1010 00:27:27,566 --> 00:27:31,666 which is essentially managing 1011 00:27:29,166 --> 00:27:33,466 uncertainty in the energy 1012 00:27:30,166 --> 00:27:34,933 system. It's easy to ask that 1013 00:27:31,666 --> 00:27:37,133 question of how much demand 1014 00:27:33,466 --> 00:27:38,500 will we we need relative to 1015 00:27:34,933 --> 00:27:43,233 supply or vice versa. We're 1016 00:27:37,133 --> 00:27:44,166 getting we're getting an 1017 00:27:38,500 --> 00:27:45,266 analysis that's forecasting, 1018 00:27:43,233 --> 00:27:47,166 forecasting over 100 scenarios 1019 00:27:44,166 --> 00:27:49,033 about what that might look like 1020 00:27:45,266 --> 00:27:50,166 and how we plan for that as a 1021 00:27:47,166 --> 00:27:51,533 state, not just a territory, 1022 00:27:49,033 --> 00:27:53,100 but entire across the entire 1023 00:27:50,166 --> 00:27:54,300 120 counties in our state. So 1024 00:27:51,533 --> 00:27:56,033 that's our long term goal, is 1025 00:27:53,100 --> 00:27:57,166 to come up with an energy 1026 00:27:54,300 --> 00:27:58,133 strategy, an energy plan for 1027 00:27:56,033 --> 00:27:59,066 our state. And we're looking 1028 00:27:57,166 --> 00:28:01,233 forward to having those 1029 00:27:58,133 --> 00:28:02,266 discussions of getting 1030 00:27:59,066 --> 00:28:03,800 stakeholders together, but also 1031 00:28:01,233 --> 00:28:05,533 commenting on topical issues 1032 00:28:02,266 --> 00:28:07,366 like data centers. I know this 1033 00:28:03,800 --> 00:28:08,733 won't be the last time. I'm 1034 00:28:05,533 --> 00:28:09,866 sure we discuss this, but it's 1035 00:28:07,366 --> 00:28:10,833 very important we get this 1036 00:28:08,733 --> 00:28:12,000 right, and that's what I hope 1037 00:28:09,866 --> 00:28:13,800 people take away. 1038 00:28:10,833 --> 00:28:14,900 >> Well, Eric King, thank you 1039 00:28:12,000 --> 00:28:16,033 so much for helping us all 1040 00:28:13,800 --> 00:28:18,100 understand it a little bit 1041 00:28:14,900 --> 00:28:20,033 better. Thank you Renee. Thank 1042 00:28:16,033 --> 00:28:21,133 you, Mr. Bevington, I want to 1043 00:28:18,100 --> 00:28:22,133 come to you and ask, just kind 1044 00:28:20,033 --> 00:28:24,633 of taking off from that 1045 00:28:21,133 --> 00:28:26,066 conversation. Some people 1046 00:28:22,133 --> 00:28:27,500 wonder and question, will data 1047 00:28:24,633 --> 00:28:29,300 centers affect the electric 1048 00:28:26,066 --> 00:28:31,100 reliability for average 1049 00:28:27,500 --> 00:28:34,000 everyday consumers and their 1050 00:28:29,300 --> 00:28:36,533 homes? What say you about that? 1051 00:28:31,100 --> 00:28:38,000 >> Yeah, I would say no, that's 1052 00:28:34,000 --> 00:28:39,000 not the case. We are obligated, 1053 00:28:36,533 --> 00:28:41,166 as I said earlier, to serve our 1054 00:28:38,000 --> 00:28:42,633 customers and our customers 1055

00:28:39,000 --> 00:28:44,333 needs. And, you know, we're in 1056 00:28:41,166 --> 00:28:45,500 a fortunate position as a 1057 00:28:42,633 --> 00:28:47,300 supplier of energy to, you know, 1058 00:28:44,333 --> 00:28:48,266 not only data centers, but the 1059 00:28:45,500 --> 00:28:49,800 entire, you know, business 1060 00:28:47,300 --> 00:28:51,966 community in the Commonwealth. 1061 00:28:48,266 --> 00:28:53,600 And so anytime any kind of 1062 00:28:49,800 --> 00:28:54,933 business wants to show up, we 1063 00:28:51,966 --> 00:28:56,666 have to we have to go through 1064 00:28:53,600 --> 00:28:58,200 the typical long term long 1065 00:28:54,933 --> 00:28:59,533 range planning process. We look 1066 00:28:56,666 --> 00:29:00,233 at the infrastructure that we 1067 00:28:58,200 --> 00:29:01,366 have. We study that 1068 00:28:59,533 --> 00:29:03,133 infrastructure to make sure 1069 00:29:00,233 --> 00:29:04,133 that any new business that 1070 00:29:01,366 --> 00:29:05,666 wants to come and operate here 1071 00:29:03,133 --> 00:29:07,233 isn't going to negatively 1072 00:29:04,133 --> 00:29:08,900 affect everybody else. So, so 1073 00:29:05,666 --> 00:29:10,600 there are systems and processes 1074 00:29:07,233 --> 00:29:11,733 in place to make sure that that 1075 00:29:08,900 --> 00:29:13,933 doesn't happen. And as I said 1076 00:29:10,600 --> 00:29:15,033 earlier, that's why we take a 1077 00:29:11,733 --> 00:29:16,566 long term view of, of resource 1078 00:29:13,933 --> 00:29:18,733 adequacy as, as Eric just 1079 00:29:15,033 --> 00:29:19,933 mentioned in his video segment 1080 00:29:16,566 --> 00:29:21,633 with you. You know, another 1081 00:29:18,733 --> 00:29:22,900 thing that I think is important 1082 00:29:19,933 --> 00:29:24,600 to understand and why we're 1083 00:29:21,633 --> 00:29:25,800 trying to get ahead of this is 1084 00:29:22,900 --> 00:29:26,966 because we want to enable 1085 00:29:24,600 --> 00:29:28,700 economic growth in the 1086 00:29:25,800 --> 00:29:30,200 Commonwealth. As I said, we've 1087 00:29:26,966 --> 00:29:31,900 been doing that for 100 years. 1088 00:29:28,700 --> 00:29:33,400 It takes a long time to build a 1089 00:29:30,200 --> 00:29:34,200 new power plant, much longer 1090 00:29:31,900 --> 00:29:35,700 than it takes to build a 1091 00:29:33,400 --> 00:29:36,966 warehouse that's going to, you 1092 00:29:34,200 --> 00:29:38,733 know, house computer equipment 1093 00:29:35,700 --> 00:29:40,500 and things of that nature. And 1094 00:29:36,966 --> 00:29:42,033 so, again, we have to balance 1095 00:29:38,733 --> 00:29:42,966 the projections of what we 1096 00:29:40,500 --> 00:29:44,633 think will come based on 1097 00:29:42,033 --> 00:29:46,366 interest that we're seeing from 1098 00:29:42,966 --> 00:29:47,966 the business community. Plan 1099 00:29:44,633 --> 00:29:49,400 for that ahead and make sure 1100 00:29:46,366 --> 00:29:51,233 that that reliability and that 1101 00:29:47,966 --> 00:29:51,666 safety in our system continues 1102 00:29:49,400 --> 00:29:52,600 on for all the rest of our 1103 00:29:51,233 --> 00:29:53,900 existing customers. 1104 00:29:51,666 --> 00:29:54,366 >> Any comment about that 1105 00:29:52,600 --> 00:29:55,466 before I go? Yes. 1106 00:29:53,900 --> 00:29:57,866 Representative Moore. 1107 00:29:54,366 --> 00:29:58,966 >> Yes, because as you're 1108 00:29:55,466 --> 00:30:00,066 talking about adequacy load 1109 00:29:57,866 --> 00:30:01,633 forecasting, how much are we 1110 00:29:58,966 --> 00:30:03,000 going to need as we look 1111 00:30:00,066 --> 00:30:05,033 towards this future landscape 1112 00:30:01,633 --> 00:30:06,166 of more data centers and more 1113 00:30:03,000 --> 00:30:07,333 AI? During the video segment 1114 00:30:05,033 --> 00:30:09,433 and the interview, Eric was 1115 00:30:06,166 --> 00:30:11,166 talking about looking at Ohio 1116 00:30:07,333 --> 00:30:12,266 and using that as a resource to, 1117 00:30:09,433 --> 00:30:13,266 to look at and learn lessons 1118 00:30:11,166 --> 00:30:15,166 from. So we just had a 1119 00:30:12,266 --> 00:30:16,233 legislative conference about a 1120 00:30:13,266 --> 00:30:17,366 week ago, and I attended an 1121 00:30:15,166 --> 00:30:18,733 energy session there, and they 1122 00:30:16,233 --> 00:30:19,633 were talking about Ohio and 1123 00:30:17,366 --> 00:30:21,966 that the original load 1124 00:30:18,733 --> 00:30:23,866 forecasting was that the state 1125 00:30:19,633 --> 00:30:26,033 of Ohio was going to need 30GW 1126 00:30:21,966 --> 00:30:27,400 of new electric generation just 1127 00:30:23,866 --> 00:30:29,933 to meet data center need. And 1128 00:30:26,033 --> 00:30:32,033 that has come down, come down, 1129 00:30:27,400 --> 00:30:33,133 come down to 5.8GW. Essentially, 1130 00:30:29,933 --> 00:30:34,333 they've reduced it by 80%. So 1131 00:30:32,033 --> 00:30:35,666 that's why I worry about 1132 00:30:33,133 --> 00:30:37,433 rushing into certain things. If 1133 00:30:34,333 --> 00:30:38,933 they've had to reduce theirs by 1134 00:30:35,666 --> 00:30:40,666 80%, I would hate for us to 1135 00:30:37,433 --> 00:30:41,733 have to overbuild over permit 1136 00:30:38,933 --> 00:30:42,800 over site. And then now we're 1137 00:30:40,666 --> 00:30:43,866 left with these abandoned sites 1138 00:30:41,733 --> 00:30:44,866 that local communities have to 1139 00:30:42,800 --> 00:30:45,633 deal with afterwards. 1140 00:30:43,866 --> 00:30:46,833 >> Yeah. Are you concerned 1141 00:30:44,866 --> 00:30:47,800 about overbuilding? 1142 00:30:45,633 --> 00:30:49,333 >> I am concerned about 1143 00:30:46,833 --> 00:30:51,500 overbuilding. I think there are 1144 00:30:47,800 --> 00:30:52,533 other concerns around this as 1145 00:30:49,333 --> 00:30:54,300 well, aside from resource 1146 00:30:51,500 --> 00:30:55,800 adequacy. One of the concerns 1147 00:30:52,533 --> 00:30:58,333 that other areas that have had 1148 00:30:54,300 --> 00:31:00,133 data center buildout concerned 1149

00:30:55,800 --> 00:31:01,733 about is just the voltage 1150 00:30:58,333 --> 00:31:03,266 regulation. These are a 1151 00:31:00,133 --> 00:31:04,933 completely new sort of load on 1152 00:31:01,733 --> 00:31:06,633 the system. They can come on 1153 00:31:03,266 --> 00:31:07,833 and off within seconds, and 1154 00:31:04,933 --> 00:31:09,733 that can cause problems with 1155 00:31:06,633 --> 00:31:10,800 flicker and other issues on the 1156 00:31:07,833 --> 00:31:12,466 grid. This isn't to say LG&E 1157 00:31:09,733 --> 00:31:15,600 hasn't accounted for that, but 1158 00:31:10,800 --> 00:31:16,733 there are there every angle of 1159 00:31:12,466 --> 00:31:18,133 this, more complexities, but 1160 00:31:15,600 --> 00:31:19,600 specifically with resource 1161 00:31:16,733 --> 00:31:22,066 adequacy, I think, and that 1162 00:31:18,133 --> 00:31:23,033 sort of voltage regulation and 1163 00:31:19,600 --> 00:31:24,666 other issues, one way for data 1164 00:31:22,066 --> 00:31:27,500 centers to actually contribute 1165 00:31:23,033 --> 00:31:29,633 to reliability of the grid is 1166 00:31:24,666 --> 00:31:31,433 to contemplate what we call 1167 00:31:27,500 --> 00:31:33,600 demand response, so that when 1168 00:31:29,633 --> 00:31:35,366 the grid is stressed, we know 1169 00:31:31,433 --> 00:31:37,066 who is available to turn off, 1170 00:31:33,600 --> 00:31:39,333 who can lower their need on the 1171 00:31:35,366 --> 00:31:40,800 system so that the system can 1172 00:31:37,066 --> 00:31:41,966 make up that that resource 1173 00:31:39,333 --> 00:31:43,700 adequacy for everybody else. 1174 00:31:40,800 --> 00:31:45,166 And that's something we have 1175 00:31:41,966 --> 00:31:47,266 seen in some areas. It's 1176 00:31:43,700 --> 00:31:48,933 something that is contemplated 1177 00:31:45,166 --> 00:31:50,266 in the contract for the Tarawa 1178 00:31:47,266 --> 00:31:52,000 facility in Hancock County that 1179 00:31:48,933 --> 00:31:53,800 was mentioned earlier. When 1180 00:31:50,266 --> 00:31:54,866 there is an emergency on the 1181 00:31:52,000 --> 00:31:56,666 grid, that's that's one 1182 00:31:53,800 --> 00:31:58,066 situation where that facility 1183 00:31:54,866 --> 00:31:59,200 would be required to turn off 1184 00:31:56,666 --> 00:32:01,666 potentially. So there's a lot 1185 00:31:58,066 --> 00:32:03,500 of complexity and other ways to 1186 00:31:59,200 --> 00:32:06,066 look at this and perhaps not 1187 00:32:01,666 --> 00:32:07,100 need to overbuild quite as much 1188 00:32:03,500 --> 00:32:08,466 new fossil fuel infrastructure. 1189 00:32:06,066 --> 00:32:10,433 >> So there are some questions 1190 00:32:07,100 --> 00:32:11,600 from some viewers that we want 1191 00:32:08,466 --> 00:32:13,366 to get to, and then we can go 1192 00:32:10,433 --> 00:32:14,466 back to some of your other 1193 00:32:11,600 --> 00:32:15,700 thoughts. This is from Martin 1194 00:32:13,366 --> 00:32:17,566 Rivers from Lexington. He asks, 1195 00:32:14,466 --> 00:32:18,633 quote, what do your guests have 1196 00:32:15,700 --> 00:32:20,366 to say about positive use of AI 1197 00:32:17,566 --> 00:32:22,233 data centers? The need for 1198 00:32:18,633 --> 00:32:24,066 updating our power grid, with 1199 00:32:20,366 --> 00:32:26,933 or without data centers and 1200 00:32:22,233 --> 00:32:29,033 national security issues 1201 00:32:24,066 --> 00:32:32,700 related to China. 1202 00:32:26,933 --> 00:32:35,533 >> This is the biggest national 1203 00:32:29,033 --> 00:32:38,766 security issue of my generation, 1204 00:32:32,700 --> 00:32:40,600 for sure, because a lot of what 1205 00:32:35,533 --> 00:32:43,066 we're seeing online now, a lot 1206 00:32:38,766 --> 00:32:46,333 of the negative discourse, I 1207 00:32:40,600 --> 00:32:47,766 feel like and Chairman Guthrie 1208 00:32:43,066 --> 00:32:51,400 in the House feels the same in. 1209 00:32:46,333 --> 00:32:53,166 >> In Washington House. 1210 00:32:47,766 --> 00:32:54,466 >> Yes, yes, in, in DC is a lot 1211 00:32:51,400 --> 00:32:55,700 of the disinformation. A lot of 1212 00:32:53,166 --> 00:32:56,833 the things we're seeing is 1213 00:32:54,466 --> 00:33:00,000 coming directly from the 1214 00:32:55,700 --> 00:33:01,866 Chinese because we are in a 1215 00:32:56,833 --> 00:33:03,466 race with China. And the 1216 00:33:00,000 --> 00:33:06,500 question right now is, is who 1217 00:33:01,866 --> 00:33:09,033 do we want to control the 1218 00:33:03,466 --> 00:33:12,700 future of AI? Do it America or 1219 00:33:06,500 --> 00:33:14,733 the Chinese? And, you know, 1220 00:33:09,033 --> 00:33:16,933 it's unfortunate that it's kind 1221 00:33:12,700 --> 00:33:18,733 of got to that point, but the 1222 00:33:14,733 --> 00:33:21,633 stakes are so high because of 1223 00:33:16,933 --> 00:33:24,000 this is going to be the next 1224 00:33:18,733 --> 00:33:25,600 industrial revolution. When you 1225 00:33:21,633 --> 00:33:29,933 look at just quantum computing, 1226 00:33:24,000 --> 00:33:31,700 what that's going to mean with 1227 00:33:25,600 --> 00:33:33,166 AI. If the Chinese beat us 1228 00:33:29,933 --> 00:33:35,133 there, it's a scary landscape 1229 00:33:31,700 --> 00:33:37,100 when we look at, you know, 1230 00:33:33,166 --> 00:33:39,466 trying to onshore manufacturing 1231 00:33:35,133 --> 00:33:42,466 back in the United States, it's 1232 00:33:37,100 --> 00:33:45,366 going to take AI and automation 1233 00:33:39,466 --> 00:33:46,566 to do that there. This is the 1234 00:33:42,466 --> 00:33:48,633 future of our economy, but 1235 00:33:45,366 --> 00:33:50,400 we've got to have good things 1236 00:33:46,566 --> 00:33:52,900 in place. We've got to make 1237 00:33:48,633 --> 00:33:55,033 sure that we don't Overbuild 1238 00:33:50,400 --> 00:33:57,266 one of my biggest concerns is 1239 00:33:52,900 --> 00:33:59,366 what happens when, you know, 1240 00:33:55,033 --> 00:34:00,733 chip capacity or chip 1241 00:33:57,266 --> 00:34:03,733 efficiency improves, and all of 1242 00:33:59,366

--> 00:34:05,533 a sudden, a gigawatt facility 1243 00:34:00,733 --> 00:34:07,733 only needs 500MW. That's why I 1244 00:34:03,733 --> 00:34:09,833 really like the idea of these 1245 00:34:05,533 --> 00:34:11,900 data centers pre-paying for, 1246 00:34:07,733 --> 00:34:13,666 for their generation. If if 1247 00:34:09,833 --> 00:34:14,733 we've got improved transmission, 1248 00:34:11,900 --> 00:34:15,933 let them pay for it, you know, 1249 00:34:13,666 --> 00:34:17,666 and they've all signed the 1250 00:34:14,733 --> 00:34:19,600 pledge. When I talk with the 1251 00:34:15,933 --> 00:34:21,066 big tech companies that we 1252 00:34:17,666 --> 00:34:23,200 think of the fortune 50 1253 00:34:19,600 --> 00:34:25,033 companies, they all say we want 1254 00:34:21,066 --> 00:34:26,400 to pay for pay for this upfront. 1255 00:34:23,200 --> 00:34:28,266 So it's kind of crazy that, you 1256 00:34:25,033 --> 00:34:29,600 know, the tech companies that 1257 00:34:26,400 --> 00:34:30,833 you kind of envision, you know, 1258 00:34:28,266 --> 00:34:32,200 that you would want Kentucky to 1259 00:34:29,600 --> 00:34:34,266 do business with when they're 1260 00:34:30,833 --> 00:34:35,933 offering to pay for this 1261 00:34:32,200 --> 00:34:38,333 upfront that we wouldn't do 1262 00:34:34,266 --> 00:34:39,733 that is is kind of crazy. 1263 00:34:35,933 --> 00:34:40,900 >> You know, that does seem 1264 00:34:38,333 --> 00:34:42,633 kind of like a no brainer. Why 1265 00:34:39,733 --> 00:34:42,866 wouldn't you just go along with 1266 00:34:40,900 --> 00:34:44,666 that since they're agreeing to 1267 00:34:42,633 --> 00:34:45,733 pay it? 1268 00:34:42,866 --> 00:34:47,700 >> And that's part of putting 1269 00:34:44,666 --> 00:34:48,866 that into statute, because it's 1270 00:34:45,733 --> 00:34:50,700 one thing to have a smile on a 1271 00:34:47,700 --> 00:34:51,866 handshake and say we've made a 1272 00:34:48,866 --> 00:34:53,633 deal, but by putting it in 1273 00:34:50,700 --> 00:34:54,833 statute, can we actually put 1274 00:34:51,866 --> 00:34:56,700 some teeth in there so that 1275 00:34:53,633 --> 00:34:57,900 when a data center looks to a 1276 00:34:54,833 --> 00:34:59,700 community and says, we want to 1277 00:34:56,700 --> 00:35:01,633 build here, the community knows 1278 00:34:57,900 --> 00:35:02,733 it is in statute, it is in 1279 00:34:59,700 --> 00:35:03,933 state law that it's going to be 1280 00:35:01,633 --> 00:35:05,666 done within that framework, and 1281 00:35:02,733 --> 00:35:06,833 it's not based on a handshake 1282 00:35:03,933 --> 00:35:07,066 agreement that someone has made 1283 00:35:05,666 --> 00:35:08,766 with a fortune 50 company. 1284 00:35:06,833 --> 00:35:10,000 >> Yeah. 1285 00:35:07,066 --> 00:35:11,733 >> Renee, if I could, if I 1286 00:35:08,766 --> 00:35:12,833 could, just because the caller 1287 00:35:10,000 --> 00:35:13,900 asked about, you know, what do 1288 00:35:11,733 --> 00:35:14,933 these things bring? What are 1289 00:35:12,833 --> 00:35:16,733 some of the positive 1290 00:35:13,900 --> 00:35:17,733 developments of this? And since 1291 00:35:14,933 --> 00:35:18,700 we were talking about sort of, 1292 00:35:16,733 --> 00:35:19,900 you know, paying for 1293 00:35:17,733 --> 00:35:21,633 infrastructure up front and 1294 00:35:18,700 --> 00:35:22,700 things of that nature, I think 1295 00:35:19,900 --> 00:35:24,033 it's important for, you know, 1296 00:35:21,633 --> 00:35:24,800 LG&E and KU customers to 1297 00:35:22,700 --> 00:35:26,166 understand that with this 1298 00:35:24,033 --> 00:35:27,633 extremely high load factor 1299 00:35:24,800 --> 00:35:28,800 tariff that we talked about 1300 00:35:26,166 --> 00:35:30,700 earlier, they need to hear some 1301 00:35:27,633 --> 00:35:31,933 of the details about it. So I 1302 00:35:28,800 --> 00:35:33,700 think it's kind of important to 1303 00:35:30,700 --> 00:35:35,166 lay that out. What what that 1304 00:35:31,933 --> 00:35:36,966 tariff requires our data center 1305 00:35:33,700 --> 00:35:38,766 customers to do is sign a 15 1306 00:35:35,166 --> 00:35:40,200 year contract. That's the first 1307 00:35:36,966 --> 00:35:42,366 case, right? So a normal 1308 00:35:38,766 --> 00:35:43,500 everyday retail customer of 1309 00:35:40,200 --> 00:35:45,366 ours, they don't have to make a 1310 00:35:42,366 --> 00:35:46,533 commitment more than a year or 1311 00:35:43,500 --> 00:35:49,233 two in the largest case. Now 1312 00:35:45,366 --> 00:35:51,033 we're asking for them to commit 1313 00:35:46,533 --> 00:35:53,000 to a 15 year contract. If they 1314 00:35:49,233 --> 00:35:54,600 break that contract early, they 1315 00:35:51,033 --> 00:35:57,433 have to pay an exit fee that is 1316 00:35:53,000 --> 00:35:58,566 equal to the amount of 1317 00:35:54,600 --> 00:36:00,400 remaining bills that they have 1318 00:35:57,433 --> 00:36:01,633 for the remainder of that 15 1319 00:35:58,566 --> 00:36:02,766 year term. There's also a 1320 00:36:00,400 --> 00:36:04,633 component of that high load 1321 00:36:01,633 --> 00:36:05,733 factor tariff that asks them to 1322 00:36:02,766 --> 00:36:07,633 pay for 80% of what they 1323 00:36:04,633 --> 00:36:08,633 project they're going to use, 1324 00:36:05,733 --> 00:36:09,666 whether they use it or not. So 1325 00:36:07,633 --> 00:36:11,900 we agree with what 1326 00:36:08,633 --> 00:36:14,400 Representative Bray just said. 1327 00:36:09,666 --> 00:36:15,833 You know, if if chip efficiency 1328 00:36:11,900 --> 00:36:17,033 happens and maybe they can do 1329 00:36:14,400 --> 00:36:18,600 more compute within those 1330 00:36:15,833 --> 00:36:20,600 buildings than if that's to be 1331 00:36:17,033 --> 00:36:21,733 the case. But again, regardless, 1332 00:36:18,600 --> 00:36:22,866 they have to pay us 80% of what 1333 00:36:20,600 --> 00:36:24,833 they say they're going to use 1334 00:36:21,733 --> 00:36:26,266 regardless. And the last really 1335 00:36:22,866 --> 00:36:28,433 important piece is

that tariff 1336 00:36:24,833 --> 00:36:30,966 asks these data centers to give 1337 00:36:26,266 --> 00:36:32,400 us up to a year, and in some 1338 00:36:28,433 --> 00:36:34,566 cases, two years worth of 1339 00:36:30,966 --> 00:36:36,366 billing to ensure that if they 1340 00:36:32,400 --> 00:36:37,433 happen to go away, we have a a 1341 00:36:34,566 --> 00:36:39,066 fund that will pay for what we 1342 00:36:36,366 --> 00:36:40,300 thought we were going to get. 1343 00:36:37,433 --> 00:36:41,400 And again, I think it's also 1344 00:36:39,066 --> 00:36:42,500 really important for customers 1345 00:36:40,300 --> 00:36:44,000 to understand, and this is the 1346 00:36:41,400 --> 00:36:45,166 complexity of the energy 1347 00:36:42,500 --> 00:36:47,000 business that is really hard 1348 00:36:44,000 --> 00:36:48,233 for a lot of people to 1349 00:36:45,166 --> 00:36:50,000 understand, and I get it. But 1350 00:36:47,000 --> 00:36:51,166 to boil it down in my eighth 1351 00:36:48,233 --> 00:36:53,000 grade math teacher would be 1352 00:36:50,000 --> 00:36:54,000 really proud of me right now 1353 00:36:51,166 --> 00:36:55,166 because I'm going to talk a 1354 00:36:53,000 --> 00:36:57,100 division equation here to 1355 00:36:54,000 --> 00:36:59,333 simplify things enough. If you 1356 00:36:55,166 --> 00:37:00,866 just look at at a math equation, 1357 00:36:57,100 --> 00:37:02,033 the numerator being the cost to 1358 00:36:59,333 --> 00:37:04,833 run the system and the 1359 00:37:00,866 --> 00:37:06,033 denominator being the revenue 1360 00:37:02,033 --> 00:37:07,133 that the system operates with, 1361 00:37:04,833 --> 00:37:09,133 right? Anytime the numerator 1362 00:37:06,033 --> 00:37:11,266 goes up and the denominator 1363 00:37:07,133 --> 00:37:12,733 does not, rates are going up 1364 00:37:09,133 --> 00:37:13,900 higher in this case. And to the 1365 00:37:11,266 --> 00:37:16,400 caller's question, what do 1366 00:37:12,733 --> 00:37:17,500 these things bring? They bring 1367 00:37:13,900 --> 00:37:18,866 an extremely high amount of 1368 00:37:16,400 --> 00:37:20,666 revenue that benefits the rest 1369 00:37:17,500 --> 00:37:22,500 of the system and actually 1370 00:37:18,866 --> 00:37:23,900 could, in the case of LG&E and 1371 00:37:20,666 --> 00:37:25,733 KU, put downward pressure on 1372 00:37:22,500 --> 00:37:27,166 rates for residential customers 1373 00:37:23,900 --> 00:37:28,900 as time goes on. So I think 1374 00:37:25,733 --> 00:37:29,933 there's some complexity in that. 1375 00:37:27,166 --> 00:37:31,166 And a lot of people don't 1376 00:37:28,900 --> 00:37:32,200 understand that when they're 1377 00:37:29,933 --> 00:37:33,800 behind the screen and they're 1378 00:37:31,166 --> 00:37:34,933 searching social media about 1379 00:37:32,200 --> 00:37:35,866 these things. But I think those 1380 00:37:33,800 --> 00:37:37,033 are some very important factors 1381 00:37:34,933 --> 00:37:38,033 that customers need to 1382 00:37:35,866 --> 00:37:39,166

understand in the grand scheme 1383 00:37:37,033 --> 00:37:39,900 of this conversation. 1384 00:37:38,033 --> 00:37:41,800 >> Are you satisfied with that, 1385 00:37:39,166 --> 00:37:42,900 Mr. Gary? 1386 00:37:39,900 --> 00:37:44,400 >> Well, I think the point that 1387 00:37:41,800 --> 00:37:46,533 still needs to be made, 1388 00:37:42,900 --> 00:37:47,966 returning to the beginning 1389 00:37:44,400 --> 00:37:49,800 statement that I made, the load 1390 00:37:46,533 --> 00:37:51,666 forecast accuracy really 1391 00:37:47,966 --> 00:37:53,066 matters. LG&E already has 1392 00:37:49,800 --> 00:37:53,933 approval to build roughly $3 1393 00:37:51,666 --> 00:37:55,766 billion worth of new 1394 00:37:53,066 --> 00:37:57,400 infrastructure, not to mention 1395 00:37:53,933 --> 00:37:59,433 the fuel costs, the pipeline 1396 00:37:55,766 --> 00:38:00,666 costs, the transmission costs, 1397 00:37:57,400 --> 00:38:02,700 etc. but to my knowledge, don't 1398 00:37:59,433 --> 00:38:03,866 have any of those contracts 1399 00:38:00,666 --> 00:38:05,766 signed yet. That's not to say 1400 00:38:02,700 --> 00:38:06,933 they won't, and that could end 1401 00:38:03,866 --> 00:38:08,666 up paying for it. But there is 1402 00:38:05,766 --> 00:38:09,966 still real concern that if they 1403 00:38:06,933 --> 00:38:11,766 don't materialize, or if they 1404 00:38:08,666 --> 00:38:12,966 do materialize and go bankrupt, 1405 00:38:09,966 --> 00:38:14,700 and all we have is that 1 or 2 1406 00:38:11,766 --> 00:38:17,133 years of security, that it 1407 00:38:12,966 --> 00:38:20,033 might still not be potentially 1408 00:38:14,700 --> 00:38:21,033 enough to, to protect the rest 1409 00:38:17,133 --> 00:38:22,100 of us. So I think as 1410 00:38:20,033 --> 00:38:24,066 Representative Bray and Moore 1411 00:38:21,033 --> 00:38:25,233 said, it's really important to 1412 00:38:22,100 --> 00:38:27,066 get out ahead of this. And I 1413 00:38:24,066 --> 00:38:28,133 think that's sort of what Mr. 1414 00:38:25,233 --> 00:38:29,433 King was referring to as well, 1415 00:38:27,066 --> 00:38:30,500 making sure that there is 1416 00:38:28,133 --> 00:38:32,366 adequate regulation in place. 1417 00:38:29,433 --> 00:38:34,100 And that's important not only 1418 00:38:30,500 --> 00:38:35,666 for the electric system, but 1419 00:38:32,366 --> 00:38:36,933 there was talk about NDAs and 1420 00:38:34,100 --> 00:38:38,400 local impacts earlier, making 1421 00:38:35,666 --> 00:38:40,200 sure that communities are 1422 00:38:36,933 --> 00:38:41,966 prepared before they get that 1423 00:38:38,400 --> 00:38:43,766 proposal from a, you know, 1424 00:38:40,200 --> 00:38:45,333 multibillion dollar company, 1425 00:38:41,966 --> 00:38:47,033 make sure that they have local 1426 00:38:43,766 --> 00:38:48,133 planning and zoning or, you 1427 00:38:45,333 --> 00:38:50,066 know, whatever regulations in 1428 00:38:47,033 --> 00:38:51,100 place. We have a model 1429 00:38:48,133 --> 00:38:53,066 ordinance for both counties 1430 00:38:50,066 --> 00:38:54,966 with planning and zoning and 1431 00:38:51,100 --> 00:38:56,866 home rule counties to make sure 1432 00:38:53,066 --> 00:38:58,900 that those new facilities are 1433 00:38:54,966 --> 00:39:00,600 adequately regulated to get out 1434 00:38:56,866 --> 00:39:01,833 ahead of that before, before a 1435 00:38:58,900 --> 00:39:02,433 facility comes in and nobody's 1436 00:39:00,600 --> 00:39:04,700 heard of it and it's already 1437 00:39:01,833 --> 00:39:06,500 approved. 1438 00:39:02,433 --> 00:39:08,533 >> Yeah. So similarly, this 1439 00:39:04,700 --> 00:39:09,900 viewer has this comment and 1440 00:39:06,500 --> 00:39:11,200 question quote. I never heard 1441 00:39:08,533 --> 00:39:13,066 anyone talk about the baseload 1442 00:39:09,900 --> 00:39:15,466 for electricity required by 1443 00:39:11,200 --> 00:39:17,300 data centers. And would this 1444 00:39:13,066 --> 00:39:18,733 not protect other ratepayers? 1445 00:39:15,466 --> 00:39:20,500 No one ever mentions what local, 1446 00:39:17,300 --> 00:39:22,333 state or federal taxes that 1447 00:39:18,733 --> 00:39:24,500 might be generated by data 1448 00:39:20,500 --> 00:39:26,300 centers on an ongoing basis, 1449 00:39:22,333 --> 00:39:26,766 not just the construction phase. 1450 00:39:24,500 --> 00:39:27,733 So can we answer that? 1451 00:39:26,300 --> 00:39:28,700 Representative Moore. 1452 00:39:26,766 --> 00:39:29,933 >> Let's then let's be 1453 00:39:27,733 --> 00:39:31,666 transparent. And instead of 1454 00:39:28,700 --> 00:39:32,900 them coming in and having a 1455 00:39:29,933 --> 00:39:34,933 predatory nature of people with 1456 00:39:31,666 --> 00:39:36,100 NDAs coming into a community, 1457 00:39:32,900 --> 00:39:38,066 let's be open with it where the 1458 00:39:34,933 --> 00:39:39,933 customer wants to come in and 1459 00:39:36,100 --> 00:39:41,066 say, I would like to put a data 1460 00:39:38,066 --> 00:39:43,200 center here, and these are your 1461 00:39:39,933 --> 00:39:45,000 benefits. So Kentucky right now 1462 00:39:41,066 --> 00:39:46,200 they have a nuclear or nuclear 1463 00:39:43,200 --> 00:39:47,966 ready energy program where 1464 00:39:45,000 --> 00:39:49,166 essentially communities can say, 1465 00:39:46,200 --> 00:39:51,133 we want to be there on the cusp 1466 00:39:47,966 --> 00:39:52,200 when we start bringing nuclear 1467 00:39:49,166 --> 00:39:53,633 power into Kentucky. Now, what 1468 00:39:51,133 --> 00:39:55,200 that means is you require 1469 00:39:52,200 --> 00:39:56,900 public education, public 1470 00:39:53,633 --> 00:39:58,733 hearings, a local vote. Could 1471 00:39:55,200 --> 00:39:59,666 we apply something like that to 1472 00:39:56,900 --> 00:40:01,233 hyperscale data centers so that 1473 00:39:58,733 --> 00:40:02,666 there is this sunlight, there 1474 00:39:59,666 --> 00:40:04,600 is this transparency, and that 1475 00:40:01,233 --> 00:40:05,833 way they can come in and make 1476 00:40:02,666 -->

00:40:07,500 their case. We want to do this 1477 00:40:04,600 --> 00:40:08,766 with you and hopefully for you, 1478 00:40:05,833 --> 00:40:10,500 we're the benefits are there, 1479 00:40:07,500 --> 00:40:11,733 but that is not happening right 1480 00:40:08,766 --> 00:40:12,900 now. I think there's an avenue 1481 00:40:10,500 --> 00:40:13,866 that we could do that based on 1482 00:40:11,733 --> 00:40:15,633 that nuclear ready community 1483 00:40:12,900 --> 00:40:17,566 program. I'm pursuing that 1484 00:40:13,866 --> 00:40:18,633 right now, but I think that is 1485 00:40:15,633 --> 00:40:20,500 one idea that I'm open to, to 1486 00:40:17,566 --> 00:40:21,733 your Aulds discussion on too, 1487 00:40:18,633 --> 00:40:22,633 but but something that we can 1488 00:40:20,500 --> 00:40:23,766 do to make sure that there's 1489 00:40:21,733 --> 00:40:24,800 more trust there. 1490 00:40:22,633 --> 00:40:26,633 >> Yeah. Mr. Smith, what are 1491 00:40:23,766 --> 00:40:27,766 your thoughts on that? 1492 00:40:24,800 --> 00:40:28,466 >> Yeah, I mean, I think I 1493 00:40:26,633 --> 00:40:29,600 think that's such an excellent 1494 00:40:27,766 --> 00:40:30,833 point. 1495 00:40:28,466 --> 00:40:32,533 >> You know, really, I think 1496 00:40:29,600 --> 00:40:33,700 this has been handled maybe 1497 00:40:30,833 --> 00:40:34,633 because of the speed of the 1498 00:40:32,533 --> 00:40:36,633 business itself as a completely 1499 00:40:33,700 --> 00:40:37,733 reactionary framework. And what 1500 00:40:34,633 --> 00:40:39,333 we really need to do is be able 1501 00:40:36,633 --> 00:40:41,433 to advertise community by 1502 00:40:37,733 --> 00:40:44,333 community, what communities are 1503 00:40:39,333 --> 00:40:45,766 willing to have. I do think 1504 00:40:41,433 --> 00:40:47,933 that the energy pricing thing 1505 00:40:44,333 --> 00:40:49,200 maybe is a source of confusion, 1506 00:40:45,766 --> 00:40:50,800 because I see it really only at 1507 00:40:47,933 --> 00:40:52,000 the point of the construction 1508 00:40:49,200 --> 00:40:53,566 of the data center. If you 1509 00:40:50,800 --> 00:40:55,466 actually look at the distance 1510 00:40:52,000 --> 00:40:57,600 of communities that would then 1511 00:40:53,566 --> 00:40:59,400 be affected by these energy 1512 00:40:55,466 --> 00:41:00,500 price concerns, they're much 1513 00:40:57,600 --> 00:41:02,666 larger than those areas, right? 1514 00:40:59,400 --> 00:41:04,100 So I think there's a 1515 00:41:00,500 --> 00:41:06,566 fundamental confusion about 1516 00:41:02,666 --> 00:41:07,666 what the local community is 1517 00:41:04,100 --> 00:41:09,166 upset about. And, you know, I 1518 00:41:06,566 --> 00:41:11,333 think it's helpful to have 1519 00:41:07,666 --> 00:41:12,433 these conversations. But if you 1520 00:41:09,166 --> 00:41:13,833 don't advertise what kind of 1521 00:41:11,333 --> 00:41:14,933 business you are willing to 1522 00:41:12,433 --> 00:41:17,066 have in your community, you 1523 00:41:13,833 --> 00:41:17,833 know, you are you're laying 1524 00:41:14,933 --> 00:41:19,433 yourself open to this kind of 1525 00:41:17,066 --> 00:41:20,533 reactionary, well, what's the 1526 00:41:17,833 --> 00:41:21,666 best deal you can give me? And 1527 00:41:19,433 --> 00:41:23,433 that's really not a good 1528 00:41:20,533 --> 00:41:24,500 position. And you look at some 1529 00:41:21,666 --> 00:41:26,066 of these model ordinances, you 1530 00:41:23,433 --> 00:41:27,500 know, Jefferson County has one 1531 00:41:24,500 --> 00:41:29,133 that they're working on and 1532 00:41:26,066 --> 00:41:31,133 Chris, you know, released a 1533 00:41:27,500 --> 00:41:32,900 model ordinance. You know, this 1534 00:41:29,133 --> 00:41:34,433 is an advertisement about what 1535 00:41:31,133 --> 00:41:36,166 your community is willing to 1536 00:41:32,900 --> 00:41:37,233 have. And I, you know, I think 1537 00:41:34,433 --> 00:41:38,833 this all gets a lot better if 1538 00:41:36,166 --> 00:41:40,366 people aren't guessing or 1539 00:41:37,233 --> 00:41:41,200 gaming because the values of 1540 00:41:38,833 --> 00:41:43,033 the community really should be 1541 00:41:40,366 --> 00:41:43,700 first and foremost. 1542 00:41:41,200 --> 00:41:45,533 >> And Mr. Gary, to that point, 1543 00:41:43,033 --> 00:41:46,633 Kentucky Resources Council does 1544 00:41:43,700 --> 00:41:47,333 have this kind of model 1545 00:41:45,533 --> 00:41:48,700 approach. Can you share more 1546 00:41:46,633 --> 00:41:49,833 about that? 1547 00:41:47,333 --> 00:41:52,000 >> Yeah, we have two separate 1548 00:41:48,700 --> 00:41:53,500 model ordinances based on sort 1549 00:41:49,833 --> 00:41:54,866 of a research of best practices 1550 00:41:52,000 --> 00:41:56,300 from around the country that 1551 00:41:53,500 --> 00:41:58,466 approach a number of different 1552 00:41:54,866 --> 00:42:00,633 issues that data centers can 1553 00:41:56,300 --> 00:42:01,700 raise locally, potentially. 1554 00:41:58,466 --> 00:42:04,866 These include things like noise 1555 00:42:00,633 --> 00:42:07,133 regulating how much noise can 1556 00:42:01,700 --> 00:42:09,033 be impact sites off site from 1557 00:42:04,866 --> 00:42:11,300 the data center themselves 1558 00:42:07,133 --> 00:42:12,300 requires a noise study up front, 1559 00:42:09,033 --> 00:42:14,066 and then actual observations 1560 00:42:11,300 --> 00:42:15,366 after the fact to make sure 1561 00:42:12,300 --> 00:42:17,900 that those noise impacts aren't 1562 00:42:14,066 --> 00:42:20,200 felt by surrounding 1563 00:42:15,366 --> 00:42:21,866 neighborhoods. It regulates the 1564 00:42:17,900 --> 00:42:24,066 use of backup generation. A lot 1565 00:42:20,200 --> 00:42:25,566 of these data centers are 1566 00:42:21,866 --> 00:42:27,333 proposing to use diesel backup 1567 00:42:24,066 --> 00:42:29,100 generators, and if you think of 1568 00:42:25,566 --> 00:42:30,533 the size of one of these data 1569 00:42:27,333 --> 00:42:32,300 centers, the campground road 1570

00:42:29,100 --> 00:42:36,666 data center, that is, I think, 1571 00:42:30,533 --> 00:42:38,533 still the farthest along in 1572 00:42:32,300 --> 00:42:40,166 LG&E KU is projected to be 1573 00:42:36,666 --> 00:42:41,800 525MW, potentially for a sense 1574 00:42:38,533 --> 00:42:43,233 of scale. If they operate at 1575 00:42:40,166 --> 00:42:44,900 that 80% load factor, they 1576 00:42:41,800 --> 00:42:47,033 would consume roughly the same 1577 00:42:43,233 --> 00:42:48,100 amount of energy in a year as 1578 00:42:44,900 --> 00:42:49,600 the entirety of LG&E existing 1579 00:42:47,033 --> 00:42:50,700 customers. Now, if they put 1580 00:42:48,100 --> 00:42:52,533 that much diesel backup 1581 00:42:49,600 --> 00:42:53,600 generation on site, that could 1582 00:42:50,700 --> 00:42:54,800 cause potential significant 1583 00:42:52,533 --> 00:42:56,833 issues for surrounding 1584 00:42:53,600 --> 00:42:58,933 communities. So it it regulates 1585 00:42:54,800 --> 00:43:00,366 what sort of backup generation 1586 00:42:56,833 --> 00:43:02,133 and make sure that they are 1587 00:42:58,933 --> 00:43:04,000 using the cleanest possible and 1588 00:43:00,366 --> 00:43:05,800 encourages things like, you 1589 00:43:02,133 --> 00:43:07,933 know, clean energy and battery 1590 00:43:04,000 --> 00:43:09,400 backup instead of those diesel 1591 00:43:05,800 --> 00:43:10,800 generators. It also includes 1592 00:43:07,933 --> 00:43:12,600 regulations that would require 1593 00:43:09,400 --> 00:43:15,500 use of closed loop water 1594 00:43:10,800 --> 00:43:17,033 systems to minimize impacts on 1595 00:43:12,600 --> 00:43:18,833 local water systems. That 1596 00:43:15,500 --> 00:43:20,100 really is a big deal depending 1597 00:43:17,033 --> 00:43:21,166 on where in the state you are. 1598 00:43:18,833 --> 00:43:22,033 You know, a lot of the Eastern 1599 00:43:20,100 --> 00:43:23,866 Kentucky water systems in 1600 00:43:21,166 --> 00:43:25,900 particular, are already 1601 00:43:22,033 --> 00:43:27,366 struggle to keep up with the 1602 00:43:23,866 --> 00:43:29,533 demand and making sure they are 1603 00:43:25,900 --> 00:43:30,633 producing clean drinking water, 1604 00:43:27,366 --> 00:43:33,500 water for communities, as is. 1605 00:43:29,533 --> 00:43:34,600 There are other things 1606 00:43:30,633 --> 00:43:36,300 addressed in that as well, so 1607 00:43:33,500 --> 00:43:37,433 feel free to visit our website 1608 00:43:34,600 --> 00:43:39,233 and check it out. Yeah, I don't 1609 00:43:36,300 --> 00:43:40,333 want to go on forever. 1610 00:43:37,433 --> 00:43:41,800 >> Robust. Right? Well, to to 1611 00:43:39,233 --> 00:43:43,200 this point, Sherri from 1612 00:43:40,333 --> 00:43:44,566 Jefferson County asked this 1613 00:43:41,800 --> 00:43:46,700 question, are there any 1614 00:43:43,200 --> 00:43:47,900 possible health ramifications 1615 00:43:44,566 --> 00:43:49,733 that could impact people and 1616 00:43:46,700 --> 00:43:51,533 animals that live in close 1617 00:43:47,900 --> 00:43:52,666 proximity to data centers? What 1618 00:43:49,733 --> 00:43:54,533 about noise pollution? How 1619 00:43:51,533 --> 00:43:54,900 concerning is that? Mr. Smith, 1620 00:43:52,666 --> 00:43:56,700 do you want to weigh in any 1621 00:43:54,533 --> 00:43:57,733 further on that? 1622 00:43:54,900 --> 00:43:59,066 >> I mean, so we're we're in 1623 00:43:56,700 --> 00:44:00,600 relatively uncharted territory 1624 00:43:57,733 --> 00:44:01,833 with these very large data 1625 00:43:59,066 --> 00:44:03,533 centers. So if you were to go 1626 00:44:00,600 --> 00:44:04,500 today and use the data center 1627 00:44:01,833 --> 00:44:05,566 to do a search on 1628 00:44:03,533 --> 00:44:07,000 epidemiological studies of 1629 00:44:04,500 --> 00:44:08,833 health effects of exposure to 1630 00:44:05,566 --> 00:44:10,600 data centers, there are no 1631 00:44:07,000 --> 00:44:12,233 there's no evidence base for it. 1632 00:44:08,833 --> 00:44:13,466 And that really forces us to 1633 00:44:10,600 --> 00:44:14,900 resort to kind of first 1634 00:44:12,233 --> 00:44:17,466 principles. So what are those 1635 00:44:13,466 --> 00:44:19,200 components? You know, if it's 1636 00:44:14,900 --> 00:44:20,933 diesel combustion, we we know a 1637 00:44:17,466 --> 00:44:22,800 lot about exposure to diesel 1638 00:44:19,200 --> 00:44:23,900 combustion. And we understand 1639 00:44:20,933 --> 00:44:25,333 the health effects. There are 1640 00:44:22,800 --> 00:44:27,833 cardiovascular just mental 1641 00:44:23,900 --> 00:44:30,033 health problems. There's 1642 00:44:25,333 --> 00:44:32,333 cancers. So we understand the 1643 00:44:27,833 --> 00:44:34,000 pieces. So sound. This is a 1644 00:44:30,033 --> 00:44:35,066 little tricky because the sound 1645 00:44:32,333 --> 00:44:37,233 these facilities make is low 1646 00:44:34,000 --> 00:44:38,666 frequency sound. So it's not 1647 00:44:35,066 --> 00:44:41,166 like occupational usual 1648 00:44:37,233 --> 00:44:42,633 clanging and banging in a 1649 00:44:38,666 --> 00:44:45,100 manufacturing setting. There's 1650 00:44:41,166 --> 00:44:47,466 less evidence out there about 1651 00:44:42,633 --> 00:44:48,766 long term exposure to 1652 00:44:45,100 --> 00:44:49,633 infrasound. But, you know, if 1653 00:44:47,466 --> 00:44:51,333 you look at the communities, 1654 00:44:48,766 --> 00:44:53,733 especially in Loudoun County 1655 00:44:49,633 --> 00:44:55,200 and Virginia. You know, those 1656 00:44:51,333 --> 00:44:57,333 kinds of complaints, you know, 1657 00:44:53,733 --> 00:44:59,166 are certainly something to pay 1658 00:44:55,200 --> 00:45:01,000 attention to. And if there are 1659 00:44:57,333 --> 00:45:02,800 decisions that developers can 1660 00:44:59,166 --> 00:45:04,333 make designing these facilities 1661 00:45:01,000 --> 00:45:06,766 to minimize these things, it 1662 00:45:02,800 --> 00:45:08,200 only follows then that we'll 1663 00:45:04,333 --> 00:45:09,733 have less health consequences, 1664

00:45:06,766 --> 00:45:11,033 right? So I think these are 1665 00:45:08,200 --> 00:45:12,833 very legitimate concerns that 1666 00:45:09,733 --> 00:45:14,033 these community members are 1667 00:45:11,033 --> 00:45:17,166 raising. And I think the real 1668 00:45:12,833 --> 00:45:18,266 answer there is to really start 1669 00:45:14,033 --> 00:45:19,366 to box in what is going to be 1670 00:45:17,166 --> 00:45:21,900 acceptable. We have those kinds 1671 00:45:18,266 --> 00:45:23,300 of guidelines for other kinds 1672 00:45:19,366 --> 00:45:25,033 of industry, not so much for 1673 00:45:21,900 --> 00:45:25,900 this. And I think, you know, we 1674 00:45:23,300 --> 00:45:27,866 sort of need to play catch up 1675 00:45:25,033 --> 00:45:29,100 right now. 1676 00:45:25,900 --> 00:45:30,866 >> I want to ask you, Mr. Smith, 1677 00:45:27,866 --> 00:45:31,966 a term that you used when we 1678 00:45:29,100 --> 00:45:32,166 talked earlier, and it's about 1679 00:45:30,866 --> 00:45:33,866 local capture. What does that 1680 00:45:31,966 --> 00:45:34,933 mean? 1681 00:45:32,166 --> 00:45:36,166 >> Explain that. So I spent 1682 00:45:33,866 --> 00:45:37,900 several years working for one 1683 00:45:34,933 --> 00:45:40,366 of the mayors of Louisville. 1684 00:45:36,166 --> 00:45:42,733 And, you know, it happened to 1685 00:45:37,900 --> 00:45:43,900 be at a time when Airbnb, Uber 1686 00:45:40,366 --> 00:45:46,700 and Lyft, the scooter guys, 1687 00:45:42,733 --> 00:45:47,800 we're all moving in, you know, 1688 00:45:43,900 --> 00:45:49,933 kind of at the same time. And I 1689 00:45:46,700 --> 00:45:52,433 remember having several 1690 00:45:47,800 --> 00:45:54,200 meetings where essentially 1691 00:45:49,933 --> 00:45:57,133 their corporate management said, 1692 00:45:52,433 --> 00:45:59,366 you know, we can't be bothered 1693 00:45:54,200 --> 00:46:01,300 with your local taxes and your 1694 00:45:57,133 --> 00:46:02,666 local regulatory schemes. You 1695 00:45:59,366 --> 00:46:04,033 know, this is our deal. This is 1696 00:46:01,300 --> 00:46:05,766 what we do. And you know what 1697 00:46:02,666 --> 00:46:07,300 they're trained in business 1698 00:46:04,033 --> 00:46:08,666 school to, to be afraid of is 1699 00:46:05,766 --> 00:46:10,200 local capture. So so if your 1700 00:46:07,300 --> 00:46:12,033 business model gets caught up 1701 00:46:08,666 --> 00:46:13,333 in a lot of jurisdictions all 1702 00:46:10,200 --> 00:46:15,200 over the world, it can be very, 1703 00:46:12,033 --> 00:46:16,266 very expensive for business, 1704 00:46:13,333 --> 00:46:18,000 right? And so, you know, what 1705 00:46:15,200 --> 00:46:19,100 ultimately happened, I think we 1706 00:46:16,266 --> 00:46:20,566 all understood like Airbnb in 1707 00:46:18,000 --> 00:46:22,300 Kentucky has experienced a lot 1708 00:46:19,100 --> 00:46:24,466 of local capture. There's, you 1709 00:46:20,566 --> 00:46:26,300 know, they pay, you know, a bed 1710 00:46:22,300 --> 00:46:29,100 tax in, in Louisville, you know, 1711 00:46:24,466 --> 00:46:30,266 for every unit that's, you know, 1712 00:46:26,300 --> 00:46:31,433 rented. So it is, I think it's 1713 00:46:29,100 --> 00:46:33,233 part of the business model for 1714 00:46:30,266 --> 00:46:35,100 these big, big tech companies 1715 00:46:31,433 --> 00:46:36,233 to say, I don't want to deal 1716 00:46:33,233 --> 00:46:37,800 with your little rules and all 1717 00:46:35,100 --> 00:46:40,733 your little places. The reality 1718 00:46:36,233 --> 00:46:42,866 is, you know, local government 1719 00:46:37,800 --> 00:46:45,000 is a pillar of our democracy. 1720 00:46:40,733 --> 00:46:46,800 If you if you mess with local 1721 00:46:42,866 --> 00:46:48,733 control, it doesn't end well. 1722 00:46:45,000 --> 00:46:49,733 Right? So, you know, I think we 1723 00:46:46,800 --> 00:46:50,766 need to take a lesson from all 1724 00:46:48,733 --> 00:46:51,966 these waves of technological 1725 00:46:49,733 --> 00:46:53,800 innovation we've seen before 1726 00:46:50,766 --> 00:46:55,466 and say, you know, let's let's 1727 00:46:51,966 --> 00:46:56,900 figure out how you can be a 1728 00:46:53,800 --> 00:46:58,366 good, you know, neighbor 1729 00:46:55,466 --> 00:46:59,433 locally in our community, 1730 00:46:56,900 --> 00:47:01,233 working the way we want to work 1731 00:46:58,366 --> 00:47:02,333 with our values. 1732 00:46:59,433 --> 00:47:04,066 >> But does there need to start 1733 00:47:01,233 --> 00:47:06,633 in Frankfort at the state 1734 00:47:02,333 --> 00:47:09,133 legislative level, some type of 1735 00:47:04,066 --> 00:47:10,900 overall guardrails and 1736 00:47:06,633 --> 00:47:12,766 guidelines? Is that? 1737 00:47:09,133 --> 00:47:14,133 >> Absolutely. And that's what, 1738 00:47:10,900 --> 00:47:16,700 you know, this interim because 1739 00:47:12,766 --> 00:47:19,766 the Senate didn't take action 1740 00:47:14,133 --> 00:47:21,433 on, you know, our the ratepayer 1741 00:47:16,700 --> 00:47:23,166 protection bill going through 1742 00:47:19,766 --> 00:47:24,633 it right now, you know, already 1743 00:47:21,433 --> 00:47:26,833 probably had 20 or 30 meetings 1744 00:47:23,166 --> 00:47:30,033 so far over the interim. Just 1745 00:47:24,633 --> 00:47:32,200 how can we improve on this? Do 1746 00:47:26,833 --> 00:47:35,033 we need to look at, you know, 1747 00:47:30,033 --> 00:47:36,500 how citing minimum requirements 1748 00:47:32,200 --> 00:47:38,000 for noise curtailment so that 1749 00:47:35,033 --> 00:47:40,133 in case there's, you know, some 1750 00:47:36,500 --> 00:47:42,266 kind of winter storm, the data 1751 00:47:38,000 --> 00:47:43,666 center gets shut down to 1752 00:47:40,133 --> 00:47:45,233 improve reliability. You know, 1753 00:47:42,266 --> 00:47:47,633 met with Eric King quite a bit. 1754 00:47:43,666 --> 00:47:49,066 Looking at what other states 1755 00:47:45,233 --> 00:47:50,166 have done, particularly on data 1756 00:47:47,633 --> 00:47:52,000 centers that bring their own 1757

00:47:49,066 --> 00:47:54,166 generation. And what would that 1758 00:47:50,166 --> 00:47:57,733 look like? Could that drive 1759 00:47:52,000 --> 00:47:58,733 down rates if they bring their 1760 00:47:54,166 --> 00:48:00,000 own generation? So yeah, 1761 00:47:57,733 --> 00:48:02,400 absolutely. Going to have 1762 00:47:58,733 --> 00:48:05,700 another bill ready to go first 1763 00:48:00,000 --> 00:48:07,433 day of session when we get back 1764 00:48:02,400 --> 00:48:08,866 and, you know, probably got 30 1765 00:48:05,700 --> 00:48:11,466 or 40 things right here that, 1766 00:48:07,433 --> 00:48:13,200 you know, we're looking at 1767 00:48:08,866 --> 00:48:14,300 actively making sure that if 1768 00:48:11,466 --> 00:48:17,166 there are any kind of 1769 00:48:13,200 --> 00:48:18,333 incentives and electric rates 1770 00:48:14,300 --> 00:48:19,300 go up, can we call that back? 1771 00:48:17,166 --> 00:48:20,233 Just a bunch of different 1772 00:48:18,333 --> 00:48:21,166 things that need to be 1773 00:48:19,300 --> 00:48:21,800 addressed, honestly. 1774 00:48:20,233 --> 00:48:23,200 >> Yeah. Representative Moore, 1775 00:48:21,166 --> 00:48:24,766 your ideas? 1776 00:48:21,800 --> 00:48:26,266 >> Yeah, he's already hit a 1777 00:48:23,200 --> 00:48:27,300 bunch of them. But I think are 1778 00:48:24,766 --> 00:48:28,400 there ways that we can do 1779 00:48:26,266 --> 00:48:29,633 almost continuous monitoring of 1780 00:48:27,300 --> 00:48:30,833 emissions that are coming out 1781 00:48:28,400 --> 00:48:32,800 of our hyperscale data centers, 1782 00:48:29,633 --> 00:48:33,766 whether that is gaseous 1783 00:48:30,833 --> 00:48:34,933 emissions or liquid water 1784 00:48:32,800 --> 00:48:35,900 emissions, are we going to be 1785 00:48:33,766 --> 00:48:37,766 able to have continuous 1786 00:48:34,933 --> 00:48:38,866 monitoring of the heat that 1787 00:48:35,900 --> 00:48:39,766 comes off of it? If that 1788 00:48:37,766 --> 00:48:40,933 changes the local atmosphere 1789 00:48:38,866 --> 00:48:42,933 and environment, the noise 1790 00:48:39,766 --> 00:48:44,833 level that comes off. You talk 1791 00:48:40,933 --> 00:48:45,966 about the I lost the term, now 1792 00:48:42,933 --> 00:48:47,033 I'm going to blink on TV, but 1793 00:48:44,833 --> 00:48:48,766 there are different things that 1794 00:48:45,966 --> 00:48:49,766 we could do, continuous 1795 00:48:47,033 --> 00:48:50,833 monitoring of, and that way we 1796 00:48:48,766 --> 00:48:51,933 could have annual assessments, 1797 00:48:49,766 --> 00:48:53,800 annual reports, and that might 1798 00:48:50,833 --> 00:48:55,333 help generate these studies in 1799 00:48:51,933 --> 00:48:56,466 the future. As we start to see 1800 00:48:53,800 --> 00:48:57,933 what the impacts are on local 1801 00:48:55,333 --> 00:49:00,133 communities. We've seen one 1802 00:48:56,466 --> 00:49:01,533 instance right now in Wolfe 1803 00:48:57,933 --> 00:49:03,333 County, where the neighbors of 1804 00:49:00,133 --> 00:49:04,533 a data center don't like the 1805 00:49:01,533 --> 00:49:06,333 continuous hum that's going on. 1806 00:49:03,333 --> 00:49:07,433 And they they look through all 1807 00:49:04,533 --> 00:49:08,600 the accounting of how much tax 1808 00:49:06,333 --> 00:49:10,333 revenue has been brought in by 1809 00:49:07,433 --> 00:49:11,466 that data center. And the 1810 00:49:08,600 --> 00:49:12,633 previous 18 months, it had 1811 00:49:10,333 --> 00:49:14,566 brought in only about $11,000 1812 00:49:11,466 --> 00:49:16,233 of tax revenue. Well, I mean, 1813 00:49:12,633 --> 00:49:17,666 that's a fraction of the salary 1814 00:49:14,566 --> 00:49:18,733 of a starting teacher out of 1815 00:49:16,233 --> 00:49:20,666 college. It's not enough to add 1816 00:49:17,666 --> 00:49:22,033 one position that's going to 1817 00:49:18,733 --> 00:49:23,566 help your kids. So I do worry 1818 00:49:20,666 --> 00:49:24,633 about some of those impacts. 1819 00:49:22,033 --> 00:49:25,733 >> Well, that is a question 1820 00:49:23,566 --> 00:49:27,566 where we've heard about it 1821 00:49:24,633 --> 00:49:28,733 doesn't really bring that much 1822 00:49:25,733 --> 00:49:29,800 job, many jobs. And how much 1823 00:49:27,566 --> 00:49:32,066 revenue does it really generate 1824 00:49:28,733 --> 00:49:33,500 for a city or county? 1825 00:49:29,800 --> 00:49:35,366 >> I don't think no two data 1826 00:49:32,066 --> 00:49:36,733 center projects are alike. You 1827 00:49:33,500 --> 00:49:37,866 know, I've seen preliminary 1828 00:49:35,366 --> 00:49:39,133 estimates on the one in Mason 1829 00:49:36,733 --> 00:49:40,100 County. I think they've 1830 00:49:37,866 --> 00:49:41,466 approached that the right way. 1831 00:49:39,133 --> 00:49:44,633 Everything's been done in 1832 00:49:40,100 --> 00:49:46,833 public. You're looking at 1833 00:49:41,466 --> 00:49:48,966 adding 400 new jobs. You look 1834 00:49:44,633 --> 00:49:51,100 at what's happened down in 1835 00:49:46,833 --> 00:49:54,066 Louisiana. Data center goes in 1836 00:49:48,966 --> 00:49:55,833 down there. Sales tax revenue 1837 00:49:51,100 --> 00:49:57,600 doubles. They're giving 1838 00:49:54,066 --> 00:50:00,166 teachers a $50,000 bonus 1839 00:49:55,833 --> 00:50:02,633 because they've got all this 1840 00:49:57,600 --> 00:50:04,900 extra tax revenue in that one 1841 00:50:00,166 --> 00:50:06,633 locality. But those are with 1842 00:50:02,633 --> 00:50:08,100 hyper scale companies. But the 1843 00:50:04,900 --> 00:50:09,400 ones that really concern me are 1844 00:50:06,633 --> 00:50:12,766 kind of the speculators. And 1845 00:50:08,100 --> 00:50:14,700 that's the one that are causing 1846 00:50:09,400 --> 00:50:16,233 the most issue all throughout 1847 00:50:12,766 --> 00:50:18,133 Kentucky right now. And that's 1848 00:50:14,700 --> 00:50:20,666 one of the things, you know, 1849 00:50:16,233 --> 00:50:23,200 the bill addressed by having a 1850 00:50:18,133 --> 00:50:25,000 high application fee to make 1851

00:50:20,666 --> 00:50:26,366 sure that when KU does their 1852 00:50:23,200 --> 00:50:28,333 load study, that they're not 1853 00:50:25,000 --> 00:50:30,733 doing it on somebody that may 1854 00:50:26,366 --> 00:50:34,033 have 5 or 6 different options 1855 00:50:28,333 --> 00:50:35,433 all throughout the state, that 1856 00:50:30,733 --> 00:50:36,900 vastly shrinks the number of 1857 00:50:34,033 --> 00:50:38,066 potential projects you have. 1858 00:50:35,433 --> 00:50:39,766 That's one of the things that, 1859 00:50:36,900 --> 00:50:41,600 you know, the Epic report 1860 00:50:38,066 --> 00:50:43,066 showed in Ohio was when they 1861 00:50:39,766 --> 00:50:44,766 put a high application fee in. 1862 00:50:41,600 --> 00:50:45,633 All of a sudden, the project 1863 00:50:43,066 --> 00:50:46,966 shrinked down because you're 1864 00:50:44,766 --> 00:50:49,100 separating the wheat from the 1865 00:50:45,633 --> 00:50:50,533 chaff at that point. 1866 00:50:46,966 --> 00:50:51,633 >> Right? So this comment 1867 00:50:49,100 --> 00:50:52,666 question from Sarah Lynn 1868 00:50:50,533 --> 00:50:54,533 Cunningham, executive director 1869 00:50:51,633 --> 00:50:56,300 of the Louisville Climate 1870 00:50:52,666 --> 00:50:57,733 Action Network, and she says, 1871 00:50:54,533 --> 00:50:59,533 quote, Mr. Bevington spoke 1872 00:50:56,300 --> 00:51:02,433 reassuringly about requiring 1873 00:50:57,733 --> 00:51:04,200 data centers pay 15 years of 1874 00:50:59,533 --> 00:51:06,000 usage. However, LG&E routinely 1875 00:51:02,433 --> 00:51:07,500 operates its power plants for 1876 00:51:04,200 --> 00:51:08,866 40 to 50 years. How will 1877 00:51:06,000 --> 00:51:11,066 consumers, including existing 1878 00:51:07,500 --> 00:51:12,500 businesses that employ many 1879 00:51:08,866 --> 00:51:15,066 more people than would data 1880 00:51:11,066 --> 00:51:17,533 centers, be protected from 1881 00:51:12,500 --> 00:51:19,366 paying for those stranded costs, 1882 00:51:15,066 --> 00:51:20,500 as well as LG&E stockholders 1883 00:51:17,533 --> 00:51:21,700 guaranteed profits? 1884 00:51:19,366 --> 00:51:23,466 >> Well, there's a lot to 1885 00:51:20,500 --> 00:51:24,600 unpack in that question, for 1886 00:51:21,700 --> 00:51:26,366 sure. And again, when we when 1887 00:51:23,466 --> 00:51:27,533 we think about sort of, you 1888 00:51:24,600 --> 00:51:29,100 know, how rate making occurs 1889 00:51:26,366 --> 00:51:30,566 and things of that nature, I 1890 00:51:27,533 --> 00:51:32,333 think the reason that the 1891 00:51:29,100 --> 00:51:33,766 extremely high load factor 1892 00:51:30,566 --> 00:51:34,766 tariff requires a, a contract 1893 00:51:32,333 --> 00:51:35,900 for 15 years is because 1894 00:51:33,766 --> 00:51:37,700 essentially the amount of 1895 00:51:34,766 --> 00:51:39,500 revenue that will collect from 1896 00:51:35,900 --> 00:51:41,000 a data center over that 15 1897 00:51:37,700 --> 00:51:43,166 years essentially will pay for 1898 00:51:39,500 --> 00:51:44,866 new generation. We'll pay for 1899 00:51:41,000 --> 00:51:46,033 the entirety of what that new 1900 00:51:43,166 --> 00:51:48,533 generation costs. And I think 1901 00:51:44,866 --> 00:51:49,833 the other thing, again, we've 1902 00:51:46,033 --> 00:51:51,900 had multiple questions from 1903 00:51:48,533 --> 00:51:53,633 from viewers about the benefits 1904 00:51:49,833 --> 00:51:54,666 of these things we sort of hate 1905 00:51:51,900 --> 00:51:56,400 toward the negative, right? 1906 00:51:53,633 --> 00:51:58,266 Which is understandable because 1907 00:51:54,666 --> 00:51:58,933 as, as Ted said, you know, 1908 00:51:56,400 --> 00:52:01,133 there's a lot of new 1909 00:51:58,266 --> 00:52:02,966 conversation to have about 1910 00:51:58,933 --> 00:52:04,766 these things. However, again, 1911 00:52:01,133 --> 00:52:05,833 when new generation is built, 1912 00:52:02,966 --> 00:52:06,900 new infrastructure is built in 1913 00:52:04,766 --> 00:52:08,733 Kentucky that benefits 1914 00:52:05,833 --> 00:52:10,500 everybody, right? And in the 1915 00:52:06,900 --> 00:52:12,000 case of brand new, most 1916 00:52:08,733 --> 00:52:13,633 efficient generation, it's like 1917 00:52:10,500 --> 00:52:15,866 buying a new car. And all of 1918 00:52:12,000 --> 00:52:17,066 our customers get to benefit 1919 00:52:13,633 --> 00:52:19,000 from that for 30 or 40 years to 1920 00:52:15,866 --> 00:52:20,300 miss Cunningham's question. And 1921 00:52:17,066 --> 00:52:21,966 again, if there if we have one 1922 00:52:19,000 --> 00:52:23,066 data center that signs up for 1923 00:52:20,300 --> 00:52:24,533 15 years, all the revenue that 1924 00:52:21,966 --> 00:52:25,966 that brings in benefits, the 1925 00:52:23,066 --> 00:52:27,066 entire system pays for that new 1926 00:52:24,533 --> 00:52:28,866 generation and that all the 1927 00:52:25,966 --> 00:52:30,600 customers get the benefit of 1928 00:52:27,066 --> 00:52:32,100 that for the remainder of its 1929 00:52:28,866 --> 00:52:34,300 operating life. While we might 1930 00:52:30,600 --> 00:52:35,166 have to retire older units and 1931 00:52:32,100 --> 00:52:36,466 things like that, those new 1932 00:52:34,300 --> 00:52:37,566 generators that we're building 1933 00:52:35,166 --> 00:52:39,166 are going to continue to 1934 00:52:36,466 --> 00:52:40,400 operate efficiently for the 1935 00:52:37,566 --> 00:52:41,433 benefit of our customers for 1936 00:52:39,166 --> 00:52:43,633 the long term. And again, these 1937 00:52:40,400 --> 00:52:45,800 data centers are helping pay 1938 00:52:41,433 --> 00:52:47,566 for, you know, that new, most 1939 00:52:43,633 --> 00:52:49,066 efficient piece. Otherwise, 1940 00:52:45,800 --> 00:52:50,700 when we have to retire a unit, 1941 00:52:47,566 --> 00:52:51,900 all residential customers are 1942 00:52:49,066 --> 00:52:52,766 having to pay for that without 1943 00:52:50,700 --> 00:52:53,900 the benefit of this additional 1944 00:52:51,900 --> 00:52:55,033 revenue that these big

1945 00:52:52,766 --> 00:52:56,833 companies bring to the table. 1946 00:52:53,900 --> 00:52:58,066 So again, that's just another 1947 00:52:55,033 --> 00:52:59,466 piece of of the revenue benefit 1948 00:52:56,833 --> 00:53:01,266 that that can be created. 1949 00:52:58,066 --> 00:53:02,733 >> Mr. Gary, what's your 1950 00:52:59,466 --> 00:53:04,900 thoughts on that explanation? 1951 00:53:01,266 --> 00:53:07,433 >> I've heard that explanation 1952 00:53:02,733 --> 00:53:08,233 before at our hearing on the I 1953 00:53:04,900 --> 00:53:09,233 believe, on the cpcn for the 1954 00:53:07,433 --> 00:53:10,300 sorry, the Certificate of 1955 00:53:08,233 --> 00:53:12,066 Public Convenience and 1956 00:53:09,233 --> 00:53:13,366 necessity, the permission from 1957 00:53:10,300 --> 00:53:14,633 PSC to build the two new gas 1958 00:53:12,066 --> 00:53:16,466 plants that were mentioned in 1959 00:53:13,366 --> 00:53:18,900 the back of the envelope. Math 1960 00:53:14,633 --> 00:53:20,366 seems to work out, but there 1961 00:53:16,466 --> 00:53:22,166 are more intricate ways to 1962 00:53:18,900 --> 00:53:24,033 assess how much needs to be 1963 00:53:20,366 --> 00:53:25,066 paid in to make sure that the 1964 00:53:22,166 --> 00:53:26,900 costs are covered as. As Mr. 1965 00:53:24,033 --> 00:53:28,000 Bevington was mentioning 1966 00:53:25,066 --> 00:53:29,200 earlier, that numerator and 1967 00:53:26,900 --> 00:53:30,866 denominator, there's a lot more 1968 00:53:28,000 --> 00:53:32,933 that goes into that numerator 1969 00:53:29,200 --> 00:53:34,166 as well. Aside from just the 1970 00:53:30,866 --> 00:53:35,466 cost of a new gas plant. So 1971 00:53:32,933 --> 00:53:36,733 that's the upfront capital cost. 1972 00:53:34,166 --> 00:53:38,666 But there's also the operations 1973 00:53:35,466 --> 00:53:40,866 and maintenance, the pipeline, 1974 00:53:36,733 --> 00:53:43,000 the fuel, the transmission and 1975 00:53:38,666 --> 00:53:44,166 other things. So a really 1976 00:53:40,866 --> 00:53:46,233 complete accounting, as I think 1977 00:53:43,000 --> 00:53:48,033 that Representative Bray and 1978 00:53:44,166 --> 00:53:52,366 Moore's bills would require, 1979 00:53:46,233 --> 00:53:53,800 would be a good first step 1980 00:53:48,033 --> 00:53:55,500 aside from from sort of not to 1981 00:53:52,366 --> 00:53:56,800 denigrate the really complex 1982 00:53:53,800 --> 00:53:58,500 math that LG&E put forward in 1983 00:53:55,500 --> 00:54:00,033 their application, but that 1984 00:53:56,800 --> 00:54:02,433 sort of back of the envelope. 1985 00:53:58,500 --> 00:54:04,266 And I think the other important 1986 00:54:00,033 --> 00:54:05,333 thing to note here is as to, to 1987 00:54:02,433 --> 00:54:06,400 health effects. We talked a lot 1988 00:54:04,266 --> 00:54:07,833 about the data centers 1989 00:54:05,333 --> 00:54:10,800 themselves, but this new 1990 00:54:06,400 --> 00:54:12,133 generation is primarily fossil 1991 00:54:07,833 --> 00:54:14,400 fuel generation. We already are 1992 00:54:10,800 --> 00:54:16,833 a non-attainment area in 1993 00:54:12,133 --> 00:54:18,300 Louisville for smog, and we are 1994 00:54:14,400 --> 00:54:20,433 now building a two new gas 1995 00:54:16,833 --> 00:54:22,366 plants actually, and extending 1996 00:54:18,300 --> 00:54:23,833 the life of a coal plant. So 1997 00:54:20,433 --> 00:54:25,133 aside from the health impacts 1998 00:54:22,366 --> 00:54:26,233 of the data centers themselves, 1999 00:54:23,833 --> 00:54:28,000 the new generation could 2000 00:54:25,133 --> 00:54:29,100 potentially have health impacts 2001 00:54:26,233 --> 00:54:30,600 as well. 2002 00:54:28,000 --> 00:54:32,133 >> Well, certainly think about 2003 00:54:29,100 --> 00:54:33,133 I'll give the representatives a 2004 00:54:30,600 --> 00:54:34,533 chance to maybe give the final 2005 00:54:32,133 --> 00:54:35,133 word here. Representative Moore, 2006 00:54:33,133 --> 00:54:37,000 we'll go with you first. Maybe 2007 00:54:34,533 --> 00:54:38,500 45 seconds. 2008 00:54:35,133 --> 00:54:39,866 >> Sure. As Rep Bray continues 2009 00:54:37,000 --> 00:54:42,100 to work on our legislation this 2010 00:54:38,500 --> 00:54:43,133 year, I think as we look at 2011 00:54:39,866 --> 00:54:45,300 potentially stranded assets or 2012 00:54:42,100 --> 00:54:46,733 decommissioning, potentially 2013 00:54:43,133 --> 00:54:48,366 that filing fee goes in or the 2014 00:54:45,300 --> 00:54:49,966 application cost goes into an 2015 00:54:46,733 --> 00:54:51,066 escrow account for down the 2016 00:54:48,366 --> 00:54:52,233 line decommissioning or 2017 00:54:49,966 --> 00:54:53,300 retirement. But the biggest 2018 00:54:51,066 --> 00:54:55,233 thing is keeping that the lines 2019 00:54:52,233 --> 00:54:57,066 of communication open. I would 2020 00:54:53,300 --> 00:54:58,133 love to work with you on this, 2021 00:54:55,233 --> 00:54:59,366 and I hope people will, from 2022 00:54:57,066 --> 00:55:00,300 across the perspective from KRC 2023 00:54:58,133 --> 00:55:02,166 and from our utility providers 2024 00:54:59,366 --> 00:55:03,333 working with rep Bray and 2025 00:55:00,300 --> 00:55:04,100 myself and others to come to a 2026 00:55:02,166 --> 00:55:06,100 solution that can work for 2027 00:55:03,333 --> 00:55:07,266 Kentucky. 2028 00:55:04,100 --> 00:55:09,133 >> So this is going to be one 2029 00:55:06,100 --> 00:55:10,833 of the big issues, if not the 2030 00:55:07,266 --> 00:55:12,833 biggest issue. Rep Bray of the 2031 00:55:09,133 --> 00:55:14,133 session of 2027. That's right. 2032 00:55:10,833 --> 00:55:14,866 >> Listen, I feel like because, 2033 00:55:12,833 --> 00:55:16,000 you know, we didn't get 2034 00:55:14,133 --> 00:55:17,733 something across the finish 2035 00:55:14,866 --> 00:55:19,066 line last session, we're kind 2036 00:55:16,000 --> 00:55:22,000 of behind the eight ball to 2037 00:55:17,733 --> 00:55:23,433 where it's imperative we do 2038 00:55:19,066 --> 00:55:24,833 this go round. So it's 2039 00:55:22,000 --> 00:55:25,633 extremely complicated. But it's 2040 00:55:23,433 --> 00:55:26,833 extremely important that we get 2041 00:55:24,833 --> 00:55:28,133 this right. 2042 00:55:25,633 --> 00:55:29,300 >> And you're doing that work 2043 00:55:26,833 --> 00:55:30,266 over the interim. So hopefully 2044 00:55:28,133 --> 00:55:31,366 perhaps you go in and even 2045 00:55:29,300 --> 00:55:32,900 during the organizational 2046 00:55:30,266 --> 00:55:33,966 session, you've already filed a 2047 00:55:31,366 --> 00:55:35,100 bill and ready to hit the 2048 00:55:32,900 --> 00:55:35,933 ground running and get it 2049 00:55:33,966 --> 00:55:37,166 passed before March the 30th 2050 00:55:35,100 --> 00:55:38,233 this time. 2051 00:55:35,933 --> 00:55:40,366 >> That's my intent. You know, 2052 00:55:37,166 --> 00:55:42,500 the Senate's been holding 2053 00:55:38,233 --> 00:55:44,333 meetings already. They've put 2054 00:55:40,366 --> 00:55:46,866 together a work group. Chairman 2055 00:55:42,500 --> 00:55:48,033 Wheeler's leading that effort. 2056 00:55:44,333 --> 00:55:48,266 So very, very optimistic that 2057 00:55:46,866 --> 00:55:49,866 we're going to get something 2058 00:55:48,033 --> 00:55:51,100 done. 2059 00:55:48,266 --> 00:55:53,366 >> All right. Something to keep 2060 00:55:49,866 --> 00:55:54,066 our eyes on. We report on it 2061 00:55:51,100 --> 00:55:54,966 every single night, it seems on 2062 00:55:53,366 --> 00:55:56,000 Kentucky Edition. And we'll 2063 00:55:54,066 --> 00:55:57,933 probably have more even 2064 00:55:54,966 --> 00:55:59,433 tomorrow night, which we hope 2065 00:55:56,000 --> 00:56:00,366 we'll see you again at at 630 2066 00:55:57,933 --> 00:56:01,933 eastern, 530 central for 2067 00:55:59,433 --> 00:56:03,166 Kentucky edition. And of course, 2068 00:56:00,366 --> 00:56:04,333 Bill Bryant and a panel of 2069 00:56:01,933 --> 00:56:06,066 working Kentucky reporters are 2070 00:56:03,166 --> 00:56:07,733 going to be here on Friday 2071 00:56:04,333 --> 00:56:09,266 night for comment on Kentucky 2072 00:56:06,066 --> 00:56:10,966 at 8:00 eastern, seven central 2073 00:56:07,733 --> 00:56:12,066 time, right here on KET. This 2074 00:56:09,266 --> 00:56:13,133 is the place where the hard 2075 00:56:10,966 --> 00:56:14,600 conversations are had. And 2076 00:56:12,066 --> 00:56:15,600 hopefully you learned a little 2077 00:56:13,133 --> 00:56:17,100 something tonight about data 2078 00:56:14,600 --> 00:56:17,966 centers, and we'll keep 2079 00:56:15,600 --> 00:56:19,800 following it as we go along. 2080 00:56:17,100 --> 00:56:21,666 Thanks for watching. I'm Renee 2081 00:56:17,966 --> 00:56:26,133 Shaw, take really good care and 2082 00:56:19,800 --> 00:56:26,133 until I see you again, have a 2083 00:56:21,666 --> 00:56:26,133 great rest of the week.