התמלול המלא של Connection: What if the Opposite of Connection Isn't Being Alone? (S2E11)

You know what I mean? 00:05:24.975 --> 00:05:27.745 We just watch it for a few seconds, 00:05:27.805 --> 00:05:29.014 And make assumptions .Yeah. 00:05:29.415 --> 00:05:31.454 And think that we have the whole thing figured out. 00:05:31.454 --> 00:05:37.845 And, you know, I, I've said before that it's real easy to judge when it doesn't cost you anything. 00:05:38.634 --> 00:05:38.785 Right. 00:05:38.785 --> 00:05:42.175 But if it costs us nothing in the moment, what's it costing over time? 00:05:44.411 --> 00:05:45.490 Well, here's what it costs. 00:05:45.490 --> 00:05:47.040 It adds up over time. 00:05:47.040 --> 00:05:50.031 We, we've talked about that in the positive realm. 00:05:50.031 --> 00:05:56.911 We always talk about like how the little things compound, you know, to make a, a big difference in your life. 00:05:56.911 --> 00:06:10.071 But I think compounding happens negatively too, and we just start having all these little moments like this and stringing them together, and it just becomes the default, and we're doing it, and we don't even know that we're doing it. 00:06:10.071 --> 00:06:13.300 So do you think part of it is us being lazy? 00:06:13.548 --> 00:06:21.028 Maybe, but, uh, I think it's, it's kinda like that rut thing that, Matt Plutko talked about way back at the beginning of our last season. 00:06:21.028 --> 00:06:23.838 You, you get in those thought ruts, you know what I mean? 00:06:23.838 --> 00:06:32.788 It's like your, your old sort of wiring system, and it's not that, it's not that we're bad people, it's that it's old habits die hard, you know? 00:06:32.788 --> 00:06:34.028 Think about people. 00:06:34.028 --> 00:06:36.939 We're all originally... 00:06:36.939 --> 00:06:40.869 I mean, we were pack animals, like we survived in tribes. 00:06:40.869 --> 00:06:51.949 We survived by knowing, like who was ours and who wasn't, and in order to do that, you had to be able to make like a snap read about people, or snap read to be able to like protect yourself. 00:06:51.949 --> 00:06:55.619 And so that wiring is in there, you know? 00:06:55.619 --> 00:06:58.408 But we're not, we're not back there anymore. 00:06:58.408 --> 00:07:12.319 So we, you know, should, continue like evolve, um, because that wiring is still there, and so it's, it's like a, it's like a defense mechanism. 00:07:12.319 --> 00:07:19.088 But honestly, like I feel like we're sliding back into that now, like picking our people, picking our side. 00:07:19.088 --> 00:07:20.809 Everybody else is the other team. 00:07:20.809 --> 00:07:27.908 People are scared, and when people are scared they pull in tight, and that's not really stupid. 00:07:27.908 --> 00:07:30.178 It's like one of the oldest things that we do. 00:07:30.178 --> 00:07:36.108 But it's a habit, and it's an old habit, and it doesn't have to be like our future. 00:07:36.108 --> 00:07:57.627 Because we talked about it with the growth mindset stuff, the wiring in your thought processes, like that responds to what you practice, and I think we've been practicing the wrong thing for a really long time If that makes sense. 00:07:57.627 --> 00:07:57.947 I don't know 00:07:59.240 --> 00:07:59.680 It does. 00:07:59.680 --> 00:08:00.149 It does. 00:08:00.149 --> 00:08:06.060 I'm just thinking too, like there, there is, there is something a little more to it when it comes to the judgment. 00:08:06.060 --> 00:08:10.392 Remember when my kids were little and I, I was the judgy mom, right? 00:08:10.392 --> 00:08:13.283 Like, I would look at other people and I was 00:08:13.326 --> 00:08:14.437 Wait, we all do it. 00:08:14.487 --> 00:08:22.646 At the times in my life when I have been a judgmental person, the person that I was really judging was me. 00:08:22.646 --> 00:08:27.177 I was outwardly judging, but 00:08:27.177 --> 00:08:28.077 it was You're, 00:08:28.108 --> 00:08:28.788 I was judging myself too 00:08:28.887 --> 00:08:31.278 you're kind of figuring out where you fit in there. 00:08:31.278 --> 00:08:33.768 Like, "Oh, how does this compare to what I'm doing? 00:08:33.768 --> 00:08:34.707 Like, am I better? 00:08:34.707 --> 00:08:35.408 Am I worse? 00:08:35.408 --> 00:08:41.638 Am I doing it, quote, unquote, right or quote, you know, wrong?" Yeah, that's a good point. 00:08:43.090 --> 00:08:45.820 And especially when my kids were little, I was in a terrible marriage. 00:08:45.820 --> 00:09:04.080 My home life was horrible, but on the outside looking in, I tried very hard to make it sure it didn't look like that, and that's when I was the worst 'cause I was working so hard to not be like people out there that I was judging them because they were my fear. 00:09:04.080 --> 00:09:07.549 That's what I didn't, I didn't want people to see that part of my life. 00:09:07.549 --> 00:09:10.929 And, and so I think that there is just different sides of it. 00:09:10.929 --> 00:09:19.230 And then there's the generational thing 'cause, yes, not listening is definitely, it's poor communication skills, but a lot of families are that way. 00:09:22.750 --> 00:09:23.070 Yeah. 00:09:23.070 --> 00:09:24.590 That's that old wiring. 00:09:24.590 --> 00:09:25.720 That's what I'm talking about. 00:09:25.720 --> 00:09:35.730 And I think we talked about it in one of our last two episodes about how, like, the patterns get handed down unless there's somebody that shows up to change the cycle. 00:09:35.730 --> 00:09:38.179 And, because we're wired for it. 00:09:38.179 --> 00:09:43.240 We're wi- we're literally wired for that, or we were wired f- that way for survival. 00:09:43.240 --> 00:09:46.769 Um, but here's the other half of that wiring. 00:09:46.769 --> 00:10:05.820 The same thing that makes us, sort out people into us and them, and whatever boxes we're doing, I don't think we really survived in groups just because they were safe. 00:10:05.820 --> 00:10:08.580 We survived because we needed each other. 00:10:08.580 --> 00:10:11.039 We needed each other. 00:10:11.134 --> 00:10:11.524

Yeah 00:10:11.750 --> 00:10:15.490 And, and that part never went anywhere. 00:10:15.490 --> 00:10:23.590 Even with your talking about, you know, about being a young mom and trying to, like, question everything, we try to do it ourselves, you know. 00:10:23.590 --> 00:10:24.740 Like, I, I got this. 00:10:24.740 --> 00:10:29.110 But we really need, we need the support of other people. 00:10:29.809 --> 00:10:30.519 Yes, we do. 00:10:30.519 --> 00:10:34.653 And even with the people that like to be by themselves. 00:10:35.985 --> 00:10:36.284 Yeah. 00:10:36.284 --> 00:10:38.134 Yep. 00:10:38.153 --> 00:10:39.023 Even loners. 00:10:39.965 --> 00:10:40.715 Oh yeah. 00:10:40.715 --> 00:10:50.825 Well, I was gonna say, like, you could have everything else in place and, still be running on empty if you don't have a support system. 00:10:50.825 --> 00:10:54.575 So there's two numbers I wanna say today. 00:10:54.575 --> 00:11:01.725 I'm a numbers girl, wanna talk about two numbers that will stay with us when we're talking about being alone and loneliness. 00:11:01.725 --> 00:11:15.707 Um- There was a time where I found myself in isolation after some things that I went through, and it was, you know, first necessary, but then I stayed there kinda too long. 00:11:15.707 --> 00:11:23.398 And that's when I had that low moment where I was like, "I- is this really it?" Like, is this really it 'cause I'm kind of just existing here? 00:11:23.398 --> 00:11:29.437 'Cause, life is going on, and I'm just here, and I'm not doing the things I used to do, and all that stuff. 00:11:29.437 --> 00:11:32.220 I told this story in our very first episode. 00:11:32.220 --> 00:11:36.940 My dad left us notes when he was dying, and one of them said, "Everybody have a nice day. 00:11:36.940 --> 00:11:38.879 Remember, you only go around once. 00:11:38.879 --> 00:11:45.889 This is it." And I'm sitting there in that stillness asking myself, "Is this really it?" And it hit me different that time. 00:11:45.889 --> 00:11:47.820 It wasn't a question anymore. 00:11:47.820 --> 00:11:50.730 It was him answering me, "This is it. 00:11:50.730 --> 00:11:59.879 This is the life." So I stopped trying to force my way back to a life that wasn't working anymore and decided I better get to living the one I got instead. 00:11:59.879 --> 00:12:10.826 And that's when I really got interested in the importance of connection. 00:12:10.826 --> 00:12:15.615 And I found out, during that time, that 85 years... 00:12:15.615 --> 00:12:29.456 So Harvard has been running a study on happiness, and it's the longest study on happiness that's ever been done, and it's been going for 85 years, and the answer has never changed in 85 years when it comes to happiness. 00:12:29.456 --> 00:12:31.645 It's always the people. 00:12:31.645 --> 00:12:33.546 It's always the people. 00:12:33.546 --> 00:12:35.385 It's always the connections. 00:12:35.385 --> 00:12:48.005 And on the flip side of that, the 15 cigarettes a day, that's what

the research says, and I'll link it in the show notes to credit the researchers. 00:12:48.005 --> 00:12:55.285 But the research says that's what a weak connection does to your body, right? 00:12:55.285 --> 00:13:05.895 It's like sitting down and chain-smoking 15 cigarettes, and we let it happen to ourselves in silence all the time. 00:13:05.895 --> 00:13:08.275 And we don't think about it. 00:13:08.275 --> 00:13:13.186 Like, you would think, people would think, "Oh, I, I probably should, cut back on the smoking," you know? 00:13:13.186 --> 00:13:20.995 But, like, when people find themselves in isolation and that becomes your pattern, you don't even see it anymore. 00:13:20.995 --> 00:13:23.975 But the thing is, I don't think... 00:13:23.975 --> 00:13:33.556 connection doesn't really stop the hard things from happening, but it is the thing that helps you come back from them. 00:13:33.556 --> 00:13:35.265 You know what I mean? 00:13:35.265 --> 00:13:39.755 Like, like, think about the worst stretch of something that you've ever been through. 00:13:39.755 --> 00:13:50.035 Maybe somebody got you through it, and it doesn't even mean that they had to say anything profound. 00:13:50.035 --> 00:13:50.255 They... 00:13:50.255 --> 00:13:53.365 just kept showing up, you know what I mean? 00:13:53.365 --> 00:13:58.926 Or maybe you did get through something alone, and you know exactly what that costs you. 00:13:58.926 --> 00:14:05.635 But either way, I think you know what I'm talking about, and I'm talking about the listeners. 00:14:05.635 --> 00:14:15.855 Most of us have had those moments in, in life where you, you know, get through those things, and it's either the, the people around you who carried you through, or you did it alone, and you know the difference. 00:14:16.076 --> 00:14:16.135 What that feels like. 00:14:16.166 --> 00:14:16.576 Yeah. 00:14:16.576 --> 00:14:17.176 Mm-hmm. 00:14:17.176 --> 00:14:18.505 Yeah. 00:14:18.505 --> 00:14:36.885 So I think we need to talk real quick about, The difference between alone and loneliness because some people do just like to be by themselves, and the thing that we have to make sure that we have straight is that being alone and being lonely are not the same thing. 00:14:36.885 --> 00:14:43.245 Like, I recharge, some of the best hours of my week are by myself, you know? 00:14:43.245 --> 00:14:44.956 But lonely is different. 00:14:44.956 --> 00:14:57.855 You can be lonely, and Lori said this, Lori Karsch, um, that you can be lonely sitting in a room full of people and not one of them, maybe doesn't know what's going on with you. 00:14:57.855 --> 00:15:06.436 Something that helped me was I started writing down every day during that time when I was really isolated three people. 00:15:06.436 --> 00:15:12.466 At the beginning of my rebuilding era, I got real intentional about it, you know? 00:15:12.466 --> 00:15:14.066 Three people every day. 00:15:14.066 --> 00:15:19.365 The goal was a connection, like reach out even

if it was just a text, you know what I mean? 00:15:19.365 --> 00:15:28.025 Something small, but doing it on purpose, like being deliberate about making those connections because we all just get going, and I wasn't going anywhere at that time. 00:15:28.025 --> 00:15:41.956 I was in stillness, and you talked about on the last episode how important it is to get still, and you're right, and that's when I realized, I was like, "I, I, you know, I need my people, and I miss them," you know? 00:15:41.956 --> 00:16:02.125 This one's a little tricky for me because I started being deliberate about connection for myself, and I want to be intentional about continuing to do it, and I've gotten away from it, but getting back to it because isolation cost my family someone that we can't get back. 00:16:02.125 --> 00:16:03.316 That's all I'm gonna say about that. 00:16:03.316 --> 00:16:12.826 But, That's one little strategy that I found to be helpful and even if I didn't end up reaching out to somebody that day, they're on my, in my heart, in my spirit. 00:16:12.826 --> 00:16:13.785 You know what I mean? 00:16:14.245 --> 00:16:14.546 Yeah, 00:16:14.630 --> 00:16:16.941 that, that counts as connection too. 00:16:16.941 --> 00:16:17.541 You know? 00:16:17.541 --> 00:16:18.421 Not forgotten, 00:16:19.831 --> 00:16:20.360 yeah. 00:16:20.360 --> 00:16:20.880 Yeah 00:16:21.705 --> 00:16:25.434 I wanted to talk about it's not about how big your circle is. 00:16:25.434 --> 00:16:27.634 Take social media for example. 00:16:27.634 --> 00:16:36.804 You might have tens of thousands, 100,000 followers, but, like, maybe not somebody that you could call at any time, you know? 00:16:36.804 --> 00:16:37.794 Um 00:16:39.147 --> 00:16:41.037 Or even the people that really know you. 00:16:42.657 --> 00:16:43.047 Right. 00:16:43.047 --> 00:16:44.206 Yep. 00:16:44.206 --> 00:16:49.956 We do it with like, strangers, you know, at the grocery store, but it's, you know, it's our own family at the holidays. 00:16:49.956 --> 00:16:52.277 It's the neighbor that we stop waving to. 00:16:52.277 --> 00:17:01.057 Um, getting pissed at somebody on social media and unfollowing instead of just having a conversation. 00:17:01.057 --> 00:17:07.297 It's that, you know, same pattern and, and it's close to home. 00:17:07.297 --> 00:17:12.767 Like, we'd rather be right than stay close sometimes. 00:17:12.767 --> 00:17:15.906 Um, I don't know. 00:17:15.906 --> 00:17:21.126 If you wanna screw up your job and your relationships all at once, be bad at communicating. 00:17:21.126 --> 00:17:22.696 Like, 00:17:24.174 --> 00:17:24.545 Yeah. 00:17:24.626 --> 00:17:25.007 I mean, 00:17:25.626 --> 00:17:27.446 There's so much to it. 00:17:27.446 --> 00:17:29.507 There's just so much to that. 00:17:30.258 --> 00:17:30.607 Yeah. 00:17:30.607 --> 00:17:35.367 Yeah, so, there's a repair kit, you know? 00:17:35.367 --> 00:17:45.087 Like, now we have restorative justice circles and courageous conversations trainings, and

you may have those, you know, at your job. 00:17:45.087 --> 00:17:52.160 And Some places have them, some places don't, but they exist and they're real. 00:17:52.160 --> 00:17:54.319 And when they're done right, they do work. 00:17:54.319 --> 00:18:05.640 But notice when we're reaching for them, those come in after the fight, after the harm's been done, after somebody's already been hurt, you know? 00:18:05.640 --> 00:18:17.430 And so, If there's an issue at school, you know, you go into a restorative justice circle, but, like, nobody's putting a kid in a listening circle just because. 00:18:17.430 --> 00:18:21.390 We're working on the repair, not the prevention, I guess is my point. 00:18:21.390 --> 00:18:31.630 We need to practice it like we trained debate teams before anybody ever needed it, and we only trained listening after the damage was already done. 00:18:33.355 --> 00:18:33.865 Yeah. 00:18:33.865 --> 00:18:36.664 And you said there's, like, so much and so many layers to it. 00:18:37.856 --> 00:18:41.807 Well, yeah, because I think too, it's beyond just listening to understand. 00:18:41.807 --> 00:18:47.576 I mean, we should be definitely listening to understand, but there's also, I think, another component to it. 00:18:47.576 --> 00:18:52.507 And to me, what that means is also finding the common denominators, right? 00:18:52.507 --> 00:19:00.017 Because we have far more, all human beings, we have far more in common than we have difference. 00:19:00.017 --> 00:19:07.936 And if we just find those common denominators and we try to do that first, then it changes the narrative. 00:19:07.936 --> 00:19:09.426 It makes it so much easier. 00:19:09.426 --> 00:19:10.946 Those two things go together. 00:19:10.946 --> 00:19:16.547 Do you know what I'm saying? It's not just listening to understand, but finding the common denominator at the same. 00:19:16.689 --> 00:19:22.189 Yeah, I do, but the problem is that there, that, that on the extremes, 00:19:23.118 --> 00:19:23.568 Yeah. 00:19:23.645 --> 00:19:24.365 uh, it's 00:19:24.838 --> 00:19:27.798 And as I always say, the magic is in the middle. 00:19:27.798 --> 00:19:30.999 I think I want that on my headstone. 00:19:31.778 --> 00:19:42.518 Yeah, well, also though the, in the middle, if you ever watch tug of war, the thing that's rattled the most is the piece of, uh, the, whatever's tied in the middle. 00:19:42.518 --> 00:19:47.117 The rag that's tied in the middle is the thing that's torn and tattered because, 00:19:47.813 --> 00:19:50.363 Sherry, I feel that on such a deep level. 00:19:50.435 --> 00:19:50.846 Yeah. 00:19:50.846 --> 00:19:58.215 Yeah, so, like yeah, it's lonely and we're talking about connection and when the s- the loneliest place is in the middle. 00:19:59.175 --> 00:20:02.086 It shouldn't be because we're humans. 00:20:02.086 --> 00:20:02.425 Yeah. 00:20:02.425 --> 00:20:08.125 Well, let's be clear too, 'cause we're talking about listening to understand in this episode. 00:20:08.125 --> 00:20:13.825 I wanna make sure I said it well enough that listening to understand does not mean giving up what you believe. 00:20:13.825 --> 00:20:22.954 It doesn't have to be going soft on your convictions or even meeting someone halfway on something that you know in your bones is right. 00:20:22.954 --> 00:20:29.615 You can hear somebody all the way out and still hold your ground when your gut says to hold it. 00:20:29.615 --> 00:20:32.785 But I'm not saying every disagreement is just a misunderstanding. 00:20:32.785 --> 00:20:33.835 Some of it isn't. 00:20:33.835 --> 00:20:44.075 When people have been saying what they think and what they need for that long and nobody hears them, they shut down, and once that happens, you can't have a productive conversation at all. 00:20:44.075 --> 00:20:57.174 That's what happens when nobody hears you for long enough, and that's why we thought it was important to do an episode on listening as part of connection, not because it's some easy fix for the big stuff. 00:20:57.174 --> 00:20:58.174 It isn't. 00:20:58.174 --> 00:21:00.694 But we're not moving forward without it. 00:21:00.694 --> 00:21:12.298 And there's another part to that, which is listening with discernment and hearing what's true, not just what lines up with what you already think. 00:21:12.298 --> 00:21:19.323 And I don't just mean, in our close relationships. 00:21:19.323 --> 00:21:22.782 I mean with everything that's coming at us all day long. 00:21:22.782 --> 00:21:25.732 We read a headline and we're done. 00:21:25.732 --> 00:21:26.932 We've made our judgment. 00:21:26.932 --> 00:21:28.893 We never even open the thing and read it. 00:21:28.893 --> 00:21:32.532 Somebody puts a caption on a video and we believe the caption. 00:21:32.532 --> 00:21:33.573 Keep scrolling. 00:21:33.573 --> 00:21:40.563 We get duped and then we get duped again and we don't even go back and check whether anything was true. 00:21:40.563 --> 00:21:46.002 We pass it on and then we carry that even further into our real lives. 00:21:46.002 --> 00:21:49.803 We're mad at our own family over something we never verified. 00:21:49.803 --> 00:22:07.798 People have wrecked relationships that matter to them over complete bullshit that somebody made up to get clicks, Forgetting that there are people behind it whose whole job is writing that shit so you can't scroll past it. 00:22:07.798 --> 00:22:17.598 They know exactly which words set you off, and they get paid when you react, and now there's AI behind it fueling it even further. 00:22:17.598 --> 00:22:21.098 So they're real good at it, and we're all tired. 00:22:21.098 --> 00:22:30.778 But we have to remember, if it made you that mad that fast, that is the time to slow down and find out if it's even true. 00:22:30.778 --> 00:22:41.078 Because those things that are put there to make you feel that way in two seconds, probably wasn't there to inform you. 00:22:41.078 --> 00:22:45.048 It's there to piss you off, and

that's the whole point. 00:22:45.048 --> 00:23:04.568 And we have to remember that it goes both directions, and it's easy to listen for the parts that prove you right, and it's easy to nod along with somebody that you like just because you like them, and never check whether what they say holds up, and that's not listening either. 00:23:04.568 --> 00:23:07.588 You're still only hearing what you wanted to hear. 00:23:07.588 --> 00:23:21.390 But the repair when it comes to, you know, our individual relationships, because I think our individual relationships really spill outward into the bigger picture, and when we can work on that, then we can get better together. 00:23:21.390 --> 00:23:26.680 But I don't think that you have to have gotten it right the first time. 00:23:26.680 --> 00:23:27.849 You know? 00:23:27.849 --> 00:23:33.140 Um, you have to be willing to say, "Hey, can we try that again?" That's it. 00:23:33.140 --> 00:23:40.109 You know, that question does a lot. 00:23:42.109 --> 00:23:42.529 It does. 00:23:42.599 --> 00:23:43.670 Circle back, you know? 00:23:43.670 --> 00:23:44.430 I'm sorry. 00:23:44.430 --> 00:23:47.569 It's such a small phrase and it's so big. 00:23:47.624 --> 00:23:48.003 Mm-hmm. 00:23:48.518 --> 00:23:50.597 So why does all of this matter? 00:23:50.597 --> 00:23:52.428 What is the bigger picture here? 00:23:52.428 --> 00:23:55.577 I don't think it's really just about being less lonely. 00:23:55.577 --> 00:23:59.567 When you have people, you show up different. 00:23:59.567 --> 00:24:02.758 You handle your bad day better. 00:24:02.758 --> 00:24:05.137 You have more patience for your kid. 00:24:05.137 --> 00:24:07.678 You have more patience for others. 00:24:07.678 --> 00:24:16.387 You might take a try at something that you wouldn't try if you were carrying it all by yourself. 00:24:16.387 --> 00:24:17.407 The world's a web. 00:24:17.407 --> 00:24:24.448 Everybody's connected to everybody, whether we like it or not, and nobody can fix the whole thing. 00:24:24.448 --> 00:24:29.188 But you get your one little spot, yours. 00:24:29.188 --> 00:24:31.367 That's it. 00:24:31.367 --> 00:24:32.728 But that's not nothing. 00:24:32.728 --> 00:24:38.167 You get better at listening in your own house, and the people in your house get treated better. 00:24:38.167 --> 00:24:41.178 Then they walk out the door, and they treat somebody else better. 00:24:41.178 --> 00:24:45.107 And I gotta say the other side of that too, because it works the same going in the wrong way. 00:24:45.107 --> 00:25:02.428 Somebody that gets talked down to all the time, and they're carrying that out the door with them, and they're short with the next person they see, and that person is short with the next person they see, and it goes on and on and compounds in either direction. 00:25:02.428 --> 00:25:06.347 And we say it a lot about the little moments. 00:25:06.347 --> 00:25:07.038 They matter. 00:25:07.038 --> 00:25:09.387 They matter a lot. 00:25:09.387 --> 00:25:16.097 And it's not some big mystery about why everybody seems meaner lately. 00:25:16.097 --> 00:25:19.248 There's a whole lot of people doing it to each other. 00:25:19.248 --> 00:25:21.688 Too many people passing it on. 00:25:21.688 --> 00:25:27.714 and the thing is, you never, ever will get to see how far that goes. 00:25:27.714 --> 00:25:30.515 But that's not a reason to skip it. 00:25:30.515 --> 00:25:34.724 Just because you can't see it happening, the ripple is still there. 00:25:34.724 --> 00:25:44.490 And nobody's ever fixed things from inside a silo, and we are not getting to a better place all working on ourselves in a room by ourselves. 00:25:44.490 --> 00:25:54.371 It spills out if, if you're working on it, or it doesn't move at all, and we stay stuck in this quagmire. 00:25:54.371 --> 00:26:04.404 I mean, so I think that it's not just a nice thing to have people in your life. 00:26:04.404 --> 00:26:07.974 They are the thing that makes the rest of it work. 00:26:07.974 --> 00:26:17.994 If you have somebody to lean on, The same problem, the same bad news, it, it hits with a different weight. 00:26:17.994 --> 00:26:29.144 If you start drifting, somebody who's paying attention notices that before you do, before you stumble too far, you know? 00:26:29.144 --> 00:26:44.275 But the thing is, like all these little actions that we were talking about in both seasons is building it on purpose a little at a time before you're in crisis, because you will need it. 00:26:44.275 --> 00:26:47.464 It's not a matter of if you will need it, you will need it. 00:26:47.464 --> 00:26:51.454 And it doesn't mean a lot of people. 00:26:51.454 --> 00:27:00.371 Like two people who know you really, really well Beats, 20 who really don't. 00:27:00.371 --> 00:27:07.681 Build whatever's yours, whatever, that feels like to you, but do it while things are fine because that's the only time you can do it. 00:27:07.681 --> 00:27:11.230 It's not gonna happen when you wait for the crisis. 00:27:11.230 --> 00:27:12.121 You know what I'm saying? 00:27:13.340 --> 00:27:13.770 Yeah, 00:27:13.780 --> 00:27:22.319 You're right maybe we need to put some resources in the show notes if somebody finds themselves in a situation where 00:27:22.498 --> 00:27:22.917 Right, right. 00:27:23.079 --> 00:27:24.140 You're not sure 00:27:24.198 --> 00:27:26.627 You don't have to look for a best friend right away. 00:27:26.627 --> 00:27:39.827 Like, if you're truly genuinely lonely, like, just being out in the world and trying to sure that you're making eye contact with somebody or saying, you know, wave to a stranger. 00:27:40.036 --> 00:27:42.115 Yeah, a smile. 00:27:42.115 --> 00:27:42.665 Yeah. 00:27:42.678 --> 00:27:43.917 We need to normalize that. 00:27:43.917 --> 00:27:44.137 We 00:27:44.276 --> 00:27:44.786 Yeah 00:27:44.988 --> 00:27:45.917 need to normalize that. 00:27:45.917 --> 00:27:47.698 Smile at people, wave at people. 00:27:47.698 --> 00:27:52.877 I mean, I know when

I'm starting to feel like, oh, ugh, I stop doing it, and I start, like, looking down. 00:27:52.877 --> 00:27:54.198 I don't wanna look at my neighbors. 00:27:54.198 --> 00:27:56.458 I'm really forcing myself 00:27:56.615 --> 00:27:57.016 Yeah. 00:27:57.018 --> 00:27:58.218 not do that. 00:27:58.556 --> 00:27:58.976 Yeah 00:27:59.028 --> 00:28:01.397 Look around, see the people around you. 00:28:01.586 --> 00:28:01.865 Yeah. 00:28:01.865 --> 00:28:06.365 And there's, there's different circumstances that create that, you know, situation. 00:28:06.365 --> 00:28:10.175 Um, and for all different reasons we can find ourselves there. 00:28:10.175 --> 00:28:12.816 And the one of the ones that comes to mind is, like, widows. 00:28:12.816 --> 00:28:17.115 And, It's really hard to get back out there, you know? 00:28:17.115 --> 00:28:22.210 But there's meetup groups and some people that I know utilize those and, 00:28:23.286 --> 00:28:24.605 Yeah, same. 00:28:24.650 --> 00:28:37.440 So- You do find yourself alone and you're ready to make a connection, but whatever barriers may be there, what can you do? 00:28:37.890 --> 00:28:39.299 Yeah, that one next thing. 00:28:40.404 --> 00:28:40.914 Yeah. 00:28:41.625 --> 00:28:45.515 So I'm sold on why, but um there's not a listening team. 00:28:45.515 --> 00:28:50.615 So what would you say to do on Tuesday morning? 00:28:50.615 --> 00:29:01.295 Well with your regular everyday interactions with people, whether it's strangers or, in your closer relationships. 00:29:01.295 --> 00:29:16.784 I didn't think of this earlier whenever you said it, but like one of the things that I think really deepens the conversation is trying to always ask one more question before you say your thing. 00:29:16.784 --> 00:29:18.604 Just one question. 00:29:18.604 --> 00:29:19.523 That's it. 00:29:19.523 --> 00:29:29.874 Like, some people walk into a room and, and just start blah, blah, blah, blah, and, you know, unloading all their shit or like, "Look at this. 00:29:29.874 --> 00:29:30.304 Look at this. 00:29:30.304 --> 00:29:30.743 Look at this. 00:29:30.743 --> 00:29:31.153 Look at this. 00:29:31.153 --> 00:29:31.523 Look at me. 00:29:31.523 --> 00:29:31.903 Look at me. 00:29:31.903 --> 00:29:32.324 Look at me. 00:29:32.324 --> 00:29:37.240 Look at me." You're there a que- to have a a conversation. 00:29:37.240 --> 00:29:43.711 So a conversation requires dialogue, which requires a question, you know? 00:29:43.711 --> 00:29:46.871 So be curious about the person who is in front of you. 00:29:46.871 --> 00:29:52.201 I think that's the biggest thing, and if I had to stop the list right here, I would stop it there. 00:29:52.201 --> 00:29:55.361 It really changes the, the vibe in the room. 00:29:55.361 --> 00:29:56.871 It changes everything. 00:29:56.871 --> 00:29:59.151 So that's the biggest one. 00:29:59.151 --> 00:30:03.641 The second thing is like that task avoidance thing. 00:30:03.641 --> 00:30:09.760 We become afraid to reach out to somebody, and the longer you don't, the harder it gets. 00:30:09.760 --> 00:30:12.951 And so I say just, just reach out. 00:30:12.951 --> 00:30:17.580 I think, we talk ourselves out of it before we let ourself do it. 00:30:17.580 --> 00:30:21.191 So if there's somebody that's been on your mind, reach out. 00:30:22.891 --> 00:30:30.471 Yeah, I gotta tell you, there are times when I thought of someone and I didn't reach out, and and now I don't have that opportunity. 00:30:30.471 --> 00:30:37.030 So I think that's something else that we need to realize, that, our time here is precious. 00:30:37.653 --> 00:30:38.002 Yeah. 00:30:38.230 --> 00:30:41.050 There is no guarantee on how long that time's gonna be. 00:30:41.131 --> 00:30:41.490 Yeah. 00:30:41.490 --> 00:30:46.009 I'd rather have reached out than regret not. 00:30:48.140 --> 00:30:48.279 100%. 00:30:50.188 --> 00:30:51.867 But the small stuff counts too. 00:30:51.867 --> 00:30:58.157 Like when it comes to acquaintances, um, learn somebody's name and use it. 00:30:58.157 --> 00:30:59.198 Look at them in the eye. 00:30:59.198 --> 00:31:01.127 Say thank you like you mean it. 00:31:01.127 --> 00:31:05.438 You know, not like you're just getting off the phone, mean it. 00:31:05.438 --> 00:31:08.028 Say hi to the stranger, like you said. 00:31:08.028 --> 00:31:11.657 Like, none of it has to be deep conversation, and it all counts. 00:31:11.657 --> 00:31:18.137 Sometimes people look at you crazy now if you do try to talk because, like, everybody's so, isolated- where I... 00:31:18.236 --> 00:31:18.635 You can have fun with that too. 00:31:18.837 --> 00:31:19.057 Yeah. 00:31:21.698 --> 00:31:27.788 But then, you know, when it does come to your circle, you don't have to have a big circle. 00:31:27.788 --> 00:31:38.048 One person who knows you, who listens when you talk, who believes you when you say you're struggling, and it's okay to show up messy with that person. 00:31:38.048 --> 00:31:42.857 That's the place where, you know, it's okay to let yourself be a little messy. 00:31:42.857 --> 00:31:48.778 Um, but you gotta be careful because everybody has their own stuff that they're carrying. 00:31:48.778 --> 00:31:59.337 And then this is one that I need to get better about, which is celebrate the good things when, like, when somebody tells you their good news, hell yeah. 00:31:59.337 --> 00:32:07.557 I think how you're showing up for someone's best day matters as much as their worst one, and this is the one I... 00:32:07.557 --> 00:32:11.258 And it gets me, because I'm bad at this. 00:32:11.258 --> 00:32:25.198 And I think it's, for me personally, like, holidays and typical happier things that are celebrated were hard for us in our particular dynamic. 00:32:25.198 --> 00:32:41.627 And so there was a level of dread when it came to certain things that I used to take for granted, and I started, like, toning down my own good news, my own celebrations, and I think it kind of spilled over into my

relationships. 00:32:41.627 --> 00:32:43.478 So, I'm working on that. 00:32:43.478 --> 00:32:46.728 And then the last thing is you're allowed to ask to be heard. 00:32:46.728 --> 00:32:49.948 I talked about the person who walks in and just dumps everything. 00:32:49.948 --> 00:32:52.528 You know, that's not, that's not what I'm talking about. 00:32:52.528 --> 00:32:54.698 I'm saying Communication is both. 00:32:54.698 --> 00:32:56.167 It's listening and talking. 00:32:56.167 --> 00:33:03.048 We need to tell our people how to love us right. 00:33:03.048 --> 00:33:03.887 You know what I'm saying? 00:33:03.938 --> 00:33:08.728 Yeah, we teach the people in our lives how to treat us. 00:33:09.621 --> 00:33:13.270 Yeah and it, comes back to the communication and the connection thing. 00:33:13.270 --> 00:33:15.040 You know, we're not good at communicating. 00:33:15.040 --> 00:33:23.263 and then that just creates walls because we don't say what we need to say. 00:33:25.359 --> 00:33:32.430 But, there's times when people may literally feel unsafe. 00:33:33.065 --> 00:33:33.255 Yeah. 00:33:34.000 --> 00:33:35.339 To speak their truth. 00:33:35.339 --> 00:33:46.210 And if you grow up in that way, it becomes very difficult, more difficult to let people know that they don't feel seen or heard. 00:33:46.210 --> 00:33:54.980 When you see somebody that is a certain way, keep in mind that there's reasons behind some of that sometimes that we can't possibly understand. 00:33:55.490 --> 00:33:58.790 That's so important that you say that. 00:33:58.790 --> 00:34:18.257 You're speaking to something that's a big why behind this episode because everyone's circumstances are individual and unique, but it is a common pattern where growing up, we learn to Hide our own needs to keep the peace. 00:34:19.516 --> 00:34:19.817 Yes, 00:34:20.027 --> 00:34:22.527 And it's hard old wiring, you know what I mean? 00:34:22.527 --> 00:34:23.056 It's hard. 00:34:23.056 --> 00:34:31.106 We learn it as a survival tactic, and it helped get through some things, but it doesn't get us to thriving. 00:34:32.483 --> 00:34:33.304 Yeah, exactly. 00:34:33.409 --> 00:34:41.268 And the thing is, some of us go through our whole life and never, never even notice. 00:34:41.268 --> 00:34:43.918 And we just keep on passing it down, passing it down. 00:34:43.918 --> 00:34:49.228 That one day at, in front of the stream, I, like, had this, like, whole epiphany about my life. 00:34:49.228 --> 00:34:51.898 I'm like, "Holy fucking shit." Holy shit. 00:34:51.898 --> 00:34:54.708 And, some people get that moment and some people don't. 00:34:54.708 --> 00:34:55.248 And 00:34:55.302 --> 00:34:55.998 Some people don't. 00:34:56.048 --> 00:34:56.548 Yeah. 00:34:56.548 --> 00:34:57.648 So, 00:34:58.918 --> 00:35:02.139 It's like putting us together is like putting together a Rubik's 00:35:03.257 --> 00:35:03.626 Yeah 00:35:03.668 --> 00:35:03.708 Cube. 00:35:03.708 --> 00:35:04.679 That's what I feel like. 00:35:04.679 --> 00:35:11.559 I find, these little pieces of myself where I'm like, "Hmm, where does that belong? 00:35:11.559 --> 00:35:18.298 Where did that come from, and where does it belong?" This is, this is a rather difficult puzzle. 00:35:19.949 --> 00:35:20.838 Yes, it is. 00:35:20.838 --> 00:35:22.528 We're some complicated peeps. 00:35:25.556 --> 00:35:27.976 These are the things that we do for someone. 00:35:27.976 --> 00:35:32.746 Is there anything in it for the person that's the listening? 00:35:32.766 --> 00:35:58.523 This is a different twist on it, but I think we can think of listening as service to others, 'cause if This Is It is about walking toward your more purposeful life, your most vibrant feel-good life, I don't think you can do that without service to others in some way. 00:35:58.523 --> 00:36:04.702 And listening is service, And I think it's, the cheapest service that there is. 00:36:04.702 --> 00:36:08.112 It's the thing that doesn't cost anything, you know? 00:36:08.112 --> 00:36:10.123 And we all, we have it. 00:36:10.123 --> 00:36:12.072 We all have it within us. 00:36:12.072 --> 00:36:13.813 It's finding it again. 00:36:13.813 --> 00:36:17.492 I don't like to speak in generalizations at all on this show, you know that. 00:36:17.492 --> 00:36:27.443 But, we we do have that in there somewhere so I think it's the thing that, like, if you, you wanna do something for somebody this week, you don't necessarily need money. 00:36:27.443 --> 00:36:31.603 You don't need some big, grand thing. 00:36:31.603 --> 00:36:34.773 Just give somebody 10 minutes. 00:36:34.773 --> 00:36:45.713 Give somebody 10 minutes where the only thing that you're doing is hearing them, because for someone, that might be the first time in years, who knows? 00:36:45.713 --> 00:36:48.373 Why are we talking about all this? 00:36:48.373 --> 00:36:50.112 This isn't just a nice idea. 00:36:50.112 --> 00:37:14.012 There's a whole model on it, and I wanna loop back to, we talked to Rich Jones from YouTurn Health in the very last episode, and that's the entire thing about their whole model, was having somebody who's been through the hard thing staying connected to somebody who's going through it now. 00:37:14.012 --> 00:37:15.432 That's the intervention. 00:37:15.432 --> 00:37:20.413 Their whole intervention is based on connection, and it works for some people. 00:37:20.413 --> 00:37:37.373 We don't want to Promote one path over another, but I think they are filling a gap in the treatment process, and that's connection. 00:37:37.373 --> 00:37:53.083 When you're talking about drug and alcohol rehabilitation, you do all the work, and how much work it takes leading up to even walking in the door in the first place, and then all the work going through programs, and then people are turned out the door. 00:37:53.083 --> 00:38:03.443 And now it's gotten better, but the thing that YouTurn is doing is keeping somebody connected along the way. 00:38:05.043 -->

00:38:05.324 For a longer time, too. 00:38:06.023 --> 00:38:10.643 'Cause some of the programs do that up to a point, but some of them aren't as long as others. 00:38:10.643 --> 00:38:20.264 I think the other part of that connection piece too that's really important is that you might have to try a couple different things before you find the one that works for you. 00:38:20.760 --> 00:38:20.981 Mm-hmm. 00:38:21.034 --> 00:38:22.364 I relate it to therapy. 00:38:22.364 --> 00:38:27.715 I've gone to therapists and I thought, you know, just didn't really feel like I connected. 00:38:27.715 --> 00:38:28.514 I didn't feel like that 00:38:28.548 --> 00:38:28.838 Yeah 00:38:28.925 --> 00:38:31.094 really got me, and I felt it. 00:38:31.094 --> 00:38:46.215 And instead of just shutting down and being like, "Therapy's not for me," I looked up other ones that I thought maybe would be a better fit, and I tried again until I found that one that was right for me. 00:38:46.215 --> 00:38:47.105 And I did the same thing. 00:38:47.105 --> 00:38:53.344 I tried to do, some group, like support groups in person, I didn't connect well that way. 00:38:53.818 --> 00:38:54.068 Um, 00:38:54.155 --> 00:38:54.614 Um, 00:38:54.818 --> 00:38:55.108 it just 00:38:55.315 --> 00:39:00.849 just I just found another avenue where I did feel that, okay, these are my people. 00:39:00.849 --> 00:39:16.248 This is where I feel connected, so I mean, don't be afraid to try other things 'cause, you know, if you, you don't connect with one person or one mode of therapy or whatever, it doesn't mean there isn't something else to try. 00:39:17.719 --> 00:39:27.889 When you're walking in connection with others, it helps the person hold the maybe that the best is still out there. 00:39:27.889 --> 00:39:40.773 When someone runs out of hope, someone You're connected to holds it for a while for you until you can pick it back up. 00:39:40.773 --> 00:39:45.853 And that's what I mean when I say about handing someone a maybe. 00:39:45.853 --> 00:39:47.963 Like, we talked about in the last episode. 00:39:47.963 --> 00:39:50.304 We can't fix it for somebody. 00:39:50.304 --> 00:40:01.693 We can't fix whatever it is for our loved one, but we can hold that maybe for them until They can carry it again. 00:40:03.681 --> 00:40:04.811 Here's my cheesy take. 00:40:04.811 --> 00:40:05.929 I'm thinking of The Lord of the Rings 00:40:05.949 --> 00:40:06.730 Yeah, yeah. 00:40:07.240 --> 00:40:13.141 when when Frodo has to get the ring and throw it in the fire, and he can't make 00:40:13.280 --> 00:40:13.559 Yeah 00:40:13.791 --> 00:40:18.320 Sam picks him up and says, "I can't carry the ring for you, but I can carry you." 00:40:19.945 --> 00:40:20.545 That's it. 00:40:20.545 --> 00:40:28.726 There's your visual to remember to connect with someone so they can hold the ring, hold the maybe, hold the hope. 00:40:28.820 --> 00:40:31.400 They can't carry your problem, but they can carry you. 00:40:31.579 --> 00:40:32.320 Absolutely. 00:40:32.320 --> 00:40:32.719 I love... 00:40:32.771 --> 00:40:33.431 Let them. 00:40:33.630 --> 00:40:35.010 Yeah, I love that Jodi. 00:40:35.010 --> 00:40:35.750 I really love that. 00:40:36.659 --> 00:40:38.210 Where does that leave us? 00:40:38.320 --> 00:40:46.719 Nobody's handing out trophies for listening, but every relationship that you've still got is one that you listened your way into keeping somehow. 00:40:46.719 --> 00:40:55.750 And that I don't think we can get the connection that we need to thrive without being good at listening. 00:40:55.750 --> 00:41:07.260 And 85 years of research, we talked about says so, and yet here we are still trying to win instead of listening to understand. 00:41:07.260 --> 00:41:11.469 And when that's happening, we are all losing. 00:41:11.469 --> 00:41:14.550 We are some stubborn mofos 00:41:15.958 --> 00:41:16.369 For real. 00:41:16.813 --> 00:41:26.152 What can each of us do the next time you feel that deep cut loading up while someone's trying to give you their perspective? 00:41:26.152 --> 00:41:28.929 Take a breath. 00:41:28.929 --> 00:41:34.588 Remember that little "peace begins with me" little finger touch thing we did grounding? 00:41:34.588 --> 00:41:42.829 Take a breath, ground yourself, and ask a question instead And if you already threw the dagger, you know what to do. 00:41:42.829 --> 00:41:48.599 You don't be a jagoff, circle back, and ask, "Can we try that again?" This is it. 00:41:48.599 --> 00:41:56.278 Before we go, hit follow so you don't miss the next one, and if somebody came to mind while you were listening, send it to them. 00:41:56.278 --> 00:41:59.929 And thank you to everybody shopping through our Amazon link. 00:41:59.929 --> 00:42:03.739 It costs you nothing extra, and it helps us keep going. 00:42:03.739 --> 00:42:16.458 It's linked in the show notes and also at thrivingyinzers.com This podcast is meant to be informational and inspirational, but it is not a substitute for professional advice. 00:42:16.458 --> 00:42:22.534 We are not licensed therapists or medical professionals, and what we share here comes from personal experience only. 00:42:22.534 --> 00:42:26.884 If you or someone you love is struggling, please reach out to someone trained to help. 00:42:26.884 --> 00:42:32.563 And if you're in crisis, you can call or text 988 The Suicide and Crisis Lifeline. 00:42:32.563 --> 00:42:34.474 It is available 24-7.