Joe Mass의 전체 녹취록

the basement but figured out the problem and we should be good going forward. 00:02:40.423 --> 00:02:41.586 Other than that, I'm good. 00:02:41.586 --> 00:02:42.370 How are you doing? 00:02:42.972 --> 00:02:45.901 I'm good and there's no rain in the orange room, correct? 00:02:46.241 --> 00:02:46.963 That is correct. 00:02:46.963 --> 00:02:55.287 The orange room is sufficiently protected from the elements, which is good, which is a good thing. 00:02:55.287 --> 00:02:56.850 So what are you doing today? 00:02:56.850 --> 00:02:58.114 What's the latest? 00:02:58.879 --> 00:03:16.115 Okay, well, latest today is, you know, I've been working on a bunch of stuff and actually, you know, today I have a little gig outside of New Jersey and I'll be going to that around five o'clock. 00:03:16.115 --> 00:03:25.026 But other than that, just you know, wake up every day, practice, write, and we do what we do, don't we? 00:03:25.407 --> 00:03:26.170 We do indeed. 00:03:26.170 --> 00:03:32.460 Now I just saw you down in Dallas and you had done a set with some jazz heavyweights. 00:03:32.460 --> 00:03:38.834 Why don't you tell us what transpired and who it was with, and all of that kind of stuff? 00:03:40.379 --> 00:03:58.855 Well, I have a good friend, a promoter named John Hill, and John Hill, a couple of years ago, when I was recording my record that I signed with Boots Hill Records back in 2020, that's a Bootsy Collins' label, yes. 00:03:58.855 --> 00:04:08.875 So John called up his friend, jimmy Haslip, in LA and he said you know, you should, you should meet this guitar player, joe Mass. 00:04:08.875 --> 00:04:14.712 So I talked with Jimmy and we began you know a relationship. 00:04:14.712 --> 00:04:21.632 He played on the what I call the Bootsy record, right. 00:04:21.632 --> 00:04:28.279 And then Jimmy said you know, I'd love to do a jazz record with you. 00:04:28.279 --> 00:04:29.742 Would you be interested in that? 00:04:29.742 --> 00:04:32.466 And I said, uh, yeah. 00:04:33.208 --> 00:04:55.079 And um, so I wrote I had like 12 compositions and I sent him those and he picked like seven of them and we started working on that and, um, of course he got Jeff Lorber involved with it and a bunch of other people. 00:04:55.079 --> 00:05:06.415 Um, so basically I recorded two records Jimmy's on the Bootsy record and then Jimmy actually produced and got everybody on it. 00:05:06.415 --> 00:05:26.694 I mean there's Jimmy Haslip, randy Brecker plays trumpet, jeff Lorber, andy Schnitzer from the Rolling Stones plays some saxophone, mike Patterson, who was with Dave Brubeck and he's a Philadelphia cat played saxophone, ralph Humphries from Zappa's band oh yeah Played drums. 00:05:26.694 --> 00:05:31.571 Dave Weckl played some drums and then Scott Kinsey was really the guy who did everything. 00:05:31.571 --> 00:05:37.826 So I'm just like this little guy from Philly and Jimmy got all his friends on it. 00:05:37.826 --> 00:05:38.670 Thank you, jimmy. 00:05:39.040 --> 00:05:49.735 And, of course, jimmy Haslip, famous from the Yellow Jackets, for those of you who may not recognize that name, if there are some of those people out there, but that's his lineage. 00:05:51.521 --> 00:06:01.000 So it came time to do Dallas and Jimmy Wallace asked me to come and play. 00:06:01.000 --> 00:06:13.608 And I asked Jimmy and Jeff and my cousin Eric Scatter, reggie, he's the drummer and and we we did, dallas and you and I had dinner and breakfast and we all hung out. 00:06:13.608 --> 00:06:15.091 We did, indeed it was. 00:06:15.091 --> 00:06:19.151 It was just a fab, fabulous time. 00:06:19.560 --> 00:06:21.067 Fabulous time, indeed. 00:06:21.067 --> 00:06:27.444 Another kind of small world moment is the Fender rep who I used to travel with quite a bit back in the day. 00:06:27.444 --> 00:06:33.076 Dan Gold is the bass player in your Neil Young outfit as well. 00:06:33.076 --> 00:06:36.223 It's a small world, is what it is. 00:06:36.985 --> 00:06:38.547 Yes, it's a very small world. 00:06:38.547 --> 00:06:41.451 Yeah, danny actually put the band together. 00:06:41.451 --> 00:06:47.860 The way it came together, greg is. 00:06:47.860 --> 00:06:50.728 I had to do the song Old man for a Wedding. 00:06:50.728 --> 00:06:58.511 Okay, I went into Danny's shop to buy some strings. 00:06:58.511 --> 00:07:02.531 He has a small shop called Danny's Guitar Shop in Narberth, pennsylvania. 00:07:02.531 --> 00:07:08.392 Went into Danny's shop and I said do you know the song Old man? 00:07:08.392 --> 00:07:11.730 And he said no, no, you know. 00:07:13.982 --> 00:07:14.343 We know. 00:07:14.384 --> 00:07:20.670 Dan and Danny said yeah. 00:07:20.670 --> 00:07:24.430 I said, well, you know, can you like see if this is right? 00:07:24.430 --> 00:07:34.047 So I played Old man and he said, you know, you kind of you sound like Neil Young a little bit when you sing and kind of look like the younger version of Neil Young. 00:07:34.047 --> 00:07:37.040 So maybe we could do a tribute band and make some money. 00:07:37.040 --> 00:07:46.990 And of course you know me, being the Philadelphia journeyman, that I am like just trying to keep going and make a living. 00:07:46.990 --> 00:07:48.603 I said, yeah, I could do that. 00:07:48.603 --> 00:07:53.492 I only knew old man and really one other song by Neil Young. 00:07:53.492 --> 00:08:08.569 And I learned, I learned his book and it's a great book and we go out and we're booked by this agency called Blue Raven Entertainment and we, we play all place and yeah, it's a lot of fun and I get to do Neil Young's catalog. 00:08:09.221 --> 00:08:10.105 And there are some great tunes. 00:08:10.105 --> 00:08:13.966 I'm an old Neil Young fan. 00:08:13.966 --> 00:08:20.732 As a matter of fact, lately I've been enjoying riffing on the epic three chords of Cortez the Killer. 00:08:20.732 --> 00:08:22.206 It is just an epic jam. 00:08:22.206 --> 00:08:24.286 Do you guys do that one? 00:08:27.180 --> 00:08:28.202 Actually we

don't, and I'll tell you why. 00:08:28.202 --> 00:08:40.697 It's because, like we do down by the river, oh yeah, we l girl in the sand, and those two songs, we, we, we stretch out and we, we jam on those okay but cortez the killer. 00:08:40.697 --> 00:08:45.246 We get a lot of requests for that actually, but we don't do that song. 00:08:45.246 --> 00:08:49.666 But I recently went to see Neil Young on May 12th. 00:08:49.865 --> 00:08:50.809 And he opened up with that. 00:08:52.001 --> 00:08:56.091 And he opened with it and it was just epic. 00:08:56.091 --> 00:09:00.883 I mean, you know the thing about his guitar playing. 00:09:00.883 --> 00:09:13.671 People ask me well, when it comes to Neil Young's guitar playing, you don't play Neil Young's riffs, you do kind of your own thing. 00:09:13.671 --> 00:09:19.424 And I'm more of a fusion player. 00:09:19.424 --> 00:09:21.508 I like blues, I like fusion. 00:09:21.508 --> 00:09:29.966 I delve into the metal side of things too, but if I were to say what I am, I'm more of a jazz fusion guy. 00:09:30.288 --> 00:09:30.509 Right. 00:09:31.701 --> 00:09:35.171 Leaning on the word fusion more than leaning on the word jazz. 00:09:35.171 --> 00:09:51.105 So I tend to think about, like, if Neil Young came to a show of mine, would would he want me to play all of his guitar riffs note for note? 00:09:51.105 --> 00:09:58.725 And I would have to say the answer would probably be no, right, he like me to stretch out and do my own thing. 00:09:58.725 --> 00:10:30.506 That's not to say that the audience like I get some audience that that, uh, you know, they love what I do, and then you get a person or two that'll say, well, you're not really playing neil young's like guitar riffs yeah, there'll always be a few of those people that wanted exactly a record, but that's, but that's I, but I, I sing all the songs authentically and we don't change keys, we do everything in the original key and I'm naturally, as a singer, a lyric tenor, so I can sing all that stuff. 00:10:31.349 --> 00:10:33.172 But you know certainly not how. 00:10:33.172 --> 00:10:39.164 You know, when I grew up, uh, my mother, my mother was a classical pianist. 00:10:39.164 --> 00:10:40.287 That's what she was. 00:10:40.287 --> 00:10:55.123 My father's family were all singers and so when my family would get together, everybody would come over and and like my mother be playing the piano, and I was like a little baby I thought everybody played. 00:10:55.123 --> 00:11:01.663 So when she came over that didn't play, I would bring them to the piano and like I would say, you know play. 00:11:01.663 --> 00:11:03.729 And well, we don't play. 00:11:03.729 --> 00:11:10.485 It was odd to me, I'd start crying. 00:11:10.485 --> 00:11:10.846 That's funny. 00:11:10.846 --> 00:11:16.654 In my grandmother's basement there was a Vox Jaguar organ and a Vox amp. 00:11:16.654 --> 00:11:23.509 My grandmother had a Vox Jaguar organ and my uncle Joe. 00:11:23.528 --> 00:11:38.025 He lived in Birmingham, he was part of the Muscle Shoals string section, so he played on all those records and I remember him telling me once when I was little. 00:11:38.025 --> 00:11:43.173 He said you know the Beatles' Long and Winding Road, I'm on that. 00:11:43.173 --> 00:11:45.522 I'm like what he goes. 00:11:45.522 --> 00:11:45.863 Yeah, he. 00:11:45.863 --> 00:11:47.841 He said I want to tell you something. 00:11:47.841 --> 00:11:57.285 He said phil specter when he he didn't want to record anything in england when it came to the orchestration, he recorded it all at muscle shawls. 00:11:57.285 --> 00:12:00.591 Ah, no, kidding, yeah. 00:12:00.591 --> 00:12:26.571 So I found that I'm like I mean, I quite didn't understand what he's talking about then, but like later, like you know, when he passed away, I got his practice violin it's a Robert Doling violin made in the early 20s and and you know that violin that sat in my curio for years and then one day I walked by it and it was like all right, it's time to play. 00:12:26.571 --> 00:12:32.964 So as an adult I started taking violin lessons and you know, it was kind of like. 00:12:32.964 --> 00:12:48.974 It's kind of like you know, you mentioned this early in the show Like I play saxophone, I play violin, I play piano, but the two instruments that I feel like I'm kind of versed on are guitar first and piano. 00:12:49.780 --> 00:12:52.028 I call myself a good actor. 00:12:52.028 --> 00:12:56.571 I'm a good actor. 00:12:56.571 --> 00:12:58.392 I can make you think I'm good. 00:12:58.392 --> 00:12:59.399 Oh, yeah, he's good. 00:12:59.399 --> 00:13:01.928 But you know, it's kind of an act. 00:13:01.928 --> 00:13:09.988 That's what I, because I work with some of the most amazing saxophonists and like, am I a great saxophonist? 00:13:09.988 --> 00:13:18.909 No, but what I've done on my records, like the record I made with Jimmy, the jazz record. 00:13:19.350 --> 00:13:21.835 I did play the melodies. 00:13:21.835 --> 00:13:24.548 I played all the melodies. 00:13:24.548 --> 00:13:28.265 I doubled the melodies on saxophone that I play on guitar. 00:13:28.265 --> 00:13:29.765 So I did do that. 00:13:29.765 --> 00:13:39.111 But when it came time to do the solos, I left it up to Mike Pedison, who played with Dave Brubeck and Andy Schnitzer you know what I mean and Bob Mincer. 00:13:39.111 --> 00:13:52.984 So that was, they're the guys who I hear as the soloist when I, when I make a record, so but you know, I, I it's, it's. 00:13:52.984 --> 00:14:07.844 It's pretty cool that, like you know, I can, I can hear a melody and like I'll, I'll, I'll play it on the saxophone and and like I'm like, yeah, this sounds like a saxophone melody, and then I'll kind of construct the song around that melody. 00:14:07.844 --> 00:14:14.322 You know, and and and and that's something like I run by jimmy haslip. 00:14:14.322 --> 00:14:15.866 I'll call jimmy up and I'll go. 00:14:15.866 --> 00:14:26.494 You know, I got this melody

idea, you know, and he goes okay, well, send it to me, you know, and then I'll send him a melody and some chords and then him and Scott Kinsey Do you know who Scott Kinsey is? 00:14:27.000 --> 00:14:28.807 I've heard that name, but I don't know who he is. 00:14:29.759 --> 00:14:35.591 He was basically the driving force behind Scott Henderson's Tribal Tech. 00:14:35.591 --> 00:14:43.812 Okay, all right, he was the keyboard cat and, like Scott, will just tear everything apart and re-harm everything. 00:14:43.812 --> 00:14:46.249 He's a master at re-harmonization. 00:14:46.249 --> 00:14:47.825 I mean a real master. 00:14:47.825 --> 00:14:51.509 I've learned so much just from making a record with Scott. 00:14:51.509 --> 00:14:53.981 Awesome, you know. 00:14:53.981 --> 00:15:00.440 So like that's what I think about my saxophone stuff and my violin playing. 00:15:01.001 --> 00:15:07.182 And my mother, my mother, was great as a critic playing, you know. 00:15:07.182 --> 00:15:08.385 And my mother, my mother, was great as a critic. 00:15:08.385 --> 00:15:35.846 My mother, like when I, when I was learning violin as an adult, she would sit at the piano and she'd go, okay, well, let me hear this, and I'd be, I'd be playing like a little piece out of I had this, this Bartok book with two-part inventions and they were really good for violin, and she would play the piano part, the violin part, and she would turn around and she would just say to me flat out, that was horrible, that was terrible. 00:15:35.846 --> 00:15:45.830 She said, your vibrato is terrible and and you know you, some of the stuff you intonate, well, but but others it's just horrible. 00:15:45.830 --> 00:15:49.650 And she goes before I come back to this, you have to really work on that. 00:15:49.650 --> 00:15:54.326 And I'd be like, ok, mom, and I'd really work on it. 00:15:54.600 --> 00:15:55.544 The mom was a savage. 00:15:55.544 --> 00:15:59.610 And then she'd say like it's passable. 00:15:59.610 --> 00:16:21.153 And then, like when I would play the piano, she would say and she'd be in the other room and I'd be playing on her yamaha piano and she'd be, she'd say, and she'd be like reading the paper or do something else and she'd go, stop banging on the piano, don't bang on the piano. 00:16:21.153 --> 00:16:29.121 It was like all I was like okay and and, but I, you know, okay and and, but I, you know, that's how I learned. 00:16:29.142 --> 00:16:29.903 I learned from my mom too, you know. 00:16:29.903 --> 00:16:32.688 So when did you want to start playing guitar and what was the impetus? 00:16:32.688 --> 00:16:34.592 I mean, obviously music was all around, but when? 00:16:39.148 --> 00:16:41.255 when was the guitar? 00:16:41.255 --> 00:16:48.039 Like I'm going to do this Um, I, I, I guess I was 11 and um, I had a lot of friends who played guitar. 00:16:48.039 --> 00:17:00.030 There was this kid named Johnny and in Philadelphia on Saturday morning it was like this local talent program. 00:17:00.030 --> 00:17:24.244 So he was on the talent program and him and his brothers were playing songs and singing three part harmony and he was 11 and they were incredible and I'm like, wait, that's Johnny, I know him. 00:17:24.244 --> 00:17:38.007 I got all excited and know you can hear my Philadelphia accent. 00:17:38.007 --> 00:17:39.346 That's all right. 00:17:40.407 --> 00:17:44.750 Monday morning I'm getting to school early and I'm going to watch him. 00:17:44.750 --> 00:17:46.671 He walked to school. 00:17:46.671 --> 00:17:53.714 My mother drove me to school and I watched him walk down the hill into the schoolyard and I ran up to him. 00:17:53.714 --> 00:17:59.557 I'm like I saw you on TV and he was like, yeah, it was me and my brother. 00:17:59.557 --> 00:18:01.238 So I'm like you guys are amazing. 00:18:01.238 --> 00:18:10.019 I'm like you're teaching me guitar right now. 00:18:10.019 --> 00:18:13.502 It was like a Gregory Cochran moment. 00:18:13.502 --> 00:18:14.824 I'm like you're teaching me now. 00:18:14.824 --> 00:18:21.071 I went to his house and and um, he had, he had an old acoustic guitar. 00:18:21.071 --> 00:18:32.727 I didn't have a guitar and and he, he, he showed me um, um, like a folk song, and and his his also. 00:18:32.727 --> 00:18:41.804 His mom was really into the beatles so he showed me the song and I love her okay which was a difficult song oh, yeah, no doubt. 00:18:43.965 --> 00:18:54.535 And but he was really diligent with me and took the time out and, you know, put the guitar in my hands and that was it. 00:18:54.535 --> 00:18:56.676 I was hooked, you were hooked. 00:18:56.676 --> 00:18:59.409 That was the end of it. 00:18:59.409 --> 00:19:03.932 And then, you know, then I really got into the Allman Brothers band. 00:19:03.932 --> 00:19:07.203 Then I really got into the Allman Brothers band. 00:19:08.085 --> 00:19:10.127 But earlier in that day too you were hanging out. 00:19:10.127 --> 00:19:16.395 The roadies kind of took a shine to you from the Allman Brothers and you got to play Dickie's Rig and stuff too right. 00:19:18.763 --> 00:19:27.721 You got to plug into it and it's kind of, yeah, yeah, yeah, it was crazy, that was a crazy, crazy time. 00:19:27.721 --> 00:19:29.123 That day. 00:19:29.123 --> 00:19:31.624 That day turned a lot of things for me. 00:19:31.624 --> 00:19:43.951 But I mean, I you know the Allman brothers um, there's such diversity and and there's so many genres that are connected to their music. 00:19:43.951 --> 00:19:52.857 You can study country, you can study jazz, you can study blues and you can study rock and roll and it's all in their music. 00:19:52.857 --> 00:20:06.516 I did a record with a leader back in 2002, and he was very influential with me doing Latin music. 00:20:06.516 --> 00:20:16.630 The record was called Sabroso and the leader's name was John Alberti, and the record did well. 00:20:16.630 --> 00:20:29.513 It went to number six on the charts and John also loved the

Allman Brothers and we made an instrumental version jazz Latin in memory of Richard. 00:20:29.814 --> 00:20:32.008 Reed yeah, it's a glorious selection. 00:20:32.900 --> 00:21:11.542 And it was interesting because John wanted to do it, like Dickie and Dwayne, because of J-Mo they got really interested in jazz so they would play Coltrane records and Miles records in the big house and John noted that Dickie Betts was also into Miles Davis, right that you know Vicki Betts was also into Miles Davis, right. 00:21:11.542 --> 00:21:13.086 A trumpet play the melody of in memory of Elizabeth Reed. 00:21:13.086 --> 00:21:36.333 I did like this little beginning that was kind of more almond brotherish, but once we got into tune, um, you know, it was more like an African six that we played in and we had just an incredible array of Philadelphia Latino and jazz musicians play on that record. 00:21:36.333 --> 00:21:36.993 It was great. 00:21:36.993 --> 00:21:42.557 And then, unfortunately, we were going to make the second record and John passed away. 00:21:42.557 --> 00:21:46.509 Oh, that's too bad, but that was, that was great. 00:21:46.509 --> 00:21:55.211 I mean, you know, philadelphia is full of like, really, um, history of like great writers. 00:21:55.211 --> 00:21:56.232 I mean there's, there's. 00:21:56.681 --> 00:21:58.627 I worked for a guy named Robert Hazard. 00:21:58.627 --> 00:22:02.188 Robert Hazard wrote girls just want to have fun. 00:22:02.188 --> 00:22:15.661 Oh yeah, cindy Lauper hit and um, robert told me the story of how he wrote, that he met this girl and this is like in the 70s. 00:22:15.661 --> 00:22:46.471 I didn't play with him until the mid 90s, but in the 70s he met this girl in Delaware, the state of Delaware, and went back to her apartment and she had to get up and go to work in the morning and she was having so much fun with him, they were having such a great time the night before and she said, listen, I'm going to leave, um, but you're free to just hang at the apartment and just lock up when you go. 00:22:46.471 --> 00:22:51.383 Just turn the bottom little knob and it'll lock and that'll be good and he goes, okay. 00:22:51.383 --> 00:23:01.397 So he, he went and she had this really big bathtub and he went into the bath, drew himself a bath and he was thinking of the song Norwegian Wood. 00:23:01.397 --> 00:23:06.038 You know, I once had a girl. 00:23:06.338 --> 00:23:08.698 So he was thinking of that song. 00:23:08.698 --> 00:23:22.337 But then he just thought of her and he thought, man, girls just want to have fun, Girls just want to have fun five in five minutes in the bathtub. 00:23:22.837 --> 00:23:23.679 That's so crazy. 00:23:24.420 --> 00:23:25.740 And and it became. 00:23:25.740 --> 00:23:28.844 It became Cindy Lauper's biggest song. 00:23:28.844 --> 00:23:37.857 Of course it went to number one, and Robert you know Robert wrote a lot of other great songs, but that was the hit that he wrote. 00:23:40.334 --> 00:23:42.000 That probably set him for life, am I right? 00:23:42.710 --> 00:23:44.977 Well, he called it the Magic Envelope. 00:23:44.977 --> 00:23:46.260 Let me tell you what happened. 00:23:46.260 --> 00:23:54.616 The Magic Envelope is a story about I believe it was Polygram that she was signed to. 00:23:54.616 --> 00:23:59.298 So the song becomes a huge hit and there's no money. 00:23:59.298 --> 00:24:04.654 Robert's like, wait a second, I'm the writer, there's no money. 00:24:04.654 --> 00:24:19.816 So he he's calling Lenny Pizzi and his Bill Ibe in Philly and they're like well, you know, we'll make a couple of calls and Nothing's happening. 00:24:19.816 --> 00:24:38.833 So one day Robert goes to the mailbox and there is a letter which looks like a letter from Polygram Records and he opens it up and it's a check for 750 000. 00:24:38.833 --> 00:24:42.378 And that was magic envelope. 00:24:42.378 --> 00:24:47.691 I I'm not sure exactly of of the amount, but it was somewhere in that neighborhood. 00:24:47.691 --> 00:24:55.144 And, and you know, that's when, when you could sell 5, 10 million records and you wrote the song. 00:24:55.730 --> 00:25:00.336 Today, of course, you know, with streaming, you know you get pennies on the dollar. 00:25:00.891 --> 00:25:04.481 That would be, you know, $500. 00:25:04.481 --> 00:25:07.656 Or $0.50. 00:25:08.018 --> 00:25:09.281 Exactly, exactly. 00:25:09.281 --> 00:25:16.654 We interrupt this regularly scheduled Gristle Infested conversation to give a special shout out to our friends at Fishman Transducers. 00:25:16.654 --> 00:25:21.458 Exactly, exactly, bringing the heat in the shadow of the Rocky Mountains. 00:25:21.458 --> 00:25:22.519 Was he able to transform? 00:25:22.519 --> 00:25:41.380 I would imagine he was smart with his dough and managed to put that to good use. 00:25:41.380 --> 00:25:43.049 Or was he a pirate? 00:25:43.049 --> 00:25:43.534 Yeah? 00:25:43.756 --> 00:25:45.795 very smart, Very smart guy. 00:25:45.795 --> 00:25:47.256 I learned a lot from him too. 00:25:47.256 --> 00:25:54.008 I played in his band for a number of years and we actually he would come up from florida. 00:25:54.008 --> 00:26:03.811 He owned two um antique stores a place in the adirondacks and a place in florida and unfortunately, robert also passed away. 00:26:03.811 --> 00:26:12.826 Young um and and, but I still talk to um his, his wife and his children. 00:26:12.826 --> 00:26:22.800 So I know his son's a guitar player too, Nice, but you know that's part of Philly's history. 00:26:22.800 --> 00:26:27.019 In fact, I'm going to have lunch tomorrow with Jimmy Bruno oh you are? 00:26:27.039 --> 00:26:28.343 Yeah, well, say hello to him. 00:26:28.343 --> 00:26:29.388 I haven't seen him in years. 00:26:29.388 --> 00:26:33.181 I used to see him at NAMM shows when I was. 00:26:33.181 --> 00:26:39.397 I'd be there for Fender and he was there with I can't remember who it was. 00:26:39.397 --> 00:26:43.914 Fender was doing a jazz guitar for a

while and he was the guy Benedetto. 00:26:44.440 --> 00:26:46.432 Yeah, he was a Benedetto guy, yeah. 00:26:46.432 --> 00:26:52.124 Yeah exactly Eastman guitars, those are nice. 00:26:54.349 --> 00:26:59.778 Went to launch a couple years a couple months ago actually, not even a month ago and we went back to his house. 00:26:59.778 --> 00:27:09.818 He has this little Hendrickson amp and I mean, you know he's such a great player I learned, like my jazz thing. 00:27:09.818 --> 00:27:14.980 Like I had this friend who studied with Pat Martino. 00:27:14.980 --> 00:27:17.986 That is back in 1990. 00:27:17.986 --> 00:27:31.021 And he came into this music store where I was kind of playing around and I was, you know, just like this rock kid and he was this rock kid who was studying with Pat Martino. 00:27:31.021 --> 00:27:33.377 I'm like, man, you're really good man. 00:27:33.377 --> 00:27:34.635 He goes yeah, you're good too. 00:27:34.635 --> 00:27:37.960 Why don't we get together, like like learn some real book stuff? 00:27:37.960 --> 00:27:40.238 And I'm like, yeah, man, that sounds great. 00:27:40.238 --> 00:27:46.557 So I would go to his house every day, we would practice the real book. 00:27:47.270 --> 00:27:51.939 And about six months later Matt said to me his name was Matthew. 00:27:51.939 --> 00:27:54.443 He said we're going to go get a gig now. 00:27:54.443 --> 00:28:02.333 I'm like, ok, he goes, meet me here Tuesday night six o'clock. 00:28:02.333 --> 00:28:12.036 I'm like, ok, so we drive into Philadelphia, we go to this place called JJ's Grotto and Matt walks in dressed in a suit. 00:28:12.036 --> 00:28:13.136 I'm dressed in jeans. 00:28:13.136 --> 00:28:15.498 I'm like, what am I supposed to do? 00:28:15.498 --> 00:28:18.219 He goes just shut up and let me take the lead here. 00:28:18.219 --> 00:28:19.779 I'm like okay. 00:28:20.380 --> 00:28:26.561 And so Matt walks, walks in, and the um, one of the owners. 00:28:26.561 --> 00:28:27.702 This was the grotto. 00:28:27.702 --> 00:28:37.606 It was downstairs on 21st Street in Philadelphia and it's the place where Jimmy Bruno made history. 00:28:37.606 --> 00:28:45.609 I mean, that's when Jimmy came back from LA to Philadelphia that's where he played was the Grotto Got it the JJ Grotto. 00:28:45.609 --> 00:28:50.923 So Matt knew that it was a jazz like a famous Philadelphia jazz room. 00:28:50.923 --> 00:28:54.780 And so Matt walked in there and Ricky and Jack owned it. 00:28:54.780 --> 00:29:00.190 So Jack greeted Matt at the door, said would you guys like a table? 00:29:00.190 --> 00:29:04.059 And Matt said and there was two kids playing jazz. 00:29:04.059 --> 00:29:09.761 It was a Tuesday night and they had two kids from UARPS playing jazz. 00:29:09.761 --> 00:29:16.303 And Matt said just to Jack he said, listen, we're here to get their gig. 00:29:16.303 --> 00:29:19.070 Jack, what he goes. 00:29:19.070 --> 00:29:23.877 Yeah, we're a lot better than them and we're going to bring people in here. 00:29:23.877 --> 00:29:26.057 And I was horrified. 00:29:26.057 --> 00:29:28.096 I was like what? 00:29:28.096 --> 00:29:31.592 Oh my God, he goes. 00:29:31.592 --> 00:29:32.938 Yeah, try us out. 00:29:32.938 --> 00:29:37.237 And Jack, ricky, came over. 00:29:37.237 --> 00:29:41.084 And now Jack and Ricky are looking at Matt like he's nuts. 00:29:41.084 --> 00:29:49.057 And Jack says to Matt he goes all right, big shot, you're on, these guys are off next week. 00:29:49.057 --> 00:29:54.675 Anyway, you come in here with him or whoever else you're going to bring in here and you guys play. 00:29:54.675 --> 00:30:12.039 So we played the next Tuesday night and we brought a ton of our friends 1990, and everybody came in and Matt was a great player and we really honed. 00:30:12.039 --> 00:30:14.636 We were playing stuff like there will never be another. 00:30:14.636 --> 00:30:20.015 You, my, you know my favorite things, my one and only love um, all the things you are. 00:30:20.015 --> 00:30:32.894 We play all these standards and we played them as a duo and it's and, and Jack came up to to Matt at the end of the gig and he goes all right, you guys got the gig. 00:30:32.954 --> 00:30:38.700 Now I had that gig for 10 years. 00:30:38.700 --> 00:30:45.395 Matt got married like three years later and had a little baby and so he left the gig. 00:30:45.395 --> 00:30:53.201 But then I had other partners in the gig and I had it till the year 2000 until they changed ownership. 00:30:53.201 --> 00:30:57.615 And that's how I learned the real book stuff by doing it. 00:30:57.615 --> 00:31:02.170 Every single week I got paid like 50 bucks and a big bowl of spaghetti. 00:31:02.170 --> 00:31:22.787 It was great food and and we had the greatest time learning in there and I had I had um, one of sandali's students, uh, I had a great guitar player named jay scott and another great guitar player named chris gordon, um and matt hollingsworth. 00:31:22.826 --> 00:31:28.905 They were my partners all throughout that run and it was great, I mean, and jimmy bruno used to come in. 00:31:28.905 --> 00:31:38.115 Every tuesday night when we played, jimmy bruno would come in and he would grab whoever's guitar was there and he goes all right, joe, let's play. 00:31:38.115 --> 00:31:44.219 And then I'd have to play his tempos and he goes ready One, two, da, da, da, da, come on comp. 00:31:44.219 --> 00:31:58.253 And it's like I'm playing, you know, and I'm playing bass lines with tour and I'm comping with Bruno and I'm like slow the fuck down. 00:31:58.253 --> 00:32:00.798 He'd be like pushing me. 00:32:00.798 --> 00:32:05.244 And then, you know, we would get into discussions about guitars and players. 00:32:05.244 --> 00:32:14.183 And then one night he brought it was me and Chris Gordon on this run and he brings, he goes. 00:32:14.183 --> 00:32:18.836 Jimmy comes down the steps, there's nobody in the place yet it's about 6.30. 00:32:18.836 --> 00:32:34.724 And you know it was a 7

to 10 gig and me and Chris were getting ready to play and you know, chris is like this 21-year-old kid we're both young and, like you know, just hungry and Jimmy brings, he goes. 00:32:34.766 --> 00:33:04.981 I brought people to see you tonight and in comes Pat Martino and this is like 1991 or no, I forget and Papa John DeFrancesco, joey DeFrancesco and that whole crew, they all walk in and Pat sits at the front table with Jimmy and like there's like it was set up like kind of Italian style, where it was like one long table and then tables on the side. 00:33:04.981 --> 00:33:06.565 Right, that's the restaurant. 00:33:06.565 --> 00:33:14.153 So Pat's sitting in front and so Chris is in the back with me and Chris goes. 00:33:14.153 --> 00:33:19.960 I can't play, I'm like just shut up and play. 00:33:19.960 --> 00:33:28.501 We played our set and Pat, I tell this story a lot. 00:33:28.589 --> 00:33:48.683 This is really funny, greg, pat's sitting there and watching me and watching Chris and we get done playing and Pat's drinking wine, okay, and Jimmy's reading the newspaper over Pat and Jimmy's listening to what Pat and Pat and I sit down and I go. 00:33:48.683 --> 00:33:52.527 You know, pat, this is really an honor having you here. 00:33:52.527 --> 00:33:56.016 He goes well and Pat talked like this. 00:33:56.016 --> 00:34:06.494 Well, joe, you know, and I said to him I said you know, because I don't really feel like I'm a legit jazz player and, by the way, I still don't. 00:34:06.494 --> 00:34:15.454 By the way, you know, I'm a rock and roll player that you know learned the real book stuff, right, the music. 00:34:15.454 --> 00:34:34.507 And he goes well, joe, let me tell you your playing is jazz, because jazz is a reflection of your personality and how you emote your music in a feeling. 00:34:34.507 --> 00:34:54.438 And Jimmy's standing over Pat and Pat gets done this sentence and there's a long pause and Jimmy takes the newspaper, hits him over the head and goes shut up head and go shut up. 00:34:56.623 --> 00:34:57.643 That's quite humorous. 00:34:59.510 --> 00:35:01.177 Yeah, it was really crazy man. 00:35:01.510 --> 00:35:07.855 Well, talk about a little bit of that Philly jazz royalty stuff, because you know you had Dennis Sandoli. 00:35:07.855 --> 00:35:28.405 My whole college curriculum that my guy used was basically he used guitar lore by Dennis Sandoli as the basis of the curriculum and Sandoli taught Pat Martino and John Coltrane took lessons from Sandoli in terms of theory and so on and so forth. 00:35:28.405 --> 00:35:29.775 Did you ever encounter Sandoli? 00:35:29.775 --> 00:35:31.657 Did you ever take any lessons from him or anything like that? 00:35:33.050 --> 00:35:36.422 No, but I got to be good friends with him. 00:35:37.125 --> 00:35:48.639 Okay, there was this guitar player named John who was one of the grotto partners that I had and he knew Dennis because he studied with Dennis. 00:35:48.639 --> 00:35:59.724 Dennis wanted to sell his D'Angelico because he had a 19-year-old daughter and Dennis was 82. 00:35:59.724 --> 00:36:09.637 So his daughter he was paying for her college tuition, so he needed to sell his DA. 00:36:09.637 --> 00:36:37.887 So John and I met with Dennis and, um, you know, uh, john knew this guitar dealer but we met at Pina's, which is an Italian restaurant in Roxborough where Dennis lived. 00:36:37.887 --> 00:36:51.889 He lived in Roxborough at this time in a little apartment, so I had this girlfriend back then and Dennis loved young girls and he loved my girlfriend. 00:36:51.889 --> 00:36:56.157 Dennis loved young girls and he loved my girlfriend. 00:36:56.157 --> 00:37:00.623 So he said let's go to dinner, you bring her with, you Bring her. 00:37:00.623 --> 00:37:08.324 So we would sit down at dinner and we did this for a whole summer. 00:37:08.324 --> 00:37:24.494 We would go every Sunday, we would go to penis and I would pick Dennis up and my girlfriend would be with me and and John would be with me too, and we would sit and order a bowl of spaghetti and Dennis told me all about Coltrane. 00:37:24.494 --> 00:37:27.721 I'm like, what was it like? 00:37:27.721 --> 00:37:40.697 He said well, you know, he said John, like he said, well, you know, he said John, john wanted to, um, wanted to keep playing in the higher register on his tenor saxophone. 00:37:40.697 --> 00:37:45.731 I'm like, yeah, well, I mean, he said you know, and, and I so I told John. 00:37:45.731 --> 00:37:50.280 I said, john, you need to go out and buy a soprano saxophone. 00:37:50.280 --> 00:37:55.369 And so it was dennis who got john to buy a soprano. 00:37:55.510 --> 00:38:05.731 And of course, my favorite things is, you know, one of the biggest, uh, I'll say the most famous of coltrane's. 00:38:05.731 --> 00:38:21.981 I'll call them hits, right, I mean really this if you study like Giant Steps, giant Steps is such a great study, I've played it and I'm still trying to play it at, like you know, or 180. 00:38:21.981 --> 00:38:35.255 Like, I'm not going to play it at 240. 00:38:35.255 --> 00:38:42.784 You know, I'm just not Right and play 16th notes at 240. 00:38:42.784 --> 00:38:48.324 No, but, but you know that that Dennis told me all about. 00:38:48.324 --> 00:39:00.063 You know John's addiction and John was very shy around Dennis when, when John was was using and Dennis knew him when he was using too, got it. 00:39:00.063 --> 00:39:09.740 So yeah, the other Philly thing, like I'm good friends with Michael Pedison, who's an amazing tenor saxophonist. 00:39:09.740 --> 00:39:14.041 And of course the other lineage is the Brecker brothers. 00:39:14.041 --> 00:39:17.375 You know they're both from Germantown. 00:39:17.655 --> 00:39:23.244 Okay, and Michael Brecker and Pedersen were best friends. 00:39:23.244 --> 00:39:24.891 They were great friends. 00:39:24.891 --> 00:39:34.918 And Brecker actually said you know, michael, I took a lot from what you did and applied it to what I do.

00:39:34.918 --> 00:39:49.539 And Pedersen, I'm doing another record that's in the infancy right now, but it's going to be called Philadelphia and I've got Jimmy producing it. 00:39:49.539 --> 00:40:00.976 We're going to get Randy on it, randy Brecker, of course we can't get Michael passed away, but Jeff's going to play, lorber's going to play, patterson's going to play on it. 00:40:01.891 --> 00:40:08.396 And then there's a whole lineage of Philadelphia bass players that people don't know about, and I'll mention their names. 00:40:08.396 --> 00:40:16.623 There's Steve Beskron, a fantastic electric and upright player who played with Ray Charles. 00:40:16.623 --> 00:40:31.161 There's also Chico Huff, an incredible bass player who played I think he did some stuff with James Taylor early on. 00:40:31.161 --> 00:40:36.802 Then there's Mike Boone, who frequents Smalls in New York City. 00:40:36.802 --> 00:40:42.778 If you know, smalls, it's a famous jazz band Right, all those in New York. 00:40:42.778 --> 00:41:03.751 And then there's guys like Kevin McConnell, who's a great upright player, and there's a guy named Glenn Marazazzo, who's a great bass player, and then, um, you know, there's also um bruce kaminsky, who developed the kid bass that a lot of bass players are using. 00:41:03.751 --> 00:41:11.030 It's this, this electric bass on a uh, on a tripod sure yep and upright and he's a great. 00:41:11.190 --> 00:41:23.498 So there's all this lineage of Philadelphia and I apologize if I'm missing anybody, but those players I know personally and you know just just great bass players, so. 00:41:23.498 --> 00:41:25.791 And then there's the horn players, you know there's. 00:41:25.791 --> 00:41:52.849 There's the Brecker brothers, there's Andy Schnitzer's from Philadelphia, and you know I could go on and on, and there's the Schnitzer's from Philadelphia, and you know I could go on and on, and there's a fantastic pianist's, also a Philadelphia cat, who plays keyboards. 00:41:52.849 --> 00:41:57.110 You know, and I have them on the Bootsy record. 00:41:57.110 --> 00:42:05.356 You know I did that in 2020 with With those guys, when I met Billy Sheehan. 00:42:05.356 --> 00:42:14.878 I met Billy Sheehan, I played NAMM in 2020 and Roto Sound did this thing and I played with Billy Sheehan and I asked Billy to be on the record. 00:42:14.878 --> 00:42:23.077 So, and Anil and all those guys that I just mentioned, they're on that record too. 00:42:23.077 --> 00:42:30.416 By the way, none of my records are released yet because I'm still waiting for Bootsy and Distribution and all this other stuff. 00:42:30.416 --> 00:42:32.597 I understand it. 00:42:32.597 --> 00:42:36.820 We're trying to make things happen, but you know what I'm talking about, you know. 00:42:37.891 --> 00:42:38.697 So what do you think about? 00:42:38.697 --> 00:42:40.530 What do you think it is about Philly? 00:42:40.530 --> 00:42:41.311 I mean, obviously it's a. 00:42:41.311 --> 00:42:46.657 It's

a sizable population center, so there would be talent, but there's, you know. 00:42:46.657 --> 00:42:47.829 But there needs to be more than this. 00:42:47.829 --> 00:42:58.063 So was there a pretty robust scene in terms of people who could stay local and make a living, or is it like most places now, where that's becoming increasingly more difficult? 00:42:58.063 --> 00:43:10.338 But at one time, was it a place where that was a bona fide way to go about making a living was just staying local and being able to play a variety of gigs and do the deed? 00:43:11.639 --> 00:43:13.943 Okay, so we'll talk about that. 00:43:13.943 --> 00:43:14.864 Let's talk about that. 00:43:14.864 --> 00:43:34.250 When you are a working musician like me, who you know, I mean I have a little notoriety because I, you know, I do all guitar network Bonamassa's thing. 00:43:34.530 --> 00:43:34.730 Right. 00:43:35.574 --> 00:44:00.925 And you know, actually it was partly due to my relationship with all guitar network and Bonamassa that I got this big feature in Vintage Guitar Magazine a couple of years ago with Joe Bonamassa but if you're like me, who's relatively unknown, and all these great players in Philly. 00:44:00.925 --> 00:44:04.670 There's always the corporate wedding scene. 00:44:04.670 --> 00:44:14.067 Sure, I did that for years and years and years because you know, on a private gig you can make your. 00:44:14.067 --> 00:44:17.150 That's kind of like the mainstay of your money, sure. 00:44:17.150 --> 00:44:19.222 And then other stuff you fill in. 00:44:19.222 --> 00:44:35.117 You fill in with studio work, you fill in with students, you fill in with doing a bar gig once in a while, you fill in doing a country club gig and the scene for making original music and making money at it. 00:44:35.739 --> 00:44:46.181 Nah, that, really, if you're gonna have a house and and a mortgage and, and you know, pay your car payment and this, and that you got to do a diverse amount of things. 00:44:46.181 --> 00:44:52.688 I mean I tour with two tribute bands I'll play. 00:44:52.688 --> 00:44:55.552 Today I'm playing a six to nine. 00:44:55.552 --> 00:45:12.869 I'm doing a corporate event where I'll take my Martin D28, take my little crate amp that has like two plugs for my mic and one for my guitar and go and sing a bunch of stuff for three hours and make real money. 00:45:13.190 --> 00:45:13.411 Right. 00:45:16.360 --> 00:45:19.447 So can you make money as an artist? 00:45:19.447 --> 00:45:20.659 That's your question. 00:45:20.659 --> 00:45:24.355 I would think it's very, very difficult. 00:45:24.355 --> 00:45:37.000 If you're the Jimmy Haslips and the Jeff Lorbers of the world, yeah, you can get a good shed tour in the summer and I'm trying, I'm trying to do some of that. 00:45:37.000 --> 00:45:39.447 You know, that's what I did in Dallas. 00:45:39.447 --> 00:45:44.045 I have a couple of promoters where I've done well in Texas. 00:45:44.045 --> 00:45:47.161 I do well at certain rooms in New York. 00:45:47.161 --> 00:45:53.945 I do well in Connecticut, but it's hard, yeah, it's hard, it's hard to do. 00:45:53.945 --> 00:46:01.322 You know, it's like nice, nice people will always take you in, you know, and promote you and help you. 00:46:01.322 --> 00:46:12.684 Like you like you're giving me this opportunity to be on this podcast, so this is an opportunity for me to like okay, I branch out a little bit more. 00:46:12.684 --> 00:46:20.289 More people get to know who I am, and you know, and we're all trying to help each other. 00:46:20.309 --> 00:46:20.795 I met Gary Hoey. 00:46:20.795 --> 00:46:23.182 I met Gary Hoey in 2014,. 00:46:23.182 --> 00:46:33.882 Right, and I'm like coming to Texas for the first time because of a crazy gig that I had that that I met Jimmy Wallace on. 00:46:33.882 --> 00:46:38.081 So I go to Texas Dallas international bar festival. 00:46:38.081 --> 00:46:44.840 I'm like I knew Gary Hoey because he did Hocus Pocus and like I was a fan, I'm a huge fan of this guy. 00:46:44.840 --> 00:46:52.101 He meets me, he hears me play and he goes hey man, come on, come on on my stage, let's play Right. 00:46:52.101 --> 00:46:55.949 And I'm like, oh, and it's Gary Howie doing this. 00:46:55.949 --> 00:46:59.746 It's like I'm like, well, you're going to wait, you're going to ask me up. 00:46:59.746 --> 00:47:01.900 He goes yeah, you're coming up to play with me. 00:47:01.900 --> 00:47:05.288 And I'm like, wow. 00:47:05.288 --> 00:47:05.855 Like. 00:47:05.855 --> 00:47:09.440 No, I don't know any like big rock star, I would ever do that. 00:47:09.460 --> 00:47:10.940 Wow, like no, I don't know any like big rock star would ever do that. 00:47:10.960 --> 00:47:13.103 True, that's the type of cat he is Like. 00:47:13.103 --> 00:47:17.148 He he's more than just like this incredible guitar player. 00:47:17.148 --> 00:47:23.599 He's an incredible human being and he translates that through his music. 00:47:23.599 --> 00:47:25.909 You could see that this guy's real, you know. 00:47:25.909 --> 00:47:32.496 And so, like we're all just, I mean, you know, the point I'm trying to make is we're all trying to help each other. 00:47:32.496 --> 00:47:46.436 You know, if I can, if I can help somebody, um, uh, get a gig or or do something, I'm, I'm all about it, man, because it'll come back and and reflect on me, you know absolutely that's. 00:47:46.536 --> 00:47:48.762 That's kind of really what I'm about, you know. 00:47:49.625 --> 00:47:53.728 Now, had you, have you ever moved away from Philly and lived other places? 00:47:53.728 --> 00:47:58.985 Or just you've gone and gigged other places, obviously, but any over the years? 00:47:58.985 --> 00:48:00.822 Have you ever contemplated going elsewhere? 00:48:03.655 --> 00:48:09.577 Well, I was in New York for a little while, but outside of that, no, just Philadelphia. 00:48:09.577 --> 00:48:15.057 If I were to go someplace else, I love california, so I, I would love to be.

00:48:15.057 --> 00:48:29.507 I would love to be in la um, just because I like the weather and and I'm out there now, but, um, I you know I love the east coast yeah I, I, you know, I, I love where I am. 00:48:29.788 --> 00:48:36.704 There's such a great wealth of players here and of course now, as you know, probably you're you're feeling the same way. 00:48:36.704 --> 00:48:38.228 I'm just rooted here. 00:48:38.228 --> 00:48:54.804 All my friends are here, like there, there's just such a great wealth of great guitar players, great, uh, musicians here, the guitar players here, I, I can name people like Kevin Hansen, which nobody knows, incredible guitar player. 00:48:54.804 --> 00:49:04.065 This guy, greg Davis, who's here, incredible guitar player, jimmy Bruno, who's here. 00:49:04.065 --> 00:49:05.728 There's all these great players. 00:49:05.728 --> 00:49:10.963 There's another guy that I play with we do this duo thing called Vahe Sarkeesian. 00:49:10.963 --> 00:49:12.989 He's a great guitar player. 00:49:12.989 --> 00:49:15.641 Chris Gordon's a great guitar player. 00:49:15.641 --> 00:49:17.206 I can go on and on and on. 00:49:17.206 --> 00:49:25.838 There's many, many great guitarists here and we all respect and help each other. 00:49:25.838 --> 00:49:31.302 Everybody here that I know is not all about themselves. 00:49:31.302 --> 00:49:33.608 Oh man, it's, it's not. 00:49:34.976 --> 00:49:49.677 I guess I'm too old for that now I understand maybe I'm just too old for it and like, my thing now is just like you know, I just want to play music and and play with people that I love and make music with people that I really love. 00:49:49.677 --> 00:49:54.422 You know, like I did, I've done music with everybody I've done. 00:49:54.422 --> 00:49:57.324 You know I was Michael Cimbello's musical director. 00:49:57.324 --> 00:50:01.449 You know I've played with Bootsy Collins. 00:50:01.449 --> 00:50:04.070 I did three records with him. 00:50:04.070 --> 00:50:18.063 You know, the last record I did with him was Worldwide Funk with Eric Gales and Buckethead were on that too, wild Brian, but you know all those but Bootsy was. 00:50:18.063 --> 00:50:20.623 He was another guy that was really really good to me. 00:50:21.155 --> 00:50:22.081 I was playing at NAMM. 00:50:22.081 --> 00:50:33.246 I was playing at NAMM and Bernie Worrell watched me play and said, hey, bootsy, you got to see this white kid play guitar, come over here. 00:50:33.246 --> 00:50:39.327 So, you know, and I met Bootsy that day and Bootsy said, hey, man, let's, let's start doing stuff. 00:50:39.327 --> 00:50:40.916 I'm like, yeah, right, ok. 00:50:40.916 --> 00:50:42.141 Well, you're Bootsy Collins. 00:50:42.141 --> 00:50:42.983 Yeah, ok, right, right. 00:50:42.983 --> 00:50:52.820 I gave him my email and like Two days later, you know, I had a track and an email hey, joe, it's Bootsy, what can you do with this? 00:50:52.820 --> 00:50:56.420 That's wild Two days later. 00:50:56.420 --> 00:51:00.706 I mean, you know, you know, you know NAMM. 00:51:00.706 --> 00:51:02.081 I met a lot of people at NAMM. 00:51:02.101 --> 00:51:04.543 Sure, and that doesn't happen to your point. 00:51:04.543 --> 00:51:20.815 I mean, you meet a lot of people and a lot of people say a lot of things, and then every now and again they follow up and you're like I, I can't believe that just happened you like all the stuff you've done since I've known you. 00:51:21.396 --> 00:51:27.956 I met you like maybe eight years ago and you know, and I I mean I knew you were great back then. 00:51:27.956 --> 00:51:37.050 I remember the first time that I really met you was across from the show when you and I we were all staying at the Hilton Garden Inn. 00:51:37.050 --> 00:51:37.831 Remember that year? 00:51:37.891 --> 00:51:38.833 Yes, exactly. 00:51:38.873 --> 00:51:46.907 Yeah, and you and I were eating breakfast and I had known about you, but I hadn't really seen you play yet. 00:51:46.907 --> 00:51:52.498 But I remember we were sitting down and then you said, all right, really seen you play yet, and but but I remember we were sitting down and then you said, all right, it's time to go. 00:51:52.498 --> 00:52:06.237 And then you stood up and I'm like, oh my God, this guy's big and like my jaws hit the ground and I'm like, oh my God, man, I got to talk to this guy more. 00:52:06.237 --> 00:52:09.925 Some of his stuff know. 00:52:09.925 --> 00:52:14.775 But, um, yeah, yeah, we meet a lot of people at NAMM. 00:52:14.775 --> 00:52:15.858 That's how I met Bootsy. 00:52:15.858 --> 00:52:16.581 It's how I met. 00:52:16.581 --> 00:52:23.418 I met Santana at NAMM, um, and that was through Andy Timmons okay, sure, andy yeah. 00:52:24.239 --> 00:52:31.090 So, andy, um, andy watched me play and he, he, oh, yeah, man, you're a great player, and all this. 00:52:31.090 --> 00:52:46.760 And, and I was playing in the booth and Santana walked by and I didn't see him and he, he, I was playing and he grabbed my hand and shook my hand and I'm like who is this Jake of my hand? 00:52:46.760 --> 00:52:49.596 I look up and it's Carlos Santana Wild. 00:52:49.596 --> 00:52:52.041 And so he, he walks. 00:52:52.041 --> 00:52:59.539 It's Carlos Santana Wild, and so he walks to the Mesa booth right, which was right past wood violins at that time. 00:52:59.539 --> 00:53:03.708 If you remember, the Mesa booth that year was the cafeteria, was right in front of me. 00:53:03.708 --> 00:53:13.601 I was playing for the Andrea Fender and we were demoing Wawa pedals Snarling Dog's Wawa pedals. 00:53:13.661 --> 00:53:14.824 Snarling Dog. 00:53:14.824 --> 00:53:15.507 I remember that. 00:53:16.074 --> 00:53:17.300 I would just play the tracks. 00:53:17.300 --> 00:53:26.025 So Carlos went into the Mesa booth and there was this long line of people and Andy Timmons said come on, come on, I'm going to get you to meet Carlos. 00:53:26.025 --> 00:53:30.639 And then that's how I met Carlos Santana that year Wild yeah. 00:53:30.639 --> 00:53:32.581 And he gave me a quote for my website. 00:53:32.581 --> 00:53:33.483 That's cool. 00:53:33.483 --> 00:53:42.152 Quote Carlos and he goes uh, yeah, and he stood there and he goes Joe, keep doing what you're doing. 00:53:46.184 --> 00:53:50.956 We need you Awesome, yeah, awesome. 00:53:50.956 --> 00:53:51.778 Well, listen, my friend. 00:53:51.778 --> 00:53:54.065 Thank you so much for spending some time with us. 00:53:54.065 --> 00:53:55.842 It was great hearing your stories. 00:53:55.842 --> 00:53:57.501 I always enjoy them immensely. 00:53:57.501 --> 00:54:02.626 I encourage people to check out your stuff, to go to your website, which is just Joe mass. 00:54:03.427 --> 00:54:04.557 Yeah, joe masscom. 00:54:04.557 --> 00:54:07.126 Or or just go to Facebook or Instagram. 00:54:07.126 --> 00:54:12.306 It's just Joe mass and Joe Mass 94, les Paul. 00:54:12.306 --> 00:54:18.367 You can find that at Instagram and then just Joe Mass on Facebook and TikTok. 00:54:18.367 --> 00:54:21.382 It'll go to everything Perfect. 00:54:22.563 --> 00:54:24.068 Yeah Well, listen, you have a good one. 00:54:24.068 --> 00:54:27.539 Say hello to Jimmy Bruno for me, and also say hello to old Danny Gold. 00:54:28.543 --> 00:54:29.806 I will Love you, Greg. 00:54:30.175 --> 00:54:31.159 Likewise, my friend. 00:54:31.159 --> 00:54:32.701 It was a pleasure, Great seeing you. 00:54:32.701 --> 00:54:34.498 Great seeing you too. 00:54:34.498 --> 00:54:35.422 Have a good one. 00:54:35.422 --> 00:54:36.164 We'll talk to you soon. 00:54:36.164 --> 00:54:37.476 See you later. 00:54:37.476 --> 00:54:40.885 Bye-bye, Folks. 00:54:40.885 --> 00:54:42.143 Thanks so much for tuning in. 00:54:42.143 --> 00:54:49.797 We certainly do appreciate you stopping by and partaking in the most savory chewable gristle this side of Cucamonga. 00:54:49.797 --> 00:55:03.815 Gregory Cock, looking forward to seeing you again next week, even though I won't actually see you, but I'll sense your presence.