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Speaker 1: Welcome to Checking In with Michelle Williams, a production of iHeart Radio and The Black Effect. Y'all come on income on income, on in. I don't have a long Okay, listen. Kirk Franklin is checking in with us this week. I'm very excited about this interview.
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Speaker 2: He just got off.
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Speaker 1: Tour and I don't even know how he is still up. I would have been taking a nap for about two weeks straight after y'all.
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Speaker 2: The tour they just.
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Speaker 1: Did it was humongous. But he is checking in with us, So just stay tuned.
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Speaker 2: Okay, y'all.
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Speaker 1: Every week it gets better and better. This week, I am fortunate to have somebody who is very, very busy, just got off of a world win tour.
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Speaker 2: Not only did we just get off a whirlwind tour.
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Speaker 1: Just want a Billboard Music Award for Top Gospel Album with Maverick City and also a Soul Train Award for Best Gospel Inspirational Award.
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Speaker 2: But hold up were not done.
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Speaker 1: In March, he made history as the first person to spend one hundred weeks at number one on any Billboard song Writers chart.
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Speaker 2: Give it up for producer, singer.
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Speaker 3: Singing, Binger, writer, Binger and the most as gospel artist ever in history. Yes, the most amazing.
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Speaker 2: Y'all know his voice, producer, Well, what do you want me to say? Artist? Artist, artist, he does.
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Speaker 3: It all and as she is gospel artist. Seven, we'll put that on.
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Speaker 2: Oh you know what, I'm gonna get you some good oil for Christmas.
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Speaker 1: I'll sit, I'll get your I'll get an appropriate mailing address from your team and send you some oil.
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Speaker 3: Some oil.
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Speaker 2: You don't have no allergies. No, it's really good. Skin oil is good.
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Speaker 3: Okay, it's really good. I love it.
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Speaker 1: Grapefruit, but it's it's not powerful grapefruit.
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Speaker 2: It's like really subtle good oil. Sunflower oil. It really good. It won't clog your pours.
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Speaker 3: Okay, okay, I'll take it. I'll take it.
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Speaker 2: Okay, all right, y'all.
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Speaker 1: Won't clog your poys, so you can walk out the door.
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Speaker 2: Don't drip none on the floor. I can't hear.
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Speaker 3: Him, now, really can't hear me.
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Speaker 2: I can hear you talk. I can't hear keyboard.
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Speaker 3: That is interesting. She can hit talk, but she can't hit the keyboard. Okay, we tried.
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Speaker 1: Well, I can't do that because I don't want to sound like I'm off or something.
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Speaker 3: No, it's all, it's all love. It's it's next time.
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Speaker 2: Next time, I'll set up an official studio time with you.
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Speaker 3: Great, great Greg. Well, it's great to see you.
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Speaker 1: It is so good to see you. King fresh off of tour, crash off.
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Speaker 2: You need a nap, you need a nap.
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Speaker 3: I don't know what I need. I don't know what I need. I feel like I need to run down the freeway in my underwear with some with with some some timberling boots on, with a with a with a Superman cape on, with a herring bone necklace. I'm gonna just I'm just gonna keep going to you to stop me.
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Speaker 1: Uh if that, If that's the headline you're going for, I go for it.
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Speaker 2: I support you. It's gonna be a pr nightmare, but I'm gonna have your bag. I'm like it was fashion week.
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Speaker 1: It was fashion week and he was showing off his new line.
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Speaker 3: I love it.
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Speaker 2: That's what we're gonna go with that. Listen as it relates to the tour.
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Speaker 1: Now, you know you about can't do a tour like that any other time, because everybody can hold their own do their own show.
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Speaker 2: Everybody can headline.
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Speaker 3: Everybody but y'all were all.
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Speaker 2: Unified like it.
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Speaker 1: No issues, No, because I want to know what tour I'm gonna go on with.
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Speaker 2: Don't nobody care about because you.
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Speaker 1: Know, the headliner got to most of the time, the headliner gott to pay the most money, so you're.
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Speaker 2: Kind of like, I don't need the headline.
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Speaker 1: What an amazing accomplishment for a music period, and then for gospel music to be displayed in such a way to where people felt like they were at a different type of genre like y'all came with clothing, led screens, staging, segues, everything.
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Speaker 3: Now, man, we had a really really good time. It was, it was, it was. It was very exciting to see gospel music, uh in that space, to see people come out by the you know, droves, just to be able to be reminded of God's love for them and songs that carried them through some difficult sisons in their lives, and for us to be able to curate this moment that will just live in in spiritual infamy. You know, yes, it is. It is a great moment for the genre and it was an epic moment for music.
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Speaker 2: A Part two, you doing a part two.
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Speaker 3: You know, what's are.
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Speaker 2: You an international verson London, Nigeria. Oh my gosh, they'll eat it up.
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Speaker 3: Yeah. You know, we've been talking about it in nationally. You know, we we are just trying to figure out how to make it work because you know, when you go overseas, there's so many things, you know, different exchange rates and different things to be able to try to make it accessible to everyone. And so you know, we're still on the high and we're still beaming from how incredible the love was here in the States. Uh. With the tour, you know, there were a lot of cities we didn't get to go to, like, you know, we didn't get to go to New York City proper. We were in Jersey, we didn't get to go to We didn't get to go to Baltimore, you know,
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Minneapolis, Indianapolis, you know, Portland, Seattle, you know, you know that's part two. Yeah, so yeah, you know, yeah, we we are trying to figure it out, man, trying to figure it out, you know. So you know, we really trying to see if there's a way to be able to make it happen.
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Speaker 2: Yeah. Well it was good to see everybody.
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Speaker 1: I can imagine relationships were probably strengthened and fortified getting to catch up on all things because a lot of y'all live in different parts of the country, so to every for everybody to be on tour at one time, it was beautiful to see, so inspiring, like, you know, there's some hit hit the other tours need to happen. Now, come on, we got we can do it.
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Speaker 2: We can do it. We can do it.
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Speaker 3: That's super dump.
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Speaker 1: And then before the tour or kind of you know, at the beginning of the tour, your Father's Day documentary was released in conjunction with your album.
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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yeah, you know life, Life was life Thing twenty three Life was life Thing. It was a lot that happened, and you know, we you know, we're just still taking them and at a time and still trying to figure out, you know, what the new normal looks like. You know, you know, it's very much kind of like how life was after the pandemic. You know, you you had to figure out what the new normal was for you. And so yeah, you know that's what I'm having to do and and I'm having to do it at my own pace and my own race. Uh, you know, it can feel very daunting, but one day to time, one day at a.
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Speaker 1: Time, you say, at your own pace, at your own race, But you decided to share it with the world. Why did you decide to share that portion with us?
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Speaker 3: Well, because I was already in the creative space. I was already documenting the making of the album. And so yeah, so as a creative you don't know how not to translate what you go through like it's someone like as a creative I was going through that, then it's going to fit the songwriting. So if I have a camera front of me and I'm going to naturally incorporate the moments that I'm experiencing in the moment that I'm in, I mean, I mean, you know, for you know, in my humble opinion, I think for real deep core creative people, they don't know a separation of art in reality. You know, there are is there reality, So you know, you know, you just you just naturally continue in the lanes that are very organic and their second nature for you, and you know that second nature for me?
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Speaker 2: Did the album change?
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Speaker 1: Like, did you were your album starting off in one way and then things happened with your father, did it kind of did it change the album?
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Speaker 2: New album.
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Speaker 3: Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. The name of the album originally was called The Rebirth the Fearless Hero. That was that was the name of the album. I was taking different titles from different
albums, and and uh, yeah it was it was going to be one project that was going in another kind of direction. And uh, this ended up being, you know, the background music for a very tumultuous, life changing experience that I was having in real time. And so they both, yeah, they both kind of lighted with each other.
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Speaker 2: The Rebirth of the Fearless Hero.
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Speaker 1: I mean, I can I can only imagine that it was scary for you to release that information to us, right, But at the same time, you became, if you weren't already a lot of people's hero for being able to share, especially a man to share and be vulnerable on camera. I always say there's a difference between being transparent and vulnerable. When you're transparent, you can tell the world anything, Hey I stepped my toe, Hey I was late for a meeting today. But being vulnerable, you actually told us how it made you feel, which being vulnerable for me feels yucky. I hate feeling vulnerable and then having to voice how it made me feel I feel like I'm watching it all over again, just.
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Speaker 2: Talking to you.
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Speaker 3: Yeah, And I don't know what other way to be is. I don't know. Me talking and me sharing is very much just a part of my nature. It's very second nature for me, so as I don't know how to have the separate space where these things in my life exist over here. But then I'm going to do music and share the gospel and yeah, and talk about Jesus over here. No, they are synonymous in the expression of who I am as a broken individual, and so I wouldn't know different to do.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, It's like every time you come out with a project, it's like we're hearing Kirk for the first time. It's like you somehow you keep our anticipation, You keep everybody so.
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Speaker 2: Excited, and you're all well to us.
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Speaker 1: I don't know if you ever feel that way, but it seems like you're always winning except for that, of course, by the grace of God his hand on your life, and every time you come out you stay relevant.
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Speaker 2: Just I just, y'all.
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Speaker 1: I'm sitting here almost fanning out because this is what I've been wanting to say to you. It's like you're fresh still, like you're new, How do you keep that energy? How do you keep us like literally on the edges of our seat, Like, what is Kirk Franklin gonna do for us musically?
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Speaker 3: I have no idea. I have no idea. Kirk, you be so humble, but I'm also keeping it a buck. Nobody, nobody knows what. Listen, you have been doing music all your life, you know, like I know, don't nobody know? Think about all the big producers that you as an artist, You were Destiny's child. You you've seen your other sister do and there'll be records you think, oh, this record is out of here, and it don't. I mean, nobody knows. So why would I get on here with you and even act like I have some divine intervention spiritual hookup number from God that I can just tell you
something that is going to be so divinely supernaturally different.
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Speaker 1: Everybody wants you to bottle up the secret sauce and sell it, and there.
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Speaker 3: Is no secret sauce. I don't is that nobody knows? You know? I guess I can't. You know, like even with you know, even with the new music, you don't know you know, I mean, you don't know, you don't know, you know, but you're mad, grateful and overwhelmed that in spite of you, in spite of your mistakes and failures or sins and struggles, that you know there's something in you, in spite of you, that God would choose to use in some kind of way. It's it's it's amazing.
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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, wow.
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Speaker 1: I want to go to the foundation of my podcast, and it is about mental health. But I find a way, we find a way to have these discussions not in a clinical type of way. And everything that you shared with us this year on the documentary with the tour, being a husband, a father, a son, how have you been balancing it all with your mental health?
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Speaker 2: How are you doing?
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Speaker 3: Thank you great question. You know. I I am grateful for the gift of music. I think that God and his kindness as a little boy gave me the gift of music because it has always been the medicine I didn't know I needed. It's very therapeutic to be able to sit at a piano and to be able to just heard melodes from have you know? Is you know, it's it's it's it's very very cathartic when you have this space that you can get a chance to occupy with God in hearing what others do get to hear first. So that has been my therapy. The tour was very healing from me because I was away from me, okay, and you know that was helpful. And you know, I was just at my therapist yesterday evening. I had a session yesterday evening and we'll have another one either tomorrow or thirsty, you know. You know I'm a black maned praise and see it's a therapist. And I've been seeing a therapist non stop since i was about twenty eight and I'm fifty three, so you know, I've I've always been in therapy and it has been, you know, very healing component of my life. I'll talk. I'm I'm not a person who won't talk. I'll talk sometimes too much, you know, but I'm but I'm I'm comfortable talking.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, what do you say to the person that's like Kirk, Frankly, you're supposed to be saved.
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Speaker 2: Jesus is enough. You don't need no therapist.
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Speaker 3: I would say to them, but they sound crazy. I would say that they sound dumb. I would say that they sound Okay. I can't say those things. Okay, I would say that you sound you just sound like you don't know what you're talking about.
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Speaker 2: Ignorant.
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Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, I just think that it is it is such a disclaimer or a misnomer to be able to make these broad statements that we only make in our mind, that we don't make with any other parts of our bodies. You don't say that to a heart speculus. You don't say that to somebody who just fell over having a heart attack. Get up, stop that heart attack. In the name of Jesus. You don't say that to somebody. You will call nine one one will you will try to do something to big the problem. But when it comes to our emotions and our souls and our minds, we over spiritualize things that don't need over spiritualized.
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Speaker 2: That's right.
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Speaker 1: I feel like we put mental health over here. But then the rest of our health, your cardiovascular health, you're reproductive, if your your your immune system like loopis like if somebody goes to the altar and says, you know what I just got to diagnosis of loopis, oh, we gotta pray, we gotta pray. But if somebody comes down and says I'm depressed, who well, who you've been sleeping with. You ain't praying them, you're not reading your Bible. You make a person feel like they did something wrong.
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Speaker 3: I agree with you. I agree with you.
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Speaker 2: That's why you're here.
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Speaker 3: I agree with you.
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Speaker 2: But we'll pray for everything else.
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Speaker 3: I agree with you, and it is it is so help me. It's a form of spiritual abuse. Mm hmm, of spiritual abuse to be able.
00:19:02
Speaker 2: To They don't know.
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Speaker 1: I don't they don't know they're there. I don't think they know that. That's what it is.
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Speaker 3: The form of abuse. You abusing people's spirits when you communicate to them in that way.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, oh my gosh, because I feel like mental health obviously your mind, your emotions. You know, when you go see the psychiatrist. Sometimes your practitioners of mental health they're in the same building as other medical care professionals. But thank you for sharing that. You know, Hey, Kirk Franklin, New Billboard Award winning, Soul Train Award winning, GRAMM your award winning you have successful television shows. You're in what the second season of Kingdom Business, Executive producer.
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Speaker 2: Of Kingdom Business. By the way, y'all, thank y'all so for having me. You did a good job episode. I appreciate, thank you. You know, I'd be liking to act and everything, and so a good job. You know, You've got.
00:20:14
Speaker 1: A lot that you are doing. Will we see you acting like featured feature film?
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Speaker 3: More feature films? I don't know. I don't know, you know, will you know? It's I love the space of creating. And if something comes that's right and it and it translates in ways that are that are conducive to the level of talent God has given me, then you know, yeah, I'd be more than honor to see if it's something that can be an O word moment that I can contribute to. And so you know, I'm very open to the accountability around me of what I'm good at or what I'm not good at when it comes to you and gout in other spaces. I'm not one that makes the assumption than because God has blessed me with one
creative lane that I can do all creative lanes. And so I love the accountability of getting the insight and input of people that I trust around me. And so we'll see, We'll see if something comes and we'll see if I'm good at it or if I'm not good at it, and then if I'm not, I believe it alone.
00:21:23
Speaker 1: All right, musicals inducing, musicals, riting, Yeah, some broadways I think, like, you know, absolutely amazing. And you do the music on the Kingdom Business.
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Speaker 2: Can you talk about that?
00:21:37
Speaker 1: Do you do that differently than you would do your own project, your own personal music project. Well?
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Speaker 3: What I love about doing the music for Kingdom Business, so for any other movie or any other TV show, is that I love being free of the anxiety of radio, the anxiety of the first single and what the first single is going to be, because I think that that can it sounds be an unnecessary pressure that that just burdens all of us. And so I love being free of that. And so when I'm working on yeah, whatever, I'm working on a TV show, I don't have to feel that that kind of pressure. I'm able to just be free from that level of pressure and just allow it to be what it is.
00:22:19
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, what's your latest music and everything that you've been showing us?
00:22:23
Speaker 3: Now?
00:22:23
Speaker 1: I was like, oh my gosh, with he can pour all of his emotion and what he's been feeling into like even scoring a movie.
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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, you know, like yeah, and I've done that before. I've had a couple of Like I scored a movie called Kingdom Come Yes, Yes, I also worked on It's another movie project that I okay, I got a blanket.
00:22:51
Speaker 1: I just feel like with everything, I can imagine just sitting down at the piano, pouring your heart out with everything that you have gone through this year, and you still blazed it on stage.
00:23:03
Speaker 2: Like I'm like, I know, he gotta soak in some epps and salt.
00:23:06
Speaker 1: I don't know them, twisting turns, jumping up in the air and.
00:23:12
Speaker 2: You're sharing in your porn.
00:23:13
Speaker 1: But that's the amazing part of us that we can have something going on, but when it comes to serving people and giving our best, that.
00:23:21
Speaker 2: You can do it.
00:23:22
Speaker 1: And so I know that you just got off tour, you are exhausted, and I'm excited that you came to talk with us today and check in and share with you. Y'all get therapy. Get in therapy as well. Nothing is wrong with a good old session. I love my Thursdays at one pm. I really really love it. There's some growth there and I feel like sometimes she takes my money anyway, even.
00:23:52
Speaker 2: Though we don't be having none to talk about but it's just good to check it.
00:23:58
Speaker 1: She gonna, she gonna, she we have there's still one hundred and fifty dollars. Sorry, you know, to talk about crawfish. But I'm so thankful for you. I'm so glad we got this time to talk and congratulations on your award. I would ask you what is next, but I feel like you just need to sit in just exactly what y'all just accomplished. To me that when people ask me that question, it annoys me because it's like, bro, you just see what what's next? A nap, what's a vacation?
00:24:30
Speaker 3: The trip?
00:24:31
Speaker 2: So you know what I mean. So I'm truly thankful. Give Tammy my.
00:24:35
Speaker 1: Love, and oh yah, y'all have the show as well about relationship. Y'all are helping people find the one and so will we see any more of that?
00:24:47
Speaker 3: Probably not, but it was fun. It was a good tribe. It was a good.
00:24:55
Speaker 1: Okay, okay, all right, all right, Well, we love you and thank you for checking in.
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Speaker 3: I love you too, Queen, so proud of you, so proud of you.
00:25:03
Speaker 2: Thank you so much.
00:25:05
Speaker 3: We'll see you again, all.
00:25:09
Speaker 2: Right, yes sir?
00:25:10
Speaker 3: All right, bye?
00:25:13
Speaker 1: Okay, If y'all didn't learn nothing from this interview.
00:25:16
Speaker 2: First of all, work hard.
00:25:19
Speaker 1: Secondly, it's okay to go to therapy. I am so glad that Kirk Franklin has decided to even share that y'all. He just found his birth father this year in twenty twenty three, in the middle of him working on his album. Y'all heard what he said The album was even a different title. I asked him, Hey, you know, did the situation with your father even changed the tone and the direction of your album.
00:25:47
Speaker 2: As y'all heard him say. He said it did, And.
00:25:51
Speaker 1: I love me some Kirk Franklin. I hope to work with him one day. That's if he ain't too tired.
00:25:57
Speaker 3: Good lord.
00:25:58
Speaker 1: He's doing a lot execute the producing television series Going on the Road, his own album is out, and so it's always a joy to talk with him. I could tell that he was a little tired, so, you know me, I read to the room and I do not hold people along. So I really hope that y'all enjoy this brief interview with my friend and my buddy, Kirk Franklin. Checking In with Michelle Williams is a production of iHeart Radio and The Black Effect. For more podcasts from iHeart Radio, visit the iHeart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.