התמלול המלא של What should Middle School and High School Really look like? A conversation with Shannon Vigil and Emily Johnson

labor, Rural farming and today those don't even crack the top 100 of employers in our country and especially of careers that are High demand fields and yet education hasn't adapted at all. We're taking the exact same classes. We're still reading the exact same textbooks. And while there is a place for that, and I'm not dismissing the need for high school to offer classical education, there's an and, right? Yeah. It's like we need to provide that classical care. Education and we need to offer things that make kids today understand the why, because if we don't tell kids why you're doing something or how is this relevant to you? It's very challenging to teach today, but when you give them the why and when you make it relevant, all of a sudden you've got the best classroom. Absolutely. Your point's a good one because as we think about the world that our kids live in and navigate now and the industries and the careers and the professions they're going to have. It is a very different dynamic than what you or I or our parents and grandparents did. So as logic would say to us, we do need to think differently about what our kids experiences are. And as we started doing some of the high school reimagined work, we started thinking about things like durable skills. And while that's a little bit of an interesting terminology that we've had to define for people, really it comes down to Recognizing that around the country, there have been organizations that have looked at job postings, you know, job descriptions that Specifically call for discrete skill sets. And over time, when they look at, you know, millions of jobs and are able to distill that down to say, What are the skills that everybody needs? You know, there's a small handful of those skills that show up in every single field. And those are those durable skills. And so as we think about things like critical thinking and communication and creativity and leadership and some of those pieces, You can see where your grandmother and you and your daughter would all need those skills, those sort of age over time and stay durable, so to speak, thus the name. So How have you and your staff engaged in conversations around how you use the durable skills, how those show up in the student experience and how you're making those really relevant and exciting for kids? So we've spoken with our academic leadership team about really leaning into four durable skills. So we're focused on collaboration, communication, critical thinking, and leadership, and really pushing Our teachers to talk about how they are teaching those things, that those are the takeaways. That's what you're going to offer employers, whether you're going to use stoichiometry or not. You, you're going to use communication, you're going to use collaboration. And so being really upfront and honest with our high school students about, hey, not every single thing you learn in high school is going to 100% transfer to your work or your career field. But the reality is those durable skills are. And so we've really been speaking with our academic leadership team about giving the teachers the time and the permission To consciously put those into their lesson plans and talk about like, Kate, today when, when we're working on this, I really want to see some leaders step up in their group. Just talking about leadership, talking about what it looks like. And calling those things out because if we're talking about durable skills, we're also creating relevancy in the classroom. Yeah, you're right. And I'm glad you mentioned those four because those have been the four that continue to rise to the top and continue to be the ones that we talk about the most as research would tell us. They are ten times more likely to show up in a job description in any field. And so recognizing that those are probably what we would consider sort of the power durable skills. That our kids need. I was in a high school classroom just the other day watching a group of students examine different articles that have been published about current events and things happening in our world and they were looking for bias. And in it, kids kept bringing up that the requirement to use their critical thinking skills and pointing back to that's their durable skill of the week that they were focused on. So we know that our kids are making those connections. And it makes sense to them right to really make that relevant and make that exciting for them. I think part of the same work that we're doing alongside our high school work is trying to bring that same relevancy to life in in middle school. And last year, in fact, in the spring, child development experts from Children's Hospital joined our middle school team, our middle school leadership team, our principals, and many of our district leaders to talk about brain growth at the middle level. We were talking about You know, how do we approach middle school and how do we ensure that our middle school students get the opportunity to also learn with those real world relevant opportunities and. Um, it was pretty powerful when it was shared with us that the amount that the brain develops in middle school is Equates very similarly to birth to two. And as we think about that, that's huge. When we think about From the time a child is born to two, how much they learn and how much development happens. And then we think about that sixth, seventh and eighth grade experience in the same thing. That just is fascinating. And I think it. It sort of put us all back on our heels in realizing what a powerful experience middle school can be for our students. Thus, really having us begin to think about middle school differently And starting to coin the phrase, the magic of middle school rather than, oh, we have to get through middle school. And many of us have heard. If you go to any, you know, dinner party, you go out with friends, you know, you'll hear people lament the idea of having gotten through middle school

and sixth, seventh and eighth grade and adolescent. And, and, you know, for me, I, I, I struggle with that because that's my favorite, favorite, favorite grades to teach. I had such a great time working with sixth, seventh, and eighth graders. The energy and the excitement for learning while they're becoming the young adults that they're going to be. Makes it such a fascinating time. Emily, talk a little bit about what that experience When we all came together and really looked at the magic of middle school and learned about that brain research, how did you go back and sort of share that with your staff? And how did you... Begin to make that a part of the work that you were, you were really thinking you wanted to do at Carmody. Yeah. I totally agree. I think my middle school experience was some of the best times for me. And I think it, I think back to the why and, and one thing that they said, the doctor said is the middle school brain is pruning all of those things that they had to do. Their brain had to use when they were in elementary but now they're developing new pathways and those new pathways in middle school we need to see those as assets and how do we capitalize on those new pathways of We don't need to hold their hand. We need to provide them choice to get them to high school, essentially. And so we had to take a step back and be like, we've done the same thing for twenty years. We put... A worksheet in front of them. We ask them to do the worksheet. We give them feedback at the end and then they go to their next class and get the same kind of traditional learning. And so at the Magic of Middle School retreat, we all took a step back and especially me and I said, What do we really need to, to provide to our middle school brain that allows them to be engaged, that allows them to feel like they belong? And not only belong social, emotionally, but academically. And so some of the work that we started in spring that we've gone full on this year is providing A more focused curriculum, so a high quality curriculum that is grade level that all students can engage in, but within that curriculum we are really looking at That choice within this curriculum, what do you think is the right way to solve this problem? We're not telling them the answer, they're grappling in it. And so something we've talked a lot about this year is the learning pit. So that we want our middle schoolers to fall into that learning pit and to be okay with struggle and to be okay taking risks. And then we are more of facilitators of learning where we're helping them Get out of that learning pit, but we're not just telling them how to get out. And so we've done a lot of work instructionally. The second thing we've really looked at as a full school is focusing on name, strength, and need. And so, in the past, it might be, okay, I have my roster of kids, I have them on a seating chart, now we're gonna learn. But we've really taken a step back and said, Who do we have in our classroom? What is their name? What are some strengths that we can leverage? And then what are their needs? And we believe by focusing on that, we are really making them want to come to school every day and to learn and to feel that magic. And so just to summarize it, we have a placement of learning around four categories, making sure we have high quality instructional material. Strong instruction, belonging, and then high expectations. And I think that high expectations is something that we really hold true to this year. We have high expectations that We as staff are going to help you succeed. We have high expectations that you believe in yourself and that we have high expectations that every single student when they walk into Carmody is going to achieve at that high level and feel like they belong. And all of that placemat or our pathway or our story all started with that work when we came together and listened to those doctors and had some time to really think of what needs to change to help all of our students be successful. You make me remember Superintendent Dorland and I had one of these episodes that we really reflected on all of the different work that we're doing in our district. Part of what she and I looked at was the data around transition from elementary to middle and middle to high. And we know that as we looked at that, we wanted to make sure that the student experience was dynamic, was exciting, and was relevant to our kids. And as you pointed out, using quality curriculum was really important. Letting kids break a sweat cognitively. That was a big deal for us is to make sure that kids... Mm-hmm. Also, this year, I want to point out we had some really great support from Gary Community Ventures. Four of our South Area schools launched a pilot. To address course compacting, a common bell schedule, transportation, and collaborating with career pathways across the four schools. You know, at the heart of our strategic approach are stronger CTE or career and technical education pathways. And we also wanted to Really crown that high school experience with a seminal Jeffco high school experience that prepared kids for success after graduation. Shannon, I'd love for you to talk a little bit about the work that you and your colleagues at Columbine, Dakota Ridge, and Chatfield have engaged in and talk a little bit about the work that you're excited about That this pilot has afforded those four schools the opportunity to really begin to explore and build in terms of the student experience. Yeah, I mean, it's not easy to get four high school principals to come into the same group. Especially when we're rivals with each other and very competitive with each other in terms of sports. And so one thing we kind of had to establish out of the gates is that we're not giving up our individual identity. But we're gonna come together for the greater good to ensure that we meet the needs of all students. Because as any administrator in education will

tell you today, One of the challenges is finding great teachers to run all those really high level CTE courses. Yeah. There's a shortage on human capital. When it comes to finding teachers to run all those unique programs. And so if we started to work together, we can actually provide more opportunities for students. So even though we don't always love each other on the football field. We've decided to really come together and I have to praise all of those leaders. They've been essential in really saying all of our kids need this and all of our kids deserve this. And so there's a lot of complications and the logistics are definitely the hardest part, like coming up with a common bell schedule, coming up with common times where we can start to share kids. Beginning next year. But what we're doing is we are trying to put unique programs at each school and then share those students amongst those programs. So in the CTE world, for example, We're going to put an automotive program at Chatfield and students from my school, Bear Creek, will be able to go there and take automotive classes because I can't offer that. I don't have an automotive teacher. But at the same time, we're gonna bring kids in for our biomedical pathway. And in our biomedical pathway, we've been lucky enough to get a CNA lab donated. We're developing a farm Certification, farm tech certification program so that our students can be farm techs when they graduate from high school and graduate from high school with livable wage jobs. And that doesn't mean that we're just pushing them into those career fields. It gives those students the opportunity to take higher level classes and then use that livable wage job to attain a college degree if they want. So at Bear Creek, we're really working on having a high quality pathway in the biomedical field. Not only are we offering those certification programs for livable wage jobs, but we're also offering concurrent enrollment classes. So that students in high school can earn college credit before they graduate. And at Bear Creek, we're now offering thirty-two concurrent enrollment classes, which is a 600% increase. From when I started there a year and a half ago. So I really feel like our teachers are doing a lot of the hard work And so is the entire community. All four schools are engaged in that work and it's really exciting because we're going to be able to offer more kids, more individualized programming. And honestly, that's what this generation needs and deserves. You're right. You're right. Yep. And just for clarification, Shannon's farm tech doesn't mean farming. She's talking pharmacy tech. I got excited. Pharmacy public. Just kidding. Pharmacy tech. You know, one of the most powerful conversations I heard you and your colleagues really engage in is just recognizing the rich History and pride in your community around your schools and so when a student enrolls at bear creek high school they want to be a bear. You know, when a student enrolls at Chatfield, they want to be a charger. And so you all went into this work really understanding that that was important to your community while also recognizing that, to your point, The Chatfield facility affords us the opportunity to really look at some specialized equipment and facility To support that auto program that it would be cost prohibitive for us to do that in four different locations all within close proximity of one another. The ability for you to offer that medical experience really makes a difference and It's okay for a Chatfield student to come and take that pathway and still remain their identity of being a charger and graduate from the school that they care so much about. I really applaud all four of you for the way that you've approached that recognizing that your school's identity is really important to your community and giving kids opportunities to learn. In a space that you can't all be all things to everyone when you think about all the different pathways that are out there and available. Trying to be efficient and trying to really, like you said, hire that high quality staff and make it available so that all kids can benefit from those programs is really what we're talking about when we talk about high school reimagined. And we're absolutely still going to remain comprehensive high schools. All of us will offer lower level entry classes like all of us are going to offer engineering one where students can just explore the various fields of engineering and begin to study engineering. But then all four of us are going to specialize our engineering three and four classes into specific fields. Like at Bear Creek, we're going to specialize in mechanical engineering. And I think Dakota, their plan is to specialize in aeronautical. So everybody's really running with helping each other, but still offering that comprehensive experience. And at the same time, being sure that we create that seminal experience for high school students. You spoke earlier about the most memorable lessons for you were probably the most memorable lessons for students as well. And what we know is that at the end of the day, when we give kids real world type experiences, they value them more. So at Bear Creek, we have a long history of offering senior field studies, which is a seminal experience That our students right now, they're in the desert in Arizona. Nice place to be this time of year, right? Yeah, and they're studying some resource allocation there later in the year, they'll go rafting, they do a farm unit where they Go do farm stays and live on farms for a couple of weeks during this semester. And it is such a memorable experience and the kids learn and grow so much with that hands-on practical learning. That not only are we going to continue to expand and offer senior field studies to our four partner region schools and let their students engage in that experience, but we're also, we've hired a career counselor. And we are trying to get

kids internships in veterinary medicine and real estate and culinary fields. And nursing. And we have kids in all of these programs right now that part of their high school credit is earning credit through an internship. And that's part of high school reimagined too. Thank you. You know, as parents yourself of students in Jeffco, you know how different it is to parent an elementary student versus a middle school student versus a high school student. As you think about these experiences that. We're engaging in and the vision we have for magic of middle school and for, you know, high school reimagined and really giving kids that relevant Connection to the world that they have interest in to pursue passions and and really look toward career fields in a very different way. What are you excited about as a parent and what advice do you have for parents in our district to Help them be involved, engaged, and really understand the student experience. Advice I have for parents and middle schoolers is to have a balance of Accepting independence, but also accountability. And so at first for me, as I had a sixth grader come in, it was more of handholding. What's going on? Can I help you? Too much questions that, you know, I wasn't asking the right question. And so as a parent and as a principal of a middle school, we need to let student voice drive how we have those conversations as a parent, as a teacher. One of the things that I've really capitalized on and increased on this year is students' voice needs to be at the forefront of all the decisions we make, whether we're the principal of a middle school or a parent of a middle school student. And so I had a conversation with my daughter and, you know, I had never asked her what her goals are. I just assumed her goals were to get straight A's and not miss school and to be successful academically, but not really what she wanted to do. And I was like, oh my gosh, that's advice I should be giving parents that I work with every day is have we sat down as parents, as educators and principals and asked our middle school students. What are their goals? How can, and then once they state them, then you're now their advocate for reaching those goals. And then you can have those conversations of, hey, if you want to do this in high school, what do you think about taking this pathway in middle school? And so student voice is huge. Listen, have a balance between allowing them to be independent, but accountability needs to be there too, especially as their middle school brain is, you know, growing their new pathways. Second thing is there are so many ways that they could become leaders in the building whether it's joining sources of strength or a web program which is where everyone belong or a mentorship or student panel. Every single student that walks in Carmody and Bear Creek have some type of leadership quality that we can learn from and so I encourage parents and and students You're a leader. Let's figure out how you

can lead in the right way. And then last thing, especially middle school, is to get involved. Whether it's find a club that you're interested in, do a service project. Participate in sports. I always tell students my hope is that at least they get involved in at least one extracurricular, but hopefully something throughout the whole year. So that's the big three things that I've learned as a parent and that I hope that parents can take away as they work with their own middle schoolers. Yeah, you're right. I know we talk a lot in Jeffco about. Expecting ourselves to be leaders growing a community of leaders and that involves our students really allowing our students to build the experiences and the skills they need to be leaders of their own lives. And so I think that the. Aspirations that you have for your own child and the children who come to Carmody are really around Giving kids that ownership, giving kids the opportunity to set the course and direction for the things that they care greatly about. Absolutely. Shannon, what about you? Yeah. Well, yeah, I have a lot of kids. You and me both. Three of my children have already graduated and when I look back and think about what really helped them be successful. I think it was really encouraging them. I even remember my oldest son came home after his freshman year and he was just a freshman boy. He was so typical freshman boy. And he's like, I think I'm going to take three AP classes next year. And he still gets mad at me to this day because he's like, and you had this look like that was a bad idea. And he did it. And he was successful. And I should have never had that look on my face. If I did to this day, Nate, I apologize. But I think it really is encouraging them to take some risks. Even if it makes it kind of scary for you as a parent. So really encouraging them. And the more a kid is at the high school, the more they're involved, the more successful they're going to be. So I was going to 100% echo what Emily said is just like. Drop your kid off at 730 in the morning and yeah, don't pick them up till seven at night because we've got plenty of clubs and sports and things for them to do. So the more you can get them in the school and involved and taking risks. The better off they're going to be. And ultimately, the other thing you need to do is feed them. Like, I think that is essential. Tons of food and, you know. And they'll stay. They'll stay. You have snacks, they'll be there. A lot of food. You know, that's funny. I think about all of those different activities because really when we started talking about durable skills, those durable skills seem to come alive first and foremost in all those different activities. When you think about... Our kids having to learn how to communicate with teammates, whether that's in an enrichment activity, in a sport, whatever it is, when we think about critical thinking skills, that's something we give them the opportunity to do. As I think about collaborating, that's huge. Sports, whether it's activities, whether it's clubs, whether it's competitions, academic competitions, all those things came to life. And I love the fact that Part of our vision is taking that into the classroom and letting kids have that same level of relevance that they get so excited about in all these clubs and activities in their day to day classroom experiences. Our kids are capable of so many amazing things if we give them the opportunity to just let them fly a little bit and let them stretch themselves, right? Yeah. Well, Emily and Shannon, thank you. This was a great conversation today. And there are very few things that I care more about in education than The experience of our adolescence through school, having been a middle school teacher, high school leader and teacher, this work is personal for me. I set out in education to really think about how do we really prepare kids for their future and I'm so excited about the work we're all doing together. And it's exciting to walk classrooms and see the great learning that's happening and the ways that you guys are bringing this to life. 3 00:30:25,000 --> 00:30:26,000 So thank you for your work and thank you for talking about it today. Clearly you're as excited about it as I am and that's fun. It's really fun to talk about that with you. Thank you for joining us for this special episode of Elevate Education. Until next time, keep learning. Keep growing and keep elevating education.