התמלול המלא של Ep 159: Unlocking Intentional Leadership, Accountability, & Emotional Maturity in Marriage with David Yep

00:04:19.199 So for you, what would you say has been your biggest struggle that has then become like we always talk about taking your weaknesses and making them your strengths? 00:04:19.360 --> 00:04:28.000 So, what do you feel like is your biggest weakness that you had to overcome that has now become your greatest strength in terms of being a husband, father, leader, anything? 00:04:28.399 --> 00:04:35.600 Yeah, and I, you know, I always have to answer that with a joke to probably have to ask my wife and see if her opinion is the same as mine. 00:04:35.759 --> 00:04:39.600 I don't know that it's become my biggest strength, but I certainly try. 00:04:39.839 --> 00:04:43.680 You know, I think you you hit on something, Cameron, that's really powerful. 00:04:43.759 --> 00:04:50.800 And it's almost one of those, it's almost one of those uncomfortable truths I think that are hard for a lot of us to voice out loud. 00:04:50.959 --> 00:04:55.439 You know, wherever we're at in life, usually it's somewhere towards the beginning of a career. 00:04:55.600 --> 00:05:03.920 And when you enter into the career world, the professional world, a lot of times we have this sort of fake it until you make it type of mentality. 00:05:04.160 --> 00:05:06.160 And you're gonna go in with confidence. 00:05:06.240 --> 00:05:08.079 And it's it's the world we live in. 00:05:08.160 --> 00:05:09.040 It's nobody's fault. 00:05:09.120 --> 00:05:14.000 You know, we've been taught that that's how you've got to do it in order to perform, in order to, in order to deliver, right? 00:05:14.079 --> 00:05:15.199 In order to produce. 00:05:15.519 --> 00:05:20.079 And that affects, I think, the way that we live so many different areas of our life. 00:05:20.160 --> 00:05:24.160 And we kind of go in with this false bravado, this false confidence into life. 00:05:24.240 --> 00:05:28.000 Like I've got it all figured out, you know, and and we do a little bit the same in dating. 00:05:28.160 --> 00:05:31.920 You know, we we go head first into dating and we want to show off that good side. 00:05:32.079 --> 00:05:34.480 And, you know, I've kind of got this all figured out. 00:05:34.639 --> 00:05:42.000 And just like it's so difficult and out of place in the workplace to say, hey, I actually don't know what I'm doing. 00:05:42.079 --> 00:05:43.360 I'm new and I want to learn. 00:05:43.519 --> 00:05:44.079 Can you help me? 00:05:44.240 --> 00:05:47.519 Like, we all feel like that would never land us a job as a guy. 00:05:47.759 --> 00:05:50.079 Most of us feel that wouldn't land us a girl either. 00:05:50.240 --> 00:05:54.399 Like we're expected to come in and and have it figured out and, you know, know what I'm doing. 00:05:54.480 --> 00:05:57.759 And so I love how you framed it up in that way. 00:05:57.920 --> 00:06:08.639 Uh, you know, my own experience, I actually decided I wanted to become a Catholic priest when I was 13 years old, which there is no marriage for Catholic priests, you know, there's no sex, no marriage, it's it's celibacy. 00:06:08.959 --> 00:06:15.920 And so it wasn't until I was 27 years old that I even abandoned the idea of the priesthood and decided I wanted to become married. 00:06:16.000 --> 00:06:38.800 But when I look at how quickly I transitioned into the the life of dating and marriage, like it was way fast, you know, and one of the greatest gifts, and this is to answer your question, I think one of the greatest gifts that my wife and I share is the ability to to talk honestly about the fact that when we got married, we didn't really know what we were doing. 00:06:38.959 --> 00:06:44.879 You know, it's like you you you want to say you are, and that's such a that's such a hard truth to admit. 00:06:45.120 --> 00:06:53.519 And I feel sorry for so many couples because I think it's one of those things that sometimes we all feel, uh, or at least one half of the equation feels. 00:06:53.600 --> 00:06:56.800 It's like, man, I really like realize now that I wasn't ready to get married. 00:06:56.879 --> 00:06:58.240 Or and it's not a bad thing. 00:06:58.319 --> 00:06:59.920 That doesn't mean the marriage can't continue. 00:07:00.000 --> 00:07:03.120 It doesn't mean the marriage won't be amazing, it doesn't mean that it wasn't meant to be. 00:07:03.199 --> 00:07:08.720 It just it's just a reality that says I got into marriage before I really knew who I was. 00:07:08.959 --> 00:07:09.199 Yeah. 00:07:09.519 --> 00:07:17.199 And that's okay, you know, and and so you ask kind of what my weakness that that has become a great strength. 00:07:17.279 --> 00:07:25.120 I think it's that is that you know, one of my weaknesses is is really going in, you know, kind of heart on my heart on my sleeve and going at it. 00:07:25.199 --> 00:07:35.279 And it's become a strength because it's allowed me to have those conversations with my wife now and have her have the conversations with me too, and say, this is the reality, you know, this is who we were when we got married. 00:07:35.439 --> 00:07:41.680 You know, we we didn't have everything figured out, but we have the chance to figure it out now together, and that's a beautiful thing. 00:07:42.319 --> 00:08:13.759 It is a beautiful thing, but I don't think enough people see that as an option that it's like they almost get stuck in this victimhood mindset or even leading from ego of, you know, and ego is the opposite of that emotional intimacy that you and your wife have of being able to have that conversation and being able to say, like, this is the reality, and it's not an attack on you, and it's not, you know, it's not humiliation for me, but it is humility, and it is just saying, like, here's what's up, you know, and and how are we gonna tackle this together? 00:08:14.000 --> 00:08:18.079 Whereas I think I mean the divorce rate at this point is up to about 60%. 00:08:18.720 --> 00:08:25.279 And so 60% of people are going the other way of that and saying, no, I wasn't ready to get

married. 00:08:25.439 --> 00:08:30.240 And you and I maybe didn't have it all figured out, but also like I'm not really willing to learn. 00:08:30.319 --> 00:08:33.360 So peace out, Girl Scout, you know, that kind of thing. 00:08:33.519 --> 00:08:44.159 So kind of talk about that as a leader, as a, you know, from that point of, you know, wanting to leave a lasting legacy as a husband and a father. 00:08:44.240 --> 00:08:52.720 And what's the difference, do you feel like, in your mindset versus someone else who has done this the opposite way? 00:08:53.679 --> 00:09:06.000 Yeah, and I I you know, my heart, like I feel what you just said so, so deeply, honestly, Cameron, because like I'm the first to say I don't I don't think that every marriage is meant to continue. 00:09:06.159 --> 00:09:09.039 I I do think that like, you know, it it happens sadly. 00:09:09.120 --> 00:09:10.080 It's just part of life. 00:09:10.240 --> 00:09:12.159 Like it I don't think there are mistakes. 00:09:12.320 --> 00:09:15.360 Um, I think that we can grow onto something else, you know. 00:09:15.519 --> 00:09:23.759 And so I'm the first to say that sometimes separation, divorce, um, you know, conscious uncoupling, whatever you call it, like sometimes is the best solution. 00:09:23.840 --> 00:09:26.080 And it is the route that our lives are meant to take. 00:09:26.240 --> 00:09:31.360 But I I love what you said about people don't consider all the options. 00:09:31.440 --> 00:09:33.039 And I do think that's true. 00:09:33.200 --> 00:09:37.279 You know, I I think that marriage is extremely tough. 00:09:37.360 --> 00:09:38.720 And my wife would say the same thing. 00:09:38.879 --> 00:09:45.679 And you get to this place where you feel like you've tried everything, and that's when you feel like you're at the end of your rope, right? 00:09:45.759 --> 00:09:49.120 You feel like I've tried it all before and it hasn't worked. 00:09:49.279 --> 00:09:53.600 And so now my only option is to is to go, right? 00:09:53.919 --> 00:10:09.440 And I feel like you when we reach that point, a lot of times we are leaving an option on the table, which is okay, the way it is now doesn't work for me, but that doesn't mean that that's the way it's always going to be. 00:10:09.519 --> 00:10:11.440 The question is, what can I get? 00:10:11.600 --> 00:10:17.919 What can I do in order to change the way it is now in order to allow it to be something else? 00:10:18.240 --> 00:10:25.600 And we so I I founded an app called Godmother, um, but the the parent company is actually called Angelic. 00:10:25.919 --> 00:10:30.159 And we exist in the world of relational intelligence. 00:10:30.480 --> 00:10:38.720 And the first, the first I call it my Marvel universe, um, which I don't I don't know if I get sued for quoting that. 00:10:39.120 --> 00:10:44.320 It's like our Marvel universe, you know, Angelic and Godmother is like Thor. 00:10:44.559 --> 00:10:51.759 It's a parenting platform to help parents understand their kids, but we're actually creating all of the different kinds of Marvel Avengers. 00:10:51.919 --> 00:10:57.440 And there's going to be one that is for personal growth, there's going to be one for dating, there's going to be one for marriages. 00:10:57.759 --> 00:11:09.919 The the underlying thesis of all of that, and um I'm writing my TEDx talk, and and the the one of the slogans is that understanding creates possibility. 00:11:10.720 --> 00:11:21.840 And I think that what happens is in a marriage, we don't, because like you just said, we get married when we're young, we haven't figured ourselves out necessarily. 00:11:22.000 --> 00:11:25.039 We don't always understand who we are, number one. 00:11:25.279 --> 00:11:29.039 And number two, we don't always understand who our spouse is. 00:11:29.440 --> 00:11:35.279 And I am aware of like how simplistic that sounds. 00:11:35.440 --> 00:11:38.960 I'm sure there are listeners who will be like, yeah, yeah, yeah, of course I understand my spouse. 00:11:39.039 --> 00:11:58.399 But like anyone who's been married for a while has had those truly humbling moments of like having an interaction with their spouse where if they can they they sit back and there's an interaction, they're like, holy shoot, I really still don't understand how his or brain, his or her brain works. 00:11:58.559 --> 00:12:01.440 Uh, I had this moment just the other day with with my wife. 00:12:01.600 --> 00:12:03.519 We were um, there was an issue. 00:12:03.600 --> 00:12:10.799 Uh, it was get back, it was going back to school week, and there was an issue with one of the kids that they didn't have the supplies they needed. 00:12:11.039 --> 00:12:16.000 And I, this is not a male-female thing, this is just a David, how David deals with stress and pressure. 00:12:16.159 --> 00:12:21.360 I I I came up with a solution in 30 seconds of how we can super easily solve this. 00:12:21.600 --> 00:12:21.919 Yeah. 00:12:22.159 --> 00:12:33.679 And I only realized, Cameron, like 45 minutes later, that like she was still going over and over this problem and like what was gonna happen if this and what was gonna happen if that. 00:12:33.759 --> 00:12:35.600 And I had already completely dismissed it. 00:12:35.840 --> 00:12:41.679 Now, you don't need examples, your your listeners don't need more examples of male versus female brain. 00:12:41.759 --> 00:12:42.320 That's not the point. 00:12:42.399 --> 00:12:54.080 The point is that my wife and I have been married for 12 years, and in spite of that, even though I think I understand her, it's so easy to forget how the other person operates. 00:12:54.480 --> 00:13:06.399 And so going full circle to answer your question, I do agree that people don't have that, they leave that option off the table, which is understanding creates possibility. 00:13:06.559 --> 00:13:20.720 If I can truly understand who I am, first of all, and understand who my spouse is, then and only then can I really discover can this

marriage actually last? 00:13:20.879 --> 00:13:23.360 And I think too often we're just like, nope, it can't last. 00:13:23.440 --> 00:13:25.759 I've tried everything, it's gone, you know, take it off the table. 00:13:25.919 --> 00:13:41.840 I love that that is your slogan because for me, connection is one of my really big points that I'm super passionate about because I believe that connection is something that we are constantly looking for. 00:13:42.159 --> 00:13:49.039 And in the relationship, like if you're coming from an egocentric place, that's gonna drive connection away. 00:13:49.360 --> 00:14:00.639 Whereas if you are trying to understand and you are listening to understand, not just to respond, then that's like you're so right. 00:14:00.879 --> 00:14:12.559 The understanding is what creates the possibilities, the possibilities for connection, the possibilities for growth, the possibilities to actually hear and see and understand each other. 00:14:12.720 --> 00:14:14.159 It's so needed. 00:14:14.399 --> 00:14:18.559 And when we get down to the core root of problems, I think that's what's missing. 00:14:18.799 --> 00:14:20.159 I agree with that, the understanding. 00:14:20.240 --> 00:14:30.480 And I so I use the taught framework, T-A-U-T, um, for relationships, with this, which is tolerance, acceptance, understanding, treasure. 00:14:30.720 --> 00:14:40.399 And the tolerance piece in relationships, that's funny because uh, for the most part, when we see someone that we romantically like, uh we skip past the tolerance like altogether, right? 00:14:40.480 --> 00:14:41.440 We we tolerate everything. 00:14:41.519 --> 00:14:44.240 And it's funny, you know, the way she sneezes is hilarious. 00:14:44.399 --> 00:14:46.240 The way she leaves her, it's like ha ha ha. 00:14:46.320 --> 00:14:49.200 It's like, you know, we we tolerate, we go straight to acceptance. 00:14:49.279 --> 00:14:51.200 I I like you, and so I accept you. 00:14:51.360 --> 00:14:57.120 And all your three years down the road, and then everything that was cute is no longer so cute. 00:14:58.240 --> 00:14:59.440 It's so true. 00:14:59.600 --> 00:15:00.799 We go backwards, right? 00:15:00.879 --> 00:15:08.799 We go back from the from the A back to the T, but we we go from that A to then the understanding, which is what you we were just talking about. 00:15:08.879 --> 00:15:21.919 That to understand why my spouse, you know, in our app godmother, why my child, why my co-parent, why I act the way I do, and truly understand where we're coming from, right? 00:15:22.080 --> 00:15:24.480 It's uh it's more than just an accept. 00:15:24.639 --> 00:15:27.519 It's not just like, okay, I accept that's who my spouse is. 00:15:27.600 --> 00:15:29.919 She, she, you know, she's stressful. 00:15:30.000 --> 00:15:34.480 It's to understand what makes her actually get to that point. 00:15:34.879 --> 00:15:45.279 But the step beyond, the, the, the bridge, if you will, uh, the invitation to the other chasm is to then actually treasure that which makes the spouse different. 00:15:45.519 --> 00:15:50.720 I use the example a lot of of uh music because I'm a failed musician. 00:15:50.879 --> 00:16:03.919 Um, and I I joke that um I played trumpet, trombone, piano, and I always wanted to play the drums, but my mom wouldn't let me play the drums because she was scared of how it would turn out, and I feel like I turned out that way anyway. 00:16:04.080 --> 00:16:13.120 Um, but in music, in music, two notes, you you can't have harmony without two different notes. 00:16:13.440 --> 00:16:24.399 And we often, we often confuse, this is my favorite, we often confuse unity with uniformity, and it's not the same thing. 00:16:24.720 --> 00:16:37.279 So much of the problems that we have in our world, whether it's countries fighting against each other, political parties, marriages, parents to child, it's because we see the other and we want that other person to be like us. 00:16:37.440 --> 00:16:38.879 But that's not harmony. 00:16:39.039 --> 00:16:42.480 That's just that's just one note that's playing louder and louder. 00:16:42.559 --> 00:16:58.720 And so to build off of our last point, which is where we're talking about understanding, the the beautiful places where you get to that point of treasuring, of truly treasuring what it is that makes that other person different, that makes them who they are. 00:16:58.960 --> 00:17:01.360 And I'll, you know, going full circle. 00:17:01.440 --> 00:17:04.480 I like I said, I do believe that some marriages aren't meant to last. 00:17:04.559 --> 00:17:13.119 I I do believe that, you know, that some paths are meant to separate, that you, you know, you get on the train and and some people are there for the whole ride and some people are there for a couple of stops. 00:17:13.200 --> 00:17:14.079 I believe all of that. 00:17:14.240 --> 00:17:25.279 But you can only make that adequate assessment if you've reached that point of truly treasuring who that person is in front of you, treasuring what it is that makes them different. 00:17:25.359 --> 00:17:29.599 And then you can always say, okay, I treasure you and I choose not to continue with you. 00:17:29.680 --> 00:17:30.240 That's okay. 00:17:30.319 --> 00:17:31.599 You know, there are different harmonies. 00:17:31.680 --> 00:17:34.960 There's C and E harmony, there's G and A harmony. 00:17:35.039 --> 00:17:44.400 You know, it's it's uh but if you don't reach that point of truly treasuring, then like you said, there's an option that gets left on the table that we never really explore. 00:17:46.400 --> 00:17:56.240 I want to dig into acceptance and treasure more because in my line of work of helping couples, usually they come to me when they are struggling. 00:17:56.640 --> 00:18:02.160 When they're at the point where they're like, okay, do we get off this train and find a new train, or do what do we do? 00:18:02.240 --> 00:18:04.240 Do we rebuild from the ground up?

00:18:04.400 --> 00:18:05.359 What what where are we at? 00:18:05.440 --> 00:18:06.160 What are we doing? 00:18:06.799 --> 00:18:16.480 And at that point, there's so much negativity that they're just focused only on the negatives that their partner does. 00:18:16.640 --> 00:18:21.200 They're not truly like there isn't an unconditional acceptance. 00:18:21.440 --> 00:18:23.039 Everything has conditions with it. 00:18:23.200 --> 00:18:30.799 Love, respect, honor, all of it has conditions, but also seeing their partner as a treasure. 00:18:30.880 --> 00:18:53.599 And this is another reason that I I I absolutely love what I do because watching these couples go from not even close to seeing each other as a treasure, completely to taking advantage of them and taking them for granted, to watching them start that process of, oh, I actually do like this person. 00:18:53.759 --> 00:18:57.440 I do see the advantage of having them, I do see them as a treasure. 00:18:57.680 --> 00:19:07.599 Talk a little bit about that and and how you help men get to that point because for the acceptance and the treasury, because these are really important points. 00:19:08.240 --> 00:19:09.039 It's so hard. 00:19:09.119 --> 00:19:09.519 You're right. 00:19:09.599 --> 00:19:24.960 And you reach that point where there's so much baggage, you know, there's so much history, there's so much like um conditions, and it's like you you try to talk about any one point, and the other person brings up 16 examples from the past, and then you bring up another, and it just escalates. 00:19:25.039 --> 00:19:26.160 And you know, I get that. 00:19:26.240 --> 00:19:32.480 And it's hard because you don't even have a starting point from which to which to build off of. 00:19:32.799 --> 00:19:37.759 I so the the invitation that I make to people, and it's actually one of the reasons. 00:19:37.839 --> 00:19:44.319 So when we build Angelic, you know, our goal it's more than an app, it's really a movement, Cameron. 00:19:44.559 --> 00:19:51.039 It's a movement of those who believe that that relationships built on understanding could can can change the world, right? 00:19:51.440 --> 00:19:54.640 And we purposely didn't start with the marriage app. 00:19:54.799 --> 00:19:59.200 We didn't, we with the marriage relationship because to your point, it's so nuanced. 00:19:59.359 --> 00:20:12.079 And we purposely didn't start with the kind of the relationship with ourselves because that also takes a lot of it just takes a lot to kind of get there and and have have um the right foundation to start it. 00:20:12.160 --> 00:20:16.319 We started with parenting in order to achieve one thing. 00:20:16.559 --> 00:20:17.839 So I'm a rock climber. 00:20:18.000 --> 00:20:18.799 Well, I used to be. 00:20:18.880 --> 00:20:20.880 I I guess I I was joking. 00:20:21.039 --> 00:20:26.880 I don't know how many times you have to rock climb in a certain period of time to consider yourself a rock climber, but I I do enjoy rock climbing. 00:20:26.960 --> 00:20:27.680 How's that? 00:20:27.920 --> 00:20:39.839 And you know, I there's this there was this one time when I was rock climbing in the Alps with a friend, and it's a long story, and I'll keep it short because I know we don't have a ton of time, but long story short, my friend almost died. 00:20:40.000 --> 00:20:43.920 And, you know, it was one of those Hollywood moments where he slipped. 00:20:44.000 --> 00:20:53.519 I happened to be reaching down, caught him by his hands, his feet slipped out, and you know, and we're stuck on this rock face, you know, trying to get up the mountain. 00:20:53.839 --> 00:20:59.599 And we were so close to the top, it was, it was, you know, the top was literally visible. 00:20:59.680 --> 00:21:06.799 But when you're when you're on a rock face, it doesn't matter how close the top is, if there's no nothing to grab. 00:21:07.039 --> 00:21:13.839 And I stood there for literally a good 25 minutes with no place to put my hands. 00:21:14.079 --> 00:21:22.880 And what you're describing when in in the marriage, and when we get to that point, is a little bit like being on that rock face, but with no holds to grab onto. 00:21:22.960 --> 00:21:25.759 There, there's nothing to grab to even start to climb. 00:21:26.240 --> 00:21:32.720 The single most important hold, in my opinion, is the hold of openness. 00:21:32.960 --> 00:21:45.440 And that's why we started with parenting as an app, because when you do the assessments, we created a proprietary assessment that will assess your children and give a full understanding of who your child is. 00:21:45.680 --> 00:21:51.359 It shows you very simply that your child is not you. 00:21:52.559 --> 00:21:59.759 And if you can get that tiny little spark of openness to realize that maybe you don't. 00:22:00.240 --> 00:22:02.799 understand your child as well as you think you do. 00:22:02.960 --> 00:22:14.079 And that's something that for a lot of us is easier with a child because we're we're, you know, children can, they can, they can hate us, they can hit us, they can swear at us, they can do all the things that a spouse would do, but we give a child a little bit more grace, right? 00:22:14.160 --> 00:22:15.839 Because we're a parent and we have this. 00:22:16.319 --> 00:22:36.000 So if when we do this assessment, when we use our platform, if we can just get to that space of a tiny bit of openness to recognize maybe my, maybe I don't understand my child the way I think I do, once you make that that tiny little step, it's a quantum leap to openness about yourself. 00:22:36.319 --> 00:22:40.559 Maybe I maybe I actually don't understand myself as well as I think I do. 00:22:40.720 --> 00:22:45.519 Oh, maybe I don't understand my spouse as well as I think I do. 00:22:45.680 --> 00:22:54.319 You know, maybe maybe I'm interpreting all of these things that have happened in the wrong way or in a different way than he or she would. 00:22:54.480 --> 00:23:10.240 And so I

think that that's the invitation that I make to people when we get into that that that place of you know bitterness and so much history and so much pain is can I can I just get you to have a glimmer of openness? 00:23:10.480 --> 00:23:10.640 Yeah. 00:23:10.799 --> 00:23:13.279 And open not even not even that the marriage is going to work out. 00:23:13.359 --> 00:23:14.960 Forget that we're not even talking about that. 00:23:15.039 --> 00:23:19.599 We're not even saying that that this person is right that the this is going to be happiness. 00:23:19.839 --> 00:23:47.599 I just invite you to openness to say if you can just be open to see things a little bit differently than you've always seen them now you've got a a a hold on that rock face and and the possibility to climb that's incredible I think everything could be solved if people just had more of an open heart but again we let that ego get in the way. 00:23:48.400 --> 00:23:58.559 It's hard crazy it's hard you know and yeah I don't I don't blame us humans because that's how we've survived right I mean it there there's survival techniques. 00:23:58.640 --> 00:24:16.079 It's it's like you like I said you go to interview for that first job and you you know puff up your chest a little bit more than you normally would and you come in and say hey I'm great at this and then you know it's hard to then go back and say actually I'm not as great at that as I thought I was or as I said I was right it's it's ego it but it's helped us survive in some ways. 00:24:16.160 --> 00:24:35.759 It's helped us perform and yeah to your point it's it's very difficult to strip that away um which is what you talk about so often you know being showing up as your authentic self as well and not being afraid to you know to be vulnerable and and recognize that I think it's um I think it's huge, you know it is because that's the only way that you can have emotional intimacy. 00:24:36.160 --> 00:24:44.960 And and that is I mean we all want to be loved but you can't be loved unless you're known and you can't be known unless you're vulnerable. 00:24:45.119 --> 00:24:50.400 And so having that humility to open yourself up and and talk about that is huge. 00:24:50.480 --> 00:24:54.960 And it's the polar opposite of what most men have been taught for their entire lives. 00:24:55.359 --> 00:25:09.759 And so um and it and it's what allows women to love our men so much deeper when they are vulnerable and when they are you know open with us and and able to have those conversations. 00:25:10.079 --> 00:25:22.240 What would you say in coaching men is the most common piece of advice or common issue that they face that you're always helping them with I would I would say it's probably the I've tried that and it didn't work. 00:25:23.839 --> 00:25:30.880 It's sort of the frustration the feeling like they've tried different things over and over and they're mine and it different didn't work. 00:25:31.039 --> 00:25:40.559 It's like I've tried sharing how I feel with her and she doesn't understand or you know I've tried to um I've tried to do something for her and it just doesn't it just falls short. 00:25:41.440 --> 00:25:55.039 And I think as a guy you know you whether it's testosterone or you know male energy whatever you call it like we're we're used to giving something a go but we'll also we'll also get frustrated if we're trying something and it doesn't work. 00:25:55.200 --> 00:25:55.519 Right? 00:25:55.599 --> 00:26:14.559 It it's it's it annoys us you know whether we're trying to fix a lawnmower which I'm terrible at or you know hang something on a wall like if we're just going to keep doing the same thing over and over eventually we lose it and we put the hammer through the wall like it's you know it's it and so I think the frustration a lot of guys come up with is I've tried something and it doesn't work. 00:26:14.720 --> 00:26:34.480 You know I I I tried to be romantic with her what we consider romantic right and that's the thing like we're all trying in as much as we see the ability to try and and that's that's often the the disconnect in so many relationships is that what I am trying to communicate is not the way you need it communicated. 00:26:34.720 --> 00:26:36.160 And that's the that's the impasse. 00:26:36.319 --> 00:26:39.440 Half the time it's not even that you know we don't care about each other. 00:26:39.599 --> 00:26:43.039 It's just that we're using the wrong language we're speaking to each other in other languages. 00:26:43.200 --> 00:27:02.079 And so I think that's a frustrating thing for guys is you know and I it's funny social media has probably done a lot of harm in the world but I think one of the things that it's done that that has been healthy about it is that it shows how prevalent certain behavior traits are across all couples everywhere. 00:27:02.240 --> 00:28:04.480 You know and God bless the comedians uh my wife and I always comment you know the our favorite pastime not favorite pastime but one of our favorite pastimes is you'll watch a video on on um on on Instagram or TikTok and then you go read the comments and oh my god Cameron like the the the collective humor of our civilization like we are humans are hysterical like I I I I love it you know but God bless the God bless all those who make light of relationships too and you know the jokes about the guy saying what do you want you know what do you want where where do you want to go for dinner and the wife's like oh I don't really care we can go anywhere he's like okay well let's go here and she's like I don't like that and he's like oh let's go here I don't want to go there you know and like every guy has been there right and and and on the one hand you like ha that's so funny on the other hand it's so freaking frustrating but it's also so therapeutic to realize that that is just a common issue of man and woman or you know different different um different mentalities blending together.

00:28:04.720 --> 00:28:11.759 So I think that's probably the hardest thing is that a guy feels like I'm actually trying to do this right and I keep getting it wrong. 00:28:12.240 --> 00:28:30.000 And that's where I also invite them to the openness to say, okay, are you open to considering that maybe you're just not trying in the right way that it's not about putting more effort necessarily it's about changing the strategy because the definition of insanity is to continue to do the same thing over and over and expect a different result. 00:28:30.720 --> 00:28:31.440 That's true. 00:28:32.160 --> 00:28:32.559 Yeah. 00:28:32.799 --> 00:28:34.000 So I think that that is it. 00:28:34.079 --> 00:28:39.599 You know it's it's that frustration and then inviting them to open and possibly a different approach in what they're doing. 00:28:40.319 --> 00:28:57.680 Okay so your advice for men is to be more open what would your advice for women be so that they can actually help their husbands not be so frustrated to say that I want them to be open too. 00:28:58.000 --> 00:29:00.880 So what does that look like in in realistic terms? 00:29:01.039 --> 00:29:26.880 Like let's use the restaurant example like women need to give three examples of I'm open to Thai, Mexican or Italian which one works for you something along those lines I think that's a perfect example is that you know as much as the man jokes about it and says oh yeah this is so funny and we see it all over social media like a woman who is open as well or spouse who's open as well has to realize that that's actually something that's frustrating. 00:29:27.039 --> 00:29:34.319 You know my my wife is incredibly good now at realizing the type of things that frustrate me. 00:29:34.400 --> 00:29:51.440 And and like that's powerful and it's not insignificant, Cameron, because those are the things that you know those are the things that build up and so it really is, you know, I talk a lot about the dance of relationships is that when when you're learning to dance with somebody, you inevitably step on each other's feet, right? 00:29:51.599 --> 00:29:57.920 But the more that you dance together the more you learn where to place your foot in order to not step on the other person. 00:29:58.240 --> 00:30:01.680 And I'm careful to say that's not about eggshells. 00:30:01.759 --> 00:30:08.559 It's not about not showing up authentically that's just being aware of what actually bothers the other person. 00:30:08.720 --> 00:30:14.799 You know I think it's common that the stereotype of of men is that oh they're just chill and nothing bothers them. 00:30:15.039 --> 00:30:15.759 That's not true. 00:30:15.920 --> 00:30:22.400 I mean there's a lot of things that there's a lot of things that bother guys it's more just like it's not worth the fight for us. 00:30:22.559 --> 00:30:23.200 You know what I mean? 00:30:23.359 --> 00:30:40.240 Like when you're when you're thinking every day how do I provide for my family and you've got

the stress of it and you know huge one I think there's a rise in emotionally intelligent dads like I I I struggle every day wondering if I'm being there enough for my kids and I built a freaking parenting app. 00:30:40.319 --> 00:30:44.960 Like I, you know I try to do this stuff every day but so dads feel pressure too. 00:30:45.119 --> 00:31:00.160 It's just that we compartmentalize we move on because we have to we show up and so this this idea that like oh he just wants to sit on the couch and and drink a beer and watch sports is that true yeah because it's a safe it's a it's an easy spot for us. 00:31:00.240 --> 00:31:02.400 It's a place where we don't have to deal with it. 00:31:02.640 --> 00:31:17.119 And so I think getting past you know that inviting women to the same openness to understand that my my husband does have demons that he fights he does have you know he does have things that really drive him absolutely insane. 00:31:17.359 --> 00:31:29.200 And you may think it's not a big deal to to actually say what restaurant you go to but I guarantee you he will move heaven and earth to get to whatever restaurant if you just flip and tell him what one you want to go to. 00:31:29.279 --> 00:31:45.839 You know, it makes it that much easier okay I want to dig into this because this is really important and I think that we have an absolute gold mine from a woman's perspective and for the woman who is listening I think one of the the most common phrases or the common go-tos is he just doesn't care. 00:31:46.160 --> 00:31:46.960 He just doesn't care. 00:31:47.440 --> 00:32:12.799 And it's not true I feel like men do care but because that is the default setting of let's just go to what's easiest that bottleneck of you're shoving more and more and more in eventually it's gonna explode so like give some advice here on how to work together so that we as women don't have that happen for our husbands. 00:32:13.359 --> 00:32:26.640 And I understand that a lot of it is keeping staying open but specifically how do we know that our husband cares when it seems like he doesn't when maybe the words and the actions aren't matching out. 00:32:26.799 --> 00:32:38.960 How do we support him in that yeah it's tough and I so I guess I'm I'm one of those who cares very much because I care about a lot of things and I you know I have strong feelings about a lot of things. 00:32:39.039 --> 00:32:48.640 I this is gonna sound really stupid but one of the things that I credit my wife for the most is that she has never given up on us. 00:32:48.799 --> 00:32:51.680 You know in in all of our difficult times. 00:32:51.920 --> 00:33:01.839 So men you're right we'll either bottle it up until we explode or we bottle up until we're so numb that we really truly don't care because it's just it's just not it's not worth the pain to us. 00:33:01.920 --> 00:33:19.039 It's not worth the the amount of stress it's easier for me to just go along because I don't frankly want to like have an argument about this or I don't want you to get upset about you know I I can put the dishes in the dishwasher the way that I think is right, but if it pisses you off every time it doesn't matter that it's right anymore. 00:33:19.119 --> 00:33:20.880 I'm just gonna do it because it's not worth it. 00:33:21.039 --> 00:33:21.279 Right. 00:33:21.440 --> 00:33:36.400 So it's not a it's not a not caring as much as a numbing but I am so blessed by by my wife because she has kept up what I would almost um classify as silly things. 00:33:36.640 --> 00:34:04.160 Like we still play these relationship uh games like all the time and it's like these card it they're I can't call them dumb because the creators you know God bless them they did a great job but like these card games and we have probably like 10 different ones in the cupboard that we'll bring out every once in a while we'll bring to a date and I I kid you not Cameron they're like the stupidest questions that like you assume you already know about your spouse. 00:34:04.799 --> 00:34:15.840 And again I not to harp on the openness thing but it goes back to things like if you you know I don't know whatever uh if you had a night out by yourself to do anything you want what would you do? 00:34:16.000 --> 00:34:22.480 And you think you know what your spouse would say but it keeps that spirit of kind of curiosity of kind of openness. 00:34:22.639 --> 00:34:40.960 So if you want a super practical thing, you know and that's helped us so much is these silly little relationship games because what it really means is that we are not we're not resigning ourselves to say I already know who you are and I've put you in this box. 00:34:41.199 --> 00:35:00.639 And whether it's whether it's these card games that are about our sex life whether it's about like our hobbies whether it's about our interests whether it's like there are so many things for someone who I've been with for 12 years or we've been together longer but married that long like you think you know everything about and then you get these cards and you're like wow I I never even thought to ask you that. 00:35:01.119 --> 00:35:05.519 And so you know to answer your question I think there's a curiosity piece. 00:35:05.599 --> 00:35:09.199 I think that women tend to be very good at taking the lead on that type of stuff. 00:35:09.280 --> 00:35:25.280 And yeah will a guy roll his eyes if she pulls out the you know the deck of cards and starts to ask questions maybe but he'll probably go along with it mostly because he you know at the in the moment he's like I and that's the way that she can kind of really show that curiosity can kind of continue to learn who he is. 00:35:25.440 --> 00:35:43.599 Now I think everything we're saying is caveated with like I said some relationships aren't meant to work out there's got it's got to be a two-way street but you've got to take those steps and I think that's a really powerful for woman is to really be curious about your

husband really try to understand he sometimes just doesn't know how to articulate things. 00:35:43.760 --> 00:35:51.119 You know it's and there's nobody to blame for that but I can tell you sometimes that's just the male female dynamic. 00:35:51.280 --> 00:35:56.159 I can tell you that sometimes there's things that I've tried to articulate which she's misunderstood. 00:35:56.239 --> 00:36:34.559 And after that I'm like screw this I'm not gonna articulate that anymore because I don't want to cause a you know I don't want to cause an issue right um we'll joke about this sometimes you know like my wife and I like if we see a if she sees like an attractive guy on the beach she'll often say oh wow he's a really good looking guy right totally fine I'll be like oh yeah I agree you know great looking guy look at those muscles looks great I would never say the same about a woman who walks by that's fun that's funny right that's funny and and maybe that's something we need to work on but it's all there's also a reality to that there's a there's a psychological component you know it or maybe that's just our relationship. 00:36:34.719 --> 00:36:46.880 But there is an element and so that that's a perfect example of where a guy may not say as much what he feels because in the past you know it was misinterpreted or in a guy's brain. 00:36:47.119 --> 00:37:31.039 And so back to your kind of you know your point about that baggage when you can keep that openness to kind of really rediscover and say oh like hey you know I I want to know what your whatever um what your favorite food is what's your favorite memory of your dad or you know uh uh what's one thing you would regret and then you start to continue to learn about each other and take it off of what it's been up until now and allow it to become something something new and greater and different makes sense makes sense okay talk about this app as we wrap up here so you've created it for parenting dating and marriage is it ready to download it is ready to download but we only have the parenting version available so far. 00:37:31.280 --> 00:38:08.480 So you can download it so it's not not exactly for although yes if any of your listeners are parents obviously they can download it's called uh Godmother yeah so go uh it's on the app store godmotherorangelic.net a-i-n-g-e-l-i-c dot net the idea behind it was it's hard for us to get to know another person it's hard for us to get to know ourselves and so we wanted to create this kind of proprietary assessment that gave a really deep understanding into who your children are and then give you real-time advice into how to deal with situations. 00:38:08.639 --> 00:38:15.599 I'm a dad of three kids I used to think it'd be enough to love my kids I realized if I don't understand them I I can't love them. 00:38:15.840 --> 00:38:20.960 I mean I can but I'm I'm gonna love them you can't love them if you don't love them. 00:38:21.199 --> 00:38:45.039 Yeah yes so how how old does

your child have to be in order to like really understand or fill out the Yeah we recommend starting at five years old four or five years old because that's when you can kind of see you know and kind of really test and understand your child's test uh temperament and then the whole concept is as a parent you're gonna run into situations that you want to address differently based on who your child is. 00:38:45.199 --> 00:38:49.519 We've actually built it in such a way so it it hypothetically actually can be used for marriages already. 00:38:49.599 --> 00:39:06.960 We're just gonna make it more streamlined but um I did testing for myself as a dad I did testing for my wife and so we actually also see how each of our children's personalities contrasts or jives with us and also how our parenting styles kind of clash or or together. 00:39:07.039 --> 00:39:13.760 So it's a whole family kind of relational ecosystem and um and then we'll build out we're building out the the the marriage component of that too. 00:39:13.920 --> 00:39:25.840 But based on this concept that if you want to get real time advice into how to deal with any situation that you go through with your kids or in your family it's got to be based on an understanding of kind of who they are. 00:39:26.000 --> 00:39:30.800 So angelic.net and happy to yeah happy to chat with anybody about that because I'm I'm passionate. 00:39:31.039 --> 00:39:36.800 Yeah no we'll have all of those links in the show notes for for listeners to go ahead and download it and everything. 00:39:36.960 --> 00:40:35.840 And then you also coach men I do yes I do a lot of uh personal coaching as well so um can certainly reach out um davidyp.com is my um my personal website for anybody that wants to wants to reach out um it's something I've been very very very passionate about we will have all of those links in the show notes for people to to check out David this has been amazing thank you so much for being here I love this conversation and I have no doubt that listeners have gotten so much out of this so thank you so much I really appreciate it thank you cameron thanks for you know inspiring hope in people uh I think we get to those spots in relationships when they're difficult where it's easy to lose hope and I think what you do is tell people hey there's still hope uh so don't don't don't give up yet um there may be options on the table so thanks so much yeah absolutely what are you feeding your mind right now if it's social media are you tired of doom scrolling through the angry comment sections and political rants yet? 00:40:36.079 --> 00:40:38.800 What if you use that time to actually fix your marriage? 00:40:38.960 --> 00:40:47.280 Welcome to the free married and connected school community it's like social media but without the ads, without the judgment and without the noise. 00:40:47.440 --> 00:40:51.920 Just real self-paced tools that get you out of that roommate phase starting today. 00:40:52.159 --> 00:40:56.480 Inside you get an exact blueprint for a weekly State of the Union meeting with your spouse. 00:40:56.639 --> 00:41:04.320 We're cutting mental load we're stopping miscommunications and we're breaking that exhausting loop of doom argument once and for all. 00:41:04.559 --> 00:41:10.960 Plus you get instant access to workshops on overcoming resentment and bringing the actual fun back into your marriage. 00:41:11.199 --> 00:41:32.800 We have a dedicated space just for guys jumping into forging fortitude to 10 week intensive to help you step into your masculine leadership and become the husband and man that God called you to be and for ladies joining Edifying Eden we're stepping out of that controlling nagging era into our soft nurturing feminine era even if your husband hasn't taken the reins yet. 00:41:33.039 --> 00:41:36.480 Either way you can take responsibility for your side of the street. 00:41:36.719 --> 00:41:40.159 Stop scrolling the internet and start investing in your home. 00:41:40.400 --> 00:41:44.079 Click the link in the show notes and join the Married and connected school community today. 00:41:44.159 --> 00:41:50.480 I'll see you inside this podcast is for educational purposes only and is not a substitute for professional counseling or therapy. 00:41:50.639 --> 00:41:53.920 Every couple story is unique so take what's helpful and leave the rest. 00:41:54.079 --> 00:42:04.639 By listening to this podcast you acknowledge that neither I, Cameron Thompson Alaricie, married and connected or recognizing potential coaching are responsible for any outcomes related to what you apply from this show. 00:42:04.880 --> 00:42:06.960 Especially if you are not a client of mine.