התמלול המלא של Stella Nickells: Excedrin, Cyanide, and Murder

but see, I love hand chains and I've bought so many over the years and they snap instantly. 00:04:13.280 --> 00:04:18.319 So it was pricey, but not that pricey because it's gonna stay on for like five five years. 00:04:18.480 --> 00:04:19.279 It'll be on. 00:04:19.439 --> 00:04:21.600 And then I also got a ring on this side. 00:04:23.759 --> 00:04:25.199 Yeah, so that was just so much fun. 00:04:25.279 --> 00:04:27.360 And then I bought a little plant. 00:04:28.079 --> 00:04:33.279 I saw the girl that runs a little candle shop. 00:04:33.360 --> 00:04:34.480 I talked about her Christina. 00:04:34.639 --> 00:04:40.399 I saw her and I bought another candle from her, and I bought Nathaniel, a car freshener from her. 00:04:40.800 --> 00:04:41.199 Wow. 00:04:41.680 --> 00:04:43.120 So we just had a little fun day. 00:04:43.360 --> 00:04:45.839 Now that I moved away, you have to buy gifts for other people. 00:04:46.079 --> 00:04:46.399 I know. 00:04:46.560 --> 00:04:47.279 What the hell? 00:04:47.439 --> 00:04:48.000 The Heli. 00:04:48.800 --> 00:04:49.759 Anything else new? 00:04:50.000 --> 00:04:50.399 Exciting. 00:04:50.639 --> 00:04:50.879 Okay. 00:04:51.040 --> 00:04:52.000 I have shop. 00:04:52.240 --> 00:04:53.279 Do you have a shop talk? 00:04:53.360 --> 00:04:56.000 Because if not, I have a couple shop talks actually. 00:04:56.319 --> 00:05:00.959 I don't because I feel like last time we told them every all of our thoughts and feels. 00:05:01.199 --> 00:05:10.079 So to recap that one in case you did miss that, uh, there was not an episode last week because we are going down to two a month for now at least. 00:05:10.240 --> 00:05:11.439 We'll see what happens. 00:05:11.759 --> 00:05:15.040 Um, but I have I have two things for you. 00:05:15.199 --> 00:05:25.360 One, we have to give a shout-out to our bestie who has a six-part mini series on Stream Beacon TV, which if you don't know about it, it's a paranormal like streaming service. 00:05:25.519 --> 00:05:30.240 And Lauren, Lauren Hos or Helixon has hers. 00:05:30.319 --> 00:05:31.680 I've been to the first three episodes. 00:05:31.759 --> 00:05:34.160 It's coming out like weekly, and it's so good. 00:05:34.319 --> 00:05:34.879 I love her. 00:05:34.959 --> 00:05:36.720 I just like I was texting her while watching. 00:05:36.800 --> 00:05:38.959 I'm like, I'm so proud of you. 00:05:39.120 --> 00:05:40.000 Like, yeah. 00:05:40.240 --> 00:05:41.759 Uh, I was telling her how proud I was. 00:05:41.839 --> 00:05:45.279 I haven't watched it yet, um, but you gave me the login, so thanks. 00:05:45.439 --> 00:05:46.639 I very much appreciate that. 00:05:46.720 --> 00:05:47.680 And I will watch it. 00:05:47.839 --> 00:05:50.160 Um, I'm so proud of her and her new equipment. 00:05:50.319 --> 00:05:52.639 She's just too much of her little smarty pants. 00:05:52.879 --> 00:05:56.319 And then I have Shop Talk that you don't know about yet. 00:05:56.560 --> 00:05:57.120 Uh oh. 00:05:57.439 --> 00:06:07.920 I have

been sending little messages and been talking with Shirley, and she knows for sure 100% that I will be flying home around major holidays. 00:06:08.160 --> 00:06:13.519 And whenever she wants, she's gonna have a chat with us to talk about events if it's not around major holiday. 00:06:13.759 --> 00:06:17.360 So at some point we are going back to Eloise. 00:06:17.920 --> 00:06:24.000 Yes, and I've been so badly wanting to reach out to her because I just miss ghosts, but I like don't want to do it without you. 00:06:24.319 --> 00:06:26.079 Dude, I had a dream I went ghost hunting. 00:06:26.319 --> 00:06:29.439 No, like I would do it without you, but I don't want to do it without you. 00:06:29.519 --> 00:06:32.399 Because number one, I just don't think it works as well if we're not together. 00:06:32.560 --> 00:06:34.560 And number two, like, I want you with me. 00:06:34.800 --> 00:06:35.439 I know. 00:06:35.600 --> 00:06:40.560 Uh, I've been planning some spooky little adventures when you eventually come out here, but yeah, so stay tuned. 00:06:40.720 --> 00:06:41.759 We will figure that out. 00:06:42.240 --> 00:06:42.800 Yes. 00:06:43.040 --> 00:06:44.160 Um, anything else? 00:06:44.240 --> 00:06:45.040 Shop talk wise. 00:06:45.199 --> 00:06:46.480 Are you ready for a question to open show? 00:06:46.639 --> 00:06:47.120 I am ready. 00:06:47.199 --> 00:06:48.319 I think everybody's ready. 00:06:48.639 --> 00:06:48.879 Okay. 00:06:49.120 --> 00:06:52.000 Do you ever take Excedrin, Tylenol, or aspirin? 00:06:52.800 --> 00:06:54.639 Now, why are you gonna do this to me? 00:06:54.879 --> 00:06:56.560 Do you ever think about the side effects? 00:06:56.879 --> 00:06:57.759 Of course. 00:06:58.000 --> 00:07:00.240 I'd think about the side effects of everything. 00:07:00.480 --> 00:07:01.279 What if you died? 00:07:01.519 --> 00:07:02.879 Zachary, we're all gonna die. 00:07:03.040 --> 00:07:04.639 When you took the aspirin, though. 00:07:04.879 --> 00:07:05.199 Okay. 00:07:05.519 --> 00:07:08.240 What do you what is somebody who was just all worked up? 00:07:08.399 --> 00:07:11.040 Well, because why are you gonna do this to us? 00:07:11.360 --> 00:07:13.199 Because this is a fun story. 00:07:13.600 --> 00:07:14.160 Uh uh. 00:07:14.560 --> 00:07:26.399 It's a fun story because during my adventures out here, I actually met somebody related to this case who promised me if I write the story, she's gonna come and do some follow-ups. 00:07:26.800 --> 00:07:32.160 Okay, you told me that you met somebody about a case and okay, but I don't know anything about it. 00:07:32.480 --> 00:07:42.240 So June 1986, Seattle, Washington, 40-year-old bank manager Susan Snow is at home dealing with a horrible headache that she woke up with. 00:07:42.319 --> 00:07:43.600 So she didn't go to work. 00:07:43.839 --> 00:07:50.240 She remembers that she had previously bought a bottle of Exeterin, and to get some relief, she swallows two capsules. 00:07:50.879 --> 00:08:00.319 Within minutes of taking the medication, she is in severe distress, and not long after that, she passes away. 00:08:00.560 --> 00:08:09.040 Investigators would eventually uncover the cause of her death was a lethal dose of cyanide, and the cyanide traced back to the bottle of excedrin. 00:08:09.199 --> 00:08:09.519 Hmm. 00:08:09.680 --> 00:08:12.079 I'd be dead because I take so much excedrine. 00:08:12.160 --> 00:08:12.639 Actually, not so much. 00:08:14.319 --> 00:08:16.800 Now that all my organs are gone, I don't get as many headaches. 00:08:17.199 --> 00:08:18.160 Ooh, that's good. 00:08:18.319 --> 00:08:19.519 They take a brain too. 00:08:19.839 --> 00:08:25.040 No, but a lot of times, a lot of times, you know, it's hormonal, so yeah. 00:08:25.279 --> 00:08:30.319 So the worst part is though, is that Susan Snow was not even the intended victim. 00:08:30.480 --> 00:08:34.559 She was just collateral damage and a murder plot that began weeks earlier. 00:08:34.720 --> 00:08:36.480 Does this ring any sorts of bells for you? 00:08:36.799 --> 00:08:37.360 No, it doesn't. 00:08:37.519 --> 00:08:45.440 But here's the thing I would be so pissed off if I was the collateral damage of somebody else that's was supposed to get murdered. 00:08:45.519 --> 00:08:47.840 Like, and you're all like, Carrie, you're dead, you're not gonna be pissed off. 00:08:47.919 --> 00:08:50.320 Oh, I would be pissed off dead. 00:08:50.879 --> 00:08:53.279 As we always say, you're coming back to poke some booty holes. 00:08:53.360 --> 00:08:56.559 So we know that's oh, I'm gonna do more than that if I was collateral damage. 00:08:56.639 --> 00:09:00.960 Like you couldn't come up with a better plan so that no one else would like or whatever. 00:09:01.039 --> 00:09:02.320 I don't know anything about this. 00:09:02.559 --> 00:09:04.480 Yeah, you'll you'll find okay, okay, okay. 00:09:04.639 --> 00:09:07.120 I just had to put that in there for this to work. 00:09:07.279 --> 00:09:09.200 There had to be random victims. 00:09:09.519 --> 00:09:10.480 Oh, that makes sense. 00:09:10.559 --> 00:09:12.720 Okay, I kind of I okay, okay, okay, okay. 00:09:12.799 --> 00:09:13.440 Let me shut up. 00:09:13.600 --> 00:09:14.399 Let's go backwards. 00:09:14.480 --> 00:09:21.360 Okay, so Stella Maudine Stevenson, she was born in Colton, Oregon in 1943. 00:09:21.600 --> 00:09:24.480 She spends a lot of her life in the Pacific Northwest. 00:09:24.639 --> 00:09:29.919 She grew up poor, pretty ordinary, nothing, you know, super special about Miss Stella. 00:09:30.159 --> 00:09:30.399 Oh. 00:09:30.879 --> 00:09:32.799 In 1959, she has a daughter. 00:09:32.960 --> 00:09:40.960 Her daughter's name is Cynthia Hamilton, and just after that, she moves to Southern California where she marries and has another daughter. 00:09:41.279 --> 00:09:41.600 Okay. 00:09:41.919 --> 00:09:56.399 Uh, it's here she runs into several legal issues, um, including a fraud conviction in 1968, uh, child abuse in 1969 for hitting

Cynthia with a rod. 00:09:56.639 --> 00:09:56.799 Oh. 00:09:57.200 --> 00:09:59.600 And let's just remember what she did to Cynthia. 00:09:59.840 --> 00:10:00.159 Okay. 00:10:00.480 --> 00:10:07.120 So her marriage falls apart and she moves to Auburn, Washington, back to the Pacific Northwest around this time. 00:10:07.360 --> 00:10:07.679 Okay. 00:10:08.000 --> 00:10:14.799 A few years later, at the age of 32 in 1974, she meets a man named Bruce Nickel. 00:10:14.960 --> 00:10:18.879 Um, and the two are married two years later in 1976. 00:10:19.360 --> 00:10:21.120 And she just has the two daughters, right? 00:10:21.440 --> 00:10:22.240 Two daughters, yeah. 00:10:22.399 --> 00:10:22.559 Okay. 00:10:22.799 --> 00:10:28.320 And I'm pretty sure one was no marriage, the other one was from a marriage that fell apart. 00:10:28.559 --> 00:10:28.879 Right. 00:10:29.039 --> 00:10:31.759 And now she needs to marry Bruce Nichols. 00:10:31.919 --> 00:10:32.320 Got it. 00:10:32.559 --> 00:10:36.000 We really don't know a whole lot about Bruce. 00:10:36.240 --> 00:10:39.600 Um, but we know at the time we met, he's about four years old. 00:10:39.759 --> 00:10:41.360 So eight years older than her. 00:10:41.440 --> 00:10:42.399 Um, and he was a happy. 00:10:42.720 --> 00:10:44.480 I thought you just said four years old. 00:10:44.639 --> 00:10:46.000 I was like, what are you talking about? 00:10:46.159 --> 00:10:46.879 Forty. 00:10:47.200 --> 00:10:47.679 Forty. 00:10:48.240 --> 00:10:53.519 It's also very likely that he had a history of drinking. 00:10:53.679 --> 00:10:55.039 He he liked to drink. 00:10:55.279 --> 00:10:55.600 Okay. 00:10:55.840 --> 00:10:58.320 So the two lived a pretty low-key life. 00:10:58.480 --> 00:11:02.080 Um, again, not much is known about their early days. 00:11:02.240 --> 00:11:05.039 But into the 1980s, they lived together for a few years. 00:11:05.200 --> 00:11:08.639 Friends described them as just ordinary working class people. 00:11:09.120 --> 00:11:15.679 And like most ordinary people, life isn't always smooth and relationships are not easy. 00:11:17.519 --> 00:11:17.759 Okay. 00:11:18.000 --> 00:11:21.440 So Bruce's alcoholism leads to tension at home. 00:11:21.600 --> 00:11:25.600 Money is often tight, financial issues are always plaguing them. 00:11:25.759 --> 00:11:31.360 And we don't know if it was like a truly unhappy marriage or if it was just like a little bit more complicated than most marriages. 00:11:31.600 --> 00:11:33.200 I just want to backtrack for a second. 00:11:33.440 --> 00:11:33.759 Yeah. 00:11:33.919 --> 00:11:36.720 I don't want anyone to be like, damn, that came for me. 00:11:36.799 --> 00:11:41.679 If you're just live an ordinary life and not like there's nothing wrong, that doesn't mean that you're married. 00:11:42.240 --> 00:11:43.039 No, there's nothing wrong. 00:11:43.200 --> 00:11:47.759 I'm just saying, it's like we they weren't like, yeah, she had some crime, but she wasn't like the same. 00:11:48.080 --> 00:11:48.320 I know. 00:11:48.799 --> 00:11:49.600 It was just the way you said it. 00:11:49.679 --> 00:11:54.559 You're like, and we know with ordinary families, like like the what just the way you said it. 00:11:54.960 --> 00:11:58.000 They're just like normal people with normal problems, is what it seems like. 00:11:58.240 --> 00:11:58.480 Okay. 00:11:58.639 --> 00:11:59.120 All right. 00:11:59.279 --> 00:12:02.799 But the way you're like, okay, he's an alcoholic, she might be abusive. 00:12:02.879 --> 00:12:04.480 You're like, you know, ordinary people. 00:12:04.879 --> 00:12:06.159 Ordinary, everyone. 00:12:06.879 --> 00:12:09.440 We all have an aunt Stella and an uncle Bruce. 00:12:09.679 --> 00:12:10.000 Okay. 00:12:11.279 --> 00:12:11.600 Okay. 00:12:12.080 --> 00:12:13.519 I just wanted to clarify. 00:12:13.759 --> 00:12:15.039 Here, here's a positive note. 00:12:15.200 --> 00:12:17.039 Bruce does eventually get sober. 00:12:17.279 --> 00:12:18.240 Good job, Bruce. 00:12:18.399 --> 00:12:21.039 And you think this would help their issues, but it almost makes sense. 00:12:21.279 --> 00:12:22.240 Oh, I'm sure it got up. 00:12:22.399 --> 00:12:22.879 Yeah. 00:12:23.200 --> 00:12:27.759 So Stella was a little bit upset that she couldn't visit the bar as much. 00:12:27.919 --> 00:12:33.440 Um, because then she stopped, like, she couldn't do what she the same types of things. 00:12:33.759 --> 00:12:36.320 She finds Bruce annoying and boring. 00:12:36.960 --> 00:12:43.600 And she begins to take evening shifts at a security job at CTAC Airport just to like have something to do at night. 00:12:43.840 --> 00:12:48.240 Um, she also starts to spend more time on her aquarium than with her husband. 00:12:48.480 --> 00:12:48.879 All right. 00:12:49.120 --> 00:12:51.759 Aquarium hobbies are important to Stella. 00:12:51.840 --> 00:12:53.039 Let's just also remember that. 00:12:53.200 --> 00:12:56.559 We need to remember child abuse and we need to remember aquariums. 00:12:56.879 --> 00:12:59.360 Child abuse doesn't she abuse her children. 00:12:59.600 --> 00:13:00.639 Yes, she abused. 00:13:00.960 --> 00:13:02.480 Okay, I just wanted to make sure I understood. 00:13:02.639 --> 00:13:03.600 Cynthia, correct. 00:13:03.759 --> 00:13:04.080 Okay. 00:13:35.240 --> 00:13:51.800 So around 1985, we get some red flags in our little ordinary folks' life because Stella starts to do what every good wife does, and she takes out life insurance policies on Bruce that would pay out even if he died unexpectedly. 00:13:51.879 --> 00:13:53.800 And she is, of course, the beneficiary. 00:13:54.200 --> 00:13:58.040 Which I mean, it's not he's a machine operator. 00:13:58.519 --> 00:14:08.040 Yeah, I mean, that's not that like here's where I would say it might be a little bit it's not policy, it's policies. 00:14:08.600 --> 00:14:09.560 Okay, yeah. 00:14:10.120 --> 00:14:13.720 Which I still don't can't why can you take multiple? 00:14:14.040 --> 00:14:15.879

Because I don't think they talk to each other. 00:14:15.960 --> 00:14:17.639 It's like can you still do that now? 00:14:17.800 --> 00:14:18.920 Yeah, I'm pretty sure. 00:14:19.320 --> 00:14:21.720 It's just like going to different brain banks and opening up different. 00:14:22.440 --> 00:14:22.920 I guess. 00:14:23.159 --> 00:14:23.879 Yeah, I guess. 00:14:24.040 --> 00:14:24.680 Okay, anyway. 00:14:24.920 --> 00:14:28.759 So that was 1985, and June 6th, 1986. 00:14:29.240 --> 00:14:31.399 Bruce returns home from work. 00:14:31.560 --> 00:14:33.080 Uh, he's not feeling very good. 00:14:33.240 --> 00:14:35.800 He complains of a headache and just general illness. 00:14:35.960 --> 00:14:37.159 So he takes a couple, etc. 00:14:37.960 --> 00:14:41.720 In a very short time, he deteriorates pretty rapidly. 00:14:41.879 --> 00:14:47.320 He collapses, Stella calls for help, and emergency responders arrive and rush him to the hospital. 00:14:47.560 --> 00:14:51.080 And shortly after getting to the hospital, Bruce passes away. 00:14:51.240 --> 00:14:51.560 Okay. 00:14:51.800 --> 00:14:52.120 Okay. 00:14:52.759 --> 00:14:54.040 So doctors. 00:14:54.200 --> 00:14:54.840 Oh, go on. 00:14:55.000 --> 00:14:58.120 I was just gonna say, but I guess I want to I'll put my question out here. 00:14:58.200 --> 00:15:01.399 You're not gonna be able to answer it or don't answer it, but I just have to get off my brain. 00:15:01.560 --> 00:15:07.320 It's like, did he have this many headaches that like it was just known that he's gonna take Excedrin? 00:15:07.720 --> 00:15:13.720 Because to me, Excedrine isn't the one that you take a lot, it's more of like a Tylenol or Motrin, like you know what I mean? 00:15:13.800 --> 00:15:16.040 Like, okay, see, that's coming from a woman's point of view. 00:15:16.200 --> 00:15:18.040 The man's just gonna grab whatever is there. 00:15:18.200 --> 00:15:19.960 Yeah, but Excedrin's like for your head. 00:15:20.040 --> 00:15:23.000 So to like to me, anyways, continue on. 00:15:23.240 --> 00:15:27.080 So doctors and officials, as they always do when somebody dies, right? 00:15:27.159 --> 00:15:29.480 They look for the cause of death, they investigate. 00:15:29.720 --> 00:15:30.040 Really? 00:15:30.120 --> 00:15:32.759 Um, we don't, but they don't find any foul play or anything. 00:15:33.080 --> 00:15:37.240 He has a history of health issues, including respiratory problems. 00:15:37.480 --> 00:15:37.800 Oh. 00:15:38.120 --> 00:15:42.680 So they the doctors originally cite emphysema as his cause of death. 00:15:42.920 --> 00:15:43.240 Oh. 00:15:43.560 --> 00:15:53.639 So shortly after the Miss Stilla gets her insurance payout, it's about a hundred thousand dollars in 1986, which would be about$300,000 today. 00:15:53.879 --> 00:15:54.120 Okay. 00:15:54.440 --> 00:15:57.000 I think you can kind of put together where this is going. 00:15:57.240 --> 00:15:57.879 Yeah. 00:15:58.360 --> 00:16:05.480 Right now, Bruce's death is ruled medical tragedy, but then something happens that makes people start to question. 00:16:05.639 --> 00:16:09.879 And that is where we started this episode with the story of Susan Snow. 00:16:10.120 --> 00:16:12.600 So Susan simply dealing with a headache. 00:16:12.759 --> 00:16:13.159 Yeah. 00:16:13.399 --> 00:16:14.680 Many other millions of people. 00:16:14.840 --> 00:16:25.159 She takes a over-the-counter extra strength, etc., a widely trusted pill, and she becomes violently ill and dies, as we've previously discussed today. 00:16:25.480 --> 00:16:25.800 Okay. 00:16:26.040 --> 00:16:26.360 Okay. 00:16:26.680 --> 00:16:29.879 So this is a this death is also examined, right? 00:16:29.960 --> 00:16:35.080 The body is looked over, and the examiner catches a scent of bitter almonds. 00:16:35.480 --> 00:16:39.080 Which, by the way, there is a book about this whole thing, and it's called Bitter Almonds. 00:16:39.320 --> 00:16:39.639 Oh. 00:16:40.120 --> 00:16:45.399 Bitter almonds is an odor that is distinctive from cyanide. 00:16:45.639 --> 00:16:51.159 I feel like I I've heard of that, yeah, because that just sounds like the bitter almonds one sounds familiar. 00:16:51.320 --> 00:16:51.560 Okay. 00:16:51.720 --> 00:16:52.360 Wow, okay. 00:16:52.600 --> 00:16:54.840 So police start an investigation. 00:16:55.000 --> 00:16:56.200 The house is scoured. 00:16:56.279 --> 00:16:57.560 This is Susan's house. 00:16:57.720 --> 00:17:03.000 Um, and it turns out they find that the excedrant she had in her home was laced with cyanide. 00:17:03.320 --> 00:17:03.879 Okay, hold on. 00:17:03.960 --> 00:17:04.519 I'm so sorry. 00:17:04.680 --> 00:17:07.799 I I know I was listening, but I think my brain was just going too fast. 00:17:08.039 --> 00:17:10.759 So, how did we get to the bitter almonds part? 00:17:11.079 --> 00:17:14.599 So it was just like when Bruce died, right? 00:17:14.839 --> 00:17:17.559 Medical examiners are checking out her body and they catch the smell. 00:17:18.119 --> 00:17:19.240 Oh, they smelled it. 00:17:19.480 --> 00:17:20.359 Yeah, they smelled it. 00:17:20.519 --> 00:17:21.319 This is on Susan. 00:17:21.480 --> 00:17:22.599 Yes, yeah, you know, I know. 00:17:22.839 --> 00:17:23.960 So he already died. 00:17:24.119 --> 00:17:28.119 Yep, so they smell it on Susan, but then so then they investigate the house. 00:17:28.440 --> 00:17:33.879 Yeah, because the examiner's like I think because she was noble health issues before she was healthy. 00:17:34.279 --> 00:17:35.000 I just missed that part. 00:17:35.079 --> 00:17:35.240 Okay. 00:17:35.399 --> 00:17:35.719 Yep. 00:17:35.879 --> 00:17:36.199 Okay. 00:17:37.399 --> 00:17:40.279 So it it's obviously a poisoning, right? 00:17:40.519 --> 00:17:44.919 So Susan's story immediately strikes fear across the country. 00:17:45.159 --> 00:17:58.519 Not only because, like, hey, she bought a pill at a store and it was poisoned, but four years earlier in Chicago, at least seven people died when Tylenol had been uh

laced with potassium cyanide. 00:17:59.480 --> 00:17:59.799 Okay. 00:18:00.119 --> 00:18:04.519 The worst part is though, is nobody was ever caught for the Chicago murders. 00:18:05.879 --> 00:18:10.599 Which that one would just make another good episode that I should get into at some point. 00:18:10.839 --> 00:18:18.519 Now, right, there's a murder, and people already have this fear of pharmaceuticals from somebody who was never caught before, right? 00:18:18.839 --> 00:18:20.359 We're for sure saying it's a murder. 00:18:20.439 --> 00:18:24.759 They don't think it was something that accidentally happened to the Excedrine or like in the making of it. 00:18:24.839 --> 00:18:31.319 Like I'm just saying, like they're not they're automatically jumping to because of what happened just four years ago, and nobody was ever caught. 00:18:31.559 --> 00:18:33.799 Okay, people are just like, Yeah, it got it. 00:18:33.959 --> 00:18:36.119 You don't accidentally lace excessive. 00:18:36.279 --> 00:18:37.000 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 00:18:37.159 --> 00:18:37.480 Okay. 00:18:37.719 --> 00:18:41.719 Um, so pe and people already have a fear of this, like it's embedded in the culture. 00:18:41.879 --> 00:18:46.119 And now, right, people are like super fearful it's gonna happen again. 00:18:46.199 --> 00:18:47.879 Like all these people are gonna start dying. 00:18:48.119 --> 00:18:58.359 So Susan's story breaks, public fear breaks out, no one knows if there's more bottles that have been tampered with, where she bought hers, or like where any more poison is. 00:18:58.839 --> 00:19:02.919 Anybody could be a victim, at least kind of what the thought was. 00:19:03.159 --> 00:19:09.399 Um, so folks start avoiding taking medication, they're returning them, they're demanding answers from the pharmaceutical company. 00:19:09.719 --> 00:19:14.919 So public fear turns into crisis, and police are like, we gotta get to the bottom of this. 00:19:15.240 --> 00:19:15.480 Okay. 00:19:15.719 --> 00:19:18.759 So Stella does something a little bit surprising here, though. 00:19:19.079 --> 00:19:19.399 Okay. 00:19:19.879 --> 00:19:25.079 Upon hearing about Susan's death on the news, she calls the police. 00:19:25.399 --> 00:19:30.279 She claims that her husband died of very similar symptoms when he had returned from work. 00:19:30.439 --> 00:19:38.359 And upon hearing about Susan, she went to go check the medicine cabinet and found that he had also taken excedrin extra strength. 00:19:38.679 --> 00:19:40.119 So she produces two bottles. 00:19:40.519 --> 00:19:41.559 Why would she say that? 00:19:41.879 --> 00:19:47.079 Why would she say, Oh, what did she count the goddamn Excedrins to know that he took it that day? 00:19:47.399 --> 00:19:49.879 Well, she knew that he took some medication. 00:19:50.119 --> 00:19:50.439 Okay. 00:19:50.599 --> 00:19:51.959 And it seemed very similar. 00:19:52.119 --> 00:19:53.159 So she called the police, right? 00:19:53.399 --> 00:20:01.000 Okay, gives him the two bottles she bought from the store, and that's tested, and his remains are tested, and they both come out positive for the case. 00:20:01.639 --> 00:20:11.639 The way you worded it, I straight up thought she was like, I my like, I thought she like was like, upon examining my cabinet, I believe he took the ex like you know what I mean. 00:20:11.719 --> 00:20:12.919 Like the way you said it was the shit. 00:20:13.639 --> 00:20:15.639 I that's kind of how she called it in. 00:20:15.879 --> 00:20:16.919 That's crazy. 00:20:17.159 --> 00:20:20.759 When we get further into this, you're gonna find out just how fucking crazy it is. 00:20:21.079 --> 00:20:23.959 So a massive recall is now done by the FDA. 00:20:24.039 --> 00:20:35.480 They pull all the Excedrin products from the Pacific Northwest and Alaska, and a total of two more bottles are found in stores, uh, both in the areas between Auburn and Seattle, Washington. 00:20:35.719 --> 00:20:38.119 You mean two more bottles that are laced? 00:20:38.359 --> 00:20:38.599 Yeah. 00:20:38.759 --> 00:20:39.240 Oh, okay. 00:20:39.399 --> 00:20:41.480 Yeah, so of all the bottles, they find two more. 00:20:41.719 --> 00:20:42.039 Okay. 00:20:42.199 --> 00:20:43.799 They have five total bottles. 00:20:43.959 --> 00:20:44.279 Okay. 00:20:44.599 --> 00:20:46.519 One in Seattle that Susan bought. 00:20:46.679 --> 00:20:47.000 Yep. 00:20:47.240 --> 00:20:49.719 Two that were in Stella's house. 00:20:49.959 --> 00:20:52.199 Oh, two in Stella's were laced. 00:20:52.439 --> 00:20:57.319 And two more that were still on the shelves in the areas between where both of them lived. 00:20:57.480 --> 00:21:00.759 Now, how did our girl get so lucky to get two laced bottles? 00:21:01.000 --> 00:21:05.480 Exactly, which is why the police start to get a little suspicious of our friend. 00:21:05.719 --> 00:21:07.000 What a freaking ding-dong. 00:21:07.240 --> 00:21:09.959 Okay, so remember Stella really likes her fish. 00:21:10.199 --> 00:21:10.679 Yeah. 00:21:11.000 --> 00:21:14.119 So when these bottles are tested, oh no. 00:21:14.359 --> 00:21:18.599 They also find some green flecks in cyanide powder. 00:21:18.839 --> 00:21:26.599 These flecks were determined to be an algae side used in home aquariums and sold under the brand name the algae destroyer. 00:21:26.919 --> 00:21:35.079 So whatever she was using to crush up, allegedly, her algae killer, she also allegedly used to crush up some etc. 00:21:35.639 --> 00:21:39.079 So, right now, we got Bruce dying, right? 00:21:39.399 --> 00:21:45.480 A random death later, Stella calling the cops to say, I think my husband took the et cetera. 00:21:45.719 --> 00:21:47.079 Now you see why that call sounds weird. 00:21:47.240 --> 00:21:49.000 But why would she do that anyway? 00:21:49.240 --> 00:21:51.240 What do we think her thought process was? 00:21:51.480 --> 00:21:54.839 She has the fish tanks and she got her insurance payout. 00:21:54.919 --> 00:21:56.519 She's bored of her

sober husband. 00:21:56.679 --> 00:21:58.599 No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. 00:21:58.759 --> 00:21:59.879 I know why she did that. 00:22:00.039 --> 00:22:04.199 I'm asking, what is her why would she fucking call the police after? 00:22:04.439 --> 00:22:06.679 Because the Chicago killer was never caught. 00:22:06.919 --> 00:22:07.240 So? 00:22:07.480 --> 00:22:14.039 No, if they had already ruled his death natural causes, I have no idea why. 00:22:14.279 --> 00:22:15.000 That's what I'm saying. 00:22:15.159 --> 00:22:17.240 I don't give a shit if who was caught or not. 00:22:17.399 --> 00:22:18.199 She got away with it. 00:22:18.359 --> 00:22:19.399 Shut your fucking mouth. 00:22:19.639 --> 00:22:27.879 I I think part of it might have been what if they start to look into these weird deaths, you know, and then I didn't say something. 00:22:27.959 --> 00:22:29.319 I I don't know why she did. 00:22:29.559 --> 00:22:30.359 Obviously, I'm glad she. 00:22:30.679 --> 00:22:31.719 She did because we wanted her to be a good idea. 00:22:31.879 --> 00:22:32.359 Allegedly. 00:22:32.519 --> 00:22:32.679 Yeah. 00:22:32.839 --> 00:22:33.240 Allegedly. 00:22:33.399 --> 00:22:34.359 Well, but you get what I'm saying. 00:22:34.519 --> 00:22:36.039 Like when I say stupid, like what? 00:22:36.119 --> 00:22:37.480 You moron, you got away. 00:22:37.719 --> 00:22:43.399 The these things are all linked, but there's no definitive proof that she messed with sedrum. 00:22:43.639 --> 00:22:48.919 Like it's like, you know, she could have been at the crime scene, but her fingerprints aren't on the knife, sort of deal. 00:22:49.000 --> 00:22:50.519 Like they don't have they they have a sort of thing. 00:22:53.879 --> 00:22:55.799 But but they don't have like the smoking gun. 00:22:55.879 --> 00:22:56.439 You know, right. 00:22:56.759 --> 00:22:58.359 They start to look into her more. 00:22:58.599 --> 00:23:05.480 Investigators do discover that she had checked out a book from the library, a toxicology-related reference book. 00:23:05.719 --> 00:23:06.359 Girl. 00:23:06.679 --> 00:23:13.480 Among that material that she checked out, there was information involving poisonous substances, including cyanide. 00:23:13.639 --> 00:23:24.759 This is so effing funny that the lot your library books got you like instead of your search history on your computer or your phone nowadays, the library, the books you check out. 00:23:24.919 --> 00:23:26.199 That is so funny. 00:23:27.000 --> 00:23:27.799 I love this. 00:23:28.039 --> 00:23:29.719 So they're building the case. 00:23:29.959 --> 00:23:35.799 They keep wanting her to take lie detector tests, and of course, she is refusing them multiple times. 00:23:36.439 --> 00:23:37.159 What's her reasoning? 00:23:37.240 --> 00:23:37.719 Do you know? 00:23:38.199 --> 00:23:42.359 It was always some excuse for she's also lawyered up at this point. 00:23:42.519 --> 00:23:43.879 Well, now because she's got money. 00:23:44.199 --> 00:23:51.719 She does fail the lie detector tests, and questions regarding purchasing cyanide when she finally takes it. 00:23:51.799 --> 00:23:52.039 Yeah. 00:23:52.199 --> 00:23:53.079 Oh, okay, okay. 00:23:53.319 --> 00:23:55.799 So we're still waiting though for the smoking gun. 00:23:56.119 --> 00:23:57.959 Now, she had charges before. 00:23:58.119 --> 00:24:00.119 Do you remember the one I told you to remember? 00:24:00.439 --> 00:24:00.759 Yeah. 00:24:01.079 --> 00:24:02.279 Beating her child. 00:24:02.519 --> 00:24:02.919 Mm-hmm. 00:24:03.319 --> 00:24:04.759 Cynthia comes forward. 00:24:05.000 --> 00:24:06.839 It was like my mom's a nut bag. 00:24:07.079 --> 00:24:14.119 In 1987, so a year after, uh, Cynthia approaches the police with information. 00:24:14.279 --> 00:24:23.319 She says her mother had reportedly spoken to her numerous times about wanting her husband dead, stating that she had grown bored with him because he had quit drinking. 00:24:23.719 --> 00:24:29.959 She even states on record that her mother had confessed to her that she tried to poison Bruce many times. 00:24:30.199 --> 00:24:34.759 Uh, once with a substance called foxglove, but all it did was cause him to be really drowsy. 00:24:34.919 --> 00:24:41.959 Uh you know what's so funny is that I was gonna say earlier, there's no way that this plan just like happened. 00:24:42.039 --> 00:24:44.119 Like she hadn't tried this many times. 00:24:44.279 --> 00:24:44.919 That's so funny. 00:24:45.000 --> 00:24:45.959 Cause I was gonna say that. 00:24:46.039 --> 00:24:52.119 Like, cause it's like the excedrin thing to me is like one of those things where it's like so specific, to me at least. 00:24:52.279 --> 00:24:54.199 Like, I'm not grabbing an excedrine. 00:24:54.279 --> 00:24:56.599 Like, it's very rare that Erin grabs her excedrine. 00:24:56.759 --> 00:24:59.319 So, like, if I'm trying to kill him, I would not poison the excedrin. 00:24:59.559 --> 00:25:02.439 Guarantee you she offered him the excedrin when he said he had a headache. 00:25:02.599 --> 00:25:03.719 Maybe, right? 00:25:03.799 --> 00:25:08.439 But like it's just so guaranteed allegedly, because we're gonna we're gonna poke some holes in this too. 00:25:08.599 --> 00:25:12.759 It's just funny though, because it's like clearly yeah, whatever. 00:25:13.000 --> 00:25:26.519 So her daughter goes on further to say her mom had even discussed with her going to the library to learn about other methods, and that the two of them had had conversations on how they were going to spend the insurance money. 00:25:26.759 --> 00:25:35.399 You know that old, not really old, but that wonderful saving saying from our favorite gals see something, say something. 00:25:35.639 --> 00:25:36.279 For real. 00:25:36.519 --> 00:25:39.319 Like, what are you doing? 00:25:39.559 --> 00:25:40.039 I don't know. 00:25:40.679 --> 00:25:42.679 Did she say that she thought her mom was like kidding? 00:25:42.839 --> 00:25:43.879 Here's the thing, though. 00:25:43.959 -->

00:25:45.319 Uh, let me put a pin in it. 00:25:45.399 --> 00:25:45.719 I'll come back. 00:25:45.959 --> 00:25:46.679 Okay, yeah, yeah, yeah. 00:25:46.839 --> 00:25:47.159 Okay. 00:25:47.480 --> 00:25:52.279 So prosecute prosecutors, prosecutors are now they're building their case, right? 00:25:52.359 --> 00:25:53.719 So it goes to trial. 00:25:53.879 --> 00:25:56.279 Uh, this is now the summer of 87. 00:25:56.599 --> 00:25:58.199 Stella with her lawyers, right? 00:25:58.279 --> 00:25:59.559 She she's already put it together. 00:25:59.639 --> 00:26:03.159 She's the prime suspect, but when they're building the case, she knows. 00:26:03.480 --> 00:26:08.359 So by December 9th, they do come and arrest her for the two deaths. 00:26:08.599 --> 00:26:15.480 But now the job of the prosecutors, still without any definitive proof, is to convince the jury she's guilty beyond reasonable doubt. 00:26:15.639 --> 00:26:17.639 So they argue she needed financial relief. 00:26:17.799 --> 00:26:20.439 She killed her husband to get it after taking out the policies. 00:26:20.599 --> 00:26:27.559 She studied the poison, spoke to family about it, and went as far as to tamper with three additional bottles to make it look like an earlier myrrh. 00:26:27.879 --> 00:26:28.199 Okay. 00:26:28.679 --> 00:26:32.599 So this move obviously it leads her to kill an innocent person. 00:26:32.759 --> 00:26:33.000 Yeah. 00:26:33.159 --> 00:26:34.439 To make her alibi stronger. 00:26:34.679 --> 00:26:35.959 And potentially two more. 00:26:36.119 --> 00:26:36.439 Yeah. 00:26:36.839 --> 00:26:40.039 And that's who knows how many people could have taken it, you know? 00:26:40.279 --> 00:26:40.839 Well, yeah. 00:26:41.079 --> 00:26:45.719 Um, because like you and me, we'd pop open a bottle after a night, I wouldn't just down it. 00:26:45.959 --> 00:26:46.359 Right. 00:26:46.599 --> 00:27:02.759 So Stella's defense tries to argue there's no eyewitness, there's no confession, there's no confirmed source of the cyanide, and that the timeline is just coincidence amplified by panic, and because the Chicago one went unsolved, they're trying to quickly point fingers. 00:27:03.079 --> 00:27:05.879 Which, I mean, that's a really good point. 00:27:06.279 --> 00:27:10.279 It's a good defense because they they don't have definitive proof. 00:27:10.359 --> 00:27:13.159 It's an easy, it's an easy one for a lawyer to defend, right? 00:27:13.399 --> 00:27:16.039 So Cynthia does testify at the trial. 00:27:16.199 --> 00:27:23.000 She talks about the research and the talks with her mom, and even says that at one point they had discussions of hiring a hit man. 00:27:23.319 --> 00:27:24.839 What the hell is going on? 00:27:25.079 --> 00:27:26.919 It's a very lengthy trial. 00:27:27.159 --> 00:27:36.039 And in 1988, the jury reaches a verdict and finds Stella guilty of both murders, and she receives a 90-year sentence. 00:27:36.279 --> 00:27:36.599 Okay. 00:27:37.399 --> 00:27:37.719 No. 00:27:38.839 --> 00:27:39.399 Come on. 00:27:39.559 --> 00:27:40.679 Well, you go first. 00:27:40.839 --> 00:27:41.480 I okay. 00:27:41.559 --> 00:27:47.240 I'm just saying if if we weren't going off of like the Cynthia thing, right? 00:27:47.480 --> 00:27:54.039 Like her talking about her mom saying all this stuff, I would probably be like, I don't know. 00:27:54.359 --> 00:28:00.839 Because it just and like I know the fish stuff is like that's pretty, but like still, I don't know. 00:28:01.079 --> 00:28:03.319 She wasn't the only one who had a fish tank. 00:28:03.480 --> 00:28:04.039 Well, right. 00:28:04.279 --> 00:28:06.359 So it's like that's a common brand. 00:28:06.599 --> 00:28:07.079 Right. 00:28:07.319 --> 00:28:08.919 So it's like, okay, whatever. 00:28:09.159 --> 00:28:10.759 And then I don't know. 00:28:10.919 --> 00:28:11.719 I don't know anyway. 00:28:11.799 --> 00:28:14.839 But I just like it's like, does she did she actually do it? 00:28:14.919 --> 00:28:25.799 Because it's like to me, it sounds so ignorant that I would call up the police though and be like, hey, you know, my husband actually passed away, blah blah blah, like whenever, and it's kind of seems the same thing. 00:28:25.879 --> 00:28:29.319 Like, I think he actually took a bottle of et cetera, and like I have them still. 00:28:29.559 --> 00:28:31.799 Like, I why would you do that? 00:28:32.039 --> 00:28:34.759 Like that that makes no sense to me at all. 00:28:35.000 --> 00:28:42.359 My thing is this I don't think she ever thought that they would have ruled it natural, but it was already done with her husband. 00:28:43.000 --> 00:28:44.199 So she had the plan, right? 00:28:44.279 --> 00:28:51.159 But if the other bottles start getting and more and more people start having these deaths, what if they looked into her husband and then she never called? 00:28:51.319 --> 00:28:52.679 No, I actually I changed my mind. 00:28:52.759 --> 00:28:57.159 I know exactly what her thought process is, because then you can sue Excedrin, potentially. 00:28:57.399 --> 00:28:58.199 Potentially, yeah. 00:28:58.279 --> 00:29:02.839 She probably actually honestly, because that's the only that's the only thing I could think of. 00:29:03.000 --> 00:29:05.480 Now, here's the other scenario that I go to, though. 00:29:06.279 --> 00:29:13.319 If I'm Cynthia and I've got a crazy mom who beat me, I might lie to the cops about some shit that she said. 00:29:13.559 --> 00:29:16.119 I want you to hold on to that because that's the point we're gonna come back to. 00:29:16.279 --> 00:29:16.439 Okay. 00:29:16.679 --> 00:29:18.839 So right now we have circumstantial evidence, right? 00:29:19.000 --> 00:29:22.759 Prosecution argued pattern was too specific to be a coincidence. 00:29:22.919 --> 00:29:27.000 The defense said, uh, you kind of use interpretation to fill in the gap. 00:29:27.319 --> 00:29:29.879 How did they say that she distributed the rest of these? 00:29:30.119 --> 00:29:35.799 Uh that she just went to random

stores between Seattle and where she lived and threw them on the shelves. 00:29:37.079 --> 00:29:37.399 Yep. 00:29:37.639 --> 00:29:42.359 But there's no camera, there's no no I mean, I guess that's where in the 80s. 00:29:42.599 --> 00:29:42.839 Okay. 00:29:43.159 --> 00:29:47.879 And and really, depending on how you look at it, like you've we've been saying, both sides really feel plausible. 00:29:48.039 --> 00:29:52.119 It's very plausible she did it, but it's also very plausible she did it, right? 00:29:52.359 --> 00:29:52.919 Right, right, right. 00:29:53.000 --> 00:29:53.159 Okay. 00:29:53.319 --> 00:29:55.799 Um, so that and that's why this case is still discussed. 00:29:55.879 --> 00:30:01.240 In fact, this is a huge one that they talk about in a lot of law schools and stuff because like it makes sense. 00:30:03.879 --> 00:30:18.519 Now, I I do think that Stella more than likely did this, but Cynthia Hamilton was paid a reward of$250,000 for her help in the case against her mom. 00:30:18.759 --> 00:30:23.319 The reward money came from a drug manufacturer's trade association. 00:30:23.559 --> 00:30:26.279 We have a vendetta against them for the way she treated us. 00:30:26.519 --> 00:30:28.279 Wait, why did they give her that? 00:30:28.519 --> 00:30:31.639 Uh, for helping them catch the real killer. 00:30:32.199 --> 00:30:40.439 But like you said, right, if she was planning to sue Excedrin and Excedrin was really behind this somehow, why wouldn't they pay off the daughter? 00:30:40.759 --> 00:30:42.519 I mean, I guess that does make sense. 00:30:42.759 --> 00:30:43.159 Mm-hmm. 00:30:43.559 --> 00:30:57.159 To offer whatever then there's some detectives who have dug into this and they uh discovered an FBI memo that seems to play down some things found among a thousand pages and that were turned over to the defense. 00:30:57.240 --> 00:31:04.039 And in these documents, there are reports about all their possible suspects and mysterious fingerprints on Sue Snow's bottle. 00:31:04.279 --> 00:31:06.279 Who were the suspects, or we don't know? 00:31:06.599 --> 00:31:07.639 We don't really know. 00:31:08.119 --> 00:31:08.519 Wow. 00:31:08.839 --> 00:31:18.039 Um it's weird to write that Stella had two out of the five bottles, but both her bottles were bought from the store, same store at the same time. 00:31:18.439 --> 00:31:21.879 So if it was random, she very easily could have gotten both. 00:31:22.119 --> 00:31:23.079 Yeah, no, for sure. 00:31:23.240 --> 00:31:34.919 I'm just thinking because the other bottles were spread out distance-wise from where those are, you'd think that if that was the case, two two bottles wouldn't be put at the same place, but who's to say it wouldn't? 00:31:35.159 --> 00:31:36.919 Who's to say it's all circumstantial? 00:31:37.159 --> 00:31:40.359 Then let's go back to the algae piece for a second. 00:31:40.519 --> 00:31:44.279 So she had a hobby, right, where she could have to ask us the product. 00:31:44.439 --> 00:31:46.039 The product was never found in your home. 00:31:46.279 --> 00:31:47.639 Let me ask about this product. 00:31:47.879 --> 00:31:55.159 Because to me, I thought like the algae stuff is like liquid that you put in the algae killer, but you're saying she had to break it up. 00:31:55.399 --> 00:31:57.879 This particular product was a solid that would dissolve. 00:31:58.119 --> 00:32:00.039 But I still don't know if you're breaking it up. 00:32:00.119 --> 00:32:01.480 Wouldn't you just put it in the tank? 00:32:01.639 --> 00:32:10.759 Because you were like what you said is like who like maybe she used the same item to break up the crush up that that you'd crush up the um excedrin. 00:32:11.000 --> 00:32:15.480 It it seems like this was like a concentrate, like a big piece you had to like break it off. 00:32:15.799 --> 00:32:17.639 So the product was never found in her home. 00:32:17.959 --> 00:32:23.319 Stella's neighbor, Sandy Scott, she becomes a spy piece for the FBI. 00:32:24.039 --> 00:32:30.839 Well she was paid$7,500 to search Stella's home for the allergy destroyer, which she never found. 00:32:31.079 --> 00:32:32.519 They just paid her to go into her house. 00:32:32.599 --> 00:32:33.719 I didn't know that was a thing. 00:32:34.039 --> 00:32:41.480 So a lot of this stuff is covered in the book Bitter Almonds, which seems at times to be a defense for Stella. 00:32:41.799 --> 00:32:42.119 Okay. 00:32:42.439 --> 00:32:47.480 The person who wrote Bitter Almonds is one of the few who got a lot of interviews with her in person. 00:32:47.719 --> 00:32:48.039 Okay. 00:32:48.519 --> 00:32:58.839 Um, so uh there's this case is wild because it's just there's so much circumstantial, there's so much evidence on both sides of people who paid off and this and that. 00:32:58.919 --> 00:33:03.559 And it's just I I I totally think Stella is the killer here. 00:33:03.719 --> 00:33:13.879 Um But I think it's important to even in something that seems cut and dry, that the way the narrative plays out and what evidence is produced and what's hidden can change a case. 00:33:14.119 --> 00:33:16.519 And I don't know if I would say that this is cut and dry. 00:33:16.679 --> 00:33:20.599 I mean, I I think that she did it only because there's major factors, right? 00:33:20.919 --> 00:33:33.399 The life insurance, like multiple policies, the you know, claims against her daughter in the past, like, you know, her daughter saying this, like, okay, we don't have to take that, but whatever. 00:33:33.639 --> 00:33:38.599 She does love for fish tanks, that this product she could have used at a time, got rid of it. 00:33:38.759 --> 00:33:41.799 Who's to say she didn't at one point have that in her home? 00:33:42.039 --> 00:33:46.199 So, I mean, to me, all of those are just like too coincidental. 00:33:46.439 --> 00:34:04.919 But then also, it's just one of those things where it's very strange, also to me, if my mom was talking all this nonsense, really truly, like

saying I'm gonna hire a hitman, I want to kill Rich, I want to do all of these things for a while prior to this. 00:34:05.159 --> 00:34:06.679 I would literally tell somebody. 00:34:06.919 --> 00:34:12.280 But remember, too, the daughter at one point says we were talking about how we were gonna spend the insurance money. 00:34:12.440 --> 00:34:13.480 But then why would you tell them? 00:34:13.880 --> 00:34:15.480 Stella is really this much of a monster. 00:34:15.639 --> 00:34:18.440 Who's to say Cynthia didn't far fall that far from the tree? 00:34:18.599 --> 00:34:21.159 I know, but like to just I don't know. 00:34:21.400 --> 00:34:22.039 I don't know. 00:34:22.280 --> 00:34:23.559 Now, do we know? 00:34:23.800 --> 00:34:32.440 Sorry, do we know if that money was offered like as a reward for like, hey, if anyone could come forward, was that like a public thing? 00:34:32.599 --> 00:34:39.239 Like where she would have read about that and been like, ooh, I'm gonna try to like you know, I'm gonna be honest with you, I didn't do to look at that. 00:34:39.480 --> 00:34:39.880 That's okay. 00:34:39.960 --> 00:34:43.559 I was just curious if you knew that would be good to know because that would be something else, too. 00:34:43.639 --> 00:34:45.559 That it's like, okay, there's this reward money. 00:34:45.880 --> 00:34:47.880 I'm gonna lie and say my mom fucking did it. 00:34:48.199 --> 00:34:56.839 Could be something we could learn more about because the final coincidence in this story, and I started talking about it, is I was out shopping in my new neighborhood. 00:34:57.079 --> 00:34:58.279 I went to this vintage store. 00:34:58.360 --> 00:35:04.759 We met this lovely, lovely woman named Tabitha, um, who gave us a ton of free stuff. 00:35:04.839 --> 00:35:07.000 She gave us some hot honey almonds and some. 00:35:07.319 --> 00:35:09.559 Oh, I heard about all of this, and I'm so jealous. 00:35:09.799 --> 00:35:13.880 So I was telling her about the podcast, and she goes, My uncle was killed. 00:35:14.119 --> 00:35:16.039 Mmm, it was her uncle. 00:35:16.360 --> 00:35:18.360 Have you ever heard of Stella Nichols? 00:35:18.599 --> 00:35:29.159 So I have met the niece of Bruce Nichols, who told me that I need to write the story because some things point Stella in a really good light, others in really bad light. 00:35:29.480 --> 00:35:33.559 But she would be able to give some pretty personal follow-ups after I write it. 00:35:33.799 --> 00:35:34.920 So my next one. 00:35:35.079 --> 00:35:36.759 So she so you don't know anything. 00:35:37.239 --> 00:35:39.799 I told her I didn't want her opinion. 00:35:39.880 --> 00:35:41.559 I wanted to go into it totally blind. 00:35:41.719 --> 00:35:42.519 I love that. 00:35:42.839 --> 00:35:47.079 And uh now I'm gonna send Miss Tabitha a message, or maybe I'll go see her this weekend. 00:35:47.239 --> 00:35:47.639 Yeah. 00:35:47.880 --> 00:35:49.639 And we're gonna get some more details. 00:35:49.799 --> 00:35:51.000 So I

don't know yet. 00:35:51.159 --> 00:35:53.480 She might call in, she might stop by. 00:35:53.639 --> 00:35:54.119 We'll see. 00:35:54.279 --> 00:35:57.319 We'll see the best way to have Tabitha come and talk to us. 00:35:57.480 --> 00:35:59.079 Okay, and what is her business? 00:35:59.319 --> 00:36:03.239 Her business is called Shack to Sheik L L C. 00:36:03.639 --> 00:36:04.360 Oh my god. 00:36:04.519 --> 00:36:08.839 Um, and so we're here in Phoenix, Arizona on 7th Avenue in the Melrose District. 00:36:08.920 --> 00:36:10.599 If you're nearby and you want to check it out. 00:36:10.920 --> 00:36:11.880 Shack to Sheik. 00:36:12.039 --> 00:36:13.960 I love Shack to Sheik. 00:36:14.039 --> 00:36:14.599 Yes. 00:36:14.839 --> 00:36:15.159 Cute. 00:36:15.480 --> 00:36:18.199 So yeah, we'll be hearing more from Tabitha, hopefully. 00:36:18.440 --> 00:36:19.239 That's so fun. 00:36:19.319 --> 00:36:20.119 I'm excited. 00:36:20.279 --> 00:36:24.920 I also just spilt my drink absolutely over all of my electronic cart. 00:36:25.159 --> 00:36:26.119 So I'm panicking. 00:36:26.519 --> 00:36:27.239 No, it's okay. 00:36:27.319 --> 00:36:27.880 We're good. 00:36:28.199 --> 00:36:28.920 Sorry. 00:36:29.239 --> 00:36:29.880 You're good. 00:36:30.039 --> 00:36:34.279 I wanted to give the listeners an inside scoop. 00:36:34.759 --> 00:36:36.599 So yeah, but sounds crazy on her end. 00:36:36.679 --> 00:36:37.799 Kira's spilling. 00:36:37.960 --> 00:36:40.519 Anyways, though, I I thought that one was super interesting. 00:36:40.599 --> 00:36:53.159 I remember hearing about it a long time ago, and uh, she was telling me one time, Tabitha, that because this was on Unsolved Mysteries in like the late 90s, that she was on a date and this episode came out, and she was like mortified. 00:36:53.239 --> 00:36:56.920 She used to be mortified about it, and now she like Oh my god. 00:36:57.079 --> 00:36:58.199 Yeah, I'm so sorry. 00:36:58.279 --> 00:37:03.799 You and I are such like opposite people where we'd be like, if we were on a date and that came out, we'd be like, dude, that's my uncle. 00:37:04.119 --> 00:37:04.599 Right. 00:37:05.079 --> 00:37:06.279 I mean, hey, it was sad. 00:37:06.599 --> 00:37:15.719 This was also before true crime was like as popular too, and like yeah, so anyway, so we'll get to more details for this episode. 00:37:15.880 --> 00:37:17.880 I think is there a fishbowl? 00:37:18.119 --> 00:37:25.480 I think fishbowl emoji for the the algae killers because I don't know if there's like medicine, but yeah, fish fish bowls, cute. 00:37:25.719 --> 00:37:29.319 With that, I do have a little follow-up of Reddit stories for us. 00:37:29.480 --> 00:37:33.239 So if you are a paid Patreon, oddball, head on over. 00:37:33.319 --> 00:37:35.719 We'll have a little fun follow-up for you guys. 00:37:35.880 --> 00:37:37.079 I don't know, it's getting late. 00:37:37.159 --> 00:37:39.960 It's time to do some side work, shut this place down for the evening. 00:37:40.039 --> 00:37:42.839 What else do we need to do before we close the shop up for the day? 00:37:43.000 --> 00:37:47.319 Rate and review, share us with your friends, family members, all the things. 00:37:47.480 --> 00:37:49.880 Don't take a sedron if the seal's been broken. 00:37:50.039 --> 00:37:55.079 And and the most important thing you can do for us is to creep it really, little outballs. 00:37:55.239 --> 00:37:55.480 Bye.