התמלול המלא של I'm Doing Well... So Why Does This Feel Empty

true believers' veins run Coke red. 00:04:29.040 --> 00:04:30.639 My veins didn't run Coke red. 00:04:30.959 --> 00:04:32.639 I put my faith above my career. 00:04:32.800 --> 00:04:36.319 At Coke, that made me a sprite in a room full of classics. 00:04:36.560 --> 00:04:38.800 Same company, different drink. 00:04:39.839 --> 00:04:42.480 I spent years wanting the VP title. 00:04:42.720 --> 00:04:44.480 Thought that was the finish line. 00:04:44.720 --> 00:04:45.600 Never got it. 00:04:45.839 --> 00:04:48.319 Turns out position doesn't equal influence. 00:04:48.480 --> 00:04:50.639 But try putting that on a nameplate. 00:04:51.759 --> 00:04:57.439 And for about half of my time at Coca-Cola, I was focused on myself, my reputation, my ambitions. 00:04:57.680 --> 00:04:58.639 The other half? 00:04:58.879 --> 00:05:01.680 God got a hold of me and I focused on people. 00:05:01.920 --> 00:05:05.040 Guess which half anyone remembered at my retirement party? 00:05:05.279 --> 00:05:07.279 Nobody toasted my KPIs. 00:05:08.879 --> 00:05:10.879 That last one hit close to home. 00:05:11.040 --> 00:05:12.160 Here's the full story. 00:05:12.399 --> 00:05:15.040 Before I tell you what happened to me, let me say this. 00:05:15.279 --> 00:05:18.319 You don't have to retire to feel what I'm about to describe. 00:05:18.560 --> 00:05:22.000 I just happened to feel it most sharply when the career ended. 00:05:22.399 --> 00:05:25.120 But the emptiness was knocking long before that. 00:05:25.360 --> 00:05:32.800 After promotions that should have thrilled me, after targets that should have satisfied me, after recognition that should have been enough. 00:05:33.120 --> 00:05:33.920 But it wasn't. 00:05:34.240 --> 00:05:37.199 And I didn't know why until everything stopped. 00:05:37.680 --> 00:05:41.279 I retired from the Coca-Cola company after 21 and a half years. 00:05:41.519 --> 00:05:43.120 That's almost 8,000 days. 00:05:43.439 --> 00:05:47.120 Nearly 40% of my life invested in one employer. 00:05:47.360 --> 00:05:48.720 And I didn't leave bitter. 00:05:48.959 --> 00:05:50.000 I left grateful. 00:05:50.399 --> 00:05:51.839 I integrated my faith. 00:05:52.079 --> 00:05:55.839 I shifted from a performance mindset to a people-first mindset. 00:05:56.240 --> 00:05:59.360 I learned that the how matters more than the what. 00:05:59.839 --> 00:06:02.000 In my retirement party, it was a beautiful night. 00:06:02.480 --> 00:06:04.879 Stories about relationships, not KPIs. 00:06:05.439 --> 00:06:10.959 And I walked out of the Atlanta office complex for the last time thinking, Lord, we did it right. 00:06:11.519 --> 00:06:14.720 And then the next chapter started or didn't. 00:06:15.120 --> 00:06:17.199 Because here's what I wasn't prepared for. 00:06:17.519 --> 00:06:26.160 When you retire, you don't just leave a job, you leave a structure, a daily rhythm, a place where people know your name and expect you to be in the room. 00:06:26.560 --> 00:06:29.519 You leave your context that

made your contributions visible. 00:06:29.920 --> 00:06:33.920 And I'd resolved to stay with Coke after job hopping across different companies. 00:06:38.879 --> 00:06:40.399 But I finally found a home. 00:06:40.639 --> 00:06:43.519 And leaving that home meant losing more than a paycheck. 00:06:43.680 --> 00:06:46.399 It meant losing the scaffolding around my identity. 00:06:46.639 --> 00:06:51.600 The accolades stopped, the calendar emptied, the challenge evaporated. 00:06:51.759 --> 00:06:54.800 The sense of importance that came from my corporate life vanished. 00:06:55.040 --> 00:06:55.600 All of it. 00:06:56.240 --> 00:06:58.319 Not gradually, suddenly. 00:06:58.639 --> 00:07:01.360 Like someone pulled a tablecloth and everything fell. 00:07:02.000 --> 00:07:06.720 And I was drifting, grappling with a loss of identity, a crisis of purpose. 00:07:07.120 --> 00:07:09.680 The existential questions came flooding back. 00:07:10.160 --> 00:07:10.800 Who am I? 00:07:11.199 --> 00:07:12.079 Why am I here? 00:07:12.560 --> 00:07:13.360 Do I matter? 00:07:13.920 --> 00:07:17.279 I'd answered all of those questions before, or I thought I had. 00:07:17.759 --> 00:07:26.720 I had purpose statements and vision statements and mission statements, but none of those were built on a foundation that included a badge, a title, and a team that reported to me. 00:07:27.199 --> 00:07:30.319 Take the foundation away, and the statements ring hollow. 00:07:30.480 --> 00:07:33.360 I finally learned that my career did not define who I am. 00:07:33.600 --> 00:07:35.519 My veins didn't run Coke Red. 00:07:35.759 --> 00:07:40.639 But knowing that in my head and living it in my bones were two completely different things. 00:07:40.879 --> 00:07:44.560 And in those first months of my retirement, my bones hadn't gotten the memo. 00:07:44.639 --> 00:07:45.680 Then came the trip. 00:07:46.000 --> 00:07:50.240 Carl and I, along with some friends, went to Passion City Church's Holy Land Tour. 00:07:50.399 --> 00:07:52.800 And there I was sitting in the Garden of Gethsemane. 00:07:53.120 --> 00:08:00.480 Maybe you've heard of it, a little garden where Jesus submitted his life to God before he went to the cross, a weighty place to say the least. 00:08:00.959 --> 00:08:04.959 I sat there, not as a tourist, a man without a compass. 00:08:05.360 --> 00:08:06.639 Lord, where are you in all this? 00:08:06.720 --> 00:08:07.439 I implored. 00:08:07.920 --> 00:08:13.360 In the garden where Jesus Himself grappled with his destiny, I found a semblance of solace. 00:08:14.000 --> 00:08:16.319 He whispered, Follow me. 00:08:16.639 --> 00:08:18.560 Two words I'll never forget hearing. 00:08:18.959 --> 00:08:23.600 It was a directive that required no roadmap, no strategic plan, and no business acumen. 00:08:24.079 --> 00:08:30.160 It was a call to surrender, to trust, to let go of the what and the why, and to embrace the who. 00:08:30.800 --> 00:08:36.559 And in that moment I realized that my identity wasn't tied to my past achievements or my future endeavors. 00:08:36.960 --> 00:08:38.639 It was anchored in Jesus. 00:08:39.039 --> 00:08:48.080 It was about being his first and foremost, not a Coca-Cola executive, not a retired leader, not a strategic thinker or a results-driven professional. 00:08:48.639 --> 00:08:49.039 His. 00:08:49.600 --> 00:08:50.240 That's it. 00:08:50.559 --> 00:08:51.600 That's the foundation. 00:08:52.080 --> 00:08:53.840 Everything else is scaffolding. 00:08:54.000 --> 00:08:56.559 I'm telling you this not as a retirement story. 00:08:56.960 --> 00:08:59.840 I'm telling you this as a warning and an invitation. 00:09:00.240 --> 00:09:06.960 The emptiness that I felt at the end of my career was the same emptiness I felt after every Halloween along the way. 00:09:07.440 --> 00:09:10.480 I just finally ran out of targets to distract me from it. 00:09:10.960 --> 00:09:16.000 You don't have to wait until the belt stops moving to ask what you've been running toward. 00:09:16.240 --> 00:09:17.440 Ask it now. 00:09:17.919 --> 00:09:20.399 Because meaning doesn't show up at retirement. 00:09:20.559 --> 00:09:24.559 It shows up when you stop long enough to hear follow me. 00:09:24.799 --> 00:09:30.559 Most leaders I know go to church on Sunday and show up on Monday like they've never heard a word of it. 00:09:30.720 --> 00:09:31.919 I was one of them. 00:09:32.159 --> 00:09:37.039 The Discipled Leader Apprenticeship exists to close that gap. 00:09:37.360 --> 00:09:42.480 One-on-one discipleship that shapes how you actually lead not just what you leave. 00:09:42.639 --> 00:09:48.080 If you're tired of living two separate lives, visit Prestonpoor.com. 00:09:55.360 --> 00:09:58.159 Chris Simpson, welcome to PCUbe. 00:09:58.240 --> 00:09:58.720 You're in the house. 00:09:58.879 --> 00:10:00.000 So glad to have you here today. 00:10:00.399 --> 00:10:02.159 Normally I don't introduce folks. 00:10:02.240 --> 00:10:04.159 I love for them to tell us about themselves. 00:10:04.240 --> 00:10:06.639 So take a moment, do that for the audience if you're Yeah, Preston. 00:10:06.799 --> 00:10:07.840 Thank you, brother, for inviting me. 00:10:08.080 --> 00:10:08.879 What an honor to be here. 00:10:08.960 --> 00:10:16.080 Uh my name is Chris Simpson, uh president and CEO of CBMC International, the world's largest and oldest evangelical marketplace ministry. 00:10:16.399 --> 00:10:17.759 Been around since 1930. 00:10:17.840 --> 00:10:18.559 Praise God for that. 00:10:18.720 --> 00:10:21.840 We're now in 90 countries around the world, 50,000 amazing. 00:10:22.080 --> 00:10:23.440 Did you start as president in 1930? 00:10:23.759 --> 00:10:24.720 Oh yeah, I got a lot of years. 00:10:24.879 --> 00:10:25.360 Yeah, you're right. 00:10:25.919 --> 00:10:28.080 No, I stepped in it in 2022. 00:10:28.159 --> 00:10:28.399 Okay. 00:10:28.639 --> 00:10:30.240 And the last four years have been amazing. 00:10:30.320 --> 00:10:31.679 You know, we're now

in 90 countries. 00:10:31.759 --> 00:10:33.039 I get to travel the world. 00:10:33.120 --> 00:10:36.240 Uh sharing the good news with business and professional leaders. 00:10:36.399 --> 00:10:38.480 Uh man, what a what an amazing job, right? 00:10:38.639 --> 00:10:43.279 Uh, but uh I got a real traditional uh, you know, ministry path behind me. 00:10:43.360 --> 00:10:46.159 For 24 years, I was a special agent in the U.S. 00:10:46.240 --> 00:10:46.879 Secret Service. 00:10:46.960 --> 00:10:48.639 I protected seven different presidents. 00:10:48.720 --> 00:10:53.279 And five of those years, uh, I was a diplomatic attaché to the Republic of Columbia. 00:10:53.440 --> 00:10:54.559 Before that, I was a U.S. 00:10:54.639 --> 00:10:55.440 Marine Corps officer. 00:10:55.519 --> 00:10:59.679 So, yes, you're your traditional pathway to marketplace ministry, right? 00:10:59.759 --> 00:11:04.720 Uh no, but but really, you know, what God did in orchestrating that path was amazing for me. 00:11:04.960 --> 00:11:07.279 I'm married to a beautiful woman, Anna. 00:11:07.360 --> 00:11:08.480 We have 26 years together. 00:11:08.559 --> 00:11:11.039 I have three children, two daughters, uh, one son. 00:11:11.279 --> 00:11:12.320 We live down in Florida. 00:11:12.399 --> 00:11:13.600 And uh, man, life is good. 00:11:13.840 --> 00:11:14.320 That's awesome. 00:11:14.480 --> 00:11:15.679 Great, great introduction. 00:11:15.759 --> 00:11:20.480 Uh, I could go any path down any path on a lot of the things you just shared. 00:11:20.720 --> 00:11:33.759 But today, we're so honored to have you in PCUbe in the studio today to chat about some of these things, about uh really about the activities that we have around our lives and where our meaning comes from versus achievement and those types of things. 00:11:33.840 --> 00:11:35.360 And so uh really important conversation. 00:11:35.519 --> 00:11:37.120 I know that we're gonna pull a lot out of you today. 00:11:37.200 --> 00:11:39.600 So let's go glow there first with the first question. 00:11:39.840 --> 00:11:45.919 Um, so Chris, have you ever hit a big milestone, a promotion, a launch, a number, and felt nothing on the other side? 00:11:46.080 --> 00:11:47.120 And what was that like? 00:11:47.360 --> 00:11:51.759 Yeah, you know, there's a lot of examples, Preston, that I could I could pull, but let me just pull one. 00:11:51.840 --> 00:11:52.080 Okay. 00:11:52.320 --> 00:11:59.039 So down in Columbia, I received what's called the Medal of Valor, it's the highest award that the nation can give to a foreign agent. 00:11:59.200 --> 00:12:04.000 Um, they gave it to me um not just for one moment in time. 00:12:04.159 --> 00:12:07.840 See, normally a value award, they usually don't give them for like the good quarter. 00:12:07.919 --> 00:12:11.919 They give it for like uh the time in your life that was difficult, but you made it out of life, right? 00:12:12.159 --> 00:12:12.320 Right. 00:12:12.480 --> 00:12:13.120 That was for us. 00:12:13.200 --> 00:12:14.639 Uh, but it wasn't one event. 00:12:14.720 --> 00:12:19.759 Over the course of five years, uh, me and my team, we we seized over 100 million in counterfeit U.S. 00:12:19.840 --> 00:12:21.600 currency, the most in Secret Service history. 00:12:21.759 --> 00:12:21.919 Wow. 00:12:22.080 --> 00:12:24.240 And we we put behind bars a lot of bad guys. 00:12:24.399 --> 00:12:26.080 So this was record-breaking type stuff. 00:12:26.159 --> 00:12:27.919 And so they gave me an award, right? 00:12:28.000 --> 00:12:31.919 And so you're getting there, you're getting the metal pins on, you're getting the applause and the recognition. 00:12:32.080 --> 00:12:33.919 Um, and then you go back, right? 00:12:34.000 --> 00:12:49.919 And and if you begin to attach identity or worth or value on those types of events, uh, you know, the aftermath really is it's kind of sobering because you go back after you got the metal, you put it in a box, you put it in your desk, or you put it on the shelf or wherever it is. 00:12:50.159 --> 00:12:52.480 But really, it it doesn't identify you. 00:12:52.559 --> 00:12:55.759 Yeah, it's it's just a snapshot of a moment in time. 00:12:55.919 --> 00:13:00.399 Like it doesn't tell you who you are, but really it just tells you where you what where you went. 00:13:00.480 --> 00:13:01.200 Like where were you? 00:13:01.360 --> 00:13:02.960 Like what did you like what did you do? 00:13:03.120 --> 00:13:19.200 And and so um for me, that reality, that like those recognized moments didn't add value necessarily to my own self-worth or like my own perception of who I was, but rather uh they just helped me identify where where the Lord had taken me. 00:13:19.360 --> 00:13:22.639 And putting that in the right perspective was vital for me, right? 00:13:22.799 --> 00:13:30.960 I mean, for example, the uh director of investigations up in Washington, D.C., um, he's like, hey, your picture is hanging up in Secret Service headquarters. 00:13:31.120 --> 00:13:32.399 So I didn't even know this, right? 00:13:32.480 --> 00:13:38.480 So a picture of a huge seizure we had done on the Venezuelan border, me in front of a uh counterfeit printing press. 00:13:38.720 --> 00:13:39.919 I had the vest on. 00:13:40.000 --> 00:13:41.120 I was looking it was pretty sharp. 00:13:41.200 --> 00:13:41.919 It was a good photo. 00:13:42.000 --> 00:13:42.080 Yeah. 00:13:42.240 --> 00:13:43.759 And they had it in Secret Service headquarters. 00:13:43.840 --> 00:13:44.720 He's like, hey, do you want it? 00:13:44.799 --> 00:13:46.320 We're we're redesigning the area. 00:13:46.399 --> 00:13:47.039 I'll send it to you. 00:13:47.120 --> 00:13:48.080 I'm like, yeah, it'd be great. 00:13:48.159 --> 00:13:48.799 No, no problem. 00:13:48.879 --> 00:13:49.279 Thanks. 00:13:49.440 --> 00:13:51.840 And by the time the mail got through with it, it was all broken. 00:13:51.919 --> 00:13:56.720 The glass was had cut the picture up and everything, but but the reality

press, it didn't bother me. 00:13:56.879 --> 00:13:57.279 You know what? 00:13:57.440 --> 00:14:01.120 Because because again, it was just a snapshot of my life. 00:14:01.279 --> 00:14:03.840 It wasn't, it didn't have deeper meaning than that. 00:14:03.919 --> 00:14:14.159 Yeah, yeah, praise God for the opportunities, praise God for the men who were with me and uh what we did to to try and step in the gap between light and dark in those days, but it didn't define me. 00:14:14.240 --> 00:14:14.399 Yeah. 00:14:14.559 --> 00:14:14.720 Right. 00:14:14.879 --> 00:14:18.480 So that coming to me, broken and scarred up and messed up, you know what? 00:14:18.559 --> 00:14:19.279 It's not a big deal. 00:14:19.360 --> 00:14:20.559 It's a snapshot of my life. 00:14:20.639 --> 00:14:21.840 You know, life goes on. 00:14:22.080 --> 00:14:29.759 With all that resume, with all the recognition that you've received, all the things that you've done, uh, when did you come to Christ in all that? 00:14:29.919 --> 00:14:31.360 Was it before, during, after? 00:14:31.519 --> 00:14:33.200 Tell us a little bit about how you came to know him. 00:14:33.519 --> 00:14:33.840 Yeah. 00:14:34.000 --> 00:14:38.879 So grew up in West Tennessee, small town, uh, church family. 00:14:38.960 --> 00:14:42.399 Like my great-grandmother played the organ, my grandmother led the choir. 00:14:42.480 --> 00:14:44.960 I was the kid that mowed the lawn and poured the grape juice, right? 00:14:45.360 --> 00:14:46.720 And so I grew up in the environment. 00:14:46.799 --> 00:14:48.559 And uh, and so I knew the verbiage. 00:14:48.639 --> 00:14:52.320 But the reality, I think this probably resonates with a lot of people in the Bible belt. 00:14:52.480 --> 00:14:59.039 Um, you're in a church culture, you understand everything about it, and yet it does require personal commitment, right? 00:14:59.120 --> 00:15:00.879 I didn't have that for years, for years. 00:15:01.279 --> 00:15:02.960 So I was rootless essentially. 00:15:03.120 --> 00:15:05.759 Uh got a scholarship to go to Tulane down in New Orleans. 00:15:05.840 --> 00:15:12.559 Well, what happens when you take an 18-year-old, doesn't have real roots in the Lord, and you send him to a city built for sin, right? 00:15:12.639 --> 00:15:15.759 Well, you know, that facade was torn down relatively quickly. 00:15:15.919 --> 00:15:18.080 You know, I I didn't, I wasn't following the Lord. 00:15:18.159 --> 00:15:22.960 I was easily succumbed by the enemy, you know, in that in that season of my life. 00:15:23.120 --> 00:15:27.039 And so um, fast forward to Marine Corps Officer Candid School. 00:15:27.120 --> 00:15:32.879 I was 21 years old, up in Quantico, Virginia, you know, very difficult school, difficult school, by the way. 00:15:33.039 --> 00:15:38.720 And I'm sitting there in chaplain service, and I got my little mini Bible in front of me, and I'm all covered in mud, and we're listening to the chaplain service. 00:15:38.799 --> 00:15:40.399 And I, man,

I start breaking down. 00:15:40.480 --> 00:15:44.000 Like I'm like, like something's hitting me right in that moment that never hit me before. 00:15:44.240 --> 00:15:49.679 I'm looking around with all these other, these real type A guys there, hoping nobody sees me, but I couldn't stop. 00:15:49.840 --> 00:15:54.159 And you know, that should have been kind of the Damascus Road moment, right? 00:15:54.320 --> 00:15:55.039 It wasn't. 00:15:55.519 --> 00:15:56.080 It wasn't. 00:15:56.320 --> 00:15:59.120 For the next 12 years, I played keep away from God. 00:15:59.200 --> 00:16:02.080 Okay, God, you can have this, but I'm keeping the finances here. 00:16:02.159 --> 00:16:05.360 Oh, God, you can you can have this part of my life, but my my sex life is mine. 00:16:05.440 --> 00:16:06.799 Like, so I'm just playing keep away. 00:16:06.960 --> 00:16:08.639 I didn't want to get off the throne. 00:16:08.720 --> 00:16:10.240 And we're gonna talk about it in a minute. 00:16:10.320 --> 00:16:11.600 There's a reason behind that. 00:16:11.919 --> 00:16:13.519 And success was part of that. 00:16:13.759 --> 00:16:32.879 And it and it really becomes becomes quite delusional to somebody when they begin to experience those, those elements of success, which caused me to delay my actual surrender until my early 30s, where finally the Lord brought me to that place, took me to the mat where I couldn't outrun, outgun, or outshoot uh, or out muscle something in my life. 00:16:33.039 --> 00:16:34.879 It was a health condition of a loved one. 00:16:35.120 --> 00:16:38.000 He he brought me lovingly to that place where I just couldn't anything about it. 00:16:38.080 --> 00:16:39.759 And finally I said, Lord, I just give it all to you. 00:16:39.919 --> 00:16:41.519 Yeah, it's that moment of surrender, right? 00:16:41.840 --> 00:16:47.279 I think I tell people uh often, like at Coke, I uh gave my life to Christ when I was in 1980. 00:16:47.360 --> 00:16:51.360 I think I was an eighth grader, but I didn't surrender my career until like 2005. 00:16:51.600 --> 00:16:59.279 And so there are moments in life like that where we surrender those things, maybe sometimes all at once, or it's peeling back the layers of the onion to get to your heart on that. 00:16:59.360 --> 00:17:00.320 And that's what uh the Lord did. 00:17:00.399 --> 00:17:01.519 So that was so it was so good. 00:17:01.600 --> 00:17:02.399 So thanks for that. 00:17:02.480 --> 00:17:04.559 Was not meant on the script, but thank you for the sharing. 00:17:04.799 --> 00:17:06.559 I think I go some great context. 00:17:06.799 --> 00:17:12.880 Um, when did you first notice the gap between what you were achieving and what you actually mattered to you? 00:17:13.119 --> 00:17:13.359 Yeah. 00:17:13.519 --> 00:17:17.519 So it took me a while to really identify kind of what I was chasing. 00:17:17.920 --> 00:17:20.720 So I when I did, I call them shadows, right? 00:17:20.799 --> 00:17:24.240 So, so power, achievement, and applause. 00:17:24.559 --> 00:17:29.200 So I came to realize like those are really the three things that I was kind of always after, right? 00:17:29.359 --> 00:17:43.920 And they're pretty dangerous because all three of those things are very well applauded in the in the world of in the in the world of professional world, whether it be in government or in business or wherever you've been called professionally, like those things are pretty well applauded. 00:17:44.000 --> 00:17:49.839 And so uh power, for example, like I thought if I could just control enough of my environment, then I'd be secure. 00:17:49.920 --> 00:17:50.079 Yeah. 00:17:50.240 --> 00:17:55.599 But the reality is that that power uh does nothing more than turn the volume up on what's already inside of you. 00:17:55.680 --> 00:17:57.440 So if you have pride inside of you, guess what? 00:17:57.599 --> 00:17:59.039 Power is gonna turn the volume up on that. 00:17:59.279 --> 00:18:03.599 If you have loneliness or whatever it may be, it's just gonna make it louder. 00:18:03.680 --> 00:18:03.759 Right. 00:18:04.079 --> 00:18:04.799 So that's power. 00:18:04.880 --> 00:18:05.519 It's rough. 00:18:05.680 --> 00:18:06.559 Uh achievement. 00:18:06.720 --> 00:18:10.400 Now, achievement is tricky because achievement looks like virtue. 00:18:10.559 --> 00:18:11.680 It looks like excellence. 00:18:11.759 --> 00:18:12.319 It looks, right? 00:18:12.880 --> 00:18:16.799 It looks like something that you're like, you're gonna be uh giving the glory to God for. 00:18:16.880 --> 00:18:20.480 But achievement, I think, and you even mentioned it earlier, achievement's a treadmill. 00:18:20.559 --> 00:18:21.039 Yeah, right. 00:18:21.119 --> 00:18:23.920 Like you never like you're always looking for the next thing, right? 00:18:24.000 --> 00:18:25.200 So you just run faster and harder. 00:18:25.359 --> 00:18:28.640 Next thing you know, you're exhausted, or you're exhausting your team, or you're exhausting your family out. 00:18:28.720 --> 00:18:29.839 So achievement was the other thing. 00:18:29.920 --> 00:18:30.160 Yeah. 00:18:30.319 --> 00:18:31.279 And then applause. 00:18:31.440 --> 00:18:32.720 Oh, applause, my goodness. 00:18:32.880 --> 00:18:33.279 Applause. 00:18:33.359 --> 00:18:37.599 We we begin to attach, you know, our our identity to applause and recognition. 00:18:37.839 --> 00:18:39.440 But you know, applause is rented. 00:18:39.759 --> 00:18:49.920 Uh the the same people who are lifting you up today uh can very quickly not only uh tear you down, uh, but but but talk that bad about you like in a heartbeat, right? 00:18:50.160 --> 00:18:51.519 So applause is rented. 00:18:51.599 --> 00:18:57.680 And so when you begin to kind of hang your identity and worth and value in those three things, I was chasing them, right? 00:18:57.920 --> 00:19:00.480 Um, uh I began to see a gap. 00:19:00.559 --> 00:19:00.720 Yeah. 00:19:00.880 --> 00:19:02.240 Now, here's the tricky part. 00:19:02.319 -->

00:19:03.920 Uh the gap I didn't see at work. 00:19:04.160 --> 00:19:05.680 At work, I was killing it. 00:19:05.839 --> 00:19:08.720 Everything I did, everything I touched would turn to gold. 00:19:08.880 --> 00:19:10.160 I saw the gap at home. 00:19:10.480 --> 00:19:10.720 Right. 00:19:10.799 --> 00:19:14.960 And that I think where we as Christian men, we really have to be cognizant of this, right? 00:19:15.119 --> 00:19:20.160 Um, in fact, I've ministered to a lot of brothers on this exact same thing because of my experience in it. 00:19:20.319 --> 00:19:21.759 The gap I felt was at home. 00:19:22.000 --> 00:19:26.160 So my marriage, which uh should have been flourishing, and my wife should have been flourishing. 00:19:26.240 --> 00:19:29.759 Uh, we'd been together, you know, a number of years at that point, but there wasn't. 00:19:29.839 --> 00:19:31.920 There, there was something missing there. 00:19:32.079 --> 00:19:34.480 Same thing with kind of with how I was fathering my children. 00:19:34.880 --> 00:19:35.680 There was something missing. 00:19:35.759 --> 00:19:46.000 And I came to realize it was because um, you know, my values, which I could recite, there was the difference between what I said and what my calendar actually looked like, right? 00:19:46.160 --> 00:19:46.240 Yeah. 00:19:46.400 --> 00:19:47.920 Like how I was walking that out. 00:19:48.079 --> 00:19:50.720 And my family, my wife, my marriage, right? 00:19:50.960 --> 00:19:54.880 They were the real kind of mirrors in this where I began to see that gap. 00:19:55.039 --> 00:20:00.559 And so um, once I, once I just said, Lord, I I'm handing this all over to you, I'm getting off this throne. 00:20:00.640 --> 00:20:11.680 I I do not want um what I consider to be of greater and higher priority, which is my covenant marriage at my home, my family, uh, to take a hit on something. 00:20:11.759 --> 00:20:22.000 So when I when I turn my life over to the Lord, he began to uh really open my eyes to the reality of his concentric love for me, beginning in my own heart and working out to my covenant marriage. 00:20:22.079 --> 00:20:24.720 Yeah, and then work, then my children, and then those immediately around me. 00:20:24.799 --> 00:20:26.799 And then afterwards, professionally, right? 00:20:26.880 --> 00:20:28.079 Yeah, I had it backwards. 00:20:28.160 --> 00:20:33.039 Like I was looking over the horizon, skipping over these concentric, valuable circles of my life. 00:20:33.359 --> 00:20:38.640 And so when he identified that for me, uh it was it it it it rapidly changed everything. 00:20:38.799 --> 00:20:41.759 I began to take my my marriage very seriously. 00:20:42.000 --> 00:20:45.119 You see, I was I was fluent in sarcasm, right? 00:20:45.359 --> 00:20:47.119 Quick to judge, slow to love. 00:20:47.200 --> 00:20:48.079 Yeah, you know what I'm saying? 00:20:48.400 --> 00:20:51.519 Um I wasn't creating an environment where she was flourishing. 00:20:51.759 --> 00:20:56.400 Like when a man

walks out his role effectively, the wife flourishes. 00:20:56.480 --> 00:20:56.880 Oh, yeah. 00:20:57.039 --> 00:20:59.200 When we fail at that, she has a hard time. 00:20:59.279 --> 00:20:59.759 Yeah, right. 00:20:59.839 --> 00:21:01.200 And it's not and it's not always on her. 00:21:01.759 --> 00:21:03.119 In fact, a lot of times it's on us. 00:21:03.200 --> 00:21:05.200 And so I began to take that very seriously. 00:21:05.359 --> 00:21:08.480 And she began to flourish, and we began to flourish as a marriage, right? 00:21:08.720 --> 00:21:12.640 Do you remember a uh tipping point though, Chris, and all that with you and your wife? 00:21:12.799 --> 00:21:17.440 Where is there a specific time that you remember and said, No, we gotta change a season. 00:21:17.839 --> 00:21:23.119 It was slow, it was just a season where you're you're you're constantly feeling like, man, something is not right here. 00:21:23.359 --> 00:21:23.440 Right. 00:21:23.599 --> 00:21:28.400 Like there wasn't that like that moment that you're talking now, but but there was a season where I'm like, this is not right. 00:21:28.480 --> 00:21:28.640 Yeah. 00:21:28.720 --> 00:21:28.799 Okay. 00:21:29.039 --> 00:21:30.240 And I don't want this to continue. 00:21:30.319 --> 00:21:30.559 Yeah. 00:21:30.640 --> 00:21:30.799 Yeah. 00:21:31.039 --> 00:21:34.960 But I love the way you frame that up with the uh the power, the achievements, and then the applause. 00:21:35.039 --> 00:21:35.200 Yeah. 00:21:35.359 --> 00:21:36.000 It's kind of funny. 00:21:36.079 --> 00:21:37.759 Even a small thing for me back at Coke. 00:21:37.839 --> 00:21:39.119 I used to go do these sales rallies. 00:21:39.200 --> 00:21:42.319 We'd get in front of all these balling folks, great people, blue collar workers. 00:21:42.400 --> 00:21:45.599 They made things happen in the field, and I go to do these fun presentations. 00:21:45.759 --> 00:21:49.039 And I always hope that somebody come up and pat me on the back and say, Nice job. 00:21:49.359 --> 00:21:50.960 And if they did, that was great. 00:21:51.119 --> 00:21:53.119 And if they didn't, man, that would ruin my day. 00:21:53.519 --> 00:21:53.759 Right. 00:21:53.920 --> 00:21:59.359 So you're saying the applause is borrowed, uh, that recognition is borrowed, the feeling you're looking for on that. 00:21:59.519 --> 00:22:01.759 I always Always uh really wanted that. 00:22:01.839 --> 00:22:04.640 And when I didn't get it, uh just bummed me out the rest of the day. 00:22:04.720 --> 00:22:06.240 Yeah, but uh that's the way that is. 00:22:06.319 --> 00:22:07.920 So I certainly understand all of that. 00:22:08.160 --> 00:22:10.319 Um how do you find meaning? 00:22:10.480 --> 00:22:14.640 So we talk a little bit about this in the opening about meaning because it's so important in our lives, right? 00:22:14.720 --> 00:22:15.920 Um, and everything around that. 00:22:16.000 --> 00:22:19.119 But how do you find meaning in the middle of your career, not just the end of it?

00:22:19.200 --> 00:22:22.240 So I mentioned in my story a little bit about kind of the end. 00:22:22.319 --> 00:22:28.559 Uh, I did find meaning dearing, uh, but there's probably people that are listening to us today that are wondering, what is all this worth? 00:22:28.799 --> 00:22:30.000 Why am I doing all this? 00:22:30.079 --> 00:22:31.519 What uh what makes this worthwhile? 00:22:31.680 --> 00:22:32.799 What would you say to that person? 00:22:33.039 --> 00:22:37.359 Yeah, so this is gonna sound weird, but you got to meet this guy. 00:22:37.599 --> 00:22:39.279 And here's who this guy is. 00:22:39.839 --> 00:22:42.400 This guy is he's got it all together. 00:22:42.559 --> 00:22:44.160 Like he's really good at his job. 00:22:44.400 --> 00:22:47.519 Um, he's the guy that people go to uh for answers. 00:22:47.599 --> 00:22:52.160 He's the guy that calms the room, like he's the guy that makes things happen, right? 00:22:52.319 --> 00:22:58.640 And um he's also the guy um who hasn't told the truth about himself uh in 20 years. 00:22:59.519 --> 00:23:05.440 He has one story for his wife at home, one story for his his friends he's had for 22 years, one story uh for work. 00:23:05.599 --> 00:23:07.759 You ask him how he's doing, he's good, he's good. 00:23:08.240 --> 00:23:09.440 The reality is he's not good. 00:23:09.519 --> 00:23:12.880 Yeah, the reality is he's tired and he's got no one. 00:23:13.119 --> 00:23:16.000 And he and he's it's internalizing all of this stuff. 00:23:16.240 --> 00:23:17.839 And you know, I kept meeting this guy. 00:23:18.079 --> 00:23:23.839 I met the guy in the Miami field office, I met the guy down in Columbia, I met the guy on protected beat tails in the jungles of Cambodia. 00:23:24.000 --> 00:23:25.920 I kept meeting this guy, right? 00:23:26.079 --> 00:23:31.759 I kept running into him, and it wasn't until the Lord opened my eyes uh say, look, that's you. 00:23:32.000 --> 00:23:32.960 Like it was me. 00:23:33.200 --> 00:23:36.480 Like I was that guy, I was the guy that had it all together. 00:23:36.720 --> 00:23:44.559 Um, but it was really lonely, shallow, yeah, no joy in my life, like no true joy in my life, right? 00:23:45.119 --> 00:23:52.640 And so um I would tell, you know, anybody listening that that's walking through life, like, you gotta meet that guy, and it's you. 00:23:52.960 --> 00:23:58.160 You you gotta you gotta begin to ask the question, um, you know, what is it about your life? 00:23:58.480 --> 00:24:04.640 Are you like a stone skipping on the stop of water, jumping from temporary satisfaction to temporary satisfaction? 00:24:04.799 --> 00:24:09.119 And then wondering why nothing feels deep, nothing feels like like it's lasting. 00:24:09.200 --> 00:24:11.200 Yeah, like ask yourself those those questions. 00:24:11.279 --> 00:24:13.599 Like you have to meet that guy. 00:24:13.839 --> 00:24:15.519 And you gotta look in the mirror, right? 00:24:15.599 --> 00:24:17.839 And ask those things because that was me. 00:24:18.000 --> 00:24:25.680 Literally just jumping from temporary satisfaction to the next, hoping, praying, expecting that the next thing would bring me fulfillment, right? 00:24:25.839 --> 00:24:26.240 Never did. 00:24:26.400 --> 00:24:26.799 Never did. 00:24:26.960 --> 00:24:27.119 Right. 00:24:27.200 --> 00:24:29.119 So I would tell them, look, meet the guy. 00:24:29.200 --> 00:24:32.880 And then once you have that heart to heart with who you are, right? 00:24:33.039 --> 00:24:34.799 Who's calling the shots in your life? 00:24:35.039 --> 00:24:37.279 Have the things you've been doing brought you fulfillment? 00:24:37.359 --> 00:24:40.960 It's kind of like you keep touching the stove over and over again, hoping it's not gonna burn you. 00:24:41.200 --> 00:24:50.160 Ask yourself the question if you're not if you're not experiencing fulfillment, yeah, right, are you gonna continue to do the exact same things over and over and over again for the next 25 years? 00:24:50.240 --> 00:24:55.119 Or are you gonna have a real discussion with yourself and with the Lord about where this needs to go? 00:24:55.599 --> 00:24:56.960 So for me, that was the that was the case, right? 00:24:57.039 --> 00:25:03.039 So I met the guy, yeah, I looked in the mirror, and the Lord said, Okay, now I'm not pulling you out, right? 00:25:03.200 --> 00:25:06.720 Some people think, and I've ministered a lot of guys in this and it drives me crazy. 00:25:07.119 --> 00:25:10.160 They come to faith and they're like, Okay, I want to go do something for the Lord now. 00:25:10.240 --> 00:25:13.440 Yeah, I want to go, I want to go drop all this and go do something holy. 00:25:13.519 --> 00:25:13.839 Yeah, right. 00:25:14.000 --> 00:25:23.839 I'm like, brother, like the Lord didn't give you the opportunities, the experiences, your network, everything that you currently have, so you can drop it and go serving now, right? 00:25:24.160 --> 00:25:24.720 He didn't do that. 00:25:24.880 --> 00:25:25.279 That's right. 00:25:25.599 --> 00:25:28.319 Lord sent me right back into the secret service, right? 00:25:28.400 --> 00:25:32.079 Yeah, same, same office, same teams, different king. 00:25:32.240 --> 00:25:32.559 That's right. 00:25:32.720 --> 00:25:32.960 Right. 00:25:33.440 --> 00:25:35.039 And so that began to change everything. 00:25:35.119 --> 00:25:35.359 Yeah. 00:25:35.519 --> 00:25:39.519 I began to see people differently, like they weren't either in my way or useful anymore. 00:25:39.680 --> 00:25:46.720 Like there were image bearers of God who I've been placed there to connect with, to love on, to encourage, to strengthen, to point to him. 00:25:46.880 --> 00:25:46.960 Yeah. 00:25:47.039 --> 00:25:47.200 Right. 00:25:47.279 --> 00:25:48.400 So it began to change everything. 00:25:48.480 --> 00:25:49.759 And that was right in the middle. 00:25:49.920 --> 00:25:51.119 And God does that a lot. 00:25:51.359 --> 00:25:55.279 Like when he begins to re-he just he just

begins to reframe the victories, right? 00:25:55.519 --> 00:25:57.519 He begins to change the scoreboard for you. 00:25:57.599 --> 00:25:59.440 He doesn't always just yank you out of there. 00:25:59.759 --> 00:26:03.680 He says, now now go back in and serve me with everything I'd already given you. 00:26:03.759 --> 00:26:03.920 Yeah. 00:26:04.000 --> 00:26:04.079 Right. 00:26:04.240 --> 00:26:04.799 And so that was me. 00:26:05.039 --> 00:26:05.680 Oh, that's awesome. 00:26:05.759 --> 00:26:08.960 What a what a story and what a what a uh I think an impact. 00:26:09.119 --> 00:26:14.160 And identifying that man and then looking in the mirror to say, hey, uh, actually, you know, that's me. 00:26:14.319 --> 00:26:14.640 Yeah. 00:26:14.799 --> 00:26:20.319 Uh I think that's often the uh self-reflection that most people don't want to have or do. 00:26:20.640 --> 00:26:29.279 Uh, but often you come to a place in your life where you need to realize, uh, and you'll have an illumination, I guess, that uh and a uh insight that something's not right. 00:26:29.519 --> 00:26:30.960 And you're not the answer to that. 00:26:31.039 --> 00:26:32.319 And that uh Jesus is. 00:26:32.480 --> 00:26:33.599 So uh thank you for that. 00:26:33.680 --> 00:26:36.960 And I love the other thing you said, uh, because we talk on the show about Imago Day. 00:26:37.200 --> 00:26:41.279 So seeing people as bear images, uh bearing the image of God. 00:26:41.440 --> 00:26:47.839 And uh, if you can shift the way that you view people and see people, uh it changes everything about the way you interact with them. 00:26:48.160 --> 00:26:50.160 It's not transactional, it becomes relational. 00:26:50.240 --> 00:26:52.160 You care about them, you want them to do well. 00:26:52.319 --> 00:26:55.200 It's not about how well you do, but you want them to do better. 00:26:55.279 --> 00:26:59.200 So that's uh what a what a shift and a change and a reframing that you do. 00:26:59.680 --> 00:27:08.400 Um what would you tell a leader in their 30s or 40s who's doing well by every measure, but can't shake the feeling that something's missing? 00:27:08.640 --> 00:27:09.039 Yeah. 00:27:09.200 --> 00:27:14.400 And you know, if they're listening to this, they they probably maybe they walk with the Lord right now, right? 00:27:14.640 --> 00:27:21.359 And and they're close to the Lord and they think they're okay, but they need they need to have that conversation again with themselves. 00:27:21.440 --> 00:27:24.000 They need to ask themselves, who's calling the shots in my life? 00:27:24.240 --> 00:27:24.559 Right. 00:27:24.720 --> 00:27:30.079 So if you're experiencing kind of a shallowness and you're like, man, this there's got to be more to this, ask yourself a simple question. 00:27:30.240 --> 00:27:31.599 Who's calling the shots in this? 00:27:31.759 --> 00:27:32.000 Right? 00:27:32.160 --> 00:27:33.839 Is it all thumbs and no fingers? 00:27:33.920 --> 00:27:34.079 Right? 00:27:34.160 --> 00:27:36.480 Because if it's all thumbs, right, then we got a problem. 00:27:36.559 --> 00:27:37.119 Yeah, right. 00:27:37.279 --> 00:27:41.920 But but if you're going to God, not not with the large stuff, but the little things, right? 00:27:42.079 --> 00:27:47.920 With your daily, with your daily agenda, with your weekly agenda, with with what God has called you to, are you doing that? 00:27:48.000 --> 00:27:48.799 Are you allowing him? 00:27:49.039 --> 00:27:54.079 So when there's a whether a conflict or a major decision point, like who wins on that? 00:27:54.240 --> 00:28:02.400 Like your personal preference, like your comfort zone, or does the word of God, does his small voice, does godly counsel, who's winning in that, right? 00:28:02.480 --> 00:28:11.920 So I would tell these brothers, like if you're in the middle of this, right, and you still feel like, man, things are shallow, and I don't feel like I'm getting traction here in my faith walk in this professional realm. 00:28:12.079 --> 00:28:14.079 Ask yourself a question, who's calling the shots? 00:28:14.240 --> 00:28:14.400 Right. 00:28:14.559 --> 00:28:14.720 Right? 00:28:14.880 --> 00:28:18.480 Because inevitably, when I when I answered that question, it was always me. 00:28:18.720 --> 00:28:21.920 Guess what, guess where my shots, guess where my decisions led me? 00:28:22.079 --> 00:28:25.039 Almost always, just even if just one degree off track. 00:28:25.119 --> 00:28:25.599 Yeah, right. 00:28:25.680 --> 00:28:28.880 And next thing I know, I'm I'm away from where God would have me exactly. 00:28:29.039 --> 00:28:29.200 Yeah. 00:28:29.519 --> 00:28:30.400 You have to ask that. 00:28:30.640 --> 00:28:32.480 So play with me on this for a minute. 00:28:32.640 --> 00:28:36.400 Uh, you get to a spot where you say, okay, I'm in this position I'm in. 00:28:36.559 --> 00:28:37.519 I know it's not good. 00:28:37.599 --> 00:28:38.720 I know I'm not the answer. 00:28:38.799 --> 00:28:40.079 It's not inside of me. 00:28:40.240 --> 00:28:41.759 What does that person then do? 00:28:42.240 --> 00:28:43.119 Tell me a little bit about it. 00:28:43.200 --> 00:28:49.519 And I'm not looking for a checklist that they need to go through, but yeah, if they get to that point in their life, uh, what would you recommend that they do? 00:28:49.599 --> 00:28:50.559 What advice would you give them? 00:28:50.720 --> 00:28:50.960 Yeah. 00:28:51.039 --> 00:28:53.839 So you gotta get connected to Christian community. 00:28:54.000 --> 00:28:56.400 You got to get connected uh to a congregation. 00:28:56.559 --> 00:29:01.599 Like, look, I don't care what church you go to, but you need to be in a Bible-believing, Bible-teaching church. 00:29:01.759 --> 00:29:03.599 You need to be in Christian community with others. 00:29:03.680 --> 00:29:06.559 And this this kind of parlays into the next point. 00:29:06.720 --> 00:29:08.240 You have to have your people. 00:29:08.480 --> 00:29:12.240 Like, like I always would ask some, like I ask

young people, like, hey, where's your people? 00:29:12.319 --> 00:29:13.039 Like, what do you mean? 00:29:13.200 --> 00:29:17.839 Like, where's the brother that, like when you're like, here's the roller coaster ride of life, right? 00:29:18.000 --> 00:29:22.319 Like when you're in the dip, where's your brother who's not there with you, who can look in and help you out? 00:29:22.400 --> 00:29:22.559 Yeah. 00:29:22.640 --> 00:29:29.200 Like, where's your brother who's not in your success bubble, who who can, who can help you calibrate your targets effectively, right? 00:29:29.359 --> 00:29:30.319 Like, where are your people? 00:29:30.559 --> 00:29:32.640 Like I always ask people, because think about this. 00:29:32.799 --> 00:29:43.519 How many companies have we known that have hired amazingly charismatic, amazingly gifted people whose character did not at least reach or surpass their giftedness? 00:29:43.599 --> 00:29:43.680 Yeah. 00:29:43.839 --> 00:29:44.640 And what did they do? 00:29:44.799 --> 00:29:46.319 They took that organization off a cliff. 00:29:46.400 --> 00:29:46.720 Oh, yeah. 00:29:46.880 --> 00:29:47.839 That's what happens. 00:29:47.920 --> 00:29:52.799 Uh, but but if you have people who are always you and you've given them access to you, right? 00:29:52.960 --> 00:30:00.079 Like they they love you enough and you love them enough to give them access to your life to say, hey, brother, I'm seeing something in you that's a little off right now. 00:30:00.160 --> 00:30:00.880 Let's talk about it. 00:30:01.039 --> 00:30:03.200 Like I would ask him, do you have your people? 00:30:03.359 --> 00:30:03.920 You have to. 00:30:04.000 --> 00:30:14.960 If you if you don't, you're missing on a vital, like one of the major legs that God gives us in our walk with him, his word, time with him personally in prayer and small in a small voice, and then Christian community. 00:30:15.039 --> 00:30:20.720 Like those are the three pillars he gives us to not only just survive, but to thrive in our walk with him. 00:30:20.880 --> 00:30:21.039 Yeah. 00:30:21.119 --> 00:30:21.279 Yeah. 00:30:21.440 --> 00:30:22.000 Yeah, so good. 00:30:22.079 --> 00:30:28.079 I, you know, Chris, I talk a lot about some of the Barness statistics about uh the number of Christians that are actually not discipled. 00:30:28.240 --> 00:30:41.200 And what I mean by that is somebody that knows how to read and study the Bible, somebody knows how to pray, somebody that uh can witness or share their faith, give their testimony about what the Lord has done in their life, or being connected to a church and the importance that you just mentioned in that whole thing on that. 00:30:41.359 --> 00:30:44.000 And about 80% of Christians out there don't know how to do that. 00:30:44.079 --> 00:30:54.160 And then couple that with the fact, okay, so you've got this leader who hasn't had his character formed, shaped, developed by the Lord, and is getting in top of the organization, drives them off that cliff. 00:30:54.240 --> 00:30:54.640 That's right. 00:30:54.720 --> 00:30:57.920 Uh, and there's Christian leaders out there that are doing that, to be quite frank with you. 00:30:58.079 --> 00:30:58.400 It's true. 00:30:58.559 --> 00:31:03.440 So the question is, how do we figure that out and help them get into a position where they're walking with the Lord? 00:31:03.519 --> 00:31:06.720 And then he can work in them and through them uh in those environments. 00:31:06.799 --> 00:31:07.839 And that's where they'll make the change. 00:31:07.920 --> 00:31:08.960 It sounds like that happened to you too. 00:31:09.200 --> 00:31:10.559 Well, it's absolutely true. 00:31:10.640 --> 00:31:15.599 And and there's a there's a sobering reality behind that statistic you gave, Preston. 00:31:16.160 --> 00:31:19.200 So when we first come to faith, like we receive, receive, receive, right? 00:31:19.359 --> 00:31:20.319 We're in receipt mode. 00:31:20.400 --> 00:31:23.599 And then we we come to that point, which is kind of a spiritual plateau. 00:31:23.759 --> 00:31:26.319 And until you begin to pour into others, you're gonna stay there. 00:31:26.400 --> 00:31:30.880 Like I know Christians, prominent Christians who've been on that spiritual plateau for 30 years. 00:31:30.960 --> 00:31:31.119 Yeah. 00:31:31.279 --> 00:31:31.440 Why? 00:31:31.599 --> 00:31:33.119 Because they've never entered a discipleship. 00:31:33.200 --> 00:31:33.440 What? 00:31:33.519 --> 00:31:37.680 They've never actually began to pour into somebody else to continue their own upward trajectory with the Lord. 00:31:37.759 --> 00:31:38.240 Yeah, right. 00:31:38.400 --> 00:31:43.759 Like I always tell people, like you're not an actual leader for Christ if you're not pouring into others. 00:31:43.839 --> 00:31:48.319 Like if you're just in receipt mode for your 50 years, your walk with him, then you're a baby. 00:31:48.400 --> 00:31:48.559 Yeah. 00:31:48.640 --> 00:31:57.599 And I'm sorry, I don't mean that in a in a you know, in a way that's that's that that's really irreverent to people, but but God calls you to be an adult and begin to feed others. 00:31:57.680 --> 00:31:57.920 Yeah. 00:31:58.000 --> 00:31:58.079 Right. 00:31:58.240 --> 00:32:03.279 And so we have unfortunately too many people living on that plateau when they could be doing so much for the Lord. 00:32:03.359 --> 00:32:03.440 Yeah. 00:32:03.599 --> 00:32:04.000 Oh, yeah. 00:32:04.079 --> 00:32:04.400 Absolutely. 00:32:04.480 --> 00:32:13.759 I I learned a long time ago, I think it was either uh a couple of my pastors in uh first Christian church in Fort Collins, Colorado, when I was growing up, uh, Jeff Crabtree or Johnny Square mentioned this. 00:32:13.839 --> 00:32:16.960 They talked about how you could get a sponge and you pour all the water into it. 00:32:17.039 --> 00:32:18.960 And if it sits in there forever, it sours. 00:32:19.200 --> 00:32:22.400 And you have to wring it out in order for that sponge to be fresh.

00:32:22.480 --> 00:32:27.039 And when they say ringing out, I meant your your faith, share it with other people, live it out, and that kind of stuff. 00:32:27.119 --> 00:32:29.200 And it just sticks inside of you to that point. 00:32:29.279 --> 00:32:32.160 You'll be plateaued, like you just mentioned, for those uh those years. 00:32:32.240 --> 00:32:34.000 So similar thought process and all that. 00:32:34.160 --> 00:32:34.559 Yeah, yeah. 00:32:34.720 --> 00:32:36.079 Chris, this has been awesome to have you. 00:32:36.160 --> 00:32:38.799 Is there anything else on your mind today as you came in here today? 00:32:38.880 --> 00:32:42.319 I know you're here for another event, and uh this worked out so well for you to actually be live. 00:32:42.480 --> 00:32:44.000 This is so special for me. 00:32:44.160 --> 00:32:47.680 Uh, is there anything else that's on your mind that you want to share as we close out today? 00:32:47.920 --> 00:32:48.160 Yeah. 00:32:48.240 --> 00:32:49.359 So thanks for asking that. 00:32:49.519 --> 00:32:55.839 And so I minister to a lot of people around the world, and uh the vast majority are business and professional leaders, right? 00:32:56.000 --> 00:33:01.359 And so one thing that I always love to share uh with them is to make yourself known. 00:33:01.680 --> 00:33:03.119 Like we got to disarm the enemy. 00:33:03.200 --> 00:33:04.559 And here's what I mean by that. 00:33:04.799 --> 00:33:13.599 If you're 95% known, you're an unknown person because the enemy will leverage that 5% hidden against you your whole life. 00:33:14.240 --> 00:33:15.440 He will leverage that against you. 00:33:15.599 --> 00:33:17.599 Yeah, he will, he will, that counterfeit small voice. 00:33:17.680 --> 00:33:18.720 Hey, what if they find out? 00:33:18.799 --> 00:33:20.240 What if they only knew, right? 00:33:20.400 --> 00:33:33.039 And he will leverage that against you, and you will be not nearly as impactful for God as you could be if you just walked in the light, got a confident group of brothers or sisters who you love and you can confess these things to. 00:33:33.440 --> 00:33:34.559 Disarm the enemy. 00:33:34.640 --> 00:33:36.079 Yeah, make yourself known. 00:33:36.240 --> 00:33:37.519 I I know it's embarrassing. 00:33:37.599 --> 00:33:40.799 I know, I know some people think that, well, what are they gonna think about me? 00:33:40.960 --> 00:33:46.319 Look, you're gonna make yourself a powerful man or woman of God if you become known and you take all the weapons out of the enemy's hands. 00:33:46.400 --> 00:33:47.279 What's he gonna say? 00:33:47.440 --> 00:33:48.240 They already know. 00:33:48.319 --> 00:33:48.799 Yeah, right. 00:33:49.039 --> 00:33:49.680 Yeah, so good. 00:33:49.759 --> 00:33:52.160 I I remember just as I close out, it brings back this. 00:33:52.240 --> 00:33:57.039 Uh, I was at a Christmas party talking to a guy about an accountability group that I was part of. 00:33:57.119 --> 00:34:00.160 And I'm not talking about somebody to ask me a bunch of questions and hammer me over the head and all that. 00:34:00.480 --> 00:34:04.559 But it was a place of being being transparent, uh, honest with each other, those types of things. 00:34:04.640 --> 00:34:06.640 And the guy looked at me and goes, why would you want to do that? 00:34:06.960 --> 00:34:15.119 Well, you just described exactly why, uh, is because that if we have that 5% that's uh in there that's not fully known, that will hold us back. 00:34:15.599 --> 00:34:26.400 And uh so if we have the opportunity to be around a sharp group of people that have our best interest or connected to the Lord, uh the Lord will use that uh to form you and shape you and use you uh in the marketplace. 00:34:27.039 --> 00:34:27.519 That's really good. 00:34:27.679 --> 00:34:28.559 Chris has been awesome. 00:34:28.639 --> 00:34:29.840 Thanks for being here on PCU. 00:34:30.000 --> 00:34:30.400 Good to have you. 00:34:30.559 --> 00:34:31.519 Oh, my pleasure, brother. 00:34:31.599 --> 00:34:32.400 Thanks you. 00:34:32.719 --> 00:34:33.760 Chris, thank you. 00:34:33.920 --> 00:34:36.639 Here's what keeps coming back to me as I listen to you. 00:34:36.880 --> 00:34:40.159 There's a man in scripture who had the ultimate resume. 00:34:40.480 --> 00:34:45.119 And what he did with it when he met Christ changes everything about this conversation. 00:34:45.280 --> 00:34:52.480 Paul had the ultimate resume, and I'm not talking about the ministry resume, I'm talking about the one he built before Damascus. 00:34:52.880 --> 00:35:14.320 He listed in himself a legitimate birth, circumcised on the eighth day, an Israelite from the elite tribe of Benjamin, a strict and devout adherent to God's law, a fiery defender of the purity of his religion, even to the point of persecuting the church, a meticulous observer of everything set down in God's law book. 00:35:14.639 --> 00:35:22.880 In today's terms, Ivy League pedigree, fast track career, board-level connections, the kind of resume that opens every door in the building. 00:35:23.440 --> 00:35:29.360 Paul didn't just achieve, he dominated by every external measure, he was doing well. 00:35:29.760 --> 00:35:37.599 And then he met Christ on the road to Damascus, and everything he'd spent his life accumulating, he re-categorized. 00:35:38.000 --> 00:35:50.800 Philippians 3, 7 through 9 in the message says this the very credentials these people are waving around is something special I'm tearing up and I'm throwing out with the trash, along with everything else I used to take credit for. 00:35:51.119 --> 00:35:51.760 And why? 00:35:52.239 --> 00:35:53.360 Because of Christ. 00:35:53.599 --> 00:36:03.119 Yes, all the things I once thought were so important are gone from my life compared to the high privilege of knowing Jesus Christ as my master firsthand. 00:36:03.519 --> 00:36:08.639 Everything I once thought I had going for me is insignificant, dog dung. 00:36:09.039 --> 00:36:13.599 I've dumped it all

in the trash so that I can embrace Christ and be embraced by him. 00:36:14.559 --> 00:36:15.360 Dog dung. 00:36:15.760 --> 00:36:17.519 That's what Paul called his resume. 00:36:17.760 --> 00:36:20.880 Not because his achievements were fake, they were real. 00:36:21.199 --> 00:36:26.800 But compared to knowing Christ, they were insignificant, trash, not worth holding. 00:36:27.360 --> 00:36:30.719 That's the tension of this episode in one confession. 00:36:31.039 --> 00:36:34.079 You can achieve everything and still be holding the wrong thing. 00:36:34.480 --> 00:36:37.679 Paul didn't lack accomplishments, he lacked the right anchor. 00:36:37.840 --> 00:36:40.960 And when he found it, the achievements didn't disappear. 00:36:41.199 --> 00:36:43.760 They just stopped mattering the way that they used to. 00:36:44.480 --> 00:36:46.639 And here's what makes Paul's story relevant. 00:36:46.800 --> 00:36:52.719 If you're in the middle of your career, not at the end of it, Paul didn't wait until retirement to recategorize. 00:36:52.960 --> 00:36:57.920 He did it mid-stride, still planning churches, still writing letters, still building. 00:36:58.079 --> 00:37:00.400 But now he was building on a different foundation. 00:37:00.639 --> 00:37:04.800 The achievements kept coming, they just stopped being the point. 00:37:05.199 --> 00:37:07.360 I was Paul in a Coca-Cola polo. 00:37:07.599 --> 00:37:10.079 I had 21 and a half years of credentials. 00:37:10.239 --> 00:37:14.000 And when the credentials were gone, I had to ask the same question Paul did. 00:37:14.400 --> 00:37:17.679 If I'm not defined by what I've achieved, then who am I? 00:37:18.159 --> 00:37:18.960 Paul's answer? 00:37:19.440 --> 00:37:20.159 I'm his. 00:37:20.320 --> 00:37:21.280 And that's enough. 00:37:21.679 --> 00:37:23.360 And that's what I heard in the garden. 00:37:24.000 --> 00:37:24.800 Follow me. 00:37:25.119 --> 00:37:28.559 Not list your accomplishments, not show me your development plan. 00:37:29.199 --> 00:37:30.000 Follow me. 00:37:30.480 --> 00:37:33.519 Two words that made every line on my resume irrelevant. 00:37:33.679 --> 00:37:37.199 And for the first time, that felt like freedom, not loss. 00:37:37.679 --> 00:37:39.119 So what do you do with all this? 00:37:39.519 --> 00:37:40.480 Three things. 00:37:40.719 --> 00:37:45.039 I wish someone had said them to me in the middle of my career, not after it ended. 00:37:45.519 --> 00:37:49.360 Number one, the empty win is a signal, not a failure. 00:37:49.760 --> 00:37:53.119 When you hit the target and feel nothing, that's not ingratitude. 00:37:53.360 --> 00:37:54.320 That's information. 00:37:54.719 --> 00:37:58.480 It's telling you that what you're chasing isn't what you're missing. 00:37:58.960 --> 00:38:00.079 Pay attention to it. 00:38:00.320 --> 00:38:02.480 I ignored that signal for years. 00:38:02.800 --> 00:38:06.719 Figured I just needed a bigger target, a harder goal, a higher title. 00:38:07.039 --> 00:38:10.079 I

was prescribing more of the disease as the cure. 00:38:10.480 --> 00:38:13.599 If the win feels empty, the problem isn't the win. 00:38:13.760 --> 00:38:15.840 It's what you thought the win would give you. 00:38:16.079 --> 00:38:20.880 Number two, your identity is not your role, and you don't have to lose the role to learn that. 00:38:21.119 --> 00:38:25.119 This one took me until retirement to figure out, and I wish it hadn't. 00:38:25.360 --> 00:38:26.639 I knew it intellectually. 00:38:26.800 --> 00:38:28.320 I even said it on stage. 00:38:28.480 --> 00:38:30.880 My career does not define who I am. 00:38:31.119 --> 00:38:36.239 But when the career ended, my identity went looking for its context and couldn't find it. 00:38:36.480 --> 00:38:41.039 You can learn this lesson now in the middle of your career before the structure disappears. 00:38:41.280 --> 00:38:44.880 Ask yourself, if you lost the title tomorrow, who would you be? 00:38:45.119 --> 00:38:50.079 If the answer is, I don't know, you've been building on scaffolding, not foundation. 00:38:50.320 --> 00:38:52.639 Build on something that doesn't retire. 00:38:52.880 --> 00:38:56.559 And number three, meaning is found, not manufactured. 00:38:56.800 --> 00:39:00.639 I didn't find meaning by writing a new mission statement or launching a new initiative. 00:39:00.880 --> 00:39:04.159 I found it sitting in a garden, asking God where he was. 00:39:04.480 --> 00:39:07.119 The answer wasn't a plan, it was a person. 00:39:07.679 --> 00:39:08.639 Follow me. 00:39:08.960 --> 00:39:09.440 That's it. 00:39:09.679 --> 00:39:14.079 No strategic framework, no five-year vision, just a directive to trust. 00:39:14.400 --> 00:39:21.920 And you can hear that same voice right now in the car, at the desk, in the meeting where you're wondering why none of this feels like enough. 00:39:22.320 --> 00:39:32.880 The moment you stop trying to construct meaning from your achievements and start receiving it from the one who made you, the emptiness fills not with accomplishments, with presence. 00:39:33.679 --> 00:39:37.039 Achievement builds the resume, meaning fills the soul. 00:39:37.360 --> 00:39:42.320 And you don't have to wait until the resume is finished to start asking which one you've been building. 00:39:42.559 --> 00:39:46.400 If the wind feels empty, maybe you're hearing the same thing that I heard. 00:39:46.800 --> 00:39:49.920 Not a strategy, not a plan, but two words. 00:39:50.159 --> 00:39:51.039 Follow me. 00:39:51.440 --> 00:39:53.039 And they changed everything. 00:39:53.360 --> 00:39:56.239 And they don't require retirement to hear. 00:39:56.639 --> 00:40:01.679 We just talked about what happens when achievement runs out of road and meaning has to take over. 00:40:02.079 --> 00:40:03.519 But there's one more question. 00:40:03.920 --> 00:40:08.559 The one underneath all of it is not what you're building or why does it matter. 00:40:08.719 --> 00:40:11.679 It's who are you becoming while you're building it. 00:40:12.000 --> 00:40:15.280 Episode 20, outcome versus identity. 00:40:15.440 --> 00:40:20.239 The final episode of the season, the question that you've been circling since episode one. 00:40:20.639 --> 00:40:21.599 See you there. 00:40:21.920 --> 00:40:23.039 Well, that's a wrap. 00:40:23.199 --> 00:40:28.320 Thanks for spending part of your day with me, and I know your time is valuable and your to-do list is long. 00:40:28.480 --> 00:40:31.280 If this was helpful, share it with someone else who needs it. 00:40:31.440 --> 00:40:33.280 Like it, comment, leave a review. 00:40:33.440 --> 00:40:38.880 It helps more people find the show, and quite honestly, it makes me feel like I'm not just talking to myself in here. 00:40:39.280 --> 00:40:52.239 And if today's tension, hit home, maybe a little too close to home, and if you're tired of being one person on Sunday and someone else on Monday, check out the Disciple Leader Apprenticeship at Preston Poor.com. 00:40:52.480 --> 00:41:00.159 Ten weeks, one hour a week, one conversation a time, no slides, no lectures, just real talk. 00:41:00.400 --> 00:41:03.119 And find me on LinkedIn, Facebook, or Instagram. 00:41:03.360 --> 00:41:04.880 Peace out, be Rockstar.