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forward. I love that concept. It's not that you're going to get it all right, but when you come with humility and say things to your daughter like, I know I don't understand, say that she's having a meltdown. You don't understand, dad. You never have. You get to lean in and say, you're right, I don't. I've never been a girl. I've never been your age. I've never been your gender. But I want to understand. Can you help me understand? So. Got it. Three parts. I know I don't understand, but I want to understand. Help me understand goes a long way to bridging the gap between where she is and where you want to be and where you are now. 00:06:53 S1: This is in a, in a sense, the listener speaker technique of hearing her, of saying, okay, what I hear you saying is this, am I getting that right? And then moving, taking the next step forward. Right. 00:07:08 S2: Exactly, exactly. And saying, teach me. I think another great question because you, Chris, we've talked so many times and I love the fact that you're a wise, seasoned dad. You're a girl dad to five daughters, you know. And, you know, I'm the oldest of four daughters. So you and I speak a similar language from both sides of this. You as a dad, me as a daughter. And what we're saying to dads is that there are practical ways that you can bridge the gap. It's okay if you don't have the language already, you know, in your mind. Or maybe your dad didn't model this to you, but we're giving you practical action steps, ways that today you can reach your daughter's heart. And one of those other questions you can ask is ask your doctor of any age. Tell me how I can be a better dad to you today. What do you need today from me? And it's a great conversation starter where a daughter may have more than one idea for you, but it gets the conversation started where you come and say, here's my heart. I want to be a better dad, and I want you to tell me one thing I can do today. 00:08:13 S1: But there are a lot of daughters who would shut down at that, and they would say, uh, I don't, I don't know, because they, they, they don't have a vision that their dad can be somebody in their life, that they know who is present, who does care about them and show them the kind of love. Jen said this in answer to my question online. What was your dad unable to give you that you desperately needed? She said the same things he desperately needed but didn't get affirmation and spoken love, tender touch, emotional connection. But then she says, now we're learning together. Isn't that good? 00:08:51 S2: Wow. That's powerful. We're learning together. See, that's the thing. If a dad comes with humility, is teachable and open. It's never too late, is it, Chris? It's. It's never too late for a dad to start learning more about his daughter. 00:09:08 S1: And for a dad to be able to say if he's worried about making a mistake, to be able to say, you know what? I got that so wrong. I'm so sorry. I want another chance here. You know, and to and

to say, I'm not giving up. I'm not going to retreat. But it's so easy to retreat. And that's why I'm so glad the dad whisperer's with us doctor Michelle Watson Canfield. Featured resource is let's talk conversation starters for dads and daughters. You can find it linked@chris.org. Two people I want to call here today, maybe three. One is the dad who says, I don't have a clue what to do. I really want to love my daughter Well. And. And you need some help. I've got the dad whisperer right here. Eight. Seven. Seven. Five. Four. Eight. Three. Six. Seven. Five. Or maybe you're a daughter. And you're saying I want to connect with my dad, but I don't know how to do that. Is there anything that I can do to kind of prime the pump? Love to hear from you. Or if you are an older person and not you don't have to be in your hundreds, you know, you could be in your 50s and you've got that father wound that Michelle just talked about, and you want to know how to get over that. Give us a call (877) 548-3675. Our number doctor Michelle Watson Canfield is with us today at the radio backyard fence (877) 548-3675. Getting dads and daughters together today at the radio backyard fence. Father's Day is coming up on Sunday, and we're going to talk about dads and daughters today and getting them together, as well as talk about some of the the father wounds that many women still deal with. And if that's you, stay with us. There's more to come right here with Doctor Michelle Watson Canfield. We have a link to her website. You can read her blog. You can watch her podcast, which she does the Dad Whisperer podcast as well as see the book. Let's talk conversation starters for dads and daughters and the book dad, here's what I really need from you. All of those resources linked at Chris Fabry live.org. Chris Fabry dot ORG. Daughter wounds for the adult daughter who is this is a haunting thing for her. What do you say? 00:11:43 S2: Well, first of all, I just want to say from my heart to yours. I'm so sorry that you're hurt. I'm sorry that you've been hurt by a dad who perhaps hasn't looked at his own wounds, right? Because hurt people, hurt people. So I just want to start by saying I'm sorry. And my heart hurts with yours. And I also want to challenge you to begin to take steps forward in a healing process. Because if you stay stuck in a wound, you'll make poor decisions right out of the place of the wound. Just like happens when we have physical wounds, right? We're limited in mobility by the places physically where we have injury. Well, it's the same on the inside. And so what I would love to, to just share, Chris, is a model that I use where I take the word heal HEAL, and this isn't in any way, shape or form meant to be a pat answer. Like what we know about process is it takes time. And so this isn't saying you can do this in one day. But Chris, what do you say? Do you think it would be helpful to give a model if there's a daughter listening that says, I have been stuck? I call it being in a hamster wheel. You go around and around and around, but you don't get out of the cage. 00:12:59 S1: Well, and this will go for dads too, who had a father wound or, you know, any kind of any kind of wound. So yeah, you're right. HEAL. What is that across? 00:13:08 S2: Yes. So h is honestly face the hurt. So sometimes, I mean, maybe this is just my experience, but I'm a pastor, conservative Baptist pastor's daughter went to Bible college. I've been in worship and youth ministry for a lot of my adult life. And a lot of times I heard the message of, you know, forgive and move on and just, you know, let bygones be bygones, forget what lies behind. And then, you know, what do you do when you're still triggered and activated by a wound? I think you got to start by being honest about the fact that the wound is there. You've named it. You've you've given that a voice and you've described it, which leads to e express the pain, which means how do you get it out? Cry it out. Talk it out, journal it out. I have a friend who? Chris. He he bought, like one of those boxing. I don't know what you even call them. You know, they hang from the ceiling, kind of boxing. 00:14:08 S1: The bag. 00:14:09 S2: Punching bag. 00:14:10 S1: Punching bag. Yeah. 00:14:11 S2: You know, and he would beat out the intense anger he had inside, but he got it out in a safe way. Right. That didn't, you know, spill out to relationships. It went into an inanimate object. So expressing the pain. Talk it out, cry it out, run it out, get it out a allow another to walk with you. Because so often we've been hurt within the context of relationship and we heal within the context of a relationship. So the question is, how do we then take a step to trusting someone to hear our story and hear our pain as we express that to them? And then L is let go, which is forgive, which I know is hard, hard, hard, especially, as Neil Anderson says in Steps to Freedom in Christ. It's because it goes against our concept of justice. We want someone to pay. But but what I love that, he says, is we're still hooked to the person we haven't forgiven. And so a practice that I've done for the last nine months in my own life with some of my own father wounds and stuff going on in my family, is every morning I wake up and my let go forgive processes. I acknowledge the pain, I send it to the cross. And then as I've been forgiven, I say I'm forgiving. I'm choosing that with my will. And then I pray number six, 24 through 26 over those that have hurt me, which is a blessing, right? May the Lord bless you and keep you. Make his face to shine upon you and be gracious to you. May the Lord lift up his countenance upon you, and always give you his peace, so that there's a blessing to counter what may feel like a curse. So let me just review those. If you're in a place, dad or daughter, where you're stuck in the wound is honestly. Face the hurt. Express the pain. Allow another to walk with you and let go.

Forgive. 00:16:07 S1: Okay, I've got a couple of questions about that, but I've got Molly on the line who I think fits right in here. Molly, why did you call today? 00:16:15 S3: Because I want to find a way to get over these. These wounds from my childhood and my teenage years. And I want to move forward with my dad. I don't want to be stuck in in a past of where there's hurt and even sometimes resentment. 00:16:35 S4: Yes. Yeah. 00:16:37 S1: So you feel almost like in in bondage to that hurt that's back there and you can't break out of it. Is that right, Molly? 00:16:47 S3: I very much do, yes. I've been trying to to even some of those things that you were just talking about with using the word heal. I've been trying to work on some of those things and I think I've made progress. But Satan is always there to remind me. 00:17:06 S5: Isn't that one of the things, though? That's one of the things that we think that. 00:17:10 S1: We especially that let go and forgive at the end, you know, release them. And the next morning you wake up and you're thinking about it again is, oh, I'm a failure. No you're not. You're not a failure. Right. Michelle. 00:17:23 S2: Exactly. Because of the process involved. And so one of the things that I found really helpful and Molly, I wonder for you is have you had a safe witness to the pain. Have you been doing it within yourself, or have you been able to get to that a where you have a safe witness, somebody who has walked with you that's bearing witness to the pain you've suffered as you're releasing it? Because that's. James 516. Confess or speak out one to another so you may be healed. 00:17:54 S3: Yeah, I have not done that. No, it's been just within me. 00:18:00 S2: So that might be your next action step because again, don't you love the power of the word? You know, we're in James five, it says, confess or speak out your sin one to another. But I think it's even the things that have been done to us that when we give it a voice, we name it and then we claim it. That's the second part. Like, what impact has that injury had? And there's such power in even the places in our brain where information can move from the place in our brain. I won't go into all the names of it, but there's a part of our brain that stores traumatic memory. And then there's a part that stores narrative memory. So when we tell the story, it aligns with scripture about speaking that out one to another so we may be healed. 00:18:45 S1: Molly, your dad still living, right? 00:18:48 S3: He is. Yeah. 00:18:50 S1: And with Father's Day coming up this weekend, how do you feel about that? What what what are you going to do or what's in your in your heart? 00:18:59 S3: Well, I love my dad. I want us to have a good relationship. I want us to I mean, he's getting up there in years and I want to have time with him and I want to spend time with him. I want to I want to be with him. I don't I don't want these wounds to hold me back from having a good relationship with my dad, because I feel like it's it spirals to my kids. I feel like it spirals to my relationship with the Lord because I look at him as I do my dad at times. 00:19:32 S4: Bingo. 00:19:32 S1: Yeah. And that was another question we had on Facebook. Susan said, how do I prevent the earthly father wound from damaging my Heavenly Father relationship with God himself? What do you say to that, Michel? 00:19:46 S2: Well, I think what courageous women hear, you know, Molly and these these women saying, I'm I'm putting that together because there's a quote that says perception is projection. So if if we have a perception of our earthly father that we've projected onto God as a father, it makes sense, doesn't it, that the father of lies Jesus called him in John 844 called Satan, not the CEO of lies, the instigator of lies. He's a counterfeit father, right? Who wants to undermine, at the end of the day, our relationship with God as a father, as a healer. So one of the things, Molly, that I've found in my own life is that I grew up where it was a lot. Jesus, Jesus, Jesus as my healer. And then Holy Spirit was another segment of my life. But when I realized that God is a father wants to refer me an ABBA father, a daddy. Well, the best place to learn about his heart for me is in the letter he's written right in the word. And I love that in Romans 816 and 17 where it says, The Holy Spirit cries out, ABBA, father! One of my friends, Doctor David Eckman, says, here's what that means. That you, the Holy Spirit, is shouting, you've got a dad! Take your pain to your dad. Isn't that beautiful? And I know that it's not a quick fix, but it's saying, God is a father. I invite you to come and wrap your presence, your embrace around me to heal the father wounds that are real. And I think even Molly and other practical thing that may be helpful is to write a letter that you don't even give to your dad, but you give a voice to what's happened and what's still hurting, and you can picture yourself laying that at the foot of the cross and then saying, ABBA, Father God, Heavenly father, come and come and love on me in a way that only you can show me through nature, through songs, through worship, through the word that you love me like only a dad can. Because you know me that intimately. 00:21:53 S1: I have a lot of hope for you, Molly. Number one. Because I can hear in your voice. You really do mean this. You really want this relationship with your dad. But number two, you called. And if you didn't have any hope, you wouldn't call. And you did, because this is right where you are and right and and, and God is walking with you through that wound and that struggle. Do you believe that, Molly? 00:22:16 S3: I do, I do. 00:22:19 S4: Good for you. 00:22:19 S1: I'm so glad you called. You don't know how many people, how many other women are in the same situation that you're in that you spoke for them today. Thank you for doing that. 00:22:31 S3: Thank you for giving

me the opportunity. 00:22:34 S1: There's Molly and I have hope for her. And I know Michelle, you do as well. But my question then jumping off from what she just said is, okay, how do you find that person to walk with you? How do what do you say to the woman who says, I thought I found somebody? And then they told me just to move on, to stop obsessing about my dad and, you know, move past it. Like you were saying a little earlier, Paul said, the things that are behind me, they told me that. How do you find the person who's not going to preach to you? 00:23:06 S2: Yeah, well, it may mean you have to go through a bunch of people till you find somebody who's done their own work. That's what I've found. If if someone has gone through their own process of healing, they'll never tell someone to do a quick fix. Because we all realize process takes time. And so it may be that you'll have to find a professional, right? You may have to pay a counselor who's trained in how to do trauma processing without a quick fix to walk you through a process of healing. But I can tell you like I have a lot of grandfather wounds, too. I was I was molested by my grandfather, I'll just be honest here. And I projected a lot of that father woundedness onto God as a father for a lot of my life too. And I had to find a counselor who walked with me for a long time through a lot of the layers, because we know there's mental impact, there's emotional impact, there's physical impact, there's social impact, right? There's all these layers of impact, of wounding. But I'm living proof that we can heal. We can heal. I mean, our bodies do it, don't they? And then what I love about a broken bone is don't doctors say, Chris, that once there's healing, you won't break in that same spot again and it's stronger than before the break. 00:24:24 S4: Yes. 00:24:26 S1: It's. It's like the kintsugi. Are you familiar with the Japanese art of kintsugi? So they put the the broken places are the strongest places in the pottery, and they are. And they are beautiful in their brokenness because of the gold lacquer that is that is put in there. Did you I don't know if we have time. Did you do that with your grandfather? Did you forgive your grandfather? But at the same time have distance. Maybe we should come back. And I want to ask you that when we have our next segment, and we'll take more of your calls. Doctor Michelle Watson Canfield is our featured resource and speaker here today at the back fence. Chris Fabry live.org. Click through today's information. You'll see that book. Let's talk that we were talking about earlier conversation starters for dads and daughters and another dad. Here's what I really need from you. Both of those are linked at Chris dot elevate.org. Chris dot ORG. And I want to hear from you today. What is your question? What is your father wound that you're dealing with as an adult daughter or dads? I want to hear from you. Is there a situation with your daughter and you don't know

how to break through? You don't know how. You're scared. Eight. Seven. Seven. Five. Four. Eight. Three. Six. Seven. Five. More straight ahead on Moody Radio. The dad whisperer is back. Michelle Watson Canfield. That's the title of her podcast. You can find out more about her, some of the books that she has written at Chris fabry.org. Chris Fabriclive dot ORG. And in that last segment, something hit my mind. And I remember a book by Becky Hertling. It was a six week Bible study on the Lord's Prayer titled Our Father. And she says in that book she says, I am no stranger to father issues. My father, though in ministry, was abusive spiritually, emotionally, physically and sexually. I remember well the counselor who told me I had to separate my earthly father from my Heavenly Father. I'm not going to lie, it wasn't easy. I spent countless hours on my knees asking God for a new picture of him as my father, and in that first section, it just brought me, stopped me short when she asked this question. When she's dealing with our father who art in heaven, hallowed be thy name, she said, how might your life look different if you truly believed God the Father was madly in love with you and delighted to give you good gifts, if you really believed that. How would it change your life? Would your life be any different? And my answer to that question was, if I really believe that, I would trust him completely, meaning I don't. I mean, there are there are places in my life where I want control, and I think I have to fill in because he might not see he might not notice, you know, he's busy. Whatever it is, how might your life look different if you truly believed God the Father was madly in love with you and delighted to give you good gifts. Michelle, how do you respond to that question? 00:27:54 S4: MM. 00:27:55 S2: I have the biggest smile on my face just hearing you read what this other woman has written, because it's a game changer. And one of the things that has helped me, and even in my clinical work with clients is, is often, I'll say, start with the member of the Trinity that you do feel the most comfortable with, because we know that they're 3 in 1 and they don't do anything apart from each other, But start with the one that you do feel the most connected to. Usually for a lot of people, it's Jesus. Some people it's Holy Spirit, and then you can ask that one to introduce you to God as a father is. Then you go through the portal of the one you do trust and that you do know, because the more you know who you are and whose you are, you are a daughter of the Most High God. Right? Romans says you are an heir of God, a co-heir with Christ. You are royalty. Your name is written on the palm of God, the Father's hand. You are chosen. You are loved. In fact, one of my favorite verses is about fathering is right in the middle of Luke 15. It's verse 20 where it's all red letter. If you have a red letter Bible where Jesus is telling a parable of the prodigal son. So it's all red letter. And what Jesus is saying is, I want you to know my dad, and I'm going to tell you the story right of the prodigal. The younger son goes off squalor, right? Blows his money living with the pigs. But there's five things Jesus is saying that dad did that he's saying is the true truth of my father in heaven, who we also know he's saying is also our father right in heaven. One the dad sees his son coming. Number two, he's filled with compassion. Number three, the dad initiates and runs towards the son. Four embraces and five kisses in a some. I've had someone go, oh, that's really gross to think of that I have sexual abuse or physical abuse from my dad, but I love to get a picture almost of a dog getting excited when you walk in the door and just licking your face like, so happy you're there. And those are five things Jesus said, My father and your father have to give you. He sees you. He's filled with compassion. He's initiating and coming toward you. He will embrace you and kiss you. And so as you begin to ask God as a father to make himself known to you, I believe Jesus and Holy Spirit will honor that prayer and introduce you to their dad, to your. 00:30:35 S4: Dad. 00:30:36 S2: But when he calls. 00:30:37 S4: Father. 00:30:37 S1: You know, there's also a robe and a ring and a party to, you know. 00:30:41 S4: Come on. 00:30:41 S1: There's dinner and there's, there's. 00:30:43 S4: There's. 00:30:44 S1: Joy and there's that delight that you're describing right there. And you can see, uh, if you close your eyes and you just picture that dad running, there's, there's tears in his eyes. My son, my son has come home. And then, and then you have to deal with the other, the other son as well. And that's a, that's another can of worms, can of worms that some people where they are. And it's, it's reality. It's what what you're dealing with. I'm going to hold the question about your granddad and get Cynthia in here in Florida. Cynthia, why did you call today? 00:31:20 S6: Oh, there was a caller that stirred me to call in. And my story is I was, uh, um, I really had anger issues with my father being raised up with him favoring, uh, my sister over me. So I had a lot of anger issues, but the Lord was, uh, gradually drawing me in and stirring me. I didn't even have it. Yeah, I did, I started getting thoughts. I think the Holy Spirit was moving with me. I want to go visit my dad. And then the voice would say, but remember what he did to you. And I would stop. But I kept going to visit my, my father with my daughter. And one night at the dinner table, my father, um, he had been going to church and he, uh, he said he wanted to ask for forgiveness for raising us up like that. And we just sat there and cried. And that was my healing, our healing. And I learned to love my father before he died. So it is the testimony that I have to share with the world that when we leave vengeance unto God, it turns. It can turn out to be a beautiful story. But

when we take vengeance in our own hands, that's why a lot of people are sitting in prison. And I have compassion for them, because my story turned out real beautiful. And I miss my dad. And I learned to love him. And it showed me to love me for who I am because that's my bloodline. 00:32:51 S4: Yeah. 00:32:52 S1: What humility he showed in in asking your forgiveness. And and because there was no guarantee about your response, you know, the tears weren't guaranteed. You could have gotten up and slammed the door, but he he took that chance. What do you say about that, Michel? 00:33:11 S2: Well, what I love about your story is that you were an adult. You're a mother at this point. And I think your story is saying to dads, they can follow the example of your dad who's in heaven now, right? And do right. Do what he did, and it's never too late to make amends. It's never too late to say I'm sorry, because what we know is as men age, right? Testosterone drops, they get softer, more tender, more humble, more gentle is follow the lead of this dad and ask forgiveness of your adult daughter and watch what she will be saying about you when you're not here, because healing will come to her heart. 00:33:53 S1: Yeah. Calling a radio program and talking about you. About him. Um, you know, that's there's something there. And what? How did that happen? He had the courage to move toward his daughter and to let that. And how many wounds of dad's leak over on all the other family members and all those relationships. But the opposite is true as well. How much will that forgiveness or the the the humility and asking for forgiveness, how much will that leak over? Do you see that in your. I bet you see that in your granddaughter's life that that leaked over into her life, Michelle, that has a a wide range, a ripple effect. Right? 00:34:38 S2: Absolutely, absolutely. And and that's the hope we're giving today is that if you're a daughter that's stuck in unforgiveness and maybe you have a dad that doesn't know how to own his part or ever ask for forgiveness, you can still forgive, you can still choose to forgive. And if the next day you wake up and you feel it all over again, you get to forgive again. It's not a one and done. It's a process that takes time. Find a safe witness to the pain. But there's the hope that we can be free. Even if we have dads who were only acting out of their own woundedness. Because one of the things that's helped me with my dad is to ask him more stories about his childhood. And it's like I've had more empathy for the child that never got what he needed. And it's how. 00:35:29 S4: That doesn't. 00:35:30 S2: Erase a bigger story. 00:35:31 S4: That doesn't. 00:35:31 S1: Erase the wound that you felt, but it helps you understand him more. It helps you see him more. But you've still got to be faithful to. But I still feel this, right? 00:35:43 S2: Mhm. Exactly. It's a. Both. And. You're right. It isn't an either or, but it's an about a process. 00:35:50 S4: With the abuse. 00:35:51 S1: Of your grandfather. Forgiveness. You know, the heal acrostic. Honestly. Face the hurt, express the pain. Allow another to walk with you and then let go or forgive. Forgiveness doesn't necessarily. Especially if there's sexual abuse or abuse of any kind. Forgiveness does not mean reconciliation. Total reconciliation. Right? 00:36:13 S2: Exactly, exactly. And that's really important to acknowledge is that if you're with someone that is not owning what they've done right, and that there needs to be boundaries set for safety and not exposing another generation to harm, that you can still get free by forgiving without reconciling. 00:36:36 S4: Mhm. 00:36:37 S1: For the woman, the, the adult woman who is really walking through this and walking through the wounds and she wants to reach out to her dad. Would giving him a book like you've written, would would that be a helpful step, do you think? 00:36:55 S2: You know, I have had some fathers and daughters work through their relational challenges by having like, dad, here's what I really need from you, you know? And she's like, I don't know how to tell this to you. What I need. But in a way, you're both looking at a book rather than each other. You know, you can kind of look down and then look back up. And I could think of this adult woman named Katie and her dad. They came into sessions together, and then they would go to Panera and they would read like two little chapters there, like 3 or 4 pages, and they would tell me that he would go, really? You think like this? She's like, yeah, I just never knew how to say that. And so if my resources can be a facilitator of healing in the dad daughter relationship, I mean, that's what I've prayed those books would do not sit on a shelf, but bring relational change and healing. And then let's talk for the dad that says, I kind of run out of things to ask. I don't even know how to mine the depths of my daughter. Is there 60 topics so your daughter could pick, let's say, the topic of, of anxiety or depression, or how to be a world changer, or lamenting wounds from you or from life. And then she picks that topic. Dad, I have all the questions under that theme that you can ask her more questions about her life. And I say, your daughter didn't come with a playbook, but I'm going to help you write one. Write down what she says. Oh my goodness. That daughter then says, wow, what I'm saying matters that much to my dad. He wants to write it down so he'll remember. That is a healing action step for dads. 00:38:34 S4: Yeah. 00:38:35 S1: Because she's seeing that he not only sees her but also wants to move closer to her. And, and what she says is important. We have a link to that book. Dad. Here's what I really need from you at Chris Fabry live.org, Chris fabriclive.org, as well as let's talk conversation starters for dads and daughters. We have a listener who said, I haven't spoken to my dad since 2020. For six years, she hasn't

spoken to her dad. I want to find out what Michelle will say to her and will do that when we return. This is Chris Fabry live online. Chris Fabry live dot. 00:39:18 S4: Com. 00:39:25 S1: Coming up tomorrow on Chris Fabry Live. I hope you'll join us. Your kids face unprecedented levels of anxiety, depression, and emotional stress. David Thomas chose a word to help you help them. You'll find out what that word is tomorrow. Right here at the radio. Backyard fence. Michelle Watson Canfield. Doctor Canfield is with us today at the back fence. Let's talk is our featured resource as well as dad. Here's what I really need from you and the question that comes from our Facebook page. I haven't spoken to my dad since 2020. I want to talk with him, but he doesn't care to talk with me. He has let me down a lot. His wife doesn't help either, and so I'm assuming that that's a second marriage. Uh. I pray for reconciliation. People say, call him. I don't want the rejection or to chase after him to be loved as I did in the past. I know I have daddy wounds and have forgiven him. Where do I go from here? 00:40:30 S2: Mhm. Well, for starters, I realize that anything I say may sound like a pat answer or not. Meeting the intensity and the longevity of how long these issues have been there. And so for that, I just say, here, give me some grace because because obviously this is a a very delicate and complex story. And what I do want to say is, I wonder if you could put your heart and your hurt into writing is that sometimes men do better with writing than they do with what we call face to face orientation. That in the middle of intense conversation, it's hard to look across a table, you know, at all the hurt that that is seen on your face. And it pulls up the shame and the guilt and a lot of men. But having something in writing allows some space for them to process. So if that, I would say is one option is to put this in writing and get it all out, and then you may divide it up. So you kind of start the way my mentor said it is. Share the one. See if the person meets you at a one, share it a two. See if they meet you at a two. See if they go to a three. In terms of intensity 0 to 10 because you don't want to be rejected again. So you start with some of it and see if your dad can respond in a bite size piece, kind of respond in a smaller way. And another option is, is there someone your dad may know or both of you know, who could be somewhat of a liaison between you and help bridge the gap in communication by being kind of a safe witness to the story, rather than just the two of you? 00:42:08 S4: That's really good. 00:42:10 S1: It's very helpful. And another person, I don't mean to throw all these things at you, but we only have a couple of minutes left. I hate to admit I'm jealous of the love that my father has for my children. So her dad loves her kids, his grandkids. But she didn't feel that as a as a child, as his daughter. I was never shown such unconditional love that I see him showing now. It seemed like love was conditional. I want a relationship, but we can't even discuss the past. Is that the same answer to her as to the other? 00:42:44 S2: Yeah, I would say first of all, if you can be honest with your own self and your own story, get it out on paper, get it out where you, you know, again, express the pain by giving a voice to it. And then I wonder if your dad could could take some of this in where you, you know, Oreo cookie communication positive, negative, positive, you know, the middle stuff. You don't want too much of it. But to say, dad, I love the way I see how you relate to my children. I wish sometimes I had more of that from you. Bottom cookie is there any way we could start doing a dad daughter date? Just the two of us. I mean, again, maybe get my book, use that as somewhere else to look that across the table at each other and open up conversations. Because what I find is that when dads have somewhat of a template or a guide of what to do because, right, they don't know what to say, what to do to make it right or to fix it. Having a guide can oftentimes help build that bridge for repairing and building a bridge back to your heart. 00:43:45 S1: Talk to the dad who's listening, who says, every Father's Day I get beat up. I just feel like I did the worst thing. I was the worst dad and encourage that fella today who's listening. 00:43:58 S2: You know, I want to speak to the dads that are also doing the best they can, and they're doing it way better than the model they had with their dad. And maybe don't always get credit for that part is Chris and I are standing here championing you, cheering you on and saying, keep going, well done, well done. Take another step today, even if you feel like you get more negative feedback than positive, we want to encourage you today and celebrate you as a dad to know that no doubt is perfect, but you just need to be present. Keep showing up and know at the end of the day, when you come with humility, willing to to make amends, willing to ask forgiveness, and then point the way to God as a father. If you don't even know what to say as a dad right out scripture verses, you can never go wrong with saying, here's what God as a father says about you. I don't always get it right, but I want to do the best I can today to let you know how much God as a father loves you. Yeah. 00:44:56 S1: Here's. You know what does. Success as a dad and and my thought today is the caller who said, you know, my dad's no longer here. And I want to tell you what he said. You know how he apologized? My, my feeling is success as a dad is when you're when you're gone, your daughter or son, whomever will call up a program like this and say, I want to tell you what my dad did. And do you know what she said? He apologized. He said something from his heart, from that soft place in his heart. How much will that spill over onto others? If you take that kind of step, that kind of humility? I mean, that to me, that success. Michelle, what do you think? 00:45:41 S2: I agree, I agree, I think that's a great way to say, dad, at the end of your life, what do you want your daughter to say about you and your granddaughters and your sons? Of course. What do you want the forever story to be? Lean into that now. If you want her to know you love her. How? By what you say. By how you make amends. By how you build a bridge to God as a father. You matter. Dads, we want to cheer you on in that role today. 00:46:07 S1: You are important. And I'm so glad you joined us today. Or maybe somebody suggested the podcast to you with Doctor Michelle Watson Canfield, author of Let's Talk as well as dad. Here's what I really need from you. Both of those we have linked as well as her podcast, The Dad Whisperer podcast at Chris Fabry live.org. Michelle, come back real soon. God bless you, friend. Thanks for being with us. 00:46:32 S2: Great to be with you. 00:46:33 S1: And if you go to Chris, relive.org, you'll see all the information that I just mentioned. Don't forget to join us tomorrow right here. The Radio Backyard Fence, which is a production of Moody Radio, a Ministry of Moody Bible Institute.