התמלול המלא של Curiosity Changes Everything | Lois Barth

know, automatic pilot, but not the bad one that causes you to do scroll. 00:04:54.800 --> 00:04:57.920 But like it was like this spiritual awakening. 00:04:58.000 --> 00:05:10.160 I went back into my apartment, I took out the scale, and we have in our hallway one man's trash is another person's cool stuff pile, and I wrote, This scale works perfectly, it just no longer works for me. 00:05:10.480 --> 00:05:19.680 And I went back and I started to automatic writing, free associate, a hundred things I'm waiting to do until I get thin. 00:05:19.839 --> 00:05:26.240 And I purposely, because I love language, I know we both share that, I called it my weightless W-E-I-G-H-T. 00:05:26.560 --> 00:05:26.879 Huh? 00:05:28.079 --> 00:05:32.079 And I had things on it like buy a bathing suit. 00:05:32.319 --> 00:05:36.480 That's not black, and in New York, that's like taboo because everybody wears black in New York. 00:05:37.279 --> 00:05:41.439 Wear the bathing suit, flirt with guys even if you don't think you're in their league. 00:05:42.560 --> 00:05:43.040 What else? 00:05:43.279 --> 00:05:46.079 Audition for shows even if you don't feel you're good enough. 00:05:46.639 --> 00:05:48.720 And I made a commitment that I would go through that list. 00:05:48.800 --> 00:05:50.079 It was about a hundred. 00:05:50.319 --> 00:05:57.519 I don't know that I went through all of them, but what I did find out, some I was shaking in my boots. 00:05:59.439 --> 00:06:03.519 Others I was like, I put my life on hold for what? 00:06:04.800 --> 00:06:05.839 Are you kidding? 00:06:06.240 --> 00:06:07.600 You know, like a guy rejected me. 00:06:07.680 --> 00:06:10.079 I was like, I'm still breathing, I'm still living. 00:06:10.240 --> 00:06:11.600 Life goes on. 00:06:12.959 --> 00:06:17.759 And so, what started happening is I started getting curious. 00:06:18.160 --> 00:06:22.879 So even when I started to binge, and I continued to binge, I got curious. 00:06:23.040 --> 00:06:24.639 I was like, huh. 00:06:25.120 --> 00:06:27.920 What would just happen that you think caused you to binge? 00:06:28.319 --> 00:06:40.319 I was like, well, I was with a friend, but I often overeat when I'm with her, and they didn't have the term friend of me then, and I went, I need to drop her as a friend or actually have a real conversation. 00:06:40.560 --> 00:06:43.040 Beautifully honest conversation, which I'll talk about later. 00:06:47.199 --> 00:06:49.600 My whole world opened up for me. 00:06:49.759 --> 00:06:51.439 I lost 35 pounds. 00:06:51.600 --> 00:07:02.160 I just ate differently because I was no longer using food to punish myself, to pursue this elusive thing called perfection, which you and I know both don't exist. 00:07:02.720 --> 00:07:05.600 And I got really curious about curiosity. 00:07:05.839 --> 00:07:13.920 And that's those are four of the two of the four C's brand, courage to sparkle, are curiosity and compassion. 00:07:14.079 --> 00:07:17.199 I got compu compassion with myself and curious. 00:07:17.519 --> 00:07:20.800 And my whole life started to open up from that place. 00:07:20.959 --> 00:07:23.360 Now, did things magically change overnight? 00:07:23.600 --> 00:07:23.920 No. 00:07:24.160 --> 00:07:29.439 But I felt like, oh my gosh, like these are the keys to the kingdom. 00:07:29.759 --> 00:07:45.279 Because we live in a culture that is either very, very we were just talking about it before our call today, that in the communication space and leadership and in work cultures, right, loyalty is unprecedented. 00:07:45.439 --> 00:07:48.879 Like the bar is so low people are tripping over it, right? 00:07:48.959 --> 00:07:51.360 There's a lack of loyalty on both sides. 00:07:51.759 --> 00:08:08.399 And what I see in communication and leadership is often they're either um ghosting or vague feedback or um cancel culture, you know, work cultures, or the other is people just dribble out of their mouth. 00:08:08.560 --> 00:08:11.360 They have no filters, and they call it just being honest. 00:08:11.439 --> 00:08:16.480 No, you're being a jerk, and you're being mean-spirited, irresponsible, and hurtful. 00:08:16.560 --> 00:08:17.759 And there's a middle ground. 00:08:17.920 --> 00:08:21.839 So, anyway, that started me becoming very, very curious. 00:08:22.000 --> 00:08:26.879 And I also, I know we both have a performance background, I got really fascinated. 00:08:26.959 --> 00:08:28.720 I was like, well, who are these characters? 00:08:28.879 --> 00:08:29.199 Right? 00:08:29.279 --> 00:08:32.639 That's what's great about being a performer, is like, who are these characters? 00:08:32.879 --> 00:08:43.200 And what I've really come to see, and it's part of the neuroscience part of my courage to sparkle brand, is that these are not our internal devils and angels. 00:08:43.360 --> 00:08:44.960 They're coping strategies. 00:08:46.080 --> 00:08:51.759 Right, the Slash, Slash was there as a coping mechanism. 00:08:52.000 --> 00:09:03.039 The only way Slash had a toolbox that was like, I don't know, um, one of those little toy toolboxes, and that's the way Slash felt it could whip me into shape to move me forward. 00:09:03.200 --> 00:09:17.039 Um and I've I've since done a lot of studying around neuroscience, and I really believe a lot of our negative self-talk is rooted in the fight, flight, freeze part of our brain, which is part of, you know, the reptilian brain, which is part of our survival, right? 00:09:17.120 --> 00:09:22.639 In cave days, you needed that reptilian brain alive and kicking 24-7. 00:09:23.120 --> 00:09:33.600 But the amygdala, bless its heart, as they say down south, you know, has sort of become very oversensitized with all the stimuli we get. 00:09:34.000 --> 00:09:41.360 And the part of our brain, the curiosity, compassion, lives in our prefrontal cortex. 00:09:41.519 --> 00:09:46.879 Um, I love, I'm kind of a neuroplasticity nerd and a word nerd. 00:09:47.200 --> 00:09:50.159 But we don't need to vilify those

parts. 00:09:50.320 --> 00:09:51.919 We just need to upgrade them. 00:09:52.159 --> 00:09:54.000 And that's where curiosity comes in. 00:09:54.240 --> 00:09:59.440 Somebody says something that's hurtful, if we can get compassionate with ourselves and go, ouch, that was an oui. 00:09:59.759 --> 00:10:00.960 What did it trigger in me? 00:10:01.120 --> 00:10:02.879 What might that person be going through? 00:10:03.039 --> 00:10:11.600 We can go to that person in a lack of rather than a dysregulated emotional Ferrari way, we can go to that person and go, hey, what's going on for you? 00:10:11.840 --> 00:10:14.799 Hey, that's out of character for you to say that. 00:10:14.960 --> 00:10:16.159 Are you are you okay? 00:10:16.320 --> 00:10:17.840 Or how can I support you? 00:10:18.080 --> 00:10:24.960 So that's be basically my four C's are uh curiosity, compassion, connection, and courage. 00:10:25.200 --> 00:10:31.279 Because I feel that you can absolutely transform work cultures, leaders, and people. 00:10:31.840 --> 00:10:38.159 That when we bring those four C's in, miracles happen. 00:10:38.480 --> 00:10:47.759 And I've had some of the most bizarre, you know, one of my hobbies is heartfelt existential conversations with strangers on the bus subway. 00:10:47.919 --> 00:10:54.480 I've had the most extraordinary experiences from just employing those tools, those C's. 00:10:54.559 --> 00:11:00.799 I mean, I'm just saying on the personal level, on the professional, the work that I do with companies and B2B, B2C. 00:11:01.120 --> 00:11:04.320 So that's how I stumbled upon the brand. 00:11:05.039 --> 00:11:05.440 Nice. 00:11:05.519 --> 00:11:06.159 I love it. 00:11:06.399 --> 00:11:11.600 Now, when we're talking about disruption, curiosity comes in in a big way. 00:11:11.759 --> 00:11:23.679 When we're thinking about the mindset and the way we're thinking about moving through life, um talk to me a little bit about that connection, because you're taking those Cs, of course, they're all related to disruption. 00:11:23.840 --> 00:11:26.240 Um, but connect curiosity for me. 00:11:26.559 --> 00:11:28.960 Absolutely specifically, because I think it's a huge piece, right? 00:11:29.200 --> 00:11:30.000 Yeah, absolutely. 00:11:30.240 --> 00:11:30.879 Great question. 00:11:30.960 --> 00:11:32.080 Thank you for asking. 00:11:32.320 --> 00:11:36.799 Um we can easily go into automatic pilot, same old, same old. 00:11:36.960 --> 00:11:39.360 Disruption goes, whoa, right? 00:11:39.519 --> 00:11:47.279 And we're most people, no matter what, how big a game they play, most people are resistant towards change. 00:11:47.840 --> 00:11:49.039 You know, we are. 00:11:49.279 --> 00:11:57.120 Um there are people who go big a go home, like you who climbs Machu Picchu in a weekend or whatever, or probably way more than that. 00:11:57.360 --> 00:12:01.600 But but we all have those areas where change is confronting. 00:12:02.080 --> 00:12:14.240 And so disruption is very confronting for that part of us that just wants consistency, certainty, that are largely living in a very survival part of the brain. 00:12:14.399 --> 00:12:30.720 So when we can get curious to our fears, when we can assume less and ask more questions of ourselves, of the situation of others, that's when we're less reactive and we're more inquisitive. 00:12:30.879 --> 00:12:36.240 And that's why I think we fall in love with children and animals, because they're so curious. 00:12:36.320 --> 00:12:37.679 It's just who they are. 00:12:37.919 --> 00:12:43.120 You know, you you plunk down a hundred bucks for a game, the kid's more interested in the box than the game. 00:12:43.279 --> 00:12:47.600 You know, uh it's just pets, animals, they're fascinated. 00:12:47.840 --> 00:12:53.360 Um, and so that's where I think I believe and I have found that curiosity interrupts. 00:12:53.519 --> 00:12:55.200 It's you assume less. 00:12:57.039 --> 00:13:00.240 You you talk less, you listen more. 00:13:00.799 --> 00:13:03.200 You actually want to be in the other person's world. 00:13:03.279 --> 00:13:06.080 You want to be in your own world, on your own reactions. 00:13:06.159 --> 00:13:08.879 That's where emotional intelligence comes in. 00:13:09.120 --> 00:13:09.679 Wow. 00:13:09.840 --> 00:13:15.519 You know, I just did a talk, a global talk for women in finance around imposter syndrome. 00:13:15.679 --> 00:13:21.279 These were very high-level successful women who still struggle with the imposter syndrome, right? 00:13:21.519 --> 00:13:24.320 Putting their hat in the ring on a in a meeting. 00:13:24.559 --> 00:13:29.679 So they can if they can get curious to go, why am I not saying anything right now? 00:13:30.000 --> 00:13:34.639 Hey, that person, man splained me, woman splained me. 00:13:34.960 --> 00:13:40.879 Like, how do I get back in the game so that I don't go on undercover instead of berating ourselves? 00:13:40.960 --> 00:13:44.399 So that's where I believe I think you almost can't disconnect. 00:13:44.480 --> 00:13:47.759 Yeah, you must conflate curiosity with compassion. 00:13:48.080 --> 00:13:50.960 Because you have to be in that moment compassionate with yourself. 00:13:51.120 --> 00:13:52.559 Hey, I'm having a reaction. 00:13:54.480 --> 00:13:58.159 And is that what the communication piece of your work is? 00:13:58.559 --> 00:13:59.120 Absolutely. 00:13:59.279 --> 00:14:00.559 Communication and leadership. 00:14:00.639 --> 00:14:03.200 I again I don't think you can separate them out. 00:14:03.440 --> 00:14:04.480 No, I agree with that. 00:14:04.799 --> 00:14:07.519 Yeah, and and I believe everybody is a leader. 00:14:07.679 --> 00:14:13.919 I don't think it's about the number of people who report to you, I think it's the number of people you impact and the depth of the impact. 00:14:14.240 --> 00:14:16.559 The abil yeah, the ability to impact them at all. 00:14:16.879 --> 00:14:18.080 Yeah, absolutely. 00:14:18.399 --> 00:14:25.759 Yeah, so t give me some

examples of of companies that you've worked with and sort of how they've they've implemented the four C's. 00:14:25.840 --> 00:14:29.279 Uh how how does that look at the ground level in the workplace? 00:14:29.919 --> 00:14:33.360 Uh yeah, thank you so much for um asking that. 00:14:33.600 --> 00:14:36.480 Um, well, I'll I'll give you an example. 00:14:36.559 --> 00:14:41.039 I um and this whole thing about being beautifully honest, which we could talk about later. 00:14:41.200 --> 00:14:55.840 Um, but I had um a very interesting experience several years back where um a client, um I'm sure you've heard the term scope creep, we've all experienced it. 00:14:56.080 --> 00:14:58.399 And it was supposed to, it was this very large program. 00:14:58.480 --> 00:15:09.600 We were we got our pillars in place, we got our focus, and all of a sudden she started adding things like structural re-org, like change management, and I was like, that's not what I signed up for. 00:15:09.759 --> 00:15:12.960 And my I felt like my stomach was having a heart attack. 00:15:13.200 --> 00:15:17.919 And um, I thought to myself, well, if I was coaching myself, what would I do? 00:15:18.080 --> 00:15:25.600 And it was it was a nice size contract, so you don't want to necessarily give that up, let's be real. 00:15:26.320 --> 00:15:38.000 And I called her back, and and she was sort of prickly at best, and I I thought to myself, and instead of saying I'm really uncomfortable, I said, How do you feel our meeting went? 00:15:38.879 --> 00:15:41.519 And she said, I went great, I'm really excited. 00:15:41.679 --> 00:15:43.600 And then I just let there be pause. 00:15:43.919 --> 00:15:44.480 Curious. 00:15:44.720 --> 00:15:45.679 She goes, How do you feel? 00:15:45.840 --> 00:15:50.000 I said, I feel like we're heading for a train wreck. 00:15:50.240 --> 00:15:51.840 And she goes, Really? 00:15:52.080 --> 00:15:55.759 I said, Yeah, we started here and now we're entering these things. 00:15:56.320 --> 00:16:07.200 I feel that people, the attendees, the team members will feel railroaded that maybe you're not talking about a restructuring and blindsided. 00:16:07.360 --> 00:16:20.480 I said, You're not gonna look good, and they're not gonna get much value, and I'm gonna be the fall guy, and nobody is gonna win silence. 00:16:20.960 --> 00:16:23.279 She burst into tears. 00:16:24.960 --> 00:16:29.200 Yeah, and she said, I just need to make some changes, and I don't know how. 00:16:29.440 --> 00:16:32.639 And I said, Great, good for you. 00:16:32.879 --> 00:16:34.000 Let's talk about that. 00:16:34.240 --> 00:16:40.320 She talked about the changes that she wants to make, and I said, That's not what I do. 00:16:41.279 --> 00:16:43.440 I said, I can refer that out. 00:16:43.679 --> 00:16:44.879 I can find somebody. 00:16:45.039 --> 00:16:49.360 I said, but your your folks were so excited about this program. 00:16:49.440 --> 00:16:52.639 It was community building and and well-being. 00:16:52.720 --> 00:16:56.720 And I said, Would you be open to a couple of different alternatives? 00:16:56.799 --> 00:16:59.519 And she said, Sure, I said, This is a one-year program. 00:16:59.600 --> 00:17:00.720 We can go six months in. 00:17:00.799 --> 00:17:02.000 It was only once a month. 00:17:02.159 --> 00:17:07.759 And I said, see if the culture changes, and if they if it does, you might not need that other thing. 00:17:08.000 --> 00:17:12.480 Or if it's six months, then you can actually hire somebody separately. 00:17:13.039 --> 00:17:18.799 And she said, I can't believe that you would have the willingness to have this conversation. 00:17:18.880 --> 00:17:20.640 Nobody's ever had that conversation with me. 00:17:20.720 --> 00:17:27.680 And I said, I said, It's my integrity, it's my work, and it's your work, and it's your word. 00:17:28.640 --> 00:17:35.519 And what happened was people really, everybody was nice, you know? 00:17:36.240 --> 00:17:37.279 Nice culture. 00:17:37.920 --> 00:17:46.319 And everybody was nice, but nobody was really talking, nobody was having transparent conversations, and we talked about curiosity. 00:17:46.960 --> 00:17:49.680 We did things that were very counterintuitive. 00:17:49.920 --> 00:17:56.559 Um, we had one month was just hobby day, where everybody went around and shared their hobbies and passions, and they were like fascinating. 00:17:56.640 --> 00:18:02.640 People created origami structures that were nine feet high, and somebody had a pencil collection, quirky. 00:18:03.440 --> 00:18:08.880 And what happened was people became really curious about each other. 00:18:09.039 --> 00:18:10.480 They would send each other articles. 00:18:10.640 --> 00:18:15.599 Hey, there's this pencil structure in blah, oh, I went to Bangladesh, I brought you back some pencils. 00:18:15.759 --> 00:18:21.440 Like, and people started to really connect, they left their niceness. 00:18:21.599 --> 00:18:26.880 They were still, um, they were no longer, you know, there's a distinction between nice and kind. 00:18:27.039 --> 00:18:29.039 I heard this wonderful Instagram. 00:18:29.200 --> 00:18:34.319 If you have spinach on your tooth and and somebody doesn't tell you, then they're being nice. 00:18:34.480 --> 00:18:36.720 If they do, they're telling, they're being kind. 00:18:37.839 --> 00:18:44.319 But that was one of the things that really opened up is they started to connect on a much deeper level. 00:18:44.640 --> 00:18:50.000 They felt confident and competent to have the heart of conversations. 00:18:50.720 --> 00:18:56.160 And I did circle back with them a couple of years later, and she said, you know, we didn't need change management. 00:18:56.319 --> 00:18:58.960 Now, sometimes you need change management in structural reworld. 00:18:59.359 --> 00:19:00.559 But that was one situation. 00:19:00.640 --> 00:19:18.880 I recently did a really wonderful executive, fractional executive leadership program for for a company PE

financed, and um all of a sudden I learned that the C-suite needed way, they were way more siloed. 00:19:19.039 --> 00:19:22.000 And how do they how do they connect with messaging? 00:19:22.480 --> 00:19:33.759 On the keynote level, one of the things that I love to do is to have fun and storytelling and humor, um, but also have vulnerable conversations. 00:19:34.000 --> 00:19:37.920 And I know you use a lot of humor and a lot of storytelling field. 00:19:38.160 --> 00:19:41.359 Our dear friend Kelly Swanson said storytelling is the Trojan horse. 00:19:41.440 --> 00:19:43.039 Well, I think humor is, right? 00:19:43.119 --> 00:19:43.759 What do they say? 00:19:43.920 --> 00:19:47.200 Humor is uh comedy is tragedy plus time. 00:19:47.759 --> 00:19:59.599 So one of the things is to be able to um make people laugh at things that they were usually embarrassed or ashamed about, but then how are we gonna talk about? 00:20:00.000 --> 00:20:16.000 Um, and so in terms of leadership, creating a safe space to really um have the difficult conversations, but look at like, hey, we're not taking we're not taking enough inspired actions. 00:20:16.160 --> 00:20:17.920 So I hope that answered your question. 00:20:18.000 --> 00:20:19.920 But yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely. 00:20:20.000 --> 00:20:22.640 Well, and and its connection piece is really important. 00:20:22.720 --> 00:20:34.000 Is that kind of the first step to this beautiful honesty to being being able to create that culture where honesty is welcomed and kindness is the default versus nice. 00:20:34.400 --> 00:20:34.960 Nice. 00:20:35.200 --> 00:20:39.039 Yeah, I think I would actually think it's curiosity. 00:20:39.200 --> 00:20:42.480 Um, I don't think you can, like I guess there's all conflated. 00:20:42.640 --> 00:20:52.240 For me, when you can get curious, not critical, that's my Lois is move from move from criticism to curiosity instead of what's wrong, what's possible. 00:20:52.480 --> 00:21:00.000 I think when you can get curious, the first step is are you as a leader fostering curiosity? 00:21:00.960 --> 00:21:15.680 Not my my dear friend Ken Kilday, who I adore, he says core values are not what's on the wall, it's what's actualized in the halls, in the metaphoric halls, in the hybrid hall, which it's much harder with remote. 00:21:15.920 --> 00:21:20.960 But it's it's really about as a leader, are you fostering curiosity? 00:21:21.119 --> 00:21:28.160 I know you get this probably a lot, Ann, but when I'm brought in for keynotes, they're like, we want people to participate more, to give more input. 00:21:28.319 --> 00:21:34.480 People don't, and I said, all the time, and I said, Do you create a structure for people to participate? 00:21:34.640 --> 00:21:37.279 Because, oh well, we have the metaphoric suggestion box. 00:21:37.440 --> 00:21:39.279 I said, No, but have you actually implemented it? 00:21:39.440 --> 00:21:41.759 Have you brought it down to your weekly huddles? 00:21:42.160 --> 00:21:43.359 And they're like, no. 00:21:43.440 --> 00:21:46.319 And I said, So what is my messaging gonna do? 00:21:46.720 --> 00:21:52.880 I said, I can give you suggestions on how to actually create a culture, and I can embed that into the keynote. 00:21:53.119 --> 00:21:59.759 But in terms, how are you as a leader, as a culture, really making it about? 00:22:01.839 --> 00:22:03.440 Participation and input. 00:22:03.680 --> 00:22:10.160 So I think it's about getting curious and really fostering curiosity as a leader and a team. 00:22:10.640 --> 00:22:14.960 Um and I think part of that is also compassion, what people might be going through. 00:22:15.119 --> 00:22:21.920 Um fostering well-being, you know, people knowing how to dysregulate. 00:22:22.079 --> 00:22:26.799 When they're dysregulated, how to get centered. 00:22:27.440 --> 00:22:33.839 And and I I don't think tr you know, people use the word trigger like big T, little T trauma, big T, little whatever. 00:22:34.000 --> 00:22:37.599 Trigger is just a disproportionate response to a stimulus. 00:22:37.759 --> 00:22:38.000 Right. 00:22:38.720 --> 00:22:45.359 It's even if it's something that feels dangerous, your reaction and anxiety is the ultimate trickster, right? 00:22:45.440 --> 00:22:47.200 You gotta go slow to go fast. 00:22:47.839 --> 00:22:49.200 Power of the pause. 00:22:49.359 --> 00:22:50.880 How are you doing that as a culture? 00:22:50.960 --> 00:22:57.279 If you're in a culture of VUCA, volatility, uncertainty, complexity, and ambiguity, that's gonna make it harder. 00:22:57.759 --> 00:23:04.160 And then how out of that do you create the connection with each other and your leaders and your teams and your fellow C-suite? 00:23:04.559 --> 00:23:09.119 And then how are you fostering inspired action? 00:23:09.599 --> 00:23:11.519 You know what that means, inspired action? 00:23:11.599 --> 00:23:12.880 I've heard that term so many times. 00:23:13.119 --> 00:23:13.839 I know, I know. 00:23:13.920 --> 00:23:15.440 It's kind of a buzzword. 00:23:15.599 --> 00:23:20.640 Um, I, you know, I'm I'm kind of I'm a stickler about language. 00:23:20.799 --> 00:23:24.160 I used to think, oh, stickler is such a bad word, but no, I am. 00:23:24.400 --> 00:23:34.480 Um I feel sometimes the term take risks, it feels a little bit like there might not be any guardrails to take risks, because there are risks that are wonderful. 00:23:34.640 --> 00:23:34.799 Right. 00:23:35.119 --> 00:23:40.160 You take them all the time, I take them all the time, but there are risks that like jump in the net will appear. 00:23:40.319 --> 00:23:43.920 Oh wow, I depend in my bank account and I have a broken neck, you know. 00:23:44.079 --> 00:23:47.200 Like so I like inspired action. 00:23:47.359 --> 00:23:59.119 Um, I I feel that we have a very strong intuition if we foster it, if we learn to trust ourselves and get support to trust ourselves and to know when we can't trust ourselves. 00:23:59.279 --> 00:24:07.519 So

I feel that, I don't know, I'm sure you've had this, Anne, a million times that the divine beckons us, right? 00:24:07.839 --> 00:24:13.039 We have ideas, we have instincts, we and they keep coming back. 00:24:13.519 --> 00:24:20.000 And you know, are the parts of us that are scared, that are frozen, go, oh no, what if they don't like it? 00:24:20.319 --> 00:24:34.160 But when we keep having those inspired ideas, to take the risk, to get support and go, hey, I have this idea, I don't know if it has any legs, but what are your thoughts about it? 00:24:34.400 --> 00:24:37.519 To be able to really have a quorum or a culture. 00:24:37.680 --> 00:24:49.440 And I know that you know I'm a hopeless optimist and a hopeful romantic, so I know I'm talking about, you know, in very high-level optimistic terms, but it can be it could be nurtured in small and meaningful ways to foster. 00:24:49.599 --> 00:24:58.000 I mean, I was doing this um all-day workshop for a global PR firm, and it was so fascinating to me. 00:24:58.240 --> 00:25:01.119 We talked about how they structure their huddles. 00:25:01.200 --> 00:25:04.400 And they were like, oh, we start with victories and celebrations. 00:25:04.720 --> 00:25:06.160 And I said, and then what happens? 00:25:06.319 --> 00:25:16.079 And she goes, and then it's kind of the senior level people chime in, but the new newbies, the up-and-comings, the mid-management that we really want to develop, it's like the wall of silence. 00:25:16.319 --> 00:25:18.400 I said, Why do you think that is? 00:25:19.119 --> 00:25:20.480 What do you think is happening? 00:25:20.559 --> 00:25:25.359 And somebody said, Oh my gosh, we're starting the meetings with the bars so high. 00:25:25.920 --> 00:25:28.400 They don't feel like they're allowed. 00:25:28.960 --> 00:25:31.599 There's no space for the SEM have a little victory. 00:25:31.680 --> 00:25:33.839 Like that's why there's a little C and a big C. 00:25:34.000 --> 00:25:35.440 So that's why I called inspired action. 00:25:35.519 --> 00:25:38.319 And they said, let's re-reverse engineer the meetings. 00:25:38.480 --> 00:25:47.119 Let's talk about what stuff went down that wasn't so great, and ask everybody to jump in on what the solution totally changed it. 00:25:47.519 --> 00:25:49.759 All of a sudden they started coming forth. 00:25:49.920 --> 00:26:02.000 So it's about really looking at how are how are your team members and you being guided of what you see are the next steps. 00:26:02.160 --> 00:26:09.839 And how do you make the bar so low, and I mean that positively, that all ideas are truly welcome. 00:26:10.319 --> 00:26:13.200 So it's that safe aspect. 00:26:14.160 --> 00:26:16.079 I call it safe and stretch. 00:26:16.400 --> 00:26:21.039 How do you create an environment that's both safe with a bias towards stretching? 00:26:22.079 --> 00:26:25.839 You know, I can I can I share this story that I heard about that, which I love. 00:26:26.720 --> 00:26:37.039 So I'm um one of my people on my Google, and I spoke to this woman at a party at networking, and I said, you know, talk about the safe and stretch, and we're all ideas welcome. 00:26:37.200 --> 00:26:41.119 She goes, Well, I had the privilege of working with Jim Henson of the Muppets. 00:26:41.519 --> 00:26:45.119 Oh for 25 years, for years. 00:26:45.359 --> 00:26:51.920 And we laugh on the weekly huddles because it's like an ideation session, and everybody's welcome, not just the writers, everybody. 00:26:52.160 --> 00:26:57.039 And if you had a great idea, he says, Ha, tell me more. 00:26:57.359 --> 00:26:58.960 The late great Jim Henson. 00:26:59.039 --> 00:27:04.000 If you had a stinker of an idea, he would take a pencil and go, Fascinating. 00:27:04.240 --> 00:27:06.480 Let me put a let's put a pin in that. 00:27:06.640 --> 00:27:09.759 And that knew that it was a stinker of an idea that he wasn't gonna use. 00:27:09.920 --> 00:27:15.359 But what happened is they all started laughing and they started having competitions of who had more, huh? 00:27:15.519 --> 00:27:16.880 They said, You had more pencils. 00:27:17.039 --> 00:27:20.160 He said, Yeah, but I had a tell me more six months ago. 00:27:20.240 --> 00:27:21.839 And it became this game. 00:27:22.160 --> 00:27:25.839 He normalized not taking people's suggestions. 00:27:26.720 --> 00:27:27.359 Brilliant. 00:27:27.519 --> 00:27:33.440 And he didn't talk about it, there weren't pillars on the wall, and this and that, you know, he just implemented it as a leader. 00:27:33.519 --> 00:27:41.839 And and I'm all about having core vision and and mission statements, so don't get me wrong, and and you know, having the core values, but he lived it. 00:27:42.000 --> 00:27:42.400 He lived it. 00:27:42.640 --> 00:27:43.039 Yeah, right. 00:27:43.119 --> 00:27:46.640 Without without it ha happening when the rubber meets the road, it doesn't matter. 00:27:47.279 --> 00:27:47.680 Exactly. 00:27:47.839 --> 00:27:50.079 It wasn't just rhetoric, it was real life. 00:27:50.319 --> 00:27:51.039 Exactly. 00:27:51.279 --> 00:27:51.920 Exactly. 00:27:52.079 --> 00:27:53.759 So this beautiful honesty. 00:27:53.920 --> 00:27:55.599 Is there a is there a structure behind that? 00:27:55.759 --> 00:27:59.279 Is there something that, you know, how do we get the courage to do that too? 00:27:59.519 --> 00:28:00.480 Tell us a little bit about that. 00:28:01.039 --> 00:28:01.519 Absolutely. 00:28:01.680 --> 00:28:11.839 Yeah, and I come from debilitating people pleasing, like debilitating, to sometimes being a little bit of an emotional Ferrari. 00:28:12.160 --> 00:28:14.400 We say and do things that we later regret. 00:28:14.640 --> 00:28:15.920 Are you feeling me in? 00:28:16.640 --> 00:28:20.400 Been there, done that, got the chocolate stains on the t-shirt to prove it. 00:28:21.359 --> 00:28:30.559 So, um, no, I I'm always I love structure and playfulness, but all you know, I I like structure but also fluidity. 00:28:31.200 -->

00:28:35.279 The first step is when you have an oui, right? 00:28:35.519 --> 00:28:42.160 A trigger, whatever you want to call it, I think it's so important to do some real curiosity. 00:28:43.440 --> 00:28:44.720 Get really curious. 00:28:45.039 --> 00:28:48.000 And sometimes you can't do that because you're triggered. 00:28:48.319 --> 00:28:52.400 So sometimes you have to go, okay, how do I how do I get regulated? 00:28:55.359 --> 00:28:57.200 There's a myriad of tools. 00:28:58.319 --> 00:29:03.519 My my dear friend Elizabeth Browning, she talks about an imaginary monologue. 00:29:03.599 --> 00:29:11.680 Just say out loud in privacy of your own home what you'd want to say to that person, totally unmanicured, totally not PC at all. 00:29:11.839 --> 00:29:13.279 Just get it out. 00:29:13.440 --> 00:29:13.839 Yeah. 00:29:14.079 --> 00:29:18.319 Um, riff on an email, save as draft. 00:29:18.880 --> 00:29:19.279 Yeah, right. 00:29:19.440 --> 00:29:21.279 Don't put an address in it until you're right. 00:29:21.599 --> 00:29:25.279 Don't put an address, um, some kind of release. 00:29:25.440 --> 00:29:27.279 Um, talk to a good friend. 00:29:27.920 --> 00:29:30.960 You know, um say, I just need to empty my basket. 00:29:31.200 --> 00:29:33.680 Alison Armstrong uses that phrase. 00:29:34.000 --> 00:29:40.240 Um then after you feel seen and heard and have a voice, then there's some work to do. 00:29:40.559 --> 00:29:45.200 What is because what triggers one person doesn't trigger another person. 00:29:45.440 --> 00:29:47.680 What's your spiritual classroom? 00:29:48.160 --> 00:29:50.400 Wow, I feel not heard. 00:29:50.559 --> 00:29:54.400 That's one of my like for me, I don't know what your spiritual classroom is. 00:29:54.480 --> 00:29:59.039 We have more than one, but mine is always being told as a child. 00:29:59.279 --> 00:30:02.960 Um, and even now, not always, but often like I'm too sensitive. 00:30:03.039 --> 00:30:04.720 I overthink things. 00:30:05.279 --> 00:30:09.599 And the truth is sometimes I do, but that's also I have great critical thinking. 00:30:09.680 --> 00:30:10.880 It's one of my superpowers. 00:30:10.960 --> 00:30:13.200 It's what what I do for a living, right? 00:30:13.359 --> 00:30:17.680 So if I hit a trigger, what would be one of your classrooms, Anne? 00:30:18.000 --> 00:30:19.200 Truth in advertising. 00:30:19.519 --> 00:30:21.039 Uh quiet down. 00:30:21.200 --> 00:30:22.319 Don't take up so much space. 00:30:22.640 --> 00:30:23.839 Don't take up okay. 00:30:24.720 --> 00:30:26.319 Too much! Yes! Too much. 00:30:27.759 --> 00:30:28.160 Yep. 00:30:29.039 --> 00:30:33.759 So let's say, yeah, you're too much, which is the other side of you're not enough, right? 00:30:34.079 --> 00:30:34.319 Yep. 00:30:34.559 --> 00:30:38.160 So I'm too much, so I get to go, okay, that's my classroom. 00:30:38.319 --> 00:30:41.519 And I like working with positive intelligent model of the saboteurs. 00:30:42.079 --> 00:30:47.599 Okay, my three top

are a hyperachiever, hyper vigilant, and stickler. 00:30:47.920 --> 00:30:49.839 What is the belief that I'm carrying? 00:30:50.000 --> 00:30:52.079 I'm too much, I'm not enough. 00:30:52.559 --> 00:30:55.279 I have this thing called seven sassy words that will change your life. 00:30:55.359 --> 00:30:56.559 Does it serve me to believe that? 00:30:56.640 --> 00:30:57.759 Of course it does not. 00:30:58.000 --> 00:30:59.359 What does it serve me to believe? 00:30:59.440 --> 00:31:04.880 It believes that some people are gonna vibe with me and some people aren't. 00:31:05.119 --> 00:31:07.680 I'm not too much, I'm not not enough. 00:31:08.000 --> 00:31:13.759 That person is just not vibing with me, or that person's having a hard day. 00:31:14.480 --> 00:31:18.240 Okay, that's the curiosity, compassion, the self-regulation. 00:31:18.720 --> 00:31:25.359 Um, what and then then I need to look at what do I want out of this conversation? 00:31:25.920 --> 00:31:26.240 Yes. 00:31:26.480 --> 00:31:27.440 What do I want? 00:31:27.599 --> 00:31:35.279 If it's to be right, to be heard, buzzer, you're not gonna get that, right? 00:31:35.359 --> 00:31:37.359 Or it's it's not gonna bring the results. 00:31:37.599 --> 00:31:46.400 If it is to feel like I'm owning my voice, to be in the other person's world, so at first it is all about you. 00:31:46.880 --> 00:31:51.599 What do I need, what do I want out of this outcome that supports my growth? 00:31:52.240 --> 00:31:59.519 Um, and then I go into the other person's world, getting curious about the wiring of that person. 00:32:00.079 --> 00:32:01.839 What I know about that person. 00:32:02.160 --> 00:32:15.599 And if you don't know anything about that person, everybody needs to feel, everybody needs to feel like they matter, they're important, they're cared about, and that they were doing their best. 00:32:15.839 --> 00:32:16.799 That's the catch-all. 00:32:17.039 --> 00:32:24.400 If you don't know squat about the person, you can, and that's when you create the bridge. 00:32:24.880 --> 00:32:27.359 And then there's always a language. 00:32:27.759 --> 00:32:32.880 Um, my three catchphrases are I'm curious, I'm confused, or I'm fascinated. 00:32:34.079 --> 00:32:36.960 And I often, and I have a whole framework. 00:32:37.039 --> 00:32:47.440 I take people, I'm launching a pilot next month, I take people through a whole framework because language and the energy with which you share language is a game changer. 00:32:47.759 --> 00:32:52.640 And I often say to people, hey, I've created this thing called Beautifully Honest. 00:32:53.200 --> 00:32:55.680 I do it imperfectly and ongoingly. 00:32:55.920 --> 00:32:58.960 Would you be open to me being beautifully honest with you? 00:32:59.279 --> 00:33:01.119 And most people go, What is that? 00:33:01.279 --> 00:33:02.559 I go, I'm gonna tell you. 00:33:02.799 --> 00:33:12.400 And I go, and I'm not gonna, I'm gonna have hiccups, I might be awkward, and um, and and sometimes I say, so how does it feel to have me say something? 00:33:13.039 --> 00:33:16.640 I'm scared, I'm not gonna attack you, you know, and that calms people down. 00:33:16.720 --> 00:33:20.000 And and there's different ways you gotta iterate in a business setting, right? 00:33:20.160 --> 00:33:20.799 Obviously. 00:33:20.960 --> 00:33:37.200 And I say, so I'm really curious when you said this to me on that day, um, what I took it to mean was, and I'm curious, or sometimes I'll say, What were you trying to tell me? 00:33:37.359 --> 00:33:39.599 Or what was going on for you? 00:33:39.759 --> 00:33:41.519 And some people go, I don't even remember saying that. 00:33:41.680 --> 00:33:43.039 Oh my god, I was having such a hard day. 00:33:43.200 --> 00:33:44.799 Oh my god, we had to put my dog down. 00:33:44.960 --> 00:33:46.160 Oh my god, I'm so sorry. 00:33:46.240 --> 00:33:47.519 They go, no, no, no, no. 00:33:47.680 --> 00:33:57.759 I said, and there's I was a licensed medical massage therapist in a prior career, and it's a medical known fact that bones that break that heal properly become stronger than bones that were never broken. 00:33:57.920 --> 00:34:02.960 So I said, I'm not here to just level set our relationship, I'm here to transform it. 00:34:03.200 --> 00:34:10.639 And they go, wow, I said, so I tell them, bones that break, let's let's use this to actually have even a stronger connection. 00:34:10.800 --> 00:34:12.719 And people really appreciate that. 00:34:12.960 --> 00:34:13.199 Yeah. 00:34:13.360 --> 00:34:21.599 I think when you get into the habit of honesty, yeah, we all understand that we're doing it with compassion, like you said, tact and respect and yeah, all of that. 00:34:21.920 --> 00:34:28.719 And then and then I'll say, and and then we'll talk about what happened, and I'll mirror back, wow, you felt this way. 00:34:30.079 --> 00:34:33.039 What could maybe I be doing or saying differently? 00:34:33.199 --> 00:34:34.480 Like, what's my role? 00:34:35.280 --> 00:34:41.519 And um, a lot of times people have said, I you know, you probably get this a lot, Ann, too. 00:34:41.760 --> 00:34:53.599 I just you have this just this big energy, like it's just like I'm so inspired by it, but sometimes it's I feel less than, and I go, wow, thank you for sharing that. 00:34:53.679 --> 00:34:54.639 Do you do you get that? 00:34:54.719 --> 00:34:56.800 I mean, I'm sure you have your own version. 00:34:57.039 --> 00:34:58.800 I don't want to put words in your mouth. 00:34:59.039 --> 00:35:04.000 Yeah, no, I I I haven't had that particular instance, but yeah. 00:35:04.159 --> 00:35:06.559 Yeah, I know you're ventriloquism here, right? 00:35:07.039 --> 00:35:13.519 And the cool part is when we come at the conversation from a solution focus versus an accusation focus. 00:35:13.599 --> 00:35:16.480 Again, curiosity versus animosity is the way I say it. 00:35:16.719 --> 00:35:17.119 I love it. 00:35:17.360 --> 00:35:18.320 Yeah, it gets there. 00:35:18.639 --> 00:35:18.880 I love that. 00:35:19.039 --> 00:35:19.360 I love it. 00:35:19.599 --> 00:35:20.880 That's uh that's an anism. 00:35:23.840 --> 00:35:24.159 But yeah. 00:35:24.480 --> 00:35:27.119 Loisbarth.com is your website. 00:35:27.280 --> 00:35:31.199 People can find information on your coaching, on your keynote speaking, on everything. 00:35:31.280 --> 00:35:34.639 Is there anywhere else people can uh find more about you? 00:35:34.960 --> 00:35:35.280 YouTube. 00:35:36.079 --> 00:35:36.400 Okay. 00:35:37.039 --> 00:35:43.280 Um, and uh yeah, I would say YouTube and my website, LoisBarth.com. 00:35:43.440 --> 00:35:44.639 And I'd love to keep in touch. 00:35:44.719 --> 00:35:52.000 And thank you so much for inviting me and engaging in this really rich, juicy, sparkle conversation. 00:35:52.719 --> 00:35:53.760 Thank you so much. 00:35:53.920 --> 00:35:56.719 And I will put all of those links in the show notes for you all. 00:35:56.800 --> 00:35:59.920 Thank you so much for joining us on Dancing in the Discomfort Zone podcast. 00:36:00.079 --> 00:36:01.199 We'll see you next week.